# Continuing To Use The Natural Parenting Section (After Yesterday)



## Wobbles

I'm going to clarify the reasons behind the short period Natural Parenting was closed off from new posts yesterday. 

It isn't as simple as people with an opinion gets banned, neither is it direct a target of Natural Parenting, why would we introduce this new section if we had a problem with it? We wouldn't and I believe it's been successful.

A very small handful of ladies lately have shown to look for trouble, light the fire then run and have been brought to our attention over and over again with at least 50+ reported posts involving them. I'm sure you understand it becomes very frustrating and time consuming it only happens to be the Natural Parenting section they are more active in, we can't help that. It became obvious that a small minority thought the forum TOS didn't apply within this section being used for a 'we can say what we want here' with no regards to other members. It could have been any section it just so happened to be this one, again we can't help that.

I want to confirm that 90% of the reported posts from Natural Parenting were actually reported by the ladies who use it and is not in any way being targeting by any 'anti-behaviour'.

There is only so much patience any human can take and yesterday mine ran out along side having a bad day (I'm allowed those like everyone else) so my patience ran out before my brain kicked in and I closed the section from new posts whist deciding what was best, again this could have been any section. Yes I realised I was cutting a support from those who weren't in the small minority and it was reactivated and I took the decision to deactivate those accounts that have been monitored instead.

There are problems all over the forum, just because you only see those within the sections you are more active in doesn't mean it's the only situations arising and being dealt with, certainly not singled out.

Please don't assume members just get banned on what you see as one small comment or ever any parenting choice (madness) - that's not how it works, it is based on a number of factors and one of those I explained above regarding the recently banned members.

Members should use all sections with consideration for all other members (that doesn't mean you have to tip-toe), it's not always what you say but how you say it. In the Natural Parenting section there are many methods that fit in this catgory and people should also remember not everyone follows each one of those, so yes potentially will get offended at those comments slightly below the belt without seeking for it.

I don't think we need to usergroup this section not for a second, it was a small minority that happened to use this section, the activity of these specific members being the problem (not just within NP either) and not anything/anyone else or the section alone.

Everything else here runs smoothly with plenty of top advice and support, that you should all keep doing as you have been. I'll confirm there's no problem with the Natural Parenting section specifically.

So please continue as you have done before.

x

I won't stop any replies but I will close it off later on so we can definitely move on with the positive support the ladies here are seeking and giving x


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## Pops

Thanks as always Wobbs. I for one really appreciate you taking the time to make that post :flower:

Hope you are having a better day today too :hugs:

xxx


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## Vici

Echo what Pops says x


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## TTC4No3

An explanation now, after the actions you took last night, well imo it isn't comforting to know we can just "continue as you have done before". Sorry but I for one was really shocked by your words in that thread (as u are an admin I expected a more calm approach to the conflicts), let alone the banning spree you went on without even sending out warnings or infractions to people. Members like Jetters should never have been banned and they will be greatly missed. Maybe I'll get banned too now for posting this but I can't just reply with a "Thank you Wobbles". What happened was totally out of hands, bad day or not for u it ended with it being a bad day for all the NP members.
I won't be able to post here again without thinking I'm walking on egg shells. That's all I've got to say, don't want to start any arguments but I needed these words to come out. Thks


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## moomoomum

Wow that's interesting because the small handful of ladies who were banned have been nothing but extremely helpful and just and right on with their facts and opinions. I feel that they have been judged by their slightly more radical parenting styles and that there are many other members that I have seen here that excercize their parenting styles just as intensely but they are not called upon because they fit in more with everyone elses styles. I have been lurking on this site for a while and I feel that their presence will be greatly missed and hopefully others will be able to carry on their spirit with similar point of views. We say so often that each baby and parent is different and yet I feel in this case itwasnt ok for them to be so different. 
I really do appreciate that you took the time to explain, wobbles, but it's not in the rules that I need to agree? I will not mention it again, though.


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## Wobbles

TTC4NO3;

Jetters account is active.

Spam is spam and the rules confirm that spamming may result in your account being banned.

We banned members who have been issued with infractions in the past in fact one of them had an account previously that was banned and asked for return ...is that not enough of a chance alone? There were problems with accounts past what you may see so interfering in those issues and the actions that were taken isn't really helpful (your guessing or taking other peoples words for it). 

Could you not assume or put the words into my mouth that people were banned by picking out where I stated I was having an off day because that's not the order I explained. I have a home and family to run too and I stated that until the decision of what was best was made I acted quickly without thinking and reopened shortly after taking the decision to deactivate accounts that were more than plenty brought to our attention and accounts that were under investigation. Accounts were deactivated with reason, good reason either from a long standing problem or breaking our TOS.


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## Wobbles

moomoomum;

I think you may have missed where I confirmed it wasn't just withing the NP section it just so happens most of their activity is within this section (which I didn't say most of their negative activity was within this section either).

Yes I found anothersquish mainly very helpful myself but helpful doesn't mend the times the account has had issues and warnings sent. You also seem to assume its just one thing and one section and not understand that it was an ongoing problem being monitored. I also didn't say that all issues were from this section, actually I will confirm it wasn't but as people were talking about the issues that have been within NP I did point out that it was other NP members reporting it.

It has nothing to do with difference :confused: I personally thought we were all parents doing things our own ways. It's not me who thinks anything else.


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## jen1604

moomoomum said:


> Wow that's interesting because the small handful of ladies who were banned have been nothing but extremely helpful and just and right on with their facts and opinions. .

I don't want to start an argument in this thread but I have to disagree,I've seen again and again some of the members that were banned making troublesome posts and putting people down.I myself have felt pretty crap after reading things some people have posted and I do a lot of 'natural parenting'.Maybe sometimes people who mostly post in natural parenting don't venture out of here and see posts that have been made in other sections? :shrug: ANYWAY,I had to say that but lets move past it..

Thanks for posting Wobbles,I understand why you did what you did but SO glad to have Natural Parenting back :happydance: 

Oh and hope you're having a better day today 

xxx


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## DueMarch2nd

not fair wobbles. you shouldnt call her by name.


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## StirCrazy

DueMarch2nd said:


> not fair wobbles. you shouldnt call her by name.

She used her username :shrug: Why not?


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## DueMarch2nd

its singling her out.


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## lfernie

Because we're not allowed to speak about banned members? :shrug:


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## enola

Agreed, we're not allowed to mention banned members by name.


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## TTC4No3

lfernie said:


> Because we're not allowed to speak about banned members? :shrug:

I guess the rules don't apply to those who make them; sigh


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## StirCrazy

Well that kinda defeats the purpose of this thread and it should be locked... or you can stop being petty and use the thread for what it is obviously intented.


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## Monkeh

lfernie said:


> Because we're not allowed to speak about banned members? :shrug:

:lol:

Exactly.


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## DueMarch2nd

StirCrazy said:


> Well that kinda defeats the purpose of this thread and it should be locked... or you can stop being petty and use the thread for what it is obviously intented.

for what? to say thanks and move on? some of us have a different opinion or is that frowned upon?


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## lfernie

I would just like to say that, I'm not sure I believe 90% of reported posts come from regular users of this section (mostly because most of them have been banned). I think that people need to stop being so offended by other opinions. For instance, someone I know has kittens and was trying to sell them I said, I'm not a cat person so wouldn't want one. She didn't fall out with me over or tell me how insulted she was that I didn't like cats because it's needless and if she did, she would be looking for an argument which is what most of the people who come here do. And people do feel the need to judge us because of our parenting tecniques (ie the 6 different people who all posted the same threads about how we were all going to suffocate our babies :dohh:). And it's threads from people outwith this section that I have seen most 'angst' from. And in all honesty, if people are happy whith their parenting decisions, why would they be upset by someone else?


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## mommyof3co

I know people are upset about certain members getting banned, as am I, but I think we need to remember to at least show a little respect to the admin. They take time out of their lives to do this and money out of their pockets. As an admin of a similar forum I know how much work goes into it, but mine isn't nearly this big so it's even more of the issues....it takes a lot of work. If they feel it's ok to break the rules for the purpose of explaining themselves then so bit. I for one am glad Wobbles at least took some time to explain why she chose to do what she did.


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## Lisa1302

Well personally I think Wobbles post is fair enough - the general users on a forum do not see the whole picture - the admins do because every time users are involved in unpleasantness it is flagged to them - chances that us users see that all the time is very slim. 

Some users simply push and push the boundaries til it gets to the point where its not acceptable and a ban is the only way to stop them. It happens on every forum because there are always people who think their opinion is worth more than someone elses.


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## StirCrazy

DueMarch2nd said:


> StirCrazy said:
> 
> 
> Well that kinda defeats the purpose of this thread and it should be locked... or you can stop being petty and use the thread for what it is obviously intented.
> 
> for what? to say thanks and move on? some of us have a different opinion or is that frowned upon?Click to expand...

and you have voiced those opinions... now either you accept what has happened (along with Wobbles explaination) or you don't and move on.


