# ***Lion Cub Mommies-Back In Action!***



## cleckner04

We spent our pregnant journey's together with our August babies. Now it's time to experience our TTC journeys together!! :happydance::happydance: Let's get to making these new babies!! :baby::baby:


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## Kimberly28

:haha: Love it!!! :D Now to invite Ash to the thread too! :happydance: Btw, we're both in the USA, we should exchange phone numbers too. Then when we get preg and eventually get to 3rd tri and labor time/birth time we could text each other too to let the other gals know what is going on. :winkwink: I'm only 4 hours ahead of you here in Georgia. 

Woohoo!! :yipee: Time to make new babies! We must either be very brave or totally forgetting what we're getting ourselves into with this haha! :haha: Still, I cant wait and I look forward to feeling my baby girl moving around inside of me. :cloud9: Come on AF, get gone already! LOL!! 

Lots of baby :dust: for us all and come on :bfp: !!


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## cleckner04

Is there anyone else TTC in our group? For some reason I keep thinking someone else was. I guess most of them just ended up pregnant again without trying. :rofl:

PM'ing my number now. :thumbup:


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## Kimberly28

Ugh! Bry is so cranky tonight. I must be outta my mind having another haha. I'm about to put him to bed. I'm trying really hard to not be nervous about getting pregnant again. I'm so afraid of having another mmc or a mc. But I'm doing everything I can to prevent it and am already on baby aspirin too. I'm trying to think positive too that everything will be alright this time. It's just really hard after a loss...


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## cleckner04

I know exactly how you feel. I'm terrified of losing another as well and especially since DH will be gone through the pregnancy if I get pregnant in the next three months. So I am facing the chance that I might MC without anyone here for me. :( Positive thoughts though! 


So I'm not sure how to use these opks. I bought a pack of 20 first response tests. Do I take them in the morning or the afternoon or what? And do I have to have a full bladder to take them? I've been taking them around 1:30 pm every day and haven't really had a full bladder but so far everything is completely negative. Not even a faint line starting yet. :wacko: I have no clue what I'm going. :rofl: 

Also, I'm taking prenatals, DHA supplements, and vitamin B6 cause I was told it helps with fertility. :thumbup:

Here's my ticker but I'm not going to put it on my siggie cause I just don't feel like rearranging it all. :rofl:

https://www.countdowntopregnancy.com/tickers/dpo.png?d=1284267600;0;30;14


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## cleckner04

Actually. I think I'll post my ticker on the first post on here. Do you want me to put yours on there too? Just let me know your info and I'll make one and put it on there too. :thumbup: That way we'll be able to check the first post to see where eachother is at on cycles. I know you have one in your siggie though. :haha:


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## Kimberly28

Awww! I'd be here for you! :hugs: But yes, PMA!! I'd love you to make me a ticker! :thumbup: What info do you need?

About opks...you use them mid afternoon to early evening. Hold your wee for about 3 hrs prior and don't drink more than normal amounts. Don't wanna dilute the LH too much. Every day use the test at the same time. I will start using opks around cd 12 and continue until it goes neg. The first response ones are good and accurate. I'm using cb digi opks. I hate guessing at lines haha. :haha:

I just put Bry down to bed and he passed out before I could lay him down. Bless his little heart. :cloud9: I cant believe how much I love him! :)


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## cleckner04

for the ticker I need day your LMP started, cycle length, and luteal phase if you know it. :thumbup:

I wanted to get CB digis but they were all out of them!! I don't think I plan on using OPKs after this month but so far they are kinda addicting so we'll see. :haha:


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## Kimberly28

AF began Sept. 20th, cycle length is 28 days (it ran 2 days more this cycle b/c i ov'd late due to stress) and I usually ov cd 16. Luteal phase, I think, is 12 days long. Thanks Sam! :flower:


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## cleckner04

k! I added a ticker for you. :D I gotta go eat now. :haha:


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## Shiv

hi girls, i have on emonth until we ttc (lots going on this month so not trying yet!)

i am expecting my period, well actually i am 3 days "late" (but then I have only had 3 since Sophia so i think it is just my cycles getting back into some sort of rhythm, and before anyone says it, I am NOT pregnant already!)

SO waiting for this period to come and go and then then next and then ttc


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## Kimberly28

Hi Shiv! :wave: Aww that's ok! You're still more than welcome here in the meantime. :hugs: Glad to see you over here! :flower:


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## ashnbump

:hi: well ive not had chance to read just yet! but will do tonight! Promise :blush: 

anyway .... IMMMMMM HHHHHHEEEEEEEEEEEREEEEEEEEEE LOL!

be nice to chat openly and not worry about upsetting anyone :thumbup:

baby dust to us all!xxxxx


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## cleckner04

Whenever you girls get a chance just give me your stats and I'll add a ticker on the main post for ya!! :thumbup: 

I plan on holding my pee as good as I can for my ovulation test today. :haha: So far there isn't even the hint of a line on the tests so that worries me a bit. I really hope I'm ovulating. 

I had a moment of fear last night thinking about having a second kid. Emma is such a handful at times I wonder how I'll handle another baby. :wacko: I must be crazy. Part of my brain keeps thinking if I don't get pregnant yet it won't be bad because it'll give Emma time to grow up some more but don't they just get worse behaving with age? :haha:


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## Shiv

i worry a lot about coping with another baby, especially trying to breastfeed a newborn whilst looking after Sophia. I think I have forgotten the hours of constant feeding involved and I am just not sur ehow that would work with a todler to keep amused too?:wacko: But then I think that in years down the line it will be great for Sophia to have a brother or sister to play with, and I get very jealous when i see baby bumps!

I always assumed i would want a baby boy (and therefore have one of each) but actually another girl would be kind of cool as well. Sophia has been such a dream interms of sleeping etc that maybe another girl would be good! 

So still no AF for me, on the brightside the later this AF is the more likely it is that I can ttc a month early. I am away for a weekend with university friends (back to teh city we went to uni in) on the w/e of 16th Oct, so I don't want to ttc before then. However if i Ovulate after that weekend then I can ttc in October instead of waiting for the following month if that makes sense. That is assuming i am ovulating - think i may have to get me some sticks to pee on :haha: although I don't understand the theory be:haha:hind them at all!

Does anyone know if you can still get EWCM if you don't ovulate?


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## Kimberly28

Welcome Ash!!! Glad to see you here!! :hi: Take your time reading. Most of this thread is me and Cleck going back and forth. 

Cleck: I know the feeling! I do the same. Especially last night when Bry was being so ornery and cranky. I was thinking to myself, what would I do if I had a newborn screaming right now and him being cranky too? :wacko: But my DH is very active in helping out with him so I think it would be ok. I hope! lol! But I do have my moments of questioning my own sanity haha. :haha: 
I know I'd definitely be much more tired and busy and such but I could always take advantage of the times that the tiny one is sleeping to spend time with Bry and do my chores. Since we all know that newborns sleep alot for the first 1-2 months of life. That would help me out much more haha. I'd just have to stop every 2-3 hours to nurse her. :thumbup: I could handle that surely. As long as Bry doesn't decide to take that moment to get clingy or fussy. But I could always distract him with something I'm sure. Or if push come to shove I could put them both in the car and go for a drive to put them both to sleep! :haha: LOL! Listen to me.....eee gads...It'll be ok one way or the other I'm sure. lol :loopy:


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## cleckner04

The CM stuff is where I really get confused. So I'll be no help there. :haha: 

I would be equally happy either way if we have a boy or a girl I think. We plan on having more than 2 kids so if we don't get a boy yet I will probably be hoping for a boy with the 3rd baby. I mentioned the fact that we may just have all girls to DH and he shit a brick at the thought. :rofl: We aren't decided about if we want 3 or 4 kids yet. I guess it depends on how we handle 2. :D 

With the opks. I'm clueless too. I know the test line has to be equally dark if not darker than the control line and than it's a positive. But that's all I know. I know once it's positive you'll ovulate within the next 24-36 hours or something like that. That's just what the box said. :rofl: But it didn't explain that I have to hold my urine and that I should take it in the afternoon. :dohh:


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## Kimberly28

Shiv, I think you only get ewcm if you are ov'ing. And it's possible to have some after ov too. So I think take that as a good sign. :thumbup: I could be wrong, but I've never heard of having ewcm each month and not ovulating (as in regularly, not as in it being withheld or put off from travel or stress or illness).


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## cleckner04

See, I don't have that husband that is there to help a ton. Cause he'll be gone a lot. So I have to figure out how to care for them on my own and manage without losing my sanity. I'm sure the housework will just suffer. :haha:


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## Kimberly28

I'm sitting here juggling 3 different threads on here and the TTC board and FB all at the same time. And Bry and his playing and occasionally watching tv too. LOL! Meanwhile I have laundry waiting for me..hmmm...must figure out how to get motivated to do my chores today haha. :blush:


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## cleckner04

:haha: 

Well it's only 12 here but I held my pee for 3 whole hours and took the test and still nothing. :rofl: Completely dead negative. Shouldn't I at least be getting a faint line by now? Doesn't it build up before it gets dark?


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## Boothh

hey girls! im going to be keeping up with this thread until november, im due AF any day then one more AF and ill be here wooo XD


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## cleckner04

You want me to make you a TTC ticker for the first post boothh? :D 

If I don't get pregnant by November I'll still stay in this thread to cheer you girls on. :thumbup:


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## spidey

Hi girls... I'm just nosey and thats why I'm here :haha:

I'm NTNP, so maybe I'll post if I'm really late and thinking about testing and everyone can share in my excitement :happydance:

So far this month no signs of a single hormone flowing thru my body :haha: I expected AF Wednesday if my cycles are 28 days, but most of the time they're closer to 34... so sometime next week AF will visit.


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## Shiv

i guess we could keep the ttc chatter to this thread now - save upsetting anyone?


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## cleckner04

I miss having my 28 day cycles! :( Now I gotta wait 30 days. I sure hope they don't get longer and longer with each kid. Although in a way it'd be nice because that just means less AF's each year. :haha:


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## Boothh

lol cleck i envy your 30day cycles! im on CD34 atm and im not really expecting AF til after the weekend at least, it sucks having long cycles, i am getting panicky nervous though because we havnt really been careful this month, weve been ntnp and pulling out if we remember but i dont think we did pull out when i came home drunk lol and that was around when i think i OV :dohh: it would be typical if we catch the month i dont wanna get pregnant eh lol x


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## Boothh

and less AFs is crap when you wanna ttc my cycles can be anything up to 50days! that means less OVs to get pregnant!


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## spidey

Boothh- I'm the same way with irregular cycles. Normally I'm around 36 days with peaks up to 48 days every couple of months. Since having Kira my cycles have been shorter though... 34, 34 and 29 days!


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## Boothh

wow id kill for 29 days before i have jesse i had about 4 periods a year he was a happy accident so it wasnt like i was bothered about only having a few periods in fact it was convieniant, they have significantly shortened since having him but they are still long compared to most people!


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## cleckner04

I like the sounds of 4 AFs a year. :haha: But I agree, it'd be awful when trying for a baby. I wish it could be as simple as just snapping the fingers and being pregnant when you want so you can get the perfect age gap between kids. That'd be awesome. I keep thinking if I don't get pregnant soon, it won't be until Emma is nearly 2 before we can try again. :wacko:


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## Boothh

dont worry about it cleck i really think sometimes the worrying makes it worse i dunno why i think just letting it happen is the best way though i really understand its difficult for you because you dont have OH with you all the time x


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## Shiv

my cycles were 31 days before i had Sophia, the three i have had since have been 31, 31, 29, and now i am on CD34 so who knows what is going on :dohh:


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## cleckner04

Boothh said:


> dont worry about it cleck i really think sometimes the worrying makes it worse i dunno why i think just letting it happen is the best way though i really understand its difficult for you because you dont have OH with you all the time x

Yeah I always approached it with a relaxed mindset and we got pregnant quickly the first two times. But this time I have a very strong feeling it won't happen right away so I'm trying to prepare for that possibility. I'm trying my very best not to worry too much. I don't go in the TTC sections at all because they are SO stressful IMO. I'm taking the OPKs to make sure I"m even ovulating in the first place. One step at a time. :D If I don't get pregnant I plan on losing a ton of weight instead while DH is gone. So it's kind of a win/win either way. :rofl:


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## Boothh

yeah thats a big reason i try and avoid them cus they stress me out, if i was in your position id probably do opks too, since iv had 2 mcs when we wernt particularly trying since having jesse its a pretty safe bet i am OV :dohh: 

you lot are making me wanna use the frers i have upstairs now hahaha all this ttc talk!


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## Kimberly28

My goodness! I'm away for a few hrs and you ladies get chatty! lol! Crap, now I don't remember what everyone said... :dohh: :haha:

I'm so ready for AF to be gone now as I really wanna try now and to be intimate with hubby too of course. The only thing is that I know that since not having :sex: for a couple weeks now (thanks to pre AF spotting) I'll O very easily and quickly. Thing is according to the shettles method woman is supposed to refrain from O b/c it makes her secretions more alkaline after O favoring male sperm where as the vaginal tract is usually more acidic. But considering that I'll likely be done with AF by the end of the weekend and I don't normally OV until cd 16, wouldn't it be ok to O as male sperm will have lots of time to die off before OV time? I will definitely refrain from O once we get to 7 days away from OV. Do you all think that'd be ok? Geez...I do sound desperate for my plan to work. :dohh: :blush: 

Cleck: You're how far away from OV day? A Line might not begin to appear until 2-3 days before OV. Don't worry just yet. :hugs:

Boothh: LOL! Aww you know you wanna go poas!! LOL! :haha:

I know what you all mean by long cycles being a pain in the a$$. After I came off the pill I didnt get an AF for almost 3 months! And DH and I were TTC at that time too. So many bfn's and frustration. The doc had to give me progesterone tablets to bring on AF. Even then I was having 40 day cycles and that was when we started using clomid to help us and fix my cycles. Which in the end got my ovaries working again but ended up not falling preggo until we took a break from ttc and were NTNP. Haha, of course right. But yeah, the process was very frustrating. 

Anyhoo, I just got Bry put down to bed. He's fast asleep hehe. I love my little prince charming. :cloud9: Time to kick back and relax and head to bed soon. G'night everyone! :flower:


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## cleckner04

Well it looks like I'm out this month before it even began. :growlmad::growlmad: DH just informed me that he has to be out on the ship next week. Right smack at the time I should be ovulating. Go F'ing figure. :( So now we only have 2 months to try. :roll: I'm so discouraged right now. I know it's not the end of the world but I really wanted to have my babies fairly close in age and it seems like that most definitely won't be happening. I can only hope I ovulate late or something. I'm still going to keep taking the ovulation strips and see if my body is functioning correctly but I'm definitely out this month unless I ovulate late. :(


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## Shiv

aw you never know Cleck, it seems i will Ov late so maybe you will too! Can Corey not sneak off the boat for a quickie?


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## Boothh

cant he stick some in a jar for you cleck ;) jokinggg. that sucks hes going to be away! you might be lucky and have some still hanging around by the time you OV xx


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## Kimberly28

Aww I'm so sorry Cleck! :( Maybe he can run home just once on the day before or on the day of OV? Maybe claim family emergency? Haha. :haha:

Boothh: She needs him home the day before OV and/or on day of OV as they are trying for a boy which requires BD very close to and right at time of OV. :winkwink:

Btw, am I the only one of us who charts and checks BBT. CM. CP, etc? :blush:


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## Shiv

I haven't got the foggiest about any of the charting stuff Kim, i think if i struggle to conceive i would consider it but fx we have no issues this time and i won't need to!


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## Boothh

is that actually true? i suppose it could be because with jesse we only dtd once that month and from my scan and his due date (which he was born on) we concieved on the 21st november, (we dtd the 20th november) id love a girl next time im gunna look into this stuff cus i desparatly want a baby girl, though id love any healthy baby, but iv always pictures myself with a baby girl never boys so i just would love one girl at least out of the 4 children we plan on having!


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## Boothh

oh and i did an frer this morning with fmu CD35 and not a hint of a line i even ripped the test apart and stuck the strip in front of my phone back light shining through and not even a squinty :( boo though means i can enjoy my holiday! and my 21st which is on sunday! xx


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## cleckner04

I wish I knew more about charting but honestly it's just a bunch of jumble to me. 

Well, I'm still taking ovulation strips and still nothing. :( Not even the hint of a line. I took one this morning instead of the afternoon because I always forget to hold my pee throughout the day. An OPK can still work by using first morning urine right? :wacko: And why does it have to be taken the same time every day? I'm so horrible at this. :rofl:


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## Kimberly28

Hi Cleck. It's because unlike hcg, LH does not build up overnight. The surge usually begins early afternoon to early evening. Thus you might get an ambiguous result with fmu. I don't expect you to see another line until 2-3 days before the full surge (aka pos. opk). When are you due to OV? Do you have any idea? Also, the reason you test at the same time each day is due to the levels of LH in your urine. And when it does go pos, if you test again the same time the next day (say 5pm for example) and it's then neg. then you will have a good idea of when you actually ov'ed and can likely even narrow it down to a 4-5 hour window as to when it happened (since you usually OV 24-36 hours after a pos opk).

Hope you're having a nice weekend. :hugs: I guess I'm the only charter here. That figures! :dohh: Haha. Oh well. I guess with how my body and cycles are I need to keep close track which charting lets me do. :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

Okay. I'll try to time it better from here on out than. I took another one tonight at 6 and there seemed to be a very faint line there. :shrug: So I hope it's the start of it. According to a 'perfect' 30 day cycle, I should ovulate on Tuesday. So in just a few more days. I'll try to remember to take the ovulation test at 6 tomorrow night too. Actually I'm going to set an alarm on my phone for it right now while I'm thinking about it. :blush: 

I can see where charting would be nice so you'd know exactly where your at with everything but honestly I have enough trouble remembering to take an OPK. :haha: I just don't have that kind of dedication. Plus, I'm a worrier as it is so I think it would just make things SO much more stressful for me. 

So far my weekend has been quiet without DH here but he'll be back tomorrow before he has to leave for the week so hopefully we can actually go out and do something tomorrow. Although I'm just as happy staying at home watching movies. :D

Hope your weekend is going well!!


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## spidey

Cleckner- I'm sorry about your DH not being home- argghhh! I hope there's a way you can meet him for a quickie!


I was getting scared on Saturday since I was soooo tired and a little nauseous all day. I got cold feet and decided I didn't want to have another baby so soon... but then AF came on Sunday at day 32! I'm liking these shorter cycles and painless periods! So despite my fears, right now I'm still planning to NTNP again this month... hehehe.. how quickly I forget how horrible it is to feel nauseous all day :haha: In regards to periods- I use to get cramps so bad that I often missed work despite taking loads of motrin. I think being in labor wasn't so bad for me since I've had worse cramps with my period. It's weird having periods without pain- I'm liking it!


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## Shiv

I seem to chnage my mind daily about TTC again. It doesn't cross my mind that Sophia would be an only child, I just assume that i will be pregnant again one day. However, I have massive pangs of guilt that when Sophia has a little baby brother or sister that she won't get as much attention anymore. I love her so much and the thought of not being able to give her all my attention (hubby gets a bit but you know what I mean :haha:) and love physically upsets me:cry: Does anyone else get what I mean?

Oh and I got af yesterday on CD37! God only know what is going on!


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## spidey

Shiv- I'm feeling the same way as you. I think thats why I'm NTNP because if its meant to happen, it will happen. If I don't become pregnant then I'll be okay with that too. I think I change my mind every day and sometimes several times a day. My life seems perfect now so I would hate to mess up what I have by having another LO, but I know my life would probably get even more perfect. It's just hard to imagine.


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## cleckner04

I sometimes get the same feeling that Emma won't get all my attention anymore. BUT, I also sometimes see Emma playing off by herself and I think to myself that she should have a friend there to play with her. A little brother or sister she can pick on and teach things. Because sometimes she looks so lonely off by herself while digging in the toy box or whatever.


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## cleckner04

I forgot to mention earlier but I took a OPK last night but it was later than usual like at 8:30 pm instead of 6 pm.(we were at the beach so I forgot) But, it was dead negative again. :dohh: I hope I get a line soon because I'm "supposed" to ovulate tomorrow! I'm already holding my pee for today's test. :haha: It's 3:30 and I plan on taking it at 6 so I can get back on that schedule.

I'm so inconsistant with these things. But I'm really trying. :blush:


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## Kimberly28

Cleck: I'm so glad that you guys found Roxy safe and sound. Since hubby did get to come help find her, any chance he also got to quickly try to knock you up before going back again? :winkwink: Hehe! I'm just curious and nosy. :blush:
Hope your day is going better now than it started out as. :flower:

Hubby and I have BD'ed twice in a row now (two nights in a row) :blush: and today is cd9. Sticking to the "rules" and hoping we conceive and are successful in making our little girl. I guess we will just have to wait and see. But I'm just glad to be officially trying now. :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

We did sneak one in...:blush: BUT, I think they changed the schedule again and he'll be able to come home tonight too. We'll see if he shows up tonight. I'm pretty sure he will though!! :happydance::happydance:


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## spidey

woo hoo Cleckner! I hope your DH can come home tonight too :blush:


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## Kimberly28

Yay Cleck!!! Time to make like rabbits and get hopping! :bunny: Hehe! :blush: You go girl!!! :happydance:


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## cleckner04

:winkwink: Now if I can get a positive OPK. I think I'm definitely not going to use OPKs again once I know if I'm ovulating or not. Too much of a hassle. :haha:


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## Boothh

i took that frer the other day think it was last week sometime when i said an clear bfn, took one this morning and jesse distracted me i forgot about it, theres a faint pink line? i dont want to think about it too much but its in the right place and faint but not squinty and def pink! im on cd40 today average cycle is about 38days recently!! OMG OMG OMG we only had sex twice this month and we pulled out and i cant cancel my holiday cus i didnt get insurance :dohh: i want to run out and buy tests right now but stuart will go mental!


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## cleckner04

OMGOMG!!! You have to go buy more!! :D:D Seriously, Disney is still fun while pregnant I see no reason you'd have to cancel your trip. There are still tons of rides that are fun while pregnant. OMG you seriously have to go buy more tests. :haha: I'm so excited for you right now.


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## Boothh

im going to get some tomorrow, i think it could be an evap cus i dont know if it appeared in the time cus i didnt look til hours later but its deffo pink proper pink, we said if i am we will just add jesse on and take him too seen as we cant go on any rollercoasters haha, it would be just typical though wouldnt it the time we dont want to get pregnant! im not fussed if AF arrives but im terrified now i want to be but i dont at the same time i dont want to go through the heartache again iv had enough bad news this year! i dont know what to think!


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## cleckner04

Well that just shows how much you really deserve this GOOD news than! :hugs::hugs: 

I think if the test is showing pink it couldn't be an evap right? I've never had an evap so I'm not really sure. Fingers tightly X'ed for you!! 

I went to disney world while I was 20 weeks pregnant and it was a ton of fun still. We are considering going to disneyland in october because they are doing a halloween thing but I don't know yet. I've never been to a disneyland before.


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## Boothh

i dont want to start obsessing and set my self up and then AF arrives though to be truthful i expected AF last sunday at the latest :/ gahh this site brings out the worst in me lmao!

i think they are all much the same thing though iv only ever been to disneyland paris (halloween there is amazing) we were thinking of taking jesse next halloween, did i mention jesse has started calling me Becki instead of mum.. LOL xx


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## joeyjo

Just randomly spotted this thread & got all excited!! woohoo!! Hello! :wave:

DH and I have been NTNP (I hate that term by the way!) for MONTHS but without much hope as there was no sign of AF - however she made her return and I am now awaiting my 4th AF...

Unfortunately last month was the first month we actually got to do the deed mid-cycle due to in-laws staying etc etc... Anyway AF is due on Saturday but fingers crossed she stays away!

I'm very casual about the whole thing at the moment, I've slipped right back into a 4 week cycle with AF starting on Saturdays so I'm just planning on trying to DTD more around that middle weekend. If there is no sign of anything happening b Xmas then I'll think about more determined methods in the New Year.

Anyway I'm off to read thru' the other posts as I got to excited and replied before I read everything :)


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## Boothh

welcomeee :D


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## cleckner04

:wave: Joeyjo!! 


Boothh- :rofl: @ him calling you Becki. He sounds like he has amazing vocabulary! Emma is chattery but doesn't say many real words. The other day she was BFing, I was talking to DH about a ping-pong ball and she popped off real fast, said "ball" clear as a bell and got a grin, than resumed her feeding. :rofl::rofl: I know what you mean about not wanting to get your hopes up. I'm the same way about the entire TTC thing in general. I'm just really trying to stay neutral about it. But if I were in your position, I'd be having trouble not getting excited. Can you post a piccie of the test?


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## Boothh

i will in the morning cus stuart is asleep and the lights off, dont hold much hope though cus iphone is crap at picking up bfps haha, i better get the sleep now though ill be falling asleep thinking of baby names haha x


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## spidey

Boothh- are you feeling any symptoms?? I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you! I agree with Cleckner- you MUST take another test!!!


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## joeyjo

:test: lol boothh - hope u get a good answer! Jesse seems to say loads G has hardly any words at all; although bless him he chatters away incomprehensibly!

btw I Didn't mean to offend anybody when I said I didntlike the phrase ntnp :( it's just that last time ttc meant chucking out the condoms and I'd barely heard of any other ttc techniques :rofl: basically we are ntnp but I class it as ttc if that makes any sense


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## cleckner04

You didn't offend me! :flower: I think the entire term NTNP is a bit ridiculous to be honest. Most women I've seen on here that say they are NTNP, are really just trying but their husbands don't seem to get the hint. :rofl:

Some women legitimately aren't really caring one way or the other so just BD and hope for the best. And I guess that is true NTNP. :haha:


----------



## Shiv

Boothh, have you tested again yet?????????????????????????????????????

Hi JoeyJo

Cleck any sign of a positive OPK yet?


----------



## cleckner04

I have a slight line that started 2 days ago and it was darker tonight(yesterday in a few minutes. :haha:), so hopefully todays is even darker. I have them all lined up to see if they get darker with time. I feel like a mad scientist. :muaha: No matter what, I have at least learned that I'm ovulating later than all the online calculators say.


----------



## Shiv

it's quite interestig stuff Cleck! i am a scientist by degree, so daren't start using them as I won't be able to stop myself figuring out exactly how they work - geek! here's hoping for a darker line then :thumbup:


----------



## Boothh

Joeyjo that's all we do I had no idea about any of this stuff til I joined this site, we just have sex without protection alot haha,

I have noo tests and I was bursting for a wee at about 6am so no fmu now either, I'm going to get some today 

I didn't notice symptoms really but
iv had cramps the last few days and I normally only get cramps when AF has already arrived, spotty, weeing lots and got a funny taste in my mouth that makes me gag on stuff, I thought it was a side effect of my painkillers but maybe it's not, I'm just going to take paracetamol until I know for sure though, :/ I might go to the shop with Jesse and get some now haha


----------



## Shiv

gogogogogogogogogogogogogoogogogogogogogogogogogoggogogoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo


----------



## Boothh

stuarts left the pram in the car :( and the ony way to get there is to use the buggy but its crap and i cant push it with my back, iv asked my sister to bring some LOL


----------



## Boothh

well i took another and its a fainter line than the one on yesterdays but it was 3rd wee of the day and id only held it for an hour, so im gunna try again fmu tomorrow

this is yesterdays, iphones dont pic up pregnancy test lines very well iv found, 

iv inverted it cus you can see it better, and its quite clear in real life you can see with out looking really, todays is abit squinty but as i said quite diluted pee i dont now what to think now! 

https://i55.tinypic.com/wwdn3a.jpg


----------



## Boothh

were is everyone im going mad here haha


----------



## Kimberly28

OMG!!! How could so much happen in less than 24 hrs?! 

BOOTHH!!!! OMG HUNNNY!!!! I'm SOOOOOOOOO excited for you!!! :happydance: :happydance: Go get a digi already! You're late enough that it's sure to say pregnant and that will show up in a pic for sure!!! :test: :test: :haha: You can defo still do disney while prego! Just avoid the rollercoasters to be on the safe side. Hehe. :winkwink: I don't blame you for being nervous though. While I am hoping and praying for a bfp this cycle, I know that once it happens, I'm gonna be a worry wart big time! Haha. :blush: Now get that digi and let's see that big ole BFP!!! :haha: :hugs:

Cleck: Sounds like you are close to OV, are you seeing any ewcm? Keep it up until it goes pos! I'm gonna start using my opks either tomorrow or saturday. I'm supposed to go to this class on Saturday morning which would require me to get up at 6:30, leave at 7:30 to be there by 8:30 and I think I'm gonna skip out on it hehe. Saturday is cd 13 and the last day of BD for hubby and I until post ov. Since mornings are supposed to be when the sperm count is highest, I'm thinking about sneaking in a quickie before bry and zach wake up haha. 

:wave: Welcome JoeyJo! You haven't offended anyone. It's all good. :thumbup: :flower:

Well my cm is starting to stretch a little more but it's not fully ewcm yet either. Hopefully it will become more clear like ewcm by end of the weekend. So help me, I better not OV early this one time and screw this whole timing thing all up to hell and back or I'll be really pissed off! :dohh: :hissy: LOL!!


----------



## Shiv

I see a line!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Congratulations Boothh! Here's to a happy and healthy 9 months for you and LO :hugs:


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## Boothh

im still not sure i think its evap or a dodgy test fmu will be the decider tomorrow!! stuart had a go at me before and said why do i get like this every month spend a fortune on hpts and sit there squinting until i convince myself i can see something and then get upset when AF arrives, but i didnt even do that this month he takes all the fun out of it moaning!


----------



## cleckner04

AHH! I wish I didn't have to sleep when you guys are up. :haha: I see it boothh but I definitely agree you need to do a FMU test. Maybe a digi too. :winkwink: Fingers X'ed!! 


kim- I don't check cm so I have no clue what to look for on that. :haha: I had never heard morning sperm being better! That's interesting. We always do it in the evening. He leaves the house around 5 in the morning so that's way too early for me. I'll have to post piccies of my OPK progression eventually. Although I haven't been tracking what day I took them. :rofl: I don't know what CD means. People always write CD12 or whatever. What does that mean? And I've also been reading about luteal phases and mine is apparently getting shorter and shorter since I haven't ovulated yet and they are saying anything under 10 for luteal phase won't actually hold a baby. So I'm worried. I need to hurry up and ovulate already. It's really interesting learning some of this stuff though. I really am clueless but I've been starting to somewhat read. :D


Oh yeah, I completely forgot to tell you guys that DH has just been working late but still gets to come home at night!!! We only see him for like 2 hours before bedtime but we've still been sneaking in some :sex: when we put Emma to bed. :D


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## Boothh

i write CD as in cycle day i dont know if thats actually what i means though but i thought it was, i will do another test in the morning, i hate being in limbo so annoying lol so glad that OH is managing to get home and see you cleck xx


----------



## Boothh

iv just realised if i am pregnant this month it will be the 3rd time in 5 cycles that iv been pregnant, maybe 3rd time lucky?


----------



## Kimberly28

Ohhhh!!! Maybe Boothh! Third time can be the charm you know! :winkwink: I cant wait to find out the results tomorrow morning! I'm certain it's a BFP for you!!! :happydance: Please let us know right after you test!! :hugs:

Cleck: Glad DH has been able to come home and :sex: haha. And yes, cd means cycle day. Ewcm is (sorry for tmi) when you wipe after you pee and its a clear and slippery type of fluid on the tissue and it seems to be stretchy and it resembles egg whites ew= eggwhite cm= cervical mucus = ewcm. :haha: When you see that it's usually a good indicator that you are in your fertile window and about to ovulate or are ovulating and should bd as soon as possible.


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## Boothh

thats all i do when i see ewcm i make sure we have sex til its gone ha


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## cleckner04

Oo okay! I'll have to look when I wipe next. :haha: So gross. :lol:


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## Boothh

haha definatly is gross! xx


----------



## spidey

JoeyJo- I'm NTNP too and don't care either way if I get pregnant or not. I figure when its the right time it will happen and perhaps it will never happen.

Boothh- I'm still keeping my fingers crossed for you.. 3rd time is the charm! The symptoms sound right on though :happydance:

Cleckner- I did a google search on OPK... I'm learning so much!


----------



## Shiv

Once you start checking for EWCM you'll never miss it again!


----------



## Boothh

i never missed it before i even knew what it was, and stuart just thinks he has just done a good job at turning me on if i have ewcm :rofl:


----------



## Kimberly28

:haha: LOL Boothh. That's funny! Ahhhh men.... they are so ignorant and nieve. LOL! 

My poor DH has been having to on decaf as of late because I told him the impact it has on his swimmers and at his age, we cant afford any further compromise since we're ttc. :coffee: He wants it back after I ovulate. I'd love to let him have it but I cant guarantee that our efforts are going to cause me to get pregnant on the first try even though I'm sure hoping it does! :blush:


----------



## Boothh

right im off to bed be posting bright and early xx


----------



## Kimberly28

Nite nite Boothh! Sleep well and I look forward to your post with your bfp! :winkwink: :hugs:


----------



## cleckner04

Okay girls. Kimberly especially. I have saved the past three days OPK tests and I got a line the past two days that were fainter than the control line, and now today I have no line. I took a picture and I'll post it in a second but is it possible that I ovulated and the line just didn't get as dark as the control line? They were each taken around 6 PM with urine I held for hours in advance. I've actually been consistent with them the past three days so I just don't get it. Did I not ovulate this month? Pics in a sec. Emma is climbing on me. :haha:


----------



## cleckner04

Here's the picture. THe last test is still wet but obviously the other two have dried up. I'm SO confused. Did I ovulate on CD 18? 

https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0785.jpg


----------



## Kimberly28

Hey Cleck. No, I don't think so. The line should at the very least match the control line. Your body may gear up to ov again though. I understand the frustration though. I had that kinda thing last cycle where it looked like I was about to OV and then crap happened at hubby's work and he got stressed and we had that spat and it caused my ov to be put off. You had that stress with Roxy's disappearance occur and I'm suspecting that that might have caused your ov to be put off as well. Hang in there and try to be patient. I know it's frustrating. :hugs:


----------



## cleckner04

So does that mean I'm out this month?


----------



## cleckner04

Okay I just read in the OPK section and apparently I should be doing a few a day because I could've had a surge and just not caught it. I hope that's what it means. And some girls said they've never gotten a super dark OPK. Hmmm..This is seriously just making me more stressed than anything and I only wanted to use them to see if I'm ovulating. And it seems like I'm not. :(


----------



## Kimberly28

Awwww! Don't let it stress you out hun. You're not out, you might be having long cycles and like I said, the stress that you went through with Roxy disappearing could have caused your ov to be put off. Your body might gear up to ov again though so hang in there. And I'd recommend doing the opk twice a day. Usually the two best times are between 11am and 3 pm and 5pm and 10pm. And you want to leave as much time between the two tests as possible so I'd recommend 1 and 9pm. I myself have to start using my opks tomorrow (cd12) since I'm starting to get the ewcm so I hopefully wont screw up our BD timing. Haha.

If its any comfort to you, I have another friend who is still breastfeeding her son and he's over a year old now too and she is now 13 weeks pregnant with their 2nd child. So you can still ovulate while BF'ing but it may also cause you have longer cycles than usual and have a later OV date. Good luck and don't stress. Just take each day as it comes and wait it out. Stressing definitely wont help things any and it definitely can mess up OV for you. So just relax and take it easy. :hugs:


----------



## Shiv

Boooooooooooooooooooooooooooothhhhhhhhhhh where are you?


----------



## Boothh

BFN!!! i guess that first line mustve been an evap :/ i dont feel like im about to come on though at all so i dont know what the hell is going on! ill do another over the weekend if she doesnt arrive xx


----------



## Shiv

hmm wierd! Yeah wait a couple of days and see what you get - either way it is all good Boothh - if you get a BFP then yeehaa you're up the duff, and if you get a BFN then you get to go on all the best rides at DLP!


----------



## Boothh

yeah im happy either way, were ttc in november anyway so not long to wait! x


----------



## Kimberly28

Hey this is really interesting!! Just for fun, I was just curious and nosing about the web and I thought to myself, I wonder what the chinese gender prediction charts would say for me this time around and if it says I'll have a boy or a girl this time. Last time I did this I was preg with Bryson. However, I didn't realize that all of those charts require you to use your LUNAR age which is NOT the same as your actual age right now. So last time it said a girl because I put in my biological age instead of my lunar age which is according to the lunar calendar. I found a lunar age calculator and it says my lunar age is 31 and if I conceive in October, it's a GIRL!!! :pink: I checked like 10 different charts from different websites (and no, they don't all have the boy/girl marks in the same places on each one) but each of them said I'm gonna have a girl. After consulting the calculator again for my lunar age for when I was pregnant with Bryson, I went back to all of those same ones and I put in my LUNAR age for when I was preg with Bry. I got pregnant with bry before I turned 30. I was 29 but my lunar age would of been 30 at the time. Each of the charts all said a boy for that lunar age and conceiving in December which is when I conceived Bryson. I'm not saying that it's 100% accurate as I'm not even preg yet but there must be something to it for that many to be correct about my having a boy (Bryson) and now saying I'm having a girl! :shrug: At the least, it sure is fun to think that it COULD be right even if it isn't. I went through every single gender chart on the first page that google gave me. All said the same thing and they were different charts I even opened them in different tabs to compare them and they were different. Kinda interesting though even if it is just for fun. :winkwink: I guess we will have to wait and see what happens. You ladies ought to try it and calculate your lunar age for when you got preg with your lion cubs and see what they say for you and see if the gender is accurate for you as well. Remember, just because you may be one age right now doesn't mean that's your lunar age. I'll include a lunar age calculator for you all. My lunar age now is 31.

https://www.chinesefortunecalendar.com/CAge1.htm

PS - I'm on cd 13, still neg opk's but have ewcm and my cp is high soft and closed now (instead of medium, medium, and closed) so not long now and my bbt is looking right on track too. :thumbup: Trying to stay calm and relaxed so that OV doesn't get put off again this cycle. DH and I will :sex: one last time tonight and I plan to use a vinegar douche to help make things acidic to freeze the male spermies haha. Hey it can only help after all. I guess we will see. I should OV on cd 16. Which is in just 3 days so fingers tightly crossed that this will result in a bfp for me and our baby girl! Please keep your fingers crossed for us!! :flower:


----------



## cleckner04

I calculated it back when I was pregnant with Emma and it said girl so it was right for me!! :thumbup: Fingers X'ed for you!!! :pink::dust:

So all of my OPKs are now completely negative so I think that one day really was my surge and I just didn't catch it on the OPK because I only took 1 that day. So I think I ovulated on CD 18. If I ovulated at all of course. :haha: I'm really undecided about doing these OPKs again next month. Because they are a bit stressful but I really didn't get what I wanted out of them this month. I wanted to know for sure that I was ovulating in the first place but obviously none of my tests were positive so it's kind of inconclusive at the moment. :dohh:


----------



## joeyjo

Hope u girls are all ok :)

kimberly -fingers crossed xx I had a go at the chart but it was sooo confusing on my phone I'll try later on the proper compuetr

I'm trying not to get excited since AF restarted I have had her Sat Jul 10th, Sat Aug 7th & Sat Sep 4th - so exactly 28 days although before G I had 29-30 day cycles. Anyway I'm now on day 29 and still no sign....

We almost used protectiomn this cycle too as it would be so inconvenient but decided we were so busy especially mid cycle that the chances of catching the egg were tiny....

Oh well if I've caught due date will by 6 dats after my sister in laws wedding that I've known about for 18months and can't really miss! Not sure when to test - DH thinks I should wait till after my birthday on Thursday incase it's a bfn and makes me feel older & badder...


----------



## cleckner04

OOO fingers X'ed for you Joey!! :happydance:


Well, DH really is gone for a week now so I won't see him until Friday. :( At least we got some good :sex: in before he left so hopefully the month isn't a total waste. :haha:


----------



## Kimberly28

:thumbup: Good job Cleck! Fingers crossed for you!

Joey: Ooooo!! That sounds promising!! :test: :test:!! Haha. :haha:

AFM - I'm cd 14 and due to ovulate in just 2 more days (cd16). Hubby and I :sex: almost every night (only missed one night) since AF left and now that's its cd 14 it's time to abstain according to Shettles Method. So that's what we're doing and now is the beginning of the waiting game. The next step is a pos opk hopefully tomorrow. Then hopefully a bfp and a baby girl! But we will see I guess. I've already got my self soothing comfort treats on stand by just in case AF shows up. :haha: But with a little luck it wont be needed. :winkwink:
Fingers tightly crossed and lots of :dust: for us all!!

*Please G-d, bless us with a healthy baby girl! *​


----------



## cleckner04

Kimberly- Woo! Fingers X'ed for you too!! Your cycle seems to have flown by already! Is that weird to say? :rofl:


----------



## Kimberly28

lol. No it's not weird and it's only almost half way over. :winkwink:


----------



## Shiv

joeyJo - sounds promising, let us know when you test!

Cleck- glad you got some good loving in whilst Corey was at home. Did you stop using OPK's in the end. I think i am going to give them a miss, i think it will stress me out.

Kim, your DH is lucky, getting all that baby dancing action. if I am honest I am not that fussed about sex, so TTC can be a bit of a chore for me :blush: My hubby loves it though cos at least for one week every months he gets some action!


----------



## Kimberly28

LOL Shiv. Yes he is lucky that his wifey has a healthy appetite for lovin :blush: and is dedicated to the cause. :rofl: He certainly doesn't complain lol! :haha: Honestly I'm ready to get to the point that I'm allowed to orgasm again though. Having to hold back has been the hardest part of all of this so far hehe. :winkwink: Orgasm causes a woman's secretions to become alkaline so I have to hold off so as to not help the male swimmers out any hehe. I also did a small mini douche vinegar and water last night before :sex: so hopefully that will help kill off whatever male swimmers there were so that they wont get up into my tubes and stay alive and beat the girl ones to the egg once I ovulate. Haha. Now it's just wait and see. Other women have sworn by it though so I'm giving it a try. :shrug:


----------



## cleckner04

Shiv- Yeah I think I'm done with the OPKs. I have about 6 more left from my pack of 20 and I might take them just for fun but at this point they are all negative anyways and truly they were just a pain in the bum more than anything. 

Kimberly- Your very dedicated to this! I could definitely not give up my orgasm for the sake of having a girl. :haha: But than again, I'm not to that point yet. If I don't have a boy by the next go around, I may resort to your method but the opposite for a boy. :haha:


----------



## Kimberly28

Have I completely lost it and gone off the deep end? I mean is all of this effort insane? Is it bad that I'm determined to have a girl? :blush: Gosh I sound like a looney. :wacko: Haha. I promise I'm not though! :haha:


----------



## joeyjo

Kimberley - I can't imagine putting so much effort into aiming got a girl - oviously a girl would be nice so we had one of each but i can see the benefits of 2 boys too. You gotta do what u are happy & comfortable doing though - I hope you get what you want but that you are still happy (once you are used to the idea) if you get a baby boy too :hugs:

AFM - I gave in & tested - BFN :( so in the shower I checked my cervix position (tmi) and it feels low so hopefully AF will arrive soon & I can get going again...


----------



## cleckner04

Kimberly28 said:


> Have I completely lost it and gone off the deep end? I mean is all of this effort insane? Is it bad that I'm determined to have a girl? :blush: Gosh I sound like a looney. :wacko: Haha. I promise I'm not though! :haha:

I don't think your insane at all because it's perfectly understandable to want a girl after having 2 boys already. And if this is your last baby, the pressure is on when you want a girl so badly. BUT, I would really hate for you to be disappointed and I truly hope your prepared for the chance that it may be another boy. :hugs: I am behind you 100% with your trying for a girl and I will continue to send my positive girl vibes your way. I truly think the Shettles Method is interesting and I love hearing about the different things your doing. I just don't want you to get hurt in the process. :hugs::hugs:


----------



## cleckner04

joeyjo said:


> AFM - I gave in & tested - BFN :( so in the shower I checked my cervix position (tmi) and it feels low so hopefully AF will arrive soon & I can get going again...

:(:hugs: Where are you in your cycle? If you want I can make a ticker for you on the first post! I'd just need to know the first day of your last AF, how long your cycles are, and your luteal phase(if you know it). 



I'm fairly certain I'm not pregnant this month either. I know it's still early but I have absolutely no signs or feelings of being pregnant and I did with my other 2 pregnancies. I hate that it's all a waiting game once the initial fun of :sex: wears off. :wacko: For me it really wore off with DH being gone. :haha:


----------



## joeyjo

cleckner04 said:


> Kimberly28 said:
> 
> 
> Have I completely lost it and gone off the deep end? I mean is all of this effort insane? Is it bad that I'm determined to have a girl? :blush: Gosh I sound like a looney. :wacko: Haha. I promise I'm not though! :haha:
> 
> I don't think your insane at all because it's perfectly understandable to want a girl after having 2 boys already. And if this is your last baby, the pressure is on when you want a girl so badly. BUT, I would really hate for you to be disappointed and I truly hope your prepared for the chance that it may be another boy. :hugs: I am behind you 100% with your trying for a girl and I will continue to send my positive girl vibes your way. I truly think the Shettles Method is interesting and I love hearing about the different things your doing. I just don't want you to get hurt in the process. :hugs::hugs:Click to expand...

Cleck is so much more eloquent than me & put what I was trying to communicate so much better!


----------



## joeyjo

cleckner04 said:


> joeyjo said:
> 
> 
> AFM - I gave in & tested - BFN :( so in the shower I checked my cervix position (tmi) and it feels low so hopefully AF will arrive soon & I can get going again...
> 
> :(:hugs: Where are you in your cycle? If you want I can make a ticker for you on the first post! I'd just need to know the first day of your last AF, how long your cycles are, and your luteal phase(if you know it).
> 
> 
> 
> I'm fairly certain I'm not pregnant this month either. I know it's still early but I have absolutely no signs or feelings of being pregnant and I did with my other 2 pregnancies. I hate that it's all a waiting game once the initial fun of :sex: wears off. :wacko: For me it really wore off with DH being gone. :haha:Click to expand...

I'm cd30 at the mo - I've only had 3 periods since G and had a 28 day cycle both times (ie 2nd & 3rd AF were after 28 days) not sure how long this cycle is gonna be.... Hopefully not much longer and I can get back in the game :)


----------



## Kimberly28

cleckner04 said:


> Kimberly28 said:
> 
> 
> Have I completely lost it and gone off the deep end? I mean is all of this effort insane? Is it bad that I'm determined to have a girl? :blush: Gosh I sound like a looney. :wacko: Haha. I promise I'm not though! :haha:
> 
> I don't think your insane at all because it's perfectly understandable to want a girl after having 2 boys already. And if this is your last baby, the pressure is on when you want a girl so badly. BUT, I would really hate for you to be disappointed and I truly hope your prepared for the chance that it may be another boy. :hugs: I am behind you 100% with your trying for a girl and I will continue to send my positive girl vibes your way. I truly think the Shettles Method is interesting and I love hearing about the different things your doing. I just don't want you to get hurt in the process. :hugs::hugs:Click to expand...

Awww thanks Cleck. I know that if it's a boy again I will be disappointed at first but after that I will definitely love him too and be very blessed to have him.


----------



## joeyjo

Another day, af still missing but still bfn... Just wish either af or bfp would arrive!

Oh well at least it looks like I'll be able to have some champagne on my birthday :)


----------



## ashnbump

well af was due yesterday, but shes a no show, did a test yesterday morning and bfn :( its strange that ive not come on though as its been the 4th of each month for the last 3 months at least! maybe its due to me worrying about it etc! i think i'll wait till friday n c if af shows then ill test again! Only got one clear blue digi left lol!x


----------



## Shiv

oh a couple of late af's - fx girls.

JoeyJo - you have probably said already but how many cycles have you had since George? I have had 4, teh first 3 were pretty much bang on 30 days and then for no reason my fourth was 37 days :dohh: god only knows what my next will be!


----------



## joeyjo

I'm on my 3rd cycle - 1st 2 were bang on 28days (pre G I had 28-29 day cycles) I'm on day 31 now, grrrr


----------



## cleckner04

It's crazy how our cycles can get so screwed up after having a baby. Fingers X'ed for both of you that have late AF!!! :dust:


Emma and I both have colds so I can't even symptom spot bc I am nauseous and have stuffy nose and all of that but it's just because I'm actually sick. :dohh::rofl:


----------



## spidey

Just popping in to say hi and to say I'm still keeping up with this thread  I hope all the late AF's arrive soon so you can get started again! Soon I think I will be hitting my fertile time if I'm even ovulating. I shouldn't keep track of my AF on my work calendar because I'm hardly ever at work :dohh:


----------



## Kimberly28

Ok ladies! Today is cd 16 and I just got my pos opk!! :happydance: Now here is to praying that there are still some alive swimmers hanging out in my tubes waiting for the egg to come out. Last days of :sex: were cd 7-9, and 11-13. If I just got my pos opk, then I should be ov'ing tonight/tomorrow am most likely right? Because LH hits the bloodstream before it hits urine by about 4-5 hours ahead and after a pos opk ovulation is usually within 12-24 hrs right? So yeah, tonight OV or tomorrow am. So let's see that's.... right now swimmers :spermy: were deposited 3 days ago (4 as of tomorrow), 4 days ago, and 5 days ago as well as 7 days ago (cd 9 and 11-13). So do you ladies think I'm in with a good chance for a bfp? :blush: Here's to hoping!

I hope you ladies with late AF's either get the witch so you can get back in the game or get late bfp's. Keep us posted! :flower: Lots of :dust: for us all! :hugs:


----------



## cleckner04

Kim- Yay!!! :happydance: I don't know how good your chances are but I'm definitely rooting for you!! 

As for me....Okay...I'm definitely confused.com right now. For the past two days I've gotten nearly positive OPKs after days of nothing? :shrug: What the heck is up with my body?


----------



## Kimberly28

Sounds like a late OV then hun. Which is definitely possible. I'd BD if I were you (if you can) just to try to catch the eggy. Here's :dust: for us both! :hugs:

PS - I hope your cold gets better soon. I know how miserable it is since I am having the same thing right now. Blah!


----------



## cleckner04

No BDing here. DH is gone until Friday. And even if we did, a luteal phase has to be at least 10 days for a baby to stick from what I've read. So it wouldn't be a sticky bean anyways.


----------



## Kimberly28

Awww. I'm sorry Cleck. That really sucks. It seems like my luteal phase is always different. Last cycle it was 11 days long, the one before that it was 12 days long. My body likes to do strange things though to keep me guessing it seems. :wacko:


----------



## Shiv

Cleck - you may just be having a long cycle, just because you have been regular since your af came back doesn't mean that this one couldn't be longer. I'd get on the case with Corey when he is back on Friday (as if you need any encouragement!) and see what happens. I'd bet my bottom dollar that your cycle will be longer this time.


----------



## ashnbump

still no af for me! caved and tested again, bfn! really have no idea what on earth is going on! very strange for me indeed! 

when is everyone testing etc? i wonder if anyone will be lucky this month!

cleck & kim could you explain what the luteal phase is??? :blush: 

xx


----------



## Boothh

im on cd47 and still no AF orrr BFP! iv not tested since sunday when i couldnt decide if i could see anything not so i just chucked it in the bin, i hate staring atm tests and tryna see a line haha, well i think im gunna test again tomorrow, i dunno what the hell is going on! boobs are very sore now though and they are NEVER sore before af ever only when iv been pregnant, grr I HATE SYMPTOM SPOTTING! i wish af or bfp would arrive i hate this crappy limbo part.


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## Kimberly28

Ash: The luteal phase is the time between 1 dpo (days past ov) and the time that AF arrives.


AFM: It looks like I have ovulated already! I had a huge temp spike this morning. It went from 96.80 to 97.58!! :thumbup: So I hope to confirm it with a neg opk this evening and hopefully another high bbt tomorrow am. It's exciting to think that my little eggy could be either getting fertilized right now or already is. Here's to hoping!! Now bring on the 2ww. Haha.


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## Boothh

oo how exciting! fingers crossed kimberly! xxx


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## ashnbump

i have to admit im not a fan of actively 'TTC' :( it feels like its taking so long :( even though we've only been trying properly 8 weeks, or 2 cycles, i know im dtd at the right time, i keep up on it all with an app on my iPhone, i get pos OPK's and the lot, but no baby yet!?!? whhhhhhhhhhyyyyyyyyy!!!?? it took me 3 months after i came off the pill to get preg with Kara, and i only missed one pill when i got caught out with our angel baby! so i genuinely expected to get a bfp on the first cycle!

im not happy at all lol!

i too suffer with sore boobies as a result of pregnancy, but never af!

im so impatient i HATE HATE HATE waiting, and this is the worst because i cant do anything other than what im doing! it makes me have baby envy cos my next door neighbor is preg with her 2nd, and she finds out what shes having next week :( 

gahhhhh i want my beany NOOOOOOOOOWWWWWW 
:growlmad: :growlmad: :growlmad: :growlmad: :growlmad:
:brat: :brat: :brat: :brat: :brat:

sorry girls, had to vent there, feel no better mind you!lol!xx


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## Boothh

ash im the same with jesse i was on the pill and 2 mcs it was first month we didnt use condoms :/ i feel like it will take ages this time, if i were you id just have sex and not do anything else instead of worrying yourself with all the technical stuff, i do think worrying about it can make it worse i do, 
and i can relate to you getting baby envy OHs sister is pregnant (i think she got pregnant on purpose though she says it was an accident with my mmc in april when i told his family i was pregnant she stormed out the room and we never got a congratulations then all of a sudden shes pregnant, lol) 
well shes due in march when i wouldve been due with second mc and all i get everytime we go round is mil shoving her scan in my face (like i wanna see that) and her goin on about buying prams etc AND SHES STILL SMOKING :dohh: i just feel so jealous when i see there and it makes me feel shit cus im not that sort of person, but i know all my life ill have to see my niece/nephew and know my baby should be that age/doing that etc and i hate it, i really do think the only way for my heart to heal will be to have another baby, i just want a little newborn to hold :( 
sorry to go off on one haha i feel better now x


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## ashnbump

i felt the exact same when i lost our baby, my close friend was due the same month i would have been, her LO is almost 4 now, that would have been me! I only got over my MC when i brought kara home from special care, i lay her on my bed and stared at her for 3 hours straight, it flew by. I still think of angel baby, but now im (not glad but you know what i mean) happy to have kara, she wouldnt be here otherwise! 

I cant wait, i really cant, ive forgotten what it was like to have a baby baby lol!

Im so bad that ive already picked out furniture and decor, and buggies, and car seats etc etc, im organised to say the least haha! 

I can picture a baby boy in my head, but i think another girl would be nice, not bothered one bit thought, a healthy baby is the most important thing! :thumbup:

i do hope it doesnt take toooooooo long, i really want them close, no more than 3 years apart! 

i am going to just get down n dirty from no on, and try not to think about it (as much) 

ahahah kara has this little doll that she takes EVERYWHERE and i mean everywhere, she cries and cries till shes got hold of her! Anyway i took the clothes off it to clean them and put one of Kara's first vests on it for the time being, it bloody fits!! I never realised how tiny my girlie was :( xxx


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## Boothh

aw i think it always tends to happen that way my mum had a mc and my auntie was due in the same week my mum was my cousin is nearly 14 now! and she said she still thinks about her baby and gets angry about it but she wouldnt have my youngest sister (10) if she had that baby, im thinking about it more recently cus i wouldve been due next month, in a way im glad there wont be a newborn around in the next few weeks because i really feel like i wouldnt appriciate jesse for what he is at the moment, hes just the cutest little thing and i just love spending time with him right now and i dont think i would have the time to do half the things we do if there was a tiny baby around, i think a 2 year gap is just perfect so im hoping i catch in november or december! 

and its mad how big theyve got isnt it my baby sister was 5lb when she was born (5weeks early) and theres a photo of her next to a babyborn doll and she house the baby born outfit on and the doll has her baby grow on and they are the same size haha! x


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## ashnbump

have to just post this piccie for those of u not on my facebook! I LOVE HER! model in the making lol!
 



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## Boothh

she is just soo cute haha, i know this is nosey but iv noticed in some of your pics what i think is a laugh and learn keyboard? or something like that, were is it from? iv looked everywhere for something like that for jess or christmas and i cant find anything!


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## ashnbump

its not nosey at all boothh!! i think you mean this one...

https://www.toysrus.co.uk/Babies-R-Us/Toys/Music-and-Dance/Laugh-and-Learn-Baby-Grand-Piano(0076487)

if the link doesnt work its type baby grand piano on the toys r us website! xx
 



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## Boothh

yaaay thanks so much! :) we plan to get him music themed christmas presents theres a toddle drum kit in agos we want to get him the gand piano, drumkit and one of those kids electric guitars along with his smart trike and toddler bed for main presents, god i must be mad buying him the loudest toys possible! xx


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## Kimberly28

LOL! I was about to say...you'll regret that Boothh! LOL!!! :haha: But he will enjoy them none the less. :winkwink:


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## ashnbump

It's fab the piano! Me and David use it more than kara haha! It's bot that noisy cos u can turn the sound down! She climbs allllllll over it though! 

We have several lists from several different retailers for Xmas but I won't be able to shorten them haha! I can't flippin wait for Xmas, I honestly don't think I've ever been so excited! Ahhhhhh I can't wait! Hope I'm preggers by then! Altho last time I was preg at Xmas I felt so crap!lol! Xxx


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## cleckner04

That's what we did for Emma's birthday. Music theme. But it's not annoying at all really. She doesn't have loud toys or electronic toys really so the little piano and xylophone and drum aren't too bad after months of no noise. :haha: I can't stand all the toys that light up and go nuts. They make ME nuts. :rofl:


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## Boothh

jesse has the laugh and learn chair which he loves and he has started singing the abc song with it
he goes A B C D and thats as far as he can get but still good!
im trying not to go too mad at christmas cus we can hardly fit any toys in thouse plus i knw he will get a tonne from family and friends but i bet i still go overboard! i cant wait cus they are gunna understand better this year and its gunna be greeeeat!!!
i hope im pregnant too though i remember when pregnant with jesse i was sick all morning ate dinner and then fell asleep in my bed at like 3pm cus i felt soo ill great christmas lol!


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## cleckner04

We aren't even having christmas this year. I'll be alone with the baby. :( So I can't really join in the happiness this year. We will probably do a few gifts on thanksgiving instead and that'll be it. I'm not even putting up a full blown tree bc it's pointless with no one here.


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## Boothh

you can do lotsa stuff! and you should deffo put the decorations up! you could make a video of emma doing her presents and stuff and maybe you could get her a santa hat and make a video of her putting her daddys presents in his stocking or something to let him open when he gets home and then have a mini late christmas when your all together, if all else fails you can skype with us and have christmas 'together' lmao xx


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## cleckner04

:haha: I really just can't get into the spirit of it this year. I think we will put up Emma's small pink tree the first of november and than on Thanksgiving we'll do something(27th or something like that can't remember when thanksgiving falls this year). Christmas will already be weird being in California with no snow. :wacko:



On a TTC note, I have been reading all over trying to figure out what is up with my body and I'm starting to worry I have a luteal phase deficiency now. :dohh: Google is the devil. But on the other side of it, some girls can pick up pregnancy with their OPKs and they said to take the OPK in the morning because the LH would be low and HCG would be higher so I took one this morning and it's still got two dark lines. So here's hoping I'm getting all these lines because I'm pregnant and not because I'm broken! :rofl:


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## Boothh

well that is the aim cleck ;) FX

and im testing in the morning btw x


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## cleckner04

Ooo Fingers X'ed for you too!! I think your totally pregnant. :D And if you are I'm going to be so jealous. I can't lie. :haha:


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## Boothh

if i am im going to be terrified, i felt sick the last few days and super sore boobs but i think its psychological :dohh:


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## Kimberly28

Well I'm confused now haha. I just did my opk and it was positive again and the lines are darker than yesterday's. However I had a huge temp spike this morning which is usually indicative of OV. So I dunno if I'm seeing the tail end of this or what. I hope I've already ov'ed because if so then we caught 4 day old sperm. If not then it will be 5 day old sperm which I know can still result in pregnancy but can also be pushing it and not result in pregnancy. So I dunno. :shrug: I just hope I'm at least in with a good chance to be preg this cycle. :dohh:


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## Kimberly28

Boothh: Hope your bfp comes for you tomorrow am! Keep us posted! 

Cleck, I'll be jealous too. I'm afraid I'm watching my chances this cycle go out the window. :( I'm really anxious/nervous now about tomorrow morning's temp. I guess we will see though. Also, I'm so sorry that you have to spend the holiday alone. :( Is there any family that you can go see/be with instead of being alone? If not, since I'm geographically closer to you than boothh (no offense boothh), it would probably be easier to catch each other on skype or msn IM with webcams. I'm really sorry that hubby wont be home with you two. I bet he doesn't like it either. Makes me wish I could bring you two out here for a couple days or so. You should still do at least a small xmas for Emma's sake. It really wouldn't be fair to her to not get to have an xmas. As for us we don't really celebrate xmas anyways. Our holiday is 8 days long instead of one and it's sooner than xmas hehe. :)

Ash: I hope we're all preggers at/by xmas time. :hugs:

Meanwhile, Bry is pestering me for snacks haha. He now has decided he likes cheerios too. :thumbup: Well I better run and feed him before he gets cranky. :wave: :flower:


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## cleckner04

Well we still plan on doing a christmas. Just not on the actual day. :D I'll probably save a few small gifts for Emma to open on christmas day but the big stuff can be opened with DH around. I considered flying home but I'm terrified to do it alone with Emma and than we have 2 dogs that would need taken care of and I'd hate to leave them behind. 

Emma is sneaking cookies from the table right now. She is looking at me the entire time. :haha: They are little animal cookies that are meant to be for toddlers but she's acting like she's being so naughty by 'sneaking' them. :rofl:


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## Kimberly28

:rofl: Awwww!! That little cutie pie!! She is just so adorable!! I really do adore her! 

I have a feeling that as soon as I let Bry try cookies he will be doing the same haha. Right now he tries to grab my box of cheerios or the bottle of his puffs and run off with them and then look back at me over his shoulder and grin or giggle haha. They are such little stinkers at this age. Almost makes me wish they could stay like this forever hehe. :cloud9:


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## Boothh

well im even more confused now, i have the faintest line ever like well squinty to the point were i cant decide if im imagining it, my camera wont pick it up, godd i just want my period now this is going no where and making me in a bad mood in the process!

we have been buying these new jumbo animal cookies and jesse loves them

https://i55.tinypic.com/10ia1eh.jpg

probably cus of the thin layer of chocolate on them haha

he is sick today and keeps getting the runs which is pretty disgusting were going through nappies like i dont know what :(


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## ashnbump

i dont get it, if our af's are late then why are we not getting bfp's lol! especially if our af's are like clockwork usually! i feel really tired today and really really sick, but im having tummy twinges, i think could be impending af?! :confused:

ahhh i give up on caring now, ive got rid of alllllllllllllll of my pg tests so no more temptation! it'll happen eventually! :thumbup:


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## Boothh

i used my last one today and im not buying anymore i hate ttc so annoying why cant we just click our fingers and be pregnant haha x


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## Boothh

well got my wish AF has arrived LOL, i must have OVd super late :/


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## ashnbump

i think im joining you today boothh, awful lower back ache = impending AF for me :thumbup: must say im kind of glad as we've got Alton towers planned for the 18th as my birthday celebrations! my bday is actually the 15th, but i want to go during scarefest! Anyway, i wouldnt have been able to go on the rides if there was a beanie this month! 

whats the betting i get caught in November like i did with Kara, and they'll have similar due dates :rofl: i actually think thats gonna happen lol!x


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## Kimberly28

Awww so sorry Bothh. :( :hugs: Lots of :dust: for next cycle. 

I'm cd 18 and I think 1 dpo. Now the 2ww begins. However, since I ov'd a day later than I thought I'm not holding out much hope this cycle. We will likely both be ttc again next cycle but I guess we will have to wait and see.


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## Boothh

at this rate ill probably be OV around the time we go to disney so that means i can still go on the rides ha and we might make a disney baby XD


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## Boothh

oh ffs iv just worked it out and ill be in the tww while were there, i can still go on stuff cant i?


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## cleckner04

I'd still ride the rides boothh. :thumbup: 

Well I have a feeling my af will be coming next week so it looks like we'll all be doing this again together next month. :haha: we will be the most pitiful group of ttc'ers ever. :lol:


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## Boothh

haha well seen as i wont have another AF before we go weve decided this cycle is when were gunna properly ttc, :) hopefully we will all catch next month then eh x


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## Shiv

And i will be joining you next month too!

I am a bit peeved, I am due to OV around the 12th October. But I am away for a weekend of drinking, dancing etc from the 15th. usually i abstain from drinking for the TWW just in case. SO my quandary is do we TTC this month around the date of OV and then just drink anyway, or should we just wait a month and not try until November? I know that even if i was to get pregnant that the bean would not be taking anything from my body for a few weeks whilst the placenta forms etc but i think I woudl still worry. What do you girls think? DO you abstain from drinking during your tww?

Oh and sorry for those who got their AF, but it sounds like you can have a blast on lots of hair-raising rides now! 

And Cleck I think you ahev definitely deterred me from buying any ovulation sticks! At least until we ahev ben trying fro a few months and I get worried!


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## Boothh

shiv id drink anyway, i took loads of drugs the week before i found out i was pregnant with jesse and i told the midwife cus i was clueless and i was panicking it would affect him and she said nothing you do even smoking affects them til the placenta takes over x


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## ashnbump

Hello af :hi: lol


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## Boothh

well least were all on cd1 together haha how weird


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## cleckner04

Well you two are. I'm not yet. Mine should start on Monday or Tuesday. :thumbup: So I'm not too far behind. 

Shiv- I'd probably not drink in a TWW at least not heavily. But honestly people always get pregnant while drunk so maybe it'd be your month. :rofl:


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## joeyjo

Well I'm still waiting for AF & got another BFP. I drink a little in the 2ww & I'm def having a drink or 3 tonight - I'm 30 today & just waiting for the babysitter :)


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## cleckner04

^^ You mean BFN right? :haha:

Happy birthday too!! I was gonna say it on facebook but I forgot and I'm on the phone so I don't feel like switching from BnB. :blush:


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## Boothh

do you mean bfn? happy birthdayyyyyyy xxx


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## Shiv

Happy Birthday JoeyJo - of what a difference a P makes compared to a N :haha:


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## ashnbump

I knowwww! I think we r destined to share another pregnancy lol! Maybe even due dates this time! If we get caught this month new baby and kara will have the same birth month, it's ok tho isn't it!? I feel awful lol!

Are we celebrating a bfp then joey? Ir a misspelled bfn lol! Happy birthday! And with regards to drinking, if you didn't know you were pregnant and you had a drink it would only be the same, like cleck said most pregnancies occur on heavily drunken nights out lol! I drank just before my bfp with kara, at a works do, and I was paralytic, if I'd known I was expecting I wouldn't have drank, but idid and she's ok! (not saying it's right to drink whilst knowingly pregnant tho lol) 

I wonder if any of us will get a bfp this cycle, oooohhhh I hope so altho I'll envy you like mad lol xx


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## joeyjo

Wishful thinking typo - I meant bfn unfortunately!! :rofl:


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## Kimberly28

Happy Birthday Joey!! :cake: Have a terrific night out! :flower:


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## Kimberly28

Just a quick update... After my temp spiked the other morning it went back down a bit the next day and this morning it was back up again even higher and FF.com has confirmed ovulation on cd16 (actually between cd16 and 17). So I'm 3 dpo today and am now in the 2ww. Fingers crossed!! IF there were any sperm still living in my tubes it was 4 and 5 day old spermies so definitely female ones! (We hope!) Let's hope they were still alive and caught the eggy! [-o&lt; I guess it's wait and see time now. I hope the 2ww goes by quickly!


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## Pippin

Hi ladies, didn't know this existed until I stumbled on it. After my mmc we're going to try again after this af. :yipee: Haven't been on BnB much lately but I'm feeling heaps better emotionally now so I think we're ready to go again. Casually but all the same trying. Think I ovulated a couple of days ago but not sure, lines on opk every day but a spike Wednesday, missed the true positive but it's good enough for me, almost negative again now. Leaving it a month so my lining returns to normal. xxxx


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## Kimberly28

Awww Hi Pippin!! It's so good to see you! I'm really glad you're feeling better now. I know what a rough road it is to have to haul. Been there myself. I'm also glad that you decided to try again. I wish you an extra sticky bean next time and a quick bfp! Lots of :dust: for you. :hugs:


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## Boothh

hey pippin! glad to see your feeling ready to try again, good luck xxx


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## cleckner04

:wave: Pip!! :hugs: Glad your feeling better. We missed you around here. :hugs:


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## Boothh

stupid SIL is having a girl


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## cleckner04

^^ :(:hugs: You guys have plenty of time for your girl and she'll be prettier than theirs anyways. :haha::winkwink:


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## Boothh

:hugs: me and stuart were just saying that haha just cba with gettin yet another scan pic shoved in my face when i dont want to see it :dohh: they have noo tact what so ever!


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## Kimberly28

Awww Boothh! I know exactly how you feel! :( Frankly I'm jealous as hell of her too! *sigh* We just gotta remember that our time will come and all will be right with the world. I'm sorry she shoved that in your face. Was pretty tactless of her. :( Big :hugs: hun and keep your chin up. :flower:


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## cleckner04

Any preggo symptoms yet Kimberly? I still have my cold so it's hard to say for me. I've held out with any testing so far. AF should be here Tuesday.


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## Boothh

well AF seems to be leaving already which is weird for me as im only on CD3 well 4 when i get up lol normally is around for about a week with having long cycles, :/ suppose its just more time to :sex: lol


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## Kimberly28

Not yet Cleck. But it's early days (only 4 dpo/days past OV). Unless you consider skin outbreak and cravings to be symptoms. :shrug: Which I guess could be. My skin is looking like it did when I was a teenager. :wacko: I was hankering 5 guys burgers and fries like mad today. I caved in and wrecked my diet today by going and indulging myself with it for lunch today. :haha: Hehe! I guess we will see how things go in the next few days. I think IF I had conceived this cycle, that the baby would be implanting around 8-10 dpo. So I wouldn't really have symptoms till then anyways as no hcg would be present just yet at 4 dpo I don't think. I will keep you posted though. Oh but one bit of good news is that my temps are much higher in my post ov(luteal phase) than they have been over the past couple of cycles. It's showing a very clear biphasic pattern on my chart so far. Which is a good sign so far. The next week will be what tells me if I'm really in with a chance or not. Fingers crossed though! And definitely fingers crossed for you too!! Lots of :dust: for both of us!! :hugs:


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## cleckner04

OMG I read your post and the one thing that sticks out to me is 5 guys!! :rofl: I want some now! We didn't even know what 5 guys WAS until they put a new one in back in VA. Mmmmm it's so greasy and yummy and a heart attack waiting to happen. :rofl: I always walk away feeling a little sicker than when I walked in because I'm so stuffed. :D 

Anyways...lol. I've been so tired the past few days but I really don't think I can call it a symptom because I'm still sick too so that's probably it. This cold refuses to go away it seems. It's just a slight cold but still enough to make me feel 'off' all day. We plan on going to the beach today so hopefully some sun will help. :D


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## Kimberly28

Hey Cleck, I don't wanna get your hopes up or anything but when I got preggers with Bry, I got 2 colds in a row and stayed sick like you are. Maybe you're preggers! When is AF due for you?


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## cleckner04

It should be here tuesday. :D I really don't "feel" pregnant though. You know how you just kinda know sometimes?


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## Boothh

i had a cold that didnt go away when i found out i pregnant all 3times lol ;) 

i dont think iv mentioned but ive decided to quite smoking, i quit when i found out i was pregnant with jesse and didnt smoke til after he was born which im really proud of, and the other 2 times iv been pregnant i quite as soon as i found out too but understandably started again after things went wrong,

well this time i decided to quit before i get pregnant, hopefully it will give me a better chance of having a succesful pregnancy 

i havnt smoked since thursday so im on day3 of not smoking now and iv only had a couple of moments when iv wanted to smoke but i havnt!


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## Kimberly28

Cleck: I understand hun.

Boothh: WTG girl!! So proud of ya! =D&gt;


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## Shiv

That's great Boothh, keep it up hun x


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## Boothh

so can anyone help me with this trying for a girl thing? i dont really mind either way but i would love love love a little girl, what do we do to make it more likely? x


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## Shiv

I think Kim is your girl for that, I believe it involves not orgasming, vinegar and no sex just before ovulation!


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## Kimberly28

:haha: :blush: Apparently this is my cue... :dohh: Boothh, my best suggestion is to buy the book 'How to Choose the Sex of Your Baby' by Dr. Landrum B. Shettles. It's not a big book or very long, it really is a pretty quick read and very interesting at the same time. You can find it in most book stores, online at amazon.com and so on. I'll include a link for your amazon.uk. I've followed the instructions to a 'T' and hoping that it pays off. But if not, at least I tried! :winkwink: I highly recommend reading it before you make your next attempt. Oh and in the book it advises you to wait a few cycles being trying for the girl but that's only for people who have never before tracked their cycles or bothered to find out when they usually ovulate. For those of us who have, we obviously know when we OV thus when to time BD correctly. Anyways good luck and it's fun to try anyways knowing that you gave it your best shot. :flower:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/How-Choose...=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1286741375&sr=1-1 (here is the link to the book on amazon.uk)

PS - Thanks a lot Shiv! Just put me on the spot will ya? :haha: (kidding!)


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## Boothh

thanks for that, i will have a quick look and order one, the only way i know when i OV is cm but i think that im quite accurate cus if i note it down AF tends to arrive 13-14 days after my guess of OV, should i be doing more to tell? x


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## Shiv

Boothh, I think you need to know how many days prior to OV you are so that you can stop having sex a few days before...............cue Kim..........

Kim you are our resident baby gender expert - I find it all really interesting, and it will certainly be cool to see it working for you!


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## Boothh

i have really irregular cycles so how would i guess that :dohh:


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## Kimberly28

Read the book Boothh. It explains all of that! :thumbup: 

And thanks Shiv...I think. :wacko: Hehe! :haha:


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## ashnbump

i think i want another girl, but then i picture a little boy and i kinda like that idea, i think i only want a girl so i can decorate their room how i want haha, that and i love dressing kara up all pretty lol!

i have to say though when we were trying for kara i didnt know about the shettles (sp) and according to my diary, i dtd on CD 15, and we made a girl! I guess she was just a super duper fast swimmer! :rofl:

right now though, im really not bothered about the sex, i just want another liccul bambino lol! im really worried about getting pre-eclampsia again too :( incase its worse this time, altho ive been told it usually sets in later than the previous time, so maybe id make it to 37 weeks next time if i do get it! fingers x'd i dont get it again!

my AF departed yesterday :wacko: but saying that it never usually lasts a full week anyway, it was just very light spotting yesterday, and nothing since, so i do believe shes gone to pastures greener lol! Now to start some serious babydancing! i dont care what they say im getting some serious sex in this month, at LEAST every other day, if not everyday, because obviously just DTD more at ovulation times is not working :( god i hope theres nothing wrong with me :( 

x


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## Boothh

i am full off AF now and we said were gunna do it at least once a day haha


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## Shiv

listen to you young'uns - everyday?!?!?!?!?? I can barely muster the energy to do it around ovulation :haha:


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## Boothh

god when i was pregnant with jesse we used to do it about 3 or 4 times a day right up to the night i went in labour haha ¬_¬
i we never get round to it anymore though with stuart working 12hour days and my back problem we can never be bothered, but i bought loads of stuff from ann summers to help us along lmao ;)


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## Shiv

lucky Stuart!


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## ashnbump

gahhh im too fat for ann summers stuff lol! although as long as im not wearing it im up for it lol! 

I was too scared to have sex when i was pregnant with Kara, the first 11 weeks we didnt do it at all :shock: and then when i had a massive bump david was put off cos he'd feel kara moving and think he was hurting her :rofl: hahah! we aren't as worried about baby to be this time, just gonna relax and enjoy!

im so excited to be pregnant again! AND as bad as this sounds i cant wait for light duties at work! They cant take the piss out of me then! and wooooooiiiiiii for 9months paid leave from work, plus 5 weeks holidays! :D :D it best happen soooooooooon :D


----------



## Boothh

ha stuart used to complain but i couldnt get enough ha

and ash shut up you look alot smaller than me lol 

i had an ann summers party a few weeks ago for my birthday so i got a big discount ha x


----------



## Kimberly28

Hehe. I'd definitely be too embarrassed to even think about putting on any lingerie. I'm way too chubby in the wrong parts of my body to wear any of that. I remember the days when I could though. Sometimes I wish so badly I could go back to that size and figure. I could wear anything I wanted to back then and didn't have to worry about looking fat. 

Meanwhile DH, bless him, keeps asking if we have a little bean in the oven. He cant wait for me to be preggers again hehe. :haha: I told him I'm only 6 dpo so it's still technically early days and that in about a week or just shy of a week I'll have a better idea of whether or not I am. I kinda doubt I am though. Not had many symptoms to speak of really. I've had 1 craving, twinges/niggles this am, I guess I'm a little constipated (no bm in 3 days), increased appetite yesterday, and a headache last evening. Oh yeah, and a little bit of fatigue, especially in the early part of the day and then again in the evenings. But that's really about it. To be honest, this time I'm just going with the flow and not even really symptom spotting and not getting bent out of shape over things. If AF arrives, then ok, and we try again. This way if a symptom does present itself, it will be for real and not just in my head due to symptom spotting. Of course, I do hope that I am pregnant but we will just have to wait and see. Which is what I keep telling hubby too. I think he is more anxious this time during the 2ww than I am haha. :haha: It is nice to have him so proactive in this though and to see him being eager to have me pregnant and have this next baby together. :thumbup:


----------



## cleckner04

I just bought some lingerie two days ago. Wore it that night after I had a nice relaxing bath. Walked out and DH's mouth dropped open. Than we tried to get Emma to sleep and EVERY time I slipped out of the bed after getting her to sleep, she woke. I did it about 5 times before I finally gave up. :dohh: So no sexy time for us that night. :roll: I swear Emma senses when I want to have an orgasm and does whatever it takes to make sure I won't. :rofl:


----------



## Shiv

cleckner04 said:


> I just bought some lingerie two days ago. Wore it that night after I had a nice relaxing bath. Walked out and DH's mouth dropped open. Than we tried to get Emma to sleep and EVERY time I slipped out of the bed after getting her to sleep, she woke. I did it about 5 times before I finally gave up. :dohh: So no sexy time for us that night. :roll: I swear Emma senses when I want to have an orgasm and does whatever it takes to make sure I won't. :rofl:

You're definitely on for a girl next time then :haha:


----------



## Boothh

i bought a nurses outfit LMAO stuart loves it though i feel abit of a divv in it, were goin away to a posh hotel this weekend so im gunna pack up a bag of tricks lmao


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## cleckner04

:rofl: Yeah if Emma keeps it up. 


Well, AF is supposed to be here tomorrow. I took an IC pregnancy test this morning and nothing so I think I'm out for sure this month! I'm really unsure if I should get an ovulation test kit again. It was somewhat stressful but now that I know how to use them a little better, it probably wouldn't be as bad. I'm worried about ovulating late. So I think I might use OPKs again this month and if I ovulate late again, than I'm done TTC until DH gets back and maybe my cycles will get back on track.


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## Boothh

maybe emma just wants a little sisterr :rofl:


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## Kimberly28

LOL! Poor you Cleck! Bry has done the same thing to DH and I a good few times. :dohh: You'd think they'd leave us alone so we can make their siblings for them! :haha: It does suck being ummm... c**k blocked by your own toddler. :blush: LOL!!

AFM... Today is cd 23. I'm still a few days out from testing. My temp went up this morning to the highest it's been yet. I'm feeling blah and quite irritable today. Maybe slightly queasy as well. But I'm not paying a lot of attention to it. Just gonna wait it out and see. I have been feeling a bit more quick tempered lately but that could be either pms or preg sign so I'm not reading much into it. I cant believe how calm and relaxed I've been through this 2ww. It's gone by so fast. Which is a good thing. Anyhoo, I guess I'm going to get off here for now and relax while I can before Bry wakes up from his morning nap. Full day today, I have a meeting to attend this evening and won't be back from it till tonight. Boy, am I gonna be wiped out by the time I get home. Makes me sleepy just thinking about it. Haha. Well you ladies have a lovely day and I'll check back in here later. :hugs: to you all.

Oh and Cleck, did AF arrive?? I know she was due today.


----------



## Boothh

Kimberly28 said:


> You'd think they'd leave us alone so we can make their siblings for them! :haha: It does suck being ummm... c**k blocked by your own toddler. :blush: LOL!!

i pretty much just wee'd myself :rofl:


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## Kimberly28

:rofl: Glad to know I made someone laugh. :haha: Now go change into dry undies. LOL! :haha:


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## Shiv

is a rise in temp a good sign of pregnancy Kim? Hope so as things would def be looking good for you!


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## Kimberly28

Shiv, yes generally. I'm only 7dpo today though. So it's still to early to discern anything from it yet though. :dohh: Fingers crossed though! And lots of :dust: for us both! :flower:


----------



## Boothh

oo so when are you gunna test kim?


----------



## Kimberly28

Probably on Saturday morning Boothh. But I won't be at home or near a computer all day long. I have a prior commitment that I have to attend to all day. I will be back that night though and will let you all know what's going on then. I will also text Cleckner to let her know. I'm kinda dreading testing tho tbh. I guess I just hate seeing bfn's. Haha.


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## cleckner04

Kimberly- Yay!!! I'm excited for you. Temp spike sounds like a good sign! I hope it means you caught the egg! If you did, your hubby must have some super sperm in there cause you ovulated a day later than you intended right? :haha: And :haha: @ cockblocking toddlers :rofl: That' pretty much it exactly. 

Well my AF should be here today. I didn't even bother testing this morning after the BFN yesterday. AF always hits me in the afternoon so we'll see. :D


----------



## Kimberly28

:haha: It's like they have child radar or something. Uh oh mommy is horny, must start screaming now. LOL! :haha: I know how frustrating it is. I remember once when Bry was very little and only about 3 months old and DH and I were umm getting hot and heavy and about to start :sex: when all of a sudden...ehhhh..ehhh...WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!! LOL!! We were both like NOOOO!!! Go back to sleep! Hahaha. :rofl: 


I'm dreading testing on Saturday. I really don't wanna see a bfn. :dohh:


----------



## cleckner04

That's why I stopped testing because I'll end up driving myself crazy. I'm fairly certain AF will just hit today. I only have 4 more ICs left so I don't want to waste them either. :haha:


----------



## Kimberly28

I understand Cleck. I only have 1 hpt so I want/hope to make it count. :winkwink:
Well I've already peed 3 times today and normally I only go 3-4 times a day. I guess that's new. You're all making me think about this way too much haha.


----------



## cleckner04

I swear if you graduate to the pregnancy section you better not ditch us. :haha:


----------



## Kimberly28

:shock: I would never!! :haha: I'd have to hang around and see who is next to join me! :winkwink: Watch AF hit me after all of this haha. :hugs:


----------



## cleckner04

Yeah it's never good to get too excited. But you have to admit, you seem a bit pregnant. :winkwink: 

Maybe we can turn this thread into a mixture cause some of us will probably still be TTC, others will be pregnant, and I will probably be WTT again. :dohh: But than we can still keep updated about what each of us are doing, feeling, etc. :D


----------



## Shiv

I think that's a good idea Cleck - this could just be a thread about all things new baby - TTC them, growing them and having them!

and Kim, it is sounding hopeful - fx for you. Cleck when Kim texts you can you update this thread please? I can't be expected to wait!


----------



## Kimberly28

I like that idea too Shiv and Cleck. Let's do it! :) It'll be our own little home for all of it so that we don't have to stay in the intimidating "ttc" "preg" "wtt" boards. :winkwink:

Me, I'm not getting my hopes up. I know better. I'm just going with the flow. I better get ready to go now ladies. I gotta leave here in 15 mins. I'll be back later tonight. Have a great evening ladies! :flower:


----------



## spidey

Hi girls.. I haven't forgotten you all! 

Kim- I hope its a BFP for you!! The symptoms and temp spike sounds promising :thumbup:

I almost peed myself laughing at the comments about Cleckner working on her next baby girl :haha:

Here nothing much is happening with me. I don't know what day of my cycle I'm on but fertile time should be coming up soon. I know- I'm no fun at all! I think Kim mentioned her DH being really excited about pregnancy- my DH seems really excited about it too. We were buying Kira purple shoes and a purple jacket and he said "little Dexter will have to wear purple, but thats okay". Haha.. I guess he thinks the next one will be a boy and we're going to name it Dexter.


----------



## joeyjo

Hi girls - I've been away for the weekend. I can't remember if I mentioned before i went that AF had arrived - she should be departing again soon and we can get this next cycle started :)

Kim - FX'd


----------



## cleckner04

spidey- My DH is the same. He's all excited about me being pregnant again and just wants me to be pregnant already. He will miss most of it but I think it's the baby he wants, not the pregnant wife. :haha:


----------



## Kimberly28

Hi ladies. I just got back about an hour ago. I've been getting the kids off to bed and settling in for the night. I am seriously wiped out! I cant believe how tired I am. I was ready to lay down and head to sleep at only 9:45pm. So unlike me. :wacko: Normally I'm a total night owl. Anyways, I think I peed 4-5 times today. So I guess we will see. And have to see what my temp does in the morning. For now though, I bid you all, adieu. Nitey night. :hugs:


----------



## cleckner04

Oo sleepy! Good sign!! AF still hasn't hit me. :wacko: Maybe you girls are right and I'm having a super long cycle this month. Which is actually horrible because than I'll only have one more month to try before DH leaves. :roll: Sometimes I seriously have the worst luck.


----------



## Boothh

oo FX kim 
and cleck it sucks having long cycles seriously! im on like what CD7 and i wont OV for over 2 weeks possibly closer to 3weeks!
stuart is getting excited too, he really wants us to have another baby, which is weird cus he was devastated when i told him i was pregnant with Jesse LOL, 
he couldnt love him more now though!
we still havnt got any :sex: either cus jesse has been living up to the other lion cubs with cockblocking thing haha
ah well we go on our dirty weekend tomorrow night so im sure were gunna get some lovin in then lmao x


----------



## ashnbump

i think im the only one whos child actually allows us to dtd lol!

david is also excited, this baby was his idea actually, he's not bothered if its a boy or girl tho! 

we've stuck to our plan of getting down n dirty every night too!

kim i think this is your month, but dont get ur hopes high, its rubbish when u feel disappointed!

i think this is the last month i'll use OPK's then im going to let nature take over completely, im sure it'll happen eventually!

does anyone plan on more babies after the 2nd one? we both want four, any sex, these two hopefully around 2 years apart, then a gap of 3-4 years, then the next two 2 years apart again, thats the 'plan' anyway, but things usually change around here lol! xx


----------



## Boothh

ash your plan is exactly the same as ours, we want 4, any sex but would love to have at least one girl so we have some of each, 
first 2 a couple of years apart then wait til they are both in nursery/school then 2more lol x


----------



## Kimberly28

ashnbump said:


> kim i think this is your month, but dont get ur hopes high, its rubbish when u feel disappointed!


Thanks Ash. Don't worry I'm not getting my hopes up. I know better. Of course it will be disappointing if AF shows but either way I'll be ok with it. Because if AF does come, then it means I get to try again with all of you. So that's good too. :thumbup: Right now it's wait and see. Temp went down just a little bit this morning. But not by a lot. So let's see what it does tomorrow. 

One thing that is different so far is that last cycle I started pre AF spotting on 6 dpo and the cycle before that pre AF spotting started on 8 dpo. Today is 8 dpo and so far no spotting (knock on wood). So I guess that can be a good sign too. Not to mention the fact that this morning when I got up even though I slept pretty well last night I was still SO exhausted that I felt like I hadn't slept at all and have been feeling that way all morning long. Matter of fact now that my oldest is off to school and Bry is on his way to sleep for his morning nap, I think I am going to take advantage and get some more sleep too. I'm still really tired. So I'm getting off here for now and I'll be back after nap time. Tah tah for now ladies. :flower:


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## ashnbump

i dont really mind if we have all girls and no boys, but a boy would be nice for david i guess!

i think the main reason i want a big gap is because i would love to go back to college and then uni, and train to become a midwife :thumbup:

but if it doesnt work out the way we'd like it to then im not really fussed!

xx


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## cleckner04

We are still pretty undecided about how many we want. 3 or 4. We will see how we feel after 2 though. :lol:


----------



## Shiv

Any sign of AF yet Cleck?

We want 2 or 3 i think, will see how we manage with 2 first!


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## cleckner04

Nope no AF. :( I took a quick IC this morning and it's negative so now it's just a waiting game I think. I totally missed ovulation this month than. It must've been that second surge and DH wasn't here that week. I'm thinking we may just NTNP next month and if it happens than fine, but if not than that's fine too because obviously my body isn't quite ready yet. And I really hate stressing about it.


----------



## Kimberly28

Let's see if you ladies have any advice for me. I haven't had a bm in 5 days now. :wacko: I'm surprisingly not in pain or anything but this is the longest I've been without a bm and I don't want to end up blocked up. I cant afford to go buy anything until Friday (we overshot our budget with this last paycheck). I have a can of peaches, I guess I can try to eat those. They certainly keep Bry going haha. The last time I was this constipated was when I was preg with Bry. However I don't really feel preg. I mean other than feeling blah and really tired right now even though I've had a few other symptoms here and there including a headache last night. But I dunno. :shrug: Ok, I admit, this is starting to bother me. It's too early to test though. Argh! I'm not even looking forward to testing! Geez..I guess I will just have to wait a couple more days. Hopefully my bowel will empty for me tonight. Anyhoo, I'll quit rambling now. :blush:


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## cleckner04

Water!! Drink tons of water. It should get things moving. :thumbup:


----------



## Kimberly28

I bet you all are thinking, holy crap, she must be pregnant! :haha: However until proven otherwise, I officially am in denial haha. :haha:


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## cleckner04

Yeah you definitely seem pregnant but unfortunately these symptoms can be misleading as I've come to learn over the years. :haha: What does your DH think?


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## Kimberly28

I know what you mean Cleck. That's why I'm in denial. My body is notorious for putting out false signs. :dohh: I don't think DH knows either. He just keeps asking if we have a little gumdrop yet. (Yes, that is what he is calling the new little one to be even if it doesn't exist yet haha.)


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## Kimberly28

Well I just managed to have a bm finally. It wasn't a lot but at least it's something. :thumbup: I might have some senekot downstairs in my medicine cabinet. If I do, I will take one of those and try to have another bm tomorrow. Anyhoo, that's about it for now. I'm just trying to not go :loopy: between now and Saturday. Even though tomorrow morning's bbt will be a lot more telling as to if I still have a chance or not. We will see. I think hubby doesn't dare say or think that I might be as he's afraid of jinxing it haha. Bless him. Well, I better get off here and feed Bry some dinner. Since I already fed me. Not like me to be ready to eat dinner at 5:30pm but I was and I did haha. :haha:


----------



## cleckner04

Glad your poo situation is solving itself! :thumbup: Well only 3 more days for you to TEST!!!!!!! 

Still no AF here. :wacko: I was so proud of my exact cycles and now it turns out...I'm not so regular! :haha:


----------



## Kimberly28

Uggh! All of this is starting to make me nervous and slightly obsessive. Dammit, and I was so relaxed and easy going about it all until now. :dohh: I'm dreading testing. :wacko: What on earth have I gotten myself into haha. :haha:


----------



## cleckner04

Well how many DPO are you today?


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## cleckner04

Do you have any internet cheapies laying around?


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## Kimberly28

I'm 8 dpo and no, no IC's. I don't even know where to find them and I hate Ebay! Haha.


----------



## cleckner04

Oh! Amazon sells them too. :D I got my BFP with Emma at 9 DPO, that's why I'm asking.


----------



## Kimberly28

Ahh!! ok!! great idea! How accurate are they tho? Any idea?


----------



## cleckner04

No clue really. The 9 DPO test that was positive with Emma was an IC. I like having the IC so than I don't feel guilty for wasting them and than if I get a positive I just get a more expensive brand to make sure.


----------



## Boothh

i want a gum drop now lol


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## cleckner04

^^ :rofl:


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## Kimberly28

:dohh: Me and my big mouth! LOL! 

Cleck, I wish I had $5 extra right now so I could order those ic's. Oh well. We get paid on Friday and I'm testing with my one and only FRER on Sat morning. DH already knows that he better get ready to buy me a new box of tests haha. I just kinda wish I had those IC's though. Oh well. Cest la vie'. I'll have to be patient, not that I look forward to testing (I'm scared of the bfn haha).


----------



## cleckner04

Well hopefully you won't even need them!! :winkwink:


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## Kimberly28

lol hopefully. We shall see. 

I just put cranky crab apple to bed. He's still complaining at the moment. I'm hoping he will settle down soon though and get to sleep since it's 8pm now. He's been quite cranky this evening and I'm not sure why. I hope he isn't getting sick or something. :wacko:


----------



## cleckner04

It seems like Emma gets crankier with age. I swear she used to be such an angel. She still is most days but when the days are bad, they are REAL bad. :roll:


----------



## Kimberly28

Yeah, it seems that Bryson has a few of those as well. Maybe it's because they really want or need to be able to communicate something with us but all they know is to cry but we don't always seem to understand what it is that they need or what is wrong and that frustrates them further and thus they cry more. :shrug: Just a guess. I wish I knew more sign language and how to teach it to Bryson. I'm sure it would really help him.


----------



## cleckner04

Emma only knows how to say dog with sign language. :haha: When Emma grumps I usually just give her food. :rofl: She is always so happy to walk around with an apple or yogurt. Although lately she wants the yogurt and when I try to give her the apple she gets mad at me. :dohh: I'm scared that I'm setting her up for bad habits later.


----------



## spidey

I'm thinking of having 2 or 3 kids, but if I can only have this one I'll be happy too. I tease DH that I'm going to have septuplets next- all those reality shows on tv about 5 or 6 kids at once scare him :haha:


----------



## cleckner04

Oh my goodness even 2 at once would be horrible I think. :haha: I just can't picture it. Anyone else following Jessa on here? She just had triplets. :shock: There is just no way in hell. :rofl:


----------



## Kimberly28

LOL Spidey! 

Cleck, you probably are but then again this is the only time and age when kids can really get away with walking around with snacks in the fist. ;)


Umm...this is not good. I'm craving chocolate cream pie. :dohh: I cant believe I'm hungry again. :wacko: I was standing there looking in the kitchen pantry a few mins ago and hubby comes up behind me and says he's hungry too is craving sweets. LOL! Then he looks at me while I'm at the counter making cookies and cream flavored pudding and he says "You gotta be pregnant! There is no other excuse for me to be this hungry and craving something sweet too!" I looked at him and I laughed. I said nah, it's probably your own wishful thinking so it's all in your head hehe and besides that, as I told the girls on bnb, I'm in denial until proven otherwise." :haha: 
The thing is that he had sympathy crap going on with me too when I was pregnant with Bryson. When I was hungry he was hungry, when I felt sick, he'd feel slightly ill too, when I had a pain, suddenly he would too! LOL!! :rofl: I remember I used to tell him to grow a pair and quit trying to carry the baby for me! LOL!! He'd just laugh and tell me that he'd prefer that I keep the baby in MY belly and not his! LOL!!! (All in jest, I assure you!) :lol:


----------



## Kimberly28

My temp is back up this morning to the same point as day before yesterday which is 98.04 (F). Yesterday it dipped slightly to 97.90 but today it's back up at 98.04. So I guess we will see what tomorrow brings. :shrug:

I hope everyone is doing well today and to those of you whose cycles have begun anew lots of :dust: for you and hopefully for me too since I'm still waiting to see haha. Soon as my oldest is off to school, I'm going back to bed for a little while. I'm too tired to stay up. For now though, I hope you all have a lovely day. :flower:


----------



## cleckner04

:happydance: Temp spike is good! Fingers tightly X'ed for you!! :dust:


----------



## Boothh

cleck when i try give jesse something he doesnt want he says 'not that!' to me and i have to keep trying til we get something he likes lol, today he keeps coming up to me and saying 'chocolate?' with a big grin on his face lol so i gave him a box of raisins and kept saying it was chocolate LOL :rofl: is that cruel?


----------



## cleckner04

:rofl: Emma loves raisins! Emma just whines if I give her something she doesn't want or she throws it. :dohh: She's quite aggressive. She will throw little mini tantrums while walking towards the refrigerator. :rofl: And she reaches up trying to open it so I always know she wants food. Lately I've been putting grapes on the bottom shelf and she loves munching on them.


----------



## Kimberly28

LOL! Jesse and Emma are so cute! What funny little toddlers! :) Bry simply screams at me and then stops to look at me and see if it worked haha. Right now he is reaching for the Cheerios box and trying to abscond with it lol!


----------



## cleckner04

Still no AF here...I wish it'd just start already!!! I have the inlaws here all weekend. So that is when she'll hit. :wacko:


----------



## Kimberly28

Awww I'm sorry Cleck! :hugs: I hope she comes for you soon! Perhaps you ovulated later than you think thus a longer time until AF arrives than originally expected?


----------



## cleckner04

Yeah. I guess I must've really ovulated on that second surge. Which on one hand is a relief that my period is later because I was starting to worry that I had some kind of luteal phase defect. It's probably my fault my cycle is messed up this month. I took vitamin B6 from the advice of someone on here this month. I don't think I'll do it again.


----------



## Kimberly28

Awww.. that's ok. :hugs: Just take prenatals which have the right amount of each vitamin in them including folic acid. This cycle I've been taking EPO (helps with fertile cm amounts) and baby aspirin from cd 1 until OV (and of course prenatals). After OV I've taken only a few baby aspirin here and there. I don't wanna thin my uterine lining too much as I'm sensitive to aspirin but I wanted to help a bean implant so that's how I handled it. We'll see if it works. :shrug:


----------



## spidey

Kimberly- my DH had sympathy pregnancy symptoms with me too. Sometimes it would really irritate me because I was the one having the real symptoms! He also gained alot of weight with me but the poor guy is still struggling to lose it. I can't wait till this weekend when you test :happydance:

Cleckner- I guess the good news about your late AF is that you have a good length between ovulation and AF. I might be wrong though- I'm learning it all by reading this thread :haha: 

So I've been paying extra attention to my womanly secretions (thanks girls, LOL) and today there was alot of what I'd call ewcm. So... does that mean I'm ovulating today? If so, if I :sex: today, could those spermies make it to the egg in time or is it too late?

Boothh- I love it how Jesse is already talking!


----------



## cleckner04

Get to :sex: spidey!! I think you'd still have plenty of time for those spermies to catch. :D


----------



## Shiv

Go get him Spidey!

Cleck, I know exactly how you feel, I had a weird freak long cycle last cycle. I am taking it as a positive sign that my body is actually getting back to normal. i figure if your body isn't ovulating because of breastfeeding then your cycle is not determined on ovulation or hormones (as much) and is therefore a bit false (if you get what I mean, almost like being on the pill), so with longer cycles I reckon it means that the hormones are kicking in and ovulation is happening. They might not be as regular to start with but i think it is a good sign that your body is getting back to normal and not just going through the motions. Did any of that make any sense?!?!?:dohh:

Kim, only a a couple more days til testing, i am very excited :happydance:


----------



## cleckner04

Yeah I getcha!! I also think it means I'm not quite ready yet to be pregnant again though. It seems like my bodies way of saying NOT YET!!!!


----------



## cleckner04

AF IS HERE!!!!! :happydance: :rofl: Who knew I'd be this excited to see her ugly face. :lol:


----------



## Shiv

HAHAHAHA - so how long did that make your cycle?


----------



## cleckner04

I'll check in a sec. I want to count my luteal phase too so I'll have to look back and see when I took those tests.


----------



## cleckner04

Okay. My cycle was 33 days and my luteal phase was still only about 8 days so it's still too short. :dohh: I'm definitely not ready yet than. That sucks. :(


----------



## Shiv

hon, i wouldn't worry, just enjoy having Corey home next month, and see what happens, damn those ov stick things, i am defo not gonna use them!


----------



## cleckner04

I know it! I don't think I'll ever use them again. It isn't worth the upset. I have no clue when I ovulated while trying for Emma. We just DTD every other day and it worked. This next month I'm just going to do that. We'll just DTD every other day and hope for the best. :haha: I'm not cut out for the hardcore TTC. Honestly I can barely even read in the TTC section because I start panicking a bit and have no clue what they are talking about. They are all wound so tight.


----------



## joeyjo

We said we'd give it 6 cycles once my AF restarted before we looked into more intense TTC methods - I've had 3 of those cycles but to be fair the first 2 we did next to no :sex: at mid cycle point. AF is taking her leave so gonna aim for every othe day at least for next few weeks (DH will be pleasantly surprised if I actually manage it - I'm a weekend girl nowadays :rofl: )


----------



## cleckner04

:haha: We struggle with every other day sometimes. Emma just senses when we want to get it on and she becomes a nightmare. Some people have gaydars? She has sexdar...:rofl:


----------



## Kimberly28

LOL Thanks ladies! I think you all are more excited about it than I am. :haha: You see how badly I dread the bfn. :dohh: 

Cleck, I'm glad she finally arrived. I'm just sorry that you had such a rough cycle. :( Another friend of mine is still bf'ing too and she got pregnant when her LO started easing back a bit on the feedings which allowed her hormones to ramp up enough for her to start ov'ing again. Maybe that's what you need to do. Still bf but not all the time. If you're not already maybe keep the feedings to twice a day or something so that your hormones can also start ramping up more to start ov'ing. I know that bf'ing can cause you to not ovulate. Hopefully you will have more luck next cycle and will get your bfp!

I think that the reason I don't go into TTC boards is that it's just too stressful and I'm a bad enough worry wart as it is. :blush: Being around those other hardcore gals makes me worry more. I think the reason that I've been so calm during this 2ww is that I haven't exposed myself to all of that this time. I've still been checking BBT, CM, CP, OPK, etc. but I've not been fretful over it which has been nice. I think it's because I've been in here with you all who I know and am familiar with so it's been much more comfortable and relaxed. Who knows, maybe that helped me conceive? (IF I have that is, which I doubt.) I guess we will see on Saturday morning. :shrug: I'm still in denial though and I doubt that I'm actually preggers. I think my body is just trying to screw with me, as usual. 
Well I'm gonna get going here and try to find something to eat. I'm hungry (again) and the meat for dinner isn't done thawing out yet. Tah tah for now! :flower:


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## cleckner04

Kimberly- Yeah I think your totally right. I think the BFing has a lot to do with it. Emma still feeds SO much. Seriously she BFs just as much now as she did at 6 months. :wacko: She just won't cut down for some reason. And she gets SO angry if I turn her down. :dohh: If I don't get pregnant next month than there will be 7 more months for my cycle to get right while DH is gone and hopefully by that point Emma wouldn't be feeding quite as often.


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## Shiv

I don't go in the TTC section, it is far too intense and I don't understand half of what is said anyway.

Kim what is CP?

Cleck, every other day? what all month? i think I would struggle with every other day for the middle week! I am so lame, have zero sex drive, poor hubby! Good job I bake good cakes otherwise I would probably be dumped :haha:


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## joeyjo

G cut down his BF loads - I didn't even get AF back till he was over 11months and he'd been down to morning & eve BFs for over 2 months then. He dropped the morning feed about a month ago and this week has only wanted 1 side at bedtime :cry: I actually tried to put him down without tonight as he seemed uninterested but I think once he twigged it was bedtime he wanted it!


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## cleckner04

:rofl: Yeah when we tried for Emma it was every other day all month. Sometimes more. And this last month while he was home it was every other day. It is fun most of the time but sometimes it can be kind of tedious because it's just like a timed thing that we just know we have to do it. And some days we are both so exhausted at the end of the day. I usually wake DH up in the middle of the night and it puts some excitement back into it. I have always had a pretty high sex drive. Honestly if we didn't do it enough, I have to do it myself. :blush:


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## Shiv

aw JoeyJo, it is hard when they seem disinterested. for one reason or another Sophia self-weaned a couple of weeks ago. it is really sad but I guess it is easier that way then having to wean them when they aren't happy to wean. I would have hated to have to say no in order to wean.


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## cleckner04

joeyjo said:


> G cut down his BF loads - I didn't even get AF back till he was over 11months and he'd been down to morning & eve BFs for over 2 months then. He dropped the morning feed about a month ago and this week has only wanted 1 side at bedtime :cry: I actually tried to put him down without tonight as he seemed uninterested but I think once he twigged it was bedtime he wanted it!

I think I'll be sad when Emma cuts down like that. At this point it feels like she never will though. She seriously feeds at LEAST 10x a day still. :dohh: She will have a quick snack and than run off. And I'm awful about distractions so I just give in and feed her. :blush: Some days it is seriously exhausting. Yesterday I just wanted to stop BFing altogether because she wanted me all day it seemed like. And now that she has teeth it hurts after a while.


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## cleckner04

Shiv said:


> aw JoeyJo, it is hard when they seem disinterested. for one reason or another Sophia self-weaned a couple of weeks ago. it is really sad but I guess it is easier that way then having to wean them when they aren't happy to wean. I would have hated to have to say no in order to wean.

I'm really worried about this. I'm already picturing how hard it will be to get her to stop. :( I'm fine with going to 2 years. It's my goal to get there. But after that I will probably want to start thinking about stopping and I have no clue how to even go about it and I don't want to force her. Everyone seems so happy and proud when their baby self weans but Emma doesn't even seem close.


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## Kimberly28

Shiv said:


> Kim what is CP?


CP = cervix position (high, medium, low/Soft, Firm, Medium) It's just another sign to help confirm that it's time for OV or it's getting close or that you've already ov'd. I just don't obsess over it like I used to. :haha:


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## cleckner04

I wouldn't even know what I was feeling with CP. I don't even know if I can reach. :rofl:


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## Kimberly28

Oh dear! Bry was sitting in the floor with his plastic bowl of crunchies (strawberry flavored puffs) and he went to dump the bowl out onto the floor and I told him no no. Next he does this defiant squeal and looks at me like "so there". I was like ooo boy you did not just backtalk me! Haha! So then he squeals and grins like nahh I'm just being cute. Right now he is being cranky. Ugh! I guess it starts. :dohh:


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## cleckner04

:haha: Awww all our babies are such stinkers. :D It's so hard not to laugh when they are bad. I have trouble trying not to crack a smile.


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## spidey

Cleckner- Kira feeds just as much as Emma. It's ALL day, but just for short periods of time. I have no idea if she'll ever stop :haha: Sometimes I can distract her if I feel a little too much like a dairy cow. I figure that one day she'll need less and less but right now I can't see that happening anytime soon.

I couldn't do every other day... so I envy you girls with the energy and drive! 

Like Cleck, I don't think my cycles are back all the way with all the bf I'm doing. AF is really light with no cramps. I hardly get any noticeable womanly secretions too (LOL, is there a better name for that??) and I have no pms symptoms. I feel like there are no hormones in my body, which is a great thing for my mood but not so great for baby making. So I really have no hope that I'll get pregnant for awhile and if it does happen it'll be a happy surprise.

I have never felt my cervix! I don't know where I would find it up there :haha:


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## Kimberly28

LOL! If near OV time it will feel like lips, soft and kinda mushy. If near AF or post OV it should feel like a nose kinda.


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## cleckner04

:wacko: That just plain sounds weird. :haha:


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## joeyjo

cleckner04 said:


> Shiv said:
> 
> 
> aw JoeyJo, it is hard when they seem disinterested. for one reason or another Sophia self-weaned a couple of weeks ago. it is really sad but I guess it is easier that way then having to wean them when they aren't happy to wean. I would have hated to have to say no in order to wean.
> 
> I'm really worried about this. I'm already picturing how hard it will be to get her to stop. :( I'm fine with going to 2 years. It's my goal to get there. But after that I will probably want to start thinking about stopping and I have no clue how to even go about it and I don't want to force her. Everyone seems so happy and proud when their baby self weans but Emma doesn't even seem close.Click to expand...

G was never really a "snacker" for milk - I was always worried about a foremilk/hindmilk imbalance so tried to really encorage long feeds where he drained at least 1 side; obviously if it was warm or anything & he was thirsty he got more short feeds. 
My friends LO self weaned very abruptly when she was 3 months pregnant - apparently it's common coz the milk changes - she felt super guilty but there Was no need & nothing she could do, LO didn't seem upset at all just didn't want milk.


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## Shiv

Aw Cleck you still have AGES until Emma is 2, a lot can change in that time, she will cut down for sure, just in her own time :hugs:


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## Kimberly28

G'morning ladies. I just wanted to let you all know that I caved this morning and tested with a FRER (first response early result) and it was bfn. :( I'm hoping that maybe it's just too early. Will have to wait and see how it goes I guess. Temp is still up though. :) (knock on wood that it stays up!) Hubby doesn't think that it's over yet and that it's just too early. He's convinced I'm preg. I hope to goodness that he's right. As much as I'd be let down if AF shows, I'm even more worried about him getting let down. :( Not a fun thought. :nope: So the waiting game continues... *sigh*


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## cleckner04

Oh no Kim!! :hugs: You are DEFINITELY not out until AF shows up. :D I still think you are. I'll be amazed if you really aren't pregnant with your long list of symptoms.


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## spidey

joeyjo- I had a foremilk/ hindmilk imbalance too. For the first 6 months I would only feed from one side for 3-4 hours straight so Kira would get the fattier milk. But something changed around 7-8 months and now I don't have much of that watery milk anymore. The only reason I know is I still pump a few times each week at work and the first milk that comes out use to be clear, but now its not. So now I just feed off the side that seems bigger :haha: It's nice not having to watch the clock anymore.

Kim- I'm sorry you didn't get your bfp, but I agree you shouldn't give up hope since its still quite early. :hugs:

Cleckner- I think you said something about teeth and bf. When Kira's top teeth first came in they use to rub on the top of my nipple and it would be quite painful at times and even leave indents. It lasted about 1-2 months but now I don't feel the teeth at all. So I don't know if she adjusted to a mouth with teeth or if I have nipple callouses now, LOL. So I bet in time the teeth issue will go away with you too.


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## cleckner04

Yup. Emma's teeth hurt. Just the top ones but if she sits a certain way while feeding I can just feel them pulling down onto the nipple. :wacko: I've had to learn to readjust the latch and we are slowly getting better at it, but I have my bad days that I think I should just give up. :dohh:


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## spidey

Cleck- don't give up because I was at the same place as you a month ago and now I wouldn't even know Kira has teeth because I never feel them anymore. I even googled and posted about the teeth issue here, but no one really had anything to say besides correct the latch. I found that nursing laying down was the best position for the days when I really felt those sharp little teeth! Now we're back to normal with all the crazy nursing positions including the acrobats that Kira likes to do while she snacks :dohh:


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## Boothh

well we managed to get in some good loving last night haha first night we both passed out we were too drunk haha, ;) how is everyone else?


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## Shiv

Kim, i will be keepingmy fingers crossed that it was just too early to test for you. How is your temp today? have you tested again?


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## Pippin

:hi: ladies, which turned up for me today so once she's gone I'm officially TTC after my erpc! :yipee: going to take it casually so I don't get too hung up on it but looking forward to having a go. Already can tell this witch is gong to be a bad one (hospital warned me it would) so will be wishing the next week away!


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## Kimberly28

Pippin: Hi. Glad to see you back. Yeah, first AF was rough on me too. Not fun and not painless like it usually is but hopefully it wont be too bad. :hugs:

Shiv: Yes, my temp is still up, no I haven't re-tested. IF it is still up tomorrow morning then I will retest. I wanted to wait a couple of days just in case it was too early. However, I am spotting now. Have been for a couple days now which for me can be either implant OR pre AF. For the past 2 cycles now I've had pre AF spotting for a few days so I cant count it for anything. Even though I had implant spotting with Bry. So who the heck knows. :shrug: To be honest I'm feeling quite pessimistic about things this time and suspecting AF is on her way. However if I do get a bfn and AF comes, then at least I can still be trying with all of you and that's a good thing. :thumbup:

Everyone else: Big :hugs: and hoping you're all having a lovely weekend. It's been a busy one for me. I haven't been home. I've had to be on duty at the Air base for the Airshow that's been taking place all weekend. But it's been fun. :)


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## Boothh

Pippin said:


> :hi: ladies, which turned up for me today so once she's gone I'm officially TTC after my erpc! :yipee: going to take it casually so I don't get too hung up on it but looking forward to having a go. Already can tell this witch is gong to be a bad one (hospital warned me it would) so will be wishing the next week away!

hey pip, my AF was pretty horrible after erpc just make sure to take plenty of painkillers and FX it disappears sharpish so you can down to ttc! :hugs: xxxxx

well im on CD12 today! should be OV in roughly two weeks! weve been going for every other day at least so hopefully we will catch if i am earlier anyway xx


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## Boothh

oh and kim FX for when you test! :D


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## Kimberly28

BFN! :( So I think this spotting is AF on her way. It definitely should have been positive by now if I was preg, so I'm pretty sure I'm out. Which is ok. I mean yeah, I'm disappointed but at least I get to try again with all of you! :thumbup:

Boothh: Wow...cd 12 and ur still 2 weeks out from OV? When the heck do u usually ov then? That seems like a very long crazy cycle. :wacko: Poor you!


Meanwhile, I hope you all had a nice weekend. Mine was crazy busy and I somehow pulled something in my right back. Yesterday morning it was seizing up so badly I could barely move or breathe. Very scary and not fun. After some medicine and massaging from hubby to try to make the muscles relax it finally got better. Still in a bit of pain this morning but not nearly as bad as yesterday morning. Since Bry is in bed, I am going to go lay down on my heating pad which helps. I even slept on it last night so I would be able to get up and get hubby off to work and Zach onto his bus. 
Anyhoo, you all have a lovely day and I'll check back later. :flower:


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## Boothh

sorry to hear about your back kim :hugs: i have back trouble and its the worst thing in the world! 

i OV anytime from CD20 onwards it was around CD24-25 for a while but the last few cycles its been at least CD30 :/ my cycles are quite irregular and long, but last 2cycles have been 48days each!! x


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## cleckner04

Well AF seems to be about finished. I am definitely going to skip the OPKs this month and DH and I will just DTD when we feel like it and not put any pressure on it. I'm starting to look more forward to losing weight than being pregnant again anyways. I know I want to be pregnant again but at the same time, I want to be thin again. :rofl: Well, MY thin. Which isn't all that thin compared to UK standards. :blush::lol: So we will see what this next cycle brings and if nothing happens I won't be TOO heartbroken. (at least I hope not)


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## Kimberly28

Hi Everyone. Hope you're all having a nice day. Well my temp is on it's way back down and I'm still spotting so I'm waiting for AF to arrive in full which SHOULD be tonight (I hope). I just want her to get here and get gone again so I can try again. 
However, I have to be in court on Nov. 2nd for a minor fender bender and I'm due to OV on Nov.3rd. So now I'm afraid that stress from that might offset OV and cause yet ANOTHER late OV and once again missing the egg. :dohh: I REALLY wanna catch it this time and get preggie so that our baby will be a Leo. Bry technically is a Virgo but because he was born in August, I still got to be part of our wonderful little group. :flower: 

It would be nice for this next baby to be a Leo and be born in mid to late July/early August as no one in my family has a July birthday so that would be perfect and it wouldn't overlap with Bry's birthday. :thumbup: So I feel like I MUST succeed this next time. The pressure is on, so to speak. :wacko: I refuse to TTC during January because that would put the baby's due date in October and right in the range of being a libra. I'm an aries and libra is my polar opposite which is what my "mother" is and is part of why we do not get along and I definitely don't want the same kind of relationship occurring with my daughter because of that too. So we gotta time this just right. I know it sounds insane and a little nuts and yes I've thought this out WAY too much. :blush: 

Anyhoo!!

Cleck, I'm glad AF is heading out now for you so that you can try again. I hope you and hubby succeed this time around too and before he deploys again. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you!

Boothh: Have you been to the doctor about your cycles? That sounds a bit excessive and they might need to run some tests on you to determine the cause. They also might be able to shorten your cycles to a more normal range with treatment which could also help you succeed in getting pregnant. 

Pippin: I hope AF won't be too harsh on you. I know you've been through enough already. :hugs:

I hope you all have a lovely day today. I better go stop bry from damaging our tv screen by banging his empty formula can against it. :dohh:

PS - Ignore my ticker, my cycle is longer this time than 28 days due to late ov. Blah! I'll fix it soon as AF arrives.


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## cleckner04

:hugs: Kimberly. I was so sure this was your month. Symptom spotting is a bitch sometimes when so many PMS symptoms are the same as pregnancy symptoms. :(

Pippin- I'm glad to see you in here! :wave: I remember that first period after my D&C. It was horrendous. I hope your cycles get right back on track for you and this first period doesn't last too long. :hugs:


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## Kimberly28

You and me both Cleck. It figures that my stupid body would throw fake signs at me. This is why I try to ignore them for the most part. :dohh:


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## Pippin

Thanks ladies, AF is heavy but no pain thankfully. I had al sorts of pills at the ready but I don't need them. Looks like Sam has chicken pox so very bad night last night so off to the doctors we went (their request I phoned before) so hoping for a better one tonight. Annnyyhooo not sure whether to use opks this month, I know I'm a POAS addict so I better get some more in so I can use myself as a human experiment again. Still going to keep it casual though. x


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## Pippin

cleckner04 said:


> :hugs: Kimberly. I was so sure this was your month. Symptom spotting is a bitch sometimes when so many PMS symptoms are the same as pregnancy symptoms. :(
> 
> Pippin- I'm glad to see you in here! :wave: I remember that first period after my D&C. It was horrendous. I hope your cycles get right back on track for you and this first period doesn't last too long. :hugs:

I hate it when that happens, every symptom under the sun and then nothing, still you never know, maybe skip taking your temp till she arrives (easier said than done though huh). xxx


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## spidey

Kimberly- I'm sorry this wasn't your month :hugs: 

Boothh- before Kira I had really long cycles like you... it makes TTC a real bitch though! 

Pippin- poor Sam :cry: He must be so miserable and itchy.

Cleckner- it sounds like a good plan to not actively TTC this month! I bet since you declared you'd rather focus on losing weight while DH is gone you'll end up pregnant, LOL.

So IF I ovulated last week I guess I'm having my official 2ww! I might actually have to do a pregnancy test if I'm more than 4 days late on AF since I have an x-ray scheduled for early November. It goes against my whole idea of not testing until I'm atleast 2 weeks late, but just this once I'll have to break my rule. But I know I'm not pregnant since I feel so unfertile right now.


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## Shiv

Kim, sorry it wasn't your month, but good luck this month!

Pip - glad that AF is not as bad as you were expecting. hope that little Sam has a better night and gets well soon

Cleck - just enjoy Corey and see what happens!

Spidey, so looks like you could be the next tester, I had forgotten how exciting it is to test!

Boothh, your long cycles don't seem to stop you and Stuart being the most fertile couple in the world - I bet you have a Disney baby!

As for us, well I am due on on Monday and then we officailly start TTC. I am assuiming I won't have a long cycle this time as I had tons of EWCM around day 15 so that would mean approx 30 day cycle which is back to normal!


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## Boothh

oo jesse is getting right on my last nerve today! his back teeth are coming in which makes him the biggest whiner EVER! i had a splitting headache and im just not in the mood and he will NOT go to sleep :dohh: :(

i hope we do have a disney baby then we can call her minnie haha :haha:


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## Kimberly28

I need you ladies thoughts please if I may. Today is 12 dpo and cd30. Still spotting. Now, I know I said my temp is on it's way back down or at least I think it is. The thing is that it's still in the high end of the temp range. It's still not near pre-OV temps. Pre-OV temps were 96.8 to 97.2 (F) at the highest. My post ov temps have been 97.7 and up to almost 98.1 (F). Temp this morning was 97.6. So while slightly lower, not that much. Normally I'd be starting my period right now. I went to the bathroom (sorry TMI) and after I wiped I used a little bit more tissue and probed inside and it came out brown stuff. No dark red in sight. I should be getting hit with full on AF right now. I don't get it! I'm hoping maybe she arrives tomorrow but I just took my temp as usually during AF and pre-ov even in the evenings it stays in the same lower range even if in the higher end of that lower range and tonight it's 98.48. Now, I don't wanna get anyone excited or anything because I seriously doubt I'm preg but this is starting to get ridiculous. Are there ANY chances that I caught live 5 day old spermies and am having a late implantation which could be why I've had only bfn's so far? I know that implant can happen between 6-12dpo. I know today is 12 dpo but IF an implant took place at 10 dpo then I would get bfn's and no bfp and no AF right? My last test/bfn was 11 dpo. You can tell it's messing with my head. :dohh: I just need something to happen one way or the other! Either bfp or AF. At this point I just wanna get on with it already. :hissy: Hopefully temp will drop more in the morning and AF will start if I'm really not pregnant. If I am preg, I want my dang bfp already! :grr: One thing is for sure, I'm very irritable and cranky and quick tempered and I don't normally get very pms'y right before AF. At least I don't recall feeling this way usually. :haha: Anyhoo I will keep you all posted.


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## cleckner04

I think those spermies can live in there up to 6 days and even than it takes a day or two for them to travel down the tubes and implant themselves. I say you aren't out until full blown AF hits. :hugs:


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## Boothh

aw kim :hugs: it gets so annoying at the end doesnt it! i hate being in limbo every month! xxx


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## Aunty E

Hello! 

I had my scan, and newBaby is still a boy, and still doesn't have a name. Don't know how we're going to agree on one :( As I know a lovely girl who's just had a little girl, but has no money at all, I just sent off most of Imogen's tiny girl things to her. There's some stuff I can't bear to get rid of and some that I will sell and some that I want to give to close friends when they have girls, but it did make me quite sniffley. Need to sell stuff on ebay so I can buy cute boy things. 

I found out that I have a posterior placenta this time. Last time I had a huge anterior placenta, which contributed to Imogen's less than optimal birth positioning. But now, having always thought that Imogen kicked quite a bit, I'm being beaten to death from the inside by new baby. He actually woke me up the night before last, kicking really hard. I guess the anterior placenta actually did shield me quite a bit. Duncan felt him easily from the outside, having not felt Mog until I was a good 24 weeks pregnant. I'm hoping this means I'll have an easier delivery this time.


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## Boothh

AE i had an anterior placenta with jesse and sometimes i couldnt feel him but sometimes wow he managed to wind me! im dreading the next babies kicking cus jesse was very active! dont worry about a name you will come across something you both love soon enough! x


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## Shiv

Hi Aunty E, glad to see you here! Glad all was well with the scan. i had ananterior placenta with Sophia and barely felt any kicks so got a bit worried with the kick counting so I guess a posterior placenta would be good next time!

Oh and Kim, try not to stress, I know it is hard but maybe try to wait and see what happens over the next few days :hugs:


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## Kimberly28

AE: Don't worry, you will think of a name I'm sure. Start going through baby boy name lists and see what appeals to you.

Boothh, Cleck, and Shiv: Thanks for the kind comments. :hugs:

I'm even more frustrated today. Temp went back up and still no AF. :dohh: I guess if it's still up tomorrow I will retest and see if it was late implantation. The other thing is that I was reading online last night that late implantations that take place at 11 and 12 dpo have a much higher chance and rate of mc than those that implant on 8-10 dpo. :wacko: So now I'm worrying of course. I swear I'll never learn to not go googling crap. :dohh: So terrible. :nope: 

This morning I'm ridiculously sleepy and had a bout of diarrhea last night (not fun). So this morning I feel really blah and tired. I've also got canker sores on my lower lip from the sunburn I got on them this past weekend from being out at the airshow all weekend. Ugh! So that's not any fun either. :( They hurt and I'm using the best stuff on them and hoping they heal and go away quickly. This has not been my week so far. :nope:


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## ashnbump

i also had an anterior placenta, and it did cushion a lot of the kicks, although i still got the hell beaten out of me! I think id like a posterior placenta next time!

right just wondering, im using the last of my opk's (not buying anymore after these have gone!) and im testing 3 times a day, to try catch the surge! ive started getting faint lines now, and i konw that the test line needs to be stronger than the control line, but now im starting to get faint lines does this mean ovulation is around the corner?

im supposed to ov around the 22nd CD16, and im on CD14 now, so are the lines on the ov kits a good thing?

we've been DTD every other day at least, to try catch the eggy this month, but im convinced that next month will be the one for us! Kara was also conceived november, so that would be nice! 

how is everyone else getting on?
xx


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## Boothh

im on CD14 still a while to OV yet for me but were dtd every other day at least now! im not going to test til after im back from disneyland though, think it will be CD45 the day we get back and the last 2 cycles have been 48days long so im definatly going to wait til were back to test! seems like aaaages yet!


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## Aunty E

Still no AF at CD3? What what? How frustrating :dohh: I got a slightly later BFP with this one, and it took longer than expected for the Clearblue digi conception indicator to go up with this one, and it's all fine. I made myself cry for hours reading threads about 2-3 readings not going up to 3+ and then pregnancies ending, and it was all fine in the end. If you get your BFP this time it's just as likely to stick as if you got it early.

Long cycles must make it really frustrating too Boothh, I've been lucky with 28 day cycles mostly, the thought of waiting an extra 20 days to test is awful!


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## Shiv

Kim a) I had terrible diarreah the day I got a BFP with Sophia
and b) STOP GOOGLING :haha:

Ash - I have no idea about OPK's I'm afraid,it sounds like you are building up to ovulation though1


What a lot of baby dancing going on! lucky men, not much going on here, I am saving myself for around ovulation (unlucky David!):haha:


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## Kimberly28

LOL!! Thanks Shiv. I'll try. :winkwink: Who knows...maybe I have a bfp coming my way afterall. :shrug: I guess what will be, will be.


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## spidey

I too had an anterior placenta, LOL. I didn't feel proper kicks with Kira for a long time. At some point she could give me huge kicks off to my right side though :haha: 

AE- you still have time to think of a name. If you pick one too early you might start wanting to change your mind and then it'll get really difficult!

Kimberly- I agree with Shiv- stop googling!!!


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## Boothh

Aunty E said:


> Still no AF at CD3? What what? How frustrating :dohh: I got a slightly later BFP with this one, and it took longer than expected for the Clearblue digi conception indicator to go up with this one, and it's all fine. I made myself cry for hours reading threads about 2-3 readings not going up to 3+ and then pregnancies ending, and it was all fine in the end. If you get your BFP this time it's just as likely to stick as if you got it early.
> 
> Long cycles must make it really frustrating too Boothh, I've been lucky with 28 day cycles mostly, the thought of waiting an extra 20 days to test is awful!

this site can be a bitch for stuff like that! with that bfp i got the same time you did i never even got a positive digi so i knew something was wrong straight away! 

long cycles are annoying when ttc but iv had them ever since my periods started and to be fair it does make up for it when your not ttc and you only get a period every 2months :haha:


----------



## cleckner04

So much chatter in here today! I have absolutely nothing to say about it either. :rofl: 

I hate google but can't stop myself from googling either. 

Emma kicked the crap out of me when I was pregnant. My placenta was on the side I don't know what that is called. :shrug: But it was my ribs that hurt the worst because she would shove her butt out. I look at her now and I picture being pregnant with her and it is so weird to think THAT was in THERE. :haha: 



AF is gone for me and DH get's home tonight and will be on vacation starting on saturday until nov. 8 so that will be awesome. :thumbup: We will make sure we get enough :sex: in while he's home. :haha:


----------



## Kimberly28

I know exactly what you mean Cleck. It's just too easy to google isn't it?! :blush: I also do the same thing with Bry. I look at him and think wow...he was in HERE! :wacko: :haha: I cant even picture that now! Nor do I want to I don't think hehe! 
You go girl Cleck, you get you some lovin! ;) I cant BD right now even though I want to because I'm still spotting. 

There is nothing on the pad, and barely any when I wipe and what little there is is mostly brown. Thing is that it's been going on for almost a week now! I know I spotted through most of first tri with Bry but still. I hope to goodness that something isn't wrong. This is driving me insane! I HATE limbo land!!! :hissy: :brat:


----------



## cleckner04

Brown blood is a good thing! It isn't bright red at all?


----------



## Kimberly28

Nope. I've seen a little tiny bit of pale light tinted color with it at times but it's mostly brown. 

By the way, I forgot to tell you all what I saw on Sunday while at the airshow. There was this skinny pregnant girl walking along the flight line of the airbase where I was and where all the displays were and stuff and she was smoking a cigarette!! Two things wrong with this picture! One, she was pregnant and smoking, 2, those planes are not fueled with ordinary gasoline! They use the most highly flammable of fuels! I was like my g-d, does she have a death wish for her and her unborn child? And should I maybe offer her a beer while she's at it?? :dohh: I seriously felt like getting up and slapping the crap out of her! I wanted to chew her out something terrible! Luckily someone else told her to put her cigarette out and got a dirty look for it but oh damn well. I couldn't do much about it other than tell her to put her cig out because I was in uniform and on duty. We couldn't let her own stupidity cause something really bad to happen. Some people I swear! She has no idea what the ramifications are of the stupid actions of which she was taking! Not only that, but she doesn't deserve that baby in her belly. She clearly doesn't love it or she wouldn't of been smoking! Man I am still outraged over this :trouble:, cant you tell? :blush: I HATE seeing that kind of thing happen when there are so many women who would about kill to be in her place and would appreciate that baby 100 times more than she does obviously!


----------



## cleckner04

Aww. That makes me mad too. I saw a pregnant woman with a drink in her hand one day. :shock: That makes me crazy. I also have a friend from highschool on FB and she was pregnant and was posting pictures of her pregnant self at the bar drinking. :dohh: The pregnancy was accidental but that doesn't mean that baby deserves any less than the best!


----------



## Kimberly28

I totally agree! I was madder than a wet hen! She just better be glad that I was in uniform and on duty or I would have chewed her out big time! :trouble:


----------



## Shiv

So I didn't smoke or drink during pregnancy - BUT over here it is recommended that you stick to less than 2 units a weeks, so it is quite "commom" for people to have the odd glass of wine here whilst pregnant. i think as long as they stick to the guidelines then it is none of my business. I never drank becasue quite frankly if I had one then I would want another so what was the point (and also because I personally didn't want to risk it) but I do think it is up to the individual to assess that risk (within the guidelines). somking is a whole other ball game, but I have never smoked so I have no idea how hard it must be to give up!


----------



## ashnbump

i didnt drink when i was pregnant either, not even a sip! I remember we were having a bbq at my mum n dads and my mum made herself a bacardi and coke, and me a plain coke, so she passes me the wrong one and i take a huge gulp and i was like "muuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuummmmmmmmmmmmm!!!!!!!!!!!!!" haha i was so over protective when i was pregnant :wacko: realistically a bit wont hurt, like the government says less than 2 units per week, i think its targeted at special occasions etc, like a glass of champagne at a wedding/birthday, although i myself would just stay t-total!

as for smoking i really dont like it when people smoke pregnant, and you see it all to often these days!

so this week is our fertile week :thumbup: and ov day should be saturday! so more sexy time for david this week lol, gonna trt dtd everyday until monday at least just incase of late OV, i want that eggy this month lol!xxx


----------



## Boothh

cleckner04 said:


> Aww. That makes me mad too. I saw a pregnant woman with a drink in her hand one day. :shock: That makes me crazy. I also have a friend from highschool on FB and she was pregnant and was posting pictures of her pregnant self at the bar drinking. :dohh: The pregnancy was accidental but that doesn't mean that baby deserves any less than the best!

i had the odd glass of wine or half a pint when i was pregnant with jesse, probably about 4times throughout the whole pregnancy, its actually been proven that one drink occasionally doesnt do any harm. :shrug:


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## Boothh

and id also like to add that when i found out i was pregnant with jesse i didnt smoke another cigarette til after he was born, and i used to smoke well over 20 a day, so im very proud of myself for that, i hate people that make excuses about smoking, SIL was still smoking all through 1st tri and i just wanted to punch her everytime i saw her.


----------



## Kimberly28

I have no problems with the occasional glass of wine during pregnancy, it was the fact that this chick was smoking while pregnant and while on a flight line around planes full of jet fuel which is the most highly flammable fuel there is!!! The combination of those two things is what really pissed me off! And you should of seen the look she had on her face when told to put her cig out. You can tell she wasn't even trying to quit. It was more like she didn't give a damn at all. Like I said before, she better be glad that I was in uniform and on duty or I would have given her all kinds of hell.

Anyhoo, BFN with FMU and then used the restroom a few mins ago and AF has FINALLY arrived!!! THANK G-D!!! I am so relieved to see her lol. Not because I don't wanna be preggers, but because I knew I wasn't and I was hating being stuck in limbo! My temp seemed to be on the way down this morning (from 97.90 to 97.58) so let's hope it drops further down as it's still a little on the high end and I'd prefer a clear low pre-ov bbt to a higher one because then it's easier to tell OV and post OV apart from pre OV. 

Well I'm gonna go lay down now since Bry is in bed and get on the heating pad. It seems that last night I slept on my neck wrong and my left upper back/lower neck are hurting a good bit. :( I'll check back with you all later. :flower:


----------



## ashnbump

i dont think the odd glass will hurt either boothh, and you should be proud of you going from 20 cigarettes to non is a HUGE accomplishment - well done!

glad your not in limbo anymore Kim, shame the eggy didnt catch this month, but theres always the next one!

im excited for testing next month lol, i dont mind if its a bfn again, i kind of like the 'will it wont it will it wont it' haha, im having fun now so when i get pregnant - great, and if it takes a while, oh well!

x


----------



## Boothh

well we were adventurous today and had sex on the couch :rofl: well jess is with my mum so we took the oppertunity haha, still doing good on the every other day :sex: from next weekend i think we will do it every day until i think im deff past OV :shrug: i hate this ttc business i dont want to be disapointed when it gets to testing time cus weve really tried for the first time ever this month, :/


----------



## Kimberly28

Awww I understand Boothh. This was our first month too and I was really hoping we'd get lucky right away but no such luck unfortunately. :nope: However, it is fun trying anyways and it does mean that I can still keep trying with the rest of you which is much more fun than just doing this on my own. :thumbup: So try to look at the bright side of it, even if you don't get preggers right away. :hugs:


----------



## Boothh

im amazed when we try how often we can actually have sex though cus we always say we never get chance but weve managed okay so far,
im really craving dominos pizza so weve just ordered some :haha: im in a bad mood (read my post in lioncubs thread) so just gunna pig out on pizza, then have a really long bath along with a bottle of wine lol


----------



## cleckner04

Pizza sounds amazing right now. Mmmm I think I know what I'm making for lunch. :haha: DH and I still have not managed to :sex: yet this cycle. He was gone and I was on AF for part of it. He's been complaining already about it. :dohh: As if he is SO deprived. :roll:


----------



## Kimberly28

LOL! A bit spoiled I think! :haha: You cant help it if you were on AF. That's not your fault. It's not like you can just make it stop like switching off a light lol. Silly men! :haha: I know how you feel though. 

I'm on cd 2 now. Poor DH has to wait almost 2 weeks before he gets some again. One week before AF I spot so no BD and then one week for AF. So yeah, he's gonna be raring to go by the time AF leaves haha. :haha: Let's hope that maybe all of that horiness :devil: will help us conceive. :winkwink: :rofl:


----------



## ashnbump

Currently doing the usual ten minutes legs in the air after dtd haha! Thought you should all know I'm giving these spermies a good head start lol! Also I'm bored here cos I'm not allowed to get up yet lol!

Boothh we decided to be adventurous in the shower! I think the last time that happened we were away in turkey many years ago lol! 

Will it affect the spermies if we do it twice a day the odd day? The lines are getting darker and darker on my opks once I'm past ov I'll post a pik of them all lined up together, I've been doing 3 a day, mornin noon n night! Xx


----------



## cleckner04

You are going all out ash! :haha: I always do the legs in the air bit too. Makes me feel like a moron but it seems to do the trick. ;)


----------



## ashnbump

I have to try cleck :rofl: David's complaining now, he said his balls (pardon me) are sore and his 'member' is tired now hahaha! Oooppsss! Xxx


----------



## cleckner04

:rofl::rofl: Men complain when they don't get it, and complain when they do. :dohh:

My own Dh just complained because as soon as the little girl I was babysitting got picked up, I stripped down naked except still have undies on. He was like 'your naked already?!' :rofl: I can't help it, I hate clothes.


----------



## spidey

I'm getting a little paranoid now... today I was just about to complain to my mom that my teeth are really sensitive- and they haven't been this sensitive since I found out I was pregnant with Kira. :shock: Sensitive teeth was the biggest and earliest symptom I had with Kira and it started about a week before AF was due. I was almost to the point of seeing the dentist since I was so certain my teeth were all going to fall out or something. For the last 2 days they've been pretty bad and I can't drink anything slightly cold. So now the paranoia is setting in...

Thats funny about the legs in the air thing. I know with Kira I ovulated a little earlier than expected and thats why I got pregnant (we were using protection only during fertile times). The day that she was made, we :sex: and then I jumped into a really hot bath, LOL. So somehow those spermies were able to survive all that.... plus they hung out in there for about 3 days before the eggy came!


----------



## cleckner04

Spidey- :shock: That would be utterly insane if you are the first to be pregnant in our group and you are the one NTNP. :rofl::rofl: When is your AF due?


----------



## Shiv

oh Spidey, when are you due AF? Well you did baby dance just before ovulation, so it is more than possible! eek!


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## spidey

I think that AF will arrive on Thursday, but stupid me writes these things on my work calendar and I can't remember how many days I decided to make my cycle. Before Kira I was anywhere from 36 to 45, but now I've been between 28 and 32... 

Out of the entire month, there was only one day where I had a teeny tiny bit of ewcm, and I did :sex: that day. Unlike all you other girls, we only baby dance about twice a week :blush:


----------



## Shiv

spidey said:


> I think that AF will arrive on Thursday, but stupid me writes these things on my work calendar and I can't remember how many days I decided to make my cycle. Before Kira I was anywhere from 36 to 45, but now I've been between 28 and 32...
> 
> Out of the entire month, there was only one day where I had a teeny tiny bit of ewcm, and I did :sex: that day. Unlike all you other girls, we only baby dance about twice a week :blush:

twice a week - in my DH's dreams - twice a month more like!


----------



## Pippin

Shiv said:


> spidey said:
> 
> 
> I think that AF will arrive on Thursday, but stupid me writes these things on my work calendar and I can't remember how many days I decided to make my cycle. Before Kira I was anywhere from 36 to 45, but now I've been between 28 and 32...
> 
> Out of the entire month, there was only one day where I had a teeny tiny bit of ewcm, and I did :sex: that day. Unlike all you other girls, we only baby dance about twice a week :blush:
> 
> twice a week - in my DH's dreams - twice a month more like!Click to expand...

Ditto Shiv :rofl: I have to pencil it in and give him warning (otherwise he'll nod off on the sofa). :haha:

AF has gone I'm now counting the days I can start the opks. :happydance:


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## Boothh

spidey - when i got pregnant with jesse we dtd then i got straight up and went to the loo and then we went out and walked for miles and stood up all night at a gig, then i didnt O til a day or 2 later according to my dates (which i imagine are exact cus he was born on edd :) )


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## spidey

Boothh- Jesse and Kira are made from super sperm :thumbup:

Its good to know I'm not the only one here who doesn't dtd almost everyday :blush:


----------



## Shiv

Well in theory AF is due around tomorrow (but after last month who knows!) then we are supposedly TTC! BUT i am having a major wobble, Sophia is being SO grumpy that I am wondering if TTC another is a good idea :dohh:


----------



## joeyjo

I'm away at my folks for the weekend; g just went down following a whole 30sec of BF :cry: he is exhausted though & up late! 

I'm mid cycle but DH isn't here :( I think we DTD on Friday night but I was so tired and tipsy it is possible we dropped off prior to completion, I'm not sure :dohh: we were being very soppy and romantic and a bit snuggly...

Anyway hope u r all well :hugs:


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## cleckner04

Shiv- I have those days for sure. In fact lately the idea of another baby makes me feel so nervous. I just don't know. :wacko: But than I see a pregnant woman and get broody all over again. :dohh:


----------



## Boothh

cleck that sounds exactly like me jesse is a terror and i wonder what it would be like to have him aswell as a newborn but even if i get pregnant now its nearly a year away and he will have changed so much so whos to say he wont be a little angel in 9months time!


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## cleckner04

^^ Now that's some positive thinking. :D You are probably right though. But they will be heading towards their "terrible twos" so that scares me a bit. :wacko:


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## Boothh

i think they should change that to 'terrible ones' hahahaha x


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## Shiv

if it's the terrible ones then it has to be the truly terrible twos!


----------



## spidey

haha.. I think they're in the terrible twos now even though they're not 2 yet! I'd like to think that in 9 months our babies will be more into pleasing us and being Mommies helper.


----------



## Boothh

OMG im soooo pissed off. i think all the sex after so long hardly doing it has done some damage, i have a uti and i think iv got friggin thrush :dohh: 
quite impossible to have sex at the moment and i am gunna OV in the next week or so i think so i think im out this month :(


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## Shiv

boothh a week is enough time to get rid of thrush and uti if you get it treated asap - get yourself to teh doctors or at least teh chemists for some canestan, drink lots of cranberry juice too - oh and get Stuart treated for thrush as well as he can keep passing it back to you otherwise :hugs:


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## Boothh

i already have antibiotics so im taking them but i need to go to the chemist tonight and get something for it, im making do with sudocreme at the moment cus its all we have in and its made me abit more comfortable to say the least, :/ 

and thanks i never thought about treating stuart, x


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## joeyjo

I've only had thrush once Boothh & it was the cycle I caught with G - apparently it's quite common to get it as you get preggers so it could be a good omen :)


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## cleckner04

I hope Joeyjo is right and it's just a good omen. :hugs: to you Boothh. Hope it clears up quickly for you.


----------



## Aunty E

I had thrush when I fell with this one too, and it's been a nightmare to get rid if since! Get treating! Newbaby is such a kicker. I was sat in bed last night watching my stomach move round as he kicked - Imogen wasn't visible from the outside this early I'm sure.


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## ashnbump

officially on day three of the 2ww! not gonna get my hopes high this month, i hate setting myself up to be disappointed! anyone else in the 2ww at the moment? anyone getting any symptoms etc? 

boothh boooooooooo to thrush and uti! never know could be an omen as previously said lol!

xxx


----------



## spidey

I had read somewhere that putting plain yogurt up there will help kill the yeast- so one night I was pretty desperate and froze little yogurt cubes and then once they were solid and cold (burrrr!) I did a yogurt treatment. I think it helped although I felt so silly and it was a mess!

AF arrived last night- 32 day cycle!! I'm loving this new AF I have! Normally I would have been up all night on pain killers sitting on the toilet and moaning and rocking back and forth in pain, but not even a tylenol so far and I barely have a cramp! And the lack of pms is great too :thumbup: No super sore boobs or really bitchy feelings. I use to plan anything slightly important for the 3-4 days exactly 1 week after AF started because those would be my "best" days. All the other days of the month I never felt good- either having cramps worse than childbirth or being super pms-y. I hope AF continues to be this good the rest of my life. 

Perhaps next month will be my month!


----------



## Shiv

Well I got AF last night - so that is a 31 day cycle for me (back to normal after long one last cycle).

Cleck can you do me a ticker for the front page? What do you need to know?
cycle length 31 days, first day of AF 26th Oct - anything else?

Good luck with the 2www Ash :hugs:


----------



## Boothh

good luck ash xxx

the yoghurt ice cube thing would have been great yesterday haha, im not even itching now so dunno whether it was thrush or what but now im just sore cus i kept scratching yesterday! :blush: feel sorry for anyone walking past my window to see me with my hands down my pants LMAO :rofl: think were gonna try dtd tonight i could OV anytime now so its kind of important we :sex: as often as possible just dont wanna make things worse! :dohh:


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## cleckner04

Shiv- Updated for you! The only thing else I'd need to know is your luteal phase if you know it, but if not, it's set automatically to 14 days. :thumbup:


Nothing too exciting from me this month. We are just DTD when we feel like it and if something happens good, if not, that's okay too. :D I just don't handle the stress of OPKs very well. :haha: It's my last cycle before DH leaves so I truly don't have high hopes at all. Now I'm more hoping to lose weight. Which might help me with better chances of trying a VBAC later too. Because I'm quite heavy. :blush:


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## Shiv

Thanks Cleck - not sure of my luteal phase, I will keep a better eye on my muccus this cycle and see if I can pin it down!

I don't blame you about the OPK's, if this thread has taught me somethign it is that I don't have the right temperament for charting, temping, opking, it would just stress me out. hats off to thsoe who do because it must make knowing your cycle much easier, but it just isn't for me, at least until we haev been trying for a good 6 months.


----------



## Kimberly28

Somehow my ticker on the first page is wrong. I'm cd 7 today since I had a longer cycle last cycle. It was 31 days long. I'm just waiting for the last little bit of spotting to quit so that DH and I can start TTC again. Fingers crossed for all of us this cycle!! :dust:


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## cleckner04

Oh I never redid the ticker on the front than. Whats your details and I'll fix it. :D


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## Kimberly28

Um... I'm just not sure how many days are gonna be in this cycle. I know that I'm cd 7 today. So I guess a luteal phase of 13 days, a cycle of 30 days with OV either on cd 16 or cd 18. :shrug:


----------



## cleckner04

K. I think I got your ticker right now..:thumbup: Let me know if it's still off and I'll try to fix it again. :haha:


----------



## cleckner04

Also, anyone else that wants a ticker on the first page let me know so we can follow eachothers cycles! :flower:


----------



## spidey

Shiv- we're going to have similar timing of things this month since we both started AF last night.

Cleckner- you can stick a timer for me on the front page. I'm guessing I'm having 32 day cycles and AF came on October 26. I don't know what else you need so let me know :thumbup:

When I told DH today that AF was here he was disappointed. He said that if I don't get pregnant soon he's going to get a vasectomy! Silly man! He really wants another baby. I think he would be happy with as many kids as I could squeeze out between now and menopause, LOL. But he doesn't want them much more than 2 years apart- I told him we could have invitro and have septuplets :haha: or he can just wait and let nature decide their spacing.


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## Shiv

ah bless your OH Spidey, good that he is keen! Oh and i'm excited to have you with the same timings!


----------



## cleckner04

Tickers are updated!! :thumbup: 

DH and I have been BDing every other day. Not on purpose but it has been working out that way. :haha: Nothing really new besides that.


----------



## ashnbump

Can I please request a ticker cleck? Ur a guddn aren't u lol!

LMP: 7th October 2019
CYCLE: 31 days (can vary by a day or two!)
L PHASE: 15 days

Thanks Hun! Xxx



On another note I wanted to ask you girls a HUGE favour would you go into my facebook and vote for kara in the next baby boutique competition, all you have to do us click the link on my profile and then in karas page click vote for me! I'd be so grateful! Xxx


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## Shiv

Don't think I've got you on fb hon?


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## ashnbump

add me if you like! (ashley Louise Irving, Manchester, picture of kara in hello kitty T-Shirt as my profile pic!) Anyone else who has me vote vote voooottttttteeeeee lol! Thanks girls!xxxx


----------



## cleckner04

Front page updated and I voted for Kara on FB! :thumbup:


----------



## Boothh

well CD24 for me and were getting back in the game tonight as i finally feel alright down there haha, which is good because OV is just around the corner now should be sometime this week i think x


----------



## joeyjo

Boothh said:


> well CD24 for me and were getting back in the game tonight as i finally feel alright down there haha, which is good because OV is just around the corner now should be sometime this week i think x

yay - have fun ;)


AFU - beena bit lazy this week but have an early night planned for tonight :)


----------



## Shiv

joeyJo - hope you enjoyed your early night last night!
As for us - well AF is on its way out so i guess this ttc business starts now. Although i have decided if I don't get pregnant this cycle (which i know is unlikely) that I am havibgn Christmas off and then start again in January!


----------



## joeyjo

Well we didn't get our early night but G slept later than us (yes I know even on the day the clocks changed!) so we got an early start instead :blush:

We've put G in his big boy bed for the first time tonight :happydance::cry:
He seemed to go down with less fuss than usual. Since he started refusing BF I've been trying to read him stories but I either get him all relaxed on my lap and then have to transfer him to the cot which upsets him or I read to him in the cot and he keeps struggling to touch me. I sat next to him with him cosied in his bed and it was much easier to lie him down, keep contact for a minute then leave :)


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## Shiv

oh let us know how it goes then joeyjo - I can't imagine Sophia just not getting up out of bed and banging on her door!


----------



## Boothh

aww thats so cute about the big boy bed! jesse is getting a toddler bed for christmas so im hoping it helps him settle better too :) x


----------



## Shiv

so my legs are waxed and i'm ready to go :haha:

I had fogotten how wierd it feels to have unprotected sex! the first time we dtd when trying to conceive Sophia, I freaked out, all i could think of was DH's sperm swimming aorund in me hunting out the egg! Hopefully i won't go quite so weird this time round!

Ash I was nosing at the front page tickers, you are 9dpo any symptoms?


----------



## ashnbump

i dont really know shiv, i dont feel 'pregnant' yet, but have been a little more tired than usual and achey boobies, so who knows? time will tell i guess! I will test if AF is M.I.A and not before lol! I think im going to give it at lest a week from when AF is due!

soooo excited for xmas! going to get most of Karas prezzies on friday, and i cant wait! Ive treated david and i, a bit early, well saying early it wont be delivered until after december 3rd! dah dah dahhhh a brand spanking new apple iMac!!! wooo! My work were offering a special staff discount thing, where you can get PC's & Mac's at low low prices, so i thought why the heck not! I love my Macbook but its getting a bit dog eared now, and i just thought, take up the opportunity! I think i might keep it packed away until xmas day, then it's a bit more exciting lol!xxx


----------



## Boothh

oo im jealous, i cant wait to start spending, its 2weeks til our holiday so gunna wait til we get back to do the serious shopping, 

iv told OH what i want now but iv added some new ghds to the list today too cus mine are seriously retro now iv had em since i was about 16! x


----------



## ashnbump

i have to admit im so excited to start the shopping properly! I can start crossing presents of her list then! she's deffo getting the following -

hello Kitty 6v Battery powered car
pink bounce and spin zebra
laugh and learn chair
laugh and learn shop and learn walker
Dancing timmy time timmy
2 - 3 mini baby borns
Just like home electronic microwave
Megablocks play and go table
megablocks playhouse adventure tub
disney princess kitchen
tomy magical melody maker
tomy pick and pop
little people animal sounds farm
toy story 3 chatter phone
toys r us wooden noah's ark
tomy octopals
cinderella aquadraw
cleaners trolley and hoover
block/drawing easel
new dolly
dolls pram
dolls crib
activity cube
tomy bath washing machine 
mr potato head
stocking fillers
little peoples noahs ark (plastic)
dolly clothing set
cook and play potsy

and hopefully the rest will be clothes and books that everyone else buys her! Im spoiling her this year, it could well be her last on her own though! and we've been saving for a while so that we can go a bit crazy!lol!

TTC related - last time my nipples were SO sore, but ony one is sore at the moment, so im not including that as a symptom until they are both dangerously painful lol!

I hate wondering why its not happening yet, but i guess it will happen eventually!

I wonder who the first one out of us all will be??!
x


----------



## Shiv

Ash - can I be really nosey and ask how much all those pressies are costing? She is a very lucky little lady, she's gonna have a great christmas :happydance:


----------



## joeyjo

Wow Ash what a lucky little girl :)

So far G has a set of toy story car keys & a book. I've asked my folks to get him one of those rugs for cars done like roads & stuff. We won't be spending loads coz our house is quite small & we want to sell it soon ao don't want loads of stuff. We'll probably put money in his account and just get a few things; he'll get loads of other people anyway. We're only just growing into the clothes he got last year :rofl:

As for the big boys bed .... Wow it's been amazing, if it carries on as well as it has done so far then I can honestly say it's the best thing to happen to bedtime ever! He has gone down so easily the last 2 nights - I thought he'd be in & out loads tonight coz he didn't seem that tired but he went straight to sleep! Fingers crossed it continues :)


----------



## Kimberly28

Hi ladies. I'm sorry I've been so quiet lately. I've been kinda busy but I've been reading all of your replies though. I'm sick right now with a cold and a sinus infection. I feel like crap. :( Went to the doctor and he put me on medicine and I'm hoping it helps. Right now, I'm doubting I'm gonna get pregnant this cycle. I can barely breathe much less have sex. :( I need to be bd'ing as I'm due to OV this weekend. :wacko: And as of Thursday, we are supposed to refrain from BD with the Shettles Method to try for our girl. *sigh* This sucks. The sinus pressure is awful. It's had me awake since 2am. You can imagine how blocked up I am and how bad it feels. :(

On a brighter note, Bry got his first hair cut today. He did SO well! He hardly cried at all! :thumbup: I am so proud of him!! :smug: I will try to attach a pic tomorrow to show you all. Finally he looks like a little boy and hopefully people will quit calling him a her haha. 

Well I'm gonna go recline and hope that this decongestant starts working soon. I dunno how long I can handle the sinus pressure. :nope: 
Hope you're all having a nice Monday and had a nice weekend. :flower:


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## cleckner04

Hope u feel better soon Kimberly. :hugs: 


Nothing new from me. We skipped a few days with the bding over the weekend. No time. We were going to on Saturday but I fell asleep before we got the chance. :dohh:


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## ashnbump

shiv - its not nosey, i dont mind answering peoples questions! all-in-all its cost us about £500, but like i say we have been saving, so its not like "omg £500 all at once!!" lol! She is very lucky, but christmas has always been a huge thing to us!

sorry you arent to well kim, hope upi feel better soon! 

joey - i also thought the toddler bed was a million times better than cot time! glad its working out for the best!

cleck - once i lie in bed im out for the count! If david isnt ready to go straight away, he'd have to roll me over whilst i sleep haha!


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## Shiv

Kim - i hope you feel better soon.

Ash, that is a lot of toys for £500, not as expensive as I thought it might be!

We can't actually have sex in our bed as it squeaks too much (and really don't want to wake Sophia) so we have to either do it downstairs or in the spare room. If it gets past about 9pm then I am way too tired, we will try to get own to business shortly after Sophia has gone to bed! I must admit (and I know this is terrible) but I find ttc a bit of a chore, sex i snot my most favourite thing - DH on the other hand thinks it great!


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## Boothh

ash jesse has quite a few of those toys and they are all stuff he loves and plays with especially the laugh and learn chair, and the little people noahs ark haha

i was going through his presents in my head last night

hes definatly getting

waybuloo trike
toddler bed (maybe the waybuloo one) 
waybuloo duvet and curtains
waybuloo night light
thomas aqua draw
magna doodle
laugh and learn kitchen
laugh and learn piano
tomy bath washing machine
monster megabloks
mr potato head
itng aquadraw mini mats
v tech alphabet desk
playskool clipo creativity table
waybuloo piplings figure pack
leapfrog fridge phonics
wooden activity cube
itng pick a picture story teller
play mobil 123 farm
big lotso huggin bear
chuggington loop the loop train set
various chuggington trains
fisher price fun to learn potty
waybuloo pop up toy storage
waybuloo wooden toy chest
waybuloo pjs
waybuloo hot water bottle
spot books, 
lots of other books
jigsaws

and just other little bits and lots of clothes, iv got another list nearly as long for other people to pick off too lol, i really wanted to get him one of those cars ash but theres no where to put it and i dont think he will actually use it really so im gunna wait til we have a bigger garden lol x


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## Boothh

i had ewcm last night so i think OV will be soon we dtd anyway x


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## ashnbump

luckily for us we have quite a bit of space in the back garden, and we have a lot of storage within the house, as well as a big shed outside :thumbup: 

we were between the hello kitty car and the pink mini cooper, but the kitty car is actually 12 months+ so its probably better for her! I actually cant wait to see all the presents wrapped up under the tree! we are storing them in my mum & dads spare room at the moment, and we are going to bring them all home on xmas eve, put kara to bed and then get them all wrapped! Otherwise she'll rip them open early haha! I hope she's got enough, i love to spoil her, its my hobby lol!

good luck this month boothh! i hope at least one of us in the group gets a bfp this time!xxxxxx


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## Boothh

yeah i feel the same about jesse haha, iv had a few people say stuff about it mainly my mum but hes my baby why cant i spoil him! we arnt going hungry to buy him stuff s whats the problem if thats hwat i wanna spend my money on! our garden is split the lawn if on a higher level and theres a little patio bit on the bottom but the other neighbours have to walk through my garden to get to their houses so i cant really have loads of stuff outside :/ 

iv just sorted out all jesses baby stuff, 6huge ikea bags of clothes, 2bouncy chairs, a moses basket, crib and cot and loads of bits to give to my friend, so ive freed up one of our wardrobes now to hide presents in! :) they are huge we have wardrobes all across one wall and they go about 3foot back so planty of room to fit his stuff in hopefully haha x

and thanks too, i hope this month is our month i dont want to be waiting ages!


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## Kimberly28

Thanks Cleck. I know what you mean. I was supposed to BD last night and I was just too exhausted and not feeling up to it and I passed out by 11pm. Hopefully get some in tonight though. :winkwink:

I went to the doc yesterday and he said that I've got a cold and a sinus infection at the same time. Blah! No wonder I feel like crap. Sinus infections make you feel more crappy than you realize. So now I'm on antibiotic, a steroid (prednisone) for the nasal inflammation, and musinex D for the congestion. I told the doc that we are TTC so please prescribe safe meds in case I get lucky this cycle so he smiled and said he would take care of that for me. So at least that's one less worry for me right now. 
Oh I also got out of going to court this morning. I called the clerk's office yesterday and told them I am pretty sick and shouldn't be sharing my germs with everyone and she said not to worry about it and that since it's just a little minor traffic citation that I can just pay it over the phone and not show up in court and not to worry about it. So I took care of it and now I get to rest. :thumbup: (It was just a following too closely ticket which actually wasn't true. The car in front of me was stopped at the red light and had been stopped for a couple of mins before I even arrived there but the cop thought that I stopped too close to the other car even though I was like 3 feet away from it *rolls eyes* so yeah, he issued me a citation to taint my perfect driving record. A$$hole.)

Oh and one more thing, for all of you American gals on here, get out and vote today please! And vote WISELY!! Do your homework BEFORE you go to the polls! This is crucial now and we can no longer take any politician at their word. Thanks. :blush:


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## spidey

Hope you're feeling better soon Kimberly. Sinus infections are awful- my DH gets them on occasion and its the only sickness that will completely knock him off his feet!

Shiv- I LOL about the spermies swimming inside you. I feel the same way too... I think because for years and years I always had protected sex but for about 6 months before Kira was made, I decided to give my DH a special treat and stop using protection when I wasn't fertile :haha: It felt weird to know the spermies were in there hunting out an egg with a mind of their own!


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## Shiv

So TTC has officially started here and baby dancing is underway (not right now obviously:haha:)

Any signs Ash? I am not looking forward to the 2ww, I swear if I had been trying last month i would have convinced myself I was pregnant, I had all the signs!

I have a problem and I was wondering if any of you could empathise (although probably not as you probably all have young perky boobs!). So it has been a month since i stopped breastfeeding :cry:, whilst i was BFing my boobs stayed covered during sex as they were likely to spurt everywhere :haha: So today was the first time I had my boobies uncovered during sex and i hate them! i can't see them as sexual anymore, and they are just so soft and wrinkly and saggy. i hate OH touching them, even though he says they are great. i woudl really much rather wear a bra :cry:


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## spidey

I don't think of my boobies as sexual anymore too and I don't know if that'll change once I stop bf, but I have a feeling it won't. My DH is always looking at boobies and he doesn't seem to care if they're small, big, flabby, firm, or super fake either, LOL. So if your DH says he likes yours the way they are, I bet he really does. I can't let my DH mess with them too much or milk will squirt out, so once I lift the low contact boobie rule he's going to be a happy guy :haha:


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## Kimberly28

I've had such a rotten day today. I need to vent so I hope you all don't mind. :wacko:
So as of this morning I got hit with a law suit (forced visitation/joint custody seeking, even though I'm married...) that my wacko/sicko "mother" is bringing against me and she stupidly based it all on lies and bullshit. So I'm about to slam her with purger y! I have plenty of evidence to use against her that she is a trouble maker. I hate how pathetic and dysfunctional my family is. :( It's like somehow only my brother and I were spared all of that crap when it comes to our sense of how a proper family should be. It's really sad though. But I guess that's why I'm trying to build my own family and teach my kids to always look out for each other and take care of one another because as adults you will need to lean on each other from time to time. I spoke to my brother a little while ago this evening and he's pretty disgusted with the whole ordeal and is willing to help me out however is needed. Unfortunately I am prolly going to need him to write up a testimony on my behalf to use in court to prove her wrong on a few accounts. 
Uggggg I don't need this crap right now. :nope: I'm still sick with this sinus crap and now Bryson has caught my cold too. :dohh: I had him at the doctor this afternoon to make sure it was just a cold. 

Oh and today is cd 14. Another concern I have is that I usually don't get a pos opk until cd 16. Well tonight I got a pos opk. :dohh: And a BUNCH of ewcm! (sorry for tmi) I guess I will be ov'ing tomorrow or day after (cd 15-16). My concern is that the sudden stress brought on by all of this stupid shit I'm dealing with could cause it to be postponed. :wacko: Now, IF it does happen on time though it will put me right in the window that I need to be in timing wise and I'll stand a good chance at being in with a shot this cycle. But now that this has happened, who knows. :shrug: Do you ladies think that since I did still get a pos opk (indicating that I'm still having an LH surge happen regardless of stress) that I might very well still OV? Man I'm hoping that I do! I REALLY wanna be pregnant this time around. But I won't let myself symptom spot or anything until AF is late (by 4 days or more). I'm tired of being let down by bfn and the witch. ;) So just gonna play it by ear and hope to goodness that I still manage to OV and maybe get preggers this time. 

Anyways, thanks for letting me vent. :blush: I've been wound up tighter than a top today because of all of this and haven't had a chance to vent and unwind from it all. Ugh! I guess I'm gonna get ready for bed now. Maybe I can convince DH to get off the computer and come cuddle up with me. Hey one can hope right? Haha.


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## Shiv

Oh Kim, sorry you are having such a crappy time. Who does your mum want joint custody of and why? i hope you get it sorted ASAP.
As for Ov I would say as you have had your surge and will ov as expected so try not to worry :hugs:


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## Boothh

:hugs: kim, i dont understand anything about opks and surges etc so i cant answer that, but your mum sounds like an idiot! maybe it will be your lucky month though pregnancy always seems t happen in the middle of a mess!

well i dont know if iv OV yet or not but my boobs are hurting and i got ewcm and belly ache so i think it will be soon, weve been dtd every other day at least and plan to for another week so ill hopefully catch it!


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## spidey

Kimberly- I also think you're probably going to ovulate. Stress doesn't always stop ovulation, so this might be your month!

Can a grandmother get forced visitation of her grandkids??? I would think not! What a mess and I hope you can get it sorted out soon without having to waste too much money on a lawyer!

Boothh- I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you!!!


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## Boothh

i really cant stand the ILs we dropped jesse off to stay over tonight and MIL made a comment about putting up the travel cot in stuarts room, then kept going on about how full of stuff it was, well i walked into the kitchen and glanced up the stairs on his bedroom door is a big sign saying OLIVIAS BEDROOM (obviously thats what sil is calling her baby) i dont know why but it really fucked me off, FIL is a decorator so tomorrow im gunna say 'so when are you gunna come and decorate jesses room then?' 
so obviously they are gunna be living there it just makes me think even more that jesse is gunna get left out, they never bother to come and see him weve lived here 8months and theyve been 3times where as my mum lives twice as far and comes about twice a week :dohh: im just so pissed off all they go on about is stupid SILs baby and jesse is gunna get forgotten cus it will be all about her, i really feel like she has just took everything away from me, i should be due in 2weeks but clearly everyones forgot about that, as if i wanna sit and look at her baby things and hear about eerytime we go round when we should be talkin bout my friggin baby things aswell but no one bothers acknowledging my baby, sorry for the rant but stuart wont hear a word against them and i fookin hate them!! i really hope im pregnant soon so i can announce it on the day she has her baby just to take the edge off it like she did with jesses birthday.. silly bitch! 


feel better now iv got that out my system haha


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## cleckner04

Boothh- :hugs: Sounds awful. I hope Jesse doesn't suffer later on because his grandparents choose to play favoritism. :( :hugs:


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## Kimberly28

Boothh, I am so sorry that you are having to deal with this! She sounds exactly like my mother who is trying to make my life a living hell right now too. She also plays favorites. Matter of fact my sister is the favorite of us children and naturally her (my sister's) little boy is her favorite also. It's just so wrong and I refuse to allow my children to be affected by it and have to deal with it too and then be asked why they aren't treated the same way, get the same things, etc. That's a big part of why I always keep my distance from her. That and the fact that the lifestyle she keeps is HIGHLY inappropriate and improper. Also the fact that she's very manipulative and controlling makes her hard to deal with as well. So I can understand your frustration. I'm really sorry you're having to deal with that. :( I also know what you mean by feeling like no one remembers the baby you lost. I often feel that way too. Matter of fact, one of my cousins is pregnant right now. But, I know that if DH and I both remember our tiny angel, then that's all that matters because it was ours. No one else's. Therefore they couldn't possibly understand the pain. I would of been 28 weeks along now. At times it's hard to believe that 4.5 months has already gone by since then. Anyways, try not to let the ILS get you down too much hun. Trust me, it's not worth it. :hugs: Hang in there!


Cleck, Welcome home hun! I hope you had a wonderful trip and I cant wait to see the pics! :)

Spidey, My mother doesn't have a case. She can only get visitation if my husband and I agree to it and if her influence is in the best interest of the child. In this case, it isn't. Not to mention she perjured herself and it's likely gonna wind up causing her to be jailed. Which at this point, if that's what it takes to teach her a lesson, then so be it. As cruel as that sounds. (You ladies have no idea the amount of chaos and pain that woman has brought into my life over the years.) Also, the only way a grandparent can get custody in this state is if the mother is deceased, separated, or divorced. I am none of the above! I'm alive and well and happy married and Zach (my oldest son who this is about) is thriving. 

Shiv, she is trying to get to Zach. The sad fact of the matter is that she is using him to try to manipulate me (as usual). She doesn't really care about him. It's about making me miserable so she can feel better about her life. I won't go any further into the messy details.

AFU, Today has been a rough day around here. Bryson has been very cranky all day today and been very picky about his diet. Normally he doesn't give me any grief. He's obviously still sick with this cold he's got and his nose sounds so snotty. :( All he wanted to eat this evening was his cereal and his baby yogurt. So that's what I fed him since it was better than nothing. I'm hoping that he will feel better tomorrow if not, then it's back to the doc I go with him this week.
Meanwhile amazingly I've managed to keep Zach well in the midst of all of this. DH, Bry, and I have all been sick so far with this. Yuck! 
TTC - Now about TTC. I had pos opk's from cd 14-16 and then today it was neg again and creamy cm so I am either 1 or 2 dpo now. I think I ov'd yesterday morning though (Friday/cd16) as I was having a ov pains (mild ones). My BBT hasn't spiked just yet but I'm hoping/expecting to see a significant rise tomorrow morning. So I guess we will see. I'm hoping I did actually OV because if so then we hit the perfect 3-4 day window timing wise for BD which puts me in with a good chance this cycle. I'm NOT symptom spotting this time around! I'm barely even gonna watch the calendar! I'll temp still and then immediately think about/do something else after I temp each morning and I refuse to let myself think about it. Hopefully, with a little luck, I'll turn around and be a few days late for AF along with a bfp. But I guess we will see what transpires. Anyhoo, 2 ww time. Is anyone else in their 2ww? Or is my cycle schedule completely opposite from the rest of you? :haha:

Hope you all are having a nice weekend so far and have a lovely day tomorrow. :hugs:


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## cleckner04

Well Kimberly, I have no clue when or if I've ovulated this month but I think I'm in my 2ww. :haha: I'm pretty sure I'll be out this month though. We didn't really try per se. We just DTD when we felt like it and since we had our vacation, we didn't do it as often because we were so exhausted from walking every day that we just fell asleep by the time our heads hit the pillow. :dohh: So I hope everyone doesn't mind me lurking around here while I'm WTT for the next seven months. :blush::haha:


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## ashnbump

Hello ladies! Sorry I've not been around in a while!

Kim & Boothh sorry to hear ur both having a shitty time with family atm! Fingers x'd all gets better!

Cleck - hope u did manage to catch the eggy! 7months is a long time, u r a strong woman being away from DH that ling, I dibt think I'd cope at all! 

Afu - well AF was due today, so far she's not here, my nipples are so so sore, wouldn't let David anywhere near them yesterday lol! I do have a bit of lower back ache today though, but I don't usually get it before AF it's normally during so no idea what that's about! I have no tests so I can't even find out, and I'm working all day today, so the shops will be shut when I finish and I can't even buy a test lol! Hate the wait! I want to know NOW so either hurry up AF or hurry up tomorrow so I can buy a test! 

I really don't know about this month, I can't decide if I think I'm pregnant or not, with kara I knew befor I knew lol! But with our angel baby I didn't have a clue!

I want it to happen soon though as I've just realised we've not been protecting since June! So it's like 6 months and not a single bfp :( I hope nothings wrong with me!

Anyway I'm sending lots of any dust to u all! Hope k e of us is lucky this month! Xxxx


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## Boothh

thanks everyone xxx

Ash we havnt protected since febuary! I suppose I have been pregnant twice since then but not successfully! You've already been pregnant twice so you know you can get pregnant it's just timing etc FX for when you test! xx


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## ashnbump

Well managed to nip to boots on my lunch hour to grab a test ......,




:bfp: WOOOOOOOOOHOOOOOOOO (scared now lol) xxx


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## joeyjo

Woooo hoooo! Yay Ash congrats!

As for me - AF turned up on Thursday - a day early, a 27 day cycle - grrrr
so that's 28 28 34 & 27...
Just want AF to go so we can get on with another cycle. 

I've got laryngitis & can barely make a sound; it's horrid and feels really odd not being able to communicate properly.


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## Shiv

oh Congrats Ash - great news, wishing you a happy and healthy 9 months x

Joeyjo - hope you feel better soon hon x

So spidey (cycle buddy!) how ar eyou getting on with BDing, we aer due to ovulate in the next couple of days? We haev only managed it once, but am planning on jumping on OH tonight once Sophia is in bed and then maybe tomorrow and wednesday if I can muster the energy :winkwink:

Kim, good luck not symptom spotting!


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## ashnbump

Thanks girls! I'm really scared! It's like I've never been pregnant before and I feel like a newbie all over again lol! I really hope at least one of u lot gets your :bfp: this cycle or I'll be all alone :( lol! I'm having bad lower back pains, especially when I lean over, I can't remember if I had that last time?

I just peed on a clearblue digi (OH grabbed it for me and brought it to work!) and it's deffo a pregnant and 1-2 weeks! Seems like nothing lol! I hope tgi's us a sticky bean, only time will tell! Xxx


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## cleckner04

OMG Ash yay!!!! That's such great news for me to wake up to. :haha: Sticky dust your way!!! :dust::dust:

Man, you will all be pregnant and I'll be sitting alone in this thread. :rofl:


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## ashnbump

Thanks Cleck, im so nervous! Really doesn't feel real!

I'll post my :bfp: pics asap lol! Might make it feel more real, then again ive not stopped checking the tests all day, and its still not sank in!xxx


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## ashnbump

bfp's . . . . . xx

https://i727.photobucket.com/albums/ww276/slimshadyluva/IMG_2400.jpg

https://i727.photobucket.com/albums/ww276/slimshadyluva/IMG_2391.jpg

https://i727.photobucket.com/albums/ww276/slimshadyluva/IMG_2393.jpg

am i seeing things or AM I PREGNANT!!!???? haha!xxxxxxx


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## Shiv

no doubt about it - you are up the duff girl!


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## ashnbump

It certainly looks that way doesn't it haha!

omg, we've told immediate family, my mum & dad and OH's mum & dad, it went 75% ok lol, davids dad seemed a bit disappointed, he said he's not, he's just worried for us, but we'll be ok! My mum & dad are cuffed and davids mum is mostly happy!

im starting to realise i do have symptoms, and i want the morning sickness to start so i feel a bit more reassured (i'll regret saying that soon lol!) xxx


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## spidey

Wooo hooo Ash!!!! :happydance: :happydance: I am so happy for you!! I would be scared too- I'm scared just thinking about being pregnant again. It'll become reality soon and you'll get less scared I'm sure 

Boothh- that sucks about your inlaws not giving equal treatment. The problem is that you can't say anything to them or they'll just call you jealous because people who play favorites don't like to admit they're wrong. They are the ones losing out by not visiting Jesse more. He'll grow up and be much closer to your mom and that won't be Jesse's fault. 

Kimberly- I keep my distance from annoying relatives too. It's not worth making yourself miserable to get along with someone just because they share genetics with you.

Since Boothh and Kimberly have me thinking about annoying relatives... I have a mini rant of my own, LOL. My FIL lives with his new wife about 20 minutes from my house and my FIL also works in this area as an appliance repairman. I often see his work truck parked on the street in front of my MIL's house (my MIL lives next to me). My FIL has yet to acknowledge that Kira exists. He hasn't called, sent a card, sent an email- nothing!! Kira is his first grandchild and it makes no sense that he isn't even curious to see what she looks like or anything. I just don't understand people. I try not to let it bother me- in the end he's going to be the one to miss out. Stupid man.

Shiv my cycle buddy- DH is away all day and night on Monday and Thursday, so we'll have to try and get some baby making time between those days and perhaps tonight. We dtd twice last week I think. I don't hold out much hope, but if it's meant to be it will be! Atleast once a day I second guess myself about having another baby so soon... eeek


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## Shiv

Spidey I second guess myself all the time too, it is really scary thinking about coping with 2 babies!

Sorry you FiL is being an arse Spidey - it is most definitely HIS loss not knowing Kira.

Boothh, sorry your in laws are being a pain as well, unfortunately i think that we learn in life that not everyone has the same values as us and that it is them who misses out :hugs:

I think I may have ov'ed early as I have had tonnes of ewcm the last few days anf now none. Also had slight tummy pains last night. We have done the deed Thursday night and sunday night, so if I ov'ed sunday night then we are hopefully in with a shot, although we dtd a couple of times over the next few days just in case i didn't ov! it is tricky this ttc business!

how are you feeling about it all today Ash?


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## Boothh

i dont think i OVd at all this month or im super late, i thought i had ewcm but it could just as easily have been leftover :blush: you know what! we dtd every other day so if i did then we are in with a chance and i am in the tww now, :/ not testing till after holiday though which is a week today!


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## Boothh

ash i missed this by just readin the last page! congratulations!! :happydance: !!! im sooo happy for you!! i hope i catch on this cycle too ill find out in just less than 2weeks ha xxx


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## ashnbump

aww thatnks boothh!! I hope you get your bfp this month then we'll be due the same time again! 

Im really chuffed, i just hope this is a sticky beanie! i have very sore boobies/nipples and im mega tired, feeling a teeny bit queezy and dizzy spells too, i just cant quite believe it, its like its too good to be true! I think ive convinced myself that this baby is never gonna actually come lol, how stupid am i! Just got to try and take it one day at a time i guess!

doctors appointment tomorrow, so gonna get him to stock me up on vitamins etc, and ask all my questions, like a first timer haha! i'll find out tomorrow if i got my dates right, if i did my EDD will be 18th July! yaaaaaaaaaaaaaay summer baby again!xxxx


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## Kimberly28

:happydance: Yay Ash!!! I'm so excited for you! You're going to have another lion cub baby!!! :dance: :thumbup: 

I'll also find out in about 2 weeks if I'm knocked up or not haha. One weird thing is though, that at 1 dpo I suddenly got REALLY bloated that night. I mean that doesn't normally happen to me. Very strange! Anyways, I'm ignoring my body mostly so I don't see false signs. Then if there is a real sign, I wont have to question it as my body will have to force it on me hehe. :haha: I'm 4 dpo and caught the 2-3 day old swimmers so fingers crossed for a bfp for me too with a little girlie! :flower: FF.com says that if I conceived this cycle, my EDD is July 28th. So, I'd have an actual lion cub this time around! Bry is a virgo but not by that much haha so I still got to be in lion cubs with you ladies. I sure hope I'm preggers too. I guess we will see though. :)

Congrats again Ash! It's so neat that one of us got a bfp! I just wonder who will be next, me, Shiv, or Boothh! Hehe. Will you find out what you're having this time with this one? Sending you lots of super sticky :dust:

I also cant help but feel bad for Cleck. I mean I know her DH will be gone for 7 months so she cant TTC till he gets back. If somehow we all get our bfp's and are all pregnant, I'm gonna feel really guilty and bad for Cleckner because then I'm afraid she will feel like the "odd man standing" so to speak. :( I don't want her to feel that way and I'll certainly feel bad if that does happen. *sigh* 
Cleck, IF that does happen, at least when you finally get your bfp, you will be the one in the spotlight and we can all make a big deal out of your pregnancy! :hugs:

Boothh: Hopefully you will be getting your bfp soon too!! When is AF due for you?

Shiv, hopefully you caught the eggy too!! Let's see how many bfp's we manage to total up this month! :winkwink:


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## Shiv

it took us 5 months to conceive with Sophia so I shall probably still be ttc when Cory gets back. However you never know - Cleck could be up the duff already!


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## Boothh

i think am due around 20th november i cant decide whether to poas that night when we get back to england from disneyland or not, that is my due date for hiro and also the day we concieved jesse so it seems significant to us but i dont want to be disappointed if i dont get a bfp that day as its gunna be emotional anyway with it being my due date, 
i might wait until the monday or as long as i can after that, i dont knowwww i know if i dont get AF on the 20th im gunna want to test asap lol, 

my boobs are actually really sore today, they never get sore when im due AF or any other time unless iv been pregnant but i dont want to symptom spot cus i want to have a nice holiday without worrying!


----------



## spidey

I have a feeling that I won't get my bfp for many many months. I'm breast feeding quite frequently still and I have a feeling that its stopping ovulation- we will see though. Cleckner will have me as company if she doesn't get her bfp this month 

I can't wait to see who gets their bfp next!!


----------



## cleckner04

I'll be okay girlies! I'm going to 'try' to lose weight instead. That should keep me busy enough. I mean, I will be uber broody when you all will be talking about pregnancy symptoms and whining about wanting your babies out already. ;) My time will come again though. AF should be here friday or saturday so hopefully she just stays away. Although I have zero symptoms so I have a feeling AF will come right on time. :haha: I'll still pop in here and check up on everyone but will more than likely move more to the WTT section of the forum too. :thumbup:


----------



## Shiv

it aint over til the wicked witch sings Cleck, you still have ages before she is due - fx! and please don't leave us!


----------



## Shiv

Oh and my ticker must be a bit wrong - I am sure I ovulate more towards the middle of my cycle than it thinks. No way do I ovulate on day 18 of 31. I am pretty sure i have ovualted now - no EWCM left, we :sex: Thursday, Sunday and Tuesday and will agian on Thursday, so we'll see. I have started getting incredibly nervous that i might actually get pregnant! and this morning I felt awful for even trying when I will have to share my attention with Sophia :cry:


----------



## Kimberly28

I agree with Shiv. Don't leave us Cleck, we love you so!! :hugs: Who knows, you might be in for a surprise bfp! :winkwink:


----------



## ashnbump

here here cleck! i have a plan for you, just get corey to leave some spermies in a cup and whack them in the freezer, then each cycle just grab a turkey baster hahaha! :rofl:

ive decided im gonna buy another clearblue digi to make sure the weeks are going up, im not worried or anything, i just want to see if it works haha!

any bfp's due soon?xxx


----------



## Kimberly28

:rofl: Ash! Haha if ONLY it were THAT easy!! I totally wish she could do that too! Haha!! :rofl:

Ash, are you sure you aren't getting paranoid? Try not to worry hun (I know easier said than done). Stress isn't good for you right now. :hugs:

I'm 6 dpo today and cd 21. So basically one more week and I'll know one way or the other. PRAYING that the usual spotting a week before AF is due doesn't start up. It usually happens around 8 dpo. So I guess we will see. Definitely praying I caught the eggy this time! Sprinkle me with some of that fertile dust of yours haha. :haha: Do you recall any signs about a week before your AF was due? I'm definitely tired and hungry quite a bit and my sense of smell seems to be up but I dunno. :shrug: I really am trying to just ignore my body and not let myself think about this too much. Please pray that there will be no spotting for me this time and I get my bfp! [-o&lt;

Yo, Boothh, any preg signs for you yet?? :haha:

Shiv, you might be right about still not ovulating due to BF so much. Try to cut back on the amount that you're BF'ing (if you can) and hopefully it will be just enough to trigger OV. :flower:


----------



## ashnbump

i am a teeny tiny bit worried, but i dont think its normal if your not worried lol! I feel positive, very very VERRRRRRY sore boobies and nipples, just like with Kara, i didnt get that with the angel baby!

i dont think i will buy another clear blue actually, whatever will be will be, so a test isnt going to make any difference! 

im starting to feel a bit queezy, although ive not actually been sick, but im guessing its a good sign that i have a few sympstoms? The tiredness is dreadful, i have to say! The only other thing im finding hard is taking it easy, im still jumping and rushing around like a mad woman! i should really stop doing so much!

im sending good luck dust your way! i want someone to share it with again lol!x


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## Kimberly28

Awww hun! Try not to worry even though I know it's too easy to worry. :hugs: I just know that I'm going to be a worry-wort too. :dohh: :blush: Those were good strong dark lines and your symptoms seem very good too though. :thumbup: And yes, you should slow down and start taking it easy. It takes a lot of energy and your body's functions to grow a baby. Get OH and family to come over and look after Kara for you while you nap or put your feet up. 

I hope to get to go through it with you as well. :flower: Just gotta get my bfp. Hoping and praying that this is it for me and I get it this time. [-o&lt;


----------



## Boothh

my boobs are ridiculously sore i havnt worn a bra for the last few days cus they really hurt! for all i know i could already have missed AF with my cycles being irregular, i thought i might take a test before i go on holiday just incase, my boobs never get sore with AF at all so i dunno i dont want to symptom spot though!


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## Kimberly28

OMG Boothh! :test: :test: :test: :test:!!!!!!! Please go poas and let us know right away!!! :haha:


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## ashnbump

boothh!!!! test test test test!!!!!!!!!! yay im having good vibes here!

let us know ASAP!

Kim- is it a good sign that the lines were dark? it got darker the following day too?

its hard not to worry, but i guess for some unknown reason ive got it n my head that this pregnancy will end in miscarriage :( i need to stop being so negative though, as most pregnancies are healthy and a lovely baby comes along! more end with babies than they do with miscarriage, its just the horrid thought of the disappointment and the feeling like ive 'caused it', thats how i felt last time! I cant remember if i thought this way with Kara or not, but i do remember feeling these symptoms, so i guess thats a good sign?

BOOOOOOOOOOO to worrying and not being in control lol!
xxx


----------



## Boothh

i cantttt test stuart wont let me get any tests i will sneak some on friday and do one at the weekend if it makes you happy haahah xxx


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## Kimberly28

Yes Boothh! :test: :test: Hehe wondering minds want to know! Haha. :haha:

Ash, awwww I don't blame you hun. I'm sure it's going to be ok though. Trust me, I know how you feel. Going through a mc sucks! I hated it when I did. :( 
However, I think your signs seem very promising of a positive outcome and dark lines are definitely a good thing! It means a good strong presence of hcg is in your urine which also indicates a good solid implantation. :thumbup: Try to think positive and just relax and rest whenever you can. Lots of sticky dust for you and hopefully preggie fertile dust for me. :dust: :dust: I'm actually kinda gassy today. :blush:


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## cleckner04

Boothh you HAVE to test!!! Also, this way you'd know so you don't get on any big rides. :winkwink: You can use that as an excuse for Stuart. :haha: 


Well, my face is starting to break out which always happens before a period is on it's way. :roll: I'm like a teenager still.


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## ashnbump

cleck - i too get spotty before af is due, and i did this time too :thumbup:

boothh - does stuart not understand how important this is haha! clecks right about the big rides, so tell him its got to be done! test test test!

Kim - youve really reassured me so thankyou :hugs: i didnt know that dark lines were indacative (sp) of anything!

xx


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## Boothh

iv just wrote a big post and jesse deleted it :dohh: 

short and short is me and stuart had an argument, i looked into it and the main risks are impact (which is slim to none before the baby pops up out of the pelvis) and placenta abruption which wont happen while there is no proper placenta, so we wont be testing til afterwards, :/ cus if i know im pregnant i wont go on regardless of what the research says, i think im going to take it easy though on the big thrills, and just feign illness or something lol x


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## cleckner04

I'd do the same. I don't know how disneyland is but there were still tons of rides at disney world that I could ride while pregnant with Emma. You'll have a blast. Take tons of pictures for us to see!!


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## Boothh

i know theres 2coasters that are particularly bumpy but all the rest are really smooth so i think riding the smooth ones once or twice wont be that bad :/


----------



## Vici

Hi girls, i'm in to join you :D

Some of you may know that I decided to take my 100mg of Clomid when AF last started (she is so few and far between i thought i'd ttake advantage while I could :)) So, without doing any other tracking i am on CD19 - waiting till 20/10/2010 to test though :D


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## Boothh

do you mean 20/11/2010 ? cus thats the day im testinggg :D


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## spidey

Shiv my cycle buddy- do you think you ovulated early and will have a 28 day cycle this month versus 31 or 32? 

I still haven't noticed any ewcm and DH decided to attempt some fancy maneuvers last night so I don't think any spermies actually made it inside very far, LOL. I was so distracted as we were :sex: because I kept smelling latex :haha: Maybe we'll have another go tonight- it might be our last opportunity this week due to DH's meeting schedule for work. 

Ash- you're scaring me about being pregnant again. I don't have time to be nauseous and tired! Try not to worry although I know its hard. It's really out of your control now and what is meant to happen will happen. :hugs:

Hi Vici- I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you! With clomid you might get twins- wouldn't that be cool!!

Boothh- how much longer till Disney? I think sore boobies is a great sign!


----------



## Shiv

spidey said:


> Shiv my cycle buddy- do you think you ovulated early and will have a 28 day cycle this month versus 31 or 32?
> 
> Well I reckon I might have a shorter cycle this time, but quite frankly who knows!
> 
> I still haven't noticed any ewcm and DH decided to attempt some fancy maneuvers last night so I don't think any spermies actually made it inside very far, LOL. I was so distracted as we were :sex: because I kept smelling latex :haha:
> 
> What on earth were you doing, rubber suits?:haha: each to their own:haha:

So we will have some same day testers then! I will be getting very poas antsy by the 20th but ..........must......not.....test..........until 25th!


----------



## Vici

Boothh said:


> do you mean 20/11/2010 ? cus thats the day im testinggg :D

lol, yeah thats what i meant! :dohh: Ooooo, i'll try to hang it out till then if no AF :D


----------



## Vici

spidey said:


> Hi Vici- I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you! With clomid you might get twins- wouldn't that be cool!!

I'm not sure cool is a word i'd use, more like petrifying :rofl:


----------



## cleckner04

I think twins would be an absolute nightmare. :haha: I can never understand women that are desperate for twins. :wacko::lol:


----------



## Shiv

i quite wanted twins when I was preggo with Sophia, but defo am not so keen next time round!


----------



## Boothh

no i cant either, i know 2girls who just had twins and another who is pregnant with them! id be scared to death after having just one! got to hand it to them though it musnt be easy!!


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## Kimberly28

:wave: Hi Vicki! Welcome!! :) 

How exciting that we're all (except Ash of course) in the 2ww!! Wouldn't it be awesome if we suddenly all got our bfp at the same time?!?! :thumbup: Haha I know it isn't likely, but it would still be pretty cool. :winkwink: I'm REALLY hoping and praying that I've caught the eggy this time but I'm trying to ignore my body and not symptom spot so that any real signs will have to slap me in the face and force itself on me haha. :haha: I'm 6 dpo now and will have anywhere from a 28-31 day cycle. But usually on 8-9dpo I start having spotting and then spot for a week before AF arrives. I'm praying that that doesn't happen and I get my bfp instead. But I guess we will see.

Ash, do you remember if you were having scant amounts of cm around 6 dpo? (a week before AF was due.) I know I tend to go dry before AF but AF is still a week away (if at all, hopefully a bfp instead of course). I'm not sure what to think. What little I do have is sort of creamy/ sort of sticky. Or were you having good amounts of cm throughout the 2ww? I wish I could remember from when I got preg with Bryson. :dohh:


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## cleckner04

At the same time, I bet they keep eachother occupied when they are older. :haha: I'm glad twins don't run in my family or anything like that. I especially cringe at the thought of BFing with multiples. That'd be insane. I give so many props to the girls on here that BF twins till a year or more. It's just amazing. There is even a girl on here exclusively BFing triplets! :shock:


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## spidey

DH's aunt has twin girls and I never appreciated all the work she must do until I had just my one baby. She exclusively bf too... and continued until they were 16 months I think! DH does have twins on his side so my MIL always tells me that I could have twins too, but I don't even want to think about it! I was all belly with Kira so of course I had to hear ALL of the time "are you sure it isn't twins??" I think a boy and girl twin would be neat so there was less jealousy and they could be really close too.


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## Shiv

DH has twin brothers and triplet cousins and I was a twin, so I guess you could say twins run in both our famillies! eek but they usually skip a generation - I hope!


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## ashnbump

Kim- Im not 100% certain but I'm sure I had some cm about 3 days before I tested! More than usual anyway!

Vici- welcome Hun! Good luck with TTC! 

On the subject of twins - gahhh no thanks! We gave identical twins in our family, but I know that identical twins aren't genetic! We want 4 kids so it'd ruin some of the fun if you had two at once and only had 3 pregnancies!lol! 

So me and David were sat talking last night and he said "oh my god we're pregnant" hahaha I was like really???! It's sinking in a bit more now, I am HATING being early pregnant tho, too much worry, I want to be in 2nd trimester NOW! I forgot what it was like at the beginning! God I want one of u lot to get ur bfp SO BAD I feel lonely! I suppose time will fly once I've got a date for my scan, with Xmas around the corner etc! When I saw the doctor on Monday he told me that I'd probably be induced early again (at full term this time) as to minimise the risk of me getting preeclampsia again, so I guess you could say, I've got about 32 Saturdays before I have my beanie! I feel so unorganised haha! 

Anyone botany noticeable symptoms, the main one for me which made me KNOW was really really sore nipples, too sore to touch! And then the bfp came and so did the nausea! Xx


----------



## ashnbump

:sick: The morning sickness is in full swing today

my stomach hasnt stopped rolling all morning and ive actually been sick!

good sign i guess, although im still getting lower back ache, which makes me think AF is coming lol! :wacko:

i forgot pregnancy turned me into a moaning paranoid pain in the ass!xx


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## Boothh

my boobs are still really killing i havnt got a bra on again i cant stand it haha, and when i was pregnant with jesse i had to stop using mouthwash cus the after taste would make me hrow up well this morning all i can taste in my mouth is mouth wash and it keeps making me gag! :dohh: 

i really doubtr im pregnant though im just symptom spotting like an idiot haha x


----------



## Vici

Sorry to hear you've been feeling so sick Ash - that is a part i'm def not looking forward to. Hoping that my gall bladder problems wer ethe caus eof me being so ill and that they won't happen this time!
Becki - i'm trying not to symptom spot - with Imogen I ahd nothing until after my BFP so trying to think the same might happen. BUT, i have had some real pulling pains and shooting pains in my pubic area, not sure what thats a sign of?!


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## Kimberly28

Awww I'm sorry Ash! That is a good sign though for sure! :thumbup: 
Is there any way that you can remember if you had a good amount or a small amount of cm a week before your bfp? :blush: Yeah.... I'm trying to figure out what my chances are. :dohh: 
I hope someone can come over and help you out today by watching Kara. If not, then hopefully she will be a good little girl today for mommy. Take care hun. :hugs:


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## ashnbump

boothh - seriously girl you NEED to test, i want to have someone to shaaaaaarrrreee this with! and im convinced ur cooking a bun in ur oven!

kim - i honestly have no idea how much cm i had a week before my bfp sorry hun :( 
my family live quite far from us, so i have no one who can just watch her for an hour or so, but she goes to nursery 3 days a week, 1.30pm - 6pm so that gives me a little break i guess, and she loves it there too!

vici - thanks hun, hope u dont feel sick wen u get ur bfp too!

xx


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## Kimberly28

Booth, I agree with Ash. You do need to test. Listen, tell Stu that it's better that you test now and know if you are or not so that you will know while at DL if it's safe to ride the coasters or not and that you don't want to take a risk that you might wind up regretting later. In all seriousness, it's the most sensible thing to do for the safety of yourself and the potential bean. After all, would he want to risk a little bean's safety because he made you wait till after the trip and caused you to ignorantly get on one of the rides that shook you up a bit too much? It's more a matter of being responsible than anything else. So I say go run out to asda or boots or whatever is close by and get you a test and tell Stu exactly what I just said. If he has any kind of sensibility and a brain in his head, then he will understand and will agree for you to test. At the very least, if it's a bfn and while I know that would make you sad, at least you will have the distraction of fun at DL to keep your mind off of it and cheer you up. ;) Please consider what I've said hun. I'd hate for you to go and find out you were pregnant and then miscarry and then blame yourself and beat yourself up over not testing sooner and feeling guilty and thinking you caused it or could have prevented it had you have tested and known to not go on the coasters. It's for your safety and sanity. :hugs:


Ash, try some ginger beer or ginger snaps, or if you can find them.. 'preggie pops' are wonderful! While I was preg with Bry, one of my UK friends told me about them as they have them over there. I didn't think they sold them here until I found them around 3rd tri haha. I've already got some on hand for next time in case I get ms again. ;)

AFM, today is 7 dpo/ cd 22. AF is due in a week. I'm tired and hungry. I ate my usual breakfast bar and was still really hungry so I got up and made a couple grilled cheese sandwiches which I've now eaten and I'm still hungry. :wacko: I'm trying very hard to ignore my body and not think about stuff too much. Which is easier said than done. :dohh: Tomorrow is 8 dpo. Hoping that the usual pre-AF spotting doesn't show up. [-o&lt; I better get going here, Bry is awake now and will start fussing up a storm for me to come get him any time now haha.


----------



## Shiv

Ash - sorry you feel so poorly, but it is a good sign - only another 8 weeks or so until itshould ease off!

Boothh - it does sound promising, fx for you x

Vici - you took Clomid before you conceived Imi didn't you? How many cycles did it take after you started the Clomid? fx'ed for you too!

Cleck - any sign of AF yet?

Kim - you do make me laugh a little bit - you are such a symptom spotter in denial :haha:

As for me, well when I was pregnant with Sophia I didn't get a single symptom until about 8 weeks when Ihad sore boobs and then that was it until heartburn kicked in at about 30 weeks (oh and the bump was a bit of a give-away!) so I don't think symptom spotting will do me any good! Doesn't stop me though! And i guess each pregnancy is different. I wonder what the chances are of having one pregnancy with absolutely no morning sickness and then getting it bad the next time?!?!?!?

Anyway sit tight girls, won't be too much longer until we all know if this month is a goer or not!


----------



## cleckner04

No AF for me yet! She should be here tomorrow if my cycle sticks to 30 days. Or on Sunday if it decides to be 32 days like last month. :dohh: Who knows. I hope it comes soon because DH is home 2 more weeks so in theory if his sperm lived a while in there, we could still have a chance next cycle. :haha:


----------



## Kimberly28

Hey Cleck, maybe you're in for a surprise bfp! Keep us posted!

Shiv, LOL!!! :haha: I cant help it! :dohh: It's SO hard to not think about it! :winkwink:


Well, I've made a horrible discovery a little while ago. My hamster has gone missing. :( I've looked and looked and so far, nada. I'm hoping to find him sometime today. I've set up 6 live traps so far (nothing that will hurt him) with food in them and I'm hoping he will find one of them and I'll be able to tell if he has been in them and hopefully even find him in one of them. One of the traps he will not be able to get back out of again so I'm hoping that maybe that will pay off too. If I don't find him by the time I have to leave here to go get hubby from work then when we return (if I dont find him in a trap) then we will have to turn the house upside down to try to find him. At the least, I'm sure he is asleep where ever he is. This evening he will be awake and wanting food so I'm sure he will go hunting for it and I'm hoping at that point finding him will be much easier. If any of you have any further tips for me I'd be grateful. I'm so worried about him because we do have a cat but she stays downstairs and his cage is upstairs. Not to mention the cat was locked in the downstairs bathroom all night because she was being bad (long story). So I don't think the cat got him but I'm not taking any chances. I doubt the hammy made his way all the way down the stairs. He's probably somewhere upstairs here. I just hope we find him alive and well. I'm trying not to panick over him. :nope:


----------



## cleckner04

Aww sorry about the MIA hamster. :hugs: Maybe he made nice friends with a mouse and they are having a party. :haha: Seriously though, I hope you can find him. We once had a hamster disappear too but it didn't end well. :( It sounds like you are doing all you can do for him though. Hopefully he gets hungry and sees the food in the trap. Fingers X'ed he shows up tonight.


----------



## Boothh

i really do wanna test but i think waiting is probably the best option for me, im not gunna go on any big coasters anyway iv already made my mind up im just gunna tell him i dont feel well or something, the longer i leave it the less time i have to be paranoid in first tri if i am pregnant, im already taking vits and folic acid so that bits covered, i will probably do a test at weekend though but id rather not do..


----------



## Kimberly28

So I don't wanna get my hopes up but a little bit ago I had a bm and after I wiped I looked down and saw this large glob of cm on my lady bits so I reached down (warning TMI!!) and thought I'd figure out what texture it is and it was creamy but had like ewcm mixed in with it. I know it's not leftover semen because hubby and I haven't bd'ed in over 48 hrs. So I looked it up and on countdowntopregnancy.com it says that that can be a pregnancy sign. I'm REALLY hoping but at the same time really trying to not get my hopes up. :blush: Shiv, your right, I'm in denial. :haha: But I am trying to not pay too much attention as well. I do kinda already feel like I'm probably out this time. :shrug: 

Anyhoo, still no luck finding my hammy. :( :wacko: I've eliminated the laundry room up here. He's not in there for sure. I've checked Bryson's room thoroughly and not there either. DH and I are going to have to tear our bedroom apart and try to find him. If no luck, then we will have to direct our search downstairs. We're hoping to find him up here though. I'll let you all know. *sigh*


----------



## Pippin

:hi: ladies. Sorry I've been missing in action but I just wanted to be on my own for a bit after the mmc. Just couldn't get chatty. Just popping in to say I think I got my :bfp: today :yipee: early days and only just visible on an ic and Internet mid stream but have just taken two more tests and a line is on those as well. I'll only believe when I get my positive digi ( tonight was a no but my wee was like water sorry tmi, was cross with myself as I knew at the time). So I'll celebrate then but not until then. Haven't caught up with what's going on but will try to in a sec. Hope you are all well and good. :hugs:


----------



## Pippin

Ash CONGRATULATIONS. That is fantastic news :happydance:

Boothh honey :test: how can you resist. You have to get in quick with my hospital so don't wait too long :hugs:

As for everyone else :hi: sorry not replying individually but I'm wishing bfps for everyone in a week :yipee:


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## Kimberly28

PIPPIN!!!! Welcome back!!!! And CONGRATS!!!!!! :happydance: :happydance: :yipee: I'm so happy for you!!! Try a digi tomorrow morning or morning after with FMU. I'm SURE it will say pregnant!! That is so exciting!! They do say that after a MC/MMC that you're especially fertile so that's wonderful! I personally wasn't ready to try again immediately after. I wanted to let myself heal emotionally and physically and get to know my cycles again first. Thus why I'm finally trying now. This is actually my 2nd cycle TTC. So we'll see. I'm so glad you're doing so well! Congratulations and I couldn't be happier for you!! :hugs:


----------



## Boothh

aww yaay pippin!! congrats hun i bet if you do i digi tomorrow it will be a bfp :) FX for you hun :hugs:

i just spoke to stuart and he finally agreed i can get some tests over the weekend :D i really think they will be bfn though cus going off my last few cycles i am not due til late next week, but im on cd36 i think and the few cycles before the 2 48day cycles were 36day cycles..


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## Kimberly28

Boothh, that's great hun! Please let us know the outcome. F'X for you!! :hugs:


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## cleckner04

Pippin!!! Congrats hun!! A line is a line IMO! :D:D


----------



## joeyjo

Congrats Pippin 

Fingers crossed for everybody else - hi Vici :)

as for me - well AF just finished so I'm back in the game again... AF due again about 3rd dec... Gonna try and DTD around midcycle this month :rofl: we seem to keep being away that weekend!


----------



## Vici

OMG Pips, massive congrats hun, sooooo pleased for you xx

Becki - glad Stuart has said you can get a test, i'd be going mad lol!

Hi Jo :wave:

Kimberly - ooo, sounds good with your CM, although i can't give any help on that as CM isn't my speciality lol!!

Shiv - yes I took Clomid to fall with Imi but the difference was I had follicle tracking and trigger shot so i knew when i'd ovulate. It took us 2 cycles. This time i've taken it on my own and I didn't temp so have no clue if anything has even happened!!


----------



## Shiv

Pippin- hi and congratulatoins! Keep us up to date with the digi, photos please!

Kim- you are the funniest non-symptom spotter I know, looking things up on google does not = not symptom spotting! i hope it is a good sign for you though :flower:

JoeyJo - good luck this cycle, hope you get some good bding inmid cycle!

Vici - I don't really understand anything that you just said :haha: but I hope you have timed it right this cycle :hugs:

Cleck - any sign of AF?

Boothh - test test test - and photos please!

Well it seems we are on a bit of a BFP run this month, so who will be next?


----------



## ashnbump

Morning ladies!

Huge congrats pip! Sticky dust for both of us! Hope u don't mind me asking but did you have strong symptoms last time? Was anything 'different'? I'm hoping u may be able to ease my mind a bit lol! Good luck with the digi, although I'm sure it'll be positive!

Boothh- if u really don't want to test hun then wait! I really want to know if u git a bfp cos im nosey but do what u got to do! Although to me ur symptoms sound convincing!

Joey- fingers x'd this cycle!

Kim- sounds promising! I'll be crossing my fingers and toes for you!

Cleck- any signs of AF?

Shiv- we do seem to be on a good bfp run don't we!

Good luck to all the ladies testing and waiting to test! I'm excited! I predict at least 2 more bfp's this month! Xx


----------



## Boothh

ash with my mmc the only symptom i had was my nips went dark i got no ms or anything and i just had a feeling something was wrong with jesse i had everything going !xxx


----------



## ashnbump

thanks hun, i cant help but worry, and i always said i wouldnt get like this this time around :wacko: 

my symptoms are -

extremely sore nipples and tender breasts
darker nipples
nausea (with on off actual sickness)
very tired, but i am mostly feeling it late at night as im getting lots of sleep!
lower back ache (on and off)

looking at it it does look good i guess lol!

im still gonna buy a digi double pack, to see if the weeks go up, i think i'll feel more at ease then, as theres actual evidence things are moving along etc!

have you decided to test or not? i really hope you get your bfp!xxx


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## Boothh

i still cant decide i think i will text but i dunno if to wait cus i want a dark line not something i have to squint at, i might do on monday before we go then leave it til when we come back, 
i dont like digis, i think by the time iv wasted my money buying loads i would only have to put abit more to just get a private scan which i think would be alot more reassuring! x


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## Boothh

oh i have well loads of cm aswell recently its pretty gross :blush:


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## ashnbump

just do what you feel is best hun! we'll all find out eventually!

just so you know tho, all clearblue is on offer in boots! i got two clearblue plus for £7 odd so bargain atm!

i thought about an early scan, but £99 is a frikkin moses basket!haha! as long as i dont bleed, (fingers extremely tightly crossed) thn im not gonna worry (well im gonna try not to worry!)

dont forget boothh, if u get a bfn now, it could just be early, always test again!xxx


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## Aunty E

Hello ladies! Popping on here to congratulate Pippin :) Hoping that this run of BFPs continues, and the Lion Cub mummies are really back in action!

Found out that I don't see the midwife again until 28 weeks - I haven't seen one since 12 weeks! I don't even have a maternity exemption certificate yet, and I have no idea about antenatal classes in this area. Sigh. They do seem to be expecting me just to get on with it this time.

Duncan brought home some little boy baby clothes from some friends of ours, whose baby (ALBERT!) was only born in August. How he's grown out of some of this stuff, I don't know, but he is a monster baby, ten and a half pounds when he was born. So I sorted through those to work out what I would keep and what was going straight to the charity shop, and actually had a moment of 'won't it be nice to have a little boy this time'. So that was pleasing. It's only taken eight weeks to stop feeling disappointed. Sigh. If only I could make myself feel what I know I should. It would help if this one had a name, I'm just not bonding the same way without a name. Imogen had been named for weeks by this point. I'll have to have another go at Duncan this weekend and get him to actually talk about it. Mostly we fight for five minutes and then stop talking about names for a week or two.


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## Shiv

I actually really like the name Albert - it is cute!

Ash - you have got every symptom going! 

We had an early scan with Sophia as I had not a single symptom and i struggled to believe there was anything in there. I think we only paid £60 and it was very reassuring, we had it at about 8 weeks and as soon as I had had it I started worrying again until the 12 weeks scan! You just never know.

AE - i can't believe you don't see a midwife until 28 weeks - I felt very reassured hearing the heartbeat every 4 weeks. I may have to purchase a doppler (after managing to resist for the whole of pregnancy with Sophia) - hark at me talking like i am already up the duff - shouldn't count your chickens Shiv!

pippin - i see you are happy on fb today - did you take the digi? Don't keep us in suspense!

i had forgotten how blooming frustrating the 2ww wait is - the sooner they develop a test that can tell you you are pregnant at 1dpo teh better :haha::haha::haha::haha:


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## Aunty E

I quite like Bertie actually, and Albie, but Albert makes me go cold. Especially as they have a slightly silly surname, it's a bit like Ramsbottom, but not. Don't want to tell you what it is in case they spot this! 

This one kicks away, and I haven't bothered with the doppler for absolutely ages, although I could pick up the HB at 10 weeks so it got a couple of months of solid use after that point. Honestly though, he kicks so hard I feel bruised a lot of the time. This time I had an 8 week scan, indispensible in my opinion ;) and then got the HB on the doppler, so didn't feel the need for a 10 week scan too like last time. We had our gender scan at 16 weeks, and the anomaly scan at 20, and we won't see bubs again until he's born. I just find the 3D scans look a bit creepy...


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## Kimberly28

Ash, those are REALLY good signs! I'm certain everything is just fine. I know it's so hard to not worry though. Hang in there and ask for an early scan. Since you've had a mc before, I'm sure they would be more willing to give you that reassurance at 7-8 weeks. 

Boothh, come on girl TEST!! Haha. :haha:

Shiv, LOL!!! :haha: Shutup and quit picking on me! LOL!!! :haha: (And no I don't mean literally, I'm just being silly.) I'm really trying to not symptom spot here. For some reason though I got VERY sleepy after dropping DH at work this morning while on my way home. Also definitely been more hungry lately. So far no spotting...knock on wood!! It usually starts on 8 dpo (today) so I guess we will see. I also am kinda expecting it all to fall apart over the weekend or something. Suddenly today I just feel "out" this month. :( Hoping I'm wrong though! Thanks Ash for the for the crossed fingers. Keep them crossed will ya? :flower: 

Cleck, AF arrive yet??

AE, Welcome!!! We don't mind you lurking here. After all Ash and Pippin are both preggers and both more than welcome to stay here with us too. Maybe eventually we will have to change the title of this thread to something else since we will hopefully all be pregnant. Haha. :haha:
I think giving baby boy a name will definitely help. Especially if it's one that you really like. :thumbup: Listen, I know how you feel because for about a month after finding out that Bry was a boy, not a girl I had a hard time bonding with him during that month. After that though I fell in love with him. Now, I wouldn't trade him for anything! He brings me so much joy! :) And besides, little girls are daddy's girls, they tend to bond more strongly with their daddies. But boys, they bond with mommy! Bryson DEFINITELY prefers me to daddy haha. He does love daddy and plays with him and stuff and gets his hugs and kisses but immediately after he reaches for/returns to mommy. I'm #1 in his book and the bond we share is very intense and close and I treasure it. You will too. You'll see. Just think of how he will feel in your arms and looking up at you with big blue eyes and that wonderful baby smell and the precious innocence of a new born wrapped in a cute baby blue blanket. I'm certain you will find that you love him more than you thought possible! :winkwink:

Pippin, did you do the digi yet? Eager minds want to know! :blush: Pics please!!! :haha:


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## Pippin

Hi ladies, didn't need to do a digi as I got this at work :blush: saving the digi for next weekend to see 2-3 (hopefully)
 



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## Shiv

Good strong line - no doubt about that Pip - congratulations! :happydance:

i am getting a tad jealous of all these BFP's now!


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## ashnbump

Well I've just done another clearblue digi, and now it's 3+ yaaaay!!! So that's good right? I only tested 5 days ago an that said 1-2!! I expected 2-3 but not 3+!!

Gosh I hope it's not twins haha! :wacko: I've not felt as sick today, was a bit sick this morning but the rest of the day was better, I read that morning sickness starts bad around 6 weeks so not too worried about that! My boobies are still sore so always a good sign! I took a new pic so I'll post asap, the novelty never wears off for me lol!

I'm having a bit of a dilemma, we have an 8month old cocker spaniel, who we love, but realistically wen new baby comes we will have our hands VERY VERY full, we are thinking of finding him a new home, as we won't have the time for him, and maybe someone else would be able to give him the love and attention he will need, but I feel so guilty! I believe a dog is for life, but he will be so left out! What should I do!?

Anyway....

Thanks for the reassuring words Kim!

AE- I'm sure you will become used to the idea eventually, it must be hard when u were so sure u were going to have another girl! Whatever you think and feel now, will be washed away with love the moment you see him! And the topic of names, did u consider Alfie or Charlie? I know they are popular now but Im not a big fan of older names so that's my best efforts right there haha!

Pip- let's see these positive test picsssss! Hope the digi was a success!


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## ashnbump

Huge congrats pip! So happy for you and what a lovely strong line too! Xxxx


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## Kimberly28

Ash, :thumbup: going from 1-2 to 3+ is awesome! I think you gotta keeper cooking in that oven of yours. :happydance: For now, try to not worry and just relax and enjoy your pregnancy. When I was preg with Bry, some days the ms was worse than others and then sometimes in 1st tri I'd have a day here and there with no ms which while concerning, was a relief haha. With my mmc I had ms for a week and then it disappeared completely. Other than that the rest of my symptoms remained so I think you're doing just fine Ash. 
As for the doggie, I really don't know what to tell you. I'm sorry I cant be of more help. You could wait it out and see how it goes once new baby has arrived if you want. It's really up to you and OH. Good luck with that hun! Take care and rest lots. :hugs:

Pip! Great line hun!! Looking good for sure! :thumbsup:


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## Pippin

Yay for the 3+ Ash :yipee:

Shiv I hope you aren't too far behind. I reckon we are all going to go through it together again give or take a month or two. 

I'm trying to be super positive and try not to worry. I was fine with Sam so I shouldn't be looking back at the one we lost. I'm fine about that one now, hard at the time but it wasn't meant to be. 

Kimberly28 we waited one cycle before trying again and never dreamed we'd be lucky first time. We even said it'll be a bit of a practice. 

What's our secret you all all ask??? Well we only dtd once with both this one and the last :shock: just can't believe it :happydance: I'm going to sprinkle lots of fertile :dust: over you all ok??? :haha: ..... oh god that sounds rude sorry :blush:


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## Pippin

Yay for the 3+ Ash :yipee:

Shiv I hope you aren't too far behind. I reckon we are all going to go through it together again give or take a month or two. 

I'm trying to be super positive and try not to worry. I was fine with Sam so I shouldn't be looking back at the one we lost. I'm fine about that one now, hard at the time but it wasn't meant to be. 

Kimberly28 we waited one cycle before trying again and never dreamed we'd be lucky first time. We even said it'll be a bit of a practice. 

What's our secret you all all ask??? Well we only dtd once with both this one and the last :shock: just can't believe it :happydance: I'm going to sprinkle lots of fertile :dust: over you all ok??? :haha: ..... oh god that sounds rude sorry :blush:


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## Shiv

You are like Mr and Mrs Fertile! maybe i can persuade my DH that we should only be doing it once a month :haha:

Yay for 3+ Ash, maybe it's triplets!

Kim - any spotting yet? hope not!


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## Kimberly28

Not yet Shiv! Knock on wood!! I still feel "out" this month though. :wacko: But I'm hoping I'm wrong. Gonna have to wait and see. If the spotting doesn't start during the weekend, then I guess there is a chance that I might be preggers. Just gonna have to wait and see and not getting my hopes up.


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## Boothh

pip :hugs: :happydance: i am so so happy for you words cant explain!! i hope ill be posting mine up soon! im waiting til after we come back ive decided! im not going to go on any rough rides and ill wait, the later i know the better for my paranoia!! xx


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## Pippin

Boothh said:


> pip :hugs: :happydance: i am so so happy for you words cant explain!! i hope ill be posting mine up soon! im waiting til after we come back ive decided! im not going to go on any rough rides and ill wait, the later i know the better for my paranoia!! xx

Thanks hon, goodness I hope this is your month. You are so good, I wouldn't be able to wait that's for sure but I'm rubbish like that. I have everything crossed for you.


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## Pippin

*Shiv* I've been calling my husband Mr Super Sperm :haha: He's as shocked as I am :dohh:


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## ashnbump

Quick pic! Yaaaaaay!!!!! Xx

https://i727.photobucket.com/albums/ww276/slimshadyluva/ebc1a512.jpg


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## Boothh

yaay thats surely a good sign ash!! :D xxx


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## ashnbump

Flippin hope so! Really hope u get ur bfp Hun! Im crossing my fingers tightly for u! Xxx


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## Kimberly28

Good grief Boothh! :dohh: You have a helluva lot more patience than I do! The anticipation is killing me! :haha: I'd be going out of my mind with curiosity! I guess props to you for holding out. 

Ash, great pic hun! :happydance:

Still no spotting on my end... *knocks on wood* Low, firm, closed cervix and had a little creamy cm today too. So keeping my fingers crossed and hoping for the best but preparing for the worst too, just in case.


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## Kimberly28

ashnbump said:


> Flippin hope so! Really hope u get ur bfp Hun! Im crossing my fingers tightly for u! Xxx

Hey! What about me?? :p :haha: (kidding)


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## ashnbump

My toes are crossed for you Kim lol! Gosh how gud would it be if we all got our bfp's in the same month! 

Is that good about the cervix then Kim? Xxx


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## Kimberly28

That would be great if we all did! I know that a closed cervix is good. I just read on google that low and firm is usually indicative of AF coming. Usually during pregnancy the cervix goes high, soft, and closed. However they also said that the cervix can change from the low firm position to a high position either before the bfp or even weeks after. So I dunno. I'm trying to be hopeful but I just have this feeling that I'm out this month. :( But I know it's not over until AF arrives so I'm hoping to be pleasantly surprised honestly. 

Has anyone heard from Cleck?? Cleck where are you and did AF find you? Hoping she's a no show!!! :hugs:


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## Pippin

Kimberly28 in the nicest possible way I want to say.......... STOP FEELING YOU CERVIX HON! :haha: :hugs: seriously though it can cause infection and introduce bacteria. Not good for potential beans. Not that I don't think you wash your hands or anything but when I researched it a lot of advice was it's not a good thing to do even when you're really sterile. Saying that though many women do but just wanted to say :blush: hope you don't mind.


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## cleckner04

I'm here I'm here! My BnB has been actin up the past few days same as some other US girls on here but stircrazy fixed it. :happydance: Still no AF here. Not even any signs of it really. But no signs of pregnancy either. Unless you count random heartburn but I think it'd be way too early to get heartburn. :haha:


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## Kimberly28

:-O Cleck, maybe you're in for a bfp too! :test: :test:

Pippin: I understand. I do actually wash my hands very well first and I use a sterile latex glove to ensure no infection occurs. :blush:


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## cleckner04

Well I changed my ticker on the front because it's not correct for some reason. So I put it as a 33 day cycle since last month was 33 days. So I'll wait until than before even thinking of testing. I'm out of tests anyways so it makes things a bit easier. :haha:


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## Kimberly28

My ticker on the front is wrong too. :haha: I'm 8 dpo, not 5 dpo haha. Prolly gonna be a 28-30 day cycle. Unless I get surprised with a bfp. ;)


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## cleckner04

I think I must've chose the wrong site for tickers because mine shouldn't have been wrong. :dohh: I have good intentions with the tickers but they aren't working too well. :haha:


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## Kimberly28

I know you had good intentions Cleck. It's not your fault. We'll just have to make do I suppose. :hugs:


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## spidey

Pippin- I am sooo happy for you!!! :happydance: :happydance: :happydance:


I have to tell you girls something


Spoiler
I have never felt my own cervix :haha:

Now that everyone is looking... we dtd tonight so according to the ticker which might not actually be right :haha: I might have a shot this month if I'm ovulating. I haven't had a speck of ewcm so I really doubt it. DH keeps telling me to put my legs in the air but I refuse to do that. Really, he should be posting on here and not me because I'm not too bothered with the whole thing, although I must admit I'm a tiny bit jealous of all the bfp's!!! I can't wait to follow you girls thru your next pregnancies!


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## cleckner04

I've never felt my cervix either spidey. I wouldn't even know what to feel for. :haha: Well hopefully YOUR ticker is right and you're ovulating soon. ;) I used to stick my legs in the air when trying for Emma. Haven't done it this time around yet. I always feel like a goof. 

I'm a bit jealous of all the BFPs so far too. But I think I need to get used to it cause I'm sure there are plenty of new BFPs to come from you girls. :p


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## ashnbump

I'm hoping for some more bfp's too! Two of U's getting one so far is brill! I think this month is the one lol! We all got preg this time two years ago!

I've never felt my cervix, wouldn't have a clue what it was to be honest!haha! I'll leave all that stuff to my doctor!

So I'm at work today, and I feel like, well, like shit! It's like I'm hungover not pregnant! I don't feel very preggo, other than the sickness and boobies etc, do u feel pregnant pip? I think it'll all become real once I've had my booking visit and I've got a date for my scan, once I've had my 12 week scan and I know everything is ok, I'll announce it! A lot of people know at work, because I work in a high risk environment with heavy machinery I had to tell all my supervisors and my department managers, otherwise beanie would be at risk! I didn't want anyone to know until 12 weeks but what can I do, it's done now!

Any other symptoms girls? 

I wonder who'll be next!!? 

Xx


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## Boothh

iv never felt my cervix either, i wouldnt know what i was doing, and i cant get anything up there myself anyway i dunno why maybe i am just superrr tight :rofl:

i felt abit queezy this morning, hung over type but i didnt drink last night, seems to be wearing off now iv had a cup of tea, and boobs are still hurting oh and i keep being a right bitch to stuart lol

i dunno whats goin on im not gunna test though til after holiday, 

jesse is being the biggest whinge ever today its really getting on my last nerve i dunno whats up with him hes just having a tantrum at every little thing! right now hes kicking himself around on the floor because he cant open the washing machine door cus its on!! :dohh:


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## Shiv

I'm a cervix feeling virgin too!

Boothh, it all sounds like good signs to me, enjoy DL, no idea how you have the patience not to test though!

I think I am going to go to Boots today to stock up on some pregnancy tests if they are on offer!


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## ashnbump

Boothh I so want u to test! But I'm not forcing u lol! I'm convinced ur up the duffer anyway so I don't need you to poas haha!

Kara has been a little witch as of recent, very bad temper on her! So ur not alone!

Xxxx


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## ashnbump

Shiv - the clear blue were still on offer last night, I paid about £7.50 for a twin pack of clear blue plus's and £11.99 for a twin pack of clear blue digi's, it's £9 for a digi on it's own, so bargain double packs I say!

Didn't see any otherbrands on offer though only clear blue! When are you going to test? I'm excited for you all lolxxx


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## Shiv

I won't be testing until about 25th Nov - aaaaaaaaaaaaaaages away!


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## Boothh

i might go buy some today and leave em til we come back though if i have em in the house then i know ill cave! i hate gettin a bfn so i wanna be really sure ill get a bfp before i do one, if my nipples go dark ill do one hahaha x


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## ashnbump

Itd be such a shaaaaammmmeee to miss out on that bargain tho! Haha cave cave cave! I understand 100% why you want to wait tho! Xxx


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## Kimberly28

Good morning ladies. I just woke up haha. Well my BBT took a huge spike this morning. So who knows. Still no spotting so far (knock on wood) and hoping it stays that way. My most consistent signs are fatigue and hunger. It's strange because I do feel very blah/run down/kinda hungover this morning too. No headache or nausea or anything, just very drowsy and blah. I guess we will see. :shrug: IF I don't start spotting over the weekend and my BBT stays up so high into Tuesday morning, I might test on a FRER then. 
You UK laides are so lucky! The pregnancy tests are much more expensive over here. The clear blue (non digi) are almost $20 a box and the digis are almost $30 a box and that's for only 3 tests!! It's insane! Even the FRER goes for about $15 and if it's the digi one (the "yes" "no" one) that goes for $20-$25. It really sucks. But oh well. When ya gotta know, you gotta know. ;)

Ash, that definitely sounds like pregnancy symptoms. I want to remind you that some days will be worse and you will really feel sick and lousy and some days will be lighter with the intensity of the symptoms but that is no reason to panick. It's simply your body getting used to it and your hcg leveling off after increasing again. The hormones during pregnancy will do that and will seem to roll like waves. So get ready hehe. I feel very certain that all will be just fine with your little beanie, but I do understand your worry and fear. :hugs: I'm gonna be just as bad about it myself I'm sure. :blush:

Boothh, I cant believe you're not testing haha. I definitely admire your patience. :flower:

Cleck, any sign of AF yet? When are u testing?? :haha:


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## Pippin

:rofl: lots of cervix virgins :winkwink: glad you do it the right way Kim I always worry when I see people check it. Horror stories and all that. I have to admit I tried once and then didn't have a clue, read up on it and then was convinced never to try again, plus I couldn't find it :rofl:

Boothh you are sooo go, I'm on the side of I rather know before AF arrives rather than get her coming as a shock. I counted myself out a number of times this month but here I am :yipee:

We all have to be pregnant again at the same time, it's just not an option not to be :haha: 
:bunny::dust: [-o&lt; :dust::bunny:


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## Boothh

i did a test and got a bfn!! i dont mind though cus it means im not paranoid on holiday! and tbh i think its wayy too early as by my calculations im not even due AF til next sunday! :D xx


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## Boothh

and ash ill send you my paypal so you can refund me for that waste of money test :rofl:


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## Shiv

go and have a blast on all the big scary rides Boothh without worrying and then test agin when you get back if AF hasn't shown up!

I am all stocked up on pregnancy tests, now I just have to try to reisist poas until I am at least 12dpo! aaaaaaaaaaaaargh I hate the tww and to top it off I think I am getting a cold boo hiss, damn DH for passing on his germs!


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## Kimberly28

LOL Pippin! (About the "we have to be pregnant again together, it's not an option" comment.) I dunno why I feel like I am out this month but I just do. I'm convinced that I'm not pregnant. However my BBT took a good sized spike this morning and I've had a couple little pulling like twinges this morning too and just feeling very tired and blah. However on the cm front, I'm a bit dry today. So who knows. :shrug: I do wish I knew one way or the other but I think it's too early to test yet so I'm waiting till Tuesday. Also I normally get spotting for almost a week before AF (or at least the past 2-3 cycles I have) and normally it starts on 8 dpo. Today is 9 dpo and still no spotting (knock on wood) so I want to take that as a good sign in hopes that it means that a bean implanted in time for my uterine lining to not begin to break down and spotting to start and thus I'm pregnant but of course that remains to be seen.
I'd really LOVE for us all to be pregnant again together! That would just be awesome!! 

Pippin, what were your first signs that convinced you to test for pregnancy? ie ms? loads of cm? fatigue? hunger? nausea? etc etc. I wish I could remember what I had going on when I got my bfp with Bry. All I do remember for sure about that was excessive thirst. After I got my bfp the peeing picked up and hunger did too and then a week later nausea hit. But I really cant remember pre bfp. :wacko: 

Cleck, where are you hun? Did AF find you? 

Boothh... so are you saying that you're not gonna test unless u know it will be a bfp OR just suddenly be hit by AF? I understand not wanting to see a bfn and how disappointing it is but at the same time, I think it's better to know for sure if it's bfn and AF still doesn't arrive. Because if that happens then you know something isn't right and will know to get to the doctor's and figure it out. At least for the sake of your health. If nothing else I'd urge you to test just to rule that out so that you know that everything is ok (instead of abnormal without a pregnancy).

Shiv, awww it will be here before you know it! Especially with the holidays upon us and so much preparing to do the time goes right by. :winkwink:


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## Pippin

Boothh said:


> i did a test and got a bfn!! i dont mind though cus it means im not paranoid on holiday! and tbh i think its wayy too early as by my calculations im not even due AF til next sunday! :D xx

You are as bad as me I started at 7dpo and I got shed loads of :bfn: until 11dpo. Quite depressing really so I do understand the need to hold off. Take some away with you :haha: Fingers crossed for you in about 5 days time.


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## Pippin

Shiv said:


> go and have a blast on all the big scary rides Boothh without worrying and then test agin when you get back if AF hasn't shown up!
> 
> I am all stocked up on pregnancy tests, now I just have to try to reisist poas until I am at least 12dpo! aaaaaaaaaaaaargh I hate the tww and to top it off I think I am getting a cold boo hiss, damn DH for passing on his germs!

Good plan :thumbup: well maybe 10 dpo :haha: btw I got what I thought was a cold with this pregnancy and with Sam look what happened :winkwink: I was also freezing right before I got that first bfp. So cold in bed it was horrible. Then nothing came of it and I don't have a cold so I'm convinced it' the pregnancy. Sam has a cold too so I totally expected to get it. With the one I lost I didn't but it was summer. I also hope getting that cold feeling is a good sign with this one. Getting lots of stretching pains tonight (not very af like) so I'm hopeful :yipee:


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## Boothh

i knowww i only tested cus ash made me *points* hahaha :rofl: with my cycles being quite long its hit and miss when i am 'late' etc but im not too fussed, i did the test when we were out so i didnt look and stare for too long at it, when i looked earlier it has a faint line but im thinking evap though im not sure when it arrived, its very squinty and cant get it to show up with camera, so im gunna wait til were back now AND IM LEAVING THE TESTS AT HOME SO DONT TEMPT ME!! :p


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## Kimberly28

Hi ladies. Well I'm exhausted but I had a fun afternoon. We knew that Bryson's favorite characters from the Sprout channel would be at the mall for a meet this afternoon and we knew it was a one time opportunity so we went and took Bry thinking oh how great this is going to be! So we get there and get in line to meet Sean and Chicka. We're in line during a "break time" for Sean so of course the line stops and we all stand and wait. Suddenly we see Sean walking past the line of all us families, moms, dads, siblings, and kids when all of the kids Sean could have stopped to say hello to, he stops and speaks to Bryson! I was so thrilled and honored and Bryson was like " I recognize this guy but I don't know what to make of this". He had the most confused look on his face hehe. I don't think Bryson realizes that the people on tv are real people haha. Bryson LOVES Sean and Chicka and every time he sees them on tv on Sprout he goes up to the tv and is glued to it. So it's finally our turn to see Sean and Chicka, we step up to them and Sean says "Hi Bryson!" Bryson is like "ok, I still cant figure this out but that's ok..and then Chicka comes up into her nest from below it and starts talking just like on the show to Bryson and suddenly he gets this look on his face like he isn't sure if he's ok anymore and then gradually gets to the point of crumpling up his face and he busts into tears and cries!! lol!! I know I shouldn't laugh but it was still so cute! Haha. :haha: Poor Sean felt bad. I could tell by the look on his face. He's a daddy himself so he hates seeing kids upset. Chicka kept trying to cheer Bry up too by blowing kisses haha. So that part didn't go so well but he did enjoy watching them with other kids from a little bit of a distance away. I know that they took a pic but I don't know how bad it's gonna be haha. They said that the pic will be available in 72 hours so I'll see about it then. It was still fun though and very cool to get to meet them that we see on tv everyday. :thumbup: If you wanna see what I'm talking about go to www.sproutonline.com and then click on 'The Sunnyside Up Show'. :)
Cleck, you might be able to get it out there in California since you are here in the USA.
Anyhoo, so yeah it was fun but I am tired now. Still no spotting (knock on wood it will stay that way). Personal TMI question time... so DH and I BD'ed this morning and this evening I had what seemed to be ewcm. But I'm betting it could be leftovers from this morning. However after it being all day long and walking around the mall all afternoon long, would it still be leftovers in there from that? Or could that actually be my stuff? :haha: :blush: AF is due Friday of this coming week. I'm thinking about testing on Monday morning or Tuesday morning. I still feel like I'm out this month though. Oh and I feel chilly and cold here tonight even though hubby says it's very warm in here. I don't have a fever either, I checked. :shrug:

Pippin, what were your first signs?

Ash, what were your first signs about a week before AF was due/before you got your bfp? 

Boothh, I'm sorry about the bfn. :( Maybe it's just too early still? Defo go to DL and have a good time and just don't go on the really shaky rides. 

Well I better get off the computer here and get to bed. I'm worn out. Talk to you all tomorrow. Hopefully my BBT stays this high and no spotting. Keep your fingers crossed for me please everyone! :blush:


----------



## cleckner04

Sorry I didn't get on today DH played paintball and we spent the rest of the day at Chuck E. Cheese. Where a kid can be a kid! :rofl: 

No AF and I bought cheap pregnancy tests at Target today and took one tonight without holding urine though and it was negative. BOOO! I don't think I'm pregnant either this month. I think I'm definitely out until June now. WTT here I come! :haha:


----------



## Pippin

Sorry *Kim* hon I missed that bit in your first post sorry just seen it :hugs: *my first signs*:

Well firstly you going to never believe this but with all three pregnancies and with none of the failed cycled I felt like there was f*lutterings/spasms in my uterus* for about a minute and in a very specific place. Always my first clue. Not not sure what is is but happened every time at 7 dpo (Sam and the MMC) and 8dpo (this one). I have my own theories but they sound stupid, implantation, but everyone says you can't feel that but I definitely felt something every time and exactly the same feeling. I've never told anyone that on here becuase it sounds stupid :blush:. Anyway then about a day after that my *boobs start*, hot and heavy at first, not all day, mainly when I'm resting or braless, then after a few days I get the stabbing pains mostly under my arms and both still happen now. All three times I just 'knew' I was pregnant which is why I tested so early this one (big mistake very frustrating until 11dpo try to hold off). Then I get *AF type pains* (still do) but not the same as normal AF, more hot and pulling than that dragging ache. Lastly a bit of *heartburn* and that's it really. Oh with *CM* is was dry and watery until 12ish dpo when it became creamy and more abundant. Trying to think if there was anything else. With my last pregnancy I felt nauseous from 7dpo but this one nothing yet, same with Sam. That didn't start till 6 weeks so maybe this one is another boy although I have already got a fetal name of Lolly as in Lollypop, super sticky I hope :winkwink: Lolly is a girls name and it feels right so I'm confused with gender this time. I knew Sam was a boy and I'm pretty sure the last one was a girl. I don't care as long as I go full term and it's healthy. Lastly *round ligament pain* started last night, quite painful, not here this morning and I don't remember it with the MMC so I'm hoping it's got in nice and deep ready for a good blood supply from me to keep it growing past that 6 weeks mark!

Anyway hope that helps. GOOD LUCK :thumbup:


----------



## Pippin

cleckner04 said:


> Sorry I didn't get on today DH played paintball and we spent the rest of the day at Chuck E. Cheese. Where a kid can be a kid! :rofl:
> 
> No AF and I bought cheap pregnancy tests at Target today and took one tonight without holding urine though and it was negative. BOOO! I don't think I'm pregnant either this month. I think I'm definitely out until June now. WTT here I come! :haha:

Sorry you are out hon :cry: you never know it could be a late shower. This one was a couple of days after I normally show too (luckily they are rising nicely as I was worrying). [-o&lt; I'm not remotely religious but having a little prey for you :haha:


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## ashnbump

Boothh- at least they were on offer lol! You can have a great time in DLP now and then when you get back test again, I'm not certain ur out just yet!

Cleck- maybe just maybe you cold be in a bfs (big fat surprise) bfp lol!

Kim- I didn't really have many symptoms other than a bit sore boobies and I was tired! But I guess deep down as soon as my AF didn't show I knew I was preggo!

Pippin - I'm glad we are on this journey together cos it's flippin scary! According to my doctor I'm 5weeks 3days today, seems so unimportant lol, can't wait to get my letter for my booking visit & scan! Your symptoms are more or less the same as mine except I am suffering with nausea! Have you noticed ur sense of taste and smell has increased? Things smell so bad from miles away haha it gets my gut rolling!


I really cannot wait for first tri to be over i forgot how dreadful it was! But at least we've got a busy few weeks ahead with christmas shopping and getting ready for Xmas, which is just around the corner, then new year etc then hopefully (if not before) scan time! Just can't wait for that, I will relax a teeny bit then lol xx


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## Pippin

Tus a bit scary isn't is Ash, I just want to get to 7 weeks first and see the baby alive. Can't focus beyond that really as that is when it all went wrong last time. I can't connect with this pregnancy yet as I'm still in disbelief it happened that quickly again! All a bit surreal really.

I must make an appointment tomorrow with the doctor, he might even give me a reassurance scan if I can find the courage to ask. What do you think?


----------



## Boothh

I would deffo ask for a scan pippin I bet they will give you one, I even got reassurance bloods with my 2nd mc (turned out not so reassurring lol) 

My boobs are still hurting and I feel really tired so maybe I'm still in with a chance xx


----------



## ashnbump

How did/do you go about ressurance scans/bloods? I'd like something like that, but I think I'd want to wait as long as poss for a scan so then I can see anproper baby lol! Iykwim?

Are you going to have a private scan pip? 

Although I know I shouldn't google I do and I read last night that most mc's happen before 9weeks and mms are the rarest, don't know how much 'truth' is in it but I read it all the same lol!

Boothh- I don't want to set u up fir disappointment but I really think ull get ur bfp in a few more days! I really hope so anyway!

Xx


----------



## ashnbump

How did/do you go about ressurance scans/bloods? I'd like something like that, but I think I'd want to wait as long as poss for a scan so then I can see anproper baby lol! Iykwim?

Are you going to have a private scan pip? 

Although I know I shouldn't google I do and I read last night that most mc's happen before 9weeks and mms are the rarest, don't know how much 'truth' is in it but I read it all the same lol!

Boothh- I don't want to set u up fir disappointment but I really think ull get ur bfp in a few more days! I really hope so anyway!

Xx


----------



## Kimberly28

So after passing out at only 10:45pm from total exhaustion (very unlike me) I broke down and tested this am and bfn. :cry: I shouldn't of tested. I wish I waited but oh well. My bbt is still up pretty high and still no spotting so I'm hoping it was just too early. Is 48 hrs after what might of been an implant dip on my chart, too early still for a bfp even on a frer? Sigh, I'm probably out but I'm trying to hold onto hope if possible. :(


----------



## ashnbump

Kim I think the earliest you can test even with a frer is 4 days before the day your period is due, and even then it can be inaccurate! My advice wait till AF is a day away! I'm sure u'll get a surprise! X


----------



## Shiv

Kim - give it a good few days and test - I think 2 days post implantation is definitely too early to get a BFP. Glad you had a good day yesterday, keep your chin up :flower:

Ash, I had a private scan at around 8 weeks and it is definitely baby like by then, so I would ask the dr , the worst he can say is no, an dthen you haven't lost anything!

So I am madly spotting symptoms - well not exactly symptom spotting but experiencing things that are different from my past cycles (I cannot for the life of my remember whay me cycles were like post Sophia and certainly wasn't really paying attention to signs when I fell pregnant with Sophia) - so over the last day I have experienced

WIND! lots of it including some of it trapped which is actually feling like little bubbles in my lower belly. 

SPOTS. now i do get spots prior to AF, but usually only a few days before now 12 days before

EMOTIONAL - I welled up several times yesterday (including X-Factor :blush:)

Now I *think* i ovulated between monday- wednesday - so there is NO WAY any of these things are pregnancy related as implantation wouldn't have even happened yet - so mainly I blame you KIM for making me go crazy :haha:

I would put my chances at actually being pregnant at about 20% this month so very unlikely!


----------



## ashnbump

So do I just ask the doctor if I'd be able to have an early scan
Because I'm worried? I never knew it was baby like at 8 weeks that's nice to know :thumbup:

I was like that last month shiv, symptom spotting eight after ov, I agree, it's all the talk of symptoms lol! 20% is still a bloody good shot! Around 300,000,000 sperm get ejaculated into the vag, it only takes one and maybe just maaaaaaybe that one made it this cycle! Hahaha xxx


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## ashnbump

Bloody iPhone doing a trillion double posts grrrrrrrr


----------



## Boothh

ash i sort of think i might be and its too early too i never really get sore boobs ever only times are when ive been pregnant so i dunno i cant think of anything else it could be! when i went to the docs i said i was really paranoid cus id only had a mmc 2months earlier and would it be possible to get some bloods done, which he did and he was arranging a scan for me when i started bleeding and had an early mc, 

also when i got my bfp with jesse i was nearly 6weeks pregnant and the lines were only really faint and with my other 2 pregnancy they both were quite faint positives too so maybe my pee is just not that good for pregnancy tests haha xx


----------



## Vici

Sorry i've not been about girls, am at the in laws for the weekend. Had to pop on just to see if there was any news :)

One thing i have to say is OMG, Pip, you just described my symptoms to a t, quite scary in fact!! Keeping my fingers crossed xx


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## ashnbump

Hoth times I've done a home test, with kara and this baby I've headstrong positives, no doubt about it! I don't know if that's good or not? I think I'm just gonna leave the doctors, I have no reason to worry as of yet, yes I've had a mc before but I went on to have an almost healthy pregnancy and a healthy baby, I need to get it out of my head that alm pregnancies end badly, because realistically, they don't! Mc's are common but not as common as we all think, because there's a large collection of us in here things evidently look more common lol!

Im gonna wait just like u did with kara, Shes here and she's perfect! No reason newbaby shouldn't be either! 

Newbaby,listen here mummy will see u in about 6-7 weeks, keep cookin! Haha!

Vici - ur symptoms sound promising! 

X


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## Kimberly28

Shiv, LOL! I'm sorry, I didn't mean to! :blush:

Ash, thanks for the reassurance. I tell you what though, normally I don't smell my wee when I'm using the restroom and now I smell it strongly. :wacko: And not because I'm trying to either. :haha: I'm also so exhausted this morning. Blah. I better go, bry is fussing. Ugh! Back later.


----------



## Pippin

Vici said:


> Sorry i've not been about girls, am at the in laws for the weekend. Had to pop on just to see if there was any news :)
> 
> One thing i have to say is OMG, Pip, you just described my symptoms to a t, quite scary in fact!! Keeping my fingers crossed xx

:haha: hope so :thumbup:

*Ash* only asking for a scan because of the mmc, wouldn't otherwise as they would say no straight away. They only do if you bleed at my hospital. I bet he says no anyway but I'll try. Yes I'm going to go for a private scan at 7 weeks. I always do just for my sanity! 

*Kim* sorry it's a bfn, too early still though, step away from the tests. Believe I know :blush:

*Shiv* forgot a bout the wind, yes I've been windy for about 4 days now so pretty much when I got the first faint line. Massive PMA coming your way:bunny:


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## ashnbump

Pip- I don't blame you hum, if I wasn't scared I'd either go private or beg the dr, but I think in my case I'm best to wait, if anything happens between now and my 12 week scan, chances are I'll know, right? It's not thaaaaat long to wait haha. Only about 6weeks! It'll kill me but I'll try stay busy!

Kim- loooovvvveeeelllyyy lol, smelly wee, always good to know hahaha! Maybe just maybe ur cookin a baby!

Gosh girls I'm so tired I can't wait to finish work and go home! I'm actually, as sad as it is, thinking of getting the Xmas decs out tonight and erecting the tree early lol! Or Is that a bit toooooo early! I'm excited to see kara see it lol xx


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## Kimberly28

Ash, I hope so!! I guess we will see.

Pippin, no worries, I'm staying away from the tests. To be honest, I'm not a poas addict. I hate seeing bfn so not testing again wont be a problem for me. AF is due on Thursday or Friday. I think I will wait till Friday to test. Maybe even Saturday, just to be safe (if AF isn't here by then). 

Call me nuts but I'm already worrying about "what if I am pregnant and my symptoms aren't going right like lack of ms kinda like last time when I had my mmc?" :blush: With my mmc I had ms for about a week and then it was gone. Deep down I felt like something just wasn't quite right and I even kinda knew it was going to result in a loss. :( It's stupid I know but I'm already worried that IF I am preg that this one could too. :dohh: I'm sure that even if I am that it's too early for ms yet. ASH, I blame you!!! :blush: *points* :haha: Once I get my bfp I'm definitely getting to my doc immediately for bloods and going to ask for a reassurance scan. I'm sure she will be willing to oblige.


----------



## Kimberly28

Quick question for you prego ladies! Did either of you ever (before bfp) get a sudden sharp pain in one boob for a few seconds and then have it stop and be fine again after that? I just had that happen to me while feeding Bry a minute ago and that is very strange for me. :wacko: It was in my right boob. Really weird. :blush:


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## Boothh

kim STOP IT!!! your gunna symptom spot yourself to death hun :hugs:!!

as for me boobs are still sore, and i keep feeling light headed today and got loads of cm! 

only one more sleep til we go on holiday! just dropped jesse off with my mum and i didnt wanna say goodbye he was being so cute!! :( xx


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## Shiv

Boothh - have an AMAZING time in DL!

Kim - I agree with Boothh, you need to slow down on the symptom spotting, you will send yourself crazy (you have every right to tell me the same thing in a few days time :haha:)


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## Kimberly28

alright alright! :haha: I wasn't even paying attention when it happened though! :sulk:


----------



## Shiv

Kimberly28 said:


> alright alright! :haha: I wasn't even paying attention when it happened though! :sulk:

hahahhahaha oh Kim i know exactly what you are going through but at least your tww ends before mine!:hugs:


----------



## Pippin

Kimberly28 said:


> Quick question for you prego ladies! Did either of you ever (before bfp) get a sudden sharp pain in one boob for a few seconds and then have it stop and be fine again after that? I just had that happen to me while feeding Bry a minute ago and that is very strange for me. :wacko: It was in my right boob. Really weird. :blush:

No don't think so but they are killing me now with the stabs! Always the sign for me I'm pregnant is the hot heavy boobs which turns to stabbing under the arm.


----------



## Shiv

Well I just had a good grope of my boobs here and no pain :haha:


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## Kimberly28

Well, I've begun to spot now. It's hot/fluorescent pink and only when I wipe but it's there and now I'm sure that I must be out. :cry: Now I get to wait for the nasty witch to make her appearance. :(


----------



## Pippin

Kimberly28 said:


> Well, I've begun to spot now. It's hot/fluorescent pink and only when I wipe but it's there and now I'm sure that I must be out. :cry: Now I get to wait for the nasty witch to make her appearance. :(

Is this normal before AF?



Shiv said:


> Well I just had a good grope of my boobs here and no pain :haha:

You go girl :rofl: I don't need to grab mine they scream at me some of the time or just like this :holly:


----------



## Kimberly28

Pippin said:


> Kimberly28 said:
> 
> 
> Well, I've begun to spot now. It's hot/fluorescent pink and only when I wipe but it's there and now I'm sure that I must be out. :cry: Now I get to wait for the nasty witch to make her appearance. :(
> 
> Is this normal before AF?
> 
> *nods* :cry:Click to expand...


----------



## ashnbump

pip do your symptoms seem to be worse some days and then not so bad others?

my boobies arent AS sore today, and the nausea isnt as bad, although saying that ive been mega busy all day and now ive stopped i feel like im swaying again lol!

does your lower back ache? as in period aches? mine is achey all day long, worse when im sat than when im standing! 

i cant stop worrying, what should i do? i dont want to waste the doctors time by booking an appointment etc!

kim - so sorry ur getting ur pre AF spotting :( fingers tightly crossed for next cycle! xxx


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## Shiv

aw Kim I'm sorry you think the witch is on her way.............but you never know until she actually arrives.

We just have to be patient, it can take time, and remember you are trying to make your princess so it may take longer as you are hoping to kill of those nasty boy spermies! It will happen.......:hugs:


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## Boothh

stuart deffo thinks im pregnant now as i burst into tears when aiden went last night on xfactor lmao i was actually quite hysterical! im not really a big cryer either so its even more unusual!

i held my fmu til like 12pm today deciding whether to do the other test and eventually decided against it! so ill wait til im back!!

were setting off at 11pm tonight and im soo excited! stressed though trying to remember if iv done everything! x


----------



## Kimberly28

Thanks Ash and Shiv. My BBT is still quite high and my chart is actually starting to look triphasic but I know that that still isn't a guarantee. *sigh* I'm going to call my doc today and see if I can get in on Wed and get her to sneak in a quick ultrasound. If my lining is still nice and thick at that point it could mean I'm pregnant afterall and maybe this is just implant (even tho I doubt it). I also need to speak with her about the week long spotting that I get every cycle as it could be low progesterone which would present a problem and could probably hamper my TTC efforts and even make sustaining a pregnancy impossible and would need to be put on supplemental progesterone to sustain me and a pregnancy. It's so frustrating because I didn't have this problem before my mmc and d&c. :( I'm beginning to feel like it keeps trying to haunt me every cycle by doing this. :(
The spotting this morning is brown and very scant/minimal. I'm hoping and praying that it's going to stop and go away completely and prove me wrong. Though I'm not holding my breath not getting any hopes up. At this point I'm counting myself as out so if I'm proven wrong and find out otherwise, it will be a great surprise. I just hope that AF isn't late without a bfp to make all of this harder. :nope:


----------



## Shiv

would your doctor really give you an ultrasound Kim at this stage? no-way would you get one over here (or at least certainly not where I live!). i am keeping my fingers crossed for you hon :hugs:

And Boothh - even i didn't cry when Aiden left - he was a bit boring I think. Althoguh I did cry at Rebacca's song on Saturday! Have a great time!

I am off to Harrogate to visit a friend for a couple of days (David is away all week doing his Masters and didn't fancy staying home alone (well with Sophia!). Dreading the drive, i am going to set off at Sophia's bedtime (with her all in her PJ's and sleeping bag) and hope that she sleeps for the entire journey (will take 5 hours if there is no traffic). wish me luck!


----------



## Boothh

aw shiv harrogate is lovely the wedding we went to a few weeks ago was there and its gorgeous, have fun xxx


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## Kimberly28

Shiv, yeah she probably would because even if I'm not preg, she needs to make sure that there isn't a physical problem going on inside my uterus from which the spotting is coming from. We need to try to find out for certain if I am having low progesterone causing my pre AF spotting for a week before AF during the luteal phase of every cycle. I didn't have this before my mmc so we need to make sure there wasn't any damage caused by the d&c which could explain the spotting. Basically just to cover the bases and rule out more major problems and issues before assuming low progesterone, even though that is probably the culprit. 

Good luck on your drive and I hope Sophia sleeps for you. Drive safe and have fun! Make sure to let us know how the trip went. :hugs:

Btw, Cleck where are you hun and did AF arrive?? It's strange not hearing from you.


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## cleckner04

No AF still :wacko: I usually get a period in the middle of the day though and today is the 33rd day like last month so if it doesn't arrive today or tonight, I'll probably start thinking about getting more tests. I'm almost glad I don't have any in the house because otherwise I'd be testing constantly. :haha: Maybe I should wait a week after no AF just to drive you girls crazy. :winkwink:


----------



## Boothh

well were all packed now, stuart is asleep and im wasting time. today has dragged like you wouldnt believe! well i might pop in once or twice but i might not do! i hope i come back to lots of bfps!! (including mine hopefully!!) xxxx


----------



## Pippin

Boothh said:


> stuart deffo thinks im pregnant now as i burst into tears when aiden went last night on xfactor lmao i was actually quite hysterical! im not really a big cryer either so its even more unusual!
> 
> i held my fmu til like 12pm today deciding whether to do the other test and eventually decided against it! so ill wait til im back!!
> 
> were setting off at 11pm tonight and im soo excited! stressed though trying to remember if iv done everything! x

Take one with you :winkwink: won't hurt will it just in case you really want to know!!!



Kimberly28 said:


> Pippin said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Kimberly28 said:
> 
> 
> Well, I've begun to spot now. It's hot/fluorescent pink and only when I wipe but it's there and now I'm sure that I must be out. :cry: Now I get to wait for the nasty witch to make her appearance. :(
> 
> Is this normal before AF?
> 
> *nods* :cry:Click to expand...
> 
> Awww sorry hon. I'd say wait and see for now. Not sure if a trip to the sonographer will tell you anything really just worry you. :hugs: Although if you are spotting for a long time it could be your progesterone thing??? Worth talking to the doctor about that.
> 
> 
> 
> cleckner04 said:
> 
> 
> No AF still :wacko: I usually get a period in the middle of the day though and today is the 33rd day like last month so if it doesn't arrive today or tonight, I'll probably start thinking about getting more tests. I'm almost glad I don't have any in the house because otherwise I'd be testing constantly. :haha: Maybe I should wait a week after no AF just to drive you girls crazy. :winkwink:Click to expand...
> 
> EEEKKKKKK :test: :haha:
> 
> 
> 
> Boothh said:
> 
> 
> well were all packed now, stuart is asleep and im wasting time. today has dragged like you wouldnt believe! well i might pop in once or twice but i might not do! i hope i come back to lots of bfps!! (including mine hopefully!!) xxxxClick to expand...
> 
> Have fun love and bring back a shiny :bfp: with Micky mouse ears on!!!!Click to expand...


----------



## Kimberly28

Have a great trip Boothh! :hugs: Be safe and I look forward to seeing lots of pics! :wave: Hope you get your bfp when you return. :thumbup:


----------



## spidey

Hey girls I'm still here and reading daily. Boothh- its probably too late but have fun on your trip!!!

Cleckner- I think you should wait another week before testing just to drive us all crazy!!

For me I should have ovulated Saturday according to my ticker and we managed to dtd Friday night. When are you testing Shiv? I'm still not going to test until atleast 1 week late, perhaps 2 just to drive everyone nuts!

Kim- I hope your doctor can check things out for you. You haven't been TTC for that long though, so have faith that your body can grow a healthy baby!


----------



## cleckner04

Well AF still didn't show up tonight. We'll see if she arrives tomorrow. :D If I was really symptom spotting majorly I could say I'm starving today. And I have a headache. But that's about it. ;)


----------



## Kimberly28

I fully believe I'm officially out. I'm sick from a UTI and have a doc appt tomorrow. Just waiting for AF at this point to get here and gone again so I can try again. I have one last shot at a leo baby before that window closes, so to speak. Hopefully maybe 3rd try is the charm. Anyways, I just wanted to let you all know.

Cleck, :test: :test:

Spidey, thanks for the words of confidence hun. I just feel like ever since the mmc that my body has failed me. :cry:

Pippin, it probably is low progesterone. This has been going on since July or August and I spot for about a week before AF which is excessive and isn't normal. So I'm gonna speak to the doc about it tomorrow and see what she says and if we can figure this out to get my body squared away and hopefully conceive next cycle.


----------



## ashnbump

So can any of u advise? Because I'm so paranoid I tested again this morning to see if the line was any darker

https://i727.photobucket.com/albums/ww276/slimshadyluva/8a0e2178.jpg

It was alot darker, so is that good? The positive showed up way before the control line aswel!

I can't find my other tests to compare it too lol but I'm a million % sure it's darker!

Kim- boo to having a uti! Maybe 3rd time is the charm, we got this bfp on our 3rd proper TTC month!

Cleck- omg do u think? Possibly? Maybe!? Excittted! Fingers x'd for a bfp!

Boothh- hope ur enjoying urselves hunny! Bring U's all back a DLP BFP! Xx


----------



## Kimberly28

Yes Ash, that is great! That's what happened when I tested and got my bfp with Bry. I was 4 days late for AF and the test line came up before the control line and was tons darker. It's a great indicator that all is well now quit testing and trust your signs to show you that everything is just fine. :thumbup: :hugs:

Looks like Shiv and I are going to be the only ones without a bfp. :wacko:


----------



## cleckner04

Well, I'm still in limbo land. No AF, took a FRER this morning and I swear I see a shadow but thats probably just where the line is supposed to be and I'm squinting majorly to see it. Like honestly no one else in their right mind would see it, I just have line eye from staring at it so long. :rofl: So goodness knows what is going on. An incredibly late cycle possibly? I've always been able to get a BFP by this point in a cycle so I'm thinking AF must just be late. :wacko:


----------



## Kimberly28

Awww I'm so sorry hun. I know how much that sucks. I was there last cycle and hoping I wont be again this cycle. Hope one or the other shows up soon for you. :hugs:


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## cleckner04

Thanks! The worst part is, we had a chance to try one more cycle because he would've left right around the time I ovulate so we could've done it the days leading up to it and still had a chance IYKWIM. Now that chance is gone. :(


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## spidey

Cleckner- don't give up hope for next cycle. Before I got pregnant with Kira, if I had a very long cycle, the next one would be much shorter as if my body was trying to average them out. So perhaps if AF started tonight, you could ovulate earlier than normal for the next cycle, plus you have the time that the spermies can live inside you. 

So if I wanted to be a super symptom spotter, I had a really bad hot flash today! :haha: Deep down I would love to get pregnant this cycle since that would mean I conceived baby #2 on the same day as Kira, exactly 2 years later. My brother and I were born almost exactly 2 years apart and DH and his brother were born almost exactly 6 years apart. I would love to keep the trend of having babies that are born nearly on the same day but different years. But I figure things will happen as they are meant to be. Getting pregnant this month would also mean another Christmas filled with laying on the bathroom floor and puking- ugh!


----------



## Pippin

cleckner04 said:


> Well, I'm still in limbo land. No AF, took a FRER this morning and I swear I see a shadow but thats probably just where the line is supposed to be and I'm squinting majorly to see it. Like honestly no one else in their right mind would see it, I just have line eye from staring at it so long. :rofl: So goodness knows what is going on. An incredibly late cycle possibly? I've always been able to get a BFP by this point in a cycle so I'm thinking AF must just be late. :wacko:

Cleck I tested positive really late this time. With Sam it was 10 dpo, the one I lost I believe 9 dpo and this one I didn't get the same kind of line really till 12/13dpo. Every pregnancy is different and it can take a day or so difference to implant. Mine all started out with super faint lines that drove me nuts, so you're not out yet, in fact it sounds positive. Check out my lines......

https://www.babyandbump.com/pregnan...self-turn-out-well-more-see-page-1-cb-ic.html



Kimberly28 said:


> I fully believe I'm officially out. I'm sick from a UTI and have a doc appt tomorrow. Just waiting for AF at this point to get here and gone again so I can try again. I have one last shot at a leo baby before that window closes, so to speak. Hopefully maybe 3rd try is the charm. Anyways, I just wanted to let you all know.
> 
> Cleck, :test: :test:
> 
> Spidey, thanks for the words of confidence hun. I just feel like ever since the mmc that my body has failed me. :cry:
> 
> Pippin, it probably is low progesterone. This has been going on since July or August and I spot for about a week before AF which is excessive and isn't normal. So I'm gonna speak to the doc about it tomorrow and see what she says and if we can figure this out to get my body squared away and hopefully conceive next cycle.

Sorry you think you are out hon :growlmad: very annoying. Hope doctors give you some answers or at least a blood test to check what they are at the moment.


----------



## Pippin

cleckner04 said:


> Thanks! The worst part is, we had a chance to try one more cycle because he would've left right around the time I ovulate so we could've done it the days leading up to it and still had a chance IYKWIM. Now that chance is gone. :(

You can catch up to a week before ovulation (slim chance but still) sperm live for about 5 days so it's doable. Some girls on here said they were a week before when I got pregnant last time. I think I was 5 days before too with the last one. This one w dtd on the day f my positive opk, exactly like Sam though.


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## cleckner04

Pip- Don't get me excited like that!! :haha: I know I'm never out until the witch arrives. I wish I had ICs so I could test every few hours. :rofl:


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## Pippin

cleckner04 said:


> Pip- Don't get me excited like that!! :haha: I know I'm never out until the witch arrives. I wish I had ICs so I could test every few hours. :rofl:

Ebay :haha: I ordered 20 when I started thinking I was pregnant and I'm testing everyday to see the line darken. I'm so paranoid I can't tell you, only today did I actually believe I'm pregnant and only for about 5 minutes. Not believing it till I see that heartbeat at 7 weeks. Go buy some more FRER for tomorrow :haha: :test:


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## Pippin

Oh my lord, I suddenly have really stinging nipples because I'm so cold I remember this happening with Sam, ouchy, ouchy damn weather! :finger:

Oh and I'm getting so annoyed with some of the posts in other sections. People can be soooo stupid sometimes. Maybe it's the hormones but I think I'm going to hang out with you guys only. Jeez, I'm sure they do it for effect :dohh:


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## cleckner04

I've noticed it has been very heated on the forum lately. So many arguments and locked threads. In baby club especially. :wacko:


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## cleckner04

Oh and I have 3 more tests left, 2 FRERs and 1 Targets own brand, so I will definitely be testing again tomorrow morning if AF doesn't show up. :D


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## ashnbump

Four words.....

SICK. AS. A. DOG :sick:


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## cleckner04

Well, still no period tonight but I'm crampy so I think it's on it's way. We shall see!


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## spidey

soooo... Cleckner- did AF arrive???


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## ashnbump

cleck - dont be convinced ur out just yet, if you dont remember, i was having period cramps etc, the day i got my bfp! and i was convinced that af was on her way! You just neeeeevvvvvvvvveeeeeeeerrrr know lol!XX


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## Shiv

on my phone so won't write much. 
Cleck are you gonna test again?
Kim how are you today, any more spotting? Hope not 
Spidey cycle buddy any symptoms?

Ash, sorry you feel rotten but a good sign though!


As for me, lots of creamy cm today, don't think I usually get that but who knows!I think I am about 7dpo


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## cleckner04

No AF, and another BFN this morning. :roll:


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## Kimberly28

Shiv, yep, still spotting. Took a test this morning just to be sure and it was bfn. So AF should be here tonight or tomorrow. :( I have a doc appt this afternoon. Oh and lots of cm for you is a good sign! Hopefully it's a good omen! ;)

Ash, awww so sorry hun. But that is a good sign. See, I was right about the hormone fluctuation and thus your ms, boobs, and other signs will vary in severity. At least it's a good sign. :thumbup:

Cleck, I know how you feel. :hugs: You and I both. :dohh:

Spidey, are you in the 2ww?

Pippin, I understand. That's also why I don't hang out in the regular TTC section. I used to back when most of us were ttc our lion cubs but it was nice then. Now it's just gotten way too intense in there, even for me! 

AFM, I will let you all know this evening what the doc said. She might also have my analysis from the post d&c tissue analysis. I guess we will see. Part of me hopes that came back inconclusive meaning nothing wrong that was seen for the mmc to have happened but at the same time it will still leave me with the question of why? Sigh. Part of me wonders if low progesterone was the cause. :shrug: However, I didn't have this problem when I had Bry. Anyways, none of it makes sense right now. I just hope that I'm ok and can and will get pregnant and be able to carry another healthy baby. [-o&lt;


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## spidey

Ash- I hope you feel better soon :hugs: Would you say the ms is worse with this pregnancy or with Kara?

Let us know how your doctor appt. goes Kim. 

Cleckner- how frustrating! I bet if you weren't waiting for AF she would have came already. 

Shiv- Is creamy cm a good sign? I'll have to remember to check mine out! 

I am in my 2ww. I was really bloated last night and this morning but then I poo'd and felt better, LOL. I am really tired today but Kira woke up so much last night so I'm not surprised. If it was any normal day I wouldn't think anything of itl. I also did some x-mas shopping this morning just incase I do fall pregnant. If my ms is anything like it was last time I'll be incapacitated for 2 months. Blah.


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## Pippin

:hi: ladies,

*Cleck* sorry it's a bfn boooo not out yet though hon could just be a late shower or you ovulated a bit later than you thought.

*Kim* hope it went well for you. Did she have the results? I don't get my erpc results I don't think.

*Spidey* good luck for your tww :thumbup:

*Shiv* creamy is good :thumbup: hope you develop more signs this week.

AFM - Doctor was lovely, NHS won't scan me early so will wait for the 12 weeks, and do a private one at 7. She was so nice, told me I was over weight lol which we both joked about as that's fairly obvious. She said I was very fertile and obviously my body is saying it's ready for another pregnancy which is nice so I felt quite comforted as I express my concern about what happened to the last one. I have my pack and forms all sent off so I hope to goodness that it all goes to plan this time. No real symptoms today but that was the same with Sam so not too worried yet. This is following his pregnancy so much more than the one I lost[-o&lt;


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## Shiv

Spidey, I have no idea if creamy cm is a good sign or not!


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## Aunty E

It's a good sign - it was one of mine this time and last. Creamy cm and TONS of it. I tend to have sticky or no CM otherwise at the end of my cycle.


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## cleckner04

I still don't ever even notice my CM. I never pay attention. :haha:


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## Kimberly28

Hi ladies. 

Well I guess the doc appt could of been worse. No bad news thankfully. No good news either. No polyps, no cysts. No evident cause for spotting. She thinks my hormones are outta whack even though she is slightly confused as to why since the scraping out during the d&c was supposed to reset my system so to speak. So now I have to take Provera for ten days which will put me into limbo. No AF, no bfp, no ttc. Just stinking miserable lousy limbo land. :hissy: :cry: This also means that there is now no shot for me to have a leo baby. :brat: By the time that I'm done with the Provera and get AF and it goes away, I wont ovulate until December 12-13th. :sulk: So then on xmas I will either get a bfp (hopefully another xmas bfp for me like with Bry) or AF will arrive. So that's what's up. I admit, I'm frustrated and disappointed. My body just loves to play up on me and I'm very unhappy about it. :growlmad:

Also she got the results back from tissue analysis done on Button's remains (post d&c) and while it's good news that nothing abnormal or wrong was found, I'm still left with the frustrating question of "why did it happen?". Ugggghhh!! :dohh: No chromosomal abnormalities. *sigh* The doc says I'm young still (psh! I'm 30, I don't have a lot of time left in my fertile days) and that it's obvious my hubby has swimmers so just gotta keep trying and that it will happen. I know that is meant to make me feel better and be reassuring but honestly I'm tired of hearing that. Remember the best fertility days are over for women after age 35 and I just had a miscarriage back in June of this year. So telling me "don't worry it will happen" just isn't helping right now. If you couldn't tell at this moment I feel very bitchy and pissy and I know it sounds selfish :blush: but I just want to be pregnant again with a healthy little bean with a strong beating heart. :brat: Oh well. Time to hurry up and wait. :growlmad:


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## cleckner04

Did they find out what your bean was? Boy/girl? I wish I could've known what mine was. :( I'm sorry you have to go through all of this, but keep thinking positive thoughts because it's just a step closer to that BFP! :hugs::hugs:


Still no AF here. I'd say I'm angry but I'm still keeping hope that I'll get a surprise BFP. :blush:


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## Kimberly28

:cry: :cry: :cry: a girl.... :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: 
I've been choking back tears all evening. I don't even want to think about it anymore. My heart is broken. :cry:


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## Pippin

Kimberly28 said:


> :cry: :cry: :cry: a girl.... :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
> I've been choking back tears all evening. I don't even want to think about it anymore. My heart is broken. :cry:

:hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:
:hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:
:hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:

So sorry hon, in a way I'm quite glad I'll never know (or at least I don't think I will now as obviously there wasn't a problem). Sorry you have to wait aso long for the next af too :hug:


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## Pippin

cleckner04 said:


> Still no AF here. I'd say I'm angry but I'm still keeping hope that I'll get a surprise BFP. :blush:

I have everything crossed for you that it is. I just read somewhere in the pregnacy gallery someone waited until 23dpo before her positive came up! Keep hoping!!!! :hug:


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## joeyjo

Kim :hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:

Cleck - still got my fingers crossed for you. Its so frustrating isn't it waiting for AF/BFP - I had that the cycle before last and AF was 6 days late - luckily I never giot even a hint of a BFP so I never got my hopes up too high.

I'm mid cycle almost exactly today I think - CD13. We finally managed to DTD last night after a frustrating/emotional week. I've had a nasty cough/cold, DH has been working stupid long hours and having to dial in from home in the middle of the night :growlmad: Anyway its not looking overly hopeful as I think we've probably missed the boat knowing my look. Is there any test the doctor can do to confirm you are ovulating or do you have to use OPKs. AF will have been back 6 months next cycle & I always said we'd give it 6 months before I started worrying. (we've actually been NTNP for longer than that but before AF reappeared.)


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## cleckner04

Kim- Oh No hun. :cry::cry: I'm so sorry. :hugs::hugs::hugs: I wish I could somehow take the pain away. :(


Quick update here- Again BFN, no AF. It's pretty clear by this point that I am not pregnant. I mean come on. :haha: I got a full blown positive with Emma by 9 DPO. So something is up here. I'm still breastfeeding quite frequently with Emma. Moreso in the past week or two for some reason she's upped her feeds again. To like 15 feeds in a 24 hour day. :wacko: So I have a feeling that has everything to do with it. My body just isn't ready yet. Which I"m starting to come to terms with. The hard part is that DH wants this more than I do and keeps asking questions. But I can't speed up the process and obviously I can't bring him home in the next 7 months...TTC was never this frustrating before. :( Now you have people saying oh babies should be close in age, blah blah. Well that isn't exactly an option for us at this point. :growlmad: And while I could easily just quit BFing and than my cycles would probably return to normal, the health of Emma and benefits from breastfeeding is far more important to me.


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## Kimberly28

Thanks for your kind words everyone. I feel like I'm back to coping one day at a time right now but I'm sure it'll get easier with time. Sigh. 

Joey, they can do an ultrasound to confirm ovulation or check your progesterone levels through blood work to confirm it's high enough to indicate that you did indeed ovulate. That test is usually done on cycle day 21. That's what I would ask for at the doc's if I were you. Good luck and I hope all is well and wishing you a speedy bfp as well. :flower:

Cleck, I understand hun. Could you maybe pump and give her half of the day's feedings in a sippie cup and not actually be bf'ing as often? Maybe that will be enough to trigger your body back into ovulating so you can get your bfp. I'm really proud of you managing to keep bf'ing this long. :thumbup: Way to go hun! =D&gt;


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## cleckner04

I'm really crap at pumping. I hardly get anything out. :( But we have 7 months until I have to worry about it again. So I'm sure Emma will drop some feeds in that time. :thumbup: 


Kim- I truly think the best way is to take it one day at a time. And sometimes you'll have bad days, and sometimes good. The pain never completely goes away but it does fade. I still have moments that something will happen to remind me and I'll have a quiet cry to myself and than get on with my day. Emma helps because she keeps me so busy. And I'm sure you really have your hands full with 2. :D :hugs:


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## Shiv

hi everyone - emotional days today so hugs all round but especially to you Kim. I am glad they couldn't find anything wrong with you hon that will stop you from conceiving in the future. I don't mean this to be insensitive (I am not the best with words so forgive me if it is), but on the up side (I try to find this in everything) at least you know that you and DH CAN make baby girls. his girl sperm obviously work, so you are good to go come December cycle, when I wish you all the girly baby dust in the world :hugs:

Cleck - breastfeeding is amazing and like you if Iwas still BFing Sophia now there is no way I would be giving up to conceive aanother baby. i already feel a bit selfish TTC never mind without actually directly impacting Sophia now. Even if you don't conceive for another year (I hope you do though :flower:) Emma and her new brother and sister will still be close in age and love eachother, so please try not to fret - and just think how supe HOT you are gonna look when Corey returns form 7 months away!

JoeyJo - I have no advice with regards ovulating as I am still unsure that I definietly am, all I know is it took us 5/6 months of trying with SOphia, it is just luck of the draw and will happen eventually for you x

Ash - you still feeling rough?

pip - how ar eyou with regards to mornign sickness? did you get it with Sam?

Spidey - how is the symptom spotting going?

as for me - well lots of cm again today although it was kinda stretchy and creamy at the same time so god only knows!

Will update the other thread with regards to our trip away - but it was successful hurrah!

much love to everyone x


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## Kimberly28

Awww! Thank you so much Shiv. You're all so sweet and wonderful! :cry: Big :hugs: for you too!
Cleck, you're exactly right. :hugs: I am taking it one day at a time. That's all I can do. And yes my 2 boys keep me busy but, like you sometimes a quiet moment to myself to shed a few tears helps and then I get back on with my day as well. I guess I'm more determined than ever now to get my baby girl back even though I'm hurting deep down inside. Roll on December! Once I have her alive and well with a strong heartbeat inside my belly, I know at that point it will really help.


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## cleckner04

Shiv- :rofl: Let's hope you are right! I have small goals in mind while he's gone but losing the baby weight from Emma is first on the list. After that, baby weight from the mc. Than I'll be almost back to normal. :haha: So that's 60 lbs. in 7 months. :shock: I doubt that will happen but I will freaking try! 

Kim- :hugs: again. Your girl is on her way. :dust: Fingers tightly crossed for you as always.


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## spidey

Kim- I'm so sorry that everything isn't working out this month, plus finding out you lost a girl :hugs: Things can only get better from here and after you take the medicine your doctor gave you, you're cycles should hopefully be back on track! Even though they found nothing obviously wrong with the lost babies chromosomes, its possible there was just a small mutation in a gene which they can not pick up in their analysis. So keep having faith in your body to grow a healthy baby :hugs: 

Cleckner- where is your AF??? How frustrating!! I don't think babies have to be really close for them to have a close relationship. In a way, it might be better to have a newborn with a 3 or 4 year old around to help, rather than a 2 year old which will still be very needy. My DH is the same as yours- he really wants me to be pregnant again. If Emma is 3 when your next baby comes, she will be in Kindergarten when you have a toddler running around the house and that might be a really good thing :thumbup: I imagine its quite draining to be looking after too many young children at a time. Plus you can give them each the time they need and deserve. 

Shiv- any symptoms besides cm??

joeyjo- this might be your month- all it takes is one spermy to make a baby!

As for me- I keep feeling like I could be pregnant, but its just wishful thinking I'm sure. My nipples get sore before AF comes, but they are already sore, which seems a little early since AF isn't due till the end of next week. I also have a feeling of heaviness in my abdomen, which could be gas :haha: I won't be testing till December 5th though since that will be 1 week after AF is due, and the day that I found out I was pregnant with Kira


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## Shiv

no other symptoms here Spidey - but then I never got any with Sophia! Your symptoms sound spromising though. 

I reckon I might test on Sunday (having though tI wouldn't test tilk the day AF is due (next Thursday according to ticker) - we'll see!


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## spidey

Shiv- I am so jealous that you didn't have symptoms when you were pregnant with Sophia! I keep meaning to tell you that but I always forget. :blush:


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## Shiv

hahahaha - it was good in a way , I appreciated not having morning sickness but I spent the first tri as a paranoid wreck that there wasn't a baby in there at all!


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## cleckner04

Spidey- Oooo Sounds promising for you!! Maybe your big day is coming sooner than you thought! :winkwink:


----------



## joeyjo

Thanks Kim for filling me in on those tests. 
Shiv I know 6 months (with AF) isn't that long to be TTC especially in a casual way but I just worry because I had ovarian surgery on 1 side a few years ago & they are fairly certain that the "cobbled together bits of ovarian remnants" (my surgeons terminology!) won't be doing much. I know you only need one ovary and it should only have minimal impact but I'm hoping that if things don't happen soon it will be enough for my GP to let me have some early tests (combined with the fact I'm 30 & DH will be 39 in the new year)

ANyway Fingers crossed Spidey's right & this is our month & I don't need to stress.


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## cleckner04

MY PERIODS HERE!!!!! YAY!! :rofl: No more limboland for me. An entire week late so now there is literally no way we can conceive this cycle because DH leaves in a week. :wacko: But oh well. Now I can get back to my old self. DH and I were looking through old pictures last night and he's like 'damn you were hot!'. I'm like "I'm still hot you asshole....that girl is still under all this somewhere." :rofl: So let the starvation begin. :lol: J/k


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## Shiv

glad you have left limboland Cleck! i think we should have some sort of competition (wrong word but can't think of the right one!) 
YOUR WEIGHTLOSS vs PREGGO LADIES WEIGHT GAIN! might help to inspire you! What do you think?

As for me, well it has been a terrible day today really. I got a phone call from my dad this morning telling me that my mum had been rushed to hospital in an ambulance last night and had been taken in for an emergency operation for a suspected perforated bowel - he sounded really scared. Anyway long story short, she came out of theatre having had her burst appendix removed. i went to see her this afternoon and when we walked in she was lying on the bed with her eyes closed and a oxygen mask on (she looked so bad). She is ok, but has so much infection in her abdomen that she can't eat or drink anything until at least monday in case it causes infection :cry:

Then whilst i was at the hospital I got a text from my best friend who was going with his wife to their 12 weeks scan with their first bubba - saying tht she had lost the baby :cry: I feel so bad for them.

As for me - no symptoms today!


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## Shiv

Vici - I just remembered aren't you testing tomorrow?


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## cleckner04

Shiv omg I'm so sorry all around :( definitely a bad day. I hope your mom heals quickly and your friend is soon blessed with a rainbow baby. :hugs:


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## Pippin

OMG *Shiv* that's really frightening! And I feel so much for your friend. I hope your Mum feels better soon :hugs: I hate seeing my parents ill as they have always been the strong one.

*Cleck* glad you're not waiting still but sorry you can't get it on this month. When he returns to his hot lady in 7 months I reckon your body would be more ready with the BF. I got mine back after 6 months and I was still feeding him full time. At the time I was gutted as no periods was wonderful but then I was glad as my body reset itself for these two beans. My friend didn't get a period for 15 months when she was breastfeeding even when she cut down so we are all different. :hugs:

*Kim* more :hug:

*Joeyjo* DH and I only dtd once this cycle and we got lucky so never count yourself out. Also the same with the one we lost. We were just too busy to :dohh:

ASM well still no sickness but that was the same with Sam until 6/7 weeks so I'm taking it as a good sign. The last one was sick straight away so either it was a girl or was doomed from the start. I'd really like a girl but a healthy boy will be just as gratefully received. Been super busy and tired so haven't got on much. I'm going to postpone my scan until 8 weeks so we see more hopefully. I was going at 7 but my MIL convinced me to wait a week (plus it means she can look after Sam while we go in the evening). Went out with my girlfriends last night and managed to keep it quite from the one that didn't know. She probably guessed as I didn't drink, well I put one inch of red wine in a glass and sipped it for 4 hours :shock: :rofl: I've never made wine last so long. I figured that tiny amount wouldn't hurt and I did enjoy the taste. Anyway it's work's Healthy and Beauty fair today so I'm going to go and have a look around and see if I can find any Christmas presents.


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## Shiv

oh blimey I am getting the urge to poas sooooooooooo bad! hahahaha I reckon I am 10 dpo today so i know I shouldn't test yet and quite frankly I have absolutley NO reason to think I am pregnant so know I am only going to be disapointed with the result! 

I shouldn't have bought any tests! Persuade me not to test girls!

how is everyone today?


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## Pippin

*Shiv* :test: :haha: Hey I'm still peeing on them look........ got my 3+ a day early so I'm dead chuffed. Still no sickness though. Look at the line on the IC :happydance: so hope this is a keeper this time.
 



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## Shiv

i am certainly not "thanking" that post Pippin - you are supposed to be STOPPING me testing! :haha:

That is one strong line - defo a keeper :thumbup:

My main problem is that DH is going out tonight leaving me home alone with the tests :haha:


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## Kimberly28

Hi ladies. I'm sorry I've been kinda quiet. I'm not really sure what to say at this point to be honest. Limbo land sucks. I cant TTC, I'm not waiting for OV, and I'm not even really waiting for AF yet. I'm still spotting too so I cant even have sex!! GRRRRRR!! Today is day 4 of limbo land and it SUCKS!!!! :hissy: I hate this!! :( Sorry, I'll shutup now. :blush:

Shiv, I'd wait till 12 dpo to test at the earliest. I'm so sorry about your Mom and your friend. I hope they both will be ok. Definitely a rough day. :( I'm so sorry! Big :hugs:

Pippin, thanks for the hugs. They definitely help. :hugs: As for that hpt, those are some GREAT lines!!! I think you have a keeper this time!! I admire you for waiting for the scan till 8 weeks. I understand why though. I'm just not sure if I could wait that long. Not knowing would be torture haha.

Cleck, Hi! :hi:

Ash, :hi:


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## Pippin

Shiv said:


> i am certainly not "thanking" that post Pippin - you are supposed to be STOPPING me testing! :haha:
> 
> That is one strong line - defo a keeper :thumbup:
> 
> My main problem is that DH is going out tonight leaving me home alone with the tests :haha:

:rofl: :test: I'm not as good as Kim. As long as you are prepared for a :bfn: what harm can it do :blush: :haha: :test: Yer alright I'll stop now......... :test:....... oppps that wasn't me!!!!


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## Pippin

Kimberly28 said:


> Hi ladies. I'm sorry I've been kinda quiet. I'm not really sure what to say at this point to be honest. Limbo land sucks. I cant TTC, I'm not waiting for OV, and I'm not even really waiting for AF yet. I'm still spotting too so I cant even have sex!! GRRRRRR!! Today is day 4 of limbo land and it SUCKS!!!! :hissy: I hate this!! :( Sorry, I'll shutup now. :blush:

Limbo does suck I agree. Hope it doesn't go on for too long.


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## Shiv

:haha: Pip you are a bad influence! Oh and I forgot to say i think waiting until 8 weeks for your scan is a good idea, whe I had my scan with Sophia it was at 8 weeks +2 and she was a little baby already. ok so not quite as you see it at 12 weeks but there was a definite body and head so I think there is prob more to see!

Kim - sorry you are feeling so down, I suggest getting on with some Christmas shopping to try to take you rmind of it and the time will fly by :hugs:


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## cleckner04

Kim- :hugs: The days will fly by and you'll be back to trying again. Just relax and enjoy this little break. :flower:


That is all. :D I'm gearing up for DH to leave so don't feel particularly chatty lately. Hope everyone is well. BFP dust to everyone. :dust:


----------



## Kimberly28

Thanks Cleck. :flower: Gosh, and here I was feeling sorry for myself. :nope: I should be grateful that I get to see my DH every day. :dohh: Poor you will have to go for 7 months without yours. :( I'm sorry Cleck. I should be grateful. I can only imagine how rough this must be on you. :hugs: I'm here for you if you need me hun. You can call or text me anytime you like or need a shoulder/ear to listen or lean on. Big :hugs:


----------



## Pippin

*Cleck* hope you have a few nice things planned for the mast week or so. Big hugs and hope you are ok :hug:


----------



## ashnbump

Hi ladies sorry I've been M.I.A been busy recently lol!

Kim - I'm sorry to hear about ur news, it's a shitter, but hopefully being in limbo now will make for a better chance TTC on the next go? Huge :hugs: about ur ERPC results I don't know what to say xxxxxxxx

Shiv - hun so sorry about all the bad news you received in one day! Ur poor mum and friend :( hopefully things can will get better for them!xxx

Pip - what a gorgeous STRONG line! I want to test everyday, but I can't afford any more clearblues lol! I used my last one the other day and it was a dud test! No control line! Maybe my HCG is just too strong haha!

How are you feeling symptom wise? My boobies are a lot more tender and I have sickness all day and night :( I'm not being sick all day just wrenching alot and feeling sick all the time! Nice reminder i guess? And don't get me started on the tiredness oh my lord! Tired isn't the word! All I want is sleep and cuddles off kara lol! Xx

Cleck - :( booooo that u won't be joining U's hunny! But I'm glad u'll stick around! I'm jealous u get to be skinny again lol! Xx

Boothh - right I know ut back, so do u have news? Has AF Arrived? How was DLP hope u both had a great time! Xxx

AFU - well I'm at work right now which doesn't help with the tiredness lol! I think I need a weekend off! I've been busy getting ready for Christmas, and I'm trying my best not to put my tree up until the 1st lol! 

I was blown away by a friend on Friday, she asked me to be godmother to her son! Which is an honour! His christening is on the 20th of feburary and I should be about 20 weeks then lol! So I'm excited for two reasons! 

I've still not had any info from the midwife/hospital! I can't remember what happened last time, do I just wait for some info through the post, scan dates booking visit etc? 

I was thinking of having an early scan but I thought about it and decided if I waited the same amount of time with kara then I can do it again! And (god forbid) anything should happen in-between, it's my bodys way of letting me know this one wasn't meant to be hey! I'm starting to have a good feeling about this pregnancy and this baby, fingers x'd tightly! Xxxxx


----------



## spidey

Shiv- how is your mom? Is she still in the hospital? I'm sorry about your friend too. Haven't you peed on a stick yet???!!

Cleckner- I'm glad you're no longer in limbo land. I can't imagine my DH leaving for so long... you're a strong momma to be able to watch Emma all on your own for that long.

Kim- I'm sorry you're stuck in limbo land, but before you know it you'll be TTC again. 

Ash- Hang in there- being sick all day makes the tiredness even worse. How is it watching Kara? I hope she's on her best behavior so mommy can get some rest! Congrats on being a godmother too 


Last week I was having some signs of possibly being pregnant like sore boobies and nipples and heaviness in my lower abdomen, but since Friday they have gone and I've been feeling great. So I'm expecting AF to visit by the end of the week!


----------



## Boothh

hi girls im back!! we had an amazing time!! :D i took a test this morning and it was a bfn! well stuart said its a bfn i think i can see a line but i might have just been looking at it too long!

iv been weeing lots, boobs are still hurting and feel bigger, iv been pretty snappy and i keep feeling sicky/faint like, i dont really feel as if AF is just around the corner either :shrug: 

wednesday will be cd49 which is the day AF has arrived the last few cycles, so ill get some tests and re test on thursday if she hasnt arrived :) 

xx


----------



## Kimberly28

Hi Boothh!! :hi: Welcome back!!! :flower: How was your trip?? I look forward to seeing pics! Did Jesse have a blast? I'm sorry about the bfn. :( Definitely re-test in a few days if no AF. If it's still bfn then, I'd get the doc. I hope it's a bfp in the works! What kind of test did you use? :hugs:


----------



## Shiv

Glad you had a good time Boothh, I agree retest on Thursday if no AF by then!

Spidey, all my symptoms are gone too, plus I have pre-AF pains today so i am expecting to come on by thursday. but I might test tomorrow :haha:

I visited mum in hospital today and they might let her go home on tuesday.

:hugs:Cleck


----------



## cleckner04

Boothh- Sounds very promising!!! :thumbup:


----------



## Pippin

Welcome back Boothh :hugs: you know we are so much better at spotting lines than these men so I'm a little bit excited for you. I have to admit though DH got pretty good at it this time round, even he said a line is a line!!!! :haha: training him well, pity this could be the last time we need to do it though (only want two children unless I get tempted trying for a girl if this one is a boy but we'll see).

