# IVF with intralipids, steroids, aspirin and heparin...?!?! Anyone else?



## Reb S

You can see from the thread title what my issue is! I'm contemplating doing my 2nd and final IVF and not only am I faced with IVF over 40 and all the issues that raises, but my immunes testing has come back with MTHRF and raised NK cells. The FS has said I would have steroids from stimming until - (assuming pregnancy) 12 weeks, plus intralipid IV's, once on EC day, and then two more; plus aspirin and heparin. It seems like a LOT of drugs.
Does anyone know anything about this stuff, or has anyone else taken it all?! I would love to hear of success after taking all these drugs, or any advice anyone has got as to whether to try or just give up in the face of pretty bad odds...
Thanks!!!
Reb x


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## _Nell

Hi Reb :) 

It's good in a way you have a bit of diagnosis, it means there's a great chance the extra meds will work for you.

I was due to take much the same as you've listed this current ivf cycle, but as i only saw Dr G half way through i didn't have time for clexane while stimming just post ET.

Unfortunately my cycle went a bit off, my lining was just 6mm and so my pg odds v low, I opted not to take the clexane and save the big guns for what will be my last round.
However, i do finally have some frosties so will be trying a fet with the whole lot in a few cycles time.

I have to be honest i'm a bit pretrified of the clexane. The aspirin and steroids have been fine and the intralipids is just a food/soy mix so not so scary to me. With the clexane i'm worried i'll run out of spots to inject and of course once i start if i get a bfp i can't just bottle out and stop.

However, i had a thread asking about clexane and both ladies who replied were pg.....so i see that as a great sign!

Good luck - where/when are you cycling?


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## Reb S

Hi Nell and thanks for replying! It's great that you have frosties! My last cycle we just made it to blastocyst but none of the others could be kept - seems a shame when I had 18 fertilised eggs! (bit of OHSS)
If we cycle (still under debate as my odds at my age are less than 13%) it'll be just after New Year, I've just hit Day 1, so probably start down-reg about the 5th..urk! Means I have to be good over Xmas...I was going to start last week, but had pneumonia!
I know what you mean about running out of spots to inject - last cycle I was SO glad to stop and this time (if I got BFP) I'd be going till week 12!
Also - don't steroids make you puffy and your hair fall out?! That's what I thought, hope I'm wrong!
I'm at the Lister, not Dr G, but after my mc I had a hunch and made them test me - just as well, considering what they found! You say this is your last round too - is that age, money or just had enough? How many times have you IVF'd?
x


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## GillAwaiting

Reb S said:


> Hi Nell and thanks for replying! It's great that you have frosties! My last cycle we just made it to blastocyst but none of the others could be kept - seems a shame when I had 18 fertilised eggs! (bit of OHSS)
> If we cycle (still under debate as my odds at my age are less than 13%) it'll be just after New Year, I've just hit Day 1, so probably start down-reg about the 5th..urk! Means I have to be good over Xmas...I was going to start last week, but had pneumonia!
> I know what you mean about running out of spots to inject - last cycle I was SO glad to stop and this time (if I got BFP) I'd be going till week 12!
> Also - don't steroids make you puffy and your hair fall out?! That's what I thought, hope I'm wrong!
> I'm at the Lister, not Dr G, but after my mc I had a hunch and made them test me - just as well, considering what they found! You say this is your last round too - is that age, money or just had enough? How many times have you IVF'd?
> x

Im on all that stuff including intralipids, 3rd month of it. Did TSI, then IUI and now ICSI. Egg retrival was yesterday. I can tell you that after 6 weeks my head started to look like a football. I've lost all definition and cheekbones and can no longer see my dimples!! It's mad. Also I had to wax my lips, never had to do that before. No hair falling out yet... :wacko: I seem to have put on a few pounds but I think its mostly water retention to be honest. I've had 2 m/c, got the wrong antibodies, lots of other crap.

It will all be worth it if it works. They told me I would be on the clexane etc for the duration of pregnancy and would have to do more intralipids.

Also something else weird, everytime I do the intralipid infusion I get the nastiest taste in my mouth for ages. It's really horrible and cannot be gotten rid of. So strange. 

Good luck with it all. xx


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## Reb S

Blimey you're scaring me! What do you mean your head looks like a football?! Which drug causes that and why?! Hope your EC went well and here's crossed fingers for fertilization x


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## _Nell

Blimey Gill that's scarey!

Reb - i think Gill is describing 'moonface' from the steroids - not everyone gets it.

I know what you mean though about worrying, i read the steroids leaflet and was petrified, so in a way i'm glad i've had 1 cycle with some steroids in (and then clexan and steroids for next cycle).
For me i haven;'t honestly noticed anything from the steroids at all, whether that would change if i took them for 12 weeks i don't know.

Sorry i forgot you were at the lister, i didn't realise they did that full a range of tests - it's good that they did though for you.

Re it being my last round, well i've done 3 fresh cycles, had 5 embryos put back in and so sort of feel I have to stop somewhere really. So a 4th fresh cycle would be my last, braving it with all the extra meds so i have 'no regrets' with trying really. I now have a little extra lifeline with trying a frozen cycle too though. Every cycle i've had problems with a thin lining and i feel like that's the real problem with me, if we can't fix that i don't want to keep going through all this with such tiny odds of pg (thin lining = rare for pg)


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## Springflower

Hi

Hello Nell again!:flower:

I used these drugs with my last cycle. I had full immunes with Dr Gorgy. It's the first time I've been pregnant and I'm pregnant with twins. Honestly I found the additional drugs fine. Please believe me when I say that Clexane is not a problem. I have to take it to birth and I've not experienced any issues. Yes sometimes I get bruises, but they are just bruises! I'm small and I haveny have a problem finding places to inject, if you are really worried then you can use your upper thighs as well. I may well do this as my tummy gets more stretched. 

Also intralipidds are just soya and egg yolk. I would be very again if you had a reaction. Steriods aren't that bad either, they just made me eat like a demon!!

Honestly I'm so so glad I went down this route. Of course you have to do what you feel comfortable with. I decided to throw everything at my last cycle and put my faith completely in Dr G. Even if it hadnt worked I would have tried it and known that I'd investigated that avenue.

Good luck!


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## Reb S

Nell - wow, you've really gone for it! We swore after round 1 that that was enough, but then I had a really old fashioned protocol that meant I was d-regging forever. Disaster. As for the Lister - I kind of pushed them into the testing, as I had a very rare auto-immune reaction to antibiotics a few years ago and that made me put two and two together. Glad I did!
Moonface?! I'm going to google that immediately...

Springflower - fantastic news! 16 weeks with twins, congratulations! If you're small as well you must be getting really bumpy now! Thanks for the encouraging post x


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## Springflower

It's very cool. I'm looking very big already but its brilliant. Promise you all the strange drugs make it worthwhile.:hugs:


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## _Nell

Thanks springflower, that's what I keep telling myself.

I'm going back to Dr G pre my FET I think, he originally told me to try the clexane this cycle post EC (but that was before the cycle went all belly up, then we agreed this wasn't the right time :()
I read on another forum that clexane is best through stimming/pre O so i'm wondering if he'll prescribe some for my the whole of my FET and if it *may* just help me sort my lining too.
I've only had the basic immunes tests.....hoping he doesn't make me do the full lot (and more £) tbh as it won't change the treatment from my perspective, i've decided LIT and IvIg isn't for me (yet!)

Reb - Good luck hun, let me know how you get along with the meds too?


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## Reb S

Nell - we haven't decided to go ahead, yet. It's the elephant in the room and we never talk about it! We've got 7 weeks to decide. Basically I want to, but I'm scared to go through it all again; he thinks we're too old (we are!) Are you doing FET first, or fresh?
Springflower thanks for the encouraging words! x


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## GillAwaiting

Sorry for frightening anyone with the steroids! Yes moonface is most definitely what I have but it didn't start to kick in until after 6 weeks. It's not so bad. People have told me lately I look really well. I think the puffiness has ironed out the creases and wrinkles.

I seem to be experiencing OHSS and have to go back to clinic to be drained today. Please god the cycle won't be cancelled. The eggs are going to blast so chances are we wont have any to freeze either or we will have to make a decision and freeze them today at day 3. :(


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## Reb S

Oh Gill, bad luck with the OHSS. I had a touch of it, but not bad enough for any intervention. Good luck today x


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## _Nell

Gill - sorry to hear of the OHSS, i hope the pain eases ok for ET.

Reb - good luck with the decision, it's not easy to know when to go ahead and when to stop, I know we're close. I think we'll do a FET and then the last fresh but I plan to have a consult at a different clinic to see what they suggest.


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## GillAwaiting

Just thought I'd come back on here and say I seem to pregnant (2 hpts say I am and levels rising), beta blood tomorrow to confirm. So maybe all the extra pills and injections will be worth it..?? And the moonface? Loads more people have told me Im looking really well!! I think the rounded cheeks have taken a few years off :)

I survived the OHSS after getting drained of the fluid. It was a comedy. A massive male nurse putting his full weight on my stomack and 'milking' me while the doctor and nurse did the technical bits and measure what was coming out. And then I farted!! Legs in stirrups, big man pressing down on me, I couldn't help it!! I was mortified. Dr was decent though and didn't made an issue.

The night pees from the steroids are doing my head in though. Been like that since I started them but have gotten worse in the last week or so. More intralipids might be on the cards.


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## _Nell

Gill - congratulations that's lovely news :)

I think I mentioned earlier i was seeking a 2nd opinion, so it seems for our FET we will be doing steroids, clexane and intralipids too (and progesterone shots which i've never done). I'm nervous and anxious, but it seems like lots of women get pregnant with the extras.

Reb - any closer to deciding whether to go for it or not?


