# What is reasonable access for a father of a newborn baby



## Lemonflower

Hi everyone

I have posted on here a few times but will explain my situation as brief as I can.

The FOB and I were engaged, he proposed in June and we started trying for a baby at that time as well. We conceived in July and were really happy.
Week 5-14 I had horrendous morning sickness and was really stressed and emotional as we were buying a house! When I was 13 weeks pregnant he decided to cancel the house we were buying, losing me over £1000 in fee money. He then left me saying "we're just not working and it's for the best". I don't know where this has come from and begged him to stay though he's nanny gave him a massive deposit for a new property and he bought that within 9 days of leaving me :-(. He's done so much to me since then, it's like he hates me:-(

Despite him leaving and not wanting me he still wants to be a father which is great. The only thing is he demanded joint custody which I said no to.
He got abusive and threatened to take me to court! He mocked me saying he has the money to do it (his nanny's money) and a stable home and I will just be a "skank" on benefits (I will have to accept benefits because my maternity pay will not cover rent/bills ect now that he's left...). I have made it clear he will have regular access and he knows I'm true to my word because my father walked out on me and I have always said men like that digust me... He has actually wrote publically on Facebook and spoke to mutual friends that he will get the baby 3-4 days a week as he has the money!! He takes the piss out of me saying that he knows I'll be fair but he wants more, "cos he f**king can"!!
I'm so heartbroken - I don't understand why he's doing this....

Mainly I'm so scared that he will get joint custody which would break me!! He's telling me he's gonna use in court that I am bulimic (he's referring to MS) also he's gonna use that I self harmed more than 10 years ago when I was in my teens and that I lashed out at the police when I was younger and it is on my record (I've been fine since, healthy, working and good person).

FOB: Has not paid a penny so far, does not contact me about the baby and says painful things that he knows will come back to me, claimed he's not the dad (he knows damn well he is the father due to fertility issues i have.)

My questions are:

*Do I put him on the BC? (I don't want his money) he claims he wants a DNA test anyway which I am willing to provide (he's from a mixed up family where only last year he found out his dad out of two potential fathers)
*What access is reasonable for a newborn baby? I'll be breastfeeding and I really have no idea what access to give him - he works Monday - Friday 9-5.
*What are the stages of court? I know he will not be happy with what I offer.
*What do I do about these false allegations? He's been an A hole recently but I'm not lowering myself to lie about him in court.

Sorry for the long post! I'd very much appreciate your answers and experiences!!
Many thanks

xxxxx


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## Laura2919

You can put him on the BC that wouldnt get him joint custody. The most he will get is visitation rights. They definitely wont give him joint custody not at the beginning if at all. Let him take you to court. Just because your on benefits doesnt mean you cannot raise a child. That doesnt matter to the court, just as long as you have a place to live, your able to afford your LO is fed, clothed and is happy. Thats their only concern. 

Before court you will most likely be offered mediation. Sometimes this works, you can have a contract drawn up in which you both agree to the terms whatever they may be. 

I wouldnt worry, he will get visitation and seen as your offering him visitation then thats ok. 

3-4 days is bloody laughable. He wont get that! Especially a newborn. Newborns are encouraged to be with their mother for the first few months and then after that he will get one night every other weekend... 

Tell him he aint got a clue..


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## Mally01

Personally I wouldn't put him on the birth certificate and if he got anymore nastier I would bloody well tell a blatant lie and say he is not the father to get rid of his sorry ass. But I guess you wouldn't want that so...Fight fire with fire and give him the facts. Do your research and show him you mean business. I would send him information on how he stands no chance in hell of getting custody in the beginning, then I would send him info on how he will NEVER get 3-4 days a week. 

Look, the moment a man runs away from his baby and behaves like an idiot (record everything by the way, save texts, e-mails, print screen facebook rants etc, record it all) he throws away most of his rights, especially if he makes no attempt to contact you, go to antenatal classes, scans etc. Is he going to be there for the birth? If he has said no, then there we go, another nail in his coffin. 

Take a deep breath,speak to someone who deals with these types of cases and give yourself some peace of mind. He can't take your baby away from you, no matter how much money he has, he's an idiot.


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## mkm1083

I'm guessing the UK must be different than the US with custody arrangements because my boyfriend has joint physical and legal custody of his daughter and has her 3 days a week. He started having her overnight at 2 or 3 months, I can't remember which. 

