# Support thread for ladies who have had 3+ failed IVF cycles



## africaqueen

Hi ladies.

I thought i would start a support thread for those of us who have had multiple cycles of IVF and still don't have our rainbow.
I do post on a lot of threads on here and have done for 4yrs but i do now feel that although other IVF ladies know the process etc of what we go through, they can't relate to the emotional aspect of multiple fails.
For this reason i thought we could all support eachother on here? i know there's a lot of 'old timers' on these threads as well as myself.

For those that don't know my story, i am 32yrs old, dh is 33. I lost both my fallopian tubes in 2010 due to ectopic pregnancies within 6mths of eachother so obviously IVF was the only step to us having a biological child of our own. We have had 3 failed cycles. 2 cycles were NHS and the 3rd self funded. We are going to start saving again after xmas to try one last cycle with my own eggs and if that fails, go abroad for DE as we cannot carry on like this.
I have DOR and very poor quality eggs. Dh's swimmers are fine and my womb is fine as i had a lap in January. So other than having no tubes my eggs are not great. Long road ahead of us but DETERMINED to get our rainbow one day no matter how that comes about:cloud9:

xxx


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## Unlucky41

africaqueen,

so glad you started this thread. I am 33 and just had our 4th failed ivf cycle. Yesterday I was suppose to have an embryo transfer at day 2 however it arrested. The doctor called me and I wailed like a baby!!!:cry: This cycle was pretty baby 3 eggs retrieved only one fertilised and it arrested on day 2.

Like you our main reason for failure is quality of eggs. I have endo stage 3 which was only found out from our new RE and DOR. What is so painful is with losing weight and the laparoscopy there was no improvement in my egg quality. My RE said we should try one more time and then consider donor egg. Here in Australia it is so difficult to get I rather still try until we succeed.

When are you considering doing your next cycle? What protocol have you been using?

:hugs:


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## africaqueen

Unlucky- I am so sorry to hear you have been through hell too :(
With our 1st cycle i was on the long protocol with 3 amps of stimms and we got 2 eggs with 1 embie which was transferred on day 2. With our 2nd cycle i was on the short protocol with 6 amps and we got 6 eggs with only 1 embie of low quality that was a late developer and again a 2 day transfer. Our last cycle was short protocol with max dose of stimms (8 amps) and i had a lap and endo scratch prior to it and 7 eggs were collected with only 1 embie again and we used ICSI... Our consultant said it is egg quality that is the issue as we only ever get 1 embie and never great quality. 
We will try one more cycle once we have the funds and then if that fails we will go abroad for DE as i cannot take more than 4 fails. Its soul destroying isnt it? 

I took high dose vitamin E, L-arginine and DHEA last cycle too as all supposed to improve egg quality but made no difference xxx


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## Unlucky41

africaqueen,

I am sorry to hear this. Yes it is heartbreaking, soul destroying event. You put so much hope into all of this and the news just get worse and worse. 3 years ago when we first starting trying we got pregnant within 3 months unfortunately I miscarriage at 8 weeks. Ever since that it was all downhill. 

First ivf cycle short protocol 4 eggs only no matured ones BFN
2nd ivf long protocol 5 eggs 2 matured only one fertilised BFN
3rd ivf long protocol + saizen 7 eggs 5 matured two fertilised BFN - Best cycle though
4th Ivf zoladex to suppress the endo 3 eggs 1 fertilised but arrested on day 2 :dohh: I found out yesterday so once again bruised and depress !!! See the doctor on Monday. You should ask about Saizen it has worked for others just not me.

Do you know what protocol your RE wants you to do next?


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## africaqueen

Yes it is soul destroying for sure.
I have never heard of that drugs, what is it supposed to do?
We will be changing clinics for our next cycle so yet to save enough cash to see some new clinics etc. It costs a fortune here. What about you? xxx


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## bugs

Hi AQ my old friend also Hi Unlucky, well my brief history is in my siggy. Haven't got the energy to type up now but promise I will. AQ I know you know it already xx

Well after worst cycle to date I had my follow up to day and aswell as having no tubes and a multitude of immune issues I now also have shitty eggs that have decided after 6 cycles they no longer want to fertilise. I'm not 100% convinced that the high dose of menopur didn't totally fry them but the consultant doesn't agree. So we are looking at cycle #8 abroad and are going to let them decide if it's worth one more try with my eggs or do we jump ship to donor eggs. That's me briefly and It's lovely if not heartbreaking to have others in the same position to chat too xxxx


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## bugs

Oh and my names Clare I hate my daft name I picked xx


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## africaqueen

Hi Clare.
Soooo hope you get some good news abroad when you go over. Any ideas what clinic you will be using yet? we are going to try one more cycle with my own eggs and if that fails we will defo be going abroad for DE as cannot take anymore. You have been so strong to get going this far and i KNOW no matter how we manage it, we will be pregnant and give birth to our rainbows ;)

Hi Unlucky x

My name is Sarah btw xxx


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## bugs

AQ would you not consider going abroad yourself for your next cycle it's so much cheaper. We're looking at Serum in Athens, I'm having a few tests done with them in Sept and they do the consult over the phone so we'll see if they recommend donor eggs first or have 1 more go with my own. We're hoping to go in November. 

Part of me wants to just jump straight to donor eggs coz at least then we're pretty much guaranteed some good embryo's but then part of me isn't ready to give up on my own eggs yet. It's a difficult decision to make xxx


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## africaqueen

Bugs- Yeah we would consider going abroad for treatment but something in the pipeline in this country if all works out... if not we will have to go abroad for our next cycle as cannot afford it here. How often would you have to go to Greece? iv heard good things about Serum. Il be honest if our 4th cycle doesnt work il be more than ready to go for DE. I think 4 goes will give me the peace of mind that it would never work with my own eggs and id be ready to move on if it comes to that kwim? I would be carrying and giving birth to our baby so it would be just as much my baby in my mind and my friend had a DE baby and adores him and said he makes her life complete after 4 fails xxx


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## bugs

Oooohhhh I'm intrigued, yeah I feel the same coz I do get a good number of eggs and I've had decent embryo's in the past I'm struggling to give up but after the next go I'll take 20 year old eggs no problem xxxx


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## Unlucky41

Hi Clare and Sarah,

I am Joanne. Saizen is a growth hormone that apparently improves egg quality. It is quite expensive so RE don't normally give this out but I suggest do ask your RE. They have been stories that 40 + ladies have success with their own eggs using this !! 

About Donor eggs here in Australia we don't have such luxury really you have to really know someone that is willing which is soooo hard. Young and willing ??

So we have decided for now that we will continue to try ! Going to see my RE this coming Monday so hopefully get some answer to how to further improve the eggs.

Sarah what is a blighted pregnancy ? 


Also what supplements you guys using?
:hugs:


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## dovkav123

Hello Ladies,
I am reading this thread and I am so sorry for so many heartaches you have experienced...
I am doing my first spontanious IVF treatment this month. I'll not take any drugs. I'll be happy to share my story with you. https://babyandbump.momtastic.com/assisted-conception/1934573-first-natural-ivf-cycle-august.html
I found very encouraging study about natural IVF cycle treatment, please read it
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2582079/

What are the prices of IVF in Greece?
3900 euros for stimulated and 425 euros for spontanious IVF cycle in Germany.

Thank you and baby dust!


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## bugs

dovkav123 said:


> Hello Ladies,
> I am reading this thread and I am so sorry for so many heartaches you have experienced...
> I am doing my first spontanious IVF treatment this month. I'll not take any drugs. I'll be happy to share my story with you. https://babyandbump.momtastic.com/assisted-conception/1934573-first-natural-ivf-cycle-august.html
> I found very encouraging study about natural IVF cycle treatment, please read it
> https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2582079/
> 
> What are the prices of IVF in Greece?
> 3900 euros for stimulated and 425 euros for spontanious IVF cycle in Germany.
> 
> Thank you and baby dust!

Hi Dokav

It's 3000 for 1 cycle or 4000 for 2 but you do not get a refund if it works first time. This does not include meds but still a lot cheaper than the Uk. Also the embryologist decides on the day if they will use ICSI and there is no extra charge. 

Good luck with your journey xxx


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## bugs

Unlucky41 said:


> Hi Clare and Sarah,
> 
> I am Joanne. Saizen is a growth hormone that apparently improves egg quality. It is quite expensive so RE don't normally give this out but I suggest do ask your RE. They have been stories that 40 + ladies have success with their own eggs using this !!
> 
> About Donor eggs here in Australia we don't have such luxury really you have to really know someone that is willing which is soooo hard. Young and willing ??
> 
> So we have decided for now that we will continue to try ! Going to see my RE this coming Monday so hopefully get some answer to how to further improve the eggs.
> 
> Sarah what is a blighted pregnancy ?
> 
> 
> Also what supplements you guys using?
> :hugs:

Hi Joanne a blighted ovum is when the pregnancy starts to implant and a gestational sac is formed but the pregnancy does not progress but it takes a while for your body to realise it. I had mine diagnosed at 6 weeks but did not miscarry I had to have surgery at 9 weeks to have it removed. Very similar to a miscarriage except that a miscarriage will spontaneously happen and is normally over in a few days. 

Good luck with your appointment, hope you get a good plan of action xxx


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## africaqueen

Joanne- Wow i will be mentioning that drug for our next cycle! can't hurt so why not. We tried DHEA leading up to our last cycle as that has been known to improve egg quality but sadly did not. Anything is worth a try though. That's strange there are so few egg donors in Oz! I would go abroad for that anyway if that's the route we have to take x

Dovkav- Thanks for sharing and wow what a difference in price in natural IVF! I have heard its good for women with low amh so will follow your story :) let us know how u get on in here too and good luck x

Clare- Just thinking after our chat before that we will have to get cvaeh on this thread to help her through this 2ww x


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## bugs

Yeah definitely her 2ww is nearly up xxx


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## africaqueen

Aww i hope to god she gets her miracle! is this her 5th or 6th cycle? xxx


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## bugs

I think looking at her siggy it's number 6. 

I've got to pull my finger out and fill in the forms for the new clinic they want to know everything about my previous cycles so that's gonna take some doing at least I've got the bank holiday weekend to do it xxx


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## africaqueen

Ah well lets hope an pray that she gets her miracle this time around. We need some good news amongst us! 

Good luck for filling in your forms and hope all goes smoothly. This whole quest to motherhood is a long nightmare we thought we would never have to go through but one day we will all have our family somehow and every heartache and tear would of been worth it xxx


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## dovkav123

hello ladies,
I just failed my natural IVF cycle treatment because dr. couldn't fine an egg. She told me it happens sometimes, that the follicle is empty. But I read some info there is no such thing...
Have you ever experienced that?


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## bugs

Sorry to hear that dovkav, in standard ivf it is pretty normal to have empty follicles when it comes to collection but due to the level of stimms you produce a number of eggs so that you end up with at least a couple to use. So sorry to hear this. 

I was considering natural ivf but I think the success rates are pretty low so I'd rather move to donor eggs xxxx


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## africaqueen

Dovkav- I am so sorry they couldnt find a egg and yes as Bugs said, sadly it can happen were a follicle grows with no egg inside. What is your next plan of action? x

Bugs- Are you thinking DE for next cycle or one more crack (no pun intended, lol) with your own eggs? we are going to do one more cycle with my eggs and god forbid if that fails we will defo be doing a DE cycle as can't waste my life feeling empty and living for tiny chances when know it will increase chances ten fold. Hard decision though as always wanted a part of me and my parents genes etc involved in me an dh's baby and obvs it would only be his genes but i adore him and i would carrying the baby so i am sure i would love it just the same x


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## bugs

I'm going to see what the new clinic think first if they think it's worth a shot with my own then we'll do that first but I think we're gonna pay for 2 cycles up front so at least we know we can move onto donor eggs if our own doesn't happen. 

I feel the same I'm over it now and just want it to work don't really care who's bits get us there !!!


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## africaqueen

Ditto Clare! we have been though too much with this journey and however we get our rainbow babies we will get there! i also am quite spiritual and believe its more the soul that matters so no matter who's genes get us there, our baby's soul will be unique anyway xxx


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## Unlucky41

africaqueen said:


> Ditto Clare! we have been though too much with this journey and however we get our rainbow babies we will get there! i also am quite spiritual and believe its more the soul that matters so no matter who's genes get us there, our baby's soul will be unique anyway xxx

Yep totally with you guys all the way. The more I think about it DE is the way to go if this cycle doesn't work. Hopefully we three get our BFP this time round!!

Empty follicles is quite common or what it is eggs that won't come out. They just say it is bad quality eggs. How disappointing. I had that problem this time round as well. Only had two big follicles and only one had an egg :cry:

My final cycle with my own eggs will be in October estimated ER will be 8th October - please pray for me!!


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## bugs

Everything crossed for you unlucky, we're hoping our next cycle will be November as I think my new clinic likes to do a hystereoscopy first. Going to spend today typing up my previous cycles to send to the new clinic how depressing but exciting at the same time xxx


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## africaqueen

Unlucky and Bugs- EVERYTHING crossed for you both for your cycles later this year and i pray you do get to have your biological babies and that i do when we come to cycle again next year but if it doesnt happen we have HUGE chance of success at last with DE and i am sure we will adore our babies regardless and always be thankful to the donor xxx


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## cvaeh

Hi

Thanks for inviting me to join this thread. I do love the other one but it gets hard at times as everyone seems to be pregnant on there now or have success first time round (don't get me wrong i am pleased for them but is tough when you think it should be your turn). I am sat with a glass of wine which i know doesn't solve anything, i am not even a big drinker, but does numb the pain!!!!!

I have to phone for my review tomorrow. I hope it is quick but these things never are. I feel like a complete failure and so guilty i can't do this for my husband, although he says he doesn't blame me.

I go back to school on Monday where one of the teachers is pregnant with a man she has known less than a year (not that i am jealous or anything)!

I am expecting an awful period after being on this gestone. I would always do it as it kept the bleeding away and nothing else did but i am sure it will produce a heavy period!!!

The nurse bless her said keep trying naturally. I thought as if they won't even fertilize and divide with chemical activation.

Glad you set this thread up. Africa will know i am Heather from facebook but for everyone else x x x x


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## africaqueen

Heather- I am sorry u had to find your way to this thread but glad you are with us and we are all here for you. Life is so bloody unfair and if a glass of wine helps numb the pain why not. We don't get much release from this nightmare do we. Its ALWAYS there. I also feel like a failure too even though we know this is not our fault, as women we feel like we have failed when we can't manage something that thousands do every day, but we are all in the same boat xxxx


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## bugs

Welcome Heather, IKWYM about the other thread. I understand that pregnancy comes with a whole new set of worries but when being pregnant is the one thing you want and dream of listening to others talk about it can be hard especially when this is the place we come to get away from it. 

Well I've just finished the referral forms for the new clinic 4 hours later. I was going through my notes and for every cycle I've got an SA for Ray a follicle count sheet whilst in stimms and an embryology form which shows how many eggs collected and how many mature and so on. Well I've got them for every cycle except the last one I only have a follicle count sheet. My notes also completely stop after egg collection it shows my egg collection was done and the next notes are when I requested a copy of my patient notes. Does anyone else think this is a little suspicious that the cycle that I had zero fertilisation there is absolutely nothing detailing what happened. I've emailed the clinic to ask for the missing information but I think it's very strange xxx


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## cvaeh

Hi
when i requested my notes for when we went Belgium i always got that a3 sheet with how many progressed etc but i always had something fertilize even if it was abnormal at care. I would phone up and ask them though as it usually has notes on about how easily the eggs injected etc. 

I am not looking forward to my follow up as i think i can tell him more than he can tell me and i don't want to be patronized x x

Well i am now sat watching American pie will a glass of wine. It is the first film me and dh watched together 10years a go. I am so lucky to have him x x x


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## bubumaci

Hello :howdy::wave: ... I think this thread is a fabulous idea!!! Thank you for starting it.
I am very active on another thread that started in Spring of last year ... where the majority of the ladies have in the meantime either had their babies / are getting pregnant ... and as you all say : I am thrilled for them ... really - no-one understands the pain of it not working better than us, who have had multiple failures.

I would love to join you on here, if that is OK?
My history is in my signature, summarised - but I will write it down for you...

As soon as we were married in October 2010, we started trying for a baby. After a few months, I started with the OPKs (DH was always sweet, wanting to know if we had a smiley face) :) ... and after a couple of months with those, I got the Clear Blue Fertility Monitor (which, incidentally, I love) ... and DH started asking "do we have an egg?" (Still asks to this day *lol*)! I also started BBT testing. And I love charting! Even in the months when I know we can't expect pregnancy, I love knowing when I am ovulating and - even better - knowing when I am getting my period!! Just love that!

Sooo... I knew that something was wrong, because our timing was right and in May 2011, I trotted off to my Gynaecologist to get checked up. Well, everything came back normal, so I begged DH to get his :spermy: tested... He wanted to keep trying and kept saying, I will go next month if it doesn't work... End of August he did finally go and then rang me, heartbroken, with the words "it's my fault". ... Broke my heart to hear that - both because of him and, well, because I started living the nightmare that I had always feared. (I know, so many families have sob stories - mine is not spectacular ... family split up. Father remarried - and one year later I was sent to live with my Mother ... Three years after that, Father and wife adopt two girls... I spend most of my youth and later years travelling back and forth between family, Christmases are not the way I believed they should be ... without one parent... I used to cry and think "some day, I will make it be for my family, for my children, the way a family should be" - and that was my candle of hope in my window - well for going on 25 years now)... I had always been terrified of infertility.

OK - so we had the diagnosis : practically no sperm and what was there was non-motile and with poor morphology. So I wanted to make an appointment with the clinic that my friend had recommended (pregnant both times first try - she said, the clinic is definitely the best in our region, if not the country / Europe) ... First appointment was October 17th (2011) - where the u/s showed that I would respond well to medication and they wanted to try to get some sperm from DH. First with a normal SA, then by giving him something to widen tubes (in case there was a "room" problem) - neither resulted in anything positive and DH was sent to a Urologist for further testing (there was talk of doing a TESE to try to retrieve sperm from the tissue) - but nothing good there. The doctors have no explanation for his - in the meantime diagnosed - Azoospermia (most ever in an SA 250 K ... with 0% motility)... The urologist wanted to try him on Tamoxifen (I was shocked when I heard that, as I associated the medicine with breast cancer patients). The reason for this is - he could find no cause for the Azoospermia - sometimes some was found, sometimes none - he had no guarantee that the part of hte testicles biopsied would provide what we needed .... so ....After 6 weeks of taking the tablets, he provided an SA - and they actually found 13 Mio sperm with 8% motility. They froze 6 straws. I cried with joy - we were onto ICSI and we had something to work with. So in June of last year, I underwent the first stimulation. 14 eggs were retrieved, 12 were mature and 11 fertilised (with fresh sperm!! Not much, but enough for ICSI). 6 were cryogenically frozen on day 1. We transferred two eggs (I think they were both morulae) on day 5 - but BFN. So in July, we did a FET, thawed three eggs ... transferred a beginning blastocyst and a morula on day 5 ... BFN. In August, thawed our last three and transferred all three (I think we had two morulae and one with many cells) on day 5 ... BFN. So next round in September ... retrieved 11 eggs, 10 were mature and 7 fertilised (the fresh sperm wasn't enough, they thawed a straw). Two were frozen right up and two were transferred on day 5 (again a beginning blast and morula) ... BFN. In October another day 5 FET ... BFN. We changed doctors within the clinic and had the new appointment on November 30th. We did a few more tests on me - which showed nothing spectacular, everything normal. But the doctor's suspicion is that we not only have male infertility, but due to my age ... decreasing quality of eggs - because the embryos develop so slowly / poorly... So I started taking additional supplements and we planned to go for it after a three month break. The plan was to stim and take all fertilised eggs to day 5 (in an embryscope) - the doctor said, we want to get pregnant, not have just transfers ...
In February of this year we started stimming (and DH took Tamoxifen again for 6 weeks in the hope that the results would be as mind blowing as in spring 2011 and maybe we could do IMSI instead of pure ICSI - unfortunately, the results weren't good and they were able to use a fresh sample, but not enough for IMSI, only ICSI) ... at retrieval, the doctors were shocked, because they retrieved 23 eggs ... they didn't want to do a fresh transfer because of OHSS-risks. So, when 18 eggs were mature and 15 fertilised, they froze 10 on day one and took 5 to day 5 in the embryoscope. On day 6 we had two blasts which they froze. One of the two looked so beautiful, that I looked at the screen and thought "that's my baby" ...
The doctor also said that there had been some very positive results when doing a transfer a month after doing an endometrial biopsy. So in March, we did the biopsy in preparation for FET in April. ... The 10 day 1 frosties didn't develop that well, so when I went in for my transfer, the doctor said that he had also had one of the blasts thawed that day, and we were transferring three. I looked at the picture and thought "but that's not the pretty one" and said so - he looked in my file and told me, that I was right...
Anyway ... none of the three implanted ... another BFN.
May was a horrific month for me. My Mother was diagnosed at the beginning of the month with lung cancer which had metastasised to the liver - and she was looking at her options (she didn't want to do traditional treatment) ... My paternal Grandmother (who had been sick / dying for a while - I had flown over a couple of weeks before to say "goodbye") died on May 10th. On the 11th, I was at a memorial service for a school buddy, who had passed at the beginning of the year. Granny was buried on May 20th - and on the 22nd, my Stepfather rang that I should come to Budapest - my Mother had max. one month to live. I drove to Budapest on the 25th and started looking after her. Helping sit her up, stand her up, feed her, wash her etc. etc. Her deterioration was so rapid, it was unfathomable. 6 days I had with her. She died early afternoon on May 31st. I was holding her hand as she lost her "death fight". So we buried Mama on June 14th and on the 15th I came home.

... we decided to go for it in the following cycle, so I had another biopsy. The protocol my doctor put me on was a new one. ER was on July 30th - they retrieved 12 eggs, 10 were mature and only 4 fertilised. I went in for transfer on the 4th (two days before my birthday) with an open mind - our eggs never developed well, I did not dare hope. Usually, I was shown the picture of my embryos before clambering up for the transfer .. this time the doctor (not mine) didn't say anything, just got down to business, so I asked how they were. Turned out, we had *two* blastocysts - one was even expanding already. ... I promptly said "are you serious" - couldn't believe it. Went back to lie down after the transfer and actually cried a little ... Mama and Granny were looking out for us!
I felt very positive after the transfer and actually felt something! And soon, my boobs were so sore, I knew something good was going on (breasts always get sore in the luteal phase, but this soreness woke me during the night and I loved it!). First blood test 6dp5dt was low HCG but positive ... I was pregnant .... only just ... they weren't sure that implantation had been successful. In the meantime, the breasts weren't hurting as much, I wasn't waking up any more ... I knew that wasn't good. This was confirmed in the second blood test at 9dp5dt - HCG was still up, but going down. A third blood test three days later confirmed - it had been a chemical pregnancy.... and I was heartbroken! Could God really be so cruel, so as to take Granny and Mama in one month ... and then not let this happen?

So - that is where we are now. We have our next doctor's appointment on September 9th. We still have that one blastocyst frozen (the day 6 one). We finally had such perfect embies... (the doctor hadn't wanted to do a fresh transfer, because three days before the ER, my Progesterone was higher than he liked - but we discussed, mentally, I really wanted to go for it - due to my losses - and we hadn't exactly had a good track record with the thawed tries) ... 

But I don't want to / can't give up yet. I believe it will work ... we were so close this time ... perhaps it was the trial run?

Oh - I am privately insured and DH is on state health insurance. Here (in Germany) the insurance of the "cause" has to cover. If I were the issue, my insurance would cover everything, all our costs. Because it is DH, they don't pay a cent and DH's insurance covers 50% of his costs (which is practically nothing) - so we are all out of pocket - so with three ICSIs and four FETs - not to mention the monitoring in between - we have paid a small fortune already.

And ... DEs are illegal here, so if we were to go down that route (I would do it - try first with DH's sperm, and if that doesn't work, we DE and donor sperm - but DH isn't too keen on that) we would have to look abroad. DH is coming round to the idea of adoption if all else fails - but there, I am getting old for a baby .... limit is pretty much 35 everywhere and I am 38 - there are exceptions, I have been told ... I don't know.

We are not giving up yet and Natural IVF sounds like a very interesting option, which I will discuss with our doctor in a couple of weeks! Thank you for the article!!

Oh - and the icing on the cake (for my emotional state) : my BIL got married in August last year. Towards the end of the year, they started trying (and even promptly went and got checked out due to our issues - he has quite a huge sperm count and everything perfect with her too). In February, we went out for dinner and she moaned to us about already being fed up with the trying and not having the nerve for it etc. etc. ... few weeks later (just a couple of days after she was out drinking and smoking) BIL rings to tell us that his wife is "a little bit pregnant". ... Irrationality here I come : completely heart-broken and starting to really resent her. Baby is due end of November. Oh and when hearing about my Mother dying from cancer - she says "I worry about my Mother getting sick too" and after our failed attempt in April "our friends ... a lesbian couple, where one has kept trying IUI - aren't being successful, so the other one is going to try now" ... I really was thinking, I don't give a crap right now. Almost could imagine the comment after hearing about our miscarriage "I was really afraid of that too". I know I am being spiteful and mean and hateful and resentful - I am so happy for all my friends, everyone on BNB too when I hear they are pregnant - my colleague, who got married last year - just told me last week that she is pregnant. I am thrilled for her (and she knows about our troubles) ... but my SIL - I don't know - just can't stand her right now.

So ... AQ ... thank you for starting this thread!! I hope it is OK if I would like to join. I really do also feel that even though there are others out there who have to do IVF / ICSI (and that is tough already in itself) - those who have success first or second try just do not get what it feels like to fail again and again and again and again and ....

:dust: to everyone on here!!

And one silly question - what is low AMH?

<3 Bubu (Andrea)


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## bugs

Well Andrea I think you more than deserve to be a part of a thread. What a shocking journey you've been through. Hope we can all pull together and help each other through. 

AMH is something they use to indicate how you'll respond to ivf drugs. If you have a low AMH they'll consider you a poor responder and some clinics in the UK won't treat you if it's below a certain level. It's only an indication and I've seen women with AMH's of 0 get pregnant so it's not something they know 100% about. 

Well after my little bit of detective work the clinic emailed me my missing notes so I guess they weren't trying to hide anything but reading the Care forum they're not doing to well results wise lately so definitely think it's time to move clinics xxx


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## africaqueen

Welcome Bubumaci and thanks for sharing your story with us. Such a awful journey for us all on here but lets hope eventually the mantra 'good things come to those who wait' pays off for us ;) Low AMH basically means low ovarian reserve so although i am only 32, i have serious egg decline and poor quality :( so time is not on my side either. I know we have option B with DE but i still hope an pray we manage to conceive with my own eggs. x

Hi to all the girls x

Cvaeh- Thinking of you lots and hope you enjoyed your wine x

AFM- I am having a shit day. Woke up feeling empty and depressed, then went the shops and dropped my new phone on the floor so now £70 to repair as i was insured which is my own stupid fault. I am feeling very emotional today and quite hopeless which i hate as most days i try to be positive but today isnt one of those days xxx


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## africaqueen

Bugs- Cross posts there. lol. Glad that the clinic were not trying to hide anything and it will soon be all systems go for you. Do you dread going again? i honestly do. I can cope with all the treatment but the 2ww nearly resulted in me losing my mind last time so if i am lucky enough to get that far again, god knows how i will cope emotionally. I may actually go away for the 2wks to spain or something xxx


----------



## bugs

I actually like the preparation part because it feels like I'm doing something and it takes my mind off what's happened in the past but ditto when it comes to the 2ww but after not getting one last time I'll be so relieved to be pupo. 

I know what you mean about bad days, my work is just full of piss takers off sick coz they're pregnant they honestly don't know how lucky they are but they just milk it and it really winds me up !!!!


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## bubumaci

Ahhh - thank you girls for the warm welcome :)
And for the explanation! Guess low AMH is not something they found with me.

I am sorry you are having such a crappy day!! There are those nasty days, when you get up on the wrong side of the bed (so to speak) and you just feel as if you blunder from one thing into the next. I hope that your evening turns out to be pleasant :flower: And more than anything, that you do get pregnant with your own eggies!!

Just wondering whether either of you have thought about TCM - acupuncture to support and perhaps improve results? I know that a lot of our American "colleagues" on here do it and have had good results. I rang a clinic today that offers it and have an appointment in October... Just a thought?


----------



## bugs

bubumaci said:


> Ahhh - thank you girls for the warm welcome :)
> And for the explanation! Guess low AMH is not something they found with me.
> 
> I am sorry you are having such a crappy day!! There are those nasty days, when you get up on the wrong side of the bed (so to speak) and you just feel as if you blunder from one thing into the next. I hope that your evening turns out to be pleasant :flower: And more than anything, that you do get pregnant with your own eggies!!
> 
> Just wondering whether either of you have thought about TCM - acupuncture to support and perhaps improve results? I know that a lot of our American "colleagues" on here do it and have had good results. I rang a clinic today that offers it and have an appointment in October... Just a thought?

I tried acupuncture on our 1st cycle and to be fair we did get 2 pretty good embryo's to put back. But I didn't find it relaxing at all it could be quite uncomfortable although my accupuncturist specialised in fertility and so was a massive support for my 1st go xxx


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## MrsE75

Hello ladies

I guess I qualify for this thread now as I've done 3 cycles plus a frozen. I already know the lovely AQ, bugs and cveah from another thread but here is my story for those i don't know.

It got married 3 yrs ago and we actually started trying about 3 months before our wedding cos we wanted to start right away due to me being 36 and with thyroid problem. Anyway after 6 months my thyroid doc said I should think about going to my GP for tests. My OH kept trying to delay so after 9 months we went. OH is fine, I however got told I have 0.00 amh level meaning they gave me a less than 5% chance of having my own children. So they wanted me on ivf straight away on LP. So less than 10 days letter I was having injection training. We got 4 eggs, all mature for ICSI due to my low egg numbers 3 fertilised. From that we got 1 blastocyst and 1 almost blastocyst put back. We got pregnant first time - everything was fine as far as I knew until we went for our 7 wk scan to see how many we had. There was a sac but no heartbeat told to wait a week and come back but looks like a miscarriage but they could only find 1 embryo so they were worried about ectopic. So went home, two day later I was having pain in should tip OH panicked and marched me off to hospital they kept me in over night. Next day they did bloods and I decided that without evidence I had an eptopic I was not having an op so went home but they booked me in for a scan a few days later. This scan the sac had grown and now we had a fetal pole so there was hope it was just a late developer. Another week and back for a scan this time the sac got small and I was about to miscarry any day. Next day at home I had a full miscarriage. Truly heartbroken and this most horrendous thing I've had to endure whilst no one around me understood that for the rest of my life I would always consider I had a child of my own it just didnt make it.

Did cycle 2 and only got 1 egg but didn't fertilise. Changed clinics and did immune tests all normal, had hysteroscopy and found I have a small uterus but otherwise it was fine. Fresh SP cycle in jan this year. We got 4 eggs again, all mature for ICSI and all 4 fertilised - result! However we got 2 blastocysts one was top grade and they were very hopeful the other prompted a debate about if it was worth freezing based on my few eggs we froze it and use it a couple of months ago but still BFN. I'm told that from outside my eggs look perfectly normal, they split in the correct times and we get great fertilisation.

At this stage I don't really know if my eggs are the problem and move to DE or if I just can't carry for some reason and we could try surrogacy. So now paying off last cycle, saving for next and then I will go an have consultations with other clinics cos i will do one more with my eggs then we need to know either way where the problem lies. However I know age is not on my side. 

Thanks my story.

Looking forward to helping each other through this rocky road we are on! Xxx


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## africaqueen

Nice to have you with us MrsE, although obviously i wish with all my heart that none of us were on this thread but we are, so we will get eachother through this nightmare.

I am feeling a little better today after a very down day yesterday. Feeling aggressive still but managing to put a lid on it. Got my slimming class later and hoping i get my 2 stone award. I am focusing on losing weight, getting fit and enjoying life as best i can and hoping that next year see's me pregnant somehow or another. Where there is life there is hope ladies. NEVER let us be defeated xxx


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## bubumaci

Hi MrsE :howdy:

I find it so sad that there are so many different types of struggles ... no-one should have to go through this :(

:hugs:

Bugs - I am looking forward to my first appointment ... I will try anything to finally make this be a success!! (And I hate ... *hate* needles... total phobia of them!)

Glad that you are feeling a bit better today AQ! And that is important - to keep enjoying life! We only have one, so we should try to make the best of it! :hugs:


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## africaqueen

Thanks Andrea. I meant to say to you also that i lost my mum in Aug 2011 just a mth before our 1st IVF cycle, then my best friend Jane in Nov 2012 and my oldest friend Kelly in Feb this year so i understand how terrible grief is alongside infertility. It really is soul destroying but like you say, we have just one life and we never know what is around the corner so i plan to live my life the best i can for myself and also in memory of my mum and my friends xxxx


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## bubumaci

I am so very sorry for your losses :hugs:


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## bugs

Cvaeh would you really not consider going abroad, donor egg cycles in this country are silly prices and I wouldn't recommend egg sharing coz they don't use proven donors like they do in some clinics abroad and you just don't know what your gonna get. Some poor cow ended up with half of my shitty eggs. I should never have been accepted as a donor. 

Well I've got to say I'm pretty upset about some things that have been said on this site tonight I wish people had a bit more compassion coz at the end of the day once their babies are born they'll forget all about us and the thread but we'll still be looking for advice, support and an escape but that's all I'm going to say on the matter xxxx


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## africaqueen

Andrea- I am very sorry for you losses too. We have plenty of guardian angels x

Heather- I agree with what you said about not point in FU etc as i felt that at our last one. Yep my eggs are pretty poor so how many different ways can it be said kwim? we will get there. Good luck with your DE plan. I am sure that will make the difference. I have been thinking of you lots x

Bugs- I don't know what has gone on tonight but i am sorry if someone has upset you and we will be here for eachother always like we have done for the past 4yrs so don't worry about that x

Got my 2 stone award at slimming world tonight! made up xxx


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## bugs

No not at all Cveah just another thread, water of a ducks back but just a bit inappropriate I thought, I've got enough on my plate without worrying about hurting someone's feelings xxx


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## bubumaci

Bugs, I am sorry that you got upset on another thread. I think it is very easy for people, once they are successful, to forget how it was before their wish was granted. And to forget how quickly hurtful things can be said. :hugs:

Cvaeh - thank you for your welcome. I was just hunting on the internet to see about donor eggs in Hungary (I have family in Budapest and Hungary has excellent medical care) since it is illegal in Germany. I came across a clinic that seems to be very good, does offer all the normal IUI, IVF, ICSI etc. care as well as donor eggs and donor sperm. Being in Hungary, the prices are well below US, UK and Western European prices (we are already about 40 KEUR out of pocket here!!) ... perhaps you would consider taking a look?

Here is the link to the website : 

https://ivfpregnancycenter.com/


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## Unlucky41

Hi All 

So glad this thread has taken off!!
Just got my timetable for my last ivf using my eggs. We should be stim 24 Sept and ER is estimated to be 8th October. Really hope this is the one but I think I need to start my research in relation to donor eggs. 

Ladies I need help to how to go about it? I have been googling donor eggs overseas and not getting very far. Any suggestions? Looking at the Asian countries due to price and I am Asian.

Thanks


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## bubumaci

Hi Unlucky!

Just thinking - can I call you something else to perhaps bring you a bit more luck? Would like to push positive karma towards you :)
Anyway, all fingers and toes crossed for your new cycle - that you won't have to move onto DE!

Yesterday I did a bit of googling (well, Hungary-specific) and I was thinking - depending on where you live - perhaps you wouldn't have to go as far as Asia? I am sure that when looking at donors, you can narrow in on what is ethnically closer to you (including blood groups etc.) and I am sure that there are Asian donors in countries outside of Asia? Or is Asia close to you (not sure whether you mean Asian living elsewhere or Asian living in Asia)? If Hungary were to be an option for you (I posted the link earlier to the clinic) perhaps you could enquire as to having an Asian donor? For example. The clinic seems to have a fantastic reputation in Europe...


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## MrsE75

AQ - huge congrats on the 2 stone badge keep going!!!

Bugs - sorry people have upset you stick with us ladies instead :)

Unlucky - good luck for you upcoming cycle. 

Cveah - looks like we all may be considering DE! 

Personally if I need DE I would probably look at Spain because I have olive/Mediterranean skin and most people think I'm Portuguese or Spanish so I would want to match my skin tone as much as possible. Also in UK the whole not guaranteed the quality of you donor would concern me. 

Just had a lovely end to a lon journey for one of my friends. She had tried for 7yrs, 5 ivf cycles and 3 m/c so had a tough time. Anyway her eggs were crap and she has immune issues and they are not very advanced where she is so she did surrogacy overseas and she just flew out to meet her twin girls last Friday how lovely. I'm absolutely made up for her. Hope that cheers you all up xx


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## africaqueen

Bubumaci- If we have to move onto DE i shall check out that clinic as Hungary is not too far from the UK and looks beautiful too :) x

MrsE- I have same complexion as you and ppl assume i am spanish when i am in spain and if dh was white we would defo seek DE in Spain for that reason but as dh is black, our baby will favour him anyway so won't matter so much x

Bugs- I realise what you mean now... i think its disgusting that you were named in the thread and that these women we have supported have turned to be downright selfish and thoughless after going through IVF themselves! it seems a case of 'im alright jack' with some of them. No names mentioned. I won't sink to that level. Some of the preg ladies are lovely. Some need a reality check and also how would they like it if they had multiple fails and still were not pregnant and there was a thread all about pregnancy on a ASSISTED conception board?! talk about insensitive when there are TONS of pregnancy threads on PREGNANCY forums! xxx


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## bugs

Hi everyone, sorry about my rant it just really hit a nerve. AQ on some forums that thread would have been moved as it can be upsetting but the thing is I was not saying if your pregnant you're not allowed to post it's the pregnancy talk by all means update and I don't even mind the thread as it means I can pop in there and see how there doing when I choose too. It pushed me over the edge when my miscarriage was referred to as my troubles but any ways all is said and done now and I think I'll just stay here now xxxx

Anyone looking for donor eggs try the fertility friends site it is region specific so you can see other people's reviews on clinics. I think all of us are having a last attempt with OE so it will be nice to do it together xxxx


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## africaqueen

Bugs- I totally agree. Of course its nice to hear success stories, but there is a big difference between announcing your pregnancy and sharing tips and advice on IVF, compared to posting about pregnancy in detail, right down to what clothes etc you are going to buy... that is just cruel to do on a assisted conception forum when baby and bump has a huge pregnancy section for threads like this and no matter how you get pregnant, be it IVF or natural, pregnancy is pregnancy and such matters should only be discussed in detail on pregnancy forums. Anyway my rant is over now too. Onwards and upwards for us ladies in here :) it will soon be us pregnant and setting up a thread over on the pregnancy forums cos i dont know about you ladies, but as much as these threads have been my lifeline, i am more than ready to move onto pregnancy boards! lol. I would always pop back here to help others through this nightmare though xxx


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## cvaeh

Totally agree Africa.
I can't wait to move over to the pregnancy forum. I thought i would be well over there by now when i first posted. 

I have had a lovely day with dh today. We went to bygone times and then had our lunch out. I went for a run for the first time in ages when i got back and is it wrong to say i really enjoyed it!!! I have been tying to work out why my egg quality is so bad. None of my family have ever had problems and i have always been fit and healthy, although went through puberty late as i was tiny so wondered if that could have caused it???

Oh well, i can't change it. I will love my baby whatever x x x x x


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## cvaeh

Mrse - wonderful news about your friend. X x


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## africaqueen

MrsE- Yes sorry meant to say what a lovely story about your friend x

Cvaeh- I don't think going through puberty late made a difference as i was only 12 when i did and look at me... just nature going wrong and sadly it had to happen to us :( we will get there, even if its not the way we thought x


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## MrsE75

Cveah - I agree with AQ I think it's just bad luck. I initially thought it was cos of my thyroid which I got at early age of 18yrs old but then there are others in same or worse boat than me that don't have that issue. It's just something we will never know I guess. But I I have a gentoo daughter I will be telling her to freeze her eggs at an early age just incase it's genetic! My mum took 3 yrs to get pregnant naturally aged 28 cos ivf didn't exist then so who knows my mum could have had the same problem. 

Feeling knackered expecting the witch sun/Mon which is never good! Stupid I know but I always think even for just a second perhaps this'd nth it may work - how insane am I!?! Ha, ha xx


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## cvaeh

Mrse- not insane at all. Every month i think maybe i will be that person telling their story about their miracle baby conceived naturally after so much intervention and my eggs won't even fertilize with icsi! I am still waiting for my period to come after my period bfn. I was on 100mg of gestone daily and it did the trick of keeping period away which nothing else did. At least i have learned something from this cycle. I think it will take a while for my hormones to settle though.

did you say your friend did her surrocacy in Cyprus? X x x x


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## bubumaci

Yay for a suggoracy success :) That is so exciting that she is getting to meet her twins!

Interestingly, I am also on another thread (that I joined in Spring of last year) - where a few who have been on as long as me are now pregnany and most have already had their babies. There was a lot of talk of symptoms and etc. during pregnancy - now its baby talk. I remember one poster getting really upset and leaving the thread, because she felt that now that people were pregnant, no one was answering her AC questions. I am in split minds about it - we have been quite a close-knit group of friends on there (as well as being friends on facebook and I created a group there just for us). Because of all the support and caring, we have, as I say, become quite close - on the other hand, it really is painful to keep failing and seeing some succeed first go / quite soon. But I there are others (three of us are "Azoo" girls on there) who have suffered some failures and who are now pregnant and of course I am over the moon for us. The thread has turned into a "supporting each and every one of us until and beyond BFP".

But I guess that is also the reason, since it has been the thread I've been most active on, why I looked for somewhere else. I mean, they say they all understand the pain and frustration and that it is OK to rant and rave ... But somehow, even though having to go through the treatment in itself is painful and awful to know you can't have children without the intervention, I don't think the ladies who had success first or second time around (and most did manage to get pregnant first time round) really get what it feels like to keep failing / to lose the baby and keep failing. There are others there of course who are more or less in the same boat as me (or worse, have had several miscarriages) who are now pregnant and I am sure they really do get it!

*ramble* sorry!

CVAEH - lol - I have that hope (deep down, even though I say I don't believe in it, because hey - without swimmers / ones that aren't able to swim, it just won't happen) too :)


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## MrsE75

Morning ladies

My friend lives in Australia and surrogacy is complicated and long as not enough people willing to do it. so only 2 countries they will let you do overseas surrogacy and allow residency is USA or India, they couldn't afford US so went to India. Which means the egg donor was Indian and the surrogate was too, my friend is pale skinned and blonde hair so they can't try to match her tone but she wants to be a mum and have her own family at whatever cost. There has been substantial costs! So I'm waiting to be sent pics, saw the pics from just after they were born but not with my friend and her OH. I've been out buying two little outfits for her and a few bits to send for them all. I'm so happy for them cos they truly deserve it after their journey. I'm determined I will be successful too perhaps not with my genetic children but I know I would be a great mum. 

So the next of us cycling is Unlucky is that correct? Obviously unless one of us falls naturally before then!! Xx


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## Jamie_lee_c_

Hi ladies, I just wanted to tell you all while you are here that the thread has been moved!
It is now in pregnancy groups and forum. 
I have private messages bugs as I was unaware I had upset/annoyed her. 
Long story short I am sorry for any upset it might of caused and wish all you ladies all the luck in the world, I did not mean any offence in my thread and have certainly not "forgotten" any one who helped me on my journey. 
Jamie lee xx


----------



## Unlucky41

bubumaci said:


> Hi Unlucky!
> 
> Just thinking - can I call you something else to perhaps bring you a bit more luck? Would like to push positive karma towards you :)
> Anyway, all fingers and toes crossed for your new cycle - that you won't have to move onto DE!
> 
> Yesterday I did a bit of googling (well, Hungary-specific) and I was thinking - depending on where you live - perhaps you wouldn't have to go as far as Asia? I am sure that when looking at donors, you can narrow in on what is ethnically closer to you (including blood groups etc.) and I am sure that there are Asian donors in countries outside of Asia? Or is Asia close to you (not sure whether you mean Asian living elsewhere or Asian living in Asia)? If Hungary were to be an option for you (I posted the link earlier to the clinic) perhaps you could enquire as to having an Asian donor? For example. The clinic seems to have a fantastic reputation in Europe...


hahah you can call me Jo. I live in Australia hence Asia is not too far I guess !! The hard thing is I can't read Chinese hence it is really hard googling. I am wondering if my RE can recommend somewhere you think that is a fair question? I just want to be ready for plan b as soon as possible.

bubumaci did you find anything ? I really do hope this cycle works but the more I think about it logically I know my answer - 16% my RE gave me hence I know I need a plan b!


----------



## Unlucky41

MrsE75 said:


> Morning ladies
> 
> My friend lives in Australia and surrogacy is complicated and long as not enough people willing to do it. so only 2 countries they will let you do overseas surrogacy and allow residency is USA or India, they couldn't afford US so went to India. Which means the egg donor was Indian and the surrogate was too, my friend is pale skinned and blonde hair so they can't try to match her tone but she wants to be a mum and have her own family at whatever cost. There has been substantial costs! So I'm waiting to be sent pics, saw the pics from just after they were born but not with my friend and her OH. I've been out buying two little outfits for her and a few bits to send for them all. I'm so happy for them cos they truly deserve it after their journey. I'm determined I will be successful too perhaps not with my genetic children but I know I would be a great mum.
> 
> So the next of us cycling is Unlucky is that correct? Obviously unless one of us falls naturally before then!! Xx

MrsE75, you know what I am venting here but with my endo my RE has suppress me such that we cant even try in between cycles. So sad !!! Yes it is so sad that Australia doesn't let woman get paid for their eggs!!! There is virtually no supply and I can't blame them who wants to get poked and violated for nothing except being happy that they had helped a complete stranger !!


----------



## bubumaci

Unlucky41 said:


> hahah you can call me Jo. I live in Australia hence Asia is not too far I guess !! The hard thing is I can't read Chinese hence it is really hard googling. I am wondering if my RE can recommend somewhere you think that is a fair question? I just want to be ready for plan b as soon as possible.
> 
> bubumaci did you find anything ? I really do hope this cycle works but the more I think about it logically I know my answer - 16% my RE gave me hence I know I need a plan b!

Where in Oz are you from Jo? I am a huge Australia fan (spent almost a year over there after Uni and fell in love with it - lived in Perth) - 2006 I came over for three weeks and stayed with my friend (who I made back in 1998) in Perth. 2007 travelled with a friend from Cairns to Brisbane and 2008 backpacked alone from Brisbane to Melbourne :) Completely love it. Took DH there a year after our wedding for our Honeymoon (spent a few days in Singapore first and then Sydney) - he is now also a fan :D
What about Singapore, Hong Kong etc.? Would that be of interest? I would imagine, since Singapore isn't that far, that you ought to find something in English? Or how bout NZ? What are your options there?

Yes, I had posted this link : https://ivfpregnancycenter.com/ which seems to be a very good clinic in Hungary.

Certainly I would ask at your clinic whether they have any suggestions - if it is not really a viable option in OZ, they might have some ideas for plan B. And why not ask, if they are not going to treat you any further? I hope they can help - but even more, that you won't need to go down the route of plan B!


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## africaqueen

For the ladies that are wishing for a natural miracle- my mum was told she would NEVER have children due to 'completely' blocked tubes and my mum and dad ttc for 10yrs and then had me, so miracles can happen if you have the necessary 'equipment' so i pray it does happen for you ladies too x

Hope everyone is ok. I am feeling more positive today after being so down the past week or so. I can see light at the end of the tunnel again which feels good xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

bubumaci said:


> Unlucky41 said:
> 
> 
> hahah you can call me Jo. I live in Australia hence Asia is not too far I guess !! The hard thing is I can't read Chinese hence it is really hard googling. I am wondering if my RE can recommend somewhere you think that is a fair question? I just want to be ready for plan b as soon as possible.
> 
> bubumaci did you find anything ? I really do hope this cycle works but the more I think about it logically I know my answer - 16% my RE gave me hence I know I need a plan b!
> 
> Where in Oz are you from Jo? I am a huge Australia fan (spent almost a year over there after Uni and fell in love with it - lived in Perth) - 2006 I came over for three weeks and stayed with my friend (who I made back in 1998) in Perth. 2007 travelled with a friend from Cairns to Brisbane and 2008 backpacked alone from Brisbane to Melbourne :) Completely love it. Took DH there a year after our wedding for our Honeymoon (spent a few days in Singapore first and then Sydney) - he is now also a fan :D
> What about Singapore, Hong Kong etc.? Would that be of interest? I would imagine, since Singapore isn't that far, that you ought to find something in English? Or how bout NZ? What are your options there?
> 
> Yes, I had posted this link : https://ivfpregnancycenter.com/ which seems to be a very good clinic in Hungary.
> 
> Certainly I would ask at your clinic whether they have any suggestions - if it is not really a viable option in OZ, they might have some ideas for plan B. And why not ask, if they are not going to treat you any further? I hope they can help - but even more, that you won't need to go down the route of plan B!Click to expand...

haha I think you have see more of Australia than me. We are in Sydney hence Singapore and HK is an option. My husband just told me today on father's day that he was not 100% sold on donor eggs and rather try further. I told him the doctors won't let us !!! Part of me agree with him but part of me just want to be a mum. He is so scare the baby will look really funny. I really hope we don't have to take this route but I definitely need a back up plan!!! 

bubumaci when will your appointment be ? Are you taking a break at the moment?

Africanqueen thanks for that story my mum also had problems having kids 3 miscarriage before having me. I keep blaming her for the bad genes I am so naughty


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## africaqueen

Unlucky- Our consultant did say that a lot of these issues are genetic, and as my mum had tubal issues and premature menopause and i had tubal issues and DOR i tend to agree with him. Just nature being a bit cruel but we will get there xxx


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## MrsE75

Hi ladies

Just got a message today that my friend is 2mths pregnant with her 2nd whilst we've been trying for our first! I'm happy for her but I said to OH that feels like stab in my heart and he got angry with me saying its nothing to do with us! So we had big arguement -men!

X


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## bugs

I totally understand, a girl I work with is pregnant with her 4th in the time we've been trying for #1. It hurts like hell but at the same time she didn't know how to tell me she felt so guilty poor cow it's not her fault she's so bloody fertile but it doesn't get any easier. 
She'll have 4 kids under 5 not my idea of fun I have to say xxx


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## dovkav123

Hello ladies,
May I ask you a question?
I got BFN this morning. I am 12dpo. I am on progesterone and my temps. are crushing down for two days now.
Should this hormone keep my temps up?? 
When should I quit this hormone?
What is your experience?


Thank you!


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## bubumaci

MrsE - totally get you. We work so hard towards trying to achieve our dreams, invest so much energy, hope, money, time ... go through so much and still come out empty handed and there are so many women out there, who get pregnant so effortlessly - of course it's not their fault that it is easy for them and it is not their fault that it is so hard for us - the stab of pain we feel, the resentment - none of it is logical, emotions aren't :hugs: :flower::kiss:

Hi Dovkav :howdy: - from your signature I understand that you went with IUI because the natural IVF cycle treatment failed and that therefore you are on progesterone? I have no experience with IUI and what the protocol is - for all my IVFs, I have had beta blood tests on 6dp5dt (so 11 dpo) and 9dp5dt (so 14 dpo). It is not unlikely that even if your treatment has been a success, that you would not see anything on a urine test at 12 dpo (since fertilisation would have to happen naturally, the implantation time line can be anything between 6-12 dpo). If I were you, I would ask the clinic what they think, but would continue taking the medication until either your beta has been drawn and been negative, or a few more days after a BFN on the urine test.

Normally, progesterone does keep the temps up, yes.

Good luck!!


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## Unlucky41

africaqueen said:


> Unlucky- Our consultant did say that a lot of these issues are genetic, and as my mum had tubal issues and premature menopause and i had tubal issues and DOR i tend to agree with him. Just nature being a bit cruel but we will get there xxx

Yep I sure know the feeling - yes I really really do hope we get there one day.

Any update when you will be cycling next?


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## bubumaci

:) What would I give for my DH to have a freak few months when he does actually produce sperm (a lot) that is motile (very) :) I mean, we enjoy practicing, even if we know that his condition is the most foolproof contraception going ... I wouldn't mind, if it stopped working and we got pregnant *hehe* (wouldn't that be a huge surprise) :)


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## MrsE75

Just a quick update as I'm in work. The witch turned up today so guess we have to keep trying au natural until we can afford another cycle! Feeling really down today. 

I also want to lose some weight but at the moment I just can't seems to get my head in the game. Last time out of pure willpower I lost nearly 2 stone in under 2 months! That was cutting out all carbs for 6 days a week plus exercising either in the gym or walking everyday. 

I just can't seem to get into it but I need to! X


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## africaqueen

MrsE- Bloody men! i break my heart crying each time one of our friends announces they are pregnant and dh goes mad saying i can't be happy for anyone and what business is it of mine!!?! insensitive A-Holes! lol x

Bugs- Yeah i don't envy someone with 4 kids under 5 as much as i want one! lol. I could never cope with that many young kids. I would be more than happy with one or god willing 2 if we had twins x

Dov- Sorry about your BFN :( x

Jo- we won't be cycling again until this time next year as need to start saving up after Christmas and we don't earn much so will take ages but we will get there x

Hi Andrea, Cvaeh and all the gang xxx


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## Unlucky41

africanqueen - I do hope you get lucky and have a natural pregnancy!!! 


MrsE75 - my RE believe that losing weight helped. Although it didn't help me it does help the majority of ladies out there. Hoping that my cycle coming up really gives me dividends from the laparoscopy and weight loss!!! Losing weight is so hard but they do say losing weight slowly is better than fast it is then a life time change!


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## bubumaci

... when it rains it pours! Over the past couple of months, I have had three "attacks" in the night, where I have been in pain for several hours. After thinking about it, I remembered that Mama, Jajó (her Mother) and my cousin on the maternal side all had had (with the exception of my Grandma) their gallbladders out around my age. So - after DH begged me to make a doctor's appointment after the last attack (which was Saturday - Sunday night - the one before had been before my third blood test, where I was up for about 4,5 hours in pain) - which I did yesterday and I went in for the ultrasound this morning. The verdict : my gallbladder is nicely full of gallstones and I will have to have it out ... appointment with the specialist in the hospital on Thursday morning. Didn't want to have the OP before this weekend, as we are flying to Budapest Friday - Sunday to be with my Grandma for her 101st birthday on Sunday.

... wanna know what my first thought was? That is why I wasn't allowed to stay pregnant ... Mama and Granny (Mama died May 31st this year, Granny died May 10th this year) wanted me to have my gallbladder out beforehand ... but wanted to show me that we can get pregnant... guess they knew what they were doing after all! <3


----------



## africaqueen

Unlucky- Thanks but absolutely no chance of me getting pregnant without IVF as i have no fallopian tubes x

Andrea- Ah im sorry to hear you are having a rough time again :( some people sail through this life and some struggle and sadly we are the latter but hope things pick up soon! don't worry about the surgery for gall bladder removal as my dad had this done last year and was fine and out of the hospital the same day and back on his feet properly within 5 days x

Hi to all the gang x


----------



## bubumaci

I must have to admit, that I have to see it with humour! I would so love to have an ultrasound picture of a nice growing bean - I joked at the doctor's office. When I was 21, I had an ultrasound picture of my breast tumour before having it removed... now at 38, I get a picture to take home of my gallbladder full of gallstones *hehe* ...
But I will have that ultrasound picture of my peanut ... I will! :)

:wave:


----------



## africaqueen

Yeah i am sick of US pics of my empty womb and hope to god that one day i get a pic of life in there! lol. We WILL get there xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

africaqueen said:


> Unlucky- Thanks but absolutely no chance of me getting pregnant without IVF as i have no fallopian tubes x
> 
> Andrea- Ah im sorry to hear you are having a rough time again :( some people sail through this life and some struggle and sadly we are the latter but hope things pick up soon! don't worry about the surgery for gall bladder removal as my dad had this done last year and was fine and out of the hospital the same day and back on his feet properly within 5 days x
> 
> Hi to all the gang x

So sorry to hear this!!! I guess in some ways we are in similar boat - we can't try naturally because of my severe endo hence heavily suppress hence no ovulation. What you guys think of estrogen priming protocol + micro dosage Lupron? 

I have doing some googling and think this protocol may suit me however my RE won't do it!!


----------



## Unlucky41

bubumaci said:


> I must have to admit, that I have to see it with humour! I would so love to have an ultrasound picture of a nice growing bean - I joked at the doctor's office. When I was 21, I had an ultrasound picture of my breast tumour before having it removed... now at 38, I get a picture to take home of my gallbladder full of gallstones *hehe* ...
> But I will have that ultrasound picture of my peanut ... I will! :)
> 
> :wave:

Yes I dream about this all the time and I end up in tears just thinking about it. Happy tear pretending it is me seeing my baby's ultrasound. Have I lost it ?


----------



## africaqueen

Jo- I think after what we have been through we have all 'lost it' to some degree! haha. I think faith and hope is what gets us through this nightmare x

AFM- I am off out to Liverpool tonight with some work mates and can't wait to blow the cobwebs away but i am feeling old as they are all in their early twenties... haha. least there will be no baby talk as they are all young free and single ;) xxx


----------



## cvaeh

Unlucky- I did the estrogen primming protocol on my fifth cycle and got my best embryo which wasn't great but for me the best. I didn't do the micro lupron though. 

Africa- have fun tonight. No baby talk sounds good. When i go out the talk always some how gets back to babies!

X x x x x


----------



## Unlucky41

cvaeh said:


> Unlucky- I did the estrogen primming protocol on my fifth cycle and got my best embryo which wasn't great but for me the best. I didn't do the micro lupron though.
> 
> Africa- have fun tonight. No baby talk sounds good. When i go out the talk always some how gets back to babies!
> 
> X x x x x

Cvaeh this sounds promising well it is just something different to try for our last last ivf with my own eggs !! I think saizen improves quality of eggs and Estrogen priming give you the most eggs and micodosage Lupron helps with endo so if you don't have endo you would not need it!!

I have booked an appointment for March 2013 with a great RE in Brisbane Australia next year for our last cycle and advice. This is our back up plan if this October cycle doesn't work. Will be injecting again in two weeks time soooo scare.

Sarah I know how you feel I only talk to unmarried girls these days as they are safe to talk to. No baby talk:0 )


----------



## africaqueen

How is everyone?
Im feeling bit low as lots of pregnancy news lately and although im happy for those that are pregnant, i am sad for myself and it hammers home yet again what a failure of a woman i am :(( xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

africaqueen said:


> How is everyone?
> Im feeling bit low as lots of pregnancy news lately and although im happy for those that are pregnant, i am sad for myself and it hammers home yet again what a failure of a woman i am :(( xxx

Definitely know how you feel!! I am stuck at home sick with the flu definitely feeling sorry from myself. Hope that we get peace and our bundle of joy one day. Really hope this nightmare will be gone and be behind us!!! 

It is hard but really trying to focus on the things we can enjoy in life!!

9 days before I start my next cycle. If this one doesn't work I have booked one last cycle in March 2014 with one of the top doctors in this country after this Donor eggs it is. I am really trying to not to get my hopes up though.


----------



## bubumaci

Hey there :howdy:
Big hugs for you AQ :hugs: ... Please remember : you are not a failure of a woman! Never think that! :hugs: ... I totally feel with you and I'm so sorry that you are feeling so down :( :hugs:

oooohhh.... ooooohh.... my fingers are so crossed for this next cycle!! I won't say "this is it" like they do on the other thread (they have said it to me every time and I have been like "yeah right") ;) But I am going to hope that you are not going to need the March 2014 cycle, because by then you are going to be 4 months from meeting your LO :)

Heading off to the hospital shortly for my pre-operation chats (anaesthesiologist, doctor etc.) ... and tomorrow morning I have to be at the hospital at 7 in the morning for the operation ... TBH I am more scared of the pain I will wake up with, since I am fine in between the attacks... <= silly me!


----------



## MrsE75

AQ I am in the exact same boat I have next door neighbour, best friend, cousin all having their 2nd children whilst I failed to have one. I have another friend that's about to use we first FET she has 3 or 4 in the freezer and I know this sounds horrible but if she gets pregnant that is every single one of my friends with families. I'm a terrible person to feel that way but I desperately want me to be next cos she's much younger and has no problems with eggs anything. I just an really impatient but have no chances of doing a cycle anytime this year unless we win lotto!! Xx

Good luck bubmachi you will be all good I'm sure. Plus you need this sorted before another cycle so it's a good thing look at it that way xx


----------



## Unlucky41

bubumaci all the best to your operation - hope you have no pain when you wake up. bubumaci thanks for your kinds words. I hope this one is it as well but it is so hard to be positive easier to think nothing will happen.

Today I got my performance review from work and it was bad. Feel like everything is turning against me now. When something in your life is not working everything seems to not work. 

MrsE75 it seems like everything about infertility is about winning the lottery. Yep it seems like you can't even go on the normal threads as they are all full of hope and positivity.

Hang in there friends and be strong at least we have each other


----------



## cvaeh

Hi everyone

Africa- i feel exactly the same. Every time i log on to facebook someone is announcing their pregnancy, posting a scan picture or announcing a birth. It always hurts even though i am happy for them but so jealous. When will it be our turn??????

I am still waiting for clinic to ring to arrange our appointment for our donor cycle. Think our consultant is off on holiday!

x x x x x x


----------



## africaqueen

Unlucky- I have everything crossed that this next cycle gives you your BFP and look forward to sharing your journey on this thread x

Bubu- Hope your Op went well and that you recover well x

MrsE- It is a nightmare financially and we were lucky that my dad helped us out and that our GP funded the drugs or we would still be saving now for a cycle. We start saving again after xmas and that means no meals out, no holidays or new clothes etc etc as we are on a limited income and it will drain us but we have no choice :( x

Cvaeh- I am the same. Sick of FB atm. I have actually took lots of women off my news feed as the pregnancy and baby talk just gets too much. There is a girl i know who has 2 kids, got rid of a baby last yr cos she split up with the dad and now she is 4mths preg to another guy!?! where is the justice?! Hope you get your appt sorted asap. x

Hi to Bugs and all the gang x


----------



## Unlucky41

africaqueen said:


> Unlucky- I have everything crossed that this next cycle gives you your BFP and look forward to sharing your journey on this thread x
> 
> Bubu- Hope your Op went well and that you recover well x
> 
> MrsE- It is a nightmare financially and we were lucky that my dad helped us out and that our GP funded the drugs or we would still be saving now for a cycle. We start saving again after xmas and that means no meals out, no holidays or new clothes etc etc as we are on a limited income and it will drain us but we have no choice :( x
> 
> Cvaeh- I am the same. Sick of FB atm. I have actually took lots of women off my news feed as the pregnancy and baby talk just gets too much. There is a girl i know who has 2 kids, got rid of a baby last yr cos she split up with the dad and now she is 4mths preg to another guy!?! where is the justice?! Hope you get your appt sorted asap. x
> 
> Hi to Bugs and all the gang x

Hi all have been battling the flu hence took 4 days off already! Hopefully recover before the injections start!

Yep I don't go on facebook at all too many people sharing their baby timeline -I am just so sick of congratulating others and nothing happening to me. Get this my contractor is off because his wife is giving birth I am so sick of working hard to cover someone else enjoying their bundle of joy.

Cvaeh please share your donor eggs experience I think we will eventually need to go down that route as well


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## africaqueen

Hi to all our lovely ladies and hope we are all doing ok x

I have got a grip of myself and started thinking no matter how many babies ppl have it wont make me have one so may as well pack in with the green eyed monster and hope for the best in my own life. Its hard but im going to try and think like that as jealousy can consume can't it? :(

Looking forward to my hol to Spain in Oct and i am sticking to my diet and healthy regime and putting myself first for a little while xxx


----------



## bubumaci

Hello lovely ladies :wave:

Thank you all for your wishes. The operation went perfectly, gallbladder safely retrieved, including 6 ca. 1cm stones (which I have in a little jar *grin*). Did wake up sore, but the recovery is going very well - less pain every day - it is just amazing, what the body can cope with! And how quickly it recuperates! Still taking it easy, and am relieved to have it behind me, be able to get better and look forward!

Tell me about all the announcments! I really am happy for them! Just wish that I could be announcing such great news too! :)

A break in Spain is just what the doctor ordered :) I am looking forward to our trip to Florida in November :)

@ Unlucky - what was your name again (I am sorry ... swiss cheese brain at the moment *lol*) ... or I shall just call you Lucky, because your luck IS going to change :) Unfortunately, there are just some years, where everything goes wrong (2013 is definitely my worst in my life so far!)... I hope you're feeling much better now!

Sending a sprinkling of :dust: to everyone - I can't wait to start hearing some good news here! :)

*EDIT* - I scrolled through all the pages and found your name :) Jo :)


----------



## bugs

bubumaci said:


> Hello lovely ladies :wave:
> 
> Thank you all for your wishes. The operation went perfectly, gallbladder safely retrieved, including 6 ca. 1cm stones (which I have in a little jar *grin*). Did wake up sore, but the recovery is going very well - less pain every day - it is just amazing, what the body can cope with! And how quickly it recuperates! Still taking it easy, and am relieved to have it behind me, be able to get better and look forward!
> 
> Tell me about all the announcments! I really am happy for them! Just wish that I could be announcing such great news too! :)
> 
> A break in Spain is just what the doctor ordered :) I am looking forward to our trip to Florida in November :)
> 
> @ Unlucky - what was your name again (I am sorry ... swiss cheese brain at the moment *lol*) ... or I shall just call you Lucky, because your luck IS going to change :) Unfortunately, there are just some years, where everything goes wrong (2013 is definitely my worst in my life so far!)... I hope you're feeling much better now!
> 
> Sending a sprinkling of :dust: to everyone - I can't wait to start hearing some good news here! :)

Glad everything went well and your on the mend one less thing to worry about. 

Hope everyone else is well, sorry I haven't been around much, not a lot going on with me at the moment. 

I'm in a bit of a dilemma with regards to treatment, the clinic in Athens like to do a hystereoscopy first so to fit it in we would probably not have treatment till Jan or do we scrap the hysto and go straight for treatment in November. Decisions decisions !!! 

Hope everyone is well, tell me about the announcements I'm the last one to have a baby out of my work friends. One of them is pregnant with #4 in the time we've been trying for one. I know ours will be worth the wait though !!!


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## africaqueen

Andrea- Glad your recovering well and you have your fab holiday to look forward to x

Clare- Personally i would wait until Jan so there are no 'what if's' and does 2mths really make a difference after how long we have waited so far...? new year, new start ;) good luck with whatever you decide x

Hi to all the gang x

Not much from me as i am so exhausted. These early shifts in work do me in! lol. I am off tomorrow so going to have a pj day and watch films :) xxx


----------



## bugs

I know that's what I keep thinking I sort of feel like we're squeezing it in before Xmas which I don't want but we'll see xxx


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## bubumaci

@ Clare - the other thread I am on (where most have their BFPs / babies and I am pretty much the only one from the original bunch still not pregnant) I know that several ladies had hysteroscopies and the results were good ... and as AQ says - what's another 2 months in the long run (I know, I know - I was raring to go and didn't want to wait another second between treatments ... but .... *smile*)


----------



## MrsE75

Hi ladies

Sorry I've been quiet just nothing much happening 

Andrea - glad you are on the mend won't be long now until you are good to go again!

Bugs - I'm with the other ladies. After my mc I was soooo super keen to get going that we didn't wait the 3 months the hosp recommended and from that cycle we didn't get any embryos so I think new year to start again!

AQ - hope you are having a nice pj day 

Afm - well it's my birthday on Friday so OH and I have decided to relive our youth and go to a theme park for the day hopefully the weather should be good!! Then on the way home we're going to a nice pub for dinner! Also I don't want to jinx anything but my OH may have investment for his business which would mean he could take a salary and perhaps pay off our debts a bit sooner so we can get going again. Nothing will happen for at least 6 mths cos got to pay everything off but I've got everything crossed this investment comes in!!!!

Xxx


----------



## africaqueen

Hi ladies :)

MrsE- Good luck with the investment! hope it happens and you can start sooner x

Well iv had a semi lazy day and it was needed! lol. Hope everyone is ok xxx


----------



## bugs

Thanks girls, I've had some tests done with them and I should have the results in a few days so once I have them I can arrange a consultation and take it from there. 

I think if she recommends the hysto I'll have that in November and then go back for cycle in Jan xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

Hi Andrea,

So glad you have something to look forward to what better than a holiday to Florida!! So good to hear that your operation went well. 2014 maybe your lucky year!! 


So I get to start my 5th cycle tomorrow. So scare as this cycle has to be it or my RE is going to send me packing to another state !!! Has anyone used Saizen before? 7 injections for $1,280 so expensive.

MrsE75 happy birthday !! I love theme parks enjoy the rides !!:happydance:


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## bubumaci

Oooh - Jo - good luck :) :) fx'd for you :) :dust:


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## africaqueen

Jo- Tons of luck and everything crossed that this is 5th time lucky for you xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

Thanking you both definitely will update you guys on my progress good or bad!! Hoping to get 5 matured eggs with the Saizen !!!

Have a great weekend everyone:hugs:


----------



## Unlucky41

Hi All

Me again just had lunch with a friend who announced that they are 4 months pregnant. They said it took them a long time 1 whole year. I was like seriously I have to listen to this !!! I year is nothing you haven't had needles and internal ultra sound and spend thousands on COUNTLESS BFN !!!!

Feeling quite sorry for myself!! So selfish I know. Tonight going to our friends place for dinner they couldn't find babysitters so the children will be around. I am over my depress life.

I know you all understand hence send out heaps of hugs!!!:hugs::hugs::hugs:


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## africaqueen

Thinking of you Jo and sending huge hugs xx
Its so bloody hard to be happy for others when we are so sad for ourselves :(
Some people have no idea! my friend moans she has been trying for 'ages' and in reality its only 9mths of ttc and now she is on fertility drugs so will only be a matter of time before i have to contend with yet another pregnancy announcement no doubt :( i am sick of being a jealous person but its so hard not to be. Esp when so many women fall pregnant so easily and here we are still going through hell... xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

africaqueen said:


> Thinking of you Jo and sending huge hugs xx
> Its so bloody hard to be happy for others when we are so sad for ourselves :(
> Some people have no idea! my friend moans she has been trying for 'ages' and in reality its only 9mths of ttc and now she is on fertility drugs so will only be a matter of time before i have to contend with yet another pregnancy announcement no doubt :( i am sick of being a jealous person but its so hard not to be. Esp when so many women fall pregnant so easily and here we are still going through hell... xxx

Yep I totally agree, I guess everyone thinks ivf is the answer can't believe that the extreme treatment does not work ! Yes and when something good like this happen to someone all they want to do is talk about it which I cant blame them but seriously esp when you know I have been trying for 3 years +

How was your weekend ? Relaxing ?


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## africaqueen

Well lets hope its us basking in the joy of pregnancy in the very near future ;)
My weekend was not too bad. I was off work on the Sat and worked the Sunday. Not been too well with stomach bug and on the late shift tonight :(
I have 2 days off from tomorrow though so will give me time to get myself back on my feet. How was your weekend?

How is everyone doing? xxx


----------



## MrsE75

Hi ladies. Thanks for your birthday wishes. Had a lovely budget weekend! Went to Alton towers on 241 vouchers with OH we had a ball. Just lovely to forget about work, money and ivf stress and remember what it's like just the 2 of us. 

The investment is still a work in progress but I've got everything crossed it happens!

So sorry to hear you are not feelin well AQ hope you are better on your days off. Typical you are ill when you are not in work!!!

A lady from another thread posted this which was very interesting research which thought may help some of us here. OH and I were talking yesterday and if the investment comes through hopefully 6 mths and we will go again but if all happens around feb I will go and get a couple of opinions from other consultants. I basically don't know if my eggs or implantation is my issue so need to do a cycle which either treats both or if it doesn't work tells me where exactly my problem is. 

https://m.bbc.co.uk/news/health-23897664

How is everyone else doing?

Xx


----------



## Unlucky41

Hi All,

Just wanted to let you ladies know that I had my first scan yesterday. We have 7 follicles between 11 and 16mm so I am quite happy as this is our best ever!! I am using saizen again 2nd time though hence I think it does help. I am obviously cautious as we never get good fertilisation. So far so good however the scary part yet to come. Another two days of injections and then trigger I think !! 

What is everyone doing this weekend? 

I am suppose to go to a 1 year party however I said I couldn't make it!


----------



## bugs

Hi unlucky those follies sound great, fingers crossed for you. 

Well it's my 32nd B'day today so just a lazy day today the OH is working so I'm gonna take my gorgeous little boy (dog) for a nice walk and then it's out tonight for Mexican food and lots of sangria. 
We had our results back from the clinic and they show a slight infection inside so I'll be in a strong course of antibiotics for a month. So we've definately decided to wait till Jan it will just give us more time to get organised. 

Hope everyone is well xxxx


----------



## Unlucky41

bugs said:


> Hi unlucky those follies sound great, fingers crossed for you.
> 
> Well it's my 32nd B'day today so just a lazy day today the OH is working so I'm gonna take my gorgeous little boy (dog) for a nice walk and then it's out tonight for Mexican food and lots of sangria.
> We had our results back from the clinic and they show a slight infection inside so I'll be in a strong course of antibiotics for a month. So we've definately decided to wait till Jan it will just give us more time to get organised.
> 
> Hope everyone is well xxxx

Happy birthday !!!! Have a great birthday and enjoy the sangria!!! Haven't had Mexican for ages. Just came back from a nice walk in the sun so relaxing weather is starting to be great down under!! 

Yes best to be 100% so there are no excuses for the RE let hope 2014 is our year!!

Going for another scan tomorrow hope they have all grown to be big fat matured eggs !!


----------



## bubumaci

Aw - happy birthday!! (belated) :)
Jo - that's wonderful that you have a nice bunch of eggies developing!! Fx'd that they mature nicely and fertilise nicely! :)

For my birthday in August, DH gave me a voucher for a weekend away (which he had booked for this past weekend) at a romantic hotel (which is owned by my favourite chef) with a lovely menu both Friday and Saturday evening. It is a couple of hours' drive from our home (and near to a place I used to live 14 years ago - Kronach) - so on Saturday we drove to the town I lived in, visited my old home, wandered around the town, walked up to the castle ... relaxed in the afternoon and then enjoyed a fabulous 5-course meal in the evening. Really lovely weekend :)


----------



## Sandy83

Hi Ladies 

Wondering if i can join :hi:

As you can see from my signature we have just had our 3rd failed IVF. Bit of background No problems on my side but we had to freeze DH sperm due to intense Chemotherapy he had to recieve so only way we can get pregnant is through ICSI. 3 fresh cycles and 1 FET which all ended in BFN not even a sign of a BFP. 
Always collected 15 to 21 eggs at retriveal and always got a 5 day blastocyst to transfer and even had a hatching blatocyst last time but still nothing. 
Going to have a break now till the new year and look into to getting some testing done and also look into acunpunture and herbal treatments. 

Look forward to speaking to you ladies within the coming months :hugs: xx


----------



## bubumaci

Hi Sandy :howdy:
I am so sorry to read that on top of everything else, you've had to battle cancer! How much :spermy: were you able to freeze up front?

I have wondered - does chemo always have to result in infertility? Or do they say, that it can be the result?

In preparation for our November cycle, I am also going to be doing the chinese herbal treatment + acupuncture (had my first appointment to discuss last Friday and on October 8th I have the first treatment - in the meantime, I have to drink some special tea conconction for two weeks). I hope that your tests can give you some insight into why your implantation is not happening. It really is so nasty of life / nature to put that roadblock in the way, when so many other hurdles have had to be overcome! Biggest hugs to you!!!

And welcome to a lovely group of ladies! :hugs:


----------



## Sandy83

Hi Bubumaci

Thanks for the welcome. We were able to freeze quite a lot of :spermy: prior to the treatment so got plenty to keep trying at the minute. Chemo has a 90% chance of causing infertility but DH had to have intense chemo and a stem cell transplant so we had a good idea that infertility would happen. They have said there is a chance in the future that fertility could return but it's a very small chance. 

I did do acupuncture with my last cycle for the first time but looking at going to another clinic as found it helped with the side effects of the meds but he only wanted to see me 3 times throughout the cycle and then he wasn't available after transfer and found his colleague very rude and unprofessional so going to try somewhere else. You will have to let me know what treatment they suggest you to try with acupuncture. like how many times to go, what tea to drink etc

As for the tests the clinic haven't suggested to do any yet but from researching things myself i am not happy to go ahead with my next cycle without looking into to why it hasn't worked, especially since this is my last funded cycle as we were lucky and got 3 cycles through the NHs due to our circumstances and the clinic are funding the 4th cycle so want to at least rule out some things even if the results are fine just want to put my mind at rest that we have done eveything we can.

Are you doing anything differently this time round? :hugs: xx


----------



## Unlucky41

bubumaci said:


> Aw - happy birthday!! (belated) :)
> Jo - that's wonderful that you have a nice bunch of eggies developing!! Fx'd that they mature nicely and fertilise nicely! :)
> 
> For my birthday in August, DH gave me a voucher for a weekend away (which he had booked for this past weekend) at a romantic hotel (which is owned by my favourite chef) with a lovely menu both Friday and Saturday evening. It is a couple of hours' drive from our home (and near to a place I used to live 14 years ago - Kronach) - so on Saturday we drove to the town I lived in, visited my old home, wandered around the town, walked up to the castle ... relaxed in the afternoon and then enjoyed a fabulous 5-course meal in the evening. Really lovely weekend :)

Hi Clare ,
hahaha glad you have a great time with the husband. DH birthday is coming up as well 26 oct hence you romantic weekend is giving me some ideas !! 

Welcome Sandy can't believe you and your husband has been through so much. Yes it doesn't make sense you seem to have so many eggs I am glad you are doing a few tests before doing another IVF. How is DH?

Just a little update tiggered tonight hence ER in two days time. 2nd scan 7 follicles 20,19,19,18,18,17,16. Really hope there is one good one in me!!


hope all is well

Jo


----------



## Sandy83

Thanks Jo, DH is fine now he was diagnosed in 2010 and March this year he got the put into remission as he has been clear for 2 years next milestone is 5 year all clear. 

Sounds like your follicles are growing nicely, Good luck with Trigger tonight and enjoy your injection free day tomorrow. Fx'd for Wednesday :hugs: xx


----------



## bubumaci

Haha Jo, got me mixed up with bug :D :D
Oooh ... glad that I have given you some ideas :) And "yay" for triggering! I have everything crossed for a successful retrieval + fertilisation!

Sandy - I am really happy for you both that your DH responded so well to the treatment and that the illness has gone into remission. I will pray for you that you safely reach the 5 year milestone! (God I hate that illness!!!).

Our last round (July) was successful in that we finally had a perfectly developed embryo at transfer (we were lucky with all the other tries if we made beginning blast - mainly Morulae) as we had an expanding blast (it was so beautiful) and I did get pregnant (although it wasn't for long). I actually believe now that it might have been linked to the fact that I had a gallbladder infection (just removed week before last) and my body might have fought of the implantation...
So in November we will be doing a similar protocol (just switching back to Gonal-F and doing plus Luveris, as opposed to only Pergoveris - because RE wants to do a slightly higher dosage, and can't dose it as well with only Pergoveris). Oh and in the cycle prior to stimming, he does an endometrial biopsy / scratch biopsy - which is also supposed to improve the implantation changes. The protocol is called Fischer-Scheme. Both DH and I are taking Resveratrol too (and I am still taking CoQ10, Vitamin D, Zink, Magnesium and nice high dosage of Folic Acid) ... hoping that all of it put together will finally end up with our BFP to at least end this year on a "positive" note after a pretty crappy 2013.


----------



## Sandy83

Thats great news on the improvement of the embryo definitely looking positive for this next cycle. Fx'd that since you have sorted the gallbladder issue this next cycle is for you. Sounds like everything is slotting in to place. 

I'm definitely going to be asking FS about a endometrial biopsy / scratch biopsy as lots of people have had positive outcomes from them xx


----------



## Lucinda7981

Hello everyone; I've had 3 failed IVF cycles and am currently doing a banking cycle so that I can freeze these embryos to go along with the 3 frozen from failed ivf #3. The plan is for 3 months of Lupron Depot, intralipids, endometrial biopsy....so it's looking like transfer for IVF will be in Jan.


----------



## bubumaci

Hi Lucinda :howdy:
I am sorry to hear that you haven't had much luck yet either - hopefully, the new plan will change all that! Quick question, what do the lupron depot and intralipids do?


----------



## Sandy83

Hi Lucinda :hi:

As I said in the other thread I'm very interested to see how this cycle works for you sounds like your FS is covering all bases with this one. Look forward to getting your updates :hugs: xx


----------



## africaqueen

MrsE- Sounds like you had a fab birthday weekend :D a bit of fun always does us good. x

Bugs- Sounds like you had a lovely birthday too x

Bubu- Hi, hope your ok x

Sandy- Welcome and so sorry to hear what your DH has been through. Lets hope we all find our joy in 2014 x

Jo- LOTS of luck for EC tomorrow! your follies are virtually identical to mine on the last cycle! we got 7 eggs but sadly only one embie through ICSI so defo a quality issue with me. I hope you manage to get a few good healthy embies x

Lucinda- Welcome and lots of luck with banking cycle. Just curious as to why you dont go straight to FET with the frosties you already have? x

Hi to Bugs, Cveah and all the crew x

AFM- Been busy with work and im worn out all the time so i am glad that me an dh are off to Spain for a week next Thur :) can't wait. Drinks, meals, sighseeing and partying xxx


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## Lucinda7981

bubumaci the lupron therapy is suppose to address my adenomyosis and the intralipids immulogic(elevated NK cells) ...all betas have been negative despite great fertilization results, great looking embryos....I seem to have had implantation issues and RE presented additional testing.
Africaqueen my RE doesn't recommend going for another transfer without addressing my implantation issue. Also I feel more comfortable having a couple of embies before we transfer again.


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## Unlucky41

So sad have my egg collection today only 2 eggs collected out of the 7 follicles.
I am crying as I type. My lining is bleeding hence even if the embryo is good they can't transfer it anyway. If the embryo is bad quality they will transfer it expecting it not to work. What nonsense of a body do I have!!

I am ready for donor eggs really can't handle this pain anymore. Life is just not fair. I got my hopes so high due to seeing so much follicles to fall back down. This is just a joke. I don't know what God is playing at but I just don't see any hope anymore.


----------



## bugs

I'm so sorry to hear this unlucky, it's so unfair you think you clear one hurdle only to be pulled down at the next. Can they not freeze the embryo's till your lining improves xxx


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## bubumaci

Oh Jo, I am so so sorry :( :( :hugs: I really hope that you get two nice :cold: ... what made your lining bleed now at ER?
Even though it feels so cruel each time we stumble, please keep your hope up ... it is so so important to pull us through all the difficult times!
I don't know what else to say - just sending you some huge hugs of strength! :hug:


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## Sandy83

Jo, I'm so so sorry to hear about your EC. I agree with bugs we clear one problem to be faced by another. IVF is such a rollercoaster ride. I'm keeping everything crossed that both embryo's are good enough to freeze and you will be able to transfer at a later date :hugs: :hugs: I've got the same question as bubumaci what has made your lining bleed at EC? xx


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## MrsE75

Jo bless you nothing we say helps but we all are here for you and praying for your little embies. 

I'm with the ladies why is your lining bleeding surely they need to find out before any embies go back?

Just don't give up hope I know it's hard when you've just been kicked in the proverbials but some said to me once after my mc that my baby is just waiting for me and that was not the right one but that it needs me to keep fighting and stay strong cos that's all it has to cling on for. 

I'm determined not to be defeated I know I will be a mum somehow just don't know how yet! 

Keep your chin up Jo lots o hugs xxxx


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## Lucinda7981

Unlucky I'm hoping your eggs end up being 2 nice looking embies and that you canst least move forward to a successful FET.


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## africaqueen

Lucinda- Ah that's good your RE is doing everything possible then :) Good luck x

Jo- Did they get 2 eggs or 2 embies? if its 2 embies that is great and i am sure they can freeze them until your lining improves? im so sorry this cycle has not gone to plan and its awful we suffer so much but stay strong. My mum always said 'where there is life there is hope' god rest her soul. I live by that mantra. She maintained that even when she was dying. Good luck x

Hi to all the gang x


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## cvaeh

Jo- sorry things haven't gone as expected! Sending you lots of luck for you two little eggs. Hope they are growing into two strong ones as we speak x x x x


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## africaqueen

Cvaeh- How are you doing? xxx


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## Unlucky41

Hi All,

Thanks so much for all the encouragement. Today we were told that our two eggs have now fertilised normally which is the best news I could get.

I know it is really really early days hence still have a long long way to go but I guess we will have a chance even how slight it is. 

Won't get another update report until two days times which I am happy about I seriously almost faint when they called me!!


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## Sandy83

Thats great news Jo :wohoo: If they have fertilised you are in with a very good chance :hugs: xx


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## africaqueen

Jo- That is AMAZING news!! out of every cycle we had, we only ever got 1 embie from 6-7 eggs so 2 embies is fab and you have lots of chance of a BFP from this cycle! good luck and i know a long way to go but you have a great chance this time x

Hi to all the gang x


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## bubumaci

Oh Jo, that's just wonderful news! I am so happy for you! And fingers and toes remain crossed so that they now continue to develop properly!!! Lots and lots of :dust: to you Sweetie!

:wave: to everybody :)


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## cvaeh

Fantastic news Jo. Grow embies grow x x x x x


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## Unlucky41

Group :hugs: thanks all for the encouragement!!! This thread is great!! We got an update today in regards to the embries. They are both 8 cells and grade 1. I am cautiously happy. We were here at our 3rd ivf but at day five there were just a morula and early blast hence I know anything can happen still! 

Really hope this is our miracle however we have such a long journey to go. Next update on Monday and hoping that they a both good enough to be frozen.
Do you guys know what quality it good enough to freeze?

Thanks again for all the encouragement and prays. If I get a good blast that would be the first time ever!!


