# don't know what to do about my ex's mum :/



## stephanie20

Basically me and my ex had a bit of a bad relationship, there was violence and cheating and spending money we didn't have on his side and I got pregnant and then he left. Since then I have never stopped him from coming to scans and appointments but recently I think he has decided he doesn't want anything to do with the baby.

My dad has been ringing his mum up every few weeks about the bills in our flat he had in my name and is refusing to pay and everytime she just completely disregards this and says that I have to put his name on the birth certificate otherwise they will get a solicitor involved. I have no intention of putting him on the birth certificate for several reasons. 1) he has admitted that he is dealing drugs "to get money for the baby" and 2) he is telling people where he lives that it isn't his baby. I don't want someone like that on her birth certificate.

Anyway there has been a couple of times where my dad has rang his mum up and shes just completely ignored the fact that there are still bills to pay in our old flat and just threatened me with solicitors if i dont put him on the birth certificate, but my dad rang them yesterday and her husband spoke to us instead who said he can understand why we don't want him on the birth certificate but that the fob will kick off if i don't. He said it will just cause us grief and then said that they're worried that because of their son they're not going to see their granddaughter. I felt sorry for them then and was going to say they could see her but then my dad asked about money and we heard his mum in the background saying "shes not gonna get a penny out of us".

I have recently found out that because the fob works for his stepdad and gets paid cash in hand I probably won't be able to claim CSA :(

I don't know whether to let his parents have some sort of access, i was thinking about sending her a message on facebook but im not sure, I think if they're seeing her its only fair he pays some sort of maintenance, I know I was only going to get a fiver a week off him but its only fair he pays for his own baby. :/


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## jessrabbit

I think you are right in that he should be paying. Also I wouldnt want to put him on the birth cert, I think its not a right but a priviledge when someone has acted how he has and he should have to prove himself by making the effort to see the baby, be a dad and pay his way before he gets on there. Besides he would have to be there with you to register the birth and by the sounds of it, that is not likely to happen.

As for the grandparents. I would back off and wait until baby is born and things have settled down a bit. If they are behaving so childishly at the moment (and unreasonably) just cut off contact and let them get their heads around the situation. Its a hard time for them as they seem to want to be involved but feel they have to back up their son (wrongly or rightly), seems like they seem torn with their loyalties. 

xx


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## Mally01

I think it's very unfair of them to blackmail you with something that is very important for your welfare at the moment (bills being paid etc). I'm not sure whether it's best to involve them very much at this stage as they seem like they won't budge. I think you should do what is best for your baby. If you strongly feel that his name should not go on the birth certificate, then stick to your guns. Don't let anyone blackmail you into doing it if you really don't want to. Things may get better when baby is born but yes, he should help towards paying for baby, it's not fair.


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## stephanie20

yeah i will probably leave them to it for now untill they get in touch with me, i hope the csa can still get something off him even though hes being paid cash in hand, i hate how it seems like hes got away with this when shes as much his responsibility as mine. Really annoys me :( xx


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## Mally01

stephanie20 said:


> yeah i will probably leave them to it for now untill they get in touch with me, i hope the csa can still get something off him even though hes being paid cash in hand, i hate how it seems like hes got away with this when shes as much his responsibility as mine. Really annoys me :( xx

Yep, I know how that feels hun. It's not fair and it's not right but they do it because they _can_. We don't have that choice at all (we all know what choice we do have but it is a very upsetting one). In the end though we end up with the most amazing gift in life, so most of all your worries will hopefully go away when you have LO in your arms. :hugs: You will also be too busy looking after LO to care about FOB being a plonker.


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## stephanie20

> Yep, I know how that feels hun. It's not fair and it's not right but they do it because they _can_. We don't have that choice at all (we all know what choice we do have but it is a very upsetting one). In the end though we end up with the most amazing gift in life, so most of all your worries will hopefully go away when you have LO in your arms. :hugs: You will also be too busy looking after LO to care about FOB being a plonker.

I know, he tried to get me to have an abortion at my first scan and then because I said I wasn't going to have one he lied and said his whole family said he wanted me to have one because it'd be easier on both of us. I think he just said that now because he doesn't wanna pay for her for 18 years, hes pathetic. And I know, he'll lose out in the end when his daughter doesn't wanna know him but it does annoy me how easily they can just walk away.


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## daveww

i will say again as i have said numerous times on this forum ... if you no the person to be the father he should be on the birth certificate regardless of what you think of him. 
a question that has never been answered.... if a father thought a mother should not be on the bc would that be acceptable???
if you choose to have intercorse with someone then both parties are 50% to blame you can't suddenly change your mind now ! .... you want to waste my money and tax payers money so the father has to go to court for parental rights? 
a father is a father and will always be stop wastin everyones money with extra court appearences.


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## stephanie20

daveww said:


> i will say again as i have said numerous times on this forum ... if you no the person to be the father he should be on the birth certificate regardless of what you think of him.
> a question that has never been answered.... if a father thought a mother should not be on the bc would that be acceptable???
> if you choose to have intercorse with someone then both parties are 50% to blame you can't suddenly change your mind now ! .... you want to waste my money and tax payers money so the father has to go to court for parental rights?
> a father is a father and will always be stop wastin everyones money with extra court appearences.

I won't be wasting your money with court appearances, don't worry, if he doesn't want to pay for his child or even see her why should he be on the birth certificate? I do think if the mother wanted nothing to do with her child and didn't wanna pay for them then they shouldn't be on the birth certificate too.

Why would I want to put him on the birth certificate when I know he will just make it more difficult for me because of the rights he will get for doing absolutely nothing? I am the one who will love her, feed her and care for her, he will do nothing, he doesn't deserve the same rights I have.

And yes, I did have sex with him and I regret that alot but people are allowed to make mistakes. My child is not going to pay for mistakes I have made, he isn't making my life or her life harder because it is "right" for him to be on the birth certificate. He needs to work for that right, he isn't going straight on it.