Provided that he's actually a good father 50/50 is not a bad thing. The jerk needs to be reasonable though. Thinking logically, as long as you are breastfeeding the courts will have to limit the amount of visitation he gets as the baby won't be able to be away from you for very long at any one time.


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## xSophieBx

If you put him on the BC he automatically gets parental responsibility so its upto you if you want him having these. He can however, fight it through courts and get his name put on there regardless. However.. I'd be inclined not to bother putting him on it if his going down the route of dna test... prick!

Theres noway he'd get that amount of time.. let him laugh all he wants as he'll b the 1 laughed at in court with that behaviour and attitude... Its usually dads that have lived with their child and then theres been a split that they get 50/50 and its usually agree with the mother. Personally, I don' think his got a hope in hells chance of getting 50/50 when his never lived with the child etc etc... a bond is going to have to be built gradually before he'll even get unsupervised access. A mother and baby bond is very important in the early days, especially when trying to establish breastfeeding. I would think an hour or 2, supervised at your house once a week or a couple of times a week is more then fair to start off with. As he works all week, he could come for an hour mid week after work, before LO's bedtime and then a couple of hours at the weekend if your happy with that.

The stages of court is a long drawn out process so nothing will happen overnight. There will be solicitor letters 1st, probs with an unreasonable request from him, and before he can even apply for a court application you will have to go to mediation etc etc... He will have a fight on his hands if he wants 50/50. 

The false allegations won't even be considered if he can't back them up with proof. Please don't worry about those.. infact it will probs help you as his gonna look like a right idiot bringing all that up. Don't worry about the 50/50.. he isn't gonna get it... I wouldn't respond to anymore of his bullcrap and tell him not to bother contacting you anymore and you will be in touch if you have anything to tell him about the baby. Keep all evidence of the nasty stuff his coming out with. 

I would also get onto CSA as soon as the babies born as he sounds like he won't bother paying either!! 

Lastly a huge :hugs: sorry his being a a.hole but honestly, do not stress over it all... enjoy the pregnancy and we'll see if he even bothers following through with his pathetic threats! xx


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## Lemonflower

Thanks ladies!

He's refusing to come to all the appts with me - though I don't want him coming anyway!! He doesn't even ask how we are both are. We work for the same company and I have been signed off work for 3 weeks and he hasn't even dropped me text.

I don't think I will put him on the BC. He's going to DNA the baby anyway so he will get on the BC at a later date and I can't help but think that cos him and his family have all this money then they can take this route. I was tempted to say he is not the FOB but I'll just keep quiet.
I'm just worried the courts will see this as me being awkward and it will go against me.
Could I say that he had no communication through my pregnancy, left me, contributed no money.....??
When the baby is born that's when he'll crawl out of the woodwork!
He'll get paternity leave which makes me sick! He's told a mutual friend he'll use it as a 2 week p*ss up! He doesn't deserve to be a dad - I believe he's just using this baby as an object! He's a spoilt brat who's always got what he wants!

I think if he does rear his ugly head I'll say he can have supervised visits at my home for 2 hours a week/every 2 weeks.
I'll leave the house because I don't want to be near him. It's obvious he's going to take me to court anyway.

So do you think the courts will see me as awkward doing this:
*Not putting his name on the BC (like I said he'll get on there anyway)
*supervised visits - 2 hours per week.

Obviously when baby is older I will say to the courts he can have every other weekend for a day and night. Weekdays wouldn't work because by the time he finishes work and picks up LO it will be coming up to their bedtime!

Mally - your ex sounds like a piece of work have you heard from him yet? Do you think he'll be back? If he does what are your plans?

Laura - your ex sounds charming too!! Do you think you'll end up in court? Does it hurt that he has a new partner and that she's around your little twins!

Mkm - I couldn't tell you if it's different laws in the UK then in the US. I never ever thought I'd be in this situation.
Most mums have 9 months - 1 year maternity leave off work to look after the baby and the bloke usually works. I've never really heard of a man going for joint custody - I think he's doing it out of spite. I don't know how he'll work it, he works Monday-Friday 9-5.
He knows I'll breastfeed because we discussed I would when we were TTC. He said, "well you'll have to get one of those pump thingys and "milk" yourself".

I don't even know this man anymore! 6 years together and he's like a stranger! Lots of our mutual friends think he's just gone mental but I'd never treat anyone like this!
Did other mums or expectant mums see I change in FOB before or after pregnancy?