Shiv did you :test: :haha:


----------



## Shiv

Nope :smug: I decided to wait! Buuuuuuuuuut i may test tomorrow am assuming that i can remember to poas first thing and not waste the fmu!

By my calculations I am due on Tuesday and by ticker Thursday so I guess I will know soon enough - defo feeling like i am out this month though! i would never be that lucky to catch first month of trying!


----------



## Pippin

Shiv said:


> Nope :smug: I decided to wait! Buuuuuuuuuut i may test tomorrow am assuming that i can remember to poas first thing and not waste the fmu!
> 
> By my calculations I am due on Tuesday and by ticker Thursday so I guess I will know soon enough - defo feeling like i am out this month though! i would never be that lucky to catch first month of trying!

Well done, you are a better woman than I am :haha: I caught first month twice remember (not so ucky with Sam though) so don't count yourself out just because it's your first month. I also found I got better lines during the day. FMU was rubbish with me but we're all different. Good luck though :thumbup:

Hope your Mum is getting better. :hugs:


----------



## Shiv

I caved - BFN! i knew it would be - hey ho, means no ttc this month and a good few drinkies over the festive period for me!


----------



## Pippin

Shiv said:


> I caved - BFN! i knew it would be - hey ho, means no ttc this month and a good few drinkies over the festive period for me!

Aww sorry it's a bfn :growlmad: having a very festive Christmas does sound good though. How come no ttc his month then? Just because of Christmas?


----------



## Shiv

yep :haha:

With Sophia I found out I was pregnant 3 days before Christmas so felt it was too early to tell anyone, so had to lie my way through Christmas and New Year. I don't want to have to do the same again. If I got pregnant this month then i would have enough time to have an 8 weeks scan and tell close family etc so it would have been ok. Plus it will be nice to be able to let my hair down a little this year what with BFing last year and preggo year before. 

Part of me does want to ttc this month, but I know that if I don't get pregnant I will resent the tww and not drinking during it (which will be main going out season - selfish I know!). I know hubby will want to ttc this month, but then it is not him whose life changes as soon as that line appears on the test!


----------



## Boothh

hi ladies just thought id let you know that boots have got frers at BOGOF! i just got 4 FRERS for £10.19 .. bargain! gunna do one tomorrow ill let you know the results lol! x


----------



## Kimberly28

:saywhat: They NEVER do that kinda sale with preg tests over here!! No fair!! :( Oh well. :growlmad: TTC supplies are always expensive over here. :dohh:

Boothh, good luck with your test! Fingers x'ed it's a bfp!! :dust:


----------



## Boothh

its a pretty rare deal the normally might have a pound or 2 knocked off but i couldnt resist when i saw them, i was going to test tomorrow but stuart has asked me about 4 times when im going to test so i may do one before i go to bed!


----------



## Shiv

oh keep us up to date Boothh - fx'ed for you!


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## Boothh

well ill still test tomorrow even if a bfn ill just look at the one i do soon as a 'free' one lol so i can waste it it didnt cost me anything, i need a wee now but tryna hold it in abit longer think my last wee was about 3.30 so ill try wait til 10 so 6 and a half hours is good enough concentration eh haha x


----------



## Pippin

Boothh I can bully you now and give Shiv a break for a bit but you need to go :test: :test: :test: :rofl:

Shiv, I don't blame you for waiting now, I'm of course happy to miss out on the Christmas festivities but I can't help be just a little jealous seeing as I've missed the last two being preggers and then BF. Bet you end up having a go anyway though :winkwink: I drank in the tww with both Sam and the one I lost as I wasn't expecting to get pregnant. This one I did by the book though from 1dpo.


----------



## ashnbump

I may even purchase some of those myself lol, I love testing and seeing bfp's lol! 

Good luck Boothh, get to poas right away! I hate waiting,
I have my fingers x'd for you, I have a good feeling!

AFU- kara has chicken pox!!!! Not good for me as I'm preggo, my mum couldn't remember if I'd had them or not :wacko: so I had to go for a blood test today to see if I'm immune or not, if I am then it's fine, if not, then I could be in trouble! So fingers x'd!! I'm sure I've had them tho, and my mum said she 'thiiinks' lol! Xx


----------



## Pippin

Boothh said:


> well ill still test tomorrow even if a bfn ill just look at the one i do soon as a 'free' one lol so i can waste it it didnt cost me anything, i need a wee now but tryna hold it in abit longer think my last wee was about 3.30 so ill try wait til 10 so 6 and a half hours is good enough concentration eh haha x

Blimey hon that's loads of time. I waited only 3 hours to get my positive. I think you'd be good to go now I'd have thought.


----------



## Boothh

i only wee about twice a day i really need to drink more i most always be really dehydrated, okay ill go do one haha im thinking 99% bfn though i just cant imagine it being a bfp right now x

ash im gunna bring jesse round and let him catch them if thats okay haha, xx


----------



## joeyjo

Ash - FX'd you've had chicken pox; you probably have, most people have. Hope kara's not too poorly with it.

Boothh:test::test: I agree with Pippin, you should be good to go now.

AFU - we ventured into London today & had a lovely day people watching at the winter wonderland in hyde park - George liked watching the really scary fairground rides and the talking reindeer head! 
Just starting the 2WW AF due Dec 3rd. I will have a drink in the 2WW but only a little not getting drunk... Although I think I did get quite drunk when I caught with G - I wasn't expecting TTC to work that month although I can't remember why not now :dohh:


----------



## ashnbump

Aaahhhh exciting!!!! 

Good luck!

And bring him haha! Xx


----------



## Pippin

Boothh hope you have gone to pee.......:loo:


----------



## Kimberly28

:rofl: at that emote pippin! Too funny!

Ash, poor Kara. :( I'm thinking about taking Bry to a "chicken pox party" when he's 2-3 to go ahead and get it over with. It's far safer than injecting him with heavy metals in the vaccine. :thumbup:


----------



## Vici

Hi girls, hope you are all OK. I've had a terrible sickness bug and only just getting over it. Have tested today and still BFN. Starting to think the Clomid didn't even work and i put my self in the 2WW for nothing :( God, it makes me so mad - I must be one of the only people who wishes she could get a period every month :growlmad: :cry:

Jo - Hope you had a fabulous day hun. My boss went there on Saturday and said it was fabulous x

Becki - OMG girl, how have you not tested again? :rofl: Go pee :thumbup:

Ash - o no, poor Kara (and you of course). Hope you have the immunity for them - if you haven't what will they do? How is she with it? Hope she's not too poorly :hugs:

Shiv - sorry for your :bfn: :( You planning to leave it a month then start trying again?

Cleck - how you doing hunni?


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## Boothh

well i just tested and i think i got a faint line!! if it is though i mustve OVd later than i thought cus its very faint or maybe i didnt get enough pee on it :shrug: too faint to show up on my phone camera but stuart said he could see it within about 5 seconds of me giving him the test but he said he thinks its too early and i have to wait a few days lol, 

so nobody congratulate me, ill retest with fmu tomorrow xx


----------



## Boothh

i swear iv been sick as a dog the last couple of days though i feel really hungover constantly, i had a cocktail everynight on holiday but 1 not 10 lol so nothing to warrant a hangover, i feel awful today and smells keep making me feel sick but i think im symptom spotting.


----------



## Vici

OMG Becki - no congrats just a big oooo, I can't wait :rofl:


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## Kimberly28

:-O Oooooooo!!!! I cant wait too Becki, hun!!! Let's see 2 lines!!!! :headspin:


----------



## Boothh

well deffo 2 lines this morning, extremely faint though, going on the longest cycle iv had recently AF would arrive tomorrow, so im going to wait til thursday to do another test i think, (we all know ill do one tomorrow lol) i just feel like this is going to turn into another chemical with all these faint lines :/


----------



## Boothh

got AF cramps now..


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## ashnbump

I had them the day I got my bfp Hun! I still get them now! Hold on to hope! Xxxx


----------



## Boothh

i keep looking at the test and theres deffo a line and a pink line at that its just really faint, i have to remember though i was quite a few days late with jesse and my bfp was pretty faint and now im testing possibly before AF is due, maybe my body just doesnt do strong bfps lol x


----------



## ashnbump

A line is a line no matter how dark or faint it is, test again in a day or two! If ur preggo ur preggo simple as Hun, I have a good feeling so until AF shows I'll stick with keeping my fingers x'd! Xxxx


----------



## Boothh

i do have loads of symptoms though, ,my feet are normally always freezing and stuart kept sayin last night why are your feet warm, only time iv had warm feet was when i was pregnant with jesse cus of the increased circulation lol, i want a proper bfp not a debatable one lol xx


----------



## ashnbump

Was it the same this mornin? With fmu? Maybe if u don't want to wait you could ask the dr to do a blood test? But by the time u get the results u'd probs have a proper bfp haha! I don't really know what to suggest Hun, but if u think ur preg then u probably are, u know ur own body best :thumbup: 

Xxx


----------



## Boothh

yeah the one this morning is clearer than last nights but still like you think your imagining it if you look for too long, its like if it was any fainter it wouldnt be there haha, i could be early though, im gunna try and wait til later in the week to test now x


----------



## Pippin

Boothh said:


> well deffo 2 lines this morning, extremely faint though, going on the longest cycle iv had recently AF would arrive tomorrow, so im going to wait til thursday to do another test i think, (we all know ill do one tomorrow lol) i just feel like this is going to turn into another chemical with all these faint lines :/

YYYYOOOOOOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE:headspin: :headspin: :headspin: :headspin: :headspin: :headspin: 
:happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance:
:happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance:
:happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance:

Hey hon my lines were really faint day AF was due and now they are storming. I'm SSSSSSSSSSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO excited for you :yipee: (note I haven't say congrats like you asked :haha:) One cocktail is fine per night in tww as the emby doesn't get anything from you then.


----------



## Pippin

Boothh said:


> i do have loads of symptoms though, ,my feet are normally always freezing and stuart kept sayin last night why are your feet warm, only time iv had warm feet was when i was pregnant with jesse cus of the increased circulation lol, i want a proper bfp not a debatable one lol xx

LOL I'm the opposite, only have cold feet when pregnant, how cool. You'll get lines soon hon, a line is a line and it's time the time we have to battle now.

I'm so excited for you I think my MS has just kicked in :sick: or maybe it's the waffers I keep eating :blush:


----------



## Vici

A line is def a line hun :D I keep trying to think the same - that my line was never strong with Imi so maybe thats why i have nothing yet!!


----------



## Boothh

i just dont wanna get excited, i just think if i get past today and tomorrow with no AF then i might let myself think i have a chance, though i did just google a due date calculator ha and id be due 3rd August 2011 so another lioncub! ¬_¬


----------



## Boothh

and pippin i hope you dont get hit too hard with the MS though if you anything like me after last time i cant wait to start my morning with my head down the loo cus it will make me feel a little confident ha, 

i didnt get MS with jesse til nearly 9weeks though and it carried on til about 14weeks erughh


----------



## Boothh

i wanna know who the guest viewing our thread is lol.


----------



## spidey

LOL Boothh- you caught me :haha: 

I'm at work right now sneaking some time on here since my boss might not be coming in today :happydance: I can't seem to get much time at home recently with DH needing to work in the evenings! 

Boothh- I am very very excited for you- but not going to congratulate you yet until you give me permission :haha: With how long you've had sore boobs, I'm not surprised since that was the main thing that I noticed when I was pregnant with Kira. :happydance::happydance:

AF came for me this morning, so I'm out! 

Shiv- how about you cycle buddy?? Any sign of AF yet???


----------



## Vici

Well AF arrived!! Proper gutted :cry: Feel like it was my only chance as now i'm gonna have to wait for a referral, lose weight etc etc and go through everything again :( :( :(


----------



## joeyjo

Vici said:


> Well AF arrived!! Proper gutted :cry: Feel like it was my only chance as now i'm gonna have to wait for a referral, lose weight etc etc and go through everything again :( :( :(

Vici - don't despair, keep NTNP and you might get lucky you never know. Friends of ours had real issues last time, PCOS, ovarian drilling, clomid - they started trying because they wanted a 3 year gap so were giving themselves plenty of time & caught on their 2nd cycle and will have a 23 month gap so you never know you could get lucky whilst your getting all the other stuff in place :hugs: :hugs:


----------



## Boothh

:hugs: vici i agree with joeyjo you could get lucky, hope you arnt feeling too down hun xxxx


as for me i have felt like im about to faint so much today its getting on my nerves now i really abit off :(


----------



## Pippin

I was also on as a guest at work just to see update :haha: I don't want my department to know I'm leaving them again and they share my office so I sneak on and off while I can.

Sorry your both out Vici and Spidey :growlmad: 

Vici why do you have to wait for a referral, can they not give clomid by your GP if you have had it already (I don't know how these things work sorry)?


----------



## Vici

Thanks girls. Its about slim to none Joey, I don't have a cycle on my own so pretty much rules it out! Pip, my GP cannot prescribe it. It has to be via a consultant because you get follicle tracking and a trigger shot (to ensure the follicles pop and you ovulate and so you know exactly what day!). He wouldn't prescribe it to me before until my BMI was below 30 but i managed to convince him when it was at about 31 (from 36!) so was lucky! OH says at least we know the clomid CAN work for us which we didn't know last time so thats a bit better I suppose x


----------



## Boothh

aw vici im sorry your going to have to go through so much to get pregnant again, i didnt know you had gone through all that to get pregnant last time :hugs: i suppose that is a good thing like OH said at least you know it CAN work for you xxx


----------



## Shiv

Vici - massive hugs hon - what is your BMI at the moment? Do you have much to lose? You can't have too much, you looked great in your wedding pics!

Spidey (cycle buddy) - sorry AF came. Well when I wiped this morning I had one streak of blood in my cm, but none since so I guess I am just waiting for AF to show in full force. I have got a shocking a headache so I hop eit shows up soon so that hopefully me head will clear. If it does show up properlytoday it means that I had a 28 day cycle (which I predicted earlier in the month) and so did you Spidey!

Boothh - take it easy hon, don't you go fainting! when are you gonna test again? maybe get a digi that way you can't be tempted to stare at it for lines!


----------



## joeyjo

Aww Vici - just get to the docs and get things moving ASAP :hugs:


----------



## Vici

Thanks girls, i'll be fine. Just hit me a bit hard, thats all :( xx


----------



## Boothh

nope no digis for me i hate the damn things haha, im happy to look for lines XD 

ill test again tomorrow morning probably i ordered some more tests and i have 2 left one for tomorrow and one for thursday hopefully my others will have arrived for friday or ill have got AF by then lol x


----------



## Pippin

Aww Vici hon :hug: you've lost tons of weight for the wedding (I was dead jealous when I saw you in your wedding and honeymoon pictures) you must be close or past the 30 surely worth making that appointment. I had a bit of a shock when she did mine the other day, way to embarrassed to tell everyone. Thanks for explaining it to me sorry it's so hard, wish I could give you a few of my cycles to give you a go :hugs: Ohhh that sounds weird but you know what I mean. Bound to hit you hard hon :hug:


----------



## Pippin

Boothh said:


> nope no digis for me i hate the damn things haha, im happy to look for lines XD
> 
> ill test again tomorrow morning probably i ordered some more tests and i have 2 left one for tomorrow and one for thursday hopefully my others will have arrived for friday or ill have got AF by then lol x

No AF coming your way darlin' she's gone for a good 8 months!!! :happydance: The wait is horrible those first few days aren't they. Hope you're doing something nice to pass the time.


----------



## Boothh

nope just being super paranoid, i really dont think i am pregnant AT all 

if AF hasnt arrived by thursday i might believe it a tiny bit, she normally arrives during the night and greats me with a nice pair of ruined knickers in the morning, :dohh: 

i hate waiting lol xx


----------



## Shiv

Why does AF always arrive in the night? You would think it would have to wark against gravity then, surely it would be easier to arrive whilst we are stood up :haha:

No more blood when i wipe, I usually come on in a flourish so not sure what the streaks were all about? :shrug:

What you got against digis Boothh? i have some stocked for if I do get preggers as I like seeing it written in black and white!


----------



## Pippin

Shiv said:


> No more blood when i wipe, I usually come on in a flourish so not sure what the streaks were all about? :shrug:

Implantation bleed???? She says hopefully:thumbup:???? :test: again tomorrow I reckon :haha: Oh there's my naughty side coming out again..... :haha:


----------



## Boothh

shiv - i with my early mc i was getting faint bfps when i tried a digi it said not pregnant, so i havnt liked them ever since lol, if i got a strong positive i might get some just to see it in writing lol :p

well stuarts verdict of this morning test 'i can see a line quite easily but its VERY faint' 

so at least i know im not imagining it, maybe tomorrow i can get one abit darker that will show up on my phone and then i might believe it, 

the only thing though thats making me think im really not pregnant is i dont think my nipples have gone darker, and with my mmc they went darker before i even got a positive, with the early mc afterwards they never went darker, they are killing though and look bigger so i dont know? :/


----------



## Shiv

soooooooooo woke up this morning and still no AF and started thinking "blimey maybe Pippin is right and it was implantation", then went to th eloo about an hour later and AF had arrived! It does appear the Witch tries to build your hopes up as much as possible - evil cowbag :haha:

Boothh - did you get a stronger line this morning?


----------



## joeyjo

Nasty AF :growlmad: :ignore:


----------



## Boothh

nope i dont think the line is any stronger than yesterday, though yesterdays has dried now into quite an obvious pink line :/ is that good or bad or what? 

iv sort of resigned myself to the fact its probably a chemical, if my lines dont get any stronger and AF hasnt arrived by the weekend im going to make a docs appointment for some bloods to see whats going on, x


----------



## spidey

Vici- I'm sorry that the clomid didn't work. :hugs: If I could get my hands on some clomid I would mail you some for sure! 

Shiv- sorry about AF. Enjoy drinks at Christmas and New Years though!!

Boothh- fingers still crossed for you. Every pregnancy is different and feeling faint is a good sign. :thumbup:


----------



## Boothh

well AF hasnt arrived touch wood!


----------



## cleckner04

Vici- What about soy isoflavones? It's supposed to be natures clomid and can be bought over the counter! Girls in TTC section seem to rave about it. :flower:

Boothh- :happydance: <---enough said. :lol:


----------



## Kimberly28

Awww Boothh, I'm sure you're pregnant hunny. After all, a line is a line. Get the doc to do bloods and I'm sure that it will reassure you. :hugs: After all, you had Jesse, so they cant ALL end badly. :flower:

Vici, since you lost all of that weight before you got married, maybe you can get the clomid now. I'd get back to the doc and try to get the help you need. Are you getting a monthly AF at all? If not, then they can give you Provera and jump start your cycle. Matter of fact that's what I'm on right now. However I'm on it not because I wasn't getting AF, but because we are re-starting my cycles in hopes to reset my hormones as the doc thinks they had gotten way out of whack. :dohh: Hopefully it can help get you rolling. :hugs: Also Cleck is right, I've heard good things about that soy isoflavones. Maybe worth a try? :shrug:

Cleck, that weight loss was probably from not eating much. The same thing happens to me when I do that. The problem though is that once you start eating again, it's 2 steps forward and 3 steps back. Before I got married to my ex I started counting calories and still ate what I enjoyed and I lost a bunch of weight! I was down to 120 lbs!! :D I haven't been that small since though. :dohh: After I get through this next pregnancy though, I WILL become that small again!! Come hell or high water! LOL!! :haha:


Shiv, I'm sorry AF found you. Bad nasty :witch:. :growlmad: Enjoy your holidays though and indulge yourself in a couple nice drinks. :winkwink:

AFM, I'm on day 8 of provera. However it seems that my period is breaking through it. :dohh: It was supposed to hold it off. Oh well. The only thing is that I read that the first day of spotting/bleeding AFTER provera is done is supposed to be counted as cd 1. Thing is if this bleeding continues like this, I'm not sure what to count as cd 1. This bleeding is heavy enough that I'm having to use tampons. :dohh: I wouldn't be so concerned if it wasn't for the fact that I need to know exactly what cycle day I'm on so as to time BD correctly to hopefully conceive our little girl, and not another boy. :dohh: Why cant anything ever be simple for me? :hissy: I'm so sick of being stuck in limbo land now! I want to be TTC again dammit!! :brat: And yes, my mood status on here is how I feel these days, IMPATIENT as hell!! :growlmad: I feel so irritable today. :grr:


----------



## cleckner04

:hugs: Kimberly. Be PATIENT!! :haha: You have all of us to rant to so you can stay busy. Although this place seems to put babies on the mind. 

And you are probably very right about gaining the weight back. I can gain so easily but the only way I seem to lose, is to starve myself. :rofl: My smallest weight as an adult was 160 and I NEVER expect to be that small again. I can't even imagine 120. :haha: I'll be happy with 180 at this point. Which is my 'comfort' weight so once I hit it, I stay there usually. Whereas 160 I had to fight to maintain. I blame my mom. We are built exactly the same. :dohh:


----------



## Boothh

well im trying to take my mind off things by planning christmas! i bought a merry christmas card holder, reindeer and santa ornements and a santa tree topper, plus a snowman wreath, all of our advent calendars (mine is twilight, stuarts is milkybar and jesses is peppa pig) and ordered jesse a cute christmas tshirt plus some slippers and jumpers as part of his presents ooo and a big board books set of nursery rhymes! im planning to do some wrapping tonight :D 

i wanna put jesse in his reindeer sleepsuit tonight now but is it too soon?!


----------



## Pippin

Boothh honey my lines only darken every two days so I reckon tomorrow you'll get a darker one for sure. ALL of my tests look better once they are a bit old then after a few days they start fading again. I got what I thought was evaps this time after the time limit but actually they were the first bfp's!!! I did pee on another one tonight as apart from being super tired and cramps I don't feel that pregnant, in fact today I completely forgot for a while which is insane!!!!! It was nice and dark though. My boobs didn't get darker until third tri with Sam and then I think I imagined it. Remember each pregnancy is different so hang in there soooo not over yet.

Shiv sorry to build your hope up hon, I promise not to do that ever again, feel a bit bad now as I hate it wen people get you thinking what if?

Think I'm coming down with something so not staying online. Sam had really bad tummy today at childminders and went through three sets of clothes and I think I'm coming down with the same. Just feel ill booooo, worried as I have really bad AF cramps tonight and last night so I'm being a bit paranoid again. Just hope tummy bugs don't harm beans??? 

:hi: to everyone else. Speak tomorrow. xxxx


----------



## Kimberly28

Pippin, I'm sorry to hear that you're feeling ill. Let's hope it's just the pregnancy. Hope you feel better better soon though! :hugs: Hope Sam feels better too. Poor little guy. :(


----------



## Boothh

i hope i do get a darker line tomorrow but im really doubting it now, i just cant see it happening! with jesse my boobs didnt go dark until 3rd tri but i figured cus of last time maybe they will now its already happened once, i dont know i really dont think i am at all now, 

hope you feel better pippin xx


----------



## cleckner04

Boothh- Honestly a line is a line. Don't let it get to you if the lines aren't dark. As long as they come up in the right time, than you are pregnant! :hugs::hugs: And darkness means nothing. I know we all say 'oh what lovely dark lines' but honestly they mean nothing in the end. my lines were SO dark with my miscarried baby. But the lines with Emma were faint.


----------



## Boothh

yeah but they are squinty lines though not even just faint!


----------



## Kimberly28

I agree with Cleck. You might only be just barely late for AF. The hcg might not have had much time to get good and high yet. Give it a few days to a week and I'm sure it will look much better. :thumbup: As long as it's a line and it has color, then its a bfp! I know it's hard but try to relax. :hugs: Like I said earlier, all of your pregnancies cant possibly all end badly. I mean you have Jesse as living proof. :flower: Stressing yourself like this isn't good for new tiny bean. So relax and remember what will be will be. Try to trust that your body knows how to grow a healthy baby. Big :hugs: I know it's rough hun. I know I'm gonna fret once I'm preg too but worrying yourself to death like this isn't worth it. Go kick your feet up and watch your favorite movie to take your mind off of it. :hugs:


----------



## Boothh

well if anything this mornings line is fainter! no AF though! so if im not pregnant this is the longest cycle ive had since i was about 14 im on CD50!
iv got no more tests now so ill have to wait for the ones i ordered to arrive, either by then i will have got AF or the lines will be much stronger, im happy either way cus it would be nice to enjoy christmas really wouldnt it! x


----------



## Shiv

Boothh said:


> well if anything this mornings line is fainter! no AF though! so if im not pregnant this is the longest cycle ive had since i was about 14 im on CD50!
> iv got no more tests now so ill have to wait for the ones i ordered to arrive, either by then i will have got AF or the lines will be much stronger, im happy either way cus it would be nice to enjoy christmas really wouldnt it! x

do you always use the same brand of test? Maybe you could try another to see what your line looks like on them? just an idea! I plan on getting trolleyed over Christmas!:happydance:


----------



## Pippin

Aww Boothh don't give up yet. I agree with Shiv try a different brand. I was getting squinty lines with ic's and bfn on digi but a strong line with a cb plus. Worth a try hon. Xxx


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## Boothh

i have been using frers but iv ordered some superdrug tests (my favourite and only brand iv got proper bfps with lol) so its just waiting til they arrive now, AF hasnt arrived still touch wood!


----------



## joeyjo

Just been thinking to myself - as I have just about week left of the 2WW. I know at least 1 local friend lurks on this site and knows who I am - sees me posting in toddlers & weaning. I think a few other friends use it to... So if & when I get my BFP its going to have to be kept pretty quiet as I don't want the world and his wife finding out at 5 weeks!

No ticker for me, no big BFP announcement until I'm a bit further on.


----------



## Pippin

joeyjo said:


> Just been thinking to myself - as I have just about week left of the 2WW. I know at least 1 local friend lurks on this site and knows who I am - sees me posting in toddlers & weaning. I think a few other friends use it to... So if & when I get my BFP its going to have to be kept pretty quiet as I don't want the world and his wife finding out at 5 weeks!
> 
> No ticker for me, no big BFP announcement until I'm a bit further on.

Fair enough, although if she doesn't have an account she can't see tickers which is good but if she is signed up all she has to do is go to your home page and look for your rescent posts. One of the reasons I've noly told my best friend about this site and she knows anyway. Grrrrr it can be a bit open this site I have to admit.


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## Boothh

if i ever mention bnb i just say a baby forum i go on never give specifics hahhaha i know my cousin is on here iv seen her posting in ttc, im always paranoid SIL is gunna come on and see my posts LOL


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## joeyjo

I used to just say a baby forum but I told this girl a story I'd had in the weaning sectin & she recognised it :dohh:


----------



## Pippin

joeyjo said:


> I used to just say a baby forum but I told this girl a story I'd had in the weaning sectin & she recognised it :dohh:

Hahaha what's the odds huh. I do look out for familiar names and faces I have to admit.


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## cleckner04

I have a few friends on here. I don't mind particularly. Except the one friend read a few things I said bad about her and she brought it up to me later. When I mc'ed she told me 'at least you still have your dog". :shock: So I ranted about it on here. Than later when I announced my pregnancy with Emma on here, she read it before my family even knew. :roll: She's still around on here but not nearly like I am. But I think of it as, I was here first and I'm definitely not going anywhere. 

And Boothh- it's your cousin that's always reading our lion cub thread right? And that evonne1 girl reads it every time I'm on there basically. And this girl has 0 posts on the forum. :wacko: It's really weird and I wonder who it is.


----------



## joeyjo

HAppy Thanksgiving to all the American Gals :flower::flower:


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## Boothh

oo i didnt know it was thanks giving! and i dont really understand what thnaks giving is either if anybody wants to enlighten me! but happy thanks giving! :flower:

i just went out and bought a christmas tree and lights for the window and me and jesse just put them up while stuart is at college lol, half of the decs iv ordered arnt arriving til tomorrow at least but i dont care im in the mood now :D x

OH and no AF touch wood!! :D


----------



## cleckner04

Here's the wikipedia definition of thanksgiving. :haha:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thanksgiving

But, my definition? An excuse to eat tons of food and watch a cool parade. :rofl:


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## Pippin

Happy Thanks giving :happydance: just spoke to my brother in PA and he's cooking the Turkey as we speak plus getting ready for a bit of......:drunk::beer::wine::icecream::pizza::cake:


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## Boothh

so is thanksgiving a big holiday then? and what do you eat on christmas day if you eat turkey at thanksgiving :dohh:


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## cleckner04

Yeah thanksgiving is one of the top holidays here. Turkey is usually the thanksgiving dinner and for Christmas the tradition dinner is a huge ham. :D All the side dishes are usually the same for each holiday with potatoes, yamssick:), cranberriessick:), green bean casserole, mac n' cheese, rolls, etc.

I always make deviled eggs, mac n' cheese, loaded mashed potatoes, turkey and stuffing, green bean casserole, and rolls for thanksgiving. 

And for christmas this year I made a glazed ham, loaded mashed potatoes, and breaded brussel sprouts. 

Yummm I'm hungry. LOL! The smell of turkey is in our house and I want to eat it NOW. But we are waiting until dinner to eat the actual thanksgiving dinner.


Honestly the only thing people typically do on thanksgiving is have family get togethers and stuff their faces, and watch the parade & football(American not soccer). :haha:


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## Boothh

what are deviled eggs? lmao it sounds good to me!

im making my first ever christmas dinner this year but me and stuart dont like turkey so were having 

roast chicken, roast potatoes, mashed potatos, yorkshire puddings, parsnips, buttered carrots, green beans, broccoli and cauliflower cheese and stuffing, :D oo and gravyyyy :D :D :D 

and what are loaded mashed potatos?


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## cleckner04

Mashed potatoes with bacon pieces, sour cream, chives, and cheese mixed in. :D And I sprinkle cheese on top of it too and bake it so it all melts on it. And deviled eggs..hold on I'll google for a picture and recipe. They are SO good. 

This is similar to how I make them, but I don't use powdered mustard, I just use regular mustard. 
https://www.deviledeggs.com/classic_deviled_eggs.html


And ooo I forgot about gravy! We plan on making gravy today too. I nearly forgot all about it. :haha:


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## Boothh

omg that mash sounds like my perfect food haha, i always make potato skins with bacon and cheese and put loads of sour cream on top i never thought of making mash like that i might do that for christmas dinner yum, 

stuart is gunna be home in half an hour and were just having pizza tonight x


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## Boothh

ohh deviled eggs are like egg mayo basically then haha sounds good x


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## cleckner04

Boothh said:


> omg that mash sounds like my perfect food haha, i always make potato skins with bacon and cheese and put loads of sour cream on top i never thought of making mash like that i might do that for christmas dinner yum,
> 
> stuart is gunna be home in half an hour and were just having pizza tonight x

Me too with the potatoes. Seriously every time we go out to eat and potatoes is a side, I always ask for them to be loaded. :D It's SO yummy. I just found another recipe and it says to put cream cheese in it. I think that sounds good too. I may just throw it in there today and see how it turns out. :haha:


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## Boothh

i always put dairylea in my mashed potatos and i put garlic paste in too lol and some times i put hardboiled eggs in chopped up XD


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## Pippin

Ohhh Devil eggs look yummy. Might try them thanks Cleck :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

No prob Pip! They really are yummy. We usually eat them all in one day. :haha: I made 2 dozen today (12 eggs and than halved) and we've already eaten about half of that. :dohh:


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## spidey

deviled eggs are good :thumbup:

We had turkey, mashed potatoes (not loaded though :haha:), gravy, mac & cheese, cranberry sauce from a can!, sweet potato casserole with marshmallows on top, asparagus and pumpkin pie for dessert.

It is a big holiday here like Cleckner said. Do you have black friday in the UK? It's always the day after Thanksgiving and when all of us Americans go crazy and start our Christmas shopping. Stores open really early- sometimes at 3am! If you're serious, you will get there long before the store opens and stand in a line :haha It's always a Thanksgiving tradition in my family to sit around and look thru all the sale circulars that come in the mail on Thanksgiving day and to make up a shopping plan to get to all the best deals before the time runs out.


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## Boothh

im confused how you can eat sweet and savoury on the same plate haha :haha: marshmallows on like the same plate as gravy? ??!!?

i cant imagine eating mac and cheese with other stuff either apart from veg or salad, its funny how we do things so differently isnt it! 

no we dont have a black friday as such though UK amazon is doing black fridya lightening deals this year, i wish we did though, they do tend to reduce things this time of year for a week or so before jacking the prices up for christmas! 

i went and bought last night a 6foot artificial canadian slim christmas tree, 80clear lights for it and a strings of clear star lights for the window for £26! that works out about $40 on the currency converter i just used! :D


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## Boothh

the only sales i get up early for and go to is the Next sales cus they are so good i love the clothes from there for jesse but i dont always like the prices and the sales are always like 70% off so i get up and go early and its always ridiculous with women running around picking anything up in their kids size and fighting over stuff haha x


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## Pippin

Boothh any sign of AF? Just logged on to check. x


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## Boothh

no AF but my tests arrived and i got a bfn, well just been to check and theres a line now but i think evap, something deffo goin on but i dont know what the hell it is!


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## ashnbump

Awww Boothh :( I was sure this was ur month!! Have u managed to get an appt at the dr's for bloods? Fingers x'd it's not a mmc but if it is then this will be the 3rd and that means ur entitled to some investigative treatment right? Obvs u can have gorgeous health babies! Jesse is proof as said before lol! Hopefully it's nothing, maybe u just need a hormone reset like Kim! I hope u get answers either way Hun! 

Pip - how are you feeling now? My sickness is unreal, I can't function properly it's horrid :(


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## Boothh

im dont even feel bothered about it i dont know whats going on my lines are so faint they almost arnt lines i might go to the docs on monday if AF not here and say like i want bloods cus somethings goin on im on CD52 now thats not normal almost 2cycles for most people that!


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## Shiv

Boothh - sorry about the bfn, I agree a trip to the docs to talk about your long cycles is a good idea.

If I could offer some advice (and this isn't meant to offend/ upset etc) it would be to NOT use FRER anymore as I do hear a lot of people getting very faint lines when they aren't pregnant. It is just not worth the heartache of thinking you might be just to get a bfn on another test. I personally would stick to clear blue or something in the future, you might have to wait acouple more days for a positive reslt, but 2 days in the grand scheme of things is nothing in comparison to the uncertainty you seem to be facing when using FRERs. I hope I don't sound preachy I just hate to see you go through this.

I am so anal about it that when I test I look at the test after 2 mins (or whatever is the time on that test), a quick look, if there is no obvious line I chuck it away and don't look at it again. i figure if I miss a really faint line then it will eventually come out stronger and it means I don't get fooled by evaps - I hate evaps!

big hugs x


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## Boothh

i dont like frers anyway i only got them cus they were on offer! still no AF though! appointment booked for tuesday evening, and i have my first cognative behavioural therapy session on tuesday too, busy day for me and doctors haah x


----------



## Pippin

Sorry it's a bfn hon, not sure what's going on to be honest maybe it is just a slow riser, when was the first line? I'm glad you made a doctors appointment though as they can sort something out for you. x


----------



## Boothh

i dont even remember, tuesday i think and it was barely there even if you squinted, but the ones on wednesday and thursday were still extremely faint but darker than the first i used a diff test today though so i dunno, AF still isnt here either way and my boobs are still really sore!


----------



## Shiv

When did your boobs start hurting Boothh and when do you think you ovulated?


----------



## Boothh

it was about 2 weeks ago a couple of days after i thought i had OVd, but now im begining to think i didnt OV at all, im going to ask for bloods at my doctors appointment to see if my hcg is actually above non pregnancy or its something else, xx


----------



## Boothh

:?


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## Shiv

hope you get some answers hon x


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## spidey

Boothh- I hope the doctors can figure it out. You've been having sore boobs for awhile now so your hormones must be up to something. Could it be possible that the tests you've been using are all duds and you need to try a test from a different brand?

regarding Thanksgiving- if you think too hard about having sweet and savory on the same plate it seems nasty- buts it's actually pretty good :haha:


----------



## Pippin

Have you tested again today Boothh? xxx


----------



## ashnbump

Just a quickie from me! 

Just been to the loo at work, and when I wiped there was a TINY teeny tiny bit of what I think was blood :( now I don't know if it came from my bottom cos I wiped front to back (tmi) or if it was from the front bum, there's not blood in my knickers and I'm not cramping, so what should I do??? X


----------



## Boothh

i tested again bfn, though now a faint line after time limit and still no AF, i really think chemical to be honest as obviously there must be a tiny bit of hcg there but it doesnt seem to be rising i have the docs on tuesday any way xx

Ash - try not to worry it could be anything, i know its hard but its probably nothing especially only a tiny bit, i bet people get that all the time but they arnt obsessive like us so they dont notice and nothings wrong, just try take it easy and if you see any more blood or start cramping get yourself to A&E and they might scan you to see if everythings okay which im sure it is :hugs: xxx


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## Shiv

Ash try not to worry, but if you get any more blood then pop along to A&E just to be safe (plus you mightget to see bean!)

Boothh - PLEASE stop looking at your tests after the time limit has gone!


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## Boothh

im notttt ¬_¬


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## Shiv

:trouble:


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## ashnbump

Well been to a&e and they took bloods, and did some internal swabs, no more blood of any kind when I wipe, she said no blood was on the swabs so that's good right? They don't scan on weekends (dumb I know) so I've got an appointment for a scan at 3:50pm on Monday

I'm nervous as hell now :( 

I'm still sicky and my boobs r still sore, still no cramping/pains!

I've been sent home from work anyway got to rest today,but I'm going in tomorrow!

Fingers crossed beanie is ok in there! Xxx


----------



## Boothh

aww hun :hugs: dont worry just put your feet up and chill out, stressing wont help anything! im so sure everything is fine hun, beanie is deffo well and truly stuck with your sickness and other symptoms, and youll get to see everything is fine on monday xxx


----------



## Shiv

Ash if there was no blood on the swabs then i wouldn't worry, the blood could have come from your bum instead. I reckon (in my highly medical proffesional opinion!) that everything is fine :hugs:


----------



## Pippin

Shiv said:


> Ash if there was no blood on the swabs then i wouldn't worry, the blood could have come from your bum instead. I reckon (in my highly medical proffesional opinion!) that everything is fine :hugs:

Ditto what Shiv says but understand your worry though hon :hugs:


----------



## Aunty E

I had bleeding from my bottom and from my labia this time cos I have a persistent yeast infection which was irritated by my knicker elastic (TMI I know). With Mog I bled after BDing and after having a poo :blush: Really scary but most likely nothing :hug:


----------



## ashnbump

thanks for all your kind words ladies :) :hugs:

im trying not to worry, as surely there would have been blood on the swabs if i was 'bleeding' i just panicked like crazy! and because i work in the hospital i thought nipping in A&E wouldn't hurt!

i've resorted to grabbing the bogof frer's from boots, peed on one half an hour after i last peed and this is what i got :-

https://i727.photobucket.com/albums/ww276/slimshadyluva/84a3482d.jpg

so im guessing this is one good sign?

im just gonna pee on these till monday to be sure the lines don't fade! Im a paranoid wreck now!lol!xx


----------



## cleckner04

Ash- :( :hugs: Please try not to worry. I am absolutely sure that beany is fine. I think if he/she wasn't you'd have cramping at the very least. And since there is no more blood, it must've been a one off. With such a high blood flow in pregnancy, blood vessels are much easier to break. I bled with Emma after sex. Freaked me out but it was perfectly fine. :flower:


----------



## spidey

Ash- I bet the blood was from the back end since they didn't see anything with the swabs. But on the bright side of all the worry you had today- you get to see baby on Monday :happydance:


----------



## Kimberly28

Argh!! I haven't been getting the emails saying there is a new post here like I usually do! Grrr!! So now I just had to read through 5 pages to catch up. :dohh:

Boothh, let's see what the doc says. It sounds like you might need a reset like me if you're not preg.

Ash, gosh I know how scary that is. :( I agree with Cleck. During all of first tri with Bry I had spotting sometimes even bright red spots! Talk about scary! The doc said that sometimes sex and having a poo will cause it because of the pressure and increased blood flow to the cervix and causes blood vessels to rupture and that causes spotting. Mine didn't quit until I got into 2nd trimester. Needless to say to play it safe my doc kept me on pelvic rest and off and on bed rest throughout ALL of first tri just in case. But everything was fine and it turned out I have a sensitive cervix. I'm certain that beany is fine since your symptoms are good and no more blood or cramps. I'm 99% certain that if there was a problem, there would be more signs of it. Try to relax and not stress. Stress isn't good for you or beany! Monday is only a day away at this point! Oh and we want pics!!!! :winkwink: By the way, the test line is darker than the control line! That's a very good sign hun! :thumbup: That's how it looked while I was preg with Bryson.

Thanksgiving is one of the biggest holidays of the year here in America. We're still eating leftovers from it here hehe. I love it though. Yummy stuff! 

AFM, yesterday was the last day of Provera. AF has hit tonight. So FINALLY out of limbo land. :thumbup: The only thing is since this is what the doc calls "a progesterone withdraw bleed" do I count today as cd1? :shrug: You all know how important it is that I keep track of my cycles and know where I am in my cycle to time BD correctly. :dohh: *sigh* I got preg with Bry in December and I'm hoping to do the same again this time. [-o&lt; If anyone knows about when to call cycle day 1, I'd appreciate it. My doc was no help and said that it's not a normal cycle because I haven't ovulated, even though I did during my last cycle and I'm sure I will again this time too. The only reason I didn't get the period on time as usual was because of the Provera which she told me it would do in the first place when she prescribed it. She said to not worry about my cycle this time and to just take whatever comes. I cant do that though. This will likely be our last baby and we want a girl and we're trying to tip our odds in favor of that. :blush: I need to be tracking BBT and cycle days and know when I'm about to OV and BD on the right days. Ugh!!! :help:

Oh and hubby is getting sick on me. :dohh: :wacko: :(


----------



## Shiv

Ash - how you feeling today?

Kim - I know nothign about Provera and what to count as CD1. My advice (and you won't want to hear this) is to skip TTC this cycle and start again after your next period. In my opinion it is the only way to be sure of when you should be BD'ing. I think if you do try this month you will not be able to be sure of timing of ovulation etc. Just my opinon though


----------



## ashnbump

I'm feelin ok today shiv, thanks! Sick as a dog still, just ate three Ginger biscuits to try ease the sickness! It's a good sign it's there but it's still horrible lol!

Kim- I (unfortunately) have to agree with shiv :( u have to think what's more important to u, getting pregnant this cycle? Or getting pregnant with more chance of a girl?

How would u feel if u got pregnant this cycle, bit with a boy because ur menses are messed up lol! I know u'd love him just as much, but all this effort for a girl so far, don't give up now! 

Afm- well I've not had any spotting since, no pains, still got all the usual symptoms etc! I don't know how I feel about the scan tomorrow? I'm excited to maybe see beanie hit obviously scared it could be bad news! Eitherway I want to be able to enjoy Xmas with kara, and I'll have some peace of mind tomorrow afternoon! What's meant to be will be I guess! Xx

Xx


----------



## Boothh

kim i agree with the other girls maybe you should skip this cycle as you cant be sure about CDs etc, its only 1 cycle in the scheme of things xxx

ash good luck with your scan tomorrow :hugs: im sure everything will be just fine! and your lines on that test luck great! xxx

afm - still no AF got no more tests so i cant do any, got lots of cm and boobs are not as sore as they have been today, just abit sensitive now really dunno what the hell is going on!


----------



## Pippin

:hug: to everyone!


----------



## Kimberly28

Thanks girls. I guess I have a week to decide. The other bit that plays into this is that according to chinese gender charts (which has proven to be quite accurate as it was when I got preg with Bry) it says my next "girl" month is February and then not again until May. So I could be done for a long while. :cry: Looks like Cleck and I will be the last ones to get pregnant. :( *Sigh* I always seem to get the short end of the stick. :growlmad: I hate how uncooperative my stupid body is. :hissy:


----------



## spidey

Kimberly- I think the only way you could TTC this month is if you consistently get a certain symptom several days before you ovulate. Do those ovulation things you pee on start showing lines days before you ovulate?


----------



## cleckner04

This is the bad part about these types of threads bc some really want to be pregnant but it's not as simple as 'just have sex and you'll get pregnant' for some women. And sometimes like in my case, life get's in the way. Kim, don't give up hope. Give your body time to correct itself so you can get your little girl. :hugs: Concentrate on christmas and the time will fly by. :flower:


----------



## Kimberly28

Spidey, yes they do. I get the lines before my pos opk. And then they darken as OV gets closer and then go light again after OV. I also get the change in CM. It gets thick and cloudy and not so stretchy anymore after OV. Then creamy right after that. So I can tell when my body is gearing up for OV. I'm thinking about temping to see if I see the tell tale temp shift to confirm OV as well as the signs before OV of my cervix becoming fertile, my cm becoming ewcm and the opk lines going from light to dark. I usually start using the opks on cycle day 13. I think I'm just gonna BD until cd13 since I usually OV on cd 16 and watch my opks after that. That's still 3 days out from OV allowing appropriate timing. If I fail at TTC this month then I'm definitely done until either Feb or May. But I know it will be worth it in the end. It's just frustrating in the meantime is all. Now, if I didn't or couldn't recognize signs that my body is gearing up for OV, I really wouldn't bother with TTC at all this cycle. Since I know what to look for and know what the signs are, I think I might give it a try. Like I already said, I can stop BD'ing at cd13 to be on the safe side. Then I'll wait and see what happens. This way I wont screw up the timing. Anyhoo, I'll still ponder it over the next few days during AF...


----------



## Pippin

Hey *Kim*, I'm afraid I'm a little bit skeptic for the whole trying for a girl thing. Sorry :blush: I know ladies that were desperate for a boy and dtd day of positive opk and got girls and visa versa. I just think it's the luck of the draw. We'd like a girl but I'm simply not convinced by all the literature I've read about timing, orgasms, etc etc. The Chinese predictor was right for Sam and this one should be a girl but again we dtd on the day of my positive so we shall see in 10 weeks time (hopefully). I guess you have to ask yourself whether you'd really be that upset if you had another boy? I thought I would but after my MMC I just want a little healthy sticky bean and I'll be happy. If Sam gets a play mate that would be fun for him and if we get a girl that'll be that's what's meant to be.

You'll know what to do in a week :hugs: just go with your heart. I'll let you into a secret too. We weren't going to try the month we hit gold with this one due to timing at work and only one af after the mmc. But the night of my positive opk I just knew we had to give it a go. It didn't quite 'happen' that night if you know what I mean but I got another positive the next day (first time ever getting two positives in a row) dtd and hit jack pot. I feel it was meant to be. Go with your gut, you'll know. :hugs:


----------



## Boothh

i dont understand alot of this ttc stuff, but i do think we probably make it alot worse for ourselves by stressing all the time, 

still no AF for me!


----------



## Shiv

Kim - as long as you get the signs and trust your body then no harm in trying I guess. I must say (and this is just my opinion) that the science behind ttc a girl interests me (that is not to say that I don't think a lot of it is down to luck), so it suprises with all the scientific reasoning you have previoulsy used, that you would not ttc in months where the chinese gender predictor is not girl. This is by no means having a go at you, I am just suprised that is all. Most people are either (wait for it this is gonna be a hugely sweeping statement :haha:) scientific in their beliefs or more (can't think of the right word, want to say airy fairy!) superstitious. You seem to combine both. Does that mean you don't completely trust the science in that even if you only had sex so that female sperm were around at ovulation, you still think it would end up a boy? Just really interested in your views Kim, it is all just very interesting!

Boothh - when is your doctors appt?

Cleck - i just wanna give you hugs :hugs: and more :hugs:


----------



## Boothh

my appointment is on tuesday my cm seems to be the cm i get a day or 2 before i get ewcm when i presume i OV is it possible to OV this late in a cycle?


----------



## Kimberly28

Shiv said:


> Kim - as long as you get the signs and trust your body then no harm in trying I guess. I must say (and this is just my opinion) that the science behind ttc a girl interests me (that is not to say that I don't think a lot of it is down to luck), so it suprises with all the scientific reasoning you have previoulsy used, that you would not ttc in months where the chinese gender predictor is not girl. This is by no means having a go at you, I am just suprised that is all. Most people are either (wait for it this is gonna be a hugely sweeping statement :haha:) scientific in their beliefs or more (can't think of the right word, want to say airy fairy!) superstitious. You seem to combine both. Does that mean you don't completely trust the science in that even if you only had sex so that female sperm were around at ovulation, you still think it would end up a boy? Just really interested in your views Kim, it is all just very interesting!

I'm honestly not sure what to think. I do know that lots of people have said that the Chinese chart was accurate for them too. But surely others have conceived the opposite of what the chart claims they should of for whatever month they got pregnant in. :shrug: Even though I got preg with a boy (Bryson) in a month that it says was a "boy month" for me, I'm still not 100% sure if I believe in it or not. 

As for the Shettles Method (the timing of BD in relation to OV) has claimed many successes and of course some failures even though more successes than failures. I bought the book by Dr. Landrum B. Shettles and there is an insert in there to cut out and fill out and mail back to himself and his business partner about your experience using the Shettles Method and if it worked for you or not. So I mean that is a form of accountability as well as the testimonies from patients of his over the years. So I dunno. I'm not sure what I think anymore. I mean if you read the book 'How to choose the sex of your baby', it explains plenty of scientific research and evidence that went into his method and made it what it is today. But of course, nothing is ever 100% guaranteed so naturally there are some failures. There is also a woman online who claims that BD exactly 12 hrs after OV will result in a girl but I'm not sure if I believe that despite her claims of testimonies. I do know that when I got pregnant with Bryson, I remember using the bathroom, after a wee, I wiped and saw a bunch of ewcm. We were on a TTC break at the time and we were basically NTNP. So I thought, it probably wont result in pregnancy but it sure wont hurt to try anyways. At the least, hubby and I had a fun time of it. Well much to my surprise I got pregnant, with Bryson. So I'm sure I OV'ed within 24 hrs of that BD. 
I also know that I've seen other girls in the TTC section who could only BD 4-5 days before their expected OV day and not only got pregnant, but found out through ultrasound that they were having a girl. So I dunno. :shrug: Some docs recommend trying the Shettles Method while others say it's nothing but a guy trying to sell a book. 
I probably seem very wishy washy now. :wacko: I'm honestly not sure what I believe is true and/or works. The Shettles Method seemed more scientific based so it's the one I've stuck by for the most part. I wish all of this was easier than it is. :( I guess the reason I want a little girl so bad is partly because I'm dying to dress her up in all of the darling little pink frilly dresses and stuff. But another reason is that I had such a terrible upbringing and my own mother completely takes my very existence for granted, I would be in 2nd heaven to have my own little girl to dress up and spoil and love and let have all of the girlie things that she wants which I was deprived of as a child. I was pretty much forced into being a tom boy as a kid while my sister was bought barbies and dolls and such. Now I am half tom girl, half girly girl. I guess what I'm saying is that I want my own daughter to give a proper upbringing to and to have and love and cherish as I'd know how special it is to have a daughter and appreciate her every day of her life. If that makes any sense. :shrug:


----------



## Pippin

Boothh said:


> my appointment is on tuesday my cm seems to be the cm i get a day or 2 before i get ewcm when i presume i OV is it possible to OV this late in a cycle?

You can have an anovulatory cycle (think that's what it's called) where you skip the period and ovulate twice. Get :sex: just in case!!!


----------



## Pippin

Are you drawing the line at two children Kim? I could be tempted by one more go if this is a boy. I understand what you are saying too but I reckon what ever sex children you'll have you'll allow them to be the person they want to be rather than how it seems you Mum made you grow up. Remember you are soooo different to her and you don't need to prove to anyone including yourself that you can be a better Mum than she was. You are already love! :hugs:


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## Shiv

Kim - i understand why you would want a girl so bad. I get it! I also get why you are trying the Shettles method, out of everything it does seem the most scientifc. I guess the only thing I don't get is the whole not TTC during the months when the chinese predictor says boy, I am not very superstitous and don't get that! but you gotta do what you gotta do, i truly hope you get your little princess :hugs:


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## Boothh

i just worked out my chinese age and i was predicted girl when i concieved jesse, also we only had sex once that month and from my dates and also the fact jesse was born on his EDD i must have actually concieved him 4 or 5 days after having sex ¬_¬


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## Kimberly28

Pippin, I already have 2 children. Both boys. My oldest is 13. I'm just not sure if my body can handle 2 more babies. Chances are that with this next pregnancy, I will have to have a cerclage put in my cervix. I almost had to have one while preg with Bry as well. Two more babies will be much less easy on our wallets too haha. Of course I will always let my children be free to always be themselves. No one will ever love them for who they are the way that I do. Thanks for your kind words. It means a lot. :hugs: 

Shiv, we probably will ttc anyways. It's my hubby tho who is the most superstitious. I might have a hard time convincing him to ttc during those months. :dohh:

By the way, my AF went from heavy last night to spotty today. :dohh: :wacko:


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## Kimberly28

Boothh said:


> i just worked out my chinese age and i was predicted girl when i concieved jesse, also we only had sex once that month and from my dates and also the fact jesse was born on his EDD i must have actually concieved him 4 or 5 days after having sex ¬_¬

Did you also work out the lunar month? It's not the same number month as on our standard calendar. Example December is 12 month of normal calendar and on chinese one it's the 11th month. So you have to take that into consideration as well. LOL. DH says to give all the facts. I just told him to shoo lol.


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## Pippin

*Kim *Ahhh I see didn't remember you had a teenager as well :dohh: yep I really draw the line at four too :rofl: child care alone would be stupid (in London £4000 a month full time :shock:) Sorry you have to have the stitch thingy, must be a real worry :hugs: Hope you get your girly then and I'd go by the opks. Mine start changing 5 days before so plenty of warning time :hugs: for a wonky cycle. Yay for spotting it'll be over soon then. xxx


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## Pippin

*Ash* good luck with you scan today I know it'll be fine :hug: bit jealous you're going to see bubs already 10 more sleeps for me. xxx


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## Shiv

Good luck today Ash - sure you wont need it - show us a pic when you get back!


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## ashnbump

thanks ladies! i dont really like the idea of early scans so im nervous now lol! i dont think they'll give me a pic this early, but i'll c what happens! im hoping they can do an abdominal scan rather than internal, i bet they just go for internal tho lol! suppose whatever gives the best view of beanie!

i need to fill my bladder, but i cant keep anything down, not even water so what the heck do i do???

x


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## Boothh

ash i had an internal scan when i found out about mmc, and its really not that bad at all, the thought is much worse than it actually is :hugs: im sure everything will be fine, good luck today xxxx


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## Boothh

THIS WAS SOMEONES STATUS ON MY FB THATS PREGNANT WITH TWINS -needs ma dad 2 hurry up coz i need a fag :) :) love my boi's loads 


:dohh: things like this really piss me off when i want a baby so much and people are so thick.


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## ashnbump

I've had an internal before Boothh, with the one I lost, and I didn't find it very pleasant at all! It kind of hurt! Plus it reminds me of the fact I had one with my angel baby etc!

That's awful about the status on facebook, my close friend smoked her hole pregnancy! And even though I didn't say anythin I completely disagree with it! Xx


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## Shiv

Ash when I had an early scan at 8 weeks they did an ultrasound - external, so you are pretty close to that so maybe it will not be internal!


Boothh - all I have to say is grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr


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## Aunty E

I've already talked about when we BD'd for Mog and this one - it's almost classic Shettles. With Mog, we did the deed about 36 hours before I would have OV'd and then not again until about 24 hours afterwards. With this one, we BD'd probably only a couple of hours before ovulation, and certainly on OV day. We were desperate for a girl, just desperate, so we've been very lucky given OH's family history of boys. 

Hope scan is going/has gone ok Ash.


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## Kimberly28

Thanks for the replies ladies. 

AF seems to have disappeared. :wacko: It's just strange because even tho I bled off and on while on the Provera, the night after my last pill AF came on full heavy (day before yesterday), then yesterday was spotting, and today, nada. Really weird. Perhaps there wasn't left since I continued to have my period off and on during the provera. :shrug: I read online though that any spotting/bleeding after fully finished with the provera is to be counted as cd 1. So I guess today is cd 3. Maybe I'll still try this cycle and hope for the best. :shrug:

Ash, good luck on your scan hun. I'm sure it will go well. Please let us all know asap. I'll be watching out for your post! :hugs:


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## ashnbump

Quickie! Scan went perfect beanie has a heartbeat! Xx


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## Kimberly28

Ash! That's WONDERFUL!!!! :happydance: :yipee: :wohoo: I'm so happy and excited for you!! I told you that this one would be just fine and that those symptoms were good! :D CONGRATS!!! Enjoy the rest of the 8 or so months ahead! :hugs: Any pics to share? What was the BPM for beanie? (Beats per minute, just curious is all.)


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## ashnbump

Ps. NO INTERNAL WOOOOOHOOO! xx


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## Shiv

YAY great news Ash! Very happy for you lovely :hugs::happydance:


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## Boothh

great news ash!! so happy everything is fine i knew it would be :D:D:D :happydance: xxxx


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## Kimberly28

Yay also for no internals! :thumbup: \\:D/ I bet you feel very reassured! :hugs: So pleased for you hun!! :dance: I bet the tiny bit of spotting you saw the other day was nothing more than a bit of leftover implantation from beany getting good and comfy for a nice long stay! :winkwink:


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## Pippin

:yipee: congrats ash great news. 

Really nervous for mine now in a little over a week. Can't see it being anything more than bad news like last time but trying to be positive :wacko:. xxx


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## Shiv

Pip - the odds are in your favour for a healthy bean, try to remember that!:hugs:


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## Kimberly28

Pip, why do you think it will be bad news? I'm sure you will feel very reassured next week when you see that little heartbeat flickering away on the screen. :hugs:


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## Boothh

pip honey im sure everything will be fine :hugs: try not to worry though i know easier said than done, nearly all of us in here have had a loss so we all understand how anxious you feel xxx

afm i have ewcm today and lots of it, so better be BDing tonight and for next few days,just incase!
this is some weird weird cycle!


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## ashnbump

sorry i couldnt update anything else ladies, i was in the hospital with 2% battery on my iPhone!

so saw beanie, he/she was perfect, little heart beating away, i didnt ask the bpm tho kim sorry! She just said all looked fabulous, exactly as it should at this gestation! He/she was moving around nicely too! 

they've put me back two days, so im 7w 2d, but i did expect that as my cycles were never 28 days, and most due date calculators online are automatically set that way etc!

two days is only two days though!

so i had the scan externally thankfully! was not looking forward to an internal at all lol! 

it was so weird, it wasnt like just a blob, it had different bits etc haha! head and body were distinctive, obvs not detailed though! 

i was really surprised everything was ok! only bit of 'bad' news was that my morning sickness is so bad that i had 2++ keytones in my urine, and ive been put on safe anti-sickness drugs, hopefully they'll help anyway because iit really has been bad :(

everything else was great though, so bring on the booking visit and the 12 week scan!

pip - dont be worried, i went thinking "whats meant to be will be" and luckily it was a positive outcome! the midwife i saw today told me that 1 in 3 pregnancies end in miscarriage, and this is my 3rd pregnancy (and yours too) so 'statistically' we've had ours! im looking at it that way to stay positive! Im sure everything will be fine with you pip, theres no reason for it not to be hun!xx

boothh - ur cycle has been crazy! but with a bit of look, this is the one!

x


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## Pippin

Thanks ladies :hugs:, I didn't mean to sound moany just apprehensive is all. You're all lovely though!!!! I like thinking that I've had my one in three Ash so thanks hon. I'm going back to the same place we found no heartbeat the last time so I'm already thinking the worst. I almost want to go somewhere different lol but I'm being silly old cow :dohh:. 10 days can't come quick enough in my eyes.

Anyyywwaaaayyyy enough about me........ let's talk you guys. Hope you are all good! I'm bloody cold here and can't get warm and it's only set to get colder. PPPPLLLLEEEAAASE no snow :growlmad:


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## ashnbump

well pip, when i had karas 12 week scan, they did the scan in the same room i was scanned for my mc, and today they scanned me in the same room again, to find more good news, so dont feel to apprehensive about that (even though i was the same with kara and this bean lol!)

its nice to think we've had our 1 in 3 (i hope) i know its not 100% gauranteed, but its nice to think of!x


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## Kimberly28

Pip, It's cold here too. High in the 40s and rainy. Blah! I'm so cold I stayed in my warm pj's today. :haha: Grab yourself a blanket hun. I remember when I was preg with Bry I would get cold and hot, cold and hot, constantly, it was so annoying! Haha. 

Ash, wow, that is a great way of thinking it. That helps me, too. Only, I've had 2 miscarriages and 2 live births. Talk about the short end of the stick. :wacko: So hopefully though, that means I've had my fill and that it wont be happening again and next time everything will be just fine. [-o&lt;

I just knew everything would be fine with your beany Ash. I just sensed it and how exciting that must have been to see beany moving around and the little strong heartbeat! :happydance:


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## Boothh

yeah i kept thinking that 1 in 3 thing before i had my second mc so it didnt work for me, BUT when i think that we want 4children, and by then ill have been pregnant 6times (hopefully ) so iv had my 2 for the statistics now and the next 3pregnancies will be healthy :D


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## Kimberly28

Atta girl Boothh! That's what I keep telling myself as well. :thumbup: Now bring on December bfp's for the rest of us not prego ladies!! :happydance:


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## Shiv

Argh am I the only one who doesn't like that statistic! It is so high!


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## Aunty E

Yay, go Ash (and beanie!). So pleased to see everything is good :)

Miscarriage statistics scare the cr*p out of me - they seem really really high. This should be our last pregnancy, and I somehow feel like we're on borrowed time. Stupidly paranoid, and certainly if bubs came now, he'd have a 70-80% chance of being fine. So I should just count my blessings and shut up :dohh:


Although, OH mentioned a third baby yesterday :haha:


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## Boothh

i hate the statistic but it does take into account very early mcs aswell apparantly, and i read a few times that theres a 75% chance that you will mc at around the time AF would be due so think how many women dont even know about it, it is just natures way i suppose and theres nothing we can do apart from think positive and take our vitamins!! x


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## Kimberly28

I don't like it either :nope: but as I said earlier, hopefully I've already had my fair share. Surely the next one is my turn for another HEALTHY pregnancy and HEALTHY baby!! [-o&lt;


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## Boothh

ooo AE i forgot to mention i cant believe your almost in 3rd tri already!! the time has gone so so quickly! xxx


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## Kimberly28

:saywhat: Goodness!! Time has gone by fast!! :shock: I didn't even realise she is almost 3rd tri! I cant wait to see pics of her baby boy! :thumbup:

Just watch, we will turn around and Ash will be in 3rd tri while we're back in 1st tri haha. :dohh:


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## Shiv

I sometimes think life would have been a lot easier a couple fo generations ago when you didn't know (or wouldn't have been considered) pregnant until you had missed two periods. No home testing etc..............modern science is great but it does have its down sides, it seems like an incredibly long time from taking a test @weeks pregnant to getting a healthy baby!

AE - has it gone as quick for you as it has done for all of us? Third tri already - wowzers! have you got a name yet? I keep trying to think of names to suggest to you, something quite traditional but not too normal - this morning's gem is Stan! :haha:

Pip just 9 sleeps to go!


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## joeyjo

I see what you mean Shiv - but imagine a 6 week wait!


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## joeyjo

Oo Shiv - we have friends and their little boys are called Stanley & Lenny (Leonard). I actually love the names, especially Stanley but when we have the 3 together (i.e. with my Geirge too) I always think their names sound like a bunch of war veterans.


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## Shiv

hahahaha JoeyJo - they do sound like a bunch of old men sat around a table playing dominoes! I do like the name stanley though.

The other day Sophia brought me the baby names book from the book shelf (she could have picked any but she picked that one the day before I was due af!) anyway I have decided I quite like the name Elsie, so old fashioned but I think it's cute, doesn't really go with Sophia though! And I'm not pregnant!:haha:

Boothh, let us know how it goes at the docs.


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## joeyjo

I like Elsie too :) I love old fashioned names. If George has a sister Edith is a definite contender for a name (Edie for short) & I also like Lois after my great-gran

I wish I'd known though before I had George just how many Georges there would be locally!


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## ashnbump

shiv - i think that all the time, how i wish i was one of those lucky women who dont know they're pregnant till late on haha! I hate knowing early, it causes so much worry! elsie is quite a lovely name, me and david talked about names when we started ttc, but we've not discussed it since lol!

joey/AE - im not a mega fan of the old names, i have to say though, when i hear other peoples children with names like alfie and charlie etc, i do think they're nice, just maybe not one for me!

boothh - hope you get some answers today sweetie! its about time you knew what was going on!

afm - i started my anti-sickness meds today! wooooooohoooooooo, i have to take 3 a day, until the sickness wears off (hopefully soon) it was 11 weeks exactly with Kara! 

Is it possible to have mild cravings this early, i swear im craving those blue and pink fizzy cola bottles, i ate through about 4 bags a week with Kara, and then moved on to sausage butties with red sauce in the later stages :blush: yum yum 

well after the scan my mind was at ease far about half an hour lol, then i started thinking omg, my next af is due in the next week, what if something goes wrong :(

bloody percentages and statistics are horrid lol!

on a BRIGHTER NOTE . . . . . . . . . 25 days till CHRISTMAAAAAAASSSS!!!!!! cant bloody wait!xx


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## Boothh

blue and pink fizzy cola bottles were all i could stomach til 14weeks lol and they were my main craving all through my pregnancy with jesse! maybe your having a boyy ooo :p


i dont really like many old fashioned names for myself either i think they are cute but i cant imagine myself using them, saying that though jesse is hebrew! and the girls name we like 

Alice-Grace is a little bit old fashioned i suppose!

its really snowy here my cognitive therapy session has been cancelled but hopefully my docs appointment wont be aslong as we can get there! stuart has managed to get to work though but he takes more risks than most in the snow cus he thinks he is a boy racer :dohh:


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## ashnbump

well i craved them with kara too, so its anyones guess, although i think boy because beanie is causing me trouble already lol!

hopefully ur drs appointment is still on for today!

we got a dusting of snow, but not nearly as much as you seem to have got, which im kinda glad about because i need to get to work lol!x


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## Boothh

its annoying cus up here we really will be stuck i better go shopping tonight and get some bread and stick in the freezer etc just incase it gets anyworse! stuart said the main roads are okay but we live on an A road and they close it off regularly in winter! xx


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## Aunty E

I like Stan, and OH likes Leonard too! Current favourites are Edmund or Arthur. We're dithering between the two, I prefer the short versions of Edmund over the short versions of Arthur, but I prefer Arthur over Edmund when you say the full name. I think we'll make a decision shortly. The other thing is that I know quite a few little Arthurs now, and I'd rather he had a name which wasn't all that frequently used. Edmund Arthur is starting to look like a contender.

I love old-fashioned names, we liked Edith for a girl, and Elsie was my grandmother's name - she and her twin were Elsie and Edward, born in 1923. Part of OH's brief for thinking about names was that if the Victorian's might have used it, it was a goer ;)

Time has gone very quickly this time round - although I've not enjoyed the pregnancy as much, I've been so busy with Mog and everything else that a lot of the time I've forgotten I was pregnant, which never happened with my first pregnancy. I've been getting stuff organised slowly, we have the pram, which I think is important, and I'm going to get the new respisense sorted. Other than that, I have to clear out our spare room and redecorate and move Imogen's stuff in. I've sort of got my Christmas annual leave pencilled in to do that. Looking forward to giving Mog a new room, I've got my eye on some lovely owl wall stickers ;)


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## joeyjo

I like both Arthur & Edmund - and they run really well together :)

I was trying to persuade DH on Edward if we have another boy (assuming we get preggo) but then my Dad told me that Eddie was my Grandad George's brother and that just seems a bit too much! DH bless him can't get past Edward Scissorhands!


----------



## Shiv

If we had had a boy we last time round we had decided on Henry - it took us ages to come up with a name we liked after our first choice (samuel - yey pip!) was nabbed by one of our friends who gave birth 10 weeks before us! My surname is James so we thought Henry James was a very solid name - I am unsure about it now though!

I like the name Art, or Artie as a short version of Arthur. Edmund reminds me of the boy out of Lion the Witch and the wardrobe!


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## Boothh

we have curtis as a favourite next boys name at the moment but we like rhys and ryan too, 

there loads of girls names i love but boys is really hard!


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## joeyjo

Boothh said:


> we have curtis as a favourite next boys name at the moment but we like rhys and ryan too,
> 
> there loads of girls names i love but boys is really hard!

I really like Ryan :) possibly because a really fit lad at school was called Ryan :kiss:

Friends called their son Rhys not long before I had G. I told mum and she was like please don't call him Rhys, please! I was like "why?" and she said that 2 of the worst kids she ever taught were called Rhys (she's a teacher) - she admits its not fair but her face when she was reminiscing!


----------



## ashnbump

There's a bit of a fashion at the moment for older names, but I don't think David would even consider anything like that! I like Joshua and Callum for boys names with David as a middle name!

Nothing I'm really fond of on the girl front though! I'll look nearer the time lol! X


----------



## Boothh

jesses middle name is David :) after my uncle who really looked after me when i was a tear away teenager, stuart only let me cus it makes him Jesse David - JD like in scrubs hahaha


----------



## cleckner04

Ooo name chat! Well, we are decided on a boys name from last time. If we have a boy he'll be named Ethan Anderson. Anderson after DH's grandfather. And if we have a girl I really like the name Ava. But don't have a middle name for her. I also love the name Elizabeth but I can't decide. :haha:


----------



## Pippin

Kimberly28 said:


> :saywhat: Goodness!! Time has gone by fast!! :shock: I didn't even realise she is almost 3rd tri! I cant wait to see pics of her baby boy! :thumbup:
> 
> Just watch, we will turn around and Ash will be in 3rd tri while we're back in 1st tri haha. :dohh:

You not planning on me getting there or something? :winkwink:

We had snow today but it was rubbish thank goodness! Snowed all day but didn't lay. I worry as Sam's childminder is on a hill and I'm worried about getting there and then not getting back to up there to get him after. Would be very scary walking him down in case w e both tumble and it's a long, long, long way up there :dohh:

Boothh did I miss the part about the doctors, how did it go? It was today wasn't it? xxx

As for names we don't have a girls but we do have a boy, keeping it secret for now :haha:


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## Shiv

I love the name Ava, DH must have vetoed it last time otherwise it defo would have been in the mix. Ava Elizabeth Cleckner has a good ring to it Cleck!

Spoilsport Pippin!:winkwink:


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## ashnbump

I too like Ava! I have a bit of a soft spot for Lexie too, bit David is unbelievably fussy :dohh: I don't think we'll tell everyone the name we pick till baby is born, incase we change our minds like last time lol!

How was the docs Boothh?

The snow is worrying when ur pregnant, I agree pip, a toddler falling and a pregnant lady too is scary!


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## Boothh

hey just back from the docs hes sending me for blood tests on thursday to check my hormones, :) at least he is on the ball ha x


----------



## Pippin

Boothh said:


> hey just back from the docs hes sending me for blood tests on thursday to check my hormones, :) at least he is on the ball ha x

:thumbup:

I've just eaten most of a medium pizza, cheesy garlic bread and some wings...... damn Pizza Hut and their deals :growlmad: :rofl:


----------



## Boothh

oh i ate half of a large dominos pepperoni passion dominator on saturday night along with a full bottle of wine :rofl: and im not even pregnant!! 

we had mozzerella and tomato tortellini in garlic sauce with garlic bread for dinner and then we went to asda after my docs appointment so i just ate a jam donut and a yorkie cookie :dohh:

the donuts were reduced to 24p though so i had to buy them lol x


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## ashnbump

Mmmmmmmmmm pizza hut :D I wish I could stomach food :( I've lost about half a stone! Can't wait till these pills have kicked in properly, although I have felt a lot better today :thumbup:

Boothh - good to know ur doc is getting something done! Hopefully nothing that can't be solved easily! Xx


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## Boothh

really glad your feeling a little better today ash! xxx


----------



## joeyjo

Boothh said:


> oh i ate half of a large dominos pepperoni passion dominator on saturday night along *with a full bottle of wine  and im not even pregnant!! *
> 
> we had mozzerella and tomato tortellini in garlic sauce with garlic bread for dinner and then we went to asda after my docs appointment so i just ate a jam donut and a yorkie cookie :dohh:
> 
> the donuts were reduced to 24p though so i had to buy them lol x

Good job really with a full bottle of wine! - think I'll be cracking open some wine tonight; its only Tuesday but it feels like its been a long week already :blush:


----------



## Boothh

joeyjo said:


> Boothh said:
> 
> 
> oh i ate half of a large dominos pepperoni passion dominator on saturday night along *with a full bottle of wine  and im not even pregnant!! *
> 
> we had mozzerella and tomato tortellini in garlic sauce with garlic bread for dinner and then we went to asda after my docs appointment so i just ate a jam donut and a yorkie cookie :dohh:
> 
> the donuts were reduced to 24p though so i had to buy them lol x
> 
> Good job really with a full bottle of wine! - think I'll be cracking open some wine tonight; its only Tuesday but it feels like its been a long week already :blush:Click to expand...

LMAO i meant the pizza bit not the wine :dohh: :p im going to have some southern comfort when jess is in bed hes screaming the place down as we speak and stuart is wrestling him tryna change his nappy lol


----------



## joeyjo

Boothh said:


> joeyjo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boothh said:
> 
> 
> oh i ate half of a large dominos pepperoni passion dominator on saturday night along *with a full bottle of wine  and im not even pregnant!! *
> 
> we had mozzerella and tomato tortellini in garlic sauce with garlic bread for dinner and then we went to asda after my docs appointment so i just ate a jam donut and a yorkie cookie :dohh:
> 
> the donuts were reduced to 24p though so i had to buy them lol x
> 
> Good job really with a full bottle of wine! - think I'll be cracking open some wine tonight; its only Tuesday but it feels like its been a long week already :blush:Click to expand...
> 
> LMAO i meant the pizza bit not the wine :dohh: :p im going to have some southern comfort when jess is in bed hes screaming the place down as we speak and stuart is wrestling him tryna change his nappy lolClick to expand...


Aww - hope he goes down OK in the end :hugs::hugs: also meant to say - glad your GP is on the ball and getting tests done etc


----------



## spidey

Lots to catch up on!

Boothh- I can't wait to see what the doctor says about your long wonky cycle. You might be super fertile right now too :thumbup: I know this is super nosey, but what is your cognitive behavioral therapy for? I did a bit for anxiety and it really helped.

Ash- Congrats of the HB!!! I hope the pills start working for you soon. Its no fun being sick all the time. Are you able to work still or are you taking time off?

Pippin- How are you feeling?

Baby names- I haven't given it a thought at all! If Kira was a boy I was going to name him Dexter. :haha: So perhaps that name is still up for the running, although its a little twisted to name a baby after the serial killer character "Dexter" on tv. I'm not sure why we decided on Kira... I was so certain I was having a boy that we weren't giving much thought to girl names at the time.


----------



## Pippin

:hi: spidey I'm good thanks, not to sick last few days which is good but also worrying. Sam had me up at 4:30 this morning so I'm tired, very tired :sleep:

Realised why Sam has been a bit off recently, a massive back tooth has come through poor bugger, no wonder he's up and nappies have been vial!!!! 

8 sleeps.... :yipee:


----------



## Boothh

spidey it is for anxiety, i did abit too many drugs when i was a teenager and as a result i am paranoid and anxious as hell, i have beta blockers but they dont do much, so i have these sessions now though i was on a waiting list 5 months and its been rearranged twice so far so im yet to get there! i did psychology in college and cognitive behaviour was one of the things i did really well at, so seeing as i understand all the concept behind it i dont know if its going to work for me ¬_¬


----------



## Aunty E

My OH loved the name Dexter - I wouldn't worry about the TV show, it won't run forever ;)


----------



## Pippin

Goodness it seems like forever waiting for you lot to ovulate, anyone nearly in the tww or am I just being impatient!?? :haha:


----------



## Shiv

hahahahhahaha pippin, you make me laugh! Well AF has just left properly for me, but we aren't trying this month so I am no use to you! I am however planning on writing down what my cm is like throughout the month so that next month when we try I know what is normal and what is not!

A quick question. Is CD1 the day your period starts or is that counted as CD 0?

Anyway ~CD 7 creamy cm :haha:


----------



## spidey

AF has just finished for me too. We'll see what happens this month in terms of TTC- I should be fertile sometime early next week I think. I'm not super excited about TTC right now... I'm having my doubts again. But thats typical for me.

Pippin- glad you're feeling okay minus being tired. Don't let a lack of symptoms worry you. All the girls at my work became pregnant in the span of a year and I was the only one with morning sickness. There were 5 others who felt just fine. I was very jealous!

Boothh- I bet the therapy will help. It really helped with my anxiety and its much nicer than needing medicine for the rest of your life.

AE- The only problem is my DH wanted to name our son Dexter because of the serial killer on tv :haha: :dohh: We still might use that name though. DH's last name is Tracy, so we need a boys name that is masculine since DH is often mistaken for a girl because of his last name (which is pretty stupid!)

Shiv- nice experiment :haha: Ever since having Kira I've hardly had a speck of cm.


----------



## Shiv

In emails I am often mistaken for a man - so my name is Siobhan James but where i used to work if you sent an internal email it would come up as from James, Siobhan. i used to get SOOOOOOOo many emails back saying, "Hi James.............". it used to really piss me off, especially as it was an internal person so they know how the email system works grrrrrrrrrrrr

sorry for that little rant :haha:


----------



## Boothh

well im on cd 56 now so thats 2 cycles for the average person :dohh: and hide nor hair of stupid AF! oh well blood tests tomorrow (yaay)


----------



## cleckner04

Checking in real quick. I don't get on this thread nearly as much now but I hope you are all well. Congrats on the heartbeat Ash! And good luck for your ultrasound Pip! Boothh, I hope you get everything figured out with AF. :flower: 

Today is my first day of working out again. I'm not doing great with eating because I had pizza for lunch but only 3 slices so that is good for me when I can usually eat half a pizza. :blush: I'm writing it all down so I can stay accountable for myself. So that is what is up with me right now. :flower:


----------



## joeyjo

Pip - AF due Friday for me


----------



## Boothh

still getting ewcm maybe i am actually OVing really late? we BD not last night the night before so we will tonight too might aswell have nothing to lose! xx


----------



## Pippin

Yay Joeyjo I can start getting excited for your results and everyone else it's not long till ovulations so :yipee: I love seeing the tww unfold :thumbup:

Spidey after all I said I have had a day of nausea, probably made worse by the fact I was up since 4:20 with Sam, but the worst I have suffered yet :dohh: going to bed soon to get away from it. Eating helps so I've pigged out all day now I feel even more bloated :rofl:

Booth the more I think about it the more I think you're having a double month. Get :sex: hon

Shiv aren't you just a tiny bit tempted to try :haha:

:hi: Cleck :hugs: hope you are ok been thinking about you this week and hoping you aren't too sad. xxx


----------



## cleckner04

I'm doing much better today pip! Yesterday was my day for tears. Now I just gotta be strong for Emma and move on as a single mom! I won't allow myself to get too depressed. I have a few craft projects that I can finish, and my weight loss goals so hopefully it all keeps me good and busy. Plus I have BnB to keep up with of course. :winkwink:


----------



## Shiv

i am tempted but then I remember that if i did get pregnant this month then my due date would only be 3 days away from Sophia's due date and so the chances are that the new baby would have a very similar birthday to Sophia and I would prefer a bit of a gap so that is another reason to wait a month!

i have worked out that I should ovulate around the 6th Jan so not long to wait until then! it will fly what with Christmas and NY etc!

Pip - glad you feel sick :haha: you know what I mean!:hugs:


----------



## spidey

Shiv- that would irritate me too! DH's name is Ian, but if you pronounce it with a southern accent it sounds like "Anne"... so it doesn't make matters any better combined with his feminine sounding last name :haha:

Pippin- hope you get a better sleep tonight. Being tired always makes morning sickness worse.

Boothh- I bet you are SUPER fertile! You've been gearing up to release this egg for more than 50 days :thumbup:

Cleckner- I think cutting back some on portions is the best way to diet otherwise you'll set yourself up for failure. I would love it if you kept posting here :thumbup:


----------



## cleckner04

Wait, spidey, do you have a southern accent? :haha: Are you actually from maryland? I think you are right about portions. I haven't eaten anything differently today than I normally would, I just ate less of it. Emma on the other hand, has been a bottomless pit today. :dohh: Which doesn't help me because she always tries to feed me whatever she's eating. Not good. She's like my little temptress. :rofl:


----------



## Kimberly28

GRRRRRR!!! This thread is really crappy about keeping me updated! :growlmad: I keep having to read through 4-5 pages to catch up! Oy-vey! :dohh:

Cleck, Keep it up and you'll be a skinny thing when DH gets back! :winkwink:

Pippin, I cant wait for you to be in 3rd tri too! :haha: Glad you're feeling alright. It could be MUCH worse! :winkwink:

Ash, so glad you're feeling a little bit better. :hugs:


As for names I'm scared of jinxing it as it seems that every time we come up with a name I either wind up mc'ing and not be able to bear to use the name for the next one or I end up not getting preg because we decided too early. :wacko: I guess I will risk it though. :dohh: If we luck out and get our little princess her name will be Maisy (still working on the middle name). We haven't decided on a boy name (yet) in hopes that we won't need one. :blush: :haha:
I'm only cd5 here. So not even close to the 2ww. :haha: The thing is that IF I do conceive this cycle, the due date will be near Bry's. :wacko: Surely they wouldn't wind up being born the exact same day? :dohh:


----------



## Boothh

well we BD monday, last night and plan to tonight and tomorrow at least so hopefully if i am OVing late then we still got a chance, bloods today nice !


----------



## spidey

LOL Cleckner. I don't have a southern accent, but I do have a Baltimore one. So I say "werder" instead of water, "Balmer" instead of Baltimore and other things that DH likes to make fun of. He's from here too but speaks properly. Thats cute that Emma likes to feed you 

Good luck Boothh with your blood test!


----------



## Boothh

well iv been for my test and bloody fainted in the nurses office! :dohh: she took 3 big vials though and i already felt sicky when i went in and she said it was probably cus of the drop in blood pressure when they take blood, i feel really crappy now though :( have an appointment on tuesday to discuss results, and i think they are testing hcg too so if im pregnant they will know x


----------



## Shiv

oh no hon, sorry you feel rubbish - good that they get your results back so soon though :hugs:


----------



## Boothh

right just done a frer and gave it to stuart before i looked at it and he said he can see a line (within time limit) and i looked and i can too though very faint, really do not know what the hell is going on, i have peed loads today though so i dunno, i have had blood took for hcg anyway so i guess ill know on tuesday :shrug:


----------



## Boothh

just been and looked again (still just in time limit) and there is def def def a very faint line, like not faint enough so i dunno if im imagining it an actuall line but faint, stuart saw it first so blame him!


----------



## spidey

I'm sorry you passed out Boothh. Get some rest and drink lots of water! I really can't wait to hear the results of your blood tests to know what's going on.


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## ashnbump

get a pic on! we're experts at spotting faintys! hope ur feeling better from fainting at ur blood test :( that line could have been responsible for your fainting!x


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## Kimberly28

Awwww hun! :dohh: I wish they could get you the results tomorrow instead. Tuesday seems so far away. :wacko: How on earth will you get through the weekend? I wish I could tell you for sure what is going on. Try to hang in there though. I'm really not sure what it all means. I do know that when I test on FRERS (which is what I usually use) unless I really am pregnant, there is NO line AT ALL!! I don't even get evaps! So surely a line must mean you're preggers. :confused:


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## Boothh

i cant believe your 8weeks already ash and we were on cd1 together just shows how shit my cycles are! im gunna try take a pic but iv only got my iphone and its crap for pictures x


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## Boothh

and ash pm me your phone number ha cus i cant get pics online either ¬_¬


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## ashnbump

ok ok ha ha i'll pm it on FB! when you say 8 weeks it feels like ive been pregnant ages and its gone fast, but to me its dragging, i hate 1st tri  xx


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## Boothh

right iv sent it now ha


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## Boothh

omg i hope i dint send to a wrong number lmao


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## ashnbump

:S ive not got it yet oh no haha!x


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## Boothh

noooo dont say that lmao some random with a pic of my pregnancy test ¬_¬


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## ashnbump

maybe its just trudging through all the snow haha!x


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## Boothh

https://i54.tinypic.com/6sxcm1.jpg

i know its blurry cus my phones shit but can you honestly see ANYTHING


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## ashnbump

crisis averted! its just arrived uploading now!xx


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## ashnbump

never mind u did it haha!x


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## Boothh

iv just figured out how to upload to fb without anyone seeing i had to make a private album and upload to that and onto here hahaha


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## ashnbump

i didnt even know you could do that i always have to use photobucket! remember fmu tomorrow lol xx


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## Boothh

i will i will it costsa a bloody fortune this ttc thing hahah xx


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## cleckner04

Oh boothh!! I'm sorry you fainted. That must've been scary. :wacko: Hope they can figure it all out. Geez that is so frustrating! I can't see a line on your picture but it's so blurry and I'm shit at looking at them anyways. :blush:


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## Pippin

Goodness three pages to catch up on. :shock:

Boothh sorry you fainted. Excited you can see a line though, not sure I can on that picture as it's too blurry. Take one from further back on a window sill with lots of light so it's in focus then we can zoom in ourselves, super excited to see an update. xxx

Lots of nausea from me so not getting on as much now. xx


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## Pippin

So quiet in here it's been almost 2 days :shock: :haha: Boothh anymore peeing on sticks?


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## Kimberly28

I was beginning to wonder if I was no longer getting the emails notifying me of new replies. As it's been bad about that lately.

AFM, cd 8 today. DH and I :sex: last night and hopefully tonight too. I should be OV'ing in about a week. So of course, lots more BD'ing to do and fingers crossed it all goes correctly with my cycle this time instead of all screwy. [-o&lt;

Pippin, sorry you're nauseated but at least that is a good sign. When is your scan again? :blush:

Boothh, any more poas? Let us know what the doc says on Monday about your bloods. :hugs:


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## Boothh

no i havnt done anymore cus i thought its a waste of money when i get blood results on tuesday soo, gunna wait, 

i did throw up for no reason on friday night though..


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## Kimberly28

Argh! It's too quiet in here! :dohh: Where did everyone go?? :haha:


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## Boothh

i thinmk were all waiting to OV and theres never anything to talk about then is there lol, i get my bloods tomorrow x


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## Shiv

I'm lurking :haha: bu tnot much to say seeing at I'm not ttc this month!

Can someone answer my question regarding day no.1 of cycle. Is it the day your period starts or the next day?

If it is the day your period starts the I am CD 13 today and have had loads of EWCM for a couple of days. So I think I am regulating to a 28 / 29 cycle (I was 31 days before I had Sophia).

Kim (oh ttc expert!) I know that you are supposed to ov the day your ewcm stops is that right? Do you know if the overall amount of ewcm that you get is linked to her fertile you are. I am getting much more ewcm now than I was a couple of months ago, do you think that means I am more fertile, or just more mucusy! :haha:

So Kim is your body acting as you would expect it to? I hope so and that your catch that eggy with a girl sperm!

JoeyJo - where are you in your cycle, I think you are in the tww? if so how is it going?

Pip and Ash - how are you feeling?

Pippin - eek not long until your scan (3 days?) so are you going on wednesday on thursday and at what time?

Boothh - hope the blood tests give you some idea of what is going on, let us know the outcome :hugs:

AE - how are you feeling now you are in third tri? any chance we can have a bump picture?


Is that chatty enough for you Kim :haha::haha::haha:


----------



## Aunty E

Hi! I was away for the weekend, back now. Feeling fine in Third Tri, bump is variable - today is a small day, but it can look absolutely huge by the end of the day if I'm tired for some reason. I'll try and get a pic tonight for you, as that's when bump is most impressive.

Teddy kicks A LOT, and it's actually quite painful, I'm guessing because I don't have a nice cushiony placenta in the way this time. I see the midwife tomorrow, not really expecting a terribly fulfilling appointment, but I need my Mat B1 and my maternity exemption form and my Health in Pregnancy grant form. Last time I put the money towards my hypnobirthing so this time I'm looking at doing an NCT course, not because I didn't enjoy hypnobirthing, but more because I'd like to meet some people with children in our area. We moved when Mog was three months old, and we didn't go to any baby groups, so we don't really know anyone. As I'll be at home for six months on maternity leave, it might be nice to meet some people. I've emailed them to ask about courses in our area, although they're kind of expensive! I thought hypnobirthing was bad, but this is nearly as pricey.

I might be TMI here, but I've had real problems with thrush in this pregnancy - I've pretty much had it non-stop since I got my BFP. Any tips on getting rid of it safely? I've been using the cream, and there doesn't seem much point in treating OH as we've not DTD for weeks. Bad wife, must do something nice for OH. I asked the doctor, and she just gave me the 'oh, it's because you're pregnant' line, and didn't give me any other advice, just use the cream and wear cotton pants.


----------



## Shiv

I have hard that natural yoghurt is good for thrush but haven't tried it personally! 

teddy eh? is that a decision made on a name? Lool forward to seeing a bump picture - how exciting!


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## Boothh

i heard natural yoghurt is good too, xx


----------



## joeyjo

Sorry not been on really over weekend - went to visit family but also feeling a bit subduded because AF arrived bang on schedule on friday :(


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## spidey

AE- I've tried yogurt before and it does help although its messy. What also helps me is taking a bath and then drying that whole area with a hairdryer on cool air. Then sit around the house with nothing on and legs spread to keep it dry, LOL. If you must have a little dignity, you can wear really loose bottoms and no underwear. It's a miserable feeling so I hope you can get some relief soon.

Shiv- I always count the first day of the previous AF when I'm calculating my cycle length, but I'm no expert :haha:

I'm lurking too. I should be ovulating this week if I'm even ovulating. No signs of CM. No excitement from me!


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## Kimberly28

Shiv, I'm not sure if more ewcm means your more fertile. But I know that ewcm in general means you're fertile. You might just be more mucosy. Have you had a junky cough or sinus congestion at all lately? If so that could be why.
As for when cd1 is...cd1 is the day that you start your AF (heavy enough for a pad/tampon). And for OV... you have ov'd once the cm begins to look thick/gloppy and less clear and less stretchy or looks creamy/lotion like.

AE, awww I cant wait to meet your little guy. Trust me, you will treasure and adore him once he's here! :thumbup:

Boothh, let us know what the doc says about your bloods.

Spidey, hopefully that will change in a day or two and you will see the ewcm.

Joey, so sorry that AF found you. I know how disappointing it is. :hugs:

LOL Shiv at chatting it up! :haha:

AFM, my cm is starting to become more ewcm like just not 100% ewcm just yet. I'm also more umm... horny..:blush: I wanted it last night really badly but DH was too tired. :dohh: I'm making him make it up to me tonight. :haha: Putting the kids to bed early and then we're going to bed. :haha: Today is cd10 for me. I should be OV'ing this weekend. (Hopefully!) So hopefully lots of BD this week and then the 2ww waiting game begins. I sure hope my body behaves and cooperates for me! [-o&lt;


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## cleckner04

I'm lurking as well. Nothing for me to talk about really but wishing you all the best! :flower:


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## Pippin

*JoeyJo* sorry the evil one got you :hugs: understand your subduedness :hugs:

*Cleck* hon hope you are doing ok. Got sad when I read your status the other day about Emma and looking for your DH :cry:

*AuntyE* sorry hon I've never really suffered from it apart from a couple of times in my teenage years. It went away on it's own but I heard Cranberry helps loads. Might be worth talking to a different doctor.

*Kim and Spidey* good luck with the bedding :winkwink: can't wait to start the tww jollities. 

*Boothh* good luck tomorrow, up date us as soon as you get back and if you have even the tiniest bit of HCG in your system get a :test: on the way home as I bet they'll be nice and dark :haha: great to hear you are throwing up too.

As for me......I have to confess something, I left Sam alone in the bath for 2 seconds while I got his towel and he slipped and couldn't get up :shock:. I rushed in but the poor baby had his head only just out of the water. I feel so terrible I hardly ever leave him (only when I forget the towel) and it could have been so bad. I feel such an awful Mummy tonight Then I had to dry his hair which he hates so that made it worse :cry:. NEVER doing that again eeek! Stupid women I am I think we'll both have nightmares tonight :cry:


----------



## cleckner04

Aww Pip. :hugs: I know that feeling all too well. :cry: We can't watch them every second of every day. You are not a bad mom at all!! I still get the award for bad mother, you're not allowed to steal it! ;)


----------



## Shiv

cleckner04 said:


> Aww Pip. :hugs: I know that feeling all too well. :cry: We can't watch them every second of every day. You are not a bad mom at all!! I still get the award for bad mother, you're not allowed to steal it! ;)

ahem.........I think you'll find I am holding on to my bad mother crown!


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## Kimberly28

Alright you 3!! :dohh: NONE of you are BAD mothers!! *grabs the crown and throws it in the trash/rubbish can* :p You're all WONDERFUL mothers!! :thumbup: MY mother is a BAD mother!!!! :growlmad:


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## cleckner04

^^That's true kimberly. :lol: At least we can have a laugh at your mother's expense. :winkwink:


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## Kimberly28

Exactly! :haha:


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## Shiv

hahahaha that made me laugh!


----------



## Aunty E

https://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f225/AuntyE/db44b117.jpg

I got OH to take this, so sorry it's a bit rubbish!


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## Kimberly28

Awwww!!! What a cute bump!!!! :D :thumbup: Love it AE!!! :flower:


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## Boothh

awwww baby!


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## Boothh

and pippin that wasnt your fault! i knocked jesses legs from under him when i didnt know he was behind me yesterday and he banged his cheek on the tiles in the kitchen and has a bruise now! xx


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## Boothh

results come back normal, im not pregnant, i now have to go in to discuss options and be referred to gynaecology for a scan of ovarys and to figure out why my cycles are whacked. :dohh: she doesnt understand its actually a matter of urgency for me.


----------



## Aunty E

Oh no! Did you take any hormonal birth control after Jesse? I was wondering if it could still be lingering in your system. Does it sound like you'll have to wait long for an appointment?


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## ashnbump

oh boothh, what a crappy appointment :( they best get to sorting you out asap! hope ur ok hun! xxx

ae - what a beautiful belly! cant wait to have a bump again! did you show sooner this pregnancy?x

pip - dont feel, crappy, he's ok, thats the important thing! we all make mistakes, thats just part of being a mummy! almost time for your can, are you excited?? 

afm - well ive still not heard anything from any midwives etc about booking appointments and scans, and from my lmp i'll be 9 weeks on thursday? is this normal?

i still feel crappy, the sickness isnt half s bad tho, so happy about that as it was slowly killing me!

ive almost got all of karas xmas prezzies, so can move on to everyone else, david only wants a set of weights, but we have bought a joint gift, an apple imac so we are only having a small prezzie each! i think thats ok though lol! 

on the note of xmas prezzies, for the UK girls, if any of you were thinking of buying a tag junior system, they are half price in argos at the mo! £14.99 instead if £29.99! Bargain! we are going to ashton to pick up karas later!xx


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## Boothh

i was on the pill but iv been pregnant twice since then so i dunno,

i was wondering were you would go in ashton for toys haha no elc anymore :(


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## Shiv

Boothh - sorry you didin't get any answers, I hope you can get seen ASAP. In the meantime keep BDing as you could ov and get preggers still!

AE - cute bump! DO you feel bigger this time or not?

Ash - I don't think I got my first midwive's appt until about 10 or 11 weeks with Sophia!

Pippin - not long now!


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## Pippin

Sorry you didn't get any positive outcomes Boothh. What a bummer. I hope it sorts itself out soon. Did they give you your HCG number?

Two days until scan, dead excited. I've developed serious bloat this week even in the morning, check it out :shock: I caught three staff members looking at me weird today, I'm paranoid there is nothing in there and they will guess I'm pregnant anyway or just think I've put on even more weight :rofl:! I didn't grow like this with the one I lost so I'm hopeful.
 



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## Shiv

I love bump piccies!


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## Kimberly28

Cute pic Pippin! :thumbup: Love the little bump!! :flower:


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## Aunty E

I feel bigger now than I did at the same time with Mog, and I bloated really quickly this time, but I'm not sure I had an obvious bump any earlier. I just looked fat a bit earlier! My bbs got huge quicker and my milk first dried up (I could still get some if I tried when I fell pregnant) and then came back in really early. I did feel like my stomach muscles gave up a bit earlier this time and let it all hang out. There was a week when I definitely popped and went from fat to pregnant, but that was probably some time around 20 weeks.


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## cleckner04

Cute bumps girlies!! :D


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## Pippin

Sorry I'm not around much, I'm suffering in silence for a bit. Was fine today at work as had sea bands on all day. Got cocky and took them off and now I've got nausea five times as bad, wish I could just be sick. Not complaining as it's a good sign but just not chatty sorry. Saying :hi: to you all tomorrow and one sleep to go till the big scan at 7pm EEEEK


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## joeyjo

Good luck tomorrow pip - get a piccy for us :flower: :)


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## Shiv

Good Luck tomorrow Pip - look forward to seeing your little bubba photo!


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## Boothh

good luck with your scan pippin! :D

well as for me i seem to be getting after OV cm now and i had ewcm a few days ago so im assuming AF will be arriving probably not this weekend one after, or maybe not cus we have BD quite abit ha x


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## Pippin

Thank you ladies, I'm so sick I can't work, well not sick just watery mouth nausea and it's driving me completely useless. I have work to do but can't concentrate. That and the thoughts of the scan tonight it's all too much. hank god my student teacher is taking my lessons today :dohh:

Nervous just talking about it all. 9 hours and counting.......


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## Aunty E

Eeeek Pip!!!! Will have to try and get online on my iphone tonight to see how you get on. Everything I have is crossed for you, and I'm trying to poke Teddy into crossing some things as well ;)

I've barely seem the midwife at all this time round, I wasn't hugely impressed at my last appointment. They won't be attending my birth, so I couldn't give two hoots frankly. I'll be giving birth at Whipps Cross, so I'm more interested in meeting the midwives there, although I'm hoping that this one will slide out like the proverbial greased piglet of course, without the need for any assistance from midwives, doctors or forceps :) We're both very keen to avoid me having to stay in hospital again, it was very unpleasant and it would be even more unpleasant to be away from Mog.


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## Shiv

AE - did you das you definitely decide on Teddy for your little boys name? i think it is adorable!

Pip - good luck at the scan!


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## ashnbump

quick one to say good luck Pip! cant wait to see piccies!xxxxx


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## Kimberly28

Pip, good luck at your scan!! I'm sure it will all be alright and you will come back relieved and happy! I cant wait to see the pic/pics!! :hugs:

AFM,

For the last 2 days I've had water like cm and I got a pos opk last night! :happydance: I'll prolly get another one today and then ov tonight or early morning tomorrow. So I'm happy about that and DH and I got some BD in (on cd 10 and 11) so the waiting game begins. The weird thing is that yesterday was cd 12. Today is cd13. I've never gotten pos opk this early before nor ov'd this early before. It's usually on cd16. Hopefully this means that the hormone reset with the provera worked. At least it should mean a nice long luteal phase with plenty of time for implantation. And hopefully NO pre AF spotting. So here we go ladies. Time for my 2 ww! :thumbup: I'm determined to ignore it this time too and keep myself occupied with the holidays. Which will be easy because as of Dec.21st DH is off work for a week and Zach is out of school for 2 weeks starting that week as well so all of that should keep me busy enough. This way if there are any real signs they are going to have to slap me in the face haha. :haha: That's about it for now. I'll keep you all posted. :winkwink: :flower:


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## Pippin

They just phoned to say it's been put back till 8:15 as they are running late so will update at 9. Booooo!


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## Shiv

Boooooooooo - I am here waiting already!


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## Kimberly28

So am I. Good luck Pippin!! :hugs:


AFM,

My opk just went negative again. Which is strange because it's usually positive for 2 days before it goes negative and my cm is looking like post ov cm. :wacko: I hope my body didn't just fail me by gearing up and then failing to ov. :dohh: My bbt hasn't spiked yet either so I guess I'm just gonna have to wait and see. sigh. Now I'm confused and not sure if I ovulated or not. :wacko: I can only hope that I did. I hope this isn't my body playing up on me. :nope:


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## spidey

I'm here lurking but decided to pop in for a post!

Good luck Pippin!!!

Kimberly- your cycle this month sounds promising :thumbup: I'm glad you were able to try baby making this month despite the provera set back. 

AE and Pippin - you both have cute bumps! I heard that you show earlier with your 2nd, so Pippin, you'll have to get out the baggy sweaters to hide it from your coworkers soon!


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## cleckner04

Should hear an update soon right?! Hope it went well Pippin!!

I'm off to Emma's doctor's appointment so I hope I come back to a cute little scan piccie!! :D


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## Shiv

:munch:


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## Kimberly28

LOL Shiv. You and me both! :paper: That update cannot come soon enough. :juggle: I dunno how many times I have hit the refresh button haha. :blush:


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## Boothh

come on pippin!


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## Pippin

Well........*WE HAVE LIFE*!!!!! Measured ahead at 8 weeks, baby had lovely strong HB seen and heard, so relieved I almost broke out sobbing on the table. Started off with an external but I hadn't drunk enough so we did an internal and had a good look around. Came from the right ovary, said it was all very healthy in there and nothing to worry about. Gave me a little picture too so I'm over the moon!!!
:happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance: :happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance: :happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance: :happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance: :happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance:
 



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## Boothh

sooooo amazing!!!! :happydance: im so so so so so happy for you i cant explain! made me feel alot more positive you know!! and the pic is sooo cute! it actually looks like a baby!!!! xxxxx


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## Shiv

:yipee::yipee::yipee::yipee::wohoo::wohoo::wohoo::wohoo::loopy::loopy::loopy::yipee::yipee::yipee:


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## ashnbump

Yaaaaay pip! And u got bumped ahead! We Could be sharing due dates at this rate! I was surprised at how much it looked like a baby when I had my scan too! Our egg came from the left ovary apparently! How do they even know this stuff!

Soooo glad u can breathe a sigh of relief now! Only 4 weeks to wait till u see beanie again! Not long at all! Xxxxxx


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## Kimberly28

Yay Pippin!!!!!! :happydance: :yipee: :dance: :wohoo: 
That's awesome news!! :thumbup: I'm SO happy for you!!! :hugs:
I knew everything would be alright! :flower:


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## Pippin

So pleased I can't tell you how much. Just emailed a picture to my brother and spoke to my folks so it all seems a little real now. Just seems all a bit real now :yipee:

edit: pregnant brain I wrote that last sentence twice :rofl: Now for sleep I'm knackered :sleep:


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## cleckner04

Yay!! So cute too! Looks just like Emma's first ultrasound. I called her my little teddy bear cause you could see the short little arms and legs. :cloud9: Congrats Pip!!! :dance::dance:


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## spidey

congrats Pippin :happydance: :happydance: :happydance:

Now you can relax a little more. How is the sickness today? I hope it has eased off now that you have that worry off your mind.


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## Shiv

So spidey you must be a few days post ovulation by now - did you try to time :sex: this month? 

Kim - you must be a few days post ov as well?

As i said i was going to write down how my body reacts when definitely not pregnant so I can compare next month in the tww

so today i think i am 4 DPO and i had a little creamy cm (tinged yellow)

i think I am going to have an even shorter cycle this month. I think i ovulated on CD13. My EWCM ran out that day and i was getting period type cramps, which i reckon might be ovulation pains? Does anyone else get them and what do they feel like.

So maybe I am heading for a 27/28 day cycle - we shall see!


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## Kimberly28

Shiv, I would be 2 dpo if my body had cooperated. :growlmad: I still have not seen a thermal (temperature) shift yet. Normally by now I'd be seeing an upward pattern in my temps but this time I'm not. They are still in pre-ov range. :( I don't think I ov'd this time. :nope: This is especially frustrating now because at least I was ov'ing regularly before the provera and now it seems that I'm not ov'ing at all. :hissy: My body isn't acting like it's trying again to ov either. I'm having creamy cm and I did another opk this evening just to be sure and it was neg. So unless something drastically changes like tomorrow morning, I am pretty sure I am in for a long useless anovulatory cycle. :brat: Why oh why does my body have to be SO damn uncooperative?? :grr: It's just not fair!!! :hissy: The provera was supposed to make this better, not worse!! One thing is for sure though, since I have had this problem before in the past (not ovulating I mean), as soon as we get to the end of this cycle and I get AF, I am going to call my doc and tell her what happened and push her to give me a prescription for Clomid! I am NOT going through months and months more of frustration like this. :growlmad: 

I wish all the rest of you better luck this month. It seems that I'm already out this time. :cry: If it weren't for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all! :nope: :cry:


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## spidey

Kimberly- I'm sorry this month turned out crappy. Perhaps it's just this one month since your body needs this cycle to re-regulate itself after the provera. Next cycle you might be back on track with no spotting and a nice big healthy egg waiting for a girly spermy! 

Shiv- It will be neat to see if you've predicted correctly based on your cm! I don't think I ever felt pains from ovulation, but I know its possible. 

I was supposed to ovulate sometime earlier this week and despite both of us being sick and Kira getting sick, plus DH's evening work schedule, we dtd twice in the last 10 days or so... so there's a chance. I would love to have another baby, but if it didn't happen this month it wouldn't bother me much since I would love to enjoy xmas, New Years and my 30th birthday :shock: without the start of morning sickness!


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## Shiv

Ah Spidey, you just know you will catch this month so you have to stay sober for all those big events :haha: 

Kim - I don't know much about temp rises, but don't give up hope, you never know! :hugs:


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## Pippin

Kim you may just ovulate late, keep charting and temping as if it's a longer cycle you may not ovulate until late.

I don't feel pregnant today and no sickness, of course I'm paranoid as I know in normal pregnancies they can come and go but I was so nauseous before. Not even wearing my bands today :dohh: Tell me I'm being stupid and it's all fine please!


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## Shiv

it's fine Pip - it is normal for the sickness to come and go - I bet it hits you full throttle on Monday when you are at work!


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## Pippin

hahaha probably Shiv, it's horrible at work.

So you weren't even tempted just a little bit then :rofl: you are a more controlled women than I!!! :winkwink:


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## Shiv

Not really tempted, I felt a bit bad the day after ovulation that I had missed a chance, but then went out on Friday night and got drunk! 

It does seem like everyone is getting pregnant around me! A girk who was in my NCT class when I was preggo with SOphia told me she is 11 weeks gone. I am a little jealous so I hopeit doesn't take too long after Christmas!


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## Pippin

I'm sure it won't take long. You'll have a fabulous Christmas (I'm slightly jealous that you can really fulfil the merry bit of Christmas heheheh :winkwink:) but after you'll be nicely relaxed and calm which I think is the key to conception.


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## Boothh

i definatly think i OVd last sunday i think we dtd on the thursday so would we have a chance? im going to test not this monday the one after x


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## Kimberly28

Shiv, you may of been right. My temp was up a bit this morning instead of down around 97.2 it was up at 97.73. :happydance: But I also didn't get to sleep until 4 am (DH and I were up late together) and my normal temping time is 5:30am. :wacko: They say you shouldn't temp until you have had at least 4 hrs of sleep which I hadn't had at 5:30 am so I didn't test until 9:30 am. I hope that isn't the only reason it was up so much higher. I guess we will see what tomorrow brings but if fertility friend is right, then I'm 3 dpo today. :thumbup: So maybe I'm in with a chance afterall. It says I ov'd on cd 13. DH and I BD'ed on cd 10 and 11. So hopefully that is still a good chance with girlie swimmers. Because if I did OV on cd 13 then we hit 3 day old swimmers so I'm pretty certain that that is plenty of time for the boy ones to die off haha. :haha: I guess we will see. For now though I plan on going through the next 2 weeks like nothing happened and ignore my body and the 2ww as much as possible. I really don't want to symptom spot this time. I just want to let whatever is to happen, happen. :thumbup: Anyhoo, I'll let you all know tomorrow what tomorrow brings. But for now... [-o&lt;

Pippin, I'm so sorry that you've been feeling so sick lately. Hopefully it will get better once you get into 2nd tri. :hugs:


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## Boothh

^


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## Shiv

Boothh - sperm can survive for up to 5 days in there so you are in with a chance!


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## Kimberly28

You're defo in with a chance boothh. Good luck hun. :thumbup:


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## Boothh

hey if thats right kim do i stand more chance of having a girl then with older sperm? :haha:


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## Kimberly28

It's not that it's older sperm boothh, it's that the male sperm are faster but weaker, and girl sperm are slower but more hardy. So yeah, if Shettles is correct, the male sperm die out before the female sperm and then yes you'd stand a chance.

PS - Do you ladies think that even though I had to temp later than usual this morning that chances are the temp is still accurate and I really did ovulate?? :blush:


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## Boothh

i know that (only from reading what youve wrote before and abit other places) i was just shortening it :p 

i dont understand temping but you seem to know what your doing so trust your instincts xx


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## Shiv

I don't know much about temping, but i would say a rise is a rise Kim!


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## Kimberly28

Let's see if I can explain temping in a nutshell haha. :haha:

Ok the basics, the basal body temp is the temp of the body at it's base resting point which is why you check it after 3-4 hrs of sleep before getting out of bed or really moving or sitting up at all. Checking the temp at the same time each day is the most accurate way to temp. Because any other factors outside the norm (ie falling asleep at 11pm, temping at 5:30 am) can cause inaccurate temps and a very real change in what the temp might of otherwise been. (Not everyone chooses the same temping time that I choose. I use 5:30 because it's the most convenient one for me with my schedule being what it is. Other women choose a time that works best with their schedule.) When one is sleep deprived (slept less than 3-4 consecutive hours) it will usually cause the BBT to be lower than it otherwise would of been. This is why I didn't test this morning at 5:30am since I didn't fall asleep until almost 4 am. It would have been even more inaccurate. I temped at 9:30 after 5.5 consecutive hours of sleep which is more accurate than a temp with sleep deprivation/lack of sleep.

Now, Progesterone is the hormone secreted by the corpeous lutem after ovulation as well as by the placenta during a pregnancy. Progesterone is a heat inducing hormone. This is why if you temp, you will notice a rise in your basal body temp (BBT) after ovulation as well as a drop if pregnancy is not achieved and AF arrives. Because progesterone is also secreted (and extremely important) during pregnancy it is also why women who chart and who do get their bfp will notice that their BBT will remain high (higher than the pre OV temps) after 14dpo. By 14dpo most women either have AF arrived/arriving or get their bfp. Some women who temp rely on that as their pregnancy test instead of poas because it can clearly show you if you are pregnant or not. Even though poas is always best if the BBT is still elevated at 14 dpo to confirm the pregnancy and to make sure that another issue is not the cause of delayed/missed AF and high BBT. When charting/temping, it's not so much each individual temp that matters but more-so the overall pattern in which you see on your chart by plotting those temps to be able to give you a better picture of what your body and your cycle is doing. Many women feel more in control of their body and their cycles (such as I do) if they chart and can have a more clear picture of what is going on throughout each cycle. Also, this way it will be far easier to recognize a problem should one arise.

Make sense? :blush: Yes, I know too much. :haha:


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## Aunty E

I rather stupidly got pregnant just before a huge holiday with a bunch of hard-drinking friends - that was not much of the fun. Idiot. I just didn't want to waste any chances. As it was, I wouldn't have been able to try again until October, and I'm pretty pleased with how our timing has worked out and I'm not a patient person when it comes to TTC, so I guess that was the price I paid!

My MS came and went with this one, and hung round until about 15 weeks, but it was more feeling sick and having a sort of watery mouth. I was only actually sick once.


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## Kimberly28

Awww AE, I don't think you're stupid at all hun. Nor an idiot. Many women get pregnant like that. It doesn't make them stupid. It just happens. And I'm glad it happened so easily for you like that. I wouldn't wish the frustration I've endured with both ttc bry and now on anyone. I'd much rather it be so easy. You're lucky IMOHO. :flower:


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## Pippin

Kim do you use FF can we look if you do as I know about temping, learnt when I was trying with Sam but got pregnant the same cycle I started temping but never went back to it as I'm too lazy to temp in the mornings :rofl:

Boothh yes definitely in with a chance :yipee: so did you have an anovulatory cycle then do you think? As you haven't had a period have you? xxxx


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## Boothh

pippin - nope i havnt had a period, i do think i had an anovulatory cycles cus i got ewcm for one day and not really alot of it and assumed id OV but never got a period, i was pretty stressed around the time too so maybe that could have been why, i definatly think i OVd this time though had alot of ewcm over 4days and got spotty and had the little cramps xx


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## Kimberly28

Hi Pippin, yes I do chart with FF. Here is my chart. https://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/22f221

I had to temp late again today because DH disturbed me and I had to pull my laptop out to check something for him this morning before he left for work only for me to suddenly realized i hadn't temped yet. :dohh: Oh well. :dohh: Anyways, I'm just taking this thing one day at a time because for some reason I doubt I actually ovulated. :wacko: Anyhoo, I cant wait till next week for DH to be off work for a week. :thumbup:


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## Pippin

I'm going to agree with FF that you have the three rises before the two out of time still indicate the shift up. Soon find out with the :bfp: in two weeks :winkwink: Good luck hon hope you get a sticky bean.


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## Pippin

Boothh said:


> pippin - nope i havnt had a period, i do think i had an anovulatory cycles cus i got ewcm for one day and not really alot of it and assumed id OV but never got a period, i was pretty stressed around the time too so maybe that could have been why, i definatly think i OVd this time though had alot of ewcm over 4days and got spotty and had the little cramps xx

Fab so you are in the tww now as well. Let the count down begin :yipee:


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## joeyjo

Pip - love the avatar :)

Kim - no idea about temping but FX'd

AFM - well AF finally left after 8 days!!!!! (usual is 5) so I am back in the game for another month :)


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## Shiv

good luck Joeyjo, fx'ed this is your month!


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## Kimberly28

Omg I am so upset!!! I'm only 4 dpo and I'm already spotting!!!!!!!! :hissy: :cry: :grr: I cant believe this! It went from happening at 8 dpo to 4 dpo!!! WTF!?!?!?!?! I am so upset and angry and frustrated!!!! Why is this happening to me??? Why cant my body just do what it's supposed to do?? Is that really asking so much?? ](*,) When I put spotting in on FF too, it takes away from crosshairs and says I haven't OV'd yet. :dohh: I dunno what to do! All I do know is that I believe that this merits a phone call to my doc office tomorrow. :trouble: Now it seems that that damn provera did more harm than good. :grr:


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## Shiv

hugs Kim, defo phone your doctor and see what she has to say :hugs:


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## Kimberly28

Well my temp is back down this morning to pre OV range and I'm still spotting. So definitely out this month and definitely no ovulation. FF also removed my cross hairs. :cry: I'll be calling my doctor office as soon as they open as it's only 6:30 am here right now. I'm gutted and very frustrated. It seems like that damn provera only made things worse instead of better. :growlmad: I will be insisting on clomid now for the next cycle which will also help to regulate my cycles as well. Grrrrr.... now I wonder how long I will have to wait for AF so I can get this useless pointless cycle over with. :growlmad:


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## ashnbump

well im not a happy bunny  

ive been waiting ever so patiently for my midwife letter to come through the post, you know the one about your booking appointment and your scan date etc, well im 10 weeks on thursday (going from LMP like the dr's do, but 10 weeks on sat according to the early scan) and ive still not heard a peep! Decided to ring up this morning, just to see if things were ok, and all went through as it should, and they've not even flippin referred me!!!!! :brat: :brat: not happy!

the receptionist said, the midwife doesnt even have and hour long appointments left until JANUARY!!! :dohh: but she said as im 10 weeks i need to be seen asap, and she will get the midwife to call me on friday - i hope they dont forget, i dont want to have to wait another month before i get my 12 week scan! I'll be knockin on 14 weeks by then :( ggrrrrrr! i really want to 'announce it around xmas new year too :( bloody nhs is so crap! :growlmad:

My pregnancy is HIGH RISK FOR CRYING OUT LOUD surely they should know this and have me monitored early??! :nope:

so what do you guys think will happen, maybe move someone who is less far along as me back to jan, and squeeze me in, or do you think im going to have to wait? 

also i want to have my baby at st mary's in central manchester, but i think they are going to force me to have beanie at tameside/ashton, can i refuse this??

sorry for the mini rant, just so peed off!

i have been reading, just so tired and sick all the time, i dont have the energy/time to post much, sorry girls, forgive me lol!

i'll do a catch up soon i promise!xxxxxxxx


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## Boothh

ash i had jesse at tameside and can i just say they were really good, i got everything i asked for straight away and the midwives were all amazing, id deffo go there again but i live way too far now, x

thats awful theyv not even referred you, hopefully they will squeeze you in or put someone back, i know it sounds awful but im sure a few appointments would open up with mcs and stuff :/ x


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## ashnbump

oh its nothing personal towards the hospital hun, its just st mary's is A LOT easier for family and friends to get to, and david works on the same road as the hospital, so for scans and appointments, he wont need to take the day off to be there, he can use an hour here and ther in holidays etc!

thats the only reason, otherwise i wouldnt mind tbh xx


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## Aunty E

That happened to me with Imogen - patiently waited for appointments, then rang to chase them only to find out that nobody had even referred me! Luckily they could squeeze me in for a 12 week scan and I had my booking in appointment afterwards. Grrr. I wasn't high risk though, so I'm sure they'll make more of an effort.

I've had a similar sort of problem, my antenatal consultant referred me to cardiology when I saw him last, but no appointment has come through, and I see him again in Jan, by which point I think he expects me to have seen the cardiology consultant. So it took me four different departments and twenty minutes to get through to the right person - who wasn't there. Sigh.


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## Kimberly28

Ash, I'm so sorry that you feel so lousy hun. It'll get better in just a few weeks when you hit 2nd tri. :hugs:


I just got off the phone with my doc's office. They want to see me at noon tomorrow. So I'll be there. I'm now 100% certain I didn't ovulate and now my body is really on the fritz and that the provera made things worse. :dohh: So I'm pushing for clomid now to regulate things because I know THAT works as I have been on it in the past. I just wish I could go ahead and start my cycle all over again right now instead of having to wait goodness knows how long until AF shows up since this is an anovulatory cycle. :growlmad:


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## Boothh

kim you know i really think all this stressing is making things worse with your cycles you know, i think you need to relax a little bit :flower:


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## Shiv

i have to agree with Boothh a little Kim, your period will show up sooner if you try to relax a bit. Easier said than done I know. But try to enjoy Christmas and then get set again in the new year :hugs:


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## Pippin

Ash I still haven't heard either and range my doctor who said they would chase it up and I still haven't heard from them. So cross too :hissy:, I missed my 12 scan and had to go private with Sam looks like I'll be doing the same for this one as it'll be Christmas and they have a long wait. I feel your pain hon :hugs:

Kim sorry you are spotting hon, don't know what to say/suggest :hugs:


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## ashnbump

its not on is it! I say ring again pip, demand they see you! Im going to wait until midday friday and if i havent heard anything by 12 on the dot im ringing again, its not fair that we should have to pay all that money for private scans, because THEY messed up! its bad, but its good to know you are having the same troubles as me pip lol, im glad we are going through this together lol! Am i right in thinking you will be due July too?x

AE - i dont mind waiting for my booking apt etc, but the scan is really important and ive waited my turn just like everyone else, so i have a right to that appointment in a way. i didnt know they messed up with imogen! And again you are being passed from pillar to post! Is it just me, or do doctors care less when its NOT your first baby?xx

kim, i can imagine how frustrated you are feeling, hopefully you will leave with some answers tomorrow, and a prescription for clomid lol!xx


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## Kimberly28

Thanks Boothh and Shiv. I honestly wasn't the least bit stressed or worried about any of this up until the last couple of days. I guess since I know that no pregnancy can happen with this cycle now, I just want it over with so I can try again IYKWIM. Since I'm sure you all are tired of listening to me obsess and worry, I'll just be quiet now.


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## Shiv

Aw Kim you can talk about whatever you want here you know that, if you want to stress and moan here then go for it, I was just thinking of your wellbeing! If you are going to be stressed anyway then best to get it off your chest here I say!:haha:


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## spidey

Kim- I hope the doctor has answers for you :hugs: Let us know what your doctor says tomorrow.

Ash and Pippin- thats pretty bad that both of you haven't heard back about having a doctors appointment. They better get things straightened out so you get your 12 week scan otherwise they'll have some really angry pregnant ladies to deal with!!

Nothings going on with me. I'm in the 2ww now and getting over a cold. No symptoms to report except for a very sore nose from blowing it all day!


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## Pippin

spidey I got cold in the tww it can be a symptom :haha: :winkwink: :rofl: I'm symptom spotting already for you and I'm guessing your only 1 or 2 dpo I'm allowed though hahahahaha


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## Pippin

Kim honey that's what the group is for for having a good old moan and letting all your fears come out. I do agree stressing won't help you but it's also good to vent the stress so carry on hon, it's therapy :hugs:


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## spidey

LOL Pippin. I'm actually more like 6 or 7 days post ovulation if I ovulated when I should have so you might be on to something :winkwink: I also had a lot of clear cm this morning, but I have the same looking stuff pouring from my nose so I'm not looking into it too much :haha:


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## Pippin

spidey said:


> LOL Pippin. I'm actually more like 6 or 7 days post ovulation if I ovulated when I should have so you might be on to something :winkwink: I also had a lot of clear cm this morning, but I have the same looking stuff pouring from my nose so I'm not looking into it too much :haha:

:rofl: I'll get excited then :rofl:


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## Kimberly28

Ok so I went to the doctor today. I also got smart and printed up my charts from the last several cycles to show her how I usually ovulate and how my chart looks when I do and thus why I think I didn't ovulate this time. She saw the one big dip and said that she thinks I might of ovulated but she isn't sure. Regardless though I'm bleeding now. She went ahead and did a vag exam and said there is quite a bit of blood in there and she thinks I'm getting my period already. She thinks that my cycle might still be resetting itself after the provera. I hope she is right although to be honest, I disagree with her. I think my hormones are even more outta whack now and I need clomid to force them back into order again. She doesn't want to give me Clomid right away though because of "side effects" she said. I told her I used it before in the past with no problems but she still wants to wait on that. :dohh: She will see me back in March and said that I can feel free to call if this continues and if I do continue to have these kind of cycles, then at that point she will follow me with ultrasounds and give me clomid and see what is going on. So I guess I get to wait around again. She said that since the holidays are upon us that that can make things stressful and cause my cycles to be a bit wacky. However I don't think that's the case for me because I don't stress over it. I haven't had to do much of anything for it so I don't see it causing me any issues. She also wants me to relax and try the NTNP method until March and see what happens. Which I'm honestly not keen about. However, she does want me to keep temping my BBT and taking notes during my cycle in case things don't work out on their own and we have to refer to them (the notes and charts) while following me medically. But the good news is that this bleeding might be my period coming on (hopefully) so hopefully this useless cycle is about to be over. I'm tempted to get my hands on that herb that is supposed to be like natural clomid haha. :haha: Oh and my doc did say that she thinks that there might be some truth to the shettles method and said that we can definitely keep trying that too if we want to. I think DH knows I'm not ready to stop trying or NTNP and not pay attention to timing. :blush: :haha:

The other good thing is that her partner in her practice is a urologist and he's her husband. He is going to see my DH in Feb. and they are going to go ahead and do a sperm count since DH is 40 to make sure that we have some live ones to do the trick. 

So that's that in a nutshell. 

Spidey, GL this cycle! I hope you get your bfp! When I got my bfp with Bryson, I had a cold too. I actually wound up getting 2 of them back to back before my bfp! Haha. So Pippin might be right, it could be a sign!! :winkwink: :happydance:


----------



## Boothh

kim i didnt mean that, i just meant with all the stuff you do temping and charting and what not it means ttc is on your mind alot and i think that can make a difference sometimes :hugs: xx sorry you didnt get what you wanted from your appointment :hugs:

afm - i have a cold too and i did with jesse and hiro x


----------



## spidey

Kim- even though things didn't go exactly how you wanted, it sounds good that you and the doctor have a plan. Giving your body some time to regulate itself sounds good. I guess you'll have to see if this bleeding turns into a full blown period. I really have no idea how clomid works, but I would guess you need to take it at a certain time of the month, so getting your cycles back on track is a good plan in the meantime :thumbup:


----------



## Kimberly28

Thanks. I just cant help but feel a little frustrated. I just want my body to work the way it's supposed to. Right now not being pregnant isn't really bothering me. Honestly, it's knowing that my body isn't working correctly the way it is supposed to that is getting to me. If it would just work the way it should instead of being all wonky then going through the cycles even if I don't get pregnant for a few more months would be much easier to deal with and more acceptable. If that makes any sense. I really think I'm being reasonable here. :-k


----------



## HeidiLSparks

Just popping in to say....I feel like I need to be part of this group because you are all my ladies....(in a creepy pimp voice) Good luck to all you pregnant mommas and trying to get pregnant mommas..maybe I will join sometime soon ....(ok....sneaking back out...)


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## cleckner04

Heidi, don't you dare have a 3rd before I even have a chance to get pregnant with my 2nd! :rofl:


----------



## Kimberly28

Heidi, you are more than welcome here anytime!! I'd love to see you with us even if you're not preg or ttc. :hugs: You're still one of us. :thumbup: Besides, you were preg with Lily not that long ago. :winkwink:


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## ashnbump

Heeeiiiiddddiiii - ive missed your beautiful face over here, i never seem to go over to our main thread anymore, no idea why! 

i think you should have another baby, this time it'll be a boy! you make GORGEOUS babies, that warrants you creating another lol! or you could join cleck in WTT over here :thumbup:

kim - i do understand how you must be feeling, its so frustrating when things are out of your control too! just try put it to the back of your mind for the next week or so, and see what happens, i know its easier said than done, but its the only advice i have hun sorry!

spidey & boothh - oooohhh colds hey!! looks like it could be a double line month for you both lol! a cold want something i had with Kara or new bean, but is does seem like a lot of ladies have! good luck!

afm - well hopefully i'll hear from the midwife tomorrow, and she will be able to squeeze me in before xmas! from LMP i'll be 12 weeks on the 30th, but i was scanned at 11 weeks last time, which would make it the 23rd! Just have to wait and see hey! I would have LOVED to announce it on christmas day, but life goes on lol!

the sickness is still here, and shows no sign of letting up anytime in the near future :( i am eating and drinking now, but i constantly feel sick and im running to the toilet heaving every half hour! i love it and hate it both at the same time lol!

ive also decided i have no idea what sex this baby could possibly be, i originally thought boy, but now im having the same early cravings of pink and blue cola bottles, that i had with kara, so its thrown me into confusion! Maybe its one of each and one was just hiding when i had my early scan lol!xx


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## ashnbump

on another note 

does anyone know where i can get one of these?? I want this for bun!

https://i727.photobucket.com/albums/ww276/slimshadyluva/154956_454554680666_616060666_5977507_477637_n-1.jpg

can u help ladies?xx


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## HeidiLSparks

I miss your face beautiful lady :hugs: How are you feeling? I had MS with Lily to the point I went into the doctor and cried and cried and begged him to either make it stop or kill me. I puked at least 10 times a day and could not get off the couch, I was put on 4 different medications...ahh it was so bad. I am so excited for you and I want a baby boy so bad haha!

Cleck..geshhhh FINE :rofl: I am taking me BC though haha, I am waiting but I miss that belly!


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## spidey

ash- are you planning to find out the sex or will it be a surprise? 

I am so terrified about having severe ms again. How are you managing Kara while having ms Ash? Heidi- Caylee must have been so young when you had ms from Lily!? I just cannot imagine! When I was pregnant with Kira the only way to stop puking was to lay perfectly still on the couch ALL day, LOL. That will not be an option this time.


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## Shiv

oh any symptoms today Spidey?


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## spidey

nope, not a single symptom! But my cold is finally going away and I can breath thru my nose again :happydance: AF should arrive early next week- eek!


----------



## HeidiLSparks

Caylee was 5 months old until 9 months old when I finally stopped throwing up. It was SO hard. I woud crawl on the floor to get her something and just keep all her supplies next to me so I didn't have to get up and go get them. It was TERRIBLE


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## Boothh

ash - i remember saying this before when you said you had cravings for pink and blue cola bottles with kara, i had them with jesse too so it could still be a boy :p 

afm - my boobies are sore again, i know they were early on in the month so its obviously not a sure fire sign for me, but its my nipples that are really painful now not like my whole boobs, its really annoying especially when jesse whacks me on them :( im testing monday if i havnt had AF, as i think i OV either 5th or 6th of december, xx


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## ashnbump

Oooh Boothh!! My nipples were SO sore when I got my bfp!! Still are as well lol :( I forgot what u said about the pink and blue sweeties, so I guess u cud be right!

Spidey- I honeslt am struggling so much withthe ms, I know it's a good sign but it's been horrid :( kara comes and rubs my leg at the toilet lol she pats me and says mum mum lol! Hopefully won't last much longer as I'm ready to give in and stay in bed for 6months!

Afm- I spoke to midwife today, she can't see me until the 6th of January at the earliest! And my scan will be sometime after that!!! Not happy with it at all but what can I do? I'll be about 14 weeks before I get my flippin scan I really wanted to announce it soon too!! But I don't want to do it without a piccie lol!

But on a lighter note..... I JUST HEARED BUNS HEARTBEAT!!!! with my angelsounds doppler I had from kara! It was strong too, low down nearer to the left, sounded like a train, so Boothh I do think it's a boy now lol! It was deffo bun as well I heard mine plenty to know the difference lol! So I'm very happy with that! 

Am I right in thinking my mc rate drops now?

Funny how u still worry!

Everyone excited for Xmas???xxxx


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## Boothh

ooo thats so good you heard HB :happydance: 

im soooo excited for christmas i have lots of wrapping to do and need to go shopping today but i cba, i feel ill im in bed waiting for stuart to get home from work, jesse has gone on a weekend away with my mum and cousins to see santa! xx


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## Boothh

https://i51.tinypic.com/rrtjwk.jpg


eeeek just tested with quite diluted wee, think AF is due monday so a couple of days early what do you think? bare in mind my camera is crap, when the dye went over the test strip it just stayed there, was a line before control line came up, and its still there now, nice and pink irl ¬_¬


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## Boothh

can see it from arms length really easy without looking really


----------



## ashnbump

Aaaaaagggggghhhhhhhh boooooooootttttthhhhh!!! 

Ur preggo!!! :happydance:

YAAAAAAAYYYY! sticky dust to u hun, so happy xxxx


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## Boothh

theres actually an actual line though hahahahha im shaking, like its definatly a line were its really there not were i could be imagining it


----------



## HeidiLSparks

THAT IS A LINE! :D Yaaayyy Booth!


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## spidey

I see it too!!! :happydance::happydance:


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## Boothh

in real life its sooo clear and really pink, it definatly a positive test were i normally kid myself it is, but this actually is hahaha OMG!


----------



## Boothh

cleck i can seeeee you and you not posting!! whats wrong with you!! :p x


----------



## cleckner04

Sorry!!! I was on my phone waiting for Emma to see santa so I didn't get a chance to respond. I see the line too!!! Congrats!!! :dance:


----------



## joeyjo

Even I can see a line Boothh & i never see lines :) wayhey congrats :)


----------



## Pippin

AHHHHHH Boothh I saw FB and knew it had to be a line. I'm on my phone and can see it no probs!!!! You're pregnant!!!!!! Wwwwoooooooohhhhhhhhhooooooooooo :yipee: :headspin: :happydance: :wacko: :yipee: :hug: :cloud9: CONGRATULATIONS xxxxxxxxx


----------



## Shiv

Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay well done Boothh! Great Christmas news!

And Kim - thi sjust goes to show you can still get preggo without "perfect, textbook" cycles! Don't give up hope :hugs:


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## Aunty E

Line, that's a line, such a line!!!!! Good luck working out your EDD from your last period on this one ;)

Congrats, everything crossed for beanie :flower:


----------



## Pippin

Any updates boothh I need news! :rofl: Going mad wondering about you.


----------



## Boothh

i done another test and its fainter, i dont get it one obviously positive, then one faint then another proper positive and now another faint one wtf is goin on! 
im just gunna try forget about it, (still take vits and folic acid and not drink etc) til after christmas, pray to god AF doesnt arrive and see what happens, 
if its meant to be its meant to be if not its not i really have no control over it so stressing isnt going to do me any or potential baba any good, 
if i do start to bleed though im taking my tests to the docs and im gunna demand they check me out properly now as it will be my 3rd mc in 9months xx


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## Pippin

Hon, honestly you can't go buy the strength of the line, tests, even the same brand, have different sensitivity, pee can be diluted or stronger. Even when I held it sometimes wasn't as strong as if I'd only just peed. Never mad sense but it was true. It's good to relax and let it happen though I agree with you there. Test again in 48 hours and see. You're still early remember and it can take 48-72 hours to double. Hang on in there you are still preggers :winkwink:


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## Shiv

So I started spotting today which mean witch will show up tomorrow - which will give me a 28 day cycle - which is what I predicted earlier in the month by when I thought I ovulated. It is pretty cool that I can tell when i ovulate!

Boothh - a line is a line honey!

Spidey - how you doing? any symptoms?

I am getting very jealous now of all the pregnant ladies, I hope i am not too far behind you all!


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## spidey

Boothh- I agree with what Pippin has said. It sounds like you have a great attitude about it though and thats the best thing that you can do for the baby now :thumbup:

Shiv- thats soooo neat that you predicted when AF would come based off of cm! 

I should be seeing AF today or tomorrow.. or anytime this week. Today would make it a 28 day cycle. I don't feel pregnant and I don't have pms either. It's the new non-hormonal Spidey :haha: Before Kira was born I had such horrible pms. DH said again last night that if I don't get pregnant by the time Kira is 3 that he's getting a vasectomy :rofl: because he DOES NOT want babies 4 years apart. Silly man! I told him I would get my sperm from the mailman then!


----------



## Pippin

spidey said:


> I should be seeing AF today or tomorrow.. or anytime this week. Today would make it a 28 day cycle. I don't feel pregnant and I don't have pms either. It's the new non-hormonal Spidey :haha: Before Kira was born I had such horrible pms. DH said again last night that if I don't get pregnant by the time Kira is 3 that he's getting a vasectomy :rofl: because he DOES NOT want babies 4 years apart. Silly man! I told him I would get my sperm from the mailman then!

:rofl: I love it you made me laugh then. Hope the witch stays away. it can be a very good sign getting no symptoms at all not even pms. Are you testing or just waiting to see if you are late?


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## cleckner04

My brother and I are 4 years apart and close as ever. So tell him to stuff it. :winkwink: I don't think age gaps matter all that much in the long run. It all just depends on how they are raised and their own individual personalities. :shrug:


----------



## spidey

Cleckner- I'll tell DH what you said :thumbup: I think since him and his brother are 6 years apart and don't get along, he assumes that you need to be close in age to have a better relationship. His parents raised them crappy so no wonder they don't get along! I was trying to tell him that a 3 or 4 year gaps seems perfect to me since Kira would be heading off to pre-school or kindergarten and I could give baby #2 lots of one on one attention during the day. I'll let nature decide though, and there's always the mailman :rofl:

Pippin- I'm only going to test if I'm about 2 weeks late since thats 2 weeks less of worrying about an early loss.


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## Pippin

Spidey how can you not test :haha: god I'd be going mad not knowing! Understand now waiting till you are late but two weeks :saywhat: do you not understand I NEED to see lines :rofl: I feed off other peoples bfps now I have mine, how will I survive hahahahaha :haha: :rofl:


----------



## Boothh

my line was barely there this morning and iv started spotting, not too bothered cus iv only known a few days, im off to the docs in the next few days though to demand some tests etc, its 3rd time now and my cycles are ridiculous! back to ttc in the new year for me, i obviously have no problem getting pregnant, but there is definatly something wrong with my body at the moment thats preventing me from supporting a baby :/ iv got pregnant 3times in 6 cycles so thats good going for anybody i think, just need to find out whats up cos once thats sorted im sure ill have a baby by this time next year :)
at least i dont have to change all my plans for christmas either now cus i tryna think of excuses about not drinking etc, x


----------



## spidey

I'm sorry Boothh that you've had to go thru this so many times this year :hugs: The doctors should take you seriously and it should be a simple fix to get you good and pregnant in the New Year. You're amazing to keep a positive attitude- bring on the holiday drinks!!!

Pippin- LOL... Perhaps I don't test just to torture you girls :rofl: I don't even have a test in my house so I'm not even tempted!


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## Boothh

oh me and stuart are gunna buy lots of cocktail making things its been a pretty shitty year for me but im feeling positive about next year, until then i have the most beautiful, clever, perfect son i could ever ask for and i am so thankful i have him, he is the best thing in my life and nothing seems as bad because i have him :) xx


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## joeyjo

:hugs:


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## cleckner04

Aww hun. :( :hugs: I'm sorry this happened again. 2011 will be better for all of us I think. :thumbup:


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## Shiv

Here's to 2011 :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

Although my 2011 won't get better until it's halfway over. :haha:


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## Shiv

Here's to JULY 2011!


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## Pippin

Shiv said:


> Here's to JULY 2011!

I agree with this one, will be here before I know it :haha:


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## spidey

2011 here we come!!

I just found out that I'm probably losing my job at the end of Feb, so the pressure is on to make a baby in 2011 so I can have a good excuse to be a stay at home mom :thumbup:


----------



## Kimberly28

I agree Cleck! Here's to July 2011!!! :wine: :happydance:

Boothh, I'm so sorry that this happened to you. :( Here's to good solid sticky bfp's for all of us (who aren't preg right now) in 2011! :flower:


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## Aunty E

Frick. So sorry Boothh :cry: Sounds like you have a good attitude to it, and are all geared up to take on your GP in the New Year. 

I remember Snowball had three early miscarriages in quick succession after she lost Beau, but then she got Ozzie, so it does happen :)

AFU, I'm a bit knackered and miserable atm. Mogling has had a few bad nights, and I sprained my ankle a couple of weeks ago, so with one thing and another I'm exhausted and in pain and MS seems to have made a reappearance in Third Tri. OH isn't doing any housework, and we've had a few visitors over the last couple of weeks, which meant I had to completely sort out my spare rooms and move stuff around. I haven't even started sorting out Imogen's room yet, and it has to be done by the time new baby gets here. This time in Imogen's pregnancy I was packing our entire house to move, and doing loads of stuff, but I just can't face doing anything. Even starting little things, like getting out my sewing machine to hem a pair of trousers, feels like too much. I'm not even really looking forward to mat leave, as I have so much to do before then at work :(


----------



## Boothh

sorry your feeling shit at the moment AE :( :hugs: last time you just had yourself to look after this time your doing it again but with a toddler to keep in check so your bound to be extra knackered, try not to worry about things, the house being tidy isnt as important as an extra hours sleep at the moment, take it easy! xxx


----------



## Pippin

spidey said:


> 2011 here we come!!
> 
> I just found out that I'm probably losing my job at the end of Feb, so the pressure is on to make a baby in 2011 so I can have a good excuse to be a stay at home mom :thumbup:

Awww sorry to hear this, but if you can afford to be SAHM go for it, I'll be very jealous. Have a few years off then you can work again. Glad you are seeing the bright side. Any sign of AF yet hon?


----------



## Shiv

I have absolutely NO idea what is going on with my body! SO onMonday I wrote that I had started spotting so expected to come on properly the next day - well still not and it' snow Thursday!

Each day I have had one wipe of brown stuff and that is it! just once in the day, the rest of the time nothing! weird! And annoying I wanted AF over before xmas, I bet it comes on full force Christmas morning!

Oh and Spidey sorry about your job, will you get a redundancy package? That is what is allowing me to be a SAHM for the moment.


----------



## Aunty E

Here is another bump pic, clothed and bare last night - I'm much smaller today, as I think Teddy has wriggled round again. No stretchies, apart from the ones by my navel piercing, but last time mine only showed up after the birth. I think they were shrinkies ;) They're cute anyway, so I don't mind at all, I'd only mind if they bled like some people's!!!!!!

https://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f225/AuntyE/da731ce5.jpg

https://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f225/AuntyE/c3c9ba3a.jpg

Mogling was up again at six - why is she doing this to us? :sleep: She had a bottle and went straight back to sleep, but in our bed, so I didn't really get to sleep much with her nuzzling me, and headbutting me, and kicking Teddy etc etc etc. If ever there was an argument against co-sleeping, it's Imogen at night! :wacko:


----------



## spidey

super cute bump AE!!!!

Shiv- thats really weird about your AF. Is there a small chance that you could be pregnant?!?!

Unfortunately I'm on a contract, so every year they can chose whether or not to renew me and if they chose NOT to renew me, I get nothing. I've been there for 9 years now so it'll be a little sad not seeing my coworkers anymore. My boss is the one who decided to leave so everyone she has hired will be losing their jobs too. I can only hope that another lab will want to take me on, but with budget issues that will probably not happen. I will be hard but I think we can live off DH's income for a few years.

No AF for me! I'm getting little cramps though so I know she's on her way! Probably right in time for Christmas :dohh:


----------



## Pippin

I think you should both :test: :haha:


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## Shiv

Oh pip you do make me laugh! There is no chance I got pregnant this month, we were very careful. Just my body keeping me guessing!


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## cleckner04

Popping in to say hi! Aunty E, cute bump hun!! 

I never mentioned AF has already been and went but I had a 28 day cycle this month! Hopefully my body is finally starting to get back on track. I was eyeing those saliva ovulation monitors last night. :haha: It's so tempting to get obsessive about it. 

In weight loss news, I've lost 5 pounds since DH left!!! :dance: And I haven't been eating any differently. I'm just working my ass off on the treadmill and recumbent bike. :D


----------



## Boothh

spidey it sucks you might be losing your job but on the bright side you get loooads of extra time with kira which can only be a plus! ;)

cleck well done on losing some weight, im just tucking into a pizza haha, january is when im getting back on track, just want to lose a stone and ill be alot happier :) xx


----------



## spidey

congrats on the 5 pounds Cleckner! 

Speaking of saliva and ovulation... does anyone else get a different taste in their mouth on the first day of AF? Sometimes I get a strange taste an hour before the bleeding starts and the taste lasts only a day. 

Still no AF... I am certain she will come right in the middle of opening presents Christmas morning :haha:


----------



## joeyjo

Just wanted to say Happy Christmas to you all, it's been super busy getting ready but I'm so excited now :)


----------



## Pippin

spidey said:


> congrats on the 5 pounds Cleckner!
> 
> Speaking of saliva and ovulation... does anyone else get a different taste in their mouth on the first day of AF? Sometimes I get a strange taste an hour before the bleeding starts and the taste lasts only a day.
> 
> Still no AF... I am certain she will come right in the middle of opening presents Christmas morning :haha:

:test: women and put me out of my misery!!!

*Cleckner* CONGRATS on the weight loss. Well done and keep it up hon. Think how fabulous you'll feel when DH gets back if you carry it on. xxxx


----------



## spidey

still no AF and Sunday will be day 34 of my cycle. Since having Kira all of my cycles have been between 28 and 32 days. But I still don't think I'm pregnant- it's probably just a late cycle from being sick. I'm going to torture you just a little longer Pippin :haha: Besides, we're under a winter storm warning so it's not safe to go out and buy a test right now :rofl: I'm trying really hard to find symptoms, but the only thing is slightly sore nipples which I usually get right before AF comes. No tiredness or nausea.

Shiv- has AF arrived yet?


----------



## Shiv

Yep AF got here in full force Christmas eve.

Spidey - eek exciting! 

Cleck - well done on the 5lbs, good work girl :thumbup:


----------



## Pippin

How about I ship some to you spidey???? :rofl: :winkwink:

Shiv does this mean it's full steam ahead this month? Fingers crossed for you hon. Xxx


----------



## spidey

There's a chance I'll buy a test Tuesday while we're out shopping! :happydance: I mentioned it to DH tonight and he said "you're not pregnant" so I'll have to sneak one into the cart tomorrow  He's been off work since last Thursday and he has no work this week either so he's been stuck up my butt and I don't have a minute to sneak off to the store! I really don't feel pregnant so I don't have much hope I'll get a positive.


----------



## ashnbump

Well good luck Spidey! Let's have a few more bfp's In the new year!!

Hope u all had a lovely christmas! And a great new year to come!

It's quiet in here since the FB group opened lol! Xxx


----------



## Pippin

spidey said:


> There's a chance I'll buy a test Tuesday while we're out shopping! :happydance: I mentioned it to DH tonight and he said "you're not pregnant" so I'll have to sneak one into the cart tomorrow  He's been off work since last Thursday and he has no work this week either so he's been stuck up my butt and I don't have a minute to sneak off to the store! I really don't feel pregnant so I don't have much hope I'll get a positive.

ohhhh yes be sneaky or even not!!!. We are our own people so even if he does see then say 'well I'm buying it so be quiet' :haha:

Sooo many people have no symptoms at all so means nothing hon. x


----------



## spidey

I just tested and it was a BFN!! So bring on the New Years drinks!! :haha: I guess my luck of having predictable cycles is over and now its back to the old days of never knowing if AF will come at 28 days or 48! And the good thing is I bought a 2 pack so next time I can test whenever I feel the urge :haha:


----------



## cleckner04

Well I haven't checked in here lately. I've been a bit off with BnB lately. Just losing the interest temporarily I think. I've been obsessively watching tv lately instead since I still don't feel well after my food poisoning last week. :dohh: 

Spidey- Sorry about the BFN. :hugs: It's good you'll be able to drink for new years eve though! Gotta think of all the positives. :D


----------



## Pippin

spidey said:


> I just tested and it was a BFN!! So bring on the New Years drinks!! :haha: I guess my luck of having predictable cycles is over and now its back to the old days of never knowing if AF will come at 28 days or 48! And the good thing is I bought a 2 pack so next time I can test whenever I feel the urge :haha:

Ahhh bottoms! Hope it's a one off wonky cycle. x


----------



## Shiv

Spidey - yay we can still be cycle buddies (apart from we both now have skew-wiff cycles!) - sorry it's a BFN! We shall both enjoy enjoy a tipple or two on NYE and then start again next month! :hugs:


----------



## spidey

Shiv- I better get AF soon or we'll no longer have the same cycles!! I'm still waiting and now I'm starting to think that I should be careful with the drinks just incase I ovulated late and could be early pregnant. Maybe I will use my other test on New Years eve :haha:

Cleckner- you have lots of tv to catch up on if you haven't had cable for awhile! I am such a tv addict that it's shameful  Did Emma get poisoning too? I hope you feel 100% soon!


----------



## cleckner04

So far, I've watched all six seasons of Nip/Tuck, the first season of Toddlers & Tiaras, a few movies, and now I'm almost finished with the first two seasons of Jon & Kate plus 8. :rofl: But it has like 6 seasons of Jon & Kate so it should hold me over until next week at least. :blush:


----------



## Boothh

i cant even remember what CD im on i need to work it out! hoping i dont have a huge long cycle again though! :(


----------



## joeyjo

Arrggh you girls are a bad influence!!! I just peed on a stick and now I've opened it up for a better look!


----------



## Shiv

ohhhhhhhhhhhhh does that mean there is a hint of a line?!?!?!


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## cleckner04

Joey!! Is there a line there than?!! You can't leave us hangin. :D

Boothh- hope you get a perfect 28 day cycle this month. :lol:


As for me, I've lost 5.8 pounds this week!! :shock: I was sick all night thursday and friday last week and than have had basically no appetite this week. I didn't expect to lose quite so much but I'm not complaining. :haha: So I've lost 10.8 total in a month!


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## Shiv

wow well done Cleck - you aren't far off a stone! hurrah!

JoeyJo - where are you?


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## spidey

yes JoeyJo, where are you??!!!!!!!!

Congrats on the weight loss Cleck. It's an awful way to lose it, but atleast there was something positive from having food poisoning. :thumbup:

Boothh, I think I can join you in the long unpredictable cycle club now. I'm at cycle day 40 today- eeek! I did enjoy my stint of 28 day cycles though. My nipple pain went away a few days ago and now I feel completely un-hormonal. If AF doesn't arrive in the next week I'll test again.


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## cleckner04

Aww Spidey that seriously sucks! Seems most of us have weird unpredictable cycles lately. Although my last cycle was 28 days. Go freaking figure right? The month DH leaves and I have a 28 day cycle. :dohh::rofl:


----------



## Boothh

im on CD 12 today and i think i had EWCM yesterday, i cant tell today cus we dtd this morning and i havnt jumped in the shower yet iykwim :blush: i hope i actually have a proper cycle and i didnt imagine it! x


----------



## joeyjo

Sorry I went out last night!

Don't think there was a line but maybe a tiny hint. Tested again this afternoon & nothing at all. AF was due yesterday so I'll probably test in the morning if she hasn't arrived...


----------



## Shiv

Spidey and JoeyJo - any sign of AF yet? Any more testing done?

As for me, well we are officially back on the TTC bandwagon. Not sure what is going on with my cycle though so i don't know if I am fertile or not at the moment. I *think* i am on CD 11 today and think i will ovulate around CD 15 so I should be coming into my fertile range, but apart from one wipe of ewcm yesterday I haven't had any. i usually have lots for a few days so who knows what is going on!


----------



## spidey

Boothh- I hope this is a 28 day cycle for you- you deserve it!!

Still no AF here and now it's day 42 I think. No sign of anything- no breast tenderness, moodiness, insomnia, constipation, nothing!! I'll test again at the end of the week since I don't want to waste my last test. I had nipple tenderness around the time I tested and I read on Dr Google that you can have nipple pain around ovulation :haha: So if thats true, then I may not see AF till next week. 

Shiv- Maybe your cycle will be a few days longer than you expected and the ewcm will kick in soon! Fingers crossed for you!

Cleck- AF has a cruel sense of humor to give you a perfect 28 day cycle after Corey leaves. 

joeyjo- fingers crossed for you too!!!


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## Boothh

havnt had any proper ewcm yet, but it seems to be going that way so i think ill be OV next week sometime HOPEFULLY!!

spidey when are you testing? xx


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## spidey

Boothh- I hope its a straight forward cycle for you this month!

Still no AF and now I'm thinking she'll never come! And now that I'm typing this I just got a cramp so maybe she's on her way, LOL. If not, I'll be testing this weekend. I'll be on cd 46 Friday.


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## cleckner04

OMG!! You have to test tomorrow. :haha: You can't hold out like this! :growlmad:;)


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## Shiv

Ah Spidey - TEST!!!! fx'ed for you. how are you feeling about theprospect of potentially being preggers?

AFM - well I think I am CD17 today and am getting little cramps and had lots of ewcm yesterday so think I will ovulate today (assuming I am ovulating at all!). SO later than last month so I guess i will be having a long cycle this month.

we managed to BD on CD 10, CD15 and hopefully tonight, so I don't hold out too much hope, I had a bit of a ttc wobble between days 10 and 15 :dohh:

Boothh, did you ever go to the docs about your line on your test?

I am going to use this thread for day to day chat about t


----------



## Shiv

Ah Spidey - TEST!!!! fx'ed for you. how are you feeling about theprospect of potentially being preggers?

AFM - well I think I am CD17 today and am getting little cramps and had lots of ewcm yesterday so think I will ovulate today (assuming I am ovulating at all!). SO later than last month so I guess i will be having a long cycle this month.

we managed to BD on CD 10, CD15 and hopefully tonight, so I don't hold out too much hope, I had a bit of a ttc wobble between days 10 and 15 :dohh:

Boothh, did you ever go to the docs about your line on your test?

I am going to use this thread for day to day chat about ttc as i don't really wanna talk about ewcm etc on facebook as there are loads of people on the group there who would prob not be interested in my bodily fluids!


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## spidey

LOL Shiv about discussing bodily fluids on FB :haha:

AF arrived this morning and it was only a 46 day cycle! I'm only a little disappointed because I was keeping my fingers crossed that I was pregnant but having no symptoms like one of those ladies on "I didn't know I was pregnant" LOL. I'm so scared of a repeat of the first trimester symptoms that I had last pregnancy. But... I am also slightly relieved since I'm still having occasional doubts about TTC. 95% of the time I want another baby but after a bad day with lots of crying and teething pain I get my doubts.


----------



## Shiv

aw sorry about the bfn Spidey, but we can still be cycle buddies (if not slightly skew whiff cycle buddies!)

I know exactly what you mean about having ttc wobbles, I have one most months!


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## Boothh

shiv no i havnt been back yet, the last few weeks have been super busy and i havnt had a chance i need to make an appointment next week really x


----------



## Pippin

Hey ladies just checking in on ya. Just seen what JoeyJo has written on fb and thought she might have an update for us. Here's hoping. Sorry still no af Spidey :hugs:


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## Shiv

oh what has JoeyJo put on fb? is she preggers?

As for me i am CD 18 today (I think) so now for the 2ww and symptom spotting! I have sensitive nipples (which I have never noticed before, not even when pregnant) but I think it is too early to be a preggo sign as I won't have even implaned yet :dohh:


----------



## Pippin

She said its proving to be an interesting afternoon in her house and my mind obviously went into overdrive after her saying she got a faint line. So hope so. Probably something completely different lol

GOOD LUCK JOEYJO!!!!!!! Come and update us.


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## spidey

Shiv, I've been noticing sensitive nipples right at or after the time of ovulation for me too during the past 3 cycles. Fingers crossed for you!! You're going to be good and paranoid for the next 2 weeks :haha:

Pippin- I tend to turn any innocent post into something pregnancy related. We have pregnancy on our brains!


----------



## Pippin

spidey said:


> Shiv, I've been noticing sensitive nipples right at or after the time of ovulation for me too during the past 3 cycles. Fingers crossed for you!! You're going to be good and paranoid for the next 2 weeks :haha:
> 
> Pippin- I tend to turn any innocent post into something pregnancy related. We have pregnancy on our brains!

:blush: it was one of the comments underneath that sold me, but yes I do have pregnancy on the brain :haha:

12 week scan tomorrow :yipee: so excited.


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## Shiv

Hi to the faithful few who are still looking in on thsi thread!

Well I think I am 5dpo today and I had a a monster headache today, like verging on migraine it was awful! I just looked back to see if I had mentioned a headache last month, but it turns out i wasn't terribly efficient at writing down what my body did last month :dohh: So none the wiser.

I don't think I am pregnant but I am such an eejit that I keep allowing myself to think I might be! The tww is harder being a sahm than it was being at work, far too much time to sit and symptom spot! Only 5dpo and it is dragging! If I don't conceive for months then i am going to be a crazy lady!:wacko:

So who else is still here?
Spidey?
Boothh?
Kim?
JoeyJo?
Cleck (all be-it play being suspended for a few months :hugs:)


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## cleckner04

I'm here! :wave: :haha: If only my vibrator could impregnate me. :muaha:


----------



## spidey

I'm here... I was just coming in to bug Shiv for her symptoms :haha: A massive headache might be promising. 

Boothh- you might be in your 2ww too!?? 

LOL Cleckner about your vibrator :haha:

AF is almost gone for me so soon I will be baby making again! I would like it to happen this cycle because I'm getting a little tired of waiting! Plus I no longer have a boss since she quit, so it would be a perfect time to have ms and not show up for a month or 2!


----------



## Shiv

Well that's agreed then Spidey and I will get preggers this cycle and Cleck we will work on getting that vibe of yours to do the job properly so you can join us next cycle :haha:

Can I just say I REALLY don't like TTC. When I am TTC this is how my month pans out

One week on my period
One week having sex that quite frankly i can't be arsed to have (I am sure we have discussed my low sex drive before!)
2 weeks checking my knickers and toilet tissue EVERY time I wipe!

it sucks!

(and Cleck I know I should be grateful that i have DH here and can ttc so sorry for moaning :hugs:)


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## spidey

I never TTC with Kira so this is the first time I've experienced months that you described perfectly Shiv! I try not to think about it too much but its hard not to. I'm also finding myself not scheduling things around the time that I would be 5 and 6 weeks pregnant because I wouldn't want to ruin my plans with the start of ms. 

Shiv, I'm not one with a big sex drive either. If DH wasn't interested I wouldn't be too bothered by it. Although in the moment I do enjoy myself and usually think "oh, we need to do this more often!" but then those feelings don't last. It's weird and I can't really explain it!


----------



## Shiv

I know exactly what you mean Spidey!

So today is 6 dpo (maybe!) and headache is gone thank goodness. I have had a bit of what canonly be decribed as ewcm though :wacko: what is that all about?!?!?


----------



## spidey

did you have ewcm when you thought you ovulated- if not, could this be a late ovulation? Does cm change if you are pregnant?


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## Shiv

yep had 3 or 4 days of ewcm when i thought I ovulated. Don't really know what is supposed to happen to it when pregnant!


----------



## cleckner04

Fingers crossed for you girls! AF should be arriving here within the next 3 days. I'm on CD29 right now. So last month's 28 day cycle musta been a fluke. :( I was hoping I had finally regulated back to a normal cycle. But I still have 5 months so obviously not that stressed about it. :haha:


----------



## spidey

So Shiv... any new symptoms?? When are you planning to test (I need something to look forward to, LOL)?

AF is gone for me so soon it will be baby making time. If history repeats itself, I had a 46 day cycle before Kira was made, and this last cycle I had was 46 days. I think those long cycles are good for gearing up for pregnancy. :thumbup:

Cleckner- did you have regular cycles before Emma?


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## Shiv

No more symptoms here - bah. As for testing. i would like to try not to test until the day after AF is due (which is 23rd i think!). But if it is anything like the previous couple of months i will have started spotting a few days before that and will be out!

so here's hoping it is lucky 46 again Spidey!


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## cleckner04

Spidey- yeah I had perfect 28 day cycles before Emma. :( It was like clockwork. Now it's all over the place which is really hard to deal with when I want to be PREGNANT! :haha:


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## Boothh

im on CD29 and i havnt even OVyet and dnt feel like im even gearing up for it either :dohh: tryna get a docs appointment now i cba wth another nearly 3 month cycle!


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## Boothh

ps i only just noticed weve been moved!


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## cleckner04

AF just hit me after a 34 day cycle. Last month was 28. Wacky cycles are bullshit. Sorry your having such long cycles booth. :hugs:


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## Shiv

sorry for wacky cycles - i hope youget some answers at the docs Boothh

Well I am CD11 today and the urge to poas is strong! No "real" symptoms to speak of. Slight stretchy pains on right hand side low down and up in th enight weeing, but pretty sure it is all psychosematic (spelling), I am not hopeful, yet can't stop thinking I might be!

I put a post in here a couple of days ago and it has disappeared - weird! It was a nice one for you as well CLeck!


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## cleckner04

Weird! No wonder you haven't been getting a high post count...:haha:


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## Shiv

cleckner04 said:


> Weird! No wonder you haven't been getting a high post count...:haha:

it's true! I should be on 20,000 by now but the mods are out to stop me :haha:

What it did say was something like this.

Hwo long has Corey been away now Cleck? Must be over 2 months? Just to let you know that I think of you often and hope that the time is flying for you and Emma :hugs:

oh and i just went to the loo and had a large amount of creamy cm!


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## cleckner04

That post was so warm and sentimental but you ended it by taking about your creamy CM. :rofl::rofl: 

He left the 30th of November so a little over a month and a half now. :dance: It's been going pretty fast. Feels like he just left yesterday really. The end half is usually the hardest bit for me because I know it's getting closer and than the time starts dragging.


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## Shiv

I always like to end a soppy post with talk of bodly fluids! Glad it's going fast for you. hope that continues!


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## cleckner04

:rofl: 

I just love you all. I don't know what I'd do without this place. 

I just pee'd my pants. 


:rofl:


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## Shiv

cleckner04 said:


> :rofl:
> 
> I just love you all. I don't know what I'd do without this place.
> 
> I just pee'd my pants.
> 
> 
> :rofl:

Have you considered Tena Lady? Or perhaps one of these to exercise your pelvic floor?
https://www.poshmums.com/images/PelvicToner_m.JPG


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## cleckner04

:rofl: I can't believe they actually make equipment for it. :rofl: Here I was trying to find a workout machine for my abs..Silly me! :haha:


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## cleckner04

Completely off topic but I just tried putting a tampon in and it hurt so bad I couldn't even get it in there. I think my vagina is sealing itself up. :rofl::rofl:


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## Shiv

born again virgin!


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## Pippin

You lot make me laugh. :haha: Not sure I'd want to insert that thing :wacko: Cleck I have months when I find it uncomfortable to *insert* mine was usually because I was a bit dry *tmi* Just seen your weight loss too, faberoony! Keep it up, he won't recognise you hon!!!

I'm really excited for you Shiv I hope this is your month. When are you going to :test:

Good luck to Spidey and Boothh hope you start ovulating soon. xxx


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## spidey

You girls always make me laugh!

Shiv.... sooo... when is AF due??? Any symptoms today? What does creamy cm mean!? 

I should be ovulating at some point in the next couple weeks :haha: I'm on cd 13 now and no sign of cm yet.


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## Shiv

I am managing to resist testing so far -just! So i have a night out planned on Saturday so i will test Saturday morning if AF hasn't arrived already by then. I will be 15DPO then. I am veering from one minute thinking I am pregnant to the next thinking i am deffo not. But then i felt like that in November and wasn't preggo so i don't hold out much hope. Why is it impossiblt to not get your hopes up?


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## spidey

Shiv- my fingers are crossed for you so you can get pregnant already and be done with TTC! Of course if you test Saturday morning you better make a post here with the results ASAP!!!!!


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## Shiv

spidey said:


> Shiv- my fingers are crossed for you so you can get pregnant already and be done with TTC! Of course if you test Saturday morning you better make a post here with the results ASAP!!!!!

Of course! Although I am thinking of testing Friday am instead :haha: I managed to resisit this morning, which means another day managed as I will only test with fmu! Well done me! the only other time I have managed to wait until AF is due to test was the time I got preggo with Sophia!

You must be about to start the baby dancing again Spidey?


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## Shiv

Well I'm out for this month! Started spotting just now (just like the past 2 months) so I expect AF to show up in full force pretty soon.

Bit down to be honest - I don't how people who have been ttc for a long time manage to pick themselves up every month. I think I would be ok if I didn't get so consumed by it, but without work I find myself thinking about it more than when ttc Sophia. ho hum


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## cleckner04

:hugs::hugs:


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## Pippin

Shiv said:


> Well I'm out for this month! Started spotting just now (just like the past 2 months) so I expect AF to show up in full force pretty soon.
> 
> Bit down to be honest - I don't how people who have been ttc for a long time manage to pick themselves up every month. I think I would be ok if I didn't get so consumed by it, but without work I find myself thinking about it more than when ttc Sophia. ho hum

:hugs: TTC is one of the worst and best things you can go through so I understand. With Sam it had me in tears because it's the not knowing if I could even have children. Thankfully I did which I think is why I relaxed the second and third time. Sorry you are out. x


----------



## spidey

ah Shiv, I'm sorry :hugs: 

I try not to get too hung up in TTC, but to be honest it does disappoint me every time AF comes. And I can truly see how some girls can get so upset hearing about other people's pregnancies, etc. I always remind myself that I'm soooo lucky to have a healthy happy Kira, so if she's the only one that I'm meant to have I am 100% okay with that :thumbup:


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## Shiv

I never feel bad about other people's pregnancies as like you I am so happy and lucky to have Sophia. I think part of the problem (and you might be able to relate Spidey) is that I am so happy having Sophia that i often wonder whether having another is a great idea. I am really only doing it so that Sophia will have a sibling to grow up with. If it were not for that I think I would just stick with having one. SO for me getting preggers quickly will take away that doubt (iykwim)!


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## spidey

Shiv- you put so nicely into words exactly how I feel!


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## Shiv

Well glad it isn't just me!


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## spidey

Shiv, has Af come full force today? 

I'm getting close to ovulation time if this cycle will be 30 days, so it's time to start taking baby making more seriously! Hope DH is ready to go tonight, LOL! I haven't noticed any cm, but I don't get much these days anyway so I can't go by that.


----------



## Shiv

Apart from one spot of blood yesterday about 4pm I haven't had anymore (and it is nearly 9pm the following day now):wacko: 

I do feel like I am going start AF at any moment though so not holding out much hope (apart from that small irrational bit of my brain telling me test!)

If AF isn't here when I wake up in the morning then I will have to test as I am going out tomorrow night and want to know if I can have a few drinks!

Have a fun night Spidey :winkwink:


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## Pippin

Shiv did you get an implantation bleed with Sophia? I still have my fingers crossed for you and hope you get to test in the morning :hug:

(actually rather selfishly :blush: I want you to test as I'm a poasa and I need other to do it for me now to feed my addiction to seeing lines :rofl: good luck hon)


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## Shiv

I would have been 13DPO yesterday so too late for implantation bleed, and no I didn't get one with Sophia.

It is just like 2 months ago when the same thing happened - my body likes to tease me!


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## spidey

Shiv- I would still test in the morning if AF isn't here just incase. I kind of remember you saying you had ewcm several days after you thought you ovulated so there's a small chance your cycle might be shifted a bit.


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## Shiv

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## Shiv

eek! Just between us please, the hard core few who still view this thread! Will go a bit more public if 8 week scan is all ok!


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## spidey

OMG!! IS that what I think it is!!!?????!!!???

Shiv!!!!!
:happydance::happydance:

eeek! I must calm down and not blab my mouth to anyone!!!


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## Shiv

Just goes to show you really aren't out until the Witch arrives in full!

Hahahahaha it is a bit of a challenge not mentioning it on the facebook group! I will probbaly blab before the week is out!

Now I just need a convincing lie for why I am not drinking tonight! I used antibioics excuse with Sophia and everyone saw straight through it!

Hope you join me ASAP Spidey!


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## spidey

I am still smiling here! I am so glad you tested!! How do you feel- any symptoms? Can you believe that you're pregnant?! 

hmmm.. you could say that your new years resolution is to not drink.. haha, that probably won't work. Or perhaps say that you just got over a stomach flu and your tummy can't handle any alcohol. You need to tell us what excuse you use :haha:

I would love to get pregnant this month so I can join you! DH is always working late on the weekends so we never have baby making time. He'll need to come home and get right to business now, LOL!


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## Shiv

I can't quite believe it! No real symptoms. My nipples have been sensitive since ovulation (remember i said they were sensitive a couple of weeks ago), not sore, I just notice if i brush them on something!

You could set your alarm for a bit of morning nooky :winkwink:


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## cleckner04

SHIV OMG!!!!! :dance::dance: Congrats hun!!! You are so lucky! No more TTC stress. :D:D


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## spidey

sore nipples is a good sign!!! I get sore nipples around ovulation too.

LOL about morning nookie. The mornings aren't really an option since Kira keeps tabs on where I'm at starting at 4am. I swear she must peek her eyes open every 5 minutes to make sure I'm still in bed. I'm going to try and stay up late tonight to catch DH when he gets home, LOL!


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## Pippin

:happydance::flower::thumbup::haha::baby:EEEEEEEEEEKKKKKKKK Shiv I'm am sooo happy for you what a wonderful Saturday surprise. OH MY GOD I'm just too excited we are preggers again together. Lovely lines on that test as well. Oh I'm jumping for joy all over the shop EEEEKKKKKKKK

Yay :happydance::dance::yipee::headspin::friends::wohoo::finger::loopy::rain::change::bunny::D:holly:


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## Pippin

Shiv said:


> I can't quite believe it! No real symptoms. My nipples have been sensitive since ovulation (remember i said they were sensitive a couple of weeks ago), not sore, I just notice if i brush them on something!
> 
> You could set your alarm for a bit of morning nooky :winkwink:

Mine haven't been sore really this time, not compared to the first time, I think it's because we've already breastfed and you're still going with it. So don't read too much into. OMG I am still grinning from ear to ear for you. Fantastic news.


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## Shiv

Thanks girls :flower:
So i did a Digi today and it said 2-3 weeks pregnant so that is good! I am 4 weeks and 3 days according to LMP!

Pip - did the wait for your early scan and dating scango any quicker this time? It seems like ageeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeees away!


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## Pippin

This pregnancy is flying by. I think it's because I'm so busy and with Sam you don't have much time to think about it. You are so good not telling the others before 8 weeks, I got carried away and told family, friends and you lot :rofl: I needed to have people around me that knew as I was a bit scared of another mmc but all has gone well obviously. Just had a shopping spree at Mothercare, they have maternity clothes half price with another 20% off. I feel really good as I must of lost weight recently as normally they aren't just quite big enough. Fab though got some nursing tops for £5 and trousers for £8 and a cardy for the house for £10. Bargains.

Shiv I'm still so chuffed and grinning from ear to ear for you. I'm so excited we have another Lion cub. What's the due day, I'm guessing September without working it out? Only two months between us eeeek


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## Shiv

Well 1st October, but I imagine that could easily change by a day and be September. Plus Sophia was a week early so I guess this one could be too (all being well!) don't you just hate the first 12 weeks and having to say that after everything you say about beanie!

I am hoping that I won't have to buy too many more maternity clothes as I will be heavily pregnany over summer again and I had some lovely clothes last time - but we'll see how early i pop (all being well :haha:)

I am pretty sure I won't be able to hold out until 8 weeks before letting the facebook group know but I won't be telling anyone in real life before my first scan!


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## Pippin

Yes, first tri sucks, it's just so uncertain and full of worry and sickness but seriously I don't know where the last 10 weeks have gone. I'm actually quite scared how quickly it has gone. The first two weeks are always the slowest and now here I am thinking about my gender scan in three weeks. October birthdays are good for school years and he/she will be oldest in the year. I only told close friend and then everyone I meet now lol. I still can't believe I'm actually going to have two in 5 1/2 months :shock: I have some maternity clothes but I only bought a few and wore them to death so I think a few new pieces won't hurt. I'm more excited about the nursing tops as I find them hard to find. :)


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## spidey

Pippin- Maternity clothes always seem more expensive to begin with so thats great to get some at a bargain! It's hard to find them on sale too. :thumbup: I ended up buying non-maternity clothes in a larger size to fit over bump because I couldn't see paying so much for clothes I may only use a few months. 

Shiv- What excuse did you use to not drink? :haha: I would have trouble keeping my mouth shut too! So excited for you still!! :happydance:

When I was pregnant with Kira I had no clue about anything! The midwives that I see do not offer a 8 week scan or even a 12 week scan. The first scan I would get is the 20 week scan. I only had a 13 week scan with Kira because they couldn't find her HB. So if I get pregnant, I'll have to make up some lie to get a 12 week scan. They don't do nuchal fold measurements either- all they do is take your blood at 12 weeks. Perhaps if I pester them I can get an earlier sonogram :haha: I was so ignorant last time!


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## Pippin

We have to pay for early ones here Spidey. The 12 week one is by nhs though so that's free. I couldn't wait till 20 weeks that would drive me mad with waiting. Lots of my clothes fitted me all the way through but couldn't resist these ones today.


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## Shiv

wow I can't imagine having to wait until 20 weeks to see that everything was ok with baby - I'd go (even more) insane with worry!

Maybe I'll get loads of symptoms with this one (all being well :haha:) which i guess would be reassuring. With Sophia if I hadn't have seen a positive test I wouldn't have believed i was pregnant so the early scan was a relief. in fact i remember it was you Pip that suggested I go for one!


----------



## Pippin

Probably was Shiv, I'm a big fan as I think if you are relaxed then the baby will too. Don't wish loads of symptoms on yourself you might live to regret it. The all day nausea for 4 weeks really got to me. I had about a week off in all that time with the odd day. Least with Sam it came in waves, this time is was all the time and at worst watery mouth but couldn't be sick. Bah never want to do that again. I think two will be my limit. I love this bit onwards though. Will miss it again once it's over.

Anyone heard from JoeyJo? Didn't she get that faint line and then not come back to update us? I wonder if she is ok. JoeyJo if you read this hope you're ok! :hi:


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## cleckner04

Geez my maternity clothes got tons of use because I'm still wearing them!! :rofl::rofl: I refuse to buy a bigger size for my giant flap of a tummy so I stick with whats comfy for now. :haha: 


So theres only a small few of us left that need to get pregnant. Spidey, hurry up! :haha:


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## spidey

haha.. maybe I won't get pregnant till you do Cleckner! We did manage to have time to dtd last night :thumbup: And I saw a teeny bit of ewcm yesterday too, so perhaps I'm going to ovulate soon.

We're lucky to have really good health insurance thru DH's work, so we hardly pay anything out of pocket. I think Kira cost $5 total :haha: I'm going to try hard to convince them for a 12 week scan this time because there is no way I can wait till 20 weeks. Last time I was perfectly happy to wait till 20 weeks :wacko:

Shiv- I'm with Pippin- don't wish for symptoms! YUCK! I know what you mean by the watery puke mouth. Oh, I am sooo not looking forward to that part!


----------



## Pippin

I'm keeping everything crossed for you Spidey so you keep everything open ok :haha: It'll be lovely if you can both be at the same time.

Shiv has it sunk in yet?


----------



## Shiv

Not really sunk in at all yet! It dawned on me a bit when I couldn't eat half the menu in a restuarant just now!

Oh and I used the " I need to be sober in case Sophia wakes up in the night" ecuse, pretty sure no-one bought it, but I only had to lie outright to one person who asked if I was pregnant


----------



## spidey

haha.. thats actually a good excuse Shiv. I'll have to remember that one :thumbup:


----------



## Pippin

I always took the car and said the tubes were down and I live to far away for other options so had to drive instead. Then I said I darn't drink even one as it was Christmas season. They all bought it. I like the excuse you used as well. 

I found the not being able to eat a load of things a shock as well at first but I have to admit I'm not so strict this time. I stay away from pate and raw meat but I've had smoked Salmon and some blue cheese. I'm not going to lose sleep over it, it was all I fancied at the time so sod it :blush: My Mum just ate brie and peaches with me and I'm fine..... sort of :rofl:


----------



## Pippin

Anymore poas Shiv? I was at it every day :blush:


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## Shiv

hahahaha no not yet! I have one more digi which I plan on using once it should have turned to 3+, so at the weekend. So you will have to wait until then!

I can't be more relaxed about food, my husband is a pregnancy food nazi! He watches me like a hawk!


----------



## spidey

ooo! You have a ticker Shiv!!! 

When I was pregnant I stopped eating salads out, since salads are handled so much and it's very possible the workers have dripped raw meat juices on them. DH is a health inspector so he tells me about all the nasty things he sees in the kitchens of restaurants. Infact, since he started working as a health inspector we pretty much stopped eating out, LOL.


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## Shiv

thanks for that Spidey, that's salad off of the list now too :dohh::winkwink:


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## Boothh

EEEEK shiv only just seen this!! :happydance:


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## Boothh

afm well i think i am round about OV, had lots of ewcm, and lots of sex, getting pregnant isnt the problem for me though :dohh: im taking baby aspirin so lets see what happens! x


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## Shiv

fx'ed that baby aspirin makes this one a sticky one Boothh!


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## spidey

the aspirin might be all you need Boothh! Fingers and toes crossed for you!


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## cleckner04

I've seen tons of girls on here taking baby aspirin and it really works for them! I hope it's just what you need Boothh. :hugs::hugs: 

Shiv- A ticker!!! :dance: Did you announce in the announcement section yet? Off to look. :winkwink:


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## Pippin

Eeeek Shiv a shiny new ticker yay. You'l have to let the lion club know now :haha:

Cleck I never announced this one as I was scared too just in case I MC again, bit late now isn't it I guess. :dohh:

And thanks Spidey :dohh: :haha: that's put me right off salads now and eating out. Maybe I'll carry on not going out like the last two years of my life :rofl:

Boothh good idea about the asprin can't hurt they recommended everyone should take a low dose everyday for your heart anyway. My husband does.


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## Shiv

Cleck - i haven't announced it yet, I didn't announce with Sophia either. I don't really feel I "know" many girls on here so would feel a bit weird putting an announcement out!

Pip - you do make me laugh! Knowing is a privelege only for those still interested enough to come on here I'm afraid :haha:


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## Pippin

Hey Shiv I understand completely. I don't post much on the other boards now still have a look most days but it's lots of first time Mums and I don't have the same worries this time round. After the fifth time of hearing about the same worry I kinda switch off so don't know many names this time round. I only post regularly in my group I've put together of people that went through the miscarriage the same time as I did and got pregnant straight away so we know each other well now (see signature). I chat mostly in there now and as you know I don't feel comfortable in Lion Cubs now so I feel safe in my little home here. I like the fact we have a little secret to keep :haha: 

Now we need Booth and Spidey to get there and Cleckner when DH gets back and we'll be sorted. :thumbup: Swim :spermy: swim

Cleckner well done on the weight loss honey just seen your ticker :thumbup:


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## spidey

oh wow Cleckner! Thats awesome weight loss! I just noticed your ticker too :thumbup: I might have to steal your BF milestone blinkie and update my signature line.

Soon enough and we will ALL be pregnant again. eek!!


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## cleckner04

Yeah I've lost even more than the ticker says but "official" weigh ins aren't until Friday so I always update it every friday!! :D Thanks girls! It's been really hard work and some weeks I've gained so it always gets me down but I've kept working at it. My goal is to at least get back to pre-Emma weight before DH gets back. So only 28 more pounds to go(26 by this mornings weigh in). And after that I'll keep at it while we TTC and hopefully lose some more! :dance:

Spidey- You can take as many blinkies as you need! That's what I made the photobucket page for. :D I actually love going around the forum and seeing 'my' blinkies in everyone's siggies.


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## Shiv

So I've been really crampy today and it scares me!


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## Pippin

Shiv said:


> So I've been really crampy today and it scares me!

Hon I had awful ones this time and yes they are scary. I think they lasted until about 6 weeks when the sickness came in. Must be the bean settling in.


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## cleckner04

As long as they are slight cramps you'll be fine hun. If they get to the point of being excruciating, than go to the hospital just in case. :hugs: Cramps are normal but not horrible ones IYKWIM.


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## spidey

I remember being really crampy with Kira too. I kept running to the bathroom thinking AF was coming (since I had no clue I was pregnant till 6 weeks!).


----------



## Shiv

gosh I had a scare this morning, I was having a shower and looked down to see bits of red on the shower floor, I rushed out of the shower to wipe expecting to see blood...........only to realise that I had been wearing red socks the previous day and it was fluff from inbetween toes! No more red socks for me :haha:


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## spidey

haha Shiv- that would have scared me too. I always think sock fuzz in the bath is bugs, LOL.

Soooo.. how are you feeling today!??


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## Shiv

tired! Not sure whether it is pregnancy related or not! oh and hungry! Again not sure if it is pregnancy related or just greed!

Have you managed to get much lovin' in with DH at work til late?


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## Pippin

:haha: Shiv that's funny but scary. Sam gets them all the time and I see things floating in the bath and think :saywhat: then I remember what it is :rofl: They look like little spiders floating around. Yay for the symptoms. Been to see a doctor yet?

Spidey get :sex: girl, you're next :haha:

Sam's supposed to be ill so I've taken the day off to look after him. He's made a remarkable recovery though :wacko: the little monkey so just setting down to watch toy story 3.


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## spidey

haha.. so recently we've dtd on cd 12, cd 16 and cd 18. Today is cd 20, so perhaps more in store for tonight :haha: Normally I get sensitive nipples around ovulation and I haven't have them yet, so I think I haven't ovulated yet. It might be another one of those 46 day cycles. I did notice a teeny tiny bit of ewcm around cd16 and some today too. :shrug: I would LOVE to be due right around the same time as Shiv, LOL, but I won't be too sad if this month doesn't work out either. My brother is visiting at the end of February :happydance: and I haven't seen him since last July! The ms would be kicking into high gear at the end of February and I wouldn't be able to drink which is a huge part of the fun when my brother visits! We'll see what happens though! I would like to get pregnant and be done with AF for another 2 years though :haha:

Shiv- hunger and tired sound like pregnancy symptoms to me :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

So I completely forgot to ask about this. But do you girls still get clots when you have your periods? My last period I suddenly got the most horrible cramps one day. I was literally laying on the floor balled up in a ball crying because it hurt so bad. A little later I went to the bathroom and two huge clots came out. After that the cramps disappeared. :wacko: Is this normal or is something wrong with me? My cycles are still all over the place too. It's starting to really get me down. I'm considering buying a clearblue fertility monitor so I know a little more about my cycles.


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## spidey

Before Kira I would get large clots and have very bad cramps. From the second I noticed AF, I needed to take a full dose of IBprofin every 4 hours to survive the day. If I didn't take pain meds I would usually curl into a ball and rock back and forth since thats the only way I could manage the pain until the medication kicked in. It was sooo awful. Childbirth was nothing compared to my periods before Kira :haha: 

But now... AF is so wonderful!!! No clots and no cramps! 

Cleck- is this the first clot you've had post-baby? Did you get cramps before you had Emma?


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## cleckner04

No definitely not the first clot but this is the first time it had horrible cramps along with it. And these clots were quite large. The size of a quarter or bigger. :wacko: I did the wrong thing and googled and it spoke about endometriosis. And now I'm all freaked out. :blush: My periods before Emma were crampy but never clots like this. My cramps happen less often since Emma, but this particular period was basically like labor pains.


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## Pippin

Never had clots like that hon, some tiny ones but cramps when I was younger could get pretty bad and could make me cry. My boyfriend used to lay on my tummy which helped. I've always had very dark blood like the same colour as clots, not much bright red to be honest. Sorry is that TMI??? Anyway now they are quite light and only about 4 days long with half a day of cramps at the start. They've changed though I used to spot too before Sam but that stopped after I had him. If you are worried or happens again next month see your doctor. Also just a thought as you've lost quite a bit of weight that sometimes kick starts fertility too. They say losing as little as 5% body weight can increase fertility. Maybe thats what's happening and you are getting super ready for DH coming back :winkwink: :thumbup: xxx


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## cleckner04

Ohh I hope you're right! Thanks for that. :hugs: 

I really think I'm gonna buy OPKs or a fertility monitor and start figuring my cycles out before DH get's back. I'm ready to get this party started. :haha: I still have a little under 5 months before he's back so hopefully I can lose even more weight in that time and maybe even get myself out of the 'obese' category..:shy:


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## spidey

Cleck- I bet it was some freak clots that your body wanted to get out and it won't happen again. If you had endometriosis I bet you would know because there's a lot of other bad symptoms that go along with it. Stay away from google!!! :haha:


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## spidey

I have some possibly exciting news! I thought AF was arriving this morning since I had some blood when I wiped. But a few hours later still no AF. I also checked my calendar to see that it's only cd22, so I wonder if this could be implantation bleeding!?? I never ever get spotting, so this is new for me. Yesterday and today I haven't been feeling the greatest. I've been tired and really hungry- which are 2 symptoms that I normally get right before AF arrives. Hmmmmm....


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## Shiv

ooooooooooooooooooh that is exciting. So at CD 22, you could be about 7DPO is that right? That is spot on for implantation bleeding!!! eek, gosh it's gonna be a "fun" week for you waiting to test! I SO hope you are pregnant! 
eek!


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## Shiv

oh and Cleck, I hope the nasty clotting is to with your cycles getting back to normal! If you get it agian next month then go and see the doctor just to make sure!


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## cleckner04

Spidey- That's so exciting!!! I bet this is your month. :dance: Are you seriously going to make us wait a week after your AF is due to test? :lol: 


Well I've lost even more weight!! :dance: Only 24.4 pounds to go before pre-Emma weight. After that I want to lose 20 more which would get me to my pre-miscarriage weight. :blush: I would than be 16 lbs overweight still and I'll keep trying to lose more but my main goal is to get to pre-miscarriage weight before getting pregnant again. I'm okay with being in the 'overweight' category. I just don't like being 'obese'.


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## Pippin

*Spidey* eeeeekkkkkk!!! HOW EXCITING!!!!!!! I so hope this is it and please don't make us wait to test :haha:

*Cleck* I'm very jealous of your weight lose that super fab honey. You'll have to take stage picture so we can see you shrink!

*Shiv* how are you feeling!?

AS FOR ME I'VE DONE MY BACK IN LOOKING AT SKETCHBOOKS ON.... Oh crap caps lock on sorry....... The floor hurts like he'll and can't do anything, not even put Sam to bed :(


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## cleckner04

Thanks hun! I have been taking a picture each 10 pounds I lose. So I only have 2 photos so far. My start photo and the first 10 lost photo. I gotta lose 4.4 more before I can take another! EEK!! They aren't pretty though. :haha: I still look a few months pregnant. :shy:

Oh no! I hope your back feels better soon. :( I would suggest taking a nice hot bath to relax your muscles but probably not the best advice for a pregnant woman. :lol: I can't believe you are 15 weeks pregnant already!! Feels like you just told us yesterday.


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## Shiv

Wow Cleck, good job on that weight loss! You can upload your -10lbs pictures and I'll upload my +10lbs photos!

Pip - take it easy you hear!

Spidey - you can't make us wait weeks to test!

As for me, still tired and hungry! About 2pm each afternoon I could seriously just fall asleep but then i get a second wind and come bed time I can't sleep at all!


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## spidey

still no AF here! I have a teeny amount of pink blood when I wipe still. Since I've never spotted in my entire life, I'm thinking this must be implantation. To be nice :haha:, I'll test when AF is due (around cd 30) so that should be next Friday or Saturday. It's still soooo early so I'm not getting my hopes up and I'm not planning to tell DH since he's more excited about having a baby than me. 

Cleckner- you're doing really good on weight loss! :thumbup: How are you losing the weight?? I think if you get to your target weight and you look and feel good, ignore the "overweight" label. I know many women who look better as "overweight" than average weight. It all depends on your body type.

Pippin- I hope your back feels better soon- having a stiff back or neck is awful. Get your DH to give you some good back massages!

Shiv- were you tired and hungry during your last pregnancy??


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## cleckner04

I am doing an hour of cardio on the elliptical and recumbent bike. Usually only 20 minutes on the ellipitcal since it kicks my ass and 40 on the recumbent bike. Than I go for a walk every evening for at least 30 minutes! And that's it. I haven't changed how I eat at all. I added in breakfast but not a true breakfast, I just have a few bites of oatmeal every morning. :haha: I figure when I start getting down more in weight and hit blocks where I can't seem to budge the weight, than that's when I'll start cutting back a bit with the food. But as of now, I still snack at least 2 times a day and eat 3 meals a day. :thumbup:


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## Shiv

That's really great the amount of exercise you are doing Cleck, do you feel better for it? I am hoping to start swimming a couple of times a week now that i am pregnant.

Spidey, i read that implantation bleeding can last 2-3 days (I am really excited for you!) 

All I remember of symptoms early on in my last pregnancy was losing my appetite!


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## Pippin

Spidey hon sounds fab :thumbup: you know I'll be bugging you to test in three days time though :haha: As for implantation my mum had a day of period like bleeding with both me and my brother. She said it was quite heavy too then just stopped. So super excited now. 

Shiv I was so tired this time, I didn't really get it with Sam but this one was a killer. Better bow but I feel more dizzy and spacey than tired. I'm getting used to it now but it was a bit odd when it first happened. 

Cleck I can't wait to see the pictures hon, and what you doing but just more exercise is the perfect way to diet and lose weight. You'll gain muscle too so really your losing more fat than the scales say. :thumbup: 

I can't believe I'm 15 weeks this is going so quickly!! Gender scan two weeks tomorrow! 

Can I just say it's so much easier to keep up with conversations when there is only a few of us :dohh: me likes! :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

Shiv- Oh yeah I definitely feel better. When I first started I could barely do that elliptical. I could manage about 2 minutes before my lungs felt like they were gonna give out. :rofl: Now I'm on there for 20! I don't breathe hard when coming up the stairs anymore. I just all around feel better. I plan on keeping it up all throughout my next pregnancy because I really don't want to gain 45 lbs again!! 

Pippin- That was why I decided not to cut out any foods. I think the word diet for some women means starving themselves to lose weight. And I've done that before by doing slim fast shakes. But it all gained right back once I stopped. So I wanted to do something this time that is more gradual and much healthier. It helps that I'm breastfeeding so I have to be careful not to lose my milk supply. :D I can't wait to find out what you are having!! :dance: Hopefully the next 2 weeks fly by. :thumbup:


----------



## spidey

Cleckner- thats really smart to do workouts to lose weight and get healthy :thumbup: At my work some of the researchers study exercise and there is tons of evidence that it also helps with depression and anxiety in addition to all the other health benefits. So all around its great! Speaking of exercise- I need the weather to warm up a bit so I can start going on walks again! Winter always feels so long!

I wasn't going to tell DH about the bleeding, but I did and now he thinks I'm pregnant :dohh: He's going to be disappointed now if/when AF comes. He's even asking when my due date is, LOL. 

Pippin- it really doesn't feel like 15 weeks to me too. It seems like only weeks ago you got your bfp!


----------



## cleckner04

Part of me hopes I am one of those girls like 'i didnt know I was pregnant' and end up being like 20 weeks pregnant without knowing. :rofl::rofl: How great would that be to skip all the worry of first tri!


----------



## spidey

Cleck- that's my fantasy too :haha: I don't want to get to the point where I'm having cramps and deliver the baby on the toilet, LOL.. but not knowing till 20 weeks would be great!!


----------



## Pippin

Update please spidey! :hugs: 

Hope everyone else is good :thumbup:


----------



## spidey

nothing new here. A teeny tiny bit of spotting yesterday and nothing yet today. I feel completely normal! But I had a dream last night that I had a baby boy who was huge- larger than Kira is right now :haha:

How's everyone else doing!?


----------



## Aunty E

Hi! Been MIA, so thought I'd stop by and catch up :)


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## Shiv

Hi Aunty E - not long to go now for you! Are you excited?


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## spidey

AE- Wow, not much longer until you see baby! Was Imogen early or late according to her due date? Have you bought any boy things yet?


----------



## spidey

Still no AF, but I'm having just a tiny bit of spotting still. Yesterday evening I started having lots of toilet trips so I must have a tummy bug. Luckily it's only the lower end and overnight it stopped only to resume this morning! Yuck! I know its a tummy bug, but the paranoid part of me is trying to blame it on implantation, LOL. It might be a little disappointed this month when I get my BFN because in my mind I'm acting like I'm pregnant :haha:


----------



## Shiv

I've read about plenty of people who get the runs before their BFP. I really hope this is it for you, although I know exactly how you feel about not wanting to be dissapointed :hugs:


----------



## spidey

The only reason that I'm even considering this as a possible pregnancy symptom is that I had no toilet trips overnight. I've had tummy bugs in the past and they never take a break overnight! This is going to be the longest week of my life... and if I AM pregnant, it's going to be the longest 2-3 months of my life until I can get myself a scan!!! 

So Shiv, how are you feeling so far today??


----------



## Shiv

mainly just hungry and tired again!!! I have already put on 3lbs (so much for not putting on as much weight this time round :haha:) although I don't think I have been eating that much more, lots more healthy stuff though.

I went ahead and booked myself an early scan for 18th Feb, I will be 8 weeks by then (all being well). It seems SOOOOOOooo long away!

I have been getting that pain when I cough and sneeze in bed, you know the one where it is ok if you are slightly curled up, but if you are lying flat out then it hurts! I don't remember getting it this early last time!

So spidey when is AF due?


----------



## spidey

Shiv- It might be 3 pounds of extra fluid and not fat, LOL! 8 weeks does feel so far away! It's good to have a early peek though! I can't wait!!!! :happydance: Now that you mention that pain when you cough... I am sort of remembering it now. Its funny how much I forget. Is it from your uterus stretching?

This time I really have to watch my weight gain since I think I had undiagnosed GD last time. I gained over 50 pounds but since I was skinny pre-pregnancy they didn't care, but Kira ended up being 10 pounds! It's something to chat about with the midwives when I see them one day.

If it is a perfect 28 day cycle AF would be due Thursday. Besides the freak long cycle last month, my average has been 30-32 days, so on the weekend AF might be here. I haven't had sore nipples this month which has been happening around ovulation, so I'm not certain what's going on. It's possible I haven't even ovulated yet and will have another freaky long cycle. But I do have spotting... sooooo... who knows!??? I really cannot get my hopes up!


----------



## Pippin

Ohh lots I can add to here. 

Right firstly Spidey toilet stops..... you know people say you get constipated when they are pregnant well I get the runs... nice! I haven't once had a problem going to the loo and it started really early so probably getting your hopes up even more but I'd say it's looking hopefully. It's good your trying to keep an even head though as I know how easy it is to get carried away and then the fall is even harder :hugs: when AF comes. Mind you, you could test now and then you'll be really in the know :haha:

Shiv those pains are round ligament pains and I got them about 5 weeks too. id loads of research and apparently according to many women and sites it's perfectly normal for second time mums to get it early. It really hurt on occasion and has done a couple of times since. At it's worst it was like a burning feeling too. Horrid but thankfully only lasted a few hours.

As for weight I feel really proud of myself, I've put on three pounds since being pregnant and I'm chuffed with that. Mind you I haven't exactly stopped eating, in fact I'm eating tons but I think where I'm saving cals is because I've stopped drinking (obviously). I know it's going to pile on soon but seeing as I put on about 10 last time by this point I feel good and I'm trying to chose the healthy options now I'm over the MS to hopefully stall it. I still haven't lost the weight from when I was on Maternity leave.

Yay for the scan date too Shiv. When are you actually going to book it? So excited for you :happydance:


----------



## spidey

haha Pippin. Okay, I give in! This is the plan... I will use my one and only pregnancy test this evening (or perhaps RIGHT NOW, LOL). Then I will order some more from online since I found a great price with free shipping at Amazon. And since I'm an Amazon prime member they will arrive in 2 days! So then I can test again this weekend. Atleast then I can stop thinking about it since this spotting is driving me nuts!


----------



## Shiv

Ah Spidey - you caved to Pippin's pressure! Have you peed yet?


----------



## Pippin

spidey said:


> haha Pippin. Okay, I give in! This is the plan... I will use my one and only pregnancy test this evening (or perhaps RIGHT NOW, LOL). Then I will order some more from online since I found a great price with free shipping at Amazon. And since I'm an Amazon prime member they will arrive in 2 days! So then I can test again this weekend. Atleast then I can stop thinking about it since this spotting is driving me nuts!

Oh yes, yes, yes, yes!!!! Woohoo :wohoo: I love it when people listen to me (you'd think that would happen a lot being a teacher but you'd be surprised :haha:) I'm going to stay on line till we get the result. I have everything crossed :thumbup:



Shiv said:


> Ah Spidey - you caved to Pippin's pressure! Have you peed yet?

You're as bad as me!

*edit*: Just looked on Amazon and OH MY GOODNESS!!! Why didn't I look there before they are even cheaper than ebay!!!! Jeez. Clear blue conception indicator digi's 2 pack are only £7.50, normally at least twice that :saywhat:


----------



## cleckner04

Stalking this page now...:D


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## cleckner04

TEST! TEST! TEST! :muaha:


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## spidey

hahaha... you girls are such a BAD influence!

It was a BFN! And I even spilled pee on my arm and shirt so I had to change my clothes too :haha:

And you all will be happy to hear that 6 pregnancy tests will be arriving to my house on Wednesday! So no more excuses that I can't get to the store. It's amazing how much $ I just saved!

I can test again later in the week, and perhaps there will be a line this time


----------



## Shiv

ah I wouldn't worry too much about the BFN spidey - if it was impantation bleeding the other day then I would expect it to take another few days to show up! Sorry about your clothes though - out of interest how di dyou manage that?


----------



## Pippin

Ahhh bottoms :dohh: but I guess it could still be way to early. Keep positive though hon and definitely keep bding. At least you won't be guessing for the next few days and can relax a little until we force you to do it again on Wednesday when the tests arrive :rofl:. I'm one of these people that need to know everything now so I tested from 10 dpo onwards. I found it softened the AF blow if you catch my drift.

Sorry it's not the early result we all hoped for but my bfp was a little later this time at 11/12dpo so it's probably too early. Well done on getting the cheap tests though :thumbup:


----------



## spidey

So.. my pee stream is very chaotic so it's hard to aim at a stick :rofl: so I pee into a cup and then dip the stick. I spilled the pee cup on myself because Kira was hugging onto my legs as I sat on the toilet since she decided to poo as I tested :haha: 

I'm not surprised it's a BFN... and if it turns out that this isn't my month that's okay too. 

Pippin- I am really starting to see your logic re: testing early! I actually feel relieved that I know the answer as of today. One less thing to think about :thumbup:


----------



## cleckner04

Pip- I'm the same. I like testing early to get the anticipation out of the way. Sitting around wondering just does my head in.

Spidey- So sorry it was BFN! But you are still super early so fingers x'ed you get some lines in a week! My pee is pretty unpredictable too. I can never take tests mid stream. I always have to use a cup. :haha:


----------



## Pippin

I'm not good at the whole guessing and waiting thing. I have to know everything now otherwise I feel anxious. It's like finding out the gender with this one. I'm just so anxious to know and when I start thinking about it, it gets all a bit much, I just NEED to know :rofl: I'm not a patient person as you can probably guess. :dohh:


----------



## Pippin

cleckner04 said:


> Pip- I'm the same. I like testing early to get the anticipation out of the way. Sitting around wondering just does my head in.

Glad your the same, I also get an enormous amount of pleasure looking at the test for hours after seeing if that line will come up. I'm a true POASaholic! I must have done 30 odd tests with each pregnancy (cheap internet mostly at 10p a go) just so I could see the lines get stronger. I love that feeling of a squinty hinty line which I then get massively excited about. If it just goes straight positive I think I'd feel cheated of that guessing game.

Goodness I sound like a right weirdo now don't I!!! I think I'll stop. :dohh: :rofl:


----------



## Shiv

I am the complete opposite of you guys. i am a control freak and that is why TTC gets to me so much as I can't really control the outcome. SO for me not testing is my way of exerting control on the situation! I also throw tests away after the 3 minute time limit and don't look at them again! I figure if I am preggers then it will show up visibly in the time limit (as I test close to AF due date) - again it's a control thing!

my pee goes everywhere, it is fairly hit and miss as to whether much goes on the stick at all. Although do you remember having to pee in the little pots when you were heavily pregnant and couldn't see down there. There were quite a few times when I went back into the midwife's room with just a dribble in the pot cos I missed!:dohh:


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## spidey

haha.. I'm glad I'm not the only one with unpredictable pee. Shiv- I remember those pee tests we had to do. For my midwife, I had to first wipe myself with these special wipes and THEN pee into the cup. When heavily pregnant it was hard enough to hold my pee, let alone sit down on a toilet, open 2 little wipe packets, wipe myself and then pee. :haha:

Since I hate the first 12 weeks of pregnancy, I would rather not find out I'm pregnant at 3 or 4 weeks, LOL. Thats a big motivator for why I like to test late.


----------



## Aunty E

Hi! Not long now, mostly I feel tired, grumpy, put upon, puffy, itchy and cross. I'd really like to just skip to the baby part now please ;) I have bought some cute boy stuff, and I'm really looking forward to moving Mog's stuff into her new room BUT I haven't finished decorating yet, so a week or so until that happens. I have bought a bedside crib for this one, but it's too big to have in our room until we need it, so it's in the spare room with all the bedding in it, and when I think I'm in labour, I'll move it into our room and attach it. We've been sorting out who has Imogen when we go to hospital, and checking that my birth partner from last time is still happy to come with us! 

Unfortunately the fly in this ointment is my work situation. I don't have someone confirmed to cover my maternity leave, and two members of my team are probably leaving next month, and I'm extremely worried about what will happen while I'm away. The ideal thing for me would be to have someone turn up in the next week or so, then I could do a really good week long handover, and then take some leave and go early. I'm not supposed to go until the end of Feb, but honestly, I really need some time to get things sorted! Thankfully Mog and OH are away until Sunday, so I can get decorating done this week in the evenings, instead of trying to cram a couple of hours in after Imogen has gone to bed. I'm picking up her wardrobe on Thursday and I can order a chest of drawers to be delivered once I've painted the floor (and OH gets paid). There's just so much to do, and OH is absolutely no help at all really. He was going away for a week with the baby and he rocks up at home at eleven pm last night, having been to the pub, and hadn't even THOUGHT about packing all the stuff she needs for a week. IDIOT.


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## Aunty E

Here are bump pics - this is why I need more room in the bed, but does OH let me have my half? NO. He just crowds me on my side so I end up hanging off the bed and making my carpal tunnel worse.

https://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f225/AuntyE/f0306c62.jpg

https://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f225/AuntyE/70b635d4.jpg

Sorry for the moan, didn't sleep well last night and am grumpy :( I am quite a bit more out front with this one, and it's NOT comfortable.


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## Shiv

AE - sounds like you are very busy - make sure you don't push yourself too hard.

well ladies I need a hug. i founf out this afternoon that David is being made redundant (that is both of us within 2 years). It has been all over the news Pfizer is shutting down in Sandwich. David will lose his job by August this year - great timing! I am really upset as everyone I know here is going to lose their jobs and there just aren't any other jobs out there. I am pretty scared about how we are going to cope especially with a new baby on the way so I can't really go out and get a job myself. And to mkae matters worse David is away on a course so he isn't back until wednesday night so I have no one to give me a hug!


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## Pippin

Oh Shiv I just heard that on the radio and saw your fb status. So sorry, what a complete arse, things tend to work themselves out and have faith it will (hard I know I'd be on floods). Big hugs coming your way. They mention on the radio 'most' would go any chance at all he could stay or have they said definitely he has to go? What shitty timing too. Could a move be on maybe come and work for one of the big firms up in London? When does he get home? xxxxxx

:hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends::hugs: :hug: :friends:


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## spidey

AE- You look great! I bet you turn a lot of heads with that bump! I hope everything gets sorted out with your work so you don't have to worry about things once you go on maternity leave. :hugs:

Shiv- that really sucks! Such horrible timing. :hugs: Fingers crossed that David can find something else before August. If not- do you have any sort of unemployment program there that could help out so he can have more time to find something else? Try not to stress about it because worrying isn't good for you or the baby. I always like to think that things will sort themselves out in the end and everything will be okay :hugs: Being nosey- but what sort of work does he do at Pfizer? Did you work at Pfizer too or did you lose your job from somewhere else?


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## Shiv

Pippin - everyone WILL go, the Pfizer PR machine is trying to make it sound better by saying some jobs will be moved to other Pfizer locations and the possibility of a science park etc etc but that is what they said when they closed down manufacturing there last year (thus why I got made redundant) and nothing like that happened.

Spidey - we both started off in Quality Control labs doing analytical testing, then I moved into production support and finally Learning and Devlopment (bit of a change) before being made redundant.
David moved over to research when manufacturing got closed (escaping redundancy) and now works as a study director for drug safety (basically directing animal testing studies - don't hate him someone has to do it!) 

He gets back tomorrow night, and boy do I feel lonely without him, mainly I would love a drink! When we found out that manufacturing was closing we all went to the pub and got hammered, it was very therapeutic and i know that is what a lot of my friends are doing now. That is what makes it even sadder, EVERYONE I know here will be affected which means that i will basically lose all my friends as well as we will all have to move away :cry:

I don't think the hormones are helping!

Spidey how do you feel today?


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## Pippin

Awww love that sucks really it does I'm so sorry. I should have guessed they'd try to make it less bad than what it is. Contrary to popular belief I know we need to test drugs so I could never hold it against anyone that works in that line of work. I hope he can find something, maybe it might be a bit of career change. Understand the need for a glass of wine and to get hammered I wish I could come and join you too. Glad he's home tomorrow :hug:


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## spidey

Shiv- here are some more hugs for you :hugs::hugs:

Thats awful that everyone must lose their jobs. Thats going to be devastating to the area since pfizer employs so many educated people... it's not good for a city or town to lose that. I work in research too so I'm not one to judge people who direct animal studies, LOL. I hope it all works out and all of your friends don't have to move away :cry: I would feel the same way as you if I found out they were shutting down my work... so I don't think it's all hormones :hugs:


Another day of spotting for me and my runs have stopped thank goodness! No other symptoms to speak of!


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## cleckner04

Oh shiv- I'm just now seeing this. :(:hugs::hugs::hugs: It will all work out. I just know it will. :hugs:


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## Shiv

so is today the day you test again Spidey?


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## spidey

hahahaha... well... I suppose it could be another testing day because those 6 tests should be coming in the mail today. I'll see how I feel later in the day. The delivery man doesn't usually come till 3pm and it's only 8:30am now!


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## Aunty E

Oh Shiv, that's awful :( I have friends who run animal studies (looking for cures for Parkinsons, which my dad has, so I'm all for it) and I would never judge your OH! Are some of the big pharmaceuticals not recruiting, like GSK? You might have to move to Harlow, but it's not too far away ;) It's rotten, sucky timing.

Mat leave cover is now looking hopeful, might have someone confirmed in the next day or so.


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## Pippin

Aunty E great news it looks like you have your post covered. I know how you feel about leaving it in capable hands I'm exactly the same especially this time as last time the person that took over my management role really messed things up I've been fixing it all since and it's a nightmare.

Spidey :test: I mean why not if they are cheap but might be worth waiting for tomorrow if your hearts not in it.

Shiv, sorry it's still crappy today but I hope you are looking forward to proper hugs from DH tonight. Bet you can't wait. How are you feeling? Any morning sickness kicking in just yet? Mine hit exactly on 6 weeks. That's so soon for you. Two weeks and you can get scanned :yipee: Have you booked it yet?

I'm so excited 10 days and we get to know the sex :wohoo: I'm starting to doubt my gut instinct of a girl though. Getting used to the idea of two little boys running around.


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## Shiv

no-one is recruiting AE - everyone is making cutbacks

I was so looking forward to my scan and announcing to close family afterwards, but now all anyone is going ot think is "crikey but he's being made redundant". What should be really good news is now going to make people (quite frankly including me!) worry even more.

We have friends who are ttc who work at Pfizer and my mum know's. When I told her about teh closure she said "gosh what if she is pregnant" , little did she know I am!

I keep crying, combination of hormones and stress I think, I am looking forward to David getting home, but I so want to be strong for him, as Iknow he will be so worried as the provider for the household. But I know I will cry as soon as I se him. Crying now just thinking baout seeing him. What a mess!

Spidey, are you still spotting today?

Pippin, haveyou had any dreams about the sex of your baby? ALthough I was sure I was having a boy I kept dreaming about having a girl (called Elisabeth!)

AE glad your maternity cover is looking more certain. What do you do for a job? I can't remember!


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## spidey

My tests haven't been delivered yet! No spotting today but the runs are back, although not as bad. My grandmother died Sunday so we've been doing funeral things yesterday and today. She's been sick for a long time and we weren't very close, so emotionally I'm not hurting... but I'm so tired from running around after Kira to prevent her from breaking all the valuables in the funeral home! I should be napping since she's napping! If it turns out I'm pregnant, then I am nothing but bad luck! Last time very early in my pregnancy DH's Uncle died!

Shiv- I hope you start feeling better soon. All those hormones plus bad news is not a good combination :hugs:

Pippin- I can't wait for 10 days to go by!! I don't have a feeling yet on what you're having- not like my instincts are very good anyway, LOL. 

AE- what a relief that someone will be able to cover you while on maternity leave!


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## spidey

My pregnancy tests got delivered LATE! So the truck must have broken down because he usually comes right at nap time (2pm) but the package didn't come till 8pm!

So DH was home when the package came and he opened it up and laughed :haha:. I told him that I might test tomorrow and he said "NO, test tonight or I won't be able to sleep!" He would fit right in on here :rofl:

I tested and it was a BFN!!! So it could be too early I suppose. I spotted on cd 22 (Friday) and it lasted until Tuesday. I have no idea what part of my cycle I'm in since I don't get cm or obvious pms symptoms like I did pre-pregnancy. I haven't had sore nipples yet this cycle, which seem to occur around ovulation. So perhaps this is another long cycle month with some freak spotting early on. I told DH to stop getting his hopes up because he wanted me to get pregnant 8 months ago when we started trying. So every month is a big let down for him. 

sooo... maybe I will test again this weekend, LOL!


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## cleckner04

Aww that's a bummer spidey. :( I really hope you aren't out yet. :hugs:

AE- Your bump looks great hun! You have no stretchmarks! I'm pretty jealous. My stomach is still covered in dark purple stretchmarks and I'm not even pregnant anymore! :haha: Not long now for you!! :dance:


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## Pippin

spidey said:


> My pregnancy tests got delivered LATE! So the truck must have broken down because he usually comes right at nap time (2pm) but the package didn't come till 8pm!
> 
> So DH was home when the package came and he opened it up and laughed :haha:. I told him that I might test tomorrow and he said "NO, test tonight or I won't be able to sleep!" He would fit right in on here :rofl:
> 
> I tested and it was a BFN!!! So it could be too early I suppose. I spotted on cd 22 (Friday) and it lasted until Tuesday. I have no idea what part of my cycle I'm in since I don't get cm or obvious pms symptoms like I did pre-pregnancy. I haven't had sore nipples yet this cycle, which seem to occur around ovulation. So perhaps this is another long cycle month with some freak spotting early on. I told DH to stop getting his hopes up because he wanted me to get pregnant 8 months ago when we started trying. So every month is a big let down for him.
> 
> sooo... maybe I will test again this weekend, LOL!

Aww bum that's not good. Have you thought about opks or do you rather not go down that route, I know it's not for eveyone but it did help both times for me. Lots of love and happy thoughts. xxx


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## ashnbump

SHHHHHIIIIIIIVVVVVV!!!!!!!! 

OMG OMG OMG OMG :happydance: :happydance: I am so chuffed for u! Ice been lurking over here but not read for a while! Awww I'm so happy for u! I saw the puc of the positive 1st and its just how my 1st one looked! Nice and strong!

Sorry about David sweetie, my David has just had his hours cut, so I can imagine how you feel!

Hope everyone is great! And AE loving the bump! Can't wait to see pics when he's born!

Any luck on the bfp Spidey!!? Xxx


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## Shiv

So I went to the doctor today so he can refer me to the midwife and he told me my EDD is 31st September! Very reassuring when a doctor tells you a date that doesn't even exist :haha::haha:


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## cleckner04

Omg :rofl:


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## spidey

oooo! A September or October baby! Perfect months to have outdoor birthday parties!

Even though it sucks that I haven't gotten my bfp yet, I can now look forward to a morning sickness free visit with my brother at the end of February!!


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## Pippin

:haha: Shiv that's really funny. 1st of October it is then.

Spidey :hug: enjoy your weekend. Are you still :sex: just in case you are having a long cycle again?


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## spidey

Pippin- we had to take a break because of the runs I was having :haha: But I think we're back on for tonight!


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## Aunty E

I have stretchies by my navel piercing (well where it was before I took it out) and I have some down under my bump, but they're still really pale. What happened last time was that after the birth, they all popped up and turned purple, so I'm expecting that to happen again this time.

I'm a civil servant, so the world won't come to an end without someone doing my job, but two of my team are retiring in March, so it was pretty stressful thinking that there would be noone there at all and I would get back to a big fat MESS in six months. Still nothing confirmed, but I've made a good start on my handover note, and I'm feeling less stressed, especially as Imogen's room is nearly finished FINALLY.

Doctors are stoopid sometimes - the last one I saw only seemed to have the vaguest idea which end the baby was going to come out of. Thank heavens I see the midwife again on Monday!


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## Shiv

AE were you early or late with Imogen? 

I've been feeling a bit icky today. For those of you that have experienced morning sickness, when did it reach its peak?


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## Pippin

Shiv. It all started bang on six weeks for me then was all day every day until 8 weeks 2 then I had a couple of lighter days then back to all day horrid nausea until about 11 weeks when it very gradually got less and less and stopped at 14 weeks. Worse in the evenings for sure. I got some yesterday though. With Sam I only got waves starting at 6 weeks again but I'd have a week on week off and nothing by week 11. Quite different to this one. Will be interesting to see in a week if this is a different sex. When is your scan?

Spidey glad you are starting to bump uglies again just in case. I have everything crossed you don't need to though.

Aunty E when do you officially leave? I'm hoping to go to 38 weeks but we'll see how we go.

Ohh I just noticed my baby changed to the size of an avocado today :happydance: (ticker)


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## spidey

Shiv, my ms started around the middle of 5 weeks with Kira. Pretty much all day and night and it started letting up around 10 weeks and was completely gone by 15 weeks. The worst part was 6 weeks to 10 weeks- I was so sick that I could hardly move without being sick. It took me awhile to learn all the little tricks that made it better. I had to eat ALL of the time. I always had a baggy of dry cereal with me and I crunched on it all day. I had to sleep in a separate bed since wiggly DH would make me hurl, and I kept cereal boxes in the bed so I would wake up 5-6 times a night and munch away :haha:

Pippin- bumping uglies :rofl:


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## cleckner04

Man all of you are lucky. I had MS the entire pregnancy with Emma. It came at completely random times. I even had to make DH stop at the side of the highway a few times so I could throw up. :wacko: Or I'd have to grab the closest thing and throw up because I couldn't make it to a bathroom. :dohh:


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## Pippin

I haven't been sick in years. I seem to be very lucky even when I'm ill.


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## spidey

Cleckner- thats awful to have ms the whole time! I know what you mean by random ms because I had that for a few weeks right before it stopped. I would be completely okay and then suddenly get an overwhelming wave of nausea.

My nipples are a little sore this morning so I have a feeling I'm ovulating. This will probably be another long cycle for me- so lets see if I'm right and AF arrives in 2 weeks (or a bfp if I'm lucky!). Today is cd 30 for me.


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## Shiv

you best get doing the horizontal baby shuffle Spidey!


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## Pippin

Or you're producing hgc spidey :winkwink: get :sex:

That's another new saying Shiv, you taught me the bumping uglies one too :rofl:


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## spidey

I have to hope the spermies from Thursday night can survive until the next time DH is home, which should be Sunday night! He's away this weekend to help clear out my grandmothers house so here I am ovulating and there is no man to impregnate me! I do know that we had unprotected :sex: 3 or 4 days before I ovulated with Kira so they should be alive up there still :haha:


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## spidey

I was just googling sensitive nipples and ovulation and learned that it could be caused by increased progesterone which occurs AFTER ovulation. Soooo... I may have already ovulated and my Thursday :sex: might have been perfectly timed, LOL. Okay, now there's no need to convince the mail man to sleep with me tomorrow :rofl:


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## Pippin

spidey said:


> I was just googling sensitive nipples and ovulation and learned that it could be caused by increased progesterone which occurs AFTER ovulation. Soooo... I may have already ovulated and my Thursday :sex: might have been perfectly timed, LOL. Okay, now there's no need to convince the mail man to sleep with me tomorrow :rofl:

:thumbup:........ bring on the bfp :happydance:

(ps my postman is better than the milkman too :winkwink: :haha:)


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## Shiv

so Spidey, where do you think you are at in your cycle? Any sign of AF?

I have been feeling pretty ropey over the weekend, just about all I can stomach is bread - the thought of anything sweet turns my stomach. I really hope I don't get morning sickness as badly as you guys did - it sounds horrific (although I do quite like the idea of having a midnight snack beside my bed!)

I have been thinking that I am probably having a boy, seeing as my symptoms are so different this time, either that or twins :wacko:

Cleck how did your weigh in go?


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## cleckner04

I gained 0.4 pounds last week. :rofl: I have no clue how but I'm thinking it was water retention or something because already since two days ago I've dropped over a pound. :dohh: Go figure right after the weigh in I finally drop.


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## Shiv

where are you in your cycle Cleck? That always made a difference tomy weight


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## cleckner04

I'm actually not sure. I think I'm around ovulation so around the time when weight is harder to come off. I have been noticing I drop most in the week after my period. Than after that it is slow going. :dohh: It's no wonder men lose weight so much faster than women. They don't have to deal with yucky periods and hormones.


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## spidey

Cleckner- you're also doing workouts so you might be dropping fat but gaining muscle. :thumbup:

Shiv- Wouldn't that be something if this one was a boy (or twins, LOL)

I'm guessing I'm due for AF in almost 2 weeks. So not this Friday but next Friday. This is all based on my nipple symptoms, LOL.


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## cleckner04

LOL your nipples are psychic. :lol:


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## Pippin

Nipple sensors I like it :rofl: all you need is a little light in the end to flash. Actually that would be really useful :rofl:


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## spidey

Wouldn't it be something if my nipples predicted the exact day AF came! I have faith in their prediction abilities :haha:

How's everyone feeling today??


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## Shiv

Spidey and her magic nipples! Imagine if they could predict other stuff too, like earthquakes and snow! :haha:

I feel like I have a permanant hangover! Along with it al I can bare to think about eating is bread and salt and vinegar crisps!


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## spidey

My nipples are predicting that Shiv is pregnant with triplets!!!!!! :rofl:


Eat what you can and don't worry about getting proper nutrition right now. I only could eat grapefruits and lettuce covered in vinegar for weeks! Any other symptoms besides your food aversions Shiv?


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## Pippin

Shiv have you booked your scan yet?


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## Shiv

Yep all booked for Friday 18th at 2.20pm!

i don't feel as bad today, not sure what is worse feeling rubbish ornot feeling rubbish!


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## spidey

can't wait for your scan Shiv :happydance::happydance:

I think having ups and downs in symptoms is normal. Try not to think about it too much :hugs:


So... I'm thinking of using another one of my precious pregnancy tests this weekend. Based on my nipples, I'm guessing that would be 1 week post ovulation. These long cycles are so torturous!!!


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## ashnbump

Ooooohhhhh it'll be scans one a week for the next 3 weeks, Pip 12th, shiv 18th & me the 21st!! Lots of exciting dates!! Can't wait for u two to have yours, I think I'm more excited than I am for mine lol!! Xxxx


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## Pippin

Yay for booking Shiv. Can't wait to see a picture. 

Ash is a good run of scans isn't it. So exciting I love it. 

Spidey :test: why not hey all good fun and feeds our universal obsession. :haha:


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## Shiv

I'm gonna disagree with Pippin and say Don't test! If you are only a week post ovulation then you might just about be implanting but too soon to get a positive on a test. These last few weeks have gone sooooooooo slowly for me, leave testing as long as you can :haha::hugs:


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## cleckner04

Yeah the earliest I've ever gotten a positive pregnancy test is 9 dpo and that is really early. I'd wait another week too if I were you. Like wednesday of next week. :D


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## Pippin

Oh you big party poopers :haha: but they are probably right hon I was thinking that maybe you could be a week late already :blush: fingers crossed and all that. xxx


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## spidey

I'm guessing that I ovulated Friday or Saturday, so I'll test sometime next week! I think my nipples will let me know if it will be a bfp though :haha: The nipple soreness goes away during the week before AF. If nipple soreness is caused by increased progesterone, then they will continue to be sore as it gets closer and closer to when AF might come (my theory!). Right now my nipples are less sore, so I'm already prepared for another unsuccessful cycle.

I might look into some sort of ovulation monitor. If my cycles keep going for 46 days it will take me years to get pregnant at this rate!! 

Shiv- I always check your ticker and I swear- these last couple of weeks have gone by soooooo slow! I bet its been even slower for you!!


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## cleckner04

I ordered a clearblue fertility monitor last week!! Didn't know if I should share because I don't want to become too obsessive. But I want to get my cycles straight before DH comes back. So if I still have a short luteal phase than I am going to start taking B6 vitamins to lengthen them. :dance: I saved so much money on the monitor by buying on ebay! And it was new! (I'd never buy a used monitor, that just seems yucky to me when pee is involved..:rofl:) But my period isn't here yet so I can't start using the monitor until my period starts. I'm just itching to use it though because it looks fun. :lol:


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## spidey

ooo Clecker- thats really cool! I never thought of ebay! I was reading about that particular ovulation monitor after my last post and it looks promising and has great reviews on Amazon. Now I have to decide if I want to buy one now, and "calibrate" it using this period coming up, or go thru one more month and see how things go. Part of me wants to get the monitor because it appeals to my scientific side... but I don't want to become obsessive about it. It's bad enough that I have 5 unused pregnancy tests in my house and I'm planning to test BEFORE AF might arrive :rofl: 

I keep reminding myself that I don't need to have a baby NOW and if Kira and another baby are 3 or 4 years apart, that is perfectly fine too. In fact it might be better because Kira will be off at Kindergarten and me and new baby can take naps together during the day, LOL.


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## cleckner04

I know I'm so worried I'll become obsessive too. But I also can't sit there just wondering when I ovulate. Because I really have no clue when I ovulate. I don't have any signs. No extra CM, no sore boobs, nothing like that. :shrug: And I also agree, a 3-4 year age gap sounds SO perfect to me. We'll probably put Emma in preschool around 4 years old so I could get all this amazing 1 on 1 time with the next baby. And naps sound good!!! :lol: I just know the terrible 2s are approaching and that freaks me out a bit. I'm definitely going to set my monitor with this next period. I've somewhat read the instruction manual but I need to read it a bit more to understand what I'm doing. :haha: I love that the tests are taken with FMU. Because with the opk sticks apparently you are supposed to take them in the afternoon and I always forgot. But I could easily remember with FMU every day.


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## spidey

Cleckner- make sure you keep us updated on your ovulation monitor. I use to have so many symptoms around ovulation and also for the week before AF was due to arrive. Now I have that strange nipple pain, but thats it. I'm still not certain what comes first.. is it nipple pain then ovulation, or ovulation and then nipple pain. Did you have more symptoms around ovulation before Emma?

Part of me wonders if bf is suppressing the hormones to ovulate still. Cleckner- are you still bf frequently and on demand? On some days Kira will take little snacks every 15 minutes, but on other days she might go hours without a feed. I still nurse her during the night too. 

Oh, and I completely agree with it being great to have one-on-one time with the next baby if our first is old enough for pre-school. We have a free half day preschool program at the elementary school next to my house and I was thinking of enrolling Kira when she turns 4 :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

No, I never had ovulation symptoms before either. But I don't know what I'm doing either when it comes to checking CM and stuff like that. I don't look. I just wipe and move on. :rofl: It's the same for us with the BFing. Some days she wants it frequently, others she couldn't care less. Now that I've been putting her in her own bed most nights, she only needs a BF once at night though. Which is an awesome new development. And it's only because she wakes up and realizes I'm not there so comes in, feeds for like a minute before falling back asleep. 

Is it sad that I'm excited for my period to come so I can start playing with the monitor? :rofl::rofl: I just really hope with my weight loss and Emma feeding a bit less, that my cycles are getting back on track. Weigh in is tomorrow for my weightloss. We'll see how I did this week. :wacko: Last week was a .4 or .6 gain, I can't remember exactly so hopefully I lost that and more! :dance: I've nearly dropped 3 bmi points so far so that makes me feel really good. My ultimate goal is to at least be in the 'overweight' category instead of 'obese' before getting pregnant again. :blush:

Spidey- you totally have to buy a monitor too. We can be monitor buddies. :rofl: If you're not already pregnant this month of course. ;)


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## spidey

Cleckner- how can you wipe and NOT look :rofl: I've been doing that for as long as I can remember! By looking, sometimes I can catch AF right at the start before I have to change my clothes and get out the stain remover :haha:

I'm not quite to the point of buying a monitor yet. I need to hear your reviews first :haha: But if I'm not pregnant by the summer, maybe I will buy one and we can both be hard core monitor using, TTC buddies, LOL! 

Oh, and thats great how Emma is cutting back on night feeds. We have good weeks and bad weeks, but for the most part Kira is cutting down on night feeds too. On good nights she'll go until 3am before she takes a snack, but then she'll snack more frequently from 5am until her wake up time (7:30).

Shiv- how are you feeling today??

I'm going to write everyone scan dates on my calendar now  I'm at work and theres nothing better to do! :rofl:


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## cleckner04

I'm down 2.4 lbs today!!! :dance::dance: I know my weight is coming off much slower than other women, but for not dieting and not depriving myself of anything, I feel like I'm doing pretty good. :D 

Emma has her bad nights with feeds too but the last two weeks have been pretty consistently just one feed and that's it. But she will probably teeth again at some point and do an all night feed. She's famous for wanting to comfort nurse literally all night long. :dohh:


----------



## Pippin

cleckner04 said:


> I'm down 2.4 lbs today!!! :dance::dance: I know my weight is coming off much slower than other women, but for not dieting and not depriving myself of anything, I feel like I'm doing pretty good. :D :

Yay congrats hon. x


----------



## Shiv

Well done Cleck, slowly is the best way to lose it and keep it off!


----------



## Pippin

Shiv can't believe you are 7 weeks already :shock: how are you feeling?


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## Shiv

ALREADY? - are you freaking kidding me :haha: It's been a long 3 weeks since I found out!

Feeling ok, a bit tired and still off anything sweet, mainly living off toast! I miss chocolate so much but I just can't eat it :cry: 

Spidey, any symptoms for us to fuss over?


----------



## spidey

2.4 pounds is amazing!!! And you're due for AF soon, right? I'm always bloated leading up to AF!

Shiv- that is so sad about the chocolate. I eat sooooo much chocolate! I actually stopped eating chocolate in 1st tri with Kira too, but don't you worry, soon you'll be eating tons again! 

No symptoms for me! I'm waiting for AF now. My nipples are back to normal and I feel great. AF should arrive at the end of this coming week (based on my nipple predictions) Then the next weekend my brother will be in town :happydance: I won't be anywhere near my 2ww or ovulation so I can join in the fun :thumbup: BUT... I will test sometime next week anyway :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

Yeah, AF started today!! Well, last night while I was sleeping. :dohh: It always does that. I have a good stain remover for my sheets though. :rofl: This week my goal is to at least try to maintain the weight. I have typically been gaining a pound each week I have a period. So we'll see how it goes. 

So I got to hit the m button on my monitor!! :dance: It begins!!!! I'm so stupidly excited. lol.


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## Pippin

:yipee: Cleckner let the monitoring begin. I loved monitoring my cycles with OPKs. Something strangely nice know what your body is doing and I'm a sucker for science (currently watching my 4th CSI of the day :rofl:) so anything like this intrigues me. Hope it goes well.


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## cleckner04

:lol: My parents love CSI too. I've seen a few but I can't really watch them without DH home because I get freaked out that someone is going to come in the house and murder me. :blush: 

I don't think I get to pee on any sticks until day 6, we'll see how it goes!! I am SOOO hoping my cycles are back on track.


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## Shiv

ooooooooh Cleck, this monitoring business sounds like fun! You get to press buttons and pee on a stick, I hope it will give you some confidence in your cycles in time for Corey's return.


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## cleckner04

You pee on the stick than basically feed it to the machine and it tells you if you are at a low,high, or peak in your cycle. :D Cool right?! I don't have to sit there and wonder if the opk is positive or not. That was the biggest stress for me when I took the OPKs that one month. Because some looked positive or close to it and I was worrying and stressing that I'm wrong. Now the machine will do all the work for me. :smug::haha:


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## Pippin

Sounds fun to me Sam my friend has one ad she's trying to conceive a girl with pcos so she's dtd three days before the peak. Can I just point out though I conceived my little girl on the day of ovulation so I blow that theory way out of the water hehehehehehe

Not long now Shiv, 5 days isn't it??? Have you told your folks yet?


----------



## Shiv

Yep 5 days to go. feeling a bit down today - bloody hormones! i remember i got so sad in the first tri with Sophia, I would literally cry over the silliest of things (including tv adverts:haha:)

I am thinking of putting off telling my parents until after my 12 weeks scan. I just don't want them to worry, and maybe by 12 weeks we might have more of a clue about what our future as a family holds (although I doubt it). David has applied for a job in essex, and one in cambridgeshire so we will see what happens.

Today I have terrible heartburn - this I was not expecting. I got it SO bad in the latter stages of my pregnancy with Sophia but not early on, I hope it disappears, I don't fancy having it the whole way through my pregnancy (all being well, haven't said that in a while, getting complacent!)

Listen to me moan on - on the upside we have a roast chicken in the oven, with home made yorkshire pudding (Cleck and Spidey do you get yorkshire pudding out there with your roast dinners? In fact do you guys even have roast dinners out there) So today we are having roast chicken, yorkshire puddings, brocolli, carrots, cauliflower cheese, roast potatoes and gravy - yum!

This is how hormonal I am getting, this morning I was thinking how sad it is that in real life I bet we could all be great friends but we live so far apart - it's such a waste!


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## spidey

awww Shiv :hugs: Hormones can be awful. I would love it if we all lived closer- I know we would be great friends in real life too. I live very close to DC and we have the National Institutes of Health close by so perhaps you guys can move here and David can get a research job at the NIH! :thumbup:

I don't know what yorkshire pudding is, but I just googled it and its nothing like I imagined LOL! I was thinking it was like a rice pudding or tapioca pudding... but its more like a biscuit-y thing :haha: We have roasted dinners here too. To make a roasted chicken with veggies I would put a whole chicken in a pan with some salt, pepper and butter on top and then put veggies (carrots, potatoes, onions) all around the chicken and bake it in the oven. Does that sound right? 

Tonight I'm making "pot roast", which is a big hunk of beef slow cooked in a tomato based sauce. I'm also making mashed potatoes, broccoli, and collards!

Pippin- I'm sooo happy that my instincts of you having a boy were wrong :haha:


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## Shiv

yep that's a roast dinner, apart from I usually do my veggies seperately as I am not a fan of roast veggies.

Yorkshire pudding is.............hmmm hard to desribe, it is made from plain pancake batter (so just milk, eggs and flour) and you pop it in the oven in little moulds (I use a cupcake tray) and it rises up and is fluffy and light and crispy on the top! yum, good soaked in gravy! For the first time today I think i have perfected the art of making them, they were gooooooooooooood!


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## spidey

I can't think of anything similar to a yorkshire pudding that we have here. The closest thing would be a biscuit, but biscuit dough is thicker. But biscuits are also yummy when dipped in gravy :thumbup: Yorkshire puddings sound soooo yummy though. I love having a bread-like thing for dipping


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## Pippin

Shiv you're not that far from me really let's see if we can arrange a meet soon and you can get to it. Last time we almost did didn't we but you got taken away somewhere lovely if I remember! I get emotional about everything at the moment. Even bloody neighbours can get me and I don't even watch it that often...... I want yorkshires now.... yummy. My Mum would kill me if I waited until 12 weeks to tell her, she was hurt I didn't tell her until 6 weeks with the one I lost. So this time I showed her the test on Skype as soon as I had done it lol. She reacted a lot better.

5 days how exiting, do you have a gut feeling on gender yet? Spidey I thought girl for ages and then I think more convinced myself it was a boy so I wasn't disappointed Stupid I know because I'd love a him just as much. Just need to get to term safely now.

Any symptoms Spidey??? Bet you are dead excited about your brother coming :yipee:

KNow what you mean about looking at positive Cleck :wacko: I always took my darkest one as the positive and it worked for me lol. I really think this will give you a good idea of our cycles. Try ebay for the sticks though they are cheaper I think they were for my friend in the UK. :hugs:


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## Pippin

spidey said:


> I can't think of anything similar to a yorkshire pudding that we have here. The closest thing would be a biscuit, but biscuit dough is thicker. But biscuits are also yummy when dipped in gravy :thumbup: Yorkshire puddings sound soooo yummy though. I love having a bread-like thing for dipping

Your biscuits are like our scones I think like heavy bread if I'm right???


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## Shiv

You should try making them Spidey, it's really easy.

makes 6 small yorkshire puddings: Oven at 220 degrees C

112g plain flour
2 eggs lightly beaten
150ml milk
pinch of salt (i leave this out)

sift flour into bowl, make a well in centre and add the eggs and half the milk. whisk to combine then add the rest of the milk and whisk until no lumps (this can be left for a few hours if you don't need it immediately.

Get your cupcake/ muffin tin and place a teaspoon of oil (or beef dripping from roast beef if you are having with beef) in each of 6 holes. Put tray in oven for a few minutes to get oil smoking hot. Take out anf ill each hole half full with batter and put back in oven for 15 minutes. DO NOT open the oven door before 15 minutes as they will sink.

After 15 minutes they should have really risen and be golden brown on top and crispy! voila! yum yum!


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## Shiv

Pip - where abouts do you live?

I think this one is a boy (but then I thought that about Sophia :dohh:), my symptoms seem really different this time (as in I have some!), but I will be waiting until he/she pops out to find out, so you will be able to predict based on bumpage later on!

My mum said my last pregnancy was the longest time of her life, and I told her at 8 weeks so she only had 7 months to wait! I just don't want her to worry more than she already is abotu our situation, it should be a purely happy announcement and i feel like it will be oversahdowed a bit by worry :cry:


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## cleckner04

So far amazon is cheaper for the test sticks. But I'm checking ebay regularly too. I bought the monitor with a box of 30 test strips for only $130. Which is awesome because the monitor by itself is $149 in stores. But I found a good deal on ebay. Brand new of course, I'd never buy a used one. :sick: And I don't have to worry about when we :sex: because I already have my girl. :haha: I'm not too bothered either way if we have another girl. I think that'd be nice. And a boy would be nice too. I just want a baby. :haha: We plan on having 3-4 kids so I'm sure we'll get a boy eventually. :D 


I agree I think we'd all get along pretty good. You girls have at least all met eachother for the meet right? Did you girls go to it? I was so jealous seeing all the pictures of everyone together. The US is way too big for us to have a meet. We'd have to meet in a random state like Kansas that's in the middle. :haha:


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## Shiv

I couldn't go to the meets, first one I was snowed in and second one I was away on holiday! It's a bit sad that some of the main contributors back then are no longer about.


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## cleckner04

Wait, I didn't know you girls had two meets! :wacko:


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## cleckner04

Yeah it is a shame people just disappeared. I really miss laura coming in here. But after 4 kids I probably wouldn't find the time to get on here either. :haha: There are so many that I just wonder what happened to them. Like xarxa. She just disappeared after her LO was born.


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## Shiv

yeha I think they did, the second was a smaller one i think though, both only a few months apart i think


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## spidey

Shiv- thats neat you're not going to find out the gender... so you didn't know for Sophia either?? I didn't know with Kira and since I was 99.9% she was a boy, I was SHOCKED when a girl popped out :haha: I think my next one will be a surprise too since it was fun not knowing. Everyone said I was having a boy based on my bump, so it was a good shock to us all. Oh, and Shiv, don't forget the possibility of twins :haha:

I might give that recipe a try. Since I'm allergic to wheat I'll have to substitute my rice/potato/tapioca flour mix for the wheat flour, but it should be okay since my flour tastes good too. I have a scale so I can weigh my flour (most Americans don't have a kitchen scale to weigh dry ingredients) and I can convert mL's to teaspoons or whatever, LOL. I'll let you know if I make them 

Our biscuits are probably like your scones, but I always thought scones were sweet?? Our biscuits aren't sweet. They're flakey and light too- yum yum yum!

No symptoms for me! Not sure when I will test.. any suggestions? I'm guessing AF will arrive Thursday or Friday. I only want to waste one test, so I don't want to test too early!

Cleckner- LOL about Kansas. It would be my first time ever on a plane! :blush:


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## cleckner04

Wait, we're supposed to weigh our food before eating? :haha: We have a kitchen scale. But only because we got it to weigh Emma. :rofl::rofl:


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## spidey

LOL Cleckner- it's more accurate to weigh flour vs. measuring it. 1 cup of flour could be densely packed or lightly packed and that could affect the outcome of the recipe. I love it how Emma gets weighed on the kitchen scale- does she still fit???


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## cleckner04

No, not anymore. :haha: We were really strategic about it too. Because she wouldn't fit laying on the little platform so we'd get a huge plywood piece and we marked down how much it weighed. Than lay Emma on it to weigh her. :rofl::rofl: It was our own ghetto way of knowing if she was gaining back in the beginning when they kept trying to get me to top up with formula to make her gain weight. I'm so glad I am done with those stresses. The next time around I am totally not going to listen to doctors. :D


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## Shiv

OMG, I am laughing at you weighing Emma on a bit of wood on a kitchen scale! Too funny, imagine if someone would haev walked in as you were doing that!

You use cups? I don't really understand that as a cup of sugar obviously weighs more than a cup of flour etc. I weigh everything if I am baking, but don't weigh mich if I am just cooking dinner.

1 teaspoon - 5ml, but it is basically just a small spoon or a drizzle of oil to make sure the batter doesn't stick. You must have teaspoons and tablespoons as measures, no? It is really tricky to measure out 5 ml any other way surely? And what do you stir tea with if not a tea-spoon?:haha:


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## cleckner04

I didn't know it was 5 ml. I just know it's a teaspoon or tablespoon. :rofl: And I have never weighed food in my life. That's weird. :haha: .....But weighing babies on a food scale on wood is normal...:rofl:


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## spidey

I would say 99.99% of Americans do not weigh their ingredients while baking. I do occasionally, but most of the time I don't since our recipes don't give weights. We do all of our larger measurements in cups, so I guess our recipes are adjusted to make up for the fact that 1 cup of sugar weighs more than 1 cup of flour. Yes- we do use teaspoons and tablespoons, LOL! We never use ml's and most people have no idea how much 1 ml is... I only do because I use ml's for my work. 

LOL Cleckner and your ghetto version of a baby scale :haha:


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## Pippin

Shiv I'm north London, Harrow. I think I'm the only one left in here from that meet apart from Boothh. You're good not finding out the sex, the guessing drives me nuts I'm so much more relaxed now it's great. I instantly feel closer to the baby once I find out as I can visualise them and give them an identity. Of course now I'm even more worried about her being ok lol.

I'm a rubbish baker so can't give advice really :rofl: I'm good at eating it though!!!

I want to try biscuits. And yes our scones can be sweet but cheese scones are yummy too.


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## Shiv

Pip - one of my best friends lives in Mill Hill, which must be just up the road from you.

I have been baking like a wild thing but haven't been able to even try any of it, it has all been going with David to work to try to cheer people up!

I quite fancy just measuring everything in cups - would be easier!

Spidey - what exactly do you do science wise?


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## spidey

Firstly, I must report that I tested this morning and it was a BFN!!!

I expect AF Thursday or Friday so I don't think it was too early. The box said I could test 6 days before AF. 


I do genetics research on aging. In my lab we experiment on a microscopic worm (instead of mice, rats or humans). It sounds strange, but the worm actually has many of the same genes and genetic pathways as humans and they only live 20 days so we can do lots of experiments in a short period of time :thumbup:


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## Pippin

It's not far hon about 30 minutes on a good day at a guess, next time you're down we must meet :thumbup:

Spidey sorry bfn and it most defo is early. I didn't get a hint of a line both time until 10/11dpo so 3 days before af was due. So don't count yourself out just yet :hugs:

What tips can you give us on ageing then Spidey???


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## spidey

If AF isn't here by Friday night I'll test again Saturday :thumbup:

LOL Pippin- eat lots of blue berries, drink some wine, exercise a little bit and stay positive


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## Pippin

spidey said:


> If AF isn't here by Friday night I'll test again Saturday :thumbup:
> 
> LOL Pippin- eat lots of blue berries, drink some wine, exercise a little bit and stay positive

Yay for the new test date and as for the ageing I do all those things anyway so horray!!!! Problem is I'm over weight which cancels them all out :haha: :rofl: Actually my husband is growing blue berries this year and we can't wait. Hope they are worth it he's had to buy in different soil, special water and all sorts of growing equipment lol.


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## spidey

Pippin- Watch out because the birds will try to eat them all!

Anything exciting happening to anyone else? I'm bored waiting for AF to arrive!


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## cleckner04

I should get to start peeing on sticks soon! :lol: And I also realized, my last cycle was only 27 days. :wacko: Who knows what is going on with my weird body. I'm still clotting with this period too but not nearly as bad as last month and I haven't cramped like last month either. So I'm hoping that was a one time thing. The clots still freak me out a bit.


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## spidey

oooo! peeing on sticks and sticking them in the monitor will be fun :thumbup: I use to have lots of large clots during my period but none since having Kira. I don't miss them either. So how long have your cycles been over the past few months?


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## cleckner04

They are different every month. They started out being 28 days but than started lengthening. The longest so far has been 34 days. And now a 27 day cycle. It's so random. :wacko: 

I forgot to check my monitor this morning to see if I needed to test. :dohh: So I hope it isn't asking for one until tomorrow. I need to remember so I can use FMU.


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## spidey

The 27 day cycle was to balance out the 34 day cycle :haha: 

Mine are going crazy too. I was having 28-32 day cycles (which was great for me :haha:) but now I'm getting these freak long 46-ish day cycles. Before Kira mine were usually between 34 and 46 days, sometimes 50-something days too. So frustrating!! Our uteruses like to keep us guessing :haha:


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## cleckner04

Do you think it's the breastfeeding making them crazy? Your cycles were crazy to begin with from the sounds of it. 50 day cycle! :shock: Although that'd be quite nice when not TTC.


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## spidey

bf might be the reason for your weird cycles since you had really predictable cycles before. For me, bf might be keeping mine lighter and pain free. Usually on the first day of my period I would miss work because the cramps would be awful. Even with max doses of IBprofin, I usually spent part of the day curled in a ball on the floor. I use to had awful pms for 1 week leading up to AF too- the kind where DH would have to hide away for fear of me biting his head off, LOL. It will be interesting to see if all that comes back when I'm no longer bf (which will hopefully be many many years from now since I'd like to get pregnant again one day, LOL)


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## Shiv

i think I have said this before but I believe the crazy cycles are just your bodies way of getting back into the swing of ovulating. I used to have a 31 day cycle pre-Sophia. But after Sophia my cycles came back at 28 days, I truly believe that these were "false" cycles, as in I probably wasn't ovulating (as I was still breastfeeding a lot then), after Sophia weaned off the boob my cycles started varying, 27 days up to 37 days one month then settling down to 30 days again. So I believe the messed up cycles were me starting to ovulate again as the breastfeeding hormones left my body.

so what I am trying to say by rambling so much is that I think your crazy cycles are a good sign that you are starting to ovulate properly again and that your bodies are gearing up to grow another baby!

ramble over :haha:

Cleck did you check to see if you missed an opportuntiy to poas?
Spidey, is it this weekend your brother is coming? Any symptoms?


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah I did run up and check and today is CD5 so I should be asked for one tomorrow morning!! :dance: I know it's just going to be 'low' but it's still fun to finally get to try it out!


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## spidey

Shiv- you're probably right. I have a feeling that I wasn't ovulating in those early cycles because I was :sex: at the right times but no pregnancy. We stopped protecting the cycle before Kira's 1st birthday. My body is gearing up for a huge egg release soon so I can have triplets! haha!

My brother visits on the 23rd! He's only here 4 full days and I already have day #1 planned. We're leaving Kira at my mom's and having an adult only day. Now I need to come up with some indoor kid and adult friendly things to do for the other days.

No symptoms for me. Shiv, your scan is soon isn't it. I have it on my work calendar, but I'm pretty certain its this week. Is it Friday?


----------



## Shiv

Yep Friday afternoon, a bit nervous, we have to drive for over an hour to get there and I have been told to have a full bladder for the scan so it could be an uncomfortable journey!


----------



## cleckner04

Is it wrong that I'm secretly hoping you come back and say it's twins? :rofl::rofl::muaha:


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## Shiv

Yep that is wrong Cleck! Although that is what David has been saying all week, I am gonna be pooing my pants now not just waiting for a heartbeat but waiting for the words "how do you feel about multiples"............:haha:


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## cleckner04

:lol: I wouldn't wish multiples on myself that's for sure. But it's really interesting seeing scan pictures of multiples. :winkwink:


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## Shiv

:help::haha:


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## spidey

if it were me I would start drinking on the drive there, not before. My bladder fills up fast though.

Twins would be neat for you to have, LOL. But I couldn't do it. DH's aunt has twin girls who are 5 or 6 now and she bf both of them for 18 months I think. Each one got it's own boob.


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## cleckner04

I think BFing twins would take some serious determination. I think twins would be easier if it's the first child IYKWIM. Than you wouldn't know any different. But since we know what its like to just have one, twins are TERRIFYING! :haha:


----------



## spidey

if I had twins now I would have to parent them very differently. I doubt I would co-sleep and with having 2 babies and 1 toddler, I'm sure they would be left to cry for long-ish periods of time as I cleaned up a poop disaster or did other tasks where I couldn't hold a toddler and 2 newborns at the same time. Can you imagine tandem feeding 3 babies!! Oh gosh!


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## cleckner04

I give props to Jessa on here that BF triplets. She's finally gave up now but she lasted a few months. There are tons of girls on here that couldn't even manage BFing one kid. :D She's a hero.


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## Shiv

I actually quite fancied having twins first time round, but defo not now, I think you are right Cleck, when you know no different you would just get on with it, but knowing what it is like having just one (and a very placid Sophia at that) having twins scares the heebeejeebees outta me!


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## cleckner04

After telling Emma to stop crying all morning, I can definitely say I am not up for having twins. :rofl::rofl: I swear Emma whines just to whine. I was trying to wipe down the kitchen counters and dining room table and she just would not stop this morning. Sometimes I just want to lock myself in a room and cry...or scream really loud. :blush:


----------



## cleckner04

Oh yeah, I forgot completely that I got to pee on a stick this morning!!! I put it in the machine wrong the first time. :rofl: I had to flip it around. Than it takes five minutes to process and than you take it out and it says whether you are low, high, or peak. I'm low obviously still. AF has barely left so I figure I have a while before I see a high or peak. But it's fun already using this thing! :lol:


----------



## Shiv

Cleck it does sound fun (poas - not Emma whining!) - it will be so interesting to see it go up to medium and high, keep us updated!


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## spidey

Cleckner- I hope Emma's whining has slowed down for the afternoon. Kira also whines just to whine. I have a feeling that when she's older and talking, everything will be said in a whiney voice, LOL. Does Emma hang off of your legs too? I'm with you on sometimes needing to scream or cry. I actually did it once and it didn't help, LOL. Kira was throwing a fit and my back was sooo sore and I was being pushed to my limit, so I laid on the floor and whined and screamed.... haha... and Kira whined and screamed even louder! I've said it before, but Cleckner you really deserve an award for basically being a single parent. :hugs:

I thought AF was coming today, but I must have imagined a pinkish tinge after I wiped. Today is cd 42!

I wonder what the machine was doing with your pee sample for an entire 5 minutes! Sounds fun!!


----------



## cleckner04

I imagine my machine was licking it to see what it tastes like. :rofl: No, I really don't understand what it was doing. I didn't realize it would take so long for results but I sat and read the manual a bit more as I was waiting. I could see the lines on it. It is basically like an OPK. The second line is really faint so I have a feeling it will darken. The monitor just says if it's positive or close to being positive. Weird. Maybe I'll take a picture of it all tomorrow so you girls can see. :thumbup:

Yes, Emma clings to my legs too. And if I leave the room, she gets quiet and follows me into the next room and than once she sees me she whines or screams again. :roll: And when she's really tantruming good, she'll follow, see me, than throw herself on the floor and roll around for dramatic affect. And if she can't see my face, she will move to a place that I can see her, and do it again. It's almost laughable if it was so freaking loud. I admit to breaking down and full blown crying a few times. It's just SO hard sometimes. I told her this morning that we have 4 more months so she has to work with me. LOL! I'm trying to reason with a kid that can't even talk. 

But she's been better after this morning. I made a good breakfast for her and I think that helped. Food usually does the trick. :lol: Or pushing her in her swing outside.


----------



## Shiv

I worry that I use food to pacify Sophia as it does tend to do the trick! I think you're a hero Cleck :hugs:


----------



## cleckner04

Thanks ladies!! :hugs::hugs: I just take comfort knowing he'll be back. We've made it 2.5 months so far. Only 4 more to go. :haha:


----------



## Pippin

Hey ladies, I'm reading but I have my Aunty staying so it's short replies.

Shiv good luck with your scan tomorrow :yipee: I drank a pint half an hour before the scan and it was fine so take drink and drink in the car.

Cleck yay for starting the sticks.

Spidey hoping AF stays away for you, test day Sat or tomorrow? xxx


----------



## spidey

AF is starting up tonight... very light right now, but I'm sure the flood gates will open tonight :haha: That makes this cycle 42 days. The interesting thing is AF came exactly 2 weeks after I first felt nipple tenderness, just as it did last cycle (which was 46 days long). Can you tell I've been taking notes like a crazy woman :haha: And once again I :sex: plenty around the time of ovulation (since I write that down too, LOL). I have a good feeling about next month though. The slightly warmer Spring weather is all I need to pop out some real eggs!!

Shiv- I expect an update ASAP tomorrow!!! Good luck :hugs:


----------



## spidey

Shiv- I've been thinking of you all morning!! 

Still no AF for me. This cycle has been so unpredictable and annoying! The light pink turned to brown overnight and it's only there when I wipe. If AF doesn't arrive today I'll do another test tonight. Can't AF see that I only have 10 pads and she's causing me to waste them!!!! Kira got into my pads yesterday and stuck most of them to the floor :dohh: So once I use my 10 clean pads I might have to use the dirty floor pads if I can't make it to the store in time, LOL.


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## ashnbump

Just bobbing in to wish shiv luck for today! If u have alreadybeen hope all was super and looking forward to pics! Xxx

3 sleeps for us, we get to see bun - hopefully healthy and happy, and of course, pink or blue! Excited! Xxx


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## cleckner04

Shiv, I don't know what time your appointment is but I wanted to wish you luck!!! :dance: I haven't gotten on facebook yet this morning so I guess I should check for updates on there too. :haha:


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## Shiv

Hi everyone, well Cleck you'll be glad to know it isn't TWINSAll was well, measured 8 weeks (which is spot on by my dates) Heartbeat was 156bpm

here is a picture of blob, I am sure it looked much more like a baby at this stage with Sophia!
 



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## cleckner04

:rofl::rofl: Only one?! I'm so disappointed. :winkwink: I definitely see the baby form. Little head, body, arms, and legs! So cute. :cloud9: I'm jealous, I had a dream last night that I was pregnant. Like I could feel the baby moving around and everything. I wish I could be one of those girls on "i didn't know I was pregnant"...So I'd really be like in second trimester right now and didn't know it. :rofl::rofl:


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## spidey

awwwwww such a cute little blob!!!! Shiv- you have no idea how many times I re-loaded this page, LOL! Right up until I left work and now I'm borrowing my mom's computer :haha: You freaked me out for a second when I saw twins, LOL! How was it holding your pee on that drive? Does it feel more real now?

Cleckner- I would love to be in 2nd tri and not know it!! This is how the announcer would say it: "Spidey didn't know she was pregnant because she continued to have irregular monthly bleeding. She only gained a few pounds and didn't have any other symptoms like she experienced with her first child. Spidey had NO prenatal care, so the baby could be at risk for a multitude of health problems." :haha:


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## Pippin

Yay Shiv congrats again. It looks pretty 8 week like to me. This one was 8 weeks when I first went it it kinda had a head and limb buds but look more like a jelly baby. This on had a hb of 170 odd so maybe a boy for you but studies have disproved that theory :haha: so exciting though. Does it feel more real now? I can't believe Ash and I are almost half way :wacko:

Spidey I hate spotting used to get it every other cycle and it would annoy me. I used to think is this IB or my AF arrrrgggghh! You make me laugh re you second tri announcement though :rofl:

Cleckner I get those dreams lots. Freaks me out and always before I get my bfp :wacko: AND 21lb woman good god that's fab. Is that a new picture in your avatar (sp?) as you look loads thinner!!!! Can we cave a body shot yet??????

Ash getting excited for you. Two sleeps to go now. Xxxx


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## cleckner04

I'll make a little collage right now for you pip! I warn you, it's not attractive. :rofl: I'm taking pictures just in a bra and yoga pants that are too small for me(I used to wear them when I was a size 8:dohh:) 

That avatar was from two days ago! :D


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## cleckner04

Okay, you can tell I stood at different angles each time so it's not quite right. :haha::blush: Oh well, you can still kinda see the difference. I definitely feel different looking in the mirror. I've had to pack away some clothes because they are too big. :dance: 

DELETED!!

Oh yeah, I apologize for the horribly ugly nursing bras in the first two pictures. :rofl:


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## spidey

Cleckner- Without a doubt I can see that you lost weight! You look great in the most recent picture :thumbup: Corey is going to be amazed when he sees you! You must carry your weight really well, because you're looking skinny for 220 pounds :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

Yeah I'm 5'8" so I hold my weight pretty well. When I tell people IRL how much I weigh they completely flip out because they can't believe I weigh so much. :haha: Even at my skinniest with hardly any fat on my body, I'm 165-170 lbs. :wacko:


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## Shiv

Cleck - you can so see a difference, you look great! And you do carry the weight well, another 20lbs and you'll be a skinny minx (as opposed to just a minx :winkwink:)

What did your stick tell you this morning Cleck? Has it changed yet?

And Spidey did AF get you properly or have you tested?

As fo rme, well I went to bed last night feeling so unbelievably sick and thought ot-oh maybe this is what real morning sickness feels like. Then I woke up at 1am and chucked my guts up, then again at 3am then at 5am I started weeing out of my bum (tmi sorry :haha:) so I have eaten something dodgy I reckon. I feel awful but i must admit when I started pooing my main thought was "thank goodness this isn't morning sickness, I couldn't have coped with that for another month or so!). SO I haven't eaten anything today but am going to attempt a slice of toast in a bit!

I forgot to tell you that I told my parents that I am pregnant yesterday after the scan, they were far from enthusiastic :cry: which I kind of expected, as at the moment I am not exactly feeling too enthusiastic about it myself either. i just need to know where i will give birth and then I can settle a bit. I am considering a home birth if we have moved by the time LO comes as Sophia came quite quickly and I need for my parents to come watch her whilst I pop out her brother/sister. It will be cutting it a bit fine if we live 2 hours away! we'll see!

well I've managed to ramble on.............off to try that slice of toast


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## Pippin

*Cleck* WOW :yipee: you can see a huge difference and around your neck in you Avatar. So cool and very jealous, well done. I'm a couple of inches taller and a similar weight. I hope to lose after birth, I'm going to use Bfding to help. Last time I'd eat a whole pack of biscuits whilst feeding as I was so hungry but I'm going to do it the right way this time.

*Shiv* sorry about your parents hon. Surely they can see this happened before the horrible news???? Mine weren't happy about the one I lost as they thought it was too soon even though they knew it was a happy accident. Really hurt me at the time but they have been great this time. Boo for runny tummy, hope you feel better this evening. Good luck with the toast.


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## cleckner04

Thanks girls!! I'll probably delete the photo now. :haha: 

Shiv- So far I'm still at "low" fertility. I figure it'll start going to high next week and no clue when it'll peak.


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## spidey

Shiv- I'm sorry to hear your parents didn't react well. It may not be the best way to think, but I believe that things always work themselves out in the end. So right now your situation may seem bad, but your DH will eventually find a great job and you'll have a nice place to live. A home birth sounds great :thumbup: If they weren't so unpopular here I would have one too- but luckily I have a birthing center near me so I can almost have home births How fast did Sophia come out? Kira took 10 hours start to finish and since I'm planning to grow the next one to less than 10 pounds, I think it will shoot out, LOL. Secretly I want a car birth, LOL :haha:

Oh, and I hope you feel better soon. What a relief it's a tummy bug and not morning sickness. I never peed out my butt with morning sickness, LOL. 

AF started up heavy last night, so my cycle length was officially 43 days. I'm going to BJ's and buying pads in bulk tomorrow and hope that it jinxes me into getting pregnant next month :haha: It would be typical that I buy a huge case of pads just to not have my period for 2 years.


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## Shiv

Sorry AF got you Spidey, but you get to have an amazing time with your bro without morning sickness and plenty of :drunk:. Then next month you will be super chilled out and will catch that eggy!

Cleck - hm hurry and get to medium fertility already :haha:

i know my parents are just worried about our situation and once we are a bit settled they will be thrilled - but well gurumph anyway!

Tummy is a lot better today, am keeping toast down now so will be back to normal in no time.

Poor Sophia had a bad night last night with her teeth, didn't get her settled properly until about 2am. Then today she has gunky eyes so need to take her the doctors tomorrow to get some conjunctivitis drops. Last night i could have cried, David had gone out for the evening, and i had no energy (as hadn't eaten in over 24 hrs) and Sophia just wouldn't settle! I hope she is feeling a bit better tonight as i could do with some sleep!


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## jelr

Knock Knock I hope you all dont mind me coming in but I dont know where to go at the moment and have probably come at the worst time as it seems to be quiet but I could do with some friends.

I dont know if any of you remember but I had posted on FB that DH and I had a bit of an accident a few weeks ago - Well I had thought that I was going to be on the coming onto FB page with my scan picture today to give you all a shock announcement as I'm 8+4 weeks pregnant from my last period but my nurse had given me an EDD as the 3rd of October as my cycle has been 30-32 days for the last few months.

We were referred for early scans again because of the MMC before Natasha but the scan didn't go to plan today. They found it really hard to find a heartbeat so did an internal scan and still no HB and the baby is only measuring 6 weeks - The doc said that maybe my dates were wrong but i am certain as my period arrived on Christmas day and I can remember it clearly. They wanted us back in 2 weeks but I got upset and asked could we be seen in a week, he said that they would probably have to see me again the week after as they wouldn't be able to do anything next week and that the heartbeat is hard to detect at 6 weeks. I said I didn't care as surely at least by next week the baby would be at least measuring a week more and he agreed to see me then.

First of all I dont know whether he meant that they wouldn't be able to do a d&c next week or whether they just probalby wouldn't be able to find the heartbeat next week. I did think they could pick up the HB on an internal earlier than 7-8 weeks.

Anybody know if this happens often and all ends up okay or should I be preparing myself for the worst as I want to think positive but dont want to set myself up for a fall either.

I feel like I'm right back to 3 years ago and am really finding it hard to think positive and I feel so guilty because at first I was upset that I was pregnant as we weren't trying but that shock only lasted a week and I gave myself a kick up the bum and realised that 3 years ago I thought I would never have a baby and am so blessed to have Natasha and now another little one and I have been over the moon and have planned it all in my head.

I have been sick this pregnancy and particularly this week so is that a good sign or have I been sick as my body has known something was wrong - my arthritis did stop kickin up about 2 weeks ago where as on Natasha it kicked up for all of 1st tri and then again in 3rd tri.

I'm sorry for imposing as I know I haven't been part of the threat - but I didn't know where else to go. I have told friends but am so not in the humour for actually talking tonight but needed to sound off also but can't get the words out to any of them where as it is easier to type. I didnt post my news on the FB group as I felt there was too many in there at the moment and didn't feel it right to post in here as I hadn't been part of the group - even through I am terrible nosey and have been having a read in here every now and again - So I did tell Shiv on a PM as I had actually PM'd her to congratulate her on her news that I read here and then I found out a 2 days after that so told her as she is due the same time as me.

I'm totally lost today and thought I was so excited to come onto FB with my scan picture and announce this evening but now I have that scan pic and dont know if my little bean is even alive.

Sorry for the ramble - am all over the shop - its so quiet in here now you probably wont all see this for days lol


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## spidey

jelr :hugs: I'm here, just being quiet since AF is draining the life out of me!

When you and DH had your 'accident'- was it just the one day? If that was the only time a spermy could have gotten past, then you should be pretty certain about your dates, right? I don't think you should give up hope until you get another scan next week to check for growth. I'll be sending lots of positive vibes your way. :hugs: SO many things could be going on such as delayed implantation, wrong dates, crappy sonographer, etc... so it's good you pushed for another scan in a week.


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## Shiv

Hiya - I'm here and I'm sure the other girls will get on at some point soon. 
Hon I think it is a good sign that you have morning sickness, try to stay positive. Did the doc say anything about a fetal pole? i have no idea what one is but people seem to bound the term around as what might be there before a heartbeat?!?!?! 

As you know I am hoping and "praying" :winkwink: for you and Jim and your little bean. Massive hugs hon, I am thinking of you:hugs:


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## cleckner04

I'm here too hun. :hugs: I really don't know what to say. Please don't give up hope. So you have another scan scheduled in a week? They should be able to see a heartbeat at 7 weeks easily. With Emma I had an ultrasound at 8 weeks and it was a full blown formed little baby in there. I'll start praying for you hun. :hugs::hugs:


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## Pippin

Awww hon I am here too :hugs: My heart has done a few thousand leaps while reading your post. I'm sorry you aren't buzzing with better news right now. First of all I'll say this is sadly what happened to me just before this one. I went in at 7+4 and baby only measured 5+ weeks no HB, two weeks later and two epu scans later I had the D&C HOWEVER.....BUT...... I've done a few quick sums bare with me......... My cycle is 26 days and I ma always put forward three or four days. Your cycle is roughly a week longer which means you could be only 7+ weeks, plus late implantation (with this one my positive didn't come until days later than it did with Sam) that cold knock a few more days off you gestation meaning 61/2 weeks or so. It's normal for a HB to start between 6-7 weeks so really you could just be too early. Also I know of a girl who posted in second tri last week asking whether it could be possible that she was but back THREE WEEKS :shock: and is a healthy 17ish weeks pregnant. It can happen, if numbers take a little longer to rise and egg implants later it's totally possible that baby is just still growing. I don't want to get your hopes up as I know how this can end but I want you to see there is hope. As for symptoms mine disappeared when the baby stopped developing so the fact you have had some is good news and hold onto that. Every pregnancy is different so maybe your arthritis isn't a good sign. x

I know you've been through the D&C if comes to that but I have too so always here if you need to talk about it or ask questions to refresh your memory. 

Big hugs honey :hug: we are all here for you and I am keeping every part of my body crossed we have a good outcome in a weeks time. :hug: 

edit: AND DON'T FEEL GUILTY! But I went through the same emotions as ours was an accident (the one I lost) but it doesn't make it any easier I know. I can now see that I wouldn't have my little girl growing in me now if it wasn't for that little bean :hug:


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## Pippin

Out of curiosity hon did they tell you how big the baby is?


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## jelr

Thanks a million girls.

Spidey: Yep it was the only time we weren't careful so I am pretty sure of the date in that sense but am hoping that maybe I could have had a long cycle - usually my cycles can be anywhere between 4 weeks and 7 weeks but they seem to clock back into place when I do low carb which I had being doing before christmas but they are still 30 to 32 days but I did test on the saturday when it was 4 weeks since my LMP and the test was negative and I thought maybe I was doting as I was convinced since the day after we weren't careful that I was pregnant but then during that week I started getting the same pains that worried me on Natasha so I tested again the wed after and it was positive and this time I used digis and I did seem to be behind you on the 1-2 / 2-3 / 3+ even though my LMP is only a day after yours so maybe I did have a longer cycle and the sonographer did seem to be trainee as she had to get the other doc to check with both the US and internal.

Shiv: That link you sent me about the post in 1st tri does seem to say a lot about the fetal pole and the trainee did actually say to the doc today "thats the fetal pole isn't it" and that was only on the first US - I must actually do some research about that as my friend was saying today that if the baby is still in the sac it should be okay because on her last pregnancy I ended up bring her to A&E with loads of pain when she was 5 weeks and they though it was an ectopic pregnancy but later found out she was carrying twins and she had lost one and on her first scan there was no heartbeat but on the second one the baby that survived was still in the sac but the one that was lost has shrunk to the end so maybe that is what she meant - that it wasn't attached to the fetal pole or something - I dont really know as I dont know anything about it and am just guessing so will research that now.

Cleck: that is part of why I pushed for next week as I know with Natasha they told me it was 7 weeks that the HB could be picked up on so hopefully the baby should have developed more or fingers crossed we will have a heart beat.

Thanks so much girls - I am feeling more positive after reading a post in 1st tri that Shiv sent me of this happening to others and that a week later - there was a hb and later the dates caught back up - so fingers crossed. The wait is the killer I even said to DH tonight that if this is the end I wish I would just bleed and get it over - even though I really really dont want this to be the end and am hoping with everything that I have that all is okay I really dont know how I will face maybe another 2 weeks of a wait and then maybe another week for a d&c before this is all over.

The last time we had to wait over the weekend and then it was a few days before the d&c and I honestly thought it was the longest and most cruel week of my life - everyone was so good but there was family and friends in the house the whole time and it was like a wake really and it was horrible so I can't believe we have to wait even longer this time to know.

but then on the other side fingers crossed all is good so it is good to wait and make sure rather than them making a rash decision and all is good anyway.

Sorry rambling again. xx


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## jelr

Sorry pippin I didn't see your post until after I posted - I know the guilt is the worst part. I do know what you mean about knowing you wouldn't have your little girls as that is the way I feel about Natasha now after the first MMC - I still am heart broken to have lost that little bean but wouldn't give your up for the worst for a baby I never met if that makes sense.

Funny thing is though I have been convinced that this was a boy so am terrified that maybe I can't carry boys or something - Anyway we are not going to go there - because I need to keep posative for the moment.

Do you mean the size cm or weeks - they said 6 weeks and didn't say anything about size but on the scan pic it says 6.5cm if that is what you mean.


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## jelr

I actually think it says 6.6 cm / 16 hrz (have no idea what that part means)


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## Pippin

Oh my goodness I know what you mean about the carrying thing. I was sure the one I lost was a girl, was convinced, sickness started earlier, very pink feeling so when I lost it that was it.... I couldn't carry girls. Thankfully I am proving that theory wrong. I got the same pink feeling this time but not the early sickness, as time grew on I convinced myself she was a boy as I desperately wanted a little girl if I'm honest. SO firstly you can forget that theory :hugs:

With the one I lost they told me the length which was 3mm, I'll never forget that as it's so tiny then, hence why it's hard to date that early. The 6.5cm will be the scan image width or radius not the baby. The fact they saw a baby and presumably a yoke too means it's a good thing. I paid for the private one where I saw no HB and she seemed totally fine with putting me back over a week which gave me hope but I kinda knew with the no symptoms. I still think you have a chance so don't count yourself out yet. I know how agonising the wait is, still very raw and the worst bit. I've put losing the baby behind me now I can think back and not feel anything but goodness it was hard at the time. I cried buckets and for weeks so feel free to do the same at us. xxx

Off to bed now, try and do the same. If bean is in there thriving away he needs his Mum to be rested. :hug:


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## jelr

Just looked up fetal pole and wikipedia gives this:

The fetal pole is a thickening on the margin of the yolk sac of a fetus during pregnancy. It is usually identified at 6.5 weeks with abdominal ultrasound imaging, and 6 weeks with vaginal ultrasound imaging. However it is quite normal for the fetal pole to not be visible until about 9 weeks. The fetal pole may be seen at 2&#8211;4 mm crown-rump length (CRL), and heart motion is often detected when it is seen. In the embryo, the heartbeat is seen as a regular flutter, which should be first evident at 5 mm CRL. If the embryo is less than 5 mm CRL, it is possible for it to be healthy without showing a heartbeat, though a follow up study in 5&#8211;7 days will almost always demonstrate the heartbeat.

So maybe I'm actually 6.5 weeks and he just said 6 weeks to round it off as they definitely said they saw the fetal pole on the normal us.

Was panicking then because I came across something else that said "Sometimes, with normal pregnancies, the fetal heartbeat is not visible until a fetal pole of up to 4 mm in length is seen. Failure to identify fetal cardiac activity in a fetus whose overall length is greater than 4 mm is an ominous sign" because I was thinking my measurements were 6.5 but then realised the measurements on picture are in cm not mm so maybe they are totally different measurements - but then I'm thinking is it just magnified x 10 and that would be 6.5mm - think I will stay away from google because for every good point I will see something that will panic me.

Pipp: do you know more on the measurements and I honestly need the truth.

Worst of it is I'm off for the rest of this week for midterm - fingers crossed the weather pics up and I can get out with Natasha and keep busy.


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## jelr

Thanks pip - Well I hope that theory is the same for me.

Yeah funny thing is DH was a bit sceptical about trying again as he was afraid of another MC and didn't want Natasha to feel the pain in the house that was in it the last time and I said I didn't think it would be as bad a second time because we had her - but I think part of it was because we have her I had forgotten how bad the pain was and today just brought me right back - and DH too. He nearly fainted - well turned grey and felt sick (although he will tell you it is the heat of the hospital) but the same thing happened when they took my blood on the 1st MMC so I think it is just the way the upset affects him and today when I was convinced it was over I thought I just need to see Natasha and will feel better but felt worse because every time I looked at her I felt such a pang of pain because it felt like I knew what I was losing if that makes sense - where as before I didn't know how strong the love for a child.

Anyway I'm not going to think that way and just focus on the positives because I have to stay strong for Natasha and for little bean if he / she is okay.

Bed sounds like a good idea pippin as it has been an extremely long day. Thanks girls and hopefully a good night sleep will help too. xx


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## cleckner04

:hugs: I know how hard it is too. I will never have a worry free pregnancy after what happened before Emma. I still grieve to this day for my lost baby. Nothing will ever take that away. I have a strong suspicion that it was a boy too. We even named him Cameron so he's a real person to us. Not just a ball of cells like the doctor said. 

I truly hope everything will turn out positive for you. You have all of us here rooting for you. :hugs:


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## Pippin

How are you feeling this morning Jelr?


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## cleckner04

Thinking of you Jelr. Hope you are doing better today. :hugs:


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## jelr

I was doing great or at least I thought I was and was extremely positive though still shattered this morning and just kept busy and didn't think about it much but then this afternoon and this evening was a complete disaster. 

It was like Natasha hit the terrible twos all in the one afternoon - she didn't want her nappy changed all day and kicked and fought me - she didn't want her lunch and spit her milk all over the place - everything was a screaming match and dinner time was the straw that broke the camels back - DH got a flat tyre and was late home and Natasha wouldn't even try her dinner and kept spitting it back and then upended her plate and threw it all at me and I completely lost the plot - I ended up shouting at her which I never do and ended up bawling in the middle of the kitchen and had a total melt down. I then rang DH and screamed down the phone at him for being late even though it wasn't his fault and ended up saying is it any wonder this keeps happening because I can't even cope with one baby so Id never manange two and this is what I get for being such a sh*te mother. 

I feel so bad now and can't believe I lost it so much. I now have pains down in my nether regions that are worrying me because it is the same kind of pressure pain that I get for the 1st 2 days of AF - I dont know if it is entirely something to worry about because I have only had these pains since I had Natasha and think it may have something to do with my delivery and episiotomy so it may be normal now to feel it in pregnancy but I can't tell as I never had it before Natasha so I wouldn't have had it when I was pregnant on her or it may be to do with the poking around from the internal scan yesterday.

I'm really hoping tomorrow is a better day and that my lovely sweet daughter is back :-(


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## Pippin

Awww hon it's understandable you had a melt down, YOU ARE ALLOWED!!!! :hug: Sam has hit that stage too so I do understand and I totally lose it sometimes too. I just tell Simon to get on with it and walk away. My hormones are the reason which I'm sure is the same for you with the added worry. Hope DH takes his words back, I'm sure it was heat of the moment stuff.

Re the pains I got loads of those at the start of my pregnancy I actually thought it was things stretching so maybe it's nothing to worry about, hope it's not anyway. Just think you are one day down already only 6 more to go :hug:


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## jelr

Sorry Pippin I must have worded that wrong - God no DH didn't say that - I said it to him - I totally felt like maybe this is why it keeps happening because I'm such a sh*ite mother and couldn't cope. God if DH said that even though that is the way I feel I would divorce him lol - No he was so full of understanding and kept telling me that I was the best mother he knows - bless him even though I had screamed at him.

Hopefully this is just a phase she is going through - she really did pick the wrong time - I can't even blame teeth as she has just broken through her 16th one so all that is left are the 2nd set of molars and they shouldn't come for a while. It probably is just hormones and the added stress that I lost it as I usually just try and ignore her when she is in a mood like that - although I must admit I do find those tantrums so frustrating and want to pull my hair out.

Yeah 1 day down and it went by quick enough - Natasha is my one saving grace this time as I reckon it will go by much quicker.


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## Pippin

Oppps sorry Jelr that's probably me reading to quick to be honest. Sorry what a wally I am :haha: You're not a crap mother hon just human!! I think we can all say we have had days like that pregnant or not.

Here's hoping for a swift day two for you I'm off to London for a girly day out so it'll be quick for me I reckon so I'll pass on some of the quickness to you too :hug:


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## cleckner04

Some positive news on my end!! My fertility monitor says I'm high fertility today!! :dance: So here's hoping I peak soon and have a longer luteal phase finally!!! :yipee: I'm gonna attach pictures so you girls can see. Today is CD14 for me. 

I also lost 1.4 lbs this week. :lol: I didn't do very good though. I skipped my hour cardio twice this week because I was just too tired and wanted to sleep instead. :dohh:


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## Pippin

cleckner04 said:


> Some positive news on my end!! My fertility monitor says I'm high fertility today!! :dance: So here's hoping I peak soon and have a longer luteal phase finally!!! :yipee: I'm gonna attach pictures so you girls can see. Today is CD14 for me.
> 
> I also lost 1.4 lbs this week. :lol: I didn't do very good though. I skipped my hour cardio twice this week because I was just too tired and wanted to sleep instead. :dohh:

:happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance: That looks such fun. Why didn't I get one when I was trying :haha: You peak the same day as me. I was always cd13 or 14 when the OPK came good. Well done on the lb you're going to be one hot Mama when C gets back.

*Jelr* another day down hon, how are you feeling?

*Shiv* hows the sickness hon? Any worse?

*Spidey* hope you are having fun with your brother. It is now isn't it? Hope AF is leaving you alone by now :hugs:


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## cleckner04

Well it's not peaked quite yet! Probably a few more days. It's just at a high right now so within my fertile period. It'll be one more bar and show an egg the day I'm gonna ovulate. :D I'm sure I'll take another picture to show when it peaks!! 

And thanks for the compliments about my weight loss! I'm finally starting to feel really good about it all. Like it's actually an attainable goal to get to pre-Emma weight before DH is back. Only 17.6 lbs to go for pre-Emma weight. :dance: 


How have you been lately? Have you bought any cute pink girly stuff yet?


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## jelr

Hey Girls

Sorry girls I just came in and hyjacked your thread with my doom and gloom and never even asked how any of you were. Thank a million for letting me come in and for being there for me - I was so lost the other evening and just couldn't get the words out to speak to anyone here and feel there is too many in the FB thread to have to share bad news with - hence why I hadn't posted when I got my BFP and it wouldn't be fair to discuss it in the Lion Cubs when we said we weren't discussing pregnancy or ttc. So thanks for letting me in.

Cleck: Well done on the weight loss I was just looking at your ticker - nearly 2stone altogether well done you - you can actually see it already in your photos - you look great. and yay for your dinky monitor saying high.

Pipp: Hope you had a lovely day in London.

Shiv: How are you feeling? Any more word on the job front. Have you any more symptoms.

Spidey: I hope AF is nearly gone or at least it is not sucking the life out of you - Hope you have a great weekend with your brother.

Well afm: Today has been much better - this morning I was convinced all was over alright because I was symptom spotting and comparing and driving myself mad during the night - but then decided to put it all out of my head and just concentrate on Natasha for the day and she was a totally different child today and back to herself - I think she was probably picking up on my mood yesterday and plus I probably wasn't giving her the attention she is used to as I was so busy staying busy and cleaning like a mad woman and the phone was hopping all day with close friends and family checking up on me. So today we had just a fun day - this morning we did loads of playing - I lay down when she went for snooze which I never do and it did me the world of good and after lunch we did some colouring and went and did the grocery shopping and she ran around the shop with my brother and had great fun and this evening DH turned on some music and we all danced around the sitting room like wallys (if anybody had of seen in our window they would have thought we were nuts lol) but she had such a ball and I think it actually did me the world of good to release some happy endorphins lol.

I also have been feeling a little queasy again and actually fancied and bought some custard when I was doing the shopping and I haven't craved custard since I was pregnant on Natasha and I had to make DH change his socks this evening as I could smell them all around the house lol - so I think they are all good pregnancy signs so fingers crossed.

So a good day was had by all and I feel like a much better mother today and also am not down on myself like yesterday and dont feel like I deserve this badness to be happening like I did yesterday.

I'm going to keep myself busy now for the night looking for bed clothes for Natasha's new room as she has been in the nursery until now so we are going to do up one of the spare rooms as it is much bigger this summer - DH is going to take out the bed and take up the floors this weekend. I have an idea in my head what I want for the bed clothes but haven't manage to find it yet - Well I have found similar but they are all over the 100 mark which is way too much for bed clothes that could possibly be thrown up on over the next few years lol


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## Pippin

Ahh I see even more exciting if we get an egg symbol as well how exciting, I definitely feel like I'm missing out. I'm loving the pictures so keep um coming daily till we get that egg. 

I'm good thanks, very jealous of your weight loss as mine seems to be piling on now. I put on three pounds only up until last week but I weighed myself yesterday after coming back from my Mum's and I think it's jumped to 6lb eeeek. I'm going to use breastfeeding as a spring board to lose it though after the birth so I'm not overly worried or stopping the chocolate I seem to eat everyday :haha: As for girly stuff. M Mum bough me this cute dress with matching tights and spotty top and I've bought this gorgeous handmade crochet dress in beige today at Spittlefields Market so cute. I'll take pictures when I have them out again. I also picked up a cot and bits today from my friend as she is having a clear out and couldn't turn down free things. I'm worried about having it in the house but I have nowhere else to put it.


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## Pippin

Jelr I posted and didn't refresh sorry hon. SOOOO glad to hear you had a better day and such a good idea to focus on the positive, especially that big ball of positive that is Natasha!! What will be will be hey say and no amount of worrying will change what will happen. I do like the sound of you symptoms though so that is good. I'm trying to lok for bedding too as we'll change our spare room into a shared bedroom for the two children. One side will have to be girly though or we'll go for a unisex theme. Not sure what to do yet but plenty of time to plan and that's more fun than doing it I find :haha:

Don't apologize for coming into the thread you nana always here for you and understand it's more intimate in here, although I do see the odd other August Mummy looking in here too but they never post which I find a bit odd as when I saw it I couldn't wait to join in :blush:.


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## cleckner04

jelr- I'm so glad you are feeling more positive. Sounds like you have plenty of great pregnancy symptoms!! :dance:

Pippin- I WISH breastfeeding helped me lose weight. :lol: It's actually held it on more I think. Because I literally only lost 5 lbs after Emma was born. :rofl: Don't feel jealous of me! You have a gorgeous baby girl on the way and that is SOOO much cooler. My DH is getting absolutely sick of me bothering him about me wanting another baby. :shy: Some weeks it's an obsession and it's only made worse by coming on here and seeing all the gorgeous scan piccies and tickers. Of course, DH being gone makes it worse too because it's something I really can't have. Well, I could probably try hitting on the fedex man or something. :muaha: 

And you definitely have to post pictures of all the baby stuff! Keep my obsession alive. :lol:


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## cleckner04

Oo I should look more often to see who's nosing in here. :lol:


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## jelr

ha ha I was probalby one of the ones that you would have seen nosing but I guess I never posted because we weren't ttc but I'm just too nosey and loved hearing how you were all getting on and then felt I couldn't run in and tell you all my news when It did happen - but I knew you would all be there for me this week and I do appreciate it very much.

Yeah I can't wait to have Natasha's room all done - The planning is fun too but then I love it being done also but that is probably because DH does all the work on that end ha ha so it is great to sit back and be foreman lol

Pippin: those clothes sound adorable - you will definitely have to post piccies.

Cleck you and Corey will be at it like rabbits when he gets back - obviously because you will have missed each other, but because you will want that baba and because he wont be able to keep his hands off you with your new sexy body lol - So na Id leave the fed ex man for another while lol

Mother of God there is a couple on the tv at the moment that have 10 children under 12 - eeek fair play to them eh?


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## cleckner04

Wow!! I could never have that many kids. Actually after spending a ton of time with my friend that has 3, I think 3 might be my max. :rofl: It was just enough craziness without being overboard if that makes sense. :haha: I think 4 would tip the scales to insanity. 10 is unimaginable. :shock:


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## jelr

yeah I would agree - I always said 3 would be my maximum but I actually think we will probably stick at 2 because the economy is so really bad here as in we are in the middle of a bail out from the IMF that nobody's job is safe so I will have to stay working in case anything happens to DH's job so I dont think with working that I would manage any more than 2 to give them proper time and attention if that makes sense.

Yep I'm the eldest of 7 and that was mental enough but imagine 10 and number 11 is due in June - that house must be nuts and I know from my own experience the older ones end up rearing the younger ones which is not really fair on the older ones - she must have been pregnant nearly ever year - she must not get bad ms lol


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## spidey

Jelr- I'm glad you had a good day! Having a good laugh and a day of smiles is wonderful :thumbup: I take daytime naps with Kira alot and it always re-energizes me for the rest of the day. And don't feel bad about posting bad news! :hugs:

Cleckner- soooo cool!!! I might have to buy one if I'm not pregnant by the summer so we can both be hard core TTC buddies together, LOL!

For me, BF is a great way to lose weight. I know it's extremely annoying for me to say this, but I actually lose too much weight and every week or so need to go on a dessert binge to get some pounds back on. I'll miss it when Kira decides to wean.

My brother came out Wednesday night so we've been having lots of fun :happydance: Kira loves the extra attention too! Only 2 1/2 more days and he leaves.. it's too bad his trips here can't be longer and more frequent. 

Oh, and I am jinxing myself to get pregnant! I bought a jumbo sized box of maxi pads AND I bought lots of new clothes since we went to the mall today! I'm pretty certain that I'm going to be pregnant this cycle :haha:


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## cleckner04

Spidey- Well, you already know I hate you for being so skinny. :rofl: Some women have it really lucky though. My mom is a plus size woman as well so it's in the genes. I'm trying to fight against those genes though!! 

:rofl: @ you jinxing yourself. Do you think if I did that, I would suddenly be pregnant too? Like the virgin mary? :rofl:


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## Shiv

AH nice and chatty in here, lets see what i can remember!

Cleck - i love your gadget, so what are the 9 and 14 out of? As in 14/20??? You are doing so well on your weightloss and it is so within your grasp to be pre-Emma weight before Corey returns. I look forward to seeing the next set of photos of you in jogging bottoms and bra!

Jelr - glad you had a better day, it sounds like fun dancing round with Natasha and Jim. And yay for Jim's stinky socks :haha:

Pippin - I think 6lbs in 19 weeks is good going, I am pretty sure by that stage with Sophia I had put on about 12 lbs! Baby girl clothes are really cute! When will you put new baby into the same room as Sam? Will you make usrethe new baby is sleeping through first?

Spidey - glad you are having fun with your brother. I am imagining your house with a spare room full to the ceiling with boxes of pads! I do hope you have jinxed yourself!

As for me, well my symptoms seem to have pretty much disappeared (since i had that bug last weekend) which is a bit worrying, but there is nothing I can do until the next scan so I am going to try not to worry about it. I am at present weaning myself back on to sweets and chocolate, it is hard as at first I really didn't fancy them, but I am persevering and managing to get a fair few down me daily :haha:

I found with breastfeeding, i didn't have any dramatic weightloss, but i did manage to get down to pre-preg weight without too much effort which considering my chocolate consumption must have been down to breastfeeding. I am scared to think about breastfeeding new baby as I had such issues to start off with (the whole eating nipple off thing) that it scares me think I might not manage it next time, and I really want to breastfeed.

SO that is all I can remember, I hope you are all having a nice weekend, Sophia was at my parents for the night last night, so we went out to dinner with some friends and will go and pick her up soon. I do enjoy a night off I must admit!


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## Pippin

Ohhh lots to talk about. Cleck hon you are going to be at it like bunnies with that super hot body you are sculpting right now. I've attached the little dress I bought for you to see, it's more of a warm gold colour in real life but it's hand crocheted and heavy weight cotton which is fab for winter time. I thought a nice pair of tights and shoes it'll look really sweet. ONly cos £18 which I thought was good for something hand made.