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## africaqueen

Everything crossed for you Jo and your embies are in my prayers! x

Hi to all the gang x

AFM- One more shift in work tomorrow then i am off work for 2wks and off to Spain with dh on Thursday for a much needed week's break :) soooo excited xxx


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## Unlucky41

africaqueen said:


> Everything crossed for you Jo and your embies are in my prayers! x
> 
> Hi to all the gang x
> 
> AFM- One more shift in work tomorrow then i am off work for 2wks and off to Spain with dh on Thursday for a much needed week's break :) soooo excited xxx

Have a blast on your holiday !! Have you been to Spain before ? 

Just wanted to say that our embries made it to freeze :happydance: don't know the exact details however over the moon for now. The RE wants to give my body a rest and transfer in December probably. I really hope this is it as my RE won't do another cycle for us.

Going to try to lose 5 pounds by then something to keep me busy !


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## Sandy83

Africaqueen, Enjoy your holiday think its a much needed rest for you. :hugs:

Jo, amazing news that they made it to freeze. What day did they freeze them? Sounds like december will be great for transfer plenty of time to rest over the christmas period. :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Jo - I am so thrilled for you that you have your frosties!!! :hugs: ... Don't know about the UK, but here, they have to be blasts to get frozen... :)

Aw - that is so good that you are going on holiday!! Where in Spain are you off to?

xxx to you all :)


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## africaqueen

Jo- WONDERFUL news! so happy for you. One huge step closer to your dream x

I am going to Lloret De mar on holiday which is a hr away from Barcelona and a lovely resort. It will be my 15th visit to Spain and my 3rd time staying in this resort :) xxx


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## bubumaci

That sounds just perfect for a week away!! Do you have connections to Spain (being the 15th visit)?

Off for my first acupuncture session now ... I so hope it doesn't hurt!!! xxx


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## Sandy83

Bubumaci, you will be fine it will not hurt. Let me know what they do and how many times they advise you to attend as i have my appointment on 1st Nov with a new clinic xx


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## Unlucky41

My RE says there is research that says acupuncture just after transfer seems to help. Have you ladies heard of this ? Sandy have you considered DH getting acupuncture or chinese herbal ?


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## Sandy83

Yeah I've heard acupuncture after transfer is very good helps you to relax and helps blood flow. There is no point in DH doing anything as all sperm is frozen as dH is now sterile after chemotherapy treatment. 

How you getting on? :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Hiho :) :wave:

So acupuncture went well - just the putting in of the needles was uncomfortable, but other than that, no complaints. I already had my first appointment with her two weeks ago. Since then I have been drinking some chinese herbal medicinal tea (tastes gross, but if it helps) and at that appointment she already said that she wanted to see me on a fortnightly basis until we do the next stimming / ER / ET, at which point she wants to see me weekly, as well as the day of the transfer (as you say Sandy).

I had also asked whether or not it would make sense for DH to go - she said that in Chinese medicine, they like to treat both partners, like the Ying & Yang - but that often men are more sceptical than women and not necessarily willing to go ... most of the men go for their partners. DH has agreed to go and he made his appointment today, going on the 29th - she did also say that I was more important, to get everything within my to be optimal to receive the embryo etc. We shall see what she does with him when he goes *muahahaha* :)

:wave:


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## Sandy83

Glad the appt went well looks like everything is sounding positive. Great news that DH is going also xx


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## africaqueen

Andrea- No i don't actually have any connections to Spain, just love the country, culture and food. haha. Got good memories there with my late mum and my late best friends too so always nice to return ;) Glad your accu went well and hope it helps. I may consider it myself for our next cycle next year as tried everything else but that. lol x

Hi to Sandy, Bugs, Cvaeh, Jo and all the gang xxx


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## bubumaci

That I can understand, Sarah, really loving a country, culture etc. etc. :) And also going back to a place where nice memories are stored! Aw - I hope you have a great holiday! Off tomorrow, aren't you?

I will have to see whether or not I become a believer in acupuncture - but I have heard of really positive results and thought, "why not - can't hurt". It doesn't make me believe in miracles, and we will never know (if we are successful), if this was why - but knowing that I am doing everything possible in my might to try and get to that positive result is comforting ... 

:wave: to all of you out there and "happy hump day" :)


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## Sandy83

Ladies, I started acupuncture in my last cycle but the clinic wasn't very good with dealing with IVF patients but i was a total sceptic about the whole thing but am trying a new clinic this time round as i found the whole experience amazing. I was so weird how relaxed it makes you and i am going into the next cycle with the mindset that as long as it is relaxing me and making me stress free i can't be bad and if it helps to get a positive results thats a bonus xx


----------



## Unlucky41

Hi All,

A story to make everyone laugh or cringe.
At work we have a dangerous chat system called communicator. Well the business came around and goes I have never seen that amount before and I said it has been there for ages. My boss then doesn't back me up and says I have never seen that before either when he only approved it last June and March !!! 

Anyway with disgust I was suppose to communicate my friend about the situation but I communicated my boss instead. When I realised I went to his computer to try to delete the message. He then caught me red-handed. 

He goes what are you doing? I go I sent you something personal that you weren't suppose to receive. He goes he will delete it but really you think he would I wouldn't. I would definitely read it ?? What you guys think ?? Stressing out can't sleep now:wacko:


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## bubumaci

... Jo, I did have to laugh about that ;)
We use communicator too (do you work for the same company I work for *grin*?).
TBH - if he is a decent boss, then he will respect the fact that it was something personal that he isn't supposed to see. You will just have to trust him and hope that he doesn't read it (or - depending what you wrote, perhaps he will realise that he was an ass to not back you up and might feel bad about it ;) ....

:hugs:


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## Unlucky41

hahahha I said something like - he is so full of crap as if he doesn't know anything about that balance damn him. - OK what you think ? is that bad ???

Well I recently told him about the truth of my MIA days hence I am thinking he probably thinks it maybe related. Hopefully he does however as you know you have to delete it from the conversation history and then delete it again !! So many chances for him to have a sneak peak. 


How is your week going ?


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## bubumaci

*loool* well ... it could be bad ... but if he were to read it, I still think he might feel like an ass :D He should! I hate people who are so superficial that they are only out to save their own skins. A boss should protect his / her people and not hang them out to dry, when they do know about a situation.

I remember once doing something similar - when I was confused about something, I pinged a friend ... and the answer came back from my boss (because I had mis-pinged) *lol* luckily I hadn't written anything to bad and I was able to "explain it away" *lool* but I remember that feeling of horror when I realised, that I hadn't sent it to the person I thought I'd sent it to :) :)

You know, it could be that he thinks it all has to do with the treatment, in which case he really might respect your wishes. Actually, I haven't done any deleting, so I don't know how much we have to delete *lol*

It's going OK ... Tuesday was our 3rd wedding anniversary, so I made us a nice dinner (8.10 was civil service and 10.10. - so three years ago - the big white do) - but I am in the middle of quarter close, so have plenty of work until the middle of next week or so ... :)

I'm not sure if it is related, but since I have been drinking the chinese medicine and especially since my acupuncture on Tuesday, I am feeling better rested and calm ... feeling generally quite good ... hmmm :)

xxx

Sarah ... don't know if you will still see this, since you are off to Spain today : HAVE A WONDERFUL HOLIDAY!!!!


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## Unlucky41

Hmmm don't tell me you are an accountant as well? Quarter close ???? 

Yes I do hope he does respect my privacy !! You know when You told him about my treatment although he said kind things there it didn't felt genuine. I had to talk to his boss which is a female that I actually felt some kind of peace. 

Hahah I am not the only one :wacko: do you remember what you said?

Congrats on three years!!! Time goes so fast these days - we are coming up to 9 years in one months time need to book a restaurant I can't cook!!!

For the chinese meds are you boiling or taking tablets? Yes it does relax and de-stress so enjoy it 

Have a good weekend as well


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## bubumaci

:) sort of - I do work with accounts but I am not exactly an accountant. I work for a French software company and am responsible for licence revenue recognition for 13 countries. For any transactions > 250 KEUR I have to prepare reporting packages, as well as reporting memos for some particular information they need at headquarters. Whenever I see that we are not recognising correctly (due to various reasons), I tell the accounting team exactly what needs to be booked - to where (which accounts) and when.

Actually, it was funny (this was about 12 years ago) - some of the employees had been asked to reduce their hours, to save money, as the company was going down the road to bankruptcy (the Co. did go bankrupt in the end) - and my colleague and I were responsible for organising the transfers ... and I remember there had been a discussion as to which salaries to transfer and which were on hold - and then I think I was told to make the full transfer. My comment was something like - aha - so we are transferring it all after all *eyeroll* 
:) Can't remember what my boss replied, but it was easily explained away, since I could have just been asking for confirmation, so it wasn't too bad :)

Where do you live again? Whenever I am down under, I love going out to eat ... mhhhmmm ... there are some great places!

Actually they are to boil. I have to soak it all for 30 mins, then boil for 30 mins, sieve and then boil some more - get 1,5 litres of fluid out of it.

xxx


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## Unlucky41

bubumaci said:


> :) sort of - I do work with accounts but I am not exactly an accountant. I work for a French software company and am responsible for licence revenue recognition for 13 countries. For any transactions > 250 KEUR I have to prepare reporting packages, as well as reporting memos for some particular information they need at headquarters. Whenever I see that we are not recognising correctly (due to various reasons), I tell the accounting team exactly what needs to be booked - to where (which accounts) and when.
> 
> Actually, it was funny (this was about 12 years ago) - some of the employees had been asked to reduce their hours, to save money, as the company was going down the road to bankruptcy (the Co. did go bankrupt in the end) - and my colleague and I were responsible for organising the transfers ... and I remember there had been a discussion as to which salaries to transfer and which were on hold - and then I think I was told to make the full transfer. My comment was something like - aha - so we are transferring it all after all *eyeroll*
> :) Can't remember what my boss replied, but it was easily explained away, since I could have just been asking for confirmation, so it wasn't too bad :)
> 
> Where do you live again? Whenever I am down under, I love going out to eat ... mhhhmmm ... there are some great places!
> 
> Actually they are to boil. I have to soak it all for 30 mins, then boil for 30 mins, sieve and then boil some more - get 1,5 litres of fluid out of it.
> 
> xxx


Yes us accountants highly reply on the business to book the correct profit !! Seriously you don't want to be an accountant all the jobs are going to India, Philippines etc Due to no future in my current role I have seek recruiters to find me a new job. At the moment any jobs that I like I don't even make it to interview stage. The market is so bad I have to convince myself everyday that I should be so glad I have a job :cry: So de-moralising but I guess life has to go on.

Yep I don't think your boss would have thought too much of it. I can't you believe you have been at on job for 12 years that is impressive. I have been at my current job for 7 years and I don't know if I can survive to 10 year for long service leave. Do you get that where you are ?

I am in Australia have you been here before ? Going to ARIA for my anniversary had to book it myself my husband so not romantic and I know not to wait fro him to organise anything haha

Yep there said that is the most effective way is to boil the herbs !!! Hope it works for you!!


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## MrsE75

Hi ladies

AQ hope you are having a great holiday! Wish I could go away but no chance prob before Christmas vos my husband got the investment which takes the pressure off me a bit! Also means I'm now working even more days to help him get things sorted &#128533;. But very happy for us both cos that hopefully means we will be able to do out next cycle in the first 6 months of nex year. Sooner the better although now I can afford to join a gym to lose the weight I want to beforehand. 

The Chinese herbs sound vile but guess if they work!

Hi to you all xxx


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## bubumaci

I haven't been in the same job / same place since then ;) In fact, I have been with three other companies and I am at the fourth. Worked at my current company since 2010 :) It was just a communication that happened 12 years ago :D

Yup - HUGE OZ fan :) Lived in Perth for nearly a year after Uni (1998-1999) and loved it. 2006 went back for 3 weeks' vacation to Perth. 2007, three weeks travelling with friend from Cairns to Brisbane. 2008, three weeks travel on my own from Brisbane to Melbourne. 2011 took DH to Sydney (and Singapore beforehand) :) I love Australia and really miss it! That's why I was wondering where in Australia you are :) ;)

No, we don't have long service leave here. I think you can take a sabbatical after some time (or is that the same thing? Sabbatical is unpaid leave though).

Boiled some more herbs and roots yesterday - got 2 litres out of it :) And they are vile - lots of honey to make it taste better ... although funnily - you get used to it, it is not that bad now that I have been drinking it for two weeks.

xxx


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## Unlucky41

MrsE75 - you definitely have a great positive mindframe. I lost weight before my 4th and 5th ivf and it just felt good fitting into my clothes with some space to spare! What are you doing at the gym?

Bub - I am in Sydney doesn't look like you have been there before. Cairns was where we went to celebrate our first year anniversary 8 years ago good memories :haha:

No long service leave that is no fun haha 

Today there has been heaps of :cry::cry::cry:. My sister that I have heavily confided in over the past 3 years just told me today that she is pregnant. She has been studying for the last 3 years and I was the one who was suppose to get pregnant. The thing is my brother in law lives in a different state until next year. They only see each other once a month and she gets pregnant. I couldn't be happy for her. I told her straight out hat I can't stop crying since knowing her news. I told her I can't go to her graduation I feel so hurt and angry and definatley can't feel happy for her. What kind of sister am I ? The worst as it comes. Seriously I was hoping that me being the older sister and the one that has been trying for the last three years would get the BFP first!! 

Sorry for the negative post but it seems like there are less and less people I can confide in now. My mum goes can't you be happy for your sister and I said I don't know. Clearly the answer is NO but I just sound like a monster!


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## Sandy83

You are not the worse sister, I went through exactly the same last year my sister who was only with her partner for a year weren't even living together fell pregnant and wasn't even trying. I was devasted and couldn't even talk to her about it as I just cried and thought why not me!!!!!! I went the whole 9 months of her pregnancy not really acknowledging it and i felt really bad but couldn't help the way i felt. It was so hard it never got any easier but now I have a gorgeous little newphew who i adore and could never imagine him not being a part of my life. :hugs: On top of that my BIL had an affair and left his partner of 23 years and now got his new partner pregnant. That is taking a little more to get use to as they have 3 kids already from their previous relationships who don't get on with each other and causes lots of conflict to then bring a new baby into the world just doesn't make sense. :shrug:

But one thing I've learnt from this whole process is my baby is out there waiting for me and will come when the time is right :hugs: and your's is too! xx


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## bubumaci

Hehe... Jo .. oh yes I have :) Was there for two weeks in '99 ... then 2008 when I travelled from Brisbane to Melbourne, Sydney was one of my stops :) And finally 2011, when I took DH to Sydney :) I love Sydney!! Fabulous city, such a great atmosphere (and some wonderful places to eat).

Oh, Sweetie :hugs: it is sooo sooo hard and I really do understand you! And feel for you. It is just so painful, when - especially when the order of things is not stuck to - other people get pregnant so effortlessly! I really can relate - to the pain, to the frustration, to the anger, the hurt, the disappointment - the whole wave of negative feelings that just overwhelm you. And then come the reproaches from people who just cannot even begin to fathom and understand what it is that we go through - and that just makes us feel even worse. I am so so sorry that you have been hit by this (... something I am only too familiar with!). It will be tough ... when you see her belly growing. No doubt your parents are excited that they will become grandparents (knife in your chest, because you are the one supposed to be making them grandparents) ... a really really cruel twist of fate - and nothing make it feel better. But I am sure, once your niece / nephew arrives, you will be a fantastic Auntie and you will love them to bits! You will get pregnant, you will have your rainbow baby - and from then on, this crap that we are confronted with on our journey to that point will no longer matter, it will melt into the shadows of the painful journey... but until then, I wish you strength and am sending much love and support .. I know just how you feel! <3


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## Unlucky41

thanking you both for the comforting words! :hugs:
I haven't spoken to my sister yet and I think it will take time before I really want to talk to her or my mother. I can't help but take it out on her she gave all the good genes to my sister. I was reading articles about infertility breaking up friendship and how people can't mix with those that have children as your life is so different. Do you ladies think this is true? Today all I thought about was there was no way I am organising my sisters baby shower how cruel would that be all the relatives going and why aren't you having a baby :growlmad:

I hope that we all get our baby sooner rather than later. I know that we would all be a great mum as the journey has been so tough. You know I was telling my sister she shouldn't be so career minded as I have troubles having children she would probably be in the same boat. I haven't been so wrong!!

Wishing you all the love!! 

Sandy how did you cope going to the hospital/baby shower etc?

Bub when you going to come and visit Aus again ?


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## Sandy83

I did plan my sisters baby shower and I'm so glad i did it now. 
It was not easy by any means but at the end of the day i looked at my life and i have an amazing husband who I'm so close too and had the most amazing wedding and she hasn't had that or even been with her partner for that long to get so close and she was the one who went out of her way to plan my Hen party etc and I thought that has got to have been hard for her as that is something she wanted so much to meet the right person and settle down. 
It is hard when relatives keep asking when is it my turn but i got through it and feel a better person at the end of it all. The hospital side of things was hard but from the moment i saw my nephew's gorgeous face all the feelings i had went away and he is such a big part of my life now. 
The best thing I did was be totally up front with my sister and told her how truly happy I was for her but made her aware that she has to give me time to come to terms with it and she was understanding at times (still had our run ins about it). 

My advice would be to take one day at a time as you will have so many ups and downs and be open and honest with your feelings and thats all you can do. :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Jo - give yourself some time. As far as others having babies is concerned, I have been happy for everyone - only with my BIL's wife have I had my troubles (similar situation to you - effortlessly pregnant ... first grandchild ... etc. etc. ) - I am not really close to her, but have been thinking about organising a baby shower (not common over here) because I think it would be a nice thing to do! Still haven't managed to bring myself to do it and time is running out. Baby is due end of November and the first two weeks, I am away on vacation :)

But as Sandy says - take one day at a time and see how you go. And I agree entirely - honesty is very important. I have been very honest with BIL and SIL (congratulated them, but explained how difficult it was for me etc. etc. - she thanked me for my honesty). You have to be true to yourself. 
I think it is possible to mix - families with children and families without. Sure, lives are different ... sometimes the friendships just fizzle out by themselves because of it - in other cases, it doesn't.

Just see how you go :hugs:

And I can't come over soon enough! Am such an addict :) But this year, we are visiting family in the US (Florida). My cousin took her eldest over to Budapest to meet our family in March, but her timing was really bad and I couldn't get over. My Uncle I saw for nearly three weeks, while I was in Budapest looking after my Mum and for the two weeks after she died - and that is when we fixed our trip over to see her, her kids and we are staying with my Uncle and Aunt. But definitely will have to come over again (DH loved it too) :) Perhaps, if and when we come over, we can organise a meet-up? :) Hopefully with babies by then :D :D


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## Unlucky41

Thanks Sandy for the great advice. I will see how I go obviously with time things may get better. I guess my problem is also I have been in the same job for 4 years and I am not going anywhere and haven't done anything about it as all I have been thinking about is getting pregnant. 

My sister has everything better than me to be honest. A more loving husband, a better career a nicer wedding so I don't know how to react but be a green with envy. So funny at work they were giving out Halloween names and they can gave me - Jolly green giant - I thought it was funny and very true :wacko:

Sandy is your sister happy in her relationship with her partner? I am so glad you have a fantastic relationship with your husband!

you guys are amazing - I think it is really nice Bub that you are thinking about organising the babyshower. Within three months of my miscarriage my SIL declared that she was pregnant I was so devastated I could never bare organising a shower. When I visited her in hospital with the baby was the night my first trigger ever which obviously ended in tears. Yes one thing is sure we have all been stronger through this journey.

You Aunty and Uncle sounds like lovely people. Good loving family are worth more than treasure. Bub enjoy your trip to Florida ! And yes I look forward to that day when we meet with our babies.:happydance:


----------



## africaqueen

Hi ladies :)
Got home from a lovely week away in Spain on Thursday but sadly was bitten by something on my last day which has caused blood poisoning and my ankle to swell to double the size and is very painful so went to docs when i got home and he gave me super strong penicillin and painkillers and i have been pretty much laid up since... also today AF showed her face and OUCH its a bad one! not a great weekend but me and dh did have a great holiday so thankful for that.

Hope everyone is ok? sorry to see some of you have been struggling with pregnancy news etc. It never gets easier does it :( i got very emotional on holiday seeing the little ones on the beach and all dressed in cute clothes etc. Broke my heart to see dh spend ages selecting a doll for our goddaughter and a cowboy hat for his godson :( so wish he was buying that for our child... i am more desperate than EVER to be pregnant now. 2014 IS going to be our year! god willing. No matter what i pray we are pregnant by this time next year. HUGE gaping hole in my heart that is waiting for our baby to fill xxx


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## bubumaci

Hi Sarah - I am glad to read that you had a lovely holiday (and pissed off at whatever bit you to ruin the end / and your days back home!!) ...
We have just had Oktoberfest here and when the kids run around in the traditional dress, they just look so unbearably cute! I totally get your feeling emotional at the beach!!

@ Jo ... I don't think I will manage to organise the baby shower in time. We are going to be dog-sitting from tonight until next week Wednesday, and on Friday next week we are off to Florida. Once we get back (14th Nov), I think it's a bit tight, since her EDD is at the end of November. And she is really really big (at 5 months she looked like some women, who are in their 8th/9th) ... so I wouldn't be surprised, if the baby comes early!

xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

Sarah so glad that you had a great holiday. Did you find out what bite you ?
Yep I know the feeling about bad AF. I only just recovered from mine. Mine is so heavy which I haven't had for a while. 

Really do hope 2014 is it for us. I forgot when are you scheduled for your next cycle? I so know the feeling about the hole it never goes away it just gets bigger especially when everyone around you just love talking about their kids or babies. Today someone was saying I don't want to have another child unless it was guarantee a boy. I was like I just want a child that is healthy who cares what sex it is!! 

Bub all credit to you for thinking about it. I never considered doing it for my SIL. Do you like dogs Bub? who are you minding it for? I am glad you are going on hols soon. We are going away for DH birthday this weekend. Nice relaxing holiday couples massage all booked near the water!


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## bubumaci

Yes, I love dogs! Grew up with a dog and about 11 years ago, "adopted" my own (she was a doberman, labrador mix with a bit of Rottie) ... she was hit and killed by a car when she was 15 months old (August 2003) :(
The doggie we're looking after belongs to a very close couple friend of ours. His name is Muffin and he is a flat-coated retriever, chocolate coloured :)

Ahh - happy birthday to your DH - I hope you have a fabulous weekend away :)


----------



## africaqueen

Thanks Andrea. I was pretty annoyed at the bug myself! lol. I hope our lil miracles are running round in cute outfits very soon x

Jo- The Dr thinks maybe a spider but can't say for sure. It is gradually healing. Been wiped out with the strong meds and AF so had to call in sick to work today so back tomorrow all being well. We don't have a date for starting our next cycle as it all depends on finances so could be this time next year as we need to save again. x

Hi to all the gang x


----------



## Unlucky41

bubumaci said:


> Yes, I love dogs! Grew up with a dog and about 11 years ago, "adopted" my own (she was a doberman, labrador mix with a bit of Rottie) ... she was hit and killed by a car when she was 15 months old (August 2003) :(
> The doggie we're looking after belongs to a very close couple friend of ours. His name is Muffin and he is a flat-coated retriever, chocolate coloured :)
> 
> Ahh - happy birthday to your DH - I hope you have a fabulous weekend away :)

ohhhh poor doggie you never got another dog then ? haha I am thinking of a chocolate muffin looking kind of dog. DH has asked for either a cat or dog a few times but I said as long as he baths and cleans it. To be honest we just too lazy can't even keep up with the housework let alone a pet. 

Sarah how are you feeling now? Are you back at work? I can imagine the first day back on work not being really fun??


----------



## bugs

Sorry I haven't been around for a while just keeping busy whilst gearing up for cycle #8. 
I spoke to the lovely Peny from Serum in Athens and she has said that I shouldn't even consider donor eggs at my age (32) she said my protocols in the past always menopur and lots of it we're not right and she couldn't understand why it hadn't been changed. She has prescribed my OH a course of antibiotics which she said are sperm strengthening and I am also on antibiotics, fish oil, inositol and reverseratrol. We go to Athens on the 6th December so they can check us both out and talk about my protocol and buy my drugs and then all things well we'll go back in January for treatment. 

I think in this country if you've got a low AMH they just put you on the max dose of stimms regardless of how it affects the quality. It's hard to judge how good Serum is as a clinic as lots of the ladies who go are older and using donor eggs but they're have certainly been lots of successes so everything crossed. Hope everyone is well xxxx


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## Sandy83

Well ladies a bit disappointed with the wtf appt! Basically if I go ahead with my next cycle with them they will not be doing anything different and no test etc as they don't do them at the clinic!!!!!! So frustrated at the moment as after 4 transfers and not one of them taking at all there has to be something wrong. 

Anyway going forward in going to do my last funded cycle with them in January but in the meantime look for a private clinic to get a consultation to see what they think. 

Feeling deflated at the moment can't even talk about it at the moment without breaking down and thinking is there any hope for us xx

Hope you are all doing well :hugs:

Bugs, Sounds like you have a great plan going forward and great news that they are going to use your own eggs before DE. Can i ask what is your reason for going to athens for treatment? :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Clare - I think that all sounds wonderfully positive! (BTW we're taking Resveratrol extra too *smile). And in just two months (and a wee bit) you will be going back from treatment. I am so excited for you!! :)



Sandy, I find that quite odd, that they just stubbornly want to go down the same road as before without considering changing / improving something... But perhaps, hopefully, the January cycle will work!!! Keeping fingers crossed for you!! xx


----------



## bugs

Hi Sandy, we've used the 2 main clinics in the north west of England so our decision was either London or abroad. Because I have immune issues we decided abroad would be best as well as cheaper. I've read such good things about Serum on the fertility friends website so we decided to go for it. We are also extremely lucky in that my OH got his inheritance recently as we lost his mum in the spring so fianancially we are in a good place which takes so much pressure off and means I don't have to sponge off my parents xxxx


----------



## africaqueen

Hi ladies :)

Jo- I am a lot better now thank you and yep im back at work but not so bad as lots of stuff planned for halloween, then the run up to Christmas and a food drive etc so lots to keep me busy and a better atmosphere :) hope your ok? x

Clare- I am so happy for you as your consult sounds sooo positive! i must admit we just are not in a financial position to continue with a small chance of success so we will have 1 more cycle with my own eggs and then unless we win the lotto we will be saving and taking the DE route as can't afford to carry on like this with my egg quality issues. Any ideas on other tests etc i should be asking for next year? iv had the endo biopsy and the Lap and all clear aside from mild Endo and we know my AMH is low at 2.5 but i am your age and don't wanna give up on my poor eggies just yet either... x

Sandy- I would be getting a 2nd opinion. I do find when you pay they listen to you more which is not right but true :( Good luck x

Andrea- How are you doing? x

Hi to Cvaeh and all the girls x

AFM- Nothing exciting to report here. I had a audition for the chase the other day and didnt get through which was a bummer as was hoping to get on and win some cash! lol. It was a long shot. Tomorrow i have my opps evening for slimming world to see about buying a franchise and becoming a consultant to increase our income so we can be better off cash wise and have more choices regards our attempts to get our baby so trying to be positive and aiming to better our lives xxx


----------



## bugs

Thanks Sarah it's hard to know really what to focus on with yourself. It could be an egg quality issue or it could be an implantation issue. The fact that you naturally got pregnant twice before to me is a sign that you do produce good eggs but the high dose of stimms could be having a detrimental effect on your egg quality so maybe a different opinion on stimms could be in order. However from my experience they seem to think low AMH = maximum stimms. 

I'll let you know my protocol when I get it I'm really hoping for a quality over quantity result this time and am just glad that someone is not prepared to give up on me. I'll try and keep track of what we spend aswell so you can compare if it would be cheaper abroad xxxx 

Hope everyone else is well xxx


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## africaqueen

Thanks Clare would really appreciate that. I just don't want to spend a small fortune again before we are fully aware of what is causing our cycles to fail... i agree that if i managed to get pregnant twice before even though it was over 3yrs ago, that surely i must have a few good eggs left at least and i would rather get 1 or 2 good quality eggs than 7 poor quality. I think last cycle i was given far too many stimms as that cycle produced our lowest quality embie yet... aaah its so sad and frustrating to keep getting so close yet so far isnt it?!
All the kids going to Halloween parties and posts on FB about parents buying xmas gifts for their kids is breaking my heart this year more than ever. Im getting beyond desperate now and i dont need to tell you how awful that feeling is ;(

Hope everyone else is coping ok as the festive period approaches xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

Hi All,
Just came back from a weekend away with DH. It was nice but we did get some bad luck as well. On DH birthday he had a puncture tyre and one of our outings got cancelled but we still managed to have a good relaxing massage and soaked into the hot pools which was great!! 

Sarah, definitely understand what you are going through watching all the little kids dressing up. I really hate how all the ladies at work have kids and they go on about them & always go to me don't you want kids Jo arghhhh :growlmad: What do you have to organise for Christmas?

Sandy aren't there any other tests that your RE can do to see how they can change up your protocol? What quality are your embryos sorry if you have managed this before.


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## Sandy83

Unlucky41 said:


> Sandy aren't there any other tests that your RE can do to see how they can change up your protocol? What quality are your embryos sorry if you have managed this before.

Sounds like you had a good relaxing weekend away even with the mishap and having a outing cancelled. 

RE said there are no additional test from what they have done already to warrant a change in protocol. :nope: My embryo's have always made it to day 5 blastocyst and even had a hatching blastocyst last cycle. We are going to book in to do our last funded cycle in Jan 2014 and see what happens. I'm the meantime we are going to enjoy time together, got lots of stuff planned for the coming months so will keep busy and go back to exercising again. xx


----------



## Sandy83

Sarah, it's definitely a hard time with halloween and christmas is so close, i do find it hard sometimes going out with a couple of close friends as I'm starting to feel like we have nothing in common anymore as there life is there children. Our time will definitely come I'm sure of it :hugs: xx


----------



## Unlucky41

Sandy83 said:


> Unlucky41 said:
> 
> 
> Sandy aren't there any other tests that your RE can do to see how they can change up your protocol? What quality are your embryos sorry if you have managed this before.
> 
> Sounds like you had a good relaxing weekend away even with the mishap and having a outing cancelled.
> 
> RE said there are no additional test from what they have done already to warrant a change in protocol. :nope: My embryo's have always made it to day 5 blastocyst and even had a hatching blastocyst last cycle. We are going to book in to do our last funded cycle in Jan 2014 and see what happens. I'm the meantime we are going to enjoy time together, got lots of stuff planned for the coming months so will keep busy and go back to exercising again. xxClick to expand...

Sandy are you taking baby aspirin ? some girls says it helps maybe you could ask whether they reckon it is more an implantation issue rather than embryo quality. Yes enjoy this rest period it is important for the body and the mind. 

Another friend just announced that she was 11 weeks pregnant. As she has had no problems she told us earlier than normal. Some ladies are just so lucky!!! I hope our turn is coming soon!!!


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## africaqueen

Jo- Glad you had a nice weekend even with the mishaps ;) x

Sandy- It sounds like more of a implantation issue than a embryo issue if you have managed to get to blast. I would request more progesterone and also take baby aspirin incase there are blood clotting issues. Have you ever had a endo biopsy? the trauma of the scratch has been known to aid implantation. Never worked for me as my issue is egg quality but could help you x

Hi to all the gang xx

AFM- Well bit annoyed today as i have a close friend who has been ttc for around 18mths as she has pcos she doesnt ovulate reg so the RE put her on clomid and this cycle was her 1st on it and cos she didnt get pregnant she text me and cancelled our lunch meet today as she is so 'devastated'. I know this is prob going to sound harsh but i told her all along not to build her hopes up too much to fall preg on her 1st clomid cycle and that all it gives you is a chance and the day after my 3rd IVF cycle failed i had to go to her engagement party and never let her down and i was heartbroken that week but pulled it together so not to let her down and that was my 3rd failed IVF not my 1st failed clomid ffs!! i feel so angry and also angry that she see's it appropriate to complain to me- a woman with no tubes, two angels lost and 3 failed cycles?!! she doesnt know what hardship is.
Sorry for rant just had to get that off my chest xxx


----------



## MrsE75

Hi ladies 

Sarah - you rant away I have a friend similar that was around at my house crying for 3 hrs after her first failed cycle but she has 4 in the freezer. But when my frozen cycle failed I got a text mess and then nothing for weeks an then she is now not taking to me cos I told her I was upset she hadn't bothered on my cycle but expected me to be there for hers! WTF!?!

Jules - sounds like a nice weekend I have one with my oh this weekend 2 nights in a spa our first break anywhere in 18mths and I can't wait!

Sandy - I'm the same I got BFP but miscarried and I get to blastos each time but AMH is zero so not sure if egg or implantation issue and there is no test to tell you. Next time I'm seriously considering chromozone testing the embryos then will tell me if it's eggs or not. Had all the immune tests and all negative so it's tough to know what to do isn't it!?

Afm - got two nights in a spa this weekend - facial and massage are booked and dinner on the first night! We both cannot wait. Prob will start making appts for consultations jan/feb so know what we are doing next. Before then I will be speaking to a few people I know who've been to both clinics and my brother knows an ex nurse from one on the clinics too so will definately be getting answers from her. 

Lots of hugs to you all xx


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## dovkav123

I have saved your thread 3months ago when I started my natural cycle IVF.
I didn't know that I'll be part of you.
I just failed 3rd IVF.

The blood tests were BFN. No signs of implantation. Nothing. I felt empty this morning, I came to the clinic for my blood tests with eyes full of tears. 
My hubby made me cry. 
He told me maybe it is not the right time.
He told me maybe we not meant to have children. Maybe our purpose of life is a different one.
Childless couples we know 3 of them, they are happy.

We transfered last month 8A perfect embryo (ICSI cos low motility, just a bad month) and last month(IVF perfect motility) 4A perfect embryo. We have no idea why they don't stick.

My life without a child, I see no purpose. It is unconditional love and I need that maddly!!! It is a magical experience. It is a different love than my relatives or my hubby.
We do live in stressful household and I do agree that stress can cause our infertility. 
I think infertility is a disease and we have pills for that!
Animals don't suffer infertility only we humans. Except My dog, she never had puppies because she didn't let any of the dogs close to her.
I think we all gonna have children in one time of our lives, it is just the matter of when. When the right moment comes.

1.I. am seeing my RE on the 8th of November. 
2. I am doing my thrombofilia genetic testing this week. It cost around 200euro. This gene is common with a women with unexplain infertility.
3. Also I want to test my hubbies sperm he is 50 y/o(genetic kind), maybe we'll pick the healthiest one and do ICSI.
4. Adding hormones to my IVF doesn't make sense. If my uterus doesn't take one, it won't take 2 or 3 embryos. 
5. Also I want to talk about assisting hatching. In the lab dr. grows embryos for 5 days and than dr. make a whole in it. That suppose to help embryo leave the shell. Maybe this is our problem too.
6. I was a child when Chernobyl radiactive atom factory exploded. Children are the most vulnerable. The cloud did go by Lithuania. And we love mushrooms!!! Many people are diagnosed with cancer in Lithuania and my age girls suffer with thyroid problems. If my eggs are damaged somehow, I am in the deep problem. I can test them, if I have only one why should I test. Just wait for a healthy egg to pop!
If I do medicated IVF, I have a reason to test and pick a healthiest one.
I was Exposed to Radiation and I have a risk to develop cancer later on in life. Hormonal treatment, high levels of estrogen can only turn on my cancer cells to thrive!

my AMH 1.29 ng/ml dr. states I am still in the game.
my hysteroscopy results are great too.


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## africaqueen

MrsE- Yep some ppl arent real. I wouldnt of minded so much had it actually been a IVF cycle she went through but it was x1 cycle of clomid! anyway glad to see you have plans for the new year and nice to see u back with us x

Dovkav- Sorry to see you ended up here but welcome. You are amongst women who know the hell of this and we all support eachother. Try and stay positive no matter how hard. Maybe tests will help before you try again x

Hi to Andrea, Jo, Clare and all the gang xxx


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## bubumaci

So sorry that I have been absent so much lately Ladies ... just popping on to give you all a bit :wave: before packing and getting ready to leave for the States tomorrow. Don't think I will be online much the next two weeks, so sending you all huge hugs and look forward to reading you all when I get back :)

:hugs::wave:


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## Unlucky41

Bub have a great trip!!! Hope to hear great stories about your trip when you come back.

Sarah, how did you survive Halloween? Here in Australia is not a big thing hence no kids came knocking at the door at our place.

Dovak it sounds like you have a lot of bad luck as you have perfect embryos. Hopefully assisted hatching would help you. I inquired about it before and they said it is mainly used for those who have good embryos but no implantation. I know what you mean about DH. Mine would say things like I am happy with no children. IVF is a waste of money. My point being if we don't waste it on IVF what would we do with it? What is the point of saving to give it to who?

I hope you are feeling better but Dovak your RE haven't rule you out yet hence don't give up!!!


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## africaqueen

Andrea- Have a safe trip and a lovely time x

Jo- As we live in a flat we don't get kids knocking either, just found it hard seeing all the pics on FB and the parties the parents threw for their children. I am 32, i should be a mummy and spoiling my little one :( just feel bit down. Think its a hard month cos its a yr on the 8th since my best friend Jane died and as i was still grieving for my mother and the failed IVF etc its only just sinking in that she's gone. Just feel very sad. Im sure i will pick up. x

Hi to all the gang xxx


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## Lucie73821

Hi ladies, do you mind if I join? As you can see in my sig, I've been TTC since August 2009. We've had 1 ivf bfn, ivf in Dec 2012 ended with both embryos implanting in my right tube (something my dr said he'd never seen in all 26 years of practice), and found out Thursday that our 3rd ivf has ended with an ectopic in my left tube (my dr said he's also never had a patient have back to back ectopics). I was given methotrexate yesterday and won't know until Thursday if it has worked. 

I'm just having a really hard time right now. :(


----------



## Unlucky41

Lucie73821 said:


> Hi ladies, do you mind if I join? As you can see in my sig, I've been TTC since August 2009. We've had 1 ivf bfn, ivf in Dec 2012 ended with both embryos implanting in my right tube (something my dr said he'd never seen in all 26 years of practice), and found out Thursday that our 3rd ivf has ended with an ectopic in my left tube (my dr said he's also never had a patient have back to back ectopics). I was given methotrexate yesterday and won't know until Thursday if it has worked.
> 
> I'm just having a really hard time right now. :(

Lucie so sorry for your lost :hugs:. Welcome to the thread. Your story sounds so much like Sarah. It seems like so much bad luck. What did your RE say the reason for these ectopics ? 

How were your cycles? Did you get good quality blastocysts?

Really hope you are okay !!!


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## Sandy83

Hi lucie, really sorry to see that you are joining us on this thread :hugs: my heart goes out to you. We are all here for you whenever you need to talk xx


----------



## Lucie73821

Unlucky41 said:


> Lucie73821 said:
> 
> 
> Hi ladies, do you mind if I join? As you can see in my sig, I've been TTC since August 2009. We've had 1 ivf bfn, ivf in Dec 2012 ended with both embryos implanting in my right tube (something my dr said he'd never seen in all 26 years of practice), and found out Thursday that our 3rd ivf has ended with an ectopic in my left tube (my dr said he's also never had a patient have back to back ectopics). I was given methotrexate yesterday and won't know until Thursday if it has worked.
> 
> I'm just having a really hard time right now. :(
> 
> Lucie so sorry for your lost :hugs:. Welcome to the thread. Your story sounds so much like Sarah. It seems like so much bad luck. What did your RE say the reason for these ectopics ?
> 
> How were your cycles? Did you get good quality blastocysts?
> 
> Really hope you are okay !!!Click to expand...


My re said that ectopics happen in 2-3% of ivf. His practice has a 1% ectopic rate. Well I guess I've ruined his average now. He also explained that it is physically impossible to put the catheter with the embryos into your tubes. He explained that the opening to your tubes is 10 times smaller than the catheter. He said unfortunately, sometimes the embryos just don't stay where they are placed. 

My last two cycles seemed to go well. I did have fewer eggs this past cycle, but that could be due to the fact that I am now 35. In the cycle that ended in a double ectopic I had 2 grade a (highest being grade a+) embryos put back, and this past cycle I had 2 grade a and one grade b put back. 

With the double ectopic cycle the doctor told me the methotrexate had an 85% success rate, and it failed to work as well. Maybe I'm just really, really, really unlucky.


----------



## bugs

Hi Lucie welcome to our thread so sorry for what you have been through. I remember reading about your double ectopic and having had my 1st IVF result in ectopic and the loss of my tubes my heart really went out to you so I can't even imagine what it must be like to have it happen again. 

My consultant thought it would be best to remove both of my tubes as they were both damaged beyond repair. We haven't got there yet but are hopeful that we will eventually the same as all us ladies in this thread. 

Hope everyone is well xxxx


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## africaqueen

Lucie- Welcome and i am so sorry for your losses. I also had 2 ectopics within 6mths of eachother in 2010 and lost both my tubes so know how devastating it is and my thoughts are with you x

Hi to all the ladies x

AFM- Omg ladies, my best friend just told me she's pregnant. I am happy for her of course but i am sat here crying my eyes out with jealousy and so sad for myself. That is ALL my friends now that have kids. She was the only one i could complain to an she kinda got how i felt as she has been ttc for a year but now this news has changed everything and tbh i dont know how to cope?? i feel less of a woman with every pregnancy announcement as its something my shitty body just cant manage and now my best friend being pregnant means i cant just avoid her or pregnancy talk and its going to tear me apart as i am heartbroken its not me. I know that sounds so selfish but omg i am in bits. She was the one person i could be with and not have to talk children or pregnancy and thats gone now and i am the only one amongst my friends who is a complete and utter failure :(


----------



## bugs

AQ I'm sorry to hear that your feeling low. I am the last out of my group of friends in work to have a baby and it is hard but our time will come and no baby will be more loved and more cherished than ours. 

As my other half says to me once we shut our front door it's just us and as long as we can cope and enjoy what we have in our lives nothing else matters. 

Keep your chin up Hun you'll be fine xxxx


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## africaqueen

Thanks Clare. You are so strong. I am starting to lose it tbh. Too many emotions going round my head. Not a good week. Build up of everything tbh. Tax took half my wages due to error they made ages ago, Friday is the 1st anniversary of my friend Jane's death, my friend Ann has cervical cancer and has a radical hysterectomy on the 11th and now yet more pregnancy news. Feeling super low. Wish my mum was here for a 'mum cuddle' :( life is crap xxx


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## Lucie73821

AQ, I'm sorry you are feeling low. We are the only couple in our group of friends not to have children. We are still able to have fun with them, but it's just not the same. 

:hugs:


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## africaqueen

Thanks Lucie, Its just not the same is it? being the 'odd couple' out :( how are you feeling? i hope the shot works. Thinking of you xxx


----------



## Lucie73821

africaqueen said:


> Thanks Lucie, Its just not the same is it? being the 'odd couple' out :( how are you feeling? i hope the shot works. Thinking of you xxx

Feeling ok. Having some side effects from the shot, mostly fatigue and abdominal pain. Anxious for Thursday, that's when I will find out if the shot has worked.


----------



## africaqueen

I hope the shot has worked. My ectopics were too advanced so i lost both tubes and would of done anything to of kept one just to have a small chance of pregnancy but sadly not. Hope fate is a little kinder to you. Ectopics are cruel enough, esp to have two and even more so after IVF ;( xxx


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## Sandy83

Morning Ladies

Hope you are all doing well :hugs:

Lucie, Fx'd for Tomorrow :hugs:

AFM, got my dates to start in the new year. Will start Buserelin on 11th Jan and looking for ER to be around 17th Feb. It's good to have a plan in place. Had my first acupuncture with my new clinic and feel so positive about going forward she was totally convinced that she can improve my chance dramatically. Very positive session and got herbal tea to drink twice a day for the next coming months. Got a session every week till we start again. Fx'd this time :hugs: xx


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## africaqueen

Lucie- Good luck for tomorrow. Thinking of you x

Sandy- That is great news that you have a good plan in place and that your raring to go again. All very positive x

Hi to Andrea, Jo, Bugs, Cvaeh and all the gang x

AFM- I am feeling a little better but still pretty low. I think its the complete lack of finances to cover another cycle that is soul destroying. We will safe every penny we can get from the new year and hope to god we manage another cycle by next Autumn and we WILL make sure we get there :) xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

Hi All,

I have slowly recovered from my sister's news. We talked once over the phone and it wasn't too bad however some baby talk!! She actually rang me to find out whether I wanted to do her booked parasailing as she obviously couldn't. To honest I rather be pregnant but I guess it is another day of distraction!! Every event now a days can be fun but short lived!! 

Sandy really happy for you new plan and something to look forward to. Sarah really hope next year is it for you financially, good quality eggs everything :hugs:

What is everyone doing this weekend?

how is the acupuncture going?


----------



## Lucie73821

Hi all, 

Well my level only fell 100 something, not the 15% they were hoping for. The NP contacted the re (who is on the west coast until Sat) and since I am stable, he wants to wait until Mon and do another beta. So I'm still in limbo. :(


----------



## africaqueen

Jo- Know exactly what you mean. I have fun days but once im home it all becomes done and dusted and my inner emptiness creeps in again x

Lucie- I am sorry you are still in limbo. I hope Monday brings some peace of mind one way or another x

Hi to all the gang xxx


----------



## bugs

Well it must be in the water, I've just had the dreaded phonecall from my sister she's pregnant. I'm a little peeved as she wasn't trying and her husband isn't my favourite person at the minute but she is older than me and it would be just awful on my mum if she was to have problems like me so if anything it takes the pressure of me a little xxxx


----------



## cvaeh

Hi everyone

Hope everyone is okay. 
Africa i can totally understand where your coming from. All our friends and collegues seem to be announcing their pregnancies even though they have only been together five minutes. We have been together ten and married for five years and it just doesn't seem fair. 
Lucie- hope all turns out okay for you.

Afm- we had our appointment with donation team this week. A lot to think about. We need to decide whether to spend nine thousand on an exclusive donor or six on an egg share. Neither one guarantees mature eggs. We are swinging for egg share as we have never been told that it is definitely my eggs just that it probably is. Oh i hate decisions x x x x


----------



## bugs

Cveah wouldn't you consider abroad for donor eggs, it's much cheaper and the clinic I use only use proven donors so they know how they will respond with egg sharing in this country they only run a few basic tests, some poor women ended up with half of my shitty eggs. I don't even know why they let me egg share with my history but they did. 

Just something else for you to think about xxxx


----------



## Unlucky41

bugs said:


> Well it must be in the water, I've just had the dreaded phonecall from my sister she's pregnant. I'm a little peeved as she wasn't trying and her husband isn't my favourite person at the minute but she is older than me and it would be just awful on my mum if she was to have problems like me so if anything it takes the pressure of me a little xxxx

Oh I totally understand how you feel!!! It really hit me when my sister gives me her parasailing ticket as she no longer does it and says I should be thankful for getting it for free !!! Excuse me I rather be pregnant than distract myself with all these outings that only last for a little while. She was so insensitive to be honest!! :hugs: Good thing you can see the good side of it all my sister is younger slightly and they have been living in different states hence only see each other once a month. Seriously how unfair is this life :growlmad::growlmad:

Hope you have a good weekend though.

cvaeh if you go with an exclusive donor can you see their track history ? as in how many successful embryos have they given others? 

Sarah I pray that our emptiness one day soon gets filled with something so joyful. Pray that God actually listens and says yes instead of wait. I am so sick of waiting.


----------



## Lucie73821

I had more bloodwork done today. Just heard from the doctor and my numbers are falling appropriately. So now I will go every Monday until my levels go to 0. Hopefully it won't take too long. 

Hope everyone is well.


----------



## africaqueen

Clare- Its always hard isnt it. Hearing someone close to you is preg cos we can't just ignore it like with others... its hard. We will get there one day x

Cvaeh- If it comes to us having a DE cycle we will go abroad as cheaper. Would be nice to have treatment here so we have our home comforts but financially we just couldnt afford and as Bugs said, this country arent proven donors like abroad. Good luck with whatever you decide x

Jo- Yes i hope god grants our one wish and allows us joy in our lifetime x

Lucie- I am glad your numbers are falling but so sorry your going through this x

Hi Andrea and all the gang x

AFM- I am just trying to focus on my weight loss and on getting fitter atm. I got my 3 stone award last week at slimming class. Iv lost that since May, but in total iv lost more :) getting there. xxx


----------



## cvaeh

Bugs and Africa- we have looked into donor abroad but i would only go for a clinic that had links with a local clinic just coz i am such a stress head. We looked into the clinic Mr kingsland is linked with in Cyprus and it works out a similar price to doing it here. I know they use younger donors and their success rates are higher but if i am stressed out with not being at home think it will be less successful for me. Also they have said we can ask if they are proven or not when we get a match and can choose to go with them or not.

Lucie- hope things get back to normal for you.

I had to laugh today as one of my class in complete innocence put his hand on my tummy and said hello little baby. If only he knew how much i would love that to be true. X x x x


----------



## africaqueen

Cvaeh- I know what you mean. I think the main drawback for me is that ED here is not anonymous and if we did take that route i would not want it this way. Let me know how u get on x

Hi to all the gang xxx


----------



## MrsE75

Hi ladies so sorry I've been missing I got a sickness bug started earlier hours of Saturday. Let's just say I lost 8lbs or 4kg in one weekend!

Still not eating anywhere near properly or feel hungry so is kick started my pre festive diet!

I've also invested in a personal trainer twice a week for 2 months to get my weight down and fitter for a cycle next year. I figure if I can get down to about 1.5-2st loss then after that I can maintain myself until we can afford to cycle. I just need the kick up the bum and my prob isn't eating less or better I only every lose weight with gym work cos of my thyroid issues. 

I've thought about donor eggs but not ready for that just yet. But I would also go abroad for it cos of the issue of donors being able to find out later in life. Personally I wouldn't want that. I would also prob go to Spain cos I have olive skin and go very tanned. People always mistake me for Spanish or Italian with my dark features. 

Glad we all seem to be doing ok who is the next to cycle?


----------



## Unlucky41

MrsE75 said:


> Hi ladies so sorry I've been missing I got a sickness bug started earlier hours of Saturday. Let's just say I lost 8lbs or 4kg in one weekend!
> 
> Still not eating anywhere near properly or feel hungry so is kick started my pre festive diet!
> 
> I've also invested in a personal trainer twice a week for 2 months to get my weight down and fitter for a cycle next year. I figure if I can get down to about 1.5-2st loss then after that I can maintain myself until we can afford to cycle. I just need the kick up the bum and my prob isn't eating less or better I only every lose weight with gym work cos of my thyroid issues.
> 
> I've thought about donor eggs but not ready for that just yet. But I would also go abroad for it cos of the issue of donors being able to find out later in life. Personally I wouldn't want that. I would also prob go to Spain cos I have olive skin and go very tanned. People always mistake me for Spanish or Italian with my dark features.
> 
> Glad we all seem to be doing ok who is the next to cycle?


MrsE75, I hope you are feeling better at least you lost weight when you are sick usually I gain for some reason although I don't eat too much !! How is your personal trainer? 

I am waiting for my period to come so we can then count down to my frozen embryo transfer. I know it is coming because my temperature is so low. Yes I know I am sad I made DH try this month although the chances are so low!!! I haven't ovulated naturally for ages hence I thought just give it a go obviously waste of time!!! 

How is everyone's weekend going?


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## bubumaci

Hello everyone :wave:
Well - back from vacation ... back to work *sniff*. Vacation was lovely and the time just flew by ... I could have stayed for so much longer *grin*

@ Lucie ... Hi :wave: I am sure I remember you from the IVF-May 2012 and onwards thread? I am so sorry that you have had to make your way here - although I am sure you will also feel as snug as a bug in a rug with this gang :hugs:

AFM - just made an "emergency" appointment for a quick scratch "biopsy" (in "" because it won't be sent in, just need the scratch before next stimming session) and am going in tomorrow morning. Have a sneaking suspicion that after having had crazy long cycles since April, AF is coming too early this time around. Will start stimming on CD3... kind of apprehensive, as I really need some good news this year, after the awful 2013 I've had. DH's nephew is due to come 24th ... (well, I guess he is my nephew too) so that, plus it being Mama's "birthday" today ... feeling a bit emotional...

I feel this thread needs a good sprinkling:

:dust::dust::dust:

:)


----------



## Unlucky41

Welcome back Bub, how was the holiday? What was he highlight?
Love your work with the sprinkling. 

Definitely need a bit of luck. My RE called today and told him he made a mistake and we were suppose to have a endometrial disruption last month. He told me he suggest we go ahead with the FET as the endometrial disruption is all experimental and 90% of the success just rest on the embryo. I just don't get it how can a RE make such a big mistake. I called them last month to make an appointment he told his receptionist to tell me to call in one months time. Today he tells me we should have done it last month. He makes me mad!! 

Anyway need to start thinking positive hope this transfer works.


----------



## Sandy83

Hi Ladies

Just thought I'd pop in to say hello, been stalking but not posting as nothing new to report here. Sounds like a few of you ladies will be starting your next cycle very soon. Look forward to getting updates on these. Hope you are all well :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

The holiday was lovely, thank you!
I guess there were several highlights (2x Disney Parks, 1x Cirque du Soleil, 1x Universal, 1x Kennedy Space Center) - but for me, the highlight was meeting my cousin's three children (one just turned 9, the next turns 7 in January and the youngest turns 4 in February) ... we babysat James (smallest) one several times, played with him in the pool - and it really was lovely, finally meeting her children. I don't get to see my cousin that often, but we are very close and she was my Matron of Honour at our wedding (and I read at hers back in 2000). And spending time with my Uncle (who did come over to Budapest and we were together when my Mother died in May) and Aunt. It was so good being with family! Here in Germany, I am alone (well, DH + his family, but that's not the same) - my Father and his folks are in England, Stepdad is in Budapest, Grandma (Mama's Mum) is in Budapest ... Aunt + Uncle in Cyprus, Uncle + Family in New Zealand, in South Africa .... need I say more? So I was like a sponge, trying to absorb having family around me.

That's really bad, that they got it wrong with the disruption (which is what I'm having done). I had one in March before my April FET and one in June before my July stimming cycle - our RE really wanted us to do it, he believes that there is a strong correlation between the scratch and the implantation success ... but your RE is right, it is still experimental and pretty much all is up to the embryo, hormone levels and lining. Don't let your head hang - just believe :) :)

:dust::dust::dust:


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## Unlucky41

Hi Sandy,

Good to hear from you? How are things going with you? How are the acupuncture treatment going?

Bub so glad you have a great holiday - I love Disney land and theme parks. That is great that you can remain close to your relatives even though you are don't live close by. Was it hard to babysit the 4 year old? Must be heaps active? Family time is so important I am glad you could soak up the love.

It sounds like our RE thinks like. I guess we had an option to go ahead or not but with my endometriosis I thought better go ahead with the transfer + I kind of like the idea that we have a chance to be pregnant at xmas. 

When is your next disruption ? Does it hurt ?


----------



## Sandy83

Unlucky41 said:


> Hi Sandy,
> 
> Good to hear from you? How are things going with you? How are the acupuncture treatment going?

I'm good enjoying the break from IVF and looking forward to Xmas. I'm loving the acupuncture having a treatment a week which is lovely. Got some not so nice tea to drink tho!!!!!!!

I've got my Fx'd for you to be pregnant for Xmas what an amazing present that would be!!!!!! I do believe things happen for a reason :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Hey Jo :)

Well, Uncle and Aunt (so Grandpa + Grandma) were there two - but we just mainly kept him occupied + played. In between, he was allowed to watch a kiddies programme and he would also fall asleep in the swivel chair. He loved it when we played with him in the pool :) DH is called Flo - and when James (kiddo) would arrive, he would yell "BubuFlo" and nothing else was of interest to him :D In the pool I started doing the "motorboat" with him ... also lifting out of the pool and whirling him around. After that he would shout "make my feet cold" :)

It was fun and very active - but he was also able to go in his room and play with lego + occupy himself too :)

I had the scratch biopsy today. The first time in March really hurt - in July I barely felt it and today it did hurt for a bit, but was over very quickly.

Picked up all my medicine today at the pharmacy - so come AF and three days in I start stabbing the belly again ...

Hey Sandy - I am doing the acupuncture too :) Has been fortnightly, but now that we are "going again" weekly - and I get to drink the tea too *lol*

My hopes are for good Christmas news too ... something good has to happen in 2013, doesn't it?

:dust: and :hugs: to you all


----------



## Unlucky41

Hi All,

Today has been traumatising!! The train that I was on hit a guy and the train next to us dragged the body a few metres. The train was stopped and we were kicked out. When I got out I looked where everyone was pointing at and you see a pair of legs under the train! 

Couldn't believe I saw part of the dead body!! 

Anyway hoping all my bad luck is out of the way. First blood test and scan in 4 days time. 

Has anyone had a natural FET before? What should I expect?


Hope everyone is well :hugs::dust::dust: To all


----------



## bubumaci

Oh Jo, I am so sorry you had that experience! It is very traumatising and I can't bear to think how the train drivers are! Or the families of the man :(

I have never had a natural FET. For my FETs we always monitored when I ovulated, then a day later the embies were thawed and four days after that transferred (and I started the progesterone after ovulation and carried on until the second beta).

A lady on my IVF/ICSI thread had a natural FET and basically, she monitored at home using OPKs when she ovulated and then based on that, the embies were thawed and then transferred and she had no additional medication. Not sure if that is how the natural FET always works, but that is how she explained it.

Are you having a natural FET?

Well, AF trundled in yesterday, so I popped to the endicrinologist this morning to have blood drawn (to make sure they have the blood test results before I start stimming) and tomorrow morning I start the belly-jabbing again... Please keep fingers and toes crossed for me :)

:howdy: and :dust::dust::dust: to everyone.


----------



## Unlucky41

Yep keeping everything cross for us both!!! 

I am going to have a blood test this coming Monday so your Tuesday hence will ask all my questions then. We were suppose to have a debrief from our RE however because he stuffed up the disruption I am just doing whatever the nurses tells me. 

I am seriously going crazy though -I keep thinking of the both scenarios in my head over and over. 1) ofcourse being pregnant and how exciting it would be 2) how sad I would be if it is another BFN. Am I going mad?
3) identical twins and then I am done haha no more internal scans etc ok getting ahead of myself here.

Going parasailing tomorrow celebrating 9 years of marriage - keeping the distraction so time goes faster :hugs::hugs: to all


----------



## bubumaci

Actually, you're ahead of me Jo, so when you are getting your blood test on Monday, it will still be Sunday here ;) Or if it is Monday afternoon, then it will be the early hours of Monday :)

Will you be transferring two? It would be pretty amazing, if one of the eggies splits and you get identical twins! Otherwise, and you to get pregnant with twins, then you will most likely be looking at fraternal twins (i.e. twins from two separately fertilised eggs, as opposed to identical twins coming from one egg that has split into two) :)

Sweetie, you are not going mad. I have been playing millions of scenarios in my head too! By this time next month, I will will either be over the moon, or just utterly disappointed by the hand dealt me by fate. Being the positive beings we are : we can look forward to being over the moon, right? :)

Congratulations on 9 years of marriage :) Enjoy the parasailing (I would be too chicken) :)


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## Unlucky41

Yes first blood test this Monday hence your Sunday. I ovulate late though so I think we maybe about the same time when we actually transfer. :flower:

We are only allowed to transfer one per my RE and in most cases I wouldn't be happy with this however given this is our last try I would like to prolong the hope for some more time before taking drastic measures.

Yep how cool would it be it the embrie splits and we are both pregnant with identical twins?? Lucky dreaming is for free right and it keeps us going. Yesterday yet another person asked me whether wanted kids my answer it all depends on God 

What you doing this weekend? Parasailing may get cancel due to the bad weather but hoping it doesn't get cancel


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## africaqueen

Andrea- Welcome back and i am glad you had a lovely holiday and enjoyed spending time with your family :) x

Jo- Wishing you tons of luck for your FET! got no advice regards that cos we never got any frosties on any of our cycles so its a strong lil embie! ;) So sorry you witnessed such a distressing event. How very sad x

Sandy- Nice to see you pop in. I am similar to you. I don't post very often as nothing to contribute really but nice to see others due to start their next cycles. Just wish i had a start date too but all depends on money sadly x

Hi to Bugs, Cvaeh, MrsE and all the gang x

AFM- I have felt really down the past fews days as learnt that my friends 13yr old niece is 7mths pregnant!?! seems even kids i held as babies are getting preg before me and its really upset me. As time goes on i am seeing pregnancy and babies as things that only ever happen to other woman and not something that is ever going to happen for me which sounds bleak but its how i feel. xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

africaqueen said:


> Andrea- Welcome back and i am glad you had a lovely holiday and enjoyed spending time with your family :) x
> 
> Jo- Wishing you tons of luck for your FET! got no advice regards that cos we never got any frosties on any of our cycles so its a strong lil embie! ;) So sorry you witnessed such a distressing event. How very sad x
> 
> Sandy- Nice to see you pop in. I am similar to you. I don't post very often as nothing to contribute really but nice to see others due to start their next cycles. Just wish i had a start date too but all depends on money sadly x
> 
> Hi to Bugs, Cvaeh, MrsE and all the gang x
> 
> AFM- I have felt really down the past fews days as learnt that my friends 13yr old niece is 7mths pregnant!?! seems even kids i held as babies are getting preg before me and its really upset me. As time goes on i am seeing pregnancy and babies as things that only ever happen to other woman and not something that is ever going to happen for me which sounds bleak but its how i feel. xxx

Hi Sarah :hugs::hugs:, 

I totally understand how you feel. Life just doesn't feel fair. Can't believe she got pregnant at 13 years she is still a child and probably doesn't understand what is going on however this would make her grow up too fast and may also have bad implications for he future. 

Today I went for a walk and I just started crying. :cry::cry: I couldn't help it - I was just thinking of all my friends and how they all have pretty much completed their families already. At lunch today my mum couldn't stop talking about my sister. 'She expects you to get her flowers for her graduation since you are not going' 'She is coming back on the 5th December to see the specialist, I wonder what they going to check do you know ' 'She is really stressed at the moment I hope she is ok being pregnant and all' 

Really I know she is pregnant and I am not so can you just leave me alone. Mothers they just don't know when to shut up sometimes so I had to tell her simply - I don't know and I don't care 

Tomorrow will be my first scan and blood test. Hope the lining is okay and we don't have another month cancel. Going shopping now really want to get the xmas presents done before the mad rush.


----------



## africaqueen

Jo- Big hugs xx Its sucks all of this! when is god going to grant our hearts desire?! i was lucky with my mum as she always said the right things as she knew how i felt having ttc for 10yrs to have me. God i miss her. I could cope better when she was alive. Life is bloody unfair! lets hope that 2014 see's us happy cos i don't know about anyone else but i have got to the point where i go through the motions. I get up, dressed, go to work, put a happy face on, try to do the same for my dad and my hubby but inside i am just broken and empty. xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

africaqueen said:


> Jo- Big hugs xx Its sucks all of this! when is god going to grant our hearts desire?! i was lucky with my mum as she always said the right things as she knew how i felt having ttc for 10yrs to have me. God i miss her. I could cope better when she was alive. Life is bloody unfair! lets hope that 2014 see's us happy cos i don't know about anyone else but i have got to the point where i go through the motions. I get up, dressed, go to work, put a happy face on, try to do the same for my dad and my hubby but inside i am just broken and empty. xxx

I know if only we knew when it would happen we can safe guard our emotions. Sarah so sad that you no longer have you mum around, I guess I can relate as I lost my dad when I was in year 12. Losing someone that really loves you so early really does hurt heaps!! 

Definitely know what you are talking about I am so not motivated at work and when you catch up with friends and they go what have you been up to? I would go noting much so old because basically nothing has changed no new job no family and no holiday. Everything has gone into the 5 ivf cycles :cry::cry:

How was you weekend? Are you feeling better ?


----------



## bubumaci

Hello everyone!

Just wanted to send some positive vibes to you all for the new week! (Nothing new to report from me ... Nephew is due since yesterday, so I guess any day now... did heaps of shopping for the little guy in Florida...).

Tomorrow I will be going for the first u/s and b/w since I started stimming - see whether I have to start injecting Orgalutran tomorrow as well, or whether I have to wait another day.
I am praying that this cycle my progesterone stays down enough for us to be able to do a fresh transfer! We agreed with the doctor that this time around, if he felt that the progesterone is too high, that we won't do a transfer.

:dust::dust::dust:


----------



## Unlucky41

Thanks for the positive vibes. I thought high progesterone is good? Why is it bad for transfer? All the best the journey now starts!! :dust::dust:

Had my first blood test and scan. lining 6mm and there see 4 follicles at however no dominant one yet. Going in tomorrow for just a blood test - will ask when they think my transfer with be.


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## bubumaci

In the luteal phase, high progesterone is good, because it "protects" pregnancy until the placenta can produce its own (is produced by the corpus luteum after ovulation). Pro = for / supporting & Gest = gestation.
However, if the levels go too high prior to ovulation, it may cause the lining to mature too early, which can negatively impact implantation.

Doctor said that he has all intentions of doing a fresh transfer and a close eye will be kept on the progesterone. He doesn't want me injecting the antagnist GnHR until tomorrow. Next u/s + b/w are on Saturday morning and it is almost definite that I will be triggering on Saturday, at the latest Sunday (so most likely ER on Monday, latest Tuesday). Lining he said looked very good.

If you have no dominant follicle yet, I don't think they will be able to tell you transfer date - but perhaps the bloodwork will give more information :) What CD are you? I look forward to hearing that one is dominant :)

:dust::dust::dust:

Hi everyone :hugs:


----------



## cvaeh

Just popping on to say hello. Nothing new to report here. 

Africa- i know exactly how you feel about getting up and going through the motions. I do try and shake myself out of it and try and remind myself of all the things that i do have. I was three days late this month, i really thought i was one of the miracles for a few days. It has been so long though like you it feels like something that happens to everyone else.

Hope everyone else is good x x x


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## africaqueen

Jo- I am sorry to hear you lost your dad so young too. Life sucks sometimes :( Glad your scan went well and your lining is nice and thick and hope u get some dominant follicles soon, and this cycle is the one x

Andrea- So glad all going well so far and not long until egg collection! whoop whoop. Everything crossed for you x

Cvaeh- I am sorry we are going through this. Its awful. I truly hope you get your miracle too x

To all the ladies that still have all their 'bits'... my friend who ttc for 8yrs and went through 4 cycles of IVF, finally got success on her last cycle and had her DD who is now one and today she announced she was 3mths pregnant NATURALLY! So if you have the 'equipment' miracles can and do happen so don't lose all hope. She honestly thought she would never be a mum and now baby no.2 on the way with no IVF either ;) i know its rare but it DOES happen. xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

Thanks Sarah for the lovely story. I really hope that miracles does happen but I keep thinking it will never happen to me though. 

Cvaeh I sorry you didn't get your miracle. I too long that a miracle would happen every time I ovulate naturally. Dreaming is for free right !

:dust::dust::dust::dust::dust: to everyone hope those who can get your natural miracle.

No real update except the nurse did say I am not close to ovulation hence probably have to wait another two more weeks.


----------



## bubumaci

Jo, how long are your cycles normally?


----------



## africaqueen

Ladies i have now lost almost 60lbs in weight and got my BMI to under 30! such a achievement for me as i have struggled with comfort eating so much! i have gone down 4 clothes sizes and i am so much fitter ) im soooo happy. Still a way to go but i am more than half way to target xxx


----------



## MrsE75

AQ - wowozzzzzers that's is such an amazing achievement fantastic and so happy for you. Congratulations!!!! I am on a diet and fitness and I was happy I've lost a stone or 14lbs in the last 3.5 wks but your weight loss has blown me out the water!! How long did that take you?

I've got another stone/14 ins to lose but ideally I want to lose another 20lbs and Christmas is coming!! Oh dear that's going to be a challenge!!


----------



## bubumaci

Sarah - that is a fantastic achievement!! Congratulations!

Just got on the scales this morning and was dismayed - OK, so I am stuffing hormones into myself and it does happen every time - the scales showed nearly 2 kg more! It is really tough, each time I stim, I swell up and look like a whale and afterwards, the water doesn't go away, it converts to fat - so since I started last year, I have "swelled" quite a bit.

But I know I am doing this all for a reason and even though I am not happy with looking like pressed sausage in anything I put on (haven't restocked my wardrobe - still have the stuff I wore before I started stimming ... in fact, still have my stuff from about a decade ago! - I keep hoping that I will lose it all again and don't want to start spending money on clothes) ... but if the rainbow miracle is the result - then I will do anything!!

:hugs: to you ladies out there :)


----------



## Unlucky41

bubumaci said:


> Jo, how long are your cycles normally?

Hmmm last cycle my o day was day 20 but I think any time from day 17 to day 20 I think. I hope that is not bad!! The only thing is they are making me take a blood test every two days :( Tomorrow is my third one!

How many days have you been stimming ? when is your first US? 

Sarah amazing I am too a sucker for good food and anything sweet !!! I would like to lose another 10 pounds still but find it so hard. You have inspired me back to the gym tomorrow :flower:


----------



## bubumaci

And what CD are you now?

Today is my 7th day stimming. First u/s + b/w was two days ago, on the 5th day. I started injecting the antagonist yesterday. Saturday, day 9 (CD11) I have my next u/s and blood work and will most likely be triggering. At the latest, on Sunday, the doctor said. So ER either Monday / Tuesday next week. Still keeping my finger crossed that progesterone stays down, so we can do a fresh transfer. Wednesday, so CD7, it was the lowest that it has been since I have been getting the treatment, when compared to all the other CD7s / stimming 5s - so I am hopeful that maybe the chinese medicine and the acupuncture are supporting that too?? He also said that my lining was looking very good. :) :)


----------



## Unlucky41

bubumaci said:


> And what CD are you now?
> 
> Today is my 7th day stimming. First u/s + b/w was two days ago, on the 5th day. I started injecting the antagonist yesterday. Saturday, day 9 (CD11) I have my next u/s and blood work and will most likely be triggering. At the latest, on Sunday, the doctor said. So ER either Monday / Tuesday next week. Still keeping my finger crossed that progesterone stays down, so we can do a fresh transfer. Wednesday, so CD7, it was the lowest that it has been since I have been getting the treatment, when compared to all the other CD7s / stimming 5s - so I am hopeful that maybe the chinese medicine and the acupuncture are supporting that too?? He also said that my lining was looking very good. :) :)


Well I am 14 days now however I don't think I will ovulate until Wednesday next week. We may be the exact same timing next factor into my Wednesday is your Tuesday ehh ?? how exciting. How many follicles did you see last scan ? Was lining a problem for you in the past? what level does your RE want to see your progesterone at ?

Natural is very relaxing but I wish I ovulate soon !!!


----------



## bubumaci

Ah, OK.
Well, you are 10 hours ahead of me (you're NSW, right?). So if I have my ER Monday morning, it would still be your Monday, just your evening :) Or if my ER is on Tuesday morning, then it will be your Tuesday evening :) But yes, more or less the same time :) Do you usually O around CD 19?

On Tuesday, I didn't get an exact count. I saw 3-4 larger antral follies on my right ovary. My left ovary tends to hide for the u/s, so we saw a few follies, but I didn't get a count. They were all still quite small, around 5-6mm. But I will know tomorrow morning where I am.
My lining has always been very good, never had an issue with it.
I am not sure of the exact value, but I think they want it under 1,8 a couple of days before ER (certainly under 2). In July, I was at 2,3.
Last time, CD7 was 1,00 ... CD 11 was 1,10 ... and CD 12 was 2,3!! And they had me triggering CD13.
My blood test on Tuesday showed me at 0,59 - so quite a bit lower than last round (which also was the highest I had been, I looked at all my CD7 results) - but this week's is the lowest I have ever been, so I hope that is a good sign :)


----------



## africaqueen

Thanks ladies. I am glad i have my weight under control now. Iv lost 3 stone 4lb since end of May this year and the rest came off slowly from 2010. 

Sad news ladies. My marriage is over. My husband and i have been issues for a long time and his lack of support lately has been soul destroying, plus many other factors i would rather not go into but sadly this has resulted in our marriage being over and he is going to start looking for somewhere to live next week. I am devastated and obviously takes away any chance of me being a mummy too. My life is not what i thought it would be. I am so sad, but cannot live with no support anymore and his attitude is just awful. Nobody else is involved. No affairs etc, just me being worn down with emotional trauma.
I wish every one of you the best of luck and i will pop in now and again to check on your progress. Good luck ladies and i am so heartbroken i won't be joining you any longer on this journey xxxxx


----------



## Unlucky41

It is looking good so far for you then bub. Hopefully you get to see heaps of good quality follicles at your next scan and your progesterone levels stay down!! Are you feeling any sign effects yet? how often do you go for acupuncture now? How many embryos will you be transferring?

Wishing you heaps of :dust::dust::dust:i 

No signs of O yet hence I think I will be O close to day 19 or 20 consistent to last month.

Went parasailing yesterday and dh got sick how romantic haha
:wacko: Just booked a nice 5 course degustation for new years eve - being positive so we can celebrate if we have a reason too!!


----------



## bugs

Sarah I am so sorry to hear this, I think sometimes infertility makes you hang onto things because the fear of what you are losing is too great. But you know what I'm sure your future holds great things for you and I'm certain you'll be back on these boards fighting for your dream. 

Much love and stay strong xxxx


----------



## bubumaci

Oh Sarah, I am desperately sorry for you!!! That is so heartbreaking :( I have no other words, really I am so sad for you! :( :( Much love and strength to you xxx

@ Jo - scan today went OK - he wants me to stim for two more days instead of triggering tonight (Saturday) - the follies hadn't reached the size he wants (we have around 11 - ranging from 5 mms to just under 20 mms - so I am already feeling quite sore and as though my abdomen is full of golf balls). So triggering Monday night, ER on Wednesday and transfer on Monday 9th. Acupuncture is weekly and we will be transferring 2 embies. 

I'm sorry to hear that DH got sick on your romantic parasailing trip :( Hope he has fully recovered now!


----------



## MrsE75

AQ sweetheart I'm so incredibly sorry it has come to this. I know things were not great after one of your cycles and you were trying to get back on track I'm just sorry the track didn't take you to where you planned. Nothing anyone can say to you other than I'm sure that there is a greater plan for you and a greater purpose. Never know with the new body may come a new relationship in the future. Whatever you do I wish you lots of luck, take courage from your experiences and make life count it's what your mum would have wanted for you I'm sure. Big hugs xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

Hi Sarah,

heaps and heaps of :hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:
So sorry to hear this news !!! Relationships are hard at the best of times and after all these trials of infertility it just doesn't seems fair. I really really hope you have a good support group over there - close friends and family. Whatever your future holds whether reconciliation with your husband or something else I wish you get some peace and happiness as soon as possible.

Bub - I don't have the best of news - my blood work shows that my estrogen levels are too low hence may have to cancel this cycle if it doesn't improve in two days time. 

It sounds like your cycle is going well !Have you gain any weight from all the golf balls ? ha-ha how is your hormone levels going ?
Wishing you all the :dust::dust::dust::dust:
Thanks about dh - he is quite sad about the possible delay of the cycle just the waiting is killing us!!


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## Sandy83

Sarah, So so sorry to hear your news, the whole infertility process is a strain on even the strongest relationships :hugs: I'm with the other ladies whatever your future holds i'm sure you will find happiness and strength and hopefull one day in the very near future join the TTC world again. :hug:

Unlucky, Got my fx'd for you and hoping your levels increase so you don't have to cancel your cycle :hugs: 

Bub, sounds like things are going good so far not long now for ER how exciting can't wait to here how many eggs you get :happydance:

Hope the rest of you ladies are doing well and starting to get into the christmas spirit. :xmas6:

Nothing new to report for me just got a weekend in Manchetser planned in 2 weeks to see the christmas market and finish christmas shopping :happydance: xx


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## bubumaci

Oh, Jo - I hope that your levels even out so that you don't have to cancel. But if you do (and I know it is hard) have to wait for the next cycle, take comfort in knowing that you haven't "wasted" a try. I do know how tough it is to have to postpone, really I do. But I am also sure that if you were to go ahead and the hormones etc. are not optimal - and it doesn't work - you will feel worse. My fingers are crossed that it does still work out for this cycle!!! :dust:

Maybe that is why it doesn't look like you are close to ovulation? If your E2 isn't rising that quickly, then your follies won't be maturing that quickly? But why can't they just adjust - if you are having a longer cycle this time? Or is it because the clinic will be closed over Christmas and any other time, it wouldn't matter?

AFM - u/s and b/w today went well. Looks like we have 10 perfect follies, lining looks perfect and my b/w is showing nice levels of everything too .. progesterone seems to be behaving itself :) So I have to inject the trigger shots tonight, at 11pm and again at midnight. ER appointment is 8:30 Wednesday morning (well, that's when I have to be there ... the ER itself will be later (have to get prepped etc.).

I guess now I have to start praying that our fertilisation rate is good. Until our last try, our fertilisation rates were amazing (considering the fact that DH has barely anything for them to pick from) - but our embryos were the best ever last time. I really hope that they fertilise nicely and -more than anything else - develop well this time! *pray*

Sandy - sounds like a nice plan :) We went to a Christmas market yesterday (actually at the location we were married) and the weather was just gorgeous - so that was a nice little outing :)


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## Unlucky41

Thanks Sandy and Bub for the encouragement.

I emailed my RE today and he said we won't be cancelling they just have to pump some meds into me. :happydance: I just don't understand how the nurse got the wrong information though !! 

Sandy how much Christmas shopping do you need to do? I always get side track and buy things for myself haha 

Bub 10 follicles is great - good luck for your ER tomorrow pray for 10 matured good quality eggs and good quality sperms. :spermy: I Pray that you get an excellent fertilisation report !! This thread need some good news Bub and it will begin with you :hugs: Why do you need two trigger though? When is your beta ?


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## bubumaci

That's great news that you won't be cancelling Jo! Sounds promising :)

Hmm, I need to start on the Christmas shopping too *grin*

So... now long now, just one more sleep and then ER it is. Starting to feel quite sore, so I will be glad to have them retrieved. I really hope that they are all nice and mature and that the fertilisation report is good :)
It depends on what stimming protocol you are on. For the first three, I was on the standard antagonist report, triggering with 10.000 units of Predalon. In July, they put me on the Fischer-Scheme and had me triggering with Decapeptyl - and for whatever reason, it is split into two jabs, 1 hour apart. I also have to have an injection of Brevactid (HCG) the day of ER and the day of ET, as well as one more shot of Decapeptyl the day after transfer ...


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## Sandy83

Unlucky41 said:


> Thanks Sandy and Bub for the encouragement.
> 
> I emailed my RE today and he said we won't be cancelling they just have to pump some meds into me. :happydance: I just don't understand how the nurse got the wrong information though !!
> 
> Sandy how much Christmas shopping do you need to do? I always get side track and buy things for myself haha

Great news that they won't be cancelling :wohoo: It's annoying that the nurse got the information wrong :dohh:

I don't have much christmas shopping to do it's more of a christmas present to me and DH and spoil ourselves :blush: xx


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## Unlucky41

Bub how did your er go?


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## bubumaci

Hi Ladies!

Sorry for not posting yesterday! I was pretty sore and by the evening in quite a lot of pain. ER went very well - we retrieved 13 eggs. Unfortunately, DH's SA was very poor - practically no swimmers and what was there was not moving. So doctor suggested he give a second sample (even though we have 5 frozen straws). DH was totally upset and depressed...

But just now I received the results and am happy to announce, that of the 13 eggs, 11 were mature and 9 fertilised :happydance: Don't yet know whether it was the second sample, or whether that is from the frozen swimmers - but now I am just praying that our 9 develop nicely in the embryscope, so that we have some beautiful embybabies to transfer on Monday! :)


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## Sandy83

Great news bub :wohoo: xx


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## africaqueen

OMG Andrea what AMAZING news!! i pray this is your time and all looks positive so why not!? ;) x

Hi to all the gang x

AFM- Well after what has been a week from hell, my DH and i have finally sat down and talked things through(he lacks communication skills most of the time) and we are going to give our marriage another chance. The love is still there but we are drowning in sorrow and somehow need to stop letting this thing take us over. So we are going to enjoy the festivities and then from Jan we will be saving hard for another shot at getting our baby. Thank you all for supportive messages and i feel so much better. I think it was the wake up call we needed and i pray 2014 is kinder to us xxx


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## bubumaci

Sarah, that is wonderful news that you have been able to talk it out! TTC with all these issues is incredibly difficult and can take its toll on the best of marriages! It is very difficult to continue being supportive of each other, when there is so much hurt ... and when you feel you need all the energy just to keep going. 
I hope that you really will be able to keep the good communication going! Make sure you look after each other ... give each other tiny gifts - show the love ... go out ... we mustn't let ourselves be consumed.

Thank you for your prayers! Our retrieval and fertilisation reports in the past have always been really good ... the trouble is with the development of the embryos. So I am praying that they are snug as a bug in a rug in the embryoscope and developing well! Monday is not that far away ... Please keep fingers crossed for them :)

:dust::dust::dust: and hugs all around :) :hugs:


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## Unlucky41

Sarah this is wonderful news. Was praying for reconciliation between you and your husband. When you, are hurting so much we forget to appreciate what we have and focus on what we dont have. Have a great Christmas with dh and enjoy the gift of each other company.

Andrea bub hehe fantastic news nine embries. Dont tell me they dont give any updates on the progress? Are you still doing accupuncture?

AFM going for yet another blood test but I think my hormones are going up. Getting heaps of mucus hopefully ovulate on the w eekend and transfer next week. Sister had her 11 weeks scan and everything was fine :happydance

We all need alot of hugs today
:hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:


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## bubumaci

Well, I could call the lab to ask. I might do that on day three, to see how they are doing. But they won't contact me. In the past, I haven't known anything until I am in the room for transfer. Guess it doesn't really help worrying even more..

Glad to read that things are moving forward for you &#55357;&#56399;

:hugs: :hugs: :hugs:


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## africaqueen

Andrea- Thank you and yes it is so hard to remain strong after so much heartbreak but i guess we just live in hope don't we. I pray all goes well for us all, esp you as you are nearing being pupo and hopefully pregnant x

Jo- Hope your blood results are ok and wish you lots of luck too. Glad everything is well with your sis but know it must be hard for you so big ((hugs)) x

Hi to Clare, Heather, Sandy and all the gang and hope those in the UK are safe with these terrible floods and winds we are having. New brighton which is not far from us is terribly flooded but luckily nobody was hurt xxx


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## Unlucky41

Bub, you have heaps of patience I would definately ask day three get my expectations in check. How are you feeling now?

Today a big scare where my mum fell unconscious.she is okay now but it was nerve breaking!!!:cry:

Sarah how are things with the husband? Hopefully this incident has brought you closer. You dont know how much you love them til they are gone.:hugs:

AFM I finally ovulated today day 21. Transfer will be this coming wednesday. Two days behind you bub. Hopefully we can be pupo and pregnant together


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## africaqueen

Jo- Things are much better thank you. Looking forward to Christmas and a fresh new year with hopefully some luck along the way :) how are you feeling? excited about Wed? x

Andrea- Lots of luck for a smooth transfer tomorrow! let us know how it goes. x

Hi to all the gang. I went out last night on works Xmas night out and omg have i suffered today! i am getting too old! haha. Praying that next Christmas i cant drink cos im pregnant :) trying to be positive even though its so hard xxx


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## bubumaci

Heyho :)

Well... I didn't get my guts up enough to ring yesterday, but DH did. Three embies were a bit slow and behind, but 6 were right on track - so I promptly burst into tears! :)

Of course that hasn't stopped me being mega nervous today, worrying about how they are ... but I guess I will just have to wait until tomorrow now (transfer is at 4 pm).

Jo - looking forward to hearing about your transfer on Wednesday (that's great that you ovulated!!)... I would love nothing more than to have you as a bump buddy! :) xx I am sorry to hear about your Mum - is she OK now??

Sarah - Glad you enjoyed the Xmas do!! *hehe* ... and I pray for you that you will not be drinking next Christmas :) :) xxx


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## africaqueen

Andrea- That is AMAZING news! wow. We have only ever had 1 embryo on each cycle so if we were lucky enough to get 2 next time i would be over the moon but 6 is FAB! made up for you x


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## bubumaci

Thank you Sarah! I guess the reason I am still so tentative is because our retrieval and fertilisation rates so far have been really great ... just by the day of transfer, the embryo quality hasn't been good in the past (several "many-cells", a few Morulae and one or two blasts - beginning blasts, not well-advanced ones). In August at transfer, I was blown away that we had two beautiful blasts... and we know what happened there.

But I was beyond excited to hear yesterday, that 6 were actually on track for day 3 development yesterday :happydance: I am praying, that tomorrow I will have some beautiful embybabies for transfer...

:dust::dust::dust: for this thread :)


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## Unlucky41

Amazing Bub you have 6 good quality embryos!!! I never even got 6 embryos from all 5 of my cycles. Really hope tomorrow goes well Bub, you must feel relieved that there are so many on track and dividing!! 

I can't believe that we are just one day apart :flower::flower:

Are you going to do a hpt before you beta ? When is your beta date as well ?

:dust::dust::dust::dust::dust: can't have enough of these


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## bubumaci

:) Thank you Jo! Yep, that is why I burst into tears on Saturday when I heard... I have just been praying so hard and keeping my fingers crossed, that they all keep going :) A lot can happen in two days ;) But not long now ... a few hours and I will know. At 14:40 my time I have acupuncture and then at 4pm the transfer (usually ends up being quite a bit later, never punctual) - but today I will know, today I will have them in me :)

No, I won't do an HPT before my beta. They do Betas at my clinic at 6dp5dt and the follow-up at 9dp5dt - so on Sunday I will already be having the blood test. 

