# 'Reins' for a toddler 'cruel' ????!!!



## sandilion

I mentioned to a lady in a store today who commented on how active my LO is that i think its about time I get some reins for him so i can keep him with me. The lady looked at me horrified and told me that was a horrible thing for me to say, and it would be cruel! With the way she said it you would think i told her i was going to belt him or something...

I also have a friend who believes they are cruel also. Is it really that cruel to ensure your child's safety is met?

I have been feeling a little anxious about the idea now as my LO is SO active it's almost impossible to keep him with me, especially in public! I can just picture him walking up to some creep and them sneaking off with him... the thought terrifies me.

It's not cruel is it??? Does anyone use them and have copped any slack from on lookers?


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## lindseymw

Nah they are not cruel in the slightest. 

Jacob wouldn't wear them or when he did, he would just flop on the ground in the hope I would 'catch' him before he hit the ground. oh that was a fun game....not


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## Bex84

Less cruel than your child running into a road, its all about safety. We barely have used ours as LO is very good at holding hands and is told that if she doesent then she gets carried when on pavement or carparks, when we started doing walks we had on once or twice as a safety measure


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## SarahP13

I don't like them and didn't want to use them with my children. So far it's been fine, DD1 is very calm and well behaved when we're out. She's just not the type to run off. Also we live in a small town so it's very pedestrian friendly and not too busy and, if shes not on the buggy board,I walk (with the pushchair) between her and the road. 

I have known parents to use them instead of teaching road safety, however I think they should be used alongside teaching LO how to walk properly and be mindful of the road and other people. 

Having said that, just because I would prefer not to use them doesn't mean I won't if I think I need to! If DD2 is a 'runner'(!) I will use them, although probably the rucksack with strap attached.

I wouldn't judge anyone for using them and some people should mind their own business!


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## suzib76

Yep totally cruel to keep your child safe :dohh:


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## topsy

We use them when walking on the pavement to the shops and out-I have a runner, he would be all over the place without them, he will not walk holding my hand BUT is now getting better-I hold his hand and regins to cross the road and he dosnt struggle anymore so hoping eventually we can progress to just hand holding but at the min the regins stay and keep him safe.

xxx


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## Button#

They keep my little boy safe while I teach him how to walk safely along the main road. It allows him a bit of independance and a chance to be out of the pushchair.


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## Siuan

EVERYBODY has an opinion about EVERYTHING. Doesn't mean you're right. Doesn't mean they're right. Everyone is entitled to that opinion. You do what YOU want to do and sod the rest of them. YOU know your child better than anyone else. Who cares what someone else thinks anyway? *shrug*

I will use them if I need to with my LO when she walks that confidently. For now, she walks fine holding my hand (but soon gives up as she's not confident at all). I couldn't give two hoots what anyone else thinks about my choice to use them if necessary. My family. My rules.


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## CormacksGirl

I still use them for Adam, most days he's really good but other days he'll bolt if given the chance. My sons safety is my priority!!


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## Dragonfly

I rather see a child on reins than on the road dead. Never owned them as I never needed them but I dont understand the controversy around them. As with everything I am sure some have abused it and dragged kids around but whats the difference in a pram, sling where your child sits still than being allowed to walk and be safe I dont know.=


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## Foogirl

It absolutely baffles me why people think reins are cruel. Why is it any different to having a child hod your hand or the handle of the buggy all the time? I see many parents not teaching road safety no matter whether their children have reins, holding hands or are on scooters, trikes etc so I think it is a bit ridiculous to decide there were a bad thing for this reason. My mum had 3 children under 6 and only had two hands. Without reins she couldn't have taken us out anywhere. I was all set to use them with Abby but as it turned out they were not needed.

As Siuan says, everyone has something against anything. If they work for you, then use them.


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## _Vicky_

Ha!! I have twins so them bolting in opposite directions was very very likely so yes I used them all the time up until about 2.5 - life saver literally!


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## Twinks

Wow I never even realised some people disagree with using baby reigns let alone dubbing them 'cruel.' My lo has always been very active and runs away from me now at 14 months laughing thinking its a lovely game of mummy chase me. If we're in a safe area away from roads I don't use baby reigns and he holds my hand (sometimes lol) but if we're near busy road I always use baby reigns on him. He doesn't mind at all and I would far rather have peace of mind that he's safe :0)


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## sequeena

Of course they're not. Thomas has a set of backpack reins. He seems to rather like them!


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## Jchihuahua

I used reins with Daisy until she was about 2. They are really common in the UK but I've had numerous comments from people outside the UK, even in Europe, who seem to think they are like treating your child like a dog. I don't understand those comments at all.


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## aimee-lou

I use them until I can confidently say that they're not going to run off. With Earl that was about 18 months. I fear that Eddy is a lot more headstrong and impulsive....he'll be about 10! lol :haha:


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## Eternal

_Vicky_ said:


> Ha!! I have twins so them bolting in opposite directions was very very likely so yes I used them all the time up until about 2.5 - life saver literally!

Exactly this, with twins you really have no option if not using the pram as they WILL run in complete opposite directions, plus I have an older toddler with suspected ADHD and autism (who doesn't use reins) so I physically cannot manage THREE toddlers by myself.


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## CertainTurton

I use baby reins with my DD when we are out near traffic or if I have the pram with me as I cant rush after her as quickly. She even puts her arms out for them when I get them out. I do also teach her to hold my hand across roads and she tends to hold on to the pram anyway. But she is so unreliable and does like to go her own way - I certainly think they are not cruel!


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## hubblybubbly

Nothing cruel about keeping them safe.....I use backpack ones when we're going somewhere very busy or near lots of traffic, and take them off when we get somewhere she can dart off without getting lost or run over.


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## Mrs Doddy

My lo does not run off, and won't even hold my hand but I'm right there by her side ...one of her friends on the other hand would benefit from Reins to teach him to stay close by !!!


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## babyjan

I never thought I would get them but I did, rarely use them at the moment but I fail to see how keeping your child safe is 'cruel'.

Would they prefer that the child somehow managed to escaped from you and got hit by a car?

Do whatever you feel is best for you and your child x


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## pinkpolkadot

Not cruel at all, in fact essential for us! My LO is a darter we have a backpack reign and hold her hand as she is off like a shot otherwise. I have heard people saying they would rather just teach road safety etc... but it's not always that simple when you have a crazy toddler with little sense of danger regardless of how hard you try to teach them not to run off!


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## Natsku

Not cruel at all! They help keep your toddler safe, how can that be cruel?! That said, they are really uncommon here so I very rarely used them but then again Maria is good at holding my hand to cross roads and stopping when I tell her to so I don't really need them.


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## kazzzzy

not cruel at all, the opposite in fact to keep your child safe, we've used them sometimes as LO loves walking now but she's gone so strong physically & willed that I would be afraid she'd get loose from my hand, they were very handy on holiday as the place we stayed in was very busy & I would be afraid of my life she'd get loose & lost in the crowd.


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## kmumtobe

I used them at your lo's age as a starter for walking out and about, i wanted to give him the oppurtunity to be out the buggy but he did not have an appreciation for holding hands and would just bolt, they cant understand safety at that age. He would wear them and id double loop the rein around my hand and encourage him to hold hands.. you could barely see them as he learnt to walk next to me, they became a back up.. he doesnt need them at all now hes fantastic at holding hands and we love going out walking together. He even gets to the edge of the road and says 'cars? safe? go!' before crossing! Definately needed in that initial stage to get to this point!


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## rosie272

I used reins for a month or so until Charlie got used to walking beside me holding my hand - I don't think they're cruel in the slightest just a safety measure for when you're out and about in busy roads/streets. I think we used them when he was around 19/20 months old, and didn't really care what anyone else thought! :flow:


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## babycrazy1706

Not cruel in the SLIGHTEST! Its so weird how ppl have these silly views.


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## lau86

IMO it's ridiculous to say toddler reins are cruel


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## geordiemoo

Not cruel at all, I would rather my daughter was on reins and not in the road than injured or worse. DD is very good at holding hands however we do use the reins if we go somewhere busy or where we are near a lot of busy roads. And her Nana uses them as she wouldn't be able to run after DD like we can. Everyone's entitled to their opinion but I personally think it's a bit naive to say they are cruel.


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## onetwothreebp

I've never had to use them but I wouldn't be opposed to them. Asher is getting a lot more stubborn these days and doesn't listen so quickly to me. I won't be afraid to resort to them once the baby comes, I can't go chasing after him so easily with a carseat on my arm.


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## Abigailly

I don't think they're 'cruel' as such. I don't agree with them though. I find them too dog like. In farming, a dog lead is because the dog is untrained, not trusted and a liability. Those dogs never last on the farm long. Which is probably why I dislike reigns so much.

However, I wouldn't be opposed to them if I had a child who was any of those. If she was not to be trusted on a road, or to not run off then I may consider them. I'd rather cut that behavior out before we get to that point though. Which has always worked with Niamh and the childminded kids. I may eat my words in the future though.


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## _dreamer_

I have never had a problem with them but my oh always used to say "I'll never put my children on a leash" and was so strong against it that it was wrong....I used to say wait until she's toddling about....well we use them with our 18 month old Lo and he now appreciates the safety factor....I especially think by busy roads and in crowded places they are an extra confidence in case your lo does decide to dart off after that dog/cat/ball/flower or just let go of your hand. I do think each to your own though. Do what works for you and your lo and try your hardest to ignore any unhelpful comments, especially from strangers x


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## Lynzeigh

I see no problem with them at all. I will use them for my son too if he gets to a stage where he can run fast and refuses to walk safely beside me. I have a knee that dislocates if I run so I have not much choice anyway.