Jelr.... another day down :yipee:

Shiv, with Sam I felt fine most of the time. It was a week off and week on regarding the sickness so I bet you'll get it back soon. All stopped at 11 weeks after getting less and less from 8 weeks on. Don't worry hon.

Spidey I hope this is your month hon I really do. I'll let you into a secret, for this pregnancy I bought a load of towels to last 2 month and before the one I lost I bought 4 boxes of tampax!!! So I always see as stocking up as a good sign of a positive month :haha:
 



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## jelr

Spidey: Glad you had fun with your brother - 1 of my brothers lives in London and I miss him like crazy too and wish I got to see him more but we do have great fun when he is home. Yep I reckon stocking up with definitely jinx you into being pregnant - I spent a fortune on lowcarb foods the week before I got pregnant this time and had to give them all away as I couldn't start the diet and I also gave away a huge big bag full of smaller size nappies. So fingers crossed for you - lmao at shivs comment with your spare room full to the ceiling with pads.

Shiv: I know my situation is nothing to go on at the moment but my symptoms were all gone at the start of this week too and are back in full force the last few days - so hopefully all is well and it is just things easing out as you get closer to finishing 1st tri. I reckon you will definitely be able to breast feed, I know you had issues at the start last time but look how long you managed to do it for, and I have heard you help and give advice to other august mummies - you will be an expert this time and will fly through it.

Pippin: Yep another day over with and I'm still feeling positive so it is all good. - that dress is adorable, girly stuff is so cute - I will probably end up with our attic overflowing as there are so many of Natasha's cute dresses that I know I will never give away lol.

Cleck: Well what number is your monitor at today. Have you told Corey all the weight you have lost or are you going to surprise him.

Well another good day here - I have battled with arthritis since I was 19 years of age and really really hate it so I never thought I would see this day come, but it is majorly flaring up today and my hands are even swelling and I'm delighted as it another pregnancy symptom for me - so fingers crossed.

We also kept busy today and went to the nearest city that is about an hour away and looked for bed clothes for Natashas new room and no luck - DH reckons they haven't made what I'm looking for lol - I want to do one of the walls a deep pink so I want more colourful bedclothes with pastel, pinks, yellows and greens and would love either flowers or butterflies so it is girly but not over kill on the pink and I can't seem to find them anywhere in a double size as we have a double bed in that room so when she is ready to move from the toddler bed we are going to put her in the double as there is no point in getting rid of it and she will have more room - Although it is keeping me really occupied trying to find something which is great to have something to focus on at the moment.


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## cleckner04

Pip- Cute dress!! :dance: I really like that. Keep the piccies coming! :D

jelr- I'm glad you had another good day! :hugs: Today was CD 15. And yes I've told DH about my weightloss. He is able to see the pictures I post on facebook too so he's seen me as well. He's already sent an email saying OMG look how skinny your neck looks. :rofl::rofl: He's only seen the pictures from my chest up because it's not like I can take good full body shots all by myself. :haha:


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## spidey

lets see if I remember everything I want to say!

I love the dress Pippin :happydance: Dresses are so fun to buy!!

Shiv- symptoms are supposed to come and go, so don't let it worry you. From the sounds of it, I'm guessing you're still having some symptoms since you're not diving right back into eating chocolate again! I'm certain that you will be a pro at bf this baby. You'll know what to expect and how to do the proper latch and all, so it won't be nearly as hard.

jelr- fingers still crossed for you! Your symptoms sound promising and I'm glad you're finding things to keep you busy :thumbup:

Cleckner- Corey will be amazed to see you in person... pictures can't capture it all! In my family it seems that every other generation struggles with weight. My mom is plus sized, but my grandma was skinny, and my great grandma was plus sized. My mom eats much less than me but she can't keep the weight off- genetics is a real bitch sometimes.

Last night I was really doubting my decision to TTC. I think because I'm having so much fun doing the non-baby thing these last few days that the thought of having a super needy newborn is scary. I also have some really nice clothes now- I actually spent real money on them rather than shopping at walmart AND I have a nice flat tummy again. I also ordered my vegetable garden seeds and I have plans to grow a nice garden this year. For the last 2 years I've been too pregnant or too busy caring for Kira to garden. I LOVE to garden and if I get pregnant soon I'll be having m/s and unable to move! AHHHHHHH! Yeah, I had a major freak out!! :haha: I think I'll be okay once my brother leaves and my life goes back to being boring!


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## Shiv

Spidey - I know how you feel with regards to TTC, I felt as if my life was kind of resuming to some sort of normality (allbeit a new normal that involves my world happily revolving around Sophia). I was happy to leave her overnight with my parents so was getting out with my friends maybe once a month (or two) etc - but then I figured what is another 2 years in the scheme of things?!?!? The last 2 yeasr has flown by pretty quick, so I guess the next 2 will, although it might be a bot more tricky getting a babysitter for 2 kids instead of 1!! So what clothes did you buy?

Cleck - Corey is gonna be so proud of your weightloss when he gets home :hugs:

Pippin- that dress is very beautiful.

JELR - glad you are managing to keep busy, that is 3 and half days down now - half way!


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## Pippin

I did some more shopping today and it felt GOOD :haha: I'm still looking at them. I've posted images in the TTC/Pregnancy FB thread save posting them again (it's so slow in here).

Have read all your posts but pregnant brain means I can't remember what to answer too so hugs to you all :hugs: Hope you are all well and dandy today.


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## cleckner04

Well my monitor is still showing High so I hope I peak soon! I'm on CD 16 today. :wacko: 

Pippin- Shopping ALWAYS feels good. :D


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## Shiv

Cleck - did youpeak yet??????

Jean - How are you doing?

Spidey - hope you had fun for the rest of your brother's stay?

Pip - the little girl clothes you got are lovely - what size are you buying?

As for me, a rubbish few days here. We had to take Sophia into th eemergency docs on Saturday as she had a crazy high temp (39.8 degrees C - that's 103.6 degrees F for you U.S ladies). Turns out she has tonsillitis, so she is on antibiotics. But she is swinging between seeming fine and being distraught, curling up into a ball and screaming and not letting me anywhere near her :cry: I hope she feels better soon. this is also the second week on the run that we have had to avoid any other children as she is contagious, i am seriously struggling to entertain her at home now!

Anyway moan over - I am definitely back on chocolate full time again now , i popped to the shop to get Sophia some balckberries (it is all she has eaten for the past 3 days) and there were so many yummy offers on so I got loads of treats :blush:


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## Pippin

Awww poor Sophia hope she feels better soon Shiv. I hate it when they are ill especially when they can't tell you what is wrong :(

As for the clothes I'm buying a mixture but the baby grows are Newborn size so she has something to come home in. With Sam we only took 0-3 as we were told he'd be big but they swamped him and it looked ridiculous. The dresses etc are 6-9 as it fits with the seasons. The handmade dress has no size so just going to try it and see.

Jelr, another day down :yipee: Hope you are ok.

Everyone else :hi:


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## cleckner04

No peak yet! :wacko: But the lines on the actual test look like they are getting close to the same color so hopefully soon. I am just praying to have a long luteal phase this time. 

Shiv- So sorry she's feeling so rotten. :( :hugs: That must be awful. I hope she starts feeling better soon. :flower:


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## spidey

I'm getting out of my funk, LOL. I tried talking to DH about my concerns of having another baby, and his response was "I'll go get a vasectomy now!" NOOOO!! :haha: After thinking about it I decided that the next baby will have no choice but to fit into our current lifestyle. It won't be nearly as hard with a second one, and I think a second baby will be ignored more which might be a good thing. 

My brother's plane took off already, so tomorrow I go back to work. I also need to start taking :sex: a little more seriously this week incase this cycle is 28 days. Today is cd 11

Shiv- I'm sorry to hear about Sophia. Poor thing :cry: It's so sad that she curls into a ball and doesn't want to be touched. I hope she feels better tomorrow and you can get out of the house soon! 

Pippin- I'm heading to FB now to see what I've missed. I love looking at cute baby outfits :happydance:


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## jelr

Hey girls just a very quick run in as I'm only on the laptop for a couple of minutes just to set up an out off office for my work email.

I'm afraid it is all over - went for a nap at lunch time when Natasha was napping as I was really uncomfortable and bloated last night and hadn't slept and when i got up and went to the loo there was blood when I wiped.

DH was half ways up the country so he had headed home as soon as I phoned him and my mam came over as I was hysterical - I phoned the Early Pregnancy Unit and left a message as nobody answered and was just about to ring maternity after an hour of waiting when they phoned me back and they said to come in to A&E as there was nobody on duty in the EPU for the afternoon.

So went into A&E and the gyne SHO took me up the the Early Pregnancy Unit and she had no idea how to use the bloody machine - eventually she was talking about bringing me back for another appointment (good job she didn't or I would have screamed blue murder in the hospital for somebody that knew what they there were doing to see me) but eventually she phoned the gyne registrar who scanned me and explained that it wasn't good news as the baby still has not grown, she said that she is not worried about no HB as the baby is still measuring to small to find it and that she is not completely ruling it out as sometimes measurements can differ with different people scanning but that with the spotting she is not hopeful.

So I was sent home and told that hopefully it will happen naturally at home but that if the bleeding gets too much to come straight in or if not I have an appointment next Monday to be scanned again and then they will arrange a d&c if necessary - they are also holding my appointment for Wednesday open in case bleeding or pain becomes too much in the meantime that I can be seen quicker rather than having to go in through A&E again.

Have some cramping now and have had a few small clots.

I am absolutely devastated as I had myself convinced that everything was going to be okay, I'm not religious but I do think there is something there and it is my grans anniversary of her death tomorrow and my nanas next Sunday so I had stupidly convinced myself that they were both going to mind this baby and that everything would be okay.

I just can't believe this is happening us again and it is not straight forward again with all the waiting around. I honestly just can't get my head around the reasoning of it at all - we weren't even trying and tried for so long on Natasha and 1 accident out of DTD every week or even twice in the week in the last 10 years and I end up pregnant and then it is taken away. I mean why give us a baby that we didn't even expect and for us to start loving with all our hearts to take it all away again. It is just so cruel.

Sorry I know this is a totally selfish post and will come back in tomorrow to catch up properly when my head is clearer. Thanks for all your support girls. xx


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## cleckner04

Oh no!! :cry: I am sat here in tears for you. :(:(:hugs::hugs: I'm so sorry hun. Nothing I say will help right now but I really wish I could give you real hugs right now and tell you that it will all be okay. It will be hun. I just know it. :flower::hugs:


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## Shiv

Oh Jean I am SO SO sorry it has turned out this way, I was hoping with all my heart for a positive outcome. I know nothing I can say will make you feel any better, but I am thinking of you and Jim all the time. Life is cruel and i think if I did believe in a God then this sort of thing would definitely try my faith. I hope things happen quickly for you now if that is what is best and that you and Jim can heal quickly together. Hold on tight to your lovely Natasha as she is the biggest healing power in your world. Big big hugs lovely :hugs: 

Oh and never worry about a self indulgent post - we all make them and nobody minds :hugs:


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## spidey

jelr- I'm so sorry :cry: I was really rooting for everything to be okay :hugs: I hope you're okay today- let us know how you're doing. It's hard to keep positive, but try to have faith that everything will work out in the end. Also trust your body because it knows what to do and what is best. :hugs:


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## Pippin

Awww Jelr I was so hoping we weren't going to read a post like that I am so so so sorry :cry: :hug: I know nothing I can say will help right now having been there but I'm always here if you want to talk, scream, shout whatever. In the nicest way I hope it happens quickly for you and won't be a long drawn out process. I thought I'd never get pregnant again after my mmc but here I am so I know it'll happen for you again when it's the right time. Give lots of cuddles to that wonderful daughter and husband of yours and take time to grieve and rest :hugs: :hug:


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## cleckner04

How are you feeling today jelr? Thinking of you hun. :hugs:


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## cleckner04

In TTC news, I peaked today! :dance: Today is CD 18. I need to go read how long my luteal phase has to be because I forget. At least 10 days right? I hope it's 12 days long though at least. Here's a photo of my lovely peaked monitor!! :haha:


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## Shiv

Whoop for peaking Cleck - must be a relief to know for sure that you are ovulating, and yeah I think it is a luteal phase of at least 10 days you are looking for.

Jean honey, i am thinking of you :hugs:


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## Pippin

Yay Cleckner that's a nice bit of news. Bet you were excited to see that. You do need a lp of 10 days. I've always had 10 day lp and got pregnant fine. I had 9 once but after taking vit b50 (I think) it lengthed to 11 from memory. X

Jean hope you are holding up hon. Xxx


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## cleckner04

So I am cramping right now! :shock: Does that mean I'm ovulating at this very second? A peak monitor and cramping! Thats so cool!! :haha: I'm totally excited in a stupid kind of way.


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## spidey

ooooo! Cleckner- wouldn't it be something if you're feeling yourself ovulate!! So cool!!! When I feel a random cramp I always wonder if I'm ovulating :haha:


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## cleckner04

The cramping lasted about half an hour!! I think it could've actually been ovulation! How weird! I never put 2 and 2 together like that before. I do get random cramping every month. :rofl: And oddly enough, I actually noticed creamy CM last night when wiping. :shock: If I'm not careful this could become obsessive. :rofl:


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## spidey

oh wow! It's all so textbook! Do you know the exact number of days before AF arrives? Would it be exactly 14 days from now? When my nipples start to get sensitive I have 14 days until AF arrives. One day I'll get myself one of those monitors and I'll be able to show that nipple pain= ovulation to prove my theory right :haha:


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## cleckner04

:rofl: I have no clue when AF will arrive. They are so random. We'll see!! 

I looked up luteal phases and it's really supposed to be over 12 days. :wacko: I guess some doctors consider it a problem if it's under 12. But you need 10 for the egg to implant. So I'm hoping I have at least a 12 day luteal phase. :D


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## Pippin

Sounds like you felt it Cleck :yipee: I haven't felt ovulation but I've felt implantation for all three pregnancies :wacko: a fluttering like spasm sensation about 7-9 dpo lasts about a minute. Then I get boobs hurting bang on two days later then the positive test..... I find that very weird :wacko:


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## Shiv

sounds like you felt ovulation Cleck - for me it feels like mild AF cramps for about half an hour! hurrah!

Still thinking of you Jean :hugs:


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## cleckner04

That's what it felt like Shiv! Like slight AF cramps. :D

Well oddly enough, I got another peak today! :wacko: I don't know what that means. I thought I'd only get it a day and than it'd disappear. :shrug: 

Also, I'm REALLY struggling this week with weightloss. I'm nearly ready to just give up. :( I have gained a lb. this week and the only thing different I've done was ADD exercise in. :wacko: I'm doing 20 minutes on the elliptical and than 60 minutes on the exercise bike. Plus my daily walk. But I'm gaining. So I don't know if it's new muscles or what but I'm really frustrated by it. Another thing I changed was I tried to work out during Emma's nap again. Because I'm sick of staying up so late doing it. But the day I worked out during the nap instead of at night, I gained TWO lbs overnight. :cry: :cry: So I think I might start over fresh next week and completely wipe the slate clean with a new start weight and the same goal but maybe the fresh start will get my mind back into the game.


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## Shiv

Cleck, do I remember you saying you skipped some work outs LAST week? I general I find that it tells on the scales a week after you have been naughty, so it might just be that, and next week the scales will go down again because of the extra exercise? Also it could be muscle gain (you must be getting nice and toned), have you considered measuring yourself with a tape measure once a week, as that will show your changing body shape even if the scales are not being kind?


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## cleckner04

Yeah I skipped exercising 2 days last week. I haven't been measuring myself at all. Maybe I will start. I have to find my sewers measuring tape first. It is just so frustrating sometimes. It's coming off so slow which is fine but I wanted to be down to 200 before DH gets back. I don't think that'll be possible. Honestly if I could lose just 15 more before he's back I'll be satisfied. My mind just isn't in it the past few days. Although I've been forcing my self to workout extra hard. It is even worse when I read journals on here and those girls are losing like 5 lbs a WEEK! :shock: There is no way I could do that. For one I'm not doing extreme diets. Although stupidly I've been considering doing a detox of sorts but I doubt that'd be good for my milk supply...

And I'm a jumble of rants today..:lol:


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## Shiv

Cleck -losing 1 to 2 lbs a week is not slow weightloss, it is recommended weightloss. Sure you could lose 5 lbs a week by only eating cabbage but as soon as you ate normally again it would come back on. You are doing things completely the RIGHT way. From what I can remember you still have 4 months until Corey is back, and 20lbs in the time frame is REALLY do-able, even if you have a couple of slack weeks you still have plenty of time left. Perhaps you need to take a couple of days off to recoup and then get back on it. It can be so easy to get into an exercise rut, maybe try something different, an exercise dvd perhaps for a few days just to "liven" things up. Your body can get used to certain exercises and you need to shock it by doing something different.

But most of all please do not beat yourself up, I truly believe that the way your are doing things is the right way and you have been consistently losing, crash diets are effective in the short term but not in the long term. I am really proud of you for sticking to your exercise regime and continuing to lose weight, i know I couldn't do it (and I have tried!).


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## cleckner04

Thank you hun!! I think I need a good kick in the ass sometimes. :lol: I'll try a dvd tonight and see if it can get me out of my funk. I have 2 dance workout dvds that I've never even tried. 

The girls in my weightloss group on here are lovely but this past week they are all like 'well I haven't lost this week but at least I'm not GAINING!'...And I don't comment because I actually am gaining this week. :cry: I know they aren't trying to be insensitive but its like poking me with a stick while I'm already down. :haha: 

Thanks so much for the pep talk. :hugs: I think I'll start measuring myself because maybe I wouldn't be so down if I saw inches dropping.


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## Shiv

oh and Cleck don't worry about gaining throughout the week - you just need to have a big poo! Maybe you need to start limiting yourself to just weighing yourself once a week?


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## cleckner04

I know but than I worry I'll be gaining all week and not know it. :rofl: So if I gain I work out overtime trying to make up for it. :blush:

And I do need a good poo. :rofl::rofl: It's been a while since I had a good one. I think I'm all backed up in there.


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## Shiv

Well there's your extra weight, no amount of exercise is gonna shift that :haha: get yourself some prunes:haha:


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## spidey

Cleckner, I think you're losing weight the perfect way. All those people who lose 5 pounds a week either started out at 400 pounds or they're doing it wrong. I use to get a good work out doing a belly dancing dvd- I wonder if netflix carries those. Do you exercise after Emma goes to bed? 

I am the poo expert because of Kira, and you should eat some sunflower seeds along with those prunes :haha:

I decided to really jinx myself into getting pregnant this month and I finally got myself some new bras! My boobs are back to their normal small size so my C cup bras were much too large. Now I have 3 pretty new bra's and they're not nursing bras either! My boobs are small enough that I really don't need nursing bras (or bras) :haha:


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## jelr

Hey girlls

thank you so much for all your lovely comments - Sorry I was MIA but on Tuesday I went into a total hole of depression and couldn't face anything or anyone - my mam had taken Natasha for the night so we spent the day over there in case the bleeding got heavy as we decided it was best for DH to go to work so as he could take time off if I needed the hospital and I couldn't even interact with my own family or Natasha. It was horriblle as I was just stuck in my own head and kept blaming myself and woindering why we had to go through this a second time.

But on Monday night I spent all night crying and cryed myself to sleep on DH chest and really gave my self a kick in the bum and decided I had two choices and that was to go completely under this where my daughter would suffer or try and get on with it so I took the decision that my daugher and DH need me so I have to try and get on with it so yesterday I was was starting to feel some way human again. I'm still hurting like crazy and feel really in limbo land as Its still only spotting when I wipe so I think we will be probably still sitting here next Monday until the next scan is done before anything happens but for the moment I am just focusing on the precious little one I already have - 3 years ago when this happened before I didn't even think I would ever have children and I do have the most beautiful daughter ever and a wonderful husband and great family and friends so that is going to be my focus and i will come through this. 

I think I'm also going to ask to be referred back to gyne as it must be my pcos causing this as I know it increase the risk of mc and I feel 2 of them is a bit of a pattern - so I'm going to see if there is anything they can do to help. I dont know if there is or not but it is worth a try as I honestly dont have the strength to go through this again. I dont know how other women do it 4 and 5 times and poor Booth even with 3.

Unfortunately we were been blown out of the water with some more bad news yesterday as DH has been put on temporary lay off effective immediately which is a load of sh*te really as it means he can't look for work and wont get redundancy so had to go down to the social this morning to sign on for benefits which he has never had to do in his life. His boss will have to make him redundant in 4 weeks time if he still doesn't have work for him but it is looking like his boss can't even afford to pay redundancy so it will probably have to come from the state which will take a year. It is just the worst time for this to come and I feel so sorry for DH as I couldn't even go with him today as I'm still housebound in case I start to hemorrhage (my mam had a mc at 9 weeks and it soaked through her clothes and everything so I can't chance it) and I know it is killing him as he is really proud and a real mans man and needs to be the provider - so at the minute we are kinda screwed because I am also out of work until d&c and all is done - I think I might be paid though but wont know until the end of the month.

I think I'm still in shock as I haven't even got upset about it - I actually laughed and said what the hell else can happen this week - I think if I dont laugh I will have a melt down.

On the up side DH reckons he will get a job no problem even though jobs are really scarce here but he is the best in his business and has 11 years experience and has had offers in the past but has never taken them because of loyalty. I'm so angry with his boss though - he knew what was going on with me as DH had to leave work the other day to meet me in the hospital and he hasn't even asked how we got on or even given any of them any notice - there is sill loads of work in his business and he has basically ran it into the ground because he got too greedy and moved to a new premises two years ago which cost him 7 million and he has also spent another million on his own house in the last year - so you can see where the cash flow has gone. DH has made them millions over the years and only ever had 2 days sick and 2 days when I MC before off in 11 years - he even had to go back early from his time off after Natasha was born because they were stuck.

Anyway enough about me - Shiv: I really hope Sophia is better the poor little mite - that must have been heartbreaking when she wouldn't let you touch her when she was in pain. No wonder she wasn't eating her dinner she probably wasn't able to with her throat.

Cleck: Yay on the monitor peaking - Dont you dare put yourself down for the weight - you are doing brilliantly, I am a bitch for fad dieting and it does go quickly for me but I have to work at it constantly to keep it off from doing it so you are doing it the right way. I hold my hat off to you as I wouldn't have the patience and it will stand to you because you wont pile it back on quickly. Just wondering the last time you put up a bit was it roughly when you were Ovulating too - the reason I ask is for years I have stood on the scales obsessively every day and from doing that realised that half way through my cycle I carry about 3lbs extra for 3-4 days so I reckon it is water retention when I ovulate - if it is it means it should drop back to normal in a few days and it is not actually a gain. I reckon you will definitely get those 15lbs off before DH gets back.

Pippin: Yay for shopping - sounds like you got loads of lovely stuff - I just saw on FB too that you have your scan soon - Best of luck with it, you time is flying by.

Spidey: Glad you are over your ttc wobble - I think it is totally understandable and we all have wobbles from time to time as we know how hard it is with a new baby but I totally agree with Shiv - think of how fast the last 2 years has gone and it will go even quicker with two LO's and you will be back to doing bits for yourself but will have the lovely joy of two LO's. Yay for all the jinking with new bras and pads - this month will definitely be yours I hope.


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## spidey

jelr- This has been such a crappy week for you :hugs: Perhaps you'll get all the bad luck out of the way and the rest of the year will be nothing but good times. It's a good thing to let yourself grieve, so you shouldn't feel bad about taking some time to cry and be sad :hugs: Do you think you'll start actively trying for another baby now? I'm sorry about your DH and his job. Thats awful his boss has been so greedy and hasn't given any concern about his employees.


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## cleckner04

jelr- Oh hun that's awful! I can't believe they won't even pay your dh. :( :hugs: And you being depressed. Honestly days like that are the only way to get by. You gotta cry sometimes to get it out of there. You are so amazing and you'll pull through this. You already sound like you are by being resolved to be strong for Natasha. 

I'm really not sure but I think you may be right and I put some pounds on at the same time last month. :shrug: I don't keep track really so I can't tell you exactly when I did but I did have trouble last month for a week too. 

I gained another pound overnight. :cry: I have a feeling part of this is because I switched my workout to emma's naptime instead of her bedtime. So I've been going to bed a bit earlier but last week when I lost over 2 lbs. I was napping with Emma during the day and working out around 11PM at night. :wacko: So that's the main change that I did this week.


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## Shiv

jelr - that is so rubbish about Jim's job (I think God must have misunderstood my bargain, as he has completely f*cked up this time :winkwink:). Is Jim a carpenter (or have I completely made that up?) I think good tradesmen will always find work because there are so many dodgy ones out there, people always look for the good ones. I really hope he gets sorted soon as I know how stressful it is.
I think you are being really brave and strong for Natasha, but do remember as Spidey said that is ok to be upset, you are not superwoman.

Spidey, how are you boobs in comparison to before you got pregnant, condition wise? Mine are terrible, they stayed a bit bigger (I was a A/B cup and I am C cup now) but they are just so saggy and they have stretchmarks all over them and just feek very empty. I certainly don't blame breastfeeding, I blame the fact that they grew from an A/B cup to a DD in the space of a week when I got pregnant, they didn't stand a chance really:cry:

Cleck, in theory it shouldn't really matter when you exercise as it should be as simple as Calories in - calories out and all that. But you never know, I guess it could make a difference as you are eating after your work out instead of before. I'd give it a week or so to balance out. But know that if you aren't eating any more than normal, and you are exercising as much (if not more) then it will right itself, it is probably just your cycle etc

As for me, well not much to report here. Sophia is feeling much brighter, she is tantruming SO badly though. It's like I have to tiptoe around her, if I try to take her upstairs to get dressed she goes off on one, if I try to bring her downstairs again, she goes off on one! I just don't know what to do with her!


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## jelr

Thanks girls - Oh dont worry I'm still crying at the drop of a hat, I'm trying not to do it in front of Natasha though. although I haven't done much today but then I haven't really had time to think or feel anything with all the sorting things out for DH. It's more the way I was the other day was not good - I could feel myself slipping into a mad depression that I just didn't want to see or speak to anybody not even my poor baby and I really felt like staying in bed and hiding from the world and it was that that I decided to either go under or pull myself back up for Natasha and so far it is working, mind you I have a funny feeling I will probably fall apart for a day or two after the scan next week and again after the d&c - but I just keep telling myself we got through it the last time and will manage this time and at least this time we have our precious little woman too.

Spidey: I'm in two minds on the ttc - one minute I think we will try straight away as I know being pregnant definitely helped with the grief for both of us the last time and I know they say you are definitely more fertile after a mc or pregnancy so I'm thinking maybe it would be best to go ahead and I hopefully wont have much trouble getting pregnant. Then on the other hand I'm thinking well maybe fertility is not a problem for me anymore seeing as I got pregnant with no trying at all, but I'm thinking maybe we should wait and get referred back to gyne again to see if my hormones and the pcos is totally out of whack and if there is anything they can do to prevent another mc and also I'm thinking maybe we should wait and see how things fair out with our financial situation at the moment. At the moment I think I'm swaying towards waiting until I can be seen in the hospital (which knowing our healthcare could take 3-6 months) as I honestly dont feel like I would have the strenght to have my heart broken like this again, but then i might feel totally different after the d&c is done and may not be able to think about anything else only having another baby like the last time - so for the moment I think it is just take each day and see how we go.

Cleck: I know I can't believe it myself - DH's boss is really greedy man and doesn't seem to care about anybody or thing only himself and making sure him and his family are okay. I definitely think it is water retention from ovulation because changing the time of your exercise should not make that much of a difference and especially when you put on another lb overnight - did you drop the weight you put up the last time after a few days - thats what happens with me - this extra 3 to 5 lbs just comes out of know where and goes again after a few days - at least now with your monitor you will know exactly when you are ovulating and see if you are having trouble again next month.

Shiv: Yep the man above definitely f*cked up your bargain and mine and everyone else rooting for us this week unfortunately. No you definitely plucked a carpenter out of know where lol - DH is an insulation sales and technical rep / manager - but he would sell sand to the arabs and knows the technical side of it inside out after being at it 11 years. We are hopeful as insulation is one of the only areas of construction over here that is booming as the goverment have grants available to everyone to get it done to try and bring down the countries emissions costs and the mad thing is DH's company are one of the biggest insulation companies in the entire country but because of pure greed and bad managment there are in trouble as DH has been making them plenty of money still. So hopefully that will all stand to him and if not he is the type of man who could turn his hand to anything - he does make furniture and that for the house and built our sun room himself so hopefully he will get something - but then we are still in really scary times over here and have a new goverment and the country is still basically bankrupt so there are not many jobs going going to begin with. Is there anything looking promising for David yet?

Not much news with me, Natasha has been a dream this week thank god as like you Shiv we were getting loads of tantrums for weeks so I think they are just going to go through phases of it over the next few months or years or for the rest of their lives lol - Aw no I hoping any of the phases will be short lived. I feel so sorry for DH as I know by his whole demeanor today that he is lost. Even though he hasn't enjoyed working there for the last few years, It really an end of era for him and it will be a big change after 11 years and it was where we met as I worked in the office there before I went and got my qualifications for adult ed. I just wish his boss had completely made him redundant when we all know that is what he is going to have to do in 4 weeks time, but by putting him on this short term lay off it means he can't look for another job as he would lose his redundancy and notice entitlement and that would be worth about 26 weeks full pay. We reckon it is probably because his boss is going to file for bankrupsy and doesn't want to be liable to pay the redundancy himself as basically he doesn't the money to pay them all redudancy and that way the state will have to pay it. It will take about 12 months once the stage have to pay it but at least if we are running into trouble with the mortgage if Dh doesn't get a job or gets a lower paid one that we will have something to fall back on eventually. 

It just makes Dh situation so much harder with not being able to look for work and I would say he has never been not working for this long in his life so I reckon he will definitely go a little stir crazy also. He is looking around the house for things to do already today.

Anyway enough waffling - I honestly can't thank you all enough for all your support over the last fews weeks and want you to know you are a fantastic bunch. :hug:


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## Pippin

What a really shit time you are having Jelr and I'm so sorry hon. Not much I can say but keeping you in my thoughts. I've been thinking of you lots and lots over the last few days. Really hope DH gets the work sorted and what a bad time hey. I think you're allowed to have a few melting moments :hugs: I hope things start looking up soon for you. x


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## jelr

Thanks Pippin - I'm just taking each day as it comes at the moment and hopefully that way I'll get through it. 

I can't belive you are going for your 20 weeks scan already - that time has flown. Sorry i didn't comment on the fb group - I'm just keeping a low profile at the moment and actually stayed away from all internet for a couple of days as I couldn't even face that. I'm fine in here as you all know but still can't face much on fb - I am reading but can't manage to get comments out to anyone in the group or even in my friends list. Just feels weird to be on fb and acting normal and talking normal when I'm my heart is breaking so much if that makes sense, but I'll get there. 

Anyway I'm commenting here instead and am delighted for you that you get to see that beautiful pink bump again - Enjoy. Xx


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## spidey

Shiv- my boobs aren't bad. I had almost no boobs and then they grew to a small C when my milk came in. I actually had some cleavage for a few months, LOL. They've gotten smaller to a B cup now, but still bigger than the A cup that I use to have. I suppose they may shrink up more once I stop BF, so we'll see. They feel quite nice still and aren't droopy- but thats because boobs are a new thing for me so they haven't had time to droop yet :haha: The only weird thing is I have droopy nipples now :rofl:

Pippin- good luck on your scan :happydance:

Cleckner- stop weighing yourself for a week because you're just having weird fluctuations! It could be water retention, poop or increased muscle mass, so hide the scale for a few days!!! You might stay a few pounds heavier until AF comes since you're on the last half of your cycle now. You're doing great on your diet so far so I hate to see you get frustrated :hugs:

jelr- I'm sure you'll have lots of ups and downs during the next few weeks :hugs: You have lots of hormones running thru your body too, so that will make it even easier to cry. I can understand not wanting to be hurt again so it'll be a tough decision whether or not to TTC :hugs: but I think you should go with your heart


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## cleckner04

You girls were right!!! It was me ovulating that caused the gain! Today I am back down to 'low' readings and the weight is GONE!! I even lost 0.2 lbs! Which isn't much but yesterday I thought I had gained so this is awesome! :lol: 

I'm sorry I was a total moany annoying person yesterday! I hate being like that. :wacko: But I'm all better and plan on kicking ass this week. :dance:


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## Pippin

jelr said:


> Thanks Pippin - I'm just taking each day as it comes at the moment and hopefully that way I'll get through it.
> 
> I can't belive you are going for your 20 weeks scan already - that time has flown. Sorry i didn't comment on the fb group - I'm just keeping a low profile at the moment and actually stayed away from all internet for a couple of days as I couldn't even face that. I'm fine in here as you all know but still can't face much on fb - I am reading but can't manage to get comments out to anyone in the group or even in my friends list. Just feels weird to be on fb and acting normal and talking normal when I'm my heart is breaking so much if that makes sense, but I'll get there.
> 
> Anyway I'm commenting here instead and am delighted for you that you get to see that beautiful pink bump again - Enjoy. Xx

So totally understand hon I was the same back in summer. I eventually found it much easier to talk about it, I think it helped me get to terms with it quicker if you know what I mean. When I started to tell people, especially at work, it felt more real. Sometimes I cried a bit and sometimes not depending on who it was (my emotions seemed to know when not to). I found comfort from so many as so many women I spoke to have been through it, often more than once. I was shocked really. You read the stats but don't really believe it until you hear the words 'that happened to me too, I understand'. Big cuddles are good too. Hope it gets easier for you soon hon. Lots of love. x


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## Shiv

Cleck - so we have learnt a LOT this week
a) when you ovulate
b) that you get ovulation pains
c) that you gain weight over ovulation
d) that you become a moany mess over ovulation :haha:

Glad your weight settled back down again :thumbup: and that you are back to feeling positive about it all. I've just seen on fb that you got a phone call from Corey so I bet that has put you in an even better as well. You must somehow get a photo of his face when he first sees you as it will be a picture!


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## spidey

woohoo Cleckner :happydance: I am so glad you actually lost weight! It will be interesting to see if this is a monthly trend. 

cd15 for me today. My nipples haven't gone sore, so I know I'm still pre-ovulation. I'm guessing this will be another 43-46 day cycle so I have a long time to go. But just incase, me and DH are doing the nasty as much as possible, LOL! With how heavy my last period was, I would actually prefer the longer cycles if I'm not meant to be pregnant anytime soon. I was run down for an entire week from the blood loss!


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## spidey

hey girls- I just wanted to report that my psychic nipples are reporting that I'm gearing up to ovulate tomorrow!!! If so, AF is due to arrive on CD30 this cycle!!! Tomorrow I will be more certain because right now I'm just feeling a twinge of soreness when Kira latches. No one else cares about these things so thats why I'm blessing you all with this information :haha:


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## cleckner04

Shiv- I just burst out laughing at me being a moany mess. Too true!! :haha::rofl: 

Spidey- OMG your psychic nipples are awesome! Can I come ask them a question sometime? :haha:


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## Shiv

your nips are SO handy Spidey :haha:


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## spidey

My nipples are much more sensitive today, so I'm pretty certain AF will arrive in 2 weeks exactly! Poor DH has been working a second job fixing up a house and I had to force him to :sex: last night :haha: When he was done he said he's so dehydrated that he doubts anything came out of him. So I'm not sure if dehydrated sperm will make this my month, but we shall see!


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## cleckner04

dehydrated sperm. :rofl::rofl:


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## Shiv

oh my, that made me laugh, your poor DH, being "forced" into sex! If he did a good job then the little fellas should have got a drink on the way up :winkwink:


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## jelr

Cleck: I knew it would be ovulation that is fantastic - I do know the frustration though - even though I know I put on about 3lbs around ovulation I still am convinced some months that it is because I have ate too much - At least you will know now exactly when you ovulate so can expect it and hopefully it wont get you down when you know its coming. See you will make your goal for Corey no problem. I think you are fantastic.

Pippin: Thanks pippin - I know time will make it easier too. Delighted your scan went well and that bump is still pink - Is it more real this time?

Shiv: How are you feeling? How is Sophia now and how are the tantrums? We were back to several today and yesterday and it is no easy task.

Spidey: lmao at the dehydrated sperm - you could be surprised maybe they were so thirsty they may have swam even faster to get to that eggy and get some fluids lol - Best of luck this month.

Well not much news from me, still only spotting. I thought on Friday maybe it was going to happen as it got a bit heavier and I had some cramps but thankfully all stayed put. I think you were all right and my body would do what it was meant to as at the start of the week I really wanted to get it all over but when I thought it was going to happen on Friday I actually realised I really did think I would deal very well with my poor little baba going down the loo so I think it will be less traumatic to just have the d&c and not have to think about where it is if you know what I mean. Also it was my mams birthday yesterday and she has been so good through all of this and I know her heart is breaking for me too as I'm still her baby and she has been through this herself and knows the pain of it and I after knowing this pain myself I think it would probably be even harder to ever have to watch Natasha go through it so I really didn't want it to all happen and me end up in hospital on her birthday or to have her birthday marked with this bad memory for the rest of our lives.

Well we are in for the scan tomorrow at eleven. I know this sounds stupid because I know and my heart and soul that is is over but one part of my head keeps thinking maybe there will be a hb on that screen tomorrow and I'm trying to put it out of my head because I know I will be devestated all over again tomorrow especially as it will be completely final and any glimmer of hope will all be gone after tomorrow.


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## spidey

jelr- I'll be thinking of you tomorrow :hugs: Let us know how everything goes at your appointment. 

Cleckner- I bloated up soooo badly yesterday and today which would be right at ovulation for me too. My stomach is still sticking out like I'm 5 months pregnant so I'm hoping it goes down tomorrow so rumors don't start at my work. With having no boobs I can't hide a pudgy belly very well!

Those dehydrated spermies are probably hanging around my egg right now


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## cleckner04

jelr- Thinking of you hun. :hugs::hugs: 

spidey- lol @ no boobs and bloat. I have big boobs but for a while there my belly still stuck out further. haha. Now that the weight is going, my boobs are finally taking over I think. :rofl:


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## spidey

Cleckner- I'm glad you understand about no boobs and bloat, LOL. I was trying to explain it to my future SIL, and she didn't get it! We were shopping together and I was trying to find shirts that would enhance my small boobs rather than bring focus to my bloat. My stomach bloats out very easily now, I guess due to my stomach muscles being stretched out when I was pregnant.


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## Pippin

Thinking of you today Jelr :hugs: update us hon :hug: It does feel more real now I have to admit. Just want her here safely now I know I'm already half way but the next 20 weeks seem a long time.

Spidey love your physic nips, hope it happens this month for you even with dehydrated sperm lol.

Shiv when is your 12 week scan?


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## Shiv

Hi girls,

Thinking of you jelr :hugs:

Pip - my scan is on 22nd March

Spidey - I know ALL about small boobs and bloat! My boobs haven't grown since getting pregnant this time, but I am SO bloated that my belly is sticking out much further than my poor shrivelled up boobies - never mind! 

Cleck - when is your official weigh in day?


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## spidey

Shiv- atleast you can say that you're pregnant so your big tummy has an excuse. :haha: Mine has gone down a little today which is a relief. If it re-bloats tonight I'll take a picture to show you all :blush:

I actually had some ewcm this cycle too, which is a first since I've had Kira. So I feel the chances of me actually getting pregnant are higher this month. I can't wait to find out! 

jelr, I hope everything goes okay today :hugs:


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## cleckner04

Shiv- Weigh ins are on fridays. :D


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## Pippin

Jelr are you ok hon???????


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## cleckner04

Today was her appointment. :( I hope she's okay.


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## Pippin

Still no news from Jelr? Hope your ok hon thinking of you. xxx


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## Shiv

yep been thinking of you too hon :hugs:


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## cleckner04

jelr- thinking of you hun. I hope you update soon. Starting to worry about you. :hugs::hugs:


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## jelr

Sorry girls

Well appointment went as I thought it would - still no hb or growth and baby the actual sac and baby are starting to disintigrate so it is definitely all over and our little angel has grown its wings.

They gave me a choice of waiting for it to happen naturally or to do for a d&c - so I opted for the d&c seeing as the bleeding is still only spotting and the last mmc was only discovered at 16 weeks and I'm only 10 now so I dont want to take the chance of waiting around for another month of being housebound as I will have gone stir crazy plus I will be off work for 3 weeks - and I dont want to push it by being off even longer with DH being laid off too. Also I think this way I think it will be less traumatic as I really dont think I could face my little baby going down the toilet or for maybe Natasha to see me bleed through my clothes. They dont have any free theatre until Thursday so I'm booked in then.

I'm really sorry I worried you all I was just completely emotionally and physically exhausted yesterday and I actually felt really sick as they had told me that I was having an internal scan so I hadn't drank any water and then they told me that they always do abdominal scans first so I had to drink water and in the mean time the doctor was called back up to the clinic so I was bursting and had to empty my bladder and had to refil and this happened twice by the time she came back down so all in all I ended up drinking 4 litres of water in the space of an hour and was actually shaking with the cold with all that ice cold water going through me.

so between that and all my family and friends that know ringing to see how it went I was shattered and didn't even go on the laptop last night in fact I sat down and had a couple of glasses of wine and smoked like a trouper out in the back garden (as we dont smoke in the house or car since Natasha was born) - They are my two big de-stressers and I would have killed for both over the last few weeks but wouldn't chance it in case the baby was still alive and had been off both since I found out I was pregnant and I think it did me the world of good as I cryed solid for about an hour after the wine but I think I really needed that to get it all out.

I'm just so angry today as it is so unfair that we have to go through this not once but twice, but then that is life I guess. Hopefully after thursday we can really start to grieve and heal.

So today I just relaxed and DH left me lie in until lunch time and we did lazed around the house and played with Natasha, although I'm still shattered. Anybody know what is good to give you a boost after something like this. I got DH to run to the chemist today to get some Vit B as I know it is good for energy levels and evening primrose and I think it is meant to be good for pmt so I'm hoping it might help with all these hormones going on at the moment. Any other suggestions to help me stop feeling like I have been trampled on would be greatly appreciated. Xx


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## cleckner04

Oh hun. :hugs::hugs::cry: The only way I start feeling better is watching a million sad movies and getting all the tears out. Than when I can't cry anymore, I start to heal. Take lots of nice warm baths and relax as much as you can hun.:hugs::hugs:

I opted for a D&C too when I lost mine. It seems to be the best for the situation so you don't sit around wondering and waiting. I hope the op goes smoothly. :hugs: I wish I had some magical words that could take it all away right now for you.


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## jelr

Thanks Sam - yeah the hysterical crying for an hour last night non stop definitely helped - I wish I had some magic to take it away myself but unfortunately there is nothing anybody can do not even myself - I will unfortunately just have to go through the motions and eventually I know I will get there. At least we have our beautiful daughter this time and know that we can have children so I think she will help with most of the healing.

Thanks for everything you lot - I dont know what I would have done over the last few weeks without you all. :hug:


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## spidey

jelr thanks for the update, I've been thinking about you alot :hugs: I hope things go smoothly on Thursday and you and your DH can begin to heal :cry:

If I'm feeling down I force myself to go outside. Sitting on the grass and watching the birds and squirrels always re-connects me to the world. Getting sun and fresh air always helps my energy and mood. Even in the winter I will bundle up and lay on the grass and let the sun hit my face. Then at the end of the day I stop for some icecream covered in fudge syrup! Cleckner- I would turn into a depressed mess if I let myself cry too much! LOL


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## cleckner04

Oh crying is like therapy to me. Sometimes when I am really missing DH I was a sad love movie than cry. Than cry even more because I think of DH and I end up hysterical. Than after that I'm fine like nothing ever happened. :rofl:


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## Pippin

Thanks for the update hon and sorry you are going through this. I wish I had a magic wand and make you feel better. Just cry when you need to, hug when you feel like it and eventually time will heal. I can now look back on mine objectively and it seems like it barely happened and I don't get upset anymore, but at the time my world broke apart. All I can say is that you will get to that point but slowly, take time to grieve and don't force yourself to do anything. Thursday isn't too far away now and then it'll be all over. I hope it goes well for you and remember that we are all with you in spirit. 

.....and just like you I had a good old glass of wine or two in the evening and did quite often if I remember, helped loads!!! You enjoy it hon you deserve a bucket full and a few smokes on the side! Sending you heaps on love hon. xxx


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## jelr

Thanks girls - yeah spidey that sounds like a good idea the sun always cheers me up - hopefully we will have some over the next week or so as the weather hasn't been good the last few days.

Cleck: yeah crying is like therapy to me too - although I always find i'm exhausted afterwards.

Pippin: Yep the vino and smokes definitely helped - I have missed them so much over the past 6 weeks. I know I should have probably stayed off the smokes once I was off them again - but then I think I need every crutch I can get at the moment and i'm going to give myself a little while and think I will get tablets from the doc and quit before ttc again as I do always miss them so much when pregnant and it think its because it is just completely cold turkey and am terrified that the extra stress of this doesn't do Lo any good. I'm the same about my mmc before Natasha - It still hurts but I dont get upset anymore as I wouldnt have Natasha and she is my whole world so I know that I will get through it again and just pray I dont ever have to go through it again.

I will let you all know how I get on thurs - they have changed things in the hospital and due to bed shortage you only are in the day ward now and are not kept in over night unless the surgery is done too late in the day, so hopefully I should be home where I think I will get more rest and being honest the last time was horrible staying overnight as again because of bed shortage there were 2 pregnanty ladies in the same ward as me as maternity was full and one went into labour in the middle of the night and I found it very upsetting - mind you I dont know if it would bother me as much now having my own LO where as last time I was convinced I would never have any.

I dont know if I'll be much good to get on here on the thurs as anesthesia and me dont usually mix well but I will hopefully be up to it on friday and will let you know how it all went. I know you will be all thinking of me and really appreciate that. xx


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## Pippin

Will be nice if you get home thursday hon, I managed to get home by 4pm with mine but I was one of the first in thankfully hope it's the same for you. Big hugs hon and really hoping it goes well for you :hugs: will be thinking of you lots and lots. xxx


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## Shiv

Will be thinking of you tomorrow Jean, I hope it all goes smoothly and you can get back home for some cuddles and rest. I don't blame you for being angry and asking "why me?". This is one of the things regarding religion that I don't get, if there is a God then why does he do crap stuff to good people (but hey that is another ramble we can have on facebook :winkwink:). 

As for me if i were you I would be getting rip roaringly drunk, you deserve a drink! Oh and my mum is on Champix at the moment (assuming that is what you meant?) and she hasn't smoked since Nov 15th (having smoked for over 40 years!) - she is finding it hard but she has never lasted this long when giving up (usually about 2 days!) so it must be helping her.

Anyway, take care of yourself and Jim tomorrow :hugs:


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## spidey

jelr- I'll be thinking of you tomorrow :hugs: I hope everything goes smoothly and your back home by nighttime.


My nipples are still sore which is expected, BUT if they're still sore this weekend then I'm pregnant (according to my theory, LOL). Which will be 1 week before AF is due, so it's going to be more accurate than a pregnancy test!! 

How is everyone else doing?


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## cleckner04

:rofl::rofl: Spidey. Can your nipples predict the weather too? :haha:

Nothing new here. I'm somewhat ready to weigh in this week. I've done well but tonight just made a massive omelet with salmon and cheese. It was SOOO yummy though. I think I may have to work out a bit extra tonight though. :dohh: I'm hoping AF stays away until at LEAST monday. That would give me a 12 day luteal phase. Which is the minimum that I want to have. It's supposed to be between 12-16. 

But anyways..I'm pretty boring here. Only 3 months 1 week before DH gets home! :dance: And I have at the most only 16 lbs to lose in that time to reach my main goal. :yipee:


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## Shiv

The midwife came to my house today to do my booking in appointment. She sent me off to the loo to wee in a pot and on a stick, it was a disaster, i dropped the pot in the loo and then didn't have any wee left to pee on the stick :dohh:


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## cleckner04

:rofl: Shiv. What'd you do after that? Have to tell her you dropped the wee? :rofl: 


Well I mysteriously gained 2 lbs. over night again. Awesome! :roll:


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## spidey

Shiv- how embarrassing!!! I like how the midwife comes to your house. Thats convenient especially with having to look after Sophia too.

Cleckner- It's probably just water weight from being a few days before AF arrives. Don't freak yourself out about it!! Your omelette sounds super yummy and healthy too. I bet you were craving protein to help you build all those new muscles :thumbup: I can't believe that it's 3 months until Corey returns!! He will be here before you know it :happydance:

My nipples CAN predict the weather, LOL! They get hard when it's cold outside :haha:

So my nipples are less sore today, so even though I still have hope that this is my month, I'm starting to think that it's not. Of course, it is waaaay too early to test and this is all based on my nipple theory  Lets see how my nipples are this weekend and then I will be more certain.


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## spidey

Cleckner- I was telling DH about your weight loss with only adding in exercise and I couldn't remember the details! He wants to lose some weight but it's impossible for him to cut foods out of his diet because he loves food too much and overall he eats fairly healthy so I think he would really struggle with feeling hungry. So the thought of adding in some exercise each day seemed very doable to him, but he wanted to know the details- how long each day and what exercises you do. You are becoming famous because I told my mom about your weightloss too :blush: She wants to lose weight but does temporary fad diets and ends up gaining more weight once she stops so she's given up. :flower:


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## cleckner04

I started out in the beginning just riding my recumbent bike for I think 30 minutes the first few weeks. On level 2 tension. I went from literally no exercise to trying to lose weight so it took me a while to work myself up. I than added in a 30 minute walk at least once a day. Which is pretty much necessary for me anyways because I have 2 dogs that need walked. 

Now this is my exercise routine as of today:

Recumbent bike- 60 minutes a day. On level 4 now. 
Walk- 30 minutes in the afternoon and 40 minutes in the evening. (I walk a different dog each time because they are impossible to walk together.) 

Occasionally I'll throw in 20 minutes on the elliptical. When I first started I could only do like 2 minutes before I wanted to die bc my lungs hurt so bad. :rofl: But now I can easily do 20 and probably could add more but I haven't tried yet. :lol: 


I'm not much of an inspiration this week with my gain. :( I'm praying it's a fluke. Technically it's not a gain because I lost 2 lbs this week so I'll end up breaking even for the weigh in tomorrow. :cry: That's two weeks of no loss.


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## Pippin

Awww Cleck you are plateauing , really normal stick with it and you'll come out the other side next week :hugs: classic time when people give up. You're doing so well. Are you measuring yourself? Bet you're still losing inches! xxx


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## spidey

Thanks Cleckner! I wrote it all down and will tell DH this evening  You could very well be losing fat but gaining muscle. I bet Pippin is right and you're still losing inches. When Corey gets back you should take him on a long hike and I bet he'll get out of breath before you!

Nipples are less sore today so my theory still says I'm not pregnant. I am such a weirdo because a meeting with the BIG boss was scheduled for March 31st. IF I'm pregnant, then I'll be having morning sickness and I will be on the verge of tossing my cookies the entire meeting or worse! I'm going to feel nauseous as it is even if I'm not pregnant, LOL! So now I'm worried about this stupid meeting and it's 3 weeks away!!! I think I mentioned on here how I was losing my job in February, but obviously that never happened because I'm at work right now. I'm still getting a paycheck, so I keep showing up :haha: My boss had a mental breakdown and quit in January, so I've been showing up and doing my work, but I don't have a boss. So the BIG boss sent me an email because he wants to meet with me :shock: This might be the end for me, but I'm trying to keep positive and hope that he lets me stay. IF I am pregnant, then I need to keep it a secret until after this meeting!


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## cleckner04

Maybe the big boss is so pleased by your efforts that you'll get a promotion! How awesome would that be. :lol: 


I did just start measuring myself last week on wednesday bc that was the day I was super frustrated and upset. It's been a week and a half since that first measuring and I measured myself this morning. 5 inches gone! :shock: Is that even possible?! It's a 1.4 lb difference since last wednesday but 5 inches difference. 

So this week I managed a 0.4 lb. loss. :dohh: It's coming off SO slow. :( AF should be here this week and I'm super gassy so I think that's why though. LOL!! :haha:


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## Pippin

See told you!!! :haha: Yes that's perfectly normal to lose inches and not weight, I use my fitness pal when I diet to track my cals (or I did till they made it difficult to use) and there are loads of posts/advice saying that's true! :thumbup:


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## spidey

5 inches!!! :happydance::happydance: That is so awesome!! Screw the scale and focus on the measurements now! 

At work today I found out that one of the girls is pregnant. There was a big baby boom when I had Kira and I wanted to be the first crazy girl one to get re-pregnant with a second baby :haha: Oh well!


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## cleckner04

Aww. Maybe there will be another baby boom now! :D


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## spidey

I hope you're right Cleckner! To be honest, I never thought it would take me this long. I've been trying for 7 months now! So I have moments where I feel disappointed. But 99% of the time I believe that things will work out for the best in the end. :thumbup:


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## Pippin

spidey said:


> I hope you're right Cleckner! To be honest, I never thought it would take me this long. I've been trying for 7 months now! So I have moments where I feel disappointed. But 99% of the time I believe that things will work out for the best in the end. :thumbup:

It's true I think. Im not religious at all but I do think things happen for a reason and what goes around comes around. We obviously make our own choices but I have a healthy respect for natural courses within life. Its weird as when I lost the last baby in Sept it was such a bad timing to be pregnant. I know I couldn't cause the mmc but I do wonder if some of my thoughts prevented it developing, it was much wanted of course but worried about age gap, work etc really got to me. Then with this one we weren't going to try until after Christmas but in Oct when I got that second positive opk which I never get I said to dh we need to make our baby now and we did. I've always seen myself with the boy girl combo and low and behold here I am, with the age gap I wanted. It was the same way for my mum when she was ttc (exactly!) and I wouldn't be here today if that middle one had survived! It took months and months to get Sam so go figure. It'll happen Spidey :hugs:


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## spidey

My original plan was to start TTC my first baby when I turned 30, but then Kira was made and it turned out to be the best thing ever! We have one plan in our head, but what actually happens seems to be just as perfect. Now I just have to be patient because sometimes that can be difficult for me :haha:


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## cleckner04

Well AF hit me today. :cry: So my LP is only 10 days long. I'm really upset. I'm probably going to start taking B6 supplements to lengthen it now. It's the BFing that's causing it. I have this very strong feeling that I won't get pregnant yet. Like DH will be home, we'll try for five months, he'll leave again out to sea and I will have to wait again. I think that is what's going to happen. On one hand, that'd give me time to get back to my normal skinny self and it'd give Emma a chance to quit BFing so my cycles can get normal.


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## spidey

Cleckner that really sucks. If the B6 can lengthen it just 2 days more then you'll be okay, right? Have some hope that in the next 3 months you can get your cycle back on track. I have a feeling that bf is keeping me from getting pregnant too, but bf is still very important to Kira so I don't want to stop now.

Jelr- I hope you're doing okay :hugs: Let us know how things went.


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## cleckner04

Yeah all I need is a 12 day cycle so hopefully B-6 will help. I'm gonna read a bit more into it before I start taking it. I'm always really cautious about anything going into my body like that. Especially with Emma still BFing. A new baby isn't as important as Emma getting booby atm. Even if it takes another year before I get pregnant again I can live with that. Just gives Emma and I more one on one time before she has to share me. Although I'm sure this won't stop me from bitching about not being pregnant yet. :rofl:


I've restarted my weightloss ticker. I want a fresh start because I'm starting to feel really 'blah' about it all. I'm having trouble getting into the workouts now. I really just want to nap all the time instead. :rofl: So I need something fresh. I think I'm gonna order a few funny weightloss books to help keep me going. I'm open to any suggestions from you girls too!! :flower:



Haven't heard much from you Shiv and Pip. How are you ladies feeling? Pip you are getting so close already!! :dance: It's really flying by. 

jelr- how are you feeling? :hugs:


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## jelr

Hi girls, our Internet is down and I'm waiting on a new modem so just a quick message from my phone to let you know the d&c went well (well doesn't seem the right word but it went as well as it was meant to ifykwim).

I'm okay a bit heartbroken at the moment but I know that will get easier with time and the anestetic has knocked me for six so I'm fairly shattered but dh is home so he is letting me lie in and making me go back to bed when I'm wiped. He has been such a sweetie and is doing everything around the house and won't allow me to lift a finger. 

So I'm trying to focus on the good things that I have going on and i definitely have the most caring and loving hubbie anyone could ask for and a beautiful little girl so between them I will get through this.

I hope your all well and I will get on and do a proper update and catch up when the Internet is fixed.


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## Pippin

cleckner04 said:


> Well AF hit me today. :cry: So my LP is only 10 days long. I'm really upset. I'm probably going to start taking B6 supplements to lengthen it now. It's the BFing that's causing it. I have this very strong feeling that I won't get pregnant yet. Like DH will be home, we'll try for five months, he'll leave again out to sea and I will have to wait again. I think that is what's going to happen. On one hand, that'd give me time to get back to my normal skinny self and it'd give Emma a chance to quit BFing so my cycles can get normal.

Hey hon mine was only 10 days too with all three, maybe 11 but if it's over 9 then that's fine :hugs: chin up hon it's not bad :hug: look at me!!!!:kiss:

As for me I'm good, think I have a cold and feel tired and achy because of it but hoping it won't last long. Bought Sam more shoes today, man he's got big feet bless him but he is a big baby!!!! Work has been hard to 8:30pm nights two thursdays in a row and it wipes me out. Still easy week ahead with hydrotherapy starting wed for my back :thumbup:


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## Pippin

jelr said:


> Hi girls, our Internet is down and I'm waiting on a new modem so just a quick message from my phone to let you know the d&c went well (well doesn't seem the right word but it went as well as it was meant to ifykwim).
> 
> I'm okay a bit heartbroken at the moment but I know that will get easier with time and the anestetic has knocked me for six so I'm fairly shattered but dh is home so he is letting me lie in and making me go back to bed when I'm wiped. He has been such a sweetie and is doing everything around the house and won't allow me to lift a finger.
> 
> So I'm trying to focus on the good things that I have going on and i definitely have the most caring and loving hubbie anyone could ask for and a beautiful little girl so between them I will get through this.
> 
> I hope your all well and I will get on and do a proper update and catch up when the Internet is fixed.

:hugs::kiss::hugs::kiss::hugs::kiss::hugs:

Glad it's all over for you now and you can start the emotional healing. Here for you hun if you need us :hugs:


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## Shiv

Hi everyone, sorry been MIA for a few days, I've been away for the weekend visiting friends, which was supposed to be a nice fun weekend but I got diagnosed with tonsillitis on FRiday morning so have been feeling pretty crap all weekend (but still went as thought I'd stand a better chance of getting some rest away than at home with Sophia :haha:)

I am feeling quite sorry for myself, my neck has ben so stiff but the antibiotics must be starting to kick in as it has eased off a bit today, but my throat is just getting worse. David has just left for a week at uni so I am praying Sophia has a good week, but he informed me that she has had teething poos over the weekend so doesn't sound good! Well that is my moan of the day over with!

Cleck - I think that the whole vit B thing can work pretty quickly so I can't see a reason why you couldn't get your luteal phase extended by the time Corey comes home.

jelr - I hope you can start feeling better soon :hugs:

pippin - glad you have an easy week ahead of you, put your feet up when you can 

Spidey - how are you nips?


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## spidey

Thanks for the update Jelr. I hope you and your DH can heal quickly from this :hugs:

Shiv- I hope you feel better soon. It's such a nightmare to be sick and have no one to help with Sophia. I know what you mean about going out despite being sick. A few times I've gone into work not feeling well because I knew I would get more rest at work than staying home with Kira :haha: I hope Sophia had a good day and let her mommy rest.

Cleckner- I did a quick google search on B6 and it seems that higher doses can decrease milk supply, so you might want to read up on it a little before trying it. But its nice to know that Pippin got pregnant from having 10 days between ovulation and AF, so there is some hope!! :thumbup:

My nipples are back to normal, so I'm pretty certain that I'm still not pregnant. AF will come Friday or Saturday morning, so if I don't see her by then, I'll test. I don't want to waste another one of my precious tests!

I had a whiney moment this morning. DH has been working a second job on the weekends and I've been feeling like such a single mother. He's gone all day, then he's gone most evenings for his hobbies (wood working and blacksmithing) and then he's gone all weekend! Plus I hurt my lower back really bad about 4 weeks ago and I keep re-hurting it since I don't have a moment to rest anymore. He feels bad too because the only time Kira sees him is when he's saying good bye. My MIL, who lives next to me, knows that I'm here alone all day, but the only time she comes to visit to "help out" is in the evening when DH is here for an hour or so before bedtime. Yeah, so I whined, and now DH is taking a day off tomorrow :haha:


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## cleckner04

spidey- Yeah I read that too. I decided to just take it. I'm only taking 100 mg and if my milk supply dips I'll quit taking them immediately. But I'm gonna give it a shot. 

Yay for your hubby taking a day off!! I'd be upset too if that was my DH. But thankfully mine tries to be home as much as humanly possible once his ship is in. He does sometimes spend a bit too much time in the garage working on our car though. But it gives me a break because Emma 'helps' him out there. I have a few pictures of her covered in grease. :rofl: 

Those nipples of yours may just be curses instead of a good thing. They might just be playing mind games with you. :D


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## spidey

From what I saw, 100mg shouldn't affect your milk. When I was having ms with Kira, I took B6 and unisom which is an antihistamine. It helped a little, so if I need it again I'll have to be careful about how much B6 I take so as not to affect my milk too much.

LOL about my nipples. Sometimes I wonder if they're wrong and playing games with me :haha: I had a slight urge to test this morning, but I'm determined to wait and trust my nipples!


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## spidey

AF arrived this morning! I woke up and felt like total crap and thought "hmmm.. maybe my nips really are playing a joke on me and I'm pregnant!??" So I took a pregnancy test and it was a BFN. 1 hour later AF arrived :haha:

This was a record breaking month for me. My cycle was only 26 days long! It beat out my old record of 28 days. I decided to be a nerd and look up all my most recent cycle lengths. Since my period returned, my cycles have been:

34, 28 (my old shortest record, LOL), 32, 34, 29, 46, 43, 26 (my new shortest record!)

I have no idea what to expect next month. Part of me wants to get some cheap ovulation strips to find out how nipple sensitivity corresponds to ovulation. I'm really curious about my nip power :haha:

I also found out that the meeting with the BIG boss is part of the process of them firing me at the end of September :cry: They don't have the budget to keep me and September is when the federal government's financial year starts.


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## Shiv

Spidey - sorry AF got you, 26 days is pretty impressive! Are yo not tempted to get a cool gizmo like Cleck so you can pee on a stick etc? 

So sorry about your job ( I know how that feels, it seems like science is sufering as much as any other area with the current financial climate. Will it mean you have to find another job or can you survive without? :hugs:


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## spidey

I'm tempted to get the same gizmo as Cleckner! But I might take baby steps and start with something cheaper and once I get addicted I can get one of those super cool monitors for the next cycle. :haha:

It will be really hard without my income, but we could survive for awhile off savings. DH works for the local government and he's had a pay cut for the last 2 years which was NOT in our long term plans for the future. DH has been working a 2nd job and he could start selling the furniture he makes if things get really tough. I'm not too stressed about it yet but I'm going to start looking soon, right now I'm more concerned about my crazy periods, LOL! Shiv- how is your DH doing on the job search?

Oh, and my psychic abilities point towards a BFP for me next cycle! It would be just my luck to be due in early January. My birthday is January 9th and I've said my entire life that I would never have a December or January baby due to the conflict with x-mas. "I'm sorry Spidey, with Christmas just over, I'm out of money and can't give you anything for your birthday so here's a card" :devil: Or maybe I just had shitty grandparents :haha:


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## cleckner04

Aww spidey, I'm sorry about AF and your job. :(:hugs::hugs: You totally gotta get opks!! They really are fun. Well, I think the monitor is way more fun because there's no questioning whether it's positive or not. :haha: Which reminds me, I have to buy more sticks! They are dropped in price to $23 on amazon so I need to snap them up while they are cheap! 

I'm jealous of you educated ladies. I never had a chance to go to college and now we could never afford it and I refuse to take out loans. :nope:


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## Shiv

I knew someone's OH was a carpenter! That is so cool that your DH can make stuff Spidey that he could sell, David is one of the most intelligent men I know, but cannot do DIY for shit!

As for his job hunt - well he has applied for lots, and not heard back from all but one, which he has an interview for next week. I am trying to be supportive, but I am not sure I want him to get the job, and I think he will get it. It is about a 2 hrs drive away from here, so we would need to move (and it wouldn't exactly be a pop down the road to visit my parents anymore). The job involves 30% European travel for which he has to be available at the drop of a hat. So basically out of every 6 weeks he will be away for 2 weeks, but I won't be able to plan when he is away. I know you would probably give your left arm for that sort of arrangement Cleck but I am SOOOOOOOOOO scared about moving to a new place where I know nobody with a toddler and newborn and then David jetting off. Serioulsy Cleck how do you do it? are you lonley? I am so scared of being lonely. I mean being a SAHM mum can be lonley anyway even if you have friends and family nearby, but I am scared that i will just never leave the house and become some sort of recluse (which I know you haven't Celck, so tips would be welcome). Also teh area where this job is, is in the commuter area for London so house prices are really high, so we would only be able to afford something smaller than we are in now. If I'm honest the ONLy sweetner for me moving is that we might get a bigger house - without that I can't find a positive spin to put on it.

Thing is the job is right up David's street, i think he would really enjoy it..........so I said go ahead and apply and we'll discuss more if you get offered it. What would you do girls?


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## spidey

Cleckner- I will look into some cheap opks to start with... I can already tell that this month will be fun! It's going to be neat to see how accurate my nips are. :haha: Don't be jealous- you can go to college later and you'll probably have a better idea of what you want to study too. It's hard to decide at 18. I went to a community college for the first 2 years and with tax breaks it was basically free :thumbup: Sometimes I wish I had my babies young (haha, I guess I'm not quite an old hag, YET), and then get them off to school and then study nursing or something more hands on. But as they say... the grass is always greener on the other side. :haha:

Shiv- My DH is a health inspector for his day job, but a carpenter at heart. He makes amazing wood furniture and he does it the "old fashioned" way with only hand tools. We just need to find rich people willing to buy some of his furniture! Regarding your dilemma... there is always the option of him taking this job, but continue to look for something else. My DH had a moment of "going to be a daddy" panic when I was 8 months pregnant and filled out an application to be an FBI agent, LOL! The job was very much the same where he would travel with no notice and not beable to tell me how long or where he was going :shock: At first I said "go ahead, whatever makes you happy" but after a few days I had to tell him how I really felt. I needed him to be home in the evenings and to be on a reliable schedule. I told him that in a few years he could re-visit his dream of having an exciting job with a gun, but for now he had to keep his boring low paid job. I'm not good being a full time mom 100% of the time. I NEED my breaks in the evenings and I need to know that I'll have a break. Once I lose my job, my mom will probably still take Kira 1-2 days a week. So if I was alone and away from my parents I would probably go crazy! But thats just me- obviously it can be done because thats what Cleckner is doing- but I honestly don't have it in me. (Cleckner- you really are my hero, LOL!). Sorry- probably not much of a help and certainly not very encouraging. I'm also on the rag, so I'm not feeling very energenic at the moment :haha:


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## cleckner04

I'm sure you guys wouldn't think I'm much of a hero if you saw me on a bad night when I lock myself in a bathroom and cry while Emma has a tantrum in the next room. :rofl::rofl:

I agree with spidey that it'd be a job for now but he can still keep looking. And who knows, you may be surprised and find good friends and love it there. I'm not really one to ask though because that really would be a dream situation compared to what we are now. :haha: 2 hours isn't too far to be away from family. That's just a quick day trip for me. :D I just think with you being pregnant and neither of you having work, you don't really have room to be picky. Something that will keep a roof over your head and keep food on the table is all you need for now and he can keep looking in the meantime. :hugs: It's really not that bad being alone. I am a million times stronger than I was when I first married him though.


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## Shiv

Thanks for your opinions guys, I know hwat you have both said makes sense. I guess what is playing on my mind is that we could probably last with neither of us having a job for maybe a year and a half (on savings and David's redundancy package) and I guess having David home with me and new baby is kind of appealing :winkwink:


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## jelr

hey girls

Well our internet is back up and running so i said I would fill you all in.

Well d&c went as planned, we were in about 9.30 and they admitted me straight away and gave me the pessery to soften my cervix around 11 and I went down to theatre around 2 and was home at 7. It went a lot better than last time as last time after the pessery - the cramps I had were really severe, where as this time I barely even felt them so I'm hoping if I do ever have another baby that because my stomach muscles have loosened since having Natasha that means that labour will be much easier.

I'm slowly but surely getting there, I had stopped bleeding by saturday but it actually started again yesterday but it is only really light so physically I am fine except I'm extremely exhausted but then anesthetic tends to do that to me.

Emotionally is still a bit hit and miss, but I dont feel completely overwhelmed by the whole thing like I did last week and each day is getting a little easier. We have had some great days with Natasha so that is what I'm focusing on. 

I am dreading going to work next week as only my boss knows, so it will be a little weird for everything to be back to normal if you know what I mean, but then that is life and it does carry on and it will the first time ever that I have been going to work while DH stays is at home with Natasha or even been at home before she came along, so I know I will feel like I'm missing out on the fun, but sure it has to be done.

There is a little angels grave nearby that we had looked into the last time as they explained that if the fetus is found when they do the d&c, that they give it back to you and we had decided to bury it there if we did - but both times little bean had deteriorated too much and there was only tissue so we didn't need to do that - but I did bury a little box with my pregnancy tests and it did give me some closure - just a way to say goodbye if that makes sense so I think we will do the same again - even changing my signature today helped me a little - silly really as it was only writing the dates down, but it is just some sort of closure if that makes sense.

I have gotten an appointment for gyne in June - but I'm hoping that I might get a sooner date as the nurse that was looking after me was going to try and make an appointment for 6 weeks time - but they had already sent me one in the post as I had also asked the nurse from the early pregnancy unit - so fingers crossed I get the earlier one too and can cancel this one. We are going to wait and not ttc until after the appointment.

I did speak a little to the doctor that was on and according to her there isn't any increase of mc with pcos, where as I was always told there was, so not sure if she or I are wrong on that one, she did explain though that there is an increased risk of mc with autoimmune diseases which my type of arthritis is so it may be that. She said that just as my body rejects my immune system causing my arthritis that sometimes it can reject a baby too as it thinks its an allergy. she does'nt reckon they will do much more with me as usually they dont do more tests unless you have had 3 concecutive mc - which is a bit mad as it would mean I would have to go through this again another 2 times, which I just couldn't cope with. She did suggest talking to the doc I see about low doses of asprin - so hopefully I will get some answers and suggestions. I know I probably wont and that will drive me nuts as I'm a real fixer and have to know the hows and whys and try and fix them so it is already driving me nuts not knowing what caused this and I know I will never know unless the results of the d&c show something genetic or a molar pregnancy which they didn't the last time. Load of people have said that maybe I can't carry boys, which I know they just dont know what to say and are trying to make me feel better, but they dont realise that I would have loved a little boy this time and had a feeling that it was a boy. So I'm hoping they are wrong, again I'm going to talk to the hospital about this, the doc I did see said though that it was too early to know the sex so I will probably be in the dark about that too.

Anyway enough about me - time for a catch up.

Cleck: boo on the 10 days, fingers crossed the b6 helps to lenghen it as it is only 2 extra days that you need. Well done on the 5 inches, that is amazing - just goes to show you that you shouldn't rely on the scales. I'll be joining you as I had put on 5lbs over christmas and another 8lbs in the pregnancy and I had 2lbs left to get back to pre pregnancy weight so I have just over a stone and that will probably be a stone and a half by the time this week is up and I have finished stuffing my face. by the way you dont have anything to be envious about when it comes to education, I left school early and went back and got my qualifications so it is always something you can do in the future when Emma and your children to be are older and you dont need to be educated to be smart and you are smart so if you do decide to ever go back, you will fly through it all. You are a hero so dont sell yourself short - I would love to be at home full time but would never last without dh and my family, I would go nuts and would be a basket case.

Spidey: I love your nipples lol (that sounds so wrong) - I would go and get the machine cleck has as the opks sound much harder to read, go on you know you want too lol - Sorry about your job - I really hope something else comes up for you, the economy sucks everywhere.

Pippin: I hope that cold is gone or it didn't turn into one, there is nothing as bad when you can't take anything and even if you never usually take anything for a cold like me, it drives you nuts knowing you can't have anything if you wanted too. Work sounds crazy for you at the moment, I would be wiped working until 8.30 also without being pregnant. Best of luck with the hydrotherapy tomorrow.

Shiv: Boo for the tonsillitis - I hope you are feeling better now, I know what you mean about having a rest though without Sophia. I dont know what I woud have done if DH was working this week, I think I would have just fell in a heap. It really is a 24 hour job minding a toddler and so hard when you are sick. I think you definitely have to tell David how you feel as you both need to make the decision together and you dont want to resent him for taking it later on if you haven't both discussed it to death and decided what is best. It is definitely a hard one as I would be like you and would become a total recluse if DH wasn't around and my family and friends weren't near and this week has brought it so much to home how important everyone is to me and how much they have all helped me get through this. I would have said the same as the girls that maybe he should take it and look for something else at first as the main thing is to keep a roof over your head and food on the table but I think that if you can last a year and a half - maybe it might be best to wait - but then do you definitely think he will get something in this time, that is the main question and I think the main thing is to talk to him and see exactly how he feels about it all and be honest about how you feel, but then that is just me - I probably a bit selfish as I couldn't keep something as big as that from Dh and I'm always terrified that if you dont communicate and say exactly what is going on - it will come back to bite you later if resentment starts to come into it. But everybody's relationship is different.

Anyway I have just realised how much better I must be feeling than the last few weeks as I'm back to my mammoth posts lol - No thankfully today has been a good day as we spent the day with one of DH's work mates at the playzone with the children as they have a little boy who is 3 months older than Natasha and also my brother made a surprise visit from London to cheer me up (I didn't expect to see him again until July) so it has been a busy and fun day so my mind has been occupied which is good.

Thanks again for helping me through everything the last few weeks and I hope you dont mind me popping in here every now and again - I know I'm not ttc but I am waiting to ttc.

:hugs: to all.


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## Pippin

Just to say hi and :hug: to you all and I have read everything but bit too tired and in bed to respond to you all now. Will do tomorrow. Xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx :friends:

Jelr glad you're starting the emotional healing already :hugs:


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## jelr

Thanks Pippin - Its a case of having to really as I have a beautiful little daughter and a wonderful husband that need me to be okay.

Poor Sam's post in fb kind of blew me out of the water today though and brought a lot of it back, I'm really saying prayers for her and hope all will be okay.


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## spidey

jelr- I'm so happy to see your massive post! Doing a little burial of your pregnancy tests is good way to say goodbye. :hugs: I'm glad you didn't have bad cramping and everything went well given the circumstances. Keep us updated on what the doctors say. Honestly, from a scientific standpoint, I don't see how the gender of the baby could cause a miscarriage, so don't think that you can't carry a boy. 

I ordered some super cheap opk's and they will be here tomorrow. What am I getting myself into!!??


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## cleckner04

Spidey, I actually have a kinda scientific thing to ask your opinion on. I've heard rumors that the guys in the navy on ships like DH's have a harder time having boys because the nuclear exposure apparently hurts Y chromosome. :rofl: Do you think this could be true? Everyone I know has only girls. :wacko: His ship is powered by nuclear reactors. I just found that little rumor interesting.


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## spidey

LOL Cleckner, I don't think that can be true either! I'm not even sure how male sperm and female sperm could behave differently to begin with (for the shettles method to work). As far as I know, sperm are powered off the mitochondria provided from the father, and the actual DNA inside the sperm that will give rise to the baby aren't even contributing to the sperm's function. So to me, there is no logical explanation to why a male sperm would swim faster than a female sperm and live shorter, or whatever. I'm no sperm expert though, so what do I know!?? :rofl: Perhaps male sperm weigh a tiny bit less than female sperm since 2 X chromosomes weigh a teeny bit more than 1 X and 1 Y. 

I can really appreciate how complicated early development is. It's truly amazing how exact everything must be for an embryo to grow properly. When I was pregnant with Kira I had such a hard time believing that she could ever develop properly and become a healthy baby because of all the things that could go wrong especially in those early weeks.


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## Boothh

just read through and Jelr i am so sorry hun :hugs: it seems so unfair that things like this happen to so many of us :( xxxx

sorry ive not been on here in a while ive been sidetracked lately, as most of you know now im pregnant again! really hoping this one is a sticky one xxx


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## Shiv

Cleck - you've got no weightloss tracker now, how am I supposed to keep up with your success?!?!? How did today's weigh in go?

Jean - how are you lovely? Did you hear whether you got an earlier appt yet?

Boothh - fx for a sticky bean for you

As for me, well i am 12 weeks today and I can actually say that the last 4 weeks have gone quicker than i expected, I think being ill and having Sophia ill gave me something else to focus on. i actually managed to get some sleep last night, I still woke up once, but didn't have to wee and managed to go back to sleep - hurrah. No more morning sickness either so I guess (assuming everything is ok with bubs) that I must be nearing second tri. I feel so much better within myself. I remember I got kinda depressed in first tri with Sophia, and I am glad that i seem to be turning the corner this time as well. Just need a positive scan on Tuesday and (apart from having to move away form friends and family etc which I try toforget abotu mostly!) things will be A ok!

David is on his way home so once Sophia is up from her nap (she has started napping again in teh afternoons which is just amazing and makes such a difference to both our moods) so I am going to go and buy some yummy marks and spencer food for us for tonight, and I'll get him a bottle of wine as he has had a hard week studying. It is Comic relief tonight (for you U.S girlies it is a big fundraising event on the tv with lots of comedians and stars doign stuff). In the past i would alsways be out on the night and come home drunk and donate money I didn't have on my credit card. But tonight I shall be in and sober (and donating money I don't really have on my credit card). It is always such an up and down show as it is full of comedy interspersed with videos from Africa and UK of children dying and in poverty etc, I shall cry buckets and David will laugh at me!

Wow what a ramble, sorry, have lovely weekends everyone :hugs:


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## Pippin

Hey Shiv, does this mean David got the job???? So glad you are feeling better and second tri is firmly knocking your door down. :yipee: for 12 weeks. Can't wait to see pictures on tuesday. Are you going to be telling everyone then?? Just think we'll be in 2nd tri together for four (or five weeks if you count 12 weeks as 2nd tri) weeks before I move on. How weird is that :wacko: it's gone very quickly.


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## spidey

I'm glad you're feeling better Shiv. It's crazy how a few hormones can change our moods and make us feel like crap and depressed. I'll be thinking of you on Tuesday and you'll have to post a picture ASAP!! Enjoy your dinner and tv tonight :thumbup: I can't imagine not having an afternoon nap for Kira. She would be such a little grouchy pants!

Boothh- I love how sick you are! Not in a mean way, but I have a great feeling about this being a really sticky bean for you :thumbup: You certainly deserve it after being thru so much :hugs:

Got my opk's in the mail last night. I'm thinking it's about time that I get knocked up! I bought 50 so that should get me thru several short cycles or one of my loooong cycles :haha:


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## Shiv

David hasn't even had the interview yet :haha:

I will be telling everyone (otherwise knows as announcing on facebook :haha:) if scan is all good on Tuesday. I think most people know anyway to be honest, I have been a bit slapdash at keeping it a secret this time!

I still can't believe you are over half way Pip, crazy!

Spidey, I think it's about time you got up the duff as well, hope the OPK's do the trick:thumbup:


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## cleckner04

I know I got rid of my ticker bc they didn't have a cute weight loss one that matches the Emma piccie. :rofl: 

I'm down to 213.4 this week!! So all the weight from AF melted back off and than some. :dance: Oddly I only lost 2.5 inches though. :haha: But last week when I only lost 1 lb. I lost 5 inches. :dohh:


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## jelr

Thanks for that info Spidey - I really hoped it was just an old wives tale when people said it, but it does still strike at the heart strings when they do so it is good to know that scientifically there shouldn't be a reason. Have fun with the opks and let us know how you get on with them.

Booth: Thanks for your kind words, I know it is not fair. I really do think your great for getting through it 3 times because it is so so hard. No you can see why I was off the cigs for 6 weeks as I was saying on fb - I had planned on telling the group at my 8 week scan but unfortunately it didn't go to plan and then I couldn't face telling so many my bad news, I nearly let it slip a couple of times when we were discussing the fags but didn't want to dampen yours and Sams news and especially after Sam got bad news as she doesn't need to hear negative stories now as I know how hard that waiting is and you really have to keep positive to get through it. Like Spidey I'm so glad you are feeling sick (I know that sounds terrible but it is a great sign). I'm crossing everything for you.

Shiv: Nope no earlier appointment so if it hasn't come by next week I will take it that they are sticking with the June one which isn't that far I guess, it would be nice if it was sooner though. by the way I meant to say to you earlier that is fantastic that your mam is doing so well on the champix as that is what I'm going to do in about a months time and kick these stupid things before becoming pregnant again and having to go cold turkey. I'm so glad you are feeling better, those hormones are really a killer. I get a black sort of depression for about 2 days each cycle and it is horrible - you can see no good in anything so I can imagine how horrible you have been feeling the last few weeks and you have had a lot to deal with on top of it. I can't wait to see your pics next week, It is amazing how you can see a really clear baby at 12 weeks and only a blob at 8. Enjoy your night tonight and I hope you dont cry too much.

Pippin: Wow your pregnancy seems to be flying by - mad to think you will be in 3rd tri so soon. How is your back now and how did the hypnotherapy go?

Cleck: 2.5 inches is still brilliant - imagine that is a whole 7 inches in the last two weeks, you are doing fab - How much did you lose this week and how much now altogether? by the way how much was your machine and what make is it. I'm strongly thinking of getting one so I can track OV and luteal phase before my appointment and if there are any problems I can sort them all out there and then together. I think it would also be cool to know when everything is going on as I do get very depressed for a couple of days about 10 days before AF and my weight drives me mad when it yoyo's up around OV and I never realise until after the fact what was happening for example when AF arrives 10 tens after feeling like crap I think oh yeah that was what was wrong with me last week and when the weight drops off again after the few days I realise it must have been OV so at least if I can track these things every month I might be able to expect them and know what is going on.

Well not much news from me, the last two days weren't great, more so yesterday but I'm feeling much better again today. It may have been hormonal along with everything else as it felt a bit like I do the week before AF. We went out yesterday to see the St. patricks days parade and it also could have been that is has been the first proper trip out of the house bar to the local shop or hospital in the last few weeks so it was a bit overwhelming. There is a local boy who is in a national talent show here on tv and he was in the parade, but they got him up to the viewing stand to sing and he is only about 8 or 9 and really does have the voice of an angel and he sang tears from heaven so I was stook there like an idiot with tears streaming down my face and from then I was in the worst form and spent most of last night crying. But sure I guess I'm going to get silly days like that and thankfully I feel much better today as some of my friends were out for the day and we spent the day in the garden playing with Natasha as the sun was shining all day. They also brought me the most beautiful and huge bunch of flowers so it all really cheered me up and we had a good day.

DH has been busy doing up one of our spare rooms for Natasha to move into so we are going to use the nursery to store all her toys in until we have another baby - it is really coming along now, he has it painted and the new flooring down and he is going to start making built in wardrobes next and hopefully if he gets back to work or gets another job - we will buy sliding wardrobe doors to go over them like we have in our own room and it is keeping him busy as he has never been off for so long and is the type of man that needs to keep busy.

There is a big festival in town tomorrow for St. Patricks day called sky fest which is a huge fireworks display that is sponsered by the national lottery and it has only been held outside of dublin 4 times so we are going to head into that with my mam and brother who is home from London. I can't wait to see Natasha's reaction, I just hope she isn't scared though, although loud noises dont usually bother her so I reckon she will be fine.

Anyway that is enough drivel from me - Hope you all have a great weekend. Xx


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## Pippin

*Good luck for your scan tomorrow Shiv, enjoy seeing your baby again   I'll be looking out for the fb announcement!!!! xxx*


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## spidey

I'll be thinking of you Shiv! Post on here too since they have FB blocked at my work. If not, I will try to be patient :haha:


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## Shiv

Spidey - just for you an update :flower:
All went well at the scan, "Dilbert" as we have nicknamed him (Sophia was Philbert! and I say we, I mean me, David isn't keen!:haha:) was very chilled out and luckily was in the correct position for the NTmeasurement as he/she didn't move much ( hopefully nice and calm just like Sophia!)

here is the obligatory scan pic, feel a bit sorry for the poor wee mite hanging around upside down! Oh and I got moved forward 4 days!
 



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## spidey

awwwww Dilbert was sleepy this morning :cloud9: I'm so glad everything went well :happydance: When is Dilberts due date?

I didn't make it to work today since poor Kira is sick. She started with a fever Sunday night (102F) and was feverish all night. Monday the fever went away for a few hours in the afternoon but last night it shot back up to 102F! She still has a fever but no other symptoms. Besides being clingy she's acting normal so I'm not sure what to do. I guess I could call the doctor- I need a "how to be a parent" manual :haha:


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## Shiv

Dilbert is now due 26th Sept.

I would say if Kira's temperature reamins elevated then I would take her to the docs. Does calpol bring it down? Sophia had no real symptoms other than temperature when she was diagnosed with tonsillitis (obv her throat was inflamed etc but we could see that!), so it could be a throat infection, or ear infection etc. Hope she feels better soon!

It must be pretty early there isn't it?


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## spidey

Thanks for letting me know about Sophia's fever with no other obvious symptoms. I decided to take Kira to the doctors and it turns out that both her ears are infected. Poor thing. DH is out getting antibiotics and some other yummy treats since Kira's not eating today. 

26th September is a great time to have a birthday! Far enough from Sophia's so they can have separate parties, but not too cold outside either. I would like to have an April baby since April is a beautiful month here. If I get pregnant this cycle I will have a Christmas day baby.. but with how things are going DH and I won't even get a chance to make a baby this cycle :haha: Having a sick Kira takes all my energy- I haven't even started peeing on my opk's I'm so worn out!


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## cleckner04

Shiv- YAY!!!! :dance: September is an awesome birth month. (I was born in september. :D)

Spidey- Awww :hugs: I'm sorry Kira's sick. That sucks. I hope those antibiotics work quickly.

jelr- I know I'm late on answering this but I lost 4 lbs last week. :D And the machine I have is a clearblue fertility monitor. It is usually $149 at amazon but I got it for $130 with 30 test sticks on ebay. So def. check ebay before buying! 



I'm not being as careful with my weight this week and I'm not getting very much sleep since I'm staying up late to skype with DH while his ship is in port overseas. :blush: But the weight is creeping back on a bit because of it. :( I'm trying not to worry about it because it's not like I get to see DH very often so I think I deserve a week of a break. :D I'm still working out but the lack of sleep seems to make me gain.


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## Shiv

Spidey - sorry Kira is sick, but so glad you got her checked out so she can take her medicine and get better. Antibiotics work really quickly in LO's so she will be better in no time!

Cleck - you SO deserve a week off, enjoy seeing your lover as much as you can!


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## Shiv

Pip here you go, if I have understood your explanation of nub theory then I think there is a definite one on this pic (although it could just be a bone of some description!)
 



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## Pippin

Thanks Shiv, it could be but like you said that could look like a bit of bone but the angle is right for a boy nub, imagine it carrying on out the body, girl nubs come out the same but the run parallel to the back. Boys nub comes out at an angle pointing up, girls point flat I think it's more obvious on the first one if you turn him the right way up. It's missing the top bit but I'm pretty sure what I'm looking at is the start of the nub where it comes out of the body (the bit I circled on fb). Hope you don't mind me guessing I know some people do just tell me to stop if you want me to. :hugs:


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## Shiv

Don't mind guessing, I'll do enough of it myself over the next 27 weeks or so!


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## Pippin

I take my hat off to you as the guessing for 17 weeks drove me mad enough. I'm just so impatient I need to know. I think it's because I wanted a girl but more because I needed to give him/her an identity in my head. Silly really as why I don't know. I look forward to comparing bumps and symptoms for the next 27 weeks :haha: I found most of the wives tales that did come true showed themselves about half way. Like now I'm spotty, unattractive and feeling yuck, where as with Sam I was healthy and lively and looked much better! My nails and hair (including fast growth) were lovely with Sam around 20 weeks, now they are just normal if not worse! The spots are the biggest thing for me.... I feel like the pregnancy glow took one look at me and ran in the other direction :cry:


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## spidey

I didn't know the sex with Kira and I don't plan to find out with the next one either. It's fun having everyone make guesses :thumbup: If I tap down deep inside myself... I think Shiv is having a..... GIRL! 

I am wrong 100% of the time so far, so that probably means you're having a boy :haha: Shiv, what did everyone guess when you were carrying Sophia? I went against all the old wives tales so everyone (and myself) were convinced I was having a boy. Even the sonographer looked at Kira's nub at 13 weeks and was 98% certain she was a boy! (she wrote it down and sealed her guess for me). I'm sure you all remember me saying how Kira had to wear boy clothes for awhile because everyone bought blue before she was born :haha:


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## Shiv

Everyone thought Sophia was a boy (from my symptoms and the way I carried), I agreed on the surface but deep down I thought she might be a girl. I had a few dreams in third tri about having a girl (who was always called Elizabeth for some reason in the dream).

I am unsure this time, I think I quite want another girl, but a boy would be ok too so we have one of each. I think if I had another girl i could stop at that, but if I had a boy then i might try for another girl mainly because I have so many gorgeous girly clothes that Sophia only wore a few times and I would be sad to never have another girl to put them in. It feels horrible to admit I have a preference, but I guess I am lucky that either way i get a good result, as long as there is a healthy baby!

i am scared to have a boy as everyone I know who has had one seemed to find them very demanding, especially breastfeeding wise and that scares me as Sophia was SO relaxed and "easy".

hmmmmmmm ramble ramble


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## jelr

Shiv: - I'm so happy for you all went well as I know how nervous you were and yay for moving up for days. Your officially in 2nd tri now yipee. Sorry but I reckon boy for some reason, ha ha but then i'm only ever right half of the time, it is usually a lucky guess if I am lol - I reckon once they are second children they are not as demanding anyway as they have no choice lol so you will be grand even if it is a boy.

Spidey: Poor Kira - two ear injections - no wonder she is poorly. I hope she is better soon.

Cleck: Wow 4lbs is brilliant - Ah feck it you definitely deserve a week off and talking to and seeing Corey is what is important this week and you had such a good week last week you have some leverage so dont worry as you can sort it out next week. Mmm I may have to hold off on that so as we are watching the pennies here with DH off work.

Pippin: Wow I wouldn't have had a clue about nubs lol, Sorry you are feeling the pregnancy glow has missed you this time, I hope it all settles down and you feel a bit better soon.

Regarding the sex - we were team yellow on Natasha but I reckon for a 2nd baby I would find out, for pure lazyness as we have all Natasha's clothes stored in the attic and it would break my heart to have to wash them all and then a boy pops out - so next time I think we will be finding out, although I will have to convince DH as he had said with the recent pregnancy that he didn't want to know.

No real news from me - back to work for me and it was okay, I was very upset last night as I have put on over a stone to a stone and a half between christmas, pregnancy and eating myself stupid the last two weeks and it has all gone on my stomach and I actually look pregnant so I was really paranoid today that people would guess that I was pregnant after being off sick for 3 weeks and unfortunately as you all know I'm not anymore, so I just felt like today was going to be about dodging questions about why I was out when I should be 12 weeks pregnant and telling everyone good news.

It wasn't actually as bad as i thought it would be and I was so busy I didn't really have time to think about it all - I'm shattered though and did a very silly thing and decided to call my hairdresser to come and cut my hair - not a good idea to make radical changes when your fed up - I got her to give me one of those bobs that are long at the front and short at the back but I actually wanted it much longer in the front and I just wanted a different look where as now it just looks like I got most of my hair chopped off eeek - Ah it will grow back and it does look much healthier - just a bit school girl looking on me lol

On a good note - Natasha's room is nearly finished - DH was a busy bee today and my mam watched Natasha and he got all the wardrobes built into her new room, so we just need to get the sliding doors and curtains and some wall decals and it is done, he painted it and put down new flooring last week. Oh and I got some retail therapy in while on my lunch today and bought all Natasha's summer clothes, although I kinda feel bad now as we really are meant to be watching our pennies with DH off and I spent nearly &#8364;200 - but then again - she will need it and I shouldn't need to get anything else for the summer, although I probably will lol


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## cleckner04

:hugs: I'm glad you are back to work and doing okay with that. You seem to be in much better spirits! Did you post piccies of the new haircut on FB? If not, post them on here! :D I have long hair now but sometimes I get this huge urge to chop it all off. I have done it twice cutting off a ton and than I donate the hair to locks of love. (Do you ladies have locks of love there?) Anyways, it always feels so great to have all that weight off your head. :haha: 

I also gained weight when I miscarried. I ended up gaining 20 lbs. from the august that I miscarried until November when I got pregnant with Emma. So that's a lot of weight really fast and I never lost it back off before getting pregnant again. :blush: I think eating is such a comfort when upset. 


Okay, I'm off for a walk before it gets too dark out! :D


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## spidey

Jelr- LOL about your haircut. I use to have bad pms and right before AF each month I would be most likely to make a drastic change to my hair when I went thru my monthly "I'm ugly" phase. Hormones are awful things sometimes! I like the haircut you're describing and I bet it looks great! I wanted to do that to my hair but the hair dresser refused saying my hair was to thin! I'm glad work wasn't too bad for you. Don't beat yourself up about the weight. Between hormones and going thru a hard time it's to be expected. :hugs: I would LOVE to see pictures of Natasha's room when you're done. I could use some idea's for when we do Kira's room one day, and I'm very nosey when it comes to looking in other people's houses :blush:

Shiv- I've heard the opposite regarding boys and bf. I hear that boys are more laid back in general. It goes to show that it all depends on the baby! It's so funny because I would like another girl for the same reason- to give a second chance to some of Kira's cute outfits that she only wore once :haha: Plus I know what to expect with a girl. With a boy we have to decide whether or not to circumcise (DH is Jewish and I'm not- so we have mixed ideas on it). I think secretly DH wants a boy that will have similar interests in wood working as him... but DH claims that he wants all girls. But really, I would be super happy with a healthy baby who weighs less than 10 pounds at birth, no matter the gender :haha:

Pippin- are you feeling regular movement now?


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## spidey

oops.. took me forever to post! Cleckner- how many inches do you need for locks of love? I haven't cut mine since last summer and with warmer weather I'm getting the urge to chop it all off!!! I had really short hair once and liked it, but now that I don't get pms anymore I haven't done anything drastic in a loooooong time :haha:


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## cleckner04

I think you need 10 inches for it. 

I always get itchy to do new things to my hair. I've even dyed it black with bright red tips once. :shock: It was AWESOME! :rofl: And I've bleached it. It looked horrible bc I'm so pale. One day while DH was at work I cut my own hair off. It was down to my waist and I got so sick of it so I chopped it up to my chin. :rofl::rofl: DH was NOT amused. But I felt better!


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## cleckner04

I got a high on my monitor today!! It's only CD 12. Last month I got my first High reading on CD 14. So hopefully I ovulate 2 days earlier and have a longer luteal phase!! :dance: I've still been taking that B6 so we'll see if it worked.


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## Shiv

That's great news Cleck - that would be so cool if you get your longer luteal phase sorted in just one month!


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## spidey

wow, 10 inches is alot of hair! I would love to see a picture of you with black hair with red tips! I've never been that daring :haha:

I'm really liking your monitor Cleck... I'll get one if the next couple cycles are failures!

I peed on my first opk last night and it was negative. It was cd 8 for me. I can't wait to see if my nips get sore before, during or after ovulation. If they get sore before ovulation I won't need to buy a monitor :haha:

Part of me doesn't want to ttc this month but I need to stop being silly and get over my aversion to having a baby with a birthday close to x-mas. I just really hated it as a kid. Maybe I won't ovulate this cycle since Kira is back to nursing 100 times a day, LOL! She's still not eating solids so her ears must be hurting still, poor thing.


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## cleckner04

I was explaining the monitor more to DH today on Skype and he thinks it's pretty cool too. :haha: He thought it was much bigger but I held it up and showed the size compared to my hand and it's about the same size as my hand. 

I'll have to dig up the pictures of me with black hair. It didn't stay that way for long. I loved it but it was hard to keep up with my roots. :haha: The pictures of me with dark hair I don't particularly like though because I was super chubby. :blush: It was my chubby newlywed phase in our marriage. lol! (Although I was still like 15 lb. smaller than I am now. :dohh:)


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## spidey

Kira is being super duper cranky this evening! The whining and screaming from the past 3 days have brought me to the breaking point, so I'm hiding upstairs right now as DH deals with it downstairs. It's either that or lay on the floor and cry, so this seems like the better option.

I need to look for pictures of when I had short hair. Maybe I will do something drastic in the next couple of weeks!


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## cleckner04

Okay. I spent all evening going through old pictures on my other computer. And I updated my randoms folder on facebook if any of you want to nosy through. I even had to start a second randoms folder. :haha: They are in order that it occurred for the most part too. Including pictures of me with black hair, than black hair with red tips! :haha: And short hair, etc. I get so nostalgic looking through old pictures. :blush: There are a few that I was pregnant with Cameron in and it makes me sad because I looked so happy. No one would know which pictures they are though.


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## spidey

Cleckner- I just had sooo much fun peering thru your old pictures :blush: I love all your bump pictures in your other randoms folder. It took me awhile, but I found you with black hair and red tips!!! Dark brown hair actually looked good on you, although I prefer your natural red hair :thumbup: We must have been doing the exact same thing last night because I got out all my old pictures and was being nostalgic. I can't believe how skinny I was 10 years ago- and I'm skinny now, so imagine me 25 pounds lighter! I've been with DH for 13 years so we were just kids in some of the pictures. Then I looked at some old bump pictures and my god!!! I was huge! I really can't remember being that pregnant. :rofl: I also have pictures of me minutes after pushing out 10 pound Kira with no epidural and I look awful! I haven't shown those pictures to anyone, and I haven't really looked at them myself until last night. So embarrassing!


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## cleckner04

I love looking through old pictures too! The ones of DH and I earlier in our relationship are just picture form not digital on a computer or anything. Those are the best ones to see. I was 15 when we started dating so it's weird to see. I can't believe I'll have been with him for 10 years this year. :shock: I can't believe you guys have been together for 13!! That's awesome! You should post up some old pictures! :D I love nosing through people's pictures too. :haha:


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## Shiv

You are such a poser Cleck :haha: Love looking through old piccies. I used to have really short hair once upon a time and was really skinny, I'll see if I can find a piccy!

Spidey, I'd love to see a pic of you whilst pregnant with Kira, I can't imagine someone so slight, carrying a 10lber!


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## jelr

Well the lesson of the day is definitely dont go chopping your hair off when hormonal Spidey because I really hate mine lol - aw well it will grow back. - Sorry to hear Kira is so cranky, she is probably wrecked after being sick all week - although you probably are too. I hate days like that, they are so hard. I bet you will be pregnant this month because you have such an aversion to becoming pregnant this month lol - I'll will be posting pics of the room when it is all done but I have got loads as the stages go along. I love looking at other peoples houses too lol

Cleck your monitor is cool but I will wait and see how money goes for the moment and I spent enough this week between Natasha's room. I'm going to have a nosey at your pics now, I would say Corey got a shock to see all your hair gone, we are the oppoisite here at the moment DH keeps telling me my hair suits me short but I hate it but then I reckon he is only saying that to make me feel better. I know isn't it funny how some things bring back the memories and the pain of a mc - my mam says that she still sometimes remembers back and it still hurts so I guess it will never truly go away just get easier with time. Nope I have no pics on fb as I'm hiding from the camera at the moment as when I put on weight I always see it in pics - I might put some up but only let you guys have access - they are not very nice though :-(

Shiv: You are always skinny but I would love to see you with short hair.

Well not much news from me I'm just shattered after work this week and Natasha is not sleeping again so the tiredness has made me pretty cranky and weepy and my brother went back to London this morning but I'll be grand at least work is finished for the week and hopefully next week will be easier. I think it was just hard to dodge the questions as my boss and one of the others girls just knows and everyone else was just told I was in hospital and I'm terrified that people will guess so I have been wearing trousers which are too tight all week as I feel I look pregnant in any of my Jumper dresses so it has been hard in that sense as I would have been 12 weeks this week and would been telling people. Aww well at least that is the first week over and next week should be easier - i guess they are all stepping stones.

Anyway on a good note we are heading to the nearest city tomorrow for the day and are going to order the sliding doors for Natashas wardrobes and we have seen the cutest little childrens couch that will match the decor - its funny its like I'm on a mission to spend money this week when I should be watching the pennies but then I had saved &#8364;1500 to do the wardrobes as we got the ones in our bedroom done last year and they cost &#8364;2000 so I reckoned the ones for her room would be a little cheaper as it is a smaller wall and it has only cost us &#8364;700 as DH made up the frame and we just need to buy the doors so technically I'm just spending the money that would have been spent if DH was working as he wouldn't have got the time to do them himself - well thats my excuse anyway and I'm sticking to it lol

We are also heading out for dinner on Saturday night 2 of my best friends and their husbands so i'm looking forward to that.


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## cleckner04

Shiv- You are still skinny now! :D Well, you may be getting fatter by the week for some reason though. :winkwink: 

jelr- definitely post piccies for us on here to see! You can leave it up for like a day and than delete. :haha: That's what I did when I posted my weight loss pictures cause I'm in a bra and yoga pants so not exactly something I want to show the world. :shy: 

Pretty soon I'll get to add to my weight progress pictures!! The 210 mark is just within my reach. I sneakily weighed myself this morning and I was down to 211.6 and that's 2 lbs off from last week. And I wasn't even trying to lose weight this week. Just relaxing and enjoying DH instead. Although I did still work out most days. 

Thinking of Shiv talking about how thin she was, I've never been super thin. Always had a softer middle but I'm curvy and I love that. Even now I love my body. The only thing I hate is the spot that hangs over my c-section scar. And I'm not super fond of my stretchmarks but only because I would love to get a tattoo on my side but there isn't much room with the stretchmarks. :rofl::rofl: Are you ladies the type that don't really like your OH's see you naked? I have talked with friends and they talk about only wanting to do it in the dark or they leave their tops on, etc. I walk around my house completely naked and don't care. :rofl: I know I'm a sexy beast. LMAO.


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## spidey

tonight I will post some pics here of me fully pregnant and of me and DH when we were in high school.. and maybe super skinny short haired Spidey :haha: Kira had another rough night since she developed an allergy to her antibiotic and broke out in hives everywhere yesterday afternoon. She's on another antibiotic now and allergy medicine for the hives, but she was still itchy and miserable last night. I'm so sleep deprived that my whole body is feeling it and I'm peeing out my butt :haha: I had to wake up waaay too early for work this morning so thats not helping things.

jelr- enjoy shopping this weekend and your dinner Sat. night! I bet your hair really does look great- when I get a drastic haircut it always takes a week for my hair to settle down and for me to get use to it. Congrats on making it thru 1 work week :hugs:

Cleckner- yipee for losing weight on your week off :happydance: 

DH sees me naked all the time because him and Kira hang out in the bathroom as I take my bath. But I prefer lights to be off or dim when we're in the moment :haha: It might sound silly, but I get distracted easily so if the lights are off I have a better chance of focusing on the task at hand, LOL! Cleckner- you are a sexy beast!! 

Shiv- post some pics of super skinny Shiv! 

I've never felt pretty and whenever I see a picture of me I always see my flaws, but when I was looking back at 10 year old pictures I looked great! So my new- new years resolution is to stop being hard on myself because I'm sure in 10 years I'll look at pictures of myself now and have the same realization!


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## spidey

this is what I found so far... 

me at 37 weeks.. silly me thought she would come any day. I still had a month to wait!
https://www.razortoe.com/share/bump1.jpg

8 days overdue and still 2 more to go!
https://www.razortoe.com/share/bump2.jpg

me and DH at our wedding almost 5 years ago. I had shorter hair and was 15 pounds lighter than now, but not super skinny (I still need to find that picture!). We were drinking really nasty wine when this picture was taken. DH is Jewish so to please his mother we agreed to drink wine and then stomp on the wine glass. :haha: 
https://www.razortoe.com/share/married.JPG


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## cleckner04

OMG spidey are you a punk?! :haha: You look SO cute on your wedding day! And you say you aren't super skinny in that picture! :shock: That is my idea of super skinny. Anything under that would be someone from Ethiopia. :lol: Also, you are another that didn't get stretchmarks I see..just another reason to hate you. :winkwink: :muaha: 



So I weighed in again this morning and I ended up officially losing 1.6 lbs. this week. I have no clue how because I even skipped 2 days of workouts. But I am going to take it anyways. :rofl: I'll take it where I can get it. So only 11.8 lbs before I'm at pre-Emma weight! :dance: Which is my first main goal. I'm so excited. I feel like I can just about do it before getting knocked up again. :rofl:

DH even saw me naked on our skype dates. :rofl::rofl: He's always asking for dirty pictures. Such a sick man.....but I still sent the dirty pictures...:rofl:


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## jelr

Cleck: You are a sexy beast - You are so confident and ooze sex appeal in all your random pics, I'm am so not confident like that - DH does see me naked and like spidey - himself and Natasha sit in the bathroom when I'm having a bath and we dont do the deed with the lights off but I dont walk around naked either and do tend to cover myself up - its only in the last few years that I let him see me naked and we are together 10 years this year. lol at you sending the dirty pics, I think your hubby is just normal my DH would so want the same if he was away, he even wants them when he lives with me lol - but that sort of confidence I definitely dont have lmao

Spidey: I agree with Cleck, you are super skinny there - i have never been that skinny not even as a child lol - I so wish I could be that skinny - You really were all bump when you were pregnant lol - I put on weight everywhere even on my fingers ha ha It took me 4 months or after Natasha was born to get my wedding rings back on, I know it was partly the odema but it was also weight as well.


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## jelr

Ok I finally put the pics of my hair on the laptop so I'll upload them to fb but I will only allow you three to see them as we have been chatting about it - If anybody wants to see my disasterous hair (well its not that bad really, I just dont like my hair short, but in fairness I am actually staring to get used to it today) just let me know and I will add you to the list of people allowed to see - I was gonna put it up for all of bnb to see but I reckoned the others will be thinking why is she putting up pics of her hair lol


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## cleckner04

Oo I commented on the pics on facebook without even realizing I'm one of the only ones that can see it. :haha: I feel special. ;) 

I still can't take my wedding rings off properly since having Emma. Even with all this lost weight. For the longest time I literally couldn't get the band off. I could get my engagement ring off but not the band. Now they both come off but it's still a struggle. :dohh: I think I may just have to resize them bc I'm just stuck with fat hands now. :haha: 

I'm confident while at home. But if you get me down to the pool in a swimsuit in front of strangers, than I feel nervous but not to the point that it'd stop me from getting in and enjoying myself. But nervous enough that I want a towel covering me as soon as I'm back out. :lol: 

I think that's one thing I miss about being pregnant. I would wear anything in my closet and feel completely confident about it bc I thought my bump was so beautiful. People can't think 'oh look how fat she is' because I was clearly pregnant. :haha:


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## spidey

haha.. I agree that I was super skinny in my wedding picture, BUT I was even more skinny (ethiopia style) a few years before that. :haha: I ate like a horse, but I couldn't keep weight on. Right around the time I got married I was diagnosed with having a food allergy and when I cut the food out (wheat, rye, barley, oats) I went from 95 pounds to 115 which was great! When I was super super skinny it was around the time that eating disorders received a lot of press, so I had complete strangers asking if I was anorexic. :shock: I really wanted to be curvy and fill out my clothes nicely, and I hated how everyone would assume I had an eating disorder. Once at my work the secretary brought in donuts and made some remark like "I'd offer you one but you probably wouldn't eat it" and I got so mad that I stuffed 2 of them in my mouth while she watched me in horror. She always made comments about my weight and after that she never commented on me having anorexia again! :haha:

Oh, and my wedding ring still doesn't fit since pregnancy. My feet also grew a size :haha: 

jelr- I checked out your hair pics and it looks really good! It's a stylish cut, but doesn't look immature. Thats the kind of cut I want :thumbup:

Cleckner- congrats on the weight loss! I know you can lose those last 11.8 pounds :happydance:

Me as ethiopia spidey!
https://www.razortoe.com/share/mule.jpg


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## cleckner04

LOL ethiopia style. :haha: That's probably really racist of me to say or offensive in some way. :blush: Ahh who am I kidding, I'm not politically correct, I like comedians like george carlin. :D

You are super skinny in that picture. Like your clavicle bones especially sticking out. But I don't think you look sick, just super thin. I wish I had the problem of eating like a horse and not gaining. :haha: I definitely think you look better now with a bit of weight on your bones though. :flower:


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## Shiv

Well I for one am offended by your Ethiopia comments Cleck, I have a long lost cousin from there and your comments really hurt ..........................:haha::haha::haha::haha: just kidding, obviously, I hate political correctness, sometimes I think the world has gone mad!!

Well I don't wanna post my "skinny" pic now, cos I am nowhere near as skinny as Spidey was :haha: I did only weigh about 6 stone though! Excuse the photo, I am 18 and on my first holiday away with friends after we finished school, it was about 6am and we had just got back from a foam party (thus I had blue feet where the dye in my shoes had run, and am not in an outfit I would normally wear!) My hair is also wet and slicked back, i didn't rock the lesbian frequently! :haha:

Spidey, I saw your first preggo photo and thought , "ha that's not that big", then saw the next one and was like "woah" that is what a slim woman carrying a 10lb baby looks like :haha:

Cleck, well done on your weightloss. That is a real result still losing weight on an off week. You are so close to being pre-emma weight!:happydance:

Hmmm nakedness. David sees me naked when I am wandering around before bed and stuff but i can't sleep naked because I freak out and have bad dreams about people seing my naked butt! I am certainly not confident about by body, but am looking forward to having a proper bump again as like you CLeck, I felt really confident in whatever I wore, because it was bump, not fat!
 



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## spidey

Shiv- you are ethiopia style skinny too! :haha: 

I was a walking freak show during my last 2-3 weeks of pregnancy and I dreaded having to leave the house. Nearly everyone would stare and make unnecessary comments, like "you should have sex and that will make the baby come out". I can laugh about it now but at the time I wanted to kill everyone! :haha:

Kira is still a miserable girl
https://www.razortoe.com/share/hive.jpg
The poor thing is covered in hives. She's hardly eaten any solids this week and I can feel my milk supply going up from all the nursing she's doing. Twice today I had to walk away and let her cry because there was nothing I could do. I thought a trip to the store would cheer her up, but she was whining and crying so badly that I only got as far as the carseat and then gave up and we came back inside. I know she's miserable, but the whining and crying is driving me crazy. The stupid thing is that she's perfectly okay when I'm not around. But when she sees me, she unloads all her whines and doesn't want to play or do anything fun- just sit on me and nurse and cry! She's regressed too, and hasn't been saying any words and has started gagging on food like a 6 month old!

I am sooo not wanting to make another baby at the moment :haha: I started doing my opk's twice a day today and still no positives.


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## cleckner04

Shiv- You are super skinny too! I hate you all. :rofl: 

spidey- I wasn't all that big in the end and I still had people asking if I was having twins. :wacko: People are rude IMO. I would never comment to a pregnant woman like that. 

Poor Kira. :( She looks miserable. I guess enjoy all the extra cuddles while you can. :hugs: I hope she's better soon. I hate when they are sick. :nope: Emma had one day of being 'sick' last week and I say 'sick' because I'm not sure what the hell was wrong with her. She had a fever of 102 and that's it. She wasn't coughing, wasn't throwing up or anything like that..just a fever. :shrug: And it only lasted a day. But she BF all day long too and wanted cuddles and if I moved her too much she'd just whine.


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## spidey

Thats so bizarre Cleckner about Emma's fever. Kira had the same thing. No other symptoms- not even a snotty nose. Hers lasted more than 2 days though so thats why I took her to the doctors and the doctor said her ears were infected. Part of me doesn't believe it was her ears since she wasn't touching them or anything, but we gave her that stupid antibiotic and now she has hives. I just need to make it thru Sunday and Monday and then Tuesday I'll get a break when I go to work. I feel awful for saying that. I am so close to my breaking point right now that I'm considering not co-sleeping tonight and let DH deal with it. I don't know how you do it Cleckner. DH is gone all day every day recently, but atleast he's here at night.


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## cleckner04

It's a gift really. Just bow down to my greatness. :smug: :rofl: 

Is she allergic to the antibiotics or is that just one of the side effects that could happen?


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## spidey

LOL, I am bowing! I'm all talk and no action- laying in bed now with my sleeping whiney princess.

She's on a new antibiotic since that first one she's allergic too, but the hives might stick around for a week or so. She inherited my crappy allergy genes. The antibiotic that she's on now is one that I get hives from, so its probably only a matter of time!

Did you feel yourself ovulate again this cycle Cleck?


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## cleckner04

Haven't ovulated yet so we'll see! Hopefully tomorrow. Last month I got high readings four days before I peaked. Today was day four of a high so hopefully in the morning I'll have a peak. :D I have noticed more CM the past few days too. It's crazy how I am finally noticing these things now that I actually know where I am in a cycle and I'm paying attention. :haha:


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## Shiv

Oh SPidey I hope Kira cheers up soon, I know EXACTLY what you mean about the whining and needing a break. Give it a week and she will be back to her happy self and it will be so great becuase you will have forgotten how great that is!

Cleck, that is funny how you ar enow noticing cm, I always wondered how people couls miss it, but of course i was the same until I started looking out for it!

David is now away again until Thursday, but Sophia has been sleeping like a dream (sorry Spidey!) and I had to wake her up at 10.45am this morning (although really it was 9.45am as the clocks went forward an hour last night). Although I do wonder what time she will go to bed tonight now! And she won't nap in the afternoon if she wakes up late, so it's swings and roundabouts really!


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## spidey

our clocks went forward a few weeks ago and I was such a nerd. I adjusted bedtime and nap time by 20 minutes each day for 2 days leading up to the change. So instead of a drastic 1 hour change, it was 3 days of 20 minute change. :haha: I also had Kira outside most of those 3 days to really wear off her energy. :thumbup:

Thats so cool Cleckner about you noticing ewcm! I'm certain you'll get knocked up the first few weeks that Corey is back!

Shiv- I hope you're right about Kira! She's still a cranky princess this morning and I'm considering taking her into the city where DH is working today for a change of scenery.


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## cleckner04

I Peaked today!!! :dance: I'm almost 100% certain I peaked on CD 18 last cycle. Today is only CD 16 for me. So fingers X'ed my period doesn't come for another 2 weeks. :D

Oh yeah, I also gained a lb. overnight again. :dohh: So definitely ovulation gain. :roll:


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## Shiv

at least you know it'll fall off again, that egg must weigh a pound :haha:


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## jelr

No I have no problem with my rings now - I had to take them off when I was about 7 months pregnant though or they were going to have to be cut off and I wasn't having that so I just bought a cheap band as I missed them like crazy. Spidey I'm glad I'm not the only one thats feet have changed I'm about a half size bigger - funny what pregnancy can do for our bodies.

Yep that pic is definitely super skinny spidey - I have a friend that is the very same as you and can't put on weight - she has even drank those special complan drinks that really sick people drink to help put on weight before she got pregnant. She has made me realise that we all seem to be unhappy with our shapes as I presumed everybody that was super skinny would be so happy with their size, but she gets so upset that she can't put on weight just as much as I do about putting it on.

big *hugs* for Kira being sick and miserable - I hope she is better soon, I hear ya on the breaking point - Natasha had two weeks of not sleeping and was like a demon around the time I found out I was pregnant and I was exactly the same - for the first time I actually was happy to go to work as my patients was at its lowest. Funily enough she is back to not sleeping this week and again is like a demon with tiredness but I actually seem to have more tolerance - I think part of it is because of the mc I just keep saying to myself well where would I be without the whinging and what if her pregnancy had ended the same way, although I actually have a funny feeling it is a lot to do with DH being here all the time instead of me having to manage her on my own on my days off - it makes such a difference when there is too of you dealing with it - so it must be tough when your dh is working so much at the moment - Cleck I also bow to your greatness lol as I would be useless on my own for that long. As shiv said though when she is back to yourself it is so so great after bad weeks - Natasha was actually back to her normal self today and I spent all day telling her what a great girls she was and I just couldn't stop kissing her for being so good lol

Cleck: Yay for peaking earlier this month - fx af stays away for at least 12 to 14 days and it is great that you at least know this time that it is ovulation weight so as it wont get you down as there is nothing worse when you are being so good to see that scales go up. I love that monitor lol - does it keep a note of what days your highs are on each month in the memory or do you have to keep track of that yourself. I still think you are great that you are so confident at home as I'm not hense that is why I dont walk around naked - I dont mind DH seeing me but I hate seeing myself if that makes sense - I wish I was more at ease with myself.

Shiv: you are super super skinny in that pic too, but then you are lovely and slim normally. How are you feeling now? when is your next appointment?

Well not much news from me, we were out for dinner last night and it was lovely to catch up with the girls - I was a bit apprehensive as 1 of them has moved up the country so we dont get to see each other much and she is 22 weeks pregnant. Dont get me wrong I'm so happy for her and I know she felt bad when I mc and I told her not to feel bad for a second and just to cherish that lo in her belly but I was a big apprehensive about seeing her with a bump but It was fine - the only thing that bothered me was I look more pregnant than she does at 22 weeks lol - she is super skinny too and only has a slight bump and looks fantastic for 22 weeks, so I do envy that lol


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## cleckner04

shiv- I must be producing ostrich eggs. :haha:

jelr- No the monitor doesn't save that for me to look up. I wish it did though! I just have a little calendar that I'm using specifically for TTC and 'charting' I guess you'd call it even though I'm not doing temping or anything. But it's easy to just look back to last month this way. And about me being confident at home, I'm always checking myself out in the mirrors. :rofl: The closet in my bedroom has sliding doors and they are giant mirrors so I'm always standing and spinning to check myself out. :blush: Being in denial a little bit always helps with the confidence. :rofl: When I see pictures of myself, that's when I freak out.


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah, forgot to say, I'm cramping right now!! :D:D


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## spidey

POP goes Cleckners ovary!!!

I took Kira to the house that DH is fixing up. It's almost done so it was pretty safe for her to play in. She had fun playing with screws and nails and running up and down the length of the house! She's still not eating so her only food has been booby milk. She's having poops like a newborn again! Runny breast milk poos that don't smell bad! She's had firm stinky poos since 8 months when she really started to eat solids, so it's been a shocker having to use tons of wipes and change her clothes from leaks again. She will put food in her mouth but she spits it all back out. It's upsetting not having her eat, but today I acted like I didn't care in front of Kira. I have a feeling that she's extending her food strike from the attention she's getting.

jelr- I'm glad you have a nice dinner with the girls and you did well seeing your pregnant friend. :hugs:

Cleckner- I bet your neighbors are always happy people- they can look out and get a good peep show :haha:

Still no positives on my opks and my nips aren't telling me anything either!


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## cleckner04

Your DH is fixing up a house?! That's so awesome! It would be so nice to have a woodworking type of husband. You could buy a total crap house for cheap and he could fix it all up. :haha:

I always am super paranoid about having my blinds closed tight. So definitely nobody peeping here. :D The neighbors attached to me are the only ones I'd care about though, the husband is seriously hot. LOL! And I thought he was hot when I was still getting :sex: regularly so you can only imagine how hot I think he is now that I'm basically celibate. (Do celibate people masturbate??) 

What cycle day are you on spidey? You think this is gonna be one of those long cycle again?


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## spidey

LOL Cleckner, so YOU don't have to be careful of your neighbors, THEY have to be careful of you! :haha: I suppose celibate people can masturbate too :haha:

I'm still early yet- cd 14. So in the next few days I expect some nip soreness and a positive opk. But with everything that's happening this month, I wouldn't be surprised if it was a long cycle. Kira is still nursing like a newborn, so that might slow this cycle down. I have 50 of the opk's so they should get me thru.

Cleckner- what hormone does your fancy device measure? The opk's I have say they measure LH and from the graphs I found online, LH seems to peak right before ovulation. So I assume that once I see a positive opk then I should start :sex: ASAP. If I get a positive opk tonight, DH won't be home, but I guess when I see him tomorrow night we can get it on and still be okay. Hmmm.. soo complicated!


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## cleckner04

Apparently it measures LH too which is weird because with OPKs you are supposed to take them in the afternoon but my monitor asks you to use FMU. I'm not really sure why that is. 

Also, I have peaks on 2 days and I don't know if I should count the first day or the second day as my day of ovulation. But I had distinct cramping yesterday so I'm sure I must've ovulated than. Today I've had no cramping at all but it's still a 'peak' reading until tomorrow when it'll turn to 'high'.


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## cleckner04

Also wanted to add, I do think you should :sex: as soon as you can after a positive OPK. Just the be safe. :thumbup:


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## spidey

Cleckner- I think you should count your ovulation day as the one where you felt cramping. Thats weird how your device collects first morning pee. I pee on my sticks at 1pm and 9pm  I often pee in the middle of the night, so I'm not sure if that would screw up my readings once I buy myself one of those nifty monitors!

No positive opks for me yet so I'm super boring Spidey!


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## Shiv

So Cleck when are you hoping AF will turn up?

Spidey - and +ve OPK yet?

Well the news here is that David has been offered that job that he went for the interview a week or so ago. Which should be a relief but now I actually have to DO something! They want him to start on June 1st (so only 2 months) which works out well with his last day at his present job which should be around May10th. SO we need to get our house up for sale ASAP. But with the market as it is I can't see it selling very quickly and we can't afford to pay our mortgage and rent a house where he will be working so I don't know what we aer going to do :wacko:


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## Pippin

:hi: ladies, I've been super poorly last two days :( with a stomach bug. Think I'm out the other side now just have to get some food in me but not looking forward to that.

Shiv that is fantastic news about the job, bet you are relieved and I'm so happy for you. I realise it's all a bit quick but you'll get it sorted somehow. How far away from you is it? Could David commute for a while or even stay up there half the week and come back at weekends until it's sold? You never know it might fly off the shelf! My Aunty put her house on the market a month ago and it sold to the first viewer, didn't even get the leaflet printed. Good luck though.

I've hit V day :yipee:


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## jelr

Cleck: Pity the monitor didn't record as well but sure I suppose then I just expect to much I would want it to pee on the stick for me too lol - still it is pretty cool and cool you can now feel yourself ovulating. I know what you mean about photos though - I can see straight away by my face if I have put weight on - I think your great. it is good to have confidence even if it is at home, I wish I did. Mmm good question about celibate people - man they would be terribly frustrated if they didn't but then maybe if they have never O'd they wouldn't know what they were missing lol

Spidey: any positives since or any nipple pain?? I would definitely dtd as soon as you get a postitive one. I hope Kira is better now, times like that are so stressful, We are into full blown tantrums here these days and it is not easy I dread when DH goes back to work as I know I wont cope as well.

Shiv: Congrats I think, is this the job you were having doubts about because of moving away and DH travelling. How are you feeling about it all now or is it just a case of dealing with the stress of moving. I hope it all goes well for you.

Pippin: Sorry to hear you have been ill - I thankfully never seem to get stomach bugs and it is a good job too, give me pain anyday but I turn into a total baby when I am sick - I hope your feeling completely back to normal soon.

Well not much news from me, Natasha is really hitting the terrible twos these days and it all seems to relate to how she has slept - if she has a good night then she is top form but on the days where she hasn't, boy it is tough work. I actually thought she was going to have one of those horrible melt downs that you see on the tv in the supermarket today and that would be my worst nightmare - DH was packing away the shopping and shortly before we got to the checkout we had let her out of the trolley as she was getting fed up (lesson learned, she will never get out of the trolley again) - I was trying to get her to hold my hand but she wanted to just run off and she lay down on the floor when trying to escape me trying to catch her hand and I though Oh boy here we go, but thankfully she got back up again and just ran off. I really do dread when DH goes back to work as at the moment she will only listen to him and just ignores me *face palm* - aw well I guess we have to take the good with the bad and she does get cuter by the day too. 

I think AF will probably appear in about 10 days as I had that horrible pms depression the last few days and there were lots of tears and snapping at poor dh, although I wasn't totally blameless as he hasn't been in the best of form the last few days himself - I think not working is really starting to get him down as Natasha's room is finished bar the curtains and wardrobe doors which still have to be delivered and he really does need to keep busy and I know he hates not being the provider at the moment. I reckon I will be doing well though if AF does arrive as it means my cycle is right on target and it usually never is when I have put on weight or haven't done low carbs as weight and carbs seem to affect pcos or it does with me anyway. I'm starting back on the low carb on Monday to shift this extra weight and hopefully have my body and cycles back to normal for ttc later in the year.

No more news from me - happy mothers day to all for Sunday (Is it mothers day on Sunday in the us also)


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## spidey

congrats Shiv on David getting the job! You're going to have a busy few months ahead of you! If you find any potential houses you can share the link here and I can check them out. I LOVE looking at inside pictures of houses :blush: Are the houses more or less expensive where you are moving? How are you feeling about the whole thing?

Pippin- I hope your food stayed down. I hate throwing up- it feels like the end of the world to me when I'm sick like that. Congrats on 24 weeks :happydance::happydance: To me the time has flown by!!!

jelr- Mothers day is in May here.. it's funny how it's on different days. I'm so glad Natasha didn't have a total meltdown in the store! That is one of my fears too because I'm always too worried about what other people will think. I always bring a purse full of distractions for Kira- things that she loves but I usually don't let her play with. My keys, a tube of butt ointment, lollipops and fingernail trimmers. :haha: So when I sense a tantrum coming on, I pull one out and it buys me a few more minutes. But that being said, I NEVER go grocery shopping alone with Kira. Once you have a half full cart, you're pretty much committed to finish shopping and Kira doesn't always have the patience for long shopping trips like that. Your DH will need to find another project around the house to keep himself busy so he stays in good spirits. My father is like that too. He gets so antsy if he has nothing to do.

Still no positive opks and my nips aren't telling me anything! I had a little cm yesterday, so perhaps things are starting. But I predict a long cycle due to the increased bf from Kira when she was ill, and all the sleepless nights and stress. We're plenty busy :sex: just incase I miss my LH surge. I'm very curious to see how accurate my nips are! I have a good feeling about this month, but I say that every month :haha: Wishful thinking 

Kira is all better and such a little sweetheart. She can be a great girl when she wants to be! :cloud9:


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## cleckner04

I'm exhausted so mostly just reading today but Shiv yay for a job!!! :dance: I know the fear of the house not selling. Ours was put up in November 09 and didn't sell until May or June 10. :wacko: (I can't remember the exact month is sold) But it was SO hard paying for both places. And California is super expensive to begin with. We ended up draining everything we had after moving here. But thankfully it sold and I paid off all debts and even managed to save some. So it's stressful but it'll all be okay in the end. :hugs::hugs:

AF shouldn't be due for me for another week and a half I think. :D


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## Shiv

house prices are MUCH more expensive where we are moving to than where we are now which is a bummer, so I won't be moving to my mansion any time soon :dohh:

Pip- it is a 2 hour drive round the M25 if there is no traffic, so goodness knows how long it would take at peak times, so i would say not commutable.

If am honest i am struggling to be happy, I know I should fel releived but i don't, I feel panicked at what needs to be done and sad that I am leaving my friends and family.

jelr- it is the job where David will have to travel, although they have made the travel seem wuite manageable, on average 3 lots of 3 weeks a year which I can handle I think.

Spidey - I am so glad Kira is back ot her old self, it is lovely when they are little sweethearts isn't it?

Jelr - sorry Natasha is being a bit of a madam, I hope it passes soon :hugs:


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## Pippin

Aww Shiv that's understandable :hugs: where is the job if you don't mind me asking (you don't have to as I know this is a public forum). Hope it's a smooth transition for you. xxxx

I'm feeling much better today and have my appetite back which is great.

Spidey, yes this is going fast for me too :dohh: July seems waaaayyyyy to close for my liking!


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## Shiv

The job is in Ascot Pip. Glad you are feeling better :hugs:


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## spidey

glad you're feeling better Pippin!

Shiv- maybe once it settles in, you'll feel better about the move. Too bad the house prices are higher though, because moving into a mansion would be a good incentive. It's so overwhelming to find a new place, sell a house and move in a short period of time so any normal person should feel panicked :hugs:

Still no ovulation action from me! It's cd19 now.


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## cleckner04

spidey- hmm it'll be interesting to see if you have a short luteal phase too. I hope you don't just because that's just an unnecessary hurdle. You better get to ovulating soon though! Are you even really getting a second line at all yet?


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## spidey

Yeah, I hope I don't have a short luteal phase too. But I do suspect something must be up since I haven't gotten a bfp yet and every month we've dtd plenty of times to make it happen. I've seen a faint 2nd line this entire time, but it has never gotten as dark as the control line. I can't wait to see if your luteal phase is longer this month Cleck!


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## jelr

Spidey: Yeah DH definitely needs to find a new project, the problem is the first week my mam took Natasha while he was doing the room as we all know and he has realised over the past few weeks, it is not so easy to get stuff done with a toddler and we dont want to be leaving her over in my mams as usually I pay her and we can't afford to do that at the moment with only 1 wage coming in and it wouldnt' be fair to take advantage. DH is really enjoying spending the time with her too and doesn't want to keep dropping her over, but I can see he is getting bored with out a project or his mind being totally occupied all the time. he is much better over the weekend as he got another few bits and pieces done when i was here with Natasha. I'm so glad Kira is back to herself, that is like heaven when they have been in such bad form. I would definitely dtd as I know I used OPK's before Natasha was born for months and never got a positive one but yet I must have been Ovulating as Natasha was conceived so I definitely always missed my surge.

Shiv: thanks Natasha is back to being an angel the last two days thank god - maybe I shoudl jinx myself my always saying she has been a terror on here lol - I'm so sorry you are feeling unhappy about Davids new job, I can totally understand not wanting to move from family and friends, I would be the very same. But hopefully you will meet new people and be happy there, I guess the main thing is to take it one step at a time and get all the buying and selling and moving sorted first. How is David feeling about the move? Does he know how you feel? At least the travel doesn't sound as bad as it did. *big hugs* the hormones are probably not helping the situation. 

Pippin: Glad you are feeling better too. It definitely has flown in.

Cleck: I really hope your Vit B6 is working. that will be great if it worked so quick and at such a low dose. You will be completely ready for when Corey comes home.

Well not much news from me. Natasha is back to being a little angel the last few days thank god ( although I'm going to know on wood now lol that I dont jinx myself) I had a lovely mothers day and DH spoilt me rotten. DH hopes to find out this week what is happening with his job so fingers crossed his boss just makes him redundant and doesn't keep him on this short time and at least he can go and look for work and we have that to fall back on. if not the only other option will be to bring his boss to an employments rights tribunal as legally after 4 weeks he either has to put him back into 13 weeks full time work (which is unlikely if the company is in that much trouble) or make him redundant.


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## spidey

Some exciting news from me!!! My opk tonight is showing a positive AND my nipples are starting to hurt! My nips started feeling funny this morning so I've been expecting a positive opk today, so I took 3 opk's throughout the day instead of 2. The only one that gave a positive was the 9pm one. My nips are so awesome! 

Today is cd20, so does that mean I'll ovulate on cd21? I want to keep track of my luteal phase too.

haha, so I need to go bump uglies now, LOL!


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## cleckner04

spidey- I feel weird knowing you are probably having sex at this very moment. :rofl::rofl: If your OPK is full blown positive than you should count today as ovulation I think. But I could be wrong here.I think OPKS turn positive literally when you are ovulating like within a few hours.


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## spidey

LOL Cleckner.. when you posted I was already in bed :rofl:

My 1pm opk today gave a positive too! So in the future I could probably switch to one opk per day and still see my positive, or start doing 2 per day once my nips give me the hint. 

DH isn't going to be home tonight so I'm not sure if we'll get time to :sex: today. But yesterday's spermies should be hanging out for the eggy right now, so I still have a good chance. I guess if I still have a positive opk then I haven't ovulated yet.


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## Shiv

It must be wird to know we are all thinking about you whilst you are havign sex Spidey :winkwink: Hope you catch that eggy:thumbup:


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## jelr

Congrats on the positive OPK Spidey, at least you know you are definitely ovulating. Just shows you how great your nips are too lol - we will definitely all be asking for psychic readings soon lol. I really hope you catch the eggy this month.

Cleck: How is the weight going this week? You mustn't have much left to go to your target now?

Shiv: How are you feeling about the move now, has it settled in with you any better? How is the house hunting going?


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## spidey

I'm sitting here looking back over the last few cycles, and I think my luteal phase should be okay. AF usually arrives 14 days after my nips are fully sore, and they are fully sore today. So with the opk information, I might be ovulating today (or last night) and that gives the eggy plenty of time to find a sperm. Just one month did AF arrive only 11 days after my nips were sore.

I'm waiting to feel ovulation- I want to be as cool as Cleckner :haha:


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## cleckner04

I may have cool cramping during ovulation but my nipples can't read minds and predict the future. :rofl::rofl:


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah jelr- I gained last week with ovulation and the weight didn't come back off. :( BUT, this week I started using myfitnesspal and I"m actually tracking my calories and it turns out, with the amount of exercise I do I wasn't eating ENOUGH calories so my body was going in starvation mode and this is why it was coming off slow for a while I think. I just started using that site on Saturday and I've already dropped down 3 lbs! :shock: So hopefully I can keep it off and have an awesome main weigh in this friday. If it stays the way it is I'll be at 29.6 lb. weight loss and 30.4 to go! But only 10.4 for my first goal before June.


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## spidey

wow Cleckner- having to eat more calories is always better than less calories. Congrats on losing 3 pounds so quick. I bet the long day at the zoo helped too.

I suppose psychic nips are way better than boring crampy ovaries :haha:


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## cleckner04

Well the real trick will be keeping it off for my main weigh in on Friday. :haha: AF starts sometime this week too so that'll make all the effort be worthless. In my mind anyways bc I hate having setbacks and AF is a serious bitch.


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## cleckner04

Well I've officially shocked even myself at the difference in my weight loss pictures. I'm down even more today and I just know it's from doing myfitnesspal online. I've lost 4.4 lbs since Friday last week! :shock: So I'm down to 209 right now. Here's the pictures to prove it. :dance::dance:

Spoiler
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_7964-1.jpg


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## Mary Jo

*lurking* :D


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## cleckner04

OMG congrats MJ!!!! :dance::dance: You sneaky gal!!


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## Mary Jo

thanks Cleck! you know me, so sure things would go wrong, I only just told my mum 5 mins ago... had 12 week scan today, thought I was 11+3 (going on ovulation date, which tallied with a scan I had at 7+5) but she put me at 12 weeks exactly. due October 19th. all looks good. so relieved :D


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## cleckner04

My jaw dropped with that scan piccie. :rofl: Seems that all the lion cubs mummies are pregnant again. :( Cept me and spidey and kimberly. Boooooo! I hate you all. :winkwink: J/K!!!


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## spidey

OMG, I knew it!! I saw that MJ was added to the FB group and I had to come here to see if there was anymore news :happydance::happydance:

Soooo happy for you. I hope you can relax now. The baby looks wonderful!

Cleckner you are hot stuff!! I can't believe the transformation! Every 10 pounds makes a huge difference, so just imagine 10 pounds from now. Corey is going to be shocked when he sees you again.

Thats it- if I don't get knocked up this cycle I'm going out to buy all new summer clothes!!! DH will have a day alone with Kira as I spend waaay too much money, LOL! Cleckner- when does Corey get back? My nips are telling me that we'll be pregnant together, so I need to know how long I'll have to wait :haha:


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## cleckner04

Spidey- :rofl::rofl: Your nips are so cool. I'd love to meet them someday. :rofl: DH gets back in the middle of June. So I'm not sure if we will be able to actually try in June. Just depends when I ovulate that month I guess. :dance: And we only have 5 months to try so I'm not too positive about it all. But my brother and I were a 4 year age gap and we are so close so I'm not too worried if we have a 'bigger' age gap.


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## Shiv

Cleck - you look amazing, the transformation is brilliant! I bet all the exercise is really helping to tone you up as well. And 5 months is plenty of time to get up the duff when you know exactly when you ovulate!

MJ - yay, congratulations, you are only 3 weeks behind me :hugs: Glad your scan went well and i look forward to being preggers with you again. Also you know you said in the other thread that you are moving to Sutton, well i am moving to somewhere near Ascot, which I know isn't "that" close, by you will officially be the closest person I "know" - so maybe we can meet up some time!

Spidey and her magic nipples!


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## jelr

and me Cleck I'm not preggers either although I guess I'm not ttc until after the appointment so I dont really count.

MJ: Huge Congrats - Told you you would get pregnant again. I'm so happy for you and and thay you have reached that joyous 12 week milestone.

Spidey: Yay for your lutual phase being longer than 10-12 days, that is great that all is good with that and you now know you are ovulating. Fx for bfp soon.

Shiv: Any more luck with houses?

Cleck: OMG those pictures are amazing you are half the size you were. Well done you look fantastic. I'm loving the idea that you get to eat more to lose more lol - I must have a look at that fitness pall.

Well I started back on my low carb diet monday and did the dreaded weigh in yesterday and I have 17lbs to go to my goal :-( - I still had 2lbs before Christmas to lose, then I put on 5lbs over christmas and a rotten 10lbs in the 10 weeks I was pregnant. Aww well hopefully it will start moving soon.

Bit of a crappy day here - DH employer really doing the dog on it. Basically he has now issued them all with rp9's and wants them to sign off on them which basically means he wants them to request redundancy, but if they do this it means that they will lose their entitlement to notice and dh would actually be entitled to 6 weeks notice as he is there so long and it would be over 4000 which is a lot of money to give away so we are looking into bringing him to the an employments rights tribunal - but if it means dh can't go into other employment we will have to leave it as that is more important.

I really feel like my head is going to explode today as we are hearing different things from different people and I feel so bad for DH as he was worked so hard for his boss over the last 11 years and this is the treatment he gets.


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## Mary Jo

thanks Spidey and Shiv! we're really happy about it, think 2 years and 2 months is a nice age gap for the babies... I think ideally I'd have a 3yr gap, so Adam was a bit more independent and having 1/2 days at nursery, but at my age I wasn't leaving it any longer (I'm 37, will be 6 weeks shy of 38 come October, which just blows my mind :lol: )

Spidey, your nips are now legendary, I hope you know that. :rofl:

Cleck, you look absolutely awesome in your transformation pics, good job! 

Shiv, yeah Sutton :lol: I wasn't at all excited about it till we found the little Victorian house we're getting rather than the 30s maisonette we were getting! but now I think it'll be ok. congratulations to David on the new job, it's awesome he got something so quickly and before his last one finishes. Sorry to hear it means a move away from everyone, though, that's very tough on you. Not sure how far Ascot is, but it can't be more than a train ride to somewhere we can meet, which would be wonderful, I'd love to meet you and Sophia :D


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## Mary Jo

ah Jean, you posted as I posted... eeeek, that's really rough on you and Jim, it's really sad when employers screw with people's lives like that especially after such a long period of service. it's like loyalty and hard work doesn't count for much.

also, I was really, really sorry to read back here and get your news. big warm hugs to you. :hug:


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## cleckner04

Af just hit me today. :cry: my luteal phase was only 9 days. So the b6 shortened my cycles but made the luteal phase even shorter. :(


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## jelr

Aww crap Cleck - I wish there was a dislike button as I would use it on your post. I really thought when you OV'd earlier this time that the B6 has sorted it :( - Can you increase the dose or would it interfere with your milk supply or is there anything else you can do?

Thanks MJ - It has been a rough couple of months alright, between both the mc and dh being layed off and being honest the last few days have been hard. I think it is all the crap with DH's work that it is all hitting me like a ton of bricks again and there has been plenty of tears. If we could just get that sorted I would feel like something was moving in the right direction this year. I'll be grand though and things can only get better.


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## Shiv

Mary Jo said:


> thanks Spidey and Shiv! we're really happy about it, think 2 years and 2 months is a nice age gap for the babies... I think ideally I'd have a 3yr gap, so Adam was a bit more independent and having 1/2 days at nursery, but at my age I wasn't leaving it any longer (I'm 37, will be 6 weeks shy of 38 come October, which just blows my mind :lol: )
> 
> Spidey, your nips are now legendary, I hope you know that. :rofl:
> 
> Cleck, you look absolutely awesome in your transformation pics, good job!
> 
> Shiv, yeah Sutton :lol: I wasn't at all excited about it till we found the little Victorian house we're getting rather than the 30s maisonette we were getting! but now I think it'll be ok. congratulations to David on the new job, it's awesome he got something so quickly and before his last one finishes. Sorry to hear it means a move away from everyone, though, that's very tough on you. Not sure how far Ascot is, but it can't be more than a train ride to somewhere we can meet, which would be wonderful, I'd love to meet you and Sophia :D

Ah crap Cleck, sorry to hear that your Luteal phase has shortened, I don't know anything about vitB so can't advise, has this happened to anyone else, I am sure there are tons of girls on here who use it? I really hope you can get it sorted.

jelr - sorry that Jim's boss is being an arse, there truly is no reward for loyalty these days and it sucks. I hope youc an get the advice you need and get the best outcome for you guys :hugs:


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## Mary Jo

cleckner04 said:


> Af just hit me today. :cry: my luteal phase was only 9 days. So the b6 shortened my cycles but made the luteal phase even shorter. :(

eeek! vitamin B6 must have acted differently on you than it did on me - it delayed my ovulation by 2-3 days, which wasn't the idea at all, so I stopped taking it and things went back to normal. can you increase the dose or won't that work with bf? grrrr, must be really frustrating. I've also heard good things about natural progesterone cream, but no idea how you'd get hold of that. :flower:


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## cleckner04

I might try doubling the dose this month and see if my milk dries up. If Emma struggles to get milk than ill stop taking the b6 immediately. Hurting emmas bfing relationship for the sake of being able to get pregnant is selfish of me so I hope I can have both. :( dh is gonna be so sad if I can't get pregnant yet. He wants this more than I do even.


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## cleckner04

Phew! Okay. My charger wasn't working earlier so I had to use my phone. But now I can read a bit more in depth. 

jelr- I don't understand some of the terms you mention but basically your DH is being forced to quit right? :growlmad: I'm sorry hun. We may be in a very similar situation this time next year with DH's job. It's so awful and scary and I'm sorry everything is hitting you guys at once. :( :hugs::hugs: 

MJ- Well the B6 made me ovulate 2 days earlier so I thought it had worked but all it really did was shorten my entire cycle. :cry: I'm going to read into it because I was only taking 100 mg a day so I will probably up it to 200 mg next month. I guess it's good that DH is gone for another 2 months still because it gives me extra time to try to fix my stupid body. 



I've been in tears all day today. Probably AF hormones but just everything is getting to me. I'm so happy for all of you pregnant ladies but I just feel totally left behind kind of. And I realize there are a few of you that aren't pregnant yet either but you have husbands around to have the chance to get knocked up IYKWIM. All I do is sit around and wait and it's driving me crazy. And I just keep thinking it just won't happen bc my cycles are all fucked up anyways. I have a very strong feeling that I won't get pregnant until after his NEXT deployment. And the only good thing that will come from that is I will be able to lose more weight. But I would rather but obese and pregnant NOW than normal BMI and pregnant a year from now. :rofl: :rofl:


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## spidey

Cleckner, I'm so sorry your luteal phase shortened from last month. So disappointing :cry: I'm curious, did you count from your first peak, or the second peak (I hope I'm remembering right). I thought your 2nd peak was when you felt ovulation pain though. I completely understand how you're feeling. I have moments where I feel left behind because it seems like everyone is getting pregnant (and easily too). But in my situation I have a shot at getting knocked up whereas you have a very stressful time limit that's approaching. My DH really wants a baby too, so thats even more pressure to deal with. Sometimes I think it would be healthier to take a break from all this TTC and pregnancy talk, but I can't pull myself away and I'd really miss you girls :haha: I'm probably going to stop the opk's and go about baby making in a more relaxed way since it's gotten a little stressful and I never wanted that. But anyways, it's good to have a plan, so increasing your dose sounds like a good plan to me. It could have been a freaky short cycle- I had a 26 day one last month and I'll never know why. For me, I'm not going to stop bf to get pregnant either... and if that's what it takes then my babies will just have to be spaced 4 years apart or so. There is nothing wrong with that! Hang in there Cleckner. It's important that you enjoy the time with Corey and not be worried about making a baby the whole time. Fun sex versus stressful sex! :hugs:

eek.. can't post anymore and I have more to say. I'll sign on at work in the morning :blush:


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## cleckner04

I counted from the first peak. Both months I've gotten cramping on the first peak day. My friends list on facebook is completely full of pregnant people now. Cousins, friends from highschool, people from here. I am so happy for everyone but SO incredibly jealous. My one friend is pregnant with her second, it's a different father than the first kid and her boyfriend left her a month ago. She had only been with him for like 9 months and got pregnant fast. Apparently he had an ex-gf that is pregnant with his kid too.(My friend had no idea about this ex) :shock: So he left my friend to go back to the ex. My friend is due in september and even though her life is in shambles right now. I'm STILL jealous. How stupid is that?! :dohh: It's funny how emotions work sometimes. I can't seem to look at the big picture some days. :haha:


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## Shiv

Oh Cleck, I don't blame you at all for feeling the way you do, and i wish you were preggers NOW, I really do (although Corey might be a bit suspicious :haha:). i wish there was something I could say to make you feel better but I dont think there is. My wish is that youget your cycles sorted so that you can give it a good shot when Corey is back. :hugs:

Spidey, we always took the relaxed approach, maybe now you know that you are def ovulating you can relax again and things will happen for you.

big :hugs: all round girls


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## spidey

I hope you're feeling better today Cleckner :hugs: Hormones can be awful things. At one time I had to separate my FB friends into "normal" and "depressing" since a handful of my friends only posted when there was something horrible going on. On sensitive days I would only look at the status updates of my "normal" friends :haha: You're right though, it is hard to look at the big picture sometimes. There must be something about pregnancy that makes us want it so bad... but it really isn't all that nice. 

Shiv- yep, now that I know my body is ovulating I can back off and let nature do its thing. I really have no idea how long it took to get pregnant with Kira. For years I was only using protection after I thought I ovulated, since I had no idea that sex before ovulation was the way to get pregnant :dohh: So my cycles were on average 36/37 days long, so I would use protection for those last 2 1/2 weeks. I was so confident in my method that when I had 46 day cycles I never once thought I was pregnant. 

jelr- I hope you're having a better day today too :hugs: It's so unfair that your DH was loyal and now he's getting screwed.


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## Shiv

Spidey - if you were using protection for teh last 2.5 weeks of your cycle then you were always being careful over ovulation which is "lucky" for the times when you didn't want a bubba!

I always assumed that however long your cycle was you ovulated right in the middle, so if you had a 30 day cycle you would ovulate day15, if you had a 40 day cycle you ovulated day 20 etc! No-one teaches us about this stuff do they!

And I do hope things feel a bit brihgter today Cleck- I am SO looking forward to your weigh in tomorrow!


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## cleckner04

I'm feeling so much better today thanks ladies! I always seem to have one day of being hormonal every few months. Usually correlating with AF. Stupid bitch that she is. :rofl: Another thing that makes me hormonal about babies is DH has been emailing me telling me about all the wives of guys from his shop that are having babies while they are out to sea. And while I think that would be the worst having a baby without DH there, I am still jealous. So all these guys are coming home to newborns they've never met before which is sad. But I wish DH wouldn't tell me about those things. It just makes it worse. 

I am going to read a little more about it but I think I'll up my B-6 to 200 mg this month just to see what happens. I am reading that I should be taking B-12 with the B-6 so it's more effective. Any advice from you ladies that may know about this stuff? There is a B-6 thread in the TTC section on here but it is REALLY long and there's no way I'm gonna sit here all day wading through it. :haha:


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## spidey

Cleckner, you should go ahead and take the B12 too.. not because I'm an expert, but it can't hurt in the short term. Also, the B6 might take a couple cycles to fully work, so I wouldn't give up hope on it yet. I can see why you're going crazy with pregnancy talk because you can't get a break from it even when you talk to DH! Plus that nasty bitch AF doesn't help!

Shiv- thats funny how you thought ovulation was always in the center of your cycle. My cycles have always been all over the place, so on an average cycle we would not protect for about 2.5 weeks and then protect for 2.5 weeks (maybe longer). The Kira cycle must have been a short one :haha: Best "oopsie" I ever made :cloud9: 

They really should teach us more about pregnancy and our bodies in general. I have a co-worker who never heard of a c-section :shock: and she's been thru 4 years of college. My MIL has had tons of pregnancy issues and during her 1st 2nd trimester miscarriage, she had no idea what was going on and didn't realize that pregnancy meant a baby would come out her lady parts. Oh, and on a side rant, I am sooo thankful we have sonograms these days. She was telling me about a mmc she had atleast a decade before DH came along. They didn't have sonograms back then, and she thought she was almost 6 months pregnant but the baby had stopped growing very early so the doctor finally got the clue when her belly never grew. The doctor sent her home with a pill to cause contractions and she nearly bled to death.


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## cleckner04

Okay how can someone in this day and age not know what a c-section is?! And how can anyone not know a baby comes out your vagina?! :rofl::rofl: Where is it supposed to come out? You throw it up like a hairball?! :haha:


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## spidey

noooo Cleckner, the stork brings it!!! :rofl:

My coworker probably doesn't know where babies come out either! I asked "are you serious" a few times when she asked what a c-section was. You should have seen the look of horror on her face as I described it to her :haha:


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## cleckner04

:rofl::rofl: And sadly about 50% of women have them! She may want to be prepared if she plans on having kids someday. :rofl:



So I'm using the diva cup for the first time with this AF. I have to say, it's quite amazing. Wheres shadowrat when we need some good mooncup jokes?! :rofl:


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## spidey

Oh! I have the diva cup in my shopping basket at amazon but I haven't been brave enough to order it yet. It has great reviews but I have a hard time believing it would work. They have 2 sizes and it was a little depressing that I qualify for the stretched out vagina larger size :haha:


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## cleckner04

Don't worry. I had to get the 2nd size too because I had a c-section. So I think it's more to do with the cervix than it is the vagina itself because my vag had nothing happen to it and they still made me buy the 2nd one. :rofl: 

It seriously works really well! I haven't had a single leak. And when I dump it I'm right beside the sink so I rinse right there without getting up. :haha: But I don't think I'd use it in public. Well I would put it in and than dump it later at home. I couldn't dump it in public I don't think because i like being able to rinse right beside myself. People have suggested using baby wipes in public but doesn't sound very convenient. :haha: 

Also wanted to add you can't even feel it once you have it in correctly. I can't even tell I'm on my period really. It's amazing not having a pad. I was having to use pads recently because tampons hurt me for some reason now. :wacko:


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## spidey

LOL, I'm glad I'm not the only one needing the larger size :haha: 

I'll give it a try this coming cycle. I plan to test at the end of next week and if it's a negative I'll place the order so I'll have it in time for AF. It should be a fun experiment! Imagine all the money I'll save on tampons :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

TMI with this one but pads and tampons always smell when you are changing them. Well with this thing, there is absolutely no gross 'period' smell. It's so much cleaner.


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## cleckner04

Oh and don't worry, we'll have giant vaginas together with the size 2 diva cup. :rofl:


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## spidey

:rofl: 

No period smell will be so awesome! I can't wait! Come on BFN so I can play with the Diva cup :haha:


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah. Forgot to share my weight loss news because I was too busy talking about giant vaginas! :rofl:


I'm down to 208.4!!!! :dance::dance: I lost 5 lbs this week!! That's the most I've ever lost in one week. And I credit my success to myfitnesspal.com. I input everything I eat and it tells me what I have left for the day in order to lose weight. It's AMAZING! I have learned so much this week. I started out the week eating way too much protein and sodium. And not enough calories. And by the end of the week, I cut down the protein and sodium and I raised the calories I eat but still not enough according to the site. :dohh: But I'm working on it!


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## Shiv

Wow cleck well done on the 5lbs!! That is so great that even after so long of losing you can still shift that much in a week! So What does that make your total weightloss now? And how much until you are back to pre-Emma weight?

I am very (hopefully) happy to not have a period for another 16 months or so assuming breastfeeding goes well next time! Imagine how big my vagina will be by then :haha:


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## cleckner04

:rofl::rofl: You'll need a size 3 divacup. :muaha: (It doesn't exist so we'll have to special make one for you.)


I have lost 31.6 lbs so far. I have 28.4 to go!! Only 8.4 to pre-Emma weight. So 8.4 lbs to lose before DH gets back in June! I really think I can do it now that I'm using this website. It seems to be really awesome. I don't expect to lose this much every week though. :haha:


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## Shiv

Cleck - just give me a bucket :haha:

You are well over half way there, and I reckon you can lose 8.4 lbs in a month easily :happydance: Leaving you only 20lbs - that is so awesome!

What is all the stuff about the military not being paid? how does that work and why?


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## cleckner04

Our government is having issues setting the budget and they are fighting it out right this moment. Mostly over Planned Parenthood funding from what I've read. But they will shut down government pay until they can come to an agreement about the budget for this fiscal year. Meaning everyone still has to work. DH still has to be deployed. But we won't get paid for it. 

I'm almost 100% certain they will back pay us so we'll get paid eventually for the weeks we aren't getting paid but there are families that live paycheck to paycheck so what are they supposed to do to pay rent, groceries, etc?!


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## cleckner04

This is the site I keep watching because it does constant updates and has a countdown. Funnily enough, it's a UK site. :haha:

https://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/apr/08/government-shutdown-2011-live-updates


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## Shiv

That's CRAZY, people won't get paid because the government can't come to a decision! I take it that it is people from opposing parties arguing? Seriously it is just mental!

Good old Guardian though, my friend works for them!


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## cleckner04

I'm not sure if it's opposing parties or not. I think the senate is made up of mostly Republicans right now. I'm really dumb about politics though. I don't really understand it all. I get that they have to write out a budget before being able to pay us but I don't get why all of a sudden this is happening. It happened back in 1995 too apparently but the pay was just shut down for 5 days. So hopefully it won't be shut down long for us if it does shut down. 

That's awesome you know someone who works for the Guardian place. It was just a random link I saw because it has the countdown going. :haha:


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## Shiv

The Guardian is a newspaper here, probably the most reputable one.

You would think that the government know they have to set a budget so they might think about it before the day it is due! it's like a school kid leaving their homework to the last minute!


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## cleckner04

Well I've known about this possibility for over a month now so I guess they've just been fighting a long time about it and have gotten to their deadline. I think they extended the deadline twice too. :wacko:


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## Mary Jo

eeeek, Cleck that sounds like an awful situation. I think if it was over here, people would be going on strike! I hope they figure something out asap, it's insane. they must realise there are going to be people who can't pay their bills. :dohh:


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## cleckner04

I know I really hope companies take this into consideration when military families are missing payments for things. It's the first time I've been happy DH totaled my car before he left because I don't have a car payment to worry about now. :rofl: And I had been saving for a new car so I have that savings to fall back on if necessary. 

And I wish the military could go on strike! But DH is stuck floating in the ocean somewhere so not much he can do. :D


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## jelr

Aww Cleck I'm so sorry I wasn't on to give you a big hug the other day. I'm sorry you were feeling so crap and I really hope you do feel better now.

I think I know how you feel though as I do feel a little like that at the moment myself - it does feel like everyone I know or see is pregnant and every time I hear of somebody else or see somebody else I end up in tears - girls for the rest of you please dont take that the wrong way because half of those tears are of joy for all of you because i know how much it means to you and how good that feeling is but also I have tears because I'm not pregnant and I dont want any of you feeling that you can't talk about these things now or not saying stuff because Its my problem what upsets me and nobody elses and I love hearing about everyones journey - one of my bf is also pregnant at the moment and phones me when she is not sure of something and I love giving her advice if I can so I don't want you all picking that up wrong.

Emotions are a horrible thing cleck and AF sure is a bitch and doesn't help and I honestly think things are always more noticable when it is something you really want. as you all know we weren't planning ttc until August and I'm sure half of my fb was pregnant then and there were millions of pregnant women around but It didn't bother me where as now that is all I see if pregnancy and even this week it seems to be on the tv everywere - I dont know if any of you watch greys anatomy but I cried for hours after watching it this week as one of the main characters had an accident and was pregnant and the baby had to be delivered at 23 weeks and the way I cried you would swear it was my baby lol

I really hope that you get pregnant as soon as Corey comes back - and you know my 3 pregnancies were all after losing weight so with all you have lost I bet you are super fertile.

Sorry I forgot that terms are different in different countries - I'm not sure if some of the terms are the same so I will explain but you may already know some of it.

Basically over here if you are working and your employer lets you go you are either sacked - which means you are not doing your job right or have done something wrong or you are made redundant and if this is the case it is if there is no work or company is in trouble - if you are there over 2 years you are entitled to redundancy pay and it is 2 weeks pay per year of service and a bonus week so DH is in his job 10.5 years so he should get 22 weeks pay. Also if you leave a job or your employer makes you redundant you must either give notice or they must give you notice and if this notice is not given to you, the employer must pay it - again it depends how long you are there - With DH he should get 6 weeks pay for his time. His boss has basically said that he is making him redundant but wont sign the forms and wants all his staff to sign an RP9 which is when you request redundancy if you have been on layoff like DH has for the last 5 weeks but if DH does this he is signing away his 6 weeks notice as he is requesting the redundancy - where as he is not and would go back to work if there was a job there but his boss says there is not. So basically his boss has made millions from his workers over the last few years and has either spent it or has it hidden away as he is saying that he can't afford to pay even the redundancy to any of them and has passed it to the state to pay (which they will if a company is in trouble and is why our country is in trouble) He still gets to live in his million euro house but the state has to fork out for the redundancy for all of his employees. So if DH doesn't sign this form and give away his notice he doesn't get the actual redundancy form signed so as such like you said Cleck he is being forced to quit. 

We have gotten advice and because we know there is no work for DH - we have sent his boss a letter and another form called an RP77 which basically tells his boss that as he has said there will be no job - his boss should be filling in the reduncancy form without DH signing away his notice and he has 14 days to do this or dh will be bringing him to an employment rights tribunal (court) for both the redundancy and the notice. We didn't think that we would be able to do this as it will hold up all the payments as the court thing will probably take about a year and we thought DH would have to stay out of work for this long and it wouldn't have been worth it but he can actually go ahead and work somewhere else - so we are going to go ahead and fight him - I know it might sound petty as he will be getting 22 weeks pay but he is entitled to another 6 weeks which is worth &#8364;4000 and is a lot of money and it will have to be our back up as you all know Ireland is broke and is going to europe and the international bank for a bail out and nobody's job is safe and I am paid by the goverment and as dh will be in a totally new job (if he even gets one) that has no guarantee if may have to be the money we have to live on and wont last too long if either of us end up out of work perminantly as our mortgage and food alone is &#8364;400 a week that is without the internet, tv licence, heating, electricity, refuse collection, phones, car insurance and petrol and really it is the principal of the thing - DH and me have fought so much over the years about how much he has given the company - he worked from 7 in the morning until 6 every evening and sometimes weekend with no extra pay - he was even forced to go back early after Natasha was born and has only ever been out 2 sick days so he deserves to get what is owed.

Anyway ha ha that was meant to be an explanation and turned into a long winded rant lol

Spidey: I think you are right to take the relaxed approach too - when I conceived on the baby before Natasha and eventually on Natasha it was when I was meant to start clomid ( I was actually waiting on AF to start but she never came) and I'm convinced it was party because in my head I was thinking it will happen next month with the tablets and stopped being stressed about it and last time there was definitely no stress as it was just a happy (now sad I know but happy at the time) accident.

Shiv: I also always thought that you ovulated in the middle lol - I swear you girls have taught me so much - my idea of ttc was having sex every couple of days instead of twice a week which usually landed on the weekend - I only ever used OPK's once and though I wasn't ovulating as I never got a positive and then was convinced when I got pregnant with the first baby that they were dodgy tests on the internet and now I realise there is a whole lot more to it as I only ever peed on them in the morning which now I know you shouldnt - I also never knew anything about lutual phase or B6 or even half the tests you girls in the UK and US get as we dont get half of them here. I know I'm not super intelligent or anything but I dont think I'm thick but here is so much I didn't know about al this suff until I came on here and I know most people I know dont either - a lot of things I mention people are like what are you taking about (for instance my friend was worried as she hasn't felt movement by 20 weeks and I siad her placenta was probably anterior and she nor any one else in the room had a clue what I was talking about - the only reason I knew myself was partly from here and when I was pregnant I bought loads of books and read everything I could)

MJ: How are you feeling - Has it sunk in yet?

Cleck: by the way that is really shit about the military pay - I can remember seeing you had something about that on fb ages ago - how the hell can the goverment take that long to argue this stuff out and that it has to come to this - People in power so annoy me at the moment. Your DH and all those other soldiers are defending their countries and you and all the other families have a lot to content with with your partners being away and this is how you get repaid - that is so so wrong.

AFM: AF arrived yesterday so as you can see from my post I'm full of rant and hormones lol - but am glad too as I presume that the day of the D&C would be cd1 so that means my cycle was exactly 28 days which I have never had a 28 day cycle in my life except when on the pill and I also have had major pressure pains since Natasha was born and was putting it down to them cutting me and I didn't have them this time so maybe the d&c sorted out something that was wrong and hopefully now that I'm back on low carb my cycles will stay right until we ttc.

Anyway I think I have said enough - DH just asked what the hell are you typing your fingers havent' stopped lol so I know this post is massive - my mind and hormones are on overdrive tonight and I have just has a glass of wine which probably has made me waffle all the more lol


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## spidey

The whole thing really sucks and it's awful to not get paid. So many people have no choice but to live paycheck to paycheck. I work for the federal gov't, but I get paid thru a 3rd party (as a contractor) and I have no idea what to expect Tuesday when I return to work. I heard that my contract company already got paid thru July, so I'm supposed to report to work. But I also heard that the building will be shut down! Most of the employees are federal employees so it'll be empty. They're shutting down work email too so I just had to give them my personal email so they can tell me what to do. It's pretty crazy and who knows if I'll be allowed to work next week or if I'll get paid. Even if they approve a budget this weekend, I already wasted 2 weeks worth of work because I had to put experiments on hold and I wasn't able to set up anything new this week. A federal employee needs to approve my timesheet and if no federal employees are legally allowed to work then my pay might go on hold for awhile. Blah!

So basically it's a bunch of anti-abortion politicians who want to stop abortions and to do so, they want to stop federal funding to planned parenthood. The normal way to ban abortions would be to change the laws, but they don't have enough support to do so. There is also some funding for the environment they want to block too, but I'm not certain the details on that.

Clecker- I am super duper impressed!!! That's an amazing amount of weight to lose in just 1 week. That website sounds awesome and I love how you need to eat more calories. 

Jelr- We have an American version of one born every minute here and I've been watching it and sobbing the entire time. Thankfully DH is never around because he would think I was nuts! I hope your DH's boss stops being so silly and signs the papers necessary for your DH to get his fair benefits. Argh!! Congrats on the 28 day cycle though! Are you going to NTNP this month, or wait until August? 

Nothing new with me. One of my nips is sore still, but the other feels fine. In a few days my nips will tell me if I'm pregnant :haha:


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## Shiv

Oh Spidey I hope you get paid, as a fellow scientist I understand justhow frustrating it is to waste weeks of work on experiments - grrrrrrrr, and all because of anti-abortion politicians! Are they idiots, if they just stop funding but don't change the law, people will stillhave abortions, you will just get crazy unquallified people doing it on the cheap endangering lives - IDIOTS!!!

Did they make their minds up yet?

Jelr - Jim's boss is also an IDIOT (my running theme for the day!), surely if he can't afford to pay the redundancy would the government not have to pay the notice as well? So surely it wouldn't cost him anymore anyway? 

Cleck (or as I shall now refer to you Foxy Cleck :kiss:) I am still in awe of your weightloss, in a year or so's time I will be asking for the website youa er using!

As for us, well we have been doign some work in the front garden this morning as an estate agent is coming round to take pictures of the house on Monday. To be honest it still looks crap :dohh:

When Sophia wakes up from her nap, we are going on a picnic to "celebrate" my birthday which is on Tuesday. DH has packed 2 bottles of champagne for everyone to drink which I can't so am not best pleased! "celebrating events when you are pregnant sucks, I am only going on this picnic because David kept nagging me :haha: Still it is sunny and as long as Sophia has a nice time that is what matters!

Oh yeah Cleck, I tried to get the old Lion cubs thread back and going again, and felt sure that you would have some input tomake, so am highly dissapointed to not have seen you in there :hissy:


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## spidey

Yes Cleckner- get over to the Lion cubs thread! :haha:

Last night the politicians came to an agreement, so thats good. The silly thing about the planned parenthood funding, is that planned parenthood does so many good things for lower income families such as provide birth control and yearly exams. They actually work to prevent pregnancies. They use private donations to fund abortions since they aren't allowed to use federal money for that anyway. So the politicians think that by cutting federal money, planned parenthood will be so broke that they'll have to stop abortions too. These politicians have no idea what it's like to be poor and not afford health care, food or clothing. It pisses me off so much that I shouldn't even be talking about it.

Have fun on your picnic Shiv! I think a sip of champaign should be okay!


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## Pippin

:hi: I'm here lurking hope you are all ok. Haven't posted for a week or so, where is this time going :wacko: sorry for being crap.

BIG hugs to you all. :hug:


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## cleckner04

I know I'm sexy ladies. :haha: And my vagina is only slightly large with my size 2 diva cup. :rofl::rofl: <---Most random post ever.

I did see the post in lion cubs but I don't think posts in groups count anymore towards post count so I didn't respond. LMAO!!!!!! We do need to get it going again. We don't even really need this group here anymore because all the ones that had issues are pregnant again. :lol:


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## Shiv

I can't believe you are only here for the post count :cry:


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## cleckner04

:rofl: No. I'm really here for spidey's nipples. :muaha:


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## spidey

:rofl: I'm only here because it makes me feel better about my super sized vagina! Knowing Shiv will need a size 3 before me :haha:

My nipples are telling me that I'm not pregnant. They are sooo smart so I believe them. DH is taking off work Wednesday just so I can have a shopping extravaganza :happydance: He'll let Kira destroy the store as I buy shorts, tops, a dress (because I do not own one!) a bathing suit... and whatever else my heart desires! I might even buy shoes since I am seriously lacking in shoes. I am so not a woman when it comes to shoes because I own 4 pair total :shock:


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## cleckner04

All of my shoes are flip flops so don't feel too bad spidey. :D I have a flip flop in nearly every color of the rainbow. Where are you gonna shop at? Sounds fun! I've been having some fun walking stores with Emma recently. It so nice not having a husband there bitching about me taking so long. :haha:

I am very nearly finally fitting in my non-maternity pants! :dance: I put on a pair of capris and it buttons but is a tight button IYKWIM. But when I was first losing weight I tried to put those pants on and they weren't even close to buttoning. :dance::dance: I can't believe I waited this long to try to lose the baby weight. With the c-section I could barely walk normally for the first few months though and than I just settled into a pattern of not caring. I'm so glad I'm making up for it! :D


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## spidey

I need to get a pair of flip flops! I was thinking of Kohls since I have a 30% off my whole purchase plus they do that $10 off every $50 spent deal. The dressing rooms are nice and they aren't nazi's about how many items you bring in with you. I have my own shopping style and I don't want rules to get in my way! :haha: 

That is super cool how you almost fit in your pre-pregnancy pants. A shopping spree is in order for you too! For the next baby you'll know to get in shape faster so you can feel good about yourself. Maybe you'll have a VBAC and won't have any long lasting pain keeping you from being motivated. But then you'll really need a size 3 diva cup :haha:

I just ordered my Diva cup- I told DH and he was super grossed out by the whole thing :rofl:


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## cleckner04

I have been holding off on telling DH about the diva cup. I have a feeling he'll be grossed out too. It sounds like a gross concept but now that I'm actually using it, it's really less gross than tampons. I'm wearing it right now. :smug: :rofl: 

You know I've actually went back and forth about trying for a VBAC because part of me wants my vagina to stay exactly the way it is. :lol: 

I love Kohls! I just went last week actually and ended up buying Emma her first pair of Nikes. I bought them a size too big because they were $30 and I want her to be able to wear them for a long time at that price. I'll just put extra thick socks on her until she grows into them more. :rofl:

I hate dressing room rules at some places. Only being able to try on 3 items at a time. That's ridiculous. I usually have arms loaded with stuff so I can get it over with in one go.


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## Shiv

I only come on here because you girls make me feel so good about my baggy vagina :cry:

I hate changing room rules, if am on a shopping spree then i willhave items that go together so I want them all in with me so I can check that this top goes with that skirt and those pants (I used the americanism just for you two! It would be tough if I tried to match every item of clothing to my knickers :haha:, what do you call knickers by the way?)

We took Sophia to the beach this morning and she HATES sand! I am not a fan either but I thought she would lik eit, she did last year!


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## cleckner04

We call knickers panties or underwear. :D 

And don't feel sad about your bucket vagina. :muaha: 

That sucks that Sophia hates sand. How weird! Our park has sand at it and Emma would rather sit and play in the sand than play on the big toys. :dohh:


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## jelr

Sorry ladies but if there was a competition between us for baggy vags I'm claiming the crown with 3 pregnancies in 3 years :haha: - Random but imagine if there was a competition for that - how would they measure it? Although there probably is a competition in the porn industry somewhere :rolf: Anyway so I'm only here cause I have a baggy vag and saggy boobs :haha:

Cleck: 5lbs in 1 week is amazing - well done you - I think I will have a look at that my fitness pall - as I only lost 1lb so far this week and we ate out today with DH's family so I'd say that lb is out the window too.

Spidey: that is crap about your pay also being affected - I agree with Shiv - the goverment are idiots - all employers are lol - I think we are going to wait until June when I'm back in the hospital and see what they say or if there is anything I can do to prevent another mc - but then I could change my mind again tomorrow lol - although with DH's work being up in the air I would say we will wait until then at least, Definitely not going to not protect until we are trying when I got pregnant so easily this time.

If they have come to an agreement does that mean there will definitely be no pay freeze??

Shiv: Natasha liked the sand last year but she hasn't been near any this year so it will be interesting to see how she gets on as lately when we are playing in the garden she is not liking it when her hands get dirty. Hope your birthday picnic went well. Happy Birthday for Tuesday. xx

Hey pippin - good to see you.

AF is nearly gone for me and surprisingly was really really light - so whether the silly bitch was luring me into a false sense of security and it going to kill me next month I dont know.

As for shopping I hate dressing room rules too and hate trying on clothes in general so now if they shops do refunds I just pick up what want and try them all on at home and bring back what I dont want and DH loves the stripping on and off of clothes lol

Well the bed clothes that I ordered for Natashas new room finally came and I'm so mad -They were quite expensive once the shipping was included as I decided feck it - we had the money saved to pay somebody to make up the wardrobes and it only cost a fraction of the cost when DH did them himself so it was money we weren't going to have if he was working anyway and I feel in love with them when I saw them and we deserved a treat after all the crap and I just want to spoil Natasha. But the colour is totally different than was on the net and the curtains are really flimsy and cheap looking and I got caught for customs tax when they arrived :dohh:

Here is the link to what they are on the net https://www5.jcpenney.com/jcp/X6E.aspx?GrpTyp=ENS&ItemID=171a459&DeptID=70753&CatID=71584&SO=0&Ne=6+4+5+877+1031+1007+18+949&PCatID=70753&NOffset=2&CatTyp=RLE&Dep=KIDS+++TEENS&N=4294953126&Cat=kids+bedding&Nao=0&PSO=0&CmCatId=70750|71584

I ordered the quilt and curtains but the pink that is in them is actually a salmon / peachy coloured pink so the curtains are totally different then the colour of the main wall - the wall is the colour of the dark pink of the flowers on the quilt in the picture on the actual quilt it is red - I think I might get away with the quilt as I wanted loads of different colours so as it wouldn't be too much pink anyway but the curtains are just too way off so may go back if it doesn't cost me a fortune to post them back :nope: - Aww well lesson learned - do not make rash purchases when feeling crap and dont buy bed clothes from the net.

We had a lovely day out today and it was a beautiful sunny day - the sun always really cheers me up and Natasha had so much fun outside with her cousins all day so I got over the bed clothes pretty quick lol


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## spidey

So Jelr gets the award for most used vagina... but only until Corey returns and then Cleckner will have the most used one :tease: :rofl: 

Luckily Jelr, everything seems okay with my work now and no threat of a pay freeze on the horizon. But come September I am out of a job unless they somehow come up with the money to keep me. I worked there for 10 years but my boss went a little psycho and quit. For now the big boss is keeping me until September which is when my contract runs out and he's only attempting to keep me longer because he feels sorry for me. :haha: In the official "you will be fired in September" meeting we had a few weeks ago he learned that I'm a first generation college graduate (in a family where most people don't graduate from high school) and I'm just a simple local girl from a poor family, LOL! So now he feels guilty for firing me and is trying to scrape together some money to keep me on.

Shiv- thats funny how Sophia hates sand. Kira loves sand and no matter what the weather, she insists on playing in her sand box. I have sand in every crevice of my house! Cleckner- Kira's the same way. The mulch at the playground is more fun than the playground!

Jelr- that bed set is so pretty! Too bad the colors are off :growlmad: I have a JC Penneys within walking distance of my house 

Kira is screaming at DH so I better get in there and give a booby!


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## spidey

last night I was meaning to ask a very important question!

How do you refer to your LO's vagina? (or future LO) Growing up we called them "suzy's" but I've never heard that term used anywhere else. I tried calling it a vagina, but that seemed so clinical. DH calls it a front butt :dohh: which I'm not thrilled with. I need a nice word for it when telling Kira to be gentle with hers :haha:


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## Shiv

We can't come to an agreement on this either. I called mine my privates when I was little but I'm not a big fan of that. I treid vagina once (that sounds much more lesbian than I intended :haha:) but it doesn't sound right either. So i don't know!

Oh and NO-ONE can compete with me when it comes to saggy boobs!


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## cleckner04

I just call Emma's a vagina. I see no point in beating around the 'bush' about it. :haha: I just feel more stupid using pet names for it vs. saying the real word.


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## jelr

Yep I reckon with all the built up frustration cleck you will definitely have the most used vagina when Corey gets home - you will need size 10. :rofl: Was your pun on the bush intentional :haha:

Shiv: I reckon I would give you a run for you money on the saggy boobs too - especially once I lose this new weight - they are like used tea bags from putting on weight and then losing it again and putting it back on - my boobs went up a size again this time :holly:

Spidey: I'm so glad your pay is not going to be frozen (Oh and your DH's too Cleck) - Sorry to hear that your job may not be there in September though. Fingers crossed your boss feels really sorry for you and comes up with the money.

We have had load of conversations about what to call it too. When we were young we called it a tail and I hated it as it was like we were animals :blush: - I can't bring myself to call it vagina either as it sounds too grown up for a little girl and the word just sounds foreign to me as i dont use it myself. I tend to just say my bits and DH calls it my box :blush: but they seem to vulger for a little girl too.

We were going with privates and it sounded a bit clinical and then we heard some call it minnie but she loves minnie mouse so I thought it might be a bit confusing. I think we are going with totty as it is what DH's family call it - although I'm not sure either as I have never heard anyone else call it that but we just kind of started it until we decided and now Natasha says it too so I reckon it will stick.

Oh Lord just goes to show you really need to think about what you are saying. I was about to write we played around with privates - how wrong would that sound :dohh:


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## jelr

I decided to not be so lazy and put some smilies in - I'm not doing too bad now eh??


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## cleckner04

Yes the bush pun was intentional. :haha: 

See that's the thing, all the cutesie names for it will only remind her later in life that flower=vagina or minnie=vagina. I know I'm a bit immature but I'd probably laugh every time I heard the word flower if that's what I was grown up calling my lady area. :haha: 

And is Emma the only one that is always playing with her daisy? She seriously won't leave it alone sometimes. I just let her get on with it. I figure it's her body so I can't really stop her from exploring it. :haha:


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## jelr

Thats a good point cleck - Vagina still feels foreign to me though lol - ha ha and now I just realised what I said and that pun was not intentional :haha: 

Nope Emma is not the only one. the minute Natasha's nappy is off she has her hands down there. I let her at it too and reckon the same thing, she is only exploring and it is her body. I heard a friend of mine telling her daughter to stop one day and that it was dirty and I would be terified that by saying that later in life she would have sexual hang ups (not that I even want to think of my daughter and sex or playing with herself, but the fact is she will one day, so I dont want her thinking it is dirty)

Although I get email updates from babycenter and a few months back one of the links was about babies at their privates and that little girls can even orgasm by playing downstairs Now that freaked me out and I'm hoping that wont happen for years to come and not in front of me anyway :blush:


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## cleckner04

I admit that I started masturbating at a VERY young age. Like 10 or possibly even younger. :blush: I have no idea why but I learned really early that water running on it feels good. :shy: 

That is pretty weird thinking our little girls could potentially orgasm. :wacko: I really hope Emma and I have the kind of relationship that she can come talk to me about sex & all the other female issues that might come along. i could never talk to my mom because she'd get embarrassed which would make me embarrassed.


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## spidey

Kira's hands go down there too as soon as her diaper is off and sometimes I do say "be gentle with your _____". (vagina, lady parts, front butt...) But if she's not tearing and clawing at herself, she's welcome to explore.

I'm glad I'm not the only one with vagina naming issues. I was dead set on calling it a vagina and I still do sometimes, but I get stuck on whether or not I should use the words labia too :dohh: I am making this vagina naming issue much too complicated :haha: To me, private parts makes it seem naughty. I like the sound of "lady parts" and thats been my new favorite :haha:

I have memories of being very young and twiddling with my lady parts because it felt good.. perhaps 9 or 10 like you Cleckner. But I don't think I had real orgasms till later. 

It would be great if Kira could talk to me about vagina's and other girl topics. In real life I am very laid back and it's almost impossible to shock me... so maybe Kira will trust that I'll stay cool and calm no matter what she needs to tell me.


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## cleckner04

That's what I'm afraid of though. I'm wound pretty tight about some things like cleaning and things being done a certain way so I don't want her to think I'm a complete jerk and not want to talk to me. Corey is the laid back one so I'm the one that has to stress about everything IYKWIM. 

I didn't even know until recently that the vagina is just part of the entire thing and that vulva is part of it. I just always called it a vagina. I didn't think about the individual parts. :rofl:


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## spidey

Good morning ladies! AF paid me a visit this morning almost an entire week early :wacko:

I don't think my luteal phase is looking so good, and my Diva cup isn't supposed to arrive till this afternoon. Just a big shitty day so far.

Here are the numbers:

AF arrived on cd30
cd20 at 9pm and cd21 at 1pm I had strong positives on my opks
Perhaps I ovulated cd21 or cd22?

I guess my luteal phase could be 8 or 9 days?? 

The only thing keeping me happy is that DH has taken off work and today is my super shopping Wednesday :happydance:


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## Shiv

Aw sorry AF got you and the your luteal phase is shorter than you hoped. Enjoy your shopping spree and make sure you show us what you get!


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## cleckner04

Oh no hun. :( I'm sorry you are having a shitty day. Hope the shopping helps you perk up a bit. I seriously hate this luteal phase crap. It's SO frustrating. I hope this was just a one time blip for you bc you said the last few months it has seemed longer from nipple pain to period starting. 


I'm off to buy a b-complex vitamin today. I guess b-6 wasn't correct. I needed a b-complex with all of the b vitamins in it. Whoops. So I'm a little late starting it this month but hopefully I can find a good one that I can start taking. I hate putting random stuff in my body like this. :nope:


Edit to add: I've already lost 3.2 lbs this week and it's not even friday yet! :dance: Let's hope it stays off for the main weigh in. I haven't been riding my exercise bike much this week either so I'm actually slacking in that regard. But I plan on ramping it up the next few days because I'm really hoping the 3.2 lbs stays off. :haha: THIS is why I weigh myself every day. Because it makes me know when I have to ramp it up a bit. :thumbup: If it stays off that means I only have 5.2 lbs to lose before June to meet my goal! :yipee:


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## spidey

thanks girls. I had a super great shopping trip :happydance::happydance:

I'll take a picture of all my loot later! I was going to cut the tags off but Kira needed a booby, so she's hanging off me right now and letting me type this 

You're right Cleckner about my luteal phase. This cycle and last cycle had very short luteal phases (last cycle was my record 26 day cycle), but before that I had 14 days from nipple pain to AF's arrival, so I know my luteal phase was okay. So who knows what's going on. It's very aggravating though. Kira was sick with her ear infection and then antibiotic reaction so for an entire week she pretty much ate only breast milk which could have affected my luteal phase.

Obviously my body doesn't think its time for another baby to be made because I have a baby that still needs me and my milk. Lets see what next month brings.

I am in shock right now- Kira fell asleep on the booby!! She NEVER does that :haha:


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## spidey

OMG Cleckner- I just saw the updated part about your weightloss. That is so wonderful :happydance:

Come on UPS man... I need my Diva cup!!!!! :rofl: Cleck- have you slept with your Diva cup in?


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## jelr

Well I have had great weight loss this week - I have lost 3lbs overnight lol - god a stinking bug and was violently ill yesterday evening and still not the best today, but am getting there. It would be nice though if that 3lbs stayed off but I know it will be back once I eat right.

Ah Spidey I'm sorry about your lutual phase - hopefully next month will be better when Kira is not bf as much now that she is feeling better.

Cleck: that is fantastic on the weightloss - well done you - 5lbs left is nothing you will have more than your goal gone by June. I didn't do too bad after last week and did actually lose 3lbs after AF went - dont think this week will be as well though as low carb went out the window today and all I could face was toast. 

I really hope Natasha will look on me as her friend too and will be able to talk to me about anything as like you my mam used to get embarressed about stuff - I reckon I will be okay as my younger brothers come to me about their girl friends and sex so I hope it can be the same with Natasha, although I must admit at the moment thinking of my daugher and sex does freak me out because she is my baby and I dont want her to grow up and have sex ifykwim - so I hope I do get over that and that she is comfortable telling me anything.


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## spidey

here are my clothes- DH is getting tired of me talking about them, so I can bother you girls instead :haha: 
https://www.razortoe.com/share/clothes.jpg

I only spent $118 so I did really good! Kira has matching plaid shorts, so we can dress the same this summer :rofl:

The halter top is actually a bathing suit top. I bought bottoms too but I need to exchange them for the right size since the hangers had been changed and I bought an xsmall instead of medium. :dohh:


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## cleckner04

spidey- CUTE outfits!! I love the bermuda type jeans. I could never get away with those little dinky shorts though. Even when I'm skinny my thighs still rub so shorts ride up in the middle. Not pretty. :rofl: Yes I do wear the diva cup overnight. It didn't leak a single time I used it either. Which is seriously amazing. :thumbup: 

jelr- Well done with your weightloss this week too!! :dance: How much more do you have to go than? I think my next goal before DH is back is to get to 'overweight' bmi instead of 'obese'. So just 9 or 10 lbs to go I think because I think 196 is overweight for my height but I'm not 100% sure. :haha:


Okay, I'm off to nap with Emma. :lol:


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## jelr

I love the clothes spidey, especially the skirt with the leggings under it 

Did your diva cup come after?

Yesterday I had 14lbs to go but this morning it was only 11 lol, it was nice to see this morning but i know it wont last and was only from being so sick, I think i will stay away from the scales until weigh in next tues as I think I'm going to give the low carb a miss for the rest of the week as I just wanted toast today and probably will until I'm 100%

You surely not still in the obese category, you look fab. Those charts bug me.


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## cleckner04

Yup, still obese! :haha: I just calculated and I have to be 196 lbs to be overweight. Right now my BMI is 31.2. Which is great considering it was 36.5 a few months ago. I hate bmi charts too. I've never been a 'normal' weight. Always slightly overweight according to the charts. But no one would've guessed it by looking at me. I just weigh a lot I guess. Sexy weighs a lot and I have a whole lotta sexy in me. :winkwink::muaha:


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## Mary Jo

spidey, I had to look twice at those clothes to figure out if they were for you or Kira! very cute, especially the shorts (which I thought might be baby jeans). :dohh:

sorry to hear about your luteal phase, hope it's a temporary blip for you. :(

jelr and cleck, WOW and well done on the weight loss (though sorry yours came at a price, jelr, hope you feel better soon, toast sounds like an excellent idea).

I'm doing ok, mostly, SPD is coming back, though, and my rosacea has flared badly, and I feel sick tonight, after being a lot lot better the last week or so. weird, it just came back tonight. I've been more energetic and more able to cope with Adam, which is obviously a good thing, as he's hard work at the best of times :dohh:


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## spidey

Jelr- I must have posted at the same time as you! Congrats on the weight loss but it's such a crappy way to lose it. I hope you're feeling better soon. :hugs:

Cleckner- DH thought those plaid shorts should be dinkier!! :haha: I told him those are the closest things to "booty" shorts as I'm going! Those BMI charts are so annoying. If they consider you obese than that's insane! You are way too sexy to be listening to those stupid charts!

MJ- LOL about those be Kira's clothes. It's good you're having more good days than bad now.. I hope you're feeling better tomorrow so you can keep after Adam!

YIPEEE! My diva cup just arrived!! I was typing this so DH and Kira decided to open it for me :rofl:

https://www.razortoe.com/share/diva.jpg


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## cleckner04

yay for diva cup!! Did you buy the diva wash too? I didn't buy it so not sure if it's actually worth using. I just used regular soap and water to clean mine. What does your DH think of it? :haha:


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## spidey

I didn't get the diva wash since I'm sure it's just a bottle of soap. After I took that picture, my mom called and then Kira snatched up my Diva cup and ran off with it in her mouth! I yelled at DH to get it before she chewed on it and then of course I had to explain to my mom what I was talking about :haha: Right this very moment I am wearing my Diva cup :rofl:

I had to take it out once already to trim that little nub part, and it had already collected some mensus! The weirdest part is the suction cup noise it makes- does yours do that too? I can't feel anything now, but at first I felt a little heavy down there and then suddenly it felt like I needed to poo. I would like to shove it up there more, but when I do it travels back down so the nub is sort of strangely hanging out. I did have a 10 pound giant headed baby come out of my vagina, so I should be happy it's staying in at all :rofl: Tampons don't like to stay in these days, and now...


Spoiler
DH's little swimmers exit the building immediately after we dtd :rofl:


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## cleckner04

LoL at your entire post. :rofl: What'd your mom think of it? It hurts removing it because it gets caught on like a vagina muscle or something. :sick::rofl::rofl: Like it pops when I pull it out and it's a slight pain for a second. I have the opposite problem where it sucks itself so high up that I have to search for the nub thing. :dohh: The first time it did it, I panicked because I would really hate to have to make a hospital visit because my vagina ate my diva cup. :rofl::rofl:


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## spidey

:rofl: I wonder how many people lose their Diva cup and have to go to the emergency room! My problem is that as I'm sticking it up there, it opens up too early, like when its still half way out and then goes "sluuuurrrrp" :blush: I try to shove it up while its already open. Right now I'm not wearing it since I'm at work and not too certain how I feel about cleaning it in the sink here, but as soon as I get home I'll try to get it up there better :haha: I haven't had any pain removing it probably because I don't have any vagina muscles left :rofl: Cleck, you are much more of a virgin than me. :flower: Last night I put the whole thing in the sink before emptying it in the toilet (I forgot) and it was quite gross. Good thing DH wasn't around or he would have been scarred for life.

Oh, my mom thought it sounded interesting. She gets really heavy periods (like 2 tampons at a time heavy!) and she liked the idea of the little measurement marks to see how much you collect :haha: She asked me what it looked like, and I said it was sort of the size of a shot glass. Then she said "oh, that would fall right out of me" :blush: :rofl:


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## cleckner04

OMG LOL @ your mom saying it would fall right out!! :rofl::rofl: I think there is another brand called instead cup that is disposable but it's bigger around the edges. Maybe she could look into that brand. :thumbup: It's a disposable version though so you'd have to buy more whenever you run out but you can wear them for like 12 hours without changing them.


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## cleckner04

Well I lost 4 lbs this week! :yipee: I'm down to 204.4. Only 4.4 left to meet my top goal before DH is back and still 2 months before he's back! :dance: I feel such a relief to be so close to my first goal. I'm still gonna stick to it hard and maybe I can somehow get down to 190 before DH is back. Than I'd just need to lose 10 more to meet my ultimate goal. But I don't want to get ahead of myself here. :haha: So the main goal is still pre-Emma weight. Anything after that will be a bonus. :thumbup:


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## spidey

Cleckner thats so amazing!! :happydance: :dance:

I can't believe how much you lost over the last 2 weeks! Have you been eating more calories still? What new things are you eating? Soon it will be time for another progress photo!!!

If my mom wants to know more about the Diva cup, I'll tell her about the instead cup too. :thumbup: She has a complex since her last OBGYN called her vagina "floppy". YES- he really did say that she had a floppy vagina :shock: I'm pretty sure the Diva cup would work just fine for her though :haha:


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## Shiv

Cleck - that is SO great! I reckon you can easily lose a stone in 2 months to get down to 190lbs. I would also love to know what you are doing differently as you must have really kick started your metabolism to be losing weight so well. And yes i think another photo is needed next week :thumbup:

You two and your vag talk :haha:

Well we are in the place we are movig to this weekend to try and find a house to rent. Today we saw a complete dump and a lovely house that we can't really afford :growlmad: But I did find the area that I would like to live in long term when we buy a house (we could just do with wining £100000 or so to help afford a house!


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## jelr

Woohoo Cleck - that is amazing I agree with Shiv - we definitely need to see another pic sure that is nearly another 10 gone in the last two weeks. dont mind those stupid charts, they dont take in your body shape and I dont believe one chart can fit all because you look amazing so no way you can be obese.

Spidey: Lol at your mom - I can't belive the obgyn was so rude - I would be scarred for life if somebody said that to me.

Girls i have to say though between slurping and pain and shaving bigs off your diva cups you are not good advertisement - I sounds ouchy :rofl:

Shiv: I really hope you can find somewhere nice to rent as I know you are nervous about the move and it would really help if you can feel at home. Yay for finding the place where you would like to be long term though. You will get there honey, everything happens for a reason so FX you will be really happy there.

MJ: Yikes on the being sick again I really hope it is short lived and that the doc can sort you would with something for your skin.

Well I think I'm good again still dont have much appetite so have only had toast and bread and chickin in the last few days - I haven't weighed myself again but I reckon the 3 overnight lbs will be back on and probably more as I lost it with low carbs and all I have been carbed out with all the toast I'm eating - aww well next week is another week.

Some good news here though - we got notification today that DH's company are going into liquidation so that means the liquidator will fill in all the forms and DH will get what he is notice and reduncancy, dont think he boss has a clue what he is doing though as he made all those poor guys sign away their notice when we was going bust and it would have been paid from the social fund anyway. I'm so glad DH waited it out, and at least we dont have to go through a messy tribunal and it will be sorted much quicker :happydance:


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## cleckner04

Yes I've been trying my best to eat more calories. I've been managing about 1400-1600 a day and when I started I was only eating about 1200 or less a day. And some days probably a lot more bc remember when I said I ate a giant omelette with salmon and eggs? That was probably a lot. :haha: Really the only thing I'm eating differently now is not much processed stuff anymore. Before I would eat mac and cheese from a box and not even think about what's in it. But it turns out it's packed full of sodium so one box would nearly be my max of sodium for an entire day. :wacko: I threw out some of my processed stuff just to get it out of the house so I don't have to look at it anymore. When I got groceries a few days ago I only shopped the outer rim of the store. So fresh veggies and fruit, meat, dairy, and that's it. But I did get a few canned items to make some things in the slow cooker and I got some frozen veggies because when I'm in a rush I like to use those steamer veggies that you just toss the bag in the microwave and it steams them for you. :haha: But those were the worst things I bought. Before I would have a cart full of things like kraft mac n cheese, hamburger helper, these little compleat meal things where you just poke holes in the top and microwave for 90 seconds and it's a meal. :blush: Which all those things were fine with calories but awful with sodium. 

I didn't tell DH how much I had lost until yesterday and his response? 'HOLY SHIT!!' :rofl: So I think he's excited to get home. :sex: I'm just thankful my boobs haven't went yet. That was my fear that my boobs would shrivel up but I think they'll stay put until Emma stops feeding. Than I'll have to roll them up to get them in a bra. :haha:

spidey- OMG I can't believe her doctor said that. :shock: I hope they have known eachother for years or something and he said it as a joke. That's insane. 

shiv- It's good that you guys are scouting out the area in advance though! DH and I once rented an apartment without even seeing it first. Heck the place I'm in now we didn't even see so we are really lucky that it turned out to be nice. :lol: Hopefully when you get settled in there you end up loving it. 

jelr- Yay for your husbands job situation being settled instead of fighting it!! :dance: I hope he can find a new job quickly. :hugs:


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## jelr

:rofl: I just had a mental image of you rolling up your boobs to put them in your bra - and laughed my heart out. Mine are just like used teabags :haha:- although DH still loves them so that is all that counts lol.

It is scary what is in processed food - I was determined to give Natasha real food instead of jars because I don't eat much veg and it stuck in my head when the health nurse told me that they are finding that babies fed on jars are more fussier than if they are fed normal food (that was probably just the health nurse trying to frighten me but it worked) so bought a book I know the author is banned from here so I wont even try and put in the name of it as before when I wrote her name on a post it wouldnt appear and she talks about all the things that are found in food today and in one sense it was the best thing I could have read because it has made me so aware but also the worst because now I'm terrified to give Natasha anything processed and I have become obsessed a bit :doh:

but it really is scary the crap they put in our food and we think we are eating healthy food - msg is one of the worst things that is in food and it is in nearly everything. I wish they would just leave our food alone and we could still have quick handy food. :nope:

Before that I was the queen of processed food (and still am for myself sometimes when we are both working and that is where my stash of frozen meals I have prepared comes in handy for Natasha).

I have a nighmare losing weight with pcos and I think that is partly whey the low carb works for me because there is not a lot of processed food that you can have on it. although I still only ever lose 3lb max so I think you are doing fantastic. :thumbup:

Frozen veggies are good though as they reckon that they are probably fresher than what they call fresh fruit and veg as it can sometimes be weeks in transport and on the shelves and need loads of preservatives to keep them so long where as the freezer actually preserves the frozen ones

Anyway that is my food rant over :ignore: - I bet you can lose that last 10lbs before DH gets back. :dance:

You will definitely need a size 10 diva cup after DH gets home :blush: because between how long you haven't seen each other and how good you are going to feel in yourself and he gets to come home to a totally new body - you two will be :sex: like rabbits for sure or then again maybe hopefully you wont need a diva cup because you will be preggers :happydance: :baby:


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## spidey

Shiv- I hope you found other possibilities on your house hunt that are nice and affordable. Keep us updated and share any pictures!

Cleckner- Thats crazy how you can get all your sodium from boxed mac and cheese! I've been shopping the outer rim of the grocery stores ever since my gluten allergy. It takes more effort to cook meals, but its worth it because it is so much healthier. I always cook more than we need so we have leftovers to freeze and lunches for the next day :thumbup:

Jelr- I'm happy to hear that things are finally working out with your DH's benefits. It's a shame they made him wait so long. How are you feeling?

Today Kira went to a birthday party and she did so well :cloud9: I'm sure you guys remember me saying how she screams around strangers. She did some screaming at first and then hid her face for awhile on me, but after 20 minutes she warmed up and went around playing with toys and having fun. It was so nice seeing her have a good time around so many strangers. She is such a flirt and was flashing smiles and giving everyone the eyes :haha: She also didn't ask for booby the entire time AND didn't want her pacifier!


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## cleckner04

Okay I just typed a mile long post and Emma hit the delete button on my computer and it backed out. :cry::cry: My day has been horrible and that was just the icing on the cake. :growlmad: Emma hasn't napped at all today. That should be enough explanation right there. :rofl: 

She also spilled water on my macbook pro this morning. :cry: Everything works except I can't click on anything. I can scroll around and type but can't click. But luckily my HP wireless mouse works for the apple so now I have to use a freaking mouse with it. Which I hate. I'm gonna wait till DH gets back to take it in to get fixed because 1) apple is hard to find. 2) it's always incredibly crowded in the apple store and 3) the people that work there are usually complete assholes so I don't want to deal with them alone. :haha: 

I haven't walked or done any sort of exercise at all today because I thought Emma would nap and than we could go. Well it got later and later and it's now 8:20 pm and no nap. And I'm exhausted so I really doubt I can stay up for an hour bike ride when she's asleep. So this week is already off to a horrible start with weightloss too. :dohh: Does anyone else's LOs skip naps now? I hope this isn't a daily occurrence now because I am wiped and Emma is a complete asshole today. That's right I called my baby an asshole. :rofl: 


spidey- That's so great Kira was good today!! She sounds like a sweetie. Emma hides too with strange people. But she does the same and warms up within about 20 minutes. 

jelr- I know it's crazy how bad boxed food is. I'm glad I've learned. I grew up eating things like hamburger helper and kraft mac n' cheese. :dohh: No wonder I've always been a little fluffy. :haha: Do they have hamburger helper there? Anyways...:haha: And I really hope my vag gets worn out when DH gets back. :muaha: He owes me for 6.5 months worth of sex. He always does a good job making up for it though. :sex::sex:


Okay. I'm off now. I've had enough of this day. :lol: I just gave Emma a spoonful of peanut butter to keep her quiet so I could type this out. :haha:


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah. A little off topic here but does anyone else completely HATE dora the explorer? I want to shoot my brains out watching this. Emma loves it. But I go to bed at night with "Backpack, BACKPACK, Backpack, BACKPACK" playing over and over in my head. :roll: Emma grabbed some Dora shoes when we were in the store last week and I quickly put them back. I refuse to buy a single Dora item. It's my own little protest. :rofl::rofl:


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## spidey

I hope Emma takes a nap today. I can't imagine if Kira skipped her nap- it would be a nightmare of a day. She usually takes hers from 1pm- 3pm/4pm. Sometimes if she's at my mom's, my mom can get her to take a morning nap too. When do babies usually stop napping?? At night Kira usually sleeps from 9:20pm-7:20pm. Getting her to sleep is still a 20 minute struggle where DH bounces her on the birthing ball. Recently for the afternoon nap she fights me when I try to bounce her, so we have a deal where she falls asleep on the booby while I sit on the couch. It's funny because she's not a booby sleeper, so this new way of taking a nap is pretty easy for me.

I spilled water all over my macbook once. It was awful. :cry: I turned it off and disconnected the power and then 2 days later turned it back on and it ran just fine (I'm using it right now). Fingers crossed your clicking problem resolves itself on its own. :hugs: In my area we have some small computer repair shops that are mac certified repair shops, so even though they mostly repair pc's, they also do mac's and will get reimbursed by apple if the computer is under warranty. I'm not sure how to search for them- perhaps on the apple website?? I have an apple store 30 minutes from me and I know what you mean. The small independent repair shop near my house was so nice and they were very appreciative of my business :thumbup:

LOL about Dora the Explorer. Kira loves that show too, but I'm not anti-Dora :haha: Kira has a Dora baby doll and a few other Dora things. Kira prefers Team Umizoomi over Dora though (and I do too!)

Da da da da da DORA da da da da da DORA!!! DORA DORA DORA THE EXPLORER.. :twisted:


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## Shiv

Cleck - I hope Emma is a happier little girl today. your asshole comment made me LOl! Sophia quite often doesn't have a nap anymore, I thank my lucky stars on the days she does and cry on the ones she doesn't! But she does sleep from 7pm to 8am most nights so I guess she probably doesn't need much of a nap. She is a much happier girl when she has one though. Just recently she started having one again (only for about 45 mins) but it gives me a chance to lay my pregnany self down and just drift off in time for her to wake up :haha:

As for Dora - well I know who she is but I can't find her on tv here (not that i have ever really looked) the only program Sophia regularly watches is In The Night Garden (do you get that there?) - she loves it and watches it before we take her up to get ready for bed. She quite often sings the songs to herself during the day and is really quite obsessed!


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## jelr

Natasha has skipped her nap on one or two occasions but then she gets back into her routine the following day thank god as she is also an asshole :haha: without it - she even gets up in bad form is she doesn't sleep for an hour - she wakes crying and is inconsolable for about a half hour. It is interesting to see how much your LO's sleep and it is something I meant to ask on the fb group as I'm a little worried about Natasha. She seems to get more sleep than other babies I know and sometimes is still very tired.

She sleeps from 8pm until between 8.30 and 9.30 but it is usually 9.30 and sometimes even 10 and then she also naps for an hour during the day and she is still so tired sometimes and I know I feel crap since the mc with tiredness and I would hate to think she feels crappy when she is tired. :cry: She gets a balanced diet so she shouldn't be lacking in anything.

Also as you know I bring her for cranial osteopathy because her head was so flat on one side and she had problems sucking and the osteopath asked me the last day if she was very tired as she said that her energy levels felt a bit flat when she was doing the treatment. I dont normally believe in the hocus pocus side of the treatment but it did make me wonder as she does get very flat. She said it can be caused sometimes by them not getting a good first breath - which Natasha didn't (hence her heart murmur) so I dont know.

Natasha isn't really bothered with Dora but is obsessed with Mickey Mouse and usually it doesn't bother me, except on really tired or hormonal days and then it does go through my head and I also go to bed with hot dog hot dog (which is the song) going through my brain :dohh: - I have bought her a minnie and mickey mouse teddy that she adores and on we got stickers to put on her helper box also and her little face lights up everytime she sees them. which reminds me I must stick up some more pictures now that it is finished as it looks really well.  

Cleck: there is no need for you to hope that your vag :blush: will be worn out because that is a dead cert :haha:

Spidey: Do you have redundancy in the US? If your job is gone will you get a redundancy package seeing as you have been there so long.

Shiv: I have done that when I have been very tired and had a nap when Natasha has :sleep: and there is nothing as bad as just drifting off and then they wake up :growlmad:


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## spidey

jelr- I wouldn't worry about her sleep because it doesn't sound off to me. If Kira gets on average 10 hours at night, and 3 hours of naps, then she's at 13 hours. Natasha is right around that amount too. When she was younger she needed 5 naps per day when most babies were down to 2 naps. Now she needs 2 naps each day to stay fully happy but she fights me (but not my mom) for the morning nap so I let her skip it. I hold her and her eyes roll back in her head because she's so sleepy, but she kicks and wiggles so badly! The inconsolable crying if her nap is too short is something Kira does too. My explanation is that Kira is so tired but hasn't mastered self-soothing yet, so she gets upset that she's awake rather than asleep. To try and prevent early waking, I either hold Kira while she naps or lay down with her. Kira has never made sleep and naps easy on me! When she was little, I spent most of the day bouncing her to sleep on the birthing ball for her 5 naps :dohh: I use to google search for overly sleepy babies because Kira always seemed to need too much sleep too. Perhaps Natasha and Kira are quick to become cranky at the first sign of tiredness, so it makes us think they need more sleep than they're getting. Kira also takes rests during the day and watches tv, etc. She's not super active, but I think its just her personality. It's 8:40am and she's already laying here taking a rest and holding her ears (something she does when she's ready to take a nap).

Regarding the theory of Natasha being tired because she didn't get a good first breath. I would think if she had damage in her brain from the lack of oxygen, she would have other obvious problems too. Kira also had lack of oxygen at a few hours old when she went blue (for who knows how long?!) and had to be resuscitated. I can see no obvious permanent damage from that- babies are very resilient!

My question for everyone is how do you get your LO to sleep? Do you say "go to sleep darling" and they lay there and drift off? That is my dream for Kira one day :haha:


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## Shiv

spidey said:


> My question for everyone is how do you get your LO to sleep? Do you say "go to sleep darling" and they lay there and drift off? That is my dream for Kira one day :haha:

At night that is pretty much what i do. Put her in her sleeping bag, she gives David a kiss goodnight, we go upstairs, get Eey-ore and then she goes in her cot and to sleep ( bet I have jinxed myself now!)

Naps are a whole other matter! 

Do you know what the turnaround was for us at bedtime. When she decided Eey-ore was her favourite cuddly toy, we made sure she only ever got him when she was going to sleep. So Eey-ore gets left in her cot and she only gets him when she is napping or going to bed at night. She definitely associates him with sleep and has even been known to say "Eey-ore nap, upstairs!"


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## Mary Jo

Adam seems to need a lot of sleep as well - most nights he is in bed by 9pm and awake at about 7am-ish, he usually goes to bed fine, I get him ready for bed, then he comes down and watches 1 or 2 episodes of Charlie & Lola (his all time favourite) with me, then Chris takes him up, he has a cup of milk while he gets 2 story books, teeth cleaned, into the cot and sleep. Sometimes he climbs straight out of the cot and settles in our bed, but that's ok. During the day, if we haven't gone out and wrecked his routine, he generally naps for 3.5 hours, sometimes more, not usually less, from about 9.45am to 1.15pm (thank GOD he was still doing that when I was desperately tired a few weeks ago, was sure it was all going to go to pot just when I needed the sleep time myself), then he usually has another short nap in late afternoon, about an hour or so, but this has been variable lately. 

today has been different - he slept late but had to get him up at 9.15am, as we were going out, then when we got back at 12pm, he wasn't tired for a nap so I kept him up till 3pm, and so he's been asleep ever since. there obviously won't be a second nap, so I hope he'll sleep till 6 or maybe even closer to 7. :lol: then we'll have dinner and start getting ready for bed at 8.30pm as usual.

he's usually good at going straight to sleep, I give him 2 dummies, put him into the cot, sometimes if he stands up again I tell him it's sleepy time or time for a sleepy lie down, then pull down the blackout blind and leave the room. 8 times out of 10 there is not a peep out of him after that. 

for ages I have thought I cannot carry on being as lucky as this with long naps... and I have had people (family) questioning our routine, thinking he doesn't need the second nap so close to bedtime, but they are always proved wrong when he is a cranky little shit all evening and doesn't eat his dinner. and then goes to bed like a lamb at bedtime. :haha: If I thought he'd still get up at 7am if I put him to bed at 7pm, I would try that (maybe) but I think he'd be up at 5am and that IS NOT HAPPENING. no. way.


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## spidey

MJ, if Adam's nap schedule works, then who cares if it's "normal" or not. It sounds like a great schedule to me :thumbup:

Shiv- I like the eeyore suggestion. Kira isn't attached to any single thing. She's always holding an object, but if she finds something else she prefers she'll switch them. It's something I could try though because it sounds like it could work or atleast help!

I'm jealous of all these babies who can fall asleep without assistance! We have a very regular night time schedule. Bath, play with Daddy, watch a tv show, booby in bed and then get bounced to sleep by daddy. The bounce can take anywhere from 20 minutes to 40 minutes (and sometimes an hour if I'm doing it). The problem is she fights sleep very badly. About a month ago we tried to skip the bounce and to go straight to bed. Me and DH said it was sleepy time and we all got into bed with Kira and turned out the light. 2 hours later she was still awake! She fell asleep many times, but as soon as she felt her body relax she would kick a leg or poke at her eye or wave her arm wildly around. We tried it for a few nights in a row and just gave up since she didn't seem ready. Kira has only fallen asleep in the car seat 3 times total and has fallen asleep while nursing about 10 times total in her life. For her afternoon nap today she nursed as I walked around the house bouncing and singing. There always has to be some form of movement for her to fall sleep. Even if she is exhausted she will not give in and allow her body to fall asleep.


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## cleckner04

spidey- Emma still uses my boob to fall asleep so don't worry you aren't alone with that. Although the night she skipped her nap, she flipped onto her stomach on the couch while watching cartoons and fell asleep all by herself. :haha: That was the first time EVER that she's fallen asleep without movement like the car/being in the carrier or with the boob. :dohh: So I think for us, when she stops napping, that will be when she starts falling asleep without me soothing her to sleep. But I'm in no hurry and I love our nighttime cuddles. :cloud9:

Well yesterday Emma had her nap again but I had to kind of force the issue with her. I kept asking her if she was ready for a nap and she'd quickly shake her head no and say 'unh uh'. :lol: But she finally fell asleep around 3 and we woke up just in time for dinner at 6. (I had a roast slow cooking so the entire house smelled like roast yesterday. *drools*)


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## Shiv

How is Emma's night time routine going now Cleck - does she still go down in her big bed for a bit?


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## cleckner04

It's kind of hit and miss lately. This past week she started off in her own bed I think 4 out of the 7 nights. And it is still completely random timing when she wakes up for me. One night she went 4 hours in her own bed, another night only 2. :dohh: And some nights I am lazy and immediately put her in my bed while I work out.


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## jelr

Actually when I count up the hours Natasha is getting compared to the rest of your LO's it is in and around the same. I just saw the times for bed and was thinking Natasha seems to get more sleep at night but when you add it up with the naps - It evens out as Natasha only naps for 45 mins to an hour - On a rare day she will nap for 1,5 hours. 

Spidey I dont think the ostopath was saying there is any lasting brain damage, she was just saying that they are finding that babies who dont take a good first breath seem to be less active and more tired and If I had heard anybody else say they were told that I would think it was a load of cr*p :wacko: but it actually fits Natasha to a tee so maybe there is something in it. :shrug:

Our bed time routine is usually one of us gets her washed and ready for bed, She sits on my knee then and has her milk while watching cartoons and then DH brings her down to brush her teeth and we both go down and give her kisses and cuddles and into her cot she goes, she lets out one cry when we leave the room but then is off to sleep. :sleep:

We kind of did the something like that Shiv when I thought she wasn't going to nap anymore a few months ago. she had started to kick up when going down for a nap and was becoming too attached to her doody (dummy) and it was in her mouth all day so we now only give it to her at bed time and nap time and since then she is back to going for a nap without any problems, we just say will we go down and get your doody and go for a snooze and she is delighted going down. :happydance:

We have taken Natasha out of her sleeping bag tonight and put a duvet on and I thought it was going to be a complete disaster as she cried her eyes out when I put her in the cot first and I just kept saying look at all the lovely teddies on it (Its a me to you duvet) and she then stopped and has went asleep no problem so fingers crossed it is as easy as that. :thumbup: I have just checked too and she still has it over her. I wanted to make the move when the weather is warmer as she cant walk in the sleeping bag and just falls over and she will be going into a toddler bed at some stage this year so at least its not a huge change from sleeping bag to duvet and cot to bed all in one go.

I am so envious of those nighttime cuddles Cleck, Natasha just wants to be put down when she is tired from the time she was 2 months old and has only once or twice fallen asleep on me or in my arms since then :cry:

MJ: I woudn't mind what anybody else says - people would drive you mad telling you what is best for your own child wouldnt' they? :hissy: If Adam was up all night it would be a different story, but he obviously needs it if he wont eat when he doesn't nap. It drives me mad that people always have to comment on what other people are doing, I wish everyone would rear their own children and not worry about what others do. ha ha that is my rant for today - DH family and my own really like their opinions :ignore:


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## spidey

Cleckner- oooh.. I'm drooling thinking of waking up from a long nap to have the house filled with smells of dinner in the oven. That is heaven for me! LOL about Emma falling asleep on the couch. I bet you were in shock when you saw her! I'm glad I'm not alone in having a more high maintenance sleeper. At night, does Emma keep her own space in the bed, or does she snuggle up to you? Lately Kira likes to lay her legs over me- it's so sweet.


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## cleckner04

Emma is definitely a snuggler at night. I usually sleep with my left arm up and she settles into my armpit basically. :rofl: Sometimes I'll wake up and my shoulder is sore from being up high for so long. :dohh:


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## Mary Jo

awww, that's so sweet, I wish Adam was a snuggler! we co-sleep most nights to some extent (he always goes into his cot but he stays in it anything from 30 seconds to the whole night, but more usually sometime around 3-5am he either cries and gets taken in or he just flips right in over the edge of the cot into our bed) but he seems to like snuggling with Chris more than me. :cry: though he usually is just in the middle by himself. when he bf at night we'd snuggle just like that and I remember how my shoulder would ache the next day :haha:


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## cleckner04

I often try to remember what it feels like to sleep with both arms down. It can be uncomfy at times. :haha:


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## spidey

jelr- I'm so glad Natasha slept okay without her sleeping bag! What a relief that must be! Now she can move to her big girl bed 

I haven't slept with my arms down for 20 months :haha: I often wake up and my arm is completely asleep. I get stiff if I lay in one position too long, so I hop over Kira a few times each night. It also keeps the boobies equally used :rofl: Kira's new thing is to lay one or both legs across me as she sleeps.. it's so cute.

MJ- I love how Adam flips himself into your bed :rofl: I hope he doesn't land on you as he falls down- that would be a shocking way to wake up!


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## Mary Jo

heh, funny you should say that, Spidey, as Chris and I had that very conversation this evening - he did flip out and onto me the night before last but I woke up just before he launched himself so I kind of eased him down. :lol: I think C and I might have to swap sides of the bed when I get bigger because I really don't want a 27lb toddler landing on my belly :haha:

(I've been on my current side of the bed for coming up 2 years and I have never liked it! I think it might be nice to swap, BUT I will have to climb further to get up and go to the loo in the night, which is frequent, and with my SPD that's not going to be good. ack. we need to move asap and figure something better out!)


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## cleckner04

That just gave me a thought. Do you ladies all have 'sides' with your husbands? I know some people literally never sleep on the opposite side. They are always on one side of the bed. 

DH and I don't care. We sleep wherever we land. :rofl:


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## spidey

haha... interesting question. Yes we do! In both places we've lived, DH always picks the side closest to the exit of the room, which is also nearest the bathroom. I have a clear memory of him claiming his side of the bed in our apartment when we first moved in with eachother. Very gentlemanly of him :rofl: I remember teasing him about it, and he came up with some bullshit excuse that he needs to be nearest the door to protect me from intruders :haha:


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## cleckner04

:rofl: DH thought I was crazy when we were first married because I'd want to change sides all the time. And I sometimes sleep the opposite way too with my head at the feet of the bed and my feet at the head of the bed. I always sleep better when I change it up occasionally. I have this theory that if you can't get good sleep, just rearrange the room and you'll sleep like a baby if you are facing a different direction. I have no idea why but it seriously works for me. :lol:


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## Shiv

Cleck - you are CRAZY! When you lie the other way round (head at the foot of the bed) does Corey swap too, or does he have to smell your feet all night?:haha:

I have a side, but David would sleep wherever. i tend to be on the side that is most open and nearest the door for when I freak out in the night :wacko:

We found a house:happydance: It isn't a mansion, but it'll do us for a year! It has such an old fashioned kitchen (circa early 1970's I would guess) but other than that it is all newly done, new carpets (eek) 3 bedrooms, although the smallest is tiny. here is a link if it'll work. 


I feel very relieved that we don't have to look anymore, It is in a lovley area with a little park just a few minutes walk away for Sophia and only a ten minute walk from Wokingham town centre which i really like. Phew!


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## jelr

I was just thinking the same thing - I dont think I could stand to smell DH's feet if I was to lie the other way :haha:

Yup we have a side too, although it changed when we moved her as there is not a lot of space at the end of the bed so I was knocking into the bed getting around it when having to pee during the night and DH never wakes up to pee - ha ha not that he doesn't wake up he just doesn't have to pee until morning :haha: So I'm on the left hand side by the door now for the last 5 years and it took a while to get used to.

Shiv: I'm so happy you got a house sorted, :thumbup: I can imagine what a weight off your mind that must be - yep the link still works and it looks lovely, I love the conservatory at the back and it sounds like an ideal location. :happydance:

Well the duvet didn't go so well last night - I think I jinxed myself by saying it went well. :nope: She woke every hour from 12 and it was like she didn't know what to do or how to get under the blankets because when I went in she said doody and then toes for me to cover up her toes :dohh: and tonight she would not let me cover her at all so I just let her go asleep uncovered and then covered her when she was asleep so I think it is going to take a few nights for her to get used to it - I'm glad I did it this week though when I was off work. 

Ouch MJ that would definitely be a frightful way to wake up with Adam landing on top of you :wacko:


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## Mary Jo

yay, Shiv :D that's great! must be a relief to have found somewhere suitable - it looks nice and fresh, and even better that it's in an area you're ok to live in. are you renting for a year and then going to buy? are you definitely selling your place or going to let it, too? how many houses did you go and see in the end? decent size, too - good to get a third bedroom, even if it's small it'll be fine for a baby.

I'm hoping we'll soon get a completion date on our new house/sale of my flat, we finally got the contract and land registry forms to sign (I say finally, it feels like this has gone on for ages but really it's quick for this house, we only had the offer accepted 2 weeks ago :lol: ), and there doesn't seem to be any major outstanding issues on the sale of my flat. we're also extending the lease, had to as it was down to 72 years and much less and it becomes unmortgagable, so we had to wait on my freeholder to get his act together and do that. really want to move in the next 6 weeks, if at all possible... we have some work to do on the house once we move in, it needs a new damp proof course and treatment for patches of woodworm, but that shouldn't take longer than two or three days, then we need to put new flooring and carpets in. I'm actually excited about the move now, I wasn't at ALL before, I had a vague sense of doom and dread, and I don't really understand why because the flat we were buying was nice enough... maybe because it was leasehold, maybe because I didn't like the area so much, maybe because there is no fence dividing the garden with the upstairs neighbour's and we wanted a fence and think that might have been a problem... this new house may need work but it and the garden is totally self-contained, and freehold, it's in a nice street, you can park outside the door, it's empty and chain free, it's also near a lovely park and the shopping centre AND good schools. so I don't have reservations. :D


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## Mary Jo

awww, jelr, am sure Natasha will get used to the new duvet soon, sounds like you're doing it in a really good way while you're off work and when the weather is warmer (is it warmer in Ireland, it's lovely here, bit of an early heatwave!). I think you're a braver woman than I am, am just not up for fighting with Adam right now, not that I presume it'll be a fight but I don't think right now he is able to appreciate something like his own duvet... once he will understand it I might make a bit of a thing of us choosing a bedding set together or something - no idea if this will work on a boy or if it's something only a girl would have opinions on! guess we'll have to see. I'm really looking forward to having a bedroom for Adam to decorate!


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## Shiv

David got the hump about me telling "you potential weirdos" where we will be iving, so I am taking the link down. If anyone wants to see it then I'll P.m it :winkwink:


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## Mary Jo

awwww, I promise I won't track you down and stalk you :winkwink:


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## spidey

Let the stalking begin Shiv! I took a look at your new house before you took the link down but I just now have a chance to tell you how beautiful it is! I love the back room that looks like a green house. The kitchen isn't that bad, it's just not modern. I call it an 80's kitchen :haha: Most of the apartments where I live were built in the 80's and they all have those same cabinets. The oven is a bit strange- what is that thing over the oven? Is it true that you guys don't have gigantic refrigerators like us Americans? :haha:

MJ- I love your new house too!! From the pictures it looks in great shape, but its always nice adding your own touches to make it yours. I've never seen a bathtub that fills up from the side rather than the end before. I love the yard too.. it's nice and private :thumbup:

Is it weird that I get such pleasure from studying your new houses? :blush:

jelr- I hope Natasha sleeps okay tonight without her sleeping bag and you can get some sleep too.

cleckner- that's pretty crazy that you are a random sleeper. I am too routine to ever sleep with my head on the wrong side of the bed :haha: But I do agree with you on re-arranging the furniture. I love re-arranging things to keep them new and exciting!


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## jelr

ha ha Shiv did you tell David that we are not "POTENTIAL" weirdos but that we were weirdos - I bet if anybody read some of our conversations they would definitely believe that :haha:

MJ: the house looks lovely too. :thumbup: it also sounds like a lovely area. What is freehold and leasehold - We dont have that here. I do know what you mean about fighting over the duvet - I was dreading it as I knew she would hate it, but it has to be done at some stage as I know she will be going into a toddler bed at some stage in the next year and as I was saying to you on fb, she falls over in her sleeping bag so it had to be done before we moved her into a bed. I actually didn't plan on doing it until the summer months when I was off but we are having the same weather as you all at the moment and it is an early heatwave so I just bit the bullet as you know yourself it could be raining all summer (I think your weather is more or less the same as ours) - I dont know why I'm worried about the cold really as our house is always roasting and is usually between 18 and 21 degrees and only ever went down to 17 during the snow, I think I was more afraid that she would feel cold because she is used to being wrapped up in her bag just like I hate my shoulders not being covered when I'm sleeping even if its roasting :dohh:

Spidey: That was a grill on top of the oven - I'm speaking for Ireland now and I think the UK is more or less the same but no the norm is not to have a gigantic fridge like you have in the US, they have become more popular in the last few years are are actually called american fride freezers but on one door is a fridge and the other a freezer.

Well I think we have cracked the duvet :thumbup: (I hope I'm not jinxing myself now again) - she didn't wake last night but was awake at 7.30 instead of 9.30 and when I went in she said out out out like she hated being in her cot, but she was much happier going down for her nap today and tonight and we had put her dummies underneath her new pillow and I had told her teddy (there are teddy's on the bedding) was minding it and she thought this was really funny and kept saying teddy and toes so that was that she wanted the duvet to cover her tonight so fingers crossed she likes it better now. :happydance:

We went to the beach today and Natasha was so funny she was really sceptical about the sand and the water being on her toes, I thought she would hate it because lately for some reason she doesn't seem to like to get her hands dirty at all :wacko: and she did keep saying first of all toes and dirty, but we just played loads of games and kept burying her feet and ours and she seemed to become less wary and enjoyed herself in the end. :happydance:

I really hope this weather is like this for the summer as she really loves being outside.  

I can't wait to be off all summer as I dont want to miss a thing and she seems to be coming on in leaps and bounds this week and is putting a couple of words together, they are not in proper sentences at all, but a few words together in the right context for example this morning she said mammy, cream (well it is more like ceam) bum bum when I was changing her nappy - she is also trying to sing along with certain songs on the radio or sing along with me when I sing somewhere over the rainbow, it really is just humming with a few of the right sounds not even words in the right places but it is really cute. :awww:

Although I hope her social life doesn't keep going the way it is at the moment or myself and DH will be exhausted :haha: - She had a birthday party last Saturday, another this Friday and another the following Friday and then we have a christening and confirmation to go to the following weekend :dohh:


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## spidey

haha... it's funny to think that you call them American fridge freezers :haha: Thats exactly what I have, and mine has a water and ice dispenser in the door too! Mine is filled to the brim and I could really use a second one :haha:

I wonder if the grill on top is what we call a broiler here. Just about everyone has an exhaust fan above their oven and sometimes an exhaust fan with a microwave ontop of it.

Congrats to Natasha on her talking!! Thats amazing! I was impressed with your other post where Natasha was telling you her feet were uncovered. My friends daughter who just turned 2 can talk in almost complete sentences now and her mom says that she hardly has a tantrum anymore. She thinks its from being able to communicate her needs better.

Oh, and Kira is entering that phase where she doesn't like dirty hands! She gets a speck of mud on them and then holds them up and whines for me to wipe them clean. 

We had hot weather today so we spent most of the day outside and Kira got to play with the garden hose. One of her canines is about to pop through, so she has 4 molars that are halfway in, and now more teeth about to break the surface. Poor cranky girl!


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## jelr

All the american style fridge freezers have the water and ice dispenser on the door too. I think the more space you have for food the more you need. We always had a normal fridge which is one door and split in two with the top half the fridge and the bottom half the freezer and it did me just fine and when we built on the kitchen we were going to go for the american style one but they were quite expensive and I didn't want to lose the space on the water and ice dispenser (as they take up half the freezer here) as I reckoned I wouldnt' use it. So we bought a larder fridge and a larder freezer and the sit side my side and the door is changed on the freezer to open the other way so it looks exactly the same as an american style one but you have more space without the dispenser and the price was a little lower and mine is now packed to the brim and I could also do with another one. When DH was layed off one of my friends said sure dont worry, you have so much food in the house you can feed yourselves for a month and not buy shopping :haha: She was so right really but I still spend a fortune on groceries every week :dohh:

I probably made Natasha sound more advanced on my previous post when I said she wanted me to cover up her toes, all she actually said was toe toes and patted the blanket but I knew what she was saying to me so what I meant was she was telling me in her own way not that she actually said cover my feet :dohh: - I do think she has less tantrums in the last week or two and it could actually be down to her being able to tell us more (I know I have really jinxed myself now :dohh:)

Isn't it funny that they are going through a phase of not wanting their hands dirty. I didn't think Kira would when she loves being out in the dirt and gardening with you so much. I dont know I suppose they are more aware of things now. :shrug:

Ah the poor little thing getting molars and canines (we call them eye teeth here :haha:) - I thought Natasha was bad getting the 4 molars together and then the canines straight after. I hope Kira gets them quickly and she will have a break, we seem to be clear of teething pain for a good month now. (again I know I'm am definitely jinxing myself :haha:) I did think she was getting more then but it does seem to have settled down, although she is drooling the last few days really bad. it is like there is a constant drip from her chin which is strange as she never drooled at all with any of her other teeth. Hopefully if Kira gets them over with she will have a nice break before the last 4 come in and I'm hoping that it might be easier on them when they are a little older.


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## Mary Jo

thanks Spidey and jelr :D - Spidey, I've seen baths like that, with the taps in the middle, but we've always had one that's had them at one end. no idea how it'll work with Adam, one of usually takes a bath with him, and we sit in front of the taps, which isn't comfy but it stops him turning them on and falling and hitting himself on them. so with them in the middle - eeek! maybe we'll have to rig up something to cover them? a towel, maybe? the house *looks* nice in the pics but it's priced quite low because it needs a new damp-proof course, the smell of damp when you go in is pretty strong. it's had a survey for that, and a quote, and it'll cost about £3,000. plus another £1,000 or so getting some woodworm treated. all that will require the carpets and laminate in the living room to come up, which is fine because I didn't like them anyway. 

we're going to put better quality laminate throughout the downstairs (apart from the kitchen, which is tiled) and carpet on the stairs and the bedrooms. the walls also need to be replastered, or skimmed, because they're really lumpy, it's like there's been wallpaper up and someone has ripped it off and it's pulled chunks of plaster down, but they didn't fix it, just painted over. so we need to spend on it before we really get to live there. but I don't mind because I think it'll be lovely once it's done. it had new double glazing put in last year - really nice as well as it's in the style of the old windows so suits the age of the house (110 years) rather than looking incongruously modern. and thank Christ it's not mock-tudor leaded double glazing because I find that to be an insult to my eyes and new or not it would have had to have gone. oh and ALL that wallpaper is going, I am not a fan of it at all, and especially in the bedroom, it won't go with any of my bedding! fortunately it's only one wall or just the chimney breast that has patterned paper on so it won't be a huge job to get rid of it.

jelr, I googled and found that you do have leasehold and freehold in Ireland! link. basically, leasehold properties are usually flats or apartments, where you own the flat itself but you don't own the land it's on. that belongs to the freeholder. leaseholders - or flat owners - pay the freeholder ground rent annually, and usually a service charge to cover building insurance and maintenence of the structure of the building - the roof, for example, and for the common parts like the hallway. my flat is leasehold, and to be honest I didn't want to do that again, I wanted us to be independent. it really put me off that the flat we were going to buy was leasehold, as we would have had to get permission to put a garden fence up to mark the boundary line, and we wouldn't have been able to extend the flat either, even though there was loads of room in the garden. also, the lease only had 87 years remaining, and once you get under 80 years you're heading towards a difficult position as to get a mortgage, lenders want there to be at least 70 years but ideally more on it. we just had to extend the lease on my flat to 99 years - which cost £3k - as it is down to 72 years, I always knew I'd have to do this as it was only at 83 years when I bought it. we ust thought, ack, we'd only need to stay in the flat for 7 years and we' be having to think about extending another lease, and it could have cost a lot lot more, up to £12k.

houses are usually freehold, so when you buy it you own the building and the land it's on, and so within reason and subject to planning consent, you can do what you want with it. so we will organise our own buildings insurance and do our own maintenance. fingers crossed once the damp is fixed it'll be sound.

re fridges, oh my god I am envious of people with normal size fridge freezers, never mind gigantic American double ones! honestly, the fridge we have here is tiny. it's 55cm wide and fits under the worktop, the smallest fridge with an actual freezer box (not just ice box) in it I could find when I got it about 7 years ago. we have no room for anything bigger. when we move, there is a fridge freezer already there that's included in the sale, it's not huge, it's nothing like as big as I want but it'll do to start. we dream of being able to go shopping and fill the trolley with stuff for the freezer! as it is I squeeze an amazing amount into my tiny freezer but I want to be able to bulk cook and have loads of meals all ready to go. 

also looking forward to Adam being able to tell me what he wants. he really doesn't say much, he has his odd words, and he has more and more of them, but he relies on us to read his mind, I think! he grabs my leg and pulls me to where he wants me to go, which is sweet, but we have crying fits and tantrums for no apparent reason, and I know if he could articulate what he wanted we wouldn't have them - for example, the other day we got up and went downstairs, and I was washing his cup for his milk, and he was looking up to the worktop and started crying and trying to push me away from the sink. I gave him the milk but he was still really upset. something on the worktop seemed to be causing it. so I lifted him up in the hope that he could tell me or point, and he grabbed this big red shiny apple that was sitting there, and proceeded to eat 3/4 of it with a huge smile. I wish he would have pointed or said something but I guess he didn't know how to. :(

oh, and we had one of the first instances of real stranger anxiety the other day - he's never bothered by people but I have noticed if someone he doesn't know or hasn't seen in a while comes to the flat, he gets upset. he could see the same person anywhere else and he wouldn't be fussed! this woman came round to see me and though Adam has met her before it was a year ago, and he burst into tears and when I held my arms out he came to me to sit on my knee - this is something Mr Independent NEVER EVER does! (he sits on my knee but never comes if I invite him, or comes for comfort, he's more of a daddy's boy in that sense and goes to Chris :cry: ).

and his sleep has gone to shit this week. arggh. I wrote about it on the facebook group - basically he keeps waking about 3-4am, and is awake awake... and won't go back to sleep for ages, and then he sleeps so late it buggers his schedule! today he didn't get up till 10.50am. which is crazy. he's just gone for a nap now (about 2.20pm). i can't deal with broken sleep like this! thank goodness for a 4-day weekend, we're going to try to tackle it. not quite sure how, but think we need to get up at 8am whatever he's been up to at night. 

re getting hands dirty - oh I wish Adam was bothered by this! he just loves rubbing his hands through dirt. we took him to the park last night as it was still really warm out, and he ran over to this piece of bare earth, kneeled down and rubbed his hands through it. ack. little boys!


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## Shiv

MJ I forgot to say that the hosue you are buying look lovely and a real bargain for London! I hope it all goes through for you quickly and youc an get Adam into his own room I think myabe the heat is affecting his sleep?

Spidey - I hope Kira's teeth stop giving her jip soon. Sophia's canines have been coming through for amonth now and still not broken the skin! She is being pretty good with them though (fingers crossed!)

Cleck - I am looking forward to your weigh in tomorrow!

jelr - I am glad Natasha settled better with her duvet last night. Sophia is still in her sleeping bag so I know we have to make the transition soon, but i am scared!

Has anyone got anything nice planned for the long weekend? In the U.K we have a 4 day weekend this weekend for Easter, do you guys have that in the states as well?

My boobs have started to grow (havig not changed f=since I got pregnant) so on the upside they are looking slightly less like a used tea bag, but I have new stretchmarks on them already - they look like a road map!


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## cleckner04

Check the lion cubs thread ladies. I posted a new idea for birthdays. 

And don't get too excited about my weigh in. I completely stopped working out this week AND I haven't been inputing my food. :blush: I've gained a lb. already. But honestly, I don't care. I've been having stress with DH's job situation so weight loss is the last thing on my mind this week. I guess they are reviewing 16,000 people in the navy and will shove out 3,000 people. DH is on that list. And he doesn't have a good past record with getting in trouble like he has so we pretty much think he's getting shoved out of the navy in a year. I had a day of panic. A day of 'omg what are we going to do'. And now I'm starting to accept it and just hoping for the best. There isn't anything I can do about it so I just have to accept it I guess. We won't know for a while I guess. And if we find out he IS getting shoved out, DH is gonna move me and Emma back home and I'll probably move in with his parents. We more than likely won't have a second kid yet either. So really coming in this thread is just making it worse but I like checking up on you ladies.


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## Shiv

Aw Cleck - sorry Corey is facing redundancy. I do know how you feel after recent events with David. If worst comes to the worst and Corey is forced out then at least you will be together :hugs: I hope you still come in here, I think talk of houses, toddlers and sleeping positions has overtaken any new baby and ttc chat anyway!


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## spidey

Cleckner that really has the potential to suck, but try to think of the positives so you don't get so down. You guys can be together and Emma can have her Daddy around. Moving in with the inlaws can't be much fun, but maybe when you live there for a little while, he could get some training in another field and get a good job- some sort of trade job would be great. My DH was an appliance repairman for awhile and it was good hours and great pay. Don't be hard on yourself about any weight gain... you'll get back into it once life stops being so stressful :hugs: And Shiv is right, we're mostly talking about american fridge freezers now :haha: Although I suppose some Diva cup conversation could come into play for my next cycle :blush: When will you know if your DH can't be in the Navy any longer?

DH gets a 4 day weekend from his job, and I'm using vacation days to give myself a 4 day one. We have soooo much planned! Unfortunately Kira has a slight fever tonight, so if she winds up sick that might ruin things. Lots of gardening, cleaning and getting ready for summer! I'm hoping her fever is just from all those teeth trying to bust through.

MJ- Kira sounds the same as Adam when it comes to talking and throwing tantrums from me not reading her mind correctly. I hope Adam's sleep improves soon. Regarding the house- it's going to be alot of work, but it'll be nice to add your own touches too. You'll have to take before and after pictures for me to obsess over :blush: 

Shiv- Thats good news on your growing boobs :haha: Are you doing anything for the 4 day weekend??

jelr- the funny thing about Kira and her dirty hands, is she sticks them in mud and then holds them up and says "ooooo" (for "no" since she can't make N sounds) and then I have to wipe them off. Then she sticks them back into the dirt :dohh: How did Natasha sleep with her blanket tonight? 

If I'm in the mood tomorrow I might take a picture of my american fridge freezer to show you girls how packed it is :haha: I am so spoiled by the crushed ice and cold water.


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## cleckner04

I'm really not sure when we'll find out about it. I hope before he's back so we can plan better. I am SO glad DH wrecked and totaled our car. Is that weird? :rofl: Because now we don't have debt. I have a small loan that I have to pay off but I could do that in a few months if I had to. I've just been paying it off slowly just to keep DH's credit building. So if he has to get out in a year, we'll be debt free! 

And I love my inlaws so living with them will actually be a luxury because my MIL likes to wake up and make breakfast and all that good stuff. :haha: But I don't think I could manage living with them in a long term sense. I lived there for 2 months last year and it wasn't bad but I did get sick of it towards the end because I like having my own house to take care of. 

DH said a few other guys on his ship are already planning too because they are in the same situation. One already said he can get DH a job but it's in Illinois so not back home but close enough. ugh. I just want a stress free life. :haha: That's not too much to ask for right? I seriously would live in a shitty trailer if it meant I'd have DH home every night though. He already said we can rent a place in a trailer court if we have to. So we'll be complete white trash but we'll be together. :cloud9:


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## jelr

Aww cleck big big :hugs: honey - I'm so sorry you are facing this. What sort of job does Corey do in the army? Could he get a job doing the same thing outside of it maybe at home. I think it would be fantastic if that was to happen as you guys could be together without him having to go away like this and be at home near family and friends too or do you think that wont be an option? Will he get a redundancy package that would help you get on your feet until he can find a new job? I do believe everything happens for a reason and it just goes to show with your DH wrecking the car that you wont have depts until you get on your feet. I know it is easy for me to say that because we are coming out the other side of it now, but I was like you when DH was laid off first I thought it was funny and was wondering what esle would hit us that week, but then I went into a blind panic and was convinced we wouldn't be able to pay our mortgate and houses are not selling here so downsizing wasn't an option so I was convinced we were going to be evicted by the bank and that we would either be homeless or would have to emigrate because there are no jobs here, but thankfully things are looking good now (I dont want to say anything on here for the moment as its a public site, but I should have good news fingers crossed in the next 2 weeks) and I do now believe that it all happened for the best and that it happened at just the right time as it has been so nice to have DH here and we have done our grieving for the mc together and had loads of time all 3 of us as a family.

Also are you still checking your monitor - could the extra lb be because you are oving - I think your cycle was around the same time as mine last time and I am 15 days after AF and have put on 2lbs in the last two days so I'm putting it down to ov as I have been sticking really well to the low carb diet this week.

Spidey: I would love to see your fridge :haha: although I would probably drool over the lovely food being on this bloody diet :haha: - I really hope Kira is not getting sick and it is just teeth that is causing the temperature - Natasha had a temperature sometimes with the last lot. Why do babies do something and then give out - I know it is cause and reaction and learning but it is so annoying :dohh: - We give Natasha her dummy on long journeys and she throws it away and then cries for it - It drives me nuts :dohh:

Shiv: I was scared too about the sleeping bag but I'm so glad I have done it now and it is another thing off my mind as having to do ifkwim - the thoughts of it was worse than actually doing it and it only took a couple of nights and she is sleeping better now (or more so I am) now that it is done because before no matter how far down we put her in the cot she would end up at the top and spent the night bashing her head off of the top of it - She didn't even flinch or waken but I woke everytime she did it and nearly felit it for her *ouch* but now with the pillow she is not doing that anymore and loves it - funny how they can hate something and then love it within a few days.

MJ: That is mad that we have freehold and leasehold here and I didn't even know it, I feel so stupid sometimes because I would think I have good knowledge of things but being on here I have realised there is so much I dont know :haha: - I reckon it must be more in the cities as everyone I know lives in houses, but then we are in a village. We do live about 15mins drive from a town but it is the same there - everyone rents apartments and flats and when they decide to buy they buy houses in the resedential part of town. I must ask my parents if they have heard of it because they are both from Dublin, although I know any of my family still up there are in houses too so that could be why I have never heard of it.

I hope Adam starts sleeping better for you - It could be the heat or just a phase, Natasha went through a stage of wanting to play at all hours and I know some of you girls dont like it but we had to used some Controlled crying because there was no way I was able to get up and play at 4 in the morning with her. The broken sleep is a killer though I also dont do well with it, although you wouuld think at this stage I would get used to it as I am a really light sleeper so have had broken sleep since Natasha was born between her thrashing around the cot and waking crying for her dummy, I know that is something I should probably tackle too and get rid off as she is far too attached to it and crys in her sleep if she can't find it and then we gave her two so she would hopefully find one but now she crys is she has one in her mouth and doesn't have the other in her hand :dohh: but I'm not ready to do it quite yet as I know that will break her heart. Hopefully the house will come through quickly and Adam will have his own room and will hopefully go back to sleep when he has nobody to jump on lol.

We also have a 4 day holiday here but it is not affecting us as I'm off for 2 weeks for Easter and DH is off with no work. Is Good Friday a National holiday in the UK. I presume the US is the same as here if you have to take a vacation day Spidey. Here it is a holday but it is up to the discretion of the employeer whether they close or not and most employeers make you take it as a vacation day if they do close.

Also do you girls have the same traditions as here on Good Friday? Here we are not meant to eat meat but then that is for religious reasons and I sometimes do. :haha: Also none of the pubs or off licences open and it is against the law to see alcohol in any of the shops either. 

Well I may run as Natasha will be awake soon and we are off to our friends son's birthday party.


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## Shiv

no time to write a big reply, but jelr you just reminded me of teh time DH and his frineds went to Ireland for a lads weekend and turned up on Good Friday and couldn't get any drink - oh I did laugh :haha:


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## spidey

Cleckner, we almost bought a trailer in a trailer park! You can get a really nice trailer for a great price- we were looking at brand new ones for around 30-50,000 but land rent is about $350- 400 a month here which sucks. If it wasn't for the high cost in land rent we would be trailer trash right now :rofl: Instead we inherited our current plot of land early from the MIL and we paid to have a house built on it. Land is expensive here, and the house was relatively inexpensive to have built. Thats great to be nearly debt free :happydance: I just paid off our car and its a great feeling. The only debt we have now is the house, but technically thats not a debt.

Jelr- There are no major traditions that take place here on Good Friday. The stores are still open and many people have to work. On Easter Sunday most places are closed though

What is everyone doing for easter for their LO's. I'm setting up a plastic easter egg hunt for Kira. I have 12 really large plastic eggs and I'm stuffing 12 different hand puppets in them and hiding them all over the house. I hope she catches on and searches for them! She's also getting a chocolate bunny and stickers.

I'll take a picture of my fridge later :haha: Kira is napping now and I'm laying with her so she stays asleep a nice long time! No fever today, so it must have been those teeth making her feel bad.


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## Shiv

Spidey - looking forward to seeing your fridge. Glad Kira's fever has gone an dI hope you and DH have a fab few family days off.

Cleck - I am excited about the possibiity of you Corey and Emma all living together, even if it's in a trailer :haha: It's kinda romantic!


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## Mary Jo

oh no, Cleck, really sorry to hear your news, that sucks. any idea when you'll hear definitively so you can make plans? I really hope it works out well for you all and that you'll be able to live together again permanently. what would the job in Illinois be? and how far is that from home? 

this economy is just awful. how many of us just here have had our husbands lose work? seems like most of us. you may remember Chris lost his job last summer when the company he'd worked at for 5 years went under, it was a scary time for us because we had hoped to TTC and move house, and we'd had to have put them on hold, but he was really lucky and found a new job after being unemployed for only 3 weeks. and this job is probably going to be a lot more stable as he works, doing graphic design, for a national medical professional body (I'd put the whole name only I wouldn't want it popping up in a google search), but it's for a profession that I doubt is going to be under pressure from the recession! (anaesthetists) really hope all the changes our guys are facing turn out for the best, even though it's beyond stressful while we're in the middle of it. for a variety of reasons last summer was pretty horrendous for me and C, but now I hope things are on the up. touch wood.

Spidey, please post a pic of your fridge! and the contents :lol: I LOVE nosing at other people's houses. :D we will definitely be taking before and after pics of our new place!

jelr, heh, don't worry about not knowing about freehold and leasehold, be glad you've never had to know! I wish to god I never knew about leasehold, it's not been something I've enjoyed or would want to do again. 

Shiv, thanks :) it's definitely a bargain for London, for an actual house, even though it's only got 2 bedrooms. it's only barely in London, though, we're in zone 5, so it's going to be more expensive for Chris to get to work (he works in zone 1 and goes in on the train and tube). I think if the house was in real good condition it would sell for more like £225k. it was originally on for £210-£230k, and we presume that the seller had a higher offer but that all fell through when the survey and damp report came back, so it came back on the market. C had a call from the agent, this was the day after we'd decided to pull out of the other flat, and the agent assured us the buyer would accept £210k for a quick sale. obviously we'd been messed about a lot and were really far on with the sale of my flat, so a quick sale was exactly what we hoped for so as not to lose our buyer, so we offered £210k and it was accepted. other houses in the street are on at £230k. because our seller lost a buyer, all his papers, etc, were already with his solicitor, damp report had been done, so things are moving pretty fast. I'm hoping this is one of those times when things work out the way they're meant to, and all the stress around the other flat will have been worth it if it meant we then found a better place.

as for good friday traditions, I don't know of any really, apart from eating hot cross buns, which I haven't done this year. the weather is really throwing me off from even remembering it's Easter, I don't remember it being as hot as this ever in April. I know Easter is late this year but even so. pubs are definitely open as normal, and I have never knowingly not eaten meat on a good friday, but I'm suspecting that might be a catholic thing anyway. Chris is off work as it's a bank holiday (as is Easter Monday - and also this coming Friday for the royal wedding, and the Monday after that for May day), so his work is closed. however if I regularly worked Fridays I'd be working as usual, as my place operates as normal throughout the year, including Christmas if it falls on a Thursday, Friday or Saturday.

I've actually eaten quite a lot of meat today, a double cheeseburger for lunch (working on my food baby) and sliced beef and chicken (with salad) for dinner. we went out to look at wood flooring, and have chosen an engineered wood rather than a laminate, in oak. then I persuaded C to take me to Ikea :rofl: - he initially refused point blank, but we were only 3 mins drive away at the flooring shop, so I got my way. I didn't mention it before we went out because I knew he'd be bolshie and moody and refuse, and maybe even refuse to go to the flooring shop as well. I can see where he was coming from because Ikea on a bank holiday sounds like hell, and I agree, if it had been mid-afternoon probably it would have been, but we went out early and were there at 11am, and it wasn't at all busy, we even parked the car right near the entrance. we weren't there to buy but just look at some stuff, bedroom furniture for Adam, a bed, and wardrobes for us. didn't look for wardrobes in the end as we're not sure of how much space there'll be for them, and we didn't like the single beds (want to get Adam a proper 3ft full length single so it can be used as a spare adult bed if necessary), but we found some nice bedroom furniture for him this Stuva range, which I think we'd get in white or beech. think we're going to get this Mothercare bed, it's on special offer right now so I might ring up and find out when the offer ends, we don't want it right now but we'd deal with another box hanging around it it meant we got over £50 off.

I'm another who's nervous about ditching the sleeping bag, think I can safely say we won't be doing so for a while yet as I only just spent £38 on a 1 tog 18-36 month one :lol: jelr, Adam has had a pillow for a couple of months and he loves it, he was clearly enjoying sleeping on our pillow when he came into our bed, and he started pulling a soft toy under his head, so I figured it was time. I think he started sleeping a lot more peacefully and soundly when we did. also not looking forward to the looming dummy battle, he also likes one in his mouth and one in his hand, though he's usuall ok if he loses one as long as he can still get the other. I really wanted not to have to buy any more, I have bought so many over the last 20 months, but I don't see an end in sight any time soon, and I've had to throw a few out because I found teeth holes in them, so I think I will need to be buying more, grrrrr.

speaking of sleeping peacefully, I am pleased to report that last night went well, not that we did anything to engineer this, it just so happened this way, and Adam stayed IN THE COT till 7.17am, when he decided to leap over onto me. such a relief to get an unbroken night. I just wish I'd gone to bed earlier myself and had a better sleep but I was silly and stayed up past 1am. :dohh: not presuming it'll happen again tonight, it's really really warm, warmer than last night I think. part of the problem is we're loath to open the window too much because that renders the blackout blind useless, and will result in him waking at stupid o'clock on account of the early daylight; also we have no fan because it's gone, along with a load of other stuff, including all my maternity clothes, to my friend's basement. we put it there months ago when we started decluttering big time for selling the flat, presuming we'd have moved by the time we needed these things again. well, I've never needed the fan in April before, so I don't feel terrible about it, but we do need to get it back!

Spidey, I have no idea what we're doing for Easter, an egg hunt sounds like a lot of fun though :D hope Kira enjoys it. I don't think Adam would understand it this year. maybe I underestimate him, though! maybe if it's still warm I'll get him an icecream. I got him one today, a Fab bar, and offered it after dinner, and he ate most of it, along with quite a fair bit of Chris's white Magnum. he's never really had ice cream before but it's safe to say he loves it. oops. BAD MUMMY.


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## spidey

here is my fridge and kitchen :haha: I'm actually going grocery shopping this Monday to get more food since we'll be "out" of food this Sunday :rofl: I left the pictures high quality for ultimate snooping :haha:

I'll post more later if I can. Kira is being a super crank pot this evening and DH took her out of the house for a moment so I could get some peace. 


Spoiler
fake stainless steal front, but complete with ice in the door (crushed or whole) and cold water!https://www.razortoe.com/share/fridge/fridge.jpg


Spoiler
inside the fridge. On the shelf with orange juice is a blue carton which contains milk. You can't tell from the picture, but we have 4 of those milk cartons on that shelf :blush:https://www.razortoe.com/share/fridge/inside.jpg


Spoiler
my kitchen! I love my kitchen and one day when it wears out I would like to do upgrades like granite counter tops, real tile floors, and a tile back splashhttps://www.razortoe.com/share/fridge/kitchen.jpg


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## cleckner04

I love that you keep your alcohol at an easily reachable level for Kira. :haha: You have a nice kitchen! 

How much did it cost to build a house? We've thought about doing that instead just buying land and maybe for now getting a cheap trailer or RV to put on it until we can afford to build. :haha:


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## spidey

I guess one day I'll have to child proof my fridge :haha:

The house cost 205,000 total, but that was in 2006 when house prices were insane and contractors were able to charge more since there was so much work. Included in that was about 20,000 of county fees for water and sewer hook up, plus permit fees. A 2 bedroom 1 bath fixer upper was going for 230,000 in this area, so we really got a great bargain :thumbup: It's a 3 bedroom 2 1/2 bath with an unfinished basement. 

This is my exact house (minus the garage) 
https://www.mod-u-kraf.com/floorplans.php?floorplan=Newport

It was shipped here from Virginia in 4 large pieces and then put into place with a crane. It was one of the most stressful days of my life!


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## cleckner04

That's a really nice layout! I'm looking at houses for 70k and under. :haha: I could never afford 200k. Even now with DH's job we couldn't afford it. :blush: 

jelr- I meant to respond earlier but you were completely right, I peaked today on my monitor. :rofl: You knew it before I even did! :haha: So hopefully you are also right and the weight will fall back off. But last month it didn't fall back off for some reason. 

This week I started that 30-day shred. I did it yesterday and I have to do it today still. I keep getting distracted looking at houses online. :haha:


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## spidey

We managed to save 40,000 in the years before buying the house since we lived in a 2 room apartment that was $500/ month and it included all utilities. We both worked full time jobs and were only paying for rent, food and gas (we seriously did not buy anything else and even were sleeping on a used matress :blush:) . So our final mortgage was 160,000 which is only about $1100 a month. So not bad at all! I bet that same house could be built for 100,000 or less in other areas of the country. It's so expensive living in Maryland and we live in one of the richest counties in the country so the price of everything is jacked up to unreasonable levels. DH works for the county government and his salary doesn't allow him to afford to live here- but we can because of the free land we early-inherited and "cheap" house :haha: My parents and MIL moved here when it was inexpensive 20+ years ago and we really wanted to live nearby. DH's income is 42K (he use to make 48K but has mandatory unpaid leave now due to the economy) and I make 24K working part time (so you can see why me losing my job will suck big time!!)

84 lumber use to sell lumber packages for houses. There was one that we were going to buy- it was a cute house that would cost 35,000... but then we would have to hire someone to put it together :haha:


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## Shiv

Your house looks amazing Spidey - lots of room. You know the house I am going to be renting, well we were told that would cost £325000 to buy (which is $537,000) now that is crazy!


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## spidey

OMG Shiv, I would die if I had to pay that much for a house!!


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## cleckner04

Yeah a house for that price would be a freaking mansion here! Well probably not here in san diego but back home it would be. :haha: San diego is ridiculous for house prices too. Although I'd never even consider buying a house here. 

I wish someone would give us land. :rofl: DH's parents own 33 acres but I don't think they'd ever give any of it away. :lol: And DH's brother owns 80 acres. :shock: But he would never give it away either. We offered to buy 5 acres from him and he denied us. :(

Well I've been searching back home some more and I"m feeling much more confident about all of this. There are some decent houses for like 40k back home and although they are in the city, I could totally deal with that if it meant we'd have a roof over our heads. The town DH is from is an hour away this city but that's still better than being a 4 day drive away.


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## Shiv

Cleck - I am SO glad you are feeling moe confident about everything. I bet you'll start getting excited about moving back home and being with Corey and then he won't get told to leave the Army :dohh: I truly hope that it all works out for the best for you guys. It is awesome that you can buy a house for 40K, I am jealous!

Suffice to say we will not be able to buy a house similar to the one we are renting, well at least not in the lovely area that it is in! That makes me sad and a bit scared but we will see what the next year brings - maybe we will win the lottery!


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## cleckner04

Well there's a bunch in the 40k range but I can't tell how nice the neighborhoods are without seeing them in person. They could be in the middle of a ghetto for all I know. :haha: Although they have houses for only 10k too in that city. :wacko: So I'm assuming THOSE are the ghetto houses.


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## Shiv

What city is it Cleck?


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## cleckner04

Fort Wayne, Indiana..Not a very well known city. :haha:


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## Shiv

So I just wiki'd it and it looks like a nice city, some good parks and some nice looking historical buildings! oh and lots of churches!


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## Shiv

ok so I just looked fro houses for sale and I don't understand how houses are for sale for only $6000?!?!??!!? They might be shitholes but they are still a house!

Looks like you could get a really nice house for $40000 Cleck, I am thinking of moving there myself :haha:


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## cleckner04

I know it!! :haha: Here are a few I'm eyeing atm but obviously doesn't matter because they will probably be gone before we even think about buying again.Most of these are over 40k but I put my max amount at 70k when looking. We have 10k right now that we could put down on a house and I plan on saving more each month obviously so I think by the time we actually go to purchase a house I could have at the very least 15k but probably closer to 20k for a down payment. 

https://www.realtor.com/realestatea...r_Fort-Wayne_IN_46806_M40057-34057?source=web
https://www.realtor.com/realestatea...t_Fort-Wayne_IN_46802_M31282-34131?source=web
https://www.realtor.com/realestatea..._Fort-Wayne_IN_46806_M34629-90576?source=web#
https://www.realtor.com/realestatea...e_Fort-Wayne_IN_46807_M37398-51004?source=web


DH's main thing is that he wants a garage because he loves working on cars and he wants a basement. My thing is that I want a dining room(The first house we bought didn't have one and we hated it) and I want at least a little bit of a backyard for the dogs and Emma to play in.


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## spidey

I'll join you and Shiv! Those houses are amazing for the price! I love the style of the first and last one the most. Whatever happens with Corey's job, I hope its the best for you both. It might not be such a bad thing for him to move onto another career. Of course I've been having a crazy 2 days with super duper cranky Kira and I would do ANYTHING to keep DH near me- even live in a shed :haha:


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## Shiv

that's the website I was looking at last night Cleck, and I even looked at house number 3!! i like them all and simply can't believe how much you get for your money! I am quite excited for you :happydance:


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## Shiv

Oh and Spidey, i hope Kira cheers up soon, try to remember what an angel she is when she is her normal self, she'll be like it again soon I'm sure :hugs:


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## spidey

In 2 days Kira has had 2 canines pop thru! She's been sooo moody today, but things are looking up since she's had some really good moments too. DH joked that Kira is keeping me from making her a sibling again this month due to all the bf :haha:


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## Pippin

Hey ladies read a few pages and WOW :shock: I'm coming to live with you too Cleck :haha: we can all come over and live in the same area so we can have a BnB lion cub community. My house is loads more boring than all of those and it cost us £325,000 :shock: we made £120,000 on our last ONE BED flat!!! Bought in the 80's buy my husband with his then wife for £80,000 and sold it for just over £200,000 in 2008 madness hey for such a tiny space, no drive, VERY small garden but in zone 3 (tube line close)!!!! I could be mortgage free if we came over with you so I'm sold :haha: Houses here in the UK are ridiculous as it's the land you pay for not the house. They cause endless problems as well as most have been standing for over 100 years and have to have things replaced like ours needs at the moment. Thankfully the roof is sound as that's the biggest cost here. I really want to move out of London in about 10 years time. DH can take early retirement and we can find a cottage that we can live in mortgage free or have a small mortgage anyway. I'd love the kids to have the same environment I did as a child.

Fort Wayne looks cool Cleck, they have a BBQ Rib festival...... I'm sold already!!! :haha:

Shiv have you definitely found somewhere to rent then? How exciting. When is the move date?


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## Shiv

ok so that's decided then we are all moving in with Cleck, Corey and Emma! That ok with you Cleck?

Pip - yep we have found a house to rent. Move day should be 26th May assuming we can get removal men for that date (need to getto work on that!)

Spidey - wow 2 canines in a day - no wonder Kira has been a madam!


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## Pippin

That's good Shiv :thumbup: I'm sure you'll find a man with a rather large van to move you. Exciting but sad times I guess :hug: hope you house shifts fast. 

Spider Sam has two canines come through too. Bizarrely they caused more Freud on the way up than when they poked through. Two more to go *sigh*


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## jelr

Cleck: See I knew the weight was just ov - I'm giving spidey's nips a run for their money now :haha:

Wow I can not believe the price of those house, Yup if DH doesn't get back to work and the bank take back our house - now I know where we are going to emigrate too :rofl: - Do you know our entention cost more than that - it was 60,000 (which is aorund $87, 000 or £53,000) and all it was for 40 sq metres (430 sq feet) at the side of the house. granted that did include an expensive kitchen and we also converted part of the attic into an extra bedroom and an office and we also put in a stairs and knocked out the wall between the existing kitchen and sitting room to make the sitting room bigger but still we did it at about half the price it would cost most people because Dh got the best prices around from being in the trade and friends of ours are plummers and electricians and do windows so we got that much cheaper too and DH fit the insulation himself and got that at cost and my dad did the tiling so we saved a bomb. They are really beautiful houses too for the price - I like the last one the most. :thumbup:

Shiv: I lmao at your dh and his friends landing in Ireland on good friday - there is no hope of getting a drink anywhere either. :rofl: What did they do? your move date is getting near so :hugs: as I know it will be hard and i hope it all goes smoothly.

Spidey: I love your house too, and I dont know why you were drooling over my kitchen on fb as yours is gorgeous too - Dont do the grantite tops though as they are the bain of my life cleaning them. :dohh: We also have the leap frog alphabet fidge magnets - funny how things change when you have kids - I swore nothing was going to ever be stuck to my fridge when we changed the kitchen and then I couldn't wait to get that set for Natasha :haha: - We wont need to baby proof our fridge for a long time as the suction is so strong I can barely open it sometimes :haha: Aww poor Kira I hope she is back to herself soon at least that is more teeth out of the way but it is so hard on them when they come through together and I totally understand as Natasha got all 4 of her canines in the one week and it was a hard week.

Pippin: that was a lovely profit to make on the apartment - I would say we would lose a packet if we sold this house. We paid 240, 000 but thankfully our mortgate is only for 200,000 as we both worked all the hours we could for a year and we saved 40,000 that we put into the extension, but house prices have hit rock bottom here and I reckon we would only get half if we sold now :nope: - Aww poor Sam, I hope those teeth come through quickly and they dont cause him much hassle.

MJ: I sure am glad I have never heard of leasehold - it sounds like just another tax for no good reason :dohh: Oh yeah I forgot about hot cross buns - I didn't have any until Sat this year either and that was only because my mam had one left over. yeah the meat thing must be catholic then, I knew it was for religious reasons but wasn't sure if other religions did it too. I was a total rebel this year and ate lots of meat too :haha: - I dont know why I never did really as I'm not religious, but we were always raised not too so I decided this year why am I doing this as I'm not religious and only feel like a hypocrite by abstaining :haha: - my mam though was not impressed, she actually fell out with my brother and refused to allow him to cook meat in her house :dohh: and she was not impressed that our friends were having their sons birthday party on Good Friday - I said sure why not that is the day of his birthday and it is handy as everyone is off - she not even that religious herself, she does have religious beliefs but doesn't go to mass excpet for Christmas and Easter and my grandparents anniversaries :dohh: - some people are funny about that sort of thing and i suppose she grew up in totally different times than us.

I love the furniture you are getting for Adam. I hear you on the dummies, I am dreading that one and I know I wont do it for a very long time, although I probably will get much more sleep myself once it is done, but I know it will break Natasha's heart so I'm not ready yet :nope: and will wait until she is older and will want to give them to santa or something.

Well we had a lovely few days - Natasha was at a birthday part on Friday and really enjoyed it - she loved the bouncy castle. Then on Sat I went into town and had a baby free day while DH stayed at home and I met the girls for some lunch and shopping (although all I bought was more clothes for Natasha :dohh:) and then that night we went out for dinner. Then yesterday we brought Natasha up to see DH's family and went to a kids disco for charity and she loved dancing with her cousins, she looked so grown up though. I must post a video when I get a chance on fb. They had some of the characters too like Mickey, Minnie, Goofy, Pluto, Barney and (Close your ears Cleck) Dora :haha: - I thought Natasha would love them as she just adores Minnie Mouse but she wanted to go over to them and her whole body would tighten when we got near and she wanted to go away again. One of DH's sisters brought her up to see Dora and didn't read the signs and went right up and (you will love this cleck) she slapped Dora in the face :haha: - Good job whoever was under there was shielded by the suit :dohh: - We then came home and had dinner with my family so it really was a nice weekend. My diet so went out the window though :dohh: so I'm going to start back at it tomorrow.

i'm also going to the docs tomorrow to see if he will give me a course of the vitamin B12 injections that he gave me after the 1st mmc as I still feel really run down and tired all the time and I must be run down to get that tummy bug as I'm never sick and DH or Natasha didn't get it thankfully so my system is just down. I'm also breaking out in spots and hives so hopefully this will help as I'm fed up with it now and just want to get back to normal.


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## cleckner04

Emma's canines just popped through last week! The bottom ones both came in on one day and the tops are almost through....okay just felt and they are SO close to coming through. :haha: Than we just have the 2nd molars and she's done with teeth. Thank goodness. When do they get the other molars? Not the 2nd year molars but the other four? And is it weird that I only have one wisdom tooth? Shouldn't they all be in by now? :rofl: 


You ladies are more than welcome to move in with us. :haha: I'm really interested in the city beside ft. wayne though. It's a smaller city and more 'country' I guess but the houses are a bit more expensive there so it's a tough choice when you can buy them for SO cheap in Ft. Wayne. 

Watch, I'm doing all of this research and trying to find a place and DH won't be kicked out. :haha:


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## jelr

Do you mean the 1st lot of permanent molars Cleck if so I think they dont get them until they are about 6 or so.

I'm not very wise at all as I have no wisdom teeth at all :haha: - My friend is a dental nurse and I asked her about it and she said some people's never errupt and some get them as late as 60 or 70.

Yeah what is the betting that will happen it would be typical and you would probably be really excited and looking forward to it by then. I will be raging for you as I'm all excited for you now to be with Corey and near your family. :happydance:


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## spidey

I had all my wisdom teeth ripped out before they even came in, but I think they normally take a long time to come through. 

Its funny how we're all at the canine stage now. Kira had a much better day today so maybe the worse is over.

jelr- you do have a beautiful kitchen and you only think otherwise since you have to clean it!! Mine will be upgraded one day waaaaay in the future and when we do I'll remember what you said about granite. I really want a tile back splash since right now grease drips down the wall behind the exhaust hood and is really disgusting. Oh, and thats so funny how Natasha slapped Dora! :haha: 

Wouldn't that be fun to all live on the same street! Kira would have plenty of play dates and I could have no mortgage.


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## cleckner04

I would freaking love if we all lived on the same street. Some of you would be going to work during the day so I could babysit. :winkwink: We could have block parties and all go trick or treating together for halloween. :haha:


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## spidey

If suddenly I disowned my family, I would move to Indiana on your street in a heartbeat Cleck. It would be so much fun! I wouldn't have to work since we wouldn't have a mortgage anymore. But I'll still take you up on the babysitting since I'll need a day or 2 each week to clean the house and shop :thumbup:

I'm spotting today and it's cd14, although I'm not ovulating yet since my nips are perfectly happy. I spotted before ovulating a few cycles ago too. It's strange for me because it's only happened those 2 times in my whole life. Who knows what's up with my uterus. 

I bought some finger paints and I'm feeling very brave today, so I might get them out. I can't imagine how messy this will be :haha:


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## jelr

Yep I'm the same I'm such a home bird but If I fell out with all my family and friends I would go in a shot. Imagine the fun the kids would have. I wish we had more children Natasha's age on the street as all the kids are older and the only time she gets to interact with other children is when we go and visit or get visted by family or friends with children. We could be like the women of desperate housewives sitting on the porch drinking coffee lol.

Ah no I do love my kitchen spidey, I just do hate cleaning it :haha: - Yours is just as nice though so thats why I wondered why you were drooling over mine :haha:

I hope the finger painting went well and wasn't too messy. We have done it twice and the first time she completely covered herself from head to toe - it was more like body painting than finger painting :haha:

How is the weight going now cleck? Did it go this time after Ov?

Well how are you nipples now spidey? :haha:


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## spidey

We ended up doing finger painting 2 days in a row. DH's birthday is this weekend and I wanted to make him a card with Kira's hand prints, so Kira and I made the card and I painted happy birthday on it. Then I went to hide it on top of the bookshelf, and stupid me dropped it down behind the bookshelf :dohh: I nearly cried since there is no way I can move all those books and move the shelf on my own. So we had a re-do today but this time it wasn't nearly as fun since Kira wasn't in the mood to fingerpaint :haha: Clean up wasn't so bad since I had pre-set up her kitchen helper chair, so I could wash her up at the sink easily.

Jelr- I'm with you on wanting more kids Kira's age living nearby. My street is all older couples, or newly married couples who haven't made kids yet. I really should join some mom's groups so I can find friends for Kira.

My psychic nips aren't telling me anything!


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## cleckner04

Aww that's a cute idea with handprint and happy birthday. :thumbup: That totally sucks that you dropped the first one. Sounds exactly like the kind of thing I'd do. :haha: 

jelr- Well I was gaining a pound a day doing the 30 day shred. :shock: So I quit because that's just ridiculous. And now I'm back down close to my last weigh in. I think my last weigh in was 204.4 or something like that and I'm at 205 right now. Which is good enough for me. :thumbup:



I always let Emma play out in the back yard. Like every day she is out there playing. It's completely privacy fenced in and I'm usually right there inside the back door but where I can still see her. Well that's what I was doing today and the connected neighbors were in their back yard too. Well their little girl was at the fence peeking through because she kept teasing Emma. I could hear her saying 'your just a BABY' and all this stuff. But I just ignored it and let Emma play. And in the meantime Emma was constantly in and out. She comes in for a bit, than goes back out as she pleases. Well when Emma was out I heard 'HELLO??!!! HELLO?!!' and it was the mom next door and she had a really shitty attitude when she was talking. I was like "WHAT!" and she said 'Oh well I didn't think anyone was back here. She's been out here a LONG time'. And it was with this completely note of 'bitch' in her voice when she was talking. I just said 'yeah she's in and out all the time'. WTF?! So I grabbed up all of Emma's toys and brought her in for the night. And the entire time that I was picking up toys the little girl was watching through the crack in the fence. :wacko: Freaking weirdos over there. Emma was so upset that I brought her in. Those neighbors are seriously so weird though. You hardly ever see them because if they notice someone else is out, they will rush into their house real fast instead of saying hi. If I'm out there and they go out to get in the car to leave, they seriously fasten their kids in so fast and quickly slam the doors so they don't have to talk. :wacko: One time I was getting out for my walk and they were just closing their car doors to leave and they literally waited until I was way down the road and turned a corner and just at that moment that I turned the corner, that's when they pulled out of the driveway to leave. They are like bats the rush out of the cave silently so no one sees. :rofl::rofl:


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## spidey

Your neighbors are such weirdo's! If the other mom is such a wonderful mother why would she let her daughter tease Emma through the fence?? Nut jobs!! There is no reason why Emma can't have the yard as part of her extended play area. I'm passive aggressive when it comes to things like this so I would think of something that would really annoy the mother. 

I have newish neighbors who are the same. If I go out the front door and the lady is sitting on the front step smoking, she'll dash back into her house. If I'm in the back they don't dare go out back until after we come in. Sometimes we'll go out and the guy will be grilling, and I swear he lets his food burn on the grill because he runs inside the house when he sees us and never returns to flip his burgers or whatever. They mow the grass when both our cars are gone. We always joke that the man is a serial killer/ kidnapper, and the lady who lives with him was one of his victims that now has stockholm syndrome and she's not allowed to look at or acknowledge anyone :haha: In Maryland you can go online and search for the owners of each house, so I looked them up and only the man's name is on the house. We can do free online criminal searches in my state too. He got in trouble in his late teens for possession of marijuana and some minor traffic issues. No kidnapping or murdering yet :haha:


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## Pippin

Spidey you can seriously just look up who owns what house and what criminal charges they have had!!!???? I'm shocked, like beyond shocked :shock: that would be a serious breach of privacy here we don't even have ID cards anymore as no one wanted them! Wow things really are different over there. I'd hate someone being able to see my past, not that I've done anything that exciting really :rofl: but it would be a bit creepy! Also minor charges are taken off you record after a few years here, your police really hold grudges :haha:


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## spidey

Atleast in Maryland all that is public..

here you can search for people's criminal histories including traffic violations
https://casesearch.courts.state.md.us/

I don't have a criminal history so no need to look me up :haha:

this is the website where you can look up any house and find out who owns it, how much they paid, and the previous 3 owners and how much they paid
https://sdatcert3.resiusa.org/rp_rewrite/

we also have a website that shows how much water each house uses and whether or not they paid their past water bill :haha:


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## cleckner04

I have a criminal history. :blush: But I think it dropped off since I became an adult but I was arrested for shoplifting from walmart when I was 15. :rofl::rofl:


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## spidey

LOL Cleckner- how embarrassing! Out of curiosity, what were you shoplifting?? I think you're right that your juvenile criminal record gets swiped clean when you turn 18.


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## cleckner04

I took all kinds of things. :rofl: I was only caught for a few though. Makeup mostly. But, I had like 3 bras on top of eachother under my shirt that they didn't know about and I had rings on my hands that they didn't know about. :rofl: Those cheap rings that are big and fake looking. :lol: 

It was my friend and I that were caught together and we were just full of stupid ideas. One of those secret shopper security people saw us and followed us. :dohh: We ended up with 6 months probation and 30 hours of community service. Which was spent working at our towns fire department and we washed fire trucks, had some of the firemen give us rides in the trucks, we found the P.A. System that had a microphone and had singing sessions that broadcasted across the entire building. :rofl::rofl: It was so much fun.


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## spidey

haha, sooo naughty!! I never would have pegged you for a shop lifter :rofl: So you went on a major shop lifting spree and got caught, but still managed to get away with 3 bras and some rings!?? Your punishment sounds like a dream punishment to me- forced to hang out with hot firemen and getting to play on the trucks :haha: So... did you learn your lesson and never shoplift again???


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## cleckner04

Yeah definitely learned my lesson! I mean, it was fun having the community service but it wasn't fun dealing with my parents reaction. I got the "i'm disappointed in you" talk. And now am the butt of occasional shoplifting jokes even to this day. :blush: It was nearly 10 years ago! But not easily forgotten. :haha:


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## spidey

haha, I can see you being the butt of shoplifting jokes here too- it's too funny not to :haha:

We have to try and remember all the stupid things we did as kids so we're not in for a shock when our little babies start getting into trouble!!


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## cleckner04

Yeah my dad likes to joke about me getting 'five finger discounts'. Even the night it happened when my parents picked me up from the police station(*hangs head in shame*) my dad said something about needing to get some gas on the way home and than he said "oh I have a great idea, we can just STEAL the gas". :dohh::rofl::rofl:


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## Pippin

Wow spidey wish I knew a few people to look up. Glad we don't have it here though although I've only had one ticket for driving in a bus lane so I'd be a bit boring to look up. That's madness though, you must have a lot of paranoid people in your state.

I stole a lip balm once :blush: never had the guts to do it again tough :haha:


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## spidey

Oh, it's even worse than I imagined Cleckner :haha: They actually took you to the police station!?? Did you get to ride in the back of a cop car and get handcuffed?? (I'm soooo nosey :blush:)

The only thing I ever remember stealing was one of those price sticker guns from the supermarket :haha: I really wanted to put price stickers on my play food and they didn't sell any toy price sticker guns. My Dad helped me steal it :haha: I think I must have been 8 or 9 at the time. 

Pippin- Luckily many people don't realize that criminal histories are searchable by the public, so the level of paranoia is still pretty low :haha:


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## cleckner04

My friend and I begged for him not to handcuff us. And he let me ride in the front seat of the cop car. My friend rode in the back. :haha: 

OMG your dad helped you steal it. :rofl: Too funny.


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## spidey

:rofl: you got the good end of the deal riding in the front seat. The back seat is all nasty from criminals! I still can't believe they took you to the police station instead of dealing with it right at walmart security!


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## cleckner04

Well they didn't throw us in a jail cell or anything though. We just sat in the cop's office until our parents showed up. It's so shameful. :haha: Than we had to meet with a probation officer once a month. Funnily enough, my DH had the same probation officer because he stole from walmart too a few years before I did. :rofl::rofl: The probation officer actually remembered Corey. :dohh: Seriously so many kids were caught stealing from walmart in my town. It's a town of 800 people. We got bored easily. People either get pregnant or in trouble with the law because there is nothing better to do. :haha: (The walmart is in the town that's 12 miles away, our town has one stoplight. So not exactly a booming business place.:lol:)


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## jelr

Cleck your such a rebel - I lol at you having 3 bras on they must have thought you had massive boobs :haha: - That is really silly that you were putting on a lb with doing the 30 day shred - maybe it was muscle, but I know I need to see it on the scales too to keep me motivated.

Spidey: that was a lovely idea with the handprints, I might steal that idea when it comes to DH birthday. I'm always stealing your ideas :haha:

You both have weirdo neighbours - ours are grand thank god, they keep themselves to themselves but are pleasent when we see each other outside thank god. Cleck that woman sounds like a bitch - Imagine letting your child call another an baby.

Well girls I have some good news DH will be back to work soon, I didn't want to say anything until it was all finalised but he has had loads of offers and one that we thought he was going with was from the biggest constuction company in the south east of the country but it fell through at the last minute as even though they really wanted DH they didn't want to big of a risk either and wanted him to work for commision only which DH said no way too, as he explained to them 10 years ago no problem but now when he has a wife and child and mortgage, he probably would make more money but it is too big of a gamble, so he is going with another builders who want to set up a company and he will be managing it so fingers crossed it goes well and he can spread the word and get business.

Sadly though because of that I dont know how much I will get on here to post anymore as it will be back to normality soon of us both running in the door in the evening and trying to get dinner ready and then clean up and get sorted after Natasha is in bed so that we get some time with her. but I will be reading on my phone when I get a minute and will try and get on whenever I can. I will probably see more of you all on fb as it is really easy to use that on my phone where as I usually post from the laptop in here and dont have as much time to turn it on in the evenings when we are both working.

Thanks a million for everything over the last few months as I couldn't have gotten through it without you all. xx


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## cleckner04

I'm so happy your DH got a job!! :dance::hugs: Although I'm really going to miss you being on here. I find BnB is always better for a good laugh but the FB group is more details about our LO's. Which is the way it was meant to be but you see what I mean. :haha: I hope this job of his ends up being amazing for you guys. You'll probably find that he does so much better and loves this job even more so all the stress will have been for a good reason. :thumbup: :hugs::hugs:


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## spidey

woohoo Jelr!!!!!! :happydance::happydance: I am sooo happy for you and your DH!! It must have been a nice confidence booster for him to feel wanted by so many different companies too. It will be sad not seeing you as much in here though. How far away is DH's new job?

Cleckner- I love it that you and Corey had the same probation officer. :rofl: It will be a good story to tell your grandkids one day so they know their grandparents were bad asses!

Not much new with me. Still no psychic nip predictions and I'm on cd21 now, although last month I didn't ovulate till cd22 and AF arrived cd30 so it might be happening soon.

In more exciting news, we finally finished remodeling the basement yesterday!! If you ever watch the show hoarders, that is my DH but luckily he has me to balance him out in the main living areas of the house. His basement hoard became too overwhelming for me and over the past year I haven't set foot down there :haha: Down the basement is his woodshop and general house storage (xmas, baby stuff, etc) and everything was covered in an inch of wood dust and was so packed tight that he could barely move around. So, we built a separate room that is just for DH's woodshop and the rest of the basement is for house/ food storage and will be completely regulated by me! It is soooooooooo nice :haha: I'm going to post pictures on FB when I get a chance. It's too bad I didn't take before pictures because the transformation is shocking. And now I can just shut the door to DH's woodshop and never have to see the horrors inside :haha:


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## cleckner04

I love watching hoarders. I'm the complete opposite of a hoarder. I throw stuff out ALL the time. My mom is horrified when she hears how often I donate stuff off or toss it out. :blush: Because if it doesn't get used in my house, it get tossed. I don't have knick knacks sitting around or anything like that really. I mean I decorate somewhat with stuff we buy on our vacations like a vase from the grand canyon and a wooden statue from the bahamas. But I don't have little figurines of ponies or angels like I see in a lot of houses back home. :rofl::rofl: 

That's awesome you guys have your garage cleaned out. I always feel SO good when something like that gets finished. I bet it's a huge relief! 

I'm waiting for AF still here. I have no clue what day I'm on or even when I ovulated. I did horribly at using the CBFM this month because I accidentally set it so I pee in the afternoon and I can't remember that in the middle of the day so I missed a few days. I did manage to catch the high and peak days on it though so that's good. I just don't know them off the top of my head. 



So Emma came inside to grab me yesterday and pulled me outside and around the corner to point out and airplane that was flying away. She was so upset that it was leaving so I waved and said 'bye bye airplane!!' so than she waved to it too. Than we made it into a little game and every airplane that flew over we'd wave and say bye bye to it when it was out of sight. :haha: We live near a private airport so it's always those little private planes flying over. But than I grabbed a blanket and we laid out in the back yard together watching planes go over. :cloud9: It's times like that when I really miss DH though. Cause I think he'd like doing that. But now I'm outside again because now that we did it once, Emma insists on sitting back here on the blanket. :dohh: I just hope the neighbors stay inside today. :lol:


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## spidey

I'm the opposite of a hoarder too. I throw things away so easily so its good DH has me to balance him out. He is awful at organizing things too. His idea of organizing is to lay everything out evenly spaced on a flat surface so it's impossible to dust around :haha: So I'm always going behind him and putting things back in drawers (or the trash). MIL is worse than DH and I really hurt her feelings the other day because I put Kira's easter basket from last year into the burn pile :haha: She saw it right before DH tossed it into the fire pit and was really hurt that we were getting rid of it. I guess she thinks I should save all of Kira's cheapy easter baskets each year for 18 years.. that would be over 50 easter baskets in my closet :haha: She's lucky I held on to it for as long as I did :rofl:

Cleckner, you need to get on it and figure out what cd you're at! Are you taking B vitamins this cycle? I'm curious to know if they're helping with your luteal phase.

That is so sweet that Emma was concerned about the airplane flying away and wanted to show you :cloud9: I had one of those moments with Kira yesterday.. for whatever reason I was throwing a fake temper tantrum on the floor to get DH to do something for me (I honestly cannot remember!) and Kira got on the floor and copied my tantrum and we were both laughing :haha: It was so cute :cloud9:

Shiv- do you have a date yet for your 20 week scan?

How is everyone else doing??


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## jelr

Thanks Girls I'm so delighted for him :happydance: as it has been a real confidence booster and he is so glad that he is going to be the provider again. The office is only in the town next to us so it will only take him 15mins to get there and then he will all over the south east of the country to do Estimates and the technical end of it, but that is the same as his last job. It will be quiet stressful for a while as he will need to establish the company and the one thing his old firm had going for it was that they had 30 years of experience and a good reputation, although it has been DH people would have been dealing with over the past 10 years they will not know that he has changed, so it will be a challenge as there are a lot more companies setting up due to the goverment grants that are available, but I reckon once it is up and running he will definitely enjoy it more as he will be the one running it instead of just the sales manager (he did this for about a year in the other place when his boss was out sick and loved it) and also it should be less stressful as they are only going to be a much smaller company with 2 or 3 crews on the road fitting so he only needs to find work for these where as in his old job he had 14 crews on the road and he was the only sales and technical rep and things have gotten quieter so he was under a lot of pressure for the last few years.

Aww I love moments like that with the Lo's we have had loads of lovely times over the last few weeks, and Natasha has really enjoyed having us both home, she was fairly upset today as I was back to work and Dh was out sorting stuff for new job, we left at 8.30 and she didn't wake until 10.30 and my mam said all she kept saying for the first 10 mins was mammy, daddy - and she wasn't really in the best of form this evening either and kept crying for everything which is really not like her :-( - poor baby, I wish we could all be at home all the time :cry:

Your basement sounds like my DH's shed - with everything everywhere and sawdust an inch thick, he would also be a horder, he kept every tin we got for Natasha's formula :dohh: although he did finally manage to clean it all up when he was off and I know see his reasoning as he now has all his screws and nails in them :haha:

I do have stuff around, but I'm a clean freak and everything has to have its place and should be in its place, so I guess we balance each other out that way too :haha:

I will still be in girls but just not as much - I know here is much better for the laugh, but I can't help it and end up writing mega posts :haha: so it takes ages of the night that seems sor short when I'm working :dohh: but I will be reading and I will drop in to catch up every now and again. :hugs: to you all because you all really have become good friends.


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## cleckner04

Well put me at CD1 today now. :growlmad: So it was a 9 day luteal phase if I go by the day I got cramps. 10 days if you count it by my first 'peak' reading. And I was taking low amounts of B-complex this month. So I think I'm going to raise the dose and see if it makes a difference and after that I give up. I'm almost to the point of not really caring if I get pregnant yet anyways. I'm kind of enjoying being skinnier. :haha: 


spidey- My mom gets the same way whenever I throw out anything she's purchased. In fact, the easter basket that Emma uses is MY easter basket from growing up. I only had one easter basket my whole life and now Emma has the same one. But I'll probably have to pack mine away bc it's not really fair that Emma gets mine IYKWIM and I don't want to upset any other kids that we have. So I plan on getting them personalized ones and they'll get the same basket every year. I hate those giant ones you see in the stores with random toys in them. :haha: They are usually HUGE. And not the prettiest things either. 

jelr- Aww that sucks that Natasha isn't quite herself. She must definitely know something is up. I'm sure once you guys settle into a new routine she'll be good again. Emma was a grumpy girl the first few weeks after DH left. But thankfully finally settled down. I'm more worried now that she'll be awful with him BACK. :dohh: That's so cute that she calls you mammy. Emma very rarely calls me mama. Only when she really really wants something. :haha:


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## jelr

Aww sorry to hear the vit b complex didn't do the job, but hopefully the increase will help and if not maybe see how it goes without, could it be that you always had 9 days and still got pregnant okay with Emma?

Not long now until Corey sees the new skinny you too :) I'm sure Emma will love having her daddy home, it might take her a couple of hours to size him up, but I reckon it will be like he has never been away then to her.

That is a lovely idea about the baskets for Easter, we don't do that here.

Yeah I hope Natasha settles into the routine soon, I missed her so much today and it breaks my heart that she was feeling the same way as it must be worse for her as we are her whole world ifkwim :cry:

Yeah she calls me mammy all the time, I don't understand women who say that they are sick of their name being called as they here it all day. Natasha must say mammy hundreds of times a day and it melts my heart each time  maybe when I have more than one it might be a bit much but at the moment I love it


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## cleckner04

You know, I guess I could've always had a short luteal phase and just not known it. I never knew when I ovulated before Emma. It was much simpler than. :haha: We just :sex: when we felt like it and got pregnant easily. 


I would melt too if Emma called me mama more. Emma isn't much of a talker yet though. She only has like 25 clear words that she says so I think she's a bit behind some of the other cubs in that area. It must be so hard going to work and leaving her behind. I seriously don't think I could do it. It's pretty pathetic that I've never once left Emma though. :blush: Just the thought of leaving her makes me get a lump in my throat. I don't know how I'll ever do it but I know she has to start school sometime. LOL! 