Xxxxx


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## xSophieBx

Oh I know the 'using the baby as an object' all to well. I would DEF not put him on the birth cert and list the reasons u have just put when your in court and say you want him to earn his parental responsibility by fulfilling all of them before you'll consider to have him on there. 

A court will not look badly on that.. you have offered contact and thats the main thing, the only time you would look bad is if u refused everything.. you need to make sure your 1 step ahead of him on everything. I think 2 hours a week is more then fair enough to start, he'll be sleeping all the time anyway! Are u going to get someone else to supervise? Good idea


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## Lemonflower

Aww! Thank you Sophie, your post has really reassured me! I was just sitting there sobbing and now I feel stronger after reading that.

He will not offer money... He mentioned that he will tell the courts that I'm struggling and that he has a kitted out nursery with everything the baby needs!
I'm not struggling I have the most amazing family and friends and working at the moment saving like crazy (whilst paying rent and bills in the house he left me in!!) 
I've currently been signed off (I'm shocked and devastated by what he's done, he's told he's friend to tell me that it will look bad in court) my doctor has reassured me that is will not. He's such a nasty b**tard!!

I'm trying so hard to enjoy pregnancy I've wanted this for so long and that PRICK is ruining it!! He's missing so much and will miss so much when LO is here!!

xxx


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## Mally01

Good lord hun, this guy is just a nasty bloke isn't he. I can't believe he is just refusing to accompany you to something as important as a scan or appointment which checks up on the baby's health and well being after all the prattling on he is doing about having the baby off you. 

I can't imagine for one minute that a court would look favourably on this attitude he has. He is basically saying 'I don't give a shit about the process of my baby getting here, it's just afterwards that's important' which as we all know is a crock of shit.

As far as my ex is concerned, like yours, he was like Jekyll and Hyde about my pregnancy. One minute a loving, attentive man who cared very much for me for two years and the next, acting like I don't even exist anymore. I have no idea if he will come back, I think 'no' as he is dead set against having kids, so he would probably like the idea now of pretending this one doesn't exist. The longer time goes by though, the more he doesn't stand a chance of getting anywhere near me personally again. People tell me he will want to see his baby, if only out of curiosity...I don't think that will happen at all.

Good luck with your FOB and like others have said, be one step ahead of him and show that you are not being unreasonable with allowing him to see his child. Remain calm and collected and let him behave like a looney. He is actually not allowed paternity leave unless he lives at home with the mother or will be responsible in the beginning with being there when the baby is being delivered and at home helping you out straight after etc. That is what paternity leave is for, for Father's that are _there _and actively helping out. It also makes me laugh how he prattles on about having so much money (from himself or family) and yet won't give you a cent towards child support...what a tosser. I think you need to just rely on him to sink himself all by his own, he is proving to be incredibly dumb about all this. I also think that judging by his current behaviour he is more than likely to be all talk and no action. The reality of actually caring for a newborn will hit him like a ton of bricks and he appears to not be the type of man who will take this responsibility easily. You may end up with him having early (agreed by you, visitation rights) and then he just disappears when he realises the responsibility he has. I would put money on it, that that is how he will behave.


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## SophiasMummy

For the first 6 months the court wouldnt support overnight stays with him or for as long as your breastfeeding, if he tries to tell you to express so he can feed the baby make an excuse like it messes with your supply or you cant get enough milk for baby when you express etc all of which are often true espcially when the baby is little, just because he has more money wont get him anywhere in court. I would keep a record of any correspondance between you just incase he does try to take you to court. But to be honest he would most likely get laughed out the court room not that it would even make it that far. Wish you all the best with your LO. Vindictive men like that dont deserve children Xxx


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## Lemonflower

As I'm in the UK and on mat leave and benefits will I get Legal Aid to help me when/if he takes me to court? :-( xxxx


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## xSophieBx

^^ Yes u will hun. I get legal aid. 

He won't be getting overnight stays for a loooooong time, regardless of breastfeeding or not.


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## Lemonflower

Thank you Sophie! I can't get it at the moment as I work, who do I ask after the baby is born? Xxx


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## xSophieBx

You literally just ring round solicitors and fine one that does legal aid.. Not many do now days :( This website is the best one as it was recommended to me by a solicitor

https://www.resolution.org.uk/landing-two-cols.asp?page_id=21

Click find a family lawyer, and then u type in your postcode and it comes up with all the 1s near u and then it has a green tick next to it if they do legal aid. 