The only time I saw reins used negatively was when I was at a lovely safe soft play group, a father had his 1 year old on reins constantly! Even while the baby was sitting in the ball pool etc which I found a bit OTT. Poor child had no freedom to move properly as he was holding her up with the reins whenever she tried to bend down, sit down or crawl about.

It's people like that, that give reins a bad name I think!


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## lozzy21

Abigailly said:


> I don't think they're 'cruel' as such. I don't agree with them though. I find them too dog like. In farming, a dog lead is because the dog is untrained, not trusted and a liability. Those dogs never last on the farm long. Which is probably why I dislike reigns so much.
> 
> However, I wouldn't be opposed to them if I had a child who was any of those. If she was not to be trusted on a road, or to not run off then I may consider them. I'd rather cut that behavior out before we get to that point though. Which has always worked with Niamh and the childminded kids. I may eat my words in the future though.

Cut what behaviour out before you get to what point? Children have no impulse control and no real danger awareness untill long after they are capable of walking.


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## CMarie

DH & I use them for our LO, and we absolutely love them. He's been getting too fussy to stay in his stroller or Ergo so we let him walk around a mall, park, etc as long as he has them on and he does super well with them. We've gotten a few negative looks, but honestly, we'd rather put up with those than a dead or injured toddler. Since we started using them a couple of months ago we've actually noticed that it's helped him in terms of knowing where his boundaries are. We'll let him walk around without them on and he's learning not to walk away too far :)


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## alisha_t

I use a backpack style one for my DD who just turned 2 last month. I couldn't keep up with her otherwise as I am 7 months pregnant lol. Like others have said, it is all about safety and I would rather her be able to walk safely than be strapped in the stroller all the time.


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## supertabby

We have used them with our lo, we had the backpack style. We don't use them so much now she's nearly 2.5yrs as she's reliable at holding hands near roads and she understands the stop and wait principle when crossing (I wouldn't say she could judge the safe moment to cross just yet but she waits to be told it's ok).

I get frustrated with the "I'd rather teach road safety" argument. The majority of parents who use reins are teaching road safety at the same time - it'd be foolish not to do so surely?! We saw the reins as a back up measure should she suddenly cut free and dart towards the road, but we insisted she held our hands by the road regardless, the reins weren't an alternative, they were a safety net while she was learning. Just like an instructor's car having a second set of brakes. I think most parents in favour of reins see it that way.


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## supertabby

Abigailly said:


> I don't think they're 'cruel' as such. I don't agree with them though. I find them too dog like. In farming, a dog lead is because the dog is untrained, not trusted and a liability. Those dogs never last on the farm long. Which is probably why I dislike reigns so much.
> 
> However, I wouldn't be opposed to them if I had a child who was any of those. If she was not to be trusted on a road, or to not run off then I may consider them. I'd rather cut that behavior out before we get to that point though. Which has always worked with Niamh and the childminded kids. I may eat my words in the future though.

How do you "cut that behaviour out" before they get the opportunity to run into a road? Children aren't born with road safety (or crowd safety) awareness, they must learn it like anything else and they learn to walk first.

Also, where are you getting dogs that are born trained?


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## mayb_baby

I have them and use them when I see fit, like recently I was in Blackpool and in places such as the Pleasure Beach I used them as I was petrified he would dart off. I think it depends on the child and where you are if they are needed but to call them cruel is just stupid.


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## Mrs_Random

My son holds hands but I have them as back up.

He's only 2 & easily gets distracted, so he will be walking nice next to the pram then see something & set off.
I can't chase him when I have his brother in a pram too so the reins just stop him going too far.

I'm confident he can wait to cross a road but again if he got distracted or excited by something he forgets what he's doing & will just go - again it's good to have them as a back up.

When toddlers are young they might understand but have short attention span & are easily distracted from what they are doing so it can be helpful to have the reins so they can't get in to danger. (Kids move quick!)


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## ellismum

Abigailly said:


> I don't think they're 'cruel' as such. I don't agree with them though. I find them too dog like. In farming, a dog lead is because the dog is untrained, not trusted and a liability. Those dogs never last on the farm long. Which is probably why I dislike reigns so much.
> 
> However, I wouldn't be opposed to them if I had a child who was any of those. If she was not to be trusted on a road, or to not run off then I may consider them. I'd rather cut that behavior out before we get to that point though. Which has always worked with Niamh and the childminded kids. I may eat my words in the future though.

I'm still trying to "cut" that behaviour out at 4 years old.:dohh:


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## Nat0619

So it's cruel to prevent your child darting into a road and getting knocked down? Cruel to keep them close to you in a shopping centre where you could lose sight of them in seconds if they bolt? Cruel to keep them close in a public place where a paedophile could be lurking around any corner? Sorry, I think that's ridiculous. A lady on here responded to a previous thread on this subject raising the story of James Bulger, who was abducted from a shopping centre and murdered. He'd be alive today if he'd been on reins.

As for the 'teaching them road safety' thing. Obviously yes. But Ciara is 15 months old! I doubt she'd understand the green cross code yet!


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## special_kala

Abigailly said:


> I don't think they're 'cruel' as such. I don't agree with them though. I find them too dog like. In farming, a dog lead is because the dog is *untrained, not trusted and a liability*. Those dogs never last on the farm long. Which is probably why I dislike reigns so much.
> 
> However, I wouldn't be opposed to them if I had a child who was any of those. If she was not to be trusted on a road, or to not run off then I may consider them. I'd rather cut that behavior out before we get to that point though. Which has always worked with Niamh and the childminded kids. I may eat my words in the future though.

Is that not exactly what toddlers are?


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## sequeena

My almost 2 year old is mentally 12 months old and like most other toddlers doesn't have any self preservation and only lives in the moment. I cannot get him to understand he needs to hold my hand and not leave my side because of his disability. One day he will not not need the reins as he will eventually learn but until that day I am confident in my choice for him to wear reins when we are out as a 'back up' :thumbup:


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## Misstrouble19

i dont think reigns are cruel at all.. your promoting your childs safety :) i use them sometimes xx


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## suzib76

Abigailly said:


> I don't think they're 'cruel' as such. I don't agree with them though. I find them too dog like. In farming, a dog lead is because the dog is untrained, not trusted and a liability. Those dogs never last on the farm long. Which is probably why I dislike reigns so much.
> 
> However, I wouldn't be opposed to them if I had a child who was any of those. If she was not to be trusted on a road, or to not run off then I may consider them. I'd rather cut that behavior out before we get to that point though. Which has always worked with Niamh and the childminded kids. I may eat my words in the future though.

Kids are not dogs nor are they comparable to dogs

My son always needed a physical boundary, he had reins, he had a play pen, he stayed in a cot for longer than most, I took him out in a buggy when he was too old to be in one and he had a stair gate on his room still when he was 5. He NEEDED these things in place, there was no way to 'cut it out' 

It turns out he has autism but back in the toddler days we never knew this and we just took every precaution to keep him safe

The idea that we could have cut the behaviour out of him is laughable


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## tommyg

Whats cruel about them???

When DS learned to walk he wouldn't take anybodys hand, I think he found walking with and arm up in the air to hold an adults hand uncomfortable and knocked him of balance. 

Try walking about with your arm in the air as if you are holding on to somebodies hand whos more than double your height and you'll realise its not very comfortable for a child, so could be regarded as cruel to force them to do it, nor is it comfy for and adult to walk stooped to hold a small childs hand.

So for us reins were a must, they also saved him from landing flat on his face a few times as we were able to stop him hitting the ground, initally we used the harness type before progressing to the backpack type.


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## special_kala

tommyg said:


> Whats cruel about them???
> 
> When DS learned to walk he wouldn't take anybodys hand, I think he found walking with and arm up in the air to hold an adults hand uncomfortable and knocked him of balance.
> 
> *Try walking about with your arm in the air as if you are holding on to somebodies hand whos more than double your height and you'll realise its not very comfortable for a child, so could be regarded as cruel to force them to do it, nor is it comfy for and adult to walk stooped to hold a small childs hand.
> *
> So for us reins were a must, they also saved him from landing flat on his face a few times as we were able to stop him hitting the ground, initally we used the harness type before progressing to the backpack type.

thats a very good point!


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## Pixie19

I used to think of them as treating a baby like a dog and always thought parents used them to be controlling etc :blush:

Now i have a toddler i have eaten my words....:blush:
We use backpack reins now and they may possibly one day save his life! 
Would much rather 'put him on a lead' than the alternative.


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## Foogirl

tommyg said:

> *Try walking about with your arm in the air as if you are holding on to somebodies hand whos more than double your height and you'll realise its not very comfortable for a child, so could be regarded as cruel to force them to do it, nor is it comfy for and adult to walk stooped to hold a small childs hand.
> *




special_kala said:


> thats a very good point!

One we've learned whilst helping Abby to walk. It really hampers the natural walking style!


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## tommyg

Hay cool Foogirl, how many steps can she take? Really chuffed for her that she'll be able to get on her feet - you've put a massive grin on my face.


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## LoraLoo

Ive never got along with them, all mine have just thrown themselves to the floor in them or refused to walk :dohh: Definitely not cruel though!


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## sandilion

I feel a lot better about it now and will definitely buy one tomorrow. As my toddler at just 17 months old is certainly not at the stage to understand road rules just yet. Of course i am constantly teaching him about it, but feel it would be safer to have him on the reins so i can teach him more safely. I also want the reins for shopping centers too - he is such a terror, just takes off and heads into stores. Its impossible to keep him with me right now. I don't think of him as 'naughty' for doing it though, just young fearless and curious.


