Chinese Accupuncture

Alison, clinics have different timescale for between trigger and EC, at create the had 35 hours but at reprofit its between 35 as and 37. But she said my natural LH could have peaked before the trigger ( which happened before) so its always hard to time EC in natural IVf.

We loved local beer and food!! Its superb and very reasonably priced. We spent a lot of time eating and drinking at starobrno brewery :) also Thai massage was fantastic, I had it every day :) overall I'm feeling OK considering the circumstances. Bring on the next cycle!
 
Alison, clinics have different timescale for between trigger and EC, at create the had 35 hours but at reprofit its between 35 as and 37. But she said my natural LH could have peaked before the trigger ( which happened before) so its always hard to time EC in natural IVf.

We loved local beer and food!! Its superb and very reasonably priced. We spent a lot of time eating and drinking at starobrno brewery :) also Thai massage was fantastic, I had it every day :) overall I'm feeling OK considering the circumstances. Bring on the next cycle!
 
Briss. I think you needed to do that nhs round. Now you know the way forward that is right for you and the way that will bring you your baby.

How much did you end up paying for the flight and hotels? Did you get a cab from the airport?

I have an spot with create but don't know what to do. I don't know if we could come back from losing another 5k but something is not working inside.
 
Blythe, I totally needed to do that nhs cycle, I just think I should have cheated and gone for natural IVF abroad while we were waiting for 8 month! I DH had that hormonal treatment which I was so hoping would improve sperm and I was doing acu/herbs but in the scheme of things, I just think we need to go for IVF more aggressively in 2014. looking back just seems like a lot of time and eggs wasted.

I am so surprised at my temp. I still cant get it how is it possible to have the hormones in order and the temp rise every month and yet have empty follicles?? my charts look like properly ovulatory charts, how would I know which cycles are the empty ones?

re Germany, the only clinic that responded so far was your berlin clinic. They cant do IMSI/PICSI and also if cetrotide does not work they suggest long protocol other wise they think our chances are very low. He did not answer any of my questions relating to fees so no idea how much this would cost. long protocol is an option but this is just so heavily medicated and the doc at reprofit said it's always tricky doing it abroad because with long protocol there is a great number of things that can go wrong well before we get to stims. also I think with long protocol they would go for higher stims and I am not sure I am ready for this. I know this natural cycle failed but it was so easy compared to stim cycles and I feel good to go again while after stims I was getting myself back into shape for 2 months and put on a lot of weight on stims.

re cost we spent about 900 pounds on the failed cycle and most of it on flights/hotel. it would have been so much cheaper if we could book things at least a week in advance. also I booked an expensive hotel because I did not know how I would feel after EC and wanted a good place to stay. there are plenty of decent 3* hotels for 30-40 pounds a night. I know 900 pounds seems like a waste but we had a good break in Brno and at create we would have been about 3-4K lighter now but then again, if it was a matter of missing my egg in the morning I have to say Create was a bit more organised and CRGH were super good in catching that egg but they would cost us around 6K.

12 Nov Natural IVF cycle cost:
Pregnil: 25
Scan (ultrasound direct) CD 9: 99 (just one scan was required)
Bloods CD 9 (E2+LH): 60 (optional)
Flights London-Brno (2): 245 (booked last minute at higher price)
Flights Brno-London (1): 38
Flights Brno-London (1): 50
Hotel: (Barcelo Brno Palace, 3 nights) 264 (about 88 a night)
airport transfer in Brno: taxi 15 pounds each way (15-20 min)
tram to the clinic: 80p per person each way.
stanstead express: 48 (duo - return for two people travelling together)
EC: 50 euro for the needle (no eggs collected, otherwise 850 euro + PICSI 150 euro)

I had brown spotting after EC for 3 days, not sure this is good cos if we had ET I'd be really concerned, just something to raise with reprofit. St create I did not have any spotting after EC. a tiny bit of red blood after the procedure and nothing else.