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## Reb S

Gill - that's fantastic news! And ha ha ha ha re the farting! That's hilarious!
Nell - we're at logger-heads. OH says he's too old and doesn't want to do it again. Huh. He's still having unprotected sex with me - perhaps I should with-hold, 'in case I get pregnant' ha ha! I'm biding my time to talk about it again, I can't believe he's giving up just when we've got lots more answers. Of course, we ARE far too old, but what the hell! When are you starting? x


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## _Nell

I'm not too sure really, I have to down-reg which i've not done before, so I'll take a single prostap shot on CD21, which I think will be just before Christmas. Woohoo menopause for Xmas, that'll be fun.

I'm really nervous tbh, I though a FET was going to be straightforward and well, now it's not. I don't know if i can keep doing this if it doesn't work tbh.


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## Reb S

Ha! Downregging - what glorious fun! All I can say is, keep the sharp knives locked away; get lots of booze in for OH; drink LOADS of water and remember that it'll all be over soon! 
I know what you mean about keeping going - we're still trying to decide what to do - OH says he's too old...we've mentioned the adoption word - but not going there yet...that's a REALLY hard decision, for us at least. 
Don't forget that compared to what you've already been through, FET IS quite straightforward. Come on, little frosties!


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## _Nell

I don't know, I think i'd take egg collection over Down regged menopause, steroids and clexane any day!

I'm sure when Christmas is out of the way and a fresh new year is ahead your decision will become clearer and hopefully you'll both agree on the way forward.


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## GillAwaiting

Reb S said:


> Gill - that's fantastic news! And ha ha ha ha re the farting! That's hilarious!
> Nell - we're at logger-heads. OH says he's too old and doesn't want to do it again. Huh. He's still having unprotected sex with me - perhaps I should with-hold, 'in case I get pregnant' ha ha! I'm biding my time to talk about it again, I can't believe he's giving up just when we've got lots more answers. Of course, we ARE far too old, but what the hell! When are you starting? x

Well my sis and her hubby have donor egg, she was 45 and he was 60. They now have a 2.5 yr old and he just turned 63! If they can do it - anyone can. :thumbup: Sis is now going through menopause.

I got good numbers on the beta hcg, they said I didn't need a retest but my bbts have been dire. :cry: Need to stop temping. Im hoping that being on estrogen as well as progesterone is throwing things out for me and that and not sleeping and peeing every hour. If anyone has any thoughts on this I would really appreciate it. Doing intralipids on Monday morning so I booked another beta hcg test for then too to either ease my mind or confirm another m/c.


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## _Nell

Gill - stop temping hun, you are spot on the estrogen will be throwing off your temps and unless your using progesterone shots the suppositaries also often don't raise you temps (even without estrogen). You don't need the stress of temping right now.

i hope the beta on monday will bring you some comfort.


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## Reb S

Gill, fingers crossed for your beta tomorrow, let us know how you go.


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## GillAwaiting

Hey guys, thank you for all the kind wishes. :hugs: Thought I'd come back and tell you my horror stories. Beta last Friday was 467, then on Monday (72 hrs later) only 694. Wasn't looking good. I was freaking waiting for another m/c. Cons took me back today Wednesday, 48 hours later for a scan and another bhcg. So after thinking we were going to m/c, it turns out to be one vanishing twin. :wacko: One embryo seems to be doing what it should and the other one is just a dot, going nowhere. Bhcg was 1800 today, waay more than doubled in 48 hours. She said the initial numbers were very high and she was planking herself in case I was having triplets. She said today my uterus is v.small. (Im only 5ft so this is not surprising news!) So apart from all the other drugs, doc has now put me on pregnyl injections twice a week. It's been a nerve wrecking few days and we are only at 5w+1dy. Temping has gone out the window completely. This might go somewhere to explain what was going on though!! Hopefully all these drugs and injections will pay off. My head has blown up like a balloon from the steroids and I've started referring to myself as the stay puff marshmallow man! DH told me he didn't think it would get bigger but it did :nope:

It it all works, it will be worth it.


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## Reb S

Wow, Gill - that's quite a tale! How do you feel? You must be delighted that one bean has stuck - hope you're not feeling too sad about the non-stick one. One is better for both of you! 
Yeehaa! You're pregnant! x
Shame about your head...!:awww:


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## GillAwaiting

Things not looking good. BB's stopped being sore fully today. :growlmad: Con's put me on pregnyl shots to try to sustain pregnancy and bb's stopped being sore a few hours after I started them three days ago. With all the other drugs I just don't know what's going on. :shrug: With 2 previous m/c's, it's hard to be optimistic. If anyone out there has any experience of mixing all of the above plus progesterone and estrogen with pregnyl, I'd love to hear it.


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## Reb S

Gill, I've got my fingers tightly crossed for you. I guess that all the meds will be messing with your symptoms. I don't have any experience with pregnyl etc. Keep hoping and let us know how you go xxx


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## CocoCrystal

firstly, congrats to all the ladies who are pregnant through steroids and good luck to all those who are trying!

I wondered if you could help me out with some answers on steroids and clexane please?

Can you tell me what doses you were on of the steroids and when in the ivf protocol that you started and stopped them? Can you stop them if you get pregnant?

Also for the Clexane, what dose did you take and when did you start taking it?

Did anyone take baby aspirin as well during the cycle?

We are starting our 4th and last ivf protocol soon and later this afternoon we have to go and speak to our doctor so id like to propose that we now try these after 3 x ivf failures, 3 x iui failures and 3 x FET failures!


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## _Nell

Coco - I would really recommend moving to a clinic or working with an immunes Dr that is practiced in prescribing the extra meds tbh. I think most ladies (myself included) have had tests that indicate they need the steroids and clexane.
Some Dr.s will prescribe empirically (mine was going to then opted to test) usually at lower doses of 10-15mg a day from ET. 
It's possible that taking steroids or clexane when you don't need it can reduce you chances of implantation.


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## CocoCrystal

_Nell said:


> Coco - I would really recommend moving to a clinic or working with an immunes Dr that is practiced in prescribing the extra meds tbh. I think most ladies (myself included) have had tests that indicate they need the steroids and clexane.
> Some Dr.s will prescribe empirically (mine was going to then opted to test) usually at lower doses of 10-15mg a day from ET.
> It's possible that taking steroids or clexane when you don't need it can reduce you chances of implantation.

Thanks for your reply. I live in Holland and unfortunately you cannot just pick and choose which hospital you go to, our insurance company picks one and thats the one you go to sadly! They dont really believe in all this immune testing here and claim there is nothing medically proven to suggest steroids make a difference. I beg to differ. They may let me take them this cycle though since we have had so many failures and approaching my 40th birthday, to be honest ill try anything that may help. I wished i could have the tests and support we want and need but it simply is not an option, its either do the ivf without trying the steroids and quite possibly face another failure with no more funding or try the steroids in the hope that they give us a better chance of success.


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## _Nell

It's not too different here tbh, it's just a handful of clinics that support it and we have to pay to cycle OOP for the full cycle to get the meds.

Good luck with your cycle, I hope your Dr is willing to try - I know what to feels like to be on an uphill struggle with asking them to listen.

Could you consider an IVF cycle in London maybe (or elsewhere is Europe even?). It might work out more expensive (though the pound is in the toilet!) but if it's what you need then it could be worth it?


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## Reb S

Hi CocoCrystal - sorry to hear about your lack of IVF success. Nell has said it all really - I think we both paid £££££££££££££'s to get our testing, which is controversial and not universally accepted, etc. Good luck with finding a solution.

Anyone heard from GillAwaiting? I'll go do a search to see how she's doing. x


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## GillAwaiting

Reb S said:


> Hi CocoCrystal - sorry to hear about your lack of IVF success. Nell has said it all really - I think we both paid £££££££££££££'s to get our testing, which is controversial and not universally accepted, etc. Good luck with finding a solution.
> 
> Anyone heard from GillAwaiting? I'll go do a search to see how she's doing. x

Hello there! You wouldn't believe the next twist in my tale. Last I left you, I'd had a scan and they could see everything looked ok and the betas were back where they should be. Well I had an apt for another scan the following week and a few days before it I felt all the symptoms leave me. I stayed in bed and cried for a whole day and said my goodbyes. The morning of the scan the clinic rang me at 8.30 to say my cons was sick and did I want to reschedule. I said I was sure pregnancy was gone and could someone else do it. So I went up with my mom to get confirmation. I was ready for it. One of the other cons scanned me and confirmed the bad news. THEN the next day my own cons rang me and said don't attempt to go off the meds, I dont believe it until I see it, come back up and I will rescan. I thought she was bonkers as I was sure it was over. Anyhoo, we went back up last Friday and there was perfect bean with beating heart at 6+3. As you can imagine I kinda went into shock. 

So my insides looked like this - there was the empty sac (the vanishing twin) and the other sac had 2 embryos in it! One had a beating heart and right size, the other smaller and nothing doing. So it looked like I had twins in one sac at one point. Unfortunately the cons is gone back to see her family now for Christmas so I cant get scanned until the day she gets back, Jan 6th. Im freaking out over every niggle and back pain and Im still not convinced this is gonna be a runner. It's during this period of pregnancy time that the two pregnancies that ended in missed m/c's, stopped progressing.

Was buying some xmas presents in the book shop yesterday and passed the baby section and couldnt even look at it. I felt like a fraud. Like those things only happen to other people.:nope:

Im chanting to myself all day everyday to try to stay calm - you're on everything there is, there is no reason for this not to work.

Oh by the way, I asked the cons about the fur growing on my head from the steroids. She said when you stop them, it falls off!! I now look like a furry stay puff marshmallow man :)
:hugs::hugs:


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## _Nell

Gill, OMG I can't believe the first consultant told you it was all over, imagine if you'd stopped the meds that would be terrible.