It has to work, right? I mean - here are our statistics so far : 

June 2012. Retrieved 14, 12 mature, 11 fertilised (6 frozen day 1)... 2 transferred - slightly raised HCG, but BFN
July 2012 - FET#1 - thawed three, transferred 2 ... BFN
August 2012 - FET#2 - thawed three, transferred 3 ... BFN
September 2012 - Retrieved 11, 10 mature, 7 fertilised (2 frozen day 1) ... 2 transferred - BFN
October 2012 - FET#3 - thawed two, transferred 2 ... BFN
February 2013 - Retrieved 23, 18 mature, 15 fertilised (10 frozen day 1, 5 taken to day 6 - 2 blasts frozen) OHSS no transfer
April 2013 - FET#4 - thawed 10 ... day of transfer thawed one blast - transferred 3 ... slightly raised HCG, BFN
July 2013 - Retrieved 12, 10 mature, 4 fertilised - transferred two perfect blasts ... raised HCG ... but went back down again - Chemical.

So - as you can see, (I know, I sound really ungrateful) we have had lots of eggies fertilise, but for some reason, they just don't develop well :( 
But you are all right ... it only takes one ... if only one (or two *grin*) could make it ... *praying so hard* ...

You all understand - when there have been so many failures, how heartbreaking it is ... how scary it is, not knowing, whether this time will work ... each time being devastated, when it doesn't ...

Could this be it? Once I am home, I will be updating you lovely ladies on how they have done and I beg of you, please pray that it / they nestle in and allow me to have my rainbow miracle!

:dust::dust::dust:


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## Sandy83

Good luck Bub, you will be pupo very soon :wohoo: xx


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## bubumaci

Puh ... am back :)

I am over the moon to announce, that I have two perfect blasts on board (A- is the grade they were given)! I couldn't believe it when the doctor said that we had two such perfect embababies to transfer! One is still going (was a Morula today) and if it keeps going, could be frozen tomorrow.

Thank you for your prayers ladies! Please, if you can, keep going ... first beta is in 6 days xxx <3


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## Unlucky41

Congrats bub you are PUPO with twins!:happydance

That is awesome that they are perfect grading. Now you can relax and enjoy the fact that your two little embries are safe at home. Wow your beta is really fast I am with you in relation to testing too scare.

I was thinking of swyping dropping by my old accupuncture place tommorrow but not sure if they have any availability. I think the best time to have it is after the ransfer. bub was it painful today? rest up and hope you get god news on sunday :dust::dust::dust::dust:


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## bubumaci

Thank you :hugs:
Acupuncture was OK today ... couple of spots hurt, but that passed quickly. She asked that I make an appointment tomorrow - so I will be getting jabbed tomorrow again ... but if that'll make these bubbas burrow, nestle and stick, then I will do anything!!

It can't hurt to see if they can fit you in somewhere! Give them a call?


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## africaqueen

Andrea- wonderful news! congrats on being pupo with twins!! so happy for you an pray this cycle brings your baby or babies x

Jo- TONS of luck for tomorrow! x

Hi to all the gang. Still nothing to contribute other than good luck wishes and support xxx


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## Unlucky41

So happy after one and a half hours I am finally pupo with one. They choice the hatching one rather than the expanded one but happy it was still alive. My beta is not until 23 dec hence if it doesn't work I will get my period by then.

Bub when is your beta? 

Thanks sarah for the encouragement. Hope we get our bfp before xmas!!:hugs:


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## bubumaci

Yay Jo! Wow - you had a hatching and expanding blast? That is fantastic!!! Congratulations on being PUPO - I am so excited for you!! :)

My first blood test is this coming Sunday *nervous* :hugs:

:dust::dust::dust:

And a big :howdy: to everyone :)


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## Unlucky41

Hi Bub,

I have been told that baby dancing around the time of your transfer helps to reduce your chance of having a miscarriage. Have you heard this before ?

Can't believe your beta is so soon? Let me know if you have any symptoms??

So hard to wait this out I just want to know but too scare as well if it doesn't work I know I will be devastated. This is the first blast I have ever transferred!!


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## bubumaci

Hey Jo!

Really? I have read that it is OK to DTD - but it is unadvisable for the woman to orgasm until the heartbeat has been seen. I hadn't heard that it helps reduce the chances of miscarrying - and to be honest, I wouldn't know why it should!

I am desperately trying not to SS - I have been feeling calm and happy, relaxed ... anything I do feel, I am trying not to think "could be it". For the past two days I have had pressure in my abdomen, my BBT shot up this morning and last night I dreamt that I received a super high HCG beta result. But I am just so used to hoping and then getting knocked down again when it doesn't work, that I am terrified to allow myself to hope. I really do have a good feeling about this time - but I daren't - if you know what I mean? In August, when it briefly worked, it was about this time (or perhaps one day later) that my breasts starting being super sore (waking me up) for a couple of days ... not having anything like that this time round... So I really don't want to think about it ... I am enjoying feeling the pressure in my abdomen, imagining that it's my baby/babies burrowing in ... but at the same time, trying not to hope (does that make sense)?

I have also been trying to send positive, warm thoughts to my abdomen, trying to funnel energy there, like egging them on to implant *lol*

It is hard waiting, wondering, has this worked - but the fact of the matter is, it's out of our hands ... try not thinking about how you will feel if it hasn't worked. Try to feel optimistic and positive ... you will deal with the results when you get them. In the meantime, enjoy being PUPO :)


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## bubumaci

Hi Ladies :howdy: - how is everybody today?

I was really upset when I woke up this morning - had another really vivid dream, but not as nice as yesterday's (where I dreamt that on Sunday we got super high HCG values) ... I dreamt that some doctors (no people I know) were telling us that there is no way we will ever be able to have a biological child of our own :(


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## Unlucky41

Yep Bub totally understand. My husband was going what should we name it if we have a boy. Half of me is excited and wanted to participate but half of me wanted to just not jinx it. It is so hard to put your hopes up too much right? 

The progesterone is definitely working with you with the vivid dreams and high temps. I always dream hence there is no difference. I have never had a dream where I have a live baby. There was once I had a baby but it stopped breathing so sad and scary :cry:

Wow your beta is so soon ! Very exciting I think we only have one 12 days after my transfer hence day17. I am confident that if it doesn't work my period should come right? 

It is finally weekend again which is good so tire of work. What is everyone doing?


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## Sandy83

Hi Ladies

So sorry to hear you are both not having very good dreams, but PMA all the way I've got everything crossed for both of you. As they say good things happen to those that wait and I think all us IVFer's have waited long enough!!!!! Looking forward to hearing your results :wohoo:

AFM nothing new to report just! I'm away with DH at the weekend for christmas shopping and some well overdue TLC, got a family christmas to look forward to my newphew's 1st so looking forward to that then start cycle on 11th Jan and fx'd I'll be where you guys are in no time :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Yes, it is very hard not to hope too much.
It is not that rare that I dream - I haven't dreamt much recently, at least, not that I remembered. These two were unbelievably vivid! It's amazing how we "believe" our dreams, that they are so realistic and how they can affect us emotionally!

Well - are you taking progesterone? If you are, then that would most likely prevent your period from coming - so I don't know if you would just get your period if you aren't pregnant... But we are thinking positively, right? :)

Tonight we are going to a friend's for winter-bbq, tomorrow a friend of ours is coming over for our annual "Love Actually" pre-Christmas watching session and on Sunday, well - in the morning I go for my beta.... *nervous*

How 'bout everybody else?


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## dovkav123

Hello ladies!

Bubumaci, IVF buddy!
Praying and hoping for good news on Sunday!
I really hope our embies will snuggle in and stay for 9 happy months!

I am 2dpo2dt I am not on the bed rest. Doing everything what feels right. We Even BD this cycle, hopefully spermies will help the embie mature. I beleave that orgasm only helps!
The day of ET I felt tiny uterine contraction
A day later a lit more activity around uterus.
These uterine contractions I had with failed IVF. Feeling pesimistic today.
Yesterday I did an HCG shot Brevactid and will do 2 more this week. It should help implantation. Dr. google said that HCG after ET helps with immunity response. Also on the drug slip I read that HCG helps to increase sperm quality!!!
Also pregnancy rate increases when HCG hormone is administered to the uterus before ET.

https://www.fertstert.org/article/S0015-0282(11)02619-7/abstract


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## bubumaci

Hi Dovkav!
Congratulations on being PUPO :) I had to have Brevactid injected - both on the day of ER and ET ... and I had to inject Decapeptyl (which I also used for my trigger shot) one day past ET. I wasn't sure what the Brevactid was for - but if it is supposed to aid implantation then *wohoo* :) Not quite sure how they went about interuterine injections - I just had a normal subcutane jab ...

As long as you feel comfortable with what you are doing, I think that is what is important.

A little sprinkling of :dust::dust::dust: for everybody :)

You enjoy your weekend Sandy, that sounds lovely, a weekend away with TLC :)


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## Unlucky41

Sandy - have fun with DH & sending you heaps of :dust::dust::dust::dust::dust::dust::dust: in advance for January !

Is this Christmas shopping all for you ? 

Dovkav congrats on being PUPO. My RE told us baby dancing around the time of transfer is good as well hence we listened and followed hopefully it makes a difference!! We have the same beta !!! 

Bub so excited for you beta tomorrow. Sending you heaps of :dust::dust::dust::dust::dust::dust::dust:. Be sure to update us as soon as you can with your good news.

AFM - 3days post transfer and no symptoms but hopefully too early.

Don't know if you guys know the company classic escapes but if they ever approach you just say no thanks my buddy has been scam before I don't want to be part of it. It is a timeshare thing currently trying to get my money back but it will be a long process.


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## africaqueen

Andrea- It is natural to panic after so many fails but everything sounds great so far so keep the faith and i have everything crossed for you. Best of luck for your 1st beta tomorrow x

Jo- Congrats on being pupo! sounds like a fab lil embie you have in there! everything crossed that you get a wonderful Xmas gift this year x

Dovkav- Congrats on being pupo! lots of luck x

Hi to all the gang x

What i wanted to know is, does anyone know of a clinic abroad(as will be cheaper than UK) that offers DE as a backup incase my own eggs end up crap again? we want to have 1 more attempt with my own eggs but dont want to waste the cycle if the same thing happens and we end up with 1 embie of low grading, so would be good if we could use a clinic that has a egg bank attached so it wouldnt matter about synchronizing cycles with donor etc?? obviously we are praying we get a decent embie from my own egg but we cant afford to keep wasting money and need a plan B xxx


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## africaqueen

I have been researching online about 'tandem ivf' and that is the way we are going to go later next year :) iv emailed 2 clinics in Cyprus to find out more. Basically i would go through a whole IVF cycle, as would the egg donor and once my eggs and hers are collected and fertilised with my husbands sperm, they would decide what is best to do. If somehow we managed 2 great embies from my eggs, we would freeze the DE and transfer my 2. If we got no embies or one poor quality, we would be able to use the DE. Its a good system that gives us much higher chances and also we can have 1 of my eggs and 1 DE transferred. Obviously if one resulted in a live birth we would then have the option of maternity testing for medical reasons. I think its going to give us the hope we need :) xxx


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## bugs

AQ I know in my clinic they have back up donor eggs frozen I don't think they really do tandem cycles as it's quite difficult to get the timing right. Your also looking at it being quite expensive as it's 2 lots of meds, 2 egg collections etc. I know I have seen it done but not sure where xxx


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## bubumaci

Hi Everyone. Well, I have been really down all day ... because - they refuse to make a statement. The blood values are positive again - like in August (a tick lower than in August), at 6,8 (at 6dp5dt) - and they are saying, because I had an HCG jab, they cannot say - and I have to wait until the next Beta, which is in three days. My E2 is very high, I think, at 2.561,00 pg/ml. Progesterone is 26 ng/ml.

I feel like it's history happening all over again, except that in August I was excited when I saw that I had 7,1. This time, I felt like my heart was breaking. I know I am not out ... I really felt like we would have good results today, esp. since my breasts started hurting this morning - the early waking... I've been tearful most of the day. I have no explanation for the constant pressure in my abdomen :( My doctor and acupuncturist had both confirmed to me, that by the blood testing date, the HCG from the shots (due to the low level) would be out of my system ... I just don't know what to think any more.

Thank you all for your prayers <3


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## dovkav123

bubumaci, your embies are the fighters and they will make it. Hoping and praying the nymbers will rise and preggo symptoms will show up more.

africanqueen, I hope tandem IVF will work for you guys!

unlucky, beta buddies????!!! I pray and hope that our miracles will snuggle in warm and cozy for the rest 9 months. how many embies are there? Are you resting at home before the beta?

Today should be the day of implanation 4dpo2dt. I think a little cramping I felt. Also headache yesterday and today. My temps jumped up tp 37. Staying active walking a lot. And also naping every minute I have. 
:dust::dust::blue: to all of us!


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## africaqueen

Bugs- That is what i would prefer. A clinic with frozen eggs. It will save us a great deal and gives us a backup plan. Do you know the costs? is it something you will do if you don't get any good enough quality embies etc? its defo what we will do as next year cannot be another year wasted with heartache. Need to increase our chances majorly. Can u inbox me all the details please x

Andrea- Things may feel a little bleak but its still sooo early. Most clinics in UK wont even accept a positive result until 12dpo at least so its early days. Hang in there and good luck x

Jo- How are u doing? x

Dov- You doing ok? hope its implantation! x

AFM- Another of my friends announced her pregnancy today and again i am happy for her but sad for me. Makes me more determined than ever to get our baby some way or another xxx


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## Unlucky41

Bub, 6 days after transfer is the first day that the embryo would be producing hcg hence a small number is probably normal. I hope it continues to grow into your miracle baby.

How are you feeling do you still have that constant pressure? Hope that is a good sign.

Dovkav, I dont have any symptoms hence feeling a bit down. I know it is kind of early days but I was hoping for some spotting or special smell to confirm something is happening. I have nothing. How about you? I am going to work from home on the day of my beta which is good and you?

Sarah I think it is great that you are planning forward. Really interested to hearing all your research work.

My sister showed me her new house including the room for the nursery. That made me sad as we have a vacant room that should be a nursery but it is vacant for the last three years


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## bubumaci

Thanks Ladies. I really hate this! I spent most of the night periodically bursting into tears. This all, especially with the year I have had, is just taking too much of its toll on me. This time, I really felt so good - only to have numbers lower than in August, that ended up being a chemical (since they assured me, that the HCG injections could not be it). I was so sure I would be seeing nice high numbers yesterday. Absolutely crushed, when we got the results. Last time, they wrote "the results look quite good ...." and then listed the results. Now, I just had the table with the results (where in the past I would have been excited to see anything above 5 at this point - but in August, they wrote the additional text, that - because it was under 10, they were not sure that implantation had fully taken place - and we all know how that attempt ended) and the comment, that they couldn't make a statement.

Of course - it is better than a right out negative... And I know I oughtn't compare this cycle with the last - although, the unbelievably low levels make it very difficult...

I have always abstained from testing before the Beta - because this is exactly what I wanted to avoid - not knowing. Now I have had the first blood test, which really should give me a yay or nay - and am none the wiser. Am an emotional wreck. Am tired, because for the past 4 nights or so, I have been sleeping badly, having crazy dreams, waking early, and I really thought that this time, it would finally be different. Going through this 8 times (and particularly with all the crap this year) has sucked all my energy out of me, all my positivity - and on top of everything else, thanks to all the medication ... I look and feel like a whale. And I have NOTHING to show for all my efforts. Oh boy... the tears are threatening to come again :(

Sarah - what about that clinic in Budapest? I know they do work with DE ... perhaps they would also have the protocol you are looking for?

Dovkav, Jo - praying for implantation for you girls! :dust::dust::dust:


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## africaqueen

Andrea- I shall look into it. Thank you x So sorry your struggling so much with this 2ww. I think they get worse after each one. The emotional strain is too much. I pray this cycle brings your BFP x

How is everyone coping with Xmas round the corner? i love Christmas but also feel very sad. Miss my mum and so sad im still not even pregnant. Every year when i put our tree up i pray the next time i do it il be pregnant so saddens me its yet another year where i need to think this. We are lucky that we have lots of children in our lives but as much as im thankful for that, it can compound the sadness sometimes seeing happy families etc. I honestly pray that next Christmas see's us as mothers or mothers to be xxx


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## Unlucky41

Bub, So sorry that you are going through this difficult time. Really really hope it turns out all good in the end! It is too early for the clinic to test I reckon if you follow what happen after day 5 transfer that is the first day of hcg implantation is at normal pace. 

Hang in there and I hope you get the news you all dreaming and hoping for :hugs::hugs::hugs:

Sarah let us know how you go with the research definitely interested to know.

AFM- no real symptoms all due to progesterone pessaries. 6 more days to beta hence ages away and too scare to test !!


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## bubumaci

Re- Christmas ... this year is going to be particularly tough for me, since Mama just died in May. I / we (this is the first time DH is coming with me) will be in Budapest with my Grandma + Stepdad for Christmas Eve ... coming back Christmas Day to celebrate with DH's folks on Boxing Day. Then I have to work, so very stressful, as Year End.

We put our Christmas tree up weekend before last, and I put a photo of me when I was about 2 (looking up at our Christmas tree in absolute awe) on the tree, saying that it is my Christmas wish to finally be blessed with our miracle. I really had been hoping so hard, that something good has to happen this year - I can't just be pounded with negative things happening... *sorry* just feeling really sorry for myself :(


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## africaqueen

Andrea- The 1st Christmas after losing your mother is very difficult and emotional. Sadly it does'nt get much better as always that huge void around the home and in your life but i am sure your mum's spirit and memories are all around you, as mine is and they carry us through the hard times. The bond and love between a mother and daughter is truly unbreakable. I pray we get to relive it with our own daughters one day xxx


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## Unlucky41

Bub how are you doing? So sorry that you lost your mother recently and you have to face infertility. Life can really be cruel. Just want to say you are not allow in suffering. I lost my father a while ago and to have me my mum had blood transfusion that made her contract a diesease which is not easily curable. She been going through treatment but the doctor may stop as she is too olds and weak.

Really hope you are some good news in your life soon


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## bubumaci

Hi girls ... nope - unfortunately I don't. HCG went up ... from 6,8 on Sunday to 8,70 today. They told me to stop taking the medication and to go in for another blood test on Friday.

I had hoped that perhaps - if the amount on Sunday was influenced by the HCG jab on transfer day, that maybe the HCG was still doubling ... but they told me the amount is too low and it is not a viable pregnancy.

Needless to say I am heartbroken, I have spent pretty much all day crying ... I am sucked dry, no energy left ...

Hope you guys have better luck <3

(Oh - and it was my paternal Grandma on May 10th, followed by my Mother on May 31st, followed by chemical in August, followed by Gallbladder operation in September ... yay for a great year)... sorry if I sound cynical. I know that there are people out there with much worse fates than mine. I am sorry to hear that your Mother has a difficult disease! :( :(


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## Sandy83

I'm so so sorry bub my heart goes out to you and DH. You have had a hell of a year I'm hoping 2014 is the year for you :hug: xx


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## Unlucky41

Bub so sorry to hear this many hugs to you. Nothing we can say will take the pain away. Really hope 2014 is your year!


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## africaqueen

Andrea- I am so sorry. Life is so unfair! in the past 4yrs i have lost 2 babies, both tubes, my mumand my 2 best friends died, 3 failed IVF's, and even my dog and budgie died. I know how awful life can be and i just pray we have some joy in 2014. We are all here for you xxxx


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## dovkav123

I am so sorry ladies about 2013 unlucky and horrible year. Hope and pray that 2014 you'll gain double what have you lost.
This Decemeber I lost my relative, he called me 3 weeks ago and told me he is dying and in a week he got in coma and this week passed away.

Yesterday I was performing CPR to my father in law and the nurse was standing by and didn't help. She just told me that I am doing it too slow!!!!
Is that cruel? The dr. came and contineud for 20min but it was too late.
I have everything on video and the whole world should know about this!!


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## Unlucky41

dovkav123 said:


> I am so sorry ladies about 2013 unlucky and horrible year. Hope and pray that 2014 you'll gain double what have you lost.
> This Decemeber I lost my relative, he called me 3 weeks ago and told me he is dying and in a week he got in coma and this week passed away.
> 
> Yesterday I was performing CPR to my father in law and the nurse was standing by and didn't help. She just told me that I am doing it too slow!!!!
> Is that cruel? The dr. came and contineud for 20min but it was too late.
> I have everything on video and the whole world should know about this!!



This is terrible I am so sorry for your lost. How is your husband doing ? 
I hate how some people just like to criticise however doesn't help! 
Praying that this board have heaps of blessing in 2014 as we sure do need it!!:hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:


Sending you heaps of :dust::dust::dust::dust::dust::dust::dust::dust::dust::dust::dust:
for the 23 Dec!!


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## Unlucky41

Hi All,

I am so scare just saw some dark brown discharge so it seems like my AF is on the way. I am in self denial at the moment thinking it could be just the progesterone pessaries however it really is not a good sign. Either way it all ends tomorrow in tears either way !!!


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## africaqueen

Dov- Omg you have had a terrible experience! i am so sorry for your loss and you should definitely show the authorities the video! how awful x

Jo- I have everything crossed for you that tomorrow will be tears of joy x

Hi to all the gang x

AFM- Well 3 days ago i learnt 2 more women i know are pregnant and yesterday we went to our friends to take their kids gifts and our friends announced her 5th pregnancy and she is due in july. I was almost crying as she has 4 kids already, one of which is only 1yr old and this pregnancy was not planned as they had used protection?!! wtf?! life is really unfair and so bleeding ironic! i actually looked up at the heavens and said 'seriously'?! 

I truly, hope and pray with every fibre of my being that 2014 brings us the joy we yearn for. Enough sadness and grief amongst us to last a lifetime so please let 2014 see us with our rainbows or at least pregnant with them by next Christmas. 

Merry Christmas everyone and i wish everyone a happy and healthy 2014 xxxxx


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## Unlucky41

Hi All,

Just want to let you know that my beta was positive:bfp: today at 443!!:happydance:

I couldn't stop laughing then I couldn't stop crying I know there is a long long way to go but for now I am going to be happy. Will no doubt start worrying again as last time we miscarriage at 8 weeks.

Hope everyone is making good plans for xmas 

dovkav123 - good luck for tomorrow :dust::dust:

To everyone else really do hope that 2014 is your year and thanks a million for all the support to date !!


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## bubumaci

Congratulations Jo! I had a good feeling for you :) That sounds like a nice, solid beta :)

Dovkav - fingers crossed for you too! :dust:

@ Sarah - thank you!! <3 You too.


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## Sandy83

Congratulations Jo, That is a great beta. How many did you transfer as that is a high number could it be twins?

Bub, How you doing? I see on your signature that a chemaical pregnancy was confirmed :sad: 

Dovkav, Fx'd for you today :hugs:

Cvaeh/Sarah, Hope you have lots to keep you busy over the christmas period and the time will be here soon for you to get your little miracles in 2014!!!!

Any other ladies on here hope your doing well and enjoying the christmas holidays :hugs: xx


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## Unlucky41

Sandy I had my beta a bit later than normal. There should only be one as we transferred only one embryo.

Christmas eve for us today!

Merry Christmas everyone !!!:xmas9:
Really hope you have some good quality time with the family and that 2014 will be your year !!!!:hugs::hugs::hugs:


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## Sandy83

:xmas6:Merry Christmas Everyone, and hoping for an even better New year for all of us.:xmas9:

Here's to 2014 :wine: xx


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## africaqueen

Jo- WONDERFUL news!! sending lots of sticky vibes and hopes that next Christmas your lil miracle will be here x

Cvaeh- So glad your going to try again and i really hope they find you a donor asap and that you get your miracle x

Andrea- Thinking of you. Know exactly how u will be feeling and sending love x

Hi to Sandy, Bugs, Dov and all the gang x

Wishing us all a very merry Christmas and i hope its the last Christmas that see's us childless and that by next Christmas we will be mummies or pregnant. This time of year is so hard but lets enjoy this time and keep hopeful for a fantastic new year xxxx


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## Unlucky41

Thanks Sarah really hope next year is your year!! Bound for some blessing and luck.

Andrea/Bub sending you heaps of :hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs: hope 2014 is your year.

MERRY CHRISTMAS :xmas6::xmas4::xmas2:

Like Sarah yes I hope we are all pregnant or have a baby by DEC 2014- that would be something to celebrate about!


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## MrsE75

Hi ladies. 

Jo that's great news congrats. 

To all the other ladies hope you had a lovely Christmas Day and may this be our last without being parents. 

My OH is taking me to the Lake District for new year as my Christmas surprise to a b&b so looking forward to it. I will enjoy this year as I'm determined this will be last without either being mummy or pregnant!! May we all get dusted with tonnes of fairy dust! Xxxx


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## dovkav123

Unlucky, my IVF buddy! change your name please! You are the lucky one! Millions hugs and kisses!

Jo,:thumbup:for great news!

Mrs, you have a fun plan for Holidays!

Super love I send to all ladies!

I didn't do my beta on 23rd.
Tomorrow my AF should show up, but progesterone pills may delay it or I'll get my BFP?! We'll see, what kind of news the stick will show:ugly or sweet.


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## Unlucky41

dovkav sending you heaps of baby dust for tomorrow :dust::dust::dust::dust:

Hope your AF stays away for another 9 months.

Hope you had a great Christmas :xmas2:


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## dovkav123

I've got 3 BFN with HPT. I am still on progesterone and want to delay my AF. I am doing my beta on Monday to double check and for a final closure.


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## Unlucky41

dovkav123 said:


> I've got 3 BFN with HPT. I am still on progesterone and want to delay my AF. I am doing my beta on Monday to double check and for a final closure.

Dovkav,

So sorry to hear this. Sending you heaps of hugs :hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:. Really hope 2014 brings hope and joy for you.


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## captainj1

Hi girls, can I join you? I've had 2 failed fresh cycles and one failed FET, each time two good embryos transferred and not a sniff of a BFP. I have a son who I conceived naturally in 2010 who is looking increasingly miraculous. 
I got 5 frosties from my first fresh cycle and have one left so going to try a natural FET in February and then if/when that doesn't work, immune testing in March before another go at a fresh cycle - probably with CGH testing- in April.
As yet no known issues other than age (I'm 38).

I'm feeling pretty low about things if I'm honest, although I know that I'm so blessed to have my son. All of his friends have siblings or one on the way and I really want that for him. One of my friends just had her fourth ivf cycle since I had DS and is pregnant with twins after having ectopic, DD, fail and now this pregnancy. Seems she has a better hit rate than me! I've only ever been pregnant once and that was DS. 

Anyway good luck for 2014 ladies xxx


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## dovkav123

Welcome captain,
Sorry for your failed IVFs. I also have problems to get pregnant. In 3 months I had 3 perfect embryos transfered and no luck.
What kind of immune testing are you talking about?
Maybe we both have implantation problems?
CGH testing? Please explain more.


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## dovkav123

My AF came in the evening after the blood test. Even I was on the progesterone. Blodod test results:
Estrogen was 65, progesterone 5. 
My beta .6
My eyes are too dry to cry, really, I feel numb and cold. 
My hubby just wants to try again.
I want to take a break from IvF.
Check my uterus with a contrast dye. Support LF with progesterone. And just BD.....

I didn't go for my blood test for nothing...
I am also checking my folic acid levels.
APA- antiphospholipid antibody
APS- antiphospholipid syndrome

I am negative with Thrombofilia.

I beleave we have problems with implantation. My hubby's sperm is perfect, his morfology 5%(average 4%) low Morfology has to do with chromosomal abnormalties.


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## Unlucky41

dovkav123 said:


> My AF came in the evening after the blood test. Even I was on the progesterone. Blodod test results:
> Estrogen was 65, progesterone 5.
> My beta .6
> My eyes are too dry to cry, really, I feel numb and cold.
> My hubby just wants to try again.
> I want to take a break from IvF.
> Check my uterus with a contrast dye. Support LF with progesterone. And just BD.....
> 
> I didn't go for my blood test for nothing...
> I am also checking my folic acid levels.
> APA- antiphospholipid antibody
> APS- antiphospholipid syndrome
> 
> I am negative with Thrombofilia.
> 
> I beleave we have problems with implantation. My hubby's sperm is perfect, his morfology 5%(average 4%) low Morfology has to do with chromosomal abnormalties.

Many :hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs: dovkav!!
At your meeting with your RE you should bring this all up and ask him/her for any more test you can do? My RE reckons disruption of the uterus also helps a little as well you should as about that.

Hope you and your husband finds the best next steps and really hope your journey to becoming a mother is not too far away.

:hugs::hugs::hugs:


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## MrsE75

Dovkav so sorry to hear your news. Just take some time and speak to your RE. 

Unlucky - congratulations not so unlucky now hey!!

Captainj - welcome to this thread I'm sure this year will be our year for us all!!!

AQ, Bugs and the gang Happy New Year lets just pray that this year is our time goodness knows we deserve it!

Afm - found out a friend of mine is pregnant with her second whilst I'm still trying for my first. So that's all my friends on their second now which I'm embarrassed to say I'm completely jealous of. I know I'm a horrible person to be jealous of them being pregnant but deep down I can't help it I just want it to be me! I'm hoping you ladies will empathise with me!? Well we have an appt for the new clinic in london that has been recommended to me by lots of people including my thyroid consultant who knows 2 people that went and now have children. So got the appt on 20th jan sent them all my copies of previous cycles in advance so we can have a constructive consultation. Not planning on doing any cycle before April but they do monitoring cycles I believe so worth getting those out the way.


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## Unlucky41

MrsE75, 

Totally understand where you are coming from majority of my friends have two or three kids already. My younger sister in law already have a 1.5 year old and my younger sister is 15 weeks pregnant. My sister in law told us they probably have another baby next year. I found it so hard to accept that majority of people get to chose when they are going to have their baby and with all this assistance. :hugs::hugs::hugs:

Wishing you all the best to your appointment ! Make sure you have your list of questions ready!! 

I am very grateful that we are now pregnant but it has been a long journey of 5 IVF. 

I have booked our first scan on the 17th Jan - hoping we see one healthy baby with a heart beat. Last time we were pregnant at our first scan we saw an empty sac hence we are quite terrified that this will happen again.


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## MrsE75

Unlucky - i know it's hard and I would be exactly the same as the same thing happened to me went for our scan and didn't feel anything was wrong but the sac was empty. It's heartbreaking but try to enjoy this bit cos now matter how anxious you get it won't change anything so you may as we'll enjoy being pregnant and I'm sure everything will be fine. PMA!!!

Xx


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## Unlucky41

Thanks for this MrsE75.

Went to my younger sister's house warming today. Everyone knows that she is pregnant and so they thought it was logically to ask me when am I having one ! It was a painful day.

Hope everyone is doing well.


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## MrsE75

I had exactly the same thing my parents had a drinks party around Christmas and 3 people asked me when we were going to have children! I had to stop myself saying that actually we can't have any just to wipe the smile off peoples faces. I know that's mean of me but I was just fed up with the questions!

Xx


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## Unlucky41

MrsE75 :hugs::hugs::hugs: to you !! Some people are born with very small brains!! I told majority of my relatives that we were going to try three years ago hence if there has been no announcement I guess we are having difficulties ehhh

Just to give you some hope my friend who has been trying for 5 years + told me she is 8 weeks pregnant. She tried IVF some time ago however due to her bad reaction to FSH she couldn't continue. She had a near death experience and decided to stop. Recently she had a cyst and the gyno told her that she looks like she has PCOS and hence has heaps of eggs left and should try again -naturally with some monitoring and simple medicine. 

After the 2nd or 3rd try she has fallen pregnant and has saw one healthy heartbeat so far !!

Hope you will have a great story very soon!!


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## dovkav123

People also asking us "When will you have children?", I tell them soon very soon... But trully I want to ask them "Do you know when you die?" 
My mom only talking about my brother's children, babysitting them...On Christmas I called my family, they were all together, happy. I am childless and without my family members hundreds of km away. I know healthy egg and sperm is waiting for us, and maybe soon... maybe this month...we are trying again

I just did my HcG trigger shot and on Friday is an ER.
We talked to my RE today and she thinks that we havn't had a good embryo yet.
Our strategy for this cycle for better implantation. Cos I think implantation is the problem.
1. Transfer 3 day embryo with assisted hatching with laser.(my clinic don't do it with blastocysts but in US, yes)
2. Injection of seminal plasma on the day of embryo transfer
3. Heparin or aspirin
4. Decepyphyl is GnH antigonist 5th day after ET.
5. BD after ET.
6. HCG inject in the uterus after ET.

We talked about those posibilities and we need to decide which treatments to take or maybe all!!!
Also we took couple of blood tests 1. vitD 2. anti-thyroid antibodies (exposer to radiation can be at fault)
Anti-phosholipid syndrome testing came back negative.


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## Unlucky41

dovkav123 really hope this cycle works for you. Hope you chose the right option to improve your implantation. :hugs::hugs: 
Definitely let us know how your transfer go. 

What are your family so far away ? I really hope that you will join you siblings and have your precious baby real soon:dust::dust::dust::dust:


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## underthestars

Can I join you too? Husband has frozen sperm due to bone marrow transplant. Failed fresh ICSI cycle June 2010, failed frozen FET November 2010. Late abandoned fresh February 2011 (wrongly abandoned we were later told). Failed fresh ICSI July 2011. Massive problems with IVF clinic, with their quality of care (sorry is pretty meaningless when it's about abandoned cycles) and staff (some were so unbelievably rude and unprofessional) leading to complaints through HEFA and deep depression for me. 

Decided we couldn't go through any of that again we consented to destroy our two frozen embies and try and draw a line under the whole thing. Moved job, house, got a dog...but can't shift the regret about it all.

I'm 31 this month. I know there is still a small window if time. We have spent near 30k on house renovations in the last 2 years (that's 4 ICSI cycles...ouch) and whilst my husband looks for a new car I'm sat here wondering whether I dare mention saving and giving it all one more go. Am I mad?


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## Unlucky41

underthestars - welcome to this thread!

:hugs::hugs::hugs: for all you have gone through and to encounter such bad unprofessional people in this industry is really disappointing. I think anyone in this industry should have compassionate and a caring nature.

Have you managed to change clinics? When are you cycling again ?
You are not mad we tried 5 times with two times having no transfer before we got our BFP. 

dovkav123 how was the transfer?

AF, bub, Mrse75 -how are you all doing?


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## bubumaci

Hi Under :howdy:
I don't think you're mad - I can totally understand the regret you are feeling, having got rid of your frozen embies! And you are not mad, wanting to try again / keep trying. You are still young, and it is most natural, that you still have the desire to become a Mother (BTW, I think you have been through so much already, with your DH's cancer!). You definitely need to talk with DH about it - of course it is a financial issue too (we are entirely out of pocket for the entire process), but yes, you should mention how you feel! :hugs:

Dovkav - how did ER on Friday go? Did you have transfer today? How are you?

Me ... knackered - the year end close has had me working 12-13 hours every day and I have worked the weekends too... We have our next appointment on Wednesday with our doctor ... guess we'll have to see what the plan is / what he suggests. Probably a new cycle ... maybe next cycle (this one is majorly out of sync after the December chemical - day 21 and still haven't ovulated ... feel like I might today or tomorrow) ... but I am running out of energy and my hope has more or less hit rock bottom on this one. Just need to get the bad 2013 out of my system ... I can't give up yet ...


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## Sandy83

Welcome Underthestars, defintely think you need to tell DH how you are feeling :hugs:

Bubumaci, Sorry to hear work is so busy at the moment, Fx'd for your appt on Wednesday :hugs:

Dovkav, How you doing, when is OTD? :hugs:

Unlucky, Great story about your friend, gives me hope :hugs:

Just wanted to do a quick update as feeling really down at the moment. Started injections on saturday but really not sure if it was the best thing to do as on Friday DH got called in to see his consultant at the hospital as he has been in really bad pain with his back and the scans have showed that they think the Lymphoma has return and is showing around his spine. He is having a biopsy this week to confirm what the scans have shown but this will mean more chemotherapy and radiotherapy if the results are positive :cry: Absolutely gutted he was doing so well nearly 3 years clear :cry: Life is just so unfair!!!! 

Do you Ladies think I'm doing the right thing by continuing with the cycle?????? Sorry for the rant 

Hope the rest of you ladies are doing well xx


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## bubumaci

Oh Sandy, I am so sorry to hear about DH! My fingers are tightly crossed that the biopsy will prove them wrong :(
I have absolutely no idea ... if it is something you can cope with (the both of you) in parallel to treatment that DH might have to undergo... I think you should discuss with the clinic. You have gone through the treatment with DH before, you know what it entails... 
I think it is a very difficult decision and I honestly don't know what I would do if I were in your shoes. On the one hand, I would be desperate to try again - on the other, I would want to be there for my DH 150% (which I don't think I could do, if I were trying to build up all the positive energy for the Mama karma)... I think I would talk to the clinic and see what the think / recommend / suggest ... and basically, how you and DH feel about the whole thing.

I am so sorry that you are being faced with this!!! :hugs::hugs::hugs:


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## Sandy83

Thanks Bubumaci :hugs: Well I know I've started the buserelin so at least i can still go ahead with it but if in 3 weeks when I'm due to start stims and have more information about dH's condition I know i can stop if i think it's too much :hugs: xx


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## africaqueen

Hi ladies, sorry been MIA. I have been unable to log into my account until today for some strange reason?! anyways im back now.

Stars- Welcome and good luck! x

Dov- How did it go? x

Sandy- I am so sorry to hear the news about your dh! life is sooo unfair! have we not suffered enough?! thoughts an prayers x

MrsE- I know what you mean. 2 of my friends are actually pregnant with third babies and all from when me an dh started ttc just one... not fair but thats life iv come to realise :( x

Hi to Jo, Andrea, Clare and all the gang x

AFM- Nothing much to report. Got the period from HELL yesterday so missed my shift in work last night as couldnt stand for the pain and also missed todays shift so down another £100 come pay day. One step forward, 2 steps back! tbh at this rate we are unable to save barely more than £50 a mth which is a p**s in a huge ocean compared to the £4000 we need to save for another cycle but not much we can do except hope dh manages to get a better job(he is applying for 50 jobs per week) or that we have some luck for once and win some money. That aside we wont afford another cycle this year, it will be next year an the thought of that depresses me, especially knowing time is not on our side with my DOR :( why is life sooo bloody hard?! anyway gotta stay hopeful and i keep entering tons of comps too in the hope il win money or something i can sell xxx


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## MrsE75

Sandy - I'm really sorry to hear about your DHs further fight as if you don't have enough to endure! Honestly they say that god only gives you what we can handle sometimes I just wish he would bugger off and leave some people alone. Heart goes out to you both xxx

AQ - sounds like you are having a bit of a down time which is unlike you so I know you will bounce back. AF time is always the hardest for us ladies I find myself having a good cry every month not that my OH knows cos I just feel it's another month where my dreams haven't been met. So keep your pecker up when your baba comes it will be worth it xxx

Hi to the rest of the gang. Sorry this is a short one cos I'm in work!!

Afm - well biten the bullet and got an appt at this clinic in London next Monday - I'm terrified at the thought of another cycle. I think the longer I wait the more I build it up to be worse than reality in my mind if that makes one iota of sense!?! We don't plan to do anything until hopefully March/April depends when we pay off the credit cards from the last fresh and frozen cycle! The next will be going back on CC cos the time it will take to save. I suspect my next cycle will involve chromosome testing and immune treatment cos basically that's the last thing to try done everything else! So prob going to be around £10k I think - I know say it fast! Let you know what they say xx


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## dovkav123

My 6th natural cycle IVF failed. An egg didn't fertilise correctly....
We are looking for the best clinic in Europe or US and try stimulated cycle.
I need it really to work, so I need to find clinic who tests per-implantation embryo genetic.


----------



## bubumaci

Dovkav - where in Germany are you?
Our clinic does do PID (pre-impantation diagnostics). It is very expensive and can *only* be done on blastocysts.
The clinic apparently has the best reputation in Germany, if not in Europe (according to the research done by a friend of mine).
Have you and DH had chromosome karyotype testing done?
If I think back to how our eggs have fertilised, I think it is quite a risk to try with only one egg!
June 2012 - 14 eggs retrieved, 12 mature, 11 fertilised
September 2012 - 11 eggs retrieved, 10 mature, 7 fertilised
February 2013 - 23 eggs retrieved, 18 mature, 15 fertilised
July 2013 - 12 eggs retrieved, 10 mature, 4 fertilised
December 2013 - 13 eggs retrieved, 11 mature, 9 fertilised

I would say, that we have a pretty good fertilisation rate, yet if you think about it, of the 73 eggs retrieved, 61 were mature (so they could try fertilisation) and of those, 46 fertilised ... 75%. In my eyes that is pretty high and still think of how many eggs could not be fertilised. :(

So anyway, if you are interested, have a look at BBN https://www.ivf-bbn.de - perhaps that is an option. If you do choose to try it, I would recommend our doctor (who we changed to after the first 5 transfers with a different doctor). I am very happy with his approach and I trust him.


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## dovkav123

bubumaci said:


> Dovkav - where in Germany are you?
> Our clinic does do PID (pre-impantation diagnostics). It is very expensive and can *only* be done on blastocysts.
> The clinic apparently has the best reputation in Germany, if not in Europe (according to the research done by a friend of mine).
> Have you and DH had chromosome karyotype testing done?
> If I think back to how our eggs have fertilised, I think it is quite a risk to try with only one egg!
> June 2012 - 14 eggs retrieved, 12 mature, 11 fertilised
> September 2012 - 11 eggs retrieved, 10 mature, 7 fertilised
> February 2013 - 23 eggs retrieved, 18 mature, 15 fertilised
> July 2013 - 12 eggs retrieved, 10 mature, 4 fertilised
> December 2013 - 13 eggs retrieved, 11 mature, 9 fertilised
> 
> I would say, that we have a pretty good fertilisation rate, yet if you think about it, of the 73 eggs retrieved, 61 were mature (so they could try fertilisation) and of those, 46 fertilised ... 75%. In my eyes that is pretty high and still think of how many eggs could not be fertilised. :(
> 
> So anyway, if you are interested, have a look at BBN https://www.ivf-bbn.de - perhaps that is an option. If you do choose to try it, I would recommend our doctor (who we changed to after the first 5 transfers with a different doctor). I am very happy with his approach and I trust him.

I am so sorry you went through so many IVFs.
Thank you for info and recommendation.
We havn't done chromosome karyotype. I don't know if it's worthy. We don't have genetic diseases in the family, unless enviromental factors, aging could cause some damage. Here the test is much cheaper than in USA, we'll see.

My clinic can never tell if my egg is the best. Only during ICSI RE can tell about it cos RE removes covering from the egg.
In Germany there are strict laws about the German Embryo Protection Act of 1990 forbids the selection of embryos. This means that all human eggs being produced in the course of one IVF-cycle may only be fertilized for a later transfer back to the mother's uterus. Therefore the doctors have to select the 'best' eggs already on the day of fertilization when the male and female nuclei have not melted to one, yet. Should there be more than 3 eggs, they can be frozen (cryopreservation) and used for another, later attempt. However it's very hard to decide on the eggs with the best chances at such an early state. In Austria or the Chech Republic (for example) the legal situation is much better. There all eggs can be fertilized and cultivated until blastocyst stadium (5th day after fertilization). Only then the decision for the 'best' embryo has to be made. Should there be more than three, the others still can be cryopreserved.
I don't like this law. It doesn't give me high success chances.


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## africaqueen

MrsE- Yes i am feeling very low this week but im sure the feeling won't last. Il pull myself together. Just tough times x

Dov- I am so sorry your cycle didnt work. We are going to try another cycle when we get the cash together and we will be opting for half the amount of drugs compared to last time in the hope we get 1 or 2 good eggs compared to 7 poor ones, but personally i wouldnt op for a natural cycle as chances are so slim sadly x

Andrea- How are u doing? x

xxx


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## bubumaci

Dovkav - being in Germany myself, I am familiar with this Law. It is also the Law, that prevents us from being able to get a donor egg, even though donor sperm is legal!

Our clinic does both. We have cryopreservation on Day 1 after fertilisation - and they also do it with blastocysts (see my February cycle last year - we had intended to do ONLY fresh transfer on day 5, but I was at risk for OHSS, so they froze 10 on day one and took five to day 5, since a few were still going, they were taken to day 6, where I had two blasts and they were frozen. One of them is still frozen).

Seeing as you are in Germany, perhaps my clinic would be for you?? At my clinic, primarily day 5 transfers are done (in a few rare cases, they do day 3 transfers).

Chromosome karyotyping definitely is very important! It is not necessarily related to genetic diseases, since having a chromosome or two that are not quite right (depending on which chromosomes they are) may not have an effect on the carrier - but definitely might effect an embryo when coming together with the chromosomes of the partner to create a new being. See my "story" below, from our chat with the doctor yesterday. If you or your husband have irregular karyotyping, it might be the reason, why getting a health embryo is so difficult! But even if not, couples with clear karyotyping might also be producing embryos with genetic defects, which is why they don't develop. I would recommend having it done, because it might either a) explain something or b) indicate that the risk is lower...


AFM (thanks for asking Sarah!!!)
So the doctor really took his time with us yesterday. In his opinion, this really just is a case of embryos that are chromosomally abnormal and that they for this reason just don't carry on developing / it doesn't lead to a viable pregnancy. He says it is impossible to know whether this is due to the really poor quality of sperm - or if perhaps my eggs contribute to it.
Both of us are chromosomally normal - however that doesn't mean that our "produce" has to be. It is a question of chance really and we have so far just been unbelievably unlucky. He does believe it will work, that we are on a good track, since for our last two tries, our embryo development has been so much better than for all the other 6, so we are doing something right.
He showed us a study of a lady, quite a bit younger than me, who had had 2 miscarriages, followed by a baby, followed by 4 miscarriages. She was tested to see how her chromosomes are and it turned out that two (#4 and #14) were abnormal. For her, that made no difference, but it clearly seemed to have an effect when she wanted to have children. So they stimmed her, managed to get 5 blastocysts, which they then did PID on. Turned out, that for four of the embryos, there were some chromosomal abnormalities (one had chromosome #9, another had #2, #4, #14, a third had all sorts, only including #14 and a fourth was all over the place) - the 5th was healthy and that turned into her baby - it worked. But the analysis of their "produce" showed, that there wasn't a link between her abnormal chromosomes, since the result of their chromosomes was totally different.

Now we had already considered doing PID for us - however a) they can only be done on blastocysts and our history of blastocysts hasn't been that great and b) our clinic can't get the genetic analysis done in 24 hours which means that it can't be a fresh transfer ... and based on all our tries, it is very clear that our frozen embryo development has been significantly worse than fresh development - and we want to avoid freezing and thawing if we can. Our doctor also said that PID is horrendously expensive, so at this point he wouldn't recommend it. Especially, if he looks that the first few tries that we had, what was transferred really didn't have that good a chance and it is only our last couple of tries that we should "count" - which would mean, that I am still well within the statistics of how many blastocysts and average woman my age needs to get pregnant.
Finally, he recommended that DH go see a different urologist to see whether he recommends doing a PESE / mTESE - just in case the developmental issues are linked to how poor the sperm is. DH just rang that he has an appointment at this other urologist next week Friday.

So I have the prescriptions for the meds ... after AF comes, I will start stimming again on day three (seeing that I ovulated day before yesterday, I guess that is in roughly two weeks, give or take a day or two).


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## MrsE75

Dov - so sorry to hear your news and I didn't know that about German law so I know if I need DE not to go to Germany! How strange to have that law. I have thought about chromasome testing but unless you get about 8 eggs I was told it's was not worth it. When I only get 2-3 the reality is they have little to play with but as I'm going to a new clinic on Monday I will ask. Apparently according to quite a few people I know that have gone there they are expensive but monitor, scan and do blood tests during stim everyday to check your levels and they are hugely into immune issues and do mini immune tests throught to check if when you have your embryo back your body then starts to create hormones to effectively kill the embryo that's not present until you get an embryo. 

Bub - good luck and I cannot imagine how much you must have spent on all your cycles let alone the emotional investment so I am inspired! Good luck with the next steps xx

AQ - aw bless I'm sorry to hear that it's so difficult this process. I've decided if I ever win the lottery or somehow end up with lots of money I'm going to create a foundation that people can apply to who don't have children in or to have Ivf. I would live to be in a position to do that. Just a small matter of the lottery win:)!!! Keep on fighting and done give up we will all get there I'm 100% sure we will somehow! Xx


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## bubumaci

Mrs E - the chromosome karyotype testing is done on blood, not on the eggs. Both you and your partner can have that done (it was done on us right at the beginning when we first went to the clinic, because they had to make sure that we really were "only" dealing with the azoospermia).
The other testing, PID (Pre-Implanation Diagnostics), can only be done on blastocysts, at least in this country, don't know about other countries. Based on our discussion yesterday with the Dr (we also looked at examples), when PID is done on younger embryos, it can be "dangerous", because there, the cell division is still taking place, but the cells haven't separated into trophectoderm (become placenta) and embryonal cells - so they can actually damage the developing embryo. If you have a nice blastocyst, then it is much easier to siphon off cells for the genetic analysis without damaging the developing embryo.

I love the idea of winning a serious sum of money and then opening a foundation to help people like us. You are right - because we don't get any financial support for this, we have already invested small fortune (several tens of thousands of Euros). I will be ordering my medis from France this time, as apparently it can be 40% cheaper than here (one Gonal-F pen costs 537 EUR ... I need at least two per cycle and I use Luveris as well, plus all the other injectibles, Orgalutran etc. etc.), so at least we will be able to save a little bit there (on our 6th stimming cycle *lol*)...


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## Unlucky41

Sandy so sad to hear your news. Really hope dh is ok and fights through it. I hope you find the answer to continue the cycle or not in 3 weeks time. Sending heaps of hugs and prayers your way as I couldn't imagine going through a cycle and supporting dh through the treatment. Be strong!:hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:

AQ really do hope you get lucky and win a lottery soon. How is DH going with all the jobs application? Really hope your next cycle is it and you can be saving up for you baby instead. 

Dovkav sorry to hear about your failed natural cycle :hugs::hugs: good to hear you are going to try a simulated cycle this time hoping it gives you more eggies.

MrE75 I love your idea about a charity for the unfertile - definitely would be a charity I would support. Hoping your appointment goes well next Monday and they give you some answers and options.

Bub good to see you back on the board it sounds like from your appointment you guys will get there is a matter of time. Really hope you get some great quality blastocyst this round :hugs::hugs::hugs:


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## dovkav123

Please read my new thread about toxic metals

https://babyandbump.momtastic.com/p...metal-poisoning-infertility.html#post31312359

Also read this reseach about Vit D and infertility
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22275473


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## MrsE75

How are we all doing? It's been quiet for a few days hope everyone is surviving. 

I know there is lots going on for each of us on this thread so I'm sending each of you a big hug and a bucket load of baby dust. I just know that we will all get our dreams somehow we may have to go about it another way be it donors or surrogates perhaps or more Ivf cycles but we will get there. Seriously we can't have put this much effort, tears and money to simply come away without our longed for families - it isn't an option quite frankly. So hope whoever needs to listen is listening and they send us all our dreams very, very soon!! Xx


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## dovkav123

Thank you MRS for sweet words. Bless you!

I know we are dealing with an age here. My hubby's sperm is super, but who know what are the chromosomes?
This month we BD every other day and hopefully this will give us the best quality sperm. Probably it'll take 3 months to see an improvement. He is sure happy about this plan!

I was in the shopping mall a couple of days ago. A little girl 1.5 was walking back and forward with her dad. My hubby noticed she liked me, smiled at me. She wanted to stay around me, but her dad was taking her away. Finally she came to me, held my hand for a second, giggled and walked away.
My hubby told me this child really liked you. I told him this was our child, she was born to a wrong parents.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Those were the bittest thoughts I have ever had during this infertility journey. I hope I won't have them again.


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## bubumaci

:hugs: @ Dovkav!


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## MrsE75

Big hugs Dovkav hope you are feeling a little better. 

My DH says to me that we shouldn't be bitter when others get pregnant because it's negative energy which sits in your womb and does our health and mental welbeing any good. I know easier said than done cos I'm jealous of others too so know how you feel sweetie. 

Well I had my consultation on Monday in London. Very interesting. Long story short I'm doing what they call Chicago immune tests as they are over 50% sure I have immune issues given what they called my young age (ha nearly fell off my chair!) cos I'm 38 and my amh level vs what quality of eggs I seem to get. They think I have an active immune system which is what has attacked my eggs basically they cannot reverse it but they can surpress it for our cycle. So I'm doing the tests next week £800! Plus I'm doing a monitoring cycle so had a blood test last week on day 3 so having a mid cycle scan also next week then I need to get a blood test from GP to test my progesterone to see if I ovulated. They do a monitoring cycle so that when you are on a cycle and your levels change they know what's normal for me so they can deal with it. They said depending on results I will either be on a short cycle or a medicated natural cycle. It will be tests and scans everyday for 2 weeks during stimulation but have relatives down there so this is the Bootcamp for Ivf by the sounds of it and it's not going to be cheap esp if I have immunes but as this is our last try I want to leave no stone unturned! They also said that they would not take my eggs to blasto cos of the few I get it's too traumatic for them cos what they have to go through to get from day 3 to 5 or 6. They think it's better to out them back where they belong. That may change if I have 4+ eggs and they need to choose but we will see. 

So that's it in a nutshell. Oh and they are doing sperm DNA fragmentation test on DH sperm not that it has been a problem but they want to check as they may put him on tablets for 3 months before treatment to help improve fragmentation which can lead to lack of implantation and miscarriages. Fx he doesn't have this prob x


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## dovkav123

MrsE75,
My dh's age could cause his sperm dna fragmantation.
What pills your dr. would recommend? Could you ask?
I am putting my dh on VitC 1gr and VitE 1 gr a day.


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## bugs

Hi girls I am lurking, just to jump in my OH was on a 40 day course of Doxycycline 100mg twice a day and is count went from 62 million to 121 million. Not bad for a 51 year old xxxx


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## bubumaci

Dovkav - has your DH had the DNA fragmentation test done to determine if he has DNA damage?

Here is some information I have found that you may find interesting : 
https://www.fertilityauthority.com/articles/fertility-clinic-testing-sperm-dna-fragmentation

Perhaps you will find something useful there?


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## MrsE75

Dovkav - I don't know yet as he's got to have the test first and find out if he has any problems but yes if they put him on anything I will let you know. X


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## Unlucky41

Just catching up on everyone's news!

Sandy how are you and dh going? Has he been through any treatment an how are you both coping?

Bub have you started your next cycle? Really hope you have gotten rid of all your bad luck and have one perfect embryo for you!! It is good to see that you RE believes that it would work :hugs:

Dovkav - have you decided what you will be doing next round ? 

MrsE75 - it seems like your RE has given you a complete treatment plan when are you starting your cycle and monitoring?

AQ - How have you been ? Has your relationship with dh strengthened over these tough times ? 

Really wishing you all helps of love and blessing in the year 2014 !!!


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## dovkav123

Unlucky41 said:


> Just catching up on everyone's news!
> 
> Sandy how are you and dh going? Has he been through any treatment an how are you both coping?
> 
> Bub have you started your next cycle? Really hope you have gotten rid of all your bad luck and have one perfect embryo for you!! It is good to see that you RE believes that it would work :hugs:
> 
> Dovkav - have you decided what you will be doing next round ?
> 
> MrsE75 - it seems like your RE has given you a complete treatment plan when are you starting your cycle and monitoring?
> 
> AQ - How have you been ? Has your relationship with dh strengthened over these tough times ?
> 
> Really wishing you all helps of love and blessing in the year 2014 !!!

Unlucky, how are you feeling?

Today we received info about a sperm dna fragmentation. My RE put an extra brochure from the synlab and it states that the sperm dna fragmantation problem could be fixed with antioxidants! Hell, my hubby got mad on our RE! She stated it's not proven! We are doing this test she wants it or not...
Also I am checking out my tubes on Thursday, if they're open we'll try for IUI. 

Anyway, I have drank alcohol every day since I found out our embryo didn't make it.
Tonight was the last 3 glasses of wine I drank, cos tomorrow will be the 3rd day of my cycle and my follilcle will start growing.

Few days ago we went to the art gallery to Heidelberg and we saw a beautiful painting and I was so sure I can paint it myself. The castle, the bridge and Necka river. it looked so easy!!!! My hubby's mother's birthday is on February and she always wanted a painting of Heidelberg. I want to do it for her. 
Today I bought the canvas for a painting and I realised I needed to paint it for us. For me and my hubby cos we had our first romantic walk by the river in Heidelberg a night before my first IVF. I injected myself with HCG shot in the car, with the light of the street lights. And we were dreaming of big...maybe too big....


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## bubumaci

Jo, not started yet. Have all the media ... just waiting for AF to turn up (expecting her any day now, probably tomorrow) and then I will start the belly-jabbing again on day 3. Our doctor has been saying the whole time that he thinks it is just a matter of time, that it will work, he just doesn't know how many tries it will take ...


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## MrsE75

Unlucky - currently on my monitoring cycle got my scan this week then ovulation sticks and progesterone tests. We don't plan to cycle until April assuming immunes come back ok otherwise they could delay us so we will see. 

Good luck Bub xxx


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## Unlucky41

dovkav, I am glad you are doing these tests. Hopefully you get answers and able to cycle better next round. Good on dh for telling off the RE sometimes I think they just don't give enough time to each case!!
Are you good with drawing ? that is a great gift !! Let us know how the drawing goes. I am okay trying just hoping everything goes okay this time round but nothing to complain about. 3 weeks to go before the scary scan.

Bub fingers cross this is it and you get plenty of good quality blastocysts!! This whole thing is a big fat waiting game forcing us to be patience but it is so hard! Let us know how it goes :dust:

MrsE75 Wishing you all the best with your monitoring. Hopefully you don't have to push out the next cycle past April. Hoping that this round goes perfect for you in every way!!


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## africaqueen

Jo- Thank you! fingers crossed. Dh Still continues to apply for many jobs but as yet no luck so he is starting to build up a small business selling electrical goods so hoping that pays off in the end but we shall see. How are you doing? x

MrsE- All sounds very promising for your next cycle! everything crossed for you. I hope by the time we have managed to scrape the money together that we can come up with a different plan but tbh we can only afford the bare minimum so we won't be able to have any immune tests etc. Just hope 'luck' is on our side for once. I truly do believe no matter what we will get our miracles but as you said, who knows how that will come about. Its exhausting wondering. I know that much x

Dov- Aww bless you. I often feel very down. My friends 14yr old daughter had a beautiful baby girl the other day and all i can think of is 'why has a 14yr old kid got the baby i should have'??! i know bitter thoughts don't improve the situation but dont worry about negative thoughts effecting you. It won't. I know some very horrid bitter women who have 3 or 4 kids ;) x

Andrea- How are you doing? hope our luck majorly improves asap! x

Bugs- How are you? i havent posted much lately as seems pretty pointless to post a lot just moaning about having no money to try again but i will drop in to check on the others as you do. Not long until you go again is it? x
 
Hi to everyone else who i may of missed out. xxx

AFM- Tbh ladies, i have felt majorly low since the new year as the enormity of the situation has really hit home. At the moment the limited income we are on, means we can save next to nothing for our 4th cycle and it is depressing me so, so much to think there is a strong possibility we may not even have a shot at being pregnant this year. Praying for a miracle in the way of funds to cover it. If we cant get the money together we just cant have a chance, simple as that but i am really stressing over it, which im sure is doing me no good and dh is so stressed he has been getting bad headaches every day :( please god give us a break xxx


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## MrsE75

AQ - aw bless you I wish to god there was something other than words that I could do to help. We a furiously trying to clear the credit cards so we have a shot as this is our last go with my eggs unless I get told it's not my eggs then we will move to surrogacy otherwise I will have to accept it will be DE unless we come into major money and can afford to keep trying. But I'm 38 now so need to just get on with having my family now. Thinking of you, big hugs xx


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## bugs

Hi ladies well I was hoping to come on with good news but afraid not. Me and my OH went to Athens in Jan and we're there for 12 days did full immune cycle with steroids and intralipids and was on a mix of 150 gonal f and 75 menopur so a pretty standard dose. Ec got us 10 eggs which looked good on the day however as you know in the past we always have a high percentage of immature eggs well this time was no different of our 10 4 could be used and all 4 did fertilise using natural IVF. So the immature thing was explained as some of my eggs are missing an enzyme which prevents them from maturing apparently this is very rare and Penny has only seen it once before but it means that no matter what meds I will only produce a low number of useable eggs. So anyways we had 3 put back on day 3 which were all 8. 

OTD was Friday and it was a BFN so that pretty much ends my journey using my own eggs. So moving forward we are starting the journey of donor eggs it's not going to be cheap but I think this will be our last shot I'm hoping we'll got some frosties so if the fresh cycle doesn't work we have them to fall back on but we have to draw a line somewhere. 

Hope everyone else is as well as can be expected on this nightmare of a journey xxxx


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## Unlucky41

Bugs I am so sorry that your last cycle did not work :hugs::hugs::hugs: 

Really hope your first donor cycle works and you have some frosties for baby 2. Is it hard to find donor eggs where you are Bugs?

AQ really hope you come across some treasure so you can go for another cycle. I can't imagine how hard it must be for you :hugs:

MrsE75 hopefully this cycle works fingers cross and toes cross for you.

Bub have you started your cycle yet?


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## bubumaci

Bugs ... :hugs: to you Sweetie! I am so sorry!!!

Sarah - I don't know whether or not you have thought about this, but on another thread, there was a lady, who had gone through IVF and they had basically sucked their funds dry ... and she wanted to go DE. She startet a fund at GoFundMe and basically, people donated (I gave $100 for example) - enough people (people she knew, people she didn't know) donated and the first try she got pregnant with a little boy (and several :cold:) ... perhaps that might be something to consider?

Yup ... started the belly-jabbing this morning. It looks like DH will have the TESE done. We would have preferred PESA (so needle aspiration) but apparently his testicles are too small and so the doctors have recommended doing the TESE. I am not sure if that is the right thing to do ... we have (with one exception) managed to have enough sperm in his sample on the day of ER to fertilise (once they had to thaw a frozen straw)... but our ER is concerned that it is the quality that is impairing our embryos and so he wanted to see if they could perhaps get more and better directly from his testicles. I feel so sorry for him - it is bad enough that he feels like he is half a man, not being able to reproduce naturally ... he is terrified of the surgery and the recovery afterwards ... :( What is the likelihood that we will retrieve better sperm from the TESE?


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## MrsE75

Bugs - not words can help but sending you lots of love and hugs for this latest challenge. Where are you going to get you DE from? 

Bub - ouch that sounds uncomfortable however nothing in comparison with what have and will have to do when we get pregnant! Good luck xx

AQ - hope you are ok and worth thinking about what they call crowdfunding xx

Afm - had my mid cycle monitor scan and all ok one dominant follicle on my right apparently. Bloods were fine too. Had the Chicago immunes done yesterday 11vials of blood they took to send to the states. I was a tad light headed after! So now I'm doing ov sticks call them when I getting surge and the have a blood test with GP 4-6 days later to make sure I ovulated. Then wait for OH sperm frag results and my immunes. Hopefully we will be able to cycle in April unless I need to have immune treatment beforehand. So going to keep eating healthy, going to gym, take vita but otherwise just forget about it until April. Xx


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## dovkav123

Bugs, I am so sorry:hugs:. Please take care of yourself and your hubby. I know you'll get your rainbow soon. Never give up!
Bub, what is your hubby's sperm dna fragm? I found some info. Sperm quality is better and dna fragm is less when the sperm is taken out from testicular and than ICSI is done.
https://humrep.oxfordjournals.org/content/20/7/2031.full

DR. Sher advices to transfer 1 embryo a time and he is talking about dq match, if you're interested please read here https://haveababy.com/fertility-inf...g-its-effect-on-reproduction-and-ivf-outcome/

MRS, sounds all so good! You'll know lots of new info about your and your hubby's fertility and the knowledge is power!I hope and pray you'll O this month. Please eat red beats, spinach, steak and chocolate it will help you to produce more blood cells. Are you doing IVF in April? I am very interested what kind of immune testing did you do?

Africaqueen, please give an extra hug to each other every single day. You'll go through this. You'll be blesses with your miracle soon.:flower:



TODAY.........I had a contrast U/S. My procedure took looong time! RE couldn't put catheter in...She wanted to use a baloon catheter but they didn't have it. She kept trying till she succeeded. It was painful! More painful than an egg retrieval! The dye went throught the tubes, so my tubes are open. However, we don't know if my tubes are damaged from the pelvic surgery. 
Anyway, Everything looks normal. My follicle on the left was 12mm. On Monday we may do IUI.
The Sperm dna fragmentation we'll check when we know the result of this cycle. My RE has never seen sperm with a very bad fragmentation. She thinks this testing will not tell us much. She doesn't beleave there are treatments for that. I know there are!

I asked my RE about ureaplasma, mycoplasma in sperm(bacteria could cause dna problems). She told me it's always there, if you have too many you treat with antibiotics and in two weeks the bacteria comes back.
I don't know if we'll test for that.
I asked about the white blood cells in sperm. Durind SA they check that. DR. worry if they find a big number of those cells


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## bugs

Thanks MrsE we are going back to Serum in Athens. I really regret not going there sooner, she's hoping to match me for March xxx


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## MrsE75

Dovkav - I have what is called Chicago tests. If you google it there is lots online to tell you all about it. The samples are sent to Chicago as the only place in the world that does these tests. I'm told they check all different immune issues like ones that prevent ovulation for example which I think is my issue, NK cells and a whole load more. The results take 2-3 wks. Already had basic immunes done with GP x


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## bubumaci

Thank you for that link Dovkav - it puts my mind a bit more at ease, that we might get something better! We haven't had the DNA fragmentation tested, so I don't know the answer, but we know that the quality of :spermy: isn't good - so perhaps the TESE really will bring us our miracle? I just hope they find something in there!!


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## Sandy83

Hi Ladies 

Sorry been MIA for a bit had loads going on. On an IVF note had scan this morning and got the go ahead to start stimms hopefully EC on 17th Feb. While at work I'm now at risk of redundancy so another thing to worry about but got things in the pipeline to hopefully move straight to a new job. Then the final thing DH!!! Well the results from his biopsy and spinal fluid test came back as inconclusive so had to see a neurologist to see about doing a open Biopsy so went in for surgery on Tuesday and back home now to recover. Fx'd we get the final results this Friday and find out where we go from here. 

Hopefully catch up on all updates very soon but thinking about all you ladies and sending you lots of :hugs: xx


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## dovkav123

MRS thank you for a detail explanation about immune testing.

BUBU, how are your follicles growing? 

Sandy, Good luck with your February IvF!
I hope on Friday you'll find out only good news about your DH

Hugs to all:hugs:


I went to my RE on Monday. I was hoping to see 20mm on my left size, but we found only 14,6mm. It grew only 2,6 mm in 4 days. However, my right size has a 13.6mm follicle!!!!!
What a suprise! This is crazy! I am excited!
But my RE is sure that we have only one follicle this cycle, cos another didn't grow enought and possible there is no egg. She insured me that it's not a cyst. My lining is still thin 7.2mm. It's growing along with a follicles. We are checking again on Wednesday.
I am going to be CD12 tomorrow and I am sure I'll O late this cycle.
This cycle is different, no spotting after AF. This cycle possible is a healthy one, maybe a healthy egg is growing slowly and cozy.(or maybe 2?)
You, girls have a lot experience with IVF. Did it happen to you? The folicles start slow and than catch up later?

I think that my body decided to grow two follicles. It slows down the left one that it catches up with a right one.
My grandmother has fraternal twins. This is genetic and runs into families.

We asked RE about clomid, she wouldn't do it in this case. How funny, that my hubby came up with this idea, cos he is so against hormones. 

Maybe IUI will be in the end of this week. 
After IVF to IUI, I know we'are going backwards but I know many cases that a couple get preggo naturally after failed IVF.


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## bubumaci

Sandy, I am sorry that you are still playing the waiting game. I have everything crossed for you guys and the results on Friday. How is DH doing? How are you? :hugs:

We are doing OK... u/s yesterday and the doctor was satisfied. Another u/s on Saturday, but he said that we would trigger Saturday night and ER on Monday morning. DH's TESE appointment is at 8 on Monday, have to be there 7:15. Praying so hard, that the TESE does it (I feel so sorry for DH!!).

Dovkav, with IVF, definitely, you can have follicles that are slower and then catch up. Not sure how that would work on a natural cycle though. I think that normally, once a dominant follicle establishes itself, the others stop. Of course it can happen that two eggs are released and you end up with fraternal twins... more common in older women though.


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## Sandy83

Thanks Ladies, We are doing ok just hate the waiting game feels like thats all we do lately. Hopefully things will start to turn round in the next couple of weeks. Acupuncture is helping so much to relieve the stress so glad I decided to continue with it. 

Bubumaci, I will be a week behind you my EC will be on 17th fx'd this is our time and sure eveything will go fine with DH :happydance:

Dovkav, great news on being able to do IUI, don't know much about it tho as we had to move straight to IVF, got everything crossed for you :hugs: xx


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## dovkav123

I am CD16 today and did IUI(12mil sperm) My follicle fell asleep at 13.6mm and an other grew 20,6mm. I'll o in 1 or 2 days. 
This cycle is really late, ussually we collect an egg on CD12 or CD13. My follicle is a very slow growing and is stubborn like my dh:) We had to monitor it 4 times this cycle.
All my 6 IVFs went smoothly with only one ultrasound! HCG trigger and ER in 36 hours.

Bubu, good luck on Monday! Cheering for you!

Sandy, hoping for a good news for you on the next IVF cycle


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## Sandy83

Hi Ladies

Bubmaci, How did yesterday go? How many eggs did they collect, Will you get a fertilization report today? Not long till you will be PUPO :happydance:

Dovkav, Are you in the 2ww with your IUI now?

Hope the rest of you ladies are doing well :hugs:

AFM, On an IVF note been a week on stimms now and got follicle scan tomorrow and hopefully doing trigger on Saturday to have ER on Monday :happydance:
Got DH's official results back and it has been confirmed the Lymphoma has returned so he Chemo on 19th Feb so will be there for ER but not for ET :sad: He will be having treatment till mid June then will be having a donor stem cell transplant. So fx'd this is our cycle and we eventually get some goods new in our lives xx


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## MrsE75

Sandy - I'm sending you the biggest hug I'm so sorry it wasn't good news for your DH but sounds like you have a plan of attack which is a great way to be. Don't worry about the ET your DH will be there for when it matters and you get your BFP and then of course your scans and birth so it's all going to be ok I have a feeling it will be. Sending you lots of luck my lovely &#128591; xxx

Bub - how are you getting on???

Dov - where are you up to with your 2ww? 

AQ, Bugs hope you are still lurking, thinking of you too. 

Hi to everyone else I've missed xxxx

Afm - I've been told my immunes are back but not my OH sperm frag results so guessing they will wait for those before they call to discuss the results. A bit nervous but it's out of my hands!!


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## bubumaci

Hi All!
So some news from me ...
They already told me before I went in for the ER, that the TESE material was useless and they were thawing two straws we have from the one amazing SA he had two years ago *sniff* ... so I already had silent tears rolling down my face before I went in, as I felt so sorry for DH having to go through it all :(
ER went well - 15 eggies were retrieved ...
Afterwards we spoke with our doctor, he said that the TESE sperm were a) very few and what was there was all very bad looking. The only good thing about having had the TESE done i.m.o. is that his clinic is also sending in a sample for histological analysis and perhaps we will get some answers as to why we have to go through this?

Today I received the fertilisation results - 14 of my 15 eggs were mature and 9 fertilised. So now we are back in the waiting game to see how the little ones develop ... Transfer is on Saturday.

Sandy, I am so so sorry that your DHs Lymphoma has returned! What are the doctors saying about the treatment ... I so hate cancer, it is such a cruel illness and hearing your news has made me very sad! I hope that he feels OK and doesn't suffer too much from the Chemo and all fingers and toes are crossed that you beat this thing together! :hugs: Good luck for your scan tomorrow Sweetie!!! :dust::dust::dust:


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## Sandy83

Bubmaci, Sorry to hear you had to thaw the sperm :hugs: but 9 fertilized is great and 5 day transfer is even better. Hope the 2ww isn't too hard on you and it flies over. I'll be in the same boat as you next week. Here's hoping this is the cycle for both of us. :hugs:

DH is doing ok, it's so hard coz to look at him he looks fit and healthy and isn't feeling ill or anything. Last time he went through chemo he was so strong and coped extremely well with it even going back to work between treatments so hoping it is the same this time [-o&lt; xx


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## Sandy83

MrsE, great news on the immune results being back hopefully you won't have to wait too long for the other results :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Yes Sandy, so far, I have always had 5 day transfers - and luckily, it never is a TWW for me - I have first beta 6dp5dt and the second is then 9dp5dt ...
I will keep everything crossed for you! :dust::dust::dust:
And my hat off to your DH! Amazing, really! :)

MrsE - have they given you the immune results, or are they waiting for the whole package before disclosing?


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## MrsE75

Bub - I suspect the clinic are waiting for all the results before they call me to discuss but I'm hoping if they don't call this week then I obviously don't have the immune that needs treatment prior to any cycles which could be good or bad! Anyway no point worrying it's is what it is we just have to deal with it! 

Let you know when I hear back from them xx


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## Sandy83

Well ladies had scan this morning and i have about 29 follicles between 8mm & 14mm so that's good and lining was 9mm which is the the best it's ever been:happydance: , will get a phone call tomorrow to confirm ER will go ahead on Monday xx

Bubmaci, any news on how your little ones are growing? xx


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## bubumaci

Wow Sandy, that's a huge amount! I really hope you won't be in danger of OHSS!!!
No, we don't usually hear anything until the day of transfer, but we intend to ring the lab tomorrow to hear how they are doing :)


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## dovkav123

I am 5 dpo. taking 200mg progesterone. I have hope cos;
1. I have never tried TTC after flushing tubes
2. I have never tried TTC with progesterone after O.
3. In 6 months I have never had my follicle growing sooo slow.
4. I didn't spot after AF till O this cycle. 
5. We have never:sex: every single day after my AF
6. My uterine lining was super thick 14mm

bubumaci, sandy, hoping and praying for you girls:flower: You deserve it so bad!!!

bubumaci, your hubby is a hero! Sorry TESE didn't work. He showed a huge love to you and your baby. Fight and never give up! Use all possible treatment options in this century!

Mrs -suspense -waiting for your test results.
Bubumaci- suspense-hopefully all embies are growing and playing there happilly.

Sandy, I am heartbroken for your hubby:hugs: He is so strong! I know that acidic enviroment helps cancer grow and devide, if your hubby eats mostly alkaline food, he maybe beat that crap:pop:


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## Unlucky41

dovkav really hope this time works for you. For glad you have a positive feel about this cycle really hoping and praying that you get your joyful news real soon. When is your blood test?

Bub heaps of hugs to your husband. DH did that operation for our first IVF cycle has he had ejaculation problems it did not look fun so totally understand :hugs::hugs::hugs: Yeah to so many embryos there is bound to be a good one there surely! Praying that you get good results today. Do let us know.

Sandy how is your husband doing ? As good as last time? You have heaps of follicles that is such a good sign, hoping this is your lucky cycle.

MrsE75 no news it good news wishing you all the best regarding the results.


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## bubumaci

Thanks Ladies!
Yesterday, we rang the clinic to hear how our embies are doing (so far, I have been scared to get hopeful, because of our history...) and out of the 9 fertilised, 8 were doing as they should (7/8/9-cell). No idea how they are right now, DH wouldn't call today :lol: but not long now - transfer appointment is at 13:55 (takes a bit 'till the transfer, but that's when I have to be there).

DH is healing nicely - still totally upset that they found nothing at all to use (he said, "I am not only half broken, but completely broken" broke my heart :( ) ... I am hoping that the histology will at least give us a reason for his infertility :(

So anyway ... last sleep before the transfer ... please keep your fingers crossed for us!

Huge hugs to all of you sweet Ladies! :hugs:


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## dovkav123

bubumaci said:


> Thanks Ladies!
> Yesterday, we rang the clinic to hear how our embies are doing (so far, I have been scared to get hopeful, because of our history...) and out of the 9 fertilised, 8 were doing as they should (7/8/9-cell). No idea how they are right now, DH wouldn't call today :lol: but not long now - transfer appointment is at 13:55 (takes a bit 'till the transfer, but that's when I have to be there).
> 
> DH is healing nicely - still totally upset that they found nothing at all to use (he said, "I am not only half broken, but completely broken" broke my heart :( ) ... I am hoping that the histology will at least give us a reason for his infertility :(
> 
> So anyway ... last sleep before the transfer ... please keep your fingers crossed for us!
> 
> Huge hugs to all of you sweet Ladies! :hugs:

Hope and pray for a smooth transfer:flower:


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## Unlucky41

bub how did your transfer go:hugs::hugs:


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## MrsE75

Good luck Bub you should them back on board by now. Hope you are resting up xx


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## bubumaci

Hi Ladies :wave:
So transfer on Saturday went - hopefully - well! We transferred one beautiful blastocyst (graded AA) that was starting to hatch (on the picture you can see it a little and on the monitor right before transfer I could see a bit more) and one grade A- Morula. There were two more in the running potentially for freezing today, but they didn't freeze them...

Please keep all fingers and toes crossed that one or both are nestling in for the long haul! :)
 



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## Unlucky41

Bub that sounds really promising!! Grade AA hatching blastocyst that is what worked for me really really hope this is it for you and your nightmare is over. Sending you heaps of baby dust and luck!!:dust::dust::dust::dust::dust::dust::dust:


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## dovkav123

Beautiful photos! You sound so relaxed and happy. Stay that way!
Everything is crossed for you! Hoping for a good news soon.


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## captainj1

hi girls just a quick update from me, I was supposed to have my FET last week with my last frozen embryo but it died in the thaw so it was a wasted trip. Super shitty day as had already got to London (which is where the embryo was) and had a 7 hour journey back what with all the storms. Not impressed with my 2/5 frozen embryo thaw survival rate (and the 2 that were transferred back in August 2013 didn't implant either...).

Having some karyotype testing this month with a view to doing another fresh cycle up in the NW somewhere, with CGH testing, in April.

Good luck to those who are in the TWW. I won't say PUPO as I HATE that phrase having transferred 6 great embryos over 3 cycles with not a sniff of implantation. I definitely consider it to be NPUPO then i'm not disappointed.

xxx


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## bubumaci

Captain - I am so sorry that your embryo didn't survive the thaw :hugs: I can just imagine how you must be feeling :(

I am the same with PUPO ;) On another thread someone said to me "you are PUPO" and I replied that I didn't want to just be PUPO - I didn't want to be proved otherwise! (Same boat as you - this was my 9th transfer now on Saturday, in total, we have had 20 embryos transferred, including the two currently on board)...
My goodness, I remember how after my first transfer, I promptly changed my status - excitedly - to PUPO with twins ... with each try, I have become more and more cautious ;)


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## Northernmonke

Bub I just came to check on you! I am so glad you had some lovely embies. Keep me posted xx


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## Sandy83

Bubmaci yay for being PUPO!!!

Captain sorry about your embryo not surviving sending you lots of hugs

AFM Had ER today and got 22 eggs get fertilisation report tomorrow xx


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## bubumaci

Yay - that's a wonderful ER report! Can't wait for your fert. report :)


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## dovkav123

Captain gentle :hugs:sorry.

Sandy, I am sure you'll have a good fertilisation report!

I am 10dpiui I'll start testing hopefully tomorrow.


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## Unlucky41

Captain sending you heaps of hugs :hugs::hugs::hugs:
Hopefully your next cycle works like a charm and hope the testing give you answers or really your RE ideas to refine your next cycle.

Bub praying that these embries settles in nicely. When is your first test? 6 days from Saturday?

Sandy so many eggs how exciting looking forward to hearing from you tomorrow

dovkav - :dust::dust::dust: for tomorrow


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## bubumaci

Yup - my clinic always tests at 6dp5dt and 9dp5dt - so ... on Friday I go in for the first blood test.
Not feeling anything in particular, apart from a lot of discomfort around my ovaries and my abdomen is hugely swollen and bloated. I felt like I was having mild OHSS after the ER and it did calm down by the transfer but seems to be flaring up again. But other than that, no idea if anything is going on down there :)

Dovkav - good luck for your testing tomorrow :dust::dust::dust:


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## Sandy83

well ladies had a call from the clinic out of the 22 eggs collected 20 of them were mature and 14 of them fertilised so next step get a call on Thursday to see if I am having a 3dt or 5dt xx


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## bubumaci

Awesome news Sandy! Congratulations!!!! :hugs:
Grow little embies, grow :dust::dust::dust:

How is your DH doing?


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## Sandy83

Thanks Bubmaci

DH is doing ok at the moment he goes in tomorrow for his first chemo treatment and will be in hospital for 5 days so will miss transfer!!!!! 

How you doing being PUPO? xx


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## bubumaci

Poor DH - my fingers are crossed that everything goes well!! What did the results of his tests say? How long does he have to have treatment for? Wishing you both tons and tons of strength!!! :hugs:

Well, like I wrote above, there isn't really anything to report. Not feeling anything to suggest it has worked, but it is still very early. The only thing that is very noticeable is how my ovaries feel swollen again (I was concerned that I had mild OHSS after the ER, but it did settle down by the day of transfer) and I am incredibly bloated (i.e. looking very pregnant) ... The progesterone has made me feel bloated after all transfers, but this is really quite extreme, especially the soreness of my ovaries. But other than that ... just praying :) xxx


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## dovkav123

bubumaci sending you tons of luck for tomorrow! Your first blood test due, right?
I tested BFN at 11dpiui, I'll retest at 13 dpiui tomorrow


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## bubumaci

Thank you Dovkav. Yep, go in tomorrow for the first blood draw.... :)
Fingers crossed for your test tomorrow :) xxx


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## bubumaci

Sooooo... I don't yet have my beta results yet (couple of hours to go yet), but this morning I decided to a-typically POAS ... figured, since it is not sensitive (> 25 mIU), either there would be nothing but it would not mean anything, or there would be something and then I could start getting excited...

I went to the clinic with a big smile on my face :) <3 <3

Will let you know the beta results once they are in... Now just praying, that our progression is as it should be!
 



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## dovkav123

:happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance::dance::wohoo::wohoo::wohoo::wohoo:

I am so happy for you! This news is so hot! You just got BFP!
I am glad to find out that the FIRST!
Hoping and praying for a good number!!!!!


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## Northernmonke

Omg I have everything crossed for you!!!!!! Xxx


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## bubumaci

Oki Doki - we now have the blood test results in ...
Still looking good - we now have to pray that we get the progression we need for the next blood test on Monday ... <3 :cloud9:
 



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## Northernmonke

Wow it is going to be a long weekend for you!!! Enjoy it, relax and keep calm. I know when o got my bfp I was so sure it wouldn't progress. I am really routing for you! !! Xx


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## Unlucky41

dovkav123 So sorry this cycle hasn't worked for you :hugs::hugs::hugs:

Sandy- how did your transfer go? How is the husband??

Bub congrats on the wonderful news! 2014 is your year!!


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## bubumaci

Dovkav, I didn't see the results from your test yesterday - how did it go?

Sandy, how are you Sweetie?

Thank you girls ... praying hard that the numbers rise properly :)


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## Sandy83

Wow great news bubmaci!

Dovkav, hope you're next test shows a positive

AFM I now have 1 outstanding blastocyst on board yay! Xx


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## bubumaci

Yay Sandy, that's great news!! :dust::dust: <3


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## dovkav123

Sandy, Congrats! Hoping and praying for cozy implantation for 9 a happy months!
Bubumaci, is your beta on Monday? Praying for you too!

I got BFN at 15dpiui and i'll quit my progest. tonight.
My hubby said:"we'll try again. We won't give up"
I feel we are going backwards with IUI, and our baby step fertility treatment will drive me crazy soon.


I assume eggs and sperm are healthy. My R tube failed this month, I'd like to give a chance to a L tube next month.
I would do another IUI if I have a mature follicle on the L side. If I have a follicle on the R side again, we'll do a natural w/o meds IVF again.
It'll give me peace of mind that I did everyhing I could...
Than I need to convince my hubby for stims. Soak myself in nasty, ugly hormones.

ON the other hand, if my egg quality was bad in all 5 egg retrievals. It is possibility that a good egg will pop out during IUIs. And we won't catch it. 
I give this up to God and he'll decide...


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## Sandy83

Dovkav, looks like you have a great plan in place and dot my fx'd for you

Bubmaci, Are you testing today? :hugs:

AFM, doing ok feeling a little tired but getting there. Got a call from the clinic this morning to say that they re graded my other embryo's and were able to freeze 2 of them so over the moon with that :happydance:

Hope the rest of you ladies are doing well :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

That's great, that you have two frosties &#55357;&#56399;
My second Beta is tomorrow morning. Please keep fingers crossed, that we have had good development. Lots of :dust: to us :)

Dovkav, I am so sorry that it didn't work! I hope that you can find a plan that works for you, you really deserve it! Bless you DH :)


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## Unlucky41

Dovkav love your husband attitude - no giving up keep trying as long as there are eggs they is bound to be a good one somewhere!!!:hugs::hugs:

Sandy so happy for you one great embrie inside and two waiting for you in the freezer !! Praying that you get a good beta :dust::dust::dust: How is the husband going?

Bub everything cross for you tomorrow!! Looking forward to hear about your bit grin and smile on your face tomorrow!!


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## bubumaci

I have good news :) :) :)
My HCG more than tripled since Friday ... we are pregnant :cloud9::cloud9::happydance: <3 <3
Cheshire Cat is definitely back :)
 



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## Sandy83

Great news bubmaci I'm so happy for you xx


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## dovkav123

BUbumci :happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance:
This is it! You made it!
I am excited for you!!!:dust::dust::dust:


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## dovkav123

My cervical canal is 8cm long. An average is 3cm. Should I worry?
During my IUI my dr. told me this news. 
I have read that 2cm short cervix at 24 weeks of pregnancy can cause a preterm labor. 
Nobody is talking about a looong cervix.
I guess spermies has a longer trip....


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## bubumaci

Puh, dovkav, I have absolutely no idea! I don't know how long my cervical canal is never had it measured...


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## Unlucky41

Bub congrats :happydance::happydance: you officially got your:bfp:

Did you and husband go out to celebrate ? Any symptoms yet

Dovkav don't think a long cervix is anything to worry about what did your RE say ? When are you going to do your next natural or IUI? 

hoping 2014 is the year for everyone!!!