I definitely feel you should give IVF another try but I find it hard to recommend a clinic, I have not found a clinic yet where I would be happy with everything. Reprofit seems super nice and flexible but you should have seen me before EC, I was a mess, I felt we were loosing that egg and noone was doing anything; the time was of the essence and I was wondering around the clinic begging nurses to get me into that theatre asap. we got there at 8 but only had the procedure at 10! but then again it the follicle was in fact empty I had no chance to begin with
 
Briss - Thank you so much for setting it all out. So helpful. I think £900 is good considering all done at last minute.

Maybe another round with then but having an early morning er would be a good way forward. I did not like lp as it just fed my big cyst.

I actually emailed a clinic in Prague earlier today as they have a sister clinic in London so I was hoping to monitor in London then fly over for EC etc. It begins with g but I will confirm name later. It will of course be more expensive this way and I just need to work out any savings against a cycle at create.

I think you ovulated your eggs early rather than having empty folicles and I see you dtd 2 x in one day. Amazing!! I have had a strange cycle as I get an almost lh rise detectable around cd8/9 but for a dark line this morning. DH tried to dtd last night and just lost erection as soon as started. I was so upset as he cycled over 40 miles that day and said he was tired. We argued and he slept in other room. This morning I just cried and said how upsetting and humiliating it is to have to ask/nag for sex every month. It is fair to say it is no longer an enjoyable experience for either of us.
 
re dtd 2 x in one day, basically tamaxofen's effect is wearing off and Dh has little sex drive so BD is a nightmare again, so gutted! I had to go back to my old ways of quilting DH into BD he could not get excited and I really needed at least 2 BD to clear old stuff for EC so it was tough….

I am talking to German clinics now but it's a world apart from reprofit, they do not seem to have many clients from abroad or people are just taking two weeks to come over. I cant do that I really only need to be there for EC/ET and DH for just one day for EC. but these guys want to start with initial consultation??? after 4 IVfs I really do not need that I know what I want.

I feel guilty for once again not going with my gut feeling and not taking endometacin and also not making it clear we need early morning EC. but at least reprofit agreed to do all that for our next cycle. problem is that everyone is closed from 25th and I may need to have ET on 24th… but I really cant miss this cycle.
 
Thanks Briss..IT sounds like you have a good plan for next month. Blythe my dh was like that too before he started taking clomid now he is doing much better but we are out of meds! I don't want to go back to that battle. I am waiting for an email from the online company we buy it from they have cashed my check for days ago and still no shipment. In addition to drive and functioning down there it has also helped him with the beer/food gut it's almost gone.
 
I am getting slightly disappointed with German clinics, Dovkav's clinic does not want to do a natural cycle before xmas and they want us to come for an initial appointment in mid Jan. They do not seem to speak much English at all so communication is hard. Your berlin clinic is not keen on natural IVF and they gave us 1% success rate and unless we are ready to do long protocol they suggest we "do a treatment in your country of origin". I have no idea where 1% came from but they are clearly not interested in taking us on. None of the clinics answered my questions about fees. There was another clinic in Munich which Dovkav recommended but they completely ignored my email, I think it's because it was in English.

Annoyingly I am going to ovulate just before xmas and basically my ET day can be the last working day the 24th but I so do not want to miss my next cycle. I do not mind going back to reprofit but not sure they can do a cycle before xmas.

I think I have heard about that clinic in Prague. There is a thread on FF. I may try them as well but travelling to Prague and hotel is going to be a bit more expensive than Brno.

Interestingly, though Brno is such a tiny town compared to London and the clinic is smaller, the facilities are so much better than at Create or CRGH. we got our own waiting room while at create and CRGH it's a common room for everyone divided into cabins by curtains so you hear everything.
 
I have contacted reprofit and the one in Prague and have agreed with DH that we will do one of those rather than create. We would save around 2k on full stim cycle. I would want to begin treatment in UK

Briss if you don't mind I have a couple of questions,,,,,

Where is best place to get scans in London?

If I start in UK presumably I have to pay UK prices for drugs.....wonder if worth flying over there to get prescription then buy them there?

I could then fly out around cd10 and stay for around 7 nights.


Alison - what is climid meant to do for sperm? Does it increase numbers?