Try to rest up and think positive thoughts, your little bean is a strong fighter :)

oh and you are really not selling the steroids - fur on your face?!!! LOL, i should hope it does fall off when you stop them.


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## Reb S

Gill - dear Gill, you poor thing! But look on the bright side - you are pregnant, and thank goodness, you're not having triplets! Here's hoping the meds do their thing and that this bean progresses to a lovely bouncy baby. And as to fur - it's good for the winter!

Nell - hope the down-regging isn't too horrendous. 

We've decided not to go for it at the moment. I'm not sure why. We may go for it in Feb/March and I'm really hopeful for that. We had a few arguments about how we haven't been healthy enough and OH has put on huge amounts of weight and not been taking his vits so we thought it's only one more shot, let's be as healthy as possible for it. New Year, new regime for health! I may also try to get some DHEA to make my eggies youthful again..hee hee!


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## _Nell

Reb - that sounds like a logical plan to get everything in order first health wise and then see how you feel. Can't have been an easy decision though :hugs:

Thanks for asking about my down reg, i'm only doing one single prostap injection at 21dpo and that's it, easy peasy - i did that a week ago. So far i've had nothing major side effect wise, i'm not spotting at all which is an unexpected bonus for me :happydance: but i have been very crampy and full feeling , sort of like when stimming tbh :wacko:


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## GillAwaiting

Well girls Im back again with another twist in my tale. Every week something new and awful. Had heavy bleeding last night after sharp back pains for a day. From having 2 missed m/c's before, I knew the sight of so much red blood was bad. Rang clinic this morning and went straight up for a thorough scan.

Turns out there is a hematoma there (some kind of blood clot). The bleeding has now eased into dark blood residue.

The embryo is only measuring 7+1 when it should be 7+3 and the heartbeat only 148bpm. Back up next Thursday for another scan.

Im to lay off the clexane and aspirin for a while and up the progesterone to 3 times a day. 

When will this torture end?


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## Reb S

Dear Gil, I'm so so sorry this is happening to you and just before Christmas as well. I do hope hugely that it's just a false alarm. Baby is only two days behind and the heartbeat is within normal range. Please don't fret, keep calm and try to enjoy Christmas. Let us know how you go.
Thinking of you x


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## GillAwaiting

Oh girls the hcg injections are killing me. Been on them now 2 x week since 5 1/2 weeks and every injection gets worse, the symptoms lasting longer. Im due to take another one tonight and haven't gotten a reprieve from the last one yet. You know that feeling you get right before you throw up, that intense godawful feeling. Well that it what I have all the time, it never stops. Now I know why hcg is used for people on mad diets because you really can't eat much with it at all. It's just all compounding the misery. Scan on Thursday. This time we are both ready to say goodbye to this. We made the decision not to try to sustain the pregnancy with meds if it isn't where it needs to be growth wise. With our history of losing pregnancies at this point, it's starting to look like its something genetic, even though nothing showed up on any of the genetic and chromosome testing. We are thinking donar eggs and sperm. We could spend forever looking for answers and we don't have the time or money to do it so I think we will cut to the chase.

Gotta tell all you steroid ladies, the fuzz on my cheeks and neck is getting insane. It starts around my earlobes and goes right down. The battle between the steroids and the hcg is horrible. The steroids wanted me to eat all the time and the hcg doesnt allow it. If I get pregnant again, there's no way I will be doing the hcg injections. I'd stop them now but part of me wants to see the results of the experiment. Did they help or did they not. It would be nice if someone out there could benefit from my torture.

Hope you all had a good Christmas. It's really nice to have folks to talk to who know what all these meds are.


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## Reb S

Gill, very good luck for tomorrow, I truly hope it's good news. Let us know how you go xxx


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## GillAwaiting

Well folks, Im back again. :wacko: Thank you all for your support. :hugs: It really helps so much. After some of the most nerve wrecking days ever, the scan went well!! :thumbup: They had to call in the head cons especially to do it and we told the nurse that was a good idea as we were expecting bad news. We were so sure. Sooo sure. We had to wait hours and at that stage we couldn't even talk with nerves. So hematoma hadn't gotten bigger or smaller :wacko:, embryo measured exactly right at 8 w + 2 days and the heartbeat at 172 bpm. I just went into shock and shook violently for about a half hour after the news. It was so bad my dh made me put my coat on because he thought I was shaking with the cold. The cons was lovely and we sat down in his office with him after scan and he was like - what else can we throw at this. So I do another round of intralipids next week providing the scan is ok next Friday with our own cons. We also discussed going off the pregnyl shots as they make me so sick but tbh, we kinda think if it ain't broke, don't fix it. So Im gonna stick them out for another while. Im sick as a dog anyway so sod it.

So there you have it. I was grand and calm yesterday evening and now Im getting back to a nervous state again. 

How are you guys getting on? Anyone doing anything exciting for the new year? Wouldn't it be great if everyones dreams could come through in 2012. If this pregnancy ends I will be so sorry and sad for my dh. He seems so joyous just now he wants this baby so bad. I will feel bad for our cons and the clinic too. They have all done their best. Please god 2012 will be kind to all of us. :hugs: :hugs:


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## _Nell

Gill, such a brilliant update - I am so happy for you :)
Have a lovely new year, just think this time next year you'll have your baby in your arms :)


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## Reb S

Gill, that's such great news! Hooray! So pleased for you. I'm sure it's goig to be really hard to relax and enjoy the pregnancy, but I hope you can! xx
Nell - good luck with the down-reg x


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## GillAwaiting

Thanks Nell and Reb S. :hugs: Im freaking over every little twinge and symptom. All sickness vanished there for 24 hours and I freaked.:wacko: My poor DH is living with a nutjob. Whether it be right or wrong, the hcg shot has kicked in now again and Im feeling rough. Even though it's fake sickness in a way, I still find it comforting to feel horrendous. 

Nell I will be very interested to hear how your downregging goes. I only did that once before the first month of meds (to get rid of endo), after that we just went straight from one treatment to the next. It was a very strange few weeks though. My bbs completely disappeared, cm dried up, hot flushes in the middle of the night. I tell ye, it gave me an insight into menopause and after that I would be an advocate for hrt! :thumbup: It's grand for the few weeks of down regging though. In a way I love the experiment of these things. Good to know what the future might hold! Medical science just blows me away. Do tell us how it's going, if it effects you too.

Reb, you've been a great support to me and to my shame I don't know where you are in this turbulent journey. Are you still trying to decide on what path to take? I hope 2012 is your year. I hope it's everyone's here year.:flower:

Cheers to all of you. May your new year's wishes come through and soon!!! Happy New Year. :hugs: :hugs:


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## Reb S

Thanks Gill! Happy New Year to you and that stubborn little sticky bean!
We're still out at the moment, but I'm planning to go for it if I can persuade OH. Trying to talk to him about adoption too, but that's not going very far...huh!
Anyway, here's to BFP's and babies in 2012 x


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## Amber3

Hi there
I just noticed that you wrote that you are constantly spotting from 4 dpo. I start spotting at ovulation and don't stop again unless I start taking progesterone. But my doctor seems completely confused about my spotting and do not seem to have any ideas about how to help me with that. Can you tell me what may cause this and what can be done about it?
Best wishes for the new year,
Amber


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## _Nell

Hi Amber, you might want to join us in this little group?
https://www.babyandbump.com/ttc-gro...ek-before-af-every-month-anyone-else-130.html

There are lots of possible causes for lengthy pre-menstrual spotting (beyond the normal 1 or 2 days pre AF)....

a tender cervix from BDing
polyps
cervical erosion
fibroids
endometriosis
hormone imbalance (aka low progesterone/ weak ovulation)
anovulatory cycles
low ovarian reserve / peri menopause

and last but not least it really can be 'normal' for some women and not affect ttc for them at all.

In terms of 'fixing it' progesterone supplementation usually stops the bleeding (or even estrogen as i've just discovered) but it rarely tackles the root cause and fixes the problem IYSWIM.


----------



## GillAwaiting

Hi everyone, 
Are you all recovered from the chaos of Christmas and New Year? We're just glad it's over and the doctors and hospitals and admins are all back working again! :happydance:
We had another scan today. I was convinced, I really mean convinced it was curtains for us. I sobbed for 3 hours the other night, couldnt even speak to my DH as I was so sure it was over. :cry: And it wasn't. Held my breath, closed my eyes and waited for cons to tell if there was a heartbeat. There was! Gone to 178bpm. Crl 2 days behind again but cons not worried, so Im going to try really hard not to worry too much about it either.:wacko: Little bean was swimming around merrily. DH and cons were so happy and excited (I just concentrated on breathing). It's DH's birthday tomorrow and Im so glad it didn't ruin it for him. Cons is going to shoot me if I don't make a decision about maternity hospitals but tbh Im just too scared to sign the forms. Signing those forms in the past has not ended well. I have a bag permanently packed for emergency if miscarriage comes up and I take it every time we go for a scan in case they say go straight to the hospital. So staying on the meds for another while. She gave me the option of going off the pregnyl shots and even though they are killing me Im going to stay on them. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Did a round of intralipids today too. Oh and the SCH has almost vanished. Weird or what? Maybe the meds helped it on its merry way? Wonder if it will come back again.

I don't know if this pregnancy is going to go any further but what I do know is that we didn't get this far before and maybe, just maybe, all these meds are doing something good. :shrug: It would be really great to think so. 