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## daveww

stephanie20 said:


> daveww said:
> 
> 
> i will say again as i have said numerous times on this forum ... if you no the person to be the father he should be on the birth certificate regardless of what you think of him.
> a question that has never been answered.... if a father thought a mother should not be on the bc would that be acceptable???
> if you choose to have intercorse with someone then both parties are 50% to blame you can't suddenly change your mind now ! .... you want to waste my money and tax payers money so the father has to go to court for parental rights?
> a father is a father and will always be stop wastin everyones money with extra court appearences.
> 
> I won't be wasting your money with court appearances, don't worry, if he doesn't want to pay for his child or even see her why should he be on the birth certificate? I do think if the mother wanted nothing to do with her child and didn't wanna pay for them then they shouldn't be on the birth certificate too.
> 
> Why would I want to put him on the birth certificate when I know he will just make it more difficult for me because of the rights he will get for doing absolutely nothing? I am the one who will love her, feed her and care for her, he will do nothing, he doesn't deserve the same rights I have.
> 
> And yes, I did have sex with him and I regret that alot but people are allowed to make mistakes. My child is not going to pay for mistakes I have made, he isn't making my life or her life harder because it is "right" for him to be on the birth certificate. He needs to work for that right, he isn't going straight on it.Click to expand...

thats were you have been mis-informed ... the only thing you will achieve by not putting him on the bc is for him to make a application to the court to get his name on thier as the father... which is a waste of court time which is very precious and also a waste of tax payers money... yes we all make mistakes thats part of life.. and whether you like it or not a mother is a mother and a father is a father from the moment a child is in the womb, thier is no argument for proving yourself , he may be the worst dad in the world or maybe you could be the worst mother in the world but the fact still remains you are the mother and he is the father. so accept that and move forward dont drag it out.


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## stephanie20

[/QUOTE]thats were you have been mis-informed ... the only thing you will achieve by not putting him on the bc is for him to make a application to the court to get his name on thier as the father... which is a waste of court time which is very precious and also a waste of tax payers money... yes we all make mistakes thats part of life.. and whether you like it or not a mother is a mother and a father is a father from the moment a child is in the womb, thier is no argument for proving yourself , he may be the worst dad in the world or maybe you could be the worst mother in the world but the fact still remains you are the mother and he is the father. so accept that and move forward dont drag it out.[/QUOTE]

the fact of the matter is he WONT be going to court to get his name on the birth certificate because he doesn't care so this won't be wasting any precious court time at all. the birth certificate isn't just a document, if hes on it he has the same rights as me which means for example he can take my child and i wouldn't be able to get her straight back, i'd have to apply through the courts to get her back. I'm sure that would be more of a waste of time as I can see him doing this just to spite because thats what kind of person he is. 

and he is the baby's dad, i'm not gonna deny that but theres a difference between being a DAD and being a FATHER, hes never been there for her, he wanted her dead for christsakes so why would i just give him the same rights as me so he can mess us about like he messed me about? 

no ones dragging anything out here, i was trying to get advice about his mother :/


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## jessrabbit

daveww said:


> i will say again as i have said numerous times on this forum ... if you no the person to be the father he should be on the birth certificate regardless of what you think of him.
> a question that has never been answered.... if a father thought a mother should not be on the bc would that be acceptable???
> if you choose to have intercorse with someone then both parties are 50% to blame you can't suddenly change your mind now ! .... you want to waste my money and tax payers money so the father has to go to court for parental rights?
> a father is a father and will always be stop wastin everyones money with extra court appearences.

Dave you need to remember that not every dad is like you and wants or deserves to be on that birth certificate. Every situation is different for everyone on this forum. I know its a sensitive subject for you and gets your back up. 

Some dads do not want or deserve to be involved and putting them on the birth certificate gives them equal parental rights, which some dads abuse when it suits them. 

If a dad has tried to make the mother abort the baby, deserted her and let his family try and emotionally blackmail her by not facing up to his responsibities, why should he have a say in anything without proving it through the courts first?

They should have to prove it and the same stands if the situation is reversed.

Think about what you say on here before you say it. We are here to support each other not give each other a hard time


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## Mally01

I am not going to enter into another arguing session with Dave but I do feel that as Jess says, he needs to consider the bigger picture on this forum and not answer women's responses with negative comments _against_ their choices and decisions about their babies, we are here to try and support and understand each others problems. It's okay to be supportive and give sound advice but I'm sorry Dave, though your situation is hard, emotional and upsetting for you and I sympathise, I really don't think you can try to equate that fairly with what a woman goes through, abandoned and pregnant (and worse in some situations e.g. homeless). Sorry but that is fact.Other women on here have been very nice and understanding towards you and your situation, maybe you can return the courtesy?

If she does not want to put the father's name on the birth certificate because he is not acting or behaving like a father, then that is her personal choice. 

If the majority of absent and neglectful fathers behaved in a noble fashion and were gentlemen in the beginning, surely there would be less need for tax payers money being wasted on court appearances in the first place?.


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## stephanie20

Thank you girls :)

At the end of the day I'm not not putting him on the birth certificate just to wind him up and spite the FOB which I'm sure some women do. I think he'll make my life harder, and abuse his rights and I don't want that happening.

I'm not a nasty person lol :)


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## jessrabbit

Im not a nasty person either, mine isnt going on their until he is paying through CSA, keeping to regular access and agrees to a residency order. Then he can go on. Just think its sensible. Besides being a name on a birth cert doesnt make you a decent dad. He can go on when he proves himself to be worthy of it. Thats just common sense!


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## stephanie20

i know, exactly, i don't think i'll get any of that from mine though lol :(


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## jessrabbit

Not sure I will from mine either, only time will tell. Good luck to both of us xx


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## stephanie20

yep, good luck :) xx


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## Mindy_mini

daveww said:


> i will say again as i have said numerous times on this forum ... if you no the person to be the father he should be on the birth certificate regardless of what you think of him.

I have to agree with this. Regardless of your feelings towards fob, he is still your childs father. 

IMO by not putting his name there, you're almost giving him ammunition go support his claims that it's not his baby.

Plus think of your child, they deserve to know who their father is even if he is a waste of space. In refusing to put his name down it may make your child feel like you're hiding information from the on purpose and could back fire in the long run. 

