# Struggling to listen, bad attitude. Please help me before i pack a bag.



## DCS

Ds has been realy struggleing yo listen at school recently. A gtoup of them ( year 1, so aged 5/6) got detention for chatting and not listening. Ds has got detention again tomorrow, for twisting a kids arm for no reason. Tbh, im not surprised. He has had a crappy attitude at home for a couple weeks now, and is fighting / argueing / attacking either his sister or his dad at home. I get the cheek and argueing, but oh and dd get attacked ( hitting, kicking, pulling, screaming right in their faces) he chases dd round the house growling at her and she gets scared and ends up running into a door. This motning ds tried shoving OH while he had a cup of tea, so oh asked him to stop, ds carried on, oh put his hand out infront of him while he put his tea down ( he was bringing it in from the kitchen) ds throws himself to the floor. As soon as i come down ds tells me OH shoved him. Ds had his tablet taken off him a few weeks ago, and hasnt had it back because of the behaviour. Im so sick of argueing with him, i know oh is too. I spoke to his teacher again today, and she daid she will get back to me at the end of the week with an idea of what we could do to help him. Tbh im not holding out much hope because i tried to discuss hos behaviour before it got this badn she said she would get back to me to book an appointment with her but still hasnt and its been a few weeks. His behaviour at school has gotten worse since the arrival of the new teacher. It could be a coincidence because his tonsils have gotten bigger since before xmas and this is causing him sleepless ( not by much, he wakes up coughing alot. But combined with his lack of ironhe needs a good solid 12 hours of sleep to be in a decent mood) nights. Im going to book him in to see the gp tomorrow, see if we can get a blood test to see how bad his iron is. He barely eats real food, just lots of carbs. His diet is in no way varied. His lunch is the same everyday. I just have no idea what to do. His old teacher was fab, and always made time for us, and took the time to listen when i tried to pre warn her about his behaviour. Therefore anticipating it and nipping it in the bud before it got to a point of detention. I should add, we can tell his behaviours going to get bad, when his coughing gets bad in the night and he starts having accidents. We always try to let the teacher know. He just doesnt listen. Even with his after school atctivuty today he just zoned out and had no idea what was happening. We are waiting for an appointment foe his tonsills to be removed but have been told it could be over a years wait. 

Im so sorry this is long jumbled mess. Thanks for reading. Apologies for the typos. Im on my phone.

Eta: when he isnt like this, he is lovely, such a polite, well mannered, thoughtfull, caring little guy. He is so smart, he amazes me with his love for learning. I sometimes wonder if he isnt being challeneged enough in school. The books he brings home he reads in a matter of minutes, his homework is done in usualy 5/10 minutes. He says alot of the work is too easy so he gets bored.


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## Nibblenic

Wow thats a lot to have on you plate.

Have you considered going to the GP to mention how life invasive his lack of sleep is? That its affecting all areas of his life? It might move him up the list a bit. 

As for the teacher, can you approach the KS team leader/deputy/head or even Senco? Maybe you need a diary to pass between you both or an agreement about contract. 

Basically harass school, harass your Gp because unless you push these underfunded areas at the minute you wont get anywhere as there arent enough resources


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## DCS

Thank you. I took him to the gp the otherday. He basically fobbed me off and said i needed to see the school nurse, the school nurse who is is once a month and only if she has enough appointments booked. I asked OH to book into see her when he droped ds off the otherday and the school said they would contact me, that was friday, i havnt heard anything since. 
Iv contacted the hospital, they said he was on the waiting list, but to contact the waiting list department who may be able to give me a timeframe for his wait. Iv been ringing them since friday but they never answer. Iv also spoken to a couple different people ( professionals from 2 different companies) who have said they have no advice. I wondered if some sort of therapy would help him deal with his feelings. I may see if my therapist has any suggestions. 
On the plus side, we had a lovely weekend, no bad serious bad behaviour. The few spells we did have were quickly resolved with talking, and they didnt seen so awfull because it was only a few moments. He hasnt been in any trouble at school since thursday, we have a meeting with his teacher thursday, again im sure she will cancel, but will wait and see. Ds hasnt been coughing as much the last few days, so hasnt been keeping himself awake. Im hoping this is him starting to feel better and so his behaviour will improve. Will keep on at the achool because im keen to get this dealt with before the next time he isnt feeling to good.


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## redneckhippy

Can he get his tonsils out if they are interfering with his sleep?


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## DCS

redneckhippy said:


> Can he get his tonsils out if they are interfering with his sleep?

