# "Spontaneous" home birth?? UK



## Amygdala

Hi all! I was wondering if anyone could enlighten me as to my rights and the regulations about home birth inn the uk. I'm very much hoping for a hospital water birth. If a birthing pool isn't available at the time though, my next choice would be for a home water birth (over a hospital birth on dry land). Can I phone them in labour and if there's no pool just say "I'm staying home"??? I don't mean to be awkward for the sake of it but I do very much want another water birth and importantly I'm not confident I could go natural without water. Has anyone got any info or experiences for me?


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## Creative

Having a home birth organised is one thing, but to suddenly at the last minute change your mind to a home birth, would mean that you would really be having an unplanned homebirth. In preparation for homebirth, equipment etc is left at your home in the run up to the expected birth. Your community midwives would know what you want and how you want your birth managed. You would risk a lot by suddenly refusing to go in. You may be better planning the other way round and opting initially for a home water birth and then when in labour "changing your mind and phoning the hospital to see if the pool is available."


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## Amygdala

Good point, I hadn't thought of actually planning for a home birth. I guess it's a very small chance that a pool won't be available though and I don't know if its worth bothering people just for that "emergency" option. Hmm. Food for thought anyway. I also didn't realise equipment would be left in advance. Didn't think they bring much?


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## Creative

Delivery pack, disposal bags, gas and air. You also need to make sure you have plastic sheets, towels, bucket etc.


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## summer rain

It depends on your area. In London they only leave the delivery pack with you, the disposal items and gas and air they bring on the day. Most MWs who attend homebirths do have a
spare delivery pack in the car and some have canisters of gas and air too. I have been told its better to book a homebirth though and then change my mind if I decide to go into hospital as opposed to vice versa. Again it varies but I have been told that in this area if you book a home birth and then during labour decide to transfer while still remaining low risk (so not transferring due to a medical emergency) the two homebirth midwives are obliged to accompany you into the hospital and to open up a room in the birth centre if you wish whereas if you are not booked for a homebirth if the birth centre or pool rooms are closed due to staffing issues then you can't use them. Xx


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## sarahh

Are there any midwife led birthing units near you with birth pools, you could go to. I started my labour at a midwife led unit in the pool but if the pool was being used when I went in they would have phoned round the other local midwife units to find a free birthing pool for me to go to.


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## MindUtopia

If it were me, I think I might approach it from the perspective of planning for a home birth with the intention of going in to hospital if a pool is available. That way you have the supplies (both from the midwives and things you need on your own, like the pool, things to cover the floor, towels, drinks, etc.) but you still have the option to go in if that's what feels right. 

If it makes you feel any better, I had a home birth and completely planned to have a water birth. In fact, it was one of the reasons why I wanted to birth at home (my hospital only has one pool room). I actually ended up not labouring much at all in the pool (only got in when I started pushing for about 30 min, it didn't feel right and slowed me up, so got out) and gave birth on dry land. I obviously can't compare because this was my only birth, so I never had a water birth but even with 4 hours of pushing (most of it on dry land), it was totally manageable. I never would have guessed it would be and I was really attached to the idea of water birth, but actually birthing on dry land worked great for me, so you never know!


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## MandaAnda

I definitely agree with the other ladies. It's much easier to plan a home birth (you can buy or hire a pool, and the few other bits you'd want/need are easy to come by as well) and decide to or need to transfer to hospital at any stage than the other way around. I got my pool (secondhand but only blown up to test, never used) for £25 off eBay, so there are definitely bargains to be had in that area. And I can always sell it on later...if I want.


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## Blah11

I think its a pretty bad idea really. I assume your first choice is hospital in case anything happens you'd feel safer but an unplanned hb would mean no oxygen cannister or resus kit let alone an available midwife.


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## Blah11

https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v329/blah11/IMAG0266.jpg have a pic of the stuff they delivered to me a few weeks before due date. The box looks smaller than it was

.


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## Creative

Blah11 said:


> https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v329/blah11/IMAG0266.jpg have a pic of the stuff they delivered to me a few weeks before due date. The box looks smaller than it was
> 
> .

that looks very similar to the set up I had.


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## summer rain

It honestly depends on area though. In my area and I know many others they only bring the g&a and oxygen on the day and the kit they deliver beforehand is a small cube shaped cardboard box with a sealed plastic bag inside (which you are instructed not to open or touch as it is only sterile until opened) they bring most of the stuff on the day and its either kept just in case in the back of their car or at wherever the midwives are based which usually isn't far at all. This is one reason they send two midwives one can quickly pop to their bade and get more entonox or anything else they need if it runs out. Before the changeover of NHS trust they didn't even do a home visit at 36 weeks in a lot of cases especially if they had done other home births where you live so they knew parking and access, they'd just bring everything on the day. Not suggesting having an unplanned homebirth is a good idea, just that how they set things up can differ so much from area to area. Xx


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## solitaire89

As the pp says, I'm not advocating an unplanned home birth, but I only had 1 home visit and nothing was delivered beforehand.
Personally, I'd plan for a home water birth over a hospital one. As another poster has said that way you're guaranteed a pool will be available to you - i know that was certainly a consideration for me when i was thinking about where i wanted to birth my baby. It is certainly easier to switch from a home birth to a hospital birth than vice versa, and you'll annoy a lot fewer people along the way!