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## bubumaci

:happydance: Well, we had visitors from Friday - Sunday, so we didn't have a celebration yet.
Symptoms - none. Only the OHSS that came back around implantation ... painful ovaries + very very bloated - plus peeing a lot and waking up at crazy hours of the morning ... other than that - no symptoms at all. Breasts are not more sore than normal ... if I hadn't had the OHSS flare back up and if I weren't peeing like a world champion, I wouldn't even have tested on Friday...


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## dovkav123

Please read this


https://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2013/05/22/feminine-hygiene-products.aspx

Furthermore, to give tampons and pads that pristine, clean white look, the fibers used must be bleached. Chlorine is commonly used for this, which can create toxic dioxin and other disinfection-by-products (DBPs) such as trihalomethane. Studies show that dioxin collects in your fatty tissues, and according to a draft report by the US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), dioxin a serious public health threat that has no "safe" level of exposure! Published reports show that even low or trace levels of dioxins may be linked to:

Abnormal tissue growth in the abdomen and reproductive organs 
Abnormal cell growth throughout the body 
Immune system suppression 
Hormonal and endocrine system disruption


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## Unlucky41

Bub I didn't have any symptoms until 8 weeks just enjoy this moment and celebrate this milestone with each other :flower: 
When is your scan ?

Dovkav - really pray that you get some good news this year :hugs::hugs:

Sandy are you feeling ?

:hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs: to all


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## bubumaci

Thanks Jo. We have an ultrasound on Monday morning, to see if we have an amniotic cavity (or two) xx


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## dovkav123

Bubumaci, googd luck on Monday! Prayers for you.
I have u/s on my CD9, we'll see what we'll find and what we'll do next than.


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## Sandy83

Not too good! Started bleeding on Friday deja vu as with every other cycle. I'm considering myself out for this cycle!!!! Had my breakdown on Friday and starting to pull myself together now. Putting all my energy in to DH at the mo and concentrating on him. Just felt like this cycle ad different guess not xx


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## dovkav123

I'm so gutted for you, sandy. This is terrible(((( we will be here when you need usxxxxx


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## bubumaci

Sandy :hugs: I am so sorry! Do you have a test scheduled?


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## Sandy83

Yes bloods are tomorrow x


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## bubumaci

My fingers are crossed that it isn't Déjà vû! Are you still bleeding, or was it a one-off on Friday?
How is DH feeling? Xxx


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## Sandy83

Well it's confirmed it's a BFN :cry:

On top of everything DH has been admitted back to hospital as he has an infection. Just feel like things keep going from bad to worse is it ever going to get better :cry:


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## bubumaci

Oh Sandy, I really am so very sorry! :hugs: and I really hope that DH fights off the silly infection! Poor thing! 
I really hate it, that when it rains, it really pours!! Hopefully, your luck will turn around soon. And I hope that DH feels better really soon! xxx


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## dovkav123

sandy:hugs:


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## Unlucky41

Sandy83 said:


> Well it's confirmed it's a BFN :cry:
> 
> On top of everything DH has been admitted back to hospital as he has an infection. Just feel like things keep going from bad to worse is it ever going to get better :cry:

So sorry to hear this Sandy really do hope DH recovers asap and that your have better luck with the frosties. Do you know when you will be schedule to do a FET ? 

:hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:


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## Unlucky41

bub how was your scan - one or two? was it the Monday that just past or the Monday coming up ?


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## bubumaci

The scan went well yesterday, thanks for asking Jo! We saw one perfect little amniotic cavity and the beginnings of the yolk sac in it. The bloods were looking good too. We have another appointment next week Wednesday morning (at 6w+2d) to see *hopefully* the heartbeat <3

DH named it "Pünktchen" which essentially means sweet little dot :cloud9:

Sorry that I didn't update... I just felt bad because a few people here have been getting bad news and I don't want anyone feeling worse. I know only too well what it is like, when others are just bursting with happiness while I feel that my world is crumbling around all around me ... went through it too many times. Huge :hugs:

Sarah - haven't seen you around for a while! How are you doing Sweetie? Nor Clare ... :flower:
 



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## Sandy83

Bubmaci, please don't stop updating on your progress. For me it gives me hope that IVF does work and to never give up. Love the picture that is great news can't wait to here about the next scan. 

Unlucky, We are probably going to hold off on FET till DH is on the road to recovery so looking at August/September time. Just taking one step at a time!!!! xx


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## bubumaci

That's so sweet of you Sandy! In that case, I hope that I can shower you with :dust: and good luck!!

How is DH feeling today? I hope a lot better than yesterday already!


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## Sandy83

He is doing ok been getting Xrays etc today so hopefully should only be in another day or so xx


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## MrsE75

Hi ladies

Sorry I've been AWOL just so busy with work at the moment I am working weekends and everything! 

Anyway Sandy my gosh my love you are having such a hard time and I'm send you lots of &#10084;&#65039;&#10084;&#65039;&#128591;. I hate it when people say God only gives us what we can cope with - if that's so why the heck does he have to do it all at once. I really do feel you and wish there was something we could so to help. You and your DH are in my prayers xxx

Bub - huge congratulations! So what was different this cycle that you think helped? I'm always keen to find out! Wishing you a happy 9 months xx

AQ - not seen you on here unless I've missed your post somewhere but hope you and hubby are doing ok xx

Dovkav and Unlucky - how are you guys any news on cycles for you?

Afm - busy with work as I said. Can't remember if I posted but I do have a slightly raised level on my immunes so I will need steroid injections and possibly intrepelis (not sure of spelling!). Plus hubby has 33% sperm fragmentation so he's now on high dosage of Vit E and Vit C to bring that down but can't cycle for 3 myths for the vita to take effect. So won't be until May/June I don't think.


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## bubumaci

Fingers are tightly crossed, that he feels better soon and that he can come home (and that the treatment is doing what it's supposed to be doing)! You are both really strong, I can't imagine having to go through that! :hugs:


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## bubumaci

Mrs E ... Jo (Unlucky) just needs to update her status ;) She got her BFP in December ;)

Thank you!! :)
What did we do differently? Well, I started doing hypnotherapy (for IVF) and other than that, DH had a TESE done and before I went in for the egg retrieval, they told me that they couldn't use it at all and they were thawing two straws from the sperm frozen in spring 2012 (it was a freak spermiogramme after taking Tamoxifen for 6 weeks, where he had an amazing spermiogramme and they froze 6 straws) ... so I am guessing that we had some good quality sperm in there... plus me being very calm and doing the hypnotherapy daily ... that is what was different this time around...

I am still tentative with getting excited - we still need to see the heartbeat next week to be counted as a viable pregnancy. So fingers crossed for that!

I really hope that the steroids and intralipids as well as the vitamins for DH are your magical cocktail! It will be May/June before you know it :) :hugs:


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## MrsE75

Unlucky - you need to change your name!! Wow so 2 BFPs so far so now just 3 of us left to get ours! It will happen I'm sure of it!

Congrats ladies really happy for you xx


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## Unlucky41

Thanks MrsE75 I am currently 14 weeks and 6 days and having a baby gril:happydance:

Things are a bit scary though as I just started to spot! 

MrsE75 keep healthy and strong and we are all praying that your cycle is a big success!!!


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## dovkav123

Unlucky, bubumaci I am seriously very happy to hear an update about your bumps.
I am jelous to people who got preggo with one try.
You and many more girls worked soo hard for your miracle. You so deserve it. You give us hope, we'll see the light soon in the end of this nightmare tunnel.

Mrs, I am so sorry about your hubby's sperm, I afraid my hubby may have the same problem. I give him anti-oxidants in advance. I give him 1000mg vitc, 1000mg vitE, zinc and selenium, q-10. How about you?
He quit alcochol for more than 10 days.
You are on the right path, you'll get treatment too and you'll be lucky very soon.:dust::dust:


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## bubumaci

Thank you Dovkav - yes, I also found that my heart would break each time someone only tried once and had success (even though I was also happy for them - going through this nightmare, you don't wish it on anybody!). And I am glad if our success (we are praying so hard to see a heartbeat next Wednesday!) can give you hope!!! Still quite a ways from having a bump - the one I still have is bloating from OHSS ;)

Have you had DHs sperm tested? In your signature, you say that you have super sperm ... so why do you think that something may be wrong?

:dust::dust::dust:


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## Cjohnson13

I hope you ladies don't mind if I join...... Iv read all the hardships everyone has went through. I also have had a rough time conceiving a baby. I had a great ivf ... Or so I thought all but 1 egg made it to day 5 blast. Put 1 back in and it resulted in a cp. my first fet was much easier on my body but also ended in a cp. however this time they thought it was ectopic because my beta continued to rise irregularly so it was an emergency laproscopy and d&e ...... I just started lupron for my next fet and I'm praying this time will be the last


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## Sandy83

Welcome Cjohnson :hi:

Sorry to hear about your cp. Fx'd this FET is for you :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Hi Cj :howdy:
I am so sorry you have had to join this group - on the other hand, this group is filled with fantastic, supportive women :hugs:
My fingers are crossed for you, that this FET is it! xx
:dust::dust::dust:


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## Sandy83

Bubmaci, how you doing, are you excited for Wednesday :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Hey Sandy,
I am doing OK thank you :hugs: ... still not *thank goodness* suffering from any bad symptoms - only mega tired (can't get through the day without a nap or two) and frequent visits to the loo :)
I am not sure if I'm imagining it, but I do find if I open our cupboard with herbs in, that that hits my nose pretty hard ... and the other one - when I open the boxes with washing powder (be that for the dishwasher or for the washing machine) that I smell that very strongly.

I have very mixed feelings - excited, because this whole journey is so exciting ... and the same time of course worried that there won't be a HB... I am thinking positively the whole time and know that there really isn't any reason why there shouldn't be one - but of course after what we have gone through, I am still tentative to believe this is really it (even though each cell in my body feels that it is).

Do you already know when you will be doing your FET? xx


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## Sandy83

Sounds all good, fx'd the symptoms won't affect you too much. I understand you being tentative about it. 

If you don't mind me asking at what point have you got to with other cycles before it's failed? I've got a good feeling that this is the one for you :happydance:

I won't be going ahead with FET until we get DH sorted. He will be going through chemo till June then require a stem cell transplant which is a month in hospital so probably start FET about Aug/sept time xx


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## bubumaci

Hehe, I hope so too :) On the other hand, having symptoms kind of reassure me, that everything is going OK *crazy*

No, I don't mind in the slightest. Basically, the first 6 transfers, the blood tests at 6dp + 9dp5dt showed that there was no pregnancy - but all egg retrievals, fertilisations etc. were successful. The embryos didn't develop that well, a couple of times we had the beginnings of a blastocyst, quite a few Morulae and a few many-celled at day 5 when we did the transfer. For the 7th and 8th transfer, we had two good looking blastocysts at the transfer. For both, the HCG had risen for the first blood test, but not very much (August = 7,10 and December = 6,80) and by the second blood test hadn't risen sufficiently / was going down (August = 6,80 and December = 8,10) which showed, that my body had started producing HCG, so perhaps the little bean had started implanting, but that I had a very very early miscarriage (chemical).
Also, the other blood serum values (progesterone + oestrogen) didn't rise as they should - which is all very different this time! (I have posted the three tests from this time around). 
In total, we have had over 80 eggs retrieved (I think 88), over 50 fertilised (I think 55) and 20 transferred ... The first try, I thought it had worked, but it hadn't ... second, third, fourth and fifth, I felt it hadn't .. 6th I really hoped, but nope... 7th I actually felt that it worked, but equally felt when it was all over ... 8th, I wasn't sure ... and this time around, the flaring up of the OHSS was a good sign that HCG was building up.

I never got spotting / :witch: before I stopped using the progesterone in any of the failed cycles - but always (with the exception of April last year, when I went a month without a period ... strangely, I then did get my period the day my Mother died and again two weeks later, the day of her funeral) I would get my period within about 2-3 days max. of stopping the progesterone.

Thank you, I hope you're right :) :)

How is DH doing? Is he back home again now? I really feel so sorry that you (plural) are having to go through this! I can't even begin to imagine what it must be like! Is he struggling with the chemo? xxx :kiss:
 



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## Sandy83

Thanks Bubmaci, it gives me hope hearing your story :hugs: Your numbers this time look amazing!!!! 

Dh got back home last Wednesday so been nice to have him home. He goes back in on Friday for his 2nd dose of chemo. He is coping amazingly he is feeling tired and slight nausea at times but apart from that he is just getting on with things, he is so strong!!!! His hair is starting to come out now but he is dealing with it so well. We both have the attitude that we can't change the fact that he has cancer so we just have to deal with the situation as best we can and stay strong! xx


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## dovkav123

I had 23mm follicle( O was yesterday or tody) during IUI, 12mm uterine lining, My dr. used a tubal catheter, cos it's very flexible and thin. We had 45 mil sperm postwash, 20%morfology, 33%motility. I felt a cramp during the procedure. Dr.told me that bleeding after it is normal. I did have a drop of blood an hour later. Later in the evening I had brown spotting too.
I am testing around 24th at home.

My hubby's SA was good again. I guess I give him antioxidants and we need to keep trying.

bubumaci, what hypnosis did you use before ET? 
Hope and pray for a wonderful experience during u/s tomorrow!
Sandy, I am sending blessings for your tough times right now. Pray and hope your hubby will recover easy.


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## Sandy83

Dovkav, I've got everything crossed for this IUI. :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

I really admire both of you, Sandy! Wishing you both lots and lots of strength! xxx

Dovkav - that sounds promising! Does sound like DH has nice, healthy sperm. Have you ever had the DNA fragmentation testing done (since you said at some point earlier, you thought he had poor fragmentation)?

Fingers crossed for this IUI!
The hypnosis I used is from the following site : 
I used "The IVF Companion" - which has three tracks. 1st is an introduction, that you only need to listen to one. 2nd is pre-embro transfer which you listen to daily from when you start the medication until the day of embryo transfer and the 3rd is post-embryo transfer - which you listen for all the days after that. I continued to listen to that track even beyond our positive blood tests, until I saw "Pünktchen" - at which point I downloaded the Pregnancy Relaxation tracks.
https://www.natalhypnotherapy.co.uk/6.html


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## dovkav123

We'll do dna fragm test in 2 weeks if this cycle fails. His age is a concern. No matter what SA is, still could be problems....
Congrats with a little bubu heartbeat. This is official! There are 3 of you under one roof!!
Can you go to a gyn office now?
Thanks for hypno info.


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## Unlucky41

Bub so happy for you. Did you cry when you hear the heart beat? 

Dovkav, really hope this time is the winner for you and like Bub really admire your spirit and positive attitude. Sending heaps of prayers your way.

Sandy how are you and your husband keeping up?
Your husband sounds like a very strong person I hope your relationship grows even stronger through all the hardship sending some hugs your way.:hugs::hugs::hugs:


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## bubumaci

Actually, when I wrote that, I hadn't yet heard the heartbeat ;) On Wednesday last week, we saw the little dot pulsating. But on Friday, I went to my OBGYN and she did a full check up, including ultrasound ... and I was so taken aback, when I heard the heart beating! Hadn't expected to be able to and just had my hand over my mouth, staring! Was really proud of the little bean, because it had grown from 4,3mm on Wednesday, to 6,2mm on Friday! Dead on track <3
Coming Friday, I go together with DH for another meeting, to get my Mother Pass and can't wait to see how it has grown and to hear the heart beat again (will record it this time!!)...
Jo - you really need to change your status!!! ;)

Dovkav - yes, we were released from the fertility clinic on Wednesday after seeing the heartbeat. How are you feeling?

Clare... where are you Honey? Are you OK?
Sarah? :(

Sandy - how is DH doing? He had his second dose of Chemo on Friday, didn't he?


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## Sandy83

Bubmaci, amazing news about your little bean and hearing the heartbeat. :hugs:

Yes DH had his 2nd dose of chemo on Saturday but had a bit of a nightmare on Friday as he got an infection in his central line which I believe it's the nurse's fault so not happy, so he is also on antibiotics yet again but on a positive he should hopefully be home tomorrow if all blood tests come back good. xx


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## bubumaci

Oh man! They are not making it easy for him, are they :(
How many lines does he have? xx


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## Sandy83

No not easy at all!!!! He has 2 lines in. 

The other day he needed some platelets and once they were finished he had to buzz the nurse to come. He did that and then 30 minutes later a nurse turned up and then went on to ask how long they had been finished and once she knew it finished 30 mins ago she started to panic and went on to realize that they have set in the tube and were solid due to not being flushed through when they had finished. She then had to try to force then through the line to unblock it. After 15 mins she succeeded but is something that could have been avoided if she did her job properly. Luckily there are more good nurses on the ward than bad ones!!!!!


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## bubumaci

That's so bad :( It is good, that there are more good nurses than bad ones - but it only takes one bad one to do some real damage. That is the thing about these professions (which are seriously underpaid) ... If I make a mistake in my quarter end report ... I'll just correct it and no worries. In the medical profession, if you make a mistake, it can cost - worst case - someone their life! :(


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## Sandy83

Morning Ladies

How is everyone doing? It's gone all quiet on here

Bubmaci, Have you had any scans lately? Any updates? :hugs:

Dovkav, How's the IUI going have you tested etc? :hugs:

Unlucky, How you doing? :hugs: 

Hope all you other ladies are ok haven't heard from you in a while xx


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## bubumaci

Hi Sandy :)
It is very quiet, isn't it!
I am doing well, thank you! Had an appointment (together with DH) at my gynaecologist on Friday. Received my Mutterpass (the document we get here in Germany, containing everything about the pregnancy and should be kept with you the whole time) and we did get to see Pünktchen again <3 Heart was beating away, and now that it is a teeny bit bigger, could really see it bang in the middle. Pünktchen had grown and was 1,18cm (measuring a day shorter than a week before), but doctor said that was nothing to worry about.
No struggles with the pregnancy so far - other than overwhelming tiredness. Have become slightly queasy on one our two occasions, but no dreaded morning sickness. Still peeing frequently. Breasts don't seem to be doing anything yet, the tenderness is only slight.
Here, a piccie from Friday :) :cloud9:

Dovkav - weren't you going to test today?

How are you and DH, Sandy?

Here, a piccie from Friday :) :cloud9:

Jo, how are you?

Clare, Sarah - where are you?????:shrug:
 



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## Sandy83

Bubmaci, Love the pic glad to here everything is going well with a nice strong heartbeat :happydance:

We are doing good, DH has been a lot better after this dose of Chemo and is actually going to work today and hopefully for the rest of the week if he is feeling up to it. Think he is just wanting a bit of normality at the moment. We are at the specialist today to talk about his donor stem cell transplant then got bloods this week and just wait for the phone call to say he is back in for 3rd treatment xx


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## bubumaci

That is great that DH is doing better! Do let us know how the meeting with the specialist today goes! xx


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## dovkav123

BFN today. I tested with a clear digital. Today is 2-3 days before my AF. The test was 96% accurate. I am out ladies. 
My hubby wants to do again IUI. BUT I say NO MORE! 
Now it is a time to decide about about dna fragm test. It could be ready by next IVF next month. Should we do it?
My hubby decreased his alcochol intake and I am loading him with antioxidnats.
If we have a bad sperm, what will it change? 
Will we skip IVF? 
Will we increase antioxidants? 
Will we wait for 2 more months sperm to heal?

Sandy, I am sending blessings to your husband. Stem cell transplant is a huge medical discovery. It can treat many conditions. I hope and pray you'll find a donor soon!

:thumbup:bubumaci for a growing punktchen!


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## Northernmonke

Dovkav - YES do the DNA frag test, finally when we got told to do ours they said to do IMSI and hey presto, pregnant with twins and 2 in the freezer! Hubbys results were 34% bad by the way. x


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## bubumaci

Hi Dovkav - I agree with Northernmonke. It is much better to get a definitive answer than to suppose / wonder. At times, you have said his fragmentation is bad, at others, that his sperm are good ... You won't know, unless you get it tested. Due to the fact that he has such a lot of sperm, you really would be perfect candidates for IMSI, like NM says :) I am so sorry, that this IUI seems to have failed again!! :hugs2:


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## Sandy83

Dovkav, Sorry to hear IUI didn't work. I would love to give you advice on DNA frag but unfortunately me knowledge is limited on this but sounds like the other ladies have gave you good advice and Northern's experience with it seems to have been positive sending you lots of :hugs: 

Will update you ladies after the appointment xx


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## Sandy83

Well ladies had appointment yesterday and they didn't tell us anything new from what we already knew but went through the risks and % of successful transplant etc. Think it is all becoming real now! Was able to push it to the back of my mind before but the truth is DH has a 50% chance of surviving this which is becoming very scary!!!!!! 

Why is life so damn hard for some people!!!!! :cry:


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## bubumaci

Oh Sandy! That is such a scary statistic! Is that what they have said? What exactly would the transplant involve?
I can't find the right words! Only wishing, praying, that you are in the 50% who survive category and much much strength going through this! :( :( 
:hug:


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## Sandy83

The transplant is a simple process where they kill off his full immune system with Chemo then replace it with a donor stem cells but there are so many risk the statistics are

10% mortality
40% of relapse within 2/3 years
50% of survival which can have potential possible side affect of Graft versus host disease which can be from mild to chronic stages or can have a full cure.


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## dovkav123

Fight that! Sandy 
Do everything you possible can. He is a strong man, he'll make it!
You're in my prayers.

Thank you for a support, ladies. You are the best. I did call the clinic about a sperm dna test.

Congrats, bubmaci with a new preggo journal


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## bubumaci

Sandy, those really are frightening statistics ... I really pray, that you fall into the very upper part of that 50%!! Do they have reasons to anticipate which patient will fall into which category? Can they give you better chances?

Dovkav - what did the clinic say?


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## Sandy83

Thanks for your kind words ladies, it's greatly appreciated :hugs: We are looking on the positive side as best we can and just taking one step at a time as there are still a lot of hurdles to get over before the transplant. xx


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## Unlucky41

Hi All have been missing due to working very long hours!

Sandy I am so sorry definitely keep you in my prayers but I agree with the others give your husband a reason to live and he will fight bad the bad cells. When do you get to know that the treatment is working ?

If it does relapse what would the options be then ? So sorry to hear this Sandy :hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:

Dovkav so sorry to hear that your last IUI didn't work have you worked out what your next steps are going to be now. Really do hope you get some good news real soon

Bub love your story


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## Sandy83

Well he will get a PET scan in the next week or 2 to assess if the chemo is working and then he really needs to be in remission after the 6 doses of chemo to have the best chance of recovering from the transplant. He should finish chemo about May/June time then straight on to transplant which he will be in hospital for a month and once he is released he should be out of immediate danger but within 2 years is the most cruical time for a relapse etc. With going through the donor transplant they do have more options open to them if he does relapse but haven't gone into full details about that yet xx


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## bubumaci

That is a pretty tough schedule! :(
Is the transplant giving him new stem cells? Or what does it entail?
How is he coping with the chemo? I really hope it is doing its job and killing off the cancer cells!!!!

I really am keeping my fingers tightly crossed for you guys! <3


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## Sandy83

Yeah the transplant is to give him donor stem cells so they will do an intense chemo treatment prior to the transplant to kill off his bone marrow and immune system hopefully eradicating the cancer cells then give him the donor stem cells to start producing a new immune system and bone marrow the procedure of replacing the stem cells takes about 1-2 hours but the chance of infection is extremely high which is why he is in hospital for a month as if his body is going to cause complications with the transplant it will do in the first 2-4 weeks. 

He is coping with this dose of chemo really well, he has went back to work this week and he is a MET fitter with in a body shop for cars which is a really manual job so is coping extremely well at the moment xx


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## dovkav123

We are doing dna sperm test on Monday.
I have checked his sperm papers and found out that the first test almost a year ago was the best one. 19% morfology and super high volume and perfect motility. Last few months his morfology was 10-5% and motility on the low nr. He had a very stressful time, his dad was sick, we went from hospital to hospital.... we had little sex, little vitamins and lots of coffee. 
March test was much better with morfology 20% and 30%motility. l am glad his nr improved. We expect good dna results.
Loads of vitamins and sex seems to help.
If we have high dna fragm, I'll look for a clinic who does IMSI and do the full stim IVF. There is a treatment. My RE denies it.


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## Sandy83

Dovkav - Sounds like you have a plan in place fx'd you get some good results :hugs:

Bubmaci - How you doing? xx


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## bubumaci

Dovkav - that is good that you are getting it tested. At least then, you will have certainty! The morphology sounds good, the motility too. Good luck for Monday!

Sandy, I am doing OK, thanks. Just back from the dentist, had my teeth cleaned and general check-up done. Everything OK there :) (Don't know why, but I am still so proud not to have any fillings ... at 38 :D). Can't wait to see Pünktchen again next Friday! I keep praying, that it's growing as it should. Can feel the top of my uterus above my pubic bone and I am seriously bloated (since it's not baby yet). Even if I suck my tummy in, there is a bump and it is firm *lol*
Other than that, feeling fine, thank you. Have the odd moment of queasiness, but then I just need to nibble on something and I am OK. The tiredness hasn't got better yet, but I am fine with that. So all in all, this pregnancy is being very kind to me :dance:

How are you feeling? We keep asking (I keep asking), how DH is doing - but how are you doing? xxx


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## Unlucky41

Dovkav I am happy for you that you did the test and proved your RE wrong. So what is your next steps? 

Sandy the treatment that your husband have to go through sounds horrible but it also sounds promising. Hopefully his body is receptive to the donor cells and he can go on producing good cells on his own. Pray that everything goes smoothly. That is tough that he has to go back to work? Are they understanding ? how much time is he going to take off for the treatment or does it just depends how he goes?:hugs::hugs: to you can't imagine want you going through.

Bub that is something to be thankful for no fillings!!!


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## dovkav123

So ladies, after 2 test cancelations, lots of thinking and debating we did a sperm dna test. Thanks to you all for pushing me to do it!
Before writing here I wanted to ask you girls, what should we do this month. IUI, IVF or natural TTC.
I think I made up my mind -natural cycle IVF

The sperm results should be in 2-3 weeks. I have an appointment on Friday for u/s on CD8. Possible ER on Monday or Tuesday.
My dr. wants us to wait till the results. She doesn't have a treatment for a high fragm sperm anyways. We are doing for our own peace and mind. However, If we do IVF and we get lucky than we did dna test for nothing...
His morfology improved from 5% to 19% last month. Motility improved from20% to 30%. He is on the normal range. I think we need to do IVF and hope that the sperm is still in good shape for this April cycle.
This time during IVF I'll ask my dr. to test my hormones during egg retrieval and after embryo transfer. Maybe I need extra help for my TWW.

Unlucky, how far are you along? Do you know a gender?

Bub, no fillings! Great! You must have good genes. I don't eat candies and sweets so I hope I won't have any more fillings and (2)crowns...I am "Lucky" we have a bad gene paradontosis from my both sides my mom's and my dad's.

Sandy, how is your day?


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## Sandy83

Dovkav, with the improvement with DH's sperm over the last couple of months i think you have nothing to lose by doing a natural IVF. I would say go for it!

AFM, Nothing new to report DH is doing good and will be going back in for 3rd treatment on Thursday. 

Unlucky as for DH's work they are totally understanding and it was DH's choice to go back to work as he wanted a bit of normality to things and was sick of sitting in the house doing nothing when he felt fine. xx


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## bubumaci

Dovkav, that is great that you feel comfortable that you are getting the DNA-fragmentation tested. My personal opinion would be to wait until you get the results! If the fragmentation is high, you would be putting yourself through what might be unnecessary surgery, because with the high fragmentation, a different approach might be required. If you have taken the step to get tested, then I would just give yourself a break this month instead of rushing into it again. Morphology + motility say nothing about the sperm's genetic structure. And if everything is OK, then you can just go for it again the following month.
I also find it a bit strange, that your Dr. has you bouncing between IUIs and IVF! What is your diagnosis?
To me, it would make more sense to a) wait until you have the results and see whether you are facing an issue there and then b) if you are, to have a medicated IVF cycle with IMSI (potentially even with a TESE, since some studies have shown, that the DNA-Fragmentation happens at a later stage and that sperm retrieved in a TESE show lower levels of fragmentation).
I think you would be giving yourself a break (I think you do put yourselves under a lot of pressure), you would have more certainty as to what you are facing and finally - this all costs money!
I know you just want to forge on ahead and finally get there - but sometimes, it does help to take a break and a step back <3

Fingers crossed for the 3rd treatment on Thursday, Sandy! :)

AFM - only a few more days before I get to see Pünktchen again ... praying so hard that he/she is developing as he/she should and that everything is OK. I think it is... uterus is definitely growing away. It just gets really scary when you read accounts of people with missed miscarriages around the time I am now ... on the one hand, it is fantastic having practically no symptoms (just terribly terribly tired and peeing frequently, also in the night) because I can really enjoy the pregnancy... on the other hand, there are no signs that Pünktchen is OK...


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## Bluebell bun

Hi ladies, hope it is ok to join you all. We have had 2 previous failed cycles and my ET for my 3rd cycle was cancelled in November due to my blood pressure being very high and having a bleed in theatre at the time of ER.
We have 2 x day 3 (6cell) eggs frozen and 1 x 2BB blastocyst frozen on day 6. I have had 2 embryos transferred each time in my previous failed cycles (day2 and day 5 transfers). I am due for embryo transfer next week but my clinic are advising we transfer the single day6 blast as they do not want to risk a twin preg on account of my blood pressure.
I am really struggling emotionally with the whole business and at this moment cannot imagine being successful with one never mind 2 babies!!! It just seems like a bit of a backward step only putting one back?
Any thoughts on what you would do? I have been really upset this morning and just feel like it will never work for us :cry:


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## bubumaci

Hi Sweetie :hugs::howdy:
I totally get how you are feeling. AC is such a tough journey, often having to face hurdles, getting past them, only to be faced by more.
As you can see from my signature, we had to do through ICSI 6 times and have 9 transfers, because finally succeeding - and each time it was a failure, having to question whether or not we would ever get there...
It is very difficult, but I would trust your clinic... What I certainly would do in your place, check out why your blood pressure is high! Get yourself fully checked out, make sure that everything is OK. I firmly believe that any additional stress will affect the outcome of the tries and it is important that you be in a good shape both physically and mentally.
We are here for you - if you have any questions, please ask and we will try to answer / advise ... sometimes, it really takes a lot of patience and more patience for us to get there. The sad truth is, that it often is a question of luck, as to when it works. In natural cycles, it may often happen that an egg gets fertilised, but that because of genetic defects, it won't develop further and it won't come to pregnancy or perhaps a chemical ... it happens more commonly than you would think - even for healthy couples. So just as many couples have to keep trying for a year or so, often we have to try more than once or twice or thrice for that miracle baby to nestle down in our uterus. Thing that makes it more difficult for us, I think, is that we know we are transferring a potential baby ... and that makes it all the more devastating each time it doesn't work.

Keep your head up, Bluebell (love that name :)), and keep plodding forward patiently. If you feel you don't trust your doctors or your clinic - then maybe find a different one. It is so important that you are being treated by people whom you can trust ... they are getting a whole heap of money for it, so you should feel that you are in good hands :hugs2:


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## Bluebell bun

Thanks bub. Have been stalking this thread so know what a difficult time you have been through. Congrats on your BFP:flower: . I think you are right, ultimately it is all in the hands of the gods. I will maybe ask the embryologist to give me a call to discuss it. I think the pressure and expectation just gets worse with every cycle :nope:


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## Sandy83

Bluebell, I agree with Bubumaci and trust your clinic not sure where in the world you are but with NHS in England they will only transfer 1 blastocyst due to the increased rate of it being successful. PMA all the way. Keep us updated xx


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## dovkav123

Bluebell, welcome!:hi:
I would transfer one at a time too. Your high blood pressure may put you on the higher risk of preeclampsia. First of all you need to know the reason of your high blood pressure.
1. genetic
2. kidney problems
3. high intake of salt(eating lots of processed food)
4. overweight
5. stress

You have to treat the cause of it. 
I hope and pray your frosty will snuggle in sweet and cozy. 
Pease let us know how are you doing.
We are here for you:flower:


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## dovkav123

Bubumaci, thank you for your time and advice.:hugs:
I do go through lots of pressure. April is our 9th month of our intense fertility screenings and treatments. WE didn't ttc naturally at all. I would had a baby any minute now if our first IVF was successful.:cry:
WE did natural cycle IVFs w/o success. Then, I needed to know if my tubes are open. It was our choice to flush the tubes, and do IUIs. 
When I came to my RE in the first consulatation, she adviced me to do lap, IUI or IVF. My husband and I are running this fertility game, my dr. does what we want and we are grateful for that. We do pay private, so we don't have limitation.
I am just angry with my dr. that she didn't stress on my hubby's sperm. It was not great at all. His morfology was (untere werte.)Only last month it was on the normal range. I really want to take advantage of his good morfology and go for a natural cycle IVF this month. Maybe his problem is gone, he is healed, maybe we need to grab that chance and run!
My ER is a joke. I don't even take a painkiller. However, It is a big risk of complications. 
For IVFs he saved up for 2 days, for dna fragm for 4 days, his sperm may have more damage cos of longer time spent in the testicles. Is the test will be accurate?
My clinic performs a testicular biopsy.

It is such a beautiful time of the year. Blooming trees and flowers. I am in such uplifting mood and positive thoughts. 
I am going for it, bubu and I need your blessings.
I hope and pray I choose a good decision to do a natural cycle IVF in April.


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## Sandy83

Dovkav, even tho Bubumaci gave you great advice and has obviously had loads of experience in this and is an IVF guru but you have to go with your heart and do what you feel is best. 

For me I've always waited at least 2 to 3 months between cycles and this time obviously taking more like 6 months break but that is what is right for me and what i felt was best. 

I'm sure we are all behind you 100% with your decision and have got everything crossed that this is the one! :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Sweetie (Dovkav), Sandy is right - you have to do what is right for you!! Your gut might be telling you that the time is right. I remember I couldn't wait to try and try and try. Then last year, July/August, I really wanted to go ahead - even though my RE didn't want to do the transfer, because he thought my progesterone was too high - but I was desperate too, just having lost Mama in May, I believed it would work. It was our best try at that time and ended in ... a chemical.
Sometimes, you do just have to do what you feel is right - and if that time is now, then go for it :) :hugs: (If our first-third ICSIs had been successful, my Mother would have still met her Grandchild *sniff* & my Grandmother, her Greatgrandchild... But now, she and my Grandmother are my guardian angels and have sent me this little miracle). I totally know how you feel!!
Concerning the saving up of sperm - our clinic has always said Karenzzeit of 3 days (I think it is 3-5 days), so I really don't think that 4 days for the DNA Fragmentation will affect the test in any negative way, I don't think you need to worry about that.

I will be keeping all fingers and toes crossed for you! Our weather is really beautiful, the sun is shining, the flowers are starting to show themselves, plants are starting to bloom ... lots of positive feelings and new life out there :) (Just so you know, the day I went in for my transfer, on February 15th, it was a gorgeous day - and I wrote to my DH "today is the perfect day to get pregnant") :) :) 
Please don't think that I wanted to talk you out of anything, I just wrote my thoughts - but you should always always trust in your thoughts and feelings above anything else. If you feel this way, and weren't to try ... you would always wonder!! :flower:


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## dovkav123

Thank you ladies! I would fall apart w/o you!

Bubumaci, I am so sorry about your mother and grandmother loss. I know our love ones are guiding us and helping us every day...
My father in law told us few weeks before his death that we'll get pregnant soon. I know his spirit is flying around us and blessing us...
We stood next to his grave and we were talking that we could of done better for him. Suddenly, black bird flew down from the tree and brushed my hubby's ears with his wings, flew on the other grave and sang very loud and passionate. My hubby even made a movie of this bird. So my hubby looked at the grave: 6 year old boy was resting here. My hubby understood what the bird meant(it's dad's message): I passed away 92, and this boy was only 6 years old. Stop blaming yourself and live in peace....
IN 2011 the bird flew in my mom's window. At the similar time two birds flew in our apartment. One bird sat on the little house it was my hubby's grandfather's little decorative house. He loved birds very much. I think he send us a message too. 
My dad fell of the roof and broke his leg. Days later
my father in law passed out in the kitchen and my hubby resuscitated him. So we didn't go to a big planned trip to Sovietsk with a motorhome.

I think we do need to be more connected to nature and read the messages from our love ones.

Sandy, it was a big day for your hubby. How is he feeling?


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## Sandy83

Wow dovkav that is a lovely sorry and believe our loved ones are looking down on us. My mother in law passed away a year and a half ago 5 months after our wedding we were so glad she was able to be there for our wedding but hoped to give her a grandchild but that wasn't meant to be and sure she is looking down on us and it will be our turn soon enough. 

Yeah dh goes in today for his 3rd round of chemo but after this one we are half way through so keeping positive xx


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## bubumaci

That really is so moving, Dovkav! And I also do believe in signs from nature! We are part of nature, but due to how society works, we are not so much in touch with the signs and signals we get - which is a shame!

Sandy, that must be a bit of a relief to have made it half-way through? And I am so glad that DH is coping so well with the chemo, I am sure it can't be easy! Fingers crossed that things keep going smoothly and then that the stem transplant is a huge success and that he recovers well from it!! xxx


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## Sandy83

Thanks Bubumaci :hugs:


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## Unlucky41

Hi All

I am just catching up on the last few days. I have been working late everyday due to year end. It isn't over yet but today is a rest day.

In the last few weeks someone at work long term girlfriend just was told that she had stomach cancer not sure what stage but quite bad. This has really put perspective into our team really this could happen to everyone. After having our baby I really don't want to be working these hours anymore what to enjoy what God has given me and help those around. 

Sandy hope your husband is handling the treatment well. Is he resting at home or still going to work ? I like how you are so patient and I really hope it all pays out at the end. :hugs::hugs:

dovkav - I am currently 19 weeks and having a girl. Hope to feel her kick any time now. 
I am in awe of your determination and your spirit. I am glad your RE takes into account your decision. Really do hope whatever your decision is it works for you. Unfortunately for us we have to be patient and wait for our luck!!!Even now it makes me sad when girls says that they got pregnant with their third really easily when we have to go through so much to even have any hope of a family. Re-charge and I wish you all the best for your next cycle.

Bub hope everything is going well with you -enjoying being pregnant


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## dovkav123

WE went to U/s on Friday. The follicle is on the R side 16.8mm on CD8. ER is on Monday.
I asked my dr about his morfology during dna sperm analysis and I was so sad to know his morfology dropped to 5% again. I feel crushed and cheated. I did my HCG shot yesterday and ER is tomorrow. I have thoughts to cancel IVF and do another IUI. 

My hubby drank a lot yesterday. He wants to have sex today. This is crazy cos tomorrow he needs to provide his sample. It is not a good idea. His volume will be too low.

Unlucky, baby girl! What a great choice of clothes, colors and fashion you can pick! Did you buy any pritty stuff?


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## Sandy83

Unlucky, Congrats on the Baby Girl! :happydance: Sorry to here about your girlfriend and it does give you a shock when something like that happens to someone so close to you. :hugs:

Dovkav, Sorry to hear about DH's morfology are you still going ahead with ER today? If you are Good luck thinking about you :hugs:

Bubumaci, How was the scan on Friday? :happydance:

AFM had a bit of a rough weekend with DH being in hospital as don't sleep as good when he is not there. He also had a bit of an off day yesterday and just isn't sleeping in hospital so he is extremely tired which isn't helping and totally lost his appetite. Kills me to not be there with him and also not being able to help. I've spoke to him this morning and said he is feeling better so fx'd it was just one off day! xx


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## bubumaci

Jo - yay for :pink: :) :)
It is so true - we always hear stories, that put everything in perspective and make us take another look at our lives and what we take for granted, sadly!

Dovkav - that is a really knock concerning DH's morphology! Have you received any other results from the DNA fragmentation analysis? If you are going ahead with it : good luck for the ER today!! xx

Sandy - I am so sorry that DH is feeling so rotten. It does make a difference, being able to sleep in one's own bed! Glad to hear that he is feeling better today and fingers crossed, that it really was just one "off" day!!! xxx

AFM - I was blown away by the u/s on Friday! So Pünktchen measured 2,6cm, heart was beating away beautifully ... but what was really incredible, she looked at Pünktchen from all angles. From above, I could clearly see the two hemispheres of the brain!! Imagine that - in something so tiny! From the side, two little paddle hands and paddle feet ... which incidentally were pedalling away (really bizarre, seeing Pünktchen being so active and not feeling anything *grin*). So she was happy with us :cloud9:
I go back again next week on Thursday - last minute check-up to make sure that everything really is developing well, so that I can feel comfortable flying on the 20th.
The appointment after that is May 5th, to have the nuchal transparency scan done....

Here is a picture from Friday <3
 



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## Sandy83

Wow bubumaci, sounds like you had an amazing scan on Friday, glad it went so well. Where are you off to on 20th? xx


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## bubumaci

Well, we had booked our trip before getting pregnant. To visit Family in Orlando, USA. Especially after my Mother passed away in May last year, contact to that side of the family has become particularly important to me (we have always been close, but became much closer after Mama died).
Practically all family members - DH's parents, my Dad ... have tried to talk us out of flying. Worried, that something might happen to Pünktchen. I have always been pretty matter of fact about it - if there is a medical reason, why I shouldn't fly, I will cancel without hesitation. But all the reading and research I have done indicate, that flying won't harm Pünktchen. (In fact, even one article said that flying was safer than driving in the first trimester, because of all the bumps in the road .. thought of sending that to my MIL after she said, she would rather we drove to Lake Garda!). We won't be quite into second trimester (flying on 11w6d) when we go ... and I know that the risk of miscarriage is higher in first trimester ... and also, the older we get (I'm 38 now). But I also know, that if we are going to lose this baby, there is nothing I can do about it - flying is not going to change that. If the pregnancy is healthy, then it will continue to be healthy - and likewise if it's the opposite.
But try convincing all these people, who are worried, knowing what we have gone through to get this far ... Very hard and has actually been really stressful for me.
When we spoke with our doctor two weeks ago, she initially didn't say anything against flying only "will you be able to live with yourselves if something does happen?". I was so upset, I practically burst into tears then and there.
I mean - we also had a second trip organised, beginning of September to the Dominican Republic (because a friend of ours wants to celebrate his 40th there with his friends and we are / were all going). As soon as she heard 32nd-34th week, she advised against it - but not because of the flight... but if something were to happen there, the medical support is nothing like here. So I promptly agreed to cancel and DH can go by himself with our friends.
But with this trip ... I said that I would make a very last-minute decision. I will go to the scan next week and if everything is developing as it should, we are going to fly. Funnily enough, DH told me last night (and he had been worried about flying and radiation and everything, but has done research..) that he had decided we could go ... because he knew how happy it would make me - and happy me = happy Pünktchen (was his logic) ... :) <3

Once I had made it clear to my doctor (on Friday), that I am well aware of the risks and if the pregnancy is not healthy, it won't matter whether I fly or confine myself to the house - she understood (she had advised against flying simply for my own psychological "peace of mind" that we hadn't done anything to endanger the pregnancy) - that I was aware of the situation. I asked her - "I need to know : will the trip / flying negatively affect this pregnancy?" - her answer was "no". I then said, so if in two weeks everything is OK and I then decide to fly, will you, as my physician, feel OK with that decision. And she said "yes".

But you guys can't imagine what a struggle this has been. My Dad has now accepted - I think MIL+FIL too - but they were all putting so much pressure on me and stressing me, that I got really angry :( I know they only mean well and worry for us and the baby - but I really wouldn't do anything (you girls know what I have gone through to get this far) that would endanger the baby and I really feel OK with flying. Not to mention that we have booked business class, so I won't be all cramped, but really have room to stretch out and be comfortable...

So - all being well on the 17th and we are off to Orlando on the 20th, flying back 2nd-3rd May. xx


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## Sandy83

Oh bubumaci sounds like you have had such a stressful time! I can understand your family being concerned but as you say it doesn't matter what you do if its a healthy pregnancy it will not be affected. As long as you and DH are happy with your decision go for it and agree with DH happy mammy means happy baby. 

Sounds like you will have a great time :hugs: xx


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## dovkav123

Bubu, sorry about the stress you have. Your intuition has to be nr1 in this decision. It's all about you and your baby. 

Sandy, praying and hoping for your hubby's appetite. I hope he'll eat something, bring him his favorite food. Even if he says no. Ginger can help with nausea. Ginger tea or ginger ale. Some crackers...

ON Monday we found an egg and today it got fertilised.:happydance: We'll wait till Thursday to transfer cos on the day3 DR will check the egg's shell, if it's hard, they will do assisted hatching. We have never done it before. I'll take aspirin, 300mg progesterone, we'll BD and I'll eat lots of pineapple core.
FRom 6 eggs we got 4 fertilised(perfect grade) and two with 3 pronuclei, not viable. Not a bad statistics.....

Egg retrieval was smooth, IVF lab asked if about anethesia and my dr. told them I didn't needed. Someone said OUCH!!!
I didn't make a sound during procedure. I had 23,1mm follicle and next to it was 11mm(she took a chance, she knew it won't be mature). She aspirated both. WE got one egg.

My hubby was holding my hand.

During sperm "retrieval" my hubby was looking in the book, I gave a helping hand, and he felt an urge, so the first drops got on the floor and his hands:growlmad:

his volume was 38mil,morfology 5%, fast sperm 0%, 20% slower.

Yesterday was a good day cos my hubby told me if it won't work will do a stim IVF in US. Finally he agrees we need to do a serious baby making decisions.


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## Sandy83

Got everything crossed for you Dovkav and hope you don't need to do a stim IVF but great to know DH is up for that :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

That is great that you had such a positive experience yesterday - and that they have been able to fertilise :) That is a good idea to check for AH. Does your clinic always do such early transfers? Never day 5?
I was wondering, why would you have to go to the US for a stimulated IVF? But it is really great that DH is more on board with the serious baby-making decisions! Hopefully (all fingers + toes crossed), you won't need to think about it anyway, because this will work :)

Sending you lots and lots of :dust::dust::dust:

I just picked up a pair of compression stockings (originally thought for the flight), but the lady suggested - if I am prone to swelling anyway, and I do sit all day for work - that I wear them all the time during the pregnancy. It is amazing, how much lighter my legs feel with them on!


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## dovkav123

we have done one time 3dt (old clinic didn't check the embryo's shell) but other two times 2dt. WE have only one embryo per cycle, no competition...so why wait... My uterine incubator is better than the lab one.
Naturally 2dt embryo should travel from the tube to the uterus. My dr tells that uterine enviroment is better for embryo.

my clinic grows embryos to blastocysts too.

we live in US(North Cal), we are here temporary.


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## bubumaci

I understand! If that is what the doctor says, then who am I to argue? :) (From all that I have read, the environment in the fallopian tubes is a bit different to the uterus and normally, a fertilised egg won't have made it to the uterus until around 5dpo) - which is one reason why so many clinics now prefer doing 5 day transfers (apart from the fact that - with more fertilised eggs - they can select the ones that look better and that make it to day 5).

Of course it does make sense to transfer it earlier, since you only have that one anyway!

When do you plan to return to the US? If your clinic does do 5 day transfers too, why not try a medicated cycle here (... not that you will need it of course, because this little bean is going to burrow its way in :) :))? Just wondering?

How long does temporarily mean? How long have you been here? (I don't remember whether I had asked, where in Germany you are located...?) ...

Oh - I know I asked this earlier : when do you get the DNA fragmentation results? :)


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## Bluebell bun

Hi ladies, Yet more disappointment:growlmad:. Went in for my FET this morning to find our embryo had lost 50% of its cells and they have given it a less that 10% success rate. I am still p..'d off by the fact they were so insistent I had to use this one and not my 2 x day 3 embryos that were frozen. This was a day 6 , grade 2 BB embryo so by no means brilliant quality to begin with. Just feel that this has been more lost weeks of time, energy and emotion. We have put it back and are on a wing and a prayer! It just doesn't get any easier:nope


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## bubumaci

Oh Bluebell, I am sorry that you have disappointing news :hugs2: ... I can understand the clinic preferring to try with the blastocyst, as opposed to the 3 day embryos - they probably thought the chances would be higher with it (because they are further along and often more resilient to the freezing / thawing process) ... Fingers and toes crossed for you Honey, that it is resilient and can develop despite the low chances they have given you!
What quality were the 2 three day embryos they have frozen?

When do you have your first beta? :hugs2:
:dust::dust::dust:


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## Sandy83

Sorry to hear your news Bluebell :hugs: Fx'd that it's a fighter xx


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## Bluebell bun

Thank you ladies xx


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## dovkav123

sorry bluebell :hugs: Wonderful things can happen. I have heard many stories about healthy babies and poor embryo's quality.
I hope and pray for both this 2ww for a good news.


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## dovkav123

yesterday we transfered 3dt 8B (embriologist told me A between B), but in report was writtten 8B. Got the photo.
I felt some activity yesterday in my uterus, Today nothing.
NO cervical contractions so far, I ussually felt before 5dt in 3 cases. It was a bad news for me. I was thinking here they come, no good!

An embryo shell was 15-20, assited hatching with a laser was performed. They made a whole. In the literature I read if zona pellucida more than 15, AH is recommended.

I rested 30min after ET
I take 100mg aspirin a day
3g fish oil (helps with immunity response)
alfa alfa, sweet pea sprouts, 
300mg progesterone
VitD 3000
flaxseed oil
q-10
eating pinapple, avocado
stopped my green tea
eating dandelion salats
BD before ET and will BD on 4dt and so on...

I have read that AH embryo could implant earlier and it is a chance for monozygote twins

a whole in the embryo's shell could cause infection. Some ladies take antibiotics...

ODT is on the Easter. Clinic is closed.
If we get lucky, we stil could have a baby in 2014, around my birthday or in early January.


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## bubumaci

Oh Dovkav - I have everything crossed for you!!! (Number 7 is usually my lucky number ... ended up being #9 with us ;) ) - I really hope this is it for you. It is great that they have done AH ... (don't forget, that orgasm will cause uterine contractions ... if the embryo isn't supposed to be in your uterus yet, is it a good idea to :sex: before the time it should be there? Just a thought - if it makes you happy, then :wohoo: go for it :) :)

:dust::dust::dust:

Perhaps you can hug a pregnant woman (I am sending virtual hugs to you), as it apparently brings luck ;)



AFM - some "surprise" news ... :
I <3 my gynaecologist! She rang this morning, because she had been thinking and really wanted me to go see a doctor at the prenatal diagnostic clinic she works with, as they could prescribe aspirin/ heparin for the long-haul flight. She made me an appointment and I went at 1 ...
So, I have my prescription, but I also got to see Pünktchen again - via abdominal u/s (my first) ... My NT-Scan is scheduled for May 5th - but she took a quick look and said that it looks absolutely perfect and we have nothing to worry about ...
And here are some photos of my Pünktchen - who now measures 3,95cm (so we are back spot on with our dates), has two arms, with two hands and 10 fingers ... two legs, with two feet and 10 toes .. has been drinking already... heart beating away nicely ... umbilical cord looked perfect with two arteries + one vein and the placenta was looking good too ... Pünktchen waved at us a few times :cloud9: - and I also was given 4 3D pictures :cloud9:
She told us, that we are fine and we should go and enjoy our holiday :) :) 
So - off to Orlando on April 20th :)
What a sweet little profile ... and thumbs ... and everything .... just can't stop grinning... (especially, since I wasn't expecting to see Pünktchen again until next week Thursday!) xxxx
 



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## dovkav123

I didn't think about contractions during Orgasm. Good that you told me I am so blessed to have you, bubumaci!
I had my contracting cervix in the past w/o BD.
Good we didn't do it yet. I can live without orgasm and bouncy sex. 
Our goal is to increase implantation with a spermies and a seminal fluid.
Our clinic does this procedure, inserts seminal fluid inside and outside the cervix 

your baby is so small 4cm and he is so big in development


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## bubumaci

:) It was just a thought ... perhaps you can :sex: and you not orgasm? I find it interesting, that the clinic does that procedure - I hadn't heard of it before :) Anything that helps!!
I really have fingers and toes crossed for you!!! :kiss:

It is really incredible, only 4cm and yet so much of the foundation is already there! The doctor even said, that Pünktchen had something in its tummy, so it has already started drinking!!


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## Unlucky41

dovkav praying that 7 is your lucky number!!! It sounds like you have done everything and eating all the good things. Hopefully this is a sticky one and you can have double celebrations at the end of the end!!
Are you going to test or be patient till the blood test?

Bub great looking photos glad everything is going well and have a blast on your babymoon!!!!I know there was a lot of stress deciding to go but you have the doctor approval so enjoy :happydance:

Sandy how is everything going with you?

AFM - 20 weeks scan in 3 days time however haven't felt the baby moved yet can't help to feel a little bit anxious. Happy that our dreadful year-end at work is all over 4 days to our 1 week getaway to Melbourne not very far but better than nothing.


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## dovkav123

Unlucky, I'll do a test on Easter morning. Who wouldn't do on a such holiday! It will be 3 days before AF. Clear blue digital will give me 82%. Next morning I'll go for a blood test, no matter what the result I'll have.
How was your scan?

Bubumaci, since 2d3dt I am feeling uterine cramping, not a cervical cramping( I had those with BFN). I really hope that the uterine walls and an embryo communicating with one another. Embryo is trying to implant. Assited haching may induce impantation earlier.
Did you have cramping too?


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## bubumaci

Hi Dovkav,
Actually, no, I didn't have any symptoms (my pregnancy so far has been pretty symptomless - except for the utter exhaustion I had had - which is now starting to clear up - am starting to be plagued a bit by sciatica in my right butt cheek when lying down) at all. I didn't notice implantation - even though I suspect I know when it happened - at 7dpo, so 2dp5dt ... I had an implantation dip, the next day when I was at my waxing / facial appointment, my skin reacted really sensitively to the products and that is when my OHSS flared back up again and got progressively worse as my HCG rose - painful ovaries and a very swollen abdomen is all I had to contend with at the very beginning - plus extreme exhaustion from about mid 5th week of pregnancy.
But I had no cramping at all (only the past few weeks stretching sensations of the uterus stretching), no spotting or bleeding.
I have been incredibly lucky to, so far, have had a really smooth, perfect pregnancy!

But that doesn't mean anything, many women experience some sensation, as the little bean starts burrowing in!! Fingers crossed, that that is what you are feeling :) :hugs2:


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## dovkav123

bubumaci, So interesting! Your body reacted to the skin products.

How did you keep yourself going during 5 week exhaustion. Did you drink caffeine? Did you take naps?
Maybe some exercises would help with your sciatica? 
Do you take magnesium citrate? Really helps with a growing belly and streching abdomen muscles.
I don't want to exercise yet. Maybe in few days...


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## dovkav123

bubumaci said:


> :) It was just a thought ... perhaps you can :sex: and you not orgasm?
> 
> I have never felt orgasm with just :sex:. I need both :sex: and my clit stimulation. WE could happily BD w/o orgasm.:happydance:


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## bubumaci

Yeah, it was really weird! The girl even commented, that my face got blotchy, which it never did before! :lol:

No, I haven't been drinking any caffeine at all - never was a big coffee drinker anyway, and even the cappuccino I had been drinking in the mornings, I stopped during this try. Haven't missed it at all. At home, we have a lot of Spezi, but I haven't drunk any of that either.

Every lunch break, I did / do my hypnotherapy and would fall asleep to that for 25 minutes. Then, in the first weeks, I would like down right after work and sleep for 1,5-2 hours. Basically, if I felt my body was telling me, that it needed a break, I would give it a break. Worked quite well :)

For the sciatica, it seems that my uterus is pushing on the nerve if I lie on my back - I don't sleep on my back anyway (big belly-sleeper :D), I lie on my side with a pillow between my knees, sort of half on side, half on tummy. But last night, whenever I moved, I felt the pain in my right buttock. Once up and moving, I am fine - just doesn't like the lying down... I do take magnesium, yes :)

Also, when feeling tired, I do go outside for a brief brisk walk - is supposed to help too...

... in the same boat as you with the orgasm thing ;)


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## Unlucky41

Just checking on how everyone is going.

Dovkav I think feel a little bit of cramping after a few days after the transfer. It is like a pulling sensation but to be honest it may just be all in my mind as well.
Hope you get your awesome news this Easter! 

Bub when is your holiday? How is everything going?

AFM the scan went well everything is on track so heaps to be thankful for.

Hope everyone has a good Easter.


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## Sandy83

Unlucky, Great news on the scan glad to hear everything is on track :happydance: xx


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## bubumaci

Hi Jo!

We fly out on Sunday. Another check-up tomorrow, just to make sure all is OK ... 

That's fantastic, that everything is on track!!


I'm still missing so many people from here ... Clare, Sarah ... I really hope, everything is well with you ... where are you? :cry:


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## bugs

Well I have been staying low but how could I resist that plea. Well we made the section to move to donor eggs as after 8 cycles we weren't getting anywhere except being poor. 

We had 3 blasts transferred on the 26th March and have 3 frozen. I got my positive last week and I am just anxiously awaiting my 7 week scan. 
Hope everyone else is well, I do pop in from time to time to see how everyone is getting on but things have been a bit crazy. 
My sister went into labour and gave birth to my nephew at 27 weeks. He's fighting a tough battle but he's getting there. He was a tiny 2lb 3 but is absolutely perfect xxxx


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## bubumaci

OMG OMG OMG ... that's so fantastic ... When I saw your :bfp: flashing in your signature, I nearly wet myself with delight!!!! How wonderful, oh, Honey, I am so very very happy!!! Congratulations! Please let us know how you are feeling, and definitely about the 7 week scan in a couple of weeks! I can barely wait, so excited for you!!

I am sorry that your sister had your nephew so early - that is great that he is a little fighter, fingers tightly crossed for him! xxxx :kiss:


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## bugs

Thanks Bubu, I'm very anxious for the scan as we've been here before but trying to stay optimistic. Hope you have a great holiday xxxx


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## Sandy83

Bugs, thats amazing news so happy for you :happydance: look forward to getting your update on your scan 

Sorry to hear about your nephew but sounds like he is a little fighter :hugs:

Bubumaci, Good luck for check up today hope all is well :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Clare, can't they do a third beta, to see if the levels are rising as they should? Instead of making you wait a couple more weeks? All fingers and toes crossed for you!!! xxx


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## dovkav123

bugs, million hugs and congrats! this thread is full of hope!
Hoping and praying for a little nephew.
My friend was born 65 years ago. He was 25 weeks old. He survived without incubator. He is a medical doctor now.

bugs, do you know the donor lady? Does she has any rights? I beleave every country law is different...


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## bugs

No i had treatment in Athens so the donor has no rights and it is completely anonymous, I can find out general information but as she has been matched to me I don't feel the need to know. 
Bubu as our clinic is abroad we have to pay for bloods and having already spent so much we decided once the first one showed a good rise we would leave it at that. I am noticing some subtle changes so I am happy with that. Just hooked up to intralipid as I type xxx


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## Unlucky41

Bub have a stress free holiday !!! We going to Melbourne on easter Monday for 1 week just want a break from work!

Bugs so happy for you:happydance::happydance: Do you know if there is more than one? What great news after all his time!! Wishing you a very stressfree pregnancy. Can't wait to hear about your first scan!


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## bugs

We don't know how many yet, we have to wait for 1st scan but as my symptoms are pretty mild I think just one has stuck around. 

Enjoy your break unlucky xxx


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## dovkav123

BFP!!!!!

14 dpo Clearblue digital this morning

Tearful, blessed, speechless.....

TTC for 2years and 5month

IVF#7

First BFP ever!

Please think about me tomorrow.
I am heading to blood tests 

Never give up!


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## bubumaci

Dovkav, I am sooooooo happy for you! :hugs::kiss: how wonderful! You felt good about it and I am just over the moon!!!
:wohoo: :dance::dance:


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## Sandy83

Congratulation Dovkav I'm so happy for you. Look forward to hearing your numbers this morning :wohoo: xx


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## bubumaci

Can't wait to hear your beta numbers!!!! :kiss:


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## Sandy83

Are you enjoying your Holiday Bubumaci? xx


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## Sandy83

Dovkav, how did you get on yesterday? xx


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## bugs

Dovkav, bloody fantastic news. Can't wait to hear your beta's. 
Well ladies after some bleeding at the weekend I went to the local EPU for a scan at 6,3 and we saw one perfect little heartbeat flashing away. I was totally overwhelmed having never got to this point before xxxx


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## Sandy83

Bugs, sorry to hear about the bleeding but great news on the scan :hugs: xx


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## Northernmonke

Hey ladies, I keep an eye on this thread and get mixed up sometimes but just wanted to say congrats to those that have their BFP and those that are still waiting have hope! As some of you know I am a firm believer that IMSI did it for us xxxxx


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## dovkav123

bugs, I am so tearfully happy for you! I got my tears after your message.

I had my beta yesterday it was 521, 5-6 weeks preggo at 16dpo, 13dp3dt. However, I am just 4 weeks. I am 17 dpo today. My period would come tomorrow. I am calculating from the start of my first day of my period. Am I correct?

My progesterone 32. Estrogen 113.

My digital test display pregnant is gone now, so I took a regular one.
I just need to look at it every day to beleave it!:happydance:

My next beta is in a week, and u/s in 2 weeks.

I hope and pray you'll get your positives soon. 
It will be on the right time in the right palce...


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## Sandy83

Great news Dovkav I'm so happy for you :wohoo: xx


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## bugs

Thanks Dovkav, that's a very healthy beta. Yes you have calculated the timing right you add 2 weeks prior to egg collection date. Good luck with 2nd beta I hope it shows a nice rise xxx


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## bubumaci

That's wonderful Dovkav! Perfect numbers! So very happy for you! That's a great number at 16 dpo :kiss:
And Clare! I couldn't be happier to be seeing success finally filling this thread! :cloud9:


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## Unlucky41

Dovkav so so happy for you :dance::dance:

Yes I know the feeling when you can't believe it is real. Your numbers looks really really good. When do you have your first scan.

Persistent is the key with us and it sure does pays out when you see the two lines :happydance::happydance:


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## Unlucky41

bugs said:


> Dovkav, bloody fantastic news. Can't wait to hear your beta's.
> Well ladies after some bleeding at the weekend I went to the local EPU for a scan at 6,3 and we saw one perfect little heartbeat flashing away. I was totally overwhelmed having never got to this point before xxxx

Bugs holidays was great but it is also good to be home now too much walking!!! haha 

Soooooooooooooooooooooooo happy for you :happydance::happydance: It is such a sigh of relief when you see the heartbeat beating away. All the pain and sorrow gets washed away ! 

Loving all the good news this board is getting really hope they keep on coming :hugs::hugs:


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## africaqueen

Hi ladies, so sorry been MIA for so long but tbh i was stressing about finances and so desperate to be starting treatment again that i had to force myself to put all baby related things out of my mind before i had a breakdown. We are still not in a good financial situation and have very little saved so looking like it will be next year when we are able to start our 4th cycle which makes me very sad but nothing we can do. Maybe we will win money in the meantime or our situation will improve and we can have it sooner but unlikely. So just trying to keep busy with work and stuff.
Anyway, i have missed soooo much! just spent last hour catching up on posts! LOVE how positive this thread has become! hope to god il be joining you lucky ladies with a BFP after our next cycle xxx

Sandy- Firstly, i am so sorry your DH's cancer has returned. Life is so unfair! hope he is responding well to chemo and big hugs to you too as so hard to watch someone you love go through major illness. I am also very sorry your last cycle failed but hope your frosties bring your miracle in Aug/Sep x

Captain- So sorry to hear your embie didnt survive the thaw and i hope your coping as well as can be expected x

Unlucky- HUGE congrats on being preg with a baby girl! wonderful news and so glad all is well! when is EDD? x

Cjohnson- Welcome and congrats! x

Bluebell- Welcome and good luck with your cycle x

Buba- HUGE congrats!! beautiful scan pics and hope all is well. Thank you for asking after me too. Means a lot x

Bugs- Just text you! OMG i am delighted for you and dh! after having been on this board together for sooo long i am beyond overjoyed for you!! hope your lil nephew is doing well?? must of been so scary for your sis and you all x

Dov- Huge congrats to you too! this thread has really come alive! x

xxx


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## babydrms

Great thread africaqueen - I am just getting back into the loop, as I had to take a break. I also, had 3 failed transfers (two fresh cycles and 1 fet) before my successful one (also fet). It was an extremely hard place to be and I couldn't relate to most going through IVF either...

I just want to add, for those who are still working to make their family - be tenacious and only work with doctors who are practicing the most current, evidence based medicine. While it is important to respect their experience, tried and true does not make an appropriate treatment plan. There is cutting edge research with new and improved protocols, push for them. 

I hope you all can find funds to push through as well, I know how hard this part of the process can be. 

Best wishes and baby dust to you all. 
XoXo


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## Sandy83

Africaqueen, Nice to hear from you :hugs: Totally understand you taking a break from the whole ttc world. I've got everything crossed that hopefully you will get your baby either this year or next whenever it is viable to progress with another cycle. We are hear whenever you need to talk xx


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## Sandy83

Quick question for you ladies, 

Has anyone used Castor oil packs before or have any opinions on these? xx


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## dovkav123

Sandy, I have used castor oil packs for a year now before my O. It didn't show any difference in my cycle, follicle grow, Ovulation... I didn't use a castor oil packs in April before IVF and we got BFP.
We got lucky this IVF. I made a list I hope it'll be useful for you all.
I did many different things this time and my embryo quality was not better. It is always A or B. This one was B.

1. No castor oil packs this cycle
2. we did assisted embryo hatching
3. we BD'ed before ET and after ET (w/o orgasm)
4. I walked slowly but long after ET, staying active always, no bed rest
5. aspirin 100mg enteric coated started after ER, quit a day for ET(procedure could cause bleeding) and now I am taking it every evening with food and water
6. I ate lots of fish. I am taking 3g fish oil a day
7. 1000mg green tea extract with vitC after ET till BFP. (reduces inflammation responce)
8. Black carraway oil 20 drops a day. now I slow down to 3 drops
9. spoonfull avocado oil 
10. pinapple and pinapple core after ET till BFP
11 increased vit D from 2000iu to 3000iu a day
12. iron 100mg a day, quit after BFP
13. Green chlorella increased from 1 pill to 3 pills a day
14. Probiotics one pill a day from ET til BFP
15 Buckthorn and lemon juice
16. dandelion salat
17. alfa alfa and sweet peas sprouts
18. layed down 30min after ET
19. eating dried plums and abricots
20. ginger root tea, clove, and cinammon
21. water soaked walnuts and brasil nuts
22. I have used organic menstrual pads for 2 months.
23. banana a day(aspirin can thin my intestines and banana thickens them)
24. spicy food, hot peppers in 2ww
25. more prayers ever
I did a lot. I'll never know what helped us this time. My hubby thinks assited hatching, I think aspirin and all above...


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## Sandy83

Wow Dovkav you really did a lot! I was just thinking of using the castor oil packs over the next couple of months just to detox my system as will be doing a FET cycle next time. 

Do you think it does detox your body or is it just another myth? xx


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## dovkav123

Yes! Castor oil does detox.
Promotes circulation and tissue healing

anti-inflammatory

support ovarian, uterine health, egg health. My ovarian reserve AMH went up from 1.29 to 2.2

it stimulated lymth, 

Helps liver to remove access hormones, toxins which are stores in an access fat tissue.

It helps to treat many other conditions like bacterial, fungal. warts, muscles spasm and strains.

I am sure in the long run it helped me.
warmth compress relaxed me too.
I would do it If I were you.


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## Sandy83

Yeah think i might give it a try just to detox to get my body ready for the FET considering I've had 4 fresh medicated IVF's think my body could use a detox xx


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## africaqueen

Babydrms- Omg cannot believe your LO is 1 already! so u are ttc x2 now? ooh exciting! where does time go?! x

Nice to be back ladies. Just won't be a prolific a poster due to inactivity on the IVF front but i shall be here cheering you all on x


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## babydrms

Africaqueen, time is flying!! We are trying for baby #2 now. We are excited and ready to fight for it, hence why we are starting while she is one - in case it takes a while. I met with my RE again today and we are looking to do an FET at the beginning of June.


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## africaqueen

Hope everyone is ok? this thread has been very quiet lately xxx


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## bugs

Hi AQ, everyone else. 
Still lying low, after some very light staining and a scary midwife I was advised to have a scan at the EPU on Friday and we got to see our blob again still measuring spot on. I'm really struggling to believe that this is finally it and find myself worrying about everything. Really wish I could fast forward the next 31 weeks coz as much as I want to enjoy my history makes me a nervous wreck !!! 

Hope everyone else is well xxxx


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## bubumaci

Oh Bugs, I am sorry you had a scare! Glad to hear that peanut is measuring just right!! Are you 6w already? If so, you should be getting to see little blob pulsating as a heartbeat soon :) <3
Please try to enjoy it and not to worry! It is easier said than done, I know, I do... :kiss:

Ooooh, good luck, baby!

My gynaecologist rang me this morning and said "I have good news". Last Monday, we had the NT Scan and it was really good (1,7). Based on my age, our risk starts at 1:100 ... an overall risk is calculated together with the NT scan measurement + the blood tests. She received the results and my risk has gone down to 1:1007 :) <3


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## bugs

Hi Bubu I'm coming up to 10 weeks, we had a scan at 6 & 9 weeks due to spotting and we're very lucky and got to see the heartbeat both times. Still doesn't stop me worrying. 

Great news about the NT scan xxxx


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## africaqueen

Bugs- Sorry to hear you had a scare again and completely natural to feel so on edge after all you have been through. Once you get past 12wks try and relax a little and enjoy this time as you have been through sooo much to get here x

Buba- Fab news! glad everything is going well x

Hi to all the gang x

AFM- Its my 33rd birthday on Monday. Feeling excited about a girlie weekend to Blackpool this weekend but also feeling super emotional that i am another year older and still no closer to our dream :( xxx


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## bubumaci

Hallooooo! So lovely to see you again!
33 is what we call a "Schnappszahl" here - so a Schnapps number :) That's great that you are having a girlie weekend away (partying??) ... but yes, getting older makes us painfully aware, that time stands still for nobody ... nasty habit that time has, that. I do hope, that you will be able to move forward sometime soon!! xxx

Just wondering - is it OK to still hang out here and chat with you ladies / give support etc.? Or does it make everyone, who is still waiting / trying feel bad, seeing my ticker and so?


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## ashknowsbest

Hi ladies! I've been a member of this site for a while but chose to step away as DH and I were taking a break from TTC. We're still on break but are starting our medicated FET in July. I start BCPs July 11th then FET sometime in August ... looking forward to it but also feeling nervous. I just want it to work so bad this time around.

Congrats to all of those who finally got pregnant! And good look to those still trying!


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## Unlucky41

babydrms - good luck for baby number two how many frozen embryos do you have?

AQ so good to hear from you !! Happy birthday !!! How was your girlie day out? Did you get a present from DH ? My birthday is coming up as well I am one year older than you. 

bub I am glad everything is going well for you surely you are more happy then mellow now?

Bugs I am glad you were able to see the heartbeat. I had a few spotting as well and everything seems ok for my so far.

Sandy how are you going?


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## Sandy83

Hi Ladies

Sorry been MIA for a while but been checking in every now and again. 

AQ - Hope you had a good birthday and enjoyed your girly weekend in Blackpool :happydance:

Bubumaci, How you doing? I do not mind you at all hanging around this thread at all gives me hope that it will eventually work for me also :hugs:

Unlucky, How you doing? How many weeks are you now? :hugs:

Bugs, Sorry to hear about your scare but I'm sure hearing the heartbeat was amazing and put your mind at rest a little :hugs:

Babydrms, Good luck with your FET :hugs:

Dovkav, How you doing? :hugs:

Ash, Great to hear from you. Glad to hear your have plans to start the TTC journey again :hugs:

AFM, Obviously nothing to report on the TTC front but lots been going on with DH. Got a bit of bad news that DH's brothers were not a match to be a donor for the stem cells so that was disappointing :cry: DH is now on to his 5th treatment just one more to go before the transplant and got some positive news also that the treatment is going as planned and DH is responding to the treatment so first hurdle cleared. 
On another positive note we have been advised that the hospital have found 3 potential donors from Germany that match DH. They will now assess who is the best match and go from there. 
So lots of ups and downs lately but things looking good at the moment. xx


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## twinklemama

Hi ladies, can I join you? Just doing a bit of searching on this site as I've just found out today that our 3rd cycle has failed, and found this thread which is perfect for a bit of hope and moral support. 

U can see my story from my signature, but I just can't believe this has happened again. We had such a good cycle this time, we finally had embies that made it to blast. I had an endo scratch done, cervical dilatation to make transfer easier, used EEVA, we used embryoglue, had acupuncture and took plenty of time off work. It's so frustrating. What tests would u ladies recommend that I have done next? I'm convinced there's something wrong with me that they haven't figured out yet. 
Xo


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## Northernmonke

Twinkle - not sure what tests you have had but I would recommend hubby having DNA fragmentation test. My hubby did and on the last cycle they changed us to IMSI - have a google. I am now feeling my twins wiggling around in my belly! amazing! I thought it would never happen x


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## bubumaci

Hey Ash :howdy: long time no see - your journal has been quiet too! That's exciting that you are moving forward again for your FET. Are you planning to transfer both? :hugs:

Jo - Definitely happy, but feeling very relaxed, so I think mellow does still accurately reflect how I am feeling :) :hugs2:

Sandy :kiss: thank you! I am doing well ... still often feel that this whole thing is somehow surreal (after having fought so hard for it and gone through so much). About an our ago, I took a break from work and sat outside in the sunshine relaxing and felt a little flutter (been feeling the odd flutter / flutters for just over a week or so) and just thought "is this real, this is so surreal" ...
I am sorry to hear that DH's brother wasn't a match! But that is very exciting news that you have quite a few possibilities from Germany! I wonder how they then do that - from here to the UK?
All fingers + toes crossed for you Sweetie!! :kiss:

Hi Twinkle :howdy:
I am sorry that you are also having these struggles!
As Northernmonke suggests, having the DNA fragmentation tests done might help understand. Even though we never had it done, it was clear in our case, that the reason we had to go through so many tries (which also include 2 chemicals last year) is simply, because the embryos developing were abnormal - so either the fertilised cells don't develop well - or if they do and it comes to transfer, our bodies reject the embryos.
Because we know we have fertilised eggs inside us, the expectation for it to work (and the disappointment when it doesn't) is so much higher than couples trying naturally. There, the statistics are likely to be similar ... but chemicals are often missed, because they are not monitored as closely as we are ...

The science is amazing, and they can do so much ... so many of us, who would have to remain childless are given the chance to become parents - but science still can't beat nature.

Sometimes, it really just takes patience and an unbelievable amount of strength to just keep going and keep going, trying again and again. 
From your signature, it seems to me, that each try is getting better and better. That was the case with us! For the first couple of tries, even though the egg retrieval and fertilisation rates were really good, the cell development wasn't (the RE we switched to later said, that our chances with those first tries : 2xICSI but 5x transfer - we had three FETs - really weren't very good). We carried on with the antagonist protocol, but changed the medication and also started putting the fertilised embryos under the embryoscope - the results really were much better ... because of OHSS, we didn't do a fresh transfer in February, but did a FET in April (scratch biopsy as well) ... July/August, again scratch biopsy, transferred two great-looking blasts ... chemical. November / December same (plus acupuncture) .. again chemical...

One thing you might like to have checked out are your thyroid levels. Mine were actually very good for an adult woman - at 2,1. However some research shows, that the TSH levels should be at or below 1 when TTC. So I went to a hormone specialist and have been taking thyroid medicine since November last year. For the November / December try, my levels hadn't been pushed down enough - but for the February try this year, they were perfect! And it was this try that was also a success!!

I had been taking CoQ10 (high dosage) and Resveratrol as well (which is good for cell regeneration) and doing hypnotherapy (which just helped me with all the injections and to keep relaxed and calm)..

So - the try that was successful, I had a scratch biopsy, was taking these supplements, my thyroid levels below 1 ... and I guess we just had the luck of getting healthy sperm fused with a healthy egg! (We transferred two, one blast was starting to hatch). Nature was on our side this time.

I really hope that together with your RE, you will be able to find some answers. As Northernmonke suggests - if you have enough sperm, then IMSI might be a good option for you! We couldn't do it, because of DH's condition...


----------



## ashknowsbest

Sandy - so sorry to hear about the ups and downs but I'm happy they did find possible matches. Best of luck to you and your DH :hugs:

bubu - congratulations on getting pregnant! After everything you've been through it's so nice to see you moving along nicely in your pregnancy. Yes we are transferring both as long as they both unfreeze .... I'm a little nervous about that part.


----------



## africaqueen

Bubu- Thank you! its lovely to be back! yes it was a partying weekend and oh man am i wiped out! definitely not 21 anymore. haha. Was a good blow out and we had fun but time to act my age and get finances sorted now ;) NEED a chance of being pregnant this year. Can't let myself think anything else. Hell or high water, i am determined to at least get another shot. Glad to see all is going well with you and cant believe your over 16wks already! wow x

Ash- Omg girl so lovely to see you again! i remember you from our other thread. Obviously i wish neither of us were here but sadly we are and we can help eachother through the rough times in our quest to be mothers and all the girls here are fab and as you can see, a lot have realised their dreams so im sure it will be our turn soon. When are you starting FET? x

Unlucky- Thank you! had a fab birthday. Hubby got me a gorgeous gold Tommy Hilfiger watch and i was spoilt with lush bath stuff from my dad and jean Paul Gautier perfume and money ;) had a wonderful long weekend. Hope your doing well? x

Sandy- I really hope your dh gets a match soon. How stressful! sending much love to you both x

Twinkle- Welcome to the thread and im so sorry you had to find your way here. I was beyond devastated after our 3rd cycle failed but their is hope in my heart again so let yourself grieve and pick yourself up, dust yourself down and start all over again as my lovely mum used to say. We are a supportive group x

Northern- Your siggie gives me so much hope. Glad all is going well x

Bugs- How are you doing? hope all is well x

Hi to all the gang x

AFM- I have enjoyed putting babies and IVF out my mind but now i can longer do that. It is my souls desire to be pregnant so no point going into denial. I am determined to get the relevant cash together no matter what so we can have another cycle before Christmas. It will be a struggle but we are going to try our best and hope for some luck inbetween xxx


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## ashknowsbest

AQ - I can't believe we're still here but I know we'll get there ... eventually one way or another. I'm sure you and your DH will come up with solid plan for saving up the money. Infertility sucks financially and emotionally ... why!? I start my FET July 11th. We'll be starting on BCPs at that time. The transfer should take place sometime in August.


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## bubumaci

Sarah, that is so great that you had such a lovely time!! I am really happy for you! Sounds like your second (or third or fourth ...) wind has come and I feel confident, that you two will get the finances together so that you can move forward! :kiss: (I can't believe that I am only a few days away from the 18th week either!!) :hugs2:


----------



## dovkav123

Sandy, I am so glad your hubby is doing well, I hope donors will do a trick and help him.:flower:

ashknowsbest, I am sorry about your rough journey.
I just got lucky on my 7th IVF last month we did a natural IVF, w/o stims.
I had a first scan on Wednesday and the baby is 16mm and we saw a heart beat. He was 8w2d. Due date is on the 29th December.
We did 2 things different;
1.I took aspirin 100mg enteric coated after an ER. I do have probably circulation problem, cold hands and feet, I get pale. My iron levels and thyroid are oK.
2.We did an assited hatching at day 3 with a laser. Embryo shell was 15-20 thick. I know when it's 17, the lab wants to do it.

Your FET cycle is coming soon. It is recommended in many studies to AH a frozen embryo. 

twinklemama, my hubby did a sperm DNA test the month we got BFP. I'll get those results soon.


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## bugs

Hi girls, sorry I haven't been on much seems I have a whole new lot of worries to google these days. 

AQ great to hear your positivity, I'm sure you'll be able to squeeze in a cycle this year your a very determined lady xxx 

Well after 2 more episodes of spotting although it was very light I've had another 2 scans at 9 weeks and 10 weeks and everything is looking great and baby is measuring 2 days ahead so although I still worry that everything will go wrong I am trying to be positive that everything will be fine xxxx

Hope everyone is well xxxx


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## bubumaci

Dovkav, I was wondering - were any of your IVF cycles stimmed? Most of the time, you went naturally without medication and then retrieved the egg for fertilisation, didn't you? Lovely to hear that your baby is 1,6cms with a nice HB :) <3

Clare : :wohoo: am loving your update! Yes, being positive is very important ... send your little one positive vibes :) Are you planning to find out the gender in a few weeks? xxx :kiss:


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## bugs

No we are not finding out, We've waited so long whats a few more months hey xxx


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## dovkav123

bubumaci said:


> Dovkav, I was wondering - were any of your IVF cycles stimmed? Most of the time, you went naturally without medication and then retrieved the egg for fertilisation, didn't you? Lovely to hear that your baby is 1,6cms with a nice HB :) <3
> 
> Thanks bubu!
> I did all my IVF cycles without stims, we worked with only one naturally produced egg and than fertilised it.
> This was a long process I would do it again w/o a doubt.


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## bubumaci

Yay, Clare is staying team :yellow: :) :)
I would have, but DH really wanted to know ... and, well, I couldn't have him knowing and me not knowing :haha:

Yes, it is much kinder to your system, not stimming - at the end of the day, your statistics aren't bad though, if you think about it ... took only 7 eggs ;) :kiss:


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## dovkav123

bubu, it took 6 eggs, the first IVF was w/o luck. We didn't find an egg. I had u/s in the morning and my follicle was 15-16mm, I was told to trigger the same evening. I think it was just a mistake and my egg arrested. Dr. told me I may O'ed earlier so we did IUI instead. 
This one was 4th embryo and a sticky one!


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## africaqueen

Bugs- so glad everything is going so well and LOVE your scan pic! <3 also love the fact your strong enough to not find out the sex. Don't think i could manage it! lol x

Dov- how amazing you have never stimmed! wish my eggs were of good enough quality not to stimm. Would save a small fortune. We are opting for low dose stims next cycle tho. 3 amps as opposed to the 8 amps we had last cycle as that gave us our poorest result yet x

Hi to Bubu, Ash, unlucky and all the crew xxx


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## twinklemama

Hi girls, thanks for your replies. Bubu, I just had a look at my thyroid levels, everything was ok but TSH was 2.25, will look into it. We threw everything at this cycle, I took metformin for 6 weeks, had endo scratch and cervical dilatation done too, which was worth doing as my transfer went so smoothly. I'm gonna ask about more tests before another cycle, I think we'd be foolish to go through another cycle so blindly. But you're right that each cycle has gotten better. Just hope the next one gives us a baby!
Northernmonke, I'll have a google about DNA testing. Don't think our clinic does imsi though-I'm a bit limited here in Northern Ireland as there's only 3 clinics and although ours is excellent I don't think they're all that advanced. Think we might have to go further afield.


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## bubumaci

Hey Twinkle! So that is just a tick higher than my thyroid levels (TSH) were. Which are healthy levels and in fact my clinic doesn't even try to do something if you are below 2,5 ... but it may well be worth looking into - the hormone centre I work with has said, that they have had several successes, where they have pushed the TSH to or below 1. Not quite sure what the correlation between these levels and conception are, but there does seem to be something!
In your siggy, you mention that DH has been diagnosed with MF - do you mind my asking which ones? xx


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## twinklemama

Hi Bubu, I'm not 100% sure what exactly is wrong with DH, they've never really gone into too much detail with us. The count was low the first couple of times he was tested (8million/ml), but it was better on EC this time, he's been on wellman supplements for about a year and it was 14million/ml. Embryologist also said after it was washed the motility was really good, 95% I think. I'm convinced there's something wrong with me that's causing our failures. I'm really considering havin immune testing and a full clotting screen done. I have psoriasis which is an autoimmune thing, so although it's not a serious complaint I think it shows that there's something dodgy with my immune system. I got tested for Factor V Leiden clotting disorder last year as it's in the family, I have one copy of the gene but the haemotologist didn't think I needed any treatment during ivf. I'm not convinced. My worry is that even if I do get immunes done and there's something wrong, I don't think I will be able to have treatment for it here. I asked about NK cells last time and was told "there's not enough evidence"! Just want to get some answers so we can move forward.


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## Unlucky41

twinklemama - So sorry to read that you have had three failed cycles. So what is the plan. Are you researching to go abroad to do your next cycle? How does that work with your job etc?

Bub what are you having - sorry if you had said already.

bugs - so glad all the scare were false alarms and you little embrie is growing well

Sandy - so glad you have some good news with dh. To answer your question I am 26.5 weeks now. Moving into the 3rd trimester. Any more updates with dh treatments?

AQ - so glad to see you appearing on this thread again!! I think all birthdays are special so happy that you had a good time!! 

Dovkav -love your story and you are so strong and patience to do natural ivf every time!! Persistent really paid off!!!


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## bubumaci

Twinkle - I know for "normal" standards, 8mil is a tiny bit lower ... but it is still a good count and with a motility of 95%, I think the chances are good :) Oh and I think it would be good to have the NK cell testing done if you can, as well as the thyroid levels ... I really hope you will be able to move forward :hugs:

Jo - we are not 100% sure. The last scan, the umbilical cord was in the way and the doctor said "tentatively" she thinks we are having a little girl. Yesterday, I had another appointment ... which went very well. Based on all the measurements, Pünktchen weighs around 186g ... I haven't put on much weight, about 1-1,5kg, so they are happy with that (in total 2 since my first appointment), iron levels are fine ... and we spent quite a long time trying to get a clear view of Baby P.'s genitals ... (I am just going to say she) but she was kneeling almost the whole time - looks like she was praying (did wriggle around, but didn't move positions), so that we couldn't really see. At one point I was pretty sure I didn't see anything dangling, but the view wasn't good enough that the doctor felt comfortable. We still think girl though... Oh well, I have an appointment for the anatomy scan in 3 weeks and then I will definitely see. She did say I could go back in again in a few days, just to see if we can see the gender ... and since I can't wait another three weeks, I have an appt. next Thursday *lol* ... Anyway, we have two pictures - one of Baby P. kneeling, you can see the spine and her basically leaning on the placenta and the other is a frontal one (which I think looks quite scary *lol*) ... It is quite funny, throughout most of the scan, she had her hand up by her head / ear. On the frontal picture, it makes her look like she has elven ears .. my little elf <3 :cloud9:
 



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## Sandy83

Great pictures Bubumaci, Hope you get to know for definite on gender next week :hugs:


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## twinklemama

Bubumaci, your scan photos are lovely! Congratulations! 

