Asking for more grown up things...

[OnErth&InHvn]

DD1 is 10, 11 on the 22ND. We do have Modesty standards, she is home schooled and I would love advice!!!

Lately, she has been asking for her nails done, hair cut and ears pierced. 😂

She's never had her hair cut, she only sees me wear earrings to Temple and no-one gets their nails done here. Lol. I'm not sure if she's just growing up? Rebelling in some way?

What is, if any, compromise?
DH says nails OK but nothing that draws attention.
No ears yet.
No hair cut just yet and never above shoulders.
I agree but I don't know if we may push her to do it more?

She's going to summer camp next month. Jewish, with much heavier standards than we have. We were kind of hoping she'd see other girls don't have the things she wants.

PS, I adhere to all the above too. 😉

 

[Wannabe Mommy]

I think at that age girls see themselves as more grown up than they necessarily are and are striving to be more grown up. Plus hair, nails and such are fun and allow you to test what your style is.

I'd sit down and explain why modesty is important to you and your family and then see what you can do within those rules.

Clip on earrings, or you can get magnetic ones
A long layered hair style
Get some nice discreet colours of nail varnish
Lip balm with a hint of colour

 

[OnErth&InHvn]

Thanks. She does like clip ons.

DD2 has no interest in anything so that's a relief.

 

[jd83]

I agree with pp, clip on or magnetic earrings are a good compromise to actually getting ears pierced. Small, simple earrings can be a great way for her to develop her own personal style, but are still not attention grabbing, since that seems to be the main concern from what I'm gathering here. Also, there are tons of longer hair cuts that could be a compromise to give her hair some shape while still keeping it long. Not being allowed any hair cut/style at that age would be very difficult. Without a proper hair cut, long hair can really lack shape and definition. Those aren't things that draw attention, in my opinion. They are just things that are attributed to taking care of your appearance, even a modest appearance. Nail polishes can very modest, too. Neutral tones or clear polishes would be fine.

 

[Pearls18]

I don't understand what the problem is with her getting a hair cut? (Unless I'm missing something with the religious aspect). I would let them pick their own hair style at that age (not dying obviously).

Nail painting I think is harmless, and understand why you may want to delay ear piercing.

I think the nails and the hair cut are the fairest compromises.

 

[OnErth&InHvn]

I don't understand what the problem is with her getting a hair cut? (Unless I'm missing something with the religious aspect). I would let them pick their own hair style at that age (not dying obviously).

Nail painting I think is harmless, and understand why you may want to delay ear piercing.

I think the nails and the hair cut are the fairest compromises.

Its religious and has to do with Modesty, Vanity and drawing attention away from your heart.

 

[lau86]

If it's religious I think that opens a whole new can of worms about whether she has to follow the religion/ can make her own choices and how you deal with that as a parent. Have you explained to her the reasons behind no hair cut etc?

 

[SarahBear]

I can't speak to the religious aspect, but in terms of just modesty alone, I think a short haircut is rather modest, especially something like a bob haircut that is really simple and not flashy or attention grabbing. Personally, short hair seems more modest to me than long. It is also safe and temporary. It will grow back and you can give her a choice of haircuts that you approve of. As far as nail polish goes, I'm not crazy about it either, but think it's better to let kids that age explore a little. A compromise might be to limit it to certain settings or limit it to colors that you approve of. Perhaps let her use the kind that peels off so that it's easy to remove or have her use nail polish remover before certain settings. Another compromise could be to not allow it in your house, but to allow her to do it at a friend's house. This compromise could also involve requiring her to remove it after a certain amount of time or before she enters certain settings. As far as ears go, I personally would let my 10 year old choose, but this is also an act that involves actually piercing through flesh which is not temporary. Although the holes can heal over so that earrings can't get through, the scar is always there. It doesn't go away. It is permanent. The only compromise I can see is to use fake earrings and perhaps limit it to specific settings.

Edit: I just re-read and see that nails are OK? Well if that's the case, then I don't see a reason to compromise on that one.

 

[Pearls18]

I don't understand what the problem is with her getting a hair cut? (Unless I'm missing something with the religious aspect). I would let them pick their own hair style at that age (not dying obviously).

Nail painting I think is harmless, and understand why you may want to delay ear piercing.

I think the nails and the hair cut are the fairest compromises.

Its religious and has to do with Modesty, Vanity and drawing attention away from your heart.

Ok, I still think it's a shame that religions put these expectations on girls, I'm not quite sure how a girl/woman choosing her hair style calls into question her modesty or vanity, but suppose it's one of the many reasons I've decided to walk away from religion. Perhaps you should seek advice from within your community as to how they deal with these understandable reactions from your children?

