Hi ladies,

I really hope that you guys will be able to help me and offer me support. I have been bfing Elliott since birth . I went through the initial latching problems, nipple pain, engorgment etc at the start when I considered stopping bfing but we got through it and I carried on.

However, I have never been very confident about feeding in public. I know that I should not worry about what people think but I just do. I feel very uncomfortable, clumsy etc etc... I know I am doing anything wrong by feeding my son in public but in some ways I am quite a confident person but in other ways I am not. Also, lately my bbs just feel so empty. I have not been very well (flu etc) and the doctor said this could have affected my milk supply and it's quality. Also, if Elliott went longer than 4 hours at night without feeding I used to leak and be sore but this does not happen anymore.

Elliott has always been a very fast feeder and and was generally only feeding for 10 minutes at the most and this was satisfying him. I believe that I have a fast let down reflex and also I know my hindmilk comes through in this time as I can see the change in colour. I was also only feeding from one side as this is what the MW, HV etc have always told me to do. However lately, I have been feeding from both sides as he does not seem satisifed with one side. With this in mind, he only feeds from the 2nd breast for 5 minutes maximum so I'm worried he's only getting the fore milk.

I have been considering stopping bfing for the last few days for the above reasons (I don't like feeding in public, I think Elliott is hungry etc etc.) but I don't really want to. Also my OH really wants me to continue and his Mother has strong feelings about it as well (My Mum will support whatever decision I decide...she never BF).

Last night and one other night in the week I gave Elliott formula for his 7/8pm feed. Last night he drank 5oz! I can never express that much so that's why I'm worried he is hungry. He hated the formula at first but did get used to it. I expressed so that my body did not miss this feed and it took 40 minutes to get 3oz! and I hurt so much afterwards!

Today I bought some Fenugreek to help increase my milk supply. The tablet strength is 550mg and the bottle says to take 1, 3 times a day. However, I am planning on taking 3, 3 times a day after reading other advice on here. Is this okay?

The reason why I want to take the fenugreek is so that my expressing is more succesful really. The reason for me wanting to express is so that if am going somewhere where that I won't feel comfortable feeding or I can't feed I can take a bottle of EBM and feed Elliott. Also my partner really wants us to go out and spend time together for his birthday next week and for my Mum to look after Elliott (I don't want to leave him but guess it will be good for both of us). With this in mind, I need some EBM!!

I would like to exclusively express but don't know how to start this up or if I have the time to do this now so guess I would like to express at some time during each day. When should I do this without having to give Elliott formula in place of a feed so that I can express to start the process off? Should I express a few times a day? Only one bb per session....the questions go on! I have a TT hand pump and a TT elec pump.

So sorry for this being so long and I feel bad about considering stopping so would rather seek some help than give up.

You need a medal if you have read this far and thanks for reading.xx

A pump will never be able to be as efficient as a baby and is never a good indication of what sort of supply you have A baby can really get your milk going but a pump just wont have the same sort of reaction. So please do not worry that Elliot is not getting enough based on your output. Go by weight gain and wet/dirty nappies. It sounds like you are doing a fab job

Thanks nikki

Can anyone else help or should I post this on the BF Champion thread? xx

First of all before I forget, here's a link about fenugreek and dosage, all brands have different weights in their tablets so it very much depends on what brand and strength you got as to how many tablets you should take. Basically, you need to take enough so that you smell either of maple syrup or curry - it always smelled like curry to me! Some people start on a low dose and increase until they get the smell. Here's the link anyway: http://www.kellymom.com/herbal/milks...fenugreek.html

Nikki is right that the amount you pump bears no relation at all to how much LO is getting from you, they're so much more efficient at getting milk than a pump can ever be. So please don't worry too much about your supply. What size teats are you using? I know a few people who use the smallest teat possible and also the breastflow bottles so LO has to work as hard for the milk from the bottle as from the boob, otherwise they may take more than they need.

As for pumping for a feed, pick a time each day that would suit and stick to that so that your boobs can get used to producing more milk at that time. If LO is only taking 5 mins from the second boob at a feed, how about pumping the second boob when he's done after each feed when it's convenient and then have an extra session maybe when LO is asleep? I used to do 10pm when LO went to bed at 7pm, I knew she was really unlikely to want a feed then.