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## Pops

I don't ever normally get involved in threads like this but I am going to this time as I have sat back and watched yesterday and today unfold into something I don't much like.

Wobbs and SC give a lot of time and energy to this entire forum and they run it really well with a team of Mods who do work that we have no idea about to protect us from all sorts of liars and people looking to cause trouble. They don't go around looking for thanks for it, they simply just do it which I again, am truly grateful for.

The rules are clearly there for everyone to see when they join and if other people are complaining about certain members or posts, what are the Mods expected to do? Of course they have to deal with it. Now, that may sometimes include friends that we have made on here but put the boot on the other foot - if you ever complain about someone, that is also someones friend so would you not want it dealt with? Of course you would.

I think it is a real shame that once again, a post that was well meant has turned into a debate over the rights and wrongs of how someone chooses to run THEIR forum.

I personally like it in here and would hate to see it closed down as I know would many others so I am genuinely grateful that Wobbs opened it again.

I'll probably get jumped on now too but there you go.....

xxx


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## Twiglet

lfernie said:


> I would just like to say that, I'm not sure I believe 90% of reported posts come from regular users of this section (mostly because most of them have been banned). I think that people need to stop being so offended by other opinions. *For instance, someone I know has kittens and was trying to sell them I said, I'm not a cat person so wouldn't want one*. She didn't fall out with me over or tell me how insulted she was that I didn't like cats because it's needless and if she did, she would be looking for an argument which is what most of the people who come here do. And people do feel the need to judge us because of our parenting tecniques (ie the 6 different people who all posted the same threads about how we were all going to suffocate our babies :dohh:). And it's threads from people outwith this section that I have seen most 'angst' from. And in all honesty, if people are happy whith their parenting decisions, why would they be upset by someone else?

BTW, I do still have two kittens to sell :haha: 

Am glad NP is back up.


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## Kit

I am very uncomfortable about the idea that a whole section was closed down because of problems with a particular thread or because of the activity of a small number of members - I am not commenting on what that activity was as I have no idea.
There have been various threads in other sections that have contained offensive posts and posts by members who regularly contribute to the closure of threads by persisting in posting offensive material. These threads have simply been closed and, I am guessing, members warned.
As a regular poster in this section I now feel as though I am somehow part of some unruly minority that is here under sufferance. There have been some posts/threads/signatures in other sections recently that were blatantly intended as a dig at those who follow the various practices discussed in the NP section - and those threads were allowed to run their course. By closing a whole section off the back of a heated thread (and I hear what you say about other factors but people will probably tend to see it as heated thread = closure of section) I feel that a message has been sent out that it is acceptable to make digs at NP type practices but not acceptable for anyone one the NP side of one of those practices to make any sort of negative comment in the opposite direction.
I am a strong believer in courtesy, adult debate and freedom of choice - but I do feel that the courtesy that is expected of members active in the NP section towards those who stick mainly to the babyclub section, is not necessarily present in the opposite direction if you see what I mean.
The closure has happened and it can't be undone, but it has changed the whole feel of this section for me.


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## lfernie

LOL you sniffed me out Chelle, hope you don't mind me using you as an example, just the first thing that popped in to me head :)


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## faun

I don't post in here really but i do read loads of the posts here and across the rest of the forum. Its a shame that we have lost some members but i have seen how upsetting some comments from a couple of these banned members made in OTHER parts of the forum have been to people. I would rather loose a couple of people then loose a whole section on natural parenting, so thanks Wobbles for making IMO the right decision.
P.S. please don't hate me :)


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## Serene123

I was back for a matter of hours after moving home and having to have a bnb break before I noticed a number of those girls putting people down and making myself (and I'm sure others) feel inferior.

Arguing with Admin and then saying something riduclous like "are you going to ban me now?" is stupid! It makes you look like an idiot to be honest. MOST people on here know it takes a lot for a member to be banned.


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## Wobbles

Kit;

I made a mistake although it was for a short period I acted on instinct what I thought was right at the time and think about what next ...at some point we have all been guilty of what seemed best at the time maybe wasn't. I admitted in the start of this thread that brain was second. Whist juggling a forum of thousands, own problems, own down days, home & 2 young children I am only human to make them. With that considered I hope in time you accept with some understanding my explanation and do not feel the use of NP is any different. Honest it could have been the same topic any where on the forum.

If you see any content on the forum that you see as offensive please report it, it's simply impossible to see them all and the same for signatures they are not to be used to make digs I simply hate it when people do this.


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## leighbaby

Why all the digs at the closure??? It was closed for a few hours...so what? Wobbles has explained that she needed to think about it and to me that is fair enough. We all need time to make sensible decisions. We ALL also make quick decisions that we change.

Get off your high horses and give the mods a break!!! like it has been said before - they give up so much time to make sure it all runs nicely for the rest of us and look out for us. So chill out!


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## buttonnose82

OK I kept my mouth shut ...... which take alot some times lol even surprise myself at times!

but

IMHO

This is getting all rather childish and pathetic now, neither sides are going to agree, so why not just agree to disagree and move on

Seriously there are more important things to think about in life than fighting over something that happened on a forum, yes it is just a forum at the end of the day, yesterday while these arguments were going on, there were people in cumbria being told their loved ones had been shot dead ...... really puts things into prespective


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## lfernie

I think the reason we don't report other things is because instead of getting on our high horse about them,we just leave people to it. Their kids, their lives up them what they do IMO. If someone says I don't pick my baby up every time he/she cries I think it's OK to let them cry it out and don't like picking them up all the time. I don't jump in and say well, that means that I'm wrong for picking my baby up and your out of order and should be thinking of others feeling. I think meh, that's up to them and leave them to it. I wish the same coutesy would be extended. If someone said I hate cloth nappies I wouldn't care either cos it's nothing to do with me :shrug:


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## Serene123

lfernie said:


> I think the reason we don't report other things is because instead of getting on our high horse about them,we just leave people to it. Their kids, their lives up them what they do IMO. If someone says I don't pick my baby up every time he/she cries I think it's OK to let them cry it out and don't like picking them up all the time. I don't jump in and say well, that means that I'm wrong for picking my baby up and your out of order and should be thinking of others feeling. I think meh, that's up to them and them to it. I wisjh the same coutesy would be extended. If someone said I hate cloth nappies I wouldn't care either cos it's nothing to do with me :shrug:

But, if someone said I hate cloth nappies because cloth nappy babies smell like wee, get sore bums, and I don't know, for examples sake, get autism! You wouldn't even be a little peeved at them saying your baby smells, is going to get a sore bum and could get autism when all of the above ARE NOT TRUE?


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## henny

i think people came into the np forum just to cause trouble, so people should just butt out of it and mind their own business and get on with things.


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## Wobbles

Buttonnose;

I understand what your saying but whist we say nothing at all people create their own stories (and have been). So putting up an explanation without locking it (or we'd be slammed for that lol) is quite helpful and sets a couple of things straight.

x


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## Lu28

Serene123 said:


> MOST people on here know it takes a lot for a member to be banned.

Honestly I don't think that's the case for alot of us here. I for one feel as though I'm walking on eggshells because if I disagree, my fate will be the same as the others. I was under the impression that this thread was started in order to allow some debate on what went on yesterday so there could be some level of understanding but to be perfectly honest, I have been keeping an eye on the thread and have not felt comfortable posting in case it means the end of my BnB membership. I have a number of non NP friends on this site and don't want to lose track of them.


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## Twiglet

I'm fine with the kitten example...now you sure you dont want one? Anyone? :haha:

Toria I dont think anyone was aiming to make you feel inferior, I used disposables at night till a few nights ago...and once you have used cloth you do notice that sposies have a smell. Still didn't put me off using them though :shrug: I'm not aiming to bring up the whole issue again though.


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## Twiglet

Oh and I dont mind if someone says cloth smells as sometimes it does.


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## Lisa1302

lfernie said:


> I think the reason we don't report other things is because instead of getting on our high horse about them,we just leave people to it. Their kids, their lives up them what they do IMO. If someone says I don't pick my baby up every time he/she cries I think it's OK to let them cry it out and don't like picking them up all the time. I don't jump in and say well, that means that I'm wrong for picking my baby up and your out of order and should be thinking of others feeling. I think meh, that's up to them and them to it. I wisjh the same coutesy would be extended. If someone said I hate cloth nappies I wouldn't care either cos it's nothing to do with me :shrug:

You don't know what other people find offensive though - everyone is different, what you can ignore others can not - a forum cant just allow people to say what they like no matter who it offends in the hope that anyone who is offended will simply ignore it! 

I do spend a fair amount of time reading the NP forum and I really do not get the people who claim that they are victims of the non NP forum members picking on them - if I am completly honest i will say that sometimes it feels a little bit the other way around - that some folk, some of who aren't here, posted in a manner that came across of rather superior. Almost laughing at anyone's reasoning for not using NP methods.