Unlucky, we're planning to stick with our clinic for now, we were very happy with everything with them and it was only our first cycle with them. We might consider going to a clinic in Dublin (only 2 hours from me) that does immune testing and imsi, but we want to have our review first and see what they say. I would prefer not to travel abroad as I'm a bad flier and it'll add to the stress for me. Plus I'm self-employed so the longer I'm off work, the more it adds to the cost of each cycle. DH's work are not very flexible about holidays so it would prob end up being very complicated. 
Hope everyone is well, it's so good to see bfp's on this page, it's giving me hope xo


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## bugs

Hi ladies hope everyone is well. 

Just a little update from me, 12 week scan today and our little over achiever is measuring 5 days ahead so I'm now 13 weeks so almost in 2nd trimester. I might even relax a little now and start enjoying it, still can't believe it xxxx


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## bubumaci

Oh, Clare, how wonderful!!! I love your little ultrasound picture avatar and am delighted to hear that you are ready to settle in and enjoy! So very happy for you! <3 :kiss:


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## Unlucky41

Very happy to hear this news Clare :hugs::hugs::hugs: Much happiness coming your way !!Only tears of happiness to come!!


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## twinklemama

Bugs, congratulations! Your scan picture is lovely! And reading your signature and looking at the point ur at now gives us all so much hope! 

Bubumaci, had my review appointment on Friday, gonna have an endometrial biopsy done to test for NK cells. Asked about imsi, he said their microscope isn't quite as strong as an imsi one but it's not far off so they're happy that they can see enough with what they can see at present. Plus DH's sample was good this time so they're not overly concerned about him at present. Excited to be moving forward!

Hope everyone is well xo


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## dovkav123

Hello ladies!
We came back from a 2 week vacation. 
I missed you so much and you were in my thoughts a lot!
We visited Boden See, Zurich see and Alps, Titisee and Lichtenstein. It was our second vacation ever! On the trip I had a little scare. I was walking down the hill and slipped on the rock and fell on my but. I was worried about the baby. I was thinking only possitive, the water surrounds him and he couldn't feel the bump.
I am feeling great! My nausea and fatigue was gone just before the trip. I have only one symptom: sore breasts and the pain is milder every day. I am so happy to hit 11 weeks, I'll be in a safer zone very soon. Then I'll quit my aspirin and I am slowly reducing my progesterone now.

My IVF bill came back and I have to pay for ICSI. It was never done. We have a letter from a dr who says "a natural cycle IVF was performed with an assited hatching". Not a word about ICSI. Is there is a mistake on the bill or I was not informed right?

My hubby's sperm dna results came back very good. Refernce range is <15, his number is 5. I beleave we had an implantation problem, aspirin and assited hatching did a trick!


bugs and unlucky, bubu I am so happy your pregnancies progressing smoothly I hope I'll get in my first tri soon and be in my safer zone.

twinklemama, you are on the good path right now, and working hard and doing everything possible for your little miracle. You'll be blessed very soon
Sending you best wishes!


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## Sandy83

Dovkav, welcome back from your trip sounds like you had a great time. Glad baby is doing well after the fall. Can't believe you are 11 weeks. Hope you get your bill sorted as doesn't sound right at all!!

Hope the rest of you ladies are doing well :hugs:

Well AFM DH came out of hospital yesterday after his last chemo! :happydance: Feel like we have passed the first milestone xx


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## bubumaci

Hey Dovkav :wave:
I already wrote back in my journal - but just thought about it ... you have been TTC since 2011, but have only just been on your second vacation ever? You poor things! How come you haven't been able to get away?
Oh, and don't worry about slipping and falling on your butt - that wouldn't bother the baby a bit. Even when you bump your tummy against something, they are so well cushioned in there :)

I would definitely ring both the doctor's practice as well as the invoicing company to get that cleared up. Something definitely not right and you shouldn't be paying for ICSI if it wasn't done. Awesome results for the DNA fragmentation too! :) You were worrying about bad quality sperm for nothing :hugs2:

It may not even have been an implantation issue you were having - I mean in total, if you think about it, you went through 8 cycles. One of which was no eggie ... So 7 cycles - two of which the fertilised eggs didn't develop further than the pronucleous stage ... For the other 5, two of the fertilised eggs were only stage 4 (should be nearer to 8 on day 3) - so were clearly not developing properly - which leaves the other three. Most couples have to try for several months before getting pregnant and I think taking 7 cycles sounds pretty normal. In many cases - it is just not known, because it is not monitored like with AI cases - eggs will get fertilised by the sperm, but they will not develop properly because of genetic defects and it doesn't come to implantation. Based on your statistics, I am sure that the assisted hatching and aspirin and everything else you did upped the chances but I would also maintain, that your statistics support a pretty normal length of time to get pregnant ;)

Sandy - that is WONDERFUL news that DH is out of hospital and is done with his treatment! How is he feeling? How are you? Sending you huge :hugs2:


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## twinklemama

Dovkav, glad you had a good holiday, I'm sure your fall won't have done any harm. Good news about the DNA fragmentation, my consultant suggested it to us aswell but just gonna have the endo biopsy first and take it from there.

Sandy, hope DH is doing well, I'm sure you're glad he's home.


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## Sandy83

Thanks Ladies, DH is doing well considering what he has been through and I'm ok. We have just booked a cottage about 2 hours from where we live to get away for a week in July so got something to look forward too. xx


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## bubumaci

A weekend away in a cottage sounds perfect Sandy! :)


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## twinklemama

Enjoy and relax Sandy, you both really deserve it after all you've been through xo


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## dovkav123

bubumaci said:


> Hey Dovkav :wave:
> I already wrote back in my journal - but just thought about it ... you have been TTC since 2011, but have only just been on your second vacation ever? You poor things! How come you haven't been able to get away?
> Oh, and don't worry about slipping and falling on your butt - that wouldn't bother the baby a bit. Even when you bump your tummy against something, they are so well cushioned in there :)
> 
> I would definitely ring both the doctor's practice as well as the invoicing company to get that cleared up. Something definitely not right and you shouldn't be paying for ICSI if it wasn't done. Awesome results for the DNA fragmentation too! :) You were worrying about bad quality sperm for nothing :hugs2:
> 
> It may not even have been an implantation issue you were having - I mean in total, if you think about it, you went through 8 cycles. One of which was no eggie ... So 7 cycles - two of which the fertilised eggs didn't develop further than the pronucleous stage ... For the other 5, two of the fertilised eggs were only stage 4 (should be nearer to 8 on day 3) - so were clearly not developing properly - which leaves the other three. Most couples have to try for several months before getting pregnant and I think taking 7 cycles sounds pretty normal. In many cases - it is just not known, because it is not monitored like with AI cases - eggs will get fertilised by the sperm, but they will not develop properly because of genetic defects and it doesn't come to implantation. Based on your statistics, I am sure that the assisted hatching and aspirin and everything else you did upped the chances but I would also maintain, that your statistics support a pretty normal length of time to get pregnant ;)
> 
> We had 7 natural w/o stims IVFs.
> 
> 2 cases of 3 pronucleus embryo was an egg's fault.
> 
> what happened to 3 other embryos? My RE and we chose to grow till 2 days our embryos they were good quality.
> 
> You are right, bubu about statistics.
> 
> we did 7 IVF's with 6 egg retrievals, it may be equal to 6 cycles of a natural TTC, maybe more IUIs when you really catch ovulation, right? ON average it takes one year for a couple to conceive. It took us 7 IVFs, not 12.
> It could be just a right time and a lucky healthy month. Aspirin and assited hatching may not did a thing???! we'll never know, my RE just raised her shoulders. She couldn't comment on our lucky BFP.
> 
> Sandy, I am so happy your hubby is home. Hoping and praying he is on his healing path. Enjoy your romantic cottage, you guys:kiss:
> 
> bubu, I am sorry about your nightmares. I did have a very colourful dreams which I could clearly remember in my early pregnancy.
> I know my hubby since 2005, this is so right that we have had only 2 vacations ever. We had to be close to his father. He had Alzheimers and he needed lots of help.
> I called my dr. yesterday. It is a mistake on the bill. ICSI was never done.
> 
> Clare, I am super excited for you!
> 
> twinklemama, endo biopsy is a good way to go towards your miracle. Good luck. Sending you blessings.


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## bubumaci

Oh, it's OK - I don't really worry about them. :)
I am sorry that DH's Father had Alzheimers! That's very tough, especially on the relatives! It is very sweet of you, that you looked after him! That can be very stressful for families!! :hugs2:


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## dovkav123

Have you told to anybody that you have had IVFs?
We did.
I am glad to some horrible people we lied, and we said we did IUI.
My mother's in law friend told her that I don't look good. So my mother in law broke the news that I am pregnant.
Instead saying congratulations! 
She said " from him?" "You don't know what they put in"
Why did she do that?
She has a grandchild, she should not be jelous.
I have 2 possible causes:
1. I know she doesn't like me and my husband. But Do we need to hear her opinion? 
2. She has a tought time right now in her life. Maybe she wants to make us feel horrible too?


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## Sandy83

Some people are just horrible!!!!! that is such a nasty thing to say. I wouldn't worry yourself with analysing why she said it as people like that are not worth the trouble! xx


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## bubumaci

That is just awful! How mean! So sorry you had such a nasty response to such fabulous news!

Yes, I have been very open about the treatments we went through - both while going through it and also about Pünktchen being an ICSI baby. I don't see it as anything to be ashamed of and even if it is nobody's business, I think it proves even more our love for each other and for our future child to go through so much to have him. (Plus it really bugged me when people would say to give it time / not to stress / how we can have another child ... really really pisses me off and so I set the record straight).

:hugs2:


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## twinklemama

I've told a lot of people, I'm the same as you Bubu, I don't think it's anything to be ashamed of. I've learnt so much from talking to people, even my patients, as I'm a dentist-one of my patients is now my consultant! 

Dovkav, some people are just cruel and don't have a good word to say about anyone. They will get their comeuppance one way or another!


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## africaqueen

Bugs- fab news regards your scan! how are things going? x

Twinkle- Glad things are moving forward x

Dov- Glad you enjoyed your vacation and that you are feeling well x

Sandy- FAB news about dh! so happy for you both. One hurdle done! and cottage sounds lovely. Will do you both good x

Hi to unlucky, Buba, and all the gang x

AFM- I actually have some news to report! lol. We are going to be starting our 4th cycle of IVF in October!!! :D we are well away from saving the required amount but my dad is very kindly going to contribute some and loan us the rest! i am so happy to be given this chance this year as i honestly could not see it happening before next year due to our circumstances. I am hoping and praying that its 4th time lucky and i also hope that my 4 stone weight loss will make a difference as regards my response to the meds as we are opting for 'mild IVF' this time around. They do the ICSI in on the price if needed and its going to cost us £1000 less due to mild doses of drugs. We have reasoned that last cycle although we may of got 7 eggs, only one was adequate enough for ICSI and i was on 8 amps of stimms that cycle so we would rather have 2-3 amps of stimms and get 2 decent eggs. Quality over quantity any day now. So i will soon be joining you ladies again in IVF chat and i pray pregnancy chat ;) xxx


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## twinklemama

AQ that's brilliant news! And so generous of your dad to help you out. Parents are usually always supportive of us on this journey but not all are able to help like this. We were also very lucky to have help last time, my father-in-law gave us £5k towards our treatment and we paid for the drugs and endo scratch/sedation. Took so much pressure off cos everytime we cycle we lose my earnings aswell as I'm self-employed. You're definitely right about quality over quantity, hopefully we'll both get 4th time lucky! I should prob be going around sept/oct too I expect xo


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## africaqueen

Thanks Twinkle :) we are very lucky. So many other people would not be able to have the support we have. My dad paid half of our last cycle too. Guess he really wants a grandchild huh? ;) i think above all else he wants me to be happy and il never truly be happy until im a mummy. I am sure you know that feeling. I still enjoy my life and live it well but that aching longing is always there. Ooh we might be cycle buddies then and i pray, pregnancy buddies! please god. i truly hope its 4th time lucky for us. Forget that 3rd time lucky crap, its just a cliche ;) xxx


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## bubumaci

Sarah - that is just wonderful! I am so excited for you and really happy, that your Dad is able to give you this opportunity this year!! And yeah - forget that 3rd time lucky crap ... I was hoping that in 2012 *lol* :) Oh, I am so excited!! Many hugs coming your way and I will start with the dust sprinkling now already :) :dust::dust::dust: :kiss:


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## bugs

Amazing news Sarah, parents are bloody amazing aren't they. We wouldn't have been able to do as many cycles without mine so we are really lucky. 

I really hope that mild IVF is better for you, we were given the option of mild IVF or donor and I was just ready to move on but I think for egg issues it is definately the way to go xxxx


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## Unlucky41

Hi to all!! 

Sandy so happy you are finally getting some good news !!! Glad the treatment is going well for dh. Also not fine more till your FET you getting excited?

AQ -I am so happy to see your post - we are all praying that you get that lucky BFP this coming October. When are you going to have your chat with the doctor to know exactly what is the best treatment ?

Bub & Bugs so happy that everything is going well for you gals to date love the scans pictures.

Dovkav -How rude and insensitive can some people be honestly if you have nothing good to say just zip it !! 


AFM- I have been missing due to a few things. I recently turned older and had one big scare. I was bleeding blood red and the baby has been measuring a little smaller than expected. I just thought oh no how to cope and worried myself to death. I am happy to say though everything is fine baby is still measuring a little smaller however not to be too concern yet just on the monitoring stage. More frequent visits to the OB.
Gals hope this doesn't happen to you but finding sleep really hard to come by now due to bad back just got my new wedge pillow hopefully that will help.

Even though I am still thankful that I have got this far and really really hope that nothing bad happens in the next 11 weeks.

:hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs: to everyone on this Thread!!!


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## Sandy83

Great news AQ, Fx'd for October :happydance:

Unlucky, so so sorry to hear about your scare, glad to hear baby is doing well and I'm sure he/she will catch up to where they need to be and fx'd you have nothing to worry about :hugs: xx


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## africaqueen

Thanks ladies. I am so happy but also terrified of another fail as wonder how i would cope mentally?? this journey is a nightmare isnt it, yet we continue to carry on so shows our strength xx

Jo- Glad all is ok with baba and sorry u had to go through a scare x

Hi to all the gang xxx


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## bubumaci

Jo - glad to hear all is OK!! :hugs2:

Sarah - it is a nightmare! I am so glad that you are getting the chance to get your dream come true this year. It costs so much energy (physically, mentally, emotionally) to keep going and to keep going ... not to mention the financial burden too ... however - I can PROMISE you this: if and when it does happen, all the crap we go through to get there, is forgotten ... the times I cursed it all in the past - but the second I got that "positive", I felt it was all worth it and I am glad that I persevered and didn't give up! :hugs2:


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## Unlucky41

Thanks to all!! 

AQ hang in there I was reading my diary from 1 year ago and I agree with bub. A lot of all the hurt and anguish that we experience gets swept away once you have your little one moving inside you. I hope pray that everything works out for you this coming cycle :hugs::hugs:

I hope in a few months you will be posting happy news and you will be laying in bed at night unable to believe that it is really happening to you!!

Hope everyone is well 6 weeks and 2 days left of work so exciting to take 1 year away from work :happydance:


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## africaqueen

Bubu and unlucky- i can imagine what you mean. It just seems like something so close yet so far away, which im sure you all understand. I feel very optimistic now but as we get closer i will no doubt feel anxious and emotional again. Hope this rollercoaster comes to a stop asap ;) Thanks ladies x

Hi to all the gang.

Claire- How are you doing?? x

AFM- Well ladies we have booked our consultation today to get the ball rolling for our 4th cycle! we see the specialist on 12th Aug! omg i am so excited and nervous! We are having the appt in Aug and starting treatment end of Sep now!! we need to get our viral bloods up to date so going to ask my GP to send us for them on the NHS to save £400 or its a huge extra amount we had not budgeted for as im aware our virals will be out of date as last ones were in 2011?? xxx


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## Peachy1584

Hello ladies I have been following this thread for a bit as I have had my own continued failures. I am truly inspired by your strength. So happy for you ladies that have finally gotten your bfp's and pray for the ladies still working towards them. I thought going in to this I would do a cycle and have a baby. Boy was I wrong : ).

AQ it has been quite a while but I am so happy to see you are able to start again. When I read your post I did a little "woot woot"! Hoping/praying this is the lucky cycle for us both :hugs:


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## bubumaci

Sarah - wow, that is a lot of money for the tests!! What viral bloods are they doing? (For each of my tries, they took blood to test for HIV, hepatitis and a bunch of other things! So I have been very thoroughly tested over the past few years *lol*). Soooo excited that the ball is starting to roll again and I have my fingers very tightly crossed for you! xxx

Hi Peachy :howdy: I am sorry that you have had to make your way here - however being here, you will find that the ladies are super supportive!! Don't we all think that (when reading success stories of first tries ... hell, on my 2012 group - a group of us still chatting and supporting each other, though mainly on FB now - I was one of the few who had to have try after try after try after try ... one girl is now pregnant with her second, a FET from one IVF that took right away last time too).
Lovely to see that you have two frosties from your try and can't wait to hear how the testing goes in 6 days! :hugs2: Fingers crossed for you :) :dust::dust::dust:


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## dovkav123

Peachy1584 said:


> Hello ladies I have been following this thread for a bit as I have had my own continued failures. I am truly inspired by your strength. So happy for you ladies that have finally gotten your bfp's and pray for the ladies still working towards them. I thought going in to this I would do a cycle and have a baby. Boy was I wrong : ).
> 
> AQ it has been quite a while but I am so happy to see you are able to start again. When I read your post I did a little "woot woot"! Hoping/praying this is the lucky cycle for us both :hugs:

Hoping and praying for he best outcome ever!
Sending you best wishes and lots of baby dusts!:dust::dust:


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## MrsE75

Hi ladies 

Sorry I've been AWOL I have been reading all the wonderful news from you all. I'm so happy for you all with bumps and AQ with your pending bump!! (do you like the positivity!!!)

I've been seeing a new clinic in London (I know a long way to go but their results are just far better than anything up here so for my last go with my eggs I need to try it or I will always wonder).

So had consult in Jan, they did full immune panel as they were 98% sure I have an immune issue due to my thyroid plus the mc. Plus they did a sperm frag test. I do have an immune problem which they can treat when I cycle plus hubby had a higher frag issue so both been on specific vits for 3 mths and hubby was retested in May his sperm frag was 33% now down to 18% so we are cycling on my July period! Scared and cannot tell you how much it is going to cos with accommodation plus the immune treatment but it will be well worth it. I have to be down in London for 2-3 weeks cos you are monitored everyday bloods and scans every 2 days initially then can be daily depending on how you go. 

This is like Bootcamp Ivf I'm told so very scared and a tad excited at the same time!

Wish me luck ladies cos I think I'm going to need all the help I can get. 

I will keep you updated with the highlights as and when and keep reading your updates. 

Lots of love and baby dust to us all xxxxx


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## bubumaci

MrsE :hugs2:
That does sound so promising!!
Will they be doing IMSI this cycle, do you know? It does sound scary and exciting and I am so happy you are getting the opportunity to try it!
All fingers (mine + Pünktchen's) are crossed for you, sending you huge :hugs: and an enormous sprinkling of :dust::dust::dust: :kiss:


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## Sandy83

Morning Ladies

Welcome Peachy :hi: How you holding up? not long now til OTD, will you be testing early? :hugs:

Bubmaci & Dovkav, how are you and bumps doing? Any up and coming scan? :hugs:

Unlucky, Wohoo! Not long left for you how are you holding up? Hope you are enjoying your last weeks at work :happydance:

AQ, Great news about appointment on 12th Aug got everything crossed for you :hugs:

MrsE, Great news about results with DH's sperm and also about being able to pin point you have immune issues at least you have a plan in place now and hopefully will get you that all important BFP! Looking forward to your updates :hugs:

AFM, Have my WTF appointment on 19th August after delaying it for so long but still not going ahead with FET till end of the year but want to make sure everything is sorted so when i decide to go ahead everything is sorted and can start straight away! DH has now finished his chemo and hospital has confirmed a German donor is willing to donate the stem cells which is a 10/12 match for DH which is great news but they have plans for the first couple of weeks of August so Transplant will be delayed till end of August/beginning of Sept so will be waiting till DH is recovering from transplant before doing FET but at least we have a plan! xx


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## MrsE75

Sandy that's amazing news and I'm so happy your hubby has got stem cell donor that's huge!!!

Good luck with the stem cell op (I'm assuming it will be an op?). Everything feels so much better when you have a plan doesn't it. Also you have lots of things to focus on so time will pass so quickly. 

Bub - thanks for your reply. The clinic don't use IMSI because they haven't personally seen any difference in success rates compared with Ivf or ICSI so probably we will have ICSI again. Dreading the steroids but this place specialises in implantation and immune issues. They also have higher success with over 40's too. The clinic is the same as where rod Stewart and penny Lancaster went to for their child apparently. So hope it works for us. 

It's a personal decision but before I give up on my eggs I want to give this place a try. They are known as the clinic where everyone says it's their last shot! But I won't care if it delivers our precious baby.

Thanks ladies you are always so supportive xx


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## Unlucky41

Sandy what did they say at you appointment ? Did they give you any % of success for your FET in Nov ? It is great that you guys have a plan and know when things are all going to happen. Also good news about the donor stem cells :hugs::hugs:

MrsE75 - wishing you all the best for the upcoming cycle. I think it is great you are trying somewhere different. After our three cycle failures we also tried somewhere with better stats and it worked. Really hope it al goes all to plan this time!!!

My sister gave birth to a baby girl today :happydance::happydance:
She had a tough time and ended having a emergency C-section.
AFM I am doing good everything is back on schedule.


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## Sandy83

MrsE, Thanks, The stem cell transplant is as simple as having a blood transfusion he is on a IV drip for a couple of hours and that's it. The lengthy process is the recovery as before they do the transplant they kill of DH's immune system so once the transplant is complete his body needs to take the donor cells and create a new immune system but they complications that can happen are his body rejects it and can be as serious as attacking his organs and causing organ failure but this is the extreme! So fx'd everything goes as good as it has so far DH is a fighter and doesn't give up easily :hugs:

Unlucky, I haven't had my WTF yet its on the 19th August. Congratulations on becoming an Auntie! It must be great to have you and your sister having babies so close to each other :hugs: xx


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## Peachy1584

Thanks so much for the well wishes ladies!

Bubu you are so far along! Have you found out the babies gender or do you want a surprise?

Dovkav YAY for being out of the tri! Can you feel baby move yet or is it still too early?

Sandy that is amazing about finding a donor. When I am all done with this craziness I plan on being put on the bone marrow registry. A friend of mine did and he ended up being a donor. It's something so easy to do but so many of us don't even think about it. It's also wonderful that you have frozen embryos. Even though mine ended in a MC from a trisomy my fet was the only one that wanted to stick around. I have been wondering if that's the only way I can get pregnant as maybe all the meds from my fresh transfers are too much so I thank God I was able to have 2 make it to freeze this time. Fresh cycles are so damn draining anyways.


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## bubumaci

Sandy - I am so excited, that you are finally getting your WTF meeting! And still sending out prayers for DH's recovery + then for the transplant. Really glad that you have a donor from here and I so very much hope, that you both will then be able to put this nightmare behind you ... and look forward to having a successful FET and BFP :kiss:

MrsE - I totally get your approach and personally probably wouldn't do it any other way either. It was also our philosophy : at least we won't have left any stone unturned and anything untried. I had only asked about the IMSI because of your status (and the two tries in your siggy) ... The clinic does sound really good!!! Fingers crossed :)

Peachy ... 3 more days :) :) :dust::dust::dust:
Yes, we do know the gender :) We are having a little boy :)

... Sandy, to answer your question - I did have one last week, yes (totally forgot to update here, because I wrote quite long posts in my journal and updated a couple of other threads). It was the big anatomy scan and we were delighted that everything was just perfect! Got some lovely pictures (I love that place! DH was able to watch everything on his own screen!!) - the scan was so good, that my risk for trisomies (which had gone down beautifully after my NT scan - started out quite high because of my age!) went down by another 50%. 

The pictures (I have heaps and heaps more ... hard being selective ;) are of:
1) Baby P's incredible thighs and calves ...
2) a lovely 3D profile piccie
3) My, what biceps!!
4) A hand waving
and 5) my bump picture from this week (taken Monday) when I started the 22nd week.

On Saturday we also went for our first bout of baby shopping (ordered cupboard, dresser - with changer on top - and crib for the nursery. That takes 8 weeks to be delivered. We ordered the pram - takes 12 weeks - and the car seat - ready for pick up - BabyBay, so that the baby can sleep next to us for the first few months - really cool, it is open on the side of the bed and I can just reach over to calm him / pick him up for feeding - and a playpen for downstairs). Made it all very real - not that the daily hiccups and little movements don't. I have been feeling him since the 18th week, then a couple of weeks later, DH could feel him from outside and on Sunday I figured, if we can feel him from the outside, then I should be able to see something. So I lay there, staring at my belly ... and there it was :) Where he kicked, I saw my belly protrude a little more <3 :)

On Tuesday, we picked up the new family car (had ordered it the day before we got the BFP - swapped mine for it) - it is the new Mazda 6 estate (looks very snazzy with lots of room) :) Driving to Budapest this afternoon, because my Aunt is there from Cyprus visiting my Grandma - and I would like to see both (haven't seen Grandma since Christmas) - plus break the car in ... driving back on Sunday :)
 



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## dovkav123

Sandy83
Bubmaci & Dovkav said:


> *Peachy* :Thinking of you! Did you test?
> 
> *MrsE,* I am glad you found some issues and they'll be fixed. We were unexplained. All my tests were perfect, except low vitD. I took a double dose for 3 month and we got BFP.
> 
> *Sandy*,I hope and pray for the smooth your hubby's recovery from the transplant in September.
> 
> Here is my 1st tri baby bump growing photos I took them strickly before breakfast cos it doubles in size after the meal.
> Do you see the difference?
> I havn't seen any dr. for 6 weeks, all my pregnancy symptoms are gone. I worry a little bit. I am weaning off aspirin and progesterone. It's very crucial time right now.
> Growing belly is my hope that baby is kicking strong
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06AeWwILdDY


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## Peachy1584

Bubu huge congrats on a baby boy! How exciting you are so lucky!

Dovkav Yay for the little bump! You're just a tiny little thing aren't you! 

Yes ladies I started testing at 6dp3dt and got a very faint positive. I have been using frer and while they got darker from that but since haven't gotten darker at all. I am hoping for the best but have prepared myself for the worst and I thank God every day that no matter what happens this cycle I have 2 frozen babies waiting for me. I think it gets to a point where you just expect the worst as the inevitable. Beta is tomorrow but unfortunately my clinic will not tell results until after second beta which is Wed. I understand their theory behind but it still bothers me because I want to know anyways : ). I guess I'm lucky they don't make me wait long though as tomorrow I am 10dp3dt. I know some ladies have to wait a couple weeks.


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## Unlucky41

Bub - great photos :happydance::happydance:

Peachy - a positive sounds promising wish you all the best for Wednesday praying that you get a fantastic beta :hugs::hugs:

Dovkav - definitely can see a bump there - welcome to the best trimester - enjoy every moment. You going to organise a baby moon before your third trimester?

AFM - I have 8.5 weeks to go 4.5 weeks left of work - counting down and getting quite scare and excited!


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## dovkav123

Unlucky, time rushed so fast, isn't! Your countdown is here! I am so excited for you!
You are right! I do feel the best in this tri, I am enjoying every minute of it!
I was worried a bit, all my preg. symptoms had gone, but I think only positive I am just a lucky one! 

Thank you peachy! Listen to this. Youtube marked my baby bump videos as age restricted. (some nudity)

Peachy, thinking and praying for you. Wishing you the best today! You so deserve it!


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## Sandy83

Dovkav & Bubumaci great pics :happydance:

Peachy, Good luck for today look forward to seeing your results. Have you tested again? :hugs:

Unlucky, Yay not long now :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Wow, Jo, only 8,5 weeks ... It has just sped by!

Peachy ... *ON TENTERHOOKS HERE* :) :dust::dust:

Sandy, how are you and DH doing? :hugs2:


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## Sandy83

We are doing good, enjoying having DH home for a long period of time and feel like we are able to plan things and get on with life as normal for a while anyway. xx


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## bubumaci

Ahhh - glad that you are able to enjoy each other and feel normal! :)


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## Peachy1584

Dovkav that's so funny YouTube did that! 

Unlucky that amazing! Why do you call yourself unlucky?

I have my second in a couple hours and will get my results by 3 o clock so I know some of you will be sleeping but I'll post them anyways. I know this sounds terrible but with my fet my betas were amazing but at u/s the yolk say was enlarged so they suspected something was wrong even though heartbeat was good. I get the whole one day at a time thing but I have to believe even in successful, everything is going right cycles the worry never ends. I am a worrier anyways. A friend recently asked me if stress affected ivf and I said well I don't think so or none of us would ever get babies : )


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## bubumaci

All fingers and toes crossed for you Peachy! I will keep an eye out for your post :)
:dust::dust::dust:


I also believe in "believing" and staying positive. It is very hard not to worry and I think it is part of being a parent - which for us begins at conception. During pregnancy, there is the worry of something going wrong ... and well once the child is here - that is just the fate of a parent ;) But you mustn't let it drive you crazy.

Stress is not good for any type of pregnancy, so best to avoid or minimise anyway :)


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## Peachy1584

Beta from Monday 10dp3dt was 115 and today's at 12dp3dt is 384. I will have an early u/s to make sure it's not ectopic around 5 1/2 weeks and have beta a couple days before that to make sure levels are even high enough to see anything. I already love whoever is in there and hope to God this time they stay..


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## Sandy83

Congratulations peachy hope this one is a sticky bean xxxxxxxxx


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## bubumaci

Yay Peachy!!!! :wohoo: :kiss: I think those numbers sound great. Congratulations Sweetie! (I specially came on to check your results!)

Night night and very sweet dreams :)


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## Peachy1584

Thank you Sandy I hope with all my heart it's my time. I hope yours comes this fall as well :flower:

Bubu thank you for checking back. I don't know that numbers mean a whole lot but I was very pleased with the 2 day progression. It's just a real long waiting game isn't it : )


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## bubumaci

Well, I think they are great and the doubling times are really good!! (27-28 hours) :) It is a long waiting game, but think positive thoughts, have positive feelings, channel them towards your little bean/beans and don't let any negativity in. I have found that really important :hugs2:


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## africaqueen

Peachy- WOW! Huge congrats! lovely to see u with us and with such special news xxx

Dov- Aww that is a cute lil bump! congrats x

Bubu- LOVE the scan pics! amazing! congrats on being team blue! x

Sandy- WONDERFUL news regards your hubby and glad u are able to plan ahead x

MrsE- Oooh all sounds very promising! best of luck and keep us updated. This next cycle we are doing is also the last cycle with my own eggs so praying we get our miracle too x

Unlucky- Glad all is going well and its going soooo fast! x

Hi to all the gang xxx

AFM- I am just counting down the days to our consultant appt so we can be pencilled in to start our 4th cycle end of Sep/beg of Oct depending on AF showing on time. lol. DH has started working nights again so me an my dad are off to Scotland tomorrow for a long weekend of sightseeing, eating an drinking. My last treat before we have to save the remainder of the IVF cash and then my lovely dad is helping with the rest ;) feel so lucky to be given another chance an pray it brings us our baby xxx


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## bubumaci

That's so great Sarah! Enjoy your weekend in Scotland :) :kiss:


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## dovkav123

peachy your beta is fantastic, you did all your best. Now you need to wait and let the little bean grow!


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## Hopefulx2

Hi.. Know so many of the names having trailered on here for a year from my first go to today, which I'm pretty sure is my third failed transfer.. I'm devastated.. I know the pain will go away eventually as it has before but I am wondering if I'm now at the end of my ivf pursuit. I don't know if I can do this again but the reality of rolling over and accepting my infertility is also one of the hardest things I'll ever have to do...


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## Unlucky41

Peachy :happydance::happydance::happydance::happydance: so happy for you your betas are great !! Enjoy this journey - pray that everything continues to go well for you.

Sandy happy that everything is going well for you and your husband :hugs:

Bub you are right behind me -have you started buying baby boy clothes etc?

Sarah I really hope you get your miracle this time :hugs::hugs:

hopefulx2 sorry did I miss something what happened? how come you are pretty sure it is your 3rd failed transferred? :hugs::hugs::hugs:


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## bubumaci

Hi Hopeful,
Oh, Sweetie, I am sorry you are feeling so down! And I totally feel with you and know what you are going through!!
What makes you think that this try has failed? Are there any reasons (other than financial perhaps) to make you give up at #3? (As you can see from my signature, we had 6 ICSIs and 9 transfers before our success - needless to say, it was a very very hard, stony journey, but I am so glad that we hadn't got to the point yet when we were giving up ... we were close!! I had said, that since I will be 40 next year, if it hasn't worked by the end of the year, we are stopping ... first try this year brought us our little miracle) ...

May I ask what your diagnosis is? Having to accept the cards that nature has dealt us is so very very difficult (in our case, I had to also try to comfort my husband, who is the infertile one, because he knew how much I wanted to children and felt broken / damaged) and it is so very unfair!

Do you have any other options to become a parent? (If it is you, perhaps with donor eggs ... if it is your husband, perhaps with donor sperm ... adoption .. fostering?)...

Hey Jo - no, we haven't gone down the clothes-shopping route yet (actually, just updated my journal - link in my signature - with our latest shopping results ... on Saturday). We bought a few things while picking up the car seat and the pram (which had originally had 12 weeks delivery, but was surprisingly there when we went to pick up the car seat!!) - a bumper for the crib, some covers for the mattresses (for the crib + the BabyBay), a mobile for the playpen, and a very sweet outfit for sleeping in ... :)


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## twinklemama

Hi girls! 

Peachy, congratulations on your BFP!! I'm sure you still can't believe it!

Dovkav and Bubu, I love the pics, especially the waving hand! 

AQ, hope you enjoyed your time in Scotland!

Hopeful, I'm so sorry to hear how you're feeling, please don't give up hope tho, so many of the girls on here have finally gotten their bfp's after years of trying, I have no doubt that we'll be the same eventually. 

Sandy, so please your hubby has a donor lined up. Thank God for people who sign onto the register. DH is on the register after a friend of his battled with Hodgkin's lymphoma for many years. Fingers crossed you'll be on the other side with a beautiful miracle on the way this time next year. 

Unlucky, so glad things are progressing well for u, so exciting!

MrsE, your plan sounds like it makes perfect sense, throw everything at it. I'm kinda at that stage too but just not sure yet how to move forward.

Afm, I've started seeing a woman called Ruthellen Logan, she's championing her own method of maya massage coupled with diet, vitamins and acupressure/reflexology treatments. I've started on zita west vitamins, and am going back for maya massage sessions. Apparently my uterus is retroverted and lying to the right, so she's gonna try to correct it. She's also certain I have an immune issue so I have an emdometrial biospy booked for NK cells and am trying to figure out if my GP can run level 1 immunes. Can anyone tell me what I need to get tested for level 1? 

Hope I didn't miss anyone, sorry for such a long post! xo


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## Sandy83

Morning ladies

Peachy, Has the news sank in yet? How you doing, when is your first scan?

Bubumaci, Unlucky & Dovkav, hope those little ones are growing nicely :hugs:

AQ, Twinkle & MrsE Hope you are doing well, Sounds like everyone is starting to get a plan in place. 

Hopeful, How are you? Have you have the definite result that this cycle hasn't worked? As Twinkle has said a lot of ladies on this thread have been through a lot and ended with there miracle and i am still in hope that it will happen for me also and not ready to give up yet. You have got to go with how you are feeling as to whether to continue with IVF as it is hard. 

AFM, Things are going good so far DH is starting to feel as normal as can be after all the treatment and is back to work full time at the moment which is doing him good to get out the house and back to normality but still taking it easy. He had a PET/CT scan yesterday so will get those results plus MRI scan results next Tuesday to see how the chemo has worked and if any radiotherapy is required before the transplant. 

Going away for a week on 19th July so looking forward to that, and have WTF appointment in 6 weeks time xx


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## MrsE75

Twinkle just to say that my GP is very good and when I had tier 1 immunes done he managed to get a couple done for me. However I would say that they came back normal so we didn't think anything was wrong. Only now I've had the full Chicago bloods done have they found my immune issue. So just a word of caution cos level 1s can be normal but you may have immune issues if that makes sense. I had my NK cells tested through the Chicago blood test too but don't have that issue at the moment but who knows once I get pumped with drugs what happens!?! So at least my next cycle I will know cos they retest your mini immunes a few times during stimm and 2ww to see if they flare up. 

This time in 2 weeks I should be starting - I'm terrified if I'm honest I don't think I can handle Ivf Bootcamp to come away with nothing but that's not going to happen is it girls!!! I need to keep positive but scared to be going again.

Baby dust to us all on our continuing journeys xxx


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## bubumaci

Twinkle - I'm afraid I can't give you details on what gets tested - the team just had the tests run for me ... But MrsE has given you good advice :hugs2:

Sandy - that's great that DH is feeling so much better! I do hope this upward curve continues, you have been through far too much already! All our fingers and toes are crossed that the results come back favourably and that he doesn't need even further treatment before the transplant!
Where are you going for on your week away? I hope you have a lovely, lovely trip!! And that'll make the time until your WTF appointment just fly by!! :kiss:

MrsE : IVF-Bootcamp does sound daunting, but they will take really good care of you there and I am sending out wishes to the Universe for your little miracle! :hugs:
:dust::dust::dust:


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## Sandy83

Yes PMA all the way, It's hard not to think about the negatives but it will happen :hugs: xx


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## Peachy1584

Bubu won't you be having a baby shower?

AQ I'm so excited for you to get started! It seems as if everyone on the old thread is far along or has had their babies so it's time for us to as well!

Hopeful it can be so hard can't it? Unfortunately if we don't keep trying we won't get what we want most. Fortunately though if we can hang in there the vast majority of us will get what we so long for. I hope you can hang in there too :hugs:

Twinkle does she know you have immune issues just by looking at you? I had the endo biopsy done this time and I'm glad you reminded me because I never even got any results from it. I hope they figure out what's going on for you.

MrsE your you're amazing for really doing everything you can!

Sandy Yay for hubby going back to work! It must feel great to him to have things a little back to normal. I hope those tests bring the good news you deserve and need.

Afm I have another beta tomorrow. If it's good I will have an u/s early next week. I am 5 weeks today and would like to hold off as long as possible (I'd just worry more if they can't see a heartbeat even though in my head I'd know it would be too early : ) ) but they insist I do it because my history of ectopics. Just taking things one very long day at a time : )


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## MrsE75

Peachy gosh we go through hell to get pregnant and then the worry doesn't stop esp for us ladies who have had miscarriages or eptopics. I think it's natural to worry ahead of a scan. When I got pregnant I had all symptoms so went into 6wks scan not worrying at all but hey presto a sac but no heartbeat I nearly died cos it was so unexpected. So now I think we all just expect the worst possible to try and prepare but then you want to be positive it will work. It's so hard so give yourself a break, try and keep busy doing nice things and I'm sure the scan will be fine. 

Good luck to you. 

Sandy - so happy for you and hubby with him back a work it must almost feel like it never happened!?! I know you still have a way to go but wishing you and he a great few weeks ahead for the results. Xxx


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## Peachy1584

MrsE you couldn't be more right. Of course with my miscarriage betas finally looked great and it seemed perfect but I kept having that niggling feeling. Then when they said the yolk sac was borderline big and could mean something was wrong I was devastated but then the next two u/s were great and his heartbeat was great and he was growing right on schedule and the sac hadn't been growing I finally had hope. Then the next one his heartbeat was just gone... it's hard now not to protect myself from that pain and devastation but on the other hand I decided it's not just about me. Whoever is in there is trying their best to grow inside of me needs all my love and strength to have a chance so I cannot deny them that. They all start out as embryos and whether they end up a BFN or a bfp that is later lost they are still our babies and it will hurt regardless because it is a loss and should be grieved rightfully so. I can't wait to hear about your rainbow baby MrsE. Sometimes we just take a longer route to get to the same place :hugs:


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## Sandy83

Well said Peachy! :hugs:

Bubumaci, We are going to the lake district which is only 2 hours away from where we live but still good to get away!

Well I've just had DH on the phone and the Dr has called him to say he has had a quick look at his scan results and looks like the chemo has work extremely well so that is amazing news. Still got to go to the appointment next week to have a full discussion about the results but is great news so far! :happydance: Feel like we have passed a major hurdle with DH getting better and hope the good news continues to roll in xx


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## MrsE75

Sandy - amazing news. Go an enjoy the Lake District with some peace of mind, one of mine and hubby's favourite places to relax. 

Enjoy xxxx


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## bubumaci

Peachy - unfortunately, Baby Showers are not really held here (Germany), much as I would love one. But in a few weeks we are having a big party to celebrate DH's birthday (didn't manage to the past few months yet), my birthday (which will have been 3 days before the party), house warming (because last year was so shitty for me, I didn't want to celebrate much) and Pre-Pünktchen-Arrival :) If we are lucky, we might get a couple of Pünktchen gifts then :)

I look forward to hearing your next beta :) :) (BTW - 6w2d is when we saw Pünktchen's heartbeat and I was released from the clinic...) All fingers and toes crossed Sweetie!

Sandy ... :wohoo: that is wonderful news! I am over the moon for you :kiss:


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## africaqueen

Just checking in to say hi and i hope everyone is well.
I had a fab weekend in Scotland and was miserable going back to work today! lol.
xxx


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## ashknowsbest

Hi ladies! I have a quick question. I'm supposed to be starting my BCPs today gearing up for my FET but I'm not sure if I'm supposed to just start at the beginning of the packet of pills or start somewhere else. There are 21 pink pills and then 7 blue. I just want to make sure I'm taking the correct pills ....


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## bubumaci

I've never had to take BCP while doing IVF or FET, but I would have thought definitely start at the beginning. The 7 blue pills are for the "pill-free" period, when you are not giving your body hormones and normally, that is the time you get your period. Yours just have 28 days' worth of pills, so that they can constantly be taken (4 weeks). So just start at the beginning and stop when the clinic tells you.... Fingers tightly crossed for your FET :) :dust::dust::dust:


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## ashknowsbest

Thanks bubu! Ended up hearing from my doctor but she said the exact same thing! :D I'm keeping everything crossed for this FET!


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## wtbmom_tx

]Hello, 
I'm new to this forum, and as I'm reading I feel like I can relate with a lot of you. This is my first time joining a group like this, but I feel I need to connect with people who are going through or have gone through the same thing as me. Friends and family try to help, but don't know what to really say because they are unable to relate.
So a let me tell you all about me. I'm 29 and DH is also 29, he has no problem. I've had three ectopic pregnancies. The first one ruptured, the second was caught in time so they were able to scrape my tube. Six months later we had another ectopic and nothing could be done to save it &#128542;, and to make matters worse my right ovary was also removed because it was full of blood!!! Doc couldn't give me an explanation as to why. Our only option to get pregnant was IVF.

When I was 26 we decided to go for IVF. First one was a fresh cycle. We were able to get two embies, but ended up as a BFN..
We tried our second fresh IVF the following year and were able to transfer two and freeze three!! Again it was a negative. My DH wanted to do a frozen right away, so we waited for my period and went ahead and did it. Two frosties were transferred and to our surprise we got a BFP!! We were excited cause we couldn't believe the time had finally come for us. A week later I had gone to the restroom and a ton of blood came out (no cramps). I went to the doc for a sono and they said it was a CP.. We were so heart broken we waited about two years for the next one, which was this summer. We transferred one and got a negative..
Sorry for venting, but I feel I can relate with you all. My question here is have any of you done a fifth cycle? We want to purse the fifth one with a new cycle, but have to save the money for it, so who knows if we can do this next summer.


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## bubumaci

Ash - that's great that you were able to get confirmation from your doctor :)

Hi wtbmom :howdy: ... I am so sorry you have had all these struggles + ectopics and loss of tubes / ovaries!! :hugs2: So so hard and I totally get your devastation! :hugs2:

In answer to your question, whether anyone has done a 5th cycle : yes. I have! We went through *9* cycles before getting our BFP! We had to do ICSI (which is essentially IVF but where the sperm is injected into the ovum).

1st cycle fresh (June 2012) = BFN
2nd cycle FET (July 2012) = BFN
3rd cycle FET (August 2012) = BFN
4th cycle fresh (September 2012) = BFN
5th cycle FET (October 2012) = FBN
6th cycle fresh (February 2013) (had to postpone because of OHSS)... so FET (April 2013) = BEFN
7th cycle fresh (July 2013) = CP
8th cycle fresh (November 2013) = CP
9th cycle fresh (February 2014) = BFP

So - as you can see from my signature - it took us 88 retrieved eggs, 56 fertilised and 20 transferred before we came away with our little miracle! In fact, at the beginning of the year, I had said, that since I will be 40 next year, if we haven't succeeded by the end of the year, we are giving up ... first try of the year brought us our miracle baby!

You are both still so young - if you have the mental energy (and I know how much this whole process saps you of energy, what it does to you physically and emotionally) to continue, then I would suggest to work on saving the money and keep trying. There seems to be no physical reason (other than having only one ovary) as to why it shouldn't work. You have managed to get pregnant on a couple of occasions, so both you and DH are healthy - so by doing IVF, you should be able to get there... :kiss:


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## Peachy1584

Ash I hope this cycle is it for you!!

Wtbmom so sorry you've had to go through so much :hugs: have they said why they font think it has worked or tweaked each cycle to try something a little different? It's hard because I've always believed it's a numbers and it's just about finding the right one and I believe you will : )

Bubu I wish you all had baby showers maybe you could start a new trend! Hopefully you do get gifts to help out and enjoy bday! : )


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## wtbmom_tx

Bubu, thank you sooo much for your kind words!!! We have looked into a new facility in a different city. I believe I can go through as many cycles ( as long as we are financially able to) as we have to get our little miracle. Congratulations on your BFP!!

Peachy, also congratulations on your BFP!! As for our cycles we haven't done anything different, which is why DH suggested I look into finding a new doctor. His co worker told him about a one they went to 2 hours from where we live and were successful. I have emailed the facility, briefly explaining my history. Their reply has made me hopeful. They said they would go into more testing to see if my uterus or my body is resisting implantation. All my clinic tested for was to see if my body would reject my DH sperm (which it didn't)


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## bugs

WTBMOM, I also had both my tubes removed due to an ectopic after my 1st cycle. I went through numerous cycles which either failed or early losses. I believe there could be a connection with ectopics/tube damage and immune issues. Once I had been diagnosed as having immune issues the treatment is very straight forward steroids during treatment and a few intralipids. My issues were also poor quality eggs but after 8 cycles using my own eggs we were ready to try something else and cracked it on our 1st cycle. 
Now I'm not saying this is the case for everyone with tube issues but it is my thoughts and another route you may wish to go down. Good luck x

Hi to everyone else sorry I haven't been around much, I'm pretty knackered and waiting for all this energy I'm supposed to get in 2nd trimester. We're are on holiday at the moment enjoying our last holiday as a couple and I've got my 20 week scan on the 24th so excited for that. Hope everyone else is well xxxx


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## wtbmom_tx

Bugs, Thank You so much for your sharing your experience. That is one of the reason we have decided to try a different clinic, because our current one never told us if their was a problem with our eggs or not. 
My doc back home is in shock not knowing why it hasn't worked, because to him I seem perfectly healthy. This new clinic we are looking into, will require more testing, which we don't mind as long as we get our baby. We have talked about donor eggs, and if that's our last resort we will surely go through it.
Congratulations on your pregnancy, wishing you the best!!


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## bugs

WTBMOM I would say if you have good quality embryo's put back and they don't take it could well be an immune response. Also I had my treatment in Greece and they do a test called the hidden C test to see if there is any underlying infections present in your uterus which is sometimes the case with tubal damage, you have to send a sample of your period which is yucky but if it comes back positive they just prescribe a strong course of antibiotics. 
With me we never really got any amazing embryo's they were always pretty average and so we had to take our consultants advice when she suggested donor eggs. 
I am a strong believer that if you can't get there in 3 cycles something needs to be changed or tests need to be done. There's always room for improvement xxx


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## bubumaci

WTBMOM - the thing that we also always have to keep in mind is - even if what looks like good quality embryos are transferred (at 5 days blastocysts or at 3 days 8 cell-embryos) at this point, we cannot tell what the genetic make-up is. Yes, we have fertilised eggs - but even in "healthy" people who can get pregnant naturally, many many cycles will pass, where the eggs get fertilised and develop, maybe even start to try implanting - but due to chromosome issues, will not survive.
That was likely the case many a time with us. And it doesn't have to be, because there is something wrong with the parents, but simply, because in the development, something goes wrong. Our doctor told us about a woman, who had had a child long long ago and then was having trouble getting pregnant again (had several chemicals and miscarriages). So they tested the parents genetically and it turned out, that on two of her chromosomes, she had a genetic mutation - which didn't affect her, but was perhaps playing a role when creating offspring.
So they decided to try IVF and do PID (pre-implanation diagnostics). They ended up having 5 (I think) blastocysts, which they then tested. The first showed a genetic mutation on 3 different chromosomes (one of which the Mother also had, but two she didn't). The second also showed genetic mutations - on 5 different chromosomes (another of the Mother's but also 4 additional ones). The third and fourth embryos showed genetic mutations all across the board on several chromosomes - NONE of which the Mother had. The fifth was fine, was transferred and ended up being their take-home baby.

But this only goes to show, that when creating a new life, things can go wrong and when we think we are transferring embryos that seem to be perfect, they might not be - and therefore, they just arrest in their development at some point.
We can get only so far with science - and then Mother Nature does the rest. Our doctor was convinced, that it was just a matter of time before we would get pregnant - but he just couldn't guarantee how long it would take. He did (after we switched to him in November 2012) tweak the treatment, suggested supplements etc. and with each try, the results got better and better ... but without doing PID, you can never be sure if the embryos being transferred are going to stick ... 

I mean, I am healthy - my husband is (excepting the lack of sperm / the lack of motility when there are sperm) also healthy - no genetic issues or hormonal or immune issues found ... so after fertilisation, there was no reason why it shouldn't work : except for nature ...

Maybe trying pre-implanation diagnosis would be something you could try (after testing everything else) - it definitely ups the chances of transferring and embryo that is likely to survive ... :hugs2:


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## captainj1

hi girls, hope everyone is doing OK. Been a while since I've posted, was fairly low after my failed cycle in April but was feeling a bit more optimistic leading up to natural cycle IVF which we were trying this month. However, I had ER this morning and despite there being 2 large follicles (one larger than the other), neither contained an egg. My consultant is baffled and wants to discuss with his colleagues before we have our follow up appointment. He had the embryologist look at the fluid in the follicles and he said something about granular cells, slate cells, being present? And that there seems to be an issue with the egg maturation process. the follicles were 18mm on Friday so there should have been something in there. 

No wonder I've had no luck conceiving naturally if I'm not actually producing any eggs. I'm devastated, as no idea where we go from here and it will be a couple of weeks before my follow up. Does anyone have any similar experiences?

X


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## bubumaci

Hi Captain :howdy:
I am so sorry that you just had ER without any little eggies in there :( :( You must be feeling so frustrated :hugs2: ... I wonder whether that was just bad luck this time around and otherwise you are producing mature eggs?
I cannot report of similar experiences, but I really really do hope that they are able to find out what is going on and will be able to come up with a solution! As awful as this sounds (I too am 38, going on 39 next month), it may be an age-related thing, where you do on most cycles produce mature eggs and ovulate, but not on all cycles? Since it would seem that for the previously stimulated cycles they were able to retrieve and fertilise eggs ..?

Huge hugs to you Sweetie! :hugs:


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## dovkav123

Captain, I am so sorry about your failed natural IVF. I am heartbroken for you. I have been there, I have suffered lots of failures too.
Do you mean you don't stimulate your ovaries and wait for a natural egg to grow? This kind of goal was mine. I think you should try for another one, I agree with bubumaci. IN Germany the prices are more affordable than in England.
I have had 7 natural IVFs in 7 cycles
6 eggs retrieved
4 fertilised(got transfered 4 or 8 cells )
(the fourth one is a lucky one BFP one, did assisted hatching and aspirin)

During my first IVF natural cycle an egg was not retrieved. The follicle was 14-15mm in the morning and in the evening I did the HCG trigger. They did check hormones that day, estrogen, progesterone and LH make sure I havn't O yet.
Other IVFs we found an 18mm in the morning, triggered next day in the evening and retrieval was in 36 hours. We let an egg to mature longer. ON the day of retrieval it grew to 21-23mm.
Here are my detail journey of each natural cycle IVF
https://babyandbump.momtastic.com/a...h-natural-cycle-ivf-w-o-meds-finally-bfp.html

Good luck to you, I am sending you tons of love and hugs:hugs:

this is a study about a natural cycle IVF for older women, for bad responders
Many women were lucky from the 3rd try.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3169680/


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## captainj1

yes it was unstimulated IVF, so just a couple of scans and then ovitrelle trigger on Saturday night and ER today (CD11). I had known that there was every chance there wouldn't be anything to transfer, I had prepared myself for the egg being immature, or not fertilising, or not dividing, or not implanting....and for this taking several goes...just not the possibility of there being no egg in the first place.

My first fresh stim cycle I got 16 eggs, 14 fertilised, 7 5 day blasts so 2 transferred and 5 to freeze. I've never had any success with implantation and my fresh cycles have got worse each time, I am in despair. I'm 39 in 2 weeks and really feeling old. 

I have a son who I conceived naturally 4 years ago and who is looking increasingly miraculous. I am so grateful for him, he is my world. I just feel so sad for him that I cannot give him a sibling.

Dovkav do you mind me asking how much natural cycle IVF costs in Germany? I paid £3k for this cycle but my consultant said he will give me a refund so at least that is something. He has already had over £20k of my money so at least that's something. 

take care ladies

x


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## wtbmom_tx

Bugs, thank you for your advice on the hidden C test. I live in Texas, and am hoping and praying they offer the same test (I'm thinking they do). My husband and I have narrowed our results to two clinics, but are looking more into the one he has been getting great reviews about. Like you I also believe treatment should be changed after any failed cycle. My current clinic never changed my medication at the beginning of any cycle!! They started me off with the same dose and would only increase my dose depending on my blood work. This is also one of the reason we started looking into another facility because we strongly believe our cycle needs to change one way or another.

Bubumaci, I also thank you for your advice. I am taking all of your into consideration and ensuring I ask all these questions when we decide on a new clinic and go for consultation. Our current clinic did have us get a genetics test and according to them everything was perfectly fine. We have even asked if it would be better if we use donor eggs, but they said it wasn't necessary. My hubby surprises me every time we go to consultations, because he starts asking all these questions I never expected to know about, let alone have the courage to ask (sorry, but he does his research without me knowing and I just remembered this).
Like you and your husband we are both healthy. We eat healthy, try to stay away from processed foods, junk food, chips, etc.. and we both exercise and enjoy running. I stop my workouts about a month and a half before any cycle to ensure nothing goes wrong. 
I will ask all of these questions when we decide on a clinic and are ready for consultation!! All your advice has really helped me.


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## MrsE75

Hi ladies

We seem to be gathering new people every time I'm on here. Which is sad by the fact we've all had to endure this long Ivf journey but welcome to all the ladies I've not met before. 

I'm posting cos I am terrified cos my af is due on Sunday which means Ivf boot camp starts!!! :(( I'm dreading it not the actual cycle but all the drugs, hormones and then the 2ww if we get that far!

Hi to all you lovely ladies and hopefully I will be joining the pregnant ladies very soon!!


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## bubumaci

MrsE - I totally get your fear! But it also sounds like a really really good plan and you must try to think and feel positively. Positive affirmations, positively accepting the drugs and hormones into your body, that they are doing their job, bringing you closer and closer to your little miracle. Imagine your body softening, them flowing to your ovaries.
I am a needle-a-phobe! I hate needles and injections, so for the past years having to go through this treatment has been a nightmare for me (on top of all the emotional, physical, financial effects). For this try, I used one of the natal hypnotherapy MP3s which is especially for IVF. It really helped put me in a good place mentally. I wouldn't go as far as saying it made all the difference - but who knows, maybe it did.
So please try to look forward to it (as difficult as that may seem) and all my fingers and toes (and those of Pünktchen) will be crossed for you :kiss:


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## Plex

:hi: everyone, Not sure where i belong at the moment :( 

Ive had 3 Ivfs all pretty dismal, all have their positives and negatives. This current cycle #3 was a zero fert but i am hopefully going to have the chance of transfer with our only :cold: today???? I'll find out later this morning if lil one survived the thaw and i go in or not. Not sure or full of optimism on that front though, so technically im in limbo.

Ive not read through this thread yet (am going to) 

Its hard to get excited over treatment anymore, dont know how we all keep going with it all :nope: I suppose we just do cos we have faith in our minds and hearts that this will one day work no matter what :D

Thank you for this thread, i think its going to be a massive support and its what i need at the moment :hugs: xx


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## Sandy83

Good luck Plex got everything crossed for you :hugs:

MrsE, Us IVF ladies are strong and you will get through this and hopefully this is your cycle! :hugs: 

wtbmom & Captain :hi: sounds like the ladies have gave you some good advice so far and will look forward to seeing how your journeys go :hugs:

Dovkav, Bubumaci & bugs hope you and bumps are all doing well :hugs: Can't be long till our first arrivial on this thread :happydance:

AQ, Hope your doing well not long till appointment :happydance:

Sorry if I've missed anyone

AFM, Just over 4 weeks till WTF appointment will be nice to get a plan sorted for end of the year. Got some amazing news yesterday DH is in full remission from the cancer so no radiotherapy needed and transplant is going ahead beginning of Sept. It's the best possible outcome means DH could be cancer free after transplant for the rest of his life :wohoo: Obviously still a long way to go but got to think positive!


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## Plex

Sandy - Thanks hun! :hugs: Awesome news about ur hubby!!! :happydance: Such a huge milestone, i bet the relief is out of this world to hear that - not outta the woods completely yet but still, awesome!! x

What does WTF mean? Ive had failed cycle consultations (great names for these things eh?! - can never bring myself to stand in reception straight after a negative to book it in front of strangers let alone utter what appointment i need :( ) is it the same as that or is it a way forward type meeting, like what to do next? xx


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## bubumaci

Hi Plex :howdy: So sorry that you have had to make your way here - but this is a fantastic, supportive group of girls!!
I think the reason we keep going and don't give up, is because we believe it will happen and can't give up! Fingers crossed, that your :cold: has survived the thaw and is looking to snuggle into your uterus today :) :dust::dust::dust:

SANDY - I am over the moon about your good news!! That is just so fantastic, I am so happy! Couldn't have heard better news today!! (DH just rang to tell me that my Father in Law had a mild stroke last night and is in hospital - so I'll be popping in to see him later).


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## Sandy83

Plex, WTF means what the F**K appointment just an appointment to find out what went wrong at the last cycle! What time are you expecting a call to see how your :cold: have got on and also how many have you got to thaw?

Thanks Ladies it's been amazing news and a great way to start our holiday on Saturday :happydance:

Bubumaci, Hope your FIL is ok thinking about you and DH :hugs: xx


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## Plex

Bub - Thanks hun! I already feel very welcome - so glad ive joined u all - just wish it was under better circumstances. 

Congratulations on reaching V-week by the way! :) Such a long journey for u to get to where u are - u deserve it - bet it took awhile to sink in it was actually happening? xx


Sandy - Are you off anywhere nice for ur hols? Hope u have a great time :hugs:

I only have 1 frostie from my january cycle - it was one of 2 that fertilized (3 eggs total). Im just so incredibly lucky it made it to freeze let alone if it thaws properly today :) As with everything, the 'call time' was extremely vague :grr: I hate, HATE waiting!!! Very annoying. 

WTF - :haha: I think I prefer that to failed cycle consultation for sure! (note to self....must be careful not to say it out loud when asking for mine or when speaking to my consultant - Although im sure after this cycle she'd be the one to say it first :haha:) xx


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## Sandy83

We are just going to a cottage in the Lake district for a week, looking forward to plenty of R&R :happydance:

Well I've got everything crossed for you that this frostie is a tough one and will be snug and warm very soon :hugs: Make sure you keep us updated i feel like the good news is on a roll at the moment! xx


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## Plex

Im not too optimistic unfortunately but I have some hope (the bugger that it is) and thats enough :) Im going to go and obsessively clean my house now - that may pass a few minutes :haha: 

A cottage in the Lakes sounds bliss :cloud9: - enjoy!! xx


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## bubumaci

Thanks Plex - yes - it is still surreal sometimes, after such a long and tough journey!

So you have to actually be at the clinic to request your WTF appointment? I was always just able to ring and make appointments...
All fingers and toes crossed that your :cold: is nicely thawed and ready to be snug as a bug in a rug :)


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## dovkav123

captainj1
Dovkav do you mind me asking how much natural cycle IVF costs in Germany? I paid £3k for this cycle but my consultant said he will give me a refund so at least that is something. He has already had over £20k of my money so at least that's something.
take care ladies
x[/QUOTE said:

> I have done my IVFs in two clinics.
> First clinic charged 450 euro for a complete cycle. Ultrasounds, HCG shot, progesterone is extra. If your egg was not retrieved, fertilised the price is lower. We didn't get pregnant with 2 perfect embryos. I didn't feel confident on ET. I felt they didn't pay much attention in importance of this step. Very short u/s use, didn't see catheter or a bubble on U/S. In the other clinic I foud out that my uterus is antiflexed, it's was a little tricky for transfer.
> 
> The other clinic charges 1000-1200 euro for a complete IVF cycle, if your egg didn't fertilise it costs 600 euro. U/S included. I had only one u/s per cycle. I was lucky that my body worked in the schedule. Ussually u/s on CD8 and retrieval on CD11.
> My dr.was super nice. She made all, my every single wish come true. My hubby even hold my hand during an egg retrieval. I didn't use any painkillers. To tell you the truth, I have suffered more with a menstrual cramping that with this procedure.
> 
> 
> This thread is so amazing, so emotional amd so rewarding. I am so fortunate to meet you all, receive and give support. I couldn't make it with all your help.
> I wish you all tons of pregnancy vibres and I hope and pray you'll join us very very soon.


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## captainj1

Thanks Dovkav, that's very helpful to know. One more question if you don't mind! on your first cycle, when there was no egg, did you have follicles? or no follicles?

x


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## Peachy1584

Sandy Yay so happy for you!!

Plex I was just getting caught up and am praying for your lo to make it through the thaw!

MrsE I am nervous about your bootcamp! : ). I can't wait to hear how it goes. I hear about this stuff but never actually talk to anyone who has done it!

Bubu so sorry for your bad news I hope he's alright :hugs:

Dovkav so glad things are moving along smoothly for you !

Captain I truly wish you the best of luck :hugs:

I know I missed things and am sorry. I should write down what I want to say to who before I press reply because after that it seems like brain flies away : )


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## AnnetteCali

Hello Ladies...

Mind if i join you?!  I am in the process of preparing for a FET ... scheduled for Aug 15th. Time couldn't go slower!! Good thing I have my LO to keep me busy. 

I take my last BC pill on Friday and start Lupron on saturday...!! Praying my embryos thaw out properly!

Sending baby dust to all! xoox


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## Plex

:hi: well im officially PUPO!!! :happydance: I go into the hospital for my first beta next friday - my lil blast thawed really well - im so bloody chuffed! Its so bitter sweet though :( I cant help but be upset by my eggs that never even got off the starting block. 

I had a thought last night that im carrying a very expensive cargo! Lets hope this tough little cookie sticks [-o&lt

:flower: xx


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## MrsE75

Sandy - I'm am sooooooooo happpppppyyyyyyy for you and DH that's such amazing and lovely news to hear after everything. Have a fab rest and get ready for sept/out it will be here in no time xxx

Plex welcome and great your frostie thawed and congrats on being pupo!!! Hopefully I will be joining you soon!

Welcome to the other ladies sadly I'm on my miny do can't scroll back to get names but I'm wishing you all the best of luck. This thread is a great source of hope and prayers so long may it continue. 

Well I'm in touch with a girl who is currently cycling at my new clinic and they've had celebs in having a transfer this week. I can't name them because let's face it none of us would want the paps to know we were going through this difficult journey but be interesting to see if an announcement is made in 3 mths!! Then I can tell you. Let's just say the guy is English, on TV and had been in a couple of movies and gets into trouble for his bad language and has been well know for drink and drug issues and was married to popstar. They have been dating for less than a year and she already has children and is older than him. 

Well I'm just waiting for my lovely af to show up. I'm all packed and ready to shoot down there when I need to. Will try and keep you posted! Xxx


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## bubumaci

Plex - congratulations on being PUPO! That's great that your little :cold: thawed so well!! So exciting :happydance:

MrsE - that would be interesting to see if there is an announcement in a few months! I am so excited for you - I really have a good feeling about this IVF-Bootcamp! You must let us know how things go there! :kiss:


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## dovkav123

captainj1 said:


> Thanks Dovkav, that's very helpful to know. One more question if you don't mind! on your first cycle, when there was no egg, did you have follicles? or no follicles?
> 
> x

Yes, Capatain, I had one 14-15mm follicle in the morning and we triggered that night. It was too early. I am sure it wasn't mature enough and it didn't make it.

Annetecali, Welcome. Praying and hoping for your lucky FET!

Sandy, I am over the moon! I am so happy that your hubby is healing wonderful!

Peachy, how is your U/S? Praying for you!


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## dovkav123

Plex! 
YAY! Great news! Sending you Tons of love and patients!


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## MrsE75

Bub - will do and I too have a feeling that everything is going to work out this time. Pray to god I'm not wrong! 

Baby dust to everyone xxx


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## Peachy1584

Plex yay!! So happy for you !

Dovkav things went well. At 6 weeks baby measured 5 weeks 6days but she said that's normal and heartbeat was 103. That seemed low to me but she said it was good. I don't think they're ever negative really and I am still scared : ). Is your little bump continuing to grow?


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## bubumaci

Peachy - that really is fine!! Sometimes at 6w, some ladies don't even get the heartbeat measurement. Pünktchen was 118 at 6w2d - 103 is perfect, it will go up and up and up, you really were right at the beginning. Some days you will measure over and some days under, that is perfectly normal :) Do you have a piccie for us? :kiss:


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## Plex

I think every hurdle is a worry :hugs: do u have another u/s scheduled Peachy? xx


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## Plex

I have a question, We had a discussion with our embryologist - brief talk admittedly, but they mentioned that we may have either a compatibility issue between sperm and egg or that they didnt fertilize as they would not form 'normal' embryos. 

Ive been thinking alot about PGD and looking at our clinic, they dont offer this :( Well, i cant see it on the price list or treatment list. I was wondering how much it costs generally?? Im in the uk so have been thinking it costs around an extra £1500 but not sure??

Also did your doctors suggest any tests etc for ur hubbies apart from spem tests? I think my hub has had hiv aswell but thats about it.

Im hopeful this frozen beauty sticks but, knowing my luck recently it wont :( I just need to price up our next cycle and possibly look at other clinics. I dont like thinking this way but i like to be prepared - i want to cycle again asap so am doing my homework now :dohh: not the happiest thing to do in your tww :nope: but gotta be done 

thanks for reading and any help you can give :flower: xx


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## dovkav123

Plex, In my experience we had 2 that eggs didn't fertilise. I was told on phone "they didn't fertilise". I asked if the sperm is still motile, they said "yes", Ok than let's wait for another night....and they agreed. It was a waste of time....
In the protocol I saw the words 3 pronucleous. It means they fertilise but not corectly. Perfect embryo should have 4 pronucleuos. Embryo with 3 cells has a 3 sets of chromosomes. It can not result in a live baby.
Please get all your resords from your clinic, your hubby's sperm results and embryo evaluation protocol.
How many cells had your frozen one? What grade was it?
You donated some eggs. Can you find out about their fate?

Reasons for a 3 pronuclei embryo:
1. maternal age
2. decrease in estradiol before HCG shot
3. egg maturity
4. high concentration of motile and normal morfology sperm in the medium
5. eggs were incubated in suboptimal conditions.

Egg allows to penetrate it only by one sperm. It has special mechanisms for that. If an egg is not healthy, few sperms may go in.
Is that amazing! Everything is set so perfect in human body.

My hubby was tested HIV, hepatitis B and hepatitis C.
My wishes were to test his heavy metals in his urine (he has mercury fillings in his teeth) and sperm dna fragmentation.

Plex, you did everything in your powers. You deserve to rest. Take this moment and do special things with your hubby.
Imagine that your little one is snuggling in, warm and cozy in your womb. He is a little fighter, he went through a lot and he made it. I am sure he'll grow into strong little penut. Hope and pray.


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## Plex

:hugs: thank you so much Dovkav xx I dont like to think negatively but this is all such a long process with so many let downs that i cant help it :( 

Surprisingly im quite relaxed about everything, AND I havent tested yet!!!! Thats a biggie for me lol Im planning on getting on with things and trying not to think about possible failure too much. 

I do know that i had progesterone, fsh,lutenising hormone and oestradol check before collection and my consultant said it all looked perfect, so thats one thing i suppose :shrug: I am beginning to think that maybe we do have a compatibility issue and only very rarely do we both produce sperm or eggs that 'work' with each other. 

I cant help feeling more and more that our lb is an absolute miracle, we are so very blessed :) It took us 4.5yr with help to get him - hes my main distraction as if i didnt have him i think i wouldnt be coping at all - everyone who is trying so hard for their first deserves their babies so much and its horrible when it doesnt happen :hugs: xxx


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## africaqueen

Hi ladies, sorry been MIA. 
Not coping well tbh. I have gone from quite positive and excited to utterly TERRIFIED of another BFN... I just honestly don't know how il cope with another fail after all iv been thru these past 4yrs. I have no choice as its the only way i have of becoming a mum but the thought of this cycle not working is soul destroying. I really miss my mum such a lot these past few weeks too(even more than usual as i obviously miss her every day anyway) i am desperate to have that mother/child bond and i am scared it may never happen. It has been hard with a few of our friends having babies this week too. Will i always be a 'outsider' looking in at a life i can only dream of?? :( sorry for negativity. Just not feeling great.
Anyway, onto everyone else...

Captain- I am so sorry your cycle failed again. I cannot imagine the heartache you are feeling. We are all here for you x

Plex- Welcome and good luck with the 2ww! lots of baby sticky vibes coming your way x

Sandy- AMAZING news about dh!! made up for you both! what a relief. I hope your WTF appt gives you a good plan to move forward x

Annettecali- Welcome an GL x

MrsE- Hope things with you are well? can't think who the celeb could be! inbox me! ha. Has IVF bootcamp started yet?? x

Bubu- Hope all is going well for you? x

Bugs- How are things? x

Unlucky- How are u doing? x

Hi to Dov, Peachy, and all the gang. Sorry if iv missed anyone out xxx


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## bubumaci

Hey Sarah!!!
I so get how you are feeling! And am also sending you huge hugs (I know that feeling, missing Mama)... And don't apologise for how you are feeling, it is so natural and it is better to get it out there, than to have it eat you up from inside.
I would really recommend some hypnotherapy to help you get through the IVF - if you are interested, I will post the link to the site where I downloaded the tracks. Really helped put me in a good place, a more relaxed and accepting place ... :kiss:

I am doing OK, thank you. Felt a bit off last night, stomach (organ) felt weird and I think I had some Braxton Hicks (the first ones I have felt - uterus contracts and practices from week 7, but you don't feel it that early) - some upper end of tummy, some lower end. What unnerved me, was that I have been feeling pelvic pressure for a couple of days and then combined with that (and it felt like it was more than only 1-2 in an hour) worried me a bit. Tomorrow morning I have my Oral Glucose Tolerance Test and I had already rung yesterday and asked to have an u/s to check my cervical length (since my prenatal this month is at the birthing house and the midwives don't check that sort of thing) - so she'll be checking cervix + length. That is comforting. Not so nice is the fasting from 8pm tonight (am sipping water, it is just too warm to not drink anything) until drinking the sweet concoction tomorrow morning at the doctor's ... Then Thursday is my next check-up.

On August 6th - my birthday - my Daddy will be here from England (flying in on the 5th and leaving on the 7th) I have organised a surprise for him and my parents-in-law. We are going to have 3D/4D session (which they know nothing about) so they are going to get to see their grandchild in utero. I am really excited about it, I hope to get some really nice pictures of Pünktchen and they film the whole thing, so also some moving pictures <3 ...
Oh - and baby furniture is being delivered next week, so we can put it together and have that behind us :)

:wave: to everyone and :hugs:


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## africaqueen

Ooh all sounds very exciting Andrea! what a lovely surprise for your Dad and inlaws! you will have to post a pic for us to see from the scan :) Bet you miss your dad. I don't think id cope without my dad being so close. He really is my rock cos as much as i obviously love my hubby he does not do well with emotional stuff.

Yes, please send the link for the hypno! anything is worth a try and i want to be as calm as poss before this cycle starts. Easier said than done! lol. How you coped with all those cycles is amazing! i think this cycle will be the last for us regardless of outcome as i can't take the emotional aspect of all this for a 5th time! hoping its 4th time lucky for us xxx


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## bugs

AQ I'm sorry your feeling stressed, what I would say is as your using the same clinic make sure you have a totally new protocol. I found that with care they just kept increasing stimms and with just pure menopur which did nothing but fry my eggs. Seeing as it's maybe your last attempt would you not consider donor eggs. I honestly think I would never have got pregnant with my own. I know it's a big decision to make but the end result is what matters. I really wish you every success we've been treading these boards a long time now. 

Sorry for no other personals I'm on holiday on my phone at the moment. We're home tonight and I have my 20 week scan tomorrow so I'm very nervous and very excited all at the same time xxx


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## bubumaci

Here is the link, Sarah : https://www.natalhypnotherapy.co.uk
Actually, I only used it for the last try (so the one that brought me my BFP ;) ). I found it very relaxing, helped me to have an even more positive mental attitude. I used the one for IVF until the day we saw the heartbeat and since then, I have been using the Pregnancy Relaxation tracks. From 32w onwards, I will then use the hypnobirthing tracks.

Yes, I do find it hard - have always found it hard, since the separation of my parents. They divorced in 1988, when I was 13 and then my Father re-married in 1989, less than a year together with the new woman. My Mother was living in Germany at the time, my Father in England. (I had been in a boarding school since 11)... One year after they married, it was decided, that it would be better for me to be with my Mother - so I moved to Germany at 15. ... I was always Daddy's girl, so the distance and not seeing each other much was tough.
Anyway, for all my adult life, I have not lived in the same country even as my parents! (well, apart from University - I went to Bath and Daddy was in England, but not that close) ... when I moved back to Munich, my Mother was living in Budapest, Hungary and my Father in the UK. So I have no family here - just the one I married into.

I really hope you do decide to get the IVF tracks. You start listening to them when you start the meds. Really make sure you get that half hour to yourself, turn phones and any other disturbances off, and let yourself "fall". I actually found that after a few sessions, I either fell asleep to it / the hypnosis is deep and it feels like waking up from a sleep. But that is fine, the subconscious is still lapping it up and it means that you are really relaxed, which is what you want to achieve :) :hugs:


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## MrsE75

AQ I'm so sorry to hear you are struggling but it happens to is all so completely natural and you will come out the other side before you do a cycle. 

Yes Ivf Bootcamp has started on Monday! So far I've been in everyday for bloods and got my 2nd scan tomorrow. Had a hysteroacopy this morning for them to check I had not fibroids or cysts and they clean out your uterus and make sure there is nothing hostile in there and do a scratch to help implantation. I was told by the last consultant that I had a deep v uterus slightly bicornia but they said today that is was normal size and nothing unusual. 

So keep you posted. Back in tomorrow for blood test and scan so far so good. Xx

Good luck for the scans ladies and seeing your babas! Xx


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## bubumaci

Ooooh - MrsE - sounds exciting!
I had the scratch done the last 4 times ... I think it is good that they have done it - our doctor had also had positive results with doing the scratch! :kiss:


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## africaqueen

Clare- Good luck with your scan and let us know how it goes. This is our last cycle using my own eggs. We are going for mild IVF this time around as a last resort. If this fails we will be saving for DE cycle x

Andrea- Thank you for the link! i shall check it out tomorrow ;) anything worth a try! x

MrsE- All sounds very hopeful! so far so good eh. Good luck x

Hi to all the gang x

AFM- Still feeling unbalanced(lol) but not the state i got in yesterday as no matter what, we cant make this work can we? we have to hope and pray it does but its down to nature really xxx


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## MrsE75

AQ I don't know if this helps you but something an Ivf friend said to me. Pregnancy is not going to happen for me naturally so Ivf is a chance that we don't get in a normal month. I'm trying not to see it as the be all and end all it's a chance not the only one though!

Hope that helps put it in perspective for you. If you don't do it your chances of being a mummy is further away. Ivf is a step nearer simple as that. Xxxx

Done my bloods and scan today so waiting for my phone call to find out what mix of drugs I need to take today! X


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## Plex

:hi: again girls - hope u are all well?

Im now 8dp5dt and getting all :bfn: why is this process so soul destroying???? 

beta 2moro am but im not optimistic AT ALL. Makes me wonder why i bother my arse :nope: Im with you africa, im bloody terrified of another cycle and all the heartache that comes with it :cry: We will be about bankrupting ourselves for this last cycle if/when we need it. I think after that we'll give up and pursue adoption. Well, we'll have no choice in the matter. I want another child and at this point dont care how that comes about. Ideally a biological child but I think I have more than enough love to cover a forever baby that someone else bravely wants a better life for :) 

I hate injections, i hate the scans, i hate the false hope and false symptoms. In fact my excitement about ivf has dulled to such a level that if i dont detest it soon I'll be very surprised.

Sorry im feeling very insular today and not doing any personals, event though i want to, im just sat here crying and am no use to anyone :cry: 

When ive had my results 2moro and have had time to process it all, ill be back with full force and chatting away like a good un :)

sending :hugs: to you all xx


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## captainj1

hi Plex, hope you are OK (but know you're not) - so many of us on this thread can totally empathise with how you are feeling. I am in a similar position to you with one child already. I just had my 6th cycle fail, didn't get any eggs (it was a natural cycle but I had two big follicles). My consultant has concluded we should not continue as there were very few granulosa cells in my follicular fluid, which implies a problem with egg maturation. He told me he thinks we maybe have a 10% chance of IVF working, and a similar chance of natural conception working. So we shouldn't waste our money and have all the crap that goes with ivf when it won't increase our chances.

I am incredibly disappointed but your comments about detesting IVF really resonated. That first cycle of mine went so well, textbook response, 2 perfect blasts transferred, 5 to freeze...it has all gone downhill since then. Whilst I'm crying lots and very sad, a little part of me is very relieved I will not be putting myself through this again. I have let this distract me for too long. I have to look forward and enjoy my son and my life. And enjoy sex again, with no agenda - who knows, we might get a miracle. But if not, we have to be amazed by the one we have already - who is more miraculous than ever given what I know now.

I have to say, amongst the slog of it I had kind of lost sight of why we were doing it. I would love my son to have a sibling, don't get me wrong. But by the end, was it that I didn't want to fail? competitiveness? stubbornness? I don't know. I have given all my spare time and energy to this over the last 2 years and that should have gone on my son. I resent IVF for giving me false hope and taking that time away at such a precious phase of my son's life.

Chin up honey. Nobody can tell you when your IVF journey is done - only you can decide. If your consultant thinks there is hope, then there is hope. Stay strong, your son needs his mum and his cuddles can work wonders for you too. xxxx


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## dovkav123

Plex, :hugs:. I hope your test is wrong, I got positive 14 dpo. You have one day or two, right?

MrsE75, sending you lots of baby dust to your cycle this month!

Bugs, good luck on your scan. Hope and pray all goes well. Thinking about you!


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## faithful96

Hello ladies,

I have been off the boards, well, I guess forever, because honestly I just don't feel I fit in anywhere. I've done 8 fresh IVFS. We have a ton of issues. It's always on-going.

How wonderful of you to start this group. I am going to play catchup and read back a few dozen pages. 

All the best,
T


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## MrsE75

Plex so sorry to hear you are not feeling great we have all been there so we do understand. I think it always looks so bleak just after a cycle and you swear you won't do it again and wonder why it's not working. As someone said to me at the moment Ivf is not an exact science because humans are all different. I remember 18 mths ago I said we couldn't afford another go and here I am at Bootcamp! It will start to hurt less over time just be kind to yourself xxx

Welcome Faithful to this lovely bunch of ladies hopefully we can help you too xx

Afm - well yesterday I got out on clomid for 5 days to up my estrogen and Viagra (yes that's correct!) to increase the blood flow to my uterus. Never thought I would be taking that let me tell you! Also the embryologist called my hubby they want him to do a sample on Monday and they will freeze any good ones so on EC day he does another sample and they use the best of both batches basically. Which is novel and something I'd not heard of before but they really are leaving nothing to chance I guess which is what I'm paying for! So had bloods done today and waiting for my call this afternoon to find out today's lucky drug mix! It changes pretty much everyday depends on my blood results from each morning so this is super tailored I'm hoping and praying! Xx


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## bubumaci

Plex - fingers are crossed, that your tests are just not sensitive enough and that the bloods will tell us something different!!! :dust::dust::dust:

Faithful - :howdy: - I am sorry, that you have had to make your way here!! But as MrsE says - you couldn't have found a better, more supportive place to be!!!

MrsE - it all sounds really wonderful! And it is fantastic that they are being so thorough! Really really valuable and they are also making you feel more confident, I hope? :hugs::dust::dust::dust:


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## bugs

Plex good luck today hope your beta gives you good news. 

MrsE, sounds like you've got everything in order. That's what I liked about Serum there was no stone unturned even though my OH's SA had never been a cause for concern he was put on a strong course of antibiotics which gave him super sperm and I was on a multitude of meds so it really helps to throw everything at it xxx

Hi to everyone else xx

AFM - back from holiday now although with the nice weather here I'm not really missing out except for going to work. I had our 20 week scan yesterday and we are waiting for little ones b'day to know the sex. Apart from that everything looks great so I am slowly coming to terms with the fact that there will be a baby at the end of this nightmare journey xxxx


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## Plex

Hi all - Thank you sooooo much for the lovely thoughts, support and kind words. They have not been missed on me i assure you :hugs: 

Well I had my email through this morning and the result is negative. As id thought really. Bit bummed out but nothing i can do about it eh? Im just thinking forward at the moment which is helping as im not upset or crying. I have my closure on this cycle, its time for me to move on. 

We will do another cycle as soon as we are able. Had to laugh earlier as i thought, well at least i now get to say - can i book my WTF appointment lol I feel like i will say it as that too :haha: 

Hope you lovely ladies are all ok? xx


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## Sandy83

Morning Ladies:hi:

Hope everyone is well.

Plex,I'm so so sorry the hear about your results but sounds like you have the right attitude for going forward :hugs: thoughts are with you and DH

Bugs, great news on 20 week scan half way there! :happydance:

MrsE, How you doing do you know when ET will be? Sorry if you have already mentioned this 

Faithful :hi: Welcome, definitely a lot of supportive ladies on this thread. Look forward to hearing about your future plans :hugs: 

Bubumaci & Dovkav, How are you getting on? :hugs:

Captain & AQ, How are yo doing? :hugs:

Sorry if I've missed anyone xx


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## bubumaci

Plex :hugs: ... so, so sorry! But I do love your attitude - you go and book your WTF appointment :) :kiss:

Hi Sandy :wave: How are you and DH doing?
I am OK, thank you. Started my last week in the 2nd trimester yesterday - which is just so unbelievably surreal!
Last week I had my OGTT (oral glucose tolerance test) and on Friday my doctor rang with the results - which were unfortunately slightly elevated. So I have made an appointment at another clinic (that also deals with gestational diabetes) - they said that my numbers really are only slightly up - but that weeks 28-32 there is another hormone change that can affect how sugar is processed. I will be getting a monitor to test my sugar levels with and to begin with, we are going to see whether or not it can be controlled with my diet (although to be honest, I don't eat much with sugars - only thing that I would be able to reduce, are the carbs through pasta) and I am very interested to hear what they have to say / suggest. At the moment, I really am borderline and Baby P.'s growth is spot in (middle percentile), so they are happy with that. Worst case scenario is that we can't control it with my diet and I have to inject insulin for the rest of the pregnancy - but we shall see what they have to say.

Attached, yesterday's weekly bump picture :) :kiss:
 



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## Sandy83

great pic, sorry to hear you have that extra bit of worry but sounds like everything is under control and will be fine. Keep us updated. :hugs:

AFM, we are doing good had an amazing week away lots of rest and relaxation just what we needed xx


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## dovkav123

Plex, don't give up! I know you'll get what your heart desire.
MrsE75,:thumbup: for Viagra! That's is new in fertility world. I hope that's all you need for BFP.

Thanks Sandy, I am doing great.
I am very happy! I finally made a decision. 
I am a team yellow and I decided 100% just few days ago.
I saw newborn outfits, they are so cute for boys and girls. I could take home 5 of them. I am not buying any baby stuff yet. 
I will look even more forward for a grand finale in December. It will be a suprise for us and the whole world!
20 weeks scan wil be in a couple of weeks. Hope and pray everything is oK. My heart tells me so...We havn't seen our peanut since week 8. It won't be a peanut anymore! 
I have gained 4 kg in 4 month. I feel fat, I feel pregnant, I wake up at night when I turn to the other side. 
Also I feel flutters and waves I have a hard time to tell which one is the baby which one is my bowel.


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## bubumaci

That is exciting, that you are staying team :yellow: !!
I would have, but DH wanted to know. And it is somehow nice knowing, I must say :)

Looking forward to your 20wk scan! And nope, definitely won't be a peanut any more :) It is an exciting time, when you will begin feeling the movements more and more :) <3

AFM:
Went to the diabetes consultant this afternoon and she said that my numbers were really really borderline. I have been given a little machine to test my blood sugar levels with (mornings on an empty stomach and then 1-2 hours after each meal) and I have to keep a journal and monitor for one week. Next appointment Monday next week to look at the results. If I see anything too high, then I need to call beforehand. We tested my blood sugar when I was there (which was 1,5 hours after lunch) and the numbers were perfect. She also said that as far as my diet was concerned, I was OK, so there was nothing she could recommend there. From the 28th week, there is another surge in hormones, so it will be important to keep monitoring, as to whether or not I will have to balance it out with insulin shots ... but for the time being I feel confident that we will be OK and just monitoring for now.


