# Doctors, Tests, & All the Rest!



## Megg33k

After speaking with groovygrl in another thread, I think this is important!

For those of you who feel that your doctors have failed you or aren't being helpful enough... I want this thread to help you, me... us! I want it to be a collection of the tests that can and should be run to try to help discover potential issues that keeps up from having the babies we desire so desperately!

My next post is going to be a list of my recent blood test results, with the "normal" range of those results. I'll also add some info about one of the results specifically that many people aren't tested for and probably should be!

Please, ask your questions, add your experiences, vent your frustrations at the medical community.... whatever you need to do!

*IMPORTANT LINKS AND INFO:*

*Tests suggested by groovygrl's naturopath:*

1) FBC - including ESR
Vit. D
iron, ferritin, B12
TSH
FSH, LH, E2 - Day 2-3
lgE, lgA
Antinuclear antibodies
Cardiolipin antibodies
Lupus anticoagulant
Thrombophilia studies
2) Progesterone - Day 21

*Chart of normal blood test results and when tests should be done (also from groovygrl):*

https://www.inciid.org/faq.php?cat=in...ity101&id=2#81


*Links for PCOS sufferers from (from hb1):*

A link re GI diet and PCOS :
https://gynecological-health.suite101...m/what_is_pcos

PCOS and rapid weight gain :
https://womenshealth.suite101.com/art...id_weight_gain

Clomid overview :
https://www.womens-health.co.uk/clomid.asp

Soulcycters :
https://www.soulcysters.com/

Great Metformin link:
https://www.soulcysters.net/faq-about-metformin-48708/

General PCOS info:
https://www.netdoctor.co.uk/womenshealth/facts/pcos.htm

*Link to info on AMH test (from zeezee):*

https://www.advancedfertility.com/amh-fertility-test.htm

*Info on Vitamin B12 (from VGibs):*

"Vitamin B12

Rationale:

Vitamin B12 has been shown to contribute to increased risk of miscarriage and this increased risk of miscarriage can be reversed with vitamin B12 supplementation.

Elevated homocysteine levels are associated with an increased risk of miscarriage. Vitamin B12 helps to lower elevated homocysteine levels.

Dosage:

1,000 - 2,000 mcg (1 - 2 mg) per daY."

On this site...www.viteminexpress.com

*Vitamin D deficiency and fertility (from Megg33k):*

Link to Google Search.... Too many good pages to list them all!

Its really interesting stuff and not often checked by most doctors! Some sources say that up to 75% of women don't have nearly enough Vitamin D. It can affect the fertility of both men and women!

*MTHFR (from heatherv2):*

Methylenetetrahydrofolate reductase (MTHFR) is a rare genetic defect that can lead to complications in pregnancy.

https://www.pregnancy-info.net/mthfr.html

*Adrenals (from shaerichelle):*

Improve Your Fertility by Maximizing Your Adrenal Gland Function

*Celiac Disease (from fluffyblue):*

My friend has piped in with a comment about something to do with wheat intolerances can cause miscarriage do you know anything about this - im now concerned !

I googled this:

Women who experience recurrent miscarriages or those whose fetuses show intrauterine growth ******ation may have undiagnosed celiac disease.

Celiac disease is a genetic condition that causes those afflicted to experience difficulty absorbing gluten, as found in wheat, oats, barley, and several other grains. Symptoms include diarrhea, abdominal distention, and fatigue. And research suggests that more people may have a symptomless, milder form that may often go undetected. Recent studies have indicated that many people are found to have mild forms of the disease when their blood is tested for the condition, even though they were unaware that there was a problem.

Women who experience repeat miscarriages, also known as recurrent spontaneous abortions (RSA) or intrauterine growth ******ation (IUGR) -- a condition in which a baby is born significantly smaller than normal -- may have celiac disease that has gone undetected.

Researchers, led by Dr. Antonio Gasbarrini, explain that they decided to look at celiac disease since it is a common cause of malabsorption of food in western countries. And for some time, miscarriages have been correlated with celiac disease.

Gasbarrini and colleagues conducted blood tests for the condition in 44 patients with RSA, 39 with IUGR, and 50 healthy women. None of the healthy women were found to have celiac disease, but the condition was detected in 8% of the women with RSA and 15% of those with IUGR.

Biopsy samples from the intestine confirmed diagnosis in eight of nine patients whose blood tested positive for the disease.

Women having recurrent miscarriages or intrauterine growth ******ation could have subclinical celiac disease, which will usually go undetected.

Celiac disease has been correlated with infertility, and with other conditions, including birth defects in children whose mothers could not absorb folic acid while pregnant because they had undiagnosed celiac disease, she said. It makes sense that the condition could lead to other problems related to too little nutritional intake, she pointed out. Spontaneous abortions could feasibly result if the mother was failing to absorb vitamins and minerals required by the baby, researchers explained. If celiac disease is responsible for some of these problems, it is easily treatable by avoiding products containing gluten.

*Good Info Source About Blood Tests and Normal Levels (from kimini26):*

https://www.fertilityplus.org/faq/hormonelevels.html


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## Megg33k

Blood results: Hormone # (my result) [range of "normal"]

T4, Free 1.04 [0.60-1.40] NG/DL

TSH 2. 09 [0.34-4.82] uIU/ML

Beta HCG: <1 [0-6] MIU/ML (when not pregnant) - So, its dropped off completely, basically!

Antimicrosomal Antibodies (thyroid): <10 [Reference range = <35 IU/ML]

Progesterone: 0.5 NG/ML [Follicular: 0.2-1.4 NG/ML, Luteal: 3.3-25.6 NG/ML, Midluteal: 4.4-28.0 NG/ML, Pregnant 1st Tri: 11.2-90.0 NG/ML]

T3, Free: 336 [230-420] PG/DL

T3, RIA/T3, Total: 148 [76-181] NG/ML

Vitamin D, 25 Hydroxy/Vitamin D, 25-OH, Total: 18 (low) [20-100] NG/ML
*25-OHD3 indicates both endogenous production and supplementation. 25-OHD2 is an indicator of exogenous sources such as diet or supplementation. Therapy is based on measurement of total 25-OHD, with levels <20 ng/mL indicative of Vitamin D deficiency while levels between 20 ng/mL and 30 ng/mL suggest insufficiency. Optimal levels are >30 ng/mL.

Vitamin D, 25-OH D3 18 NG/ML
Vitamin D, 25-OH D2 <4 NG/ML

So, I'm Vitamin D deficient!

About the Vitamin D deficiency: 



https://www.womentowomen.com/healthynutrition/vitamind.aspx said:

> So, Vitamin D deficiency can cause PCOS, insulin resistance, weight gain or the inability to keep weight off, cancer, osteoporosis, muscle pain, fatigue, depression, mood swings, sleep irregularities, and renal or intestinal problems.

Here's the best part... Optimally, we should have 50-70 ng/mL... I got an 18... and she told me it was "ALL NORMAL"?!?! WTF?!

Edit: Just read a study that showed a Vit D deficiency in rats lowered their fertility by 75%, and when they conceived it lowered the viability of the pups, made litters significantly smaller, and hindered the growth of the embryos!


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## groovygrl

hello ladies! I hope you find this helpful! As Megg articulated, our experience has taught us how important is to be empowered with knowledge.

I hope Hb1 doesn't mind but I'm pasting a copy of a post she made in another thread. It's a good one!



https://www.inciid.org/faq.php?cat=in...ity101&id=2#81

Here's a table of most tests and what they read from the levels.

They would normally test :

cd3 - estrogen, estradol ( gives indication of egg reserves I think ), testosterone and something else, 7dpo or cd21 they gen do progesterone.

Good luck with the testing 

hx


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## groovygrl

First question:

On a recent visit to my gp I asked for a referral to a specialist ob/gyn - I was looking for someone who would be more focused on helping me prevent MC and helping me concieve. I am 40 and have found very little support. Anyhoo... she was really supportive of sending me to a Dr. within a popular fertility clinic. She quickly offered that perhaps I should get started with clomid.Sadly almost $300- for the first consult with him and tests would be additional $. Can anyone offer an explaination of why clomid would help me? Dr. and I already know that I ovulate regularly. Beyond pushing an ovulation response, does clomid offer any further benefit to women who are ovulating?


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## Megg33k

Clomid can help too strengthen ovulation with a more mature, better quality egg being released. It can also aid in the release of more than one egg which gives the swimmers more targets to hit and a better chance for one of them to stick!

P.S. That chart is amazing! Thank you! xx


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## hb1

This is a fab idea Megg!!! 

I have popped the useful links for PCOS sufferers too - it's on the pcos thread but woulod be good in a central place hx

A link re GI diet and PCOS :
https://gynecological-health.suite101...m/what_is_pcos

PCOS and rapid weight gain :
https://womenshealth.suite101.com/art...id_weight_gain

Clomid overview :
https://www.womens-health.co.uk/clomid.asp

Soulcycters :
https://www.soulcysters.com/

Great Metformin link:
https://www.soulcysters.net/faq-about-metformin-48708/

General PCOS info:
https://www.netdoctor.co.uk/womenshealth/facts/pcos.htm


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## MinnieMone

Megg

I've written in the recurrent mc thread, but wondered if you all would be able to help here too.