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## Lu28

Serene123 said:


> lfernie said:
> 
> 
> I think the reason we don't report other things is because instead of getting on our high horse about them,we just leave people to it. Their kids, their lives up them what they do IMO. If someone says I don't pick my baby up every time he/she cries I think it's OK to let them cry it out and don't like picking them up all the time. I don't jump in and say well, that means that I'm wrong for picking my baby up and your out of order and should be thinking of others feeling. I think meh, that's up to them and them to it. I wisjh the same coutesy would be extended. If someone said I hate cloth nappies I wouldn't care either cos it's nothing to do with me :shrug:
> 
> But, if someone said I hate cloth nappies because cloth nappy babies smell like wee, get sore bums, and I don't know, for examples sake, get autism! You wouldn't even be a little peeved at them saying your baby smells, is going to get a sore bum and could get autism when all of the above ARE NOT TRUE?Click to expand...

I don't think any of us would be peeved because as you say all the abobve are not true! We're grown up enough to see something which to us is ridiculous, sigh, and move on.


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## Serene123

Lu28 said:


> Serene123 said:
> 
> 
> MOST people on here know it takes a lot for a member to be banned.
> 
> Honestly I don't think that's the case for alot of us here. I for one feel as though I'm walking on eggshells because if I disagree, my fate will be the same as the others. I was under the impression that this thread was started in order to allow some debate on what went on yesterday so there could be some level of understanding but to be perfectly honest, I have been keeping an eye on the thread and have not felt comfortable posting in case it means the end of my BnB membership. I have a number of non NP friends on this site and don't want to lose track of them.Click to expand...

I hear what you're saying, but you can have your own opinion on things without belittling people if that makes sense. There are millions of ways of wording things and sometimes people just have abrupt and insensitive approaches to most things....

I'm not trying to argue I just don't think you should be worried if you're a nice person x


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## lfernie

Serene123 said:


> lfernie said:
> 
> 
> I think the reason we don't report other things is because instead of getting on our high horse about them,we just leave people to it. Their kids, their lives up them what they do IMO. If someone says I don't pick my baby up every time he/she cries I think it's OK to let them cry it out and don't like picking them up all the time. I don't jump in and say well, that means that I'm wrong for picking my baby up and your out of order and should be thinking of others feeling. I think meh, that's up to them and them to it. I wisjh the same coutesy would be extended. If someone said I hate cloth nappies I wouldn't care either cos it's nothing to do with me :shrug:
> 
> But, if someone said I hate cloth nappies because cloth nappy babies smell like wee, get sore bums, and I don't know, for examples sake, get autism! You wouldn't even be a little peeved at them saying your baby smells, is going to get a sore bum and could get autism when all of the above ARE NOT TRUE?Click to expand...

Like I said before, nothing to do with me and if something that I was doing with my baby was linked to Autism, I would be reading up on it and rethinking my parenting tecniques

And disposable nappies do stink, mostly because of wee mixed with chemicals but I'm not saying cloth doesn't


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## Wobbles

Lu28 said:


> Serene123 said:
> 
> 
> MOST people on here know it takes a lot for a member to be banned.
> 
> Honestly I don't think that's the case for alot of us here. I for one feel as though I'm walking on eggshells because if I disagree, my fate will be the same as the others. I was under the impression that this thread was started in order to allow some debate on what went on yesterday so there could be some level of understanding but to be perfectly honest, I have been keeping an eye on the thread and have not felt comfortable posting in case it means the end of my BnB membership. I have a number of non NP friends on this site and don't want to lose track of them.Click to expand...

NP or non NP it really doesn't matter :wacko: that's not what this is about, just so happens to have ended from this section. Neither is their parenting methods related to any bans. 

I have friends in the NP too (some from real life) so it makes no difference.


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## henny

Lo has to use sposies at night and they do smell but at times so does cloth nappies. I dont like the fact that it was an innocent comment that was made and then someone has to came along and cause trouble.


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## Tiff

I do think sometimes that the tone of someone's thoughts are very hard to interpret reading through text. There have been so many times that if I didn't have smilies plastered all over my posts to show that I wasn't upset people thought that I was... if that makes sense?

So I'm sure there have been miscommunication between someone thinking that a person was being mean when they weren't intending to be, iykwim?

:)


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## buttonnose82

I know what you mean tiff, it is difficult to know exactly what someone means when it is just 'words on a screen' i think thats my sometimes i over use smilies lol


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## DueMarch2nd

thats just it... the thread was disrupted by a non np person and i know it was a long time coming so it seems but it is a section for like minded people with similar opinions so i think we should be allowed to sat that WE think cloth is better or bfing is better or whatever. its our opinion and most here in np agree


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## Lu28

Wobbles said:


> Lu28 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Serene123 said:
> 
> 
> MOST people on here know it takes a lot for a member to be banned.
> 
> Honestly I don't think that's the case for alot of us here. I for one feel as though I'm walking on eggshells because if I disagree, my fate will be the same as the others. I was under the impression that this thread was started in order to allow some debate on what went on yesterday so there could be some level of understanding but to be perfectly honest, I have been keeping an eye on the thread and have not felt comfortable posting in case it means the end of my BnB membership. I have a number of non NP friends on this site and don't want to lose track of them.Click to expand...
> 
> NP or non NP it really doesn't matter :wacko: that's not what this is about, just so happens to have ended from this section. Neither is their parenting methods related to any bans.
> 
> I have friends in the NP too (some from real life) so it makes no difference.Click to expand...

My point was that I have other ways of staying in touch with my NP friends but tend to keep track of my non NP friends here.


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## Wobbles

You concentrating on one thread from your view but it's not about one thread one view.

Regarding the members who have had their accounts deactivated I think thats the last I will comment on the matter or it goes round and round in circles.

:)


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## aob1013

There's no harm in saying cloth is better etc, if you put it across nicely. I think sometimes it is just how something is worded - that's where people take offence.

Somebody said they would laugh/make a comment about someone buying cheap chicken is mean - just no need for it.

Anyway, thank you for keeping it open as I think when Leni comes I will be using this forum x


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## Wobbles

Lu28;

Ah sorry for misunderstanding.

People seem to be under the impression it's just those who may use NP that are banned though and that's most definitely false. People have grouped a couple of friends who happen to use the section to looking like those who NP should be careful of their membership, which is wrong in more than one way (although I am not saying you personally there).


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## lfernie

The reason for that person commenting on cheap chicken is because she has a history of working with battery hens and see's how they are treated and it's animal cruelty IMO. You wouldn't keep a dog like. Hence why she said it's scummy because she know what these animals have been through and to be honest in this day and age we should all know where food we eat comes from.


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## Wobbles

People also live within their means.


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## Lisa1302

Exactly - some people can not afford anything but that - they should not be laughed at or looked down at.


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## lfernie

Yes but that was obviously something close to home for her :shrug: or is that opinion not allowed? You see this is where the line is blurred, she cannot take offence to someone buying chicken which has been kept in a cage it's whole life but others can take offence when someone say nappies stink :confused:


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## xxxjacxxx

Lisa1302 said:


> lfernie said:
> 
> 
> I think the reason we don't report other things is because instead of getting on our high horse about them,we just leave people to it. Their kids, their lives up them what they do IMO. If someone says I don't pick my baby up every time he/she cries I think it's OK to let them cry it out and don't like picking them up all the time. I don't jump in and say well, that means that I'm wrong for picking my baby up and your out of order and should be thinking of others feeling. I think meh, that's up to them and them to it. I wisjh the same coutesy would be extended. If someone said I hate cloth nappies I wouldn't care either cos it's nothing to do with me :shrug:
> 
> You don't know what other people find offensive though - everyone is different, what you can ignore others can not - a forum cant just allow people to say what they like no matter who it offends in the hope that anyone who is offended will simply ignore it!
> 
> I do spend a fair amount of time reading the NP forum and I really do not get the people who claim that they are victims of the non NP forum members picking on them - if I am completly honest i will say that sometimes it feels a little bit the other way around - that some folk, some of who aren't here, posted in a manner that came across of rather superior. Almost laughing at anyone's reasoning for not using NP methods.Click to expand...

At the end of the day, we all are mothers, we are all grown adults, we all want the very best for our children...as long as they are happy and healthy who cares what they wear on their butts? 

I started off using cloth and I loved it, but for the sheer mass of washing it created I gave up and went over to sposies,(am just dipping my toe back into cloth again) I don't care what other peoples opinions are on my parenting ways, and I don't really care about theirs...its their choice, just as it is mine. 

My point is, we all have different idea's and people coming into here should respect that, we all have opinions and we all think we are doing the best for our kids...why kick up a fuss about it? Why knock others down because its not your way?:shrug: 
No we cant all ignore comments that put us down but to literally shove their beliefs/ways down others throats on a daily basis is not acceptable. 

