Anyone ever had a night/series of nights like this?

[LankyDoodle]

I don't know what to do. I don't follow the CIO/CC methods so they aren't an option at this stage. BUT...

On Tuesday night when I got back from my group, my LO was with her daddy and quite fraught. She was over-tired I think... she'd got her 2nd wind and it took a while to get her off to sleep but in the end I did. Then when we went onto bed at 11ish she woke up. I guess it's the sleep regression thing = lighter sleep. Anyway I couldn't get her back off so I took her out for a drive and I was so tired I smashed into the back of OH's car! Oooops! Managed to get her off in the car, came back and she was asleep til 230am then stayed on me til 8am more or less, with a few breathers. Then she slept til 1030am!

Last night she was exhausted (she's been resisting naps no matter what I do as well) and drifted off of her own accord, then woke a few minutes later screaming blue murder. I tried all sorts (she was nomming her fist so I assumed teething pain again... we've had growth spurt and I think she is still in it but a lot of the time last night she was comfort sucking!). She was still awake at 11pm (normal time she wants/needs bed between 7 and 730!) and I eventually gave in and lay on the sofa with her where she fell asleep nursing. She woke at 130am and did not go back to sleep til about 730am (then slept again til around 10am). Now one may say she has developed a habbit here, but this is not normal at all for her - even the day we brought her home she only woke twice in the night! She has always been an amazing sleeper until 2 weeks ago when the saga started (started with a few nights of her waking every 20-90 mins, then she slept through 7 til 4 for a few nights and I got mastitis because of that... the tablets made her quite restless and hard to settle, then she went into a wake every 3 hours til 4am then every hour til we get up at 7/8am pattern!). I thought I'd seen the worst of it til Monday/Tuesday when all this started.

She doesn't have a routine set by us - she follows her own and we follow her cues. This has meant her bedtime has fallen at around 7/730 most nights... well every night really. Tuesday nights are harder since I started slimming world 4 weeks ago. She has a bath before bed and that is her little bedtime routine. I started swaddling at 12 weeks because I thought I'd try it again - she didn't like it first time. This helped her sleep much better even than before. I stopped swaddling on Tuesday as I thought she was getting annoyed with it (in the mornings she tries to heave her way out of it) and also because I need to wean her off by 6m as I can't get a swaddlepod big enough. I wondered if it was that so I have swaddled again tonight and had a game getting her off but she is now, touch wood, asleep.

Some people (namely his mum, my mum and gran) keep saying to leave her to cry, but I hate to think of her lying there alone crying and wondering where I am. I've always said I wouldn't after all my study and research. I just see her sleep as being so important to her and to us (and tbh she has been VERY cheerful today despite the lack of sleep), and I don't know what to do. I realise these problems are common around this time but surely we can't go on for several weeks/months with these problems. I know it's not forever but after a sum total of 5 hours sleep in 3 nights I feel at the end of my tether.

She doesn't have a temperature and I tried calpol for her teeth last night, to no avail. I am keeping my fingers crossed she sleeps tonight.

 

[hannahR]

Oh lovey, sounds like a tough time for you. I havent got any advice just wanted to give you big big hugs. Hope she sleeps well for you tonight. xxxx

 

[pheobe]

Have you heard of the wonder weeks book?? Its about how certain weeks in LOs life will be affected by develomental milestones and there is one around now for you.

We went through exactly the same it was brutal! hubby and had to do the night shift in turns but it passed after a few weeks and now he's back to his normal 11 hours per night

it will pass hun, hope it goes quickly
xxx

 

[Laughing Girl]

How about taking her to see an Osteopath?

 

[LankyDoodle]

Have you heard of the wonder weeks book?? Its about how certain weeks in LOs life will be affected by develomental milestones and there is one around now for you.

We went through exactly the same it was brutal! hubby and had to do the night shift in turns but it passed after a few weeks and now he's back to his normal 11 hours per night

it will pass hun, hope it goes quickly
xxx

Thank you
Yes I've read that book and it's great. Week 19 is meant to be a toughie. She was 19wks Tues!

Nice to know it passes thank you. xx

 

[KamKol]

Yep, it's definately the horrid 4 month marker. It's a killer at night times. My LO went through the same thing recently and it lasted I think a week or two. It passes...trust me, it passes.

 

[RJsMum]

Babies under 6 months are way too young to try CC/CIO in my opinion. It's not until 6 months that they finally realise they aren't a part of you.