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## Noelle610

I've found that most people who don't like them fall into one of the following categories:

1. Don't have children

2. Have adult children

3. Have children, but they're not yet walking

or 

4. Have one of those magic kids I'm unfamiliar with who is perfectly behaved at all times, has total control over impulses and always acts with impunity. Kind of like a unicorn.


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## seoj

Lots of opinions huh? LOL. OP- Glad you decided to do what you feel is best though- that is all any of us can do. As what is right for one may or may not be for another...

Personally, I don't use reigns, BUT- with that said, my LO behaves well enough when she is walking... but, as needed she goes in her stroller. She does well in the stroller- always has, so for me, there is no need to use reigns. We started allowing more freedom walking when out about 16mos- and it was a bit tough at first, when she got into everything or took off running :haha: -- but it was never that hard, and she's only improved and understands the boundaries much better. She still hates holding hands when crossing parking lots etc... but we are getting there ;) I like that she is learning and that I can trust her more- even though I always have a hawk eye on her.


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## lhancock90

Noelle610 said:


> I've found that most people who don't like them fall into one of the following categories:
> 
> 1. Don't have children
> 
> 2. Have adult children
> 
> 3. Have children, but they're not yet walking
> 
> or
> 
> 4. Have one of those magic kids I'm unfamiliar with who is perfectly behaved at all times, has total control over impulses and always acts with impunity. Kind of like a unicorn.

This! :thumbup:
So what if they remind people of a leash. I wouldn't want my child to get hit by a car anymore than I would my dog. It's a safety measure I do with love not to be cruel.


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## Noelle610

lhancock90 said:


> Noelle610 said:
> 
> 
> I've found that most people who don't like them fall into one of the following categories:
> 
> 1. Don't have children
> 
> 2. Have adult children
> 
> 3. Have children, but they're not yet walking
> 
> or
> 
> 4. Have one of those magic kids I'm unfamiliar with who is perfectly behaved at all times, has total control over impulses and always acts with impunity. Kind of like a unicorn.
> 
> This! :thumbup:
> 
> So what if they remind people of a leash. I wouldn't want my child to get hit by a car anymore than I would my dog. It's a safety measure I do with love not to be cruel.Click to expand...

OH AND, you reminder me :haha: I find that people who compare reigns to leashes.... do not have dogs.


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## OmarsMum

We never needed it as Omar is very good at staying close & holding hands. But I think they're so handy, I saw a lady in a busy mall with twins boys (around 18-24 months old), she was pushing a double buggy, the mall was so crowed, both her kids when in reins, they were still trying to escape & run around :haha:


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## Foogirl

tommyg said:


> Hay cool Foogirl, how many steps can she take? Really chuffed for her that she'll be able to get on her feet - you've put a massive grin on my face.

Oh she is doing great. She's going great guns in her walking frame. Even jumping in puddles at the weekend! I'll find somewhere here to stick the video up!


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## jodilee6

We've just got back from a weekend away at the seaside with our 14mnt old and I can tell you our reigns were a god send!

I don't care what anyone thinks, they kept my son safe, stopped him from running in the road or sea when very excited. I'll use them until he's old enough to be trusted to walk on his own without darting off in a moment of excitement.


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## snb1978

Cruel??? How can stopping them from getting run over, lost etc be cruel? I'd rather be cruel then see my child get into harm, my in laws have my daughter part time and they are quite slow people and could never keep up with my toddler if she wiggled free I would be worried at work for my child's safety if they did t have her on reigns, take no notice! Xx


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## snb1978

Abigailly said:


> I don't think they're 'cruel' as such. I don't agree with them though. I find them too dog like. In farming, a dog lead is because the dog is untrained, not trusted and a liability. Those dogs never last on the farm long. Which is probably why I dislike reigns so much.
> 
> However, I wouldn't be opposed to them if I had a child who was any of those. If she was not to be trusted on a road, or to not run off then I may consider them. I'd rather cut that behavior out before we get to that point though. Which has always worked with Niamh and the childminded kids. I may eat my words in the future though.

It's not that a toddler can't be trusted, toddlers aren't developed mentally to even understand the meaning of trust, toddlers don't see danger and that's all there is to it, they don't grasp the concept of simple things like going to toilet until approx 2 let alone not running off!


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## Groovychick

I personally don't think they are cruel at all. :nope:

I got some for my daughter after she had 'grown out' of her pushchair simply on the basis of safety. The last thing I would want her to do is to get over-excited and run off, the consequences are unthinkable. I have no qualms about letting her off her reins in a park or a fenced area but otherwise I make sure she keeps them on. It just gives me a piece of mind that she is safe and I am in control. :)


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## snowfia

I don't think they're cruel. I haven't used them much with DD. I do think it's like walking a dog though :haha: 
But I will use them more when this one's born. I don't fancy risking DD running off when we're by a road or in a busy shopping centre or something. They're definitely better than something terrible happening.


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## Maggs

No, definitely not cruel but not my personal preference either. I find it's more common to see them in the UK then it is in Canada though. 

Only thing I'd like to see done differently is that some children are left to run ahead with parent just holding the reins. If on a road, I think it's best for a child to still hold an adult's hand to learn that is what you do. Fine enough if you're walking on a path or in a park.


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## tommyg

Macys reins aren't normally that long for a child to run ahead. Try walking with your arm in the air before you decide which is more comfy for a child.


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## smokey

We don't need them anymore (well nanny and grandma still use them occasionally as they arnt as quick) but the way I see it if wanting to keep your child safe and trying to prevent them running out in a road or our case is more the river because we live along the Thames is cruel then im happy enough being wicked and evil and sod what anyone else thinks or says.


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## _jellybean_

Just bought a backpack one. I'm disabled, and I'm hoping they will help me to be able to take my son out while using my cane. No...they're not cruel. TBH we did feel a bit uncomfy using them at first, b/c I do think that a lot of people think they look like a leash--but--who cares, lol! As long as lo is safe!


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## bumpy_j

We used a backpack set of reins - not cruel at all, just a safety precaution. I find it absurd that anyone would come to that conclusion.


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## MrsButterfly

We have a backpack set ready for when we need them. Don't think they are cruel at all and just help protect your lo.


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## SjandPeanut

Noelle610 said:


> lhancock90 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noelle610 said:
> 
> 
> I've found that most people who don't like them fall into one of the following categories:
> 
> 1. Don't have children
> 
> 2. Have adult children
> 
> 3. Have children, but they're not yet walking
> 
> or
> 
> 4. Have one of those magic kids I'm unfamiliar with who is perfectly behaved at all times, has total control over impulses and always acts with impunity. Kind of like a unicorn.
> 
> This! :thumbup:
> 
> So what if they remind people of a leash. I wouldn't want my child to get hit by a car anymore than I would my dog. It's a safety measure I do with love not to be cruel.Click to expand...
> 
> OH AND, you reminder me :haha: I find that people who compare reigns to leashes.... do not have dogs.Click to expand...

My son has back pack reigns one is a like a dinosaur the other is a bumblebee. They have little rain hoods and are ridiculously cute. I'm now imagining trying to walk my 30kg German Shepard and my 35kg lab x bully with backpack reigns...I'm sure that would work lol


----------



## sequeena

SjandPeanut said:


> Noelle610 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lhancock90 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noelle610 said:
> 
> 
> I've found that most people who don't like them fall into one of the following categories:
> 
> 1. Don't have children
> 
> 2. Have adult children
> 
> 3. Have children, but they're not yet walking
> 
> or
> 
> 4. Have one of those magic kids I'm unfamiliar with who is perfectly behaved at all times, has total control over impulses and always acts with impunity. Kind of like a unicorn.
> 
> This! :thumbup:
> 
> So what if they remind people of a leash. I wouldn't want my child to get hit by a car anymore than I would my dog. It's a safety measure I do with love not to be cruel.Click to expand...
> 
> OH AND, you reminder me :haha: I find that people who compare reigns to leashes.... do not have dogs.Click to expand...
> 
> My son has back pack reigns one is a like a dinosaur the other is a bumblebee. They have little rain hoods and are ridiculously cute. I'm now imagining trying to walk my 30kg German Shepard and my 35kg lab x bully with backpack reigns...I'm sure that would work lolClick to expand...

That image is hilarious. My own mental image is similar. I have a black GSD and a Mastiff :rofl:


----------



## SjandPeanut

sequeena said:


> SjandPeanut said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noelle610 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lhancock90 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Noelle610 said:
> 
> 
> I've found that most people who don't like them fall into one of the following categories:
> 
> 1. Don't have children
> 
> 2. Have adult children
> 
> 3. Have children, but they're not yet walking
> 
> or
> 
> 4. Have one of those magic kids I'm unfamiliar with who is perfectly behaved at all times, has total control over impulses and always acts with impunity. Kind of like a unicorn.
> 
> This! :thumbup:
> 
> So what if they remind people of a leash. I wouldn't want my child to get hit by a car anymore than I would my dog. It's a safety measure I do with love not to be cruel.Click to expand...
> 
> OH AND, you reminder me :haha: I find that people who compare reigns to leashes.... do not have dogs.Click to expand...
> 
> My son has back pack reigns one is a like a dinosaur the other is a bumblebee. They have little rain hoods and are ridiculously cute. I'm now imagining trying to walk my 30kg German Shepard and my 35kg lab x bully with backpack reigns...I'm sure that would work lolClick to expand...
> 
> That image is hilarious. My own mental image is similar. I have a black GSD and a Mastiff :rofl:Click to expand...

