ADHD need someone who knows to advise, please!

[Bekkiboo]

I'm not sure where to put this but I didn't think the special needs section was the right place as no diagnoses have been made.

Running across a thread on the forum about this made me concerned about my boys. They both used to be very well behaved boys and have gradually become more and more, what I initially thought as ignorant.

I'll start with Devon who is 5 (6 in January).
I have noticed that he is always fidgety, he will be watching tv but won't sit still at all. He can't stick to simple jobs I give him and his brother, i.e. pairing up socks, he will start playing with toys and leave his older brother to it.
He cries really loudly and squeals if he thinks he's been wronged in any way and does this to things that I myself don't consider an issue. He does this if he is told he can't have something or if he doesn't get his own way (and we have never spoiled him so that's not the issue) He has also bitten his nails right down which I'm not sure is relevant or not but he will sometimes sit and stare into space nibbling away at them.

Now Jordon who is now 8.
If I ask Jordon to get something for me, for example a pack of baby wipes I left in my room, he will go upstairs and I will still be waiting 10 minutes later for the pack of wipes. I will call him down and he will say ''sorry, I forgot''. Instead of going to get the wipes he has gone into his room to play. Incidents like this happen alot. If he has misbehaved and say for example his punishment is that he cannot watch a football game, he won't listen when you tell him he is definitely not watching it and will sit there saying ''please, please i'm sorry'' and even if you tell him not to keep begging he will do it anyway. Also if him and his brother are arguing over a toy or something, Jordon will often pinch his younger brother and then immediately start saying ''oh i'm sorry, i'm sorry''. Also we have had to remove their tv from their room (we allow 1 dvd before bed on a Friday and Saturday) I will use last nights example of this to highlight it.
I was in my room settling the baby and the boys were supposed to be asleep, I heard my OH get up to put the bins out and subsequently heard the button go on the kids tv. I didn't get up right away to tell him off because I wanted to see what he would do. After my OH came back in and settled, I heard the button go again, so I decided to get up and have a word. I tried to get up as quietly as possible but the bed creeked and again I heard the button on the tv go. I stood there quietly for a few seconds and as expected the tv button went once more turning the tv back on so I promptly went in there and told him off. The thing is he has done this for a long time and I was always reluctant to move the tv because I was desperate to trust him but he just doesn't seem to get it, even though he knows how cross I will be for catching him with it on, on a school night and how cross I will be because of how he is trying to be crafty about it he still does it.

I don't know if these are signs of adhd or bad behaviour but all I know is my boys were never always like this and if it is bad behaviour I just don't know where it's come from, I've done nothing different??

I am concerned as to the genetic links because I myself have a lot of issues and after looking at the information on it and the adult symptoms I am worried I may have it and just never been diagnosed. I was brought up in care and because of this any bad behaviour I showed including screaming fits where I had to be restrained by careworkers, was written off because I was as they would put it ''a typical care kid''.

The adult symptoms that I can refer to myself are:

continually starting new tasks before finishing old ones
inability to focus, or prioritise
continually losing, or misplacing, things
forgetfulness
restlessness and edginess
difficulty keeping quiet, and speaking out of turn
blurting responses, and poor social timing when talking to others.
often interrupting others
mood swings
irritability and a quick temper
inability to deal with stress
extreme impatience

I've always had a nagging feeling that I am not right in myself, I struggle to make friends in real life, in fact other than females that are related to me in some way (and have to put up with me) I have no friends, and that's not an exaggeration, I literally have no friends. I can go from calm and happy to stressed and depressed in a flip of a switch and I know it is happening but I can't stop it. My OH tries to point it out to me, what I am like but even though I know it is true I will rather have a big row then admit it to him, I hate to say sorry and will sit there sulking, (I'm 25 years old for crying out loud, I shouldn't be sulking) and refuse to say sorry.
Looking back on a recent day out for coffee and shopping with my SIL, I just didn't stop talking (the poor girls ears must have hurt) I remember having my hands together and tapping my forefinger in rhythm off my other hand as I talked. Also sometimes I hate to look directly at people when talking to them and sometimes it actually hurts my eyes to make eye contact.

When I first started this post I was thinking I was probably just being silly but now I am extremely worried and starting to feel like a nut job I don't want my kids to grow up feeling how I do every day Do you think there is a problem because I really don't feel normal most of the time and I really don't want my boys to end up the same way.

Please advise me !