So then u can ring one, make an appointment with them and take proof that ur on benefits etc(bank statement) and they photocopy it and sort out legal aid for you. xx


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## jaytee146

:hugs:


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## InVivoVeritas

What a horrible situation he's put you in! And what's worst of all is the fact that he's using your baby to hurt and manipulate you. If he seemed to genuinely love and care about his child it would probably be easier to take.

What I'd say is document *everything*. Take screenshots of anything he posts on Facebook, keep a notebook and carefully date and record everything inappropriate he says to you. Inform him about all the appointments in writing and keep copies. Do the same with the access you're offering him. When I went through my custody battle documentation was the most important thing in my favour.

He won't automatically get custody just because he has more money -- the courts are smarter than that. Your job now is to keep your cool and make sure that you do everything right. If you're continuing to inform him about appointments and offering reasonable access while he's acting like a pr*ck, and if you document that over time then his game will be obvious to the courts.

I personally wouldn't put his name on the birth cert, and if he's requesting DNA tests then you can't reasonably be expected to. Putting his name on the birth cert automatically gives him parental rights, and I'd be inclined to make him work for every tiny crumb of progress.

Hang in there, it will get better. :hugs:


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## cluelessnow

FOB turned into Jekyl and Hyde and turned nasty when he found out I was pregnant. He agreed for me to go off the pill but didn't think of the consequences. He's in another country now and wants little to do with our son. Hope things work out for you. :hugs:


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## angelpkj

xSophieBx said:


> You literally just ring round solicitors and fine one that does legal aid.. Not many do now days :( This website is the best one as it was recommended to me by a solicitor
> 
> https://www.resolution.org.uk/landing-two-cols.asp?page_id=21
> 
> Click find a family lawyer, and then u type in your postcode and it comes up with all the 1s near u and then it has a green tick next to it if they do legal aid.
> 
> So then u can ring one, make an appointment with them and take proof that ur on benefits etc(bank statement) and they photocopy it and sort out legal aid for you. xx

what type of benefits must you be on
i only get child benefit and working tax credits 
i work but earn little


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## wouldluvabub

Lemonflower- I just searched you as hadn't heard from you in SO long and I wanted to see how you were going and was shocked to read this! You poor thing.. You must be going through so much! As hard as it may be try your hardest to enjoy your pregnancy and forget about him, also don't loose your cool with him EVER! He sounds like a sneaky turd who would use it against you. What you need to do is keep receipts for all of the thing's YOU have brought for the baby so he can not claim he brought them. You also need to keep any abusive text messages or facebook things he says.. The more he put's in writing the better it is for you! If you can keep a record of the abuse and then lack of interest he has shown he won't do well in court. I have not been through any of this before but I just know you need some evidence to support what you are saying. If you don't know there is a button on your keyboard called 'print screen' or PrtSc. If he puts anything on facebook if you press this button it will take a screen shot and then you just go into 'paint' program on your computer and click paste. You will then have a screen shot saved of what he has said. As for text messages just try not to delete any. And don't retaliate against any horrible things he says or he could use that against you. Try to keep some proof of you asking him to come to appointments and things. You have done nothing wrong. You have nothing to worry about. He obviously had issues...

Apart from all that horribleness hope you and your little man are doing well!!! How are you coming with names and things? Hope you ex doesn't think he deserves a say.. I tried to see if you have a journal but couldn't find one!


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## Lemonflower

Hi Wouldluvabub !
Thank you for the advice. I don't have a journal as I know i'd be useless at keeping it up !:dohh:
Yeah can't believe i'm in this situation and that he's done this really. 6 years together - I never knew him or maybe I did and I refused to see, I dunno..... Was so happy when we were trying to conceive and got engaged. It really has been a shock and devestating. :sad:
Trying to look at the positive things, I already love my little boy and so lucky I am pregnant with him especially after being diagnosed with PCOS. He is still my miracle baby. :happydance:

Thank you for the advice, - I feel a little embarrassed sometime as I was gushing about how happy and in love we were only a few months ago! How things can change....
He's gone back to being silent and I don't wanna know what he gets up to or write on Facebook.