So, who's set for Valentines Day then?? People in my work are talking about Paddy's Day already!! :flower:


----------



## _Nell

Gill, I'm so pleased you've had another good scan :) Stay strong little bean :)


----------



## Lou32

Gill, wow! I can't believe what you've gone throuh so far. It sounds like you have a real fighter there and sounds like your clinic have been supportive. Nell - I'm really interested in what you said about estrogen. My immune tests suggested i'd need estrogen in my next cycle. Don't kno why. I wonder if that might stop my early spotting and v short luteal phase in my next cycle (and would mean i wouldn't need prog shots!) Think my new protocol mentions estradiol...Really don't want to do prog shots but I thought it was only solution. Unfortunately I'm stuck between 2 docs, one who's against immune tests and other who's impossible to get hold of.


----------



## _Nell

Hi Lou, will you have estrogen while stimming too or just in your LP? I had patches for IVF 2 and 3, I still spotted pre AF tbh (though not as early as usual). However my down-reg shot caused an initial estrogen surge for a week in my LP that stopped my spotting completely, so i suppose with the right dose it can work for me.

I think you do the estrogen on top of the progesterone though not instead of, I'm nervous about those shots too.....I won't be too disappointed if they are out of stock and I have to have the pessaries :)


----------



## Lou32

Hi, I think I start the estradiol while stimming and take for the whole 2ww too.Yup, I take it on top of the progesterone. I had an appointment today and my doc didn't want to prescribe the prog shots in the end. He doubled my pessaries. I used natural bioidentical progesterone cream last time when I started spotting early as I was desperate and it worked. So I told my doc today I did that last time and I expected him to be mad at me but he said I could supplement with that again this time if I want. I feel a bit better about that as it worked last time. Also, I read a research paper that suggested the natural cream was as good as the shots. Anyway, not much choice if my doc wouldn't prescribe the shots! When do you do your FET?


----------



## _Nell

Lou - You're right the pessaries are as good as the shots. TBH I really like the crinone, so easy and the cyclogest was ok too. I'm really nervous about the PIO, I think DH is going to have to do them as I might not be able to reach well enough, so far I've done all my own shots for everything else.
I started the clexane yesterday and you'll be pleased to here it was 'no biggie', I was so worried but it didn't sting at all. Both jabs so far have each left a tiny bruise, but literally just 4 or 5mm and I feel fine.

Gill - Sorry I didn't really answer you about my down-regging when you asked. I'd found a lump at the time I read your post and was deep in the land of worry and not really thinking FET too much. Turns out it's just a haematoma from injecting last cycle or maybe the down-reg shpt, a 3cm lump on one side of my belly under the surface. It should go on it's own but until then I have only my right side to inject on, a bit of a pain as i've now started the clexane. Down-regging was ok, I wouldn't want to repeat it tbh with the prostap, it gave me an estrogen surge first and i'm sure aggravated my endo....and it seems it gave me this haematoma too.

I'm nervous to admit, but I think more than any of my fresh cycles I really really want this FET to work. It's not just the emotional and financial stress, I'm starting to worry what i'm doing to my body. When I started out I didn't even know I had endo, now I have endo cysts and get cramps from all the meds and lumps and bumps from injections and things.


----------



## GillAwaiting

_Nell said:


> Lou - You're right the pessaries are as good as the shots. TBH I really like the crinone, so easy and the cyclogest was ok too. I'm really nervous about the PIO, I think DH is going to have to do them as I might not be able to reach well enough, so far I've done all my own shots for everything else.
> I started the clexane yesterday and you'll be pleased to here it was 'no biggie', I was so worried but it didn't sting at all. Both jabs so far have each left a tiny bruise, but literally just 4 or 5mm and I feel fine.
> 
> Gill - Sorry I didn't really answer you about my down-regging when you asked. I'd found a lump at the time I read your post and was deep in the land of worry and not really thinking FET too much. Turns out it's just a haematoma from injecting last cycle or maybe the down-reg shpt, a 3cm lump on one side of my belly under the surface. It should go on it's own but until then I have only my right side to inject on, a bit of a pain as i've now started the clexane. Down-regging was ok, I wouldn't want to repeat it tbh with the prostap, it gave me an estrogen surge first and i'm sure aggravated my endo....and it seems it gave me this haematoma too.
> 
> I'm nervous to admit, but I think more than any of my fresh cycles I really really want this FET to work. It's not just the emotional and financial stress, I'm starting to worry what i'm doing to my body. When I started out I didn't even know I had endo, now I have endo cysts and get cramps from all the meds and lumps and bumps from injections and things.


Hi Nell, you really hit home with me there when you were talking about what this stuff does to your body. It's mad. I don't even feel human these days. Im on everything going plus these pregnyl shots and so sick, bloated, all those lumps and bumps you are talking about, my tummy area where the steroid fat is, is covered in them from all the shots. Sometimes it feels like I have to go through a really tough layer of stuff to get another injection in. Im one hormonal cow these days. I even look like a different person from the head and body bloating and what should now be called 'fur' growing on my skin! :wacko: However, to give you hope, I've never gotten an embryo this far before so maybe the torture is worth it. You are doing all you can and will never regret it. You're so doing the right thing. When is the FET?


----------



## _Nell

> Sometimes it feels like I have to go through a really tough layer of stuff to get another injection in

Me too and that's what worries me really (on top of everything else i'll worry about if get a BFP!) I already have that just from my 3 cycles of stimming, just this morning I started to inject and it just wasn't going in easy so i moved to a different spot.....i'm so worried i'll run out of spots if i have to do this through pg!



> You are doing all you can and will never regret it

I know, I feel just like you, it's the 'no regrets' attitude that keeps me going tbh.

My next lining check is on friday. I know from having my haematoma checked at on monday it's 7mm. 7mm is the most i've ever achieved, it gets there and just stops. FX it's managed even a mm more for me on friday.

Will you be able to stop your extra meds at the 12 week mark Gill? If so, not too long left for you :)


----------



## GillAwaiting

Good luck tomorrow Nell with the lining check. Fingers crossed. :thumbup:

I've got another scan in the morn. Usual terrors kicking in.:wacko: In a way it's fortunate that I am so unbelievably sick because Im too sick to worry myself into a stupor tonight. :sleep:

It's weird, we want this to work so much but Im terrified to get to 12 weeks and come off some of the meds and leave the security and hand holding the fertility clinic has provided. If I could shack up in their lovely waiting room for the other 30 weeks it would be great! 

How's everyone else doing these days? Any news?


----------



## Amber3

Lou
Can you tell me more about the antioxidant diet?
Amber


----------



## Missy01

Hi Gill,

I hope your last scan went well and that you are starting to feel better.

I was wondering at what points in your cycle you started taking each of the following drugs: aspirin, clexane, intralipids, and steroids? Ie. which did you take from cd1, first stimming day, EC and ET?

Thanks.

Missy


----------



## GillAwaiting

Missy01 said:


> Hi Gill,
> 
> I hope your last scan went well and that you are starting to feel better.
> 
> I was wondering at what points in your cycle you started taking each of the following drugs: aspirin, clexane, intralipids, and steroids? Ie. which did you take from cd1, first stimming day, EC and ET?
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Missy

Hi Missy,
I had a look back on my charts on fertility friend to see. I went straight from a TSI cycle into an IUI cycle and then straight into ICSI. I started the steroids, aspirin, and clexane when I started stimming for the TSI and haven't been off them since. The first intralipid infusion was a few days before the TSI. I had one again a few days before IUI and the same for ICSI. I had further intralipid infusion when I got BFP and I had another one in week 9 of pregnancy. I hope that is some use to you!

The last scan went extremely well. Crl was perfect at 10+3. Another one next week. Not sure if that will be the last one with the clinic. Im hoping that if it goes ok, there will be one more after that. Im really afraid of leaving them.

Cons said I could go off the pregnyl too. I would have been due another shot a few days ago and still sick as parrott 24/7 so I know my own hcg levels must be peaking. Interestingly I've never gotten sick, just permanently on the brink of it. I've read that steroids are sometimes prescribed for vomiting in morning sickness so perhaps they are stopping me actually throwing up. Cons said she will wean me off the steroids soon and I will feel more human again. and perhaps look less like a monkey. My face is so furry!


----------



## _Nell

Gill - yay for another great scan. I'm sure if you want to stay and have an extra one at your clinic they'll let you? great news about starting to wean off the meds soon too.......so long to your furry face eh?! :)


----------



## Lou32

Gill, great news! Boy am I not looking forward to a furry face, but sadly would go through it to get preggers! Amber - OH is on healthy diet and every antioxidant known to man. These include Pycnogenol, lycopene, high dose vit C and E, as well as fertilaid and some antioxidant drink we found on the internet called Zambroza. Just hope it all makes a difference. Out of interest, how much did you all pay for your Clexane? I will be taking 40mg doses. The hospital say they are cheapest but I want to shop around.


----------



## Missy01

GillAwaiting said:


> Missy01 said:
> 
> 
> Hi Gill,
> 
> I hope your last scan went well and that you are starting to feel better.
> 
> I was wondering at what points in your cycle you started taking each of the following drugs: aspirin, clexane, intralipids, and steroids? Ie. which did you take from cd1, first stimming day, EC and ET?
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Missy
> 
> Hi Missy,
> I had a look back on my charts on fertility friend to see. I went straight from a TSI cycle into an IUI cycle and then straight into ICSI. I started the steroids, aspirin, and clexane when I started stimming for the TSI and haven't been off them since. The first intralipid infusion was a few days before the TSI. I had one again a few days before IUI and the same for ICSI. I had further intralipid infusion when I got BFP and I had another one in week 9 of pregnancy. I hope that is some use to you!
> 
> The last scan went extremely well. Crl was perfect at 10+3. Another one next week. Not sure if that will be the last one with the clinic. Im hoping that if it goes ok, there will be one more after that. Im really afraid of leaving them.
> 
> Cons said I could go off the pregnyl too. I would have been due another shot a few days ago and still sick as parrott 24/7 so I know my own hcg levels must be peaking. Interestingly I've never gotten sick, just permanently on the brink of it. I've read that steroids are sometimes prescribed for vomiting in morning sickness so perhaps they are stopping me actually throwing up. Cons said she will wean me off the steroids soon and I will feel more human again. and perhaps look less like a monkey. My face is so furry!Click to expand...