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## MrsE75

Hi ladies

Looks like all those that are pregnant are doing ok although diabetes is a pain I'm sure. 

Afm - well another TV celeb came into the clinic yesterday I'm guessing for baby number 2 cos they had a little boy with them. 
Well Monday I ended up having to have Intralipids for my immune/killer cells which was a bit scary but not as bad as I thought it would be. 

I'm nearly cooked I have 3 large follies nearly 21,19 and nearly 16 plus a few smaller ones. So I'm going for a 2nd blood test and 2 nd scan today and think trigger will be tonight. Pray to god I've got some good eggs in there - say your prayers cos I'm going to need them. I was hoping to have more follies but guess as I dont produce many eggs it's not a surprise! So think collection will be Friday. They have already said we are doing ICSI plus I will have day 2 or 3 transfer because they feel embryos are better back with me than in a more clinical environment. They have better success with day2/3 than blasts in most cases. 

Keep you posted I'm now getting very nervous and scared!


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## dovkav123

Hoping and praying for the best outcome this time. You so deserve it!


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## bubumaci

Oh MrsE - I am so excited for you. They really sound like they are on top of it. And it is not important to have many follies - it is important to have a couple of good, mature eggs. Perhaps that is what they have been going for with their dosage and it all sounds very promising! :hugs2:
All fingers and toes crossed that your trigger goes well and of course everything else. Sending you lots and lots and lots of :dust::dust::dust: :kiss:


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## MrsE75

Hi ladies. Just to update you I had my collection this morning and we got 4 eggs so in happy with that. Now got to wait for my dreaded call tomorrow! Fingers crossed xx


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## bubumaci

:hugs: that is great!! Can't wait to hear the fertilisation results tomorrow! Everything is crossed for you, Sweetie! :dust::dust::dust:
How are you feeling?


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## MrsE75

Hi Bub I'm feeling ok usual bloated and sore after collection but should be fine tomorrow. 

Just got to keep everything crossed now for a good fertilisation report tomorrow. 

Let you know how I'm getting on. 
X


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## Peachy1584

MrsE so excited for you and praying everything continues to go well!!

Bubu love your bump pics. What a great way to remember things as time goes so fast and memories fade.

Plex I hope you are feeling better. I know how hard it is but time seemed to bring back my hope every time :hugs:


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## Sandy83

MrsE, got my fx'd for you. Keep us updated xx


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## dovkav123

Peachy, cute u/s photo. Congrats! Praying and hoping for a sticky one!
Thinking about you too, MrsE75


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## africaqueen

Hi ladies :)

Bugs- Fab news on 20wk scan and i think you have some wilpower to stay team lemon! i would love to do that but know for sure il just have to know when the time comes! ha x

Plex- I am sorry this cycle didn't work. Maybe if you cycle Sep/Oct we will be cycle buddies ;) x

Sandy- I am doing much better thank you. How are you and hubby?? x

Bubu- Love the bump pic! what a lovey idea to chart it like that :) very glad all is ok with your blood sugar levels too. One less worry so you can enjoy your pregnancy x

Dov- Loving all your pregnancy symptoms! well done for staying team yellow. Some strong wilpower there! i would find out the sex an turn into a shopaholic after the 20wk scan! haha x

MrsE- How was your fert report?? thinking of you loads an hope an pray it was what you hoped. Please update asap x

Faithful- Welcome to our lil community. I am sorry you have endured 8 cycles. Cannot imagine. You are obviously very strong. I hope your journey comes to a happy ending soon x

Hi to unlucky, and all the gang. Sorry if i have forgot some of you on personals. Bit tired this week as worked all weekend on early shift and im lying in bed as i type! lol x

AFM- Well ladies, its 9 days until our consultation to get the ball rolling again! cannot believe i can now say that we start our 4th cycle next mth! feels like such a long time since i started this thread and have been patiently waiting to join you all in IVF chat :) just hope an pray this cycle works. Getting very excited and hoping that my huge weight loss since the last cycle makes the diff (iv lost 4 stone since last cycle) i have also become a lot more active with using my exercise bike daily, walking lots and doing weights an press ups etc. My diet has always involved lots of fresh fruit, veg, lean meat etc so im fine on that score. Started taking my supplements again last mth. I take folic acid, vitamin b6, b12, zinc, selenium, high dose vitamin E and L arginine. I took DHEA last cycle and had the poorest quality eggs yet, so dropped that, although i do think being on max dose of stimms 'fried' my already struggling eggies, hence the reason i will be going for a much lower dose this time around. Defo quality over quantity! xxx


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## Sandy83

MrsE, Did you get the call about your fertilisation? Thinking of you and fx'd xx


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## bubumaci

Awww - thank you Sarah...
Morning Ladies ... 27w0d!!! (Third trimester, here we come) <3
Last week was quite exciting, with our furniture arriving and getting put together on Thursday (I have taken pictures, but I need to do a bit of decorating before I feel happy) :)
And with today, we start our 28th week and have made it to the third trimester. I simply cannot believe how quickly this is speeding by ... Tomorrow, Daddy arrives from England and on Wednesday (my birthday), I am surprising him and my parents-in-law with a 3D/4D u/s photo shooting session. I imagine they will be blown away, since they didn't even have ultrasound, when I was born! So excited to see Baby P. in 3D!!!
In an hour, I am off to the diabetician so we can discuss how to proceed. Over the past week my numbers have remained below the upper limit she gave me - no doubt we will need to continue monitoring and I am curious as to what she has to say ...
Wishing you all a lovely week :)
 



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## bubumaci

MrsE ... do you have any news for us? :kiss:


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## Sandy83

Bubmaci, good luck for your appt today :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Brief update, I am going to start injecting a low dose of insulin at bedtime. My numbers post-eating are always OK, but the morning number we want to push down .. and since another hormone surge is going to come these coming weeks, it won't get better (nor my hunger pangs *lol*). But I am OK with that. The needle is such a mini thing compared to the ones I had to use for the treatment :D


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## Sandy83

Sounds like they have this under control Bubumaci and are doing the right thing going forward :hugs: xx


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## africaqueen

Happy 27wks Andrea! glad they have a plan for you to stop the blood sugar getting any worse and as you said, we are a dab hand at needles! lol x

MrsE- Really hoping the reason you have not posted is due to no internet connection or just being too busy and nothing else... either way, plz let us know. We are all here for eachother. Inbox me if need be. We go back a long time x


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## Unlucky41

Hi MrsE75 -I hope your 4 eggs are doing great!! Sorry missed out on so much !!! Please let us know

AQ I am so glad you have started your 4th cycle - I really hope you get some great news this time - praying that this cycle is the one for you and your husband !!!

Bub welcome to the 3rd trimester !! So happy for you :happydance: 

Sandy how are you going? It is so good that your husband has been doing well !! 

Plex have you had your WTF meeting yet? 

AFM I am currently on my maternity leave only 3 weeks and 5 days to go. I am feeling really excited and scare all together!


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## bubumaci

Oooh - Jo - how exciting! I totally get you feeling both emotions - a lot going to change in such a short time! :) How are you feeling otherwise?

MrsE - I really hope everything is OK! If Friday was ER and you are meant to be having a 2-3 day transfer, you should be PUPO ... All fingers and toes crossed for you Sweetie! Please let us know how you are doing. Thinking of you!! :kiss:


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## MrsE75

Hi ladies sorry I've been offline. The cycle ended in disaster. The 4 eggs were all immature so it's over for me. They have told me that I should consider other options cos my eggs are the issue. I'm completely heartbroken and crushed at the moment so sorry for the lack of personals. 

I don't even know where to start to process the fact I won't have my biological child and why life is so unfair. I feel like I'm being punished but I don't know what for. My husband said he's the saddest he's ever been in his life which just kills me inside cos I know it my body that's failed us. 

Xx


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## bubumaci

Oh Honey, I am so so so desperately sorry for you :( ... I just burst into tears :( Sending you huge hugs - I have no words except to tell you that I am sending you virtual hugs and comfort :(


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## bugs

MrsE I'm really sorry that the cycle didn't go as planned, there's nothing worse when you put your heart & soul and not to mention finances into something to not even have anything to put back. 

I don't know how you feel about donor eggs and believe me at 32 I didn't think it would be the way I'd go but after 8 cycles and close to £40,000 I couldn't bury my head any more my eggs were the issue and no meds or tweaks of treatment were going to change that. I was really worried at first but every scan I have and each movement I feel is from my baby and I couldn't love it any more. 

So what I'm saying is take time to come to terms with things but know there is other options for you xxxx


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## Peachy1584

MrsE my heart breaks for you. There is nothing harder in this world and after you give yourself time to grieve your loss and it is a loss, I pray you find the right path no matter what it may be...:hugs:


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## dovkav123

MrsE75 :hugs:


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## Plex

MrsE - Just wanted to give you a big :hugs: dont even know what to say hun - wish i had the right words to help :hugs: xxx


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## Plex

Unlucky - Gosh not long left till u meet ur lil one :) exciting!

I have my WTF appointment 2moro at 5pm. Hubby and I have been doing a LOT of talking about what to do next - such a hard decision to make considering this is all so expensive!! 

I may (hopefully) be cycling with you AQ :happydance: Its all dependant on what she says 2moro and how she answers our questions. we have a VERY loooooong list lol 

My computer is on a serious go slow. think i may quit and come back to finish this later - its only taken me 45mins to write this so far!!! xxx


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## africaqueen

MrsE- I had really hoped that was not the reason you had not posted :( im so sorry. It is soul destroying having egg quality issues. Il be honest, i obviously hope an pray we get our miracle from this next cycle but IF we don't, DE cycle is our next stop. We will not continue throwing money, time an emotion at something fruitless. It is hard at 33 to think DE may be the only option and the thought saddens me as really want a biological part of my Mum here as i miss her so much, but as my dad pointed out, the baby will still be a huge part of my mum as it would be growing inside me as i grew inside my mum and the baby would have life had it not been for my mum having me so its still a bonded chain of maternal closeness and he is very right. As Bugs said, once you get pregnant DE or otherwise that baby is YOURS and you are the one making it grow and nourishing it. The DE is just a special one cell gift from a special lady and the rest is down to you. Its too early to make these decisions now though so take time to grieve for what you have lost- your chance of being pregnant this time around. Thinking of you and here if you need to talk xxx

Unlucky- Glad you're ok x

Peachy- Hope things are well with you? x

Ash- Any news? not seen you around here in a while x

Plex- Good luck for your WTF appt tomorrow an i hope we end up cycle buddies! x

Hi to all the gang x

One week today until our consultation! let the madness commence for the 4th time! lol xxx


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## Sandy83

MrsE so so sorry to hear about your cycle my heart goes out to you and dh. Thinking of you xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


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## ashknowsbest

I'm around just not very active. I'm so sorry for all of the struggles I've been reading on this thread lately. My heart goes out to you girls :hugs: 

I just started my estrace today for my FET so its been pretty boring on my end. I'm also trying to not get caught up in all of the numbers since they really don't seem to matter all that much in the long run. I mean each one of my previous cycles was textbook perfect and still nothing. 

I'll be around, best of luck to everyone!


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## Unlucky41

So sorry MrsE that is terrible news - sending you many many :hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs: This world just doesn't seem to be fair. I hope in time you are able to chose a path that will lead you to some happiness again!


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## bugs

Cvaeh, it's lovely to see you. I wondered how you got on. So sorry it didn't work. Where abouts are you looking at abroad PM me if you wish xxxx


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## africaqueen

Heather- lovely to see you back with us! was thinking of you yesterday funnily enough and was going to msg you on Fb! glad you are ok and raring to go again! wishing you the best of luck and please keep us updated. I start cycling around the 10th of Sep so we will be going through the madness an mayhem together. This is our last cycle with my own eggs, so praying it works but if its not meant to be, we will be saving for 2yrs and then doing a DE cycle abroad too. Most likely in Spain xxx

Ash- Nice to see you back :) i don't know much about FET seeing as we have never been lucky enough to get any frosties, so what happens now? when is the thaw? x

MrsE- Thinking of you lots. I hope you find the strength to get through this and look forward. I know its soul destroying, but weird how we find the courage to go on... x

Hi to all the girls x

AFM- I was very poorly in work today and was physically sick 3 times due to severe Endo pain. I am now lying in bed dosed up on painkillers and trying to gain strength for my early shift tomorrow :( please god let this next cycle work. I am desperate for our baby and the added bonus of no AF for 9mths will go down a treat! lol xxx


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## ashknowsbest

I stopped my BCPs and starting on estrace which is meant to thicken my lining to prepare it for the transfer. The embryos are supposed to thaw on the 23rd of 24th of august at that time they will be transferred and hopefully stick this time! lol


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## Plex

AQ - :hugs: hope your feeling better today hun - did u make it into work in the end? Exciting that you only have 5 days to go till ur consultation! xx

Cvaeh - Where will you be going for your next cycle if you dont mind me asking? xx

Ash - Good luck for your FET hun :hugs: Do you get many side effects from the estrace? xx

Captain - I never really replied to your lovely post to me :hugs: Sorry its taken me so long but your words really hit home and sounded like i could have written them myself. Although im excited to do another cycle ill be glad to have finished with it all - no more drugs, not more painful injections, no more mood swings or side effects, no more sneaking off to inject myself at work, no more sick time off work or having to explain myself away. It all sounds very appealing actually lolol. 

We've decided on one more go - its all we can afford, then thats it. End of the line. I feel like ive wasted the past 2 and a half years of my/our/my sons life and that hurts like hell. I feel so damned guilty. Why does conceiving a child have to be the hardest bloody thing????? It makes me mad that the people who dont deserve their children more often than no have NO trouble at all getting up the duff! 

Sorry end of rant :blush: xx

AFM - I had my WTF (sooo LOVE that expression!!) yesterday and im not entirely sure how i feel :shrug: i guess i feel a mixture of happiness, anger and depression - if thats possible? 

Our consultant is truely lovely :) i didnt have to ask anything off my list (and it was extensive let me tell you !) She explained everything, even as far as telling me that our case of non fertilization was an isolated case - therefore there may be a chromosonal problem - hubby is now to be tested as well as seeing if hes a cystic fybrosis carrier. I had my tests for that last year so am glad he'll have these tests too. Only problem is that it takes up to 10weeks for those results to come back :( 

We will be cycling october november now due to waiting for test results. We will be doing ICSI this time too. Not much else to report apart from the waiting will probably drive me loopy! 

Hope you are all well? xxx


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## ashknowsbest

Plex - if I don't eat anything with the estrace I get an upset stomach and I'm a tad bit emotional but I haven't noticed any other side effects. Woohoo! 

So sorry your last cycle didn't work out :( It's always nice to have a plan and I wish you the best of luck for your final try! <3 I feel your pain. After this FET I'm not really sure if I want to go through with another cycle.


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## Plex

It all gets a bit too much - extremely draining in lots of different ways! 

Will you be having both your :cold: put back? I hope this is the last cycle for you and you get ur bfp :hugs: 

Its good you dont get much in the way of side effects too - bet you always eat with the medication now though?  :thumbup: Do you have to take any other meds aswell? xx


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## Peachy1584

AQ I am doing ok. I hope you're feeling better. I also have those painful periods due to endo and I can't stand up or even breathe it seems like. Are you getting excited again about your cycle? Are they doing anything differently or does all that come with consult?

Ash I think it's a great sign that they were strong enough to make it to freeze! So many women I know have had better luck with fet than fresh.

Plex I know the 10 weeks seems like a long time but it will really go fast and you can enjoy the rest of summer with your little one. Will they change anything besides icsi for next cycle?


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## faithful96

Hello Ladies,

MrsE - I am so so sorry. I have endured so many cycles with eggs that went nowhere. I know how painful it is and I wish there was some way to comfort you (us, everyone who suffers this). I hope you will take some time to be sad and angry and to grieve and to indulge yourself and hopefully treat yourself with grace.

AfricaQueen - Silly question, did you used to be on the Fertility Forum, I feel like your name looks familiar?


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## ashknowsbest

Plex - definitely draining, in every way I can think of! I'm just hoping this one works so that I can be done with all of this and have my family! And yes I eat with my medication everytime :happyface: I'm also taking folic acid, and vit D. Nothing else though, it's much easier than a fresh cycle! 

peachy - thanks girl! I've heard that a ton of people have better luck with FET I'm just hoping I'm one of them! I'm super worried about the thaw but .... I'm trying to remain positive :D


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## LadyLovenox

This is my first time ever posting on a forum, after reading them for years. My husband and I both just turned 30. Unexplained If for years until they've finally labeled me as DOR. We have failed three fresh cycles, all in the last 9 months. I'm emotionally and physically exhausted and just... Beat down. 

Ivf #1: antagonist protocol.... Very low stims 8 eggs, 5 mature, 3 embies, 2 transferred on day 3 bfn
Ivf #2: stop Lupron protocol... Somewhat higher stims but still not as high as I would have liked... 14 eggs
4 mature 
3 fertilized
2 transferred day 3 bfn

Ivf #3 microdose lupron flare protocol.. Finally high dose drugs menopur 225 follistim 175
17 eggs
11 mature
11 fertilized 
2 perfect blasts transferred day 5 bfn
1 frostie (my clinic only freezes the perfect ones) 

FET expanded grade AA blast, waiting for beta but bfn on hpt 7dp5dt, so I'm out. 
Haven't even told dh about the bfn. He hates when I do them early. 

So so so frustrated. I don't understand why "perfect blasts" won't stick. I'm not opposed to DE, but how would that be better if mine are "perfect". I've had 4 endometrial biopsies done and and they all show inflammation, so they're thinking maybe immune issue but all bloods come back normal. They put me on immunosuppresants the last two transfers just in case, but they don't seem to make a difference. I'm on lovenox for mthfr, but only because I've pushed for it, as my re brushes mthfr off like no big deal. Any advice or help??


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## Plex

Peachy - Not really, ill be on menopur with cetrotide, short protocol. Daily aspirin, then lubion, utrogestan, augmentin, prednisolone and clexine - 40mg istead of 20mg. Im still doing acupuncture and im going to try to loose some weight, if i can! We are going to have a nice time not doing anything ttc related :D although we have talked about ttc naturally in the 2months we have to wait :dohh: its like we cant switch off from it all! 

I love ur profile picture :D when will you have ur next scan? xx 

Ash - I agree with peachy embryos are generally of top quality when frozen so ur chances are good :thumbup: Sounds like a nice cycle, if any cycle can be nice that is :D. I was worried about the thaw of my one lil :cold: but they freeze them differently now so thawing rates are much much higher - doesnt stop the worry though :hugs: xx

Lady - :hugs: ur doc sounds so frustrating! Have u thought about moving clinics? I dont know much about mthfr but surely if there is a chance of it hindering you getting pregnant then you should be on medication? Surely your doctor should have at least looked into it? :hugs: Sorry u are in this situation :( 

I agree with you about the DE issue, if you are putting back perfect blasts then surely the egg quality is not the issue there? When is your beta hun? Im praying for a different result for you :hugs: xx

AFM -Nothing going on with me! Im about to nip into town to get some supplements for hubby and me. Im in desperate need of some coq-10 and i have a list of supplements from the doc for hubby, i have most of them now but need a specific few more. 

I have acupuncture later and plan on doing some form of exercise before lunch but i cant really see that happening lol Im off to work tonight after a month off, was hoping to be going back pregnant but hey ho what can you do about it right? So ill skulk off to work tonight lol

Any of you ever taken those fat binding tablets that make u poo through the eye of a needle??? Well im gunna get some of those aswell to try them :D hopefully they dont upset my stomach as much as ive heard they do! 

Anyway im rambling now :blush: Hope u are all ok xx


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## bugs

Hi ladies hope everyone is well. 

Ladylovenox welcome and I'm sorry that your first post is to join this thread.
I just felt I had to chime in with regards to donor eggs, The way I see it just because an embryo makes it to blast does not guarantee it is perfect. No embryologist or machine can predict whether a blast will make a baby or we would all be pregnant in no time. I used to produce eggs that looked ok and we never got to blast due to numbers we always had embryos' of 8 cells on day 3 so exactly where they should have been with little fragmentation and they never took. 
This cycle we used a 24 year old donor who helped us produce 6 blasts. The 3 put back were perfect so you would think multiples but only one took, Why who knows but I can only guess that of the 3 only one was viable. 

So after my very long analysis what i'm saying is don't think that because your own blasts didn't take donor eggs won't as that is not the case. My clinic in Athens puts 3 back as they know the chances of all 3 taking are very slim and it is impossible to know which ones will take. It took me 8 cycles with my own eggs to come to the conclusion that it wasn't working and we needed a big change. 

I hope it is just a bit early for you to have tested and that your journey here will be short lived but if not I hope we can support you the best we can xxxx


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## LadyLovenox

Plex.... Thank you so much for the encouraging words. I am currently going to shady grove which is supposed to be the best in our area. Dh tells me all the time that we should be going to Hershey med center, just bc he is sick of this place and all of its disappointments. I would like to try a new place, but cringe at "starting over" if you know what I mean. My beta is tues the 12th, because shady grove does theirs soo late. 13dp5dt. Ever since my test at 7dp5dt, though, I figured im out. I have browsed enough forums where everyone gets their Bfp by 5 or 6dp5dt. 

As far as my perfect blasts, they always tell me "just bc they look perfect doesn't mean they're chromosomally normal." which I get, but pgd testing costs an additional 5 grand and we just don't have it, as we are all out of pocket. I definitely want to do the microdose flare protocol again next time since my results were so much better, and just hope for stickier beans. I'm so sick of everyone around me getting pregnant, and I'm so sick of people's sympathy. I know they mean the best, but I feel like they're looking at me like the most pathetic, pitiful thing in the world. I'll take anyone's support, but don't feel sorry for me, ya know? 

I'm jealous of your acupuncture!!! I did that for awhile, and I loved it but at 100 bucks a session, it's just too much. :( i hear ya about wanting to go back to work pregnant. I'm a teacher, so I really thought maybe these two cycles I did over the summer would be the ticket. Sigh. More hoop jumping ahead!! Hope you have a great day!


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## LadyLovenox

Thank you so much, bugs!!! Thats basically what the doctor told us too, but I'm not willing to give up on my eggs just yet. My first two cycles w low dose stims were a bust from the start, in my opinion, so I'm really hoping that w more high dose cycles, we will stumble upon a lucky one. I am def putting in three blasts next cycle if we have them. If we have to go the donor egg route, I'm thinking we will use donor embryos. If it can't be my Dna, I don't want it to be either of ours. I know that sounds selfish, but I just don't know how I'd handle it. If you don't mind me asking, did you have these same concerns before using DE, and how do you feel now?


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## Plex

Lady - OUCH to the extra 5 grand!! I had no idea pgd was that expensive! Im now waiting on hubbies karotyping and cf results so if any positive results then that is an area we will have to consider/go down. 

I have read up on about lots of people getting positives 6dp5dt too - i was reading them all in my tww aswell - why do we torture ourselves??? 

Why cant the treatment process be more clear cut? I mean a lovely looking embryo/blast should be just that, we shouldnt need to look deeper to see if its chromosonally normal, it just should be :( infertility sucks :( 

I agree with what bugs says, at the time of writing i never thought of the fact that the problem could be chromosonal and therefore 'unseen'. xx


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## LadyLovenox

Yes.... All the expenses add up soo much!!! We have both had karyotype testing and genetic testing.... The works.... Which showed nothing but I guess crappy eggs are just chromosomally messed up on their own? 

There are several doctors at my office and the two main ones I see don't really agree on our problem. One doctor days I def have Dor, but the other doctor says with my afc, she doesn't think it's Dor. (my afc gas ranged from 11-22 throughout a million different monitoring appointments)


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## bugs

I think you have to come to the decision of donor eggs in your own time. I hope I don't come across as telling people to give up on themselves as it's not something to decide on lightly. As I said before we'd had 8 cycles, we were coming to the end of the road fianancially and emotionally. We'd spent a lot on immune testing and it wasn't worth us doing PGD as we only ever had 1-2 embryos left so we'd just put them back and hope for the best. 

After my 8th cycle failed our consultant recommended donor eggs, she felt that we would have a better chance of success and we agreed we'd given my eggs enough cycles to know it wasn't going to happen so it really wasn't a difficult decision to make and I actually had my donor transfer just 2 months after my failed cycle. My partner has kids already so it was important to me that he would have a genetic bond that he has with his other kids and I get to carry our baby so that is enough for me. I was concerned that I might feel different but every scan is so special and now I'm feeling the baby move it really doesn't cross my mind that we used donor eggs but again I total understand that it's not for everyone but it certainly was the answer for us xxxx


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## Peachy1584

Plex are the fat binding pills to lose weight or to help you go to the bathroom?

Lady I am so sorry you feel this cycle hasn't worked but I'm glad you're a fighter and aren't giving up!

Bugs and Lady with my last Mc at almost 9 weeks was a frozen transfer with a 6 A A hatching blast. That's the best grade they can get and baby had trisomy 13. I no longer believe in or worry about grades. Abnormal embies can look perfect and the perplexing thing about my case is that I was told as mine was not genetic it's something that happens at fertilization that it isn't even a trisomy that pgd looks for. So if we had paid all that money and had ours tested it still would have ended the same way. I have always looked at is as a numbers game. Eventually you'll get a good one and not everyone is fortunate enough to get it on the first try so it's about how much you can deal with emotionally, physically and mentally as well as financially. I have an adopted sister and love her as such so I have never cared about the whole biological deal so I would use donor eggs if I had to. It's only my husband that wants that so he'd get it regardless.


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## Plex

Peachy - lolol :D for fat burning purposes only! If it could be done without the side effects then that would be better :D I did have a look at them but read that people with a thyroid disorder should not take them, well thats me out as far as theyre concerned. So its loosing weight the old fashioned way for me. xx


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## africaqueen

Plex- Yeah made it to work. Had no choice financially sadly :( feeling a lot better today just tired. Good luck for your next cycle hun. Hope u manage to give your LO a lil bro or sis x

Ash- Ah so not long for you now then! hope the thaw goes perfectly and the you get your sticky embie from this cycle x

Peachy- Sorry you suffer too! yep same for me. I get on all fours and actually wail with the pain! you would swear i was in labour :( Glad you are ok. As regards what we will be doing for next cycle, we wont know until after Tuesdays appt but i want mild IVF this time around so along those lines x

Faithful- No, i have been posting here since 2009 :( x

LadyLove- Welcome and i am sorry for your failed cycles. It sucks. Sometimes life is random and its a numbers game, but obviously a very costly one. As regards DE, if it comes to that(and you are a long way off that yet i think) then im sure u would want your DH to be the babies bio daddy. You would be carrying, nuturing an giving birth to the baby so there is your bond right there. Hubby needs a connection too ;) x

Hi to all the gang x

AFM- Been a sad day today as 3yr anniversary of my mum passing. Had my bloods done this morning(virals, rubella immunity and 3 day FSH) at my GP's and hubby gets done on Monday. This is saving us nearly £500 (IVF clinic prices) so very lucky our GP is covering it for us! Right im off to bed. On yet another early shift tomorrow an Sunday! Boooooo xxx


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## bubumaci

Sarah - :hugs: I know how hard that has been for you!
It is really good that the GP is helping out with the tests though! Always so good to find financial relief in this horrendous process!!


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## LadyLovenox

Hey ladies! Sorry it took me so long to reply. I was out of town for a wedding with no service. I love the idea that my connection to a donor egg would be from carrying, nurturing, birthing the baby. I guess i overlook some of those beautiful things and just felt like it would be my husband's baby and not mine. Definitely not true. 

I have my beta tomorrow for fet and just wish I could skip it. I know it didn't work, and have known it for almost a week. Can we NOT throw salt in that wound w a call from a nurse saying "oh I'm sorry, I really thought this would be it" Ugh. 

I am handling this failure sooooo much better than my 3 fresh cycles, though... And I really attribute that to the small dose of antidepressants I have been on. (safe in early pregnancy). I wish I would have gotten on them so much sooner. No shame!


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## Sandy83

Welcome Lady, Sorry to hear about your cycle at least after tomorrow you can truly mourn this cycle and look to moving forward. I do believe the more cycles I have done the better i have coped when it has been a BFN. Thinking of you tomorrow :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

I agree with Sandy - somehow, the more the were, the easier they were to deal with - isn't that crazy? Apart from the two chemicals ... they were pretty nasty.
I remember your test, Lady - was it at 11 / 12 dpo? Depending on what type of test you did, it may just have been too early to see anything in the urine and a blood test might have given you a different result. Or have you tested since?

Hugs to all Ladies here :)


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## LadyLovenox

Thanks Sandy and bubumaci! I'm hoping everyone on this forum is past their bfn days and have sunnier days ahead. No one deserves all we have been thru! 

You are right bubumaci.... I texted at 12dpo....7dp5dt.... Ugly old bfn with fmu on frer. The kiss of death. Lol I didn't test again bc I feel like it is torturing myself. I just have my list of questions and dates ready to go for when my nurse calls with results tomorrow.


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## bubumaci

My fingers are still crossed for you :)


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## LadyLovenox

Thanks!!! :)) I would absolutely looove a Bfp, but we have become fairly familiar with the short end of the stick. Lol I'll keep you updated.


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## Unlucky41

Hi Lady any news? hoping you get some good news.

AQ Sorry that you are feeling a little depress esp in relation to your mum :hugs::hugs::hugs: Hoping this cycle is the one for you. It is nice that they are some kind hearted GPs out there. How are you feeling now better?

Ash how is your FET cycle going?

how is everyone else doing?

AFM - Just counting down the days 19 days to go - wishing everyone who haven't received their BFP a big fat BFP real soon!!!


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## LadyLovenox

I wish I had good news to share with you all, but unfortunately... The bfn.... Once again. My gosh I wish I knew how hard it actually is to get pregnant when I was preventing back in college and early twenties!! We will cycle again in October. A little break for starting my school year (I'm a teacher ) how is everyone else??


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## Sandy83

sorry to hear that Lady, sounds like you have a plan in place and thinking of you and DH :hugs: xx


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## Peachy1584

Lady I am so sorry. I know you knew but having it be made official is painful. Did they give you any insight? I am crazy glad you're able to cycle again and so soon! We opted to go with a warranty program when we started again and could cycle when we wanted and boy do I know how lucky we were to be able to do so. It's all so expensive


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## africaqueen

Unlucky- I am feeling a fair bit better thanks. Just feel so alone sometimes without my mum here even tho im lucky to have such a great dad, coming up to treatment all i want is my mum :( Can't believe you are due soon! where did the time go?! x

Lady- I am so sorry. I know you were expecting it but i think we all still have the glimmer of hope until we are told for certain so huge hugs. Words fail me. Life is so unfair! i hope Octobers cycle see's you get your bfp! x

Hi to all the gang! x

AFM- We went for our consult appt today and it went exactly as predicted. Our consultant wanted me on max dose of stimms again, which i refused so we are going on 4 amps instead of 8 like previous cycle. We are doing a cetrotide cycle again and my drugs should be here in the next 2wks with the cycle starting on Sep's AF which should be around the 9th Sep so all systems go now! Our consultant did once again say that the only thing that will improve our chances is donor eggs, and i am aware of that BUT i want to give this cycle one last shot with my own eggs. We know what our plan B is but for now we have a chance an that is good enough for me. Only takes one special embie to make it and i am determined to be positive! :) xxx


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## bubumaci

Lady, I am so sorry that it turned out to be a BFN :( Hearing it always stole a piece of my soul. From experience I can say, that taking a little break is not only good for your body, but also for your soul (and in the first year, I never wanted to take breaks - the first 5 months we were active each month : 2012 - June ICSI with fresh transfer, July FET, August FET, September ICSI with fresh transfer, October FET ... after that, the tries were more spaced out).
October is not that far away :hugs2:

Sarah - glad that you have had your consultation. It is surprising that he didn't suggest changing the protocol himself. It is good that you are wanting to go for quality not quantity. After a few tries, it makes sense to try something else. And maybe you can try the IVF Companion - really helped me get into a better frame of mind for the whole treatment :) :hugs2:


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## africaqueen

Andrea- Thank you. The clinic we use are not very dynamic and if i did not have a egg quality and reserve issue, we would if changed clinics but due to these factors, we have a slim chance anywhere we go and its down to luck now tbh. Hope to god this brings us our miracle. Feeling very excited but did also feel sad sat in the cons office yesterday as we first sat there, so full of hope in 2011 and now it holds some sad moments of past fails. Hope this journey takes a happy turn this time. Would love to be pregnant for Christmas and enter 2015 full of happiness and hope xxx


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## LadyLovenox

Thank you all so so much for all the beautiful words of encouragement and understanding. No one "gets it" like you all. It is very hard. I was put on a prayer chain at a friends church and after my name was mentioned, the next prayer request was for a baby born with a heroin addiction. Things like this never cease to destroy me. Some things are just not right. 

Africa queen: just out of curiosity, what makes you want lower med doses and not what the max dose? I'm always begging for higher doses, so I'm just curious. I hope and pray you get your Bfp!!!! You are right, so much of it is down to luck. What all protocols have you tried? I went on Dhea for three months before my last cycle and had major improvements. Microdose flare protocol worked best for me. I believe that's what we will try again and if that doesn't work, estrogen priming protocol. So much guess and check.


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## Peachy1584

AQ so glad consult is out of the way and you'll be starting soon. I am so nervous and excited for you! I know with my second fresh cycle I felt like I stimmed too fast and it was my worst one. On my 3rd fresh I had higher doses the first 2 days (he said this would get them moving) then lowered my dose and I stimmed for an extra day and I did end up with better quality. It's such a learning process when you don't fall into the majority that need the same dose for the same amount of days for a clinics regular protocol. I did switch clinics and almost felt bad for them because it was always like ok why do you do it this way when they do it that way? Hard to have blind faith. It is just about getting the right embie and I wish money weren't an issue. My husband never wants to talk about the actual number we have spent : )


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## africaqueen

Lady- I had 6 amps on our 2nd cycle and although we got 5 eggs, we only ended up with one embie and was graded low :( 3rd cycle we went for 8 amps and got 7 eggs and again one embie. My issue is obviously having no tubes, but also premature ovarian failure and poor egg quality to boot, so i have now come to the conclusion that max stimms are frying my already struggling eggs. I am hoping that having half the dose of stimms gives us 2 good eggs compared to 7 low quality ;)
Fingers crossed i am right! x

Peachy- Yeah glad to have the consult appt out the way and all systems go now! just cannot wait to get my next AF(something we NEVER say unless waiting to start IVF! lol) and get the ball rolling. How are you doing? x

Just wanted to say to all the ladies who are now pregnant- after 3 fails, did u feel it was a virtual impossibility to get preg? and do you think its just a numbers game and pot luck for getting the 'good egg'? I am trying to make myself believe this cycle will give us our miracle but its soooo hard to stay that 100% positive isnt it? xxx


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## ashknowsbest

AQ - I'm gonna sound a tad bit negative for a minute. I've had 3 fails and I am starting to feel like it's virtually impossible however, that being said I think it's important to try even if you don't feel it will work. That might sound weird but that's exactly how I feel. I don't think it's going to work but I do think it is a numbers game and I have to keep trying. If I just stopped trying even though I feel like it won't work, I would feel .... like I gave up and I don't want to feel like that. I want to do everything I can until I can't. Since we have these two frozen embryos we're going through with the FET but I'm not sure we're doing anything after. 

That probably sounds crazy and confusing but that's how I see it.


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## africaqueen

Ash- It doesn't sound crazy at all. I know exactly what you mean! no matter how hard it is to believe a actual baby could result from all these invasive medical procedures , i still have the dream of being a mummy and know that for me IVF is the only possible way that can even have a chance of happening so like you said, i will still try with even a 1% chance as that 1% gives me hope i can otherwise never have so we will carry on until we are unable or until we get our miracle x


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## Peachy1584

AQ when I began ivf I honestly I would be pregnant on the 1st try. I have no fertility issues except for tubal reversal was unsuccessful. After my 1st BFN I thought for sure it was because transfer went bad and my fet would get me there and voila I was pregnant! To lose my baby to a trisomy was just utter devastation. I mean wtf? My second fresh my first 2 betas were good and then junk. Now after 3 fails I am finally pregnant, 10 weeks yesterday, and I still don't believe it will work. Why would I when it hasn't before? I gave blood yesterday for the harmony testing which tests for trisomy 21,18 and 13. That comes back in 2 weeks and I am petrified. I have the NT u/s next week and it makes me sick to my stomach. IF is so unfair. On the other side of the coin I do believe it is a numbers game and for whoever can keep going the more embies you get the better the chance of getting a good one. Unfortunately so many run out of time and money. On our warranty program I have one fresh cycle left and whatever frozen cycles are possible should this not end up being our miracle. I am excited for you because you get another chance and nervous because it is your last one. I wish you had more just in case but why not now? Why not you?


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## africaqueen

Ah Peachy i can fully understand where you are coming from. I can only imagine how nerve racking it is to finally get that long awaited viable pregnancy and then be terrified. I think after what we go thru to get pregnant, we wont be happy fully until our miracles are in our arms. I am sure you lil bean will be fine but i understand the fear. It will get better once 1st tri is out the way. You are right in what you say. Why not me and why not this time? same applies to you and your precious cargo ;) xxx


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## bubumaci

Sarah - ... for me, it wasn't just 3 fails, it was 8 ... #9 brought us our BFP ... and our doctor had kept saying to us, that he firmly believed it would work, he just didn't know how long it would take. The first 5 tries were with a different doctor at the clinic and in November 2012 we switched. Right away, our tries were more promising with the new doctor, but we weren't quite there yet. Did scratch biopsies and various other things to try to optimise our chances ... February 2013 had OHSS, so for the July try he changed the protocol a bit - two beautiful blasts transferred and a Chemical. Before the transfer, after the transfer and late August I had colic attacks from my Gallbladder - that needed removing in September. Next try, November - again slightly modified protocol - again perfect blastocysts transferred - again Chemical. February this year, again slightly modified protocol - beautiful hatching blast transferred - BFP. Oh and from February last year, we had all fertilised eggs monitored in an Embryoscope, which also optimises the conditions (I think that also contributed to the better quality and development).
So I think it is a lot of different influences that contribute to how it all works or doesn't work. Just because they fertilise, doesn't mean that it will end up in pregnancy (I also thought it would work first try!!) - and there may be nothing wrong with us DNA-wise - and still, when sperm and egg fuse, there are chromosome anomalies... and that is just nature :(

I somehow always believed. But because we were entirely out of pocket for the whole treatment, I knew there had to be a limit. Beginning of the year I said - "I will be 40 next year, if it hasn't worked by the end of the year, we are stopping". Luckily, our first try this year was it :) <3


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## africaqueen

Gosh Andrea, you have really been thru it to get to your BFP! I can't imagine how you have coped with all those cycles. You are very strong. It is so mentally exhausting! i dont mind the physical aspect at all, but emotionally, i know i cant do this much more and also financially, so hope my gut instinct is right an this cycle will bring us our earth baby xxx


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## Unlucky41

AQ - We only got pregnant with the 5th IVF try and basically it was the last time the doctor wanted us to try with my eggs so YES I thought it would never happen !!! I feel so blessed that it has worked and we are not soooo close to being parents! 

Out of our 5 IVF we only got 5 embryos and only the last two has been good quality!! I do thank God every time I remember for this gift of life. 

Words can't express how relieved I am that this time has worked and I won't now how I would be if it didn't considering DH didn't want to use donor eggs!

Hope this is your miracle cycle as well AQ!!! :hugs::hugs::hugs:


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## Bumpsparkle

Hi AQ,

Just wanted to pop in and wish you lots of baby dust for this cycle!
I was on your previous thread back in Jan 2013 and it's really great to see that you are able to have another cycle!

After 2 failed cycles we're looking at another fresh cycle in Oct and I'm really not sure where I'm going to find the emotional strength from. It is so hard to find that positivity that was there on cycle 1 but I know I have to find some as I just can't face giving up just yet.

I've got everything crossed for ya! x x


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## ashknowsbest

1 week and 1 day until I get my transfer! I'm getting excited now, but mostly to see our families and have the babies in my uterus where they should be instead of frozen in a lab. :D I've been taking a ton of estrace now and its been giving me a headache I'm pretty sure :( Ready for that to be over too, not looking forward to the PIO. I'll be starting that in the next 3-4 days.


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## africaqueen

Jo- That gives me so much hope! it brings to mind my beloved mum's phrase 'where there is life there is hope'! i am going to be as positive as possible and pray we get at least one embie for transfer an that its our sticky. Glad everything is going well for you. Where is your pregnancy ticker? ;) x

Bumpsparkle- Lovely to hear from you! i am sorry you are also still going thru this nightmare but its amazing where we do find the strength for something we want so much. Never give up. Good luck for Oct! keep me updated x

Hi to all the gang x


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## dovkav123

ashknowsbest said:


> AQ - I'm gonna sound a tad bit negative for a minute. I've had 3 fails and I am starting to feel like it's virtually impossible however, that being said I think it's important to try even if you don't feel it will work. That might sound weird but that's exactly how I feel. I don't think it's going to work but I do think it is a numbers game and I have to keep trying. If I just stopped trying even though I feel like it won't work, I would feel .... like I gave up and I don't want to feel like that. I want to do everything I can until I can't. Since we have these two frozen embryos we're going through with the FET but I'm not sure we're doing anything after.
> 
> That probably sounds crazy and confusing but that's how I see it.

I know what you are talking about. I was negative too after 6 failed IVFs. I didn't cry anymore I was numb and heartless. I was not nervous anymore, I was not excited anymore...It didn't work before, why will it work now... It was our last non stim IVF. I had already big plans to continue my journey in US and pay 4 times more than in Germany.
I'll be positive now. Maybe less stress was a bit good for me and for my success.
Everything is crossed for you!


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## ashknowsbest

dovkav - I'm glad I'm not alone! that's pretty much how I feel right now. I want to be excited, but I'm not really. I'm looking forward to getting it over with but not excited. When I went through my very first IVF I thought, "OMG it's going to work the first time, it just has to!" but the more they failed the less is bothers me. And even though that's kind of sad. I like it that way. It's not that I'm not upset it's just ... crying is not going to help. I like to remain calm now and have a plan. And yes probably not stressing is doing me some good! This cycle I have a glass or two of wine every other night .... I don't worry about the little stuff, I don't obsess about the numbers. I'm feeling ... relaxed surprisingly.


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## LadyLovenox

Oh, Ash..... I am totally right there with you. I feel the same way!! 

Question for any of you ladies..... My re is pretty open to trying what I recommend. I have recently asked about a natural start for my 4th ivf..... No bcp to prime me. What are your thoughts on this?


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## Unlucky41

AQ really hope you get your sticky embry this cycle. To be honest once you get your good news the night mare of this journey seems behind you and you can breath again! :hugs::hugs:

How are you feeling now AQ? 

We are looking at a c section as the baby has not engaged and my ob knows how hard it was for us to get this baby hence she rather not take any chances and take it out before our due date.


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## ashknowsbest

Well I got the go ahead. They wanted transfer on the 22nd but thats not possible because my DH and I are flying out on the 22nd and won't be there until 6PM. But they moved transfer and it's on the 25th! I'm looking forward to the transfer but I'm also nervous as hell. I just want it to work already but it is a numbers game and nobody knows if it's going to work .... so the wait already begins it seems. 

unlucky - when is your official due date? Are you excited? Nervous? 

lady - i'm really not familiar with the science behind all of the cycles and I try not to google things so I don't have much advice for you but I hope some of the other ladies are able to help! :hugs:


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## bubumaci

Lady : I never took BCPs, for any of the tries! (And we had several). I don't know if that is because my cycles were regular anyway ... or because my clinic is constantly available, every day, no day off - so there is no need to "control" the woman's cycle. If you need to be seen on the weekend / have ER or transfer on the weekend - then that is how it is.

Dovkav, for example, had only natural IVFs (without any stimming at all) - so it was always a game of chance, whether or not the eggie retrieved was a) there and b) mature enough - but she did all her cycles with only one egg and no meds ...

Jo, if I were you and it is possible, I would try to go without a c-section. It is major surgery and takes much longer to recover from ... so if there is no medical reason for you to have to have the c-section, it would be my tip to try and avoid it :hugs2:


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## africaqueen

Ash- Ooh not long now! how are the PIO shots going? we don't have them in my clinic luckily as iv heard they are not very nice! Good luck and enjoy the excitement. Its not often us IVF ladies get to feel the anxiety/hope of possibly being pregnant x

Jo- If you have a section you will be fine im sure. My mum had one with me, my friend Jane had 3 and my friend Jen had one 7wks ago. All went smoothly an they recovered pretty well. Quicker than some of my friends who had a 'natural delivery' esp when forceps were involved! ;) go with what is best for baby and you x

Hi to all the gang x

AFM- I keep thinking about Christmas and stuff and getting really excited thinking i could be pregnant for Christmas and going into 2nd tri! in one way it seems a distant dream and in another i can fully picture it! omg you forget what a head f**k this journey is until you start again! Aaaaah xxx


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## ashknowsbest

AQ - I haven't started the PIO shots yet. They start on Wednesday. I'm not looking forward to them but it'll be fine. My DH and I have a routine ... he ices the area the whole time I'm drawing up the medication so by the time I'm ready to inject it I'm pretty numb :D


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## africaqueen

Good plan Ash and love the team work with you an dh! my dh cannot leave the room quick enough once i start prepping my needles! haha. He is VERY weak stomached xxx


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## ashknowsbest

:D especially the PIO it's huge! I pretty much told him that I did everything else, the least he could do was hold the ice pack :haha:


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## Unlucky41

Ash & AQ you are both very brave I can't stand injecting myself. DH has to do it and I make funny faces every time. Although most of the time it is not too bad they are some times when he hits a bad spot and I start yelling at him. He would then as me to do it myself and I would refuse and that was our daily routine!

Ash does it matter about the timing for the transfer? What did the Doctor say ?

AQ I think it is important to have the positive thinking especially when you are going through the cycle it helps you get by ! 

Ash I am due 31 August so not long now !! 

Bub I agree I would love to have a natural birth got my TENS machine already however going from my sister's labour where they tried natural and later had an emergency c section I rather just have the planned c section if that is the case. The problem is the baby is not engaged and my fluid levels starting to drop hence there is a possibility that I need a c section. I hope it you have a text book labour!!!

AQ that is promising that so many of your friends had c sections and they were fine! DH is already preparing himself to do all the work in the first few weeks!!! Definitely keep you guys posted but I think she will be out sometime next week!!!:happydance:


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## bubumaci

Jo!! ... :dance: that is just sooooo close! :)
Your doctor will do what is best for you and baby, I am sure! It is true, caesarian has become so routine, that for many, the recovery is good!

Last week at the baby-preparation-course, the midwife was telling the husbands / partners, that in the first couple of weeks, they should be doing the nappy changing (while the mothers do the feedings - assuming breastfeeding), because long time standing over the changing table isn't that great for the pelvic region and the mother needs to recover from the birth. DH looked at me horrified :haha:


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## africaqueen

Jo- Omg not long now! cannot believe how fast your pregnancy has gone!! also cannot believe iv been on these ttc boards on here for 5yrs next mth! wtf?! lol. My life is going too fast! x

Ash- Lol. You are right! haha. My dh made a face when the doc said he needs to repeat his SA on Tuesday as its been 2yrs since last one! i was like 'err all u need to do is watch porn an provide a 'sample' and i have to inject daily, have internal scans, ER and ET! haha. They do get it easy physically. Obviously mentally they have their own ups and downs x

Andrea- How are you doing? x

Clare- How are things?? x

MrsE- Thinking of you. I understand you need time out but we are here when you are ready x


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## ashknowsbest

unlucky - My doctor said since I was on BCPs prior to the cycle and they are controlling everything that it's fine. Since I will be doing PIO to maintain my lining I think that helps too as I won't get a period until I stop that. I trust my doctor, been through 6 cycles with him so hopefully it'll be fine :D I think that's one of the benefits of doing a FET cycle, they're a lot more flexible. OMG august 31st is so close! Do you know the sex of your baby? :happydance: You get to meet you LO so soon! 

AQ - they do have it easy. Honestly every man reacts different emotionally but I think even on the emotional side they have it fairly easy. I mean most men aren't super emotional anyways. I know my DH gets upset but never cries about our infertility and he also tries to stay strong for me I'm sure. I'm pretty emotional without female hormones raging around in my body and the meds just make it worse :haha:


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## bugs

Ash and Sarah hope both your cycles is the final step in your journey. Wishing you both the best of luck xxx

Jo you are so close now, I've been told that the tens machines are really good so may look into that myself. 

Sarah I'm fine thanks for asking, I don't post too much after my little altercation with someone on another thread I'm sure you remember our thread had been taken over by baby talk so I try to keep it to a minimum. I know you all like to hear updates as i do so of course I will keep you all posted. Today I am very pleased to have made 24 weeks V day I think it's called. Baby is getting more active and even with the anterior placenta I am feeling kicks. I thought I would be nice & relaxed at this point but as my sister had a prem baby at 27 weeks I think I'm even more anxious, analysing every twinge. Still feel like I've got ages left but I'm sure it will be here before I know it xxxx


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## africaqueen

Yep totally agree! my dh tends to favour sticking his head in the sand tbh but i am very 'vocal' with my emotions! haha. I guess each person deals differently. I find that we women have to be the strong ones tho x

Well ladies, had a stressful few hours! called docs receptionist to get viral blood results so i can arrange faxing them to the clinic and she says 'there is a issue with your hep b test and doctor wants to speak to you' well obviously we know we have been monogamous since we have been together an had clear tests 3yrs ago but still been stressed awaiting the call?! anyway, doc just called and said the wrong test was done. It was a hep b immunity test which obviously shows we are not immune seeing as we have never had it or been immunized against it, so we need to go in the morning for more bloods for 'hep b core' which i have no idea what it is but the clinic need us to have it before treatment can commence so more bloods and more nightmare for dh as he is terrified of needles! Grrrrr. Dh also needs to go to the clinic on Wed morning for another SA. None stop tests once the ball starts moving again isnt it. Think i forgot all the groundwork BEFORE actual cycle can start. lol xxx


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## africaqueen

Cross posted there Clare! happy 24 weeks! soooo happy for you!! time is flying by altho im sure not for you ;) glad all is going well xxx


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## Unlucky41

Hi All 

I can't believe that it is almost time now. I as ready as I can be. My body is full of aches - back and legs but very thankful that I am finally here! DH said he can finally be excited as we are so close and we should be in the clear now. 

Bub - yes DH should do all the nappy changing and settling from my perspective but I am really scare as DH has not held a baby before! How is yours with kids?

AQ how could they get the test wrong? Dcotor's bad handwriting ? DH always struggled with producing his sample so totally can relate to your husband but yes compared to us it doesn't compare right ? 

Ash- we are going to have a little girl although I don't think she will be too little already estimated to be 3.2kg last week already. Sounds like your doctor has all things covered. Ash my pregnancy was from a FET hence I hope this is it for you! I think you are heaps more relaxed doing a FET instead of a Fresh. I think the worst part is just waiting for it to work!!


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## africaqueen

Jo- It was not so much our GP that got the test wrong, basically what happened was, our clinic was going to charge us £500 for our viral bloods to be redone and so i asked our GP could she do them for free which she kindly agreed and asked me what needed doing. I emailed our RE and asked him and he replied HIV, Hep B and C and rubella immunity. I just relaid this info to our GP and she did the bloods. It was only that another Doc picked up on the fact the core test had not been done that he called us to say that is the relevant one for IVF so hence the mix up really x


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## africaqueen

Hi ladies

Well me an dh have just been for our bloods for Hep B core and all my other results were there but dh's are missing?!! so the doc was not happy at all and has redone all dh's bloods. Results should be in by Monday latest and then i can get them faxed to the IVF clinic. Hope things start going smoothly from now! don't need all this added stress before the cycle even starts. Just got our invoice too so off to transfer the money. My account will look very healthy for first time in a year for all of a hour before i make payment! haha xxx


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## Sandy83

Hi Ladies

Sorry I've been MIA, still need to catch up on posts as DH got admitted into hospital last tuesday due to an infection he had a very scary episode! All better now but was in hospital on IV antiobiotics till sunday. 

Well the time has come my WFT appt is this afternoon, haven't been to the clinic since my failed cycle in Feb due to DH's condition hopefully be able to come away from this afternoon with a plan for the end of the year 

Hope everyone is doing well and will catch up soon xx


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## ashknowsbest

sandy - good luck at your WTF appointment :hugs: I hope they have some answers for you and your DH. Sorry to hear that DH got an infection but happy after the antibiotics he's feeling better! Let us know how it goes.


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## Peachy1584

AQ what a pain in the ass! I was lucky as new RE didn't make us redo all that even though they were "expired". You know these last 2 fresh cycles (thanks to a gal on here) i applied for the First Steps program and got half off my stims. It's income based and I'm not sure if it's available in the UK and if it's not maybe there are other programs available for the there since I know we don't use the same meds but it's worth looking into and they give you an answer within 48 hours.

Sandy so sorry about your scare! You really deserve a break and I hope this appt goes well for you and leaves you feeling hopeful :hugs:

Ash yay for having a date! Hope it goes by quick for you! My husband did my pio for me (so did others) i never felt comfortable with trying to do it in my behind area : )

Bubu and Dovkav hope you ladies are feeling great and babies are perfect!

Unlucky I think you're going to have think about a name change! : )

Hope everyone else is well! So glad to have football season back it's the best time of year : )


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## Sandy83

Well appointment went as expected no really answers to why it hasn't worked yet but plan is to start FET in November so just need to ring nearer the time for drugs and dates. Xx


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## Peachy1584

Sandy I wish you had some answers. Have you been at the same clinic this whole time? I know you can't do much different since it's a frozen cycle but have you don't the endo scratch? I did it this time and they told me it can be very beneficial. Hope time passes quickly and smoothly for you. Sometimes when we're taking care of others we forget to take care of ourselves. Take time to treat yourself to things you enjoy hon :hugs:


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## Unlucky41

AQ - I hope from now onwards everything goes smoothly. Did your GP do all the extra test or did you have to pay out of pockets ?

Sandy - how is dh doing now? It is good to get the WTF appointment out of the way so you know what is the plan going forward.

Peachy - haha I don't think I can change the name yet ! I feel very blessed that it is finally happening for us.

AFM - We have our c section book for this coming Monday. My fluid levels is starting to be too low hence safer to take her out. Doctor suspects my placenta no longer working as well!! 

Only 5 more sleeps!!


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## Sandy83

Wow 5 more sleeps and your miracle will be here :wohoo: sounds like the c section is the right move :hugs:

AQ, sorry you have had to go through all this stress and hope that the hard part is out the way and everything else just falls into place :hugs:

Ash, How's everything going not long now :hugs:

Dovkav & Bubumaci, How you both doing :hugs:

Plex, How you doing, have you had WTF appt? (Sorry if you have already posted) :hugs:

Hope anyone I've missed is doing well :hugs:

DH is doing good getting back to his normal self, Off work after today so i can spend sometime with DH before he goes in for his transplant booked a local hotel for the night over the weekend so i can spoil him rotten before a 4 weeks hospital stint! So looking forward to that xx


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## bubumaci

*Jo* .. my goodness ... it is here already.
DH has absolutely no experience holding babies. Didn't even hold his nephew (born last November) even though I said he should try and get some practice :haha: Last week at the baby-preparation-course he put on the doll's nappy ... And then while I was dressing the doll, I was talking to it, telling it how well it was doing, using a soothing voice (didn't even think about it, just came naturally *lol*) and he totally laughed at me, thinking it was weird that I was talking to a doll :haha:
Will definitely be thinking of you Monday and looking forward to an update and some pictures when you are up to it :) :kiss:

*Sandy*, I am so so sorry to hear that DH suffered an infection! Very glad to hear that he is OK now and also that you will have some together-time before he has to go in for his transplant. When is that? Will definitely be sending out prayers for the two of you! :hugs2:
Sadly, on this journey, there - more often than not - isn't always an answer as to why it doesn't work. We never got an answer, just the assumption, that the embryos we were transferring were in some way chromosomally abnormal and that they stopped developing / body rejected them. i.e. it was just nature at work. I mean the two times we had chemicals (before the bfp), we transferred two beautiful looking blastocysts each time ... No rhyme or reason, just the way Mother Nature works some times. It is of no consolation to the couple, desperate for it to work...
For the last tries we had, they did an endo scratch (which is really supposed to help) ... as Peachy suggests, maybe that is one thing you could bring up?

*Sarah* - fingers are now tightly crossed that nothing else goes wrong with the bloods and that it can be smooth sailing from here on in!! So annoying, when "external influences" screw up and there is nothing you can do about it. Sometimes makes you wonder if they have _any_ idea what they are putting the patients through with their incompetence? :( :hugs2:

AFM ... I have been so good updating my journal (and the groups I am on on Facebook), that I have been terrible updating anywhere else. Incidentally, anyone who wants to read and stalk my journal is most welcome *hint hint* :D The link is in my siggy...
Soooo there has been a lot going on the past week or so. Last week on Monday we went to a breastfeeding seminar which was very interesting. Then on Wednesday, to the baby-preparation course, which was also pretty cool. That was held at the birthing centre we were registered and at the end, I asked the midwife, whether having the gestational diabetes would influence my being able to give birth there ... sadly, it does and I no longer can give birth there. So I promptly started researching clinics - the first one that both of us liked was where we visited the breastfeeding seminar last Monday (they are certified as baby-friendly and have a fantastic policy on breastfeeding, 24-h rooming in with the baby etc. etc.). Also, I promptly stated my desire to have a Doula at the birth supporting me / us. So the hunt for the doula began. I found a few that I contacted and tonight we are meeting one and on the weekend (Saturday + Sunday) another two. At least I can now be relieved that I will have a Doula and don't have to worry about not finding one.
Then on Monday I was at various appointments. First, for the gestational diabetes - we agreed to up my dosage at night to 8IE (maybe 10) and that I would send her the readings for Monday and Tuesday (and not just 4 times a day, but 7 - fasting, before eating and after eating 3x a day) ... did that and this morning she told me to up my night dose to 12IE and to inject 4IE in the morning too....
Monday afternoon I was at the birthing centre we had been registered at and wanted to know if they would still carry out the "after-birth-care" now that I wasn't giving birth there any more. They said they would and would let me know who would come out to me after team discussions today. So I was relieved.
In the evening on Monday we then went to the hospital we had listened to the breastfeeding seminar at (info evening) and feel pretty comfortable that that is where we will register at for the birth. So next week I will be ringing to get an appointment for the registration. Also, with gestational diabetes, I won't be able to come straight home again, as baby P. will need monitoring to make sure that his sugar levels are OK (poor little bean)...
This afternoon, the midwife-led facility rang me to tell me that the midwife who would have been coming out to look after me / us will be on her honeymoon during the first month that I need her (it is the practice here for midwives to visit you on a daily basis in the beginning to make sure everything is OK) and would I please look for someone near where I live (even though hard, because I am very late looking for someone now). She confirmed if I couldn't find anyone, that they would somehow do it. ... anyway, long story short, I managed to find someone with availability and she is coming for a "getting to know you" meeting on September 2nd. Decided I won't look further, don't need the stress - but luckily, I have someone now :)

So ... that is the excitement going on at my end at the moment ... here is my bump-picture from Monday, when I started into the 30th (OMG!!!) week!

Hugs to you sweet ladies and lots and lots of :dust: for the upcoming tries!!! <3 :kiss:
 



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## dovkav123

Unlucky, 5 more days and you'll be rewarded with your little one!
Sandy, it's time for your hubby's transplant! I hope and pray all goes well like always.

I had my 21 week scan yesterday. 
The baby's head was near my belly botton, my tears went down my chin. I was so emotional to hear this. All the measurements head, belly, hips were dating between 21w1d-21w4days. We saw black spots in the tummy and in the bladder, it means liquid is there, digestive system is developed nicely. His heart was beating strong 140bpm and I could see 3 beautiful heart valves. We will not find out the gender. EED It's on the 26th of December on my birthday!!!! I am so happy, excited and blessed that little 8w2day(last u/s) peanut grew in a such a big and healthy pomegranate. 
In the hospital I was told that no much craziness going on in the end of the year, more births are in Summer.

Varicose vein on my left leg and overall pain in my legs are the only comlaints I have so far. I have mild Gingivitis also, after prof. teeth cleaning the bleeding has stopped. Dr. prescribed compression stockings to manage my bulging blood vessel on my left leg. Have you used them, do you know if somebody else wore them?
My mom has varicose veins and so do I. It's genetic, I have week veins, and during pregnancy they showing up. It's not big deal. It's only a cosmetic problem, my varicose vein may dissapear after the delivery, if not there are some options to remove them. The good news is that I do carry lots of genetics from my mom, and I hope I carry her "easy delivery gene" too ( she delivered 3 kids quick and easy, without even pushing, they came out like from the cannon.:happydance:
I realised that pregnancy puts your body on a huge stress and this way you can find out your weak spot in your body. It is a chance that by the time I am 60 I may need to repair my varicose veins and implant my new teeth.


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## bubumaci

Dovkav - that's wonderful news! So happy for you!
I'm surprised they're changing the due date - in cases when IVF is done and the exact date of conception is known, they don't usually change it (some of my scans Baby P. has been behind - right at the beginning - and in the later scans, he was measuring earlier - but the don't adjust the EDD). Still, very exciting that it looks like baby will come around your birthday :)

I'm sorry to hear about your varicose veins. I have heard that they can be quite painful! Let's hope that they do go away after baby is here!
In the first trimester I went and had my teeth cleaned and had my second pregnancy cleaning today. Even though my teeth are OK, I was told to floss more and to also use the mouthwash more...

I have not been wearing them, but I had the compression stockings prescribed for my flight to the US. Really tight ones - so I have had some practice putting them on and taking them off. It is hard work putting them on, but your legs do feel lighter when wearing them and they prevent your legs swelling... I suppose I could have worn them for the rest of the pregnancy, but I wanted to keep on eye on whether or not my legs were really swelling and so far it has been OK - just after looooong bouts of sitting. So so far I haven't been wearing them. Also, you should wear them only when you are up (so not during the night) and after two days, wash them, so that they spring back to the original tighter form. Might be a good idea to get a few pairs so that you are not constantly washing the same pair to wear. They have them in different styles and colours, so you can be quite stylish wearing them (and not look like a frump with only brown ones *grin*). xx


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## LadyLovenox

Hi ladies!! LOVE seeing some of your pregnancies progressing...gives us hope! Had my wtf appointment today and basically:

No real answers as to why it didn't work. She says an "egg issue" again, but it's not a quantity issue, it's a quality issue. Although she expected my perfect blasts to stick. :( 

We will cycle again in Oct.

Microdose Flare Protocol 225 menopur 225 follistim

Endometrial scratch beforehand

Lovenox and prednisolone

Both Estrogen and PIO will be injected during tww

She said MOST patients my age (30), with DOR are able to use their own eggs, sometimes it just takes several tries. She said if it was her, though, after this time, if we don't get a pregnancy, she'd go the DE route. I'm just not ready for it yet. We have 6 fresh cycles in our shared risk, and this will only ("only"..haha) be fresh cycle 4, so she can keep on tryin' cause I'm far from giving up! 

Much love to you ALL! It's so nice to read your stories and feel like someone understands, as I watch all of my friends get pregnant the first few months of trying. (UGH!)


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## Unlucky41

Sandy - how are you going to spoil your husband ? glad to hear he is back to normal and good on you being so supportive!!

Bub I lover the bump - 30 weeks you don't have long to go !!! I think the husbands will just have to learn on the job eh ?

Dovkav- looks like your scan went well such a sigh of relief after the 20 weeks scan. You can really start to relax and enjoy the pregnancy !! Hope your veins don't bother you too much.

Ladylove - I agree it is too early for you to consider donor eggs. hopefully this is the miracle cycle but I am sure they can do a few more things for you before you have to consider DE. What is you amh?


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## ashknowsbest

dovkav - Not long now! And on your birthday, how cool! 

Bubu - sorry about the GD. Not long now for you either! 

lady - sorry you didn't have an answer from your doctor. I know how you feel about going the DE route. I'm not ready yet either but I do want a family sooner rather than later. Good luck with your October cycle!


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## ashknowsbest

sandy - everything is going pretty good. I had a bunch of problems gtting my medication and keeping both of my clinics in sync but we're finally in the last phase and I couldn't be happier. I just started my PIO last night and it's not that bad. I remember it from my 3 IVF cycles so it's not a big deal. Transfer in 4 days! 

Hope you and DH are doing well and taking some time to spend together before his transplant.


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## africaqueen

Sandy- Hope dh is ok and im sorry you didnt get any answers as such at your wtf appt. I always find those darn things to be a let down! good luck x

Lady- I get what u mean about not wanting to 'give up' with your own eggs but i have made the decision that 4 cycles is plenty with my own eggs so if this next cycle fails( god forbid) it will be a DE cycle for sure. Can't take anymore heartbreak knowing what a slim chance i have but determined to give it one last shot x

Dov and Bubu- Glad all going well with your pregnancies and cant wait to share my stories too! pma pma! haha x

Ash- Ooh only 3 sleeps till transfer now isnt it?! good luck x

Jo- Omg you are gonna be a mother soon!! eeeek! so excited for you and cannot believe how fast time has gone!! x

Hi to all the gang x

AFM- Not had the best few days. Been very emotional and tbh dh has been crap support once again. I am lucky i have my dad for emotional support at home an u ladies on here. So once again i just have to be the strong one and its tiring but hopefully worth it! fingers crossed xxx


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## LadyLovenox

Unlucky... Thanks!! My Amh is 1.33.... Last afc was 22. They got 17 eggs out of me, 11 embryos but only 3 made it to blast, so the doctor thinks they're not quality eggs they're getting. :( she doesn't act like there's much else they can do that they haven't tried. Sigh

Ash.... I'm sorry we are in the same boat, but I'm glad to have someone who understands. Hopefully your next cycle will be it too!! Are u in the middle of an fet? 

AQ... I hope I didn't come across that using DE is "giving up". It is in No way giving up, and people who go that route have fought harder than anyone! I know the heartache of feeling like your eggs keep failing. Ugh. I will pray that this next cycle is your miracle.... Regardless if the chances... Its absolutely possible!!! I'm sorry about the lack of support from dh.... I think our husbands run out of things to say and are just as frustrated as us, but don't know how to show it as support


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## ashknowsbest

AQ - sorry hubby isn't being very supportive right now. Infertility is hard on everyone. Even our hubbies! Hang in there :hugs:

lady - I'm in the middle of a FET. I go in for transfer on Monday, final scan on Sunday.


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## africaqueen

Lady- No you didnt come across like that all! Going the DE route is the most brave as ladies who end up with DE babies have been to hell an back to get them and all we are giving up on is our own eggs, not our baby dream ;) i hope an pray we both get lucky this time around but at least we know we have plan B ;) x

Ash- thanks. Just so hard. I do accept men deal with things differently but it is also selfish to not think about the other side and that annoys me but hey i am a tough cookie an i will get thru, hopefully even stronger and as a MOTHER ;) please god! x

Hi to all the gang x

Bugs- How are you doing? x

MrsE- dont know if u are reading but thinking of you x

AFM- Feel a lot calmer today thankfully. Went for a coffee on my own before work an had a half hour time out which i needed. I am going to do it more often. I need to put myself first during this cycle. I always think of others needs too much an need to start putting myself first and being kind to myself during this cycle :) xxx


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## bubumaci

*Lady* hmmm - I don't think that your doctor need be pushing you towards DE so soon. I was under the impression that DOR just means that you don't have that many ova in your ovaries, but not, that their quality is poor. Your response to the stims doesn't to me seem to indicate poor ovarian reserve at all!
In our experience, it doesn't necessarily mean that the egg quality is poor if the fertilised embryo doesn't develop to a blast (we can count on both hands how many of ours did!!). It can be the sperm, it can be the egg or it can just be that the fused egg is chromosomally abnormal and won't develop better. 
The plan for October sounds good (also with the endo scratch, as well as the oestrogen + progesterone support during the TWW) and all fingers and toes will be crossed for you! :hugs2::dust::dust::dust:
I think you will have to decide for yourselves at which point you want to stop trying with your own eggs and going for DE - but at this point, if you are still OK with stimming and ER and everything, then I think it is a bit early :kiss:

*Sarah* I'm sorry you were so down ... this awfully rocky journey can get even the strongest person down at times! We do all bounce back, but it is so very trying. And you _do_ need to care for yourself and look after yourself! Have you looked into the MP3s I suggested for IVF (hypnotherapy)? It forces you to take that half hour for yourself, closing doors, turning off phones, making sure you aren't disturbed and really just concentrating on yourself.
Glad, that you're feeling better today :) :hugs2:

*MrsE* Thinking of you, Sweetie! :hug:


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## LadyLovenox

Ash...I am so praying for your FET, for good luck, for God's blessings, and for your journey to be wrapping up!! Hugs!!

AQ...Definitely pamper yourself during this time! Anything that makes you feel good, relaxed, and stress-free! I have recently read a book called "The Power of your Subconscious Mind" by Joseph Murphy, and I could not recommend it more!! It is simply amazing, and it truly helps to turn your mindset around for the positive!! 

Bubumaci...Oh thank you, thank you, thank you! Your message was good for my soul! Sometimes I feel foolish NOT going to DE if they're recommending it, so hearing that someone else thinks I could still be in the game with my own eggs is just so uplifting! I am debating so much right now over whether to take birth control pills before we cycle or not. We have every time, and I just feel like that might be suppressing me...maybe I'd get better quality or more blasts if I didn't start with bcp. My RE is willing to try it, but also says that I'll be in danger of getting a lead follicle without being suppressed first, which would cause my cycle to be cancelled so I'm really worried about that....cycles are costing us about 4 grand each time in meds, so it's a big gamble. I've also read about Estrogen Primed Microdose Flare Protocol, which I want to ask about too. My RE is willing to try whatever I want, but I sort of hate that too, because I feel like the decisions are all on my shoulders, and I"m no expert!


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## bubumaci

Lady, that is really frustrating, that they won't advise you / take the lead on how to stim! It is interesting, the different methods! I didn't have to take BCP nor did I down-regulate for any of the cycle - it was the aggressive protocol each time (just once I changed doctors at the clinic, trying different combinations and protocols).
If your clinic has and uses an embryoscope, then I would definitely recommend that. Our fertilisation results were always amazingly good (considering DH's sperm, lack thereof / quality of), but the embryo development was not that great ... once using the embryoscope it definitely improved.
I think you need to discuss pros and cons with your RE, get them to advise which protocol would be best - it shouldn't be you telling them, they are the experts ...
Being no expert myself, of course I cannot judge how your eggs are, but I know that the doctor started thinking (being not the youngest any more) that my egg quality might not be that great any more (I did respond well the meds - too well at times, with OHSS). I started taking a high dose of CoQ10 (from NOW, maximum strength, 600mg), Resveratrol (both suggested by my doctor) - both improve cell-regeneration. In parallel, I am taking Zinc; get your vitamin D levels checked and also your thyroid. My thyroid levels were perfect for a healthy woman (at 2,1 or thereabout, sometimes 1,7) - specialists said, that when trying to conceive, a TSH level of around 1 or below is better, so my TSH levels have been artificially adjusted...
So maybe there are a few things you can do, to try and improve things at your end. Taking the supplements for a couple of months might be a good idea?
Anyway, a combination of taking everything, plus the varied stim plans, plus the additional shots + embryoscope ... it took several tries, but we got there (I still can't believe it, despite Pünktchen moving around to let me know he's there) - and I really am praying that Jo, Dovkav and I can bring some good luck to this thread and spread heaps of :dust::dust::dust: ... xxx


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## Unlucky41

Lady - your amh is better than mine and you definitely stim better than I do. Just to give you some hope I only got two eggs in my fifth IVF cycle which lead to my bub inside me in at the moment !!! She is coming out tomorrow hence extremely exited and ofcourse very scare. Hope she pass every test!!!
If you are still keen with trying with your own eggs I think you still have a good chance being so young just need to get the right protocol and some luck!!!

AQ -How are you feeling now ? I agree you need to distract yourself with some pampering during this time. I agree that dh are the worst comforters at times. They just don't know what to say!!:hugs::hugs::hugs:

Ash all the best to 1the transfer hope to hear our good news once I come back from hospital!!

AFM the nurse called and said my operation is tomorrow 2p.m. hence no eating from 8 a.m. how am I going to distract myself all morning!! Excited and thankful. Thanks for all the support ladies over the year!! Wouldn't be the same without this thread!!!


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## bubumaci

..ooohhh... this time tomorrow you will have your LO <3 ... I am so excited for you! If you can, try to sleep as long as possible, to extend the morning :) Then spend time making sure you have everything you need for the hospital. Wander around the house, taking it in - it is the last time it will look and smell the way it is for a long time ... and spend and cherish your last moments with DH as a twosome :)
You probably will need to be at the hospital at least an hour beforehand, right?
Thinking of you, crossing fingers for you and : SO HAPPY FOR YOU!!!
xxxx


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## LadyLovenox

Bubumaci and Unlucky...Thank you both so much for the positive words and encouragement!! Bubumaci...I agree...I totally wish my RE would take the reigns and tell me what's best! I feel like she will suggest this or that, but it's up to me, and I always beat myself up when it fails, like I should have made different decisions. I am on coq10 right now, (600mg as well), I have never heard of reversatrol (sp?), but I will definitely look into it! I am on 75 mg DHEA daily, which I definitely feel helped our last cycle, so I am staying on it. It makes me super greasy (we are talking 2 showers a day, kind of greasy), and I notice more hair in the shower drain but nothing too dramatic. The embryoscope is something I've never heard of, but will DEFINITELY bring up. After googling this, it seems like it could be a huge help. I am so so so happy for your success, and I'm sure you're just ready to hold that little baby in your arms and give a huge sigh of relief that your journey with infertility is over!! 
Unlucky...Thanks so much! I'm sooo glad to hear you had success, with low numbers like mine!! I am so encouraged to hear that with only two eggs, you still got pregnant!! It really does just take one golden egg!! You have to be over the moon right now!!


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## africaqueen

Jo- OMG D day is almost here!! i am so excited for you and would love to see a pic of your miracle if you are able to share with us <3 Wishing you lots of luck and shall be thinking of you tomorrow! x

Ash- Is ET tomorrow?? x

Hi to Andrea, Clare, MrsE and all the gang x

AFM- I am feeling a lot calmer today. I have had a weekend off my healthy life plan an enjoyed maccies an pizza an choc! back on the tons of fruit an veg tomorrow tho to keep my eggies healthy! x

Btw ladies, did u hear somewhere that organic milk is best during stimming as normal milk contains hormones or have i imagined it?! lol xxx


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## bubumaci

Puh, Sarah, I wouldn't know about milk. I don't drink it full stop (have always hated milk and am somewhat lactose intolerant), so I always have Soja Drink or something similar ... But I hadn't heard that about milk before ...


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## africaqueen

Thanks Andrea. I may of imagined it anyway! lol xxx


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## bubumaci

I'm about to trundle off to bed - but I wanted to wish you, *Jo* all the best for your C-Sec (it's morning there), lots of luck, a wonderful meeting with your LO and I look forward to hearing from you and seeing some photos once you're up to it :) :kiss: <3

*Ash* good luck for your transfer :) :kiss:


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## ashknowsbest

unlucky - I hope everything went smoothly for you today! Am thinking about you and your family. Can't wait to see pictures when you get home :happydance:

AQ - Yes transfer is tomorrow. I go in between 1 and 1:30 and the transfer is at 2. I'm looking forward to the transfer but not the drive up to NYC. I went to NYC today for bloodwork u/s and we hit a ton of traffic on the way home .... it was awful! I was surprised too because it's normally not that bad on Sunday. I was also exhausted because I couldn't get to sleep until midnight and then I had to be up by 4:15 am to leave by 5 to be there on time for my 7am monitoring. Crazy crazy day! And as far as milk goes, I always drink organic milk because regardless of if I'm stimming or not for IVF I do not want the hormones that they give the cows to be in my system. But I think it's just a personal choice, not really sure if it really matters for the stimming procress.

bubu - thanks! Will keep you girls updated.


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## dovkav123

Hi ladies,
It's is such an amzing thread, I had chills reading it this morning. You are so wonderful and supportive!:hugs:

ashknowsbest, hope and pray you'll have a smooth transfer today!

Unlucky, you are the luckiest mummy in the world by now. Sending you blessings to you and your family!

africaqueen, If I were you, I would drink only organic milk. I advice everybody: old or young to consume only organic milk products. It suppose to be free of pesticides, antibiotics, hormones. All these nasty stuff may cause anitbiotic resistance, inflammation, autoimmune problems and even cancer. I don't know how honest the companies are in these days but I hope they do their best to reduce the amounts of chemicals.
I beleave that whole milk is better for IVF than a low fat milk. Drink lots of filtered water too!
Wishing you all the best for your journey!:hugs:


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## Sandy83

Ash good luck for transfer today got everything crossed for you :hugs:

Unlucky good luck for your c section can't wait to see photo's :hugs: xx


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## Peachy1584

Ash best of luck today! So excited for you but totally don't envy that tww : ). Everything crossed this is it for you!

Unlucky you are so lucky! Hope everything goes perfectly for you and baby but I know it will! So jealous! :flower:

AQ when you start digging into all that stuff it's a mess. Really you have to be a vegetarian and eat only organic fruits and veggies because it's in the meat you consume as well. I'm not a huge meat eater but I'm bad on the processed foods. I didn't get like this on carrot sticks : ). So I looked at the grocery yesterday just to see and a pound of 93% lean ground beef was $6.99. No wonder I don't buy organic I couldn't afford it : ) . Anyhow I think the bottom line is go ahead and switch the milk if you'd like but I think you're perfectly fine. I've been eating/drinking the crap for years and I'm older than you : ) . This was the only time we transferred on day 3 and the only time we did assisted hatching and the endo scratch. Maybe they helped and maybe not. I think sometimes it's just getting lucky and getting the right one. When I see how much weight you've lost on the ticker it's amazing! This is the heaviest I've ever been during a cycle. This whole process has stressed me out and I've gained weight. Don't beat yourself up over every little thing. You know form the weight loss and the supplements and trying to be positive you've done everything you can on your part. I think you know that too:hugs:


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## ashknowsbest

Transfer went great. Both frozen embryos thawed well and we transferred both. They were graded 4BB and 3BB. Hoping that's good enough to get us pregnant! Official test date is Sept 3rd. I will probably test on the 2nd but not sooner than that. I've attached a picture for you girls to see if you're interested! I love pictures!


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## africaqueen

Congrats on being pupo with twins Ash! BEAUTIFUL looking embies! <3 Wishing u lots of luck for OTD and pray its a BFP for you x

Any news on Jo an Baby?? x

Hi everyone. Not much to report from me. I am just waiting for script to be sent to pharmacy an then i can arrange drug delivery and then its just a case of waiting for AF! always waiting for something arent we?! lolxxx


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## Razcox

Hi guys! Hoping I can join your group for a bit of support as we have just had our 3rd failed attempt at IVF with a frosty. Due to a genetic issue I have PGD so I know it was a genetically healthy embie but it just didn't stick.

I have one more go on the NHS and then after that it will be back to TTC naturally and risking more MC's. I have been on the site for about 5 1/2 years now, had 4 MC's and 2 chemicals but still trying for that miracle. It can be really hard to see people get what you want while you because a smaller and smaller statistic . .


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## bubumaci

Hi Razcox :howdy:
I am so sorry you have had to make your way here - but you have found a group of fantastic, supportive women!!
Sorry that I have to ask, but what is PGD? The way you describe it, it sounds like a condition - or do you mean the pre-implantation diagnostic testing they do?

Definitely know how you feel about seeing people left right and centre getting what you want, while it just doesn't seem to want to work. To be honest, I was in a group (still am in the group and we are all friends on Facebook), when we all started down the IVF/ICSI journey back in Spring 2012... there were so many women, for whom the first try was success or even the second or third - and there I was, with try after try after try ... and I even got jealous of these sweet friends, because they didn't have to go through as much as we did to get their miracles.
It is hard, so very hard and it costs so much energy to stand up and try again.
Do you mind my asking, how many IVF tries you have actually had (so stimming and egg-retrieval etc.) if this third try was a FET? Does the NHS count the FETs as if they were fresh tries?

Have you been given a reason for your miscarriages (I am so sorry to hear about that!!!) - do you think that perhaps hormonal supplements (eg. progesterone) might be able to help?

Have everything crossed for you Sweetie! :hugs:


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## Razcox

Hiya! To answer your questions:


Sorry that I have to ask, but what is PGD? The way you describe it, it sounds like a condition - or do you mean the pre-implantation diagnostic testing they do? 

I mean pre-implantation genetic diagnostis. I have a Balanced Robertsonian Translocation 13 & 14.

Do you mind my asking, how many IVF tries you have actually had (so stimming and egg-retrieval etc.) if this third try was a FET? Does the NHS count the FETs as if they were fresh tries? 

I have had 2 full cycles of ICSI with PDG, the second cycle gave me 3 normal embryos 1 AA and 1B something, the A was put back and the B frozen. The last one wasn't good enough for freezing. So I have just had a FET as they wouldn't let me do a fresh cycle with one frozen. This was still paid for by the NHS as it came under the heading of cycle 2. I have one full cycle of ICSI with PDG left on the NHS plus any frozen ones i may get from that cycle. Before we do this though I want to look at other tests first to make sure there isn't something going on to prevent implantation or would cause me to MC again.

Have you been given a reason for your miscarriages (I am so sorry to hear about that!!!) - do you think that perhaps hormonal supplements (eg. progesterone) might be able to help? 

They blame then all on the chromosome issue I have but as my Mum and Auntie both have the same translocation and two kids a piece I am not convinced so I am looking at further testing privately.


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## bubumaci

Hmmm .. is there any particular reason why the clinic is going to ICSI instead of IVF? Since you have been able to get pregnant naturally (even though :cry: those pregnancies have not been sustained), it would seem that there is no problem with your partner's sperm?

Your instincts sound about right (incidentally, my clinic did a trial with one lady, who had had a child a very long time ago, but kept miscarrying while trying to conceive her second. When testing her genetically, they found a chromosomal defect - I think 7 and 13. So they did a stimulated cycle with IVF and also did PID / PGD. They managed to have 5 blastocysts that were tested and interestingly enough, the first had two chromosome abnormalities, 7 and a different one. The second had three chromosome abnormalities; 13 and two others. The third and fourth had abnormalities all across the board - but neither 7 nor 13 were impacted. The fifth was a perfect blast that was transferred and ended up becoming her baby). Our doctor showed us this to demonstrate, that even if you have no chromosome abnormalities / have them - the combination of male and female DNA when making the baby can still have an entirely different outcome... (and also why your Mum and Auntie have been able to have two children each).

It may well be that your genetic issue is contributing, but I wouldn't be entirely convinced that it is the only contributor and think that your idea to have other testing done is a very good idea. It doesn't seem to be an implantation issue, as you have been pregnant a few times. It doesn't seem to be a sperm issue, as fertilisation doesn't seem to be a problem. You know of your genetic translocation (I just read up on it and it does seem to be a major contributor to miscarriages) so it does make sense to have IVF done with the genetic testing ...
Unfortunately, as so many of us have experienced, even having a perfect specimen transferred does not guarantee that a baby will be the outcome - but with the PID, your chances should be quite good.

What other tests are you thinking of having done?

xxx


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## africaqueen

Welcome Raz and i am so sorry for your losses and failed cycles :(
So did you have 1 fresh and 2 FET? i hope your next cycle works! it is awful and i know what you mean about watching everyone else get what you want as i have also been on this forum in ttc threads for 5yrs and it sometimes feels i will never be in a due date thread but i try to remain hopeful, although hard at times x

Jo- Hope all went well? update us when u can x

Ash- Not long until OTD now! everything crossed for you x

MrsE- Think of you often and hope your ok as can be x

Heather- How are you? hope you are ok. Not seen u around here for a while x

Clare- Hows things? x

Hi to Dov, Peachy, Bubu and all the gang x

AFM- I had another melt down before. The nurse from the clinic called to say she had received the viral results via fax from our GP and dh's hep b core is missing and my rubella immunity!!! wtf?! getting sick of this now! so we both have to have yet another blood test tomorrow and she is marking them as urgent for results to be back on Monday. The nurse said seeing as AF is due around the 8th Sep, if the results arent back on Monday it could mean we wont be able to start on my next AF which messes us right up as i have booked 2wks off work starting on Fri and i have no holidays left this side of Xmas... praying we can start. I will be heartbroken if we cant and also very annoyed as i made it very clear what bloods needed doing! I hope things work out. This much stress prior to the cycle is just not fair xxx


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## bubumaci

Oh Sarah, how unbelievably annoying! I am so sorry - it's unbelievable that these blood test results keep going missing - never heard of anything so incompetent! I sincerely hope that this urgent testing works and you can get started now in September! :kiss:


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## africaqueen

Andrea, i know! it almost makes me wonder if its a sign not to bother! :( feeling bit fed up tonight. Hope your ok? xxx


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## ashknowsbest

AQ - sorry they lost the paperwork again! That's so lame. I understand your frustrating as everything went wrong this cycle for me except for the transfer. Even my doctor made me really mad by a comment he made when I spoke to him yesterday about how messed up this cycle has been .... I will tell you girls later but I don't want to write about it right now because I get pretty worked up when I talk about it. :haha: Let me just say I'm happy that I don't have any frosties there because I will NOT be communicating with them at all anymore. Even if I get pregnant, I will be consulting with a doctor over here, a high risk OB or something. 

AFM - I'm fine, just trying to remain patient. I want to test so bad but I'm not going to ... it's way too early anyways. No symptoms for me either so I'm hoping that's not a bad sign.


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## africaqueen

Thanks Ash and i really hope whatever that doctor said that your ok? some medical people have no bedside manner at all!! makes me so mad. Don't u go near the pee sticks! waaaay too early! ;) enjoy being pupo xxx


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## Peachy1584

Raz so sorry things haven't gone your way but truly hope they will. This whole thing just isn't fair :hugs:

Ash I'm sorry whatever happened upsets you so much and I hope you never have to deal with them or any other RE because everything works out this time!