Yes, thats one of the reasons they decided to remove them. Unfortunately we have no idea how long it will be untill they are removed. They will be removing them just no idea when. Whwn i spoke to the hospital they said they had no idea, they are currently working on people who have been waiting 3 months but also people qho have been waiting over a year.


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## zorak

It sounds like his illness /lack of sleep is affecting his behaviour. Also sounds like his class teacher is being pretty useless. Where in the world are you? 

Keep harassing the doctors until something is done, but it also sounds like you need to address some things at home. Try to improve his diet, maybe look for professional advice on how to do that. 

Regarding the school, bypass the teacher and make an appointment with the HT.


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## DCS

zorak said:


> It sounds like his illness /lack of sleep is affecting his behaviour. Also sounds like his class teacher is being pretty useless. Where in the world are you?
> 
> Keep harassing the doctors until something is done, but it also sounds like you need to address some things at home. Try to improve his diet, maybe look for professional advice on how to do that.
> 
> Regarding the school, bypass the teacher and make an appointment with the HT.

The teachers new, i realy want to give her a chance but today we turned up and she came over and said she couldnt actually see me today because she had to get to an urgent meeting. So i went to the deputy head. Who is going to have a chat with her. We have been told to see her tomorrow to book another meeting and he or someone else will be present for that. 

He has previously seen a dietition. They weighed him, and discusses his eating offered the usual suggestions, no snacks, try a bite of everything, hide veg, all of which we have been doing even after he was discharged from them. However he still doesnt eat a great diet. They discharged us because he gained 1kg over the course of several months. He is booked in for a blood test because we think his iron levels are low, i imagine they will prescribe iron medication, and suggest we keep it up through food, which is impossible because he doesnt eat. Thanks all.


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## zorak

That's so tough. I'm a teacher and actually gobsmacked at a teacher acting like that. No meeting trumps a pre arranged appointment with a parent.


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## DCS

zorak said:


> That's so tough. I'm a teacher and actually gobsmacked at a teacher acting like that. No meeting trumps a pre arranged appointment with a parent.

Thanks, i didnt know if i was being a bit silly. I was meant to talk to her thia morning but she wasnt there, i had another teacher approach me and have arranged something for the end of the first week back. Which is a pain because iv been dealing with this for years and asked for the firat meeting over 4 weeks ago


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## lau86

What are you wanting the teacher to do? it sounds like his problems are related to his medical issues?


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## DCS

lau86 said:


> What are you wanting the teacher to do? it sounds like his problems are related to his medical issues?

Well to begin wiyh i wanted to warn her of the signs that we notice his behaviour is going to get bad. Then i wanted to discuss a reward system or something similar that wpuld be consistant with school and home to help manage his behaviour. I was hoping she could share what they use in school and we could use the same at home, previously he has had a reward chart for school and home once he collected x amount of stickers between them he got a treat. Now im just annoyed that they keep telling me he is a good kid when ever i try to tell them that he has had a rough night so is emotional, or that his behaviours been bad that morning. 
Im not talking not listening or not picking up his toys, i mean more throwing stuff at people, getting in our faces, hitting us. 
Since the health vistor wont see him, and the school nurse says its not what she deals with, we have no idea how to manage the bad days and everything we try fails untill it eventually passes. And it does eventaully pass, for a few weeks. But while he is displaying such aggression, its awful.


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## Apple111

Hi hon, didn't want to read and run. Sorry you and oh are going throug this with your little boy.. Just wanted to share my experience with u. My little boy , just coming up 4 had to have emergency op last year to remove tonsils and adds. ( still on waiting list even in emergency) This was due to sleep apnea. My little boy was always full on, there is a big gap between him and our older children so we always put it down to him being a bit spoilt&#128521;.. We were really surprised at the difference in him after the op, he definately seemed to settle down, wasnt half as moody, speech came on loads, and just generally seemed a nicer and happier little boy..this was also noticed by his nursery.. They said they noticed a big difference in him and I hadn't prompted that they just commented one day..

I do agree, although it sounds like u r that it's important to push services. In the end my oh emailed the consultant ( head of that department) and explained the severity of our concerns , saying that my son was stopping breathing at night, and he got back to us and we were seen within a couple of weeks for the op, we were told 6 months by his understudy the day before in a consultation. Id explain the impact it is having in his home , school life and exaggerate if needed, not that you should have to.. You could even ask if you could be seen quicker at another hospital as its normally a day case so u should be home same night if all is well. 