 

[jessmke]

Since this is a religious issue I think your best bet is to discuss the reasons why you believe in these rules. Just saying no without her understanding the reasons why will probably lead to rebellion. Then you can discuss ways that she can express herself or experiment with her appearance a little bit while still abiding by the rules. Maybe outside the home she can wear nude shades of nailpolish, but she can only experiment with colored nails inside your home as a bit of dress up play. Color has to come off when she leaves home. What about keeping her hair long but allowing her to cut bangs? Or if not then maybe she can get some fun headbands. Clip on earrings are a great option too, and you can restrict her to wearing them only at home again as dress up play if you don't want her wearing them outside. I think it's important to compromise a little bit with her to keep her from rebelling while also ensuring she understands why these rules are in place.

 

[fantastica]

Agree with SarahBear in that sometimes shorter hair seems more modest than long...but I don't really understand the issue with the haircut/religion. I do think it's important to talk to her and find some compromise or she will probably end up rebelling much more as she gets older, it's good that you and your husband are both considering how you can meet half way. What did she think of the compromise?

Just as an aside and I don't want to cause offence, but I remember your tattoo thread from a while ago and was wondering the difference to this and what your daughter wants? I was always under the impression that tattoos were either forbidden or at least frowned upon in Judaism? (Please correct me if I'm wrong - just curious!)

 

[weedle]

Personally, I feel you should allow her to get her hair cut. I can't imagine it's very healthy looking if it hasn't ever been cut? hair is nothing to do with modesty. I'd also agree for pale nail varnish. I would allow my daughter to have her ears pierced at 10 but you're well within your right as a parent to insist she waits until she's 16 when she can go and do it herself.

I don't think she is rebelling, just finding herself as a person and that is 100% ok and your personal beliefs should not effect her.

 

[OnErth&InHvn]

Just as an aside and I don't want to cause offence, but I remember your tattoo thread from a while ago and was wondering the difference to this and what your daughter wants? I was always under the impression that tattoos were either forbidden or at least frowned upon in Judaism? (Please correct me if I'm wrong - just curious!)

We are Reform and they are very lax. ( My rabbi was one of the first Synagogues in the area to perform a same sex marriage for example.)

Different Jews or synagogues may have different beliefs and it may even vary by location!

and my tats are modest, they are words and dont stand out/draw attention. Simple black ink.
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UPDATE:
We have come to a conclusion and have talked to her. She is the most excited about getting her nails painted.

 

[Zephram]

I would definitely let her get a haircut. Long hair that has never even had a trim starts to look straggly, dry and unkempt. Not to mention heavy and hot! There are lots of lovely ways to get a haircut and keep hair long, to be honest I think part of teaching kids to look after their bodies is teaching them to have their hair trimmed every now and then so they don't get split ends and it doesn't start looking unkempt.

I'm another who doesn't understand the issue with having a haircut and religion, so I really can't speak to that.

 

[OnErth&InHvn]

We have it figured out. Thanks

 

[loeylo]

Glad you have got it figured out, I was brought up Christian by my parents, and had slightly stricter dress standards than my peers, it lead to so much conflict and rebelling to the point I got a job and used my own money to get piercings, but ridiculously immodest clothing, buy alcohol and dye my hair in ridiculous colours.

Your rabbi is okay with tattoos but not haircuts? I think self expression is an important part of growing up. I won't let my dd get her ears pierced until she is around 8, but providing her essentials are covered and she isn't wearing anything overtly sexual we will be good to go.

 

[OnErth&InHvn]

We have rules. The temple has rules.

I have a friend who had really strict rules and the most rebelling she did was get her ears pierced in college. That's it. So it can go either way.

 

[minties]

I can't speak to the religious aspect, but in terms of just modesty alone, I think a short haircut is rather modest, especially something like a bob haircut that is really simple and not flashy or attention grabbing. Personally, short hair seems more modest to me than long. It is also safe and temporary. It will grow back and you can give her a choice of haircuts that you approve of. As far as nail polish goes, I'm not crazy about it either, but think it's better to let kids that age explore a little. A compromise might be to limit it to certain settings or limit it to colors that you approve of. Perhaps let her use the kind that peels off so that it's easy to remove or have her use nail polish remover before certain settings. Another compromise could be to not allow it in your house, but to allow her to do it at a friend's house. This compromise could also involve requiring her to remove it after a certain amount of time or before she enters certain settings. As far as ears go, I personally would let my 10 year old choose, but this is also an act that involves actually piercing through flesh which is not temporary. Although the holes can heal over so that earrings can't get through, the scar is always there. It doesn't go away. It is permanent. The only compromise I can see is to use fake earrings and perhaps limit it to specific settings.

Edit: I just re-read and see that nails are OK? Well if that's the case, then I don't see a reason to compromise on that one.[seeking

I agree. Long hair is much more attention-seeking and I would think there would be a bit of pride/vanity in maintaining it.

 

[OnErth&InHvn]

We have it figured out. Thanks