So it was navy seals from DH's ship that killed osama. :wacko: I've only just discovered this today. I had wondered why I haven't heard from DH for the past 2 days. They have shut emails completely down. :( And the burial at sea for osama happened straight from my DH's ship too. It's so surreal to think about. My husband was on the same boat as the most well known terrorist in the world. :wacko: Well, his body anyways.. So now I just worry that his ship will become a target somehow. :(


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## spidey

Cleckner that is so neat that Corey's ship has osama's body on it. I bet security on and around the ship is so high now that anyone who attempted anything would be obliterated!

Cleckner- DH has recently been taking Kira to the grocery store- just him and Kira, and I always feel on edge when they're gone. I'm sorry your luteal phase hasn't improved :growlmad: 

jelr- the job sounds really wonderful :thumbup: 15 minutes is a great commute! I am so glad everything worked out for the best. I bet Natasha will adjust quickly to her new routine. Maybe if your DH's job is really successful he will get a raise and you could afford to stop working. :thumbup:

So- my nips are telling me I'm going to ovulate soon. Yesterday they started to tingle.. and today they're sore. So I'm guessing I will ovulate tomorrow and although I declared I wasn't going to use opk's anymore, I might pee on one today for fun to see how awesome my nips are :haha: Like Cleckner, I no longer care if I get pregnant. It's been especially hard to watch so many of my friends on here have mmc and now Boothh's loss- I'm not ready to have all that worry ontop of morning sickness right now. But if I do get pregnant this cycle I'll deal with it.

I know this post is way too long already, but I need to tell you girls about my large vagina dream :haha: I went in for my pap smear and the midwife (the one who delivered Kira) put in the speculum and was staring into my eyes as he did the pap smear (creepy). Over here a male gyno or midwife cannot be alone with a female patient during internal exams, so in my dream the exam was done in the hallway! Then he walked off to his office and I went to the counter to pay. The secretary told me that I needed to book a surgery to fix my vagina since it is 100mm larger in diameter than it should be :rofl: I was trying to convert 100mm to inches and was getting really frustrated with the math. Then I asked if I could have another baby first and then have the surgery since I didn't want to undo the surgery with another 10 pound baby :haha: The rest of the dream was spent with me making formal complaints about the midwife who failed to do a breast exam and who put the responsibility on the secretary to tell me about my vagina surgery :rofl::rofl: It was the weirdest dream ever!


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## cleckner04

OMG I am in fits of giggles about your dream. :rofl::rofl: Your poor poor vagina. :rofl: At least you still have cool nipples. :haha: I hope you have a longer luteal phase this month. Fingers X'ed for you. 

I could never send DH for groceries. He would seriously come back with the most random junk food and if I gave him a list he probably wouldn't follow it. :dohh: I sent him for frozen mixed vegetables once and he came back with this bag of veggies in asian sauce. :wacko: I hate stuff with asian style sauce on it. So gross. So it sat in my freezer for months until I finally got rid of it a few months ago. That is how great DH is at shopping though. :lol: I think when DH gets back I'll let him take Emma to the park behind our house and than I can work my way up with it. It's like ripping a bandaid right? Just do it and get it over with. :haha: Whenever he's just be downstairs with her and me upstairs, I'm wondering and worrying the whole time. Wondering if she's laughing or if she's happy with him. :dohh: 


Well Osama's body isn't still on the ship because they did a burial at sea because he had to be buried within 24 hours according to muslim religion. So they performed a full muslim ceremony I guess and wrapped his body, etc. I'm just reading this from the news though because I haven't heard from DH since it happened. :wacko: It's been 3 days with no word from him. And that's the longest we've ever went without SOME kind of contact so it kinda sucks. 

But in good news, the weight is dropping off finally again. I started using myfitnesspal online again yesterday though so I'm sure that is why. I hurt my knee two days ago so I haven't been riding the exercise bike again yet but I'm walking at night again. I went nearly 2 weeks with no real work outs. That stress with DH and his job got me out of the weight loss mindset for a while but I'm back in! :lol:


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## jelr

ha ha spidey your dream is hilarious :rofl: - your poor vag - ouch :blush: - I can't wait to see if the opk is positive.

What is the betting that now that you girls have it in your head that you dont know if you want to be pregnant or not that you will be this month spidey and you will next month Cleck when Corey gets home :haha: - You will be delighted then though, keep thinking that way and see if you can jinx it to happen :haha:

Cleck that is so mad about it being your hubbies ship, will he be able to tell you if it is or will it be top secret - well obviously he will tell you, but will he be able to tell anyone else?

I reckon the same as Spidey they will be on full alert and full security so that nothing happens to the ship.

yeah DH getting such a pay rise that I can leave work would be great - oh I can dream, although even then I dont think it would be an option the economy is so bad here that we would be taking a huge chance to have only one income, DH losing his job has really thought me that, thankfully we had my wages and some savings or we would have been in huge trouble - I doubt he would get a pay rise anyway as he is on good money and we would probably manage on his wages to pay all the bills but we wouldn't have anything extra for treats for Natasha or days out ifkwim and it really has been a life saver this last while and it is nice to know we have something if this doesn't work out as it will take a good while to establish it and then we will just have to hope for the best that they get business in, it really is scary times and so many businesses are failing and closing down, most of the town now are becoming ghost towns because every second shops is closing so I shouldn't complain really as it is only 3 days and I have loads of holidays too, only another 2 months and I will be off for 7 weeks for the summer. Oh well I can just keep dreaming that we will win the lotto and neither of us will have to work. 

I do just miss Natasha so much - I actually rang about 3 times today to talk to her on the phone - sad or what :haha: - she does seem far more settled today, although she woke up every hour last night crying and was grand once I went into the room and tucked her back up, so I think she was checking that we were still there as we were gone to work when she woke the morning before as she didn't wake until 10 so my mam came over here as I hate waking her before she is ready. :sleep:

Funnily I'm not nervous at all when DH is looking after Natasha even though my mam has had 7 children and when DH is minding her I was a bit of control freak as I'm used to having my own routine :haha: and was phoning him to see what he had given her to eat and so on, but I feel better knowing she isn't missing two of us as even though my mam sees her everyday anyway, we only seem to know all her quirks and exactly what she wants and all the tricks to stop her tantrums or how she likes to be comforted if that makes sense. 

Cleck I dont think Emma is behind at her talking at all, Natasha does have a lot of words but most of them are not clear and only we can understand and Natasha would be a lot more behind Emma physically with her climbing and so on, she doesn't really climb that much. Mammy and Daddy are two of the few ones that are totally clear though which I love : ) 

ha ha so much for me not being on here as much :haha: - Id say the DH will be back properly next week and then the madness will begin :dohh:


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## spidey

I just did an opk and its a strong positive! My nips are so great! :haha: Now we just have to wait and see. 

I forgot to say earlier that Kira doesn't say mama either. If I say "say mama", she'll say "ma", but its never spontaneous. She does say "boo boo boo" and chase after me when she wants a booby :haha:

woohoo Cleckner for more weight loss! :happydance: Is it almost time for another picture update??? 

jelr- I hope Natasha sleeps okay tonight. 2 months will fly by and then you'll have a nice long break!! I'll miss your long posts in the meantime, but during your break you might have more time to post again :thumbup:

I wasn't going to tell DH my vagina dream but I couldn't keep my mouth shut and told him :blush: He had to top my dream with some sex dream of his- men! :rofl:


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## cleckner04

spidey- :rofl::rofl: You and your bionic nipples. Was your DH's sex dream at least about you? :rofl: No new weight loss pictures yet from me. I still have 2.4 lbs to lose until I get to the next '10' mark. I really need to measure myself too but I never remember at the right time of the day because I usually measure in the mornings. 

jelr- So does your mam watch Natasha all the time than? Or does N go to nursery sometimes as well? You've probably already said this but I don't remember. :blush::lol: It really is scary how so many businesses are closing down. Only the strong survive I guess. I wonder when it will ever be back to normal and when jobs will be available again for people. Sometimes I think it would be simpler if we were Amish. Do they have Amish people over in the UK? They all work the land and hunt and the women take care of the kids and house while the men plow the fields and bring home the money. :rofl::rofl: The area that I'm from has tons of Amish people. They still drive horse and buggies everywhere too. They don't use electricity or anything. :lol:


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## spidey

You and my DH could be friends Cleckner... he's always talking about wanting to be Amish :haha: 

DH's sex dream wasn't about me :growlmad: :rofl: He was taking his aunt to the brothel so she could work as a prostitute and there were strippers involved too.


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## cleckner04

Doesn't your DH have a bit of a beard too? That's already the start of being Amish! :haha: hahahaha about his dream. So not only is he not with you in it, he's with prostitutes. :haha: 

I always ask my DH if he has sex dreams but he says he never does. I think he's lying. I have sex dreams ALL the time. Like a few a week usually. I even had one last night. :rofl::rofl: It always gets worse the longer I go without :sex: So once DH gets back they will tame down a bit. None of mine are with DH. :blush: But they aren't ever anyone specific either. Just random people that I don't know.


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## spidey

haha, he did have an amish beard but once the weather got warmer he shaved it off. I'm sure he'll grow it back this winter :haha: He's part American Indian and doesn't have much body hair, so it takes him all winter to grow a straggly amish like beard 

I don't have many sex dreams, but thats all that DH has. His always end in sex or killing someone :lol: :dohh:

Its hard to believe your DH doesn't have sex dreams. He's probably a smart man and doesn't tell you about them :haha:


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## jelr

:rofl: :rofl: at your DH's dream spidey - his poor aunt :haha: - DH says he does have sex dreams but he lies and tells me they are only about me :haha: I rarely have sex dreams.

Cleck: Yes my mam watches her all the time thank god, I dont think I could cope with her going to nursery when she is so little, I would be terrified something would happen and she wouldn't be able to tell me :nope: - nope they are not for me so I'm very lucky my mam is so near and so good.

Yeah it is scary times isn't it and it seems to be all over the world - here though not even the strong are surviving partly because so many are greedy like DH's old boss and they decide to liquidate because all their debts go with the company and none of their personal stuff is touched, they just have to give up the business premises and stock and we know his old boss took most of the stock worth anything out of the place before he liquidated and it is now going to cost the state probably a couple of 100 thousand to pay redunancy to the 60 odd staff he had. Grr I get so angry when I think of it, it is no wonder our country is in receivership to Europe and the IMF now with every greedy business man doing that. :grr:

No we dont have Amish in Ireland anyway, although I have seen them on tv. I think I would be far too independant and outspoken for that life and I really like my creature comforts and electricity. Imagine no Internet :haha: - but then I guess if you grew up and didn't no any different you wouldn't miss that stuff. It would be lovely not to have to worry about work though. Still I think the lotto sounds like a better option than being Amish :haha: - Not too much though that your life would become mental - just enough to pay for the house and live comfortably without working. Spidey you will have to fine tune those nipples of yours to give me the lotto numbers :haha: It is so cool that you get the positive OPK on the very day that they hurt, I think it was a good idea to get the OPK's just to confirm how brilliant your nipps are :haha:

Forgot to say on the last post - well done on the weight loss Cleck - you must be nearly at your target :happydance:

Aww work is finished now until next Tuesday for me Thank God and we have a busy weekend, with a christening on Saturday and a confirmation on Sunday so we will be staying with DH's sister on Sat night as it about an hours drive so it will save us driving back on Saturday and back up on Sunday. I hope Natasha is in good form though as they will be long days on her out.

AF was due today so my dream of perfect 28 day cycles like I had last month are gone - aww well I'm still hopeful that it might be 30 days seeing as I'm doing low carb and not my normal long cycles.


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## jelr

ha ha I literally went to the loo straight after posting and AF is here. I really am shocked that is 2 months in a row at 28 days. I know I was hoping for it but really didn't think it would happen, maybe my body has fixed itself :haha: - because last month was a first for me unless i was on the pill so this is a miracle :happydance: 

I'm not usually as excited to see the :witch: at all - but I feel that maybe if my cycles are right the pcos is not as active (if that can even happen) and hopefully we will conceive easily when we do ttc and maybe the chances of mc are lower. I wish I had your nipples now spidey to see what my luteal is, but then on the other side I dont think I want to know as I reckon it would only stress me.


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## spidey

woohoo Jelr for a nice 28 day cycle :happydance: I hope it keeps up so TTC will be a breeze!

I think I ovulated yesterday. Cleckner, what time of the day do you ovulate? It was around 6pm and I had cramps for about 20 minutes. Of course it could have been gut cramps :lol:

Winning the lottery would be great! I need to get my nips on that- it seems my nips are super focused on ovulation at the moment, so maybe I can steer them to pick some numbers too :haha:

I'm glad my mom watches Kira too. I don't think I could leave her at daycare with strangers. I know a few girls that nanny or work at daycare centers and some of them I would never trust around my children. They can be very 2-faced- sweet and loving when the parents are around and nasty once they leave. My mom could hear other peoples phone conversations on her police scanner years ago, and one of the neighbors had an in home daycare. This woman was so jealous of the working moms with their nice clothes and cars, and one day she gave a little girl a laxative so the girl would poop in the mom's brand new sports car. My mom called child protective services and they did an investigation. Who know if she actually gave the child a laxative, or if she was making up crap to tell her friend over the phone, but its not something you should even think or say. I'm sure most daycare workers love children and are wonderful, but it only takes one bad seed.

Enjoy your busy weekend Jelr! Kira has a playdate tomorrow and I'm shopping for flowers for my garden afterwards :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

I'm down to 200 lbs even!!!!! :dance::dance::dance: I took a picture and it's not that different this time but I also measured and I've only lost 2.5 inches around my hips and no where else has changed so that's probably why the picture doesn't look much different. I don't measure my legs though and they look slightly smaller in the picture so that must be where the last 10 lbs. disappeared from. Anyways, I tried to make a collage but photobucket is acting up on me. I might try a different website to make one. I made it 3 different times on photobucket and each time I save it, it cuts off the last few pictures. :( Very frustrating and I'm not sure why it's doing it.


But, I"M BACK TO PRE-PREGNANCY WEIGHT!!!! :yipee::yipee: :haha:


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## cleckner04

Weightloss piccies!!


Spoiler
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_8253-1.jpg


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## spidey

Cleckner I can totally see those last 10 pounds you lost :thumbup::happydance::happydance: I am sooo happy for you. I can't believe how fast these last 10 pounds have dropped off. If you look at the first picture and most current picture only, it is sooo amazing! You should get a deal with subway and be the next weight loss sensation! :haha:

I am in shock right now, and no, I am not pregnant :haha:. I need to vent here otherwise I might explode. My BIL who is 22 has been dating a girl who is 17 on and off for the past year. My BIL has mild autism and mentally he is 13 and this is his first GF. She uses drugs, cheats on him all of the time, and is nothing but trouble. It is so sad because he's so in love and wants to marry her and settle down. So every 2 months this chaotic girl suddenly stops seeing my BIL and goes back with her old drug-using bf. My BIL is such a dense man and he believes whatever she tells him, but its obvious from FB that she's sleeping with her ex and using drugs again. She tells him that gas costs too much so they need to take a week apart (they live 5 minutes apart, LOL) and during the "week off" she's screwing other guys. My BIL gets so upset because she's his whole world. 

So... she's taking another "week off" right now. I noticed my BIL sulking around so I looked at her FB wall and didn't see anything. So then spy Spidey looked at her druggy ex-bf's FB and she's posting on his wall again! DH also saw her driving into the neighborhood where her druggy ex-bf lives. So DH had a talk with his brother to see what was up and his brother repeated back the bullshit excuse that the chaotic GF gave him. DH told his brother to look on FB to see for himself. Spy spidey just went to the chaotic GF's FB wall and this is what I see...

"ian & wendy,
you wanna talk shit? fine. but dont start thinkin your gonna get all up in my personal life when you dont know a goddamn thing. ill set the fuckin record straight for yall cuz im not about to have this pussy bullshit drama with you talkin shit behind my back. since neither of you have a life and creep on my pg all the time...you know how to reach me. 
peace"

:rofl::rofl: I'm 30 years old and this 17 year old is trying to pull me into her angsty world! She's not even my FB friend and neither is her druggy ex-BF, but they have their walls open. I'm going to pretend I never saw it :wacko:


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## cleckner04

OMG Is it bad that I just laughed out loud at her post towards you guys? :haha: So dramatic. I hope that's that with her and she doesn't start anything IRL though. :hugs: I can't remember ever acting like that at 17. Heck, I was married to Corey at 17 and had already moved to Virginia and we had our own apartment. :shock::rofl: I feel bad for your BIL. :( Poor guy doesn't deserve to be used like that.


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## jelr

Woo Hoo Cleck - Congratulations on pre pregnancy weight :happydance: :happydance::yipee::yipee::wohoo::wohoo: - that is brilliant you should be so proud of yourself. 

You can definitely see the difference in the last two and you are actually about half of the size you were when you look at the first and last.

How many weeks until Corey is home? What was your overall goal again? I bet you can do the second goal too before he gets home :thumbup:

Have you heard from him yet?

Spidey: eeek, she sounds like a little drama queen:wacko: why would she make a big public deal out of it, but then again it is probably party her age :brat: - I think you are right just ignore it because she is only looking for a reaction and to know that she got to you, so pretend you haven't seen it at all and dont mention it to your BIL or he will let her know that you did. I hate to see people being made idiots out of by horrible people like that, I really hope he sees sense and gets away from her.

That is my biggest fear about childcare, I would starve myself and not go to work if I had the worry leaving Natasha in that kind of care. I also have heard horror stories about places here too, one girl I know had her child in daycare and the child came home with a bruise and had she had been told that that he fell but the following week one of the girls was leaving the place because she had a row with the boss and turned around and told the girl that I know by the way the reason the baby had a bruise was because she dropped him off the changing mat last week. I know this was an accident and accidents happen, but they way she lied was wrong. Another story I heard was the children go into a room to have their naps on the floor (which for the start I dont like) and later when a parent came to collect her son, he couldn't be found and eventually they found him locked out in the sleeping room, the had left the poor child there all day. So I'm so glad I have my mam to mind Natasha and my mam dotes on her and Natasha loves being over there with all my brothers, she gets way more attention than when she is at home as 3 of my brothers still live at home and the idolize her too :thumbup: so its all good.

Had a lovely day off today and Natasha was back to herself, which made me feel more guilty :dohh: because I really think it is because we are back to work and she is missing us. DH keeps giving out to me and saying that he doesn't understand why I feel guilty as it is not like I'm off pampering myself for 3 days or working because I want to that I'm working because I have to, but I just think it is a mammy thing. The men feel like they are doing right by the kids by working because they feel they are the bread winners but I think us women feel we should be with our children ifkwim - or maybe that is just me :dohh:

Anyway I guess I just have to enjoy every minute I am with her.

Hope you all have a good weekend girls?

Shiv: Your very quiet, hope all is okay? or is she away, I know she had something on her status about doing shopping for a trip away last week so that is probably it :winkwink:


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## spidey

Thanks for listening to my rant- I felt better after I typed it :lol: I'm not worried this girl will do anything in real life. I have security camera's all around my house (paranoid, huh?? :lol:) and she's too much of a wuss to start anything. My family has a reputation for taking revenge out on people so if she messes with me she'll be sorry :haha: I hope my BIL breaks up with her for good because he deserves more than her. He might be really slow academically, but he has a really good heart.

jelr- it sounds like Natasha has it made at your mam's house with all the adults ready to give her attention! I understand you feeling guilty because I'm the same way. For me, my biggest feeling of guilt comes from sometimes enjoying being at work and having a little time away. I do miss her terribly, but having a short break and being able to eat lunch slowly can be nice too. :haha: My mom sends me email updates nearly every hour and on some days if they're busy I'll obsessively click the "get mail" button because I miss her so much and want to hear an update.

Cleckner- thinking back to when I was 17, I was dating my future husband and working my butt off to get good grades. I hung out with the nerdy crowd so the drama level was very low :haha: Thats impressive you were already living on your own and married at 17 :thumbup: 

Shiv, where are you!?? I want to know when your next scan is... 20 weeks should be fast approaching :happydance:


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## Shiv

Hello lovely ladies! I have been on holiday for a week so haven't been able to get on. I have read back through and will do my best to remember what you've been all up to...............

SO Cleck is a kleptomaniac, and so is Spidey's dad :haha:

Cleck - so well done on your weightloss, that is brilliant! I can see the difference between the last 2 pictures, your whole torso is much more defined. SO what is your next mini target and by when?

Jelr - I am SO happy that Jim is sorted with work now, and it sounds like once everything is set up he will really enjoy it. Must be such a weight off of your mind :hugs: How is your weightloss going now? 

Also glad your periods are really regular, always good to know when you can expect the witch to show her face!

Spidey - I feel really bad for your BiL, she sounds like a complete train wreck and someone he could do without having in his life, I hope he has the strength to sitch her soon. he fb message made me laugh as well - psycho!


hmmmm what else - SEX DREAMS! Spidey, your DH's dream sounds a bit dodge, I can't believe he was pimping his Aunt out :haha: Since I have been preggers I have been having fairly regular sex dreams where I actually get the big O in my sleep! Always about random men who I don't know, usually faceless ot be honest:haha:

Childcare - I have only ever left Sophia with my parents or David's mum. I would be very nervous about using a nursery but realise that really at some point I am going to have to let someone else watch Sophia as I have no intention of home schooling her :haha: I think I am going to ease myself in to it, by when we move house, I am goingto find a gym with a creche, and I am going ot force myself to leave Sophia there for an hour while i go for a swim. I figure it will be good for her to get used to being looked after by other people otherwise school is gonna be a BIG shock - I am scared as hell about it though and there is every chance i won't go through with it :haha:

Well i just got back this afternoon from a weeks holiday up in a cottage in Yorkshire. It was great. We went with 2 of my friends from university (as we were going to visit a fellow uni friend who has just had her first baby while we were up there) so it was me, David, Sophia and my 2 friends. We had this gorgeous cottage on a farm with an indoor pool, a play park with swings, slides and a trampoline, a duck pond etc. Sophia LOVES my friends, she spent the whole week playing with them (which gave me and David such a break). Her new favourite game is hide and seek! I nearly cried when we all came home today as i won't see them for a while and Sophia is going to really miss them. She spent the 5 hour journey home saying "Sophie, Anna" over and over again. While we were away she started speaking in proper sentances (5 words at a time :shock:) she would say stuff like "I want a snack please" or " want to go on slide". It was amazing she just came out with this stuff, we were all sat there gobsmacked. She also was sat at dinner and there were lots of spot lights on the ceiling, she looked up and said "lots of lights" then proceeded to count to 10! faultlessly! Now we have never really tried to teach her to count, we might count steps as we walk up them or the like, so this was a real shocker. I am sure she doesn't actually know that she is counting, more that she has memorised the pattern of words. Also (sorry I know i am bragging (bad mummy) but I am seriously stunned at how quickly this has happened) we were all sat around after dinner one night and Sophia started kind of humming to herself (she likes us to sing to her but she doesn't usually do it herself) and it was quite clear she was humming twinkle twinkle little star. Anyway, we were all like aw that's cute, then she just started singing "like a diamond in the sky". Seriously crazy! SO beware girls, before you know it your LO's will be reciting shakespeare!

We saw my friend and her 4 week old little boy. I was giving him a cuddle and Sophia freaked out a bit. She hadn't paid me the slightest bit of attention all day as she was having too much fun with Sophie and Anna, anyway, I was holding the baby and she came over and was saying, "mummy up" and trying to get me to pull her onto my lap where the baby was, and she getting upset. I didn't give the baby to anyone else because I think Sophia needed to see that sometimes I might need to look after someelse - but she was not happy!

Anyway, I'll put some piccies on facebook of our trip!

Oh and my 20 week scan is on Wednesday! I have definite bumpage now, although that could be to do with the approx 5000 claories I haev been eating a day since I was on holiday :dohh:


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## Shiv

Oh no - I killed the thread with my bragging :blush:


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## cleckner04

:rofl: You didn't kill it! I haven't been on much this weekend. Trying to be lazy and not clean but after not cleaning yesterday, I felt like crap this morning when I saw the house so I've been cleaning today. :blush: And my puppy left me a giant mother's day present in Emma's room today. :growlmad: He took the biggest shit in the world up there. I don't know what the hell is wrong with him. He's NEVER had a poo accident before. Even as a teeny puppy. So I'm not happy to say the least. I'm thinking a rug doctor is in my future once DH gets back. :haha: These carpets need scrubbed. I can't believe I don't own a rug doctor by now. :lol: 


Shiv- I'm glad you had fun on your vacation!! And that's so amazing about Sophia bursting out with full sentences!! I keep hearing that will happen at any moment now. I can't wait till Emma does that! The longest sentence she says atm is "There it is" while pointing to whatever she's looking for. :haha: 


I weighed myself this morning and it's the first time since 2008 that I've seen a 1 in front of my weight. OMG!!! :haha: :dance::dance: It said 198.8. I tried to get a picture so I could send it to DH but stupid me, my camera weighs over a lb. so it put my weight up to 200.2. :rofl::rofl: I'll have to lose another pound or two before I can get a picture of the 1. :haha:


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## Shiv

Cleck - could you not gently hold on to something (windowsill etc) so that the weight on teh scales drops to what you really weigh even when you are holding the camera? Did that make any sense!

Happy Mothers Day Cleck and Spidey - I hope you have had nice days (apart from the dog poo incident Cleck - is he unwell?)

I am organising our leaving night out for before we move. we are inviting frineds to go out for dinner and then to the casino. The casino was just about the only thing I could think of that I would enjoy sober whilst everyone else gets drunk! But now I want to buy a new outfit so that i actually feel marginally attractive and not like a heffalump. What do you think of this? It is ridiculously expensive but i am hoping that means it will be amazing!

https://www.tiffanyrose.com/maternity/clothing/GRB.html


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## jelr

ha ha Shiv - you are quite entitled to brag, that is fantastic and I know from your videos she is really clear with her talking too. Natasha has loads of words, but most of them are not clear and only myself and DH can understand them. :haha:

She is however say her first proper sentance today and it is a classic for her baby book and an embarassing story :haha: - up until now she has put 3 words together but it has been things like teddy, tasha toes which is that she wants her teddy duvet to cover up her toes. but tonight she said it all in context and it was Daddy give me money, except it actually sounded like Daddy gimme money :haha: - what she actually wanted were the chocolate coins that she got for Easter, but I will have to omit that when I'm embarrassing her later in life :rofl: :haha:

Natasha also counts to ten, but most of the time she does forget one of the numbers, you might be surprised how much she does understand Shiv and that it may not just be a pattern that she has learned as that is what I presumed when Natasha started saying it but the other day, she was doing it and actually counting her pieces of apple and today really shocked me as we were in DH's sisters house and she started counting and was pointing to something on a book that she has never seen before and when I looked there were actual numbers on it, she wasn't pointing to the right ones or anything but I was shocked that she actually knew they were numbers. I think she must have learned it from watching Mickey Mouse Clubhouse as they often have numbers on it.

They really are coming on in leaps and bounds, that is so cute that Sophia sang "like a diamond in the sky" and very clever. Natasha tries to sing along with me singing "Somewhere over the rainbow" but it sounds more like "o aim bow" than "over the rainbow" :haha:

It sounds like you had a lovely holiday which you totally deserve after all the stress you have had and now with a big move to face. : )

Spidey: I'm like that when I'm off and actually get an afternoon to go shopping or have a massage. I feel so guilty for enjoying the time to myself. But with work I dont tend to enjoy the time to myself as I'm always mad on the go as really I have the same work load as I had before I had Natasha except now it is shoved into 3 days instead of 4-5 because my work is flexible as in I can do it in whatever time I want or whenever I want once the work is done and the groups I co-ordinate are all looked after and organised, but I have chosen to only work the 3 days since she was born so as I'm not away from her as much, but unfortunately because of it I dont even have time to get lunch and do end up under more pressure:nope: - Aww well as I said before we were really lucky to have my income when DH was out and it has been good to keep my mind busy after the mc.

Cleck: that is mad that you were married and all at 17, I bet you were really mature then too. I was quiet mature and settled myself at 17. Up until then I was a rip and fought a lot with my parents, mainly because they were so strict and because of my dads drinking. but then I moved out at 16 and it really did quieten me down and mature me, but that was because I had to work in a crappy burger place to keep myself fed and my rent paid and I didn't get to go out with my friends that much because I was either working or too broke or tired to move out. Although when I say I was mature, I think I thought I was because I did make the stupid mistake to even move out on my own and to leave school early and because of it I spent my early to mid twenties studying again, instead of again enjoying like most of my friends. But then again I'm glad for it all now and it has shaped my life so much. I definitely would never have spoken to anybody like that girl did to you spidey, but then if she is into drugs and all, she probably doesn't even know what she is at most of the time. - It really is so sad for your poor BIL : (

Well not much news here, we had a lovely weekend with all the family events and Natasha had a ball playing with her cousins again.

Although I did have a bit of a moment. :cry: DH's niece (his is from a large family and has sisters much older than him who have grown up children) announced she is expecting again. I had to slap a smile on and give my congratulations and just get out because I really thought I was going to cry. Dont get me wrong, I am so so happy for her but her eldest daughter is now 3 and Natasha and her get on so well. it would have been lovely if we hadn't of lost the baby for these two to grow up also. She is due the 3rd Dec and I would have been due the 3rd Oct so there would have been only 2 months between them. DH really felt it too as his face dropped and he followed me outside and looked like he could cry too. I was talking to her mam (DH's sister) that night and the poor girl didn't know how she was going to tell us after the mc and that made me feel worse because she shouldn't feel bad just because she is pregnant and I'm not. But I just have to keep telling myself that everything happens for a reason and I just can't see the reason for it yet. :cry:


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## jelr

Sorry girls my post was so massive you both managed to get one in before I finished it :haha: 

Oh Cleck, poor you having to clean up that mess - I would also be mad as hell :wacko:

Yay for the weightloss record :happydance: - you are doing so well.

Shiv: That dress is fairly sore on the pocket alright :haha: but it is absolutely stunning and usually the more expensive the nicer the cut - feck it go for it because you really want to feel good and enjoy that night. :thumbup:

My weightloss is not going to bad - I was down 6lbs algether on Friday but I have broken it all weekend so Id say I will be back up. I would do fine if I just stuck to it, but I keep breaking it at least once a week :dohh: - so I'm hoping to go back at it tomorrow and keep at it without breaking it at all for the next two weeks and then we have a girly night out for dinner with my friend so I would be really happy if I could lose another 4lb by then and then I would only have a half stone to go. (thats assuming I haven't put anything on, which I'm sure I have)


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## Shiv

aw jelr, you never know if you start ttc again after your appt with specialist in June then there could still only be a few months between your baby and Jim's neice's baby :hugs:


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## Shiv

I ate so much crap on holidya that i put 4lbs on in a week - fairly impressive going :haha: I just ordered myself a pregnancy workout DVD to try to stop myself turning into a blimp again!

jelr - well done on your 10lbs that is ace, and I am sure one day off a week won't do too much damage!


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## jelr

Yeah actually thats what Dh and myself were actually saying the two girls are so close now and there is over a year between them, so hopefully we will have a LO by next year so it will be the same. I think it was just the shock when she announced and then realising the dates were exactly 2 months apart :cry:

I wish I had 10lbs gone - If I lose another 4 over the next 2 weeks it will be 10 but it is only 6 so far, but hey that is nearly a half a stone right - even though it has taken me about 6 weeks I have stopped and started so much :dohh:

You were never a blimp and dont put yourself under too much pressure because you lost it all very quickly after Sophia so you will lose anything you put up this time too. My motto is when you are abstaining from drinking on holidays you must have nice food and loads of it :haha: so you did right.


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## jelr

Happy mothers day Spidy and Cleck :happydance:


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## spidey

LOL Shiv, I've been super busy this weekend too. You're bragging didn't drive me away :rofl:

talking- I love how Sophia says real sentences now. That is so amazing and it must be really fun hearing what she has to say. My friends daughter is also very advanced in her language and she gets into real arguments with her mother now :lol: It leaves me feeling a little sad because I know Kira must have so much to say but she can't tell me. Congrats to Natasha too for having her first real sentence :thumbup: I have a feeling Kira will need speech therapy one day. She still cannot mock sounds properly- she only repeats back pa, pe, ba, or be for almost anything I ask her to say. I needed speech therapy as a kid and didn't talk until I was almost 5 and from what I've read, language development has a large genetic component. Kira has been really slow in all her milestones (except for having a dry diaper in the morning- she's a super advanced pee holder!), so I'm not surprised she's slow on talking too... she likes to drive her mommy crazy with worry :haha:

Shiv- I'm glad you had a great time on your vacation. I hope your post- vacation depression isn't too bad. I love that dress- you should spoil yourself and buy it!

Cleckner- congrats on seeing a 1 on the scale :happydance: Too bad Emma isn't a little older and then she could take the picture for you :lol:

jelr- Things have a way of working out, so whenever your next baby comes I'm certain it will be the perfect spacing :hugs: 

My weekend was fun. We didn't do anything special for mother's day, but about a week ago DH snuck all my recipe cards to the office supply store and had them laminated for me. Then he snuck them back into my recipe box and I was surprised by nicely laminated cards that evening when I cooked dinner. It was such a thoughtful gift because I love my recipe cards- and now I can spill things all over them and it doesn't matter :haha:


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## cleckner04

I've seen a few of the cubs are potty trained already too and that makes me kinda :shock: and think I'm doing something wrong by not caring if Emma potty trains yet. :blush: I'm not bothered by it. I thought you weren't supposed to start potty training until 2-3 years old. 

Spidey- Emma's not too chatty either. I mean she has been coming out with a lot more words lately but she certainly isn't speaking in long winded sentences. I mean she DOES, but in baby babble sentences that make no sense. :rofl: I think hers is more because she's not around other people or kids at all. I mean, I talk to her but probably not as much as most kids hear IYKWIM. Because they usually have both parents there so they hear them communicate. Where with us, it's just me and I don't say a whole lot throughout the day. Which makes me feel bad because I could be the reason she's 'behind'.


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## spidey

I'm not going to start potty training till this summer- perhaps right around her birthday. But if it doesn't work out then I'll wait a couple of months and try again. I think if I wanted to make Kira sound advanced, I could say I'm potty training her right now since a few times I've stuck her over the toilet in midstream or mid poo :lol: But to me that doesn't count. I only did it to spare the rug in my bathroom from even more damage. :haha: 

Cleckner- me and DH blab ALL day and I have a tendency to talk to myself, so that's certainly not the issue with Kira :haha:


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## jelr

Girls I wouldn't think any of the LO's are behind - they are just all doing things in their own time. So I wouldn't worry, I do understand that is easier said than done though because Natasha was one of the last to do all the other bits like sitting, rolling, standing, crawling and walking and I did worry at the time but then she seemed to catch up with all that stuff and It made me realise even though they can be months behind to do things, they all catch up with one another and sometimes I think when I write stuff it makes it sound like Natasha is more advanced than she is because I say what she has said in the words I know she means but most of the time it sounds nothing like that. She says a lot of things that even my family dont know what she is saying and only myself and DH know as we hear her saying the words so often ifkwim. For example I said a few weeks ago about her wanting her toes covered and you thought she had said that spidey - where as then I had to explain that all she actually said was teddy toe toes for teddy to cover her toes :haha: - I just sometimes dont know how to spell what she says :haha:

Re: Potty training: I'm thinking of maybe trying during the summer, but I'm still in two minds - Like you Cleck I didn't think it was done until they were 2 and was gonna wait until then and then when I was pregnant loads of people said to me, you would be better off potty training her now before the baby comes along so you dont have 2 sets of nappies, and it made me think more about it. I do think I'm going to go the road of just letting her go bare bottomed and I think I would like to do that in the summer when it is warmer, although our house is always really warm. I always feel much colder in the winter and it does get so cold and wet and miserable in winter in Ireland so I just have it in my head that even though the temperature of the house doesn't change much as the heat is on, that she would be freezing with her bum out :haha: so I think I might just try and see if she is ready and if not wait until next Easter when it starts to get warm again.

I really dont know if she is ready though as her nappy is always completely sodden in the mornings and she doesn't have a specific poo time and is quite happy to go around with a dirty nappy if we didn't smell it, she would never tell us and even when you do cop she is doing a poo and say "are you pooing - do you want your nappy changed" she will say noooo because she doesn't want to be changed. On the other hand - I have the potty in the bathroom since Christmas and she will sit on it when I'm sitting on the loo and even pretends to wipe :haha: - Ack it is hard to know, :shrug: but I really want to do it when I'm off work as I really am a control freak when it comes to things like that and want to be the one doing all her firsts with her myself (and DH) instead of when she is over in my mams, but then I see her little cousin who is 3 and they have to keep asking her every couple of minutes does she need to do a wee and I think it might be easier changing a nappy than trying to remember to check if she wants to go and deal with a load of accidents. I'm so lazy aren't I :haha:


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## spidey

Kira's been slow in almost everything like Natasha- rolling, crawling, sitting up, walking, etc. And now talking too :lol: But she's really good at puzzles and complicated shape sorters :thumbup: And she's also super cuddly and has a very sweet disposition. :cloud9: I don't think I posted about it, but at the birthday party we went to a few weeks ago, Kira was sitting in my lap as she played with toys. She insists on sitting on someone's lap as she plays or eats. Another lady at the party started trying to get her daughter to sit on her lap too, but her daughter wanted nothing to do with it :haha: The mom kept pulling her daughter towards her and saying "you're being sooo cuddly today" and the girl kept pushing herself away to go play by herself :rofl: Sometimes I would get annoyed having Kira sitting on me all the time, but since that party I've been enjoying every minute since I realize it's not typical for kids her age. (did I brag enough??, LOL)

My nips aren't hurting anymore so I think no bfp this month. If my luteal phase is short again, I expect AF in the next few days. If it's longer, then early next week. I'm feeling very "whatever" about getting pregnant right now. I need to get out my Diva cup and see if I can get it up there further this cycle :haha:


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## jelr

You definitely should brag and do enjoy every minute of it. Natasha was never a cuddly baby and still isn't. From the time she was 2 months old, if she was tired she just wanted to be put down and left alone and not handled or cuddled at all or she would just cry and squirm in your arms. She does give us cuddles, but it is more like a hug rather than cuddling into us now, but she would be exactly like that other baby and would prefer to be out being nosey rather than on my knee. :haha: The only time she really sits quiet on my knee and just cuddles in is when she is watching tv just before bed when she is tired, I used to think it was the tv and put it on during the day if I felt like a cuddle but that didn't work either and she just wanted to stand or sit on the floor :dohh: - So I would so love those cuddles. :cloud9: because it does make me really sad that she doesn't want to cuddle sometimes :cry:

Natasha can do shape sorters but only the very basic ones like the circle and square. We have one that has 10 different shapes and she tries to do it but gets annoyed when she can't, I reckon if she stuck at it long enough she might get them in the right ones, but she has no patience at all :haha:

I used to worry when Natasha was not doing the same as the other Lioin cubs, but now that she can, she can walk and roll just the same I would imagine, mind you she is still not good with climbing (thank god or I would probably have a heart attack :haha:) and I'm sure once Kira starts talking there will be no stopping her. I think she is just laid back. I reckon she has the right idea, she will be doing all these things for the rest of her life so what is the hurry :thumbsup:

You probably will get pregnant now that you are feeling whatever about it. I sometimes think when you forget about it and are not really thinking about it is when it happens.

Ouch for getting the diva cup up further :blush: - that sounds painful :haha:


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## cleckner04

Emma is cuddly too. Emma and Kira seem very similar with a lot of things. Emma LOVES puzzles too. I only have two of them for her so I want to buy her more. Off topic a bit- but do you have a rack that fits the puzzles on it? I want to get her those melissa and doug chunky puzzles but all the reviews I've read about the racks say the chunky puzzles don't fit on them. :( 

Anyways..:lol: I got off track a bit there. But when I had those playdates with the 3 girls that turned nasty on me, their kids didn't want to cuddle either but Emma would always come back to me to get hugs before running off again. And when I told the girls about Emma and I sitting and cuddling they said their little ones don't do that. I wonder if it's a breastfeeding thing. :shrug: Well, an extended breastfeeding thing since we are still doing it at this 'advanced' age. :haha:


I'm feeling pretty whatever about getting pregnant too. I just found a house back home that I freaking LOVE. It's 95k dollars but it's in DH's old town so literally within 15 minutes of everyone back home. I really really want it. But we don't even know if DH is gonna lose his job yet and by the time we know, it'll probably be sold. :lol: I shouldn't have even looked because now I can't get it out of my head. It's exactly what we want though. But the thought of finding a new house and losing weight has taken my mind completely away from having another kid. It doesn't help that my luteal phase hasn't fixed itself so I pretty much know it's not happening yet for me anyways. 


jelr- When are you guys gonna start trying again? I think I remember you saying december this year but I can't be sure. :haha:


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## spidey

I have alot of Melissa and Doug puzzles but no puzzle rack to test them on. I keep them in a stack on the lowest shelf of my cube organizer. I usually pull them all out and lay them across the floor and Kira will play with a few. I love the Melissa and Doug puzzles. If you have a Michael's or AC Moore craft store, they often run sales that give 50% off Melissa and Doug puzzles (or buy 1 get 1 free) and both stores have great coupons for 15 or 20% your whole purchase if you watch their websites.

Cleckner- you are going to jinx it and Corey won't lose his job :haha: Any pictures of your dream house for nosey me to snoop at? :blush: 

I wonder if Emma and Kira are extended breast feeders because they tend to be more cuddly, or if we made them that way with our boobies? :lol: I never intended to feed Kira this long- I've been doing whatever she wants since a few weeks after she was born. 

jelr- Kira isn't a climber yet either (thank god!) LOL! I'm sure in time they'll be climbing, but that milestone can wait. You're exactly right though- there's no hurry for them to walk, talk, etc. I took my sweet time talking as a child and there's nothing stopping me now :haha:


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## cleckner04

Okay, the house I want is under construction so the pictures reflect that a bit. They completely redid the interior. Which is pretty much why it's my dream house because I don't want to have to do any work on whatever house we buy next. :lol: I saved the piccies so I could email them to DH so I just gotta upload them to photobucket and than I'll post.


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## cleckner04

Okay, I got distracted and was talking to my dad on the phone. :haha: 


Living Room
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-05-09at90735PM.png
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-05-09at90716PM.png

Dining Room
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-05-09at90739PM.png

Kitchen
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-05-09at90711PM.png

Bathroom
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-05-09at90748PM.png
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-05-09at90754PM.png

And my favorite part of the entire house. The basement
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-05-09at90804PM.png
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-05-09at90808PM.png
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-05-09at90812PM.png
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-05-09at90820PM.png
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-05-09at90828PM.png


And there is 3 bedrooms but no pictures online. I assume they are just standard looking bedrooms though. :haha: It's only got the 1 bath which DH hates but they said it's ready for a full bath in the basement so I figure that's a project we could do a few years down the road. I totally want this house. I don't have any pictures of the outside that is actually finished because they redid the outside as well. It's just a standard ranch style house though with a one car garage.


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## spidey

I love the basement too. You could turn that into a play room and have a sitting area with tv :thumbup: The kitchen floor tile is very pretty and the large window in the kitchen is really nice. The center island in the kitchen is a strange height- kind of tall isn't it? 1 bathroom isn't good if you're use to 2, but I grew up with just one and never thought twice about it. I use to pee outside behind the shed or in the drainage tub for the washing machine down the basement if I had an emergency :rofl: 

Fingers crossed that it's not sold by the time you need to buy!


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## cleckner04

I'm curious about that island in the kitchen too. It doesn't even match the rest of the kitchen. The wood is darker. But it's in the middle of being constructed in these pictures so maybe they stained the rest to match. Either way, I could do without the island. :haha: 

This isn't like my DREAM house but for our price range, this is exactly what we want if that makes sense. I mean, if we could afford it I'd want a move opened floor plan but this is an old house so not made the same way they make them now. But this house is probably sturdier than any new house we could buy. They don't make em like they used to.


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## jelr

It is lovely Cleck, I love the way the 3 rooms join on to one another and it looks really airy and bright and to have loads of light. That is the one thing I dont like about our house, we have a little hallway between the kitchen and sitting room so I have to move Natasha into the room i am in as if not I cant see or hear her from the other room. That island is weird - isn't it and it is funny that the took all the picures while it was being renovated instead of at least moving the ladders and tools :haha: it really is a fab house for the price :thumbup:

Do all houses in the US have basements? We dont have them here - do you have attics?

Spidey: I'm in total agreement, climbing is the one milestone that can definitely wait :haha: How are your nips now, still nothing??

Regarding TTC, the jury is still out on when, but no it will definitely be before December, I have my gyne (obgyn in the US) appointment on the 13th of June to see if there is anything we can do to prevent another mc so we are waiting to see what they say. I am thinking we might wait until July now as my cousin is getting married on the 15th July and we are really close and Natasha is the flower girl and all the family will be there, so it would be nice to have a couple of drinks that night when Natasha goes to bed (my brother doesn't want to go to the after part so has decided he is babysitting) and it is up the county so it will a little mini holiday for us and the only one we will get this year as our savings are just about gone and DH is not back to work properly yet. I also still need to give up the cigs and I really would like to be off them before I get pregnant so as I'm not craving them the whole way through and just waiting to get to the end of the pregnancy to smoke again. I want to kick it for good this time and feel I need to do it before I get pregnant rather than stressing myself even more by giving up when I am pregnant. I had planned on taking those chamix tablets but they are really expensive (even more than cigs lol) and again we are really watching money at this stage and I just haven't felt after the mc and then DH losing his job and now worry about money and adjusting to getting back to work. But then I dont know if I will ever feel ready and will just have to do it :haha: - So the next step is to go to the appointment and see what they say and make the decision then exactly when we are going to but it will definitely be in the next few months.

Af is a bit strange this time, it has been really light since the mmc and I put that down to the lining of my womb having to thicken up again, but both times it only lasted 4 days so this time it was all gone by Monday and then I got up this morning and the bitch was back, was only heavy for about an hour and it is only spotting now - strange!!


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## spidey

haha Cleckner, I didn't notice the darker wood too. It looks like they tiled underneath that island, so you can remove it once you move in :haha:

Since I'm not well traveled, I can only speak for the houses in the middle of the east coast, but most of them have basements, and every house has an attic. The only reason not to have a basement is if the house is very close to water, or if the builder was really cheap and trying to save some money on excavation costs.

Jelr- In the mornings I will sometimes get heavier flow and then by the end of the day AF will lighten again. My theory is that I continue to bleed all night, but since I'm laying down it pools up more so more comes out in the morning. haha, but I could be wrong! Maybe once you start TTC, me and Cleck will have longer luteal phases and we can all be pregnant together :thumbup:

My nips are telling me nothing. I'm having some early pregnancy symptoms like exhaustion, insomnia and bloating, but I've been getting that for the last few cycles right before AF comes. So I'm predicting AF will arrive in the next couple of days.


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## Shiv

Weigh in day tomorrow cleck! I predict 195lbs! i love that house, but I am sure that *if* corey leaves the Navy then there will be other lovely houses out there even if that one gets sold.

Hi Spidey and jelr


jelr - my mum uses Champix, can you get it on prescription over there as that i show she gets it?


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## spidey

DH and Kira are off getting me a milk shake :happydance: I've had a really sore throat since yesterday so I'm waiting for it to go away or turn into something worse.

Does anyone have good plans for the weekend? We'll probably work in the garden and go to the park.


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## cleckner04

Oh no Shiv, there's no way I lost that much this week. :haha: I'm glad you have such confidence in me though. :D I started back on my exercise bike this week, but I didn't use myfitnesspal and I didn't take my walks so it kind of evens out I think. :blush: We'll see in the morning. It's almost midnight here now and I really should be trying to sleep but I can't help myself, I have to get my BnB fixes when I can. 

So I was just looking in the postpartum section on here. I'm an idiot and I do it every time but when threads about 'post pregnancy bellies' show up every so often I always end up browsing through and it's never "normal" women posting in there. It's always ones that are super slim and have no stretchmarks and their bellies look perfect after. So now I feel like shit. :dohh: It doesn't help that they are like 'oh my belly got so destroyed, I'm so ugly' and than they post pictures of this perfect flat belly with like one stretchmark on it. And these are girls with 1 month old babies and they are saying 'oh I still have 5 lbs to lose..boo hoo poor me'. :gun: I wish I could avoid those types of threads but I seriously can't control myself sometimes. :rofl: 


spidey- well my plans involve me playing with Emma and I might go out and get the mail and I possibly might sit on the couch and watch tv. :rofl::rofl: I never have plans without DH. It's the sad life of a lonely housewife with no friends. :haha: And omg a milkshake sounds so good.I haven't had sweets in months. Not even chocolate. :shock: I just know that once I have one bite of something sweet I'm going to go nuts and binge on it. I seriously could sit and eat half a pie if given the chance. :lol:(Pie is my weakness. Cherry, pumpkin, apple, ALL pie is gooooooooddddd :lol:)


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## spidey

LOL Cleckner, I found the thread you're talking about :rofl: Where did all those women come from??? :lol: There's a website called "the shape of a mother" (I think) that has more realistic pictures. Do you ever watch the show "Top Chef"? The host is/was a super model named Padma who was pregnant one season. Then in the next season she was wearing a skimpy bikini in one episode and looked like she never even had a baby :shock: They did a long close up shot of her in the bikini which pissed me off since it's a show about cooking, not about Padma in a bikini. Way to go Padma for making every mother out there feel like shit :rofl:

I have an awful sweet tooth and I'm badly addicted to chocolate and sugar. I'm dreading having to cut out the sweets when I get pregnant. After Kira was born there was talk that I had undiagnosed GD, so they might automatically put me on a low sugar/carb diet for the next one.

Do you have any bounce zones, or similar places where you live Cleckner? I haven't been to one yet but they sound like fun.


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## cleckner04

I'm not sure if we have any around here. There was a place back in virginia that was full of bounce houses and I always wanted to go but didn't have a kid yet. :rofl: There is a place called playtown here and it has all sorts of toddler appropriate things and they have a bounce house inside it with a slide but only one. They also have those tube things that you see in chuckie cheese. It's fun to go up there and play. :haha: This place is for ages 5 and under and theres even a soft fenced in type of area for non-walkers. . It's really neat. Emma was kind of unsure about the bounce house bit of it though so I don't think she's quite ready for a place full of them. :lol: Here's a link to the place we've went a few times. It's a few towns over so I haven't went without DH. If I had the car I would, but all we have now is my 4 cylinder jeep wrangler that has trouble getting up to speed on the highways so I try to stay local with DH gone. 

https://www.goplaytown.com/



As for weight loss today, I only lost 1.4 lbs this week but I am very happy with this because I didn't use myfitnesspal and I didn't walk. But I am proud to be back on the exercise bike routine every night. Which half the battle is finding motivation to stay up and do that. :thumbup: So I'm at 198.6 this week. :dance:


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah, and about the top chef woman. I don't watch it but I have seen her in my People magazine. I think they even did a feature of her for the 'body after baby' page. :roll: Those are ALWAYS ridiculous. Like heidi klum type of people. It's seriously so unrealistic. 

I think as far as threads on here, it's not so much the fact that these girls are thin again that bothers me. It's the fact that they bitch and moan and say they are SO fat. Those types of girls are just screaming for attention I think. Like they have to know they look good and they just want compliments. I wonder if they realize that by complaining about their perfect bodies, they are really putting down the rest of us. Because you don't see the average types of girls posting in those threads. I know there are plenty of us because theres a good 20 girls in my weightloss group on here. And that's just breastfeeding mothers. :shrug: 

I am determined to keep up with my exercise and watching what I eat even while pregnant next time. I think I would bounce back a lot quicker if I kept up with it all. I was borderline gestational diabetic during my pregnancy. Like just a few points below the line I think. I ate a lot of sweets though. So it was definitely my own fault. :lol:


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## Shiv

I agree about the girls looking for attention Cleck - however from the otherside of the argument, if I were to tell you that i felt awful and fat after I had Sophia, you might think i was one of those girls (or you might have thought I was fat :haha:) and I wouldn't have been looking for attention. I think it is all relative. If prior tp pregnancy you were a tiny size (say a U.S size 4) then you went up to a US size 10 (which is still small) to that person it would seem like a massive change and might be quite depressing. Do you see what I mean? Absolutely no need for skinny minnies to make threads about how gross they are though as it is only gonna make us normal people feel bad :haha:

Well done on the weight loss cleck, any loss is great especially if you haven't worked as hard as you normally would have.

i am off tonight for a friends birthday and Sophia is staying at my parents so I shall be having a lovely lie in tomorrow, and david will no doubt be totally hungover!


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## jelr

Spidey: yeah AF would normally be heavier for me in the mornings but the thing that was strange was she had completely gone by Monday and then came back Wednesday morning but only heavy for an hour and then just spotting for the day and then gone again so I dont know what was up with that :shrugg:

Our plans are relaxing tomorrow and going to get all the bed clothes washed and then Natasha has another birthday party on Sunday - It is her 4th in about 5 weeks - she has a much more hectic social life than DH and I :haha:

Shiv: Yeah the champix are only available on prescription so it will be 50 for the doctors and then whatever the prescription costs which I checked in the chemist today and it is 135 - I forgot to ask them how long the course was for 135, but I think they give you two weeks to start off, so it is quite expensive. Was it as expensive for your mam? I hope you have a lovely meal out tonight and enjoy that lie in tomorrow :thumbup:

Cleck: Yeah I definitely think the weight thing is relative as I know loads of people tell me I dont look like I have put on weight and that I have a lovely figure but I feel awful at the moment as I'm a stone heavier than I usually am and I'm in a size up in my clothes. (I'm usually a UK size 10 - US size 8 but now I'm a UK size 12 or US 10 and a size up again in some clothes) which is not massive I know but I don't feel good in myself at all (probably because none of my clothes will fit and I refuse to go out and buy more :haha:) But I definitely agree there somebody who is tiny and only 5lbs heavier a month after giving birth should have no need to post a picture and say she is fat, that to me is looking for people to tell her how lovely she and skinny she is - God I wish I had only 5lbs to lose when I had Natasha - I was nearly 4 stone heavier at full term and I only lost the 8lb that she weighed - granted I did lose another 12lbs or so without doing anything in the first couple of months I reckon that was fluid and so on so in terms of just fat I put on 2.5 stone :haha: - hell I managed to put on double of their 5lbs in the 10 weeks I was pregnant this time and I'm still not doing a good job of moving it :haha:

Not much news here - it was a fairly stressful week in work so I'm shattered and Natasha is still a little unsettled at night since I went back the poor thing. Not as much now but she just cries in her sleep every now and again - so its a lots of broken sleep I'm getting as I'm a light sleeper and since was born, Its worse as I hear her every move, I think I only have go into a sleep in case she does wake up :dohh:

Well I hope you all have a good weekend :hugs:


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## spidey

Cleck, your weightloss has been amazing! So did you take your scale picture yet? The camera shouldn't make it jump up to 200 anymore :haha:

jelr- I understand what you're saying about AF now.. that is weird to get a burst of heavy bleeding once it was all done. I guess your body is still getting things back to normal.

Shiv- enjoy your sleep in tomorrow!

We've been trying a new bedtime routine and I don't know how I feel about it. Kira has been requiring 30-50 minutes of bouncing each night by DH to get to sleep. His back has been hurting and he really can't go more than 20 minutes now, and 20 minutes is my limit too since my arms give out. We've been delaying bedtime to try and shorten her bounce to 20 minutes, but letting her stay up an extra hour doesn't help and by the time she's in bed, it's 11 and I have to be at work at 6am. Last night DH laid with her in bed and she basically cried for 40 minutes until she fell asleep. He was right there the whole time comforting her but I guess she wasn't thrilled with the idea. Now tonight he's trying it again (I hear her crying right now). I would love for this to work but I hate having her cry so long. DH is hopeful that each night it will get better... I hope so! LOL, she stopped crying.. I bet she's trying to pry open DH's eyes right now since he's pretending to be asleep.

edited to say that I love that bouncy/play place Cleck!! I need to find something like that here since I'm not sure how Kira would do with just bouncy castles. Kira would love all those cozy coupes and other play areas though!


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## jelr

I hope the night time thing gets easier Spidey, you might be surprised though they do tend to adjust quickly. I was dreading taking Natasha out of her sleeping bag and putting a duvet on and especially as the first night she woke crying so much, but it was much better the second night and she had completely adjusted the 3rd night and loves the duvet now, so hopefully it will only take a couple of nights because I know it is hard to see them upset. :hugs:

Cleck: I meant to say in my post last night but completely forgot as I was so tired. Dont let those girls make you feel bad about yourself. :hugs: You look fantastic and should be so proud of your weightloss :thumbup: and being that skinny with a surf board stomach as I call it without stretchies is not the norm postpartum. :nope:

I used to strive to have a surf board stomach as two of my friends have them and felt really bad about myself and then I actually took a step back one night and looked around me at every woman I saw and realised it is not the norm and that they were just really really lucky and a minority and that most women are not like this. Also back to these girls looking for attention, the reason you only see these skinny minnies in that section is because most normal woman hate their bodies postpartum and would not attempt to put up pictures on a public forum. I know I would definitely not as I never had a flat stomach to begin with and although i dont have much stretch marks, I have loads of loose skin since having Natasha. It is like my stomach was good at stretching but it didn't know how to go back :haha: 

Shiv: I hope your dinner went well and you had a lovely rest this morning.

AFM: I think I have thrush (a yeast infection for the US girls) :blush: - I guess everything is still unbalanced after the procedure and the pregnancy and then non-pregnancy hormones. it is making me feel rotten and dirty though, so between that and I have been so good this week and stuck so well to the diet and lost nothing. I'm feeling a bit rubbish :sad2: - Aw well it can only get better eh!!


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## cleckner04

You ladies are totally right. I guess it's pure opinion and those girls are entitled to it if they think they are gross looking. :haha: And I'm sure they don't realize they are hurting the feelings of the 'bigger' crowd. I think it's just my own sensitivity talking when I complain about it. :blush: I'm confident with my own body for the most part but threads like that knock me back a bit. I know I should just not click on them! It's just it took me nearly 2 YEARS to lose the pregnancy weight and they lose it all within a month and are still complaining. :dohh: Granted, I had a c-section that was infected so I couldn't even walk properly for months. And I was always scared about my milk supply after all my supply problems in the beginning. Next time around, I think I'm going to try to lose it earlier. I may have another c-section but I hear planned ones are much smoother and the healing time is quicker. So that's something to think about. 

spidey- :hugs: That bedtime routine sounds rough. How did she do last night? From what I've read, if you keep doing it like that she'll cry less and less each night. I hope it starts getting better for you guys. :hugs::hugs:

jelr- :hugs: to you too. I've never had a yeast infection but I hear they are super uncomfortable. Your not dirty. I think every woman gets one at least once in their lifetime. Being a woman with all of these hormones just sucks sometimes. And with the weightloss, I'm already frustrated this week too now. Usually I weigh about 2 lbs. more at night than the morning. So I weigh myself every night after I work out so I'll know if I did good that day. Well last night I was 198.4 weighing in at night. So I was so pleased and ready for a 196.4 weight this morning. I thought I would already be to 'overweight' instead of 'obese' because all I need to do is get down to 196 so I was so excited last night. This morning my weight is exactly the same as last night. :dohh: So it was a serious disappointment. I've noticed I actually lose slower on the weeks that I ride my exercise bike. So I feel like I'm doing that long workout for nothing. Although the sensible side of me knows it's probably better that I'm not losing as fast. Are you exercising at all? For what it's worth, I think women with six pack abs look kinda gross. :rofl: I think a woman is meant to be slightly soft in the middle. Much more feminine that way. :thumbup:


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## spidey

Last night went much better with Kira's new sleep routine. She cried for only 1-2 minutes and then I didn't hear another peep from her on the monitor. DH fell asleep while laying next to her so he has no idea how long it took her to drift off :haha: but he does remember her laying there and wiggling her toes. About an hour after he took her upstairs for bedtime, he came stumbling down the stairs with squinty eyes :lol: It's a huge deal because Kira has always needed movement and booby to sleep, so for her to lay down and drift off is amazing! I hope its just as easy tonight!

yeast infections- ugh, I hate them! When I feel extra "yeasty" I'll try to let things air out down there... so no panties and extra baggy pants. I re-wash all my panties and do 2 rinses on them because sometimes I think lingering detergent can make it worse. I've also been known to smear cold plain yogurt down there and then take an hour to lay down bottomless on a towel to let the bacteria in the yogurt kill the yeast. Somewhere I read that apple cider vinegar helps too, but I made the mistake of dabbing it on fully concentrated and it burned so badly :rofl:, so you might want to look it up first and see if diluted apple cider vinegar is useful. Garlic might help too because I know garlic has natural anti-bacteria and anti-fungal abilities- I stuck garlic cloves up there (they were wrapped in cheese cloth) when I was pregnant to try and kill my Strep B :haha: I don't know if it worked because my midwives refused to re-test me. LOL, how embarrassing that my vagina has sampled nearly everything in the kitchen, but if you are really suffering with itchiness and feel like you're going to go crazy, you can freeze yogurt in the shape of a tampon, and then put a frozen yogurt pop in there... ahhhhhh, such relief, LOL! 

Cleckner- thats shitty about not dropping weight overnight. I'm the same way- I always drop a couple pounds between night and morning. 

No AF yet. I ovulated last Thursday...


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## cleckner04

Ooooo No AF!! Any symptoms?? I hope it's pregnancy and not a super long luteal phase!! Although, the long luteal phase would be nice too. :haha:


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## Shiv

Cleck - you have much more reason to be proud of you rbody than any of those skinny minnies. Just look at your weightloss photos - you rock!

jelr - Thrush sucks, I hope it clears up quick for you, can you get canestan over there?
i also wake up at every tiny noise Sophia makes. When she is teething she tends to yelp in the night, just once and then nothing. I doubt she even wakes up - but i do and my heart is bloody racing! Also stop beating yourself about being at work. Natasha loves being with your mum and I bet she has tons of fun, I also bet the she appreciates you a lot more when you get home. Sophia is bored of me by 11am :haha:

Spidey - your post made me laugh, no wonder you always have so much food in your fridge :haha:
I hope you are either due your BFP or a nice 12-14 day luteal phase this month. Has Kira been breastfeeding less this month?

Well my meal out last night was lovley, I was so damn full when i got home. My lie in was nice but i woke up every couple of hours in the night either needing to wee or just uncomfortable so I still feel tired today :dohh:

I forget which thread it was on that we were discussing whether LO was cuddly or not? Anyway Sophia is pretty cuddly, she rarely ever comes over just for a cuddle, but she spends a good coupl eof hours a day cuddled up to me reading books, she is a total bookworm!

We are going to a bootfair in the morning (do you have them in the US - a bit like a garage sale but on a field with lots of other people selling their junk too) to try to get rid of some of our junk. DH bought down some stuff from the loft that made me laugh, a few disco lights from when we used to have lots of parties was a highlight! i am also selling a lot of my ball dresses. I haev loads of floor length dresses from balls at uni and work Christmas parties etc that I am seriously never gonna wear again so it would be nice to get a bit of money for them but we'll see.

Oh and I bought that dress by the way! It arrived yesterday and i do love it. I think it will also look better the bigger I get, but it is flattering and very elegant, and even sexy according to my DH :thumbup: I'll post a piccy when I wear it next weekend!

I am getting quite upset about moving now that it is getting som close. I have put it to the back of my mind for a few weeks but no everyone is talking about it and I just can't. I think I am in complete denial :cry:


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## spidey

Shiv- Maybe once you start packing you'll get more excited about the move to a new house with a new town to explore. :hugs: I wouldn't be thrilled if I had to move either, so I can understand your denial. You'll have to plan lots of fun day trips and sleepovers back home.

The closest thing to a bootfair would be a flea market. Usually they're indoors in a large building and people rent tables and try to sell their junk. Good luck Shiv on selling your stuff!

Shiv- take a picture of yourself in your sexy dress so we can see!!

So far no pregnancy symptoms, and no symptoms indicating that AF is on her way. I have a technical question. If I ovulated on a Thursday, and AF came on the next Thursday, would that be a 8 day luteal phase, or 7 day? Up until now I've been calling that 8 days. So right now my luteal phase is atleast 10 days long!! Much better than the 8 day luteal phase last month :thumbup: I know I'm not pregnant, but I can't help getting a little excited that I might be.

Kira nursed like crazy right at the beginning of this cycle since her molars and canines were all moving around, but since then she's been cutting back on her nursing. Over the past 2 weeks she has transformed into a Daddy's girl. Sometimes she seems to prefer DH over me :shock: :haha: He's loving the extra Kira attention and I love seeing her want to spend so much time with him.. a true Daddy's girl :cloud9: The boobies have been getting less action, which might help push my luteal phase in the right direction.


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## cleckner04

They added more updated pictures of that house now. That island makes more sense now. :rofl: 

I still love this house.

https://hansbarger.idxco.com/idx/6824/photoGallery.php?idxID=397&listingID=68271


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## cleckner04

Shiv- :hugs::hugs: I know it's so scary moving. Especially if you aren't used to it. I have a feeling it won't be nearly as bad as you think though. It'll be an adventure and you'll have a new area to explore. It's awful when you don't really want to move though. :( I'm sorry you guys have to do this. I really hope it all works out and you end up loving it at your new area. 

Spidey- I'm starting to wonder how to count luteal phase too. According to my monitor, if my AF starts in the afternoon, I set the monitor the next morning. But I'm not sure if I'm supposed to set it as CD1 or CD2 since the period started in the middle of the day. If it's CD1, that would also make my luteal phases a day longer if that makes sense. :haha: I really don't know how to count it I guess. No matter what your luteal phase would be longer this month if you aren't pregnant. Which is amazing and I'm totally jealous! :lol:


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## spidey

Cleckner, you know how to make me happy! I LOVE looking at house pictures :blush::haha:

The center island is actually great, LOL, that original picture had such an awkward angle on it. It's a really nice house and you could move right in. I grew up in a house much like that (but with no dining space) and my parents still live there. There's something nice with having everything on one level and to have a nice big finished basement thats cool in the summer time :thumbup: My only bit of concern is it looks like the neighbors yard has standing water- is that really what I'm seeing? If so I hope the house has a good sump pump!

HA! You should be jealous of my long luteal phase :rofl: Lets see if I wake up tomorrow with a visit from AF.

I also need to report that Kira had no crying tonight.. she snuggled right up with DH and drifted off to sleep within 10 minutes. Such a good girl!! It still seems too good to be true!

I just put a video of Kira doing a puzzle on FB :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

I think the neighbors have a trampoline sitting there and it looks like water. I can sorta see legs in the picture. It's not the clearest picture. :haha: The only problem DH and I have is that the house is kinda cramped looking along the kitchen/dining/living areas. But it may be bigger in person and just seem small. But honestly, that's a minor problem for me. It's got everything we would want. I want a place that is move in ready without needing work and this is exactly it. And I actually love that the lawn looks kind of crappy because I am already forming in my mind all the pretty flowers and garden I can plant. :haha: 

Yay for Kira going right to sleep without fuss!! :dance: That's amazing!! SHe must just have been ready. Wouldn't it suck if she could've done this months ago and you guys just figured it out. :rofl: 

I hope your AF doesn't hit you. At least one of us has to get pregnant. It'll give me hope that it's possible even with a booby monster. I tried my absolute best to deny Emma the booby today (except morning, nap, and before bed tonight) but she still just yanks down my top and doesn't listen when I tell her no. :dohh: I'm actually considering starting the actual weaning process though and stopping when she turns 2. Its my top goal but I don't know if I'll want to go much further than 2. Although, if I quit feeding her and still can't get pregnant I'll probably be pissed. :rofl:


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## cleckner04

I just looked through some of your facebook albums spidey, I absolutely cannot get over how big Kira was at birth. It's almost like you completely skipped the newborn phase because she was so big. :lol: Was she in newborn clothing at all?


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## spidey

Cleckner- the outside of the house is already beautiful, so just imagine it with some flowers! I do see the trampoline now.

We actually tried this new sleep routine in the past but its been a failure. Once I tried laying with her and she just did acrobatics off my boobs and giggled the whole time. I had to give up after an hour because my nips were getting sore. A couple of months ago DH did it by himself and Kira cried hysterically and fought him like her life was in danger. He didn't like the level of upset she was showing so he gave up. It still seems so unreal that she fell asleep so easily last night.

When Corey gets home Emma will probably want less booby once she warms up to him. So having Corey there will make weaning much easier. Kira still uses a pacifier and DH has been saying "big girls don't use pacifiers" and most of the time Kira gives it up like she understands the "big girl" concept. But if she really needs it, she won't let him have it and we don't force the issue. So maybe something like "boobies are for sleepy time" and then offer some other comfort object or hug. Atleast that's my plan for when I need to lessen the amount of booby. I have 3 places where Kira nurses (couch, bed and lounge chair outside) so she knows I don't whip it out in the front yard or in the kitchen :haha: If you made a designated booby spot, it might make booby snacks more inconvenient for Emma and she won't ask for it as much. I'm still not certain when I'll start actively weaning Kira. I figure it will be like her sleep routine change and I'll know when its the right time. But when you do start weaning you must keep me updated on what works!

No AF yet!


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## spidey

oops, forgot! Kira never wore her newborn clothes or newborn diapers. Thats why I need to grow baby #2 smaller so I can get some use out of those clothes! :haha:


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## Shiv

Cleck - that house is really lovely. When will you know any more about Corey's job?

Spidey - that is so great about Kira going to sleep, must seem like a big wieght has been lifted now that you don't have to bounce her.

as for luteal phase, I would just be guessing, but as we count in days post ovulation, I guess the day you ovulate is counted as day zero, but I really don't know! 

Well David made £220.25 at the car boot fair which I am pretty happy with. We still had to cart some stuff back home, a bread maker and some books which will be donated to a charity shop I think. He is curled up asleep on the sofa now, the 5am start has knocked him out.


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## Shiv

oh and Cleck - you inspired me to start working out again! I brought myself a pregnancy workout DVD and did it yesterday - I am walking like John Wayne today :haha:


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## jelr

Thanks girls - feeling a bit better down there today :blush: - I got the canestan pessery and cream and it has made a huge difference already. It really felt horrible and just made me feel like I wanted to shower every two minutes :haha: Spidey I lmao at you with all that food in your vagina :haha: - although I have to say that cold yogurt pop sounds like heaven the way I was feeling yesterday :haha:

Cleck: I can totally understand your sensitivity, I get like that too when I'm struggling, one of my friends tends to complain if she has went up from 8 stone to 8.5 stone and only has to cut out chocolate for a few days and she will lose it and I get so frustrated, but I have realised over the years that she actually does get really down in herself about it. But like Shiv said you have so much more to be proud of, it just fell off them (bitches :haha:) but you have had to work at it and you have done so well and you look fantastic. :thumbup: But do please please stop going into those threads and making yourself feel bad, because you are far more confident that I am in your body and I would hate to see that go. I didn't even look at the thread you were talking about because I know I would cry :haha:

I love the house, the outside is gorgeous and yes the island makes a lot more sense now and really suits. I hope it is still there when and if you want to buy it.

As for the exercising. I'm not too good at it to be honest :nope: - but I did do some tonight, my problem is that I feel you are not going to lose weight unless you do cardio and any of the dvd's I have bought have so much jumping around that I end up swelling up from my arthritis and am broke up for the next few days, I think a threadmill would probably be ideal for me but at the moment it is not an option as money is really tight with DH not back to work properly yet and being honest we dont really have anywhere to put it without it being in the way. As it would be in the way in the kitchen or sitting room and the 3 bedrooms down stairs are all full between us, Natasha and a toy room and the spare room upstairs is an attic conversion so you couldn't stand on it without hitting your head on the ceiling :haha: - we do have a sun room, which it could go in at the moment but by the time we can afford it, we will be thinking about baby number 2 who will go into the bedroom that is now the toy room and the sun room will become the toy room - so I'm stuck on that one :dohh: - I decided I'm going to try and do 30 minutes on the wii fit plus, I know they are probably not cardio enough to lose weight but I'm thinking it can't hurt. I would be happy to lose 2lbs a week for the next few weeks between that and the diet and hopefully the stone or near enough to it will be gone by July for the wedding we are going to.

Spidey: mmm not sure about the counting, I think maybe the day after as 1 day the same as you would count back if you were counting the days you were pregnant. Yay for long lutual phases or being pregnant lol - and that is fantastic that Kira's bedtime routine is sorted and was done so quickly, they actually surprise me how quickly they do adjust to change in the things that we think are going to be a nightmare. I saw that video on fb of Kira and it is really cute, I was also looking at your garden pictures and you garden is gorgeous :thumbup:

Shiv: big :hugs: - I'm sorry you are feeling a bit down about the move, it is totally understandable when all your family and friends are there. I would be the very same as I'm a terrible home bird. I really hope it works out and you love the new place and you know we all are if you want to cry or rant or get upset. Yay for David making over 200 that is fantastic and it is good to get rid of stuff you are not going to use and have a good clean up when moving and even better to make a few bob. :thumbup: We have what we call car boot sales here, so nearly the same. Aww that is lovely that Sophia cuddles up to you reading a book. Natasha loves books too, but doesn't cuddle up reading them at all. She really is miss independant that way :cry: - Natasha does that yelping in her sleep too and I have been in the room checking on her when she has done it and she doesn't wake up, but like you if I'm asleep I do wake up with my heart racing and then I can't get back to sleep and am waiting on her to waken :dohh: it is so tiring isn't it?

We had a good day, we went to a birthday party and Natasha didn't want to get off the bouncy castle they had hired. I was terrified of her on it though and DH and I stayed on it with her as there was so many other older children on it and I was terrified they would land on her and then afterwards one of the people there said that there was a little girl fell off one up the country yesterday and she fell awkardly and instantly broke her neck and died, so I'm so glad we did stay on it with her and kept her in a corner and helped her on and off :wacko:


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## spidey

AF got me :growlmad: so that means my luteal phase was 10 days. I'm going to call ovulation day 0 since that makes a little more sense to me. I had to go back and re-calculate my luteal phase and here are my numbers from my last 5 cycles (incase anyone here is a number freak like me :haha:)

Dec/Jan: 46cd, 11 day luteal phase
Jan/Feb: 43cd, 12 day luteal phase
Feb/March: 26cd, 9 day luteal phase
March/April: 30cd, 7 day luteal phase
April/May: 33cd, 10 day luteal phase

haha, so what does it all mean? It seems like those really long cycles are better for my luteal phase.

Jelr- I'm glad your vagina is doing better :haha: 

LOL Shiv for walking like John Wayne. 

Me and DH bought pedometers a couple of weeks ago to try to motivate each other to walk more, and I started taking the stairs at work instead of the elevator, but that's all I've done so far. I know I would feel much healthier if I exercised more.


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## cleckner04

jelr- I'm glad the thrush is feeling better. :hugs: I bet you'll be surprised at the amount of results you can get just from working out on the Wii. There are quite a few ladies on here that use the wii to lose weight. :thumbup: I actually find I've been getting better results from just walking outside than I am with my exercise bike. I think the exercise bike is building my muscles though which slows down the weight loss part of it. 

Spidey- I'm sorry AF hit. :( Right here is a luteal phase calculator that I've been using so it takes the guesswork out of how many days there is. https://www.mymonthlycycles.com/lutealcalc.jsp 10 days is the minimum I think so it's still a normal luteal phase. :thumbup: 



I gave my parents the address to the house I love. I sent them the link also so they could see the pictures and we were talking about it today and all the things we could do with it like a garden and landscaping, etc. Well mom and dad drove into town today to see it and there is a big SOLD sign in the front yard. :cry::cry: I knew it would go fast. It's just too nice on the inside for that price. So back to square one with house hunting. I'm sad but oddly I feel like I just saved myself 95k dollars. :rofl:


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## spidey

GRRR I don't like your calculator!!! It says my luteal phase is actually 9 days :growlmad: I ovulated on the 5th and AF arrived on the 15th. So I need to knock a day off of each of my luteal phase measurements.

That sucks your favorite house sold, but I'm certain you'll find another dream house. Thats funny your parents drove by it- it's something my parents would do too :haha:

I'm off to bed. DH put Kira to sleep and he must have passed out too :lol: It's been over an hour and we had a tv date planned with popcorn and cream soda and he never showed up! I'm going to tease him in the morning :haha:


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## Shiv

Spidey - I can't believe you got stood up! :haha:
sorry AF got you :hugs:

Cleck - sorry about the house, but I am certain that you will find something else (if indeed you need to, as Corey might stay in the Navy yet!).

jelr - wii fit is a good idea, even a little bitof exercise can help with weight loss and toning, and I have heard great things about people who use wii fit regularly.

I have just been going through old clothes to see what I can chuck and what can go to charity. I found a load of old underwear (U.S ladies, I don't mean just panties) from when David and I first got together. They are a size 8 (U.S size 4) and a bra size 32 A, they are goregoues basques and lots of sexy stuff. Made me realise a) that I will never be that size again and b) that I really stopped making an effort with myself after the first couple of years with David :haha:

My legs are still sore today but I am hoping that by this evening they will be better so I can do my DVD again once Sophia is in bed.


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## cleckner04

spidey- :rofl: at your DH falling asleep. Sounds exactly like something my own DH would do. Sorry the luteal phase calculator isn't good for you. :hugs:

shiv- I used to have tons of matching panties and bras and I agree, I've let myself go a bit since getting with my DH. I'm still wearing my giant underwear from when I was pregnant. :rofl: They are just so comfy! I need to make a lingerie purchase too. Maybe just a few things that match. And panties that can't be used as a parachute. :rofl:


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## spidey

LOL Shiv about not making an effort with David now. DH always asks why I don't buy thongs anymore :haha: 

I double checked my last 5 luteal phases with Cleckner's nifty online calculator, and these are my lengths: 10,11,8,6 and 9. Sort of depressing. DH and I talked about it today and I think he's coming to terms with another baby not happening anytime soon.

A girl I was friends with in elementary school is a hairdresser and almost 10 years ago I randomly walked into a salon where she was working. She did a great job on my hair and gave me a nice short cut. When I returned, the shop had closed :cry: and I had no contact info for her. Last month she contacted me on FB and I gave her a call today to arrange a time for a haircut since she does it in her house now. I can't wait for her to call back! It's been a year since I had my hair cut and I'm planning something drastic!!! :shock:


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## cleckner04

Aww that's great you found your old friend again! I only ever let my friend cut my hair. I made the mistake once of going to a random salon in virginia and they turned me away because I am white. :cry::cry: I'm dead serious though. :rofl::rofl: They recommended me a salon down the street. Which was full of white people. So..I only go to my friend now. :blush::rofl: Anyways, you'll have to post a piccie of your 'drastic' new cut. :D I love doing random whacky things with my hair. Every once in a while I just get so sick of my hair that I have to do something crazy to it.


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## Shiv

oooooooooooooh new hair cut, what are you thinking of having done Spidey? Does your Luteal phase seem to correspond with how how much Kira breastfeeds fo you think, or just random?

Cleck - is Virginia a heavily black populated area? I can't imagine being turned away from somewher becasue of the colour of my skin. ALthough maybe all the hairdressers are onlytrained in how to do afro hair?:shrug:

Well I have completely lost the plot! :wacko: We went to bed last night and I couldn't sleep. I started to think about the move and then started to cry uncontrollably which woke DH up! He called me weird (which at le:wacko:ast made me laugh!) his exacts words were "why are you crying in the middle of the night, its a bit weird" - my reply - it's not the middle of the night, we've only just come to bed!

my problem is, I have just completely blocked the move out emotionally, I can deal with organising stuff, packing etc, but i have pretty much refused to think about the emotional side as I didn't see the point in upsetting myself. Well last night I opened the floodgates and didn't stop crying for over an hour. The only way I could stop myself was to sing the Makka Pakka song from in the night gardn repeatedly (luckily it was justin my head and not out loud!) The main thing that makes me cry is this. Whenever we get home in the car now, Sophia says "home" as we are pulling into the driveway. We are still going to hav eto come back to this house fairly often as we need to pick up mail, mow lawns etc. It breaks my heart to think we will come back and she will say "home" when we pull onto teh driveway and be all excited about being back in her home again..............ok now I'm crying again! I am a complete hormonal fruit loop!


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## cleckner04

Shiv- Certain areas of VA was definitely heavily populated with black people. But the specific area wasn't really. So must've been my own horrible luck. :dohh: 

I'm sorry you are feeling so down. :(:hugs::hugs: All I can say is, little kids adapt SO quickly you would be surprised. Soon she'll call the new place home. You have your lovely little family together and that is all that matters right now. It will take a while to adjust and crying is normal, believe me on that one. I cried so much when I had to move away for the first time. It was my own choice but still very difficult to do. :hugs::hugs:


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## Kimberly28

Hi Ladies! I took a nice long break from BNB as the whole TTC was depressing me too much and went at it on my own. After 10 months, I'm finally pregnant! :happydance: I just got my :bfp: this morning! :happydance: Really hoping this one sticks after our devestating loss last year. [-o&lt; 

To those of you still TTC, I hope your time comes soon! Trust me I was really beginning to think mine NEVER would and had lost hope. Hang in there! :hugs: :flower:


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## spidey

Shiv- your crying spell was bound to happen because you can't keep those feelings bottled up inside forever :hugs: Plus those damn hormones can make things a hundred times worse. Like what Cleck said, Sophia will quickly adjust to her new house. My only advice is to let yourself cry when you need to and talk to David some more about your feelings so he doesn't have to call you weird again :lol: I forgot, when are you moving?

Cleckner- LOL about being turned away for not being black :haha: The stylists were probably experts on doing black hair and didn't want to screw yours up. My mom is white, but she has very thick super curly black hair, and many "normal" stylists have no idea how to handle her hair. Once the stylist was going to prove to my mom that she could blow it out straight.. the lady got half done and then gave up :haha: 

Kim- congrats :happydance: welcome back

This is my current hair.. it hasn't been trimmed in 1 year and I straightened it this morning, but the humidity is getting to it..

https://www.razortoe.com/share/hairfront.jpg

https://www.razortoe.com/share/hairback.jpg

I'm thinking of short all around, with it being a little shorter in the back with layers, so my natural curl will show nicely. The front I plan to straighten- and perhaps be as long as my chin.. not sure yet though. I'll take suggestions though!! :haha:

Breastfeeding and luteal phase.. I know my 7 day luteal phase was from a heavily bf month. But in general, Kira has been bf less and less (she still is a booby monster though). It seems like those really long 40-something day cycles are good for my luteal phase. Before Kira I had really long cycles too.


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## cleckner04

Spidey- I bet you can really pull off short hair well since you're so thin! It's amazing that that is your 'straightened' version of your hair. :D Kira didn't really inherit the curls though did she? Curly hair is always SO pretty but I can imagine it would be very hard to manage. 



So I'm looking at outfits for me to wear when DH comes home. I'm thinking this top with jeans. Any opinions? 

https://www.fredericks.com/Ruched_Watercolor_Corset/56067,default,pd.html

I always love when it starts getting close because I can plan out everything that I want to wear. And this time I get to dress Emma up too. :dance: I already have a little dress for her to wear and I am gonna put a flower headband on her. Hopefully she'll keep it in. :lol:


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## jelr

Oh Shiv big big :hugs: :hugs: - you are not weird for crying in the middle of the night (mind you if you had of sang the song out loud or David would have definitely have thought you were lol) Moving is emotional in itself and especially with all those hormones. You definitely need to let it out though and talk to David and tell him how you are feeling. I wouldn't worry about Sophia though as she will be "home" wherever you and David and her new brother or sister are and she will adjust quickly and you know we will still all be here and you can cry to us anytime :hugs:

Spidey: Sorry AF got you and that your luteal phase isn't as long as you thought it was, but like I said to Cleck before, maybe it was never long and you still conceived Kira. Mmm do I remember you saying that before you had Kira you always wanted to chop your hair off when AF arrived, I hope this is not one of those times or maybe you should wait until next week :haha: - The short with the layers at the back sounds really nice. I'm so glad Kira has settled into her new routine. lol at DH standing up though, I hope you teased him loads :haha:

Cleck: Sorry to hear the house is sold - but everything happens for a reason and that house was meant to keep you busy while you were worrying about DH's job and if it does happen now, an even nicer house will hopefully be available for you two to settle in. :thumbup: How long until Corey is home now? Is it the start or end of next month? You must be really getting excited.

Kim: Congrats again, Sending loads of sticky dust your way. :dust:

Well I have done 30 to 45 mins on the wii fit the last few nights - The first day I managed to put on a lb :dohh: but then this morning I went down 3lbs - so I dont know what is going on :shrug: as it is not possible to lose that much overnight, :shrug: the only thing I can think of is maybe I ov earlier this month as I do tend to carry water then. It is really getting me down now though as I really want to shift the extra pregnancy weight before this wedding and before we ttc again. Hopefully the exercise will pay off and I will start to see results soon.

Natasha is drooling lots this week and is chewing on literally everything she gets into her hands so I'm wondering if those 2nd molars are moving again, mind you I thought this a few months ago and they never appeared :shrug: - she is in better form though and seems to be starting to settle back into the routine of being back in my mams while we are at work.


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## jelr

Sorry Cleck only saw your post now. That top is gorgeous, it will look perfect with jeans. Your DH is going to get the shock of his life when he sees you, you will look amazing :thumbup:

Oh yeah meant to say on last post too. Regarding underwear my DH is always on at me about why I dont wear thongs anymore either. and my reply is "that is the price you pay for having such a beautiful daughter - after being sliced and diced I'm not wearing any cheese graters to cut into me" :rofl: - it really wouldn't make a difference to down there to wear one after all this time, but I'm just too lazy and they are not that comfortable but the above is my excuse and I'm sticking to it:haha:


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## spidey

suuuuuuper cute Cleckner!!!! That will be so hot with jeans! The poor man will have to resist the urge to pounce on you until Emma goes to bed! 

jelr- weighing yourself everyday is asking for trouble!! I bet you'll lose weight with your new workout routine. Have you bought the dress for the wedding yet? Does Natasha have all of her canines yet? 

LOL jelr- you're right about me doing drastic things with my hair before AF comes. I actually wanted to cut my hair last week, but I forced myself to wait until after AF came to make the call to my friend. :haha: 

Kira's hair- I was really worried that Kira could end up with bad hair since my mom has super thick black curly hair and my MIL has super thick black straight hair. Somehow she turned out with thin blonde hair. I never imagined my baby to look like Kira... both me and DH have dark eyes and dark hair (his is black) and she has blue eyes and blonde hair. Her hair will probably darken when she gets older, but the blue eyes are a nice surprise. I think she looks a lot like DH too.. and she acts like him too :haha:


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## Shiv

Cleck - that top is gorgeous! I am glad corey's homecoming is close enough now for you to get excited and start making plans. What will youdo for your first meal back together? Do you go and meet him at his ship (or is that just a romantic film type image i have in my head!)? What date does he get back?

Spidey - how curly is your hair au naturale? i have spent my whole life trying (and failing) to get my hair to curl. It is far to think and straight to hold any style! I think you will really suit a shorter style :thumbup: 

jelr - good work on the wii fit :thumbup: I agree with Spidey (and I have said teh same to Cleck) weighing yourself every day is a nightmare! The only time i ever lost a decent amount of weight is when my scales at home broke and I had to wiegh myself after a fitness class once a week. I find that if half way through the week I have lost a few lbs I ease off and give myself a treat, where as if I don't know how I am doing then I will assume the worst and continue being good!

I am sure the exercise will help in the long run, it certainly can't hurt! When is the wedding you are going to?

As for me, well i am doing better, mainly because i have put moving to the back of my mind again! This time next week will be our last night in the house!

Sophia has been a bit of a madam the last few days, those bloomin teeth. She has been really testing me and the boundaries i set. I hope it's a phase!

David finished work today, must feel really weird for him but at least he knows he has another job to go to. I feel bad for all the people who are leaving with nothing to go to. i left the same place of work, nearly two years to the day ago!

Oh that's right I meant to ask you Cleck,what did you do before you ahd Emma in terms of a job, or were you lucky enough to go straight into being a kept woman?


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## cleckner04

Shiv- I have no idea what we'll do for a first meal. I might just make a big roast dinner in the slow cooker for him. But I usually let him decide since he's spent 6.5 months having nasty ship food. :haha: And yes I do go meet him at the ship. I'm not as gung-ho as most wives though. They usually get there super early in the morning and get around in the parking lot and than watch the ship pull in, etc. I just wait for DH to text or call and than I drive to him. I don't even watch the ship pull in. Because once it does, it still takes a good 2 hours before they can get off the ship because they spend time tying the ship off to the dock and all of that crazy stuff. It's ridiculous the amount of time those wives wait at the pier though. :wacko: I never join in with the crowd either. I just stay back further in the parking lot and let him come to me. :rofl::rofl: I can't imagine Emma in that huge crowd though. Plus it'll be even worse with the media frenzy over his ship right now. (Because of the whole bin laden thing and his ship being the one that did it all). 

Before I had Emma, I had random odd jobs but no actual career. I have babysat for a few different kids at different intervals but that never lasts long because they are military kids and the parents get stationed somewhere else so I have to say goodbye and stop watching them. I even spent a summer being a girl scout camp counselor for brownies. So girls ages 6-8 I think it was. :haha: That was a fun summer. But basically, those jobs were all just for fun and to keep me busy. DH has always been the main breadwinner. :D'

Edit to add: I can't say exact dates of when his ship comes in for security reasons but it's mid-june. :D Lets just say I'm in the 20s already for the countdown of days left. :dance:


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## jelr

Ah stop sure I know myself I shouldn't be stepping on the scales everyday - that is the advice I give to everyone "Step away from the scales" - I think I even said it to you Cleck, but I am my own worst enemy and am so bad at taking my own advice and the minute I am dieting - I'm on it day and night :dohh: :haha:

Cleck: You are so right to just go when DH texts you, that would do my head in waiting around for 2 hours just to watch the ship come in. maybe the first time, but I guess it would be very boring. OMG in the 20's of a countdown, that is brilliant. It seems like no length ago when he was going (although I guess it seems forever to you) - I'm so happy for you :happydance:

Shiv: I'm glad you are okay now, but dont bottle it all up because it will get to you. It will be a big change for DH - but he will adjust quickly too once he has another job to keep him busy. Sorry to hear Sophia is being a madam the last few days, you would think as they get older it would get easier, but I think it is harder in some senses. DH and I were only talking about that recently as at two of Natasha's cousins are 3 and at a family thing lately it made me realise that it really is worse it is going to get, because at the moment if Natasha is starting to give out we can sort of distract her away from what she wants to do and is not meant to, where as there was no distracting with these and it was actual head down and sulking and screaming matches, so I'm not looking forward to that :nope: - I just keep trying to tell myself that it is all only phases and Natasha will never be like that - although I know to well she will probably be worse :haha:

Spidey: Yep she has all her canines and 1st set of molars since Jan / Feb so it is only the 2nd set to go and she is all done thank god. I'm also surprised that Natasha doesn't have darker hair too as both myself and DH do but she is more a light brown / blonde - It is getting more brown though as she gets older. When are you actually getting your hair done, you will have to put up photos. I wish I had either straight or curly hair, but it is neither and just has a kink in it so I have to straighten it every day for straight or if I wanted a curly look I would have to put a bottle of mousse in it.

Well I'm finished work for this week and am not back until next Tuesday so happy days. I'm hoping Natasha is in better form though as she is extremely cross today and my mam said she just didn't know what she wanted and she was the same this evening. She is always a great little eater, but tonight just refused her dinner and wanted her daddy's dinner. I knew we were going to be late from work so I took a fish dish out of the freezer for her that I had bulk cooked and I knew it would be something really quick for us but didn't know what and in the end we just both had an omlette - she usually loves fish but wouldn't even try this one, DH tried to trick her and put some of his egg on the edge of the spoon and the rest was her own and she lapped it up so it wasn't that she didn't like it, but she just wouldnt entertain it when she knew it was her own and not her daddy's so he ended up giving her his one as we reckoned omlette and fish with spinach would not be a good mix together - yuck :haha: and basically she just kept crying for everything, she would cry when she wanted something and when she was handed it she didn't want it anymore :dohh: - so hopefully she will be much better tomorrow and we can enjoy the time off together.

My friend that moved away last year is down home for the weekend so there is 4 of us girls are heading out for dinner on Saturday night so that is the diet out the window again ;dohh: - it is typical we hadn't had anything on for months and since I went on this diet we have had nothing but birthday parties and occasions - I think that is why not losing really bothered me this week as at the birthday party / communion party we were at on Sunday they had the most beautiful food and I was so good and resisted it all and just drank my glass of water and waited until I came home for my diet food.

DH is also back to work properly next week so hopefully I can stop panicking about money, he probably wont be on full wages for a few weeks until it is all properly up and running, but at least he will have some money coming in as our savings are just gone. I will really miss having him here everyday though. But he is delighted with himself today as he has transport again, so he feels like he has his independance back. We have only 1 car which is the one I drive, although when we are together I let him drive as he is a desperate back seat driver and I end up losing the plot :haha:) he had a car when I met him and it sat there and was never used as he was given a company van so it seemed pointless to have 2 cars with only one being used. but he has really missed not being able to go anywhere on the days I'm working when he is home and it will take the pressure off of me as I have had to leave for work earlier the last few days to drop him in as with my job I'm on the road going to different groups during the mornings and work from home in the afternoons to do all the paperwork so then I had to go back into town to collect him.

Anyway enough ramble from me, I really must go to bed. xx


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## spidey

I hope Natasha and Sophia have better days tomorrow. Kira was extra clingy today and by nap time I was exhausted and took a 2 hour nap with her. It must have been something in the air making them all have off days.

Shiv- I'm glad you had a better day today, but it's too bad it was from being in denial :haha:

Cleckner- I can't believe your wait is almost over! How do you think Emma will act when she see's her daddy? Have you counted forward to see if you'll be free and clear of AF when DH arrives? :haha:

jelr- enjoy your days off! Yay for DH getting his own car! I hope his first week back to work goes smoothly and he comes home happy and full of energy!

Today I kept my curls and took this picture later in the day so some of the curl is lost, but you can get an idea...
https://www.razortoe.com/share/curlyhair.jpg

The girl who is going to cut my hair is having some health problems so my new hair style might be on hold for awhile. She has arthritis and anxiety and isn't having an easy time with either right now. I don't trust anyone else to cut it short so if I end up having to get it cut by someone else in the meantime I'll just have the ends trimmed up.


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah I was gonna ask that. So natasha has all of her teeth but the second molars. Emma got her last canine in today too so she has them all but second molars. What about the other lion cubs? Kimberly- I remember you saying that Bry was already getting his second molars right? 

It's a relief to get all of her teeth in for the time being. I don't think the second molars typically come in for a while now right? 


jelr- have fun with your friends when they come! That's the hardest time when dieting. When a group of people get together and food is around. I know my friends just eat whatever they want so it's VERY hard to keep myself in control in that type of situation. I'm worried bc I go back home in July to visit and everything usually revolves around food when we are home. Giant family breakfasts, going out for dinner, etc. Not good when I've worked so hard to lose it. So I am hoping my DH can help motivate me to be good or slap my hand full of food away from my mouth. :rofl: As for weighing in, I still weigh in every morning. I've been trying my best to not let it get to me when I gain but my logic is that how would I know if I'm gaining that week and need to cut back more? :lol:


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## cleckner04

ooo crossed posts there. 

Spidey- your hair is amazing!! Man, I wouldn't cut it at all if I was you. Let that grow long and crazy. :lol: Just dye it a fun color or something. Red is nice I hear. :winkwink: I don't really know how Emma will respond. I have movies of him saying good morning to her and than one saying goodnight to her. And every time I play it for her, she gets a shy grin and kind of hides against me while watching it. But I think she knows somewhat who he is. I'm hoping that she just warms up quickly and it won't be a hard transition. She won't really have a choice because he'll be sleeping in our bed that night. :lol: As for AF, I am actually cutting it really close to me ovulating when he comes home I think. I should ovulate tomorrow so if my luteal phase is finally longer this month, than he would be coming home in perfect timing for me to ovulate next month. :thumbup: If my luteal phase is shorter, he'll be home like literally the day of ovulation so not much chances there for actually getting pregnant next month. :dohh:


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## spidey

Kira has all of her 1st molars (3 of which have completely grown in) and tiny points from 2 of her canines. So she has 2 more canines to go.

Cleckner- fingers crossed for you that you can get knocked up next month!!!! My life is so boring that I'm really looking forward to you having :sex: and peeing on sticks :haha: I was reading a little bit about luteal phases and it said that progesterone cream can help lengthen it. Is progesterone our problem, or is prolactin our problem, or does prolactin cause progesterone to be low? I need to read more because I'm so confused about the whole thing. If you ovulate the day that Corey arrives, put a video on for Emma and then lock yourselves in the bathroom for a quickie! :haha: Then report back here and tell us :rofl:


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## cleckner04

:rofl::rofl: 

That top I like is from fredericks of hollywood and I've been eyeing sexy lingerie on there too. I might have to make a purchase on our next payday. :muaha: I already have a lot of lingerie but it's always good to have more. And I should probably buy new panties that don't look like parachutes. :rofl: 


I've read progesterone is the problem too. But I didn't know whether those creams are safe. I thought about buying some. They sell it online. But it just seems sketchy. If you figure out exactly what we'd need, let me know and I'll try it. You have a much more scientific mind than I do and I just don't understand some of the stuff I read about the body chemicals, etc.. :dohh:


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## cleckner04

I'm pretty darn sure my CBFM missed my ovulation this month. I'm having thick CM and I was getting crampy last night. I also gained a lb. overnight which is another sign of ovulation. But my monitor still only says 'high' not 'peak'. :( I've had 5 days of highs now and no peak. So I think it missed it somehow. 

Can we get all the signs and symptoms of ovulation and still not actually ovulate?


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## morri

I think so, sometimes you have gear up for it but the egg never actually comes around... (sorry for invading you thread , the Lion Cubs where the first and most prominent group of bumop buddies I saw when I first joined up ^^)(and I am gone again ^^)


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## cleckner04

You can invade all you want. :D 

Hmm I wonder if I'm even gonna ovulate this month than. :( Booo! It really sucks because I still gained my usual pound from it. :dohh:


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## spidey

Hi Morri :wave: 

My guess is you ovulated but the monitor failed to tell you. Maybe the calibration was a little off this month. 

So Cleck, I did some more reading and it does seem that luteal phase defects are from low progesterone. I guess taking vitamin B can help a little since it lowers prolactin levels which in turn could increase progesterone. Even if we did get pregnant with our short luteal phases, it seems like the chance of early miscarriage could be higher since progesterone levels aren't high enough to maintain the pregnancy and the placenta doesn't start making its own progesterone until later. If I went to the doctor, I doubt they would do anything or prescribe progesterone... they would tell me to wean. To me it seems dangerous to self-prescribe progesterone, but I found people on message boards doing it. I guess you would have to keep taking progesterone supplements for the first part of the pregnancy. It seems too risky to me though. Personally, I can't take hormonal birth control since my mom is quick to get blood clots (which have almost killed her a few times) so I was told to avoid them too. My mom actually took clomid to get pregnant with me (at 20 years old after TTC for a year), but she got pregnant with my brother when I was still nursing (no clomid needed). Oh well.. what will be will be. Kira isn't ready to wean so I'm going to keep TTC but I won't be surprised if it doesn't happen anytime soon. I wish I was much younger so time was on my side. I'm only 30, but I do feel limited in the # of babies I can have, especially if they all turn out to be booby monsters. :haha:

I'd love to see some sexy lingerie! If my DH could only be so lucky :rofl:


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## cleckner04

And I have been trying to slightly wean Emma down but today she has had booby more than ever. :dohh: I don't really understand where my urgency is coming from because I'm only 24. But I think the fact that I'm on a deadline of only 5 months to try, makes me feel like time isn't on my side. 

Although I've been thinking a bit about it lately and I think the great thing about a slightly bigger age gap is that the newborn years are spread out more if that makes sense. If I already had another right now, than the baby years would go by faster between the two kids. I don't know if that makes any sense at all. :rofl: I just know people have all of their babies and than they are done. And than they get upset because the 'baby years' are over too quick. So it's one positive point to spreading them out. How many children do you want spidey? I think we will have 3. I used to want 4 but it doesn't seem realistic when you factor in needing a much bigger vehicle, etc. So 3 seems like a nice number. Although if we have a boy next I might just stop at 2. :haha:


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## spidey

I think I know exactly what you're saying Cleckner about the baby years thing. I want 2 kids since I have 2 bedrooms and I like the idea of them having their own rooms. But having 3 might be nice too. I really liked being pregnant (except for 1st trimester) and I loved giving birth. BF has been great, and having time to enjoy Kira at each age has been wonderful. So if I can't get pregnant until Kira is 3 or 4, then I will get to enjoy that all again while Kira will be in preschool and kindergarten. Some days I can see why people say to get the baby years over ASAP, but on average I've really enjoyed these last 2 years. 

I can definitely understand your urgency though since Corey won't be home long. But try to make TTC the lowest priority while he is here so you don't end up too disappointed or frustrated if it doesn't happen.


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## cleckner04

Yeah. That's kind of why I'm glad I'm focused on weight loss right now because if I don't get pregnant I can just keep trying to lose weight instead. I think I also might be moving back home pretty soon. Even if DH makes it and gets to stay in the navy, we've both somewhat agreed that it's pointless for me to be here in california when I could be back home with family and friends. And I could be saving a ton more money if I didn't have this place. Rent here is $1830 a month. :wacko: So I would probably get an apartment back home so I'm not stuck living with other people but we'd still be saving bc rent back home is only $700 at the most. Seems like it'd be a good idea since DH is just leaving for 6.5 months again.


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## spidey

wow, your rent is ridiculous!! Moving back home sounds like a great idea to me too. If Corey isn't laid off (or whatever they're calling it), when will he be done with the Navy? If it's soon, it might be worth buying a place back home since the mortgage shouldn't be much higher than rent. I owe 117k on my house and pay 650/month for the mortgage at 6%. Plus you can get a really low interest rate (around 4%) and claim the interest paid on your taxes and get money back. Being isolated like you are isn't good. Having people nearby who I trust to watch Kira is a VERY important part of my life. When Kira is cranky, seeing one of her Grandmothers is sure to cheer her up, plus I get a much needed break too. Also, when I'm sick it's nice having people willing to entertain Kira as I try to rest.

Now that I'm pretty certain pregnancy isn't in my near future, I'm starting to plan a trip to the ocean this summer! It's a 2 1/2- 3 hour drive from my house but I want to spend the night somewhere and make it a longer vacation rather than a day trip. It's so expensive though, so it might not happen this year. The other option is to drive 2 1/2- 3 hours the other direction to the mountains and do a camping-type trip which would be much cheaper.


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah. I forgot to update a bit on DH's situation. I'm not sure if I told you guys about this list that has 16,000 sailors on it and they are going to review them all and shove people out as much as they can. Well, DH's name was on that list. And he was chosen. :wacko: So if he doesn't make it on this next exam than he will be out in June 2012. The exam is a test you have to take every six months to advance to the next rank. And you can pass it all you want, but that doesn't mean they'll advance you because they only advance a certain percentage of passers. The last test cycle they advanced 0% of passers in my DH's rate. :dohh: Literally no one made it even though a bunch passed. This time around is a 13% chance. Well, if DH can somehow miraculously make it, than his job is safe for now. But if not, than he's out next June. DH is so happy. :roll: But I'm panicking again. I now have 10k saved up and this'll give me a year to save more and I think I could save another 10k in that time. ESPECIALLY if I move back home. The biggest thing I"m scared about is losing our healthcare. Thats the worst part of it for me. Bc right now we don't pay for healthcare at all and I have no clue how much it would be a month. And I'm thinking it would be a bad idea to buy a house now because we really don't know what town or city DH will find a job in. So I think I'll actually end up living with the inlaws until we figure it all out instead of wasting money on rent. And I'm now trying to think of ways I could make money while back home. The only things I've come up with so far is babysitting and cleaning people's houses for them. I want something that I could still have Emma. I know cleaning houses I could put Emma on my back in the carrier and do it all. But obviously babysitting would be a more ideal job bc people would bring the kids to me and I wouldn't be wasting gas driving all over. I'm not so sure if I could do this while living at the inlaws though, but I am trying to make back up plans. :haha: 

So that's my drama of a life. I've been planning a Los Angeles vacation for this year and already saving money for it so I was all upset that we wouldn't be able to go now but DH says there's no way we are giving it up and he even wants to go to hawaii next year in june when he gets out. :rofl: That was our second option for a vacation that we wanted to do while living on this side of the country. So once I save up for this LA trip, I'm gonna start saving for a possible hawaii trip next year. Waste of money? Probably. :rofl: But DH says he wants to go when he's finally 'free' for the first time ever. Because right now he can't do anything without permission. They even have a bedtime on the ship. And they don't let anyone watch TV after 10 pm. :wacko: Did you know he can't even get a tattoo without written permission from the military? :wacko:


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah. Also, my monitor finally peaked yesterday and today. So I am confused about all of my symptoms showing up early for ovulation. But at least it finally peaked. I have a feeling this will be a SUPER short luteal phase this month. :dohh:


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## spidey

oh wow, so its looking pretty certain your DH will be out of a job soon. Private healthcare is expensive, but you can buy cheaper plans that only cover for emergencies and have a high deductible. I wish I remembered how much my plan cost- it was nearly 10 years ago though. DH use to work at home depot part time and I'm pretty certain they offered health care, so places like that might be something to look into. Right now my DH has the best health coverage and benefits and he works for local government. He doesn't make much money, but the benefits make his job worth it... so if Corey could find a job like that it could be really good. Even something like a school janitor would be nice. Whatever happens, I'm sure everything will work out so you can't spend too much time worrying. As long as you have some back up plans, you'll be good.

As for ways to make money.. I've been thinking of this too since I'll be out of work in September. I've thought of babysitting, cleaning houses, tutoring and after school care for older kids. Sometimes I see adds in the paper for people needed to run errands for an older disabled person, which is doable with a toddler. If I think of anything else I'll let you know :thumbup: 

Thats bizarre you ovulated later than you expected based on symptoms. It'll be interesting to see how long your luteal phase is. Are you taking a higher dose of vit. B this month?


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## Shiv

hmm so still not certain about Corey's future in the Navy then? Does he really want to stay in? I like the idea that you will get to move nearer home regardless of what happens. The rent where you live is crazy, let me just go convert that to pounds..............about £1150. Similar to ours and completely outrageous! You would be able to save a bomb back home!

I think it's great that you are still going on holidays, you need these things planned to keep your chin up, and I am SOOOOOOoo jealous of you going to Hawaii. I went to LA a couple of years ago but only for a few days passing through on my way to the South pacific.

Ok so if you could go ANYWHERE on holiday for 2 weeks (just one place though - no round the world trips allowed!) no expense spared, no worries about flying with baby etc - where would you go? I am going to go away and think about it and get back to you!


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## cleckner04

Well the hawaii trip is more of a dream right now. :haha: It depends on our situation at the time I guess. But I am definitely up for saving for it and if it doesn't work out than we'll use the money for something more local next year. I think that is the one thing I refuse to give up. I want to at least have one nice family vacation every year. Even if it's a week of camping or something. Niagara falls is fairly close to back home and I've never been there either so that could be a possibility if Hawaii falls through. I just never got to go anywhere as a kid and I'm making up for it now. :lol: 

If I could go one place with no worries about costs. I think it'd be australia. The entire country of australia. Does that count or does it have to be a specific city? :lol: I was originally going to choose italy but I am absolutely scared of countries that I can't speak the language. My SIL and BIL went to paris on their honeymoon and I don't understand how they managed it without being able to speak french. When I think about it, it just makes me nervous. Obviously people there must speak english and people do it all the time taking trips to those places. Some day I might get brave enough to go. I know it's easier for you UK girls to visit mainland europe and I'm WAY jealous of that. It seems like you ladies pop over to paris like it's nothing. But that'd be the biggest vacation we've ever taken if we ever went. :blush:


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## Shiv

Australia counts!

Pretty much everywhere you go in Europe, people will speak enough English for you to be understood. i always try and speak a little bitof "guide book" whatever language when I go as I think they appreciate you trying to speak their language even if you sound ridiculous!

I LOVE italy, mainly because of the food and wine :haha: it is also ridiculously pretty in places. You are right I take for granted being able to take a holiday to a different european of choice each year and it only being a 4 hour flight max. Although I haven't been out of England since I fell pregnant with Sophia. I shall start being more appreciative of that :thumbup:

Although i think you are lucky too, America has so many different terrains, you can hit the beach, mountains, lakes, forest etc all in one (albeit massive) country! I have only ever been to LA in North America, but my parents used to visit florida regularly (not the theme parks though) and loved it.

I am still workign on my holiday of choice. I am very lucky in that I am (i think) pretty well travelled, as I did a little bit of travelling when i finished uni and have been on some amazing holidays............still plenty of the world to see though! I think my major travelling days are behind me now until Sophia is older and we can hopefully afford to go somewhere exotic again!


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## spidey

I seriously cannot think of a place that I want to go, but I know what I want so I would have to meet with a travel expert before booking my dream vacation :haha: For 2 weeks I don't want to see anyone else, so it has to be in the middle of nowhere. A nice clear lake for fishing, lots of trees and no mosquitoes. I would love to see birds that I don't see around here, so a place with different kinds of birds and wildlife would be ideal. :thumbup:

I'm not well traveled at all. Once I drove to Florida, but besides that I've only been to the neighboring states (which are all within a 3 hour drive).


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## cleckner04

spidey I'm not well traveled either. I think that's why vacations are so important to me now. My dad used to always say he'd take us on a vacation and than we never went. We once went down to florida bc my great grandma died and my parents had to clean out her apartment. So we spent almost the entire time at the apartment and one day at disney world. And I dont even remember it because I was 4. :wacko: So I would be the kid in school that during every spring break I didn't get to go anywhere and all of my friends would come back talking about all the cool places they went. :dohh: 

But than I married DH and he was in the navy and it was so exciting just moving to Virginia. :haha:



I notice in the UK overall, they take far more vacations than US people. I've seen some take several 'holidays' a year and there is no way we could do that. One is all we could afford.


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## Shiv

I don't think its the norm to take more than one vacation a year. We take one holiday a year for a week (this has been in England for the last 3 years though) - we might have a couple of long weekends away but again in England.

I have been considering my dream trip and I have it down to few places, I quite fancy madagascar, to see all the cool animals. Or maybe Brazil, combine seeing the carnival with some beach and rainforest/ amazon action.

Or maybe far east, Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia etc. Mainly for the food! I have been To Thailand and it was great.

But lets face it, unitil I pluck up the courage to fly with kids then it will be holidays in England for a while! Luckily England has some truly beautiful places, just a shame you can't guarantee the weather :winkwink:


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## cleckner04

I seems like girls on here take a million vacations though. And to really cool places like Greece and Spain. I love acting like a total tourist when I go places. Like disney world I made DH wear a mickey shirt on the last day and I wore a minnie shirt. :rofl: Which I would never be caught dead wearing that shirt anywhere else but around the house. But it was hilarious that day. 


So DH didn't make it so he's out in june! I'm actually incredibly excited. I got up at 5 am this morning because that's when they put out the list of who made it. And the entire time my stomach was churning and I had to poop a few times. :rofl: But once I saw his name wasn't on the list, the stomach issues went away. And I feel kind of free now. Like I will finally have my husband home like a normal family and my daughter won't have to move around her entire life. It's so great! We are going to see about DH joining the army reserves now instead so hopefully we can get healthcare through that. That's my biggest worry at the moment. It's freaking RIDICULOUS that we have to worry about that in this country. Everyone should get healthcare I think. I know if I were to get pregnant I would qualify for medicare but I honestly don't want to do that. I have way too much pride. I refuse to go on WIC or anything like that either unless we absolutely cannot afford to live.

Edit to add: In the reserves he would just be gone one weekend a month. So that would be great in order to get healthcare and plus a small paycheck on top of that. I'm not sure if they'll take him though after this. :shrug: But we are definitely going to look into it.


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## Shiv

Cleck- I am REALLY happy that you are going to get to be a regular family all living together! So now you can start house hunting for real!

It does absolutely suck that you don't get free health care in the U.S.

See Greece and Spain are the cheapy holidays to Europe from England. I am not slating them, that is where we go on holiday when we go abroad, I love Greece. But they are the cheapest places to go especially as a family. It is often cheaper to go to Spain for a weeks holiday than it is to go somewhere in England!


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## spidey

woohoo Cleckner!! :happydance: Is it THIS June or next??? I would have been taking tons of poop breaks too :rofl:

Don't get me started on the US not having national healthcare :evil: My Dad has worked a labor intensive low paid job his entire life, and he has never had healthcare thru his employer. My family never got proper healthcare and visits to the doctor only happened once a sickness was at it's worse. In my early 20's I went without healthcare since I couldn't afford it since I was making minimum wage. Having any sort of health care is better than none... I don't understand why people in this country are so against it. I hope Corey can get a spot in the reserves. I'll check with DH when he gets home, but I think the volunteer firemen where I live get health coverage... 

At my work the people who came from Europe are always complaining about the lack of vacation days :haha: We get 10 days of vacation each year.

My dad always got 1 week off in the summer and 1 week off at x-mas. During that summer week we always did some sort of vacation. Sometimes we went to the ocean, sometimes to an amusement park nearby. Some years we did day trips, like to the bowling ally and mini-golf. I always looked forward to my Dad's week off as a kid. Thats too bad Cleckner that your dad made promises he didn't keep... I would have been sooo mad!


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## Shiv

10 days? that is rubbish - do you have any public holidays (independance day, thanksgiving) on top of that?

in my old job I used to get 26.5 days holiday and then we get about another 7 days public holiday on top of that! Of course now every day is a holiday (or no day is ever a holiday depending on which way you look at it!)


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## morri

hehe I have been to lots of european countries :). But as mentioned there are a lot places (really only norway and englnad) that are more expensive that at home ^^


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## spidey

we have 10 public holidays at my work. 

DH's job is one of the best around when it comes to benefits. The citizens of this county (he works for county government) actually hate the county government workers because they are so jealous! He get 20 vacation days (after 3 years of service), 15 public holidays, and 13 sick days! I think all jobs should be like that because it makes for a happy employee. He's been on furlough the past 2 years too, so on top of that, he gets 13 days unpaid leave. So he's seriously NEVER at work :haha: There's no way he could work another job now because he's spoiled by his days off.

My Dad's job has always been 10 vacation days, no sick days, and 10 public holidays. Atleast at my job I get some sick days if I need them. I think 10 days of vacation is pretty standard around here.


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## cleckner04

Yeah for us to go to greece or spain that would be a HUGE deal. :haha: 

It's going to suck because DH gets 24 days of leave(vacation) a year and now it'll only be like 10 days probably. But we usually used most of his leave to go back home to visit anyways so not really THAT big of a deal. :haha: 

It'll be June 2012 that he gets out. So we have a year to save up more money! 

And it did suck having my dad make promises like that. He is VERY hard to talk into doing things. When he takes vacation days, he naps all day or plays around on his computers. (He's a total computer nerd) I am SO glad I married someone that is the complete opposite. Because Corey and I will randomly just hop in the car and go discover new places. But I feel bad for my mom because she wants to see places and my dad has no interest in it. They drove across the country to visit us for Emma's birthday last year. And they stopped in las vegas for a night or two. Well, DH and I went to vegas in 2007 and we had a blast. So I tried telling my parents all of the places they could go while there since they only had a limited amount of time. My mom wanted to see it all. Well they barely left the hotel. They stayed in the same hotel/casino that corey and I stayed in because they wanted to see where we were. My dad is sentimental like that. But they only walked a few blocks before coming back and I guess my dad wouldn't let my mom go into any of the casinos even though she wanted to go in and explore. :wacko: If it were ME, I would've went in anyways and would've told my husband to fuck off. :rofl: But Corey and I both want to explore stuff so we always have amazing times on our vacations. I try to fit in as much as I possibly can when we go places. I know by the end of the vegas vacation our legs felt like they were gonna fall off because we walked the entire strip and into each and every one of the casinos. :haha:


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah, corey never gets sick days right now either. He has had food poisoning and he still had to go into work that day. :wacko: He couldn't even waste a vacation day because you have to submit paperwork to even take vacations. And it has to get approved up the chain of command. So no way to take off a day with short notice. He is a modern day slave. That's what we call it. Because he has no freedom and they can call him in at any time and he has to go. It's really no wonder my DH is so freaking happy right now.


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## Kimberly28

Hi everyone.

Cleck, he has 2 of his 2nd molars now. Still waiting on the last two. But prolly soon.
So glad to hear about your DH cleck! :) Honestly though Army Reserves is shipping their reserves out like normal army. The best hope of non deployment is for him to go Air Force Reserves. And you still get he TRICARE medical with them too. Not to mention base privileges, BX access, etc. Honestly, the Air Force Reserves has the lowest rate of deployment and that would keep him home with you guys. Not to mention there are AF bases ALL OVER the USA. Please have him research that instead. I think that would be a better match for him and your family. 

Hmmm if I could go anywhere... if I had childcare all lined up and such I'd go to BORA BORA!! I've always wanted to go there! It looks like such an awesome exotic paradise. :winkwink: And if hubby behaves I'd drag him with me! LOL!!! :haha:


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## cleckner04

It really all depends on high year tenure for each branch to decide which he would choose. DH is at his high year tenure right now in the navy. He's an E-4 with a little over 8 years in right now. So we need something with like 10-12 years for HYT at E-4 so he can make rank. The navy is really hard to advance and I hear the army is easy as heck to advance so that's one reason I thought army would be good. We don't really mind if he has to be deployed. At least we'd be getting active duty pay through it. But we will definitely scout our options before he signs anything.


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## Shiv

I didn't understand any of that :haha:

Kim - I have been to Samoa (western not American) and the Cook Islands, which can't be too far from Bora Bora (in the grand scheme of things!) Very romantic and tropical - would be a shame to not take hubby :winkwink:

If I was to recommend anywhere to go that i have been I would say New Zealand. I loved it there, really laid back but much more beautiful than Australia. I'd love to go back but i feel there are new places to be discovered!


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## cleckner04

I have read amazing things about new zealand as a country. I guess they are really family friendly? The most exotic place we've ever been is the bahamas. It was dirty but that was part of the charm. :lol:


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## Shiv

bahamas is pretty damn exotic!

New Zealand is really family friendly. I quite fancy renting a big motorhome thing and travelling around for a month or so with the kids, what an experience that would be!


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## cleckner04

You know you just gave me the idea to buy a motorhome while we are home while DH goes to school and we can live in that instead of paying $700 a month in rent. :rofl::rofl: I bet DH would LOVE that. (I'd probably go crazy)


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## Kimberly28

Either Bora Bora or NZ or Australia. I GOTTA visit AU Zoo someday. :winkwink:


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## spidey

haha, a motorhome. You could really drive yourself crazy and get a little house boat if there's a creek nearby. 

I have a co-worker who goes to New Zealand almost every year so I always get to see tons of pictures. It looks like a beautiful place to visit :thumbup:

Cleckner- If I were your mom, I would be off exploring on my own too! I'm sure she could get a girlfriend to travel with her and leave your fuddy duddy father at home :haha:


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## Shiv

Thats exactly what your mum should do Cleck. Get a friend (or even you and Emma) and go exploring leaving your Dad at home to play on his computer.

Well it is 2.42am and this is the first night I have had to get up because I just can't get back to sleep. I remember when I was pregnant with Sophia I used to come downstairs about this time for an hour or so and watch tv. It wasn't this early on in the pregnancy though!


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## spidey

get back to bed!!! :haha: I use to have middle of the night adventures when I was pregnant with Kira. I hope Sophia lets you get an afternoon nap.

DH stood me up again!! :rofl: We had another date planned- and since AF is gone, this one involved more than popcorn and cream soda :blush: It's a good thing I'm not ovulating! I have an early wake up tomorrow so I better get to bed too and join the rest of the family...


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## cleckner04

LOL @ your Dh missing another date. Poor guy is sleepy. :haha:


I forgot to update you ladies on my weightloss too. I've been a little preoccupied with other things but I have started working out again this week. I wasn't doing good with motivation last week so I am forcing myself to get back into it now. I started watching the biggest loser while I workout and it actually really helps me stay motivated to see them do it. But I'm down to 195.8! I gained from ovulation last week so I didn't count Friday as an official weigh in but the weight started moving again so I added it as an official loss now because I don't think it'll go back up. Hopefully I can lose a bit more before this friday. :yipee:

Edit to add: I'm no longer obese either. I'm now officially overweight instead. :rofl::rofl:


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## Shiv

Congratulations Cleck on being Overweight :haha: But seriously you are an inspiration! When can we have another photo?


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## cleckner04

:rofl: I never thought I'd actually be excited about being overweight. :lol: I'll take my next picture at 190 lbs so still a few weeks probably. I'm really going to work hard at it though so hopefully not TOO long and I'll be able to take another. I never thought I would even meet my 200 goal before DH came back but now it looks like I'm even gonna meet my 195 goal before he's back. It's a good feeling! Hopefully I can keep losing as much as possible and than get knocked up. :haha:


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## spidey

:happydance: wooohooo!! That is some great weight loss :thumbup: You should be really proud of yourself! I can't wait to see another picture!

DH is a sleepy man. He stays up till midnight or 12:30am most nights and wakes up at 5:45, unless it's Monday or Wednesday and then he "sleeps in" until 6:30! He needs to stop since it's not safe to be so sleepy.


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## cleckner04

Sleeps in till 6:30. :haha: I am one very pissed off woman if I have to wake up that early. My mom HATED me back when I was in school because I would be a total bitch every morning when she'd try to wake me up. :blush:


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## spidey

I guess to be fair, DH does get to sleep in more on the weekends- till 7:30. But this past weekend Kira woke up at 6am Saturday and 6:30 Sunday. Usually she wakes up at 7:30 exactly. Luckily I'm more of a morning person so waking up super early for high school only made me a little grumpy. HS started at 7:10am here- soooo painfully early!


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## cleckner04

Yikes!! What time did your school end in the day? Ours started at 8:01 am. And ended at 3:01 pm. I have no idea why they did the :01 part but that's how it seriously was. :rofl:


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## Shiv

My school ran from 9 - 4pm I can't imagine having to be in school at 7am :wacko:

I just did my first and only bit of packing. I packed all the foodstuffs that we are taking with us. i chucked lots of stuff but we still had 2 boxes full, one pretty much full of herbs and spices that I ahev built up over time and didn't want to chuck out. Luckily the removal men are packing up everything for us, I just didn't trust them to pack the food and not end up with flour and sugar everywhere!

So tonight is my penultimate night in the house! Still not actuallu thinking about the emotional aspect of it - DENIAL is my friend :haha: We move out of this house on Thursday and then move into the new house on Saturday (the removal firm we're booked on friday so couldn't move us then0 so we are staying with my parents on Thursday and Friday night. I think that is going ot be the worst bit, I know my mum is really upset about us moving, but is putting a brave face on it! 

My best friend and I were supposed to meet for farewell lunch tomorrow, but we decided not to, and are just gonna arrange a date when we will see eachother next instead.

We went out for our leaving night on Saturday. it was a great night. We went out for dinner and then to a casino. I ended up stayign out until it got light 9i have never done that sober before). I could seriously become addicted to gambling, I won £110 on blackjack :happydance:. I told everyone before the night not to mention us moving as I would get upset and everyone stuck to that, so much so that it took a few people giving me ridiculously big hugs on saying goodbye to realise why they were being so weird! But I just carried on with my denial, said "see you soon" and left it at that. I was quite proud of myself!

Anyway, that is all from me, rambled on as usual!


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## spidey

ooo.. I was wrong. DH says it started at 7:17, but the 1st bell rang at 7:10. :haha: School was over at 2:05, which was really nice since there was still plenty of afternoon left to have fun. For a long time they were trying to get high school to start later since kids can't think straight that early in the morning, but for whatever reason they haven't changed it yet.

Thats crazy it started at exactly 8:01 :haha: I wonder who made up that start time.


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## cleckner04

Aww Shiv. :hugs: I'm glad you had a good night out and lucky you winning all that money!!! Send some my way will ya? :winkwink: I truly think in the end, it will take a few days to a week of coming to terms with the move and crying it out and you will feel much better for it. You have the most important things you need close to you and thats your DH and Sophia. :hugs::hugs: 


Spidey- Well, 7:17 is a pretty random number too. :rofl: I would've much preferred waking up later in the morning and going to school later in the day. I never ate breakfast as a kid because there was just never time. I lived in the country and had to ride the bus for a few hours in the morning too so we usually woke up around 5:45 to 6. Although that number got later and later once my brother started driving us to school and than even worse once I started driving myself. I drive a really slow four cylinder jeep wrangler but I could seriously get that thing moving on the back roads into school. :rofl::rofl:


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## spidey

haha, we posted at the same time Shiv. Good luck for the next couple of days and I hope your denial can shift right to acceptance and some happiness too :hugs: Congrats on your gambling wins :thumbup: They're building a casino 10 minutes from my house so I'll get to gamble for the 1st time very soon.. but I'll probably lose money :haha:

Cleck- taking a bus for a couple of hours :shock: I'm a suburbs girl so my bus ride was only 10-15 minutes.. or 5 minutes by car. We live right next to the elementary and middle school so Kira won't have to ride a bus until she enters high school.


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## jelr

Just a quick run in but I have been reading.

Cleck: Wooo Hooo on being overweight :haha: - that is fantastic well done to you and also I never thought I would be saying this but congrats on DH losing his job :haha: - I'm so happy for you guys to be together as a family and to get to move home to your family and friends. :dance:

Shiv: :hugs: - I really hope the move goes well and that it is not too emotional in the next few days, so glad your night went well. Fair play to you staying out till morning stone cold sober, I have never managed to stay up that long either apart from being in labour :haha: 

Spidey: lol at your DH falling asleep again and standing you, I think I would definitely fall asleep too if I was up at 5.45 :haha: - Getting up at 7.30 is a struggle for me when I'm working. I'm so happy Natasha likes her sleep like her mammy and sleep until 9 or 9.30:sleep:

Things a bit hectic here with DH properly back to work and I'm up to my eyes now for the the month until the holidays to get everything finished off - but I'm still reading and thinking of you girls. Xx


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## Shiv

Hi everyone - it's gone quiet in here, I hope it is because you have all been having lots of fun!

jelr - do you get 6 weeks off over summer? If you do then just keep that time in mind as you work your arse off this next month!

Cleck - how was your weigh in yesterday? Photo yet? Are you still looking for houses? Also i have no idea where you are in your cycle, has your luteal phase improved any on the higher dose B-vits?

Spidey - gambling is lots of fun. My only advice is to go there with an amount you are happy to lose and have fun. If you lose it all then it doesn't matter and if you win then it is an added bonus! I have to be careful and only go to teh casino once in a blue moon (I hadn't been for 3 years when I went last week) as I can easily see that I could get addicted :haha:

Well we moved in to the new house today. We were up at 6am to drive here. The removal men got everything in by 1pm and so far we have managed to unpack the whole of the downstairs and make our bed! So I am quite pleased with our progress, although upstairs is still full to the brim with boxes! Sophia is with myparents until Monday (when they will bring her over) so hopefully we can get he upstairs done. Our main problem is that we have moved from a house with built in wardrobes to one without, so we have no hanging space for our clothes, and we have a LOT of clothes between us. SO we need to go and buy some cheap wardrobs tomorrow!

Pretty exhausted now, so an early night and a bit of a lie in tomorrow. I am sleping really badly now, up once in the night to pee, and the heartburn has kicked in big time (so early, I have another 18 weeks of it!), so I want to prop myself up in bed, but then i think i should be lying on my left side, so just end up in some sort of uncomfortable compromise :haha:

I hope you are all having a great weekend. CLeck I just remember I saw a fb update saying you were picking up a friend from the airport, so i hope you having fun. Also it can't be long until Corey is home :happydance:


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## spidey

Shiv- That is impressive that you even made your bed! If you keep at this rate, you'll have the whole house done by the time Sophia sees it. Did you sleep good on your 1st night in the new house? Is the bathroom close to the bedroom for those middle of the night pees? When does DH start at his new job? I can't imagine not having closets! I have soooo much crap stuffed into my closet and would have some serious downsizing to do if I didn't have them.

It's memorial day weekend here so DH has been off work since Friday and he'll be going back Wednesday. We have a BBQ with the MIL on Sunday and Kira has a playdate/BBQ lunch Monday. It's been HOT here this past week so Kira has been playing in her pool and running thru the sprinklers. Besides that, not much else is going on and my nips aren't telling me anything either :haha: 

Jelr- :hi: 

I hope everyone else is having a good weekend!


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## Shiv

Glad you are having a good weekend Spidey, sounds like Kira is having fun, the weather has been rubbish here the last few days, rain, wind and cloud, although I am glad it isn't too hot as we can't open windows or doors because we need to keep our cat in for a few weeks before he can be allowed to roam.

Well today we have pretty much unpacked upstairs, we are going out after lunch to buy some clothes rails and then we should be pretty much sorted (except for all the boxes we shoved straight in the garage and loft, but we won't count them :haha:)

I slept really well last night (for me!), no pee trip needed, and my heartburn didn't bother me too much. I think i was just exhasuted so would've slept wherever I fell!

What does memorial day commemorate Spidey?


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## spidey

Memorial day is for the soldiers who died in war and people usually have a BBQ and spend time outside. It's also the 1st weekend that public pools are open (memorial day to labor day). Since I'm close to the ocean, around here everyone heads to the ocean for the 1st weekend at the beach. 

Shiv- I saw on FB that you're done unpacking which is so impressive. How did Sophia like her new house? How are you feeling about the whole thing now?

It's been balls ass hot here so our BBQ's have been bringing me to the brink of heat stroke :haha:


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## Shiv

It's good that you get a national holiday for that Spidey. We have remembrance day here, but no day off for it!

Sophia got dropped off with us and she has settled in straight away, made a tip of the place with her toys within 10 mins of being here! She seems a bit unsettled in her new room tonight though, keeps waking up and screaming then (luckily) going back to sleep!. The plan is to get her used to her new room, then introduce a pillow and duvet (instead of sleeping bag), then take the side off of the cot, then eventually move her into the bigger bedroom once we have brought the double bed etc.

As for me, is it posible I am still in denial? No tears, no nothing. I like the new house (shame we don't own it :dohh:) but I don't think it will really hit me until David goes to work on Wednesday, leaving me and Sophia in a town we don't know. I am like, what are we gonna do with ourselves? 

Still we shall see, I think I just need to make some plans, like one day go to the park, another day find some ducks to feed, find a softplay area that sort of thing.........need to do some googling!

It has beed raining here all day!


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## jelr

Shiv: if I ever move house again - I am sending over for you and hiring you :haha: - how did you do all that in a week. All packing and unpacking done. Fair play to you. I can remember packing up stuff for weeks when we moved here and we dont have half the stuff we have now.

Remember Natasha did that screaming in her sleep the first night we changed to a duvet so I think they just really feel change, but it only lasted the night and she was completely settled into it as if she had always had it after 2 nights, so I reckon my Wednesday night she will be as iff you were always there. it will actually be like a whole new adventure for her to explore a new house.

I think that is a brilliant idea to keep busy when David goes back to work, spend loads of time exploring and hopefully that will make it easier :hugs:

Spidey: I would love some of that heat, we have had rain and cloud and it has been really really windy - some of the days are sunny but because we live next to the sea, we can't even bring Natasha out in the garden as she would be blown over. We really have had awful weather for May. I'm think positive though and hoping that the good weather is waiting for me to be finished work for the summer :haha:

Cleck: I hope you are having a great time with your friend and her baby. - Hope the weight is going well and you are definitely on the countdown to Corey coming home.

Poor Natasha woke up crying yesterday morning and we could not settle her at all, she wouldn't even have any breakfast and didn't eat much lunch either. She has had a touch of a runny nose this week so I thought maybe she was coming down with something so all three of us spent the morning in our bed watching care bears and she perked up a bit and is right as rain today so I have no idea what it was all about as it is really out of character for her to be off her food.

On the weight loss - I have lost 4lbs this week :dance: so I'm delighted with that. I had a really rough week the week before last and was almost bordering on depression I was so low and I have no idea why, but I think it may have been hormonal because it has passed now and was right around when I should Ov. Only 2 weeks now until my appointment and I think I'm going to ask them is there anything for pmt, because it is worse it is getting. So between the hormones going back to normal and my weightloss and the holidays getting nearer I'm feeling really good this week and although I know work is getting crazier, I can see the finish line for being off :happydance:


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## Shiv

jelr - well done on the weight loss, ho wmuch more would you like to lose? Also glad you are feeling less hormonal.

As for us packing and unpacking in a week. We paid someone to pack up for us! It cost us an extra £260 to have the removal men come in on the mornign of the move and pack up for us. We didn't do anything, they took stuff from the cupboards and wardrobes etc. It was amazing and for the money I would definitely recommend it :thumbup:

We did do the unpacking ourselves though!


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## spidey

Shiv, I don't think you're in denial anymore. Perhaps your denial stopped after that night where you cried and DH called you weird :haha: It should be fun exploring the town and finding playgrounds and parks :thumbup: 

jelr- I hope Natasha is feeling better today. That's cute that you all stayed in bed and watched care bears.

I would love some rain for my garden- it is sooo hot again and will be this way the rest of the summer so I better stop complaining and get used to it! We bought a gazebo tent with mosquito netting so Kira can play in her sandbox and pool and not be swarmed by mosquitoes or be baked by the sun. I'll take pictures later!

With my impending job loss I'm starting to think about ways to make mom friends. At the park last week there was a mom and dad with twin 2 year olds and we actually chatted for a minute (normally I don't talk to anyone because I'm so shy!). The kids seemed to like each other, but I have no idea if it's okay to say "hey, you guys should come to my house" or something like that. What should I say? Has anyone done this yet, and what did you say? I have a few mom friends at work who I'll keep in contact with as long as they stay in the area, but it might be nice to have more friends for Kira and people I can chat with too! I know Cleckner had that awful playgroup experience, so part of me is afraid of trying to join an already established playgroup.


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## cleckner04

Hey girls! :wave: I've been around just being quiet. My friend left saturday and since than I think I'm kind of depressed. 1)Because I'm all alone again after having a house full of kids and a friend to chat with. 2)Because everyone in the freaking world keeps announcing they are pregnant. I swear half of my friends list on facebook is hidden because it's all constant pregnancy updates. :( No offense to you pregnant ones bc I love hearing updates on here but on facebook I just don't expect if IYKWIM so when I sign in on mornings and get hit with a million pregnancy related things, it's upsetting. Especially because two of my friends on there are accidentally pregnant and aren't even with the dads. :dohh: 3) My period started and my luteal phase was only 8 days this month. I had increased my B-complex vitamins and it made no difference. So I guess I'll have to deal with the jealousy about pregnant people for a really long time still with DH deploying again in November. Because obviously I won't be getting pregnant yet. 4)I gained 3 lbs while my friend was here. It's my own fault because I have a hard time saying no when it comes to food. She's a candyaholic and is constantly eating sweets. We even made a stop at an ice cream shop and I had a brownie sundae. It was so good but so not worth it. It's amazing how fast I can put the lbs on though. :( .... And that's all. I don't feel like getting out of bed lately, let alone clean my house and actually do anything with Emma. Seriously I don't know what my deal is but I just want Corey home now and I think I need to ban the internet from my life if I don't get pregnant quickly. :lol: Poor Emma keeps saying 'walk' and pointing to the front door. She wants to go out and I just don't feel like it. I don't want to even get dressed to get the mail, and she wants to walk. I've managed to distract her with baths each time. She loves taking baths. :haha:


Okay..Enough about myself and being depressing.

Shiv- It is seriously amazing when people come to pack for you. We had that when we moved here and it was SO much easier and less stressful. They packed and shipped it. Than they even would've unpacked the boxes if I wanted them to but I declined because I LOVE unpacking and decorating and all of that. It's like an organizers dream. :haha: I'm glad sophia is adjusted fairly well in the new place! Kids are amazing when it comes to changes like that. I'm glad you like your new place too. :hugs: Hopefully it'll be an amazing experience and you end up loving the area too. 

jelr- Well done on the weight loss!! :dance: Keep it up!! You can't have much more to lose now right? I think you only had a bit to lose in the first place. :dance: Send some of those weightloss vibes to me. I've been kinda stuck all month. I know exactly what you mean about feeling like your bordering on depression. I think I must be too right now. You know it's bad when I don't even feel like signing onto BnB to talk to you guys. :blush: 

spidey- I've mentioned to random people that I chat with at parks that I come there the same time every day. In hopes that they will come back and meet me there again. But so far that hasn't worked out too well. :dohh: I used to take emma every day after lunch to the park. But I got out of the habit of going now. It is really tough to make mommy friends. I was lucky enough to meet a girl from BnB but than she moved away on me. :haha: She's the one that visited this weekend. Do you have a local library near you? My mom is a librarian and they always do 'story hour' where they sit and the librarian reads stories to the kids and than they do crafts. Stuff like that is EXCELLENT for meeting new mommy friends. I plan on taking Emma every week once I move back home. Especially since it's my mom that does the reading. :haha:


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## Shiv

Oh Cleck, I am sorry you are so down, all your reasons are valid, and all piled together i can see why you would feel a bit crappy. HOWEVER, you must be down to less that 2 weeks until Corey back, and that will be SOOO amazing. Maybe you just need this funk to make his return even better. As for everyone being pregnant around you, just remember that they may will be pregnant, but they will never ever have a child as brilliant as Emma :thumbup:
So on to your weight gain - quite frankly 3lbs is nothing compared to how much you have lost, you deserved to have some treats while your friend was here, but now I am afraid it is time to snap out of your funk and get back on that exercise bike. Did you buy that lovley top in the end, just think how good you will look when Corey gets back if you can just lose that 3lbs again. Also I think you will haev more chance of keeping the weight off when corey is back if you get back into the exercise now. You can go for long family walks etc. Ok lecture over, you have come far too far to just slump into a rut :nope:
Just think you can start making plans about returning home to your friends and family, look forward, you will get pregnant again, I bet you had a short luteal phase all along and still conceived with Emma. And until that day comes thank yoru stars that you aren't doing night feeds anymore :haha:
I know you can snap out of this, get yourself back on the bike and it will be hard for a couple of days but the exercise will start releasing endorphins and you will soon feel better :hugs: And please don't ban the internet, I really missed your chatter the last few days :hugs:

Spidey - I can't help with the making mummy friends, I sometimes manage a few words to random people at the park etc, but I always feel that they think i am a weirdo (perhaps they are right). I have no idea how to make friends anymore, it is so much easier when you are little. Cleck's idea of organised events where there is an activity is a good idea as then you can pick and choose who you talk to. We have something here (although i don't know if they have one in my new town) called play gym, which is basically a big room set up with trampolines, and trikes and bouncy castles and soft play etc where you go and just let the kids run about (a bit like a soft play area but a much bigger room that is not always a soft play area, often a gymnastics club for example) - Sophia used to love it. 

I need to try to make new mummy friends as well, I had some where I used ot live because i paid to do some antenatal classes prior to having Sophia with the NCT (national childbirth trust) which is basically where 8 couples form the same area who are expecting their first child, go to some classes together to learn about childbirth, but basically everyone just signs up to make friends. I don't think I can do that this time because I am not a first time mum.

So David starts work tomorrow, I am nervous, my plans for exploring have been put on hold as it is school holiday here so all soft play areas are rammed and all organised classes are off for the week. We did go to the local park today (we can see it from our window) and Sophia was a fan so I guess we will just go there again tomorrow while david is at work.


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## cleckner04

Thanks shiv. :hugs: You are right. I need to just get myself out of this funk. I am doing myfitnesspal again today and tonight I'm going to try to force myself to exercise. And I got up and vacuumed the house which always makes me feel better. :lol: 

About half an hour ago Emma went upstairs which is normal for her but I just continued watching an episode of ally mcbeal. (I know I'm so neglectful) But than she came downstairs and I watched her sit in the middle of the floor with a book in her hand and a crayon in the other hand. I shot off the couch so fast and scrambled to her to get the crayon away. She must've found it upstairs I am always really careful about crayons being put up but this was a little broken piece of a crayon. As I went to put the crayon up in the cupboard, that's when I noticed it all. She scribbled on the following things: The front of the white cupboards, a dining room chair, the front of my glass fish aquarium, the wall beside the fish aquarium, her toy box. This is when I started walking upstairs to see the damage. She also scribbled on the stairway wall, and my mirror in my bedroom. :dohh: The whole time I'm looking around Emma is saying 'oh no! Oh no!'. :rofl::rofl:


Edit to add: The crayons are washable so they wiped right off with water and a towel. :D


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## Shiv

oh no oh no oh no...................hahahahahahahaha bless her! They are little monkies! I am terrified in our rented house, there are new cream carpets throughout (what person puts new creamcarpets in a house they are going to rent!)!


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## cleckner04

Our apartment has cream carpets too. :roll: And Emma spilled strawberry applesauce today on it. :dohh: I plan on renting a rug doctor as soon as DH gets back. :rofl:


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## jelr

Aww Cleck :hugs: - I'm sorry you feel so crappy, but I bet it is mainly to do with having your friend around and now she is gone. I get like that when I have things to look forward to and then they are over. it is a horrible feeling though I know as that is exactly how I felt the week before last, I didn't want to see anyone or talk to them or do anything and I felt so tired and sick that I felt I wasn't interacting with DH or Natasha properly. I even had a bit of a falling out with one of my closest friends - we are friends about 18 years and have not had words since we were back in school and it basically was a total miscommunicaiton as both of us were in bad places that week. In the end I gave myself a kick in the ass and said right you are feeling sorry for yourself for feeling crappy but if you actually got up and started being positive you wouldn't feel s crappy and so far it seems to have worked :haha: - next week or even tomorrow could be a different story :haha: - I do agree with Shiv though that you may have always had a short lutual phase and still got pregnant with Emma - I think I said that to you before so please please put that out of your head because I honestly do think that if you have it in your head that you wont get pregnant, you wont. On my first pregnancy and on Natasha I became pregnant the month before starting clomid and I'm convinced it had a lot to do with not worrying as I was convinced it was going to happen straight away with the clomid so once my mind relaxed my body did too if that makes sense. Just put all the worry's of not becoming pregnant out of your mind and concentrate on DH coming home and you three spending loads of quality time together and planning for moving home and hopefully with all that :sex: you are going to be having without a doubt after not seeing each other, the pregnancy will just happen by itself. :thumpup: So go and buy some ridiculous sexy underwear that is a tiny bit tight and tell yourself you are gonna fit into it before your hubby comes home and that will motivate you to get back on that bike.

Shiv: That is a pain about school holiday tomorrow, I definitely think you should go to the park and didn't you say that the town was near, so maybe have a walk around it and see where everything is, it can be like a little adventure for you and Sophia.

Spidey: Wouldn't it be great if we could send some of our rain to you and you send some of your sun to us so we would have perfect balance :haha: I'm also not good for meeting people either. I would talk for Ireland once I do know people but find getting to know people really hard and am really shy for starting conversation. I also think it because all of my closest friends have been around for years - my oldest friend and I are friends since we were 4 and 5 and the shortest is a friend I made through Jim so that is 10 years. So I kind of feel that I dont get enough time with my own friends that I have for years so I wouldn't try and make more if that makes sense, although I do understand the need for mommy friends as I do see more distance between my friends and I since I had Natasha as I dont seem to have a minute between work and then at the weekends just want to spend as much time as possible with Natasha and DH so maybe if they all had children we could do more stuff together and I could kill two birds with the one stone as now I feel I dont like calling to them as much as it wouldn't be fair to arrive with a toddler with me and she would get bored if I was just chatting to my friend. My oldest friend has a child, but he is going on 12 in July and one of my other friends had 3 children but it is harder for her to cart three of them off to do something with us. One of the others girls is pregnant at the moment but they moved about 3.5 hours away last year so we only see each other a few times a year now. But then I love them all so much I dont want to lose any of them either so I know I still wouldn't make anymore friends even if they were mothers as I would feel I should be making more of an effort with the ones I already have. but then I'm a bit nuts I think :haha:

I definitely think the idea that Cleck had about the story reading or something like that would be a good idea and maybe try the playgroup and see how it goes. Hopefully they are not all meanies like poor cleck got.


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## cleckner04

Thanks jelr. :hugs::hugs: You are totally right about me needing to just relax too. That's how I got pregnant with Emma and the first time. I didn't stress or anything because we had all the time in the world to have a baby. I think this time around it's just stressful because if I don't get pregnant soon, we won't have health insurance anymore to have a baby. And I will probably have a c-section again so that is $18k or more without insurance. :wacko: That's one reason I think I might step away from the internet a bit once DH is back. That way I won't stress myself out by reading other peoples good news. I feel so bad for being so bitter. And I feel guilty for being obsessive some days because it makes it seem like I don't love Emma and just want to replace her with a new baby. I worry too much right? :haha: 

You actually just made me remember that I forgot to tell you guys the juiciest gossip from DH. One of the mean girls in that group. Well her husband is on my husbands ship. And he has been having an affair with a girl from my DH's shop the entire time they've been out to sea. :shock::shock: The wife was pregnant with his second child too and just had him like a month or two ago while this guy is deployed with my DH. My DH went up to the girl in his shop and told her 'you realize he is married with kids right?'. The woman acted like she didn't know. Well a week later they were still seen together so apparently she doesn't care that the guy is married. :nope: And now Dh has heard that the guy is telling everyone that his wife's kids aren't his. I feel SO bad for her even though she was part of the mean girl playgroup. She is completely unaware of all of this. I've also heard that her husband plans on leaving her once he gets back home. DH's ship is going to hawaii for the next port and I guess the girl from his shop and the husband are going to have a little vacation together. :wacko: And DH said they have been getting off together at every port too for this entire deployment. I feel so bad for the wife. I kind of wish I could warn her but it's not my place at all. So I just sit back and get the email updates about it all.


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## cleckner04

Thanks jelr. :hugs::hugs: You are totally right about me needing to just relax too. That's how I got pregnant with Emma and the first time. I didn't stress or anything because we had all the time in the world to have a baby. I think this time around it's just stressful because if I don't get pregnant soon, we won't have health insurance anymore to have a baby. And I will probably have a c-section again so that is $18k or more without insurance. :wacko: That's one reason I think I might step away from the internet a bit once DH is back. That way I won't stress myself out by reading other peoples good news. I feel so bad for being so bitter. And I feel guilty for being obsessive some days because it makes it seem like I don't love Emma and just want to replace her with a new baby. I worry too much right? :haha: 

You actually just made me remember that I forgot to tell you guys the juiciest gossip from DH. One of the mean girls in that group. Well her husband is on my husbands ship. And he has been having an affair with a girl from my DH's shop the entire time they've been out to sea. :shock::shock: The wife was pregnant with his second child too and just had him like a month or two ago while this guy is deployed with my DH. My DH went up to the girl in his shop and told her 'you realize he is married with kids right?'. The woman acted like she didn't know. Well a week later they were still seen together so apparently she doesn't care that the guy is married. :nope: And now Dh has heard that the guy is telling everyone that his wife's kids aren't his. I feel SO bad for her even though she was part of the mean girl playgroup. She is completely unaware of all of this. I've also heard that her husband plans on leaving her once he gets back home. DH's ship is going to hawaii for the next port and I guess the girl from his shop and the husband are going to have a little vacation together. :wacko: And DH said they have been getting off together at every port too for this entire deployment. I feel so bad for the wife. I kind of wish I could warn her but it's not my place at all. So I just sit back and get the email updates about it all.


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## jelr

Yep you do worry too much :haha: - but that is what part of being a mommy is we worry about everything :dohh: - I know exactly where you are coming from too. Some of our family said when we had the mc that well at least you have Natasha and they were so right because the last time I didn't think we would have any children and we have been blessed. But in some senses it made it harder because I knew the love I was losing and how precious and felt my heart would never skip a beat the way it does with Natasha for this baby or I would never hear it laugh or see it smile where as I had never felt the earth shattering love for a child on the first mc. But then when I would think of that I would feel guilty because everyone was saying that I should be so gratful and why was I not and I felt like a terrible mother for feeling such grieve and so bitter for a baby I had never met when I should have been just grateful for the precious one I had and then I actually realised that it is all human nature to have all these feelings and it is human nature that you want another baby because you do love Emma so much and know how precious that love is because of her and want company for her too, so stop beating yourself up it as for becoming obsessive I think all women become obsessive about ttc at some point again I think it is human nature because it is something we can't control and make happen when we want to and I think us woman like to be in control - Well I do anyway but then I'm a control freak :haha:

We will miss you if you are not here, but do what is best for you and if you think stepping away for a while will help do that (athough make sure it is not too long)

Just relax and it will all work out - FX your Dh will get another job with insurance and you wont need to worry about that either, but I honestly do think the more you think positive, the more likely hood it is to happen. Well that is my reckoning on it at this moment in time anyway. I'm having one of those weeks where I'm not letting the world beat me. I AM going to lose these last 8lbs. I AM going to work my ass off and get all my work done as quickly as possible in the next few weeks before my holidays. I IS going to be a glorious summer. DH job IS going to work out. I AM going to quit smoking over the summe and AM going to have another healthy baby. I have been worrying about all this stuff lately and it has really gotten me down and my health has suffered because of the worry and I figure that even if it all doesn't work out we will deal with that too, but me worrying myself into sickness and depression is not going to change it and is only going to make us all suffer the more.

Well I will get off my soap box now :haha: :haha: - wait till you see I will probably be crying over spilled milk or something random tomorrow :haha:

OMG about that womans husband - although I remember saying that to you at the time, that I reckon to be that bitter you have to have some crap going on in your life, so see I am actually right about some things so you have to listen to me now :haha:

You will get through this Cleck and I remember you saying before that the last few weeks before Corey comes home you get very fed up because it seems so near, but not near enough so you are just having a bad few weeks, he will be home soon and all this stuff will hopefully be washed away - You are a great mom and have achieved so much with your weight loss and are so strong being away from family and friends with your DH being away and a small baby so give yourself credit woman - after all that you can acheive anything.

You too Spidey and Shiv - you are going to be fine tomorrow Shiv, you have been so strong with all this move and will do great when David goes back to work and you will find loads of new mommy friends Spidey.

Okay now I'm actually freaking myself out. I'm so hyper today and was so down the past few weeks maybe I'm actually bipolar or something and this is my high :wacko:

Night girls. xx


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## jelr

Oh Shiv do I remember AuntyE going to a class when she was pregnant with Teddy and meeting some parents that were on a second pregnancy or is that just in my head. Maybe check into it and it would be a great way to meet other mothers in the area.


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## Shiv

I want some of whatever jelr has been having :haha:


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## Mary Jo

hey ladies - sorry I've been silent, not very much to say really. (still cross about our flat sale falling through, we haven't found another buyer yet, though there is someone who's interested, so fingers crossed...)

but I do have some good news - 20 week scan today and baby is a boy, and doing perfectly. :D we're really happy that Adam is getting a little brother. I had to go to the scan by myself because Chris woke up and felt ill, and had the runs for the hour before we were due to go. probably for the best as we didn't have to deal with Adam taking the scan room apart. :lol:

anyway, here he is... (baby not Adam)

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/e3330456.jpg

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/aa7e6f20.jpg

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/86c32ac0.jpg


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## spidey

awwww, congrats MJ- he looks perfect. Are you showing much? Soon your boss might notice your growing bump!

Cleck, vacuuming always makes me feel good too :haha: Corey will be here soon and then you'll be super busy :sex: and going new places. And who knows, you might get pregnant too, but if you don't then you'll know it's not meant to be your time. You have plenty of years to have another baby (or 3 or 4!) and having them spaced apart more than 2 years might be a good thing. You'll have a super hot body and make all the sleep deprived frazzled moms with a toddler and newborn at the play ground super jealous! (sorry Shiv and MJ, LOL!) 

Make sure you get private insurance right after your Navy insurance stops since insurance companies can be weird about having a gap in coverage. Private insurance isn't that much money overall and they will cover most of a c-section if you need one, so don't let that depress you. My friend at work who is 27 (I think) is paying $30 a month for private insurance. I have no idea what that covers, but I can ask her more questions if you like. If you know you're going to get pregnant, get a plan with a low deductible so you'll only have to pay 3,000 or 1,500 max. My parents and me (up until 2006) always had to buy private insurance and it covers things just as well as some company paid insurance. Plus give yourself a chance to have a vbac! My birth center birth only cost 3,000 total from my 1st pre-natal appointment to my final post-natal appointment. I ended up as a hospital transfer and by the time Kira was out of the NICU the total cost was 30,000! But insurance covered it all thank god.

So my plan this month is to prove the luteal phase theory wrong and get pregnant! :rofl: I have given up hope of my bfp anytime soon, but I can still be hopeful, right?

Thanks for the suggestions on making mommy friends. The lady with the twins at the park told me what time they're usually there, so I might see them again today since I'll be going to the park for our new weekly picnic. If I see her again I'll get brave and say hi and maybe I'll ask if she stays home with the kids. If so, she might be looking for some mommy friends too. We're starting a weekly tradition of having a Wednesday picnic at the park. I get all the food ready during the day and when DH gets home we load up the car and head to the park. 

This morning I decided to be a weirdo and me and Kira are dressed almost the same :haha: We're both wearing blue plaid shorts and a blue tank top... maybe I'm subconsciously trying to scare away any possible new mommy friends :rofl:


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## jelr

Shiv I also want some of what I was on the other night :haha: - it was short lived because I have a very cranky girl today who doesn't want to eat or do anything really she just wants to scream at me and doesn't know what she wants :( - so the happy me went out the window. I just hope she is not coming down with something because it really is not like her to go off her food and this is the second day this week - Sunday was the same. I just wish when she was like this she could tell me what is wrong or if there is something wrong and she is not just having todder tantrums :dohh: - Although even though I did think it was just tantrums this morning - I honestly think she is either in awful pain or is coming down with something because I brought her into the soft play area this afternoon and she did perk up but was extremely wishy washy looking and was .running a very slight temp (only just very slight at 37.2 which could be from the heat as it was very warm and sticky here today) but she also woke tonight and we ended up taking her up as she was so upset and she just lay for a half hour cuddled into me before falling asleep which is very out of character for her. Dont get me wrong, I loved the cuddling, but much as I would love those cuddles all the time, I don't want her to be sick or in pain to get them the poor love.

MJ: Congrats on the scan and another little baby boy, that is great news that everything went well. You got great pictures. I see on fb too that you have a new buyer - fingers crossed it goes through this time.

Spidey: I hope the lady was at the park today and I'm sure you looked very cute in your matching outfits and now a weirdo :haha:

Shiv: Well how did you get on with David back to work, he was back today wasn't he or did I dream that? I hope it went well and you were okay.

Cleck: if you are reading I hope you are feeling better.


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## spidey

jelr- how is Natasha today? Do you think she has some teeth coming in? I hope whatever it is, it was a one day thing and she's back to her normal happy self today.

We went to the park and we had a really fun picnic, but I didn't see Kira's twin friends or their mom. Our heat wave ended so it was a perfect day and Kira was in a great mood. I told DH my plan and he was keeping an eye on the parking lot for their car :haha: We are such stalkers :lol:

Kira is just starting to attempt to communicate with words. It's so cute! Instead of banging on the closet for me to get out the playdough, she says "dou" and she says "dee dee" when she wants her pacifier. Yesterday she said "egg" because she saw her plastic toy egg and wanted me to make her a real egg to eat. Of course I have no idea what she's saying, but she's being patient with me so I can figure most of it out. And the cutest thing is she shouts "DAAA" when DH is home but she doesn't know where he is. She still doesn't say Mama so DH is feeling extra special :haha:


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## cleckner04

spidey- :haha: at stalking for that woman. I was the same way after I told this one couple that I'm there the same time every day. I kept watching to see if they'd show up and it was such a disappointment when they didn't. :blush: Yay for Kira voicing her wants more!! :dance: 

jelr- Hope Natasha is back to normal now. :hugs: It's awful when they don't feel well. The cuddles must've been pretty nice though. I feel like my mama bear instincts come out more when Emma isn't feeling well. Like I want to do anything I can to make her feel better and I cater to her every whim no matter how random. :haha: 

MJ- He is gorgeous! :cloud9: He has the most perfect little nose. I wonder if he'll look like Adam. 



I'm feeling a bit better now these past few days. I still don't really feel like leaving the house though. Emma keeps going to the door with her little purse and sippy cup saying 'walk! walk!' but I just don't feel like getting around. I'm the type of person that I have to have makeup and hair done and nice clothes on to go outside so that's part of my problem. I wish I could just be relaxed enough to go out in pajamas. :rofl: But I've been cleaning and Emma and I have been playing a lot the past few days. She loves horsey rides on my back and I crawl around on all fours. :rofl: We do it forever and I'll buck her off and she goes flying and she laughs and laughs. She's really a rough child. She loves wrestling too. But anyways...I'm also back on track with my weight I think. I haven't really exercised but I've been really careful with the eating and I'm down to 193.6 now!!! This morning was the 'official' weigh in. So I met my second goal before DH gets back!! I've now completely changed my goal to July 16th which is when we fly to go back home. I hope to be down to 185 by than.


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## Shiv

My god if i had to have make-up, nice clothes and hair done to go out I'd leave the hosue about twice a year :haha:

Glad you are feeling a bit better Cleck, you don't have to go out to have fun with Emma, i am lucky in that Sophia loves just messing around at home. She also loves riding David like a horse, she sings whilst she is doing it "horsey horsey don't you stop, just let your hooves go clippety clop" - well words to that effect and to that tune anyhow! very cute, I need to try to get a video of her singing as she sings lots of songs now!

Well done on your weight loss, your new target sounds achievable and assuming you don't put on loads when you are home (cut yourself some slack and allow yourself a few lbs though :thumbup:) you will only have a few pounds left to lose. So i knwo your original goal was back to pre-preg with Emma weight, is your final goal back to the weight you were before you got pregnant the first time? I am sure you said we could have another photo when you got to 195lbs :winkwink:

Spidey - that is cool that Kira is starting to express herself with words, she'll be chattering away soon enough.

jelr - it sounds like teething to me, I hope Natasha is feeling better soon, those days are so hard :hugs:

As for us, well we haven't done anything very exciting over the last few days whilst David has been at work but Sophia has been enjoying herself. We have been to the park right behind our house a few times, there are these two wooden cars there, they don't move (stuck to the groud) and apart from a steering wheel that turns they don't do anything, but Sophia LOVES them and wakes up most days saying, "go play on cars". We have to walk past the park to get to the town or shop, so I have to go everyday or face a meltdown as we walk past!

It is SO hot here, it seems you sent some of your sunshine this was after all SPidey! We have to keep our cat in for a while so can't open the windows and i am melting!

Any plans for the weekend anyone? Looking at facebook jean you have a fun month ahead of you!


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## jelr

Spidey: Ah its a pity they weren't there, I hope the next day you are there, you meet them again. yay for Kira saying loads of words, she will start now and not stop I bet. Natasha said daddy long before mammy too, you will find though that you will understand her. Natasha says a lot of things that only DH and I understand and nobody else can, mind you she also says a lot that we dont either :haha: You definitely must have sent the sunshine this way as it is roasting here today too, which has been lovely. :thumbup:

Cleck: I'm so glad you are feeling a bit better, I am the very same, I dont leave the house without make up and maybe not always nice clothes but half decent ones and not the scuffy old tracksuits that I wear around the house, except if I'm running over to my mams which is two minutes away and I even keep my head down then in case I meet anyone :haha:. I reckon the postman gets an awful fright when he calls to the door because he is local and is used to seeing me out with a full face of make up and when he calls with a package and I'm at home. - I'm as while as a ghost :haha: and always in an old tracksuit. Although I know you dont feel like going out at the moment, sometimes I find if I'm down putting on my mask (face full of crap :haha:) and going out helps to snap me out of being fed up. I was thinking of you today actually and I really think you are brilliant and I'm not surprised you are down, with living so far from family and friends and not having DH around that has to be tough not having somebody to talk to all the time, DH had to work late tonight and wasn't home until 8 and I really missed him not being here to chat to during dinner. I know I had Natasha here and love spending time with her but it is not like we were having any big conversations (well we did but in toddler conversations :haha:) - Yep you definitely are overdue a picture now. What is your overall goal? Yep I took full advantage and loved the cuddles and then felt guilty that I was getting pleasure when she wasn't well :dohh: - I'm the same when Natasha isn't well, I just down tools and dont care what has to be done around the house and just spend the day doing what she wants. Good job she is never sick or I would live in a tip :haha:

Shiv: Urgh on the having to keep the windows closed in this heat and being pregnant, no wonder you are melting. Isn't the singing so cute, Natasha loves to sing too, she spent one night during the week holding her two hands together and turning around singing ring a ring a rosey, mind you the only words you can hear is posey and tissue tissue lol - It was such a relief that she has found this way of playing it as it makes a change from me playing it with her about 500 times a day :dohh: I know you haven't done much the last few days but how have you found being in a new area with DH back to work? Did you find it easier or harder than you thought it would be?

Well thankfully she is back to herself today and temp is back to normal. Not sure if it is teeth as she only has the 2nd molars left and I managed to get my finger in yesterday with some bongela on it and there is definitely nothing there, although they could be moving up in the gums I guess :shrug:

I think she may also be hitting the fussy eating stage that some toddlers go through, anybody else's LO's doing this. Up until now she has been the best litte eater and eats everyhing - all types of fruit, veg, meat and she loves fish especially salmon or tuna and even sardines. The only thing she has ever refused is lettuce and avocados. But today at lunch I had made her a pitta bread with tuna and in it and some cherry tomatoes and she kept saying no tuna, no sandwich and point blank refused it so I thought it was just because she was still off and not hungry and said okay do you want some brown bread instead so she proceded to eat a brown bap, a slice of ham and 2 satsumas, so it wasn't that she wasn't hungry and yesterday her lunch was homemade veg soup and I did think that maybe she just didn't like the soup as it was the first time I had made it for her but she had some tonight on her potatoes :dohh: - She did refuse her dinner this evening but I just left it there and pottered around the kitchen and said okay if you dont want it don't eat it and after a while she did eat about half of it so I dont know :shrug:

Yep we sure do have loads on this month Shiv, it will be very very busy, we are off to a family fun day out in town tomorrow as it is a bank holiday weekend here and next weekend I'm going shopping on Saturday with my mam and sister for clothes for the wedding, the weekend after we have DH's Nan's 90th birthday, fathers day and our anniversary is a few days after and then the weekend after is my birthday. We are going out for something to eat with friends and some family for my birthday and I moved it to the weekend after my birthday as I didn't want to be leaving Natasha in my mams 2 weekends in a row becasue we have DH's Nans 90th birthday the week before and I will hopefully be completely finished work so can relax, but DH is now insisting that we go for a meal for our anniversay that weekend that we have in between because he says it is not often we do go out and that we need to also make time for us after the year we have had so I have agreed. I do feel guilty that she will be in my mams so much which I know she really loves and it is only to sleep as we wont be going out until she is in bed and we will put her down to bed over there, but still feel bad. It is always the same, we dont go out for months and then everything is on together. We have only been out for three nights I think since Christmas and now we have 3 nights in a row :dohh:

I'm a bit mad over DH's Nan's 90th birthday though as DH's family had all being discussing it and we had agreed that we would go for an early meal around 5 so that all the children could come and we were going to even be there at 4 to get some pictures, as she even has great great gran children. But DH's 2 aunts went ahead and booked it for 8 and have decided that no children under 10 can go and they dont even live over here, they are both in the UK and only see her maybe once in the year. We were saying we felt like saying we couldn't go as we wouldn't have a babysitter, but we decided that wouldn't be fair as it would hurt his nan and it is not her fault.

Well I have lost another 2lbs so I have only 7 left to go, I'm being very bold though and doing it through lipotrim which is total food replacement and only 3 shakes a day. but it was actually the hospital recommended it years ago when I put on loads of weight and tried everything to shift it and didn't success with the pcos. It is monitored by the pharmacy and I do have to say I always have loads of energy on it (hense my hyper and better mood these days :haha:) - I wish I had your motivation and stamina Cleck, but I have no patience and I think it is because when it comes to me losing weight I have no faith in any diet because of trying them all years ago. This one is a quick fix, but for some reason it seems to work for me and I always follow ww to maintain it then bar pregnancy of course. I did it 5 years ago first of all and kept the weight off until I became pregnant and then I did it again after I had Natasha and shifted the bulk of my pregnancy weight and and continued to lose the rest slowly on the low carbs until I became pregnant again this time. I'm only doing it for 3 weeks and then you have a week refeed. I just hope I dont put half of it back on on with all these occasions so I will just have to be extra good during the week.

My perfect 28 cycle didn't happen this month either as AF was due yesterday and is a now show - back to normal I guess :nope: I dont mind so much though as I'm still going to keep positive that we will still conceive quickly. I dont know whether it is from losing some weight or having more energy or knowing my holidays are coming or just because I hit rock bottom two weeks ago, but I really do feel like I have turned a corner and feel back to myself for the first time since the MC. I really hope it is that I have turned a corner and that it is not short lived.

I know you are suffering in this weather Shiv, but I'm am really enjoying it - DH has our haouse so insulated though that the heat doesn't get in when it is hot so it is nice and cool inside and being beside the sea we always have a slight breeze and myself and Natasha had such a lovely day, we went to the playground and then walked to the top of the bank to look at the beach and then we spent the afternoon ou in the garden playing with her toys and on her own swings and slide. :thumbup:

Well I think I have waffled on enough now :haha: - I'm just making up for probably not having a minute between finishing up work and everything else this month :haha:

Have a great weekend everyone. Xx


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## spidey

My nips started tingling and feeling a bit sore today so I peed on an opk and sure enough I got a positive! DH isn't home tonight, but we dtd Thursday night and we should have a chance to go at it again Saturday, so I think that'll give my egg a chance at fertilization. I had to go back and take 2 days off all my luteal phase calculations since I was doing it totally wrong. So the practical side of me says there is no way I can get pregnant right now, but I still have hope that this will be my month!! It would be a February baby if it was 

Cleck, I'm glad you're starting to feel better. Congrats on the weight loss :happydance: I don't think we get to see a picture until 190 though, right?

jelr- I'm glad Natasha is feeling better. She might be having a picky day because she may not feel 100% yet. Kira got sooooo picky with her food during the week that she reacted to the antibiotic. I think the first thing that goes is her appetite when she doesn't feel well. Kira can be difficult with her eating since some days she eats like a pig and on others she barely touches her food. I give her plenty of choices and let her decide whether or not to eat since I can't force her.

Shiv- thats super cute about Sophia and the wooden cars. I would love to see a video of her singing and talking. I think it's the cutest thing when a little toddler can talk.

I'm glad jelr and Shiv are enjoying the hot weather that I sent :haha: It has cooled off here to normal temps and this weekend should be perfect for being outside!


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## cleckner04

Shiv- Aww Sophia sounds so cute! Emma doesn't sing like that. Although, I never sing to her so she wouldn't know words to anything anyways. :blush: Yes, my end goal is the weight I was before my first pregnancy. 180. Which is huge to some of you ladies but I looked quite nice at that size. If I meet that goal, I'll still keep going if I don't get pregnant though. I see no reason to stop. :D A healthy weight for me is 164 according to the BMI charts. Which on me is really thin. But I'll still try to get as close to that as I can before getting pregnant again. I honestly never thought I'd even get to 200 before getting pregnant again so this is all so great. 

jelr- Well done with the 2 lb loss!! I'd go mad only drinking shakes though. I know with PCOS it's really hard to lose the weight from what I've read. So as long as you are being safe and monitored. :hugs: I definitely think I'm losing my motivation and stamina lately though. I keep saying I'll get back on track and than I end up lazy. I always get like this when I know DH is close. It's depressing in a way because I know he is so close yet still so far away. I told him once he gets back I want to walk like crazy. Even hike around some of the mountains around here while we are still here to enjoy them. :shock::lol: I'm glad you are starting to feel like your old self again. :hugs: 

spidey- I'm gonna ask for nipples like yours for christmas. :rofl: Yeah I'll post my next body picture at 190. Which might be a while from now because I just had a giant plate of cheese and crackers. :blush: Cheese is my biggest weakness. But it was SOO good. :haha: 


Okay. Next I'm gonna post a crazy update/question type of post about a house we think we might buy back home. Spidey you'll be intrigued I'm sure. :winkwink: I gotta upload the photos to photobucket first though. It's gonna be a long one.


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## cleckner04

Okay. So this might sound like a completely stupid idea which is part of the reason I'm posting to get more opinions. There is a foreclosed house in my DH's hometown for sale for $9,900. It is shitty. I mean, completely tore up on the inside. BUT, I could pay for it with cash right now and than when I move back home in November I'm going to be getting that extra 1800 a month that would've been put on rent for living here in California. So I was thinking that 1800 a month could go towards fixing up each room of this place one by one. The kitchen being the most expensive obviously but we could do it all slowly. It has pretty much everything we were wanting in a house except that it's a 2 story and we only wanted a 1 story. But I can live with it because the master bedroom is on the main floor. There is a basement and dining room and although there isn't a garage, there is a brand new cement slab in the back yard where the previous owners looked like they were going to build one. Big enough for a two car garage to be built on. My parents went to see this place(just the outside) and they took extra pictures for me and inspected the place over. And my MIL is going to make an appointment with a realtor hopefully tomorrow(Monday) to go in and see it. She is also going to bring my uncle who is a contractor to inspect the place over for termite damage and things like that. 

My reasoning for this house is that we will NEVER have to pay a mortgage. No matter what this place will be ours even if DH can't find a job right away. Plus, Dh's family is huge and there is someone that knows how to do pretty much everything in that house. Like his parents redid their bathroom themselves so they know how to remodel a bathroom. His cousin does amazing flooring work. My brother went to school for electrical engineering so he knows how to rewire the house. And the list goes on. I am more than willing to learn how to do some of these things as well. And I am under no illusion that this will be easy to do. SO...here are the pictures. And the information that I culled together from several different listings online. 

Realtor's pictures


Spoiler
This is the front of the house, the kitchen, a bedroom I'm assuming, and a laundry room which is on the back of the house.
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-06-04at113332AM-1.png

This is a bedroom, a half bath that looks like it is attached to a bedroom, a full bath, and the living room(I think:dohh:).
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-06-04at113333AM-1.png

This is an upstairs bedroom, and the dining room. 
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-06-04at113333AM-2.png


And since the realtors pictures are pretty blurry and not all that good, I asked my mom to take as many pictures as she could while visiting. They didn't go inside so they are just pictures from her peaking in the windows. And going onto the front porch. :haha:

Spoiler
Outer front porch, front windows, angeled shot, and the inner front porch. There's another door to actually get into the house. 
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/P6040049-1.jpg

The front "landscaping"(I use that word loosely because it will be totally redone if we buy it. :haha:, the back of the house, back angle of the house, the cement slab in the back yard for a future garage. 
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/P6040053-1.jpg

2 more angles of the back, more of their beautiful landscaping:lol: I think they mustve ripped out sidewalk or another cement slab and just left the pieces behind but it's an easy cleanup job, and closer picture of the windows. That's my dad in the pictures. He was on the phone with me describing it all to me. :haha:
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/P6040061-1.jpg

Kitchen & dining room(I think this picture is taken from the inner front porch.), stairway and you can see where they started to build a closet, living room.
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/P6040056-1.jpg

And here's the descriptions I could find on it.

*2 bedroom 1.5 bath home with endless possibilities. This home has potential for a 3rd bedroom and the loft can be used for play area or bedroom. The half bath is plumbed so a shower can be added. The backyard has plenty of room for barbeques and entertaining. There is a slab of concrete you can park on or you can build a garage. Dont miss this buy!

Basic Features:
Acres: 0.175
Area: Steuben County
City Name: Angola
County Name: Steuben
Neighborhood: 
Schools: Other, Angola
State: INDIANA
Sub Area: 
Subdivision: 
Type: Single Family
Zip: 46703
Bathrooms: 1
Bedrooms: 2
Partial Baths: 
Square Ft.: 1519
Additional Features:
Dining Room Level: First
Dining Room Size: 13'2x10'6
Living/Great Room Level: First
Living/Great Room Size: 15'1x13'3
Entry/Foyer Level: First
Entry/Foyer Size: 13'1x7
Kitchen Level: First
Kitchen Size: 13'8x11'5
Laundry Level: First
Laundry Size: 8'3x7'4
Bedroom 2nd Level: First
Bedroom 2nd Size: 13'3x13'9
Master Bed Level: First
Master Bed Size: 13'9x17'6
Bath Level: First
Bedroom Size: 5'5x5'10
Master Bath Level: First
Master Bath Size: 3'10x8'6
Cooling: None
Taxes: 983
Auction Price: None
Auction: No
Class: Residential
Directions: From mound, go west on 20 to west street, go north, property up 4 blocks on east side of street.
Days on Market: 23
Electric: Nipsco
Exemption Homestead Credit: No
Exemption Mortgage: No
Exterior Features: Porch Covered,Porch Enclosed
Exterior Finish: Vinyl
Extra Room 1 Description: Loft
Extra Room 1 Level: Second
Extra Room 1 Size: 13'5x9'8
Fireplace: None
Foreclosure: Yes
Foundation: Basement & Crawl
Garage Capacity: None
Garage: None
Gas: Natural Gas
Heating: Gas Natural Fa
Lake Access: None
Lake Name: NONE
Lake Type: None
Legal: W & J LOT 24
Level: 1 1/2
Location: City/Town
Lot Dimensions: 60x127
Occupancy: Vacant
Other Exemptions: No
Possession: Day Of Final Cl
Status: Active
Rental Property: No
Rooms/Bedrooms/Full Baths/Half Baths: 8/2/1/1
For Sale or Rent: For Sale
School District: M S D Steuben County
Section: 26
Sewer: City
Softener Owned: No
SqFt Above Grade Finished: 1134
SqFt Above Grade Total: 1134
SqFt Below Grade Finished: 385
SqFt Below Grade Total: 385
SqFt Main Level: 770
SqFt Upper Level: 364
Street Type: City
Total SqFt Finished: 1134
Total SqFt Unfinished: 385
Township: Pleasant
Water: City
Water Heater Type: Gas
Year Built: 1921
Tax Year: 10/11
Zoning: Residential
*


Thoughts? Are we completely crazy to even consider doing this? Do you see the potential like I do? DH is TOTALLY excited. He thinks it's an amazing idea. Especially the part about never having a mortgage. :rofl: The best part is this is in his hometown and we will have so many family and friends within a 10 mile radius. Both of our sets of parents live out in the country but still not too far away. And my brother lives in a town away only about a 6 minute drive though. So give me the opinions girls!! Spidey- your DH is smart about this kind of stuff, see what he thinks too. :haha:


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## spidey

I let DH read your post and he studied the pictures- we both love that kind of stuff. He totally wants to move out there! :haha:

His opinions were all good as are mine. :thumbup: It looks like you could live there during the renovation since the house looks to be in livable condition since it has windows, doors and roof, but it would be nice to know if it's safe to have the power and water turned on right away. It looks like a flipper ran out of money and never finished the job. And its not in really bad condition. Its not like the walls have been torn up in order for someone to strip it for copper wire. As long as you have competent friends and relatives, they should beable to take a look and make sure the foundation and structure are okay and none of the repairs are major. Me and DH have put up walls, drywall, floors (wood and tile), plumbing, electric.. etc. When it's your 1st time it takes awhile, but it really isn't that hard. As long as you're not afraid to give it a try and make a few mistakes along the way, it's actually really nice to make the house exactly how you want it. Plus if you have people willing to give advice or work for beer and pizza, it's perfect :haha:

Paying with cash sounds great :thumbsup: I recommend making a list of all the repairs and renovations (in order of most importance) and then taking a trip to the hardware store to see how much things cost. Supplies alone can add up quickly- me and DH were just at Home Depot today pricing out sinks and flooring for our downstairs bathroom. DH renovated the entire basement- he put in drywall to section off his woodshop, flooring, electric, lights, and insulation for $800. So repairs like that are relatively cheap. You can put in a new kitchen relatively cheaply too if you do it all yourself- even new appliances are inexpensive as long as you don't buy fancy ones.

Would you buy this house soon after DH returns this month? If so you could get started on the more important renovations right away so you and Emma could have a nice place to live when he gets deployed again. I know you don't want a loan, but if you needed it, you could take out a 10,000/ 15 year mortgage to pay for the immediate repairs. Then pay off the mortgage quickly so you don't have to pay too much in interest. I've been paying off my mortgage as fast as possible since I hate having debt so I know exactly where you're coming from. Thats why we looked at trailer homes for so long since we had the cash to buy one- but I hated the thought of ground rent so we trashed that idea.

I'm so excited to hear more about this house!! I hope there's nothing major wrong with it and it's all mostly cosmetic. The room sizes are nice too- very close to the sizes of the rooms in my house and I've been really happy with my house and the amount of space I have. Do you need AC in Indiana? Is it 3 bedrooms total with 1 bedroom upstairs? I couldn't quite figure that out from the description. I would love to be upstairs in a rain storm with that tin roof :thumbup: Rain storms and tin roofs are a major turn on for me :rofl:


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## cleckner04

I am assuming the house is 2 bedrooms downstairs and than 1 bedroom upstairs. Because it keeps describing it as a 2 bedroom house with potential for a 3rd. But there are two carpeted rooms in the pictures and than the one room upstairs that is gutted. So that must be the room they say can be finished. I'm puzzled by it too. :lol: We don't need AC too much in Indiana. I mean, it's hot there right now but it's not normal. I think we'll just get a window AC unit because that is plenty to get us by and maybe someday we can get central air installed. I think having the electric redone is the first priority because it may require the walls to be torn up even more so I think that should be done first. If it needs redone of course. I can already picture how I want everything to be in this house. Like I want to put in floating hardwood flooring throughout the downstairs. I know it has hardwood flooring now but I don't like the look of old hardwood like that. I'm rambling here...

I'm just so excited. If MIL and FIL approve of this house and it's still available tomorrow, than we are going to have them buy it and than we will buy it off of them when we go home in July. Well, I'll send a check as soon as DH is back but we'll figure out about switching the deed to our name in July. Because there is no way DH will be back in time to rush home and buy this place. So I want to snap it up before it goes. My stomach has been in knots most of the day because I don't want it to sell. DH keeps emailing with all of these ideas for the house too so I know he really wants it. Are we crazy for buying a house without even seeing it in person? :rofl:


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## cleckner04

I keep looking at the pictures over and over. I can't control myself. :rofl: There was another house a block away from this one that went for 21k and it sold within 2 days of being listed. This one has been listed 22 days. So I have a feeling it's already sold. My MIL called the realtor saturday to ask about it and they said it's not sold but that doesn't mean there isn't offers IYKWIM. It's so silly that I want this beat down house so badly. :blush: I just see so much potential.


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## Shiv

Cleck - I think that as long as the house is structurally sound and in an area you would like to live then you should go for it! imagine being mortgage free - that would be amazing! The hosue doesn't look nearly as bad inside as I was expecting, you could do it up really nicely. I hope you get it, and I can't wait to see the update pictures as you do it up!


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## spidey

One thing I forgot to ask is how much are fixed up, ready to live in houses going for in that area? You don't want to spend $ to fix up this house and have it be worth more than what the neighborhood sells for. 

Have your parents take pictures of the neighbors houses too so you can get an idea of what the immediate area looks like. The last thing you want is a neighbor who has 50 refrigerators on their front lawn :haha: Or for your backyard to butt up against a dog kennel that breeds dogs and the smell is so bad you can't open your windows. Maryland lets you see where all the sex offenders live and their charge, so I always check to make sure that I don't have a child sex offender on my street.

I hope you hear some news on the house today. Like what Shiv said, I can't wait to see before and after pictures. :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

I checked worth of a few on the block and it was in the 80k range. My parents said the houses around it are nice and look like they've been remodeled too. I guess there are a few that need work but not many. They also said there was kids out playing and it seemed like a really quiet neighborhood. There is a park just a block away too so that is neat. I'm not sure if it's the type of park that has a playground for Emma or just a baseball field, but still a park. :haha:


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## cleckner04

Okay I just gave the realtor a call because she never called my MIL back and she said it's sold. She asked if I wanted her to search for any places in the area and I said 'no don't worry about it, that's the one we wanted'. And she HUNG UP ON ME!!! :wacko: WTF?! What a bitch!! :gun: 


So I'm a bit disappointed that it sold but I knew it would go quick. It's 9k dollars for goodness sakes. I can't even buy a good used car for that price. :rofl: It's stupid to be so disappointed but we were already planning it out in our heads so in a way it feels like we lost a dream. I still have to email DH to let him know.


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## Shiv

aw sorry it sold Cleck, keep your eyes peeled for some other projects, other houses that need work are bound to com eup. Must be really disappointing though - sorry :hugs:


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## spidey

It's still sounding really good Cleckner :thumbup: Have you heard anything yet?

I got brave and responded to a playdate ad at a local online yahoo group. Eeeek... so scared now! 

LOL, DH just shrieked from the bathroom. He was peeing and Kira ran in and stuck her hand into the stream of pee and said "pee" :rofl:


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## spidey

ah crap.. while I was cleaning up Kira's pee hand you posted :dohh:

That's super disappointing :growlmad: I can't believe she hung up on you too, what a bitch!


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## cleckner04

:rofl: at her putting her hand in his pee. hahahahaha. 


Yeah the realtor girl was definitely a bitch. I told my mom about it afterwards and she said at least I know her name so when we go to buy a house we will know not to ever use her. My mom wanted me to call the company and complain about her but I'm not that type of person. I will get a completely wrong order in a restaurant and still not complain IYKWIM. I just don't like confrontation like that.


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## cleckner04

I got that corset top in the mail today! :dance: i tried it on with the jeans I'm going to wear and took piccies for you guys. I'll have my makeup done up on the actual day though. :haha: I'm such a poser. And I want a nose job. :rofl: Emma's hair won't ever stay out of her eyes but I don't want to cut it either. 

https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_8501-1.jpg
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_8524-1.jpg


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## Shiv

seriously CLeck you look amazing. I can't actually believe that you are classed as overweight. I would say that you look about a UK size 12 (U.S 8) in those pictures. I can quite see that if you got down to your "ideal" weight that you would look far too thin.

Corey is gonna flip when he sees you!


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## cleckner04

Thanks! :blush: Not only am I overweight, but just barely under the obese line still. :dohh: I just weigh a lot. I think I carry it well because of my height and I'm curvy in the right places instead of being roly poly if that makes sense. 


Can you post a clothing size chart for a popular UK site? I was having a debate with Blah on here about it recently because I don't think the sizing is that different once you hit the bigger sizes. I'll go find the size chart for the jeans I'm wearing in that picture. But I'd love to see how they really differ because half of the UK girls think it's a 2 size difference and other girls think it's just 1 size difference between the two countries.


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## cleckner04

https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-06-06at12932PM.png

I took a screenshot of the american eagle site. :haha: This is the size chart for the jeans I'm wearing. I'm a size 16. I'm curious how it stacks up next to a UK size chart.


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## Shiv

https://www.pinkfridge.com/s_shoppingonline/sizes.htm

Don't know if that is what you are after? i always thought it was 2 sizes diferent. E.G in Gap a size 6 is a UK 10. But looking at some charts they do say just one size different. Maybe over recent years the sizes have got more similar and there is now just one size different? :shrug:


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## cleckner04

No I mean a size chart from a popular clothing site in the uk. Like Next or something that I always hear people speak about. For bottoms sizing too not dress size.

That's what I get confused about though because each person says something different so I want to look at measurements on the charts and than we would know for sure. :haha: It just feels bad because me being a US 16 and if it's really 2 sizes different I would be a 20UK sizing? Thats depressing if it's true.


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## Shiv

Ok here is Next - a warning though, Next is very generous with sizing, I could fit into a size 8 last summer after losing teh baby weight, but was a 10/12 everywhere else!
 



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## cleckner04

Oh well judging by that chart I'd still be a 16. But notice it says it would be a US size 12. Which that part is totally not right. If that is generous sizing is there any other popular clothing stores over there that you can share a chart of? :haha: Sorry I'm bugging you...:blush: I've wondered about this for a while though after that argument with Blah on here.


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## Mary Jo

yeah, Next is ridiculously generous (and H&M ridiculously mean). I have been in the weird situation just this week of fitting - in my 20 weeks pregnant state - into my Next size 10 jeans and my H&M size 16 maternity jeans. it would be depressing if it wasn't funny.

Cleck you look absolutely fantastic in your new corset (and Emma is super cute, we can't cut Adam's hair either, good thing it only looks long when it's wet!). Sorry you missed out on the bargain house, guess someone rocked up with the $9k in their hand.


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## Mary Jo

at John Lewis, you'd be closer to a size 18 - click, nowhere near a 20!


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## cleckner04

So really any of these charts proves that it's not a 2 size difference between countries. Which makes me feel better in a way. I just see threads with girls saying how huge they are at a size 16, etc and I think holy crap if a UK 16 is a US 12 and they think they are huge than I must be really gross to them. :dohh: 

I only ever wear one brand of jeans but I think old navy jeans I would fit into a 14 from what I've heard. My bigger friends love old navy because of the generous sizing there. :haha: I only ever wear american eagle brand though. Stylish and they last forever.


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## spidey

Cleck, I love that corset! Corey won't be able to keep his eyes off your boobs :haha: Don't be silly about your nose- you look really good :thumbup: 

And about hair- I have to trim Kira's bangs while she sleeps. She refuses to wear a barrette too. This morning I put a barrette in my hair and she had a complete meltdown because I refused to take it out :rofl:


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## cleckner04

Aww Kira gets traumatized by hair clips. :haha: 

I keep thinking if I just let Emma's hair grow a bit longer than we can tuck the hair behind her ears and it won't go in her eyes anymore. My mom used to cut my bangs when I was a kid and I look back at those pictures and just cringe. :rofl: So I really don't want to cut Emma's hair if I can help it. :lol:


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## jelr

Wowsers Cleck you look amazing in those photos - you definitely look more like a UK size 12 to me. Corey is definitely going to be all over you. I can't believe after losing so much weight your boobs are so pert. Mine have drooped so much from losing the weight I did before we got married. :haha:

Sorry to hear about the house. I still can't get over the price of it, you wouldn't even buy the materials here for that. We built on a sun room last year and DH built it himself, he did all the structure and tiled the roof and a friend did the electrics so the only thing we paid labour on was the plastering and that was only &#8364;150 and it still cost us &#8364;2000 and even at that it was timbre frame instead of block which is cheaper and DH actually there is very little wall space as it is mostly windows and a door to outside and they didn't cost us anything because DH got them from somebody who was throwing them out. Fingers crossed you will come across another bargain like that because it would be my dream to be mortgate free. :cloud:

Spidey: Natasha used to also hate clips in her hair and would pull them out, but I bought a load of bright colours and she has a little box for them and loves to sort through them when I'm doing her hair and thinks they are the best thing ever now. I also get Natasha's hair cut as it sticks out everywhere, I think she has my hair which is neither straight or curly. I never wanted to cut it except the fringe and the hair dresser talked me into it and said that if I kept getting it trimmed the fly away baby hairs would soon be gone and it would thicken up and she was right because it seems to be getting a little better every time it is trimmed. :thumbup:

MJ: I hope everything is still in order with the house and the one you wanted is still available. :thumbup:

Shiv: I see from FB Sophia wants to play all night, we had one of those nights last night too, thankfully she didn't want to get up, but I couldn't sleep knowing she was awake and was waiting for her to cry :dohh:

Well we had a busy weekend as my friends dad took very sick and had a few mini strokes and had to be brought to Dublin so I had her little fella who is going on 12 here yesterday and today. It was so weird looking after a child who really didn't need to be looked after, he was out playing with his friends all day yesterday and all I had to do was phone and check on him a few times and today he was just on the laptop all day and there wasn't a peep out of him. I kind of felt I wasn't looking after him properly because he wasn't in my sight all the time or I didn't have to entertain him, but I guess that is because I'm used to having a toddler around. It did make me sad though to see the grown up side of children even though it is only a few years away really as I know I will miss not playing or entertaining Natasha all day :haha: Maybe it will be different when it is your own, but I really didn't know he was here all day and was chatting to him as much as I could without annoying him, but at that age I think they are happy to be on the computer and left alone.

It also made me realise how quickly the years go by because it only seems like yesterday he was a tiny baby. I feel like I want to stop time and stop Natasha growing up and at the moment she does seem to be growing up every day, although watching her grow is nice too.

Last night she told me she loved me without me saying it first for the first time. She has been saying love you anytime we say it for a while now when we say it to her but it has only been "you" and for the last week it has been "ove you too" because when we say it and she says it back we always say love you too again, well when I put her down in her cot at night the last thing I say to her is night night, love you, sweet dreams and last night she was playing at away in her cot in the middle of the night and I went in and said you should be asleep, its night time and her new thing is she has to have mickey and minnie and her glow worm all lined up beside her under the covers, she never snuggles into them, she just likes them in the bed beside her, so when I told her it was night time, she wanted them under the covers so I lined them all up and she then said "night night ninnie" to Minnie and gave Minnie a kiss, then "night night key" to Mickey and gave him a kiss and then "night night usic" for Music which is what she calls the glow work and then she said mammy kiss and I gave her a kiss and out she spurted "night night mammy - ove you too" before I got a chance to say anything. I know it was only because of routine and not that she really knows what it means, obviously she knows what love feels like but not what the word means, but it still melted my heart - even her little thing of kissing them all good night was so lovely.

We are really having to watch what we say now because she is really trying to copy all of our words, funnily enough DH and I were talking last night and I was getting on to him that he will need to make sure he doesn't curse in front of her and he said he didn't so I said yes you do and he said you curse far more than me, which I always did but I said to him, since Natasha has started talking I have become so aware of it I dont anymore and that he was to watch me over the next few days and he bet me a fiver that I would curse in front of her before he did and of course first thing this morning he let me lie in as I hadn't slept last night between Natasha being awake and worrying about my friends dad and when after her breakfast he was getting her dressed and I went into the room but I had gotten out of bed too quickly and was seeing stars and I said shite and of course for the first time Natasha had heard me curse in a long time, she had to repeat it after me :haha: so I lost the bloody bet :haha:

Anyways that is enough stories from me and I best get to bed as I have work in the morning.


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## Mary Jo

sorry Jean, but I had to laugh at you swearing first :rofl:

(I'm a terrible swearer, dread to think what Adam will be coming out with.)

fingers crossed the new house will be ours! it went back on the market while we waited to get an offer on ours but didn't sell, so the vendor agreed to sell to us again. :D we're thrilled but not counting any chickens.


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## cleckner04

jelr- :rofl: at you swearing first. I am a horrible swearer as well. Especially when angry. I come out with a different swear word every other word when I'm upset or angry. :dohh: Sadly DH is even worse so I'm going to have to really be on his case when he gets back. I drop the F bomb quite a lot even in emails to DH. I've caught myself doing it on here too but I always have to backspace. :haha: Yay for her saying love you!! Emma hasn't even said it the first time yet. Let alone to me on her own. :dohh:


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## spidey

aww, jelr, Natasha sounds so sweet :cloud9: I love how she said goodnight to all her favorite sleepy toys. I tried convincing Kira that she should like hair bows.. I bought really pretty ones with polka dots (she loves anything with polka dots!) and I made a big deal of how pretty they look in her hair. My plan actually backfired because now she will randomly run her hands through her hair checking for barrettes that mommy might have snuck in!

On the weekends DH tries to keep sleeping after Kira wakes up and I always tell Kira that if you give Daddy a kiss he will wake up. Now she does it all on her own and DH loves it :cloud9:

As far as talking, Kira still can't say anything :haha: When I say "say mama" she says "pa" :rofl: She can say the first sounds of a few words, but nothing with 2 syllables. So combining words is a loooong way away. When she wants me to cook an egg, she runs to the kitchen and says "ee" for egg. I keep the pacifiers near the eggs and when she wants a pacifier she says "dee", so I never know which one she wants. She must get so frustrated since I have to point to everything and say "this? this? this?" until I get it right. I have a feeling the pediatrician will be sending us to speech therapy. I actually think her speech has worsened... at one time she used to say baaafff for "bath" which is the only time she has made an ending sound to a word. So she says "pee" for pig, "du" for duck, "bu" for bubble, etc... haha, so my point is that we don't have to stop our cussing anytime soon :haha: I have a potty mouth too, so I've been trying to cut back on the cuss words!

MJ- I hope things work out this time for selling your house. What a relief it'll be once it's over.


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## cleckner04

spidey- can you imagine you guys taking her to speech therapy and the only words she comes out with are piss, shit, ass, and fuck? :rofl::rofl::rofl: 

Emma has about 50-60 words but not very many sentences. "there it is" and "thank you" are her only sentences or phrases. I'm amazed at those of you that have toddlers singing entire songs already. I just can't even imagine Emma doing that yet. It doesn't help that I don't sing to her ever so she doesn't even know any songs. :rofl:


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## spidey

If Kira could talk she would be cussing up a storm! We call her Uncle Joel "uncle fuck-tard" and DH is always shouting "shut up you bitch" or "fuckoff" to his mother from our front porch to hers. We are pretty trashy :haha:

My secret talent is making up songs without practice since I'm really quick to come up with rhyming words to make songs about anything. :blush: The only people who I will sing around are DH and Kira since I sound awful :haha:. Some days I sing all day about the various things me and Kira and doing. When we read a book and see a picture of a spider Kira will rock back and forth because she expects me to sing "itsy bitsy spider", and when I read her the hanukah book, she expect me to sing the dreidel song on the page with a dreidel... and when she sees sponge bob, I have to sing the sponge bob song :rofl: A few times a day I sing "happy birthday" and let Kira blow out a candle. So even with all the singing, Kira doesn't sing. The closest thing is she says "haaaaa" (for happy) and rocks back and forth when she wants me to light the candle so she can blow it out :lol:

My nips aren't hurting anymore so I think there is no bfp this month for me. :growlmad: My nip pain was really minor and if it wasn't for the opk backing up my guess, I would be doubting myself right now on whether or not I ovulated. I know it's not over until AF arrives, but I really thought I had a chance this month since Kira has been bf much less during the day. It will be interesting to see what my luteal phase is.


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## cleckner04

I laughed out loud at you guys yelling shut up you bitch to his mom. :rofl: I would love to have you guys as neighbors. :haha: 

And that is so funny that you sing happy birthday and let her blow out a candle every day. :rofl: She'll be a champion candle blower by the time her actual birthday comes around. :lol:

Do you think you'll start taking B-complex vitamins if your luteal phase is still short? It might be worth a shot! I mean, they haven't worked for me so far but they do work for some people. I definitely think it's a matter of us having low progesterone while BFing. I'm not quite to my ovulation yet this month so who knows what it'll bring this time around. I'm still taking the vitamins religiously every day but I feel like I'm doing it for nothing.


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## Shiv

unlce fu*k-tard:haha:

I wrote a big post earlier but it wouldn't post because it took me so long ot write as Ihad to keep stopping to see to Sophia :dohh:

Cleck what US size do you wear? In your photos you don't look anywhere near a UK 18.

MJ - fingers crossed the house moving runs smoothly for you this time.

jelr - that is SO adorable Natasha telling you she loves you, that would make my heart melt.

Spidey - well if you don't get a BFP it will be interesting to see if the redued breastfeeding lengthens your luteal phase

Hair cuts, we have trimmed Sophia fringe once but we want to grow it out. She refuses to wear anything in her hair so it is constantly in her face, we will persevere though!

Sophia has been a bit difficult the last few days, generally ok during the day but really hard to get down at night. I am putting it down to a canine I can see emerging.

When is your playdate Spidey that you signed up to on yahoo? I have arranged to meet some local mums at a soft play area on Thursday, I am cacking my pants. I found a group on netmums and they also have a facebook group. Why is trying to make new friends so nerve wracking. It would be cool if we were like little kids and just went up to kids and started playing! Either that or i could get really drunk before meeting up with them :haha:


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## cleckner04

I'm a US 16. :flower: I have really big hips though. Like 44 inches around. :wacko: but my waist is only 35 inches. I honestly think if I hadn't had a c-section, my hips would be smaller now. The thing that makes them so big is my stomach still hangs down over the scar so that is part of the measurement. :sick:


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## Shiv

I think I need to see a photo of you stood next to Spidey, as I just can't imagine that you are a US size 16. I think I need to invest in yoru camera :winkwink:


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## Shiv

oh and I can't stop checking out your boobs in your avatar pic \\:D/ (no idea what that smiley is supposed to be but i like it :haha:)


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## cleckner04

:rofl: I would probably look huge standing next to spidey. I think the fact that I'm fairly tall(5'8") hides my weight a bit better. You are gonna give me a big head if you keep it up. :winkwink: I used to be a size 8 and when I hold those jeans up to my body, I think I'll never fit them again. :nope: I think I might just get rid of them because I can't see ever fitting them again. It's that stupid overhang on my belly.


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## Shiv

Before we moved I threw out a ton of clothes that I just had to admit i was never gonna wear again (alot of them were tops that i can't wear a bra with and my boobs just hang so low now that i can't go braless) - the things having children do to us eh?


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## spidey

I'm a US size 7. Cleckner, a 16 isn't that big and you have your weight in good spots so it makes you look good :thumbup: My waist is a bit thick compared to my hips and I don't have boobs :haha: I've always had a boyish shape and sort of stick like, but now I'm a bit softer around my middle. 

ooooo Shiv- tell us how Sophia's play date goes this Thursday!! The ad I answered was for a mom looking to start a playgroup and/or have a play date for her daughter. I haven't heard back, so I'm relieved but a tiny bit disappointed too.

Cleck, what dose of B vitamins are you taking? Do you take them after ovulation too? I'm still not certain if I want to try them. I'm not really worried about having a supply decrease since I can stop them at anytime, but I hate taking any sort of medicines. Have you noticed a decrease in supply? 

Oh, and Kira is so good at blowing out candles! She patiently waits until the right part of the song to blow it out too :haha:


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## Shiv

Size 7? So do you get a size for each number then in the US? Like size 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9,10 etc etc I have never heard of a size 7 before! See now I think that it can't be 2 dress size difference because that would make Spidey a size 11 over here (not that we have size 11) but i would put you at a size UK8 max Spidey which would be a US 4?!?!?!?!?!? None of it makes sense!

Oh and does Kira actually think it is her birthday every day?


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## cleckner04

spidey I can't believe you are a 7! I think you look like a 4 at most! 

I agree shiv, it's crazy the sizing differences. 


I am taking 2 pills of this https://www.amazon.com/Nature-Made-Super-Complex-Tablets/dp/B0010L4J28 every day. I have no clue how many mg it is exactly off the top of my head but it's not very high of a doseage. I am exactly the same about medicine. I HATE taking anything. Remember I debated back and forth about these for months before actually trying them. It made me feel a bit better knowing they are just vitamins and not actual medicine. I haven't noticed any difference with my supply. I haven't noticed any difference with anything really. :rofl: But I'm going to keep at it because I've read in a few places that it could take up to 6 months to work. :dohh:


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## cleckner04

Shiv said:


> Before we moved I threw out a ton of clothes that I just had to admit i was never gonna wear again (alot of them were tops that i can't wear a bra with and my boobs just hang so low now that i can't go braless) - the things having children do to us eh?

I hate that I can't go braless anymore!! :nope: I loved my ability to walk around with no bra and no one could tell because they were so perky and perfect. I wish I would've taken naked pictures of my body before having Emma. :haha:


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## Shiv

i was thinking that after my last post. my boobs were tiny but very pert and I used to go braless all the time. Now, well it took a couple of months after Sophia stopped breastfeeding fo rme to go without a bursing bra in bed just because I hated the way they felt saggy - I still hate the way they feel saggy but got over wearing a bra :haha:


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## Mary Jo

I have pics I took of myself - not nekkid but in nice undies - about 6 years ago. man, I wish I'd appreciated it back then! I have never had a toned tummy but there is a ridge of semi-toned muscle nevertheless that I doubt I will ever see again in this life. *pout*

I tried on my maternity bras from last time and I think they shrunk in the wash. do you think that's even possible? they're a 36DD but I feel pretty squeezed in. :dohh: and if I am not bruised round the ribcage tomorrow I'll be surprised. just don't want to have to buy more, I've been appreciating the fact that there are only a few things I *have* to buy this time round. might have to wear my nursing bras, they are 36E I think. jesus.

how are you getting on in Berkshire, Shiv? how's Sophia enjoying her new home? kudos to you for trying to find some mummy friends! I'm going to have to be proactive about that when we move, too. my mummy friends here are all people from a child-friendly AA meeting I go to - it was actually quite bizarre, back in November or so, I bumped into an AA friend of mine I hadn't seen in *years* (5 at least), she was with her little boy, who turns out to be 6 weeks older than Adam. I was amazed and so was she to see me with Adam. anyway she told me about this meeting, and it turned out that there were 2 other old AA friends of mine who also go, one just had her 1st baby last Oct, and the other had her 4th boy in Feb 09. all these women I have known for over 8 years but hadn't been in touch with for a while. it was brilliant to find the group. and through it I made another friend, a lady whose son is a month younger than Adam, and we also go to playgroup together now as she lives really locally to me. I am going to miss them all terribly, and have consiered making the effort to still go to the meeting but realistically I can't see me trailing from Sutton to Lewisham for 10.30am every Monday morning, with 2 kids. it really is a shame because they're all around my age (in fact *I* am the baby of the group at 37, the others are 38, 39, 43 and the last is somewhere in the early 40s). it's just been so amazing to talk to them about everything, especially the ones who just had their first baby as well. 

I am planning to go to some toddler groups but might look into a specific meet somewhere as well, because I am shy and it takes a while for me to talk to people. it's even harder I find with a toddler. it shouldn't be but I spend half my time chasing after Adam and stopping him from doing stuff he shouldn't (steal biscuits, try and get a cup of tea, raid the money jar, sneak out via the fire exit...)

Spidey, so cute about Kira and the candles :D do you sing Happy birthday to her or something else? Adam doesn't sing much, nothing I can recognise, but he likes it when I sing. usually it's made up songs but sometimes I think and remember proper ones. :lol:

Cleck, haven't had a chance to say, but I just love the pics of Emma in your sig. she looks so demure, sort of coy. she's such a strikingly beautiful little girl. :kiss:

we're not much further on with the house moving thing, waiting for our buyer to arrange a survey. she told our agents that she hoed to complete in 4 weeks, well I hardly think that'll happen. 6 weeks would be mid-July. I am thinking conservatively and would be thrilled if we are in by Adam's birthday. though realistically it would be better if it *was* mid-July so we can get the damp proof course done, the woodworm nuked, the new flooring and carpets down and buy some furniture before we have C's family round for A's party. we're not bringing our bed, just the mattress, because our new bedroom is small and our bed had this ridge round it that makes the bed 6in wider and 4in longer than it needs to be. and I think we'll need to buy a couple 2-seat settees for the living room as ours is a 4-seater and I would be amazed if it fits. it's hard not to get too excited about things, but I am hyper aware it could all go wrong again, so we're not buying, getting rid of, or even packing a thing until we've exchanged contracts. after that if someone wants to pull out they pay a penalty, so it's fairly safe to assume they won't. barring natural disasters or death. it's possible that Adam and I will go up to my mum and dad's for a week or so while C stays here, while the work gets done on the house. (but that depends on being able to get the damp course people exactly when it suits us!) I just don't really want to have to deal with a toddler while everything is a mess. the house isn't big enough for us to do one small bit at a time, basically the whole of the downstairs will have no floor for a while. 

super tired right now. it's insane. makes me think I might be a little bit anaemic even though my blood results at 9 weeks were ok. trying to eat more red meat - had a salad of spinach, tomatoes and a whole packet of roast beef slices for lunch today. :haha:


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## jelr

you are all right to laugh I laughed myself at being the first one to curse, was kicking myself too though because DH always wins our bets, it is like he jinxes me the minute he says I bet blah blah, and I was sure I was going to win this one because I have been so careful not to curse in front of her and then only a few hours after our conversation, the first word out of my mouth is a curse :dohh: :haha:

Natasha doesn't sing full songs she more has the tune and the odd random word of the song comes out with the tune, it is cute though. DH is like you Spidey and makes up songs, but he tends to make up songs out of existing songs about whatever is going on in the day. He is really good for remembering songs, modern and really really old well before his time. The song that Natasha mostly sings is a song about Daisy, it came one day from Daisy being on Mickey Mouse and he started singing "Daisy Daisy give me your tits to chew" :haha: so I made him sing the proper song when Natasha was around everytime it came into his head so the real one is a really old song that I dont even like but now I sing it all the time because it is the one that she sings the most words of :haha: 

Cleck: Eh if you say your boobs were pert before having Emma, they must have been like coat hangers because I think they are so pert now. Mine just head downwards and as a size D that is not a pretty sight :haha: I know you can't tell us when Corey is home but is it in the middle or end of the month?

Spidey; :rofl: at your DH calling his mom a fucking bitch - Oh God I can just see my mams face if I dared, I would say she would knock me out :haha: I love that you sing happy birthday to Kira and she blows out a candle, I think Natasha will be an expert candle blower too from all the birthday parties we had a few weeks ago, she did spend a couple of days singing "happy birbay you too" and then blowing out pretend candles but she has forgotten now about it and doesn't do it anymore I must actually upload our videos as I think I might have gotten one at the time. You must get a video of one of your birthday days :haha:

Girls I'm lost with the sizes, I wonder have we got it totally out as I would agree with Shiv, I would put you as a UK size 12 cleck and you as a size 8 Spidey. :shrug:

Thanks for the lovely comments about Natasha - "ove you too" has turned into "ove e too today :haha: - Still melts my heart though and she says it in a little squeal too. it is something that you girls will all love when you hear it and I doubt it will ever get old.

Shiv: Eeek at the play date, I can image it must be scary, but I'm sure it will go really well and once you get over the inital nerves you will really enjoy it. I hope that tooth comes in quick for Sopha and she settles back into sleeping. They dont ever tell you that the sleepless nights continue for 2 years do they :haha: How have you settled into the house and the area yourself?

MJ: that is great news on the house. FX it all goes through this time. That is a great idea of a AA toddler group, hopefully like Shiv though you will find something in the area. I do know what you mean about finding it hard to talk with a toddler. I'm like that even with my own friends who I know for years, it feels like I have half conversations with them because you always have one eye on the LO's too and I'm am so bad for being able to concentrate on two things at once - DH laughs at me as he says he thought women can multi task but I'm useless if I can't watch tele and be on the laptop at the same time because I end up concentrating on what I'm typing or reading and dont take in any of what is on the tele. I'm always saying to him what was that or how did that happen and he can manage both perfectly fine :haha: so when I'm watching Natasha and trying to talk to a friend, I end up missing half of the conversation :nope:

Well not much else from me - AF arrived yesterday so it was only a 32 day cycle which wasn't too bad. Hospital appointment is next Monday so not long now and I have also lost another 2lbs so that is 8lbs in total in just over 2 weeks and 4lb's from the previous couple of weeks doing low carb so I have 12 in total gone and only another 5 to go and I'm starting to fit back into my clothes so I'm thrilled with that.


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## spidey

I think a 7 is the same as an 8. So it's 3/4 5/6 7/8 9/10 and so on. I shop in the juniors department (which is meant for teenage girls :blush: ) because I like the jeans style better. The juniors department usually goes with the odd numbers whereas the ladies section uses the even numbers. Atleast I think that's how it works :haha: There is no way I can fit in a 3/4.. I use to fit in that size when I weighed 95 pounds and now I weigh 120.

I'll try to get a video of Kira with her candle tomorrow and I'll post it if I can get past my awful singing voice :haha: Kira is going to LOVE it when her real birthday comes. She is practiced on unwrapping gifts too since she demands that I wrap something up when she sees the wrapping paper in the closet.

MJ- don't forget to take before and after pictures once you get started on renovating the house :thumbup: You know how much I like snooping in other peoples houses :blush::haha:

jelr- the time has flown by.. when you first told us about your hospital appointment it seemed so far away!

Cleckner- thanks for the vitamin link- I have it saved so if I decide to try them I'll get the same kind. :flower:


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## Shiv

MJ - Berkshire is ok. I really like our house (and will be very sad when we have to leave as we won't be able to afford to buy a house this nice, it is nothing fancy just suits us well), I also really like the area. We have a park a minutes walk away, a duck pond just round the corner, town is a 15 minute walk away. I mainly miss having my parents close by. Not having a babysitter pretty much on demand is a bit depressing to be honest. We never wentout much anyway, but it was nice to know we could have if we wanted to!

I am rubbish at toddler groups, if I go and nobody makes a real effortto talk to me, then I just follow Sophia round and leave early. I am hoping that because I am meeting a specific group (I don't know how many people will be there) that I will be forced to talk. I also got a facebook message from a girl who moved here 4 months ago and she she to let her know if we fancied a play date (her daughter is 21 months as well (and she has a 4 month old). I like the idea of people coming ot my house one at a time (I am so sad), I'd be on my home territory then and would have to "entertain" if you know what I mean. 

If I am honest I am more scared/nervous about this than I have been about anything in a long time, even giving birth. Silly really I suppose.

Sophia took an hour to go to sleep again last night. David put his foot down and said she is not comign downstairs again once we have put her up, so I said fine, but you can go up to her! She calls out on the monitor "mummy, want out of the cot, go downstairs" and when I go up to her there is no placating her. Anyway, he went up a few times and eventually she went to sleep. She was up an hour early again though............. 

MJ - how are you sleeping with this pregnancy? I am getting about 2 hours a night, what with needing to wee ad terrible hayfever :dohh:


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## Mary Jo

Shiv, have you thought about finding another NCT group? one that meets for tea every so often? I would like to, have only ever once been to an open house thing, and that was with a lady I met through toddler group (this particular lady is extremely friendly and stops to speak to everyone she sees with a baby or toddler, she's actually a bit of an evangelist - she's religious as well) and it was ok but stressful with Adam going through the house like a dose of salts. I could barely believe that a toddler lived in the house because other than locks on the kitchen cupboards there didn't seem to be any child-proofing, down to them still having books and important and fragile things on low down shelves! well, most of that got moved within a few minutes of Adam arriving! and I don't think it's very conducive to making new friends when you have a toddler who wants to take the place apart. I really wish I'd started doing things like that when Adam was a baby (not on the move anyway) because then by the time he was dismantling things they'd have got to know us and realised he's just an active interested little boy, not an undisciplined monster. that's the theory anyway...

we don't have family round here and won't have anyone local enough for me to leave Adam if I decided to take the new baby to something like that. it's a shame. you'll really really miss that. we don't go out much either, and I don't think we'd go out much more if we did have a local babysitter, but it's when there is an emergency situation that you really benefit. we'll both just have to pray for no emergencies...

it's not silly to be worried about meeting new friends! the point is that despite that worry and fear you're still going to make the effort. would be so much easier to not bother, but then you risk being lonely and isolated. how is David's new job going? do any of his new colleagues have young kids? any chance of some family-type socialising there?

as for sleeping - gah. I don't sleep at all well at night. (Adam is great at the moment, we haven't had to move him into a new bed or bedroom yet obviously, so he's all happy and ignorant that it's going to be changing. am expecting some hard times once we've moved.) I have horrid heartburn so I have to eat Rennies before bed, and then after each time I drink water in the night. I think I'm up maybe 4-5x a night to pee, and I have to have water then as well because I'm parched. it's especially annoying because I know how it's going to get worse when I get bigger, and when the SPD ramps up (it's ok right now, pretty mild), but I'm so physically restless despite being so tired. I feel like I'm either tossing and turning or I'm up peeing and chewing on Rennies. I don't even have bad nasal congestion like I did last time (that really affected my sleep). And despite being exhausted it's hard to *get* to sleep most nights! I don't go to bed till after midnight because there's just no point, and then Adam is usually up at 7am. I can stave off getting up by putting Charlie & Lola and Postman Pat on my iPhone for him but then I only get snatched 10 minute sleeps in between programmes (and I feel like an awful mummy for doing that, but he likes it). my one saving grace is that he still takes long naps so I go up and sleep in the day for 1-2 hours. even so I feel like a wrung-out dishcloth most of the time. :( I keep looking at pics of myself from last time and wondering how I'll wrestle Adam around when I'm the size of a house again...


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## Shiv

So today is the day for me to go and try to make some new friends! Sophia woke up at 5am (what is going on with her sleep?) so i look and feel like a zombie! Wish me luck!


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## Mary Jo

good luck Shiv :D 

am off to doc this afternoon, have officially had enough of heartburn. last night it felt like a drilling pain rather than a burning, which is how it was when I had stomach ulcers about 3-4 years ago, and I'm not dealing with that, so rang up and going in at 4.20pm. also going to ask about a couple of strange scabs that have appeared on my right boob. they're kind of itchy. no idea what they are, eeeek.


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## spidey

goodluck Shiv! I bet you're at the playgroup right now! It's 8am here, so that would be 112 or 1 there? I understand completely about you preferring to have one on one playdates at your house- I'm the same way. I don't do well in groups at all. I can be chatty with 1 person but I completely shut down when its a group of people that isn't my immediate family!

MJ- I hope the doctor can give you some relief for the ulcer pain. I use to suffer from terrible heart burn and ulcer pain in my early 20's before I was diagnosed with gluten allergy, so I know how hard it is to sleep or function- besides the fact that you have to pee all the time!

Nothing new with me. No AF yet, but it's still early. Kira was sooo moody yesterday and I tried 3 times to have her blow out a candle but as soon as she saw the camera she would melt down! She does a new "fake" cry where she sticks out her tongue into a U shape and makes a crying sound. :haha:


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## Mary Jo

thanks Spidey :D stomach/ulcer pain is just awful, I went through agonies a few years ago, but of course I wasn't pregnant so they could give me the good drugs. doctor was nice, one I hadn't seen before. I told him all I'd been prescribed last pregnancy (Gaviscon, then ranitidine, then omeprazole) and because I'm only 21 weeks he wants to wait a while if poss before giving me omeprazole again (last time I got it at 7 months). so I have a giant bottle of Gaviscon, and to go back in 2 weeks if it isn't helping. I expect I'll be back, I know how this goes. :( for my boob scab, he gave me a steriod/antifungal/antibiotic cream, and to go back if it doesn't clear up in 2 weeks. he seemed puzzled as to what it is. I am, too. absolutely no idea why I'd suddenly get an itchy scab!

Adam was - not good. he's ok if we only have to wait 5 mins max in the waiting room, but then he just wants to leave, and spends his time running to the waiting room door and trying to open it. obviously it's a door that's in use a lot and it's heavy and there isn't an thing on to stop it closing sharply, and I could see a broken fingers incident coming up, so I couldn't let him. plus it was clear he wasn't playing, he was serious about wanting to leave. kept shouting "go" and "home". once through that door there was another to the lobby, and he could open that easily, and then the door to the outside was standing open. he would NOT have it that he should stay and play, that we need to see the doctor first, we'll go soon... so I had to put him in his pushchair and wait in the lobby. pushchairs aren't allowed in the waiting room, for health & safety reasons, but they're obviously not strict on the rule because there's often buggies in there, so I asked the receptionist. she had witnessed my struggles and said it was fine. by this time Adam had calmed down because he was watching Charlie & Lola on my phone, and though he cried a bit when we went back in the waiting room, he settled down when I gave him a dummy. 

this is all since he was in hospital 5 weeks ago, when he was on the drip and had the awful experiences when they had to take blood (it took 4 of us to hold him down) and he had to stay in overnight... he was always fine about the doctors but now he is only fine for the first 3-5 mins and then wants to LEAVE NOW. which is unrealistic as there's usually a wait of at least half an hour, if not longer. 

when we move my main criterion for finding a new docs is how safe is the building, how easy is it to escape from. right now I am totally capable of chasing after him and grabbing him but I won't be in a few months. :(


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## cleckner04

MJ- :hugs::hugs: Sounds like you had a rough day with the struggles at the doctors office. And the stomach issues sound rough too. :( Hopefully the Gaviscon helps ease your discomfort a bit. It's insane the things we go through to have a baby. Just keep your eye on the prize. You're over halfway there. :hugs::hugs: 

Shiv- Hope your meeting with new friends went well! I know it is SO nerve wracking trying to make new friends. It's my least favorite part of moving for sure. 

Spidey- :wave: :haha: Emma has a fake cry too. It's quite irritating if I'm being honest. :dohh: 



Nothing new here really. DH's ship is currently in Hawaii so we've been spending the past two days on the phone with eachother. It's nice to actually be able to call and text again now that he's in the states. Only a week left for him to be home. :dance: I get butterflies in my stomach just thinking about it. I always worry that we won't like eachother when we get back together. :rofl: Because so much changes in six months time. So we have to relearn eachother.


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## Shiv

MJ - glad teh doctor is nice and hope the gaviscon can ease your symptoms a little until he will give you something more effective. i get pretty bad heartburn whilst pregnant but find that milk really helps so obvioulsy not as severe as you. Itis horrible when you can feel it at night though.

Cleck - well a lot sure has changed over the last 6 months with you, you are half the woman you were, Corey will enjoy relearning you for sure :haha:

Well my playdate went ok, there were 5 ladies there with various toddlers (all boys apart from Sophia). i would say on first impressions there are probably 2 women I could actually be proper friends with, and the other ladies were all nice and woudl happily meet up again. Do you know what I mean when i say that almost without anyone talking I had sized who I thought was friend potential. Probably terribly judgemental of me, but I'll keep an open mind. i managed to keep Sophia happy where we were for about half an hour before she wanted to go off and explore so I didn't speak to anyone much after that. One woman there said she was coming along to these things because her husband had left her 2 months earlier for another woman and she was trying to rebuild. She mentioned it several times and i didn't know what to say. "what a *******" sprang to mind, but I just nodded supportively! She said I could pop round for a coffee anytime so that was nice.

There is a bigger meet up on Monday so I might go to that and there is another lady who messaged me, but I haven't heard back since I suggested she pop round for coffee and cake (obv i sounded far too keen/desperate :dohh:)

Spidey - when is AF due?


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## cleckner04

:rofl: @ Corey rediscovering me. :haha: 

Your playdate sounds like it was a pretty good success! I know what you mean about judging people right at the start. I'm the same way. Definitely don't go by a first meeting though. I've found that some people end up surprising me and being great friends even if the first impression was bad. Go you for being so brave!! :thumbup:


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## Mary Jo

thanks Cleck. I know it's all just part of pregnancy, and it's not like I didn't go into it with my eyes open, :haha: I knew that I'd get all the stuff I got last time. plus extras, actually, just grateful the nausea/sickness only lasted about 8 or so weeks. :lol: I can deal with it, but heartburn at night is just awful. Shiv, milk worked in the first few weeks, and it still gives me some relief during the day, but not at night. I know it's all going to be worth it. eventually.

Am with Shiv, Cleck, I think Corey is going to enjoy getting to know you again. :haha: How long is he home? How long will he be away next time? You have loads to plan for if he's getting out in a year's time, it's exciting. :D

Playdate sounds like it went pretty well, Shiv. Hope the next meet goes well, too, and that you manage to tempt someone round for cake! (I'd be there in a flash, your cakes look yummy). I know what you mean about sizing up people, but do keep an open mind, I have been surprised before now when my first impressions have really missed a lot. My AA friend I go to playgroup with, I didn't have a very positive first impression of her at all, but it turns out we have exactly the same sense of humour. (plus a lot in common, given our life situations, but you'd kind of expect that given where we met and given we have toddlers practically the same age.) I'm still pondering finding some NCT things to go to. Wish there was a specific group for pregnant mums with toddlers who are new to the area! I might ask Aunty E on the FB group, since I am pretty sure she has been to NCT things since moving to where she is now.

Spidey, awwww at Kira and the candle and the camera! Adam has been terrible with cameras for a while now. As soon as he sees it he wants it and won't give up, so I have barely taken any pics in ages, other than when we went to Legoland. It's a shame, I had so so many and now they've just tailed right off. Cleck, how do you get Emma to keep posing nicely? what's your secret? :rofl:


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## Shiv

MJ - I looked into NCT, you can do a refresher class which is 3 or 4 sessions and women only, and is for women who are pregnant with their 2nd (or more) baby. They didn't have one vey local to me and the one closest was running so that the postnatal meetup was planned in for 2 weeks before I am due to give birth. So i think i am going to give it a miss.

Have you checked out netmums, they have a meetup section and that is where I found my meet-up?


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## spidey

MJ- It's pretty bad that I know all the drugs you mentioned :haha: I use to take esomeprazole (nexium) but luckily was able to stop it after my diet change. I LOL about your new criteria for your next doctor :rofl: I actually interviewed pediatricians before picking one for Kira, and one of the questions I asked was average wait time. One doctor admitted she was always really late seeing her patients and she was crossed off the list of potentials right away! I never thought of building safety back then though :haha:

Cleck- The next week will probably crawl by for you! I was actually thinking of you today (yeah, like a weird stalker :haha:) and wondering how Emma will react to seeing Corey. If it was my DH and Kira, I bet Kira would remember him but still need her space at first to warm up. My DH would want to scoop her up and hug and kiss her, but I know that would result in screaming... and DH would be upset too. Gosh, I am a hormonal mess and tearing up thinking about it :haha:

Shiv- yipee on making it through your play group! :happydance: Where did you meet? Did the lady whose husband left her one of the ladies you had a good friend vibe about?

In an ideal 14 day luteal phase world, AF is due on June 19th, but I'm expecting her on June 13th :haha:

I still haven't heard from my future play date friend. Such rejection!! I'm planning to go to the park on Monday when the weather cools off to try and "run" into the lady with twins again. I am determined to make a new mommy friend!


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## Shiv

Right ladies we should make it our aim to make one new mummy friend each (cleck you can be excused from this exercise if you like as you'll be too busy having sex to worry about making new friends for the next 6 months :haha:) and MJ, you can postpone until you move. But Spidey, I shall give us a one month deadline, by which time we must have made an actual, real life friend!


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## Mary Jo

heh, Spidey, omeprazole is my 3rd PPI, I was also on rabeprazole for quite a while, and lansoprazole briefly. fortunately my ulcers healed and my iron levels went back up (I was anaemic because of bleeding ulcers - they bled slowly, just a trickle, so there was never a major crisis) when I stopped taking ibuprofen (used to overuse it somewhat). all this was in the few months before Adam was conceived, my iron was back to normal by then and I didn't have any further stomach issues. until I got pregnant - and that was one of the first indications to me, after having zero heartburn/pain for a good few months, it was suddenly creeping back. :haha: I'm generally ok when not pregnant, thank goodness. the doc today asked if I'd been on domperidone - no - and I wondered if he'd try it... I know it has a side effect of increased milk supply when bf, so I wouldn't mind being on it in a few months' time. :lol:

I don't blame you for asking about time-keeping when interviewing for a doc, I'd do the same if I could! unfortunately most of the docs here that I've ever been to either start out behind schedule because they're late (my last doc was terrible, I used to arrive 1st at the drop-in morning session and would still wait up to a hour because he just hadn't arrived) or else they just run behind. the doc I saw today, we waited about 40 mins I think, and then when I saw him, he was quite slow with the consultation. which was fine by me, he was very nice and pretty dishy, and it was nice not to be hustled out in 3 mins like usual, but I could see quite why it was that we'd waited 40 mins if he was that slow with everyone. 

Shiv, amgoing to check out the NCT website for Sutton & Epsom, and also Netmums. I think I am registered there and have used it to track down stuff to do round here, but never thought about finding a meet-up in Sutton yet. though I did find out that there are some playgroups that run in halls within about 15 mins walk away, which is ideal. just hope they don't start too early in the morning, I'm not good in the morning at the moment. I have managed to get to my AA meeting every week (starts at 10.30am) but haven't been to playgroup (starts at 10am Fridays) for about 3-4 weeks. it wasn't on last week because of half term, but previous... I just couldn't get out of bed a couple of times and the the other time I was all set to go but Adam had been up very early and was clearly really really tired by 9.30am, AND then I had a text to say my friend wasn't going either, so we both just went back to bed. I have to get myself together because really, an earlier playgroup is better for Adam because he usually sleeps from 10am-ish to 1.30pm-ish, give or take half an hour here and there, and he's ok about going to bed at 12ish if we've been out, but there's no way an 11am start would work. we just would never get out of the house.

Adam's funny around people he hasn't seen for a while now, though it's actually only if they come here to the flat. if he sees people anywhere else he's fine but if they're in his space, he gets very very clingy to me (which is so rare I find it to be rather bizarre), and at worst he tries to leave the room and cries. he was shy around my mum for the first 10 minutes when she came down last month (he had seen her a couple of weeks before at Legoland, but she hadn't been to the flat since January) and the same with my best friend when she came over. he's never usually at all wary of people.

oh and speaking of escaping - my little monkey actually escaped from my AA meeting on Monday. I haven't told anyone this, not even (especially not) Chris... it was a really really scary moment. we were clearing the room at the end of the meeting and suddenly it felt there was this massive gap in the room where Adam wasn't! he had been hanging round the door, and it seems someone went to the loo and didn't notice him slip out as well. problem was, the hall we use is a Salvation Army church, and they have a charity shop in the foyer and a side room off the foyer, and the front door was also open. my monkey had run out into the street - fortunately not a main road but cars still go up and down - and I found him standing next to someone's car. my heart was absolutely in my mouth, it was awful. I hate not being able to take my eyes off him for more than 10 seconds, but now he is getting tall enough, and strong enough, to open doors, but he is not obedient and has no concept of danger... eeek. it's a scary age!


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## Shiv

I really struggle getting to playgroups as they all start at about 10am, on a good (normal) day, Sophia won't wake up until 8.30am and then is happy playing in her cot for half an hour. So by the time we get downstairs, read some stories and get breaskfast, there is no chance of getting out of the house on time. i moaned this morning becasue Sophia was up at 5.30am but realistically at least it meant I was on time to meet these women (10am an di was first there!).

I like leisurely mornings, we often stay in our PJ's until just before lunch, Sophia likes to read for half an hour or so before breakfast, then she can take up to 40 minutes to eat breakfast, then more playing and reading before persuading herto go upstairs to get dressed, then lunch, then a nap.........what a lazy pair we are! i think it is good that she is not used to doign exciting things every day as when the new baby comes I guess we won't be doing too much for a while :haha:


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## Mary Jo

haha, Shiv, your usual days sound rather like mine... today is a typical example - Adam woke about 7am (in our bed) but that was too early for me so I let him watch some stuff on my iphone till after 8am (oops). then we got up and he had breakfast and milk, and then he played till 10am, when I got him upstairs to change his nappy and he went back to bed (his own cot). I joined him about 11.30am and we both slept till about 1.30pm, when he joined me (by vaulting over the cotside). we stayed in bed till after 2pm, then got up and made lunch, and then finally got dressed. went out to doc's appt for 4.20pm, home about 5.30pm and then Adam played with daddy while I made dinner, which was about 7pm. Adam went to bed at 8.30pm. 

if we have to go out, I have to make a mammoth effort! I just feel so lazy/tired. fortunately Adam seems to be ok playing in the flat. if we do go out it tends to be after lunch unless we have a morning appt. I sometimes plan to go out in the morning for shopping etc because it's easier to get home on the bus earlier in the day (if I leave it till we're coming home after 4pm we can't even get on the bus) but I am very loathe to mess with Adam's naps. they're just so reliable and I am really relying on them myself for a break/nap.

really hope we've moved house by the time new baby arrives, just so at least Adam has a garden to play in. plus a much bigger house. it's a very small house but compared to my 1-bed flat it's massive. :haha:


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## jelr

So glad the playdate went well Shiv, I was checking in during the day on my phone to see how it went but only got a chance to get on now, I really hope you make some new friends from it :thumbup:

MJ: I hope the gaviscon helps, I also found peppermint cordial used to help me a little when I was pregnant. I also have suffered from ulcers and was on nexium, but thankfully I had the helicobacter treatment and that helped loads and it really hasn't bothered me too much since I came off all the anti-inflamatory tablets for my arthritis before I had Natasha. 

Spidey: FX for that lovely long lutual phase this time, typical that Kira wouldn't play ball for the camera I also find it really hard to get as many photos or videos now as she just wants to see the pictures or videos so just runs after me saying see see.

Cleck: OMG I can't believe it is only a week away from Corey being home. I would love to be a fly on the wall when you guys meet. I would say it would make me cry and be like a romantic movie, (although when I say I would love to see when you guys meet, I dont mean when Corey is rediscovering you :haha:)

Now that is a great challenge Shiv, you guys can have a competition to see who meets a friend first :haha: and I can be the judge :haha:

I told you all - my positive vibes are going to work and you will all meet some lovely friends soon I just know it.

Not much news from me, Natasha is still being fussy with her food, but mainly at dinner time and she does seem to be getting tired around the same time as we usually dont have dinner until 6 as she sleeps from 12 until about 2 so her lunch is usually quite late - So I'm going to try and give her lunch before she sleep tomorrow when I'm off - I know she wont be hungry enough for it as she usually doesn't have breakfast until 9.30 to 10 depending on when she wakes but even if she eats a bit to keep her going and then I will give her dinner around 5 as I would prefer if she was eating her dinner better than her lunch if that makes sense as it has more of the different food groups that she needs.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who has trouble getting out of the house early with a toddler, It takes me so long to get Natasha and myself ready as I'm not a morning person at all and am always on the go slow first thing :haha: - Thank God my mam minds her when I'm working and comes over here to collect her as she is usually still asleep or has just woken and I have only started to dress her. If I had to get her out to a creche or to a childminder I would seriously be late every day :haha:

Natasha also has a fake cry but I think it is really cute because when she does it I have to go over and give her a cuddle and she grins from ear to ear and it has turned into a little game now.

Well I'm heading shopping with my mam and sister at the weekend for us to get something to wear for the wedding so I'm looking forward to that. I'm off tomorrow so am going to have a lazy day with Natasha. I got lovely hand crafted cards done up for Fathers day with loads of photos of DH and Natasha and I'm going to steal your idea Spidey and get Natasha to put her handprints on them so we might do some painting tomorrow.


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## spidey

jelr- ahh, you reminded me that I need to come up with something cute for father's day! :thumbup:

Kira is really easy to get up and get out in the morning. She usually wakes up at 7am and she's not interested in breakfast until 10am, so I can pack a snack cup of cereal for our trip. She prefers to get an hours worth of cuddles in the morning, but she'll gladly get out of bed right away too. 

Shiv, a month deadline to make a mommy friend is not very long!!! I'll search the internet tomorrow to see what else I can find so I can at least attempt to meet someone. There's a girl I was friends with in high school who adopted a little boy who is 6 months older than Kira... so I suppose I could ask her to visit for a playdate. It's not technically cheating since I haven't seen her in 12 years (since we graduated) and we have only spoken on FB. She works fulltime and is split from her husband so it might hard since I think the father has custody on the weekends. Blah- this isn't going to be easy :haha:


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## Shiv

The girl whose husband left her, just friended me on facebook, I must not be too awful after all (although i get the impression she is just as desperate for friends as I am :haha:)

We are going to try Sophia with a duvet and pillow tonight (instead of a sleeping bag) - wish us luck! The plan is get her used to that for a week or so, then take the side off of her cot, and then move her into her new room and her big bed (which we are hoping to buy on Sunday) - although there is every chance come tomorrow night she'll beback in her sleeping bag :haha:


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## cleckner04

:rofl: at your mommy friend competition. I'll need to find more mommy friends once I move back home too. A lot of my friends are still childless so it'd be nice to meet more people. 

Weigh in this morning. I lost 0.6 lbs this week. :dohh: I can't complain because it's still a loss and I'm at my lowest yet at 193 lbs even. :dance: So I've lost 47 lbs so far. I have been speaking with DH the past few days while they are in port and we've both agreed that I'll get back onto the weightloss track more once he's back. He said he would take Emma so I can exercise in the evenings and we plan on walking every night so hopefully I can get back into that routine. I know I'm not doing that great the past few weeks. :( But I haven't gained and that is enough to be positive about. :thumbup:


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## Shiv

Cleck - it must be good to know that you can have not great weeks in terms of food and exercise and not gain back though. Well done. I do remember you saying that you go out to eat a lot when Corey is home, so be careful not ot fall in that trap too often!


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## cleckner04

Yeah that is why I got so big in the first place from eating out. I've explained to DH a few times that things are changing around here. All I can do is hope that he follows through with his promises. Although I asked him what he wants to do when I pick him up and he said he wants to eat at burger king. :growlmad::roll: It makes me so mad because I have really bad self control as it is, so he is only hurting me by eating whatever he wants in front of me like that. I'm so incredibly terrified that I'll gain it all back. I am also worried because when I move home in November I'll be living with his family and they aren't healthy eaters either. Neither are my parents. Pretty much no one eats healthy. So I will be living in a house with crap food and it will be a constant temptation. :cry:


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## Shiv

You'll have to show them all how it's done. I hope that because you have made such an effort to lose the weight can resist temptation, although I know how hard it is. David can eat anything and everything (and often does :haha:) and he is still skinny, being 6ft2in helps him I think!


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## Shiv

Plus, you have Emma now and you need to set a good example for her, and so should the rest of your family!


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## cleckner04

I agree! The problem is everyone says they will change and they never do. My parents eat like crap. It's part of the reason I've always ate like crap. Which is also why I don't want Emma following in all of our footsteps. :roll: My parents will tell me on the phone that they are eating healthy but in the same phone call my dad will speak about eating a bag of potato chips and my mom will bring up the cake that she bought from the store that week. :dohh: 

DH's family is a little better than mine with eating but not by much. They all always eat out. They are a very close family with aunts and uncles and cousins living within miles of eachother and they go out to eat together at least once a week usually. Which is nice but not good on a waistline. :nope: 

I guess all I can do is hope that I'm strong enough to say no. I'm thinking the day DH comes back I will make a roast dinner in the slow cooker so he won't have a choice but to take us home to eat there instead of a fast food place.


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## jelr

Spidey: I bet you come up with a lovely idea for fathers day, you are good at that. I'm not very imaginative at all :haha: - Is fathers day the 19th of June like over her or is it different like mothers day is?

Shiv: Of course you are not awful, you would make a lovely friend to anyone :thumbup: - Best of luck with the sleeping bag move, I hope it goes as well for you as it did for us, dont give up on the first night though. Our first night was a disaster, but the second not so bad and the 3rd perfect.

Cleck: I have every faith that you will resist temptation when Corey gets home and when you move back home. I think I told you before I lost 3 stone (42lbs) the year before we got married and kept it off until I got pregnant which was 3 years later, and I found I became much more aware of what I was eating and much more disiplined and able to resist temptation because I knew how much I had struggled to lose it and get where I was and was so much happier in myself and I think you will be the same. Also by the time you move home you will be well at your target and what I found worked for me to maintain it was to be good all week and allow myself a treat meal once a week which was usually a take away on a Saturday night. This helped me to keep my motivation going and stick to it because I also had that treat, so it didn't feel like I was depriving myself of yummy food all the time, so maybe you could do this and eat out with DH once a week or use the time that you will all meet as family as your treat meal. I bet DH will be converted once he sees you and then tastes all the new yummy healthy food that you have been eating :thumbup:


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## spidey

OMG, I'm going to crap myself! The lady finally responded to my playdate email and wants to get together in 2 Mondays! eeeek!! I'm not going to write back until tomorrow because I don't want to seem too desperate or say something weird. :haha: I was just going to come on here and complain that I tried to join a FB group for mom's in the town I live in. The group said "closed" but I figured I would try anyway since they could see I was a nice person and they still rejected me!! :growlmad:

Cleckner, my family sounds just like yours. Food is such a huge part of the family and how our love is shown. Our family vacations are usually centered around what's for breakfast, lunch and dinner :haha: The people at my work are the same way and will actually get offended if I turn down a huge slice of cake or a donut. It use to bother me because I didn't want to hurt people's feelings, but I learned not to care. 

It took me many years to figure out a solid system of avoiding fast food (to avoid gluten). Every Tuesday I work on making a meal list for the next 7 days. Complete meals that usually have a meat and 2 veggies and sometimes a carb like rice pasta. For example, BBQ chicken wings with sweet potato and green beans is on this weeks list. To be honest, I HATE thinking of 7 complete meals! Then I make a list of all the ingredients that I need to buy and write them in 4 categories (meat, fruit/veg, dairy, other). And finally I add in all the extra things that I like to have on hand like bananas, yogurt, juice, milk and eggs. On Tuesday evening we go shopping and buy only the things on the list- no extra's!! I freeze any meat we aren't going to use right away. I keep the meal list on the fridge and each evening I check it to see if there is any meat I should thaw out for the next day. I also make 4 servings for every meal since the next day's lunch is always left overs. If I didn't do this, 5pm would come around and I would have nothing ready to cook so I would go out to buy milkshakes and fries for dinner, Kira would never get a balanced meal and I would spend tons of money on fast food!


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## Mary Jo

Spidey, would you like to move to London - with Kira - and move in with me? I'll be your mommy friend and you can plan my diet. :D


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## Shiv

Spidey - i do the same, I plan our weeks dinners on a sunday night and then do an internet shop and get it delivered on the monday. If I don't then we would just eat crap or pasta every night! I too stick it on the fridge and when I cook the dinner I check to see if i need to get anything out of the freezer for the following night! We are like domestic goddesses!

jelr - are you shopping today? You'll have to put a pic up of whatever you buy to wear for the wedding.

Well night 1 of duvet and pillow was not overly good, but then Sophia's sleepign has been a bit hit and miss anyway this week. She settled fine, then woke up after half an hour, went in a read her another story, left again and she cried for a few minutes then settled. We checked on her as we went to bed and she had fallen asleep on top of the duvet :dohh: so David did a nifty lift and cover maneouvre (he told me I had to be in bed when he did it as I am so clumsy I would make a noise and wake her) She slept welluntil 5am when she woke up. Now this has happened three times this week and quite frankly Iwant my 14 hour a night sleeper back, so i decided she was not being got out of her cot until 6.30am (still crazy early). So i went every ten minutes or so, told her it was still night time and laid her back down. At 6.25am just as i was thinking "crap I'm gonna have to get up" she went quiet, and slept until 9am! So that is my plan now if she wakes up ridiculously early - show her who is boss! She is getting bloody clever though, when she really wants out of her cot she now says "Mummy change my nappy", so I have to get her up to check she hasn't done a poo - which she hadn't! cheeky monkey!

Wow sorry for the essay!

David's mum is visiting today, wonder what comment she will make to upset me this time!

Cleck is this your last weekend alone with emma for a while now! I was thinking about you the other day, and I seriously do not know how you have coped with no break for so long. I would be actually insane by now, quite frankly you deserve a month off from any childcare duties!

My mission today is to get a video of Sophia singing, I have given up trying to take photos as she just won't sit still :dohh:


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## cleckner04

Shiv- I can't seem to get photos of Emma either lately. She refuses to look at the camera. I miss the days when she would just sit pretty and smile at the camera. :haha: And LOL at 'mummy change my nappy' :lol: I seriously cannot even picture Emma speaking like that yet. She just has single words still and it's so weird to think that some of the august babies are already having full blown conversations. 

spidey- I don't plan my meals that detailed but I probably should start. I'm thinking I may get into couponing once DH loses his job too to help save some pennies on our grocery bills. So planning our meals like that would probably be really beneficial for that. :thumbup:


Is it bad that I get sad when I realize I have to share Emma with DH now? :cry: She's been all mine for so long and it makes me sad that I'm gonna have to hand her over and he gets to have some of those cuddles that would've been mine before. I'm so selfish. :blush:


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## Shiv

Cleck, I reckon after a week of sharing the cuddles you will soon see the benefit! A bath without being disturbed, being able to cook dinner without a meltdown, maybe go for a haircut, or to the shops.......think of the possibilities and when you get back from doing whatever, Emma will be there with a big cuddle just for her Mummy!


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## spidey

Shiv, are we domestic goddesses or just anal retentive? :haha:

Cleck- I agree with Shiv 100%! I do understand what you mean though, but once you see Emma playing with Corey your heart will melt. Getting a break from being the only caregiver will be awesome :thumbup: I still have no idea how you managed... the daily breaks I get keep me from insanity :haha:

Shiv, I'm glad the transition to the duvet went okay. She might need a couple more weeks to fully adjust to the new house and her new room before she turns back into the 14 hour nightly sleeper. Everything is different- even the smells I bet. I hope you got the singing video!

coupons- Cleck, have you seen that new show about couponing? Everytime I watch it I feel like such a lazy bum since I pay full price for my food. Are you going to stockpile food too :haha:

Kira is telling me I should stop.. she is laying on my hsnds as I type!


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## Shiv

Oh and I forgot to say EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK for your playdate Spidey! Perhaps a month is not such a tight deadline after all!

I just ordered a ridiculously expensive food shop becuase there were thingson offer so I bought lots 4 packs of chicken breasts, 2 packs of nappies, etc etc DH will flip when he sees the bill but some of it should last us a while. We have a nice big freezer here so may as well fill it!


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## Shiv

Me again! Hope you are all having a lovely weekend.

We went out and ordered Sophia's bed today. We changed our mind from the other bed and this is what we got:

https://www.dreams.co.uk/bed-frames...etal-steads/cadiz-bedstead/211-00979/product/

David really liked it, as he thinks it is very girly, and Sophia took a shine to it, and it was dead cheap. So that is being in delivered in a week, so I am on the hunt for bedding and wall decals. We are going for a kind of a vintage country garden theme, so maybe a patchwork duvet (so some pink but also lots of other colours), then maybe some flowers and butterfly decals, and perhaps even some pretty bunting around the ceiling - wow that sounds very over the top now I have written it down! I LOVE these cushions (the duvet is too pink for my liking, but the two little scatter cushions are cute):

https://www.next.co.uk/g362690s1#992969g36

and perhaps a duvet like this:
https://www.argos.co.uk/static/Product/partNumber/1194733.htm#pdpProductReviews

Also I have been trying to get a video of her singing but I can't get her to sing more than a line before she is off doing something else. So this is a rather long (probably not very interesting to you guys) video of her, well just being her!

https://youtu.be/f8IkIyt2UeA


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## cleckner04

Oh my goodness!!! :cloud9: Sophia seems SO much older than Emma. I love her saying 'ready steady go!' :haha: It's amazing how well she speaks. I love her accent too. And yours. ;) Now I'm kind of worried about Emma a bit. :dohh: Emma doesn't talk anything like that.


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## Shiv

Cleck - please don't worry about Emma, that isn't why I posted it, I am starting to think that Sophia is speeding ahead with her speech (not bragging), she just caught on one day and hasn't stopped since, I certianly don't think that anyone else's little ones are "behind" in comparison. She talks better than her cousin who is 10 months older than her :wacko:.

Now I feel bad for posting. Everyones little ones have their own special talents, it just so happens that Sophia is a blabbermouth like her Mother!


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## cleckner04

Oh no don't feel bad! I had the biggest grin on my face watching it. Emma liked watching it too. :hugs: It is just amazing to me how well she speaks. I know Emma will speak like that in her own time but it's just so hard to picture right now. :haha: We are still on one word answers here. I know my niece is a year older than Emma and she still doesn't speak much. But by the time they hit kindergarten age they are all in the same place with it all. :D


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## Shiv

In that case I give Emma one month until she is stringing several words together, it happens SO quickly once they get the hang of it. Treasure any quiet you get because Sophia will not Shut up now :haha:

on the down side, she is not taking well to her new bedding, I really hope she gets used to it soon!


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## jelr

I agree Cleck, they definitely all get to the same level and catch up with one another so I wouldn't worry. I can remember all your LO's crawling, rolling and all that other stuff and Natasha wasn't doing any of it and now she runs around the same as any other child her age. I also understand you being upset with sharing Emma. I love having Natasha to myself on my days off during the week, but I do treasure the breaks when DH comes home on a cranky day too, so I bet you will love having some time to yourself :thumbup:

Shiv: Wow Sophia is so clear with her talking, even though Natasha has quiet a lot of chatter it is no where near as clear as that, she speaks like a year old and has all of the proper sounds where as Natasha will still miss a lot of l's and t's and that. We also have more single words, she is putting more words together now but only the odd full sentence. I loved watching ALL of the video. :thumbup: I love the new bed and love those cushions. It is really hard to find nice bedding. I also looked at that duvet set from Next but thought the same that it was too pink when I had already painted the wall pink and was looking for something with some pink and also greens and yellows on it. I can't wait to see how she gets on in the double bed as we hope to eventually put Natasha in a double too as we already had one in that room before we changed it to her room and it seems a shame to get rid of it and buy a single when she will probably be looking for a double eventually. Dont give up on the duvet yet I bet it wont take long. I know I was convinced we would never get Natasha liking hers by the way the first night went and she really loves it now. She doesn't really stay covered though once she is asleep so I cover her up again before I go to bed. She is probably still adjusting to the new house too. 

Spidey: It looks like you are in the lead for making a new mommy friend :haha: - I also do the same with shopping and plan our meals for the week ahead but I dont always stick to it. I usually buy enough veg, potatoes, rice or pasta and meat to do particular meals, but I also have extra chicken and meat in the freezer. I'm not keen on the meat from the supermarket so we usually go the butchers once a month and fill the freezer. So then during the week I take out whatever I fancy for the next day to thaw out and it could have been one of the meals I planned when I was doing the shopping or it could be something completely different - so I'm not so much a domestic godess :haha:

Well the shopping was a bit of a disaster, I thought we were going to have a nightmare trying to find something for my mam and she was dressed in the first hour with not only something for the wedding but something for the day after and I couldn't find anything. I eventually did get a dress but my sister thought it was horrible and did nothing for me, but we would have very different tastes in clothes. She likes to have the most up to date fashion that is going. She was trying to get me into one of those new prom style dresses, and they did really suit my shape and were lovely but they didnt' feel like a dress you would wear to a wedding and a bit too school girl or something on me :dohh: - We searched the whole city and found nothing else and came back to our local town and I got another two dresses, (the plan was to try them on for DH and bring the one back and have one for the wedding and one for my birthday) but I think now that I panic bought because I tried them on and got DH to take a photo as my friend wanted to see them and wont be down until the weekend and I hate the photos :dohh: - I'm now thinking the fact that the one my sister wanted me to get suited my shape so much that I could maybe get that and get netting underneath so that it felt a bit more wedding like.


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## spidey

Score 2 for Spidey! I have 2 potential new friends now :rofl: My first friend is coming to my house next Monday, and I'm thinking of inviting my other newly aquired friend too, but more than likely we'll meet separately since she has a 10 week old too and lives about 20 minutes away- so I'll probably make the drive to her house. I shall see though! This is starting to get really stressful. There's a reason why I don't keep in contact with ANY of my high school friends. I am awful at maintaining friendships!

I met both these women on a local yahoo group for women who do attachment parenting so I shouldn't get any strange looks as Kira hangs off my boob the whole time :haha:

Shiv- I LOVED watching your video! Sophia is so talented in her talking and her jumping :haha: She talks so well and like Cleck said, makes Kira seem much much younger! I took a little video of Kira today that I'll try to post later- inspired by you because I really enjoyed the randomness of your video. And your house looked very tidy in the background too you domestic goddess! 

jelr- thats too bad dress shopping wasn't faster and more fun. Is there any chance you could go back and try to get the style that suited you better? When is the wedding? Try the dress on again tomorrow and you might like it better... it sounds like you tried on too many dresses today!


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## spidey

Kira getting her swimsuit 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofVYsdimvD0


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## Shiv

Spidey - Kira is just the cutest, she clearly understands everything you say to her, and she is definately making the sounds of words now, "daddy" for sure! Do you have an actual swimming pool in your back garden or just a paddling pool?

Wow - check you out with your new friends! I was supposed to meet up with some girls today but my parents are visiting and I would have had to leave after half an hour of being there so I called a rain check. I am now friends with 3 of them on facebook and one has made a few comments on my status's which are pretty funny and exactly my sort of humour. She aso invited me over for a coffee so i am hoping to see her on Friday once my mum has left. I am feeling kind of confident that I might have a friend or two to chat to. ALthough I have learnt that I quite like just hanging out with Sophia and that sometimes having places to go and people to meet is a bit of a pain!:haha: i guess I just like to know that I people there to see if I need to, but I am not fussed if I have people to see all the time if that makes sense?

jelr - sorry the shopping didn't go as well as you had hoped, if you want some unbiased opinions you could alwways put the photos up here!

Cleck - Corey must be home some time this week - eek! best get your bikini line in order :haha:

My parents are coming over today - my Dad is going golfing for a few days so mum is staying here until Thursday night. This is going to sound weird, but my Mum has never stayed in my house. As in she has never slept over (we lived so close that there was never any need). I am looking forward to her coming, but think it is going to be a bit wierd "waiting" on my mum, making her dinner etc


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## Shiv

Been doing some more searching for bedding and I quite like these, what do you think?

Oh and also, we took Sophia's pillow away last night before she went to bed, and it was a more successful night. She slept from 7pm to 6.30am, and she did wake at intervals but put herself back to sleep before we got to her. She ovbisoulsly doesn't like pillows!
 



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## spidey

Shiv, I bet that will be fun having your mom stay over! My parents have never stayed overnight with me since we've always lived 5 minutes apart.

this is the pool we swim in:
https://www.razortoe.com/Kira/2011-06/June%2012/pool%20with%20daddy.jpg

It's my MIL's who lives next to us. In the picture you can see her screened in back deck and my house (and bedroom window). The bright green foliage on the left is bamboo which was planted by DH to create a privacy screen, but MIL was told it was planted to create a more tropical feel to the yard. Little does she know that it will "grow out of control" and create a solid wall between the 2 houses :haha: Kira makes us get in MIL's pool everyday. My MIL bought that pool about 5 years ago but has swam in it 10 times total. All day she will talk about how she plans to swim in it but she's so lazy that she never actually gets on her bathing suit and climbs in :dohh: This is the 1st year I've swam in it because I know that MIL will use it against me one day- either blame me for a hole or try to make me give her money to maintain it.

Shiv, I love all the bedding that you've shown so far! I really liked the bed frame that you're getting too :thumbup: Make sure you take before and after pictures because I love those kinds of things :haha:


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## spidey

We just make DH's father's day present...

https://www.razortoe.com/share/fathers.jpg

DH has a wood working catalog and they play a game where DH says "what should Daddy buy?" and Kira points to a tool on the page. DH loves playing that game :haha: So we took his catalog and I asked her what we should buy daddy and I cut out everything that Kira picked! I hope DH doesn't notice :rofl: Kira had a meltdown at the end because she stuck the Dora sticker on it and then changed her mind. We're having a very whiney morning here!


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## cleckner04

Shiv- OMG I think you are reading my mind because I just whacked my lady garden off this morning so it's all smooth now. :rofl::rofl: It wasn't too bad to begin with. Oddly I shave that more often than I shave my legs and armpits. :rofl: Okay, out of all the bedding you posted, I like the first attachment in the last post if that makes sense. The flowers with the brighter pink bottom half. I love the wall decals and everything. I also like the bed frame you guys have chosen. It's gonna look so good when you guys are done. :thumbup:

spidey- Kira is so cute!!! She is much more like Emma with speech and behavior. I can't believe you are worried about Kira's speech to the point of thinking she'll need therapy. I think she's fine! That is totally awesome that your MIL has a pool you can use. So it's a nice pool but you don't have to do the upkeep. :haha: I would hate living that close to my MIL though. I love my MIL but I think it'd get old fast. You said your MIL gave you guys the land though right? So it's worth it since you didn't have to pay for the land. :lol: I love the fathers day gift too. You always come up with the most fun ideas. 


I finally got around and went to walmart today. I seriously needed so much stuff like cleaning supplies that had run out so now I should be good for a few more months. :haha: And the dogs food was nearly gone. I always buy a giant 50 lb bag so I hate going because the cart is so hard to push while holding Emma's hand as she walks at the same time. Because she refuses to sit in a cart now. :dohh: I measured Emma's height yesterday because her dresses are suddenly too short. She's 32 inches tall now! So has grown 3 inches since I last had her measured. So I need to go to 24 month dresses because they are the right length. :dohh: She wasn't even in the 18 month ones very long. The jeans and tops still fit her in 18 months but I think I'm gonna be slowly making the switch again.


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## jelr

Spidey: Kira is so cute, I definitely wouldn't be worried about her speech, Natasha doesn't get the whole word a lot of the time either and will only get either the start or end of it. I LOVE the pool and would love to live in a climate that you could swim outside :haha: - Yay for 2 mommy friends, dont be scared you will be fine :thumbup: - I love DH's fathers day card, you have great ideas.

Shiv: I love the 1st lot of bedding, where did you find it as I found it really hard to get something nice like that in a double, although it got to the stage where I had looked at so many I was goggle eyed :haha: so I could have actually seen and not actually remember, but I dont think so as it is exactly what I was looking for. Yay for Sophia sleeping better, isn't it gas how are LO's are so different. Natasha actually settled better when we put the pillow in the second night.

Yeah now that you say it my mam has never stayed with me because we live so close too, and I think it would actually be weird :haha: - my dad stayed with me alright when he got out of hospital when I was pregnant on Natasha as they are seperated. I have cooked for them both loads though as if they happen to call at dinner time I usually do extra and include them in the pot.

Cleck: Yay for a lovely clean cut lady garden :haha: - and yay for Emma's height, she is flying up 3 inches is a huge difference. Thats a pain in the bum for all new clothes though. Not long now, I'm so excited for you :dance:

Well the appointment went as I kind of expected it today with the consultant, he didn't really tell me anything I didn't know already, but he was really nice, he told us that he was very sorry for our loss and that he knew it was no concolation to us but that 1 in 5 pregnancies end in MC and that it was through no fault of my mine but that he could only put it down to extremely bad luck that we had been through two and that I was at an increased risk of this because of the PCOS and that he couldn't guarantee that it wouldn't happen again but to stay positive and that at least my fertility seems to have increased from when we were ttc with Natasha. He also had no explanation as to why both mc were mmc. He has given me a prescriptiion for asprin and I am to take that as soon as I become pregnant and take it until 34 weeks and I am to book into the Early Pregnancy Until to be monitored from 7 weeks. We also discussed how badly depressed I am getting lately with PMT I get around OV time and said that there is medication that will help but that we would look at that later as it is not suitable for pregnancy so he wouldn't recommend it at the moment if we are going to TTC soon. So at least I know I'm doing all that I can now to help prevent another one :thumbup: - I did find it a bit upsetting though dragging it all back up and seeing all the scan pictures again so I had a little cry to DH when we came out :cry: but I feel better now.

On the upside the nurse did my blood pressure and a height and weight check before I went in and my bmi is back to normal (just under the underweight, but I'm delighted that it is not over weight anymore :thumbup:) - I have started the re-feed as we are out for DH's nans birthday this saturday so I dont expect to lose anything this week but I'm only a tiny bit off my target (yesterday I was only 2 and 3/4 lbs away from it, but this morning I had put back up 3/4s so I have 3.5lbs to lose, but I reckon I could do with going to the loo and that is what the extra is today) - so hopefully I will do the maintance which is 2 shakes and one healthy meal and that will shift the last lot.

I also brought two of the dresses back and got another one which I'm happier with, I really think I did try on too many and panic bought the last day. I hate shopping anyway :haha: - I actually have them up on fb so my friend could see them so I will change the settings tomorrow and give you a look at them all, I'm too lazy to log back in now as I really should be in bed.

I must also put up some videos of Natasha singing I think the ones I have are from last month and one in April as I can't seem to get any at them moment but again I will stick them up on fb tomorrow so only you guys can see as I'm singing in some of them and I'm not letting the world see that :haha:


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## cleckner04

jelr- YAY for normal weight!!! :dance::dance: I've got so much to lose still before I get to that point. I'm quite jealous. :D I'm sorry you had to go through with the whole mc talk with the consultant. It must be hard having it all brought up again. I truly hope it won't happen again and the next pregnancy is a sticky one for you. :hugs:


I forgot to say I got a peak on my CBFM today. :dohh: So DH will JUST miss my ovulation this month. Which sucks but I did ovulate a day earlier than normal so I have my fingers X'ed that my luteal phase is a day longer somehow. :D


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## spidey

jelr- even though the appointment brought up tons of emotions, it sounds like all went well to me. The aspirin might be all you need, and having them keep a closer eye on you is really good too :thumbup: It's good they can give you something for the monthly depression, so if that returns after baby #2, you know you don't have to suffer with it.

Cleck- how crappy for Corey to miss ovulation by just days!! But I hope you're right and you finally get longer luteal phases while he's here :thumbup:

I'm still waiting on AF. If AF comes Tuesday, then my luteal phase will be 9 days long. My last 3 have been 9, 8 and 6 days long. I have absolutely no symptoms of pregnancy or pms, so I'm expecting AF any hour.

Cleck- Emma really went on a growth spurt! If you're moving back to Indiana then you'll get to buy her real winter clothes this year!

Thanks girls for watching Kira's video :flower: I managed to get me singing Happy Birthday on video, although Kira couldn't blow out the candle. But it's still funny because you can see her fake cry and how she can't say the "M" sound for mama :haha: And notice how I have a bottle of cleaner and a knife laying right next to Kira :dohh: Shiv- I need to watch my other video to find the part where you hear her say "Daddy" :haha: So far I've only heard her say "DAAAAAA" but not daddy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_vr3sYl_uI


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## cleckner04

I haven't watched the video yet but I just LOLed at you saying you left a knife and cleaner by her. I am always forgetting that Emma can now reach the countertops and I accidentally leave knives close to the edge. :dohh: And recently I caught Emma with a bottle of cleaner and she was spraying my sliding glass door. :rofl: She even went and grabbed a towel to wipe after she was done spraying. I think she's learning my obsessive cleaning habits. :rofl:


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## cleckner04

OMG she's SO much like Emma! Seriously that just reminded me so much of Emma with her whining and than huge grin when she gets her way. :haha: And did she just tell you to stop? LOL! You are a pyro playing with candles and a lighter. Teaching her bad things. :winkwink:

About winter clothes, I KNOW! I keep telling my mom it's gonna suck because we have to get completely bundled up this winter now. The winters in virginia weren't all that bad either so I haven't had a real full winter since 2004 :shock: I got a taste of it last year while living at home for those 3 months but that's not too bad because it was already springtime by the time we were done there. I do still have a lot of zip up sweatshirt hoodies that I will probably live in during the winters. But Emma doesn't have anything that is suitable.


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## cleckner04

Well, I'm allowed to say now because it's only 24 hours away but DH is home tomorrow!! :dance::dance: They don't let us say until 24 hours beforehand that's why I couldn't tell you ladies. :( I've been cleaning the house like crazy trying to make it perfect before he's back. It's not like my house ever gets that messy in the first place but I feel good spraying down cabinets and light switches and all those wonderful OCD cleaning things that I do at least once a month. :rofl:


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## spidey

:happydance::happydance: Cleckner!!!! I am soooo happy for you!! :happydance: Do you get nervous before you see Corey? Do you have an approximate time, or will you be waiting for the phone call all day tomorrow?

I have slight OCD when it comes to cleaning too :haha: I don't mind having playdough in the rug or toys scattered all over the house while Kira is playing, but at the end of the day I like to have everything put away and clean. When I was pregnant my MIL said to me several times "you can either be a good mom or have a clean house". Grrr.. proved her wrong, huh :haha: I swear it's her favorite thing to say, but now she only says it after she talks about DH's Aunt who has kids. "Aunt Teresa decided she would rather be a good mom than have a clean house. Spidey, one day when you have more kids you'll understand" It makes my blood boil!

Cleck, I love hearing that Emma behaves like Kira. They are very smart and know how to get their way! Hearing you say winters in Virginia weren't that bad makes me feel like a wimp! Maryland winters are only slightly worse than Virginia- I can't imagine what a bad winter must be like!


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## Shiv

Cleck that must be SO exciting for you! Have you explained to Emma that her Daddy is coming home? Do you think she understands? I am guessing we wont see too much of you for a while after tonight then :haha:

Spidey - I am sure Kira is saying more than you think, it sounds like she is saying words to the affect of you do it, when she wants you to blow out the candle. Sophia also does a fake cry. 
i love the pool that you use, how lovely to have access to that in your back garden, and to have the weather to use it!
Did AF show up yet?


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## spidey

no AF yet, but I'm feeling really ugly today so she should show up soon! The urge to chop off my hair is becoming overwhelming once again :haha:


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## cleckner04

Yes I'm nervous about it! I keep getting horrible butterflies in my stomach. I'm scared that we have grown apart or that he'll take one look at me and think 'why am I with this ugly heffer'. :rofl: Seriously I just am worrying about everything. And I'm worried Emma will hate him and scream and cry. I've explained to her that he's coming home but she doesn't seem to understand. 

Today I was painting my toenails in preparation for him and Emma sat down beside me and held out her foot. :haha: So I painted her toenails for the first time ever. I've asked her if she wanted them painted a few times and she always freaks out at me. But this time she was ready. After I did her toes she held out her hand for me to paint her fingernails. Which is weird because I never paint my own fingernails so it's funny that she knows the fingernails get painted IYKWIM. So Emma is now walking around with neon pink fingers and toes. I'm not a huge fan of little girls having painted nails but I figure it's a special occasion with her daddy coming home so it'll be okay. :D


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah, I have no clue when his ship is pulling in. Most of the wives are going super early in the morning and they are basically having a party in the parking lot waiting for them to come. I am SO not doing that. I will wait for him to call and I'll take my sweet ass time getting there. :haha: I hate the crowds and I hate waiting. So he can wait for me. :smug:


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## Shiv

cleckner04 said:


> Oh yeah, I have no clue when his ship is pulling in. Most of the wives are going super early in the morning and they are basically having a party in the parking lot waiting for them to come. I am SO not doing that. I will wait for him to call and I'll take my sweet ass time getting there. :haha: I hate the crowds and I hate waiting. So he can wait for me. :smug:

Too bloody right, you've been waiting for him for 7 months, it is only fair he has to wait for you!

It is understandable that you are nervous, but it must be pretty cool when you are used to each otheragain and you realise why you are together and why you love eachother, like falling in love all over again!


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## jelr

Cleck: :happydance: :happydance: Woohoo for Corey coming home, I can understand those butterflies but it must be as Shiv said falling in love all over again each time, I think that would be cool :thumbup: - I bet even if Emma is not sure of him she will feel how much he loves her and will warm to him quick enough, I think our LO's really pick up on emotions like that. Eh I dont know why you are jealous because you look amazing and carry your weight so well. I am only 5ft 2 and you see every lump and bump that I have :haha: which reminds me I must change the security on those dress pics so you can all see all my lumps and bumps in the dresses :haha:

Spidey: Boo for feeling crap when AF is on the way, Kira is so so cute. Yeah I really have to remember to take stuff away when Natasha is in her kitchen box. I have nearly left a sharp knife down a couple of times but remembered to move it at the last minute :dohh: - She is definitely trying to say you do it and I 100% heard stop there :haha: - There is definitely no need for speech therapy for her and I bet if you brought her she would probably do as Cleck said a while back and tell them to Fuck off :haha:

Shiv: How is the friend making going? Did Sophia sleep any better last night without the pillow?

Thanks girls about the appointment yesterday - I'm grand about it all today, even though it was upsetting I still feel I have definitely turned a corner and am getting back to normal, I do feel very positive that next time around it will all work out. I think I have to really or I would drive myself mad with worry. 

I must stick up those videos on fb tonight actually. it takes so long though as DH's camera is HD. I do have a little one but I can't find the charger and I must get some up to date videos as the ones I have are from May and April.

Yep I'm a bit of clean freak too, in fact I'm anal about it :haha: although since Natasha has been born I have calmed down a lot purely because I dont have time with her and working but like you spidey there are toys around all day and at night when she is in bed I tidy them all away. Dont mind your MIL - you are a great mom and a domestic godess :haha:


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## spidey

I hope you can get some sleep tonight Cleck! Make sure you post while Corey's here- we would be sad not having you around.

Cleck- that is SUPER cute that Emma put out her foot to have her nails painted :cloud9: I bet she's so cute with her painted toes. I haven't painted my toe nails in such a long time, but if Kira wanted hers done too, I would paint them :haha:

Thanks for all the language feedback. Even though most of it seems gibberish at the time, I can hear some possible words when I watch the videos. Kira was watching her video where she wanted to go swimming, and I asked the question "do you want mommy or daddy to go with you?" and in real life she said the same exact "word" that she said seconds later in the video. So it's neat that Kira is saying the same word and its just not a random sound. I guess I worry about it too much because I was so delayed as a kid. It doesn't help the my MIL always tells a story about how she "taught" all the kids in the neighborhood how to talk because she enunciates her words so perfectly. And how her 2 boys talked at such a young age due to her great parenting. I've been forced to hear that stupid story about 50 times, and every time I remind her that I didn't talk until I was 4 and my mom did a great job, so there's more to it than that. Eeeek.. thats 2 MIL complaints in ONE day! I must stop :haha:

No AF yet.. hmmmm..... if I make it to tomorrow that will give me a 10 day luteal phase!!


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## cleckner04

Your MIL sounds like a stupid bitch. :rofl: At least in this case. She taught kids how to speak? Yeah, cause that's how it works. :roll::haha: Kids will speak when they are good and ready. I think Kira is definitely right on target. The babies in our group that are speaking full sentences are just ahead a bit. That's all. :D My own MIL is hit and miss with advice like that. She kept asking why Emma wasn't walking yet at 9 months. :wacko: Because apparently all of her kids were walking by that age. :dohh: This is why it's good to write all of those milestones down because we will forget in our old age. :haha: 

jelr- I looked on your FB and somehow I missed the pictures of natasha's new room! It is SO cute! I love the light and the wardrobe. Your DH made that wardrobe?! I need to get my DH to make stuff like that. It's very neat. They don't have closets in the UK do they? Everyone seems to have those wardrobe things. I didn't see the dress piccies you are talking about so you must not have showed us yet. Let us know if you open it up for us to see! :flower:



So I think I may delete myself from the lion cub facebook TTC group. All the drama in there is driving me crazy. And the nasty posts girls are putting as their status updates are starting to bother me so I may have a friends list cleanout too. :wacko:


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## spidey

Oh, I remember your MIL making those walking comments about Emma! She would have had a heart attack if Kira was her grandchild- not walking till 16 months :rofl: 

Do you know that in the US, a bedroom isn't considered a bedroom if it doesn't have a closet :haha: 

I saw all the drama on FB too. I've been considering leaving the group for awhile just because I'm not sure if I would even post there IF I got pregnant. I don't know many of the girls there either (my own fault since I took a bnb break during 2nd and 3rd tri). I think its much easier to post here anyway since I can rant about unimportant things :haha:


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## cleckner04

Wait, you took a break in 2nd and 3rd tri? I don't remember you being gone. Weird. :haha: I've been considering leaving the group for a while too. I don't even post on the regular lion cub group on there really. I read it all, but I just don't feel like I have much to contribute. :haha: 

It's weird because there are just the few of us diehard fans that still get on here. :haha: jelr, spidey, shiv, and me. MJ occasionally too. But everyone else disappeared. I know nuttymummy still gets on but only in her other group. The flumpy mummies or something like that. And there are quite a few 'lion cubs' in there but they had their own group too. 


Really a room isn't considered a bedroom without a closet? That actually explains a lot for me because looking at these houses on the realtor website it lists them as a 2 bedroom but in the pictures there are 3. But without closets so that makes sense. :thumbup:


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## spidey

I posted alot during 1st tri since I was off work from m/s :haha:. Then I went back full time after the m/s subsided and I was overwhelmed with constant remarks and comments about my pregnancy at work. I think everyone had good intentions, but sometimes I think they were TOO excited about the whole thing and I always received daily remarks on my growth, clothing, belly button poppage, what I was eating for lunch and so on. Plus I had EVERYONE trying to tell me horror stories of birth which I really wanted to avoid due to my desires for an unmedicated birth. To top it off, my crazy MIL would always pop out of her house whenever I was outside and make weird remarks to me like "you go girl, you are SO big and beautiful" :growlmad: :haha: Yeah, so I had to step away from here since it was the only thing in life I still had control over :rofl:

I'm off to bed now- good luck tomorrow Cleckner. :happydance: I'll be thinking of you all day. I want a full detailed report of the reunion :blush::haha:


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## cleckner04

:rofl::rofl: Okay, although it's gonna be kinda difficult for us to have a real proper reunion now that we have Emma. Before Emma was around I would've set up candles all over and gotten dressed up in a kinky outfit, etc. Not as fun this time around. :haha: Maybe I should dig out the tealight candles and at least do that. :muaha:

I'm sure I'll still be on tomorrow at some point. I can't stay away from here for too long. I don't want to miss you getting a BFP this month. :winkwink:


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## cleckner04

Another quick update on the ex-friend who's husband was cheating. Well the 'mistress' changed her relationship status on facebook to single instead of in a relationship. And the wife changed her profile picture to a picture of her, her husband and the kids all smiling. So I am assuming that the husband never told the wife about it and he dumped the mistress instead now that the ship is gonna be home. (He flew off the ship a few days early so he's already home with his family) :rofl::rofl: So he basically used this girl in my husbands shop for the cruise and now that they are home he's done with her. :wacko: I feel bad for her kinda even though she knew the ******* was married. Such drama. I love it. :lol:


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## Shiv

Is it completely wrong that i love a good bitch fight (as llong as it doesn't include anyone I *really* care about). I missed all the action last night on the fb group, and I am sad cos I do find them quite funny (bad Shiv!). I can imagine how it went though. I do use the group, but not to discuss anything terribly important, I don't chat to them like I do with you guys.

I like this little elite group on here because I feel like we are actually friends, after so long we still make it on most days, we never argue even though we have different parenting and life views, in fact I can honestly say it is a very very rare occasion when anyone even says something that makes me roll my eyes. I would be REALLY upset if this group disipated completely becasue i think we are a comfortable group if that makes any sense, no drama here!

Cleck - TODAY IS THE DAY! Are you wearingyour sexy new top to go and meet Corey? i am really excited for you and Emma :happydance:

Spidey - yay for either a longer luteal phase or fingers crossed a BFP!! your MiL sounds like a vey wise woman, the community must be SO thankful to her for teaching all the kids to speak, imagine without her you'd have a load of mutes :haha:

jelr - glad you feel you have turned a corner. I think positivity is the best way to go :thumbup

Sophia is back to sleeping 13 hours a night - it is bliss, and I feel like a different woman for getting justa couple more hours sleep a night. MJ if you are reading then hopefully Adam follow suit soon :hugs:

Love you all ladies, and I mean that :hugs:


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## Mary Jo

*waves* just to let you know, I am still here, not going anywhere either... :D 

no idea what all the FB group nonsense was about last night, but it certainly got a lot nastier than it needed to. bizarre. guess some people really love the scent of a drama and a chance to stir. :( I'm sorry if it means you two leaving the group. But I definitely understand your choice. 

loved the videos you posted, Shiv and Spidey. :D Adam is definitely closer to Kira in terms of speech and language, kid barely said more than one or two words before 20 months. He has about 30 or so now, so I have stopped worrying completely. I have wondered if he just doesn't feel the need to bother much? He's not a quiet kid, he babbles a LOT, and I know I simply don't understand a lot of it. Chris is a lot better than I am, maybe he's just more familiar with small children. The only ones I have ever spent much time around, other than Adam, are my nephew and nieces, and as they are Norwegian and being brought up with two languages, when they babbled if I didn't understand them I figured they were trying to speak Norwegian. :rofl: I have wondered if Adam is trying the same...

Sophia seems to be way ahead with her talking and singing and jumping! :D Adam sings Postman Pat but it's just Pa Pa Pa to the tune. :rofl: 

ack. I let Adam play in the fridge and he's managed to open a whole tub of plain yogurt and is now rubbing it into the floor (fortunately it's laminate boards) and smearing it all over himself. we were going to go out but now it looks like it's going to be bath and BED.

hope you're having fun, Cleck. :haha:

will be back later, got to clean my little monkey up now...


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## jelr

WooHoo today is the day Cleck - I know you probably wont have much time to get in but please let us know how it all goes, we want all the details of the meet up and how Emma gets on with him.

Spidey: Yep your MIL does sound like a bitch alright - by the sounds of it - she is actually not very happy in her own life and needs to feel superior to others so she tried to convince herself and others that she is a wonderful mother. You can not teach a baby to speak or walk they just do it in their own time and that has nothing to do with the parents. Silly woman grr - now I'm ranting at your MIL. :haha:

RE: wardrobes and closets, I always presumed that a wardrobe was a closet is it not.

Ah girls I hope you dont leave the fb group because I know sometimes I get more time to get in there lately. Although I have to be honest and I know some of you might differ with me, but I think we can be honest here at this stage there has been quite a few posts in the last few weeks that have made me roll my eyes in there, although that could be my own problem as I'm trying to be postive about life so I'm having problems with every little thing being negative. I'm like Shiv and am nosy and love an ould fight every now and again once it is not to do with me or mine :haha:

I have put up the dresses for you for to see, so hopefully you can now, although I'm a bit wary of fb now as I left the video to upload while I was in bed but set it to me only to see it until this morning to see if it worked as I had to compress it to put it up and you were able to see it spidey and so was my mam even though it was set to me only. I got DH to log in from work this morning to check and he can't see it so I'm hoping it was only a clitch for a minute. Spidey do you mind checking to see if you can still see it and I will leave it as me only for the minute and I will change the settings later for the 4 of you to see also.

Oh MJ I hope you like the smell of yogurt, funnily my DH hates it he always said when I was pregnant that I would have to do any yogurt feedings as he wont even touch a child who has yogurt on them, although he has relented and does with Natasha. So I hope you are not like that seeing as it is everywhere :haha: - hope it doesnt take long to clean up.

Well I am meant to be working so may move my ass - but I'm all over the place between the video being viewable and all the stuff going on in fb :haha:


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## jelr

Oh meant to say I love you girls too - God we are all getting so sentimental - I really feel like I have made good friends here and you guys have really helped me get over the last few months so thanks from me too :hugs:


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## spidey

I can't see your video anymore Jelr, but I can see your dresses!! I'm going to look at them when I'm done posting!

MJ- I LOVED those pics of Adam, he's adorable!

Ahhhh... I never meant to have you girls ask me to stay on the FB group- I HATE when other people post things like "I'm leaving" and expect everyone to plead with them to stay :haha: Some of the chat over the last few weeks has annoyed me too Jelr, but I have an awful desire to watch drama unflold that I doubt I will leave :blush:

Cleck, TODAY is the day :happydance:

Shiv, I'm sooo glad Sophia is sleeping for you again :thumbup:

Kira is trying to get me to build a guinea pig house out of blocks so I'll post more later as I know there is more I want to say. Kira gives me a toy to play with and makes me play with it as she does something else :haha:

Oh, and no AF yet. I peed on an OPK this morning and no BFP. AF today will give me a 10 day luteal phase... awesome!!!


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## cleckner04

I'll catch up in a bit. Emma is throwing a giant tantrum atm. We woke up really early because I couldn't sleep and my tossing and turning woke Emma up. So I may try to get her(and me) to nap. DH is back right now but he has to stay on the ship for a while to drive forklifts around. We knew about this in advance and they are letting him have two days off because of his help. So I won't be picking him up until 3-4 according to him. But he's awful at time so it's probably more like 5-6. :rofl: Okay, off to deal with Emma. :wave:


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## jelr

Spidey I knew you didn't say it for that reason that is why I asked you to stay because I do hate that myself, I am sad when people think they have to leave but I'm not going to beg anyone to stay as we are all adults. - although I think if any of you four were to leave I would beg :haha:

MJ: those photos are hilarious, I really laughed at them. See Adam knew you didn't a good old laugh today :rofl:

Shiv: Yay for sleeping - she really must not have liked the pillow.

Cleck: Oooo I wonder if you have met Corey already, I really hope Emma is in better form.

Finally got the videos on Fb - jeez they take forever and I have set them so only you four can see. 

Am in two minds about the dress I bought now again, as the more I look at the photos the more I like the pink one with the ruffles on top or the purple one. I really hope my cousin comes back to me and says that the bridesmaids are more a wine purple than just purple and if so I can the purple one is in the same shop where I got the one in the end so I can change it. They will be sick of seeing me coming through the door :haha: - I can't go for the one with the ruffles as it would mean spending more money and we really need to watch our pennies for the next while as DH work is slow getting off the ground so he is going to be on half wages for another month and I will be out of work for the summer and we have a busy month. I was going to cancel my birthday meal and our anniversary meal but DH is so adamant that we go out and enjoy ourselves for both occassions that he would rather go hungry himself than us not go out when we haven't been out in so long and have had a crappy year and that he is not having my birthday or our anniversary not celebrated.


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## spidey

Jelr, those are the 2 dresses I like the most too. I agree that the purple color looks better than the lighter pink. I really like the one with the ruffles, but it's just a dress and you shouldn't have to miss out on your birthday dinner just to buy a dress. When is the wedding? I noticed a second video on FB so I'll take a look at it once Kira gets to sleep tonight!

Clecker- you must have picked up Corey by now! I hope you guys are having a good time 

Still no AF- she is torturing me on purpose! I'm certain that I'm not pregnant because my nips are telling me that I'm not, but since I haven't got a visit from AF yet, I keep thinking "what if". I'm even having slight nausea and thinking "oh, this could be m/s" but I know it's my normal pre-AF nausea. On a positive note, if AF comes tomorrow then my luteal phase will be 11 days :happydance:


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## Mary Jo

jelr, I had a good look through the dresses as well last night, and completely agree with you and Spidey, the purple (it's like a deep lilac, isn't it?) and the ruffled ones are gorgeous on you! really hope the bridesmaids are wearing a red-purple so you can wear your purple one. also agree with Jim about prioritising the money for celebrating your brithday and anniversary, I'd say you could do with a couple of good nights out together after all that's gone on in the last year or so.

Spidey, are you testing again or are you just going to wait this out? Even if it's a no, that's great that your luteal phase is longer! Your nips might be having an off day... even psychic nips can't be on top form all the time. :haha:


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## spidey

Just a quick update that AF arrived this morning so no bfp this month :growlmad: but the 11 day luteal phase is a huge improvement :thumbup: and I can continue to trust the accuracy of my nips :haha:


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## jelr

Those psycic nips never fail to do they :haha: - Sorry the :witch: got you, but Yay for a longer luteal phase :thumbup:

Yeah I think DH is right also and I'm really looking forward to going out and catching up with everyone and also to us going out on our own for a night. Although on the other hand he never worries about money and is always positive where as i'm a worry wart when it comes to things like that - he even told me to go and get that other dress be fecked but there is no way I'm spending more money on dresses especially now that we have found out he is only going to be on half wages for another month (which is why I was going to cancel everything) - but then on the other hand maybe I shouldn't be so worried because he has always been right over the last 10 years when it comes to money and it has always worked out okay in the end. There is no way I'm spending more on dresses though as the one thing that has always got us through and up until now we hadn't been affected by the recession is that we have been careful with money so I dont want to start squandering it now when things are tight :haha:

I have sent you all a photo though of the bridesmaids on pm on fb to see if you think it is too close. Honest opinions now because I'm heading into town with my mam and sister and Natasha this afternoon to change it if it is not too close but on the other hand I dont want to if it is too close. I have also text the pics onto some of my friends and the majority rules :haha: - on the other hand if it is too close I dont want to chance it as at my wedding one of my best friends wore a similar colour to my bridesmaids which didn't bother me at all in fact when she found out about the colour of my bridesmaids she was going to change the dress and I told her not too as I knew hers was short and it would look different. But loads of people did comment on it and I would hate for people to be commenting on me like that.


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## jelr

Oh yeah and DH pressie for our anniversary arrived today - We decided this year we are not spending a fortune on each other and are going to get gifts from the list that you are meant to get for anniversaries but when we checked there is only a list for the UK, US and modern so we decided we can pick from any once it is for 4th - so it was a choice between flowers or fruit - linen and lace - or electrical so I picked the linen and lace one. Can you can guess what I got him (well its for me really, but he will love it :blush:) :haha: - thought it was time I make an effort before I get pregnant and again and put the weight back on :haha:

Oh Cleck if you are lurking I didn't send pics to you as I reckon you will be far too busy I wont say getting to know DH again but him getting to know you :haha:


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## cleckner04

Ok, DH has duty today which means he's gone all day and night. So I am going to catch up right now on all the posts that I meant to reply on yesterday. :blush: I'll tell about our reunion after the replies. :thumbup:




Shiv- Yay for 13 hours of sleep!! :dance::dance: I bet that feels good. I agree that our group is comfy and we are all great friends. I often wish we all lived much closer together because I think we'd all get along well IRL too. 

MJ- I saw the yogurt pictures of adam in the 'mess' thread on the toddler section and I got a giant giggle. :haha: He's so cute. That's totally up Emma's alley too with messes. 

jelr- I definitely wouldn't call a wardrobe a closet. A closet for me is a hole in the wall basically with doors on it. :haha: I think the wardrobes look really nice though. With all the cubes for storage and still spots to hang clothes. It's like my dream storage because it's so neat and nice. Our closets only have the poles hanging across and than there is usually one shelf at the top to store stuff. I'll add a picture of my closet to show. Oh, and you know I love the dress with the ruffles at the top too. It really suits your figure. -Just saw the latest post and I do think the purple looks nicer than the light pink. Do you really think people will care that much if you have a similar color dress as the bridesmaids? I can't see why anyone would care as long as the bride isn't upset about it. Weddings are so crazy with all the customs and 'rules'. 

Okay..here's my closet. 