It looks like I'm having my 3rd mc, it will be confirmed tomorrow. I started to have tests privately before I found out I was pregnant, (TEG, and thrombophilia), both of which came back as normal, but I want to return now and have the rest done, but the Dr seemed reluctant to do more (I think due to my age), but I wanted to go back to him with a definitive list if poss, and say 'why aren't you testing for this?' and basically be a bit of a moody mare, because last time I was in there I cried for the whole visit and because my OH was working and couldn't come I didn't really take anything in.... and I felt he was quite dismissive. For example, shouldn't my partner's sperm be tested for a start? 

I'm determined to go back and be a know it all this time, especially as it's costing me about £10 a minute!

If anyone could help I would be so grateful, I'm getting so desperate now for some kind of answer.... if it is ultimately my age, then I can rest easy that I did what I could.... I just can't give up on this now...

Thanks. Rach x


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## hb1

Hi Minnie

Here is a link for tests that they can/should do when investigating recurrent miscarriage - hope it helps :)

https://www.miscarriageassociation.or...iscarriage.pdf

Fxd you get unexpected good news tomorrow and if not I am very sorry for your loss :hugs:

hx


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## shaerichelle

Megg, :hugs: I posted on FB. But please get some Vitamin D3 and start taking it. I have been doing this for 2 years I think its helped me with my fibro pain. 

Also, I hear ya on docs. I have gotten no help in the ttc thing. I am frustrated.


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## MinnieMone

Hi h, thank you so much for the link, it's really useful. I will be armed and dangerous now with knowledge, when I go back for a follow up.

I'm praying for some kind of miracle tomorrow, but the scan on Monday showed no fetal pole and I should be about 7 weeks (although they are unsure as I had no AF between this pregnancy and my last mc in March), and I'm bleeding.... so I'm prepared really, although I know actually getting it confirmed will be the hardest part. Thanks for your kind words tho'!

Rach x


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## zeezee

Great thread - I will post some of the info on testing from my dr when I am more awake. One test not in the link above is the AMH test (anti-mullerian hormone testing) which is newer and shows ovarian reserve (and is constant, so can be done any time in the cycle). Here is a link with a chart for reading results:

https://www.advancedfertility.com/amh-fertility-test.htm

xx


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## Megg33k

Rach - I hope they're wrong about you losing this one. But, big huge :hugs: if not! I'm glad you were able to get the info that you needed, honey! 

Thanks to everyone who has added their knowledge so far! I'm hoping this thread can help a lot of women over a very long time to get the testing they need and minimize their losses!


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## VGibs

I know this one is kind of a no brainer but another thing to ask to be tested for is B12 defiency. I am not 100% sure why but my doc told me a big reason I lost my bub is because I had a severe B12 deficiency.


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## VGibs

A little blurb that sums it up... 

"Vitamin B12

Rationale:

Vitamin B12 has been shown to contribute to increased risk of miscarriage and this increased risk of miscarriage can be reversed with vitamin B12 supplementation.

Elevated homocysteine levels are associated with an increased risk of miscarriage. Vitamin B12 helps to lower elevated homocysteine levels.

Dosage:

1,000 - 2,000 mcg (1 - 2 mg) per daY."

On this site...www.viteminexpress.com


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## Dazed

Hey Megg, is it possible to get this as a "sticky thread" so that it doesn't disappear on us? I don't know if you have anything to do with that, but thought I would ask.


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## roonsma

Hi ladies, this thread couldn't have come at a better time for me, after visiting the my GP last Friday she has agreed for some blood tests( which i had done yesterday), only really basic stuff though.. 5 Vials, including FBC and sticky blood, i think thyroid too. 

I asked to be referred for more testing, i even offered to pay privately but we don't fit the criteria? the last two m/c were not late enough to justify further testing?

Should i expect more? I don't know anymore..one minute i feel that she's right, then i get angry because i just can't face the prospect of another loss- this last one hit me really hard, then i'm scared to think what further testing could mean, then i'm upset cause all i want to do is keep TTC till i get a sticky bean- bloody hell!!!! 

Anyway..i'm having a month off, let my body have a break,no caffeine, lots of vits, i'm on a diet( yay to the others who are too), BTW is there any connection between m/c and being overweight??? and the list goes on...

Megg, glad you could have found something with the vit D xx


Best of luck for the scan Rach xx :hugs:


Good luck to all you ladies and :hugs: to you all 

Rach xx


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## Megg33k

B12, eh? Hmm... I don't know if I've ever been checked for that! I'll add it to my list! :)

I finally talked to the doctor. She said that we're still waiting on a couple of my results, specifically one of the thyroid ones for sure. She said that they're "send out" tests and can take up to 2 weeks to come back. She did advise that I start Provera and offered me a script for it. I said I still had refills and would just use that. I was pretty happy since I'm already on my 2nd dose! LOL 

Uhm... What else? She never mentioned the Vit D deficiency, but I'm treating it anyway... So, I guess it doesn't matter if she mentions it. I asked if they needed to know when my bleed started so they could do CD3 testing or not. She said that they would like to know when it starts, but she didn't know why they would do CD3 tests. I'm a little confused about that... because it seems like a logical next step.

So, my plan is to print out that list from the first page about the tests that should be done and the proper day to do them, and I'm going to go to my GP and beg until she does them! LOL I'm done playing games! I can't take this crap anymore! I need to know what's going on, and I need to know now! Then, I'll offer the results to this new doc and hope they do something useful with the info when its already in front of them.

The saliva test that she wanted to do... Its not covered by my insurance. So, she's going to confer with the other docs there and see if they think they can get the info another way, because its a $240 test... and I don't want to do it if there's any other way or if they aren't sure it'll give us the answers we need. If they really think its necessary, I'll totally pay up though!

Dazed - Not sure! I think it would be a good one to sticky. I guess we'd have to petition an admin for that to happen. I'm not sure who does the "sticky'ing" of threads! Hmm... Anyone know?

Rach - I think you deserve a bit more. I mean, there's no harm in them looking... but I don't know how easy it is to make that happen. Things here are very cut and dry sometimes.... "Yes, you can have it!" or "No, you can't!" But, I would like to think that they could do something to help you! I mean, 3 mc's is usually when doctors start to care about helping. I'd think you fit that criteria for anyone! I don't know! Plus, I know very little about your system over there and how to get what you want! Maybe someone from the UK (You are from the UK, right?) can help you out?


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## roonsma

Hey Megg, yep i'm in the uk, i think what she was referring to is that my last loss was only at 4+4 and unfortunately it doesn't seem to count as a miscarriage, she said if i had another loss after the six week stage then yes they would do further investigations? 

Does anyone have anymore knowledge of the system over here? i'd be really grateful for any info

Thanks Megg x


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## Megg33k

Oh! I understand what you're saying now! Still... I don't see why someone should have to lose 3 babies after the 6 week mark to get help! How about they do the testing and keep you from losing that 3rd baby! I hate doctors!


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## roonsma

Yeah Megg, if feel if you go in armed with information they seem to raise an eyebrow and think your a nut!!, i find the best way is to gently point them in the direction you want( a bit like when making a suggestion to my DH i know he's not gonna like!!) 

i'm hoping these first tests show up something thats easily sorted, not sure how i'm going to feel if they don't, its a real rollercoaster ride at the minute, my feelings change every hour, but i suppose i'm not ready to get off yet

I hope this makes sense, i've got brain fog, i really need my bed x


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## groovygrl

Hiya! :flower:

VGibs - yes, B12 is a good one to test for however, folic acid supplementation masks B12 deficiency. I will ask my naturopath about how to work around that :shrug:

Rach, so sorry your dr. is hesitant to run more tests. My advice is to push. My dr. was the same (and I thought she would be one to be a lot more pro-active 'cus she had fertility challenges and finally had her twins last year through IVF - she is a gp but is also an ob/gyn) She watched me suffer through MMC and D&C at end of Jan. and didn't offer these tests because I also wasn't in the right 'category'.

Anyhoo, I sought out a TCM practitioner who specialised in fertility and pregnancy care and she got me to work also with her colleague who is a naturopath. First thing they did was write out a list of the tests they were interested in (will list below) and asked me to take it to my dr. to write out a lab requisition form. They can order the tests themselves but it is really expensive as they have to go through a private lab. The first step was to see if my dr. would order them (only pay for the dr. visit this way and the blood tests are free) if she was resistant they said we could do them privately. My dr. was really happy to write out the lab req. forms.WTF? I was shocked, I mean why didn't she order these herself (months ago) if it was no big deal :shrug: She did ask me to get lab to mail the results to my home address so that I don't stalk her or her practice nurse for results - i guess because they weren't really 'their' labs.

