# Thin endometrium/womb lining and light afs



## Chase

Hiya,

I was wondering if any of you have this symptom? After losing my girls last year my periods have been very light 1.5-2 days of light bleeding. My last scan showed that my endometrial layer was only 4.9 at cd 12 and I am concerned that I will never conceive again.

Does anyone have any experience of this or advice? xxxx


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## muncho

hi i was exactly the same.
dont have any kids but went for a vag scan and was told the above. doc suggested i got for a lap..i didnt see why as i have regular periods and no symptoms

had the lap week and turns out i have severe endo..shocking..and i have to have IVF..
im sure this may not be the case with you, but my cells were growing outside of the womb
did the doc suggest anything? lap or progestrone?


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## muncho

p.s my af is also 2 days


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## Chase

Hiya,
I have recently had a HSG and hysteroscopy which did not highlight any particular reason for it. Prior to losing my girls last year my periods were very different (better and longer), so I am not sure what has happened. I thought with endo your periods were supposed to be heavier? They are trying me out with oestrogen patches and progesterone at the moment, but I have an appointment for IVF in Jan. Fingers crossed this will work for both of us!


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## Chase

Has your af always been so short? Is it also light? Sorry if this is too personal. xxx


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## Leila Fae

Since having my Implanon implant taken out 16 months ago my AFs have been very light - a couple of days of very light bleeding, not what I'd call full flow.

I have mentioned this to both my GP and my specialist at the diabetic pre-pregnancy clinic but they don't seem to think it's a problem. Perhaps I should push for a scan. It does worry me that my lining must be so thin that nothing could ever implant. DH has a low rate of morphology too so the odds of fertilisation are against us even before implantation is an issue.

Is a scan something I should ask my GP for?


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## Chase

I would speak to your gp or consultant if you are seeing one at the moment and ask them if you can have a midcycle scan. I have been messed around for the last year with specialists telling me different things, but I had an early mc in April that I am sure was to do with this and when I saw the consultant a few weeks ago he told me that there was almost no chance I would conceive in that month (NICE). Just to let you know though, it is the quality of your lining that is more important than thickness, the specialists look for a triple stripe or trilaminar endometrial layer, which is an indicator of healthy lining.
xxx


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## muncho

i didnt have any symptoms for endo which is wierd

Af has been light for as long as i can remember. years..NEVER had any issues with af and cycle...nothing is too personal
i donated eggs for my sis a few times, maybe since then - that was 5 years ago..??

The hormone stuf shoudl be good are u going to try naturally anyway? we are hopefully dec will b the month

why not ask for the scan, you may have to really push for it though as the doc may not see it as an issue...if you have private insurance you could try thru them..
fingers crossed x


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## FBbaby

It is a relief to read about others who are concerned about their light AF, I think it is the first time I read a similar thread. 

Obviously, I fall in that category, AF last two days at most and that, strangely, ever since my m/c last June. There is another thread in ttc about a lady who also started having light AF after her m/c, so wondering if there could be a link. Before this AF, they were also very watery. I was quite excited on tuesday evening when AF came nice and strong, I thought maybe it was back to normal, but by Wednesday evening, it was almost over, only light bleeding yesterday morning,

There is mixed messages around, many saying it is of no concern, other saying it can be oestrogen deficiency. When they scan me after my m/c, they said my lining was looking good, but still wonder whether it could be a problem. I got my cd3 tests done this morning, including oestrogen levels, so will see. Appointment with consultant in Feb, will definitely ask for a scan to check lining.

Muncho, it will be interesting to see if acupuncture helps with this too. I look forward to your feedback. Unfortunately, don't have private insurance -I work for the NHS ha ha-, but will be prepared to pay if results show problems.


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## FBbaby

I meant to ask you girls, do you have normal fertile mucus? It is oestrogen that controls it, so a lack of it with light AF could, I suppose, be an indication of an imbalance. I don't get ewcm any longer, but good wet mucus. I put it down to my taking antihistamine every day for the past 10 years, but who knows.


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## BigFoot1980

Hi 

I am also concerned about my light AF and lack of EWCM. I just get watery CM and thats it. My AF used to be 3-4 days and now its just 2 days. I talked to my GP and she said it doesn't matter :shrug:


I had an ultra sound 2 years ago on day 14 and my endometrial thickness was written as 5 in the report. I have been concerned about that but none of the doctors who have seen the report ever mentioned it.


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## Chase

5mm is a bit thin midcycle (which is what I had at cd 12) I am currently taking oestrogen to see if that will help. 