Spoiler
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_8329.jpg

spidey- Boo for AF. :( But yay for 11 day luteal phase!! :dance: I went back and checked my past months and 2 out of 4 of my cycles were 11 day phases. The other 2 were 9 and 10 days. So not as bad as I've been making them seem I guess. I hope you get your BFP soon. :D

re: the facebook drama- I am just amazed at how some grown adults act. I know I'm not perfect and I've been in the middle of some of those cat fights but now looking back on it I just think how incredibly stupid it is to fight like that on the internet. :wacko: And to post mean statuses as a main status update on profiles is just SO immature. I hate that people use facebook to air dirty laundry and fight publicly like that. The namecalling, etc and saying they hope Kim would have a boy. :growlmad: So I'm gonna do a clean and I already did delete myself from that group. If I get pregnant I have you guys on here and it's drama free. I already have enough stress with DH losing his job next year and going away all the time, etc. I just don't need random petty drama online too. :haha: 


I, too, love all of you girls. I think I am very lucky to have a group to come to if I want to rant or complain or brag, etc. I know that you girls will always listen and understand. It's especially great for me because I am alone here in California as far as friends go. I just feel so blessed to have you girls. :hugs::hugs: 




And now DH being back. He had to stay back on the ship to drive the forklifts and I called it when I said he'd be later than he originally said. :haha: He didn't get off until closer to 6 pm. I was angry at first but than I made him WALK off the base because Emma and I were at a park nearby to keep her happy instead of making her wait in the car where she probably would've been throwing a fit. So he had to walk like 1.5 miles to me. :rofl::rofl: 
I did wear my sexy top and jeans outfit. I had my hair down and straightened so it looked even longer. It's down to my waist so DH loves that. Emma was in a little white dress and I put her hair back in a little ponytail. She had on cute little sparkly white shoes too. BUT, we were at a park that had mulch and dirt under everything and by the time DH got to us, she had thrown the dark mulch and dirt mixture into the air and it landed on her head and all over her dress. She was FILTHY by the time he saw us. :dohh: There was dirt crusted in her hair and all over her hands, feet and face. :roll: But he didn't care. 
DH came right up to me and gave me a giant hug and at this point Emma was on the other side of the play area so didn't see him. Well I called her over and she saw him and got really shy and scared. She is always like this with men so I went and picked her up and brought her to him. He didn't try to hold her, he just tried saying hi to her but she kept hiding her face in my neck. DH took it okay and we just loaded her in the car to start heading home without making more effort with her at that time. In the car he had his hand on my leg and he started feeling around it and asked where the rest of my leg is. :rofl: Since it's a lot thinner now. I asked if he can really tell a difference and he said 'hell yeah!'. And he kept saying how sexy I am, etc. :cloud9: 
We got home and DH took Emma out of her carseat instead of me and she went just fine in his arms. I got pictures of it because it's the first time he held her for 6.5 months so definitely a picture sort of moment. He is always really gentle with Emma at first. Kind of like coaxing an unfamiliar animal with a treat. :haha: It only took about 20 minutes at home and DH asked Emma if he could hold her and she walked right up to him and held her arms up to be picked up. :cloud9: 
Also, Emma and I made a sign for DH that we put on our front door that said 'welcome home daddy'. It had the outline of my hand and Emma's hand on it, and than I let Emma color all around the paper. He really seemed to like that when we first walked into the front door. I got a picture of the sign too. I'll probably post all the pictures in a bit for you all to see. 
DH is freaking built. He has been lifting weights the entire time and I was angry at him at first because he has been losing weight too and he weighs less than me. So that made me a bit upset when he'd email me that. Well, seeing him in person. :sex: Seriously, I couldn't stop touching his arms and stomach. :rofl: He even has washboard abs now. *drools* I hate that I'm so turned on by it. I always said I don't like guys with muscles like that. I'd rather have them a little soft and cuddly. But I have to admit he is very lickable. :blush: And lick him I did. :haha: 
Now to the sexy time part. I put on Emma's favorite cartoon in the living room and got out crayons and coloring books for her on the floor and we snuck to the kitchen. :rofl: We managed to 'perform' in the kitchen, the stairway, and the landing of the stairway before Emma started coming towards us and we had to quickly fix our clothes like caught teenagers. :rofl::rofl: 
After that we gave it a rest and went for a walk. Emma fell asleep during the walk and as soon as we noticed that she was asleep we rushed home. :rofl: I laid Emma down in her bed and we snuck off to our room. It's so weird doing it in our own bed. Because before he left we would usually have to sneak downstairs to get any sexy time in since Emma cosleeps. So it was nice having our own bed again. I'm not gonna get into the dirty details but I just have to say it was SOOOO worth the wait. OMG it was so good. :rofl: I forget how good an orgasm can actually be with a real live person. :rofl::rofl: My vibrating friend isn't even close to being as good. I am happy to report that I am walking a bit funny today because I'm all bruised up and I'm very satisfied with myself. :smug: 

DH said he slept like crap last night though because Emma woke up in the middle of the night and climbed into our bed. Well as soon as she saw DH there, she was kicking against him trying to get him out of the bed. :rofl: So he didn't sleep well with all the pushing and kicking. I told him it will take some time but she's just going to have to learn to share. She also threw a fit anytime DH and I would try to cuddle on the couch or when he'd try to hug me. She would rush over and shove against him and try to climb into my lap. :dohh: I think she's telling him who I really belong to. :haha: I'm hoping that doesn't last forever though because it's not nice being separated from him when all I really want to do is lay there cuddling. :blush:


----------



## cleckner04

Oh yeah, and another random awesome thing, yesterday I weighed myself in the afternoon because I forgot to in the morning. Well I usually weigh a lot more in the afternoon but I was down to 191.6 :shock::dance: I have NO idea how I managed to do that but that means I lost 48.4 lbs while DH was gone. :dance::dance: This morning I am down a little more at 191.2!! :dance: Tomorrow is my real official weigh in though so I hope I can keep it off and maybe even a bit more. I'm so excited. I'm almost to the 50 lb mark with loss. That is AMAZING!! I never thought I'd get this far. I figured I wouldn't even get to pre-Emma weight and here I am working my way down to pre-miscarriage weight too. :yipee:


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## Shiv

Cleck - your post made me cry (well until youstarted talking baout sex and then I was a little less emotional!) i love that you made Corey walk to meet you :haha: I am glad it didn't take Emma long ot warm to him, but I guess it will take a while longer before she is ready to share you with him. 

Corey sounds like he is ripped now, it is so cool that you both get to discover a new body (and in so many different places, good effort :haha:).

SO when he worksnow, does he stay on the ship, and does he work Monday - Friday?

Spidey - sorry AF gotyou, but yay for a longer luteal phase, fingers crossed for next month, you and Cleck can get preggo together again now!

jelr- I take it Jim is in for a treat on your anniversary night :haha:


Well I am going to meet the mummies again tomorrow,so wish me luck!

Oh and Cleck - well done on another great weightloss week. 1 more lb and I get to perve on another photo, if you can happen to get one with Corey nakes in the backgroud, that would be super :haha:


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## cleckner04

:rofl: at Corey naked in the background. :lol: I think he'd disapprove of that idea. ;) 

I probably should've never brought up the drama on facebook cause now if they read this it will start in here too. :blush: I do love a good argument too. DH and I always have small arguments over random stupid facts and each of us always thinks we are right and the other always wrong. :rofl: I miss those kinds of arguments. It's always the most dumb stuff too like who directed this movie, etc. 

Corey will work monday-friday on the ship. He said it's 6:30am-2:30pm which is AMAZING. Before his ship went out to sea it was 6:30am-5:30pm. He also has duty every four days. So every four days he has to stay on the ship day and night. They do this so there is always people on the ship working and keeping an eye on it at all times. He'll often 'stand watch' is what they call it and he basically will be in charge of watching a certain part of the ship. Which is so boring for him but it has to be done. I don't think I've ever really talked about the ship itself to you guys. It's probably not at all what you ladies would picture in your head. It's seriously huge. Here are some stats and some pictures that I stole from the ships facebook page. :haha: 
_COMMISSIONED: March 13, 1982
COST (1980): Approximately 3.9 billion dollars
PROPULSION: Nuclear, with enough fuel for 20 years of normal operation
SPEED: Thirty plus knots
NUMBER OF REACTORS: Two
LENGTH OVER FLIGHT DECK: 1,092 feet
BREADTH OF FLIGHT DECK: 252 feet
AREA OF FLIGHT DECK: 4.5 Acres
NUMBER OF AIRCRAFT ELEVATORS: Four
HEIGHT, KEEL TO MAST: 244 feet (equal to a 24 story building)
ANCHORS: Two at 30 tons each

It holds about 6,000 people and 90 aircraft at full capacity._
https://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x249/docmerlincwo3usn/USS20Carl20Vinson-1-1.jpg
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-06-16at124640PM.png
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-06-16at124424PM.png
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-06-16at124407PM.png

And they did what is called 'swim call' where they let the sailors jump off a platform on the side of the ship in the middle of the ocean. Dh did it once on his old ship too and he did it on this one. He's not in these pictures BTW. These are just random people. :haha: They than swam around and had to climb that rope ladder that you see the guy doing. Pretty crazy stuff! 
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-06-16at12159PM.png
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-06-16at12424PM.png


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## jelr

Aww Cleck your meeting with Corey was like a fairytale movie with a happy ending bar Corey walking 1.5 miles and Emma being covered in muck :rofl: - but then toddlers in parks in white dresses only ever stay clean in the movies :haha: - No seriously I'm so glad your meeting went well and that Emma has softened to him already. I bet by the end of the week it will be like he has always been there to her, I knew she would soften to him as I bet she has picked up on his love and emotions towards her already.

God ye did well on the ould nooky too with Emma around this time, just shows to show you when you have an itch that needs to be scratched you will find a way :haha: Well done on the weight loss too, I bet you will lose even more this week with all that action :haha: Woohoo for Corey's abs too.

wowsers at the ship, it is huge. We went on a carribean cruise on our honeymoon and I was amazed by the size of the ship and I dont think it is a patch on that one.

No I totally agree about the posting on public statuses, I said that the last time there was a arguement that I didn't like it and I thought about leaving the group the last time because peoples husbands were talking about hitting people and all sorts and I was really uncomfortable with it I think it is a private group so the arguement should stay private in the group, but then I'm a paranoid freak when it comes to privacy :haha: hence why I never put pics or videos up here because it is open and dont say as much as I would like to about myself either sometimes because I'm convinced someone I know would read it :haha: I really do wish we could have this forum but it could be locked so as only the people that are in it can see. :haha: I do like that about the fb group that only the group can see it but as you said before it is easier to have a conversation in here because it is a post rather than a comment, plus I find it easier to get onto fb. If only fb had the private group setting with more of a layout like this :thumbup:

Yay for both of your luteul phases being longer spidey and cleck - bet you both get pregnant at the same time :thumbup:

Shiv: yep he is in for a treat :haha: - see I dont even like saying that on here because I'm imagining somebody from work or my mother seeing it :haha: - I know I'm too paranoid for my own good :haha: Ooo the best of luck with meeting the mommies again tomorrow, I really hope it goes well.

Spidey: dont you have a playdate this week too. I really hope that goes well too.

MJ: how are you feeling now, a little better I hope.

thanks for the input on the dresses girls - I'm far happier now that I have gotten the purple one and dont feel like it is too near the bridesmaids (I know I really shouldn't give a shit if people think it is either but I do :haha:) - I know you probably thought I was a bit mad not being able to just go out and pick and bloody dress without getting the world and its mothers opinion, I'm not usually so indecisive, dont know know why but I really really want to look and feel good at this wedding, think it because I thought I was going to be pregnant and as big as a house with nothing to wear and stone cold sober and I did have a whinge about that when I found out I was pregnant and feel so so bad for it now and would give anything to be just that really so my way of not focusing on that is to make the most of it and feel like I look good and kick back and enjoy the day if that make sense, so I really appreciated everyones opinions, plus I actually found it much harder now that I'm working on a budget because the last few years I have been used to just buying what I wanted for something like this and not having to worry about the cost.

I think I will have to treat myself to that pink one with the ruffles though if once DH gets back on full pay and we are back on our feet :haha: - although it will probably be gone and really I dont need another pink dress as I actually have one that I'm wearing for DH's nans party at the weekend that I bought last year and haven't worn yet.

Well I best get to bed, I have been in bed late every night this week and I'm only just asleep when Natasha has woken and I bet what will happen is it will all catch up on me on Saturday night when we are out :dohh:


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## spidey

awww Cleck, your post was awesome. All the details that I wanted to hear :blush: I'm so glad things went well and Emma warmed up quickly to Corey. I think its super cute that she doesn't like him cuddling with you. She's like one of those small dogs that is protective of their owner :haha: I can't believe you had Emma entertained long enough to get some :sex: in :rofl: We totally need to get our BFP's this month- or you at the least! Your closet is just like mine. A bar at the top with a shelf on top of it. And Corey's ship is HUGE! 

I didn't see the boy comment in that fight the other night. I guess it happened after I went to bed. I do wish we all lived closer together.. but if any of you girls want a vacation to Maryland my house is open to you! Seriously- it would be fun.

Jelr- I'm glad you're happy with your final dress choice :thumbup: You'll have to take a picture once you get all the accessories! I'm glad you got the purple one- I really like that color!

Shiv, good luck with your mommy meet-up. I hope you're less nervous this time.

My play date is Monday, so still some days away.


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## Shiv

ok Cleck so maybe not Corey fully naked in the photo, how about just a chest shot? :haha:

What was your weigh in today? how is Emma getting on with Corey now?

Jelr - so glad you got the purple dress, you look great in it, your waist is to die for.

Spidey - is your play date at someones house? 

Well i met a couple of the girls today at a soft play, and invited them round for a coffee at my house on Monday and they both said yes hurrah :thumbup: They both have 2 boys so i hate to think what state my house will be in when they leave :haha:

When i was at the soft play today, this boy came up to me (i would guess he was about 4, but I am rubbish with ages) and he just hit me across the face :shrug: i was gobsmacked, and although i wanted to wring his little neck, I just sat there opened mouthed until he ran off!


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## spidey

woohoo Shiv for having the ladies come to your house Monday :happydance: So far you're winning the mommy friend competition :haha: 

The playdate is at my house Monday morning and I have a feeling both ladies won't show up. Maggie is the lady who posted the original ad for a playdate and I responded to it. Spidey, the introverted one, was basically forced into making the plans- date, time and location. In my email to her last week I sent her my phone # and address and she wrote back and said "can you send me a reminder email later in the week so I don't forget." Hmmm.. so I'm not feeling too good about this- if she originally wanted the playdate then why do I have to be her personal schedule keeper :haha: The second lady named Lesley fails to respond to my emails so I guess she's hoping I go away. 

I'll take a chest shot of Corey too :blush: I have a thing for nice manly chests. DH's chest is what attracted me to him. I was just friends with him at the time and I drove to his house to pick him up and he came out with his shirt unbuttoned and I suddenly fell in love :haha:

Shiv, I can't believe a boy just came up and hit you! I wouldn't know what to do either! 

When you girls have a play date, how long do they usually last? When my work friend comes to visit she usually stays for 3 hours, but she lives about 40 minutes away. Twice I asked Maggie what time works best for her Monday morning and gave her the option of anytime between 9am and 1pm. She never told me a time so I just emailed her a reminder (ugh!) and told her 10am-12. No more options for her, she lost her chance! :haha:


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## Shiv

When myold mummy friends used to come over they would usually saty between 90mins and 2 hours. Mainly because by the time theyget the LO up and ready and here, after 2 hours it is normally lunch time! I hope at least one of the women turns up SPidey. Maybe the first one is just very forgetful so would like a reminder!


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## cleckner04

Good luck with your playdate monday Spidey!! Whenever we have playdates it varies on times but usually lasts about 3 hours. Although I'm never really watching the time because we are usually too busy chatting and chasing the kids. 

Shiv- I cannot believe some kid came up and hit you. :wacko: That's awful. I probably would have been too stunned to react too. 


Well I've been putting Emma down in her own bed now and last night she slept in her own bed from 9:30 pm till 5 am before running into our room for booby. :shock::dance: I hope it starts becoming a regular occurrence. I was shocked when I woke up and saw the clock with 5 am on it. :haha: 

We've been fairly busy. Went to the beach and a science museum yesterday. Than walked to the bank and park today. Emma is still skittish around corey. And still won't let him come near me. But it's only day 3 of him being here so I can't expect miracles. I told him to just keep trying with her. 

My weigh in was bad yesterday. I haven't eaten any crap food but I was back up to 193. I think it's because we've been exercising a lot with walking and playing so my muscles are working more than usual since I haven't exercised in a while. Plus I didn't drink much water yesterday. But I'm charting my food into myfitnesspal today and will hopefully stick to it so I don't gain any more. :wacko:


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## Shiv

Sounds like you have fallen back into life with Corey around very easily Cleck. Emma will get used to him being around really quickly I'm sure.

That is awesome about Emma staying in her own bed for so long, maybe she doesn't like being squashed now corey is back :haha: i hope it continues for you. at least now you know she can do it!

Been feeling a bit down today (damn hormones). I go through a phase every 3 months or so where I fell miserable because I haven't got anything to look forward to. No plans made to do anything fun. We have friends coming to visit this coming weekend, but David has been told there is a good chance he will have to go away with work on Wednesday for a week, so he won't be here. Normally this wouldn't bother me, they are just as much my friends as his, but............it can be really hard work having guests to stay and without david being here I will be the one doing all the cooking and tidying, and asking if people need drinks or food etc, as well as looking after Sophia. I know that my friends will help to entertain Sophia, but now it just seems like a bit of a chore rather than a pleasure. Oh well hopefully David won't be away.............just me having a moan!


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## Shiv

So we've started buying bits and pieces for Sophia's new room. We have changed tack a little bit, the first thing we bought was this as Sophia saw it in a shop and loved it (by loved I mean screamed until we gave it to her :haha:)

https://www.mollieandfred.co.uk/images/products/41t.jpg

Then we got this wall sticker

https://s7v1.scene7.com/is/image/JohnLewis/231022525?$fash_product$

and these wall stickers

https://www.beckyandlolo.co.uk/images/product/Tivoli_Garden_Wall_Stickers1_med.gif

then we got these two bedding sets........David had final say!

https://www.childrens-rooms.co.uk/childrensrooms-web/images/products/detail/2044.jpg

https://s7v1.scene7.com/is/image/JohnLewis/000175353?$fash_product$

That's it so far, I am looking forward to getting it all delivered now. Would like to find a cute bedside lamp and lampshade and then some girly bits to put on the bookshelf!

Oh and I now have 3 ladies coming for coffee tomorrow! If they bring all their kids that will be 6 kids as well as me and Sophia! eek, I even baked! Good luck with your playdate Spidey :thumbup:


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## jelr

Shiv: that stuff is gorgeous, the room will look absolutely smashing when it is all done. Best of luck with tomorrow, I hope it all goes really well and the house is not ransacked by all those children :haha: - I hope you are feeling a bit better too, I get like that when we have nothing coming up or nothing planned, think that is why I was also down a few months back as we hadn't been anywhere in ages, hopefully getting to know these women more will help cheer you up :thumbup: - thanks about the comment on my waist, I do think that dress is flattering to my shape because I carry my weight on my lower tummy which can be seen in the first dresses I got :haha:

Spidey: I really hope at least one of your mommy friends turns up which I'm sure they will, the lady that needs a reminder may have just wanted to be sure that you really wanted her to come or something. I can't answer the play date question because any of Natasha's play dates have been with either friends of mine or family so they could be here all day really depending on what is going on.

Cleck: I'm glad you are settling in well. Could the weight gain be OV again? I hope Emma is warming up to Cory, I also think it is cute that she wont let you two cuddle, just shows how territorial she is of her mom. I forgot to say what you call a closet we would call a walk in wardrobe. 

Well we had DH's nans party last night and it was lovely to get out for a night and I felt really well with the weight gone again. We also had a lovely relaxing day here for fathers day and just relaxed at home and in the garden. DH loved the handmade cards I got done with the photos on them and Natasha hand and foot print on her one, he even had a few tears which is so unlike him. I have only seen him cry when Natasha was born and on both mc, so that melted my heart and was so worth it :thumbup:

Oh I also forgot to tell you, I brought Natasha to get her feet measured and she is now in a 6G so I got her new shoes. I think she has my feet though as she has a big difference in both feet which I have too as one of her feet is just above the 5 1/5 and the other is the 6 :haha:


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## Mary Jo

Shiv, I was in town today and cut through British Home Stores to get the bus - and on the way through the kids' bedding dept saw a girls' duvet set with owls on! very cute. just looked it up online and can't find it, but they do have some owl accessories -

twit twoo and more twit twoo

jelr, Natasha's feet sound like Adam's :lol: - he is a 6G (in them a few months) but when we got them the other foot was a 5.5!


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## spidey

Shiv, the owl stuff is cute. I have a few owl things for Kira's bedroom and an owl pillow too. Cleck, don't you have some owl stuff too?

Shiv, I hope you're feeling less depressed today :hugs: Good luck with your play group tomorrow! You'll have to tell us how it goes having all those boys running through your house!

Cleckner- woohoo about Emma sleeping so long in her own bed!! :happydance: I've had some 9:30-5am stretches recently without having to bf Kira and it's been a real shock seeing 5am on the clock, so I know what you mean! It sounds like you guys are having fun :thumbup:

Jelr- Thats adorable DH liked his father's day card so much.

Kira has been doing something super cute this weekend. About 2 months ago I taught Kira how to kiss DH to wake him up on the weekends. Me and Kira use to wake up at 7:30 and DH would cover his head with a pillow and snooze as long as he possibly could. When she kisses him, he HAS to wake up because it's so darn cute :haha: Now whenever DH is laying on the floor or ignoring Kira's request to play a certain game, she will kiss him. It's been working like a charm too :haha:

I'm pretty certain the original playdate lady is going to come tomorrow. I'm not nervous at all yet because I'm still in denial :haha: I looked at her old posts and we seem to have alot in common. Of course I can't tell her that I've been spying on her :haha:


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## jelr

MJ: Glad Natasha is not the only one, I know everybody has a different in sizes in their feet but you wouldn't expect a full half size would you :haha: - although I have a huge difference in size too and reckon it would probably be a half size - same as one of my boobs is noticably bigger than the other :haha: - I'm just lobsided :haha:

Spidey: Sounds like the playdate with the original lady will go well and that you two might really hit it off :thumbup: - I have to say I would check her out too if it was me, but then I'm nosey :haha:

Yay for both Kira and Emma sleeping longer in their beds and without booby, - they will be sleeping through the night before you know it and just in time for little brothers and sisters to come along when you both get your bfp soon. :dance:


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## Shiv

Sophia's feet are half a size different as well, 5.5 and a 6!

jelr - is your big boob on the same side as your big foot?

Well the women have just left, one couldn't make it because the wheel came off her car last night. It sounds pretty scary seeing as she was driving along at the time! They stayed from 10.30 til about 12.25, which was just about the right amount of time. It was slight carnage but luckily it isn't raining here today (yet!) so they all went out in the garden for a bit. It was pretty easy chatting to them, although we mainly spoke about our Lo's as I guess we don't know enough about eachother to talk about much else. I am off to Kent tomorrow but will see them again next week hopefully :thumbup:

Hope your playdate goes well too SPidey, sounds like you have a lot in common so that's a good start! Oh and i went back through the facebook pages of the women too, good to find out about them. Then I realised that they probably did the same to me and got embarrassed because one of my status's was something about "this weeks task to meet some new mummy friends and actually talk to them" :blush: IDIOT!!

Sophia's bed just got delivered, we aren't going to put it together until after this weekend though as we want Sophia to be the first person to sleep on it and not our guests this weekend!

MJ - i had a look at the BHS site and they have some really cure stuff. I wanted to go all out owl, but David persuaded me that maybe perhaps just a few bits and then mix and match, country cottage stylee

I put on 4lbs last week :shock: I was doing *okish* with my weight gain, but it feels like it is going to spiral out of control again, I know I shouldn't worry about it, I am very lucky to be pregnant, but I just don't want to put on 50lbs like I did with Sophia, or more to the point I don't want to have to lose 50lbs again afterwards! But then I am not willing to cut out my treats so I guess it is my own fault! I will haveto start doing my prenatal workout DVD again, I gto into it but then started having those funny turns so stopped. Wille ease myself back in again slowly.

Sophia is napping and for the first time in about a month, i don't feel that if I don't nap I won't be able to function for the rest of teh day. I am still waking up several times a night, but i haven't needed to get up to weefor two nights in a row now, just a quick sip of water and back to sleep again which is great! :thumbup:


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## Shiv

Oh and one of my mummy friends from when I had Sophia is in labour! She has been having contractions since yesterday evening, and when I text her this morning at 9am they were still 15 minutes apart so i think it could be a looooooooooong labour, but hopefully her little girl will be here today sometime, if she is then I might be able to pop in with a gift when i am down in kent over the next few days!


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## spidey

Shiv said:


> Then I realised that they probably did the same to me and got embarrassed because one of my status's was something about "this weeks task to meet some new mummy friends and actually talk to them" :blush: IDIOT!!

 :rofl: Sounds like something I would do. I think it's sweet- it shows that you're making a real effort to be friends with them and they should be even more appreciative. I guess I shouldn't post "hope the internet stranger I'm inviting to my house this morning isn't a murderer" but one day she might see that and think I'm a weirdo. 

My tummy is in knots waiting for this lady. I already had my 3rd trip to the bathroom this morning :blush::haha:

I'll post more later! Kira wants to read books now


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## Shiv

Hope it's going well Spidey - and yes I would refrain from putting any facebook status about her!

Well one of the girls who came round sent out a message on fb asking if we wanted to go to hers next week and also did we fancy going out for a meal or to the cinema sometime without the children :happydance:


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## cleckner04

Shiv- YAY!! :dance::dance: Sounds like you've got yourself some new friends! :D I love the bedding stuff you bought too! You'll have to post piccies of the finished product when you are done decorating. :thumbup:

Spidey- You sound like me with the bathroom trips. :haha: I think that may be why I lost a lb when DH was first coming home. :blush: Wish it would've stayed off though. :haha: I did have a few owl stickers on emma's wall but I switched it to that giant flowery tree instead now. I hope your playdate is going well!! 



DH has duty today again so it's my catchup day on BnB. :D And a catchup day for laundry. :dohh: That is one of the worst parts of DH being back. More chores. :roll:


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah and shiv, don't let the weight gain get you down. Being pregnant is the one time you can justify indulging in all those cravings. :D You seemed to lose the baby weight fairly quickly last time too so I don't think you'll have a problem this time either. :flower:


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## Mary Jo

I keep telling myself that running around after 2 kids I'll be skinny in no time :haha:

but seriously, Shiv, I weighed on Sat and had gained 4lb as well, but that was over 2 weeks. still, 2lb each week, it's more than I *was* gaining. actually it might have been 3.5lb as I round down (my scale goes in 1/4lbs). I think I went from 10st 8 and 3/4lb to 10st 12 and 1/4lb. but even so. it was a shock. because I never weighed through my pregnancy with Adam I have no idea if I can be confident that some weeks I will gain nothing and others 5lb or something. it's scary! what if I gain 2lb a week every week that's left? that would make me gain 52lb overall. ack. but ok, I only (*only* :haha: ) gained 45 with Adam. 

I need to be accountable for the crap I eat. if I gain 50lb eating well, then I can deal better, and it's just what I needed. but if I gain it and I know I didn't eat well, I'll be angry after. I eat ok, if you take away the crisps and chocolate. maybe I need to have one day a week when I eat those? even if I just did it every other day rather than every day it'd be a start. 

yay for new friends, Shiv! and Spidey, hope the playdate has gone well and you meet a kindred spirit!

oh, and Shiv, I have also been having a few more days where I haven't needed to nap. it's a big improvement because I felt so awful. I'm sleeping a lot better at night as well, think the Gaviscon Advance the doc gave me seems to be helping, am not really waking up at all and it makes a huge difference to me not feeling exhausted by about 11am. have also been making a big effort to eat more meat, and to try not to have calcium foods and caffeine when I have iron foods. just because the doc told me that although my haemoglobin levels were fine, my ferritin (stored iron) was a little low, and I started to wonder - was it part of the reason that I was craving McDonalds double cheeseburgers? and sure enough since I have been eating roast beef a few times a week, I have not wanted a burger! also taking Spatone iron supplements. and I don't know which change has made the difference but something is. :D

we took Adam to the hospital on Friday for his follow-up appt at the children's metabolic clinic because they think he might have a metabolic problem. it's not a serious one but we have to be careful when he is sick (vomiting) or generall unwell and off his food, because if he fasts longer than usual his blood sugar might dip too low and he becomes really weak and lethargic. this is what they say he has. it's something that they can only really diagnose in the absence of another explanation for his symptoms, hence why they took more blood tests after Adam was feeling better and behaving and eating normally a few days after being in hospital. so we got the results of that on fri and everything came back normal, which is a relief because it means they are probably right and we just have to be careful and if he's sick we have these emergency drinks to give him asap (if he vomits them he has to go to hospital and go on a drip again). I have read bits about it online and it seems some kids get diagnosed with it and never have another serious episode because their family give them the glucose drinks and it arrests them. in others it's more serious. the doc said if he has two or three more episodes that need hospital treatment they'd do more in depth investigations, which would involve a controlled fast and regular blood tests throughout. but in the meantime I have to take him back just once every 6 months. and I have seen a nutritionist twice and they talked me through this emergency regime and given me loads of the drinks. I am not worried about it, hoping it was a one-off. Adam was very scared at the hospital, though, well, he was fine when he was allowed to play but when the doc wanted to examine him he went berserk. all she did was feel his tummy and listen to his chest! same when he was taken to be weighed and measured, went bonkers. and when I had to put a plastic bag in his nappy to get a urine sample. doc wanted to take blood but she changed her mind when she saw how insane he was. :wacko:


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## spidey

Playdate went well :thumbup: The little girl is 8 months older than Kira but is very much on the same level (and the same height too!) The girl was very destructive though!! Kira is so laid back and this little girl was a true baby bomb :rofl: The mom was nice but on first impressions I can't see us being close friends, although we hardly had a moment to talk so I'm probably wrong. 

LOL, Kira is kissing me because she wants me to get up and go somewhere with her.

Post more later I hope. I can't ignore the cute kisses :haha:


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## Shiv

MJ - I am glad you have a diagnosis and one that should be easily treatable if it crops up again. Hopefully Adam will not need to go to hospital again. Is it something they can grow out of? It says on the wiki thing that it is mainly children between 10mo and 4 years, does that mean after 4 they are usually ok?

As for weight gain, I was shocked (funnily enough I went from 10st 9lbs to 
10st 12 3/4lbs, so almost the same as you (a bit heavier!) If I had had a much worse than usual week eating wise then i woudln't mind as much, but it wasn't so different to normal. What If I continue to put on weight at this rate. But i am not willing to cut out treats, I have crisps and choc most days, but I eat well at meal times and get my 5 a day too. i guess i will just have to deal with what happens! We can do a weightloss thread after LO's are born!

Spidey, sorry you don't think you will be close friends. I don't think I will be close friends with these ladies either, but it is nice to have mummy friends even if they aren't life long best friends I think.

Kira has you wrapped round her little finger with those kisses :haha:

Cleck - I hope you aren't still do laundry!


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## Mary Jo

Shiv, that's funny about the weight! we're about the same height as well, aren't we? I'm 5ft 4in. you're 3 weeks ahead of me though. I bet I end up fatter than you. :( :haha:

but yes, we can lose it together (in more ways than one, probably) once the babies are here. 

as for growing out of it, yes, that's exactly what the doctor said. something about when he's about 4 or 5 and the liver being bigger and able to store more glycogen or something? I am just relieved that they didn't find a more scary reason for it all, though they can't rule it out unless he had the further tests but they won't put him through those unless it's really necessary. I was thinking, not sure if they'd be able to sedate him for the fast and blood tests if he needed them (it would involve a thing in his arm for a few hours) because possibly observing his alertness would be a factor. though maybe it would be just on actual blood chemistry. I don't know, I didn't ask, hoping we don't have to do that. 

sorry you didn't find a kindred spirit Spidey, do you have plans to see the woman again? as for the baby bomb - :rofl: - I worry that Adam is a baby bomb. BUT Chris took him to see his sister and his two cousins who are the same age, and I was really worried that Adam would be the destructive one but he was actually really good. he's usually into everything and isn't very responsive when I say no. we've started warning him of consequences if he keeps doing thing we don't want him to, like tonight he was crashing his fire truck into the kitchen cupboards and he didn't respond to no, so I told him I'd take it away if he kept doing it - and he actually stopped. probably a coincidence but you never know. :lol:


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## jelr

Spidey: I'm delighted the playdate went well, you would be surprised you might still be close friends as it is hard to talk when kids are running around and you were probably both nervous too, it is a great start though :thumbup: it just goes to show you also that you have nothing to worry about with Kira if the little one was 8 months older and at the same level :thumbup:

Shiv: Sounds like you had a good morning also, I'm surprised your house survived with all those kids running around :haha: - That is great that your energy levels are back up, they really must be if you didn't need a nap after that morning :haha: - I'm also glad none of them slapped you this time, I meant to say on an earlier post that was mental that some boy just slapped you out of no-where, I would have been gobsmacked too. Did the parents say anything to the child?? - Yep it is my left boob and my left foot - so I'm definitely lobsided :haha: You will have to take photos of Sophias room to show us? Have you taken the side off of the cot yet?

MJ: Glad Adams tests came back clear so hopefully it was only a one off and it is probably better that you know now and are at least prepared with the drinks and the emergency plan for it. Still it must have been a worry after they phoned you.

Girls - my advice is throw the scales away when your pregnant (says the one who stands on it twice a day now :haha:) - No I actually got rid of it when I was pregnant because I found it did depress the life out of me to keep seeing it go up and then every time I was hungry I felt guilty for eating but knew I had to eat, so I got rid and just did as Cleck said I enjoyed being able to indulge all the cravings :haha: - I know I was sorry after but I would definitely do it again and worry about the weight after. I honestly do think our bodies crave what we need. I know it is awful after the fact when trying to lose it but I think you too both lost a lot by just cutting out chocolate and treats didn't you, so between just doing that and running after two little ones you will lose it again so dont be hard on yourself now.

Cleck: :hiya: Hope Corey being home is going well and boo for extra washing. It is amazing how much extra washing 1 person can make, I'm still in shock as to how much more we have now that Natasha is here.

Lord I'm tired today after being out the weekend - I really am getting too old for staying up until the small hours of the morning and it takes a week now to get over it :haha: - Was worth it though as we really did have a great night. It is our wedding anniversary tomorrow so looking forward to just going out with DH on Saturday night and only 3 more weeks left in work :dance: - so looking forward to that too and spending every day with Natasha. I really love the age they are at now. I know the tantrums are worse and the bad days are really worse but the good days are so much fun and it feels like we have less bad days here now that she is not teething all of the time and even if I have stuff to do around the house I still get to spend time with her as she potters behind me and "helps" :haha: but we make games out of things and have fun with it :thumbup:


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## jelr

MJ: meant to say poor Adam was probably terrified of doctors from remembering how sick he was the last time he was in there. I know after Natasha's last jabs I had to bring her to the doc for a throat infection and she freaked the minute he went near her :dohh:

Shiv: you never know you might end up more friendly with the women too, I dont think I ever would have imagined being life long friends with the friends I have now when I met them, one in fact I couldn't stand (although we were hormonal teenagers :haha:) and we are the best of friends now so I think a friendship is something that grows in time, definitely good to have some company though as you said either way. :thumbup:


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## Shiv

jean - I am SO gonna remind you of your last post when you are pregnant and still weighing yourself and worrying about weight gain :haha: you are right though, but I know I will keep weighing myself, it is a habit! I think I probably have a limit where if i start to pile it on dramatically every week I will cut some crap out (famous last words!)

How long have you and Jim been married?

MJ yep I'm 5ft 4 too, will be interesting to see what we weigh at full term :haha:

After I said I didn't need a nap, well Sophia was asleep for an hour, so I thought, I'll just go and rest upstairs as she will wake up soon. Well 2 hours later Sophia woke up (and so did I!!!) oops so maybe I did need that nap :haha:


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## Mary Jo

what were you at full term with Sophia, Shiv? I was 9st 4lb when I got pregnant with Adam, 10st 1lb at about 16 weeks, then didn't weigh till I was 40+2, though it was in the evening and after a massive plate of curry - I was 13st 3lb. but next morning I was 12st 11lb. so that was 49lb. eeek, I thought it was 45lb. oh well. maybe I was a bit more than 9st 4lb, maybe I was closer to 9 and a half.

Jean, yes, Adam is still definitely scared of doctors. if we go to the GP (which is somewhere he wasn't at when he was ill at all since it was over the bank holiday weekend when it was shut) he can only tolerate the waiting room for about 2 minutes before he tries to leave, and he won't be persuaded away from the door. :dohh: last time (couple of weeks ago) I had to put him in the pushchair and ask the receptionist if it was ok, since you're not meant to have pushchairs in the waiting room. fortunately she was fine about it. he used to be absolutely fine. never a bother on him when he had his injections, it is just since he was in hospital. :(


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## jelr

ha ha shiv you got me there, I will definitely worry I know I will, but for my sanity the scales will have to go :haha: - That is the one time in my life that denial is so so good, because I always pile it on and eat all the wrong stuff so my motto is well if I didn't see it on the scales it is not happening :haha: My friend is 30 weeks pregnant at the moment and only went into maternity jeans about 3 weeks ago, where as I was in them already on the last pregnancy :dohh: - I'm such a pig - maybe next time I will hopfully have quit smoking so I wont be eating to make up for the lack of smoking, although I will probably have already pile it on from giving up :dohh:

We will be married 4 years and together 10 at the end of the year :thumbup:

MJ: Poor Adam - was he always afraid of the doctors or just since he went to hospital. I had no choice but to bring Natasha the last time I got my vitamin B12 injection and thought she would lose the plot but because she hadn't been there so long, she was actually fine and was grand with me getting the jab, I just had to make sure I didn't flinch and told her I was getting medicine and she was happy enough with that thank god.


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## cleckner04

jelr- when is your 'dating' anniversary? We are at 10 years for dating at the end of the year also. Literally the last day of the year. :haha: Grr at your friend who only JUST switched to maternity jeans. I was wearing them right away with the second pregnancy cause i gained so much from the first. :dohh: I am amazed that mine are all finally packed away. :lol:


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## spidey

For what its worth, I kept track of my weight gain with Kira and actually have a picture of it. Every Friday I would weigh myself at my parents house. In the upper left is week 17 and this picture shows every week until week 39. There are 3 skipped weeks (there's a little arrow that says skip). "W" is me, "I" is DH, and "A" is my brother. I weighed 114 at my first midwife appointment at 9 weeks, and by 41+5 I weighed 165. So there are some weeks that I gained 2 pounds. Plus its getting warmer out, so your bodies will retain more water. 

https://www.razortoe.com/share/weight.jpg

MJ- we posted at the same time earlier. I'm glad Adam doesn't have anything serious and that he might outgrow whatever it is. Kira is terrified of doctors too and she's on a delayed vaccination schedule so she hasn't even been tortured too much. 

I have an appointment Wednesday at noon to have my hair cut! I'm no longer going short since I'm no longer having pms:haha:


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## cleckner04

I love that you have your DH's weight too. :rofl: My DH gained 30 lbs with my pregnancy. :lol: I gained 45 so he was almost as bad as me! :wacko:


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## spidey

Your DH was growing a baby too :haha: My DH gained weight after Kira was born. He put on 15 pounds and recently has lost all but 3 pounds of it by walking and cutting out snacks.


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## Shiv

MJ - I was 13st 2lbs the day before Sophia was born at 39 weeks (thank goodness I wasn't 2 weeks overdue otherwise who knows what I would have been) and I started at 9st9lbs. I would be SO SO SO SO happy if I could stick to 12 stone this time.............but seeing as I have puton another half lb over night (and that is after I had had a poo as well!) it is looking unlikely! Oh well never mind!

Cleck - you got together on NYE, how romantic!

Happy anniversary to you and Jim, Jean. I hope you have a lovely time at the weekend and that Jim enjoys his pressie!

David and I have been married 4 years in August (day after Sophia's birthday) and have been together 9 years in october (not sure of the exact date, it was complicated at the time :haha:)

Well I am off to my parents for a couple of days in a bit, as I have a midwife appt back in Kent (really must register here really!). Did I tell you all that by the end of the time my mum was here she was absolutely doing my head ? Well she was so i have decided 2 days is my pleasant limit!


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## spidey

Shiv, I was meaning to ask how your moms visit went. Have fun visiting your parents.. how long does it take to get to their house?

I had my 5 year anniversary June 6th (yes, we got married on 6-6-6 :lol:! I can't believe 5 married years went by so fast. We got together for the first time sometime in early March 1999, so 12 years?!!

Enjoy your anniversary Jelr :happydance:


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## cleckner04

spidey- :rofl: @ getting married on 666. I bet so many people have that same anniversary. Although, you guys messed up. Isn't the devil technically 616? I swear I read that somewhere. :haha: 

Shiv- Hope your trip to your parents goes well. :flower: 

You know with DH home, I haven't even begun thinking about TTC yet. I guess that's a good thing to stay relaxed. I'm too busy worrying about being able to afford a move back home in november at this point. Did you know it'll be like 3-4k just to rent a uhaul truck to drive across country? And that's not even including hotels and food. :wacko: And from what I'm reading, Emma can't ride in the truck so I'm going to have to figure out a different plan. We thought about paying a moving company to come do it all but that would be even more money. I don't want to dip into our house savings at all if I can help it. So my stressing is pointed towards that now. :haha: 

I haven't lost a bit of weight really either so far. When DH gets home tonight after dinner I'm gonna make him and Emma get ready to go for a few hours walk. I love just walking outdoors so hopefully that will help my weight start moving. I mean I was an even 193 on friday and I'm at 192.4 now but I know I can do better than that. I've been using myfitnesspal but I haven't been 100% honest on it because yesterday I ate cheese and crackers and I never added it in even though I added every other meal in. And the day before I had popcorn with butter melted on top. :blush: MUST STOP SNACKING!! :lol:


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## spidey

Wow, thats insane a Uhaul costs that much! Does that include gas, or just rental? I guess it depends on how much stuff you have, but would it be more economical to sell whatever you can and re-buy new stuff back home? How do those POD things work- can you fill up a POD and have them deliver it to a different state? Even if it takes a month to have it delivered, it might be worth it. 

No more snacking!! :haha: It's hard if someone else is snacking though, so you'll have to get DH to stop too. How is Emma doing with DH? 

LOL about the devil being 616. I have no idea :haha: We mostly picked that date to annoy other people. Even with such an easy date to remember DH forgot our anniversary this year :dohh:


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## cleckner04

That's with gas too. It's a 1300 mile trip and it's only a 10mpg vehicle. :dohh: Not good with gas being nearly $4 a gallon. I searched pods a while back and they don't deliver to Angola, IN which is where I'm going. Go figure. :haha: But uhaul does a pod sort of thing that I've read is cheaper than other pod style boxes. It's called upack I think. And they ship to IN so I am considering that. I think no matter what I'll need like 5k to move all of our stuff. I'm already in the process of selling some stuff. I own 3 strollers that I don't need. An 80 gallon fish aquarium and stand, Emma's crib and mattress that never got used:lol:, etc. So hopefully I can make some decent money off of the stuff to help with moving costs. We still want to take one last vacation while over here too to LA so I am saving for that as well. I refuse to give up my vacation. :haha:

Emma is slowly getting better with DH. He is home now and she went outside with him for a little bit. So I know she must be pretty ok with him if she's willingly going. :D


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## Mimiso

Hi All, is it too late to join you all!


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## Mimiso

ttc number four


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## cleckner04

Oh I just mentioned this thread in the lion cub thread to you. :haha: Welcome hun!! Never too late. I'm just now starting to try since DH just got back from deployment so I'm technically behind the others a bit.


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## spidey

wow, #4! What ages are your other LO's?

Cleck- 5k for moving is insane! I suppose you can't get the Navy to pay for any of it. That's sweet that Emma went outside with DH... it sounds like she's getting used to him. Does she flash him smiles? How has she slept the past few nights?

DH is off work today and is trying to fix our bedroom windows so light can't come in as easily. He's building out the windows so we can install a roller shade and mini blinds. Right now I have to velcro a large piece of vinyl (the fake leather stuff) underneath the black out curtains and light still gets through the cracks. Kira wakes up with the sunshine, so it's been hard keeping her asleep longer than 7am most mornings. If it's an overcast and rainy morning, she'll sleep till 8:30!

I'm starting a bad habit here and should stop. I'm an M&M addict and when Kira wakes up from her nap I give her a few M&M's since she's always a bit cranky and the M&M's put her in a happy mood. Bad mommy!


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## jelr

Cleck: Our dating anniversary is sometime in September but I'm not sure what the exact date is :dohh: as we worked together and became really good friends before we actually dated as I as actually seeing somebody but he lived 2 hours away and things were sour for a couple of months but he was one of my best friends brothers so I really didn't want to fall our with her so was trying to make it work but then I had feelings for DH and knew he had for me and knew I had to get out but didn't want to do it over the phone so we had to wait a couple of weeks before I saw him and wouldn't be anymore than friends with DH so I can't remember the actual date that we actually moved from being friends to more :haha: Aww NYE is a lovely date. 

I'm delighted that Emma is warming to DH and Yikes at the cost of moving, that is seriously madness :nope:

Hey Mimiso - good to see you again - you are a brave woman and I'm still scared some days and maybe having two :haha: - Best of luck with it all.

Spidey: you are like the m&m pusher :haha: - lol at your wedding anniversary date especially to wind everyone up :thumbup: :haha:

Shiv: I hope your trip is going well and that your mum is not driving you bonkers this time, it could just be that you are so used to having your own space and doing things your way in your own home. It is hard to have another woman around that does things differently especially if your mum is anything like mine and makes sure to give her opinions on the way it should be done :haha: - Hopefully when you are on her turf it wont be driving you mad as much.

Not much news for me except the dreaded OV hormones are back, I didn't actually realise it was that time again as AF lasted so long this time around but when I stepped on the scales this morning I had put on 2lbs and was so mad as I have been doing the maintance diet to the letter this week and then when I counted back I'm on CD16 and my last cycle was 32 days so it was nice to know for once because at least when I got depressed out of my life this evening and just kept crying for everything I knew what it was. 

Birthday is going to be a disaster I think as there is a load going on with everyone so everyone is either working or completely broke and it normally wouldn't bother me as I totally understand it is a shitty year for everyone and I actually nearly expected it as it has been the same everyone elses birthdays too except stupid hormones are making me feel sorry for myself :dohh: - aww well hopefully they will be gone the day after tomorrow and all will be well in the world.


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## Shiv

Cleck - I can't believe moving costs so much there, it's crazy, I hope youcan find a cheaper solution. I'm glad Emma is warming to Corey, they'll be inseperable before you know it.

Spidey - we just tape some black out material over the window frame (inside obviously) as black out curtains always let light in. It's a pain when you want to open the window but we rarely have the window open at night so it works for us!

Mimiso - hello! Number 4 wowzers! i do warn you though that this thread doesn't exactly stick to the topic of ttc as you have probably guessed :haha: but feel free to join in with our random mutterings and throw any ttc stuff into the mix too :flower:

jelr - your birthday will be fab, once your hormones settle in a day or so you'll feel better about it i promise. As long as Jim is there and Natasha gives you a big cuddle that is all you need :hugs:

Well my trip home was ok, I didn't spend that much time at my parents house as i was trying to see as many friends as possible while I was there. My midwife appt was a mixed bag, I am measuring spot on which is good. But she took blood a few weeks early as she thinks I might be anemic and my blood pressure was quite low (90/55) which would explain my funny turn! It also took her 10 minutes to find a heartbeat, I was scared shitless quite frankly! Sophia was obsessed with watching her take blood, maybe I have a future medic on my hands :haha:


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## spidey

jelr- those ovulation hormones are awful for you. You would think ovulation hormones should make you happy so you'd be more likely to dtd and make a baby!

Shiv- no wonder you had those dizzy spells! Are you supposed to do something to raise your bp?

I finally have my hair appointment this evening. :happydance: I haven't had my hair cut for over a year so its a big deal for me! I'm actually going to get dressed up Saturday for a party celebrating the life of DH's step- grandmother. She wanted a party when she died so they're going to have balloons and other various happy things. I haven't dressed up in soooooo long. I have to paint my toes and put some make up on too :shock: :haha:

Cleckner- Are you expecting AF soon? I want to know how your luteal phase is this month!


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## Shiv

Spidey - take a before and after pic of your hair. yay for getting dressed up, do you know what you are going to wear yet?

Oh and I forgot to say that the meal out with my 3 new mummu friends is on Wednesday - eek!


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## Shiv

Oh and no there is nothign I can do to raise my blood pressure. The blood pressurre in itself isn't a worry, it's teh affects of it that can be, dizzyness etc. But i am a good girl now and if i feel even a tiny bit lightheaded I sit down (and don't try to pump petrol into teh car :haha:)


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## cleckner04

Shiv- Can you eat more salt though to help raise it? There has to be SOMETHING that could help! You have the opposite issue that I had because mine was always too high. But no one ever tried to lower it, they just let me go as if nothing was wrong. :wacko:


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## Shiv

I don't think eating more salt would help unless I ate a ton of it and I don't exactly watch my intake as it is (just had a bag of salt and vinegar crisps and huge lump of cheese! :haha:). 

It is better than having high blood pressure for sure and apparently it will start to rise again as I get closer to the end of my pregnancy.


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## jelr

Ooo Spidey we definitely want pictures of your hair once it is done and Yay for getting dressed up, I was the same last week I was delighted with myself having somewhere to go and get dressed up for a change, I even went all out and got my hair put up as a trial for the wedding and did my toes and fake tan and I felt so good once it was all done, mind you I had forgotten how much I hate doing it all and how time consuming it all is :haha:

Shiv and Cleck: Isn't it mad that in this day and age they dont can't do something to regulate blood pressure in pregnancy. Shiv it is no wonder you were so dizzy, you definitely mind yourself as it doesn't sound plesant at all and must be scary when it happens.

Shiv: so glad they found that hb, you must have stopped breathing yourself when she was trying to find it. Are they going to put you on iron for the anemia, that is probably why you have been feeling so tired. Eeek for the dinner with the other mums, I'm sure you will really enjoy it and it will give you a chance to really get to know them.

Well the hormones are a little better today, this morning was a disaster and I cried for most of it and ended up being late for work by the time I stopped looking like I was crying and put more make up on, but It started to lift this afternoon so I dont feel half as bad tonight. It really is mental how much they change me and more so since the mc but I'm wondering if it is something to do with my diet lately as my friend was telling me about this herbal remedy that she used to take called pms escape and I have been trying to locate it as she used to get it on special order from our local health food shop but they can't get it anymore, but finally today I found it online and from what I can see it is a complex carboyhdrate tonic with vitamins and minerals in it and from what I have read you need extra carbs to balance the serotonin levels that drop with pms and I have been on low carb or total food replacement for so long so I'm wondering if that is what is the problem or is it just to do with the mc. When I was a teenager I was put on anti depression tablets twice and it was only my mam figured out that when I was like that it was once a month so she made me put it in a diary and it was always half way to ten days before Af arrived and over the years it has gotten much better, but has hit me like a ton of bricks again the last few months - I'm presuming it is ov hormones but I'm not 100% sure as I dont pee on any sticks to check but it is always half way though my cycle and on the same day that I put up 2lb so I'm presuming that it is. Fingers crossed this pms escape helps as I know when I spoke to the consultant he said that there was stuff he could give me but not if we were going to ttc soon as it was either contra-indicated in pregnancy or basically birth control and being honest even after we have another baby I would prefer to treat it with something natural than shoving medicine or more hormones into my body.

My birthday will be fine though and I really don't care once DH and Natasha are around, which they always are :cloud: it is exactly what I thought would happen as everyone is under serious pressure here this year, I know was really looking forward to catching up with everyone as we all seem to have gotten so busy between children and some of them are working second jobs and I know myself I dont have that much time since Natasha was born and even when I'm off in the summer everyone is working, so we only get to speak on the phone every couple of days and see each other every couple of weeks, but sure there will be other times and it really isn't that much of a big deal, but yesterday I was like a big baby and thought it was the end of the world :haha: i mean in fairness if that is all I have to cry about :haha: but it is like all happyness switches off and I turn into a crying, depressed mess for at least a day each month where I think I have the weight of the world on my shoulders over absolutely nothing :dohh: I was feeling so sorry for myself this morning I was even going to cancel going out :dohh: - I do worry for my sanity sometimes :haha:

Now that my mind is a little clearer though i'm still going to go out and tonight my sister phoned and she has changed her work so her and her husband are coming, so there will be myself and Jim, my sister and her husband, one of my friends, my mam and one of my brothers going for the meal and then my mam will head home to take over looking after Natasha and the rest of my brothers are coming out for a few drinks and my brother from London is also hoping to arrive home that night as he is off for a few weeks so is heading home early for the wedding and one of my other friends that can't also phoned tonight and is coming down with her boyfriend this Monday which is actually my birthday and we are going to get a take away, she wanted to go for a meal that night but I dont want to leave Natasha with my mam another night and we really dont have the money either, so in the end I didn't even have anything to be upset about :dohh: but then I always find something when I'm like that. It is so stupid really as I just felt like nobody cared and I know how much they all care about me. Good job I didn't say it to any of them when I got the texts yesterday or I would be convinced there was extra coming now out of pity in the mood I have been in :haha: :dohh: - Poor DH though got the brunt of it all, I really dont know how he doesn't have me checked into a mental hospital when I'm like that :haha: - but it is funny as he actually knows what is happening before I do most months and will actually say, check your calender I bet your periods are due in the next two weeks :haha:

On a brighter note I saved money on my car insurance last week so I have saved more and I treated myself to a slow cooker which arrived today so that cheered me up and I'm looking forward to using it.

Well I think I have rambled on enough and really should be in bed, but we did the weekly clean on the house tonight as all my classes are finishing next week so I will probably have to work extra days so I'm just going to relax with Natasha for the day. If I'm not in tomorrow which I probably will be have a good weekend everyone. xx


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## Shiv

oh jelr - it sounds really horrible how you are feeling mid-cycle, I really hope that the herbal stuff helps you as it must not be much fun for you. I am glad that your birthday is looking up :thumbup:

Ooooooh what slow cooker did you get? I still haven't done any research but still want to get one


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## jelr

I realy hope it helps too Shiv because honestly all perspective and coping skills go out the window. At least DH is used to it now and is so good about it and supportive and he is the only one really sees it because I feel so stupid the next day. it is like being really drunk and getting upset over something pathetic and you feel so stupid the next day as you know it was the drink and not the real you, and with this is it is hormones :dohh:

I went for the russell hobs 6.5 litre one. I got if from Amazon for about £40. It was a middle of the range one as I wanted a big one so I can do a roast if all the family are over and can do extra stews and things to freeze for all of us if I want to. it also has the keep warm function and timer which is what sold it for me. The only thing is I wish I had done some more research as I think I might be sorry I didn't go for one that you could cook in the crock pot. I did feel I wasn't going to pay another 15 or 20 pounds for the sake of saving on the washing up :haha: and thought I would just brown off the meat and that in the pan, but now that I'm reading the recipies and understand it a bit more I think you would need to brown off a roast or chicken if you want it to crisp up and I think the big crock pot would have been handy for that rather than trying to fit a big roast in a pan or it would have been handy to finish off to brown in the oven.

Actually you have looked at recipies and things you can do in it and I know some of you other girls use one, do you really need to brown everything off first. Looking at the recipies in the books, they seem to do all the steps first on the pan and bring to the boil and then put it all in the slow cooker and to me it seems like the same amount of work as cooking it on the hob except you put it in the slow cooker to finish cooking like you would leave it to simmer on the hob or put it in the oven, which is kind of defeating the purpose of cutting down some of the work :dohh: Obviously some things would need some cooking but I dont know if everything would as I know if I'm doing a stew / casserole I just chop up all the veg and meat and add my stock and some barley to thicken and fire it all in the oven for a few hours and I dont bother browning so I would imagine with a lot of things you can just fire it all in am I right?


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## Shiv

I plan on just chucking everything in and turning it on! I think you do get a bit more flavour if you brown you rmeat first, but I can't imagine it makes that much difference. I agree that if you have to get everything up toboiling before putting it in the slow cooker then all you are saving is giving it an occasional stir!


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## jelr

Exactly my thoughts Shiv, I didn't really do my shopping this week around it as I thought it wouldn't be here until next week so was going do fish for the dinner but I have a piece of steak here for DH (because I'm not really a steak lover) that I was going to do next week and I haven't frozen it yet as shopping was only delivered so I think I will do fish for myself and Natasha and try and fire the steak and potatoes and some onions for flavour into it now and try it on high for 3-4 hours and see what it is like and I have extra fish here if it is a disaster he can have that lol


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## cleckner04

I LOOOVVEEE my slow cooker. I cook in it at least once a week if not more. :thumbup: It's so easy to just toss stuff in there and everything I've ever cooked ends up being delicious. 



I'm down to 190 lbs even!! So today is your lucky day Shiv, I took another picture. :winkwink:


Spoiler
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_8943-1.jpg

I'm so excited!! So I've lost 50 lbs now. :yipee: Only 10 more to my goal weight but I think I might continue to lose weight even after that to get down to a 'healthy' weight. But I'm honestly pretty happy at this weight too. :haha: I told DH once I get down to 180, I'll retry the 30 day shred DVD so I can tone up all over. The last time I tried it I started gaining so that is the only thing that puts me off on the idea but I bet if I stuck to it longer, maybe it would even out and I'd lose inches instead.


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## Shiv

WOWZERS Cleck!!! You look amazing! You have a flat tummy and your thighs have slimmed down noticeably even comapring to the last photo! Yikes you are hot :thumbup:

Have you by any chance taken photos of your face every 10lb loss as well? I'd love to see the difference. I carry weight on my face and chin really easily so when I lose weight I like to see my face slim down too.

Serioulsy though, well done, it must have taken some darned determination to stick at this weight loss when it was just you looking after Emma. I know when David isn't here I eat rubbish to make myself better. I bet Corey is so proud of you. Iknow it sounds silly as I don't *really* know you, but I am proud of you too. And when I have had this baby and am ready to start slimming down again I am going ot be asking for your help.

By the way you look slimmer than I do when I am 135lbs :haha:


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## cleckner04

Aww thanks!! :dance: I'm proud of myself!! Although I got really angry with DH two nights ago because he stepped on the scale and now weighs 174 lbs. :growlmad: I HATE weighing more than him. 

No I didn't take any of my face but you are right, I probably should've to see the difference. I think my face is still too chubby. I need to learn some facial exercises. :rofl: 

135 lbs is TINY though! I wouldn't even dream of being that weight ever in my life. :haha: I'd feel like a giant next to you I'm sure. I always feel like a giant next to girls that are shorter. Because I may be slimming down but I'm still 'big boned'. :blush:


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## Shiv

Well I am a short arse and I weigh no where near 135lbs anymore :haha:

how tall is Corey? Can you not fiddle with the scales just before he uses them so it shows he has put on 20lbs :haha:


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## cleckner04

He's the exact same height as me. :haha: And it's a digital scale so I think there's no way of messing with him. :rofl:


I just calculated my bmi and it's now 28.9 so I've lost 7.6 bmi points! That's pretty great. And I've lost 21% of my body weight. That's kinda shocking. I've lost 2 Emmas now because she's only 24-25 lbs. :haha:


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## Shiv

wow you've lost nearly a quater of yourself - eek!


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## jelr

OMG Cleck you look absolutely so so so amazing, you can really see a massive difference in the new photo again, you have slimmed down all over. I am 135.5lbs and I dont have as flat as stomach as that :haha: - I really am a short arse though at only 5ft 2inches and you really see every lb on me :haha:

I'm so glad you are proud of yourself because that is one heck of an acheivement losing over 50lbs :happydance: - I'm am so proud of you too :thumbup: - My DH is nearly always lighter than me so I know how annoying it is and he eats loads of crap which is even more annoying as he can eat and eat and not put it on grrrrr - that is where I put on all my weight originally because when I met him I thought I could eat the same and soon realised that I couldn't when I was 3stone heavier :haha:

Have you loads of clothes that you used to wear that fit you now or did you fling them out, I'm too tight to thrown any of mine out and love when I lose weight and it feels like I have been on a shopping spree, without spending money or having the hassle of trying on clothes in shops :haha:

Well the steak turned out really well in the slow cooker, but the only thing was because I put in spuds as well I had to cover with stock so the steak was more braised than if you had done it in the oven or on the pan, so I'm thinking I might root my steamer out and maybe put it on a timer if I'm working and just do the steak in the slow cooker as it will be a little different as we will have the braised steak effect when doing stews and stuff, but I'm really pleased with it and am looking forward to firing stuff into it and experimenting :haha:

Shiv is it this weekend that you have your visitors - does David have to work after?

Spidey: dont forget those pics of your hair, I can't wait to see it.


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## cleckner04

I do still have my old clothes. I was never in a 16 with jeans though so I had to buy new. Because when I was this size I was wearing smaller maternity jeans during my first pregnancy. But those are all packed away now. I'm only in non-maternity bottoms now. :dance: And I've unpacked a bunch of shirts that were pre-baby. Not all fit yet but a lot do again. I did buy a few new tops but not a lot. It really is nice to not have to re-buy stuff. I have size 8 stuff that I freaking just know I will never fit again so I think I may start listing them for sale on craigslist. Which makes me sad because I love all of those jeans but when I hold them up to my body now, they are TINY. And I'm not. :haha: 


Call me crazy but I've started packing already too. Money is really tight right now trying to save for the big move. Which is why I want to get an early start on it so I can sort through and sell off some stuff. :haha: We bought 9 moving boxes yesterday. 3 small, 3 medium, and 3 large sizes. Just to start us off IYKWIM. So far I've packed one large box full of fabric from my craft room. I'll have to fill another box with my sewing stuff because the large box is full already just with fabric. :dohh: And I am in the middle of packing a small box with books but I need that packing paper to stuff in the open spaces so they aren't moving around getting damaged. I'm selling 5 of my books off. Pregnancy and baby related ones. I figure I don't really need them anymore because I've done it all before and if I have questions I have BnB for advice. :D I even went as far as weighing the box on my scale to make sure it's not over the weight limit for the box. :haha: I LOVE packing and moving. It's like an organizers dream because I get to reorganize a new place and have fun sorting through it all to pack in the first place. :blush:


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## spidey

Woooo Cleck, you are a HOT MOMMA!!! You seriously carry your weight well- if I had to guess I would say you were 145 pounds. I love that polka dot bra too :haha: Every 10 pounds makes a huge difference so I can't imagine how skinny you'll be once you drop to 180. I completely understand the pleasure you get from packing :haha:

jelr- I hope you can find some relief from your mid month craziness. I use to have bad pms, but my craziness and paranoia peaked 2 days before AF arrived. DH was lucky to survive each month :haha: 

slow cookers- supposedly browning the meat adds more flavor, but I bet you don't need to brown things first. Its another huge pot to wash and it takes away from the convenience of using a crock pot. jelr- I bet your house smelled sooo good!

my hair- yes, it is cut! I have before pictures and I took after pictures at 5am this morning but they don't do my hair justice so I'm going to re-take them tomorrow before the funeral thing. The only crap thing is the girl who cut my hair is obviously using drugs and I strongly think it's meth. I walked into her house and it wasn't good and my instinct was to run away. DH told me I can't go back and most of me agrees as it wasn't safe- she had 3 strung out guys hanging out there. A small part of me wants to overlook all the dangers for a good haircut, argh!

My work is driving me nuts! Last March my boss fired me for a day, and then she fired me again in December the day before Christmas break (because she turned crazy) :haha: Then she quit due to her craziness and I was told I would lose my job this February. Then I was told I would lose it at the end of September. Yesterday I was told that no matter what the budget was I would keep my job past September. AND...today I was told there was NO WAY they could keep me past September. I've been there 10 years and have tons of publications and it's just so unfair. I guess it finally got to me today :growlmad: Next week they will probably tell me I can stay again just to f*ck with me. I seriously feel like going postal :rofl: (do you UK girls know what going postal means or is that a US thing??) haha, sorry for the rant!


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## spidey

Before Hair

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/hair/1.jpg
https://www.razortoe.com/share/hair/2.jpg

After Hair

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/hair/3.jpg
https://www.razortoe.com/share/hair/4.jpg

What you can't see is in the after pictures the bathroom is totally gutted! There's no toilet or sink. DH made his own wood floor and he's going to install that as well as a smaller sink to fit in that tiny bathroom. I'll post befores and after when thats all done too


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## Mary Jo

you went for a radical change then, Spidey! :D looks great. 

well done on the weight-loss Cleck, good work! you look amazing


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## Shiv

Spidey - your hair looks great, and not too short so you can still tie it up if you want/need to.

jelr - well I just ordered myself a slow cooker too! I spent far too much on it, but I get bored looking through reviews and just end up buying which ever got good reviees regardless of price. I got a crockpot one, but not the one you can put on the hob (as it got some bad reviews and as we said before it is no different to just using a casserole dish! I also ordered a couple of cookbooks too. 

how did your birthday night out go? Also how did your anniversary go, did Jim like his present :winkwink:

MJ - how is your house sale/purchase preogressing? We still haven't even had a viewing on ours!

Well we had friends down this weekend and luckily David didn't have to work. It was good fun but i am exhauseted now. Will you allow me to have a petty rant please? The girl who came (i am more friends with her husband) is 19 weeks pregnant and has a tiny bump, but she is acting like she is disabled or something. She makes her husband do EVERYTHING for her, even tie her shoe laces:haha: The poor guy barely got to sit down! I just kept laughing as she sent him from task to task. I know that later in pregnancy it does get hard to tie your laces, but not at 19 weeks, boy is she in for a shock! Apparently she had to make him clean the bath the otherday because she couldn't bend over enough to do it :haha: I sure hope David realises how lucky he is!


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## jelr

Shiv: You are quite entitled to have a rant, sure that is what here is for, I have had enough of them lately :haha: and I dont blame you for ranting, that would drive me bonkers, you would feel like saying ffs get up and get on with it - I mean if she was 39 or even 29 weeks maybe but not at 19 :haha; - I'm very different than that though and know where Natasha gets her independance from as I hate not being able to do things for myself and have had so many rows with DH over the years when my arthritis has been bad because I wont ask for help :dohh:

No my birthday night out is not until next weekend, DH and I just went out for dinner for our anniversary and yes he LOVED his pressie :winkwink: - mind you it was nearly a disaster as I dont know what the sizes are about. I am now back to a UK size 10 to 12 in a bottoms and always a 12 on top to fit my D cup chest in :haha: so I would have though medium in a corset, but aired on the side of caution and got a large and let me tell you I didn't think it was going to fasten and you never saw the amount of sucking in I had to do to fasten it - I would hate to see what size you would have to be to wear the extra small :haha:

Yeah I looked at the crockpot one with the inside that goes on the hob and it was around the same price as what I paid for mine but the reviews put me off. Be warned though most of the cooks books all ask you to do everything up to boil, but it is still handy to have them to get ideas on what you can do and timings and things and I intend to use them for the recipies also but just to lob it all in and hope for the best :haha:

I also have rooted my steamer out and am going to maybe do meat or chicken on its own in the crock pot too and spuds and veg into the steamer on timer so that we are not eating cassarole type dinners the whole time, so hopefully that will work when I'm back to work in September too and we can come home to a lovely cooked dinner :thumbup:

Spidey: Easy to know Af is gone as you dont have a shaven head or really short hair :haha: - I'm glad though as I really like the lenght of your hair and think the cut has really tidied it all up and gives it more shape and makes it look really healthy. That would have scared me in the hairdressers, I dont think I would be going back either tbh. Did you say she had a child or was that my imagination??

That is a realy pain with your job, it is horrible to not know one way or another what your future holds, I relaly do sympathise as I know when we didn't know whether DH's job there or not at the start I was gone out of my mind. Nope we dont have postal in Ireland anyway, what is it?

Cleck: That is great that you have got a whole lot of new clothes to wear without having to buy much :thumbup: - I have also thrown out some of my smaller sized jeans as I know I will never fit them again :nope: - I think you are right doing the packing as you are going along as it will be less stressful, although I have to say I hate moving and packing.

Have you and DH done any of your usual day trips over the weekend?

Hey MJ - Yeah I hope the house sale is moving along nicely.

Only 2 weeks hopefully left in work, all classes will be finished this week and it is just how long it takes me to do any paperwork then but I have been getting ahead so 1 week should definitely do it and I have everything set up for September so again a week before the classes are back will do it so I wont be back until the 6th of September so for once I will actually have 8 weeks off - I can't wait to have a while two months at home with Natasha. I really hope the weather is fine so we can get loads of trips to the beach and days out in the garden :dance:


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## spidey

thanks for the hair compliments :flower: It doesn't look too drastic but I can really feel the change.

Shiv, LOL about the pregnant girl having her DH as her personal servant :haha: You'll have to arrange another visit closer to her due date to see what she has her DH doing then- perhaps wiping her butt :rofl: 

jelr and Shiv- you'll have to share any good slow cooker recipes! I don't have one, but I have a cast iron dutch oven that I slow cook in on the stove top.

jelr- thats going to be great having 2 months off! :happydance: I saw on FB you were feeling better so I'm glad your crazy ovulating hormones have settled down :thumbup:

oh, and going postal is when you go into work and go psycho and kill a bunch of coworkers :haha: There were a bunch of highly publicized work place shootings in post offices from disgruntled postal workers so thats how it got the name. 

Kira ate tons of dried cherries right before bed so I hope we don't have a 2am poop! :haha: This past week I think she had a growth spurt because she seems so much taller and much more grown up. My dad sees her every Friday and he even said she seemed different. Oh, and Cleckner, Kira got her toenails painted for the first time too. She saw me painting mine and sat down and stuck out her feet and insisted I paint hers too. She actually held still! She's been looking at her toes all weekend and smiling :)


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## jelr

ha ha postal was so different than I thought it would be - I thought it was somewhere to compain or like a tribunal over here and was going to tell you to go for it :dohh: - maybe not now that I actually know what it is :haha:

Will defo share some recipies when I find some nice ones :thumbup:

yeah those mad hormones are gone thanks god, and had a lovely birthday. We more celebrated it on Sunday at home because of work yesterday and it was so lovely to hear Natasha sing happy birthday to mammy - although she really didn't understand and just wanted to blow out candles :haha: but it still melted my heart to hear it :thumbup: - My friend and her boyfriend called last night and we had a couple of glasses of wine and a take away and it was lovely to catch up and my brother is coming home from London for the wedding this weekend and will be home in time to come out to dinner with us so really looking forward to spending some time with him. Other than that is is all work and work this week - but it is so good to be getting near the finish line, Fingers crossed I will be finished next week :thumbup:


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## Mary Jo

glad you had a lovely birthday, Jean! :D 

re the pregnant woman, jesus, more fool her husband for going along with all the slavery! (or am I just jealous? Chris likes to tell me what not to do but what not to do doesn't include all the housework and shopping, and it definitely doesn't include looking after Adam and myself!)

re our flat sale... gah. gah. I am really stressed about it. on our purchase, we're ready to complete. on my sale - gah. turns out there are some major works afoot on the building. (they were afoot when we were selling before, when it fell through, only the freeholder didn't declare it. this time he decided to.) so I found out this was coming up but we were waiting for the freeholder to respond officially (to my solicitor) to some questions that would have revealed the news to our buyer. well, rather than respond in that way he has responded by issuing formal written notice of major works, which we received today. I have forwarded it all to my solicitor and informed our estate agent, who has told our buyer. the problem is not so much the works but that the freeholder won't be drawn on the costs, and that's a concern because even though I have unofficially had the figure £10,000 given to me, of which my flat's share is 25% so £2,500, the buyer, not being given an official estimate, would be forgiven for worrying that it could cost many thousands. for the work that needs doing, it's highly doubtful, but I know I'd be concerned. the agent has now said she doesn't think it's going to be a big problem for the buyer, but we'll see how she feels when she's read the 16 page spec for the work. :( we are prepared to cut the price because we HAVE to get out of here, my worry is that she'll just pull out.

if it wasn't for that we'd be ready to exchange contracts next week. :( we'll see what happens. no chance of getting this work delayed (even though nothing is likely to happen till next year) and there won't be a proper estimate on the costs for at least 2 months. our buyer is very very keen... so we are just praying that she isn't hugely put off. 

there are loads of reasons why I am insanely furious about all this, but none of them I could write on a publicly accessible forum. once we've completed on the sale I won't hold back and I will vent my spleen. :lol: suffice to say, my freeholder can best be described using a four-letter word that begins with a c and rhymes with front.

other than that - which is an enormous source of stress for me and C - things are ok. 24 weeks tomorrow. :D can't agree on a name for the new baby, we have a short-list of possibilities but I don't love any of them. :wacko:


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## spidey

MJ- you've had the worst luck with selling your place. If your buyer is in love with your place and already has her mind set on living there, she might be willing to move forward despite not knowing exactly how much the repairs will cost or how long everything will take. And perhaps a slightly lower price will help too. I really hope the sale goes through so you can buy your new place and leave this nightmare behind! How has your energy level been recently? Is Adam still getting into trouble or is he giving you a break for the moment? :lol: Are you keeping possible baby names to yourself?

jelr- I'm glad your birthday was good! How many brothers do you have? 

Just as I predicted, I was told today that I can probably keep my job past September. So irritating :growlmad: No wonder some people go postal :lol: 

My psychic nips aren't telling me anything. But I expect ovulation to happen sometime next week. Cleckner, when are you due to ovulate?


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## cleckner04

I'm just coming off my period so another two weeks before ovulation. Right around when we fly back home to visit for two weeks. Go figure. :dohh: 


MJ- I hope everything ends up going through with the new buyer and you can put it all past you. I've learned its far more stressful trying to sell a house than it was buying one and I thought buying was super stressful when we did it. I can't believe you are 24 weeks pregnant already. I'm sure you'll settle on a name eventually. If I recall, you guys had the same issue with Adam. :haha: 

jelr- That is so sweet natasha singing happy birthday. :cloud9: I'm glad you had a nice birthday. :flower: 

spidey- Your hair isn't drastic but I totally can tell the difference. It looks really good. Healthier even. :thumbup: That sounds so sketchy about the girl you went to though. :haha: I'm sure you can find a less scandalous person to cut your hair without the druggies hanging around. :lol: But I definitely know what you mean about giving up a good hairdresser once you find one. 

Shiv- I remember being pregnant the first time and I would get angry about girls treating their husbands like they are supposed to serve each and every request. It's ridiculous. I have a friend similar but won't name names in case she reads this. I'm not very incognito with my username. :haha: 



I'm in a grumpy mood tonight. I've been packing more and DH has duty so he's been gone all day and night tonight. He called and we were talking about me moving back home and I just keep getting more and more pissed off as the time goes on. At everything really. The way my life has turned out. The fact that we'll be freaking homeless soon. The fact that I am stuck living with his parents while he goes out and sees the world one last time. It just all pisses me off. And we are really tight with money now because we have to save for this move that I don't even want to make. I told DH tonight on the phone that I will probably end up hating him because of all this. Because it is honestly all his fault and he is just bringing us down with him. I ended up hanging up with him angry and told him not to call back tonight because I don't want to deal with him. :blush:


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## Mary Jo

thanks Spidey and Cleck. I am very very cautiously hopeful. thing is, our buyer is already getting SUCH a bargain. compared to the price we put the flat on the market at back in November, we're selling it to her for 14% less. so she really needs to think about that. for one, she won't get another flat that's as perfect for her (and it really is, she LOVES it, she's a single woman and I don't think she was laying it on thick when she said she loved what we'd done) and at this price. we did need to cut the price because the market dropped, but 10% would have been more realistic. and the difference between a 10% cut and a 14% cut is £6,500. it would be hard on us to cut it further, but if we have to get a sale through then we will. :cry: at this point I just want to be away from here. it's all taking so long. and yes, I cannot believe how stressful it's been. just awful. a rollercoaster. compared to when I bought this flat in 1999, I had zero stress (even though I did, and guess who caused it, yep, bingo, the lovely freeholder). but it was a quick purchase. I viewed it for the first time on Oct 30th and moved in on Dec 22nd. 7 weeks. I wish this had been so quick! 

my energy has been mixed. it was a bit better since I've been careful about getting iron, and I wasn't needing naps in the day, but then the hot weather messed with it because I wasn't sleeping well at night. hopefully it'll stay a bit cooler, as it is today, and then I can sleep ok at night. 

Adam isn't being so bad either, bless him. :lol: his naps have also been erratic. he goes up and doesn't sleep even though he looks tired, but he will sleep later if he misses his morning nap. like yesterday, he wouldn't nap, so we went out, just for 15 mins (supposed to be anyway) but on my way out I found this letter with the notice of major works, and rang C to tell him, and he wanted me to take it straight to the main post office and send it to the solicitor. so we ended up being out for a couple of hours. Adam was good, I bought him a sandwich and some fruit and he fell asleep in the pushchair, and stayed asleep while I carried him up and put him in bed and he slept till about 6,30pm (it was about 4 hours). I love long naps!

though we got back and after Adam was in bed I realised there was a flood in the bedroom. :dohh: I had left the skylight wide open and the rain came on while we were out and so much came in. :( wooden parquet floor was soaked and black, some of Adam's books are sodden and may be beyond repair... and two teddies were drowned (but coming back to life on the windowsill now, sunbathing). fortunately the floor has dried out and doesn't show signs of flooding. but god, I was scared for a bit! (even though it isn't in good condition and could do with being replaced).

as for names - heh, ok then, just in here!

my favoured name is Luke, but Chris says no, which saddens me because none of the other names feel as right to me. but since it's not my choice 100% I have to accept his veto, and I will respond (and I do!) to most of his choices with mine.

there are 3 names we're tossing around - Euan, Jamie and Joel. right now I prefer Joel, because I have always liked Joseph because I like Joe and Joey, but C doesn't like Joseph, but he does like Joel. so I think, ok, we could call him Joel and I could call him Joey! Euan (or Ewan) I like, but not sure. (this is the name that most people I've mentioned names to prefer.) and Jamie is C's favourite, but there is a Jamie in the family already. not close to me, it's my mum's cousin's grandson (my mum and her cousin are quite close). this boy is James but known as Jamie. I would have Jamie not James. but I am very mixed about it.

on my own shortlist but not approved by C: Duncan (my late uncle, and very much a family name), Evan, Corin, Brady and Jonah. I think of those, other than Luke, Jonah is my favourite. but no go. because Jonah is a New Zealand rugby player. meh.

middle name will probably be David, after my dad (this is C insisting, don't know why, we don't tend to call people after people in our family, though I do like some family names). we'd love to name him after Simon & Garfunkel, but I don't like Paul or Arthur. but I do like Simon and Garfunkel, and would be fine about using either (not both) as a middle name. but C is being funny, he likes Simon as a first name but not a middle, whereas I am the other way round. :dohh:

Spidey, I knew the phrase "going postal" and understood it meant going a bit mental, but didn't know where it came from! wow. heh. don't blame you for going postal over how you've been messed about with your job. but good news you're not out of a job! :D

Cleck, sorry you're grumpy. it's a stressful time for you. but it won't always be like this, you have to hang on to that. :kiss:


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## Shiv

I love the name Joel, a lady I have met here has sons called Elias and joel and i love both those names. I also like Jonah. It is really hard picking names, David and I never agree, we have such differing tastes.

Cleck - sorry you are grumpy. Are you upset about moving home in general or just that temporarily you will have to live with your in-laws? Is there no way you could stay in San Diego until COrey gets out of the Navy? I kind of felt the same way about David making us move. I felt i would end up resenting him so much for making me do something i didn't want do. So far though (fingers crossed) I really like it here. I am sure once you get back home and get used to seeing friends and family agian it will seem so much better, especially as you will be able to keep your eyes peeled for a house to buy. Massive hugs to you, but also try not to be too hard on Corey, I am sure he is only trying to do what is best in the long run for his little family :hugs:

Spidey - I had also heard of going postal, but didn't no the backgroud to it! Can you get them to give you somethign in writing regarding your job? That way at least you would have a little certainty.

MJ -I hoep the lady buys your flat and it can start moving a bit quicker for you. I also hope the weather says cooler!

Well I am off out otnight for dinner with my new "friends", i am a bit nerous as we won't have children to run after and will actually have to talk! David has had to go away for work today and overnight, when he told me I went mental! It is not as if I go our EVER, so he got his mum to come up and babysit, great I can go out, not so great that I have the MiL here for 2 days!


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## spidey

Cleckner- I'm sorry you're in a shit mood :hugs: Do you think it's because you've been doing this all on your own for months and months and now that DH is back you're still on your own and you will continue to basically be a single parent until next summer? It's all very overwhelming to me and I know it would be a huge cause of my own grumpiness. Heck, I can't deal with my DH being away 2 evenings in the same week- it always makes me bitter because it feels like I have so much more responsibility (with the house and Kira) compared to him and he's off having more fun and less worry. 

Once you're back home do you think you'll continue looking for houses to buy? Since you're the one who has to live alone for all those months I think you should get the final say at where you live. So if you'd rather stay in California then you should. Or if you want to stay in an apartment back home, then you should. 

Cleckner- how long was your luteal phase this month? I hope the vit. B6 is working!

MJ- 4 hour naps are great :thumbup: I really love some of the names you like. Luke is probably my favorite. I think it would be okay to name the baby Jamie because it sounds like that relative is quite distant (and a James anyway). Jonah is a nice name too. You'll have to work on DH to get him to like the names you like :lol: I hope you hear soon about the buyer on your house and it's good news (fingers crossed!)


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## cleckner04

MJ- I like the name Luke too. It goes really well with Adam. Out of your list, Evan is my favorite though. :haha: But I like E names. EEk about the flooding!! I would've been panicking if that were me. :hugs: 

shiv- Have fun tonight!! :dance: I'm sure it'll be great even without the kids. 

spidey- Well I just calculated my phase and it was actually 12 days!! OMG! :shock::dance: Hopefully it will stay that way now!! I wonder if my losing weight has helped at all. 



I think it's a mixture of things that is making me grumpy. I definitely want to be back home. There is no question about that. But thinking about living with my inlaws for 7 months or more is just making me freak out. I love my inlaws but I have a feeling they will start taking over with Emma and telling me how to parent her, I know they will hate that I'm still breastfeeding her because they were against me still feeding her the last time I lived at home. SILs kids are always around because they live right next to the inlaws. Well her kids are always sick and they get Emma sick every single time we go home to visit. So that makes me freak out a bit about being there so long because soon we won't have health insurance so I'm freaking out that Emma will be sick and we can't pay for a doctor. I am going to keep looking at houses but I have a feeling we won't buy yet. I'm thinking it's pointless to buy yet when we don't know where DH will find a job and the school he wants to go to is 2 hours away so we would probably have to move to that town for a few years while he goes to school. :roll: 

I'm so glad DH can just take me being grumpy and roll with it. :haha: This morning he sent a text saying he knows I'm not awake but he loves me. Which is a nice thing to wake up to. Although I also woke up to Emma screaming at me for no reason so that soured the morning a bit. 


Anyone elses LOs sometimes just seem to wake up on the wrong side of the bed? Emma has these days where she just screams at me for every little thing. This morning was because I got up to pee and she wanted me to stay in bed to cuddle longer. :dohh: Than it was because we took a bath together and I got out before her to get dressed while she kept playing and she didn't want me to leave so she screamed and climbed out following me while screaming. :dohh: She is SO clingy lately. It's driving me crazy. I'm sure it doesn't help that her life is always changing. DH is in and out with having duty every 4 days. We are always moving house so she is dealing with me packing away our stuff already. It must be really hard on her. But even knowing how hard it must be, I still get upset when she screams at me all day. :haha:


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## jelr

Aww Cleck, sorry your feeling so grumpy. It is probably stress from not knowing what is going to happen in your future and money being tight. I know how hard that is over the last while and I think it is hard to get used to when your not used to worrying about money ifkwim. Dont be mad at Corey though as he is probably just as worried as you, but I dont think men show it as much. I know my DH is really laid back and acts like he doesn't have a care in the world but I know a few times lately he has said that he was worried about work or money and just didn't want to let on so as not to worry me. Once all this stress is over I bet everything will work out and you will be much happier closer to friends and family and Corey will get a good job and you wont need to worry about health insurance. :hugs: - Yay for a 12 day luteal phase - I bet it increased this month because you weren't even thinking about it :happydance:

Yep Natasha has days like that particularly if she hasn't slept well and is tired and she just gives out for absolutely everything. She is probably more clingy as she knows you are stressed too. Last week when I was upset Natasha spent the two days I was off giving me loads of cuddles and kisses and just lying on my shoulder anytime I was carrying her and as I have said before she is not a cuddly baby so I think she just sensed that I was upset and was trying to comfort me :thumbup:

MJ: I would say you can not wait to see the back of your freeholder - he/she sounds like a right arse. I really hope that the buyer loves the house and realises what a good bargain it is even with the work that is needed. I'm so glad Adam is being good for you and wow for a 4 hour nap, did he still go down tonight for you. Natasha usually only sleeps for an hour or two and if she has anymore she wont sleep at night :dohh: - Glad the heat has settled down a bit. I really like Luke too and Jamie, although Jamie is something I would never call one of my own because it is too near James and I'm convinced that it is a bad omen in my family :haha: as DH, my Dad and my brother are all James and they all have had to fight the demon drink, although thankfully DH as you know is in recovery for 19 years now and my brother about 5 I think and my Dad is meant to be off of it, although I have my suspicions that he has slipped lately, although since Natasha was born I have decided I am sticking my head in the sand and dont want to know because I have realised that if all his surgery didnt stop him I can't and he has to get to that place himself so it is best if I dont know. I know it is silly but if I had a son I would be convinced that he would have to battle it one day which is totally stupid because of a name :haha:

Spidey: Yay for having a job past September again :dance: but OMG that is so annoying about that they keep changing their minds :dohh:, I think getting something in writing this time would definitely be a good idea, that would drive me crazy. - I have 1 sister and 5 brothers all younger than me, we are like steps of stairs and my youngest brother is 20.

Shiv: I hope your dinner is going well, which I'm sure it is and I'm sure you will all have lots to talk about even without the children there. I'm also glad that DH got your MIL down to babysit, although I know it is a pain having her for 2 days but at least you didn't have to cancel. You were right to flip out, I would have too, that is one of the only things that DH and I tend to fight about is if he has to work late or do extra work - thankfully with this new job he is home by 5.30 and 6 at the latest. Did Sophia's furniture arrive yet and have you moved her into her bed?

Well not much news from me. Only next week left in work I hope :thumbup:

Oh I meant to tell you all, I think we had a big conversation at the weekend and I think we are actually going to put ttc off until Oct / Nov. DH is happy enough to ttc whenever I am really and just wants me to be ready and I thought I was but now that the time is getting closer I really want to just enjoy the summer off with Natasha and not be stressing about ttc or giving up the fags - I know you probably all think I'm terrible for not just giving up but they really have been my comfort since I was a teenager and I know it is more an addiction in my mind than a physical one, because I dont even smoke that much now since I had Natasha because I dont get a chance to get outside when I'm here on my own with her, but I know if I do it over the summer when I'm off I will have more time to think about it and stress about them where as I know September will be busy so I will have less time to focus on it if that makes sense and I know on the other hand there is not going to be a good time to do it and I'm probably just kidding myself by thinking that but when I quit this time I want it to be for good and not just because I'm pregnanat and have to, so the plan is to start the champix around the middle / end of August because you keep smoking on them for the first couple of weeks and then my date for stopping will be when I go back to work.

I suppose I'm scared too that if I was to become pregnant over the summer I would be stressed and worrying that it would end in another mc and I dont want the time off with Natasha to be stressful and full of worry and I just really want to enjoy maybe / hopefully our last summer on our own together because if the one thing the second mc has taught me is that we are so so lucky to have her and that her pregnancy didn't end in the same way so I just really want to treasure this summer and again I know if I was to fall pregnant with more time to think I would only worry more. My mind works better when I dont have too much time to think :haha: - I know I will be kept plenty busy with a toddler to look after but you know yourself it is all more pysical work than mental work and because playing doesn't take too much brain power I know my mind will wander off to either cigs or pregnancy stress where as when I'm back to work, my mind is tired when I come home and is too tired to think about anything else only looking after Natasha and playing :haha:

Ack I'm probably just kidding myself but it just feels like the right thing and feels like this summer is family time for us all (obviously DH only gets a look in in the evenings and weekends and it is more me and Natasha time) but I just want it be about the 3 of us with no stress as it feels like this year has been stressful enough and still is to a certain extent with money and getting his new job off the ground and it does feel like one thing after another this year even with stupid stuff like stuff breaking around the house. The shower went last week and our washing machine went on new years day (think maybe that was a bad omen for something so big and expensive to go on the first day of this year :haha:)

Hopefully I wont need the full 3 month course of the champix and will be happy to come off of them after a month or so and as soon as I do we can ttc then :thumbup: - Hope you dont mind me still coming in here when we are not ttc but I miss you girls when I dont and really feel a bond to you all after you all helped me so much after the mmc.


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## Mary Jo

thanks for the input on the names, ladies. :D at the moment Joel is definitely the front-runner, since I really can't have Luke :cry: - tried C with it again tonight and he said absolutely no way. I do like Jamie but I think he'd get people assuming he was James, and it wouldn't be James, since it breaks a rule of mine not to have a name ending in "s". If I didn't mind that, I'd be pushing for Linus, but I just think it's all too much "s" what with our surname beginning with "s". my mother prefers Euan, a good Scots name, but I'm not feeling it.

As for the others, on the non-C-sanctioned names - heh - I really liked Evan but then twigged it's just one letter away from my brother's name (add a K to the beginning). and Jonah, it's such a shame, but C really cannot get past this bloody rugby player. it would be up there on the short-shortlist if he liked it. makes me so mad, actually. grrrrrrr!

have a feeling my mother will dislike Joel as she doesn't like Joe. oh well, tough! 

as for Adam being good... well... I guess this doesn't count as naughty... but: he went up for a nap around 11-11.30am. I think I heard some sounds of non-sleeping toddler crashing around bedroom, but he will put himself to bed when he's tired, so I wasn't concerned. rang my mum for a chat, since she's been in Oslo the past 2 weeks and we had to catch up. 

1/2 an hour into the call and Adam starts wailing, so I went up, still talking to my mum. wasn't even at the top of the stairs when I smelled this - bad smell. I first thought it was puke, and I like like, oh no, where's he been sick, hopefully not the bed... but then saw his dirty nappy. on the other side of the gate, on the landing - exactly where I always put dirty nappies before rinsing them and putting in the bucket! poor Adam is standing there crying, shit on his hands, shit on his face, shit on his arse, shit smeared into the floor (my poor floor! flooded one day, shit smears the next). poor baby had been wearing shortie pyjamas, and he'd somehow managed to get the shorts off (didn't know he knew how to!) and took the nappy off and put it in the place dirty nappies go - I am sure he was trying to change his own nappy! he wan't running around triumphant, in fact I think the shit was spread over the floor because he'd tried to clean it up! I couldn't be annoyed with him (but I wish he'd learn that after you take the nappy off you wipe your bum) and got off the phone and started running the bath. 

hours later and it still makes me laugh to think of the poor baby trying to change his own nappy. need to steer him towards the potty, I think... :rofl:

Jean, Adam has been a bit funny about sleep lately, he used to be so easy to go to sleep for naps and bedtime, but he does play up sometimes now. goes to bed ok but then I hear him out of bed rattling the gate. last night and tonight he's done a poo after getting ready for bed, which is annoying because he has never been a night-late evening pooer! but a 4-hour nap wouldn't usually put him off his night's sleep. I think the heat is affecting him just the same as me. though I am expecting his sleep pattern to change, he won't be napping this way for ever (more's the pity).

totally get where you're coming from w/r/t the name that you see as a bad omen/curse. it *is* superstitious but understandable when people with the same name have had similar issues. 

your TTC plan sounds like you've given it a lot of thought, and for what my opinion is worth I think you've got some great reasons for waiting. definitely think planning for a fun-filled stress-free summer is a great idea, also knocking the smoking on the head first, just so you don't have the added stress of that when you do get pregnant. just think, TTC in Oct/Nov and you could have another August baby!

Cleck, ouch, you've got a lot on your plate. :( re grumpy babies, yes, definitely Adam has days when he's on the grouchy side - and because he doesn't speak much yet he leaves it to me to figure things out. it can be quite the challenge. his latest thing is to take my by the hand and pull me to whatever he wants, which is ok, only half the time I can't tell what he means, he drags me to the kitchen and pulls my hand up to the worktop, and cries or wails. sometimes I lift him up to see if there is something up there he wants (today he grabbed an apple and seemed happy enough with that) but sometimes there isn't anything! though it's usually actually a bloody dummy. I try my hardest not to let him have one other than sleep times but he finds them or cries so much that I crack. he is also teething again, I caught him poking right in the back of his mouth and then crying, so I had a poke in there myself and there was a hard lump where a 2nd molar would be coming through. 

I feel for you on the screaming all day, I find it hard not to scream right back. it really grinds you down. on those days I just pray for a decent nap (him not me) because it's so nice when he goes to sleep grumpy and wakes all cheery smiles.

Shiv, hope everything went well tonight and you found something other than kids to talk about! are you managing to still see a fair bit of your family now you've moved? it must be hard on them, too, not getting to see you whenever they like.

omg, just clocked your ticker - over 27 weeks already, lordy, off to 3rd tri for you :haha:


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## spidey

Cleckner, could you afford to get an apartment back home, one about 5-10 minutes from the inlaws? 7 months is a long time to live under someone else's roof especially if you've been living on your own for years. 

grumpy babies- Kira screams at me all the time too. She does the same thing- after we wake up I can't get up and go pee right away or she cries. She'll scream if I do anything that she doesn't agree to. For example, if we're upstairs and I want to come downstairs I might say "hey Kira, lets go downstairs" (Kira shakes her head no) "come on, we're going to eat breakfast, mommy's hungry" (Kira shakes her head no) "ummm.. we can play with blocks" (Kira shakes her head no) "how about we go downstairs and play with playdough" (Kira nods yes and heads downstairs) :haha: She'll scream non stop if I just drag her against her will. Somedays she's much more laid back and other days she's very clingy. MJ- Kira still uses her pacifier. I try not to encourage it but she is really persistent about needing it and it quiets her.

Cleckner- a 12 day luteal phase!!! That is the longest one yet- I thought my 11 day one was awesome last month :happydance:

jelr- I can completely understand you wanting a nice stress free summer with Natasha. :thumbup: Maybe by November my luteal phase will be closer to 12 days and we can be pregnant together :thumbup: I would love another August baby.

MJ- poor Adam and his poopy disaster! He sounds like a sweet and smart boy trying to clean up his own poo. I have a mental image of the mess! The poor floor, first water and now poop! :lol:

Shiv- how did your dinner date go with your mommy friends? Since my playdate I haven't heard from my new mommy friend. I even emailed her a picture of our kids sitting together but never got a response. :shrug:

Joel- Joel is my BIL's name but MIL pronounces it like it rhymes with Noel although everyone else says it with 1 syllable. I never think of his name as being like "Joe". I like the name Joel but of course I would never use it since it's taken in my family :lol: 

my work- there's nothing in writing regarding my job. But back in March I had a meeting with the big boss who was supposed to put it in writing that I would lose my job in September. He asked me a few personal questions (where I grew up, etc) and then he felt sorry for me :lol: and said he would try to keep me if he could. I work with very educated people who come from educated well-to do families and I am from a "poor" family and the first one to ever go to college. I guess he felt bad for firing the only local trashy girl he had working for him :haha:

I spent the evening painting the bathroom! It's a light blue color now, I'll take pics when its all done.


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## Shiv

Cleck - great news about your 12 day LP, I hope it stays that way for you. I was wondering if it was your weight loss as well. Or maybe Emma fed less? Either way fingers crossed for a BFP real soon x

If Sophia doesn't have enough sleep then she can be a grumpy moo, and nothing I do is right. Luckily is doesn't happen too often!

jelr - sounds like you have really thought through your TTC options and have come to a good decision. You and Natasha will have a blast over the summer. And of course you can stick around here, I feel this group is far more than a ttc group now.You're my friends and I love hearing about all aspects of your lives.

Everything for Sophia's room has been delivered but we haven't decorated or put her be dup yet. I keep delaying as I am scared! And people keep saying they are coming to visit and I want her to able to stay in her bed to get used to it for a few weeks before we kick her out so guests can stay in it. SO we are looking at another couple of weeks.She as started playing in her cot a lot before she goes to sleep at night. I don't mind, she is happy and when she is tired enough she just goes to sleep, but I am guessing it won't be that simple when she can get out of bed. If I am honest I feel David is pushing me a bit into moving her. He was the same with putting her in her own room, and using a duvet etc. I'd keep her the same way forever if it was up to me!

MJ- eek about Adam's poo incident. but bless him for takign the initiative and trying to change his nappy. And he got the dirty one in the right spot!

I am not seeing as much of my family as I did before but am still trying to see them twice a month, which is way more than a lot of people get to do so can't complain! 

And yes 3rd tri! I have started really feeling pregnant now. And having not had the hurumphy feeling whne I was pregnant with SOphia about feeling massive (i love dmy bump), I am finding it more difficult and much more tiring with a toddler to run after. I have it in myhead that I will go into labout before the 40 weeks as I went at 39 weeks with Sophia. But then I think - no I assumed last time I would be overdue by 2 weeks which is why I never got to the really fed up stage. But I can feel it will be a moany Shiv for a good month or so before the birth - sorry in advance!

Spidey - look forward to seeing your bathroom! Where are you in your cycle?

Well my dinner with my new friends was ok. We still talked about the kids a lot. The problem is that mostof conversation starters would revolve around stuff like, hwo did you meet your OH, how did he propose, wedding talk, honeymoon, etc etc and because one of teh ladies husband just ram off with a younger woman I dont feel I can ask. So it rules out a whole load of getting to know you questions. But hopefully we will go out and again and it will get better.


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## jelr

Yeah I think it is the right decision. I just feels right at the moment anyway although I nearly did a u-turn after seeing my cousins pictures of her triplets - they are just adorable and so cute together. I would say my cousin gets little sleep though and dont know if I could do it cute and all as they are :haha:

MJ: Sorry but I did laugh reading your post, bless Adam for trying to change his own nappy the poor thing and poor you having to clean up that mess :wacko:

Spidey: that is a pity that the lady didn't respond and that you have heard nothing back from her - how long ago was it again? - Maybe she has something going on and will come back to you soon. I can't wait to see your bathroom once it is all done.

Shiv: I'm so glad the dinner went well, yeah that is a tough one regarding the lady who's husband has left her it really does leave out a lot of conversation starters and it probably brings lots of conversation droppers too depending on her response if she discusses it at all :dohh: - At least you do have the children to talk for conversation starters though and I think it is alright to talk about them too. I know with any of my friends we would talk about them and even the ones who dont have children always ask and are interested in Natasha, although I try not to talk too much about her when they dont have their own to talk about in case I bore them :haha:

I can totally understand you being afraid to put Sophia into a big bed, because I'm terrified of doing it :haha: it was top of my list when we thought there was another baby on the way, but now it is moving futher and further down my list :haha: that is why I'm really interested to see how Sophia does and maybe it will kick me up the bum to start thinking about it again if it goes well :haha:

Well I definitely jinxed myself last night by talking about Natasha having cranky days as she most definitley had one today and we haven't had one in ages. but nothing I did was right today - not food - not playing not anything :dohh: and then to top it off she was turning around and around and made herself dizzy and fell and has a little lump and a bruise on her forehead. I really hate it when she hits her head as I'm always terrified it will do damage, although I'm not good with her falling at all really as she rarely does, I would say I will really die the day she first falls and actually cuts herself which I know is part of toddlerhood but my heart just stops with panic when she is hurt.

Tell me something I would always try and put a cold cloth on her head if she hits it but my friend that has the three small girls was telling me tonight that you actually shouldn't do that as you are meant to let any bleeding out, which actually makes sense but I'm just wondering what everyone else does or if anybody else has heard this. Even though she is nearly two I still feel like I'm constantly learning the best things to do :dohh:

Well I'm going to head to bed I think as I'm wrecked tonight and hope I have a happy little girly tomorrow as it definitely is far more tiring when they are cranky like that and think all the running around trying to get finished for work is catching up on me too as my arthritis is playing up badly today.


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## spidey

Shiv, I can't believe your in 3rd tri already. The time has flown by! More than likely you'll have this one at 39 weeks too but it's best to mentally prepare yourself for a 42 weeker :haha:

jelr- I hope Natasha has a better day tomorrow. I've tried putting cold rags on Kira after she bumps herself but she refuses to leave them on. She hasn't had a bleeding cut yet- just head bumps which I hate too.

I'm expecting to ovulate in 6 days since I started spotting yesterday and the recent trend is that I ovulate 7 days after I spot. It's all becoming so predictable! I never use to spot before I had Kira so its another new thing for me.

So the lady who I had a playdate with must have read my mind because she just sent me an email apologizing for not seeing my earlier email (it's been about 2 or 3 weeks). She's changing jobs so once she's settled into her schedule we're going to arrange for another playdate :thumbup:

Me and DH have a 4 day weekend so today is technically Friday :happydance:


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## Shiv

oh Spidey, glad your friend got back in contact! and I hope you are enjoying your long weekend.

David has decided that Sophia will go into her new bed(room) tonight, so we have been decorating today. David just put her down and she is already banging at the door - it is not going to go well and I blame David entirely! i am sending him up to sort her out! I have put some photos of her new room on facebook, set so only you guys can see them, so let me know what you think! I'll give a full report of the horrendous night ahead tomorrow!


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## Mary Jo

I LOVE Sophia's room! so pretty but not OTT girly :D she is very very lucky - hope she appreciates it and doesn't give David too hard a time!

what made him decide that tonight's the night? 

(will be back later with a better reply, at work but just wanted to do some gushing!)


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## cleckner04

Shiv- Her room looks so good!! :dance: I hope the night isn't too bad. :hugs: 


I've been really burnt out with BnB lately so haven't been on much. I've been packing still and started reading the sookie stackhouse series of books again. :haha: I'm such a geek. But just haven't really been in the mood to be on here as much for some reason. Must be because I spent SO much time on here when DH was gone so now it's all caught up with me. My post count is ridiculous. :rofl:


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## Shiv

Cleck - it is understandable that you might not want to be on here as much as when Corey was away, still nice to hear from you though :flower: How are Emma and Corey getting on now?


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## cleckner04

Better! She will run up to him and shove him around a bit on the living room floor now to wrestle and play rough which is good. And she has been holding his hand when out in public. Also, our front door beeps when it's opened and every time she hears that beep when he gets home from work she gets this giant grin and giggles because she knows he is home. He still isn't completely satisfied with it all yet though because she refuses to give him kisses. She gives me kisses all the time and it hurts his feelings I think.


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## spidey

I hope Sophia is still asleep for you Shiv. Her bedroom is very pretty and I can't believe how grown up she looks! She's looking a bit mischievous in those pictures and I can't figure out why. Maybe because she's looking right at the camera and grinning :lol:

Cleckner, it sounds like Emma is doing great with Corey. Even if he was home the whole time, Emma would still treat you 2 differently since you're her mommy. I can understand about taking a break from bnb... I go thru periods where I'm here all the time and then sometimes I need a break too.

So far my 4 day weekend is turning out great :thumbup: I have a huge list of chores for DH (want want want want) and he's getting them done :haha:

Kira's been obsessed with a huge bag of flax seed that we keep in the basement. She will spend an hour running her hands through it and pouring it on herself. So right now DH is working down the basement and Kira is entertaining herself with flax seed (and I'm supposed to be making dinner). :haha:


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## Mary Jo

How did it go, Shiv? :D


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## Shiv

Weeeeeeeeeeeell, actually much better than I expected! David put her down as normal at 7pm, read her a story and left the room. She was immediately up at the door (which she can't open as the landlord put in new carpets and they are so thick that the door needs a real shove to get open - lucky!). David went up and read her another story, then sat by her door, told her not to get out of bed (whcih she didn't - she's such a goody two shoes for him!) and then ignored her until she fell asleep. It took an hour of her pleading and singing and moving around the bed until she just put herself back under the covers and went to sleep. We checked on her when we went to bed and she was lying across the bed with no covers :dohh: But she slept until 7.30am and then refused to get out of bed until David said it was ok! 

David just put her down fro her nap and even that seems to haev worked. She cried for a few minutes and has been silent for over an hour!

Problem is it will be my turn to sort her out tonight if she gets up and she doesn't behave as well for me!


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## Mary Jo

yay!!! well done Sophia!! :happydance:

I'm sure she'll soon get used to it and not need encouragement. :lol: do you have toys in her room, or is it just for sleeping? Adam's generally better for C as well, at least at actual bedtime, but he does know that if he makes enough fuss daddy will just come up to bed himself. he never used to be like that, but I guess that's toddlers, keep us on our toes.

though I managed to kind of bribe him into bed myself a bit last night (it didn't last, but he was quiet for a bit...) I got in from work at 10pm and Adam couldn't have been asleep or properly so, because I heard him up and shaking the gate straightaway. so I went up. he wasn't looking like he realised it was bedtime, so I picked up his baby (my old Cabbage Patch doll, Carina, we call her "baby" now!) and sat down with her, ignoring Adam, and cuddled her and talked to her. "Awww, poor baby, do you want to go to sleep but Adam won't go to bed and he's keeping you awake? AWWW, poor baby! let's lie down and try to have a sleepy". Put baby down in Adam's bed and next thing Adam was up at the bed, too, to give her a cuddle as well! so I said, "aww, are you both going to have a sleepy now, awww, goodnight Adam and baby!" and left the room.

it was quiet for about 15 mins anyway. :rofl:

been to Bluewater today and bought a maternity tankini. we're going to take Adam swimming next Fri, and poss the following Monday as well. really want to be able to go, I know he'll love it, and I really need some form of exercise. thinking about roping my friend in to go to ladies' swimming Tuesday evenings at one of the local pools.

also went to John Lewis and scoped out the Phil and Teds. Chris looked utterly horrified, complaining they are too big. um, no, no they aren't, not for a tandem double. I told him we *are* getting one. and then showed him the Bugaboo Donkey and said how about this then? he nearly collapsed. don't blame him, it's bloody massive! so we will be getting a P&T, we saw loads out and about and I pointed out every single one. :haha:

Cleck, so glad to hear it's going well with Corey and Emma! 

well done for cracking the whip, Spidey. :rofl: Kira sound so cute with the flax. what do you use it for?


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## spidey

Yipee for Sophia sleeping in her big girl bed :happydance: She's such a sweetheart listening to DH and not getting out of bed. Fingers crossed it's easy for you tonight, but it sounds like it was an overall success so she might go right to bed willingly!

MJ- That is the cutest way to get Adam into bed! :haha: Swimming will be so much fun and I'm sure Adam will love it too. Kira loves swimming even though she's not thrilled with her bath these days.

Flax seed- DH had this strange vision of turning our back yard into a flax field and then harvesting the flax to make fiber. :haha: So he bought several pounds of seed from the farm store and it's been sitting down the basement for a few years now tempting the local mice to find a way into our house.

Kira has been a big time Daddy's girl these past few days and I'm loving it! I've had free time to play on my computer AND I cleaned the bathrooms and started the laundry and its only noon. I might even find time to bake a cake this evening if she keeps it up! DH is trying to get all his chores done and entertain Kira at the same time so maybe by the end of the weekend he'll realize how hard it is to be me :haha:


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## Shiv

Sophia went straight to bed tonight after David read her story so I didn;t even have to go in :happydance: Of course there is no guaranteeing she will stay there but woooohooooo anyway!

MJ - how is your weight coming along. My weekly weigh in tomorrow. I have moved my goal from onlyputting on 2 stone to being 12 stone or under when I have baby (which would be a gain of 2st 5 lbs). I wonder what my aim will be in a few weeks time :haha:

Oh and Cleck - how was your weigh in on Friday?


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## Mary Jo

wow, good girl Sophia!

:haha: at the flaxseed - that's the sort of thing Chris would do, I'm kind of dreading how he'll be once he has a garden. he has visions of being self-sufficient. I have visions of a couple of tomato plants. :lol:

I am ashamed to admit but Adam has only been swimming once before, when we were on honeymoon, he was 7 months old. :shrug: but he just loves bathtime, he dives forward and makes a huge splash. 

ouch right now he is crying at the loudest possible volume. eeek. it's my mil's birthday in a few days so C wrote the card and let Adam draw inside with crayons. he wasn't best pleased to have it taken away once there was nothing left to colour in. jesus, I don't know when he developed such a LOUD VOICE.

Shiv, I feel like I'm out of control, weight-wise. part of me thinks oh fuck it, I'll lose it after, but I *know* I will regret that... but I can't stop eating shit. weighed this morning (usually weigh on Sat but forgot yesterday) and I was up 2lb from last week. 11st 1lb. ack. it's all too much considering I still have 15 weeks to go. I'm up 19lb. it's not good. 19lb. even if I only gain 1lb per week, that's 34lb. which admittedly would be a lot less than last time's 45lb. a 2lb/week gain would be 49lb. which would leave me at 13st 3lb, or 7lb above my top weight last time. 

I have got to get this in check. don't know how, though. :cry:


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## Shiv

I am EXACTLY the same MJ - each day I think "today i will not eat crap" and every day I eat crap! I've just had a double caramel magnum, it was amazing! I too just can't find the motivation to stop, i think i will just have to face that i will put on more than i would like and deal with it afterwards:shrug: i have no self control!


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## jelr

Shiv: WooHoo for Sophia going straight to sleep, that is brilliant and I love her room, It is gorgeous. I really love the owl height chart. You have been my guinea pig for the big bed so I'm hoping Natasha's move when I stop being scared enough to do it goes a smoothly. :thumbup:

MJ: Oh Best of luck with the swimming, we hope to take Natasha when we are away for the wedding as the hotel has a pool and she has only been once too last year when we were on holidays and the same I feel bad because she does love the bath, so hopefully she will like the pool this time, she was a little wary the first time.

Cleck: Totally understandable you are not going to be able to get on here as much not that DH is home, do try and pop in when you can though as we would miss you if you went all together. I'm so glad that Emma is getting more used to DH and I'm sure those kisses will come in time too.

Spidey: So glad you mommy friend came back to you and you are meeting up again once she settles into her job. :thumpup: at getting DH to do all those jobs over the long weekend.

Sorry you girls are finding the weight hard, I do know how upsetting it can be to see those scales go up, but I know no matter what you both put on you will lose it all in no time afterwards. Still not easy worrying and feeling uncomfortable in yourself though :hugs:

Well birthday night out went really well, there were 12 of us for the meal after as some more were able to change stuff around and then we went up to the local hotel and had a couple of drinks and then of course we had to be greedy and come back to the house and have more drinks :haha: - I'm fine today though but am shattered tired, getting too old to be sat up half the night :haha: and even though I could have had a lie in stupid body clock woke me up at 9 so I just got up and went over to enjoy the beautiful weather we have with Natasha.

Natasha is back to herself thankfully, I do see a little bit of a 2nd molar peeking through so I think that was probably it. I hope they dont take months to come in like the first lot. She is loving having my brother home from London and was a bit wary of him at first yesterday when he arrived but warmed to him quite quickly and was having a ball with him today. We all spend the day over in my mams out in the garden as the sun was splitting the trees.


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## Mary Jo

I'm so out of control... today I have had... :(

a bowl of bran flakes with a few cheerios and prunes (and milk)
a double cheeseburger, large fries and a side salad from McDonalds (at Bluewater)
a bag of McCoys grilled steak crisps (from a multipack so not a proper size bag)
2 chocolate digestives
a small box of orange juice
cold roast chicken, egg mayonnaise, 1.5 tortillas, houmous, coleslaw, salsa, sour cream dip, spinach, cucumber, raw carrots, spring onions, tomato.
a Twirl (also from a multipack)

gah. gah gah gah.

I'm not even hungry now but I can't stop thinking about ricecakes, cream cheese and marmite. and cheese.

Jean, yay for your birthday celebrations! so glad it went well, even if you are tired today. :haha: it's a bit too warm for me right now, not as bad as it was at the beginning of last week, but hot and sticky. Adam is also getting at least one 2nd molar as well, I felt a hard lump in there last week. poor babies. still, once they're in, that's it till they're what, 6? hope Natasha doesn't suffer too badly. I have been giving Adam apples and raw carrots to chew on, he seems to enjoy them. :D


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## Shiv

MJ - other than the Maccy D's that doesn't sound too bad, and i would assume you don't have that every day. at least you are getting plenty of good stuff too:thumbup:

Today i have had:
breakfast - skipped because i laid in until 11am :blush:
Lunch - cheese, ham and salad sandwich, some grapes
snack - 2 toffee crisp biscuits (99 cals each)
dinner - roast chicken, roast potatoes, yorkshire pudding, carrots and brocolli
snack - bag of discos (multipack size), lump of cheese and an apple
double caramel magnum!

I hope that makes you feel better, or at least that you aren't alone!

jelr - glad you had a good birthday night out - i told you plenty of people would go! Good work on not having a hangover :thumbup: I hope you manage to get your work done quickly this week so you can start your summer holidays :happydance:


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## Mary Jo

ok, Shiv, I don't feel quite so alone now... as the for McD's - I did have it for dinner last night as well, after work. I always eat badly on work days, though yesterday wasn't as bad as some weeks:

breakfast - branflakes & milk
lunch - tuna & cucumber sandwich, garden salad with sour cream dressing (from Waitrose), bag of Branston Pickle mini cheddars, a whole 400g punnet of strawberries
early dinner - bowl of carrot & caraway soup, croutons
dinner - double cheeseburger & large fries

usually I can't stop myself having extra crisps and chocolate at work, and I usually have a tuna layer salad (which is full of mayo and about 500 cals) but I think Waitrose have stopped doing it. so it wasn't as bad as usual...

I do try to eat salad and stuff, actually I don't have to try I kind of want to anyway (not as strong as a craving but approaching it). so that's a good thing. I don't crave the bad stuff, I am just plain greedy.

yet another night that Adam isn't wanting to go to bed. :cry: he goes up and is ok for about 20 mins, and then the screaming starts. it IS warm up there, but I don't know, he's just not very tired. he slept from about 1.15pm to 4.30pm. maybe I will need to curtail his naps. I never used to have to, but it is a fact that on Fri, when he didn't nap and I was at the end of my rope, he slept well at night... argh. I'm just not ready for no naps!


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## Shiv

Now that is a fine day for eating MJ, You didn't snack on crap at all, which is of course my downfall, my meals in themselves are pretty healthy, it is the chocolate and crisps that do the damage. Although at this mornings weigh in I had onlyput on 1/4lb since last week, so I think the 4lbs I put on in 2 weeks is trying to even itself out a bit! So I am 19 and 3/4 lbs up in 28 weeks. Not great but I guess 30lbs is still achievable especially if I go a bit early like with Sophia. 

I am going to try to walk a bit more this week, Town is a one mile walk away, so I am going to do that at least twice and try to do my pre-natal DVD twice.

As for naps, i have started waking Sophia from her nap at 3pm as if not she is not tired enough to go to sleep at night. You don't have to lose the nap altogether, just choose a time (for Sophia it is 4 hours before bed time) and make sure he is up by then. Seems to work ok for Sophia. SHe slept in her big girl bed from 7pm - 8.30am last night, and I woke up to her saying "careful not to fall out"!


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## Mary Jo

awww, that's so sweet - "careful not to fall out"! at least you know she listens to you!

not even 20lb at 28 weeks, that's good going, Shiv. I predict between 30 and 35 for you. which I'd be thrilled at for myself. :lol:

hope nobody minds but I think I might keep a track of what I'm eating, just to keep myself aware and accountable. 

so today so far: 
bowl of branflakes and milk
egg & marmite sandwich (homemade, well, from a tub of egg mayo)
salad - spinach, carrots, cucumber, tomato, with a tbsp of houmous
might finish the apple that Adam didn't really want at lunchtime

which is all good. might be quiche for dinner, and more salad (or veg, I have some green beans and broccoli that need cooking), depends if it cools down because C gets arsey if I have the oven on when it's hot outside. or I might cook the quiche before he gets in and we can have it cold and he need never know the oven was on...

we have some crisps and 1 small Twirl. maybe I should have some ricecakes and cheese to snack on tonight instead?

re naps, that's a good idea, Shiv, you think 4 hours before bedtime? that would be about 5pm for Adam, but yesterday he was up at 4.30pm and we still had a battle. he's gone up for a nap now, but he isn't sleeping, I might have to go and intervene. we were out all morning, he's had his lunch and I thought he was tired. grrrrrrr.

oh and re exercise. I am so lazy. got bus down to my AA meeting this morning but did walk back (not quite a mile, maybe 3/4). and I only walked because my friend had parked her car halfway back to the flat so I walked with her (and it's uphill on the way home). usually I'd be on the bus. when (if if if if if if PLEEEEEAAASE) we move, the shops are close by but the shopping street in Sutton is very long, so from our house to the far end is about a mile, and the station is at the far end. I think if was to go to the station specifically I'd get the bus but probably not if I was shopping.


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## Shiv

MJ - maybe make it 5 hours before he goes to bed that you wake him up then?

More than happy for you to record your food intake here, in fact i might join you. At best it might help me to stop being such a pig, at worst it'll give you ladies a giggle!

Today i have had
2 weetabix and glass OJ
Cheese, ham and salad sandwich
fox's classic biscuit
homemade spag bol, one slice of garlic bread and baby corn
usual evening snack of discos, cheese and apple
prob about to have a 2 finger kitkat

Not a great day but if I am honest it doesn't get much better than this!

I also walked into town and back - knackering in this heat!


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## Mary Jo

that looks like a good day, Shiv. :D do you drink tea/coffee/fizzy pop at all? I drink far too much diet coke, but hardly ever coffee or tea now, occasionally some tea at work, and the odd decaf coffee if I'm out but rarely at home (I have developed an aversion to instant coffee).

so today in full:
bowl of branflakes and milk
egg & marmite sandwich
salad - spinach, carrots, cucumber, tomato, with a tbsp of houmous
bag of McCoy's steak crisps (from a multipack)
1 chocolate digestive
cold roast chicken, houmous, coleslaw, salsa, sour cream dip, 1.5 tortilla wraps, spinach, carrots, cucumber, onion, tomato
bar of Dairy Milk (also from a multipack)

have definitely had worse days but this is fairly typical. I really should cut out *some* of the junk. crisps OR chocolate. 

didn't eat the apple Adam had rejected. he did for with good reason, it was really sour. weird, it was a Pink Lady, I thought they were meant to be sweet? and quiche was off the menu. way too hot to bother cooking it.

as for naps - very poor day. no naps! not even one, well, maybe he did nap for 10 minutes, but I'd be surprised. three or four times he looked tired and I took him up, and left him but not long after he was up and banging around. I don't understand. at least *I* wasn't too exhausted today so I wasn't too horrendously frazzled. and he wasn't in a bad mood, just a bit hyper. a lot hyper, really. and then after his bath he fell asleep on me while watching some stuff on YouTube (Charlie & Lola are somewhat out of favour but he loves Noddy for some reason) and C put him to bed without his milk and his stories - and even cleaning his teeth. which is not good, but I wasnt risking him waking up again. 

grrrr. I'm just not ready for no naps! I can't be dealing with it now. I'll have to rethink my entire day's routine! ffs!


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## Shiv

I forgot to say earlier - but egg and marmite? I love marmite but I can't imagine this combo!

I think our days intake of crap was fairly similar, if I could cut down to just one choc/biscuit thing a day i would be happy! 

I don't drink tea or coffee (just don't like it, or coke for that matter, maybe it's a caffeine thing?) or fizzy drinks. I read somewhere that fizzy drinks can make heartburn worse though? I drink no added sugar squash, apart from a glass of OJ with breakfast it is all i drink.

Sophia only had a 40 minute nap today, but she slept in late this morning so not too bad. i was saying the same to David about not being ready to have no naps, (who if he had his way would stop the naps), how on earth will i cope with a newborn and a toddler who doesn't nap. It wouldn;t be so bad if Sophia was happy with no nap but she is a grump!

Spidey, cleck and jean - how do your LO's nap these days?

Happy July 4th to Spidey and cleck :happydance: I hope you've had a great long weekend.


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## Mary Jo

Happy 4th July, Cleck & Spidey! :happydance: what are you doing to celebrate?

Shiv, it was such a teensy weensy scraping of Marmite, I barely even noticed it... but I quite like the combo. though I prefer it on ricecakes not bread. I much prefer ricecakes to bread full stop, but am trying to eat more wholemeal bread to encourage the poo fairy. 

wouldn't surprise me if caffeine is implicated in my heartburn. :( but I'd be a (more deeply) miserable cow without it, not to mention the headaches. am not that keen on squash/cordial, though I like water, but plain water is one of the worst thing for heartburn for me. I drink fizzy water if I buy it when out, as someone suggested it was good for heartburn, but I haven't noticed much difference. I have been drinking real orange juice with Spatone iron sachets, as it's meant to help absorption of the iron, and it definitely helps neutralise the irony taste, but it brings on the heartburn terribly. what's worst is I can't take Gaviscon or anything immediately after it or *that* will hinder the iron absorption! so I just suffer.

why would David stop Sophia's naps? Chris is appalled by this turn of events, he needs his breaks as much as I do! the thought of dealing with a newborn AND an Adam who doesn't nap is scary. I am thinking we'll have to have a plan to get out and about every day for him to get tired out. I'll do playgroups every day if it's what it takes (even though I don't like playgroup for myself unless my friend is there).


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## Shiv

I think David thinks I force Sophia to have a nap (good luck trying to force a toddler to sleep :haha:). He doesn't really see teh cues that Sophia is tired until she is overtired and then won't nap. So on weekends when are a bit busier out and about, i will say she is getting tired we should head home, by the time we get home she is overtired and won't nap, so he thinks she was never tired in the first place - if that makes any sense!


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## Mary Jo

ahhh :rofl: if it were possible to *force* Adam to nap, believe me I'd have been doing some nice heavy forcing these last couple of weeks! 

but yes, I see what you mean. Chris used to get very pissy with me sometimes when he had Adam on Saturdays, when he wasn't doing what he'd do with me and take 3-4 hours in the morning and then 1-2 in the late afternoon. like it was my fault he wouldn't nap as well, or maybe he thought I was exaggerating? (I never did.) I think the difference was I had him on a pretty steady, dull routine, I only went out at times he'd usually be awake, I fit in my needs and requirements to go out around him rather than going out when I liked, staying out as long as I liked, and expecting a magical sleepy baby/toddler to nap when *I* decided. and it bugged me when C thought he could do what he wanted and Adam would nap as usual, because not only did he not nap (and then was overtired and found it harder to sleep/relax later, and it was all not nice) but C seemd to think that I actually have it easy staying home with him as I have practically half the day to do what I want! whereas when he stays home with him he is lucky to get an hour! he did eventually twig that what I said worked and he has had some very nice lazy Saturdays since. 

toddlers are tricky little creatures, though. I get anxious if Adam falls asleep in the car (when we aren't going to be in for long) or the pushchair because it can go either way - he can stay asleep while I transfer him, and sleep a few hours more, or he can wake refreshed after just 20 mins and that's IT. that does my head in, especially when I am also tired from being out (it's what happened Friday).


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## spidey

About half the things you girls eat I have no clue what they are :lol: 

We didn't do anything special for the 4th. DH was off work and all the stores were open, so we did some shopping. DH is at the forge tonight making a toilet paper holder and a towel holder for our newly redecorated bathroom. He said earlier that I'll be on my forum complaining that my good for nothing husband isn't even home on the holiday :lol:

Kira had her worst meltdown tonight. I decided to make chocolate cupcakes with Kira. She patiently waited for the 20 minute cook time, but stupid mommy accidently turned the oven off around the 10 minute mark when I adjusted the timer (it's a digital oven). When I checked the cupcakes at 20 minutes they were really raw so I stuck them back in... over and over until I finally figured it out. Then I turned the oven back on and they started cooking again- at which time Kira refused to leave the oven and cried. Finally they were done and they were too hot to eat, and thats when she completely lost it, poor thing. And when I cut one up into tiny pieces so it could cool faster she completely flipped! She sobbed uncontrollably until a non-chopped up cupcake was ready to eat, and then she was okay. 

Nap times- Recently Kira sleeps from 9:30pm-7:30am and naps from 1:30-3:30 or 4.


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## Shiv

Oh dear about the meltdown bless her, BUT I'd have probably had a meltdown too if someone had made me wait that long for cake :haha:

You can pretty much guarantee that anything that I eat that you haven't heard of is junk food!

I am typing in here now to try to stop myself going to the kitchen to get some chocolate. If I can hold out this afternoon then I can have some tonight without feeling guilty!


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## Mary Jo

ha, yes, Spidey, it's probably junk... how about Marmite? do you have that? (I know it's available in import stores but no idea how widely available/known it is.)

awww, poor little Kira! I've never baked with Adam yet because I don't think he'd appreciate waiting either. when we have moved (if if if if PLEEEAASE) and I have a separate kitchen, I will, because I'll be able to keep him away from the kitchen and play outside or in another room, and hope he forgets! I am planning to do a lot more cooking from scratch, and meal planning, because we'll be on quite a tight budget. it's what I've always wanted to do but been too lazy. story of my life...

Shiv, for some reason I have no problem resisting chocolate during the day. only ever have it when at work, and that's down to boredom! come the evening, after dinner, and I have been known to walk out on a tv programme I was watching in order to buy it. crisps on the other hand - my downfall. have already had 1 bag today (Seabrooks cheese & onion).

today was shaping up not too bad till the crisps:
branflakes & 1 chocolate weetabix (we had a sample box they gave us free at Bluewater)
the crisps
egg mayo, marmite and cucumber sandwich, with salad (raw carrots, onion, spinach, tomato) and some houmous.

Have decided not to stress on the napping today. Spidey, Kira's routine is pretty much exactly what Adam's used to be :cry: - about 10 hours at night and then 4 or so hours during the day. I loved it. so last night he fell asleep early, 8.15pm, on me, and slept till 9.15am. so that's a long sleep for him, 13 hours. which is good... but I would prefer a 10+3, and get a break myself. because I didn't get a good night myself, since he's turned into a really inconsiderate co-sleeper, I have found myself perching on a couple of inches at the edge of the bed a few times because he's forced me over, feet in my back or face. it's too hot for that! (which is probably why he does it, he's trying to get some space!)

today we went out this morning to a local cafe where there is a garden and play area, and he got filthy (eating mud) so we went home and had a cool bath/shower, then lunch. he's now been up in the bedroom for the last 30 mins but isn't asleep, so I will probably go and get him out soon (though he is ok). I just think, if I expect a nap and I am disappointed I will feel worse than if I don't expect it and he surprises me. I'd take him out this afternoon only I am really hot now and can't be bothered!


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## Shiv

I just had some grapes:smug:


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## Mary Jo

*kicks pebble*


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## Shiv

it's ok MJ - I have BIG snackage plans for tonight :haha:


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## Mary Jo

come on then, vicarious snackers are curious. :haha:


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## Shiv

Well I am VERY proud of myself, we decided to get a DVD tonight so I went to blockbusters and got the DVD and David wanted a tub of ben and jerry's. Anyway I looked at bags of chocoltae for myself and managed not to buy one! :happydance: First time for everything!

So my snackage will consist of my usual, discos, lump of cheese and an apple. Plus a 2 finger kitkat!


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## Mary Jo

wow. well done! 

I managed not to buy *more* chocolate today, much to C's disgruntlement. I had bought the multipack of Dairy Milks yesterday (4), and we both had one, and he had his other when he came in from work. now I have to resist him being persuasive about going out later for more. or else persuading me that I can have his (little chance). didn't buy any more crisps either even though there are some good multipack offers on. got ricecakes for me. but we have very little cheese left, and no cream cheese (I like either sour cream dip and cheese OR cream cheese and marmite). we have ham but I'd have to be desperate to snack on ham.

are your Discos multipack? what kind of cheese? and I can't believe you only have one 2-finger kit-kat. you are the model of restraint.


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## Shiv

yeah i don't think I would snack on ham either!
 
Yep discos are from a multipack, cheddar cheese, a lump about a cm in diameter, and I do have plenty more kitkats in the cupboard but am hopig I might feel full wnought not to eat them!

A bit of chocolate won't hurt especialy i fyou've had a pretty good day otherwise :thumbup:


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## Mary Jo

I'm not keen on ham at all, actually, much prefer sliced chicken and roast beef, but we had chicken and the shop had no beef, and I am still pretty much banned from cooking while it's so hot. so I got ham. Adam loves it anyway.

so today has gone thus:

branflakes & chocolate weetabix
small bag of crisps
egg, marmite & cucumber sandwich, plus salad and houmous
roast chicken, sliced ham, 1.5 tortilla wraps, spinach, cucumber, onion, tomato, salsa, sour cream dip, coleslaw, carrots
annnnnnd... Dairy Milk (I got it :haha: )

that might be it. depends what time I go to bed and how loudly the ricecakes call my name.


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## spidey

MJ- I prefer a daytime nap over a longer sleep at night too. I often take a daytime nap with Kira :haha: I hope Adam goes back to a daytime nap soon- I think sometimes they like to mix things up to keep us on our toes.

Congrats on the self control girls :lol: I have none as I just ate 2 chocolate cupcakes during Kira's nap and I have atleast 2 more in my future today :haha:

Speaking of forcing a toddler to nap. Kira falls asleep nursing for her daytime nap, but it requires alot of cooperation on her part to sit on my lap, nurse and close her eyes. She use to hold her stuffed guinea pig for naps, but recently she's been holding other random things. To give her a sense of control over the nap situation, I let her pick something to hold. Today she dragged in the kitchen garbage can to hold :sick::dohh::haha: So I had a nasty ass garbage can sitting next to me on the sofa as Kira got her booby and slowly allowed herself to drift into sleep land :haha:

Looking back at recent posts, I have no idea what these foods are :haha:
digestive- by the name it sounds gross, LOL
twirl
discos
caramel magnum
marmite- I've heard of it but I have no idea whats in it.
spag bol- I'm assuming this is spaghetti in a bowl??


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## Shiv

That's a good day MJ - well done :thumbup:

Here is mine

2 weetabix and glass of OJ
ham, cheese and salad sandwich with grapes
more grapes
homemade chicken and lentil curry with rice
disco's, cheese, apple, kitkat

A good day for me, well doesn't get any better. 

Baby is giving me a good kicking tonight, feels a bit weird!

Spidey - i bet your DH will be glad to get back to work, after all those chores!


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## Mary Jo

ok Spidey, I'm going to fill you in on some British delicacies :thumbup:

digestive- by the name it sounds gross, LOL
a digestive biscuit is I think similar to what you call a graham cracker. they're yummy. wholemeal, sweet with a touch of salt, and they come plain or half covered in chocolate: clicky

twirl
a yummy chocolate treat made by my good friend Mr Cadbury: Twirl!

discos
a crispy snack made from reconstituted potato, rather like Pringles, but Discos were around in the UK years and years before Pringles made it over here: mmmm

caramel magnum
a luxury chocolate covered ice cream on a stick - yummmy

marmite- I've heard of it but I have no idea whats in it.
it's a very salty, savoury yeast extract spread, it's so strong you only need a very tiny amount to spread on a ricecake (my favourite), I'd literally only just have enough to cover the very tip of a knife. it's full of B vitamins and actually very good for you, salt notwithstanding. I believe it was originaly a byproduct of the brewing industry. it's very popular on toast. people seem to love it or hate it. I suspect the haters used too much in one go, it's not nice if you overdo it. clicky - in the pic in the link, there is about 5 times more than I'd use on one go on the knife. there's also a lot of Marmite flavoured products available now, Marmite crisps are very good.

spag bol- I'm assuming this is spaghetti in a bowl?? 
short for spaghetti bolognese - spaghetti with a tomato/mince sauce. :D

that looks like a really good day, Shiv. :D I forgot to add, I did eat a bit of Adam's leftovers as well, a bite of banana, about a quarter of his houmous sandwich and a small chunk of cheese. :dohh: other than that it *was* a good day, I managed to eschew the massive vanilla cupcakes at the cafe we went to this morning, usually I can't resist. they are thick with butter icing. mmmm.


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## jelr

Well done girlies, you are doing really well and eating really healthy I think. I actually rarely snack but just manage to put on weight by eating too much dinner ha ha and if I eat too much bread it piles it on :dohh:

although when I was pregnant I was a divil for custard, pots of ice-cream and cream crackers.

I'm more a crisp person myself than chocolate but I do try and stick to the low cal ones like snax and skips and I have been known to snack on ham when I dieting and really hungry as it is very low cal :haha: and it satifies my salt cravings :haha:

Spidey: eek at Kira wanting the trash can :haha: - I would say that you didn't manage to nap with the smell from that if it smells anything like ours does :haha: Poor Kira being so upset over the cake. Natasha had a melt down this morning because she wanted different shoes put on :dohh:

Shiv: I saw on fb last night that you were going to use your slow cooker - how did it go? and did you just throw it all in? That is so cute about Sophia "mind you dont fall out" I hope baby doesn't keep you awake with the kicking.

MJ: Natasha usually sleeps from 8 at night until 8 or 9 in the morning and can nap from anywhere from 40 mins to 2.5 hours, but it is usually 1.5 or 2 at the moment but she does go through phases where she just doesn't want to nap and will chat and play and then only sleeps for 40 mins and is very grumpy then. I also curtail her naps and take her up no later than 3 but she is usually always up between 1.30 and 2 as I put her down at 12 as she tends to get sleepy then and if I leave it any longer she gets overtired and wont sleep or if she does go down no problem later she wont sleep that night.

She did go through a phase where she wouldn't nap at all and would kick up and I actually found that only giving her the dummy at sleep time has changed all that. She was taking it with her one day when she wouldn't sleep and I said no dody is only for sleep time and she did get upset but then I distracted her and used to hide them and when they were out of sight she didn't look for them at all (I say them because she has to have one in her mouth and one in her hand :dohh:) and now we play a game where she puts them under pillow and says "mind tasha dody teddy" and is quiet happy to be without them unless she is going to sleep and when it is nap time I say do you want to have a snooze with your dody's and she is delighted about going down.

Well so much for not having a hangover instead I feel like a bus has ran me over for the last two days :haha: - and to top it off Natasha cried in her sleep every twenty minutes last night so I definitely think it is teeth as she is constipated too the poor thing and she always gets constipated when teeth are coming through. I can still only see a teeny bit of one but then she doesn't really let me have a good look. I only get to peek when we are playing and she is laughing. I gave her soaked some prunes last night and gave her the juice from them today and gave her oranges as her fruit today so I'm hoping it might help as the hard lump she actually managed last night would have hurt me it was so solid (sorry tmi I know) and the worst of it was she did it in her at some stage in her cot. She did play away for about an hour singing to herself when we put her down last night so it must have been then because I dont think she could have managed this one in her sleep and I only noticed around 11 when I went to check on her before I was going to bed and got the smell so I had to waken her to change her and it was from then on that she cried and she was so so cross this morning but thankfully she cheered up after a while and was in good form for my mam all day.

Well last day tomorrow girls - even with being wrecked I managed to get all the paperwork done. I kind of knew i would because I'm really organised this year but didn't want to bet on it because everytime I tend to get really organised and think stuff will only take so long - something urgent that has to sorted lands on my desk but thankfully it didn't this time :dance:


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## jelr

Oh and by the way Shiv and MJ - I really dont know how you eat marmite Yuck :sick: - but then I think you either love it or hate it dont you :haha:


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## spidey

haha, thanks MJ for the food lesson :flower:

In my mind I pictured a digestive as some sort of cracker that was supposed to help prevent indigestion :haha: Out of all the snacks, I would go for a twirl :thumbup: And thankfully I can stop picturing spag bol as a microwaveable instant bowl of spaghetti :rofl: Bolognese isn't a word that you hear around here often.

A treat that all the Baltimore locals go crazy for is a snowball with marshmallow
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/_6t5VTPWKTBg/S6rBo4JfwpI/AAAAAAAAAH4/xUDJLcJEdlM/s320/Blue.JPG

If I go 4 minutes in any direction I will hit a snowball stand. Right now I eat one every 3 days but during the summer when I was pregnant with Kira I had one every day. Pure heaven!

jelr, enjoy your last day tomorrow :happydance::happydance:


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## Mary Jo

hmmm, nice tip about the dummies and bedtime, Jean, might try that. not sure how it'll go though since he is more attached to them in the day than I'd like, actually having tantrums about having one. :( but it's worth a go! he's not in a proper bed yet but in effect he is, as he's in his cot with the side off, so he gets in and out when he likes. I have a feeling he'd get the dummy and rather than settle down, he'd get up and play!

hope poor Natasha's teething poo troubles clear up soon, that's not fun. Adam usually goes the other way and has disgusting sloppy nappies. yuck.

wow, what is that blue marshmallowy thing, Spidey? it looks like a blue slush puppy! what flavour is it? I presume its ice/sorbet in there?

well, at least it's cooler today. don't think I'm going to get much of a nap out of Adam, given he slept for 14 hours. from 8.45pm to 10.45am. it's ridiculous! I also slept that late, but in my defense, I went to bed at midnight, spent over 2 hours not being able to sleep, before finally my stomach started hurting badly (it's less of a burning and more of a drilling when it's empty, horrible, going to doc next week I think) and I got up for about an hour (and ate a load of plain yogurt AND 3 ricecakes with cheese and sour cream dip :dohh: ), then sometime after 3am I finaly fell asleep. so I was sort of appreciative that Adam wasn't bright eyed and bushy tailed at 7am, but I was so shocked to realise how late it was when he eventually reached for my phone to watch Postman Pat (his signal he's awake :lol: ).

so though we had no plans for today we're going to go out. I am still feeling really tired. it's irritating. last night my brain just wasnt tired at all, now, even though I have slept, it wants to go back to sleep. wondering if I need to be really strict with me and Adam an try to get us both into a better routine? I mean, I know I can't make either us sleep if we can't/don't want to, but I can be more disciplined about getting up at a time that might encourage a better sleep time later?

:(


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## Shiv

i LOVE marmite and pretty muchpread it like chocolate spread! When i was little i used to have it so thick it burned my mouth :haha:

jelr - the slow cooker was ok. i did a chicken curry and it was tasty but a bit dry. I guess it will work better with beef or lamb.

I hope natasha's teeth come in quickly - poor little mite, especially with the poos. Sophia has vey sloppy poos when she is teething, very messy to clean up! she is still getting her top two canines in.

I hope your last day went well, ROLL ON THE SUMMER!

Spidey - I saw your pics on the breastfeedin thread and laughed out loud, especially at the one of Kira holding the giant blue ball, it is so cute and a tad rebellious!

Sophia sleeps between 12 and 14 hours a night and usually has about a one hour nap in the afternoon. I am appreciating any lie ins as like you MJ, itis taking me hours to get to sleep at night, I am so uncomfortable and can't get comfy on my sides, so I toss and turn for hours and then eventually justthink screw it and fall asleep on my back (but usally not until about 5am!). David woke me up this morning my giving me a huge slap on my arse 9as it was sticking out of the covers! I went mental at him, as it felt like I had only just gone to sleep (it was 7am), he usally just gives me a quick kiss so i was not happy with this new wake up call!

Well i have been "good" again today with my eating, no chocolate so far so I will enjoy my little kitkat later! i also walked the 2.5 miles to the doctors surgery and back.

My friend is on weight watchers and I haev set her a challenge that she has to lose as much weight as I put on until bubs is born! I told David about this and his response was "is it safe for a woman to lose that much wieght so quickly" - cheeky sod :haha:

David is away on work next week, so I have been asking him when he is leaving (sunday night or Monday morning). Anyway I asked him again today and he said he still doesn't know, but basically not to plan anything for him for the 2 weeks" - AHEM 2 weeks?????????????????? Where did the second week come from, apparently it could run over by a week! Not happy. If he has told me he would be away for two weeks from the off, thne i would have mentally prepared myself for it. I can't stand teh inconsistency of his job!

Oh moany post from me today, i'd blame hormones but quite frankly I think I am just pissed off :haha:


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## Mary Jo

oh my, Shiv, I'd have been mad if Chris had woken me in that way, ESPECIALLY if I'd had a poor night's sleep anyway :rofl: well done on the walking. bloody hell, 2.5 miles. 

and I'd be mad if I was suddenly left alone with Adam for 2 WEEKS. crikey. are you going to have anyone to stay in that time? meant to say before, but it's great that you're getting to see family every couple of weeks. means there's never too long to have to wait. I'd be really happy if I could see my mum that often, but we talk so much on the phone anyway (probably over 3 and a half hours' worth just today, though that was a long time even for us - over 3 calls :lol: ).

though I did have stuff on my mind. my best friend found out today she has cancer, so I'm really upset and scared for her. 

Adam napped for 2 hours, which amazed me, after his mammoth 14-hour sleep last night. we went to the shops and just wandered around and he dropped off on the bus on the way home and stayed asleep through the transfer to his cot. so that was nice. of course he played up at bedtime and refused to settle down till C went up (after the Apprentice at 10pm). 

as for food - not terribly bad, but not brilliant. 

bowl of bran flakes & a handful of Cheerios and milk
a roast beef & horseradish sandwich (from M&S); to my credit I didn't finish off all Adam's leftovers (he had chicken & mayo), even though I was tempted, I took the other half home and he had some at dinner time. also to my credit I *got* the sandwich at all rather than go for a double cheeseburger at McD's (only thing that stopped me was the knowlege that fries would also have been involved)
slice (large) of cheese & onion quiche, plus salad and a bag of spicy Transformasnacks (puffed corn snacks) :wacko:
4 teeny weeny Thorntons's milionaire's shortbread squares
(and I blame you for this Shiv) a bag of cheese and onion DISCOS.

so no chocolate per se, though there is a Wispa (Spidey, this is a bar of aerated Cadbury's choc) in the fridge that did have my name on it :D

anxious about going to bed now bcause I can't stand not sleeping. :(

is that you free for the summer now, Jean? NICE! :D

Cleck, where are you? hope everything's ok! - ok, edited after going to Facebook, you've been busy with your family! great pics. :kiss:


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## jelr

Mmm Spidey the bit on top looks lovely, is that the marshmallow. I would love that bit, not so sure about the blue slush puppy part though as I reckon it would be too sugary for me. I tend to go for more salty rubbish than sweet rubbish. - Is your bathroom all done yet?

MJ: Natasha was extremely attached to her dummies to during the day and surprisingly when we took them away she only looked for them and got upset a couple of times, the out of sight really worked and it was definitely more habit with her, we used to give it to her in the car if we were travelling to DH parents which is about 40 - 50 mins away as usually it was around nap time and we were hoping she would nap and then my mam started giving it to her in the car so then even though she didn't have it during the day she would cry for it the minute we got into the car and again one day I just told my mam to hide it in the car (as she did keep it in the door nearest to Natasha's seat) and I just told her to remember teddy has it and is minding it for when you go to bed and she gave out that day and then the next just asked and I told her the same and she didn't give out and hasn't looked for it since.

I also love my lie ins and thought it was great when DH was off as Natasha started sleeping until 10.30 but then the day started going pear shaped and she wouldn't nap and was grumpy or was ready for a nap too late and then wouldn't sleep at night and because by the time I got her nappy changed and breakfast ready it was 11 and she getting her breakfast and then she wasn't ready for lunch until later and dinner was running nearly into bedtime so I had to give the lie in up and just get her into a routine so now if she is not awake I wake her at 9.30 and the days goes well as she has breakfast by 10 - funnily enough is hungry enough for lunch at 12, then goes for a nap around 12.30 or 1 and sleeps for around an hour and a half and as if it runs later or she sleeps later I get her up by 3 and she has a snack and then her dinner at 5.30 or 6 and then goes off to bed no problem at 8. so she seems to like a routine and the days just seems to work better and really I am still lucky that I get to sleep until between 8.30 and 9.30 usually if I'm not working which I never expected to be able to do with a toddler :haha: (although I still love Sundays when DH give me a lie in and some days really feel like staying there and not waking her until if she is still asleep :haha: but know the day just goes to pot if I do for the sake of an extra hour :dohh:

Shiv: Sorry you are pissed off today, although I dont blame you, if I got a wake up call like that especially after not sleeping I would be pissed too grrrr and that would also do my head in to only hear at the last minute that DH was going to be away for 2 weeks instead of 1. Men just dont understand do they, DH would be like that and tell me stuff at the last minute and doesn't get that I like to know in advance to plan and get my head around it :dohh:

Sorry to hear you girls are not sleeping I do remember that horrible pregnancy symptom so vividly and actually now that I think if it that is where I did a lot of my snacking as I would aimlessly walk around the house at night when I couldn't sleep and was bored and start to eat just for something to do mainly and because I would end up starving from being awake so long after my dinner :dohh: - I hope it is short lived for you both.

Well thankfully Natasha slept all last night and had a good full soft nappy today so hopefully those teeth will back off for a while as she is back to happy self today.

I didn't sleep well though as I had the most horrible dream - I dreamed that Natasha was dead and DH had these other 2 children (dont ask me who the mother was or where they were all of this time) but we were now going to look after them so I was fine with Natasha not being here and then the youngest one which looked around the same age as Natasha said she needed her nappy changed and I realised she didnt' talk like Natasha or sound like her so I started to completely freak and realised that my baby was gone and I was trying to pull of my ears because i would never hear my baby again and I was trying to scratch out my eyes because I would never see her again and then I thankfully woke up crying and in a cold sweat so I couldn't sleep again after that it freaked me out so much and I spent most of the night checking on her. I was horrible. 

I wondering if it maybe coming from the fact that I'm a little bit like you were last year Shiv and dont want her to hit two. I just want to stop time and stop her growing up as it seems to be happening all so fast, I just dont know where the last 2 years have gone and she seems to be growing up before my eyes every day. She just seems to be advancing at climbing on things and we are now getting loads of sentances and she is singing more and more songs and it is just scary because it just seems to have happened over night. Also I really love this age (bar the tantrums :haha:) - She is just full of affection and kisses and cuddles and is just so much more interactive with us now with every day things, she wants to help with every thing I do and is so funny to see her copying everything. Tonight I was cleaning the glass on the oven with some spray and she wanted a spray bottle so I have a travel spray bottle that I had bought in boots and never used so I give her that when I'm cleaning but usually she just eats it or plays with the lid and then she asked for some towel as I had kitchen towel and next minute she was beside me making a spray noise with her bottle and then was wiping with the towel and she has followed me with a cloth before but tonight she mimicked my actions perfectly and somebody actually called to the door and DH laughed because he said whoever walks in there will think we have the poor child cleaning because she was doing it perfectly :haha:

and the random things she is coming out with - On Saturday we were all lying in bed and she kept pulling up my pjs and was saying mammy boobies and I was messing and said leave mammy's boobies alone and next minute she looked at me with a grin and said not mammys, daddys boobies it was so funny. she also cursed properly for the first time as stood on a chair for something and my knee gave way getting down and I said "fuck" and next minute she said fuck and I saved myself quickly by saying yeah mammys foot is very sore as she had seen me limp and she made an ouch face and said mammy toe toes sore.

Anyway enough ramble - I just want to eat up her cuteness at the moment and dont want her to hit the terrible two's of non stop tantrums and I just want to stop her growing up really :haha: so I'm wondering these feelings are where the dream came from :dohh:

Oh and on a happy note - Work is finally finished so I can really enjoy her for the next few weeks (although wait she will probably have nothing but tantrums instead - I'm hoping that will jinx them away :haha)

I'm also doing bad with the weight as I managed to put up 2lbs over the weekend with eating out and feeding my non hangover on Sunday so I'm now 4lbs away from my goal and my brother that is home from London is a chef so he cooked fajitas on Monday so we ate in my mams and then when I asked him what spices he put on the chicken as it was so tasty (there as a load of different spices and a ton of sugar and salt :dohh) and he is now cooking us all a proper 3 course meal Friday in my house and I know there will be loads of nasty things for my waist in it as he is a typical chef and doesn't give a crap about the calories as it is all about the taste and then we are away next week for the wedding so it will be all eating out - do I'm doomed :dohh:


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## jelr

Sorry MJ - It took me so long to write that mammoth post you got in before me :haha:

I'm so sorry about your friend - what type of cancer and what is the outlook for her, no wonder you were upset. I really hope it can all be sorted.

I'm glad Adam napped for you, he probably knew you were upset and need that time on the phone with your mam.

Well done on resisting the McDonalds :thumbup:

Funny I am so near you and up until now all the food is the same but I had no idea what Transformasnacks were until you explained :haha:

I hope you get some sleep too. I do know how horrible it is not being able to sleep and the night is always so long :(.

Cleck: must go and have a look at photos now, I hope everything is going well with DH home and that Emma is getting more used to him and you are feeling more relaxed about the future.


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## spidey

Jelr, Shiv and MJ, I hope you all are sleeping peacefully tonight. Shiv, I would have been so irritated with being woken up with a smack on my butt too!

Shiv, fingers crossed DH is only away for 1 week. Do you have any plans for the week (or 2) that he's gone?

MJ- I'm sorry about your friend, thats very scary :-( Oh, and a wispa sounds very yummy :thumbup:

jelr, I LOL about Natasha and her comment about your boobies being daddy's boobies :rofl: Thats an awful dream and I wouldn't dare go back to sleep after that :cry:

Snowball- there are probably a hundred different flavors for snowballs, but they are pure sugar and very sweet. The marshmallow makes them even sweeter. It sounds gross, but they're actually very yummy  The marshmallow gets stuck all over your lips and mouth as you eat them and your tongue turns colors :haha:

The bathroom is almost done, DH still needs to make a towel bar and a toilet paper holder. He does black smithing once a week at an old fashioned forge nearby so he's working on them still. And he's going to make a shelf for above the toilet too.

Before- it's a perfectly good bathroom, but DH wanted to try his hand at making his own wood flooring and I needed to paint the walls since the current paint had water stains all over it.

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/improvements/sinkBEFORE.jpg

After

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/improvements/sinkAFTER.jpg

The wood floor DH made- he had rough lumber and sanded it down to make the boards for the floor

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/improvements/floor.jpg


TTC news- still no nip pain so no ovulation for me yet and its cd24 I think. I think I jinxed myself to get pregnant this month. First, I really stocked up on maxi pads since I had good coupons :haha: I bought 5 very nice new bras that fit my currently small boobies. AND... I have fun plans for Kira's birthday and would actually prefer NOT to have morning sickness during it.


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## cleckner04

OMG I just typed out a really long reply to all the past posts and I accidentally hit the back button and it was all lost. :cry::cry: 

I replied to everyone too. :growlmad: 

But now I've lost my steam and I have to go deal with Emma so I will just :wave: and sneak back out. :dohh: I'll try to post more tonight after Emma goes to bed.


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## cleckner04

Ok. I'm gonna try this again....

spidey- That bathroom looks awesome! Your DH is very talented. It looked nice in the first place too but I love the wood flooring in there now. :thumbup: 

jelr- Your dream sounds absolutely awful. :(:hugs: I'd have had trouble sleeping after that too. I once had a dream that my mom died and I woke up so distraught and couldn't stop crying. I even nearly called her even though it was at a crazy hour at night. :blush: Your brother is a chef? That's awesome! Is he single? :muaha: I might need to book him as my second husband. :winkwink: 

MJ & Shiv- You ladies quit fretting over your weight! If I remember correctly you both lost the baby weight fairly quickly after the first LOs were born. You both are smaller than me and that's even after I've lost all this weight. :rofl: Enjoy being pregnant and indulge those cravings and don't feel guilty about it!! :hugs: 



Weightloss for me is nonexistant almost. Last week was the exact same 190 weigh in. This week I'm losing so far but not sure what the official weigh in will be. I am hoping to at least lose a lb. or 2. I've been following myfitnesspal this week but not as religiously as I could be. 

We went to the county fair for fourth of july and you ladies would be so proud of my self control. Greasy food as far as the eye can see and I didn't have a single bit of it. I packed our lunch and dinner and stuck to my calories for the day. BUT I did have an ice cream treat for dinner that I didn't count. :haha: I told DH as long as it wasn't anything fried than I would eat it. So he got a banana split and this mudpie thing that was icecream with oreos and fudge drizzled on it. DH was SUCH a whiner the whole day about the food though. Everything we passed he wanted to buy. Like greasy burgers and kebabs that people were carrying around. I tried my best to just stare straight ahead and not even look at the food though. And I did good I think. :smug: Now if only I can keep up that willpower when we fly home in a week and a half. :roll: 


No ovulation or anything yet here so no TTC news. Last month I was already getting high readings by this day so I think my luteal phase will be short again this month. :cry: Go figure. DH leaves for five weeks in September/october so we only have 4 months to try now instead of the 5 months that I thought we'd have. I have a feeling it just won't happen for us yet though so I'm trying not to stress myself out. Which is part of the reason I've been avoiding this site with all these accidental pregnancies going on here lately. :gun:


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## overcomer79

Wow I didn't know this thread existed!!! OH and I are in our second cycle of trying. I hope its easier than last!!


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## spidey

Cleckner, you should be very proud to walk pass greasy fair food and not eat any! :thumbup: It's going to be extra hard for you with DH and his cravings. You said he lost weight too so he should be happy having you as the diet enforcer :haha: Oh, and you should skip all the other threads on BNB and only come here :lol: I think my luteal phase this month will be shorter than my 11 day record too. :growlmad:

Hi overcomer :wave:

Shiv and MJ, I wanted to say last night that if your sleep problems continue, you might want to look into hypnosis to help you sleep. I did a hypnobirthing course starting at 30 weeks when I was pregnant with Kira and once I learned all the relaxation skills I started using the hypnosis to help me fall asleep. I still use it every night to help me turn my brain off and fall asleep since sleeping has always been an issue with me. So if you get desperate its something to look into :flower:


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## Shiv

Jelr - gosh that dream sounds awful, I am sorry it was so horrible, i hope it never happens again. Natasha will always be your little girl no matter how grown up she gets.

She sounds so cute with the things she is doing and coming out with. Sophia pointed at David's chest the other week and went Daddy's boobies - he was not best pleased!

And don't worry about the weight loss, you've had a lot on these last few weeks, enjoy the wedding and think about the weight afetrwards!

oh and i have never heard of transforma snacks and i live about 30 miles away from MJ. i am assuming they are transformer brand crisps?

Spidey - i didn't sleep well again, I may look into hypnotherapy.

your bathroom looks great, your DH is very talented.

As for nip pain, you said you conceived Kira on a long cycle, so you never know!

cleck - on your orders i have just been to the shop and bought an obscene amount of chocolate/ice-cream/cake/biscuits. You'll see why soon enough!

I think you did really well to resist all of that greasy food, well done. And maintaining your weight in the first week Corey is back is a great achievment.

fingers crossed for ttc over the next few months.

The photos of your family fun are great, we might see less of you on here but I really like seeing all your pictures!

Hi Overcomer, good luck with the ttc.

Right well if you thought last nights post was moany and hormonal - just wait for tonights. I suggest getting a cup of tea and a biscuit and settling down in a comfy seat!

So David comes home from work tonight and says he has been told when he will be working away over the coming months.

First off let me say that i know everything David does is to provide a home for me, Sophia and bump, but does that mean I shouldn't be allowed ot be upset, afraid and angry?

So.............. he is supposed to be away for the whole month of September. Bare in mind that bump is due on the 26th Sept and i gave birth to Sophia a week early. So his boss has said, as I am due the 26th Sept he can go out to Holland (oh did i forget to mention the work is in Holland?) for the first 2 weeks of Sept and then come home. So i will be 38 weeks and 2 days when he gets back (assuming the dates don't change). So not only am I gonna have to deal with a toddler on my own when I am very heavily pregnant, but christ knows what I am going to do if i go into labour while he is away. My parents are on holiday until the 16th Sept so they won't even be here. Who is gonna be my birth partner, who is gonna look after Sophia?

Then.......... he needs to go away fro work again to Portugal in October, work is hoping it will be late October for a few weeks. So I will be left with a toddler and a baby who is a few weeks old. lets hope to god I don't have to have a c-section.

So me being me, I haven't reacted to any of this yet. he told me over dinner so I didn;t want to upset SOphia by getting angry, so I mainly just aha'd throughout the whole conversation. As soon as Sophia was in bed i walked to the shop and bought hideous amounts of bad food which I am now steadily munching my way through. David know something is wrong, but I just can't talk about it yet, it all feels too much. i need to formulate a plan in my head of what i am going to do. There is no point being hideously upset about it (which I am) without having some sort of plan.......I need a plan! But mainly I just want to cry!

Oh and Cleck I have no idea how you have done without Corey there with you for so long and knowing he has to go away again. Kudos to you and you so rarely moan.


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## Shiv

and now it turns out that David might not be entitled to paternity leave (his company don't have to give him any as he hasn't been there 6 months), so if they don't give him any he will have to take holiday (assuming they let him) and that will be all his holiday for the year taken straight after the birth...........:cry:


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## Mary Jo

ah, shit, Shiv! I'm sorry, that's really really REALLY rough. :hugs: kudos on you for not reacting, I think I'd have blown up into little pieces and take Chris with me.

in the absence of your parents in the first part of Sept, is there any way anyone else can come and stay with you? maybe some people could take turns? I know it's FAR from ideal but if David hasn't got a choice, then I don't know what he can do. It's really shit, but I bet he feels awful as well.

failing that, could you go and stay with anyone? So you have help with Sophia and someone on hand in case you go into labour while David isn't available?

ack. I know I'd feel terrible. I'm really really sorry.


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## Mary Jo

Jean, ack, what a horrible dream! I know that sort, the kind you wake in tears from and daren't close your eyes and go back to sleep in case the dream comes back, too. awful. mine usually involves something bad happening to my parents. touch wood I haven't had a bad dream about Adam, not that I recall anyway.

hope you're enjoying your time off!

and that's a great idea about the dummies. I never thought to say to Adam that teddy/baby or something else is looking after the dummies. I think because he doesn't have a word for dummy (that I have heard anyway) I don't know if he'd understand it, but actually I know he would. he certainly comes running if I say do you want your dummy!

Spidey, great bathroom! your DH is very talented making stuff and doing the floor himself. is that what he does for a living?

as for sleeping, I actually slept ok last night,it helps that it is cooler. however I didn't go to bed till after 1am, and then Adam was awake and wanting to play about 5.30am, and I had to get up at 7am, so even though I slept well it was nowhere near enough. thankfully he was flagging by 9.30am and so he went back to bed and slept for 3 hours! I went up at 10am and also caught up a bit and felt hugely better. the heat really messes with me, because we can't keep the window open because it's not dark enough (the blackout bind is fitted to the window, it doesn't open behind the blind) and I hate the noise of a fan. and of course we don't have aircon!

I do have a natal hypnotherapy CD on my computer, might need to listen to it again and try to learn the relaxation techniques a bit better than I did last time! I'd love to have some real hyponosis though, always fancied it. :rofl:

hi Cleck! thanks for the reassurance over weight - part of me is blase about it all an thinks what the hell I'll lose it after, the other freaks out when I get on the scale! well done for getting past all the nice food, I don't think I'd have resisted. when we go places like that I always find myself going for things I'd never usually have, like hot dogs. :lol:

fingers crossed for the next 4 months! think positive. I also think you should skip the rest of the forum and just check in here.

hey OC, nice to see you :D

Transformasnacks are a bit like Space Raiders, you know, Shiv, cheap corn snacks that are generally eaten by kids. they used to be 10p years ago, then 20p, now they're 30p. I like them. lookie - recognise them?!

my friend and the cancer - gah. it's pretty shit. cancer of the endometrium (basically the uterus). she's had heavy excessive crazy bleeding for ages now, but it got a lot worse this past Sept. so much so that she finally took advantage of her private health insurance through her job and got an appt with a gynaecologist. she wanted to do some investigations, which were done under general anaesthetic 5 weeks ago. a week later when she saw the consultant for the follow up, the doc said she had precancerous cells, but that she was unhappy with the lab's assessment of her results and wanted a second opinion. then on Tues my friend had a call from the doc's secretary asking her to come in as a matter of urgency to see the doc, the next day. even though there were no appts, she'd fit her in. we thought it wasnt going to be good news and it wasn't. after a 2nd and 3rd opinion, it seems she does have actual cancer after all. next step is an MRI scan and a CT scan, I guess to see if it has spread at all. we are praying it's only in the uterus and not spread at all, and then a radical hysterectomy would be done and maybe some radiation therapy. if it is spread, it would be a different story. :cry:

complicating all this is the fact that my friend is very obese. really really obese. like I worked out and from what she told me, in order to be a healthy, not overweight, BMI she would need to lose 15 stone, or 210lb. to be overweight but not obese she'd need to lose over 12 and a half st (180lb). one of the risk factors for this type of cancer is being very overweight. :cry: she has actually lost 4 stone since Christmas but obviously she has to lose more, not least because undergoing surgery is extremely complicated by her size. she was ok under the general anaesthetic last month, but that was only a D&C, not surgery involving cuts into her body as a hysterectomy would be. she wants a hysterectomy, though she is only 36, as she is single and no prospects for having a family. she is very much alone apart from friends who adore her. she has no family, her parents are dead and the rest of her family disowned her (she's had a shit life in lots of ways, through no fault of her own). she's been my best friend since school, since we were 13 or 14, so over 22 years. I am heartbroken for her that this had happened, just hope to god it can be treated and she'll be ok. her initial instinct was to refuse treatment because she doesnt want to lose her hair, but it seems unless the cancer has spread badly chemo wouldn't be a first option, as radiotherapy and progesterone treatment are more effective on this type of cancer, and she wouldn't lose her hair (apart from in the area treated).

so. she has her MRI a week on Monday, me and Adam are going along to support her from the waiting room.

it's been a stressful couple of days, we're hoping things have moved on a little with the sale of the flat, but I am still going to be really anxious til we've exchanged contracts. just want to hear it's all ok. I can't bear worrying like this.

as for food - gah. wasn't a bad day, but it wasn't great (again).
breakfast was cereal as usual, lunch was a sandwich, so that was all fine. then I had a packet of crisps. and dinner was fried chicken and chips. but me, C and Adam shared one bag of chips so I didn't make a total pig of myself (it was a generous bag). and the fried chicken was breast meat and I didn't eat the skin (I usually have a wing and breast piece and eat everything apart from the bone). and then I've had my Wispa from last night. 

oh well.


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## jelr

Spidey: I love the bathroom and love the flooring, your DH is definitely talented, people would pay big money for those floors and he made them himself. Fair play to him :thumbup: - He will definitely never be out of work with that talent. I'm raging my DH is gone to bed as I know he would be impressed too. - Maybe your nips have gone on strike because you are pregnant :winkwink:

Cleck: :thumbup: for resisting all that food, I would have definitely caved I know I would - that is my downfall and the same when I eat out I just cannot pay for food that I would make at home or that is boring and have to go for the most delicious thing on the menu and it is usually the most fattening. - I agree I had no idea there were loads of accident pregnancies on here because I have a link on my favourites bar that brings me straight into this thread so I have no idea what is going on with the rest of it and know that I'm better off because losses and things like that would suck me in and upset me so it is best I stay away. I really hope you get pregnant before DH goes back in September. lol at my brother being your second husband - he is only 27 too so not much older than you :haha: - 2 of my brothers are chefs actually but the one that lives in London really has a passion for it and would cook at home all the time too where as my other brother only cooks in work, although you would have no hope sticking to a diet - I went shopping today with him for the food and you would want to see the amount of double cream that is going into the food eeeek :dohh: - although maybe you would because you have great will power where as I dont :haha:

Hi Overcomer - best of luck with ttc number 2 :thumbup:

Shiv: Definitely Kudos for you for not saying anything I might have managed to contain myself not to upset Natasha as I dont like to argue in front of her but I would have just walked out of the room in a strop and bawled my eyes out and with that news I'm actualy not sure if I would have managed to contain myself even in front of Natasha with that news. I actually gasped with I read the dates he has to go away. That is really unfair that they told him he wouldn't have to be away for much and now they expect him to be away all that time and especially with you being due around that time and then again just after the baby is born. You are so right to be mad and I know where you are coming from that it is not his fault but I would have to get angry at somebody. DH had booked 2 weeks off when Natasha was born and had to go in and do half days on the 2nd week, his old boss wanted him back in full stop, but he explained that I had an infection in my womb after having strep B and had to get into the bath (which I can't do with my joints at the best of times) 3 times a day so his boss agreed that he could do half days and I lost it I was horrible to poor DH and told him it was his fault that he didn't stand up to his boss and that he cared more about his work than he did about us and that it was fine we would just move into my mams. I felt so bad afterwards though because it wasn't his fault and he did feel that his job was to provide for us and not jepordise losing his job and he was right I was just a total bitch with being so sick and hormonal and I feel even worse now because since that company have gone into liquidation DH has told me he knew that he had an idea that things was going pear shaped there and didn't want to give his boss an excuse to get rid of him so I now know he actually was putting us first after being through the stress of the company going belly up anyway and David is so new there he really doesn't have a choice, but I do think talk to him because I do find talking about it and even getting upset can help to make you feel better and maybe you can both come up with a plan together and he is probably just as upset as you too. You are probably doing the right thing to give yourself time to calm down though because I really was a bitch and said horrible things because I hadn't calmed down :dohh: - Big big :hugs: though as that is really a tough one and you definitely do need a plan because you will need somebody with you and somebody to look after Sophia.

MJ: that is really scary about your friend. I can't believe they missed it not once but twice and it took a third opinion to find out. Fingers crossed that she was meant to find out and that it has not spread. It will still be tough having a hysterectomy though even though she hadn't planned a family as I would imagine unless you definitely never ever wanted kids you are going to wonder about the what if. I think you are doing the right thing to go and give her support. the poor girl sounds like she has had a rough life and it is so unfair that she should have to go through this now too - :hugs: to you too. Your night sounds a bit like mine as I stupidly didn't go to bed until after 1.30 and then Natasha woke at 5, but thankfully went back to sleep but I was wide awake until 6. Although she didn't waken again until 10.15 which never happens as I was saying last night because I'm always awake and get her up by 9.30 so we had one of those days that went to hell :dohh:

Well not much from me today, had to go to town and get shopping and sort out financial stuff and that so not much enjoying of the holidays yet. Af got me too and for some reason she is hitting my face as well I never get spots so shouldn't complain because I only ever maybe get one when she comes but this time I have not one or two but five on my face just a week before the wedding, but then on the other side at least the :witch: will be gone - so I had a 31 day cycle this time and I counted back to those horrible hormonal days and the first one was exactly 15 days ago (I remember when it happend this time because I had been in such a good mood on our anniversary and then the next day was a mess :haha:) so it is definitely the half way mark that the depression sets in and reason goes out the window :haha: - I would love to get some sticks to pee on the minute it happens and check is it OV, but I once did use the sticks before Natasha was born and actually thought I wasn't OVing at all because I never got a postive but now after being educated on here I probably just didn't get my surge, but then I dont think I have the head to pee on loads of sticks in the day and when i'm in that mood I definitely won't have the head for it :haha: - Whenever money sorts itself out here I might have to treat myself to your machine Cleck.

Oh Shiv I used the slow cooker again, but only to do steak again but this time I didn't put any liquid in and just put a drizzle of oil in the end and put some mushrooms and onions underneat but it was really dry and even looked dry so that idea didn't work - so steak is out the window unless we want it braised. I hope to really get using it now when I'm off but am trying to clear all the bulk cooked dinners for Natasha and fast dinners for us out of the freezer as the one I got was a 6.5 litre one so my plan is when I using it over the summer do extra to freeze for us all for when I'm back to work - as it will cut down on more work as I will just need to add extra :thumbup: - although I'm disappointed that your chicken was a little dry as I tend to cook chicen more than beef or lamb :growl:

anyways I had better get to bed as it is late again and apparantly I'm the commis chef for my brother tomorrow :haha:


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## jelr

Oh MJ are Transformasnacks like monster munch or chickatees (not sure if you have them in the UK)


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## jelr

Oh girls I have just been reflecting on my post and realised that even though we have had a shitty year and are worried about money. Life is good and I have a got to be grateful for because the only thing I had to complain about were a few spots tonight and some of you have so much going on. I really hope it stays that way and that in a few weeks things turn around for you and that you only have spots to complain about in a few weeks :hugs: all around.


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## spidey

oh Shiv :hugs: that is really crappy. I thought traveling was just a small part of DH's new job but it seems they have him traveling quite often. More than likely you won't have the baby until 38 weeks or later, but I agree that you need some sort of plan in place just incase. I would be very upset and scared about the whole thing too if it were me. Would you trust having a doula as a back up birth partner if you go early and DH isn't around? I honestly have no idea what I would do in your situation. I think in those first weeks you should have someone staying with you to keep Sophia busy so you can adjust to having the new baby. But you might find it quite easy with the second one, and bf might go swimmingly and the new baby might sleep all day happily in a sling. Pus Sophia will love being mommy's helper and she may be quite happy with everything too. Fingers crossed it all works out and David gets his paternity leave too :hugs:

MJ- I'm so sorry about your friend :cry: Thats awful she has to go through this at such a young age too. I'm sure she's worried with everything and to top it off, she has to worry about being put under due to her weight. I hope it hasn't spread and the hysterectomy is all she needs. 

DH is a health inspector for a living and brings home a steady salary and gets great benefits, so neither of us can complain. He'll retire with a pension and full benefits after 30 years of service at age 53, so you can't beat that! He does the wood working as a hobby and it's something he could fall back on as a career if he wanted to.

jelr, I didn't find your post complaining at all :haha: But I'm in the same boat as you. Life is good for me and I'm so thankful for it. :thumbup:

I think I'm going to get my LH surge tomorrow and OV Saturday. My nips just started to tingle today, so this is my next chance girls!!


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## Shiv

MJ - that is very scary about your friend. I really hope it hasn't spread and a hysterectomy will clear all the cancer - massive hugs.

Thanks for all your kind words, I would love to say I am feeling better today but I'm not. I didn't sleep well and have woken up this morning very teary. I have decided to email David, iknow thi sis pathetically ridiculous, but I can't talk to him face to face as as soon as I even think about it I cry, so if i talked about it I would just squeak, cry and then snot everywhere, andnot actually say anthing that i need to. I'll end up just looking like a hormonal mess, which is a fairly accurate description, but not one i am fond of! i know there are much worse things that could be happening but I just feel so out fo control. It feels like the bloody house move all over again, so unhappy but nothing I can do about it. i seem to have spent the majority of this pregnancy stressed out and deeply unhappy. So just need to wait for Sophia to go down for a nap (she chose today to be up at 5.30am!) and then I'll write the email and at least that way he will know how I feel, as I never talked to him about the house move so he probably thinks I was always fine about that too :haha:

We are away for the weekend with friends so hopefully that will help take my mind off of it.

Have lovely weekends everyone :hugs:


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## jelr

Ah Spidey I thought maybe your nips were on strike as you were pregnant - Darn it - Fingers crossed for the next few days to catch that eggy :thumbup:

Oh Shiv: I just had a quick read on my phone and had to turn on the laptop to give you a big :hugs: - I wish I lived nearer to you to give you a proper hug or be your back up for a birthing partner and help when the baby is born.

You are not a mess, I would be so upset, scared and angry without hormones, let alone with those added and tiredness.

I actually think that is a good idea to email him as I have done that before with a friend when I was really upset about something. Sometimes it is the best way to get everything off of your chest without somebody else interupting your train of thought and making you forget to say half of the things that you meant in the first place and you still end up frustrated and as you said in this situation because you are so upset and teary you will just end up crying and not able to say what you want so you will still end up frustrated and I definitely think he needs to know what is going on as this is too big a deal to just internalise it all because you did do it with the moving and now if you do it again with such a big thing. it will all just sit there and fester and eventualy you will only end up resenting David and he wont even know why as you haven't told him.

I also think it is a good idea because it allows you to say it in a clear manner as I know if it was me and he was there in front of me and was to maybe say something I would probably start to shout as I would have to get angry at somebody and even though it is not his fault - but in the heat of the moment I would feel that it is because it is him going away even though he has no choice (if that makes sense).

I hope that getting it all off your chest it will help you feel a bit better and in control and that maybe by this evening you two can sit down and talk about it and both come up with a plan. 

Big big :hugs:


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## cleckner04

Oh Shiv. :(:hugs::hugs: It's perfectly understandable that you are upset. I would probably go the emailing route too. It's so much easier to get everything out that you want to say by emailing or writing a letter. I think the chances of you going into labor before he is back is kinda slim but it's the thought that it could happen that is terrifying. I was in the exact same situation with DH when I had Emma. His ship left when I was like 37 weeks pregnant and they were gone for 2 weeks. I was terrified and so upset but DH ended up finding a way to stay on land instead of going with the ship. But it didn't matter in the end because I went to 40+3. :haha: 


Weigh in today and I'm down to 188.4! :dance: So a 1.6 lb loss this week. Not bad considering how much harder it is with DH home. We haven't been going for our walks this week but I told him we need to start again this next week. And I am going home in a week so that's scary. Hopefully I can just maintain at least while I'm home. I don't expect to really lose. I'm only 8.4 lbs from my goal though! So close to being back to my pre-mc weight. I feel like I'll never get there though. And oddly I was a size 10-12 right before my miscarriage but I'm still a 16 now. :growlmad: I bet it's because of my floppy mommy tummy because it hangs over my scar into the waistband area. :sick: I am definitely selling off my 8s. It's so depressing. :shy:


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## spidey

Shiv, how did everything with the email to David turn out? I hope you're having a good weekend and things are looking up :hugs:

Cleckner, congrats on losing even more weight with Corey around!! :happydance: Good luck on maintaining weight while you're home. How long are you visiting home? Are you flying or driving?

My tingly nips on Thursday were just a tease and they never turned into full blown sore nips, so I haven't ovulated yet. My opks haven't given a positive yet either, although tonight I got an almost positive so I'm almost there. My nips have been tingling again today, so this might be the real thing :haha: Once DH is done getting Kira to bed I'm going to put him to work so I can get those spermies lined up for the egg :haha: Although he's going to try and get out of it since he's supposed to play video games with my brother tonight :rofl:

Kira did the cutest thing on Thursday and Friday! DH dropped her off at my mom's house in the morning and Kira waved bye bye to Daddy, but she also made her stuffed doll's hand wave bye bye too. None of us have done this before so she came up with it all on her own. Over the past few days she's seemed so grown up to me- not my little baby anymore!

Once I'm done with DH I'm going to post in the other Lions Cub thread about more birthday stuff that I bought :blush: :lol:


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## Shiv

MJ - I can't believe space raider type crisps are now 30p - extaution I tell you!

How is the eating going, I hope you gave yourself some well deserved snacks over the weekend?

jelr - slow cooker - I don't think it will really work to cook dry food such as steak, it needs to be wet food to keep the moisture in. I cooked a chilli con carne teh other day it was really nice, so I am all for it now. Unfortunately, I was scraping out the ceramic bowl into the bin and I dropped it and it smashed! So no more slow cooking for me until I can find someone to sell me a replacement as I don't want to buy a whole new one. What an idiot, 2 uses, that's only £30 a use - bargain! TO make it worse I dropped it on Friday morning and had a compleet meltdown, luckily Sophia was in another room!

Oh and I think chicken such as thighs or drumsticks will work better in the slow cookera s they will be moister and the meat shoudl just fall away from the bone.

Spidey - did you Ov over the weekend? i hope you managed to pin DH down (so to speak!)

And Kira's waving baby sounds REALLY cute.

As for me well, we have been away for a weekend with friends, which was a good distraction but I am now SO tird, we were up til 1am each night and Sophia woke up at 5.15am each day. Although she did go down ok and stayed in the bed so that was good. We were staying in my friends mum's friends holiday home (for free), and seriously the lounge in this place was the same square footage as my whole house! It was amazing, had its own private mooring on to the river, loads of things to do, a pool table, table tennis, table football etc

So I emailed David on Friday morning and pretty much just said that i knew it wasn;t his fault but that I was scared and very upset and felt that I had spent the majority of this pregnancy stressed and deeply unhappy and just when things had settled down, now this! He was of course lovely and spoke to his boss who was understanding and said he would "understand if David refused to go on the trip before baby is born, but that he would disapointed" etc etc. We have basically said he will go for the 2 weeks as long as teh trip starts on time. If it is delayed then he won't go for as long. I still hate the idea, but I would feel incredibly guilty if he stayed home with me and I didn't pop until 40 weeks. As for after the birth, until he gets a definite date for when he would be away i am unwilling to let him commit. So next week i am going to be phoning friends to see if they fancy taking shifts coming ot stay with me for a few days so at least someone is here to look after Sophia, even if I have to labour on my own, which I am sure won't happen.

So i am feeling better, not becasue the situation is actually any better, but at least I have let all that emotion out and you were all right in that it did feel like a huge wieght lifted when i wrote it down.

So David is away this coming week (and perhaps the next), so I am going back to Kent on Wednesday for a couple of days and have a meet with mummy friends on Tuesday.

I am trying to plan a weekend where we can leave Sophia with my parents before new baby is born. instead of going anywhere new and exciting, my plan is to find a nice hotel near to where we used to live and the one night we can go out for dinner with friends and the next maybe just go to the cinema. And the joy of staying somewhere we know is that a) we won't have to do much driving once we have dropped Sophia off and b) we know the good places to go for lunch etc and won't have to wander round for ages getting our bearings etc. Just need to find a free weekend when David is here, although if I have to i will go on my own and just sleep in a hotel for a whole weekend!

I hope everyone had lovely weekends and thanks for your support. it is always much easier to tell you guys stuff than my *real life* friends so I really appreciate you all x


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## Mary Jo

aww, Shiv, I'm glad you're feeling better for letting David know how you feel about it. and that he's been lovely. really hope your friends will rally round and that you get your time in a hotel! that sounds awesome, a night or two away from Adam would be brilliant (never had one yet, I guess the first that's planned will be when I have the new baby, unless he comes very quickly and I don't have to stay in).

pleased you have had a lovely weekend away, will you have a chance to rest in the next few days? hope you enjoyed your crisps and snacks. :lol: what a pita that you smashed your ceramic dish though. I ruined my new toy the other week as well, we bought a new dustbuster (a mini hand-held vacuum cleaner), it's so much better than any other I have had, Adam was obsessed with it. well, I plugged it in to charge a little bit too close to the gas ring and burnt through the cable. thankfully I was there and smelled this awful smell, I could so easily have been upstairs while something was cooking... so there wasn't a disaster but I now have no cable and it's run out of charge, so it's sitting useless in the cupboard!

Spidey, aww, Kira looks so sweet with her wings on. :D so cute that she made her dolly wave! Adam doesn't really wave, he *has* waved, a few times, and he says bye bye, but when I go out to work and he and C wave at the window he just looks (and C sometimes waves his hand for him).

hope things went well with DH over the weekend. :haha: that's great he can retire so young!

Jean, Transformasnacks are like cheapo Monster Munch, they do them in pickled onion, spicy, BBQ rib and sometimes you can find them in cheese and onion (my fave). :lol: I don't know Chickatees (they're not over here). and yeah, Shiv, it's ridiculous. they've gone up recently, am sure they were 25p for a while because I used to get some on the way home from work, but when I think about it, that would have been well before I had Adam. 30p is a rip off, but they're still the cheapest bag of crisps.

v envious of your fancy schmancy dinner done by your brother! saw the pic on FB, wow. where does he work? 

as for OPKs, they never worked for me. I was terrible at remembering to pee on them, for one. I did get some good ones (not the expensive smily face ones but some other pretty good ones, I always had internet cheapy tests before) when I was home over Christmas, and tried to remember, this was out of curiosity to see if they worked, as we were not TTC over Christmas. but I only did a couple and forgot to do more. then the next month I did remember (set an alarm on my phone) and I was convinced I'd missed the surge, because it was really dark one day and not at all the next, so I thought we were out, but we DTD anyway (just the once the whole month) and bingo. :rofl:

wow Cleck, yay for being so close to your goal! I think most people find their body shape has changed even despite getting back to, or close to, pre preg. I feel like after this baby I will have to do some concerted efforts at toning up and losing fat because I can diet fine and lose *weight*, but honestly, I know that even though I am not overweight usually, I carry more fat on my tummy than I should. and I don't want to be an unfit, flabby mum because it won't make it easier running around after two boys. I am going to diet probably after Christmas I think. eat what I like for a while and then be more disciplined in January. which is what I did with Adam. but it's easy to say these things. I really admire how disciplined you've been, it's amazing, you've made such a major change, is Corey really impressed? he should be. :lol:

as for us... we finally took Adam swimming on Friday, and he had an absolute ball! he just loved every second, he laughed and laughed. we went to a pool where you can walk into the water, it's so shallow, up to your ankles to start with. and lots of water squirter toys and sprays and fountains and stuff. he was running around, falling down with a splash and just loving it. totally fearless, went right under a few times and didn't seem to be bothered. I even thought I might take him myself only I guess I've only a got a few months left. it's a shame we didn't go before now. he was absolutely zonked after, slept really well. though that's gone back down the pan. I think he napped yesterday but nothing at all today and he's been quite hard work. I have a day off tomorrow, going out by myself (C has another day off work so he's having Adam) and I'm going into town to see a friend I haven't seen in ages and her new baby, who isn't quite so new now (13 weeks I think). we're going to John Lewis to check out double pushchairs, since C wasn't keen when we went a couple of weeks ago, just wanted to get out of there as soon as we'd arrived.

thanks for all the support re my friend with cancer. it's hard on her because she really is so alone. she feels that even though she has me and another friend who she's very close to, she worries she is a burden to us. I don't see it that way, she is my best friend who not only has been in my life for over 20 years but has been the most amazing, brilliant support in the last 8 or 9 years, since I stopped drinking. she moved pretty close to me 8 years ago, and in the few years I was single (before meeting C), we spent so much time together. not so much now, and I know that's normal, I have a husband and a child, and I feel bad about not being able to see her as much as I used to, but I want to be there for her as much as I possibly can. 

hoping that *when* we move (if if if pleeeaaase) it won't make too much difference. we won't live so close to her, but we can meet in Croydon, which is halfway. I will miss being able to hop on a couple of buses and being at hers within the hour, though. neither of us drive so it's public transport all the way unless C takes me.

so she has her MRI and her CT scans booked, one is next Fri and the other the following Mon, so fingers crossed it isn't worse than we think. 

as for food, grrr, it's not been brilliant. I've had McD's twice, yesterday after work, and Fri after swimming on the way to Dawn's (friend). and pizza on Fri night. 

so what I've had exactly... today -

sultana bran & cheerios & milk, orange juice (really early, went back to bed after)
breakfast 2 was a croissant and a cappuccino
lunch was a ham and cream cheese and cucumber sandwich
dinner was a big piece of 3-cheese quiche and salad
and there was a bag of square crisps and a load of Doritos. :( no choc yet but there is some in the fridge.

not sure if I'll be properly back on the wagon tomorrow as I'll be out most of the day and probably won't be able to resist another double cheeseburger. 

didn't weigh myself yesterday, completely forgot. given my workmates yesterday were laughing at me saying I look a lot further on than almost 6 months, I am a bit scared to. but I will. I think I am not far off how I looked at 30 weeks last time. I don't mind being big, it's all in a good cause, but I hope I don't end up bigger overall. bigger sooner is ok. I've started having minor heart palpitations again in the morning after breakfast, which didn't start till 32 weeks last time, so that's irritating. and I am definitely tired when climbing the stairs. it's weird when I'm not even in 3rd tri yet. :wacko:


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## jelr

Cleck: Well done on the weight loss especially when DH is home. I always find if DH is off for a week it is so much harder when you are out and about to still be good, so I really think you are great. Fx if you can even stay the same when you are home, that would be amazing. Do give yourself a bit of a break when you are there though as you deserve a treat week, when you have done so well. I think my body shape has changed since having Natasha too. I have jeans that I could fit into when I was 4 or 5lbs heavier than I am now and they will not go near me now, it is like my pelvis or hips have spread :haha:

Spidey: Hope you managed to dtd and DH was compliant with those nips :haha: - Fx this is your month. Aww that is so sweet about Kira waving her dolls hand. Natasha waves herself but has never waved or done anything like that with her toys really only covered them with blankets in her toy pram or fed them. I didn't realise the other thread was still going, it was dormant for so long I didn't even think to pop it :haha: - Just had a nose now and I love the butterfly theme and love love Kira with her wings on, she is adorable. :cloud9: How do you girls not get confused with the two threads, I think I'll stick in here as I know I would be confused between the two :haha:

Shiv: I'm so glad you emailed DH and so glad you feel much better. I definitely always think you need to get these things off your chest and it is great that DH has been so good about it - sometimes just hearing what they think and feel also helps too so you dont feel so alone with the burden if you know what I mean. Fx all your friends can come up and that would also be a great way to spend the last few weeks as they are so so long as we all know so hopefully with different visitors it will go quicker for you too. :thumbup:

grrr on the ceramic bowl breaking and of all days on Friday when you were feeling so cr*p anyway. I would have had a meltdown too. I'm terrified I'm going to forget and stick mine down on the granite when it is hot and it will probably crack :dohh: - Yeah steak is definitely not good in it. I didn't really think it would be as I saw no recipies for it, but was trying to be experimental (I usually stick to every letter in a recipie book) and hoped that because you can do roast beef maybe it would work :dohh: - aww well steak really only takes about 10 mins anyway I just thought it would be nice to be able to come home on the days I'm working to completely cooked dinners without having to do anything :haha: I'm going to do hungarian goulash in it this week so that should be nice. The idea of the hotel sounds lovely, you two have had so much stress this year that it would do you both really good to have some time alone too before new baby arrives and it sounds perfectly stress free where with being so near home :thumbup:

MJ: Yeah I was thinking they sounded more like monster munch and I think we do have space invadors too and have a funny feeling the chickatees are actually Irish. I'm more a snax or skips gall as the monster much and chipsticks get stuck in my teeth :haha: - Grr on your new toy getting broken too. I hate when things like that happen :dohh:

My brother works in the hilton hotel in tower bridge. Aww the meal was amazing, some of the stuff I didn't think I would like but said I would try it and I cleaned my plate for every course. the pic I had up was the bread and butter pudding but he did it with croissants and cream instead and it was mouthwatering - although I noticed afterwards that he actually used over 1/2 of a kg bag of suger thoughout the whole meal :dohh: so that goes my diet out the window this week, although I'm trying to tell myself that it was between 8 of us :haha:

It must be so hard for your friend going through all of that when she doesn't have a partner or family to go through it, although I'm sure you and her other friend will be all that she needs, she is lucky to have you :thumbup:

Glad Adam enjoyed the swimming :thumbup:

Well we didn't do anything different over the weekend really, my brother cooked Friday night and then we spent yesterday up with DH family as we haven't been up for a few weeks, so they hadn't seen Natasha and then DH did a bbq this evening, so just a quiet weekend really as we are leaving for the wedding on Thursday. I'm really looking forward to it now and the few days away. We are staying in the hotel on the Thursday night and Friday night as the wedding is Friday and One of my best friends (the girl who is pregnant) actually moved last year to the same town that my cousin is getting married in and I dont get to see her as often now as she is only down home every couple of weeks and she actually hasn't been down since May now with being so heavily pregnant she is wrecked after working all week, so we are going to stay with her and her husband on the Saturday night. I'm not looking forward to the car journey though as it is about 3-4 hours long, but I have gotten a few new toys like a colour doodle and some new crayons and some stickers for Natasha to play with and I'm hoping she will sleep some of the way too.

I do apologise in advance girls as I'm about to brag but I was so proud Natasha actually spelled her name out yesterday. She had no idea what she was doing and it actually is not as big as it sounds once I explain how it came about. she loves to scribble with pens, or crayons and I'm completely useless at art or drawing so when she wants me to draw I usually just write Mammy or Daddy or Natasha but I do tend to spell it out when I'm doing it and lately she has been say NAT or SHA when she is drawing but yesterday in the back of the car she was drawing and out of her mouth came NATASHA - and then she said Mammy at the end as I would usually say what I have spelled after spelling it so that is why I know she had no idea what she was doing and has basically just learned it by heart by hearing me say it so much the same as counting, but all the same I was so proud, :cloud9: she hasn't done it since and is back to just NAT or SHA :dohh:

Anybody elses babies obsessed with boobies, Natasha was never breast fed so it hasn't come from that but lately all she keeps saying is mammy's boobies or nana's boobies and embarrassed the life out of my poor mam last week by saying pointing and saying to somebody my mam was talking to in the shop :haha: - I'm convinced she is going to should boobies walking up the isle when she is doing flower girl for the wedding on Friday :haha:


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## Mary Jo

I wouldn't say Adam is obsessed with boobs (yet :rofl: ) - a few weeks ago I was getting dressed and changing his nappy in the middle of getting dressed, and he was curious and a bit grabby. so I said "boobs"! and he did say it back, but hasn't since. :lol: though "boo" is one of his words that he uses most often (he hides and jumps out and shouts "boo!" ) so I won't be surprised or shocked if he shouts it while we're out. unless it is very clear it has the final b, of course. :lol:

wow, the Hilton at Tower Bridge - I walk past it on the way to and from work, as our offices are just the other side of St Katherine's docks, and I get the bus from London Bridge to Tower Bridge and walk. heh, that's actually quite funny, I might have bumped into him!

my work was on the TV last night (and the last few days but especially last night). I work for the big media company that just closed its best selling Sunday tabloid (I work on the other Sunday paper, the broadsheet one - sorry Cleck and Spidey, don't want to post the names, though you can easily work out what I mean, it's the biggest story in the UK right now!). when I got to work at 1pm and left at 9pm, there were all the tv cameras etc just outside. very weird atmosphere at work yesterday. we are all just so sorry for the innocent journalists and production people who have lost their jobs because of something that happened years ago by people who don't work there now. it doesn't make it easier to know that cuts (ie more cuts, there have already been loads over the past couple of years) were coming, this is just so massive and awful. I know what it's like to work on a publication that just closes one day, it happened to me 10 years ago, and it's horrible and weird to just stop what you're doing and walk away forever. very different to losing a job but the place carries on.


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## jelr

Hey MJ - Yeah that story is all over the news here too, but I have only caught bits and pieces of it as I refuse to watch the news since the recession started here because it depresses the life out of me and makes me worry about stuff that I can't change anyway so I only know the parts of the story that people around me are taking about. Sad that people are losing their jobs through no fault of their own :nope:

That is mad alright that you walk past there all the time, you could very well have passed him and maybe even me and DH when we visited him when I was pregnant on Natasha :haha: - I didn't realise you were so near or I could have arranged to meet you. I was going to say the next time we go over we will have to meet up, but then we are broke this year and hopefully next year I will be pregnant so God knows when it will be and you will have moved too. Is it far from where you are moving to as in do you hope to go back to work when new baby is born?

yeah no Natasha actually says boobies :haha: so I'm in big trouble if she says it in the church on Friday :haha: - Lol I'm sure Adam will have so many years of being obsessed that he needs a break now :rofl:


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## spidey

Shiv, that is so sad about breaking your slow cooker. I would have been in tears too. I'm glad you're feeling better about DH's traveling for work and DH can cut the trip short if he needs to. The house you stayed at this weekend sounds really nice!

MJ- I've never had a night away from Kira either and may not until I have another baby- but more than likely I'll have the baby during the day and be home by night :haha: Awww.. it sounds like Adam had such a fun time swimming! If you move (fingers crossed) will you have a place for Adam to have a pool and sprinkler? If I remember right you don't have an outdoor place for Adam right now. 

jelr-I'm only using the other msg board to go on and on about Kira's birthday, so you're not missing much :haha: 'Natasha' is a hard name to say so super big congrats to Natasha!!! :happydance: Kira can't make the "K" sound yet, so when I say "say Kira" she says "DA", LOL! DA is her substitute for any word or sound she can't say. 

Boobies- Kira is obsessed with them :haha: She laughs at DH's boobies and tries poking at his nipples. She's laughed at my mom's boobies when they were changing into bathing suits once :haha: And she gets a huge smile on her face when she sees both of mine at once. "Boo" is Kira's word for boobies, boo boos, balloon, belly button, and beauty mark (what I call a mole :haha: as I have TONS of them).

I still haven't gotten a true positive opk, but tonight I got an almost positive one again. My nips are hurting more, so I think I'm going to ovulate tomorrow based on everything. So we shall see...

Kira has been playing imaginative games with us recently. She has an alter ego called "bad bunny" and before she does anything naughty, she hops like a bunny and then does it :haha: We always ask "did bad bunny throw the toys on the floor?" and she'll nod yes, and then we'll ask "where did bad bunny go?" and she'll say "hmmmm hmmmm hmmm" and then point in some random direction. Well today, DH made a pretend bunny trap out of a rug and some toys and then we hid to wait for bad bunny to get caught in the trap. Kira understood it all, and she hopped like a bunny and pretended to fall into the trap :haha: It was so cute. If we find something broken or a huge mess, we'll ask "who did this?" and Kira will say "Ba Bu" :haha: So basically we're teaching her to lie from a very young age!


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## cleckner04

Emma is a major booby fan too. She was fascinated when she realized DH has nipples too. She slowly takes her finger and pokes his nipple if he's sitting there watching TV. She tries to be sly about it. :rofl: And she is obsessed with the dogs nipples because they both have like 8 nipples. And of course my boobs are her favorite. They are called boo-boos here too. 


Spidey- I think we will ovulate at the same time this month. I have been getting high readings for a few days but no peak yet so I think tomorrow or the next day I'll peak. I am on CD16 I think today so I'm not happy about it because the month I got a 12 day luteal phase I peaked at CD14 I think. :dohh: Oh well.. 

Shiv- I'm glad you are feeling a bit better about it all. :hugs: 

MJ- Adam sounds so cute with swimming!! It's always so nice how great they sleep after swimming too. :haha: 

jelr- Your meal did look really good. It's probably best if I don't marry your brother. :rofl::rofl:


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah. Forgot to say I spoke to my mom on the phone earlier today and she said 'So are you pregnant yet?' :roll: Is she serious? DH hasn't even been home an entire month yet. :growlmad: She knows we are trying but now I feel like she's pressuring me. I told her I haven't even ovulated since he's been back so it's kinda hard to get pregnant without ovulating. :gun:


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## Shiv

Sophia is also obsessed with boobies. The other day she was playing in our bedroom whilst I took a shower and when I came out she had the knob/cap bits that fit on each end (no idea if you know what I mean, like these two white things in the picture)

https://www.designer-bathstore.co.uk/assets/images/Category-Images/Radiator-Accessories/Radiator-Valves.jpg

Anyway I sit on the bed and she comes up and tries to put one on each nipple :haha: i laughed but said moved them away and then she put one in my belly button amd shouted "honk honk".............very funny, she does make me giggle.

Gotta go as Sophia is telling me to "close the 'cuter up". I will reply to everyone in a bit butjust had to get the booby story out!


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## spidey

:rofl: Emma and Sophia are adorable! Its funny how they all like boobies :lol:

Cleck, it's so cool we will both ovulate together :haha: Now if only we can both get pregnant together! I get the same pressure from my MIL who doesn't even know we've been TTC. If I mention anything about having an upset stomach, craving a certain food, being tired, etc etc, she says "ooooo, is there something I should know about?" :dohh: I'm SO glad she doesn't know we've been TTC for a year now otherwise she would be driving me crazy each month!


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## jelr

ha ha Shiv: that made me giggle at Sophia saying honk honk to the radiator cap (have no idea if that is the name, but that is what we call them :haha:) in your belly button :haha: - Natasha loves those caps too and takes them off all our rads in the house, but she hides them everywhere :haha: - they really do things to make us giggle now don't they. Natasha caught her sippy cup handle on her top yesterday and scraped her chest and said "ouch me booby" and I laughted my heart out :haha: 

Actually do anybody elses babies say me instead of my - Natasha says "me boobies" or "me dink (drink)" and so on and I tried one day to tell her it was "my toys" and she got upset with me and said "no tasha toys" as she thought I was saying they were mine :haha:

Cleck: I told you, he is fantastic chef, but there is no way you could diet if he was your husband, I reckon if he still lived at home I would be as big as a bus :haha: - Oh no at your mom asking if you are pregnant yet, I hate when people say things like that, although I'm sure she didn't mean to put pressure on you. I can remember when we got married first all of a sudden everyone was saying so are you pregnant yet or isn't it about time you two had some children and it used to drive me nuts, they had no idea that we were trying and were having trouble and I found it really hard after the first MC. DH was going to start saying, do you think we never had sex before we got married or something, but I managed to stop him, although I felt like it myself sometimes. FX you are only having a long cycle and your luteal phase is not too short.

Spidey: Even though Natasha spelled out the letters that day, she still cant pronounce her name properly and still says Tasha. Natasha also can't pronounce her K's and says "tiss" for kiss and "but" for book :haha: - I love Kiras new game, she has a great little imagination and is so creative. I hope those nips are right and you OV soon. I love your butterfly theme for her birthday. We have been thinking about Natasha birthday this year and we had planned on going to the soft play are for convenience but when we worked out the prices, it will work out far more expensive than having it at home, at first I thought it would be cheaper as we spent an absolute fortune last year, but for the amount of children it would cost &#8364;250 plus we would still have to get the cake and present so we are going to have it at home but I will have to be really disiplined as last year I spent more than &#8364;250 on food and a fortune on decorations, and half of the food wasn't wasted. so even though we will still have loads here as we both have big families and Natasha has been so many birthdays this year, I will only do a small amount of food and keep the decorations to a minimum and not themed as I could only get the decorations that were themed last year online and it was very expensive, so It will be just plain 2 decorations which I feel is very boring :dohh: but it will have to do with money so tight and it will get tighter over the summer when I have no work as I dont get paid. I can't wait to see pictures of it Kiras party when you have it together. I love themes for parties and would love to have done a minnie mouse one this year as Natasha loves Minnie so much (I think I will still treat her to a minnie cake though)

I may run as I think Natasha is waking up.


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## Shiv

MJ - sorry about your new toy - I feel your pain! Can you get a replacement lead?

I hope you had a nice day to yourself. did you have that double cheeseburger? 

I had no idea you worked for NI. I feel sorry for the innocent victims but what the paper had been accused of is pretty shocking, it is just a shame that the guilty ones have ruined it for everyone.

Cleck - my body shape has definitely changed, even when I was pre-pregnancy weight i was buying clothes a size bigger, they fitted over my hips, but were big on the waist so kept showing off my bum crack - nice!

jelr - I hope you have a blast at the wedding. We play a CD for Sophia in the car with nursery rhymes on, she loves it and will say "put songs on the radiator" - we keep telling her it's a radio! So you could try that for your journey. We also haev plenty of snacks on hand!

Natasha is such a bright spark spelling out her name, it is so lovely hearing about everyone's proud mummy moments.

I hope that the bride doesn't wear a cleavage enhancing dress other wise Natasha is for sure gonna shout boobies as she walks down the aisle!

As for the me/my thing. Sophia hasn't grasped the whole me/you concept yet. She uses the word you for me, and vice versa, i suppose because she is copying us. So she will say "shall I start reading then" - but what she means is - "will you start reading", but she has copied what we say. If that makes sense?

Spidey - that sounds like such a cool game with Kira. Bad rabbit! She might not say much but that takes a serious amount of comprehension to understand that game. I can see that Bad Rabbit will be getting into trouble for years to come!

Cleck and Spidey - that is cool that you will ovulate at the same time, an exciting 2 week wait for us spectators! Fingers crossed. I was reading a thread in the pregnancy club section about women who had got preggers with a 10 day LP, so it is definitely possible!


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## jelr

Sorry Spidey I missed your other post today when I was writing :haha; - that is cool that you too will ovulate at the same time, maybe it is just destiny and you are both meant to get pregnant at the same time - that would be so lovely :thumbup:

Yep I'm hoping nobody is going to show off their cleavage Shiv :haha: or I could be in trouble, although it does seem to be more mine that she is obsessed with more than anybody else - DH keeps saying he has taught her well :haha: - DH also said it is a good job that I'm not wearing a top that is low cut as I'm doing a reading and he reckons it would be priceless if she was to start shouting mammy's boobies :rofl: - It does sound priceless, but it certainly would not be at the time. I would probably either turn bright red with embarrassment at the top of the church or start to laugh :rofl: - but I'm all covered up so hopefully it will be all good :haha:

that makes total sense what you are saying about Sophia saying - I did think it was a bad habit that she had picked up because where DH is from the tend to say me tea or me coffee as slang, but then I read somewhere that babies tend to talk about themselves in the 3rd person which she does and says Tasha's toys etc or that they can say me instead of my so I'm hoping that it is just a phase and DH is very aware now and is using my all the time instead of me.

That is a great idea about the nursery rhymes as she is singing loads of them now and loves playing her glow worm at night and I have to sing along to it before she sleeps and I actually have a cd with nursery rhymes on it in the car that I bought when she was born (more for me to learn them all again :haha:) and I actually haven't played it for her since she has started singing some of them herself.

I see on the fb thread that you are considering a home birth, I think that might actually be a great idea for you at the moment. Didn't Tsia have a home birth water birth so that might curtail any mess to just the pool. How is the ringing around for company those weeks going? At least that way whomever is staying with you could watch Sophia when it is all going on and if she is asleep could keep you company too (Well depending if you are comfortable with that and who they are I guess)


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## Shiv

i haven't phoned anyone yet to ask if they will come visit me, mainly because I am scared they will say no! not because they don't want to but because of work commitments etc.

Home birth seems like the logical answer, but it scares me a lot. I have also started looking into Doulas (as suggested by Spidey) and that makes a home birth appeal more (although i would have NHS midwives in attendance as well).


oh I dunno, david won't like the idea, the midwife in Kent suggested a home birth and he was dead set against it, but as i said in the fb thread he could end up not having too much say in the matter, as at the end of the day i need a plan that i am comfortable with.

I just don't know, I think it is the cream carpets in my rented house that are putting me off :haha:


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## jelr

ha ha I just posted and went back to fb and saw you had said about a waterbirth - I knew there was something in my head about you wanting another water birth or having one already.

I definitely think this is an option for you, I know what everyone was saying about being scared if something went wrong, but If it was that frequent they wouldn't do home births at all and at least your mw would be there with you the whole time and if anything was wrong, you would be straight to hospital in an ambulance rather than driving yourself as you said. 

I also think if it was me I would feel more in control of the situation with having this all planned so I would know what to expect and exactly that this is what my plan was going to be, rather than planning a hospital birth and worrying the whole time that maybe it would happen when DH is away. So I definitely think the best thing to do is research it as much as you can and even have a look on here and see if you can speak to others who have done it already and once you have all the info, at least then you can see how you feel about it all.


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## jelr

Aww double posts all over the place - popped back in here after fb - posted and now see you have too :haha:

yeah I can see where you are coming from with DH not having a say when he may not be there, I do think get all the info - then see how you feel - then speak to him too and explain to him that you need a plan and I reckon if it is what you decide to do he will go along with it if he thinks of it logically, as in does he have a different plan if you do go into labour without him.

Is there any options to plan both as in if David is home have a hospital birth and if he is not have a home birth??

I wouldn't worry about the cream carpets either as I'm sure there has to be a way to keep the mess in check or nobody would do it, they probably have some plastic sheeting or something or if not get some yourself so at least you are not in labour and worry about the carpets (which I know I would) as you will have enough to do and worry about then.

The Doula is definitely a good idea though if everyone does have work commitments, which is a very good point they might have, but then maybe ask anyway if you would be more comfortable with somebody close to you and if they can't then you know you have the doula option.


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## spidey

I think I'm ovulating right now! I had some blood when I wiped so I suppose that could be from ovulation- I never had that before. And now I'm having some cramps. I am super excited this month because I get to follow Cleckners 2ww! :happydance: There's no hope for me especially since Kira increased her booby time this month.

Personally I think having a birth with a midwife either at home or at a birth center is safer than having one with a doctor in a hospital. I know tons of people would disagree with me so I don't dare say so on FB :haha:


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## jelr

You would never know Spidey, didn't you get pregnant on Kira on a long cycle, your not out until the :witch: arrives :)

Yeah I definitely think the midwives know more than the doctors most of the time.

MJ: I hope you enjoyed your day off yesterday.

Shiv: Dont you have your meet with the mummies today, hope it is going well and that your research into doulas and home births is going well too.

Cleck: Hope your getting plenty of :sex: now that you are due to OV.

Well girls I will probably be MIA until next Monday as I'm calling to my friends this evening and tomorrow I have to do my nails and get my tan done and get all de-haired :haha: and I also need to pack - not looking forward to packing everything but the kitchen sink for Natasha especially since it is a hotel and not a friends house that we could improvise with stuff if I have forgotten it - aww well fx I wont forget anything important and then we are off early Thursday morning.

I will have my phone with me so will probably have a read every now and again if I have a minute, but I know I wont have time to reply as there will be so many family around and I reckon it will be a busy few days and I'm cr*p at posting on my phone anyway as I'm all fingers and thumbs and it really annoys me when I'm used to touch typing (hense my fifty million typos as I never proof read :haha:)

Keep your fingers crossed that we dont have a cranky girl for the next week as she is constipated again today and yesterday and didn't sleep the last two nights so those teeth must be at her again (although I can't feel anything there - so I dont know what is going on really :shrug:)


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## Shiv

Have an amazing time Jean :flower:


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## overcomer79

Hi all! Maybe now that I got my glasses (after having eye surgery in april) I can keep up with this thread more!!

Good luck to all of us ttc!! Maybe we all be due in april together LOL


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## spidey

jelr, have a great time at the wedding! I bet Natasha will enjoy the extra attention and she'll forget any teeth troubles that she's having. I've always found that teeth pain comes in waves with Kira, so about 3 bad days and then it eases up for a few days before it returns.

I've had more spotting this morning so I'm assuming thats still from ovulation. Before Kira I had a 50-ish day cycle and then I must have had a short one after that in order for my strange methods of birth control to fail :haha: So she was actually conceived on a short cycle. Now my cycles are about 30-33 days long which are short for me. I've had a few long ones thrown in there (post Kira) and with those longer cycles my LP has been longer (but still not ideal). With this current cycle I didn't OV until CD 26. I'd love to have an April baby but I can't get my hopes up.

Good luck this month overcomer!


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## cleckner04

Spidey- that's odd that you are getting bleeding. You sure its not implantion bleeding or whatever they call it? Are you crampy too?


I ovulated yesterday. We definitely got busy so we'll see if it works. :shrug: If I get pregnant this month he wont be there for the birth, though I told him I don't even care at this point I just want another baby. :rofl: I go back and forth with this whole baby thing. I've been doing so well with weightloss so I keep thinking that if I don't end up pregnant I can lose another 30 lbs while Dh deploys in november. :haha:


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## Shiv

Cleck - if you lose another 30lbs there won't be anything of you left!


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## cleckner04

:haha: It would put me just a few lbs under the maximum for healthy bmi though. I need to be 164 lbs to be a healthy bmi. Which is still 24 lbs away. Although it's more like 25 or 26 because I gained weight from ovulating again this month. :dohh:


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## spidey

The bleeding is weird for me since I've never had it this time of the month before and there is no cramping involved. Post Kira, I've been getting mid-cycle bleeding 7 days before ovulation and I did have that sort of bleeding with this cycle. I'm almost certain that this new bleeding is not from implantation since my nips just started to hurt Saturday and my opks gave me an almost positive Saturday, Sunday, and Tuesday (Monday I was out of tests). I know an almost positive isn't a positive though. I do find it strange that the second line has been so strong because its normally all or none for me, and normally I have 2 strong positive opk days so its not hard to miss my surge. :shrug: But based on nips, I'm going with Monday as my ovulation day :thumbup: This is just a wonky month because my nips barely hurt too. I just feel very un-hormonal and non fertile. Hope that ramble made sense :haha:


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## cleckner04

Hmm interesting. OPKs pick up pregnancy hormones too. :winkwink: So your nips are saying monday. I ovulated monday too so we are together on this month. :thumbup: I used my diva cup after :sex: :haha: To keep the spermies in there as long as possible. Is that weird? LOL!


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## spidey

I took another opk and my LH levels are back down, so no sneaky pregnancy for me :haha:

LOL Cleckner, thats another great use for a Diva cup :rofl: I've never put my hips up high or anything like that after :sex: to keep them in but maybe I should since it seems that everything falls right out due to my stretched out vagina :blush::haha: Hey, maybe thats why I haven't gotten pregnant yet :lol:

Does anyone have fun weekend plans- I know Jelr does :thumbup: Cleckner, when are you leaving to go back home?


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## spidey

2ww update from Spidey: my spotting let up on Thursday but today its back but even heavier. I'm hoping its implantation bleeding (I ovulated on Monday) but more than likely my uterus is being cranky this month and not staying intact very well. TMI, but the blood is mixed in with a bunch of clear mucous too. I also bought 20 cheapo pregnancy tests so I don't have to be so hesitant about wasting my precious few :haha:


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## Shiv

I don't like to tempt fate, but when I go tmy BFp this time I got lots of clear mucous (usually only get EWCM leading up to ovulation) and a little bit of spotting - so you never know Spidey - fingers crosses.

Oh and when I was ttc Sophia, I got my BFP the month I started to put a pillow under my hips after dtd to keep the spermies up there so it is definitely worth a try!


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## cleckner04

Yeah I got pregnant really quickly with Emma and the first pregnancy and I always propped a pillow under my butt. This time I haven't so far but I used the diva cup and laid there for a while so same concept really. :haha::blush: 

Nothing from me except I have 3 giant pimples that showed up overnight on my chin. :roll: But I think that is more related to the stress of packing to fly home and cleaning. I scrubbed my entire downstairs yesterday. Today I have to finish the upstairs and we are gonna rent a rug doctor in a bit to do the floors. :dance: I'm excited. LOL! I love coming back to a really clean house after being gone for a while.


Edit to add: I lost 1 lb this week too!! :dance: Which is pretty amazing considering I've had a bowl of ice cream twice this week. And I haven't been following myfitnesspal. But I'm not gonna complain. :lol: I'm down to 187.4 now. This last 10 lbs has been going SO slow. :dohh: I'm going to be really good when we go back home so hopefully I'll come back at least weighing the same but hopefully with a loss. :thumbup:


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## Shiv

Welldone with the weightloss Cleck, fingers crossed for maintaining at least while you are back home. When do you leave and how long are you away for?


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## cleckner04

I leave tomorrow morning super early and return on the 31st around 6 pm. :thumbup: So we'll be home 2 entire weeks!! :dance: I finally lined up someone to keep an eye on our dogs so that is the main thing I worry about because they'll be by themselves in the backyard the entire time. DH covered our patio so they have tons of shade and we have a hard plastic baby pool that we will fill with water for them to drink and if they need to cool off. The neighbor across the street said she would feed and water them every day. But DH has a friend that I want to go check in the middle of the week to make sure the neighbor is doing the job. I just worry so much about them. I'm sure they will be super angry with us when we return. I didn't want to put them in a kennel to board them or anything while we were gone though. They aren't used to confined spaces like that.


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## Pippin

Popping in to say :hi: and good luck to you all trying, haven't been in here for ages seems like time has flown. Sam :yipee: for being in the tww! Big fingers crossed for you. Spidey hope it is implantation hun :hugs: xxx


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## cleckner04

Sitting in the airport right now!! Corey just took off with Emma to fill up a water bottle since we couldn't take water through security. :roll: It all has went so smoothly so far except Emma cried when they took our checked luggage and it went down the belt and disappeared. She was SO upset. :haha: I promised her that we will see it again later today. :rofl:


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## Shiv

Glad to hear it is going well Cleck, fingers crossed the rest of the journey goes as well and most important of all that your luggage gets there too!


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## Shiv

Think you might be home by now Cleck - exciting, I hope Emma enjoyed her first plane ride!

So Spidey and Cleck - how is your 2ww going? Any more spotting Spidey?

Jean - I hope you are having an amazing time at the wedding and that there were no "booby" incidents with Natasha!

MJ - you've been quiet? Hope you're ok.

Well I officially got massive this week. i have new stretchmarks :cry: boo hoo! I only got a few on my hips last time and this time they are above and below my belley button, which surey goes to show that I am carrying differently this time?

I was at my parents for a few nights this week, which was a bit of a disaster sleep wise. I had to share a room with Sophia, she was good in that she stayed inher single bed, but she would wake in the night and realise i was next to her and start singing to me, which was cute for the first rendition of wheels on teh bus, but after 3 hours I was begging for some more sleep! So I feel very sleep deprived, which puts me off going to my parents house really (although we wouldn't usually share a room, (they had guests)). I appreciate the help I get whilst I am there with Sophia, but I think I value her having a good sleep more. She is being SO whiny! I am putting it down to being tired and top canines coming in. But seriously all she says is nooo-oooooooo to everything. It is trying my patience especially as i am tired, we are not a happy hosuehold!

David came home for the weekend, but had been told he may be away for the next 3 weeks. They barely got any work done this week as the weather was too windy to do what they needed, so they sat in a barn doing nothing! 

If you can't alreday tell haha:) I am feeling a bit down. I need to get on and book this weekend in a hotel so that i have something to look forward to. At the moment it just seems like weeks and weeks of David being away with a whingy baby and a mahoosive belly. again boo hoo me. Don't humour girls, tell me to stop being such a grump, be thankful for what i have and snap out of it!

Have done a bit of thinking about home birth, I am still kinda up for it and David is even coming round to the idea. But I have come across a problem. They will only let me have a home birth from 37 weeks. Which leaves a week when David is away where i would have to go to hospital, which kind of negates the whole "have a plan - won't panic" plan! on the plus side, I asked my best friend if she would be available to come down and babysit me for a few days while David is away and she said she would come down (she live a long way away) when she could around work. She only works Tuesday and Thursday so she could come down for long weekends.

There is absolutley nothing on tv tonight (there never is anymore!) so David has gone to get a film, and hopefully a small pot of icecream for me!

Anyway I hope everyone is having better weekend than me (boo hoo me :haha:) x


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## Mary Jo

oooh, fingers crossed Spidey and Cleck! wouldn't it be great if you both got pregnant at the same time?!

re hips in the air - I might have done this with Adam (memory is hazy!), definitely didn't with this one, but I do remember falling asleep without going to the loo after (which I usually do, at least 10-15 mins later). and about feeling hormonal and pregnant vs non-pregnant - I never did and was always gobsmacked to find out I was actually up the duff. :lol: though I did have some nipple tingles in the 2ww this time, and I noted it, but didn't presume anything. I was such a negative nelly that I didn't symptom spot, and it was only a spur of the moment decision to poas at all (when my temp was still up, but AF wasn't due for another couple of days so really I don't know what made me!)

hope you've had a fab time away at the wedding, Jean! looking forward to pics. hope Natasha didn't see any boobies in church. :rofl:

Shiv, are you making plans for a homebirth now? I think it might be a great solution for you, if you need it. Who'd look after Sophia (if the action didn't happen while she was asleep in bed?!)

I had a lovely day out with my friend on Mon, v tired by the end of the day as I was out from 9.45am till nearly 7pm. didn't get my McDonald's though, was running a little late to sneak a visit in before meeting her, so we had crepes at the restaurant at John Lewis instead. nice and civilised. :lol: we had a good look at the Phil & Teds tandem pushchairs and am pretty much set on getting the Explorer. I wasn't that impressed by the Baby Jogger City Select, seemed massive, and way too expensive for me.

some progress this week on the flat selling/house buying - beginning of the week was bad because we were waiting on some information from my freeholder (he of the "c" word) and he was impossible to get hode of. I resorted to a voicemail where I cried and said I was 26 weeks pregnant and desperate that our sale not fall through again... also left other tearful messages with other people who would try to get hold of him and bingo it worked. then we had to wait on our buyer to decide whether she still wanted to go ahead with the purchase given our freeholder declared some major works to be done to the building in the next 2 years. problem was, there was no quote for the work, so we have had to make an offer of a price reduction, and it might be accurate in the end or it might not. we offered £2k off to start, thinking that was very very low but a starting point (I had been told approx £10k overall, of which my share would have been 25%, but that wouldn't have included VAT at 20%. but my neighbour was told it was going to be £10k-£15k). so we offered up to £4k off and thankfully she accepted that. so a few documents have to be amended but fingers crossed it's all ok now and we hope to exchange next week, hopefully Tue or Wed. and complete (and move!) a week later. by the end of July anyway. :D so we're excited but still nervous in case it falls through at the last minute.

it's a really pain in the ass that this major works notice came up but nothing we could do about it. I wish we'd known it was definitely on the way when we set the asking price and we'd have given ourselves more room to cut the price at the point. as it is the woman is getting the bargain of the year. oh well. we'll just have to buy our new furniture from Gumtree rather than Ikea!

how's the weight and eating going, Shiv? I have been eating badly. but I remember to weigh myself today and I was 11st 3lb, which is I think up 2lb on 2 weeks ago, so not too awful. and today I haven't eaten terribly as I managed to lose my purse (wallet) on the way to work today so have had no money and no means of getting any, however I did have about £3 on my work pass (which we use to pay for stuff from the canteen and vending machines) so have been eating frugally (but still pretty well, I should really try to not spend so much when it isn't necessary - my £3 has got me: a jacket potato and baked beans, a bag of Walker's crisps, a Yorkie, some soup and a slice of home-made bread and a can of diet coke. Chris is having to collect me from work as my Oyster card and travel card were in the purse. (I think I dropped it on the bus, I've submitted a lost property form online at the London Transport website, hope someone handed it in, maybe the driver of the bus, as I got off at the second to last stop on the route. I definitely had it when I got on the bus and it was gone 5 mins later when I tried to buy something in Waitrose. no way it could have been pickpocketed as I was carrying my stuff in a deep shopping bag. I think I must have missed when I thought I put it in the bag after getting on the bus. maybe it ended up on the floor.)

been thinking about birth centres. not sure whether to request to go to one this time. I would love not to have an epidural again (even though I didn't have a bad experience with Adam) but I think Chris will be not supportive of that. :( he appreciated that I wasn't a screamer last time. whether or not we move, the hospital I'll be at has a birthing centre next to the delivery ward, and I was an uncomplicated problem free pregnancy, labour and delivery last time, so I hope I'd be acccepted.


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## Mary Jo

shiv, you were posting as I was!

sorry Sophia has been noisy but oh so sweet to sing to you! ack. I know how it feels to be sleep deprived, sadly! Adam has napped better in general this week but yesterday he napped far too long and consquently would NOT go to sleep last night. we were all up till well after 1am. :cry:

no new stretchmarks here but I think it's a matter of time as I haven't been using the Bio-Oil... I measured my fundal height this morning and it was 29cm. eeek. I've had a few people this week think I am further along than 6 months. one was a lady on the curry counter in Sainsbury's who was trying to sell us the chicken jalfrezei. Chris refused in case it make me pop, but the woman said 'but that wouldn't be a bad thing!' I was like NO, I'm only 26 weeks!!!


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## spidey

Cleckner, I'm glad the flight went well :thumbup: If you can maintain your weight while Corey is here that'll be a huge accomplishment, and its wonderful you're still losing :happydance: I hope you packed some pregnancy tests with you :haha:

Shiv- that is SOOO cute that Sophia sang to you during the night! I wouldn't worry about popping before 37 weeks, but you could have a doula lined up as your back up plan just incase and she could be with you at the hospital or at home if DH isn't home. Most likely you won't have the baby until 39 or 40 weeks and maybe you should start talking to your bump and tell him/her to stay put. I might be totally psycho, but I spent tons of time envisioning my birth and most of what really happened is what I envisioned. Have some chocolate and ask David for a back and foot massage and you'll feel tons better. :thumbup: Plus if you get a good sleep tonight you'll have more positive thoughts in the morning :hugs:

MJ- Yipeeee on the possibility of you finally moving :happydance: Fingers crossed it actually goes through this time. It sucks you had to lose even more money on the deal but atleast you'll be out of that situation and away from those difficult people. Thats funny your crying pregnant lady plea worked. You might have to use that more often :haha: If you want to have the baby at a birthing center then Chris will have to deal with any screaming :haha: More than likely you won't be screaming and it'll be just fine.

Hi Pippin :wave:

No more spotting since Friday. My right nip was bitten by accident during the night so it's very sore so I can't make predictions off them right now. I'm still having some clear mucous when I wipe. I also had a dizzy spell on Friday. When should I take my first pregnancy test in I ovulated Monday?


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## Pippin

Wednesday Spidey :winkwink: exciting. xxx


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## Shiv

MJ - glad the house moveis progressing well, fingers crossed in a few days time you will have exchanged and can relax a bit and thinkabout your new home! 2lbs in 2 weeks is ideal weight gain, I think I put on 3lbs last week :wacko:

Spidey - i personally would wait until Friday to test :thumbup: fingers crossed though, you are definitely having symptoms that you don't normally have! Hope your nip stops hurting soon, that must be a shock waking up to your nipple being bitten - ouch!

Pippin - eek not long to go for you now :happydance:

As for me, well Sophia slept in today and I had a good night as well. Imust have been tired as I didn't even wake up for a wee! I woke up at 7am needing one, but didn't dare get up in case I woke Sophia! I manged to go back to sleep and Sophia slept until 9am :happydance: As always a good nights sleep makes you feel much better!


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## Shiv

Oh and MJ - have you found a boys name that you and C can both agree on? Are you still considering Elliot?

I am waivering on our Girls name - but have been through all the name websites and can;t find one I like better so I guess we will stick with it. I think it is hard with your second, as with Sophia we LOVED the name instantly and knew we would use it (if it was a girl) and with the second if you have the smae sex Iguess you ar eunlikely to feel like that, otherwise you would have wanted it first time round!

Sophia is much happier today and we've not had any whining yet so that is much better already!


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## Mary Jo

hooray for a good night's sleep :D let's hope it continues haha: - we all know what toddlers are like so don't count on it)

I know what you mean about the name thing. REALLY wishing we hadn't used both our top boy names last time. but oh well we did. mind, finding a girl name wouldn't have been easy either as we never agreed on one. in fact we didn't seriously discuss it, waited till we knew. I had names I liked but wasn't set on.

so yes, we do have a boy name and I guess that's the one. I don't love it like I love Adam Elliott, but I am holding on to the idea that I will love it once it belongs to a baby I love. so unless some chavvy reality tv star comes along in the next few months with the same name and puts me right off, he will be Joel David. we are keeping it (almost) completely quiet though. my parents know this is probably the one but we're not telling C's family or any of the rest of mine. and not posting it anywhere else online. I don't love David, but it's my dad's name (so I feel I *should* :lol: ); it's Chris who is insisting on it. 

I just couldn't call him Elliott. it felt wrong. kind of wish I didn't feel like that but I do so that's that.


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## Shiv

I REALLY like the name joel. One of my new mummy friends has a 2 year old called Joel (he is just the cutest little boy) and when i heard his name I though "ooooh I like that". But we didn't want a JJ (Joel James) so was out of the question, i like it a lot though and you are right you will loveit once it is attached to your little boy!

Other than you girls we haevn't and won't tell anyone our names as a) I don't want their opinions (your opinions are fine but just not close family) and b) it will be a suprise for then (nice or not :haha:)


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## Mary Jo

that's exactly the reasons we're not sharing the name other than here. I had my fingers burnt last time. mind, we hadn't decided Adam or Elliott. but I wish we'd made our own minds up. no idea how they'll like it. the reason I told my mum is because I knew she doesn't like "Joseph", and I was concerned it meant she didn't like any "Jo" type name. but it seems it is just Joseph and Joel is fine. or else she put on a very convincing show of seeming to like it. :lol:

the good thing about Joel is that I don't know anyone called it. whereas with Adam I did (some long-dead family members, but also one of my oldest friend's brothers is an Adam). and same with Jamie, we *did* really like it but too many people too close in the family called it. and Luke just was a no-go for Chris. :cry: I still don't really understand why but I've let it go.


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## spidey

Shiv, are you going to share your choice in boys and girls names with us? MJ- I really like the name Joel :thumbup: It's not a common name here, although my BIL is named Joel. The funny thing is my brother is Adam :lol: Both are great names :thumbup: I'm glad I have more time to think of baby names because right now there are no names that I'm in love with. We were so certain Kira would be a boy that we didn't pick a girls name until the very end, and to be honest I wasn't in love with the name. DH loved it and once she was born the name Kira was perfect. A boy would have been Dexter (after the tv serial killer :blush:) and I wasn't in love with that name either. I do like the nickname "Dex" but Dexter has some nerdy undertones to it. If I had a baby right this moment I would probably name it Dexter Raymond or Zanna Ray (because I like the letter Z :lol:) The middle name is after my Dad. Any boy I have needs a masculine name since DH's last name is feminine. For whatever reason people always think my DH is a woman based off his last name :dohh:

Pip says Wednesday and Shiv says Friday, so maybe I will test on Thursday :haha:


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## Shiv

I thought I had already shared my names

Henry and Cora

So it would be Henry James or Cora James (my surname is James)

What do you think?

What is your gut telling you regarding being pregnant Spidey?

Oh and MJ I forgot to say i gave birth to Sophia in a birth centre and it was brilliant. I had a midwife with me pretty much all the time, the birth pool was brilliant (i had only intended to labour in it for pain relief, but in the end I only had time to get in it to push!). Everything was very relaxed and not rushed after the birth. We got our own private room that was like a hotel room, with a tv and everything. There was a kitchen there so we could make our own food, and we could even have takeaway deliverec there. Can't recommend it enough. If you are worried about pain relief then I woudl say go to the birth centre, try the pool, (I could barely feel my contractions enough to push when I was in the water) and if worse comes to the worse and you feel you need more than pethidine and gas and air then get transferred over to the main hospital. Although I would say that with the extra attention you'd get from midwives and teh fact that thsi birth is liekly to be quicker and you are likely to be calmer second around, you might suprise yourself and not need an epi after all.


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## Mary Jo

I love both your names, Shiv, Henry James is such a classic; Cora is more unusual but very pretty. I like "C" names, I had Cara, Carey and Carrie on my girl list. :lol:

Zanna is very unusual, Spidey, :) I never thought but I guess it could be short for Suzanna? I also like Dex, though I am old enough that I think of Dex Dexter from Dynasty rather than the other Dexter on tv. (Dex Dexter was Alexis's 4th husband, IIRC.) 

Shiv, I am really inspired by what I've heard about labouring in water, from you and others, and really really want to try it, that's part of my reason for wanting to go to a birth centre. The one I'd be at is this one, it's a part of the main labour ward. I don't know whether that would be a good or bad thing, on the one hand good because it's near the docs in case of emergency, but bad in that it would make it too easy to request to transfer because I'd know it wouldn't take long. I'd prefer to go to my old hospital's new birthing centre - this one, as it is in the same building as the labour ward but a couple of floors below, so a quick but not instant transfer. also I feel a bit sad that I can't go there (not that there's any guarantees, so many things could make me ineligible) because the head midwife at the birth centre was one of the midwives I saw a few times when I was pregnant and she was the loveliest one of all. but should this move go ahead, there is no way I'd want to travel back to Lewisham to have the baby, or all the appointments before. it's too far.

last time I only had a very vague birth plan because I was scared to think about things more firmly in case it all went a different way to how I'd hoped. I was very very very anxious about it, not the birth itself, but the fear that something would go wrong. so when they said to come to hospital when my waters were leaking, of course I went, and I didn't argue when they said to stay in, and I didn't resist when they suggested speeding things up with the pessary. if that all happened again, I'd not go to hospital unless the waters indicated that meconium had been passed, and if I did, and they said it was all going slowly I'd press to be allowed home to do the first bits in my own relaxed environment with my stuff around, my bed, my tv, etc etc etc. I couldn't relax in the antenatal ward, it was awful. I was alone and uncomfortable. so I would refuse even a very gentle induction unless it really was necessary. but last time - gah, I was so fed up with it all, and the SPD pain, that I just wanted it to be over. I guess I'd have to be patient if it was similar and accept that he'll arrive in his own time. even if I am having contractions and they say it's likely to be at least another 48 hours (which is what I was told with Adam) I'll have to deal with it. 

so I don't want to be in any sort of hospital to stay till I am in established labour. NEVER want to be on another antenatal ward with midwives who pop in once an hour and are pretty dismissive. once I *was* in established labour with Adam I had already decided I was sick of it all and give me the hard-core anaesthesia, because nobody was saying, no, don't do it, try to carry on, try this, blah blah. I was all alone and hating it. of course once I had the epidural I was rarely alone at all, but the midwife's job was to monitor the machines and stuff, she had no role in getting me through. of course she had a big role at the pushing bit, but I just wished I'd had the support earlier.

however - the one thing that makes me question whether I could mentally cope with not having an epidural is that during the whole process I was on a fetal heart monitor and I *knew* Adam was ok. I only had to look at the monitor next to me and see that. it helped my anxiety that he wouldn't survive hugely. this time around, I haven't been so anxious. I've used my doppler once in the last month or more, I don't need reassurance that this one is alive because he is really active. I hope this carries on and maybe I will be more relaxed about no machines.

I don't know. thinking about not even discussing this with Chris. when we move I'll discuss it with a midwife and see if she thinks I'd be a candidate. if all goes as well as last time I don't see why I wouldn't be. (I have a mw appt this Wed, might ask her even though I won't be having baby at that hospital.) if I am then I might just wait and see, and then hopefully present it to C as a fait accompli.


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## spidey

Honestly I don't think I'm pregnant and I don't feel like I am, but of course the chance is still there so I can't help but be hopeful!

I guess Zanna must be short for Suzanna, but I actually like the name Anna. Over the past 5 years I've made 2 close friends named Anna and now it would be weird to name my daughter Anna. I saw the name Zanna somewhere recently and it seem like a nice Anna alternative. I haven't mentioned it to DH though- it would only add to his disappointment that I'm not pregnant yet.

Shiv, those are both great names! I don't think you've told us before but I might have forgotten. 

MJ, that birth center is super nice looking! It's so modern and the birthing tubs are great :thumbup: This is the one that I went to: https://www.specialbeginnings.com/ It's sort of grandma-ish compared to yours :haha: I spent half my labor at the birth center and half at the hospital after being deemed high risk. Going into the birth knowing that I would HAVE to do it naturally is what really helped me. I studied a hynobirthing program religiously too. Next time I hope to have a water birth :thumbup: Being in labor at the birth center was nice. It was so laid back compared to my experience at the hospital and my birth center is very pro-breast feeding, delayed clamping, etc. MJ- with this one you should definitely stay home longer. My water broke first and my MW would give me up to 24 hours at home before I needed to come in. 

:shrug::happydance::baby::cloud9::coffee: <- Kira's contribution. She always laughs at the smilies so I let her pick out her favorites.


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## jelr

Hey girls - will catch up once I get a minute as we only got home last night and my brother is heading back in the morning so I am cooking dinner this evening and myself and my two brothers are heading to the cinema tonight after Natasha is in bed and I need to get to the shops as we have nothing in after being away.

We had a great time at the wedding, Natasha was as good as gold all weekend and didn't shout boobies :haha: - I didn't think she would walk up the isle as she was running around at the rehearsal and I had walked her up the isle before the bride arrived and she had to stop at every seat to see the flowers and lanterns but she did it when the time came and went straight up in front of the bridesmaids and bride and so did the other little girl that was the same age as her - I actually thought I was going to cry I was so proud, she also sat and played with her stickers during the mass and coloured and sat nicely during the meal and really stole everyones hearts in between with dancing and singing and being so good and she looked so beautiful and cute in her dress. Sleep was a little off in a strange place and I had to pretend I was going to bed to get to her settle but once she went she stayed asleep and my family were great and took it in turns to babysit with the baby monitor in an ajoining room so as not to wake her with the tv on. I did find it hard over the weekend though as DH and I didn't get to spend much time together with minding a toddler and having to watch her like a hawk with so many around and in a strange place and taking it in turns to change / feed and get to her nap in between everything else, but it was still a great weekend, but it was go go go all the time.

had planned on starting potty training tomorrow, but am waivering now as I was really excited about it but not so much today but think it is just tiredness and feeling a little down after all the excitement and build up to finishing work and my birthday and the wedding and now it is all over with and I know I will really miss my brother when he is gone tomorrow so am wondering if I should wait as I dont want my being a bit down to impact on how well it goes, but then on the other hand I know I probably wont go anywhere this week as I'm so tired after all the going over the last few days and have a mountain of washing and housework to catch up on so this week would probably be the best as I will be indoors anyway and the weather is not great here. I think I will just see how I feel tomorrow as I really want to do it over the summer when I'm off and think she is ready.

Hope you are all well and I promise I will catch up tomorrow or the next day when things settle down a bit.


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## spidey

I'm so glad Natasha was such an angel at the wedding! I can't wait to see any pics you post on FB.

I'm still not certain when I want to potty train Kira. She tells me when she pees and she'll pretend to wipe herself. We also flush all her poops down the toilet and wave bye bye. When I use the bathroom she keeps me company and helps out by handing me little tiny pieces of toilet paper :haha: She also likes to sit on her potty and make a pushy face and twice she actually peed in it! 

So the things holding me back are that she still has very poor coordination and cannot aim her butt to sit on the potty by herself. She also cannot get her pants up and down by herself. I suppose I could do these things for her, but I suspect she would put up a fuss with me helping her since she's very much into doing things herself these days. Also over the past couple of weeks she likes to strip down naked in the morning and if I ask "do you want to sit on the potty" she says no (because the answer to everything is NO :lol:) and one morning she peed 3 times on the floor within a 5 minute span. Normally I don't take all her clothes off until her diaper is wet (since she holds her pee all night) but that particular morning DH was the one who did it and he watched in horror as pee went everywhere 3 separate times :haha: Kira didn't care and during all this we were trying to get her on the potty and she wanted nothing to do with it because she was having too much fun playing.

Jelr, if you decide to potty train you must give us daily updates!

Kira slept until 8:45 this morning!!! Thats the longest I've slept in for almost 1 1/2 years! But of course she only took a 5 minute nap :dohh: and I am sooo tired now. Thankfully DH came home early so I'm getting some rest time in now.


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## Shiv

jelr - so glad Natasha was a good girl for the wedding, I hope we will get to see some photos of her looking lovely? i hope you manage to get some rest this week.

As for potty training, i don't think Sophia is ready. She doesn't know when she wees and is more than happy going around in a wet nappy. She does tell us when she has poo'd though so a step in the right direction. She is still wet in the mornings, and quite frankly her nappy always seems to be a bit heavy, so she must eb weeing really frequently. She knows what a potty is for, and when she tells us she has done a poo she then wants to sit on it (a bit late dear :haha:), but not before.

In short i think i am going wait until she is more than ready if anything. The potty is always out downstairs so if she wants to sit on it then she can. But until she can tell us she needs a wee i am not seriously going to try to potty train her.

When we do, I plan to just put her in knickers during the day whether we are out and about or just at home. I think chopping and changing between having a nappy on and then not could be confusing. Obviously I'll still use nappies at night for a while.

Apparently if you do it when they are ready then can be dry within a week with very few accidents. So i guess you will know pretty soon if Natasha is ready. I hope she is ready and takes to it really well. Make sure you keep us up to date with all the messy details :thumbup:

Spidey - yay for the lie-in, boo for the lack of naps! Sophia actually had a nap today but then wouldn't go to sleep tonight :dohh:

MJ - I think you shoudl defo go for the birthing centre. i think you will cope a lot better with labour this time around with better care at the birthing centre :thumbup:


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## Mary Jo

yes, Adam is some way from being ready to potty train and I am not forcing the issue. especially not with a house move (hopefully) coming up, and a new baby. I think he'll be well over 2 before we get going. I'm also waiting till he can tell me he needs a wee. he tells me he's done a poo, which is good, and he isn't anti-potty (he's sat on it and finds it great fun, but has never weed on it though he once weed on the floor next to it). he does hold his wee sometimes, though, and I know he can take his trousers down when he wants to (witness the nappy off, poo rubbed into floor incident of a few weeks ago) but I don't think he'd be able to pull them back up. I'd like to let him have nappy-free days but while we're selling the flat it's not the right time. I also don't *think* he'd understand stuff like getting a sticker or something for using the potty, so if we go down that route it won't be till I know it will give him some motivation. 

Jean, so pleased the wedding went well and Natasha also enjoyed it. looking forward to pics :D that's great you had so much help from your family even though it wasn't much of a break for you. 

hooray for a lie-in Spidey but grrr for it meaning no nap. that's what it's been like here. wishing for the days when he napped with no fuss, and went to bed at night with no fuss. :lol: oh well. 

speaking of beds... I'm going to have to get Adam a bed, since we'll need the cot for Joel haha:). Shiv, I know you have got a double for Sophia; now, we haven't got space in Adam's room for a double, so we're going to get a full-size single. space-wise a toddler bed would make more sense, but I want it to be somewhere an adult can also sleep (in case we have guests or if one of us needs to sleep with Adam, I couldn't face a night in a short, narrow bed). I'm just not sure how much I should spend. I don't want to get a cheap foam mattress but how far upscale should I go? It's not meant to be a bed he'll be in for years, since the longer-term plan is to get some sort of bunk bed system as the children will be sharing a room till one of them moves out (or we win the lottery). I am trying to work out what we need to spend on furnishing this house as we don't have a lot of ££ left now since having to cut the price for this bloody major works :( and we need quite a lot - bed, mattress and storage furniture for Adam, bed frame and wardrobe for ours (our current bed frame wastes a lot of space and it's a really small room), new carpet on the stairs and the bedrooms, wooden flooring for the two downstairs rooms, possibly two 2-seat settees for the living room... not to mention the baby stuff (though my parents are giving us some money and that'll buy the pushchair - if we get a 2nd hand pushchair it'll probably pay for everything we need, just a new cover for the infant car seat, a new moses basket mattress and a breast pump). AND the damp course, woodworm treatment and redecorating after all that. eeeeek.

thanks for the input on the birth centre idea... it's my ideal now but I am afraid of getting too set on it in case it doesn't work out. ack!


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## Shiv

Sophia has a foam matress on her double bed, it wasn't an uber cheap one, but the guy in the shop actually recommended a foam matress as with all the bouncing it is much less likely to bugger up than a sprung one. As I see it there are also likely to be numerous bed wetting instances over the next months (years?) so I would rather replace a cheaper matress than have to replace an expensive one. Also Sophia is so light in comparison to an adult that don't feel she will come to any harm on a foam matress!

Off to see my new midwide today - I have to go through the whole booking in process again, including bloods and lots of forms (boo). for once I remembered to wee in my little pot this morning so won't have to *perform* under pressure later!


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## cleckner04

Just popping in to say hi! :wave:

Everything is going good here. It's incredibly hot here which is a bummer. In the high 90s with a heat index in the 100s. :roll: But we spent yesterday at the lake and today we are trying to stay indoors so it's been okay. Emma is loving all the new attention from all her grandparents and cousins. 

No TWW news from me. I don't think I'm pregnant this month because I feel no different. :shrug: Oh well though. 

I've gained a few lbs already I think. DH's family reunion is the cause because I went a bit overboard with the dessert. They had a ton of different pies though and pie is my favorite so I indulged. I didn't eat entire slices though I shared with DH but I still probably shouldn't have touched them. So I will probably have to start over with a new start weight when I return. :dohh: 

I hope you are all well. Too much chatter for me to catch up with now. I'm currently sitting at my parents using their wireless but I've been ignoring everyone for the past half hour. :haha:


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## Mary Jo

oh, ok, thanks Shiv. I guess we'll have to go to Ikea and bounce on a few mattresses and see how they are. good point about being prepared to replace it if and when it gets weed/pooed/sicked on. we definitely have to go and have a good look at other stuff at Ikea, I have quite a list. :D 

what happened at the midwife? I saw your FB status. did you not like her? I have a mw appt tomorrow, hopefully my last at this surgery. I did ask last time what the protocol was for changing hospitals and they told me to photocopy my notes so the old hospital has its own record, but to take what I have with me. I hope I don't have to go through the whole gamut of blood tests again. I bet they're not offering extra scans though!

hi Cleck! so glad you're having a good time. how was the journey? please don't worry about a couple of pounds, you're on holiday! enjoy it and then you'll be extra motivated when you get back


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## Shiv

I am no expert on matresses MJ - they were just my musings!

As for the midwife, well this may be a long story!

It wasn't that i didn't like her, she was perfectly pleasant, it was her attitude to giving birth that annoyed me. in Kent the midwives were very pro home birth, with a birth centre next best option, and then hospital birth if you needed it.

This woman asked me where I was going to give birth and I said i wasn't sure of the options in the area, so she started off by saying

"well there is a birth centre, but you'll probably end up being transferred to hospital by ambulance, and nobody wants that" 

I was gobsmacked so didn't say anything. SO then she said 

"there is the hospital which is your best bet, I'll sign you up for there"

i said I was considering a home birth, and she said

"oh, well i suppose that is an option, but I'll be honest, the midwives are really pushed here and the on-call midwives are usually called to the hospital so would have to cancel any home births anyway"

I came back at her with is that legal, I am pretty sure if I call you in labour then you are obliged to send a midwife to me. She got a bit arsey and said

"if there are no midwives you'll have to make do with paramedics"

:nope: Not a happy bunny and I am fairly sure she is talking out of backside.

I am seeing a different midwife at my next appt 34 weeks so i am hoping for a better response in general to birthing options.

She also weighed me (and said they routinely weigh at each appt here :cry:) and measured my height and proceeded to tell me my BMI, which was in the overweight category :dohh: What the hell does she expect, i am 30 weeks pregnant! Not helpful I don't think!

So all in all i was disapointed with the appt and am now seriously considering moving back to my parents house for my last few weeks of pregnancy so that I can go back to where I had Sophia. I just want it sorted where I am going to give birth.

I almost feel like definitely having a home birth just to stick two fingers up at her :haha:

I hope you have (and am sure you will have ) a better experience with your new midwife MJ

Oh and David went away again this morning, til..........well, we don't know. have to play it day by day, as it all depends on the weather!


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## Shiv

Oh and hi Cleck - glad you are having a good time back home!


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## Mary Jo

oh dear god, no wonder you were a bit hacked off after that! I presume you told her you had a pretty quick, straightforward labour & delivery in a birth centre last time - no reason for her to presume you'll have to go anywhere near a hospital! you could call the midwive dept at the hospital/wherever it is, and talk through some of this, just so you have an idea if it seems to be regional/hospital policy or just that one midwife. 

really hope I don't get someone who'll presume I am ok to do the easy thing (from their point of view) and just be admitted to the regular labour ward... but I guess since the birth centre I want to go to is just a unit on the labour ward it probably won't matter. 

that's definitely crap what she said about forcing you to have a hospital birth. I have read stuff in the home birth section, word for word what to say, how to respond to people who say this sort of ting. they're just hoping to put you off and assuming you haven't educated yourself on your rights and what they are legally obliged to supply.

I hope I don't get weighed. eeeek. I was always led to believe that it's your BMI at the start of pregnancy that indicates anything. ANYONE who starts out at a mid-range normal BMI is going to end up technically overwight by the end/close to the end! I have a feeling my start BMI was 23 point something, close to 24. so it didn't take much for me to tip into overweight I will laugh at anyone who dares say anything. they'd be on your case so much if you hadn't gained any weight at this stage, given you didn't start out obese!

grrr. I am annoyed about it too! stupid woman.


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## spidey

Shiv, thats an awful thing for her to say about winding up in the hospital if you start at the birth center. Is this your assigned midwife or will it be different every time? I saw a group with 4 midwives and they all irritated me in different ways, but when it came time for the birth, the one who irritated me the most was the one who delivered Kira and it really turned out okay. Here the midwives just catch the baby and check the HB every so often, so they take a backseat to the whole process... is that how it works there? LOL about having a paramedic be at the birth, that is so silly! And who calculates the BMI of someone in the 3rd trimester!? My bit of moral support is to not let this one woman ruin your outlook on the whole thing. I remember having so many ups and downs with all the worries the MW's gave me (high bp, going over due, low iron, etc etc) that I was almost to the point of wanting to do an unassisted HB, but in the end I stood my ground and had the outcome that I wanted.

Hi Cleckner! I'm glad you're having fun and Emma is being spoiled by all the attention!! When are you going to test?

DH is home so we're off to grocery shop for the week. I'll write more later about mattresses


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## jelr

Hey girls

Well I'm finally able to get in properly although i can't remember most of it now after reading :haha:

Shiv: God I would be annoyed too, that is ridiculous her going on about the hospital and that you would probably end up there, what does she have against birthing centres. I really wish we did have some here as they sound so much less clinical and I do think the midwives no more than the bloody doctors anyway and if you had booked a home birth surely they would have to send a midwive. I really hope that the next one you see is a lot nicer and a lot more positive and WTF was calculating your BMI in aid of, of course you are going to be overweight when you are 30 weeks pregnant. I would imagine that if your BMI wasn't overweight that there would be something wrong FFS. I am actually angry for you :Growl: 

I hope that David is not away too long this time and that he gets his work done quickly and I had hoped to ask you were you feeling less p*ssed off, but I doubt it after that appointment :nope:

I love your names by the way, any feelings yet as to whether it is a blue or pink bump?

MJ: So glad the house sale is moving on. FX it all keeps on going smoothly from here. I love the name Joel also. Glad you and C agreed on one. I never really thought about mattresses and we are actually putting Natasha into a double bed when we move her and it actually has a good mattress on it and I actually never thought about the wee and poo and sick - Oops, but then I may use it now as I dont want it getting damp by storing it for too long :dohh: - I can't wait to see pictures of your new house.

Spidey: Best of luck in the tww, did you decide when you are going to test? That is weird about the spotting this month, I would love to know what goes on in our bodies sometimes. I hope your nip is healing well after getting bitten - Ouchy, it sounds painful.

Cleck: Glad you are getting on well at home, but do let yourself enjoy your holidays too, you deserve to after all your hard work and at most it will only be a few lbs and you will lose that in no time when you get back. Best of luck on the tww too.

Well the potty training is a disaster so far :dohh: - I think I was a bit premature with it all :wacko: tbh but my friend has said to stick with it for 3 days as sometimes the first two are a disaster and then they just get it on the 3rd so the fact that I have done a day I will keep going. I left her with no bottoms on all day and she did pee about 6 times but on the floor :haha: - the first time I had only walked out of the room and she called me and was saying "me mess, me mess" so I knew what had happened and then the other times she just said oo or nothing at all :haha: - so we had actually no wee's in the potty, but eventually this evening we managed to get a poo in there - only by chance though as I saw her starting to push and grabbed her and ran to the potty, which she didn't want to sit on (even though she spent most of the day sitting on and off of it, as it kept in it what ever room we were in) but the poo managed to fall in so DH and I made a big fuss and told her what a good girl she was and we made a big deal of flushing it and saying bye bye and she loved putting the sticker on her chart. She really loved the sticker chart and wanted to put stickers on it all day, and kept kissing Minnie mouse, but I just kept explaining that the stickers only go on when she does a wee or poo in the potty. I do think she can understand it all, but am not sure she actually has enough bladder control yet or is aware that she needs to go before she does so I think I will probably be putting it back to after Christmas and I will be off until after the 6th of January so hopefully if it doesn't work this time, she will be ready by then as it is something I really want to do myself and not have my mam do it if that makes sense and did think now would be a better time than winter to leave her with no bottoms on, but then again I'm sure she wont be cold if I leave the heating on all day in the winter either.

Well think the photos have just finished uploading on fb so I'm gonna run over there for a catch up too.


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## Mary Jo

awwww, I've just been over to FB to look at the wedding pics - they're great! Natasha looks so so sweet and pretty in her dress and little cape. :D and your dress looked lovely and not at all like the bridesmaids' dresses (which I thought were very nice - I was a bridesmaid for one of my good friends about 5 years ago, and her idea was to have us in dresses of Cadbury's purple. I wish we'd been put in something like your bridesmaids were in - I absolutely hated what we had to wear, the colour wasn't right, the fabric was awful... it's hard to grasp the full enormity of the awfulness from this pic... click for scary pic ...but yeah. I think someone vetoed strapless and didnt want to show their arms/shoulders, so those stupid bits of chiffon on the arms got added... and just yuck. (mind, it was nothing compared to what my friend the bride wore. again, hard to tell from that pic but it was like an Elizabethan serving wench costume not a wedding dress.)

I wouldn't worry about the potty training - if it's not time it's not time, no harm done and hopefully in a few months she'll be all set and keen. never know, though, if it's just day 1, it might just click tomorrow. according to my mother both me and my brother were fully trained before we were 2. no idea how she did that or if I even believe her! not that she's put any pressure on me re Adam, but I do remember some pointed comments she made to me when my SIL wasn't doing much about encouraging my nephew and niece. (my niece was quick to learn, but then she had her older brother as encouragement and to copy. my nephew was a lot slower, and he's still not dry overnight, poor little soul, he'll be 6 in a couple of months and he's mortified that he is still in pull-ups. and my little niece, who is almost 4, and shaping up to be a bit of a mean girl when she likes, rubs it in his face that he still is in a nappy.) I'm just aware that Adam is having some major changes in the next few months anyway - new house, new brother, sharing mummy and daddy, not sleeping with us or being near us every night - so I want him to be fully settled with it all before something else changes. plus like I said before, he really isnt showing enough signs for me to be dealing with the hassle of poo and wee everywhere, especially since he likes to rub it in to the floor when he accidentally does it. if I thought it was readier than he is, I'd go ahead!

3rd tri for me tomorrow - today was the day in my last pregnancy that I had my 4D scan. I want to get one this time round as well, but nothing is booked. been a bit overwhelmed with everything else to even remember I am pregnant sometimes.

oh, and my eating is not going especially well. I made the unfortunate discovery of chocolate triple chocolate chunk super chocolatey chocolate cookies from the Co-op of all places. (they were reduced for quick sale the first time but I paid full whack today.) o. m. g. no idea about the calories but these babies are BIG and must therefore be at least 300 each. and C and I had 2 each. oops.


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## jelr

Woohoo for 3rd Tri MJ - god your time is all flying (but that is easy for me to say when it is not my time :haha:)

Thanks for the lovely comments on me and Natasha - I did think she looked gorgeous, but then I'm meant to think that :haha: - I actually nearly cried when she walked up the isle, I really was so proud. - such a big softie :haha:

I'm sorry but I have to agree with you, those bits on the dresses really didn't do anything for it and I love purple but that is a funny shade, mind you you still manage to look great and are the best looking of them all.

Yeah you are right not to start with Adam, when he has so many changes going on, being honest I think most children are 2 and a half so I definitely wouldn't worry as he will do it in his own time and I'm not too worried either in fact I'm half thinking after today not only is Natasha not ready but I'm not ready either :haha: - It was a nightmare trying to clean her bum standing up after she pood compared to the changing mat :haha: but then i have done a day so I'll stick with it for the 3 now.

I wouldn't blame you being overwhelmed between your friend being sick and the move, I would definitely be overwhelmed myself. Hopefully with everything else going on though it means the time is going quicker for you :)


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## spidey

Jelr, thanks for sharing the pictures! I really enjoyed looking at them.

You should go with your gut with potty training and if nows not the right time then its best to put it off. This morning Kira asked to have her clothes and diaper off because she likes wiping herself with toilet paper. She peed 2 separate times on the floor and didn't seem to care at all! I don't think she's ready yet either :haha: My friend said that potty training her daughter in the winter wasn't bad because her daughter could feel when she wet herself since her pants got wet. And she said having the pants soak up most of the pee was much better than having pee all over the rug :haha:

MJ, congrats on being in 3rd tri! I can see why you didn't like the bridesmaid dress but despite it being not the prettiest, you still look good in it :thumbup:

I decided to test this morning and a BFN, but I know its early still since I ovulated last Monday. I don't feel pregnant and I don't feel like AF will come soon either. If I had to go completely off my psychic nips I might have suspicion that I'm pregnant. They're still sore and normally they're sore 5-7 days and then go back to normal for 4-5 days and then AF comes. But they can't be trusted this month because one was bitten and Kira's been latching on poorly and I see tooth indents when she's done nursing now. My poor nips!


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## Shiv

Spidey - sorry about the BFN but as you said it is very early days 9i told you to test on Friday :haha:). Sounds like your nips are telling you somethign might be different this month! And even ifyou aren't pregnant (and you might be!) it sound slike AF is a way off so that means a nice long luteal phase! I have a good feeling though!

MJ - They are pretty awful bridesmaid dresses, I had a chuckle if I am honest! My eating has been ok the last few days, I think I am sticking to about 2000 cals a day (although not actively counting them), which considering my bmr says I shoudl be having about 1600 is probably still too much but hey ho!

What happened to your post on facebook. I had just settled down to write a nice lengthy reply and I can't find it! So i shall write it here!

I would go and see both birth centres/hospitals and see if one floats yoru boat more than the other. If it does then I would go to that one regardless of any scare stories of how busy it might be. If you can't choose between the two (I had this issue last time), then wait until you go into labour and give them both a ring and see which one has most room and a free birthing pool. I did this and both centres were happy to give me the info and happy for me to wait until then to decide where to go. Mymidwife was also more than happy for me to wait until labour to make my mind up and I just had my midwife appts at my local doctors. I am sure your new midwife will be happy to see you locally as she probably will serve both birth centres as they are so close. Lucky you having 2 birth centres within 6 miles! Don't know if that helsp at all, but remember any hospital/birth centre if you are having a normal pregnancy is obliged to take you if you are in labour, they can;t turn you away unless there is some urgent reason.

jelr- the photos of Natasha are gorgeous, she really is a beauty! Sorry potty training didn't go well yesterday, I hoep it went better today, or if not that you are happy to leave it for a while. It is so difficultto know when they are ready isn't it. It is great they you are being the potty training guinea pig for us all :haha:

As for me, well i am a bit calmer about the whole midiwfe thing. I will see what my next midwife is like and how she feels about home births. to be honest I guess i was just expecting the midwife to say "yes that's a great idea" and that would make my mind up, as i am still a little unsure.

Sophia has been a complete madam today, seriously bad. we didn;t leave the house because she just wouldn't co-operate at all. It took me 90 mins to get her dressed. And yes I could have done it quicker but I didn;t want to have to pin her down, especially as we had nowhere specific to go. Then she didn't want to go downstairs...........that was another hour. Then when we did go downstairs I told her it was too late to go out as it was nearly lunchtime, cue yet another meltdown. I ended up giving her lunch at 11am in the hopr of getting her down for a nap (whcih she was in desperate need of juddging by her tantrums). She went down at 11.45am and slept for 3 hours. Yay! But now I am still trying to get her to settle for the night (1hr and 45 mins after her normal bedtime!).

I am just wondering what to do about the whole nap vs bedtime thing. Waking her up 4 hours before bedtime is no longer working, so do i stop naps entirely and have a miserable madam on my hands, but one who goes tsraight to sleep at night. Or just let her nap but move her bedtime back and miss out on having any sort of evening to myself?


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## Mary Jo

eeek, Spidey, sorry about the BFN, hopefully it is just too soon and leaving it a couple of days will show something different! I laughed at your FB pic, did Kira make you slurp water from a bowl? (Adam sometimes does this if he has milk left in his cereal bowl. such beautiful manners!)

and sorry Sophia has been playing you up Shiv. I don't have answers on the nap thing, it's something we're dealing with now, as you know. though with you being alone with S so much at the moment with David away, I can see why you need your restful nice evenings (if Adam doesn't sleep, C goes up and settles him or goes to bed himself). but a grumpy toddler is no fun either. I have been going to wake Adam up if it's getting towards a 3 hour nap, unless the nap starts very early in the day. it's not foolproof, probably because I still have the mindset of let him sleep as much as he likes and it's hard to go wake him when I am enjoying the peace/getting stuff done as well.

the midwives I saw today (there was a student and a regular mw) suggested homebirth to me, which was nice (this after I asked about the birth centre). they were very very positive about the whole thing. I wish it was an option for me but there is no way C would agree, and whereas I do think - heck, it's my body, my birth, it is his home as well and if he isn't comfortable with it then he isn't. but if he is to veto one idea I am not letting him veto anything else! and really, I am too risk-averse to plan for a home birth anyway. maybe I should tell him I want one and then agree to compromise on the birth centre of my choice! win win!

as for my FB post - ack, I just suddenly felt it was too long, and decided to delete it. I wish I hadn't now, but oh well. if anyone missed it - in a nutshell I was saying: I want to give birth in a birth centre if poss, and mentioned it to the mw I saw today. however they didn't seem to think much of my chances of getting into the birth centre at what will be my local hospital when we move, because it's on the labour ward and therefore used as overspill when they are busy. so they recommended a different hospital with birth centre, 6 miles away from where we'll be. however there is no guarantee of getting in there either if it is busy, and while neither of the hospitals' regular labour wards get good reviews (and some truly terrible ones), the more local one seems to be less negative. I have to be aware that there is the possibility that I will not get into the birth centre and will have to go to the regular labour ward. so I don't know what to do. also I am concerned about where I'd go for mw appts if I go out of area - Shiv, the two hospitals are not in the same NHS trust, and I guess that matters. I won't know anything for sure til I register with a new GP and ask. Chris is likely to oppose me going to a not very local hospital, so I have decided to have flexible morals on this and if I have to I will tell him or have him believe that I have simply been referred there and that's it. he might swallow it if I say it's because I booked in late and the other hospital is likely to be far too busy! 

thanks for the advice, Shiv, I didn't know I didn't have to commit to one or the other. hope them being different trusts won't make a difference? I am planning to go and have a look round both of them anyway, just so I have an idea of what I'm dealing with.

how's Natasha been on day 2, Jean? 

my friend has now had her MRI and CT scans and found out today that her cancer is localised to her uterus, so that is good news. however, she requires a radical hysterectomy, but the doc wants her to lose a lot of weight first. doc is consulting with some people about that and so my friend doesn't have a date for her surgery. I am happy for her but I know she is now extra stressed. she had hoped drug treatment would be sufficient to control/cure the cancer but it seems not if the doc is talking surgery.

Adam is suddenly not well tonight. :cry: I am worried and thinking he might have to go to the hospital in the morning if he doesn't start drinking enough of the special drink he has to take when he's not well (because of this ketotic hypoglycemia). he was ok this morning, ate his breakfast as usual (a big bowl of bran flakes mixed with cheerios) and some milk, then we went to the midwife appt (and he was very good most of the time, bit fussy in the actual appt but nothing too bad), then he was tired when we got in and sat on the settee next to me. but I didn't think anything of that since it was past his nap time anyway. so we went up and he slept for about 3 and a half hours. I decided to get him up for lunch at around 3.30pm, because I didn't want such a long nap to affect his sleep later, and he ate a small dish of baked beans. and then he just stopped eating. didn't fuss, didn't cry or whine, didn't throw the rest of his food (some cheese, cucumber and buttered bread) but just sat there. so I cleaned him up and let him down from the high chair. he immediately went and lay down on the settee! this after such a long nap troubled me, so I thought, ok, see how he is in an hour or so and then I'll give him the emergency drink. 

by the time an hour was up C was home, and Adam had asked to go back to the bedroom and was lying on the bed. of course C thought he was ok because he perked up to see him, and begged some of C's sandwich, but then he lay down again and was clearly not himself. so I went and got some ribena to see if he'd like the drink any better mixed with juice (he had some, not much) and got some biscuits (he had 1 and a half), and made dinner. his all-time favourite - sausages and a potato waffle. he ate half a sausage and nothing else. this is proof positive he's not right, usually he wolfs the sausages down. 

so we let him back to bed again and he just lay down. not asleep but not moving. no energy. gah. according to the instructions I got from the hospital, we have to get him to drink 100ml of this drink (it's glucose and water basically) every 2 hours, day and night. there is little chance of that. I don't know how I can force a toddler to drink. so if he is the same in the morning I am going to ring up the nutritionist at the hospital and be prepared to take him down to children's A&E again. poor baby. blood tests and a drip for him if he doesn't improve soon. :(


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## jelr

spidey: ouchy that sounds sore seeing teeth indents, still them both being sore might be a good pregnancy sign. Sorry about the BFN, but I would definitely say it is too early especially since you it was later in your cycle to ovulate as I know I with Natasha I tested the day after AF was due and got a BFN but then when I tested a week later when she still didn't arrive it was a BFP and I'm putting it down to my cycle being longer that month, so fingers crossed for you. :thumbup:

I loved the picture of you on FB too. Kira has such an imagination.

Shiv: I'm glad you are feeling a bit better about the midwife appointment and hope that the next one is a lot nicer and gives you the proper info that you need to make a decision. 

I always try and wake Natasha up at around the 2 hour mark if she is still asleep, I know it means less time to relax or get stuff done during the day, but she wont go down for me if she sleeps any longer and if I wake her before the two hours she is cross as she hasn't had enough. Maybe try that and if it is not working, try and wake her after the 2 hours and maybe just leave her a half hour later at night rather than leaving her too late and see if that works so at least then you have some time during the day and some of your evening. It really is all a guessing game isn't it. I can remember when Natasha started to nap properly instead of cat nap. I thought yes finally a nice routine to take the guess work out of it and now realise it is always going to be guess work as the minute something works, it all goes to pot and they change :dohh: 

I really hope Sophia is in better form tomorrow, could it be teeth again. Those days are really tough at the best of times, let alone with DH is away.

MJ: Sorry to hear Adam is not well and it is such a worry for you when he wont take the drink that he has too. FX he is just off colour and by morning he is back to himself and you wont need to go to the hospital. Poor baby :kiss:

I'm so glad your friend's cancer is contained to her uterus and hasn't spread, not nice though having to face surgery though and definitely not nice having to lose weight at a stressful time like this. They only thing is at least with surgery it will all be done and over with and she wont have months of treatment ahead of her.

I dont have any advice on the birthing centre I'm afraid as our system is totally different here and it is just the hospital and it is always the one closest to you, we do have what is called a domino service that is midwife led but you still give birth in the same hospital, but all your appointments are with the midwife only and not the obstetrician and you can get home within 6 hours and the midwife calls to you at home for a few days, but I had asked about it the last time and due to my previous mc and my arthritis, they wouldn't allow me to do it and I would say I definitely wont have a hope next time as Natasha was faceup and I had to have vacuum and forceps and I had strep B also and then lost a lot of blood on top of it, and I actually heard today that they are doing away with it, but am not sure if it is true. I do think it is a good idea to have a look at them both and I honestly think you will have a gut feeling on which one is right for you.

Well AFU - I have decided to put the potty training on hold as she just isn't ready. I have being brining the potty into whatever room we are in so it is near and is easy access and today I managed between the tv and playing with my phone to get her to sit on it for 20mins and nothing and the minute she stood up she peed on the floor and then my mam was over and she said show me how you sit on your potty and she peed on the way over to it and then this afternoon I again I managed to get to her to sit on the potty for about 30mins between books and she got a money box that is a meer cat from my aunt at the weekend and he moves his head and makes noise when you put the money in so I empied our coin bottle and we played with that and nothing and two minutes after she stood up she peed on the floor again, so I definitely think she doesn't have enough bladder control or is not aware yet that she needs to go, as she is very aware of what she needs to do in it and what it is for. Also the time that she peed after sitting for 30 mins she actually got a bit upset and said "oh no me wee" - "on potty, on potty" and she ran to the potty. I then was thinking I would scrap it and put a knickers and skirt on her and brought her outside for a while and she went again and again went running to the potty so I dont want that she ends up stressed or upset that she can't make it or that she hasn't realised that she needs to go until it is too late and that it might only just upset her and put her off.

I'm also thinking the winter wouldn't be so bad as we plan on getting a stove put in (DH is so aware of losing heat because of his job and he reckons we lose loads up the chimney) so we have decided to do that out of his redundancy money but we are actually getting a loan from my dad to get it done in the summer time rather than in the winter where we can't have the heat off for a few days to get it all done, so anyway with the stove you can leave it lit all night so when I decide to try again, I can always have it on all night so the house is not cold first thing in the morning and as you were saying Spidey I might even leave pants on. I know they say that sometimes knickers or pants confuse them, but she was really aware when she went in the garden today, although I suspect there will be lots more washing, which I didn't have the last few days, except all the old rags to mop up the pee :haha:

Well by my calculations the dreaded middle of cycle is coming up this weekend, I dont feel like it is going to happen this month as I feel good even though I'm missing my brother so much, but then again I feel like this every month and then just wake up like a different person on one of the days :dohh: - although hopefully the pms escape that I bought will help this time.


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## spidey

MJ, I hope Adam is well in the morning. Thats so stressful to have to worry about him taking a sudden turn for the worse like that. I have enough trouble trying to get Kira to eat so if she had that problem I just can't imagine the constant worry I would have. Could you freeze the liquid like a popsicle? Or freeze it and then make a shaved ice type slushy? Or perhaps put it in a fast food cup with a straw and he might think its a forbidden treat. You're right though, there is no way to force a toddler to eat or drink. Update us on how he is in the morning :hugs: I don't have much advice on what to do about the birth center. Do they just say these things so you don't get completely disappointed if there is no space, or is it really that crowded? 

Shiv, is there anyway Sophia could start her afternoon nap earlier in the day? Does she like to sit and watch tv? At 10am I always play Kira's favorite tv show to force her to recharge because she gets sooo cranky at 10am since I think she still could benefit from a morning nap. So instead of a morning nap she gets a tv rest. So perhaps Sophia could have an afternoon tv rest instead :haha:

jelr, it does sound like its too soon to potty train. When the time is right it'll be much easier I think. Fingers crossed your mid month depression is not as bad this month.

Luckily Kira doesn't make me do Kitty things while I'm meow meow mommy :lol: I do have to talk differently, so I might say "meow meow mommy is so hungry meow meow" :haha: And she'll keep checking to make sure I'm still wearing it and will make me put it back on if I have it off! But, Kira will listen to meow meow mommy more than regular mommy, so Shiv, you might want to try it with Sophia if she has another cranky day tomorrow :haha: We also play with hand puppets and Kira will treat my hand puppet character like a new friend and show off all her toys. It's so adorable, but DH thinks I'm crazy :rofl: But he has no right since he was the one who created the Bad Bunny split personality for Kira!

I'm going to test again on Friday and see what I get. I had another one of those dizzy spells again today, but besides that and the nips I feel nothing else. It's hard not to get my hopes up each month... I swear that I won't get excited but I always do.


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## Shiv

eek MJ- how is Adam this morning? I hope he is better or that you can get him to drink the special drink. With Sophia if I put any drink in one of our glasses then she wants to drink it as she thinks it is special!

Gotta go as have a playdate that I am late for, will reply to everyone else later x


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## Mary Jo

thanks everyone, I think Adam is going to be ok, and I don't think we're going to have to go to hospital, thank goodness. :)

not a great night, though in terms of broken sleep for me... Adam woke around 2am, chattering away, so we went with it and decided to see if he'd eat something (still refusing all but the smallest sips of the glucose drink) and he had a biscuit and his cold sausages from dinner (I thought since they're salty they might make him thirsty, but really a sugary snack would have been better). and he had some plain water. at first he was just sitting in bed, quite bright, but not standing or walking, so I was concerned he was too weak, but then he did get up and ran around the bedroom a little. up again playing at 4am. he went back to sleep, but I had to get up at 7am and go out before C left for work because we didn't have enough sugary food in the flat. I got him a box of Frosties (sugary cornflakes) and a malt loaf and a bottle of Lucozade, which he is fine to have as the glucose drink according to the papers I have, it's one thing we hadn't tried (just desperately trying to find him something he will drink willingly). it's hard because he is just too young to understand - please drink some of this because if you don't you might have to go to hospital and have blood taken and needles in your hand. might be easier when he is older.

so Adam slept till 10.15am. I went back to bed just after 8am, so I caught up a bit on sleep. when he woke he got up when I said it was breakfast time and we walked downstairs together. he then finished the carton of adulterated Ribena that Chris made for him last night, and has eaten a bowl of Frosties and a half slice of malt loaf AND I made up another carton of adulterated Ribena, and he's had most of that (I can make up these drinks with juice or water or sugar-free drinks, the amount of powder to add if different if it's an already sugary drink, so I bought no-added sugar Ribena so I could use it like water. the cartons are 200ml, so if he has one of those over the course of 4 hours I am winning the game of give the baby a special drink :D )

if he goes on like this he should be absolutely fine. if we'd left it chances are he'd have started feeling sick and/or puked because of hypoglycemia, and then it would have been extra hard to get him to eat or drink. so I think our efforts have worked. touch wood anyway. :)

he hasn't wanted the Lucozade. took a couple of small sips and made a face. I don't care so long as there is some way of getting the glucose in him, and so far the Ribena is the only thing that's worked. and I think *that* worked because it's in a cute little carton (I had to cut it open, pour the juice into a jug, add the powder, mix and pour back in and tape it up, so he could drink it with the little straw). a bit of a palaver, but if it works it works. he doesn't get juice that often but he really likes it, so I think he's seeing it as a forbidden treat, like you suggested, Spidey. :)

as for the birth centre - I guess some women must have been turned away. it's just rotten luck if you are in labour when it's busy (rotten luck on a few counts, the lack of attention you get from the midwives is another).


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## Mary Jo

Adam is pretty much back to normal now. he's had more than enough of the drinks, he is ok with them mixed with Ribena.

I made this video this morning after breakfast - Adam and his new obsession, the empty cupboard:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXLRKMXvg9s

excuse the dummy, and don't mind that he's grabbing his nappy, it needed to be changed! (he's not very talkative with the dummy in but given he has been a bit below par I haven't been fighting that battle today)


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## Shiv

Spidey- so when are you going to test again. Anymore nipple premonitions. I know it is impossible not to get your hopes up each month, but then again each month coul dbe THE Month! Fingers crossed!

MJ - It is good news that your friend's cancer is localised to the uterus. I know a hysterectomy is a major op, but it could have been much much worse. How much wieght do they want her to lose, and what help are they giving her to lose it?

I am so glad Adam is brighter today, must be scary stuff.That video is really cute, I forget that you are from 'borough, your accent is lovely. 

jelr - I think i will be potty training over winter as well, as i can't see Sophia being quite ready before new baby is here and I am guessing i won't really want to try it straight after!

I hope you don't feel too bad mid cycle and that if you do it passes really quickly.

As for us, today was a better today. Last night was not good sleep wise, but Sophia only had a little nap in the car today so she is tired so I am hoping for a better nights sleep tonight. I need it having not had a nap!

Had a playdate this morning, with the usual girls and it was nice and pretty relaxed. I am off out to dinner next Friday with them as well, so all going well.


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## jelr

MJ: I'm so glad Adam is much better today and that he has taken lots of the drink for you, I would say you probably wouldn't have slept with worry even if he hadn't of woken. I love the video, he is so cute. Isn't it funny even with all the toys in the world its the simple things like an empty cupboard or box that keep them entertained for hours :thumbup:

Shiv: I'm glad your playdate went well and that the dinner goes well next Friday and I'm glad Sophia is a bit brighter today. I really hope she sleeps tonight and you get to catch up on some much needed sleep :thumbup:

Spidey: Best of luck with testing tomorrow, will be looking forward to your update. I would definitely keep up the meow mommy if Kira behaves better for her :haha:

Well I had a cranky girl today, she was awake last nigth so I think that was the problem, although she is becoming very demanding these days and shouts when she wants something and her patience seems to have gone out the window :dohh: - She was shout "me dinner, me dinner" and I mean shouting it this evening while I was trying to dish it up and there was no telling her that it was coming :dohh: - The joys of toddlerhood eh :haha:

Well has anybody any nice plans for the weekend? Just a quiet one here after being away last weekend, although I reckon I will be busy enough calling to friends and catching up over the next few weeks, I can't believe 2 weeks of my holidays are gone already and apart from the wedding I haven't done anything yet and all my friends have been on about meeting up, so I'm going to make a start on that next week and have made plans to meet up with two of them and have told the rest that it will the couple of weeks after that as I dont really want to be out all day with Natasha everyday as I really want to have some time with her on my own too and its not fair to be dragging her out everyday either. It really is hard to fit it all in, especially in between naps and mealtimes :haha:


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## spidey

MJ, thats a really cute video. I like how he put all his toys in there and sat on top :haha: I can see why he likes that cupboard! I'm glad he's feeling better today. He looked great in the video :thumbup:

Shiv, I hope you get a good long sleep tonight!

Jelr- Kira is quite bossy and impatient these days as well. If she sees me sitting on the couch she'll come over and push me and grunt and then shows me where I should be sitting on the floor. 

No weekend plans for me. It's really hot here with temps in the 100's and high humidity. The mosquitoes are really bad now too so no more outdoor fun for awhile. So I think we're doing some shopping instead! :thumbup:

Since I have 20 cheapo tests and some really concentrated pee, I decided to test this evening :lol: It was a BFN... I'll test Friday morning too. It's fun having tons of tests to waste. I finally had some pre- AF symptoms today like super ugly hair, so she might be on her way soon if I'm not pregnant. Nips are still a bit sore too.


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## Mary Jo

I'll come back later with a proper post but just wanted to say:

WE HAVE EXCHANGED CONTRACTS!!! Completing and moving next Friday, 29th! :happydance:


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## Shiv

YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY Great news MJ, so happy for you!

Get packing! Or may I suggest you get someone to pack for you!


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## Mary Jo

thanks Shiv!! we are so so so so SOOOOOOOOOOOOO unbelievably relieved. :D

as for packing, I have barely been able to stop Chris from packing so far (even though I didn't want to do a thing till exchange) but now he can go right ahead. :lol: we're doing the move ourselves (with my mum and dad's help, thank goodness), so we're hiring a van, and during the week Chris is going to take a car-full of stuff over to his mother's to store, so we don't have such a big amount of things to get into the van on Friday (my friend already has a load of our stuff in her basement, plus she is giving us an old settee and tv, which we go back for Fri night). so with the van, plus 2 cars I think we'll be ok. we don't have so much stuff anyway, we're not taking any kitchen appliances, have included the fridge and washer dryer in the sale, and we'll be getting a new bed frame as ours has a big ridge round the edge, which wastes a lot of space, and our new bedroom is pretty small. so there's just the settee (which comes to pieces) and the mattress and our dining table. plus boxes and boxes and bin bags galore. 

I don't expect to do any of the hard work, I'll be the one making phone calls about various things all week. :D


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## spidey

oooo!!! That is such good news MJ!!! :happydance: I'm glad things are finally moving in the right direction!

Well girls, I might be pregnant :shock: I tested this morning and it was a BFN but then I just tested this evening with some nice concentrated pee and there is a very slight line. My nips are still sore and have been getting sorer, so I know it must be true. To be honest I'm scared and hoping the test is wrong. I don't know what's wrong with me. I guess I'm so scared of everything and life seems so perfect now that I can't see how this could be a good thing. I haven't even told DH yet. The only time we DTD around ovulation time was Sat July 9th, and I think I ovulated Monday July 11th. Today is CD37 and 11 days post ovulation, so I conceived on a long cycle. Ahhhh, sooooo scared!!!!!!! I'll test again in the morning and see if its darker.


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## Mary Jo

ooooooooh SPIDEY!!! YAY!!!!! test again and post the pics! congratulations! your psychic nips were on the money after all. :happydance:

(fwiw, when I got my first bfp this time, I was totally totally shocked and scared and wondering what the hell we'd done, and wishing we'd left it a few months. :dohh: but I came round to the idea pretty quickly. hopefully you'll be the same once it's sunk in :D )


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## spidey

heres the test from tonight... can anyone else see that super faint line?

https://www.razortoe.com/share/pos.jpg

I told DH and he's thrilled so I'm feeling a bit more positive about it all. After talking to DH I realized my biggest fear is having ms as bad as last time. I couldn't even sleep in the same bed as DH as his movement would make me retch. I can't imagine needing to take care of Kira like that. I missed 1 complete month of work and a second month was spent curled in a ball at my office chair. I need to keep any pregnancy secret at work since they need to make a decision regarding my employment at the end of September. If this pregnancy works out, it is absolutely perfect for the long term so I need to stop dwelling on the what ifs for the short term! Okay, enough crazy rants from me for the night :haha:

I found scratches all over the hood of my car today and I am 99% certain my stupid BIL was doing stunts off my car since he does them on his car all the time and his car is all scratched and dented up. I have secret security cameras around my house and I'm reviewing the footage now hoping he did it during the day so I can confirm it before I go rip his head off :growlmad:


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## Shiv

Spidey - I dreamt last night that you were pregnant and then I log on today to see your news! Congratulations, I can see the line! I was freaked out too when I got pregnant this time, although we try when it happens it all becomes very real and scary. Could you not get some anti-emetics this time round to help with your sickness? My best friend is a doctor and although she was nothappy about taking anything whilst pregnant she did,a nd she woudl do so again. She was hospitalised a few times and would rather take some anti-sickness meds than go through that again. Just a thought!

Gotta love your psychic nips! :happydance:


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## Mary Jo

I totally see the line as well. 

:wohoo:

yeah, I was mostly freaked out because of Adam. although I had a pretty easy pregnancy with him, with only very mild ms, it was harder by 3rd tri when I got SPD, and I just thought oh - GOD. can I actually cope? the realistic sensible rational considerations about another pregnancy never really kicked in when we were TTC/planning to TTC... I just wanted it so much I kind of came crashing back to earth when I saw the second line! but by the time I did the second test (about 3 hours later) I was completely on board with myself. :rofl:

I have had times of thinking, shite, can I manage being pregnant with looking after a toddler? 1st tri was the hardest so far, though I guess third will be hard in a different way. I had much worse ms this time, almost like motion sickness, if I moved I wanted to be sick. would you take anti-emetics, Spidey? sounds like a good idea. mine was never that bad, but even so the first 9 or so weeks just dragged by in a bit of a pit of misery!

:D so pleased your DH is happy about it. when I told Chris - showed him the test that said 1-2 pregnant on - and he said I couldn't be as I was on my period! I wasn't, obviously, but the night before, without my knowledge, I must have dripped a drip of blood into the toilet. I know, TMI, but it must have stuck on the side of the loo and not gone into the water, and we don't flush wees overnight because historically we were afraid of disturbing Adam. so he was convinced I was in the early stages of mc, whereas I thought, ooooh, implantation bleeding, maybe? obviously I did turn out to be pregnant, but there was no celebrating from him, he's far too cautious. it felt like he was pissing on my parade but he did come round to it (it sunk in when I was puking all the time!)


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## Shiv

oh and I just had to say I told youto test on Friday, and I was right :smug:


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## Mary Jo

ooh, meant to say - I weighed this morning and was exactly the same as last Saturday (11st 3 and 3/4 lb. I don't usually mention the fractions but this amused me). :D


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## Shiv

ooooooooooooh well done on your weight MJ, make sure it doesn't keep happening though.


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## spidey

just woke up and took another test and it was a bfn... but my nips still hurt so I'm still pregnant for now. I'll test again tonight with my super good concentrated evening pee :haha: Last night when I told DH I was pregnant, he asked "why do you think you're pregnant?" and I said "because my nips hurt... and I got a positive pregnancy test" He thought it was funny that I listed the non-scientific evidence first :lol: Even if this one ends soon, I am very pleased that I can actually get pregnant AND my nip theory was completely right! :happydance:

I guess I never really considered taking medicine for the m/s, and there is no reason why I shouldn't. I didn't see a midwife about my last pregnancy until 10 weeks when the m/s let up a bit so I didn't really complain. I am much more educated this time around from being here on bnb :lol: MJ, mine was like bad motion sickness too. If I moved I would feel sick, so I spent most of 1st tri laying still on the couch! I'm trying to think more rational and not pre-worry about everything that could go wrong. Easier said than done! Oh yes, and Shiv you were right about testing on Friday!

MJ, yipee on the lack of weight gain!


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## cleckner04

Just popping in and saw the news!!!!!! OMG CONGRATS SPIDEY!!!! :yipee::happydance::yipee: Your nipples are amazing. :rofl: 



No news here. No symptoms but no AF either but I had a 12 day luteal phase two months ago so I could be having that again. I don't think I'm pregnant at all though.


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## Shiv

Cleck - so are you 12 DPO now? Hope you are having a blast back home x


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## cleckner04

Yeah I'm 12 DPO today.


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## overcomer79

I just learned that I have a really short luteal phase (last at 9 dpo witch showed) so I guess I will be speaking to a dr about this...


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## Shiv

Well good news all round then, either you are preggers or this could be a 13 day luteal phase :happydance:


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## Pippin

EEEeeeek Spidey :happydance: I totally see a line :yipee: and I would always get better lines in the evening. When do we get another update? :haha:

Cleck would love you to test too :blush: I want to know who I'm handing the baton over to...... maybe it's a few of you :winkwink: I can cope with that after all Ash has a baton going spare too :haha:

Overcomer I had a short lutual phase and it never stopped me conceiving, it was 10 days. Take Vit B50 to lengthen it by a few days, makes all the difference.


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## cleckner04

I'm at a family reunion but had to jump on to say af hit. :( better luck next month I guess! I have a feeling I'll be waiting until dh is done with his next deployment. But it'll give me time to get down to a healthy bmi I guess.


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## Shiv

aw sorry she got you Cleck, still that is another 12 day luteal phase, so that is good. Good luck next month and stay positive............oh and treat yourself to some pie :thumbup:


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## spidey

Cleck, sorry about AF but it sounds like you're on the right track since you had another longer luteal phase :thumbup: I wonder if the B6 has finally kicked in and is working, or is Emma bf less? 

I have so many of these cheapo pregnancy tests so I might take another one when I have to pee again :haha:


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## spidey

not to bee too obsessive, but I took another test and another BFN. Its in the 100's here and I haven't drank much water or peed since waking this morning so I had really concentrated wee. Hmmmm... I need Kira to ask for a booby so I can see how my nips are :haha:


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## Shiv

You really should drink more Spidey - it's important to keep hydrated especiallu if it's hot. As for the BFN's, it is still early days and you are using cheapy tests so i would suggest keeping testing until the line gets stronger (assuming you have lots of tests?)

I have cricked my neck, I look like a complete idiot as I can't even hold it up straight, I am constantly tilting it to the left as if i move it any further to right it is agony. I have no idea how I am going to sleep tonight (badly I suppose :haha:)!

Sophia won't go to sleep tonight, David is up there and all i can here is Sophia protesting. I did warn him that if he let her nap so late in the afternoon that she wouldn't go to bed tonight, but would he listen. It does make me laugh when our men folk think they know best even if they are not around the child as much as the mother!


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## overcomer79

cleck sorry about the witch getting you. It sounds like you have the problem that I just discovered. 

Pip: I'm glad to hear that. I go for my "annual" august 2nd anyway so I'm going to talk to her about ttc. I am going to go get me some pre natals even though...that might help?

I should also point out that this was my first month of using FF and it might not have pinpointed O correctly. 

Spidey: I am feeling you on these hot temps!!! 100 here too! We took James to an indoor playground and he is still asleep from that after eating a big lunch!!

I was asleep until the wind started getting up so now worried about tornadoes so checking alerts but nothing as of yet except a "special weather statement". 

Oh geez Shiv...I hope James doesn't have Sophia's problem as this is a late nap for him but we DON'T dare wake him as he will make us PAY!! :haha:


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## Mary Jo

yes, Spidey, I went through so many (I'd venture a guess of 70+) tests, they're so cheap. test again, and keep hydrated!

ouch, Shiv, that sounds nasty. what did you do? aw, poor David, but I agree with you, I see it a lot with Chris, he comes in and tells me what to do, as though I don't spend practically all my waking hours with the child and know him and his habits inside out. but you can't tell them. or at least you can try. :lol:

sorry about AF, Cleck, but a 12-day luteal phase is definitely on the right track.

and sorry about your short lp, OC, hopefully like Pip said there will be something that can help. I have also read good things about the B vitamins.

Jean, really hope Natasha has got over being a grumpy girl and is being her usual sweet self this weekend!

thanks for the nice comments about Adam's video. he just loves that cupboard. I forsee trouble when the time comes that it's full of stuff he can't have. might have to make it his cupboard and use it to store toys. I used to have photo albums and vases and candles and stuff like that in it, so it was off limits. he is pretty much back to normal today, full of beans. phew. it is awful when he goes so weak and tired as he did, Chris always tries to say, oh he's just tired, you don't need to give him the drinks, but it will progress fast if we don't. and the other day was weird. it's not normal for any child to sleep almost 4 hours, get up, pick at lunch and then lie down exhausted again! it's not like Adam anyway.

didn't have a shift at work today, so I went swimming with my friend who has cancer. she told me a bit more about what's going on - apparently the doc doesn't want to delay the hysterectomy because although the cancer is just in the uterus, it's a big tumour so waiting for her to lose weight wouldn't be an option because the worry is it'd spread in the meantime. the doc has to take the case to some cancer board or something, to discuss the risks. but that shouldn't delay things too much. it's scary and I feel bad we're moving further away from her at a time when she needs me. and annoyingly her op is going to be at a hospital really close to where we are now (as there is an intensive care unit, it's a private hospital). I had hoped she'd be in somewhere closer to where we're moving.