Moral of the story - find someone who will get all the testing ordered for you. Perhaps you might find someone helpfull in the alternative health care arena like I did (naturopath.) Look for someone who specialises in fertility. I'm with Megg, I mean why not do everything you can to minimise chance of going through it again? push, push, push for the labs hun :hugs:

Megg - ya, saliva testing is really the way to go if you can afford it. That's my next step. Will get these labs done this cycle first. As I understand it, blood tests will measure what's floating/circulating around in our blood stream. Saliva tests actually measure what our tissues have absorbed. It draws a much more accurate picture of what/how our bodies are functioning. NASA uses saliva testing for their pilots. It's not used in mainstream health care because it's quite expensive and we don't have to go into that old rant again. It sucks to have to pay out so much but... Like I said earlier, I'd love to stroll up to the Clarins and MAC counter but it's going to be neutrogena and revlon. heh ho

okay heres the tests my naturopath wrote out:

1) FBC - including ESR
Vit. D
iron, ferritin, B12
TSH
FSH, LH, E2 - Day 2-3
lgE, lgA
Antinuclear antibodies
Cardiolipin antibodies
Lupus anticoagulant
Thrombophilia studies
2) Progesterone - Day 21

These were written out like this so I only had to go to the lab twice. Only the FSH, LH and E2 (day 2-3) and Progesterone (day 21) have to be done on those specific days. All the rest can be done anytime. Don't do the majority of these tests in luteal phase 'cus they take a lot of blood. you don't want your body to be working hard to replace blood supply when your needing to build healthy, sticky, extra cushion-y endometrial lining.

I will report my results as I get them. I'm doing the whole lot in #1 in about three days. Waiting for AF, got BFN on my HPT today :cry: My DH is gone during fertile phase this coming cycle so It's give me good chance to do all these labs and eat/drink properly. He's a bad influence :haha:


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## Megg33k

roonsma - My GP actually doesn't entirely mind being told what to do! I think she likes it! IT gives her less work/less to have to think about! LOL

groovygrl - I guess I'll pay out for the saliva testing then! Now that I understand it, it seems more worth it! I'll talk to my OH about putting the $$ out and see if he's okay with it! I'm also going to take that list of stuff to my GP on CD3 and ask all of them to be run! :) Thank you a million times over for posting it! I'm going to add it to the first post!


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## Megg33k

The first post looks a lot different now! I'll try to keep updating so all the info will be easy to find! :)


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## heatherv2

Ok, I really lucked out when I picked my Dr. She did a whole ton of tests after I had just one MC (at 16 wks). They took blood from me 2 different days, for a grand total of 16 vials! That was a little freaky to me. I really don't know what every test was. She told me but there were just so many I forgot some of them. I know they did testing for diabetes, thyroid, cardiolipin antibodies, lupus anticoagulant, MTHFR and a bunch of other stuff. The magic test for me was the MTHFR. I apparently have homozygous MTHFR. There are different types, and I do not yet know which type I have, but my doctor thinks that is most likely the cause of my MC. I have an appointment with a perinatologist on Tuesday afternoon and I will find out more then. The perinatologist will give me a treatment plan for next time I get PG for (hopefully) a better outcome. Anyway, you might add the MTHFR to your list!


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## Megg33k

I will! I don't really know much about it... but it always looks like a shortened version of a not very nice word to me... MTHFR --- MTHRFCKR (with all the vowels taken out)! The similarities are too much for my feeble mind! Haha!


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## heatherv2

Hahaha And that was exactly what I thought when they told me that test came back abnormal!


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## groovygrl

:rofl: yup in perfect beevis and buthead form I thought exactly the same thing.

heather - I just looked it up now actually and see that it relates directly to homocysteine levels and uptake of folic acid - same thing AMOS is being treated for right? Thanks so much for that hun! I will add that to my list. Aren't you lucky to get a dr. to jump onto it right away! my dr. also appearantly doesn't mind being given instructions. Lot's of love and prayers for that BFP and then off to the perinotologist! -just looked up that one too!


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## Megg33k

Our doctors are going to be like... "YOU WON'T HAVE ANY BLOOD LEFT! I CAN'T DO IT!" Haha!


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## roonsma

Thanks girls for all your help, i shall wait to see what these first blood turn up and i shall go from there :thumbup: gotta get to the bottom of this

I'm deciding which GP i'm gonna go for this time!! hum need to think about that one!!!

Sorry its a bfn groovy :hugs:

lucky you Heather, mine are certainly not that pro-active x

I'll let you know when my results are in(please let somthing come up!)

Rach x


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## shaerichelle

I have a thought.. Have your adrenals been tested? My doc says that those help balance all the other hormones!!??


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## Megg33k

I don't know if my adrenals were tested or not! Hmm... Dr. Google has some stuff about it relating to fertility though... 

https://www.associatedcontent.com/article/517445/improve_fertility_by_maximizing_adrenal.html


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## heatherv2

Yes, the MTHFR is all about folic acid and homocystene, and from what I have read, the homocystene can cause blood clots, right? I am anxious to actually talk to the perinatologist and get all the info. I am just glad they found something wrong, because I think it will help me not be quite as paranoid about something going wrong next time I get PG.


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## VGibs

Too...many...blood...tests....going...to....faint...hahahaha I walked my happy little butt into the doc and asked to be drawn up for all those good things we have in the list. She looked at the list and goes "Vitamin D. Why didn't I think of that?" DUHHHHHHH Then I went and got EIGHT vials sucked out! I have to wait till they come back to see what they say but Im pretty hopeful!


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## Megg33k

Ha! Yay for Vitamin D!!! :) Can't wait for your results to come back! I want CD3 to get here so I can have 2053840 vials of blood sucked out and every test known to man run on my damn blood!


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## Megg33k

Oh... Speaking of tests... I have a jug of urine in my refrigerator right now! Fun, fun! LOL


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## Megg33k

So, about the jug of urine in my refrigerator. The "normal" range for the amount of urine collected in 24 hours is 800-2000ml. I'm at 750ml in 9 hours. I think I'm going to fail!


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## goddess25

Megg33k I was so sorry to see this news but I hope you get it all sorted out this time.

Thanks so much for starting this thread its awesome and well needed for lots of us.

When I was having my last mc well about too I went up to the emerg and I spoke with some horrible little man... i was out of country so it was a bit awkward but I asked him if he wanted to do some blood work and his answer to me was what is the point. I then said well we could check my hcg levels and check it again in a few days and if its rising then everything is ok. I did bleed fairly badly with my son too. At this point i was only spotting, anyway he said no he still did not see the point go home and if you start to bleed more then your having a mc if you dont and it stops go and see someone in 2 yes TWO weeks and see if your still pregnant.
I was livid but there was not much I could do as I was on vacation.... as it was i started bleeding properly a few days later but your right so many medics just dont give a toss about you or the fact that you have lost a baby.

I think its great that we can find out about all these tests and that way we can force medics to pay attention to us and give us the care we deserve that quite frankly they should be doing anyway.


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## fluffyblue

My friend has piped in with a comment about something to do with wheat intolerances can cause miscarriage do you know anything about this - im now concerned !

I googled this:

Women who experience recurrent miscarriages or those whose fetuses show intrauterine growth ******ation may have undiagnosed celiac disease.

Celiac disease is a genetic condition that causes those afflicted to experience difficulty absorbing gluten, as found in wheat, oats, barley, and several other grains. Symptoms include diarrhea, abdominal distention, and fatigue. And research suggests that more people may have a symptomless, milder form that may often go undetected. Recent studies have indicated that many people are found to have mild forms of the disease when their blood is tested for the condition, even though they were unaware that there was a problem.

Women who experience repeat miscarriages, also known as recurrent spontaneous abortions (RSA) or intrauterine growth ******ation (IUGR) -- a condition in which a baby is born significantly smaller than normal -- may have celiac disease that has gone undetected.

Researchers, led by Dr. Antonio Gasbarrini, explain that they decided to look at celiac disease since it is a common cause of malabsorption of food in western countries. And for some time, miscarriages have been correlated with celiac disease.

Gasbarrini and colleagues conducted blood tests for the condition in 44 patients with RSA, 39 with IUGR, and 50 healthy women. None of the healthy women were found to have celiac disease, but the condition was detected in 8% of the women with RSA and 15% of those with IUGR.

Biopsy samples from the intestine confirmed diagnosis in eight of nine patients whose blood tested positive for the disease.

Women having recurrent miscarriages or intrauterine growth ******ation could have subclinical celiac disease, which will usually go undetected.

Celiac disease has been correlated with infertility, and with other conditions, including birth defects in children whose mothers could not absorb folic acid while pregnant because they had undiagnosed celiac disease, she said. It makes sense that the condition could lead to other problems related to too little nutritional intake, she pointed out. Spontaneous abortions could feasibly result if the mother was failing to absorb vitamins and minerals required by the baby, researchers explained. If celiac disease is responsible for some of these problems, it is easily treatable by avoiding products containing gluten.


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## Megg33k

I don't know anything about Celiac Disease relating to infertility, but the science seems to make sense! I wish I had info for you! I'll add it to the front page! 

I couldn't have said it better myself, goddess! Your experience sounds bloody awful! I'm SO sorry you were treated that way!!! :hugs:

Update on my current urine test... I still have over 9 hours left, and I'm now up to 1850ml. That's 62.5 fl oz. I think I've peed about 15 times today.... so far!