There is a book I have called The No Cry Sleep Solution, which has helped us out loads. But also know that around 4 mos most babies have a "wakeful" period where they avoid sleep like the plague. A lot has to do with them no longer being "newborns" and they're starting to his milestones and really come into their own. Basically...too nosy to fall/stay asleep. (Picture kid on Christmas Eve, hehe)

I would say, if she's falling asleep around the same time every night, but you don't have any routine...then maybe start doing a few things around that time that might signal "bedtime" to her. In fact, in the NCSS book, it mentions that the hour before bed should be kept calm with low(ish) lighting (if possible) and nothing loud or overstimulating (like TV or louder music). In fact, even now with my son, we spend the last 45 minutes up in his room where it's quiet. We look at books and he plays with some toys...but I avoid overly-stimulating things like tickling.

To be honest, you may find that starting a bit of a routine may help. Nothing that has to be rigid...but just something consistent that happens every night so she can start to associate it with sleeping. That and just creating a calm atmosphere.

**ETA: I know you mentioned swaddling...but have you also tried white noise? We found this is good for our LO to keep him drifting into a deeper sleep the first 45 min.

 

[Seraphim]

Huge

Honestly I truly wonder what was going on for 'our' mums and grans that they didn't spot these patterns. (OK OK I know they didn't have the internet, but they must have talked more to neighbours )

@ 4 months it's HELL, honestly. It's not just Isabella.
I thought I was going to lose the plot entirely - but it does pass
It's a bit like people mostly stop BFing when they hit unforeseen growth spurts, people also start sleep training and CIO/CC at 4 months because they think they've done it all wrong, their baby is broken, and omg we've made all these bad habits, and we must set it straight for baby's own good.
I can't give you anything other than to tell you you are in good company and it WILL pass.

 

[pheobe]

Have you heard of the wonder weeks book?? Its about how certain weeks in LOs life will be affected by develomental milestones and there is one around now for you.

We went through exactly the same it was brutal! hubby and had to do the night shift in turns but it passed after a few weeks and now he's back to his normal 11 hours per night

it will pass hun, hope it goes quickly
xxx

Thank you
Yes I've read that book and it's great. Week 19 is meant to be a toughie. She was 19wks Tues!

Nice to know it passes thank you. xx

It does pass hunni, it's just trying to stay sane while it does is easier than it sounds lol

I forgot to mention that white noise was A GOD SEND!!!! It's also just got us through the 9 month mark a treat

xxx
xxxx

 

[LankyDoodle]

Babies under 6 months are way too young to try CC/CIO in my opinion. It's not until 6 months that they finally realise they aren't a part of you.

There is a book I have called The No Cry Sleep Solution, which has helped us out loads. But also know that around 4 mos most babies have a "wakeful" period where they avoid sleep like the plague. A lot has to do with them no longer being "newborns" and they're starting to his milestones and really come into their own. Basically...too nosy to fall/stay asleep. (Picture kid on Christmas Eve, hehe)

I would say, if she's falling asleep around the same time every night, but you don't have any routine...then maybe start doing a few things around that time that might signal "bedtime" to her. In fact, in the NCSS book, it mentions that the hour before bed should be kept calm with low(ish) lighting (if possible) and nothing loud or overstimulating (like TV or louder music). In fact, even now with my son, we spend the last 45 minutes up in his room where it's quiet. We look at books and he plays with some toys...but I avoid overly-stimulating things like tickling.

To be honest, you may find that starting a bit of a routine may help. Nothing that has to be rigid...but just something consistent that happens every night so she can start to associate it with sleeping. That and just creating a calm atmosphere.

**ETA: I know you mentioned swaddling...but have you also tried white noise? We found this is good for our LO to keep him drifting into a deeper sleep the first 45 min.

Sorry I just wanted to say I am not going to be using CC/CIO. Not even at 6m. I just meant that is what people keep advising and I wanted different advice not relating to CC/CIO basically. Sorry if that wasn't clear.
I have read the no cry sleep solution cover to cover twice and I love it, but it hasn't stopped this occurring LOL!
I understand all about sleep and devlopmental milestones etc. I'm usually the one on threads explaining to people it's not because they need weaning it's because xyz. But I just reached the end of my tether yesterday and thought 'what can I do to help me rest?' She is at the 19 week stage which in the wonder weeks book is a big week for change. She is actually changing a lot at the moment.
I never blame her for any of this and I would NEVER EVER use CIO/CC on one so young, and wouldn't ever want to use it if I could help it. She has got to this stage knowing that if she cries I am there within seconds and I wouldn't want it any other way tbh.