 

[Bekkiboo]

I've just thought back the Jordons last few parent evenings and his teachers saying that he gets distracted and when I looked through his books his work is always incomplete with notes from the teacher saying they expected more. They say he's got a great array of general knowledge and imagination but struggles to put it onto paper. Not sure if that is relevant either but again, very concerning.

 

[NatalieW]

Have you thought about going to the doctors for a CAMH referral? You can go with supporting evidence of the school... Please bear in mind a CAMH referral and diagnosis can take a few years...

 

[Bekkiboo]

I've been to the doctors a couple of times about myself but they brushed it off as depression but until recently it hadn't dawned on me that there might be something going on with the boys too but when you read up on something and it seems to explain everything it's a pretty daunting feeling.
I am going to have a word with Jordon and Devons teachers past and present to see if they have any real concerns. Although I realise now the issue with his work, whether or not their teachers would see it just as concerning as me is a different matter. Do I need them to say 'we think Jordon/Devon has adhd' or do they just need to say 'he struggles with finishing his work'??

 

[NatalieW]

I would first go to the school and talk to their teachers. Try and get their SEN teacher in on it as well, explain your concerns about him. If you all agree there is an issue, get a letter written by the school for a CAMH referral. The system changed recently and schools can't just instigate the referral has to come from GP and parents. But I will say this, I have come across primary schools that don't do diddly squat when there is a known problem because it's too much hassle filling the in paper work. So by the time they get to secondary school, they need extra support and it's harder at secondary level getting them diagnoses. Thats for any special needs not just ADD or ADHD

 

[helen1234]

hi hun.

it is really horrible when you know something isnt quite right with our children.

my daughter Rosie was diagnosed at 7 with ADHD she is also epileptic which the two can be associated.
rosie is really impulsive and when she was younger dam right naughty, she was given concerta and she took it for 2 yrs, didnt make a blind bit of differance so i refused to medicate any longer she takes enough drugs for epilepsy.

as the years have gone by i changed parenting tactics with her and instead of losing my temper with her i changed discipline techniques to find which one suited her. that was nearly 10yrs ago now and she's really grown up. still impulsive and forgetful, low concentration, moody. but i think most of that is their age.
if i was you i'd go back and talk to the doctors in getting referred to a child pyscologist so you can talk parenting techniques, as this in my oplinion is better than medication, and you dont have to have a diagnosis of adhd to get them to focus better at home and school.
outside sports and activities great for children, having friends over for tea, taking an hour each day to do an activity of their choice. these are just some of the things i've changed with rosie. rosie has no idea she was diagnosed ADHD and neither does anyone else.
the biggest thing i changed was her diet, only fresh food now, lots of pasta's and veg lots of fruit, no fizzy drinks, bisuits, or chocolate in this house hasnt been for yrs. it makes a huge differance in childrens concentration and behaviour

i was a crazy child i nearly got expelled lots of times, i'm dyslexic as they come as well and this can also get confused with adhd. i forget everything and anything, i half job everything i do i leave half a bed made, washing on the line, i've forgotten to pick rosie up from school, even my friends children lol.

x

 

[Bekkiboo]

Thank you hun x

I just want to try and get some answers to everything, for myself as well, for peace of mind more than anything so I know it's not just that I've lost the plot and that there's a reason for my boys acting like they are other then the possibility i'm just a terrible mother.

I do hope that if there are issues that something can be put into place before they reach secondary school because the older they get the more difficult things will be. Other kids can be so cruel at times and I don't want my boys to be bullied.

 

[helen1234]

if your feeling low hun the children may play on that as well, and sometimes when we hink we've come to a wall we give up on them and they play up even more which turns into a vicious circle iykwim.

dont leave it to weigh you down. go and talk to someone. your definetly not losing the plot hun, all children can be silly esp if they have siblings to bounce off. thing to be is consistant with discipline that goes for a child with or without adhd, reward the good stuff they do ten fold.

have a word with the teacher as well, adhd doesnt stop at the school gates if he's behaving and knuckling down at school and isnt at home its not adhd.

do you have much of a routine at home hun?