To put that into some sort of perspective... The cup this girl (I don't know who she is, Google found it for me!) is holding holds 64.25 fl oz. So, the next time I pee, I'll have probably over-filled that cup!

https://i43.tinypic.com/239e9.jpg

Poor girl has no idea that I just made it sound like she might be ingesting a cup full of urine! I'm sure its probably not urine... rather Mountain Dew, or Dr. Pepper, or Coke! Sorry random internet girl! :(


----------



## xshell79

been to the doctors and have a copy of my blood test results taken on 8dpo last cycle

LH 3.1 IU/L
FSH 1.3 IU/L
PROGESTERONE 18.7 nmol/L
TESTOSTERONE 1.2 nmol/L
OESTRADIOL 452 pmol/L
TSH 2.57 mU/L

so i have to wait to see the gyno specialist on 24th june to diagnos me with PCOS!!

so im going to try hard to lose some weight before the gyno appointment and to continue this to hopefully see if this helps with my pcos....

my results show i ov'd which is good as was my first proper cycle since my mc in jan..

megg- does my FSH level of 1.3 IU/L mean that i have a good ovarian reserve or does that not matter because of LH being higher......???? because my LH is higher than FSH does it also mean that i will keep getting highs on my cbfm even after ov because the levels high??? do LH and FSH differ throughout a cycle as i hear women having bloods done on cd3 for pcos testing??
any info or help would be great megg...sorry if my questions dont make sense! x

im trying to get my head round what pcos impact would be having on my fertility


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## Megg33k

xshell - Your FSH and LH levels don't matter very much at 8dpo. They're both low, which is good. You need those tested on CD3 for them to give you any insight into your ovarian reserve! Honestly, your bloods don't look very "PCOS-y"! Good luck at the appointment!


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## Aerdrie

Megg you're awesome. Great thread.


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## xshell79

thanks again megg....well i tried explaing to the doctor about having my cd3 bloods done so my lh and fsh would be accurate and would have results for gyno in june but he said because my cycles are irregular i told him there normaly 28 to 30 days long and he said it doesnt matter when there done in the cycle unless im regular!!! even showed me it on some paper work ..... i used to have regular cycles before my mc 28/30 days long which i explained that i was charting and noticed my ov date changes sometimes from 10/14 days but i still have the same luteal phase length . i dont think he understood me. i always thought i was regular and a few days difference in cycle length wouldnt matter but obviously it does!!!


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## Megg33k

xshell79 said:


> thanks again megg....well i tried explaing to the doctor about having my cd3 bloods done so my lh and fsh would be accurate and would have results for gyno in june but he said because my cycles are irregular i told him there normaly 28 to 30 days long and he said it doesnt matter when there done in the cycle unless im regular!!! even showed me it on some paper work ..... i used to have regular cycles before my mc 28/30 days long which i explained that i was charting and noticed my ov date changes sometimes from 10/14 days but i still have the same luteal phase length . i dont think he understood me. i always thought i was regular and a few days difference in cycle length wouldnt matter but obviously it does!!!

A few days shouldn't matter! And, it definitely does need to be done on CD3 specifically! They say it doesn't matter when its done if you have cycles that just drag on forever... Like the girls with 60+ day cycles and they never know when their next AF will come... but if you know within a few days when she'll show... then you should have them done CD3. Can you still get that tested?

Btw, this makes me hate docs even more! They should know more about this than I do! :(


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## Megg33k

Ooh! Totally forgot to update with my final tally! When I turned in my jug of urine, I was at almost exactly 2600ml or about 88 fl oz!!!

The pic below is the jug I had to collect in. I took the pic early on in the collection process. The arrow shows where the "fluid line" was after my final collection. Keep in mind, this thing only barely fit on the top shelf of my fridge!

https://i42.tinypic.com/szh8qu.jpg


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## hb1

Thats a lot of pee Megg :)

hx


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## Megg33k

Yes, yes it is, hb1! LOL


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## hb1

At least they've got plenty to be going on with!


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## zeezee

Possible interesting correlation with m/c and celiac, but can't take much from that study unfort, the sample size is just too small - I hope they undertake a bigger study though, it seems worth pursuing.

xshell, I am so sorry , you should change drs, (s)he is a twit, the bloods HAVE to be done on CD3!!!


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## goddess25

That is a lot of pee... and i cant believe they made you put that thing in the fridge. They used to need refrigerated years ago but now they done bother but some places still tell people to do it. I am a transplant coordinator and arrange everything for patients undergoing a transplant, workup patients to be ready for it and we do the 24 hour pee collections all the time..

anyway I am waffling...its been a long time since i seen one that full.. its normally under 2L, so well done you, you have some nice healthy kidneys there girl.


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## Megg33k

I got the impression that too much was a bad thing! I read that anything over 2500ml is considered "too much"... You know more about this than me... So, I'd appreciate any info. The concern is regarding whether my kidneys are leaving the proper amount of fluids in my body. So, is there not such a thing as "too much" urine output? Now I'm all confused! LOL


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## Megg33k

Day 1 of waiting on the bleed! *taps fingers* This is going to be a long few days!


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## VGibs

Megg33k said:


> Day 1 of waiting on the bleed! *taps fingers* This is going to be a long few days!

Did they give you something to "help" it along????


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## Megg33k

Yes, honey! It should start anytime from tomorrow on... Friday at the latest, probably! I'm just impatient!


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## Megg33k

So, I got a call from my GP's office today. They're the ones that ordered the DI test with the urine collection and bloods. Anyway, they said that my doctor wants me to come get more labs done because it showed "my sugar was a little high along with some other stuff" or something like that. If this is my first set of bloods, then I'm pissed. No one even asked me about fasting or anything. I had it done about 20 min after lunch. Of course my sugar might have looked a little high if they assumed I hadn't just eaten. If she tries to put me back on the Metformin that was making me hypoglycemic, I'll be less than happy. Anyway, I told them that I want a copy of the bloods when I come in and to please have it ready in my folder. I decided I'd do it tomorrow morning so I could ensure fasting and no confusion.

Its funny... I couldn't really care less about my sugar at this juncture. I'm glad that's what we're focusing on! But, whatever! I'll let report in when I have an answer.


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## Megg33k

All of it was about my glucose because some idiot marked that I was fasting when I wasn't... not that anyone ASKED me if I was fasting! So, they marked that I was fasting and my glucose level was 140. However, I had JUST eaten a full meal. So, its not even sort of shocking that it was 140! 

Anyway, I have some of the results from the urine thing back... I just don't know what they mean really. Some of it doesn't look quite right to me. 

Here goes the boring!

5/12 - blood

Sodium 141 [137-145]
Potassium 4.3 [3.5-5.0]
Chloride 105 [101-111]
CO2 29 [21-32]
Glucose 140 H [65-100] <--- Where they said I was fasting when I wasn't! :dohh:
BUN 13 [7-17]
Creat 0.9 [0.7-1.2]
GFR >60 [>60]
Calcium 8.7 [8.4-10.2]
Uric Acid 5.1 [2.5-6.2]

5/13 - urine

Volume of Collection 2625
Creatinine Clearance 147 [100-180]*
Creat, Urine, QT 2620 [Normal:Male 1200-2000; Female 800-1500]
Creatinine 0.8 [0.7-1.2]

*Internet suggests that their numbers are a bit high (from WebMD):

https://farm5.static.flickr.com/4040/4619949556_1fa00d40fd_o.jpg

5/14 - blood

Sodium 138 [137-145]
Potassium 4.4 [3.5-5.0]
Chloride 104 [101-111]
CO2 26 [21-32]
Glucose 105 H [65-100] <--- Where they said I was fasting when I wasn't! :dohh:
BUN 12 [7-17]
Creat 0.8 [0.7-1.2]
GFR >60 [>60]
Calcium 8.9 [8.4-10.2]
Uric Acid 4.7 [2.5-6.2]

That's all I've got! Like I said, I don't know much about it. The "CREAT, URINE, QT" thing seems off... and I don't know how I feel about "Creatinine 0.8 [0.7-1.2]" since its really close to too low. 

Calling goddess25? You seem to know what this is all about! LOL They didn't talk to me about any of it at all today! I'd love any input available!


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## WannaB

I think they look okay. Creatinine is waste made by your body during metabolism, and your kidneys excret it into your urine. If your kidneys arnt working properly you have low levels in your urine and high levels in your blood, both or yours are within range. It being in lower levels in your urnine could mean you were just dehydrated or under hydrated at the time. That whole test is aimed at looking at your kidney function, it could be better, but I dare say all of our kidney function could be better, drink more water to help flush them out and at less garbage like we have all been told, but who listens?!:haha:


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## Megg33k

Thanks, Michelle! Can I just say that I was very excited to see your username as the last post in this thread... hell, ANY thread! :hugs: I've missed you soooooo much!


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## goddess25

Megg

Just sent you a PM. Everything looks ok.

Have you got some more tests that you need to do soon?


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## Megg33k

I got your PM! Thanks, goddess! :hugs:

Yeah, I have a list of things I'm hoping to have checked on CD3. Just realized how that could be an issue. I have a feeling tomorrow will be CD1. That makes CD3 on Saturday, and my doc only works M-F. *sigh* Does CD2 work? Because CD5 is the next chance I'll get!


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## Megg33k

Going for bloods in an hour and a half! FX'd that she does them!