Hi Gill,

I am so glad your scan went well!

What dose of clexane and streriods were / are you on? Have they kept it constant?

Missy


----------



## GillAwaiting

You know Im getting getting used to the fur. I enjoy rubbing it!! (but I'l never say that in public, hehe)


----------



## GillAwaiting

Missy01 said:


> GillAwaiting said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Missy01 said:
> 
> 
> Hi Gill,
> 
> I hope your last scan went well and that you are starting to feel better.
> 
> I was wondering at what points in your cycle you started taking each of the following drugs: aspirin, clexane, intralipids, and steroids? Ie. which did you take from cd1, first stimming day, EC and ET?
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Missy
> 
> Hi Missy,
> I had a look back on my charts on fertility friend to see. I went straight from a TSI cycle into an IUI cycle and then straight into ICSI. I started the steroids, aspirin, and clexane when I started stimming for the TSI and haven't been off them since. The first intralipid infusion was a few days before the TSI. I had one again a few days before IUI and the same for ICSI. I had further intralipid infusion when I got BFP and I had another one in week 9 of pregnancy. I hope that is some use to you!
> 
> The last scan went extremely well. Crl was perfect at 10+3. Another one next week. Not sure if that will be the last one with the clinic. Im hoping that if it goes ok, there will be one more after that. Im really afraid of leaving them.
> 
> Cons said I could go off the pregnyl too. I would have been due another shot a few days ago and still sick as parrott 24/7 so I know my own hcg levels must be peaking. Interestingly I've never gotten sick, just permanently on the brink of it. I've read that steroids are sometimes prescribed for vomiting in morning sickness so perhaps they are stopping me actually throwing up. Cons said she will wean me off the steroids soon and I will feel more human again. and perhaps look less like a monkey. My face is so furry!Click to expand...
> 
> Hi Gill,
> 
> I am so glad your scan went well!
> 
> What dose of clexane and streriods were / are you on? Have they kept it constant?
> 
> MissyClick to expand...

The clexane shots are 20mg each and Im on 25 mgs of steroids (Prednisolone) 5 pills of 5mgs each. Doc also has me on vitamin b complex which interestingly I had been taking for months myself before we got to the fertility clinic. Its supposed to be good for luteal phase defect and progesterone levels. I've been taking pregnacare conception for what seems like forever too and OH on the male version of it.

The pills aren't so bad and you get used to the clexane injections. Even if it does go all to pot for us now, I really feel like meds helped and got us this far but I still obsessively knicker check in the million times I go to the loo every day and night. Oh there's something. steroids make you pee loads at night. it was that way a long time before our BFP and the cons confirmed it for me. But it's ok, because due to the steroids, you aren't too exhausted! It's crazy what these little balls of chemicals do to us.

I must give you a laugh, a lady at work today was talking about a friend who has bulging eyes syndrome due to thyroid problems. I've got a heap of nasty thyroid antibodies and cons told me my thyroid is fecked in future. So we had a good laugh at work and said I will look like something from a horror movie with all the fur and bulgy eyes. Always something to look forward to :haha:


----------



## Missy01

The clexane shots are 20mg each and Im on 25 mgs of steroids (Prednisolone) 5 pills of 5mgs each. Doc also has me on vitamin b complex which interestingly I had been taking for months myself before we got to the fertility clinic. Its supposed to be good for luteal phase defect and progesterone levels. I've been taking pregnacare conception for what seems like forever too and OH on the male version of it.

The pills aren't so bad and you get used to the clexane injections. Even if it does go all to pot for us now, I really feel like meds helped and got us this far but I still obsessively knicker check in the million times I go to the loo every day and night. Oh there's something. steroids make you pee loads at night. it was that way a long time before our BFP and the cons confirmed it for me. But it's ok, because due to the steroids, you aren't too exhausted! It's crazy what these little balls of chemicals do to us.

I must give you a laugh, a lady at work today was talking about a friend who has bulging eyes syndrome due to thyroid problems. I've got a heap of nasty thyroid antibodies and cons told me my thyroid is fecked in future. So we had a good laugh at work and said I will look like something from a horror movie with all the fur and bulgy eyes. Always something to look forward to :haha:[/QUOTE]

Thanks Gill.

It is funny you say that actually as I have high thyriod antibodies due to an autoimmune disease....which is why I think I will be on steriods soon too. Looks like we will both end up being bulgy, furry little things:haha:!

Will they start to decrease the dosage of steriods soon? Is that 25mg the initial dosage that you started on? Is the high thyriod antibodies the main reason you are on steriods etc?

Missy x


----------



## GillAwaiting

Hi Missy, yes the clinic started me on 25mgs steroids from the beginning. Not sure when they will wean me off but I guess starting pretty soon. The cons just said 'soon' and my brain wasn't functioning enough to ask when. From talking to my gp about it, he reckons they will go down 5mgs a week, no more and no quicker than that. To tell the truth Im terrified of coming off them now. The clinic started me on the whole shebang because I've had 2 miscarriages already. We had done a shed load of tests with another clinic but not particular one. The antibody test results came later when we were into treatment. I was still looking for some answers and we had done so many tests, I decided to go the whole hog and do the rest.

Do you have any symptoms from your autoimmune issues? Will it change in the future? I had problems with arthritis a few years back (change of climate for a few years helped it) and never thought it would have any connection to infertility or thyroid problems in the future. It's nuts who things are all connected.

Been so sick for the last few days. Had to leave work halfway though day today and go straight home into bed. No more pregnyl shots, hopefully ever. If we have to do more treatment, I think I would leave that one off the list.

Terrified again for Friday. I do fine for a couple of days after a scan and then the fear kicks in for the upcoming one. Should be 11 weeks today.


----------



## Missy01

GillAwaiting said:


> Hi Missy, yes the clinic started me on 25mgs steroids from the beginning. Not sure when they will wean me off but I guess starting pretty soon. The cons just said 'soon' and my brain wasn't functioning enough to ask when. From talking to my gp about it, he reckons they will go down 5mgs a week, no more and no quicker than that. To tell the truth Im terrified of coming off them now. The clinic started me on the whole shebang because I've had 2 miscarriages already. We had done a shed load of tests with another clinic but not particular one. The antibody test results came later when we were into treatment. I was still looking for some answers and we had done so many tests, I decided to go the whole hog and do the rest.
> 
> Do you have any symptoms from your autoimmune issues? Will it change in the future? I had problems with arthritis a few years back (change of climate for a few years helped it) and never thought it would have any connection to infertility or thyroid problems in the future. It's nuts who things are all connected.
> 
> Been so sick for the last few days. Had to leave work halfway though day today and go straight home into bed. No more pregnyl shots, hopefully ever. If we have to do more treatment, I think I would leave that one off the list.
> 
> Terrified again for Friday. I do fine for a couple of days after a scan and then the fear kicks in for the upcoming one. Should be 11 weeks today.

Thanks for the info Gill.

I have Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Basically the antithyroid antibodies have destroyed my thyroid gland so I need to take thyroxine daily. As long as I am on the correct dosage (which is modified from time to time based on TSH and T4 levels) then I feel fine. I was originally diagnosed about 7 years ago via a blood test. At the time, I was exhausted all the time. 

It is probably worthwhile your doctors checking your TSH and T4 levels throughout your pregnancy. 

Good luck for your next scan. I will be thinking of you.


----------



## GillAwaiting

Hey guys, coming back with some updates. Went for scan today as I had a few little clots yesterday and freaked out a bit. :wacko: Called and got scan a day early. The people in the clinic must think Im barmy. So glad we did. Everything grand. Cons said no bleed from uterus at all, must be from cervix possibly irritated by putting in suppositories. Im currently at 11+2 but baby flying around at 11+5 size. It was doing twists and turns all over the place. So had interesting chat with cons about meds. She is taking me off everything starting next week. Terrifying thought but she says the placenta is doing all now and only a percentage of the meds Im taking are actually getting to baby. I asked about weaning off steroids. They do something like this:-
Im on 5 pills at the mo, 5mgs each. They say to take 4 pills for 4 days, 3 pills for 3 days, 2 pills for 2 days and 1 pill for one day. Or something like that. I will take more notes next week at last scan :cry: So the clexane, progesterone, estrogen, and folic acid 5mgs are all going too. How freaking scary is that. Will just be continuing on the ordinary dose folic acid. I think I will still take aspirin though. I have a friend who had stillborn baby and for her 2nd pregnancy (which ended perfectly well) she took aspirin all the way through. What do you guys think? 

Oh asked about the nuchal scans too. Cons said she wouldnt recommend as she knows people who got bad odds from the test and baby turned out healthy. Same thing happened my DH's sister and she had perfect baby. Cons said to her eye baby looks grand and she has seen trisomy 21 babies. So Im going to take her advice and leave that one off the list.

Im considering putting a ticker up finally. Its a bit late in the day coming out of first trimester but it's a massive step for me. Maybe I should wait until next scan to be sure...:shrug:


----------



## Reb S

Hey Gill - how're you doing? Still no ticker...hope everything is ok x


----------



## GillAwaiting

Reb S said:


> Hey Gill - how're you doing? Still no ticker...hope everything is ok x

Thanks for asking! No ticker yet. Im still not brave enough. Everything went ok at the scan last Thursday. I was 12 weeks and 2 days and baby measured 12 weeks 4 days so things looking good but still....