Wobbles has explained herself, theres nothing more she can do, so please just accept it and move on (no you dont have to reply with 'thanks wobbs!' if you don't want to).:winkwink:


----------



## jen1604

Please lets not get back in to the chicken debate or why the chicken debate happened? People have been banned for good reasons,lets leave it all in the past and move forward? :flower: 

This is making my head hurt today. :dohh: 

xxxxx


----------



## enola

lfernie said:


> Yes but that was obviously something close to home for her :shrug: or is that opinion not allowed? You see this is where the line is blurred, she cannot take offence to someone buying chicken which has been kept in a cage it's whole life but others can take offence when someone say nappies stink :confused:

Agreed - this is what others have meant when they have stated that they feel there is 'one rule for one and one for another'. It's confusing to only seemingly randomly enforce certain rules and leaves us with this sense of trepidation that at any minute our passion for the way we parent our own children will cause us to be silenced. 

We are already in the minority in real life, thus a sense of solace builds in these sort of forums and, as such, if our community feels attacked we naturally defend not only our beliefs but our friends, too. 

Regardless of reasoning, the shape of the section has now changed due to holes created in haste and bitterness and it will most likely not be the same friendly corner for advice it once was. 

I am thankful that it existed once as it was, and will miss it greatly...or I would, were there not another way...


----------



## DueMarch2nd

enola said:


> lfernie said:
> 
> 
> Yes but that was obviously something close to home for her :shrug: or is that opinion not allowed? You see this is where the line is blurred, she cannot take offence to someone buying chicken which has been kept in a cage it's whole life but others can take offence when someone say nappies stink :confused:
> 
> Agreed - this is what others have meant when they have stated that they feel there is 'one rule for one and one for another'. It's confusing to only seemingly randomly enforce certain rules and leaves us with this sense of trepidation that at any minute our passion for the way we parent our own children will cause us to be silenced.
> 
> We are already in the minority in real life, thus a sense of solace builds in these sort of forums and, as such, if our community feels attacked we naturally defend not only our beliefs but our friends, too.
> 
> Regardless of reasoning, the shape of the section has now changed due to holes created in haste and bitterness and it will most likely not be the same friendly corner for advice it once was.
> 
> I am thankful that it existed once as it was, and will miss it greatly...or I would, were there not another way...Click to expand...

i feel the same!:thumbup:


----------



## Lisa1302

enola said:


> lfernie said:
> 
> 
> Yes but that was obviously something close to home for her :shrug: or is that opinion not allowed? You see this is where the line is blurred, she cannot take offence to someone buying chicken which has been kept in a cage it's whole life but others can take offence when someone say nappies stink :confused:
> 
> Agreed - this is what others have meant when they have stated that they feel there is 'one rule for one and one for another'. It's confusing to only seemingly randomly enforce certain rules and leaves us with this sense of trepidation that at any minute our passion for the way we parent our own children will cause us to be silenced.
> 
> We are already in the minority in real life, thus a sense of solace builds in these sort of forums and, as such, if our community feels attacked we naturally defend not only our beliefs but our friends, too.
> 
> *Regardless of reasoning, the shape of the section has now changed due to holes created in haste and bitterness and it will most likely not be the same friendly corner for advice it once was. *
> 
> I am thankful that it existed once as it was, and will miss it greatly...or I would, were there not another way...Click to expand...

That's bit harsh - the banned members were not the only ones giving advice, and there are lots of friendly people here who have great advice to share.

There are plenty of folk who will not miss the banned members, others that will - that doesn't mean the forum cant move on and be just as successful as it has been - it didn't (contrary to their belief) revolve around them and their opinions. 

I really cant see why people are assuming the forum is now doomed after the loss of a few members and the 1 hour closure!


----------



## Vici

O good lord, they hate the place (apart from NP and maybe a couple of other sections), slag off how it's run, 9 times out of 10 don't think about others feelings and then continue to moan for days on end about being banned because they can't get on said forum!! Life goes on!! Any generated bitterness will only come from the people using the section who IMO are not ones who I'd want around anyway!! This forum is owned an run by a group of people who do it for free and IMO if you don't like it, you know where that little red cross is in the corner of your screen!!


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## DueMarch2nd

Not doomed, just not the same and never can be. Watch threads fall down the board with hardly any answers


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## lfernie

We're not just talking about 3 people gone from this section. It's the main staple

Kirsten
JayleighAnn
Boltonlass
Shifter
Purplesocks
Sezzlebum
FemmeEnceinte
Anothersquish
Bekkiboo
Jetters (for a period, another hasty decision)

and probably couple more I can't think of from the top of my head. Sorry for breaking the rules but I think people should understand the enormity of this 'cull'.

And all of those mentioned above are lovely girls and a lot of them I have found great advice in. So sorry that I'm not thankful that the same admin team that see fit to close a full section open it again and expect everyone to just get on with it.

Whether they like it or not people still have a bitter taste in their mouth about the whole debaucle and they have every right.


----------



## henny

what happened to lovebunny? :shrug:


----------



## bubbles

there are 2 names on there I didn't even know had been banned :shock:

henny LB was banned a while ago along with jayleighAnn and Kirsten


----------



## lfernie

She got banned too!


----------



## Wobbles

They are the ONLY members banned or just the ones your pointed out as your friends?

I refuse to sit here and explain every one of those reasons all done rightfully. A handful of those name 1/3 threw ABUSE around the forum directly, purposely and in hope to upset and YOU have a bitter taste in your mouth? Wow sorry the abuse offended you.

Bekki - Didn't she request closure? (Edit - She did)

2 of those names yesterday

Jetters - As she is ok with me through private contact why are you making it an issue?


----------



## Wobbles

lfernie said:


> She got banned too!

With good reason, yes she did.


----------



## lfernie

Whatever, I'm out. Please deactivate my account and delete of my posts and photo's. This isn't the same forum I joined and yes they are my friends but you have only chosen to respond to that and not the other valid arguments I have made previously.

I'm grateful to the forum for the friends that I have made so Thanks for that!


----------



## henny

perhaps signatures should be banned as people could be offended by people saying there Lo is bf or wearing cloth nappies.


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## Dream.A.Dream

Okay, I'm only new to this section put thought I'd put my opinion out there. 

Firstly, PLEASE can people in here try to remember that not everyone in NP breastfeeds! That has been implied numerous times in this thread. 

With regards to the chicken thing, not everyone will be aware of the background of the person who made that comment. I wasn't aware until later and as such when I read the intial post it seemed to come across as very snobby and holier-than-thou. 

I have been a member on this forum a long time and prior to posting in this section I have had a clash of opinions with those banned members numerous times. On a few occasions they have deeply upset me. When I came in this section they seemed like totally different people and I was amazed how nice they were. If you're a regular user of this section but tend not to venture out much, or you do share their views, then you may be unaware how they can seem to others until you "know" them if you see what I mean? 

I personally am very pleased Wobbles has reopened the section, we should try to appreciate that people have bad days, could all of you honestly put your hands on your hearts and say your work has never ever once suffered due to you having a bad day?! (And the mods here don't even get paid). 

I think that's all I wanted to say. 

Hopefully the section can continue to be the friendly place it was. 

xx


----------



## Rachel_C

I do find it very sad that the longer people hang around in NP, the more they tend to feel like admin, mods and members who hang around places like Baby Club are out to get them. If you look at the people who are defending recent events/actions, it tends to be members who are newer in NP that find it all fine and dandy. Of course, that is a generalisation but I do see a pattern. Yes, I know there are established NP members who also defend what happened, but I see them as being the exception rather than the rule.

One thing about this forum costing a lot of money to run etc so we should all be extra grateful that it exists...well, isn't it ad supported? I was under the impression that ads are paid for and I assumed that there was at least a small element of profit involved in running the forum (obviously not for unpaid mods, but for owners). If the forum doesn't generate profit, I would think something is going wrong somewhere.


----------



## StirCrazy

lfernie said:


> We're not just talking about 3 people gone from this section. It's the main staple
> 
> Kirsten
> JayleighAnn
> Boltonlass
> Shifter
> Purplesocks
> Sezzlebum
> FemmeEnceinte
> Anothersquish
> Bekkiboo
> Jetters (for a period, another hasty decision)
> 
> and probably couple more I can't think of from the top of my head. Sorry for breaking the rules but I think people should understand the enormity of this 'cull'.
> 
> And all of those mentioned above are lovely girls and a lot of them I have found great advice in. So sorry that I'm not thankful that the same admin team that see fit to close a full section open it again and expect everyone to just get on with it.
> 
> Whether they like it or not people still have a bitter taste in their mouth about the whole debaucle and they have every right.

All individual cases, all banned for very good reasons, none banned solely on activity in NP and all none of your business!! You think "people should understand the enormity" of your *limited* knowledge of what actually happened (yes I'm sure they bigged themselves when they traded embellished stories, trying to out do the last about just how bad and unfair we are :(). If you don't like it then leave... we aren't the only forum on the net, nothing is stoping you from just going 'see ya'. You don't have to be banned to do that.