As for the ex mil, it's your call if you allow access or not. To be fair to her, it's not her fault your ex was a plank with money. Yes it's her son but if he's old enough to live with you, have sex and have a job, he's old enough to take responsibility for things and chasing her seems rather unfair to me.


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## daveww

Mindy_mini said:


> daveww said:
> 
> 
> i will say again as i have said numerous times on this forum ... if you no the person to be the father he should be on the birth certificate regardless of what you think of him.
> 
> I have to agree with this. Regardless of your feelings towards fob, he is still your childs father.
> 
> IMO by not putting his name there, you're almost giving him ammunition go support his claims that it's not his baby.
> 
> Plus think of your child, they deserve to know who their father is even if he is a waste of space. In refusing to put his name down it may make your child feel like you're hiding information from the on purpose and could back fire in the long run.
> 
> As for the ex mil, it's your call if you allow access or not. To be fair to her, it's not her fault your ex was a plank with money. Yes it's her son but if he's old enough to live with you, have sex and have a job, he's old enough to take responsibility for things and chasing her seems rather unfair to me.Click to expand...

its nice to no thier is some mature sensible women out there. i agree with you post completely


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## Mally01

Oh Grow up Dave (yawn)


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## Laura2919

Mally01 said:


> Oh Grow up Dave (yawn)

Thats not necessary really. Your saying you dont want to argue then you should be adult and ignore his comment. :shrug: sometimes asking for an argument isnt going to help you out. 

It does get a bit annoying when people keep going oh shall I put him on the birth certificate or not. 
You had a child with him or are at least having a child with him. I'm a firm believer in children knowing where they came from and yes regardless of situations! I have seen first hand the effects of lying can have!

FOB, as much as I cannot stand the twat is on their birth certificate because he is their dad! Even with rights fathers are still put at the back. :shrug: just my opinion but I agree with both Dave and Mindy_mini


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## Mally01

I'm sorry Laura but I find that the only 'immature' person on this forum at the moment appears to be Dave. If that upsets you and you feel the need to defend him all the time, fair enough but this statement he made below to us women on here (not just me okay) is unnecessary and _yet _again rude! 

*"its nice to no thier is some mature sensible women out there. i agree with you post completely" *


He can say what he wants to say on here but why the sniping at people on a personal level and _judging_ them for their choices?. To be frank, reading on here that he has yet again taken a personal swipe at another pregnant woman insenses me and it's not on. He has a thread on here that quite a few of us (including yourself) are being super nice to him and he has so far said rude and upsetting things to me on another thread and he is now having a go at this young lady about her choice to not put her FOB on a birth certificate, even saying she is wasting taxpayers money.

Like I said before, this appeared to be / is a forum for support and understanding others situations as single parents. I'm pretty damn sure if we all decided to make sarky comments after every post _he_ makes about his emotional, private and upsetting situation with his child we would be pulled up on it, so why should _he_ get away with doing it to us? Are our situations less upsetting or important than his then?


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## daveww

its really is nice to no thier is some mature sensible women out there. but i suppose this forum covers a wide specturm of women so you will get the odd one who is a trouble maker and likes to play god with a child but i guess thats just life . :)


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## Lillybloss

The Father of my baby turned his back on us when I first found out I was pregnant. He never made contact while I was pregnant and in fact when I tried to get him involved and make contact with him he wrote me a letter stating he didn't want anything to do with me or the baby. So he isn't on my sons biry certificate because a) he wouldn't have come with me b) he doesn't want to be. 

There will never b a time when he takes me to court over access because he doesn't want any and I would never change my sins birth certificate and allow him parental responsibility. 
I think mums should do what they know is best for their baby


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## hubble

This is getting really ridiculous. Mally - I'm with you 100 percent. Dave is certainly entitled to his personal views BUT so are we!! I have been following this forum for quite a while and it has been really good in helping me realise there are others in my situation but I certainly have been completely put off sharing my story on this forum as I know it would invite similar unsupportive comments as to what Stephanie and Mally received. Is this not the exact opposite to the point of this forum? There is certainly something wrong.
Apologies if I have offended anyone.


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## Laura2919

Im not sticking up for anything.. I agree with what I believe in... :shrug: you should of been adult enough to ignore his comment. If you want to cause an argument then what your doing is whats gonna happen. Sometimes one person has to just stop and think do you know what? its not worth it!!

Personally I agree that a father should be on the BC, not for him but for that child... What you choose to do is a different matter, I may think its wrong but your still entitled to do it. So as YOUR allowed YOUR opinion I am allowed MINE! 

I have no say what you do with your child but if someone is asking a question its gonna get answered and not everyone has the same view. It all needs to be respected.. 

Plus, you should have just ignored his comment, if he was looking for a reaction he sure got one.


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## kelzyboo

Not putting a name on a birth certificate doesn't equal lying! It doesn't mean mothers aren't going to be honest and open about paternity, its just that there are that few that do not deserve to be on there, because they neither deserve or want the rights that brings.

In an ideal world there would be no need for any of this, we would share responsibility for our children equally and so an equal share of the upbringing but reality isn't like that at all. My DD's father isn't on her birth certificate because he was in prison at the time she was registered, which i believe wasn't my choice, then made zero effort to see here after so the discussion of being added never happened but i would have expected him to prove his commitment to her and pay his way before i'd have ever considered it. I don't believe he should have the same rights i do, if he isn't doing the same job i do, if he isn't raising her and paying for her, sharing the responsibility then why should he share the rights?

Yes he's her dad, and i'll never be dishonest to her about that ever but he doesn't deserve to have rights to a child that he effectively abandoned and has made no effort to connect with, if i had abandoned her i'd have one hell of a fight on my hands to get back those rights i gave away, it shouldn't be any different for fathers who abandon their children!

Then there are the fathers who are great and want to share responsibility and take care of their children and yes there are nasty women out there who will block them all the way and thats wrong too i just think the spectrum is way to broad to ever say that 'all fathers' deserve rights, no matter how they treat their children. I think rights need to be earned, i know mothers have automatic rights but that doesn't mean we don't spend all day every day earning those rights.