Finished with fertility clinic now. :cry: Should have public hospital apt next week. Was talking to them on the phone. It's looking good for the high risk unit but I wont know for sure until I get there. The 24/7 morning sickness is still belting away. Cons said I could go off all the meds and start weaning off the steroids. I've started the 2 week wean off the steroids but I haven't been brave enough to cut the meds yet. I decided to do it when I hit 13 weeks next Tuesday and maybe just do one progesterone suppository instead of two for another month and continue the aspirin until its gone. Any thoughts? :shrug:

How's everyone else here? :hugs: Im always babbling on. What are you all up to these days?


----------



## Reb S

Gill, that sounds great! two days ahead...I'm so sorry you've been so sick and haven't been able to relax with this pregnancy yet but I'm sure it'll all be worth it in the end!
AFM, no change x


----------



## Lou32

Hi Gill, Can't believe you have passed 12weeks already! Time has flown, although i imagine it hasn't.for you! 
Nell, how are things with you? I noticed on your sig that you have had lining problems again. Can't believe it. Do the docs have any idea what the problem is? It must be bloody frustrating.
AFM, just waiting to start treatment now. Have to call.on first day of AF and go in for b/l scan, pick up my boatload of meds and go through the spreadsheet the nurse has kindly prepared for me to help with the nightmare protocol. To be honest I'm not too confident we will go ahead as I've been having a lot of pain which I think is an old parafimbrial cyst which must have got bigger. Will.just have to see what the scan reveals. Hope everyone well. Xxxxx
Ps, I have a new phone andwhile i can now start new paragraphs yey! I can't seem to type a sentence without typos! Hope it all makes sense.x


----------



## _Nell

Hi Lou :flower: Good to hear from you. Hope you don't have a cyst and the scan goes well so you can get started.
Yes I had lining issues, my worst yet :growlmad: Nothing they can suggest other than trying different protocols for a FET really, tbh I doubt i'm ever going to get above 7mm. The plan was a natural cycle break and then try again but with mild injectibel stimms, i think my body is screwed from the estrogen meds and down-reg though so i might have a long wait. I don't ever want to down-reg again :growlmad:

Gill - So happy things are going well for you :flower: C'mon, be brave, let's see a ticker up and celebrate? :baby:

Reb - how are you doing? :flower:


----------



## Lou32

_Nell said:


> Hi Lou :flower: Good to hear from you. Hope you don't have a cyst and the scan goes well so you can get started.
> Yes I had lining issues, my worst yet :growlmad: Nothing they can suggest other than trying different protocols for a FET really, tbh I doubt i'm ever going to get above 7mm. The plan was a natural cycle break and then try again but with mild injectibel stimms, i think my body is screwed from the estrogen meds and down-reg though so i might have a long wait. I don't ever want to down-reg again :growlmad:
> 
> Gill - So happy things are going well for you :flower: C'mon, be brave, let's see a ticker up and celebrate? :baby:
> 
> Reb - how are you doing? :flower:

God, frustrating doesn't even cover it! I really feel for you having gone through all that. Really hope the docs get to grips with this for you as you have a lovely embie there waiting to snuggle in. 
Got a stinking cold this week, in fact my first for a couple of years so i was starting to think I'd inadvertantly discovered a cure for the common cold there for a while...not so lucky. At least it's come before treatment starts so can't complain. 
Take care everyone.x


----------



## Reb S

Hi all,
Lou - I hope you feel better soon and that your cyst hasn't reappeared - I'm on my 3rd cold of this year and it's only 3rd Feb! I think my immune system has emigrated to Australia or something.
Nell - sorry to hear of your lining issues. There must be something they can dream up. And have you tried acupuncture? Not sure if I believe in it but some swear by it x


----------



## _Nell

Lou - funny you say that about the cold 9not funny you have it of course). Dr Beer reckons and indicatori f having immunes issues is if you don't get colds, bugs etc. I haven't had one in yonks either, but have an iffy throat right now.

Reb - i tried acupuncture for IVF 2, starting a couple of months before. I don't believe in it and it did nothing but cost me money. But times are pretty desperate so i've started again (with a new acu lady) pre my FET, I just want to feel i'm trying everything tbh.


----------



## GillAwaiting

Thanks everyone for all the votes of confidence. I hope you are all doing well now that we are over that long dreary month of January.:flower:

Im still a nervous wreck and willing every day to go by faster. :wacko: And now I've got all these funny pains and stuff that is just freaking me out. Finished with the private clinic, they say good bye at 12 weeks. Felt so weird leaving them. Weaning off the meds now too. Nothing strange has happened as yet except these weird pains now and then. Although I think some of them could be a form of constipation. (TMI right?) Thought the public hospital apt would come quicker but they wont see me until Feb 20th which is the day before I hit 16 weeks. Imagine that. I think that's terribly late. Scary cutbacks. I booked private scan for next week because my nerves just won't take it until then to see if everything is still there. DH thinks Im a nutjob. No ticker yet. I just can't do it. Maybe after the next scan if it's ok...

Nell I've been following your lining issues. Just when you say about down regging. I had problems with that too. We were waiting ages for period to start to get going on treatment. It never happened. Cons did a scan and nothing was there at all for period so we just went straight to stims. I hope you get a solution soon. Your drs seem willing to try stuff so that's good. 

Reb I did buckets of acupuncture as did my dh. It did nout for me except as you say, leave me broke. However we discovered that it effected my dh's motility. It was totally crap to begin with on both sp tests. However, after first few times he went to acupuncture, we miraculously got pregnant, he left it for a long while (pregnant and then m/c), went back and then we did repeat sperm test (while checking his dna frag)and his motility was up. He left the acupuncture, we did IUI and motility was back down. Cons was baffled but I wasn't. When he was doing acupuncture it was up and when he wasn't it went down. Apart from that though, I didn't think it did much.

Lou I've never heard of a cyst like that. Im going to google it now and see what it is. I hope it doesn't delay things for you. Will it take long to resolve?


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## Reb S

Gill, I'm so sorry you're not able to enjoy this pregnancy yet and I think the private scan is absolutely the way to go. Hopefully it will put your fears to rest and then you can change your emoticon and put up a ticker! xxx


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## _Nell

Gill - you have a ticker!!!! wohoo!! So pleased, i hope this means you are starting to enjoy the pg......how has the weaning off the meds been?


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## Reb S

Woohoo! Well noticed, Nell!


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## GillAwaiting

Hey folks, yes I finally plucked up the courage to put up a ticker. It took a lot of nerve. I still haven't told some people Im pregnant. Afraid of my life. The private scan we went for was a relief. The lady even gave us a dvd with the scan on it! We didn't know they did that until we were leaving and she said to hold on while she put the dvd in a box. Now Im afraid to look at it though..:wacko:

I since got a cheap little doppler thing on the internet and I tell ya, it's helped sooo much. They are not recommended for ladies because I think doctors think we will ignore problems but to be honest, we use it just for me to know that the baby is still there. With missed miscarriages, the baby has died but you don't know for weeks after. I don't want to go through that again. My DH has been having great fun listening to his own heartbeat. Its fascinating. First time I ever heard my own heartbeat and it turns out its a triple beat one. It sounds totally different to the bambino's. Weird! 

Off most of the drugs now. Have been taking half progesterone suppositories for a few days and Im going to move on to 1/3 for three days and then that's it. Im going off it. Only other thing is aspirin. Have booking apt tomorrow at hospital so will ask them about it.

Have had some really strange problems with my legs the last few days and Im wondering if it has anything to do with coming off the steroids. It came on really suddenly. I said it to a nurse friend of mine and she said the steroids can mess up your calcium. Will talk to dr about it. It kinda feels like my arthritis is back worse than ever but only in legs and hands. The other weird thing is that the hair on my face seems to have taken a mad growth spurt and doubled in facial area. Here's hoping it disappears soon :wacko:

Still sick as a parrot. Different sick though. It all went away for a brief few days. It was bliss! Then the horrific heartburn and indigestion kicked in. Indigestion to the point of nausea. I tried everything. All the diet changes, liquid changes, antiacids, liquid antiacids. The whole shebang. This evening out of sheer desperation I bought some ginger root and put some in boiling water to make basic ginger tea. It actually have me some relief. I can't believe it. :happydance:

Think that's all the updates from me. My DH is in Florida at a family reunion. They are coming from all over. He hasn't seen them in so long. I was supposed to go but consultant said No way, too long a flight. Will be a lonely week :cry: There's my novel. How's everyone else? Any updates? Anyone do anything wild for Valentines Day?


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## _Nell

Gill :hugs: you still sound to be having a rough time in the 2nd tri, but it'll all be worth it in the end :flower:

No updates from me because I'm still just waiting to get started. I got a UTI for valentines day :cry:


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## Reb S

Nell - boo hoo! That's not a great present! Gill - I hope you feel better soon, gosh what a journey! x


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## Lou32

Hi everyone. Wow Gill, not been on here in a while and it's great to read things are still going well for you. Blimey, not liking the sound of that facial hair though eek! Not looking forward to steroids at all...
Well, we postponed a month because I've been having terrible pain from a corpus luteum cyst. The hosp didn' t really seem all that bothered but I didn' t feel comfortable going ahead with the pain. They didnt seem to think it could cause pain but it bloody does! My gp was close to sending me to A& E witn suspected appendicitis cos it got so bad. Anyway, it has eased a bit so really hoping to get going in about 3 weeks. 
Hope everyone doing well. Nell - is everything ok with you? 
Xxx


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## _Nell

Gill - I can't believe your still so sick, I though the 2nd tri was meant to be easier....poor you. I'm sorry you weren't allowed to fly....is that an immunes related thing? I've not heard of it before tbh.