AQ I know how frustrating having all the right paperwork/tests can be. Hopefully they get it through their fat heads this time how damn important it is. I'm not very tolerant of incompetence :growlmad:.


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## ashknowsbest

AQ - yeah I'm okay. He pretty much said that he was doing my husband and I a favor allowing up to be remotely monitored .... talk about RUDE! I was pissed but kept a level head and just told him that I was willing to have my embryos shipped to CA but they told me that it would be sooo easy to be remotely monitored. He told me he deals with international patient all of the time and I was thinking to myself ... then how come it's so hard for you to deal with a 3 hour time difference.


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## Sandy83

Morning Ladies

Ash, So sorry your Dr. is being that way but on the positive side your embies are were they should be and hopefully won't have to deal with him again :hugs: Fx'd no symptoms are a good sign. 

AQ, I hope you can still cycle on this AF :hugs: Hope everything starts to run smoothly for you soon

Bubumaci, Dovkav & Peachy hope you all are doing well and bumps are growing nicely :happydance:

Welcome Raz :hi: Sorry to hear about your failed cycles it's so unfair fx'd for your next cycle :hugs:

Unlucky, Know that you will be more than have your hands full but anxiously awaiting photo's :happydance:

MrsE, Thinking of you :hugs: 

Sorry if i missed anyone :hugs:

AFM nothing much going on here, on a fertility side of things apart from a 2 week long period off and on not sure what is going on there happened last month also but never thought anything of it and thought it was a one off. Not sure whether to ring the clinic or not???? :shrug:

Well DH went into hospital on wednesday and will be in for a minimum of 4 weeks! going to be a long 4 weeks missing him already!:cry: He is currently having intense chemo to kill off his immune system and will have the Stem cell transplant next Wednesday 3rd Sept fx'd xx


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## Peachy1584

Sandy I think you should call your clinic. My rule is that if I ever wonder if I should call I should : ). How scary but yet exciting for hubby! It will be so amazing for you both when this works! I hope you have friends/family that can stay with you here and there to ease the loneliness of him being gone even though I know it will never be the same. You are an amazingly strong woman and I pray the next 4 weeks fly by for you :hugs: :flower:


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## ashknowsbest

Sandy - It will be hard without your hubby but the prize at the end will be so worth it! Like peachy said, maybe you have some friends or family that can help ease your loneliness although I know there's nothing like having your husband with you!


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## africaqueen

Sandy- thinking of you and prayers for dh xxx

Hi to all the gang x

AFM- Had a nice 3days off work, back in tomorrow for 7 days straight then 2wks off for treatment! whoop whoop! xxx


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## ashknowsbest

Just tested ... not a FRER and not FMU obviously but BFN.


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## Peachy1584

Ash I can't blame you because I can never hold out either!! I'm a realist and I don't like giving false hope to others so you can believe me when I say that even if it had been a frer and had been fmu it would still be way too early!! You only transfered 5 days ago! Hang in there hon you are definitely not out yet! :hugs:


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## Unlucky41

Our little girl was born 3.275kg on the 25 August through c section. 
She is such a cutie. Her dad can't stop looking at her and he is a natural dad. I have only done one nappy change and the rest are taken care my daddy! 

Breastfeeding is still a challenge for us my nipples are so sore !!

For some reason I can't post the photo. Will work it out hopefully! 

Thanks for thinking about us. It is definately rewarding and worth the five ivf cycles!


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## bubumaci

Congratulations Jo! And what is princess's name? How are you doing? Look forward to seeing a piccie :)
Enjoy settling in together. That's great that Daddy is helping so much! I hope you get the breast feeding down soon xxxx


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## Plex

Was just going to pop in to see how u all are - Congratulations Unlucky!! Cant wait to see a photo of ur lil one :cloud9: xx


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## Unlucky41

Hope this attachment works - little Annabel sleeping in her bassinet ! 

:happydance::happydance: So Happy that we have been blessed with this baby. She is our miracle child and have already brought much happiness into our lives in only 7 days!!!


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## ashknowsbest

unlucky - congratulations on your daughter! She is beautiful and your husband sounds like he's doing an amazing job :D


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## Unlucky41

Thanks Ash really do hope this cycle works for you!!

My husband really loves being a father talking about if we have another one the car is definitely too small! I don't know if I can go through it all again not so fast but then if we want another one we have to do it ASAP!


Sending all my best wishes to everyone :hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:


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## bugs

Congratulations Jo, what a beautiful little girl you must be thrilled xxx

Ash I agree it's still early days don't lose heart yet xxx 

Sarah it's nearly time how exciting, hope you managed to sort out your blood tests xxx

Hope everyone else is well, we are doing just fine getting bigger by the day. I've just booked in for my 4d scan when I'll be 29 weeks so very excited for that. Time is just flying by so quickly, nursery is ready thanks to OH so we are pretty much ready xxxx


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## Sandy83

Congratulations Unlucky, She is just adorable! Sounds like you have a great DH. I'm so happy for the both of you :hugs:

Ash, when is OTD? I'm sorry you got a bfn when you tested but fx'd it was wrong :hugs: 

Bugs, Glad to hear things are going well won't be long now :happydance:

AQ, Any news on the blood tests? When will you know if you can go ahead this cycle? :hugs:

Plex, How you doing? :hugs:

Hope everyone else is doing well :hugs: xx


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## Plex

Alls good ta Sandy - just waiting around for my next cycle to start :D

Hows ur hubby doing and how are you? xx


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## Plex

Ash - was going to ask about when ur OTD is too hun - is it 9 days past transfer? xx


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## Sandy83

Hubby is doing ok, had a bad day on Saturday due to side effects off the Chemo but was better yesterday. Another long day today for his chemo then transplant on Wednesday. I'm ok just keeping myself busy with work, teaching and visiting DH. xx


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## bubumaci

Jo, she is just perfect! <3

Sarah - any news on your incompetent blood suckers?

Sandy, I am sorry that DH had a bad day :( :( I can't even begin to imagine what it must be like, having to go through that awful (life-saving, but awful!) treatment. Glad to hear that he felt better yesterday. The transplant is so close! How long will it be before you know the results of the transplant?
Sending you both strength and love to withstand the coming times (you are both so strong!!!) xoxoxo


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## africaqueen

Jo- HUGE congrats on your beautiful daughter! she is amazing x

Clare- Glad to see all is going so well for you and time is flying isnt it! bet it seems surreal x

MrsE- If your reading, hope your ok x

Ash- Is today OTD? x

Sandy- Ah im sorry your hubby had a rough day. Sending hugs to you both x

Hi to Peachy, Dov, Bubu and all the gang x

AFM- We won't know until tomorrow if we can be fitted in this cycle but hoping we can be. If not its not the end of the world, just means next mth i wont have my holidays and i will have the added stress of getting time off work for appts and scans etc which i dont need xxx


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## ashknowsbest

tomorrow is OTD but I've been testing BFN and just know it didn't work. I contacted CCRM this morning, Jason and I will be having a consult with one of the doctors on September 30 by phone. I wrote a much longer post on how I'm feeling in my journal. If you want to be sad and depressed you can go on over and read it, if not it's okay. Having hard days lately.


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## africaqueen

Oh Ash i am so sorry :( i know we know the score but occasionally ladies have got a BFP a day later so although slim chance, better than none. Hang in there. We are all here for you x


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## Sandy83

AQ, Hope you get good news today that you can go ahead on this cycle :hugs:

Ash, So so sorry we are all hear for you whenever you need us. My heart goes out for you :hugs: xx


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## africaqueen

Hi ladies

Plex- When do you start? x

Sandy- Sending hugs to you an dh. What a hard situation to go through x

Ash- Thinking of you so much x

Hi to all the gang x

AFM- Had a hellish day. Nurse from clinic called and said the wrong Hep B has been faxed AGAIN!!!!!! WTF?!!! and we cant start without that!! so basically too late this cycle to get drugs in time. Complained to GP, he read out his request and it was for that as mine was fine so he is going to complain to the lab tomorrow! either way, leaves it too late for us this time. So another 4wks wait. Nothing compared to the 5yrs we have been trying but means i have 2wks off work for no reason and too late to cancel hols as rotas are based around them(we only have 10 staff) so looks like il have to calm down and accept il have to take some unpaid leave or get signed off work for few days next mth for EC and transfer. I am very angry but had a pounding headache i got so worked up so time to calm a little xxx


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## bugs

Oh Sarah what a nightmare, we had a few issues with bloods with Care it's just so frustrating when you do everything you can and then you have to wait due to someone else's error. Hope it goes quick for you, could you not get signed off sick for the week you have collection and transfer. I had the weekend off after I went to Athens and then went back to work, I found it a very welcome distraction xxx 

Ash I'm so sorry your FET wasn't the one. Hope your ok and looking at your next plan of action xxx 

Hi everyone else xxx


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## ashknowsbest

Wanted to give a little update. I called this morning to see if my official beta results were faxed in and they weren't but I asked the woman at the lab what the beta level was and I'm pretty sure she said it was 5. I've been reading and 5 means inconclusive so you have to go back 2 days later to get another beta .... I know the chances are really low but .... I'm hoping for a miracle right now. Maybe late implanter?


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## africaqueen

Clare- Glad all good with you and yeah i will only be taking 2 days off work following transfer as last 3 cycles took the whole 2ww off and went mental so defo need to carry on as normal as poss and im sure time will pass quicker too? x

Ash- I don't know anything about this as we dont have beta test in UK clinics. Its just a pee stick for us, but i truly hope that you do have a late implanter! it does happen so why not to you? keep us updated x

AFM- Well ladies guess who got AF early today and guess who called the clinic for one last try and seeing as the blood result was there AT LAST, the lovely nurse has fitted us in to start!!! Soooo happy! means majority of my scans etc won't effect work as im off for 2wks from Fri. Got my baseline scan tomorrow(which will be lovely seeing how heavy AF is!) and i collect my meds from clinic and start injecting on Saturday i think! can't believe this is happening! please god let it work. 
Walked in the front door before and stood on something... turned out to be one of my butterfly earrings i wore to my mums funeral and has been missing for mths?! butterflies were mine an my mums 'thing' hoping its a sign! xxx


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## bubumaci

Sarah - unbelievable! I am so very sorry that they have screwed up again! So incompetent. I would blow my top at them, seriously! (Even if it doesn't help, it would let you get off steam *lol*). I am sorry that you have to wait for the next cycle :hugs:

*EDIT* we cross-posted ... I am over the moon that you can get started :happydance:

Ash - certainly if you have 5 then your body has started producing HCG (which is why they want you to have another beta two days later to see the trend - is it going up, is it going up as it should - i.e. confirm that it's not an ectopic but a proper implantation) since normally, there is no HCG (or teeny tiny amount) of HCG in our bodies, unless we are pregnant. My fingers are tightly crossed for you. But I would also like to say : please don't get your hopes up too high :hugs2: two of our tries last year, I had HCG above 5 but under 10 (twice at 6dp5dt) the first, the number started going back down again but I did have to go in for a third beta and the second, the number went up, but stayed under 10 and the third beta confirmed in both cases, that there was no intact pregnancy - that I had chemicals, something was wrong with the embryo which prevented it's implantation.

As tough as it sounds - if that is going to be the case here, I know just how devastating it is - but on the other hand, it also gives the glimmer of hope that things are starting to work, getting one step closer to that ever so much wanted :bfp:

Fingers and toes are crossed for you, Sweetie! :kiss:


----------



## africaqueen

Thanks Andrea! I am over the moon too! need to calm my mind down now after a stressful few days! planning lots of country walks and pub lunches with my dad during my time off work and lazy mornings with the hubby watching movies. Bliss xxx


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## MrsE75

Yay Sarah sorry it's been a roller coaster week for you but all worked out in the end!!

Sorry I've been AWOL just been a very difficult few weeks and still not healed so to speak!

Bugs - can I ask did you go to serum in Athens or another clinic. Would be interested to hear should Cos prob will need to go abroad. 

Good luck Sarah!!!


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## bubumaci

Hi Mrs E :hugs::kiss::hugs2: ... no need to apologise - you take the time you need!!! We are here for you, always!


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## africaqueen

Thanks MrsE and nice to see you back with us. It took me a long, long time to come to terms with our 3rd fresh fail so can imagine how you feel. You are strong and you will overcome this and have a plan B soon for that dream baby x

Well ladies i went for my baseline scan and nurse said all looking good. No cysts etc and 5 nice dormant follicles on each ovary. Start stimms tomorrow. I am on 4 amps per day then introduce cetrotide next week same as last cycle but half the stimms dose as firmly believe 8 amps just nuked my eggs and i think quality over quantity any day now xxx


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## bubumaci

:wohoo: for getting started Sarah! So very excited for you :) :happydance:


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## bugs

Sarah that's great news, so glad you could start as planned. I've got everything crossed for you. 

Yes MrsE it was Serum in Athens, I found the treatment abroad a lot more relaxed maybe a bit too relaxed if you stress easy and like to know every detail but I trusted Penny and after our 1st cycle didn't work and she suggested donor I knew it was the right way to go. Also a donor egg cycle is much easier on the body than a full cycle but just takes a little more to get your head round xxxx


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## Unlucky41

Ash so sorry the results are inconclusive. Can I ask what grade was the blastocyst? 
Do you have any more frozen embryos? Hope you are ok and definately hope that youhave a late implanter.

AQ I am so glad things are starting to move forward for you again! Definitely will be reading up on your progress! 

MrsE75 hope you find some comfort once a new plan is arranged! Sending you heaps of hugs :hugs: :hugs:


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## ashknowsbest

It's an official negative. Starting seeing a psychologist last Thursday and she has also been through infertility which is awesome since she can really understand what's going on with me. 

We have a plan which is also comforting. I scheduled a phone consult with Dr. Surrey over at CCRM. After we talk to him we will probably be doing the one day workup that they do. I read what it involved a couple of days ago but I can't remember right now. It's a bunch of tests, pretty much we'll be there all day! We'll have to travel for that of course but we like traveling so .... should make it a tad bit easier. Unfortunately CCRM is out of network for us but they will reimburse us up to 70% so we're only responsible for 30% which is not bad at all. So ... consult on the 30th of this month. I have to send them all of our records which is a pain because our records consist of a huge pile of paper but ... I'll manage. We figured it we do one more cycle at CCRM they have the highest succuess rates and if that doesn't work we are moving on to adoption. We will still try to have our own biological child but we want to move on with our lives with a child. We feel stuck. Like we can't move out of this chapter of our lives and we're not happy with it. So ... we're taking steps to move on and ultimately get what we want.

I really wanted to feel a baby growing inside of me but the end goal is a baby and a family and I have to keep the end goal in mind and not get completely caught up in the idea of carrying a baby in my belly. 

Anyways, sorry for the longish post. I hope you girls are doing great. I won't be on as frequently as nothing is really happening but I always support you girls in your journeys! 

AQ - so exciting that you finally are getting started! 

bubu - baby is going to be here so soon! 

MrsE - I totally get why you've been AWOL. I just had my 4th transfer fail ... really hard. Take all the time you need :hugs:

unlucky - The blastocyst was a 4BB and 3 BB. I have no more frozen embryos :cry:


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## africaqueen

Ash, i know it was expected but i am sorry you got a official negative. Think we all hold onto that shred of hope until its 100% and why not. Its what gets us through this hard life. I am glad you have a plan B. If this cycle fails, god forbid, we will be taking the DE route in a few years time. I am praying this cycle works and we dont have to wait that long for our baby. x

Hi to all the gang x

AFM- Did my 1st stimms injection before and was bit nervous as been over a year, but its like riding a bike- you never forget do you! lol. So officially back on the rollercoaster and praying for my follies to grow nicely so we get some encouraging news at Wednesdays scan xxx


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## Unlucky41

Ash sending you heaps of:hugs::hugs::hugs:
I totally know I what you feel as with our 5th attempt the doctor did tell us to consider stop trying if it didn't work as we are just wasting money! 

I hope you share our fate and get your bfp with this 5th cycle. Really like your plan to move ahead I think it gives comfort that you don't have to be stuck in this nightmare! 
Let us know when you are going to do your next cycle. 

AQ it is great to hear that things are moving long. Will be following your journey!


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## ashknowsbest

thanks unlucky :hugs: I will definitely let you girls know when we have a date set for our next try. It won't be until next year I know that for sure, probably in February or March.


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## africaqueen

Urgh just done my injection and it really hurt as hit a tough bit of skin :( feeling sorry for myself now so me an dh are going to cosy up later with some chocolates and watch 'Non Stop'. Need some TLC and a relaxed night xxx


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## Peachy1584

Ash I am so sorry. At the same time I am so excited for you to go to CCRM I have heard amazing things about them and if we had had money and time we would have opted for them. Their success rates are the best and even though they're so busy it's worth the wait :hugs:

Sandy I hope all is well with hubby:hugs:

AQ I was so excited to see you were able to start! EEK! 5 on each side sounds great too! I know the shots aren't the funnest but the quality time tonight will be worth it :winkwink:

Unlucky huge congrats on your wonderfully perfect baby! 

Bubu and Dovkav hope all is well with your beans and you aren't too uncomfortable yet!


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## Plex

:hi: all sorry ive been away for a bit

Just popping back to see how u all are :hugs:

AQ - so excited that u have started again, sounds like it was a close call there what with those damn test results. I think waiting is far worse between cycles as u just want to be doing something! xx

Ash - Really sorry about ur FET :( its crap when the treatment doesnt work, its great that you have a way forward for ur next cycle (hoping that one does the trick for you!) 

My husband and I have also discussed adoption, im more resolved to that than him. I agree with you that the goal is what we should focus on. I think it helps with the here and now :hugs: xx

Sandy - I really hope ur hubby is doing better now and that you are well? xx


I really hope everyone else is well?? 

Im bored of waiting!!!!!!!!!!! Seriously BORED :grr: Not much going on with me. I actually ov'd this month - cd40 something i think??? im about 8dpo, secretly hoping that we get a sneaky bfp even though i know thats highly unlikely....A girl can dream though eh? lol xx


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## bugs

Sarah good luck with your scan today, hope there's some very nice looking follies on there xxxx


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## africaqueen

Thanks Clare :)

Well went for my day 5 scan and not great tbh. The left ovary has not responded at all, and only 3 follicles have responded on the right ovary. Sized 12mm, 11.5mm and 10.5mm. Obviously we were aware we would get less follicles than last cycle as my stimms dose is half the dose of last cycle, but bit disappointed that my left ovary has not responded at all... ah well obviously with DOR and poor egg quality the issue is only going to get worse with time and we have 3 decent looking follicles that we hope contain 3 decent eggs ;) gotta stay positive and hope for a miracle as this is the last cycle with my own eggs and we are a long way off affording a DE cycle so please god let this work xxx


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## bubumaci

Sarah - have been thinking about you! That is frustrating, that your left ovary hasn't been responding! But I think the ones on the right sound nice and promising! All fingers and toes crossed, that they carry on growing nicely and that you have great quality eggies inside! :kiss:


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## bubumaci

I am doing well, thank you Peachy! My Doula was just over and gave me a wonderfully relaxing ayurveda massage <3 ... will be having another one on the 13th October :)

Ash - also here : I am so sorry that it was a negative! :( :( ... but I love the plan that you have in place!
I was just wondering about one thing - would you not want to try with donor egg? I totally get where you are coming from - for me, it wasn't the genetics that was so important, but the miracle of experiencing pregnancy, the little miracle of new life growing and being birthed... Or would you want to skip that and move right on to adoption if - god forbid - the CCRM try weren't to work?


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## ashknowsbest

Jason and I decided against donor eggs for right now unless the doctor thinks that it could really work. At this point we have no clue why the embryo is not attaching and donor eggs doesn't guarantee that it will work. Donor egg cycle is about $40,000 and in the US the rate for adoption is about $40,000. My feeling about it is that if we do adoption we're guaranteed a baby at some point, whereas paying 40,000 for a donor egg cycle we're not even guaranteed to get a baby. I think in the end we want to move on with our life. When we adopt we are not going to stop trying for a biological child. We will do both but most likely not with IVF every time. As we are going through the adoption process we are going to do our last cycle at CCRM. If I get pregnant that's awesome and we will have an adopted child and I will be pregnant. We can't wait! I don't know what switched in me but I feel ready for adoption. I feel that I can love any child and if I can give a child a great life that it wouldn't otherwise had that's not a bad deal. Things could be much worse. 

So, yes I've considered donor eggs and if after all of our testing at CCRM the doctor things that's our best chance we will most likely go that route...despite it being a ton of money!


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## Plex

AQ -3 follicle is a fair number hun, hope u recruit more along the way!! The quality should be increased though? With the lower dose of stimms? Do u have a tentative date for retireval yet? xx


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## bubumaci

I see, Ash. Over here, if you choose to go down the route of adoption, you are not allowed to in parallel still be going through any fertility treatments. Plus (did think of it) - I am too old to be able to adopt a baby... You are still young, so I suppose that doesn't really factor in yet :) :)
At the end of the day, I suppose it is wanting to be a parent - and you can be a parent and give a child a good, loving home, without the child being your biological offspring :)
As you know, we went through many many cycles before we got our BFP - and it was basically explained that even if an embryo looks good on the outside, on the inside it may not be healthy - and if all other parameters (hormones, lining etc.) are good - then it is just likely that the embryo couldn't survive : i.e. nature "interferes with science". Our doctor had said to us, that he did believe we would get pregnant, he just couldn't tell us how many tries it would take. ... and he was right!
The only way to really know whether or not the embryo is good, is to have PID done (which we didn't have done, because we never had that many blastocysts develop per cycle) - and otherwise, just keep fingers crossed that the blast transferred is healthy and can continue developing.
As much as science can do and as far as we have come with it (so many of us would not be able to become parents without the miracle of fertility science) - at the end of the day, it is still Mother Nature that holds the key and the outcome in her hands :hugs:


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## africaqueen

Plex- Yeah with my low ovarian reserve i always feel lucky to get any follicles growing tbh so everything is a blessing as long as it results in at least one healthy embie for us to transfer :) no egg collection date as yet. Based on previous cycles i will probs have to stimm for 1 additional day, so i estimate EC to be on Thur/Fri of next week x

AFM- Did my cetrotide jab this morning half asleep and injected it too damn fast which resulted in a big red mark on my tummy and a stinging sensation for half a hr! forgot how much i hate cetrotide! good job for selective memory or i would not be doing this a 4th time lol x


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## bubumaci

Oh, Sarah, with the cetrotide, are you alternating sides from where you inject the FSH? I tried to make sure that I wasn't injecting at a similar site...
So funny, the nurses allowed me to inject the shot after the ER and after the transfer, that I had to have - they almost couldn't watch, because I did it so slowly *lol* - they wouldn't believe me when I said that it really hurts me when injections are done too quickly, because it burns as the fluid goes in. I'm amazed that I seem to be the only person who has this issue (or at least who says something about it) ...


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## africaqueen

Yeah i do alternate sides but each side is still getting a needle each day due to two lots of injections and i seem to have a stinging sensation with the cetrotide everytime i use it :( least its not for long. Only another 3 to go! lol. 
Hows everything with you Andrea? xxx


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## dovkav123

africaqueen, hope and pray for a juicy growing nice eggs!

My pelvic griddle pain getting intense every month and I think It's time to visit physiotherapy. I am not complaining, the pain is managable, but I am afraid to wait till it gets to extreme.


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## africaqueen

Thanks Dov. Sorry to hear you are in discomfort and hope you get some relief soon. Can't believe you are 24wks already! this year is going so fast x


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## bugs

Sarah how are you getting on, are you still on track for egg collection xxx


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## africaqueen

Hi Clare.
So far so good! i had my scan on Monday and the 3 follicles i have were sized 22mm, 21mm and 20.5mm so fantastic growth since last scan and egg collection all booked in for 12 noon tomorrow! cannot believe how fast this cycle has gone! its crazy.
The nurse said my womb lining is perfect at 9.5mm too :)
How are you doing? xxx


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## bugs

Thats great news, Enjoy your anaesthetic tomorrow that was without a doubt my favourite part. 

I'm good thanks a bit tired but all good, I had my 28 week 4d scan on Monday so that made things so much more real. I haven't a clue how to upload pics but I have managed to change my avatar pic xxxx

Hope everyone else is well xxxx


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## bubumaci

Sarah, that is absolutely fantastic news about your follies!! How wonderful! :)
All fingers and toes crossed for your EC tomorrow, will be thinking of you! :) xoxoxo

Clare - what a lovely photo - absolutely beautiful! :) To upload pictures, you need to "go advanced" and then attach :) xoxo


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## bugs

I'll give that a try when I'm on the laptop xxxx


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## africaqueen

Clare- Omg the pic is amazing! sooo clear! does it help make things a bit more 'real'? Yes the sleepy juice is defo the best part! love it! haha. Altho i hate the cannula being put in though...ouch! x

Andrea- Thank you! things seem a lot more promising this time around x

OMG girls i am a nervous wreck tonight! Been ok all day and now the enormity of what's happening tomorrow has hit me like a ton of bricks. This truly is our last cycle as we are broke and cannot afford anymore without a win which is unlikely so pinning every hope an prayer on this being the one that works. So, so scared and excited xxx


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## Peachy1584

AQ that sounds absolutely fantastic!! Have been anxiously awaiting a report from you and it's terrific! Your sleepy juice will take the anxiety away ha! Truly the best of luck to you tomorrow. I will be praying all 3 fertilize for you!

Bugs what a beautiful photo! I've seen some scary ones but yours looks great!

Sandy I hope things with hubby are moving along perfectly:hugs:

Bubu and Dovkav hope babies are perfect!

Ash I can't wait to hear what CCRM had to say. Still jealous you get to go there : )

Hope everyone else is happy and hopeful as well!


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## bubumaci

I'm not the big praying person - but I will be sending up some prayers for you! Did you ever get the IVF companion (from natal hypnotherapy)? If not, perhaps you could put on some soothing music, have some scent that you enjoy ... and lay back, relax, breathe ... breathe a golden light first into your head, then your throat, then down to your lungs, down your spine and finally down to your ovaries - imagine the golden light swirling around your ovaries and your womb, preparing a welcoming home to your coming embryos - deep breaths in through your nose, out of your mouth and let yourself sink into this warm, relaxed state of mind :)
Will be thinking of you and keeping everything crossed!! xoxo


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## bubumaci

Thank you Peachy, yes, Baby P. is doing well, thank you. Had a pre-natal today .. he is weighing around 2 kilos ... and while we were looking at him, opened his mouth into a HUGE yawn (first time I have seen him yawn on the ultrasound) and then swallowed some amniotic fluid (quite a few times) - could see his tongue working away as he was swallowing!
He has hiccups several times a day and - poor mite, must have this from me - has them for several minutes at a time!
But we are doing very well - thank you! Latest updates (as always, every Monday) in my journal (link at the bottom of my siggie) :) xoxo


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## Peachy1584

That's amazing Bubu! So happy for you and don't blame yourself for the hiccups. They all get them and they last for a bit. It's a good thing because that means everything is working : )


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## africaqueen

Peachy- Thank you! how are u doing? x

Andrea- Thank you! i never got the chance to download as this cycle has gone sooo fast! lol. I have been using relaxation techniques though and love your idea x


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## Peachy1584

AQ I am doing ok. So far so good but found out I have gestational diabetes and am trying to figure that out along with yet another cold. I hate being sick. So is this the best cycle you've had so far? Once it starts it just zooms by doesn't it? Did your Dr say he now agrees with your lower stims appraoch? Sorry for interrogating you : )


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## africaqueen

peachy- Tbh my doctor wanted me to have max dose again and i said no. I have done research and women with my problems are not helped with max doses of stimms as it makes the already poor quality eggs worse. It seems the gentle approach gives a few good quality eggs as opposed to several poor quality ones. I said this to him and then he agreed?! i know my own body best i think so regardless of the outcome i am pleased with the decision to do this cycle the way i have :) On previous cycles i have obviously had more follicles due to more drugs but the sizes were never so good at day 10 as these have been. We only have 3 but they are perfect size and we are praying they contain mature healthy eggs and we get our embie :) We did ICSI last cycle(against RE's advice but we wanted to exhaust all avenues) which did turn out to be waste of £1000 as we still only got 1 embie as we have each IVF cycle. So back to straight IVF for us this time around xxx


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## Peachy1584

Yes I remember you saying that about stims frying your eggs but since the follies are so big I had just wondered if he was more on your side now. At the clinic I switched to they always do icsi with our program and I was disappointed because at our other clinic our fertilization was fine and I didn't want to do anything invasive if it was unnecessary so I'm glad you know you don't need it and don't have to use it. The sizes of your follies really are perfect so you obviously made the right choice. Hopefully they don't make you wait to know anything. So glad the cycle timing worked out so you have off to relax.


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## bubumaci

I actually love it when he has hiccups! *feeling evil* ... feels so sweet somehow and I have had people feel my tummy when he does it and they can feel his hiccups from the outside <3 (I just feel sorry for him, when he has 5-6 minute long sessions of the hiccups *lol* - but I know that it is normal and a good sign that his diaphragm and everything is in good working order) :)

I am sorry to hear that you have joined the "gestational diabetes" club ... :( Feel free to ask me anything (I have it too *sniff* - means I can't give birth at the midwife-led facility, but have to go to a hospital, which I really didn't want to have to do *double sniffle*) and I will try to answer. It isn't that bad - have to finger prick 7 times a day (after fasting and before and after each meal) and inject insulin before bedtime (20 units) and in the morning (8 units)... xoxoxo


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## africaqueen

Yes Peachy, the follies seem a good size dont they? all looks promising! pleeease god. 
Hope you're ok and that they keep your diabetes under control xxx


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## bugs

The best of luck today Sarah hope everything goes well xxxx


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## bubumaci

Another hour until your EC ... thinking of you Sweetie!! :hugs::dust::dust::dust:


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## Peachy1584

Bubu I wasn't aware you had GD. It's not fun but I only have to test 4 times a day you poor thing. Dr told me it can get worse as time goes on but your little one is almost here!

AQ I'm not sure about the time difference but I think you may have had your procedure already. Hope everything went perfectly and your resting comfortably! Hubby had better be spoiling you!


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## bubumaci

Yup, Peachy, to begin with, I only had to monitor 4 times a day. Then, as the hormone surges increased, I started having to inject insulin and monitor 7 times a day. I have had to increase the insulin required quite a few times, because the hormone surges increase and my insulin requirements have gone up ... xoxo


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## africaqueen

Well EC went smoothly and each of my follicles contained a egg so we got 3 eggs! so relieved but obviously long way to go yet. Im in bed feeling very sore and tired. Praying that tomorrows call from the embryologist is good news xxx


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## Peachy1584

Oh AQ I am so happy that you got all 3 eggs!! That's the best possible news for today:happydance:. Everything crossed tomorrow brings more amazing news! :flower:


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## bugs

Great news Sarah that's another hurdle over, did I read it right that they also use EEVA now free of charge ??


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## bubumaci

Awww - Sarah, that is just fabulous news! So happy!! Now take care of yourself and rest up (and carry on with your relaxation techniques, imagining your lining welcoming your embryos, golden light in your body, in your ovaries, in your womb ... welcoming, accepting a baby, making a good home for your baby... working out if you have some "fears" and coming to peace with them) ... xoxoxo


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## africaqueen

Thanks ladies.
We are very relieved to of got the 3 eggs, just scared for tomorrows result... trying to be positive and hoping against hope this is our time :)

Clare- Yeah as standard, they now either use EEVA or the Embryoscope. I opted for the latter but they will just use whichever is available on the day. Each machine fits 40 embryos x

Well iv not long woke up and i am soooo sore! i have been lucky up to now and never had pain from any of my collections so not feeling great but all will be worth it if we get our baby xxx


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## bubumaci

The quality of our embabies really improved in the embryoscope! :)
I am sorry to hear that you are so sore! Totally know how you are feeling :hugs:
Now all fingers and toes are crossed for a good fertilisation :kiss:
:dust::dust::dust:


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## Unlucky41

Really happy for you Sarah that is one more egg than I got when we got Annabel!
Praying that they all fertises for you and become beautiful embryos! 

Annabel has a bloated stomach too much gas. She hasn't been sleeping well poor thing. Will be seeing her doctor today hopefully they can help her!


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## africaqueen

Omg ladies i have just woke up and i am so anxious! the call can happen anytime from 8.30- 12.00 and its only just gone 7am here and i am a nervous wreck! also still in a fair bit of pain. Please please let us get a embryo. I am actually terrified of the call! xxx


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## bubumaci

Good Morning!
Been up since about 5:30 (had to pick DH up from the airport this morning). I am sorry that you are still so sore :(
Everything is crossed for you Sweetie! It is so terrifying, the wait, to hear whether anything has fertilised ... and then the wait until the transfer, to see how they are developing ... Wishing you much strength and sending heaps and heaps of :dust::dust::dust: :kiss:


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## africaqueen

Morning Andrea and thank you xx
I have just been the loo an as well as being in pain i am bleeding lightly now :(
Please god let all this of been worth it this time around xxx


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## dovkav123

Hope and pray on your next step of great fertilisation.:flower: 
I hope bleeding will stop today.:hugs:
Did you have a control u/s 2 hours after EC?


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## africaqueen

Thanks Dov.
I don't even know what a control US is so im guessing no? lol xxx


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## africaqueen

OMG we just got the call and we have 2 embies!!!! Ahhhhhhhhhhhhh we are delighted! we only got 3 eggs and we did not have ICSI this time around!! over the moon. We have never had 2 embryo's so such a big deal for us and also i will be having a 3dt and we have always had 2dt so another plus! xxxx


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## bugs

My God they left you hanging with that one. Amazing news, thank god they are open on a Sunday now or you'd have no choice but a 2 day transfer xxx


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## africaqueen

Thanks Clare! the waiting was awful but once i had the good news i was so happy i forgot about the torturous morning! haha. Yeah glad they are open weekends now as really wanted a 3dt xxx


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## bubumaci

Oh Sarah, I am so so very pleased for you! Fabulous news! Really excited (and have a couple of tears pricking my eyes for you) :) :) xoxoxoxo
Now grow, little embies, grow :dust::dust::dust:


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## africaqueen

Ah thank you Andrea! still on cloud nine! xxx


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## Bumpsparkle

That's fantastic news AQ! Really really pleased for you and so glad you stood your ground with the doc about the stims.

Sending you lots of babydust for the transfer x


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## dovkav123

Thanks heaven!
What a great news! You'll be a PUPO! Yayyyy!
Wishing you all the best for your transfer. Your incubator is way better for 2dt! Turned on and ready for it!
Would you transfer two?
I keep praying for you every day.


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## africaqueen

Thank you!
Yes if both embies make it to transfer we will be having both transferred ;) please god let them keep growing nicely and be ready for mummy on Sunday <3 xxx


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## Peachy1584

AQ I am so happy for you!! I held my breath a little getting on here to see your news! Now everything better turn out perfect because I can't take this kind of stress : ) :dance: :dust:


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## africaqueen

Ah thank you! it was a highly stressful morning until the call came! i am breath a sigh of relief now and hopefully relax a little xxx


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## Lisa40

Hi Sarah & Bugs,

I remember you guys from our Liverpool IVF thread a few years ago & just wanted to say that Bugs I'm so so pleased to see that you are expecting & Sarah I'm really chuffed for you to have your little embies & will keep everything crossed for you. 

Best of luck guys :flower:
xxx


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## africaqueen

Ah thank you Lisa! lovely to see you and i cannot believe your LO is almost 2?! where has the time gone!! x

Well ladies, Not long now until our precious embies are transferred! cannot wait until tomorrow, knowing they are with their mother were they should be xxx


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## Lisa40

Oh tell me about it, I can't believe how fast everything flies by! 

I'll be thinking of you tomorrow :hugs:
x


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## bubumaci

Everything will be crossed for you tomorrow, Sweetie! Hope both embies are doing well and that they get comfy in your womb for the long haul! :) :dust::dust::dust:


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## africaqueen

well ladies i am pupo with twins! transfer went very smoothly, the embryologist said our embies are 8 cells each with no fragmentation and excellent quality! Had to sign some papers to say i have been told there is a high chance of twins. OTD is the 4th Oct so let the 2ww madness commence! lol. I am gonna relax and read my magazine and my dad is doing me a roast dinner later so lazy day for me xxx


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## bugs

Amazing news Sarah, Now stay calm and give those embies the best chance to snuggle in xxx


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## bubumaci

Sarah, that is the best news I've had for a while!! Fabulous! 8 cells and no fragmentation on day 3 is incredible, wonderful .. :wohoo: I am so very happy for you, so excited ...
And don't forget to do a daily 30 mins or so of relaxation, breathing in the warm, golden light, to all parts of your body, then concentrating on your womb, on your little embies, sending positive, warm thoughts with the golden light, accepting them into your uterus, breathing in through your nose, out through your mouth, concentrating on your breathing, then on your little ones in your uterus, sending them thoughts of love and welcoming - and if there are any thoughts of fear or nervousness, listening to them, accepting them and then sending them away to be replaced by calmness, relaxed feelings of warmth and love :)

Can't wait for the 4th October :) :kiss: :dust::dust::dust:


----------



## africaqueen

Thank you girls. Feeling very happy this evening indeed! xxx


----------



## Lisa40

Ahhhh congrats & the 4th October is a very lucky day (Islas birthday) I really hope you have great news then :flower:
xx


----------



## bubumaci

Just thought I would write an update from my Journal - copied :)

Good Evening Ladies,

Today, I received the photos from last weekend's photoshoot! :cloud9: We received 103 photos - I have uploaded a selection and am posting the link. Please let me know, if you are able to look at the photos there :)

DH arrived back on Friday, so it has been really lovely having him back home. And to be honest, I am starting to freak out at the concept of Baby P. being here in around 6 weeks! If he shows earlier, than even less than that - and if he is induced on his due date (3rd November), then not much longer than that!! :baby:

Other than that, I am feeling great ... bit like a heffalump, but great nonetheless :) Have been having some Braxton Hicks (always thought they were Baby P. pressing against the side - but read today, that they are probably Braxton Hicks), which are not painful, but at times a little uncomfortable. Nights I tend to wake up every couple of hours to go to the loo - but that's not a big deal. I sleep on my sides, but recently compared myself a bit to a tortoise on its back and struggling to get back on its feet, when I am rolling from one side to the other :D :haha:

Here, the link to the Dropbox, where I have uploaded the selection of photos. We will be doing another photo shoot on the 11th October (on the 10th, we are celebrating our anniversary - last one just the two of us - at the location we got married; eating dinner there and staying the night) and then the next day, we will have another session, this time also with DH :cloud9: - can't imagine a nicer, more special place, to have our maternity shots taken! <3

Babybump Photoshoot 13.09.2014


----------



## Peachy1584

AQ that is the most amazing news! I honestly couldn't be happier for you both! For how long you've waited getting twins would be a remarkable end and beginning to your journey!


----------



## Unlucky41

Oh my this is excellent news! AQ are these the best quality embryos you have had. This is so exciting. Rest up and let yourself be pampered by family!


----------



## africaqueen

Lisa- Aww how lovely! well i hope to be sharing wonderful news on Isla's special day x

Andrea- OMG the photo's are beautiful! <3 cannot wait to have a bump like that x

Peachy- Thank you and yes twins would be double blessing although obviously we will be delighted as long as we get one <3 How are you doing? x

Jo- Yes best quality we have ever had and we have never had 2 before :D x

AFM- Slept so well last night! feel very calm today and will be for rest of this week. Its as i approach OTD next week that i will start to lose it! haha xxx


----------



## dovkav123

AQ, great news! Congrats on being pupo!
Mine kickboxer was grade A-B and we transfer on the day3. Cramping was my first symptom from day one of the transfer and it lasted for a few weeks. 
You did all you could and you are doing the right thing, relaxing.....
Hope and pray for the good news soon!

bubumaci, those are wonderful photos in the nature, you are so blessed, happy enjoy each second, cos you don't have much left. i am so excited for you! You are almost at the finish line!

It's the 4th day now and I am fighting cold. I have no fever, only congestion, headache, running nose. The good thing that I am improving and feeling better every day. My baby doesn't seem to be sick, cos he is more active then ussually. Also I had 3 Braxton Hicks contractions in 12 hours.
I have read a research about viral infections during pregnancy. Pregnant woman's immune system is lowered to prevent from body attacking unorn child. Viruses and bacteria may change the womb's enviroment and the baby may have asthma.:( My hubby had asthma when he was a child and my dad has it.
So please stay away from crowded places and eat plenty vitmins fruits and veggies and drink lots of water!


----------



## africaqueen

Hi ladies, how is everyone doing? x

i have had since late last night(started when i was in bed) like a 'pinching' small stabbing pain in the pelvic area and in the same position, and i had it for most of today in work and again for a hour tonight so i am praying its a good sign. Have not had it with previous cycles. I have had the cramps from the progesterone and pain in my ovaries from the EC but this is different. PLEASE GOD let it be implantation pains! xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

AQ this is very good sign. I think I felt that as well with Annabel. At the time I thought it was in my mind but later got the good news. Hoping this is it for you!


----------



## Peachy1584

AQ I think that sounds very promising! Keep wondering how you're holding up but don't want to nag : ). I always admire those who can hold out and not test. I have no willpower!


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## africaqueen

Thanks Unlucky and Peachy! i am feeling very positive! do i see that correctly Peachy that you got a BFP at 6dp3dt?!! didnt think the embryo completes inplanting until 7dpt? i will prob poas 2 days early but that is only due to dh working weekends and i want him to be here ;) xxx


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## bubumaci

That does sound very promising!!
It is pretty early, usually, the embryo develops to a blastocyst by day 5 after fertilisation, then starts hatching and implanting ... So a couple of days after that, you can get a positive result on the very sensitive tests. 9dpo isn't unheard of ;) .. The only time I POASd was this try and had my bfp at 11 dpo on a non-sensitive digital (which recognises HCG from 25 upwards). 
Everything is crossed for you :dust::dust::dust:


----------



## africaqueen

Thanks Andrea. I am going to test 2 days early so dh is here for the result as he works all weekend. In one way i would be tempted to test early but did that with my first 2 cycles and just upset myself. Would rather stay in the 'pupo bubble' a bit longer? xxx


----------



## bubumaci

Oh, how well I remember that PUPO-bubble ... :) What dpo are you when you are testing? (I have a good feeling for you Sarah!!) xoxoxo

You know, I am still in disbelief (if you can believe that)? ... I have this huge belly, with my little man hiccoughing, rolling around inside - and almost every day, I will say to DH "I'm pregnant!!! ... There is a little baby in here!!!" ... Even though I couldn't give up, somehow, I think I had got to the point of not believing that it would work any more, after so many tries - and here we are, almost 9 months later - and still I can't believe ... does that sound nuts?! lol :)


----------



## africaqueen

Aww hope your feeling is right Andrea ;) i have a good feeling too but like you said, after fails, it is so, so hard to believe it could work and a actual baby could come from this??! lol. I get what you mean totally. I will be in shock for the whole 9mths too! lol. I think even when we hold our babies, we wont believe they are ours <3 At OTD i will be 13dp3dt xxx


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## Peachy1584

AQ yes I did get my first positive 6dp3dt. I had already tested the trigger out and used a frer after holding my pee for as long as I could. However it was very light and I only drove myself crazy because others had seemed even lighter and I tested a bunch of times during that period before otd and always over analyzed and worried myself senseless. You are smart to hold off. I didn't have to wait so long for otd but you don't do betas do you?

Bubu I know exactly what you mean. Everyday I'm like is this finally really going to happen? I'm always worried something will go wrong. Every week further I get I hope it brings some peace but it never does : ). I have my afp test Tuesday at 17 weeks and my anomaly scan 2 weeks later at 19 weeks. So I have set that new date for myself hoping I feel better about everything after that. I still haven't told everyone about him and sometimes I want to scream it from the rooftops but I'm too afraid as of yet. Ahh well.. one day at a time : )

Ash how are you doing? I hope your consult went well I hope I didn't miss you tell I got about it...


----------



## africaqueen

Peachy- Yeah tbh i would not test that early as have read a lot about the line being so faint that women are not sure if its a evap or not an i dont need more stress/upset. lol. I will test a day or 2 early so dh is here for the result as he works away weekends but aside from that i am going to go slightly mad and stay away from the pee sticks ;) xxx


----------



## Plex

AQ - Congratulations on being PUPO!! Did i read earlier that you had 3 eggs collected? How did they do fert wise ect? Ive been awo; for a bit and in serious need of a catch up! xx

How is everyone else doing? xx


----------



## MrsE75

Hi ladies I'm currently overseas on business for a month so just nipped on to see how AQ was doing. Congratulations honey all sounds very hopefull for you. Got everything crossed for you. 

I am relying on wifi connections so will pop on when I can!

Hi to everyone else and good luck with impending arrivals! Xxx


----------



## africaqueen

Plex- Thank you! half way through the 2ww now! yes we got 3 eggs and 2 of them fertilised and gave us our 'excellent quality' 8 cell embies to transfer <3 praying for our miracle but i am a wreck! How are u doing? x


MrsE- Thank you for popping into see how im doing! whereabouts are you? hope your ok. I am up the wall. Beyond desperate for OTD to be here but utterly terrified too which im sure u know that feeling all too well :( x


----------



## babydrms

Just poking around and so incredibly happy for you AQ!!! It sounds like your whole cycle went well and I have everything crossed for you. Xo


----------



## africaqueen

Omg, hi Baby!! lovely to see you popping in and thank you so much! yes everything has gone perfectly this cycle. We just pray it results in our baby/babies :)
Can't believe your LO is 18mths old! i dont know where time goes. I feel i have spent a eternity on ttc boards. Lol. Time to move onto a pregnancy forum i think huh? ;) xxx


----------



## africaqueen

Hi ladies, hope everyone is well x

I woke up this morning with achy legs and a slight nausea feeling in my chest and thought 'omg im pregnant'?! its the exact same 'feeling' i had when i was pregnant last time!?! Please god let this be it! i am feeling that it is xxx


----------



## nicijones

Hi africa!!! 
I used to be on liverpool womens page on here and check in every now and again. 
U have been such a huge support to so many ladies on here and your journey has been sooooo long! I truly hope with all my heart that it is your turn :)
It does sound so so Promising. 
Sending an infinite sprinkling of baby dust to you!
Xxxxxxx


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## bubumaci

Liking what I'm reading, Sarah, liking what I'm reading :) :)
:dust::dust::dust:


----------



## africaqueen

Thanks Nici and wow, congrats on your 2nd pregnancy! you must be over the moon x

Andrea- I am feeling very hopeful! ;) x


----------



## nicijones

We were so so shocked and completely over the moon for it to work twice! Did not expect it at all!
Xx


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## dovkav123

AQ,hope and pray for your BFP!
:dust::dust::dust:


----------



## africaqueen

Thanks Dov! how are u doing? x

Well today i have felt spaced out an just odd. I am defo feeling pregnant! its the same feeling i had with my other 2 pregnancies and even tho they were ectopic im sure the preg hormones are just the same?
Now when i was out today, i purchased 2 pregnancy tests and as dh is now going to be working away Thur-Sun i am wondering.... shall i test tomorrow in the hope of seeing a faint BFP?? My OTD is Sat and tomorrow i will be 10dpt3dt so what do i do? i am not a fan of early poas BUT, I have a strong feeling and also i want dh to be here so we can celebrate together before he goes to work? xxx


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## bubumaci

Sarah, I am so over the moon and delighted. I think you should listen to your gut - yes, HCG is the same hormone, just doesn't rise as quickly with an ectopic pregnancy!!
If you are 13dpo tomorrow, I would go for it!! I got my BFP at 11dpo on a DIGI!! Much less sensitive than the FRERs ...
I just can't wait to finally hear good news from you Sweetie! :dust::dust::dust: :kiss:


----------



## africaqueen

Ah thanks honey xx If you tested that early on a digital and got a positive i am gonna test tomorrow as i bought those early detection tests that can be used 4 days before a missed period ;) OMG can't believe im so confident that i am going to test tomorrow!! even if i see 2 lines, i wont believe it after all this time! xxx


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## bubumaci

It was the only time I tested *lol* it was the day of my first Beta (at my clinic they do them at 6dp5dt and 9dp5dt) and DH kept on saying he was concerned about my swollen belly (which came from the OHSS that had flared up again) - so I thought "what the xxxx" and tested *lol* It was kind of incredible, driving to the clinic for my blood test, knowing what I knew and with a huge grin on my face :D ... It was a bittersweet day, because an Aunt (distant) had died and was being buried that day in Budapest. Normally, I would have been there to pay my respects - so while I was driving to the clinic, I had this huge grin on my face - that was then wiped off my face as I thought of my cousin and family going to the funeral and being sad - and then I had tears rolling down my cheeks, wondering where the fairness in the world is, that I am allowed to be so happy, while they are all so sad ....


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## africaqueen

Aww how wonderful! my clinic does not do beta's so it all relies on the pregnancy test! getting excited now! xxx


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## Peachy1584

AQ Omg I am so excited/nervous for you! I truly want this to happen for you! If your clinic doesn't do betas then how do they know things are progressing as they should? Do they just do the hpt and make you wait for 6 week u/s? Eek! I'll have to hop on here when I get up in the morning to see your wonderful news!! Just out of curiosity what does chuff mean? I'm probably stupid but we don't use that word here : )


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## africaqueen

Aww thank you Peachy! Yes i do the hpt on OTD, call them with result and they book me in for a scan 3wks later. Eeeeek. Chuff is anglo-slang for snatch, vagina... lol. Where u hear that? not heard that word for ages! ha x


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## Peachy1584

Omg I had no idea it meant that! On a thread I was on someone said they were chuffed about something. They must not have known what it is either : )


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## captainj1

Haha chuffed in that context (adjective rather than noun) means pleased! Us English confusing everyone!

X
Good luck for tomorrow AQ, keeping everything crossed. Not posted on this thread for a while but been stalking and so hope this is it for you. Xx


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## africaqueen

peachy- haha yes as Captain explained, 'chuffed' means happy ;) x

Captain- Ah thank you! how are things going? x


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## captainj1

Everything going very well for me thanks AQ. Was told to quit ivf in July after 6 failed cycles and told 10% chance if conceiving naturally or via ivf so to save our money. Was given clomid as a consolation - 'it can't hurt' and it worked first month, still early days but scan at 8 weeks all looked on track so keeping hopeful that this might turn out well. 

X will be on tomorrow to hear your news! &#128591;&#128591;&#128591;


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## bubumaci

:wohoo: captain - fantastic news! :) :happydance:

Funny - I thought of "dead-chuffed" right away and didn't even think of the other meaning *lol*


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## nicijones

Eeeeeeeek can't Wait For your news tmw AQ! :)
Xx


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## captainj1

bubumaci said:


> :wohoo: captain - fantastic news! :) :happydance:
> 
> Funny - I thought of "dead-chuffed" right away and didn't even think of the other meaning *lol*

I actually thought about it as 'chuffin' hell' at first when I read the question! AQ you obviously have foofs on the brain :haha:


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## LadyLovenox

AQ ... I am soooo beyond excited for you!!! I have been reading along daily, but just haven't posted in awhile. I will be anxiously awaiting the good news tomorrow!!! You deserve every bit of happiness!!! Please keep us updated!!! Xoxox


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## africaqueen

Aww thanks for all support ladies <3 means the world an dont know how i would of got thru all this without you an hope to god i have happy news to share tomorrow! x

Captain- LMAO! just rem as kids we called our lady bits a 'chuff'! hahaha. x


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## Unlucky41

AQ - just want to say I am so happy you feel this way and definitely looking out for your good news tomorrow. :hugs::hugs:

Bub not long now - be prepared for sore breast and sleepless nights not sure if you already have that now! It is all worth it but boy it will be hard hard work!!


----------



## LadyLovenox

AQ.... Sending up a special prayer for you tonight from Chambersburg Pennsylvania . May this be the close of one difficult chapter, and the beginning of the best one yet. We are all rooting for you!! It's in God's hands, and I have no doubt that the best is yet to come!! Much love!!


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## Sandy83

Morning Ladies

Sorry I've been MIA for a while been putting all my energy into making sure DH is doing well. 

AQ, I've got everything crossed for you today will be looking forward to see your post as symptons sounds so promising! :happydance:

Bubumaci & dovkav not long for you both now look forward to hearing about your news and seeing lots of pictures

Unlucky, How you getting on have you got any recent pictures?

Captain, your story gives us all hope that when you think there is no hope left miracles can happen :hugs:

Plex, Ash and anyone else how you doing?

AFM, nothing new on the TTC front yet but DH has had his Stem cell transplant and is at day 28 and looking good so far :happydance: fx'd it continues to go smoothly! xx


----------



## bubumaci

Jo, you really need to change your status ;) ;) ... well, definitely can't remember the last time I had a good night's sleep (since I wake up every other hour or so to relieve my bladder) and once DH is up in the morning, I am wide awake. But that is OK - somehow, I believe it is just nature getting my body ready for the sleepless nights once Baby P. is here :)

Sandy ... so so glad to read that everything is going well with DH! xoxoxo

Sarah, I keep checking on here to read an update from you (even though I know I am an hour ahead) ... :dust::dust::dust:


----------



## bugs

AQ absolutely praying you got good news today can't believe how quick your test day has come round. 

Bubu I'm with you on the sleepless nights and I've caught a cold which is hard work but I'm managing on hot lemon and manuka honey by the gallon. All ok with us we had a little scare at the weekend baby had become very lazy but not sure if it was because I was sick so I went to get checked out and everything is fine but baby is measuring on the large side. I am being tested for GD tomorrow so should know more then xxxx


----------



## bubumaci

Oooh, Clare, I hope you feel better soon! The babies do have quieter days, I usually associate them with their growth spurts - and after that, they are back to being nice and active. Baby P. has been mid to lower percentile for the past couple of months, so the doctor thinks he just won't be such a big baby. Yesterday's appointment put him at around 2.400g and 42 cms (based on the length of his femur). So I am very grateful that the GD has at least not had any effect on his size!

SARAH.... are you up yet, have you tested yet??? ... Fingers are crossed so tightly, I want to be able to uncross them again ;) :kiss:


----------



## africaqueen

Well i tested and... there is a 2nd line!!!!! it is very faint but pink and came up within 2 mins so even tho its faint a line is a line right??!! i am going to test again tomorrow morning but i think this must be a early bfp?? there would be no 2nd pink line there if i had no hcg in my system would there?? Ahhhhhh xxx


Sorry for no personals, will post properly tonight after work xxx


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## nicijones

Omg that is amazing news hunni! Absolutely amazing! Ur eggo is preggo!!!!!!!!!!!
Wahoooooooo!!! So happy for u!
Xxx


----------



## nicijones

Can u post pic of ur test??
Xxx


----------



## bugs

Amazing news Sarah, get a digital test that way there's no worrying about lines. It's still early days so a faint line is defo all you need. If you wanted to do bloods Pall Mall medical in Liverpool will do them for around £80 expensive but it gives you an answer so excited for you xxxx


----------



## bubumaci

:wohoo: ... yup - there would NOT be a second line without HCG ... I am so thrilled for you Honey! So excited ... definitely a BFP :wohoo: :happydance: :dance:
And how dark or light the line is is irrelevant! The test is not quantity but qualitative and it is there! :kiss:


----------



## africaqueen

Thanks ladies! still not allowing myself to get too excited until i see a stronger line but its looking promising!! :D 
Il try and post the pic later but its crap quality as my phone's camera is rubbish! lol. Im off to work now so il pop back on tonight. Sooooo excited!! xxx


----------



## Peachy1584

AQ :happydance::wohoo::dance: I AM SO EXCITED FOR YOU!!


----------



## captainj1

Congratulations AQ! Fab news xxx


----------



## Sandy83

Great news AQ look forward to hearing more :happydance: xx


----------



## Sharkey

Hello,

Hope you dont mind me posting on this thread!

Just wanted to pop on here to wish AQ a massive congratulations on that 2nd line you had this morning!!! Im so over the moon for you at this time :happydance: & emotional for you :cry: Have been stalking this thread a while now keeping up with what the LWH women have been up to.... Finally AQ this Is your time & Im absolutely thrilled for you & all the girls on this thread that have had their BFP!!! Will keep stalking xxx

Bugs, not long now & you will have your little one In your arms.... Amazing!! xxx

MrsE, hope all Is well with you? Keeping everything crossed for you when you decided to another cycle, your time will come, just believe xxx

Wishing you all the very best on this thread :kiss: xx


----------



## nicijones

Can't wait to see ur pic AQ! :) 
Xx


----------



## africaqueen

Thanks ladies x

Sharkey- Lovely to see you! thank u! :) i am cautiously happy but really want to see a stronger line an then il feel better x

As regards sharing a pic of the faint positive, there is no point as the line is faint and my camera is crap so u can barely see anything! lol. I will do a pic with my proper camera when the line gets darker, god willing xxx


----------



## nicijones

Am sure ur line be Darker tmw! Are u using frer? They are the best for showing progression :) 
Xx


----------



## africaqueen

Nici- No im just using home bargain cheapies! lol. I have a clearblue digital for OTD though :) xxx


----------



## Peachy1584

AQ if you are using cheapie then that's why it's faint! Do you call the clinic tomorrow?


----------



## nicijones

I hardly got a line on cheapy ones even tho I had dark lines on frer! Defo the reason why it's faint! 
Can't wait to hear about tmws! 
Xx


----------



## africaqueen

Peachy- No, OTD is Saturday so we call the clinic then with result and they book us in for a scan 3wks later all being well x

Nici- Yeah i just got the cheapies to play around with an see whats what before using the 'official' test on Sat. Could be such a faint line cos they are cheap an cos im testing early x


----------



## LadyLovenox

Yaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!! This is it, this is it, this is IT!!!! Happy dance!!!!!! I've never even met you and I wanna give you a huge hug!!!


----------



## Unlucky41

Oh my this is great news AQ !! It is all happening. Looking forward to seeing the two dark lines. Really happy to read this. 

Annabel going through I rough patch with bad colic. Hoping this nightmare will end in another six weeks time!


----------



## africaqueen

This mornings test on a cheapie xxx

https://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad257/habeeb80/WP_20141002_002.jpg


----------



## nicijones

Gaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Oh AQ that is such a beautiful sight!!!!!! U ARE PREGNANT!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Am over the moon for u hunni I really am! Can't stop smiling! 
Xxx


----------



## nicijones

Get a frer if ur out and about today. The Line on that will be amazeballs! :)
Xx


----------



## bubumaci

That is clear as night and day!!! :wohoo: definitely a beautiful :bfp: I am over the moon for you :dance:


----------



## africaqueen

Thanks girls! i am in complete shock tbh and so is dh! <3 xxx


----------



## LadyLovenox

This made my morning!!!! I logged on before work just to see if there was a pic of that beautiful Bfp!!!! Yayyyyy!!!!!!


----------



## Blythe

AQ - i just wanted to say how lovely it is to see you are pregnant. I have been on these threads a while and it is just so wonderful to see a LTTTC who has been through so much get their BFP. :flower:

Did you have less meds this cycle? i am thinking that high dosages of meds can sometimes compromise egg quality so i am really interested in others views on this.


----------



## africaqueen

Thank you blythe and yes i had less meds. 
Last cycle i did max dose stimms and we did get 7 eggs but only one was good enough to fertilise with ICSI and that embie was graded average.
This cycle i insisted on half the dose of last time and we ended up getting 3 eggs, of which 2 fertilised and were classed as excellent quality at day 3 when the 2 were transferred. Defo quality over quantity! Good luck xxx


----------



## Peachy1584

AQ I know you said you and hubby are in shock but how about your Dad? I know he's your biggest supporter and wants this for you more than anything. He must be so excited!


----------



## africaqueen

Peachy- Yes my dad has been wonderful support! he is very happy but also cautious until a stronger BFP on OTD which i understand as i feel the same. I wont count my chickens until they have hatched altho i am overjoyed <3 xxx


----------



## Unlucky41

:happydance: congrats AQ so happy for you


----------



## nicijones

Loving your new ticker AQ! :)
Xx


----------



## bubumaci

:wohoo: we have a new pregnancy ticker :dance:


----------



## africaqueen

Haha. Yes we do! i was super nervous about putting one up but thought, lets enjoy the moments <3
Tested again today and the line is still as faint as yesterdays? should i be worried? It is otd tomorrow... i am going to buy a cb digital today and use that tomorrow but im scared of it saying 'not pregnant' cos of the faint lines on the cheapies?? xxx


----------



## bubumaci

You are much braver than I am ... I think I changed my status and made a ticker a couple of weeks later ;)

No, I would not be worried. These lines do not measure quantity, they just measure the presence of HCG. That CB digital will be screaming "PREGNANT" at you tomorrow :) :kiss:


----------



## africaqueen

Ah i hope so! thanks for putting my mind at rest Andrea. Just terrified of something happening after waiting so long for this joyful news xxx


----------



## nicijones

Hey hunni, don't worry at all! Those cheapy tests are rubbish for showing progression. Ur eggo is defo prego and your digi will for sure tell u that tmw! :) 
Xx


----------



## Peachy1584

AQ she's right those cheapies are terrible when it comes to progression. The only ones I've found that work good for that are frer. The cheap ones I bought were still light when my hcg was in the hundreds and my frer was super dark. I think the ticker is great! I still can't even figure out how to use one : )


----------



## Peachy1584

Bubu I noticed your ticker went up to the last one! Yay he's almost here now!!


----------



## africaqueen

Peachy, go to thebump.com and make a ticker, then copy the bb code and go to edit signature on here, then paste and its done ;) 

Thanks for reassurance ladies. I bought a CB digital before. It will show as pregnant even though my cheapie test lines are faint wont it? im scared. lol xxx


----------



## Peachy1584

AQ yes it'll show. Those cheapies really are cheap for a reason. You'd think your clinic could at least give you a good specific test for otd. It's not like they can't afford it : ). If I were you I wouldn't worry about that I'd be worried about how to get through the 3 whole weeks you have to wait! I am terrible at waiting : )


----------



## nicijones

Your digi will say PREGNANT!!
Can't Wait to see pic of it!! :)
Xxx


----------



## LadyLovenox

AQ..... A friend of mine who is about six months pregnant... Took an frer when she was 12dpo and got her Bfp. She was ecstatic... The line got a little darker on 13dpo on frer... Then 14dpo it was a little lighter on frer than 13dpo was. She called me crying and panicking, saying she just knew it was going to be another chemical. Well.... Her first beta was 208! And doubled beautifully.... The doctor told her if the darkness was accurate, they wouldn't have to worry about betas rising, they could just watch tests darkening. Don't worry!!


----------



## Hopefulx2

Hey Africa
I followed yoi for the last two years... Three failed Ivfs and I cannot believe what I am reading
I am thrilled beyond belief .. I also feel a bit odd as I had given up and I just popped on here, and here you are with your miracle story...
Beyond happy for you xx did you do anything differently can I ask?! Xx


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## wrightywales

AQ congrats hun :) best news I've heard all day xx


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## bugs

Sarah I am just so delighted for you (saw the pic). If anything is true this thread has shown it may take many attempts but if you persevere and know your own body and what will work for you you will get there. I'd like to say the next part is easy but I found the wait for my scan even harder than the 2ww but probably coz I had some bleeding. Fingers crossed for a very happy and healthy 8 months eeeekkk xxxx


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## africaqueen

Thanks everyone <3
Clare- Yes i can imagine this 3wk wait is gonna be a nightmare! lol. I have decided to do a cb digital next Sat an the Sat after to see the wks go up as a bit of comfort seeing as we dont do betas and its a lot cheaper doing that than paying for bloods. 
Called the clinic an told them im pregnant which was utterly surreal! they have booked me in for my 1st scan for 23rd of this mth so il be 6wk5d by then. Time is gonna drag! lol. Over the moon and in complete happy shock xxx

https://i941.photobucket.com/albums/ad257/habeeb80/WP_20141004_001.jpg


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## nicijones

Did u do your digital hunni? Xxx


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## nicijones

Oooops cross post! 
HUGE CONGRATULATIONS! &#9829;
its so lovely to see the words! 
So happy for u!
Xxx


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## africaqueen

Thanks hun! i am over the moon!! going out for a chinese and a j20 tonight to celebrate! haha. My scan is at 6wk5d. Can u see anything at that stage and can u buy a pic?? xxx


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## Lisa40

Omg omg omg omg omg omg omg yeayyyyyy!

I am actually crying here, so so happy for you!

:dust: 
Xxxx


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## africaqueen

Ah thank you so much Lisa xxx


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## nicijones

Yeah u will Defo see ur beautiful bean at 6+5 and more than likely a heartbeat. Pics are 3 quid from what I can remember? 
Can't wait for that update! :)
Xxx


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## africaqueen

Oooh getting excited! will buy a few pics as want to give my dad one too <3 xxx


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## bubumaci

There it is :happydance: ... I am so over the moon for you! We have visitors, but I specially logged on to see that picture we have waited for for so long!

I can tell you that at 6w2d we saw the blob pulsating and could see the heartbeat of 118bpm <3 (piccie attached) and that is when I was released from the the clinic and started going to my gynaecologist ... You should definitely be seeing the HB at 6w5d :kiss:
 



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## bugs

Great stuff although I wouldn't recommend re testing with CB digitals coz if they don't move up you'll worry for nothing. Enjoy it I think that's why they brought them tests out to make money coz they're not cheap and they know we'll keep testing to see that 3+. That's just my personal advice xxx


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## africaqueen

Thanks Andrea- cute lil pic! can't wait to have our own pic now <3 x

Clare- My dad said the exact same thing before! lol. I suppose i would just be torturing myself needlessly so for 'reassurance' i think il just poas with a cheapie every week instead x


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## captainj1

I totally agree on the digis! I got 2-3 on the day my blood hcg was 7000...they are rubbish at getting to the +3 weeks, save yourself the worry hon xxx


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## LadyLovenox

AQ.... I'm starting my stims in 2 weeks for ivf cycle 4 (I'm on bcp now)... Can I be nosy and ask what your dosage of stims was? I know you said you cut it in half... But I'm not sure what your original dose was. Also... Did you have cramping in your tww? I always have cramps in the tww after ivf, and I always figure that's my sign that it didn't work. :(


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## Hopefulx2

Captain... I can't believe it ! Clomid?!! I debated that after 3 fails now
What made you do that?


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## africaqueen

Lady- I was on max dose last cycle which was 8 amps (75miu each amp) this cycle was 4 amps. It was a gamble with me having diminished ovarian reserve but its payed off thank god! Yes i still had mild cramps during my 2ww with this cycle as i did with all the others. This time round i had little 'swirly scratchy' sensations too though :)
Best of luck with your 4th cycle xxx


----------



## captainj1

Hopefulx2 said:


> Captain... I can't believe it ! Clomid?!! I debated that after 3 fails now
> What made you do that?

I know, still can't quite believe it myself and constantly expecting something to go wrong...

I've always had regular cycles so never been offered clomid before, but my consultant said that as well as triggering ovulation there was some evidence that it helped with egg maturity, and that it couldn't hurt to try it. This was immediately after telling me he thought I had a 10% chance of conceiving either through ivf or naturally, so to not bother with any more ivf. I took it on cd 2-6, 50mg each day, and it amazingly worked first cycle. I also took dhea and coq10, based on my own research.

Since then my consultant told me that he has prescribed it to other women when they are in between ivf cycles and has seen it work for others too.

Good luck xx


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## Plex

Oh my!!! 

So excited for you both - Captain / AQ !!!!! :happydance: 

Best news Ive heard all year! :hugs: U girls so deserve this! xxxx


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## africaqueen

Thanks Plex! how u doing? x

AFM- Got shooting pain in my nipples, metallic taste in mouth, mild cramping and complete exhaustion. LOVIN it! ha xxx


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## bubumaci

:wohoo:


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## Bumpsparkle

AQ - So so pleased for you!! Been crossing everything for you and you totally deserve this after going through so much. You've supported so many on here and it's really lovely to see such positive news!

Thanks for starting the Jan 2013 thread as it provided such a lifeline through my first ivf cycle.

Will be stalking to see how many bundles of joy are snuggled in at your scan x x


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## Plex

AQ - lolol never thought u'd be saying yay for shooting pains in ur nipples did u? :haha: ENJOY every second (not that i need to tell u that!) Im now looking forward to seeing ur lovely scan picture :cloud9: 

When will u tell everyone? Will u be waiting until ur 12wk scan to share? I did with my son - very hard when all u want to do is scream it from the rooftops (not that u'd have the energy to do that at the moment anyway lol)

Im good ta - just lounging about waiting :coffee: and managing to fit in a bit more waiting :coffee: while i wait lol

I now have my date for a baseline scan - 29th Oct so thats just around the corner. Hoping its fourth time lucky :D xx


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## eveclo

Hey ladies, just wondering if i could join for some hope after a few failed IVF cycles! I have a blog in my sig, but basically we have done 2 fresh ICSI cycles and 2 FET's all BFN. We are going to be having our EPU roughly the first week of Dec so hopefully we have some good news then but in the meantime I need some inspiration!


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## africaqueen

Ladies, I am devastated.
Did the last test i had in the cupboard this morning which was a IC and it was negative. Convinced it was a dud so got dh to go to tesco to get one of their own brand and that shows such a faint pink line it is barely there :(
Absolutely broken. The tears wont stop. I have had more than i can take.


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## bubumaci

Sweetie, please don't go by how faint or dark the line is - those tests don't measure quantity - they only measure presence of HCG (and even then, some have more dye than others)...
How are you feeling? Your symptoms have been spot on, haven't they ...? And your digi on Saturday was spot on too :kiss::hugs:

G'day Eveclo! I am sorry that you have had to make your way onto this thread - but you really are amongst some fantastic ladies, who will hopefully be able to offer you the inspiration that you need. (And if you look at my signature / read my journal - link in signature - then you will see that even when it really seems to just not want to happen, it can) :hugs::howdy:


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## Sandy83

Ah AQ I'm sorry you are going through this but I've got everything crossed that it's not the case :hugs: Is there anything that your clinic will do or even your doctors? xx


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## Plex

AQ - IC are CRAP, even those sensitive ones. When i had my chemical in January the IC never picked ANYTHING up but i got a positive on a sainsburys digital. Dont trust them honey. As for the tescos hpt - do u know the sensitivity of it? I know cb digi is 25mIU. 

Thinking of u hun - like Sandy says will ur docs do another test or something? :hugs: xxx


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## africaqueen

Thanks girls. I am going to try and stay positive even though things are not seeming good. A line is still a line although faint. I have to keep hopeful right? Iv had no bleeding or bad cramps etc, my nipples are still sore, my sense of smell is still amazing and i still have metallic taste in my mouth. Bought another cb digital and will test in the morning. Terrified. x


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## nicijones

Hunni step right away from those ic's!!! At 12 weeks preg I used my last ic and it was completely neg and I was completely preg! They are awful rubbish crappy things and there is a reason why they Are cheap! Your defo prego but if u still wanna see lines (believe me I know how that feels cos I peed on ALOT!) then please get frers! They are fabs and worth the money if u want that reassurance. 
Big hugs mama!!
Xx


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## africaqueen

Really Nici?? what about the tesco own brand being super faint too??
So u think il get another BFP tomorrow on the digital? ah god this is a nightmare. I wish i had not poas again today! xxx


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## nicijones

U will Defo get pregnant on your digi tmw hunni!! Defo Defo Defo! I have used ic's, tescos own and superdrugs!! Super duper lines on frers but not those! 
Xxx
Ps I don't work for frer or anything Haha! Feel like am pushing them on u but they really are the best for showing lines if that's what u wanna see xxx


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## africaqueen

Thank you. I pray your right x
I have just called docs, explained i am losing my mind and they have agreed to do a beta tomorrow and repeat few days later. xxx


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## bubumaci

That is great that they are going to do betas!! Really glad that they have agreed :kiss:


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## nicijones

That's brilliant! U certainly have a v good dr!! 
All will be fine hunni! :)
Xx


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## Peachy1584

AQ I am sorry you have to go through this worry! Truly glad your clinic is doing bloods for you, it really is the only way to know for sure :hugs:


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## LadyLovenox

Praying, praying, praying for you, AQ!!! Keep the faith!!!


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## Sandy83

AQ thinking of you today :hugs: xx


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## africaqueen

Thanks for support ladies
Did my CB digital and it said pregnant 1-2 so we are fine!! we are sooo relieved!! i never ever wanna see a IC again! evil little pee sticks!! lol.
Going to Docs in a hour to have my beta done and hopefully get a little booklet on pregnancy or something to make this seem real! ha. Then its work till 6pm. Zzzz. Glad really though as takes my mind off things a bit xxx


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## bugs

Now step away from the pee sticks and wait for bloods. 

I never heard back from the hospital after my glucose test so thankfully I don't have gestational diabetes just a big baby by the looks of things !!!


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## nicijones

So pleased hunni! Now Throw away those evil sticks!!! 
Xxx


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## Plex

AQ - :hugs: I agree with the others! bin those pee sticks!!! xx


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## eveclo

africaqueen said:


> Ladies, I am devastated.
> Did the last test i had in the cupboard this morning which was a IC and it was negative. Convinced it was a dud so got dh to go to tesco to get one of their own brand and that shows such a faint pink line it is barely there :(
> Absolutely broken. The tears wont stop. I have had more than i can take.

Definately get your betas checked properly! So sorry you have to go through this! Those Internet cheapies really play with your mind!! 



bubumaci said:


> Sweetie, please don't go by how faint or dark the line is - those tests don't measure quantity - they only measure presence of HCG (and even then, some have more dye than others)...
> How are you feeling? Your symptoms have been spot on, haven't they ...? And your digi on Saturday was spot on too :kiss::hugs:
> 
> G'day Eveclo! I am sorry that you have had to make your way onto this thread - but you really are amongst some fantastic ladies, who will hopefully be able to offer you the inspiration that you need. (And if you look at my signature / read my journal - link in signature - then you will see that even when it really seems to just not want to happen, it can) :hugs::howdy:

I will read your journal now, but by the looks of your signature it gives me a little hope! We originally thought we had just MFI, but since our 4 transfers haven't worked I guess it might be a 'me' problem as well hehe.


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## bubumaci

africaqueen said:


> Thanks for support ladies
> Did my CB digital and it said pregnant 1-2 so we are fine!! we are sooo relieved!! i never ever wanna see a IC again! evil little pee sticks!! lol.
> Going to Docs in a hour to have my beta done and hopefully get a little booklet on pregnancy or something to make this seem real! ha. Then its work till 6pm. Zzzz. Glad really though as takes my mind off things a bit xxx

There you go!! Trust that digital and tell the evil little pee sticks where they can go! :) :kiss::hugs:

Really looking forward to hearing your beta results! :) :wohoo:

Eveclo - I am so glad if my story has been able to give you some inspiration!! And really wish, that it won't be long, before you can write your own inspirational story! :) :hugs:


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## LadyLovenox

Anxiously awaiting the beta!!! So happy for that trusty digi!! Forget those cheapies!! That makes me never wanna get cheapies again!!


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## africaqueen

AFM-Well i went to docs and she did my BP and a pelvic exam which were both fine and when i asked about the betas she said she would only do it if ectopic was suspected and that is no longer the case with me as i have no tubes. She said considering how anxious i already am with hpts etc, that she would not recommend betas as its not standard practice here and that all it will do is add more anxiety to these early days waiting for the results etc and i have to say, i agree. So i am going to calm myself down, allow myself to get excited about my scan in just over 2wks and enjoy these early stages of pregnancy as we have waited sooo long for this
xxx


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## MrsE75

Huge congrats AQ just logged on as still overseas on business. I did have a celeb spot today though Kate Beckinsale I didn't realise until she walked past! 

So happy for you AQ and throw those flipping pee sticks in the bin pronto! Here's to a healthy 9mths for you xxx

Hi to all the rest of the gang and sorry for lack of personals but on my phone and overseas for another couple of weeks so will get into the swing then xx


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## Peachy1584

AQ I'm glad you have a plan and hope you can relax and everything goes smoothly : ). Just out of curiosity though did she test you there and why did they tell you they would do betas and then change their mind? Do something special for yourself you deserve it!


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## africaqueen

MrsE- Thank you. Hope business is going well and take it your in LA if your celeb spotting? lol x

Peachy- It was me that told the docs receptionist that i wanted a beta and she said she would book me in with doc. It is really not the norm here and i agree with doc so i plan to enjoy being pregnant now :) x


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## nicijones

Good on ya lovely! As u say this has been a long time coming so enjoy every second! U have no reason to think anything other than u are very much prego and ur beautiful sticky bean needs u to be nice and stress free! :)
Xx


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## Plex

AQ- :hugs: yay!! Nows the time to think lovely baby thoughts, put ur feet up and enjoy every second :D xxx


Well......I paid for my drugs today and get them delivered 2moro! Weirdly excited by that??!!?? lolol I start my northisterone on friday too (for 2 weeks) then baseline scan 29th October :thumbup: Cant wait for the collection but so bloody scared about the fert report, dont think i could handle ANOTHER zero fert :nope:

Wondering whether to go off sick over that time now, but unsure :shrug: although i dont wanna kick myself for not doing that if it doesnt work. Not sure!! xx


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## africaqueen

Ladies, i am in a right state! just been the loo for a wee an there was pink on the tissue when i wiped :( i am so, so scared right now and nothing i can do. Please god don't take our precious bean away from us... xxx


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## nicijones

Awww hunni! Please try not to panic. Have u any pains? Was it only the once? Don't lose sight of the fact that bleeding in early pregnancy is v common! 
Sending u hugs!
Xx


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## africaqueen

No hun, no pain at all, just the pink when i wiped. I have put a pad on to keep a eye on it but so scared of it getting worse. We cannot lose this baby!! :( xxx


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## bugs

Sarah I know it's hard but try and stay positive. Maybe see about getting bloods done it's a long wait till your scan and the only way of knowing what's happening. Praying it's just some early pregnancy spotting. Are you still on progesterone support ?


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## Plex

AQ - :hugs: the amount of women that have early pregnancy bleeding after ivf is soooooo common. Doesnt make it any easier when ur going through it though i know :hugs: im praying for all to be well with u and ur baby!! xxx


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## Peachy1584

AQ it is very common and can be completely normal. A friend of mine is 17 weeks and still bleeds sometimes. Hope this is nothing as well :hugs:

Plex you should be excited! Everything crossed for a great fertilization report for you!


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## africaqueen

Thanks ladies but not looking good. Blood is bright red now. went for a wee and can see splashes in the loo and a few spots on my pad and on tissue when i wipe. I am feeling helpless!! how can life be so cruel? this is all we want from life! please god dont let us lose our baby. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE!!!! Cannot cope with this.

I am not on progesterone now no. My clinic stops it the day after OTD.


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## bubumaci

Oh Sarah!! I am keeping everything crossed for you!!!
I cannot believe that they stop progesterone! Anyone else I have known who goes through AC has to stay on the progesterone for many many weeks (my clinic wanted me to use it until the 12th week and I weaned myself off it by the 14th). Because it is an artificial process of getting pregnant, your body won't be producing the hormones as it would in a natural cycle and so it needs the support certainly until the pregnancy is stable ...
I am not giving up hope for you Sweetie! Sending you much strength and huge hugs! 

How are you feeling otherwise? :hugs::kiss:


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## africaqueen

So if i ask my gp to prescribe more progesterone tomorrow will it help or is it already too late?? :( xxx


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## bugs

Sometimes you can spot when your progesterone levels drop, it certainly wouldn't do any harm. Can you not ring the women's and ask them to prescribe it xxxx


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## nicijones

Hey lovely, I don't think u shud have stopped progesterone? With this preg and with scarlett I was on it until week 13 as that's wen the placenta takes over. Is that not what they told you? 
Xxx


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## bugs

They did a trial at the Liverpool women's for progesterone support and I think it showed that there was no increase in live birth results when progesterone support was used until 12 weeks compared to when not at all. I think the jury is out on whether it can save a pregnancy or not. All's I know is I could never even get to test day without bleeding pregnant or not it was only when I switched to progesterone injections that I wouldn't bleed until I stopped them xxxx


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## nicijones

Sarah I would get some prescribed as soon as and if u can't get any tmw I have some left over I can give u? 
Xx


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## Hopefulx2

I even bled on them bugs... I have some progesterone left over here if you want it but not sure where you are xxx praying for you Africa you deserve this x


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## africaqueen

Dont think its going to make a difference now but thanks.
The bleeding is worse and bright red and i am cramping, although mildly. dh, me an my dad are in bits. Going to bed and praying for a miracle in the morning that the blood has stopped but doubtful. Enough is enough. Can't go through more heartbreak. Just can't.


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## Hopefulx2

You are in my thoughts and lrayers tonight and I hope it all is ok... I really really do x those of us who have quietly kept and eye on our fellow 3 x people are all feeling your concern and worry and I just wanted you to know that. I doubt it's any help but I and many others are thinking of yoi and sending positive vibes x


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## Plex

AQ - Thinking of you huni :hugs: xxx


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## bubumaci

:hugs: and prayers going your way!!! xoxo


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## LadyLovenox

Hoping and praying for a positive outcome!!! You deserve all the best!!


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## Peachy1584

AQ huge :hugs:. Hope and pray this turns out to be nothing. I don't know whether progesterone helps or not but both of my clinics use it til 10 weeks. On my failed cycles I would not bleed until I stopped it. The only way to know is doing the blood tests. :hugs:


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## Unlucky41

Sarah really sorry to hear this. Can you get a blood test done? Hope everything works out fine! We are all praying for you!


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## Sandy83

AQ, Thinking of you and hope this morning gave you some positive news and the bleeding has stopped :hugs: have you tested again? xx


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## nicijones

Hoping that everything is ok this morning Sarah and u have spoken to women's re progesterone?? 
Thinking of you! 
Xx


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## bubumaci

Thinking of you Sarah! xoxo


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## Plex

AQ - Hope ur doing better today huni? U are in my prayers :hugs: xxx


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## africaqueen

The bleeding got much worse during the night and the pain from the cramping was horrific so not looking good at all. Went the doctors and she examined me an said my cervix was closed but i also lost ton of blood during the exam. The early pregnancy unit here just will not scan before 6wks but my gp did do betas today and result will be in tomorrow with repeat on Monday. She said she did not want to give me false hope as obviously not looking good with the severe cramps too but she did say very rarely sometimes both embies implant and one is miscarried but the other survives. This is the last glimmer of hope for us. Meanwhile we have to wait till Monday to find out. I feel so ill. Been signed off work for 2wks and been in bed all day with dh trying to console eachother but failing miserably xxx


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## bugs

Sorry to hear this Sarah, it's definitely not over yet but it's such a cruel thing to happen. I'll be thinking of you over the next few days xxx


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## nicijones

Oh hunni I truly truly hope everything turns out ok for you!! Did u ask your gp or at the women's about progesterone?? Am shocked that ur not still on it and would seriously be questioning that??
Big hugs
Xxx


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## africaqueen

Hun, the women's as standard don't keep anyone on it following OTD so dont know why your shocked? if im losing my baby its too late for anything to be done and now im feeling to blame that i didnt push for more pessaries. Can't handle this! x


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## nicijones

No your not too blame hunni, am just going by what happened to me and i was prescribed the pessaries to take me up to 12 weeks. I just Thort that was standard practice as so many other ladies have used them too for that long. 
Sorry if I have upset u in what I said. Got everything and more crossed for u my lovely!!
Xxx


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## africaqueen

well obviously they thought my baby was not worth giving a fighting chance to then. Feel more devastated than ever now knowing there could of been a chance of saving our baby and i didnt push more more pessaries so it is my fault. Wish i was dead.


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## bubumaci

Sweet Sarah, I just don't know what to say! :( ... I had also had the thought of perhaps a twin not implanting properly ... I hate that you are going through this!!! :hug:


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## bugs

Sarah you can't think like that, additional progesterone is used to help support an ongoing pregnancy and if they thought that by using additional progesterone that would save a pregnancy they would without a doubt use it all the time but you've been on these boards long enough like me to know how often this happens. It doesn't make it any easier to deal with but sadly if it's not meant to be no drugs are going to save it xxxx


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## africaqueen

I know you are right Clare. I just cannot cope with this emotional pain after everything else iv been thru in the last 4yrs. This really is end of the road for me. There is actually nothing in this life i want anymore. I love my dad and dh so i would never harm myself as would not put them thru it but i truly dont derive any joy from my life anymore. Utterly broken. Miss my mum more than ever today.


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## bubumaci

Sweetie, I really wish I could take you in my arms and comfort you somehow! :( :(
There is no way this is your fault and please please please don't look to yourself for the blame! On another thread I am on (for Azoospermia), we just had a BFP - 6 weeks ... started bleeding and having clotting ... was at the doctor's a couple of days ago and everything looked fine, despite bleeding - HB was seen etc. Today ... no HB, and blood had pooled around the sac and it had detached from her uterus... There is nothing that one can say, it is so so cruel and there is no rhyme or reason to it - and nobody did anything wrong.

I am still really hoping that we are talking about cramping from implantation, bleeding that can happen even though the pregnancy is healthy ... perhaps even a vanishing twin ... and I am sending you all the love and strength I can muster ... Hoping and keeping fingers crossed for a good beta result!!! :hug:


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## captainj1

Oh no AQ I have only just seen the last few days' posts. My heart goes out to you and I am keeping everything crossed that there is still a bean in there that has a fighting chance.

But please please please do not blame yourself. You have done everything right. And yes it is so bloody unfair that you are having to go through this. But there is NOTHING that you could have done differently. Progesterone support never did anything for me. LWH know what they are talking about. They are the experts. They know your history. You have done nothing wrong, quite the opposite; the research, energy and physical commitment you have applied to this is amazing. It is biology that is so bloody shitty sometimes but that isn't your fault. But biology and infertility is incredibly unfair and indiscriminate and that hurts.

Thinking of you hon. Please take care of yourself and DH xxxx


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## Plex

AQ - Im devestated for u hun :hugs: I am hoping and praying for a miracle for you:hugs:
Like you say you could have caught with twins and are loosing one but are still pregnant with the other. 
I so wish this were easier for you and you didnt have to go through this after everything you have endured to get here :( 
Please dont blame urself huni :hugs:
xxx


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## LadyLovenox

AQ... I'm still staying positive!!! It ain't over til it's over!!! And I completely understand how crushed you are right now.... But don't you ever say that this is the end of your road!!! You have been through a lot...And you've made it. You are a warrior!! Don't let your doubts and fears put negativity into your mind. This is another obstacle in your path. Another page of your story.... But not the end. There are so many other options, and you will have a baby... No matter what it takes. Obstacles may mean changing your path, but it doesn't mean giving up on your destination!!! You are strong, you are determined and you will WIN!!! Keep your passion.... You're amazing!!!!