I'm so tempted to try, maybe just for a picture... :haha:


----------



## sequeena

...I am willing to do this... for scientific purposes of course :rofl:


----------



## LegoHouse

I didn't use reins with my first but she had my undivided attention. This time.... I've used reins once, and I don't really like them, but sometimes they are safer and if I need them again I will use them :)


----------



## Abigailly

lozzy21 said:


> Abigailly said:
> 
> 
> I don't think they're 'cruel' as such. I don't agree with them though. I find them too dog like. In farming, a dog lead is because the dog is untrained, not trusted and a liability. Those dogs never last on the farm long. Which is probably why I dislike reigns so much.
> 
> However, I wouldn't be opposed to them if I had a child who was any of those. If she was not to be trusted on a road, or to not run off then I may consider them. I'd rather cut that behavior out before we get to that point though. Which has always worked with Niamh and the childminded kids. I may eat my words in the future though.
> 
> Cut what behaviour out before you get to what point? Children have no impulse control and no real danger awareness untill long after they are capable of walking.Click to expand...

Cut out the 'impulsiveness'. Yes, they always will be however not Once has Niamh run out on a road, nor has she ever run off in a shop etc. I know I'm incredibly lucky with her.

And yes, children are comparable to dogs. And I mean that with no negativity what so ever. The dogs I've trained were always the most important things in my life before Niamh. They both need to be taught right from wrong. 

She walks beside me, she may hold my hand, may not, she ALWAYS stays beside me. I'd like to think that's entirely my nurturing. But apparently she's a Unicorn:shrug:

As I said, I only have one child and may one day eat my words.


----------



## Abigailly

And as for being against, and comparing, reigns and leads.

I have an almost 4 year old. She's by no means perfect but I'm currently against reigns. I compare reigns to leads and growing up I had 2 working Springer Spaniels (both who I trained) 4 hunting Cockers and my pet Hovawart. Who was 100lbs and trained both on and off lead. However, I very rarely used a lead.

The only time I did was on a busy road. Just as with Niamh, if it's a busy road then we either hold hands or I keep my hand on hood lightly 'just in case'.


----------



## minties

I thought swaddling and reigns were both "stupid and mean" before I had kids. Now I'm a mum who swaddled both kids until about 8 months, and Thomas has reigns for if we need them.

I now don't poo-poo anything too quickly!


----------



## kerrie24

I had reigns for no.1 as he was a terror,the other 2 I have managed without.

Its one of those things that just doesn't seem worth spending my time worrying about,I have become so laid back after 3 kids and try not to judge anyone.


----------



## special_kala

kerrie24 said:


> I had reigns for no.1 as he was a terror,the other 2 I have managed without.
> 
> Its one of those things that just doesn't seem worth spending my time worrying about,I have become so laid back after 3 kids and try not to judge anyone.

Judging involves far too much energy


----------



## smokey

Thing is its all well and good saying to cut that behavour out of them or to teach them not to run off but that isnt a instant thing to teach them, it takes time and patiance to teach them and it only takes a split second for somthing to go wrong in that time.
Is it really worth taking that risk while your teaching them about safety.
A split second could get a child killed so i just dont understand why anyone would be against takeing a precaution (deciding not to use them isnt the same as beimg against them)
Would so many people be against using armbands in a swimming pool before they learn to swim? Its the same thing to me, a aid to help them while teaching them.


----------



## sequeena

smokey said:


> Thing is its all well and good saying to cut that behavour out of them or to teach them not to run off but that isnt a instant thing to teach them, it takes time and patiance to teach them and it only takes a split second for somthing to go wrong in that time.
> Is it really worth taking that risk while your teaching them about safety.
> A split second could get a child killed so i just dont understand why anyone would be against takeing a precaution (deciding not to use them isnt the same as beimg against them)
> Would so many people be against using armbands in a swimming pool before they learn to swim? Its the same thing to me, a aid to help them while teaching them.

Agreed.


----------



## Foogirl

I think it's one thing to say "I personally don't like reins and won't use them" and "i'm against reins" The first indicates a personal preference. The second is a judgement on people who use them. That might not be the intention behind the words but it is the meaning conveyed nonetheless.

I'm definitely looking forward to seeing the Bull Mastiff in backpack reins!

And, we keep comparing children's reins to dogs leads. Surely a more correct comparison would be to a horse - those are the animal we use reins on....


----------



## Abigailly

Foogirl said:


> I think it's one thing to say "I personally don't like reins and won't use them" and "i'm against reins" The first indicates a personal preference. The second is a judgement on people who use them. That might not be the intention behind the words but it is the meaning conveyed nonetheless.
> 
> I'm definitely looking forward to seeing the Bull Mastiff in backpack reins!
> 
> And, we keep comparing children's reins to dogs leads. Surely a more correct comparison would be to a horse - those are the animal we use reins on....

Just because I'm against reigns doesn't mean I have an issue with other people using them? Nor does it mean I'm 'judging' someone for using them. Saying that I'm against them is me saying that I don't like them. Therefore would not use them unless I deemed necessary.
I'm against Independence, but that doesn't mean that I don't understand people's reasoning behind supporting it? 

Being against something doesn't make you judgmental of the opposing argument.


----------



## Foogirl

No, saying you are against them is saying that you don't think they should be used by anyone. As I said, that might not be your intention but it is the meaning conveyed.

Using your analogy, saying you are against independence, means you don't personally want it but if everyone else votes for it, you'll be fine with that.......


----------



## Abigailly

smokey said:


> Thing is its all well and good saying to cut that behavour out of them or to teach them not to run off but that isnt a instant thing to teach them, it takes time and patiance to teach them and it only takes a split second for somthing to go wrong in that time.
> Is it really worth taking that risk while your teaching them about safety.
> A split second could get a child killed so i just dont understand why anyone would be against takeing a precaution (deciding not to use them isnt the same as beimg against them)
> Would so many people be against using armbands in a swimming pool before they learn to swim? Its the same thing to me, a aid to help them while teaching them.

Yes, I used a floating aid for Niamh. But she would never be able to swim a whole length independently as she can now if I'd never have given her the chance to learn. But I was always there, with my hands under her just in case she panicked or lost concentration.

Just as with reins. Just because she wasn't wearing a restraint doesn't mean that she ever got near a road without me. It can be a split second. But because she's my first I could devote all my attention to her. 
I may have to use them in the future. Which is why I never said I'm 'against' them.


----------



## Foogirl

I'd also love to know what the difference is between "lightly holding the hood" (presumably of a jacked) and using a pair of reins. Surely it is still restraining the child.


----------



## Abigailly

Foogirl said:


> I'd also love to know what the difference is between "lightly holding the hood" (presumably of a jacked) and using a pair of reins. Surely it is still restraining the child.

I mean that when we're crossing a road and she's pushing her buggy or something I hover my hand over the back of her so if she's distracted by anything or something falls out her buggy I can take control of the situation in a split second, without her being able to dart back onto the road.

ETA And there is no difference. Both are to restrain them in moments in need.


----------



## smokey

Foogirl said:


> I think it's one thing to say "I personally don't like reins and won't use them" and "i'm against reins" The first indicates a personal preference. The second is a judgement on people who use them. That might not be the intention behind the words but it is the meaning conveyed nonetheless.
> 
> I'm definitely looking forward to seeing the Bull Mastiff in backpack reins!
> 
> And, we keep comparing children's reins to dogs leads. Surely a more correct comparison would be to a horse - those are the animal we use reins on....

Yeah but iv noticed even more judgmental looks when your riding on your kids back around the shops :)
Now what i want is one of those retractable leads for when he gets too far ahead, weeeeee :)


----------



## smokey

Foogirl said:


> I'd also love to know what the difference is between "lightly holding the hood" (presumably of a jacked) and using a pair of reins. Surely it is still restraining the child.

And risking choking them, learnt that one the hard way, he yanked his hand out of mine and ran towards the river (the path is only a few feet wide and we have ti walk it daily) the only thing i could grab for quick enough was his jumper hood and nearly choked him.


----------



## tommyg

Anybody else have the issue of LO wanting to hold their own reins??? "my turn"


----------



## kimberleyrobx

Reins are not cruel! Reins were very important to me when out with Emily! Without them, I feared that she would run onto the road and it would be fault if she ever 'slipped' her hand away from mine! Reins are crucial to me, to me it's like driving without a seat belt on! Dangerous! Although Emily has the cutest bag back reins, everyone's always cooing over them! IMO reins are an essential to me xx


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## emzul

People are idiots. How can they be cruel when they can potentially prevent a child rushing into the road and being mown down?? 

Why cant people (ESPECIALLY strangers) keep their thoughts to themselves? LOL


----------



## Foogirl

smokey said:


> And risking choking them, learnt that one the hard way, he yanked his hand out of mine and ran towards the river (the path is only a few feet wide and we have ti walk it daily) the only thing i could grab for quick enough was his jumper hood and nearly choked him.

Ouch! That doesn't sound good. I've done similar when Abby's legs have given way, but she just fell out of the jacket and on the floor anyway. Thankfully she wasn't hurt!



smokey said:


> Yeah but iv noticed even more judgmental looks when your riding on your kids back around the shops :)
> Now what i want is one of those retractable leads for when he gets too far ahead, weeeeee :)

And even more judgemental when it is a 3 year old in a buggy :dohh: Why can't people just let people be!



tommyg said:


> Anybody else have the issue of LO wanting to hold their own reins??? "my turn"

Lol, we get Abby wanting to push her own wheelchair. A real challenge that one!