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## Megg33k

I'm back from docs! I love that woman... I really, really do! :happydance:

So, I'm not diabetic (shocking, right?)... Actually, I knew I wasn't... It was just the "fasting" blood sugar of 140. She told me she was flipping out... "OMG! Is she out there somewhere not knowing that she's diabetic? With blurry vision? Passing out in the mall?" I :rofl: at her! She also said that my urine test stuff came back fine... so, I asked about all the faintness. She said that my urine isn't "broken"... its just not "like most other people's urine." She said that they don't know why, but some people just don't get the regents absorbed into their urine like most people. The tests are made the way they are because "most people" can use them accurately. I cannot. She basically said not to think of myself as "broken"... because there is no "fix"... I'm "just different and have to accept that." So, that's the story of my pee. Want the best part? She (finally!!!) agreed to do betas for me whenever a situation was unclear!!! I told her I couldn't get anyone to do beta HCG's for me, and she said that she'll make sure I get them in her office whenever I need them!!! I'm SO excited! Especially since I've been accused so many times of not being willing to get blood tests for one reason or another... Its nice that I'll never have to hear it again! I FINALLY have someone who will do HCG for me!

She also said that Illinois is a very different medical community than anywhere else she's been (Indiana, Michigan, etc)... because the doctors in those places consistently want and try to help. Here... They just want to pass you off to someone else! But, she's not passing me off! I was so happy that I could have cried!

She's looking for a doctor who will do certain tests that she can't perform based on her orders. Like, she wants me to get an HSG... She was shocked that I'd not had one! So, that should be in the works. She was shocked that I hadn't had the tests on the list I gave her too! She said most of them should have been done over a year ago!!! :shock:

So, while I'm horrified at a lot of the doctors who have failed me... I'm VERY EXCITED that she's working so hard for me! She said she'll do her best to become the doctor I need her to be since no one else wants to help me! :yipee: :yipee: :yipee:

So, I'm down another 7 vials of blood. She didn't do the entire list, as she said it was just too much blood at one time! So, she did the ones she felt were most important first! 

I got:

CBC - including ESR
Iron, Ferritin, B12, B6
FSH, LH, E2
Antinuclear antibodies
Cardiolipin antibodies
Lupus anticoagulant
Prolactin

My TSH had just been tested 2 weeks ago. My progesterone WILL be tested at 7dpo (also horrified that everyone had refused to do that one)!

Anyway, those are the ones that she thought were most pertinent at this moment. She said we'd move on to the others if these didn't show anything. She's thinking it could be some sort of autoimmune disease though... Said it would explain it. So, maybe! It would be treatable, which is good! Prednisone through 1st Tri is apparently the way to get around that if I have one.

I don't know what else to say! I'm just hopeful finally!!! I can't believe that she's actually HELPING me! I'm so, so, so happy today! Love to Dr. Lashunda Williams! <3


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## goddess25

Megg your doctor does sound awesome i am so happy for you that you have someone taking you seriously now and can get to the bottom of everything for you. I have never had any tests into why i have had 2 losses but i have not pushed it either. Your right though none of my doctors give a s**t..(sorry) If i manage to get pregnant again I have another loss i will be getting all the tests done and i think you may be my go to gal to find out what i need to get.

Once again I am happy that you are finally getting there.


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## Megg33k

Thanks, goddess! I basically just laid it all on the line to her. I've been her patient for a while... and she KNOWS her patients. She knows who I am by face and name... which is nice. I hadn't seen her since before Christmas though. So, I basically just started telling her and ended up in tears. I hate that.. but I couldn't help it. I took her through the OB/GYN's I've seen, through the FS I saw, all of it. She was appalled at the lack of testing. She pretty much said that she gets a lot of patients that everyone else has just pushed aside, passed along, or given up on. She likes the challenge, because it keeps her job interesting. She was so unhappy that no one had bothered to check me for very basic things, apparently. 

Plus, the office is really laid back and funny. So, we had a good laugh or 3! :) She's around my age, which is nice. She can sort of relate!

Definitely let me know whatever I can provide you with. I'll give you any info I have! Some of the testing can be passed off as not necessarily being fertility related. I mean, she totally knew why I wanted them... but I think they could be done without 3 losses. Especially the auto-immune stuff. She said that most people who think there's something wrong... do have something wrong... its just up to her to figure out what it is! :) I have real hope for the first time in ages!


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## nefis

Megg, I'm so happy for you!! I still haven't found the doctor I could rely on


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## heatherv2

I'm so glad for you! I know it will be a real relief to find out what could be wrong!


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## Megg33k

Come to Illinois! :)

Yes, definitely! Just hoping we find something rather than an "all clear" sort of thing!


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## kimini26

I'm so happy you've got such a helpful doctor. I'm hoping thats how mine turns out to be. My high risk OB scheduled me for a 6 week miscarriage follow up (although they forgot to tell me) but still its nice. It probly has something to do with my GP more or less forcing me to go for a stress echo that I've been putting off and sending him the results of my labs. I have no idea what she ordered, but everything looked fine. So he's probably wondering why I've been so sick-so am I! So now I just have to force myself to make a one hour drive to do the miscarriage lab routine, no idea whats involved, just told to drink lots of water beforehand. My appointment is on CD 21 so hopefully they can check things out again. Stress echo was all clear. I have A-Fib which comes with an increased risk of stroke due to small clots forming when the heart starts beating all wrong. I'm wondering if these small clots are possible messing things up when I get pregnant since my A-Fib is worse during pregnancy. Its not a clotting disorder and can't really be seen on a blood test. Blood thinners are the routine treatment for it after you hit a certain age, I'm going to ask my OB about taking baby aspirin or something in the meantime. 

How much blood have you donated now Megg? We are seriously going to have to meet up at some point. We're too close not to imo. I'm tired of only hanging out with my pregnant sister in law, she just looks too pregnant for me to not get upset now. And all hubby does is gaming most of the time! I do too, but after every loss I take a 2 month break from wow.


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## Megg33k

Hmmm... Might have to look into the A-Fib thing! See if there's something to it that could cause RM. I hope they can figure out something for you so that you don't ever have to suffer another loss! :hugs:

I've donated 17 vials in 2 weeks! :( Its starting to take a toll on me, even with the iron supplement. I've had dizzy spells for 2 days now. Its scary. But, I think I'll back to normal very soon! If not, I'll definitely consult my doc when I go in to talk about my results! 

We definitely should meet up! I'm a-okay with that idea! We'll have to figure out on Yahoo when might be good... and also where! :) I'm always up for meeting new people IRL. We game too... Except we go for Fallout 3 instead of WoW! :)


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## groovygrl

hello ladies! :flower:

it's been cool to catch up with this thread and hear of all the positive steps, groovy Dr's and educated dialogue towards getting some answers!

my test results have been trickling in and it looks like I'll be getting some answers soon!

great news is that my results in the reproductive hormones are reallly bl***y good for an old chick (41yrs) :happydance:

FSH - 7.2 IU/L
LH - 5.0 IU/L
Oestradiol - 34.54 pg/ml

the not so great news but... possibly an answer is that I have tested positive for antinuclear antibodies (speckled pattern) I have yet to speak to my dr. but from all the reading I've been doing it appears that I will have to undergo further tests to rule out: lupus, Sjogren's syndrome, connective tissue diease, etc. This could be a reason for MC and fertility challenges - treatment could range from taking prednisone in early pregnancy to taking aspirin and/or heparin.Interesting to hear that you might be looking at this too Megg? :shrug:

another thing to ask about is my high level of B12 - 766 pmol/L (should be between 170 - 600) Folate is also high at 38. 0 nmol/L (should be greater than 10) don't know if this is really a problem yet but... stay tuned.

Once I speak to my Dr. AND Naturopath, I'll let you know what I learn (should be this week sometime.)

YAAAY for pushing through the lame responses i.e "once you've had three" or " just one of those things that happen, you've been unlucky" or my favorite, "at your age....blah... blah" I honestly wouldn't have had these tests done if I didn't keep on educating myself and pushing. My Dr. was quite happy to file me away in the 'so sad but better luck next time' cabinet.

Please know that I respect that this is not everyone's path. My intuition has led me here. I wish you all a healthy BFP and pregnancy through "grace and ease" I believe I'm going to get there and it appears that I'll be finding my voice as well. :winkwink:

now, I push further to get details, a treatment plan and another BFP


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## kimini26

Are you supplementing with folic acid and a b vitamin? Over 16 is high on folic acid but not usually worrisome unless you have a vitamin B 12 deficiency which you don't. But too much folic acid will give you the runs. I hope you find your answers soon.


