# 3rd failed ivf/icsi, please help



## Nayla82

Dear Ladies,

PLEASE I hope some one can help :cry:

Yesterday I got my blood test my 3rd Fresh failed IVF/ICSI :cry: NEGATIVE

Honestly what do I do now?? Im so shocked and in disbelief. NO Frosties.

We had 3 Grade 1 5 Cells Transferred on Day 2... my 1st and 2nd Cycle two Grade 1 8 cells embryos on day 3.

I have had ALL my IMMUNE TESTINGS DONE came back clear... I have had a Hysterscopy and a biopsy of my Uterus.. Again came back clear.. The Reasons were having IVF is due to my husbands very low counts... now im blaming my self......

The doctor told me she wants to talk to a collegue as she is shocked that it has not worked yet... Im watching women day in and out walking away with their BFP in this clinic and all i do is watch from the sideline :cry: We have gone private and paid for ALL our Treatments im very very upset with it all...

She gave me HIBOR 25OOIU injection that I took throughout the full 2WW she said she usually doesnt give it, but if blood clotting might be an issue... Both of my Thighs are purple and bruised which is a reminder that I got a no :cry:

Since the whole journey of IVF and 100s of my blood tests my TSH Came back 6.2 She told me I had an underactive Thyroid didnt have a clue I had that... I was put on medication and it came down to 2.7 thats when i started my 1st IVF......

I keep telling her time and time again is 2.7 TSH not too High?? and she said under 3 is perfectly fine??

This is the only thing that I can think of??? Were DEFINITELY moving on, when I have the strength I will go get my file and move to a different clinic, I have lost faith in her and we have NEVER had a 2nd view.. maybe we just need a new set of eyes....

I so wish she can say its because X Y AND Z? she always says 'its in Gods hands if its a yes or no' how many more IVFS can I have with her 4 5 6? and she always says its Gods will... which it certainly is :cry: I need a medical reason also....

I would appreciate any suggestions? I hope I have made sense? and anyone got successful on the 4th IVF? I have read that after 3 failed IVF the success rate takes a nose dive :cry: Im 29 Very Healthy and now 3 failed cycles never did i think 2011 would end like this :cry:

Its Christmas Day and I would rather be asleep :cry:

Looking forward for ANY replies xx


----------



## Bepaisley

Hi Nayla, I sent u a PM...check it out and please don't give up hope. I know it's easy for me to say and Im sure we all can tell u tons of success stories after 3 tries. Especially after switching clinics, maybe she just wasn't the right person to be seeing u, btw let me just tell u my friend had 3 failed cycles at one clinic, switched and got a BFP on her first try at the second, plus had some to freeze and got her other baby on a FET on the first try. I know things feel hopeless right now, please check out my PM and I'll help u in any way u need.


----------



## Fifer77

Hi Nayla, 

I am so sorry for your result, I myself had a fail this week as well. This was my first so I can only imagine what a third would do to a persons sanity. I can offer no guidance or reasoning, only words of encouragement. I personally hate the notion of someone saying it's in Gods hands, how do you move forward or do something constructive with that?

Take your time to grieve, if you want to sleep then that's what I would do. Whatever you need to come to terms with your loss. Lean on your family, we didn't tell ours we were doing ICSI and it's something I regretted - there are no set of people that want happiness for you more. 


I truely wish I could take some of your pain for you, please know that I am thinking of you. 

Take care of yourself. 

Fifer x


----------



## Tinks85

Nayla, I am so so sorry to be reading this. You are in my thoughts hun.

I think a new clinic would be the best way forward :hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:


----------



## Titi

Hi hun....I'm so sorry. I just got my negative result back from my first failed IVF and am devastated and broke enough to not even think #2 is an option--so I can only imagine how gutted you must be right now. I got my - POAS on xmas day and it was unbelievable how unfair........I don't have answers for you but can be of support if I can.