----------



## amygwen

I don't think they are cruel at all. We personally don't use them, although there are plenty of times and instances where I would love to have them, i.e. in amusement parks, walks near busy streets, etc etc.. I would prefer getting dirty looks from other people (who are likely not parents or parents of children who don't walk yet) then having my child get lost or hit by a car.

Most people who think they are cruel are really old people who have no filter about anything anyways, people who don't have children, or people who do have children but their children aren't old enough to walk yet. LOL!


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## maisiemoo

Whilst I always encouraged freedom walking when my daughter was young, teaching road safety etc in some children the impulse is too strong. I have an adventurer and explorer, and even now the impulse gets the better of her. The back pack reigns were an absolute god send, now she rides a scooter and 99% she's fine, for the occasional 1% I'm that bellowing mother, running down the road (with an almighty bump I hasten to add) trying to regain control of my out of control monkey - imagine the judgements that come from that scene!


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## mrsdean2009

They are not cruel in the slightest, far from it! If you feel your child needs reins to help with learning how to be safe whilst walking or for whatever reason then go for it. At the end of the day they are your child and therefore what you choose to do for them and to keep them safe is your right and responsibility.

I have used them on occasions but never really had to much with Ava. I was very adamant that if she wanted to walk she held hands with me or another adult. If she refused she was immediately picked up or put in her buggy. She soon learned if she was to walk she held my hand.

Do whatever you feel is best for your LO and down worry about anyone judging you x


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## fluffpuffin

I think they're great for keeping toddlers safe by the road or in busy places to stop them running off into danger. They saved me a lot of stress as Isla was a terrible one for darting off.

One thing I do dislike though is when they're used as a walking aid for toddlers that only just start walking. FIL kept trying to put them on Isla in the garden to try and would then yank her back up with the reins when she was falling. Toddlers need to learn how to fall safely so reins aren't meant for this purpose and also it just looks horrible and uncomfortable when they're yanked about by reins or held upright by them.


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## tommyg

Even if they are used to help safe a tot from falling its better than their arm being yanked, that has been known to dislocate joints.


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## fluffpuffin

oh not at is not good either. But I just let her walk freely without hand holding in a safe environment. when she fell she would just get back up. There was never any need to 'stop her from falling' when it's only soft grass in the garden or park. or you can just gently let go so the toddler gently lands on their bum. no need to yank them upright by hand or reins.


----------



## smokey

tommyg said:


> Even if they are used to help safe a tot from falling its better than their arm being yanked, that has been known to dislocate joints.

That's why im not too keen on the strap springy ones that go round the wrist, my nephew had one and hurt his arm as he went to run forward and it pulled his arm barckwards.


----------



## smokey

fluffpuffin said:


> I think they're great for keeping toddlers safe by the road or in busy places to stop them running off into danger. They saved me a lot of stress as Isla was a terrible one for darting off.
> 
> One thing I do dislike though is when they're used as a walking aid for toddlers that only just start walking. FIL kept trying to put them on Isla in the garden to try and would then yank her back up with the reins when she was falling. Toddlers need to learn how to fall safely so *reins aren't meant for this purpose and also it just looks horrible and uncomfortable when they're yanked about by reins or held upright by them*.

Unless you have a child like mine that thinks this is hilarious and spends most of his time swinging from them shouting weeeee :) one of the main reasons I stoped using them as he kept pulling me other or dropping to his knees pretending to be a mouse.


----------



## KittyVentura

I think it is completely backwards that anyone would ever think them cruel. They can and do save lives. And I say that as someone who isn't that keen on them personally.

I think my aversion comes front the fact they seem so overused here (**disclaimer, I know most mothers use them sensibly and teach road safety with just using the reins as extra security JUST IN CASE... So this this just what I have seen here and not a claim all mothers are like this... At all). Like I will see toddlers Fins age now pulling their parents along by them, not holding hands to cross roads, being held back from constantly running off with them, being held up by them while having a floppy tantrum etc. I've seen children arrive at a play park, be released and literally bolt and run straight away as soon as they are unclipped.

I've been to a farm park, which was completely child safe in the petting fields, and been the ONLY parent there with a toddler walking free. All the others on open grass with no roads or falls or hazards anywhere close by... On reins. Being stopped from running, playing, exploring, experiencing what takes THEIR interest etc in what is probably THE safest place to do so. If you can't let your toddler run free in a field then when the heck can you? Incidentally despite there being big signs up to pet and feed the animals by picking weeds etc from the wildgrass area AND hand washing places signposted AND sanitizer avail regularly... All the children were being prevented from going anywhere near an animal (in pens)... All being told they will bite or give germs. Fin was there in his wellies, tramping about, going up to whatever he wanted to experience at that moment, picking clover flowers and hand feeding the goats with such glee and it just felt so odd that all of these other kids were being kept from experiencing things the same.

I've been at a play park and seen a toddler on the swings... With one parent pushing and the other holding the strap from the little life backpack. That made no sense. The same parents held it when the kid went on EVERYTHING. I get hovering, I really do. But surely holding a rein tight while your toddler goes down a pretty small slide is creating more risk than what it could possibly prevent?

So, to conclude. They are absolutely NOT cruel. We do not use them, but that was a personal choice and as a SAHM I did have the time on every walk to wait while he sniffed every flower and picked up every stick etc and to turn around and go home if he refused to hold my hand or listen etc. If I had places to be, had to get us to nursery etc with a deadline etc, maybe I would have used them too. It could have also have been that we lucked out with Fin and that Amelia is too strong headed to use the same approach with when I need to have my eyes on too. Maybe I will need one for her at she point. I will never rule them out, they absolutely have their place and can be wonderful... But certainly here they seem to be overused. Sometimes it does seem that using reins has been done instead of tackling behaviour issues head on. Sometimes it seems they have been used in a way that the child hasn't learnt boundaries or road safety and when let off them they are at real risk of just running out into a road unaware of the risk as it has never been taught. Sometimes kids seem to be in them when there truly seems no need to be.

Some people mis-use them as they can so many other tools and things and that is a bad thing. But they are still not at all cruel. Xx


----------



## aliss

Are reins a UK thing? I've never seen those here.


----------



## tinkerbelle93

My LO is 19 months old and has reins, he will sometimes scream if he's stuck in his pushchair but won't hold my hand at the moment so it's the only option really!


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## tommyg

Even if they are used to help safe a tot from falling its better than their arm being yanked, that has been known to dislocate joints.


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## KittyVentura

Honesty? I never yank their arms. If I can catch them, I will... But also at think there is a lot to learn from falling so if I cannot catch them then I will just kiss away any booboos and sing away any ouchies. I don't think pulling (lets me honest though, it can also be the same as a yank) back their shoulders suddenly with reins or yanking their arm is ideal. Neither is better than the other in my view. Learning themselves from the tumble and a grazed knee is what I would prefer every time xxx


----------



## x__amour

Run out in street, get run over and killed. Be critized by other parents. I'll take number two. 

I've never used them but see why they're useful.


----------



## tommyg

Can I just add for those who think their LO will never run onto the road. I as a small child was walking happily with mum. A road worker started up a pneumatic drill. I got a fright and bolted, before mum could do anything, a kind elderly gent in a tweed jacket came and got me.

I must have been 3 possiblely 4 as I can remember the incident. But at the stage of being too old for reins.


----------



## Maggs

Well said Kitty! I don't recall seeing them very often back at home. I was a nanny for years and never used them nor did any of the other Mom's we met in baby groups. I think we're lucky that our LO is quite laid back and we don't have huge battles every time we go for a walk to force him to hold our hands. Maybe in a year's time, he'll be a different story. Maybe another child will be a different story. For at the moment, for us, I feel we don't need it and don't choose to use it. For others, I'm sure it's a godsend and to each their own!


----------



## Mrs HM

My 18month old thinks its funny to run everywhere at the minute so he wears a backpack with a strap attached to it that gos around my wrist. It doesn't control his movement much at all but it means that he can't dart off towards the road. It's also in a cute dinosaur design so he's happy to wear it at the minute as he knows it also contains a few snacks for when we are out and about.

I honestly don't know how anyone can think keeping control of your child, and for their own safety too, is cruel!


----------



## Maggs

I saw the backpack ones today for the first time. They are really cute. If I never needed one in the future, that would be the route I would go down.


----------



## kimberleyrobx

I also have the back pack xx


----------



## pandacub

Jacob has the dinosaur backpack reins too :) 
Theyre obviously not cruel.. Theres not much more to say on this subjet really!


----------



## jjbump

We use the back packs too. Sorry, but very few 18 month - 3 year olds are going to understand road safety. My LO will nod when I talk to her about road safety, but seconds later she will have forgotten and will attempt to run into the road. If you live in a relatively quiet area with few cars, I can understand taking the risk, but if you live somewhere like London, there are plenty of dangerous obstacles around.


----------



## Foogirl

KittyVentura said:


> I've been at a play park and seen a toddler on the swings... With one parent pushing and the other holding the strap from the little life backpack. That made no sense. The same parents held it when the kid went on EVERYTHING. I get hovering, I really do. But surely holding a rein tight while your toddler goes down a pretty small slide is creating more risk than what it could possibly prevent?