Also, we do have a bedtime routine of bath with daddy then into the dark room with me where we have a song and then he is swaddled, fed and put down drowsy and goes off. I just meant she doesn't have a set bedtime kind of thing. I think that, as well as her knowing I am straight there if she needs me, is what has helped her be such an excellent sleeper up to now.

I honestly can't believe how desperate I sound in the OP! I'm usually so resolute about things. I know all about the 4 month thing, teething, massive growth spurts. I'm completely focussed on breastfeeding for as long as possible. I think I just felt so incredibly tired and emotional and I needed people to agree with me that this has happened to the majority of their babies and it passes! LMAO.

 

[LankyDoodle]

Huge

Honestly I truly wonder what was going on for 'our' mums and grans that they didn't spot these patterns. (OK OK I know they didn't have the internet, but they must have talked more to neighbours )

@ 4 months it's HELL, honestly. It's not just Isabella.
I thought I was going to lose the plot entirely - but it does pass
It's a bit like people mostly stop BFing when they hit unforeseen growth spurts, people also start sleep training and CIO/CC at 4 months because they think they've done it all wrong, their baby is broken, and omg we've made all these bad habits, and we must set it straight for baby's own good.
I can't give you anything other than to tell you you are in good company and it WILL pass.

Thank you Seraphim! I am glad to hear it passes. Her sleep has been unravelling one way or another for about 3 weeks now and as I say, I thought I'd seen the worst until Tuesday when this all happened! I really think she needed the comfort as apart from not swaddling, nothing else had changed at all. Bedtime was the same, routine for bedtime was the same, I was there for her when she needed me like always... It just hits you like a bolt out of the blue really!

I have to say that on Weds night when I was up all night with her, what kept ringing in my ears was people saying 'you're making a rod for your back' and 'she won't thank you for it' and 'she'll get into bad habits you won't be able to break' which I always, in sane mind, tend to ignore/laugh at/come back with a comment. I knew this 4 month thing was coming and I knew all the reasons why but when it did come it was like 'woaaaaaaah!'

I certainly won't be stopping breastfeeding. Hehe! Oh and as for our parents' advice to use CIO/CC... at a time when she needs me more than ever?! No way! I am just glad people posted here to say it passes soon enough. I was imagining months like this!

 

[LankyDoodle]

Thanks all for the reassurance it will pass! I hope no one thinks I was considering CIO etc - I just meant my MIL/mum had all been saying that and it was making me feel I was abnormal to be going through this or that it was going to go on for months and months and months. I wanted to hear other people say 'yes I went through that and it passed soon enough' and it is great to hear it has happened to others! I know it has - I know all about the 4 month thing, but it's that old adage of when it happens to you you think you've got it all wrong somewhere eventhough you know the reasons it's happening and that it's perfectly normal!

Laughing Girl - I haven't tried an osteopath but I have friends who did after traumatic births.

Last night was a better night. I swaddled her and didn't go to bed til she woke for a feed so I could avoid waking her when I went to bed like I usually do. She slept til 12 and then was fed, then til 3 and fed again, then 430, then 6, then 715, then 830 and we got up. That was late for getting up but we needed it!!

 

[Laughing Girl]

Hi again Lanky D,

Sorry my post yesterday was rather abrupt, I had very little time and wanted to get something down to you quickly.......osteopaths are great for babies especially when they become out of balance and can't right themselves. For instance, Isla reacted really badly to her immunisations - she turned into a different child - no smiles and laughter, lots of whinging, not her usual self - her osteopath put this right almost immediately and for the next lots of jabs she went before and after them and she's not reacted at all. I know that growth spurts are different to immunisations, but I really do think that a visit might help if you are in the position to do so.

Also, a psychotherapist friend of mine came out with a really thought provoking statement yesterday along the lines of............."yes, well when we have things on our mind, we don't sleep well do we?"
I suppose this can be very easily applied to little babies who are experiencing huge developmental spurts when they have exactly that - something on their mind!
xx x

 

[LankyDoodle]

Thank you laughing girl. I might look into this. What your friend said sounds spot on.

I will try to find an osteopath in the area. xx

 

[RJsMum]

Babies under 6 months are way too young to try CC/CIO in my opinion. It's not until 6 months that they finally realise they aren't a part of you.