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## Megg33k

groovygrl said:


> hello ladies! :flower:
> 
> it's been cool to catch up with this thread and hear of all the positive steps, groovy Dr's and educated dialogue towards getting some answers!
> 
> my test results have been trickling in and it looks like I'll be getting some answers soon!
> 
> great news is that my results in the reproductive hormones are reallly bl***y good for an old chick (41yrs) :happydance:
> 
> FSH - 7.2 IU/L
> LH - 5.0 IU/L
> Oestradiol - 34.54 pg/ml
> 
> the not so great news but... possibly an answer is that I have tested positive for antinuclear antibodies (speckled pattern) I have yet to speak to my dr. but from all the reading I've been doing it appears that I will have to undergo further tests to rule out: lupus, Sjogren's syndrome, connective tissue diease, etc. This could be a reason for MC and fertility challenges - treatment could range from taking prednisone in early pregnancy to taking aspirin and/or heparin.Interesting to hear that you might be looking at this too Megg? :shrug:
> 
> another thing to ask about is my high level of B12 - 766 pmol/L (should be between 170 - 600) Folate is also high at 38. 0 nmol/L (should be greater than 10) don't know if this is really a problem yet but... stay tuned.
> 
> Once I speak to my Dr. AND Naturopath, I'll let you know what I learn (should be this week sometime.)
> 
> YAAAY for pushing through the lame responses i.e "once you've had three" or " just one of those things that happen, you've been unlucky" or my favorite, "at your age....blah... blah" I honestly wouldn't have had these tests done if I didn't keep on educating myself and pushing. My Dr. was quite happy to file me away in the 'so sad but better luck next time' cabinet.
> 
> Please know that I respect that this is not everyone's path. My intuition has led me here. I wish you all a healthy BFP and pregnancy through "grace and ease" I believe I'm going to get there and it appears that I'll be finding my voice as well. :winkwink:
> 
> now, I push further to get details, a treatment plan and another BFP

Thanks for sharing though! The FSH, LH, E2 is one of the tests they just did on me. I'm terrified of POF. So, I'm hoping mine come back as good as yours! I have no reason to believe that I would fall into a POF diagnosis... Its just a very scary one that can't be fixed. So, of course I worry about it. Congrats on those results though!

Definitely ask about the ones that you're unsure on . When I told my GP about the Vit D deficiency and the fact that no one ever mentioned it to me from the OB/GYN's office.. She blatantly told me that if its not a hormone that they care about replacing for fertility purposes, they don't care. She seemed quite okay with me taking a supplement for it though. She said its usually sold together with Calcium and that would be a good route. So, next bottle will be Vit D and Calcium together. I told her my Calcium level was fine... She says "Yeah, until we get your pregnant and that baby starts sucking the life out of you!" I :rofl: at her! :) I adore her, I really do!

Very, very interesting that we could possibly be looking at the same diagnosis depending on my ANA results. She did mention Prednisone during 1st Tri... but warned me that it makes for HUGE babies and there's little chance of natural (non-C-section) birth if that's the case. I desperately want a natural birth, but all of my ideals go out the window when it comes to getting a happy, healthy baby. If I can't, I'd rather have a baby in a way I don't want to than to have no baby at all.

I respect the hell out of your will to get things done! I only just found mine! A year ago, I never thought I'd be sitting in her office crying because I'd been failed so many times! NEVER! But, that's what it took to get me to this line of tests... and I couldn't be happier! 

I'm hoping we can get this worked out together! :) I should know more in the next few days... "early next week" could be anything up to Wednesday probably!

FX'd for us both!


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## shaerichelle

Good Luck on your tests Megg. :)

I am now looking for a new midwife and not finding any :cry:


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## Megg33k

shaerichelle said:


> Good Luck on your tests Megg. :)
> 
> I am now looking for a new midwife and not finding any :cry:

Here ya go! :) They're all the ones within 20 miles of your zip code pulled from my insurance provider's doctor search! It should at least get you started. It includes names, address, phone numbers, and distance from your zip code! :thumbup:

Beach, Katherine G, NMW
96 Campus Dr
Scarborough, ME 04074
(207) 885-8400
2.4 mi

Bellwood, Lori J, NMW
96 Campus Dr
Scarborough, ME 04074
(207) 885-0946
2.4mi

Hackett, Linda A, NMW
96 Campus Dr
Scarborough, ME 04074
(207) 885-8400
2.4 mi

Vest, Victoria, CNM
96 Campus Dr
Scarborough, ME 04074
(207) 885-8422
2.4 mi

Beach, Katherine G, NMW
100 Brickhill Ave
South Portland, ME 04106
(207) 761-1502
5.5 mi

Harris, Amy A, CNM
66 Bramhall St Ste 2
Portland, ME 04102
(207) 662-5040
8.4 mi

Coplon, Leah, CNM
527 Ocean Ave
Portland, ME 04103
(207) 871-0666
10.7 mi

Gilbert, Jennifer E
527 Ocean Ave
Portland, ME 04103
(207) 871-0666
10.7 mi

Grillo, Eileen P, NMW
527 Ocean Ave
Portland, ME 04103
(207) 871-0666
10.7 mi

Janisch, Laura, CNM
527 Ocean Ave
Portland, ME 04103
(207) 871-0666
10.7 mi

Poirier, Joyce P, CNM
527 Ocean Ave
Portland, ME 04103
(207) 871-0666
10.7 mi

Selbe, Susan, CNM
10 Goodall Dr Ste 100
E Waterboro, ME 04030
(207) 247-6999
17.5 mi


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## kimini26

How much vitamin D are you planning on taking in the future? Calcium + D usually only has 400 IU vitamin D which is not nearly enough when fighting a deficiency. My doctor actually told me the vitamin D deficiency could have been responsible for my last two losses and was surprised I wasn't having seizures or hallucinating yet. He has no idea the power of a 3rd shift work schedule.


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## zeezee

On the vitamin D thing, I take a multi with 400 IUI, plus 2,000 IUI of straight vitamin D daily. I was taking 1,000 IUI but I was still considered "severely deficient" on that, so added another and now I am normal  Although this could not have had anything to do with my m/c b/c I was already at that level.

I got my day 3 labs back, I can't remember them all, but I scrawled down these:

Estrogen: 60 (apparently they want less than 80)
FSH: 7.5 (less than 12 is normal)
TSH: 1.9 (0.4-4.0 is normal)

So I am heartened by these, but also scared, because almost everything has been ruled out as a cause, and if it happens again (m/c that is) then maybe its genetic, and that's terrifying.

Z
xx


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## kimini26

I'm supposed to be on 50,000 IU a week, but I read bad things about the prescription version. Instead I take 400 IU with my calcium, 1000 IU in my multivitamin and 5000 IU straight vitamin D each day for a total of 44,800 IU per week, so I figure that's sufficient to raise me up. I just wish they'd check it sooner than 3 months, is that how long it takes to raise them or what?


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## groovygrl

hi - thanks kimini! Interesting info re: high folate count. I have been supplementing with a multivitamin specific to pregnancy as well as extra folic acid. Multi has only 250 ug of folic so I bumped it up by taking an extra .8 mg every day. I have definately had issues re: diarrhoea. I recently went off the multi and x tra folic acid - approx 10 days) and noticed that things in bottom land have been very 'normal.' I will bring back the multi in a few more days and see how I go.

megg - ya I know those reproductive hormones are scary. I was quietly freaking about those too. I'm looking forward to hearing how fabulous your results are as well :hugs: Your Dr. sounds really cool!

shaeri - good luck finding a lovely MW! I hope you can find someone you resonate with in the list that Megg gave you :thumbup: fingers cx'd for you hun

zee zee - NICE day 3 results. YAAY! So sorry about your recent loss.


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## shaerichelle

Thank you Megg, but those arent homebirth ones. There are only 3 here! :cry:


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## Megg33k

kimini26 said:


> How much vitamin D are you planning on taking in the future? Calcium + D usually only has 400 IU vitamin D which is not nearly enough when fighting a deficiency. My doctor actually told me the vitamin D deficiency could have been responsible for my last two losses and was surprised I wasn't having seizures or hallucinating yet. He has no idea the power of a 3rd shift work schedule.

I'm currently taking 5000 IU of straight Vit D every day, plus 400 IU in my prenatal. If I get close to normal, I'll probably add the 400 IU with Calcium and maybe drop back to 2000 IU straight Vit D. Hoping I can get to the 50-70 levels sooner than later!



zeezee said:


> On the vitamin D thing, I take a multi with 400 IUI, plus 2,000 IUI of straight vitamin D daily. I was taking 1,000 IUI but I was still considered "severely deficient" on that, so added another and now I am normal  Although this could not have had anything to do with my m/c b/c I was already at that level.
> 
> I got my day 3 labs back, I can't remember them all, but I scrawled down these:
> 
> Estrogen: 60 (apparently they want less than 80)
> FSH: 7.5 (less than 12 is normal)
> TSH: 1.9 (0.4-4.0 is normal)
> 
> So I am heartened by these, but also scared, because almost everything has been ruled out as a cause, and if it happens again (m/c that is) then maybe its genetic, and that's terrifying.
> 
> Z
> xx

Those #'s look great! I just hope mine come back like yours! Congrats on that! Although, I know what you mean about worrying it genetic! Thats scary stuff! Hoping not, honey! :hugs:



kimini26 said:


> I'm supposed to be on 50,000 IU a week, but I read bad things about the prescription version. Instead I take 400 IU with my calcium, 1000 IU in my multivitamin and 5000 IU straight vitamin D each day for a total of 44,800 IU per week, so I figure that's sufficient to raise me up. I just wish they'd check it sooner than 3 months, is that how long it takes to raise them or what?