So happy you're pregnancy is going well - 26 weeks already, nearly 3rd trimester ! How exciting, or scary !!!
I remember you posted names on your journal - what were they ? Have you decided on any yet ?
We had names from years ago and I'm actually gonna keep the boy name because I really like it and I know he does (it'll be spiteful if I changed it for the sake of it)
However I always said if baby is a boy he would have taken his first name as the middle name and also his surname. I wont be doing that now. Baby isn't haven't a middle name and will have my surname. I'm actually sad about that!

How is your sickness now, mine stopped at 15 weeks thank god. Do you feel lots of kicks ? They're lovely (at the moment - before they get too hard and under the ribs lol)

x x x x


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## makecaker

Sounds like you are in an awful position.
I personally would keep your mouth shut and dont stoop to his level. Just nod and agree, record all the nasty things he says/does and get legal advice.
I haven't been in this situation with fob but we have been in a similiar situation with my mil oh when she was very poorly. (long story) We tried to contact her oh after her death to sort some things without court he ended up going to the police and my oh got a warning for harassment! We hadn't harassed him just tried ringing a few times and got no answer so tried emailing, no answer etc etc. sorry going off the subject a bit but just a warning that sometimes it is just better not to contact him or anything, on the other hand if he keeps hassling you, you can always go to police, however this will probs make him more angry.
Birth certificate, I would put his name on. Hopefully all of this will e in the past when your lo is older and you won't want him to know or hate you for it and he has a right to know who is father is. Only thing I would say is that you need to make sure you have contracts of visitation etc before you leave him alone with baby so he can't take him and keep him aslong as he feels like.
I know it's hard an I know he might be a complete idiot but he is still the babies dad so no matter how much you hate him you have to put that aside and let your son have a good relationship with his dad no matter what he has done to you, Maybe look at it from the other side, if he was telling you you could only see baby for 2 hours a week or one weekend a fortnight?

However are you sure he really wants baby half the week (which i dont really agree with, unsettling for kids i think) and it's not just to hurt you? The more you resist the more he will say it?? So again I would probably just keep mouth shut come up with a reasonable plan of access for when the time comes for mediation/court or whatever. If you are reasonable they will see him as unreasonable and being a pain and go in your favour. I know you can even set it in place whether he is allowed to take lo on holiday each year, for how long and whether he can leave country or not etc so maybe be generous with that so you can be less generous with other access or something? 
I really think you need legal advice, Im sure if you go to job centre or citizens advice or somewhere they will help you for free. If you have car insurance or house insurance with legal advice you can ring them and ask them legal advice about anything for free.
Sorry this is long and probably doesn't make huge sense bcos I wrote it on phone so can't see all of what I've wrote but hope it might help a little. 
Good luck with it all xxx


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## wouldluvabub

Ok firstly don't feel silly for thinking things would be perfect, 6 years is a long time together and nobody expects what's happened to you.. Your not silly.. It sounds as though your ex has some issues and maybe the responsibility of this baby brought that all to the surface.. My bet is he will be a very sorry man one day and regret his decisions. But in the end you shouldn't put up with that treatment! 

Yes everything is goin well!! And I am so excited to nearly be in 3rd tri! Can't actually believe it! It's going so quick but at the same time in starting to get uncomfortable after big meals and when trying to sleep so I'm not really looking forward to getting bigger lol!!

The names we are deciding between at spencer and Braxton. I am leaning more toward braxton This week!!! What is your little mans name?

Morning sickness finally buggered off after 16weeks! I think hubby had a hard time believing I was so sick until I threw up in his car! Oops!! Ha ha!! It's so funny while I was suffering through the morning sickness I swore this baby would be an only child, now it's gone I am already thinking about a second lol!! If my morning sickness was the same I just wouldnt be able to work.. I ended up loosing 5kgs in the first 12 weeks! It was horrible! I was so worried about the baby, I just have no idea how he could have survived but he did and even manged to measure a whole week bigger at my 12 week scan!! Amazing little creatures they are!! :)


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## Lemonflower

Thanks Makecaker ! FOB is serious - it's a bonus he gets to hurt me in the process of applying for joint custody !

I've heard he is smoking weed and dabbling in drugs at the weekend. He's not addicted and it's recreational but still I don't like it, I don't know where I stand with this infomation.
If he's going to fling accusations and lies about me then I will bring this up in court but then I don't know if it will sound like tit-for-tat !!!??
I don't want a "druggie" around my son - he knows I hate all that.

Wouldluvabub - I will reply to you on your journal, it's a happier thread then this one 

xxx


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