For those of you that have had light afs after d&c following mc, I would look into Asherman's syndrome but make sure that it is a specialist that investigates it as most consultants don't know how to deal with it properly and can do more harm than good. There are only 2 in Britain (Mr Adrian Lower and Geoff Trew), both in London and only 1 is NHS. 

I have recently undergone tests for this as I had to have my girls placentas manually removed after giving birth and was worried about scarring, but it has come back clear for me.

xxx


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## Chase

FBbaby said:


> It is a relief to read about others who are concerned about their light AF, I think it is the first time I read a similar thread.
> 
> Obviously, I fall in that category, AF last two days at most and that, strangely, ever since my m/c last June. There is another thread in ttc about a lady who also started having light AF after her m/c, so wondering if there could be a link. Before this AF, they were also very watery. I was quite excited on tuesday evening when AF came nice and strong, I thought maybe it was back to normal, but by Wednesday evening, it was almost over, only light bleeding yesterday morning,
> 
> There is mixed messages around, many saying it is of no concern, other saying it can be oestrogen deficiency. When they scan me after my m/c, they said my lining was looking good, but still wonder whether it could be a problem. I got my cd3 tests done this morning, including oestrogen levels, so will see. Appointment with consultant in Feb, will definitely ask for a scan to check lining.
> 
> Muncho, it will be interesting to see if acupuncture helps with this too. I look forward to your feedback. Unfortunately, don't have private insurance -I work for the NHS ha ha-, but will be prepared to pay if results show problems.

I also work for the NHS, but would advise you to get private insurance before you do investigations if you go for Asherman's testing as it has cost me a fortune!!!!!!


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## Chase

FBbaby said:


> I meant to ask you girls, do you have normal fertile mucus? It is oestrogen that controls it, so a lack of it with light AF could, I suppose, be an indication of an imbalance. I don't get ewcm any longer, but good wet mucus. I put it down to my taking antihistamine every day for the past 10 years, but who knows.

I do get EWCM, but it is only for around 1 day each month. What is interesting about it though is that on my CBFM I often go from low to peak without hitting high (which is when you get increase in oestrogen), this month since I have been on the oestrogen patches I am on high today cd 9 and have had ewcm since yest, so maybe this is helping?


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## muncho

i get a little, but last month i had lots of EWCM , i drank grapefruit juice, took 1000mg EPO from AF to OV and had an orange everyday. they all help with CM and it def worked for me

we also used concieve plus which helps the sperm live longer inside. you need cm to make the environment sperm friendly

sorry dont know about the patches
xx


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## FBbaby

Thanks for all this info. So sorry for the loss of your girls. I did read about Asherman's syndrome a while ago, but I m/c naturally, so wouldn't apply to me, I think!

I too did wonder whether low oestrogen levels would reflect on minimal numbers of high on cbfm. I have checked the last 6 cycles, and despite ovulating early (from cd10 to cd13), I have always had at least two highs before the peak, but your situation confirms that there might indeed be a link. Glad that you got a first high this cycle. Cross fingers that the patch will help. 

I probably will sign up for private insurance with my OH, but because you have to be with them for a couple of years before you are eligible for fertility treatment and by then I will be really old and I expect have had them within the nhs anyway, I'm not in a rush. There is no preferential treatment working for the NHS, but knowing the loops, it does help. I find that being well informed makes a big difference too. Clinicians take you more seriously, and you are more likely to get the right treatment right away. 

Which part of the NHS do yo work for? I'm at the PCT.


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## muncho

FB: i work for a pharma company..how funny is that..we deal with PCT and hospitals all the time..
you are right, being informed makes the clinican take u a bit more serious..alot of pts may not be able to understand the medical implications x


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## FBbaby

I take epo two, 1000mg mornings and evenings, have done for years as supposed to help with pms too. I tried grapefruit juice last month, but made no difference, haven't seen ewcm for years I think. Not overly worried as I did fell pg in May and had none then. I use preseed to help, even though it is not supposed to be a fertility aid. I might use conceive plus this cycle. 

It is so confusing trying to find cause and effect as to why we are struggling to fall pregnant.


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## FBbaby

muncho said:


> FB: i work for a pharma company..how funny is that..we deal with PCT and hospitals all the time..
> you are right, being informed makes the clinican take u a bit more serious..alot of pts may not be able to understand the medical implications x

That's a funny coincidence, three of us (or are there more!) working in the health industry.