 

[Bekkiboo]

hi hun.

it is really horrible when you know something isnt quite right with our children.

my daughter Rosie was diagnosed at 7 with ADHD she is also epileptic which the two can be associated.
rosie is really impulsive and when she was younger dam right naughty, she was given concerta and she took it for 2 yrs, didnt make a blind bit of differance so i refused to medicate any longer she takes enough drugs for epilepsy.

as the years have gone by i changed parenting tactics with her and instead of losing my temper with her i changed discipline techniques to find which one suited her. that was nearly 10yrs ago now and she's really grown up. still impulsive and forgetful, low concentration, moody. but i think most of that is their age.
if i was you i'd go back and talk to the doctors in getting referred to a child pyscologist so you can talk parenting techniques, as this in my oplinion is better than medication, and you dont have to have a diagnosis of adhd to get them to focus better at home and school.
outside sports and activities great for children, having friends over for tea, taking an hour each day to do an activity of their choice. these are just some of the things i've changed with rosie. rosie has no idea she was diagnosed ADHD and neither does anyone else.
the biggest thing i changed was her diet, only fresh food now, lots of pasta's and veg lots of fruit, no fizzy drinks, bisuits, or chocolate in this house hasnt been for yrs. it makes a huge differance in childrens concentration and behaviour

i was a crazy child i nearly got expelled lots of times, i'm dyslexic as they come as well and this can also get confused with adhd. i forget everything and anything, i half job everything i do i leave half a bed made, washing on the line, i've forgotten to pick rosie up from school, even my friends children lol.

x

I'm just at a loss and with the way I feel all the time I think it amplifies the situation, we bounce off each other like a game of ping pong and if they do something that I believe is naughty I shout really angrily at them when I know I shouldn't be so aggressive with it, but even when I shout loud 5 minutes later they will be doing whatever it was they were doing to begin with!

I think I'm going to have a chat with their teachers whilst implementing a healthy eating regime, luckily they love pasta and certain veg!

I'm going to cut out sweets, chocolates and fizzy pop all together and see how that fairs, if there's no change I don't know what will help.

 

[Bekkiboo]

if your feeling low hun the children may play on that as well, and sometimes when we hink we've come to a wall we give up on them and they play up even more which turns into a vicious circle iykwim.

dont leave it to weigh you down. go and talk to someone. your definetly not losing the plot hun, all children can be silly esp if they have siblings to bounce off. thing to be is consistant with discipline that goes for a child with or without adhd, reward the good stuff they do ten fold.

have a word with the teacher as well, adhd doesnt stop at the school gates if he's behaving and knuckling down at school and isnt at home its not adhd.

do you have much of a routine at home hun?

In light of the housework etc, there's no routine there. I do it as and when.
I always stick to a routine as far as the kids are concerned but over time they don't seem to follow that routine anymore and even while I try to continue implementing it they fight against it.
To implement new rules, do I just do it or do I sit them down and explain it to them first?

 

[Rach28]

Hi hun

My son was diagnosed with ADHD when he was 5 after behaviour and presentation deteriorated both at home and school. The key there was it was in more than one setting and he matched every symptom.

You do need to arrange to speak with teachers first to see if they have any concerns or issues within school. If they do, then arrange to see your GP and request a referral be made either to CAMHS or a paediatrician. They will complete a number of observations and assessments in conjunction with you/home life and school teachers.

If school dont have any real issues or have not spotted anything then its unlikely there will be a diagnosis as like I said behaviours and issues need to be there in more than one setting.

Have there been any major channges at home/ within your family that could have triggered a patch of poor behaviour?

As a social worker, I have worked with lots of children's who's behaviour present like ADHD but they dont have it, its just down to other things going on.

As well as learning all about ADHD and ways to approach managing and parenting a child with it, I also found that diet changes helped as well as omega 3 supplements.

My son is 10 now and has come on leaps and bounds with the right support at home and school. We did not go down the medication route and im pleased we didnt.

We do have to be careful with his ability to concentrate and become distracted easily. He is desperate for a TV in his room like most of his mates have but we wont let him because it wont help his routine, sleep pattern etc

https://www.helpguide.org/mental/adhd_add_signs_symptoms.htm

this site may help make sense of things abit more.

Feel free to pm me#

P.S. I have alot of the 'characteristics' that you do - your not alone!!

 

[Bekkiboo]

That article is very useful thank you hun x

I can't help but associate the described signs and symptoms with my own behaviour as well as the boys.

I'm sitting there reading it going ''oh gosh that's me'' at everything.

The kids are back from school and have started already, hurting each other!!

On that site it says they would struggle to sit still so I decided to test it.

I've got both of them to sit with their legs crossed and arms folded and it's only been a couple of minutes and Devon is in tears saying he can't do it and that he's tired, now he wants to go to bed and go to sleep.
Jordon on the other hand is just a bit fidgety messing around with his hands but nothing too dramatic!

I had a word with them about them not having chocolate, sweets etc anymore and that they would be replaced with fruit and apart from a few tears from Devon they took it really well.