I swam 16 lengths, and really took my time over them (used to do 40 but it's been ages since I went swimming, not since I went back to work last April because we always went to ladies' swimming on a Sat lunchtime); I was so tired after swiming just 2 that I had to stop and take breaks! but I enjoyed it. so tired after, though. got home and C took Adam out to the park and I went and had a bath!

packing is going well, I still haven't done any of it. :haha: We got rid of the bed frame, we were selling it (just for £25) but the person who wanted it let us down at the last minute so we just took bits of it outside this morning with a sign on saying what it was and to ring our doorbell if they wanted it, free, and sure enough someone rang and off it went. so we're hoping to fit in a trip to Ikea on Friday night after we've moved and while we still have the van, and we'll try to get a new bed and one for Adam, and maybe a wardrobe. I've never had my own wardrobe (since I left home), we just have a rail here, and a big chest of drawers. :D


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## Pippin

Cleck sorry you are out this month :hugs: glad to hear you LP is lengthening. xx

Spidey definitely drink more hun, not good for you or a potential bean and keep testing I can defo see a line on that test.

OC definitely go for the vits you should be taking folic acid now anyway, you need three months ideally on folic acid before you conceive to really help.

Shiv hope your neck feels better soon :hug:

MJ I forgot to say congrats on signing the contracts I bet you feel so relieved and I am so happy for you guys :yipee: I remember the relief well when we finally exchanged. We tried to exchange and complete on the same day and it was a nightmare as half the money got lost from our buyer and we had to stay at a friends and beg for our seller to let us dump our stuff. Madness!!!! Never again and never recommending that.


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## Mary Jo

thanks Pip. :D it's just been such a very different experience to when I bought the flat in 1999. I guess I was stressed then, but it was also because I was breaking up with the guy I had been living with, and because Christmas/Millennium holidays were coming up. I ended up exchanging, completing and moving in on Dec 22nd, which was the last possible day before the solicitors and estate agent closed for the 10-day holiday. I *was* shitting myself that it wasn't going to happen in time (and all my stuff was going to go up in a van to my ex's family's garage till January) but never did I think it would fall through. don't think it ever crossed my mind, actually. 

this time, it's been 9 weeks almost from the day our new buyer viewed the flat to the day we'll move out, which isn't too bad itself if that was all it was! I can date it all very easily because we had the offer the day I was 20 weeks, she saw the flat 4 days before, and I'll be over 28 weeks when we move. it's been such a long process. we put the flat on the market in November. had the 1st offer beginning of Feb (just about the time I got pregnant), he pulled out middle of May, and this 2nd offer 1st June. during that time we have had offers on 6 places. one was my downstairs neighbour's flat (SO glad we didn't get that), another was a small flat near here (we pulled out after C decided he wanted to leave the area), 3rd was on a really nice freehold flat that needed a load of work, the old lady selling "changed her mind" a few hours after accepting that offer - she was meant to be selling to go into a retirement flat), the 4th was on a leasehold flat that was nice but had issues with the garden, plus the owners lied to us about having found somewhere themselves; they hadn't and were not prepared to go into a rental, so we pulled out, the 5th was a bank repossession that we wouldn't have got in the end anyway because it went for more than we could afford (plus it was too big for us right now, at least it would have been great but way too much work needed doing) and the 6th was our lovely little damp woodwormy house that we're buying. :D work to do there as well but hopefully it'll be ok.

I'd never had agreed to exchange and complete on the same day again, have read too many horror stories of people being all packed up and loading the van when the whole sale fell through. I don't think I could cope with that.


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## spidey

Pippin, do you have a gut feeling for when baby will come? My gut is telling me Tuesday for you.. just long enough to be really tired of waiting 

Cleck, how is your family reacting to you bf Emma? I hope you're having a blast and getting a much deserved break too.

MJ, I'm sorry to hear that your friend will need the surgery sooner than later. How far is it from your old place to your new place? Adam is in your bedroom now isn't he? Is he going to go straight into his own room once you move?

OC- the heat and humidity are so bad right now. We got up to 106 yesterday and 100 today plus with the humidity it feels even hotter. Right now a 90 degree day isn't looking too bad :haha: I bet the indoor playground was packed!

Shiv, get DH to give you a neck massage :thumbup: I hope your neck miraculously feels better when you wake up in the morning. Have you booked your weekend away yet? If it's a fancy hotel you must share links to pictures!


I've been drinking lots of water after my scolding from Shiv :lol: Crazy me tested again this evening and its still negative, so I'll see what it says in the morning.


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## jelr

Spidey: Eeeek I see a line too, FX for you, it does sound like you are though with your nip pain and the dizzy spells so it might be just that some of the cheapo tests are duds or it might be just a little early with you OV so late in your cycle this month. Dont worry about panicking, I think we all do that. We had been trying for Natasha for 2 years and I still panicked even though I was over the moon. It is totally normal.

Cleck: Sorry to hear AF hit you, very good news that your luteul phase is longer though, so fx next month is your month and that you dont have to wait until DH comes back again. Hope you are enjoying being home.

MJ: Yay on exchanging contracts, I hope the move goes smoothly for you. Sorry to hear your friends surgery is sooner rather than later, although maybe it is better to get it over and done with so she is not spending the next few months worrying and killing herself trying to lose weight.

Shiv: I really hope your neck is better and glad to hear DH is home. I hope Sophia went down last night after, Did you tell DH I told you so :haha: - I love saying that to my DH when he thinks he knows best on things like that - I such a bitch aint I? :haha: - Did you speak to DH anymore about the home birth. Funny after we just talking about I actually found out today that there is access to home births in my area, funny the stuff you think you know :haha: - Remember I was saying that there is what is called the domino service in our area which is midwife lead, well I wasn't a candidate for it, but know others who have said it is brilliant and they are now cutting it now, so I signed an online petition to have it saved and in reading more I discovered they also do home births, I have never actually known anybody to do it here, so if they dont cut it I might just look into it next time. Mmm I wonder if they allow home water births?, although I doubt I will be a candidate again after having a hard enough time with Natasha and even when I had the follow up on my mc, the consultant said you really did have a hard time on the birth of your daughter didn't you, so I dont know if he will let me, but it is definitely all food for thought as I would love love love a water birth and I know the only way you can have one here is through a home birth and I thought they were only available if you go privately, dont know if DH would go for it though as our hospital is only 10 mins away and if you are allowed to use the dominos you are home within 6 hours anyway, but anyway we will see, sorry am thinking/waffling out loud there :haha:

Overcomer: FX your luteal phase gets longer.

Pippin: Hope your all caught up on your sleep after your horrilbe experience with the hospital and that you enjoyed your brothers visit.

Not much news from me, the mid cycle depression hasn't hit in yet, although I found myself being very short with everyone yesterday and my tolerance was much much lower :haha: - so maybe it has sorted itself out, that is the way it has been for the last few years instead of the horrible depression that I have had since the Mc and I also had it years ago. Hard to know whether it is a good or bad sign, definitely a good sign that I dont have to suffer it anymore, but wondering if it is lowering my chances of getting pregnant quickly when we do try - Must stay positive as it definitely helps things and we conceived last time without the depression or even trying, so FX we will next time too :thump:

Had a nice relaxing weekend, myself and Natasha called up to one of my friends yesterday afternoon, while DH took our our old fireplace so that the stove can be fitted and today we are all going to go over to a field day that is in our local area for the afternoon. Do you have field days in the UK or US. they are like a boot same with family fun activities also, ie, bouncy castles for the children, competitions and people have stalls to sell goods too.


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## spidey

still a bfn this morning. So what do you girls think? I'm thinking I'm not pregnant since surely these tests should be giving me a line. Like what jelr suggested, I tried an expensive first response test also and it was a bfn too. 

Since my nips are still sore I've come up with a crazy ass theory that only has 1 detail that doesn't make sense. 2 weekends ago I got an almost positive opk Friday and Saturday (almost positives = negatives in the opk world). I ran out of tests and couldn't test Sunday or Monday. I assumed I peaked Sunday and ovulated Monday. My nips were constantly hurting from the biting incident so I couldn't really go off them. During this week my nips healed and started to hurt how they do when I'm ovulating. I assumed that I was pregnant since my nips never hurt that long after suspected ovulation. SO... perhaps I didn't ovulate until Wednesday or Thursday this past week. The only thing that doesn't fit with my theory is that slight line on the pregnancy test. Today is cd40 for me, but I have a history of long cycles so I can't go off that.

jelr, I hope the worse of your mid month depression/ irritation is over. I can't think of anything here like a field day, but we do have fairs which have rides, games, food and animals and carnivals which are mostly rides, games and food :thumbup:


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## Shiv

No time to reply to everyone, but Spidey - I'd get baby dancing just incase youovulated recently. It is weird though, usually I struggle to see lines on tests if they are faint (dubious) but I can see it clearly on yours. hmmmmmmmm weird, I'd keep baby dancing and maybe test again in a few days? What does DH say?


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## Pippin

Aww MJ that sounds manic house buying but thank goodness you had this sale go through in 9 weeks. That's the best I have heard for a long long time. The quickest I've ever heard of is 5 :shock:

Spidey sorry you are getting bfn, I really hope you haven't had a chemical :( Also you can get lines if you touch an opk to a hpt whilst it's wet so make sure you keep them separate (I'm sure you did but worth remembering). Also ic are notoriously crap in my opinion despite me using them.

Jelr glad you had a nice weekend hun, we have fairs here but it's more a country thing and often run by schools as a fundraising activity. They are fun and miss having them in London, mind you they might happen it's just I don't get to know about them.


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## spidey

Pippin, thats interesting about getting a bfp by touching the 2 tests together. Luckily we dtd during this past week and also on the day that I noticed my nips getting sorer so if I did ovulate late I still stand a good chance this month :thumbup: I'll retest in the morning and then wait it out for awhile. My nips are super sore today so something's going on.


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## jelr

Spidey: Mmm yeah that is a mystery alright. I still think you could be in with a shot when your nips are so sore and the fact that you were dizzy too, does that mean that you are only 14 days dpo?? if so it could be that the test is not picking it up yet as with all my pregnancies even though I knew in my heart and soul that I was pregnant, I didn't get a positive until I was 21 dpo (cd35) with Natasha (got bfn at 15 dpo (cd29)) and 18 dpo (cd32) with last pregnancy. The first one I tested at 21 dpo (cd35) and got a negative so presumed I wasn't pregnant and was having a long cycle and then when AF still didn't arrive and my boobs were sore I tested again at 40 dpo and it was positive, so it definitely takes longer for the tests to show positive for me. I dont want to get your hopes up though as it may just be a dodgy test :( - What is your gut telling you? because I know with Natasha and the last pregnancy I just knew I was pregnant, more so with the last one as I had the same pains in my pelvic area.

Pippin: That is really interesting about the 2 tests touching, I never knew that either but then I'm very thick when it comes to all that really :haha: and dont have much experience with opk's at all.

Yeah the fairs sound a little like a field day, there was loads of animals, stalls to buy stuff, bouncy castles for the children, music and loads of bbq and ice-cream stalls and it was a charity event for the community. You can get really good field days and bad ones, being honest there wasn't much in this one, but we still enjoyed having a look around and Natasha got a blow up (think it is a deer as it has antlers, although it doesn't look anything like a deer and it is blue :haha:) toy that she can sit on and bounce and she absolutely loves it and there was a lovely playground next to it so we spent time in there too.


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## spidey

My gut tells me I'm not pregnant. Although its nice to hear that you needed to test so late to get your bfp jelr. It'll be interesting to see what my nips do in the next few days. They even hurt rubbing against my shirt... my poor nips!

I realized today that in 2 weekends is Kira's birthday! I'm still trying to plan the menu since I'm going to have her party at dinner time. She's usually much happier in the evenings than the morning. I have all my game prizes and decorations bought, and DH wasn't thrilled with any of the tool themed gifts I wanted to buy so he's making Kira's present by hand! It's going to be a wooden box with a wooden hammer, screw driver and saw, and some wooden pegs to hammer or screw into holes. I'm going to post a movie soon of Kira showing off her tool knowledge :haha:


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## spidey

Kira is a pro at sound effects :haha:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8osQ5h2y2sg


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## jelr

I would say you are probably not if you gut is telling you that your not Spidey, but then you are not out until :witch: arrives, so fingers crossed.

Ouch your nips sound sore. My boobs are sore this cycle for some reason, but it is the whole book and one more than the other, so maybe I banged it or something :haha: - Strange though.

Kira is so cute making the tool sound effects, she is brilliant at them too and does a better job than I would myself :haha:

I think that is a lovely idea for DH to make her birthday present, we are looking at a wooden kitchen for Natasha for Christmas and DH was talking about making it too, but he just wont have time, so we decided against it, but I do think it is a lovely thing for them to actually make the stuff.

Had a quiet day today, i just did some batch cooking and went as far as the supermarket and bank and played for the rest of the day, my mam is going to take Natasha tomorrow and I'm going to head into town to meet a friend for lunch and get a few bits that I need and think I will have a look around for stuff for Natasha's birthday as it is not far away now at all.


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## spidey

Jelr, a toy kitchen sounds great. Kira really likes hers and I like playing in it too, which is always a plus.

Still a negative test today so I'm certain I was only pregnant for a moment. Right now I'm waiting for my nips to stop hurting since they're a direct indicator of progesterone levels (according to my theory :haha:) and then AF will come. I hope she comes soon so I can get going on another cycle!! This 50+ day cycle is a real bitch. DH is really disappointed so next time I might not be so quick to tell him.


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## Shiv

sorry you nips are giving you mixed messages Spidey - any sign of AF today?
Your DH is so awesome to be able to make Kira's birthday present himself! i am at my parents house and can't get any sound to watch the video of Kira, but I'll watch it tomorrow when I am back home.

jelr - SOphia LOVES her play kitchen and i just know she will get a good few more years play out of it.

I am thinking of getting Sophia a little table and chairs forher birthday. She is obsessed with little chairs and is like a little removal woman, rearranging furniture. It would be her craft table, so use it for painting and drawing etc and we'd buy her a load of new crafty stuff too. Seems very dull getting her a table and chairs for her birthday though, but I know she'd love it.

MJ - how is the packing going, not long now until you ar ein your new HOUSE! Which playhouse did you get Adam. I looked at them but they all seem so damn expensive!

Cleck - thinking of you and hope you are havign fun at home still x

As for us, I have been at my parents for a couple of days as David is away all week (AGAIN! grrrrrrr). Went out for dinner with friends last night which wa snice and had the most amazing gnocchi.

My weight gain is not going as well as you MJ, i am now up at 11st 5.5 lbs, and had put on 4 lbs in the last 2 weeks again. Even though I feel I haev been pretty good. Aw well, I met with a friend last night who is 24 weeks preggo with her first. She was a size 6 pre preg (that is a US2) and still looks very slim but has already put on over 2 stone, so that made me feel better!

I am off out for dinner on Friday night with my new mummy friends, and have a playdate with them on Thursday, so that is all going well.

We went to see the local birth centre at the weekend, it was ok, but it made me think that really there isnothignon offer at a birth centre that isn't available for ahome birth (apart from a midwife if that nasty midwife is to be believed). So I think I would choose home birth over birth centre. We are going ot go and see the hospital as well so that I have seen all my options, but I am really leaning towards to a home birth now which is quite scary really. David has told his boss that he needs to be home from Holland no later than the 9th Sept (due ddate 26th), which I am happy about, and best friend has said she will come and staty from 3rd -8th Sept if I need herto (she is also a doctor, but quite frankly I think Iknow more about babies than her :dohh:) but she is the only other person that would feel comfortable having as my birth partner. So I feel quite sorted now. Just need to hope a) the next midwife I see is a bit more positive about home birth and b) that bubs decides to move from transverse to head down ASAP! 

No other real news, my bump has deffo grown, I'll post an updated photo next week, but a metrnity top that I think saw me through to the end last time is feelign decidedly snug (not stretchy material!)!

Hope everyone is ok x


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## jelr

Aww Spidey I'm sorry that you got another bpn, It sounds like either a chemical or a dodgy test, but I know even if it was for a moment you were pregnant in your head so that is disappointing for both you and DH :hugs: I really hope AF comes quick as I know from previous experience those long cycles make you feel crappy and really are a bitch when it comes to ttc. At least you have a lovely long luteal phase this time though, has Kira cut down on feeding this month?

Shiv: Glad you are enjoying being at home and catching up with friends while DH is away and glad you are starting to get a plan sorted for the birth. I really hope that the next midwife is more open to it and gives you the proper information that you need and want. I think it makes it less stressful if you have a plan anyway no matter what it is and glad your friend can come and stay with you too. Actually that is food for thought I'm really close to my friends and some from when i was a child, but I actually dont know if I would be comfortable with any of them or any of my family other than DH being my birth partner, so I'm glad you have somebody that you are comfortable with and I'm sure bubs will be still cosy at that stage and wont come until DH is home anyway.

Yeah I can't wait to get the kitchen for her as she is really into helping me at the moment, so I would say she will love it, but we are going to wait until Christmas to get it and get a few smaller bits for her birthday. We have decided on a singalong keyboard as she loves singing and music and a couple of our friends children have one and it is the first thing she goes for when we visit, we are also getting a toy shop, with some play food as she also loves shopping and at Christmas when we have the kitchen she can go shopping for the food to bring home to make the dinner :haha: - and also an inside playhouse tent thing as she really loves her outside one that she got for her birthday last year, but doesn't get enough use out of it with our weather :dohh: - (we got a bargain on our playhouse last year with smyths Shiv, do you have smyths in the UK? - It was about &#8364;70, it is smaller than most, but does the job as the rest were extremely expensive to me) - My mam is also going to get her an art table and chair as she loves colouring at the moment so at least she can sit up at the desk to do it. Other than that people have been asking what she wants and I'm saying autumn / winter clothes as she has enough toys already and doesn't play with them that much and we are getting those 3 things along with the one my mam is getting which is enough when Christmas is so near.

Well I met my friend for lunch today and went to town and came back with sod all really,I got a maxi dress and two tops in new look so I still have most of my birthday vouchers left and I couldn't find anything for Natasha to wear for her birthday as the sales are on and there really was nothing nice left :dohh: - I did get the paperplates and cupes for her party though and some of the presents as I need to go to the nearest city to smyths to get the other two and other than that trip which hopefully will get the toys and something for her to wear, I 'm pretty much sorted as I'm going much more low key than last year.


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## spidey

From all the presents Kira got this past Christmas, she's gotten the most use from her plastic picnic table. She likes to randomly sit at it throughout the day and it's also where we play with playdough and eat snacks and breakfast. At the local snowball stand they have 8 kiddie chairs that Kira busily rearranges. So Sophia isn't the only one obsessed with rearranging furniture :haha: I know Sophia and Natasha will both love their table and chairs!

Shiv, it sounds like everything is falling into place for the birth! I'm glad DH told his boss that he needed to be home by the 9th. It will be nice not having to worry about when to leave for the hospital or birthing center once you're in labor. When do you get to meet another midwife?

jelr, you'll need to plan another shopping day soon and maybe you'll find some nice things to spend your birthday money on! 

Wednesday morning Kira is having a playdate! This one is with a little boy who is 6 months older. Me and his mom went to middle and high school together and haven't seen eachother since we graduated, so we'll have lots of catching up to do. Most of my high school friends live within minutes of me but I haven't seen any for 12 years, so it's a little sad how antisocial I am :lol: 

So one of my nips no longer hurts and one still hurts but not as bad. I'm expecting AF to be on her way during this week. The whole thing has been very frustrating and emotional, but I would rather only be barely pregnant for a day then pregnant for a few weeks and then lose the pregnancy. I hope I don't have to go through this again and again as my luteal phase gets into the "almost there" zone. Kira has cut down on her feeds and there have been some days where she only nursed upon waking, nap time (before and after) and bedtime. But most days she'll have 2 or 3 other feeds thrown in there. My mom and I are synched up on our cycles and she still hasn't gotten hers this month :haha: She knows I'm late on mine but I haven't told her why.. so she's waiting for me to get my period so she can start hers. No one in my family knows I've been trying to make a baby for the past year.


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## jelr

Aww spidey I know it is the one saving grace that you didn't have a pregnancy that was lost further down the line, but still the whole thing must have been really emotional and heartbreaking, it is amazing, it only takes a split second of knowing or thinking you are pregnant to have 100 plans and dreams in your head and it is so hard to have them taken all away. FX it doesn't happen again. I hope AF does come soon so you can get on with baby dancing.

I hope Kira enjoys the playdate and so do you, it will be nice to meet with somebody that you already know and catch up over the years :thumbup:

Poor Natasha wont be able to rearrange her chair though as this one is attached to the table :haha: but still I think she will enjoy it as she loves colouring so she can sit at her own special table to do it rather than sitting on the floor or standing and leaning on one of the kitchen chairs :haha:

Well we went to the beach today as we finally got some sunshine and my two brothers took Natasha into the sea, I thought she would be terrified as most children are of the sea for the first time, but she loved it, she was splashing and wanted to go deeper, but I wouldn't let them take her any deeper than waist high and then she was still a bit apprehensive of the sand, but then found a shell and was pouring sand with it onto her legs and then onto one of my brothers and she didn't want to leave :haha: - I had forgotten how much a pain the sand is with sun cream though :dohh:


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## Shiv

Spidey - hope your body gets with the program soon, but if you aren't pregnant then i do believe that yoru body is onviously changing and therefore i think your chances of getting pregnant now are much higher.

jelr - aw it sounds like Natasha had fun on the beach. That is so brave of her going in to teh sea up to her waist, it must have been bloomin freezing.

We are back home now and i am praying for a good nights sleep from Sophia. visiting my parents is turning out to be a bit of a nightmre, i come home ten times more tired because Sophia sleeps badly there.

Sophia sang Frere Jaques today in French :haha: Just goes to show that she doesn't have a clue what she is singing about and just learns things verbatum and copies me! She has also started reciting books word for word, an dI mean whole books. She has a Mr Birthday book (mr man series) and she sits down on her own and I hear her say the story out loud, pretty much word for word, her memory is incredible. I think i am going to have to get a video and make everyone beleive she can actually read :haha:


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## Shiv

oh and Spidey I just watched that video and Kira is brilliant at sound affects, i particularly liked the saw, seriously there is no way I could do an impression of a saw that good :thumbup:


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## Mary Jo

ack, I'm sorry about the BFP turning N, Spidey, that's really upsetting. but hopefully like Shiv said it's a good sign that your body is gearing up nicely. must be so frustrating having such long and unpredictable cycles. have you ever temped or is that inconclusive for you? I found it worked well for me, I never got on with OPKs and my nips have always been a bit oblivious.

and yes, Adam is still in with us. the plan is to use his new room in the first few weeks as a dumping ground/storage room :haha: so we won't be letting him in there and he'll be in with us. this was the idea anyway, since I think it's going to be a lot of upheaval for him anyway. over the next few weeks, we'll sort things out and put his room together, with his new bed, and then let him play in there, then hope he'll take naps, and then if that goes well (and please god it does) he'll sleep there at night. obviously the aim is for him to be happy in his room by October because I don't want all 4 of us co-sleeping, at least not while baby Joel is tiny and up through the night. :lol:

as for distance - it's not actually so far (15 or so miles) but it takes about an hour to drive over from our old place to the new one, more in rush hour, less overnight or on a Sunday morning. I'd probably use public transport if I was to visit my friend in hospital.

Jean, yeah, about my friend, I have mixed feelings about the surgery. on the one hand it'll be great to have it over and done with so she can get on with recovering and the rest of her life. on the other, I wish the doc had said she could leave it and my friend could lose some weight first, a) because that would mean the cancer wasn't serious or likely to spread and b) because the surgery might be more straightforward if she was a little thinner. on balance I am nervous for her, just got to put trust in the professionals and presume they'll take as best care of her as is possible.

Shiv, packing is going well, Chris has done it all, but we've run out of boxes. my parents are coming down tomorrow to help and they're bringing us some. tomorrow afternoon C goes for the van so we can start loading it up. then Fri morning, all that'll be left is to finish loading the van and the two cars. I am hoping my mum will take Adam out while we're finishing up, so we can take the safety gates down and be in and out without worrying where he is, especially since his toys and the TV will be packed!

we got him this playhouse, it's not perfect because there aren't shutters or glass/perspex in the windows, so it's not somewhere he can get decent shelter from the rain but I think he'll like it anyway!

Jean, I bet Natasha will love a kitchen! we're getting Adam the Ikea wooden one as a gift from the baby, he is so drawn to toy kitchens at playgroup and other people's houses, so I know he'll be thrilled. we weren't planning on getting him much for his birthday but decided we had to get something for the garden, so that'll be a slightly early birthday present. he's also getting toy food from C's mum, C asked for it specifically.

sorry you didn't get much for your birthday vouchers and nothing for Natasha. I hate the sales as well, most of the shops end up like jumble sales, and I just can't be bothered. I like a bargain as much as the next person but I do like clothes shops to be nicely presented! I'm also looking forward to the autumn/winter stuff coming in, I have done no new baby shopping for clothes yet. not that I need much as I have a lot of Adam's, but the stuff I need is small baby cold weather specific, what with Adam being small in summer/early autumn when it wasn't cold.

beach sounds like fun! how far away are you from the coast? I think I remember you saying it's very windy where you are so I am thinking you are on the coast somewhere? south of Dublin? good on Natasha for being brave! I guess the water was still quite cold :haha:

Spidey, I think we'll be getting Adam a little table and chairs as well at some point, he always amazes me with how well behaved he is when he goes to C's mum's or his sister's and sits at a small table for his meals. How did the playdate go?

Shiv, hope Sophia settles down for you now you're home. were you sharing a room at your parents' or was she just not settling there? clever girl singing in French! Adam makes a noise that sounds like Twinkle Twinkle but if you didn't know what to listen for you'd be none the wiser. :lol:

oh, and I wouldn't worry about your weight gain, I have decided not to. fully expecting a big increase on the scale this weekend, since I have eaten really badly at times. Chris isn't helping - on Sunday he went over to his mother's with some boxes to be stored, and came back with McDonald's for us all. only he didn't realise I normally have 1 double cheeseburger and brought me 2! plus fries. and I ate it all. (but not much dinner later on!)

good to hear things are going well with your mummy friends, and that there is a plan all set time-wise for D being home with you. I'm sure it'll all be fine. home birth plans sound great, you're a braver woman than I am! 

oooh, just watched the sound effects video! LOVE :D Kira is so so sweet. :D 

sooo... I think Adam is either a little unsettled by the changes round here, boxes everywhere, bed gone, and now his cot is in bits, or else he's just being a typical annoying toddler, but he's been driving me mad the last couple of days. he keeps bursting out in tears whenever he is frustrated. he won't speak to ask for anything, he just cries. I find it hard to keep my temper and I know it's bad to be cross with him. and he keeps screeching as well. today really dragged, even though he napped for 3 hours. I left his nap even though I knew he was a bit tired in the hope that there wouldn't be any argument when I did put him upstairs, but I left it too long (chatting on the phone to my mum) and then we had to pop over to the doc's surgery to see if I could pick up a MatB1 form from the midwife as I forgot to get it last week but really wanted it in hand before we move (this is the form I need to apply for maternity pay from my employer). I had rung the receptionist so she knew I was coming, but still had to wait for a few minutes, and Adam started crying and screaming in the reception. I felt bad about it because the receptionists were trying to get on with calls etc, and I was rather grumpy with Adam... took him and pushed the pushchair round outside for a few mins, and he shut up but every time we went back in he screamed again. and stupid me didn't have a dummy for him (I couldn't find one as we were leaving the house, I don't know what he does with them). then when we got home, he lay straight down on the bed and fell asleep, and slept 3 hours. I hoped he'd be less screechy when he woke and he was not in a bad mood but the screeching carried right on. I can cope with that but not with the bursting into tears every couple of minutes. :( and screaming tantrums, proper good ones.

I've spent the last few days making a million (ish) phone calls about everything, so I have done a lot and don't feel too bad about leaving the packing to C! I am really organised, we have a plan for the next 2 days. I even have an appt made for my cat to see a vet first thing Monday morning to get her started on her injections (hers lapsed some years ago since she's been an indoor cat the last 11 years, she did go out in the flat I was in before here). just looking forward to being into the new house and get started on making it our home. we are planning a trip to Ikea Fri early evening (sans Adam, he can stay with my mum and dad) to buy furniture (bed, wardrobe, Adam's bed & mattress, couple of small sofas). we have to measure up before we go else I'd have been weeks ago! the rooms are really small in the new house so I can't just have everything I want, it's got to work. plus it's got to be cheap, since we're £4k down on our savings what with having to pay off the buyer for the major works. :cry:

we'll only be offline for about a day, since we'll be turned off here sometime on Fri morning, and turned on in the new house Sat afternoon (priorities! I had to make sure it'd be done quickly!) but I have 3G on my phone so I'll probably post at some point and let you all know we're in! (or not, in case there is some disaster...) 

getting excited now, even though it'll still be sad (for me) to leave my little flat after all these years.


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## jelr

Shiv: Well done to Sophia for singing Frere jacques and for reciting her book, that is brilliant - Natasha can sing the Frere jacques bit and Sonnez les matines, but to the untrained ear it sounds nothing like it :haha: - I remember the first time I sung it to her, she was completely mesmorised by it and followed my mouth without blinking and It was so funny, probably because they were words she had never heard before. I would love to see a video of Sophia reading her book, it bet she is so so cute.

Sorry to hear she is not sleeping in your parents, Natasha was the same when we were away and the same the few nights we were out and she was staying in my mams, I think partly because there was somebody in the room with her, but more so because it was different from her routine, she seems to get knocked out so easily if her routine is disrupted at all, it is the same everytime I go back to work after being off for a while, she wont sleep properly or eat properly :dohh: - hopefully if she get more used to staying there she will settle down.

Yep Natasha was definitely brave as I was in up to my calves and I was freezing I hadn't brought any swim gear as I didn't imagine she would go into the water, thankfully I had brought a spare t-shirt and shorts for her just in case she did put her toes in and splashed a bit, she wanted to stay in longer but she was shivering so I got her out and dressed and warmed up and even though I loved to see her enjoy it, I was slightly panicked that it wasn't be in control of holding her :dohh: and it was silly really as my brothers are very responsible and so aware of danger around her, but she looked so deep in it up to her waist and I hadn't brought her inflatable jacket, so I was terrified she would fall over and swallow a load of water or get an awful fright.

MJ: Yes we are about two minutes away from the coast, but it is not that accessible as the beach itself is down a clif side or about 200 wooden steps, I actually drove down today as I knew Natasha would never be able for it. We are right on the south east so you are exactly right it is the south of dublin.

I can totally understand you being concerned about your friend, I would feel the very same if it was somebody close to me, it would be nicer to here that she didn't need surgery or that she had time to lose the weight, but all you can do is keep positive that the surgeon is going for the best option and it will all work out for the best and she can move on as quick as possible and not have months of treatment, still worrying though I'm sure of that.

I would say it is probably all the disruption that is causing Adam to play up and the fact that you are both so busy and partly the age he is at too. Natasha has had a few bouts of crying for nothing as I was saying to you on fb, yesterday she started to cry as I was about to drop her over to my mam before I headed to town because she didn't want her jacket on and wanted a coat on instead and then once we hit the side of my mams house, she had another melt down of crying because she wanted to go back and go in my mams front door that was locked and she cried buckets, but was able to switch it off so quickly too when I asked her if she wanted to go in and wake up by brothers. I have noticed though that she seems to be doing it more if I am on the phone or have been on the phone or of myself and DH are talking when he comes in from work, so I think it is partly to do with not getting enough attention, do Adam is probably just knocked out with the move and hopefully will settle down once you are on settled in.

Another bad habit Natasha has gotten in to is saying ouch for everything whether it is putting on her shoes or moving her on the changing mat, she is saying oww me feet or oww me back, it was funny at first, but is starting to wear thin now that it is all day :haha: - I guess this kind of stuff is what they call the terrible twos :haha: - I just hope it is short lived, I am fine with it most of the time and find it funny, but on the days where I am tired I do find it does get to me, so you are probably on a shorter fuse yourself MJ with having pregnancy tiredness and the stress of moving. - They reckon it is the most stressful thing you can do in your life let alone to be pregnant and have a toddler as well, so dont be so hard on yourself and it is an emotional time when you are saying goodbye to an era.


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## spidey

jelr, yipee for Natasha having fun at the beach! Is she the one who didn't like sand? It sounds like she realized how fun sand was today :happydance: Kira's new thing is saying Uh Oh for everything. She was helping me bake cupcakes and we were putting those paper cupcake liners in the tray, and she pointed to every hole and said "uh oh" (12 times!) :haha: I think they get stuck on something for a week and then move onto another annoying habit :lol:

Shiv, Sophia sounds amazing with her skills! You should declare that she can read and put a video on bnb and irritate all the other moms :haha: Kira has never sang and hasn't hummed a tune either so when everyone here talks about their LO's singing, I can't even imagine it! So you must post some videos of her singing and reading!! I'm not sure if it was you who suggested singing a song and leaving out the end word... but I've been doing that and Kira still hasn't caught on :dohh: :lol:

MJ- I think your plan for slowly getting Adam in his own room is a great one because you want him to love his room and not hate it. It's too bad Adam can't be on his best behavior right now so you can pack and get things ready to move. He's probably feeling a bit stressed from all the extra activity around the house, and he can't be the center of attention right now. Plus they have so much they want to do and say, but they can't really communicate yet, so he's probably getting really frustrated. Times like this always seem to come in waves, so perhaps after a few bad days you'll have a few good ones now. 

The playdate went well! Kira and Jack were very much alike and they actually played with each other and ran around the house in circles giggling together. Jack is shy too, so it was nice having another mom who understands shy kids. We blabbed the entire time, so there was no shortage of conversation. It's been 12 years since we've talked and I wonder how much I've changed. 

Jelr, I think you said it perfectly about coming up with 100 hopes and dreams once I got my bfp. I kept telling myself the chances of having a baby next April were sooo low, but even so, I couldn't help but be hopeful. Thanks girls for your support- I haven't told anyone but DH and he's much more upset than I am so I feel like I need to comfort him. MJ, I haven't tried temping, but thats an option. I've had pretty good luck with going off my nips and confirming with opks though. I'm not sure if I would remember to take my temp in the morning, so I would have to get on a routine. The good thing about temping is I could use that as well as my nips after ovulation to see if I was indeed pregnant. So double the evidence!


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## cleckner04

At my parents so trying to catch up a bit. Spidey, I'm so sorry it turned BFN. :hugs::hugs: Have you had AF yet though? I say you're never out until AF shows. 

Okay, I was gonna talk longer but my parents are wanting to go putt-putting. Mini golf for the UK girls because I"m not sure if you call it putt-putting there. :haha: 

All is well with me. AF wrapped up 2 days ago so it's a fresh cycle now. I keep forgetting to take my vitamins though. :blush: Gotta run. Miss you girls. :hugs:


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## jelr

Cleck: glad you are having fun at home and glad :witch: is gone so you can concentrate on baby dancing for another cycle, you just reminded me I need to start taking folic acid before we start ttc. We miss you too.

Spidey: I know you are comforting DH but dont forget about yourself either, have you talked to him and told him how you feel as you will probably find it helps, as you both had the same hopes and dreams when you did get the bfp and feel the same way now that it is a bfn :hugs: - fx you dont have to go through that again and just get a bfp :thumbup:

Yeah I'm hoping it is just a phase with Natasha, we also "uh oh" here too and I dont mind that at all and I actually thought the "ouch" was funny at the start but now that it is all day about everything, it is getting a bit wearing because it is a real whining ouch and you would think she is really hurt :haha: - it is not as bad today so fx the phase is passing :haha:

I'm so glad the playdate went well and the little boy is very like Kira and that you enjoyed chatting with his mom too :thumbup: - Are you going to arrange another playdate?

Well so much for our weather, we are back to rain and drizzle today grrr, It seems we are not going to have much of a summer at all, which is such a pity as Natasha really loves playing the garden and loved the beach yesterday (oh spidey by the way, no I think it was Sophia that didn't like the sand, Natasha was a bit wary of it the first time we went, but didn't hate it either) - we still had a lovely day though and called to my friends who has the 3 girls (6, 4 1/2 and 3) and Natasha had a ball playing with them and all their toys as they were all knew and my friends lives in the country and actually has chickens and their are horses in the field next door so she really loved seeing them :thumbup: - Going to have a relaxing day at home tomorrow though as I'm wrecked after all the visiting this week and am spending the mornings getting dinner ready for that evening so we get a good few hours out after her nap and then spending the evening getting everything else done that I wasn't around to do during the day :haha: - but it is all worth it though as Natasha is having a ball everyday and it is lovely to have time when I'm not working to catch up with everybody :thumbup:


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## spidey

Cleckner, putt putt is fun :thumbup: I hope you have some nice courses there with water pits and windmills! I miss your posts Cleckner- you'll have to tell us about your trip when you get back!

Jelr- its too bad you're not having good summer weather. One summer you'll have to plan a trip here and you can get your fill of hot sunny weather. If you ever travel to the States you have a place to stay in Maryland!

MJ, I hope the unpacking is going well.

Shiv, :wave: I hope David's home this weekend and you're having fun together :thumbup:

Still no AF for me. She'll have to come eventually I suppose! I've been stressed the last few days since we found out MIL is out of money and is considering getting a reverse mortgage on her house. It's a program for old people where the bank either pays you a small amount each month, or the bank pays your mortgage for you, but after you die the bank owns your house. So me and DH are trying to figure out a way to buy the house from her, which we can afford if I keep working. I would LOVE to own her house since it's next to mine, but I would also like the freedom to stop working one day too. I seriously need to win the lottery!


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## Shiv

Been quiet in here recently - I hope everyone is ok?

MJ - so how did the move go, and how is the new house, and how has Adam found it all?

jelr - glad you are enjoying your time off and getting to catch up with your friends. The weather here has been very changable too. Today it has been SOOOOOOOOOOO ridiculously hot though. Luckily Sophia doesn't seem to mind, but I am melting!

Spidey - has your AF showed up yet? I hope that you are managing to chat to your DH about everything. I really feel your body is sorting itself out though and feel positive that you will be getting a BFP really soon.

Cleck - I miss you! When are you back home? I am glad you are having fun at home though. I bet Emma is having a ball getting lots of attention.

As for us, well David was home for the weekend, but has now gone again and I won't see him until 12th August when we meet at the hotel for our weekend off. There was only one hotel with any rooms left where we wanted to stay so we really didn't have a choice, luckily the hotel looks ok and it has a pool which is good. I can bob around whislt waiting for david to finish work on the friday. Here is a link:

https://www.thanington-hotel.co.uk/

I can't wait for a weekend but am very aware that it will be a long time before I get anytime alone for a LONG time!

I have been spending a lot of time on my hands and knees trying to get the baby to turn but I can still feel a bum and head laying across my tummy :cry: I want thebaby to turn before my 34 week midwife appt as i don't see teh point getting my hopes up about home birth when there is still a chance I will have to have a c-section.

here is my 32 week bump, it is getting big now! I put on 1lb last week which I am happy with, better than 2lbs anyway :haha: I was asked at least 3 times last week , "so you can't have long left to go?" - I just replied with "you'd think so wouldn't you":haha:



Oh and it turns our David might be working in Holland for Sophia's birthday, hurrumph!
 



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## spidey

Shiv, I'm sorry DH will be gone so long :hugs: Isn't there something you can try with a frozen bag of veggies to get the baby to flip, like the baby will try to get its head away from the veggies?? I guess on the bright side, the baby is transverse and not breech, so it only has a half turn. I remember spending hours on my hands and knees trying to keep Kira anterior since she kept wanting to lie posterior... it must be even more frustrating getting them head down since the impact on a good birth is much greater. Once the baby turns you'll have to bounce on that ball to get it stuck in there! You do look quite pregnant and seriously all bump!!!

AF is still not here. I don't feel like she's on her way either except every gas cramp makes me think she might be here. If AF arrives soon I'm debating taking a TTC break next cycle. We'll see though, even if I did TTC I doubt I would get pregnant anyway. I haven't talked to DH about the whole thing- we're actually focusing our attention of finding fun local places to go once the weather cools down, so it's been a nice distraction for both of us. Plus I'm obsessing over Kira's birthday party :lol: I think we both need a little break. We've been wishing for an April baby this entire time since April is a very nice month here with all the flowers in bloom and the bamboo shoots (DH's dream month!) so it hurt even more when it didn't happen.

So I need party food advice. My first thought was to make a very nice dinner with roast chicken, eggplant squash lasagna, salad, coleslaw, and bacon almond green beans. The party starts at 4pm and my fear is that everyone will be sitting down eating soooo slowly and we'll never have time for the party games I have planned. So now I'm thinking of serving hotdogs, potato chips and beer, LOL! People can stuff the food in their mouths while sitting on the floor if necessary and then we can get on with the party. And if anyone doesn't like the menu I will tell them to go somewhere else :haha: Hmmmm... maybe AF will arrive soon with the attitude I'm having today :rofl:


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## Shiv

A strange cycle you are having Spidey, hope it sorts itself out soon.

I think finger type food would be better, especially as then Kira can move around whilst eating as sitting down while everyone else eats is never fun for a toddler! So yep hotdogs etc, or you could go all "english"and have an afternnon tea type thing. Lots of sandwiches and cakes etc, or have a big picnic on the floor, lay down picnic rugs etc (would make it easy to clean up as well!)

What date is Kira's birthday?


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## jelr

Hey girls, sorry I have been quiet, myself and DH just stayed off the internet for the weekend as we were saying we give out about not having time together and then get stuck on the net too much in the evenings and even though we are in the same room, and are talking we are only half talking to one another, we already dont turn on the laptop on a Saturday night, but lately somebody has called and we still haven't got any time together, so this weekend it was a long weekend here so we just stayed off it until last night and even at that we were meant to stay off of it but I got a text from my friend saying she was in labour so we turned it on in case the news went up there first instead of in a text. She had a lovely baby boy and both mammy and baby are doing well, I was so excited for her though I didn't sleep a wink until the actual text came in at 5 this morning to say he was here, I haven't managed to catch up with her properly as she has moved about 3 hours away and is still in hospital so it has only been a few texts here and there as she has had family in the hospital all day. I can't wait to speak to her though and see how she is properly.

Spidey: I'm really sorry your body is still playing up and you are feeling rotten - big :hugs: - I really hope it sorts itself out and AF comes soon to stop playing with your mind, what CD are you now? Also sorry to hear about the stress about your MIL - did you decide what to do? 

I think finger food sounds perfect, whether it be hotdogs or sandwiches, it sounds much easier to prepare and clean up and I agree with Shiv, Kira will enjoy it much better and you will also have much more time to play the games. is the weather still too hot there to go outside as If you could, you could maybe bbq and have the games outside at the same time.

Shiv: :hugs: to you too, that is really cr*p that David will be away for Sophias birthday too, so much for him being away only a couple of weeks a year, it seems like he is gone more than at home at the moment, Is this only a short term thing or will it be an ongoing thing?

I think your bump looks great, in fairness you do only have 8 weeks left, so I think you look perfect for that :thumbup: I'm glad you got the hotel booked, it looks lovely, I really hope you have some lovely alone time there together.

MJ: I hope the move is going well and you are getting through the unpacking and are settling in well.

Cleck: you should be home soon, shouldn't you. I hope the trip back goes well.

Well we had a lovely weekend, we went to a park near where DH lives and had a picnic on Saturday, it wasn't sunny, but was warm and dry and Natasha got to feed the ducks and we went on a pony and trap around it and there is a lovely playground there too, we also met a friend of ours and her little boy there as her husband was working and her little girl was gone to birthday party so we arranged for the two of them to have the picnic with us and it was lovely, her little boy is 8 months older than Natasha and we really dont get to see them enough, Natasha and him were going around holding hands which was really cute. then yesterday it was raining so we baked some buns (cupcakes) and Natasha decorated them, it was actually far less messy than I expected :thumbup: and then today we went to a local garden centre as they have a new small petting farm and playground and then we went out for something to eat, so it really was a lovely weekend.

I have a sneaky suspicion though that I may be pregnant, but I'm only telling you girls and I could be completely off the wall on this one as we have been protecting, and I'm not sure when I OV'd or even if I did because I forgot to weigh myself last weekend so dont know if my weight went up as it usually does when I OV and I didn't have that mid cycle madness that I have had over the last few months just a few days of bad form, but then that could have been anything. but we dtd last Friday and Saturday (but did use protection) which would have been around the middle of my cycle if I have a 28 to 32 day cycle like I have for the last few months. Anyway what is making me wonder is my boobs have been sore all week and now I have an ache in my pelvic area all day which is exactly what I had when I was pregnant with Natasha and last time as I never get sore boobs or AF pains other than in pregnancy, the last time though I actually just knew I was pregnant and had more strechy like pains that I dont have this time and even though I have some of the symptoms I dont have them all or have that feeling that I just know like last time, so maybe it is just some crazy hormone thing going on this month that is causing the symptoms and making me read into things and from my dates I wont be CD28 until Thursday and have never gotten a postive before CD31 or 32 so there is no point in even testing until then which will be this day week. Ah I'm probably just being silly and it is some hormone thing causing my boobs to be sore and I'm probably just thinking I have AF pains because it has put the idea in my head - tell me I'm just being crazy will you as I'm terrified that I am and will only MC again because I'll stress myself out giving up smoking when pregnant instead of being off of them like I had planned to do in September - so much for a stress and worry free summer, on the other side if I am it would mean not stressing about ttc and worrying that I wont get pregnant with the pcos or it taking too long like with Natasha and I will be just gratful that it happened without the stress (that is if it all goes well and beanie stays put) - Sorry girls I know I'm babbling, but it is all going aorund and around in my head and I have only said it to DH and that is another thing that makes me think I might be as those first few weeks of hormones tend to send my head into a loop always, which it is at the moment and It is bringing all the memories and fears of another mc back. 

Okay sorry babble over :(


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## spidey

Jelr, probably too personal, but what sort of protection do you use? If a condom then try not to get your hopes up, but if you use some other less effective method then perhaps your hunches are right! I'm looking forward to you testing now!!! Your weekend sounded really nice :thumbup: That's adorable that Natasha and her little friend were holding hands. So sweet :cloud9:

Kira's birthday is on the 14th, but the party is Saturday evening on the 13th. It's way too hot here to be outside for Kira's birthday unfortunately. The temperatures are in the 90's and 100's with full humidity. The picnic on the floor idea is really good Shiv and whoever can't sit on the floor can sit on the sofa instead. I want people to eat fast otherwise they'll have excuses not to participate in the games. I'm expecting some resistance from my guests when it comes to coloring and making pipe cleaner butterflies :haha: 

no more news about buying my MIL's house. 

I don't know what to think about AF not coming yet. I'm assuming the pregnancy test and my nips were right so I guess my body is trying to figure out what to do and eventually I'll start my period. I hope its not extra heavy.


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## jelr

Thanks spidey, yes it was condoms, so thanks for putting my mind at ease :haha: that is the only thing that has made me think that I'm not because they are so safe, which is why we have protected this way since Natasha was born as I didn't want to go down the road of using anything with hormones in it as I was on the pill for years and think that contributed to it taking so long to get pregnant the first time, but with these bloody sore boobs and AF pains I was questioning it, but feel better now to hear it from somebody else.

I actually dont know whether I was hoping or panicking, in one sense I would be just so grateful to be pregnant as I know how stressful ttc can be, but on the other, I'm the type of person who likes to have things planned and everything in place and my head goes into a spin for a few days when things go differently than what I planned until I can get my head around it and re-adjust my plan ifkwim :haha: - I know I'm a fruit loop really and should be just grateful instead of panicking if I was (and I would be so so gratful once I got my head around it :haha:) - I just have an awful fear that maybe the stress I have put myself under in the past by quiting smoking once i found out I was pregnant has maybe contributed to my mc's.

Dont know what is going on with my body then as they only time I get these symptoms is when I'm pregnant, maybe the fact that I didn't have the middle of the month depression like I have since the mc just means the hormones are just doing something funny and everything is evening out this month, or maybe it is actually OV time now for me and instead of the mid month depression, my mind is just in a frenzy :haha: and I can't even weight myself to check as I have eaten so much this weekend I'm bound to be up a few lbs :haha:

That is a pity about the weather being so hot for Kira's birthday, I definitely think the idea of having an indoor picnic sounds great, your party games sound really fun. I love the idea of making butterflies out of pipe cleaners :thumbup:


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## Shiv

wowzers everyone's bodies are playing games with them this month. Jelr - I agree with SPidey that condoms when used properly are really effective, but not 100%, so you do never know. You always seem to have a gut feeling when you are pregnant, so I say go with your gut. And on the whole stress casuing your MC, I think you know that it has nothing to do with it, it is just pure damned bad luck and nothing you do or don't do affects it :hugs:

I am back up after going to bed as it is just too hot to sleep. I came down t the lounge to find a moth the size of a bat flitting around, and my cat cowered in the corner. Seriously this thing is massive, much too big for me to take a swipe at as it would make some serious mess on the wall :haha: i hate moths ever since my brother told me when i was little that they were poisonous, what a git :haha:

David's work front is all a big mess at the moment, basically the company he works for took on a contract from another company who are basically idiots. The project was supposed to take a week but because of their incompetence has now taken over 3 and is likely to take another 2. I very much doubt they will take on any more work from them as David's boss is getting seriously pissed off. He will pretty much be away from home (at leats during the week) until 9th September, but after that it should settle down a bit I hope.

His big boss has agreed to give him an extra 2 days of holiday to use as paternity leave (as he is not entitled to any as he hasn't worked there 6 months). So it isn't much, but hopefully he will take 2 weeks off, but only have to use 8 days of his own holiday, which will leave him with another few days to take before Christmas. I was hoping they would be a bit more generous, and perhaps just offer to give him statutory leave (which is 2 weeks off where they get paid about £120 a week), which would leave us more out of pocket but with lots more holiday to take so he could take some time off when baby is a month or two old. Never mind!


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## spidey

Shiv, it really sucks about DH working away from home, but if it's not the norm, then I guess it's a tiny bit easier to live with. It came at such a bad time though. Did you ever catch that gigantic moth :shock: ??

jelr- any more pregnancy signs??

so my crazy BIL killed one of these with a giant pole. It ate my entire veggie garden and was working on eating my BIL's garden so he snuck up behind it. He's lucky he wasn't bitten as they are viscous and the size of a medium dog.
https://dc-cdn.virtacore.com/2011/02/ground-hog.jpg
after he killed it, he came over my house with it :dohh: YUCK! I still need to sanitize my doorbell. I think he felt bad... and then DH told him he should stick it in the refrigerator before it goes bad. So right now a giant dead groundhog is in my MIL's fridge :rofl: She will piss her pants when she discovers it. I feel bad for the giant rodent, but in a way I'm getting some thrill out of knowing a giant rodent is in my MIL's fridge. I can't wait to hear the screams when she gets home :haha:


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## Shiv

OMG Spidey - thats hilarious! Although i must admit i would not want to find that in my fridge!

As for our giant moth, I left it locked in the conservatory last night and there was no sign of it this morning, so it is still in there somewhere - it was seriously huge, when it flew you could hear its wings flapping! 

I have been stood in the dark for the past 20 minutes with a torch held to my pubic bone :haha: I tried the frozen peas on my belly last night to no avail, so tonight was light and tmorrow i will try music to turn this baby!

i just spoke to David who has just finished work at 9.30pm having been at the farm since 6.30am - shame he is not on overtime payments - he sounded exhausted bless him.

So hot here still, Sophia is just in a nappy togo to bed and it took her over 90 minutes to settle. She had a disrupted night last night where she was up for an hour getting upset about random stuff, most to do with books that she wanted to read. i hope she sleeps through tonight, for the neighbours sake at least!

How are you feeling today jelr with regards to pregnancy?

and spidey anysign of AF yet?


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## jelr

OMG Spidey I would freak too if I found that in my fridge, although I lol when I heard it was in your MIL as I know you dont get on the best and thought that is sweet revenge :rofl: - that thing is huge, no wonder it ate half of your garden eeeekkk.

And eeek at the moth shiv, I have to say creepy crawlies dont bother me at all, but I do find moths freak me out a bit as they are so ugly :haha: - and by the sounds of that one, I would say I would have bricked myself :haha: - I hope he has just died somewhere with the heat :haha: 

Yeah it is really warm and clamy here too, we have the windows open slightly at night and both myself and DH didn't sleep well last night with it, although Natasha slept through thankfully so it doesn't seem to be bothering her, although she did get up from her nap in bad form and was really sweaty and clamy.

You would think DH's boss would give him a bit more time when he is away so much when he wasn't supposed to be, but then I guess that is bosses for you take, take, take most of the time. I'm so glad my boss is so so nice as nobody elses seems to be :thumbup: - that really takes the buscuit that he is going to be away all week until September and at such a bad time too. FX it all settles down then.

Yeah I dont know what to think really, my gut was telling me yes yesterday but then logic was telling me no so I didn't have that 100% feeling like I did before but I'm not sure if that was because the logical side of my brain was saying no and this morning I was more convinced because my arthritis was really bad in my knees and even though my arthritis affects mosts of my joints on and off, it only affects my knees when really overweight or when I'm pregnant and not just heavily pregnant but from the very, very start and this morning they were killing me, but that seems to have settled down now and my boobs are not so sore, so I'm thinking no this evening, but I still have the AF pains :shrug: being honest I'm starting to think maybe I OV'd late this month and it was something to do with that because looking back to how I was feeling yesterday, my mind was in a flap and panicked which I tend to do at the mid month time, where as today I'm back to my positive self and feel that what is meant to be will be and if I am, I will give up smoking and even though it will stress me, I will do it like I did before and really as you said shiv, I think it is bad luck mc before as I stressed myself out when giving up with Natasha and my dad was really sick and had to have open stomach surgery and we didn't know he if he was going to make it when I was pregnant on Natasha too, so if stress was my cause of mc, we wouldn't have our little woman here either and people have been far more stressed than just quiting smoking and all has ended well.

I will see how the week goes though as I still dont know 100% what my gut is telling me :haha: but then that could be more wanting it to tell me that I am now as it would be so nice and I would be so lucky if I was, but I do have a funny feeling it is more wishful thinking now at this stage and if I actually got a bfp I would probably be in a panic again.

I swear hormones dont do me any favours at all, I am so calm usually, well maybe not calm as I am a worry wort, but usually very postive and have good coping skills, well at least I think I do :haha: and then a surge or hormoes, let it be pregnacy or OV and I turn to a mess :dohh:

I actually had a lovely day, (well apart from Natasha having a few strops :haha: I had two long phone conversation with my friend, so I feel so much better now, knowing she is doing well as I was anxious to speak to her and I also met up with a very old friend, I went to school with her and we were good friends, but she moved away just after school when her parents split up and I haven't seen her in over 13 years, but we have been back in contact through fb, her dad still lives here so she was down visiting and I got a pm from her today to say she was staying a few more days and would love to call up and meet Natasha and bring her baby who is a month old and it was lovely to catch up with her, I was so nervous though and was afraid we wouldn't know what to say, but we had a great old chat and it was as if we saw each other regularly, the time went too quick though as she only got here at 4 and then I was getting dinner ready so she headed off about 5.30 which was a pity if I had known sooner I would have had something quick to cook or stuck something in the slow cooker this morning, but I didn't get the pm until lunch time today and then I sent her a text as she sent on her number and she didn't get it straight away, the baby was gorgeous also, maybe with all these babies I'm actually getting psychosomatic pregnancy symptoms :rofl: - Imagine I think I would need to see somebody :haha:


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## spidey

no word yet if she found the groundhog. I can't see how she would miss it with how large it is :haha: DH was telling me how all the parasites will flee the body and crawl around her fridge, ugh!! I told DH NO groundhogs EVER in my fridge :rofl:

Shiv, I have a mental picture of you holding a torch (flashlight) to your tummy :haha: Imagine if your neighbors saw you through your window! Fingers crossed the baby gets the message and moves!

Jelr, with all your symptoms it does sound quite promising, but don't get your hopes up just incase. I hope you're not having a psychosomatic pregnancy :haha: My mom says if she spends too much time holding a newborn, she feels milk letdown :shock:

You both must have gotten our really hot weather from a week ago. It's no fun to sleep when its hot. Fortunately we have air conditioning- couldn't live without it!

No AF yet... still waiting....


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## jelr

Eeeek spidey I'm cringing at the thoughts of all those things crawling your MIL's fridge, I think I would just get rid of the fridge after that, it would never feel clean :sick: - well have you heard any screams yet :haha:

What CD are you now, this really is a long cycle, have you tested again just in case or are your nips not sore anymore?

Shiv: How did the flashlight last night or music tonight work, Any luck?? - Yeah the neighbours will definitely be wondering with all your weird positions and sticking a flashlight to your stomach, they will think they live beside a mad woman :rofl:

Well girls the gut feeling has gone, so I know I'm not, AF ache only comes and goes and boobs only hurt now if Natasha bashes against them and not everytime I carry her or cuddle her so it was either some freak hormones or else maybe I am cracking up and it was some sort of psychosomatic symptoms :rofl:

My poor friend is still in hospital as her baby was showing signs of infection and they were afraid as her waters were gone so long that she didn't get antibiotics in labour on time, so they have to wait until his blood cultures are back tomorrow and he is the special care until so my heart goes out to her as all her family are visiting and she is stuck in the hospital and she is missing her baba so much as I can only imagine. My heart is going out to her and I hate that she lives so far away now as it is not the same over the phone, I just wish I could give her a big hug. Myself and two of our other bfs are going up in 3 weeks time to see her and the new arrival :kiss: 

I'm presuming it is strep b, but they dont tell you anything about that here, I only know anything about it from bnb and what I have googled as they dont test here and just treat you if you are showing symptoms. I had a massively high temperature in labour and was given antiobiotics and had to be treated later with antibiotics when I am home as I ended up bleeding heavily and being really sick a week later and again nothing was explained I was just told I had an injection so i'm not 100% if I already had strep b or if it was because my waters were gone so long. All I know is that the public health nurse said it was probably step b when I had my check and explained my history and that is when I googled it. My friends experience has made me think of it more though and I'm going to ask if there was a swab done in labour the next time I get pregnant and according to the AIMS Ireland site you can request a test here, but they try to put you off, so I think the next time around I'm going to ask for one, so as at least if I test positive I can get the antibiotics because it really isn't nice what she is going through. I can't belive that I didn't ask more the last time, but then I guess with being wrecked after labour and a new baby I didn't even think being honest.

The health system drives me mad here because you are treated for stuff and nothing is explained. It was always the very same when I was up and down to the rheumatologist, in the end he hated me because doctor google was my friend and I came armed with 50 million questions about my treatment and medication and the funny thing is I had appointments every 6 weeks or so I have only had one since I came off all my medication to have Natasha and have stayed off it apart from the dose of steriods i needed when Natasha was born and maybe one or two more since then, so now that I'm not their guinea pig to ploy lots of stuff into they dont want to know, although I'm not complaining as I hated sitting around the hospital half the day and it was the regional hospital which is an hour away, so it actually suits me fine not to have to go often and I want to stay in the system as I can get an appointment if I need it but there is a waiting list of a few years for new patients to see the rheumatologist, which is ridiculious - okay rant over now :haha:


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## Mary Jo

hey ladies, feels like ages since I posted, even though it's less than a week... guess a lot has happened. :haha:

any sign of AF, Spidey? and any news on the MIL's house? would that mean you had 2 houses? what would you do, knock them down and build a new massive one? eeeek at the beast in the fridge! I would completely freak out if I found that in mine. though it would take up the entire fridge as it's not very big :lol: (fridge that is, not beast)

how are you doing, Jean? I also say go with your gut feeling, but not get too hopeful because yeah, condoms are generally very reliable. but nothing is 100%. and as for stress, well, I managed to conceive and gestate thus far while enduring some not very nice moving house related stress... I have always been amazed my blood pressure isn't through the roof (it's something like 104/68, which is a little lower than when I was pregnant with Adam).

Shiv, FX your efforts will encourage baby to shift head down! at least like Spidey said, there is only a half turn to be done, and you do still have a good few weeks left. I know how worrying it is to be told they're not in a good position, I freaked out hen at my 39 or 40 week appt Adam was allegedly transverse oblique, after being nicely head down and in the same position since about 32 weeks. am really hoping this baby decides to engage sooner rather than later because I am convinced this is what led to my being induced (mildly, to hurry things up after my waters had broken) last time. he just wouldn't engage so no pressure in the right place. annoying. and I bounced like a lunatic on the ball as well. am very inspired by both Ash and Aimee having relatively quick labours with no time for epidural second time round, and really hoping for the same myself. 

eeeek, re David's work, that doesn't sound like fun at all, for any of you. :( good that he's getting some extra holiday to make up for the lack of paternity leave. Chris is only planning to take 1 week of paternity and 1 week holiday, because we can't afford the 2 weeks at £128 or whatever it is. 

and super-eek at the moth ... I don't know if my cat would have been scared or would have been a trouper and gone for it - she always used to go for moths, and I noticed they made her either sick or get diarrhoea. twice she shat or threw up on new rugs the same day I got them. so I think I'd have encouraged her away from your giant, because I have too much nice new stuff in the new house to take a chance!

speaking of the new house - the move went very well, though crikey, I was shocked by how much there was still left to do the day we moved. and by how absolutely jam-packed the massive van we hired was. but we managed, my parents were a huge help. the calls from the solicitor to say we'd first completed on the sale and then the purchase came through nice and early, which was a relief I cannot begin to explain... and then off we were! goodbye to my little flat. I did shed a small tear, but tbh, it wasn't as hard as I thought it would be. I was the last to leave, and I locked up, and I did feel sad but it's not the same place all empty. 

so we arrived at the new house, my mum and I drove over with Adam, and we got there last as we had had to drop the keys off at the estate agent and then pick the new ones up. but C had managed to open the back gate and had started unloading the van already. we were (mostly) kind of pleasantly surprised by the house (glad it didn't go the other way and be unpleasantly shocked) - no real signs of damp, so though we're not disputing there is damp and it does need a new damp proof course, it's not something we're rushing to do right away. the rooms are small but they are not ridiculously tiny. the carpet in our bedroom is in really good condition so we're not replacing it, and the one in the dining room is all fine, and though we're putting down wooden floors we're going to put the carpet up into Adam's room as the one there, while ok, is the most vile shade of orange and there's no way I'm keeping it. we thought all the carpets would have to be ripped up. the hall and stair ones do have to go but that is more because we have to take them up to treat the staircase for woodworm and we wouldn't get them back ok (plus I don't like them). the bathroom is better than we thought, we knew there was a damp problem there, and thought it would be expensive to fix, but C thinks he can do it himself as the shower is not electric after all. the kitchen is fine, the only room that nothing needs changing on. the walls in some of the rooms need to be skimmed as the plaster is marked with gouges, but no rush there. the biggest thing we have to do is have the electrics checked as the meter is from when jesus was a child, and there is a scary looking electric cable running up one wall from the outside to the meter. 

so we moved in, and then C and I went to Ikea, leaving my parents with Adam. C had put up his playhouse first so he was thrilled with that, and while we were out my parents cleared the garden (it's only small), cut the grass, which was knee high, and put the slide up. no word of a lie, but Adam spent the majority of the couple of days we were there out in the garden on the slide! he loves it! he seems so so so so happy having space to run around, he is SO much better behaved than I dreamt he'd be, for example, the dining room is just packed with boxes and stuff piled everywhere, and he's not been into it at all, not really shown any interest, whereas in the flat I couldn't leave my bag on a table and it would be down and the contents everywhere. NOTHING was safe. I realise now how small and limited his world was, and probably how bored he was. so this is a great move for him. for all of us. I think it's going to be brilliant.

so we went to Ikea and bought a 3-seat sofa and an armchair, and a wardrobe. still got to order a bed for us, one for Adam, plus mattress, and a chest of drawers, but waiting till some of the stuff C is doing has been done. we wanted the bed (ours) while we had the van but it was not in stock, grrrr. then Saturday my mum and I went and got a load more stuff, including the wooden flooring we'd ordered ages ago. Sunday, C's mum came over to see the new house, and C and I went and got more stuff, washing line and pole for me etc. and then it was decided that me and Adam should return up north with my parents Monday, so C could get on with the messy work he had to do, including the woodworm spraying, painting skirting boards, and laying flooring. he's taking next week off work, and will do some DIY then, but didn't want us away then as he still wants us to have some nice family time, so he decided if we were away this week, he'd do everything in the evenings after work (which he wouldn't do if we were around). I just couldn't deal with the thought of him being around but busy, and not just busy but busy with messy stuff. Adam loves him so much and wants to be where he is (he is fine if he's not around but he knows he is, he'll raise the roof) and I could see it being very very hard work on me if I was the one having to keep him away from paint and chemicals and saws and other items of potential danger. much easier for us just not to be there. 

it was weird to disappear just 3 days after moving in, I really didn't want to, but it's been the sensible decision. it's ok up here, as my dad works in a school he is on holiday and my mum is retired so I have help with Adam. he's been mostly very good, a lot lot better than last time we were here (Christmas), but not great at night. tonight hasn't been too terrible but last night was. he wants to open the bedroom door and go wandering and I say no, because there are no gates and he'd be down the stairs and I won't have that. we had a mega tantrum, really awful, but then he stopped and went to sleep. :lol: this was after midnight, when he'd first been sent to bed at 9pm. 

so we're coming back south on Friday, and I have this train trip to contend with. eeeek. not confident I'll cope without losing it, but what choice do I have??!

some pics... ot many, these are ones my mum took. Chris tells me he's taking progress pics of the work he's doing so I'll post them after Friday. :D

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_1575-1.jpg

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_1576-1.jpg

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_1577-1.jpg

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_1578-1.jpg

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_1579-1.jpg

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_1580-1.jpg

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_1582-1.jpg
our house is the one on the right with the sold board. :D

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_1584-1.jpg
first dinner I cooked, on Sunday (that wallpaper on the chimney breast is not long for this world)


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## spidey

MJ- I'm so glad the move went well and everything managed to go smoothly. Your backyard looks really nice and I can see why Adam loves it. Having an outdoor place for Kira is so nice for her mood and she'll ask to go outside every day rain or shine. Adam's slide and playhouse are great!! I really cannot wait to see pics of the improvements- you know how nosey I am about things like that! I bet it was hard to leave your new house so soon, but it sounds like it was for the best. When DH does things around the house its 5 times as much work for me since Kira throws fits when she can't be involved with daddy, so I can completely understand why it was smarter to take Adam to your parents for the week. Plus you would want to unpack and it would be impossible having to run after Adam.

If we bought MIL's house, we would own 2. She would live there rent free until she died and then we could bulldoze it or rent it out. She's 65 now, but I suspect she'll live to be 95 atleast... so I'll be old by the time it's mine :lol: She was not too pleased with the groundhog in her fridge. As far as I know, it's still there :lol: but she banned my BIL from butchering it or cooking it in the house :haha: She's very dramatic so she stood out in the back corner of her backyard, which is the only part of her backyard that I can see from my windows and she put on a big emotional show by hold her head and crying. It's awful of me, but when she puts on drama shows like that I can't help but laugh. She does it ALL the time though. Our houses are quite close, so if she knows we're outside, she'll suddenly start bawling at top volume from inside her house. She'll actually stand in the street and put on these shows too- I would be soooooo embarrassed if she were my mom and I was 13 years old.

jelr- I wonder why you had sore boobs for so long this month. I'm sorry about your friend. I was strep B positive and got antibiotics while in labor. But once Kira had her health problems, they suspected she had contracted strep B despite my antibiotic treatment and started antibiotics on her too, so apparently the antibiotics during labor aren't 100% protective. But taking the antibiotics were so easy and I would do it again if I tested positive next time. I hope your friends baby can go home asap! Kira needed a 10 day course of antibiotics and they had a home health nurse come and administer them thru her IV the last couple days so she could come home a little early. I hope they can do the same for your friend.

I think AF should come soon... I'm being extra mean to DH today :haha: and I've been extra emotional. I've been thinking about how Kira is almost 2 and thinking back to what I was doing 2 years ago since the 4th was my due date, and crying about it. I'm tearing up just typing it!  LOL, I am sooo emotional right now! And I've been thinking about how I thought Kira wasn't going to live and then I really start to bawl. So AF better come soon so my brain starts thinking normal again! I did test a few days ago and it's still negative, plus my nips aren't hurting. 

Shiv, any success on getting baby to turn?


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## jelr

MJ: I'm so glad the move went well, it sounds like you are making great progress, I think you did the right thing taking Adam out of the way, I always do the same here, because you would want eyes in the back of your head to make sure they dont touch anything dangerous and they dont understand at all why they can't "help" so it is only a recipe for disaster to have a toddler in the middle of it. Honestly dont worry about your train journey as it will all be fine, you are so prepared and armed with stuff, he wont have a minute to misbehave :thumbup:

It sounds like Adam is going to love the new house with all the extra freedom, he probably just didn't have enough space to run around and be a little boy in when you were in the flat, so instead had to find other mischief to get up to :haha: - His playhouse and slide are lovely, the house if very similar to Natashas and she loves it and more so the slide, hers is a little smaller though and she has now taken to sliding down head first, but thankfully it is so small she is not in any danger doing this as the first time she did it I nearly had a heart attack :haha:

I love the pictures, you all looks so happy in your new home :thumbup:

Spidey: I'm so sorry you are feeling so emotional, It is no wonder when you are waiting on AF for so long, I bloody hate hormones, I swear they turn my brain into a somebody else :haha: so I completely understand. I'm also a little anxious about Natasha turning 2 because that age to me seems more like a little girl age than a toddler :nope: and the time is going so quickly. I can't believe your MIL kept her fridge let alone still has that thing in it eeeeeekkkkkkk, so I think you could be right on the little drama, because I would have made your BIL take the whole lot out, so it can't be bothering her that much :haha:

Unfortunately there isn't a hope of my friend getting the antibiotics admisistered at home as our healthcare system doesn't have enough staff in it to manage the hospitals at the moment with all the cut backs, so there is no hope of a home visit. She still didn't get the results of the bloods back tonight, but they reckon that is a good sign as if it was bad news, they would have come up on the computer quicker, although it is looking like she will still be in until at least Sunday to monitor him, the poor thing my heart goes out to her, I wish I could make it all better for her. I can't imagine going through that or what you did when Kira was in special care and not being beside you, yeah I think I would definitely like to know if I had strep b next time around and just get the antibiotics as I didn't even notice I was getting them, I had already been hooked up to an IV to induce me as my labour wasn't progressing and my waters were gone so long.

Well girls I'm definitely not pregnant and not having a psychosomatic pregnancy either :haha: - I woke up the is morning and all pain is gone from my boobs and I even managed to do my exercises without holding my chest to stop the pain (I would say my neighbours would have had a right laugh at me last week, I didn't even attempt to exercise this week as they were just too sore) so my gut was telling me a definite no no, which if I'm honest I'm a little disappointed but then i'm okay with it too because I can just go back to the plan of a lovely stress free summer with Natasha and concentrate on the smoking first in September, although it would have been nice to not even have to ttc :haha:

Anyway then I spent the day with really bad cramps and thought it was going to end up on the loo all day, but nothing and I also had an awful headache and then this afternoon :witch: decided to appear so I'm guessing it has all been some weird hormonal thing my body has been doing, so strange though as I have never gotten AF pains since I was in my teens and AF started first and I have never had sore boobs except in pregnancy and especially for nearly 2 weeks and funnily enough i had a perfect 28 day cycle again which I did have for the first two months after the mc, but other than that I have always had at least a 30 day cycle and more so 32 days (even then it is usually only if I'm on low carb that I even get that short of a cycle) when I'm not on the pill, so I have no idea what it is all about. I'm hoping it doesn't happen again, although i'm trying to take the good from it and say it has to be a good sign that I'm having regular cycles regarding the pcos and hopefully the fact that I didn't have the really bad mid cycle depression this time like the other cycles after the mc that hopefully it is just my body getting back to full working order after the mc and that hopefully ttc will go smoothly.

Shiv: I see from fb you are sitting with the torch to your belly again, any luck this time?


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## spidey

jelr, that's bizarre your cycle was so different this time. It'll be interesting to see how it is next cycle and if you skip over your mid month depression again. I use to have awful cramps each month but since having Kira I don't get cramps anymore. It's strange how things can change overtime.

I'm still waiting for AF. At some point I'll start getting concerned about it. I was in a much better mood today although I felt really ugly, so she must be on her way. My skin and hair always look awful right before AF arrives.

Does anyone have fun plans for the weekend? I'm baking my MIL a cake since her 65th birthday is on the 8th. It's going to be a cake based off of a Smith Island cake, which is the official cake of Maryland. The original cake has 9 thin layers of white cake with chocolate frosting in between. I'm going to aim for 6 layers, because I doubt I'll have skill to carve out 9 layers :haha: I'll post a picture if it turns out. We're also taking Kira to a carnival for the first time and I can't wait to see if she'll get on the rides.


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## spidey

AF finally came! 52 day cycle this time, but I suppose it could be worse. I'm having awful cramps with this one too so I jinxed myself when I said I don't get cramps anymore :haha:


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## Shiv

MJ - so glad the move went smoothly. I love pictures, you look incredibly proud of your clothes line! Adam's playhouse looks great, I think Sophia would love it too.

Also glad the train journey went well, you just can't bank on any behaviour from our Lo's can you!

Did C manage to get all his jobs done when you were away?

JELR - sorry your friend is having such a tough time in hospital, I hope she gets to go home with her LO soon.

So AF got you, I hope youa aren't disapointed. Enjoy your summer and then get to it come September.

Spidey - you should make the cake for your MiL in the shape of a groudhog!

AF got you too, weird cycle, but and Iknow you aren't going to like this.......perhaps the cramps (as horrible as they are) are a sign that things are getting back to how they were pre Kira and therefore you are back to being fertile again after breastfeeding etc?

Cleck - i have been enjoying looking at your photos on fb

As for me well David was allowed home for a whole 24 hours, so he got back yesterday evening and left again today. And he got food poisoning from a take-away last night so has been in bed the whole time he was here! I felt really bad for him, but could have also cried for myself as i was SO tired and could have done with some rest! Never mind. SO he is away again now until I meet him at the hotel on Friday.

I have decided to book myself in for a fish pedicure thing on Friday after I drop Sophia off at my parents. i quite like the idea of little fishies nibbling all my dry skin and leaving them super soft, then I am gonna get my toenails painted a pretty bright colour to try to detract from my cankles!

I have been doing lots of things to try to turn baby (David's helpful suggestion was that he had read that sex was a good way to get baby to turn, I did nottake him up on his offer, and ver glad too seeing as a few hours later her got sick!). But baby has not turned. I am guessing that unless baby decides to do it of his own free will, my ice/torch/all fours action is not going to help. I am sad and really think that baby will stay transverse, which I have read could mean that they admit me to hospital from 36 weeks until they do c-section to ensure that if my waters break I don;t get cord prolapse. Quite frankly, being admitted is not an option with David not here so they will have to go jump for that one!

My parents are coming over for lunch tomorrow, I am doing roast lamb, I don;t usually do raost lamb but last time I did it SOphia gobbled an adult sized portion of lamb and begged for me, and she is not a massive meat fan really so i enjoy watching her enjoy it.

Oh I had an amazing dinner tonight, I seriously haven't enjoyed a meal so much in ages ................scrambled egg on toast with bacon and sausage! yum, not terribly nutritious but never mind, I REALLY enjoyed it and so did Sophia!

Right well I am off to bed, to fall asleep with a torch on my belly (I know just in case it works!), I hope you are all having lovely weekends x


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## Shiv

ooooooooh I just did a long post and it said that it won't be visible until mods have approved it, I can't think of anything even particularly interesting that was in it. Unless there was an unfortunate typo somewhere!

Lets see if it gets approved!


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## spidey

aww, that is awful David got sick to ruin his 24 hours at home. So you had 2 babies instead of just one :haha:

A fish pedicure sounds really fun! I've heard about them, but I'm not sure they have them here. 

That seems a little extreme to stick you in the hospital from 36 weeks on if the baby isn't head down just to prevent a prolapsed cord. I have no idea who told me- perhaps my midwife- that if your waters break and you can feel the cord coming out of you, you're supposed to invert yourself and call for an ambulance. It prevents the babies weight from compressing the cord. If the baby doesn't want to turn with all your tricks, then maybe you're right and the baby isn't going to turn (for now). The position of the placenta might make it more uncomfortable to be head down at this point.

Kira has been cutting back her bf pretty heavily, so it's quite possible the cramps are a sign my body is going back to pre-Kira days. I'm still on the fence about skipping ttc this month, but I have a feeling once my nips get sore and I get a positive opk, I'll be ready to baby dance again!

Tomorrow is cake baking day! I need to whip my egg whites into soft peaks, something I have never done before!! LOL about making a groundhog shaped cake. If my multi layer cake is a disaster that will be my backup plan :haha:


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## cleckner04

Hey girls. :wave: I've been around but not really in the mood for BnB lately. I'm glad you guys like my facebook photos. We've been staying pretty busy since being back. Oddly enough, we are suddenly hanging out with our neighbors across the cul de sac and the ones attached to us occasionally as well. Every night this weekend we've all hung out in the front while the kids play in the cul de sac area. They have power wheels vehicles so the kids like driving them. Emma loves them too but she mostly just rides because she can't figure out the pedal. I've spoken to the across the street neighbor before but never like this. She keeps saying 'thanks for hanging out with us now that you are leaving in four months'. :lol: 

I'm cutting Emma back on the boob too. But she's not doing it on her own, I'm pushing the issue myself. Although she just fed all morning this morning while we were still in bed. :roll: I won't let her have boob again today if I can help it though. She hasnt' even had it to go to bed for the past two nights. We have kept her up real late and corey walks her around until she falls asleep. But tonight DH has duty so I'm on my own with it. We will see how it goes because of course she immediately grabs for my shirt trying to get my boob out. I'm just done with it though. She's 2 in a few days and that was my goal and now I want to stop. I'm thinking I may go the lemon juice on the nipple route so she notices that it tastes bad and than won't want it anymore. Because I don't want it to be traumatic for her. 

I've still been asking her if she wants to sit on the potty and nothing yet. She flat out tells me no. :rofl: She asked for a diaper today too when I asked if she has to go pee pee. So I think I have a very stubborn little girl on my hands. The neighbors next to us have a daughter that is only 3 months older than Emma but she's already fully potty trained so it kinda makes me feel like I'm a bad lazy mother. But I really don't know how to train Emma. She just refuses me flat out. 

And in ttc news, theres no news. :haha: We've barely had a chance to :sex: at all this month. Emma is a total cockblock. :growlmad: The other night every single time we tried to have sex Emma would wake up upstairs and interrupt us. We were so pissed off and tried several times before finally just giving up and going to sleep. But the next night we put her down in her own bed and she slept there until 7am. :shock: So she made up for it I guess. :haha: I have no clue where I am in my cycle. I haven't kept track this month either. I just found out my attached neighbor is pregnant and it was an accidental pregnancy so that is like a kick in the gut. :roll: She said her first daughter wasn't planned either. And her second daughter took only 1 month of trying. I just stood there thinking 'way to rub it in bitch'. :lol: 



Shiv- I hope that LO turns for you soon. I hope they won't try to make you stay in a hospital. And hopefully you can avoid a c-section. It's probably a scary thought since you had a vaginal birth the first time. I never knew the UK girls called a flashlight a torch. When I first read about you holding a torch to your belly I was thinking 'doesn't that hurt'. :rofl: 

spidey- :sick: about the groundhog. I love Shiv's idea of making a groundhog cake. :rofl: Sorry AF hit you and the testing turned negative for you. :( I think you should still try this month. :D 

jelr- Sorry AF hit you too. :hugs: 

MJ- Your new house looks really cute. I love the backyard. Looks like Adam has a great little play area. :thumbup:


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## jelr

Spidey: Sorry Af got you and that the cramps were bad, I do think like shiv though that it might be a sign that you body is getting back to normal :thumbup: Ha ha that would be funny to do a ground hog cake, hope it all went well.

Shiv: that is crappy that they will keep you in hospital if baby is transverse, I do know they do that here too as when my friends baby was transverse she was brought in at 38 weeks i think, 36 does sound like a long time :nope: - sure if the baby is not early, will they wait and schedule a c-section after 40 weeks or before as surely they wont keep you in there for a month. FX baby turns before then so you dont have any hospital stay :thumbup: - my friends baby turned 2 days after being in hospital. Poor David with food poisoning, I hope he is better now, that is a real pain when you had so little time together already. I hope you have a great weekend, I would love to know why your post had to be checked, I can't see anything in it that might cause any offense :shrug:

Cleck: :wave: - good to see you. Sounds like you are having fun getting to know the neightbours. Sorry to hear Emma is being a cockblock :haha: - Natasha woke up screaming the other night, right at the crucial moment :dohh: - nothing as bad :haha: - I hope weaning Emma off the bf goes smoothly and is not too traumatic for you both. I wouldn't worry about the potty training, I tried with Natasha and she wasn't ready at all, it is like everything they will do it when they are ready and it has nothing to do with you being lazy. From what I have seen here anyway, the majority dont do it until 2 and a half.

Well not much from me, cramps finally went after 2 days, I'm a bit dissapointed, but not too much as I'm really really enjoying all the stress free time with Natasha, we did loads of painting on Friday, yesterday we headed to the city and got her something to wear for her birthday and we picked out her toys, we forgot to take the pram out of the boot and didn't want to let her see them on by putting them on the seat beside her :haha: - so Dh will be down that way during the week for work and will pick them up and today we just had a lazy day around the house. I will probably jinx myself now, but she is in such a lovely routine at the moment with me off of work and is sleeping through without crying in her sleep most nights and she is eating everything I give her and more, although I have a funny feeling she is going through a growth spurt too, she is eating so much and it is not just being content that I'm at home with her all day :haha: - She is such a sweet little thing and loves cuddling so much now and gives us hugs and kisses all day long and is finally actually cuddling in at every oppertunity she gets, so I'm loving that and we are getting more and more sentances every day, even funny ones. Yesterday before we headed off DH had been doing some work around the house and said I must go and change and she said "change daddy bum bum" - we laughted so much :haha: - I just wish I could win the lotto and be at home everyday with her.


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## spidey

It's nice having you back Cleckner! How did your family react to Emma BF during the visit? Kira's been veeeeeeery slowly cutting down on her booby. Some days she only wants it upon waking, nap time and bed time. We still have days where she must not feel well or needs more reassurance and gets much more booby, but I can see a trend towards completely weaning probably over the next 8-12 months I'd say. I think if I get pregnant and my nips hurt the way they did this time, I might have to force weaning. Don't worry about the potty training thing. Kira's not ready yet either and she doesn't want to sit on the potty and would rather pee on the floor, so I'm not forcing the issue. :haha: I will ask "do you want to sit on the potty?" and she shakes her head no, and then 10 seconds later will pee on the floor and splash her hand around in it. :dohh:

LOL about all the cockblocking :haha: Luckily (knock on wood) Kira hasn't interrupted anything yet :lol:

jelr, thats wonderful you and Natasha are having a great time this summer, and yippee for the cuddles. I really love this age and even though we're in the terrible twos, it seems like I have a much easier time figuring out what Kira wants and it's really fun seeing how fast she learns. When your mom watches Natasha again she'll be amazed at how different she is. You'll have to take another video of Natasha and her talking. It's the cutest thing when kids this little can come up with whole sentences! 

I didn't get any cleaning done this weekend, but I did make the cake for MIL, although only 4 layers instead of 9. I can't wait till Kira's party this weekend! I made a huge checklist of things I need to do over the next 6 days :blush:


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## jelr

well done on the cake spidey, I would have a clue when it comes to baking, so I would be lucky to get one layer :haha:

yeah I really love this age too, they are so cute and funny and as you said I find it much easier, I think I found 12-18 months the hardest really, but I think that was a lot to do with back teeth and not a lot of sleep :dohh:, but no all in all they are better able to communicate and it does make things so much easier.

I must actually get another video as we haven't done one in ages. OMG I can't believe Kiras birthday is only a week away, Natashas is 2 and I really need to get my finger out and get organised :haha: - Well enjoy all the preperations :thumbup:


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## Shiv

Spidey - glad the cake went well, would love to see a picture!

Kira's birthday is coming around quick, but sounds like you are well on top of t too

Cleck - hello! Nice to get a lovely long post from you. It sound sfun hanging out with your neighbours. THey aren't the weird ones from nextdoor are they?

It sounds like you are ready to wean Emma, and if she isn;t protesting too much at bedtime then I would say she is ready fo ready for it too. I hope it goes smoothly for you both. How did it go getting her to sleep without Corey there?

Potty trainig - SOphia isn't ready either. I honestly think it is the exception to have them trained by two rather than the other way round. I have read that if you leave it until they are truly ready then youc an have the job done in a week. SO I am waiting until SOphia can pretty much say, mummy I need wee, until that day the potty is there for her to sit on if she chooses to. But mainly she puts her soft toys on it and says "bunny is having a ppoo on the potty" or the like!

Sorry you are not gettin as much chnace to do the deed, hopefully Emma will sleep in her bed more and more which will help.

Did you think I had been holding a big flame to my belly? That made me laugh!Saying that, if it would make bubs move I'd give it a go!

How did your weight maintaining go whilst back home?

Jelr - glad that Natasha is being a dream for you, I wonder if she was being a nightmare if you;d be as keen to be athome 24/7 with her!

MJ - eek at the riots, I am so glad you moved from Lewisham! 

As for us well. Sophia's birthday is next Friday and I haev planned nothing! I don't even know if David will be here for it. She is having a joint party on the Saturday with her NCT (antenatal group) friends back in Kent, so I am not too worried if she doesn't have one just for her. Must get to ordering her presents though.

Weigh in this week went well, just a quater pound gain, which evens out the 5.5lbs from the previous 3 weeks a little bit! I have so far put on 26lbs at 33 weeks, so I am ok with that. I am 11st 7lbs so still just about on target for 12stone overall.

I need to order my baby carriers for the new baby. I think I am going to get a babasling and a babyhawk. CLeck - you have a babyhawk don;t you? Do you rate it?

Only 4 nights until my weekend away! hurrah

oh and here is a pic of my bump just fo ryou Cleck as I know you don;t see the fb group anymore.Check out the weird shape - awkward baby - must be a boy!
 



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## jelr

Shiv: you are totally right, if she was a nightmare I would probably be praying to go back to work :haha: - Ah no it is just nice to have time really and not always running around like a headless chicken :haha:

Natasha does the very same with her potty and her minnie mouse and today actually started to get toilet paper for Minnie to wipe her bum with :haha:

I really hope David gets home for Sophias birthday and that that baby turns for you, I'm willing it to turn so badly for you :thumbup:

MJ: I was thinking of you tonight when I was watching sky news and Lewisham was mentioned, I'm so glad you moved just in time :thumbup: - I just hope little brother stays safe, it is mental.


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## spidey

Shiv, do you know what you're buying Sohia yet? In the other thread I posted a link to the doll house I finally decided to get, so Kira's getting that as well as her wooden tools :thumbup: I hope David can be home for her birthday.

I have a crazy idea, but they do sell hypnosis cds to help turn a baby head down. If you're really desperate, it might be worth a try. I'm going to get a reputation for recommending hypnosis for everything :haha: 

I know I would be just as obsessed as you regarding turning the baby. I was very obsessed with keeping Kira in the right position and never dared to recline in those last 2 months. I always slept on my left side and spent hours on my hands and knees. Days after my due date she turned fully posterior and I was devastated. I actually spent the entire night on my hands and knees supported by pillows and slept as much as I could in that position. It was very freeing once I wasn't pregnant anymore. 

jelr, Natasha is having a pretty big party isn't she? You better start making a check list! :haha:


I managed to check some of the to do's off the birthday checklist this evening!


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## cleckner04

Shiv- First of all, your bump is SOOO cute! I was just getting ready to ask everyone to post bump piccies since I'm missing out on the FB group. The bump photos is all I'm really missing though, the other pregnancy related chatter I could do without. :haha: How does your bump differ to the bump you had with Sophia? Shaped totally different this time around? I have 3 babyhawks actually. :blush: 2 normal mei tai ones and an oh snap! also. I HIGHLY recommend them. I tried a normal sling type of carrier and Emma didn't like it and I have a moby wrap as well. I loved the moby at first but as Emma got bigger it had to be retied frequently. I think a moby would be excellent for a newborn though because it's so snug and cozy. I didn't start wearing Emma until she was around 6-7 months old though. Well I started out trying with the sling carrier but she refused so I gave up until I came across the moby and mei tai kinds. I still use my babyhawk oh snap. It's great because it never has to be tightened with the weight of Emma since it has buckles instead of ties. I don't think it'd be comfortable as a front carrier though so I'd say a regular babyhawk would be best for the 'baby' months when you front carry. 

My weight skyrocketed while back home. I forgot to mention that to you guys. :blush: I'm trying to not think of it too much. :haha: I went from 187 up to 198. :shock: But I think a lot of it was water weight because it was so hot there and I kept forgetting to drink lots of water. I started drinking more water since being back and I'm down to 192. And today I used myfitnesspal for the first time since being back so I'm hoping it won't take long to get back down to 187. And than down to 180 eventually. :haha: If I don't get pregnant by november than I am going to get down to 160. That's my long term goal. 


I'm pretty sure I've ovulated today. I haven't been using my fertility monitor but I felt cramping for about half an hour earlier while cooking dinner. DH and I tried to sneak off to :sex: on the stairway while Emma watched cartoons but she snuck up behind us and said 'hey!'. :rofl::rofl::rofl: DH about had a heart attack. He said we should put a bell around her neck. :rofl: I think I'm already out this month because we seriously haven't had a chance to do it more than 3 times in the past week. 


Trying to wean isn't going the best. Emma is on my right now. :dohh: Although she's falling asleep on me so I should probably put her down and go :sex: with DH. :haha: Last night she ended up having five minutes of boob before rolling over and falling asleep. But she only had it in the morning and for bed. So that is amazing. Today she had morning and just now and hopefully DH will be able to walk around with her until she falls asleep. 

Gonna go see if I can lay her down now. :muaha:


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## Mary Jo

cleckner04 said:


> I think I'm already out this month because we seriously haven't had a chance to do it more than 3 times in the past week.

I'll come back and do proper replies but just wanted to pick up on this... dear lord! we only did it once in the entire MONTH and I was certain we had no chance, and here I am almost 30 weeks along...

3 times in a week? jesus. neither C or I have the energy for anything close to that! :haha:


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## cleckner04

:rofl: We usually manage about 5 times a week. But don't forget we have to make up for the 7 months of celibacy a year. :haha:


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## jelr

Mother of God Cleck how can you walk after 5 times a week :rofl: - Twice a week is all we ever manage it and that is usually at the weekends :haha: - Remember it only takes once to catch that eggy, so you would never know :thumbup:

I think you have done great on the weight now that the water has sorted itself out it realy is only 5lbs and that is great after being away and at so many family gatherings, so well done you :thumbup:

MJ and Shiv: None of the riots have moved near you have they, I only got to see a bit of sky news this evening and know it has moved further than central London, but didn't get to see much more. Hope you are both safe and well away from it. Scary stuff.

Spidey: I know I really do need to make a big checklist :haha: - Well I'm not even sure who is coming yet, but we have invited both families and a few friends, but I'm still waiting on replies. I have bought the paper plates and some decorations and DH is getting her birthday presents during the week, and I have just ordered her birthday card, so not much to do really only organise the food and I can't do that until I have more idea on numbers. Not long left for you now, are you excited?

We have the plumbers in fitting the new stove, so myself and Natasha headed to town today and got her new shoes as she had grown out of her summer ones, so hopefully these will do for the last few weeks and then we called to my dad, who I think I told you all before is an alcoholic and had to have major surgery when I was pregnant on Natasha, but has been off the drink since (well so I thought), I have had my suspicions over the last month or so, but I didn't ask out straight as I decided when Natasha was born that I was going to stick my head in the sand as if the surgery that he went through couldn't stop him, I definitely couldn't and I had spent so many years stressing and worrying about it and didn't want that going on now that I had a child of my own to look after, but today when I called, when I had rang the bell with Natasha in the car in the drive as I didn't want to take her out if he wasn't it, so when I was taking her out of the car, all I could hear was the clank of bottles, so I said it out straight, what was all the clanking of bottles, hiding the evidence and he said yes :dohh: - I am so annoyed with him right now, I know how much of a battle it is to stay off of it, but he hasn't really tried really, he only went to aa once about 20 years ago and it was the local one here and there were only two others, so he has decided it is not for him, instead of trying again and going to one in the town that there are loads of people at and not two locals that he knows. I dont know how he can be so selfish and not at least try his hardest. I gave him a bit of an earful and said it was very unfair that Natasha loved her grandad to bits and could he not even try for her seeing as I obviously was never good enough to try for and he said, it was all fine that it was only a weekend thing and it wouldn't get out of control again - eh he was told that it would definitely kill him early as it has already done so much damage to his pancreas, ffs they took out of huge tumour already because of it, his theory is when your time is up, it is up and that the pain we will feel of his loss will be as bad if it is tomorrow or in 20 years, never mind the fact that my youngest brother hasn't even turned 21 or that Natasha is so young and should have years to love him. Grr it drives me nuts, anyway rant over and I'm going to try and put it to the back of my mind again now because the one thing I have learned is that he has to want to do it himself and I can't make him, so I really dont want to stress about it like I have in the past, but it does make me so mad and it does worry me to death.


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## spidey

jelr, thats awful to watch someone like that drink their life away and selfish too since he'll leave this earth too early if he keeps it up :hugs: You can't stop him and you shouldn't feel guilty about it- he's the one who needs to decide to stop. Even if you took away his alcohol he'll go out and get more. 

We never dtd 5 times a week either.. maybe 2 if we're lucky. The only time we have is in the evening after Kira goes to bed, and half the nights DH is out at his various meetings or playing games over the internet with my brother. I wouldn't dare dream of :sex: on the stairs while Kira watched tv :rofl:

Cleckner, It sounds like you're doing a great job cutting back the booby. It might be hard on her to stop cold turkey, so if you have it cut down to just sleepy times you should be really proud! I read somewhere that if you make a change (ie, cut out feeds, change the bedtime routine etc) and the next morning the child is happy and acting normal, then you can be certain you've made the right decision :thumbup: In the past I've tried forcing a bf cutback and it has always backfired on me with a VERY cranky sour Kira. So I'm feeling really good about Kira's decision to cut back on feeds by herself since I've had no luck taking charge of it myself.

MJ- I hope the unpacking is going well!!

I really liked the Moby for the newborn stage too. I used mine from around 3 weeks until about 10 months for more than an hour each day and thats the only thing I used when I took Kira shopping since it was easy to bf in too.


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## Shiv

Happy Birthday Emma - I hope you all have a great day Cleck.

Sophia had a wee in her potty today - unfortunately she still had leggings on:haha: Sheis being really awkward and refusing to wear nappies a lot. So I let her run around naked but every 2 minutes I am saying "remember if you need a wee wee or a poo you must sit on your potty", which she usually says no to. Anyway, today she was naked and put some leggings on whilst I was making dinner in another room, then I hear "mummy, I've done a wee in my potty" - so I run into the lounge and she is sat on her potty with her leggings still up. I stand her up and there is a big wet patch on her leggings and some wee has made it through them to the potty :haha:

I should be happy that she went on her potty to wee,but really I didn;t want to potty train her until well after the new baby was born. I amnot going to officially do anything, if she wants to be naked then I'll let her and see what happens!

I am away for my weekend off tomorrow so won't be on until Sunday night. Everyone have great weekends.

Spidey - I hope Kira's birthday party goes really well and can't wait to see some photos!


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## jelr

thanks spidey, unfortunately I do feel guilty sometimes and think maybe I should call to him more or do more, but I do know deep down I have done all I can and have tried everything and that he has to want it himself and all I can do is support him when he does. I guess I'm scared too that he is going to land back in hospital, number one because I dont want to see him sick or lose him and also because I'm the only one out of 7 of us that really has much time for him and has forgiven him for everything he put the family through when we were younger, so I was the only one who looked after him over the 2 years that he spent in and out of hospital and I spent most of my evenings visiting him when he was in hospital because I felt so bad for him that none of the others were, but if that happens again I wont be in a position to do that as I have Natasha to look after and I know I will end up wracked with guilt then. All I can do is hope for the best and that he will find his way or that it wont spiral out of control this time :dohh:

In case I'm not in over the weekend, I want to wish Kira a happy birthday and hope you all have a fantastic day. :thumbup: :hugs: I can't wait to see photos either.

Shiv: Well done Sophia for doing a wee in her potty, even if it was through leggings :haha: - I think you are doing the right thing and just do it unofficially and if she goes on it she goes on it and if she doesn't then you can sort it all after the new baby is here, on the other side of it I know you didn't want to do it until after the baby is born, but if she is ready now and keeps on going without you really officially training her, wouldn't it be great that it will be all done stress free before the baby comes :thumbup:

I hope you have a fantastic weekend away, you deserve it after all the stress you have had this year, and you and David definitely deserve some time together :thumbup::hugs:

Cleck: Happy Birthday to Emma today, I hope you are all having a fantastic day. :thumbup: :hugs: I can't wait to see your photos either.

Well hope you all have a fantastic weekend, we are going to town on Saturday morning to buy all the goodies for Natasha's party and then I have a girls night with some friends and DH a boys night as friends of ours are getting married and although they have both had their hen and stag, not everyone got to go including us as it was the week after the last wedding and we just didn't have the money as they were going away for them, so they are having another night just in some of the houses, so a busy weekend here too.


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## spidey

Hi girls! I hope everyone had a good weekend!! Shiv, I hope your weekend get away was fun!

Kira's birthday weekend was very busy and so much fun. I managed to have everything organized so I didn't have any freak out moments beforehand :haha: She really loved being the center of attention I think. I posted some pics on FB so you all can see :thumbup:

Some funny things... I had some prizes leftover and couldn't think of any more games, so DH suggested that everyone guess what time Kira was born and whoever was the closest would win a prize. I said that DH should play too since I didn't think he really remembered, but he said he did and it wouldn't be fair. Then my BIL said in all seriousness "yeah, he should know the time better than you since you were asleep when Kira was born" :rofl: Hmmm.. if he only knew :haha: My BIL is so clueless :lol:

DH's tool kit that he made for Kira was a huge hit. I saw it for the first time when Kira opened it. Kira also loves the little critter doll house that I got her. It's intended for much older kids since it has super tiny parts, but I thought she would like playing with it since she's gentle and likes tiny things. But just to be silly she stuck one of the parts completely in her mouth tonight :dohh: so I'll have to watch her more closely from now on. She was so spoiled and even got presents from people who didn't come to the party and aren't even related- crazy!

I don't remember being so emotional about her birthday last year. She was born at 9:02pm so I was having flashbacks of her birth right at 9:02 tonight- psycho hormonal Spidey! Now that Kira's party is over I'm afraid I'll feel empty since there's nothing else to obsess about for awhile- Christmas is months away :haha:

Anyway, enough babbling... here are some pictures from the party, there are lots more on FB 

cupcakes

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/Kira/2011-08/August%2014/cupcakes%202.jpg

toolbox

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/Kira/2011-08/August%2014/tollbox.jpg

prizes

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/Kira/2011-08/August%2014/prizes.jpg


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## Shiv

jelr - so sorry that your dad isn't taking his issues seriously. Please try not to feel guilty for not being able to care for him like you used to. He is your dad and should be looking after you and Natasha not the other way round :hugs:

Spidey and Cleck - I loved loking at your birthday pictures. It look slike Kira and Emma had great days.

Spidey - did everyone join in the games with gusto or did they moan?

It is Sophia's birthday on Friday and I have just wrapped her presents (well apart from the table and chairs which are too big to wrap - i have put a link in the other lion cubs thread of which one I got here, it is really cute and I think she will love it.) We also got her a couple of DVD's (she only watches in the night garden so we got her some postman pat and pingu DVD's to hopefully keep her occupied when new baby is here). We got her some new painting stuff and an apron, and a little watering can as she loves helping in the garden. A lovely weekend, but gothome feeling even more tired than when I left! 

I had a midwife appt today and unfortunatley it was with the same one i saw last time who was very anti-birth! Everything is fine, baby was head down, if only for a short time as s/he wriggled around soon after :dohh:. I mentioned home birth again and she told me to ring the woman who should be my midwife to discuss (she is on holiday until next week). i am feeling a little better about bubs position as at least I know that s/he CAN be head down and isn't stuck transverse. So I guess i need to get on and order a birth pool etc....................eek I need to really think about this home birth business now!

So how is everyone, Cleck and Spidey where are you in your cycles?

jelr- it sounds like you had a great night out staying up until 5am at the weekend. Have you recovered yet?

MJ - how are you doing? How is your SPD this time around and your heatburn?

I am really struggling to sleep, my ribs seem to ache after only a few minutes lying on myside which is weird.

David is home for her birthday :happydance: and he has taken teh day off:happydance:. So we plan to take her swimming in the morning (she loves swimming and we don't go nearly often enough), then a picnic lunch if the weather is good. Home to do some painting and then dinner and cake (I am just going to do some chocolate cupcakes with a strawberry on top, as i have to bake a peppa pig cake for her joint birthday party on Saturday). I am REALLY looking forward to spending the day as a family. Especially as David is off to holland on Monday for goodness knows how long :happydance:

Our weekend away was a bit of a mixed bag. We went out for dinner on the Friday night and then to see a play which was good. But I was then on the toilet ALL night with diahorea and cramps. It hurt so bad at one point I considered I might be in labour. ANyhow, once I got it out of my system I was fine. Saturday we went to buy Sophia's birthday presents and had a late brunch at our favourite tea room. A swim at the hotel (water was freezing so was a quick dip!) then out for dinner with friends. Dinner was lovely and was great to see everyone. Ended up staying up until 1.30am. Lunch at my parents house on Sunday then home again. Sophia had a ball and slept really well there (so it os obvioulsy only when I am there that she is a pain :dohh:).


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## overcomer79

Hi everyone. It has been a busy august! I'm sitting here trying to plan James' birthday party (doing it at a children's art museum, mommy is VERY excited!!!). I am sitting here waiting for the witch to show so I can start serious baby making next cycle. James didn't sleep well on vacation (the time I o'ed so NOT optimistic about it at all!!!) 

I start back my fall semester tomorrow...it is going to be so busy but am thankful I have a job. I have taken up running (mostly to distract me from ttc but I have lost 3 lbs:D)

Fx'ed for everyone trying.


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## Shiv

oh and Cleck just for you here is my 34 weeks (+1 day) bump photos
 



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## jelr

Spidey: I'm so glad the day went well for you, I loved looking at all your photos on fb, it looks like everybody made a really good effort with the games too from what they all made, lol at your BIL, wouldn't it be nice to be able to sleep through labour :haha: - I am quiet emotional this year about Natasha's birthday and wasn't at all last year, I just want to stop her growing up :haha:

Cleck: I loved your photos too, they both have made me very excited for Natasha's party, although she will only get to unwrap gifts from everyone else as the ones from us need to be put together.

Shiv: Yay for baby going head down, fx he or she is just wriggling around then and will move in the correct direction when the time is right. Your ribs are probably hurting so much from all that wriggling and funny positions - hope you get some sleep soon. It sounds like you did have a good weekend bar sitting on the loo of course, that is a pity it had to happen that weekend of all weekends :dohh: - so glad David is home for Sophias birthday and it sounds like you have a lovely day planned.

MJ: Well are you all settled into the house. How did Adams birthday go?

Overcomer: You never know your not out until :witch: comes, fx for you.

Well I had great night on Saturday night, I actually was very well behaved and was only a little tipsy going home considering we were there until 5, we right a right girly natter about everything and anything, but mostly children :haha: which was lovely my friend that hosted the party cooked dinner which was absolutely divine :thumpup:

Have had a busy enough week so far, but non eventful really, just getting some spring cleaning done before the party on Saturday and popped to town this morning and have a couple of friends calling tomorrow, which I'm really looking forward to as these are two girls that wouldn't be in my close circle and I only get to see them a couple of times a year, but one of them has a 3 year old, so Natasha will also have some fun tomorrow and that is about all the news I have this week. 

I really am so excited to see Natasha's face the day of her birthday as she will understand so much more this year, she still sings happy birthday everytime she sees a candle or a cake, so it will be great that is finally for her. I am very emotional about it all though as it does feel like the time is going just too quickly and she is growing up so fast and my holidays are nearly over eeeeekkkkk. 

DH has Monday off too as that is the actual day of her birthday and the local festival is on at the weekend so hopefully the weather will be fine and we will get to bring her down to that and to the carnival and then on Sunday night we are going to turn the sun room into her playroom as at the moment it is what used to be the nursery and she really doesn't get much use out of it as I dont like leaving her down the end of the house when I'm up in the kitchen, so it is only really if we are down that end of the house or go to the playroom with her, so I have got some winnie the pooh and mickey and minnie decals for the sun room and I think she will love that in itself and it is right beside the sitting room and kitchen so she can potter in and out all day now and have total access to all of the toys, so that will be a surprise along with her new toys for her birthday and also the nursery will be ready again for a new baby hopefully next year :thumbup:


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## spidey

Shiv- blah for the anti birth midwife :growlmad: So if you have a home birth, you'll get a different midwife? All the more reason to do a home birth! :haha: Yay for having David home on Sophia's birthday. Since both of you have gotten food poisoning out of the way, it should be a good time :lol: And don't forget to take pictures of your cupcakes and the Peppa pig cake. 

jelr- you must take a picture of your sunroom after its converted to a play room! It sounds like it will be really nice. I can't wait to see pictures from Natasha's party too :thumbup: I spent the day reorganizing Kiras toys since I needed to find places for all her new ones!

Overcomer- fingers crossed you'll get your bfp soon!!


Kira had her doctors appointment on Monday and all is good. She's 35 3/4 inches tall and 25 pounds! I measured her myself a few weeks ago and she wasn't that tall, so either I messed up or she had a major growth spurt. The doctor isn't worried about her language, so thats good. The only thing the doctor mentioned was weaning her off the pacifier. She has it in her mouth right now, so I'm not doing a very good job :haha:

I'm going to be a social mommy this fall! There is an art class for 2-4 year olds at the local art center. It's for 6 weeks, every Wednesday and costs only $35. There is also story time at the library for 2-5 year olds and it's free. So I might do both, or have my mom take Kira to the story time one since its on a day I work (if I still have a job). I still haven't officially heard if I can keep my job- my last day is September 23rd. 

As for my cycle, I might ovulate anytime between now and the next couple of weeks. No nip pain yet, so I don't think it's soon.


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## jelr

Spidey: that is great news about Kiras appointment, see I bet she will be chattering away in no time, somebody else said that to me lately actually that they took away the pacifier during the day and their child came on in leaps and bounds with speaking.

I do know what the fear of taking it away is like though, but for us, it wasn't as bad as I thought it would be, I found hiding it from her, so she couldn't see it during the day worked really well, out of sight out of mind definitely was the answer here.

The art classes sound really good, I would love to do something like that, but I haven't heard of any here. I love doing arts and crafts with Natasha but am not creative at all and am no good for coming up with ideas, so you will have to let us know what you make.


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## spidey

does Natasha still use the pacifier at night? Kira's been cutting back on hers slowly, but all on her own. Most of the time she'll only ask for it right before nap time when she's feeling tired, and again right before bed time. She tries to bark orders with it in, and we say "we can't understand you with the dee dee" and she'll pop it out. I have a feeling that she heard the doctor talking about her pacifier usage and now she's retaliating! She's been using it non stop since the doctors appointment :haha: I'm going to give it a few days to see if she cuts back on her own, otherwise I might have to step in.

Today she's been a bit chattier than normal despite the pacifier. She was saying "pa pa" over and over and getting frustrated with me until I finally figured out that she wanted to play with puppets! She also said something like "chirp chirp tweet tweet" when she saw a picture of a bird. She knows most of her colors so if I ask her "what color is this?" she'll say geen, boo, pupu, pink and "DA" for yellow and red since "DA" is the word she uses for anything she can't say :haha: I can really see her language improving these last 2 days :thumbup: Oh, and she also says "peeewo" for pillow! AND... she said "baby" clear as day when she saw a picture of a baby today! Enough bragging from me :lol: I'll have to get some on video to show you all!

Shiv, I forgot to ask- has Sophia done any more peeing on the potty??


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## jelr

She does still use it at night and at nap time, but we keep it under her pillow and then when it is bedtime or nap time I say will we go down to bed and get your doodee and its like a little treat so she loves going to bed too :haha:

Yay for Kira saying loads of new words, now is the start of it and she wont stop. I would love to see a video of all her new words :thumbup:

Happy Birthday for tomorrow Sophia as I know I wont get in tomorrow as I'll be up to my eyes in party prep - I think we have about 10 children and 20 adults so pray that its not raining or I dont know how I will keep them all entertained inside eeekkk.

Have a great weekend everybody else. Xx


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## cleckner04

At least with a pacifier you can eventually just take it away from your LOs. I've been regretting using my boob as a soother for emma because she still BFs a lot some days and I know it's just for comfort. But I can't take my boobs away like you could a paci. :haha: :dohh:

Shiv- I'm so glad baby decided to flip over for you!! :dance::dance: LOVE the bump piccies!! :cloud9: I wish I was that bumpalicious right now. :haha: 

Spidey- Sounds like Kira is hitting her word burst!! Emma seems to be saying something new every day now too. I've lost count on her words. She still doesn't say too many full sentences like other august babies though. :nope: Kira is so tall!! Especially for only being 25 lbs. I need to measure and weigh Emma again. I'm thinking she must've at least gotten a height growth spurt recently because her dresses are suddenly getting short on her again. :dohh: 

I'm sorry if I've missed saying Happy birthday to any of the august babies. It's really hard to remember who is born on each day but Happy birthday to all!! I know a few are still coming up this week and next so I hope they are fab for all of you!! 


I'm not sure the exact CD I'm on right now but it's like CD 10 I think so if I don't get AF by Sunday I'll test. I'm not feeling anything different as far as pregnancy symptoms though so I think I'm out this month already.


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## spidey

thats cute Natasha calls her pacifier a doodee and Kira's is a deedee. I haven't heard anyone else call it a doodee or deedee before.

Good luck with both your parties Jelr and Shiv!! They're a great age for opening up presents and it'll be so fun watching their faces :cloud9: 

Cleckner- for the next baby will you try a pacifier? Kira didn't use a pacifier for the first 3 months but when I went back to work my mom got her to take one, so she really likes them now. It doesn't prevent her from wanting booby though :haha: She's been really good at cutting back on her booby this past month. It use to be 20 times a day but now its only when she wakes in the morning, at nap time, waking up from nap time, at bedtime and once or twice in the night. On days that I work, she'll ask for a booby as soon as I get to my mom's to pick her up and recently she's been wanting booby right after eating dinner too. LOL, when I type it all out it sounds like alot, but it really isn't. I'm very happy with her booby cutback. Sometimes she'll ask for it other times and I can usually see it coming so I get up and try to initiate a game of running around the house or something silly and fun and I offer her some juice. If we're sitting on the couch and watching tv or playing quietly she's more likely to ask me for booby. Now she calls it "da boob" :haha: Did your family say anything about Emma's bf?

yay for Emma's word explosion :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

No my family didn't really comment on me BFing. Most were just surprised a bit that I was still doing it but when I was back home she very rarely wanted it during the day so most of them didn't even see her BF. 

Emma calls it da boob too!! In fact everything seems to have da in front of it now. Anytime we are in public and a kid is crying she says 'da baby!!' :haha: 


Anyone else at the annoying 'mama? mama!' phase yet? Emma will say repeatedly 'mama look!! mama! Mama? mama look!' And she will do it until I look. :rofl: And it's always the dumbest stuff that she wants me to look at. Yesterday in the car she wanted me to look because she put her foot up on the window. :rofl: It's really cute but gets SOOO annoying when I'm trying to accomplish something. It reminds me of family guy when stewie does it with lois. :haha:


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## spidey

da boob :rofl: that is sooo cute!

Kira's not in that phase yet. Her current thing is pushing me while grunting, and then pointing to the location that she would rather have me sit and says "der". It's very cute, but sooooo annoying when I just need a moment to sit down and as soon as she sees me relaxing on the couch she gives me orders to sit on the floor and then she'll point to which toy I need to play with. :haha:

She does call DH "DAAAAAA DAAAAAAAAA DAAAAAAAA" until he answers, but she never calls me like that. LOL about Emma putting her foot on the window, I bet if Kira and Emma were in the same room they would be making each other laugh as they both have a silly sense of humor.


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## Shiv

Yay for Emma and Kira's word growth spurt! There will be no shutting them up now! Sophia doesn't stop to take breath ALL day! My mum always says that she thought I talked a lot, but apparently Sophia even tops me! it is mainly cute, but can be draining, as like your LO's she is very demanding of attention, and because she can do sentences I get stuff like "Mummy, come into the playroom and take a peek in the oven"..........but she just repeats it over and over until I go and look in her play oven at what she is "cooking". Sophia amazes me as she will pick up on really strange words and she has the memory of an elephant, which is dangerous!

Jelr - I hope the party goes well and teh weather is good for you. It has pissed it down all day here, so I think our birthday picnic tomorrow may turn into a floor picnic!

Well I have mainly been baking these last 2 days, Peppe pig cake is carved and covered in sugarpaste so I just need to decorate it tomorrow. I did two batches of cupcakes, and the Peppa Pig toppers (which don't look much like Peppa Pig :haha:) and then I had a go at cake pops tonight which turned out better than I expected.

Sophia's presents are all wrapped and out in the lounge for when she gets up. We built hertable and chairs and one of the chairs is faulty so will have to go back which made me sad. I am really excited for tomorrow which is the complete opposite of how i felt last year (I was so sad). What made it easier was that Sophia was SOOOOOOOOO kissy and cuddly today, and I kept saying to her "I am gonna kiss and cuddle you so much today while you are still me little girl becuase tomorrow you are two". Gosh I love her!

David's big boss asked to see him today and gave him letter that basically said thanks for all your hard work, we'd like to pay for you and Siobhan to go out for dinner as a thankyou - so that is our anniversary dinner on Saturday night paid for. It is a nice gesture I think as they are such a small company that thinsg like that probably add up to them. I think David was chuffed too that his efforts had been recognised.

I am worried about tomorrow as I would love to get some lovely photos of Sophia but she refuses to pose for the camera (still - we haven't got a photo of her that isn't blurry for about t6 months now!). I just want some pretty pictures to show off to everyone and i bet she won;t co-operate -any tips?


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## Mary Jo

ack, so much to catch up on... been so tired and stressed lately, and I mean to sit down and write a post and then it all feels like too much. getting through the day feels like too much some days. not really very happy right now, just struggling, I guess.

anyway - to start while it's fresh in my memory... Spidey, Adam calls his dummy a deedee as well. I only noticed a few weeks ago, and I don't know how he came up with it because I have only ever called it a dummy. it's cute. but I am hoping he will cut back on needing it at all. something tells me I'll have a fight on my hands. his language has also improved lately, in terms of the words I have heard, but he doesn't speak in sentences (sometimes 2 words together is about the stretch of it). I've read it's normal and ok but I'm sure he'd get along better without a lump of plastic in his mouth.

happy birthday to Emma and Kira! I saw their pics on FB, lovely. :D and the cupcakes - mmmmm 

ok, going back a few pages...

Jean and Shiv, yeah the riots were scary. so glad we moved when we did. not that our part of Lewisham was affected (though where the cars were burnt out was right next to the Sally Army hall my AA meeting was held at) but I would have been terrified, if we hadn't exchanged or completed, that it would somehow mess things up for us and it would be be the final nail in the coffin for our buyer. so we were massively relieved to be out of there. Sutton wasn't hit much, even though it's next to Croydon where there were arson attacks - few shop windows put in but nothing much more that I heard about.

yay for baby turning at least once, Shiv. there you go, s/he'll shift him/herself nicely in good time for your home birth. s/he has just been comfy lying crossways while s/he can. soon enough that won't be comfy.

how's the weight-loss going, Cleck?

Jean, I'm really sorry about your dad. you know I understand it, so hard to deal with an addict. they honestly think other people won't be harmed or bothered or upset or hurt when the truth is a million miles from that. I can say when I was drinking I had no idea of the impact it had on others. it's a truly selfish illness and all you can do is take care of yourself. my grandad was similar, he drank himself into an early grave. mind, he somehow made it to 70, but his sisters both made it well into their 90s, so longevity was in the family, but he screwed himself over well and truly. I was 10 when he died and I had lots of happy memories of him because I was too young to be involved with the dramas. as an adult though, I feel both sympathy and empathy for him, and for my grandmother and my mum and what they suffered, and angry for myself that he possibly wouldn't have died that young had he not drunk the way he did. I guess I can see all sides now. very very sad when someone thinks they are invincible and it won't happen to them, when everyone around just sees what's coming and that they are selfish and stupid for not doing something about it while they have the chance. but if it were that easy... and it isn't. ack. makes me so glad I stopped drinking well before I had a family. :hugs: awful for you having to live with that fear. it's really terrible. I'm sorry. :(

glad to hear you had a good weekend away, Shiv, despite the runs. must have been good just to get away. great that David can be home for Sophia's birthday. :happydance:

am loving hearing about all the plans for birthday presents and parties. almost makes me wish I could be there (not that anyone would really want my little bulldozer Adam around :haha: ) loads of pics will have to suffice. 

sooo... as for us... where to start? ok, house things. we're not fully unpacked yet because the bed (which has storage drawers) and the chest of drawers only arrived on Tuesday, and we haven't had a chance to put stuff in them yet. so what will be Adam's room is still full of bags of clothes and bedding etc. we can get on with that this weekend though. the flooring is all done, and C has done the woodworm treatment and some painting. then the next step is to order carpets, for the stairs and anding, and Adam's room. but before we do that Chris is making an alteration to the staircase. really hope that doesn't drag out for weeks because I am ready for my carpets now.

he's taken pics of the staircase as it's been changed. don't have an absolutely "before" pic, with the old carpet, the first one is once the carpet came up before C did the woodworm treatment. the skirting boards were painted dark blue, which I hated:

pics:

Spoiler
https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_0283.jpg

after painting it white:

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_0308.jpg

this is the top of the stairs, where the staircase splits, one side goes up to our bedroom and the other to a landing, where his bedroom and the bathroom come off - this is the landing side:

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_0284.jpg

view from the bit that goes to our bedroom. note the "v" shaped bit:

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_0286.jpg

the plan is to fill that "v" shaped bit in to make a solid step (he is going to make a wedge out of wood and slot it in). it'll be a lot safer, as it's kind of perilous as it is. 

the other thing he has done is to make a rail thing at the top of the landing side:

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_0285.jpg

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_0317.jpg

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_0319.jpg

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_0321.jpg

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_0341.jpg

so it's going to be at least a few weeks. I just want the stairs fixed and carpet down now, before Oct. there's other stuff to do, build shelves and paint the living room, and ideally that would all be done, too, but it's not the most urgent. however we have this big understairs cupboard that is at present full to bursting with boxes (mostly books and other stuff we packed ages ago) and I want my cupboard back, because that's where I am planning to store my new pushchair...

...which arrived last week. I ordered a Phil & Teds Explorer, it was a package that was pretty decent value, AND I had a code for an extra 15% off at Mothercare, so I got it there, plus the P&T carrycot, a new mattress for the moses basket and a breastpump. the code ended up saving me over £100, lots more if I calculated the saving for buying what I did (the basic pushchair, extra seat, sleeping bag, cup holder and rain cover) as a package. haven't had time to put it up and play with it yet, far too much other stuff to do, we just opened the boxes to make sure it was all there and they didn't send us anything in lime green.

I love the new house, don't miss the old flat at all, fortunately. however, I have been concerned with my mood recently. sort of worried. and annoyed and upset because of it... I thought after the months of stress of trying to sell and buy, that once it was over I'd be nothing but straighforwardly happy, but I'm not. I am anxious about stuff I haven't done, anxious about stuff I don't know but might forget to do (this is stupid), SO SO weary... every day is like trudging through treacle. I did myself a to-do list today, and I did manage to get some stuff done (I pushed myself) but at one point I couldn't even face reaching up to a shelf to find some documents I needed. it's horrible, like when I have been depressed in the past. 95% sure it's all just pregnancy tiredness, plus feeling hugely daunted about the idea of another child like Adam. I love him more than anyone else in the world but he's in a phase that is such hard work. very demanding. and I feel like I have zero energy. I am barely treading water, it feels, just struggling through the day. NOTHING gets done to get me ahead of myself, like I am always a couple of steps behind. the house is a tip, I can't imagine finding the energy to do anything about it. 

what I'm worried about now is letting this slide and it getting worse. when I was pregnant with Adam I was seeing a psychiatrist (had been for a couple of years), and then, because of my mental health past, I was referred to a perinatal mental health midwife/nurse. so this was all out there, and I ended up being ok. now... I have nothing. I was seeing a psychologist up till March, but that finished. and I am concerned Joel will be born and I won't be able to cope. I have cried more in this past week than I have in months, a combination of terror and exhaustion. I need to call about seeing a midwife, still have seen nobody here yet. I registered us with a doctor last week and we had to go last Thursday for a basic check up, so I had my bp taken and urine checked. bp was normal but quite a bit up for me (I am usually around 102/68, this time I was 123/72) and there was a bit of protein in my urine, so the nurse wanted me to wait and get an appt with the doc, which was fortunately only 40 mins later (also needed to see doc to get referred to hospital). when I saw doc bp was back down to my normal but she was still concerned about the protein and wanted me to go back in 2 weeks (though I have no swelling or headaches so no pre-eclampsia at the moment). in the meantime I have not had my iron levels tested, as they should have been at 28 weeks. so there's loads of reasons I have to call and get things moving. but I have no energy to do it. grrr. 

part of what's made me feel so down is that till Tuesday I hadn't had a day alone with Adam since July 27th, 2 days before we moved. we had my parents down, then I went up there, then when I came back C had the week off, then parents came back on the 11th for Adam's birthday weekend, and they left at lunchtime on Adam's birthday, which was Monday 15th. I have all these things to do, it's all a mess, I am not getting anywhere, and I feel like I'd be getting nowhere with it all even if I didn't have Adam because I am so tired I'd probably stay in bed. only I can't because of Adam, and he's being, at times, extra demanding and hard work (other times he is great and very well behaved, but not so much when I am home alone with him except when he is asleep).

Adam had a nice birthday, I think... we had a little party on the Sunday, the day before. I didn't make any cakes or do anything special (I got a train cake from Asda, and we also had crisps and dips and fizzy pop), C's sisters, BILs, nephews, mum and grandparents came round, also to see the house, and it was fine. kids played in the garden, weather stayed ok. I have a few pics that my mum took, which I'll try and put up tomorrow. his actual birthday - Chris went to work because he forgot it was the 15th and took the previous week off instead. :dohh: so it was quiet. my parents took Adam out in the morning, and then he slept most of the afternoon, and we had his favourite dinner (sausages and mash and ice cream). I guess he's still young enough not to realise. I know I won't get away with a low-key day in years to come.

other than that - we went for a 4D scan, and it wasn't such a great experience, baby was camera shy and hid most of the time behind his hands, feet and legs, or with his head turned in facing my spine. so we got 2 pics that are ok and the rest are terrible. but he is growing well and seemingly healthy, so I was happy about that. not happy to find out he is breech. it's just another stress to add. even though Adam might have been breech at this point in my pregnancy with him and I'd never have known (he was kind of head down at 27 weeks, and then from when the midwives started telling me, he was always head down lying down my right side, but there's no telling if he ever switched and then switched back). I really don't want a c-section, and I know I have ages and he'll probably turn, and I can try to get him shifted, but what if he doesn't? ack. :cry: 

physically, health-wise, other than being tired and slow, the SPD isn't too bad. I am wondering if it's because he is breech and there isn't the same amount of pressure down there yet? it still hurts in the evenings and at night, and I am very careful when getting up, but considering it kicked in at 9 weeks this time, I really thought it would be a lot worse by 31 weeks. crossing fingers it stays tolerable. as for the heartburn, yuck. I guess it depends on what I eat, but the omeprazole isn't the miracle cure it was last time. I've had some horrific heartburn, and have had to buy Gaviscon Advance and Rennies to have in the house, and I've had to take 2 omeprazoles some days. I got another prescription from the new doc (thank god, I was scared she'd say it wasn't safe, but she looked it up). maybe this is also because he's breech and sitting right up there? my bump is really high up and sticking right out. lost count of the number of people who think I am due in the next few days/weeks.

ok, I'll stop rambling now. should really go to bed.


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## spidey

Shiv, my only tip for taking pictures is to take them outside in the sun so even if she's wiggling they should turn out pretty clear. I usually let Kira play and then I snap a bunch of pictures and atleast one turns out :haha: Happy birthday to Sophia tomorrow :happydance:

MJ- that was a record long post, but I read it all! I have so much to say so I hope I don't forget! It sounds to me like you could be depressed, so if you could make an appointment with a psychologist to just talk through things it might really help. Even though you sold your house and that stress is off your mind you have tons of other things going on right now that could certainly overwhelm you to the point of feeling really down. Plus pregnancy hormones never help and if you can't openly talk about things to DH it can make you feel alone. :hugs: I think you said on FB that your mom is coming to help, so that might be all you need to give you a break to let your energy levels come back up. It'll be good to get the results of your iron test too because low iron might be the culprit. Being depressed is awful and if you're heading that way you'll want to get it sorted out before the baby comes. :hugs:

I showed DH your stairs since he loves things like that and he noticed your transom window and was impressed :thumbup: He likes your idea of making that triangle stair a normal shape and his suggestion for the hand rail was to make it semi-easy to remove incase you need to move something large in the future. It's very neat how your stairs are laid out- I have never seen anything like it.

I took a video of Kira talking- you can see how she says the first sounds correctly for many words. She also does that wooo wooo woo thing, and that means she wants me to play with mini electric cars and have them ride all over the house chasing her :haha: You'll also notice how she pushes me as a signal to GET UP MOMMY! :haha:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEHomFm7rFs


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## jelr

Cleck: ha ha for da boob and da baby, even though Natasha does sentances, she tends to leave out the a lot for example she just say there bee instead of there is the bee, we have more me everything still like me house, me bath etc. Yep we have the repeating here too, its "mammy mon" for come on and that means she wants me to come with her to see or do something and she calls "mammy" all day :haha: funnily enough though I actually thought all the chatter would drive me mad as it does with others peoples children, but with Natasha I love it and would listen to her chattering all day :haha: - that is probably because I'm now in the frame of mind where I know I'm going back to work in the next few weeks and miss her already even though I'm not back yet, ifkwim :dohh:

That must be tough going being used as a pacifier - did you decide if you are going to use the lemon juice yet, I had never heard of that before.

Spidey: Aww that video of Kira is so cute, she is definitely getting more words, Natasha is the total opposite and tends to miss the start of the words and get the ends, its amazing how they can completely learn and do things the opposite way. I love the ways she does the woo woo sound :thumbup:

Here everybody calls a pacifier / dummy a doodee, I used to call it a soother as that is what we called it growing up, but my mam and dad are from a different county and nobody in our county called it that and DH and everyone else was calling it a doodee so I decided to switch rather than confuse her, I'm not even sure if I have spelled it right because it is a slang word, I have only ever seen how others spell it and there seems to be different spellings, the doo is prounounced doe so maybe it should be spelled doedee :shrug: 

Shiv: Thankfully the weather has been good here the last few days, although it is windy and overcast today so fingers crossed it just stays dry tomorrow. I hope it is nice for your picnic. I'm so glad you are not sad this year, I'm a bit of both, I am so excited about her party and seeing her face with her own cake and seeing her face with her presents and the playroom, but I'm a little sad that she is growing up so quick and is more and more like a little girl everyday instead of a baby.

That was really lovely of Davids boss. I didn't realise it was your anniversary this weekend too, hope you have a lovely meal out too, how many years are you married?

MJ: Massive :hugs: sweetie, I have to agree with Spidey I think you need to talk to somebody as you do seem to be depressed. It could be all hormonal too as I think you were very down in last tri when you were pregnant with Adam too if I'm remembering right. Is there no way you can talk to DH about how you are feeling, I do always it helps me, mind you I think the reason my DH is good like that is because he actually doesn't listen half the time :haha: hense he never remembers to hold it against me :haha: - or if not maybe your mum, as I find with me, I have all these fears in my head especially when I'm hormonal and once I actually say them out loud they dont seem as bad.

Also dont be so hard on yourself, I think you are doing great considering all the stress you have been under and are still under. As I said on FB - moving house is one of the most stressful things that anybody goes through in life and you are heavily pregnant and have a toddler and the stress doesn't stop once you have moved in, when you still have work to do, it ony stops once everything is done and you can relax in it, we have had major work done on the house before and I was like a basket case and toddlers do seem like such hard work when you are exhausted. When I found out I was pregnant the last time I was completely panicked because Natasha was going through a phase of not sleeping and I was shattered and couldn't cope at all and the same when I was miscarrying I was so stressed and shouted loads at poor Natasha as there was so much on my mind I was mentally drained, which I think you are at the moment.

Hopefully when your mum comes down it will help and give you a rest and then when LO is born, the house will be all done and you wont be feeling so tired, crappy and hormonal and I know you will do great, you did with Adam and you will again. - I wish I was nearer to you and run over and give you a big cuddle and tell you it will all be okay, which I know it will. :hugs:

And thanks you so much for giving me your insight into my dad, DH always tells me the same to treat him like a sick person and that it is nothing to do with me, or him not caring, but that he can only think of drink and as I told you before DH hasn't drank in 20 years now because of the same problem and even though I know he knows what he is talking about, I still find it hard not to be angry as I see that DH has done it and sometimes when DH is giving me an insight i think he is only trying to make me feel better so it is good to hear it from somebody else. That is another thing, look how far you have come in your life and what you have coped with, you dont give yourself enough credit, you have done great with your life and have been through so much, so you are stronger than you think.

Well things have nearly gone too well for me, I am normally like a headless chicken for anything we have in the house, but I'm on top of it this time for some reason, I hope it all doesn't go to pot tomorrow :dohh: - I left Natasha over with my mam yesterday and scrubbed the house from top to bottom, I id the stuff I do everyweek like sweeping, mopping, dusting and the bathrooms and mirrors and then I cleaned the oven, the fridge all the crystal and glass in the cabinet and the inside of the windows, DH is going to do the outside tomorrow and this morning I got loads of veg chopped and frozen to fill up the freezer and made the rice crispy buns and jelly all by 10.30 - Oh and this evenings dinner prepared. Some friends are calling this afternoon that can't come tomorrow and when they go I'm going to get Natasha bathed and when she is in bed we will decorate and set everything up so all I will need to do tomorrow is dump everything in bowls and make some sandwiches and get myself showered and ready.

I'm delighted with myself :haha: - I even got in here to do this huge post when I didn't think I would get in at all over the weekend :haha: 

So happy Birthday today to Sophia and hope you all have a great weekend. Xx


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## cleckner04

AF hit. :cry: Only a 10 day luteal phase than. Not sure if we'll be able to try the next two months because his ship schedule keeps changing so I have no clue if he'll be here for ovulation. I'm starting to panic now though. If I don't get pregnant soon, we won't have insurance when I DO get pregnant. :cry: If DH gets out in June 2012 than our insurance ends like 90 days after that. So if I don't get pregnant before he leaves, we are probably done having kids unless I get on medicaid or something. :nope: 


In good news, I was up to 195 lbs after Emma's birthday but I'm down to 191.6 today. :thumbup: DH and I both got bicycles and I got one of those bike seats for Emma so she sits in that behind me with her cute little toddler helmet. :haha: We just got them two days ago so yesterday was our first day riding them around. But we plan on going every day so I'm getting good exercise again. :thumbup:


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## Shiv

Spidey - Kira has a foot fetish :haha: She defintiley has the start of her words sorted, she is just so expressive facially too.

Cleck - sorry AF hit you. Don't give up hope. If Corey's schedule keeps changing then there is as much chance that he will be with you for ovulation as he won't. Fingers crossed for your BFP hon. 

Good work on your weightloss. I would love to see a photo of you and Emma on your bike. I am not confident enough on my bike to get SOphia a seat, I fall off quite frequently (well I did when i used to ride which was a while back now!)

Jelr - I hope the party is amazing tomorrow, it sounds like you are super organised so will be able to really enjoy the day. 

MJ - massive hugs, I am sorry you are feeling so down and like there is no way back up. It does sound like you could be a little depressed. I think you should mention it to your midwife so that if you do need some help and reassurance after Joel is born then you will get it. Hormones and lack of sleep are a killer and cumulative too so they just build up and up making you feel more out of control. Try to tell Chris what is going on and perhaps he could lighten your load a little.
I didn;t realise how much work you would still have to do on the house. I don't blame you for being stressed out still. If I am honest what I can see and have heard boys do seem to be harder work at this age (I guess girls will make up for it in the teenage years :haha:). SO please don't beat yourself up about finding Adam hard work. I am sure your mum coming down will lighten your load and your mood considerably. Most of all as Jean said, give yourself some credit, most of all Adam is a happy and bright boy and that is mostly down to you, be proud :hugs:

Well Sophia's birthday has been lovely. She wasn't really that fussed about her presents and spent a good while just putting them in a tower and then transferring them to another table and making another tower :dohh:. We went swimming which she loved and then had a floor picnic at home, with lots of SOphia's favourite foods (olives, mango, houmous and carrot/cucumber sticks, cocktail sausages) followed by a cupcake. Then in the afternoon we did some painting and played withher new toys. Her favourite is a wooden cake stand and cakes and a cat called coco who came with a little cat sofa!

So tomorrow we go back to Kent for the joint party and she will see both sets of grandparents and get more presents. 

I am all baked out, but am finished, I will put some photos up on facebook after the weekend. I managed ot get about two photos of her actually smiling at the camera but the others are just of her playing and not looking at the camera.

Right time for bed I think - big hugs to all that need them x


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## spidey

Shiv, I can't wait to see the pictures of Sophia and to peek at her new toys! Kira really needed some more advanced toys so this week she's been very entertained playing with all her new things. She also got some educational type things for her birthday like cards with colors and shapes on them, so we've been doing some educational type play too where I lay out 3 cards and ask "where is the triangle" etc.. it's amazing how fast she can learn now. Kira loves olives too 

Cleckner, I'm sorry about AF :growlmad: Make sure you look into private insurance before you let your current insurance lapse since it's not a good idea to have a lapse in insurance or you might run into trouble in the future if they want to claim that you had "pre-existing conditions" during that uninsured time. You can get plans that aren't too expensive per month if you have a high yearly deductible. So instead of being stuck with a 20,000 bill for your next pregnancy you will "only" have to pay 2,500 for instance (if 2,500 is your deductible). Me and DH carried private insurance for several years and it wasn't too much money, except the deductible was very high so the doctor visits were ridiculously expensive (so we never went), but it was nice to have it just incase, if you know what I mean. We were required to have health insurance when we were in college, so if Corey goes to college after he gets out of the Navy he might run into the same problem. I'm really sorry things aren't looking too bright for getting pregnant now :hugs: But don't give up hope yet and things might be timed just right for a pregnancy next month. When are you moving back home?

jelr, it sounds like you were a crazy lady with all the cleaning and cooking you got done! Atleast now you can sit back and enjoy the party :thumbup: Fingers crossed for good weather! 

I'm still going back and forth on whether or not to TTC this cycle. My main worry is that I'll get pregnant and the m/s will kick in right when they're deciding to renew my job at the end of September. I don't want to give them a good reason to terminate me. But I want another baby so missing one month could set me back 30-50 days, depending on my cycle. My job is perfect since I'm allowed to come in late every morning, leave early, sit around and chat for half my day and get paid really good money for being part time. There's no way I can find that anywhere else :haha:


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## Shiv

Spidey - just go for TTC this cycle, if you do get a BFP then you'll figure it out, if you don't try you will always wonder!

I have uploaded pictures from Sophia's birthday weekend to facebook, i have put them in an album that only you girls can see as I will use one of the photos as a thank you card so don't want to spoil the suprise for those that will receive one. There are pictures of quite a few random children (well they will be to you guys!), they are Sophia's friends from my antenatal group so are all just turned or jus turning 2. Sophia is the giant of the group! 

Everyone kept saying to me, she is actually a girl now, not a baby, not even a toddler but actually a girl! Made me kinda sad but proud at the same time. Who can believe that we have brought up such wonderful children for 2 years now............we all deserve a big pat on the back!


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## spidey

Shiv, Sophia is so adorable. Which picture are you planning to use for your thank you cards? In the 2 pictures where she's sitting next to the other little girl on the bench- is that other girl really the same age as Sophia??!! If she is, then no wonder you call Sophia a giant :haha: I bet Sophia is mistaken for being 3 since she's so tall and talking very well too. Her longer hair might make her seem more grown up too. I still consider Kira a toddler :lol: since she can hardly walk straight and she still babbles! It looked like she had a great time at her 2 birthday celebrations, and you looked great in the pictures too :thumbup:

Kira went poop in the potty this weekend. Me and Kira were taking a bath together and she started to make the poop face so I jumped out of the bathtub and then stuck her on the potty chair. She wasn't happy at first, but then settled down and pooped!


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## Shiv

Yay well done Kira :thumbup:

The picture of Sophia on a bench is with a little girl called Sophie who is one week younger than Sophia. Sophie is the smallest of the group and SOphia is teh biggest but this photo really shows the difference!

A funny story is that Sophie was due on the 15th August, then Sophia was born early on the 19th with Sophie finally being born on 26th. The mum was going to call her little girl SOphia, but not only did I push ahead of her in the queue but I nicked her name (not that I knew that was what she wanted to call her, I'm not that mean :haha:). SO she opted for Sophie instead. Can you imagine her face when myemail came through saying that Sophia had been born and not only was she still preggers but now had to find another name!

As for thank you card, I am thinking of either using the one with the backpack, because it is just very Sophia, or one with bubbles. Not sure yet. Which do you think?


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## spidey

Thats so funny you beat her to the name Sophia. If it were the other way around, would you have still named your baby Sophia? The difference in size between the 2 girls is crazy.

For the thank you card I really like the backpack one because her smile is so beautiful :thumbup:

Heres my funny story for how I named Kira :haha: You girls should feel special because this is the first time I've admitted this to anyone :blush: We were so certain that we were having a boy that we didn't give much thought to a girls name. We spent some time trying to come up with a girls name "just incase", and I went through some with DH and he didn't like any. I really liked italian-type names like Isabella or Gabrielle and since my family is mostly Italian, I thought it would be nice. I have an online friend who I met through a gluten free message board who was pregnant at the same time as me. She knew she was having a girl and had the name "Kira" picked out since the gender scan. I told DH about my friend naming her daughter Kira and DH said "I want to use that too" :rofl: I felt so ashamed to take her name and when Kira was born, I told her that I named her Zoey (Kira's middle name) because I couldn't bring myself to admit I stole her name :blush: Thankfully we haven't spoken since we had our babies because it would be hard to keep up a lie like that.


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## jelr

Shiv: I loved looking at your photos, Sophia is a real dote, she is definitely more like a little girl than a baby, I also think the photo with the backpack. It looks like you had a great few days.

Spidey: Yay for Kira doing a poop in her potty - I would agree with Shiv, I would ttc or else you will also wonder, also maybe it would actually jinx you into getting pregnant, and if you did you would manage with work and maybe they would feel sorry for you with being so sick and keep you.

Cleck: Sorry AF hit, FX Corey will be home on the days that you need him to be.

MJ: How are you feeling now, I hope a little better.

Well we had a great few days, but I'm definitely feeling my age, I am absolutely shattered after it all, it lashed after on Saturday, but it was fine as DH set up a gazebo at the door so any smokers stayed dry and it gave some more room in the house, as some were out there, and everyone else was between the sun room that we had the food set up in and the kitchen and sitting room and some of the kids were in the playroom - she absolutely loved having everyone here and being the centre of attention and seeing her face light up with it all was worth her weight in gold.

Sunday then, we got up and she opened all her present, she wasn't as mad about opening the wrapping paper as I thought she would be, but then most were clothes so she didn't have much interest in that I guess :haha: - she really enjoyed opening the cards more. We then went down to the festival and went to my mams for dinner where she blew out more candles and had more cake. Then on Sunday night we turned the sun room into her new playroom and put up some wall decals and I got really emotional putting her to bed and cried for about an hour, partly because I honestly feel so lucky to have her and partly because I just love her so much I can't explain it and partly because she is growing up so quickly and the time is going way too fast for me :haha:

Monday then, we brought her into our bed, where we all had breakfast and then we got dressed and up to get her presents from us, which she absolutely loved, the weather was gorgeous, so we spent the day in the garden and she got to play on the bouncy castle we had borrowed and had a bbq. 

she is exhausted herself today after it all, but I really think she did enjoy it.


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## spidey

jelr, your pictures were great! I really LOVE your sunroom and I'm sooo jealous! I told DH that he needs to build me a sunroom :haha: I would have loved that store as a kid!

jelr, when do you start back to work and when are you quitting smoking? Are you going cold turkey? Are you going to TTC during your next cycle?

MJ, have you gotten any results back yet about your iron?

Shiv, how is baby turning going? 

Cleckner, I hope you're having a good time with Corey! Are you planning any fun day trips?

Kira pooped again in the potty yesterday! Once again we were taking a bath together and she started moving around like she might have to poop soon, so I stuck her on the potty and she went! But she pooped today in her diaper so I don't think its a permanent thing. Kira is a career bathtub pooper so it's nice not having to disinfect the bathtub and all of the toys recently :haha:

I decided to go with what you girls are saying and I'm going to TTC this cycle. I haven't ovulated yet but I want to catch it with my nips and opk's so I can have a nice estimation of luteal phase this time. The time will never be 100% right and if Kira didn't accidently happen, most likely I would still be putting off having my first baby. I was super bloated today and had a very nice bump, and it was nice imagining it was a baby :haha:

This weekend a hurricane is supposed to come up the coast so if it hits hard I might not be around for a few days as I wait for power to come back on. We had a big hurricane in 2003 and we lost power for almost a week! It's been a crazy 2 weeks because we've had severe thunderstorms and tornado watches and then the earthquake and now a hurricane! So exciting!


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## Shiv

No time for a big post but just wanted to say KEEP SAFE spidey and update us when you get the chance :hugs:


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## jelr

Eeek Spidey, yes do stay safe, will be thinking of you and hope it passes you by. It must be so scary.

I'm back to work Monday week :( and am dreading it being honest. I have so loved being off with Natasha and having extra time to catch up with friends and being honest I'm worried how I'm going to fit it all into the day. I usually co-ordinate 12 / 14 classes / groups, but for this term I have 20 and I already was under pressure to get it all done in the 3 days - before Natasha I used to work 4 to 5 days and I had the same work load last term, just squeezed into the 3 days and now I have more, plus I compiled a guide and policy and procedures manual for the tutors for preparing for assessment before I had Natasha and our National awarding body have made major changes and I have to update that also and there are so many changes, I need to more or less re-write it, so I may just do that at night time as I dont want to be away from Natasha for anymore time, poor DH will have to look at the back of my head on the laptop for the next few months. I had agreed to all of this last term when DH was on half wages as I was panicking about money and now I'm sorry as he is back on proper wages almost, so we are okay, but then on the other hand I guess it will all stand to me when I get pregnant again as the extra money will hopefully go towards me taking off extra time after maternity and hopefully my boss will agree to it with all the extra I'm going to do in the next few months. Anyway I'm trying to tell myself it is only for a few months and I have always worked well under pressure, so I'm sure it will all work out and the way things are going in this country I'm lucky to have a job and it is well paying too, so overall I am lucky.

I'm not going to go cold turkey on the cigerettes, I'm staring the champix tablets the day I go back to work and you actually smoke for the first two weeks on them and then stop, so I'm hoping I will be settled back into work and will be so busy I wont miss them :haha: - I know it wont be as plain sailing as that, but I'm hopefull.

The next week or so is going to fly though as we are getting some work done on the house and it is like a bomb and we have another wedding next thurs, so it will be a busy week.

Your DH would have no problem building you a sun room, DH actually built that on himself last year and only got somebody to do the electrics and plastering and I have to say I do love it myself, it is such a bright room with loads of lights. It wasn't expensive either, although we actually got the windows for nothing as somebody was throwing them out on a job DH was working on and he said he would take them, so it was more or less built around them and they would have been the most expensive part. Imagine throwing out beautiful and perfect windows like that. Some people have more money than sense.

I'm glad you decided to ttc again, as you said there never will be a right time for MS and so on, so hopefully it will jinx you into getting pregnant this month.

Shiv: I really hope baby has turned. How are you getting on in the plans for a home birth?

Cleck: I hope you are having loads of fun with DH and Emma.

MJ: I really hope you are feeling a bit better and the house work is coming along nicely.

Poor Natasha has a touch of a cold, it is not a full blown cold and she is not really put out by it at all, just a bit of a runny nose and a dose of sneezing every now and again. It has reminded me the winter is on its way back though as she hasn't had a cold since last Feb or March, I think it is bothering me that is is unwell more than it is her :haha: - She is loving her new playroom and new toys, so I think she is just too busy with them to notice :haha:

Well I hope you all have a great weekend and let us know how you are after the weather spidey.


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## spidey

jelr, if you work well under pressure I'm sure you'll do fine. It'll be an adjustment going back to work but once you get into the swing of things you'll be okay. It doesn't sound like you'll have much time for breaks at work though since thats a huge work load. Will you try to squish it all into 3 days again? Fingers crossed the champix tablets work, and it does sound like a good time to start since you won't have time for a smoke break while you're working :haha:

Thanks for the hurricane well wishes :flower: They're saying we won't be hit till Saturday night or Sunday morning, so I have a few more days of calm to enjoy. People are going crazy here buying bottled water and food. Apparently it'll be the worst hurricane to hit this area in a long time and they're worried that the damage will be extra bad since the ground is already softened from all the rain we've had- so the trees will come out easier. Normally we get hit with tropical storms which is a hurricane that became weakened and has lesser winds, so having an actual hurricane hit us is a big deal. We have tons of dried beans, rice and slim jims (preserved meat sticks) so I'm teasing DH that we'll cook beans with slim jims over the fire pit outside during the week or 2 without power. He complained about the dinner I made tonight and I told him that he better enjoy it because it'll be the last balanced meal he'll have in a long time :haha: And DH obviously isn't worried since his biggest fear is the "maggots might all drown in the compost pile" :dohh: :haha: He was seriously concerned about that today. I'm going to have major internet and tv withdrawal if we lose power though- what will I do with myself!!!??


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## Shiv

Spidey - where abouts in Maryland are you? I want to know so I can keep an eye on what happens with the weather where you are -that way i can know how things are going :hugs:


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## jelr

Yep that is a great idea Shiv and if you see anything before me, let me know and vise versa.

Spidey I think you are great being so calm, I would be a basket case, but then we are not used to weather like that here at all. I does sound quite serious too, it was even on our news today that the US was expecting Irene and that the governor of Maryland had ordered Ocean City to be evacuated. I really hope you are not near there.

Will be thinking of you over the weekend :hugs:


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## cleckner04

Popping in to say I hope you are staying safe spidey!! 

I'm awfully glad I don't still live in virginia right now. They just evacuated the area that I lived in. :wacko: I wonder how our old house will hold up. I sometimes wonder how the new owners are treating it. 


Corey and my 7th wedding anniversary is on Sunday so we decided we'll take a drive to disneyland and do part of our L.A. vacation early. Just the disneyland part. We'll be going to disneyland tomorrow and than disney adventureland and downtown disney on Sunday before driving back. It's kind of a last minute idea so I've been rushing around cleaning and packing. Cleaning because I hate coming back to a messy house when we've been gone for a while. And it is so much trickier to pack now that we have Emma. I keep thinking I need spare outfits in case she spills or gets dirty and I need all the little hair bands so I can keep her hair out of her face. And than I have to remember her favorite snacks so she doesn't get grumpy between meals. Such a hassle. :haha: 

My weight is like up and down all the time. I guess I'm just maintaining the weight I lost when DH was gone but I seriously haven't been losing more because we keep going out to eat. :dohh: I can't help it. We went to this mexican taco shop that was featured on man vs. food and got the burrito that he got on the show yesterday. It was delicious and probably really bad on my weight. I was too scared to step on a scale this morning. :rofl: I really wish I could just get down to 180 and than maintain that weight. I just can't find the motivation now that Dh is back though. :(

Okay, enough talking about myself..

jelr- It must be so hard going back to work when you have gotten used to being home with N. :(:hugs: I hope it all goes smoothly. Good luck with quitting smoking too! Does your DH smoke too? For some reason it's sticking in my head that he smokes too. If he does that would make it 100x harder to quit I think if he still smoked. 

spidey- that is so cool that Kira has pooped on the potty a few times!! :dance::dance: I can never tell when Emma is pooping. I swear she just stands there and does it while playing without even stopping what she's doing. :rofl: It's crazy all that is going on at the east coast this past week. Hopefully you guys will be good through it all. :hugs: In a way it's so exciting but it's also scary. I always loved when we had tornado warnings and big storms in Ohio. It was just so exciting in our boring little town.

Shiv- Wow I can't believe how big Sophia is next to that other little girl! :shock: Sophia really is very grown up looking. And acting from the way you describe her. She makes Emma seem like a baby still. :haha: 

MJ- I'm so sorry you are feeling down. :hugs: I hope you manage to speak to someone to help get your feelings out and help you feel better. I think it's always good to get it out instead of bottling it up. Your stairway is awesome in your new place. I love how it wraps to each side of the upstairs. I've never seen anything like that. And the work you guys have done looks beautiful! I hope you keep updating us with progress pictures. I wish my DH was more gifted when it comes to carpentry. He's all about the mechanical work but doesn't know what he's doing really when it comes to house repair. 



And I think that's about it. Sorry I'm not around much lately. I lurk and read but always seem to get sidetracked to respond. I've been spending quite a bit of time with the neighbor across the cul-de-sac. Emma and her two girls get along really well so we always sit out there while they play in the middle of the cul-de-sac. :haha: Which kind of sucks that I finally have a good friend right before I have to move again. :dohh: Sometimes my weird attached neighbors come out too. They have two girls also so the 5 girls all play together. But it's more of a frenemy type of situation with my attached neighbors. :haha: We are civil to eachother but I still think they are weird. The husband tries really hard to be cool but he's really just a giant douchebag. :rofl: And the wife is accidentally pregnant right now and keeps going on and on about how fertile she is every time we see her. :roll: She knows DH and I are trying with no luck too so it's like she is rubbing it in on purpose. They didn't even want to be pregnant again so it's quite irritating and I think it'll be really hurtful for me to see her once she starts showing. She's only 10 weeks pregnant right now. 

I'm pretty resolved to the fact that I probably won't get pregnant yet. I've been trying to cut Emma down on the booby still with no luck. I put vinegar on my nipples yesterday and she didn't even flinch when latching on. She just fed like there was nothing different. :rofl: I told Dh last night that she will BF forever. I just can't see her stopping without a million tears.


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## spidey

I won't give my exact location on here, but the nearest city is Baltimore. If you look at a map of Maryland you'll see the Chesapeake bay and I live very close to the bay. They had the storm tracked so it might come up or be close to the Chesapeake Bay but now they're tracking the storm more off the coast, which is good news for us. Ocean City is the place where all the locals go for the summer and I'm a 3 hours drive from there.

I'll take pictures of any storm damage. I'm not expecting it to be too bad, but we'll see. It's going to hit us late Saturday so I'll be sleeping (or trying to sleep) during most of it. I'll be filling my spare bathtub with drinking water and we have lots of propane gas so we can grill if we need to since my stove is electric. I've always liked storms so I'm a little excited about it. :blush:

Cleckner, have fun on your trip!! Thats really nice that you made friends with the neighbors across the street :thumbup: Your strange newly pregnant neighbor sounds annoying :growlmad: Emma is a stealth pooper :haha: Kira's poops are large and on the harder side so she usually does some serious pushy faces so I know ones coming!


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## Mary Jo

coming back later to post properly, at work, but just want to say Spidey, STAY SAFE. hope you don't get too much damage and that power doesn't go off, or if it does it's very temporary. 

:kiss:


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## spidey

The storm has passed and we only lost power for a short time :thumbup: Overall there wasn't much damage besides some fallen trees and I missed most of the hurricane because I slept right through it! Many people are without power now so I'm pretty lucky and we managed to get to the toy store today to pass the time :haha: 

So, during all this excitement I ovulated! I got a positive opk on Thursday evening and an almost positive Friday evening. I was really bloated and a little crampy on Friday evening so I think I ovulated on Friday, although it could have happened Saturday. Either way, we :sex: so I'm in the 2ww now. Nips started hurting Thursday right on cue. AND... I was told I'm keeping my job for the next 12 months!! I celebrated by buying new underwear, socks and a purse :haha: When I heard the news about my job, I gave my direct supervisor the warning that I'm trying to get pregnant. We've worked together for the past 10 years and just recently he became my supervisor after my boss went psycho and quit. So now I'll feel a little less guilty if it happens this month.


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## jelr

Woooohoooo Spidey :happydance: :dance: for surviving the storm with no damage and only minimum tv and internet withdrawals, ovulation and keeping your job for another 12 months. 

Looks like it was a good weekend all around for you, I'm so glad you weren't hit badly by the storm though.

Cleck: Hope you are having a lovely trip away and Happy Anniversary. That is great that you are getting to know the neighbours. But yeah I have to agree the neighbour beside you does sound like a pain, that is really mean of her to keep going on about the pregnancy when she knows you are trying.

Yep DH does smoke as well, so I know that is going to be tough, he says he is sick of them and will probably give them up too, but I'm not so sure and am leaving it up to him as he hasn't had a drink in 19 or 20 years, and buys me wine all the time, so I think he has already done so well and I'm so proud of him to have won the battle with that addiction, so I dont want to take his cigs away from him too and as I have learned myself when I gave up in pregnancy, it is something you have to do for you and not that you are forced to or it wont last forever. I am really really hoping that he does give up with me though as I know it will make it easier on me, but I'm not telling him that as I dont want him to feel he has to ifykwim. He actually doesn't smoke that much once he is home in fact I would say I would smoke more, which is funny as I never noticed it before Natasha was born as we just smoked inside and you would never really notice how much the other is smoking, but now that we go outside to smoke it is much more obvious :haha: so I don't think at home will be that much of a problem, but it will be more if we are out or at others houses, as we would always go out for a smoke together for a change of scenery and that is where he would smoke more, I think it is partly a break away from everyone drinking for him and thats why I wouldn't ask him to stop but at the same time I know that is where I will find it harder :dohh:

Well it was a hectic weekend here but a pretty non eventful one, our bathroom is finally finished. DH also got a truck load (and I do mean truck load literally) of turf delivered yesterday so himself and my brothers spent the whole day out bringing it from our drive into the shed, I did a bit, but the dust was blowing around and some was going in Natashas face so I brought her inside out of the way, so I am so glad that is all over, because I'm shattered and have a nasty sore throat and Natasha is a bit snuffly too, which was a bit of a shock as she hasn't had a cold since last Feb/March and she was doing okay with it until today where she spent most of the day screaming and having melt downs for no reason at all :dohh: - which I felt bad for her as I know she probably feels rotten, but it was really hard when DH was so busy and I felt so crappy myself. Oh well hopefully tomorrow will be a much better day.


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## spidey

awww, I hope you and Natasha feel better today. She must of picked up a germ from her party. What are you going to do with the turf?

Operation wean from the deedee has started! On Saturday Kira was bossing DH around all day with the pacifier in her mouth, and DH was being really stubborn saying "I can't understand you" and both of them were acting like toddlers! Of course Kira held onto her pacifier even tighter since DH was trying to take it away. So on Sunday DH said "deedees are for sleepy time" and we hid them all. She asked for it several times and we occupied her mouth with cookies and she never had a huge meltdown. So far today she only asked me twice, and both times she easily accepted the "deedee's are for sleepy time" explanation. Tomorrow will be the final test since my mom has Kira, so I hope Kira is as understanding with her. To be honest, I'm shocked at how easy it's been so far (knock on wood!).


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## cleckner04

spidey- I'm glad the storm didn't cause too much damage and that your power wasn't out for long. And it sounds like the weaning from the pacifier has been so easy!! I wish it was that easy to get Emma off my boobs since they have always been her version of a paci. :haha: 

jelr- I can see why you wouldn't ask your DH to quit as well. I would do the same. Although I do know it will be much harder to quit if you smell his a lot. I have my fingers crossed for you to be able to quit easy enough. I know it's a very tough thing to do. I've got an aunt on Corey's side that hasn't been able to quit even after losing a lung and both of her breasts from cancer. :wacko: 


Well Disneyland was so much fun! Although I feel worn out and bled dry. :rofl: They sure know how to market themselves so you blow all your money there. Emma did really well. We bought an umbrella stroller so I didn't have to haul around my big one. She only sat in it a handful of times though. The rest of the time she wanted to walk or help push the stroller or I had to carry her. :dohh: But we managed without her running off or anything. She enjoyed almost all of the rides but the dumbo ride that goes in a circle she hated. That was really stressful because she kept trying to climb out and she was clearly panicking but obviously you can't get out when you are strapped in and up in the air spinning. She got really excited when she saw Minnie. Which was the main character that I wanted her to see since she loves her minnie doll so much and her birthday was minnie. She tried to sneak further up in the line to get to her but I had to keep telling Emma that we have to wait our turn. :rofl: But once we finally got up to her Emma turned shy and just stared. A few characters tried to interact with her and those were the times that she'd start to fuss a bit and hide into me. We were watching the parade and captain hook came up to her and put his hand out to her. She didn't like that at all. Which was funny and I wish I got it on tape. :lol: I'll post pictures on facebook eventually but we want to do the rest of our LA trip this weekend or next so I probably won't post the pictures until they are all sorted. :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah, meant to say that the neighbors attached to me are suddenly giving us the cold shoulder. Not just DH and I but the across the street neighbors too. While we were gone the across the street neighbor(V) went outside and as soon as she went out they packed up their chairs and went in. V has waved at them several times and they just look at her and go on their way without waving back or smiling or anything. :wacko: Last night we were all hanging out talking and the attached neighbor husband came out with his remote control truck and he played by himself off to the side but when we waved he pretended we wasn't there. :rofl: Corey even walked by him and said 'whats up man' and he didn't speak once. :rofl::rofl: So they are being really immature and we have no clue why. Maybe the wife is on this forum and read what I wrote or something. :lol:


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## Shiv

HI everyone - Cleck good to see you back!

Spidey - so glad you weren't too afected by the storm. Were any areas hit worse than expected? 

It sounds like getting Kira off of her dummy might not be too traumatic which is good.

Cleck - your trip sounds fun, will look forward to seeing the pics. 

have you tried lemon juice on your nips yet?

Jelr - I hope you and natasha are feeling better. Sophia is snotty too but I don't know if it is a cold or her 2 year molars causing it.

MJ - glad you are feeling a bit better.

As for me, well we've had friends staying for the weekend whcih was good as Sophia always has a blast with them (same people we went on holiday to yorkshire with earlier this year). Anyway we have decided to go on a proper holiday next year - ABROAD including a flight! I don't know whether I am being brave or stupid seeing as I will have an 8 month old by then! But I figured if I didn't bite the bullet and go next year then Sophia would be in school and it would cost a fortune. So in total there will be 6 adults and 3 kids, and we are going to get a big villa with a pool in Menorca or the like! Exciting but scary! I figured it would be a good introduction to going away as we will have extra hands to help on the plane etc.

I have my 36 week appt tomorrow with a doctor instead of midwife (still haven't met my midwife :dohh:) and she will determine whether baby is head down or not and send me for a scan if s/he isn't. Baby has been so hyperactive the past few days, it makes me feel sick as s/he keeps booting my stomach/bowel or something and it feels really weird. I never had this with SOphia, I always struggled to count 10 kicks in a day with her.

I am MASSIVE! The last couple of weeks I have just ballooned, I am bigger now than I was when I had Sophia, and it is all sticking out the front so that my maternity tops are flasing bump at the bottom :blush: I have put on 2stone and 2lbs at 36 weeks which I am ok with, I have 3 lbs until I hit 12 stone which is what i wanted to be my maximum. So assuming I don't go overdue by too much I might not be too far off that. Which will mean that I will have put on a stone less this time around.

David is off to Holland again either the end of this week or next week and then that should be him at home until the birth (I mean he will still be working, but in the office 15 minutes drive away). I have my best friend coming down on Saturday for 5 nights with her little boy, so it is going to be pretty busy i guess. I hope she doesn't expect to be constantly entertained, my whale like status is stopping me wanting to do much apart from sleep (and eat obviously :haha:)

anyway , I guess that is it from me, nothing too exciting!


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## Shiv

oh and Cleck - your neighbours really are weird!


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## jelr

Spidey: That is brilliant that she is weaning so well from her deedee. I was surprised myself when we did it for during the day how easy it was after. I definitely think hiding them is the trick. We will burn the turf, I'm not sure if other countries do this as I know Ireland is known for its turf - here is a link https://www.irelandlogue.com/about-ireland/irish-fuel-turf.html - apologies to you UK ladies as it does make a smart remark about the English, but it was the best description I could get with a picture.

Cleck: Sounds like you had a lovely trip, We went to disneyland florida on our honeymoon and I would love to bring Natasha some day, but I would never do that long haul flight again and especially not with a child :haha: - I dont think the smell will actually bother me because I wont smell fresh smoke as DH will be outside and I realised when I was pregnant that the smell of smoke off of somebody is actually quite disgusting :haha: but I think it will be more that it will make me think of them when DH does go outside ifkwim - the champix tablets are supposed to actually turn you off of them, so I'm hoping that this does happen, so when I do think of them when DH goes out for one, it will more disgust me than make me want one - I have no idea if that will happen, but fingers crossed it will :haha: - Your neighbours are definitely weird, I can't understand people like that, if I had a problem with someone I would just say what was up, especially when Corey asked the man out straight, but then I have a big gob that I can't keep shut :haha:

Shiv: eeeek I can't believe how quickly your time is coming up - I really hope baby has turned and that you enjoy having your friend over and it doesn't turn into a chore. I think it soundsl like a great idea to go on holidays when you have a crowd going with you to help with the journey. We have also been putting off foreign holidays for the same reasons and you make a good point about school - what age do they start in the UK? Natasha will be 5 before she goes here. We did plan on going this year, but then I was pregnant and we put it off and then DH lost his job after I wasn't pregnant and now hopefully I will be pregnant next year so we wont be going anywhere again, but hopefully the year after - God that sounds so far away now that I write it down :dohh:

Well Natasha seems to be back to full health and I thought I was this morning as my throat wasn't sore anymore, but now I'm all sniffly this evening and really feel crappy and tired, but then I have been tired since Natasha's birthday so I dont know if I'm run down or what, because I dont usually get sick either or if I do, I just get on with it, where as this time, I'm really feeling sorry for myself :haha: - I just ate a big jumbo size of crisps all by myself - you know the ones that you open if you have a crowd over :haha: and DH said to Natasha this evening that mammy will be back in work next week and I bawled like a baby and got really upset at the thoughts of leaving her :dohh: so I will have to give myself a good talking to and get on with it really :haha:

I think it is partly because she is reaching a stage where she is kicking up a bit and ignoring us and being bold, which she never really does and we have had a few time outs and that in the last week and I hate the thoughts of anybody else other than myself or DH disciplining her if that makes sense and at the same time I dont want my mam to let her away with murder either. Ack I'm sure it will all be grand once we get back into the swing of things.


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## Shiv

so turf isn't grass then?......You irish folk have some weird ways :winkwink:er 

I am glad natasha is feeling better, but not that your aren't. The problem is I find, that once you are run down and knackered, there is no chance to re-energise, no lie-ins etc so you tend to stay run down for longer. I hope you can shake it soon.

I hope you enjoyed your crisps! I have eaten a ton of crisps over the weekend too!

I forgot to mention aout Sophia's recent potty experieneces. She is still being awkward abot wearing a nappy when we are at home. A couple of times last week i have gone for a shower (when i am in the shower Sophia has the run of upstairs), i have said to her, here is your potty, ifyou need a wee or a poo you can sit on it. I get in the shower then a few minutes later I hear "mummy doing a wee in my potty", so I get out of the shower and look in her potty which does indeed have a wee in it. then I have to ask, have you done a wee anywheer else, and she shows me where she startde to wee! So she starts to wee, then realises, stops the flow (no drips en-route to the potty!) and runs to her potty. SO this is kinda clever but she obviously doesn't know BEFORE she is goign to wee which is obviously the key to potty training.

Today however she did do a wee in her potty starght off, however she had just been upstairs and started to wee so I lifted her to the toilet where she contiued. Then we came downstairs and she found her potty and did another one staright away! Progress I suppose not that I am actually tryign for progress!


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## cleckner04

I'm so amazed by the little ones that are willingly going on the potty already! Every time I ask Emma to sit on the potty she flat out tells me NO with a stubborn look on her face. :rofl: She seriously is just not interested at all. I wonder if one day she'll just decide to go on her own or if I need to figure out how to properly train her. 


Ok I was gonna post more but Emma is insisting we go for a ride in the jeep with daddy so I gotta go. :haha:


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## spidey

jelr, when you said turf, I pictured a bunch of rolled up grass to put in your yard :haha:

Cleckner, I can't wait to see pictures of Disney! Emma is very brave for getting on rides and Captain Hook would have freaked me out too :haha: Your attached neighbors sound so dramatic.

Shiv, your vacation next year should be fun! Atleast with an 8 month old they can't walk so you don't have to chase after them the whole time. You need to post another bump picture so we can see your massive bump! Fingers crossed that baby is head down and your appointment tomorrow goes well. Will you ever meet the home birth midwife? So far you've met the anti-birth one and now a doctor. 

jelr, I hope you feel better tomorrow :hugs: It's hard knowing you have to return to work so soon and won't see Natasha as much. Kira's been a bit rebellious this week too. I feel like the terrible 2's are finally kicking in for us. 

And huge congrats to Sophia for figuring out the potty!!! Thats really promising that she'll make it to the potty to finish her pee. I'm also amazed that she remembers where she tinkled in the house and will show you! Such a smart girl!

The hurricane did hit us hard but we got extremely lucky with having no damage and keeping our power. Most of this area is still without power and many of the major intersections don't have working traffic lights. Now they're saying that many won't get power back till Friday. School has been cancelled too and lots of people are trapped on their roads from fallen trees. We went to the store this evening just to find out that the entire mall and all the surrounding restaurants were without power and closed. Tomorrow I get to drive to work without working traffic lights, so that should be a real b*tch!

Kira put up a small fuss after her nap for her deedee, and bad mommy gave her some M&M's to eat instead. Besides that, it's been a success all day!


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## cleckner04

Spidey- M&Ms solve everything. :D Good luck getting to work without traffic lights! That would definitely be a pain in the ass. I've had to go a few places while living here and traffic lights were out and people were clueless about what to do. :haha: 

Shiv- I just saw on FB that baby is head down! That's wonderful news! :D I agree with spidey, we need piccies of the massive bump. :thumbup:


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## Shiv

This is where roundabouts would be handy for you Americans!

Thanks Cleck - lets just hope baby stays that way!

Well here is today's photo - it looks less massive than it does in real life, and it appears to have dropped over night! I'll put last weeks up to compare so that you can compare!

Today's photo is the one in jeans
 



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## jelr

Nope people turf is not grass :haha: I didn't even think when I posted and it was only until spidey asked what we were going to do with it that I guessed you thought it was grass and not the turf for fuel. Shiv: I knew the US ladies wouldn't have had a clue, but I thought maybe you might have heard of it in the UK, we usually dont burn turf as it is very dusty, but now that we have the stove, it will solve that problem as there is definitely more heat from it :thumbup:

Spidey: If the m&m's work then go with it :haha: - Funnily enough Natasha has started to not want to give hers up after her nap this week either, but is not kicking up, she has just said me go sleep and stays in her cot for about 20 mins after waking and I think it is for the extra few mins sucking :dohh: - Sorry to hear Kira is being more rebellious this week too. I like that description actually, I usually think of rebellious with teenagers, but it actually describles Natasha so well this week :haha: and it much nicer than bold as I actually hate that word. Best of luck going to work tomorrow, I have only once had traffic lights down and it is a real pain as people dont have a clue :dohh: - I'm so glad though you were so lucky with the hurricane.

Cleck: I hope your neighbours are not doing anything else weird :haha: - I woudn't worry about Emma and the potty, I reckon she will just sit on it when she is ready, she is just making sure you are clear that she is not at the moment, by her stubborn NO :haha: - or I know my friends little girl wouldn't use the potty at all, so they got these steps attached to a potty seat for the toilet and she took to it straight away, so maybe some children just dont like the potty for some reason :shrug:

Shiv: Bump has definitely dropped and gotten bigger, I do think you look amazing for 36 weeks pregnant though, you are only bump and are not carrying weight anywhere else. I would say you are so relieved about baby being head down. Mad that you have not met your midwife yet. Have you looked into getting the birthing pool and all yet?

I know what you mean about not having time to re-coup when you are knackered or run down and I think that is what the problem is with me at the moment as I dont have any reason to be run down as I'm eating better than ever and am off work so not under much stress. I even went to bed early all this week. Natasha did go through a couple of weeks again of crying in her sleep so I was awake nearly every hour and found it hard to get back to sleep and now that she has settle down again, I keep waking anyway when I could be getting a proper nights sleep :dohh: - think my body clock had just gotten used to waking every hour :dohh: so I think that is why I am so knackered, hopefully Natasha will keep on sleeping and I will be so exhausted next week being back at work that I will go out like a light for a few nights and be back to normal.

Yay for Sophia more or less potty training herself, now that is clever :thumpup: - I'm really impressed that she can hold it - I'm hard pressed to do that myself some days :rofl: - I think Natasha is starting to get a better understanding of it as for the last few months she hates if she is pooing that anybody is looking at her or she hates if you mention are you pooing, so lately if she is constipated I will say are you okay or are you alright, do you want me to rub your belly rather than asking her if she is pooing - well the last few days, when she starts to poo, she comes running up to me and says alright mammy and gives me a kiss :haha: - so she is now kind of starting to tell me that she is going :haha:

MJ: hope you are okay and feeling a little better this week - am thinking of you :hugs:

Well we just had a completely lazy day today as I'm full of snot :haha: so not much news going on, had a friend over for dinner which was kinda weird, well not weird but I was so paranoid as even though we are best friends for nearly 20 years, I have never cooked for her or any of my friends really :haha: - it just happened that she was calling tonight and had said she was going to come straight from work as she wanted to spend some time with Natasha too, so I said sure you may as well have dinner with us then. I only did roast chicken and potatoes and veg as I reckoned I couldn't really go wrong with that :haha: and she was still standing leaving here an hour ago :haha:

Her visit did cheer me up a bit though and I'm not feeling as sorry for myself, I think it really is that I just dont want to go back next week between wanting to be one to sort out Natasha's rebelliousness myself and I'm just afraid that I will miss out on all her new words and things, she really does amaze me more and more each day. It really is such a wonderful age and you can see her little imagination coming out more and more and her memory just shocks me - I had to email DH his work brochure as it was on his laptop here and when she saw it she straight away said "birdie on Daddys ban (van)" - so she recognised the logo. Only this week she is recognising the correct colours and saying them out randomly like blue car mammy when we are out and so on and today she was playing with a toy and next minute she piped up "heart on the top" which there was. I knew she knew the basic shapes like a circle, square and triangle, but didn't realise she knew a heart also and I love hearing and learning all the things that she does know, so I dont want to miss any of it when I'm at work :cry: - but then as my friend pointed out, once I go back and get into my routine I will be fine and that it is more the thoughts of it is usually worse than actually doing it and she loves being in my mams too, so I know she will be fine and I will just have to get over myself really :haha: - So give me a kick up the bum girls and tell me get over myself :haha: 

Well I probably wont be on for the next few days as we have the wedding Thursday and tomorrow night I may do my nails and so on and make myself presentable :haha: and DH and I usually dont go online Friday or Sat night now, so I hope you all have a great weekend.


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## Mary Jo

ah poo, I was just almost done with the biggest most bloated post ever and I managed to lose it. GRRRRRRRR. 

can't face writing it all out again. :cry: so it'll have to be the extremely abridged version.

Spidey, hooray for making it through the hurricane with minimal bad effects. massive hooray for your job and for the OPK, fingers well and truly crossed... Kira is super sweet in the video :D ... she is pretty much on a par with Adam speech-wise, sems to know a lot of words but doesn't always get the whole thing out. he is understandable to us but probably not everyone. am full of admiration for you with operation farewell deedee... that's one battle I am not winning right now. I am weak willed in the face of a screaming, crying toddler who is desperate. I should hide them, 9 times out of 10 when he's dragging me somewhere it's to wave at the top of the fridge where the deedees are.

Cleck, Disney sounded like a lot of fun, good on Emma for not running off (that's my trouble with Adam, he runs and then when he's caught he struggles and screams when being put back into car seat/pushchair). fingers crossed your dates coincide nicely with Corey's time home. and I can't believe Emma wasn't bothered by the vinegar on your nips. perhaps she liked the different taste sensation? Adam is also a stealth pooer, he never tells me, only after breakfast he says "poo poo" but he's already gone by then. he doesn't seem at all bothered by sitting in a load of shit. or in a sodden, dripping wet nappy. till he's able to tell me, or indicates to me that he doesn't like it, I'm not even attempting much with a potty. 

Shiv, first - happy birthday Sophia and am glad her birthday and party went well. I also love the pic of her in the backpack, she's adorable. she does look older than 2, I think next to Adam she'd really look older, he has a chubby round baby face, and with his curls and longish hair (for a boy) he does look like a baby. though people do remark on his height. think your holiday will be fine with that child/adult ratio, especially if new baby isn't really active by then. though IIRC, Adam at 8 months was cruising and being v difficult when not allowed to do what he wanted... 

massive yay for baby doing the right thing, finally, and going head down. hope this is it and s/he stays put. well done on your weight gain, don't think I am doing so well, though I don't know for sure as the scales are in a box, location unknown, so I haven't weighed myself in well over a month. the nurse weighed me when we registered at the docs, and I was 11 and a half st, but it was fully clothed and after breakfast so it doesn't count in my eyes. have been eating like someone who isn't trying to be careful not to gain too much weight. oops.

Jean, ack, am sorry your holidays are almost over, I totally understand what you say about not wanting to miss a thing with Natasha. I'd be exactly the same. he is also picking up new words and behaviours every day, and I have no idea where he learns some things. TV I suppose... still, N's 3-day birthday celebration sounded awesome, so glad the weather didn't spoil anything and that she had a great time. hope the champix works for you, and I am with you on understanding that someone can only give up something when the motivation truly comes from themself, not someone else. I tried stopping drinking (several times in the years before I did) but never for the right reasons (to please someone else/get them off my back) and of course it failed. when it came from me, when I knew I had to do it and there were no conditions attached, I was able. I hope Jim comes to the decision to quit himself, but you are very very understanding in why it mightn't be the right time for him, and I think it's admirable.

as for us... thank you all for the support after my last post, when I was feeling so low. I'm not quite so bad now, thank goodness, honestly think I was just exhausted and it crushes my mood. also I'm not fighting with Adam. if he has a tantrum I am not engaging with it, and if he pulls at my hands, I am just going along with that, too. I still hate it but I hate getting angry about it more. I've been sleeping ok, 3x a night toilet trips notwithstanding, and managing to stave off Adam's early mornings with my iphone (he watches episodes of Cbeebies shows while I doze, and on a good day I can keep him in bed for an extra hour). also, we went over to C's mum the other week, and while we were chatting she asked if I was still carrying Adam, meaning upstairs, etc, and yes I am when I have to, which is usually to enforce a nappy change when he won't walk up because he doesn't want to go. she came up with the simplest suggestion and I was kicking myself for not thinking of it myself... to keep some of his nappies downstairs :dohh: so I moved the changing mat and got some wipes and it's all working well and that's 3-4 fights a day I am not having now. also getting his clothes all ready when I'm upstairs on my own and bringing them to him and dressing him while he's doing something else. 

C has been getting on with the the house some more, he finished the work on the stairs and it's now a lot safer:

before: scary v-shaped stair

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_0284.jpg

after: v shape filled in with a very solid triangle of wood:

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_0372.jpg

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_0370.jpg

carpets are being fitted tomorrow. a hardwearing cream carpet on the stairs and landing, and a green one in Adam's room (it's not so dark as pine green but darker than emerald). his walls are pale yellow - plan was for cream but B&Q's colour sample chart was very misleading and it's definitely yellow, but by the time I got to see it it was almost all done and I didn't have the heart to tell Chris I hate it - which I don't but I almost do :( - and make him do it over again. it'll be ok once it's all done, I'm sure. I've bought him this duvet set, so I think it'll look nice. thinking about getting some wall stickers as well but never done anything like that - I know you have Cleck and Jean and I think Shiv - is it easy to get a good result?

can't wait to get the carpets down, it's the last big disruptive thing in the near future (longer term the shower and the wall behind it in the bathroom has to come down as it leaks so the shower can only be used if you sit in the bath with it away from the wall, but that's going to be a big job and no immediate plans). am concerned how it'll be in the house with a carpet fitter and keeping Adam away as we have to take the stair gate off. eeek. once it's done, all I really want doing is my shelves up so I can empty my big understairs cupboard of the remaining boxes and get the cupboard properly organised, and once Adam is out of our bedroom we can sort the wardrobe and chest of drawers out (drawers are up but empty and facing the wall as Adam just wanted to climb in them and it was doing our heads in).

have not had blood test results back from hospital, not sure if I will need to call and ask, as I am curious about my iron levels. actually I might call because I am nervous they might have got lost or something, with me being a new patient and not even booked in properly, and then I'll be 35 weeks (next appt is my booking in 2 weeks on Thursday) and I'm scared if the results are lost they'll insist on redoing them, so I'd rather redo them now not then. 

am working this Thursday, usually only do Saturdays bu my boss emailed today and offered me a 12-8pm shift. I was going to automatically turn it down but then C suggested his mum have Adam. she has offered before, she is a childminder, so we thought we'd see if she could do it, and she can. it'll be Adam's first whole day with her he's only been looked after by her a couple of times and only 2-3 hours max; this will be from 10pm till about 5pm. so I have to get him from Sutton to Richmond for 10am or so, which will be 2 buses and 2 trains, and then get myself over the other side of London - Tower Hill, which is a bus, and then 50 mins on the tube - by 11.30am (I hate being late so always plan to be there at least half an hour early in case of delays). C will go and get him after work, he's going to go in early so he can finish at 3.30pm. I hope it goes well and he has fun, and is not badly behaved. she has 5 other kids that day, and another adult. if it goes well I am hoping we can maybe do it again to give me a break (C would take him in the morning, leave his car at his mum's, get the train to work, then back and drive them home) both before and especially after the new baby is here. my mum isn't coming down till the 14th Sept, so another couple of weeks yet, but she's staying nearly a week when she does, so am really looking forward to that.

ok, better go to bed now, I'd probably have been asleep by now if I hadn't have lost my last post. :dohh:


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## spidey

MJ, that is a huge improvement to the stairs and they seem 100 times safer :thumbup: We keep Kira's clothes and changing pad and wipes on the main floor too and it's great to walk a few feet and then change her. Or if she gets dirty I have her clothes close by to change her into new ones. The only downside is her clothes are all downstairs so she often pulls them all out and instructs me to re-fold them into neat piles :haha: I'm glad you're feeling better :hugs: By the time you get your iron results the baby will be here! The caterpillar bed set is very cute! Are you thinking of doing caterpillar stickers too? 

jelr, I'm glad your meal turned out well for your friend :thumbup: I almost never cook for other people and when I do, I get nervous too. I always wonder if my tastes are the same as everyone else's. Natasha is so smart with the things she comes up with :flower: Enjoy your weekend and have fun at the wedding! I hope you feel better soon :hugs:

Shiv, you're looking quite pregnant! Do you put on any creams to prevent stretch marks? I'm so happy the baby is head down! When are you getting your birth pool and what room are you planning to have the pool in? 

Cleckner, Kira's not into the potty either. She only pooped on it because I caught her mid turd in the bathtub :lol: She can't get her pants up and down and she can't sit on the potty without my help. She was a late walker (16 months) and hasn't figured out how to backup yet. I don't see the point in trying to potty train her when she can't even aim herself to sit on the potty :haha:


My nips aren't hurting too much so I have a feeling this month didn't work. But I know its still way early to tell. I decided that when AF comes I'm going to make an appointment with my midwife for a normal check-up, but also to talk about my inability to get pregnant. At some point I'll get more desperate and seek out fertility help and I have no clue if the midwife does that. Also I'm afraid that if I do get pregnant, my progesterone will be too low to maintain the pregnancy. The midwife doesn't want to see a newly pregnant person until 10 weeks, but I'm hoping they'll agree to see me earlier so they can do blood tests to make sure everything is okay. So I'll get that all figured out. DH was talking about getting a vasectomy again today. He's partially joking, but he's also partially serious. He's very much against more than a 2 year gap for whatever reason, so I spent an hour today re-assuring him (and myself) that it's probably good to have them 3-4 years apart. He's saying January he will book a vasectomy if I'm not pregnant by then :roll: If I said "okay" I am 100% certain he would do it too. I told him I'll get pregnant with or without him, and the mailman isn't looking so bad :haha: The only thing I wish is that I wasn't living cycle to cycle. For example, I can't think about Christmas without first thinking "hmmm, I wonder if I will pregnant by Christmas". I don't want to think back on these years as the years I lived month to month wondering if I was pregnant.


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## cleckner04

MJ- the stairs look really nice. I know when the carpet is in it will look amazing. Our house had hardwood floors and we carpeted over all of it but the living room and it just made our old house look so much better from that simple update. I really love putting up vinyl wall decals. They arent too much work. You just have to take your time with it if you are doing something intricate. They sell cheap stickers that are simple to just stick to the wall but the ones I have take some time because they are more than one piece to make a bigger piece so you have to line it all up so you can't tell it's separate pieces. The hardest one was the tree in Emma's room. It took me a few hours to do. But I did it alone and had to fend off Emma while doing it so I think it could've been a lot quicker with help. :haha: I'm glad you are feeling better. :hugs: 

spidey- All I can say is my brother and I have a 4 year age gap and we were very close growing up and still keep in contact as much as possible now that we live so far from each other. I don't get the obsession with having children super close in age. Biologically speaking we are meant to have a 3-4 year gap between children because that's how long we are meant to breastfeed our children. I've read a few articles on age gaps and they say to either have a 1 year gap or a 3-4 year gap. Because before 1 year they don't have a sense of identity yet so a new baby will fit right in. Than they get to the awkward stage where they are trying to figure out their identities and bringing in a new kid would be more of a struggle in those years. But by 3-4 they are more independent and accepting of siblings. This is just what the articles said. I always thought a 2 year gap would be perfect too but obviously that isn't going to happen so the articles have made me feel a bit better when I start getting upset about not having another yet. :haha: Another random thing that would probably upset a lot of women on this website is an article that said research has shown that women who have babies less than a year apart in age have a 20% shorter lifespan. :shock: I'm not sure what the reasoning is but I think it's something about not giving the body enough time to recuperate between pregnancies. 

That was a bit of a ramble but I hope your hubby doesn't get too serious about the vasectomy talk. Kids will be as close as you raise them. I think there are just as many siblings that are close age gap that hate eachother as there are far age gaps that hate eachother. And vice versa. :haha:


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## Mary Jo

thanks spidey and Cleck :D - and yes I would get Very Hungry Caterpillar wall stickers - these. I would be really nervous about putting them up but Chris could do it, he's more confident and a lot lot more artistic (well, he is a graphic designer). just one thing though, the walls aren't very good, Chris has filled in the worst of it but they're generally not very smooth (though they should be as they're plain plaster). the problem is that they have clearly not been plastered in a long time, so the plaster is old and fragile, and they've obviously been wallpapered and then someone stripped that off, and it took chunks away with it, along with gouge marks from the wallpaper scraper. so I don't want to spend £18 or more on stickers if they don't stick on my dodgy walls! I think they'll look great, though, if I do them.

am being proactive about the iron and taking Spatone, which is a natural form of iron (it's spa water that's high in an absorbable form of iron, which you mix with OJ for even better absorption). so hoping to pre-empt finding out my levels are low. I don't really think I am anaemic, because I do know what that's like, when I had bleeding stomach ulcers a few years ago I felt dreadful, but I know my tiredness now is because of being big and pregnant, and I don't feel dreadful most of the time. but I am going to call. not sure who. maybe my GP, I guess they'd receive blood test results? 

Spidey, I'm sorry DH is talking of vasectomies... for what my opinion is worth, I agree with Cleck about the age gap thing. in an ideal world we'd have 3 years, maybe even 4, but it's not an ideal world, I am too old to have left TTC till Adam was almost 3/already 3. I'm going to be 38 on New Year's Eve, and the thought of purposely leaving it till I was about to turn 40 is not a fun one. for lots of reasons, but mostly I would be scared my fertility would have failed by then. so we'll have just over 2 years. and I will handle it, but I'd much prefer - to be the parent I want to be - to have Adam in school when the new baby is small. what does your DH have against a bigger age gap? 

I also think that everyone has good and bad stories about every age gap imaginable, so so much must have to do with the personalities of the children and parents. my brother and I are 20 months apart, and I'd prefer it was a bigger gap, simply because coming so close behind I felt the comparisons very acutely, and my brother was (and is) a genius, which I was (am) not. maybe I'd not have felt differently if w'd had 4 years between us, though, there is no way of knowing for sure.

really hope you can get support from a midwife, *if* AF turns up. how long would you leave it before asking for tests/whatever? I was so certain, before Adam, that I'd have messed up my body so badly I'd be infertile (because of being anorexic and bulimic for 14 years, and drinking for 7 years, even though by the time I was TTC I had been in recovery for over 5 years), and that's why I temped. it was mainly so *when* (there was no *if* in my mind) I needed to ask for help, a) I have concrete proof of how long we'd been trying (I thought I'd go after 6 months-1 year of trying actively) b) I have evidence that I do or don't ovulate, how long my cycles tend to be, what my luteal phase is... plus all the other stuff they can gather. I think depending on *what* the actual temps are, they can figure out if you're likely to need thyroid tests done. which would be standard in a fertility work-up anyway, but I was just trying to cover all bases, with the fear/belief that getting referred to fertility specialists in the UK isn't an automatic or quick thing. obviously I didn't need all my evidence as I got pregnant with Adam on the 4th month of temping, but I was glad to have it and don't regret it. OPKs are ok, but they don't tell you for sure you *did* ovulate, only that you were gearing up to, and they don't tell you anything about your luteal phase (which you know for sure by the temps, they rise after ovulation and stay elevated till your period starts, and they won't rise if you didn't ovulate, at least not if you temp carefully and consistently).

Taking Charge of Your Fertility is a really good book, explains it all, and much more. 

:flower:


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## Shiv

jelr - I have heard of burning peat from a bog but never heard it called turf before.

Thanks for saying I look all bump but I can assure you there is a good layer fo fat all over - but hey ho, i think i am defnitely slimmer than last time so it is good.

i am absolutely positive that baby has moved again! But trying not to worry about it. I have an appt for a home birth assessment on Friday so will meet the midwife then - although there is no guarantee she would be on call so I could still have the anti-birth one show up!

That is so cute about Natasha getting her belly rubbed when she is having a poo, and super cute that she tells you she is alright! 

have a lovely time at the wedding and I hope you aer feeling better.

MJ - the stairs look great - i can't believe how useful all your husbands are, David wouldn't know one end of a hammer from the other! You'll have to post more photos when the carpets are done as i bet it will look great.

The bedding set is really cute. We have decals on Sophia's wall and they were dead easy to put up, they do say not to use on bad walls though - although i think the walls would have to be pretty bad for them not to work.

I had my iron levels tested off schedule also and was told they would only sen dme my results (as opposed to just telling me at my next appt) if they were low.

I think it is a good idea to get Adam looked after for a full day by your MIL. It will be good to know that he will be fine with her for that long, so that in future you can get a bit of a break.

In teh last week or so I have just started offering Sophia the option of having her nappy changed downstairs as it is just easier than traipsing upstairs. I have bought an extra change mat to have downstairs (although not using it yet) for when new baby comes as I won't wanting to be going upstairs 10 times a day to change nappies with Sophia trailing behind me!

Spidey - yes i would say pregnant would be a good way to describe how I look! I have been using some cocoa butter stuff twice a day religously, but have got new stretchmarks all above my belly button. I only got a couple on my hips last time, where I carried out at the sides, so I am definitely carrying more out front this time. I really worried about having a saggy pouch afterwards.

Fingers crossed that you get your BFP soon, I agree with MJ though that the more info you have to take to a specialist the quicker they can help you.

Oh and age gaps - I truly believe that how close you aer to your siblings has everything to do with how close your family is in general, how your parents behave, and very little to do with the gap. We are not a particularly close family, so we could have been twins and we probably would still not have been close!

As for us, well David goes to Holland again on either Sunday or Monday - until Friday (when I will be 37 + 4) so I need you all to keep your ifngers crossed that baby stays put until at least 38 weeks!


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## spidey

Thanks girls for listening to my whine... I'm feeling much better everything :flower: Me and DH originally planned to have them 24 months apart and neither of us thought it would take this long. My brother and I are 24 months apart and are very close, but looking back I think it worked out well because I'm very bossy and he is very passive :haha: DH and his brother are exactly 6 years apart and aren't very close, but I think their parents always babied the younger brother whereas DH was forced to grow up very fast. Personally, I would love a 4 year gap so Kira would be in school and I would have more one-on-one time with the baby. I could also get a nap if I needed one :haha: When Kira was younger I had many days where I felt like I was barely hanging on to sanity. I need a certain amount of time to myself- to play on the computer and watch tv, and if I had 2 very young kids I wouldn't have me-time and that scares me. Maybe my inability to get pregnant is a sign that I'm not ready yet :haha: Cleckner, thats interesting about living shorter if you have kids very close together. Growing and feeding a baby sucks a lot from our bodies. 

MJ, thats a good idea to start doing more to track my fertility. Right now I keep a calendar for when we :sex:, when my nips hurts, and any opk results. I haven't tried temping yet, but I know that'll be next. My health insurance is very good and I doubt I'll have to prove that I've been TTC at all to have them look into my fertility. I think they cover up to 100,000 worth of invitro too :thumbup: Right now I'm thinking that next summer is when I'll get desperate and seek help. I know my mom took clomid to have me, and she was 20 I think. They hand that out like candy :haha: 

MJ, it's funny because I always assumed I wasn't fertile either. Thats why I didn't take birth control too seriously. I guess because my mom had trouble conceiving me and I was always very skinny and had irregular periods. I was also sick with unknown gluten intolerance for many years in my late teens and early/mid 20's so I thought my body had been drained from any nutrients it had left. It's amazing how quickly we bounce back from things like that though :thumbup:

ack, I just got an IM from my mom that my Aunt died. She's been battling breast cancer for years and then it had spread everywhere but she has been hanging on despite the constant chemo. She owns the place where my Dad works. I took Kira to see her a few months ago and I knew it would probably be the last time as she was going downhill pretty fast :cry: I hate having to see anyone suffer like that. Ah, makes me put my own tiny problems into perspective.


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## cleckner04

Oh no spidey. :( I'm so sorry about your aunt. :hugs::hugs:


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## spidey

I was looking through my closet to find something suitable for the funeral and I was getting dressed on the floor infront of the floor length mirror. I haven't looked at my lady bits post-Kira, but I got up the bravery and finally took a peak. Oh gosh, it looks scary down there! There are things I don't recognize and extra lumpy things too. eeeek! I'm traumatized for life now :blush: I'm going to google vagina close-ups now for comparisons :haha:


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## Shiv

Sorry to hear about your Aunt Spidey - also sorry to hear about your vagina! I haven't dared look at mine in a mirror and can't see me doing so any time soon either, I'd rather not know!


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## cleckner04

:rofl::rofl: @ scary vaginas. I never realized they would change that much looks wise after babies. I know some people end up with scars from tears and such. I wonder if anyone ever takes before and after pictures. :haha:


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## overcomer79

I just wanted to pop in and say hi. Been a bit down and out so just been keeping too myself <3


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## spidey

Cleckner, don't rub it in that your vagina is still virginous looking :rofl: Shiv, take a peek, it can't be that bad :haha: Did you have a tear with Sophia? I didn't see a scar from my 2nd degree tear, but perhaps I was too distracted with all the mystery things to notice :blush:


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## cleckner04

:rofl: I'm sure mine doesn't look the same as it did years ago. I've never really looked too much at mine. Vaginas are gross. I would be a horrible lesbian. :rofl: 


Overcomer- Hey hun. :wave: Sorry you've been feeling down lately. :hugs:


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## Shiv

If I am honest i wouldn't know what it looked like before I had Sophia, and I am not sure how I would actually get to see it at the moment - I would need about 10 mirrors all lined up to get past the bump! And yes I had a 2nd degree tear too


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## spidey

there are a serious lack of real life, non-sexual images of vagina's on google :haha:

I guess the biggest difference is before Kira things seemed symmetrical down there, but now it's just a jumble of unknown parts :rofl:

I would be an awful lesbian too :haha:

oh, and :hi: overcomer


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## Shiv

major feeling sorry for myself rant coming up................

So having been told bubs was head down at my last appt, I went ahead and booked for a midwife to come to the house for a home birth assessment. Sjhe was lovely and very positive (and shcoked when I told her that the last woman was very anti- home birth, apparently she attended her last home birth with this midwife and she is generally very happy and pro-home/natural birth)..............anyway, we went through all the paperwork and had a chat etc and I was feeling really good about it. Foolishly (or not) i asked her to check the position of bubs as I feared s/he would go transverse again. So she did and baby is now BREECH and their bum is well wedged apparently! SO either the doctor got it wrong or bubs did a flip. So i am booked in for a scan on Tuesday, if baby is breech then they will book me in for an ECV (If I want it, which I think I do as I want to avoid a c-sec if poss), then if that doesn;t work a probable c-sec or depending on teh consutant their is a slim chance they would let me try to deliver naturally. I am so disapointed. I know there is still time, but I had just relaxed a bit and started considering that I might actually get my home birth. What makes it worse is that David goes to Holland on Sunday. My friend is down but she will have to watch the children (Sophia and her little boy) while I go to hospital for a scan. The scan I can cope with but if they schedule my ECV for before David gets back (Saturday am) the i will have to go through that on my own..............I feel neglected quite frankly, I know it is nothis fault but it is all just pants!


HURRUMPH


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## cleckner04

Oh hun!! I'm so sorry the stubborn LO flipped again. If I remember correctly you posted recently saying you swear you felt him/her turn again. I wish I could say something that would help but I know if you had your heart set on a home birth than it's probably very devastating for you. :hugs::hugs: I will just keep my fingers crossed for you that he/she decides to flip around again. Just try to remember no matter what, the important thing is a healthy baby and how it comes into the world is just a tiny thing in the grand scheme of it all. :hugs:



Well I've had days of highs now on my monitor. Five days of highs actually. Which is unusual. Normally I only get 3-4 days of highs and than I peak. So I'm hoping I peak tomorrow. :wacko: We've managed to have sex monday, tuesday, yesterday, and hopefully today we can too. The only reason we skipped wednesday was because DH had duty otherwise we woulda tried than too. :haha: I think this is our last month to try so we are gonna make it count. If not, I guess I should start focusing on weightloss instead again because I've not budged since DH returned. :dohh:


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## Shiv

I think you've done so well to maintain your weight with Corey back - and I hope that this is your month for a BFP. Enjoy your evening :winkwink:

Oh and Cleck - I know you had to supplement Emma with formula when she was first born, do you think this had anything to do with having a c-section? I hear a lot of women say that they struggled with supply becasue they had a c-section????


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## Mary Jo

ack, Shiv, I hope this is just temporary and baby swings back round. I know you're running short of time but I have heard of babies moving at the very last minute. don't lose hope! also, until you have a scan it *is* just guesswork. very educated guesswork, sure, but you can't be 100% certain. (that's why I was so down when I was told my LO was breech, because it was seen on a scan, and why I don't really believe he moved, despite what the mw said).

massive hugs. you know I understand how this feels, it's scary and depressing. fingers tightly crossed that s/he will settle down head first, and is just not ready for the exit yet. at least s/he *is* moving a lot, and hasn't been sitting breech for 8 weeks or something. my baby moves so much I think he's been head down, head up, head bloody everywhere.


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## cleckner04

Shiv- I think I didn't actually HAVE to supplement. They told me to of course so I did it without knowing any better. My milk didn't come in until Day 6. Which I'm sure did have something to do with the C-section. But keep in mind that I had a really rough labor first so that may have contributed to the delay. I think I could've just kept at it and Emma would have been fine without the formula. If I could do it again, I would've ignored their advice because the doctor just wanted her to gain, gain, gain and Emma ended up being a slow gainer in general even with the formula top ups for those 2 weeks. You've breastfed before so I think you won't have any issues with this new baby. Regardless of how he/she is born. :hugs: I know it must be so scary to even think about C-sections when you had a vaginal the first time. I do promise you it isn't all that bad. I have my fingers crossed that you will get the birth you want though. :hugs::hugs:


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## spidey

Shiv, I'm so sorry to hear the baby flipped a full 180 :cry: I would be devastated too. I belong to a yahoo group for people who used the same hypno birthing course that I did, and I have read MANY successful version stories! I'm so happy they're going to try a version before jumping right to a section. And for all you know, baby will make a flip head down before then. Fingers crossed that any version you need is scheduled for when David is back. Would they do a version and then an induction? After reading version stories, it seems like if you can totally relax your chances of success are high. Instinct will be to tense up.

Cleckner- I have a feeling this could be your month! Theres no excuse for the eggy not to find a sperm :haha: My milk took 6 days to come in too but I bet our milk will come in much sooner next time!

MJ- is the baby still transverse you think?

We're in the middle of a busy weekend. We had the funeral for my Aunt on Friday and I think being to 3 funerals this year has finally gotten to me so I overbooked this weekend for fun things. I didn't really talk about the other funerals on here, but my Grandma died in February after a fire accident and DH's grandma died 2 months ago. So today we took Kira to the go cart racetrack and she got half way through the course with DH and then started to cry. But me and DH were able to take turns and get some laps in :thumbup: Tomorrow we're going to a park with a river that is actually clean enough to swim in :shock: and we're going to wade in it and catch fish with a net! And since Monday is a holiday, we're heading to another park to rent a rowboat! 

I ovulated on Friday last week, so today is 8 days post ovulation. I'm not planning to test right now, but I suppose I can test soon. I don't have any symptoms, although my nips are a different kind of sore which I think is from teeth rubbing rather than pregnancy sore. But I can't be 100% certain so there is still some hope. I would love for this to be my month but I'm trying to mentally prepare for another negative.


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## cleckner04

Well it's day 7 of only high readings on my monitor. No peaks at all. :cry: We've still been :sex: every day just in case but DH is gone tomorrow and than for the entire week so this was my only day to do it during a peak time. And it didn't peak so we won't be able to try if it does. I don't think it will even peak this cycle. Maybe I didn't ovulate at all this month. :shrug: which would be just my luck. I'm feeling very FML lately. And I hate that saying but I've really been feeling it. :( I seriously hate TTC and being disappointed every month. Why can't I just have an "accident" like the rest of the world and end up pregnant without meaning to. :lol:


spidey- I'm sorry you've had so many losses this year. :(:hugs: I'm glad you guys are having fun this weekend! Go-Karting is so much fun! Although I've never done it at an actual track. My SIL owns them so we go all over their yard. :haha: I wish DH got monday off! His ship is awful though. They don't care if it's a holiday.


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## jelr

Hey girls

MJ: I'm so glad you are feeling a lot better, I knew it was just exhaustion. It is so hard to deal with a toddler when your exhausted, let alone heavily pregnant. The stairs definitely looks much safer, I love the bed set you are getting Adam. We have done a few stickers and DH did them I have to say, most of them though were easy enough, excpet the ones we have in the new playroom as they were ones I got from ebay and the quality was awful, so we had to take them really carefully off the backing so as they wouldn't care. I reckon C will have no problem with them as they are more than likely good quality. Just make sure and be certain on where you are putting them before actually putting them up as I made that mistake with one lot and because I moved them, they weren't as sticky and fell off the wall. How did Adam get on with C's mum?

Spidey: I'm so so sorry about your Aunt and about your other losses this year. I dont blame you for wanting a fun filled weekend, I really hope it was everything that you hoped it would be and more, you definitely deserve it. Fx that AF doesn't turn up this month. Sorry to hear that DH has been talking about not having anymore children too. I definitely think it doesn't matter how many years are between you, siblings getting on or not on, has a lot to do with personalities and also the family environment. There are 7 of us and some get on and some don't and it definitely doesn't have anything to do with age gaps. I am very close with them all and some of the boys say I'm their cool mother as they can come to me with any problem and the age gaps I have with them all varies between 2 years and 12 years.

Overcomer: Sorry to hear you are down lately.

Shiv: You definitely dont look to have any fat at all, you are being too hard on yourself. I'm so so sorry that bubs is breech now. I really hope that the ECv is after David gets back or even better that bubs has turned before the scan. I know I would be devestated too so you are quite entitled to rant.

Cleck: so so sorry you are feeling FML - I do know how you feel though, I was the very same when we were trying with Natasha and even more then after the 1st MC becasue so many others seemed to get pregnant by accident and now even want it when we did so so much. It really is heartbreaking and so cruel when it takes so long for it to happen for people that want children so much and I know it has to be harder when you are on a timetable with DH's job. I really do hope this month is for you.

Well massive massive :hugs: :hugs: to you all as it seems like everyone is having a hard time. I really hope it all changes for you all soon. :hugs:

Well we had a great day at the wedding after, but I ended up at the doctors the day after as this dose was getting worse and I was running a temp and started to cough up horrilbe stuff so he put me on an antibiotic as he reckons I have a sinus and throat infection. Broke my heart to shell out &#8364;80 between the doctor and prescription, but I had spent 2 weeks trying to let my own immune system fight it and just want to be better before facing work tomorrow and even though I still feel crappy, I'm much better today than I have been over the past week, so it is all good. So we just spent the last few days lazing around at home which was actually quite nice to just have time for the three of us before heading back to the grindstone. I had a few tears this evening, so hopefully that is out of the way and I wont have them tomorrow as I could do with not having to start the day with my make up down my face :haha: and I won't cry before I leave the house as I wouldn't upset Natasha and she will probably be still sleeping anyway, which is probably better as I said it to her today that mammy would be working tomorrow and she actually started to cry, I didn't think she would even take much notice of what I was saying and was sorry I had when she got upset, but I don't like her just waking up tomorrow and I'm not here without any explanation. I know she will be fine in the morning once she wakes up and my mam is here and she will have loads of fun with my brothers :thumbup: 

anyway that is my moan over with and compared to what you girls have going on, I don't have much to moan about and I know once this week is over I will be fine, I just need to adjust again :thumbup:


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## spidey

good luck at your first day back tomorrow jelr :hugs: That's so sad that Natasha cried when you said you were going back to work :cry:. I'm sure she'll have a great time at your mom's so you shouldn't worry about her. Are you going to try and squeeze all your work into 3 days again? I hope you still find some time to post here :hugs: I'm glad you're going to start feeling better soon with your antibiotics :thumbup:

Cleckner, what is up with your monitor??? How can you be at "high" for 7 days? There is no way its picking up LH because LH doesn't slowly increase like that. Is it reading some other hormone? Or maybe it's factoring in your "average" cycle length and figuring that this cycle will be just as long. Are you having any other signs of ovulation? Ugh, so annoying- but don't give up hope since those spermies can survive a good amount of time up there. I'm with you on feeling down about this TTC thing. An old friend from HS just had a baby last year and she posted on FB that she's 8 weeks with another. She still bf's her baby too. I actually almost blocked her post from my news feed :lol: 

Today was action packed. We drove to a river and Kira had a blast wading in the river and then getting DH to take her out to the deeper parts. This evening we walked to the closest playground and let Kira take us wherever she wanted to go. So we wandered all over and had a great time. Tomorrow we're renting a canoe! 

I never fully updated on operation no deedee during the day. It was a complete success!! She only got sad about not having a deedee a few times, especially in the car. And now without a plug in her mouth, she's trying to talk more although it's still not understandable :haha:


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## cleckner04

This TTC business is bullshit. :lol: I flipped out when that status thing on facebook was going on. "X weeks and craving X" I had like three people do it within a few hours and I was chatting with DH at the time while he was on duty and I was in tears because I thought all of these girls were suddenly pregnant. :dohh: I admit that I block people that talk about their pregnancies constantly on FB. I just don't want to read it. I'm fine once they have the little ones. But it's the pregnancy talk that upsets me right now. 

I'm really not sure what is up with the monitor. I pee on it every morning and I can see that the lines are getting lighter instead of darker now. So I'm assuming I either missed my surge or I didn't ovulate at all. But I shouldn't have 'missed' it because we have had sex every day but the day he had duty. So I just have my fingers crossed that this month is it. If not, I think we may have a small chance of trying in November but it really depends when I ovulate because he's gone around the 20th. :( 

spidey- Your day sounds like it was so fun today!! I hope you guys enjoy canoeing too. I would be scared taking Emma on a canoe I think. I am scared of deep water in general though so the thought of Emma on it really scares me. I'm not really a strong swimmer. I mean I can swim but I don't think I could save someone if it ever came to that. 

jelr- I'm sorry you have been feeling sick but I'm glad you are on the mend. :thumbup:I hope Natasha has a wonderful day tomorrow and I really hope it's not TOO hard on you. I can't even imagine how hard it'd be. :hugs::hugs:


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## spidey

LOL Cleckner, I had the same thing happen on my newsfeed "I am __ weeks and craving __" The sad thing is that I don't have that many friends on there, but I have 1 blocked for having nothing but daily pointless pregnancy updates, another blocked for constantly talking bad about the president and a 3rd blocked for giving me nothing but bible quotes :rofl: Other irritating updates are blocked on a case by case basis :haha: And don't feel paranoid girls, I have NEVER blocked any of your updates. I don't want to sound like a prude as I do love hearing updates on people's pregnancies, but some people won't leave it alone and it takes a long time before my buttons are pushed.

I think it's very possible that your monitor missed your surge. I am keeping my fingers super crossed for you for the next 2 weeks. 

Kira is saying "A boooo' which means "get up" so I best listen!


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## cleckner04

Well day 8 of High reading without a peak. :wacko: I don't get it either because the line is barely even there anymore so it's amazing that it's even a 'high'. I do remember a few days back the lines were really dark and the same color so I think that was my peak and it missed it. Although this machine is supposed to be really accurate so maybe I didn't ovulate at all. 

And DH leaves today for the week so thats our only chance till November because he's gone for my entire next cycle. 


spidey- Yeah I blocked people if that's all they ever talk about. It's so irritating to see twenty pregnancy updates a day from one person. But people like Shiv and MJ are not blocked because you girls aren't always talking about it. :haha:


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## Mary Jo

:lol: I keep pregnancy off Facebook completely, other than when I posted the 20 week scan pics. don't think I've mentioned it, other than in the group, since.

however *Adam* is the subject of most of my updates. :haha:

(will come back and post again later, been a busy day, our toilet started playing up last week and something went very wrong yesterday so have had a plumber in today and we've had to get a new one. fortunately the plumber is extended family - Chris's brother in law's step dad- so it didn't cost as much as it might.)


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## jelr

Spidey: Well done to Kira on getting rid of her deedee and I'm delighted her speech is improving :thumbup: - I'm so glad you have had a fun few days.

Cleck: It does sound like something is up with the monitor, surely if the lines were really dark that was your peak and now it is on the way down again, when does it usually start going back to Low, it will be interesting to see if it stays at high then too. I definitely think you are in with a really good chance when you have dtd every day and even though you missed that one day, those spermies should still be around from the day before :thumup:

MJ: Sorry to hear you are having problems with the loo - glad you got it sorted so quickly and cheaply though as it is not something that you can do without, especially not when pregnant :haha:

Shiv: I just want to wish you the very best of luck for tomorrow, I really hope it goes well.

[[[[Edited, so the whole world doensn't know my pay ha ha]]]]

This whole recession here just sickens me, it is normal hardworking people like us who are suffering. I have worked my way up for years and went back to get a better education for myself and was in a high paying job, but now it is like it is all for nothing and will now be on an extremely low paying job and the cost of everything is just getting worse. I have worked out that we actually have &#8364;650 a week going out in bills and we dont live in luxury or anything, that would just cover the mortgage, the insurances you have to have with the mortgage, the shopping, phones, petrol and car insurance, the bins,electricity and sky tv - like in fairness there is not even much there we could cut back on. I'm just sick of suffering for the mistakes that the fat cats made and I'm sick of this year in general, it is like two steps forward and three back grrrrr.

Sorry girls I know that was a rant and a half - So so annoyed right now.


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## spidey

jelr, that is so unfair :growlmad: I can't believe they cut your pay, let alone that much! It's not fair to the students especially if everyone is in a sour mood over their pay cuts and slack off as a result. They needed to reduce salary amounts of the local government employees and DH ended up with 2 weeks of unpaid leave, which is so much better than working the same hours but making less. Why did they wait till your first day to tell you? Oooo, I would be just as irate as you. We're in the same boat in regards to my salary. We could survive with DH's salary alone, but we wouldn't have a penny extra. I hope you can figure out what to do. :hugs: Will this be a permanent cut?

MJ, I hope the toilet gets sorted out. It's great to have a plumber in the family :thumbup:

Cleckner, your fertility monitor totally needs new batteries :haha: I would count your peak as the day with the darkest line and ignore the monitor for this month.

I know you girls all like to use crock pots so I have a recipe to share! I made this today: https://www.bhg.com/recipe/chicken/dried-plum-and-olive-chicken/ I'm not sure how the non-US girls would like this as it's a bit sweet with the honey and prunes (I remember the thought of having cranberry sauce with thanksgiving was a bit repulsive :rofl: ) It was super easy and very tasty! I thickened the final sauce with some corn starch and it made a nice gravy :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

Day 9 of a high reading. :wacko: :shrug:


jelr- That is absolutely appalling that they can cut your pay so much and still expect you to work just as many hours. :wacko: I'm sorry you're dealing with this mess. :hugs::hugs: 

spidey- I don't like sweet stuff on things that are meant to be savory. :haha: Cranberry sauce at thanksgiving IS repulsive. :rofl: Do you always use corn starch to make gravy? I've always used flour but is corn starch better? 

shiv- Read your good news on FB!!! :dance::dance: I'm so happy baby is head down now! I think your LO has to be a boy. Giving you trouble already like that. :haha:


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## spidey

ooooooh Cleckner, how dare you say you don't like cranberry sauce with turkey! :haha:

I use corn starch since I can't eat wheat... but even if I could eat wheat I would still use corn starch since I have no idea how to thicken things otherwise :haha:

woooohooo Shiv!!! I'm sooo happy the baby is head down!! :happydance::happydance:

Today is day 11 post ovulation, so my luteal phase might be good this month :thumbup: Kira really cut back on booby for most of the month, although for the last 4 days she's been asking for booby quite frequently. I'm hoping its a temporary thing since her latch doesn't seem so great these days and my poor nips aren't feeling so great. I'm going through the lanolin like crazy!


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## cleckner04

Woo hoo for a good luteal phase hun!!! :dance: are you having any symptoms yet for either AF or preg? Maybe your nips aren't feeling great because you are pregnant!! :lol: 


I've been doing some reading on why I'm only getting high readings. Apparently the monitor does that if you don't ovulate. :( So I don't think I ovulated this month. Go figure it's just my luck. :growlmad:


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## Shiv

jelr - so sorry about your pay cut - that is awful about your pay cut, this recession sucks ass. I hope you can come up with a way to stay home with Natasha more and still earn some money. I really feel for you, they made a bad day even worse. :hugs:

Cleck - your monitor sounds a bit whacked to me. Don't give up hope this month, there is no reason why you wouldn't have ovulated this month, so assume that you have and wait and see what happens. Fingers crossed for you. I really want for you to get pregnant.

Spidey - 11 day luteal phase is good, hold on a few more days and then a BFP. So sorry about all your losses this year, glad you had a great weekend, it sounds fun, especially the go-karting and river wading.

I am in agreement with Cleck, sweet stuff with savoury doesn't work, so cranberry sauce is a no go here. I use corn flour to thicken stuff, which I am guessing is the same as corn starch. Much better at thickening than just normal flour, you only need a small amount.

MJ - how are you doing? Have you had your iron levels back yet? When is your next midwife appt?

Well as for me, as you've seen on fb (sorry for the pregnancy status :winkwink:) baby is head down :happydance:. Was SO relieved! However i lost a big chunk of my mucus plug now, and feel a bit different 8down there*, so I am majorly panicking about baby coming soon and David not being here. So David is going to be back about midnight on Friday and my parents go away tomorrow, my friend is here until Thursday, but that gives me someone to watch Sophia but not help me! eek, I SO should have organised things better, but I didn't want to plan for a birth that I couldn't have. SHIT!

On the up side I just ordered a birth pool which should be here on THursday. But I really feel like my waters are gonna break any minute - I hope I'm wrong and it'll probably be anoher 3weeks!


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## Mary Jo

yay, Shiv! am so glad baby is definitely head-down, and like I said on FB, I do wonder if s/he was all along and it was the mw who got it wrong. is s/he engaged at all? are you bouncing on a ball to try to make sure baby doesn't shift again?

fx that your plug starting to come away doesn't mean you're about to pop! I had a very small amount the other morning, quite definite about what it was, but such a little bit I'm not at all concerned or reading anything into it. however, C, who is massively busy at work (at this point - he is preparing all the literature for his organisation's annual congress in a couple of weeks' time - he is relying on other people getting their arses in gear and doing their bit so as to hit deadlines) is not above telling people I had a "show" and putting the wind up them that he's soon to be off on paternity and to get a move on! none of these people knew what a show or a plug was, so I guess they all went and consulted Dr Google. I was slightly mortified by this. :rofl: Chris knows it is meaningless at this early stage but he let them all think otherwise!

Spidey, so sorry about the loss of your aunt, and your other losses this year. that's really rough. glad to hear you had a fun weekend though. as for vaginas, eeeek, brave lady having a look. I don't think I've looked at all since Adam was born, I know it feels a little different (also had a 2nd degree tear). C has never commented, and I actually think he would if it had been majorly rearranged, he wouldn't bother about being kind or sensitive, so I have to presume it's basically the same as before! oh, and brilliant news about operation deedee! I would love Adam to ditch his but am thinking he does get so much comfort from it, and he's had a lot to deal with, and much more to come, so along with potty training it's not something I'm going to push. I love it when he gives it to me when I ask, though, he knows we don't want him to have it all the time. but I can't cope with not having something to help when he's driving me mad with the screaming.

fx that your longer LP isn't really, and you get a BFP instead. :D am thinking positive for you.

also for you Cleck. I do empathise about feeling that other people get knocked up exactly when they want to/without trying. it's hard under any circumstances but especially when you've only got a limited TTC window because of Corey's job. and super frustrating about the monitor. have you ever thought about temping? like I said to Spidey, the advantage of that is that it won't leave you under any doubt that you ovulated or not. also about Facebook, I have a lot of hidden statuses, for loads of reasons but pregnancy/children is definitely one of them. it actually annoys me that I don't have the guts to unfriend them as it's nobody I am at all close to.

as for sweet condiments with a savoury dish - it's one of my pet hates as well. so no apple sauce with pork (though I only very rarely eat pork anyway), no mint with lamb, no cranberry with turkey... yuck. I don't know why I hate it so much but I always have! my one exception I guess would be tomato ketchup. I suppose it is sweet but to me it is more acidic. am very much a fan of mustard, all kinds, mild and strong.

Jean, ack, I don't blame you for being livid about your job, I'm so sorry. Ireland is still in so much shit, it's terrible. as you know I work on the Irish edition of the Sunday Times and so I am hearing more than I would under normal circumstances in the UK. it really really sucks, I know it is so much worse for you all than it is over here. it's not fair that it's people who have always been responsible and lived within their means who are being affected so badly. it's the stupid banks' fault, lending so much money to people who never had a hope of being able to pay it back. definitely know what it's like to be in the situation where you can pay the bills but have nothing much left on only DH's salary. when I was working 3 days a week I was able to save a fair bit but on 1 day a week, I can't (and it's not even been 1 day a week - 3 days a months is more like it recently), and though C assures me we're ok, I do worry. thankfully I found out I am getting statutory maternity pay, so I will have a small income myself from when it starts, hopefully in early Oct, for nine months. I am already worrying about how we'll manage if I don't get shifts once that is finished. I'd like to do the odd shift, but no idea if I will be asked. the thing is, I can only really do Saturdays, unless my mum is available to come here to babysit.

speaking of my mum, she did actually come down this past weekend. I went to work on Thur, and was asked to do Fri. C couldn't take the day off and he didn't want to ask his mother again, so I asked mine. I paid her train ticket (it's not as expensive as it otherwise would be because she has an over 60s' railcard) and met her at the station at 12.30pm, handed Adam over, and then went and did a 2-10pm shift. it was fine. and as I didn't get a Saturday shift, it meant I was able to have a really relaxed Saturday as my mum took care of Adam. C also had pretty much a free day, he went out by himself for a few hours, while I slept late and then dyed my hair. then in the evening we decided to leave my mum and Adam and went to Ikea and bought some furniture for Adam's bedroom. so now the carpet is all in (and looks great) and Adam has a chest of drawers and a bookcase with a cupboard above, and his bed has been assembled, we're almost ready for him to go in. sheets etc are washed, I bought a duvet, so just need to iron the duvet cover. haven't got the wall stickers yet but I will. our plan was to have it all ready for Adam tomorrow (though he's already been in and seems to like it) only now Chris wants to leave putting him in the bed till after my mum has been down again (she's coming from next Wed, the 14th, till Tue the 20th). I don't know about that, I actually think Chris is going to find it hard kicking him out of our room, and I'd like to get him used to the idea of being in his own room and bed more than a month before my EDD. otherwise I can see me and the new baby moving in to the new bedroom and leaving C and Adam in ours!

the day at C's mum's went well, she enjoyed it and said he was lovely, anyway, and wants to have him again. I hope he enjoyed it, but I didn't really see him till the next day because he was sound asleep when I got in from work.

haven't rung about my iron levels, must remember to do that tomorrow as I have my appt a week on Thur, the 15th. my "booking in" appt, which I am hoping won't be as long as my first one, since I do have my notes and all my blood test results from when it was done in March. I guess it'll also be a general antenatal appt. not sure if they'd offer a scan quite yet (I'll be 35+1) if they think baby is still breech. I have no idea where he is, though I don't feel a big hard lump beneath my ribs on my left side, which is where his head was at my 4D scan and where the mw said his bum was last time I saw one. so I hope he's in a better position but I just can't tell. 

we'll see. I read a thread in 3rd tri about moxibustion and the lady was praising it, so it's something to keep in mind if it's not good news!

other than that, I am feeling bigger and slower and much more SPD-ish. it's not terrible, but it wears me down. I am ok once I am walking about, it's when I have to get up from sitting or lying, and turning in bed or changing position when sitting. bump feels so massive, but I laid down and measured my fundal height a few days ago and I was 34cm, so exactly on target. also measured my waist and I was 42.5inches round. jesus.


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## jelr

thanks girls I have calmed down a lot today and myself and DH have had a long talk and some of the girls were on to me because of my fb rant so after talking it all out I feel a lot better, have decided I'm only going to cut down to 2 days and if the work doesn't get done then, there is nothing I can do. I have explained this to my boss and she is in agreement, she is so good, it is just higher above that are making the cuts and she totally understands me not doing the 3 days and trying to manage to pay my mam out of what is left, so even though we will be down a huge chunk of money and I don't really know how much it is until it comes in. I'm going to take the postive from it that I will get an extra day with N. I have no idea if it will work as things may completely fall apart and I could be pulled up on it, but all I can do is try. I do feel sorry for the students as they will suffer and I know it I am making it worse on mine by cutting back the days, but I have to look after my own little family first and this way I at least save on a days childcare and I'm sorry but I have always done over and above for my learners and for work, but I'm not prepared to be away from my daughter for 3 days when she doesn't get the benefit by us having an extra few bob. I know that is selfish in one sense, but she is what is most important and I won't make any apology for that :thumup: - I'm hoping maybe now that my earnings are lower that my taxes and levies will now be too, so maybe I will be able to claw some of the loss back, but I won't be sure until my pay comes in and we will just have to see how it goes.

Spidey: Yay for the longer luteal phase and fx for a bfp instead :thumup: - Yeah I have to agree I'm not a sweet and savory kind of gal either, in fact I'm not really a sweet gal at all and much prefer savory stuff, although in saying that I do love sweet and sour or sweet chilli chicken, so maybe I would like it, although I do hate prunes. Yep I'm afraid I think it will be a permenant cut as our country is still in receivership with the IMF basically and I know our goverment has to cut another 10 billion in the next few years, so when we have the budget in Dec, I reckon we will all be hit again :growl:

Cleck: I reckon you did ovulate the fact that the lines got so dark and there is something up with the monitor. Bet this will be your month when you are worrying that you didn't OV at all and then you will know we were all right about your monitor :thumup:

Shiv: I'm am so so delighted for you, I had a quick read on my phone when out for a cigerette at work today and it really did cheer me up, I'm so so happy for you and think baba will stay put until David comes home, this one just likes to worry you, but is a good BOY (i'm even more convinced it is a boy now) in the end :haha:

MJ: That is great news that Adam got on so well with your MIL and with your mum and it is nice that you got a little break. You will have to put up some photos of Adam's new room. How do you think he will get on in the bed? Yep our economy is in big mess and will be for years to come. I really hope your spd doesn't get anyworse, you actually brought mine back to me as that is exactly how mine was and hurt like hell turning over at night or getting up, so I do sympathise.

Just a question, do your LO's use a spoon, kife properly yet, Natasha still doesn't, she can use them, but drops most of it off before reaching her mouth most of the time :haha: but she usually eats with her fingers most of the time. I'm just thinking should I be trying to get her to use the cutlery more as it probably would look more mannerly :haha: but then at the same time, I'd much prefer her to get the food into her mouth and am happy once she is fed and I do presume she will use the cutlery much more once she can completely manage it properly.


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## Mary Jo

Jean, Adam is keen to use his cutlery but isn't always successful, and he does use his fingers a lot still. If I give him, say, a yogurt, I let him do it himself with a spoon, and he is sometimes fine and sometimes spreads it all over the table and himself, but Chris likes to feed him, which we never did when he was weaning, so it irritates me a bit, but I know C is just trying to cut down on the mess. plus he likes the game and Adam says "train" and "aeroplane" and C likes that. I must confess to frequently giving Adam food still that can be easily managed with fingers. but if I give him a fork and prepare the food so he can spear it easily (sometimes I forget) he will have a go. I gave him a potato waffle and baked beans for his lunch today and he did very well with the fork, all the waffle and most of the beans. he'll get there and so will Natasha. they have their whole lives to demonstrate their good manners!


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## spidey

you girls are no fun with your dislike of sweet and savory mixed! If any of you visit me, half my meals would be out of the question :haha: Cleckner, do you dip breakfast sausage into syrup? 

Kira is pretty good at using a spoon (with her left hand). Like Adam, sometimes she'll eat something very neatly and other times it's spread all over the table and down her shirt. Even so, she eats most things with her fingers, but so do I :haha:

I hope you girls are right about me getting a bfp this month. I don't feel it though.. maybe I will test in the morning. I should be 12 days post Ov. by then.

jelr, I think cutting it down to 2 days is the right thing. You can keep some extra income for fun times, but still have 3 days during the week with Natasha. I didn't know that you paid your mom. My poor mom works for free :blush: But you're right- you need to look after your family first. I went through the same thing when Kira was a baby and my boss told me I needed to work 40 hours/week. She could not understand my logic behind wanting to spend time with my daughter versus work my butt off to the point of regret and exhaustion.

MJ, how horrifying that your DH was talking about your plug at work. I bet a few of them were traumatized by their google searches :haha: Thats sweet that Adam will hand over his pacifier when asked. I feel the same way about Kira needing something for comfort. She gets frustrated so easily because she has so much to say but she can't say it. She still has my boobs as comfort for those really bad meltdowns. I would love to see pictures of Adam's room too!

I decided to try temping for this next cycle (you sold me MJ!) I already found the thermometer and put it next to the bed. I usually have 22-26 days after AF before I ovulate, so that'll be plenty of time to get used to taking my temperature in the morning :thumbup: It should be a fun experiment!

Shiv, I'm really curious on where you're planning to put your birthing pool?


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## cleckner04

I don't really like syrup period. I don't even put it on my pancakes. :haha: I just eat my pancakes plain. Or with chocolate chips in them like I did tonight. :thumbup: 


Emma is really good with utensils. She's never used a knife to cut up her own food or anything like that though. She will actually get really upset if I don't give her a fork or spoon with her meals. She does eat some stuff with her hands but stuff like cereal and milk she does really well with. I'm actually even confident enough to let her eat it in the living room watching spongebob in the mornings. :haha: We did BLWing though so that may have contributed to that since she's been practicing with utensils from the start. But she still doesn't speak in full sentences or count or anything so she's kinda behind the others in that regard. 


All this talk of plugs makes me wonder if I was ever meant to give birth vaginally. I never had anything like that happen for myself. No plug loss, no nothing as far as signs of labor. Makes me question my body a bit. And now I won't ever know because I don't really have the urge to even attempt a VBAC.


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## spidey

OMG no syrup!?? :haha:

I didn't lose my plug or have any bleeding whatsoever :shrug: My water popped at 41+3 and then Kira came out 10 hours later. Seeing a plug would have freaked me out :haha:


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## spidey

oh, I forgot to mention that I got a bfn this morning :wacko:


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## cleckner04

:haha: Nope no syrup. I sometimes put a little bit of it on the plate so if I feel like dipping than it's there but I hate when the pancakes get soggy with it. I'm not much of a maple person in general though. I hate maple donuts too. :sick: :haha:

Sorry for the BFN. :hugs: I'm glad I don't have any pregnancy tests in my house. I think I'd be taking them every day if I had some in stock. :blush:


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## Mary Jo

with Adam I lost a chunk of plug (not a huge amount, I've heard some women say theirs was the size of a dinner plate) on the Monday, 39+6, and he was born on the Saturday, 40+4. it did give me some hope that *something* was happening. then my waters started leaking at 40+3, but again not much. wish I'd never gone to hospital to get it checked, there was no meconium in them or anything. next time I am sitting tight unless there is a substantial amount!

sorry about the BFN, Spidey. I know it's disheartening but while AF stays away there is always hope. :) I was never an early tester, I couldn't bear the disappointment. again another advantage of temping - I knew a day before my period started that it would because my temp would drop two days running, and definitely the day it would start it would be way down. with Adam my suspicions were raised when my temp went really high the day after I'd normally get my period, it *had* dropped a bit the day before and I thought it was all over, but then it went up again, so I tested. I think it was 16 or even 17 DPO, and my normal luteal phase was 15 days.

in the UK syrup never goes with savoury food. I like maple syrup on pancakes, or ice cream, and I *love* maple glazed Krispy Kreme doughnuts, but not really anything else. I like golden syrup on toast or scotch pancakes or crumpets. :D the thought of syrup with sausage turns my stomach, actually. :lol:

actually the one food Adam refuses to eat with a spoon is cereal. I make it so he can pick it up, I pour the milk on, let it sit for a minute then pour the rest into my bowl. he has cereal he can eat easily, like mini shredded wheats, cheerios and branflakes. 

Jean, I think you're doing the best thing for your family, you're right, you have to think of your family first, it's a shame about the students but they are not your first responsibility. :kiss:

Adam has been a right monkey today. his latest naughtiness is to dig in the tomato plants and tip soil everywhere. he's already picked most of the tomatoes and either eaten them or thrown them down (green ones). yesterday he tipped up the cucumber plant, and ate the one little cucumber that was left, and covered himself in the dirt. same thing today, came in filthy. he's also started tipping Betty's (my cat's) dry food into her water dish. he won't respond to "no" or being told off. and the grabbing at me is getting worse. I hate it. gah.


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## Shiv

MJ - the consultant didn't say if s/he was engaged and I was just so relieved that I raced out of there without asking anything! I haven't been bouncing yet but I guess I should start again!

David also discussed my plug with his colleagues in Holland and OVER DINNER! none of them had ever heard of losing a plug either and some of the women had children!

My midwife suggested moxibustion to me and said it had a much higher success rate than ECV - 70% she quoted so def worth a go, but I bet Joel is head down now.

jelr - you are not selfish at all, you have to do what is right for your family, and working extra hours for no pay is not what is best for your family. It sounds like going down to two days is the right thing to do. I am glad your boss is understanding. Has she had her pay cut too?

SOphia will use a spoon to eat yoghurt or breakfast , and she can prong with a fork but gets bored very quickly and then uses her hands. I was going to ask the question on fb actually as I feel like Sophia should be using cutlery all the time and not just on occasion, but you girls have convinced me she is ok. 

Cleck - it is interesting that Emma uses her fork so well, Sophia was BLW as well (as was Adam I believe? an dI put it down to this that she wasn;t so good with a fork/spoon. I do think you are right though, toddlers of this age pick their skills, whilst Sophia chats away shovelling food into her face with her hands, Emma is carefully using her cutlery. I guess they will all even out in time and be able to do everything.

Spidey - I plan to put my pool in the lounge as I want to be able to watch tv whilst in it! I ordered it last night and now just need to get soem waterproof sheets to go under and around it!

Sorry for the BFN SPidey, i wish I could just magic you and Cleck pregnant.

As for us, well as you may have seen on fb - David is back early from Holland as it was bad weather. So my friend who had been staying went home just now. It had been lovely having her here but Sophia has been a nightmare at times, and her little boy was a nightmare at times as well - they seemed to play off each other. SO let me tell you the issues as I would like your opinions.

SO her little boy is 19 months old and pretty much as big as Sophia and much stockier. He kept pushing Sophia and hitting his mum and trying to eat play-doh. The problem I had is this, his mum refused to say "no" to him. She would reprimand but it always started with either "hey hey" which to me is far to jovial for a telling off, or she just said "Ewan we don't hit/ eat play-doh/push" etc. Basically he ignored her and I can't help but think that if she had taught him the word "no" then it would be easier. Sophia knows the word no, so as soon I say it she stops doing whatever it is (well usually, sometimes, maybe!) then I can explain to her what she is doign wrong. My friends child just carried on until she has finished explaining to him. I worry that if it came to him running into a road then "Ewan, we don't run in the road" will be too little too late. Do your LO's understand no? Are you trying to teach them no? I know that toddlers don't always listen it was more the fact that she didn't even say the word to him that bothered me. The funny thing was that while we were at soft play she said it several time to strangers!

As for Sophia well she has been a madam. Her latest "game" is this e.g. She will say she has finished her dinner, so I ask her if she is sure and should I take it away, she says yes, so I take it away, she screams that she wants her dinner again and has a meltdown. So I give it back, she they screams that she doesn't want it, so I take it away and so on and so on with a continuing tantrum. So after a couple of tries I talk sternly to her and say "right, do you want your dinner? if you do then you can have it, but if you ask for it to be taken away then you won't get it back again" or words to that affect. She gets it back and then screams so I take it and put it in the bin - queue even bigger meltdown. But if I don't do it the "game" just goes on and on. it isn't just with dinner, it could be with going upstairs, playing with a certain toy, getting in the car etc etc many times a day. I just don't know how to handle it. What would you do?


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## jelr

thanks girls - I know Im doing the right thing, but still hate that the leaners have to lose out, but Natasha is what is most important to me, but its glad to hear that others thing I'm right too, so I dont feel so selfish :thumup:

Thanks for the feedback on the cutlery too, glad to know she is not the only one, she can use her spoon for a yogurt, but for anything else, it is 50/50 whether she will get it all into her mouth and she really just isn't bothered using them and seems to prefer her hands, I'm not too worried really, was just wondering if she was the only one and maybe it was because I leave her too using her hands too much instead of maybe encouraging her to use the cutlery more, but I'm sure she will do it in her own time. yeah it is funny how they all differ in their skills, but then they are like adults and have things they are good and not so good at.

Spidey: I actually shuddered when I read that you dip your sausages in syrup, Yuck. :haha: - so sorry about the bfp - but I do agree with MJ, you are not out until AF arrives, I know you are probably sick of us saying that every month.

Cleck: I didn't lose any of my plug either, I had no symptoms at all until my waters just went at 40+1.

MJ and Shiv: I can't believe your hubbies were talking about your plug's :haha: - I would say DH would be the very same, they just don't care do they. I actually wouldn't even say it myself to anyone only you girls or my mam or sister or my close friends.

MJ: Sorry to hear Adam is being a monkey. Would a little sandbox help keep him out of the plants and he could still dig and tip to his hearts content? I do know the grabby days Natasha has I do find hard also.

Shiv: Natasha did that a few times on me last week, where she said she had enough dinner and then when I threw it out she screamed, but I had already thrown it out so we didn't actually have the game as there is normally no hope of getting anymore in when she says she has had enough. I don't actually have any advise on what to do, I would say it is just a phase though and hopefully it won't be long lasting. I think you are doing the right thing by not playing the "game" - I know it is causing a bigger meltdown, but I think if you do, she will continue with it for longer as she knows she is getting her own way and winding you up.

As for your friends little boy - I am definitely trying to teach her no. I do try and explain like your friend did that we don't hit and why, but I do use no beforehand, although I have to be honest Natasha doesn't stop in her tracks when I do say it. I haven't really had to use it much since she was a small baby and was into everything, but I know this week I have had to use it more, but being honest she doesn't stop in her tracks and does just ignore me :haha: and she is also going through a phase of telling me no for everything :haha:


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## spidey

Shiv, playdough tastes really bad! I'm surprised he was eating it :haha: Kira understands "no" but I don't use it often, although I would use it for eating playdough or hitting. Yesterday she bit my leg and I said very sternly "NO, do NOT bite" and I could tell she knew mommy was serious (and she needed a booby from the trauma I caused by yelling :haha:) When Kira first played with playdough, she tried eating it and I said "no no mouth" and she understood. If she didn't I would have taken the playdough away and tried again a few months later. 

Oh gosh... Sophia sounds just like Kira! I wouldn't recommend listening to any advice I have to offer since Kira eats her dinner on my lap and she often stands up and sways back and forth and chews while I try to stuff food in my face and keep her from falling at the same time :blush: :haha: But.. that being said... could you move her plate to the side rather than take it away, so if she changes her mind she can pull it back in front of her. I guess it depends on where she eats her dinner- if she's at the table or in a high chair. Kira changes her mind all the time and is quick to melt down if I don't do exactly what she wants.

MJ- Adam sounds like Kira.. she picks every green tomato off the plant and throws them, so I have no chance of a red tomato. I gave up on trying to stop her. She also likes to water my rosemary plant so she drowns the poor plant over and over again and then swooshes her hands in the muddy pot :dohh: I let her get away with it because she can entertain herself for a long time. A sandbox does sound like a good idea since he likes digging so much.

Shiv- good idea to have the pool by the tv! I would probably put mine in the livingroom too so I could keep an eye out the front window at the same time.


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## cleckner04

You know, I've read on this forum several times about mothers who refuse to use the word 'no' unless its in an emergency sort of situation. I seriously don't understand why. :shrug: It sounds like this woman is the same. I can't even count the amount of times I've said no. Or she also listens to 'uh huh'(sp?). Emma listens sometimes and other times not. I'll say 'no no Emma' when she's being naughty. So now when she's telling off the dogs she'll say 'no no Diesel' or 'no no Roxy' :rofl: Some days when she's really being stubborn I'll tell her no and she'll yell it back to me and laugh. :dohh: 


I'm so delighted today Emma threw the dogs ball and pointed to it and said 'Go Diesel, ball!'. :haha: I think she's trying to form a real full sentence!! She often asks 'where's ---' but never usually more than two word sentences. In the past two days her favorite is 'wheres daddy' though. :( Which I feel bad about.


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah and as for Sophia playing her games. Emma has done similar a few times. I think they are just trying to push the boundaries and see what we'll do for them. Emma has sometimes played the game with the dogs and that always ends in serious tears because she offers them her food and when they take it and eat it, she cries her heart out. :dohh: So I get her more food and she just repeats it.


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## Mary Jo

finally got round to calling about my 28-week blood test, the one that was done at 31 weeks. waited for about 20 mins on hold to my GP's surgery, only to be told yes they do give results over the phone but no they don't have them. they should have. shite, this is a little worrying. so the woman suggested I call the antenatal unit at the hospital, which I did, only to be told that owing to confidentiality, they *don't* give out test results over the phone! no matter if I have my hospital number, etc etc. I was starting to get upset, really had to rein myself in, and just asked if she could tell if they have any results for me, not what they are, but that they have them (because it's not so much the detail that I want but the assurance they haven't been lost, since I have yet to book in). so she did tell me that, yes they have them. I aske if they would definitely let me know if there was a problem and she said yes. so I can assume it's all fine, I think, given it's been 2.5 weeks and no word from them.

it's a relief. but I'm still a tiny bit annoyed at not getting the exact results when the doc would have been prepared to give me them. I'd understand if it was a flat policy, no results over the phone, but it isn't.

Shiv, I am trying my best to teach Adam what 'no' means, and it's a real uphill struggle. he is far from one of those children who is told once and then puts down/leaves whatever he's not meant to have/be doing. I can tell him 20 times and it won't register, or if it does he ignores it, and I have to physically remove him from what he's doing or take the object of his desire away. for example - the cat food in the cat water incident(s), he won't hear no, or he doesn't want to, so now there is no food or water left down in the kitchen. poor Betty has to come and ask. which is also a pain but less of a pain. and the dumping of the soil from the plants - I moved the plants. Chris moved them back last night, saying I just have to tell him no, and I have tried, but it's more that I don't want to have to supervise absolutely everything he does, I want him to be able to go into the garden without being on his case the whole time. so when C went out today, first thing I did was move the plants again. I know C will not be pleased but tough luck. 

I'm probably just as slack as your friend. I do try, I do say no, don't just tell him we don't do x, y or z, I mean, I say that as well, but I am quite dejected at the moment because he just doesn't seem to listen to me. he is very very good for my mum, though! she tells him no and he goes wide-eyed and steps away from whatever it is! I know it's normal for kids to defy their main carers more than non-main carers, but it's disheartening to feel I cannot discipline my child.

as for the game Sophia likes to play, I think if it was me I'd refuse to play the game at all, and be deaf to her screaming about it. we have a game with Adam that we're going to have to stop - it's from the You Tube video Charlie Bit My Finger, which is the most watched video apparently, and Adam loves it. he finds it hilarious, and has been playing the game with his dolly for ages. which is fine but he also likes to play with us and to start it was cute, but now he won't stop when we say enough, and he's biting hard and it hurts, and I think we have to draw a line under the game else he's going to think it's ok to bite. I know it's our fault for playing the game in the first place but it was really so cute that he found the video so funny and was copying it. 

Jean & Spidey, sand pit is a good idea, only thing is part of my annoyance about the plants is the fact that he comes in with soil all over him, trailing it through my house! I would hate there to be sand everywhere. :( I know, I need to be less precious about mess. I'm not excessively precious, my new settee already has chocolate biscuit marks on, where Adam ate a Fox's chocolate crunch cream and smeared the filling (a bit like Oreo filling) everywhere. again, I know, my fault for letting him have a potentially messy biscuit near my new furniture! a sand pit will be a good thing next summer I think but it's got so cool lately, and windy, and I hate to think it's be blowing everywhere. maybe I need to dig over a patch of garden and let him play and just clear up his mess when he makes it. I know with two little boys my dreams of having a nice house should be on hold for the next 12 or so years anyway. :haha:

(I really wanted the settee with machine washable covers but allowed C to get the one he prefered, which is dry-clean only. I need to sent a few pieces to the cleaners because my mum spilt a cup of coffee on one cushion, and I did wipe it with upholstery cleaner but it still left a stain. :( )

Cleck, happy birthday! I hope this year brings you much joy and you get your BFP! agree with Shiv, if I could magic them up, I'd be getting one for you and Spidey and Jean. also, yay for Emma putting some words together! Adam still only uses learnt phrases, like "get down" "up get" (I say "up you get"), I can't remember if he's ever put two words together himself. though he might have and I didn't notice. :lol:


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## spidey

MJ, that is so aggravating about your blood results. Perhaps you'll get the results after the baby is born :haha:

I'm guilty of taking away anything that I don't want Kira to mess with because I don't have the patience to say NO all the time. I guess that's why I don't say no very often... it's not that she's well behaved- it's that I have everything hidden :rofl: MJ, I'm in agreement with you- I think you should toddler proof your garden and put all the naughty things out of Adam's reach. It's tiring having to police a toddler all day. 

I love Adam's finger biting game and Emma with her sadness when the dogs eat her food :lol: So cute  Kira's most popular "game" is to bark like a dog and then DH says "where's the puppy!? Kira says "hmmm hmmm" and touches her chin and looks around like she's thinking really hard and then randomly points at things. Then DH goes around and opens cabinets and doors looking for the imaginary puppy :haha:

Still no AF. If AF comes tomorrow my LP will be 14 days :shock: It must be from the major reduction in bf this month. I bet next month my LP will be shorter because Kira ramped up her booby time after operation no dee-dee :dohh: I'm tempted to test again, but I'm going to wait and test Saturday morning if AF hasn't arrived in the night. eeek!!

Oh, re: sandboxes. If the sand is dry, it's very easy to dust off. But Kira loves mixing sand and water and rolling around in it, so it's quite messy. I will strip her down on the front porch and leave all the sandy clothes outside to dry. I don't mind Kira getting really dirty outside, but my rule is once we're done outside, then we're not going back out for a few hours. Otherwise I would be changing clothes ALL day! She wears 2-3 outfits a day and today she wore 4! :haha:


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## Shiv

Spidey - I do just move Sophia's food a little way away so that she could ask for it back, that is until after 3 goes it gets taken to the bin! Saying that we haven't had any episodes since my friend left so i guess she was just showing off.

i love the games Kira plays - she is just so imaginative!

Did AF turn up yet? Hope not!

Cleck - that is a proper sentence that Emma said! oh my she'll be away with it now!

MJ - sorry the hospital wouldn't give you your results, but I am sure they would have sent them out to you if there was anything wrong.

Oh and you are def not as slack as my friend when it comes to saying no, if you have said it once then you beat her hands down! I get that kids don't always listen to their parents "no" but it worries me that she (and other aprents as Cleck said) don't believe in saying the word at all. i think a child needs a word that they understand means stop that, even if it takes a long time for them to learn it, each time they hear it it must reinforce it.

Not much happeneing here, as you may haev seen on fb we had a trial run with the pool last night. Good job too, the adaptor wouldn't fit the kitchen tap, or the downstairs wc tap, but luckily the hose stretched upsatirs and the adaptor fitted then bath tap! We also put way too much cold water in the pool to start and ended up with a pool tempof 30 degrees instead of 37...............so definitely a learning curve. I can't quite believe I am going to try to have a home birth - eek!

I was up most of the night with terrible stomach pains, i think it was constipation but it did occur to me that it could be contractions. I was rather relieved when i finally fell asleep and woke up pain f


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## spidey

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/syrup.jpg 
We had pancakes and sausage for dinner and I couldn't resist taking a picture of DH's syrup moat to gross you all out :haha:


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## cleckner04

I'll try to reply to the recent posts later but I wanted to jump on here and share my recent update with the attached neighbors. :wacko: It's nearly midnight and I can't sleep because it keeps running over and over in my head. 

So they have ignored us and V & her DH for weeks now. We managed to get a small wave out of them once the entire time. The rest of the time they have point blank ignored us. Same with V & her DH. Corey has even went up to the attached neighbor and said 'hey whats up man' and he just completely ignored Corey and went about his business with not even a flinch for a response. :shock::wacko: 

Well today I noticed V was out with her kids and the attached neighbors kids were out there. In the past few weeks they haven't allowed their kids to play with our kids. They will come home and pull into their driveway and you can see that their kids want to come over the play and they would immediately say 'get in the house!'. So I thought it was odd that all the kids were playing out there together. I got a text from V shortly after I noticed they were out asking us to come out too. Well Emma napped and than we started slowly going out. I felt awkward because the attached neighbors were both out there. 

Remember I said the attached neighbor was pregnant? Well when we walked out she was standing there downing a beer. So my lovely DH who is always very blunt says, 'Aren't you pregnant? Why are you drinking?'. Well she says she had a miscarriage. So Corey immediately apologizes and says he's sorry he didn't know and than I explain that I've been there myself so I know how it feels. She just laughed it off and said it's okay you didn't know. 

Fast forward like 3-4 hours. Everything was still fine. The attached neighbors hung out and acted like nothing had ever happened wrong between all of us in the past few weeks. They eventually take their kids in for the night and V & her husband, Corey and I still stay outside hanging out. (our kids were all playing in my living room with Emma's toys) Well the attached husband comes out like 20 minutes after they had went inside and calls corey over to him. He immediately starts getting in corey's face about what Corey said to his wife. Saying that Corey doesn't know him and doesn't know his wife and that corey needs to keep his comments to himself. He's completely being a total asshole to corey. Corey said he didn't know and that he said he was sorry to her. This guy didn't listen at all. He just kept going on and on saying that he needs to keep his comments to himself. :wacko: Corey finally started telling the neighbor that he needs to go back into his house because corey was done listening to it. Corey's like 'I really dont care now, go back in your house'. Cause this guy just wouldn't stop. I spoke up and told him that Corey apologized and that he didn't know she lost the baby. 

I was like shaking with anger while all this was happening. It's just so surreal to me because we were all having a decent time. Than this guy comes out like a total asshole. I swear these people are so Fing bipolar. They ignore us all one second, than pretend we are the best of friends and nothing happened, than he comes out with guns blazing acting like my husband is the worst person in the world. 

Now I admit, Corey stuck his foot in his mouth. But the wife didn't seem that bothered and just laughed it off. And he apologized!! So why would the husband come out HOURS later and start stuff?!! I was so upset after he finally went in. V could tell because she offered to go for a walk with me. :lol: So we walked around the block talking about it. I was almost in tears because I always get that adrenaline rush in situations like this and when I'm coming back down from the rush I just feel the tears building up behind my eyes. So we walked and talked and she is just as confused as me. She can't believe it happened. It's just so incredibly bizarre. V kept saying 'He just made it SO awkward because we all have to live by eachother'. I seriously don't even want to leave my house if I know they are out there now. I don't even want to look at their faces again. I'm also worried that they will do something to our vehicle. Because we share a driveway. And they always play music and their TV loud to begin with and it irritates us so I have a feeling they will try to irritate us even more now. :( Corey leaves for a month after this weekend too so it's just me here dealing with them. 



:wacko: So that's my drama for the night. That was probably all jumbled to read. I don't even expect any advice or anything just wanted to get it out. I know how hard it is to have a loss and I seriously felt bad for them but now it's hard for me to feel any sympathy. :nope:


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## Shiv

Spidey - I can't even tell what is pancake and what is sausage!

Cleck - wow, sorry you had such a weird experience with your neighbours. My guess would be that her husband is very upset about the miscarriage and is taking his emotions out on Corey - but that is NO excuse for being such an asshole about it. Corey apologized and I can imagine he was very sincere about it too as he has been there. If they haven't told you then how are you supposed to know. I can imagine that you feel very protective of your family right now and a little bit scared. Could you perhaps try talking ot the wife and explain that her husband was so out fo order and that you feel very uncomfortable now.

On the upside V sounds absolutely lovely, a true friend and I am glad you have someone close by that you can rely on while Corey is away :hugs:


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## cleckner04

Well after sleeping on it I'm still just as confused as I was last night. :haha: But I feel better. I just don't understand what the husband was trying to accomplish with it all. I told Corey this morning, if he wanted Corey to apologize again that would be one thing. But coming out with guns blazing like a total jerk is not the way to accomplish that. And now we've lost all our respect for them. Corey doesn't care really. He said he deals with assholes like that at work all the time and he just ignores it. With corey though, you either love him or hate him because he does say stupid stuff a lot. He's not a mean person. He just doesn't think before he speaks..And in this situation, there is seriously no way he could've known. 


Yeah, V is really great. I'm sad that it took us this long to talk regularly and now I just have to move soon. She came to my house once when I first moved here for a playdate but she couldn't stay long because her dog had ran off and she had to go search for him. So she just stopped off at the playdate to explain the situation and that she was sorry she couldn't stay. Than we've taken our girls to the park at random times together but still never became good friends until recently.



Shiv- I saw the birthing pool picture on FB and I wanted to comment and say 'YAYYYYY!!!!' but for some reason my FB wasn't letting the picture load up so I could comment. But I got so excited for you when I saw it. I have my fingers crossed that everything is perfect for you. :flower: 

spidey- Are your pancakes green? Also OMG about a 14 day luteal phase!!! Go you! Hopefully your period doesn't show at all. :D You have serious willpower to not test yet. The only thing that ever keeps me from testing is not having them in my house. If they were there, I'd test every day. :haha:


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## spidey

Cleck, I think either one or both of your neighbors has some major mental illness. DH's father acts in the same way. He'll be really nice and fun to be around for 1 visit or 1/2 a visit, and then he turns into this unreasonable, self-centered, drama king. It's like he enjoys fighting and drama and no matter how "perfect" we try to act, he will still find someway to create a fight. Since he can be nice every so often it always left me feeling guilty like I did something wrong. It was so unhealthy to worry about his feelings and whether or not he was mad at us all the time, so we totally cut him off about 5 years ago. I have a feeling your neighbor just picked the miscarriage as a way to be re-mad at you. You always pegged them as weird. Ugh, I'm so sorry you have to live right next to them and share a driveway. I'm always paranoid about my car too :growlmad: We have security cameras pointing at our cars :haha: Don't let those idiots keep you from enjoying the outdoors :hugs:

Well AF came late yesterday evening. Such a disappointment since I had convinced myself I was pregnant and not getting a positive test yet. On the bright side, my cycle was 36 days and my LP was 14 days!! I'm not sure how it'll be next month with all the extra booby demands, but it seems like I'm heading in the right direction. On Monday I'm going to make my midwife appointment to discuss everything. :thumbup:

Shiv, how are you feeling today? Did you eat some prunes to get things moving? I loved your picture of the birthing pool- it really made me smile. You need to keep that for the baby book :haha:


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## jelr

Spidey: Your sausage is definitely different to ours, like Shiv, I had no idea which was sausage or pancake :haha: - I'm really sorry AF got you, but I'm glad you are thinking positive about it and that your cycle seems to be moving in the right direction along with your luteal phase. How is DH feeling about it all now, have you talked him around about the age gap or is he still upset? - Best of luck at the midwifes appointment.

Cleck: I'm so sorry that you have to deal with weird neighbours like that, yes I can understand them being upset by Corey's comment, but they have to understand, he didn't know and had no way of knowing when they hadn't said anything - It does sound like they like an arguement. I know the week I was miscarrying 3 seperate people said to me that it was about time that Natasha had a little brother or sister and I really wasn't even out that much, I only went as far as the playground with Natasha and to the local supermarket one day and I know it hurt so badly, but I never in a million years would have turned on them, in fact I didn't say anything at all as it didn't want it to be common knowledge that I had mc and I also didn't want to embarrass them or upset them for saying that, as they had no way of knowing. I hope they just go back to ignoring you, rather than fighting with you. So glad you have found a good friend in V though :thumbup:

MJ: That is a real pain about your blood results, so silly the rules they have some times and especially when it is not across the board. It definitely does sound like all is well though, so great news about that. I do hear you on the mess in the house, the few days we went to the beach over the summer, the house was covered in sand afterwards and it did my head in, but I think it was more because we had been wet and then sand stuck again. That is a good idea like Spidey said to brush or even strip him off at the door so hopefully that will contain the mess. I also hear you on the weather, My mam bought Natasha a sand pit for her 1st birthday and she only got to use it once this year, It has a lid on it though, so hopefully that will keep it safe until next year and the cats out :haha:

Shiv: That is great news that you have the pool all sorted out and it really is a good job you did a trial run. Getting into cold water while in labour would not be nice :nope: - At least now you are all sorted and hopefully baby won't keep you waiting too long and will arrive shortly after your parents get back from holidays. I hope your pains are better today and that it is not a start of something.

Well I offically can have no secrets now from DH :haha: - It is his birthday tomorrow and I decided to write his cards on Friday when he was at work when I was off and held Natasha's hand to write her name on the card from her and I knew she would say somethign about birthday when he came in, but didn't mind as she has been saying its daddy's birthday all week, but the minute he walked in the door, she said "happy birthday daddy, birthday cards" - So I was hung. DH just laughed as he knew well what we had been up to :haha:


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## spidey

Cleck, we must have posted at the same time earlier! 

LOL about my flat circular sausage. You can get sausage in patties like that, or in links. We've been in a sausage patty mood lately :haha: My pancakes are green aren't they! :haha: I add frozen blue berries to them and it makes the batter a little bit bluish green.

Oh, and Cleck, I don't have self control! I tested 6 times this cycle :blush: I bought a 50-pack of opk's that came with 20 pregnancy tests as a bonus, so I used most of them last cycle and the rest this cycle. I think I have 2 left :haha:

jelr, that is so cute about Natasha blabbing to DH! That is so sweet- there are no secrets anymore! 

Kira did something really cute today. Her new fascination is with dirt, so she will point to a dirty spot on the floor and say EEEWWWEEEE! We just taught her how to say "dir-dee" and she says it clear as day :cloud9: DH took her over to his mom's house (which has no shortage of dirt :lol:) and DH asked Kira "is Nanny's house dirty?" and Kira nodded yes, and said "dir-dee" and then pointed at the floor and said "EEEEEWWWWEE!" :rofl:


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## Shiv

jelr - have you started the champix now? When is your last day smoking? My mum started champix back in November and is still free of cigarettes now, so they can defintiely work. She has had such a hard few months so I am very suprsied and proud that she has managed to do it. It will be a year soon, I must remember to treat her to something!

Spidey - so cute about Kira saying dir-dee, although I would like you to know she is not welcome in my house, i can do without a 2 year old telling me off for my housekeeping ability :haha:

cleck - so what is going on with your cycle, what is your monitor showing now? any sign of AF? Anymore trouble with the neighbours from hell?

MJ - how you doing? Is your midiwfe appt this week?

As for me, well here is my 38 week bump pic, I think it has gone back up if that is possible! i have a midwife appt tomorrow so I am just hoping she tells me baby is still head down!

I have about 2 tonnes of chilli cooking on the hob at the moment to freeze, tomorrow night will be bolognese and then chicken curry and finally a pasticcio. It was easier when Sophia was born, we could just eat whatever, i stocked up on ready meals and stuff. but this time round I need to make sure that Sophia gets fed well and quickly. SO no convenience food! Well not much anyway!
 



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## Mary Jo

eeeek, I couldn't quite make the connection between that plate of food and pancakes and sausages! I'm sure it's one of those things you have to try, but I'm afraid it would be a bit of a leap of faith for me to put any sort of syrup on sausage. I hope your DH enjoyed it, Spidey, sure he did. :D Kira would also have a field day if she came here, though I am doing better since I finally got round to acquiring a new charger for my Dustbuster (I set the other one on fire a couple of months ago). 

really sorry about AF turning up but a 14-day LP is brilliant. fingers crossed for next month. :hug: did you make your appointment? hope the mw can see you soon. can they order tests or is that a doctor thing?

Cleck, ack, your neighbours just sound plain weird. and yes, perhaps with a touch of genuine mental issues thrown in. I can see why they'd have been thrown a bit by Corey's comment, but how was he to know, and what more could he do but apologise? if they don't want to accept that, it's their issue, but I know how it is to be on bad terms with the neighbours, it's really uncomfortable. we had that with our neighbours in my old flat. the ones I mentioned quite a few times over the past 2 years. we didn't speak to them at all - just dirty looks or averted eyes when we saw them - from mid-May to when we moved at the end of July. fortunately we didn't actually se them that much, but it was uncomfortable anyway. this was their doing, they refused to go inside their flat one evening when we had some people coming to view ours - these were the people who treated our communal front garden as a bar, and stood outside smoking and drinking. we didn't think it was too awful a suggestion that they go in - or somewhere else - for a few minutes while our viewers came round, the guy had been fine about it a couple of days before the day this happened, but this day, it was his girlfriend who was arsey about it, and Chris saw red and yelled at them. I wasn't there, I'd taken Adam out for 1/2 an hour. it really made me happy to leave there, even though I was sorry to leave my flat, I was not sorry to leave these unpleasant people behind. v glad you have a friend who understands it all though, a shame you find her and then you're leaving as well.

:haha: at Natasha blabbing about the birthday card! ha! I am still able to say things around Adam and he doesn't repeat them (we have still to get our use of unfortunate language under control, I keep expecting him to say something we really won't like, sure it won't be long, eeek). hope Jim had a good day!

Shiv, yay for being super organised and cooking up a storm. obviously I have done nothing of the sort, but as I am 3 weeks behind you, I think I am ok for time. :lol: it is in my plans to stock up on meals that are easy for C to put together, we don't have a big freezer here in the new house but it's still about 3 times bigger than the little ice box affair we had at the flat, and I love it. we'll probably get some frozen pizzas and quiches and things Adam likes like fish fingers and waffles, but I really also want portions of lasagne, that sort of thing. I'm planning to start internet supermarket shopping as well. Chris is against it but he has to be realistic. I won't be able to go shopping for bits daily as I do (and I hate, or at least I hate HAVING to go and get bits, don't mind if I was going out anyway), and we have to get organised, and he isn't going to be happy (and neither will I) if after a day at work when I need him home to help with children, and he wants to be home to see them, I send him out with a list. it won't be forever (he rather likes going sometimes I think) plus I figure we'll cover the delivery cost by not buying impulse things like crisps and chocolate. 

also great pic in the pool! good idea to have a trial run, you don't want to be ironing out issues when you're in labour, especially if it's likely to be quick when it gets going. 

well done to your mum on staying stopped smoking for so long. I wish mine would go for something like Champix. she did quit several years ago, and stayed stopped for - I can't quite remember - might have been 3 or 4 years, 5? but started again when she was stressed. the reason she stopped in the first place was because the hospital she worked at (she is a retired intensive care nurse) was simultaneously going 100% smoke-free (not even in your car in the car park) whie her unit changed to 12-hour shifts. my poor mother couldn't contemplate not smoking for 12 hours. so she went for hypnotherapy and it worked. until she started again, of course! I don't hassle her about it but she knows how I feel. what she doesn't know (because I would feel very insensitive to tell her this) is how much I can still detect the smell of smoke even though she only smokes outside. it's really only an issue when pregnant this time (never noticed last time but have had a very acute sense of smell with this baby) but when I went up there with Adam in August for a few days, I was nearly sick with the smell in the bedroom I was sleeping in. and I know she never ever smokes in the house, but even so I could hardly sleep without using loads of air freshener. it was weird, and that's partly why I didn't say anything because what more could she do about it? the health aspects worry me, she's been a smoker since she was 12 and she is now 62 (crikey, 50 YEARS).

speaking of health, my friend with cancer had her hysterectomy 4 weeks ago today and she's recovered really well, aside from a period of deep depression a couple of weeks ago - her wound started leaking, which freaked her out, and although she has had friends helping, none of us live very nearby so it's hard when there is a crisis. also she was climbing the walls with boredom. so she's gone back to work today, 2 weeks before her doc wanted her to, but she is confident she'll cope with the commute, and that's the only challenging thing, as she has a desk job. so she got her results and the doc says she is cancer free, thank god, as although her uterus contained a 10cm tumour, it was only in the uterus and everything else that was removed (tubes, ovaries) was clear, so fingers crossed that's it for the cancer, and it's just been a nasty period in her life but it's over and she'll be ok. she should be in the menopause now after having her ovaries out, but the doc says she won't probably feel the usual symptoms till she has lost a lot of weight as her fat produces a lot of oestrogen (which is one reason, apparently, she developed this particlar cancer). so we're all really happy she is doing well, and hope she can put this all behind her and get on with living.

as for me... well, yes, my mw appt is this week, my booking in, on Thursday. hoping it won't be a long appt, though I guess they will want to go through my history etc. really hope they don't need to repeat all the blood tests like blood group and immunity to all the various things, because I have my notes from Lewisham and surely to christ they will believe that I *do* have A+ blood without needing to check for themselves! mostly what I am hoping to hear is that baby is head down and my bp is still good. we'll see. I have no idea of how this baby is positioned, I cannot tell. there's been a whole lot of wriggle action going on, though, I had a bath with Adam the other day and he was blowing raspberries - hard ones - on my bump and baby wasn't impressed and there were big hard lumps of baby visible and shifting about. I am trying to make time to go on all 4s when I feel him moving a lot. guess if he *is* breech, at 35 weeks, they'd discuss my options? am definitely going to look into moxibustion if he is. 

my mum is down on Wed, so she will (in theory) mind Adam while I am at the appt. however, her back has gone ping again - she has slipped discs and because of that cancelled coming down in March, which was when I was so desperate for a break as I was in 1st tri and feeling horrendous, but I hadn't told her I was pregnant, and even if I had I don't think she was *able* to come down, and if she did she'd have not been able to do anything with Adam. I am praying that this time isn't as bad and she will manage to take him sometimes. the worry is that she won't be able to lift him, and he can still be very difficult at nappy time and require lifting. obviously if C or I are there we'll do all that, but we won't always be there. maybe we'll need to have some nappy free time and enlist the help of the potty... and then I'll have to clean up the piss and shit later! this visit shouldn't be too bad, she can take him out and simply not have him out of the pushchair, but she is our person who is going to look after Adam while I am having the new baby, so there will be times we are not there. also, one of the points of her coming down was to let me have a break now and then, now I'm getting closer to the end of it, and as it is I can see me not getting much of a break. I probably sound extremely selfish but my first thought was for myself when she told me yesterday her back had gone again. she's insisted she is still coming down, though, she has dihydrocodeine and tramadol from the doc.

other than that, I am ok. unwieldy, though. not sleeping great, at least in the first part of the night. heartburn is bad, plus I need the loo at least 4 times. and my nose is really congested. and we still have Adam in with us. his room is almost finished, just the stickers to put up, but C has decided we won't try him in there till after my mum has been, so she can have a proper bed to sleep in (he sounds all considerate to her but he isn't, I think he's putting off the day because he'll miss Adam. so will I, he's been in the (or a) room with me/us, if not our bed, every single night since he was born. I have never had a night away from him. it will be strange but I am so conscious that after my mum goes home there is only 4 weeks till my due date, and it's not long to get him settled. I wish we'd have had longer, but it is what it is, I guess. part of me wishes we could all just co-sleep together but realistically, the new baby will end up in with us, because unless something goes badly wrong and I cannot bf at all, I will probably bf lying down and I can't help but go to sleep or at least doze. and it's just not safe to have a toddler in with a newborn. plus I don't want Adam to be disturbed by middle of the night goings on, he needs his sleep as well or he'll be hell on two little legs.


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## spidey

Shiv, you have such a nice big bump! Good luck at your midwife appointment tomorrow.

MJ- I'm glad your friends hysterectomy was a success :thumbup: Perhaps being busy at work will help her feel better. I really hope your moms back is okay when she visits you so you can get a break. Don't feel bad about feeling selfish about it- I would feel the same way. You've been looking forward to having a break for a long time, so it's disappointing to find out that it might not happen. Adam's transition to his own room might go smoother than you're anticipating too. I'm sure the first night will be hard- I'm really looking forward to hearing how it goes since we'll be doing the same thing one day.

So I made my midwife appointment this morning! It's on the 26th, so in 2 weeks. I hope the midwife can do some of the basic fertility stuff and reassure me that they'll take good care of me when I become pregnant. When I called to make my appointment I had some flashbacks when I spoke to the same very nasty secretary on the phone. Between the nasty mean secretary and all the fear induced appointments... it's making me consider switching to another birth center that's in the same area. DH is also convinced that the midwife who delivered Kira caused her brain bleeding since he (the midwife) was leaving finger indents in her head as she was crowning. I don't think the midwife caused it, but DH does. It seemed that at every appointment they were trying to find a reason for me to be high risk so I couldn't have a birth center birth. In the end, they got what they wanted too :growlmad: It's too bad we don't have home birth midwives around here... but that's not going to stop me since I want to have a planned "unplanned" home birth with my next one :haha:


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## ckc

Hi Cleckner! 
What do you mean you are moving soon? when are you moving? I might be going to San Diego next month and I thought It would be great to get together and get out girls together. Are you gonna still be there in October?


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## ckc

spidey said:


> Shiv, you have such a nice big bump! Good luck at your midwife appointment tomorrow.
> 
> 
> So I made my midwife appointment this morning! It's on the 26th, so in 2 weeks. I hope the midwife can do some of the basic fertility stuff and reassure me that they'll take good care of me when I become pregnant. When I called to make my appointment I had some flashbacks when I spoke to the same very nasty secretary on the phone. Between the nasty mean secretary and all the fear induced appointments... it's making me consider switching to another birth center that's in the same area. DH is also convinced that the midwife who delivered Kira caused her brain bleeding since he (the midwife) was leaving finger indents in her head as she was crowning. I don't think the midwife caused it, but DH does. It seemed that at every appointment they were trying to find a reason for me to be high risk so I couldn't have a birth center birth. In the end, they got what they wanted too :growlmad: It's too bad we don't have home birth midwives around here... but that's not going to stop me since I want to have a planned "unplanned" home birth with my next one :haha:

Hello Spidey, Actually I had a home birth with DD, and the midwife also left fingers marks in her head. Well she is not to blame, she was the only midwife willing to deliver my baby at home since here in China is illegal, also I had a back labor, so with every contraction the midwife had to reach in and turn her head, OMG that was soooo incredibly painful! If I have had a foreign midwife I am sure she would have known how to change the baby's head position by changing my own position, after the birth I found out this was entirely possible. For my next baby I will try to have an American midwife, challenging but possible. Which makes me wonder, why dont you find a midwife that is willing to travel to your area to deliver your baby at home?


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## ckc

I would like a lion club sticker too!!! how do I do it?


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## spidey

I believe it's illegal in my state because there is a case right now where they're prosecuting a midwife for doing an "illegal" HB and the baby ended up dying from complications. I don't think anyone is willing to take that risk right now and considering that I made a huge baby, the fear of getting stuck shoulders might scare any renegade HB midwives away :haha: But we have birth centers which are a nice alternative and I'm very lucky to have 2 within 30 minutes of my house :thumbup: Although I do fantasize of delivering in the car on the way to the birth center... I love a little bit of added excitement! 

LOL about the finger marks in the head... our poor babies! Good luck on finding an American midwife :thumbup: Are you starting your search already?


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## Shiv

jelr- I couldn't keep any secrets either, and there is no chance of me getting away with an affair, Sophia likes nothing better than telling David that the Tesco man has been!

I saw on fb that it was your first day on Champix, does that mean you have set your last day as a smoker?

MJ- internet shopping is AMAZING. I was very against it until about 9 months ago, but now I love it. I strted to dread taking SOphia to the supermarket and had fed her half the food in the trolley by the time we got back tothe car just to keep her happy! You'll never look back!

Great news about your friend and being cancer free.

It used to upset me so much my mum smoking and I used to get on at her a lot about it when I lived at home. It used to bother me that she would come in from having a cigarette outside and want to hold SOphia straight away.........so I am very glad she has stopped. not sure she'll stay off them forever but if she can manage it through her father and sisters disowning her then I guess she can cope through most things.

I hate to tell you but when I had my booking in appt here they re-did all the tests again!

Don't feel bad about wishing your mums back hadn;t gone again. You have been looking forward to having help for awhile now so to find out it might not be quite what you ahd hoped for is bound to leave you feeling pissed off. I would be the same.

I reckon Adam will adjust to being in his room quiker than you think, they aer so adaptable,a nd I am sure he will still come in with you for big family cuddles.

Spidey - I hope the midwife can get the ball rolling for you. Such a shame homebirth is illegal in your state as I think you would like one.

Oh and i like your new avatar!

Does my bump look really big then? I can't really tell, I am definitely more mobile this time. Iguess I have had to stay mobile to play with Sophia so if you keep doing stuff then you don't struggle as much with it. My friend was very impressed with how quickly I was still getting around!

Cleck - I have been keeping up to date with the BFing thread and see you have had success with reducing the amount Emma feeds - that's great! Sophia loves lemons - she asks for them as a snack so it would never have worked with her!

Well my midwife appt went well, LO is still head down although not engaged (explains the lack of SPD for me i think). Am measuring right and my wee was ok. My blood pressure was 80/60 which sounds low to me but she was happy with it. So i don't see anyone now until 40 weeks when I see a GP and then 41 weeks when I see the midwife again. I went to weekly appts in Kent at this stage, I do feel the level of care here is much less. Fingers crossed I won't need either of those appts though. The midwife joked that Firday night would be good for her as she is on call, and I was like Deal - my parenta are back then, and it would be good for David to start his paternity leave at a weekend. If only it worked like that eh?


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## spidey

ooo.. I just had a peak in the bf thread too. The lemon juice sounds great Cleckner! :happydance: And no tears- I can't think of a better solution. Kira had herself weaned down to morning nap and night too, but she's had a major booby resurgence these past 2 weeks. I really don't mind bf but it was getting a little tiring having her bf ALL day long and having it cut down to those 3 times made it enjoyable again. I've been feeling a bit drained these past 2 weeks so I hope she cuts back again soon or I might have to get out the lemons :haha:

Shiv, your bump does look full term to me but you're small everywhere else so it makes it stand out more. Do you have any bump pics from Sophia to compare it to? Or was it you that lost all your pictures with a broken computer... I hope not :-( That's great you're still mobile, but you're right- you don't have much of a choice with this pregnancy. I remember being mobile until 40 weeks and then I got stuck in bed a few times and was so massive :haha: My last day of work was 3 days before my due date because I couldn't do the walk to the parking lot anymore. Just think, the next time you see a midwife is when your in labor! (unless you go overdue!) Are you going to give us hourly FB updates from your pool? You know I would really love that :blush::haha:


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## ckc

spidey said:


> I believe it's illegal in my state because there is a case right now where they're prosecuting a midwife for doing an "illegal" HB and the baby ended up dying from complications. I don't think anyone is willing to take that risk right now and considering that I made a huge baby, the fear of getting stuck shoulders might scare any renegade HB midwives away :haha: But we have birth centers which are a nice alternative and I'm very lucky to have 2 within 30 minutes of my house :thumbup: Although I do fantasize of delivering in the car on the way to the birth center... I love a little bit of added excitement!
> 
> LOL about the finger marks in the head... our poor babies! Good luck on finding an American midwife :thumbup: Are you starting your search already?

I didn't know it was illegal in your state, but I did recently read about that midwife that is being persecuted, it is a really sad story. I am not really looking right now, until I am completely sure that this baby is gonna stick. I had a MMC in May and another one early MC in Feb and right before my first baby another early one. the first one was pretty sad, the second one disappointing but the Missed Miscarriage I find it is a cruel trick of nature :( i was 10 weeks along and thinking that everything was fine and it wasn't. Bu anyways to judge by the strength of the morning sickness this one is probably gonna be alright :) 
I will probably start looking after 14 weeks.


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## ckc

Me too I am still nursing, and it has become very painful as i am pregnant. Althought Narain doesn't nurse a lot, and since she turned 14 months we no longer nurse outside the house. I wish she could wean herself, in the past she did it, I mean, I stop offering that she stopped asking and I think we went one day without nursing but then then next day she fell sick and everything restarted with vengeance :haha:. Now the problem is that i feel very tired so i can use the breaks of nursing just to lay in bed and relax with her for a bit, well, as now it hurts so much there is no so much relaxing., so i think i will stop offering again to see how it goes. Other wise I will try the Lemon :) although my daughter eats play-dough and paint , so she will probably like the lemon too:dohh:


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## cleckner04

Hey ckc!! I haven't seen you around for a while! :D I'm moving in November from here. But won't be around all of october either bc we plan on having our Los Angeles vacation when DH is back next. So it all depends when you plan on being here! :flower:

Shiv- your bump is massive!! I will seriously be shocked if this isn't a boy. You are all bump. 

Spidey- Sorry AF hit but YAY for 14 day luteal phase!!! I'm so jealous! :haha: 

MJ- I hope your mom's back is okay so she can watch Adam enough for you to get a break. :flower: I just looked at your ticker and I feel like your pregnancy has flown by!! It probably helps that you were sneaky and didn't tell us till late into it. :winkwink: 




Ok, well the neighbors are still friendly with V. V was out with her youngest daughter helping her ride a two-wheel bike with training wheels and the attached wife came out with her youngest and they stood there talking. V called me right after she came in to tell me about it but I guess the attached neighbor brought it up immediately and said she had no clue that her husband went outside until after the fact. :roll: She's lying because they only went in for like 20-30 minutes before he came back out to get in Corey's face. So that was just enough time for her to explain what happened. She also asked V if her husband was rude. V just gave a grunt I guess but didn't really respond. So the attached neighbor was like 'my husband is always very professional' :shrug::wacko: She's freaking crazy and stupid. lol That's all I can say really. V said she would love to be mean to these people but she has to live here still after I leave and their older daughters are in the same grade in school so they run into eachother all the time. Which I understand. 

The other day I was out getting my bike around to go for a ride with Emma and the attached neighbors pulled in from wherever they was. Well the husband stared at me the entire time and I just stared right back. :rofl: He didn't smile or say hi and neither did I. But when V came out to get her bike ready to go with me, he waved to her. :roll: So they hate me for no F'ing reason and are still fine with V and her husband apparently. I hate having people hate me especially when I did nothing wrong. V hates it because she feels like she's in the middle. Which I don't know why she feels like that because she doesn't like these people either. But she's too nice to stop being friendly. 


Also right before I got on here, my brother called to tell me his daughter is nearly potty trained. She's 8 months younger than Emma. :cry: So now I'm sure he will hold that over me and crack jokes when we move back and his kid is potty trained and mine isn't. He sees his daughter for like 3 hours a day. That's it because she is at daycare all day. And the daycare people are potty training her. But that won't register with my brother. He'll just gloat about it. So now I feel like shit because Emma is no closer to being trained. I can manage to get her to sit on the potty with a bribe for about half an hour in the mornings while watching spongebob and eating breakfast. But she never goes on it. She will hold it until she's off the potty and than go in her diaper. She's so stubborn. She will pee in her diaper and than immediately take it off. But she won't pee in the freaking potty. :dohh:


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## Shiv

Cleck - your neighbours are wierdo's and attention seekers that's for sure. I know what you mean about not liking it when people take a disliking to you for no reason. I can rub people up the wrong way (apparently :haha:) because I am very sarcastic and blunt, but at least if someone hates me after i have made a cheeky comment then I know why - it pisses me right off when they turn against me for no apparent reason. Makes me wanna give them a reason :haha:

Gosh I didn't realise i looked that big, here was me thinking I looked quite neat :haha: I'm such a loser :haha: I am going to go and find a pic of me with SOphia at a similar gestation to compare! First photo is with Sophia at 39 weeks (day I went into labour) and second is 38 weeks this time. What do you think?

It is David's birthday on Friday and I agreed to make him a load of mini muffins to take in for his work mates and I had already planned an extravagant cake for him to have at home, so I am going to be mainly baking over the next few days. For his main cake i a hoping to do a round chocolate sponge, covered in chocolate ganache buttercream with a layer of chocolate cigarillos around the edge, with a load of cake balls (like cake pops but without the stick) in a big pile on top, the cake balls will be covered in white chocolate, light brown candy melt and dark brown candy melt. The idea is that they look like fancy truffles, but David prefers cake balls. Goodness knows what it will turn out like!
 



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## Shiv

Oh and my main reason for posting was to reassue you about potty training Cleck. I seriously cannot understand how a child of what 16 months can be potty trained. Sophia couldn't get her trousers down at 16 months (and isn't quick at it now), so how can you be potty trained unless you can a) know you need a wee/poo (which i doubt a 16 month old can do) b) get to the potty and c) get your trousers down in time

I am sorry but to me it doesn't count as potty training if you are placing the child on the potty at intervals and seeing if they wee/poo. ..........which is what I think your brother might be talking about. I mean maybe I am wrong, maybe his daughter can say "daddy I need a wee", walk over to the potty, take her trousers down and wee............but I doubt it. And if she can then she is the exception to the rule. Don't feel bad, Sophia has complete lost interest in her potty and has been fine keeping her nappy on for the last couple of weeks............in fact today was the first day she showed any interest in her potty and that was to tell me "Sophia is having a shower", to which she stood in the potty and pretended she was having a shower :haha:

Emma isn't behind her peers with this, and I truly believe if you try to push them into it then they will just get upset. I bet Emma will one day (maybe in a few months) just get up and go and use the potty. I think they can pretty much train themselves IF they are ready..................at least that is what I am hoping for!

Ignore your brother, I bet his little girl will be having accidents all the time for months to come and you are better off not putting Emma through the stress of that
rant over!


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## cleckner04

Yeah he did say that she said 'ucky' so they knew she had to pee so they hurried and put her on the potty and pulled her diaper down. She peed and said 'pee pee yay!'. But she didn't pull her own pants down. They just rushed her over and did it. I hate the whole unspoken 'competition' that comes with parenting. I feel like he's turning it into a competition and I'm losing. :dohh: 


And shiv, I think your bump is definitely bigger this time around! It's so adorable. I can't freaking wait to be pregnant again.


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## Shiv

Well in my opinion she is far off being potty trained then!

My bump looks bigger and lower...........At this time with Sophia i think I weighed about 13st 2lbs and this time round I weigh 11st 12lbs so I am pretty happy with that. Although I know a lot of it was water and I haven't really swelled this time. I got really bad carpal tunnel last time and this time not a jot :thumbup:

I can't wait for you to be preggers as well Cleck, i would love to see photos of a little Cleckner boy with red hair and all cheeky looking!


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## Pippin

Goodness you girls write so much I can't keep up :shock: Love to you all though. xxx


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## Shiv

Pippin said:


> Goodness you girls write so much I can't keep up :shock: Love to you all though. xxx

hahahaha we do tend to gibber away :haha:

So how are things going with 2 children to look after pippin? Go on be honest!


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## spidey

CKC, I'm sorry to hear about your earlier m/c's :hugs: I can understand about bf to get some rest... I enjoy the bits of rest when I bf Kira. It's too bad its so painful now though :cry:

Cleckner, I hate it when someone is mad at me for no good reason either and like what Shiv said, it makes me want to give them a reason and I usually do! And that totally doesn't sound like potty trained to me! It's like people claiming their baby can walk because it took 1 random step. Don't argue with him because it will make it seem like you're up for a competition and even if you are a competitive person it's totally not worth it. If he wants to start a comparison game, just say "it's not even worth discussing it since your daughter is obviously way more advanced than Emma". The meanest thing you can do to a competitive person is to tell them they win right away :haha:

Shiv, can I come to Davids birthday! That cake sounds sooooo chocolate-y divine! I can actually picture the final cake and please take a picture! Your bump is bigger now and it sticks out more in the front for sure! And you look noticeably thinner too and less swollen :thumbup: 

Pippin, how is it going!??


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## jelr

Hey girls

Shiv: You definitely look neater and lower this time around - I definitely still think a boy :haha: - Yaaaaaay :dance: for baby staying head down.

Spidey: Best of luck at your appointment, I hope the midwife can make a start on some tests and you won't have to be referred.

Cleck: I wouldn't worry about the potty training either - I was speaking to a couple lately and was saying that i had tried Natasha but she wasn't ready, so I stopped and they said I had done the best thing that they trained their oldest daughter at 2 and she is now 3.5 and still having loads of accidents and they think it was because she wasn't ready.

MJ: I really hope your mam can come down and give you that break, you are not being selfish at all. I'm so glad your friends surgery went well and she is cancer free, I hope getting back to work helps her.

CKC: Sorry to hear about your mc's - I have also had two mmc and they are definitely so cruel, my first one wasn't discovered until 16 weeks and like you I had no idea anything was wrong. Very cruel - Best of luck with the pregnancy.

Pippin: Hey hope you and your two gorgeous children are doing well.

Sorry guys I know that is a really quick post, but I'm doing this extra project for work at night (which is actually not that much time, by the time Natasha goes down and then by this time I shattered this week with only being back in work) - So I really havn't had a minute. It will be an extra few bob though and hopefully it will be done in a few weeks and things will get back to normal. I'm actually working the 3 days instead of 2, because some of the others that do my job in other parts of the county really kicked up, so it has been left with HR and we are to work as normal until it has been resolved, so have been working the last few days and then at night, am finally off tomorrow, but I have to get the car serviced as it is due for its first NCT this year and I may get cracking on some housework and washing.

Well I started the champix on Monday, felt fairly sick the first day, but it has gone now, I'm still smoking as normal and even though I am now putting them out half way through and they are giving me a taste, I still have the urge to smoke, but I think most of it is habit, which I know I'm really going to struggle with as bar being pregnant, it is a habit of 18 years I need to break. the dose increases tomorrow and then again after 2 weeks, so I'm hoping that puts me off more and It helps me stop wanting them - FX I will be a non-smoker in the next week and a half.

Hope that post made sense, am exhausted tbh and a little stupid today :haha:


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## ckc

thank you jerl, spidey and cleckner, 

Cleckner I am going to LA too, but I will write you when I am there and see where you are at, if it is convenient we meet other wise maybe another time:) . 

Potty training: Narain has been potty trained since she was 19 months, I find that the younger they are the better because they become more stubborn and strong willed with age. What work for us was that three day method, Fellom method. We took a long weekend and did just that. I am not gonna say that she was completely potty trained in three days but it laid a strong foundation and she totally got it. At the begging was a novelty and she did it accident free for a few weeks, however like a month or so later she started having accidents ( only pee accidents) which was confusing but then talking to other moms I found out that they always regress for the most part and it is not a big deal, it will pass as they now the are doing something wrong. For peeing in the potty was never a problem but for number two she was so freaked out! so we started telling her that her poop is so beautiful! and complimented her, and then she was so proud of her poop that even now when she goes she says "hello poo" and blow kisses to it and then wants to show every body and says that is beautiful. lol 
Anyways, my sister's daughter is almost a year older than Narain and she is not potty trained yet, but I personally find it more difficult with older children. So often tell my sister not to worry that she will do it when she is ready and most importantly it should be a good experience for them. But if you guys feel like devoting three days to the fellom method you should give it a shot it worked for me.


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## ckc

Jerl, I am so sorry to hear about what happened to you. Can I just ask you, when did you do your last ultrasound before you found out at 16 weeks? 

I am kind of freaking out a little bit, thinking that I should go and do an ultrasound. I had on at 6w to for the heartbeat, and now i would like to have another one, but I also wanna have trust that this is gonna go well. Where i leave ultrasounds are quite affordable and technically I can have them anytime I want. But i don't wanna go all psycho having ultrasounds because i am afraid. So I am trying to hang in there and wait until I am ten weeks. 

It has been a long process, with my daughter we got pregnant right away, and for this baby we have been trying for almost a year and two MC in between. I hope this is gonna be alright.