Regarding his behaviour, I work in mental health and oh has a lot to do with childrens services/ camhs. It might be worth giving camhs a call directly and asking them if they could send you out any information on interventions to try and help with his behaviour. There are so many things they do in addition to reward charts and they support the parents as well. Maybe trying making things into games to try and understand some of his feelings, using art and pictures, ect. I find that when I bake with my little boy and talk at same time I get loads of Information from him. With my teenager I have Sussed that if I take him for a drive and put music on ( he is always singing ) he chills out and I drop the odd question in and get to know how he is that way) I'm sure CAHMS waiting lists would be really long but they might send h out some u go or be able to advise. I'm not suggesting he needs referring at this stage but if someone calls me at work im happy to send info x

I hope you get things sorted soon. You sound like u and you oh are doing a great job. It's so difficult. He sounds like a good little boy underneath just going through a difficult patch ..also im not sure if u mentioned if his sister was older of younger? Only mentioning as my Older ds def changed when sibling arrived so I made sure I had mummy day just me and him x 

Apple xx


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## DCS

Apple111 said:


> Hi hon, didn't want to read and run. Sorry you and oh are going throug this with your little boy.. Just wanted to share my experience with u. My little boy , just coming up 4 had to have emergency op last year to remove tonsils and adds. ( still on waiting list even in emergency) This was due to sleep apnea. My little boy was always full on, there is a big gap between him and our older children so we always put it down to him being a bit spoilt&#128521;.. We were really surprised at the difference in him after the op, he definately seemed to settle down, wasnt half as moody, speech came on loads, and just generally seemed a nicer and happier little boy..this was also noticed by his nursery.. They said they noticed a big difference in him and I hadn't prompted that they just commented one day..
> 
> I do agree, although it sounds like u r that it's important to push services. In the end my oh emailed the consultant ( head of that department) and explained the severity of our concerns , saying that my son was stopping breathing at night, and he got back to us and we were seen within a couple of weeks for the op, we were told 6 months by his understudy the day before in a consultation. Id explain the impact it is having in his home , school life and exaggerate if needed, not that you should have to.. You could even ask if you could be seen quicker at another hospital as its normally a day case so u should be home same night if all is well.
> 
> Regarding his behaviour, I work in mental health and oh has a lot to do with childrens services/ camhs. It might be worth giving camhs a call directly and asking them if they could send you out any information on interventions to try and help with his behaviour. There are so many things they do in addition to reward charts and they support the parents as well. Maybe trying making things into games to try and understand some of his feelings, using art and pictures, ect. I find that when I bake with my little boy and talk at same time I get loads of Information from him. With my teenager I have Sussed that if I take him for a drive and put music on ( he is always singing ) he chills out and I drop the odd question in and get to know how he is that way) I'm sure CAHMS waiting lists would be really long but they might send h out some u go or be able to advise. I'm not suggesting he needs referring at this stage but if someone calls me at work im happy to send info x
> 
> I hope you get things sorted soon. You sound like u and you oh are doing a great job. It's so difficult. He sounds like a good little boy underneath just going through a difficult patch ..also im not sure if u mentioned if his sister was older of younger? Only mentioning as my Older ds def changed when sibling arrived so I made sure I had mummy day just me and him x
> 
> Apple xx


Thank you. Thank you so much. His sistet is younger. She is 2. I have contacted camhs. They sent me out a bunch of info. Im slowly going through it all. They also suggested another company who i called and both said it seemed like we were doing the right things. I mentioned this to his deputy head, and he suggested this wasnt a good idea because ds would get labled. Which i think is a poor attitude. I almost feel like they should be encouraging him getting help not saying its a bad idea. I see where he is coming from, ds mught get bullied or picked on if other kids found out he was talking to mental health professionals but surely the school should be stopping the nasty behaviour if it came to it rather than saying ds shouldnt get any help he needs. I mean, why should ds not get help dealing with his feeling, speaking to whoever he needs to, if he needs to, just because a bunch of kids are being nasty in the play ground. Unfortunately nothing can be done without a referal. Im seeing his teacher next week so will see what they suggest and take it from there. 
My therapist is amazing, has helped me deal with my ocd and anxiety amazingly in a few months. If ds could get similar, and see similar results that would be fab. 
Thank you again. Sorry for the jumbled mess.


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## Apple111

It may be worth considering a few sessions private hon if u could manage it financially as this this would avoid involvement officially, for now anyway. Also working In services myself I know that, definately in my area, staff are really under pressure with high caseloads so time would be limited anyway. If you have experienced therapy yourself you would be in a good position to help him through it and understand the principles, look for someone that specialises in working with children tho as it is different to working with adults although many of principles are the same, especially if it's a CBT approach which im guessing is what you have worked with yourself.. A lot of childens therapy includes parent involvement and education on how to support and understand your childs difficulties, development and maintaining factors. Good luck hon, like I said before you are doing a great job ! make sure u get some 'me time' yourself as this will help you deal with difficult times x


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## noon_child

Lack of sleep can be such a major factor in behaviour. 