I do feel quite strongly about that, it should be on a case to case basis not just giving everyone the same! I know my DD would be a million time worse off with her father in her life, but he'd never get any access no matter how he tried now (and he wouldn't try) and i'm very glad about that, for my childs sake. It used to keep me awake at night, it hurt me deeply, for her, that he wasn't interested, only now i realise that it was for the best. And in some cases it is. It needs to be taken into account that all cases are different and while hopefully the majority are good fathers, there are some who are not. x


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## jessrabbit

I dont come on here at the weekends but am quite shocked to see what a mess this thread has turned into since friday. 

I thought this was somewhere I could come and be honest about my situation and get constructive advice. Everyones situation is different and constructive advice is always welcome. What is right for one person is not necessarily right for another.

I'm not even going to bother to put my point across in regards to the conversation above. 

But I am really saddened to feel like I can't be bothered to come to this section anymore. I didnt come here to be judged or abused by people, I came here for support and not to get caught up in petty, immature slanging matches.


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## MummyJade

My daughters Dad is on her Birth Certificate, even has his last name.

I agree being on the birth certificate doesn't make a person a dad or a mum, but i think every child if given the chance has a right to have both names on it..

FOB doesn't bother with our daughter much, he picks and chooses.. Do i regret it? No, he is her dad and imo she didn't/doesn't deserve a blank space on her Birth Certificate (no matter how good or bad of a dad he is).. He had Parental Responsibility of our daughter just like me, but that means nothing to him..

Maizie is known as my surname now as he isn't about much and none of his family bother with her i didn't want her feeling not wanted (if that makes sense), but once she is old enough she can decide if she would like to change her name to mine or keep her surname (his)... 

I know in some cases it isn't that simple to put the dad on, like him not around/not wanting anything to do with the baby.. 

But i do think some peoples judgements on if they should have the dad on the birth certificate are clouded by their feelings and anger rather then whats best to child... 

x


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## daveww

MummyJade said:


> My daughters Dad is on her Birth Certificate, even has his last name.
> 
> I agree being on the birth certificate doesn't make a person a dad or a mum, but i think every child if given the chance has a right to have both names on it..
> 
> FOB doesn't bother with our daughter much, he picks and chooses.. Do i regret it? No, he is her dad and imo she didn't/doesn't deserve a blank space on her Birth Certificate (no matter how good or bad of a dad he is).. He had Parental Responsibility of our daughter just like me, but that means nothing to him..
> 
> Maizie is known as my surname now as he isn't about much and none of his family bother with her i didn't want her feeling not wanted (if that makes sense), but once she is old enough she can decide if she would like to change her name to mine or keep her surname (his)...
> 
> I know in some cases it isn't that simple to put the dad on, like him not around/not wanting anything to do with the baby..
> 
> But i do think some peoples judgements on if they should have the dad on the birth certificate are clouded by their feelings and anger rather then whats best to child...
> 
> x

i agree with you totally :thumbup:


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## teal

I would like to say that FOB is not on my son's birth certificate but it's not through choice. Where I live if you're not married both parents have to be there when registering the birth. Since FOB cut all contact after I refused a termination I registered the birth alone (in tears) and the father's details were left blank. So it's not always as simple as 'you know who the father is so he should be on the birth certificate.'

To the OP I'm so sorry to hear that you're having trouble with your ex and his mother. They don't deserve all the nice things if they can't help with the responsibilities (eg finance) 

:hugs: xx


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## chichestermum

I haven't read all of the posts as it seems to of got a bit heated in places.
I think that if he hasn't been there and proven himself to be supportive and you dont feel right putting him on the birth certificate then don't, he had a choice to be a dad and he seems to have not bothered. Tell both him and his parents that its only for the time being him not being on the birth cert and that if he starts being a good dad when baby is here that you can both pay half the amount of the fee to add his name. but make there be a length of time he has to be a good dad for so that he cant just be involved for a month to get what he wants, say like a year of being a good dad and then he can add it if he still wants to. 

My mum put my dads name on my birth cert even tho they were split up, he didnt bother with me for 5 years and then he decided he wanted he suddenly wanted access to me because he wanted to have kids with his newest love interest and she wouldnt until he showed he could be a dad. i didnt have a clue who this random man was and as he was on the cert he had rights to see me and bullied my mum into letting me go with him on days out etc which i hated. My mum went to a solicitors ended up having his name taken off the birth certificate and he gave up his parental rights. 
So i fully support women who dont wish to put the fathers name on birth certificates because my experience of having them on there when they are not acting like a father isnt the best.
Its up to you what you do. xx


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## dustbunny

Some places in this thread seem to burn quite brightly so I'll try and say my own view without pissing people off. 

Yes, it does take two to tango and both of you consented to the tango... but then if he has backed out of his responsibilities towards being a dad in every which way it should not automatically be assumed his name is going on the birth certificate. Having sex, getting off and leaving doesn't make you a father... it makes you a shitty man. 

By not putting his name on the birth certificate it is not denying the child a right to know who there dad is and the mother can always add the fathers name at a later date or the father can go to the court to be added on... it is not wasting the courts time if it means so much to the father. If he wanted to be on the certificate and be a part of the childs life then he would bend over backwards, either through a genuine loving relationship where no question would be asked or through growing a pair of balls and manning up to the situation. 

It is not his parents responsibility to bail him, it is his own. Until he is ready to accept what is going on then go it alone. It is not game playing because a game implies at least 2 people are seated at the table, when one has fucked off then fuck it. And no... the child does not have to have his surname either.

I do think, however, to the men on this forum... it is unfair to not put the fathers name on the certificate if they actively... both financially and emotionally... as both have to be covered [same for the mother] then they should be named....

And the guys on this forum can not deny that some men are pathetic low life scum who think and act with their dicks without little thought for the aftermath.... just as some women are shit too.

The point of a forum is to debate.... not make direct attacks on users. Everyone's opinion matters and everyone deserves a voice.


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## Kacie

Three points that I'd consider in this case. 

1. To be put on the birth ceritficate you both have to go and register the birth together (unless you're married, which I assume you're not). Which means you need to be capable of being in the same room together. Again I don't know if you are or not but it is a factor to consider before the time arises. 