Truth is you will never know exactly what happens behind each case, and BnB has thrived after each ban. I think people forget that a year ago this forum wasn't even here... and we were fine then, just like we are now.


----------



## buttonnose82

why don't we just all remember ..... opinions are like arse holes ..... we all have them, nothing out there to say who is right and whole is wrong here, lets just get over it and carry on :)

oh and beside I am happy because we booked out honeymoon today:flasher:to you all!!!




:blush: sorry:blush:


----------



## Wobbles

Your bringing up a list of banned members like it was done for no reason just for the sake of it and 4 of those at least threw HORRID abuse around the forum and our sister site. slagging the mods personal features, calling my OH a c***, me a lazy junkie bitch- A rather large personal attack.

If you want to share the whole story I of course do not mind but come on you surely don't expect me to sit back and watch people read like it was done 'just because'. Thats not what happened.


----------



## leighbaby

lfernie said:


> We're not just talking about 3 people gone from this section. It's the main staple
> 
> Kirsten
> JayleighAnn
> Boltonlass
> Shifter
> Purplesocks
> Sezzlebum
> FemmeEnceinte
> Anothersquish
> Bekkiboo
> Jetters (for a period, another hasty decision)
> 
> and probably couple more I can't think of from the top of my head. Sorry for breaking the rules but I think people should understand the enormity of this 'cull'.
> 
> And all of those mentioned above are lovely girls and a lot of them I have found great advice in. So sorry that I'm not thankful that the same admin team that see fit to close a full section open it again and expect everyone to just get on with it.
> 
> Whether they like it or not people still have a bitter taste in their mouth about the whole debaucle and they have every right.

I imagine that there are 100's of others that have been banned for the same reasons as those above, why isn't a fuss kicked up about those?!! because, just maybe, all the focus is on NP?? 10 or so members is a teeny weeny proportions of the whole members count. 

And it has been pointed out on numerous threads that have ended in closure - members are banned for flouting rules regularly. Just because someone gives good advice and seems lovely, it doesn't mean they can pick and choose which rules they adhere to.


----------



## Serene123

henny said:


> perhaps signatures should be banned as people could be offended by people saying there Lo is bf or wearing cloth nappies.

Oh please!! The fact you even said that means you don't get ANYTHING that's being said in this thread :dohh:

It's not what you do, or what you think, it's what you say and how you say it.


----------



## Lisa1302

Serene123 said:


> henny said:
> 
> 
> perhaps signatures should be banned as people could be offended by people saying there Lo is bf or wearing cloth nappies.
> 
> Oh please!! The fact you even said that means you don't get ANYTHING that's being said in this thread :dohh:
> 
> It's not what you do, or what you think, it's what you say and how you say it.Click to expand...

Some people appear to be just trolling - they are all talking about it on the 'other forum' - pathetic really that they even had to hide the thread :haha:


----------



## Twiglet

Is this still going on? :wacko: 

Firstly, I'm great friends with some of those that have been banned and some that remain...and the only thing I do that is considered "natural" is using cloth nappies...and I use them cause they're pretty [don't hate me for that reason! :haha: ] I formula feed, I give my baby chocolate, immunise, used sposies at night, TW until I switched to BLW at 7.5 months...and yet I feel welcome here? 

Secondly, I am in no way sticking up for Admin here as I dont think they need sticking up for but can we remember that someone that they're close to has just lost her second baby in less than a year...so as much as the closure of NP did annoy me yesterday, I can forgive that as rash decisions are made when one is upset.

Thirdly, no one want a kitten? :haha: they're cute :haha:

But overall, if you dont wanna use the forum, dont? If you do, do. I dont think anything is going to be achieved by this thread going around and around in circles.


----------



## Monkeh

Wobbles said:


> Bekki - Didn't she request closure? (Edit - She did)

Bekki requested closure whilst she sorted out personal issues and it was her understanding it wasn't permanent. She has now been banned after asking for her account to be re-activated because she spoke about it on another forum.

If banning people for activities outwith the forums is a good reason, why aren't those who were abusive on fb towards other bnb mummies yesterday after a bnb meet being banned?


----------



## henny

be careful, i might get offended by what you said!


----------



## Twiglet

P.S the mother is in my avatar ;)


----------



## Serene123

Stop tempting me Twiglet!


----------



## Rachel_C

Wobbles said:


> Bekki - Didn't she request closure? (Edit - She did)

I'm pretty sure Bekki requested a temporary account closure while she sorted through some personal issues. I think she has recently requested that her account be reactivated but it hasn't been. An oversight perhaps?

Edit: Doh, should read to the end before posting!


----------



## Lisa1302

Monkeh said:


> Wobbles said:
> 
> 
> Bekki - Didn't she request closure? (Edit - She did)
> 
> Bekki requested closure whilst she sorted out personal issues and it was her understanding it wasn't permanent. She has now been banned after asking for her account to be re-activated because she spoke about it on another forum.
> 
> If banning people for activities outwith the forums is a good reason, why aren't those who were abusive on fb towards other bnb mummies yesterday after a bnb meet being banned?Click to expand...

hahah this is hilarious - - it was all over FB and she got caught out - she only wanted back in so she could cause a scene for her 'other' buddies! 
She then spat her dummy out because her plan was transparent!


----------



## henny

Serene123 said:


> henny said:
> 
> 
> perhaps signatures should be banned as people could be offended by people saying there Lo is bf or wearing cloth nappies.
> 
> Oh please!! The fact you even said that means you don't get ANYTHING that's being said in this thread :dohh:
> 
> It's not what you do, or what you think, it's what you say and how you say it.Click to expand...

be careful, i might get offended.


----------



## xerinx

In my humble opinion what has happened has happened im sure there were good reasons why people were banned. Lets just move on and continue to use this forum as its intended for! 

People have different opinions and there is nothing you ca do about that just accept that everyone is different and thats what makes us human!


----------



## Wobbles

Rachel_C said:


> I do find it very sad that the longer people hang around in NP, the more they tend to feel like admin, mods and members who hang around places like Baby Club are out to get them.

I don't hang around any of the sections and haven't for some time :wacko: I act on the reports and member questions with general running of the site, most times behind the scene so it is likely people only see me when there is a problem (90% of the time).


----------



## lfernie

StirCrazy said:


> lfernie said:
> 
> 
> We're not just talking about 3 people gone from this section. It's the main staple
> 
> Kirsten
> JayleighAnn
> Boltonlass
> Shifter
> Purplesocks
> Sezzlebum
> FemmeEnceinte
> Anothersquish
> Bekkiboo
> Jetters (for a period, another hasty decision)
> 
> and probably couple more I can't think of from the top of my head. Sorry for breaking the rules but I think people should understand the enormity of this 'cull'.
> 
> And all of those mentioned above are lovely girls and a lot of them I have found great advice in. So sorry that I'm not thankful that the same admin team that see fit to close a full section open it again and expect everyone to just get on with it.
> 
> Whether they like it or not people still have a bitter taste in their mouth about the whole debaucle and they have every right.
> 
> All individual cases, all banned for very good reasons, none banned solely on activity in NP and all none of your business!! You think "people should understand the enormity" of your *limited* knowledge of what actually happened (yes I'm sure they bigged themselves when they traded embellished stories, trying to out do the last about just how bad and unfair we are :(). If you don't like it then leave... we aren't the only forum on the net, nothing is stoping you from just going 'see ya'. You don't have to be banned to do that.
> 
> Truth is you will never know exactly what happens behind each case, and BnB has thrived after each ban. I think people forget that a year ago this forum wasn't even here... and we were fine then, just like we are now.Click to expand...

It's fine, no hard feelings. This just isn't something I want to be a part of anymore unfortunatley. So, as I said before I would just appreciate that my posts and photo's are deleted and I'll be on my merry way. Again, thanks for the friends I've gained.


----------



## mommyof3co

Rachel_C said:


> I do find it very sad that the longer people hang around in NP, the more they tend to feel like admin, mods and members who hang around places like Baby Club are out to get them. If you look at the people who are defending recent events/actions, it tends to be members who are newer in NP that find it all fine and dandy. Of course, that is a generalisation but I do see a pattern. Yes, I know there are established NP members who also defend what happened, but I see them as being the exception rather than the rule.
> 
> One thing about this forum costing a lot of money to run etc so we should all be extra grateful that it exists...well, isn't it ad supported? I was under the impression that ads are paid for and I assumed that there was at least a small element of profit involved in running the forum (obviously not for unpaid mods, but for owners). If the forum doesn't generate profit, I would think something is going wrong somewhere.

They may be doing more than us but our ads don't pay for much at all and between forum upgrades (we run the same software), mods to add more features, hosting and more no ads don't even come close to paying for it. We ended up taking all of our ads off because it wasn't even worth it and there were ones we didn't like, so just to make it more pleasant. We don't do it for the profit/money...there really is none. It's done because we want to. Of course it could be different for Wobbs and SC but I would have to assume they aren't making much if anything at all and it takes a lot of time for little to nothing in return. 