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## Pearls18

Thing is though the OP doesn't know what her area may be like, it could be that she needs the equipment that Blah put up in which case it would need to be discussed first. It would be putting the midwives in a really awkward position. I understand your desire for a water birth, it is why I am giving birth at home, but as the others said I would do it the other way around. Perhaps even look into the benefits of home birth? If I am honest I would probably prefer a hospital water birth as I had last time, but for me the most important thing is a water birth so I am compromising by trying to do it at home, fingers crossed.


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## summer rain

I was only saying as I didn't want ladies other than the OP to worry that their midwives haven't dropped off the equipment blah's midwife left and think that this is something they are meant to do. I know in this area they'd never leave gas canisters of any type (highly flammable) or any type of needles, scissors etc in an unsealed box or container in someone's home for a few weeks beforehand, because of health and safety concerns. To be fair myself and the other posters who said that it varies from area to area did stress strongly that an unplanned home birth is probably not a good idea. I would think if you had a birth pool set up and the midwives came along not knowing you planned a homebirth they may well be rather ticked off! Xx


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## Blah11

Surely if you're safe enough to take a baby home you're safe enough to have scissors in the house?! The mw alerts the fire brigade about the gases and a fire crew sometimes do a home visit risk assessment. The only thing I was told to lock away in a high place was the syntometrine.


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## solitaire89

solitaire89 said:


> As the pp says, I'm not advocating an unplanned home birth

I just wanted to clarify, I do not support the notion of a home birth where the authorities have not been notified of the intention to do so. However, as someone who was planning a home birth it worried me when everyone spoke about lots of home visits and kit delivered. I didn't have that, and it worried me that I wouldn't get my home birth.

My previous post also states that I would plan for a home water birth, and then the op would have the option of going in if the facilities were available. I'm sorry if my post was poorly worded. I do not support the idea of just staying at home if the wished for facilities are not available.


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## summer rain

I am talking more about the fact the scissors are single use and need to be kept sterile. But it would be a bit ridiculous for it to be expected that MWs in London or other large heavily populated areas who tend to deal with a lot of homebirths (perhaps not percentage wise but by sheer numbers) would have to notify the fire brigade about leaving gas cylinders in someone's house or flat, it just wouldn't be possible. Fire crews and midwifery teams are very stretched down here as it is. Also a lot of people around here live in flats or other social housing and they have their own rules about keeping gas cylinders in the home overnight let alone for a longer period. One of my friends her son needs oxygen all the time but she had to have special permission to keep the cylinders in her house and she has to have fire extinguishers etc xx


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## Blah11

I think they're stretchedd everywhere tbh and even though london is more heavily populated, there will be a larger number of firemen/doctors/nurses/police etc to account for that. For example in london the nhs is split into 31 primary trusts which would make each trust serve the same number of people as anywhere else in the country.


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## Blah11

Ps. I know pct don't exist anymore it was just an example!


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## summer rain

There is a larger discrepancy here between emergency services staff and HCPs per population than anywhere else in the country so there may be more staff overall but there are less in terms of ratio to the population. They have recently closed loads of fire stations and are due to do the same with police stations so in this area we aren't even going to have a police station at all anymore. They have also closed several maternity units and got rid of quite a few of the community midwives. Under ordinary circumstances midwives here cannot do home visits for normal ante natal appointments at all nor are they allowed to take blood anymore, it has to be a phlebotomist and you have to go to them. I've had one of my children up north and things are far, far more stretched down here and like I said there are other rules and regulations that need to be taken into account, i.e. housing regulations. For many years they have done the home births like this its just how it goes, never caused a problem last time and sure it won't this time :shrug: xx


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## Blah11

No I'm sure it doesn't make any difference either way, just saves the midwife wasting time going to collect all the stuff then set up gas cannisters when potentially a labouring woman needs them. 
However if they are that stretched then its unavoidable I guess.
The fire brigade didn't actually visit us anyway and my mw only did 1 home visit on a weekend to check parking and layout of my house etc. She would have done one other to give me a sweep on a Sunday but i had already had him that morning :D


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## Pearls18

I'm in London (West) I found some nhs docs online about my hospital and they mentioned a home visit to find parking and the actual house, not sure about what "stuff" they leave.