2. The mother should certainly NOT be using this to blackmail you in anyway shape or form and withholding money until it happens. That is just starting completely on the wrong foot if they want a good relationship with you and their grandchild. And tbh, you could just agree with everything she says now and then still go and register alone (not saying you should do this, just pointing out how pointless her argument is right now).

3. (the sensitive issue) . Whilst I agree wholeheartedly that a child should know where they come from and not have a blank spot on their birth certificate, there is one piece of legislation in the UK 'joint parental responsiblity' that terrifies me and would make me think twice _in certain circumstances_...

My FOB is on the BC (DD even has his surname) but, because of this.. If he decided after a visit that he just didn't want to give DD back to me, he doesn't have to... the police have no right to intercept and I would have to apply for a court order to get her back taking a minimum of 3 working days... as an exclusively breastfeeding mother of (at the time) a very young baby, with a very nasty and controlling FOB, this thought/threat from him, kept me awake more nights than you can imagine! 

Again I'm not saying it's right or wrong or will happen to anyone in particular and, yes, it's easy for the FOB to just go to court and have their name put on anyway (but in this instance you can apply for a custody order) but I think it is good to understand exactly what it means to have joint parental responsibility. In the UK it really isn't just about putting the name on the BC to give an 'identity'.. there is a whole lot that goes with it and I think that is what scares mums away from doing it.. especially if their FOB's have made threats in the past.. and vise versa for when the situation is reversed. I guess, as with anything.. joint responsibility only really works if both parents are reasonable.

Again please don't get upset by this.. trying to be objective as possible but each case is different and it's hard to give advice without bringing your own heartache and personal expereince into it sometimes.

Hope it works out ok for you in the end,

xxx


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## Kacie

Oh and with regards to CSA, if you want to pursue it then do it anyway.. He'd have to provide evidence of income or evidence of who is supporting him if no income... if on benefits then I think they usually give at least £5 a week.. or worst they can do is say no and likelihood is it will just highlight his cash in hand job if not xxxx


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## dustbunny

Kacie said:


> Oh and with regards to CSA, if you want to pursue it then do it anyway.. He'd have to provide evidence of income or evidence of who is supporting him if no income... if on benefits then I think they usually give at least £5 a week.. or worst they can do is say no and likelihood is it will just highlight his cash in hand job if not xxxx

£5 is a fucking joke!!! I'm sorry but I am in the same boat RE father not getting of his lazy ass and I think it is unfair that both parents should have equal rights when the mother is working her ass of [2 jobs in my case] and supporting the majority of the costs etc and the father is doing fuck all. 

Sorry for the hijack but it just pisses me off.


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## InVivoVeritas

My daughters' dad is on their birth cert and they have his last name. Fortunately for all of us, they were born before that gave him automatic full parental responsibility.

He gets regular access, but it's fully supervised and he doesn't get overnight visits. He's done things that have shown that he isn't to be trusted with my girls, and although he wants parental responsibility (and has put a huge amount of pressure on me to grant it to him) he hasn't gone to the courts because he knows that with his history no judge will give it to him.

The bottom line is that we're guardians of our children's right and welfare before anything else. If giving parental responsibility to somebody who will abuse it will be disturbing, distressing or dangerous for them then it's our job to stand firm.

This isn't a game of tit for tat. We're the adults in the situation and we're making these decisions for adult reasons.


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## Kacie

dustbunny said:


> Kacie said:
> 
> 
> Oh and with regards to CSA, if you want to pursue it then do it anyway.. He'd have to provide evidence of income or evidence of who is supporting him if no income... if on benefits then I think they usually give at least £5 a week.. or worst they can do is say no and likelihood is it will just highlight his cash in hand job if not xxxx
> 
> £5 is a fucking joke!!! I'm sorry but I am in the same boat RE father not getting of his lazy ass and I think it is unfair that both parents should have equal rights when the mother is working her ass of [2 jobs in my case] and supporting the majority of the costs etc and the father is doing fuck all.
> 
> Sorry for the hijack but it just pisses me off.Click to expand...

Oh I agree it's pathetic but it adds up to £260 a year which could go into savings (if u can afford it) and is better than nothing.. TBh if a FOB doesn't want to pay then they will try anything not too and likelihood is, you'll get very little. But i agree, they shouldn't expect equal rights in this case. 

xx


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## kelzyboo

Kacie i agree with you completely, that scared me too since FOB told me if i ever left him alone with her he'd take her and i'd never see her again (he wasn't on BC) needless to say i never left him alone with her!! I think if the person is unreasonable then its unreasonable to expect any mother, who wants to protect her child, to give in to parental responsibility request, go to court and earn it!! I'd ask for a custody order aswell, its too scary to think they don't have to bring our babies back!

I should be getting £2.60 per week from FOB pmsl, he doesn't pay it, he never wanted to and i don't want it. Won't even feed her for a day, he can shove it!! Plus, i happen to know for a fact that he is working (and claiming benefit) and can pay way more than that, if he chooses not to thats down to him, my child will remember i went without so she could have everything she wanted, and she'll remember he did nothing. If thats what he wants, i can live with that. x


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## PumpkinPatchx

Didn't wanna read & run, was in a similar situation with "my monster in law" after loads of crap during pregnancy I stupidly let them have the chance for access to see my Daughter... then only to drop her after a month and now doesn't acknowledge her in the street if she walks past. I'm not saying your FOB mum will do the same but be very careful as I wouldn't wish that on nobody it broke my heart & I'm still angry with myself.. xx


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## stephanie20

Not been on here for a long time so just seen all these posts, i really do not appreciate being thought of as a bad person on here and to your comment dave no i am NOT trying to play God with my childs life, how dare you say that?

I think your situation and mine are alot different, I don't see my FOB coming on a forum like this and asking for advice regarding his child, no he spends all his money on drugs, threatens me and sleeps with 14/15/16 year old girls from what i'v last heard. If the mother of your baby was doing that would you be happy with her seeing her???