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## Unlucky41

Sarah I am so so sorry to hear your news :hugs::hugs::hugs:
Definately not your fault and life is just so cruel sometimes! Just not fair! 
We are all hoping for the best for you and that Monday you get some awesome news!

Don't give up on life I know you will be able to bounce back from this you are a fighter!


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## Sandy83

AQ, I agree with what all the ladies have said and thinking of you at this hard time :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Hi Sandy :howdy:
I just wanted to ask how your DH is doing? Is he allowed home already? Are you getting ready for your FET next month? :hugs:

Sarah - you get the blood test results today, don't you? :kiss:


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## Sandy83

Thanks for Asking Bubumaci

Dh is doing ok been home 3 weeks now but a side effect from the transplant is something called graft vs host disease and in majority of cases causes skin irritation which DH has got but he got some cream which seems to be helping. Also found out yesterday at the hospital that he has a low level of infection which looks like glandular fever so just got to keep an eye on that. 
Not sure what to do yet with the FET just going to see how DH goes but all being well we might look to doing it with next AF which would be end of this month meaning transfer would be beginning of Dec. On a TTC point of view tho I've been reading that apparently some men after Allogeneic Stem cell transplants there fertility has returned so fx'd if IVF doesn't work in a year or so I could fall pregnant natural who knows. 

Sorry for forgetting but when is your Due date? I know it's not far away! xx


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## nicijones

Crossing everything I can for u Sarah! 
Xxx


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## bubumaci

Sandy83 said:


> Thanks for Asking Bubumaci
> 
> Dh is doing ok been home 3 weeks now but a side effect from the transplant is something called graft vs host disease and in majority of cases causes skin irritation which DH has got but he got some cream which seems to be helping. Also found out yesterday at the hospital that he has a low level of infection which looks like glandular fever so just got to keep an eye on that.
> Not sure what to do yet with the FET just going to see how DH goes but all being well we might look to doing it with next AF which would be end of this month meaning transfer would be beginning of Dec. On a TTC point of view tho I've been reading that apparently some men after Allogeneic Stem cell transplants there fertility has returned so fx'd if IVF doesn't work in a year or so I could fall pregnant natural who knows.
> 
> Sorry for forgetting but when is your Due date? I know it's not far away! xx

That is great that he has been doing OK! How annoying about the graft vs host disease!
Gosh - I got ill will Glandular Fever in 2008 .. and had a temperature / fever for nearly 1,5 years (it was misdiagnosed at the beginning and ended up becoming chronic) before I finally got rid of it. I really hope he doesn't have that, it can be debilitating without having gone through all he has gone through!!

Are you excited to get started again quite soon?

Due date is November 3rd (so 24 days) ... I have had the feeling the whole pregnancy, that he won't wait for November and I am kind of hoping he won't or at least won't wait for November 3rd (not because I want him out ... I don't, I'm loving having him in there and am not ready for him to leave yet) - but because of my gestational diabetes, the will induce on my due date if he's not here beforehand, and I would like to avoid and any all interventions if at all possible ...

Sarah, how are you Honey? Has the clinic got back to you with the blood test results yet? :hugs:


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## africaqueen

Thank you so much ladies for support. Means a lot x

Well im still bleeding. Not looking good. I have called the doctors to get 1st beta result and its 4.20pm here and the results are still not in?! the blood was taken at noon yesterday!! Im so confused and emotional! my nipples have prominent veins around them today for the first time?? i still have a strong metallic taste in my mouth, yet im still bleeding?! i dont know what to think. This is torture. xxx


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## LadyLovenox

Keep calling and nagging them!!!! Thats awful to have to keep waiting for bloodwork!!! All those signs and symptoms sound promising!!!! Stay strong!!!


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## dovkav123

Hope and pray for a good news:hugs:


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## bugs

Sarah I've just read your news on the other thread, I'm so so sorry. Please do not give up hope when your ready to you will find the strength to move forward and although it wasn't your forever baby it did implant. Something as little as steroids with your next cycle may help but it's too early to be thinking about what happens. Just know that there is other options and please take care of yourself xxxx


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## nicijones

So so so sorry sarah!! Sending u lots of healing thoughts. Life is so so cruel sometimes! 
Xxxxxxxx


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## africaqueen

Thank you for support x
Sorry i forgot to update this thread. We lost our babies. HCG was 7.7 from Thursday. Not stopped bleeding and passed 2 clots with grey matter earlier. I am going to be taking a long break from these boards but want to thank you all for support and wish you all well with your IVF's and pregnancies xxx


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## captainj1

AQ, I have no words. Life is so unfair. I hope you can find the strength to continue your journey when the time is right. Xxx


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## Peachy1584

AQ you are an amazing woman. It truly lifted my spirit to see how many women you have supported and gotten through their hard times that want to see you succeed. I honestly believe you will get your rainbow baby, and with all the wishes and prayers of everyone who adores you I know it will happen for you... i also hope the pain fades soon so you can focus on the future and continue on the path that you are meant to. Be kind to yourself and let your loved ones take care of you..:hugs:


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## bubumaci

Sarah - I have no words, just a deep sorrow for you and this loss! I really wish for you, that you will at some point find the strength to continue on this journey and in the meantime, I wish you the strength to cope with your loss, to grieve it ... There are many of us who are and will be thinking of you. :kiss:


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## Plex

AQ- :flower: So very very sorry to read of your loss hun, I wish I had some words that could take away the pain and heartbreak that you must be feeling right now :hugs: You and your husband are in my thoughts at this extremely hard time. Take as long as you need away from these boards, but just know that you will be greatly missed xx


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## Unlucky41

AQ so sorry for your loss. You have been a star starting this thread and giving us so much support. When you are ready and able please check back in so we can continue to support you in your Journey.


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## eveclo

AQ, so sorry to hear your news. My heart is heavy for you. I am thinking of you, your partner and your angel babes, as I'm sure the other ladies on this thread are too xx


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## Sandy83

Hey ladies 

Just checking in to see how everyone is doing :hugs: xx


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## Peachy1584

Hello Sandy I am well but have yet another cold so am feeling a bit sorry for myself : ). How about you? Will you still be starting your fet soon?


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## Sandy83

Sorry to hear you have another cold peachy hope you feel better soon :hugs: 

Not sure about FET yet i've got to call on next AF if i want to transfer before xmas which will be end of this month. Not sure what to do as even tho DH is doing really well he has a lot of mood swings and side effects from the drugs he is on (sounds like me on a fresh cycle!) so some days are stressful especially with work and everything so don't know what to do as keep thinking will the time ever be perfect or will i regret starting so soon after DH's transplant????????????????????? xx


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## Peachy1584

How long does he have to continue with the medication? The good thing about the fet is at least isn't as stressful as the fresh and you don't have to worry about all the meds. You'll still need his support and understanding though.


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## Sandy83

Think I was just having one of those days yesterday! DH is still really supportive even tho everything he is going through himself and he has left the decision up to me as he says i know what's best for my body which is true. Think I'll gear everything up for going ahead then can always cancel if I feel I'm not ready and as you say FET is so much easier on the body. think I'm anxious also as not done any cycle since Jan 2014 xx


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## BabyDancing13

Hey ladies, 

I hope you don't mind me gate crashing? 

I had an early bleed on my first ICSI cycle following transfer of a 5AA Blastocyst. Froze 4, transferred 2 and had a chemical on FET cycle, and just going through another ICSI. 

We had 13 eggs, 11 were injected, only 4 fertilised. By day 3, 2 arrested and the other 2 are grade 2 (1 best, 4 worst) and have some fragmentation. I am feeling pessimistic and don't know what the outcome will be. I also had endo scratch this cycle. 

I don't know how many more times I will go through ivf though. x


----------



## Unlucky41

Baby dancing How are you going? Have you had your transfer? How are you feeling? 
There are many success with Embryos that are grade 2.

Hope you are feeling more positive. Did they do anything Different this cycle? Seems like your first one went quite positively?


----------



## ashknowsbest

Sorry I've been MIA. After my failed FET I needed to take some time away. Sorry to bombard you girls with so much information but I can't wait to get started and so happy to have a doctor that wants to get to the bottom of everything! 

My husband and I had our phone consultation with Dr. Surrey at CCRM. We like the plan and are looking forward to getting started. He's taking a very serious approach since I'm 26, everything seems okay and we've had so much embryo attrition. So the plan .... 

He will perform a sperm fragmentation test to see if there is more wrong with Jason's sperm than we can see just from the normal sperm analysis. Apparently this test is more in depth then the normal one. 

He wants to check Jason and I for translocation. Apparently translocation is where one of your chromosomes could have like "switched" places with a different one and it doesn't cause any genetic abnormalities but it can effect fertility. 

He also wants to run more in depth blood tests on Jason and I. I am a carrier of CF and because Jason isn't there was nothing to worry about. Buuuuut Dr. Surrey said there are about 100 other "types". They can't test all 100 but there are 23 unusual types that they can test. So we're going to do that.

He will also perform CCS on all embryos. I'm so excited for this! We get to find out if they are boys or girls! It seems ridiculous now that I'm typing it out that I'm so excited for this part but ... oh well. 

He's going to check my uterus for a protein called intergrin. Apparently this is a protein that is lacking in women who have recurrent miscarriage, recurrent IVF failures so he thinks checking this is important. The crappy thing is that I have to have a biopsy while I'm awake .... he said it's about a 30 second ouch but if it comes back that this is lacking then ... that would solve our problem. The way they remedy this problem is easy peasy. It's one shot of lupron (long form) once a month. It's different than the lupron you take to stimulate your ovaries.

He said acupuncture can't hurt and I've been doing that. So .. yay! 

We'll be traveling there for our one day workup. Probably next month because I just can't fathom going this week. They like us to be there between day 5 and 13. And I'm day 6 right now but the flights are crazy expensive! So I will probably go next month before thanksgiving.

At the on day workup he'll do a bunch of blood work and ultrasounds but also a hysteroscopy and a trial transfer to make sure that everything will go smoothly. 

Fun stuff! 

My honey had to go back to work immediately after the phone consult so we didn't get to chat about it yet but we will when he gets home! 

I love that the doctor seems very adamant about finding what's causing our infertility. He said nobody can have that much bad luck and I agree. There has to be something else going on here.


----------



## LadyLovenox

@ash....Don't even worry about the biopsy!!! I've had 5 of them now. Take 600mg ibuprofen at least an hour before, and you're golden. :) sounds like you've got a lot of great investigating going on!!!! I'm sure it feels great to take a step in the right direction!!! Hugs!!


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## eveclo

ashknowsbest said:


> Sorry I've been MIA. After my failed FET I needed to take some time away. Sorry to bombard you girls with so much information but I can't wait to get started and so happy to have a doctor that wants to get to the bottom of everything!
> 
> My husband and I had our phone consultation with Dr. Surrey at CCRM. We like the plan and are looking forward to getting started. He's taking a very serious approach since I'm 26, everything seems okay and we've had so much embryo attrition. So the plan ....
> 
> He will perform a sperm fragmentation test to see if there is more wrong with Jason's sperm than we can see just from the normal sperm analysis. Apparently this test is more in depth then the normal one.
> 
> He wants to check Jason and I for translocation. Apparently translocation is where one of your chromosomes could have like "switched" places with a different one and it doesn't cause any genetic abnormalities but it can effect fertility.
> 
> He also wants to run more in depth blood tests on Jason and I. I am a carrier of CF and because Jason isn't there was nothing to worry about. Buuuuut Dr. Surrey said there are about 100 other "types". They can't test all 100 but there are 23 unusual types that they can test. So we're going to do that.
> 
> He will also perform CCS on all embryos. I'm so excited for this! We get to find out if they are boys or girls! It seems ridiculous now that I'm typing it out that I'm so excited for this part but ... oh well.
> 
> He's going to check my uterus for a protein called intergrin. Apparently this is a protein that is lacking in women who have recurrent miscarriage, recurrent IVF failures so he thinks checking this is important. The crappy thing is that I have to have a biopsy while I'm awake .... he said it's about a 30 second ouch but if it comes back that this is lacking then ... that would solve our problem. The way they remedy this problem is easy peasy. It's one shot of lupron (long form) once a month. It's different than the lupron you take to stimulate your ovaries.
> 
> He said acupuncture can't hurt and I've been doing that. So .. yay!
> 
> We'll be traveling there for our one day workup. Probably next month because I just can't fathom going this week. They like us to be there between day 5 and 13. And I'm day 6 right now but the flights are crazy expensive! So I will probably go next month before thanksgiving.
> 
> At the on day workup he'll do a bunch of blood work and ultrasounds but also a hysteroscopy and a trial transfer to make sure that everything will go smoothly.
> 
> Fun stuff!
> 
> My honey had to go back to work immediately after the phone consult so we didn't get to chat about it yet but we will when he gets home!
> 
> I love that the doctor seems very adamant about finding what's causing our infertility. He said nobody can have that much bad luck and I agree. There has to be something else going on here.

That's fantastic news! I hope everything goes well for you, i'm interested to see what the tests will come up with as I am also younger and healthy with no explanation for our repeat failures! Glad you have found a doctor that's willing to look into other things!


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## ashknowsbest

Thanks girlies, ibuprofin it is when I go through the biopsy. I can't imagine, with everything else I've gone through, that the biopsy could be that bad anyways. It probably sounds worse than it is. 

eveclo - definitely annoying when you're so young and you can't get pregnant. Not that I'm saying it's not as painful if you're older. I just feel so ripped off. I should have 5 kids by now! 

AFM - Flights are booked, hotel and car are next. One day workup on the 27th. I'm very excited. I'm also nervous but the fact that we MAY get some answers is just so exciting. I can't wait!


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## BabyDancing13

Unlucky41 said:


> Baby dancing How are you going? Have you had your transfer? How are you feeling?
> There are many success with Embryos that are grade 2.
> 
> Hope you are feeling more positive. Did they do anything Different this cycle? Seems like your first one went quite positively?

Hi unlucky, I am 5dp3dt with no signs/symptoms. I can't even say I have any side effects from PIO and Cyclogest. I just have a gut feeling this cycle will be a fail like our first fresh transfer. 

The only thing different this time is the endo scratch and I started on higher menopur dose. I did stimulate better but our fertilisation rate was just so poor- 4 out of 11 eggs. Whereas on first cycle we had 6 eggs and got 5 blastocysts. 

This journey is just such a rollercoaster. We also have to pay for all treatment and I can't do it forever x


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## ashknowsbest

babydance - try to stay positive. I know it's hard but you just never know what's going to happen until test day :hugs:


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## Peachy1584

Sandy so excited for you to be trying again in Dec. Hope you guys finally get the great news you deserve!

Ash that's wonderful about your next step. As I said before I have only heard wonderful things about CCRM and I know I had wished I could go there from the start of my journey.

Baby dancing I hope you are wrong and this turns out to be a good cycle. I have never liked embryo grades as I have had perfect quality embies that didn't work while gals with poor quality embies now have babies. You just never know and I am wishing the best for you!


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## BabyDancing13

Thanks ladies. It's a shame we get to know our bodies so well after going through this treatment. At the moment my faith is in FET cycles as that's when I got my first ever BFP- although lost it. We shall see. :) x


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## bubumaci

Ash - so excited about your plan. Sounds wonderful and it is comforting to know that the doctor is going to be so thorough!
Oh, for the last tries, I had a scratch biopsy. The first one was a bit painful, but it really only lasted a few seconds ... most of the others were really easy, didn't need any pain meds for any of them.

I think if I were younger, I would have felt that at least I had more time. Being older definitely put the pressure on : aging eggs = diminishing quality with age etc. etc. And if it doesn't work right away (as it didn't with us), then you just see the years going by without results (same as when you are younger, but when you are younger, you do have more time) ;) Started at the clinic when I was 36 - will be having my baby at 39 ... and at the beginning of the year I had said, "next year I will be 40 - if we are not pregnant by the end of the year, we are stopping trying".


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## Unlucky41

Baby dancing I know the dreaded feeling but as you said if it doesn't work there is the FET. It is not over but the wait is just so annoying. Keep yourself busy so the time goes faster! 

Praying that your gut feeling is wrong!


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## ashknowsbest

bubu - I hope my uterine biopsy is like yours in that it doesn't hurt too much! I can't believe you're LO is going to be on his way so soon! And about the age thing and still having time. I mean, I do have time but if I can't get pregnant now, it's just going to get harder in time because of aging. And my husband is 41. He doesn't want to be a very old father and I can understand that. I also want my family now. I know that sounds greedy but I want to be a stay at home mom and we have the means for that to be an option but I can't do that without having children. I was an only child and always dreamed of having a house full of kids and toys and just ... excitement and joy from kids. I don't have that and it hurts everyday. I love my pup Rupert and he's amazing and adds a good amount of chaos but I've always wanted to be a mother. I'm old enough to have children, financially stable enough to have children and I feel like I'm "stuck" ... 

I'm sorry if this comes off as brash. I'm just trying to explain my situation and feelings to the best of my ability.


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## eveclo

ashknowsbest said:


> bubu - I hope my uterine biopsy is like yours in that it doesn't hurt too much! I can't believe you're LO is going to be on his way so soon! And about the age thing and still having time. I mean, I do have time but if I can't get pregnant now, it's just going to get harder in time because of aging. And my husband is 41. He doesn't want to be a very old father and I can understand that. I also want my family now. I know that sounds greedy but I want to be a stay at home mom and we have the means for that to be an option but I can't do that without having children. I was an only child and always dreamed of having a house full of kids and toys and just ... excitement and joy from kids. I don't have that and it hurts everyday. I love my pup Rupert and he's amazing and adds a good amount of chaos but I've always wanted to be a mother. I'm old enough to have children, financially stable enough to have children and I feel like I'm "stuck" ...
> 
> I'm sorry if this comes off as brash. I'm just trying to explain my situation and feelings to the best of my ability.

I am an only child too. I feel the exact same way and if it were up to me, I'd have as many kids as I could comfortably! 

I agree about the age thing- ivf failures hurt at ANY age. I feel grateful to have time on my side (kind of) but at the same time if it doesn't work now, what chance will I have as I age. Anyway, can't wait to see how you go! :)


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## bubumaci

Haha :) Welcome to the "only child" family :D
I still consider myself an only child ... when I was 14, my Father re-married. I was sent to live with my Mother (in Germany). When I was 18, my Father and his wife adopted two children. So - not having ever really lived with siblings, I don't really feel like they are my sisters - plus, I was fully grown up when they adopted.
Spending most of my life travelling between my parents, never having my Father around for Christmas (always had a really special relationship with my Father, but due to the circumstances, it was at a distance), the adopted children have had more vacations with my Father than I have (don't get me wrong, I admire them for going the route of adoption - but somehow often have felt that I have lost out because of it - perhaps that sounds weird).
Anyway, the only thing that kept me going over all the years, because family events (Christmases etc. that my Mother used to make magical when I was little and the family was whole) were really painful for me, someone was always missing ... I had this little candle of hope in the window that some day, I would have my own family, I would have my children and I would make family life be the way that I believe it should be for a family, for my children ... together.
Facing what we did and seeing this one thing I had held on to for most of my life slipping away was unbelievably painful...

I think the one advantage that you have being younger (and I don't rate any of the comments as being brash - it is how you feel and you are perfectly entitled to have those feelings :hugs: ) is the time factor and - should (heaven forbid) the diagnosis be, that biological children are an issue - you do still have plenty of time to discuss alternative ways of becoming parents (Ash, I understand DH's point of view too!).
When I started researching the option of adoption for example (in Germany, we could have tried donor sperm, but if we had also opted for donor eggs - even though everything seemed to be fine with me - we couldn't have gone down that route, as it is illegal here ... would have had to go abroad) I very soon discovered that I was already too old to adopt a newborn / baby!
Or for example, I really felt under pressure, at least the first year, to try again right away (the past couple of years, I relaxed a bit and we did take our time), really feeling the big "4-0" creeping up.
So with having more time, it is OK to take a break here or there, go somewhere else for a second opinion etc. etc.
But the pain, the stress, the emotional, physical, psychological strain : that is the same, no matter what stage of life you are at when confronted with the diagnosis of infertility :(

Sending everyone huge piles of :dust:

@ Baby - the cycle I got my BFP, I had no symptoms at all! The only thing that changed, was the OHSS I had had after egg collection, which did settle a bit by transfer, flared up again badly about two days after transfer and I got more and more bloated and sorer and sorer. But I felt no cramping, had no spotting, my breasts didn't do anything ... nothing to indicate, that we had a little bean burrowing in there. Try to feel and stay positive. :kiss:


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## Sandy83

Babydancing, got everything crossed for you :hugs:

Ash, as I said on another thread you have a great plan in place and look forward to hearing the outcome of your appointment :happydance:

Bubmaci, how you holding up not long now :happydance:

Hope the rest of you ladies are doing well xx


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## bubumaci

Doing OK, thank you Sandy! ... 12 days until due date ...
Monday's appointment went well, his head is fully engaged, he is still being nourished perfectly by the umbilical cord and placenta, all healthy there...
Waking up more or less on an hourly to two-hourly basis to go pee :haha: ... and have managed to develop carpal tunnel syndrome, so my finger joints and hands are constantly hurting / don't have much strength. The doctor asked if I wanted to have braces, but I figured, I could cope for the last two weeks and didn't need them.

I had been feeling that Christopher might not suit our baby boy (not to mention some comments from the Grandparents that caused me a couple of sleepless nights) - so now that is going to be his second name and his Christian name, which we decided on at the weekend, is remaining a secret now until he has arrived. I don't want to put up with any more comments, as they really get to me. But I feel very happy with the new name, he feels like a xxxxxx :D 

How is DH doing?


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## Sandy83

Thats great news and totally agree with you keeping his name a secret as the only people that matter are you and DH. :hugs:

DH is doing well he developed the rash which now seems to be disappearing and starting to get some energy back. He cleaned the whole house at the weekend as he is getting so bored and wash the windows inside and out as well as the car yesterday, think he has more energy than me! he will get a scan at the beginning of december so fx'd xx


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## bubumaci

I think often, people are just not aware how badly their reactions / comments can affect the parents-to-be. I mean, you do take your time, thinking of names, finally coming up with something you like and it is really quite hurtful, what some - not even nastily meant - comments can do.

That is great that he is getting his energy back! And that the rash is going away. My goodness, just reading what he did this weekend has tired me out *lol*
Definitely will have everything crossed that you have this nightmare finally behind you!!! xoxo


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## BabyDancing13

As expected, BFN. It's been a long 14 months and 3 rounds of ICSI/FET. We will take a break now to enjoy Christmas and my 30th Birthday in February. We will wait for consultant appointment to discuss any issues with this cycle and probably look to do another FET in March with our last 2 blastocysts. We're not upset, it's just getting to a point where it just becomes more frustrating. 

We have discussed how far we are prepared to go with IVF and agree we would try donor sperm/eggs/embryos if we need too. However, we are not ready to consider adoption. x


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## Peachy1584

Baby :hugs: I hope this break for the holidays does some good and renews your energy. Hopefully they can give you some insight and change things up a bit for your next cycle.

Ash can't wait to hear how your appt went. Hopefully you get results quickly.

Bubu how are you feeling? Have you started progressing at all? So exciting!

Dovkav hope you and baby are perfect!

Sandy I am excited for your upcoming cycle and can't wait to cheer you on. It's almost Nov already! I have no clue where the time goes.


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## Unlucky41

Babydancing so sad to hear your news. I am glad you are not prepared to give up. Take your much needed break and wish you all the best for your FET.

Bub you must be excited now! Prepare for the happiest day of your life followed by many sleepless nights but all worth it!


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## ashknowsbest

I posted my CCRM experience in my blog if anyone is interested. 

peachy - how are you feeling? How's the LO?

babydancing - sorry for the BFN :hugs: Infertility sucks!


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## BabyDancing13

Thanks ladies. I really hope you get your BFP's soon. This infertility rollercoaster is such a bitch isn't it. ;) xxx


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## bunyhuny

Hi ladies. I hope it's okay if I join you. Just found out yesterday that my beta didn't rise (went from 63 to 67 in 72hours). Looks like another failure. Just can't wrap my head around it. Have cried so much that I don't have tears left. Hopefully we'll be able to go right into the next FET.... depends on hCG results tomorrow. Next FET I'll be on Prednisone, Aspirin, Metformin, and daily injections of blood thinners. Thanks for having me. It's good to be around others who understand this feeling.


Our IVF so far:

IVF #1 (half Standard, half ICSI), August 2014: *M/C.* 300 gonal-f daily, 1000mg XR Metformin. 18 eggs: 10 eggs standard (DH still had great sperm then), 8 ICSI. All ICSI fertilized but stopped growing by day 3. Seven standard IVF fertilized and we got 3 blastocysts: 3AA, 3AB, 3BB. SET of the 3AA gave us a BFP, but I immediately started spotting and it continued for weeks. Doctors couldn't figure out why. In tenth week, I started weaning off my progesterone and miscarried.

FET #1, January 2014: *BFN.* On Metformin only. 

IVF #2 (Standard), February 2014: *BFN.* 300 gonal-f, Aspirin, and Prednisone, but RE didn't put me on Metformin. Only got 8 eggs. DH's sperm had all sorts of problems (totally out of the blue). Only got one embryo from standard IVF (didn't want to risk ICSI) and had a SET on day 3. 

IVF #3 (PICSI), March 2014: *Ectopic.* 300 gonal-f, Aspirin, Prednisone, Metformin. 20+eggs fertilized well and we ended up 6 blastocysts. Transferred a 5AA and a 4AA, and got a BFP. hCG was low but doubled normally. Ultrasound revealed baby with heartbeat in my left tube at 6 weeks and they removed the tube.

FET #2, October 2014: *Chemical Pregnancy/Early M/C.* Was on Aspirin and Metformin. No prednisone. First beta = 37, two days later = 64, three days later (yesterday) = 67. RE says no hope to salvage this one. Very, very sad. 

After the next FET we're totally out of funds and will have maxed out both our credit cards, so who knows what will happen if it doesn't work. We already sold our house last year to pay for the first IVF (and all the associated complications) and the first FET. Nothing left to sell, so I guess we'd have to take time off to pay down the card. Just trying to keep my head up.


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## Peachy1584

Ash just read your blog about CCRM and wow. I don't like the extra costs either but I'm glad you found the experience there as a whole good because one thing that doesn't change is their success rates. I first heard about them because of Giulianna and Bill Rancic. Not sure if you know her from E! or from their own reality show but they were finally able to have a baby (through a surrogate) from there and they have enough money to go anywhere in the world. I know sometimes it's better to have answers but sometimes it's just a crap shoot to getting the right embryo. Which happened to be my case. So if everything will be back on 2-3 weeks when would you be starting your cycle?

Buny I am so very sorry you are going through this again. I remember you from a different thread. I hope things turn out better for you than you think. Huge :hugs:


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## Unlucky41

Bub how you going? Had your little one yet?


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## eveclo

Yes Bub ! Hope little man has made his way safely into the world and you are feeling good right about now :) Thinking of you


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## Sandy83

Bubumaci thinking of you and hoping your little boy has had a safe entry into the world :hugs: xx


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## bubumaci

Hello sweet Ladies,

Just a quick message (sorry for not having been around) to let you all know that we are doing really well. Baby P. : 
Fabian Christopher Graham Obermüller
was born on 31st October at 18:13 (under 12 hours of contractions - 13 minutes of pushing), natural birth in the bath, no pain meds - and he is just perfect. Weighed in at 3.100g, 47cms long.

After the birth, I lost about 1,5 litres of blood, so my circulation crashed and things got quite hectic. It's part of the reason why I haven't been on here to let you know how things are yet - and to be honest, I still have a long way to go to replenish what I lost, and iron levels are very low too.

I promise that I will be posting some photos of our little miracle soon - but at the moment, I have to spend most of my time lying down.

Fabian is really perfect, he is a gorgeous little boy, very sweet, very easy going and is a total joy to watch (which Mama does of course non-stop). We are very much in love with the little man <3 <3

And yes ... he is a Halloween baby - amazing, how right my gut was!


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## Sandy83

Congratulations Bubumaci :hugs: Sorry to hear you had a hectic time after the birth. make sure you take it easy and will look forward to seeing the pics xx


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## bunyhuny

Congrats bubumaci! Good luck with your recovery! Enjoy those baby cuddles. <3

As for me:

I know I don't post on here very much and don't know all of you ladies super well yet, but I thought I'd share my most recent journal post with you all. It's in regards to something called the "antihistamine protocol" that used to be used at CCRM and is occasionally used in other clinics. DH and I stumbled across is when we were trying to figure out what could be causing our miscarriages and it put a lot of things into perspective for us. The protocol and the reasons behind it haven't been researched much yet, so there isn't a lot of info on it, but after reading up on the research that has been done, it seems like it could be a big cause of our infertility. DH and I started off with unexplained infertility years ago when I didn't have PCOS yet and DH had perfect semen analysis results. 

My PCOS came from a progesterone spike cause by an herbal supplement I took after unsuccessfully TTC for several months, then DH's SA's went bad possibly due to BD'ing with me while I was on progesterone suppositories, then I lost my left tube to ectopic and that's the side I usually O on.... so we have all sort of issues right now... but in the beginning of all this, I O'd every month and DH's SA was perfect. How crazy would it be if the only thing we started out with was an immunological/allergy issue? 

The post is long so I'm not going to repost it here, but my journal link is in my signature.


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## bugs

Congratulations Bubu, hope your feeling better soon xxxx


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## Peachy1584

Bubu that's wonderful! So happy for you and your family. Hope you get well soon and I'm glad he's taking it easy on mommy while you recover :hugs:


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## Unlucky41

Congrats bub wonderful news! Rest up and use the mid wives as much as you can you will need all the energy you can muster up!


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## Unlucky41

Buny huny all the best for the FET this coming Dec2014. Hope you get wonderful news for the new year


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## Plex

Bubumaci - Congratulations hun!!! :happydance: sorry it was a traumatic birth for u :hugs: Im wishing u a speedy recovery hun - looking forward to seeing pictures of ur lil boy xx


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## bubumaci

Thank you! 
The birth itself was absolutely perfect! Just the aftermath was rather hectic and could have been very serious (well, it was, nearly needed a transfusion). But I definitely got the birth I wanted. And I'm still blown away by the experience. <3

I hope it works, I've tried uploading some photos while on my iPad. The first is directly after he was born. The last, was last night. Absolutely smitten with our gorgeous little man! :cloud9::cloud9::cloud9:

Hmmm, from my iPad I can only upload one picture it would seem... So this photo is from last night. He's had slightly gunky eyes, but he is fine and content :cloud9:
 



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## bubumaci

This is right after he was born :cloud9:
 



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## bubumaci

First cuddles :cloud9:
 



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## bubumaci

Three days old, on his due date :cloud9:
 



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## ashknowsbest

I'm loving his little peach fuzz in the last photo!


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## Plex

Bub - Sorry hun i totally mis read that :dohh: Glad u had the birth u wanted :D ur lil man is soooooo cute!! I bet over the moon doesnt quite cover it? 

Ur experience does sound scary - at least ur getting over the worst of it now. The pictures are fantastic :D xx


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## eveclo

bubumaci said:


> Thank you!
> The birth itself was absolutely perfect! Just the aftermath was rather hectic and could have been very serious (well, it was, nearly needed a transfusion). But I definitely got the birth I wanted. And I'm still blown away by the experience. <3
> 
> I hope it works, I've tried uploading some photos while on my iPad. The first is directly after he was born. The last, was last night. Absolutely smitten with our gorgeous little man! :cloud9::cloud9::cloud9:
> 
> Hmmm, from my iPad I can only upload one picture it would seem... So this photo is from last night. He's had slightly gunky eyes, but he is fine and content :cloud9:

Oh my goodness Bub!!! Soooo beautiful. Congratulations. :) xxxx


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## Sandy83

Gorgeous Pics Bubumaci :hugs:

Dovkav, how are you getting on not long for you now? xx


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## dovkav123

Congrats, bubu on your little miracle Fabian. Beautiful photos! 

bunnyhuny, how are you? Your journey is so difficult and it's not fair. I am so sorry. You have no luck yet. I hope and pray you'll get some answers in U.S clinics.

How are you, Sandy? Is your hubby doing OK?
Thanks for asking. I am doing great. This morning the baby was awake early and kicking and I told to my hubby, it's so nice, that he is not crying, doesn't need to be fed and changed. Let's enjoy those last carefree weeks. 
I am going to midwive this week and hopefully she'll find him with a head down position.


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## Sandy83

We are doing good. Dh is doing amazing had a few off days but seems to be getting back to normal still got to take it easy but fx'd this is the start of good news coming our way 

Look forward to hearing about your appt hopefully he is ready to go very soon xx


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## africaqueen

Hi ladies, hope all of you are ok x

Just popping in to say a huge congrats to Andrea and her hubby on the birth of your gorgeous son Fabian <3 The photo of the two of you, gives me hope. Il never give up till my baby is in my arms, but i do need this break from the forums so i wont be on here much as another year intill we can try again. We have our WTF appt next week so il update after that xxxx


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## Peachy1584

Bubu he's beautiful! So happy for you!

AQ I wish you only the very best :hugs:

Sandy that's great about hubby. I hope the good news keeps coming!


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## bunyhuny

dovkav123- Hey hunny! So good to see you!! Sorry for disappearing this past summer- the ectopic was really hard on me and I kind of went into hiding. <3 I'm so happy to see that things are going well for you. Yay!! :happydance: Do you have a pregnancy (soon to be parenting!) journal? I'd love to stalk. After so long, I am so happy that this is finally happening for you. Oh! And I started a new journal. Link is in my siggy. 

We didn't get the US health insurance we were supposed to get (you can read about that in my latest journal post), so it looks like overseas is the plan again. I'm hoping this coming year will be much better. I think it will be. DH and I are doing the FET in Prague in the winter, and if that doesn't work, we'll do one to two more fresh cycles in Prague if needed- probably in the summer/fall once we've had a chance to save up. If we still don't get a take-home baby after all of that we'll have to bring out the big guns and start saving up for CCRM in late 2016.

Of course, I'm hoping that the FET this winter does the trick, but if not, I'm glad DH and I have a plan.


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## bubumaci

Sarah, thank you so much!
You take good care of yourself! And please let us know, how the consultation goes!

I finally got around to updating my journal with Pünktchen's birth story <3


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## eveclo

Hope you and Bubba are doing well Bub. Love the birth story you are amazing!!! I feel all warm and fuzzy for you. Such a miracle :) xx


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## bubumaci

Thank you eveclo!
He really is a miracle <3 :)


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## Unlucky41

Hi ladies just to see how everyone is? Also with Christmas coming up what everyone will be up to?


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## africaqueen

Hi ladies, just checking in to see if Clare has had her baby yet? Hope everyone is ok. For those with their miracles, enjoy a wonderful 1st christmas together and for those of of still suffering this christmas without our miracles, i pray you find comfort somewhere and that 2015 brings the joy we crave. HAPPY CHRISTMAS all and have a FAB new year. Thank u for all support this year xxxxx


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## bugs

Hi ladies just to announce the arrival of baby Alfie born 19/12/14 10 ten days overdue weighing in at 10lb 4oz. His Birth was not the experience I had hoped for, induced and in labour for 43 hours to only get to 3cm and then EMCS. 2 night stay in hospital but we are home now and relishing every minute. 

Hope everyone has a lovely Christmas and lots of love and luck for 2015 xxxx


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## africaqueen

Ahh Clare, HUGE congrats to you and dh!! can't believe he is finally here!! have shared every step of your journey with you and delighted to see you get your extra special christmas miracle! xxxxx


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## dovkav123

Bugs, congrats on your baby arrival! What a big baby!

Marry Christmas ladies! Hope and pray for your baby miracle suprise in 2015.


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## cvaeh

Huge congratulations bugs!!! You must be over the moon. X


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## bubumaci

Clare - huge congratulations on the arrival of your little man! I am so happy for you (like Sarah, I followed the struggles for so long *hugs*).

Sarah - wishing you and yours a very Merry Christmas and may 2015 bring you your blessing ... :hugs:

Ladies - wishing you all a very Merry Christmas, wherever you are xoxoxo


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## africaqueen

Wishing you all a very merry Christmas and thank you all for support xxxx


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## Unlucky41

Clare congrats the best xmas present ever. Only two nights in hospital you must have had a speedy recovery!


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## gsn2014

Hi ladies.
Recently failed my 5th embryo transfer. This is my 3rd cycle. It was a fresh transfer of 2 blastocysts. we have 4 frozen day 3 embies.
I took clexane, baby aspirin and steroids, for last 3 cycles. yet this is not working.
If anybody has been trough similar situation and succeeded later on, please suggest what did you do differently.
I am so lost and depressed right now.


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## bubumaci

Hi gsn! Welcome to this forum - I am so sorry, you have found your way here - on the other hand, the support of these ladies is amazing?

For us, it took 9 transfers (6x egg retrieval and fertilisation through ICSI, 5 transfers were fresh transfers, 4 were FETs - in our case, we have MF infertility). Unfortunately, there are so many factors that influence what happens - and most often than not, it is something that is out of the hands of the clinic : nature.
I had 88 eggs retrieved, 56 fertilised and 20 transferred over the course of 3 years (feel free to take a look at my journal), so we really consider our little man to be a miracle. The last three tries were the best : did endometrial scratch, injected HCG boosters, the embryos were grown in the embryscope ... I had two chemical pregnancies and one baby boy (<3) from these three tries.
Also, the last three tries we followed the Fischer stimulation protocol. This is still antagonist, but the medications are different, plus the trigger is different.
It really was a case of try, try again. Our doctor believed we would get pregnant, he just could not tell us, how many tries it would take.
At the beginning of last year, I basically said "I will be 40 next year. If we are not pregnant by the end of the year, we are stopping. I've had enough" - and coming to that decision was so hard. But ... we didn't need to make that decision, because I got pregnant with the first try of the year, in February.

It is such a difficult journey. And it is so easy to feel lost and depressed ...
What is the cause of your infertility? MF? FF? Joint?

xoxoxo


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## gsn2014

Thank you so much,
bubumaci.
I had a brief look at your journal and your son is certainly a miracle. 
Well, in our case the infertility is combined. I have bilateral tubal blockage and he suffers from ED. but I would need ivf anyway, because of tubal issues. 
I have had 9 embryos transferred and all have been either of decent or good quality. 
I have 4 more frozen and I hope I get lucky next time.
Stories like yours give me a lot of hope. You had no issues still it took 9 transfers.
I can certainly try few more times. But it is quite difficult to gather hopes after each failure. 
Anyway thanks and congratulations to you for your bundle of joy. Take care.


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## eveclo

gsn2014 said:


> Hi ladies.
> Recently failed my 5th embryo transfer. This is my 3rd cycle. It was a fresh transfer of 2 blastocysts. we have 4 frozen day 3 embies.
> I took clexane, baby aspirin and steroids, for last 3 cycles. yet this is not working.
> If anybody has been trough similar situation and succeeded later on, please suggest what did you do differently.
> I am so lost and depressed right now.

Hi GSN! :hi:


I feel your pain, my husband and I have undergone 5 Embryo transfers (3 Fresh and 2 FET's) and all have been BFN. Our last cycle we did Clexane and Steroids (20mg of Prednisolone) and nothing again. I am looking into visiting a Reproductive Immunologist and seeing what he can recommend for us. I have researched and some people have had success with Intralipid treatment. 

Have you looked into any of this? Or had your Natural Killer Cells tested? Sorry to hear about your failures but there are some great success stories on this thread that give me hope too! :flower:


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## Northernmonke

Haven't got time to reply ladies vut if you habe male fertility issues please look into Imsi. We had 4 failed cycles and the final was Imsi and I have 8 month old twins and 2 in thr freezer from that cycle. Nothing from yhe previous 4 x


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## eveclo

Northernmonke said:


> Haven't got time to reply ladies vut if you habe male fertility issues please look into Imsi. We had 4 failed cycles and the final was Imsi and I have 8 month old twins and 2 in thr freezer from that cycle. Nothing from yhe previous 4 x

Thanks for that, just had a quick google about it but it seems as though no clinics in Australia (where I am) offer it. They do have a thing called PICSI though which might be similar? Very interesting though. Thanks :)


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## Plex

hiya all :hi: Just wondering how u r all doing? Ive not been online much since our last epic ICSI failure. We have no funds left so no more treatments, its kinda hard to accept. 
xx


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## ashknowsbest

Re subscribing. I accidentally hit unsubscribe.


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## bubumaci

Hi Plex - I see you are moving forward with adoption! Wishing you all the best - I hope the approval goes through smoothly! xoxo


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## Plex

:hugs: thanks bubumaci, looking at ur siggy i cant believe fabian is 4 months, hows life going with him? Babies are amazing :D 

We're trying some last ditched attempts at ttc. We also have our WTF appointment (from our last cycle in NOV) at the end of May - already had to chase to get an appointment then it got moved back a month. Then i think we will move on. Its such a hard decision to make, adoption, i keep going over our options time and time again - i guess sometimes u just have to go for things :D xx


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## bubumaci

Oh, I can't believe that he is already 4 months old either, believe me! It is unbelievable, how time just races by!
He is very sweet, loves looking around, has the most heart-warming smile - it is such a pleasure to just observe him, watch him developing. I feel incredibly lucky to have been blessed by him!
Just on Wednesday, I went and organised his child passport, as we are driving to Budapest next weekend to visit my Grandma (she is 102). It will be a short visit, but a visit nevertheless and she will finally get to meet him ... I don't know how long she has left...
Here, a photo of him from last weekend, before going on a walk <3

Ah, I wonder what they will say at your WTF appointment .. you have had to wait such a long time for it, unbelievable!
Do you know what the source of the difficulties is?

I think you're right, at some point comes the time to decide one has had enough. For me, it was the beginning of last year - where I said "next year I will be 40. If we haven't become pregnant by the end of the year, we are stopping"... Our little miracle was conceived on the first try of last year! As I really really wanted to have a baby, I was struggling with adoption, because here, you won't be given a baby if you are older than 35 (there are rare cases where you can, but highly unlikely)...
 



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## eveclo

ashknowsbest said:


> Re subscribing. I accidentally hit unsubscribe.

Hey Ash I posted on your blog a few weeks ago just to check in with you and see how you are going! When do you start your next cycle? We had our 5th IVF failure (3rd fresh cycle) back in December. Waiting to see a Reproductive Immunologist now. Hope you are well.






Bub LOVE the photo of your little cutie. You must be over the moon. Such a well deserved gift xxx


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## ashknowsbest

eveclo - So sorry you've had another failed cycle. It sucks! I start my next cycle sometime in late April, early May. My hubby and I are not in any rush ... not sure why. I'm sort of just having a good time busting my butt at school and my hubby is really busy with work. We also don't want to stress out finances so that's another reason we're waiting. April/May is better financially. We could afford to do it now but it would put a tad bit of stress on our finances so we're choosing to wait. This is my last attend with my own eggs (depending on what the outcome is) and I just want to make sure I'm not stressed about anything during the cycle. 

I was supposed to have my e-tegrity biospy yesterday but DH and I had sex accidentally while I was ovulating ... oops. So I have to put it off until next month but like I said we're not doing our cycle until April/May so we still have time. They want to make sure I have this certain protein in my uterus during implantation time. This is sort of the last test IMO until I want to move on and stop using my eggs. Dr. Surrey said that if I still get a horrible attrition rate during my cycle with them then he thinks its most likely my eggs even though all of my numbers have come back ok. 

If I don't get pregnant this go with my own eggs I'm okay and at peace with using donor eggs. I just really want to experience pregnancy ... I should at least be able to do that.

Bubu - your LO is adorable! Enjoy the time, they grow up fast!


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## eveclo

ashknowsbest said:


> eveclo - So sorry you've had another failed cycle. It sucks! I start my next cycle sometime in late April, early May. My hubby and I are not in any rush ... not sure why. I'm sort of just having a good time busting my butt at school and my hubby is really busy with work. We also don't want to stress out finances so that's another reason we're waiting. April/May is better financially. We could afford to do it now but it would put a tad bit of stress on our finances so we're choosing to wait. This is my last attend with my own eggs (depending on what the outcome is) and I just want to make sure I'm not stressed about anything during the cycle.
> 
> I was supposed to have my e-tegrity biospy yesterday but DH and I had sex accidentally while I was ovulating ... oops. So I have to put it off until next month but like I said we're not doing our cycle until April/May so we still have time. They want to make sure I have this certain protein in my uterus during implantation time. This is sort of the last test IMO until I want to move on and stop using my eggs. Dr. Surrey said that if I still get a horrible attrition rate during my cycle with them then he thinks its most likely my eggs even though all of my numbers have come back ok.
> 
> If I don't get pregnant this go with my own eggs I'm okay and at peace with using donor eggs. I just really want to experience pregnancy ... I should at least be able to do that.
> 
> Bubu - your LO is adorable! Enjoy the time, they grow up fast!


Sounds like a great idea to wait until you are ready, it sounds just about the same way I am feeling about making that appointment to the Reproductive Immunologist. Just waiting until I feel confident enough to call him and make the appointment - not there yet but soon. :)

How do they know that it could be your eggs? Or is it a process of elimination? Last cycle our stats were so bad - 15 eggs, 13 mature eggs; 8 fertilized with ICSI and 3 fertlized with IVF, then on day 5 we only had one Blastocyst and then one more on day 6 frozen. We have no idea what to think of it all and our clinic doesn't seem to care or have any ideas. Eh!

Good luck with it all, i will be following your journey. :)


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## ashknowsbest

Pretty much it's just a process of elimination. I've had a total of 75 eggs retrieved and have only had 6 make it to transfer. And at transfer I never had a great quality one. So even though all of my blood work that coincides with egg quality has come back good my dr said reproductive medicine has only come so far and there are some things they just can't test yet regarding eggs. So ... we'll see. Like I said, I'm comfortable moving on to DE if that's what we need to do but I really want to experience pregnancy so ... 

Good news is that I had a hysteroscopy and there is nothing wrong with my uterus. Dr. said it's beautiful and ready for a baby! So ... that's good news.


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## eveclo

ashknowsbest said:


> Pretty much it's just a process of elimination. I've had a total of 75 eggs retrieved and have only had 6 make it to transfer. And at transfer I never had a great quality one. So even though all of my blood work that coincides with egg quality has come back good my dr said reproductive medicine has only come so far and there are some things they just can't test yet regarding eggs. So ... we'll see. Like I said, I'm comfortable moving on to DE if that's what we need to do but I really want to experience pregnancy so ...
> 
> Good news is that I had a hysteroscopy and there is nothing wrong with my uterus. Dr. said it's beautiful and ready for a baby! So ... that's good news.

That is very interesting thank you for that. I had a hysteroscopy before our last cycle too and the doctor came up to me afterwards and said 'you'll get pregnant'. (I didn't but hopefully one day haha!) 

what is your fertilisation rate like usually ? Does that have anything to do with egg quality? Did you do day 3 or day 5 transfers? I hope the next cycle provides some Answers for you. X


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## ashknowsbest

These are all averages but here are my numbers:
I got approx. 25 eggs each retrieval (I've had 3)
Out of the 25 on average 10-12 fertilized with and without ICSI (we didn't do ICSI with the first IVF but we did with the 2 following)
Out of the 10-12 fertilized each cycle we had approx. 3-4 by day 5 (I've always had day 5 transfers) 
I believe the highest quality embryo I had was a 4AB
Out of my 3 fresh cycles I've only had 2 to freeze. Those 2 were transferred during my FET that I had last August which also didn't work.

So .... it seems like it is an egg quality issue even though all of my numbers regarding egg quality are good. (Meaning my AMH, FSH, and my age) But there's obviously something doing on since I have such a horrible attrition rate. 

Yeah I'm hoping the next cycle provides us with some answers although I'm not counting on it. I tried to convince my DH to allow us to move on to donor eggs already but he really wants to try one more time with my eggs. So we'll see what happens ....


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## LadyLovenox

Ash knows best... Have you had an endometrial biopsy? I had three failed fresh cycles and one failed frozen. They would do a biopsy in between each cycle, and the biopsies always showed inflammation also known as endometritis (not endometriosis)... They treated me with antibiotics every time, and the inflammation never went away. My doctor always acted like that wasn't a big deal, but then they did a study a found that endometritis caused a hostile environment for embryos and prevented implantation in many cases. Since antibiotics didn't work, my doctor recommended I go gluten free, as gluten intolerance causes inflammation in many parts if the body. I had no Symptoms of gluten intolerance but I went strictly gluten free for three months and had another biopsy... My 4th! Finally... All inflammation was gone!! They gave me another round of antibiotics just to kick out anything else that may remain, as far as the inflammation. We did one more round of ivf and got pregnant with twins!! I ended up losing one at 8 weeks, but I'm currently 15 weeks pregnant with the remaining twin and everything looks healthy and right on track. I was similar to you.... I'd get 15-17 eggs... By day 5 only had a few... Highest quality was 4AB....they said that was super quality and were very happy w those though. I only ever had one to freeze. My hsg was normal as well... They don't show inflammation. Just wanted to share my story with you and anyone else on here in case it helps.


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## eveclo

Hiiii everyone, hope you are all doing well. Just wanted to check in to say that i am have finally met with a Reproductive Immunologist who has sent me off for many blood tests including natural killer cells, full immune panel and MTHFR as well. Hoping that we do get some sort of answers from these tests but I know that this journey is never smooth! :)


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## bubumaci

Hi there :wave: do you know when you will be getting the results? It is great that you have had it done. Though, I did also have all the testing done and was found to be perfectly healthy ... we never did know why the other 8 tries didn't work / what was wrong with all those many embryos we had ..


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## ashknowsbest

Hi girls! I had my endometrial biopsy done yesterday. It was pretty painful I'm not going to lie. It's over now though thank god and I sent out the cells for testing. I'm guessing the results will be here in about a week or so. I'm looking forward to getting started again but I'm not getting happy about it yet because I don't want to be let down by the outcome. My hubby and I also decided that we're going to wait for the actual transfer for about a year or two. 

My emotions about it are pretty clear but it was a hard thing to tell my DH I wanted to wait because we have tried for so long and so hard to have a baby I felt bad putting it off. 

The bottom line is this ... I don't want my eggs to age anymore than they already are because I'm already having issues getting pregnant and I'm 27 tomorrow. I don't want to turn 30 and find that I have even more problems. After we get the eggs out we will fertilize them but I want to travel the world! I put off traveling for so long. 5 years this October to be exact. We wanted to have a baby that was the priority so I put everything else off but I'm sick of waiting to travel. And yes, I could travel with a baby when he/she is born but I'd rather just wait and do it in about a year or so when I'm done traveling. 

We're going to Europe next year for a month and we've taken so many trips this year already. I'm happy with life right now. We're also testing the embryos for genetic issues so we wouldn't be able to have the transfer right away anyway. It would happen a month later so ... that's the plan.

I hope everyone else is doing well. I will let you girls know the results of the e-tegrity test when I get the results. I will be traveling to CO at the end of this month or the beginning/middle of May to do the cycle. I will keep you updated. 

I hope everyone is doing well and good luck in all of your upcoming cycles!


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## eveclo

bubumaci said:


> Hi there :wave: do you know when you will be getting the results? It is great that you have had it done. Though, I did also have all the testing done and was found to be perfectly healthy ... we never did know why the other 8 tries didn't work / what was wrong with all those many embryos we had ..

Probably about 2 weeks, hopefully it goes fast! I am so impatient although much more patient than I used to be thanks to this journey. Wow, well that kind of thing makes me feel a lot better if I don't have anything immunologically wrong with me. You have such an amazing success story Bubu i absolutely love hearing it. :) I will make sure I update when I get the results though, just to see if we can compare stories or situations. 

How is your little baby boy? I can't believe he is 5 months old already. Are you getting much sleep? hehe. :flower:


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## eveclo

ashknowsbest said:


> Hi girls! I had my endometrial biopsy done yesterday. It was pretty painful I'm not going to lie. It's over now though thank god and I sent out the cells for testing. I'm guessing the results will be here in about a week or so. I'm looking forward to getting started again but I'm not getting happy about it yet because I don't want to be let down by the outcome. My hubby and I also decided that we're going to wait for the actual transfer for about a year or two.
> 
> My emotions about it are pretty clear but it was a hard thing to tell my DH I wanted to wait because we have tried for so long and so hard to have a baby I felt bad putting it off.
> 
> The bottom line is this ... I don't want my eggs to age anymore than they already are because I'm already having issues getting pregnant and I'm 27 tomorrow. I don't want to turn 30 and find that I have even more problems. After we get the eggs out we will fertilize them but I want to travel the world! I put off traveling for so long. 5 years this October to be exact. We wanted to have a baby that was the priority so I put everything else off but I'm sick of waiting to travel. And yes, I could travel with a baby when he/she is born but I'd rather just wait and do it in about a year or so when I'm done traveling.
> 
> We're going to Europe next year for a month and we've taken so many trips this year already. I'm happy with life right now. We're also testing the embryos for genetic issues so we wouldn't be able to have the transfer right away anyway. It would happen a month later so ... that's the plan.
> 
> I hope everyone else is doing well. I will let you girls know the results of the e-tegrity test when I get the results. I will be traveling to CO at the end of this month or the beginning/middle of May to do the cycle. I will keep you updated.
> 
> I hope everyone is doing well and good luck in all of your upcoming cycles!

Oh Ash that is fantastic. I know the feels about putting off your other dreams and desires because you want a family, but sometimes you just have to do what the moment is telling you to do. You sound as though you are in a really good place at the moment and I think that is really important. How did your Husband take the news? 

Good luck with your cycle! I can't remember if i have asked but are you on Royal Jelly at all ? I have recently started taking it just to see if it makes a difference but a lot of ladies have said it has helped with their egg quality. I figure it was worth a try :)


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## ashknowsbest

Eveclo, I'm not taking royal jelly right now as I'm doing a study with CCRM and they have me on Acai berry supplements for egg quality improvement. It's not a for sure thing but I figured I'd participate in the study to help them out. Since I'm in the study I can't take anything else for egg quality since it will skew the results of the effects of the acai berry. As far as being in a good place I absolutely am. I still want a family but ... maybe now I'm just not willing to give up everything else for that. I've accepted that and when I'm ready we'll move forward.

How did my husband take it? He was GREAT! I started crying and he just told me that he's not mad and that he would love to take a break too. He's been wanting to go to Europe as well and ... he's pursuing a promotion at work so it's sort of a good time for us both to take a break. We also found out in December that his father has stage 4 esophageal cancer so ... we're also dealing with that and will have to travel back and forth to Pennsylvania (where he lives) for him .... the doctor gave him 11 months with chemotherapy so ... yeah. We sort of have a lot on our plate right now as it is. His dad really wants us to continue on with our cycle .. I think he hopes he can at least see us get pregnant before he passes. We'll see.

Since I had the uterine biopsy my DH and I are going to go hard core and try to have a baby naturally this month. OPKs and all. :D I know it works for some people and I would love the chance to try naturally before going onto another cycle. I have a post testing consult with my doctor at CCRM this upcoming Tuesday ... I guess at that point he'll look at all of the tests and we'll come up with a plan for the cycle. I won't get my calendar until I pay the $25,000!! but I'll pay that at the end of this month and then we can get started. Fun times ..... 

Anyways, thanks for reading!


----------



## bubumaci

Eve ... he is just amazing! Nope, still not getting much sleep, but I don't mind in the slightest. Since I am breastfeeding and he refuses the bottle, I am needed every 2-3 hours around the clock. He does sleep fantastically (has done from very early on) though and will only wake to feed and then carries on sleeping. He will sleep 12-13 hours in the night and takes his naps during the day too <3
I can't believe he's 5 months either!

Here, a couple of photos (I just love his smile, it warms the cockles of my heart) :)

Ash - I think that is great that you are in a good place right now. And yes, definitely get that travelling done, it is an excellent idea. You guys need a break!
 



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## eveclo

bubumaci said:


> Eve ... he is just amazing! Nope, still not getting much sleep, but I don't mind in the slightest. Since I am breastfeeding and he refuses the bottle, I am needed every 2-3 hours around the clock. He does sleep fantastically (has done from very early on) though and will only wake to feed and then carries on sleeping. He will sleep 12-13 hours in the night and takes his naps during the day too <3
> I can't believe he's 5 months either!
> 
> Here, a couple of photos (I just love his smile, it warms the cockles of my heart) :)
> 
> Ash - I think that is great that you are in a good place right now. And yes, definitely get that travelling done, it is an excellent idea. You guys need a break!

Oh my goodness, I can see why you don't mind! He is so gorgeous. Such a contagious little smile. He's a hungry little growing man, you are doing a fantastic job. It's so wonderful to see such a happy little human. :) Thank you for the update!


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## eveclo

ashknowsbest said:


> Eveclo, I'm not taking royal jelly right now as I'm doing a study with CCRM and they have me on Acai berry supplements for egg quality improvement. It's not a for sure thing but I figured I'd participate in the study to help them out. Since I'm in the study I can't take anything else for egg quality since it will skew the results of the effects of the acai berry. As far as being in a good place I absolutely am. I still want a family but ... maybe now I'm just not willing to give up everything else for that. I've accepted that and when I'm ready we'll move forward.
> 
> How did my husband take it? He was GREAT! I started crying and he just told me that he's not mad and that he would love to take a break too. He's been wanting to go to Europe as well and ... he's pursuing a promotion at work so it's sort of a good time for us both to take a break. We also found out in December that his father has stage 4 esophageal cancer so ... we're also dealing with that and will have to travel back and forth to Pennsylvania (where he lives) for him .... the doctor gave him 11 months with chemotherapy so ... yeah. We sort of have a lot on our plate right now as it is. His dad really wants us to continue on with our cycle .. I think he hopes he can at least see us get pregnant before he passes. We'll see.
> 
> Since I had the uterine biopsy my DH and I are going to go hard core and try to have a baby naturally this month. OPKs and all. :D I know it works for some people and I would love the chance to try naturally before going onto another cycle. I have a post testing consult with my doctor at CCRM this upcoming Tuesday ... I guess at that point he'll look at all of the tests and we'll come up with a plan for the cycle. I won't get my calendar until I pay the $25,000!! but I'll pay that at the end of this month and then we can get started. Fun times .....
> 
> Anyways, thanks for reading!

Oh wonderful, I hope that the Acai Berry helps you, is it a tablet or like the powder? It is all the rage over here in Australia at the moment - everybody is having those acai bowls hehe. Good luck with this month, i so hope it surprises you! Man, IVF is so expensive isn't it. Good luck with it all, I hope for lots of fantastic updates! :) :flower:


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## ashknowsbest

Got the results of my beta-3 integrin test back and I do not have the protein that's required for implantation. For more information please read my baby and bump journal. It's not make it or break it but it does provide some insight and I'm really looking forward to seeing how this works out for me.


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## Unlucky41

Ash just want to say all the best for the travels. Also I hope you get pregnant naturally it can happen. My friend is 39 and only gets her period once every quarter now pregnant with a boy! 

Bub so happy for you! He is a very happy boy!


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## bubumaci

Ash - finally, perhaps some insight that will help. I am sure, now that they know that this protein is missing, that they can support with implantation?! You will be a Mama :) :kiss:


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## eveclo

ashknowsbest said:


> Got the results of my beta-3 integrin test back and I do not have the protein that's required for implantation. For more information please read my baby and bump journal. It's not make it or break it but it does provide some insight and I'm really looking forward to seeing how this works out for me.

Very interesting Ash, thank you so much for sharing. I will bring this up with my next appointment when we are preparing for the next cycle.


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## ashknowsbest

bubu - they can help implantation by giving depot lupron once a month 2 months before transfer. I'm really looking forward to doing this cycle. I was telling my hubby that a trip to Europe would be AMAZING but now that I may have an answer I feel this yearning to have a baby again ... like immediately! We're both going to write a pros and cons list and then talk about it together once we have our separate lists. I think that will help us come to a good decision about doing it now or waiting...

eve - A good amount of doctors don't believe in the test but that's why I wanted to do our final cycle with CCRM .... they do all of the new/cutting edge tests that other doesn't aren't sure really have benefits. I'm happy I did mine but after research I found that a lot of women get a normal result ... so it was worth it for me (hopefully! I guess we'll find out if I get pregnant) but for other women it hasn't really indicated anything helpful. Also, it's not covered by insurance at all .... and it's a $615 test. That's what I paid anyways. 

Definitely worth so far in my opinion but like I said if your doctor looks at you like your crazy ... it's because it's fairly new and not a lot of doctors are doing it! You can always join me at CCRM though :D


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## eveclo

ashknowsbest said:


> bubu - they can help implantation by giving depot lupron once a month 2 months before transfer. I'm really looking forward to doing this cycle. I was telling my hubby that a trip to Europe would be AMAZING but now that I may have an answer I feel this yearning to have a baby again ... like immediately! We're both going to write a pros and cons list and then talk about it together once we have our separate lists. I think that will help us come to a good decision about doing it now or waiting...
> 
> eve - A good amount of doctors don't believe in the test but that's why I wanted to do our final cycle with CCRM .... they do all of the new/cutting edge tests that other doesn't aren't sure really have benefits. I'm happy I did mine but after research I found that a lot of women get a normal result ... so it was worth it for me (hopefully! I guess we'll find out if I get pregnant) but for other women it hasn't really indicated anything helpful. Also, it's not covered by insurance at all .... and it's a $615 test. That's what I paid anyways.
> 
> Definitely worth so far in my opinion but like I said if your doctor looks at you like your crazy ... it's because it's fairly new and not a lot of doctors are doing it! You can always join me at CCRM though :D

I have private health insurance (in Australia) so usually hospital fees are covered. I have had a biopsy and hysteroscopy previously that was all covered but i don't think they would have done this test as I was already on synarel at the time of my hysteroscopy. So if i can get it done and have it partially subsidised it would be worth it for sure. 

That's so interesting though, I can understand why you would want to rectify the issue and see if anything happens. I am so interested to see how it goes. How does the depot lupron help the issue? So good to know that there is a solution hopefully. :happydance:


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## ashknowsbest

Well this felt like it came up very fast. Not sure I'm ready to move forward but that may just be because of the hectic schedule and the nerves of having another failed cycle. 

I'm starting a new cycle ... yay? I got my period today so I start BCPs on Friday. I take those for I think my nurse said like 22-23 days or something like that and then off to Colorado we go not shortly after that. 

Tentative Schedule:
Start BCPs April 24th
Last BCP May 16
May 20 I'll get a baseline scan - guessing I start the stims this day or a day after
May 24th I get a follicle/lining scan
May 25th I'm supposed to be in CO
May 26th I have a scan with CCRM
June 1st is my retrieval date as of right now.

Fun times. I'm not going to lie ... I have butterflies thinking about doing all of this again. I'm not sure they're good butterflies either, it's like that nervous stomach ache I get when I have to take a test that I'm not quite ready for. I haven't done this in so long it all feels sort of foreign to me. Oh well ... here we go! 

Another little side note. My DH and I planned a trip to San Diego and we don't fly back to San Francisco until the 25th ... so figuring this out should be really interesting. 

Oh and I also have to miss about a week or school .... not good but it is what it is.

Wish me luck!


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## bubumaci

Good luck!!! :dust::dust::dust:


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## eveclo

Oooo wow, so I have finally had my consult and blood results back from the Immunologist and I have ANA (Antinuclear antibodies) The antibodies that target &#8220;normal&#8221; proteins within the nucleus of a cell are called antinuclear antibodies. My levels were 1:160 and they should be about 1:20. I also have been diagnosed with high NKC's in my uterus and slightly in my blood too. The course of action is basically of the next cycle

CD1; start Prednisone (steroid) 15mg
1 week before ET: start Clexane and also have Intralipid infusion
Day of ET; increase dosage of Prednisone to 20mg, begin double dose of Progesterone. 

It feels like such a relief to have some sort of an answer as to why our embryos have failed to implant but at the same time I am feeling scared that maybe we will never be able to fix this issue. Only time will tell but we will be transferring in mid June with our only frozen embryo.


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## bubumaci

eve - I think that sounds like a huge step forward! You have some very clear answers and it sounds like there is a definite solution. Of course IVF / FET etc. never comes with guarantees, but your chances have definitely been significantly increased by this new knowledge!

Not long to go, everything crossed for you! :) xoxo


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## eveclo

bubumaci said:


> eve - I think that sounds like a huge step forward! You have some very clear answers and it sounds like there is a definite solution. Of course IVF / FET etc. never comes with guarantees, but your chances have definitely been significantly increased by this new knowledge!
> 
> Not long to go, everything crossed for you! :) xoxo

I hope these are the answers and that something can be done! I am so nervous and trying not to get my hopes up but this is the first time i've felt a little bit more hope regarding our chances. I just knew in my heart something wasn't right. 

Someone said something like I have to take it like i'm starting all over again; so my embryos still have that 50/50 chance and not to be too let down if it doesn't work, just keep persisting until we have the right amount of meds and perfect embie.

Hope you and your little family are doing fabulously xx


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## bubumaci

Except that you are not quite starting all over again - but, as far as science has come in helping us with getting our little miracles, nature is still a huge factor. There just are no guarantees. That's, what makes it extra hard.
Our doctor did say (the one we switched to after 5 failures), that he did believe we would get pregnant - he just didn't know how long and how many tries it would take.

Thank you for asking, Fabi really is such a gem. I watch him with awe and wonder - still not quite comprehending, that he is here (despite going through the pregnancy and giving birth ... I am a Mother and I can't believe it!) <3


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## SunUp

:hugs:


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## Unlucky41

Hi all just checking to see how is everyone doing? 

Sandy did you ever have your transfer? 

Ash did you do another cycle or went traveling? 

AQ what have you been up to? 

Evelco how you going? 

Bub, bugs and dokva how is motherhood

How is Everyone else that I missed out on? 

AFM my maternity leave has ended and back to work. Can't believe our little daughter is almost one. Love to hear what everyone has been up to.


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## eveclo

Unlucky41 said:


> Hi all just checking to see how is everyone doing?
> 
> Sandy did you ever have your transfer?
> 
> Ash did you do another cycle or went traveling?
> 
> AQ what have you been up to?
> 
> Evelco how you going?
> 
> Bub, bugs and dokva how is motherhood
> 
> How is Everyone else that I missed out on?
> 
> AFM my maternity leave has ended and back to work. Can't believe our little daughter is almost one. Love to hear what everyone has been up to.

Hello! 

I am going well thank you for asking. We ended up doing a FET with our remaining blastocyst with Prednisolone, Intralipids and clexane and unfortunately it was another negative for us. :( we were going to do another cycle this month but unfortunately AF arrived at a bad time when I was interstate and unable to fly back home. I start work at the end of this month which means I probaby won't be able to cycle again for a while but I think maybe this could be a good thing. I need a bit of time to just work out my life and what I'm going to do with everything / lack of options really. I think partly I'm scared of what we will find out (as in another failure or something wrong with our embryos). Next plan is to do same dose that got us 15 eggs last time and then ICSI them all maybe using TESA as our new doctor thinks my husbands sperm could be getting damaged on the way out... And then having them PGD tested. So that's an expensive and long process so I will see how I can go about getting some time off for it or something. 

So exciting that your little one is almost one. How are you enjoying being back at work ?? Are you full time or part time? Have a great day :)


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## ashknowsbest

I did do the cycle at CCRM ... the outcome wasn't that great or different from our other cycles but it was worth a try. We haven't tranferred anything yet becase we're going to do another cycle to get more fertilized eggs so that paying for CCS ($7000) makes sense. I'll be cycling in October/November. 

I did go on my vacation to Europe too! Can't believe we managed both but we got really lucky. My DH and I were visiting his father in Pennsylvania (his father has 3 months to live due to stage 4 esophageal cancer) when he got a call from his work manager saying he needed to be in Zurich Switzerland for work things. So we pretty much got 50% off the trip because his job will pay for almost all of his things. We planned stuff for us to do in front of his work week and then after ... its been great! 

How are you doing?


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## eveclo

ashknowsbest said:


> I did do the cycle at CCRM ... the outcome wasn't that great or different from our other cycles but it was worth a try. We haven't tranferred anything yet becase we're going to do another cycle to get more fertilized eggs so that paying for CCS ($7000) makes sense. I'll be cycling in October/November.
> 
> I did go on my vacation to Europe too! Can't believe we managed both but we got really lucky. My DH and I were visiting his father in Pennsylvania (his father has 3 months to live due to stage 4 esophageal cancer) when he got a call from his work manager saying he needed to be in Zurich Switzerland for work things. So we pretty much got 50% off the trip because his job will pay for almost all of his things. We planned stuff for us to do in front of his work week and then after ... its been great!
> 
> How are you doing?

Sorry that your most recent cycle wasn't that fabulous, fingers crossed the next round makes some fabulous embryos for testing! We are going to do another round maybe next year or end of this year, with pgd as well. Need to know what's going on in these embryos. 

Sorry to hear about your husbands dad, that sounds just awful. Glad to hear you had a holiday though, it sounds like a fantastic trip. Well deserved. :)


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## Unlucky41

Eveclo sorry to hear about your last cycle. So glad you have a good comprehensive plan for the next one. 

How is your new job? 

I went back part time three days and reporting to someone more junior than me. It is only a one year role as well hence they really want me to leave! 

October is not far away two more months. We also thought at the end of this year we should transferour remaining embryo seeing that I am 35. 

Hope this by this xmas we are both pregnant together.


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## Unlucky41

Ash sorry to hear that your cycle didn't go as well. How many embryos did you get? 

Your poor husband. I am so happy that you could have a holiday but it must have been so sad seeing your father in law like that. Cancer took my father 18 years ago so I know how dreadful it could be. 

Hopefully we are cycling together and we all get a bfp soon


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## wannabmum

Hi first congrats to everyone that got their success & good luck to everyone still trying, do you mind if i join you? I have been forum member for a long time but not been about as much lately as had to put treatment on hold to complete adoption of my little bio (bio nephew) only got this sorted end last year by which time clear he had asd so waiting until he was settled in school (he has only just started primary 1) 

Anyway now getting ready to start again have review consultation at old clinic next week thinking doing 1 or 2 icsi there between jan/april & if get nowhere (dont expect too) going go to serum, i would go direct to serum but as having wait till may/june to go there thought may as well try here in the meantime although dont expect it to work. xx


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## s08

I know this is an older, not-so-active thread anymore, but wondering if I could still join? I just got the news that I'm having my third IVF chemical (4th chemical total).

Or is it just for women who do not have children? If so, I TOTALLY get it! I am fortunate to have a son from IVF, so you can definitely tell me to butt out. 

Otherwise, does anyone have experience with repeated chemicals? It just keeps happening. It's like déjà vu! I just don't get why these embryos that apparently look good implant, but then fail. Probably egg quality, I suppose. Ugh!


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## ashknowsbest

s08 - as far as I'm concerned even if you have a child already you're welcome on this thread. Just because you have a son doesn't mean you're not struggling and needing support. Unfortunately I don't have any advice regarding the chemicals as I have never been pregnant ever. I have seen people talk about clotting issues? Or like you said egg quality issues. However, for egg quality there is really not much they can do unless you're willing to pay for CCS/genetic testing. That is where I'm at. If you look at my siggy you can see I've been through the ringer. I'm young and have a horrible attrition rate with my own embryos. Welcome to the group and good luck in the future! :hugs:


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## bubumaci

wannabmum said:


> Hi first congrats to everyone that got their success & good luck to everyone still trying, do you mind if i join you? I have been forum member for a long time but not been about as much lately as had to put treatment on hold to complete adoption of my little bio (bio nephew) only got this sorted end last year by which time clear he had asd so waiting until he was settled in school (he has only just started primary 1)
> 
> Anyway now getting ready to start again have review consultation at old clinic next week thinking doing 1 or 2 icsi there between jan/april & if get nowhere (dont expect too) going go to serum, i would go direct to serum but as having wait till may/june to go there thought may as well try here in the meantime although dont expect it to work. xx

Hi Wannabmum :wave:
I think that is wonderful, that you have adopted your bio nephew! That is such a big-hearted, generous thing to do! Welcome to the thread, I hope that you can find the much needed support that this struggle brings with it amongst the wonderful ladies on here! My fingers will be crossed for you! :hugs:



s08 said:


> I know this is an older, not-so-active thread anymore, but wondering if I could still join? I just got the news that I'm having my third IVF chemical (4th chemical total).
> 
> Or is it just for women who do not have children? If so, I TOTALLY get it! I am fortunate to have a son from IVF, so you can definitely tell me to butt out.
> 
> Otherwise, does anyone have experience with repeated chemicals? It just keeps happening. It's like déjà vu! I just don't get why these embryos that apparently look good implant, but then fail. Probably egg quality, I suppose. Ugh!

Hi s08 :howdy: ... is it possible, that we were on the same thread way back when you got pregnant in 2012? I seem to remember your name.
Anyway, I don't believe that this thread is only for women who have no children. The struggle and the pain is very real, even when trying for subsequent babies!
I did have two chemicals before I got pregnant with Fabi (and he was on the 9th (!!!) try!. It is very difficult to know what causes them. Women have them in natural cycles too - often without even knowing it, because they are not following their cycles so closely. They may just think that their period has been delayed for whatever reason. More often than not, I would think that it is genetic - that something was wrong with the chromosomes of the embryo (neither the egg's nor the sperm's fault) and since nature tries to "select the fittest", the body aborts.
At our clinic, our RE told us about woman, who did have a child naturally and when subsequently trying for a sibling, was having repeated miscarriages (a chemical is essentially a very early miscarriage). They decided to test the woman and the man's genetics and discovered, that she did have two chromosomes that were irregular (for the sake of this story, I will say chromosome 5 and 13). They then proceeded with IVF, harvested eggs from her, fertilised them and then had them PGD tested at blastocyst stage. 5 reached this stage and were tested.
1 had two chromosomes that were irregular. One was 5 and one another.
Another had three chromosomes that were irregular. One was 13 and two other ones.
One had several chromosomes that were irregular (but neither of hers were).
One had practically all chromosomes irregular. This was, if I recall correctly, the best looking blastocyst!!
The last one was perfect, was transferred and she ended up carrying to term and having the baby.

The "moral" of the story - even if you are genetically fully healthy, we must never forget, that sperm and egg fuse. During this fusion, an entirely new being is being created and during this fusion, things *can* go wrong. It doesn't mean that egg or sperm were faulty - it's simply nature.

Now, if you don't have PGD testing done (which we didn't either), you don't know the quality of the embryo being transferred. It may not take at all, it may take for a little while - chemical - or it may take entirely and end up in a later miscarriage ... or - we end up getting lucky and have a happy and healthy pregnancy, resulting in a little miracle <3

As hard as it is, and as much as we need to have answers, sometimes, there just aren't any! And we can be thankful for science and how far we have come - but there is always going to be the element of nature and that we cannot influence.
My fingers are crossed, that you will get that sibling for you LO! :hugs:


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## wannabmum

Thank you so much he is such a great little man full of cheek but makes us smile every day :) we had our review yesterday & are all set to dog ICSI 4 in january :) 

so8 so sorry to hear about your repeated chemicals don't really have much advice but :hugs:

xx


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## s08

Thanks for the warm welcome, ladies. I really appreciate it, especially because I&#8217;m completely aware that there is a difference when struggling for your first child and struggling for subsequent children. There just is. At least for me, the pain has been different.

Bubu, I totally remember you from a previous thread. I&#8217;m so happy you have your miracle after all your struggles&#8230;that&#8217;s wonderful! Is your family complete now? I am planning on asking about PDG testing at my WTF appointment on Thursday (along with immune testing, recurrent pregnancy loss panel, etc.). Before, we did not even consider spending the extra money for genetic testing since we are entirely out of pocket in the first place. I&#8217;m also relatively young (29 at my first ER and 32 at my last), so it&#8217;s not typically recommended by my clinic at this age. I&#8217;m not even sure what my clinic charges for it. I also have an appointment scheduled for mid-October at another local clinic with a RE who specializes in recurrent pregnancy loss, so we&#8217;ll see if she has any fresh ideas or a different perspective. I suspect there is something genetically wrong with my eggs, as my mother also struggled to conceive for 13 years before having me. Interestingly, even my son (who is just perfection, in my totally biased opinion) didn&#8217;t look that great as an embryo. We were not given good odds when they transferred him. Our last two embryos looked &#8220;beautiful,&#8221; and yet here we are&#8230; Goes to show you they really can&#8217;t tell you what is inside that embryo. 

Ash, I think I remember you from another thread as well. I&#8217;m so incredibly sorry that your struggles continue. I&#8217;m older than you, but I do know how exceptionally frustrating it is to be young and unable to conceive. What are the next steps for you?


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## ashknowsbest

I'm also very sorry I'm still going through this. We have come up with a plan of action, thanks for asking. We're going to be starting another IVF cycle with my own eggs tentative retrieval being around the 10th of November. I'm not thrilled that I'm going through this again but I feel we need to give it one more go with my own material before my husband and I move onto donor egg. I think the one thing I have going for me is that I am open to donor eggs so if this cycle is also a bust I will move forward knowing I did everything I could (emotionally and financially) to have my own biological child. I find it very hard to think that I wouldn't love a child that I carried for 9 months but that wasn't biologically mine. That's kind of where I'm at with all of that. 

This cycle will be at CCRM and if all goes as planned I will be pregnant at the beginning of next year. If things don't go as planned I will move onto donor eggs next year and will hopefully be pregnant by the middle of the year .... we'll see.

I think you have a great plan going forward. Sometimes getting a fresh set of eyes on the situation is very helpful. I hope that you get some new ideas and a plan for moving forward soon. I know how annoying/frustrating it can be when you just want answers and to be pregnant and nothing is working.


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## MrsF2012

Hi
Hoping I can join you ladies, haven't been on this forum before but it's the only one I have found for people that have had previous unsuccessful cycles.
I had a natural bfp within four weeks of ttc but sadly a ruptured ectopic at 7weeks and was left with one tube, two months later another bfp and at 6weeks found out another ectopic was treated with methotrexate but after blood work showed increased hcg scan showed little angle has continued to grow and I needed to have my remaining tube and baby removed, I then went through a NHS Ivf cycle 1 perfect blast transferred bfn, due to the way we where treated we decided to move clinic as we had to pay for any further attempts anyway. The new clinic is so so much better had one fresh perfect blast transferred bfn, went on to have 3 more FET cycles five day top grade blasts transferred all bfn. I'm currently waiting for a hysteroscopy, apt on the 28th to review and hopefully get booked in as I also need surgery to remove some scar tissue from the ectopic surgery so having both done at once. I have thin lining that is very stubborn but apart from having no tubes we have no egg or sperm problems, had level one immunes done and all good. Getting very tired and feeling very broken now, I was 22 with the first ectopic and I'm now 25 DH is 29.

I'm sorry everyone has to through this whole infertility journey but hoping having ladies to chat to helps a little x


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## ashknowsbest

I know this thread hasn't been active in a long time but I wanted to stop by to give some hope. This thread was such a great place for support so giving back just feels right. 

After all of the failed IVFs my husband and I went through I'm so happy to announce that we are expecting boy/girl twins! Persistence pays off. I know how hard it is to stay positive and keep fighting but you will win in the end! :hugs:


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## Unlucky41

Congrats Ash so happy for you!


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## s08

Congratulations, Ash!!! How very exciting! Best wishes on an uneventful twin pregnancy!


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## PatientMum

Thank you for posting you great news Ash!
That's excactly what I needed to hear today, my 8th day post 5 day transfer and starting spotting... my 6th natural ivf, plus had two stimulated ones.
Congratulations to your twin pregnancy! I'm so happy for you!


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## dovkav123

Congrats Ash. I am so pleased to know that u are pregnant:flower:

patient mum, I had 7 natural IVFs, 4 total embyo transfers. The last embryo we did assisted hatching, 3 day transfer, I took aspirin 80mg for 12 weeks. My boy is 14 months old now. 
One day you will be a mommy too:flower:


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## Hopesfor2013

Hi ladies (and guys)

Congratulations to everyone that got their BFPs and buckets of good luck to everyone still trying.

I do not post very often but I look at these boards every day looking for hope. Thank you for what you all share - it really helps lurkers like me! 

Brief history - me 33, thin-ish symptomless PCOS, DH 42, DH had vasectomy (he has one child). Treatment so far 2 x failed vasectomy reversals at The Dawson Clinic Hartlepool. Treatment at QEH Gateshead: SSR (5 vials frozen), 1 x ISCI BFN, 1 x ICSI freeze all OHSS, 1 x FET positive but no heartbeat at 7 week scan - D&C, moved to new clinic LWC Darlington: 1 x FET BFN from poor quality frozen embryos that were transferred from QEH, 1 x ICSI freeze all due to OHSS, 1 x FET first time we ever got to blastocyst (grade 4AB & 3BB) - just got BFN today. I over respond to the meds every time and get a lot of eggs but only ever get average-poor quality.

We have just got our BFN this morning following our latest FET and I am looking for hope that we will get our baby. Has anyone been through something similar and got their baby?

Hopes xxx


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## Peachy1584

Ash I am so happy for you! Hopes2013 I do not have the same story but do believe if you can afford it eventually it works and I wish you all the best!


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## bubumaci

Hi Hopes :howdy:
I don't have any experience with PCOS - as our infertility lies with DH (who has azoospermia).

You can see from my signature, that it took us a loong time to be successful - but we were and I am the Mama of a gorgeous 17 month old little boy <3 
It is really hard with PCOS to get the dosage just right, so that you get eggs, but not overstimulate (which is more likely to yield many poor quality eggs). But there have been many successes for women with PCOS, so I have my fingers crossed, that they will figure out the right protocol for you (and that you have the emotional, physical strength to persevere to get your dream).


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## Bluebell bun

Congratulations Ash, delighted to hear your news. 

Hope -sorry to hear about your unsuccessful cycle. Try and stay strong xx


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## Unlucky41

Hi ladies it has been a long long time. 

Just wanted to give your ladies some hope with my story. After getting pregnant after 5 ivf and 1 fet we tried for number two. We did one FET and 1 more IVF. IVF resulted in no eggs. I was so depressed and was told to give up assisted conception.

I then made an appointment with a nathropath that put me on a diet, herbs and supplements. After two months of trying I am now 7weeks and 4 days pregnant. Saw a lovely heartbeat two days ago! 

Sometimes our path or journey is not what we expect but sometimes with prayer, persistence and luck we get there.

Really hope everyone is doing well! 
Once baby number 2 comes our family will be complete. Looking forward to no more appointments and infertility behind me. 

Infertlity definitely made me a different person but for now I am just so grateful that we got there!


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## Unlucky41

Also wanted to say thanks to everyone on the thread for all the support!


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## HopeLoveWins

So its taken me about a week but I just read through all 134 pages of this thread! Even though I knew it was inactive. And I really felt like I got to know some of you amazing brave women, who have been through so much to get to where you are today. 

I have one daughter aged 2 and a half years, conceived through our first cycle of ICSI, and ever since she turned 1 we have been trying so hard to get her a sibling. four cycles of ICSI/IMSI and all nothing. Only one embryo each time so nothing to freeze either. We are so grateful to have one child, I just so wish we could give her a sibling. 

I've never been on a forum before but just read the last page just now and signed up so I could ask a few questions. Africa Queen are you still around? My heart broke for you when I read your happy news that so quickly turned to sad news. I hope you are doing okay. 
And Unlucky which supplements did you take that your naturopath recommended? We are about to embark on IVF cycle 5 and it would be great to know so that I could try and take them. 

Anyway I'm not sure if anyone will read this, but thanks for being so open about your journeys and giving me some hope and solidarity on my journey.


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## mimi4

A friend of mine friend was in the same position - 4 failed IVF-s. She combined her 5th with PGS NGS, and got pregnant. Believe and your dreams will come true. Keep my fingers crossed xx


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## HopeLoveWins

Thank you x


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## bubumaci

My fingers will be crossed for you, Hope!


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## HopeLoveWins

Thanks Bubumaci! I read all about your struggles and your journey gave me hope. Well done for chasing your dreams so hard. Are you going to try for a sibling for your little one?

We had an initial consultation at a new clinic and they suggested batching embryos and PGD which is exciting but also tough considering we only seem to get one viable embryo each cycle. Trying to decide between that or cycle number 5 at our local clinic which is where our daughter was conceived. Any thoughts? May even do both, have number five at our local clinic then a couple of cycles and batching embryos at the new clinic. I'm 39 and feel the window of opportunity is small. Batching will give us an opportunity to use my eggs whilst they are still not quite ancient without wasting months on failed cycles. Any thoughts? These are tough decisions...x


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## Unlucky41

HopeLoveWins said:


> So its taken me about a week but I just read through all 134 pages of this thread! Even though I knew it was inactive. And I really felt like I got to know some of you amazing brave women, who have been through so much to get to where you are today.
> 
> I have one daughter aged 2 and a half years, conceived through our first cycle of ICSI, and ever since she turned 1 we have been trying so hard to get her a sibling. four cycles of ICSI/IMSI and all nothing. Only one embryo each time so nothing to freeze either. We are so grateful to have one child, I just so wish we could give her a sibling.
> 
> I've never been on a forum before but just read the last page just now and signed up so I could ask a few questions. Africa Queen are you still around? My heart broke for you when I read your happy news that so quickly turned to sad news. I hope you are doing okay.
> And Unlucky which supplements did you take that your naturopath recommended? We are about to embark on IVF cycle 5 and it would be great to know so that I could try and take them.
> 
> Anyway I'm not sure if anyone will read this, but thanks for being so open about your journeys and giving me some hope and solidarity on my journey.


Hi hope did you have any luck?

my supplements were designed to help my endometriosis so not sure if it is suitable for you? if you are still interested let me know. 

this thread saved me and thanks for reading


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## bubumaci

Oh, I just saw your question.
Well, we have one embryo frozen (would in theory be older, than Fabi!) - however my husband is suffering from depression and so it seems unlikely, that we will transfer in the near future :( :( 
We wouldn't go through the whole process again, no. I have neither the finances for it, nor the psychological / emotional / physical strength to go through it all again.

What did you decide on?


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