the effects of pain relief/epidural on baby

applejack

Expecting baby boy #2!!!!
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hello ladies, first time posting in this section! :flower: im hoping to have a drug free birth (in hospital but in a very lovely hospital i may add!) and im just wondering if anyone has any info on the effects of pain relief and epidurals on baby? does gas and air have any effect?

thankyou in advance :thumbup:
 
I know Pethidine effect babies respiratory and heart rate, Epi's also can effect baby but I'm not sure how much, I think its to do with heart rate and response.

Gas and air doesn't effect baby as it wears off so fast, tens doesn't effect baby, water doesn't effect baby.

Thats all my m/w has gone over with me :flow:
 
I had an epidural and my son and I are perfectly fine. He was alert and screaming and ready to breastfeed straightaway - despite being 6 weeks early. Try not to listen to too many scaremongering stories about all the apparantly awful things you will inflict on your child. Labour and childbirth is totally unpredictable and how you will while in immense pain may be different to now, so i suggest you go in with an open mind.
 
I've never really thought about it tbh! Ive had 2 with gas and air, and one with no pain relief.. none of them were any 'different' at birth, no drowsiness or delay in taking the first breath or anything!

I dont know anything abuot epidurals pethidine or anything, as I knew from the second I first got pregnant on my eldest, I would never consider such things so just havn't looked into them!
 
thanks ladies :flower: with my son i was induced b/c of fetal distress with pitocin, had diamorphine, gas & air and an epidural and he came out very sleepy and wouldnt latch on at all - so naturally i would quite like to avoid that this time if i can. all babies are different i know - he was perfectly healthy in the end depsite epidural also but i would just like to do it without one as i do feel that it had some negative effects on him (he became distressed shortly after i had my epidural, almost landed myself a c section but managed to push him out myself whilst numb with im very proud about lol! :happydance: ) and myself in the end. i had horrific back ache for months.

not trying to bash epidurals as mine was a life saver for me at the time (pitocin is a drug from hell) :flower: i just dont think my baby enjoyed it too much x
 
I got given pethidine during transition during my labour with dd (against my wishes) and she came out very sleepy and was too tired to be able to get a latch on my breast.

I haven't fully looked into epidurals but generally if you get one you have a greater risk for c section. I think because it slows down your labour, baby can then start to show distress which in turn can lead to a c section. Of course this won't happen to everyone, but I don't want to risk it if I can avoid it with other pain relief that doesn't have an adverse effect on my baby, myself or my labour.
 
thanks ladies :flower: with my son i was induced b/c of fetal distress with pitocin, had diamorphine, gas & air and an epidural and he came out very sleepy and wouldnt latch on at all - so naturally i would quite like to avoid that this time if i can. all babies are different i know - he was perfectly healthy in the end depsite epidural also but i would just like to do it without one as i do feel that it had some negative effects on him (he became distressed shortly after i had my epidural, almost landed myself a c section but managed to push him out myself whilst numb with im very proud about lol! :happydance: ) and myself in the end. i had horrific back ache for months.

not trying to bash epidurals as mine was a life saver for me at the time (pitocin is a drug from hell) :flower: i just dont think my baby enjoyed it too much x

This is pretty common outcome isn't it? Alot of woman I've known who've had one end up with back ache for several months afterwards.
 
I'm kinda sleepy but I'll try not to forget to much

Risks of Epidural
- Biggest risk is that it won't be effective or will only be partially effective
- Itchyness
- Increased need to augment labour (use oxytocin to boost contraction strength and frequency - artificial oxytocin increases risk of fetal distress and subsequently c-section)
- Increased risk of prolonged 2nd stage (pushing stage)
- Increased risk of instrumental delivery (vacuum or forceps)
- Risk of spinal headache occuring afterwards
- The procedure can hurt, but labour hurts too
- Increased incidence of breastfeeding difficulties, including getting baby to latch and breast engorgement issues. (epidurals require increased IV fluid intake in order to ensure a stable temp. Receiving lots of IV fluid in labour increases the chances of suffering from really bad (wore then physiological) engorgement and increases the risk of mastitis)
- Level of anesthesia may rise too high impairing ability to breathe
- Abnormal drop in blood pressure can occur
- Continuous monitoring not required but is generally used anyways
- Very very rare risk of neurological injury causing paralysis

And although risks exist most people who have epidurals end up perfectly fine and there are instances where epidurals can be benficial such as times when there is a pre-existing labour progress issue as sometimes the woman's tension can prevent adequate progress to occur. In this situation, an epidural can potentially relax the pelvic floor enough to encourage fetal descent and cervical dilation which can subsequently reduce the odds of requiring a c-section for progress... Best to try other things first like position changes to avoid the epidural having the opposite effect. Epidurals can also be beneficial in labours that are already at high risk for requiring a c-section, such as twins. An epidural can easily be topped up to provide adequate anasthesia for a c-section which allows the woman to be awake during the procedure. If it is a true emergency situation then often there is not enough time to insert a spinal for the c-section so general anesthesia would be used and when it is used you are put to sleep and your partner is generally not allowed to be in the room either.