I know that I was told it would take at least a month to see ANY difference. So, I guess 3 months is probably necessary to know for sure if you're taking enough.



shaerichelle said:


> Thank you Megg, but those arent homebirth ones. There are only 3 here! :cry:

Oh! :( Its hard to find a homebirth MW in the US. Just not something we do very often here! Hmm... 



groovygrl said:


> hi - thanks kimini! Interesting info re: high folate count. I have been supplementing with a multivitamin specific to pregnancy as well as extra folic acid. Multi has only 250 ug of folic so I bumped it up by taking an extra .8 mg every day. I have definately had issues re: diarrhoea. I recently went off the multi and x tra folic acid - approx 10 days) and noticed that things in bottom land have been very 'normal.' I will bring back the multi in a few more days and see how I go.
> 
> megg - ya I know those reproductive hormones are scary. I was quietly freaking about those too. I'm looking forward to hearing how fabulous your results are as well :hugs: Your Dr. sounds really cool!
> 
> shaeri - good luck finding a lovely MW! I hope you can find someone you resonate with in the list that Megg gave you :thumbup: fingers cx'd for you hun
> 
> zee zee - NICE day 3 results. YAAY! So sorry about your recent loss.

Thanks, hun! I hope so! I'm really worried about them! I want some sort of a problem, but not that kind! :(


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## shaerichelle

Yah I am emailing my last one. Ugh.


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## Megg33k

And, if that doesn't work... What's Plan B? I only ask because 3 isn't very many! Why haven't the others worked out?


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## kimini26

Its funny you mentioned the homebirth midwife in the US. I actually saw a doula post her services on craigslist.


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## Megg33k

So, I have more test results! I don't know if I should say they're good or bad though! :wacko:

Iron 64 [60-180] - I've been on over 100mg of Iron daily for well over a year, and I'm BARELY in "normal" range!
Ferritin 116 [10-154]
WBC 8.89 [4.0-10.0]
RBC 4.45 [4.0-5.2]
HGB 13.0 [12-16]
HCT % 37.5 [36-46]
MCV 84.3 [80-100]
MCH 29.2 [26-34]
MCHC 34.7 [31-37]
PLT CT 213 [132-400]
RDW 13.6 [12.0-14.6]
MPV 9.7 [7-14]
Neutrophils 69.8 [50-70]
Lymphocyte 25.3 [25-45]
Monocyte 3.8 [1-8]
Eosinophil L 0.8 [1-5]
Basophil 0.3 [0-1]
ABS Neutrophils 6.20 [2.00-7.00]
ABS Lymphocytes 2.25 [1.00-4.50]
ABS Monocytes 0.34 [0.04-0.80]
ABS Eosinophils 0.07 [0.04-0.50]
ABS Basophils 0.03 [0-0.10]

Vit B12 526 [200-1100]

Follicle Stimulating Hormone (FSH) 3.4 - Follicular Phase [2.5-10.2] :happydance:
Lutenizing Hormone (LH) 3.6 - Follicular Phase [1.9-12.5] :happydance:

SED Rate H 24 [0-20] :(

C-Reactive Protein H 2.0 [0.0-0.8] :(

So, good news first! My ovaries are ACE! I'm SO excited by that! I was terrified to the point of tears waiting on those! :happydance:

Bad news: Who knew that groovygrl was a psychic?



groovygrl said:


> the not so great news but... possibly an answer is that I have tested positive for antinuclear antibodies (speckled pattern) I have yet to speak to my dr. but from all the reading I've been doing it appears that I will have to undergo further tests to rule out: lupus, Sjogren's syndrome, connective tissue diease, etc. This could be a reason for MC and fertility challenges - treatment could range from taking prednisone in early pregnancy to taking aspirin and/or heparin.Interesting to hear that you might be looking at this too Megg? :shrug:

Those 2 results with the :( next to them? Yeah, well... I had to go in for a blood pregnancy test today. The only 2 logical possibilities with those being elevated are pregnancy (which is so unlikely that I'm inclined to call it impossible) and an autoimmune disease! My antinuclear antibody test results (and HCG from today) will be in tomorrow some time. But, when pregnancy is ruled out, we'll be trying to track down my autoimmune disease too! 

Hoping you're up for making a new TTC buddy really soon, groovygrl! Because, I'm freaking out right now! And, knowing someone else going through it... Well, it might help! We're almost certainly looking at the same sort of thing... I'm just sure my ANA will prove it tomorrow!


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## Megg33k

After a bit of reading... I might have located some shred of hope that I don't actually have an autoimmune disease! No guarantees, but I will be bringing it up to my doctor tomorrow!

Apparently, ESR (SED Rate) can be elevated slightly when pregnant OR menstruating! I was on CD2 and definitely still bleeding! It was 24 with a normal range of 0-20.

Also, CRP (C-Reactive Protein) is often elevated in obese adults! Well, they've got me there! 

So, maybe I was just fat and bleeding? It wouldn't necessarily put me closer to an answer regarding the losses, but its better than an incurable disease! Maybe we should all cross our fingers and pray after all! LOL


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## VGibs

Well meggs I hope you are just fat and bleeding LOL Everytime I say it in my head it gets funnier!!!!!!!


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## kimini26

Your slightly elevated thingys just point to inflammation which I can total understand on CD 2. Seriously, who isn't inflamed at that point?

Quick question: anyone know a good natural remedy for feeling like you need to claw your way out of your skin and general jumpiness/sleepiness. I dosed myself with my last two remaining promethazines and slept fine and woke up fine but without it I'd have been up all night. Trying to avoid hard core drugs before I get my bloodwork done tomorrow.


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## Megg33k

VGibs said:


> Well meggs I hope you are just fat and bleeding LOL Everytime I say it in my head it gets funnier!!!!!!!

Haha! Thanks! I hope so too!



kimini26 said:


> Your slightly elevated thingys just point to inflammation which I can total understand on CD 2. Seriously, who isn't inflamed at that point?
> 
> Quick question: anyone know a good natural remedy for feeling like you need to claw your way out of your skin and general jumpiness/sleepiness. I dosed myself with my last two remaining promethazines and slept fine and woke up fine but without it I'd have been up all night. Trying to avoid hard core drugs before I get my bloodwork done tomorrow.

True! Maybe it was just mild inflammation! I hope so! I really don't want an autoimmune disease! :(

Uhm... natural... err... Melatonin is good if you want to sleep! :)


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## shaerichelle

Valerian Root is good for sleeping:)

Plan B is for when I got raped to prevent pregnancy. The other ones didnt workout cause they were being snotty.


I am so done with the docs btw. :finger: to them


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## kimini26

So I bought Sleepytime Extra Tea. It has chamomile, tilia estrella? and valerian. Maybe that will calm me down. Ice cream seems to have helped for the moment. I had a cbc done the night I miscarried, and looking at those numbers everything was elevated or low. They went back to normal the following day and then wacked out again when the bleeding started back up. Something to think about.


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## Megg33k

Well, my ANA came back negative. So, I get the impression that means no autoimmune disease! Yay! :)

HCG was also negative... Shocking @ CD6... Official earliest testing EVER! :rofl:


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## MySillyGirls

Megg, hello!! I am not sure about Peoria but I found an amazing doc in the chicago area who was able to help me with an autoimmune diagnosis. I had the ana test, rheumatoid arthritis, gi tests for crohns, etc etc. As it turns out, he was the only one able to diagnose this crazy autoimmune reaction I had as due to post-pregnancy hormones and getting back on the pill. Wow! Btw, heard you guys had some crazy storms the last few days. My fam said that it hailed, tree limbs down etc


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## MySillyGirls

Your ANA being negative is AWESOME!! That helps rule out lupus, ra, etc.! YAY


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## shaerichelle

Hey Silly, tell me more about this auto immune reaction..

I dont like that all my mw wants to do is test my hormones and throw me on clomid. What if I get pregnant again and have another loss? She said I need to have 3 before they will do anything. I said I have..so she says well.. 3 documented and she has to see me during them, but she believes that I wasnt pregnant this time and I had a false positive on 3 different brands of tests:shock:


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## shaerichelle

Megg, I wish you luck today.


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## MySillyGirls

Shannon, about 9 mos after my dd was born (7 yrs ago), I had this bizarre autoimmune reaction called erythema nodosum. It started with feeling fluish for a week and then these giant red lumps started developing on my legs. It kind of looked like I had slammed my legs into something. When they started, I thought I must have just bumped my knee on something. My joints hurt also. The lumps were under the skin and spreading. in addition, I had driven the day it started to the train station in a convertible. In the car 40 minutes roundtrip but developed a blistering sunburn. Night sweats etc. It was the scariest thing that has ever happened to me in my life. As it turns out, erythema nodosum is associated with a variety of disorders including lupus, crohns, RA, lymphoma, sarcoidosis, etc. First doc said lupus but ANA came back negative. Sed rate, inflammation was sky high. I was on high dose NSAID and started having stomach problems. Second doc said Crohns. Finally, I found the most amazing doctor in Gurnee IL. He and a fantastic dermatalogist realized immediately that this was erythema nodosum although it is pretty rare. They worked together to order the lung xrays for sarc, gi tests, c-reactive, etc. and wouldn't let the GI stick a label of Crohns on me. As it turns out, in the past few years, they have associated Erythema Nodosum with hormones from birth control pills, childbirth etc. I had just started back on the pill after nursing my daughter and my hormones were all out of wack. Thank God for the amazing docs I found...