Its ridicolous I'm being judged for not wanting a waste of space like that on her birth certificate, the birth certificate just doesn't state the mother and the father (btw I know who her father is so i don't know why people are saying I will be denying her the chance of knowing him, I will show her photos and tell her about him and the door is ALWAYS open, its not my fault he cant be bothered walking through it) it gives the father EQUAL RIGHTS. Like someone has already said on here why would I willingly give him equal rights when he has done nothing to support her up to now, his own mother made him come to the second scan, he didn't even have the decency to come to that of his own accord. 

But like i said dave, my situation and yours are different, I suppose if you get on your daughters birth certificate you won't use it to cause trouble, you'll see her and be there for her. My FOB would probably take her just to spite me and then I'd have to go to court to get her back....THAT would be wasting taxpayers money, not me not putting him on the birth certificate.

I came on here for advice, not to be judged.


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## stephanie20

Oh and with regards to CSA, he works for his dad and they've told me he'll be starting to pay him cash in hand just so i can't get anything off him. Really sounds like a good dad that don't it?


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## dustbunny

stephanie20 said:


> Not been on here for a long time so just seen all these posts, i really do not appreciate being thought of as a bad person on here and to your comment dave no i am NOT trying to play God with my childs life, how dare you say that?
> 
> I think your situation and mine are alot different, I don't see my FOB coming on a forum like this and asking for advice regarding his child, no he spends all his money on drugs, threatens me and sleeps with 14/15/16 year old girls from what i'v last heard. If the mother of your baby was doing that would you be happy with her seeing her???
> 
> Its ridicolous I'm being judged for not wanting a waste of space like that on her birth certificate, the birth certificate just doesn't state the mother and the father (btw I know who her father is so i don't know why people are saying I will be denying her the chance of knowing him, I will show her photos and tell her about him and the door is ALWAYS open, its not my fault he cant be bothered walking through it) it gives the father EQUAL RIGHTS. Like someone has already said on here why would I willingly give him equal rights when he has done nothing to support her up to now, his own mother made him come to the second scan, he didn't even have the decency to come to that of his own accord.
> 
> But like i said dave, my situation and yours are different, I suppose if you get on your daughters birth certificate you won't use it to cause trouble, you'll see her and be there for her. My FOB would probably take her just to spite me and then I'd have to go to court to get her back....THAT would be wasting taxpayers money, not me not putting him on the birth certificate.
> 
> I came on here for advice, not to be judged.

I think some people have taken their own situation and lapped it over yours. Although I can appreciate where Dave is coming from, I do agree it is unfair to presume all FOB's want to be their for their babies. Case in point there is a whole forum for single parents. Further more you shouldn't feel the need to defend yourself against someone else's opinion, misguided though I'm sure it was, as you have said... your situation is completely different. 

I stand by what I said in my other post but didn't want you to be feeling shit or feeling that everyone is judging you on here, some of us do read and listen. :hugs:


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## stephanie20

> I think some people have taken their own situation and lapped it over yours. Although I can appreciate where Dave is coming from, I do agree it is unfair to presume all FOB's want to be their for their babies. Case in point there is a whole forum for single parents. Further more you shouldn't feel the need to defend yourself against someone else's opinion, misguided though I'm sure it was, as you have said... your situation is completely different.
> 
> I stand by what I said in my other post but didn't want you to be feeling shit or feeling that everyone is judging you on here, some of us do read and listen. :hugs:

I agree that there are some women that are nasty and don't let the dads see their kids as a way to get back at them and that is probably what is happening to dave but not all people deserve to be part of their childs life and not all dads actually want to be there. 

But yeah I understand what you mean, if he wanted to be there and if he wasn't acting like such a **** then I'd have no problem with him being there lol


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## kelzyboo

No one's judging you at all hun, i agree completely with what you've said, mostly because you're situation sounds a lot like my DD's FOB!! 6 years later, he still doesn't care!

There are bad fathers and bad mothers, peoples situations are different and should be treated that way, whats right for one would be a disaster for another, people would do well to realise that before they judge others for their choices. You do what you believe is best for you're child, thats all you can ever do and no one should ever judge you for that xx


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## Laura2919

teal said:


> I would like to say that FOB is not on my son's birth certificate but it's not through choice. Where I live if you're not married both parents have to be there when registering the birth. Since FOB cut all contact after I refused a termination I registered the birth alone (in tears) and the father's details were left blank. So it's not always as simple as 'you know who the father is so he should be on the birth certificate.'
> 
> To the OP I'm so sorry to hear that you're having trouble with your ex and his mother. They don't deserve all the nice things if they can't help with the responsibilities (eg finance)
> 
> :hugs: xx

Same here. FOB had to be there when I registered the twins. 

As for the post about not being able to come here and say what you want. Your still entitled to do that and you shouldnt feel you cant. People have different views and done see things the same. Its just the way it is. I would still post if I had something to post about and I pop into this section frequently and answer what I can... :flower:


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## daveww

i am a little confused as to the mention of my name in sevral posts , i have not personally attacked anyone all i have done is give my opinion from my point of view. each person has a unique point of view. i have posted nothing on this forum to be offensive or upset anyone. if you dont like peoples opinions dont ask the question


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## stephanie20

daveww said:


> its really is nice to no thier is some mature sensible women out there. but i suppose this forum covers a wide specturm of women so you will get the odd one who is a trouble maker and likes to play god with a child but i guess thats just life . :)

^^

implying that i'm trying to play God with my childs life and that im a troublemaker, oh and that i'm not mature or sensible because I don't want him on the birth certificate.

nice.


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## daveww

stephanie20 said:


> daveww said:
> 
> 
> its really is nice to no thier is some mature sensible women out there. but i suppose this forum covers a wide specturm of women so you will get the odd one who is a trouble maker and likes to play god with a child but i guess thats just life . :)
> 
> ^^
> 
> implying that i'm trying to play God with my childs life and that im a troublemaker, oh and that i'm not mature or sensible because I don't want him on the birth certificate.
> 
> nice.Click to expand...

omg your supposed to be a mother... grow up stephanie


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## stephanie20

you know what? i could say the same thing about you but i'm not going to because i'm obviously not as childish as you. I have sympathy for the position you're in and I understand that there are some men that deserve to see their children and have ex girlfriends/wives that stop them but i'm not like that and i don't appreciate being called a trouble maker etc.

sorry if me telling you that makes me childish because i don't think it does. i think you're childish, judging everything by what you've been through which isn't fair, i came on here for advice on MY situation, not to be judged and abused by you because of what you have gone through.