Until you know why those parents are doing those things, it's not really right to judge. There could be any number of reasons why. We used what would look like ordinary reins when Abby was younger to basically keep her straight. Her low muscle tone meant on that "pretty small slide" she would fall backwards and thump her head off the slide. Using a harness we could keep her upright, the same was true when she went on EVERYTHING. (and on our visits to any child's attraction....) To all other parents I'm sure we looked like we were stopping our poor child from running free. These same parents would have thought (and indeed often commented) we were so cruel for having her in the buggy at 3 years old.

Maybe we should just have just kept her home and not subjected her to such cruel behaviour:dohh:


----------



## Destiny08

i have reins for LO. and i dont care what people think. lol that said, we do live in a small town and the town centre is totally off limits to cars, so i dont worry too much. i also would rather i taught LO how to be safe so if i can trust her (which i usually can) i wont use them. 
that said, the last few days she thinks its a big game to try run into the road, and has been tugged back rather violently by me. so i may have to bring the reins back.

basically no. they arent cruel. i rather wouldnt use mine, but i know some toddlers are runners and cant be relied upon to listen and stay close. and if LO is ever like that, i will most definitely use the reins and nobody has the right to judge me on that :)


----------



## KittyVentura

Foogirl said:


> KittyVentura said:
> 
> 
> I've been at a play park and seen a toddler on the swings... With one parent pushing and the other holding the strap from the little life backpack. That made no sense. The same parents held it when the kid went on EVERYTHING. I get hovering, I really do. But surely holding a rein tight while your toddler goes down a pretty small slide is creating more risk than what it could possibly prevent?
> 
> Until you know why those parents are doing those things, it's not really right to judge. There could be any number of reasons why. We used what would look like ordinary reins when Abby was younger to basically keep her straight. Her low muscle tone meant on that "pretty small slide" she would fall backwards and thump her head off the slide. Using a harness we could keep her upright, the same was true when she went on EVERYTHING. (and on our visits to any child's attraction....) To all other parents I'm sure we looked like we were stopping our poor child from running free. These same parents would have thought (and indeed often commented) we were so cruel for having her in the buggy at 3 years old.
> 
> Maybe we should just have just kept her home and not subjected her to such cruel behaviour:dohh:Click to expand...

I did say repeatedly that I do not thing they are cruel at all, and I never intended to offend anyone, especially you Foo. You obviously did what was the absolute best thing for Abby and I take my hat off to you. I must say though that, while I do know that a lot of disabilities, illnesses and impairments won't be obvious... This child certainly appeared to have none. And it was a little life, not reins. I can't imagine a little life could be used as you did as they just don't seem reliable enough but I could be wrong. I didn't judge them, I just didn't get it. This child was running about, climbing, jumping, having full on conversations and seemed to have full mobility and I really just could not see any reason why the reins would be needed. But again, I do appreciate there could have been a lot more than met the eye. Again, I am sorry if I offended you or hit a nerve. It was absolutely not intentional, I was simply using this one of many scenarios here as an example xxx


----------



## Misscheifmake

I've got 18 month old twins, try keeping them both with you and safe without reins! Why don't they at least run in the same direction?? 

Must have for me ;)


----------



## smokey

Foogirl said:


> KittyVentura said:
> 
> 
> I've been at a play park and seen a toddler on the swings... With one parent pushing and the other holding the strap from the little life backpack. That made no sense. The same parents held it when the kid went on EVERYTHING. I get hovering, I really do. But surely holding a rein tight while your toddler goes down a pretty small slide is creating more risk than what it could possibly prevent?
> 
> Until you know why those parents are doing those things, it's not really right to judge. There could be any number of reasons why. We used what would look like ordinary reins when Abby was younger to basically keep her straight. Her low muscle tone meant on that "pretty small slide" she would fall backwards and thump her head off the slide. Using a harness we could keep her upright, the same was true when she went on EVERYTHING. (and on our visits to any child's attraction....) To all other parents I'm sure we looked like we were stopping our poor child from running free. These same parents would have thought (and indeed often commented) we were so cruel for having her in the buggy at 3 years old.
> 
> Maybe we should just have just kept her home and not subjected her to such cruel behaviour:dohh:Click to expand...

I have a similer experience, being born with spina bifida I spent the first 5 years in a specialy adapted disability pushchair but I was stuburn.
I was able to walk but not far and had very weak ankles but was so independent that I refused to stay in the pushchair so my mum had these thick brown leather reins (I can actually still remember wearing them) so as to help me walk and she could take some of the weight of my legs and stop me falling so much.
I really believe if it wasn't for that it would have taken me a lot longer to build up the muscles in my legs and spine to be able to walk normaly because I would have spent most of my time in the buggy.


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## Emma&Freya

I bought reins for Freya for when I went on holiday and I only used them in the airport abroad!


To me, I felt like they were pointless as Freya was good!

I dont see them as cruel, our Freya is pretty good without them so I choose not to use them


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## bubbles123

Yes I used them with my son when he was younger as he was a runner - no sense of fear at all. Now at 3.5 I rarely use them as I have taught him to hold my hand and wait at roads. I still use them in very crowded places though (like city centres) as he can get distracted and run off still and I have the baby too so he doesn't always have my full attention. I couldn't give two hoots what people think! Having.said that I've only had positive comments. One old lady stopped me and said I was the only sensible mother she had seen that day.


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## m4nc3r

I don't use them because Zane genuinely behaved worse when I put them on him than he did normally.
That being said, I think it is important to try anything that may benefit your child's safety!! Only you know your child well enough to make that decision!

Zane was about 14-15 months when I started letting him walk out and about in the town, I bought a wrist strap for the day when I decided to do it, and used this for a couple days while I ordered a set of reins off ebay.
The wrist strap was a complete success, I taught him from *Day One* that he is to hold my hands at all times and used the wrist strap only as a way to let him explore those couple of extra feet away when something was particularly interesting to him (like stones, flowers etc).
The reins, for us, were a *nightmare!* He liked putting them on just fine, but it took him all of 2 days to realize reins meant he could run forward a few steps and before I could loosen the slack again the reins would pull him back down and it was a "great game". He would just pull and pull on them testing us all the way refusing to hold hands etc. Yet take them off him and he would cling to my hands like we were glued.

To be honest, Zane has always been a good, calm boy really, and combined with teaching him "Wait" as his first outside command I NEVER had a problem with him running off or showing any interest in being more than 2 feet away from me. Now he's 2.5 he will run up the street about 10-15 feet maybe before turning round and telling me to hurry up lol but when we start approaching the area of town where there are several crossings in a row, he always comes right back to me and tells me to wait for the green man =P

For my family, reins haven't proven to be worth it, I will probably use a wrist strap for the first few months of walking with number 2, But if he is as calm as Zane always was then I'm hoping it won't have to be for to long. If he is an active child then I will keep an open mind to reins etc =)


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## XJessicaX

Tried them, lost them and havent replaced them. A stern "NO running off young lady" usually does the trick.


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## pippi_89

Nope not cruel at all :nope:

Obviously, like anything they can be cruel if misused but for a child's safety it's just good sense! We used them with dd on holiday about 18 months ago. We got some looks but she wanted to explore and her wandering off to explore the middle of a road is not a good plan imo! :dohh:


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## Teeny

if u have a runner (like me) a few nasty looks or comments is nothing compAred to knowing ur keeping ur child within a safe radius of u!


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## JASMAK

I dont think they 'cruel', but they aren't really used here and are somewhat 'frowned upon'. Does it really matter what others think?


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## Dream.dream

I don't think they are cruel however I don't agree with them. It's another thing in my opinion that alot of people use instead properly teaching children to behave or watching them properly . Your child can be taught really early to stay with you out in public , and if you keep any eye on them there shouldn't be on a leash like a dog


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## Teeny

Dream.dream said:


> I don't think they are cruel however I don't agree with them. It's another thing in my opinion that alot of people use instead properly teaching children to behave or watching them properly . Your child can be taught really early to stay with you out in public , and if you keep any eye on them there shouldn't be on a leash like a dog

my daughter learnt to walk and then run very quickly at ten months. I know that consistent boundaries and guidance is the first option and imwork very hard with my dd on these things, but not all children are the same, so sometimes it is a very needed addition in certain situations to keep them safe. using the phase 'leash like a dog' is very judgmental. we are in the pre school phase of this forum. if we have learnt anything from using bandb for our knowledge its that all children are NOT the same, so varied parenting styles are needed for different children. 

mothers who use reins are not 'leasing' their children like dogs. it's a horrible thing to say.


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## JASMAK

Dream.dream said:


> I don't think they are cruel however I don't agree with them. It's another thing in my opinion that alot of people use instead properly teaching children to behave or watching them properly . Your child can be taught really early to stay with you out in public , and if you keep any eye on them there shouldn't be on a leash like a dog

A fellow Canadian....and I would sum up that this is how our country, give or take, feels about them. Every country is different. I am not trying to offend, just stating the differences. That is why I said they are rather 'frowned upon' here. My LO ran at nine months, so I understand keeping kids safe and the struggles with that.


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## fannyadams

Dream.dream said:


> I don't think they are cruel however I don't agree with them. It's another thing in my opinion that alot of people use instead properly teaching children to behave or watching them properly . Your child can be taught really early to stay with you out in public , and if you keep any eye on them there shouldn't be on a leash like a dog

Nice! I would rather my toddler be on a leash like a dog than under a car if she escapes my grip for 2 seconds. She likes the freedom of trotting along beside me and I like the safety of her not being able to dart into the road if a cat catches her eye.
Maybe where you live isn't as busy as where some others do.