I pumped for the first 5 months so DH could give the last feed of the night but we got to a point where she was taking 10oz and I just couldn't keep up, I was pumping 3 times a day to get that. So I went back to direct bfing. If you're pumping so you can go out, then just book in your sessions and freeze the milk so it's there for when you want it.

Poppy, great to see you!

I'll leave it to the experts to answer you fully, but for one... expressing is not a true indication of how much milk you have.

I've been expressing so we can give colief and now hubby gives a bottle of EBM in the mornings.

I understand if you want to exclusively express its a consideration - although I'd wonder if that's necessary.



Are you planning on coming to the next meet?

If theres a chance you could get comfy feeding outside of home it might be worth thinking about clothes that make it easier and to try practising at home.

Please be careful with giving formula and its affects on your supply! xx

I get most milk from a pump if I express in the early hours of the morning. Unfortunately, it means you get even less sleep!

If I were you, I'd keep breast feeding and just pump for when you're going out or not going to be around to bf. Pumping is VERY time consuming and I can't imagine being able to exclusively pump. And that's coming from someone who could easily get up to 6oz from one side in one session. I found that after about 3 months my boobs stopped being so engorged and I couldn't express so much even though Harvey seemed to be quite settled after his feeds. I mentioned it to someone who assured me that around that stage your supply levels off and so you're not so uncomfortable if they're full and they don't get so hard. It might just be that you've reached that stage rather than you're not producing enough milk.

I'd second what kiddo has said.
Pumping for 2 feeds at 8 weeks is close to sending me bonkers - just less bonkers than not having the chance to sleep and have a bath, which the bottles of EBM allow me

Exclusive expressing is hard work... I have to pump during the day as I'm back at work now and I hate it. I'd much rather be feeding my gorgeous girl.

As others have said, a pump isn't as good as your baby. What one do you have though? I'd recommend pumping for at least 5 minutes after the milk stops coming out, and if you have one with adjustable cycling, make it fast again to try to trigger another letdown.

Hi hun

Great to see you too. I love the photo of you and Hazel on your profile. What a sweetheart she is.

There is another meet??? I didn't realise. I don't check that section of the forum often so will go and have a look in a minute. Unfortunately I don't have my car anymore as work took it back so will have to see if I can borrow OH's car if I can make it. Would be lovely to meet you both.

Thanks for offering your advice. I only feel comfortable feeding jn certain places. I wish I could get over it as I feel bad as I only want to feed my son!

Don't worry, every time I have given formula (3 times in total) I have always expressed so my body doesn't get confused.


Thanks to everyone for your help. I must admit I hate expressing and don't know how I will find the time to exclusively express so I don't think this is an option for me anymore. I wish it was as it would solve everything!

I have a TT elec pump and the TT manual pump. Sometimes I find the hand pump better than the elec one!! Neither of the seem to milk me efficiently and easily though!

I started taking fenugreek yesterday and my urine already smells like curry house lol!!

I'm going to speak to the HV tomorrow ad I'm finding that this last week Elliott is tugging on my bb after feeding and sometimes crys when I take him off when I think he has finished. Putting him on the other bb I'd the only way to calm him which makes me think he has emptied the first one. I've never had to feed from both times in one sitting!

He hasn't been very well this week and has had the occasional green nappy or mucusy nappy. The doctor said the mucusy nappy is probably the mucus caused by his virus coming out of the bottom end rather than the top end. He has had a few runny nappys today aswell

He has been colicky tonight and only just settled after crying for about 2 hours solid. I feel so sorry for him. I gave him some cooled boiled water and ge is now asleep on me. I'm worried that the colic and runny nappys may be due to our recent feeding problems and me feeding from both sides and Elliott not getting enough hind milk.

I will phone the HV first thing tomorrow morning and I really, really
hope she can help.

Thank you all for your support and advice. I'm going to sit here and cuddle my poor boy and hope we get sorted soon.xx

That's interesting - today I have just been searching for the cause of a week of mucusy nappies and a green one just before that... everything I've read says too much foremilk or response to mothers diet

Hazel hasn't been ill though