Reb - Hi , how are you doing?

Lou - Hi, good to hear from you. Sorry you delayed a month - I'd have done the same. I get painful corpus luteums some cycle, oddly only on my right side so like you worry I could be ignoring apendicitus. Not much happening with me, I have a UTI (thought it was an IC flare but turns out not) AB's haven't budged it so starting a 2nd round.....not sure if this will delay my stimms cycle which was due to be next cycle.


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## GillAwaiting

Hi folks, i just had a read back, Reb has a cold, Lou has a cyst and Nell has a UTi! :wacko: How are you all doing??? Are ye all feeling any better at all? I want you all to hurry up and get pregnant so someone else can have a moan here for a change instead of me!! :hugs: Im dying to hear what effects the drugs have you guys too. :winkwink: Hairy monsters all over the thread!

I had booking in apt. 5 hours in the hospital. Lordy!!! They booked me in to see an endocrinologist tomorrow. Not sure why. Was afraid to ask any questions of the midwife because I'd still be there with her. She was so slow!! It took an entire hour for her to go through my history and get it on their computer system. They must not be too used to people coming from fertility treatment, she hadn't even heard of ICSI. :wacko: Scary. I think they booked me in for this guy tomorrow for the antibodies. Will be interesting to see what comes out of it. I'll come back on here and fill you in. Any of you guys ever seen an endocrinologist?


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## Reb S

Nope, don't even know what one is...let us know - sounds interesting, hope it's not making you nervous! 
AFM, I e-mailed my consultant and said - I've been so unwell, can you tell me what side effects to expect from the meds and she replied - no, I can't possibly do that in an e-mail, you'll have to book another (£150) consultation' COW. Stuff that, I thought - Gill can tell me everything! xx


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## _Nell

Gill - I guess midwives are used to slow 19hour labours so not good at ding stuff in a hurry! I expect the endicronologist is because you've had immunes....I bet they're not sure what/if they should be doing anything for you and so are hoping he will know......but from everything i've read beyond the first try immunes ladies just get treated like regularly preggers ladies so I wouldn't have thought he'll do much - especially since the nhs don't really believe in immunes treatment with ivf!.
AFM - thanks for asking, still got UTI, stubborn one, trying a different AB this week instead.

Reb - is this the immunes meds your asking for side effects from? Save yourself the money hun and google for the drug data sheets.....your Dr won't tell you anything different to what's on them (they are worst case scenario though and always a scary read!).


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## Reb S

Thanks Nell - I decided the money-grabbing consultant was rich enough and I'm going to follow your advice! x


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## GillAwaiting

Hi everyone, Nell you were right about the endocrinologist and the health service. It was almost funny. Im in Ireland so its the good old HSE over here. Waaaaay worse than the NHS!! So I went in to the apt, and he was looking at me and I was looking at him and neither of us knew what I was there for!! i told him I didnt know what an endo guy does and he said thyroid and hormones. I think you are right. In reality, nobody knew where to put me so they started with him. Anyway, he said thyroid is fine (which I already knew, its going to go bonkers in far off future but its grand now). After lunch I went to second apt with consultant except it was his underling. They decided not to put me in high risk unit but to see me more often than the norm so Im back in 4 weeks. I started to lose the cool when he suggested that a c section may not be needed. i trust my fertility cons completely, she's seen my insides so much and if she said section, then section it is. Also Im only 4ft 11 and not usually too chunky (except recently with the steroids!). He said the decision would be made when I meet the consultant so I will be having a hissy fit if I dont get in to see him the next time. I gathered they are just afraid of getting sued by women who suffer from some after effects and I told him we would sign all the papers they could throw at us.

So there you go. Health service. They don't even do an anomaly scan which baffles me. Surely the sooner they know about a problem the better?? :shrug:

We discussed aspirin as Im still on it and he said its only useful for the first few months unless there is a thrombosis problem. I've have those tests (no thanks to the HSE, that was all privately paid for, they only do those tests after 3 miscarriages, I lost the cool with them over that one back then, it went like "we don't have the luxury of being able to get pregnant (hubby no sperm) so how are we going to have another miscarriage to find out?" ) so I know there are no thrombosis probs. So tomorrow is the last aspirin and that's it. Im nervous as hell. :wacko:

Reb that consultant sounds like a right sod. Shame on them. Imagine wanting you to come in for a consultation. Nell is right, thank goodness for the internet. Apart from all the concrete facts, sometimes people on threads know more about what's really going on than the doctors.


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## Lou32

Hi all. I'm on my phone again so will try post properly over the weekend, but just wanted to say hope youre all well. Nell, only just noticed a PM from you from Jan! I really need to sort my settings out so I get emailed when I receive a PM. So sorry to hear about your UTI and the ABs not working. Boy do I know how that feels!!
Will post soon! 
X


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## Reb S

Off to Korea and China for 12 days for work (yuk) so might not get internet access. Love to all x


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## GillAwaiting

Reb S said:


> Off to Korea and China for 12 days for work (yuk) so might not get internet access. Love to all x

That sounds like a cool job! :thumbup:


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## Reb S

Hi Gill, I've found some internet and I'm online at 3 am with jet lag. Beijing is covered with a vile orange smog - really hideous! I'm escaping the city tomorrow to get away from the smell. Hope you're doing ok x


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## GillAwaiting

Reb S said:


> Hi Gill, I've found some internet and I'm online at 3 am with jet lag. Beijing is covered with a vile orange smog - really hideous! I'm escaping the city tomorrow to get away from the smell. Hope you're doing ok x

I was in Bejing a decade ago with ex-hubby. The smog was bad then so I can't imagine how much worse it must be now. Lots of fascinating stuff there so so I hope you are having a good time and not working round the clock.


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## GillAwaiting

_Nell said:


> Gill - I guess midwives are used to slow 19hour labours so not good at ding stuff in a hurry! I expect the endicronologist is because you've had immunes....I bet they're not sure what/if they should be doing anything for you and so are hoping he will know......but from everything i've read beyond the first try immunes ladies just get treated like regularly preggers ladies so I wouldn't have thought he'll do much - especially since the nhs don't really believe in immunes treatment with ivf!.
> AFM - thanks for asking, still got UTI, stubborn one, trying a different AB this week instead.
> 
> Reb - is this the immunes meds your asking for side effects from? Save yourself the money hun and google for the drug data sheets.....your Dr won't tell you anything different to what's on them (they are worst case scenario though and always a scary read!).


Any joy yet?


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## Reb S

Hello ladies - Day 2 of downreg! I finally did it. How's it going with you guys?


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## GillAwaiting

Reb S said:


> Hello ladies - Day 2 of downreg! I finally did it. How's it going with you guys?

That's great news. :happydance: All fingers crossed now. Do keep us posted how it's going and share the details! :thumbup: It's all fascinating stuff. 

Things seem to be ok for us. We had anomaly scan yesterday and got a really detailed examination of the baby. So far all is well. Im crippled with arthritis and acid indigestion but hey! As long as bambino is ok I dont care what suffering there is. Still terrified. We choose not to find out the sex. Im afraid to get too attached to be honest. Starting to feel the odd flutter now too. Really weird.


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## GillAwaiting

I should have added that my doc told me the steroids could have contributed to the bad acid indigestion. Apparently they can mess up your stomach and throat. Might explain why its been bad from about 12 weeks.


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## Reb S

Blimey Gill, sounds like you're having a hard time. How come you've got arthritis? Is that something you had anyway? I had a bout of arthralgia once and it was agony - poor you x


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## GillAwaiting

Reb S said:


> Blimey Gill, sounds like you're having a hard time. How come you've got arthritis? Is that something you had anyway? I had a bout of arthralgia once and it was agony - poor you x

The arthritis is really weird. It hasnt bothered me for years. I was living in the U.S for a couple of years and found the climate change did absolute wonders. When I came back to Ireland I only had the odd twinge in my hands. But now three years on, I came off the steroids and bang! Every single joint in my body is fecked. It's pretty horrendous. I can't sleep because it aches to much and Im so stiff to move. Can't do stairs, can't get out of chairs, put on socks.... It's the freakiest thing. It was never this bad. Im hoping it will go with pregnancy. But nevermind that because at least bambino seems to be doing ok and that is the most important thing right now! I can't believe this is happening still. It's very surreal.


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## Reb S

Have you seen a rheumatologist? Or are you waiting till after the pregnancy to see if it just goes? Glad bambino is doing so well though! 
AFM - day one due any day, down reg has had no symptoms this time - weird - last time it was a disaster!


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## GillAwaiting

Reb S said:


> Have you seen a rheumatologist? Or are you waiting till after the pregnancy to see if it just goes? Glad bambino is doing so well though!
> AFM - day one due any day, down reg has had no symptoms this time - weird - last time it was a disaster!

How you getting on Reb? Have you started??


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## Reb S

Hi Gill! Yes, I'm stimming now, on day 5 and just off to my scan. I'll let you know how I go. Then I have to start the steroids tomorrow, urk yuk. Still no symptoms. If my last IVF had been like this, I probably would have tried again last year. Oh well... 
How're you doing?! x


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## _Nell

Gill - sorry to hear your in so much pain with the arthritis, but great news all is well with baby - will you find out gender?

Reb - great that your cycle is giving you less side effects, it makes all the difference I think in helping you mentally get through it. Hope your scan went well.

AFM: Well coming out of the woodwork as per my signature, I can't shake the ropey start but I have to try put my positive head on now else I'm going to drive myself insane waiting the next couple of weeks for my viability scan. 
I'm totally symptomless and the last couple of days i've even had my usual brown gunky spotting I get every cycle for a week before AF.....but I do have hcg in my blood and for now it's rising, so I am apparently pregnant :)


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## Reb S

OMG!!!! Nell, that's great, great news! So pleased for you. My scan seemed fine - lots of follies growing, albeit a bit small so far. FXd.