I have been making myself a fresh raw kale salad every night. I will post link later.....it's delicious and amazing for you too.
 
Blythe, I am coping below my notes and responses of other ladies from FF on scans. I used ultrasound direct it's 99 per scan and I found them efficient. However, the lady who did my scan told me I had two follicles: one on each ovary while when I had an actual EC, both follicles were on the same left ovary. but in the scheme of things you only need to know follicles size and lining and that's not that hard.

re meds, they are definitely cheaper in CR but adding flights and hotel to get there might add a lot to the cost, also this medication may not be readily available. in Brno, there were only two pharmacies that could potentially have that and one required at least 1 day notice and the other luckily had the meds but we waited half day. Brno's clinic pharmacy can also post your meds to the UK (which might be cheaper than buying it here). also with Czech prescription there are only a few pharmacies in London that can accept it and the prices go up for this service. let me know if I can post you some of my meds, I am not sure if I will ever agree to do a stim cycle again and by that time they may expire anyway.

scan in London:

Rachel, have had all my recent UK scans done at the Birth Co on Harley Street, London:
https://www.thebirthcompany.co.uk/ultrasound-scans/gynaecology-scan/

baby bird - I get my scans done at ultrasound direct, and my gp did my bloods. It's worth a try? Even if he won't - he should be able to refer you to a walk in phlebotomy service who'd do them via the nhs for a small fee.
https://www.ultrasound-direct.com/clinic-locations/london-harley-st/

Daisy: use my local fertility clinic, for all of my bloodwork, scans and hcg tests. They are the closest NHS fertility clinic to me, although I pay privately for the treatment. They just have a set package price for initial consultation, scans, writing prescriptions, and bloods to confirm hcg levels at the end of the cycle. The BEST part is that when you get pg, you are already in their books as a fertility patient, so once your pg, you just slot right into the system, so your six week scan is free, as once you are pregnant you become an NHS patient......no discrimination as your pregnancy is not classified as a private pregnancy and the little one growing inside is an NHS patient in their own right. This also goes for meds, as once I was pregnant, my progesterone and estrogen was paid for by the NHS, so it may be worth checking this out if you need any meds post pregnancy. I had a lot of bleeding issues and was scanned every two weeks in the early days, however as a fertility patient, I wasn't signed off into the mainstream pg clinic until the fertility clinic were satisfied that the pg was on going and that I was OK.

re clomid, it has the same effect as tamaxofen, increases male hormones and as a side effect sex drive
 
finding it really hard to deal with German clinics, finally called the Munich clinic and managed to book the initial appointment next week. for some reason you cant just start the cycle without it. the annoying thing is that they do bloods/scans all over again and charge about 1,600 euro for this appointment!! + flights to Munich and annual leave… having second thoughts but this was the only German clinic that offers IMSI. if I understood correctly natural IVF is 660 + 400 for IMSI which is not too bad but the initial charge is outrages unless I did not understand her correctly. they sent me forms all in German – how am I supposed to fill them in??
 
Briss - many many thanks.

I have decided on doing everything i can in London and then flying out around CD10-12.

My last CD3 bloods were taken in Dec 2013 so i think it would be a good idea to get that done ahead of new treatment plan.

I have had responses from Gennet [UK/Prague], Reprofit and GYNEM:

City Fertility/Gennet
Pros: can do everything at their london clinic in Farringdon and they consult directly with their sister clinic in Prague and i would then fly over for EC/ET. I am just waiting to see how much they charge for scans and meds. Initial consult cost is refundable and joint bloods/SA/Scan etc is £250.

ICSI cycle would be £1575 not including meds

direct flights from Gatwick which is much easier for us

Cons: Prague more expensive than Brno for everything


From what i can tell the price for IVF at Reprofit is also around £1500 but im not sure if that includes the meds or not
 
After listening to a Julie Chang/Fertility Revolution podcast (thanks Blythe!) with a maya abdominal massage practitioner, I am intrigued. I made a 15 minute phone consult with a local practitioner for Dec 5. Have any of you heard of this, done it before, etc??
 