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## cleckner04

AF hit today. It was only a 27 day cycle. I'm almost certain that I didn't ovulate this month so I can't tell you a luteal phase. Every website I've read about those monitors say it does the stupid high every day thing if you have an anovulary cycle. Go figure when my husband is actually home I don't even ovulate. :gun: I've calculated it and we've only tried for 5 cycles but some of those can't even count because he's gone a few days before and on ovulation day. But it feels like we've been at it FOREVER with the long breaks in between. Looks like my babies will have a 5 year age gap. :(


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## spidey

Cleckner, I am so so sorry :cry: I know how frustrated I feel about the whole thing so I can only imagine how much worse you must feel since you don't have nearly as many chances as me. The ups and downs each month really hurt. Do you remember which day your monitor showed the darkest line? Perhaps you could take a guesstimate and say you ovulated the day after the darkest line (assuming you did ovulate). Since AF came this weekend I've been especially down about the whole thing so I'm in no place to say anything positive :cry:

ckc, that is very cool that Narain is potty trained! Your method is how I plan to do it one day too, so I'm so glad it worked :thumbup: Kira can't aim her behind to sit down on the potty and she can't get her pants down either, so I'm being a lazy and putting off potty training until she is more equipped to use the potty independently :haha: Will Narain run off to use the potty by herself, or do you accompany her each time? Does she wear a diaper at night? We also get very excited about poop too- me and DH will cheer and clap if there's a poo poo, and then we'll put it in the toilet and wave bye bye :lol: I even get excited about my own poop :blush:

jelr- that's interesting that the champix is making cigarettes not as enjoyable. I guess that's how its supposed to work. I hope you get some rest this weekend since it sounds like you've been really busy!!


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## cleckner04

I have to keep reminding myself when I get upset that I'm only 25 and it's not the end of the world if our kids have a bigger gap. But when I'm in the moment and not thinking clearly I do get really upset. I think if DH was actually home every month it'd be easier. I can't help but get mad at him sometimes about it all. I know it's not his fault but he's an easy target for my frustration. :blush: I also sometimes read in the LTTTC section on here and I feel so bad because I'm getting upset about not getting pregnant with a second kid when these women haven't even been blessed with one.


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## Shiv

Cleck - I am so sorry that TTC is proving tobe so stressful for you. I wish there was something I could do or say to help, but there isn't is there? Corey will be with you full time at some point so if (and i hope that isn't the case) you don;t get pregnant soon, then you will have ample opportunity. I understand getting mad at himfo rnot being there. I know it isn't the same but I get angry at David, especially when I was over 37 weeks pregnant and he wasn't here. Massive massive hugs to you.


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## jelr

Aww Cleck sorry AF hit you - Like Shiv said I really do wish there was something I could do or say to make you feel better - you too Spidey I wish I could make you both pregnant (well not that I would make you pregnant :haha:) - but I do wish that I could make it happen now for you both.

Spidey: Yeah I'm kinda disappointed that the tablets are doing that and not making me not want them in the first place, but then I guess that would be too easy and I guess it is just going to take a LOT of will power when I do actually stop too :dohh: - Funny thing is I have done total food replacement diets and had the will power for that, but the cigs are my downfall and purely out of habit, like tonight myself and DH were cleaning the house once Natasha was in bed and out of habit when we were half way though we went outside for a smoke (with the baby monitor of course) and I do tend to have one whenever I need a few minutes to re-motivate myself like people stop for a cup of tea or coffee, except I don't drink tea or coffee, so I just don't know what to do with myself and I'm also terrified it will be food and I'm terrified of putting back on the weight, which I know I will as even the tablets themselves are making me so so hungry :dohh: - I guess I may just get over it and find something :haha:

Shiv: Are you going to try hot curries or pineapple or anything now that you would like baby to move when s/he is head down and your parents and David are home or are you just going to go with the flow and hope?

CDC: I hadn't had any scan before the 16 week one as over here they don't scan until 18 to 24 weeks, the only reason I had found out was because at my 16 week check my nurse still hadn't detected the heartbeat and I got really upset at home in case anything was wrong and DH decided to we go into A&E just to put my mind at rest, but unfortunately it didn't. Thankfully now I get early scans because of this. I know it is hard not to worry, but the fact that everything was fine at the previous scan is a good sign so hopefully everything will be at the next one also.

Not much news here - pretty mundane day of cleaning and washing - Natasha made it fun though as I laughed at her so much today, First at lunch had a sandwich for her lunch and had some of the crust left which was in the shape of an L - so she put off the crust of the second sandwich so she had two like an L one longer than the other and then she stood them up and said "look me boots mammy" ha ha I love this age and their little imaginations - then this evening she was at the back door (our back door is now at the side since we put on the kitchen, so DH has put up a little gate, so Natasha can be outside when I'm cooking but can't get out onto the road, so she was out playing at the door this evening waiting for DH to come home and she started to sing, no particular song just random words, and next she started singing at the top of her voice she started singing "mammy and daddy's boobies" - she is still obsessed with boobs bless her :haha:


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## ckc

Spidey and Cleckner, I don't know if this can help at all or if it is even an option for you. But as I mentioned before I got pregnant twice before this time after Narain was born. i mean I got AF after 13 months, so we started trying then, that was almost a year ago!!! always use the ovulation detector, and my charts were perfect, once you get a positive in the test, it is better to keep testing until the peak value decreased ( until it changes colors to a lighter one) once that happens, then you can be sure that you will ovulate within 24 hours. Anyways, the whole process was a bit stressful cause I couldn't understand what was wrong , now I know but that is besides the point. What I wanted to say was that the two times that I did get pregnant ( regardless of the results) I had acupuncture and Chinese herbal treatment from the previous cycle and quite frankly trying for that long and getting pregnant when I had the treatments, I have to believe that it worked. 
Also one of the two times I got pregnant we conceived on ovulation date ( because my husband was traveling the days before that ) and i remember being upset and thinking we wouldn't be able to make it:) . Anyways I can definitely relate to the stress and frustration/anxiety that this process implies. And of course at 25 you have a pretty high success rate :)


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## ckc

Shiv, I have read that is very common for second times moms that the baby engage until delivery, I guess you will confirm this later. You look beautiful with your belly by the way!!!!!!!! is it different than last time? Who is going to help you with Sophia when you have the baby?


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## ckc

Spidey, Actually Narain still can't pull her pants up or down. We have one potty that looks like a little toilette in the bathroom and another regular in the living room where she plays. At the beginning we would take her when she said pee pee, and after a while she started going by herself, i would keep her with dresses and no panties so she could do it by herself. She never says she has to poop but when I see her collecting books and toys I now she has to poop, some times she even asks for a pillow so she can relax more in the potty lol. 
She is still using diapers at night and for nap time but that doesn't bother me. I am not willing to get up at night to take her to the bathroom, so i am just gonna wait and see if naturally she can hold her pee the whole night. 
I also have a great potty that I carry around with me, it folds easily in the diaper bag and she can use it anytime. I never see people carrying potties around, i wonder how they do it then. Here public bathrooms are nasty.

I cant wait to go to the US!!!! I cant wait to go to target!!!! I can't wait to have nice Mexican food :) not looking forward to the jet lag though.


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## spidey

ckc, I would really miss Target too :haha: Thats neat about your folding potty... I wouldn't want to use public bathrooms here either. The one and only thing that Kira seems "advanced" in is that she will hold her pee all night and hasn't had a wet overnight diaper in a very long time (I'm a very proud mommy :haha:) :thumbup: To give you some background on me TTC, I started the month after AF returned, so Kira was 11 months old. For the first couple of months I didn't track ovulation but I figured out that my nipples get sore 2-3 days before I ovulate, so I've been going off my nips and opk's for a long time and this month I'm temping too. My problem is my luteal phase is usually too short (9 days) but last month I had a nice normal 14 day LP :thumbup: I think bf is really keeping me infertile, so it'll probably be another 6 months- 1 year before I get my bfp. I need to be more patient, and like what Cleckner said, I must remember how grateful I am to already have one healthy baby :thumbup: I have a good friend who used acupuncture to get pregnant too... so I would definitely try it one day. I'm glad to hear it's worked for you too!

jelr, it's going to be hard to break the habit. I wish I could think of something you could replace smoking with that wouldn't have its own bad outcomes. The first thing that came to mind was chocolate :haha: Natasha is such a cute thing! I love her booby obsession :haha:

Shiv, I hope you're having fun during your bake-a-thon!


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## cleckner04

ckc- Yeah I have the same problem spidey has had. Although the sneaky bitch got a 14 day phase this month. :haha::p My luteal phase has only been 9-11 days and it's meant to be 12 or more I believe. I never had to do any of this stuff when trying for Emma. I got pregnant in the 2nd month trying for my first pregnancy(MMC) and with Emma it took a month and a half cause the first month was totally half assed trying while on vacation. :lol: But I've only tried for 5 months so far so I think I'm just impatient. But my trying has been split up because DH keeps deploying. So it's really been almost a year since we first started trying. He's just been gone for most of it. :wacko:


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## Pippin

Shiv said:


> Pippin said:
> 
> 
> Goodness you girls write so much I can't keep up :shock: Love to you all though. xxx
> 
> hahahaha we do tend to gibber away :haha:
> 
> So how are things going with 2 children to look after pippin? Go on be honest!Click to expand...

I won't lie and say it doesn't have it's moments as sometimes when I'm on my own it's hard but the good bits waaayyyyy out weigh these times :) The hardest parts is when Sam wants me and I'm feeding as he just doesn't understand I can't help him right at that time. I'm getting round that now by having sticker books or iPads to hand to distract him. He's getting better all the time so that's good. Having the second is lots easier than the first. More relaxed I guess and done it all before. It makes me cross I stressed out so much with Sam! I think I worried to much with him but I guess you do when things are soooo different. Having two is fun and already Sam entertains her it's lovely to watch. Just be warned though she might get jealous of your new one like Sam and instead of taking it out on the new baby she might take it out on you like Sam does with me. I was expecting him to hit Adélie or something but no he loves her just hates his Mummy most of the time and Daddy is number one now. At times it hurts but I'm expecting when he goes back to work properly that will change. 


Cleckner I understand you frustration. I was like that when trying for Sam when DH wasn't in the 'mood' to perform iykwim and I took it out on him all the time. Lots of tears when I thought we'd missed our chance for that month so goodness know how you feel :hug: It can really take over your life so big :hugs:


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## Pippin

Spidey and Cleckner not sure if I've said before but I've got pregnant all three times (including the one I lost) with a 10 day lp so don't dispare. I've never had more than a 12 day one when charting and that was a fluke! Good luck lovelies hope it happens soon. Xxxx


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## Shiv

CKC - do you mean who is helping with sophia during the birth or afterwards? We are planning for a home birth so Sophia will be around at the start until my parents can get here (they are about a 2 hour drive away). It depends on what time of day it is as to whether my parents take Sophi aback home with them for a day or two or just stay here. If it is in the middle of the night then I will ask them to just go to bed upstairs and be there to look after Sophia in the morning if I am still in labour. If it is during the day I might get them to take her away. I am going to see how I feel at the time. Part of me wants her here so that she doesn;t go away and then come to a new baby, but part of me wonders how I will EVER catch up on sleep if I labour throughout the night and then have to take care of Sophia and the new baby the next day.....................so basically I don't know! What would you all do?

The bake-a-thon was a bit of a disaster, my weighing scales broke, so i had to guesstimate everything (where being in the US would come in handy with your cups!). This led to a cake that was uncooked in the middle! Got there eventually, and the photo is on facebook. It is the most ridiculously choclately cake ever, I have been nursing a slice since 6pm (now 8.40pm) and just can't get it all down me :haha:

I have come down with a cold, booooooooooo

David's mum and her partner are coming to see us tomorrow, they invited themselves (as I would have rather been visitor free to be honest) but it was David's birthday today so she wanted to come and take us out for lunch. Only it turns out she is broke so can't afford to take us out, which means I need to provide something for lunch (she told us this tonight), wouldn't normally be an issue but she has recently turned vegan so goodness knows what i am gonna give her. I am abit pissed off to be honest (it doesn't take much!) she is forever letting people down. She always promises stuff "oh when you come down I'll take you out to dinner", "Sophia next time I see you I'll have a present for you" etc etc but never sees these promises through. She has never taken us out for lunch or dinner, which wouldn't bother me in the slightest if a) she didn't tell us that she would and b) she wasn't happy for us to spend a lot of money on taking her out! Rant Rant Rant!

I hope you all have great weekends.

oh and jelr - Natasha's booby song made me laugh a LOT!!! you know you were saying that the other week she ruined teh suprise for Jim's birthday card, well Sophia not only told David about his card, but even told him what was on the front of the card! I had built this card up to David saying that he was gonna really laugh when he saw it (basically it is a picture of a cat that looks exactly like our cat, but in a funny pose that I swear is OUR cat and they have stolen this picture somehow. Anyway we were in a pet shop the other day and there was a stand of animal related cards that Sophia found and she saw this one and immediately said "its Rufus" so we got it)........anyway Sophia handed the card to David and said its a rufus card :dohh: No more secrets!

Enoug


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## Shiv

hmm that just posted before I had finished

enough rambling from me, I might get an early night :kiss:


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## jelr

Shiv: :rofl: at sophia telling David what was on the card, I could see Natasha doing the very same if it was an Oskar (our cat) card as every tiger cat in books now is Oskar, so I know she would have said that too - Nope no secrets in our houses anymore :haha: I saw the cake on my phone on fb and it looks fantastic :thumbup:

I'm glad Natasha's song made you laugh, when you are fed up with your MIL. That would drive me nuts too, I never want anything from anyone, but can not stand empty promises. this morning Natasha spent the morning saying "the baby sucking on mammys boobies" because DH had put on the tv, but we weren't watching and from here to maternity was on and we hadn't realised, because we don't usually have the tv on except for cartoons or sports when Natasha is around, so we didn't cop what was on, but little miss did :haha: I really hope your cold goes soon and that bubs is in the right position.

Pippin: Lovely to hear that Sam loves his baby sister so much, sorry to hear that he is taking out his jelousy out on you, that must be hard, but hopefully that will only be a phase and won't last long.

Cleck and Spidey: Hope you are feeling a little better after the weekend.

CDC: Hope all is going well for you.

MJ: How are you doing now, have you done any more with the new house.

We didn't do much over the weekend as I was too wrecked and sick from these tablets, so we just relaxed and had a friend visit yesterday and my sister and her husband were out most of today. Hoping to stop smoking completely either tomorrow morning or evening once I have increased the dose of the tablets - So wish me luck.


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## Shiv

oh good luck tomorrow jean - I hope that this time tommorow you will be cigarette free and stay that way, I hope it is not too awful for you :hugs:


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## Mary Jo

hey ladies, sorry I've been quiet, my mum has been down and I've been busy out and about with her and Adam, and consequently really tired in the evenings. this pregnancy thing is starting really to drain me! haven't been napping in the day at all, and I have been up several times a night with heartburn and toilet trips, but when I *do* sleep I sleep like a log.

sooo... Jean, how's the Champix going? and what's it like being back at work? Natasha is so funny with her booby song. :lol: I taught Adam what a boob is, he doesn't go yelling about it, though, but if I ask he says "boop". :D

cleck, sorry to hear about AF. I hope you do take heart from the fact that you are really young still, though I understand you had hoped for a less than 5 year age gap. I also think a Cleckner boy would be super cute. Emma looks soooo like Corey in her latest pics. your hair, and very like you, but she has his face! you're right about this pregnancy flying by, though when I think about it, I found out 7 months ago (Feb 11th), so that feels like ages, but I didn't go public at all till I was 12 weeks. in some ways it's been as long as usual, in others, I guess we've been so busy and stressed with moving that I haven't had the chance to spend much time thinking about it. in fact I feel like I am now squeezing in all the stuff we have to do for the baby, rather than having the luxury of doing it all at my leisure and enjoying it, as I did with Adam. last time I knew exactly how many weeks and days I was at any given point, now I have to think about it. and I was aware of what developmental stage baby was at - now I don't really have a clue. though headed towards 37 weeks is a relief. not that I think baby will be early but it's good to feel that if he was he has better and better chances of not needing special care as each day goes by. hard to believe there's only 10 left till full term.

Shiv, hope you're feeling better and your cold hasn't amounted to much? how did D's mum's visit go? your bump at 38 weeks now does look a lot lower than 39 with Sophia. you look great, and that's brilliant about your weight gain. well done! I have not done as well, I was weighed on Thursday (our scales are still awol) and fully clothed after a big lunch and needing the loo I was 12st 4lb. :cry: so going on 5 weeks left (and the way I have been eating) I might hit 40 weeks at a few lb less than last time but definitely a good bit over 12st, which was my upper goal.

David's cake looked fab, v envious. there's been no baking in this house yet as my kitchen still isn't organised as I want it. plus I am lazy. haven't done any internet shopping yet but I did go on Asda's website last night and started a list. we don't have fridge space to stock up *so* much, but I can get a week or so's fresh stuff, plus more than that of stuff like cheese, which keeps longer. it's my aim to have it so there's only milk and salad and fresh veg we have to buy in between times. I am stocking up on loads of frozen food and tins and things like washing liquid and toothpaste and toilet paper, so I don't have to think about it. it's a really bugbear of mine that we are not properly organised in that way. 

so, my mum came down on Wednesday. her back *is* bad, but she's putting an extremely brave face on it. fortunately - so she says - the most pain free thing she can do is go out with Adam in the pushchair, so that's great, and I've had some time to relax. though we have been out most days. 

Thursday I had my booking in appt - it went well, I really liked the midwives I met, there was an older, very experienced one and a newly qualified one. the appt took ages - an hour and a half - because they were very thorough, much more so than the ones who did my booking in at 9 weeks. they basically went through what had been written in my notes and questioned me further about some things, and expressed surprise that despite me telling them about my mental health history, it hadn't been taken that seriously, and they asked me more about that, and about my state of mind now. I guess because I've had so few actual mw appts, and I knew we were moving, and I *wasn't* in a bad way (though I have been stressed for months) nobody picked up on a thing before now. but I took my chance to say I have some really bad days, and they have referred me to two people, one is the the mw who sees depressed mothers to be, and the other will keep an eye on me (or at least be aware and a contact) for possible PPD. I didn't have it last time but I think that was in part because I did have someone I could contact. plus I just felt like I coped a lot better than I expected and that made me feel actively good about myself. obviously I hope this time is the same, but it's a different baby, I am different now (more experienced), and I have a toddler to cope with. so I am glad they know my fears and they were really nice.

other than that, the experienced mw said she was 100% that baby is head down. my bp was up but I am hoping it was a one-off. pee was ok. my bp was 121 over 75, which to me is high as I am usually around 102/70, but they said it was perfectly normal. they told me I had to make an appt for my 36 week appt within 10 days, so I did call and that is tomorrow (35+5), they're at the place I have to go on Mondays only, so I am quite glad I'm not having to wait till 36+5. 

they were also very encouraging about me hoping to go to the birth centre, and tried to make an arrangement for me to go straight up and have a tour, but there wasn't a mw available, so I went the next day. that also went well, the only thing that worries me is not getting in - either because it's full (there are 3 rooms with pools etc and 1 with a regular bed, which they said was a post-natal room) or because there are not enough midwives, as if they are busy on the regular labour ward they might draft them in. the labour ward is just through a set of double doors on the same floor. I really hope I can get in there, I have a feeling it would be quite a different experience to last time. but it's down to luck on the day. :shrug:

my mum and I have had our hair cut in the last few days, and we made an appt for tomorrow lunchtime for Adam's first haircut. :cry: I am not looking forward to it, though I said in no uncertain terms that it's just to be a trim and a tidy up, I don't want a short back and sides. I love his curls, but I do admit now that it's getting a little long, especially in the front now. the curls at the back are tight corkscrew Shirley Temple style curls, so so cute, and they don't hang low because the curls are so tight, but when wet it's beyond his shoulders. if he was a girl I think I'd leave it a while yet apart from a fringe/front trim. but Chris has been on about it for ages now. I just want him to have longer hair while it is so curly, and really hope it stays curly. my brother's is very very curly, and thick, though he wears it short now so it doesn't appear curly. when he was a teenager he let it grow and it was a bit like a poodle. he was about 20 here, I was 18, that's my dad and my gran as well

oh, and I posted this on the FB group, but here it is again - 35 weeks:

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/efcf8091.jpg

so mw in the morning. really hoping he or she is also certain of baby's position. also that my bp is a bit more towards my usual. my mum is coming with us then we'll go to the hairdresser after. :( my mum is going back up north on Tuesday, then I have a day's work on Wed, so C is taking the day off and is planning to take Adam swimming. then I will be counting down to my mum coming back on Oct 7th (if no baby by then, surely not as I will only be 38+2). unfortunately C's mum is off on holiday this Friday, till the 8th, so no chance of her having Adam for the day again. poor timing, really, I could have done with him going there, but by the time she is back my mum will be here. 

eeeek. so much still to do. I've washed nappies and clothes, and the wall stickers are up in Adam's room (they look fab, I'll take pics once he's in there and his bedding is on). haven't had a chance to get the new pushchair out, or fix up the car seat with its new cover. bit anxious about everything really, just want everything a *bit* more ready so there is no major panic.


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## Mary Jo

Jean, you posted as I was writing - yuck, the sickness sounds bad, but fingers crossed the quit day goes well and you feel better soon.

we've not done a lot with the house this week, though this morning we got some wood for shelves and C has made 2 of them. this is good as it's an important stage towards getting my big understairs cupboard emptied of books and DVD and stuff in box files, and getting the cupboard filled with miscellany that's not got a proper home yet. so am quite excited about that. :lol:


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## spidey

Pippin- your 10 day LP is what keeps me going :haha: I'm glad things aren't too impossible with 2 babies.

Shiv- I think you need to plan on having everything done for you for the first week after the new baby is born and everyone should expect that too. So David and your parents can entertain Sophia and they can cook, clean and make sure all your needs are met. Sophia can snuggle with you and watch tv and read books, but besides that, all you should do is feed the new baby and rest. I hope thats good advice :lol: Too bad you're a weirdo and rely on a scale for baking... if only you knew how to bake with cups! :haha: Your cake looked REALLY yummy though! How was your lunch with MIL?

jelr, thats too bad the champix is making you sick. Good luck on not smoking at all tomorrow! 

MJ- I wouldn't cut all Adam's curls either. He is adorable with his hair and there is no doubt he is a boy in all his pictures, so its not like he needs a super short haircut. And I do love your bump picture... it really is a keeper for the scrap book! I'm glad your midwife appointment went well and they're taking precautions against PPD.

I've been having a rough week with Kira. She's been throwing tantrums for the past week and it's really pushing me to my limit and I don't know what to do. As soon as I need to do something, like eat breakfast, make dinner, use the toilet, etc., she screams and hangs off my legs, and tries to push me in another direction. I always get to her level and say "mommy needs to make dinner now." and she screams even louder. A few times I've stopped what I was doing and said "show mommy what you want" and she takes me through an elaborate process of collecting 15 different items and then makes me go upstairs and give her a booby on her bed. Once she's done, she refuses to go back downstairs so another tantrum and elaborate process of collection starts all over again :dohh: During her item collection process she cries the whole time because things are dropping from her hands. When I run out of patience, I've said "mommy needs to make dinner now" and I let her hang off of me and scream for 15 minutes, or however long it takes. Then I have to spend 30 more minutes giving her booby. Usually when DH is home, Kira ignores me and plays with him, but during this past week she won't do anything without me right there too. The only time I get to myself is the 45 minutes between Kira going to bed and me going to sleep, and I end up spending most of that time trying to clean since I can't get sh*t done during the day. Thankfully DH got Kira away from me today and gave her a bath without me there, so that was 20 minutes to iron clothes. And DH is leaving at the end of this month for a vacation without me and I am dreading him going away. Not only will I have to deal with the tantrums all day, I'll have to somehow get her to sleep at night too (I have never put Kira to sleep on this new routine). And my parents are out of town the same 4 days as DH so I will have no help if I start to feel a little Casey Anthony :lol: I shouldn't complain because you girls have it much harder than me, heck, my DH even comes home for 1 hour at lunch each day. I'm not cut out for this and I find it hard to be a loving mommy under these circumstances. I've had mornings this week where I feel anxiety when I wake up, rather than joy when I see Kira's face. :cry: I know that once I get out of bed to spend 3 minutes straightening my hair, she'll hang off of me and start the screaming. When I'm not around, she is a sweet girl and perfectly content with whoever is watching her, but as soon as she sees me it's nothing but tears and demands. My left nipple is about to fall off it hurts so bad.

AND... if my cycle follows it's "normal" schedule, I will be ovulating when DH is gone too. :growlmad:

I'm just feeling sorry for myself. Advice I could use is what works best in these circumstances? I might have had a break through today because during one tantrum I finished preparing dinner and then I said "show mommy what you want" and Kira pointed upstairs. Not wanting to give her ANOTHER booby upstairs and get stuck up there, I said "do you want a booby on the sofa, or do you want to play outside?" she cried of course, and I repeated it a few times and then miraculously she picked booby on the sofa! So that might work. To prevent a tantrum, I've tried giving warnings like "in 2 minutes mommy has to make dinner". That doesn't always work. And normally Kira loves to join in and "help" me but when she's gearing up for a tantrum she doesn't want to help me.


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## ckc

Cleckner and Spidey, luckily for you guys short lutheal phase it is no hard to fix. Cleckner I hope your husband can be home on time to give it a good shot.

Spidey: That is really nice that Natasha can hold her pee at night, Narain can't, not even for nap, some times her nap diaper is heavier than the overnight diaper LOL 

Pippin: thank you for your post about having two, often times i wonder the same thing, how is it gonna be with two children. Narain will be a bit pass 2.5 years when her little baby brother or sister is here. You make it sound manageable. I am really hoping Narain can wean her self from the boobby soon, I can't see myself doing tandem nursing :)

Actually my husband said something kind of unusual the other day... he said that he could never love anyone like he loves Narain, and no matter how the other baby will be, Narain will always be his baby princess... at the beginning I didnt know what to make of that comment, then I felt hurt, especially given all that we have gone through to conceive that baby, and how much we want this baby!, then, I remember a time when Narain was about 6 months old and someone asked about when we will have another baby, I remember thinking or feeling the same way, I was so full of feelings for Narain that I couldnt believe myself as being capable of feeling more love than that. But of course after some time I was ready. Anyways, after my husband saw the heartbeat something changed for him and now he is super excited, I think he feels bad about what he said before. 

Shiv: Yes, both. We are planning for a home birth too and I don't know how it is gonna happen. Some women that give birth at home let their other children say through the whole thing. But I don't think I can do that I think Narain will be freaked out. But it is good that you have your parents there to help you. I dont have any family around and I dont think I want my mother in law to come and help, she is more needy than a women in labor and a toddler together so I don't think she can be useful. When Narain was born I stayed inside the house for a few weeks and it was so nice to have all the time in the world to bound with her, I loved that time, and now I am worried I wont have the same with the new baby. Well I guess my husband will take care of her. If I was you, would let your parents take her away and come back when you are all rested and ready ! I also I will ask them if they can stay at your house for a little bit so they can play with Sophia and take her out and give her a lot of love an attention. And also help you cook :) I would love that. 
I mean I would like for Narain to take part in everything ( I thin you do too with Sophia) but I think she will be better having her own fun and I will be less worried knowing that she is good and having fun and has the idea and the excitement to come home to a new baby. 

Jerl: That is so cute! I agree this stage is so funny and cute! Narain made a song for the booby too! and played it in the guitar ( I was actually holding the guitar and she would stream and sing along) I send the video to my family and they all had a good laugh.


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## ckc

Shiv, I am so sorry you are having such a hard week. Read this if you have time https://www.awareparenting.com/tantrums.htm I hope it helps a little tiny bit or at least you can try.


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## Shiv

MJ - I hear ya on the lack of sleep thing!I finally managed to get to sleep last night to be woken up by a bloomin police helicopter hovering overhead for over an hour!

I wouldn't worry about your weight, the doctors scales probably added a good half stone what with breakfast, lunch, a poo, a wee, clothes etc! You look great in your picture and certainly don't look like you have gained wieght anywhere apart from your bump. Plus if you are anything like me (our pregnancies do seem to have been a little similar this time) then you will lose your appetite in a couple of weeks! i actually lost weight last week - I was 11st 11.5lbs this morning.

I'm glad your mum has been able to take Adam out and about giving you a break.

Also glad that the midwives have been asking you how you are feeling and will be there to support you should you need it post partum.

I hope you can get into the birth centre, i had such a positive experience and wish I was still near the one I had Sophia in, chances are you will get in!

I saw th epic of Adam getting his haircut, looks liek he behaved himself, were you happy with the result?

Oh and you will get everything done, I really only just got everything organised this past week.......the pressure will spur you on!

Spidey - I agree I should be allowed ot just lie in bed with new baby for a week.......but I can;t see it happening. David used to be so good, when SOphia was first born he was great and used to prepare me food so that I ate enough etc etc, but to be honest he has become pretty slack, and I feel that whenever he does actually do anything that I am supposed to be really grateful instead of it just being him doing his share. I tried to talk to him about it in a *fun* way but I don't think he got the hint. I think because i have had to cope onmy own while he has been away that he thinks it can be just like that while he is home. But I would quite like to be taken care of just a little bit............but alas no. He better step up after baby is born, as he won't be at work so will have no excuse!

As for Kira's tantrums........well I can certainly empathise, although Sophia has been much better this week. My advice would be that by breastfeeding her you are giving her a reward for her bad behaviour. They are old enough to be reasoned with. Could you try saying something like "mummy needs to make dinner now, if you let mummy make dinner then youc an have boob afterwards".Can you make upstairs safe so that you can leave her up there. Sophia is often asking me to go upstairs so we can read and play, I don't have a problem with it unless i have something I need to do downstairs. If I need to go and make dinner I give her the option, you can either come downstairs with me or stay upstairs on your own. She often chooses to stay upstairs and then ten minutes later will call me to go and bring her down. Also Sophia is back to hating me making dinner (it used to be my most stressful time of day about 9 months ago but sh grew out of it), so now sh eis back to standing on a chair next to me and playing helper, or I fill up the sink and let her "wash up" - this keeps her entertained for ages.

Basically, I would try not to give in to her requests if there is really something you need to be doing. Try to get her to help, or if she wants booby to reason that if she is good and kets youget on with thinsg then she can have it as soon as you are finished.

I really feel for you as having no time to yourself is exhausting. 

Oh and could you try offering a snack instead of booby?

Where is DH going on holiday? I swear these men lead the life of Riley!


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## spidey

thanks for the link ckc :flower:

I think you're right Shiv that I was rewarding her by giving her booby. She's right in the middle of her "no" phase where everything is NO NO NO, and she's testing her limits with me obviously, and looking back I definitely let her get her way when I shouldn't. Today was much better, most likely because I was more confident in the rules I set. Dinner was always easy since Kira would play in the sink and "help" me, but now she's not interested in that. I'm sure thats just a phase too. 

DH is going on a manly vacation where he hangs out with other woodworkers and they sit around and chat all day :haha: There are some "famous" woodworkers from tv who will be there too. When Kira was 6 weeks old DH went on a a similar type trip, but it was for people who liked to grow bamboo. :haha: I need to come up with a vacation for myself because it isn't fair!

Shiv, perhaps after your DH watches you give birth, his helpfulness will reset :haha: I know my DH had a whole new respect for me after I had Kira and he suddenly became Mr. helpful, although right now he's slacked off too. Are you planning to have pictures taken during labor?

I took a movie of Kira during our picnic today and thought you girls might like to watch! Her new word is "eat" :haha:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-JyHGSmqWw


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## cleckner04

K girls. I have a question. when I go back home I plan on watching my friends two children. One is only two weeks old and the other is preschool age. What should I charge her? She works a full time job. She said she pays $175 a week for just her son right now. I thought $175 a week for both children would be good for me. But she isn't responding to the text now so I worry that she doesn't think it's reasonable. Maybe because I don't have childhood education as a background or anything like that. I don't know. I just don't want to rip her off. But at the same time I am going to be providing for my family too and I want it to be worth my while. So what do you think? What's the rate for childcare? I know most of us stay home with our LOs so don't even have to worry about paying for it. But maybe you guys still know what the rates are. I plan on taking CPR training and doing whatever I need to do to be licensed as well. Another thing is I plan on driving to her house to watch them every day. So that's gas money too that will be spent on going to her. She's only about 5 miles at the most from where I'll be living but it is still a factor. I just don't know what to do. 



spidey- Kira is so cute! Emma gets excited about airplanes too. :haha: 


My DH has never been too good about just jumping up and doing things. He has to be asked every time. But he will do things when I ask. Cooking dinner, taking trash out, etc. He tries his best to take Emma for me too when I need but he has no clue what to do when she throws tantrums and acts up. He just panics and ends up bringing her to me. :dohh: But our situation is a bit different because he's only been around like 9 months of her 2 year life. :wacko: I sometimes wonder how he'd be if he were here every night. Because even the days that his ship is home, he still has duty once a week so is gone all day and night. It's going to be odd being 'normal' next year. Terrifying really.


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## cleckner04

Okay my friend still hasn't responded so I'm thinking I may have F'ed up. She put in the text 'I pay for both 3 dollars an hour. and it was 175 for just westen.' (westen is her first son). But she didn't put a . so I thought she meant $175.00 a week. But now I"m thinking she meant $1.75 an hour for just her son. So my offering to watch them both for $175 a week is overshooting it if that's the case and I'm thinking I F'ed it up. :dohh: I don't really want to watch her kids for any less than $150 a week. And if she works a 40 hour week at a mere $3 an hour for childcare expenses, that's only $120 a week that she's paying for both children. That doesn't seem right. :shrug:


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## Shiv

To put one child in nursery full time here is about £40 a day (minimum up to £50) so that is £200 a week, so 2 children would be £400 a week = $630

SO over here what you are offering is a complete bargain! I can't say for the states though, hopefully SPidey can help you out.

I find it hard to believe she is paying someone less that $2 an hour for childcare..........is there no minimum wage over there as surely nobody would work for that!

If you charge $175 dollars a week then that is $87.5 a week per kid. That works out as just over $2 an hour which seems ridiculoulsy reaonable to me, especially because even if she is only working 40 hours a week she will be away for longer as she will have to get to work etc I would wait for her to get back to you. DO NOT message her again. If she feels you are being unreasonable let her tell you so. do not reduce your offer without her giving good reason. If your minimum is $150 a week then you did right in going in a bit higher.

Sorry if that isn't much help but wanted to reply ASAP


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## cleckner04

Thanks shiv. :hugs: Yeah there is a minimum wage here but I don't think it applies to some childcare providers because they mostly work out of their home IYKWIM. So it's also under the table and taxes wouldn't be taken out of it. My brother pays $100 a week at an actual daycare at a church. And that's only for like 3 days of childcare because my SIL only works part time and is home part of the week. 

I haven't texted back. At this point I would probably seem like a crazy person because I have texted twice since her last message and she hasn't responded so texting again at this point would be overdoing it. :rofl: 

It's times like this that I kick myself for never going to college and getting a career. I feel absolutely useless at times. I want to be able to help DH provide for our family but making $3 an hour isn't going to cut it. :wacko:


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## Shiv

Cleck - I went to university and I still can't earn any money and one of my biggest fears is that when I am ready to go back to work full time (in a couple of years or so) that noboday will want me! I was SO career driven before Sophia and had quite a high powered job before I left, but I know I will haveto start again from the bottom...............so I don't think you are at that much more of a disadvantage to be honest!


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## spidey

Cleck, that seems very fair. Here you can expect to pay $18,000/ year for a baby under 2 at a reputable center, so thats DOUBLE what you're offering to watch 2 kids (one being an infant). Minimum wage is 7.25 I think ($14,000/year). Cost of living might be slightly higher in Baltimore/DC, but I don't think it's that much higher. :shrug:

I wouldn't watch 2 kids for any less than 175/ week. I'm assuming its 40 hours a week and that's alot of work to watch 2 more kids in someone else's house. Heck, you could get a part time job for $10/ hour and work 2-3 days a week and make the same amount (but you would have to find someone to watch Emma for free to have it work out)


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## Shiv

oh and Spidey - Kira is a feeder :haha: Her words are coming on really well now, she is a cutie pie


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## cleckner04

I'm sitting here worrying all day now. :dohh: I keep thinking maybe I should just take a lot less because we will need the money. I want to be able to make enough to pay for our car insurance, cell phone and gas at the very least. I need to sit down and add it all up. I'm thinking if I can't do this, I need to find someone that needs a house cleaner that wouldn't mind Emma tagging along. :haha:


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## jelr

Cleck: I pay &#8364;35 a day / Roughly £30 or $47 a day so I definitely don't think you are looking for too much, that is a long week when you are minding them in her house, it wouldn't be so bad if it was in your own, where you could do your own housework and so on, but this way, you will only have the evenings and weekends to get your own bits done around the house, plus go home and cook a meal for you all, so why should you get any less.

I agree with Shiv, don't be so hard on yourself about work. I went back and studied and look how my job could be going and I'm kind of stuck if it does as I haven't done any teaching in 4 years since I got promoted, so I couldn't actually go back to it now because I would end up having to work full time, just to get my teaching notes done, because all my old ones are now obsolete.

Spidey: Kira is so so cute in that video, I hope the tantrums have gotten a bit better today. I do agree with Shiv that going upstairs and giving her booby seems like you are giving her her own way. Natasha had one of those evenings yesterday and refused her dinner (and it was her one that she likess) and screamed the place down for cheese, but I decided not to give in and said no that if she was hungry her dinner was there and if she wanted cheese, she had to eat it first. She did scream louder for a while, but then she stopped and actually ate it, so I gave her the cheese, so it showed she did listen and understand - I can totally understand the time to yourself too, I think that is partly why I'm struggling with the smoking as it gives me 10 mins here and there when DH is around to just go outside and have complete quiet time to myself.

Shiv: Would sitting down and talking to your DH help, I used to do most of the stuff here before Natasha was born because I wasn't working when we moved in together - well when I say most of the stuff, I mean cleaning, cooking and washing as he always looked after the garden, bins and any diy. That was just the routine we got into and I did get mad and have strops every now and again, but he never got the hint that I was pissed off still doing it all when I was working too. Like David he was great when I was pregnant and did nearly everything and also when she was born, but then it slipped back to normal after about a month. So when Natasha was born and it came to me going back to work, I did sit him down and said I wasn't going to be the martyr and just do everything and get mad, but that I was telling him now I wanted more help as there was two of us living here and two of us were now responsible for Natasha and it really has made a difference. I still look after most of the cooking, but that is because I finish up earlier, but he now cleans up after the dinner with me and when I do the once a week deep clean on the house, he does half of it now too. I definitely think men do need that extra push and even still I sometimes need to give him an extra push - like last week we had a huge row, because he was home late a few evenings and I knew it was because I was back at work and dinner was now at 6 instead of 5.30 so he just presumed he would work later and take the pressure off himself in work, where as I said I didn't have that luxury as Natasha had to be fed and I was running in the door and trying to get a dinner and entertain Natasha too all by myself, so this week he has been really good and is home not just on time, but early and is helping with getting the dinner ready. How long it will last I don't know.

MJ: I'm so glad you got lovely midwives and are going to be checked for ppd too. The birthing centre sounds lovely, I do hope you get in. 

Glad your mum got to get down too and you are enjoying some days out. Well did Adams hair turn out the way you wanted. I hope so as he has beautiful curls and it would be a shame to get too much chopped off, but some hairdressers do what they want don't they.

It wouldn't panic on what you have to do, think of how much you have managed to get done in the last few weeks and it sounds like you are pretty much sorted on top of moving house.

Well I'm officially a non smoker. It is a lot harder than I expected it to be with the tablets, I think I thought I wasn't going to need any will power, but unfortunately I do and I am struggling with it, but I'm getting there - well I must be as I haven't had any now since 12 last night. I do think the tablets may have taken the edge off though as it is not on my mind 24 hours a day like it was when I quit when I was pregnant, although it is on it about half the time, and part of that could be because I spent most of the morning trying not to vomit on anyone in work, but it was better than constantly wanting a ciggie, so I guess it was grand in the end :haha: The sickness has subsided a lot this evening, and hopefully the cravings will tomorrow also.

I'm actually quiet proud of myself as I have smoked since I was 14 so 18 years, bar the pregnancies and that wasn't for me, so it is a big acheivement.


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## Mary Jo

ha, I thought the same, Kira is a feeder! she's making you all eat. :lol: I love the video, Spidey, K is adorable. and I am very envious because there is no way on this good green earth that Adam would sit with us and have a picnic when there's all that grass to escape off to and explore. I wonder if it's a girl thing? I frequently see parents with little girls out and about, around Adam's age, and they are walking nicely, not even necessarily holding hands, but staying within 2-3 steps and being so well behaved. while Adam has to be in the pushchair else I cannot cope with chasing him around. I took him to the park early in the summer with my friend who has a little boy a month younger (before we moved, I have no friends now) and we really did chase Adam round the entire time (and this was a really big park) till I forced him into the pushchair and strapped him in, in order to eat a sandwich. it was less than fun. I cannot wait for the day that he cooperates. I fear it is far away. :(

about the tantrums, though - I definitely empathise. Adam is being difficult at the moment. same sort of thing, I cannot get half a minute to myself, unless his attention is captured by something on TV, and I confess to letting him watch more than I'd ideally like simply because that time turns out to be all the break I get while he is awake. there's only a couple of shows that he'll watch all the way through anyway, other stuff I try he'll glance at but not be bothered about. Adam also pulls at me, and he wants to be lifted up a lot now, something he never used to ask for. he'll pull on my top and squeal/scream, and sometimes it's clear what he wants (a deedee that's "hidden") or a piece of fruit, but other times I have no idea and he can't or won't say. it's immensely frustrating. he wants to go outside, so I'll go, and he pulls me into his playhouse, which is really small and not easy for me to go in and out of, or he drags me round the garden wanting into the shed, which is locked and I pretend not to have a key. he is such hard work. constant hard work. if it wasn't for his naps I'd have been taken away by now.

I don't know what to suggest. I think it's harder when the child in question isn't very verbal. Adam has lots of words but doesn't string them together, so to all intents and purposes he can't communicate too well. or at least not verbally, and I am getting sick of the non-verbals, especially when screaming (seemingly randomly) is part of it. it is especially annoying when I know he understands so much and will follow instructions very well, yet seems not to understand "mummy will come and play soon". sorry, I wish I had advice or suggestions for you but we're in a similar boat.

jean, massive well done on being a non-smoker! :D that's briliant, and I hope it gets easier as the days go by. I know just what you mean about being angry when your OH comes in late and you still have to do everything, Chris has been busy at work lately and been in later, and not told me, so I have waited and then poor Adam is waiting for his dinner as well and it's really not fair. fortunately I don't have to do everything in the house, C, for all his faults, is not too bad in that sense. though he has problems with deciding when to carry out the stuff he wants to do. if he's doing it, he's doing it, even if it is midnight, even if I have had Adam all day and need a break, even if Adam is standing behin the gate screaming for his daddy. this annoys me because I think he should try to do things at a good time for us all, not just for himself.

cleck, sorry, I know less than nothing about appropriate childcare rates, but I hope you don't end up selling yourself short and stick to the price level you are looking for. as for the job situation, I do empathise. although I have somehow managed to work 1 day a week (more likely 3 days a month lately) I feel less than hopeless about getting work again once my maternity leave is up this time round. and especially, the idea of me ever being offered a decent part-time job, let alone a full-time job, seems unrealistic. nothing like that would be an option till the 2nd baby is in full-time school anyway, since childcare costs would likely prohibit anything much earlier, so we're looking at late 2016 anyway. eeeek. 5 years away. I try not to think about it or I get so scared. cant see the job I do being open in the next few years, as it's a dying industry and we have all been well aware of that fact for the last 3 years. I also want to help contribute financially and I have been, but it's a huge worry that I won't be able to in the future. just hope I have some majorly bright idea for money making in the meantime.

how's things today, Shiv? any hopeful signs of anything imminent? 

we have managed to get a few things done, Chris came home yesterday to take me to the hospital for the scan that didn't happen, and afterwards we bought more wood for more shelves and he put the new car seat cover on and dug out my birth ball. so we do have a car seat now all ready. and Adam's haircut went well, I explained I didn't want it too short, so she went the other way and didn't really cut enough off. it's still curly and fairly long, but a lot tidier. he doesn't look different, which is what I wanted, I have seen too manylittle boys go to the hairdressers and come out looking 2 years older. I want my baby to look like a baby for a while yet. he was very very well-behaved at the hairdressers, he sat on my mum's lap as no room on mine, and we had got him a lolly (like a giant boiled sweet on a stick). this is only the second non-ice lolly he's ever had (first was to calm him down when he was distraught at the doctor's a few months ago, after his time in hospital when he was very traumatised by all things doctor) and he sat lovely and still. it probably helps that he's a bit of a narcissist and loves gazing at his own reflection. :rofl:

so, that was fine, but I am not in a good way at all, not coping, stressed out of my tree. part of it is the fear that baby is breech (after yesterday's appt where 1 mw thought he was and then being sent for a scan and being told they wouldn't scan till 37 weeks, and then 2 more midwives saying he *isn't* breech, but still not managing to convince me). I want to be able to chill about it all and strip away my hopes for a birth centre birth, and just be grateful if we both get through it alive and well, but I can't, and I feel so down. as well as this, like I was saying ^^ about Adam being difficult, I can't cope with it. I just can't. it drives me mad and I feel like a bad mother. I've had my mum here to help since last Wednesday, and she's amazing with him, taking him out so I can get a break, and just sharing the load, and she was supposed to go back home today, but I went with her, with Adam, to the station this morning and when she said goodbye I just burst into tears. this was after a difficult morning with Adam (and it was still only 9.30am - in his attempt to make me get out of bed, he slapped me in the face and ended up busting my lip - this after seeing how many of his dummies he could fit in my mouth at once, fortunately he only had 3 available). so my mum, who'd already asked me if I wanted her to stay (and I'd said no, I'd cope) said she was staying, and rang Chris to tell him. this is where I feel bad. Chris gets really sick of my mum being here. and he is so selfish about it because she helps *so much*. with Adam, with the house, with going out and getting our shopping, she just wants to make life easier on me, and all he sees is how he is inconvenienced. and I hate him feeling like that. it doesn't help that my mum has witnessed blazing rows we have had in the past, and that he knows I have told her about other much more major blazing rows (we had one the other week that got totally out of hand when he called me a fat fucking bitch, this would make me see red at any time, given my anorexia history, but at almost 8 months pregnant I was just livid and so upset). so because he thinks she thinks badly of him (even though they actually get on fine) he is antagonistic to me when she is coming down. you'd think she was on our doorstep every 5 minutes but she really isn't, because of her bad back in the spring, she wasn't here at all between February and May. he seems to project how he feels about himself onto other people, so I think he feels badly about how he has behaved to me and he projects that into thinking other people feel badly towards him. and he wouldn't be 100% wrong, my mum is angry that he's upset me, but she somehow sets it aside. she can see his good points, and he does have a lot of them, but empathy doesn't seem to be one of them. 

anyway, he was fine when my mum spoke to him about her staying. though we haven't discussed how long she is staying. he won't be happy if this is her here till after the baby is born. the original plan was that she left today and came back on Oct 7th, so 2 and a half weeks' time. I just don't know because I can't see me finding things any more tolerable as I get even bigger.

I'm clinging to the idea that it won't be this awful and I won't feel this bad after the baby is here. I feel so awful because I am pregnant and huge and tired and unable to comfortably run around after Adam. I hate myself, I feel like I am a failure, that I should never have tried to do this (have another baby) because I cannot cope, and I am afraid (with good reason, he has said so) that Chris really thinks I won't manage 2 children. I remember having a few bad days at the end of my last pregnancy, but of course then it was all about me, and I didn't have to cope with it while dealing with a 2 year old. I just keep on bursting into tears. everyone is put out because of me. Chris isn't comfortable or happy in his own home, my poor mother, who should be resting as she is 62 and has a bad back, is forced to stay because she is so worried about me... poor Adam isn't getting much of a nice mummy any more (I do try but then my temper is so short when he won't cooperate; every time I tried to put him in his high chair for a meal today, and also his pushchair when my mum was taking him out, he fought against me, and he doesn't usually). my mum was seeing to him while I was making dinner tonight but still he wouldn't leave me be. and I am concerned that we've still never put him in his own room and we're not going to get him out of our bed before the baby is here. my mum said she'd sleep on the settee and let him have his bed, but C said no. I am scared that we now have 6 weeks max before baby is here, and how upset is Adam going to be to be evicted all of a sudden and not just evicted but usurped. I never wanted to upset or traumatise him, I hoped we'd have a good few clear months for him to get used to not co-sleeping, but now if we have a few days it'll be a miracle. :cry:

I just want to be able to cope with the life I have. C keeps saying "my mum will have him for a day, I'll take a day off a week" and I think, ack, that would be nice but being this pregnant it's not 1 day off I want or need, it's help every day. I cannot store up my rest or my quiet time and have it carry me through the other 4 days I am by myself with Adam. if only. C's mum is a non-option anyway as she goes away on hols on Fri for 2 weeks. 

tomorrow should be better as I am working and C took the day off for it when I was booked, and he's planning to take Adam swimming, so my mum will have a rest. a day at work sounds like heaven right now. even though the trip into town won't be a breeze, a day with no screaming and nobody to pull at me will be amazing. and I feel like a terrible person for thinking it, let alone saying it out loud.

then Thursday I have an appt with the midwife who deals with depressed mothers. it was actually great timing, as I was only referred last week I didn't have great hopes of the system getting me in for an appt much before the baby is due, but the lady rang today, right after my mum said she'd stay, and offered me an appt for Thurs at 12.30pm. the way I feel right now it couldn't have come at a better time. it's not that I think she can change anything but I am very close to thinking I am in as bad a way as Ive been in some years, and I *need* to talk to someone professional about it. I'm even thinking more open-mindedly about medication. I haven't been on any (for my head) in about 3 years, but if it would help me cope then I'd consider it. and that makes me feel more like a failure but if it can help me be more the sort of mummy I want to be for my babies, then so be it. :(

sorry I'm on such a downer right now. I've wanted to write it all down all day but never had the chance.


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## spidey

MJ, I'm sorry you're having such a hard time. :hugs: It sounds like you're putting too much pressure on yourself to be a perfect mom, wife and daughter and too worried about other people's feelings. You shouldn't feel bad about your mom staying and I'm sure she loves the time to bond with Adam. I'm sorry DH isn't more accepting of your mother staying to help out. Do you think DH gets jealous that your mom helps out more than he is able to? I think with how we live these days, we have too much pressure on us as mom's to care for a baby all day and we don't have a large extended family close by to help us out. I think talking to a professional will be great and you'll have to tell us how it goes. I had to laugh though when you said Adam was stuffing dummies in your mouth to wake you up. Once the baby is here you might actually get better sleep and with more sleep you'll find everyday tasks easier to deal with. 

Cleckner, did you ever hear back from your friend? How hard is it to get a home daycare license? Do you have family back home willing to watch Emma 2 or 3 days a week for free? If you did, you could work a few hours here and there to make extra money and Emma could have time to bond with her grandparents (or whoever). It is nice getting a break and making a few extra $$. My MIL hands out free samples at Sam's club and started at 11- something an hour! So you could be a free sample lady too :haha:

jelr, congrats on being a non smoker!! Has DH hid all the cigarettes so you're not tempted? What are you doing instead of smoking?

Oh, and MJ, Kira does not walk nicely with us if we're in the store. She runs off and starts removing things from the shelves :haha: But when we have a picnic she stays close by, which is great for me so I don't have to keep chasing her down!


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## Shiv

Cleck - did you hear back from your friend?

jelr - We have dinner at 5pm in this house and I am REALLY lucky that 9/10 David is home for it. the thing is (as I am sure you all understand) dinner time can be the most stressful part of the day. So David used to get in at 4.45pm, just to give me enough time to finish up dinner. He does it for a few weeks then reverts back to rolling in at 5.02pm in time to sit down. He got in at 5pm tonight and said to Sophia "mummy looks a bit stressed" so I hit him with the fact that he is supposed to be here at 4.45pm if possible and he said "you just have to ask".............but this isn't a new arrangement! SO we'll see what tomorrow brings!

Congratulations on being a non-smoker - I hope that today was easier than yesterday.

MJ - as far as tantrums are concerned I am not sure what is worse a toddler who can't communicat ein words and screams or a toddler who can communicate in words and screams the same unobtainable wish on repeat! hahaha there is no pleasing us!

I know how you feel about not returning to work (full time) for many years, it scares me as I already feel that I am unemployable!

I am glad you have got some stuff done in preparation for the baby. Remember as long as the baby has some clothes and a boob/bottle then everything else can wait.

I am sorry you are not coping well at the moment. you are not a bad mother, you are a heavily pregnant, hormonal mother of a very demanding toddler, who has not been receiving the cupport she needs from her husband. No wonder you aer stressed! i am glad your mum has stayed around with you, tell Chris that perhaps if he helped out a bit more and didn't make you feel like sh*t sometimes then perhaps you wouldn't need her there.

You WILL manage with 2 children, because you will HAVE to manage with 2 children. What other option do we have?! you are a great mum to Adam and you will be to Joel as well. Everyone has off weeks and with all teh hormones going round, try not to be too hard on yourself.You feed Adam, you don;t beat him, you clothe him, you are there for him if he needs you............you are not a bad mum. Adam is testing the boundaries, he can see you are at breaking point and as horrible as it sounds that is what they want. But you CAN do this. Adam isn't going to be scarred for life by having a stroppy mum for a few weeks, he won't even remember!

I think it is a good idea to speak to the specialist midwife, I am sure she can give better advice than me! But it will get better. I don;t know i fyou remember me posting a week or so ago about how demanding SOphia was being. Well someone asked me if I was sick of being pregnant and my reply "no - I'm sick of being a mother".........what a terrible thing to say, but I felt it at the time. I wanted to go away somewhere for a week without Sophia and sleep, and be myself and not just a mum.............being is so all consuming and it gets on top of the best of us, you are not alone. Big hugs x 

Oh and I just did a route planner and you are only a 20 minute diversion frommy route when I go back to Kent, so perhaps we can meet up once we are both a bit settled with the new babies?

As for me, I feel far away from labour, no signs at all..........hurumph!


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## jelr

Shiv: I totally understand, that was exactly what our row was about, like David he is 9/10 times home in time for dinner, but over the summer when dinner was at 5.30 as he can't get home before he was home at that time and the minute I went back to work and dinner had to be shifted to 6 as I'm only in around 5.30 myself after collecting Natasha, he wasn't arriving until 6. But thankfully now after the row he is back to being here at 5.30 and even arrived at 5 on Monday and it makes all the difference to half a second person there, when I'm getting Natasha in and trying to get veg or pasta or something on to go with whatever has been put in the slowcooker or oven if I have been working from home.

I think with men, you do have to spell it out sometimes because my DH didn't even think about it, he just thought "ah sure I may as well get some more work done and take the pressure off myself as dinner is not until 6" and it was only when I said it to him that I found it extremely stressful, just finishing work, having to run over and collect Natasha and organise dinner so that it isn't too late for Natasha, while he gets to saunter in and have it handed to him :dohh: - So I think he gets it now, how long it will last though is another question. I really hope that your DH is home on time tomorrow and every other day and maybe like he said, ask a bit more when you do need help with stuff around the house as you really should be resting as much as possible now, so he should be helping more with Sophia.

Did you send the email to your friend after, is there anymore news?

Spidey: Don't you know I have replaced smoking with food - I have ate more bread, peanuts, crisps and chocolate over the last few days :haha: - Although I am also using my no nicotine cigarette if it is really bad - I don't mind the food too much though if it gets me over the first week or two and then I'm going to put myself on one of my strict diets, number 1 to stop all the eating and rein myself back in, number 2 to lose the weight I'm already putting on and number 3 as I always seem to get pregnant if ttc striaght after so hopefully it will be a win win situation.

How is Kira now? Has she settled down any? I hope so as that is exhausting. I'm hoping Natasha is as good as gold for the next two days when I'm off or I could be heading to the shop for smokes :haha: - No DH didn't hide them on me, he actually has more faith in me this time than I do, he reckons he has never seen me more determined and he has been great and not went out to smoke at all in the evenings, so that is helping too.

MJ: I'm so so sorry that you feel so bad, but you are not a bad mum, you are a great mum and are just having a hard time with being heavily pregnant, exhausted and full of hormones that is doing most of the looking after of an extremely active toddler by herself. I wouldn't feel a bit quilty for your mum staying to help, think about it, I bet there is nowhere else she would prefer to be. I know when I was pregnant on Natasha, my mum was over here every day helping with this and that, In fact herself and DH had me drove nuts not allowing me to do anything (ha ha it will a total different story the next time with Natasha to look after too and I will be letting them) and I totally agree with Shiv, if Chris has a problem with it, well let him do all that your mum is doing at the moment. Honestly please stop being so hard on yourself and trying to have everything perfect. You are doing 3 of the most stressful things in life together, being a mum, moving house and being pregnant. I would be a basket case.

I do definitely think that it would be a good idea to talk to specialist midwife too as she is dealing with this day in and day out and we are all here if you need us too.

Yeah Day 2 is not too bad, I'm not as sick on the tabets today so that is good, and the craving was a little less, although I felt really sad to be off them today, how stupid is that :dohh: - Although I have done lots of reading and aparantly that is normal, that you do kind of grieve after smoking for such a long time. It is weird as it is so different to when I stopped when I was pregnant, whether it is to do with the tablets or just because mother nature took over before I don't know. But hopefully it is all for the better and because I'm making the decision for myself I will stick with forever. Other than that it has just been work and more work today. 

Looking forward to being off tomrorow in one sense, but I'm scared that I will have mor time to think about smoking. Although I nipped into the office shop on the way home and got a few bits of arty things and we are going to make sock puppets, so hopefully Natasha will enjoy it and it will keep me busy :thumbup:


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## spidey

Kira's been really good these past 2 days and I've been better at preventing tantrums. I've been doing a good job giving her 2 choices, and even if I know she doesn't want either, she'll pick one of my options and be happy about it. So for now that's working :thumbup:

I did something really drastic today. I put bright pink/red streaks in my hair :shock: They are bright and I have to go to work tomorrow- oh gosh :blush: I think from all the stress recently I needed to do something semi-destructive to myself although DH thinks it looks good :haha: When I was younger I use to give myself piercings, or cut, neither of which I'll allow myself to do now. I know its probably nothing, but my mom got called back for a second look at one of her breasts after her mammogram, and I just lost my Aunt to breast cancer. It's been a bad year for things like that. Atleast the hair dye is semi-permanent, so it won't be bright red forever :haha:

Have fun with the sock puppets tomorrow jelr and let us know how its goes. I collected a bunch of pine cones and plan to make a pine cone wreath with Kira this weekend.

Shiv, is the baby back to back still?


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## cleckner04

jelr- Well done with the smoking!! Keep it up hun, it'll be so worth it. :hugs: Sock puppets sounds like a fun distraction. :D 

You girls are so creative. I need to think of more crafty things to do with Emma. I seem to go through spurts of doing creative things with her. Lately I've been so busy packing so Emma has been suffering for attention a bit. Right now I'm letting her play with a roll of christmas wrapping paper. She's giggling away so I think she enjoys it. :haha: 

spidey- Pictures of your hair please!! Unless you've posted them on FB and I haven't noticed. :blush: You've had such a rough year. :hugs::hugs: 

Shiv- Labor dust to you. :dust: You had already had Sophia at this point right? Didn't you have her at 38 weeks? 

MJ- You are an amazing mother. I think you are putting far too much pressure on yourself to be perfect. You will cope with two babies. People have been doing it for centuries. Your DH seems to be making matters worse instead of better. :nope: I wish I could somehow help more. :hugs: 



Well, I had never heard of the Fellom method for potty training until the lovely ckc mentioned it the other day. So today I woke up and thought, 'fuck it, I'm gonna try it today'. Emma hates wearing diapers and I'm sick of cleaning up piss all day. So this morning I immediately put her on the potty with a pop tart in front of sponge bob. :rofl: Than she stood up after about half an hour and she finally started peeing while standing there. I grabbed the potty real fast and put it under her. I caught more than half the wee and than immediately started cheering and dancing because I was so happy to finally catch some in there. Emma got this proud little smirk, we walked off to the bathroom and dumped the pee and said bye bye. Than all day today I've watched her. I've had her sit on it a few times but nothing happened. I think she must've been holding it being stubborn because after her nap I told her where the potty is and we ate a snack together. Well in the middle of eating the snack she hurried and backed onto the potty and started peeing on her own!! She nearly filled the thing up. :rofl: She held her pee from 11 in the morning with the first morning pee, to 6 pm. :wacko: But she did it on her own!! It's now 7:25 pm and she hasn't went since but I've been keeping an eye and plan on rushing over if she starts to go again. I ask constantly if she has to go too. :haha: Is there anything I should be doing differently? Or am I doing okay? It says to leave the house for an hour the second day but I'm not sure if I'm comfortable with that. We will see how the night goes. She rarely pees in the night so if it goes well I may try to leave tomorrow for a bit but I'm nervous about her peeing in public and ruining her confidence IYKWIM. Ahhh! I'm so excited even though it's minor compared to other LOs in the august group.


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## ckc

Hello Girls!!!

I have been down with some pretty nasty MS, and right now I can't write all I would like as I have to get ready to go and get an ultrasound. 
So I will start by saying that up to now I have never had to deal with a tantrum ( at least from Narain ) , that is why I can't quite give advise, but I kept thinking about it and maybe one of reasons why she doesn't thrown tantrums ( yet) in spite of being born a quite high maintenance, strong-willed baby girl is because by principal I dont change my mind after giving a warning, so I put my self in that dinner situation, that actually I have to deal with everyday, 5 pm it is a difficult time, we just come back from playing she is tired and needy, i am tired too and less patient, I need to make her dinner and move on with our routine, a that time it is only the two of us in the house. I give the warning first ( with her i have to constantly tell her what's going to happen. With Narain, It doesn't work giving her options) " Mama is going to cook dinner and you are free to read your books or play with your blocks" and that is what happens everyday, but of course it is not always like that as sometimes she is not willing, and when this happens I don't nurse her, I don't play with her, i just stay with her while she cries and acknowledge her feelings, then I go and she stays crying and saying things for a little bit and then she calms down and does what she needs to do. When she asks for something and I say no, she doesn't insist or cry ( and if she cries she gets over it quickly ) and this Is because I have been constant in meaning what I say to her and i don't give in. BUT with my husband for example, Narain does what ever she wants with him, she is spoiled and whinny and a complete different child when she is alone with her father, he says no to her and 2 minutes later he says yes, she knows exactly how to get what she wants from her father. And sometimes I truly don't approve of her behavior with him. I have told him and he agreed with me and now he feels more comfortable about letting her cry and helping her integrate her feelings of frustration and anger as suppose to constantly giving her quick fixes to spare her a cry and on the way contribute to an spoiled behavior. I don't now if this makes sense to you guys. I am just trying to describe how it works for us, but I believe that children are all different and Moms know best what method is more suitable for their children. 


Cleckner, I can help you with your day care thing I have so much to say. i just need time to write it down and I have to go, i will get back to you ASAP. 

Hugs to all!!


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## spidey

ckc, I'm sorry your m/s is getting worse. How did your ultrasound go?

I guess I shouldn't call Kira's crying a tantrum- it's not fair to parents who actually have children who throw tantrums :haha: That's funny that Narain has your husband figured out!

Cleckner, we must have been thinking of the same thing! I gave potty training a test run too, and I was surprised at how long she held her pee. It was right before dinner and she somehow managed to remove her diaper. She wasn't going to wear another one without a fight, so I asked if she wanted to wear big girl underwear. She held her pee from 5pm (the last time I changed a wet diaper) until 8, when she finally peed outside the bathtub when she heard the water running. I got her on the potty half way thru, and a few dribbles made it in. She was so pleased with herself! I did the same thing as you and asked "do you have to pee?" over and over. The poor girl was probably sick of me asking. This is how is played out: Me: "do you have to go pee pee?" "NO NO NO!................ pee pee" Me: "do you have to go pee pee then?" "NO NO NO!..............pee pee" Me: "do you want to sit on the potty?" "NO NO NO!............pee pee" :haha: So I decided that when DH is away next weekend, I'm going to try potty training on my own. I'm going to roll up the rugs and see what happens :lol: I'm planning to put a diaper on her at night, and I'll use a diaper if we go out. If Emma pees while you're out, she might not feel embarrassed because she doesn't know that peeing your pants is a bad thing. So if you're brave enough give it a try :haha: I dread having to clean the car seat, so thats why I'll stick with diapers for the first couple of weeks. Thats super that Emma peed a second time on the potty- she is a quick learner :thumbup:

So here is my hair!


Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/red/red1.jpg
https://www.razortoe.com/share/red/red2.jpg
https://www.razortoe.com/share/red/red3.jpg

Also I started spotting, so if history repeats itself I'll ovulate in a week. I've tried searching for reasons for spotting 1 week before ovulation but can't find anything- does anyone have any ideas?


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## cleckner04

:rofl: Yeah Emma mostly just says no too when I ask if she has to go. :dohh: But I think I'm making progress because a week ago Emma wouldn't even sit on the potty. I've been writing it all down so I will know if she progresses for the better each day. 

Yesterday was like this. -Total for the day: 1 full pee on the potty by herself - 3 pees half on the potty after she started to go on the floor - 1 pee completely on the floor. No poop. 

Than she slept the entire night without a diaper and no accidents. 

Today so far - 1 full pee on potty by herself. That's it so far. :haha: But it's only 11:45 am and if she follows the same pattern as yesterday she won't pee again until after a nap. It's the evening that she was suddenly peeing a ton yesterday. Which was bad for me because I wasn't as diligent about watching her at night because I was cleaning after the boredom of sitting around all day watching her. :dohh: 

Each time she pees we get up and say 'bye bye pee pee' and wave bye and flush it down. Today when Emma peed by herself she immediately said 'bye bye pee pee' even though she was still sitting there peeing. :rofl: So I think she likes that part of the routine. I wish I could get this on video because I'm so proud of her but I think it'd ruin the moment if I shoved a camera in her face. :haha: 

As a sidenote- I'm so glad we don't own these carpets. :rofl: We plan on renting a rug doctor one more time before moving out but I'm starting to think our next house should be hardwood flooring only. 


Spidey- I love your hair!! I think it's awesome that when it's down you can't tell too much but you have the option of putting it half up to show the color off if you want. :thumbup:


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## Mary Jo

more to say when I have the time and energy, but - to add to the pee talk, Adam peed in the wardrobe today. I was not impressed. I haven't had a chance to put stuff in it yet because he's been going in and playing peekaboo since we got it (plan was to leave the final unpacking till he is in his own room). 

it was after his bath while I was tring to get him to lie down and let me put a nappy on. he went in and crouched down and closed the door. guess he wanted some privacy. gah. just glad it wasn't a poo.


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## cleckner04

Aww MJ. :haha: Emma did similar last week but instead of a wardrobe it was inside her toy box. She loves climbing in but now that she refuses to wear a diaper I wasn't quick enough to get her out and she pissed all over all the toys. :wacko: I was not a happy mommy that day. Her pee stinks now too. Not like when she was a baby. It's like adult pee now. :sick: Just another reason why I had to at least try to potty train right now. With her taking her diaper off every five seconds, my house was starting to smell like an old folks home. :rofl:


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## spidey

oh my- those are both really bad places for pee! The only thing I have to deal with is poop in the bathtub :haha: Lucky for me the bathtub is relatively easy to clean up once I fish the turds out. Tonight was the second time this week :lol:

Keep us updated on Emma's potty progress. We're going to start next Wednesday. I talked to my friend at work who just potty trained her daughter 4 months ago. Her daughter goes to daycare, so she would wear a diaper during the day, and when her daughter came home in the evening she would change into underwear. If they were home on the weekends, she would wear underwear all weekend, but if they were busy, she would wear a diaper most of the day. But even with the inconsistencies and the more laid back attitude, her daughter is fully potty trained now.


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## cleckner04

How did your friend do it? I'm open to all and any tips. :haha: Today Emma has so far: 1 full pee on the potty by herself. 2 half pee on the floor and I hurried and put her on. She snuck upstairs once and by the time I grabbed the potty and rushed up there, she had pooped. I think she wanted privacy for her poop. And she's had 1 full pee on the floor while I was on the phone with my parents. I'm not happy about it because the potty was right in front of her. She could've stepped two steps forward and sat down. :( I'm frustrated but I plan to keep pushing through it because she is at least trying to sit on it after months of refusing flat out to sit. So I want to take advantage of the sudden effort on her part. I'm still not sure that she 'gets it'. But she does look very proud of herself when she makes it in time. 


Totally different topic but I got Emma a little spongebob beanie baby toy from amazon and it arrived today. The first thing she did was ask me where his hat is. :rofl: Since he wears a hat to work. I guess she wanted him to have a hat. But he didn't come with one. :dohh: She must've got over it because she's now naked except for a tutu and is running really fast in circles with spongebob under her arm. :haha: I love toddlers. Such entertainment.


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## Mary Jo

thanks ladies. I am glad I can vent here...

Shiv, how's things? anything going on? are you sick of people asking/wondering yet? re your comment about being sick of being a mum - yeah, I sometimes feel that as well. not that often because the guilt sets in pretty fast, but yes. (and last night I wanted not to be a wife as well, I was on the verge of grabbing my jacket and purse and phone and going out to find a hotel for the night by myself.) when Adam's being demanding and wanting to be picked up and go outside when I am only in my nightie... and when he's wailing at the gate when I'd just love for him to come back to bed and let me have another 20 minutes... I have a had a few thoughts this week of "only 2 years till he's at school", but then when we hit that point Joel will be younger than Adam is now so I'll be going through this again! though maybe not, maybe having a big brother will mean he learns to communicate better at a younger age? not sure how that works.

spidey, I love the red in your hair, it's a statement but subtle at the same time. I like even better that you did it as a positive thing as opposed to something actually destructive. I need to find that sort of positive outlet as well, I was so self-destructive in the past, and I am not now (unless you count over-eating/eating junk) but I have really strong urges to do stuff. not drink, or even use food in the way I did, but I yearn to self-harm when I am in the worst stress. and the *only* reason I don't is because I don't want C to know, and I don't know how I could hide it. what I want to do - and I just have to let the moment pass - wouldn't be easily hidden, unless I started wearing nightclothes, which I just don't. so I don't. I don't feel good for resisting, but maybe I should. I'm so sorry you're under stress, it's been a bad year for you, really hope your mom is ok. :hugs:

you're right, I do care too much about what other people think, and I do wish I didn't feel so uncomfortable at the thought that Chris is uncomfortable with my mum around. I do realise it is him who has the problem, if there is one time in my life I should be having whatever makes me comfortable (within reason, and within possibility, of course) it is now. I have wondered myself if he is jealous and it could be. I don't know for sure. It's not like she is an interfering person, she lets us get on with things, but tries to help (she's done wonders in my house, cleaning and sorting things, I swear, she rarely sits down. she's just one of those people, and this is even with a bad back). and she's brilliant with Adam, which is what I need the most. I couldn't give a flying fuck about the housework, beyond the bare essentials (laundry, food shopping, cooking, keeping the place fairly hygienic) but I do like it when it's done. (I am lazy, it doesn't take pregnancy to make me slack off, unfortunately.) I think he might feel uncomfortable because he knows I tell my mum most things, and she's seen for herself how vile he can be to me at times, never mind the things I have told her myself. he'd like to play the devoted husband and father, and he does when there is an audience, generally, but with someone living in the house, true colours tend to come out, and it doesn't suit him. 

Shiv, other than the pushchair, everything is pretty much sorted for the baby now. I need to get my sling out and practise, as it's been a long time since Adam was in it. we washed the mattress cover today, and I still have to dig out most of my muslins, and the baby monitor, but we have clothes and nappies. and I don't feel anxious about the new baby. I mean, I am anxious that the labour etc goes well, and anxious as to how Adam will deal with everything, but I was totally inexperienced with babies before Adam, and now I don't feel scared of a newborn, though it'll be funny to change a very small newborn after my giant toddler. :lol: we need to go to Ikea and get Adam's kitchen as well. Chris is under strict instructions that he is *not* to set it up or let Adam see it before we arrive home with the baby. guess he will have to set it up but hide it somehow. I am going to get a small present for him to give the baby and one for the baby to give him, just in case we are still in hospital when he first meets him. I am not planning to be in, but you never know and I'd rather have all this done just in case.

as for meeting up with the babies, I would LOVE that, so I really hope we can do it :D

Jean, how did the sock puppets go? I bet Natasha loved it :D and how's the no smoking going? really hope it's getting a little easier. so admire you for doing it right now, for yourself, rather than making it a conditional thing, because you're pregnant. when I stopped drinking I had to do it unconditionally for myself, not anyone or anything else, because I knew that if the person or thing I stopped for ever let me down, I'd be at risk of starting again, whereas if it's for me, I feel less vulnerable.

also, you're totally right, my mum said only yesterday that it is no hardship for her to be here with us and helping. I feel bad that we need her when her bad back has flared up, but she's so stoic. and bless my little baby boy, he loves his gran ("Gan") so much and gives her kisses and cuddles (and he's only just started giving *me* kisses and cuddles) and he's so very well behaved 95% of the time for her. I'm sure it would be a different story if he was difficult but he isn't, for her he is an unmitigated joy to be around. I am learning a lot myself. which I sometimes feel weird about, he's my boy, I should be able to manage him the best, but the truth is, she has spent so much time in the last few years with my nephew and nieces, so she is just a lot more practised at handing toddlers. they even have fun cleaning his teeth, whereas I get frustrated and hate doing it.

cleck, wow, Emma is doing great with the potty training! good for her. guess she just got ready all of a sudden if she just decided it was ok to sit on the potty after all. I wonder if it'll be like for Adam? he only very rarely wants to take his nappy off, I was always led to believe that toddlers in cloth had the desire to be out of nappies earlier than toddlers in disposables because they were aware of the wet feeling, but it doesn't seem to bother Adam at all. oh well. he also doesn't have a predictable time when I notice he's held his wee, though he sometimes does. he always has a full nappy in the morning, though I do admit to not changing it or checking it the minute he wakes. I haven't tried sitting him on the potty in a while. not a fan of wee everywhere. I think that might be my issue to deal with. 

so... I saw the special midwife (not sure what her actual title would be, but she's a regular midwife who liaises with mothers who have mental health issues) yesterday. it went ok. she was nice, and understanding of my stresses, especially w/r/t managing a 2 year old while being 8 months pregnant. she's referred me to the psychiatric liaison team, and said she'd rush the referral through because of my late stage of pregnancy (they want to see women before they have their babies to get a genuine picture of them before all the feel-good hormones from having a new baby kick in - or I guess the feel-bad hormones of PPD as well) and sure enough I had a call this morning offering me an appointment on Monday morning for an assessment. if I didn't know that they were keen to see me because I'll be almost 37 weeks then, I'd be extra worried that they think I am really bad and *need* a quick appt. it's not that, I think under normal circumstances it'd be a couple of weeks/a month. am also seeing this special mw in 2 weeks. and the normal mw on Monday afternoon. so many appointments. it's a really good thing my mum is still here, though she has to go home next week, on Tue, and she'll be away for 4-5 days (we're hoping to get Adam into his new room while she's gone). so I don't know what this assessment will lead to, but the idea is a plan will be put in place. guess I'll find out what if anything they can offer on Monday. I am not especially hopeful because I want what nobody can offer - someone to come and live with me and just be there and help if I need it when C isn't around. unless there is a medication that can help me cope. I don't know if going to appointments and seeing someone will help, it's possible if I have someone to mind the children, but if I have to take them, that would be an additional stress. it was bad enough trailing over to my parent-infant psychotherapy appts with Adam last year/early this year, and he was just one child and between 9 and 19 months old, not a bigger, more active toddler and a new baby.

also, the special mw checked me and baby, and she is *certain* he's head down. though he was a total monkey and she couldn't get his hb. at least, she could get the echo of it, but not the loud noise of it right at his back, because he was wriggling around so much. she tried three times, had me up and walking around in between times. I'd have been beside myself with stress if I hadn't been able to feel and see him moving so much. she mentioned he might be back to back and that's why it was harder to find. I have decided not to stress about that. if he is, he is. fingers crossed he can figure out the optimal position for exit by himself. as long as his head is down, that's fine. there is *still* this lingering doubt but I am trying to dismiss it. 

we had an ok day today. probably helped that I didn't go out other than a walk round the block with Adam in the pushchair while my mum was vacuuming (Adam likes to help and it holds things up) and so I haven't over-tired myself. Adam was also pretty well- behaved, or perhaps my tolerance levels were just a bit better than they have been. and tomorrow I am at work and C is taking Adam to see his cousins, so I have a day off (it is how it feels) and Chris gets to do the coping. (and my mum gets a dy off to go and meet a friend.)

time is ticking down so fast. I am telling myself I will go over 41 weeks - and I really think I will. Adam was 4 days over, and my due date this time is 4 days earlier than the one I calculated from temping (and we only dtd once so it's not like I might have messed up the temping, because I couldn't have got pregnant 3 or 4 days before we did it). so my due date is calculated on LMP and the 12 week scan confirmed that, but baby must just have been 4 days ahead. actually when I had the 4D scan, I saw on the screen where the EDD was calculated going on measurements, and it came up as Oct 15th, which is 4 days BEFORE my official due date. baby will, of course, come in his own time (I hope and pray anyway, no induction this time) and so any time from the 15th to the 27th is my guess. :lol: it's quite a big window. but they plan to induce at 40+12 here, which is, eeek, Halloween. really hope he is here by then!


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## spidey

Cleckner, how is the potty training going? I said to my friend that I hope after 4 days of trying it'll be obvious if Kira is ready, and she gave me a look and said "give it longer than that" :haha: She said to expect to clean pee off the floor for weeks. As for poop, her daughter did not want to poo in the potty, and she would ask for her diaper to be put back on so she could poop. Finally her mom said no, and she must poop in the potty. She wasn't happy, but finally pooped in the potty and then was okay with it after she realized it wasn't bad. I'm going to start this Wednesday :thumbup:

MJ, I understand what you mean by finding positive outlets when you're stressed. If you did self-harm, it would only make you feel worse in the end. I do understand how you feel though :hugs: Let us know how your appointment goes on Monday. Oh, and I would totally go off your predicted due date! So you're definitely going to be "over due" :haha:

My midwife appointment is Monday so fingers crossed they can help with basic fertility things when the time is right. I'm not planning to pursue any fertility treatments right now, but perhaps when I get so desperate that I can't stand it anymore :lol:. I guess my issue is that I want to trust my body to decide when the time is right. Obviously nature hasn't intended for me to have children very close together, and perhaps there is good reason for it.


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## cleckner04

Emma won't poop on the potty either. In fact I think she's ashamed when she poops because she sneaks off upstairs and poops in the hallway but today I caught her midpoo and she got the saddest most pathetic look on her face and than started crying. I told her it's okay even though you're not supposed to say that to them but I felt so bad for her. I offered her a diaper earlier because it looked like she had to poo because she snuck off to the other side of the dining room hiding behind the chairs. I told her I can get a diaper so she can poop but she yelled NO! So I think poop will be an issue for us. 

Okay, now the good stuff about the training. She now goes twice a day on her own. After sleep times. She now knows that as soon as she wakes up she needs to pee on the potty. So she pees in the morning, than she holds it ALL day until after her nap. That has been consistent each day. But now after the nap she sits right on the potty and pees too. So we have the mornings and early afternoons trained when it comes to pee. She also has consistently not peed overnight but I already knew that part. So now we just have to get her to focus on the potty more in the evenings and poops. No clue how to get past the poop embarrassment for her. And I get lazy in the evenings too because I'm always tired and just want to be lazy at night so I'm not as quick about getting her on the potty. :dohh: But we are only on day 5 I think so I think we are doing pretty good. I stopped writing it all down every day. I probably should keep at the little journal I started. I just don't think about it at the time and than I forget by the end of the day when she went.


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## spidey

my friends little girl was the same way as Emma about poop. She would retreat under the dining room table to poop, and if her mom came close she would yell "NO MAMA GO AWAY!" I'm not sure how to get past the poop embarrassment part. My friend basically cornered her daughter in the bathroom and forced her to poop on the potty- yes, it sounds mean and she felt REALLY bad for doing it but there was no other way. I know she tried encouragement and bribery, but her little girl refused to poop in the potty. When I was a kid I remember my mom reading us a book about pee and poop in the potty (she must have been gearing my brother up for potty training at the time), so a potty training book from the library might plant some positive seeds in Emma's head regarding poop. Whenever I poo (TMI!) Kira is always there and I clap and cheer and we say goodbye to mommy's poo poo. When Kira poops, I will dump it in the toilet and we wave bye bye, and sometimes I'll put it in the potty chair and let her dump it in the toilet. Kira has no qualms about poop though- she poops in the bathtub and then orders me to scoop it out :rofl: :dohh:

It sounds like Emma was ready to start potty training! She's doing a wonderful job with peeing in the potty and I can only hope Kira does that well! I can't believe she holds her pee for that long in the morning. Maybe once she gets used to it, she'll go pee mid morning too. Do you have her in underwear, or is she bare bottomed?


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## cleckner04

We wave bye bye to the pee but I guess I could have her look at my poo and wave to it. :rofl: I'm leaving Emma completely naked all day. Although today I put her in a dress and let her play outside without bottoms and she peed on the patio :dohh: Which is better than the carpet I guess. But I really wish she'd learn to come in and pee on the potty. The evenings are not progressing so far. I really am trying not to beat myself about all of this. Because I want her to do it in her own time. But I do get really frustrated when she has accidents. 




Completely different topic but for halloween this year Emma is going to be pebbles from the flintstones, I'm going to be wilma, and DH is going to be fred. Well I asked my mom if she had patterns still because I remember as a kid I was wilma for my twirling competitions(Yes, I twirled baton for like 10 years.:blush:) Anyways, she couldn't find patterns but she did go out and buy fleece and ended up making the fred costume and the top for pebbles. She didn't know how to make the bloomers for pebbles though so I found a woman on etsy that was willing to make it. Mom left the length really long on each but tonight I finally cut them shorter and did the ragged edging on the bottom. So I now have the finished pebbles costume and finished fred costume. For mine, I have a white dress that I really don't wear very often so I've decided to modify it into a wilma dress. But I wanted to show you guys the finished ones. In the picture that Emma is pissed off, it's because she peed herself. :dohh::rofl: In the brand new bloomers that just arrived yesterday. :roll::haha:


Edit to add: Notice she used seashells for the buttons!! Which is an awesome idea but I might change them to plain black buttons because the seashells keep coming out of the hole when Emma moves around. :dohh:


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## cleckner04

After just saying she won't poop on the potty, she just stood a few inches in front of the potty and I could see her straining so I hurried and put the potty more under her although she wouldn't sit down. I'm not sure she knows how to poop while sitting cause she is always standing to poop. :haha: But anyways, I caught it in the potty!!! :dance: :haha: A small victory because she's had like 4 accidents on the floor today but that's 2 pees a 1 poop we managed to catch on the potty today. Although the poop was more me instead of her sitting. But I will take it! :haha:


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## Shiv

Cleck - you and emma are doing SO well with the potty training - you make it sound easy!
That costume is really cute.........I think it's fun that you make such a big thing of halloween over there, I was never even allowed to go trick or treating when I was a kid.

Spidey - good luck with the potty training next week! 

I really like your hair as well, dramatic but not scary! 

how did the Appt with the midwife go?

MJ - how you doing? SO you must hit full term at some point this week right? Then it's all systems go!

As for me, well I was getting pretty fed up, yesterday I managed to persuade myself I was in labour, but I wasn't! SO today i woke up with a differernt attitude of well baby will come when they want. I decided to make an effort for once and put some make-up on (not that I was going anywhere in particular!) and took some photos of me with a due date bump. I've attached them below although you've prob seen them on fb already. And i did feel better today. I went to the docs for my 40 week appt, everything normal. Babyhead down but not engaged, migh tbe back to back she wasn't sure, but as long as head is down I am happy :thumbup:

I have been losing plug all day. And miraculously I lost more weight this last week (and I have been eating SO much bad food!) so I am 11st 11lbs (although I have poo'd so much today (TMI!) that I bet I've lost another 1lb at least! So at 40 weeks I have put on 30lbs which I am very happy with!
 



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## spidey

very nice bump Shiv. The picture with you, Sophia and bump is very cute  I guess with all the impending baby talk and knowing I had to see the midwife today, I had a dream last night that you had your baby! I was at your house and you decided to push the baby out on the bed and your birthing pool was in the bedroom. I don't know if it was a girl or boy though. It wasn't a long dream- so don't get too creeped out that I dreamed of you :haha:

My midwife appointment went okay. She said she can't do any fertility stuff, but they can refer me to a specialist AFTER Kira is fully weaned. I asked about getting a blood test to check my progesterone levels when/if I get pregnant, and she said they can do that around 5-6 weeks if I want, but they don't normally offer that to people. She also said that when I see my LH spike, it means I've just ovulated. That doesn't seem right from what I've been reading, but oh well- it really doesn't matter. She didn't comment on my vagina, so I'm assuming its not as messed up as I thought :haha: She was brutal with the pap smear though- my poor cervix! I'm not planning to force Kira to wean, but I might start pushing the issue when she turns 3. So who knows what'll happen over the next year. I need to plan on NOT being pregnant though.

Shiv, tomorrow you'll be in the overdue club, and as a member myself (+10 days) it's a good idea to enjoy every extra day you get. Don't forget to nap too to save up your energy. And don't be a total pig like me and eat an entire cake every day or you might end up with a 10 pounder! I was testing out new recipes and DH doesn't like sweets. Can't let them go to waste, right? :haha: The constant pooing sounds promising though- your body is getting things ready :thumbup:


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## Shiv

I forgot to say earlier that Sophia has almost mastered the alphabet :haha: Not as in the song but as in recognising the letters. We have an alphabet snake puzzle 

https://www.elc.co.uk/Alphabet-Adder/123335,default,pd.html

and I can ask her where is the letter a - and she'll find it and the same for all the letters apart from a couple (L seems to be an issue for some reason).....I was amazed. So now if we show her a word we can say what letters can you see, and for example if it is her name she will say

S- for Sophia
o- for orange
p - for penguin
h- for hello
i -for igloo (where pingu lives :haha:)
a - for apple

how cool is that!


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## spidey

very impressive Sophia!!! She's a little smarty pants :thumbup:

I forgot to talk about Halloween in my last post! Cleckner, your costume idea is so neat and Emma makes a perfect Pebbles! Kira is going to be a puppy this year. I'm going to take her trick or treating too :happydance: My street is a dead end off of a highway so I'll have to drive her to a neighborhood near my parents where the houses are closer together and there is a sidewalk. She might have the energy to walk to 3 houses :haha: Shiv, that's a shame you never got to celebrate Halloween! If you ever visit the states, plan a trip at the end of October so you can join in too.


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## Mary Jo

heh, Spidey, speaking of dreams, I dreamed about you last night! we were talking about going overdue, but I don't remember any real details, in fact I forgot all about it till you said you dreamed about Shiv. :haha:

glad your midwife appt went ok, maybe that's the best strategy, expect not to get pregnant and then when you do you'll be so happy and surprised. did the mw indicate that she thought you wouldn't before Kira is weaned? sorry about the awful pap smear, I hate getting those done (and actually cried at one once, the doc - a man - was vicious). I actually had a letter come in the other day saying I was overdue mine, and I guess I am but only because I am pregnant. my last one was Dec 2007, and the letter I had then said next one was due in 3 years. so of course NOW it's coming up to a year overdue, but it was only 1 month overdue when I got pregnant again, and they don't do them in pregnancy here as far as I know. not exactly looking forward to that. but I won't skip it because I had cell changes evident after my 1st test (which was very late, I was 29 I think) and had to have a LEEP done (where they cut out a chunk of cervix). ever since I've been clear, but I don't take that for granted.

Shiv, love the pics, you look gorgeous. 30lb is a brilliant weight gain, right on target, yay! good idea to get dressed up nice and not to stress any further. you're right, baby will come in their own time. was the 26th the due date you first calculated yourself or one from a scan? because I am going from my ovulation date not my dating scan date. just because it is later so I don't get stressed when the 19th comes and goes, as I am certain it will. I don't actually mind going later this time, probably because I am not posting in a due date/month thread. I *was*, but I decided not to any more, because I didn't click with anyone else in it, and so there didn't seem any point. and to get all "wah-wah" about it, I didn't think anyone would notice if I dropped out. and I am glad I did because now I'd be feeling stressed to be the last one to have the baby (it was a due date thread) whereas posting in here, and on FB, there isn't anyone so close. well, Samstar is, but she doesn't count as she's having a c-section anyway so she *will* go early. the main reason I don't want to go over too much is because I don't want to be induced. 

cleck, Emma looks super cute as Pebbles :D and hooray for pooing on the potty :happydance: Adam escaped from me while I was changing his nappy today and he ran outside and wee'd on the patio. he then stood in the wee, well, danced is more the word, and shouted "uh-oh!" and examined his winkle. so I think he totally knew what he was doing. then a little later, I decided to go get the potty and put it outside, and he didn't want me to go and tried to drag me outside, well I went up and got the potty anyway, and he sat on it, at least his bum brushed the edge of it and left a smear of poo. so I thought, aye aye he needs to poo, and encouraged him to sit, but he stood up and ran to his playhouse where there was a poo on the ground inside. he'd done it before I got the potty and I think that was why he wanted me to come outside, to show me. :lol: I am dreading proper potty training because the thought of all that on my floors in the house makes me sick, just wish we had a few more months of summer so he could run around in the garden without his nappy.

he likes going into the bathroom and pressing the flush, and I tell him that's where the wees and poos go, but I don't know if he understands. he's getting there, I can see each day he's twigging more and more stuff.

so, as for me - I am ok, full term on Wednesday. had two appointments today, one with the midwife, who said baby is in exactly the same position as yours, Shiv, head down, not engaged, might be back to back but not 100% sure! she thought initially he was definitely back to back going on the dip when I lie on my back, but as I am not getting backache, and because the student who was with her had a feel and asked what the hard thing was running down my left side was and she thought ok, that's his back, he's lying sideways, so not entirely back to back. I also don't care, back to back won't stop me going to the birth centre, and there is loads of time for him to get into the right position, just as long as he is head down. I'm just so relieved about that. I mentioned about Adam not engaging till I was well on in labour with him, and she said she thought it would happen again, so I *have* to call and go in if my waters start leaking, as they did with Adam. which I didn't want to, unless a lot went, because I am scared they'll induce if nothing happens. this is what is worrying me now. but fingers crossed it'll all be different this time. I won't be allowed to go to the birth centre if my waters break and I am not in labour after I think it is 18 hours. 

the other appointment was for this psychiatric evaluation. it went on forever, I was there almost 2 hours, and the upshot is she clearly thinks I am depressed and has prescribed antidepressants, and she thinks I'd benefit from proper psychotherapy in the future, and she's looking into what the community mental health people will be able to offer. however. I have decided not to take the antidepressants for now. I looked them up - sertraline (Zoloft) - and found a load of stuff about the risks of taking it in 3rd tri, and all these potential problems. so I'm going to get the prescription, and even might get it filled, but won't take anything quite yet. apparently it's really safe in breastfeeding as very little gets through, but I need to look further into that. I read something about how if you take it in pregnancy and don't plan to bf, you should taper off by 36 weeks or the baby will have withdrawals; if you do plan to bf the baby will be ok as it will get a very small amount from the breastmilk. thing is, I didn't bf Adam exclusively, much as I'd have liked to, and it worries me that if I am in the same situation of having to supplement because of lowish supply, the new baby mightn't get enough breastmilk to counteract withdrawals. so along with the stuff I read about breathing problems and tube feeding, not to mention irritability and restlessness, I just don't want to do it. I'm going to have help for the next few weeks, since though my mum is going back north tomorrow, C is taking Wed, Thur and Fri off work, and my mum is coming back next Mon, so I'm just going to have to cope.

I know the chances of problems are probably very very low but I just don't feel right. I'll see how I am after having the baby. also, I wasn't planning to tell Chris about the antidepressants, but this was when I thought I'd feel 100% ok with the safety aspect (going on what the psychiatrist said and before I did some research myself). if I don't, I don't see how I can not tell him (if I was planning to take them anyway). he wouldn't understand. he'd think I was taking them to get some sort of high, or worry that they were addictive, and even if he was fine, it would only take 2 mins with Dr Google for him to be freaking out. so I'll just deal with it for now. if I have to take them once baby is here and I am maybe breastfeeding, I feel ok with that. situation might be diffeent if I had a long long way to go in the pregnancy, but with 3-5 weeks max, it's not a long time and I'd feel absolutely awful if baby was affected and I couldn't get my act together for such a short time. if I was competely non-functional, again it would be different, but with help I am getting what I need to get done, at least Adam is well cared for. and it does help that I generally have the bar set very low when it comes to housework, so I don't feel like I am slacking off too much when I do practically nothing.

feel like I am getting a cold or sore throat tonight. really want to have a Lemsip but don't think it's allowed... and I don't think we have any paracetamol left. grrrrr!


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## ckc

Hello Girls! 
So many messages to catch up with!!!!

I am having a rough week, and it is only Tuesday!!!! I am only gonna share the good news! 
My ultrasound went well!! I was so nervous at the beginning I couldn't see anything, it was scary, but then there it was! with fingers, toes, 175 bpm and measuring almost a week older! I was so relieve and happy! it made things more real. Although I get scared some times cause I don't have a bump yet and my sister has the same time as me and she is getting big by the day. But anyways I feel nauseous enough to reassure me!

Cleckner : About the babysitting thing, I wanted to say that you need to think about it really careful before making a decision. My sister was taking care of one little girl ( her friend's girl) for half day and she was charging 300 a week. Having another child to care for and in the house put a lot of stress in my sister's relationship with her daughter, who soon became aggressive and started acting out, whereas before she never had that problem. The other little girl was constantly with colds which means my sister's toddler was constantly infected. The other little had a fever once and they took her to the doctor ( her own parents) she was also having a greenish vaginal discharge ( she was two years old) the Doctor said that they had to explore the probability that she had been molested or abused!! as my sister's place was the only place she went to, her mom had to ask my sister about it. My sister's husband works for the government so they started freaking out with the possibility of being investigated, even if they are not guilty, being involved in such a thing remains in your reccord and carry consequences. Of course like everything in the US , the system and doctors always try to scare people and make them fearful ( that is my personal point of view and please don't take offense to it ) at last the little girl tested positive for a bacterial infection caused by stools on her vagina. But my sister still blames her M/C to all the stress that taking care of her caused. After that my sister realized how liable she could be and how even if she needed the money she thought it wasn't worth it. Also my sister's friend, so the mom of the little girl had another baby and was literally begging my sister for her to take her daughter back and also the new baby. Needless to say that she wont longer consider it. Cleckner all I am saying is that if you are gonna be ding something like that, at least the money has to be pretty damn good, and 175 for two children, the whole day, doesn't make much sense to me. Your home is better than any day care so you can't compare prices that way. You will be engaging emotionally, you will be teaching them, educating them, offering all Emma's stuff and not to mention that Emma wont get all you attention, not even close, and she will suffer. I am not trying to discourage you, I only wanted to share this with you because this is not a commitment that can be taken lightly, I was actually at my sister's when she started it and it is no what she said " oh I am already taking care of one and they are friends so this wont be much work" it as nothing like it! and that was only half day. Anyways just think about all the possibilities and liabilities. Good luck!!

Keep it up with potty training!!!!! good job!!! 

hugs to all of you, I will try to catch up soon, I am back to school so I don't have as much time.


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## spidey

ckc, I'm so glad everything went well at your scan :happydance: I hope the m/s lets up soon. Don't worry about a bump- the baby is super tiny right now, so any bump would just be weight gain and not baby. 

MJ, I hope you're feeling better today. Being sick and not being able to take medicine is awful and I HATE breathing through my mouth at night. With them not knowing the exact risks of taking an SSRI in the third trimester, I would try to hold off on taking Zoloft until the baby is here, but if you really needed it now you shouldn't feel guilty for taking it, because it's also not good for the baby if you're completely stressed out and feeling really low. I'm glad the appointment was long and they took you seriously. If it were me, I would feel better just having the filled prescription nearby just incase suddenly things got worse. :hugs: 

The midwife seemed to think I won't get pregnant until Kira is completely weaned. But there is no way of knowing for sure. For the first time, I've thought about the Thanksgiving and Christmas holidays without stressing about "what if I'm pregnant". So that's a start :thumbup:

Shiv, you were quiet on FB today (it's not like I'm stalking you or something :haha:) so how are you feeling??? I'm assuming you took a little break from all the pregnancy talk, but I like to think you're in labor :lol:


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## ckc

Hi Spidey, 

How much are you nursing now? I have a hard time believing that nursing is the main reason why you aren't pregnant. I am still nursing too. I find at this age she doesn't nurse very much. What did the midwife explain to you?


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## cleckner04

I think some women just can't get pregnant while nursing. No matter how often the child nurses. Emma still BFs quite frequently here. So I'm certain it has something to do with my messed up cycles too. Although spidey, your cycles seem to be correcting themselves so I have a feeling you WILL be pregnant in the near future. :D 

I had a rough evening. Too many pregnancy announcements on here and facebook and I just can't take it anymore. People that don't even try, people that try a month and it just happens that easy. It's driving me crazy. It just seems like some people get things so easily. I hate being jealous like this. I really do. It eats away at me. :( I should be happy with everything I have. A husband that loves me and treats me right and a daughter that I seriously can't imagine my life without. But than I think of the negative things. Like the fact that I've only seen my husband 4 months in the past year. And the whole baby issue where I want it so bad sometimes. But obviously it's not easy with a husband who is only here 4 months of the year. :wacko: Okay, enough feeling sorry for myself. I'm glad I got it out. 



On a happy note. I think Emma may have cracked it! She only had one small accident today. The rest of the day she went over to the potty whenever she had to go. At one point while we were upstairs she even searched it out saying 'wheres potty' and than she found it and sat down quickly and said 'bye bye pee pee!' before peeing on it. :lol: We even caught a poo on it today. Although it was her standing a foot from it squeezing and I hurried and put the potty under her and managed to catch it. :haha: I think that will be a bit harder to learn still. But it's a step up from her running upstairs and hiding to do it. I just looked at my 'potty journal' and she started last wednesday the 21st. So today is the week milestone. I am seriously keeping my fingers crossed that it just gets better from here. Although I know I am probably just jinxing myself after I've went on about it and tomorrow she will probably pee on the floor a million times to make up for my bragging. :haha:


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## spidey

Kira ALWAYS nurses in the morning when she wakes up (if I'm not at work), at 2pm for nap time, 4pm when she wakes up, and at 9pm before she goes to bed. Many days she'll nurse 10 additional times, but only for 1-2 minutes or so.

From what I've read, even once a day nursing can prevent some women from getting pregnant. I know my mom got pregnant with my brother when I was still nursing 1-2 times a day, so that's promising for me. The midwife said since I already got pregnant once, she thinks it's the bf and not something else. But they won't look into a secondary infertility cause until I wean her completely.

YAY for Emma!!!! Potty training starts this afternoon for Kira! I hope she gets it as fast as Emma. I took my rug up last night to prepare :haha:

Shiv is in labor now, so send her some fast labor vibes :thumbup:


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## spidey

Potty day #1. Didn't start till 5pm since Kira was in defiant 2 year old mode earlier in the day :haha: But we decided to have her naked. She went from 5pm until 8pm and then made 2-3 dribbles in the floor. She was sort of grabbing herself so DH moved her to the potty and she peed!!!! :happydance: Then she took her bath and almost pooped in the bathtub, but we got her in time and the poop dropped off in the potty :thumbup: I don't count that as a success though, but we made a huge deal out of it. Then after her bath she squatted on the floor and made a few dribbles. I think she was testing things out.

DH has her all day tomorrow as I work, so he's going to be all alone in potty training her, and then I have her Friday, Sat and Sunday. I'm exhausted and it was only a partial day. Cleckner, when Emma pees on the floor, what do you say? 

Shiv....... do you realize I reloaded FB a thousand times today!?? I can't wait to hear your birth story. I was having overwhelming emotional moments today thinking about you. It makes me want to have another baby so bad!! :haha:


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## cleckner04

Shiv had the baby?! Boy or girl?!!! 


No accidents at all today. She even backed up to the potty to poop. She got one turd in and one hit the edge and fell onto the floor but I still count it as a success because she really tried. :rofl: I don't even have to ask her much anymore if she has to pee because she automatically goes over to the potty on her own. I am going to buy a second potty to put upstairs though because I'm sick of hauling it up and down a few times a day. 

When Emma has accidents on the floor I don't tell her it's okay. I tell her we don't pee on the floor, we pee on the potty. Than I get the carpet cleaning stuff and spray the floor and hand her a rag and she cleans it up. With me doing the real cleaning after her effort of course. :lol: I'm doing what it said for the fellom method that ckc recommended. She's naked all day and everything. The only thing I haven't been brave enough to try is taking her out of the house with loose clothes on like it says. Actually the method says to take them out the second day of training but there was no way because Emma was still having accidents like crazy than! So I think we will see if she has any accidents in the next few days and than I'll try to work up the courage to take her to the park for half an hour or more behind my house. 

I'm so worried our trip across country and new living situation will wipe all of this away though. :( I really hope this doesn't all hurt her too much.


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## Shiv

Cleck - congrats on the potty training - that is amazing!

Well Cora was born yesterday at 4.38pm weighing 9lb 1oz (eek) at home in the pool - all went to plan (not that I had a plan!). I'll do a proper update when I have a bit more energy (say 2 years time :haha:)


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## ckc

Shiv!!! OMG OMG OMG OMG:yipee::yipee: congratulations!!!!!!!!!!!:hugs:
I can't wait to know all the details!!!!!!! I am so excited and happy for you! rest well and i hope you get all the love and care that a good mama like you deserve.


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## ckc

Cleckner: congratulations!!! way to go!! it sounds pretty similar as the way it went with Narain. I did what the method said and took her out ( with a potty, actually I carry the potty everywhere still) and she didn't wear undies or diapers ( except for nap or sleeping) ever again. It is important for you to know that most children regress. Narain was extremely good and virtually accident free for nearly a month, then all of the sudden she started peeing all over the place, just like a pissed off cat hehehe, I noticed she did it mostly to be defiant. When that happened I was serious and said that I was disappointed because she knew very well how to use the potty, and then I said: "so you peed again Narain, oh well, now you have to have a quick shower... ( in the shower) oh but we don't have time for the water to warm up so we gotta use cold water" ( is that super mean?) and of course she didn't like it. After three of those she never did it again. 

Spidey: It sounds like your potty training is going well! keep it up!! Also my husband helped half day every day for the three days of the method. It was really helpful. 

Cleckner, I can relate to your feelings of frustration when everyone seems to get pregnant around you. And of course you have every right to be upset and vent about it, that doesn't mean you are not super grateful for what you have, it only speaks of how given and dedicated you are to your family and your desire to make a bigger family. Just hang in there and be patient, it is going to happen, it is hard to be patient but your situation is different because having your husband away so much makes things so much harder! I hope you guys can find a way around it somehow.

Spidey, Same to you, If your problem if short lutheal phase, that is relatively easy to fix. I can't believe that a whole year and two MC went by before i was able to get pregnant again. Now it seems like all the wait was worth it and it was a HUGE lesson on patience and strength, I was crushed every time i got my period but then the next day I was able to be even more grateful for my amazing daughter and start planing for the next cycle again. I even got better at dealing with MC, not a nice thing to be good at but It is hard to remain negative and grieve when you have a toddler making you laugh all the time. I can't imagine going through this without her...
I am sure it is going to happen for both of you . I just know it and probably even sooner than what you think :)


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## spidey

Shiv, I can't wait to hear your birth story and to hear what Sophia thinks of her sister! It's incredibly empowering to have a baby naturally, but even more so when it's a big one. It makes you feel like super woman :haha: 

Huge congrats to Emma for pooping on the potty!!! :happydance:

I've been leaving Kira naked too, but when we go outside she wears pants to protect her from the mosquitoes. We took a short car trip yesterday with no diaper on and I put a towel on the carseat. Luckily she didn't pee! I'll probably leave her naked for awhile and then transition to underwear and pants, since it'll get cold here in a month. DH has her today (I'm at work now) so I can't wait to get home and hear how she did!

ckc, thanks for your words of support on TTC. It certainly is teaching me patience, and even though I have moments where I'm fed up, I know that in the end I'll be glad everything worked out the way it was meant to happen.


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## cleckner04

Shiv- YAYAYAYAYAY!!!!!! :dance: She's beautiful!!! And I was SO wrong about her being a he. :haha: I'm so happy you got the birth you wanted. Get some rest now. :hugs::hugs::D

ckc- Yeah I have a feeling she'll regress too. Especially when we move in November and start living in an entirely new place with all new people. I think that will be rough on her. I don't think making her have a cold shower is mean at all! I made Emma scrub my floor through her tears a few times in the past week. :/ I think that's what made it click with her because she didn't like having to scrub but I told her I'm not cleaning up the pee because she's the one that did it so she has to clean her own mess. (Even though I scrubbed after she did:lol:) I plan on buying a smaller potty to take out with us. And I expect that there will be accidents still. In fact, she peed the bed last night after no accidents for nearly 2 days. :dohh: I'll probably start packing 2-3 changes of clothes now. :lol: 

spidey- I hope your DH does good with her today!! I'm wondering how Emma will do once Corey is back in 2 weeks. I hope she doesn't regress from that. We will have to figure out how to get Emma wearing clothes too once we go back to Ohio/Indiana. I'm starting to get really nervous about the cold weather. It's been so long since I lived there. I've already bought myself a new winter peacoat with matching scarf/gloves and Emma a snowbib/coat/gloves/hat set. :haha:


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## spidey

so far it's been a peeing everywhere day :dohh: She peed several times on the floor with DH. His back was always turned as she peed and he would hear "eeeeewwwww" and find her pointing to a puddle of pee. She peed on me during a booby, and she peed on the sofa as she watched tv. Just one time she went in the potty, so I suppose it wasn't a complete failure. She doesn't want to sit on the potty, so we stick her on there and she whines and gets right back up. I feel like quitting, but I'm going to suck it up and give it a week. Cleckner, we started acting disappointed when she pees on the floor, so I hope that helps. The first few times that she peed on the floor we just cleaned it up and didn't say anything. I'm also making her clean it up now too. 

Cleckner, since you grew up with cold winters, I bet it won't take long to adjust. I like winters- its a nice break from the heat. There's something nice about being warm and snugly under a blanket as it snows outside. :thumbup:


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## ckc

Spidey: it is great that you are determent to carry on with potty training. The first three days are the hardest because: this method says that once they get 10 to 12 pees or poos in the potty they are good to go. And that is exactly how it happened for us. That is why my husband and i took turns watching her for 2 and a half days, because we needed to identify cues and what she does before she pees, once we learned how to read that behavior we were able to anticipate and sit her in the potty at a time when she had no other choice but peeing. For example: Narain ( was naked all the time) would always look for cloth like surfaces to pee ( couch, bed, carpet, anything that had fabric because of the similar feeling of the diapers) we provided her with salty snacks and tons of water down juice so we had plenty of opportunity to practice and get at least 10 successful potty experiences. After we figured out the fabric thing ( that was day one, I think day one we only got like three pees in the potty ) the second half of the second day she started doing the pee pee dance and she cried before she had to poop because she didnt want to do it in the potty. every time she had a pee or poop in the potty i wore this huge skirt and dance can-can for her, and she would follow me around dancing happy! funny thing was when my husband had to do the same lol. The third day we took her out and she peed on my husband, we acted disappointed and said the same that cleckner said, by that time she was already completing the phrase "pee goes in the potty" , and after ten times, she would consistently do the pee pee dance as a way of letting us know that she wanted to go, and no son long thereafter she started verbalizing that she wanted to go. 
It is a bit exhausting to have 4 eyes or Kira 24/24, but keep in mind you only need 10 to 12 potty times and you will be good! that would take around 2 and half to 3 days because they learn to hold their pee. Best luck to you! 

Cleckner: are you moving permanently to Ohio?


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## cleckner04

ckc- I'm not certain about our move being permanent. I'll be living with the inlaws in Indiana. Right over the ohio line only 2 miles from my parents in ohio. DH should be getting out of the navy in June 2012(we are still waiting to see if he has to get out for sure and won't know until Nov/Dec this year). When/if he get's out he plans on going to school in Ohio so we will probably move there for a few years. Than wherever he finds a job out of school I guess will be our next destination. It's all very uncertain and scary right now. My inlaws say they are happy to have us as long as we need so I am very grateful for that. But I really can't wait to be settled and in our own place again. I'm hoping it doesn't take too long to accomplish that. This was why I'm looking to babysit because I don't want to leave Emma but at the same time, I need to start bringing in some income to help out. I never went to college and I haven't had a real job since high school over 7 years ago so I think my chances of finding a decent job are slim. I've had random babysitting jobs over the course of our marriage and was a camp counselor one summer for girl scouts. :haha: But nothing substantial IYKWIM. 


spidey- Just stick with it hun. I'd say if she isn't improving at all in a weeks time than she might not be ready yet. Although Emma's worst day ever was on day 6. She was peeing left and right on the floor that day. It's mostly my fault because I was running only less than 4 hours of sleep though because roofers came to work on our house at 7 in the morning and I hadn't fallen asleep the previous night until 3:30ish. :dohh: 

Here I'll post my little journal from our time doing it. I skipped a few days writing it all down and haven't added to it since yesterday. 

Day 1 of Potty Training- Wednesday September 21, 2011

*Woke up and I put Emma on the potty. She sat for approximately 30 minutes before standing up. As she stood there she started to pee. I grabbed the potty and put it under her, catching most of the pee in the potty. I praised her, she gave me a proud grin, we took the pee into the bathroom and said bye bye to it after flushing it down the toilet. 

*Emma sat on the potty throughout the day but held it in. She napped around 5 pm. She woke at 6 pm, we started eating a snack and I told her to pee pee on the potty if she has to go. 5 minutes into eating the snack, she quickly backed up and sat on the potty and did an entire pee by herself! I praised her like crazy, she again smiled proudly and we waved bye bye to it in the big toilet. 

*Emma peed while standing on the dining room chair in the dining room. I noticed the flow starting so I grabbed her and ran her to the potty. We caught the last bits of it. I still praised her and we said bye bye to it. 

*Emma sat on the potty while eating oranges for an evening snack. My back was turned and she got off the potty and peed right beside it before I noticed. =(

*Around 9 pm, I went to the kitchen to put a plate away. When I came back into the living room I noticed Emma squatting on the blanket. I immediately grabbed her and put her on the potty. I caught most of it, very little was actually on the blanket. I have to keep reminding myself this is only the first day. But I'm already getting frustrated.


Total for the day: 1 full pee on the potty by herself - 3 pees half on the potty after she started to go on the floor - 1 pee completely on the floor. No poop. 


Day 2 of Potty Training- Thursday September 22, 2011

*Sat on the potty on and off all morning until she peed on the potty fully without any accident on the floor at 10:50 a.m.. I did a dance and praised her than we said bye bye. Emma is very excited about saying bye bye to the pee pee. She immediately says 'bye bye pee pee' as soon as she is done peeing and she enjoys it when I flush it down the big toilet. 

*Emma snuck upstairs at 2:30 pm and in the time it took me to rush and grab the potty and chase her up the stairs, she pooped in the hallway. I cleaned her up and minutes later asked her to sit on the potty. She said no. Than she started peeing a minute later. She managed to stop herself mid flow when I yelled stop and I got the potty under her in time to catch the last half. At this point, I'm not certain she is 'getting it'. Again, I'm getting frustrated. 

*After nap Emma refused to pee on the potty. Finally ended up peeing right beside it and I managed to catch a small bit at the end. I'm not happy but still trying to stick to my guns.

*While on the phone with my parents, I wasn't watching her well enough. She pee'd outright on the floor without making any into the potty. The potty was right in front of her so again I'm not happy. Each time she has accidents on the floor, I have her clean it up. With me doing the final scrubbing of course. 


Total for the day: 1 full pee on the potty by herself - 2 pee half on the potty after she started to go on the floor - 1 poop on the floor - 1 pee completely on the floor 


Emma pee'd overnight.

Day 3 of Potty Training- Friday September 23, 2011

*Woke up and sat on the potty but stood up, peed on floor and I caught the end half. I told her we need to pee on the potty like a big girl. I'm not sure she understands or has the capability to hold it long enough to get to the potty yet. 

*Peed on her potty after the nap without any accident on the floor. I'm very pleased that she is maintaining at least one full pee on the potty each day. I hope this will eventually increase to more but I can't complain, it's only the 3rd day.


Day 7 of Potty Training- Tuesday September 27, 2011

*Woke up and refused to sit on the potty. She wanted to watch spongebob and I told her to sit on the potty first and than I would put spongebob on. She ended up peeing on the floor. I scolded her and told her no spongebob since she didn't pee on the potty. She immediately started crying and finally sat on the potty. I assumed it was too late and her sitting there was for nothing but suddenly she stopped crying and I heard pee coming out. I cheered and told her how good she did and I put spongebob on! She was very pleased with herself and the crying stopped immediately. I feel like I'm too harsh but maybe it's what she needs for this to work. 

*She searched for the potty while we were upstairs. Saying 'wheres potty?' until she found it in her room where I normally put it. She immediately sat down and said 'bye bye pee pee' and peed on the potty all by herself without any interference from me. I couldn't be prouder if I tried. 

*She peed on the potty 5 times total today all by herself. We also caught one poop on the potty when she stood a foot from it, I saw her start to go so I hurried and put the potty under her. She pooped while standing but the fact that she didn't hide to poop is an improvement! 

I'm amazed at how well this day went. I hope she can stick to it. The next thing we will tackle is going out in public without diapers! We haven't left the house in the entire last week while training so I will probably give it one more week for her to get a good routine of going on her own and than I will add to her learning. 


Total for the Day: 5 full pees on potty by herself, 1 pee accident on the floor, 1 poop on the potty with me catching mid-poo. 


Day 8 of Potty Training- Wednesday September 28, 2011

*Woke up and immediately peed on potty. Good start to the day!

*Has peed 3 separate times this morning. Naptime is in an hour so she no longer holds it all morning. I think this is a good sign! 

*Tried to poop on the potty all by herself. Half of it made it in the potty, the other half on the floor. I am VERY proud. She stands to poop so I think the next step is teaching her that she can poop while sitting. =) 

*Continuously peed on the potty all evening without my help!


Total for the Day: No accidents unless you count the half poo that ended up on the floor!


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## cleckner04

Oh yeah, also wanted to say I watched wuthering heights tonight. The pbs version. I've never seen it before OR read the book but OMG I cried like a freaking baby. I was sobbing like crazy. Emma stood there looking at me like I had two heads. :rofl: Than she went and searched for Minnie and handed her to me. Which is what I do when Emma is upset because minnie always helps her calm down. :rofl: She also climbed into my lap with her discarded dress and started wiping my face clean. Such a sweet girl. :cloud9: And such a horribly sad movie. I have the novel on my kindle I just haven't had a chance to read it yet. I'm thinking I will read it soon now.


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## spidey

Cleckner, great note taking! It seems like Kira pees a lot more frequently, or she's just testing out her plumbing and peeing as often as she can. I don't even remember how many pees she's had, but since my last post she had 2 pees in the potty! I pulled out the big guns and said if she peed in the potty she would get 1 M&M and if she pooped she would get 2! Suddenly, the potty was a fun place to sit and she did 2 pees over the course of 3 hours and 1 half pee on the rug. ckc, it's so funny you mentioned Narain looking for cloth surfaces to pee, because Kira has peed on rugs today! I took up the large livingroom rug and I thought I was safe, but I forgot about the small rug I keep at the kitchen sink, and the small one in front of Kira's pretend kitchen. :haha:

TMI, but me and DH just :sex: as this will be our last chance until Monday. I'm getting almost positives on my opks this week, but no true positives yet and no basal body temp changes. Today is cd20.


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## cleckner04

Well now that Emma uses the potty on her own, she pees way more frequently. I think she was being stubborn and holding it a lot in the first few days. :haha: 

Yay for progress!!! :dance: I'm so excited for you. Hopefully she just keeps on improving!! :thumbup:


Jealous of your sex. :lol: My vibrator is getting a lot of action lately though. :rofl:


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## spidey

Cleckner, do you and Emma roll around and hang out in the bed once you wake up in the morning? How do you handle peeing in the morning. Kira is dry when she wakes up, but after an hour of rolling around in the bed as I try to catch a few more zzz's, she pees in her diaper a few times. I really love my extra sleep :haha:

Day 3 of potty training and I am such a proud mommy today! Besides the morning diaper pees (which she didn't seem phased about), we've had 3 pees on the potty and it's only 11am. 1 full pee, 1 half pee in potty (half in her pants), and 1 full pee! I must look like a crazy woman because we spent an hour outside and I followed Kira around with a potty chair :haha: She did her half pee while outside next to the sand box :thumbup: So she's had 3 M&M's today and I do the potty dance everytime she goes. Cleckner- you've probably seen the diaper commercial with the "potty dance" :haha:


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## jelr

shiv: Huge Huge Congrats again :happydance: - Cora is so beautiful and a beautiful name. I am so so happy that you got the birth you wanted and that it all went well and there were no complications. It really sounded so nice to start your new family all in your own home :) - Yay for Sophia knowing all her letters, she really is so clever. Natasha knows a couple, but not many at all. Sophia could nearly go to playschool now and be ahead of the other kids :thumbup:

MJ: Sock puppets went well, Natasha enjoyed it, although they didn't look the best ha ha, because I'm not artistic at all :dohh: - but sure once she enjoyed it, is all that counts. I wish I could take the credit for being off the cigs totally for myself. I think I'm terrified of the stress that I may have caused when stopping when I was pregnant each time or that I would have been smoking before I found out I was pregnant and that maybe it had something to do with the mc - so I just wanted to have it done before we even ttc and also I think I felt it was best to stop before becoming pregnant as it needs to be a forever things this time, With one child it is easy to go outside and peer in through the frech doors that she is okay, but with two I reckon Natasha could maybe hurt a new baby in two seconds (obviously not meaning too, but thinking it is one of her dolls lol) so I just can't be outside peering in lol - Yay for being full term, not long now and honestly I know it is easy for me to say, but I really think it will all be fine in the end for you. You are really strong and I think you have made the right decision about the medication and it is a great idea to have it just in case, but hopefully you won't need it.

Spidey: I love the hair, that is a great way to express your feelings without really being distructive. I'm so sorry your mum is being called back. I really hope it is only as precaution. Eeekk on the smear also, I do think it is down to whomever is doing them as sometimes there is no problem and only some discomfort and others it is agony. Are you happy with what she had to say overall?

Cleck: I love the costunes, Emma looks adorable. Sorry to hear you are feeling down about ttc. It is hard when everyone else is announcing something that you want. I do think the only way to face it is to try and think it will happen when the time is completely right. Did your friend actually ever text you back about the babysitting.

CDK: - I'm sorry I have stayed out of the thread all week as I didn't want to upset or make anybody uncomfortable. I do normally stay well away from any conflict, but I feel so strongly about this, I have to say it and I will take the repercussions if nobody in the thread talks to me, but I do think giving a two year old a cold shower is really mean in fact I think it is barbaric. I know from personal experience if I am having a shower and the water goes cold, it takes me breath away and panics me, so I can't imagine what a little baby must feel :( - When my daughter is potty trained I want it to be a good learning experience for her and not an experience of fear, being honest here it is not the norm to potty train until they are 2 and a half and that is because most who do it too early do find that they do regress, and even if Natasha regressed after the 2.5 I would never ever punish her for it, especially with a cold shower, they are still babies and have known nothing different than to pee and poo without thinking about it, so it is a big learning curve and new habit to form so to me as frustrating as it is to clean it all up, it is not something that deserves punishment.

Well AFU - Natasha is a cranky moo this week for some reason and off her food a bit and not sleeping as well so hope she is not coming down with anything. - Sock puppets went well after, except the glue that I got wasn't the best, we had to leave them for ages to dry, they weren't the greatest looking things, but Natasha enjoyed picking out each of the facial features and I put them together, in fact she mostly enjoyed sifting through the boxes of googly eyes, pipe cleaners and other crafty bits I had bought :haha:

We didn't do much this weekend except call to DH's family yesterday and catch up with all of them and today we just had a lazy day at home and my mam watched Natasha for a half hour while myself and DH went as far as the little angels plot in the grave yard and we finally burried the little box with my pregnancy tests in them. I would have been due this weekend so it seemed the right time to do it and get some closure. I'm not sure my exact due date as my lmp was christmas day so with a 28 day cycle that would make it yesterday, but the doctors had given me the 3rd which is tomorrow and they could have been right as my cycle tends to be 30 or 32 days. I have been dreading this weekend all week, so am glad it is over and done with. There was plenty of tears, but I do feel so much better after them and feel I can move on now and we will hopefully start ttc in the next few cycles.


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## spidey

jelr, I'm so sorry this was a tough weekend thinking about your lost baby :hugs: How are you doing without cigarettes? Is it getting easier every day? Where are you in your cycle?

Potty training has been a success and it was definitely the right time for Kira. A month ago it wouldn't have worked since she was peeing on her feet and not giving it a second thought :haha: Today and yesterday, every pee made it into the potty. About half will start in her pants, but she stops peeing and then rushes to the potty. It's been very cold here so I had to put her in pants instead of being naked, but it didn't seem to make a difference with her success rate. She pooped twice in the potty too :happydance: I don't know if you girls remember, but Kira has always had issues with holding back poop and being constipated from it. She's gone twice in 3 days and it's been so easy and happy for her :thumbup: 


As for TTC, I've had almost positive opk's for the last 5 days but my nips don't hurt. I'm going to buy a new thermometer for the next cycle because today I took my temperature 3 times in a row and got completely different numbers for each one... so I'm not sure how accurate my bbt readings have been this cycle. This is going to be another looooong cycle! jelr, I guess I'm happy with what the midwife said overall. It's what I was expecting since I was pretty certain they couldn't do anything for me until I wean Kira. But bf Kira is more important than having another baby- she's grown up in so many ways, but she's still just a baby and bf is something that provides her a lot of comfort. I don't think she's ready to give that up yet.

DH has been out of town all weekend and just got back an hour ago :thumbup: So I finally got some time to come on here :haha:


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## jelr

Well done Kira :thumbup: that is great that the potty training is going so well and great that it seems to have helped with her holding back her poo.

That is a pain with that it is looking like a long cycle again, on the upside maybe it will only be a little longer and the timing might actually have worked out right with DH being away for the weekend and now he is home for you two to get down to business when you get that proper postive.

I'm glad you are happy with what the midwife said and even though our girls are really growing up every day, you are right they are all still babies. Fingers crossed though it will still happen quickly and when the time is right as I do know ttc can be so stressful, even when trying to be relaxed about the whole thing. Every month is a disappointment.

Yeah I'm definitely doing much much better on the cigerettes, every day is much better and I have put myself on that detox diet for a week so I'm sorting out my swapping it for food now too. I was going to wait, but then reckoned I may as well sort the two out in the one shot, so hopefully this will do it. I'm really am very proud of myself and am shocked that it has gotten so easy in such little time. Don't get me wrong, I still get the odd pang, but not all the time now that the physical withdrawal is done. I think something just clicked with it in my head this time. I'm dreading my first night out as I'm very much a social smoker, but I'm thinking I will actually bring out my electronic cigerette. I have the one with no nicotine, but It will make me feel like I'm the same as I always have been and I won't feel like I'm missing out so hopefully won't give in when my will power is a little weaker with alcohol :haha:


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## Shiv

I am reading every day girls, but am going to bed by 8pm each night as Cora refuses to sleep in her moses basket at night (so sleeps on me) so not much time to reply.

Good work on the potty training Emma and Kira - I am impressed but still unwilling to try just yet :haha:

jean - hugs, I have been thinking of you this weekend.
oh and fair play for expressing your opinions, we have always been able to do that in here and it is what makes this thread great. I wouldn't give Sophia a cold shower either. 

Right I am off to bed to try and get a couple of hours of sleep in before Cora wakes up and won't go back in her basket :dohh:


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## cleckner04

Re: the cold shower thing. I don't think it's horribly cruel but I also wouldn't do it. I've heard of far worse being done though. My SIL literally rubbed her daughters nose in her own wee in order to train her. Like a dog. :cry: And she has also been known to take the kids outside and hose them down with cold water. So a small cold shower in the house isn't very shocking to me. I do agree we should all be able to voice our opinions and concerns. :hugs: 

Shiv- Cora sounds like Emma when she was a newborn. Always wanting to sleep on my chest. :cloud9: It's so sweet. Enjoy those cuddles hun! 

jelr- I'm so glad stopping smoking is going so well for you!! :dance: What does an electronic cigarette look like? Does it look like a normal cigarette? Doesn't it puff out steam or something like that? You'll have to enlighten me. I think it's kinda neat. 

spidey- Yay for potty training going well!!! :dance::dance: Sounds like she was ready too!!! With our morning cuddles, Emma just climbs out of bed and pees and than climbs back into bed with me. I put the potty to the left of the bed every night and she knows right where to go. :thumbup: 



We went out for the first time today! Got groceries. So we were out for an hour and she had clothes on and was fine. No accidents. We got home and she didn't have to pee but I texted the neighbor and she came out with her daughter and we let the girls play in the middle(cul de sac). Suddenly I look over and Emma is across the street taking her pants off. :rofl: I rushed over and grabbed her and asked her if she has to pee. We go in and she sat down and peed. Than tried to put her pants back on. :rofl: So I'm thinking that will be her cue that she has to go when she starts stripping down. :dohh: I'm glad it happened around home instead of in the middle of walmart or somewhere with spectators. :rofl:


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## jelr

Aww Shiv - I hope Cora starts to settle soon Shiv and you get some sleep - Eeek just made me realise, you expect it all to go exactly the way it did the first time and forget every baby is different. How are you feeling in yourself? How does Sophia feel about her now?

Cleck: Well done Emma, she really is getting it as well isn't she - especially good that she knows she needs to take her pants off to pee even if it is out on the street :haha: - It does really show she is understanding it all though.

God that is awful what your SIL does. I can see why your not shocked so. I think I'm more shocked because I know how much cold showers badly affect me and I guess I just don't see it as something to be punished. To me it would be like punishing them for missing their mouths when learning how to use a spoon or falling over when learning how to walk. It just doesn't makes sense as peeing on the floor and regressing are all part of potty training. 

The electronic cigarette looks exactly like a cigarette does except the white part is made of metal and plastic. it gives out some vapour when you exhale. you charge it up and there is a little light that comes on when you inhale. This is a description one of the websites gives:-

"Electronic cigarette is a non-flammable electronic atomizing device, utilizing advanced microelectronic technology and supercritical physical atomized technology to atomize in a disposable cartridge" 

Here is a link to a you tube video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdTinj5sXOE&feature=related

You can get the cartridges in different strenghts but I have the no nicotine one as I used in to help me stop in my last pregnancy. For some reason because it has clicked better in my head this time. I might only use it one in the day, but I know it will be handy for when I go out :thumbup:

Well girls myself and DH had a chat tonight and seeing as I have stopped the champix we are going to ttc from next cycle onwards, so I'm finally doing what the thread was set up for :haha: - AF is due sometime next weekend, It will be weird to be back to the tww next month :haha:


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## cleckner04

Okay that e-cigarette is NEAT!! :haha: That'd be an awesome prop for halloween. (Can you tell I'm looking at halloween stuff online today? :lol:)

YAY for TTC soon!!! You are gonna start trying and I'll be moving on to WTT again. :haha: Hopefully one of us actually ends up pregnant. :p

Oh and my SIL is a moron. Seriously some of the stuff she does makes me so angry. Like letting her kids have sips of beer. :wacko: That's so sickening to me. But I have to keep my mouth shut because everyone would just gang up on me I think. My MIL agrees with me but she wouldn't agree with me in front of SIL if that makes sense. Since I'm not 'blood' she will stick up for SIL first in a group setting. But when it's just MIL and I we can talk about the horrible things SIL does and we are in agreement about it. :dohh:


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## Mary Jo

hey girls, sorry I've been a bit quiet, I don't really feel like talking that much right now, though there is a lot going on. I'm feeling a bit uncomfortable, to be honest, perhaps this isn't the best place for me to be right now.

hooray for all the potty training babes, though. that's awesome, a big milestone for them. like I have said before, time isn't right for us. too much other stuff going on and I would rather wait till I am sure he'll "get it". perhaps he'd get it now, but I haven't the energy. perhaps I am selfish and denying him the chance to progress. as for methods, I haven't looked into it, but suffice to say, I agree with you Jean, 100% over the harsh "punishment"/consequences aspect. I don't understand it, it's not for us at all. :shrug: glad you brought up your feelings about it, rather than letting them fester. :hug:

Shiv, hope Cora is settling a bit and that she will soon learn to love her basket.

Jean, yay for TTC as of next month! just think, that could be another August baby for you... :happydance:


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## Shiv

MJ - sorry you are feeling uncomfortable in here, am always here if you wanna send me a pm or facebook chat :hugs:

I understand completely with regards to not being the right time to potty train, we are leaving it with Sophia too, she may be ready now, but I am not!

Right I am afraid this is going ot be a ranty message..........I need to know whether I am being irrational or am within my rights to be mightily pissed off!

SO you know how David's work situation has been, well I think I have been (or at least tried to be) very reasonable with the amount he has been away etc.

Anyway the day after cora was born he tells me that there is a managers meeting her would like to go to during his two weeks off. He says it is just an hour (today) so I say ok. But really I am thinking "why on earth do you need to go in when you are on paternity leave, no-body will be expecting him to".

SO it gets to last night and he is on his work computer for 3 hours, so I decide to be nice and I let him sleep from 10pm until 7am with no wake-ups to help me with Cora or Sophia who woke twice last night because of teeth, so that he is fresh for his meeting. his meeting is at 10am. SO at 7am I feed Cora and say " you can go to Daddy for cuddles now" and he says oh I am just going ot get a shower. And I say surely you don't need to leave until 9.30am. He says I am going to go in early, I hurumph and he says "do you want me to tell you all that I have to do" (as in what work he needs to do) and I say" you don't HAVE to do anything you are choosing to. He says yes and I say just go and a have a shower, getting pretty pissed off. He comes out of teh shower and I say "so you aren't taking a full days holiday for today I assume (he doesn't get paternity leave so he is using precious holiday). he says I was planning on still taking a full day. I say but you will be there from 8.30am - midday that is half a day worked plus the three hours you did last night. he says "i think it looks good if I do it my way", i say I think it makes him look foolish, it is comendable enough that he is even going in at all. We decide to agree to disagree. By which point having given him a night off I am sorely regretting! So off he goes to work, coming home at just gone midday. 

Basically I wonder why he even wants to go into work when his new daughter is 5 days old, they wouldn't expect him to. Secondly why is he using up holiday which is extra time he could spend at home with us.

he has invited a mutual friend up on Saturday to wet the baby's head - which will mean them getting hugely drunk (whilst I stay at home with LO's), so he tells me he is hoping to get the friend up as early as possble on saturday. I say fine but you AREN'T going out until after Sophia is in bed. To which he replies "I think you mean you would like for me not to go out until after Sophia is in bed..........I say " no I mean you AREN'T going out until then". I say I don't put my foot down much (make that EVER). He says you don't have to, i would have stayed in until Sophia was in bed if you had just asked nicely. But after the rigmaroll with him going ot work , I am just SO pissed off and quite frankly a little bit disgusted at his behaviour.

i realise now writing it down that it doesn;t sound THAT bad, and if Cora was a month old then it would be ok, but she is 5 days old, I am getting very little sleep (up until last night he was kinda pulling his weight as much as he could without being able to feed her) (oh and I didn't even get a thankyou for his night off!)

I just don't understand, his loyalties seem to be with work rather than me, SOphia and Cora. I put up with it for months before the birth I just hoped I might get a couple of weeks of us being the priority!

Sorry this has been so rambled and incoherent (speech marks left out etc) but I just wanted to get it out.

So how would you ladies feel, am I being irrational or within my rights to be a bit miffed.

One thing is for sure, he getting up in the night tonight to do all the nappy changes before I feed Cora!


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## spidey

Shiv, I would be upset too. I can almost understand him going to the meeting since he is new at the job and he wants to make a good impression, but there is no reason why he should take vacation leave at the same time. He shouldn't sacrifice time with his family for a job... jobs come and go but your family doesn't. And going out drinking with his friend would not make me happy. Sometimes it's hard to figure out what men are thinking!!

MJ, are you uncomfortable with posting on a semi-public board, or this particular thread? I hope its nothing thats be said in here. I saw on FB that Adam has been shifted to his own room. How is that going?? How have you been feeling recently? 

jelr, yay for TTC!!! We need some extra TTC excitement in here. I am a dud, and Cleckner rarely gets a chance to :sex: :haha: I always notice those electronic cigarettes when people are "smoking" them inside stores. In Maryland we have a very strict no smoking policy, so seeing someone smoking indoors always makes me look twice. They look very realistic too. :thumbup:

Cleckner, thats awesome that Emma is fully trained now! Go Emma!! It's so cute that she stripped down in the street. Kira used her potty in the front yard yesterday :haha: They have no modesty :lol: Where are you in your cycle? Are you going to get a chance to TTC again before Corey leaves?


as for me, I still haven't ovulated. But I have a new thermometer coming in the mail today, so I can start taking my bbt with 2 different ones and perhaps I can see my temperature shift. One day I'll enter all the data in here and show you girls :haha:


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## cleckner04

MJ- :hugs: I hope it's not something we said hun. If it's my ranting about pregnant women that makes you uncomfortable please know that I'm not ever referring to you ladies. :blush: I'm genuinely happy for all of you. :lol:

Shiv- I would be PISSED. Seriously I just learned about this whole 'wetting the babies head thing' and I don't understand the point of it. My DH would never even consider doing something like that but if he did, I would probably blow a gasket. And him going into work when he's meant to be on leave. That is ridiculous too. I think you are completely reasonable in being angry with him. These early days are so important and he'll never get them back with Cora. :hugs::hugs: 

spidey- No clue where I am in my cycle. I didn't use my CBFM this month. I'd say I'm probably mid-cycle because my period started the day Corey left and it's been a few weeks I think. We should get one more chance to try but that will be in the middle of us moving stuff into storage and packing so it's gonna be tough to get the :sex: in I think. I'm pretty resigned to the fact that it just isn't happening yet. Now if only I could get people to stop asking when I'm having another. :( 


Well here's some weight loss news finally! After going home in July, I gained 7 lbs. So I was up to 197 at a few points in the past 2 months. My weight kept fluctuating but it was definitely higher than when DH first got back in June. Well since he left 2 weeks ago, I have dropped back down to 189.4!! :dance: I was trying my best to get down into the 180s before he got back again. Now if I can manage to stick with it through the holidays and in the last month of Dh being back. :wacko: I have the worst will power when in the company of others. :nope: My lowest weight since I started all of this was 188.4 though so I have 1 lb to lose to get back to that. Now that you ladies are all about to pop, maybe we can talk weightloss together. :D That would give me some extra boost I think. Since you all actually have an excuse for the extra weight with having newborns. My 'baby' is over 2. :haha:


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## Shiv

I don;t actually mind too much David going out to wet the baby's head too much. It is more the way that after him going into work for longer than agreed fiasco this morning I was shocked with the wayhe spoke to me like I was being unreasonable! I seriously think for the past few months I have been seriously reasonable! We aren't really talking tonight. He was on the phone earlier with work and I could hear them trying to persuade him to go back off leave early :nope: He was saying well my preference is to stay off for the 2 weeks but if it is important I can talk to my wife etc etc. he walked back in and I just said "if there is anything you want to discuss with me I would leave it until tomorrow"! They have known I was pregnant and my due date since June. his boss is so lame, when he went in to work today apparently his boss was stressing out and couldn't find the stuff he needed to do the job. Now David has only been there a few months so his boss should be in charge not David! I know David wants me to say "fine just go back"............and I probably will. What is the point in having him here if he is on the phone to work, an don his computer for hours each day. I would rather he didn't waste his leave and had some time off when they are less busy. Seriously if he doesn't get promoted and a damn good pay rise I am gonna be down there giving them a piece of my mind!

Cleck - well done for the wieght loss. I am having my one week post partum weigh in tomorrow. Obvioulsy I am not trying to lose weight (as I tuck into a bag of haribo!) but am hopign it will just fall off :haha:

Cora actually slept in her moses basket last night :happydance:

Jelr - exciting about TTC, I look forward to stalking you. I am already getting a bit sad about how quick time is going, Cora is a week old tomorrow and I just know before I know it she will turnign one and I will be having a meltdown again!


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## jelr

Cleck: Sorry but I have to say your SIL sounds like an ass, It must be hard not to say anything when she does things like that :dohh:

MJ: Huge :hugs: - I'm so sorry you feel uncomfortable and really hope you know I'm always here too, PM me anytime.

Spidey: You are not a dud, it is only the bf that is slowing things down, maybe we will all be pregnant together and you two were just wating for me :haha:

Shiv: I totally hear you on the whole work thing. I know it happened to us when Natasha was born. DH was called back into work on his second week off and I have to say I wasn't as good as you and I totally lost it, but then it did actually help as I felt better for ranting at him and eventually we sat down and talked and I explained my feelings to him and he explained his to me and we were both more understanding (although I did feel really bad as I was really mean when I ranted and I know I did make him feel really really bad) I felt that he was putting work ahead of us and he felt that he had no choice as to him his main role to look after us is to keep a roof over our heads and food on the table by being the provider and he had an idea that things were going bad in his job and didn't want to give them any excuses to get rid of him - so in the end we comprimised and he only worked half days the second week. 

So David probably feels like he is looking after you all by being the best at his job when he is so new there.

On the other hand, I totally see why you are pissed and you have good right too. He is definitely being an ass about going out, I think you should actually have first dibs on having a treat out first - even it if it just for a massage or to get your hair done. In fairness you are the one that has done all the work by carrying Cora over the last 9 months and by giving birth to her and you have done it all with David away for most of it, so he should definitely be helping you as much as possible now, especially since you are getting so little sleep, so I would be really pissed if he was going out in the first place being honest, but as you said yourself I think it is the attitude about it and about the time is the worst thing. There really was no need for it, when he should be bending over backwards for you.

I think when you have calmed down tomorrow, you need to sit him down and tell him exactly how you feel, about how much you were left on your own during the pregnancy and you didn't say anything and that you are just really fed up and hurt with his behaviour so soon after Cora has been born and that he needs to remember where his priorities are and that it was both of you made this family and both of you should look after it.


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## jelr

Oh and I meant to say - thanks you everyone for letting me say how I felt. I'm glad I was able to voice my opinion and you were all cool with it :thumbup:


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## spidey

jelr, you always says things so perfectly :thumbup: Shiv, I do understand how you feel and think you're justified to feel that way. It's really wrong that his work expects him to come back and skip a measly 2 weeks home with you and the baby. His job seems to have much more time spent away from home than was originally expected. Does his boss have children or a wife? Do you think DH wants to go back to work, or do you think he is being forced back to work out of fear of losing his job? Like what jelr said, once you calm down it will be a good idea to talk openly about how you feel... I know you've been holding back a few opinions regarding DH's job.

Cleckner, congrats on the weight loss!!!! I'm sorry people keep asking you when you're having another baby. My MIL asks me and I usually just stare back and don't say anything. I know not to use the word "craving" around her or else she gets excited and asks if I'm expecting :dohh:

I would love for the 3 of us to be pregnant at the same time! With the constant nursing at the beginning of this cycle, I think my body reverted back to complete infertility. Kira's slowed down on nursing this past week, so maybe my hormones will kick back up soon and I will finally ovulate.

Kira hasn't peed since 1:00 and it's 7:30 now! When I ask if she needs to pee she says "NO!" She's a ticking time bomb!

Tomorrow my mom goes in for her repeat mammogram so fingers crossed everything is okay. Did I tell you girls that DH is getting an award on Tuesday? We're going to a fancy dinner for the awards ceremony and I need to get all dressed up. It'll be our first "date night" since Kira was born :lol: Since I can't eat gluten, I emailed the restaurant and they're going to try and make me something I can eat. I get to meet all of DH's bosses, so I better be on my best behavior.


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## cleckner04

spidey that's so exciting with the awards ceremony! Getting dressed up for a kid free night sounds so nice right about now. :D 

I also would love if we could all be pregnant at the same time again!

I have a friend that was a grade under me that just announced on facebook she's pregnant with #4. :wacko: She's younger than me and on #4 already. *sigh*


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## spidey

wow, #4 at your age is crazy! I bet she's a basket case at the end of the day with all those kids. All my girl friends from HS started having babies right away too and 3 of their husbands have had vasectomies in the past year :haha:


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## cleckner04

:haha: @ vasectomies. 

This girl homeschools her kids and everything. She's a natural mommy in some ways too with babywearing and breastfeeding. She's a really good mom but that doesn't stop me from being envious. :blush: I have a friend from back in Virginia that is on baby #3 and it's 3 different dads. :wacko: She's a few years younger than me as well. But she's finally settled down with a good guy so hopefully this last dad will be one that sticks.


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## jelr

Cleck: I completely forgot to say. Well done on the weightloss, that is fantastic to do so well with DH especially if you have no will power around under people, you only put on a half stone on holidays and have shifted that now, that is more than anyone could hope for. I put on 7lbs on every holiday and that is by my and DH being off work together without actually going anywhere :haha:

I know it is hard with everyone else being pregnant, but when you seriously think about it, would you like to have 4 children at this stage, I think it would be hard to give the same time that I have to Natasha if I had 3 others and I wouldn't want to change that for the world. That is horrible when people ask when you are having another, I get that myself. In fact the worst of it is it all started the week I was misscarrying and it was like a knife anytime anybody said it and I just had to grin and say ah we will see as I know they had no idea and would have died if they had of known, it was still hard though. It has made me very aware of saying anything to people about having more children as you never know what is going on in peoples lives.

Spidey: Oooohhh that sounds lovely to get dressed up and head out to a fancy dinner. What is DH getting the award for? Is it a black tie affair? What will you wear?

OMG on Kira holding her pee for so long - I don't know if I could hold it that long myself. I hope that pee did not explode every where :haha: - if she makes it to the potty, it will probably overflow :haha:

Sorry your MIL is annoying you too, you would think MIL's would know better, mine is the same, we were up there at the weekend and when DH told her I was off the cigarettes, she said "Oh is she pregnant" and she knows our history :dohh:

I really hope your mams appointment goes well today, how quickly will she get the results? I hope you all don't have to wait long :hugs:

Shiv: Well how did Cora sleep last night? and how are you feeling today, I think now is the time to sit down and tell David exactly how you are feeling and have been feeling the whole time, because if not it will only fester and you have enough to do at the moment with two babies to look after without feeling angry at him the whole time too and he really does need to understand as he clearly doesn't with the way he is the last few days.

MJ: How are you feeling now, I really hope you will be back in here. Have you any more appointments coming up. Isn't it next week you all have your meet. I wish I was nearer for that as it would be lovely to meet some of you.

Completely OT, but what adds to you all see on here, I'm wondering if they are targetted at what we write as I have a stop smoking one for the past two weeks or I wonder is it totally random :haha:

Anyway I had better make a move as I'm supposed to be working :haha:


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## spidey

jelr, thats funny about the stop smoking ad. I've reloaded twice and I only get Halloween ads trying to sell me candy and costumes :haha:

I just heard from my mom and everything went well. It is a harmless cyst. They had to do multiple x-rays and sonograms but finally figured it out :thumbup: Such a relief!

I would love to be close enough to attend a meet too. Maybe one day me and Cleckner will pass through eachother's states and we can have a mini meet :haha:

DH was chosen for a community safety award since he enforces laws to do with rats, trash, etc. It's a big deal and the first time that someone from his department was chosen. Most of the time they award firemen, policeman or security guards, so it's neat he's getting the award. DH told me it's basically like employee of the year :thumbup: I think it's black tie. I have some dress pants and 1 dressier shirt I could wear. But it might be nice to wear a dress, which I don't have... so this weekend a shopping trip might be in order! Maybe I will take pictures of what I have and get your opinions.


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## cleckner04

Ooo spidey you gotta get a gown. It's gonna be like the prom! So exciting!! 

Do you ladies in the UK have proms? We should all share our prom pictures. :haha: I love looking back at old pictures. 

jelr- you are totally right. I really wouldn't want 4 kids right now. (or ever :lol:) I do think Emma will benefit from having alone time with me for so long. 

spidey- Well now that I'm moving back to Ohio/Indiana area its a definite possibility to have a meet since we'll be so much closer!! The others are fairly close too. Well on the east coast/midwest at least. :haha: Teresa, Kimberly, and Heidi. South Carolina, Georgia, and Heidi is in minnesota I think. The US is far too big. :haha: 



I actually dropped down even more this morning in weight. Down to 188.4!! Which is exactly what I was when we went home in July. And was also my lowest weight since losing weight this time. I have one more week before Corey is back so hopefully I can get down even further!! :dance: And have the willpower to stay out of restaurants when he's back. :blush:


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## Shiv

Spidey - so glad your mum got good news, must be such a relief :hugs:

You HAVE to go and buy a dress, with a killer figure like yours it would be a shame to hide it in trousers. We MUST have photos too!

Cleck - we don't have proms here (although I think they are catching on now in schoold) but we did have a leaving party, like a prom I suppose when we all left school at 18. I'll see if I can dig out some photos! boo I don't have any on facebook, so might have to try to scan some in!

jelr - how long have you been off the cigarettes now? I think you should give yoruself some sort of treat for each month you make. My mum has been off them for a year next month and I want to do something/ get her something to celebrate. She still struggles every day with it (sorry you don't want to know that :dohh:) so I think she deserves something special.

It would be super cool if you girls get pregnant together! Although I will be very jealous. I didn't really enjoy being pregnant this time round, mainly because i spent the majority of it on my hands and knees and other ridiculous positions! But having said I would never have anymore, i am already feeling like time is flying, and I am making the most of cuddles with Cora, but the thought of never having any more newborn cuddles is sad :cry:

I know that I am no longer TTC or even pregnant but I hope you girls don't mind me sticking around. I would be a bit lost without you all to be honest :hugs:

Had a busy day today, went shopping, mainly to get my boobs measured so that I can order some pretty nursing bras, my ones from Sophia have no elastic left and don't support my now hefty again cleavage! Anyway we were out from 11am to 4pm on our feet and I think i did too much as I am bleeding a bit heavier again now. 

I tried Cora out in the babyhawk and it is SO comfortable for me. I do worry that she is a bit squished in the leg department when she is in it though.

David and I aren't really talking at the moment. We "discussed" the work situation. He told me they needed to know when he was going back and I said "go back when you want to", its no use you using up your holiday when you aren't totally focussed on the family". he got in a huff saying, so you're saying I am no use while I'm here! I of course said that wasn't the case but that I would rather he used his holiday time with us for when he could concentrate on us and not be thinking about work. He said that he didn;t mind work contacting him etc, but I said that I did. he basically wants me to tell him it is fine by me if you go back early.........which I won't do. HE can choose to go back but I am not making that decision for him. I have realised that he has been doign that all along, making me have the final say so that I can't really complain afterwards! who knew he was so devious - very woman like that :haha: Anyway the upshot is he has told work he would like the full 2 weeks, but if they REALLY need him then he will go back 2 days early, but they have to let him know by this weekend. We wills see.

I just want to forget about it and for him to give me a cuddle, because i am tired and because I gave birth to his baby and because I am breastfeeding and it's hard work................but men are rubbish and I know I won't get one unless I ask - and that isn't the point!

So I had my one week post partum weigh in today and here are my stats!

Pre- preg weight - 9st 9lbs
Fully pregnant weight - 11st 11lbs
1 week post partum weight 10 st 6.5lbs

I am pretty happy with that, at this stag with Sophia I weighed 12 stone. SO my first aim is to get down to 10 stone, then pre-preg weight, then finally 9 st 4 lbs.

Oh and here is a pic of me at one week post partum in comparison to fully cooked! Ok photo is taking ages to upload to PC so will attach in seperate message
 



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## Shiv

so here goes, fully cooked vs 1 week post partum
 



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## cleckner04

Shiv- You did SO good with weight this time around!! I'm so jealous it's mostly dropped right back off for you!! I wonder why I never lost any of mine. C-section and not being able to move maybe. :shrug: I don't want you as a weight loss buddy anymore. You're losing it too fast. :winkwink: Of course you should stick around. Hell, I haven't been pregnant at all and have mostly been WTT this whole time. I think this thread is more of a 'general chat' thread for us. Because we really haven't discussed TTC or Pregnancy that much. Our poor lion cub thread is dead as a doornail. 


I'm gonna search out some prom pictures. Although most are on facebook I think.


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## cleckner04

Jeremy Kyle is on right now on my TV. :wacko: I take it he moved to america?!! It's americans on his show!


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## Shiv

Jeremy Kyle is car crash tv here - I can't let myself watch it because as bad as it is, I will get addicted to watching idiots discuss their f'ed up lives!:haha:

As for weightloss, as you know it is the last bit of weight that is the hardest to lose, so give me another half stone that I hope will come off easily and the rest will be a slow process that involves a lot of exercise and watching what I eat (to a certain extent cos of the BFing)


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## cleckner04

Well I think you did fabulous with weight gain this time around. You don't seem to have gained anywhere on your body but your belly. :thumbup: I hope I can do just as well whenever I get pregnant again. 


Okay, I redid my avatar and my siggie. Now I"m off to find some prom pictures. :haha:


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## Shiv

your avatar is simply gorgeous


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## cleckner04

The first three are from my sophomore year in 2002. I was 15 and went to Corey's high school prom. Corey was 18. We had only been together for like 4-5 months at this point. These aren't on facebook. I took a picture of the pictures in one of my scrapbooks. :haha: I totally love the picture showing the side shot of me. I can't believe how skinny I was. :D That dress was amazing too. Really heavy because of all the beadwork. I wish we got a picture of the back because it was an open back. I wish I still had this dress but I'm pretty sure my mom sold it. :cry: 


The fourth picture is on facebook too. I'm not sure where the rest of these photos are but I know they must be in a scrapbook somewhere probably packed already. This was my Junior year. Ages 16 for me and 19 for Corey. You can tell he joined the military between the two years because his hair is super short for the second prom. :haha:

I never went to my senior prom. Corey was deployed and I didn't want to go alone or even with friends really. I was a giant downer because it was our first deployment.

Edit: Hmm the fourth picture wouldn't upload for some reason so here's a photobucket version. 

https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/Screenshot2011-10-05at23852PM.png


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## jelr

Spidey: Yay for your mom's good news, I'm so so happy for you, that is a big worry that is over now.

Oh you really really have to wear an evening dress, you would look amazing. I love an excuse to dress up :haha: - that is a great achievement for your DH.

Cleck: We have something like a prom here, but it is called a grad (short for graduation) - I had a baby pink dress for mine, I must see if I have any pictures, but I have a funny feeling my mam has the only 1 and that is on her wall :haha: - You look amazing at both proms - I love your new sig and avatar, Emma is adorable.

Shiv: You did great on the weight, and I bet more of that will come off without you even doing anything, as you will probably still have fluid and so on to lose. Do you think you did ate better this time or ate less crap or did you do more exercise?

I know I'm not David but here is a :hugs: from me - I do think you two need to sort this out as you don't wan't to remember the first two weeks of Cora's life with you both not talking or waste the time off with all this bad feeling and you do need those hugs and deserve them at the moment. If you are not up for telling him how you feel, could you write him another email or letter as I know you found that easier last time and it sorted things out. Honestly you won't get this time back, so you wan't to have good memories :thumup:

Don't you even think about going anywhere, sure look at me, I only came in when I mc and haven't been ttc until now. It is definitely more our little chat group than anything and you are a huge part of that and I for 1 would be lost without you.

MJ: Would be lost without you too, if you are reading and I hope you come back :hugs:

Well I'm off the cigs now 16 days and am actually saving the money that I would have smoked so that I can see the savings and I'm hoping it will be our little holiday fund, mind you if my money is cut it will probably be used on every day stuff :haha: but sure I can dream.

DH did give me money to treat myself though so I bought my new ghd and a few dresses yesterday. I have to say he really did help me stop, even though he is still smoking. The first weekend I had a glass of wine and was really agitated and upset and was ready to give up and he told me that I was better and stronger than that and that I had managed to survive 2 mc's and lived a full life with arthritis, even though the doctors had had me down for ending up in a wheelchair and I proved them all wrong and even came off all the injections they had me on and managed the pain with no meds to have Natasha and that I was the strongest people he knew and he was so so proud of me for stopping. It all really melted my heart because even though he would compliment me if I was dressed up and stuff, he would never compliment me by saying I was strong or anything like that and it actually made me very proud of myself as I had never thought about any of it like that before :haha: - so after his little pep talk I did pull myself together and thought he is right, I have managed harder so I wasn't going to let them beat me. So hopefully I can keep the momentem up now.

Well thankfully Natasha was in better form today, and I hope it stays like that when I'm off tomorrow - bet I have jinxed myself now, she has been like a demon on and off all week and is screaming for everything and just doing everything that she is not meant to like slapping and throwing things. It really isn't like her, so don't know if it is her back teeth or if she maybe picked up on me being down over the few days. She did say tonight that her mouth was sore and woke up screaming at one stage last night so I think it could be teeth, the poor thing. Although much as I feel for her, it has been hard work when she has been in such a bad mood :dohh:


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## cleckner04

What is ghd? I keep seeing girls post that on facebook and I have no clue what they are talking about. 

Your paragraph about your husband giving you a pep talk actually made me tear up a little. I must be hormonal but that was very sweet of him to encourage you like that. You've got a good man. :thumbup:


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## spidey

I gave DH the heads up that I'll be heading off to the mall to shop for a dress this weekend!! He said it's not black tie :growlmad: but it's supposed to be a little fancier than business casual. He's wearing a dress shirt, tie and trousers. So I think a dress will be okay for me to wear (IF I can find one!). I NEVER get the chance to dress up for something fun, so I can't wait. Be warned I will be posting pictures to get advice- I have no clue what I'm doing :haha:

Cleckner, I love your pictures. Were you married when you were a senior in HS? You have way more boobage now :haha: I wish mine grew after HS :blush: I didn't go to my prom or DH's prom... or even homecoming! I was very shy in HS and the thought of going to a dance terrified me. Also, it was hard to ask my parents for money. I should have gotten off my lazy ass and got a job :haha:

Cleckner, you are right... Ohio isn't toooo far. Maybe one day I'll plan a family vacation out that way and we will pass by your town and stop in :thumbup:

Shiv, you must stick around and keep posting!!! You did have a rough pregnancy with all the worry of head up/down. It's funny to think that sweet Cora caused all that worry. It sounds like David has figured out the perfect way to avoid trouble. I hope you both start talking soon and can get your feelings out :hugs: I looked up the conversion 14 pounds= 1 stone :lol: You've had really great weight loss after only 1 week. You look great in your picture too. It's so sad your bump has gone.

jelr, congrats on 16 days! That's very sweet what your DH said and it's true too. It's very nice to be reminded every so often. I hope Natasha is feeling better tomorrow. It's probably those molars coming in- poor thing.


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## cleckner04

I married Corey 3 months after graduation. I spent my senior year planning my wedding. :rofl: Which is funny because we had to 'plan our wedding' as a home economics project so I aced it. :rofl::rofl: And yes I had no boobs whatsoever before Emma. They were an A cup. Now are Ds. Which I have a feeling they won't look too good once I'm done losing the weight and done breastfeeding. I'll probably be able to roll them up and put them in a bra. :haha: 

Booo about no prom pictures of you. Did you go to a big school? I was shy too but I grew up with everyone I was in school with so it wasn't a big deal to make a fool of myself in front of them all. :haha: Our class only had 50-55 people in it I think. 


I look forward to seeing your dress selections!! Kinda a bummer that it's not black tie. But you can still get a nice dress! So it's homecoming instead of prom for you. :winkwink:


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## overcomer79

Hi all...sorry I have been MIA. I have had so much going on lately!! I am so jealous those with girls getting potty training down. I wish James was interested but he just isn't. With me working full time, I can't work with him as I should. Maybe when I get some time off in Dec I will have a chance to work with him. We are still hanging in there with ttc. Not been successful mind you but hopefully we will get there. 

Cleck...hope the move isn't too bad for you.

I can't remember what all I have read:

MJ ((hugs))

Good luck ttc Jelr and spidey

I think I'm caught up? not sure...


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## Shiv

Cleck - you look beautiful in the prom pictures. how much did you weigh then, you certainly were a skinny minny!

GHD's are hair straighteners but the best ones you can get here.

Spidey - I can't wait to see your dress choice. It doesn't have to be black tie to wear a dress, that is such a man thing to say!

jelr - Can I borrow Jim, he sounds like a sweetheart and everything he said is true:hugs: I hope Natasha is in better spirits today

As for me, well things are better with David now he has made the decision regarding going back to work (still waiting to see if they get back to him about going in on Monday. Got my cuddle although I did (begrudgingly) have to initiate it. But woke up to one this morning (at 9.30am, Cora is loving her sleep now!).

I had forgotten the worry of having a newborn, first it was that she wouldn't sleep and now it is that she is sleeping loads and I worry she isn't feeding enough. I am scared of her not putting on weight. She gets weighed on Saturday, and if she is all ok then I will be relieved and she is obviously an effcicient feeder. She can have a full feed in 10 mins (which is short for a newborn i think). I was so worried that i was encouraging her to feed for longer (teh usual tricks, tickling face and feet etc) She fed for 20 mins then projectile vomitted over the laptop so she obviously didn't need more food!

SO last night she went to bed late (because of the projectile vomitting, she needed another feed) at 11.30pm then woke at 4.30am for a feed. Went back down at 5.30am and woke up at 9.30am. Pretty good I think and not unlike Sophia was.

We played hide and seek today with Sophia (she LOVES this game) and I was amazed at all teh great places I found to hide now that I am not the size of a whale :haha:

On the weight front, my scales ran our of battery today, so I am now worried that they may have been weighing light for a while and I will step on them when I get some new batteries and they will say 16 stone or something! :haha:

The keyboard has just started squeaking when I type, I can only assume it is the vomit causing it :haha:


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## jelr

Cleck: Yep GHD stands for Good Hair Day and as Shiv said they are a straightners, I have had one for about 5 years now and simply could not live without it as I have a kink in my hair so it is extremely fuzzy if not straightened. Mine old one broke last week, so the treat money came in handy, although I would have rather have my old ones and use the treat money for more clothes :haha:

That was so handy planning your wedding and doing your home economics project too :haha: 

Shiv: I'm so happy that you got your cuddle and Cora sounds like she is doing brilliantly. Yeah I can totally understand the whole newborn thing. It is only with speaking to my friend that had the baby a few months ago that I am remembering the worry of a newborn not being able to tell you anything and trying to guess everything. I can remember finding that really frustrating.

Oh and by the way I meant to say yesterday, that is a great idea to treat your mum, she really does deserve it. I do like to think that the struggle will stop, but realistically it is like any addiction I'm always going to have to fight the urge to have just one for the rest of my life and that does scare me, so I try to just work on it day to day and your mum has done brilliantly as she smoked for so much longer than me and I have to be honest here are times where if I wasn't intending to become pregnant, I don't know if I would have been so good.

I decided tonight also that the money I am saving for the first month I am actually going to treat myself with too. I really shouldn't as my hours will be cut soon, but I think by getting the few extra bits I will also see the financial benefits of stopping too and I may as well do it this month before my hours do get cut and I end up using it for stuff that has to be got rather than going towards nice things :haha: - There are a couple of recipe books that I want to get and not just one but two pairs of winter boots so I'm going to spoil myself :haha:

Spidey: Aww I'm raging it is not a black tie affair as I would have loved to see you in a ball gown. But still I'm looking forward to seeing your dress choices and yep I'm definitely up for helping out, you girls were great when I was looking for clothes for the wedding :thumbup:

OC: Thanks OK and you too.

Thanks for the lovely comments on DH girls, he really is a sweetie and a bit old softie, although like them all he has his moments too and I always say AF hits him as bad as me he can get so cranky by times :haha: - Ah no he actually wasn't that great of a communicator when we met, but I am a big believer in communications and in fact can't cope when it is not there and end up making mountains out of mole hills in my head when I don't know what is going on in his, so over the years I think he has learned that it is so so much easlier to talk to me and tell me what is going on in his head and how he does feel about things - mind you it is probably to stop me turning into a lunatic :haha: - but he actually did shock me with his pep talk as he has never really said anything like that, although he did say something similiar when I was having Natasha and after 3 hours of pushing and getting sick was saying "I can't do this anymore" - but I had completely forgotten he had told me I could and went through why I was so strong, so it good to hear it the other night and know that he has that kind of respect for me, because it is not something he would usually say. In fact he is a big joker and would usually tell you he is the best at everything :haha: 

Natasha is in much much better form today and wanted loads of kisses and cuddles, so maybe it was her teeth or maybe it was just she picked up on my mood all week. I'm feeling so much better myself today and really do feel ready to move past it all now. I just hope I haven't jinxed it now and she will be like a divil tomorrow :haha: - Well I had better get to bed or will be like a divil myself. I have just got my upgrade with my phone company so I have the Iphone 4 now instead of the 3 and have spent hours messing with it, although I have no idea why because apart from the video it is the very same, that is probably why I did play so much hoping to find something more exciting on itunes that would really make it feel like new :haha: - I shouldn't complain really when it is for free, although DH got his upgrade a few weeks ago and got a Samsung Galaxy and I actually think his is better :dohh:

Well I won't be in over the weekend, so hope you all have a great one. Xx


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## Shiv

Hi girls, hope everyone is having a good weekend.

Well David is out so I am home with my girls! Sophia is in bed and hopefully will stay settled until morning. Cora is asleep in her basket (but due to wake up soon for more mummy milk (i am loving breastfeeding, and my nipples are no longer sore at all, which is such a contrast to with Sophia where I suffered with nipple loss until 3 months in when it started growing back)

I had Cora weighed today and she is slowly putting on weight but still not back up to her birth weight, she is 8lbs 11oz now. Now that she isn't quite as chubby faced as first born she looks SO much like Sophia. Let me see if I can dig out some photos of them both at the same age for comparison (i'll post later)

David suprised me by buying me a dress today! He said he was going out to return a DVD to the shop, which he did, buthe came back with a bag from a boutique in town. We had walked past this shop on Thursday and commented as we walked past the liked the dress in the window....anyhow that is the dress he got me. It is a bit snug at the moment (size 12) so it is myaim to be able to fit nicely into it by Christmas.

I found out at the midwife today that my abdominal muscles have separated down the middle, she made me feel where I can get my whole hand in between and basicaly feel my insides - gross! So I am very much doubting I will be getting a flat tummy again, so I am going to go and scoff some ice-cream and cake :haha:

how is the potty training going Spidey?


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## spidey

I just got Kira down for her nap, so it's mommy internet time! DH and my Dad are starting work on a large deck for the backyard so for the next few weekends I won't have much help with Kira. My grandma left some money to my mom so she's giving us some to build a deck and an equal amount to my brother :thumbup: But with all this deck stuff, I haven't gotten a chance to dress shop yet :growlmad:

Shiv, my tummy muscles separated too and the only problem I have now is at the slightest bit of bloat, I grow a nice 20 week bump. I can still feel the separation above my belly button, but it has greatly improved from about 6 or 9 months ppd. I can take a pic of my belly to show you- it looks pretty good and flat as long as I haven't just eaten :thumbup: Thats very sweet about the dress... maybe David realized he was being insensitive and that's his way of making up. I'm so happy to hear that bf is going well :happydance: Did your nipples actually wear away with Sophia? Oh gosh, I can't imagine how painful that must have been.

Cleck, I'm not sure how many students were in my graduating class, but the entire school (grades 9-12) had just over 2,000. You gave me a nice visual about rolling your boobs up :rofl: How is Emma with her potty training?

jelr, I hope Natasha is still being a sweetheart this weekend. Don't feel guilty about treating yourself with the money you've saved this month. It's a great incentive!

OC- fingers crossed you'll get pregnant this cycle!


So I think I'm finally going to ovulate and today is cd29. My nips are starting to tingle. I'll pee on an opk tonight and see. No spike in bbt yet, so maybe I'll see that tomorrow morning.

Potty training is going okay- harder now that DH is back. I created the M&M incentive, so 1 for pee and 2 for poop and after she uses the potty I dance and sing. When DH came back from his vacation, right away he decided that she didn't need M&M's anymore and he wasn't going to dance :growlmad: So she started having more accidents and holding her pee for 8 hours at a time. So yesterday I told him that we must stay consistent with the rewards. So of course I was right and she stopped having frequent accidents when we started dancing and singing and giving out M&M's again. I got a little mad at DH for trying to control the potty training thing, but I think he felt a little left out because he wasn't home when I trained her. She only wears a diaper at night, but hasn't peed in it yet. No diaper at nap time and she's wearing underwear and pants now!


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## Shiv

Spidey that is great about the potty training, I am so impressed with Kira and Emma - still not ready to give it a go with Sophia though, although I think she would probably take to it ok.

The other day I went to wake her from her nap (is she sleeps past 3pm she is a mare to get togo to bed at night) and I went in and she was sat up inbed, kinda looking under the covers. So I get on the bed next to her and peek under the covers, she pulls them back down and says "mummy I was trying to have a poo"! By the smell of it she had suceeded too! So she knows she is going to poo, just waiting fro some signs that she she knows sheis going to wee. Also her nappy is SO full in the mornings so we are a long way off night training. But then she does sleep for between 13 and 14 horus each night and I would struggle to hold on that long too!

As fo rmy nipples, it was less worn away as eaten away in chunks, I was literally left with just a tinybit of nipple on my left side. I started to see new pink nipple at 12 weeks and then itgrew back, it is now much larger than my right, I suppose because it is scar tissue. I wish I had taken photos of it because I don't think people believe she actually ate my nipple :haha:

The dress is definitely David's way of saying sorry, and also prob because he is off out tonight. I told him the other night he should be giving ultimate respect after having his baby and not crap!

I hope you get to go dress shopping Spidey. Also make sure you take photos of the decking.

I just ate a tub of ice-cream :dohh:


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## spidey

I bet Sophia would potty train fast. I remember you posting that she will stop in mid stream and show you where her pee is. And she's not against sitting on the potty too. It's just a matter of when you feel like taking the plunge!

Oh Shiv, that is awful about your nipples :cry: My nips are hurting right now thinking about it. I'm glad the tissue grew back and the scarring didn't block milk flow. Looking back, do you know what caused your nipples to be damaged so badly? Was it a latch issue? I can understand now why you were afraid that bf may not be easy with the new baby.


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## Shiv

the weird thing is that it was only one nipple, so her latch was obviously fine with the other :shrug:

Anyway Cora doesn't seem to have an issue changing from giant nip to normal nip so that is good. My damaged nipple does leak a LOT though!


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## jelr

Eeeek Shiv: that sounds really painful - So glad it is going better this time :thumbup: 

Aww that was lovely of David to go out and buy you the dress, glad he realised that he was wrong :thumbup:

Spidey: Sorry you didn't get to go shopping the weekend. Boo I was looking forward to looking at some dresses too. Definitely get some pictures. That is a lovely treat to get the decking done.

Not much news here, just went as far as a local farm on Saturday and met my friend with her 3 girls and we did some spring cleaning today and that was it. Natasha is still hit and miss, Friday she was in really bad form again and then over the weekend, she was fine most of the time, but had her moments, but I can live with that once it is not all day :dohh:


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## spidey

I finally got 15 minutes to shop for a dress! :happydance: So tell me honestly what you think. The event is on Tuesday evening so I technically still have Monday, which is a US holiday and DH has off. We already have tons of plans, but I'm sure I could squeeze in another short trip to the mall.

My shoes (the only "dress" shoes I own, so they HAVE to work!) DH calls them my slut shoes.


Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/dress/shoes.jpg

The dress. It's very plain, but I can imagine re-wearing it in the future for something work related. I was looking for something a little flashier, but everything was either way too slutty/flashy, or way too conservative.

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/dress/entiredress.jpg

Fake boobs :rofl: 

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/dress/sockboobs.jpg

Real boobs 

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/dress/realboobs.jpg

My butt

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/dress/backside.jpg


The main thing I don't like is the boob part, but I can stuff my bra a bit to help things out. DH likes the dress, but who knows how he really feels since he was trying to entertain a cranky Kira :haha:


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## cleckner04

I LOVE the dress! And you need fake boobs!!!! :haha: Go to walmart and in the bra section they sell amazing pad things that you can shove in your bra. It's always by the strapless bra section with the clear straps, etc. :D


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## Shiv

I love the dress too, not too flashy but very elegant and your butt looks great :thumbup: Agree that it looks better with a bit of padding though.


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## jelr

:thumbup: on the dress from me too - but I also agree, add the padding - you can get good plunge bras with what we call chicken fillets (gel padding) and they are brilliant, my sister is only a b cup, but looks like a d cup.

Have a great night tomorrow night.


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## spidey

I took another trip since my last was barely 15 minutes. I left cranky Kira home with tired cranky DH :haha: I've had a long day, so excuse the crazy hair and tiredness!

dress 2 is a little less formal. DH says it'll match his level of "fanciness". I like it most, perhaps because it's my typical style- shirt with tight pants. It also gets around the boob problem, which I was not able to solve today because I could not find any bra inserts in the 1 store closest my house :growlmad: But if I wore the first one I would definitely stuff my bra with something. :thumbup:


Spoiler
Butt first- my best feature 
https://www.razortoe.com/share/dress/more/dress2.jpg

https://www.razortoe.com/share/dress/more/dress2b.jpg

https://www.razortoe.com/share/dress/more/dress2c.jpg

Super fancy dress #3. DH says it's way too fancy for the event, but I'm having fun trying it on until I have to return it :haha:


Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/dress/more/dress3.jpg

https://www.razortoe.com/share/dress/more/dress3b.jpg


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## cleckner04

I love them all! But I still like the first dress the best. With the legging/top outfit in a close second. The third dress is kind of hard to see details by the pictures so I can't give a good review on it. :haha: 

I say wear what you are most comfortable in. The first two are both dressy enough that you can't be mistaken as being underdressed or overdressed IYKWIM.


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## jelr

I love them all too, I really like the look of the 2nd picture of the last one. Like Cleck said, go with what you are comfortable in because there is nothing as bad as feeling uncomfortable at something like that. 

The dress and leggins are lovely, but I would wear them for everyday use here, but if dh thinks they are right for the event and that is what you are most comfortable with i would go for it and they are gorgeous on you as it shows off your teeny tiny figure :thumbup:


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## spidey

thanks girls, I really appreciate your opinions. :flower: DH votes for the purple sweater/ leggings combo. I really like the long dress (#3), but he says it's way too fancy. I might wait till tomorrow to make my final decision, but right now I'm leaning more towards the purple/black leggings since it's really comfortable. I still like the first dress though, but it's a bit stiff and right now I'm too tired to think about wearing anything stiff :lol:

In other news... here is the progress on the deck


Spoiler
The door to nowhere will one day open onto the deck. It's going to be 12 foot by 20 foot.
https://www.razortoe.com/share/deck/weekend1.jpg

The concrete footers where the wooden posts will sit. Those go down 3 feet! DH calculated that he carried 2600 pounds of concrete today.
https://www.razortoe.com/share/deck/footers.jpg


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## cleckner04

Your house is absolutely massive spidey! I'm quite jealous here. :D


Emma keeps pooping on the floor again instead of in the potty. :( Not sure what her deal is but I was upstairs scrubbing the bath and I came down to see that she moved the small hall rug and put it over top of her poop so she was trying to hide it. She knows it's bad but I don't know what I can do about it. :shrug:


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## spidey

Cleckner, we've had some poop issues too. Kira pooped twice in the potty last weekend when we started potty training. But then she held her poop all the way from Sunday until Friday. She was soooo miserable Friday from being unable to poo. Friday night we gave her a suppository since her poop was too hard by then. Then on Sunday night she pooped in the bathtub :dohh: She's been holding her pee so she only goes up to 4 times a day. Today she's peed 3 times so far (and its almost 9pm). Twice completely in her pants and once fully on the potty. Her bladder gets so full that when she has to go, it's too late to make it to the potty. I'm guessing she's testing her limits and one day she'll pee more often. I don't know what to suggest about Emma's pooping. Kira doesn't hide hers.. it floats in the bathtub and she points to it and signals me to fish it out :haha:

Ah, and I almost forgot the most important news! On Saturday and Sunday I got positive opks. My nips started hurting Saturday morning right on cue :thumbup: I've been eagerly waiting for my temp to rise but it hasn't happened as of Monday morning with either thermometer


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## Shiv

Spidey - dress one is stillmy favourite, but you have to wear what you fel comfortable in. Where is the event? Make sure you take pictures of you all dolled up!

As for the poo incidents, no advice here as I am still too chicken to try potty training :haha:

Will come back later for a proper catch-up.


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## spidey

you girls are making me have second thoughts! I really do like the 1st dress. My new plan is to wear the 1st dress and stuff the bra a little bit. If it looks good, then the 1st dress will win! Then I can wear the sweater/leggings combo another time :thumbup:

How's everything going Shiv?

No obvious temp rise for me this morning. Tonight or tomorrow I'll enter all the temperature data into the computer and make a graph so I can share.


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## cleckner04

The first dress just looks so nice on you. I just love the style of it too. It's something I could never wear. :haha: Really out of all your choices I could probably only get away with the 3rd dress. I think people would be disgusted if I wore leggings. I've never wore leggings ever. My only outfits are jeans and a nice top. :blush: I'm not very fashionable.


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## Shiv

I am SO unfashionable! I am terrible, I have no idea how to dress for my shape, so always just look rubbish - especially now I am breastfeeding again. The only thing I worry about is access to my boobs!


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## Shiv

You do look hot in the first dress, your figure is amazing!

So David goes back to work tomorrow, I am dreading it. Cora has decided that throwing up after every feed it the way forward, so i am havign to keep her upright for like an hour after each feed, which is tough when Sophia wants me to play with her. Up until Day 10 Cora would just feed then go down in her 'basket for hours until her next feed, she is far more maintenance now. If she was my only chid it wouldn't be a problem but I can't just sit on the sofa this time round.

I have been making use of my babyhawk around the house today to keep her upright, but I don;t want her to lose the ability to sleep in her basket - aargh.

i am pretty worried about the amount she is being sick. The Health visitor is coming round tomorrow so I will discuss it with her. Although she has a small tongue tie when she was checked for it it wasn't casuing any issues. But i wonder if it is the tongue tie causing her to swallow more wind and thus giving the sick issues :shrug: 

I had forgotten how worrying the first few weeks are, you'd do anything to stop your new baby feeling pain etc

She will be weighed tomorrow, she was 8lbs 11oz on Saturday (still 6 oz below birth weight). She will be 2 weeks old tomorrow so I hope she is nearly up to her birth weight otherwise I will assume the sick episodes are stopping her putting on weight, which is one of my main fears. SO fingers crossed for a good weigh in!

So you may have seen on fb that when Cora was just 3 days old we went back to Kent to visit David's mum. i was not happy about having to make this trip when surely she should have been coming to visit us so soon after the birth. Anyway since then we haven't heard anything from her, not a text to find out how we are nothing. SO we are going back to Kent on Sunday as my parents invited us for lunch on Sunday (no pressure just if we felt up to it). Now my question to you ladies is this.............my parents live about 3 miles away from David's mum, should we be telling her we are back in Kent? To be honest I don't want to. She should have been in contact with us to arrange seeing Sophia and Cora again and she hasn't been. But is it very harsh to just not say anything?

Hope you are all well x


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## cleckner04

Oh shiv I don't know what to say about the vomiting issue. :( That sounds awful. :hugs::hugs: Have you tried cutting out different things in your diet to see if it changes her gas issues? I really hope they can figure it out and I also hope she's back up to her birth weight and even higher at the next weigh in. :hugs: I remember how worrying it was with Emma because she wasn't gaining back the weight either. We ended up having the vomiting issues than but it was from the formula they made me give her. :growlmad: 

As for going home. If it were me I would have to tell her. Otherwise I'd feel really guilty about it. I do think it's wrong that she hasn't tried to see how you guys are doing. Is David very close with his mom? 

Oh yeah, also wanted to say good luck with David back to work! I hope it's a really smooth transition for you and isn't too stressful. :hugs:





Have you girls ever had that feeling where you just want to cry for no reason at all but you just have that urge where you need to cry? :rofl: I felt like that all day yesterday. I just kept feeling like I need to cry and that something was wrong with me. I haven't been keeping track of my cycle at all but today AF hit me like a brick. So I guess that explains it. All day yesterday I thought I was nuts. I wanted corey home so bad just to have someone to hug. :haha::blush: I hate hormones sometimes. 

In more exciting news I'm down to 186 lbs! :dance: I was doing so great until yesterday but again AF hit so that must be why the loss suddenly stopped. Yes, I'm still weighing myself every morning. I can't help it. :lol:


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## jelr

Spidey: I love the last one too, but there is definitely no point in wearing it if it is too fancy for the event or you will feel totally uncomfortable. Can you tell I love an excuse to dress up :haha:

You are so tiny, you can get away with any of them - so see if stuffing the boobs works on the first one and if not wear the 2nd as they are both lovely :thumbup:

Most of all have a great night out :thumbup:

Cleck: I hope the feeling of wanting to cry passes, I hate days like that and get them once a month but in the middle of the month for me and it is horrilble when you have no reason what so ever to cry, but at the same time feel like everything is a reason to cry :dohh:

Sorry girls I have no idea what to advise on the potty training either as you know our attempt didn't work, hopefully it is only temporary as they were both doing brilliantly :thumbup:

Shiv: Best of luck tomorrow, but you will do fine, it will probably take you a few days, but you will get your own little routine going.

Sorry to hear about Cora being sick though and I do wish I had some advice, but Natasha was a really dry baby so I never had to deal with that at all. It must be a worry though and not nice to clean up. I really hope the HV can give you some answers tomorrow.

Regarding your MIL - mmm I would definitely feel like not calling to her, but I probably would in the end as I would also feel too guilty, she definitely is in the wrong though. For a start you shouldn't have had to call and she definitely should have been in contact since. 

As for fashion - some of clothes would be very fashionable and some are not fashionable at all. I do try and keep up a little as my sister would be totally and utterly obsessed with fashion and I always feel like the plain Jayne if I don't make some sort of effort :haha: - but at the same time I will only wear and buy stuff that I like and not because it is in fashion, where as she would buy it just because it is in fashion even though she may not like it 100% - I also buy stuff that is not in fashion just because I like it too, where as she wouldn't dream of that :haha:

My work clothes are totally not in fashion as it is usually a black pants and some sort of smart top - mind you they have being boring me lately so I have been wearing loads of my smart casual dresses with black tights for a change, but now they feel like work clothes and not at home clothes :dohh:

Well not much news from me, I am cutting down to two days from this week as my hours are so bad, so that will be nice to have an extra day with Natasha, although we will miss the money, our savings are back up a bit and DH redundancy money should be through soon, so we will be fine for a while and hopefully things will pick back up. Although I really don't want to see all his redundancy money being used on bills and day to day things. It would be nice to save it for a while in case anything happens to his new job and all going well do something nice with it, but sure that is life aint it.

Feeling a bit crap today and it is not time of the month for me, I can't explain it, I don't actually miss or want a cigarette, but I do have a feeling like something is missing all the time. Last week I was putting it down to being on my detox and wanting food, but now that I'm eating normally again, it is still here and I'm back to snacking again, so I know it is cigarettes I'm missing.

I have been doing so well, but I really do wish this feeling would go away as it is really getting me down and this is going to sound really silly but I actually feel slightly depressed the last two days, how stupid is that. Maybe it is just the change of seasons or something and will pass, because I really hate feeling crappy like this and am trying my best to think positive but its not working :dohh: - At least when I feel like this with hormones I know it will pass. I guess that is what is getting to me, is that I'm afraid it won't pass, as I have a friend who stopped smoking 4 years ago and she says she still misses them. I would be really weak that way and would just end up smoking if I felt like this for 4 years :dohh:

Anyway enough whinging. I'm going to start temping just to see how I get on. I'm not going to take it too serious though and will probably forget to take my temp :haha:


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## cleckner04

Aww jelr I'm so sorry you are feeling down. :hugs: I can imagine quitting smoking after so long will have so many emotions running through you. Something IS missing in a way because you had that habit for so long. It's like you lost an old friend bc ciggies were there for you probably especially when you were stressed, angry, etc. I truly hope you don't feel this way for long. Do you have any hobbies that can keep your hands busy even when you are sitting? Something that can also take your mind off cigs a bit more. Like cross stitching or knitting or something like that? Probably a stupid suggestion but I don't really know what else to say. :blush::lol:


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## jelr

Thanks Cleck - no it is not a silly suggestion at all. I know another friend of mine that did cross stitch to keep her hands busy, but unfortunately I never really had an interest in anything like that and am not very good with detailed work as I don't have great dexterity in my hands.

I think that could be part of it, I have been so busy in work getting everything started back up for the new term and I have also been updating the assessment guidelines book that I compiled for the tutors a few years ago and I did this at night so that I wouldn't be away from Natasha anymore than three days and also to keep myself busy. Well I'm now finished that and work has slowed down so I don't really know what to do with myself and I'm off now until this day next week as I'm working Tuesday and Wednesday of next week.

Being busy has really helped, but it now feels like I have kind of stuck my head in the sand and not really thought about it where as I don't have much choice now :dohh: and I hate feeling like this when I should be thrilled that I have so much time to spend and enjoy with Natasha.

Oh well hopefully the weather won't be really rotten tomorrow and maybe we will get out for a walk and I can walk the frustration out of me :haha:

Thanks for listening and hopefully tomorrow will be a better day :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

Look at this old thread I just found. This will cheer us all up. :D 

https://www.babyandbump.com/photo-gallery/160643-lion-cubs-family-album.html


Although all my pictures have been removed because I went through photobucket and cleared it out. I still can't believe how teeny and cute all our lion cubs were!! Well, they are still all cute but there's nothing like little babies. :cloud9:


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## spidey

Shiv, I'm sorry about Cora and her spit up. Kira use spit up, but it wasn't severe and it never shot out of her mouth. I use to keep her upright in the Moby after she ate, but I can understand you wanting/needing to put her down after she feeds. Do you have a forceful letdown? I had a very forceful let down and it always caused her to gulp air in the beginning of a feed. I also had a fore milk imbalance that caused greenish frothy poos and spit up. Are her poops normal colored? I hope you can find a solution soon. Let us know how she does at her appointment tomorrow.

Oh, and Shiv... if it were me, I would NOT tell David's mom you were in town. But I'm a bitch like that and I don't feel remorse :haha: DH's mom who lives right next door couldn't get her ass over to see Kira but 3 times during her first 5 months. I refused to carry Kira over to her house to "force" a visit. As a grandmother there should be some effort on her part to see or ask about their grandchild. 

Yay Cleckner on more weight loss :happydance: I know what you feel about feeling the need to cry all day. I saw the picture on FB of Corey's ship. Did he just leave today? Maybe if you have a good cry it'll make you feel better. Watch some of those Baby Story shows on tv- those always do it for me :haha:

jelr, I hope you're having a better day. It's probably a combination of everything you said- the seasons changing, not smoking, and taking a pay cut. I'm sure you'll always miss cigarettes, but it won't be an all day thing. You'll miss them when everyone else is smoking or after a really stressful day. What days of the week will you work?

Thats a neat old thread to look at. I have all my pictures in iphoto and I like to skip back to see what I was doing 1 year ago, or 2 years ago. I take so many pictures that it's fun to bring back old memories.


The dinner went great!! I wore the first dress based on your opinions and it was perfect! There was another woman at the event with the same sweater/leggings combo so it's a good thing I didn't wear mine too! They actually prepared me a special gluten free meal too :thumbup: I couldn't get a great picture since I was running around until the last second, but you can get an idea of what I looked like. They had a photographer at the event so when the pictures go up I will share the link.


Spoiler
me with makeup on... I have no idea how to put makeup on, so I don't put on much in fear of looking like a clown :haha: I put 2 socks in each bra cup. I found an old nursing bra from when my boobs were a little bigger so it was easy to stuff :haha:
https://razortoe.com/share/dress/finaldress.jpg

afterwards at my parents house to pick up Kira. Doesn't DH look Amish here? Kira is saying "A BOO A BOO A BOO A BOO" (for booby)
https://razortoe.com/share/dress/after.jpg


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## cleckner04

spidey- DH has been gone since mid-september. :haha: His ship was out doing training exercises and than it went to san francisco for fleet week there. But that picture was them leaving san fran to come back here!! He'll be back tomorrow. :D 

Now the exciting bit. YOU LOOK AMAZING!!! I'm seriously jealous of your body. :haha: I like your subtle makeup. I'm always over the top with mine so I probably really do look like a clown at times. :lol: 
Talk about serious luck that you didn't wear the sweater and leggings!!! Your DH and you match really well too which I like. 
Yes, your husband does look slightly amish but he'd have a much longer beard by now cause you guys have been married a while. :D 
And lastly, I love Kiras cupcake pajamas!! Emma has the loose fitting version of that with the same pattern. LOVE it. Did she get really excited seeing your bigger boobs? :haha:


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## Mary Jo

*waves*

hey girls... sorry I went a bit weird last week, it was me being over-sensitive and silly. I should have come back and posted again later that day to explain but I haven't been in the mood to write much anywhere, and I owe PMs and emails all over the place (which I feel bad about, and need to get my arse in gear and do something about).

it wasn't anything any of you said, though. maybe a little bit of me being worried about being a whining whinger and you all getting sick of it. my head is in a bad bad place much of the time, I feel stuck and fed up and stressed and anxious, I have had thought of putting the baby up for adoption, leaving Chris, taking Adam to live by myself... walking out on everything other than Adam. I would never do that, I don't *want* to but sometimes I think they'd all be better off if I just plain was not here. I don't feel like this all the time, just when things are going badly. I had another argument with Chris last night (will explain more about it later, as it's an issue I'd like views on) and I am just fed up of him not seeming to care about my opinions and not having *any* patience with me when I am upset. it's almost as though he sees it as a direct attack on himself that I am upset. he doesn't understand and it seems he will not try.

anyway. I'll come back to that.

Spidey, you looked beautiful in your dress, stuffing and all. :) I loved all the outfits, you really have the sort of figure that can carry off so many different styles. lucky lady. looking forward to seeing more pics.

cleck, I loved looking at your HS photos, too. :D you and Corey made (and still do make) a very good-looking couple. I can't imagine getting married that young, though, but then I was all messed up through school and university and never even had a boyfriend till I was 22. :haha: speaking of which, Chris and I have been together for 5 years on Friday (I was 32 when we met). it's hard to believe sometimes. he hasn't changed much, he's never been that good at understanding me, but I think I was more resilient to it in the past. good on you for the continued weight-loss and getting back on track. it's so easy not to and to let it slide. 

Shiv, so sorry to hear Cora has been having sick issues. poor little bub. does she seem like she is in pain? I really hope you can get it sorted out fast, it sounds so distressing for you. :hugs: as for your weightloss, well I can but sit here and be green with envy. got a feeling I am going to be close to 12st *after* delivering baby. meh. it's my own fault, I have not been restrained in the slightest. and as for your in-laws, gah. I would be extremely sorely tempted to forget they were three miles away and just go see your parents. would David be angry? how does he feel about their lack of attention to Sophia and Cora? I empathise, though, as I will explain below. I have something similar with members of C's family who seem to expect us to do the running. only this time round I am going to refuse to. they want to see the baby, they get off their arses. 

Jean, ack, I'm sorry you're also feeling down, but you're right in that the loss of the cigs *is* a loss, it's a loss of your routine, the loss of something to look forward to. I hope you're really proud of yourself, it's brilliant what you've done, but even when you *know* that it doesn't always make your feelings catch up right away. it sounds very like the type of conflicted feelings I had when I stopped drinking. I was very proud of myself, and I appreciated not being a worry to people, and I didn't miss the bad side-effects (I used to go into physical withdrawal when I didn't drink, uncontrollable vomiting, shaking, sweating, hallucinations, the lot) but I did miss the way it was before it all went really bad, when it was something to look forward to, enjoy, my way to wind down and sleep, the sense of ease I would get. and I have to be honest, there's not really anything that replaces it, but I did get used to it and it got to the point (thank goodness else I'd still be drinking) that the memory of how it was in the end months is way more powerful than the rose-tinted memories of when it worked. but a period of depression and feeling low about the loss is normal when you make a big change in your life. that alongside the changes in your job/work makes it not surprising to me at all that you feel this way. massive big hugs. I really hope you can find the positives and focus on those (listen to me, I should take my own advice :haha: ).

so... as for me... 39 weeks today. telling myself I have another 19 days (I'd be induced at 40+12). I don't feel too bad about it, but envious when I see people due after me having their babies already (apart from ones who have been induced, I don't envy those). it's only going to get worse because I am certain I'll go overdue. please god not so much as 12 days, but I won't be surprised if I make 41 weeks. :( haven't even been trying anything to encourage things along. other than drinking RLT, but I know that only strengthens the uterus. have hardly even been bouncing on the gym ball. 

baby has quietened down a lot the past couple of days, I have no idea if there is a problem, wondering about going to get checked as I am not seeing anyone till Monday. hopefully he has just shifted to a better position and I am not getting kicked all out front. but it's always a worry. he is still moving, but I have had my doppler out two or three times after never using it in months. the midwife I saw last Thursday (the one who referred me for a psychiatric evaluation) said something about a sweep if I hadn't had the baby by next Thur, which is when my next appt is with her (Monday is the community mw). I will be 40+1 and I think policy is to offer one at 41 weeks, but I don't know, I had the feeling she might take a peek and see if I am at all favourable for one. kind of hope she does because I'd like to know what's going on. I understand why they don't do these internal checks as standard, but it doesn't stop me being curious.

have got a lot of stretchmarks now. noticed them last week. with Adam I only had a few and didn't notice them at all till my belly started going down. those ones are in 2 small patches either side of my bellybutton. the new ones are not dark red or big, but they are higher up, also either side of my bellybutton. and they are itchy and the skin feels so tight. I wasn't certain they were definitely stretchmarks, thought they might be broken veins, but when I squeeze the skin I can see it puckers up. so I think it's going to be a bit of a mess. oh well. I shouldn't feel down about it, since it's not like I have worn a bikini since I was 3 years old, and I have had no plans to ever again, but... gah. wondering if it is because I have barely used Bio-Oil this time. last time I put it on every day, sometimes more than once, because it was what I used as an agent for my doppler, and because Adam was a bit of a slug in utero, I listened every day, or almost every day. this time because baby is (or was) a busy bee, I didn't bother much after about 13-14 weeks. :hissy:

my mum is still here and doing a brilliant job as a nanny. :haha: Sunday and Monday she took him out for much of the day, yesterday he went to his other grandmother's, and today they have gone out together again. she is finding all the walking with the pushchair is helping her back pain a lot, so I don't feel *too* bad. I miss Adam, though, yesterday he really was out all day, from 6.50am till 8pm. I hate that he seems to favour my mum and Chris over me, and I hate that when I do things with him, when he tantrums I still can't cope. even if I have not looked after him all day I still cannot cope. it's pretty pathetic.

anyway. the thing I wanted opinions on - it's about C's mother, who, as I have said before, is a childminder. she has really not spent much time with Adam - ever - she has now had him for 2 whole days, and once she babysat him for three hours (in January). other than that, she has never been one to come over and visit, we have been the ones to get in the car and go over. I thought with us moving a bit closer things would be easier, and I guess they are in a way (it's a 1/2 hour drive not a 1hr+ drive) but it hasn't made much real difference. anyway. she had Adam for the first time for a day at the beginning of Sept. I was offered a last-minute shift at work and C rang to see if she could have him. whether she can depends on how many other kids she has booked that day and whether or not she has someone to help her, as there are rules about the number of kids to adults. she took him and it all was fine. she said at the time that she'd love to have him again. and we started thinking that it might be a good idea to see if she could have him once a week or every other week for a day once the baby is here. then she went on holiday and only got back at the weekend. when she spoke to C, he mentioned seeing if she could have him, and she suggested yesterday. I was supposed to be taking him for lunch out (I was meeting with Pippin, joeyjo and Aunty E) but decided it might be better if I went alone as he'd also be seeing his cousins (who are looked after by C's mum a few days a week each and were due to be there). so I said ok, and off he went. 

the argument I had with C later - I don't know whether I am being unreasonable or he is... on the one hand I would like him to go over there for the odd day, even if it is a regular arrangement. however, C wants us to pay his mother her regular daily rate. she is of course running a business, and it would be unfair on us to suggest she takes a child for nothing when she could have a paid for child. she didn't want paying for yesterday, we paid her about 1/2 her rate when he went in Sept (even though again she said she didn't want paying, but since it was because I was working, she agreed. C's sisters pay her but again it is because they are working. she has them for nothing on other days when they need helping out). 

I have a couple of issues with this. the biggest one is that I just don't feel it is right for the only contact Adam has with his grandmother is paid for. C says it's because she works full time and when else would she see them, but what about other grandparents who work and want to see their grandchildren? they find time in the evenings and at weekends, or they take time during their holidays (C's mother goes abroad every chance she gets). I also don't think it's right that it's the only time he sees his cousins. again, what's wrong with C making plans at weekends to see them? the cost is an issue, she charges £56 a day. that is close to half my maternity allowance, and I don't think I want to pay that every week. I don't know how it compares to other childminders, but I would guess it is on the higher end as his mum lives in a pretty affluent part of London (in a council house, they aren't wealthy) and looks after the kids of GPs and other professionals, etc. for Adam to go over there for the day, we need to get him up at 6am to leave about 6.45am to be there in time for C to get to work on time, and then he wouldn't be home till at least 7pm (they were later last night because they stayed for dinner). it's a long day away from me. and I am not sure that if we are going to pay for child care it's how I want it to be. I have thought maybe it would work better for me to find a local childminder who could have Adam for maybe 2 mornings or 2 afternoons a week. I could take him there and pick him up, he'd be closer to home, etc. It just doesn't sit well with me that he is never getting one to one time with his grandmother because there are 5-6 kids being minded by her. I'd rather she made the effort to come and see him, or offer to take him out on her days off - she doesnt have kids on Fridays, but she is also a registrar who marries people, but she tells me she won't be so busy with Friday weddings now we're past the summer busy period. but I have the feeling that if I sit here and wait for her to offer to have him one Friday, I'll be waiting a long time. :(

I don't know. am I being unreasonable? it's not that I expect free childcare, but that I resent it's likely going to be the only time he sees her and his cousins, and I think that should be done because you want to and from love not through a business transaction. the fact of the cost being pretty high *is* an issue but not the biggest one. I was saying to C last night that I'd sooner take the £56 a day and take Adam places myself. and I'd definitely rather it was more flexible and I paid that to get a couple of mornings or afternoons locally, rather than a full - and very long - day. C was antagonistic when I suggested this, though, doesn't want him going to a stranger (grrr) and isn't thinking of what might work better for me. I said - whose benefit is this for? he said yours. ok, I said, so a whole single day mightn't suit me as well as 2 half days. also Adam's, as he can spend time with his cousins. but I am annoyed by this, we shouldn't have to pay for him to see his cousins, ffs!

I have a strong feeling I will not win this, unless I put my foot down and say no, he's not going over there again. which would be cutting off my nose to spite my face. but I am hacked off that there is no discussion about it. C thinks we can afford it so it's fine. I think I'd rather spend the money elsewhere and Adam see his family regularly in a non-payment scenario. :hissy:

gah. I don't need more stress but bam, my husband does seem to like adding to it.


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## Shiv

Sorry you girls are feeling fed up - I can honestly say that each and evry one of you has a VERY good reason for not feeling on top of the world. (Apart from you Spidey, you're a skinny biatch who has a big night out to look forward to :haha:)

Jean - it is normal to feel depressed when giving up smoking, my mum certainly did. It is like losing a friend and a past time all rolled in to one. It will get easier, but don't beat yourself up about feeling a bit lost, it is understandable. Perhaps start to plan what you are going to spend your saved up money on. Maybe mak eit something that will be improved by giving up smoking. Maybe a facial as it is supposed to improve your skin etc. I think you should be really proud of yourself :thumbup:

Cleck - I can certainly say that when David was away I often had days where I didn't just feel like crying but did cry. I find crying to be quite therapeutic. I hope you feel better soon. And well done on your weightloss :thumbup:

MJ - not long to go now until Joel will be here and things will seem brighter. I am glad your mum is being such a help with Adam. Try not to feel bad about Adam seemingly prefering her, he doesn't, it is just that I am sure with your mum it is all about Adam and funand games. It can't be like that when you are a mum as life must go on. He loves you more than your mum and if she were to take Adam away for a few days and he didn;t see you then you would soon see that you are his number 1 :thumbup:

I will reply about the MiL issue later as I have to go and finish dinner now. I will also update about my first day with 2 children to look after, if I survive long enough to reply again :haha:


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## cleckner04

MJ- You can moan and whine on here as much as your heart desires! Sometimes I feel like I whine way too much on here too. But we've all gotten to know eachother over the years and it's a safe place with very little judgement so that's the great thing about this group. :hugs: I'm very sorry that you've been feeling so down in this pregnancy. :(:hugs:

The MIL issue. I completely agree with you on this one. I think it's very unfair that the only way you can get C's mom to spend time with Adam is through a business transaction. Especially because she'll be having to split her time between all the kids she watches so Adam really isn't getting the special grandma/adam time that he deserves. It really does seem wrong that you'd be paying her for it too. I really don't know what to suggest in this situation but I really hope C stops being so unreasonable. You two seem to both have very strong personalities and opinions so that's what makes you butt heads. I really hope you guys can come to a good compromise. :hugs::hugs: 

Is your bump bigger with this baby than last? Do you have pictures to compare? I'm sure that's why the new stretchies are cropping up. Or maybe this baby is positioned in a different spot than Adam. As you know, my stretchies were AWFUL. Like there really wasn't a spot on my tummy that wasn't affected. But now that I'm losing the weight off, the stretchies are nearly 100% faded. Although now my belly looks like a deflated sack but that's another problem altogether. :haha: I'm sure you'll drop the weight off pretty quickly and those stretchies will fade with it. :flower: 

Also, yay for 39 weeks!!! :dance: I can't believe you are almost done already!! All of your pregnancies seem to fly by! Hopefully you don't have to go all the way to 41 weeks.


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## spidey

LOL about me being a skinny bitch. A skinny bitch with fake boobs! Here are the pictures from the event: https://www.katrinakrauss.com/ click on 2011 community safety awards. Nothing too interesting, but you can see how fancy it was. There is a picture of DH with his boss.

Shiv, I can't wait to hear how your adventure was today! Kira is being very stubborn and naughty today so if I had a newborn I would be going bonkers!

MJ, I'm so glad you posted. I'm sorry that everything seems to be crashing in around you :hugs: We've all had bad days/ weeks/ months, so don't feel like your posts will be too whiney. It really helps when you get things out and that's why it's nice having you girls here to vent too. Have you started taking your SSRI yet, or are you holding off. You know, you don't have to be a hero and not take a drug that your body needs to get balanced again :hugs: 

In regards to your inlaws... I don't think you're crazy with how you see the situation. If I was in your situation, I would expect my MIL to spend some time with Kira without pay. So either for a few hours during the week, or for a half-day on the weekend. If it were a constant thing, like full time every Wednesday, Thursday and Friday, I would be okay with paying a little bit of money, but not full price. I don't know- I just think that grandma's should want to spend some time with their grand kids without being compensated for it. Or maybe I'm just cheap :lol: My mom watches Kira 15 hours/ week for free, but if she needed extra money, I wouldn't feel weird giving her some pay. My MIL has told me that she'll babysit Kira with pay, which has always turned me off. I think sending Adam to daycare a few mornings or afternoons/ week is a good idea. It would be great for him to be in a different environment and good for you too. You could catch a nap with Joel, or just have 1 baby to look after for a few hours. Sometimes we just need a few hours away to refresh our minds and re-energize.


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## cleckner04

spidey- I love that everyone is in some kind of uniform when scrolling through the pictures, and than theres your DH. :haha:


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## spidey

I noticed that too :lol: I think he needs a uniform and a gun... or atleast a taser! He deals with a lot of crazies.

Look at this mess... I got a positive opk on October 8th and 9th. The 9th gave me a very dark positive too.

https://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/3839e1


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## Shiv

You look great Spidey and your make-up is perfect. I am often clown like i fear!

Right MJ - I think it is ridiculous that the only time your MIL sees Adam is if she is being paid. C is being unreasonable because it his mum you are dealing with. Perhaps you could suggest that you should be paying your mum an hourly rate while she is down withyou as she is helping so much. I am guessing C wouldn't be up for that suggestion so it might make him see sense! 

If however Adam is going to go to your MIL regularly for a full day of childcare then I suppose it is kinda fair that she gets paid (as she will lose out on income from not having another child) expecting you to pay such extortionate rates is though ridiculous. And even if Adam did go regularly she should still be seeing him on her days off as he is her grandson and should be wanting one on one time with him.

If I were you I would rather put Adam in nursery/preschool a couple of mornings a week so it is convenient for you and no doubt cheaper as well. he would get to mix with a large range of other children and would have a great time. It will be scary leaving him with "strangers" to start with but I bet he would settle in quick and it will be good preparation for pre-school in a years time.

As for my MIL - she works funnyshifts so has always struggled to see as much of Sophia as my parents (who are oth retired) - when we lived 10 miles away she would see Sophia about once every two weeks for a couple of hours. Which was plenty for me! I am just put out about her "allowing" us to go and visit her with a 3 day old baby. My mum is FURIOUS with her as she feels she should have come to us.

David has not mentioned telling his mum that we will be down there on Sunday so I am just leaving it to him, if he doesn't tell her then it is his fault!

The Health visitor came today and refused to weigh Cora :dohh: She said it would be too early to tell if her sick issue was afecting her weight gain so I would have to wait another week. Ridiculous!

So today was my first day alone with both girls. It had good and bad points. If Cora didn't have the issues with vomiting then I think it would have been a breeze. But she wouldn't settle at all this morning after we were up and about so I had to have her in the sling, which is a bit restricting for playing with Sophia in. She wanted to feed frequently which has me sat down, and then I have to wind her for ages and then keep her upright, so Sophia was getting quite frustrated. Then just as I was getting really rather stressed, Cora vomited ALL over me! I could have cried. I couldn't put her down to get my clothes off for fear she would be sick again, so I just had to sit there for half an hour with Sophia getting more agitated and Cora feeding and being winded! Not fun. Luckily Cora then fell asleep, and I managed to get her down in her basket, and then get Sophia down for a nap. So I got undressed (put my PJ's on) and went to bed. Sophia napped for 90 minutes and Cora slept for 4 and a half hours :happydance: So I got to have a rest (although didn't sleep as I am constantly listening for Cora being sick) and then spend a couple of hours playing with Sophia before dinner.

SOOOOOOOOO morning was horrendous but afternoon was better!

I forgot to tell you guys that I woke David up last night to change Cora's nappy before I fed her (I was going to leave him as he had work, but he is literally up for 5 minutes then goes back to sleep where as I am up for 2 hours, so I thought stuff it, I'll wake him) anyway he changed her and I fed her and put her down. A couple of hours later i could hear her struggling to have a poo in her basket, she did an almighty fart/poo and usually she would re-settle but she didn't. So I got her up to change her nappy and feed her. When i went to get her she was absolutely soaked through all up her back and legs etc. Turns out David had been so tired that her forgot to put a nappy on her :dohh: More washing:dohh:


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## Shiv

Oh and i had my 2 week post partum weigh in this morning.

1 week pp= 10st 6.5lbs
2 week pp= 10st 3lbs

:happydance:

And i am not doing ANYTHING to lose weight, I am eating so much rubbish. i guess blood loss, night sweats and breastfeeding are all helping!

i would like to be down to 10 stone by 6 weeks post partum. It took me until the following february to get down to that after Sophia.


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## Shiv

oh and here is my 2 week post partum photo. (and my 1 week so I can compare -2 week is flowery bra)

and MJ - I got tonnes of new stretch marks this time. Last time I had about two on each hip, and now I have them all over my tummy. I am gonna have a saggy tummy for sure!

try not to beat yourself up about any weight gain, you'll lose it afterwards no worries.
 



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## spidey

Shiv, you're really losing the belly weight fast :thumbup: I like your bra- is that a new one? It sounds like you've been busy with poo for the last 24 hours :haha: That's really funny that David forgot to put on a new diaper- what a mess!! Did the HV say anything about Cora being sick? Based on mothers intuition you know something isn't right so I hope they're going to take this seriously. It's ridiculous that Cora wasn't weighed :growlmad:

Cleckner, I've been meaning to ask about Emma's bf cutback. Is she still only feeding a couple times a day or is she back to full on booby? Kira's been such a booby hog these days. I must have jinxed myself when I bragged how Kira was only feeding 2X a day :haha: Today I had to say no when I was putting away groceries, cooking dinner and then eating dinner. She screamed the entire time. It was atleast 45 minutes of screaming. I really don't mind bf, but a week of hearing nothing but "A BOO A BOO A BOO" gets to me.


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## jelr

Cleck: I didn't have any photos in the thread because I'm so paranoid about photos of Natasha on the web :haha: - but I really did enjoy looking at them, most of the babies still have the same facial features as they do today, where as I think Natasha is totally different then when she was born. 

I'm so bad though as some of the girls on it I don't remember at all :nope: - Funny looking at some of the ciggys though, some have married or are expecting since. - It has made me really broody also :haha:

Well done on the weightloss, you really have done so brilliantly with it. Hope your enjoying DH being back.

Spidey: You look absolutely amazing, The dress is perfect on you, fake boobs and all :haha: - I love your hair like that and your make up is so natural, I definitely over do my make up and not only look clown like, but also as If I have applied pollyfiller it can be so thick :haha: Your DH looks so proud in the photo with his boss, which he should be :thumbup:

I wish I could help you on your chart, but I am totally new to this as well, it does look all over the place, although I have a funny feeling mine will be the same as my thermometer is only an ordinary one and it is C (not sure if that makes a difference) - I must look for a bbt one next time I'm in town. I do forget to take my temp at the same time every morning too :dohh:

Shiv: Oh God you really are getting a rough time with poo lately aren't you. I'm sorry but the no nappy and your other two poo emergencies that I read on fb did make me laugh, although I'm sure it hasn't been so much fun for you. Sophia waving her poo hands at David really made me laugh though as isn't he freaked out by poo or was that somebody else?

That really is stupid that the hv wouldn't weigh Cora. Has the sick settled down any? I think you are doing the right thing, if David doesn't let his mum know, well it's certainly not your job too and you don't have the responsibility of feeling guilty then :haha:

you look fantastic, you will be back to pre-pregnancy weight in no time - I would love your secret :haha:

MJ: big :hugs: - I'm so so sorry you have felt so bad that everyone would be better without you, you do know deep down that they wouldn't be and this is only the hormones and depression making you think that way. I would maybe think about taking the medication if it does continue to be that bad and I don't think at this stage you would be taking it long enough to effect Joel. You have been so strong to put up with this for so long. I'm only feeling down for a week or so and hate it, you have put up with this for months, so I really do admire you.

I do agree with you on C's mother also. I have no problem with the payment (although it is extremely high) if it was a regular thing and she was also making an effort to see Adam outside of the arrangement. I do pay my mam for minding Natasha when I work, but when DH was out of work, she wouldn't take any money from us and if we are out for a night, she takes her overnight without a penny and would and has dropped everything just to mind Natasha if I needed or wanted to go or do anything and C's mum should be the same and want to spend time with her grandchild.

I think I would definitely send Adam somewhere else that is cheaper out of principle number 1 and because financially it makes more sense for him to get a few days for the same money as you would pay C's mum for 1 day.

Oh and don't you dare worry about whining in here, we are all friends now and thats what friends are for. Believe me if I keep feeling like this that is all I will do, I will be the biggest whinger going let me tell you :haha:

Thanks for all the understanding and advise girls - I really do appreciate it :thumbup: - I do feel exactly the way you all explained and I hate it. I don't actually have a craving to have a cigarette, but it is like everything seems boring without them and I just feel miserable, which really is ridiculous and I feel so stupid and I feel bad because I hate that I'm feeling this way when I'm off with Natasha rather than enjoying the time with her.

It is is different to when I gave up when I was pregnant - the last pregnancy I was only off them a few weeks as I did start smoking once I started to bleed as I knew it was over and on the two pregnancies before that I did actually wish them away and I just tried to keep myself as busy to make the time go quicker (which I know is bad and partly why I wanted to be off them before I fall pregnant this time) - but I think I always knew I would smoke after i had Natasha so it only felt like it temporary, where as this time it is for good, so there is no wishing the time away, although I do find I'm wishing the time away until this feeling passes and I really really hate that I'm wishing Natasha's life away :nope:

I'm also terrified about piling on the weight as I do struggle so hard to get rid of it and the more weight I put on the less fertile I am with the pcos - again it seemed okay to put it on when pregnant, but now that this is a life time choice I don't want to keep eating instead of smoking, but don't know how to stop myself, because I'm staving all the time and it feels like I need to treat myself with crap instead of cigarettes :dohh:

I have done a lot of reading tonight and a lot of the stuff says depression comes before acceptance with quitting so hopefully that will happen soon because I'm really no good for this, I'm such a fixer and just want to fix myself at the moment, but don't know how too.

I'm thinking strongly about trying hypnotism to take away the contstant want and bad feeling and just to feel like I'm doing something to move this all along. I just feel life is too short and precious to be wasting it feeling miserable like I do at the moment :dohh: - I'm not doing too badly during the day, but have ended up in tears to DH the last few evenings. - but at the same time I don't want to waste money either if it doesn't work as I'm a bit sceptical.

Saving the money was a huge incentive, and the plan was to actually put it buy for a big expensive holiday in disneyland paris for a few weeks during peak time when it is warm and right in the most expensive hotel on the resort, but I won't be able to do that now as I'm actually down 200 a week than when I finished in June, so the 60 a week that I save on smoking will make up for some of what I'm down and will probably be used for day to day stuff :dohh:

Anyway enough whining from me - sorry girls for bending your ears, but I actually just feel better by getting it all out, even though I feel really silly letting stupid little cancerous smelly cigarettes take up so much space in my head :dohh:

Anyway has anybody any nice plans for the weekend? - We were meant to be heading out to dinner for my friends birthday, but the poor thing has come down with shingles, so it is cancelled, DH has talked me into us going for dinner anyway to cheer me up. I'm not so sure as we have DH's sister's 50th party next weekend, so Natasha will be in my mams again. Everything always comes together for us, we don't go out for months and then it all comes together. I will probably end up agreeing with him though as he does like to go out to dinner every now and again and he has had a lot to put up with from me this week :haha: and I do see his point, it is not like Natasha is missing out on time with us as she will be asleep anyway and loves sleeping in my mams - I do still feel guilthy though :dohh:

Well have a good weekend, whatever you do girls. Xx


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## cleckner04

jelr- I think hypnotism is a really good idea. Especially because you are already quitting. So you have the first hurdle accomplished. So I bet they can help take the edge off. I've also heard acupuncture can help smokers quit as well. I've always wondered about both for weight loss too. Cause I can do the weightloss but the hardest part is having the constant willpower to stay away from crap. My friend who quit smoking did end up gaining like 40 lbs from it because she was replacing the ciggies with food. Not good. But I can see how it's easy to fall into that pattern. Maybe have suckers(lollies) at hand instead? Something to keep your mouth occupied but isn't super high in calories. 

Well DH has been home since yesterday but we really haven't spent much time together because he was working nights while out to sea so now he is getting himself switched back to days and by the time he gets home from work he just sleeps. :( He's napping right now as I type this. But hopefully he'll be good as new by next week. We are planning on driving to L.A. this weekend to knock out some more things on my list of things to see there for our 2011 vacation. We are gonna split the vacation up over weekends since he doesn't really want to take vacation days when we are moving soon. I'm thinking I want to just drive early in the morning to L.A. and than see as much as we can, and than drive home in the same day. It's a 2 hour drive so not too bad and it would save us $60-$100 for hotel costs. I'm not sure how it'll go over but I think that's the plan. Money is tight obviously with our move coming up but I really don't want to NOT see L.A. when we live so close IYKWIM. I don't think we'll ever be this way again so it's our only chance.


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## spidey

jelr, I also vote for giving hypnotism a try to help you with those feelings of loss. You all know I did hypnosis for Kira's birth and it worked wonderfully :thumbup: I'm a fixer too, so I know what you mean. You have to keep pushing through each day and I promise it'll get easier, and don't feel guilty about wishing away time. Your brain has gotten use to the nicotine and now your body needs to re-adjust itself so you can shake those cravings and learn to feel good without the use of nicotine. It's a really powerful brain altering chemical.

No real plans for the weekend. DH and my dad will be working on the deck and my mom and I will entertain Kira. The weather will be really nice here so maybe we'll go to the park :thumbup:

My nips are getting less sore, so I think I'm out this month already. I have a feeling my LP will be really short this time, and not like the whopping 14 days last cycle :haha:


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## spidey

How was everyone's weekend? 

Does anyone want to hear me whine? :lol: I'm hoping that by telling you girls I'll stop driving myself absolutely crazy. I'm having my midlife crisis and having anxiety about getting diseases and dying. So I have a life insurance man coming on Wednesday to sell us life insurance :haha: and I already had my pap smear to check for cervical cancer and on Tuesday I have a skin cancer screening. The skin cancer screening has been freaking me out more than I expected. I am covered head to toe in moles and I've never had them looked at before. I haven't seen any changes in them, but a few meet some of the "warning" signs for melanoma. My Grandfathers half sister's daughter has melanoma which has spread everywhere and she's only in her 40's. I met her at my Aunt's funeral (who was my Grandfather's other half sister) and it really tore my heart out knowing she's fighting a battle that she's never going to win :cry: I have a feeling the dermatologist will want me to come back to have some biopsied or removed. I'm so scared. Ugh, I wish I could stop obsessing about it. And the stupidest thing is I'm mad at myself for not buying life insurance before all this mole stuff, so now when I die I'll leave DH and Kira without any money to help with bills :dohh: My head is in a strange place right now and I'm hoping it's just temporary from pms hormones, but whatever it is I can't get out of it. So everyone wish me luck on Tuesday.


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## Shiv

Spidey - big hugs, I hope it is just hormones that is making yu freak out about your health. Hope the skin screening goes well, let us know x

jelr - how are you feeling now?

Cleck- and you, I hope you are brighter now corey is back home.

Not much new to report here. Cora slept from 10pm til 7am last night, i of course was awake waiting for her wanting to feed!


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## cleckner04

Popping in taking a break from cleaning. I've been a very bad mommy today. I've been packing the past two days and I was busy packing away this morning too when I suddenly remembered the apartment people are coming to inspect our apartment today to start the process of our move. They are going to tell us what needs replaced, etc. So since I was packing, the house was DESTROYED because I make it worse before it gets packed IYKWIM. Well I remembered and started freaking out rushing around and Emma must've sensed something was up because when I went upstairs she screamed her head off downstairs and continued to scream for at least 45 minutes. She was just laying on the bottom of the stairs throwing herself around screaming. :roll: So the bad mommy part was me ignoring her while I rushed around and than I just couldn't take it anymore so I told her to "STOP CRYING!!!". It didn't work. :rofl: She eventually came upstairs and I hugged her and told her I have to clean and I can't play right now. I told her to go down and watch spongebob but instead she sat and played with her barbie on the floor while I scurried around finishing some packing and rehanging clothes that we are keeping out to go with us. Now my downstairs and upstairs and completely clean except the floors. They need swept and I'm gonna mop. But I needed a break. :coffee: I swear I typically have a completely clean house but since DH has been home it's been pretty chaotic. We have so much that needs done like renting a storage unit and canceling some services like netflix, etc. And my jeep needs work done so DH has been scrambling out in the garage trying to fix it up more since I'll be home in the winter months. AHHH!! And we knew we wanted to throw a halloween party for the neighborhood people but we thought we would throw it the day before halloween. So I thought we had a few weeks to plan still. Well turns out V has a wedding to be at that weekend so now we are having the party THIS friday. :dohh: So I'm also scrambling around planning a party because no one else has taken charge so I'm the one buying everything. :wacko: I bought plates, napkins, forks, spoons, and decorations for $38. So not TOO bad so far but I know it's just the beginning because no one has volunteered for food either so I think that falls on my shoulders yet again. I hate being nice sometimes because we get taken advantage of. But the party is in my garage/yard so I guess that technically makes us the host but it was a joint idea so doesn't seem very fair. :shrug:

Okay, enough of my rambling. 

spidey- Big hugs hun. :hugs::hugs: I hope everything checks out okay and you are worrying for nothing. :hugs: I worry about skin cancer a lot myself with my fair skin and countless sunburns. 

shiv- Yay for Cora sleeping so long!! :dance: That's better than Emma some nights still. :haha:


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## spidey

so all went well at my skin cancer screen :happydance: She said all my moles looked good :thumbup: I'm still feeling uneasy and paranoid about life but it has to be from pms. I watched a show last night about a family that was murdered in their house and I stayed up late researching alarm systems :dohh:

Cleckner, you should call your neighbors and say "so what did you say you were going to bring to the party?" :haha: I've been a bad mommy too and let Kira scream while I did other things. Saying "stop crying" doesn't work :lol: How is Emma doing on the booby now?

Shiv, how did Cora sleep last night? I hope you got another nice stretch of sleep :thumbup:

jelr, how are the cravings for cigarettes now? I hope you're feeling better day by day.


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## cleckner04

I'm so glad everything is fine with your moles!! :dance: You seem to definitely be going through some hormones with all this panicking. You'll be fine. Everyone is safe. :hugs::hugs: 

Well over the weekend and monday Emma only had booby twice a day. Nighttime and morning right after waking. Today will be 3 times by the end of the day because she needed it for her nap today. Over the weekend she napped in the car and yesterday she napped in the car so that's what cut them out. It's kind of great because she really doesn't ask for it anymore. I think she realized I meant it when I said 'booby for sleepy time only'. :lol: It actually hit me today how little she has wanted booby lately. Kind of sad but it does make me realize the end could be near eventually, when before I thought there is no way she'll ever quit. :haha:

You are totally right. Saying 'stop crying' really doesn't help. I wish it did. Emma has been very grumpy at times. She has to have things exactly the way she wants or she freaks out. Like she'll want to wear shoes but if I grab the wrong pair she FREAKS out. Or if she wants to put her pants on by herself she gets mad if I try to help. It's really hard to deal with at times. I'll get her an apple but she wants the other apple. Just stupid things like that. She gets these ideas in her head and just won't let it go. :rofl: She has a minnie mouse nap mat that is a blanket attached to a mat. Anyways, I keep it downstairs so she can lay down and watch her shows if she wants in the day because she was always taking our rugs and using them as blankets. :dohh: Well she got it in her head the other day for her nap that she HAD to have that nap mat to sleep with. I offered several blankets but none of them were good enough. And she wouldn't go downstairs to get the minnie blanket herself, she would rather just sit there and scream at the top of her lungs. :dohh: I finally just gave in and got it for her but I feel like me giving in is just going to turn her into an even bigger brat. :shrug: I'm clueless about how to parent her sometimes now. She's very stubborn. 


Oh I meant to say we spent all day at LA on saturday and she didn't have a single accident. We brought the little potty and any time we were close to a bathroom we'd ask if she has to go. She refused all morning but finally at one museum she went. Than she went again later in the jeep right after we ate dinner. I just sit the potty on the front seat and she goes there. :haha: But all that victory was short lived because we went out yesterday looking for halloween party supplies and stopped at Kmart and while she was playing with a toy in the toy section she peed her pants. It was a giant puddle too. I freaked out a bit and yelled across the store for Corey. :rofl: In the second that I turned my head to yell for corey, Emma slipped in her own pee and was basically on the floor rolling in it. :dohh::sick::rofl: I was panicking. DH came running and saw what happened and he found someone that works there to let them know about it. I took Emma out to the jeep and changed her pants but I only brought pants and not a top because I didn't think she'd need a new top when having a pee accident. I guess I didn't consider the fact that she may roll in it. :rofl:


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## spidey

oh wow, I might have to do the booby is for sleepy time rule too. That's how I cut back on the pacifier and it worked well. Once I make the rule I need to stick with it though. The only booby session she would really miss is when I get home from work. So I could make my booby rule a little more complex- booby for sleepy time AND when mommy gets home from work :haha: 

Emma and Kira sound sooo much alike! Kira is so stubborn and very particular. She has her quirks and sometimes I don't have patience for it. Her big thing is to collect random objects and squirrel them away on the sofa. So my couch has become a collection zone for sticks, rocks, rugs, toilet rolls, dirty laundry, towels... and when she's tired she needs everything arranged just right before she'll get her booby and fall asleep.  Most of the time she makes me put everything on the couch and she orders me around and whines. If I tell her to do it herself, she hysterically cries. She doesn't have a single "favorite" object, so she needs these huge collections before she falls asleep.

Congrats on the potty success!!! Kira has had no accidents for the last 2 days. She's been pooping only once every 4-5 days, so during the last poop she was standing next to the potty and I got her on in time. She also stopped holding her pee, and now goes 8+ times a day versus 3. And tonight is her first night in panties!! All in all, I feel like we're finally headed in the right direction and she seems to like her potty now :thumbup: We do the same thing with the potty chair when we're out. It sits on the car's seat :haha: Kira is very resistant to peeing while we're out even in her own potty, so she just holds it (and makes mommy very nervous!). 

LOL, I found this picture from a few weeks ago. Thats me BF Kira (in a green dress) under that pile :rofl: All those items were chosen and arranged in a very particular way by Kira's ordering. Gosh, what did I do to raise such a silly spoiled girl?!!

https://www.razortoe.com/share/nap.jpg


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## cleckner04

:rofl: at that picture. That's so cute that she hoards everything together. But definitely something that would be tiring after a while. 
I'm so glad Emma isn't the only odd child. :haha: Kira and her always seem so similar with things! Emma changes what her favorite thing is by the week. This week it's her barbies. She has to have them when we go upstairs and has to have them when we go down. So I am constantly hauling them up and down. She bathes with them and everything. :dohh: And if I forget one, she knows and won't let it go. 
Are they spoiled or is this normal behavior? I worry so much that I'm turning Emma into a spoiled brat. I try my best not to give in to her in these unreasonable moments but she can seriously scream and cry for hours if I let her. :wacko: 

Emma wore panties for the first time today!! She did good with it playing with her little friend from across the street. What kind of panties did you get kira? Emma's are minnie mouse and hello kitty. :haha: It's so weird leaving the house and not really needing a diaper bag anymore. Yesterday I just brought 2 changes of pants, wipes, the potty and no diaper bag. So weird.


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## Shiv

Spidey - yay for the all clear with your moles! now please stop worrying! 
That photo is HILARIOUS!How long did you have to sit like that for? I particularly like the box on your head :haha:
it sounds like Kira is doing really well on the potty training. How long would you say it has taken her to get the hand of it?

Cleck - Emma is doing really with reducing booby, I think a morning and evenign feed is quite nice and manageable until she/you decide that it is not for you anymore.
Any idea where you are in your cycle?
Also when do you move? I hope your inspection went well!

Sophia is very similare to Emma with her tantrums. We had an almighty one yesterday (in fact we had about 15 in total!). We were at the registry office registering Cora. ..........gotta go Cora has woken up, will finish my story later!


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## spidey

oh Shiv, I can't wait to hear your story... I hope it wasn't too horrible :haha:

I guess it's just their age, but I do worry that I'm turning Kira into a spoiled brat. Cleckner, you sound just like me- having to lug Kira's items up and down the stairs for her :lol: Sometimes when Kira's on her 20th screaming session of the day, I say "stop acting like you're 2!" :haha:

We started potty training on September 29th, and within 1 day she started using the potty. But then she had a week where many of the pees would start in her pants and finish in the potty. Then another week of holding her pee all day and showing some resistance to using the potty "NO NO NO NO!!!" and now things are leveling out and she's doing really well. So about 3 weeks I'd say :thumbup:

Cleckner, Kira's panties are Hello Kitty and DORA :rofl: They don't have many options for size 2/3 panties. It is weird not using diapers at all. I have a huge unopened box I plan to return for store credit. And it's neat I haven't bought any disposable training pants... those things are expensive!


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## cleckner04

Shiv- Oh can't wait for you story. :haha: Maybe it'll make Emma seem normal instead of a brat. 

spidey- EWW DORA!! :haha: Yeah they only had minnie and hello kitty at target when we went. Well, and no-themed ones but I wanted cool ones for her. :haha: My mom said my first undies were barbie. :lol: Emma is wearing the size 2/3 as well for them. I have an unopened box of sposies too! I packed them away with the cloth diapers for the next kid. Whenever that next kid may be. :haha:


I'm not sure where I am exactly in my cycle. I started my period right before DH returned so I'm about a week into the cycle. So probably ovulate around halloween time? I'm not keeping track this month. We are just having sex when we feel like it. So I'm thinking it's more NTNP this month. :haha: There are far too many other things to worry about this month. Speaking of which, i gotta go start on cupcakes for the party. I'm making my famous multicolored cupcakes but with black/orange/purple colors for halloween and I bought those black spider rings that I'll shove into the top. :D I'm hoping they turn out good. Later we are heading to the pumpkin patch to pick out our pumpkins too! :thumbup:


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## cleckner04

Emma is currently crying because she dropped her cracker and she apparently wants me to pick it up. Even though she is standing right beside it. :growlmad: I'm going to go crazy. It is SO hard to hold my temper back and remember that she is just a baby still. But good lord, THE CRACKER IS RIGHT THERE! :rofl: That's what I want to scream. Instead I'm on here and ignoring her. :wacko:


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## spidey

It's one of those days here too Cleckner. I got fed up and ignored Kira for 20 minutes and cleaned the kitchen as she screamed. It makes me feel awful but I can't keep it together all the time. She does the same thing- something will be right next to her but she NEEDS me to get it for her. 

Your cupcakes sound awesome!!

I bought a HUGE gnarly pumpkin and we're going to carve it either tonight after the life insurance guy comes :lol: or tomorrow night. Kira is going to have a blast playing in pumpkin nasty!

And speaking of DORA.... we're going to the Baltimore aquarium on Saturday because Dora will be there!! The first 50 kids get a free picture with her :haha:


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## cleckner04

Emma is STILL screaming. :wacko: I seriously don't even know what to do with her some days. I've tried cuddling her just now and it doesn't help. She just wants to scream. And it is ear piercing screams as loud as she can go. I'm sure the neighbors think I'm beating her. But no..I'm just sitting here beside her while she rolls around on the floor screaming. :shrug: I think I'm a horrible mom. I don't see why she acts like this. It has to be something I messed up with along the way. :( I can't blame it on DH because he's never here. 

The aquarium sounds fun!! We plan on going to the aquarium in LA on sunday! I'm hoping it's worth the trip. We are seeing that and an auto museum for DH and the cemetery that Marilyn monroe is buried in(is that weird?:lol:)


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## Shiv

gosh emma sounds just like sophia!

so my story from yesterday............we were at the registry office, just me SOphia and Cora. Sophia had been a gem during the time when I was form filling and had just been sat on the floor playing with some toys that they had in a box. Cora had ben feeding so it was all going swimmingly! then Sophia found a book she wanted me to read. She loves books and when she wants me to read to her there isno deterring her. SO i was trying to answer the womans questions whilst reading her this book. The appointment was coming to an end so I started skipping bits of the book so that we were finished. SO we finish up and I strap Cora back in to her babyhawk on my front. (i had Cora in the carrier and Sophia had walked from the car 20m away holding my hand). I get up out of the chair and say "come on Sophia, lets go", she said "no I don;t want to go" and started screaming at full volume, you know the scream, high pitched, awful! SO i spent 5 mins trying to persuade her to come with me. No movement - continuous screaming. So I said "right I am going then, see you later". I walked out of teh room aand round the corner so she can;t see me.......usually she would get worried and come and find me, but she just kept screaming "don;t want to go". The registrar was looking worried and embarrassed and sorry for me. Normally I would just scoop SOphia up kicking and screaming and march out, but I couldn't because I had Cora on my front. I managed to grab Sophia and get her out of the room into reception (where the next person was waiting for their appt, clearly an elderly man who was coming to register the death of someone, probably his wife!). I couldn't keep carrying her as she was writhing too much, so I plonked her down and sat down myself. I tried bribery "if you are good and come with me to the car you can have a snack", but nothing was working. So I just had to sit it out. It tool 30 minutes of her screaming for her to calm down and leave. I was so embarrassed but there was nothign I could do, as I wasn't about to leave her there while I put Cora in the car. Anyway I got her in the car and she asked for a snack, which I declined saying she hadn't been a good girl and she must come with me when I tell her to. So she screamed all the way home, then refused to get outof the car. So I left her in the car for 15 minutes and took Cora inside. Seriously it was an hour from hell! And the first of many tantrums that day. Other reasons for screaming were, she couldn't get hertights off and silly me tried to help! I went for a wee when she wanted to read a book! One of her puzzle pieces wouldn't fit! David came home fromwork and she said "no I want Daddy to go back to work" followed by screaming (poor David!)

seriously what ahs happened to out girls?!?!? this must be what they mean by the terrible twos.

Sometimes all youcan do is ignore, because Ilike you don;t want to give in every time. They have to learn surely? I am hoping it is a short lived phase!

Cora is 3 weeks old today,I had my weigh in this morning

weight 2 weeks post partum = 10st 3.5lbs
weight 3 weeks post partum = 10st 0.75 lbs :happydance:

I am eating like a horse so it MUST be breastfeeding! I have stopped bleeding now so that is helping anymore. I don't really feel like my shape has changed at all (will upload photos now), but I am back in my pre-preg jeans! It took 4 months last time!

David is away tonight for work so I have been on my own and it hasn't been too bad. Sophia went to bed easily (fingers crossed it stays that way) and cora is asleep in herbasket in the lounge with me.

Here are the photos then. First one 2 weeks post partum, second one 3 weeks post partum
 



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## Mary Jo

oh dear, Shiv. that sounds awful, in the registry office of all places! but I understand, we have major meltdowns from Adam as well. mostly at home, I don't tend to give him chances to go mad outside (he rarely gets to walk unless there are two of us there, he's not reliable enough yet and I am scared he'd run into the road).

(just wondering what would have happened if you'd tried to film the tantrum, remember we mentioned that a while back)

I am with all of you on the ignoring the tantrum thing. sometimes it's my only option because as you know when I was having a tough time alone with him a few weeks ago, if I shout it gets out of control. it's usually over such small and (to us) irrational things. and Chris seems to think there is something wrong with him for it, but I know there isn't, it's because he just gets overwhelmed with frustration. the other day he found our cat's Cath Kidston bed (which had been away somewhere) and he took a huge fancy to it, and spent ages trying to squeeze into it, with varying degrees of success. then he took into his head to squeeze one of our settee cushions into it. this did not work and he couldn't handle it. it's funny to watch, but sad as well, tears were streaming down his little face, he was just raging, and couldn't or wouldn't understand why it wasn't working, and wouldn't let it be. same thing with various toys that don't do what he wants. he has a variety of toy people (Lego men, Happyland, etc) and they are not interchangeable in all his toy cars and van, etc, and he always tries to get ones that won't fit to fit, and this is a recipe for disaster.

none of us are horrible mums, though. if all of us are reporting a similar thing, then it *has* to be put down to them being toddlers. got to take the rough with the smooth, I guess, and the good parts are really good. Adam is getting so sweet recently, I don't know if he realises things are going to change or what, but he's started to want me to comfort him more (though I am *always* second to daddy if daddy is around). this morning when we were getting ready to go to playgroup, he had a minor mishap (don't know what as I was in the other room) and he cried and screamed, and I lifted him onto my knee to cuddle him, and he still cried and it wasn't stopping. we had to go out, so my mum tried to take him so I could go get dressed, but he wouldn't sit on her knee and wanted to come back to me. there's been other stuff as well and it just warms my heart. he's never been *that* demonstrative, but he'll give my mum a kiss when she asks (not me!).

wow to your weightloss progress, you look amazing. I am still green with envy and certain I am not going to go that way! I'll be joining in the Lion Cubs dieters properly, no doubt. :( 

spidey, so glad your mole screening was clear. what a relief. :D pic of Kira is so cute, she seems such a sweet little girl.

Jean, how are you doing?

so it's my due date today. well, my official one, and the one that will be counted regarding how far over I am allowed to go. so 12 days left, unless I hang out for 40+13. I don't feel *too* awful. yesterday was pretty horrible, though, midwife calling me fat really got to me. stupid cow. she didn't use the word fat but she asked if anyone had said that the baby is big. I said no, is he? and she said yes, and "there's rather a lot of you as well" while pretty much grabbing the layer of fat on my bump, like the Special K ads from the 80s, can you pinch more than an inch. I just froze, and it was annoying because I never seem to react in a constructive manner at times like those. I wish I had got up and said something, but I'd have cried, and I can never explain myself properly. am a bit worried about explaining it to the mental health midwife tomorrow, because I know I'll cry, but I have to.

(slightly concerned I am cooking a 10lber as well.)

also, we went to labour ward last night because I had a bath with clary sage and afterwards baby was hyperactive. way more than he usually is, and he is generally a busy little bee. I got terribly worried that he'd got tangled up in his cord and was in distress, so rang up and they said come straight down. labour ward seemed to be very quiet, there was one woman in who had a baby while we were there because we heard the newborn cries, but not a peep from the mum so guess she had an epi. they were very nice anyway, and put me on the monitor for 30 mins, and it showed he was ok, but really active still. no explanation for that so I just hope he's really ok. his hb was fast, a lot faster than it's been at mw appts (baseline 150 but up beyond 180 at times). mw tomorrow morning again, and perhaps a sweep. need to get Chris involved before I go there, he's not been very "helpful" because he's taken the last 3 days off work sick. Monday was a not-really sickie, but Tue was a genuine one, and today was because he'd been up past 1am taking me to be monitored! think he's planning to go back tomorrow. have been taking EPO at both ends, and loads of RLT, not sure about the clary sage again. might have been coincidence that baby went berserk after my bath in it... I didn't use much, maybe 8-10 drops in a really deep bath. next time, if I dare, I'll use less. 

oooooh, I might have finally made a mummy friend! a couple of weeks ago my mum checked out this toddler group locally. it's very popular and you have to register (it's not always open for registration but my mum got chatting to one of the girls who runs the group and explained and they let us register Adam) and you have to book your place online the day before the group. booking opens 7.30am and it was fully booked by 10.30am. so I booked Adam a place at 7.45am yesterday. had to set my alarm! anyway, there was a woman with a 6-week-old newborn there, I thought she also had a toddler but she didn't, but her mum does stuff at the Sally Army hall the group is at so it seems she was there to meet mums and for the company. she was lovely, and really pleased that I'll also be there with a newborn soon. so that's good. she mentioned meeting for coffee as well. not sure how old she'd have been, early 30s probably. 

I am in the place where I simply cannot imagine things starting. just hoping my waters don't break and nothing happens. I am scared of needing to be induced. but last night while we were listening to baby hb racing away like mad, and I was worried they might keep me in for an emergency c-section, I wasn't worried about missing out on a natural birth, I just want him to be ok. so I have to hang on to that. like I did last time. I want us both to be alive and well at the end and everything else is a bonus.

no 40 weeks belly pic. forgot and now I am full of curry, so maybe I'll do an officially overdue one in the morning. :haha:


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## jelr

Hey girls

Thanks for all the messages - I'm not too bad, was a bold girl on Friday night when out and drinking and smoked, but it made me sick as a pig (which is good) and I haven't smoked since, was doing fine over the weekend and hadn't really thought of them, but am back to eating all around me the last two days and missing them in the evening only so that is better than last week. I have bought the alan car book to reinforce everything and I'm going to read that first and if I'm still struggling, I will try the hypnotist as it is 190 to 250 which is a lot.

Spidey: I'm sorry you are feeling crappy and worrying - so glad your appointment went well and you don't have anything to worry about - so I hope you can relax a bit now. Hormones are just the worst aint they - the make us think so crazy some times (well they do me anyways)

Cleck: Sounds like you will be busy with the party - best of luck with it. That is great Emma is doing so well cutting down on BF.

Shiv: I hope Cora is still sleeping through for you and Wow your weight loss has been amazing and you look fantastic, there is a definite difference from last week.

MJ: That midwive is a cow - I hope you can get out the words you want for the other midwife tomorrow and compain. I'm delighted you have also met a new friend and delighted Adam is looking for cuddles from you, Natasha used to never want cuddles either, but she loves cuddling in now for a good few months and I absolutely love it and feel so much closer to her (and I didn't think that was possible).

As for the tantrums girls - It definitely has to be the age because Natasha sounds the very same as each and every one of your children at the moment and it was great to read all your stories as I was starting to think we had spoilt her too much too, so I'm glad now that maybe we haven't and hopefully it is just a phase. We really haven't had any tantrums out yet (wait and see I will have jinxed myself now) but we do have plenty of screaming and shouting these days. She is also fussy about things for example there has been a few nights where she has screamed going to bed and I have ran in thinking there was something wrong and she would be crying "teddy wong way wound" - because her teddy would have been turned a diffferent way than she wanted :dohh: or she will scream if she wants a drink or is hungry. I keep trying to tell her all you have to do is ask, but its just not working the same as stop screaming doesn't either :dohh: - so like you all I don't want to always give in so I do ignore a lot or if she is really bad we have a travel cot / playpen that I leave up in the hall and I put her in that for 2 mins and she usually screams louder and then stops and calms down in that so basically she gets a time out, but in the playpen rather than the corner or on a step as I don't think I would have the patience to keep putting her back if she was moving out of it :dohh:

Not much news from me - just was busy the last few nights trying to get the last of the updated publication done for work and I also have to give a training session on the same publication to another dept's tutors (which I am a bit scared about) and then I only seemed to get in as far as fb and then it was time for bed.

Oh yeah I got 2 penalty points on my driving licence today for getting caught using my mobile - I was so mad with myself as I never do it because I have a handsfree installed, but there is something wrong with it for the last 2 months - I was working so when I got back to the office (was out with groups) DH got screamed at because I have asked him several times to phone the guy who can fix it :dohh: - so I now have them stuck on my licence for 3 years and a fine of 80 - but on the other side, it did teach me a lesson for being so careless.

Other than that I am on CD13 today so we dtd and will again on CD15 and CD17 so hopefully that will be enough around CD14 to 18 days - We are actually out on Saturday night for DH's sister's 50th birthday party so I'm sure we will that night too seeing as Natasha will be at my mams so that will also be CD16. I'm excited to see if my charts shows ov - it is a bit all over the place at the moment :haha:


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## spidey

jelr, I'm glad the cigarettes made you sick. Maybe thats all you needed to get back on track :hugs: Good luck this month TTC... I hope I'll see a BFP picture in the next 2-3 weeks!

MJ, I still can't believe your midwife said those things to you. Those belly measurements are not a good indication of the baby's size so firstly she shouldn't have commented on you having a big baby. And she should NOT have added the squeeze and fat comment about you. Gosh, it's a wonder you didn't slap her! Yay about the new Mommy friend! I hope it works out and Joel will have a little playmate one day. When I was pregnant with Kira I never felt like labor was imminent so I know how you feel... it's crazy to think that you're already at 40 weeks. Time has flown by. Make sure you post on FB or here atleast once a day or else I'll be stalking your FB page :haha:

Shiv, that was a tough situation with Sophia. You did good waiting it out though- that takes alot of strength. I might have caved and called DH to come over to help me :lol: Your tummy is still going down and your boobs look bigger in the most recent picture! 

Cleckner, after all that screaming Emma will sleep good tonight. I have another bf question for you. Does Emma still feed in the night and as she wakes up in the morning. I'm debating how strict I will be with my bf rule, but I think it would be impossible to cut out those feeds right now for Kira. I mostly want to cut back on all the daytime feeds to begin with so I would keep the night/morning ones for now until she fully night weans.


I took Kira to her 4th library story time class today. For the 3rd class I had to carry her out half way through screaming :blush: but she behaved nicely for this one. It's nice to hear we're all dealing with the same quirks. I always feel like I'm coming up with new strategies to out smart Kira :haha: I think the hardest part is they're all self-centered at this age. 

Oh, and if AF comes tomorrow my LP will have been 10 days even with newborn style bf!! I know I'm not pregnant because my nips don't hurt, but I'm starting to get a little excited wondering if I am. I can't believe I'm capable of getting so excited each month :lol:


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## cleckner04

Shiv- That trip to the registry office sounds awful! I can totally see that exact same thing happening with Emma. It's like they get these ideas in their little heads and they just won't let it go. :nope: I'm sorry that happened when you had little Cora too. That's probably twice as stressful. This is why the second kids are always more laid back. They see how awful their brothers and sisters are and decide they don't want to be that loud. :haha: 
You look amazing in your postpartum piccies!!! :dance: SOOO jealous that you are already in pre-pregnancy jeans. It took me nearly 2 years to be back out of maternity stuff. And that was with seriously hard work. :haha:


MJ- OMG WTF was the midwife thinking by saying that and grabbing you! :gun: Seriously I think if someone did that in this country they'd get fired. :nope: That's inexcusable. You are NOT fat. If your fat than I am in trouble because I'm much bigger than you in 'non pregnant' form. I'm angry for you right now. I know just what you mean about not knowing what to say in that situation though. 
That is great that you met a mummy friend!! I hope she turns out to be an amazing friend. My luck has been awful with mommy friends so hopefully yours is better. :D 
Labor dust your way too. :dust: Although I hope you don't go in labor before taking one last belly pic because I want to see your belly again. :lol: 

jelr- Naughty girl with the cigarettes! But I'm glad it made you sick in a way cause that probably helped with your lack of cravings for it now. Stick to your guns girl, you are doing great. :hugs: 
Good luck TTC!! So exciting!! I hope you have better luck than I've had. We could use some new excitement around here. :D

spidey- Most nights Emma sleeps through now without asking for booby but she does still get it all morning while I get extra sleep. I'm not about to quit that because it gets me more sleep every day. :haha: So I feed her to sleep and than if she does wake up in the night I let her nurse(not that I really notice because I usually sleep through it), and than mornings and if we are home naps too. But for most of this week she has napped in the car so she has skipped those. :D 
I'm so excited to go back home because I'll be able to take Emma to story hour at the library. My mom is the one that reads the books to the kids(she works there) so I think Emma will love it because it's grandma doing the reading. :D The good thing about that is if Emma throws a tantrum I can just take her into the staff room to let her calm down. :haha: 
I hope you get a sneaky BFP this month too!! :D




Well, I have to say I feel SOOO much better hearing that Emma isn't the only one acting this way. I actually think knowing that Emma isn't spoiled but doing this because of her age makes me less frustrated about it. Hopefully I can keep my cool knowing this now. I was just getting so upset thinking she's a spoiled brat. :( But if she's a spoiled brat, than I guess we all have spoiled brats. :haha: 


Well I've made 22 cupcakes(wasn't quite enough mix to make 24:dohh:), 3 dozen cookies, and have carved minnie mouse into the front of my pumpkin so far. :haha: I have a lot more to do still. I'll probably try making pinwheel wraps tonight. They are baby dill pickles with cream cheese and sliced meat wrapped with soft shell tortillas. Soo yummy and I remembered them last minute so I'm gonna make those along with the main mean dish for the party. And probably making deviled eggs. I'm gonna make the deviled eggs look like eyeballs in honor of halloween. :D Okay, I'm off. :wave:


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## spidey

Thats so cool your mom does story time!! Is she a librarian?

Cleckner, I didn't want to admit it, but I don't want to give up those morning feeds either because it gives me a good amount of extra sleep :haha: Today Kira was such an angel and she didn't ask for booby during the day. It was a wonderful break from the terrible twos :thumbup:

Don't forget to take pictures before your party Cleckner!!


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## cleckner04

Yup my mom is a librarian!! :D Cool but embarrassing because she knows everyone in town along with all the town gossip. :haha: 

I admit I haven't been good about getting pictures of everything we are doing here. So I will have to get it out tomorrow and get pictures of everything. DH made cornhole boards. Has anyone ever played that here? I'm sure UK girls have no clue but it's a bean bag toss game that adults play. Well anyways, DH made one and it's black with skulls. It is SO awesome. We spent tonight painting them and will eventually have to clear coat them but I don't think we have time before the party so we'll just play with flat paint for now. Here's a link to the game of cornhole for anyone curious. :haha: I know it's a horrible name. 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornhole


I'm gonna go try to get some pictures of the boards and maybe I'll post them tonight. I'm making brownies and starting deviled eggs in a second so might not have time. It's already 8:30 pm and we have cookies to decorate too. :dohh:


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## spidey

LOL Cleckner, cornhole must be a mid western game :lol: IF we played it here, we would call it bean bag toss. The last time I played bean bag toss was in elementary school during a May Day festival and I haven't seen it played, or heard about it ever since :haha: I wonder if your California neighbors have any experience with cornhole boards.


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## cleckner04

Oh man we play cornhole at every family get together. :haha: Maybe it is a midwest thing. V and her husband have never heard of it. But DH said his friends from the ship will know how to play because they play when out to sea sometimes. :haha: I'm uploading pictures now so hopefully I can post a few on here. I'm also in the middle of making cheesy hamburger meat for sandwiches. Recipe here:

https://www.cooks.com/rec/view/0,2344,157177-228204,00.html


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## cleckner04

Okay, I just resized a shitload of pictures to post on here for you girls so here goes. :haha:


Pictures from the pumpkin patch:

Spoiler
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0126.jpg
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0150.jpg
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0176.jpg
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0180.jpg
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0189.jpg
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0216.jpg

I ended up carving both of these. Corey was too busy with the cornhole boards. 
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0283.jpg


Cupcake and food pictures:

Spoiler
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0252.jpg
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0276.jpg
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0275.jpg

Inside my fridge right now for spidey's nosiness:winkwink:
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0312.jpg
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0313.jpg


Decorated garage:

Spoiler
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0305.jpg
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0307.jpg
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0308.jpg


And the cornhole boards. 

Spoiler
https://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e255/cleckner04/IMG_0303.jpg


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## spidey

oh f*ck I'm pregnant!

https://www.razortoe.com/share/preg.jpg

I was soooo certain AF was coming since I saw a temp drop this morning in my wiggly all over the place BBT chart. But just for sh*ts and giggles, I POS tonight and look what I got!!?? I am 11 days post ovulation. Crazy huh!?? How the hell will I sleep tonight. Oh geeze.. let the constant worry begin!


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## Shiv

OMG! Yay yay yay! Will write a proper reply when I'm not on my phone!


Cute photos cleck, Emma just gets more gorgeous if that's possible. And Sophia loves goats too!


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## Mary Jo

SPIDEY!! HOORAY!!!! and wow, that's a pretty clear bfp for 11DPO :happydance: (it looks a lot darker than my first did at 12 or 13DPO - here).

SO happy for you! now you have to do more POASing! :wohoo:

great pics, Cleck, Halloween looks like it's going to be a lot of fun again :D

How are you doing, Shiv? how's Cora doing, is the sickiness any better?

as for me - nothing going on. no signs. by my calcs I am 39+6 today, which is when I lost some plug with Adam. we'll see. I am not hopeful for much going on in the next few days, but I have a sweep booked for Tuesday afternoon. just hoping she is able to do it, as I am dreading her sticking her hand up and saying she can't reach or it's totally unripe and closed. I also had a sweep booked for Monday, my community mw appt (Tue is the mental health mw at the hospital), Mon was the rescheduled appt from the one I had with the horrible mw, but I cancelled it when the hospital mw said she could do me on Tue. I told the nice mw about the awful one and she was frustrated and exasperated that she could make a comment like that. for one, she said, it's clearly not true, for another, comments like that will stay with some woman for the rest of their lives. and they have to be more careful and sensitive. so she said she will speak to her.

my mum bought Adam a boy baby doll and a buggy yesterday and he just LOVES his baby. :D he is so sweet with it. sometimes not gentle, but mostly great. 

going to Primark this morning to buy some sort of massive baggy nightie or t-shirt. it occured to me when I woke for the 6th time in the night that since I have misplaced the massive maternity t shirt I wore when birthing Adam, I don't have anything that's long enough to be decent. all my maternity clothes are too short and tight now. and though I hope to be able to use one of the pools, if I can't I will need something. and there is literally nothing apart from a garish shocking pink nightie I bought last time, which is ok to bf in (it's a Primark non-maternity 18-20 with buttons that go halfway down) but I suspect it'd be a bit tight right now. ok for after, though. plus it's hideous. so I want something better.

Cleck, as you're not on the FB group oyu won't have seen my last belly pic (well, latest, possibly not last) - 40+1:

https://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/ariel3112/IMG_0818.jpg


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## cleckner04

SPIDEY OMG!!!! YAYAY!!! I am soo happy for you!! :dance::dance: Sticky and healthy dust your way! :dust: May it be a sick free pain free 9 months for you now. :D 

mj- You look soooo good!!! Your MW or HV was an idiot to say that you are fat! :wacko: You look like you are all belly. 




Okay, I feel like I'm going to taint this thread after spidey's good news but I have to say it because you guys already know the situation with us and our attached neighbors and I've been sick to my stomach all day over it. Last night was the party. It was great. 10 adults and at least 1 kid per adult so a good turn out. We ate food, sat around the fire pit and laughed, the guys played cornhole, and we had a sheet hung from the neighbors house with a projector playing kids halloween movies for the kids all night. 

Now the attached neighbors obviously weren't invited and they did come out a few times to leave in their car and come back. So they knew we were out there. But every time I'd go in the house, it was SO loud from them playing music. I mean it was ridiculous how loud it was. Shaking our whole house. Our party ended around 11 so everyone could get home with their kids and put them to bed. We go in and clean up doing dishes, etc. All whilst this music is being loud next door. Well we laid down in bed around 11:30 and our dog diesel was barking. Well a bit later we heard a loud bang against our fence and corey quickly opened our bedroom window in time to here Scott(the attached neighbor guy) yell 'TAKE THAT MOTHERFUCKER' to our dog. And he suddenly got quiet. Corey threw on clothes as fast as he could and ran into the backyard and leaped up onto our fence like a cat so he could see into the neighbors yard. Of course corey yells what the fuck are you doing. Scott denies doing anything saying 'what are you talking about'. Than corey said you hit our fence. Scott was like no i didn't. And corey said yes you did we heard you yelling at our dog too. Than scott admitted to throwing something at the fence. Corey than said to turn the music off. They wouldn't. Corey said 'you have two kids sleeping in your house and you continue to play music this loud'. The wife Casey cuts in and says 'my kids are trained to sleep all night'. Corey said 'good for you'. :rofl: Than casey tries cutting in again and corey yelled at her to shut up. The arguing only lasted about 5 minutes but it was enough to have me shaking. I'm just watching it all from our upstairs bedroom window which faces the back yard. (fill in appropriate curse words as needed because this conversation was full of them.) Finally I screamed 'forget it, I'm calling the cops'. So corey came in and didn't want to call. I said 'we can't keep living like this with them because they play their stuff loud all the time'. So I found the number to the 24 hour security people that drive our neighborhood all day and night and they sent out 2 cars with 3 security cops. Excuse my language here but the fucking pussy wouldn't even answer the door to them!! The cops said they can see him looking through the peephole from the shadows of it and they were like 'we can see you dumbass' to scott. :rofl: Corey went out and had a chat with them and they said they'd keep trying but he's not answering. They ended up being out there at least an hour last night repeatedly ringing the doorbell of the neighbors trying to get them to answer. They never answered and the music was turned down slightly but still loud until 1-2 in the morning. :wacko: 

Corey has duty today so it's just me. I couldn't sleep very well last night and in between bursts of sleep I've been running to the trash dry heaving because my stomach hurts so bad. I couldn't manage to actually throw up but I really needed it. I was crying and just a general mess. I had to take a hot bath to calm my shakes because my whole body was shaking too. I just think if they are capable of trying to hurt and scare our dog who is completely innocent, what else are they capable of? As I type this their stuff is loud again. Not loud to the point of me trying to call the police but definitely loud enough for us to hear. I don't know what to do. We have two more weeks here and than we should be gone but I am absolutely terrified. I let our dogs out for a few minutes this morning so they could do their business but I watched them like a hawk and let them right back in. Normally we could just let them be out there as they pleased. Now I don't think we can do that. And I'm also scared they'll do something to our vehicle. I mean, what are they really capable of?! :cry: 


Okay, I had to get that out. I'm so sorry spidey because I feel like I'm raining on your parade. I am so freaking happy for you. You gave me the one smile I've had so far today. :D


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## spidey

Cleckner, Firstly, I LOVE your pictures. Thanks for the fridge one :haha: you have a very anal fridge :lol: Your pumpkins are really good too and the corn hole boards turned out great. I bet everyone was impressed with your party planning and decorating skills :thumbup:

Please don't think you're raining on my parade with telling us about your sh*tty neighbors. I was happy to hear about it since I need a break from being paranoid about this pregnancy. I totally get your fear of them screwing with your car. Is there another place you can park your car for the next 2 weeks. Like a police station or a 7-11 nearby? Do you have 1 or 2 cars? Can you clear out your garage for the next 2 weeks or does it only hold 1 car? They were throwing a HUGE temper tantrum because they weren't invited to the party. It just makes them look like big idiots. Once my boss was being super mean and unreasonable to me and I decided to really f*ck with her head so I left her 3 candy bars wrapped in ribbon with a note that said something like "thinking of you, I hope you enjoy your weekend" :haha: I hope your tummy and nerves can calm down soon :hugs: I react the same way to situations like that. 

MJ, good luck on finding a shirt to wear during labor. When I was transferred to the hospital they made me wear a stupid gown. So that thing came off pretty fast and the nurses kept trying to cover me up :haha:


I have NO pregnancy symptoms, so I'm having a really hard time with this being for real. I couldn't sleep at all last night because of course I was worrying. Did I make the right choice? am I going to be a bad mom to Kira? what if there's something wrong with the baby and it stresses my marriage? what if something happens to the pregnancy and I can't cope with the loss? I need to stop thinking about it and trust that everything will be okay. It's actually a perfect time to get pregnant since my m/s will be letting up by Christmas (my favorite holiday!), I have 6 weeks of leave to use by February, so I could use 6 weeks if I have m/s, it would be another summer baby so I don't have to waste money on maternity clothes... Can you all see how crazy my brain is. I seriously need to turn my brain off :haha:


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## cleckner04

spidey- I just knew you'd get pregnant when the time is right and it seems like it is with the timing and everything! I would worry with no symptoms too but it is still VERY early. You'll probably be kicking yourself in a few weeks time for wishing symptoms onto yourself. :lol: Did you have MS with Kira? I can't remember. Well, MS usually doesn't kick in until 6 weeks anyways. For once your nipples are wrong though! :haha: I'm seriously so excited for you. :hugs::hugs: It's been a long time coming. And also gives me hope that I can get pregnant with my F'ed up cycles even if Emma is still breastfeeding next year. :thumbup:


We only have the one car since DH wrecked our other one last year. But I'm not certain that it will fit in the garage because it has a safari rack on it. (It's a jeep wrangler so pretty tall too) I had DH park it right in front of my kitchen window viewpoint so I can watch it all day. I keep getting up and checking to make sure it's good. I'm not sure that he would actually do anything to it because he's too pussy to even open the front door when the security guys show up. So he's obviously a bit of a coward. 

I called the main office and voiced a complaint as well. The woman was really nice on the phone and didn't seem like she could do anything to help but than I mentioned that she probably knows who this guy is because recently he went in and yelled at the people at the main office because a security guard was supposedly harassing his wife.(The story behind this is that Casey(the wife) would walk to the nearby school to get her 5 year old from kindergarten. Well she'd walk on the road so the security guard told her to get on the sidewalk. And he had to tell her again a few days later. So she told her husband about it and they said the security guard was harassing her. Which to me it seems like he was just doing his job trying to keep her off the road.) I'm pretty sure the security guard ended up being fired:( and when I mentioned Scotts name to the woman at the main office, she immediately said 'OH!! Yeah, we know him..' In a 'yeah that guy is an asshole' tone of voice. :haha: Than she seemed like she wanted to press the issue a little harder about getting the complaint filed. I guess they'll be sending them a letter. Which I don't think a letter would do much. :dohh: but V from across the street said if I keep complaining each time they are loud or do something bad, I can get them evicted. :haha: But I only have 2 weeks left so it's slim chances. I warned DH to stay completely away from both of them. I told him he is absolutely under no circumstances to get into a physical fight with Scott. From now on we are just going to immediately call security if anything happens. I'm not going to stoop to their level IYKWIM. 

Okay that was a giant jumble of a post. :haha:


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## cleckner04

spidey- I also meant to say, yes my fridge is anal. :haha: That's how all of my food items are in cabinets too. Anally stored. :rofl: DH refuses to put groceries away anymore because I throw a fit if they aren't the way I want. :rofl:


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## Shiv

Cleck - i seriously thought you were gonna say that your neighbours had shot your dog! Thank god they didn't, but that is how crazy I think they are! They sound like complete Dicks, i hope you don't have anymore run ins with them before you leave. by the sound of it he wouldn't have the balls to do anything, but best to be on the look out!

Spidey - your fears are normal, I felt the same when I got pregnant with Cora. You spend all that time getting pregnant and then when it happens you wonder if you are doing the right thing! You'll be great and Kira will be a great big sister! Sticky vibes coming your way!

MJ -hope Joel makes his appearance soon, glad you have your parents around to help out. Also really glad that Adam has been lavishing you with love, told you he loved you most!

jelr - hope you are having a good weeked. Naughty naughty for smoking, hope it has taught you a lesson :haha: 
Where are you in your cycle and how is charting going?

As for us, Cora's sickness is variable (which means it is not reflux etc). Some days we don't have much and others lots - she just vommed all over David (first time he has had it on him) and he just lay there saying "help"!

She has been sleeping well at night, although she has slept so much today that I fear the worst for tonight!

TMI - but did any of you have issues with feeling like your poos were sharp after birth? It was fine for the first 2 weeks but now my poo feels like it is sharp - not nice!

I got a bra delivery the other day and they feel great! I hadn't realised how unsupportive my old nursing bras were. So the old ones are gonna be my night bras and i now have 3 new fancy daytime ones! That is about as exciting as it gets for me these days!


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## spidey

The top was last nights and the bottom is from tonight.

https://www.razortoe.com/share/test2.jpg

Cleckner, I'm still in shock it happened this month and I have no doubt that you'll get your bfp either this month or right away when Corey returns. Fingers crossed its this month so I have company :lol: Kira bf sooooo much that I was certain my LP would be 6 days at most. We also only dtd once around the time of ovulation on the first day that I got a positive opk.

So I looked back at the journal I kept when I was pregnant with Kira, and I looked at my weekly belly pictures and then I got excited about being pregnant. I even looked at old emails I sent to my mom when I was in my 1st trimester with Kira. It brought back tons of memories- mostly good ones :thumbup:

I had really bad m/s with Kira that started at 5w4 days- the reason I did a pregnancy test since Kira was a total surprise :haha: I couldn't stand up or move without heaving, so I spent the rest of my weeks on the couch and sleeping in a separate bed than DH (due to his wiggling) until 10ish weeks. I missed 1 full month of work and another month of partial days. Right when AF was due (4w0d) I already had symptoms with Kira. I remember it clearly since it was Thanksgiving and I could not muster up the energy to clean my house or cook even though I was hosting dinner. I also had very sensitive gums and was contemplating making a dentist appointment after Thanksgiving weekend. Maybe I can be pregnant without the symptoms this time- that would be a dream. But if I have m/s like I did last time I'll need medicine so I can function enough to care for Kira.

Cleckner, smart idea to warn DH to stay away from those crazy neighbors. They're liars so you don't want to give them any chance to blame Corey for causing them pain or damage or whatever. Oh, and you should see my cabinets. They are so random its embarrassing. :haha:

Shiv, any ideas on what's causing Cora's spitting up?

I don't remember having sharp poo, but I took a laxative for a couple of weeks since I was afraid of having pain when I went. I would eat some prunes and dried fruit to soften things up for awhile.


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## cleckner04

Wow spidey your line is so dark already!! What if it's twins?! :haha:


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## spidey

oh sh*t no!


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## cleckner04

They do say breastfeeding increases risk of twins. :muaha::rofl:


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## jelr

OMG - Spidey: Huge Huge Congrats :happydance: :dance: - I can't believe I missed this, we had such a busy weekend I didn't even get to read on my phone. I'm so happy for you, See I think that had so much to do with you had your appointment and once the nurse told you, it was the bf and I think you kind of resigned yourself to the fact that it wouldn't happen yet and stopped worrying that there was anything wrong. I do think to actually stop worrying about ttc is what helps and Cleck is definitely right, it has happened when the time is right. 

You will a great mom of two - bet that is why your hormones have been so up in the air the last few days too. Eeeekkkk it is so exciting :thumbup:

Cleck: Your neighbours are nuts aren't they? I did think you were going to say that they had done something really bad and beat the dog or something, they are definitely capable of anything. Sounds like a really good idea to have phoned the security and at least they will be on alert and hopefully keeping a closer eye now. I really hope the next two weeks flies until you are out of there.

Shiv: I meant to say to you on the previous post - well done for handling the Sophia tantrum so well, I probably would have sat and cried with her :haha:

No I don't remember sharp poos either, but then I did have to take something for constipation as my double dose of Iron really bunged me up :nope: - I hope it clears soon along with Coras sickness, any idea at all what could be causing it?

MJ: Not long now and hopefully sooner rather than later. Aww I'm delighted Adam loves his baby doll. I bet he is going to make the best big brother and be a real little helper. Best of luck with the sweep on Tuesday, I really hope it makes things move along. I bought a larger nightdress from Primark (it is called Penny's here) for when I had Natasha and it was perfect. Although I have a secret confession to make. I love Pennys here for a lot of my own clothes, they dont wear well as they are so cheap, but the style really suits me and I do get bored with clothes so easily so it suits me that they are so cheap and dont' last long as it gives me an excuse to update my wardrobe often :haha:

Well we had such a busy weekend, my friend came down to stay on Friday night, then we had to drive to DH home place (45 mins to 1 hour drive) on Sat lunch time for a fancy dress (for the kids) 1st birthday party with Natasha, then home again and got Natasha packed up to go to my mams and gave her her dinner and then got ready and headed back up to DH home place for his sisters 50th birthday party. We then headed into town this morning as Argos have 3 for 2 on toys and we have 22 children to buy for this year, so we made a huge saving on it and then this afternoon my friend and her husband and 3 girls called.

Oh Lord though Natasha had the tantrum off all times and I was really embarrassed at first, but then remembered my friend has 3 girls and I know have had their moments over the years, so I knew my friend totally understood, she was more shocked because Natasha is normally so laid back and she has never even heard her cry. My mam has told her this morning when she got up in her house that the girls were calling ot play and they Natasha said "girls play in toy room" and then went really quiet and started to cry and said "no girls play with me toys" and my mam had said "you have to share" and she had a few tears there. so when the lads arrived she had a complete melt down and was screaming "no share me toys" "no girls in me toy room" - So I had to put her in a time out to calm to her down and eventually she did, but she grabbed at everything they wanted to play with :dohh: - so we had to just keep taking things from her that she had grabbed from others and saying "no you have to share" - eventually she did better with it, but OMG I really did feel like she was spoiled today :dohh:

As for ttc - I'm on CD17 today so according to FF I ov tomorrow, but I'm not sure if that is correct as I'm very bloated for the past few days so we dtd on CD13, 15, 16 and we will again tomorrow on CD18 so hopefully that will cover if I do OV on CD14 to 18. I will be interested to see if my temp goes way up to shop ovulation after tomorrow or if it still the same and is all over the place :haha: - mind you I'm not worried now that I'm not OV by the chart after seeing Spideys one (mine is not so bad) and now her BFP :haha:

I have decided I am definitely going to the hypnotist as I really struggled again last night and ended up smoking and I didn't really drink much at all as I was concious of there being a possibility of maybe already being pregnant. I'm not too worried about the stress element now and pregnancy, because I have done the main stressful part and if I did become pregnant I wouldnt' be drinking so wouldn't miss them that way. but I'm terrified that even though at the moment I am managing no problem to get up the next day and not smoke or even want one, but even though I would love to be a social smoker only. I do know deep down that after being addicted to them for all these years, I don't think you can go from being a full time smoker to a social one and that it really is a slippery slope and it could cause me to go back to them full time. 

It is just so hard when we are out though - I don't know about other countries, but in Ireland it is actually more sociable to be outside smoking than in. We have the smoking ban in for about 6 or 7 years now and most of our pubs have fancy gardens with fires and heaters for people to smoke in comfort outside so people are in and out and that is usually where the craic is, so it is so hard to miss all that when you are already struggling already and struggling even more after having a drink. :dohh: - it is terrible to say that I gave up in the hopes of becoming pregnant, but now if I was to get pregnant quickly it would be a blessing as it will keep me off of them :haha:

Well I best get to bed - back to work tomorrow - yuck :haha:


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## spidey

jelr, I hope you get your bfp this month so it'll be the final motivator to stop smoking. I can imagine its hard if socializing is centered around smoking. It seems like smoking is getting less and less popular here, perhaps because its so expensive now. And in most places you can't smoke right outside the door... at my work the smokers have to leave federal property so they walk a long distance and cross a street. It's also going to be extra hard for you since DH smokes. Re: sharing toys, the last time Kira's friend visited, Kira had several meltdowns while watching the other girl play with her toys. So I suppose it's their age.. poor Natasha must have been so overwhelmed with everyone touching her things!

I think you're right about me getting pregnant right after I stopped caring about TTC. I still have doubts this pregnancy will go anywhere and I haven't allowed myself to be excited about it. The lines do seem really dark especially since I've been using evening pee and now meanie Cleckner has me worried it could be twins :haha: Kira is still bf constantly, but I read that bf doesn't effect pregnancy, so lets hope that's really true. The midwife said that she'll allow me to come in for blood tests at 5 or 6 weeks to check progesterone levels, so perhaps I'll do that. Normally they don't want to see you until 9 or 10 weeks. They don't do early scans and I'll probably have to cry to get a 12 week scan :haha: I only got a 12 week scan with Kira because they couldn't find her HB with the doppler. 

https://www.razortoe.com/share/3days.jpg


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## Shiv

Spidey - those lines are great! Is there any history of twins in your family?

jelr - I hope the hypnotist can cure the last of those cravings for you. 
sounds like you had a busy but great weekend!

Cleck- how is the weight loss going? Any news from your psycho neighbours?

MJ - how you doing? good luck with your tomorrow (assuming you don't pop tonight!)

I am SO going to have put weight on this week. I can't stop eating! And I have finished bleeding so that isn't gonna help! 

We've got a busy week for visitors this week. Tomorrow my parents are coming for a few hours. Wednesday an old school friend and her brood (3 kids) are coming. Friday, I have my mummy friends coming round. Saturday, David's mum is coming round (first time she has been to visit Cora since we went there 3 days after her birth) and on Sunday oneof my best friends from Kent is visiting! Crikey, that seems a bit crazy, I bet I won't see anyone for months after this week!

I went to get Cora weighed today (after the health visitor nevershowed up last week). They actually make you weigh the baby yourself. You go into a room where there are several scales, weigh the baby and write teh wieght down in their book. Then a HV came and plotted it on the curve (when I checked at home she had plotted it drastically wrong!). To be honest i may as well have just weighed at her home. When i weighed her on my scales at home she was 10lbs (a couple of days ago) and today she wieghed..........10lbs! And the stress of getting both girls there, and out again was SO not worth it!


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## spidey

Shiv, wow! You're going to be busy this week! I'm glad Cora is gaining weight :thumbup: I remember you asking Pippin this question, but now it's your turn! Tell us honesty how it is with 2 kids. How is Sophia doing with you needing to give attention to Cora.

Shiv and Cleckner, you are meanies for making me think it's twins :haha: We don't have any in my family that I know of, but DH's half-Aunt has identical twin girls. The half-Aunt and DH's mother share a dad. Do you really think the lines are overly dark? With Kira I didn't test till later and the line was very dark and came up immediately so I have nothing to compare it to. I don't have any more tests so now I just sit back and wait for 5 weeks to pass and then I can try my doppler.

Kira is being more and more extreme in her nesting behavior. It's hilarious watching her collect certain objects and stash them under the already existing piles of stuff accumulated on the couch. By the end of the day I have to spend 30 minutes putting everything in it's place and tossing any rocks and sticks back outside :lol: And her new thing is to bury sticks and pieces of wood in her sandbox. :haha:


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## cleckner04

Spidey- I just like fucking with you. :haha: And every single one of the august mommies that have been pregnant so far, I have been wrong about gender so I'm sure I'm wrong about twins too. :haha: Kira sounds so funny with her nesting. I hope you are getting lots of pictures and video to show her later in life how crazy she is. :D

Shiv- Sounds like you are busy this week with all those visitors!! I bet it will fly by though. I always find having people here makes the days go so fast. Yay for cora weighing 10 lbs!! That's sucky that you had to go through all that trouble just to weigh her though. :wacko: 


The neighbors have been suspiciously quiet and than yesterday DH was getting something from far up on a shelf upstairs and when he came down he landed kinda hard. Not even a minute later the neighbors beat on the wall. :rofl: So they are just sitting around waiting for us to be loud now I think. I hung out with V today and she agrees that they are just total dirt bags. :haha: It's fun talking trash about them. I've decided to just take the high road and ignore them and report anything sketchy but not do anything to retaliate. Although DH has been having fun setting off their extremely sensitive car alarm. :rofl: Any loud noises set it off. And DH is borrowing his friends bike for the next two weeks so any time he starts the bike up, the alarm goes off next door. :rofl::rofl: I was just waiting for the neighbor to come out and start another fight over it. But DH said he has seen him once and the guy just looked and kept walking. So he's clearly a giant coward. This has even made V and her husband start giving them dirty looks too so I feel like no matter what, we have someone in our corner. 

Oh yeah, my dog is terrified now though. DH went to pet him yesterday and Diesel peed himself right where he stood. :( He hasn't done that since he was a little puppy with a weak bladder. So obviously the neighbors are really scaring him. :cry: I am so scared the neighbors will turn Diesel mean. We love on him as much as we can to make up for it but I'm not sure what kind of damage something like this can do to a dog.


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## Pippin

I knew if I snuck in here again I'd see pictures :rofl: *CONGRATULATIONS SPIDEY!!* :wohoo: sorry I missed it in the FB thread. I miss out on all the gossip now I don't come in to BnB very often. I just hate the new layout to be honest. You guys right so much I can't keep up with it all.

I'm so happy for you Spidey, Cleckner your turn next hun I can feel it in my waters! :hugs:

Any stronger feelings today Spidey? Of course the first thing I want to know lol is are you going to find out the sex? :haha:

When is the due date too?


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## spidey

I'm so sorry Diesel is scared :cry: That's really awful. Thankfully you're moving soon so he won't have to be traumatized by those stupid neighbors anymore. How is the packing going? 

Hi Pippin :wave: I probably won't find out the sex, BUT.. if its twins or triplets I might :rofl: No symptoms whatsoever even with me trying to make symptoms up :lol: I think the due date would be July 1st. I've been listening to my nausea hypnosis cd every night with hopes I can avoid MS this time. I figured that hypnosis worked with Kira's birth so my brain is designed nicely for it :haha:


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## Pippin

:hi: Yay for no sickness so far, but are you saying you are impressionable though :rofl: can I hypnotise you to come and do my washing and ironing then...... hehehehe Maybe you'll avoid it this time because it'll be a boy :haha: My goodness twins can you imagine eeeekk. Mind you you'd be the first of the group to have them and with lines developing that quick my goodness it could be :shock: One of us has to have twins surely hehehehehe!!!! I think if I had another one I'd try and stay team yellow just because I'd quite like to know what it felt like to have the surprise but in my experience I'm so glad just to have them out the sex might be the last thing on my mind :rofl: :haha: 

I'm super chuffed for you though big smile on my face. Just can't believe I missed it the other day. My apologies hun.


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## spidey

I called my midwife group and said that I needed an appointment to have my hcg and progesterone levels checked next week. The bitchy secretary said no! :growlmad: I told her that during my yearly check up my midwife told me to come in to have those tests done, so the bitchy secretary had to give in and said the only time available is next Thursday at 4:30. This woman is always so bitter and mean on the phone and even worse in real life. She made me cry several times when I was pregnant with Kira :haha: She's the type that avoids eye contact so she doesn't have to help you. I've been having bad feelings about seeing this particular group of midwives for another pregnancy since I didn't have the best time with them while I was pregnant with Kira. 

Sooo... I called a midwife center even further from my house. It'll be a 30-40 minute drive but it already seems worth it. They sent in an order to the laboratory where I can have my blood drawn. So I can go tonight if I want to! And I have an appointment on Dec 7th when I'll be around 11 weeks for my first check up. She said if my levels are under 20, then she'll prescribe me progesterone. 

More than likely my levels are okay, but I've had 14 months with a short LP, and last month my LP was really good at 14 days. So I think its something that should be checked. 

Pippin, I'm a real weirdo and love cleaning, so you won't need much hypnotizing to convince me!  A chocolate bar might be enough incentive :haha:


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## Pippin

Oh hun sorry about the bitchy receptionist, why are people like that huh? Life must be so miserable for them. I'm one of these people that think if I'm not nice no one will be nice to me so I'll be nice to even the most horrid of people which is stupid really as I should stick up for myself more (you'd find that rather ironic if you met me I'm nearly 6 foot very large and loud lol). I'm very bossy but when it comes to sticking up for myself I am rubbish :dohh: can't even take something back to a shop in case they question me!!!! Anyway I digress, glad you have gone to another place. We don't get that option here it's our closest doctors or nothing! So did you go and get the bloods? I would if I was you a nice piece of mind. We don't have bloods here unless a problem has been flagged up somewhere in the past. Super chuffed for you still :hug: I had short LP as you probably remember and I carried both to term well. MY MC wasn't anything to do with that just a no go egg.

So back to cleaning, if I count your flight costs as pay then i reckon I could hire you for about 6 months. How does that sound :haha:? And I'd even buy you two bars of chocolate!!!


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## Shiv

Spidey - glad you have found a centre with nicer midwives. I always wonder why some midwives are so miserable, why go into a people centred job if you don't want to help them? Let us know how the bloods go! Your lines are super good, but I don't think they are thatstrong that they indicate twins, just a good progression. 

Kira's nesting cracks me up. My nephew was a bit like that too, he had a bob the builder hat thathe would fill with stuff in a certain order and would take it everywhere with him. Then he would get all the stuff out and lay it out in a certain way. he has grown out of it now!

Cleck - poor Diesel. I am sure it won't affect him long term seeing as you are moving away. Lots of cuddles will sort him out. Stupid ass neighbours:nope:

Pippin - hiya!

So Spidey you wanted to know how life is with 2. Well, here is the brutal truth. Mostly it is absolutley fine..................BUT the stress of thinking that things might not be ok is kinda taking the joy out of it for me. For example, remember with the first one in the early days, when they needed a feed and you used to get all snuggled up on the sofa or in bed, and just gaze at them as they fed and cuddle. Well, there isn't too much gazing going on, as I am so worried about keeping Sophia happy. Most of the time Sophia is great and just lets me read to her, but it still isn't the same undivided attention that I was able to give to her when she as little. I actually quite enjoy the night feeds as it is really just me and Cora, however then I remember that Sophia will be up in however many hours and I stress about how much sleep I'll get! 
After Sophia's mega tantrum at the registry office, I am pretty reluctant to go out unless I have to, which is sad. I know it will get better but it is all just a bit more stressful with 2! 
Saying that Sophia is generally good, and she loves Cora, and I don't think she loves me any less, although I do snap at her more as she seems to not understand that she should be a bit quiet! the number of times she has woken up Cora when I have just got her to nap! I have tried explaining to her that if she lets Cora sleep then we get to play............but alas she still wakes her up :dohh:
I am not making it sound too good am I? It is, i love Cora to bits (she fills my heart all over again) but I wish I had appreciated how *easy* it was first time round!

My school friend came to visit today with her 3 kids (7 year old girl who was my bridesmaid at my wedding 5 years ago, 5 year old boy and 2 year old boy). Sophia was shy to start off with, but by the end of the day they were all playing hide and seek and having a ball. They went upstairs to Sophia's room, and when I popped myhead in to check on them, they were all tucked up in the bed in a row with the girl reading them a story - it was SO cute! It was lovely to see Sophia playing with other children as she doesn't get much opportunity and when she sees other children she is often happier to sit on my lap being read to than playing.


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## spidey

I have an appointment at 11:45 tomorrow at a lab near my work, so I can stop over on my lunch break :thumbup: Pippin, I'm the same way and I'm often too nice and get taken advantage of. In my head I can be brave and nasty, but in person I'm always a pushover :haha: I hope you mean 2 candy bars per day :lol:

Shiv, I understand what you're saying. Those first months with a newborn were easy and fun since I would sit down to bf for hours and watch tv. I had nothing else I HAD to do besides use the bathroom and eat. I'm already planning to send Kira to my mom's 2 days a week so I can have that special lazy alone time with a new baby. 

That's very sweet about Sophia playing with the other children. And I'm happy to hear your nephew outgrew his odd behaviors.. that gives Kira some hope for the future :lol:


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## Pippin

Shiv I know how you feel I felt like that too at first but I promise it gets easier and easier every week and you will start going out again you just make compromises and have ways of dealing with bad situations. I've become much more brave and stopped worrying about when Adelie naps, she does in her buggy if we go out or just drifts off at home on her mat, I think she's just learnt to take naps when she wants to. When she gets bigger I'll put her in her cot like I did with Sam but that's a month or two off yet I think. It really is a case of second child syndrome where they learn to put up with a lot more. I snap way more at Sam especially when I'm feeding but he just carries on playing now where at first he'd want to come up all the time and cuddle and make me feel guilty. He's learnt to give us space and then I put her down and it's his turn. I think they find what works for them after a while. Stick with it hun I promise it gets way easier as you go on. I too feel like I didn't appreciate how easy it was with one but then I'm more confident now and trust myself a bit more to cope with the difficult situations. I tell myself "what's the worst that can happen" my answer is always "one or both will be crying and all I'll have to do is turn around and come home". It's not that bad when I think of it that way. As soon as I'm in the car and no one can hear us I tell myself it's ok and it is. People can look and stare when we are out but I can guarantee they won't remember us 5 minutes later.


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## jelr

Spidey: That is fantastic that you have gotten another midwife centre and they seem to be really helpful already. I think getting the bloods done too is a great idea as it will reassure you that everything is okay. I would definitely get them if we had the option here too. I think Kira is cute with her nesting :thumbup:

Cleck: I'm sorry that Diesel is scared now and hopefully he will get back to his normal self once he is out of there and away from those horrible people. Are you all packed up now, not long now. How did you decide to move it all in the end? By the way, was just looking at your pictures on fb and you look fantastic in your halloween costume, you look so so skinny :thumbup:

Shiv: You sound exactly like I know I would be with another child, I worry so much as it is about not giving Natasha enough time when I'm working, so I know I would feel extra guilty if I was splitting my time between two. On the up side, I would definitely say it will get easlier, I suppose having one seems like a doddle when you have two, but I know I remember it taking a while to get into the swing of it too, so I would imagine it is just the same this time around, you are still getting into the swing of it. :thumup: - You really do have a busy few days, I hope you enjoy all the visitors.

Pippin: Hey there you, glad to see you are in the swing of things with two babies and good to hear that it does get easier, as I know now that we are actually ttc, I do worry about how hard it will be :dohh:

MJ: You will have to let us know what you decided to do on the list we gave you on fb, but sure now that you have listened to DH and left those jeans off sure LO will be here by morning :rofl:

Well I'm going to the hypnotist tomorrow so fingers crossed he can make me stop thinking of these bloody awful cigerattes all the time. I'm really hoping this does the trick, although in one sense I feel he is getting easy money when I have already done the quitting :haha: - but on the other hand, if it stops me feeling crappy and thinking of them all the time and most important being bold and smoking when I'm out, it is worth its weight in gold. I'm terrified though that I'm going to shell out &#8364;190 and still feel the same :dohh: - so keep your fingers crossed for me girls.

Well the tww has begun - Not quiet sure if I have ovulated yet by the chart, but I did get a dip the morning of CD18 which was my predicted OV day and my temp has been rising the last two days, so we will see. For any of you girls that have used FF - Does it put the red lines for ov at the end of the month or does it do it straight away after it reckons you have OV'd as It hasn't put any on mine yet, so am wondering if I did OV at all. I know the course it gives you probably tells you that, but I did read the first few days and then fell behind and now I have about 10 emails to read :haha:

I do think I will be awfully disappointed though if I don't get a bfp and realistically I won't first time around, but I have it in my head now that it will happen quickly seeing as we got caught in January by accident. I know it is good to think positive and I'm hoping all the positive thinking I'm doing will help, but I know if It doesn't happen I will be disappointed and that is silly seeing as it took 2 years with Natahsa and it was only towards the end that I got disappointed. I'm symptom spotting already and I'm only on CD20 :haha: - Something I never did before :dohh:


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## Pippin

Hey Jelr, yay for ovulation. FF puts your cross hairs on once you've had three temp rises after your dip so you don't have to wait long. I have everything crossed for you love and your right it can happen first time did with me but don't be too disappointed if you don't plenty of time hun. xxxx


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## Shiv

jelr - how did it go at the hypnotist? Are you "cured":haha:
How is the symptom spotting going? i alsways found the first month the hardest with disapointment as for some reason you get it into your head that because you *could* be pregnant you defintily will be! once I have one month of disapointment I tend to assume the worst each month so I am not disheartened. I hope your ttc journey is a swift one.

Pippin - thanks for the reassurance. I would have been fine if Sophia hadn't thrown the mother of all wobblies while out last week :dohh:

You know how I was saying that I don't think Sophia loves me any less since having Cora, well she is being really horrible to David since he went back to work. When he gets back from work she has started saying "I want Daddy to go back to work" to his face :cry: and today he rang the doorbell and she opened the door and then when she saw it was him tried to slam it in his face. I feel so bad for him. She doesn't mean it, I ask her if she really wants daddy to go back to work and she says no. Yet every night for the last week she has told him to go away again. He tried to joke it off but it must be horrible for him.


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## jelr

Thanks Pippin - my temp dropped again this morning so I wonder if I did OV at all now. I'm not really sure though if I'm getting accurate temps as they are a different times and sometimes i have been up in the night with Natasha too so I don't know :shrug:

Shiv: Nope not cured and now have wasted money too :dohh: - I came out so positive and feeling really good and this evening feel like crap again. I actually want to cry, I'm so fed up with it all now. My main reason for quitting (apart from doing it before getting pregnant) was that I didn't want to spend time with Natasha and be thinking I wanted to go out for a smoke and now instead I'm fed up all day when I'm with her :dohh: I don't know I can't say I actually want a smoke the last few days, but I have uncontrollable hunger and I mean nothing I eat seems to satisfy me, so that is really upsetting me because if I do pile on weight It lowers my chances of getting pregnant with PCOS :dohh: - yeah the symptom spotting is driving me nuts - if I didn't have that funny hormonal month with symptoms before we were trying a few months ago, I would be certain I was pregnant, I have that bad ache just above my pubic bone that I had in the tww the last time I was pregnant, although I don't have any boob pain :shrug:

Sorry to hear Sophia is being horrible to David, that has to be really hard for him alright. Hopefully it is only a phase she is going through and that it will be short lived. Isn't it funny how they react to things :shrug:


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## spidey

jelr, I'm also curious how your hypnotism went! Good luck on your 2ww too. I really hope this is your month! oops, I see you just posted. Thats too bad about the hypnotism not helping long term. Is there some sort of home program you could do so every day you could listen to a track and re-enforce everything? With the hypnobirthing course I did, I had to listen to one 30 minute track every day, plus a second 40 minute track daily.