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## GillAwaiting

Nell this looks so promising! How is it going. I see you are waiting on a viability scan. Oh my god my fingers are crossed for you. Do let us know how you are doing.

Reb, what's the story? How are you getting on???


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## Reb S

Hi ladies! EC was yesterday - they got 21 crappy eggs! Only 6 fertilized, but I'll take 6! OH's sample was his best ever as well! Hooray! We were able to do IVF rather than ICSI. Op was easy, hospital great - the cycle has been SO easy compared to the last disaster. Just about to do my first Clexane injection, urk - doesn't seem as easy as the Gonal pens. Hoping to get one to blast for Tuesday ET, but if not they will just pop back what's left on Sunday. 
How're you two girls getting on? I'm hoping that Gill, you're not still feeling scared, and that Nell, your arthritis is too bad and you've already had your viability scan and all is well...x


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## _Nell

Hi :)

Reb - you sound in good spirits and yay for 6 eggs, fingers crossed they are divinding nicely now. Hope your clexane went ok? I find nice and slow and gentle is the best way for me to avoid too many big bruises from them.

Gill - how are you doing? I can't believe your 23 weeks now :)

I had my scan yesterday and we saw a heartbeat :) 
Unfortunately I am measuring behind, by 6 days - up to 5 days ahead or behind is normal, so I'm a little outside normal but at least there was a heartbeat.

Gill - can I ask what dose of steroids you were on? and how long/when did you wean off them? I'm a bit unclear if the aim is to be off them at 12 wks or if that's when I start to taper....i'm on 40mg so it's going to take a while i think.


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## Reb S

Ooh, Nell - there's a HB!!! that's good news. Don't worry about the days - nothing you can do but keep hoping xxx
Do you Clexane into tummy fat or thigh? My tummy is still sore and lumpy from the first shot yesterday! Can't imagine it's going to last very long..!


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## _Nell

Reb, I'm still going in my tummy. The skin has thickened from too many injections and it's quite hard to push the needle in and feels quite horrid tbh.
There was a point where I almost ran out of space bruise wise after stimms, but many seem to have cleared now or at least faded.

I am going to switch to my thigh I think, but I go on holiday next weekend and belly bruises look bad enough without thigh bruises (might look like i've been assaulted?) so my plan is to switch to thighs on my return and until then try muddle through finding belly spots - i've sort of moved to the bit of skin at the very side, almost just in front of my hip bone.
I don't actually know where on the thigh you do it - is it the inner thigh?

Gill - Can I ask another Q - did you facial hair disappear after the steroids? I've just noticed the first few darker hairs appear on my top lip, I assume from the prednisolone. I've bought some veet to lighten them but hope they're not here for good!


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## Reb S

The nurses said I could just do it in the fatty bit of my thigh, where I was doing my stims - then the Clexane paperwork said do it in your tummy. I think I'll ask again when I go in , cos tummy sure hurts more than I think thigh will...!


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## _Nell

ooh did you do stimms in your thigh? I wish I had known that was ok as my tummy could have done with a break after 4 cycles.

I would have thought injecting in the thigs would hurt, so it's good to know it doesn't :)

How are your embryos doing? Have you got a transfer dsy yet?


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## Reb S

Yes - Tuesday! Hopefully making it to blastocyst. We've got 2 grade 1 8 cells; 2 grade 1 7 cells; 1 grade 2 7 cells and a little 5 cell. Not bad! x
Yes, I did all my stimms in my thigh - much nicer. Will ask about clexane. Yuk. hate it. ouch.


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## _Nell

wow your little embryos are doing just great :)

I'm so pleased this cycle is going well for you :)


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## _Nell

Hi Reb, just wishing to lots of luck for transfer today, hope all went smoothly :)


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## GillAwaiting

Hi Nell and Reb, wow major things happening around here!! 
Nell about the steroids, I just followed my gut instinct really. I think I really should have been off them by 12 weeks but I had tons of the stuff so I stayed on them fully until 12 weeks and then weaned off over the next 2 weeks. Bad news on the hair front. My hair is falling out in buckets from my head but the stuff on my face seems to be staying put!!! The bloating all went down and stuff though. Even though Im well on now in pregnancy I dont look half as bloated as I did with the steroids. About being a few days behind. I was constantly worrying about this because things were up an down. Behind, then ahead, then behind... Also my 2nd miscarriage, we got a heartbeat but things didn't progress so that made me worry. When can you do another scan? If you do one a week later that will tell you buckets. Even if you have to pay for it, it's worth it. Im thinking of you and hoping you are just in the same boat and things will be up and down in little growth spurts. At least you are on the right drugs now to help things tick along.
Reb hope the transfer went ok today. The waiting is the worst torture. Hope the next 2 weeks go by quickly and brilliant news coming at the end of it. 
Im rooting for you guys big time.
AFM arthritis still kicking my butt and Im getting bigger so movement is very difficult! Like a chicken sitting on an egg. Still nervous as hell. Went to baby fair and bought nothing. Still terrified!!
Fingers crossed for you guys.xx


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## Reb S

Hi Gill, I'm sorry about the hair and the arthritis situation - that sucks. I'm sure your hair will thicken up again but it changes with pregnancy and birth anyway, so I'm told. I hope you can get some peace soon and be able to enjoy this pregnancy a bit! x
Nell - thanks things went okay - there was a dodgy moment this morning as they hadn't progressed to blastocyst - it was touch and go as to whether there was going to be anything to transfer. However one made it - a 2BC, which isn't great, but not bad - and a morula was transfered too, as it had potential. So 2 little beans on board, test next Thursday xxx


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## lizlemon

Good luck Rebs, I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you! I'm going to have to use heparin and aspirin next time too xxx


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## Reb S

Hi Liz, lovely to hear for you! I hope you're doing okay - what's the latest news with you? Aspirin is fine, steroids are fine, heparin hurts! The needle is tougher than some and the blooming stuff stings as it goes in, then keeps stinging for about five minutes. I have lots of little blood blisters all over my tum, but only 2 bruises, so I think I'm quite an expert! I do have to grit my teeth though, makes the IVF shots a breeze! xx


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## GillAwaiting

Reb just thinking of you and the 2ww. A few more days. Will you test yourself early or wait?


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## Reb S

Hi Gill,
No, I'm going to wait. I'm away with my Mum for the next few days - she has mild dementia and is more than enough to take my mind off things, although I may go completely INSANE!!! I get back to OH on Wed. evening and then will test Thursday. OMG. 
How're you doing? I hope things are going okay for you now - I wish you'd change your emoticon from scared - it makes me sad to think of you all these weeks so scared, although I completely understand xxx


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## Lou32

Hi guys, Good to see you're all doing well. Gill, it's lovely to see things are still goin well for you, and Nell - wow! Fantastic news. I'm really chuffed for you. Reb, good luck!
Well I haven't been on here in a while but wanted to post just to update really as im not sure I'll be on again, at least not regularly. We had the truly amazing news that our third ICSI was a BFP and it felt like it was finally our turn. But unfortunately not. Our 7 wk scan showed a blighted ovum. We go back next Fri just to confirm but the doc was "100% certain". It's so cruel I can't find the words to express how devastated we are. We're out of money, £5k in debt and don't know where to go from here. We have two frozen blasts but I cant help but think the TESE didn't overcome our sperm problem so what's the point. Anyway, I just wanted to wish you all the best in your journeys. Xxx


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## _Nell

Oh Lou :hugs::hugs:. I have been wondering about you, hoping you we're quiet enjoying good news. I am gutted for you, so so very unfair :cry:

I don't know much about blighted ovums but didn't think it was linked to sperm issues, is it? 

It's good news you have some frosties, they will be there for you when the timing and funds are right :hugs:

Take care xx


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## Reb S

Lou - I'm so sorry, that is such bad luck - lots of hugs.
I'm not feeling so great myself as I got my BFN a couple of days ago. So Nell and Gill - it's up to you guys! x


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## Lou32

I'm so sorry to hear that Reb. This whole thing is cruel and none of us deserve it. Xxx


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## GillAwaiting

Oh Reb and Lou Im heartbroken for the pair of ye. Two horrible outcomes. It's such a godawful difficult road. There's nothing to say that will help or ease it all. I don't think its the end of the road for either of you though. You've gone so far, maybe a break for a while will help. I pray for happy times ahead. :hugs: :hugs:


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## _Nell

Oh Reb, I too am really sorry. It's just so unfair :nope:


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## GillAwaiting

_Nell said:


> Oh Reb, I too am really sorry. It's just so unfair :nope:

Nell, you had a little girl!!!! That's so wonderful. What a lovely start to the New Year. Happy New Year everyone on here. It's been a while since this thread was going. Just wanted to say hello and wish everyone the best for 2013. I hope all your dreams come through.xxxx


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## _Nell

Thanks gill, still recovering post c section but getting there. How is your lovely little boy?


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## GillAwaiting

_Nell said:


> Thanks gill, still recovering post c section but getting there. How is your lovely little boy?

Hi Nell, its all go. We had serious eating problems with Cooper but he's on the road now to normality. C sections really take a lot out of you. I hope you are back to life again. Cooper is 6 1/2 mths old now and oh my god, what changes!! We are now debating whether to go back and try our frozen blast or not. Unfortunately I have to get my gallbladder out. Been really suffering with stones since Coop was 5 weeks. Absolute murder. Yet another spin off from pregnancy!!! Im sure you'll agree it's crazy how much life has changed. :hugs:


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