Nitrous (Gas & Air) Risks
-Can cause dizziness, lightheadedness, nausea
-In rare cases can cause hallucinations
-Memories of labour and birth may become unclear or dreamlike
-Doesn't give full relief (but does take the edge of for many women)
-Not recommended for preterm births (<32 weeks) as it increases risk of intracranial hemorrhage
-Not recommended for women with vitamin B12 deficiencies (not sure why??)

The benefits of nitrous is that it is Very shortlasting, if you don't like how it makes you feel you stop using it and the effect is gone in a few short minutes if not seconds. It has not been shown to affect labour progress. It has not been associated with fetal or newborn distress. It has not been shown to influence newborn breastfeeding behaviours. An IV is not required nor is continuous monitoring required

Risks of Narcotics (such as demoral, but there's lots of different types)
- Can cause nausea and lightheadedness
- Been described as producing a "stoned" feeling
- Doesn't completely take pain away but changes your perception on what you think about the pain.
- Can also impair memories of the birth experience
- Longer acting than nitrous
- It's an injection and needles hurt, but labour hurts too.
- Baby is at risk of respiratory depression (being unable to breathe on their own) if born within 4 hours of the mom getting narcotics. This is reversable by giving the baby another drug called Narcan but if this occured baby would still be required to stay in NICU for post-resus observation.

Narcotics can be very very useful in managing early/prodromal/latent/false labour. False labour contractions CAN be just as painful as "real" contractions and can go on and on in some unfortunate women. In these women, a dose of narcotics can be just what they need to get a few hours of sleep and when they wake up the contractions will either be gone and they will enter labour later one when their body is ready or they will wake up in full fledge labour and be well rested to continue the labour with no further meds.


Anyways, every labour and birth is different and while it is good to plan for a natural birth with minimal intervention and most women commited to do this are in fact capable of doing so, it's definitly good to know what your pharmacological pain relief options are because as I mentioned above there are situations when they can do good... The key is determining when those situations are. It's also very very very good to be well versed in several non-medical pain relief options as well including water therapy and hypnobirthing.
 
As far as I have read gas and air is the only thing that won't effect you and baby durng or after birth x
 
I had a very long second stage, and Mog's head was stuck, so after five or so hours of gas and air sucking, I had a spinal block and managed to get her out with a lot of help from the ventouse and forceps. I didn't have a single problem with my spinal block or from the gas and air. I never had a back ache, or a head ache, I couldn't feel a thing (which after pushing for over four hours was pure heaven) and all of Mog's post-birth issues were caused by the extended second stage (fetal distress, leading to pooping, leading to meconium aspiration). I think if I had that birth again, I wouldn't allow them to break my waters and would have made more of an effort to turn her into a better birthing position, but I was totally whacked out by the pain and the midwives didn't realise she was stuck so I just kept pushing harder and harder instead. Poor baby. I'm confident that this birth will be quicker and easier, but I won't say no to an epidural if I don't dilate as quickly this time. If it doesn't work fully the first time, you can make them resite it, it doesn't (shouldn't anyway) hurt.
 
I used gna, needed pethadine for an ambulance transfer, epi (which got broken) had s pinal for a section....I honestly couldnt say if my baby had beeb sleepy/floppy etc as I was so het up on the morphine I had to have after the section I dont remember our first day really.
 
I had an epi, it didnt really work...
but my baby was fine :)
 
There are some great explanations of the effects in the book Gentle Birth Gentle Mothering by Sarah Buckley. Obviously, It has it's place but it is not risk free and some babies are born fine in spite of the birth not because of it and vice versa.

Here is a bit of what is in the book but the book contains a lot more info.

https://www.sarahbuckley.com/epidurals-risks-and-concerns-for-mother-and-baby/

Another site that goes through a few more but in a lot less detail:

https://www.mybirth.com.au/intervention/epidurals.html

If you learn the risks and benefits you will have the benefit of knowing when they can be used to get the best out of your birth rather then unnecessarily.
 
As long as you have the pethedine in plenty of time it will not affect the baby. With my first pethedine was a great effective source of pain relief and baby was born very alert. With my next 2 the pethedine was given within an hour of delivery and both babies were very drowsy for 24 hours afterwards. My daughter in particular would not feed because she just wanted to sleep. Since I expect an even faster labour this time I shall not have pethedine.
I have no experience of epidurals, although I do remember begging for 1 with each labour!
Don't think gas and air affects the baby but it can make the mother sick. I was very sick after my last baby and couldn't stop shaking, but I had been surgically attatched to the mouth piece so I could have just overdone it!
 

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