Shiv, Kira does sort of the same thing with DH. He drops her off in the morning at my mom's house and she says "BLEGH" when he tries to kiss her and then she points to the door telling him to leave already :haha: It hurts DH's feelings because I think secretly he wants Kira to miss him. Since Kira is so set on her rituals and routines, I've always explained to DH that Kira knows "daddy goes to work" as well as "daddy throws me on the bed" and "daddy swings me upside down". So it's just something that daddy does... if that makes any sense. :lol: She also ignores him when he gets home from work and prefers to hang out with me instead and I am sooo boring compared to him! Luckily for my DH, Kira can't talk so she only points to the door instead of telling him in words.

I got my blood test today and hopefully I'll hear back tomorrow or else it'll be Monday. Still no symptoms, but if I try really hard I might be able to imagine that I can smell things better :haha: Once I get the results back I'll tell my mom (if the results are good) :thumbup:


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## jelr

Oh Spidey - have you gotten your bloods done yet?


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## spidey

yep, I went in this afternoon :thumbup: The midwife said 48 hours but the blood lady said 24hrs until I get my results. So fingers crossed I hear something tomorrow. I've been feeling good today. It feels like I've done everything that I can do and now it's out of my hands.


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## jelr

Sorry Spidey we must have posted at the same time as I'm only seeing your previous post now :haha:

Yeah he gave me a CD and notes so I'm going to listen to it now and read the notes, he also gave me some self hypnosis and an anchor, I have tried using the anchor, but id didn't work :dohh:

I'm so glad the bloods will be back so soon, that is great, bloods here take about a week unless you are in hospital.

Good that you have no symptoms yet and hopefully that MS will stay away this time as I know you had it bad the last time. Maybe I'm getting your symptoms for you :haha: as actually I am feeling sick the last few days too, although that is probably from all I am eating :haha: - I hope your right Shiv and I'm only like this for the first month as it is driving me nuts as I never did it with Natasha, but then I think I was very naive and wouldn't have known what to look for :haha: - I mean the earliest I would have OV'd is CD14 and the chances are it was later with a 32 day cycle so the most I am is 7 DPO, and probably not even that, so implantation wouldn't have even occured yet :dohh: - and by looking at my chart I may not have even OV'd - My mind is just playing tricks on me :dohh:


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## spidey

jelr, I'm curious what an "anchor" is... I'm assuming its not a real life anchor :haha: Do you have a link to your chart so I can be nosey :lol:

I would love not to have MS this time. I'm using the power of positive thinking to ward it off... lets see how it goes :haha: When are you planning to test at the earliest?


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## jelr

ha ha no it is not a real anchor.

Quote from the notes he gave me.

Anchoring is a way to instantly bring back wonderful, happy and postive feelings. it is a great way tof contgrolling your internal responses to external stimulus (eg situations where cravings occur) by touching your wrist and repeating your key word. You could also recall a good day from the time when you were a non-smoker by vividly re-experiencing it, touching your tumb and forefinger together (creating an anchor) and say the affirmation, "Its great to be a healthy, happy no smoker."

I have put my chart online for you to nosey at. It is in Celcius as that is the only thermometer I have bar Natasha's ear one. I even looked in town for a bbt one with no joy not even in boots :dohh: - I think you can change it to Fahrenheit, you can when I view it anyway so if you can let me know and I will change it to that and publish it again.

From this I didn't ovulate at all - the put my projected ov day at CD18 because of my 32 cycle and I did think it was going to plan as I did have a temp drop that day. I have also discovered that my temp spikes after two glasses of wine :haha: as you can see on both Saturday mornings after the Friday night - I had always noticed I woke up too warm after alcohol but it is funny to actually see it on the chart.

https://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/3827b2

This tummy pain is driving me nuts though, it is there all day and sometimes feels like hunger and other times like I need to poo and other times like AF pains :dohh:


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## cleckner04

Just popping in real fast bc we are finally moving boxes out today into our storage unit that we just rented yesterday!! :dance: So I'm sorting the boxes so we know what goes to the back and what goes to the front of the unit. Like DH's clothes will stay towards the front in case he needs them. 

Anyways, jelr- I'm so sorry the hypnotism did nothing. :( Fingers crossed you really did ovulate this month and end up pregnant right away. :hugs:

Pip- Hi hun! :wave: Sounds like you are doing amazing as a mother of two!! :thumbup: Adelie is so pretty! I wish I could squeeze her. :haha: 

Shiv- That really would be heartbreaking hearing her tell her dad to leave. :( I'm sure she isn't doing it to be cruel. I hope it's a quick phase though because that must be really hard to see. :hugs: I don't think I said it earlier but you look fab in your post pregnancy pictures. Your so lucky everything is going down so fast!! I hope I can do that good next time around. :thumbup:

spidey- *whispers* TWINS :rofl: 


Okay, I'm off. I have no clue where I am in my cycle and no clue when I'm meant to have my next period. :dohh: We have been having sex every day that we are together but he has duty every 4 days so that's really only 5 times a week. :haha: It's not really sex with the thought of getting pregnant though. We just know he's gone in a few weeks so we want to make the best of it. If I get pregnant I'll be quite surprised.


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## spidey

jelr, your chart is all over the place! Lets hope we find out soon that you're pregnant so your tummy pain can be explained. What were your early symptoms with Natasha? As for the hypnosis, you might have to practice the part where you associate a happy non smoking place with a touch on your wrist a bunch of times before it actually helps you. The hypnosis I did for birth has a similar thing where I learned how to get really relaxed and then link that to a certain word or touch. It took a long time to make that connection so if you can stand listening to your smoking hypnotism cd, it might be worth giving it more time. I can't see how 1 session of hypnotherapy can "fix" your cravings. Nicotine is a really addictive chemical so it's going to take a long time to stop craving it.

Hi Cleckner- that's so exciting you're packing! Did you get one of those POD things? Sex 5 times a week is ridiculous! You animal! :haha: Fingers crossed you get a surprise BFP this month.


No blood results today. I called and asked if they were in and the lady said they wouldn't be faxed over until the afternoon, but since they're closing at 1pm they won't see them till Monday :growlmad: I'm still making up symptoms and having pretend nausea. I'm not sure if I ever told you girls, but I have emetophobia (fear of vomiting) so every little thing related to vomiting sends me into an anxiety attack about feeling sick. I think that's why my MS was so bad. Normal people would have vomited and moved on, but I would spend hours trying to prevent it from happening and right on the verge of puke. I honestly believe if Kira wasn't an accident, I would have never gotten pregnant on my own since my vomiting fear is so bad. I've gotten a little bit better since having Kira because there was a time where I always needed to keep gingerale, water, hard candy and dry cereal with me "just incase". I haven't packed my anti puke materials for the last 2 years. Yeah, so now you all know how crazy I really am :haha:


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## cleckner04

spidey- You aren't crazy. :hugs: In fact I think that fear is fairly common. I have a friend that was terrified of vomiting too. If anyone even made a gagging noise around her even as a joke she would freak out and start panicking. Okay, so it was a little weird. :haha: But I do think vomiting is a fairly normal fear. I mean, who wants to vomit? It's not like people wake up in the morning and think, 'man I hope I vomit today'. Now if you were scared of orgasms or something equally nice, than I'd be worried. :D Cause who doesn't want an orgasm every day? :rofl:


We didn't get a POD. Those are like 5k!! Which was a shock to me because I did look into them. But we just rented a storage unit. It's $230 a month for the biggest unit they have and that's what we rented because we have so much stuff. :haha: But we are going from paying $1930 a month in rent to only $230 for a storage unit so I will be seriously banking a lot of money when DH leaves. :thumbup:


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## Pippin

My goodness you guys chat some :rofl: haven't got heaps of time to post but just wanted to pick out a few things (hugs to you all though)

Shiv, Sam did that to me a lot at first and totally went to Simon so I know how David feels. All I can say is it doesn't last I promise. It's a phase and it hurt me so much. If he hurt himself or something normally it would be me but for month or so he'd push me away and say Daddy. I just had to remember he was two and that it'll pass and now we are far more equal. Dad is still favourite but I'm much more in favour.

Jean sorry the hypnotist didn't work :( that's a real bummer. Symptoms sound good though and hunger is one of the more promising signs. My boobs hardly hurt at all this time apart from hot and heavy at 7dpo. I have everything crossed for you.

Cleck sounds like you are at it like rabbits :rofl: I'll be surprised if you don't get pregnant :haha: Good luck though I have everything crossed for you.

Spidey can't wait to hear your results. 

Ahhhh gotta go get Sam see you laters. xxx


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## Shiv

Hi girls,

jelr - I think you need to practice your hypnotism for the anchor thing to become a bit more embeded. Listening to your CD can only help so worth doing I reckon. I hope it gets better for you.

Cleck - Hope the packing up is going well. When do you actually leave your current house? i don't think i have had sex 5 times in a week since I was a teenager!, in fact probably EVER!

Spidey - hop eyour blood results come back good for you on Monday, boo for having to wait

pippin- I hope it is a short lived phase as it makes me sad to see her beign so mean to David

right so here comes the rant, it is a MiL rant of course. Feel free to tell me I am being an unreasonable bitch if I am :haha:

So David's mum and her partner came to visit today for the first time since Cora was born. We went out for lunch and his mum asked what we were doing for Christmas. We were honest and said we didn't know yet as we were waiting to see how things went having 2 LO's. She tells us the only day she has off is Christmas day, but she is refusing to cook Christmas lunch as she has turned vegan. So one of David's brothers is hosting and he will cook the dinner (while she brings along her own nut roast). Now David's family is mental, he has 3 brothers and they fight like cat and dog, and shout and scream (serioulsy they have no volume control). Last Christmas when we saw them (on boxing day) Sophia was really unhappy, she doesn't know them because they have only seen her a handful of times. They try to pick her up and cuddle her and she cries and tries to get away as she is scared of them. Both David and I are thoroughly stressed when around them all with Sophia. Anyway we said that we find it a bit stressful, and his mum's partner said he knew what we meant. David's mum said well "I HAVE to see sophia and Cora on Christmas". We said it was difficult for us as we have to travel down and it is a long way to go for just the day, so she says "well won't you be coming down for a few days?". I said that i didn't know if we could as space is getting tight at my parents now with all the kids and my brother, his wife and 2 kids were alreday plannign on staying there. SO she says "but you have your own house down here"...........yeah we do but there is no furniture in it, not even a kettle etc. So she offered to lend us a camp bed :haha: She seriously expects us to travel down to spend Christmas in a stressful situation to then sleep in an empty house with two small children on a camp bed! By this point I had shut up as I was getting so angry. She barely visits us yet expects us to do this so that she can see the girls at Christmas. I said that to be honest we couldn't guarantee seeign anyone on Christmas day itself but would make sure we saw evevryone over the Christmas period at some point. I said we would consider our options but that we would be doing what was least stressful for us as a family. I don't *want* to stay at home just the four of us as I like someone else (ie my mum) cooking dinner etc, but i would stay at home if it meant not being stressed. So her partner (who clearly doesn't want to spend it at David's brother's house either) suggested that if we decided to stay at home they could drive over in the morning for a couple of hours then go to the brothers in the afternoon. David's mum says "oh no I don't want to travel", to which I replied "oh so it's ok for US to travel with 2 small children but not for you" (I tried to say it in a jokey way), she said, yeah I only have one day off and don't want to spend it in a car.............to which I replied, I have two small children, I don't have ANY days off!

i am REALLY annoyed, my parents never put pressure on us, they would LOVE for us to spend Christmas with them and although space is tight, they would make room for us somehow, but would never ever guilt trip us. I feel like staying at home for Christmas just to spite David's mum, but that is unfair on my parents..............My ideal would be to go to my parents and somehow squeeze in, get waited on for a couple of days and then go home. I feel bad because it seems like we favour my parents (and I say we becasue I honestly believe David is less stressed at my parents than with his family), we always stay with my parents as David's mum doesn't have a spare room. SO we only ever pop over to his mum's for a few hours then back to my parents. We can't stay at my parents house but not spend anytime with them, that is just rude IMO.

So I know that if we do go to my parents house for Christmas day then we will be expected to go over to David's brother's for a few hours whcih will make the day super stressful and will mess up any napping routine for Sophia and Cora (assuming she has one :haha:) and takes away from a relaxing day for us, plus puts my parents out as they will have to fit around us.

David's mum REALLY put the guilt trip on David (I had to get up to go to the loo as I was gonna lose it with her), she doesn't put herself out for us yet expects us to for her.

SO am i being unreasonable? what should we do? I always write this stuff down and then feel stupid like I am blwoing stuff out of all proportion. I just wish that as a family we felt comfortable with David's family, but we don't. It upsets me that Sophia doesn't know her Uncles. We saw them over the summer with a big group of people and she was saying hello to our friends but didn't even know her uncles. SO maybe we should spend more time with them so she does know them, but it is always so loud and manic, and they haven't made any effort to be known to her iykwim.

whadda you think? sorry for typos and length of essay!


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## spidey

LOL Shiv, I like your comeback of "I have no days off" so true!! I agree with your view on the situation. I wouldn't take Kira into a situation that caused me MORE stress than I already have unless I absolutely have to (ie. doctors appointment). So when she went through her phase of putting everything in her mouth I refused to take her into my MIL's house since it's a pig sty. I would have spent the entire visit freaking out rather than relaxing like I should be able to. As for the fighting and yelling, that's not a very nice situation for small children. It doesn't sound like a fun time to me. Your MIL saying that she needs to see the children on Christmas day is silly... if she NEEDS to see them, then she should come out and see them. Do you think she was playing "good loving granny" in front of her partner? As for Sophia not knowing who her uncles are- I feel like the adult should make an effort to know the kid and not the other way around. If they're not interested in forming a relationship with her, that's okay too. I hope David isn't guilted by his mom too much. My MIL is crazy too and a professional guilt-tripper and lucky for me, DH doesn't fall for most of her guilt trips. When someone tries to use guilt against me I do the opposite :lol: You should spend Christmas the best way for your family of 4 and say tough sh*t to everyone else!

Cleckner, I'm almost the same way as your crazy puke afraid friend. When I go into a public bathroom, if I see anyone's feet facing the wrong way in a stall I run out! :haha: I've had some exposure vomit therapy thanks to DH so I'm a little better with other people vomiting. He doesn't chew his food and almost twice a week will be Heimlich maneuver choking on his food and will vomit his meal into the kitchen sink :sick: I use to run out of the kitchen and cover my ears, but now I sit there and continue to eat :rofl:

Oh, and that's ridiculous about those PODS! Are you putting everything in storage in CA and then going to Uhaul it home later? Or is it a mobile storage unit?


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## spidey

I just called for my results and they can't give them to me until 1pm! It's only 9am now :growlmad: In my mind everything is okay, but I have zero symptoms and thats a bit concerning especially since I was full of symptoms at this stage with Kira. My boobs don't even hurt!


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## Shiv

My boobs killed with Sophia but didn't even tingle with Cora. I think your boobs are all prepared this time, everything is good to go so they don't grow and your ducts are ready etc so no pain is normal!

I'll be checking back in 4 hours!


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## spidey

Good news :happydance: Progesterone is 25 (anything over 20 is good) and HCG was 982. I'm assuming the HCG was right since she seemed happy about both results. I would have been 4w4d at the test- off to google now for HCG results so I can rule out twins :haha:


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## cleckner04

:rofl: @ ruling out twins. :lol: Yay for good results hun!! I'm so happy to see a ticker on your siggie now too. :dance::dance: 


Congrats to MJ too for the birth of your beautiful boy!! On halloween too!! What an awesome day to have him. :D


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## spidey

I'm pretty certain its not twins :rofl:

I decided that I needed to get over my fear of jinxing things. Seems so real now that I have a ticker.

MJ, I can't wait to hear your birth story! How are you feeling? When are you going home? A Halloween birthday is excellent and he picked it all on his own! Congrats again :happydance:

I am sitting here trying to make myself nauseous :lol: I'm grilling burgers for dinner and it brought back a dream that I had during first trimester with Kira. I had a dream that I ordered a HUGE bunless burger with a giant slab of butter on top. I woke up from the dream gagging and that stupid image stuck with me for weeks! It's actually making me feel a little sick, although the thought of a giant burger covered in butter would probably make me sick no matter what :haha: I seriously need a hobby!


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## Shiv

So glad your results came back as they should be Spidey! has it sunk in yet?


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## spidey

I told my parents tonight. Honestly, it doesn't feel real because I don't feel pregnant. I will consider myself VERY lucky if this continues and I have a healthy baby at the end. After over-analyzing it, I could very well have an easy first trimester this time. Before Kira I had awful divorce causing pms :lol: and post Kira I barely got a symptom before AF arrived. So do you think its possible my body doesn't react to hormones in the same way now? Shiv, I remember you having almost no symptoms when pregnant with Sophia... did you have pms? I'm trying to prove my theory right :haha:

We took Kira trick or treating and she just ate her smarties (American smarties are small disks of powdered sugar) and a lollipop. She is being so silly on her sugar high :haha:


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## cleckner04

Aww you all get to go trick or treating before us. It's only 4:30 here so I'm trying to get Emma to nap right now and than we'll get her dressed for tonight. :dance: I'm excited. I've been dressed all day in flannel, jeans, and I have my hair in cute pigtails with ribbons in. I'm a country girl. :rofl: I didn't want to do a full costume since we did the full costumes for our party. Emma is going to be dorothy tonight instead of pebbles. We bought the dorothy costume last year with the 70% off halloween clearance after the fact so I figure it might as well get used. :thumbup:


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## Pippin

*Shiv* :hugs: you have a right to be pissed hun!!! I would she sounds unreasonable and I think if I was you I'd just go to your Mum's or have Christmas just with the four of you at home where you are :hug: I'd rant too. Grrrrrr

*Spidey* :yipee: for good results hun. So glad you have no symptoms. I'm not going to wish them on you as you were so poorly last time. Every pregnancy is different :hug:


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## jelr

Hey girls how is everybody.

Spidey: Yay I'm so delighted that your results are so good and that you are not sick. I didn't know you had a phobia of being sick, that must have been so tough when you were so sick with Kira. I really hope you don't get any this time.

Shiv: I would totally rant too, you are not being a bit unreasonable. Could you go to your mums and tell MIL that there is no way you can stay in an empty house that hasn't been lived in with two small babies as there hasn't been any heating on for ages and it would be damp and that it would be rude to stay at your mums and not eat there, and that there isn't enough time between dinner, naps and feeds to call over, but that she is more than welcome to call to your mums to see the girls and hopefully she won't call at all. Grrrrr how selfish is she, I loved your come back about the days off :thumbup:

Cleck: I bet this is the time when you will get pregnant because you are not worrying about it. Fair play to you with 5 times in the week, we are really boring and tend to stick to weekends when we are not working so are usually up later because I'm not into quickies :haha: and also a lot of the time DH is in bed far earlier than me during the week, we really are not spontanious that often, well DH would be, but I'm hopeless :haha:

MJ: Congrats again, Joel is only gorgeous, I can't wait to hear your birth story.

Pippin: I see from FB that Adelie is 3 months now, where has the time went??

Well I'm doing a bit better with the smoking this week, am reading Allen Cars book and have listened to the CD a couple of times.

If I was a betting woman I would say I am pregnant, but I'm not 100% - I would say that I'm about 70% certain - I have the very same nagging pain just above my pelvis for since last week and now behind my pelvic bone, which I had with my pregnancy on Natasha (although not until after 5 weeks) and also with the last pregnancy and I did have it in the tww. I also am bloated, starving (both could be to do with not smoking and my bowels slowing down and lack of nicotine) - Arthritis and psoriasis is kicking up which did in all pregnancies early on and I'm shattered and mainly because I have the same gut feeling that I did the last time. I didn't really have any of these symptoms with Natasha until after I had a postive test, but then I could have but maybe didn't put any pass on it.

I'm taking off 10% of being certain due to the fact that I don't have sore boobs at all, which I usually do.

I'm taking off another 10% because of my funny hormonal month a few months back that gave me symptoms before we were ttc.

I'm also taking off another 10% as it could all be down to quitting smoking - I only ever quit before when pregnant so maybe some of the pregnancy symptoms were not actually pregnancy related and more withdrawal related.

So AF is not due until this day next week, but I bought a frer today and will try it on Saturday, I have never gotten a postive before 32 days though, but I'm not sure if I actually ever used a frer. I think I may have - I normally just go for whatever brand catches my eye or doesn't cost a fortune lol.

So we will see then whether I really do have a good gut instint and have predicted pregnancy before testing again or whether it is all just wishful thinking - which it could very well be too :haha:

Not much other news - have just been keeping myself busy to stop thinking of smokes, but my brain is a bit garbelled the last few days so I can't even think of how or what I was busy at :haha:

Natasha went trick or treating for the first time yesterday and loved it, we only went to about 5 houses as it was really cold, but we parked the cars so as people would have to come to the side door instead of the front and that leads into the kitchen so when we were having dinner she got to see all the trick or treaters that called to our door.


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## spidey

How was trick or treating Cleckner? You must be in the middle of moving right now!

Pippin, I can't believe its been 3 months already! How is Adelie sleeping at night?

jelr, the possibility of you being pregnant sounds promising, especially the arthritis symptoms since those can't be caused by nicotine withdrawal. I like how you have everything mathematically figured out :lol: its something I would do :haha: I liked the pictures you posted of Natasha on FB. She's an adorable little girl.

I'm still feeling good and waiting for the morning sickness to kick in, but still hopeful that I'll be spared. Everyday that goes by where I feel good makes me extra happy, so I've been a little too cheerful these last few days :haha: I think my vomit phobia started when I was sick for all those years with my food allergy problems. I was nauseous ALL day and night with pains in my stomach and I learned how to hold back vomit quite well. Being sick all the time eventually led to tons of anxiety and depression and it all went down hill from there, so I think that's when it started.


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## spidey

jelr, how are your symptoms now?? Are you testing this weekend? I NEED to know :lol: :blush:


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## jelr

All my symptoms are still there and I even had some nausea, but I got a bfn this morning :(. It is only Cd30 and I have never gotten a bfp before 32 days, but I used a frer and it says they are 99% accurate 2 days before so I reckon there is something up with my body or else I'm going mad and all these symptoms are all in my head. The hunger is driving me nuts, my tummy is rumbling so loud after every 2 to 3 hous of eating and I have already put up 7lbs and that wouldn't bother me if I was pregnant but now that I'm not it's driving me nuts. I feel so silly for convincing myself that I would be pregnant first month into it. I guess the power of positive thinking doesn't always work.

How are you feeling spidey?

Sorry if post is all over the place on my phone and rushing as I'm supposed to be getting ready for this christening.

Hope everyone has a good weekend. Xx


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## spidey

jelr, fingers crossed you get your bfp after a couple more days. 

It's been a hectic week because Kira is sick. My mom was really sick last week and Kira caught her germs. So she's been stuck to me all day and night (literally :haha:) and really really whiney. She's sneezed and coughed right in my face so now I'm waiting to get sick too. I'm worried about having a fever so early in pregnancy since it can't be the best thing for a developing embryo, but I don't have much choice at this point. 

As far as symptoms, I've been napping with Kira everyday, so I might be more tired or I could be tired from restless nights with her. I was also a bit queasy on Friday and had to use my zappy watch while at work. It gives little electric pulses to the nausea pressure point in the wrist. After I took a nap that afternoon, I felt better, so I think the nausea was from exhaustion. I'm definitely not as hungry as I usually am, but I haven't gone off chocolate yet. 

I'm getting really worn out from having an unhappy sick baby


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## Vici

Hello lovely ladies, back using my PC a bit more now so easier to read on here :) Mind if I come and join you? x


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## spidey

:wave: the more the merrier!


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## Shiv

jelr - :hugs: honey, you aren't out until the witch shows up and as you say it wouldn't be "normal" for you to get a BFP so early so there is defo still hope! I hope you have a nice time at the christening and get the result you want in a couple of days time.

Spidey - I wonder if you are having a boy? Are you going to find out? how bad was your sickness with Kira at this stage? I hope Kira gets better soon and you don't catch her germs!

Vici - Hiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii! more than welcome hon as long as you don't mind that the thread has become some what un-ttc related :haha: It is mainly a place for us to chat about our kids, moan about stuff and generally gossip!


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## Vici

I don't mind at all! Lol. Just seen your recent pic of cora, she is just gorgeous x


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## Pippin

Spidey and Jelr I have no idea where that last three months have gone. My newborn is no longer a newborn :( but she is my beautiful little baby that I just love more and more everyday :) She sleeps well most nights. Last night she slept from 7:30-6:00 but pin contrast the night before she was up almost every hour bar one solid three blocks. Generally though she sleeps 7:30-3:30 then again until we get up.

Spidey glad you are keeping the nausea at bay. Mine really kicked in at 6 weeks and lasted a lot longer and was stronger with Adelie. The old wives tale was right for me!

Jelr don't give up hope yet hun. Lie you said you got a late bfp other times and I did this time as well. Trust you're body it's probably telling you something way before the sticks do I'm keeping everything crossed for you :hug: Also re Allen Carr, my husband went to his classes (by him personally) before he was famous and stopped for 7 years, he did start again but read the book a week before our wedding and stopped again instantly and has been clean every since. Six years again so far and looks like he's a proper reformed smoker. Stick with it it can work trust me if you have the will. xxxx

:hi: Vici, I'm a bit of a part timer in here to be honest but I always love having you around. How is the Soy going?


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## spidey

well, m/s is getting worse as the day goes on. With Kira at this stage I couldn't stand too long, or move too much or I would get very light headed and that would trigger my nausea. I also couldn't smell foods or imagine eating certain foods. Right now I can move around fine, but if I think about a certain food it makes me want to barf. The only thing I could think about that didn't turn my stomach was salad so DH got me a salad for dinner. I survived off salad and grapefruits with Kira. Lucky for me, grapefruits are in season in early winter :haha:

I already decided that if something happens to this pregnancy I'm not TTC again. I am such a wimp when it comes to being sick :haha:

Kira has been so miserable today and has made me part of her hoard :lol: If I leave the couch she gets so upset and pushes me back to my spot. I've been sitting here surrounded with blankets, pillows, balls, toys, and the rest of Kira's hoard all day. They say you can't give cold medicines to children under 6 anymore, but I just gave her a little decongestant.


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## Vici

Spidey - hope your sickness doesn't get any worse and that Kira gets better soon. Its awful having poorly babies. 

Pip - not too sure about the soy. Ov pin pointed at CD13 but been spotting since 4DPO and Im now thinking it could actually be light AF but that's rubbish if it is as Im only 9DPO now. I don't know what to bloody think. Its stressing me out now which makes me eat which makes me not lose weight which makes me not go to docs. Vicious circle. If it was AF I've also missed the window for soy this month so hoping that its not another 100 + day cycle! Sorry for the rant! :-(


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## Pippin

Awww Vici that is rubbish if it is :( implantation bleed thinking optimistically? Do you have to take the soy at the beginning then? Maybe it's your body resetting itself :hug:

Spidey would you consider anti sickness meds? Might help you cope a bit if it gets worse. xxx


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## spidey

Vici, do you ever have really light periods? Fingers crossed its actually implantation bleeding! How does your bbt chart look now?

If the sickness gets worse I might consider medication. I need to keep on top of eating so my stomach doesn't ever get empty since that's when I feel my worse. It's hard because I fantasize about food and eating most of the day, and I love the feeling of getting hungry, eating really good food, and then being satisfied :lol: The morning sickness is here to stay I think. I've been munching on cereal and canned pears and DH is asking me what's for lunch. Blergh


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## Shiv

Vici - I hope it isn't another long cycle for you and that you figure out what is going on. If it helps, both Spidey and I had spotting inbetween ovulation and AF arriving (I had never experieced it before but had it the two months before I got my BFP), so perhaps it is nothing to worry about.

Spidey - well I am *glad* you ar ehaving symptoms as it means that things are progressing well, but I do hope your sickness doesn't get worse. What is your due date by the way?

Cleck - how are you, all packed up/ When do you leave?

As for us well I have a Christmas/MIL update for you all........ David came up with a compromise of invite MiL and partner to out house after she finishes work on Christmas Eve (3pm), they can they stay over and see the girls Christmas morning but leave about 11am when we will travel to my parents for a couple of days

SO David asked her and guess what................she doesn't want to leave her cats overnight, so she is having a think about it:dohh: She obviously isn't THAT desperate to see Sophia and Cora then.

Have I told you that she is a crazy cat lady? She started off with 2 kittens (normal ) and now feeds about 8 neighbourhood cats, that she now calls her own! :wacko:

SO Sophia took it upon herself to use the potty yesterday ( we were plannng on tackling potty training when David breals up for Christmas), she did 2 wees on there yesterday, and was nappy free all afternoon and evening without any incidents. SO today unless we have been out she has been nappy free, no wees, but while I was cooking dinner, Sophia came running in to the kitchen shouting "a bit of poo fell out of my trousers"..........she had obvioulsy done a poo and it had fallen down her trouser leg onto the carpet! She was quite upset about so I calmed her down and told her it was ok but that next time she should sit on her potty! What do you girls do on long car journeys, it would be a nightmare if on the motorway Sophia said that she needed a wee but didn't have a potty.

jelr - when is AF due and are you going to test again.

I need to be brave this week and get out and about a bit more, it won't do to stay in so much, it is not fair on the girls (still feels weird saying that!) and I need to get over the FEAR!! I want to find a gymnastics group for Sophia!


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## spidey

Yay for Sophia using the potty! We take a potty and toilet paper with us in the car and it sits on the empty seat. At some point she'll be more confident using a public bathroom and better at going wee before we leave the house. 

I think that's a very good compromise for Davids mom to see the girls. If she doesn't take you up on the offer than you can't feel bad.

During my early days with Kira I would work up the courage all week to leave the house for babies-r-us. I figured if she cried or pooped everywhere, the women in the store would be sympathetic :haha: 

The only thing Kira has eaten all day is chocolate frosting :dohh: The poor girl is so sick and is a little germ fountain. When she sneezes snot shoots out her nose across the room! My due date is July 1st, so add 10 days and we can expect the baby to be here on the 10th! I've been very surprised at how many of the 2nd babies come late... and also how large they are! Kira was 10 pounds so surely this one will be 12 pounds! :haha:


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## Shiv

spidey said:


> Yay for Sophia using the potty! We take a potty and toilet paper with us in the car and it sits on the empty seat. At some point she'll be more confident using a public bathroom and better at going wee before we leave the house.
> 
> I think that's a very good compromise for Davids mom to see the girls. If she doesn't take you up on the offer than you can't feel bad.
> 
> During my early days with Kira I would work up the courage all week to leave the house for babies-r-us. I figured if she cried or pooped everywhere, the women in the store would be sympathetic :haha:
> 
> The only thing Kira has eaten all day is chocolate frosting :dohh: The poor girl is so sick and is a little germ fountain. When she sneezes snot shoots out her nose across the room! My due date is July 1st, so add 10 days and we can expect the baby to be here on the 10th! I've been very surprised at how many of the 2nd babies come late... and also how large they are! Kira was 10 pounds so surely this one will be 12 pounds! :haha:

Poor Kira - but yum to the frosting! i hope she feels better soon.
They thought you had GD after Kira was born didn't they? Perhaps by keeping that under control you will have a slightly smaller baby?


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## jelr

Thanks girls - was really disappointed yesterday which is so silly to be when it is only the first month ttc and when it took so long with Natasha, am trying to think positive though as I really do think stopping to worry and relax is why I got pregnant eventually on Natasha.

Spidey: O no poor Kira, I really hope she is better soon, regarding the fever, I got a bad flu and was running a temp when I was pregnant on Natasha and the doc did say to keep it down by taking paracetamol and sponging myself down, which I did but it keep going up over a few days, but it didn't affect the pregnancy or Natasha at all. Hopefully you won't need to worry and will stay well, but I just wanted to let you know that a fever doesn't have to always be bad for pregnancy.

Shiv: Your MIL would drive anybody nuts :haha: - you and David have done your bit now and have made the offer so that she can see the girls and it is up to herself after that what is more important, so you have nothing to feel guilty about. I bet once you start getting out and about it will be easier and you won't fear it as much.

Pippin: Sounds like Adeile is thriving, Your husband is very lucky, I would love a seminar with Allen Car himself. I'm nearly finsihed the book, but have also gotten a loan of the one for women and am going to read that as I reckon every bit of reinforcement helps and being honest it is keeping me busy in the evenings so I'm not thinking about them as much :thumbup:

Vici: Of course you are welcome to join us, it is lovely to see you back as Shiv said I hope you don't mind our rantings and ramblings about everything and everyone :haha: - I'm so sorry you are getting down about it all, I can understand eating when your fed up though, I haven't stopped eating since I stopped smoking and I hate it as I know the weight i'm putting on is going to impact on the pcos and ttc, but I just can't help myself :dohh: - I really hope it is implantation for you and not another long cycle, you definitely deserve a break at this stage.

AFM: Well symptoms nearly completely disappeared yesterday so I'm thinking it is all in my head as I want it so badly now and maybe I am a bit mental :haha: - although the pain in my tummy is back today and boobs are a little sore, but that could be AF on the way, although I don't usually get sore boobs before AF except for that wonky cycle I had a few months ago. I don't know my body seems to be doing stange stuff lately, although maybe it is just with knowing we were starting to ttc I have just been reading it more since the mc, whereas it could have been happening before and I maybe wouldn't have noticed as much :haha:

AF is due on Tuesday if I do have a 32 day cycle but the extra half a stone may delay this :dohh:, so if for some reason that she doesn't make an appearance I will test on Tuesday.

We had a lovely day at the christening and Natasha was really well behaved and only really kicked up a bit when my mam collected her that evening, but that was only as she didn't want to go home, we were home by midnight which is really early for me :haha: but I only had a couple of drinks and didn't go to town on it just in case the test is wrong. I know AF will probably come now and I will be raging for staying sober, but then it is better to be safe than sorry. I did still have a lovely day though and chatting with the girls really cheered me up after my disappointment and I actually didn't mind so much not really drinking :thumup:

Dont know how much I will be in this week as I'm working the 4 days and really want to try and get some exercise done every evening to try and shift the extra I have put on and try and curtail my eating before It does get out of control. 7lbs in two weeks is not good :dohh:

I will definitley write a quick post if there is any other update on AF or any POAS.


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## Vici

Aimee - yes you have to take it like Clomid so CD2-6 for me. If it was just light AF then i've missed out :( You know, every time I see your avatar, it makes me smile, she is just so gorgeous x

Spidey - not really, they are never particuarly heavy even after waiting a few months but this was really light. Its so hard to know because my cycles are so up in the air, i never know whats going on! I def know what you mean about not getting hungry as I was exactly the same. I had mini cheese biscuits in my bag ALL the time and just nibbled on one all the time. If I got hungry that was when i felt worse. 

Shiv - yay for Sophia using the potty, thats fab. I'm not sure about long car journeys as we are yet to tackle that. Nappy free at home for ages but only ever do knickers outside of the house if she's just been and we're not going far! We were out yesterday though and she wanted a wee when I changed her bum but she was on a blanket in a car park so i took her to the corner and held under her legs and she went (took about 3 mins and my back was killing me but can't blame her TBH as her bum must have been chilly)!!! Def not ideal but seeing as Imi won't use a potty now, only a toilet stopping at the side of the road could be tricky! What a pain your MiL is, you have offered now and she can't make you feel bad. Its her decision x

Jean - I put on most of my weight when I gave up smoking but now i'm so glad. I'm very proud that I don't smoke anymore and whenever I have a craving I think of how much of a waste itd be if i had a ciggy lol (been just over 6 years for me and i still feel like one sometimes). Polos or gum seem to be a good idea for keeping your mouth busy rather than food :) PCOS is bloody rubbish isn't it! If it isn't bad enough that its there in the first place, then add an intolerance that makes you put on more weight than anyone else that in turn will make your condition worse - bloody cheers!!! Hope AF stays away for you, no signs isn't always a bad thing!! Fingers crossed x

AFM - still the same, although my back is killing me today and I have tender boobs (more than they've been for last few days!!) This is my chart as of today....

My Ovulation Chart 

Not really sure what to make of it! If i test -ive at 17DPO then i might change the spotting to AF and see where that takes me for next cycle xx


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## spidey

jelr, I'm sorry all your symptoms disappeared. You still have a chance as long as AF stays away! It's nice to hear you had the flu and it didn't affect your pregnancy. So far I haven't caught Kira's cold (fingers crossed!)

Vici, if your temp didn't dip down those 2 days you'd still be okay... grrr how frustrating. 

Kira is feeling so much better today! I've been lazy mommy though and we've sat on the couch all day reading books, watching tv, doing water color and making bracelets. I also let her eat a chocolate cupcake for breakfast... so the good mommy award of the day goes to me :blush::haha:

I've got a question... how many children would you like to have, but how many will you probably have realistically? I would like 2, but I can see how a third could happen by accident :lol: Knowing this will probably be my last pregnancy I'm trying to enjoy even the sh*tty parts :haha:


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## jelr

Vici: That chart would be perfect only for CD 20 and 21 :dohh: - Were you extra tired or anything else that could have made it drop. I have no advice as my chart is all over the place. I was so intent on pcos on Saturday first thing I didn't temp and then I was so fed up since I didn't either as I felt what was the point, but I should have to see how my chart changed if AF comes.

Yep PCOS is a real pain when it comes to the weight, I know people look at me and say sure you are not overweight now, but they have no idea what it takes for me to maintain that. I literally eat two wheetabix with skimmed milk for breakfast (if I'm not working I don't have any at all) - Then a toasted ham sandwich on brown bread with low low for lunch and then a healthy dinner and the only snack I might have is 1 pack of some type of light crisps. I do have a takeaway on a saturday and that is it and if I go out side of this I pile it on and the only way I can lose it is Low Carb or Lipotrim if I have a good bit to go which is basically 3 shakes a day and loads of water and that is it :dohh:

How long did you find you stopped really longing for a cig, Well done on the 6 years, I really hope i can do it :thumbup:

When will you test if AF doesn't arrive, I really hope this is it for you too :hugs:

Spide: I so glad Kira is feeling better and you have stayed well so far, hopefully you have managed to escape it :thumup:

I was really lazy last week, when I was off too and we did loads of arts and crafts and watched a few disney films. I am shattered this week, so hopefully that is a good symptom too.

I think initally I would have loved 3 children, but realistically I think we will have 2, because being honest I don't know if I could give as much as I would want to give to 3 and still work and as I have said before, we could live on DH wages, but it would only just cover the bills and being honest much as I have always said I would love to give up work since Natasha was born, I was so glad to have my job when DH lost his, we wouldn't have survived those 3 months without my wages. Also DH is a few years older than me, so time isn't on our side either and after the second MC, I would just be so happy if I do have another I don't think I would jinx it all and look for more if that makes sense.

Well still no AF for me and she was due today, although I think I did have a 33 day cycle last month and it could be a lot longer with the weight I have put on and the crap I have been eating. I did POAS today and it was still negative, but it was only a cheap one from boots. I did have some milky discharge this evening which could be a sign of pregnancy. I actually thought AF had arrived as I could feel it and went to the loo, to see this, which has now got my hopes up again as I had this on some of the other pregnancies. I have got some digitals so I'm debating whether I should test tomorrow or wait a few days, I don't really want to waste them as they are 17 for two, but I reckon curiousity will get the better of me :haha:

How is everyone else? Hope the move has gone well Cleck. Shiv did you get out any more with the two girls this week? MJ - thinking of you and hope you and Joel are home soon. Pippin: how are you this week?

Here is my chart to have a look at Vici - I know I just got the friend request, but I said I would post it here as I know spidey loves looking at these https://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/3827b2:haha:


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## spidey

oh darn jelr, I was really hoping you'd get a bfp today. You're still not out though and I still have hope. How are the cigarette cravings?

I've been feeling really crappy the last few days. I managed to make it into work for a few hours today and had to tell my supervisor about the pregnancy since I can't see myself making it into work over the next few weeks. A couple of nights ago I had to start sleeping in Kira's bed so I could wake up and eat through the night and not disturb them. Kira has been forced to fully night wean, and I hear her calling for mama from the bedroom in the middle of the night and I can't be there to comfort her. DH has been handling it well and is the one snuggling Kira back to sleep now. I've gone to sleep crying every night because I miss them :cry: I'm also feeling like an awful mother because I sit on the couch all day and watch cartoons with Kira while feeding her chocolate to keep her happy. I know its only temporary but I can't help but feeling like crap about it. DH and Kira are grocery shopping right now. I couldn't even make up a grocery list because the thought of food makes me ill. I normally plan out a weeks worth of meals and write down all the ingredients. DH is out there on his own- I have no idea what foods he'll come back with... chips and beef jerky maybe :haha: I keep telling myself that it's only temporary and by Christmas I'll be feeling good again and can cook, clean and be a good mommy again, ugh.


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## jelr

Awe spidey big :hugs:, I'm so so sorry you are so sick and feeling so rubbish. But you are not a bad mommy, it is only temporary and Kira won't even remember and I'm sure thinks its great to watch tv and eat chocolate, don't we all :hugs:. You need to just do whatever you can to get though the next few weeks and this sickness. On the up side though, it's is a very good sign that the pregnancy is progressing well. Would you think of taking anything for it?


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## Vici

Hi ladies :)

jelr - i don't really remember how long it took for the main craving to go away - I still get them now occassionally but it seems more to be when i am out having a drink or I go out for dinner. It really is so worth it, and i' can't tell you enough how well you're doing. When are you next testing?

spidey - o hun, don't feel bad, sometimes we just have to do what is necessary to function. Crikey, if i have a migraine I practicially let Imi do what she wants until Shaun gets home and I can go to bed! I know its hard but you need to try and relax, Kira is fine with her daddy and it sounds like he's doing a grand job of looking after her at night. Maybe it'll help you in the long run ready for when new baby arrives. 

How did the move go Cleck? Hope all is OK x

Shiv - how you doing hun? You been out with the girls? 

AFM, spotting seems to have stopped and back and boobs still ache like a biatch!! Stupidly tested yesterday (i have no idea why as I got a def BFN at 14DPO with Imi and only faint BFP at 15DPO) Going to wait till Sunday if no AF then test again!! 

Also I seem to have developed a climbing child. We tried the sides off her cotbed a few months ago but she was getting up about 10 times a night for a week so they went back on. Well the last 2 mornings (although not this morning) she has wandered into the kitchen having taken her sleeping bag off and climbed over the side!!! I have ordered a bed guard which should arrive tomorrow so looks like we're on operation get Imi to sleep in a bed again!! 

xx


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## jelr

quick run in as i'm meant to be working.

I was so good this morning and didn't test, but then caved a moment ago and used one of the digitals and it was another bfn :dohh: - I still can't help but feel that I am and it really is annoying me as I'm obviously not and it is just my mind playing tricks with me. I was never like this when ttc Natasha, maybe it was just because I never expected to get pregnant and really didn't test that much as AF was all over the place and only ever test if it was past 4 weeks and I had a night out planned just in case. Where as now I know I can get pregnant and know the symptoms and am thinking about it far too much and THINK I'm getting all the symptoms :dohh:

I suppose don't want to believe that my cycles are gone wonky again too as today is CD34. I'm so annoyed with that. I got pregnant in Jan and then the D&C was done in march and since then I have had either a perfect 28 day cycle for the first time in my life or 32 days (which is still really good for me to have it all the time) and I think 1 33 day cycle, so why now that we actually do ttc do they have to go wonky again. I'm kind of mad now that we didn't try earlier :dohh:

Vici: Sorry you got a bfn aswell, it is so disheartening isn't it. FX Sunday will tell a different story for you. Eeeek for Imi climbing out of the cot, I hope you can manage to get her to stay in bed this time. I haven't even attempted to take Natasha's sides off and know I really need to start thinking of it, but she goes through phases where she will cry for no reason until we go in and this will happen several times a night (like the 4 times I was up last night) so I just know she will be in and out of bed if she can. So I am so glad she hasn't started climbing yet and I haven't been forced to do it. Hopefully the bed guard will make a difference.

Well I really had better go and do something. I have no motivation at all the last two days and am actually so tired today, I'm stupid :dohh: - So much for starting my exercises this week, although I'm half afraid to anything too heavy until AF arrives just in case too. I hate how everything has to go on hold until AF arrives and you know :dohh:

Sorry for the moany post today girls.


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## cleckner04

Just popping in real quick. I haven't read thoroughly through so sorry about that ladies. :hugs: But I did read a few snippets. 

jelr- I'm sorry you keep getting BFNs and stupid symptoms. :( That must be really upsetting for you. :hugs: 

vici- I hope you end up getting your BFP this month. :hugs: Your not out till the stupid witch shows up! 

spidey- I'm so sorry you are feeling unwell. But I can't feel too bad for you because you are preggo and I'm not. :p :lol: I would take those bad feelings in a second if it meant I was pregnant. :haha: 




Well we are in albuquerque new mexico right now. We are going to take it easy tonight because Emma isn't feeling well. :( She popped in her first 2nd year molar. Well I had noticed she was getting a runny nose and fever two days ago but didn't even think about teeth. Well yesterday her fever spiked to 103. :cry: I checked in her mouth and noticed all four corners of one molar came through. She was really lethargic and last night she woke up and her eyes were twitching up and down really fast and she wouldn't make eye contact with us. I was panicking. Screaming for Corey to come in and check her. He held her and I said 'Emma look at mama' and she just looked behind me and she grabbed my face and squeezed it. It's hard to explain how she was acting. Definitely not like my baby and I had visions of her being blind and even having downs syndrome and I panicked and started bawling. I ended up finding cold medicine that had never been opened in our luggage and it said it helps reduce fever and helps with toothache. So I gave her half of one dose and it helped bring the fever down to 102. :wacko: She went to sleep and I slept in fits because I kept waking to make sure she's still breathing. But as of this morning she is fairly back to normal. A bit grumpy and wants constant cuddling and booby but I can deal with that. She's on my lap right now as I type. Her temperature is now down to 100 so I hope it keeps going down. She has no other sickness symptoms besides the runny nose and fever so it has to be teeth right?! We are still going to drive a little today but only 3 hours and 50 minutes today instead of the 6 hours we've been driving each day so far. We want to make it to texas by tonight. But I will keep checking her and stop obviously if we have to. There is a children's museum here in albuquerque that we are going to go to for a few hours this morning. I'm hoping it helps distract Emma and hopefully tires her out so she can sleep for most of the right later. I don't want to push it though. 


Also, my period started out of nowhere three days ago. So we are done now. It's like a cruel joke because I keep having dreams that I'm pregnant. Last nights dream was me using the doppler and listening to the heartbeat. :cry: So I'm done and I probably won't be on here very much anymore until he returns. I'll try to check up on you all when I can but it's kinda painful for me atm. And Facebook is sometimes even worse than here with all the randoms popping up with pregnancy announcements. I hate feeling this way. I feel so selfish because I should just be happy for what I've been blessed with. Emma is everything to me. But than I get around babies and Emma goes nuts saying 'baby! baby!' while she gently touches them. It kills me every time cause I want to give her that. Ugh! Okay, enough whining and negativity from me. I do genuinely hope all of you fall pregnant quickly. :hugs: I love seeing you girls pop up pregnant. It's the rest of the world that I hate. It's so weird and hard to explain. :haha: Anyways, I'm off to get around for the museum. :wave:


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## spidey

I really hope you stick around Cleckner. I need my fellow booby momma so I'm not so alone in having a booby loving toddler. And I was planning to somehow convince you to take pics of your new place so I can be nosey. :blush: And more pics of your fridge :haha: We need you here when we start posting about Christmas presents, and I need someone to complain about the snow with.

But I can understand you needing to step away :hugs:. I know you're not thinking of leaving because of me, but I promise not to moan about being pregnant for the next 9 months :rofl: And when I do start to moan you need to be here to tell me to STFU you ungrateful b*tch! :rofl: But seriously, I hope you stick around, perhaps just for this thread :hugs:

That's very scary about Emma's high fever. Do you think it was one of those febrile seizures? Kira had a very high fever for 3 days in a row and no other symptoms right when her 1st molars were coming in. We ended up taking her to the doctor on day 3, and she got antibiotics (which she became allergic too :dohh:) but I'm convinced it wasn't an infection and it was her teeth. I hope her fever goes away soon, poor girl :-( It's funny how she was the last to get her 1st tooth, but is already getting her 2nd molars- unless the other LO's have theirs and I missed it??


Vici- is the sleeping bag the kind that has separate leg holes, or are her feet in a sack? That's some skill to climb out of the crib and take off her sleeping bag! We haven't had Kira get out of bed and surprise us in another room yet :haha: She still calls out for us when she wakes up.

jelr, I'm sorry that you got another bfn. It would be nice to have your symptoms explained. 

Shiv, how is the week of activities away from home going?

As for me, today has been better. It's really strange how all the foods that I could stomach with Kira are the same foods that I can stomach now. So I'm surviving on dry rice cereal, lettuce smothered in salad dressing and grapefruits. Healthy aren't I :lol: Kira has been obsessed with painting, so every 15 minutes she requests to "pay" :haha: Her version of painting is squeezing the tubes of paint until they make a farting sound :rofl: and then she's done! I was using a tooth pick to remove dried paint from one of the tubes, so now she's obsessed with sticking toothpicks down the nozzles of the paint tubes :dohh: When I take her to her art class this January they're going to kick us out!


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## cleckner04

I definitely won't be leaving completely from here. I just don't think I'll be getting on every day anymore like I have been. It becomes too obsessive for me with looking at threads that I know will just make me angry. I don't have the willpower to just stick to this thread. :haha:


I just looked up febrile seizures and I think you are right spidey bc the definition is pretty much exact with a fever that came on really quickly and her body was rigid but twitchy and her eyes were open. She wasn't responding to us bib according to Wikipedia she was probably unconscious but her eyes were still open. It was all very scary and I was bawling by the end. I did the right thing though bc it says a lot of parents wrap their babies up to give them comfort but I did what I could to cool her down. Water and a cool bath and fever relieving meds. She was fine by the late morning and has been her normal self since. Thank god. It makes me think what I would do if I lost her and I don't think I could live I'd Emma died.


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## spidey

Cleckner, I'm glad she's back to her normal self and I hope her fever is gone now. It's good you did the right thing without even knowing and cooled her down :thumbup: I feel the same way about Kira. If something happened to her I wouldn't be able to go on living. Where are you at now in your cross country journey? I was able to avoid all those other potentially annoying threads by keeping this as my fav place on my browser :haha: Sooo... you never made a comment about my request for more fridge pictures :rofl: :blush: 

Kira has never seen another child throw a tantrum, nor have I ever thrown a tantrum :haha:, but she just started to do that action where she crosses her arms and makes a mad face when she's angry. Her other new thing is to collapse onto the floor in a ball of tears! And yesterday she started throwing things! It's all happening so fast, but she's a proper temper tantrum throwing toddler now! It's so hard not to laugh sometimes, but I've been trying to take her emotions seriously and talk her through them when I can. It doesn't help that she's very particular so she throws these fits all day long!


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## jelr

Oh God Cleck that sounds so so scary and it does sound like a febrile seizures, my friends little one had one a few years ago and it sounds the very same. I am terrified of temperatures because of it and sponge Natasha down if she gets a temp at all. Big :hugs: - I also know what you mean, I even shed a tear reading your post, because I can't even think about if something happened Natasha, I don't think myself or DH could live after that. It really doesn't bear thining about. I'm so glad she is back to her old self now :thumbup:

I'm so sorry the stupid bitch got you and that you feel you need to step away, but I agree with Spidey, I hope that you don't as I would miss you terribly too. I also have a link in my favourites straight to here, so maybe that is worth a try.

Spidey: I'm glad you are feeling a bit better today, No Natasha doesn't have her 2nd molars either, I keep thinking they are on the way, but nothing. Although she won't let me look in anymore and I try not to stick my finger in for fear of losing it :haha: so I really haven't had a proper look in a few weeks.

That is weird that you are able to eat the same stuff again, funnily enough I had this conversation with my friend today as they are also ttc and she said she knows she is not pregnant because she can still stomach weetabix - she had a major aversion to this on all 3 pregnancies.

Natasha had a good few tantrums a few weeks ago and also did throw stuff, but it seems to have stopped, I did have to stop myself laughing a few times :haha: - I usually ignored her and told her I didn't listen to screaming and I think she got fed up of doing it :haha: - mind you it could all start again :dohh:

Well still no AF for me and I still feel pregnant, and today I kept feeling a dribble sensation down there :blush: and thinking it was AF but nothing and then remembered I had this on the last pregnancy as well, so there is another symptom. I'm not going to test until Saturday though as that will be CD36, because when I think about it on Natasha I tested on CD28 and then I didn't do another until CD35 and it was very faint even then, I just presumed it was after the CD32 because that is when I got the positive the last time, so we will see. If it is still negative, I might go to the doc next week and see what is going on with my stomach or if I am just mental :haha:

I got very upset last night thought and said to DH that because I have felt so sure that I am pregnant, that bpn yesterday felt like another loss all over again and I really hate this limbo. I'm so bloated and my bowels are so sluggish that I'm uncomforable all day, but am afraid to take anything in case I'm pregnant. I feel annoyed at myself with the extra weight but am afraid to exercise or diet in case I'm pregnant and I'm terrified I should be on the baby asprin if I am.

Lord this ttc lark is really frustrating isn't it and this is our first month :dohh: What will I be like after several :dohh: Innocence and ignorance were definitely bliss when ttc Natasha and it was a far more relaxed approach than this, but I have no idea how to get back to that, now that I know about temping and ways that could help and now that I have experinced the symptoms to look for when pregnant :dohh:

Well Natasha is in staring questioning phase and it is very funny, I know people say it is annoying and it probably will get annoying, but I just think it is gas to hear her come out with some of it now. We have "why" - "what are you doing" - "whats going on" and "whats happening" all this week. :haha:

God this week is so long, I'm working again tomorrow and I can't remember the last Friday I worked and I have to do some training with a load of tutors from another dept around our quality assurance and assessment guidelines and they are a really cross bunch and will not like the extra paperwork that I will be training them on how to do, so I could be lynched, so I'm bricking it eeeekkkk. Wish me luck and I hope you all have a great weekend. Xx


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## cleckner04

spidey- I can try to post pictures but obviously it's not my place this time, it's the inlaws. :haha: So I'll have to sneak around when they aren't home otherwise they might think I'm nuts. 

jelr- I agree, TTC is very frustrating. I never thought I'd get this stressed about it. With my first pregnancy and with Emma it was so easy. I guess I'm getting payback now for being so smug about it back than. :dohh: 

I think I'll give your ideas a try with just favoriting this thread. Although no matter what I won't be on here as often simply because the inlaws only have dial up and it is ridiculously annoying and slow. 


We are now in an unknown city. :rofl: I really have no clue where we are. In missouri. I know that much. Edit: just checked the hotel door and it says lebanon, missouri. :rofl: So I guess that's where we are. We have about 3 hours until we hit st. louis. We plan on stopping in st. louis to go up in the arch and there is a children's museum I want to take Emma to that is there. Than from st. louis there is still 7-8 hours of driving before we will be home. :wacko: We are doing quite well though. We had one meltdown today where I ended up screaming at DH to just fucking pull over already because Emma wouldn't stop screaming and I couldn't calm her down and I'm tired and I let it all get to me and burst out in one giant adult tantrum. :shy: All of these time changes and sitting drives a person nuts though. 4 straight days of driving and we still have 1-2 days to go. :hissy:


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## spidey

jelr, I'm so sorry you're in bfn no AF land :hugs: Could you start taking baby aspirin just incase. It shouldn't hurt and if AF comes, then you can stop taking it so your bleeding isn't too heavy. I use to get my hopes up every month even after promising myself that I wouldn't. It was only this past month that I had no hope of being pregnant and didn't care if I wasn't. I hope you figure out what's happening soon so you can either celebrate or move on :hugs: 

TTC sucks, I never realized I had it so good when I accidentally got pregnant with Kira.

Natasha is such a cutie with her questions 

Oh Cleckner, I forgot about the inlaws part :haha: But pictures would still be nice :blush: :haha: Only having 1 meltdown is good. I am known for long trip meltdowns- we drove to Florida a few years ago and poor DH was yelled at so much and I didn't even have a toddler screaming in the back seat :lol: Your inlaws need to get with the times and get real internet!! Who uses dial up still?? :haha:


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## Shiv

Sorry I haven't been in much lately, I have been readng everyday but couldn't face writing a long reply one handed! Cora has been perma-feeding in the evenings.

Cleck - eek that sounds so scary, well done youfor knowing instinctively what to do. 
I hope your journey is going ok and Emma is all better.
I do hope that you will still come in here, with Christmas coming up I want to hear all about your plans for Emma etc.

jelr - any sign of AF? Your symptoms do sound very promising, especially the milky dribbles! Have a great weekend as I don't expect you'll be in until Sunday/Monday

Spidey - I hope Kira is better now. Don't feel bad about using the tv and chocolate to keep Kira happy. I have been doing the same here (much to David's disgust!). As far as parenting goes there is far worse we could be doing..........and I bet Kira i sloving having all those snuggles with you. 

I am sorry you are feeling so ill, but am happy because it means everything is going well with the twins.

Pippin - hey lovely.

Vici - any sign of AF for you? when will you test?

As for me well, i have been trying to get out and about a bit more, managed a trip in to town, a trip to the park and a trip to a friends house this week. Sophia has been quite good this week, apart from tipping Cora out of her bouncy chair :dohh: I don't think she meant any harm, just over zealous bouncing. She got yelled out though, the first time i have properly lost my temper with her. She burst in to tears and crumbled to the floor so I ended up comforting her and Cora! Cora was fine and we were told not to take her in to A&E by the ambulance man who DAvid was on a first aid course with.

Cora has been having issues with wind and pooing - she really struggles for ages and then often can't pass anything and her poos have started to go mucousy. SO I decided to try to go dairy free to see if it helps. It is hell, i am so miserable and it has only been 14 hours. I have realised that food is definitely my crutch at the moment, with chocolate I am thoroughly miserable. I went and bought some substitues which are ok, but I seriously don't think I can keep it up, soI hope Cora's gut matures and she gets better quick!

So Cora turned 6 weeks old this week, my 6 week weigh on was as follows

pre-preg weight = 9lbs 9oz
fully preg weight = 11st 11lbs (i think)
6 week post partum = 9st 12.5lbs

so only 3.5 lbs left to go, but i have only lost a couple of lbs in the last 3 weeks so it has definitely slowed down. I'll attach a picture.

Spidey - you asked hom many kids we would have. I always thought I would have 2 or 3. After Sophia we decided to stick to 2, and David is still sure about that but I am having a funny week. I feel kinda ........redundant. I feel like all the big exciting things in my life are now done (university, finding true love, getting married, buying a house, having kids), so I feel like I have nothing left to do and that makes me feel very sad. It probably sounds ridiculous, David thinks it is. He says our live snow are about watching the girls grow up and do all those exiting things. But I doesn't feel right that that is it for me now..........I dunno I just feel a bit sad about the most exciting times of my life being over.

David dropped the bombshell that he will be away Monday to Friday next week - eek, scared! Will go to my parents for a couple of days, but dont want to spend the whole week there. Sophia is a bit of a hnadful and when at home if sh ebehaves badly I can cope, but when we are there it reallt stresses me out.

ah I forgot to tell you all about Christmas plans! So david came up with a compromise for the mother in law. We asked her if her and her artner would like to come her eon Christmas eve afetr she finished work (at 3pm) and stay over, then open pressies with us Christmas morning and then they go off to David's brothers in time for lunch and we will go to my parents. Well she turned us down! She can't leave her cats apparently! So has now suggested that she comes up on the 23rd Dec for the day, which is great, don;t know why she didn;t just say that before (oh that's right because she lied and told us that she only had Christmas Day off). BUT that she also wants to come to my parents house on Boxing day for a few hours to see the girls. Say what? If she has seen them 3 days previously why does she need to do that? My parents have met her twice, once at our engagement party and once at the wedding. They are very different people and they will have a hosue full in boxing day. BUT I can't exactly say no as then it looks like they don't like her! I haven't asked my parents yet. They will say yes but I know my dad will be pissed off and it will be MEGA awkward. Why can't the woman just be normal! rant rant rant!


right gotta feed Cora, hope everyone has lovely weekends! xx


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## jelr

No I'm here on a Friday for once :haha: 

DH said this evening that he wouldn't mind seeing the Ireland match, so I told him to go ahead as he usually takes or leaves them and is not a fantatic, so I'm lucky in that way. Even though we have 4 tv's in the house, they all show the same station as they are all hooked up to sky, so I jumped onto the laptop when he was watching it :thumup:

Cleck: you did well only having one meltdown I would crack up with that amount of travelling and would probably crack a few times, especially if I had a screaming toddler. I'm glad you decided to try the favourites. We would all miss you here. I can totally understand you not being on as much on dial up though, that would drive me insane. I have no patience :haha:

Spidey: Funny thing is we did try for nearly two years with Natasha and I don't remember being this caught up in it. I really did prefer the relaxed approach we had that time and wish I could be there this time because it was so much easier. I suppose in one sense I'm terrified I have left it too late and that it might take 2 years and Natasha will be 4 or 5 and DH will be much older and I just had it in my head that it would happen straight away after our "accident" last time. 

How are you feeling now? Is Kira better now too? I saw your post on FB and am sorry that her speech is still worrying you, those babies (or I suppose I should say toddlers, really like to worry us) - I do think she is going to start one of these days and pass them all out :thumbup:

Shiv: I can totally understand you feeling so miserable without chocolate and you sound like I feel about missing the cigs - I know you are probably wondering why, when chocolate tastes so good and cigs smell so bad :haha: - Food is now my crutch and I'm starting to wonder if everybody has one. I hear most non smokers talk about food as if it is thier crutch and food honestly never bothered me before, but now it is all I think about since I quit :haha: - I hope that the dairy and choc is not Coras problem and that it sorts itself out. I know you probably don't want to give her anything, but if this doesn't work. I know we had to give Natasha infacol and it really did help with wind.

As for Davids mother, she really is being a pain. Is she a good mixer, would she maybe just come on boxing day and be totally uncomfortable with your parents having a crowd around and head home after a half hour or an hour - or could you even say, yes that is no problem as long as you don't mind a houseful and hope that it does put her off and that she might be happy to just see them on the 23rd. At least you don't have to face going over there on Christmas day.

Eeek on Sophia knocking Cora out of the bouncy seat, I'm so glad she wasn't hurt. I know I would totally lose my temper too and hopefully she will have learned her lesson now, she probalby got a fright herself between both you and Cora. It all sounds so stressful though :hugs:

Well done on the weight - that is amazing that you have only 3.5lbs to go after just 6 weeks, ha I have more to lose after a few weeks of eating crap :haha: - I bet you lose the rest of it with giving up chocolate :haha:

I do know what you are saying about the big things in your life being over. I think every womans kind of feels like that once they have decided they are not having any more children. My mam had 7 of us and at one stage when she was in her late 40's, they were talking about maybe doing a hysterectomy and she was so upset and told me that even though she knew she was too old to have any more children and had enough that it made her sad that she definitely would not be able too if they had to do the op.

I sometimes feel like all Natasha's big things are over now that she had done her firsts and even though I will be there to love her to bits and nurture her more and witness plenty more moments, I do feel sad that all the really big firsts are completely gone and that they are such a huge and exciting part of our lives that is done with and won't ever be lived again, so I think I know what you mean or does that even sound remotely what you are talking about.


I'm glad I'm not the only one with the milky dribble :haha: and the likes of that is what is making me think I'm not imagining it as that was real and I definitely couldn't have imagined it :haha: and I haven't been even thinking about the symptoms or anything, they have just appeared one by one and it is only once they have come that I have remembered I had them when pregnant before.

Well AFM - I caved and did another test today at CD36 and it is still negative. I'm going to test again on Monday if AF hasn't come and if it is still negative I'm going to go to the doc and see if they can shed any light on it. I'm terrified that I could have had another mmc already and that is the reason for the bfn, but I don't even know if that is possible. I have looked on Dr. Google tonight and apparantly some people can actually be pregnant and still get bfn, although I may be crutching at straws now at this stage, but I'm not the type of person to imagine things usually or get symptoms that are not there and I know DH thought I was cracking up last time but I was right and I have that same knowing feeling this time, but the tests are telling me different or maybe because I still had a knowing feeling after the test the last time and with Natasha, I just have it in my head that I'm always right on this :haha: and I'm actually not, because surely the test should be postive at this stage right????

I have decided that if I'm not, I'm going to get one of your fertility monitors cleck - I noticed when I was buying my tests in boots that they have them on sale for &#8364;75 and I would like to know for definite if I am ovulating, because if I'm to go by my chart I'm not, but then I'm not sure how accurate it is as I only wake when Natasha wakes me and that could range from 7 to 10 am (unless I'm working of course) and I could also be up several times during the night with her. I think I'm more worried that If AF does turn up that I may not be because of my cycles going a bit crazy if I'm not pregnant this time and don't want to waste months, because if the monitor tells me i'm not then I will ask to be referred back to the specialist that was dealing with me for the PCOS and when it wasn't happening for us with Natasha.

DH is not too impressed and just wants to let it happen naturally, but my thing is it can't happen at all if i'm not ovulating.

I'm just thinking how is it when I think I won't have time to get in that I'm in here more than ever like this week :haha: 

I'm glad work is over this week though as it was an awful long week for me doing the 4 days, but the training session went well and nobody lynched me and in fact the evaluation I got them to all fill out at the end was extremely postive and they were all happy, so that is good :thumbup:

Okay well I have waffled on enough tonight :haha: - Night all and I hope you all have a great weekend. Xx


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## spidey

Shiv said:


> I am sorry you are feeling so ill, but am happy because it means everything is going well with the twins.

 :rofl: you are so mean!

Good luck next week alone. I hope you see some positive changes in Cora's poos with your diet change. I bet after a few days without dairy and chocolate you'll find it easier. I've had to eliminate a few foods from my diet over the years and those first few days are always the hardest because its like a withdrawal period. That being said, I've gone off chocolate but actually managed to eat a chocolate bar yesterday, yum! :evil:

Re: feeling redundant. It's so funny you mentioned it Shiv because I've been feeling the same way. I'm pretty sure this is the last baby (if all works out) so I've been a bit sad that I'll never TTC again, never be pregnant again and once this one weans, my boobs will no longer be useful. Kind of like there is nothing left to look forward to, but I know how ridiculous that sounds. 

jelr, food is definitely my crutch and I'm lucky my metabolism is still keeping up with my intake. I had an easy time with using opks, so getting one of those fertility monitors might be the way to go if temping isn't working. I really hope you get some answers soon regarding your symptoms and your bfn's. I think when we really focus on our cycles is when we notice all the weird things that happen. Remember how I had that cycle where I got a very slight bfp for one day and then it took 14 more days before AF came? I think these misfire cycles just happen and it's only when we're really focused on things do we really take notice. I hope you get answers soon :hugs:


Kira is doing much better. She still has a lingering cough and stuffy nose, but finally has her appetite and energy back. I'm still sleeping in Kira's room at night, but I'm realizing it was for the best. She doesn't wake up in the night searching for booby anymore and I can officially say she's finally sleeping through. When I start feeling better DH is planning to transition her to her own bed. 

I haven't been feeling any worse, and if anything I've been feeling better because I remembered all the anti-nausea tricks that I learned while pregnant with Kira. Besides nausea I don't have any other symptoms, which is a bit worrying at times. I even managed to make it into work last week, although I had to sneak snacks in the lab and I ate my lunch in the car :haha: I eat ALL day long but I crave amazingly healthy foods so I stopped taking my vitamins since they make me sick. Every so often I get really worried that something will happen to this pregnancy. I even had a dream last night that I started to bleed. But my worry is much less than with Kira, and I think it's because I already have everything I want in life, and this baby will just be a really nice bonus. At the end of this month I'm going to try and find the HB with my doppler and then I'll have a better idea if things are okay in there.

DH has been doing ALL the house chores without me even asking! Laundry, cleaning, cooking, dishes... it's amazing! When we were TTC I kept saying "you know, if I get pregnant you'll have to do all this house work" so I must have brain washed him :haha:


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## Vici

Hi girls, finally found time to sit down and have a good ctch up - man you girls can type lol!!!

Cleck - o my word, well done you for surviving that long without a meltdown, i'd have cracked waaaaaaaay sooner. I just cannot even comprehend that amount of travelling. Glad to see that Emma is feeling better now. Hope you do stick around - i do know exactly how you feel though. Although for very different reasons, it seems we are both in limbo land :( I agree with Spidey, all I am doing is having this thread as my fav and not looking at anything else xx

Spidey - glad your DH is doing all your chores for you and well done for brainwashing him lol. Its a sleeping bag where her legs are in a sack! It is like some kind of olympic event how she manages to flip herself over the top!! Still waiting on her bed guard so we can take the side off her cot! The scariest thing about her getting out is the fact that she manages to sneak into our room without waking us and then stands about 6 inches from your face whispering "mummy, wake up" :shock:

Jelr - after seeing your chart on FB I def think you are in with a chance and are looking at an AF expected day of Wednesdya. You have good high temps though so got my fingers crossed. Can you not start the baby asprin and then just stop if you're not PG? We are having lots of questions from Imogen too - am coping pretty well with them at the min. The one thats really annoying me is Imi saying - "Muuuuuuummmmmmmmmmy?" "Yes Imogen?! then nothing. And repeat. After about 4 times when I look at her she just has this stupid big grin!! Shaun tried to play her at her own game and after about 5 mins of her saying daddy and him saying Imogen, he gave up lol!!

Shiv - glad you've managed to get out a few times. Def good for the system. O no at Sophia tipping Cora out :dohh: Glad all is OK though. Massive well done on your weight, that is AMAZING!!! You should be really proud of yourself. And well done for cutting out your chocolate - thats no mean feat!! Really sounds like you can't win with your MiL. Hope you manage to get something sorted out without upsetting anyone xx

AFM - completely and utterly fed up!!! Hate not knowing whats going on and now don't even think i ovulated!! Shouldn't be suprised really but I can't help but let it get to me. Why doesn't my stupid body work!!! Think i'm gonna have to go in for Cambridge Diet or something (if I can persuade OH to let me) as I just cannot shift it and am not going to put myself through docs and consultant when I know what they are going to say!!! Feeling utterly shit and to top it off DH was out at football all last night and has gone bowling with some mates this arvo and out drinking straight after while I'm at home with a grumpy snotty toddler. Grrrrrrrrr :growlmad::growlmad::growlmad:


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## spidey

Vici, that's so funny that Imogen escapes and then wakes you up like that :haha: I spoke too soon when I said that Kira doesn't leave the bed without calling for us. Yesterday morning DH woke up because he felt something brush against his foot, and it was Kira walking around the bed to leave the room! Of course now we're shutting the safety gate at the top of the stairs once she's in bed so she won't tumble down the stairs in the middle of the night. 

I'm sorry your cycles are so unpredictable and irritating. Are the doctors refusing to help because they think you have weight to lose? If so, that's so unfair.. it's like refusing to help a gay couple have a child. :growlmad:

So, I need to hear about the laziness level of everyone's toddlers :haha: I think Kira is extremely lazy and she has me well trained to do everything for her! If she wants something, she'll reach out her arm and wiggle her hand and make a grunting sound- then I pick it up for her. She doesn't go to her toy area and pull out a toy to play with- I have to pick out a toy and then she might play with it. She doesn't go off to explore the house on her own- she makes me carry her everywhere! And she becomes a ball of tears if I suggest she do something on her own. So I'm well trained, right? :haha:


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## Pippin

I just can't keep up with you chatterboxes :dohh:

:kiss: to you all.


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## jelr

Hey girls

Spidey: I'm glad some of your MS tricks are working, how long did you have ms with Kira. I hope you won't have it for too much longer. Well done on getting DH to do all the chores :haha: - I hope he keeps it up now for the full 9 months and after :thumup:

Yes Kira definitely has you well training :haha: - Aww no Natasha has her moments of lazyness too, I told you sometimes she screams at night and when I go in, she just wants her teddy to be put under the blankets or he is the wrong way around :haha: - She does tend to bring me with her to the toy room every now and again, but she will pick out her own toys. She does prefer to walk though than be carried, which is good as my back is not so good the last few weeks and I actually only said to DH, I actually have a habit of carrying her and there really is no need now. I just find it quicker sometimes :haha:

Pippin - :kiss: to you too. xx

Vici: :hugs: to you - I'm sorry you are feeling so fed up with it all. What is the Cambridge Diet?? - Also is there no way the docs would start treatment without the weight loss, the fact that you had the treatment already. it might be worth a shot to just look for a referral and see what they say, at least you might feel like things are moving somewhere. How much do you have to lose to get to what they would want you at?

I can't believe Imi manages to get out over the cot in her sleeping bag and all :shocked: - I would say she frightens the life out of you, when you wake and she is right in front of your face :haha:

I hope Imi's cold is better and she is in better form, there is nothing as bad as being home alone all day with a grumpy toddler :growlmad:

Well not much news from me, as you all know from fb, I think I know what is going on now and that they symptoms are all just really bad pmt. I hope it is just the smoking like you said spidey, because I really do feel drained with it all and could do without this for two weeks every month or 6 weeks, my boobs are killing me so badly and it is so painful to cuddle Natasha :dohh: - Friday is D day now for AF - I do expect she will be here though as I don't trust my gut feeling anymore with all these LP symptoms :haha: - Well I couldn't really seeing as my gut feeling was that I was pregnant before I probably even ovulated now. I was fed up when I copped it all first, but I'm okay now as at least I know what was going on now, all these symptoms and bfn and no AF was doing my head in, and at least I'm nearly sure I'm am ovulating now, which although I didn't really have many worries about after 3 pregnancies, but I think with PCOS you do always worry that it might be an issue or that things have changed since the last pregnancy. 

Well we didn't do much the weekend and just tidied what was the nursery and then the toy room and also the back kitchen, because they had both become a dumping ground. My friend called on Saturday with her nephew who is 10 months, and herself and DH went outside to go for a smoke so I had 2 children in my care for 10 mins and survived :haha: - I did think it was going to be a disaster as he normally doesn't let my friend out of his sight, so I was trying to distract him with a soft book and Natasha of course decided she didn't want to share :dohh: - I managed to convince her to show him the lovely pictures and tell him who they were so they were both happy in the end :thumup:

My mam also gave us a surprise - she has also given up smoking since last Monday, she didn't tell anyone. She decided she would take my lead. I'm so proud of her as she is doing really well and a bit ashamed really as she is smoking twice as long as me and I have sruggled so much :dohh: 

Well I had best get to bed, work tomorrow :growlmad:


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## spidey

Hi Pippin :flower:

jelr, thats wonderful that you've inspired your mom to quit smoking too. I bet she's struggling with it too, and for all you know she decided to quit because you made it seem easy. Natasha is cute with wanting her teddy positioned just right. 

Kira started a bad habit today of throwing her food and saying "BLAH" when she's tired of eating something. I think she's been acting up recently because she senses something is off with me. Plus I don't sleep with her at night or see her in the mornings anymore. Her whole little world has been turned upside down. We even eat meals on the couch now so I can lay down. I use to spend my afternoons and evenings cooking in the kitchen but now DH heats up unhealthy microwave meals, and we use to take trips to the store as a family but now I'm left at home while DH and Kira go off by themselves. It's really quite sad when I think about it :cry: Gosh I'm an emotional wreck!! I'm expecting my m/s to go away around 12/13 weeks like it did last time, and perhaps ease up a bit at 10 weeks. Time is going by too painfully slow!


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## Vici

jelr - thank you. I dunno, I might make an app at the docs as at least it'll get things moving. Not sure how long the waiting list is at the moment either. Well done on inspiring your mum to give up smoking too, thats fabulous. Cambridge diet is a food replacement diet (just shakes!!) but I don't think Shaun will let me do it. Imi is still poorly sadly, been 4 days now - nothing to worry about, just fever and snotty but still not nice for her (or me, lol).

spidey, don't feel bad about how things are at home atm. You know Kira is well looked after and she knows you'[re there, she's prob just worried about her mummy. Take it easy and hopefully things will start to ease off in the next few weeks xx


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## jelr

Aww Spidey :hugs: - I'm sorry your feeling so bad, but honestly don't worry about Kira, she is definitely being well looked after by DH and it is only a couple of weeks and she won't even remember anything was different once things go back to normal. I know the time is probably taking forever when you feel so sick, but it is only another few weeks. I really hope that you are feeling better sooner rather than later.

Vici: Yeah that sounds like a good idea to go to the doc anyway and see what they say, as it might be a long waiting list, so that would give you time to hopefully get some weight down, but at least you might feel like things are moving on and hopefully they won't expect you to lose too much or might just give you treatment, the fact that you needed it before. 

I know exactly what the Cambridge diet is now, here we call it Lipotrim and it is how I lost all my weight initially and after Natasha. I can understand Shauns concerns and it can't be good for your body - I know when I was on it the first time, my rheumatologist accussed me of drinking too much as my liver function tests were showing this :haha: and I actually hadn't had even a sup because I was on this for 6 weeks, so it did do something on that end, but on the other hand, it does really work and it does work quickly and I have to say I always felt really healthy on it after the 1st first week, my hair and skin were better and my nails grew really quickly and were a lot stronger and I did have loads more energy and it was actually my gynacologist that recommended it to me. So that is my version of the pros and cons that I know of. Have you ever done it before? Bloody PCOS is so frustrating when it comes to losing weight :hugs:

I hope Imi is better soon too, could it be her 2nd molars?

Not much news from me - went to buy the fertility monitor and boots dont have anymore and the price is way too much everywhere else - have asked you all a question on OPK's on fb - I'm too lazy to write it again :haha: - Think AF is definitely on the way Friday as my temp is on its way down.


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## spidey

jelr, I saw your question on FB  Hope I helped

Is the cambridge diet low carb? I sort of eat low carb due to my limits on not eating gluten. I know quiet a few people who went low carb to lose weight and felt loads better, but realized in the end that it was actually gluten causing their health problems. You don't have to be super skinny with the runs to have celiac. There are plenty of people who have trouble losing weight, fertility issues, gut problems... basically everything can be affected. I think it's something like 1 in 100 people have it and most don't know. Something to keep in mind especially if you feel better going low carb (I'm assuming that's what the Cambridge diet is). haha, enough gluten preaching from me!

We had a MAJOR potty disaster today! I figured you girls could get the humor in it :haha: Kira has a major poop aversion so when she has to poop she refuses to sit on the potty to pee since the poop might come out. So she had to pee but didn't want to sit and pee. She kept holding it and holding it and finally started to pee while standing on the couch. She stopped and I got her on the potty and she finished with a nice big bowl of concentrated pee. She wanted to walk the pee into the bathroom herself (we keep the potty in the livingroom) but I said I needed to change her pants first. She got mad and THREW the potty bowl across the livingroom :shock: I screamed "NOOOOOOOOO!!!!" and then she had a total meltdown because of me screaming since I never scream. There was pee everywhere. Splashed on the wall, toys, table, rug, floor... it was awful. So I started running around to clean up the puddles and Kira decided to go off and scream as she hoarded more items to the couch. Then I look over and see a bulge in her pants :dohh: she poo'd and I don't think she even realized. So then I had to tackle the smeary poo disaster too. She was kicking and fighting as I was trying to get off her pants without making a mess and it got everywhere. It took an hour from start to finish to get it all cleaned up and to calm her down. She felt bad for throwing the pee- I asked if she was sorry and she nodded yes. This all happened right before nap time so by the time it was done we both needed a nap bad :haha:

Hope everyone is doing good! Cleckner, are you to your final destination yet with your dial up? :lol: 

I've been feeling good the past 2 days so I'm hoping there's still a baby in there!


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## Shiv

Spidey - eek at your potty disaster! This is my worst fear, if I am breastfeeding Cora when Sophia uses the potty, which I often am, she tries to pick it up and I am like NOOOOOOOOOOo wait for mummy because I know it will go everywhere.

I hope that maybe you are starting to feel a teensy bit better now Spidey, if not then you should hit the peak soon and come down the other side :hugs:

Vici - I see from fb that FF thinks you ovulated, that's good right?

jelr- I hope your mum sticks at the not smoking and that you can suport each other through it. My mum hit her 1 year smoke free this week and I sent her flowers from Sophia and Cora saying how they proud they were of her.

I can't remember what else has been said, but I hope you are all doing ok.

As for us, well i am on day 9 of dairy free and it is still hell and I had a little cry earlier (pathetic I know) when David prepared a floor picnic for us and all I could eat was bread and ham, when Sophia and him got stilton and falafel and pate...........who knew so much stuff had dairy :shrug: On the down side, Cora has had a couple of bad nights where she hasn't settled until the early hours, so no imrovement there. On the plus-side i weighed myself today and I have lost 3lbs since my last official weigh in (a week and a half ago, I missed this weeks because I was at my parents). That puts me at just half a lb over re-preg weight!

Potty training news, Sophia is pretty much nappy free at home apart from nap and night time. She happily takes herself off for a wee, but we haven't had a poo in her potty yet as she waits til she wakes up from her nap and does it in her nappy! i have been telling her how exciting it will be when she does a poo in her potty! Am very nervous about leaving the house without a nappy, will leave it a week or so i think.

So I went to my parents for a couple of days this week as david was away Monday-Friday and had a bit of a nightmare time to be honest. Cora and Sophia both slept badly the first night, which meant both me and Sophia were tired the following day. Sophia was in a grup and screaming frequently. We were out most of the day visiting friends and when we got back, for some reason Sophia didn;t want to go back inside the house. It was cold and dark so I picked her up and put her inside - cue screaming fit. The phone rings and my mum answers it so I take Sophia into the next room. Try to get her boots and coat off and calm her down. 5 mins later she is still fully dressed but is calm. She says she wants to go into the room mum is in so I exlplain that nanny was on the phone so if we go in there we have to be really quiet and practice our whispering. We go in and Sophia is quiet as a mouse when my mum shouts, "get her out of here", shocked I pick SOphia up and go in the other room and understandably SOphia starts screaming again. another 5 minutes and I get her calmed down and manage to persuade her to take her boots off but she wouldn't budge on her coat, so I thought, fine keep your coat on, no big deal. Mum comes into the room, and says to Sophia "aren't you gonna take your coat off" to which Sophia screams No and I want my boots back on! more screaming and I say "nice one mum, its taken me 10 mins to get the boots off her", Dad shouts at mum to shut up. I calm Sophia down and mum goes up to her and says "are you going to say sorry to me for making that horrible noise" - Sophia apologises and I am left fuming, thinking that mum should probably apologise to her for shouting! Mum has a go at me for letting her back in the kitchen and I say but she was being quiet, to which she replies "it was an important call I didn't know that she wasn't gonna throw another wobbly". So i was really pissed off, youc an;t shout at a kid because they might throw a wobbly, and her shouting did make her throw a wobbly. SO we had a very tense dinner and I went to be bed early. If I could have just put the kids in the car and driven home I would have done. Going there is supposed to be a break for me, it is not nice when a toddler tantrums but I feel being there just makes it worse because it stresses me out even more. At home it is such that there isn't much she can damage and if she throws a tantrum and I can't calm her and it is not over something life damaging I just let her get on with it. I can't do that there and it stresses me out. SO now I don't want to go back, or at least not for more than one night so that if Sophia is tired the next day we can just come home. ho hum!

Not sure i have any other news really, very very tired but other than that ok!


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## spidey

Shiv, I wouldn't be happy with that visit either. Are your parents usually more helpful and understanding? You'd think that as grandparents they would remember how hard it can be getting a toddler to cooperate. I do think your mother should have apologized to Sophia for yelling and not the other way around. Most of the time my MIL is helpful when she visits, but sometimes she's the opposite and I get really mad about it. Then I feel guilty for feeling that it's my right to have a break while she visits- which I do think I'm entitled to! :blush: 

We've been having some issues with Kira's diet recently. I haven't been cooking for the past 3 weeks so she hasn't been getting proper nutrition at home, and my parents are horribly failing at giving her nutritious foods too. On Friday Kira ate nothing but cookies and icecream. She conned my mom out of icecream cups and then icecream cookie sandwiches for breakfast and lunch. As soon as my Dad came home from work Kira hung off the freezer door handle and my Dad said "do you want icecream?" Dinner was being put on the table as he asked this. :dohh: So Kira had another icecream cookie sandwich for dinner instead of a proper meal. So this weekend I've only offered her healthy foods. She refused to eat much on Saturday but finally around 3pm hunger took over and she started to eat my healthy offerings.

Shiv, it sounds like Sophia is really catching on to using the potty! I didn't leave the house with Kira for a week, and then for another 2 weeks I only left the house right after she peed and only stayed out 1 hour max. If we went to the park, I would lug around the potty chair... DH was really set against using any diapers at all since he thought it would confuse her. He was the one brave enough to keep the diaper off at night. So far she's had no night or nap accidents, so I guess she was ready and he was right. She does occasionally pee in her pants during the day, but only on days where a poop is imminent and she refuses to get near the potty. 

In other news... Kira started saying her name! She says "tee-ra"! She also just started saying mommy and daddy instead of mama and dada. So now she says "Mommy Daddy Teera!" over and over again. She also says "pizza pie" and if we ask "what do you want to eat?" she always says "pizza pie" clear as day :haha: DH has been eating alot of pizza recently, so pizza is her new favorite food. She's trying to say words now too, which I'm very pleased about. I think things are just beginning to click so fingers crossed she starts to build her vocabulary now and make 2 word sentences. 

I'm feeling the same. Very bloated and the shittiest in the evening. It takes me until 1am to fall asleep since heartburn keeps me awake. Thankfully I feel pretty decent in the mornings and DH brings me breakfast in bed. So I eat slowly and then usually feel good for the rest of the morning. This week is Thanksgiving week and me and DH have the entire week off :happydance: So lots of resting and sleeping in my future :thumbup:


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## overcomer79

Spidey...I'm so dreading PT. We finally just got James to sit on the potty for five minutes last night. He has a cars potty and likes to press down the gear shifter to have it make noise. Shame he didn't pee or boo boo lol.


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## jelr

Oh Spidey, I'm sorry but I did laugh, but in an OMG sort of way :haha: - I would die, that is the last thing you needed when you have been so sick to have to clean up pee from everywhere and every thing eeeeekkkkkk.

I hear you on the grandparents, that is why I send over Natashas lunch when I'm working because my mam never has any fruit and veg in the house, so nutrition would be out the window and it would be ice-cream and cookies here too :haha: - Although she is good and doesn't give her too many treats in between what I send over thank goodness :thumup:

That is absolutely fantastic about the Mommy and Daddy and "Tee-ra" that is so cute, I can actually here her saying it too as it is how Natasha pronounces Kira. That is definitely the start to it.

Enjoy thanks giving and all that rest.

Shiv: Oh Shiv, you are not having an easy time of it with the dairly free, you poor thing and after all the hardship Cora is still not settling. Did you try the infacol after? Did it help at all? No wonder you are shattered and then to head down to your mum and dads and have all that happen. I can totally understand you being pissed too. Your mum shouldn't have shouted at her when she was actually being quiet and there is no possible way in asking a toddler to apologies for making lots of noise or having a tantrum because when they are like that they don't see reason or realise that they are being unreasonable, so by asking the to apologies is only going to start another tantrum. It will all get easier though. Does Sophia have to sleep in the same room as you when you are there as maybe she might sleep better in a different room. I know this may not be possible, hopefully as Cora gets a little older and settles better, you might all get more sleep when you are there.

Well done on the weight loss though. Please tell me what your secret is though, What did you do so differently this pregnancy from the last to not pile it all on??

Well done to your mum on the 1 year mark, I am doing a lot better this week, so I'm hoping that this is the start of it all disappearing from my brain now :haha:

yay for the potty training and you didn't really have any stress or fuss with it. I'm going to try again the week after New years because I'm not back to work until the 9th so fingers crossed she is ready then. She is not showing any different signs though, but then I figured she was ready mentally, but when it came to it, she just didn't have the bladder control and the couple of months may have improved that. Although she doesn't tell me before she needs to go yet or doesn't attempt to take off her nappy, so I'm not sure, so we will have to see. I will just take the relaxed approach again and if it is a disaster, well it won't be the end of the world and we will just leave it until later again.

Overcomer: I see you have a ticker, congratulations :thumbup:

Cleck: I hope you have got home okay and that you are enjoying the time there and that Emma hasn't been sick again.

MJ: Hope you are doing well too and managing well with both babies, let us know it is all going when you have a minute :thumbup:

Vici: How is Imi now, is she feeling any better? I definitely think the Soy is doing something hand on heart, so please don't get completely frustrated with it all. I can understand how upsetting it must all be though. I was like a basket case this cycle not knowing what was going on when it went passed the 32 days again :dohh: - so if it was going up to 170 days I would be tearing my hair out.

Pippin: I hope Sam and Adeile are both keeping well.

Well not much news with us at the mo - AF got me as you all probably know from FB - it was 6 weeks exactly, but at least my LP was 14 days. I was a bit disappointed at first, but then I think I knew she was on the way for the few days before and once I had figured out my chart I had an idea that was going to happen. I'm realy glad I did chart though as I honestly never expected to have a normal chart, so that was really nice and I actually find it all facinating. the human body is a funny old thing. I'm going to try and use OPKs this month. I was going to use your monitor Cleck as they were on special in Boots, but when I went to get it the special was nearly over and they had none in stock and they are &#8364;150 everywhere else.

OPK's didn't work for me before, but I may have missed my surge as I definitely only tested once in the day and it may have even been FMU by times, I can't remember now being honest. In one sense I don't want to use them as I know I will probably forget, but if my cycles are going to be irregular I don't want to miss the window like we did this month and I'm not as energetic as I used to be especially this time of the year and my joints are bad. As much as I love dtd with DH - I wouldn't be able for every two days for weeks just to make sure we didn't miss the window :haha: - I hate that charting doesn't tell you beforehand. If it even told you 1 day after, you might have some chance, but 3 days later is too late :haha:

If I do have a 28 to 32 day cycle this month and did get pregnant I would be due at the same time as Natasha was born, so in one sense I kind of don't want to get pregnant then because I would hate it if two babies shared the same birthday, I think it would be cruel. DH thinks it wouldn't make a difference, but I know I wouldn't have liked to have shared my birthday with my sister and also it would mean myself and DH would be stuck in the hospital for Natasha's birthday next year. 

Even though I wouldn't like it, I'm still going to ttc this month as I do think everything happens for a reason and am not going to start chopping and choosing and if I do become pregnant even thought it wouldn't be ideal, I will be just damn happy that it did happen and so so grateful to have a healthy pregnancies and baba at the end of it.

Well any sign of snow in your part of the world spidey, I think they reckon we won't get any until after Christmas if we even do at all. It is actualy really mild here at the moment and is not cold at all, we have had plenty of rain alright. This is my mad time if year with my arthritis - None of the winter is good, But November and Decmeber is really a killer, I really did think I would escape this year when it was so mild, but I'm really swelling and in a huge amount of pain the last few days. I'm going to try and exercise tomorrow as sometimes it actually helps afterwards, but doing it is a nightmare. Oh well I have done better this year than most as Its only really hitting in this week and not from Oct / early Nov so I shouldn't complain.

Hopefully the next few weeks will go quickly, also for Christmas. I really can't wait to see Natasha's face this year, she is talking about Santa and all the last few weeks and knows he is bringing presents, so she really will be so excited that morning :dance: 

Okay well enough rambling. I'm off to bed. Chat soon girls. Xx


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## spidey

jelr, I hope the opks work for you. Do you ever notice changes in cm? It's hit and miss with me, but with this past cycle when I got pregnant, I had ewcm right at the time I got positive opks, so I had 2 pieces of info to go off of (actually 3 if you count my psychic nips :lol:) Don't stop yourself from TTC this cycle. My brother and I are born 2 days apart, as well as DH and his brother, and neither of us have bad memories from sharing a birthday. My parents did a great job of treating us fairly and I remember it being fun having a joint party with my brother. We both got so much attention at the same time, that neither of us ever felt jealous or left out. :thumbup:

Vici- I had a look at your chart on FB, and to me your chart looks very promising too. I can see why ff put crosshairs where it did. Another cycle or 2 like that and you might wind up pregnant. I really hope you continue to have fairly regular periods because those ridiculously long ones would seriously drive me nuts. 

Kira had a complete potty regression today. She peed in her pants 6 times and once in the potty. :dohh: The first 2 were true accidents because DH doesn't think to remind her to pee and she pees when she sees water flowing. By the end, she was peeing in her pants on purpose. DH reacts a bit too dramatically about pee in the pants and I think she was having fun watching him freak out. The only time she used the potty was when I watched her for an hour as DH made dinner. But I think it's 2 steps forward 1 step back. Her language has shown more improvement today and she was saying things like "Daddy up", so I think her potty skills regressed as her language skills leapt forward :haha: And, she was eating wonderfully today too- huge amounts and all her veggies, so really I can't complain about a bunch of pee laundry :rofl:

I also found the HB on the doppler and I'm only 8w1d. :happydance: I tried for about 10 minutes when DH and Kira went to bed and there it was (and I only found 1 :lol:)! I've been in denial that there's actually a baby in there, and fearing that all this m/s is for nothing. I couldn't get a reading on how many bpm because it was so quiet, but it was a babies HB for sure!

No signs of snow here either jelr. It's been rainy but very mild, so I can't complain.


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## overcomer79

Thank you Jelr. 

I hope you get your bfp soon!

James is now looking at the potty as "oh boy I get to sit and play with no clothes on"...si that a good thing? He sat there 10 minutes this morning and played but I explained to him that this is where he "pee pees and boo boos". In fact, he started at his diaper and said I gotta pee pee but never did. I'm trying to do this very stress free lol


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## spidey

Hi girls :wave: its been too quiet in here! How is everyone doing?

It's that time of the night where I get really nauseous and can't sleep but if I keep myself distracted until midnight I'll start to feel better and can get to sleep. So don't mind me, I'll just chat to myself if I have too :haha:

We had Thanksgiving on Thursday which was really fun. Usually my parents are out of town, but they stayed home this year and 2 close family friends visited too. Kira was being sooo flirty and sweet and she really made me a proud mommy. Not long ago she would scream at anyone (including these 2 friends), but she interacted with them so sweetly. They're "uncle" and "aunt" even though they're not blood related. She's starting to talk a bit more saying "pizza pie" ALL the time. She also started calling me "meanie ma" instead of "mommy" because her and DH were laughing about it one day and it stuck :lol: All the potty issues from the past few days have resolved and it seems like she's even more mature about using the potty and not holding her pee until the last possible second. My mom always says there is some regression before they take a big step forward, which always seems true with Kira.

DH has been off work this past week and has been spoiling me with letting me sleep in and breakfast in bed! It makes a huge difference in how I feel in the mornings if I get an extra hour and then eat very slowly. He goes back to work tomorrow and I'm not looking forward to it! Kira has no idea that I sleep in her bedroom, so in the mornings she doesn't even look for me! Then I appear out of nowhere dressed and with my hair brushed and DH says "Mommy's home!" :haha: 

I haven't done any Christmas shopping yet. I'm hoping I'll feel better soon so I can actually go out to the stores but I might have to order everything off Amazon this year. I tried taking a short trip to the store last week and I had to run out feeling really ill. I stripped down to my tank top while shopping since I was sweating so bad but I was still so hot and sick to my stomach so I had to leave. People must have thought I was crazy- everyone else had their winter coats on and I was wearing a strappy tank fanning myself :haha: 

As for how I feel- pretty sick to my stomach but I still haven't vomited and don't plan on it :haha: I dread meal times since I can't even think about food, so DH has been struggling to come up with meals for himself. My teeth are probably going to rot out since I can't brush them before I go to sleep since my nausea is much worse at night. But overall I have much less symptoms this time so I really can't complain. But I'd love another week off work with DH spoiling me :haha:

That's all I can think of for tonight, maybe I'll bore you all some more tomorrow night :lol:


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## jelr

Hey spidey, there is no need for you to chat to yourself :haha: - I'm reading just haven't had much time to get on as Natasha has been really sick with a cold and temperature the poor little thing is really miserable with it and is not eating or sleeping much and she really doesn't know what is happening to her I don't think, was a bit of shock to us too, because she hasn't had a proper cold since last January.

Hopefully the sickness will ease soon Spidey, not long to go, I know it probably feels like an eternity to you though. I don't cope well with sickness at all, so I don't envy you.

Kira sounds so cute and it definitely sounds like she is coming out of her shell. she is so good with the potty now :thumbup:

I hope it goes as well for us in a couple of weeks.

Well not much going on here, I haven't been anywhere really with Natasha being sick since last Thurs. I did go into to town on Saturday afternoon while DH and Natasha relaxed at home and almost finished the Christmas shopping, so I'm glad that is nearly out of the way.

We are going to put up our tree this weekend, we don't usually put it up until the 8th, but we decided we are going to get Natasha to help this year, so it will have to be a weekend and the weekend after we are heading out for a meal for my sisters 30th, so I don't fancy still sorting decorations and trying to get ready at once, so this weekend it is.

I have a meeting in work tomorrow to sort out exactly what is going on with my job, hr have made decisions and we are going to be given the options available. I'm scared being honest and feel sick to my stomach every time I think about it. I hate all this unsettlement this year and worry about stupid money and stupid recession, but sure at least tomorrow I will know one way or another what is happening.


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## spidey

I know you girls are busy but reading, so I really don't mind chatting to myself :haha: I'm the bored one who doesn't have much of a life right now :lol:

aww poor Natasha.. she's been sick for awhile, poor baby :-( I hope you and DH can get by without catching it. Kira had a bad cold a few weeks ago and really went off food for 2 weeks total. It was starting to get worrying, but for the past 7 days she's been eating insane amounts of food. She might finally gain weight away from 24 pounds now. She's been stuck at 24 pounds for almost a year. I hope Natasha feels back to normal soon. Good luck at your work meeting... I really hate job stresses.

We always put up our tree and decorate the weekend after the 6th since that's my Dad's birthday. It's a family tradition now... why do you wait until the 8th?

Poor DH ate something bad and has been peeing out his butt all day and night. We have 3 bathrooms and he graced all 3 of them during the night, so I had to spend the morning bleaching out 2 of them and leaving 1 just for him to use. He claims its not contagious but I'm still freaking out that me or Kira could catch it. Bleck He asked me if I knew anything to make his butt hurt less, so I found a numbing spray they gave me when I had stitches after labor and witch hazel pads. Poor guy.

I took some pics of my cute bloat baby :haha: I'm going to work tomorrow and have no clue how I'll hide it since it's there all the time now. My stomach muscles aren't doing their job anymore!

Kira- week 9

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/tummy/p1w9.jpg

Kira- week 20

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/tummy/p1w20.jpg

New baby- week 9 

Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/tummy/p2w9.jpg

I think this one is comparable to the week 20 bump from Kira :haha:


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## jelr

Gorgeous photos, there is definitely bumpage there now, You are so skinny still I'm jealous :haha: apart from the bump there is not a pick on you :thumbup:

I'm so glad Kira is better, it is horrible when they are sick, Natasha is finally starting to come around, but is still a bit snuffly and still off her food, mind you I'm not 100% sure if it is not just a fussy phase, because she ate more today, but what she wanted and not what I wanted her to eat :haha: - but sure once she eats at all when she is sick that is all that counts I guess and hopefully she will be like Kira and stuffing herself by next week.

How is the sickness now, is it getting any better at all??, I really hope so :hugs:

Can I ask you about your food allergies, It is coeliac disease that suffer from isn't it, a friend of mine has had awful trouble with her stomach for years and in the last year it has gotten really bad, she is constantly full of wind and in a huge amount of mine most of the time now, she has tried cutting out various foods as she thought she had ibs, but nothing has helped. Her doctor has done the blood screening for Coeliac and it came back negative, but the pain got so unbearable over the weekend and somebody told her that the blood test doesn't always come back positive, but you can still be coeliac, so she just said for the sake of it she would try gluten free this week and she hasn't had any wind or pain. But she is finding it really limiting because she doesn't know what she can eat or drink - she did have 2 bottles of beer last night and did get a twinge so is thinking she will need to cut that out also. Any info you would have that I could give her would be geatly appreciated and it will give you something to do when your bored tonight :haha: 

It must be hard though at the moment not being able to go or do anything with the sickness, that would be the exact way I would be, I know I wouldn't be able to leave the house if I had ms because I don't cope well with nausea, give me pain anyday :haha:

No news from me, I'm on CD14 so we got busy tonight once Natasha went to bed just in case my cycle is back to 28 days, I will know over the next few days if my temp goes up as my opks still haven't arrived grrrr thats what I get for ordering from Hong Kong :haha: - although maybe it is a good thing as maybe it will jinx me into being pregnant already and then they will arrive and will be no good to me :haha:


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## spidey

Jelr, I will gladly talk about celiac disease :haha: You've made my evening :lol:

me blabbing away about gluten:


Spoiler
The blood tests for Celiac aren't accurate, and even an intestinal biopsy will give false negatives. I didn't have any tests to confirm or deny since I didn't have insurance at the time and it was all too expensive. The true test is whether a strict gluten free (GF) diet makes the symptoms go away. Beer contains malt, which comes from barley so she can't have beer. Distilled alcohol and wine are okay, and there are a few specialty beers that are made GF. I had major withdrawals at first and would lay on the kitchen floor and cry. Once I got over it I tried to center my meals on meat and veg, with potato, corn or rice as the starch. If she continues with a GF diet she might find that intestinal symptoms will come back after a few weeks either because gluten is hidden in some of her foods, or because she has secondary food intolerances that crop up since the intestines have been damaged badly for years. Ultimately I had to eat strictly GF, dairy, oat, soy and corn free for 6 months. After 6 months I slowly added dairy, corn and soy back in and then only ate them every 3rd-5th day until I felt fine eating them again. Most people I know have similar stories as mine with seeing secondary temporary (and sometimes permanent) food intolerances. Also, once she's GF for awhile and if she slips up and eats gluten, her symptoms might come back even stronger than before and last up to a week. 

The hardest part is the social aspect of eating. It seems that everything is centered around food and I've had people get mad and offended when I turn down food offered to me. I can't go out to eat with friends or stop for fast food. I've been with my job for 10 years and people saw me at my sickest (95 pounds and on the verge of a mental breakdown) and then they saw me get better. I still have people offer me a cupcake and when I say "no thanks" they say "oh, thats right, you have those issues". My diet annoys some people more than it annoys me! I never expect people to accommodate me, but I've been pleasantly surprised when people go out of their way to include me. My old lab would have lab parties and a few co-workers always brought fruit or veg with dip so I could eat too. I even had a co-worker bake me a cake made from chickpea flour. 

At first she should think about removing dairy from her diet too. The part of the intestine that releases Lactase to digest Lactose is usually damaged in people with undiagnosed Celiac. It'll take a few months for her intestines to heal and for milk digestion to happen again. I'm happy to answer anymore questions. It's hard to feel supported in general since many people roll their eyes at food allergies, and doctors rely on inaccurate tests too much.

Oh, and for foods she cannot eat. She needs to avoid anything with wheat, rye, oats and barely (malt). Soy sauce usually contains wheat- not something you'd expect. Most processed foods aren't okay so she'll have to stick with simple meats, veggies and fruit. There are alot of ancient grains that are okay, like quinoa, buckwheat, etc, so she can get creative and use those instead of wheat based cereals. Rice and potato are good for starches too. Blue cheese sometimes contains wheat since they grow the fungus on bread, so I avoid all blue cheeses just incase. In the US, "food starch" is made from corn unless otherwise specified... I'm not sure what "food starch" means for you, so that's something to keep in mind.

Good luck on baby making this month!! You'll have to keep us informed on your symptoms!

My m/s is still here, but still not bad enough for me to complain. I'm hoping it'll calm down next week when I'm at 10 weeks. I'm mostly annoyed that I can't cook or think about food :haha: I also think I'm getting stretch marks already from my super sudden bloat. I had a few light ones just around my belly button but now I have them alot further out. It's not good to have them so soon, I might be doomed this pregnancy!


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## jelr

Thanks you so much Spidey for all that info, I will pass it all onto her and I will let you know if she has any questions.

Did you have physical withdrawals or was it that you missed it all so much. I can't imagine how hard it must have been to give all that up. I try to keep away from white bread as my weight seems to go up more quickly when I eat it and I hate having to give it up, but at least I can have a sneeky slice of toast or sambo every now and again and it won't make me sick. So it must be so so hard to give so much up in the one time, especially when you have no choice. :hugs:

Sorry the MS is still not gone, but thankfully it is not as bad as last time. FX it goes after the 10 weeks.

Dont think I ov'd yesterday anyway as my temp is still down, althugh it may happen on Day 18 as I went up 2lbs this morning even though I have been dieting and I'm very bloated so I could be gearing up for OV - I just hope I don't have all those symptoms again in my LP because they were horrilbe for a start and messed with mind also making me think that I was pregnant.

Also It would take away all this need to diet to keep my cycles right and it would make me quit smoking because even though I can't face stopping again right now, partly because it seemed to make my LP so much harder and hard know which were symptoms or withdrawal, but I do also feel really guilty and every day is will I won't I.

It would also be really cool to get pregnant this month as one of my best friends started ttc in October like us and she found out yesterday she is pregnant. This will be her fourth child and it would really be lovely for us both to be pregnant at the same time and moan together :haha: and it would be lovely for our babies to be the same age. 

We are going to put up our tree this weekend and bring Natasha see Santa if she is well enough, so I'm looking forward to that before it is all back to doom and gloom as our budget is on next week and for the first time ever it is a 2 day budget. One is the normal budget and the other is a public sector reform budget, which as you all know I work for government so am public sector, so it will be 2 days of cuts right on top of my huge pay cut. I'm not actually going to make a final decision about my job until that is over because it could mean another huge cut and if that happens I will have to leave.

Hope you have a great weekend Spidey and to any of the rest of you that are maybe reading. Hope you are all well :hugs: Xx


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## Shiv

I'm reading and will hopefully get back in later to reply properly to you both


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## Shiv

okely dokely, sorry i have been a bit MIA, I have been reading but literally haven't been able to write a reply. Cora just will not sleep in the day or evening. She will sleep great once she is down for the night but sometimes (mostly) that isn;t until gone 11pm so I always have one hand holding her so can't type too well.

So let me see what I can remember

Spidey - really great that Kira is more omfortable around people who she doesn't see all the time. I think it is all too common for it to go the other way around this age so it is great that she is becoming more of a joiner.

Lovely having your DH off work, jealous!

Sorry your morning sikness isn't over yet, won't be long. Have you a feeling as to whether you are having a boy or a girl and will you find out?

Youe baby bloat is quite impressive, Ithink you look bigger now that an 20 weeks with Kira, still a skinny bitch though!

jelr - sorry Natasha has been unwell, I hope she has erked up by the weekend.

I was really sorry to hear about your job news, I ope that the budget next week doesn't bring any worse news as it seems you have got your head around your current situation. I must admit the economi climate is really getting me down.

Glad you are gettig busy with it Jean, fingers crossed for a festive BFP for you.

I hope Natasha enjoys putting the tree up and seeing Father Christmas, I think (hope) it is going to be pretty magial this year with our LO's.

Well as for me, I have been feeling a bit low this week, absolutely nothing for me to moan about, just at that everything is always the same stage where the excitement of new baby is wearing off and routine is taking over,that plus Cora never sleeping in the day is getting a little frustrating for me and more so for Sophia.

SOphia had her fist day in knikers today and having had no acidents for over a week went through 4 pairs of knickers and tights today. I partly blame David he had the day off work and insisted we go out to a disovery centre which is a place with cool science stuff for kids. Sophia loves it but we were out all morning and she was engrossed in stuff so kept forgetting to tell us she needed a wee! She is fine at home but struggles when we are out.

Sophia and i have been having tummy issues, both keep getting dodgy tummies (bottom end). fine all day until I need to poo and then have pain and loose bowel movement then fine again unt the next day I need to poo and the same again..........weird and annoyingly not going away.

We are going to Kent tomorrow to see David's mum, then staying at my parents and David is going out for a friends birthday and I may join them for a couple of hours once I have got cora settled (if it is before 11pm which is unlikey!). 

I started my Christmas shopping this week, iplan on doing as much as possible online. Christmas is fast approaching so I need to get on it. People keep asking what I want and I can't think of anything, I don;t know if it is because i am very lucky and have everything I ould ever want, or because i am sad and have no interests!

Our tree goes up after 12th Dec usually as that is my Dad's birthday. Plus David is totally bah humbug so it is a challenge getting him to put it up. All our decs are back at the house in Kent so need to pick them up at the weekend.

Did i tell you girls that we have managed to rent the Kent house out to David's cousin, they have asked us to take it of the market because they would like to rent it pretty long term (2 years plus) which we have agreed to do as nobody is interested inbuying it anyway. They move in 1st Jan, but have asked us if they can redecorate before hand - well yeah! We are putting in new carpets for them as we figure it'll help with resale further down the line. So we get to cover the mortgage (+£100 each month) and they get a good deal for a 3 bed house, It is a big relief as it was becoming a bit of a noose around our necks. Means we can't buy here, but we can't afford to buy a nice house here anyway so will carry on renting.

David got approahed to apply for a job in Singapore this week. It is a good job (£90,000 per annum eek) but I don't think I am up for living so far away from here, you saw what I was like when we moved 100 miles away from home so Singapore seems a bit of a stretch. What a shame there aren;t any £90 k jobs here, imagine taking home like £6000 a month after tax (singapore tax is only 10%) - it would be AMAZING!

right well Cora is actually asleep, although I fear she has not had her last feed of the night yet so I am going to get to bed, which is bound to make her wake up!

Big hugs to everyone x


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## spidey

Shiv- I'm sorry Cora isn't a good napper during the day. Is it that she falls asleep and doesn't stay asleep? Yay for big girl underpants for Sophia! It takes time and anyone who claims their toddler was fully trained in a week has memory problems :haha: I still have to look for clues that Kira has to pee since she's not always aware when she needs to go especially when she's doing something really fun that requires focus. 

Wow, thats neat that David got offered a job in Singapore! If my DH was offered a job like that we would say no too. It would be nice before we had kids- a fun adventure. But with Kira I need family support nearby.

re:gluten. It might have been physical withdrawal that I experienced for those first 3-4 days when I stopped eating gluten. Overall it wasn't hard to give up since I felt so much better without it. The symptoms were all physical but overtime feeling ill wore on me mentally that I was wishing for my life to end.

jelr, make sure you keep up with the :sex: since you may have a longer cycle this time due to job stress. I hope your pay isn't cut anymore- my fingers are crossed for you. :hugs:

re: baby gender- I think we're going to be team yellow again this time. The babies nickname is Rebel... Kira's was "Flicker" :haha: 


I finished Kira's Christmas shopping. Everything was bought online this year except for a wooden train set that DH found in Aldi.

Here is the final gift list and links (if you want to see anything in particular)

large cafe play house- its a big tent that is easy to set up and take down and big enough for her play kitchen to go inside.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000UCZ3LE/ref=oh_o02_s00_i00_details

cash register. I think Kira will spend hours opening and closing the money drawer :haha:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00000DMD2/ref=oh_o02_s01_i00_details

Doll feeding set
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0037UP9GU/ref=oh_o03_s00_i00_details

Flutes that you play with in the bath tub
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000I7ZHO4/ref=oh_o03_s01_i00_details

A doll that pees!
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0037UT2CC/ref=oh_o03_s01_i01_details

A doll to undress!
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0037V0Q62/ref=oh_o03_s02_i00_details

wooden pizza set. Kira is currently obsessed with pizza
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0000658L4/ref=oh_o03_s02_i01_details

butterfly necklace for her stocking
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000O7JRLC/ref=oh_o03_s01_i02_details

stamp set
https://www.amazon.com/Melissa-Doug...P1CO/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1322881116&sr=8-7

wooden train set 
(from Aldi)


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## jelr

Hi girls

Shiv: Sorry to hear that Cora isn't napping for you, hopefully she will grow out of that soon. Natasaha used to be a 20 minute only napper, but then grew out of it and eventually napped for longer.

That is great news about the house, I bet you are relieved to at least have rented it and not have the extra going out.

Wow on DH's job offer in singapore, I am a home bird too and would be no good for moving so far away, although our current situation is making me think maybe I would these days.

I hope you and Sophia's poos issues are gone, it sounds like a little bug. I spray tea tree around and down the toilet if there is any bugs at all and it seems to help them spreading.

I hope the Christmas shopping is all done and that you got to go out for a bit at the weekend and hopefully that cheered you up. I think this time of year the weather gets everyone down and everything does feel samey because you can't really get out and about.

Spidey: Fair play to you staying team yellow again, we did on Natasha, but I do think I would find out next time, but I would have to convince DH. I would have to agree with you, I don't think it is possible for a toddler to be trained in a week, which is partly why I'm dreading it :haha:

I love all Kira's christmas pressies, especially the tent.

Thanks again for the gluten info, my friend was delighted, she is still pain free without the gluten, I know it will be hard for her to give it all up, but like you I think the pain that she was in was wearing her down, so I really hope this works.

The current climate is definitely getting me down. I can't believe we were very very comfortable and now we will be scrimping and saving and we are both in good jobs, I really don't know how other families with no income manage. I had to re-do our budget as I forgot a few things and it is not looking so nice at all, To pay all our bills and save a teeny bit for Natasha's birthday and Christmas we will have just over 800 a week going out and we will only be bringing in just over 900 a week coming in. Thankfully we do have more coming in than going out, but that is not taking into account clothes or doctors or buying anyone a birthday present (which with 2 big families, there is always something) or anything going wrong with the car or house and most weeks I do have 50 in my purse at the start of the week and it is gone buy the end of it and DH is the same and we never have anything to show for it, it just goes on paying for parking or coffee or bread and milk and stuff that runs out, or a takeaway. It actually shocked me how much is going out and scared the life out of me being honest. Thankfully the only debts we have is the mortgage.

It really bugs me how bad the country is and that we have to suffer for the mistakes of others, we are not big spenders and we don't go out often so it is just not fair that we are going to have to watch every penny, when we have both worked hard all our lives or why I even bothered going back to study, when I'm no better off now, yes we have done loads on the house, but we had finally done all we wanted to on the house and were hopefully going to start going on holidays again as apart from a weekend to Paris and London, we haven't been on a proper holiday since 2007, but that is now out the window along with much more :growl: I'm hoping that I have really over budgeted everything and that it ends up better than I expected and we do have the rest of DH's redundancy and I had being saving to take extra time off if we do have another baby so at least we do have some emergency money to work from for a while to take the pressure off, although I do want to try and manage on our weekly money as much as possible because unless the economy does a major turn, things will be hard for plenty of years to come here I think :dohh:

Everywhere is very doom and gloom here with the budget the last two days and I really wanted to just check if I would be getting a further paycut and I didn't want to know anymore and just stick my head in the sand, but it is all everyone is talking about and it is driving me mad. Thankfully my pay is not cut anymore, but vat has gone up by 2% so everything is going to go up and Carbon tax has majorly gone up so again, that brings everything up. They have now introduced a household tax aswell and these are things that I didn't budget for, so it does scare me. I think it is going to be a case of waiting and seeing and getting from week to week. I hate that I'm such a worrier about money. I used to worry even when we did have money :haha: - I am trying to stay positive about it all and not get sucked into the doom and gloom as we are very lucky to have the rest of the reduncancy and at least I do have a job, but it is hard not to get sucked in, especially when my younger brothers are now talking about emigrating when they finish college.

Sorry girls enough moaning from me :haha: - Natasha is much better as in her nose is not streaming and she is not croaky, but she still has a cough and is still hit and miss with food :dohh:

On the up side, I'm nearly certain that I ovulated yesterday on CD18, my temp went up this morning and I have the same LP symptoms as last month, which I could do without, but it is still good to know that I am Ovulating. We will see if FF puts in cross hairs in on Thurs or Friday. We dtd on CD14, 16 and 18 so definitely in with a good chance this month. My OPK's came also, but only yesterday so I did pee on one of course but it was only a faint line as I would have missed my surge on day 16 or 17. At least I have loads of pregnancy tests now to also pee on if AF doesn't turn up :haha: as I got 20 free ones with the OPK's. It should have been 30 as I ordered 3 lots of 30 OPK's each with 10 free tests, but only 2 of the packages have arrived so far :dohh:

So it looks like I'm in for a 32 day cycle, if my symptoms are right, so at least I know what is going on with my body these days and my cycles are back to normal - Well I hope they are anyways :thumbup:


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## jelr

Oh actually question for you girls - when you started to potty train and left LO's nappy free, did you put any bottoms on at all?? Even though our house is really warm, it is so so cold here at the moment and can be chilly in the morning, so I don't know if I want to leave Natasha completely bottomless when I start over Christmas, but at the same time, she is not able to pull up or down trousers at all - so I'm not sure what way to approach it. Would love to know how you girls started.


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## spidey

jelr, you should definitely try to avoid all the doom and gloom talk. You already know its bad so turn off the tv and avoid the news for awhile and focus on all the good things in life. There are people who LOVE doom and gloom and it can quickly wear down people who tend to worry (me!) :haha: I have a few doom and gloom lovers at my work and its so depressing listening to all their depressing topics. And DH likes to listen to NPR- not sure if you know what that is. It's National Public Radio and they talk about political and social things. I find it incredibly depressing and he's not allowed to discuss NPR topics with me in the evening. My co-workers use to listen to NPR out loud in the lab and it drove me nuts! I would blast rap music through my ipod so I didn't have to overhear it.

I'm sorry things are so rough right now. I'm the same way with money and worry all the time even though our situation could be much much worse. I have everything budgeted and have a short term plan to pay off the house so all our extra money goes right to that. We only owe $100,000 on our house but it makes me anxious having that much in debt, although its not technically debt. I'm sure you'll be okay since your so conscious of your spending, and if this is fairly short term (which I really hope it is!) then you can make it through these crappy years and know things will improve. 

yay for ovulation!! I really hope this is your month!! :happydance:


I have my 1st midwife appointment Wednesday. I haven't been to this birthing center before so it'll be interesting. I hope I get a good feeling about it otherwise I'll have to go back to the place where I had Kira which makes me feel a bit uncomfortable and I don't know why.

As for potty training, the first 3 or 4 days were really warm so I left Kira with no pants or underpants. I was worried that wearing pants would confuse her, but I don't think it did because around day 4 or 5 I put pants on her and she was just as skilled (or unskilled :haha:) at using the potty. Then after a couple weeks my mom convinced her to wear underpants. My main goal at first was to get her on the potty in midstream so she got used to the feeling of peeing on the potty so having no pants made that easier to do. But very quickly- 2 days maybe, she would start to pee and then stop peeing, and then run to the potty and finish. So I honestly think wearing pants would be okay. She'll probably do partial pees in them a lot at first but she'll learn all the feelings and it'll get better. Kira still can't pull her pants down and refuses to try.. she's being very stubborn about trying so I've stopped suggesting it. When Kira has to pee she says "pssss" or "pee pee" and then we both run to the potty and I pull down her pants and put her on it. Then I wipe her dry (she refuses to do this too :lol:) So it's really just as much work as using diapers :haha:


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## jelr

Thanks Spidey - I stopped DH watching the news when all this recession started, I told him he could listen to it in work, but that I didn't want it on in the house because it usually scares the life out of me.

Fingers crossed things do pick up, although I they reckon it probably won't until Natasha is grown up, with the amount of money we owe now to Europe and the more they tax people the less people spend, so unless they come up with some brainwave to stimulate economic growth here, it won't be happening for a while and I suppose what scares me the most is before my work swang in roundabouts and if things were quiet I always had the hope that it would pick up, whereas now I will be on a set salary so unless this lift the embargo on public service jobs and I can get a premotion, it is just going to stay the same for a few years anyway. I will get yearly increments, but at the rate things are going up, it will end up balancing out. But sure fingers crossed I have over budgeted and it will all work out.

I know what you mean about the mortgate though, if I won the lotto in the morning I would pay ours off - We still owe &#8364;180,000 on ours so as such &#8364;20, 000 has only been paid in the last 4 years and it would be a real weight to get rid of that, because I'm always panicked that one day we won't be able to pay it and would lose the house after all the work that has went into it :growl: and it would make such a difference everyweek as that would be &#8364;300 extra a week between the actual mortgate and all the insurances that you have to have with it. Aw well I'm forgetting about it now and am going back to focus on Christmas and hopefully becoming pregnant :thumup: 

I can't wait to see Natasha's face on Christmas day :dance:

Mmm - that does sound like a good idea to have no pants on the first couple of days to be able to just lift her and plonk her on the potty midstream and I do think pants will confuse her. Maybe I will start 2 days before DH goes back to work and he can have the stove lighting first thing (I find it takes longer for the house to actually warm up in the mornings with the Oil) and once the morning nip is gone our house is so well insulated that it does stay warm so hopefully she won't get cold or I could put a skirt on her with nothing under neath.

I really hope the birthing centre is nice and that you get a good feeling about it and that the appointment with the midwife goes well and I really hope that now that you are over 10 weeks that the MS is starting to get better :thumbup:


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## Shiv

I'll come back later for a proper reply, but wanted to recommend dresses for early days of potty training. They keep their legs a bit warm but just need to be hoiked up to go on potty which is easier for them to do than trousers.

Sophia is back to going naked bottom half cos if she wears knickers she wees in them but naked she goes on the potty :shrug:

We created a "Sophia's no wee wee or poo acidents" chart today. She is really keen to wear knickers again, so each day she has no wees or poos in her clothes or on the floor she gets a sticker, 5 stickers = knickers! So far no accidents today, a few wees and 2 poos in her potty :happydance:


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## spidey

I visited my new midwife center and I even got a sonogram :happydance: They have a machine in the office- so cool!

It's quite far from my house but I got a good feeling about the place. It's attached to the hospital via an underground tunnel, so I can be wheeled over in an emergency if need be. They have 2 birthing suites with tubs that were quite nice. They asked me tons of questions about Kira's birth and want me to bring in her medical records from the NICU stay. I guess they need to figure out if I'm at risk for repeat complications. The other birthing center is very nice but I can't get over my feelings of anxiety and doom when I walk through the doors. I can't quite put my finger on it... I'm not sure if its left over from Kira's birth or if somethings telling me not to attempt a second delivery there. Whatever it is, I have to follow my gut.

Rebel, 10 1/2 weeks old.
https://www.razortoe.com/share/tummy/baby.jpg


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## jelr

Aww love the pic spidey - definitely a baby in there :thumup: - I'm so glad that the visit went so well.

I would definitely follow your gut, if you are far happier with the other birthing centre go with it, rather than when the time comes being anxious about being there.

I wish we had a choice, but it would be just the local hospital and that is it :dohh:

Yay for no accidents today shiv, I hope to use a sticker chart at the start because Natasha loves stickers (although I got a whole load of stickers as one of her stocking fillers, which I may hide until the after the potty training week or the novelty will wear off :haha:)

yeah I think I'm going to go with the dresses or skirts number 1 as it will keep her warmer and 2 because of it being around Christmas, we will probably still have family calling, so at least she is not running around naked if anybody does :haha:


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## spidey

Shiv, thats great Sophia is having an accident free day :happydance: It sounds like she's getting used to the potty very quickly :thumbup: We had company the 2nd day of Kira's potty training and I only had her in a dress, and she kept pulling up her dress and flashing our company :haha: I still give her a choice of 1 M&M or 1 candy corn if she pees, and 2 if she poops.

Kira actually peed in a public toilet today, so that's a big accomplishment here :thumbup: DH took her, so maybe that's why. She seems to behave better with him and saves the bad behavior for mommy :lol:

I also forgot to brag to you girls how my high maintenance sleeper is transforming into a perfect sleeping little girl! You all remember how we use to bounce her for 30-60 minutes before naps and at night. Then that turned into nursing her to sleep for naps and DH laying in the bed next to her for nighttime. I stopped nursing her to sleep for naps, so she just lays with me in bed with her pacifier. And the biggest change is at night- DH reads to her in bed, says goodnight and leaves the room!!! He made the change because she was taking 60 minutes to fall asleep at night and would jump around the bed and be super silly, and it was really grating on his nerves as he pretended to sleep laying in the bed. We explained how things were going to change and on the first night she went to sleep with no complaints. This will be night 4 and so far so good :thumbup:


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## jelr

rofl at Kira flashing your guests, I can totally see Natasha doing that. She spent days pulling up her t-shirt when I took off her vest for the summer and putting her tummy against the fridge or the patio doors, so I can only imagine what could happen with no nappy on :haha: - mind you, it didn't phase her the last time I tried potty training and for the two days she had only a t-shirt on.

Yay for the sleeping also, I can imagine how DH would get frustrated with all the jumping around. I took Natasha into bed with me the first night she was sick because she was really so so miserable and she has never slept in our bed before and as sick as she was, she sang and kept standing up and when I pretented to be asleep, she started giving me kisses to wake me up and then pulling open my eye lids :haha: - for the first two hours it was funny, but at 4.30 it was a different story :dohh:


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## spidey

jelr, Kira does silly things like that in bed when she's supposed to be sleeping. Its cute for a minute but gets old fast! :haha:

I've been feeling a bit better since the weekend so we rearranged the house to turn the dining room into a playroom! It use to have a large table that was being used as a changing station :lol:, DH's computer desk and Kira's play kitchen. I moved all Kira's toys from the livingroom into the new playroom and DH's computer desk is now in the livingroom. It looks so much better and at the end of the day it's nice to have all the toys in one room.

new playroom. It's nighttime so I have the blinds closed, but there's a door that opens onto the deck
https://www.razortoe.com/share/playroom.jpg

the living room without toys! Ignore the clutter- we were still straightening things :lol:
https://www.razortoe.com/share/livingroom2.jpg


I ate waaaaay too many nerds candy tonight and feeling really sick from them. I haven't been sick yet but it's close :sick: So thats why I'm staying up so late posting here :lol: I should be asleep so I can get up for work tomorrow.
these things:
https://www.luminomagazine.com/mw/storyimages/358_wide.jpg


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## jelr

I can totally see how it gets old very fast, I only had 1 night of it, let alone every night :nope:

I love the new toy rooom and I would not call your living room cluttered at all, it looks exactly like ours does most days since Natasha was born with stuff on the floor :haha:

I love Natasha's toy room too and it is so nice to just close the door on the mess some nights when I'm too tired to put it all away. Although we are going to have to do something out there as it is getting a bit cold lately, so Natasha is not getting as much use from it. I think it is because of all the windows, because it is full of insulation (it is our old sun room) so Im thinking maybe some big thick curtains to see if that helps.

I hope you weren't sick after last night - Stay away from the sweets :haha: 

So glad you are starting to feel better now :thumup:


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## spidey

could you run a little space heater in her playroom? We have ones here that use oil and don't get too hot and aren't a fire hazard. Once we move Kira into her own room we'll have to run something like that since her bedroom is the coldest room in the house. We heat the house off a stove that's in Kira's new playroom and the heat has to passively go up the stairs to heat the bedrooms. So it gets quite cold up there in the winter!

Kira just started putting 2 words together! She said "more bacon" (mo bacon) tonight. It's adorable hearing her speak :cloud9:

Today at work the secretary for my department came up to me and asked if I was expecting :shock: She said I've gained weight around my middle :haha: So it must be pretty obvious now. 

jelr, do you have any symptoms that might be pregnancy related? I can't wait for you to test and now that you have all those cheapo tests you can do one every day when it gets closer to when AF is due :lol:


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## jelr

We are thinking about putting in an oil heater in there, but i'm not sure it will make a difference. We heat the house either with oil fired central heating or we also have a stove that has a back boiler that heats and the house and the funny thing is there is a radiator in that room. When the fire is lighting and the door from the living room / to the playroom is open it heats up, but until the fire really heats up the radiator doesn't seem to be making a difference, so I think the cold is coming in through those big windows. I'm looking around for big thick curtains (they seem to be really expensive though for the size i'm looking for)

Yay for Kira's words, see I knew you had nothing to worry about and she was just doing it in her own time, she will be off now full stream in no time :thumpup:

Oooops for getting found out, what did you say to her? :haha:

No real symptoms - I don't "feel" pregnant so I'm guessing i'm not. The only symtoms that are going on are a lot of cramps, but that is probably because my bowels seem to be funny the last few months, and my arthritis is kicking up, but I think that is from the severe cold we have over the last two weeks. I'm also exhausted but again that tends to come with my arthritis this time of the year and I'm very teary, but I think that is from tiredness and all the stress over my job the last few weeks has finally hit in this week so that is getting me down. So all in all, nothing major - no sore boobs and that is usually a definite for me when I'm pregnant, I am getting a few sharp pains in them every now and again, but not a constant ache.

Although i will probably make the most of those tests and pee on them anyway :haha:

Only 1 more day in work for me and then I'm off for 3 weeks - really looking forward to it so I can forget about work and because it will the last year that I will get so much time off with this new job :nope:

Will you get long off spidey?

Hope the rest of you girls are doing well if you are reading. Cleck: I hope you are enjoying being home and Shiv: I hope Cora is settling down a bit.


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## Shiv

Time for a bit of a catch up, sorry I have been somewhat MIA, any spare time in the evenigns I have had have been taken up wrapping presents!

SO Spidey, I am glad you are feeling less sick, lay off the nerds, we used to have them over here when I was about 10, i LOVED them! 

Have you got all of Kira's great presents wrapped yet?

Oh and I love the new playroom, I bet Kira does too. You rlounge is way tidier in that photo than mine is at its best!

We are having the smae problem as Jean with our playroom. It is in a conservatory and it is serioulsy cold. It has a heater in there but I am totally paranoid about how much it is costing to have it on constantly. SO now Sophia picks a toy an dbrings it in to the lounge closing the playroom door behind her :haha:

Jean, my boobs didn't hurt at all this time, I think they had everything all sorted after Sophia so there was less disruption. When are you due AF again? Fingers crossed. I hope you can forget about work after tomorrow and have a lovely Christmas. 

As for us well, the Christmas shopping is now done, apart from a helmet for Sophia's bike, and I am wrapping a little at a time instead of saving it all to xmas eve like usual!

Cora is pretty settled at the moment. She takes naps during the day, she even puts herself to sleep. And she is sleeping 10 hours at night :happydance: 

Sophia on the otherhand is being a MADAM! We have meltdowns about every 20 minutes over nothing! It is seriously bad!

Potty training is going...........variably well!

So after she kept weeing in her knickers we went back to naked bottom half when indoors and nappies when out. We made a no accidents chart, and each day she didn't wee/poo on the floor etc. After 5 days she got her knickers back. So we had 5 days of only wees and poos in the potty and toilet. Not even anything in her nappy other than overnight. Sooooooooo she gets her knickers, 10 minutes later she's wee'd in them! It took 4 pairs of wet knickers for me to realise that she was weeing in them on purpose so she got to wear ALL her in the night garden knickers in one day! So I've hidden the knickers, she gets a pair in the morning and if she wets them then she goes without for the rest of the day, so far so good but we're only day 2!

Jean will you start when you finish work?

Sophia still has a dodgy tummy. Will go 2 days without a poo, then do 4 loose, mucousy ones in an hour. No other issues, she seems fine in herself, not great for potty training though!


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## jelr

Hey Shiv :hi: - Great to see you :dance:

I'm so glad Cora is setting again and that Sophia is doing better with the potty training - clever girl though, wetting just so she could wear all her knickers :haha: - not so much fun for you though :dohh:

Would the tummy issues be anything to do with her teeth? Natasha is having a lot of loose acidy poos on and off lately and like Sophia has days where it is all tantrums and she had that cold and the cough hung around for the last 3 weeks and then today she woke up with a fresh cold :dohh: and I'm wondering if it is to do with those back teeth as she would chew on me if she got the chance at the minute and it is so unlike her to be sick like this.

I hear you on the heater in the toyroom, I said the same about the cost when DH decided to put on the heater, but he reckons when we ran it last year the electricity didn't go up that much considering all the Christmas lights were on that bill as well. I must actually have a look back and see.

I don't know what to do about the potty training now, my plan was to start after New years day as before that we have loads of visiting and days out planned and that week DH was back to work on the 4th and I wasn't due back until the 9th, but I was told today that now that we are permanent staff our contract will actually start on the 3rd so I have a few options 1 to work, 2 to take annual leave (which is not an option to use it all up so early in the year and it is more time from the summer) or 3 work back the days (which I'm not really in favour of either as it would mean working 4 days for 3 weeks) so I think I'm going to have to work - well start on the 4th as DH is not back until that day so I will owe them a day. The silly thing is my boss is away until the 9th and the groups are not back until the 9th either so I actually won't have any work to do. It probably will take me some time to move my home office into Head Office so I'm going to that and hope that I have enough to keep me going for the 2 days as I really can't just sit around and do nothing, it is just not in my nature :nope: - So I spent another day crying over this stupid job. I swear if I knew there was work out there, I would definitely pack it in, because I'm so angry and upset over it all and the worst of it is I have nobody to be angry and upset with and I'm terrified my work ethic will change if I don't let all this go.

I'm thinking I might start the following week as I will be in Monday to Wednesday and then off until the following Tuesday. Do you think 5 days at home without going out will be enough to give her a start at it?

My mam reckons I'm staring her way to young, that none of us where potty training until we were nearly 3 and in one sense I am wondering if she is really ready as apart from sitting on the potty fully clothed when I'm using the loo, she really hasn't shown any signs of wanting to go or telling me that she needs to go. On the other hand, I probably won't have 5 days off in a row until Easter and that is not until April and because it will be only time off until the Summer I don't really want that we are stuck in the house all week and I'm thinking of maybe sending her to playschool 1 morning a week after Easter as most children here go a few days when they are 3, but If I do become pregnant soon, then a new baby and her staring playschool in September would both be coming up around the same time and I don't want her to think she is being pushed out if that makes sense, where as she will already be settled if she goes 1 morning beforehand and I will send her 1 of the mornings I'm working so that we don't miss out on time together. Ah I don't know really, there is 50 million things going on in my head now between ttc, work and Natasha being sick.

Anyways on a brighter note - I'm finsihed now for 2 weeks so I'm going to enjoy that and make the most of it and try and snap myself out of this silly crying and fed up humour :dohh:

Well I hope you all have a great weekend girls :hugs:


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## spidey

jelr, enjoy your time off work. I think there is no harm in waiting to potty train if you don't have time over Christmas break. If Kira didn't catch on quickly I was going to wait until April or May once the weather warmed up. Our house gets really cold in the winter and I wanted to have the option of her being naked when she started learning. 

Shiv, Kira went through a phase of peeing in her pants because she loved picking out fresh clothes to wear. She'd purposely run off to pee, and then come back to me so I could take off her wet clothes and then she would run off and pick out a new outfit. We overcame it by keeping a baggy of M&M's right near the potty out in the open, so eating an M&M must have been more appealing than picking out fresh clothes :lol: It sounds like Sophia's doing great with using the potty

I didn't have any symptoms with this pregnancy but I had very obvious ones with Kira. The only possible early symptom I had was some feelings of doom. My boobs still don't hurt and my nips are just a little sore, not even as sore as when I would ovulate. Kira still nurses 2 or 3 times a day for a minute or so and it doesn't really hurt like I thought it would. Fingers crossed this is your month jelr so you don't have to wait very long.

I spoke too soon when I said I was feeling better. I had the nerds incident :lol: but I've also been nauseous all week. I'm getting my energy back so I've been cleaning and cooking a little and not eating frequently like I should be, so the nausea creeps up on me until its really bad. Only 1 more day and then I can get extra rest and a break over the weekend. This week is dragging by...

For the week between Christmas and New Years, DH and I are working Tuesday and Wednesday but taking off the rest of the week. So it'll be like having 2 long weekends. At some point my brother will visit, and DH wants to save leave up for when the baby is here, so we didn't want to use too much time at Christmas. 

I know there was more that I wanted to say, but I'm pretty tired and should attempt to sleep. I haven't felt well enough to sleep until midnight but then I wake up at 4am for no reason at all and can't go back to sleep until 7am but Kira wakes up at 7:30 :dohh: My dreams have been so realistic and scary too... crazy ass pregnancy hormones!! :haha:


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## Shiv

jean - i have considered teething, but I have no evidence to back it up!

I hope Natasha feels better soon. I will certainly feel glad when all their teeth are in!

Spidey - what will you do with your time off over Christmas?

I weighed myself today, having not done so for a couple of weeks, and I am 9stone 5lbs! That's 4lbs under pre-preg weight! Don't know how it's happened, but the more weight i lose, the worse my belly looks!

I am having a night out tomorrow with my best friends from uni, they are coming here and we are going out for dinner and drinks and maybe ddancing! Very excited. have got 15oz milk expressed to hopefully get Cora to sleep and a feed in the morning!


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## spidey

Shiv, I hope you had a wonderful night out and Cora took her bottles with no problems! Congrats on the massive weight loss too- that's so fast to lose all your pregnancy weight plus extra! I'm already dreading what my tummy will look like when this is all over. My muscles have already split so if I lay down and then tighten my abs, my insides sort of herniate through the giant opening. My belly button has already popped and I know its going to look dreadful when it has to go back :lol: 

We're planning on decorating Kira's bedroom over the Christmas holiday. I never did much for her nursery- I just stuck some animal stickers on the wall. Right now she has a mattress on the floor and some really old mis-matched furniture from various places. I want to buy her a matching bed, dresser and night stand and put up light blocking curtains. The walls are dark gray and the carpet is blue, so I want to get white furniture and white/ pink accents. Once we fix up her room to make it hers, we're planning on transitioning her to her own bed.

I'm planning on doing tons of cooking over the next couple of weeks. On the menu is coconut macaroons, fudge, pumpkin roll, and strawberry toaster strudels. Yum yum yum! I need to get my fill of carbs before I'm diagnosed with GD :haha:


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## jelr

Spidey: I can't believe your belly button has popped already. Sorry to hear that you have been feeling sick again, I really do hope it settles down soon.

You will have to show us loads of pictures once Kira's room is done, it sounds like it will be lovely :thumbup:

Shiv: I hope you had a great night out, I see from fb that you have a hangover, so always a good sign :haha: - I hope Cora was well behaved and took her bottles too.

I actually don't have any evidence that it is teeth with Natasha either, I'm only guessing, although she did ask for bonjela the other night and I did manage to get a feel and although there are no teeth through, I can feel the actual shape of both the bottom teeth in the gum, so they are just there on the other side, but just need to actually break through the gum and I know on the previous back ones, that she was sick and cranky before they actually broke through rather than when they were breaking through, so I'm thinking it might be the case again this time. 

I'm amazed at how easily I had forgotten how hard teething can be. I will definitely be glad when they are finished with teething, this week has given me deja vu to this time last year.

Well not much news from me, we were meant to go visiting this weekend but had to cancel all. On saturday we were meant to go and see DH's nieces new baby, but I didn't want to bring Natasha up with a cold on top of a new baby and then today we were meant to call to friends of ours but one of their family members is very sick in hospital with suspected meningitis and they have all been in contact with her. I hope its not for their sakes as they have 2 small children too, so it is a big worry for them and obviously about the family member too. But we didn't want to chance taking Natasha up, especially when her immune system seems to be low at the moment also, so it was a quiet weekend here.

AF really did knock me for 6 yesterday, even though I didn't think I was pregnant, I just didn't expect to see her until Tuesday and fed up that my cycles are still wonky because when ff said that I had ovulated on Day 18, I was delighted that things seemed to be back in order, but they are obviously not as that is only a 29 day cycle and a LP of 11 days and it was still disappointing too that I'm not getting a christmas BFP like we did with Natasha 3 years ago. Aw well as I said on FB new year, new start and 2012 will hopefully start off with a BFP. :thumbup: - and the doom and gloom that I felt for the last two weeks over work has lifted so I'm thinking some of it could have been hormonal too.


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## spidey

jelr, fingers crossed Natasha is back to her happy healthy self for Christmas. I'm dreading Kira's molars coming in. We've had such a nice long break with no teething so it'll be hard when it starts up again.

I think your cycle was perfect! An 11 day LP is plenty long to get pregnant and it means the 2ww is a little shorter too :thumbup: I'm glad some of your doom and gloom has lifted and now you can focus on having a really fun Christmas break.

Shiv, I'm assuming your night out was fun and full of drinks :happydance: :thumbup:

:wave: to anyone else who is reading

I finally wrapped all the Christmas presents this weekend. I cannot wait until Christmas!! Kira has so much fun stuff that I want to play with :lol: I felt a bit better this weekend too, so maybe things are really looking up this time.

My belly button has always been shallow so its not too surprising its popped already :haha: I'll have to take an updated bump picture next time I have the camera out. I can't hide it now and I don't think its bloat- I think my uterus is gigantic :haha:


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## jelr

Hopefully 11 days is long enough, I suppose what I'm more afraid of is some of the reading I have been doing says that some doctors believe that a LP less than 12 can cause early MC, so I'm wondering if that has been my problem. I know 29 days is a very short cycle for me, so I'm hoping that hasn't been the case in the past, but it is so hard to know because my cycles have always been erratic, that maybe they were short LP cycles that I got pregnant on before and that is why the ended in MC. 

Ach I don't know, sometimes ignorance is bliss :haha: - I'm hoping it was just a once off and you had warned me that my cycle might be shorter on account of the previous one being longer, so maybe that is what the problem was this time, my body was just trying to catch back up with itself.

I can't wait for Christmas too, it really will be so exciting this year because they understand so much more. I can't wait to see Natasha's face when she sees her kitchen. DH put it together the other night and it looks great. My mam and brothers have bought her loads of wooden accessories to go with it too, so she will have great fun with it all.

Aw you see my belly button is the total opposite and never popped last time - in fact it just stretched and stretched so it is a huge gaping hole now :haha:

I really do hope that this is the start of your sickness getting better and that you can enjoy plenty of food over Christmas :thumbup:


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## spidey

jelr, I read all sorts of scary things about shorter LP's and early m/c and that's why I demanded having a progesterone test around 5w with this one for peace of mind. I honestly thought it would end in an early m/c because I had short LP's for so long and I really didn't think my body was back 100% to support a pregnancy. Plus Kira bf tons during the start of that cycle. Isn't it Aimee who has a 10 day LP? With your history of m/c will you get any extra medical attention for the next pregnancy? You grew one beautiful baby so I'm certain you'll grow another. There also seems to be debate on whether or not progesterone supplements started after a BFP (4w) will actually help. It seems like they need to be started right after ovulation for them to make a difference if progesterone is the cause of recurrent m/c. You're right though- ignorance is bliss :haha:

Natasha will love her kitchen! Kira still plays with hers atleast once or twice a week. If I stage a meal being cooked she'll discover it and then it'll keep her attention for 15 minutes :lol: 

I felt pretty good today and even cooked a proper dinner. It's so sweet because DH has been denied of home cooked meals for over a month now, so whatever I cook gets "oooo's and aaaaah's" and "this is the best meal EVER!" comments :haha; DH took Kira to his Christmas work party today and left me at home to relax. He claimed he wanted me to have time alone to relax, but I think he doesn't want his work to know I'm pregnant and there's no hiding it right now :haha: He has a plan to keep it a secret until I'm full term. He works with ladies who run the infants and newborns program and when I was pregnant with Kira they gave him a really hard time. They kept telling him how I wouldn't be able to do it without drugs, and then criticized some of our plans for co-sleeping and non scheduled bf. And since they're the "experts" DH was criticized even more when he tried to defend our decisions. I don't think they'll pick on him this time, but he doesn't want to risk it. Kira did very well with being around strangers at the Christmas party so she has completely outgrown her paralyzing stranger anxiety. I'm so glad she won't be as shy as me when I was younger. And now that she's talking it looks like she'll be much more advanced than I was in speech, so thats great too! :thumbup:


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## jelr

I will get extra scans starting from 7 weeks, but that is all im afraid. Ireland are very much behind and seem to not interfere much and let nature take its course, because we don't have half the tests during pregnancy that you have in the US or UK. I think the only reason they even do the extra scans after a MC is to put your mind at rest, but there wouldn't be a hope of getting a progesterone test or anything of the sort.

Ah hopefully if Aimee had a 10 day LP, all will be okay and 29 days is a particularly short cycle for me, so it was probably all the stress from work and my body catching up from the long cycle last time. Fingers crossed this one is back to normal and we hit the jackpot :thumbup:

Aww that is so sweet of DH to show he is so excited about your cooking. I can understand him not wanting to tell his co-workers if they are that interfering. I don't know why people don't just mind their own business, everybody has different parenting styles and there really is no right or wrong way as long as the child is loved and looked after. God that really annoys me :growl: 

That is brilliant that Kira has outgrown her stranger anxiety. They are all growing up so quickly now and really coming into their own personalities.

I really hope the dentist goes well today and that you don't get panicked and that Kira doesn't need work on her teeth. But please don't feel horrilbe, it is not your fault. You were not to know that they should go at 12 months and as I said to you over here it is 3 as far as I know, think of it none of our lion cubs have been. I honestly don't know how a dentist would look in a 12 month olds mouth. I have a hard enough time seeing into Natasha's and she trusts me and DH out of anybody in the world. Big hugs though as I know it must be a worry.

Well we have a busy few days head, so I might not get in for a few days, but then every time I say that I seem to make time :haha: I'm going to get the grocery shop done tonight, then clean the house tomorrow and then there is a carol service down in the village. Friday we out visiting and then Christmas eve we usually head to town for dinner and then Christmas day we have all my family over for dinner and then head up to DH's family for St. Stephens day (Boxing day in the UK, not sure if you have a day in the US but it is the day after Christmas :haha:) Then on the 27th the girls are calling here for food and drinks and then things will settle down a bit again. Don't know what we are doing new years yet, I would say we will probably stay at home this year. We have only went for a meal the last few years and came home to bring in the new year with Natasha (even though she is fast asleep :haha:) but I think we are going to give the meal a miss this year because it is more expensive and we only ever have time for our starter and main so it is a bit of a waste really.

Well just in case I'm not in. I hope you all have a very Merry Christmas and that it is really magical for all our little ones this year.

:hugs: to you all and thanks for everything over the year. Xx


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## Shiv

Jean - so sorry AF got you, I feel great things will happen for you and your family next year :thumbup:

Spidey - glad you are feeling better and that DH is appeciating you getting back your usual self!

AS for us, well we have had a busy few days, we went back to Kent on Sunday night in an attempt to see all our extended family before Christmas so that we could relax over Christmas proper. So on Sunday evening we went to a get together with David's 3 brothers, mum, dad, gran, aunts and uncles and respective partners etc. We only stayed a couple of hous, dropped off presents, let everyone have cuddles with the girls etc. SOphia was a star, I see showbiz in her future, she was singing the ABC song to her uncle and everyone went quiet so she started singing louder and looking around the room giving everyone some eye contact, she finished with a flourish to a great round of applause to which she joined in giving herself a clap too!

Monday we went to out old house to clear out the garage so that David's cousin can move in. Then i took the girls to see my Nan.

Tuesday we went to David's granparents, popped to the hospital to drop off my friends little girls pressie (remember I said on fb that I had a friend who was pregnany but the baby was not well, well they got moved to their local hospital after 6 weeks up in London in intensive care, so she is now in SCBU, and doing better than expected but still not very well). Also dropped a pressie off for a baby born on Saturday.

Then today we came home via a friend of mine and her 3 kids to drop of pressies and have some lunch

Tomorrow David's mum and partner are heading over for the day........phew I am exhausted!

Cora has been sleeping SO well (bet i just jinxed that) she slept from 6pm to 6.30am the other night - not been repeated though! Sophia on the other hand has been waking up at least 10 times a night, no idea why. She has on inspection alredy got one full 2nd molar through (just not on the side I expected it to be) and the 4 prongs of the other bottom one. It could be that but I would have thought she could have explained that her mouth hurt and she says it doesn;t when I ask :shrug: Exhausting though, I hope she has a good night tonight.

Potty training is going well. We only one time in the last week that she did a bit of a wee in her knickers before she told me she had a soggy bottom and we went to the toilet. Other than that she has been dry (she still wears a nappy at night which is always full in the morning though) even with a few 2 hour car journeys and lots of tooing and froing - so quite pleased with that. We still ask her all the time if she needs to go, not sure how she would get on if we just left her completely to it.

Well we are at home until Christmas morning when we head to my parents, I intend to do a lot of dairy free baking so that i have lots of treats to take with me to my parents to munch whilst everyone else digs in to yummy stuff!

Oh I forgot, my night out went well! Cora went down fine after only 1oz from her bottle and slept until 7am, then went back down after a full bottle in the am for another 4 hours. I had a lovely thai meal then went on to a few bars in the town where i live, one very random one where the DJ was playing lots of 80's songs, bananarama, wham, t'pau, madonna etc, it was hilarious and a blast from the past. We got in about 2am, very tipsy but not too bad, I did feel pretty ropey in the morning though, was sick and then felt much better! SO a success hurrah!

Well I will be looking in over the next few days, but will wish you both (it seems to be just the three of us at the moment) 

A VERY MERRY, MAGICAL CHRISTMAS, AND A 2012 FILLED WITH JOY AND ALL YOUR DREAMS COME TRUE. 

I just made myself tear up thinking about how much I really do love you girls even though I've never met you - what a plonker :haha:


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## Mary Jo

*waves*

hey girls, sorry I have not been posting since Joel was born, I have been reading every couple of days and keeping up on Facebook as well. 

Jean, so sorry about AF hitting you, I have all my fingers crossed that 2012 is your year. you, too, Cleck, if you're reading. :kiss: 

Spidey, ack, please don't beat yourself up about Kira's teeth, from what you've said you have done pretty much the same as most of us. it is so so hard to clean a toddler's teeth properly, I think it's just very very bad luck that she's got some decay. like Shiv, I would have no idea if Adam has problems as he is impossible to pin down. I let Chris do the teeth cleaning and I am 95% sure it's never done as properly as it should be, am thinking about banning or limiting juice now, though. really hope the treatment helps and she doesn't need crowns. I guess it's just a good thing to did spot it, before she was in pain. big hugs to you both.

very glad to hear you are feeling better yourself, though. right in time for Christmas, too. don't blame you for keeping your pregnancy quiet from people like that, I hate unsolicited opinions especially when they are negative. I had it when pregnant with Adam, when I was planning to use cloth nappies, a couple of friends laughed and said I'd never do it. it only made me more set on the idea, to show them! I don't really talk much IRL about my parenting choices, I can't be bothered explaining or feeling like I have to justify anything. your child, your choices, nobody's business but yours and your husband's. experts schmexperts.

sounds like you've had a busy few days Shiv! that's so cute about Sophia and her audience. what happened about your MIL? is she coming over after all? glad you got your night out and C took a bottle. good girl! what sort of dairy free stuff will you be baking? is C responding to your changed diet?

as for us... I had my 6 week check today and it was fine. both kids fell asleep in the pushchair and stayed asleep in the waiting room (the part I was dreading most, having to prise Adam from the toys when it was my turn) and then Adam woke about 10 mins into the appt, but it was almost done then so his screaming didn't cause too much of a problem. I didn't ask about my bulging stomach (it's all sticking out below my ribs but not at the bottom of my tummy), but she had a good feel and nothing is abnormal so I am assuming I am just fat and untoned! I have 2 stones to lose. yep it's scary. I have barely lost anything since weighing myself about a week after Joel was born. but I have been eating like it's Christmas every day. and I don't really care *that* much. well I do, but am not dieting before Christmas. after - ok. grrrr. 

Joel is doing well, he's so big though. we were given a load of stuff in 3-6 months and I tried some on today and it's tight enough that he won't fit it for more than a week or so. this is new stuff that I have just washed once at 40C and airdried. I want to get him weighed and measured, hoping it'll be done at his 8 week check on the 30th. we are still bf, well, mix-feeding, I definitely have a lot more milk than with Adam, I can express more, and he has one full bottle of EBM a day plus bf overnight and a couple of times during the day. he has quite a lot of formula but it's ok, he's a big lad. I feel good knowing he's getting *some* bm. he is very congested (nose), though, he has always been snuffly, but he seemed to get my cold last week, and I had to get saline spray, which helped, and he seems ok during the day but at night I have had to spray at least least once a night. poor baby hates it but it seems to do the trick for a while. I have been getting all anxious worrying that he has allergies, especially to my cat, but IIRC, he sneezed loads during the week we were in the hospital so I don't think it's that. I will see how he goes but might think about getting a humidifier for the bedroom. it does get very warm in there (rest of the house is draughty).

Adam is - a challenge. oh, the SCREAMING. the tantrums. it's doing my head in. and he's started biting and pinching, when I have to change his nappy or make him go into the pushchair. he grabs my face. ow. (we need to potty train him. thinking about trying to go nappy free for a few days over Christmas once my parents have left and before C is back at work.) he has never directed his violence to Joel, and I don't think it's really related to him, he just gets annoyed when he can't do something. you all know the score I am sure. :(

he's speaking a lot but not that clearly. and a lot of words are not right, but they're often funny. for example, he knows that jelly wobbles, and he knows the word wobble but he says "mabble". so cute. I am not stressing about it, C tells me he used to say loads of words wrong, and he can remember it (he remembers his nana telling him off for misprouncing his sister's name - Daydul for Rachel. if he remembers he must have been 3 or older). Adam says some stuff very clearly, so I am sure he'll get there. 

(though I do feel he is behind now, with all the chattering, potty trained lion cubs we have. )

Joel is just gorgeous, just thought I'd say! he's my little darling, I love him so much. 

so Christmas - I am kind of ready. C is off from tomorrow night, then my parents are down from Fri till Tuesday, and C is not back to work till the 3rd. I'm mostly looking forward to the chance of a lie in. :haha:


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## spidey

jelr, enjoy the next few days! Are you cooking Christmas dinner for everyone at your house or is it a potluck? We don't celebrate Boxing day here and I honestly have no clue what that day is about :haha: it's probably not about boxing though :rofl: I haven't even thought of New Years plans yet. We'll probably stay home with Kira and enjoy the break from work :thumbup:

Shiv, yay for a fun night out! Thats really smart to get some family visiting out of the way so you can rest more during Christmas. I can picture Sophia putting on her performance for the family- so adorable! Kira does silly things and then looks around to see who's watching :lol: Poor Sophia and her teeth... I hope they pop through quick. I'm glad Cora is sleeping well too :thumbup:

I can't shake the guilt I've been feeling about Kira's teeth. It's been almost 3 days of guilt ever since I saw the decay on her teeth. I can hardly eat and haven't slept and I feel so sick over it and just want to cry :cry: Crying now infact since DH and Kira have gone to the store and I don't allow myself to cry infront of them. I feel like I've let her down... it's one of the only things I had to do as a mom and I couldn't even do it right. I know DH is feeling it too. We both had horrible experiences as kids with the dentist and both of us have crooked teeth that are mostly fillings and we've always openly discussed how Kira will not go thru the same things as us, and here we've f'ed it up and she's starting out worse than we did. The dentist didn't intend to be mean, but she said "you say you brush her teeth but they don't appear to be" I wish I knew it would be okay but I'm afraid of her losing her pretty perfect smile. I stare at her smile everyday thankful she has perfect straight teeth unlike my massive overlapping ones and now I look at her and it makes me sick knowing they're decayed where I can't see yet. God this is an awful feeling. I hope it passes soon because it's killing me inside and now I'm wondering how I'll cope with all the other things in life feeling this much guilt about baby teeth. Gosh I'm sounding so crazy now I just wish there was a way to stop obsessively thinking about it.

On a better note.. 2 work days for me and then Friday night we're having Christmas at my parents house. It's family tradition to open presents the Friday night at the start of my Dad's week off work. He has only ever gotten 2 weeks off, one in Summer and one at Christmas so to maximize the time spent having fun we would open our presents the moment his vacation started. So if we got a bike or skates, my Dad could take us out all week to play with our new toys. Then Sunday morning Santa is coming to my house, and Sunday afternoon we're walking nextdoor to the MIL's house. Kira is going to be spoiled by the time this is over :lol: Next week I'll be hanging out with my parents a lot since my Dad is off work... and perhaps buying furniture for Kira's room!

I also want to thank you girls for being in my life :hugs: It might sound crazy but you two (and the others who are too busy to post atm) are closer friends than the people I know in real life.


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## Shiv

Hi MJ, thanks for popping in to see us, I miss your chat :hugs: Glad that Joel is doing so well, and that you are managing to get more milk out this time, he is clearly thriving. How are you feeling in yourself now?

My tummy is still bigger at the top near my ribs than at the bottom, I thought it might be to do with my abs muscles separating, do you know if yours did?

Don't worry about the weight, enjoy Christmas, then give up Chocolate for a few weeks and you'll soon shift it. I can highly recommend a dairy free diet for weight loss :haha:

Sorry Adam is being handful, Sophia is being such a madam, I am getting towards my wits ends some days especially as she is keeping us up all through the night and it is so much harder when you are tired. She is just SO defiant and has suddenly got selective hearing so basically spends all day ignoring me. I end up getting down to her level and holding her by the shoulders so she has to listen to me. Then she just shouts "NO" in my face. Then what do I do? i have no idea! I hope it is a phase that she grows out of real quick!

AS for potty training, have him nappy free at home for a couple of days and you'll soon see if he is ready. If he isn't then no harm done. My nephew turned 3 and is ony just being trained now as my brother tried a few months ago and it ended in tears. 

As for dairy free goodies. I have made a dairy free choc sponge which I am going to make cake balls out of (like cake pops but without the sticks) so basically mix the cake crumbed up cake with dairy free buttercream (made with dairy free spread and icing sugar) and then cover with 85% dark choc.

I have found some yummy crisps that don't contain milk to take as well and if I can be bothered i will maybe make some other sort of dessert. 

I almost cried today in the supermarket when David was piling the trolley high with Christmas goodies (stilton, biscuits, stollen etc etc) that i couldn't eat. It really does suck especially as I am wondering if it really is dairy that is affecting cora. She is happy as larry these days, sleeps and naps like an angel (jinxed that I bet :haha:) and i am sure the Tequila Rose shots I had the other night must have contained dairy and she doesn't seem to have reacted to it. It is however too close to Christmas to test it out now as she tends to react 48 hours later for a few days and I don't want a grumpy baby over Christmas.

Spidey, I understand your guilt, when Sophia fell down the stairs at 14 months I felt terrible for months (still do) and I can still hear the noise of her bumping down the stairs, makes me feel sick. So I understand and what has happened to Kira is not your fault, the guilt will pass. Try to forget about it over Christmas.

I LOVE the fact you have Christmas early so you can play with your toys with your dad for longer!

David's mum came round today and wanted to come to my parents house as well on boxing day but I *think* David has persuaded her to skype on Christmas day instead which works for me!

So Cora is in her own room now as I couldn't squeeze her in her basket any longer, I miss her. And now that she has decided that she wants to go to bed by about 7.30pm instead 11pm I miss my evening of cuddles too. They grow up so darn quick and I find myself getting a bit mopey at the thought that she'll be a terror like Sophia before I know it and my baby will be gone. 

Right best go and cover my cake balls in chocolate!


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## jelr

Shiv: I'm glad that Cora is sleeping and sorry to hear that Sophia is being a madam, I do think it is down to the teeth though. I was the same last week when Natasha was sick, I found her moods very hard and it was my mam said it is probably her teeth too and I had said she is not complaining about her mouth though and my mam reckoned none of us rarely complained about our mouths being sore, that sometimes the teeth don't actually hurt but they just don't feel well or their heads hurt, so maybe she is right. I really hope she is back to her sweet self soon. Thankfully Natasha is :thumbup:

You are right to get as much Christmas visting out of the way, we have found we end up spending most of the holidays either visiting or having visitors and although I do love it, it goes so quickly and it is tiring and at the end of the holidays you have barely had a minute to just spend time as a family. I have dropped off any of the pressies for my friends children this week and had a good old catch up and the ones that I haven't seen are coming on the 27th for drinks here, so that has reduced our running around a little. Although we still have a few to catch up with that we didn't get to the last few week with Natasha being sick and DH's family. 

I'm glad David managed to put of your MIL so hopefully you can relax with your own family now.

Your treats sound lovely I have to say. I hope dairy free is not too hard this year. your night out sounds like great fun. I was so looking forward to my nights dancing and it was a disaster because everyone was so young and under dressed :haha: and I was afraid to drink more than a couple because of being in the tww. Imagine all of us out dancing together for the night, I bet we would have a great laugh :haha:

MJ: so good to see you, I miss your chat too :thumbup:

I'm so glad you are getting some bf in for Joel and you are happy with him getting formula too, he is definitely getting exactly what he needs and is thriving. How are you feeling in yourself now, are you still taking the tablets?

I loved your pic on fb today with Adam in the bath and Joel asleep in the shower, now that is definitely smart thinking and a great mum, see I knew you would be great with two.

Dont worry about the weight, you lost it the last time by just cutting out chocolate, so you will again. I am up a half a stone from giving up smoking and I know I will be up another over the Christmas, so I will be joining you in the post Christmas weight loss. I did do low carb over the last few weeks, but I could only do it for 2 weeks at the start of my cycle because again I was terrified it wouldn't be good for a potential baby to be down a food group, but it was a disaster and I only lost 2lbs. I wish I could lose weight by just giving up junk, but I actually eat little junk so that wouldn't work, all that works for me is to starve myself :haha: - my plan for the new year is to quit smoking again as soon as I go back to work on the 4th and if I'm not pregnant that cycle to go back on the lipotrim once AF comes and I'm sure I'm not pregnant, because the heavier I am the worse the pcos is and I may shift it or there will be no babies :growl:

Adam is definitely not behind, even though Natasha has loads of sentaces, she doesn't pronounce a huge amount of her words properly as you can see from the video on FB and she is not potty trained either. They will all do it in their own time.

Sorry to hear he is being a typical toddler too and screaming like them all these days. Those days are so bloody hard though.

Spidey: Yep we are cooking for all of most of my family, so we have myself and DH, my mam and dad (the only meal they share together now :haha:) and 4 of my brothers and Natasha. My sister is going to her husbands this year and my brother won't be home from London, but will hopefully be home for new years.

Please don't feel so guilty about Kiras teeth, because you are more on the ball than any of us to have spotted it, when none of us have seen in our LO's mouths. I do understand though, I know when my mam fell with Natasha when she was 2 months old. I don't know if you remember or were on bnb at that stage, but we got timber delivered and I had told the delivery mam to put it in our hall, so it wouldn't get wet until DH came home and my mam called over and was playing with Natasha while I lit the fire and she had a dirty nappy and she said she would go down and change her and I never thought to tell her about the stuff in the hall and she fell over it and dropped Natasha. My poor mam was worse than Natasha because she hit the wall and burst her nose, but we had to make a trip to the doctors and then into A&E to check for a head injury as Natasha got sick all over herself. I still feel sick when I think of it and will never forget my mams scream that she had dropped her. I was rooted to the spot and don't remember even going down the hall. I had to ask my mam did I just stand there, because it felt like I was frozen to the spot. I know when I did go down all I just whipped Natasha up and then saw blood on the floor and couldn't even take Natasha away from my chest to look if it was her bleeding or my mam, I was too terrified to look at her face and just shouted at my poor mam whos blood is that. The guilt does get easier and you have hopefully nipped this in the butt and taught all of us some lessons too.

I can't wait to see Kira's new furniture. Enjoy your dad being off work.

Aww, I teared up reading you girls posts. I LOVE you girls too and am so so happy that you are a part of my life, you have been great over the last year. I have very good best friends, but we don't get to see each other as much as I would like now because life is so busy with everyone, where as I nearly talk to you girls every day or every second day and it really has been a hard year as you all know and you girls have been there for me and been my rock just as much as my own close friends have. I definitely couldn't have gotten through everything this year without you all. Crazy when we have never met, I so wish we all lived nearer, because I know we would be great friends and I'm funny when it comes to friends, since I have gotten older. Because I don't have much time anymore between work and Natasha, I don't really have time for new friends. I'm not good with making conversation with new people really either (well I can do the small talk, but that is it) and I think it is partly because my best friends have all been my friends for years and years when I was better at meeting and mixing with people, but also because I feel I wouldn't have time now to meet new friends when I can't find the time that I want to with my oldest and closest. I speak to them all once or twice a week and they are here in a heartbeat if anything is wrong or vice versa, but I only get to see them every few weeks now. Anyway I'm rambling now, but my point is, I know I would click with you girls and become great friends if you lived nearer. I mean how many times have I said I wouldn't get back in the thread when I'm working and I do sometimes find it so hard to even get the time to get in here, but when I'm not I miss you girls or else I intend to read and try to get to bed early and then I do read on my phone and something has happened or one of you is down and I have to log on and let you know I'm here or be there for you, because it upsets me so much if any of you are upset. You are all such a big part of my life now.

Well not much news from us, I told you I would find time to get back in seeing as I didn't think I would :haha: - I ran around like a looney today, getting washing and cleaning done and we went to the carol service which was lovely and Natasha really loved it, they also had dancers in the hall afterwards from different schools of dancing and she wanted to get on the stage and dance with them :haha: - I definitely think we will have to do dance classes of some sort when she is older. DH now has her cold though and is really smothering with it, I hope he is better soon and that I don't catch it - although I usually do end up sick over the Christmas holidays and my immune system is probably down because my arthritis is playing havoc the last week. I feel so much better though this week and am in much better form and am starting to get the Christmas cheer and am so excited for Santa and even though next year will be so different with work. I'm feeling really positive that I will get my bfp and that next year will be a better year. 

Well this time I know I won't be in under after Christmas anyways, I will hopefully get in before the new year though.

So have a ball everyone and eat and drink loads and enjoy Santa. Love and :hugs: to you all.


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## spidey

Hi MJ :wave: we must have posted at the same time the other day! It sounds like Joel is doing wonderful. Is he pretty laid back? I bet he's entertained all day by watching Adam run around the house :lol: I loved the pictures you posted of Adam on FB. The sandwich on the wall was so clever :rofl: Kira doesn't talk much either, but she's just starting to repeat things back to us, so I think this time next year she'll have sentences. I think its hard on them because they're so smart and have things to say and tons of wants, but don't quite have the skills to say them yet. 

Shiv, I'm sorry you can't indulge in all the yummy dairy filled desserts. Everything yummy has dairy in it. There are some great blogs for gluten free recipes, so you might want to search for dairy free blogs. I know GF people are very determined to make yummy GF desserts, so I bet the dairy free blog people are the same way.

With all this talk about molars coming in, yesterday Kira was being super cranky and I noticed 1 corner of her molar just popped in! It's funny how they're all going through teething again.

jelr, I hope you can avoid the germs at your house. Your cycle worked out perfect so you can enjoy some drinks over Christmas and not worry about being in the 2ww! 

As for me, I'm feeling better after my rant and hearing how you girls suffer from the same awful mommy guilt. jelr, I don't remember your mom dropping Natasha so I must not have been posting around that time, but that's so awful. I do remember Sophia falling down the stairs though. I guess no matter what we do we're going to feel guilty about something. After giving it much thought, I decided to change dentists for Kira. The dentist was very good, but I think she could have been a bit less accusing and strict. I brushed Kira's teeth before her nap yesterday and had a really good look in there... she even let me scrape at her teeth with my fingernail. The dentist said her teeth had plaque and tarter ALL over them, but they don't. I went almost 10 years without seeing a dentist and I know what tarter and plaque look like. So I honestly believe DH was doing a good job at brushing her teeth in the evening, and I think the dentist was being a bit dramatic. I also don't fully agree with the accusation that mom infects the sterile mouthed infant with bacteria causing them to get cavities. The dentist told me to stop sharing food and drink with Kira so I stop giving her big doses of cavity causing bacteria (after I told her I have no unfilled cavities in my mouth). I've spent the last 10 years working in science, specifically with bacteria, and I know that everything is covered in bacteria. Our entire digestive track is teeming with bacteria, which we ingest everyday. Lastly, to tell us to "be mean" when we brush her teeth and hold her in a slightly inverted position as we brush her teeth for 10 minutes "and its okay if her gums bleed" seems so cruel. Ive also done some reading on how some baby teeth can come in with little or no enamel, or pores and these teeth are prone to decay no matter how many times they're brushed. Sometimes its genetic, sometimes its from medications the child has, but basically they don't know why some teeth are made crappier than others. Kira has been on some harsh medications in her little life, so who knows if they affected her teeth. I'm sure me and DH are to blame somewhat for her decay, but I don't think it's 100% our fault and I think the dentist should have been more understanding. Kira is sooo good at getting her teeth brushed and I told DH that we are NOT going to "be mean" when we brush them and torture her. We're going to start brushing them 3 times a day- after breakfast, before nap and before bed. And we're going to cut out juice and give her water instead. My mom told me how at the age of 3 I was still sucking on a bottle of koolaid all day! I had my teeth brushed once a day before bed and I ate an unhealthy diet filled with sweets. Gotta love the honesty of my mom :haha: Kira doesn't drink from a bottle or a sippy cup (which are 2 major causes of decay), she mostly eats healthy when I'm feeling well enough to cook, and her snacks are foods like pistachios, sunflower seeds, raisins and granola... things that don't speed up tooth decay (but rather help her poop, lol). Okay, I need to stop blabbing on about this, sorry about my rant :haha: it's been eating me up this week.

I'm being naughty and posting from work, so I better get back to it. No one is here today so its hard to focus! Tonight is the first round of present opening!!!


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## Shiv

Hi girls, I will come back with my own update later but i wanted to paste this before I forget. I messaged Cleck on fb to wish her a merry christmas and she replied and asked me to post it here .........

Hey. Hope you guys had an amazing christmas! I've been so busy since being home. My MIL bought a Curves business, which is a work out place for women. Well my SIL is managing it, so I babysit my niece every day and have helped with random business things like making their business cards and we'll be painting and redecorating this week.
Emma has been sick twice since being home. The first time was her first ever ear infection and it was a double ear infection too. So that was an awful week. And now she is sick again. It's the price we pay for being around cousins and family on a regular basis, I suppose. 
I ran over my dog Diesel last week with my Jeep. :( Since being home he started chasing me out of the driveway anytime I would try to leave. We are in the middle of the country and the dogs are just left outside to roam (35 acres) when we aren't home. Anyways, he was chasing me and I hit him. But he is okay. Just a little beat up. That was a dramatic week for me as well. 
I don't have super regular access to the internet so when I do get on, I typically just check email and pay bills and than get right back off. Surprisingly it has been really refreshening for me to not be as dependent on it. I know I need to get on BnB and update but I am such a downer about anything pregnancy or baby related right now so I've just stayed away. I have friends and family asking at every get together when I'll have another. Drives me crazy. 
Corey is definitely getting out of the navy now. That wait is over with wondering if he has to get out. He plans on joining the reserves for the healthcare though. So he will still have to be gone only one weekend a month now. Which will be a drastic change. I'm terrified and preparing myself for the worst. But my inlaws have said they will let us live there for as long as necessary. It has been so wonderful living there so far. I keep their house clean and cook a lot of dinners to help out because my MIL works all day so I figure she shouldn't have to cook when she's tired from work. 
Emma is doing great with potty training. She rarely uses her little potty anymore because she would rather sit straight on the toilet and she has finally started telling me when she has to go so I don't have to keep asking anymore. She is still having issues with pooping on the potty though. I think she's embarrassed about it so she would rather just do it in her pants without me knowing. But I figure she'll get the hang of it eventually. Her talking is coming on by leaps and bounds now that we are around a ton of people. She speaks better than her 3 year old cousin! Which I'm slightly smug about. 
Feel free to post this on the page so everyone can read this update. I really am sorry I haven't gotten on. I'm sure once we settle into our own place and get normal internet back I will be back full force. Corey get's out of the navy September 1, 2012. Which seems to be coming up fast. I've been saving like crazy in preparation and fixing whatever needs fixed on my Jeep so we won't have any mechanical worries right away either. lol Okay, this is all jumbled and I'm sure I forgot some updates. I really miss all of you guys! XOXOXO


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## spidey

yay, I'm so glad she wrote you with an update! Besides Diesel being hit by the car it sounds like things are going really well! Thanks for posting it. I have tons of questions for her but will save them for when she's back on here posting.

On Saturday we're picking up Kira's new furniture!
https://www.roomstore.com/kids-room/kids-furniture/collections/chantilly/205254.aspx
We're getting the bed (not the underneath part), dresser (without the mirror) and nightstand. I've spent the last few days trying to organize all of Kira's clothes and toys. It's a real disaster right now. Today I'll be cleaning out the spare bedroom which currently is packed with DH's book hoard, diningroom chairs, and tons of boxes and garbage. That room will be for the new baby and before Saturday I need it mostly cleared out so I have room to put Kira's current mismatched furniture in it.

How is everyone else enjoying their Christmas week? I could use about 2 more weeks in order to get everything done around here!!

I'm having some flashbacks and mental issues regarding Kira's time in the NICU... I'll make a longer post about it later because I need to figure out how to get it into words. It's come out of nowhere and at night I can't help but cry for an hour about it before I can get to sleep or go back to sleep. I can't tell anyone because it makes me feel crazy so I'll subject you girls to it :lol:


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## spidey

I'm going to blab on about things now... I think I just need to get it out and I really hope it makes me feel better. I can't bring myself to talk about it to DH because I would cry before the first words came out. Kira's tooth problems have brought back all these crazy emotions about her birth that I obviously had bottled up somewhere. With Kira's teeth, we were given 2 choices- either have her put under general anesthesia to have crowns put on, or give her fluoride and wait and see how long those teeth last. We picked the wait and see option. In my mind, "good" parents would take the more medicalized option and have their child's teeth fixed right away. When Kira was about 3 days old she was intubated and not making good progress towards recovery. They sat us down in a meeting and said we had 2 choices. Either have her transported to Children's Hospital in Washington DC to see a pediatric neurosurgeon who could perform life saving surgery to stop her bleeds, or we could leave her at the current hospital with no pediatric neurosurgeon and wait and see what happens. We decided to wait and see. At the time I felt like I let her down because "good" parents would do anything they could to save their child. I know in the end we made the right decision and more than likely any surgery would have left her with disabilities. But at the time the guilt nearly killed me and I knew if something happened to her I would forever live with guilt knowing I didn't do everything to save her. Another incident that I keep playing over and over in my head, that I can't even think about without crying, is when Kira was 4 hours old and they put us in our private hospital room for the night. The nurse turned off the lights and told us to go to sleep (it was 1am). Once the nurse left we flicked on the lights to have a few minutes alone with our new baby. DH insisted she was a little blue, but I honestly did not see it. He kept going on and on about it and I told him to shut up and she was fine. I was really irritated with him. The nurse came back in the room and wasn't too happy to see us with the lights on, and DH said "she keeps turning blue". I was mad he would say something like that to the nurse when all I wanted to do was hold my baby. She watched Kira for awhile and said everything looked fine, but DH said he couldn't sleep, so the nurse offered to take Kira to the nurses station. An hour later she completely stopped breathing and they found her blue and performed CPR. If she remained in our room that night, she would have died and I would have woken in the morning to find her. I get so overwhelmed at times because I know that one little decision changed everything. 99% of the time if I tell DH to shut up he will, so why didn't he listen to me that night. I can't get that moment out of my head... every detail of that night plays over and over and it's all come back these past 2 weeks since Kira's teeth incident. I know her stay in the NICU permanently changed me and its obvious I haven't healed from it since some decay on baby teeth shouldn't leave me so traumatized. I've been on edge her entire life waiting for the next disaster... at first I was obsessed with her having SIDS, then having seizures, cancer from all the x-rays, developmental delays, etc and so far everything has been too perfect and I feel like I'm cheating at life. I've been mentally preparing for the next disaster and now she has a few rotten baby teeth and I snap. I never talked about what happened at Kira's birth and the week after. I lied to everyone about it. When my parents called to get updates I didn't tell them the complete story and most people including my MIL have no idea that Kira had hemorrhaging in her brain. I told most of the family that they kept her in the hospital nursery because inhaled meconium might cause an infection. I didn't even cry when she was in the hospital... completely blocking it out hasn't done me much good obviously.

Okay, end blab session. I wish I knew how to fix it. I don't think being pregnant helps because childbirth is creeping back into my mind. And I'm a pro at avoidance since I changed birthing centers and midwives for no good obvious reason. Now I don't have to face whatever anxiety I have when I see the midwives who delivered Kira and visited us during the days after her birth. 

Oh, and I'm planning to take Kira to another dentist for a second opinion. Perhaps it'll help.

If you made it through thanks for reading and I hope it wasn't too jumbled... I just needed to get it out of my head. Lets see if I sleep better tonight.


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## jelr

Oh Spidey big massive :hugs: - you are not a bit mental, it is totally understandable what you are going through. You have loads of pregnancy hormones playing havoc with you at the moment and that was a massive massive trauma to go through with Kira that would change anybody and you are bound to be thinking about it more at the moment with being pregnant and facing child birth again.

First of all - I do agree with you though, you are not a "good" parent, but instead you are an excellent parent. I would have made the very same decision regarding Kira's teeth. Why would you put a tiny little tot through an anesthetic to put crowns on when she is not in pain and the flouride can do the job. Anesthetic can be so dangerous and it would be extremely traumatic for her to go through, so it would be madness to put her through it when it is not necessary and they are only her baby teeth.

Also regarding the surgery when she was a baby, you totally made the right decision by waiting because she is perfectly normal and healthy, whereas the surgery would probably have caused disabilities. I'm not religious, but I do believe that there is a higher power or I guess you could call it a God, but even though I am a catholic because 99.9 percent of Irish people are and I have gotten Natasha christened, but more so because I don't want her to be different than her class mates when she goes to school and feel left out when it comes to her first communion and confirmation. But I am not a practicing catholic. The only time I go to church is for weddings and funerals and on Christmas because it makes my mam happy and the choir and ceremony makes it feel like Christmas if that makes sense. I don't belive though that any particular religion is correct or that you need to pray or worship a God, but that once you are a good person and treat others as you would like to be treated, you will be okay. I guess what I'm saying is I do believe there is something up there and more so I believe that everything happens for a reason - Granted I did feel very differently at the last MC and lost that bit of faith that I did have for a while, but now I have it back again and do feel that because Natasha wasn't sleeping I was struggling with parenting and since then I don't care if she sleeps or not and have so much more patience because I feel so lucky to have been blessed with her because her pregnancy could have ended in MC, so what I'm saying is maybe that was the reason, or maybe things with my job would have worked out differently because I would have been on maternity so maybe I wouldn't have gotten my permenant contract and would have had no job to go back to. :shrug: I don't know, but I do think there was some reason for it and we just don't know it yet.

Anyway I know I'm waffling, but the point I'm trying to make is you feel like you didn't fight for Kira, but something made you make that decision to wait and it was the right one so everything does happen for a reason and the reason you waited was that the outcome of the surgery would probably have been much worse. Being a parent is all about choices and it is usually a guessing game and you had a choice back then in the hospital and although it doesn't feel to you like you were fighting for her, I think that you did. You made the decision to wait because you were fighting for her to have the most normal life possible and that happened because of your good choice, so please please stop feeling like you are a bad parent, because you are not, you are a fantastic mom who has made the correct choices for her baby.

I know it has to be scary to think what could have happened if DH didn't kick up a fuss, but he did and again it was the right decision and that is not something to beat yourself up over, you had just had a baby and were probably exhausted if you were anything like me, so it is totally understandable that you didn't see her being a bit blue - the nurse didn't even see it, so you couldn't have been expected to just after giving birth. My DH reckons he could have thrown a cow on top of me and he would have gotten the same reaction because I was completely exhausted after childbrith.

I hope that you feel a little better now you have gotten it all out, but maybe if you don't feel like you will still cry, talk to your DH about it or even your mom, because I do think it is something you will need to deal with before you give birth again, so that it doesn't all freak you out when the time comes. Maybe even write or type it out to either of them and that way they will know, but you will have it out without crying and then you can discuss it and cry all you need to.

I love Kira's furniture by the way, it is absolutely gorgeous.

Cleck: if you are reading - I'm glad things seem to be going well, but am sorry to hear that Emma has been sick and about the dog, I'm so glad he was okay though. We do miss you, so hope you will be back with us soon.

Shiv: Thanks for giving us the update and hope you and the girls are well also.

Well not much going on for us. I have been really sick since Christmas Eve, so this year really did finish with a bang. I started to shiver and shake on Christmas eve and had really bad flu symptoms like pains and my skin was sore and then when I took my temp Christmas morning I was running a fever. It was fine though I was well enough to get up and do santa and DH looked after all the dinner and I went back to bed when Natasha went for her nap, since then I have had an awful throat, headache and sinisitus and really bad snottyness. It thankfully seems to be clearing the last few days and I only have the headache and sinus problems so hopefully it is on its way out. It did mean we didn't do as much as we had hoped and I have felt pretty miserable and exhausted that I didn't really get to enjoy the holidays and time with DH and Natasha like I wanted to, but then I always tend to end up sick at Christmas and should have known this year would end with me feeling crap :growl: 

Anways at least the year is gone now and hopefully this year will be a good one. I'm on CD16 today so OV will probably be around Tuesday, we have dtd loads to cover all bases and I still haven't gotten a postive OPK - I'm constantly getting a line, but just not a darker one than the test line and I forgot to test yesterday, so I'm not sure if they will work for me with the pcos. Don't know how this month will go either with being so sick and so full of cold medication in the last two weeks, although I'm really grateful that I could take loads of cold medication and that I wasn't in the tww, because I probably would have ended up in bed if not.

How did Santa go for you all. I think Natasha was still a little overwhelmed by it all, she loved everything she got, but we didn't get the really excited reaction that we thought we would, she just didn't really know what to look at or what to play with :dohh: - she has really made me laugh over the Christmas though, although the I don't like was really annoying, there were times where it was funny and her new one is "I need" and it is mainly I need a snuggle when she is meant to be going to bed or eating :haha:

What did you all do for new years after? We ended up just staying at home and it was looking like the two of us (and Natasha in bed) and funnily enough I would have happy enough with that this year. I usually feel we have to do something for new years, but this year I was so happy to see it go and it kind of felt right to have a quiet one and be just with DH considering everything that we have been through this year. But my brother arrived home from London and my sister and her husband opted not to go out either as my sister had to work today, so we had ourselves, my sister and her husband, my two brothers and my mam and it was really lovely, we had a few bottles of champers and had a right old giggle, and it was so relaxed and just right really.

Anyways hope you are all well - I have babbled enough :haha:


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## spidey

jelr, thanks for your words of support :flower: I didn't have time to post a few days ago after you posted, but you definitely reminded me to focus on the more important things. I know what you mean about having more patience because you are blessed to have Natasha in your life. I am the same way with Kira- I still stare at her while she sleeps and feel so lucky that I have her. I do think the experience of having her in the hospital has changed me for the better too, because I am a very patient person now and I don't take life for granted like I used to. When I was in the hospital there was a mom on the maternity ward complaining about her newborn crying. I swore that if I could leave the hospital with my baby that I would never complain when she cried. I know this tooth issue has rattled me and I'm definitely thinking more doom and gloom about things, but I'm trying to change my way of thinking to be more positive again. I know I'm over protective to a fault because I don't want Kira to have any more pain in life. 

I'm in contact with 3 women who have 2 year olds with similar decay and they have told me their stories. In all 3 cases the decay progressed very quickly and all 3 girls needed their 4 front teeth removed. 2 of the girls needed other teeth fixed too. It has made me sick hearing the stories of these girls. They use this thing called a papoose board where the child is secured to a board so they can't move their arms, and their foreheads are secured with a belt. I looked more into it, and it's banned in most countries, but apparently commonly used here in the US. In both cases, the parents weren't allowed in the room during treatment. This happened to 2 of the girls. The other was held still by her mother as they took out her teeth. I wouldn't let anyone do that to a dog, let alone a child. I have an appointment with another pediatric dentist tomorrow (Wednesday) for a second opinion. I know this journey will end with torture so part of me wants to repair the teeth now. It's either torture now or later... but no matter what I'm not allowing them to strap her down. 

jelr, I'm sorry you had to spend your Christmas break sick. 2012 will have to be a better year for you! Have you gotten a positive opk yet? When I'm sick my cycle seems to take a pause so I end up with a longer cycle on those months. My opks were usually almost positive and I often times doubted myself, but when it was positive there was no doubt because the line was clearly darker than control.

It's been a crazy week filled with reorganization of the house. First I had to find places for all of Kira's new toys. Then we redid her bedroom and I took all my personal stuff out of her closet. So her room is only filled with her stuff. Then we emptied out the spare bedroom which was being used for storage and an office. Now that room only has stuff in it for the new baby and none of our personal stuff. We had to clean out our bedroom and bedroom closet to make room for all the crap we took out of the spare room. Anyways, the house has been a wreck but its finally almost back together.

Here are pics of Kira's new bedroom. I'm still waiting on pink curtains and bed guards so she doesn't roll out. She loves it and has been taking naps in there, so once we have the curtains and bed guards DH is going to transition her in.


Spoiler
https://www.razortoe.com/share/biggirl/IMG_3311.jpg

https://www.razortoe.com/share/biggirl/IMG_3313.jpg

https://www.razortoe.com/share/biggirl/IMG_3315.jpg

https://www.razortoe.com/share/biggirl/IMG_3318.jpg

she thinks the hedgehog looks like me, so everytime she sees it she says "mommy" and laughs. "mommy" is also on her sheets, and on her curtain too :haha:

https://www.razortoe.com/share/biggirl/IMG_3322.jpg


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## Shiv

Spidey - I am so sorry I haven't replied to your previous post, it didn;t show up on my phone.

Firstly you are not mental but I do think you need to talk to someone face to face about the feelings you have around Kira's first hours/days in the world. It is completely undrestandable you feel the way you do, but I know from experience that things you don;t work through regarding the birth will come back to haunt you during your next labour, and you don't want to freak out and refuse to push like me :haha:

I too am not religious, but it is obvious that Kira was meant to turn out perfect and the world did whatever it took to keep her that way, that meant your DH pushed the point about her being blue. You had just given birth so please don't feelbad about not being quite as uber aware as him, labour is exhausting and all we want afterwards is to hold our bubbas not have them whisked them away. 

And you are not a bad parent, you are a great parent because your instincts to keep Kira with you and not send her for surgery are what has kept her perfect. 

As for the whole teeth thing, I would have made the same choice as you to use the flouride treatment rather than putting her under anasthetic for crowns. I can't believe that they keep LO awake and strapped down to remove teeth there. I don;t know what they do here but that is totally barbaric and like you there is no way I would be allowing that. SO they put them under for crowns but keep them awake for removal - seems crazy! I hope your appt with the dentist goes better today and he has some positive news for you - let us know

jelr - any positive opk yet? When is AF due, when will you test etc. I know you aer back at work today so I hope it didn't suck too much and you are feeling much better after being sick over christmas

I loved looking at all the Christmas photos from both of you on fb, seems quite a long time agonow.

Anyway I have to go now as Sophia is being a madam, OMG the tantruns have been monumental recently, will come back later hopefully with an update about us :hugs:


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## jelr

Spidey: you are not overprotective, you are just a good mommy. I think it just in us now to not want them to feel any pain.

OMG, that is barbaric about strapping them to a board, that is mental that it is allowed anywhere. I would totally agree with you on that one about refusing it, there surely has to be an more humane alternative.

I love Kira's room. I really love the white furniture. When do you think you will have everything to transision her?

Shiv: Lovely to see you, sorry to hear Sophia is being a madam - we are not getting as many tantrums now, but by God she has become so cheeky and is starting to tell little fibs, the money. This evening when I came home from work to collect her, my mam had given her a present to open from my aunt and I was looking at the instructions and she decided she wanted them and was saying "they're mine", to which I retorted "no the present is for you and this part is for grown ups" and I wouldn't give it back and next thing she said. "I talk to Eilish and she said its mine" and she didn't talk to my aunt at all. I found it very hard not to laugh, but instead I was very stern and told her "no you didn't talk to Eilish and that is a lie and we don't tell lies as it is very bold" - She has come out with stuff before that is not the truth, but it has only been imagination stuff, so I have let it go. It is very hard to know when to what non-truths to pull them up on :dohh:

Anyway not much from me, I'm on CD19 today and no positive OPK yet, which I didn't mind up until now as I know they sometimes don't work with PCOS, but my temp didn't go up above the coverline this morning either so I don't think I OV'd on CD18 like I thought I would so it is looking like a longer cycle again this month which is a real pain in the ass as I have no idea when I might OV is the OPK's don't work, but on the other side you probably both saw my post in the fb group about my friend misscarrying and it really felt wrong that we would be conceiving just as she is losing her baby and I don't know how I would have told her if I was pregnant.

Although in saying that I am still gutted this morning, I know we are only ttc for 3 cycles now, but I really did think it would happened quickly seeing as I got pregnant by accident the last time and I know this is going to sound so stupid but I had it in my head that this was going to be it, that I finally knew more about my cycles and I suppose I went overboard on the positive thinking and had convicned myself that it would be perfect to conceive straight away in the new year, seeing as how I have been saying this year would be so different than last year and also it would have been nicer as we got to dtd properly loads this time because of being off work and not being as tired or rushing around as it does tend to me more about dtd for conception sometimes and not because we are in the mood if you know what I mean, where as all this week has been because we were both in the mood and we had dtd on CD12, CD14, CD15, CD17 and CD18 so I thought sure there was no escaping it (except me being sick, but I deep down I was convinced it wouldn't matter) - It kind of feels like it will never happen and I know it is still early days, but all the waiting around does my head in and it is all I seem to think about these days :dohh:

Other than that, work was okay. I wasn't in the office until nearly 12 as I had to pack up my home office this morning and I took the time to get Natasha ready and dressed for my mam as I had put in an hour yesterday and the day before, getting it packed up also. It was hard being in the office though as nobody seemed like they wanted to be there, which is understandable after the break, but the mood in the office didn't help mine ifkwim - so it wasn't horrible, but it wasn't the best of days between thinking of my friend and feeling fed up because of no OV, but then it wasn't the worst, just very long so I shouldn't complain.

I meant to also tell you, I have decided to leave potty training until the summer. I did think I would have 5 days next week as I thought I was in Mon to Wed next week and not back until the following Tues, but I'm in what I think will be my usual days for the moment and that is Tues to Thurs, so I won't have more than 4 days to work on it until the Easter Break and because it will be my only week off until the summer, I don't want the two of us cooped in as the weather will be getting better and it would be nice to go to the park and just do some fun stuff that week. So the summer it is unless she decides to start herself. I feel like such a lazy mother though and really had intended to do it this week until my start back date changed. 

Spidey: How did you manage around work? Did you have time off or did you let your mom take over from you in that first week?

I do think I'm going to transition her from the cot to her cotbed in the next while though, so I don't feel lazy altogether, although DH is saying to leave her when she is happy in the cot, so I will have to convince him :dohh:

Well I best get to bed as I'm up earlier from now on as I have to be in the office for 9 and it is a 30 minute drive. I was a bit teary tonight about it as I usually always got Natasha dressed and left here at 9 as my work has been so flexible up until now, but it won't be now that I'm office based and she will probably be still asleep or just waking when I'm leaving. It hit me, when I was saying goodnight as I always say "see you in the morning" and it dawned on me that I probably wouldn't. It feels such a long time not to have spoken or cuddled or kissed her from when she goes to bed at 8 until the next evening :cry: - I guess I should count myself lucky that I have managed to do it so far and I will just take some adjusting too.

Night girls. xx


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## spidey

Shiv, I read that the papoose board is illegal in the UK. You're right, I need to talk to someone about my first birth because I know it will cause problems with this one. Giving birth is such a mental thing and little hangups can really slow things down and stand in they way of a good delivery. It's a bit scary the second time around because I know what to expect... but I'm thinking this baby will just drop out randomly so it'll probably be a lot easier :haha:

jelr, I'm sorry your first day back sucked. I bet you'll ovulate soon... you have to expect ovulation to happen later this month since you were so sick around Christmas. I honestly thought I would get pregnant TTC my first cycle too. That would make the baby about 8 months old now :shock: Honestly, I'm glad things worked out the way they did. I do feel your pain on having TTC on your mind all of the time. Every month was stressful trying to decide when I ovulated, and every month was a let down when I wasn't pregnant.

I think leaving potty training until the summer is a good idea. The only reason I attempted it when I did is because DH was away, my parents were away, and Kira and I were going to be house bound for 4-5 days. My mom continued potty training once I went back to work. Kira was holding her pee at that stage and was only going 2-3 times a day, so some days my mom never got a pee :lol: I usually work Tues, Thurs and Fri, but that week I couldn't work Thursday and Friday since no one was here to watch Kira, so I started training on a Thursday, so she had 5 long days home with me until she needed to leave the house to go to my mom's.

Today we met another dentist. This one was soooooo nice! She said those teeth came in with no enamel and that's why they decayed, but the rest of Kira's teeth are formed well and look good. I wonder what happened to all the plaque, tarter and gum disease that the other dentist saw.. grrrr! Since Kira is "strong willed", a sedative wouldn't work since strong willed children can fight the effects, so the only way she'll fix those teeth is under GA. But she wouldn't do it until Kira's 4 other molars come in. IF those 4 molars came in with no enamel, then the dentist could go in all at one time and fix everything as its not worth the risk to have 2 separate "surgeries". She gave Kira prizes and stickers.. and Kira left with only good memories. It was so sweet how nice everyone was to her. This dentist said juice is okay, as long as its not slowly sipped from a bottle or cup all day. Sweets are okay, just not sticky sweets like taffy. Raisins and dried fruit aren't the greatest for teeth, so brushing after eating them is a good idea. I go back on Monday for an appointment to discuss a treatment plan. The dentist doesn't like talking in detail in front of the kids since they hear everything- which is true for Kira- she's like a sponge. We still don't want to do GA, but at least we have time before we have to make a final decision. I bet those molars will take 6-12 months before they're in.


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## Shiv

No time for a big reply but 

hugs for you jean, ttc is hard but keep having sex and you will catch that egg

spidey - SO glad the new dentist was great! i would find it hard to trust any health care in the Us as it is all about money but sounds like you have a good dentist there and also that the decay was NOT anything you could have pevented :thumbup:


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## jelr

Spidey: Yeah I'm thinking I will definitely leave it until the summer as I do think I would need 5 days plus and I will only have 4, I suppose the big thing with me is I would like to leave her with no bottoms for a week and 3 of my brothers who are aged 20 to 25 are living at home with my mam and it wouldn't feel right having her going around with no bottoms all day over there. I'm probably being silly, and they are often around when she is getting her nappy changed, but I dunno It just wouldn't feel right for her when she was older to know that she was starkers from the waist down for days in front of them. I know I wouldn't like to think of myself strolling around as a toddler with no bottoms on in front of my uncles :blush:

I'm so so happy that you got on so well at the other dentist and that she was so nice and I hope you will feel better now, knowing she was born like this, so there was no possible way it could have been anything you did or didn't do :thumup:

I think some dentists are ott anyway. I know I went to one years ago and he told me I had a touch of gum disease and more or less said my teeth would fall out if I didn't gargel with special mouthwash, brush after every meal and use interfloss several times a day also. Well I don't gargle with the special mouthwash. I do brush twice a day but not after meals and I only think if using the interfloss once in a blue moon and I am 32 years of age and only have 1 filling and have never had to have teeth out. I probably just jinxed myself now :haha:

Thank you both for the sympathy on ttc. Dr. Google is not my friend tonight though as I have been looking up stuff about irregular cycles and ttc and a lot of siteis reckon that if you OV later than CD21, the egg will be too old and probably of no use, so 2 of out the 3 cycles we have been ttc have been longer than CD21 unless I OV tomorrow and I doubt that will happen as I have no positive OPK and no symptoms of OV yet. I'm thinking I might ask my doc about referring me back to the gyne I was under for my pcos when ttc Natasha and for the MC. I know I'm probably jumping the gun, but it could take months for an appointment so I don't want to wait another 6 months and then have to wait another 6 months or even a year to be seen as I do feel time is not with us to wait that long as Natasha could 3 and a half or 4 before I'm even seen at that stage and I really didn't want that much of a gap and DH is older than me also, so I really don't want it to be years.

I don't know as I haven't actually discussed it with DH yet as I only found the info just now and he has already gone to bed, so I will have a chat with him tomorrow and see what he thinks.

Well I hope you both have a great weekend. Xx


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## spidey

I do worry that the dentists here go overboard because it's all money to them. It seems a bit crazy that all these dentists recommend crowns on her 4 front baby teeth that she'll lose at age 6/7 anyway. I can almost understand putting crowns on the 2nd year molars since they last until age 13... but still. I can't imagine how much general anesthesia and 4 baby crowns will cost. We do have dental insurance, but it only covers part of the bill, and only up to 1,000 per year. I bet all that work would be several thousand and with 2 appointments, and 1 more on Monday, we've already reached $200 atleast. I definitely feel better after hearing it's a developmental issue and not my awful parenting. The dentist also said antihistamines and allergy medication are notorious for causing tooth decay since they dry out the mouth. It seemed like Kira was always on allergy meds between 12 and 24 months since she had all those food and medicine allergies. At the meeting on Monday I need to get a clear answer from the dentist on whether or not she'll pull those teeth herself. When I asked, she said she would probably refer us to an oral surgeon. So she'll put a kid under GA, but won't pull a baby tooth? Seems crazy. I have a feeling she didn't want to discuss pulling them since her goal is to save them, but to me they're baby teeth and not worth the risk of GA. Ahhhh!!!! Makes me crazy thinking about it!

jelr, I honestly don't think late ovulation causes worn out eggs. Once the signals are sent to start the process of ovulation, then it's on a set schedule. I think late ovulation is caused by an early delay in those signals being sent... so everything just sits dormant for awhile. But once the signal is sent it leads to a cascade of hormones and ovulation will happen in X number of days. I'm not an expert though, but this is what I remember from school. I know my cycle started on September 10th, and I conceived October 9th, so I ovulated around cd30. But that being said, it certainly won't hurt to get an appointment with a doctor who could help things along especially if you have to wait months for an appointment. Don't give up hope.. you're on cycle 3 and haven't ovulated yet, so you're still in the game this month. I kept an anal record of my ovulation dates and cycle lengths, and I saw a trend that showed that late ovulation led to a longer luteal phase. It's as if the hormones had more time to build up or something. I think that's why I got pregnant on a cd30 ovulation cycle... if I would have ovulated on cd14 the egg wouldn't have had the time to implant before AF started. It's frustrating I know. Keep BDing because ovulation will happen soon... my guess is 7 days after you expect OV because you were sick. Whenever I'm sick at the start of my cycle, it seems like I get an extra 7-10 day delay.


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## jelr

Spidey: It definitely sounds like it is a money game, my God $200, Ireland is usually so expensive, but 2 appointments would not amount to that amount. It does seem a little crazy to spend an unmerciful amount of money when they are going to fall out anyway. Did they say how long they expect the flouride to last for?

I didn't realise that you got pregnant on a long cycle this time, that gives me great hope, because I really was convinced from what I was reading that we were totally out this month because of ov being so late, so thankfully now I know we are not.

I think I will still go and see my gp and see what she thinks about the long cycles. I suppose I'm really paranoid that if my pcos is really playing up again. I'm at more risk of a mc too and that is what really scares me. The only thing is I will probably have to tell the gp that we have been trying for longer as the consultant doesn't usually see you unless you have been trying a year and they don't take into account the waiting times, so If I am truthful, we will probably have to go back to the gp in 9 months for referral and then that could take another 1 and then possibly a few months of treatment if necessary, so the worst case senario could be that along with the pregnancy it could be 3 years before we actually have another baby, so I'm going to say we are ttc since the last mc and at least if we are waiting a year for the appointment we will be ttc over a year at that stage. 

I'm staying postive though and hoping I will never need the appointment and it will happen by itself, but at least this is our safe guard if it doesn't and i'm hoping that by even having that plan in place might relax me enough for it to happen, if that makes sense. 

I was due to start clomid before my first mc and then again before we conceived Natasha and both times I was waiting on my period to start, so as I could start the treatment, but AF never came, so I think it was that I relaxed and didn't think about it as much as I was convinced it would happen the month after with the Clomid, so hopefully just by getting the wheels in motion this time might relax me as at the moment it just feels like it will never happen and I know I shouldn't feel like that as it is early days, but It just does for some reason. So I need to get back to those positive thoughts and hopefully by chatting to my gp and getting a referral will do that.

Didn't do much over the weekend, DH took down the decorations yesterday and I had a nap when Natasha was down as my arthritis is really playing up and I'm just exhausted, probably the after affects from being sick over Christmas too. Myself and Natasha then had a bath and that was about all we did bar play yesterday. Today we went over to see my friend that had the MC she looks so shattered the poor love. It is so strange to see her going through she is getting angry for the exact same things I did and is looking for the exact same answers that I did. The worst of it is though, I know that nothing I can say will help and only time will do that and even then it will always hurt, just not as much. I do know though how much I appreciated all the help and support my family, friends and you girls gave me, so I hope that I have helped her in some ways just by her knowing I'm here.

Hope you girls are all well and had a nice weekend. Xx


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## Shiv

Right so I am not sure if I have even given a proper update since Christmas so here goes get a cuppa and choccy bar and settle down for a novel :haha:

Christmas went much better than expected, I was concerned about SOphia's behaviour at my parents house and also about the fact that all 4 of us would be sharing a room whilst there. Anyway other than one meltdown Sophia behaved really well and played very nicely with her 2 cousins (boys aged 5 and 3). She also slept really well, she was still waking up several times a night for some reason but becasue we were on an airbed on teh floor (whilst she got the proper bed :haha:) and snuck in after she was asleep (obviously as otherwise we'd have gone to bed at 7pm!) we could tell there was nothing wrong and she mainly just talked a bit of jibberish and then went back to sleep. She didn't notice we were there until the morning. It wa sweet, she woke up and I heard her sit up (it was pretty dark in the room) and I heard "who's there"........." I can see you"..........."it's mummy and daddy". We thought we would be doomed the second night and that when she woke up in the night she would know we were there and not goback to sleep, but she didn;t realise and we had the same wake up call in the morning.

She got loads of good presents her favourite is her toy shop stuff and a treehouse toy a bit like a dollshouse but a treehouse.

I didn't get anything particularly special, but then there was nothing I wanted to be honest. What were your best gifts for yourselves and your LO's?

New Years Eve we stayed in and had a couple of my university friends cmoe to stay (they have come to stay each NYE since Sophia was born so it is becoming a tradition). i had a bit of a cold so wasn't drinking much. We had a bit of an extravagant night, we only drank champagne (got through 6 bottles) and ate posh party food from waitrose. We played games and had fun. I snuck off to bed at about 1.30am and the rest followed at about 3pm

Since then we haven't really been up to much, Sophia has ruin most plans I have made by being such a madam. Seriously she has been testing my very last nerve. There is a meltdown about EVERYTHING which socks she wears, brushing her teeth, whether she has finished breakfast or not, and that is all in teh first hour of the day..............very draining. It got to the point last week where i was asking her over breakfast what she wanted to do that day. She would say go to the park (etc) and I would say ok lets go and get ready. She would fight my every move to try and get her dressed and out of the house to the point i was saying "do you want to go to the park?, IF you do then you need to get dresses/brush your teeth/put your shoes on" etc etc and if you don't do it then we can't go. Still not co-operating so I say"right you have one chance if you don't do what I say now then we are not going to the park. So she still doesn;t do it so i HAVE to refuse to go to the park! I didn't leave the house last week:dohh: I am hoping that a bit of tough love will teach her to cooperate! I used to pick my battles but now it feels like I can't let her get away with anything as it sends the wrong the message about who is boss.

I have been seriously at the end of my tether. 

She has also had a set back with potty training. She has been weeing in her clothes again, she says "I need the toilet" and the before we can even respind she stands there and wees. She has the bladder control but is choosing not to use it. She hadn't used the potty in ages and was going on the toilet but we were asking if she wanted to go and not really letting her tell us. So today we went back to making sure the potty was in eyes view and remiding her it was there and to use it if she needed to. And voila no accidents today........2 steps forward one step back!

She has tonight also realsied she can get out of her bed. She has never got out of bed at night before, but she is putting up a fight tonight and I can hear David having to wrestle with her. She is really testing us!

aargh she just woke up Cora! 


Spidey - when do you go back to the dentist to talk about treatment? 
Did you get to have an ultrasound at your recent midwife appt?

Jean - long cycles shouldn't affecct the viability of an egg, I agree with what spidey says in terms of freshness etc. So you are definitely still in with a shot this month. I hope you can relax and catch that egg!


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## Shiv

Oh and I just realised I barely mentioned Cora in my above update which pretty much sums up the little mites life. It makes me sad to say that she gets so little attention if it wasn't for breastfeeding then I wonder if I would even have time to cuddle her. She is such a lovely baby smiley and giggley and barely ever cries.........I have thoughts in my head about those babies in Romanian orphanages that don't cry anymore because nobody comes anyway.........but Cora has never been a very cryey baby (I hope!)

She is still a giant 14.5lbs and just on the top centile for height (that I measured myself). She is grabbing out for things now and oohing and ahhing she really is lovely and the time I do get to cuddle her I treasure as it is just so lovely to hold a baby and feel their warmth and nuzzle her neck and have her smile at me............such a shame that give her a couple of years and she'll be wearing me down like her big sister :haha:

Oh and i hope you are doing something lovely for your birthday Spidey x


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## spidey

Shiv, I'm sorry Sophia is being rebellious! Kira is getting there although definitely not at the same point as Sophia (yet!). There have been times that I get her dressed in one set of pj's and she changes her mind and wants to wear another set, and I comply and change her clothes... so yeah, I'm a pushover mom :haha: And life has become nothing but deal making now. For instance, at the dentists office she was turning a crank on a ball machine, but it was time to go back and see the dentist. She started to throw a fit when DH picked her up to take her away, so we said "you can turn the crank 2 more times and then we have to go". She turned it 2 more times and then was happy to be carried away. All day is spent making these little deals and compromises and it seems to work, although I probably just jinxed myself :lol: I have a few rules that she must follow no matter what- teeth brushing, flossing, and wearing a coat. She also wants my attention ALL the time. I hear "mommy" about 1,000 times a day. If I had another LO to look after it wouldn't be pretty- Kira would certainly act up more. Do you think Sophia is teething too. Kira has a 2nd molar coming through and has been much moodier these last few days.

I do cherish all the snuggles she still gives me. We lay down in her bed to take naps and she likes to fall asleep with our noses touching. It's so sweet. She plays with her ear and that lulls her to sleep- she's been doing that since she was a little baby. But now she'll reach over and play with my ear and drift off. Then after we wake up from the nap we lay in bed 20 more minutes and just stare at eachother. I'm really going to miss this when I have another baby to look after.

Shiv- As for potty training set backs- Kira has had quite a few and I think it's to be expected although I don't think people tend to talk about it. With the most recent set back I put a treat bag right near the potty which sits in the livingroom, so all day she was reminded of the candy that she could get if she peed in the right spot. It seemed to work and now I've hidden the treats and she only gets one if she asks for it after a pee, which is almost never.

jelr, thats so funny how you became pregnant right before a clomid cycle, 2 times! Thats just like me- I was told by the midwife not to expect to get pregnant anytime soon and they would refer me to a specialist after I fully weaned Kira, and tadaa- I became pregnant that cycle. Have you had any temp spikes yet?


We had the consultation appointment with Kira's new dentist and it went well. She's going back every 2-3 months for fluoride and the dentist will keep a close eye on all her teeth. Once the 2 year molars come in then we have to make the decision to have her teeth fixed because the dentist won't do GA twice, and she wants to wait until all the 2nd year molars come in.

My birthday was great. I'm 31 now! In an attempt to not get too fat, I made a carrot cake (which is far from being healthy) :rofl: and proceeded to eat nearly half of it. I think I'm going to watch my calories more closely near the end of the pregnancy and not right now. I went on a baking binge during the 10 days prior to Kira's arrival and I believe that played a big part in her size. I was finally off work and my goal was to convert my old favorite recipes to gluten free ones, so I made a new recipes every day and then ate nearly the entire thing myself. Fudge, peanut butter chocolate bars, pineapple upside down cake... I even have pictures documenting my baking experiments :haha:

I didn't get a sonogram at my 14/15 week appointment and I won't until 20 weeks.

It's getting late so I need to stop blabbing :lol:


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## Shiv

Spidey - so glad you had a nice birthday and enjoyed your cake! I honestly believe that your baby will be the size it will be and there is very little you can do about it. I ate so much rubbish with Sophia and she was tiny. I would worry less about what you eat and just go for a walk if you feel you have over-indulged.

I am glad you have a plan in place with the dentist now, she sounds sensible with regards to not wanting to put LO's under GA twice.

We do a lot of deal making here too, unfortunately SOphia has started to relent on her part of the deal. SO if we had been in the same situation with the lever thingy as Kira, I would have done the exact same thing as you, "ok you can have two more goes and then we have to go, ok" to which Sophia would have said ok had hertwo go's and then screamed bloody murder when we had to leave :haha: With the pyjamas I used to change them too, I thought no point making a big deal out of it. However now I would say ok which ones do you wnat then, she would pick them put them on the scream because she wanted the old ones back, and we could keep changing between the two pairs repeatedly and she she would still scream. So I kind of figured we needed to just say no from the start and ride out the screaming. Not fun. 

We did manage to get out of the house today to feed the ducks. SO Last night when she wouldn't go to bed I asked her what she wanted to do tomorrow and she said feed the ducks so I said ok, if you go to sleep now then we can go to see the ducks, but if you stay awake we will be too tired to go. And she slept thank goodness!

SO we only had 3 big meltdowns today (plus numerous mini ones that I don't count!)

And yes she is teething so has one full 2nd molar through and a half of another. I am not sure i can blame it on that though and even if I can I can't let her get away with this behaviour for the next 6 months while the others come through!

SO mil is annoying me again, we haven't heard hide nor hair of her since 23rd Dec when she came to see us. Today David messaged me to say that she was going to phone the house at 6pm to speak to Sophia. SO I made sure Sophia was all cleaned up and knew she was going to call. 45 minutes later I get a text saying that MiL has a migraine and had been asleep and would call tomorrow at 6pm. Ok fine, migraines suck so I understood. Then I just go on to facebook and she has posted loads of stuff including this (which I think is a bit wierd and over the top)

A grandchild is a special person in your life through a special person you gave life.
A grandchild holds a special place in your heart, meant only for them to take part.
A grandchild reminds you how to laugh and play just as you did before your children grew up and moved away.
A grandchild is given to you as a gift from above, and this is just one way to show them they're loved!.

Anyway apart from being wierd, I was angry because if she had a migraine there is no way she would have been able to sit up never mind look at a computer.............grrrrrrrrrr. So Sophia was disapointed!

I realised today that I don't have a single thing in my diary...........ever........that is pretty sad no events booked in at all. It sucks living so far away from family who can babysit for us.

Other than all that moaning this week is going better than last :happydance:

Jean - any news on ovulation etc


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## spidey

Shiv, I feel better now knowing that you're the same amount of a pushover mom as me :haha: The only difference is Kira hasn't rebelled to the point of Sophia yet. If Kira was to turn the crank 2 more times and then want more, I would have drug her away kicking and screaming too. Like you- I don't mind making compromises but I stop there. Luckily Kira hasn't tested me too much so we can still go out in public :rofl: But she does save all her grumpiness for me. With DH, MIL and my mom she is such a sweet girl, but I get all the whines and cries. I guess that comes with being mom.

I'm so nervous! Tomorrow me and Kira have the first day of art class that I signed up for months ago when I wanted mommy friends, lol! I've been telling Kira about all the fun things we will do, and then I ask "do you want to go to art class" and she says "NO!". I'm pretty certain she will say "all done home all done home all done home all done home" from the moment we step in the door. I hope she likes it and behaves. I've taught her some bad habits when it comes to art so she might kick up a fuss if there are rules. Her favorite part of painting is squeezing the tubes of paint until they "fart" and I doubt they'll let us waste all of their paint :haha:

Oh Shiv, your MIL sounds a bit nutty. The thing she posted about grandchildren is weird. I have a tendency to be paranoid and read into things, but perhaps she just copied and pasted some junk onto FB and it doesn't have a deeper meaning behind it. If her migraine was bad enough that she couldn't talk to Sophia for a few minutes, then she certainly shouldn't be on the computer. Does she often use sickness as a way to get attention? My MIL is like that. She'll call DH on the phone and make her voice sound like she's in her death bed, but minutes later she'll be talking normal. I can't stand it!

My coworkers still have no idea I'm pregnant :haha: Only one knows and he's finding it funny that no one has said anything yet. I honestly don't think people have noticed... they probably just think I'm getting fat. This is what I wore to work today...

https://www.razortoe.com/share/bump15.jpg


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## Shiv

How did the art class go SPidey?

I CANNOT believe that your colleagues haven't guessed you are pregnant. It would be different if you were not a skinny minny and there was a chance you had just porked out a bit but you are usually so slim it is obvious that is baby bump. You look GREAT!

SO guess who didn't call again tonight :growlmad: not even an explanation this time. She put on facebook the other day how it makes her mad that all her family don't take the other members in to consideration and I was wondering if it was a dig at us because we haven't been in touch since Christmas. Well whether it is or not you don't tell a little girl that you are gonna call and then don't. That is 2 nights in a row that Sophia has gone to bed asking why Grandma didn't call. In answer to your question about whether she uses illness often as an excuse........this is the first time she has arranged to call up especially to speak to Sophia so I guess that is a 100% fail rate. I am mad!

I had my worst day ever with Sophia, we had tantrums about everything and she was really mean to Cora (usually she just leaves her alone) but she was stealing her toys and she even pulled her hair........I swear I had to leave the room on several occasions to compose myself as I was a mixture of bloody angry and bloody upset. We were going to go out and ride her bike, but she wanted to do it in her pyjamas and refused to get dressed (which obviously I am not going to allow). By the time she had clothes on that weren't her pj's it was nearly 1pm and late for lunch so I had to explain to her that the reason we weren't going out on her bike was because she didn't get dressed when I asked her to. She wouldn't go down for her nap so I said right if you behave nicely while we pop to the shop then we can ride your bike when we get back. She point blank refused to put any shoes on so again we didn't even go to the shop never mind ride her bike. 

What would you ladies have done in the above situations? I don't want to pin her down to get her dressed etc as she is big enough now to know what I asking her to do, and she is really rather strong and I am afrain I will hurt her as she squirms around getting free. I dunno, it is really getting me down. It is a good job I have Cora as I can pick her up and instantly feel calm.

And don't even get me started on brushing her teeth and putting her hair up :dohh:

Jean - hope everything is ok, haven;t heard from you in a few days :hugs:


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## spidey

Shiv, thats so mean your MIL isn't making an attempt to talk to Sophia. She shouldn't lie to Sophia, its so unfair and selfish. And not speaking since Christmas is really NOT that long. You have 2 babies to look after so in my opinion, attempts for contact should be made by the grandparent. 

I'm so sorry Sophia had such a bad day, plus no nap to top it off. I guess if it were me and Kira (mind you, Kira seems much less headstrong that Sophia!) I would have said "do you want to wear boots or sparkle shoes". If that tactic doesn't work and we're heading to the grocery store, then I'll say "OH! you know what we need to buy!?? (pause for drama) CHIPS!" and then she'll happily sit down to have her shoes on. She loves chips/crisps and she knows I will let her pick out any bag she wants. If we're going shopping at a non-food store, I'll say "what are you bringing to the store with you?" For some reason that makes her happy so she'll run away and come back with some strange object and then she'll sit to get her shoes on. I'm sure you've tried all this with Sophia, but I want to give you an idea of how easy it is to change Kira's mind. I will not let Kira leave the house with pj's on either. For whatever reason, if I say "NEW CLOTHES!" Kira gets very excited and lets me change her out of pj's. If I say "we need to change you into real clothes" she doesn't comply. Sometimes I'll have to say "NEW CLOTHES! ooooo! I wonder if you're going to wear a butterfly shirt, or maybe a zebra shirt..." The only time I actually wrestle her down is for teeth brushing, but I've only done that a few times in the past year. If she acts up during teeth brushing (like keeping her mouth shut) I can usually get her to open up by making a really goofy face and then she'll forget about her stubbornness for a second. If I said to Kira "you have to eat pea soup for dinner since you didn't let mommy go shopping earlier" I don't think she would understand a consequence like that. Kira's newish thing is peeing outside so when she wants to pee outside I have to be quick to think of a reason why the toilet in the house is better. Yesterday she found a spot in the grass where she wanted to pee, and I said "oh, but it will be so much fun peeing on the BIIIIIG potty!" rather than "we don't pee outside" And it worked, lol! So when I'm a bit goofy, she'll listen to me more :rofl: When I'm tired and don't have the energy to make everything sound exciting, Kira's more likely to have a grump day. Could you sign Sophia up for some sort of nursery school for 2-3 mornings a week. It might be all you (and Sophia) need so you're more recharged to deal with her antics. The break I get from working 3 mornings a week really helps me re-focus and deal with things easier and it gives Kira a MUCH needed break from me. Plus I have my MIL who visits in the evening about 3 days a week. My MIL and mom are filled with energy when they see her and Kira has so much fun with them. When she's with me, I have to do the laundry, clean, cook, and shop so I'm not nearly as fun. Does Sophia behave better with your DH? I'm so sorry I can't be of much help... I haven't reached the peak of the terrible twos yet so I don't have much advice :hugs: 

Art class went well. There were 6 kids and their moms (and 1 dad) and we spent the first 50 minutes sitting at tables doing 4 different crafts. Then during the last 10 minutes the kids got to play with the toys in the other half of the room. Kira covered her eyes with her hands for the first few minutes but after awhile she warmed up, although she never ventured far from me. Since she was so against going to art class, I reworded it and said "mommy is going to mommy's art class....... and if you want, you can help mommy". It totally worked :haha: It's so easy to change her mind- I'm going to dread the day she becomes more stubborn! She also walked out of the classroom and out to the car while holding my hand!! She saw the other kids doing it, and I guess she wanted to fit in. Normally she makes me carry her, or she refuses to hold my hand. It was so sweet.


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## Shiv

Glad art class went well Spidey. you are great at spinning things round to get Kira to play ball!

All the things you said you would do in my circumstance were things I used to do. I think I have got so fed up with her behaviour that I have become incredibly stubborn (I wonder where SOphia gets it from :haha:) and have started to try to force the issue rather than being nicey nicey. SO I decided today that I would go back to the nicey nicey approach and on the most part it worked. I didn't back down on any major issues but I tried to not let things get to the point where it was a stand off situation. SO when Sophia didn't want to brush her teeth I aksed her to choose which toothbrush she wanted to use (we have 2 granted one of them is her old one and very very tatty but she wouldn't let us throw it away :dohh:). SO I put some toothpaste on it and let her brush (she is actually getting much better) and then got the other brush in there too. Probably not the most thorough brushing but good enough I think every tooth got touched! We were teeth brushed, dressed and hair done by 10am. 
I laid out the plans for the day then, that we needed to wait for the tesco delivery and then we would go out on her tirke (wearing her wellies because it had rained and there might be puddles to be jumped in), then we needed to go to teh shop in the afternoon to get her some more yoghurts (which I would let her choose). We didn't have a tantrum free day (in fact David did have to physically pin her down to brush her teeth tonight and she is mighty hard to pin down these days) but it was a great improvement. We got out on her trike. We didn't make it to the shop as Cora slept too long but that means we can go tomorrow morning!

So spidey I want to thank you for reminding me that nicey nicey tactics are not weak, but essential to get anything done :thumbup:

It does still frustrate me that she won;t simply do what I say, especially when it is something that will benefit her e.g she aks for a snack as we need to get ready to go out. I say sure, get your shoes on and you can have a chocolate coin in the car.............but she won't put her shoes on :shrug: She is seriously just SO stubborn, she would rather spoil for a fight than get chocolate - strange girl!

This morning as she was getting up out of bed she was telling me about what happened in her bedtime tv program and bedtime story the previous night and also that she waited and waited and waited for Grandma to call :cry: All day long she kept talking about how she would tell grandma this and that. I felt so terrible. I should have known not to tell her that she was going to call. She texted David late last night to say sorry she was asleep again and was not feeling well. But she was on facebook an hour before she was due to call could she not have waited before going to bed? She has said she will ring on Saturday so now I have to get Sophia to stop talking about her constantly as I have nothing nice to say about her and have managed to be nothing but positive so far!

So I have decided that I need to organise something for my birthday (not until April but need SOMETHING in my dairy :haha:). The only way both David and I can go out is if we go back to Kent and leave the girls with my parents. This means that if I want to invite my friends who don't live in Kent then I have nowehere to offer for them to stay as I can't offer rooms at my parents house out! So i think I might book in to a travelodge (cheap hotel SPidey) and so can my friends from outside of Kent. It is only £40 a room and a room sleeps 3 so it is actually probably cheaper than taxi's would cost to get home from a night out etc. I might do a meal and the casino. David said oh but we ALWAYS do that. I had to point out that last time we did it was out leaving do from Kent last May and that come April that will be nearly a year ago! 

Oh and SPidey I would LOVE for Sophia to go to nursery a few mornings a week, but it costs £15 per 3 hour session so that is nearly £50 a week for 3 mornings and we simply can't afford £200 a month for something that really is a luxury. Sophia will get 15 hours free pre-school a week from September though so that is something to lookforward to. We looked around where she will go before Christmas as you have to register and she loved it :thumbup:


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## spidey

Shiv, I'm glad you had a better day today. It couldn't have gotten worse... I think :haha: Somedays I don't have it in me to be nicey nicey and those are always the hardest days. Either I'm tired, mad about something else or I just don't feel good. DH will innocently walk through the door and I say "why are you 5 minutes late!? I need some time alone!!" and run upstairs to hide for an hour while he cooks dinner and I think to myself- lets see how he likes making dinner with Kira crying and hanging off his legs :lol: It's really hard being a mommy sometimes :hugs: I'm VERY stubborn too and so is Kira. I guess thats why the only way I can get her to do things is by putting some sort of exciting spin on everything.  I have to present everything in a way so Kira thinks she's the one making the decisions. The dentist was funny and told me there's a certain type of little girl who is very head strong, and those girls are impossible to sedate because they will fight the effects and turn into an "angry drunk"... and Kira is one of those types. I bet Sophia is too.

I have to give Kira the choice of toothbrushes too :lol:

That is so sad Sophia was talking about waiting for grandma to call the next morning. Does David ever yell at his mother? It sounds like she needs it.

Thats really neat you get 15 free hours of nursery school when the kids are 3. Is it 3 hours a day? Here you can send the kids to public pre-school when they're 4 and its probably about 15 hours a week, 5 days a week. Spaces are limited, so first choice goes to kids with delays or who are very poor and then the others may or may not get in. I'm still not sure if I'll send Kira. Sending Kira to school is a scary thought. It'll be the same elementary school that DH went to and he turned out okay, but its certainly not the best in the area. We live in a poor area and we're "wealthier" than most in this neighborhood. Kira will be the only blonde haired one in the class- not like that matters, but she'll have to get used to kids with very different life experiences than her. 

We have travelodge here! That sounds like a fun birthday celebration! I think booking a motel is the best idea so you only have to stumble a few blocks from the casino to the motel and then you can have the morning to recover before you have to travel back home. If I were closer I would invite myself :haha:

jelr... I hope you are getting lots of :sex: in :haha:


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## jelr

Hey girls - sorry I have been MIA but I'm off the cigs again and not in the best of form :haha: - I will be fine in another week or so. I had forgotten how fed up you get in that first week and work has been hectic and we have had meetings all week, so I'm really tired on top of it and just generally feeling sorry for myself :haha: - I'll be grand though just haven't been motivated to do anything in the evenings - not fb, not here and I have barely spoke to poor DH :haha: - I have just stuck my head in the tv and the allen carr book. I just wish I didn't put on so much weight so quickly or that I was somebody that didn't care about my weight. It just feels like I'm getting fat, missing the cigs, ttc and trying to settle into the office all at once and it does seem a lot this week, but I do feel a bit better today thank god and so far have not had any cigs at all as I was really bad and managed to survive all day without them and then on Tuesday had 1 before bed and Wed had 3 in the evening and yesterday had 3 also.

So far today is going a lot better considering I'm at home all day which is where my problem is as I don't have time to think about it in work. I know you both told me, but I'm so stupid for staring again before Christmas.

I did read on and off here though even in my mod and am really sorry I didn't get on to reply.

Spidey: I'm glad the dentist is not for GA if possible and definitely not more than once, she sounds really nice.

I can't believe everyone hasn't guessed either, you look so so pregnant, especially since you are usually teeny tiny :thumup:

Shiv: I'm really sorry to hear that Sophia is playing up so much, I hope today went better like yesterday did.

I do think the nicey nicey work here also and I do think we avoid too many tantrums with mainly distraction. Natasha is still easily distracted before she has a meltdown. Although it does't always work either.

I do find though and DH even notices it when he comes home, if I am tired and stressed and don't have the energy for nicey nicey and I do get stubborn, the day ends in disaster. It is like a battle of the wills between myself and Natasha. God help us when she hits hormone age :haha:

She actually has DH's temperment and is extremely laid back, but when she blows watch out as she is as stubborn and as cranky and so is he :haha:

If Natasha is particularly misbehaving I do use time outs and they do seem to help and do exactly what they say on the tin and give both of us time out away from each other. I don't use them too often more for big things like hitting me or throwing stuff in temper. 

Although yesterday was very funny, DH had a class last night and it was only myself and Natasha here and we were playing and she struck out and hit me so I put her in the corner for a time out and she said "I'm ready to come out and I'm sorry" so I said "no you can stay there a little longer" as she was only there for about 30 seconds - so after another minute I let her out and she went over to the cooker and slapped it and then said "I go to timeout for slapping the cooker" and off she went to the corner and then went over to the cooker and said "sorry cooker" - I would have laughed my heart out except I didn't want to send the message that slapping or time outs were funny, but she really was hilarious :haha:

Well AFM - I got a nearly postitive OPK on Sunday night but it was really late and DH was in bed (I had completely forgotten about it that day) - I did try and waken him, but I didn't have a hope :haha: - It did however turn completely positive on Monday morning and according to my chart OV occured on Monday - so that is really great that OV happens for me so close after the postive OPK and not a few days later and my surge seems to last a good long time too as it was still positive Monday evening but had gone by Tuesday evening. So we dtd on Monday and had already done it on Friday and Saturday so they will also count for Monday, we really should have on Tuesday also as well, but I was so not in the mood on my first day off the cigs and was actually exhausted and really stupid all that day and just couldn't - so I'm hoping that Friday, Saturday and Monday was enough.

I'm having a horrible LP too with this cycle, it must be something to do with long cycles as the previous long one was the same. Majorly sore boobs and cramps in my pelvis all day long. OV was really hard as well as I was realy nauseated for a few days beforehand.

I'm sorry girls that was a really selfish and moany post. i'm just stuck up my own arse this week :haha: - I hope I will be back to normal next week and get in to do proper posts. 

Have a great weekend and :hugs: to all. Xx


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## spidey

woohoo jelr for positive opks!!!! That's wonderful they work for you. My surge was also long and after awhile I only tested once a day rather than morning and evening. Long cycles have always been bad for me too. Before Kira my cycles were very long and I had awful pms symptoms. After Kira my cycles mostly shortened and were much better. I think the hormones have more time to build up or something. I bet you'll have a 14 day LP this time too.

That's great you've started to quit smoking again! What made you pick this week to start? I hope its much easier for you this time. Didn't your mom quit smoking last time- how is she doing with it?

I actually have something written on my social calendar (much like you Shiv) :haha: The group of girls that I used to hang out with in middle and high school are getting together for tea in a month. I hope I don't sound too stupid, but its supposed to be like real English tea but with a bunch of trashy Americans trying to act fancy. :lol: Here is the place we're going https://www.reynoldstavern.org/ In the last 12 years I've only seen one of the girls... the one who adopted the little boy and they came to my house for a play date a few months ago. So this means I'll need to have my hair cut and buy a new outfit! I am so antisocial so this is a big deal for me :haha: I can't eat any of the baked treats but on the menu they have a salad so I can eat that and not look too weird.

Kira's been such a grump today and thank god DH is home to help out. She's had her finger in the back of her mouth all day so I think her molar is hurting. 

I hope you girls are having a fun weekend. It's a 3 day weekend here so no work for DH tomorrow :happydance:


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## jelr

Spidey: I bet you will have loads of fun meeting up with everyone once you get over the nerves. The place you are going looks lovely and quaint.

I'm sorry to hear Kira has been grumpy, it definitely sounds like it is her teeth. I hope you got a nice rest when DH was home at the weekend.

Anymore people noticing that you are pregnant yet? How are you feeling now? Is the MS gone completely?

Re: the smoking - I had always planned on quitting after Christmas but had decided to wait until I went back to work and then chickened out the first week and said I would wait until I had moved into the new office and the first week was over. I'm doing a lot better this week, although I'm still having one last thing at night and it just goes to show you, how much it is in the head. I'm thinking of them less and less each day and if I do I just think aw sure I'll have that one tonight and then it goes out of my head, whereas the last time I thought of them all day long and ate all around me, which I'm not doing this time either - although that could be because I'm concious that I have nearly a stone to lose after the last time and Christmas :haha:

I do know I have to knock that one on the head too, but can't seem to find the will power at all, in once sense I can't wait to be pregnant because there is no tempation because I just can't smoke and I don't think the stress will be there like before because I have knocked most of it on the head - I think :shrug: :dohh:

Not much news here, arthritis was playing up a lot over the weekend, so we had a really lazy weekend and watched a cartoon movie both days and all three of us curled up with a big blanket and some popcorn on the sofa (our corner suite pulls out into a bed, so it was lovely and snug).

Shiv: How are things going now??? - I really hope Sophia has settled down, it must be so hard to look after a newborn with such a cranky toddler. :hugs:


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## spidey

jelr, how is not smoking going? I can't wait to hear about any pregnancy tests you take this cycle.. it has to be soon, right?

It's too obvious I'm pregnant now so I'm purposely hiding my bump at work. I don't like being the center of attention and I know I'll have to "announce" it at some point and the longer I wait the more awkward it gets! I really want to get the blood results from my quad screen (end of next week) before I announce, and preferably I'd like to have my 20 week sonogram to know all is well. For whatever reason I'm convinced something is wrong and I don't want to jinx things by being happy and having people congratulate me. My m/s is much much better but I still have trouble brushing my teeth and I have to eat in bed before moving too much in the morning. But I'm eating normal foods now and enjoying them. I occasionally feel little movements too.

We had Kira's 2nd art class Wednesday and it went much better than I was expecting! I was worried that having the toys in the same room as the art class would be bad and she would refuse to stop playing to do art. She did put up a fuss when I tried to carry her over when it was time to start, but then I appealed to Kira's kleptomania side and said "what toy would you like to take to the art table with you?" and she happily picked out a toy frying pan and sat down with the rest of the kids. Whew, what a relief!

Kira has become such a Daddy's girl this past week. She calls out for daddy all day long while DH is at work, so I started calling DH to let Kira talk to him on the phone. Everytime she starts off the conversation by saying "boo boo" and DH promises to kiss her boo boo when he gets home (mommy doesn't heal boo boo's like daddy apparently :haha:). Then she says "race car, puppy" and DH promises to play the race car and puppy game when he gets home. Then she says "bye bye" and hands the phone back to me. It's so cute. And now when she sees his car pull into the driveway, she runs to the door screaming "daddy" and opens it for him. Today she pointed to my left boob and said "BIG" and pointed to my right boob and said "baby" and laughed.. really they're the same size, but it was so funny. She doesn't use the words small or little- she prefers to say baby  She's down to 1-2 super short breast feeds per day and I'm certain no milk comes out. She just latches on and wiggles around and tries to have a conversation with the nipple in her mouth. It lasts 20 seconds each time.

I got my hair cut too in preparation for my social event next month :haha: I went to a new salon near my house this time... this place: https://salondebeleza.net/ The owner Ramiro cut my hair and did a really great job. He definitely knew what he was doing. It was really funny because he was really quick with the flat iron and the curling iron, and both things would appear out of nowhere really close to my face. I jumped a few times thinking he was going to hot iron my ear! Then all of a sudden a giant metal curing iron flew by my face alongside my cheek and I said "OOOH!" haha.. he must have thought I was nuts!

So that's all the excitement with me... what a selfish post!

Shiv- how are things with Sophia now? I saw on FB that Sophia had another grump day. I really hope the terrible twos end early for her. I wonder if her advanced talking has made it worse for her. Kira is very limited in what she can say, but she does say "STOP!" now while pointing a finger at me. That one little word really drives me nuts, so I can't imagine if Kira was saying full smart ass phrases. I'm sure she thinks them in her head though, but I don't get the pleasure of knowing :haha: I'm so lucky my mom and MIL are so close and watch Kira whenever I need it. Me and Kira really benefit from time apart... I'm already thinking that Kira will continue to go to my mom's 2-3 mornings per week once the baby arrives while I'm on maternity leave for 12 weeks.


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## Shiv

Jean - how is the not smoking going? I really hope that it is getting easier for you. How are you feeling with regards to TTC now? Any symptoms? When is AF due?

Spidey - glad that your morning sickness is manageable now, must feel better to be able to eat normal food. DO you have a date for your 20 week scan? Are you keeping the sex a suprise?

So glad Kira cooperated at the art class, I bet she will love it soon enough, what art do you do there? Sophia has started to actually to try to draw things rather than just scribbling. Today she drew me! It was a big circle (ish) with 2 scribbles for eyes at the top, a scribble for a mouth at the bottom, a scribble for a nose in the middle and 2 scribbles for ears on either side of the nose, all in green! And I didn't intervene or help at all, I just kept asking questions like, and what else does mummy have? Obvioulsy it looked nothing like a face but it is only really this week that she has made it clear she trying to draw something specific.

Kira sounds so cute on the phone to her daddy, she sounds a lot like Sophia in respect to being a daddy's girl.

Is your new fb profile with your new haircut? You look great in it regardless! I love afternoon tea and we often used to take Sophia where we used to live. I hope you have a lovely sophisticated time, it sounds like you will. Have you bought your new outfit yet? Can we see it?

Sooooooooooooooo apart from a potential serious head injury and a chocking incident today has been an ok day :dohh: Sophia is a bit obsessed with getting Cora undressed (only when she is in sleepsuits, which if I am honest is most days - lazy me!). Anyway I left Cora on her changemat, which is on our coffee table in the lounge (approx 50cm high) while I grabbed a change of clothes for her from the kitchen (Sophia was playing in the playroom at this point). Anyway I hear a terrible cry, Cora never cries so I knew something was wrong. I ran in to see Cora on the floor at the end of the table, her head against the wall with Sophia leanign over her! I scooped her up and she stopped crying pretty quick. Sophia had been unpoppering her and i ca imagine what happened, the poppers were a bit hard to do and Cora will haev edged towards the edge as Sophia tried to pull them apart and off she went! I am SURE Sophia didn't pull her off on purpose, but that doesn't stop the fact that I can no longer leave Cora alone in a room where Sophia could be! Cora seems fine, not even a red mark on her head and she must have bumped it. Ikept an eye on her for signs of concussion but she seems fine.

Choking incident was Sophia. I was peelign carrots for dinner and Sophia asked for one. I said no, cue tantrum.........I gave in and said ok yu can have a small bit but nothing more until dinner and gave her a small round slice. She was still screaming and crying when she put it in her mouth to eat it, kind of inhaled and suddenly the screaming stopped. I bent down, put her across my knee and whacked her back so hard until the carrot flew out - very scary!

Other than that toady was ok. I took Sophia out in the pram and wore Cora in her sling and walked to town so that Sophia would nap (she did) and I was exhausted after the 2 mile or so round trip. Cora is no light weight!

Sophia is still being an absolute madam and really trying my patience many times a day. Hey ho, I know I am not the only one so should stop moaning about it :haha:

Anyway, gonna head to bed now as no real news, hope you both have great weekends and will look forward to hearing all about them :hugs:


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## spidey

Shiv, thats funny you mention Sophia doing more than scribbling. Kira just started doing the same thing. She draws a big circle and then puts 2 lines at the bottom for legs. Then she puts a few random dots and calls them eyes. She'll draw scribbles for hair if I remind her, and sometimes DH reminds her to draw boobies on mommy (which she draws at the bottom part of my face) :haha:. And she drew a pizza the other day- a big circle with lots of dots in it, and then she said "pizza pie!"

No date for my 20 week scan yet. I see the midwife again in 2 weeks and then I should be able to call up and make an appointment. We're keeping the gender a surprise again. DH and I are trying to think of names and I keep saying it would be 50% easier if we knew the sex, but he's not convinced :haha: We have a few girls names but we're having major problems thinking of boys names. So far I like Riley, Jameson and Westin, but DH hates them all and says he likes "Max". For girls we both like Hailey and Jade, but DH really loves the name Dahlia and I really like the name Hazel. Whatever the name, it has to go with DH's last name which is feminine. So a boy really needs a masculine name to balance it out. 

Poor Cora falling off the table and Sophia choking! I'm glad they're both okay. I hope you're getting a break this weekend and DH is entertaining Sophia. How does she behave with him? How is Cora sleeping at night? Does Sophia still escape her bed? I like to hear the little naughty things that Sophia does so keep them coming!

Yep, my new haircut is on my FB profile. I haven't bought a new outfit yet- I asked the other girls what they usually wear so that'll determine what I buy. It's 5 of us total and we've all known eachother since we were 11. One of the girls asked if she could invite her female friend along- a friend that didn't go to school with us and we haven't met. One of the other girls said it wasn't a good idea since the 5 of us will be talking about the past and this girl will feel left out. Then she said "well its too late I already invited her, and if you all don't want her to come then I won't be coming too!" She's not even hosting the event... I think its really rude and I said so (in the nicest way possible). But I've been in a quick to anger mood recently so maybe I'm being unreasonable. I also told DH to yell at his mother today because she's been letting her dog bark incessantly for hours starting at 6am. I was so mad this morning. I told him to tell her, that if the dog wakes me up again I'll personally do something about it. So he followed directions nicely and yelled at her! :haha: Next time I see her I'm planning to reiterate what DH told her. I keep asking DH, why do I get such pleasure when you yell at your mom, :lol:

So far this weekend we got a new mattress and it finally snowed a little! DH is taking off on Monday so he can watch Kira as I get my blood test, so another 3 day weekend for us!


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## spidey

I was downloading my pics and here are the things she's made in art class so far:

these are actually stickers and she colored in the edges of the snowflakes
https://www.razortoe.com/share/artclass/art1.jpg

Kira had no interest in this, so this is mommy's art!
https://www.razortoe.com/share/artclass/art2.jpg

Kira colored yellow all over the raven and smeared glitter glue all over her snowflake 
https://www.razortoe.com/share/artclass/art3.jpg

She did most of this by herself (all of this is week #2) I did help her glue together the little furry ball thing, and I colored a bit on her Ravens color page.
https://www.razortoe.com/share/artclass/art4.jpg


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## Shiv

Spidey - Kira'a art projects are great, is she left handed? Left handed people are definitely supposed to be more artistic I think.

I think it is very rude of that girl to invite someone who nobody knows to a group reunion, i mean why would you do that? Unless it is actually her girlfriend and she is going to come out then and there! 

I love the fact that you can tell DH to shout at his mother and he does it! David would just look at me and say but I don;t understand why you are upset!

My favourite of your names are Max (sorry! I used to like Riley but it is getting very popular here, I do like the naem though) and Hailey for a girl.

I forgot to say the other day that I had been researching the terrible twos and it always says that it is becasue they are unable to communicat eand get frstrated! bulls*it! Sophia can tell me exactly what she wants, the problem is when she can't have it :haha: I do feel that the terrible twos are worse because Sophia is so able to tell me what she wants, so I can;t pretent I don't know and i have to try to explain why she can'thave it!

I will come back later for a review of our relatively calm weekend - there is still time yet for it all to go pear shaped - 4 hours until Sophia's bedtime is a long time in this house :haha:


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## Shiv

ok so both girls are in bed so time for a post all about me hahahahahahahaha

SO you may have seen that we were having issues with Sophia going to bed. Well (fingers crossed, the last 2 nights she has been back to normal). SO a couple of weeks ago she realised she could actually get out of bed, so was getting out and running about a bit but then getting back in again and goign back to sleep, so we just left her to it. This progressed on to getting up, putting her lamp on (it is one of those ones where if you touch the base it comes on, touch it again it gets brighter, touch it again it goes off) and then running around followed by getting back in to bed. Not too much of an issue apart from we had to go in when we went to bed to turn the light off and this always woke her up as her door is noisy.

This progressed to getting up, putting light on, running around, banging on her door and screaming for me. This progressed to refusing to go to sleep without her door open and her lamp on, and even then she refused to even lie down. It got to 10pm when I wanted to go to bed and hardcore mummy kicked in. I went in turned the lamp off at the mains (which you can only get to by taking a draw out from her wardrobe) and shutting the door. After 2 minutes of screaming she went to sleep. Since then she hasn't made a fuss. I do hear her each morning sayng, "mummy my lamp won't work" :haha:

SO that is sleep hopefully sorted. We have also cut her daytime nap :cry: so that she is exhausted by bedtime. Great for getting her to sleep, terrible fo rmy sanity!

So I haven't had much of a break this weekend. My usual 90 minutes while Sophia has her swimming lesson didn't happen as Sophia asked me to go and watch her swim. How could i refuse! So I went and stood at the side with Cora. She did really well. With armbands on she can swim the width of the pool (maybe 15 metres). She has no fear and happily throws herself in and can monkey along the edge holding on. 

Sophia has been wearing nappies for a few days now and I think she is getting a bit sick of it. She tells me when she has done a wee so I take her nappy off and ask her if she wants a fresh one put on. She has started sometimes saying no, and I say "so what will you do if you need a wee or a poo" and she says "go on my potty", which she does (well twice so far). I must admit I have enjoyed having her back in nappies, no worry about accidents.

We haven't really had any tantrums this weekend. Mainly because Sophia has been constantly entertained with stuff she wants to do. I am sure it will be a different story tomorrow!

I have signed Sophia up for a gymnastcs class startinf on wednesday, I hope she enjoys it.

Cora is doign ok, I am worried that she is allergic to something else as well as dairy/soya. She had been fine for a while but has started being a bit sick after feeds again and hasn't been putting on weight (or at least not much, I am only weighing on my home digital scales), and tonight I spotted a patch of exzema. I am going to keep an eye on it and if she has not put on at least 0.25 lbs in2 weeks time then I am going to take her to the doctor. Not that she will do anything, she is rubbish. SPidey did you find it difficult to get a doctor to take your food intolerances seriously?

Sleep wise Cora goes to bed at the same time as Sophia. No idea how we go this to happen, she just started needing to go to bed then. So we get both girls washed and dressed in PJ's on our bed, then David reads to Sophia in her bed and I feed Cora and put her down. So she goes to bed at about 7.30pm and will sleep for between 8.5 hrs and 12 hrs. She is really variable and there is no rhyme or reason as to why some nights she wakes earlier than others. But I figure even if she does 7.30pm - 4am and then back down again to 7.30am then that is no bad.

We tried Cora on a bottle yesterday, just a couple of ounces of EBM, because I actually find it really hard to see her having a bottle, so David gives her the couple of ounces and then I grab her back and feed her straight away. Anyway she took it fine (she hadn't had a bottle since christmas eve) so in theory I can leave her with David. I just need to think of something to do now :haha: I don't really have any interests to pursue. I have been looking into getting a personal trainer, just for maybe one session a week for a couple of months. I want to get a bit fitter, I have been doing an exercise video a few times a week (although that was during Sophia's nap time so i don't know when I will do it now), but once I have some fitness back I would love to have someone to completely beast me for an hour at a time :haha: But they are so expensive, like £45 per hour! Which got me thinking...............i wonder if I could get fit then maybe i could study to be a personal trainer over the next few years and then once the girls are at school it would be the perfect job to fit around school hours and I wouldn't have to do too many hours. I thought i could specialise in post natal women. What do you reckon. Prob just a pipedream and would obvisouly rely on me getting really fit which will prob never happen :haha:

SO what else can i ramble about................hmm weightloss has stopped now, so I guess to lose anymore I will have to actually stop eating so much crap. I have been steady at around 9st 4lbs for a couple of weeks now. Which was actually my long term goal, but obviously now i am there i want to get down to 9stone :haha:

My tummy is pretty terrible, when I lean forward it hangs down a serious amount, like 6 inches of hang blush:) however if i then tighten my abs (please read that as ab :haha:) it pulls in to about an inch of hang. SO do you think that means that if I really work hard on my abs that it would stop hanging so much?

Well i don't think i have anything else to ramble about...........ooh wait I do.

Do you remember ages ago I told you all about my mum falling out with her family. Well she hasn't spoken to her dad or sisters in about 18months. Well another family member died last week and they will all be going to the funeral on wednesday. Things were not left nicely, my worry isn't so much what my mum will do but what my dad will do when he sees her bitch sisters. Good job I didn't really know the person who died as I was the last person to have any contact with my grandad (her dad) when i wrote him a letter telling him in the nicest possible way that I couldn't stand what he had done to my mum and that I wanted nothing more to do with him. If I saw any of them again I would not be able to bite my tongue that is for sure :haha:

right well I think that really is it now. I hope you all had good weekends.

Oh Spidey, is Kira in her room now?

right that really is it............yep..............I'm off :haha:


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## spidey

Kira has skipped half her daytime naps this past week and its been so tough not getting that break plus she is soooooo cranky in the evening. Luckily I got a 3 hour nap with her Sunday. She doesn't get out of bed yet like naughty Sophia :haha: but she calls for Daddy and says she has to pee. What are Sophia's and Natasha's normal sleep schedules? Kira usually sleeps from 9:30 until 7:20 (so almost 10 hours) and then she'll usually take a 2 hour nap. Kira's not in her own room yet. DH fixed her door this weekend so its not loud when it opens so at anytime we can move her in there... and I have a feeling I'll be unplugging her lamp too :haha: 

I like the name Max too, but I think its too short for a formal name as we'd have to name the kid something like "Maximillan" or "Maximus" which I really don't like! Do you think "Max" could be the kids real name?

Thats funny Sophia has peed in her potty a few times again. I guess wearing diapers isn't so fun! 

Re: Cora's food sensitivities, do you have any suspected foods? I never found a doctor who took my food allergies seriously. I saw an acupuncturist/ herbalist who did, but all the "regular" doctors blamed my symptoms on other things. I was told that I make too much stomach acid and would have to take prescription antacids the rest of my life. Can you change pediatricians or are you stuck with that one? Kira gets eczema too, but hers only appears in the winter as does DH's eczema. I was going to ask if you thought Sophia had any food issues too. When I was having all my troubles with gluten I felt like crap and I didn't have any real physical symptoms. No vomiting, diarrhea or rashes. But overall I coped with life very poorly because I had general discomfort. I could see how a toddler who didn't feel 100% could be really off on their behavior. Although more than likely its a bad case of terrible twos. I know that Kira understands the difficulty she has in communicating with me so if I don't understand something she doesn't get too troubled and we usually move onto the next thing. 

Shiv, I think your idea to be a personal trainer geared towards post-natal women is great! Have you looked into how long it takes to do the education part? I don't think you'll have to be super trim and muscular to be a good personal trainer. If I wanted to see a personal trainer, I wouldn't want a body builder type woman telling me what to do, but seeing another mom who managed to get back in shape would be inspiring. Mostly I would want someone who was really knowledgeable in the specific exercises that would help me, so brains would be more important. My tummy was very dangly when I leaned over (now its nice and tight, lol!) but I never did any workouts to try and help it. I have a friend who volunteered with physical therapists and most of them worked part time schedules and really enjoyed their jobs telling people what exercises to do. I think a personal trainer and a physical therapist are pretty closely related. My friend decided not to pursue the field because she's very uncomfortable touching other people so it wasn't a good fit for her. After this one I'll have some major work ahead of me so you'll have to give me some advice on how to get things back to normal. I really would like to know how to get my muscles back together this time... they're split again and when I tighten my "abs" I can see my innards protruding through the large gap.

I went for my massive blood draw this morning and they took sooo many viles of blood. Kira watched and found it amusing so I had to put on my brave face :haha: I really hope everything is okay. Then we went shopping at the craft store and then to the mall to buy me another maternity top so I have enough to get me through the week. Now Kira is ordering DH around. Whenever she sees that I'm not sitting on the sofa she says "mommy LIVINGROOM!!!" :haha: I don't complain! And now my MIL just rang the bell, so I better get off my computer. Whenever she sees me I'm on the computer so I don't want to get a reputation :lol:

oh, 1 more thing! Kira is a lefty. Isn't Natasha a lefty too? I've been meaning to tell you girls that Kira's feet turn in when she walks or runs. The right one is pretty badly turned in, and the left one turns in a little. I've always described her as a goofy runner, but now I think its because she's very pigeon toed. I'll have to search Dr Google and see if I should call her doctor or wait until her 3 year appointment.


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## jelr

Hey girls

Well see how much I can remember now, I'm pretty brain dead with little sleep and a really poorly girl all day.

Shiv: I'm so sorry Sophia is still kicking up, I actually remember reading that about the terrible two's also. I honestly do think it sounds like she a bit put out because of Cora and is doing everything to get your attention. If only she could understand she would get so much more good attention if she just behaved. I can see Natasha being the very same though if we do have another baby and it terrifies me being honest, but in some senses she is spoilled rotten with the attention from myself and DH and all my family just around the corner, she really is the apple of all of my brothers' eyes. They even all called to see her today and didn't care if they got the bug themselves :kiss: and they really were all so so worried about her, so she is really going to be put out if she has to share that attention. I can see it already when we are over in my mams on a Sunday for dinner, she will now shout if she is not the centre of attention at the dinner table :dohh:

I suppose it has to be hard for them to get used to the change when it has been only them for so long. I know it has flown for us, but it is there life time.

Or Spidey did have a good point, I wonder if it is food allergies. It is all so hard to know isn't it. That is still the thing I find hardest about parenting is the guessing especially when they were teeny and I am a fixer and have to know what the problem is and a way to fix it, so I find the guessing really hard work :dohh: 

I think your idea of the personal instructor is a fantastic idea and at £45 an hour, you wouldn't need to work too many hours to make a decent wage and like Spidey said I don't think you would have to be super super fit :thumbup: - Go for it.

I do think I remember something about your mum and her family, but I don't remember any details (maybe you didn't tell us details :haha:) - I really hope the funeral goes smoothly and hassle free for both your mum and your dad.

Spidey: I love Kira's art work, it sounds like you are both enjoying the class. Have you made any new mommy friends at it as I know that was part of your original plan or have you changed your mind on that one?

:haha: Your DH cracks me up yelling at your MIL, I actually get on with my MIL, but then that is maybe as I don't see her everyday, because I definitely wouldn't get away with yelling at her, she would bury me I would say :haha:

I love your bump picture on fb, you look fantastic. I know what you mean about being the centre of attention. I never liked that about pregnancy and everyone has an opinion on everything you do :dohh: - have you announced to work now that you have on fb?

Yes Natasha is left handed too, well she does use both, but she does favour the left and always uses the left for drawing, painting and eating.

About the feet turning in, I think I would get it checked, because most of these things can be corrected if they are caught early I think and I know how much extra trouble I have with my joints because I have fallen arches, which tends to cause me to twist my feet in slightly and in turn it causes my knees and hips to be misaligned. I wouldn't think you need to worry about anything like that with Kira because it is being caught so early if it is anything and if it is treatment would probably be exercise or corrective shoes (but then I'm only guessing on that), but I do think all those types of things are better dealt with as early as possible and not in your 20's like me :haha:

AFM: Well the smoking is not going to well. I decied to buy the lightest brand available so as not to be smoking DH's for 1 a day as I smoked the 2nd lightest brand here anyway and he doesn't, but that was a bad mistake as having them in the house just made me smoke more. still not much more, but more all the same. So I'm going to go at it again properly this week and try and stop full stop.

No more news on ttc. AF is due tomorrow. I did a test this morning and yesterday (this morning wasn't fmu though as I was so tired from being up all night I didn't think of it) - Both were negative of course and I do think I'm out again this month as I feel like AF is on the way, I am really bloated and have a lot of pressure down by my pubic bone and I got that on the last long cycle. Mind you I did think she would arrive today as I have it since yesterday, but she hasn't shown up yet, so you would never know. When I say she is due tomorrow that would be going on a 14 day LP, but then my cycles are so all over the place at the moment. I actually don't know when she is due :haha: - I think I'm trying to talk myself into believing that she is on the way and I'm out, so as I won't be disappointed, but I know I will be devestated again.

Although according to ff if I'm pregnant this month I would be due on the 1st of Oct, which is in or around the date I was due this time last year, so that would be a bit weird, but I don't care. I'm so so broody now and really am getting more frustrated with ttc by the day. I think I'm also dreading the next month or two as it would have been feb / march that we were going through the mc and I just don't want to deal or think about it and just want to be pregnant again so that I don't have to. It just feels like it is going to be a big enough hurdle to get to the 12 weeks and everything be okay without the waiting and worrying about ttc as well if that makes sense. But then I keep telling myself that good things comes to those who wait, although its not really working. Patients was never my strong point :haha:

Will fill you in on how tomorrows test goes. I reckon I may as well use up the 40 free tests I got with the OPK's :haha:

Well I guess I had better get a move on and get to bed in case Natasha is awake again tonight. I'm had a training course on Sat so have a day to take off instead which has to be taken within the month so I have decided to take it tomorrow. In one sense I know this week especially tomorrow is busy, but feck it, even if Natasha is not still sick tomorrow, she is not going to be right after being that sick and all she wants is me at the moment so what is the point in leaving her with my mam and then taking a day next week or the week after to do nothing on when she needs me now.


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## jelr

The silly stupid bitch got me :cry:


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## Shiv

oh when I saw you had been on again I really thought it was to announce your BFP. I'm really sorry. Next month honey will be your month x


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## spidey

jelr, I'm so sorry :hugs: I was really hoping that this would be your month especially with having to wait for such a long cycle.

Kira is just like Natasha- everyone in the family showers her with attention and she doesn't have to share. She has people sending her gifts who have never met her (or me!) :haha:

I hope Natasha has a good night tonight and a much better day tomorrow.

I'll post more later- I need to get my bath before Kira wants to take one with me. Her new thing is to point to each of my body parts and say "pillow tummy" "pillow booby... baby" and "pillow booby... BIG!" I swear my boobs are the same size! DH finds it very entertaining, so I have both of them giggling at me as I'm trying to bathe and shave :lol:


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## jelr

Thanks girls - am really fed up with it all now to be honest.

I don't remember ttc being half as stressful last time, but then I was clueless :haha: - It feels like time is against us and I suppose to a certain degree last time I didn't expect it to happen at all and now that I know it can it just feels like it is within my grasp, but yet a million miles away and this is only the first part of the battle, I then need to manage to hold onto the pregnancy. 

Each month I promise myself I won't get my hopes up, but then I'm devestated and all these silly LP symptoms are so like pregnancy ones, it is so hard not to think that I am pregnant each and every time :dohh:

Ack I'm just feeling sorry for myself I guess, I will be fine.

Diet starts tomorrow and hopefully shifting the extra weight will help and I'm going to phone the docs on Friday when I'm off again and see about an appointment for a referral.

Spidey: Kira is so cute with her "pillow tummy" and "pillow booby" - although I probably wouldn't think it was as funny if it was about my tummy and boobs :haha:

Have you gotten anything to wear for the afternoon tea yet? I meant to say in my last post. I would agree that is very rude for that girl to bring a friend and especially to demand it. I was thinking the very same as Shiv though, I wonder if she is going to come out :haha:

Shiv: How is Sophia this week? did she have your gymnastics class yet? Any more luck figuring out if Cora has anymore allergies?

Well not much news here, Natasha is much better thankfully, she is still off her food, but did eat a bit, but she is back to her bright self and has colour back in her cheeks and is playing away instead of just lying on the couch and most importantly no more vomit or temperature and she is taking loads of fluids so I don't mind about the food, as it will probably be a few days before her tummy is 100% right.


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## spidey

jelr, I'm so sorry you're so fed up with ttc. :hugs: I know exactly what you mean. On the bright side, the changes you're making (ie. weight loss) will only make ttc easier, plus you had a nice long 14 day LP this cycle. And you know you're ovulating from the opks and temping, so everything is on track for a bfp and now you have to let nature do its thing- easier said than done. I hope you can get a fast appointment with your doctor so you can get that referral and some peace of mind.

What sort of diet are you doing?

I don't think I'm going to buy anything new for afternoon tea since the girls all say they wear jeans and t-shirts. So I'm going to wear a purple shirt that I already own with a very low back. It's also see through, so it's a bit sexy and it fits over my bump still. I have some blackish gray velvety maternity pants that might look nice with it. I'll take a picture before I leave for my lady date in 2 weeks :haha:

The girl who is bringing another girl along is most certainly not coming out :haha: but I love how you 2 think! She has a bf and I am forced to hear the details of their nightly encounters on FB. I also know when they're fighting (which happens frequently) and what sort of birth control she uses :lol: He doesn't want to have any more kids (he had 1 with his first wife) but she always posts how she wants to get pregnant and how her ovaries are sad. Then 6 hours later she'll post about a new birth control pill she's taking and the side effects.

jelr, I'm glad Natasha was playing today and feeling much better. It might take awhile for her tummy to feel completely better. How are you feeling? I hope you've been spared from the tummy bug.

We had our 3rd art class today. I sat at a table with a mom and little girl who appeared to be close to Kira's age, but it turns out she was 3 1/2. Kira is by far the youngest one there and I think most of the kids are 4 year olds. The mom didn't seem too interested in talking to me, but its not like I'm the queen of conversation :haha:

I called up for my blood results today and the very nice nurse went over them all. Everything looks great she said, even my iron which was a problem last time. So tomorrow I might get brave and tell people I'm officially pregnant- if they haven't already figured it out :haha:


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## jelr

Your purple shirt sounds lovely, I can't wait to see your photo.

Mmmm - Okay so your friend is not coming out so :haha: - Ar e you are sure though as she does sound a bit confused :haha: - Some people love living their entire life out of fb don't they :shrug: :haha:

:happydance: for the bloods coming back all right, it is such a relief to have those things over and done with. I hope it has put your mind at rest now and you can relax and enjoy it.

Natasha is back to her normal self now thank god and so far we have both escaped the bug - Fingers crossed it will stay that way.

Well I took the bull by the horns and phoned my consultants secretary to see did I need to go to my gp for a referral or could I just book in and she said she would just book me in on account of me only being there last June, so that saved me &#8364;50 in the doctors and the appointment is for 27th of March so it is not a year long wait like I expected it, so I'm feeling a lot more postive and am hoping that maybe just the security of knowing it will happen within the next few months will actually relax me enough for it to it happen before that.

Oh yeah I meant to actually answer you girls about the drawing earlier, Natasha is doing the same with the drawing and when she paints as you might remember from her video. Everything is "meant" to be something now, although it looks absolutely nothing like it and is still only a load of scribbles. It is so funny to watch her though, some days she will tell me it is "Minnie's bow" and then "Santa's foot" - Where do they get their ideas from :haha:

Well now plans for us for the weekend, just going to relax as it has gone extremely cold here and I'm very very sore and tired after Natasha being sick, so we might have a movie day again one of the days. Shiv: how did Sophia get on watching Nemo after?

Have a good weekend girls. Xx


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## spidey

I'm so glad you don't have to wait too long for your appointment jelr! March will be here in no time and I bet you'll get your bfp a week before the appointment. 

How was everyones weekend?

Kira and I slept until 9:45 this morning and didn't leave the bed until 10:45! Just as we were done eating breakfast DH walked in the door ready for his lunch break :haha: She usually never sleeps past 7:30am, so she must have needed it. I decided to skip her nap which was a mistake because she's been a crank head all evening!

Kira had a playdate this weekend with the daughter of a good friend of mine at work. The other little girl was a very early talker but now I think the clarity of Kira's words almost matches that of this other little girl. It's nice to see how quickly she's catching up. We also cleaned the basement. Overall it wasn't a very exciting weekend :lol:

I have a midwife appointment Friday where I should get my referral for a 20 week scan. I still haven't announced my pregnancy at work. I tried on Friday but I felt so stupid saying "hey, guess what, I'm pregnant". I went as far as walking into the office of the 2 main secretaries and I was about to say something but felt so weird that I pretended I was there to buy a candy bar to support one of their daughter's schools. :blush: I can't even eat the candy bar since it has gluten in it :haha: Maybe tomorrow (Tuesday) I'll tell people if I can work up the nerve :haha:


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## Shiv

Hi girls, been quiet in here, hope that is because everyone is having fun with their LO's and not because of illness etc.

Jean - I am sure Natasha is fully recovered now, I hope so and I also hope that you and Jim managed to avoid it.

Great news on your consultant appointment, not you can hopefully relax a bit and let that swimmer catch the egg :thumbup: Where are you in your cycle now?

How is the not smoking going?

Spidey - when is your 20 week scan then? How did your mw appt go? It made me laugh thinking of you walking in to a room ready to announce your news and then...........buying some candy you can't even eat! Could you send an email instead, that is what I did at work (with SOphia) but then i sent it before I was obvioulsy pregnant :haha:

it is so cool that Kira's speech has caught up really quickly, do you still think she will need speech therapy? I don't think she does!

As for us, well let me see, I'll start with a SOphia update. She has been much less cranky the last couple of weeks. We still have daily meltdowns but they seem to be quicker to pass. Obvioulsy we still have the odd major one but not ten times a day like it was! When she starts getting upset I say e.g "right listen to me, you have two options 1)You put that back by yourself or 2) I will take it off of you and put it back myself". 9 times out of ten she will put it back herself.

She is out of nappies again but only because since we had put her back in them she has got terrible exzema where thenappy must rub her leg, it was so sore that I couldn't keep the nappy on her. She is generally attempting to get to the potty, but rarely she makes it before she has started to wee, so we are having several changes of trousers a day. She always makes it for a poo though so that is good :haha:

We have signed up for a term of gymnastics classes. It is less of a class and more of just a free play scenario in a proper gymnastics club with a sprung floor and all teh gym equipment, beams, bars, floor level trampoline. I did gym when I was younger so it is fun getting to run around with Sophia. She is really good on the beam and she can walk along it by herself when it is a low one (practice one) but needs to hld my hand on a full height one (can't say I blame her). They have a group warm up as well and this week they used the ribbons that rhythmic gymnasts use, she picked it up and straight away did the circle swirly thing, I hope she is good at gym, I can live through her then :haha:

She is also still going to swimming lessons and is so confident in the water, she is getting good at pointing her toes when she kicks on her back etc

hmm what else.......she has started singing more songs recently, she has always been quite good at this and had been singing nuresery rhymes properly for months. The other day she just came out with Yanky Doodle, now the only place she has got this from is a book at my parents house with it in, so she maybe sees it once a month - and she sang this without any prompting

Yanky Doodle came to town, riding on a pony
stuck a feather in his cap and called it macaroni

(at which point I though, wow, how does she know that........then she continued on)

yanky doodle keep it up, yanky doodle dandy
mind the music and the step and with the girls be handy

I had to phone my mum to see if those are the right words, and they are! Her memory is a bit ridiculous, at times I worry she might be a bit rainman esque!

So on to Cora - she is great. My dairy trial was not a complete disaster, she did react but not nearly as badly. She got mucousy poos but didn't seem to suffer from any wind pain (which was my main concern). So I will try again in a few weeks and see. It means that I will not worry *too* much about if I eat dairy if we eat out (which is very rare) but won't eat it regularly.

I just ordered a load of milk chocolate from a company called moo free (amazon sell it which is amazing). SO far I have been eating the darkest of dark chocolate and I now really like it but am looking forward to trying some milk chocolate again, I hope it isn't rank, and I hope it turns up tomorrow!

Cora is still waking once in the night, I am really tired but am trying ot treasure every single feed as I am well aware that these days are precious and she will be a toddler in a flash, makes me sad and broody. She is just so chilled out and happy. She giggles now which is just beautiful. 

SO an update on me - not much to say. I started the week wieghing 9lbs 2.5oz. I was over the moon as I hadn't really lost any weight for a good few weeks. However I weighed myself today and I am back up to 9st 4.5lbs so nevermind!

I am trying to exercise but now that Sophia doesn't nap it is hard. She will do the DVD with me for about 5 minutes but then wants me to stop. I have started doing it while she eats breakfast so that she is occupied but can see me prancing about!

It has been snowing here this weekend, we got a good few inches and Sophia was SO excited about it. You will prob have seen the photo on facebook. SO today we had another film day (after she had dragged David out in the snow at 7.30am). We watched a Winnie the Pooh movie. They are her favourite characters and she giggled loads. But still said she preffered Nemo! She LOVES popcorn which is quite good as i figure it is actually a fairly healthy snack. We pop our own and other than a tablespoon of oil we don;t add anything else (to hers, we add a tonne of salt to ours :haha:).

Not many plans for this week, seeing some mummy friends on Tuesday, gymnastics on wednesday but other than that not much. I am really missing my old mummy friends, I don't really feel that close to the ones here, I see them more for Sophia's interaction with their kids. They are nice enough but I don't feel a big connection. I am also missing having family and friends close by, we don't do much at the weekends as I hate eating out now that I can't eat anything nice, and everything involves food, even if we go to a museum we still need to get lunch. I miss having my parents nearby so that I could drop the girls off and go for a swim or get my hair cut.........but hey what can you do. It has been just over a year since we found out David would lose his job and we have been living here for over 8 months now, so I think i have done quite well to not miss everyone until now. It is especially hard as two of my friends *back home* (must get out of the habit of calling Kent home) have had babies in the last 3 months, and I am sad that Cora won't grow up really being friends with them. And I have spent the last couple of years being the only one with a child whilst they all go out all the time, and now that they suddenly know how limiting to your social life children can be, I am not there. We always talked about holding big dinner parties at eachothers houses when we all had kids so that we could take the kids and put them to sleep upstairs..................ah well, just ignore me, I'll get over it, life would just be a bit easier if we lived closer to everyone, not the end of the world, look at how Cleck coped being so far from her family.

Well i promised myself an early night, which for me is 9pm and it is already nearly 10pm so I better go, I hope to see some nice big updates soon from you both xxx

oh and I don;t know how you feel about this, but I realised the other day that it is ridiculous that I tell you girls pretty much everything but i don;t even send you Christmas cards or birthday cards, or send Natasha and Kira birthday cards. I would love to swap addresses.............I kow that makes e sound like a stalker but I promise I'm not :haha: Anyway if you are up for it then let me know and we can PM or something, if not then don't worry, I won't be offended. (that's a lie, I will be mortally offended but will try not to show it :haha:)

xxx


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## jelr

Spidey: Well how the Kira's play date go and how did the midwife appointment go, I hope you got your scan appointment.

I really can't believe you are nearly half way there already, the time is flying by.

Well were you brave enough to tell work yet? I think the email would be a great idea.

Yay for the lie in, Natasha has done the opposite and is walking at 7 instead of her normal 9 :dohh: - so I envy you at the moment :haha:

Shiv: I'm glad Sophia has settled down, thankfully it seems to have been just a phase and hopefully the potty training will get better and better also. Natasha actually asked to use her potty today to do her poo, but when I brought her into the bathroom to where the potty is she started shouting no no no, so I have no idea what that was about. That sounds painful where the nappies were rubbing, your right though I wouldn't have been able to leave it on either.

Natasha usually doesn't have too many tantrums but this week she did seem to have loads and then I discovered one of her bath teeth have broken through. She also is waking at 7, instead of 9 so is tired all day, although I can't actually say she is awake, but is crying in her sleep and shouting "no its mine" and "no I want to go to the bank with mammy" and stuff like that, like she is having nightmares. But yet when I go in, she will talk to me normally as if she is awake so I don't know :shrug: 

Like you though I would have thought she would have been able to tell me her mouth is hurting as she can communicate everything that she wants and chatters away about everything now and tells me all about her day when I'm home from work and tells me if she has a pain in her stomach. I wonder if they just feel like crap with their teeth and can't can't exactly pin point what is wrong with them - I just don't know :shrug:

I'm glad the Cora dairy challenge wasn't a complete disaster and it definitely sounds like things are looking up when she didn't get wind. I wonder if the poos where just the change rather than a reaction. I know if we are away and I eat lots of rich foods my bowels either back up or get loose due to the change in my diet.

Sophia sounds like she is doing great with the gymnastics and swimming. She sounds so cute singing - she really does have a fantastic memory.

I'm sorry you are feeling like you are missing everyone, it is totally normal though, you have done brilliantly to last this long, I would have been a big mess right from the start. I miss my friend that has moved away too especially now that she has a child as I know we would probably do stuff with the kiddies, my dream was always that we would all have children at the same time and do stuff together, but it hasn't worked out like that either as 2 of my friends have no children, 1 has 3 so it is hard for her to get out with them all and other other has a 12 year old, so there is not much common ground with a 12 and 2 year old.

Big hugs :hugs: - I hope you are feeling better soon, the tiredness will make you feel worse also.

Well not much news from me, diet is going well and I have lost 8lbs so I'm 4 away from my goal, I am also going to join the gym again as it is only a two minute walk from my house and they are doing a special deal and it is only &#8364;100 for the year, so I reckon even if I only go for a few weeks I will have gotten my moneys worth as most gyms here are about &#8364;350 to &#8364;500 a year and I got my last decent pay check (we used to get paid nearly two months behind, so I got decembers pay at the good rate :haha:) and reckoned if I didn't do it now I won't have the money next month.

The smoking isn't going too well, since going on this liquid only diet again, I have found it so hard the fact that I was still smoking a few in the evenings to stop when I'm already so hungry. I do know though I have to knock it on the head because I can't afford to spend &#8364;10 a pack (which was what I smoked a day before) and I can't keep half giving them up and then eating more and putting up the weight and having to go to such extremes to lose it or there will be no babies. I really hate having pcos for that reason. I'm still only smoking 3 or 4 in the evenings on the days I'm working, but it is about 8 to 10 on my days off :dohh: - I'm hoping the gym will keep me busier in the evenings until I have cracked it and that it will also help to keep the weight off when I eat extra when I completely stop.

I'm on CD12 today so if I have a 32 day cycle I should OV on CD18 when I will be back on proper food, I have started testing with the OPK's though just incase I OV earlier and will go back on food straight away just in case.

Natasha is completely back to normal now thank god, I never want to see her go through that again, although I'm sure I will. she is hilarious though telling people about it. She says "I had a tummy bug in my belly and spuddies and carrots came out of my mouth on nanna's floor and mammy and daddy's cuddles made me better" :haha: - she is so dramatic about it too and does the actions with her hand up to her mouth and then down to the ground to show how she got sick :haha:

We had a christening / birthday party yesterday as Jim's neices baby was christened and it was her older sisters 4th birthday. Natasha had a ball as she really loves meeting up with her cousins, although I did notice even though she really is a little social butterfly and loves other children and is usually so so confident, she wasn't herself in such a big crowd and was happier sitting down looking at books when it got really noisy and the other children were really running aorund wild. She can be quiet cautious and seemed to be really uncomfortable when they were getting really boisterous. I hope she will get on okay when it comes to playschool and won't be pushed around, because she is so laid back and relaxed. 

Today we also had a movie day and watched the Lion King, Natasha also loves the popcorn and we do the very same, we pop our own and don't put any salt on her bowl :haha:

We actually have a copy of every disney movie ever and more on an external hard drive that we got from a friend, it is a pity you girls are not nearer and I could give you a copy or that there wasn't a way of compressing it to send it on a disk or usb, but it is over 80 gigabytes and there is over 100 movies so I reckon we will never get bored on movie day or have to watch the same ones over and over. She really loved the Lion King more so than when we watched beauty and the beast, that is about all we have been up to and last week we spent 1 of my days off in town sorting bank stuff as we are changing our accounts and it was a mega pain to change all the direct debits for the bills and on the other day, myself and my sister took Natasha to the soft play area.

We didn't get any of the snow thank god. Do you still have much shiv? Have you gotten any Spidey? My sister and her husband were over visiting my brother in London and only just got out on time last night before it really all started.

Shiv that is a fantastic idea about the swapping of addresses and the cards, so you don't have to be mortified :haha: - I just hope I remember to send cards :haha: - I used to be so so good with that and always remembered everybody, but in the last few years i'm getting more forgetful and have to put constant reminders in my phone. I think it is because I tend to do the remembering for DH's family also and there is so many children have been born in the last few years. There seems to be about 3 or 4 birthdays with both families and friends and their children every month, so it is hard to remember them all, so please do not be offended if I do miss any of them :dohh: - Christmas I will definitely be okay for as I keep a list of the names and addresses and they are all done together :haha:

Well I have blabbered on enough, but wanted to make sure I got in today as I will hopefully be getting fit during the week :haha: - knowing me I will go once and that will be it - I really wish I had a passion for exercise :haha:


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## spidey

wow, lots to catch up on!

I have my scan this Wednesday at 10:30! They want me to drink 32 ounces of water 1 hour before the scan... no f-ing way!

The email announcing my pregnancy is a great idea. I asked DH what he thought and he agreed. So on Tuesday I'll send an email to my boss and my employer since I'm on a contract hired by the government. How about something like this:

"I want to inform you that I'm pregnant and due July 1st. I plan to work until my due date and then take maternity leave which will start in July or possibly late June. I will be returning to work 12 weeks after the baby is born, or perhaps earlier if I can arrange childcare. If you have any questions or concerns please contact me"

Shiv, after you talked about getting in shape, I decided to buy a pregnant lady work out dvd! It mostly focuses on squats and lower body. I've done it 2 nights in a row and my legs are sooo sore! I've managed to find time in the evening as DH entertains Kira. When I do floor exercises, Kira likes to crawl under me like a tunnel :lol: I need to start training for labor- I remember after having Kira every single muscle in my body hurt for days.

This weekend I went shopping for maternity clothes! I bought 2 pairs of leggings and 4 short sleeve shirts. DH says 2 of the combinations are too hot to wear to work :haha: I'll have to take pictures one day when Kira gives me a chance. I haven't been to this particular maternity store before but I could have bought everything. It was all so stylish... I was in shopping heaven!

Tonight Kira is sleeping in her own bedroom for the very first time! She was fine falling asleep but we'll see if she wakes in the night. It might sound stupid but I'm really going to miss sleeping in Kira's bed. She has such a nice comfy room and I loved sleeping alone with no disturbances. Sometimes I'd wake up in the middle of the night and read my kindle. I have a feeling she'll love sleeping in her room too, but she also likes to snuggle so we'll see how she does tonight.

Okay, thats everything with me I think. Shiv, I'm glad Sophia's tantrums are lessening. It sounds like you are being very consistent when she starts to act up, so I bet thats the reason why she's learning not to throw such a fit all the time. Kira does not sing AT ALL, so thats very cute Sophia is a singer. Taking her to gymnastics sounds like fun... I'll have to see if we have something similar in this area because I think Kira would like doing the balance beam and jumping in foam pits. We have 2 more art classes left and had to skip last weeks since I was sick. Kira had a runny nose and gave it to both me and DH so we've been blowing our noses and coughing all week, but I think we're finally over it. Oh, and don't worry too much about your lack of weight loss- I bet you're gaining muscle! And I would love to swap addresses with you! I'll send mine to jelr too and anyone else who reads here and wants it- just ask! Like jelr, I'm awful at sending cards so don't expect mine to be on time, :haha: 

jelr, congrats on your weight loss! I'm sorry quitting smoking is so hard- its one of the hardest addictions to quit so don't beat yourself up about it. Kira doesn't like boisterous crowds either. If the playground has other children on it, she's very cautious, I think because the other children are much bigger than her and she's afraid of being knocked over. I can just imagine Natasha's reenactment of her vomiting, lol!

I better get to bed, this might be a long night! Fingers crossed Kira sleeps good!


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## jelr

I think that emails sounds fine to me. Do you think you will go back earlier than the 12 weeks? I would probably leave that bit out if you don't have too or don't want to :thumbup:

Delighted you got some nice new maternity clothes, I found nice clothes so so hard to get when i was pregnant on Natasha and ended up wearing leggins and bigger sized tops all the time :haha:

I hope last night went well with Kira and that she loves her new room. - you will have to show us a photo now that it is all done and I hope you got some sleep too. 

Best of luck on Wednesday for the scan - I hate having to drink all that water - I usually end up emptying my bladder by the time I get to the hospital and then I have to poor another litre of water down into me really quickly. They always ask did I half empty it or fully empty it too when I tell them - Who the hell manages to half empty their bladder :haha:

Shiv: I meant to say, I would agree with Spidey, I bet you are just toning muscle or could you be half way through your cycle and are ovulating as I always put up a few lbs for a few days and then it goes again. You are doing so so well though with your weight :thumbup:

Oh yeah I also meant to update about Natasha in her bed, she has done really well and doesn't get out at all and even calls us in the morning. I do think it is because the bed guard is up and she only has a little space at the end of the toddler bed to get out and she just wont attempt it in the dark and if I was in any doubt tonight has confirmed it because she is kicking up a stink about being in bed for some unknown reason as she never does this, she is looking for water and all sorts and we have been in about 10 times, we are currently leaving her cry for a while and even with all this she hasn't got out :thumbup:


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## spidey

hmm, good idea jelr... I'll probably leave that sooner than 12 weeks part off. At this moment I'm considering it since I'm not sure if we can do 12 whole weeks without my paycheck and DH will still be on a paycut when I take leave. But if I do go back early they should consider it a special bonus and not be expecting it. At my work the typical maternity leave time is 8 weeks and it's sort of expected that you start to return at 6 weeks, but I'm protected under the law for 12 weeks... actually I'm not protected, but I'm pretending that I am and hopefully they don't know the specifics of the law. The only people protected under the family medical leave act are those who work nearly 40 hours/week for 12 months before giving birth, and those who work for employers who hire more than a certain # of employees. Since I only work 20 hours/ week, I'm not protected, but perhaps they don't realize that. So if they fired me, I would have no grounds for a lawsuit. Gotta love this anti-family country that I live in! So many of our laws protect wealthy businesses and the people in power and they don't give a sh*t about the common people. When DH finds a restaurant that could be killing people will poisonous food, he has no power to shut it down because it might piss off the business owner and eventually lead to less monetary support for the local elected official so they can't run a good campaign for re-election. oops, sorry for the rant.

Kira did great in her own bed! She slept all the way through until 7:30 which is her normal wake up time. But I slept awful and was hyper aware all night waking up to every tiny sound in the house. I probably only got 2 total hours of sleep. Tonight I'm putting a baby monitor in her room so I don't have to listen so hard to hear her. I've been drinking tea and eating chocolate to try and stay awake today.

Thats great Natasha is doing so well in her bed :thumbup: I'm glad she doesn't escape :lol: We have a bed guard on Kira's bed and it makes it difficult for her to escape too.

Oh, I see some pm's about addresses so I better have a peek!!


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## jelr

Yep I definitely think that is the way to go Wendy, because you don't know how you will feel or how things will be then, so at least if you do want to take it they won't be expecting you back and sure they will be delighted to see you back early I'm sure.

Do you not get paid at all then for maternity, We really are so lucky here then. that is about the first perk I have seen of this country that isn't every where else. We get 26 weeks off (at least two weeks have to be taken before your due date) and if you have the correct PRSI (pay related social insurance - which is taken out of your pay check every week) - you get a payment also, which is dependant on how much you earn. The minimum is &#8364;217 and the maximum is &#8364;262 a week and I am even luckier now as one of the perks of being made a perminent public service employee is that I get fully paid maternity leave. We also have the option of another 16 weeks unpaid. I didn't take this the last time but if we manage okay on our new budget I will definitely take it the next time around because my job is 100% secure now and I did manage to save a little over the last year which if I don't have to break into it I will use it to cover my wages. I reckon I will never have the option to get time off work without breaking my service so I might as well make the most of the time when both children are small. I just hope money doesn't end up tighter than I think though and that we have to break into it.

Well done Kira for staying in her bed, I do know what you mean about not sleeping though, I was nearly going to put up a stair gate on Natasha's room and leave the door open the first night as I was terrified that she would get up wandering and that I wouldn't hear here, until DH reminded me that we have the breathing sensor on her monitor still turned on so the alarm would sound if she was to leave the bed :haha: - so I sleep easier now.

Well my poor baby as you know from fb has another tummy bug. My brother came down with it last Friday and DH was sitting on the loo most of Saturday night and then my mam phoned this mornign to say another one of my brothers had it and what did I want to do as she knows I try to keep Natasha away from anything like that. I was very upset to be honest as I asked her if she would mind, looking after Natasha here for just today rather than her picking it up again. I know my mam had a point that if she was going to get it again she would after being in contact with my brother yesterday, but I still wanted to try and prevent it if possible, but she had a right old moan about how she would come over, but that she wasn't happy as she wouldn't be able to get her own stuff done and what was she going to do all day (I felt like saying entertain your grandaughter which is what you are being paid to do :haha:) - but I didn't want to be mean because she really is very good to us and especially to Natasha. My brother then had a go at me in the car as I was giving him a lift to work that she was right and that I was being silly. I know I probably was being overprotective but I have to be honest I would climb a mountain if it meant preventing Natasha from being sick. I wouldn't expect him to understand as he is a 20 year old chap with no children, but I did think my mam would and it was only for the 1 day.

Anyway in the end it was all for nothing as I got a phone call at 2.30 to say she was sick again :( - DH headed straight home and I finished at 4 (the time which I am meant to finish as I have opted not to take a lunch) - I usually don't get finished until 5, as I prefer to finish the task I'm doing rather go back at it the next day and once I have dinner organised from the night before I'm still home at 5.30 which gives me a chance to get it ready and it has actually worked out perfectly as I get time in lieu for any extra that I work now and I had about a half day built up again and I have a training course this sat which is another half day so I'm going to take it off tomorrow to be home with Natasha.

The poor little mite is being so brave this time and is not panicking when she is sick, but she hasn't held anything down since it started. She is drinking lots more though this time as I don't think she is as afraid as she was two weeks ago. She is sipping water all day and even drank some flat 7up, so at least I'm not as worried this time.

Well I'm going to run and get to bed as this could be a long night and I'm going to take Natasha in with me in the spare bed tonight just in case she is sick again.


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## spidey

We don't get maternity pay here and I don't know of any employers that do. I emailed my boss and the contract company that I get paid by. My boss wrote back a nice email saying congratulations and he hoped I had a smooth sailing pregnancy. He didn't mention anything about my 12 weeks of leave, so that's good. But my contract representative called me and said they typically only "give" 6-8 weeks of leave. I guess they're not happy that they won't make money off me for 12 whole weeks!

I'm so sorry Natasha is sick again. Poor thing :cry: it's not fair at all. I don't think its unreasonable to ask your mom to come to your house for the day so Natasha could avoid germs. I hope this tummy bug passes quickly for her and you manage to avoid it again. 20 year old boys (men) have no idea what its like to be a parent. My BIL is 22 and he says some of the stupidest things about my parenting. :haha: My BIL is the one who said "how could you possibly remember when Kira was born- you were sleeping" :rofl: and he also asked why I still looked pregnant 3 days after giving birth. I could seriously slap him sometimes!

Tomorrow I have my scan. I had one around 9 or 10 weeks and the baby was still a blob, so it'll be neat seeing a real looking baby in there. I really hope everything is okay. I'm still convinced there must be something wrong because I can't be this lucky to have a smart beautiful daughter and a healthy baby inside me too.


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