I'm not defending what was done, I too am sad to see those members gone. I don't know all that was involved in banning them, but doesn't change that I think the admin deserve respect and if they feel this was best for the overall forum I'm sure they have their reasons. I'm glad that they decided to keep this section of the forum open as I feel most comfortable posting here...as others have said in life and most other areas we feel like outsiders, it's nice to have a place where most believe the same things we do


----------



## Serene123

henny said:


> Serene123 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> henny said:
> 
> 
> perhaps signatures should be banned as people could be offended by people saying there Lo is bf or wearing cloth nappies.
> 
> Oh please!! The fact you even said that means you don't get ANYTHING that's being said in this thread :dohh:
> 
> It's not what you do, or what you think, it's what you say and how you say it.Click to expand...
> 
> be careful, i might get offended.Click to expand...

Please point out which part of that was offensive?


----------



## Jetters

Ack, messy messy. 

Things have changed- end of. This section wont be like it was, with such long standing members gone (and yes i'm still here btw, my situation was different from the rest and has been sorted out with Wobbles), but it will continue. That in itself is a good thing. As a minority as natural parenters, we _need _a place and there are still some of us remaining- So if you're choosing to remain, remain properly, move on, lets build something new. It is sad and messy and horrible how things have ended up here, but to be completely honest I think it was a long time brewing. 


FTR I am glad this section is here, I am bloody glad some of those banned members were here once to help me out, and I am also glad the internet is big enough that they can now exist elsewhere. I am not a fence sitter, I'm simply seeing this situation for what it is now- crap, a bit lose lose, but nothing is going to change from all these circles people are running around in. 

*grand sigh*


----------



## StirCrazy

Monkeh said:


> Wobbles said:
> 
> 
> Bekki - Didn't she request closure? (Edit - She did)
> 
> Bekki requested closure whilst she sorted out personal issues and it was her understanding it wasn't permanent. She has now been banned after asking for her account to be re-activated because she spoke about it on another forum.
> 
> If banning people for activities outwith the forums is a good reason, why aren't those who were abusive on fb towards other bnb mummies yesterday after a bnb meet being banned?Click to expand...

You are actually condoning someone saying that they wanted their account reopened so they can troll and flame threads on BnB (regardless of where they said it)? Yes, sorry, excuse me while I ignore you (I don't know why I didn't greet her with open arms... naughty me). Besides you're obviously here to do that on her behalf :wacko:


----------



## Kit

Vici said:


> O good lord, they hate the place (apart from NP and maybe a couple of other sections), slag off how it's run, 9 times out of 10 don't think about others feelings and then continue to moan for days on end about being banned because they can't get on said forum!! Life goes on!! Any generated bitterness will only come from the people using the section who IMO are not ones who I'd want around anyway!! This forum is owned an run by a group of people who do it for free and IMO if you don't like it, you know where that little red cross is in the corner of your screen!!

I am really, really hoping that this comment wasn't written the way it reads, ie the people in np are the only ones making a fuss and you don't want them around anyway?! Please tell me that is not actually what you meant!


----------



## Wobbles

Monkeh said:


> Wobbles said:
> 
> 
> Bekki - Didn't she request closure? (Edit - She did)
> 
> Bekki requested closure whilst she sorted out personal issues and it was her understanding it wasn't permanent. She has now been banned after asking for her account to be re-activated because she spoke about it on another forum.
> 
> If banning people for activities outwith the forums is a good reason, why aren't those who were abusive on fb towards other bnb mummies yesterday after a bnb meet being banned?Click to expand...

I have no idea about this situation only vaguely and that was taperjeangirl asking for her account to be deactivated because someone attacked her through FB private messaging. I have seen none of the FB conversations you talk of. Please don't rope me into everything that happens ...honestly I'm clueless about this.

:wacko:


----------



## Dream.A.Dream

Twiglet I really seriously want your kittens. IF you think they could cope with a 3 hour drive I'll have them xx


----------



## Jetters

Lisa1302 said:


> Some people appear to be just trolling - they are all talking about it on the 'other forum' - pathetic really that they even had to hide the thread :haha:

Lisa- you are really not helping the situation- it isn't supposed to be "us vs them" but apparently you're allowed to talk as if it is?!


----------



## Dream.A.Dream

I feel that perhaps if people are that upset about the situation it would be best they move on? :shrug:


----------



## Lu28

katy said:


> I have been a member on this forum a long time and prior to posting in this section I have had a clash of opinions with those banned members numerous times. On a few occasions they have deeply upset me. When I came in this section they seemed like totally different people and I was amazed how nice they were. If you're a regular user of this section but tend not to venture out much, or you do share their views, then you may be unaware how they can seem to others until you "know" them if you see what I mean?

This is something I just don't understand. I have clashed with some of the banned members outside the NP forum on a few occasions, there are many things we don't agree on. But I would count all of those banned members as my friends. We don't agree on everything and why should we? We're all adults and I would be incredibly bored if I limited myself to only speaking to people I agree with on 100% of issues. Why can't we all be adults, agree to disagree on certain issues and leave it at that? Why are members who are passionate about issues and have views that's aren't in the majority seen as troublesome?


----------



## Serene123

Lu28 said:


> katy said:
> 
> 
> I have been a member on this forum a long time and prior to posting in this section I have had a clash of opinions with those banned members numerous times. On a few occasions they have deeply upset me. When I came in this section they seemed like totally different people and I was amazed how nice they were. If you're a regular user of this section but tend not to venture out much, or you do share their views, then you may be unaware how they can seem to others until you "know" them if you see what I mean?
> 
> This is something I just don't understand. I have clashed with some of the banned members outside the NP forum on a few occasions, there are many things we don't agree on. But I would count all of those banned members as my friends. We don't agree on everything and why should we? We're all adults and I would be incredibly bored if I limited myself to only speaking to people I agree with on 100% of issues. Why can't we all be adults, agree to disagree on certain issues and leave it at that? *Why are members who are passionate about issues and have views that's aren't in the majority seen as troublesome*?Click to expand...

Because they're horrible to people!!


----------



## Twiglet

Ohh Katy they would :haha: just give them water and food and they'll be fine!


----------



## Lu28

Kit said:


> Vici said:
> 
> 
> O good lord, they hate the place (apart from NP and maybe a couple of other sections), slag off how it's run, 9 times out of 10 don't think about others feelings and then continue to moan for days on end about being banned because they can't get on said forum!! Life goes on!! Any generated bitterness will only come from the people using the section who IMO are not ones who I'd want around anyway!! This forum is owned an run by a group of people who do it for free and IMO if you don't like it, you know where that little red cross is in the corner of your screen!!
> 
> I am really, really hoping that this comment wasn't written the way it reads, ie the people in np are the only ones making a fuss and you don't want them around anyway?! Please tell me that is not actually what you meant!Click to expand...

I may be wrong but I think she's referring to those of us who are left and upset about the situation.


----------



## StirCrazy

Jetters said:


> Lisa1302 said:
> 
> 
> Some people appear to be just trolling - they are all talking about it on the 'other forum' - pathetic really that they even had to hide the thread :haha:
> 
> Lisa- you are really not helping the situation- it isn't supposed to be "us vs them" but apparently you're allowed to talk as if it is?!Click to expand...

Lets keep it civil Lisa. Acknowledging Trolls, yes, but lets keep off the "us vs them" (goes for everyone else too). Been enough of that already.


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## Lisa1302

Jetters said:


> Lisa1302 said:
> 
> 
> Some people appear to be just trolling - they are all talking about it on the 'other forum' - pathetic really that they even had to hide the thread :haha:
> 
> Lisa- you are really not helping the situation- it isn't supposed to be "us vs them" but apparently you're allowed to talk as if it is?!Click to expand...

I'm not saying its us v them at all - but that appears to be the attitude on there


----------



## Lu28

Serene123 said:


> Lu28 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> katy said:
> 
> 
> I have been a member on this forum a long time and prior to posting in this section I have had a clash of opinions with those banned members numerous times. On a few occasions they have deeply upset me. When I came in this section they seemed like totally different people and I was amazed how nice they were. If you're a regular user of this section but tend not to venture out much, or you do share their views, then you may be unaware how they can seem to others until you "know" them if you see what I mean?
> 
> This is something I just don't understand. I have clashed with some of the banned members outside the NP forum on a few occasions, there are many things we don't agree on. But I would count all of those banned members as my friends. We don't agree on everything and why should we? We're all adults and I would be incredibly bored if I limited myself to only speaking to people I agree with on 100% of issues. Why can't we all be adults, agree to disagree on certain issues and leave it at that? *Why are members who are passionate about issues and have views that's aren't in the majority seen as troublesome*?Click to expand...
> 
> Because they're horrible to people!!Click to expand...

Oh I give up.