----------



## blondemop

Hi Nayla,
I just wanted to say that I COMPLETELY understand. I am so sorry you are going through this. I remember you from a thread earlier in the year. I have been through 4 IVFs (3 fresh, one frozen), one D&C, and 2 hysteroscopies (clear) this year - not to mention ALL of the immunologic testing - clear. My first IVF was actually successful but I had a MMC at 10 wks. Jumped back in as soon as my doc would let me, I figured it worked the first time, it will work again. wrong. Since my miscarriage I have had 2 failed fresh, one failed frozen. 2 hysteroscopies - clear. Our diagnosis is also male factor. My doc has also said he is shocked and frustrated that I am not pregnant yet and can't tell me what the problem is. He also says that "part of it is out of our control." I had been bugging him during the failed cycles that maybe my lining isn't thick enough as it was 11 with my BFP and 8-9 for my BFNs (he tells me anything above 7 is fine). It is like beating your head against a wall. I'm sorry, I have no advice for you except to make sure you are at peace and comfortable with whatever decision you make. If something doesn't seem right in your heart, then it isn't right. Mostly, I just want you to know that you are not alone. I feel your anger, despair, fear, and hopelessness. I have considered calling it quits, but my heart won't let me. I am starting my 5th round of IVF in a few weeks. I am scared out of my mind of another BFN. But I have to try. That's all I can do. Cry, scream, yell, change docs - Do whatever you need to do to find some moment of peace.


----------



## Springflower

Nayla

Your tsh should be under 2 for conception. That is the NHS guidelines. Could you take the info sheet I sent you to your gp and ask them to help? 

I so sorry it didn't work again. It's so hard. Big hugs.

xxx


----------



## Springflower

Ps my 4.5 go worked! 

Also have you had all the immune tests done? Different clinics have differing ideas on immunes. 

xxx


----------



## _Nell

Hi,

I was going to say the same as springflower, your Dr might consider you 'done' with immunes testing but it seems there's a whole array of tests that only some clinics offer - it might be worth looking into.

Other than that ((((hugs)))) I do know how you feel and truly is just sucks.

Blondemop - best of luck for your January cycle, FX it's your turn at last :)


----------



## Lou32

Nayla - So sorry to hear about your BFN. It's heartbreaking and frustrating... I just wondered if you had tried getting your embies to blast? It might give the embryologists an idea of what's happening to them after day 3 and if they're staying strong. Ours tend to slow down after day 3, which is why we had the sperm DNA fragmentation test done (sperm dna kicks in after day 3). It showed up pretty high, which is gives us a good indication that they're probably not making it to implantation.
You are probably missing just one piece to the jigsaw and a new clinic might just be what you need to find it and get your BFP! xxx


----------



## Wallie

I'm so sorry Nayla, I remember you from IVF earlier this year.

I'm about to start IVF 3 and I'm shit scared I'll be in the exact same position as you. I haven't had immune testing though, my clinic doesn't support it at all.

I'm not impressed with your Consultant saying it's in gods hands, that just wouldn't cut it for me either although when my Consultant said it's just bad luck I wasn't impressed with that either.

I do think a new clinic might be the way to go though, although it's such an expense for you as no doubt they'll want to do a ton of other tests for you. But hopefully it will bring you your bfp. Fingers crossed for you dear. :hugs:


----------



## Wallie

Oh and my clinic did say they may try and get the embies to day 5 for me, so that may be something to think about too. Another thing to shit scare myself with...


----------



## Nayla82

Dear Ladies Thank you so much for your words.. Its just gone 1 week since the news and still feeling very tender and delicate and very numb, Not thought to deep into it as I get very very upset with it all..

Fifer- Im very sorry your cycle did not work also, Many women go on to have a 2nd IVF with a BFP, I pray very hard this will be the same with you... xx

Titi- Again very sorry that your cycle didnt work, I pray you find the strength to have cycle 2 in the near future xx

Blondemop- Darling you have been through so much your in my prayers that 5th time will be the final one for you... God Bless you and be as strong as you can be... I know what you mean 'my heart will NOT let me give up this dream' And my throat is so dry from asking the doctor is it this? is it that? Is it too high too low? its drained me to the bones.. it really has, and im sure theres 1000s and 1000s of women in this awful test in life and I find myself thinking is it just me it can be so so lonely, but hearing other women in this forum that have got through this storm gives us all hope.. I keep telling myself our babies are waiting in the que and eventually they will get to the front.. I will say a prayer for you Dear x

Spring Flower- Thank you again for your lovely words, What frustrates me and hurts me the most is that this Clinic keeps telling me TSH Under 3 is perfectly fine for IVF, I have told her that I am worried sick that 2.7 is too high.. She said she has women with 2.8 and 2.9 That get pregnant. She said Different Clinics have different cut of line hers is 3? When I have the energy to go elsewhere I will beg them to get my TSH under 3, Even if it is just for my peace of mind... :cry:

Nell- Thank you Dear, I dont Have the exact tests with me but the Immunes she Definitely Checked were Protein C, NK Cells, Thrombalis, Clotting All blood counts, beta Thyroid Anti Bodies Congeulent, Again many more 3 Pages of Blood tests which I dont have with me, When I do I will Message them here to see if there the correct ones? The Doctor told me she has done ALL the Immune tests related to fail IVFS and she is Happy that everything is within range?? It makes it ever so frustrating.... The pain would be easier is she said This is the problem lets fix it.. Instead she gets more confused with every passing day :nope:

Lou32- I pray so hard dear its just a missing link.. Never in a million years would i think that i would have 3 failed IVFS in one year... My Clinic say they prefer Day 3 or Day 2 I did ask for Blast on 2nd cycle but she said that as I get under 7 Eggs with my cycles its too much of a risk to go day 5.. my first two were day 3.. than this recent one she changed her mind saying lets try day 2 as Three were 5 Cells she said they look Perfectly healthy and dividing beautifully the Uterus will be much better, I guess that was not the case with me.. :cry: Again im praying the new clinic will give me a chance to go Blastocyst.. Thank you so so much for your kind information xx

Wallie- I pray Hun you wont be in this situation and this 3rd cycle will be it for you xx I was having Therapy sessions during the cycle full of positive thinking, and i had convinced myself that it was a yes, i was so so confident in my 2WW that it will be a positive, When it was a no it felt like i got hit by a bus i was blinded by it, even now im so shocked that im in this mess :cry: my clinic did not want to do Immune testing saying all i can give you is Steriods, I demanded that they get done (They were very expensive) again for my peace of mind if anything else. If you can go to Blast it will be very good, The clinic seems to be changing things for you.. Stay Relaxed and Positive and Again you will be in my prayers xx 

Thank you again to anyone who i have missed out...

I will be back with a clear plan.. at the moment it all seems so so blurry and such a DISTANT dream...

You ladies give me faith and hope that dreams can and do come true... Physically I feel very very weak and tired and a 4th IVF anytime soon is a no no, Having 3 Full Failed IVFS within 12 Months has not done my health any good..

Once i feel better physically and mentally i will get back on this journey.

Appreciate all your words xx


----------



## nhood

Bepaisley said:


> Hi Nayla, I sent u a PM...check it out and please don't give up hope. I know it's easy for me to say and Im sure we all can tell u tons of success stories after 3 tries. Especially after switching clinics, maybe she just wasn't the right person to be seeing u, btw let me just tell u my friend had 3 failed cycles at one clinic, switched and got a BFP on her first try at the second, plus had some to freeze and got her other baby on a FET on the first try. I know things feel hopeless right now, please check out my PM and I'll help u in any way u need.

I agree with this Nayla!!!!! I have a cousin who is good friends with the husband and chief of Shady Grove Fertililty clinic and she will place her hand on the bible and say they gave her special treatment. My Re before said that implantation or Transfer failures are due to either 3 things, egg quality, sperm quality or the Lab and the RE skills at transferring and usually if you make it to a expaning blast then and fail, more than likely its the fashion it was transferred.

What day(s) have they transferred your embryos? who was the doctor? What time of day did they transfer? I would demand to be first to be transferred on the day of Transfer and have your RE or a RE you trust to do it. Also, I would REALLY think about switching clinics.


----------



## nhood

Nyala,

I think RE's should really study this age group!!!! I started out with ther fertility clinic at 29, I have had 2 failed IUI's 2 failed IVF's and 1 success with IVF with twins, but lost them both. I am now 33 years old without children. 

My peers who have gone through IVF and have had success were either younger than 26or older than 35. Ironically I think with the "over 35", RE's pay more attention to these cases, thus the reason for success. But this age group of 29-34 from the people I know struggle. I don't know if RE's treat us like early 20's, yet we could have the fertility of 35plus. At any rate, hang in there. I know its hard. I just had a cycle which was BFN. I actually thought that after losing twins back in April this would be MY time and I would get some reward for surving PROM and lost of my babies, but NO! I am at the point where I will try again and not give up, but I am also numb to it all. If it work, it will work.

At any rate, be strong and look to your next step - hopefully a new clinic.