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## MandaAnda

MarineWAG said:


> I'm in London (West) I found some nhs docs online about my hospital and they mentioned a home visit to find parking and the actual house, not sure about what "stuff" they leave.

They definitely don't leave the g&a, and I'm pretty sure they don't leave ancillaries. In Slough, they left a bin bag of ancillaries with the first attending midwife bringing the g&a, and if you need more the second one brings another canister or has to go back to hospital for one.


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## summer rain

Blah11 said:


> No I'm sure it doesn't make any difference either way, just saves the midwife wasting time going to collect all the stuff then set up gas cannisters when potentially a labouring woman needs them.
> However if they are that stretched then its unavoidable I guess.
> The fire brigade didn't actually visit us anyway and my mw only did 1 home visit on a weekend to check parking and layout of my house etc. She would have done one other to give me a sweep on a Sunday but i had already had him that morning :D

The gas and air and oxygen canisters they use round here are really small (similar size to those canisters for inflating balloons) and its literally a case of screwing in the mouthpiece and adaptor somehow which takes seconds and the adaptors and mouthpieces are stored in the same bag. Well in theory someone took the mouthpieces out of the bag when I had my second youngest but the same thing with the MWs forgetting the mouthpieces happened with my friend in Manchester where they did drop the canisters off but only bring the mouthpiece parts on the day. They bring two canisters in a sports type bag on the day (of the gas and air) not sure how they brought in the oxygen as they never needed to use it. If they need more they can go back to their base and get another sports bag which has everything ready to put together. Because they are so portable midwives around here who regularly attend home births sometimes have a bag of gas and air locked in the boot of their car obviously they then
have hazard warning stickers on their car. Xx


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## Pearls18

Not really related...but a friend of mine had a home birth in Wales over the winter, the MW left the entonox in the car and it froze so she couldnt have it, I'd be gutted!


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## lynnikins

my HB team left nothing when i was planning ds3's birth all we had at home ( unassisted in the end ) was the pool + hire kit and what we had assembled from our own supplies, the MW gave me a list and id gotten most of the things on it and the ambulance arrived with the cord clamps and sterile sissors and other things from their birth kit including gas and air lol


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## summer rain

MarineWAG said:


> Not really related...but a friend of mine had a home birth in Wales over the winter, the MW left the entonox in the car and it froze so she couldnt have it, I'd be gutted!

Yep lots of mishaps with gas and air not being useable. It was my worst nightmare but the MWs with second youngest reassured me they never had anything happen then one of the other midwives took the mouthpiece parts from the bag as it seems her bag hadnt had any put in there by whoever puts the bags together, only she neglected to tell the others on the midwife team. My OH said he had never seen me give anyone such an evil look. As the midwives only came five minutes before he was born there was no time for them to get the relevant parts from their base clinic even though it was only a few minutes drive away. It wasn't the nicest experience though it wasn't as bad as I thought it would be. They wanted to do my stitches with just a local injected anaesthetic but I knew from past experience that I can still feel everything pretty much with that so I made one of the midwives go back to base for the right mouthpiece adaptors. Needless to say I completely rinsed the whole canister by the time my stitches were done. I asked if I could use the other one just for fun and they said no! Mean sods Xx


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## summer rain

lynnikins said:


> my HB team left nothing when i was planning ds3's birth all we had at home ( unassisted in the end ) was the pool + hire kit and what we had assembled from our own supplies, the MW gave me a list and id gotten most of the things on it and the ambulance arrived with the cord clamps and sterile sissors and other things from their birth kit including gas and air lol

Here the only thing they really tell you to have ready is an old shower curtain and some old towels to protect surfaces etc. I got told off for buying a new shower curtain and not using the old one from the bathroom even though the one I bought was a value one and our old one was not something I would want in contact with a newborn as it was rather hideously mouldy and fit for the bin. Also got told off for buying 'new' towels when they weren't new I just looked after them well. In the end I gave birth sitting on the floor on our machine washable viscose rug, which OH put in the machine pronto and it was totally clean again. Overall the lack of mess and rubbish at the end was surprising, it was literally the rug, one pillow (which I sat on after giving birth as my bum was aching from being on the floor) and two or three towels that needed washing, a few tiny dots of blood on the laminate flooring which were easily mopped and everything else got on the disposable drapes that the midwives brought and they wrapped everything up at the end in a yellow bag and took it with them for incineration-except the placenta which we buried in the garden and a wild rocket plant sprung up on top of it that we couldn't get rid of! Xx


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## irish_cob

I had no home visit prior to my home birth attempt and no supplies delivered, the midwives brought everything on the day.


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## television

I had pack delivered @ 37weeks, which contained towels gloves pads, nothing sharp. No oxygen was delivered. I gave birth on old blanket that was it. MW didn't get to my home in time for birth so didn't have any pain relief. Paramedics turned up in time to deliver babys body. They had stuff to clamp cord and cut it.


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