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## kelzyboo

She's mearly pointing out the place that you personally attacked her!! And every other mother who's FOB isn't on BC!!

I don't think you can see past you're own situation, which is understandable, but if all you can do is judge and attack a woman who's doing the best thing for HER child, then you should say nothing.


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## stephanie20

kelzyboo said:


> She's mearly pointing out the place that you personally attacked her!! And every other mother who's FOB isn't on BC!!
> 
> I don't think you can see past you're own situation, which is understandable, but if all you can do is judge and attack a woman who's doing the best thing for HER child, then you should say nothing.

I agree completely. Thank you. :)


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## daveww

maybe you should read the entire post and not pick bits to suit yourself. i very clearly said i did not personally attack anyone or wish to cause offense. if you want to make sure a man is not on the bc of your child then dont sleep with them. if you do then accept the fact that person is the childs father and get on with it.


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## kelzyboo

And give him the means to ruin that childs life??
Not a chance. Not ever.
In an ideal world it would happens like that, its not an ideal world and not all fathers want that responsiblity. You make it sound so simple, it really isn't.

Can't you understand that some fathers don't want to be part of their childs life? Shall we force them? Would that be best for the child?

Your situation sounds awful and there are deffinately bad mothers out there too, but accept that just because you're not a bad dad doesn't mean there are none!


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## daveww

kelzyboo said:


> And give him the means to ruin that childs life??
> Not a chance. Not ever.
> In an ideal world it would happens like that, its not an ideal world and not all fathers want that responsiblity. You make it sound so simple, it really isn't.
> 
> Can't you understand that some fathers don't want to be part of their childs life? Shall we force them? Would that be best for the child?
> 
> Your situation sounds awful and there are deffinately bad mothers out there too, but accept that just because you're not a bad dad doesn't mean there are none!

i would certainly agree that thier are some very bad fathers out thier and a good chunk of them are not even intreseted in being a dad but feel they have to do it becuase of thier own mother of father pusing them into it etc. but the fact still remains the person is the father and has parental responseability or can get it thro the courts and by having intercorse with that person you both created a child , a child is born with a mother and a father not just a mother ... the father might think similar things of the mother unfit parent etc. the bottom line is for the rest of your life the person will always be the father to the child so just accept it ..... and dont play for sympathy and accuse people of targeting a person and being offensive when thier just givin a opinion


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## kelzyboo

I'm playing for sympathy?? PMSL
I couldn't care less tbh, just speaking up for OP who doesn't deserve to be judged!

I earn my parental rights every single day, he doesn't even care enough to send her a birthday card, tbh i don't think he remembers when it is actually. Should he have the same rights as me? No, because he doesn't do the same job as me. Simple. He will always be her dad and when she's older i really hope he actually wants to try to build something then, if thats what she wants and she's not lied to in any way. She'll always know who he is and providing i know, she'll know where he is to contact him when she's older.

If these fathers cared enough they could get those right easily, by proving their commitment to their child, as we do every day. The courts favour fathers now, its not hard. The fact that they don't speaks volumes about them. Why would anyone allow someone the rights to take their child and never bring them back unless they were to be trusted and completely commited to that child and unlikely to ever do that.

Its just life. Not always fair but thats how it is. If they cared they'd get their names added on, proof of a bad dad is when they don't bother trying!


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## stephanie20

> i would certainly agree that thier are some very bad fathers out thier and a good chunk of them are not even intreseted in being a dad but feel they have to do it becuase of thier own mother of father pusing them into it etc. but the fact still remains the person is the father and has parental responseability or can get it thro the courts and by having intercorse with that person you both created a child , a child is born with a mother and a father not just a mother ... the father might think similar things of the mother unfit parent etc. the bottom line is for the rest of your life the person will always be the father to the child so just accept it ..... and dont play for sympathy and accuse people of targeting a person and being offensive when thier just givin a opinion

First of all I am not playing for sympathy :/ I am trying to get advice, its not the same thing and secondly I think anyone would take offence at coming on a forum like this asking for help and instead getting someone calling them a "trouble maker" etc.

You are getting two seperate things tangled up in my opinion, yes I know hes my childs father and I know that will not go away and that doesn't bother me. Believe me she will know who her dad is, I will show her pictures of him and tell her about him like I said before but at the end of the day a birth certificate doesn't just tell a child who their parents are, it enables both parents to have equal rights. Thats all good in an ideal world but in this world that enables a father who only wants to cause trouble to cause trouble. For example if he is on the birth certificate if he sees me in town he can snatch my baby and refuse to give her back until i go to court and get an emergency residency order (i think its called that). Why would I give him the chance to do that?

I know hes my childs father dave but until he acts like that why should I give him these rights? If he mans up and sees her and pays for her and stops acting like a child then he can go on the birth certificate but until then, no way.


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## daveww

you as a women help create the father when you have intercorse , its all well and good pointing out the bad points of a man when your pregnant but you were quite happy to have intercorse with that person initially. bc space for father is for the fathers name grow up whatever your opinion the man is the father


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## stephanie20

daveww said:


> you as a women help create the father when you have intercorse , its all well and good pointing out the bad points of a man when your pregnant but you were quite happy to have intercorse with that person initially. bc space for father is for the fathers name grow up whatever your opinion the man is the father

yes i was because he didn't take drugs, sleep with underage people and abuse me before i got pregnant. you just don't get it at all and i cant be bothered arguing with someone as small minded as you :) do you not think i'd have prefered it if he did want to be there, if i could have a break once in a while? but no that isn't going to happen because he does not want to be a dad. I don't understand why that is so hard for you to understand to be honest :/ 

oh and btw how am i supposed to get him to come to register her with me? did you think about that? no. you just assume because you want to see your child every other man does, he can't go on the birth certificate if he doesn't come with me to register her and he doesn't want to be there when I register her. 

so you grow up and stop thinking everybody wants to see their child because you do...