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## Lisa1302

Serene123 said:


> Lu28 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> katy said:
> 
> 
> I have been a member on this forum a long time and prior to posting in this section I have had a clash of opinions with those banned members numerous times. On a few occasions they have deeply upset me. When I came in this section they seemed like totally different people and I was amazed how nice they were. If you're a regular user of this section but tend not to venture out much, or you do share their views, then you may be unaware how they can seem to others until you "know" them if you see what I mean?
> 
> This is something I just don't understand. I have clashed with some of the banned members outside the NP forum on a few occasions, there are many things we don't agree on. But I would count all of those banned members as my friends. We don't agree on everything and why should we? We're all adults and I would be incredibly bored if I limited myself to only speaking to people I agree with on 100% of issues. Why can't we all be adults, agree to disagree on certain issues and leave it at that? *Why are members who are passionate about issues and have views that's aren't in the majority seen as troublesome*?Click to expand...
> 
> Because they're horrible to people!!Click to expand...

Exactly! You cant allow people to get away with being nasty little witches just cos they do help when it suits them in the meantime :dohh:


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## Twiglet

Vici's referring to things that have been said in the past.


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## DueMarch2nd

Lu28 said:


> katy said:
> 
> 
> I have been a member on this forum a long time and prior to posting in this section I have had a clash of opinions with those banned members numerous times. On a few occasions they have deeply upset me. When I came in this section they seemed like totally different people and I was amazed how nice they were. If you're a regular user of this section but tend not to venture out much, or you do share their views, then you may be unaware how they can seem to others until you "know" them if you see what I mean?
> 
> This is something I just don't understand. I have clashed with some of the banned members outside the NP forum on a few occasions, there are many things we don't agree on. But I would count all of those banned members as my friends. We don't agree on everything and why should we? We're all adults and I would be incredibly bored if I limited myself to only speaking to people I agree with on 100% of issues. Why can't we all be adults, agree to disagree on certain issues and leave it at that? Why are members who are passionate about issues and have views that's aren't in the majority seen as troublesome?Click to expand...

same here and one in particular even says in her siggy shes wicked evil mean and nasty lol and i clashed with her when we were preggo. but she is a brilliant source of knowledge as many people here and in life are. the reason they are so opinionated is that they have the knowledge to defend what they beleive.

i for one hate wishy washy people so i say it is fantastic to say what you beleive... no one can agree with all of it


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## StirCrazy

OK I know the idea was to close this thread eventually but I was hoping at a natural point, don't force it. Serene, not all of them are. You can't generalise.


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## Monkeh

Sigh.

No matter who's right, wrong, or what the opinions are, the NP section just isn't the same. The closing of the forum and the resulting craziness, coupled with my bad experiences with forum members namecalling and talking about me behind my back yesterday for no reason has just left a bad taste in my mouth. I'm not comfortable posting here anymore. I too feel like I'm walking on eggshells and to be honest I don't think I'm going to feel comfortable posting alongside the members who I know have the capacity to bitch about me and others because they apparently just don't like us. 

Aside from the above incident where Serina27 decided I was a 'rude cow', I generally am not in agreement with how things are run here. 

Also I think those who feel like the NP-ers are 'superior' are the ones who are aware that, for example (as I know this example doesn't cover all of the girls in NP), breast IS best, and can't admit it, so are offended when it's pointed out. It astounds me that we're not 'allowed' to say it, for fear of offending the FFers. The same as cloth nappies ARE better for the environment than sposies.

There. Obviously I think I'm better than everyone else now :rolleyes:


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## Dream.A.Dream

All I am saying is that it took me joining this section to see their helpful and kind side. To those who don't use this section they won't have seen it.


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## Jetters

Lisa1302 said:


> Exactly! You cant allow people to get away with being nasty little witches just cos they do help when it suits them in the meantime :dohh:

And you can't be 'allowed' to call them nasty little witches! Stop being a hypocrite. 


This thread is important I think, to get things out and said rather than be all behind closed doors and bitched about on fb etc- and i'm actually glad, Wobbs and SC that you've allowed it without removing posts etc. If it's just going to get silly and childish though- ie "cos they're horrible people" dohh:) then it may as well be closed. Which is a shame.


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## Dream.A.Dream

How many times do I have to ask for BF to be left out of this section. There is a seperate section for that.


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## DueMarch2nd

katy said:


> How many times do I have to ask for BF to be left out of this section. There is a seperate section for that.

monkeh is just saying these things are FACT not opinion. 

noone here is judging those that dont do it but it is fact that its better... proven

NO APOLOGIES


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## Serene123

Matureeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee


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## Dream.A.Dream

Oh FFS, I did a thread in baby club about this the other day to try and stop this type of thing. When will some of you get into your bloody heads that some people CAN'T breastfeed. Regardless of whether they want to. They physically bloody can't.


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## mommyof3co

katy said:


> How many times do I have to ask for BF to be left out of this section. There is a seperate section for that.

Everyone knows not everyone here BFs, but it is something that falls up NP. She's just making a point, not implying everyone in here thinks exactly the same way about every topic.

Yes some CAN'T we are all aware of that, it doesn't change facts, she's not trying to make anyone feel bad :hugs:


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## Jetters

....and off the thread goes on a tangent. Goodbye thread.


----------



## Twiglet

I have to say one last things and this time it isn't about kittens BUT how we parent should not offend others as it's our child. Spreading the benefits out to others isnt rude IMO, saying disposables smell isn't rude either IMO...labelling people "witches" is rude...I'm NOT a NPer by the "norm" but I love cloth nappies and yes I will promote them. I couldn't BF but I am not ignorant that breast IS best...the people who feel the need to come and defend themselves without needing to shouldn't get offended...ask the people WHY they've made those comments before defending yourself and you may get a nicely coherent answer...if they rile at you THEN repeat.

At the end of the day we're all parent's, we all have our children yet sometimes I feel our children are acting more mature than us...

P.S forgive the rambly post, I have a teether on my hands and am pregnant too...lethal combo!

Edit: and repeat is meant to say report ;)

Edit again: Just saying, for Katy, BFing topics do upset her...and for an understandable reason...but are we really being mature now replying the way we have?


----------



## Tiff

Okay, this isn't going to turn into a BF debate. Lets leave that aspect out of this, eh?


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## DueMarch2nd

katy said:


> Oh FFS, I did a thread in baby club about this the other day to try and stop this type of thing. When will some of you get into your bloody heads that some people CAN'T breastfeed. Regardless of whether they want to. They physically bloody can't.

get it through your head i wasnt judging... if you have tried then you clearly know it is the best for baby if you can do it.


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## Serene123

Sorry, but ALL nappies smell, not just disposables.


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## Monkeh

Just to clarify, I have nothing against those who FF, and I'm well aware not all the NP girls Bf (as I stated in the earlier post) I was just pointing out that these things are fact, not opinion, as much as 'the sky is blue' is fact, not opinion, yet we still are not 'allowed' to say them for fear of offending someone.


----------



## Serene123

Sometimes it isn't about offending, it's about upsetting. If you were guilty because you couldn't BF and someone was constantly telling you that you failed at giving your child the best you're going to feel like crap.

I did BF for the record but some people appear to lack compassion in this thread.


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## DueMarch2nd

Monkeh said:


> Just to clarify, I have nothing against those who FF, and I'm well aware not all the NP girls Bf (as I stated in the earlier post) I was just pointing out that these things are fact, not opinion, as much as 'the sky is blue' is fact, not opinion, yet we still are not 'allowed' to say them for fear of offending someone.

and just stating that HAS offended some :wacko:


----------



## Monkeh

Serene123 said:


> Sometimes it isn't about offending, it's about upsetting. If you were guilty because you couldn't BF and someone was constantly telling you that you failed at giving your child the best you're going to feel like crap.
> 
> I did BF for the record but some people appear to lack compassion in this thread.

Nobody's saying anyone 'failed'. I'm stating fact. That's all.


----------



## StirCrazy

Monkeh said:


> Aside from the above incident where Serina27 decided I was a 'rude cow', I generally am not in agreement with how things are run here.

We know nothing about this. Nothing has been reported so seems like something personal between the two of you (not sure what you want us to do?).

Man... I walk away from the thread for 2 minutes and the mood has changed again. No wonder we're seen as the bad guys when all we are seen doing to do is telling members off (Lisa less of the name calling). Last chance before I'm forced to closed the thread... *ON TOPIC PLEASE*


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## DueMarch2nd

ok really get off the bf subject... people arent getting it! it wasnt said as judgement and no one called anyone a failure ffs


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## Serene123

I know that, but they feel like they're not giving their child the best?

There are reasons for the BnB rules. I myself used to be pretty narked about not being able to say breast is best but since then I've met some amazing women with a very bad feeling of guilt. Some because of things I had said and that ISN'T fair.

It just doesn't need to be said.