Blythe, I am sure the meds are not included in the price.

we are going to Munich but I am struggling to accept their ways, 1200 euros for the initial appointment?? have been filling in their forms in German all day today, I am exhausted! Will send them all my IVF history with all the test results, hopefully that would decrease the amount we have to pay cos together with the flights and hotel this consultation is going to cost us 2 Brno IVfs… but I am working to accept this cos they offer IMSI and cos I need to explore other options without losing any more valuable time. But I have to say that reprofit is just so much easier to deal with. I may look into other Czech clinics, they seem to understand patients from abroad better than German clinics.

Vonn, do report back on the maya thing. I am curious
 
Vonn - its quite difficult to find a decent video of it. if you can find a practitioner and then you can do it yourself! im so glad you listened to the podcasts - some are fab aren't they!

i have had abdominal massage from my yoga practitioner and it was very firm like the maya style. you can do it yourself by really digging in around your pubic bone but there was no prodding around my uterus. it can apparently help with blood flow and moving uterus into optimal position.

please report back :)

Briss - i am swaying towards Gennet - it is 1575 for ICSI and the scans i have during stimulation in London are included in that price so looking at:

drugs - 1000 - 1500
bloods - 330
pre ivf scan - 110
semen assessment - 100

so all in around £3115 and up to 1k for food/travel/hotel for 7 nights etc so around 4k mark all in which does not really seem too much of a saving. i am hoping i can shave some of it off with bloods etc and i have some progesterone left.

we have not been away for 3 years so it would be a nice break. i know create would be more convenient but they charge more for icsi and at Gennet they include assisted hatching which i guess is a good thing and something that create would, again, charge extra for.

im not completely decided....i still need to set out the reprofit costs and compare.


Briss - i am heartened to hear that your are happy with the CZ clinic's dealings with you. However, i am glad you have found a clinic that deal do IMSI.

i am massively impressed you have been sitting there translating all day - sehr beeindruckt!!!!

i wanted to thank you as if it was not for you i would not have considered going abroad as a realistic option but now i feel good about it and like the idea of eating different food and being somewhere other than here whilst doing it!!
 
Blythe, re travelling I agree it does make it very different experience. travelling abroad, trying new things seeing different places, it took my mind away from the whole "no eggs" situation. I just wish I could have kept DH away from the beer... he is so excited about Munich, we even booked the flights for weekend so we could spend a couple of says there, I've never been there before. it also makes me feel better about the costs.

i think it's a good thing that London scans are included in Gennet's fees cos you will be paying at least 100 pounds per scan otherwise and in stim cycles you do have to have quite a few scans.

in London (and in Germany actually) you pay for every step, I was so surprised that they did not even charge for our follow up appointment at reprofit.

I found Reprofit so much easier to communicate with than Create or CRGH. you have a direct email contact with your co-ordinator and your doctor so you discuss everything and get responses within 1-2 hours. at create I sometimes was calling 4-5 times before somebody responded and at CRGH you just leave a voicemail and hoping they will call you but often they do not.

the Munich clinic is also responsive, they respond to my emails within 2 hours.

I was actually so scared going there for egg collection, I was awake at 4 am saying mental good-bye to everyone, it's like jumping off with a parachute for the first time but once you've done it you realise that actually it's fine. as I said I so wish I started this earlier. For some reason I was convinced that UK was leading in fertility treatments but I am not so sure now.

my german translation was so funny at times, google translate rocks :)

I'd really recommend joining the FF thread for your chosen clinic, it helps to get a feel for the clinic and sort all the logistics. it can save money and time cos ladies have done all these trips before and know what works.
 
I had my HSG today and good news, no blocked tubes. Yay! I also got results from day 3 tests. They didn't test estradiol, though. Grrr.

FSH = 10.5
AMH = .165

You ladies are so well researched, do you have thoughts/feedback/suggestions on these numbers?? :shrug:

Dr wasn't shocked by these, said they weren't great but pretty normal for my age. She mentioned I'd probably need some assistance next cycle (which I read as clomid, or some such thing). I go back in on Tuesday, cycle day 10, for an ultrasound to look at follicle development.
 

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