 

[Rach28]

Neither me or my son can sit still - drives my husband mad with 2 of us fidgeting!!

Noticed your signature hun thats shows your new (beautiful!) baby born in July, id maybe give it some time to see if they settle down abit, new babys can trigger different behaviours in all siblings no matter how old, its not just toddlers that struggle.

Although my son is excited about having a new brother or sister in Feb, I know he will strugggle with how things will change.

Maybe see if they settle down with starting back at school, a new baby and the changes that brings first before you take any action. Also remember that all siblings mess about, wind each other up, fight etc etc it maybe that this just seems more than normal at the moment as your having to focus alot of your attention on to new bubs.

Hope im not sounding like im preaching or anything - after all your a mum to 3 so I dont want to cause offence, just trying to be helpful :O)

 

[Bekkiboo]

No offence taken at all hun, that's something to consider. I'll just monitor things really closely for a while and see how things go. I just hope some improvement shows and that adhd isn't the cause!

 

[mommy43]

also another thing to consider if u do have it have they just learnt from your behaviour kids learn by copying i am no expert but have a friend with 2 adhd children n the others do copy them just an idea

 

[Bekkiboo]

also another thing to consider if u do have it have they just learnt from your behaviour kids learn by copying i am no expert but have a friend with 2 adhd children n the others do copy them just an idea

I was thinking that too, that the kids have picked up on how I am and are imitating it. I'd be mortified if that turned out to be the case.

 

[helen1234]

i think most kids would struggle to sit still on demand. try giving them simple tasks like playing a game all of you together, or sitting down and drawing their favourite picture to put on the wall. kids love it when you get involved. maybe a new baby has upset the apple cart for a few months but i'm sure you'll soon get into a nice routine and their behaviour will improve. 9 and 5 are funny ages especialy brothers and their play fighting and winding each other up will be funny to them.

i ended up in screaming matches with rosie and i used to say things are you thick or just ignoring me. looking back i was just giving her low self esteem. but in hind sight i used to get soooo angry she wouldnt listen to me.
she's run off from me when we got to the school gates, she refused to eat, then 1 r later be crying she was hungry, she wrote all over her wall, she tipped nail varnish over her bed quilt and wrote her name with it on her wardrobe, she let my mums quails out the chicken shed. you name it rosie did it she was a nightmare. teachers kept saying she would refuse to do anything at school, keep saying your boring.... she'snearly 15 now and good as gold.
honestly hun might feel like your the only one with this going on but you honestly arent.
x

 

[Bekkiboo]

I sat down with them tonight and had a chat with them!
I told them that things ARE going to change and that their behaviour has been unacceptable!
As of today sweets, chocolates and fizzy pop have been banned, a fruit alternative will be offered and they can either accept it or not but under no circumstances will they be offered sweets or chocolate!
Normally I have to cook specific things because my youngest is really fussy, he will look at something before trying it and if he doesn't like the look of it he won't touch it!
I told them that from now on they would eat what I choose to cook for them, I made chicken salad with potatoes and coleslaw for dinner and they ate the lot!
I'm not sure whether they will take in what I've spoken to them about tonight but I am going to persist with it and hope some good comes of it!
Are behaviour charts a good idea do you think?

 

[helen1234]

thats brilliant, rosie would refuse fruit, but then i cut into pieces and put the bowl there for her to help herself. she loved it.

behaviour charts are brilliant its def worth a shot. rosie designed her own chart would get a treat for good behaviour or money to spend on what she wanted.
you may have lapses and thats ok never easy ptting kids into line and they'll push you to the boundaries to see f you'll crack. have you tried the naughty step and the 3 strikes, i lived in a bungalow so rosie had to face the wall lol.

we have a sweety night on a friday where we all goto the shop or i send oh to get a bar of chocolate each.

x

 

[Bekkiboo]

Ive done the naughty step but it doesn't seem to phase them and each time they go back to their previous behaviour!
With Devon I used to start counting to 5 and he would get in a panic and stop whatever it was he was doing wrong before I got to 5 but he's been pushing that method a bit recently and i've no idea what to do should I ever actually get to 5!
I think rather than focusing on punishment I'm going to try and encourage them to realise that good behaviour is rewarded and bad behaviour isn't. Like what you said, if they behave for the whole week they get to go to the shop and pick 1 chocolate bar
each!
I have it all in my head what I feel needs to change but its hard to write it all down, it's in there but just a bit jumbled!