# anyone got advice about fathers rights when not on birth certificate?



## ProudMum

Hi ladies.
Well to brief you, my kids father has never been the bothered type, atleast not when he's got everything he wants in front of him.
he's 46 almost and im 25 and hes been somewhat manipulative since we got together, trying to control all i do.
hes very much set in his own ways where he'll do the same things every day, ie: get up, go to work (if he cant be arsed) and then go out drinking, he'll then go home for dinner, sleep for 3 hrs and go back to the pub again... same thing day in day out. 
we dont live together and dont see one another- he's never been a father to the kids, infact i dont think he knows how to be. he thinks speaking to them on the phone once a week or coming to the house once a month means he's bein a father.

hes in arrears with his rent and council tax, hardly has any work, cant pay any bills and lives in a 1 bedroom flat.

i have dislike issues with his family and i dont let them see my kids- thats my choice and some may not agree with it.
ive also been looking up his families rights to my children, grandparents rights etc and it basically says its down to the mother, she choses who see's her children.

ANYWAY, because of this, because i wont let his family see my kids its caused huge arguments and i havent seen him for months, therefore he hasnt seen his kids- tho i havent stopped him seeing them at all.
hes the sorta person who, if got what he wants he wont bother with it, but if he cant get what he wants (ie his family seeing my kids) he'll turn into a nasty shit.

well he's threatened me with court if i dont let him family see my children.
he didnt send our eldest a birthday card last week or come to m house to see him, he's not phoned, not been round to the house etc; he's just told my brother if i dont let his family see the children he's going to court, tho im not sure what for exactly.
when prompted by my brother about why he's taking me to court he said "i just wanna see my kids"- but i've never ever stopped him, only his family.

anyway hes not on the birth certificate, doesnt pay me any money and as far as the "law" is concerned he's got no children.
On things like tax forms or any kind of "paper" he needs to fill out he states he has no dependants.

my eldest son is in private nursery- very settled- my kids have a gorgeous bedroom full of everything a child could possibly want (not meaning to blow my own trumpet, just stating some facts)
we live in a rural village where theres no crime, no noise, no dangers and stuff; i have a relatively nice home for them, i buy all their clothes and manage these children all by myself in terms of bringing them up.

im now loosing sleep at the thought of the "un-named" father taking me to court. im not sure what he can take me to court for and if he lies about why he's taking court action, what the courts will actually grant him where the kids are concerned.

will it be once a week visits- weekend stay overs at his (must stress, 1 bedroom over crowded) flat, trips out (even tho my kids dont know him that well)

can anyone breif me slightly on what to expect?
will he get a free DNA test? if so then what? does he automatically go on the birth certificate and if so, what happens next? will he have to start paying maitenence? does he get all the rights i've got? is he entitled to legal aid? he's self employed and has no accounts to prove he's not got the income to pay for a solicitor personally and as far as i know he's got issues with the tax office so cant get a self assessment report...

i'd just really like some input from someone, anyone, whos been in this situation and i'd love to know the outcome of it.

sorry for the long winded typo-filled, post.. im sorta stressing out and loosing sleep over it :(
also to add, my eldest is a very clingy mummys boy who cries even when i go to the toilet without him so if this is dragged thru court and the "father" gets what it is he's after, nicholas will be devestated by it as it means he'll be spending time with this bloke without me... will this be taken into consideration???


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## billy2mm

i dont know about his "rights" but i think you should get advice off a solicitor and find out exactly where you stand.

as for his family you dont have to let the kids see them but if he gets unsupervised access then he can allow his family to see them during that time as far as i am aware.

:hugs:


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## BrookieG

hun im so so sorry...i dont have any advice coz im not so sure of all the ins and outs but i really hope you can get it all sorted in a way thats best for you and your boys...take care sweetie xx


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## Janidog

If he hasn't been bothered seeing your children regularly then i really can't see him getting of his backside and taking you to court :hugs:


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## FBbaby

I think if he really really really wanted to, he could get the judge to request a DNA test and then be added on the birth certificate and then agree visits. However, to get through all these hurdles, he would have to show commitment and dedication, not really what he has shown so far.

I think you should email/text him, tell him that you don't have an issue with him seeing his kids and suggest some dates when he can see them, or some arrangement (every saturdays or whatever a judge is likely to consider reasonable). Tell him that you are however worried about his family having access because x,y and z. Say you would like to come to some arrangement preferably without going to court and see what he responds. If he does take it to court, you have this to show the judge, proof that you are not withholding contact. He can't go to court to request access for his family, the grand parents would have to do that, and as you say, they would have a very very strong case to get agreement, and you seem to have very good reasons for not letting them that has nothing to do with resentment. 

Don't let him intimidate you with his threats, it's a common thing to say, but very few do so because they are most of the time just venting air and are deep inside way to embarassed at how a crap a parent they are to take the risk of hearing from a judge!