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## sequeena

Dream.dream said:


> I don't think they are cruel however I don't agree with them. It's another thing in my opinion that alot of people use instead properly teaching children to behave or watching them properly . Your child can be taught really early to stay with you out in public , and if you keep any eye on them there shouldn't be on a leash like a dog

You should teach my GDD toddler then (who is mentally 10 months old), seeing as you are an expert :thumbup:


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## aliss

JASMAK said:


> Dream.dream said:
> 
> 
> I don't think they are cruel however I don't agree with them. It's another thing in my opinion that alot of people use instead properly teaching children to behave or watching them properly . Your child can be taught really early to stay with you out in public , and if you keep any eye on them there shouldn't be on a leash like a dog
> 
> A fellow Canadian....and I would sum up that this is how our country, give or take, feels about them. Every country is different. I am not trying to offend, just stating the differences. That is why I said they are rather 'frowned upon' here. My LO ran at nine months, so I understand keeping kids safe and the struggles with that.Click to expand...

Agreed, you would not see these used in Canada. But most of us use cars anyways, we don't necessarily have the same street planning or logistics of girls in Europe. 

That being said, my 3 year old is still a pain in the ass to walk and it's not about teaching, it's about him being unable to focus properly. I don't use reins (it's just not done here, ever) but that doesn't mean all kids still walk fine either.

I also think it's very easy to say when you've only gone one little one to wrangle in!


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## Gingerspice

I used reins. Its a safety back up. Its like people on roofs waering a fall ahrness. They know how to work on a roof and are taught how to work safety but accidents do happen. At that point the harness will stop them being seriously injured. 

Same as the reins. Its a back up if LO does slip out of holding my hand, doesn;t follow my instructions and runs away. I know she can then only get so far and not result in being squished by a car. 

TBH I don't know why people don't use them. Its a hazard elimination process. By using them you eliminate the chance that the one time they do eacape your grasp, ignore their teaching and run off, will not result in harm.


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## tommyg

DS had his reins on yesterday cuddly toy in each hand. What would have been cruelest putting reins on him or insisting one of his companions were left in the car? 
Happy toddler = happy mummy.


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## Lellow

Weve used reins a handful of times...I have a kid who legs it at any opportunity so i would rather he was safe than endangering himself.


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## sequeena

In the grand scheme of things using reins/not using reins is irrelevant
Who honestly cares. They help some parents and are useless to others. I've just been told on my son's birthday of all days that he needs another op. I wish I could say no but we risk him losing the use of hos thumb completely if he doesn't have it. Sucks but we do what we have to do for our children.


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## LaughOutLoud

All children are different. Agreed, if you have a easy going laid back child who listens to everything you say, you might not need reins. However, most toddlers push healthy boundaries and you have to do what you feel is safe for your child, be that reins or not - really depends on the childs temperament and what it will take to keep them safe.


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## fluffpuffin

Those in other countries I think maybe have wider pavements? I know in Germany they don't use reins really and I know from experience the pavements tend to be wider. In this country pavements can be really narrow with cars parked on them as well etc which can make it a real hazard for toddlers running into the road especially when they're still learning. I think that might have something to do with them being used more in the UK.


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## highhopes19

I love being cruel I use them quite often when out and about :thumbup:....

I think tomorrow though when walking down the main road I may not use them and be kind and risk her getting hit by a car:dohh:... 

Who ever thinks toddlers listen to them 100% of the time needs a reality check


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## suzib76

sequeena said:


> In the grand scheme of things using reins/not using reins is irrelevant
> Who honestly cares. They help some parents and are useless to others. I've just been told on my son's birthday of all days that he needs another op. I wish I could say no but we risk him losing the use of hos thumb completely if he doesn't have it. Sucks but we do what we have to do for our children.

I'm really sorry to hear that but tbh this thread is ABOUT reins, so it's quite unfair to post and say that using reins or not using them isn't relevant because you have had bad news today :nope:


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## sequeena

suzib76 said:


> sequeena said:
> 
> 
> In the grand scheme of things using reins/not using reins is irrelevant
> Who honestly cares. They help some parents and are useless to others. I've just been told on my son's birthday of all days that he needs another op. I wish I could say no but we risk him losing the use of hos thumb completely if he doesn't have it. Sucks but we do what we have to do for our children.
> 
> I'm really sorry to hear that but tbh this thread is ABOUT reins, so it's quite unfair to post and say that using reins or not using them isn't relevant because you have had bad news today :nope:Click to expand...

I just think it's a bit daft to get so wound up over them. I did earlier when a pp said we should be able to teach them early on and not ise reins as they look like dogs but now I really don't care. I'm all for reins I think they're a fabulous safety device. I also think that if you don't want or need them that's fine too :thumbup: there's no need to compare kids wearing them to dogs though or assume that parents who use them aren't watching thwir kids

Anyway hope I didn't offend. I just gained some perspective in the last few hours x


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## tommyg

Are the people who are anti reins also anti stair gates, " I'll teach my kid to climb the stairs" it just seems odd people are so wound up about what is a safety aid.


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## ILoveShoes

My DH would not fit a stair gate at the bottom of the stairs, as he wanted LO to "be confident on the stairs."
We had one at the top though.
I really wanted one at the bottom but, to be honest, LO is really good on the stairs and has never fallen (touch wood!).
We got rid of The gate at the top a good few months ago too.
We've also never used reins, but are not against them.
xx


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## aliss

Heh, my MIL is against stair gates. She said my OH only 'fell down a flight once" and learned his lesson. BRB, pushing my baby down stairs or into traffic to learn :rofl:


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## xprincessx

my son has (suspected) autism and tries to run across roads in front of cars because they go "brrm" so if any cheeky cow wants to come up to me and say to my face that reins are cruel I will not be held responsible for my actions..

Callum WILL run in front of a car, he will NEVER understand road safety and I will probably be using reins until he is about 6/8 years old because I would rather do that than have him get killed, he adores all kinds of vehicles and always wants to "have a look" so for that very reason I would politely tell the person judging me to f*ck off!

My thoughts are you never know the reason behind why a parent is doing something the way they are and until you have walked a mile in their shoes, don't judge them. simple as that.


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## jjbump

LaughOutLoud said:


> All children are different. Agreed, if you have a easy going laid back child who listens to everything you say, you might not need reins. However, most toddlers push healthy boundaries and you have to do what you feel is safe for your child, be that reins or not - really depends on the childs temperament and what it will take to keep them safe.

I think you've hit the nail on the head. Each child is different and I don't think it has anything to do with how they're taught. My LO 'understands' when I am telling her not to run into the road, but young children's minds are easily distracted and she'll see a butterfly or cat and suddenly forget where she is and what she's been told. That's toddlers for you. I suspect many of the parents whose children don't do this put it down to how they've taught their children, but it really boils down to how the individual child perceives the world. My LO's cousin (same age, but a week) is never interested in what's around him and will gladly hold your hand and go wherever you want to go without any fuss. His parents have NEVER taught him about road safety.

I also agree that is depends on pavement size. In the UK, the pavements are very narrow, especially where I live. It would take just a second for my LO to reach the road if she let go of my hand.


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## emyandpotato

Today I tied a balloon around my LO's waist and let him run free, deciding that if I lost him I'd just look for the balloon, as if he was my tent at a festival. How's THAT for lazy parenting? :haha:



In all seriousness he was always within grabbing distance, but it did make hand holding quite unnecessary at times. As for reins, I have no problem with them at all, but luckily my LO is pretty good at listening and holding my hand so we rarely use them (unfortunately, cos he has those gorgeous Little Life dino ones).


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## sequeena

xprincessx said:


> my son has (suspected) autism and tries to run across roads in front of cars because they go "brrm" so if any cheeky cow wants to come up to me and say to my face that reins are cruel I will not be held responsible for my actions..
> 
> Callum WILL run in front of a car, he will NEVER understand road safety and I will probably be using reins until he is about 6/8 years old because I would rather do that than have him get killed, he adores all kinds of vehicles and always wants to "have a look" so for that very reason I would politely tell the person judging me to f*ck off!
> 
> My thoughts are you never know the reason behind why a parent is doing something the way they are and until you have walked a mile in their shoes, don't judge them. simple as that.

T has suspected autism too I completely understand the lack of self preservation (which a lot of toddlers have anyway as they don't really get the dangers in this world) and it can be so scary. In Thomas' case he's extremely over friendly. He will run up to anyone and ask to be picked up. He will happily walk off with anyone and it's terrifying. It's the same with traffic too. He ADORES buses. He would step out in front of it if he could so he can touch it.


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## XJessicaX

Genius idea!!

I am quite tempted to attach DD1 to a very long rope and attach it to a stake in the ground so she has freedom to run, but only able to pivot in a circle!


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## sequeena

XJessicaX said:


> Genius idea!!
> 
> I am quite tempted to attach DD1 to a very long rope and attach it to a stake in the ground so she has freedom to run, but only able to pivot in a circle!

Give her the lawnmower and she can earn her keep too :D


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## XJessicaX

sequeena said:


> XJessicaX said:
> 
> 
> Genius idea!!
> 
> I am quite tempted to attach DD1 to a very long rope and attach it to a stake in the ground so she has freedom to run, but only able to pivot in a circle!
> 
> Give her the lawnmower and she can earn her keep too :DClick to expand...

Interesting fact about myself ( ;) )....I have never mowed my garden due to owning 5+ at any one time free range guinea pigs over the years!


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## sequeena

XJessicaX said:


> sequeena said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> XJessicaX said:
> 
> 
> Genius idea!!
> 
> I am quite tempted to attach DD1 to a very long rope and attach it to a stake in the ground so she has freedom to run, but only able to pivot in a circle!
> 
> Give her the lawnmower and she can earn her keep too :DClick to expand...
> 
> Interesting fact about myself ( ;) )....I have never mowed my garden due to owning 5+ at any one time free range guinea pigs over the years!Click to expand...