Would he nap after school do you think? 
Could you put his bedtime a little earlier when you know he's having bad nights?
Would school allow him to ask to go somewhere for a rest/sleep?

Sounds like he's feeling sorry for himself but doesn't know quite why or what is going to make him feel better so he's lashing out at your family as a way of trying to get some attention. Maybe you could come up with a list (when he is calm) of things he can do if he's feeling rotten that are less destructive e.g
"I know you aren't well and your tired but hitting won't help. Let's make a list of things that might help you feel better....e.g. A cuddle, a warm drink, a bath, a story" . Let him know that asking for these things will help the family know he isn't feeling at his best.

Does he currently take a vitamin supplement?

And OH my GOD what an unprofessional deputy head! That has made my blood boil. Mental Health should not be stigmatised and yet here is a school leader doing just that! I would be making a formal complaint. The biggest killer of men age 17-30 is suicide because men feel stigmatised and don't access services and here is a teacher saying you should avoid accessing mental health services for your child who is suffering!! You should be commended for being open to getting all the advice and help you can. I . AM. SO. MAD


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## DCS

noon_child said:


> Lack of sleep can be such a major factor in behaviour.
> 
> Would he nap after school do you think?
> Could you put his bedtime a little earlier when you know he's having bad nights?
> Would school allow him to ask to go somewhere for a rest/sleep?
> 
> Sounds like he's feeling sorry for himself but doesn't know quite why or what is going to make him feel better so he's lashing out at your family as a way of trying to get some attention. Maybe you could come up with a list (when he is calm) of things he can do if he's feeling rotten that are less destructive e.g
> "I know you aren't well and your tired but hitting won't help. Let's make a list of things that might help you feel better....e.g. A cuddle, a warm drink, a bath, a story" . Let him know that asking for these things will help the family know he isn't feeling at his best.
> 
> Does he currently take a vitamin supplement?
> 
> And OH my GOD what an unprofessional deputy head! That has made my blood boil. Mental Health should not be stigmatised and yet here is a school leader doing just that! I would be making a formal complaint. The biggest killer of men age 17-30 is suicide because men feel stigmatised and don't access services and here is a teacher saying you should avoid accessing mental health services for your child who is suffering!! You should be commended for being open to getting all the advice and help you can. I . AM. SO. MAD

Thank you. I am also really mad about the whole issue with the deputy head. We had a metting with his teacher today and her supervisor (?). Hos teacher looked completely confused at everything i was saying about his behaviour. Its like they dont believe it exists because he isnt half as badly behaved at school. So we ( me and OH) figured it was pointless trying to get them to help and we would find a solution ourselves. They keep telling me he is a good kid, which i know, im his mum, i know he is a great kid but they obviously dont believe theres a problem. Which is a shame. The lady who deals with behaviour wasnt actually there, neither was the deputy head, has he had said he would be. 
Teachers suggested somewhere he can go, a quiet corner with books or a soft toy, when he feels cross. Im willing to give it a try and we brought down a cozy chair with a fluffy throw and explained to both kids what it was for. I dont see it working personaly, but im willing to give it a crack. They said they didnt want to offer too many suggestions because they didnt want to overload us with ideas ( i understood this as, we havnt prepared for this and have nothing to offer).
DS currently goes to bed at 6.30 is usually asleep very quick providing there is no major tantrum. Im trying to bring it forward a bit so we are upstairs sooner but its just so much of a rush after school. He wakes up around 6. He stopped napping at 18 months. The only time he naps now is if he has a fever. I feel like i completely failed today. Iv been feeling so rough with a stupid cold and cough that wont shift, im finding everything is such a chore. I realy didnt have the energy to argue with what the teachers said. 
I must admit, he has been coughing a little less at night, and his behaviour has been so much better the last week or so. Its been lovely, but i still feel a bit on edge waiting for the next dose of bad behaviour. 
Thanks for the replies. It helps to just rant and write this stuff down. Helps me make sense of it all.


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## Rhea Santiago

I think we should know first the problem of our child. I know my toddler also doesn't want to listen to me at all and defy me on things that he does not like to do. In case of your child, as I read your post, he has tonsillitis and maybe he is not in the mood because of it. Well, you should probably see his doctor first before letting him have his classes. No matter what we say, health of our child is more important than anything else.


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