Autoimmune stuff is pretty scary...as your body is attacking itself


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## shaerichelle

I think my body does attack itsself.

I have fibromyalgia and hemipheligic migraines. My body just decides to become paralyzed. sharp pain and then I become paralyzed. I guess I need to see a specialist.

Sorry you had to go through all the :hugs: at least you found some great docs.. and got help.

What is your name again? I know you from the crazy thread but my mind is blank.


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## shaerichelle

Oh I didnt get all my problems til after I had my son. He is 7.5


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## MySillyGirls

I am sorry to hear about your pregnancy losses! It seems that in some cases there should be a correlation between pregnancy and immune response, especially if you are a person who has other allergies...


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## MySillyGirls

Shannon, I am Lesley. Nice to meet you :) I like the other thread but can't seem to keep up..lol


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## shaerichelle

I do have allergies.. hmmm..Hi Lesley

my hormones are normal
FSH 6.2
LH 31.3
Prolactin 3.7

just what I thought.


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## kimini26

Quick side note on autoimmune and pregnancy- My mom was diagnosed with JRA 2 months after I was born and was sick all my life except for when she was pregnant with my brother. I'm terrified of developing RA and get tested for it about once a year, but so far so good.


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## Megg33k

MySillyGirls said:


> Megg, hello!! I am not sure about Peoria but I found an amazing doc in the chicago area who was able to help me with an autoimmune diagnosis. I had the ana test, rheumatoid arthritis, gi tests for crohns, etc etc. As it turns out, he was the only one able to diagnose this crazy autoimmune reaction I had as due to post-pregnancy hormones and getting back on the pill. Wow! Btw, heard you guys had some crazy storms the last few days. My fam said that it hailed, tree limbs down etc

Yeah! The storms SUCKED! :( I'm trying to avoid having to go to Chicago! I really, really am! Ugh! Its just sort of far away. I'm going to go as far as I can with this doctor for now. But Chicago is my backup plan!



MySillyGirls said:


> Your ANA being negative is AWESOME!! That helps rule out lupus, ra, etc.! YAY

Yes! I was happy! But, I've also been told that there are still several that it doesn't rule out even with the negative ANA. I'm not sure which blood tests I'm going for tomorrow (I am going back for more tomorrow) as I had to cut my appointment short. She is faxing it to the lab so I can go at my leisure. Something about checking for PCOS (AGAIN!) and something about trying to rule out a pituitary tumor (which sounds fucking awful), and some other stuff. Not sure. It was really my fault for not asking more! And, obviously, progesterone at 7dpo. But, that's a while off still! :(



shaerichelle said:


> I do have allergies.. hmmm..Hi Lesley
> 
> my hormones are normal
> FSH 6.2
> LH 31.3
> Prolactin 3.7
> 
> just what I thought.

Uhm... Much like in my txt... Your LH suggests that you'll be ovulating soon! That's in ovulatory peak range. That confuses me quite a bit. I'm not sure that you could be at ovulatory peak levels of LH if you were pregnant and haven't even bled from that ye. Maybe that's why she doesn't think you were pregnant. I mean, it suggests that you haven't even ovulated yet... which would make sense for why she didn't think you could have been pregnant, iykwim?


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## shaerichelle

Well I am terrified of having something more wrong.So I know what you mean.


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## shaerichelle

I do know what you mean. But I had a positive test and symptoms and call me confused believe me!


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## shaerichelle

Oh and maybe that is why no clomid.


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## Megg33k

I know what you mean, Shan... and I know how unlikely false + are... but I don't see how you could have been pregnant if you haven't ovulated yet! I'm feeling a bit :wacko: about it all! You know I say this with love, I hope! I just don't want you to feel like you've had another loss if you haven't, ya know? I know I'd rather have false positives before ovulation than a loss! I don't know what to think! All I know is what those #'s tell me! Very, very :wacko:... for real!


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## shaerichelle

Ill just go with :wohoo: I am going to ovulate and those tests are shit. FF now says I didnt ov :wacko:


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## WannaB

Well thats good news, would rather just have a dogey test than another mc so yah!:happydance: Did FF only just take away the crosshairs now??


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## shaerichelle

I added a missing temp and it took it away :wacko: So it looks like maybe another long cycle. I dont know I am so confused. I had symptoms of pregnancy and stuff .. ugh I also had faints on frer, which I guess could be antibody strip, and line on another test and faint on two others. ugh.


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## kimini26

I found a helpful website concerning fertility blood tests:

https://www.fertilityplus.org/faq/hormonelevels.html


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## Megg33k

Good one! I'll add it to the first page! :)


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## MySillyGirls

Shannon, the good news is that it is possible to ovulate twice in one cycle! So, if you did get a false positive on hpt, maybe you are now getting ready to ovulate! Round up oh! 

Megg, good luck on your tests! I know it is SO daunting! Hopefully, you can rule out the serious stuff before the holiday weekend.


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## Megg33k

Thanks, Lesley! :)

This is fun! Posted at the hospital I go to for my testing! Who wants to see how the U.S. doctors take advantage of people and steal our money!

https://farm5.static.flickr.com/4012/4646153524_a712d12e39_o.jpg



Greedy Hospital's Wall Sign said:

> Current Established Charges for Services Posted as Required by Healthcare Regulations
> 
> Private Room $875.00
> Semi-Private Room $875.00
> Intensive Care Room $2635.00
> Emergency Room-1 $190.50
> Delivery Room (Normal Delivery) $1342.94
> Operating Room Class 1- First Half-Hour $4927.66
> ENG. $281.33 (no clue what this is!)
> Anesthesia (per minute) $49.42
> Chest X-Ray (one view) $179.30
> Upper GI Series $665.28
> Blood Sugar $37.74
> Urinalysis $53.08
> Blood Count $80.80
> Blood Chemistry (MPB) $102.34
> ABO Blood Typing $64.28
> RH Typing $59.28
> 
> Our charges are available for public examination. The above are examples of our prices and reflect only a portion of an entire hospital bill.
> All prices are subject to change.

Today, I lost another 3 vials of blood... Good times!

Tested for:

Total Testosterone (including Free & Weakly-Bound)
Prolactin (didn't get done last time apparently)
DHEA sulfate
Androstenedione

Got a call from my MW's office. The OB/GYN there (who specializes in thyroid therapy for infertility) says, "Thyroid looks pretty good." So, that's good... I guess. She passed along a list of OTC vitamins that he wants me taking though. 

I'm supposed to add:
Zinc 50mg
Selenium 200mg
Chromium
B Complex
Vitamin D 5000 IU (which I already started taking a couple of weeks ago)

That's about all I know! My left ovary is doing its thing... which is good! We shall see soon enough!


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## shaerichelle

Thanks Lesley, somethings going on. My ovaries hurt all the way into my back. 

Megg, good luck Hope u ov soon.


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## Megg33k

Ugh @ ovary pain! I'm getting annoyed at it, although I'm happy to have it in many ways! I think I'm still a good week or so from O! I still have 1 dose of soy left for tomorrow! *sigh*


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## shaerichelle

I am wondering if I shouldnt start taking soy even though I am not oving. A normal cycle is 30 days for me. so I was thinking 5-9 on first month and the day 35 on next month. I dont know what else to do but hope I ov and catch it this time.


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## Megg33k

Results for my last set of tests (Total Testosterone (including Free & Weakly-Bound), Prolactin, DHEA sulfate, Androstenedione) came through this morning. Can't tell me anything until my doc looks them over and interprets them, apparently! I guess reading an H or L is really hard! :rofl: Will report when I know more!

Edit: 

I got the rest of my test results back today.

B6 - Normal
Cardiolipin IGG AB - Normal
Cardiolipin IGM AB - Normal
Cardiolipin IGA AB - Normal
Antinuclear Antibodies (ANA) - Negative
DHEA-S - Normal
Prolactin - Normal
Aldosterone, serum - 11 (Upright 3:10pm) ???
[Upright 8am-10am = <29; Upright 4pm-6pm = <22; Supine 8am-10am = 3-16]
Free Testosterone - Normal
Percent Free - 2.35% [0.5-2.0] (So, slightly elevated, but "nothing to worry about")
Total Testosterone - Normal

So, she's all but tapped out on what she can do for me now. She's tested everything she's allowed to test! I have a standing order for 7dpo progesterone testing... but that's not here yet! She's not looking for a new fertility specialist to send me to. I think we found a local one that will be okay. Its not the awful one I went to last year. So, I'm hopeful. I'm also hoping that since my weight isn't effecting my ovulation that I won't be remanded to losing weight prior to treatment. Granted, I need to lose a ton of weight... but I don't feel like I can adequately focus on weight loss when I'd only be resenting the lack of baby making! I have a one-track mind and losing weight is in the backseat to having a baby right now. I don't believe my weight is actually keeping me from having a baby... So, why on earth should I spend a year or so losing weight if that's not the problem? I'm honestly hoping to fail my progesterone test miserably!!!

So, that's me hoping O is soon and my progesterone SUCKS! FX'd for bad test result! :rofl: Sounds so odd!


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