:haha: I have also never mowed a garden because who really has time for that :rofl: plus we don't have grass in our new home ;) it's either patio, fancy pebble stones or bark :thumbup:


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## Foogirl

I've never mowed a lawn either. That's an outside job and therefore my husband's responsibility. Under no circumstances should this be seen as the reason I married him....nope....honest... :haha:


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## Foogirl

tommyg said:


> Are the people who are anti reins also anti stair gates, " I'll teach my kid to climb the stairs" it just seems odd people are so wound up about what is a safety aid.

Yep, people can have some strange views. I'm actually someone who would have reins but not a stairgate, or any other baby proofing stuff.

However, my stance on that has yet to be properly tested as our LO was two and a half before she moved and has only just mastered the stairs. By that age she was old enough to be told not to do the stuff and it was all good. I'm sure I'll be propping up the baby proofing industry if we ever get to experience a baby moving at the age that babies should do:haha:


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## tommyg

I don't mow lawns either however Hubby is now interested in the Gunie pig idea


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## Foogirl

Mine is after one of those automatic ones that cut the grass when you are out. He also wants the equivalent hoover. I've told him he can have one when they can climb stairs!


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## tommyg

I'm just not convinced how good a job the automatic ones would do.


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## Foogirl

In Mr Foo's world where anything shiny or with the word "turbo" attached to it must be bought, how well they actually do a job is pretty much at the bottom of the list!


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## tommyg

Well there has to be somebody who wants to buy all these gadgets. That said the price tag put me off when I had my flat, they are a big expensive to buy if they are hopeless at doing the job.

Can I just say we have completely de-railed this thread...
Must be the biggest derailment ever


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## VieraSky

We have one of those leashes that looks like a monkey backpack and you hold onto the tail. I don't think they are cruel at all. My child has a tendency to run off. People may think it's cruel of me, but at least I'm taking my child home with me.


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## JASMAK

aliss said:


> JASMAK said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dream.dream said:
> 
> 
> I don't think they are cruel however I don't agree with them. It's another thing in my opinion that alot of people use instead properly teaching children to behave or watching them properly . Your child can be taught really early to stay with you out in public , and if you keep any eye on them there shouldn't be on a leash like a dog
> 
> A fellow Canadian....and I would sum up that this is how our country, give or take, feels about them. Every country is different. I am not trying to offend, just stating the differences. That is why I said they are rather 'frowned upon' here. My LO ran at nine months, so I understand keeping kids safe and the struggles with that.Click to expand...
> 
> Agreed, you would not see these used in Canada. But most of us use cars anyways, we don't necessarily have the same street planning or logistics of girls in Europe.
> 
> That being said, my 3 year old is still a pain in the ass to walk and it's not about teaching, it's about him being unable to focus properly. I don't use reins (it's just not done here, ever) but that doesn't mean all kids still walk fine either.
> 
> I also think it's very easy to say when you've only gone one little one to wrangle in!Click to expand...


Yes, its just not done here. My daughter has asd, and still, at age 8, runs off, but they just arent used here. I have seen the odd one, and I am not all judgey about it. I probably did a double look to see. I think Aliss is right, its different here too...with streets and most people use cars ect.


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## meli1981

I live in canada and i would use them, not cruel in the least. Altho i agree, dont see them used here very often.


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## Starry Night

Another Canadian here. I would totally use reins and am meaning to get some. Just haven't gotten around to it yet. Carters/Osh Kosh stores sell the little backpacks that look like a monkey or you can get one that looks like an elephant. They're really cute! 

Yesterday was the first time we had our son in the city out of his stroller and were chasing him NON-STOP. The moment we loosened our grip a little he was gone. And he's fast! It was a long car ride so that's why we let him out of the stroller for a bit. But we eventually just put him back in.

I haven't seen others use reins either but my mom used them on me as a child because I took off all the time. I wasn't trying to be bad. I was 'independent' and just got it into my head I wanted to go somewhere and I would go. It seems my son is that way too. My son had to wear one of those helmets for plagiocephely so I am accustomed to strange looks for using strange gear. LOL I wouldn't feel judged.


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## tommyg

Foogirl said:


> tommyg said:
> 
> 
> Are the people who are anti reins also anti stair gates, " I'll teach my kid to climb the stairs" it just seems odd people are so wound up about what is a safety aid.
> 
> Yep, people can have some strange views. I'm actually someone who would have reins but not a stairgate, or any other baby proofing stuff.
> 
> However, my stance on that has yet to be properly tested as our LO was two and a half before she moved and has only just mastered the stairs. By that age she was old enough to be told not to do the stuff and it was all good. I'm sure I'll be propping up the baby proofing industry if we ever get to experience a baby moving at the age that babies should do:haha:Click to expand...

I checked back to see where this thread was its kind of back on the rails.

But I thought I should mention stair gates are my only baby proofing. We had socket covers but questioned why we needed them on the basis UK sockets have safety features built in. Then we came across a website slateing them stating as they aren't made to the same spec as plugs they can be inserted upside down therefore opening the built in covers over the live and neutral. Actually undoing one of the safety features, allowing another object to be pushed in. apparently it's very difficult to find something the right shape to fit the earth to open them but socket covers are designed to fit. The man also shows a 3 month olds fingers are already to big to fit in any of the holes.


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## Foogirl

Yeah socket covers are one of my pet hates. I can't believe people pay for a piece of equipment to make their sockets less safe!


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## tommyg

But again it's scary that people are dubbed into beliving they are a required bit of equipment. As I said we questioned them HD is a electrician by trade but we still bought them, and came across the website - linked to on there - confirming what we thought and worse so went round the house and binned them.


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## Natsku

fluffpuffin said:


> Those in other countries I think maybe have wider pavements? I know in Germany they don't use reins really and I know from experience the pavements tend to be wider. In this country pavements can be really narrow with cars parked on them as well etc which can make it a real hazard for toddlers running into the road especially when they're still learning. I think that might have something to do with them being used more in the UK.

Thats a good point. People don't use reins here and pavements tend to be really wide and often the busy roads have a stretch of grass or bushes between the pavement and the road so you have a better chance of grabbing back hold of an escaping toddler before they reach the road. Then again in the older parts of towns they don't have pavements at all, but also not so many cars drive down those roads.


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## marymoomin

I didn't use then with dd but I will be using them with my twins .


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## babydevil1989

We have a littlelife backpack - we used it a lot when he was younger and would use it now if we were somewhere really busy - why would something keeping a child safe be cruel?! I had reins when I was younger and I think im fairly normal lol x


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## Dragonfly

tommyg said:


> Are the people who are anti reins also anti stair gates, " I'll teach my kid to climb the stairs" it just seems odd people are so wound up about what is a safety aid.

I seen a row on facebook about these the other day, the amount that where calling them dog leashes I thought was disrespectful. As if parents where treating kids like dogs. I have never used one but I know Williams granny had one for when she took him to the shopping center as she isnt the fittest for chasing children and I rather she did than him run off. They are a safety harness, no different from strapping a child in to a stroller or a carrier., All have their uses I do not get the anger about this one product. :shrug:


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## tommyg

Dragonfly said:


> tommyg said:
> 
> 
> Are the people who are anti reins also anti stair gates, " I'll teach my kid to climb the stairs" it just seems odd people are so wound up about what is a safety aid.
> 
> I seen a row on facebook about these the other day, the amount that where calling them dog leashes I thought was disrespectful. As if parents where treating kids like dogs. I have never used one but I know Williams granny had one for when she took him to the shopping center as she isnt the fittest for chasing children and I rather she did than him run off. They are a safety harness, no different from strapping a child in to a stroller or a carrier., All have their uses I do not get the anger about this one product. :shrug:Click to expand...

Exactly I can't understand why people are wound up about other people's use of a safety aid.


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## Dragonfly

It was assumed those who use are abusing them and treating kids like dogs. Rather insulting to any one. I see many uses for them even if I dont use them. Certainly not one being the use for a kid as a dog.


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## tommyg

I an way people are treating their kids like dogs, both are stupid enough to run into the road and daft enough to get lost. People keep them on reins or leads to keep them safe - is that a bad thing?


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## beanzz

I really don't get how they can be seen as cruel. These people who think it is cruel, what would they rather, let the child run into the road?! Don't think so. 

It's not as if you see people dragging their children along by these, they are so children have the freedom to walk but are safe from running into danger.


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## katy1310

My granny once made a comment about them being cruel, but I don't see any problem with them at all. They give them a bit more freedom than holding your hand all the time but keep them safe at the same time. We had them for a while but Sophie quite happily holds my hand now. Safety is the most important thing, in my opinion x


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## meli1981

Theyre not cruel, unless youre tying them up to a parking meter :haha:


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## mayb_baby

Or outside the shop :haha:


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## tommyg

Now that would be a bit cruel to tie them up in the street with no where soft to sit. At least the earlier suggestion of tieing them to a stake in the garden they had somewhere soft to sit and play.


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## NellyLou

I haven't read the whole thread, but have to admit that before I had a child I thought they were cruel too! Now I have a very busy 18 month old who hates to be confined to a stroller, but tries to run away and does all she can to get her hand free from mine. She's too fast and thinks it's a game to run away, so I now see that people use them to keep their children safe! We have one and have used it a few times. My child's safety matters a lot more than what someone else thinks :)


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