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## LittleMadam

As he is not on the BCs, he will have to have paternity established via the courts. This is quite a drawn out process and he will have to pay legal fees if he does not qualify for legal aid. He will also have to pay for the DNA test. At the moment, legally, he has no rights because he is not the named father. Tell him to take you to court. It will bite him in the arse because IF he is legally added as their father, you can insist on (back) child support. Judging by what you've said though, I have to agree with FB baby in that he can't seem to commit to his kids so is unlikely to pursue a court hearing.

He is being manipulative and controlling. Call his bluff and try not to let him get to you. Just remember that any 'rights' he has to the kids are only those you have allowed him so far. I reiterate, legally, he has NO rights at this point in time. Seek legal advice (CAB, family lawyer) if still worried.

Best.xx


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## LittleMadam

Just to add, if he goes through with it, the courts will take into account his lack of visitation up-to-date, so, I imagine, any visits he is granted will be gradual. I think you may be able to request supervised visits, but I am not sure. HTH


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## WhiteGeisha

If he is not named on the BC he has no rights. He can take you to court to get parental rights but judging from the sounds of it, he would not be able to afford to do this. He isn't entitled to a free DNA test as far as I am aware and it would be questioned as to why he wants PR now and not before...also, he would be made to pay maintenance by the court and PR doesn't just mean having his name on a piece of paper to use as a weapon, it means he is 50/50 responsible for their care and that means financially!

The furthest I think this would ever get is mediation, and from the sounds of it the outcome would be your favour not his.

x


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## kj135

hello, 
this is a bit complicated, im 16 weeks pregnant, just after i found out i got dumped me and my partner was having troubles before we found out we was expecting. we are still friends but finding it hard to live together ( were still living together as i have no where else to go) 

this is my first child, but he has a little girl with his ex wife, she doesn't let him see his daughter, he is not on her birth certificate, would he have any rights at all to be able to see her. it breaks his heart everyday to not see his little girl. 

i would never stop him seeing our baby and he will be on the birth certificate. 

im just really worried about my ex as he gets really depressed about not seeing his child. he thinks i would turn out like his exwife and stop him seeing the baby.which i would never do. hes not one to talk to people about his problems so wont take help i dont know what i can do. i want to help him see his daughter but need to know what rights he might have can someone please help me 

x
x


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## Ceejay123

Im sorry you're losing sleep over this Hun.

My OH wasn't on his son's birth certificate, but he did care.. and went through the effort to get it corrected. As you state, your ex may not even bother.. Because it is hard work. My OH was asked by his solicitor initally whether he had any concerns about paternity - He said no. They offered him a DNA test - He said no. Because I assume the mother also didn't deny paternity (Which i assume you wont), the fact that he was the father was assumed. Further down the line at court, he was granted Parental Responsibility (2-3 years on if I remember right), he didn't push for this earlier, but could have. As soon as he had parental responsibility he had full rights as any parent would on the birth certificate : I.E Medical decision, Education decisions if it were pushed, child not leaving the country etc. However, he also granted the mother a residence order as he agreed the child was better off living with her and wanted to offer her peace of mind when he's taking the child out that he will be returned iykwim?. 

Anyway, as soon as PR was granted by court, he had to apply for his sons birth certificate, which took around 7 days, along with a form to correct it from the office in his sons hometown. He sent off the form requesting that he be entered onto the birth certificate, instead of unknown in the place of the father. Around 4 weeks later he was called with an appointment to go and sign the documentation and take proof of PR - He was on the birth certificate. I think the mother was told he was doing this, as the office said they'd notify her - but it couldn't be argued against. So if your ex gains PR he will have full rights. 

HOWEVER... that doesn't mean he'll have unsupervised visits straight away. My OH still doesnt have unsupervised visits, although this was by his choice. He was told to push for them and would have had them within a few months.. but his LO is clingy like your son. Cafcass were a little out of order with trying to push it, and my OH disagreed with legal advice to push it. Cafcass were useless and didn't treat it as an indivual case , I know this isn't what you want to hear but i hope its preparing you. 

I highly doubt from what you say that your ex will go through this much trouble, as it took years of solicitors meetings and court dates to get to this stage. If he does, he'll only be granted minimal access to start iwth and if he doesnt attend you can get this cut down. My nephews Dad saw him once a month.. Didnt attend three times, and now sees him 4 times a year! Well deserved. Im afraid to say that they will inevitably probably meet their grandparents, so long as they maintain a long term relationship with their dad. Solicitors advised us that grandparents can fight for rights, but its faster for the father to fight for unsupervised access, and unless you have legitimate proved concerns (Abuse, harassment) the court will side with the child knowing their grandparents through the father. This may take a lot of time though.

Sorry for the longwinded reply.. If you want any more information on what ive said feel free to PM me. x


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