----------



## Twiglet

:dohh: 

Sky's not blue today :haha: ;)

Tasha: I'm not aiming to start a debate BUT have you ever used a cloth nappy? They dont smell until they're off the baby and left in the pail...if they do smell then they need stripping as there's a build up of detergent... I wont get offended if someone tells me my cloth nappies smell, I'll check Moo's not pooped and then I'll strip them if it's the actual nappy. It's a fact that disposables do have chemicals in them that make them smell...yet I still use them at night [well I have some cute fleece soakers to use now] and dont mind the smell TBH. I'm not aiming to be a git here / insult you BUT I can't believe we're arguing about what our babies wear on their butt :rofl:


----------



## DueMarch2nd

Serene123 said:


> I know that, but they feel like they're not giving their child the best?
> 
> There are reasons for the BnB rules. I myself used to be pretty narked about not being able to say breast is best but since then I've met some amazing women with a very bad feeling of guilt. Some because of things I had said and that ISN'T fair.
> 
> It just doesn't need to be said.

ok this is the last i'll say on bf...

if they choose formula they are choosing 2nd best but if they try to bf and genuinely cant then they are still doing the best they can for their babies

back to topic please...


----------



## Serene123

DueMarch2nd said:


> Serene123 said:
> 
> 
> I know that, but they feel like they're not giving their child the best?
> 
> There are reasons for the BnB rules. I myself used to be pretty narked about not being able to say breast is best but since then I've met some amazing women with a very bad feeling of guilt. Some because of things I had said and that ISN'T fair.
> 
> It just doesn't need to be said.
> 
> ok this is the last i'll say on bf...
> 
> if they choose formula they are choosing 2nd best but if they try to bf and genuinely cant then they are still doing the best they can for their babies
> 
> back to topic please...Click to expand...

I do agree with you but that doesn't change how people feel about it that's all I'm saying :flower:


----------



## Rachel_C

Serene123 said:


> I know that, but they feel like they're not giving their child the best?

Well they're not giving their child the best, simple as! I FF by the way, and feel guilty about it, but that doesn't mean that facts aren't facts and we shouldn't acknowledge that.


----------



## xpinkness87x

Thank you Wobbs.

I have looked around the NP forum as i was considering cloth nappies but dont have the money to at the moment. And i did see some people picking on others... but i have also see lots of people picking on everyone all arounf the forum x


----------



## Serene123

Rachel_C said:


> Serene123 said:
> 
> 
> I know that, but they feel like they're not giving their child the best?
> 
> Well they're not giving their child the best, simple as! I FF by the way, and feel guilty about it, but that doesn't mean that facts aren't facts and we shouldn't acknowledge that.Click to expand...

Erm, we all KNOW the facts, they don't need to be relayed all the time.


----------



## Vici

Kit said:


> Vici said:
> 
> 
> O good lord, they hate the place (apart from NP and maybe a couple of other sections), slag off how it's run, 9 times out of 10 don't think about others feelings and then continue to moan for days on end about being banned because they can't get on said forum!! Life goes on!! Any generated bitterness will only come from the people using the section who IMO are not ones who I'd want around anyway!! This forum is owned an run by a group of people who do it for free and IMO if you don't like it, you know where that little red cross is in the corner of your screen!!
> 
> I am really, really hoping that this comment wasn't written the way it reads, ie the people in np are the only ones making a fuss and you don't want them around anyway?! Please tell me that is not actually what you meant!Click to expand...

That wasn't what it meant in the slighest! As a frequent user of the NP section, why would it? :) While there are some that feel the forum will be a worse place without most of these particular banned members whereas others think it will be a better place! 

Again i say it, if you don't like it, you don't have to come on BnB!!


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## enola

But doesn't it seem that people try to discount scientific proof in favour of personal opinion? As in - crying it out *does* causes stress, formula feeding *isn't* as good for babies or mums as breastfeeding and cloth nappies *are not* chemical-ridden...all of these topics are controversial as they are so natural and instinctual, and when we do not or cannot follow our instincts when it comes to parenting we are left with a sense of guilt which then causes us to lash out in jealousy at those who have taken the path we wish we could/would have. Hence the reason for natural parenting sections and attempts at trying to repeat these messages of what IS best, but with the support there to help people in their choices (and, might I say, I've never once encountered judgments on those who do not follow all/some of the parenting practices commonly called 'natural').
Apologies if this is garbled, an insane baby and a passion for free speech are not the best of bed-fellows!


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## StirCrazy

Hello (..._hello_)... Echo (..._echo_)... Can anyone hear me (_can anyone hear me_)... I think this thread is at its end. 

I don't want to be the last to reply (because we get accused of having the last word before closing), so thanks to eveyone who posted in here and for your (constructive) thoughts, good or bad.

Closing thoughts:
I've just glanced at the stats on this thread and tbh, it does seem to be a storm in a teacup. We have 1500+ online right now (about 7000 member online at some point since this thread started) and only 134 members have even looked at this thread. So lets calm down, take a deep breath and try to gain some prospective.

Right, closing this in 5 minutes. TTFN :)


----------



## Twiglet

Anyone want a kitten?


----------



## vanessayogini

enola said:


> lfernie said:
> 
> 
> Yes but that was obviously something close to home for her :shrug: or is that opinion not allowed? You see this is where the line is blurred, she cannot take offence to someone buying chicken which has been kept in a cage it's whole life but others can take offence when someone say nappies stink :confused:
> 
> Agreed - this is what others have meant when they have stated that they feel there is 'one rule for one and one for another'. It's confusing to only seemingly randomly enforce certain rules and leaves us with this sense of trepidation that at any minute our passion for the way we parent our own children will cause us to be silenced.
> 
> We are already in the minority in real life, thus a sense of solace builds in these sort of forums and, as such, if our community feels attacked we naturally defend not only our beliefs but our friends, too.Click to expand...


In general, in life, I try and think objectively in most situations so I can create informed thoughts in my head with all sides taken into account. In this situation, the text quoted above really does seem to be very true.
Some of us feel differently about the state of our world today. I feel very passionately about certain issues that have been discussed and debated here in this section and others of this forum. I feel that some of the banned members that we are discussing have felt similarly, and are more bold and brave with the things they have said regarding them. 

There are DEFINITELY signatures I've seen here that are OBVIOUSLY direct reactions to people who "natural parent". Clearly these women feel defensive. And actually that is what I've seen happen the most (people becoming defensive when the poster was not attacking but in fact trying to be informing). 

(((For example, with the diaper discussion, the COLD HARD FACT of the matter is that once they are used, roughly 90 percent to 95 percent of the 18 billion feces-and urine-filled disposable diapers used a year end up in landfills, creating an immediate public health hazard. Leachate (which is the liquid that drains or 'leaches' from a landfill containing viruses from human feces including live vaccines from routine childhood immunizations) can leak into the Earth and pollute underground water supplies. In addition to the potential of groundwater contamination, air-borne viruses carried by flies and other insects contribute to an unhealthy and unsanitary situation.))))

I can't help that I CARE DEEPLY about this subject. Others do not, and that's totally cool, but I do. So can I not try and inform others? I am not attacking women who do use them, I am simply telling everyone something about them. Is this information not useful? Is this information not important because someone could possibly feel defensive because they use disposable diapers? This was just one example. and it is just an example, I'm not trying to discuss diapers right now.

The people that were banned yesterday feel strongly about certain things and remained true to their opinions. My perception of them is that they are strong, informed, caring and passionate people. 
The people that are calling them names, etc are really making themselves look badly and very immature. 

Why do we keep having to point out facts, such as breastfeeding?! Because if we don't keep talking about it, change will not happen.


----------



## becstar

Oh, can I please have the last word? My husband never lets me... ;-)


----------



## Twiglet

My kittens want the last word...:(


----------



## veganmum2be

i wasn't part of the thread, nor was i ever apart of the natrual parenting section really, as i'm not a parent. so don't really have the right to comment i don't think.

but this whole thing has comepletly baffled me.
:( i was really interested in the NP section, as it had alot of topics that i felt applied to they way in which i would like to parent when i have my baby.
i love this forum its been a life saver to me and i do really appreciate the work and effort it takes to run.
but i do feel and always have, that certain things cant be talked about in case it upsets certain others. so freedom of speech is limited.
:shrug:


----------



## StirCrazy

becstar said:


> Oh, can I please have the last word? My husband never lets me... ;-)

:lol: 3 minutes... keep posting, it might just be you :rofl:

{typo edit}


----------



## MummyKaya

{edited by S.C}
_there always has to be one doesn't there... trying to get the last word in (wait til the end) and demeaning everyone else._


----------



## jen1604

Twiglet said:


> My kittens want the last word...:(

Just quoting to try and get your kittens to have the last word :D x


----------



## danapeter36

laughter is the best medicine

random i know, just want the last word haha


----------



## becstar

StirCrazy said:


> becstar said:
> 
> 
> Oh, can I please have the last word? My husband never lets me... ;-)
> 
> :lol: 3 minutes... keep posting, it might just be you :rofl:
> 
> {typo edit}Click to expand...

*sets timer*


----------



## jen1604

Twiglet's kittens!!!!!!!!! :rofl: x


----------