----------



## Bepaisley

NHood its funny you mention shady grove because the person I'm talking about had 3 fails at one clinic and first time success at shady grove! And had left overs to freeze which gave her a positive on her first FET at shady grove where with the other clinic she had none to freeze! 
So sad to hear about ur twins, the greatest gift being taken away is horrible, I hope u never have to suffer through that again and find success and happiness again in this new year!


----------



## jchic

Hi Nayla,

I am so sorry :( Its difficult, I know. If you have an underactive thyroid (I was just diagnosed with this, and I literally had to MAKE the doctor listen to me because my levels were still "normal" but I knew they were a bit high after seeing the results) this could be your issue. Lab ranges for Thyroids are just that, ranges. Most women need to be within a 1-2 for optimal conception. Did they put you on Synthroid? If so, that usually takes a few weeks to about 3 months for them to level you out. When are you getting your thyroid tested again? I bet thats the issue. If you start to see your level come down more, thats great! If not, they can up your dosage to find the perfect mg for you. I am SURE you will get your BFP once your thyroid gets to that level :)


----------



## Nayla82

N-Hood.. im very sorry for the loss of your twins, and your recent failed cycle.. its so so hard getting hurt time and time again... Its Excellent to know that you will keep going.. Yes i feel that they treat many of us just as an age and not really the quality of the eggs and our over all body??....
Not only does this test ones patience, my marriage is like a stress bomb im so scared to death that i will lose my dream of being a mom and my husband also... Its very damaging.. Again i hope it will ALL will be worth it and we will all get that dream of a child saying 'mom' to us xx Stay strong lovely xx

Jchic- Thank you for your kind words.. I was Told that I had an underactive Thyroid just over 1 year ago (while i had ALL my intial blood test done for IVF) Before my first IVF I was put on on Synthyroid 25mg and I have been on the Meds for over 1 year... Its was 6.2 I have had two more TSH tests during last year and both come back 2.7.. The clinic that I am at say under 3 is fine?? I have a gut feeling that it isnt :nope: I have asked her time again to give me 50mg of Meds and she said being over active is just as bad?? :shrug: I will not attempt a 4th IVF till my TSH is under 2.. That will be a priority for me when i seek for a new clinic..

I am planning to wait at least 6months or maybe longer to try again.. i have never felt so physically and mentally exhausted in my life... I can do the drugs the injections the egg collection ..... even the 2ww is Okish but the day i get the blood test and when its a Negative... its like i have had my heart ripped out of my chest 3 times my whole world spins in that split second, and i just dont want to be hurt anymore :cry: I have been hurt to the maximum 3 times and I CANT take this pain any time soon.... its took my breath away...

After 3 failed IVFS my mind will be thinking why will it work 4th time?? the doctor told my husband some women have a faint line and it fades.. but in your situation all 3 tests are starch white its like NOTHING is happening??

Im scared to death of a 4th one... :nope:


----------



## jchic

Im sorry honey - perhaps go to an endocronlogist and see if they will up your dosage or start looking for a new clinic. I am SURE 2.7 is fine for pregnancy....tons of women get pregnant all the time with levels much higher than that. Do they think its implantation related? Stay strong and if you need to take a break, do what is right for YOU. YOU are the one that has to go through this. Know that you will be a mother - a BFP will happen for you...have you ever heard that quote "When you feel like giving up, hope whispers "try one more time"....I love that quote and believe there is alot of truth behind it :)


----------



## Wallie

I've always said the whole IVF process is fine, the sniffing the injections (I actually don't mind at all), I'm the happiest when I'm going through it as something is happening, no more waiting and waiting but the bfn is the most awful thing ever. Usually it's a couple of weeks after the bfn it hits me the hardest. It's all the uncertainty of what's next and will it ever happen.

That's why I'm so scared to do it again.

:hugs:


----------



## JaniceT

I had two full fresh ICSI cycles at clinic A and suffered from so much pain of OHSS and yet the Doc put my enbryos back in my at Day 3. Such a horrible experience both times! We have to pay through our teeth here as Govt does not help.

We decided to switch doctors and gve it one last try because it was just too expensive and taxing for our marriage. Surprisingly, my new Dr was wonderful!! Zero pain, no OHSS at all. He explained everything, my options and all the additional medicines to control PCO. I got blessed with a beautiful boy. Then we decided to try again. I'm now pregnant with twins.

DO NOT give up. Switch doctors. Do your research especially regarding the
Embryologist and laboratory because that determines a percentage of your success also.

Xoxo hugs


----------