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## daveww

stephanie20 said:


> daveww said:
> 
> 
> you as a women help create the father when you have intercorse , its all well and good pointing out the bad points of a man when your pregnant but you were quite happy to have intercorse with that person initially. bc space for father is for the fathers name grow up whatever your opinion the man is the father
> 
> yes i was because he didn't take drugs, sleep with underage people and abuse me before i got pregnant. you just don't get it at all and i cant be bothered arguing with someone as small minded as you :) do you not think i'd have prefered it if he did want to be there, if i could have a break once in a while? but no that isn't going to happen because he does not want to be a dad. I don't understand why that is so hard for you to understand to be honest :/
> 
> oh and btw how am i supposed to get him to come to register her with me? did you think about that? no. you just assume because you want to see your child every other man does, he can't go on the birth certificate if he doesn't come with me to register her and he doesn't want to be there when I register her.
> 
> so you grow up and stop thinking everybody wants to see their child because you do...Click to expand...

you should start a petition for the worst treated women in the world, you think you are so hard done by... omg get a grip grow up and stop acting inmature


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## dustbunny

[/QUOTE]you should start a petition for the worst treated women in the world, you think you are so hard done by... omg get a grip grow up and stop acting inmature[/QUOTE]


Oh why don't you take your own advice and grow up. All I can see through this thread is you feeling hard done by and then picking on women for sticking up for themselves. You have all these one liners that you throw at people but when people stick up for themselves or someone else then you fire some cheap shot back.


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## Laura2919

Im pretty sure your both are old enough to leave this be. :shrug: agree to disagree before it ends up locked.


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## stephanie20

[/QUOTE]you should start a petition for the worst treated women in the world, you think you are so hard done by... omg get a grip grow up and stop acting inmature[/QUOTE]

lmfao no i don't think im hard done by :/ i think theres alot of people in a worse situation then me, yourself included.... i don't judge people and make them feel bad about themselves when they come on a forum and ask for advice though....i even sent you a message when this whole thing started saying i'm sorry if i offended you with my post, you didn't have to keep replying but you did. 

and you're the one that sounds immature to be honest, you listen to nothing I have to say and disregard it and make immature comments on a forum that is meant for advice, not childish comments.


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## daveww

you should start a petition for the worst treated women in the world, you think you are so hard done by... omg get a grip grow up and stop acting inmature[/QUOTE]

lmfao no i don't think im hard done by :/ i think theres alot of people in a worse situation then me, yourself included.... i don't judge people and make them feel bad about themselves when they come on a forum and ask for advice though....i even sent you a message when this whole thing started saying i'm sorry if i offended you with my post, you didn't have to keep replying but you did. 

and you're the one that sounds immature to be honest, you listen to nothing I have to say and disregard it and make immature comments on a forum that is meant for advice, not childish comments.[/QUOTE]stephanie your right give yourself a big pat on the back you no everything


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## stephanie20

> Oh why don't you take your own advise and grow up. All I can see through this thread is you feeling hard done by and then picking on women for sticking up for themselves. You have all these one liners that you throw at people but when people stick up for themselves or someone else then you fire some cheap shot back

I agree with this, I comment on other people's posts with advice without dragging my own situation into it and you should do the same to be honest Dave. You should start a petition for most hard done man in the world because all you seem to do is feel sorry for yourself and pick on people that are in a totally different situation to you. Its not fair and its not needed.


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## daveww

stephanie20 said:


> Oh why don't you take your own advise and grow up. All I can see through this thread is you feeling hard done by and then picking on women for sticking up for themselves. You have all these one liners that you throw at people but when people stick up for themselves or someone else then you fire some cheap shot back
> 
> I agree with this, I comment on other people's posts with advice without dragging my own situation into it and you should do the same to be honest Dave. You should start a petition for most hard done man in the world because all you seem to do is feel sorry for yourself and pick on people that are in a totally different situation to you. Its not fair and its not needed.Click to expand...

round of applause for you stephanie... lay it on a bit thicker if you want some more sympathy... if your not intreseted in what i say stop replying and grow up


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## stephanie20

> round of applause for you stephanie... lay it on a bit thicker if you want some more sympathy... if your not intreseted in what i say stop replying and grow up

Have you not noticed that no one takes the same view as you Dave but it seems someone takes mine? 

Why would i be looking for sympathy on an online site? You stop replying because you're not getting anywhere, just making yourself look like a fool.


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## daveww

Yawn !


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## kelzyboo

To be quite honest Dave, and you can all whine at me all you like for saying this but i am entitled, if this is the way you behave it doesn't suprise me that your having difficulties being allowed access to your child.

I can't believe i've actually lowered myself to debating this with someone so unreasonable. Good luck, you'll need it!


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## Laura2919

Dave, I think your looking for a fight and it might be better to leave this one alone. :shrug:


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## stephanie20

kelzyboo said:


> To be quite honest Dave, and you can all whine at me all you like for saying this but i am entitled, if this is the way you behave it doesn't suprise me that your having difficulties being allowed access to your child.
> 
> I can't believe i've actually lowered myself to debating this with someone so unreasonable. Good luck, you'll need it!

I was going to say this too but I didn't wanna lower myself to his level lol.


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## kelzyboo

Lol i'm way past caring about what people like him think, or anyone for that matter!

I won't justify myself to anyone.


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## booflebump

Daveww - if you cannot be constructive in your advice, or refrain from berating the OP, then perhaps you should remove yourself from this particular thread? Rudeness and flaming will not be tolerated.


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## stephanie20

I know, exactly, if hes going to behave like this people should be allowed to pull him up on it...

At the end of the day if we'd gone on to his post and started acting like this he wouldn't have put up with it so I don't see why we should. Pfft.


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## jessrabbit

Well said everyone except for Dave. Because of his attacks I nearly stopped posting in this section. But not anymore, I'm just going to pretend like he doesnt exist, whatever insults or childish comments he throws at me or others, I will be pressing the report button where appropriate.


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