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## muncho

FBbaby said:


> muncho said:
> 
> 
> FB: i work for a pharma company..how funny is that..we deal with PCT and hospitals all the time..
> you are right, being informed makes the clinican take u a bit more serious..alot of pts may not be able to understand the medical implications x
> 
> That's a funny coincidence, three of us (or are there more!) working in the health industry.Click to expand...

i know, goes ot show it can affect anyone... funny thing is i work for a company that makes one of the egg stimulation injections!! if i told them i would prob get them free but i dont want them to know

FB i cant remember if you said you were having IVF or not, but i have found a few places where you can get your drugs alot cheaper. I will def be getting them through one of these places..if u want details let me know


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## FBbaby

Oh thank you so much muncho for the offer. I have only just started the journey towards fertility treatment so not at the IVF stage yet, neither clinically nor psychologically, but starting to think about it because if I have problems affecting my ability to conceive, I don't have a lot of time to wait and see what happens.

The irony of our situation is almost laughable! In my case, it is that I am involved in the management of the IVF contract. I have conversed with so many heartbroken patients who have been turned down because one of the partners already has a child from a previous relationship. I don't make the policy, that's the way it is. But I never thought before now that I could find myself in the same position as them (I have children, Oh doesn't). At least I can certainly sympathise!


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## muncho

OMG that is so bizzare. when i 1st joined this forum i took a look at LLTTC and thought thats not for me....now look at me, im living on this site

also when i did the egg donation, i had no idea that one day i would be going thru it..

strange isnt how sometimes you end up in situations where you never thought u would end up...

i really hope you get your BFP..i went to a talk on nutrtion and TTC and its amazing how you forget that by eating healthy can help with everything. so i guess there rae some things that u can do yourself whilst you are on your journey :)


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## muncho

OMG that is so bizzare. when i 1st joined this forum i took a look at LLTTC and thought thats not for me....now look at me, im living on this site

also when i did the egg donation, i had no idea that one day i would be going thru it..

strange isnt how sometimes you end up in situations where you never thought u would end up...

i really hope you get your BFP..i went to a talk on nutrtion and TTC and its amazing how you forget that by eating healthy can help with everything. so i guess there are some things that u can do yourself whilst you are on your journey :)


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## Mrs G

Hi

I used to have really light af and was recommeded to take co enzyme q10 as it builds up the endometrium lining each cycle, hence making af heavier. I def noticed a difference in af and when I had IVF my lining was thick at each scan.

Good luck xx


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## FBbaby

that is so true muncho but that's what we have to remember, life is full of surprises, and things can happen when we don't expect them any longer. I was single for 5 years because I never met anyone who I knew I would want to spend the rest of my life with and when I had just about given up, my soulmate came into my life, even more perfect than what I'd wished for!

Thanks Mrs G for the advice. I was in Tesco 20 minutes ago and so the vit, so thought wth, and got them! Do you know what is the recommended dose to take? Is it safe to take in the 2ww wait too? Is it better to take morning of afternoon? Congratulation on your pg, it is always so heartwarming to read about a bfp as a result of IVF.


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## Chase

FB I work for a mental health trust at the moment, but have worked in physical health too. It is weird that we are all in the 'health' industry!
Can I ask, what is conceive plus?
I used preseed when I got preg with my girls and when I got preg this April too, so it does definitely work!!!
I have been a bit slack with other stuff this month (EPO and grapefruit juice etc) so should really start taking it.
Muncho, would you mind letting me know where you get fertility drugs cheaper from? I wouldn't mind knowing for later.
FB glad that it is unlikely that you have Asherman's, it was a bit concern of mine as I seemed to fit the profile completely after having manual removal of the girls placentas.
xxxx


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## Chase

Thanks for the advice Mrs G, I am currently taking coenzyme Q10 as I was recommended it on the Asherman's site, but have only been taking it for a few days. I got it from Tesco and am just taking one a day, is this right???
FB I believe that you only take it prior to ovulation, but I will double check that.
I also never thought I would be here. I conceived twins naturally really quickly and thought that it would be easy and quick even after losing them. How wrong I was! It just goes to show that you can never predict what will happen in life. 
On the upside though like you FB I never thought I would find my soulmate and I did when I wasn't looking for it either!


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## Chase

Mrs G said:


> Hi
> 
> I used to have really light af and was recommeded to take co enzyme q10 as it builds up the endometrium lining each cycle, hence making af heavier. I def noticed a difference in af and when I had IVF my lining was thick at each scan.
> 
> Good luck xx

Sorry more questions. Can I ask you how much it increased your lining to?


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## muncho

FB this 1s too freaky... i was also single for 5 years before i met DH. i was 35 and had given up hope but he def has been worth the wait!!