There is a book I have called The No Cry Sleep Solution, which has helped us out loads. But also know that around 4 mos most babies have a "wakeful" period where they avoid sleep like the plague. A lot has to do with them no longer being "newborns" and they're starting to his milestones and really come into their own. Basically...too nosy to fall/stay asleep. (Picture kid on Christmas Eve, hehe)

I would say, if she's falling asleep around the same time every night, but you don't have any routine...then maybe start doing a few things around that time that might signal "bedtime" to her. In fact, in the NCSS book, it mentions that the hour before bed should be kept calm with low(ish) lighting (if possible) and nothing loud or overstimulating (like TV or louder music). In fact, even now with my son, we spend the last 45 minutes up in his room where it's quiet. We look at books and he plays with some toys...but I avoid overly-stimulating things like tickling.

To be honest, you may find that starting a bit of a routine may help. Nothing that has to be rigid...but just something consistent that happens every night so she can start to associate it with sleeping. That and just creating a calm atmosphere.

**ETA: I know you mentioned swaddling...but have you also tried white noise? We found this is good for our LO to keep him drifting into a deeper sleep the first 45 min.

Sorry I just wanted to say I am not going to be using CC/CIO. Not even at 6m. I just meant that is what people keep advising and I wanted different advice not relating to CC/CIO basically. Sorry if that wasn't clear.
I have read the no cry sleep solution cover to cover twice and I love it, but it hasn't stopped this occurring LOL!
I understand all about sleep and devlopmental milestones etc. I'm usually the one on threads explaining to people it's not because they need weaning it's because xyz. But I just reached the end of my tether yesterday and thought 'what can I do to help me rest?' She is at the 19 week stage which in the wonder weeks book is a big week for change. She is actually changing a lot at the moment.
I never blame her for any of this and I would NEVER EVER use CIO/CC on one so young, and wouldn't ever want to use it if I could help it. She has got to this stage knowing that if she cries I am there within seconds and I wouldn't want it any other way tbh.

Also, we do have a bedtime routine of bath with daddy then into the dark room with me where we have a song and then he is swaddled, fed and put down drowsy and goes off. I just meant she doesn't have a set bedtime kind of thing. I think that, as well as her knowing I am straight there if she needs me, is what has helped her be such an excellent sleeper up to now.

I honestly can't believe how desperate I sound in the OP! I'm usually so resolute about things. I know all about the 4 month thing, teething, massive growth spurts. I'm completely focussed on breastfeeding for as long as possible. I think I just felt so incredibly tired and emotional and I needed people to agree with me that this has happened to the majority of their babies and it passes! LMAO.

I wouldn't say you sound desperate. We're all a bit out of sorts when we're fatigued...especially when it seems like there's no end in sight.

Also, I didn't think you would be trying CC/CIO, I was just posting it in general. I wouldn't judge anyone who chose that route, but it's not my style anyway.

Hang in there though. I've found with my son that it comes and goes. He'll have good nights and bad nights (last night being a bad one...I got less than 3 hours)...but my aunt (3 kids of her own...all grown) promises me all the time that it does get better.

 

[Seity]

White noise is great. A bit of lavender oil under the chin seems to help calm Gabriel and allow him to sleep longer/fall asleep faster (wish I'd tried this sooner -been using it the past week). The 4 month sleep regression is a bear. He went from waking every 2 hours to waking every hour. After it passed his sleep improved to waking every 3 hours though. I will never use CC/CIO either. I don't personally believe there is such a thing as making a 'rod for your back' when it comes to babies.

 

[Seraphim]

There was a thread a couple of weeks ago about babies getting good sleep habits *without* CIO/CC and it was really uplifting. I also have had the ringing ears of 'rod for your own back' 'spoilt' 'for their own good' etc etc and it was just then that H had a night where she woke and chattered to herself and went back to sleep - first time ever I think.

I felt a bit embarrassed to say it was the first time she'd done that (well since being a tiny baby) and that otherwise she needs help to go back to sleep - but the whole thread was really lovely to read all about LOs just developing these skills as the matured, rather than being pushed into it. Heaven knows I'd love more sleep than I've been getting this fortnight but it's not about me.

I've rambled, sorry - but it was more proof to me that I'm NOT making any rods.

 

[Jchihuahua]

I found 4 months absolute hell too! Then she was an absolute dream until 8 months and now it is hell again. I have had no sleep for a fortnight .