Chase.. some of them are pharmacies so juts google them and you will find where thye are. But they can deliver.. ignore the prices, thye were for something else

Applied Dispensary/Ferring @ Home... £12.80
Rowlands Pharmacy....................... £14.10
Moss Pharmacy @ Waitrose............ £14.75
Fazeley ...................................... £12.25
Woking Nuffield ............................ £15.86
Pharmasure ................................. £12.21

Thanks Mrs G. Im trying not to self medicate. im seeign the doc on the 12th dec and wil ask him about this :)

finally ladies. i have been readig about the zita west clinic in london. hmmm they seem really good and have read fantasti reviews. Is anyone taking anykind of supplementts, if so which ones. they have good ones but they are expensive..

chase.... i used to promote seroquel for mental health...this thread is becoming too spooky..can u remind me again whethe u are tryin nautrallu or IVF?


Concieve plus is the ONLY lubricant that is sperm friendly ..its still better to have your own cm, but conieve is the only one that closesy mimics our natural cm. i have heard people say its easier to use than preseed. we use it..i would def buy that over preseed..it only in the UK, is that where u are from??


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## Leila Fae

Wow, lots of advice! I've only had EWCM twice since starting TTC. 

I shall try the coenzyme Q10 and consider Conceive Plus. We've been using Preseed up to now.

It's such a relief to touch base with other ladies who have similar issues. I've been finding it so tough lately and getting a bit down about the whole thing. Poor old DH had me sobbing down the phone to him last night - he works away a lot and because of that we can't try again until Jan. I'm finding it much harder than I thought I would.

Anyway, onwards and upwards!


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## muncho

hi Leila
we all know how you feel, i felt so down last week after my lap and now i feel so much better. have you tried EPO ?grapefruit juice?

i have started a thread called which prenatal...maybe you could consider the one i have suggested as it contains the Q10 plus lots of ther things that may help..

you can chat to us anytime on this thread..:)


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## Leila Fae

I've just been shopping and bought some Q10 and some grapefruit juice to add to my supply of agnus castus and Bvits! Will be popping onto the other thread to see what else I can be doing.

What with all this and my usual diabetes medication I'm going to end up rattling like a medicine bottle! :dohh: Still, if it does the job :thumbup:


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## muncho

bril...fingers crossed...


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## Chase

muncho said:


> FB this 1s too freaky... i was also single for 5 years before i met DH. i was 35 and had given up hope but he def has been worth the wait!!
> 
> Chase.. some of them are pharmacies so juts google them and you will find where thye are. But they can deliver.. ignore the prices, thye were for something else
> 
> Applied Dispensary/Ferring @ Home... £12.80
> Rowlands Pharmacy....................... £14.10
> Moss Pharmacy @ Waitrose............ £14.75
> Fazeley ...................................... £12.25
> Woking Nuffield ............................ £15.86
> Pharmasure ................................. £12.21
> 
> Thanks Mrs G. Im trying not to self medicate. im seeign the doc on the 12th dec and wil ask him about this :)
> 
> finally ladies. i have been readig about the zita west clinic in london. hmmm they seem really good and have read fantasti reviews. Is anyone taking anykind of supplementts, if so which ones. they have good ones but they are expensive..
> 
> chase.... i used to promote seroquel for mental health...this thread is becoming too spooky..can u remind me again whethe u are tryin nautrallu or IVF?
> 
> 
> Concieve plus is the ONLY lubricant that is sperm friendly ..its still better to have your own cm, but conieve is the only one that closesy mimics our natural cm. i have heard people say its easier to use than preseed. we use it..i would def buy that over preseed..it only in the UK, is that where u are from??

I am trying naturally at the min, but am taking oestrogen to see if it bulks up my lining. I have an IVF initial appointment in January, so I guess I will have to see what happens then. This thread is a bit scary!!!! I am in the UK too and am interested in conceive plus, but have had success with preseed twice, so am interested to see if it is any better.


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## muncho

hi chase

i have heard good stuff about preseed, i think concieve is just a new competitor.but it is the only ones that contains calcium and magnesuim ions which mimic the your natural cm..thats what they say..

we too are trying naturally till Jan. im out this month due to the lap , so it december baby or IVF..hopefully ill be ov around the xmas hols so ill be nice and stress free..

im also chaning my diet from tomorrow and hope the acupuncture will help - although i have one tube that is twisted so who knows....

hope the esotrogen works, how will you know, will u have a heavier period? did i read u are about cd 9? ill be starting IVF early jan as long as i can get my first consulation in Dec..not looking forward to this whole process :(


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## Chase

I am not sure how I will know unless I get a heavier af? Is that how quickly they do IVF???? My appt is in Jan so could it be quite soon afterwards that it starts? I am now on cd 11, so am going to be busy for the next few days :blush:
Good luck with getting a Christmas BFP, I hope that these few months are lucky for both of us. xxx


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