Friends son abusive to her

[pregatlast]

I'm really worried about a friend. She has 3 kids, a 4 year old daughter, 6 year old son and 11 year old son. She has had behavioural issues with the 11 year old since I've known her (around 6 years). I hadn't met up with her and all the kids for a long time due to school etc, but had a day out with them yesterday. She told me she was having a really hard time with the kids, the eldest in particular, bullying the 6 year old and talking to her in a way that she didn't know how to deal with.

I was quite horrified to hear him, I'd say it was verging on abusive! It was his tone as much as his words, telling her she wS deaf, stupid, fat, leaning right in and shouting at her for getting sand on his things, demanding the largest ice cream since he was the oldest etc etc. She said she can do no right by him. It was awful!

I don't know her husband very well, he is 15 years older than her and very very old school, ie the kids and house are her responsibility and earning money is his. I don't know if he talks to her in a similar way which the 11 year old has adopted, or where he gets it from. I know he isn't very supportive to her with parenting.

I've suggested before that perhaps he needs more one on one attention as the younger kids get more due to their age, but they are all quite hard work, my friend is quite timid and she gets little support from her husband, or family, so is too exhausted to address things.

I really don't know what advice to offer her???

 

[amytrisha]

Maybe advise she speaks to the child's school? They'll probably be the most help I'm sure they'll have some sort of pastoral care in place for this kind of thing x

 

[pregatlast]

She has spoken to the school before and they have said they have no issues with his behaviour, it only seems to be with her??

 

[nicem815]

Yikes...it sounds like therapy would be a really good option...

 

[daneuse27]

That sounds awful I feel bad for the two younger children watching their mom get yelled at like that. I wonder if they will adopt it as well over time. Mostly, I feel awful for your friend. I couldn't imagine having anyone (let alone my child) speak to me like that.

I think your friend's first step though is recognizing it as abuse. Sometimes when you live with behaviour like that all the time, you forget how abnormal and shocking it is to everyone else. I think you should contact her and tell her how shocked you were by how the 11 year old treated her, and ask her questions about how common it is, and if she ever stands up to herself. Comment on how you've never seen or heard anything like that before.. basically, help her see it as abuse if she doesn't already. I think thats the first step if shes going to get help (which I really hope she does!) x

 

[housewifey]

Gosh, that sounds so difficult for her to deal with, especially with little support.

I'd say to you, be there for her as often as possible, even a text or a phone call every now and then can mean a lot to somebody in a situation like hers. If possible try to meet up without the children present, she may have not even told you the half of it if he was there.

I'd suggest maybe reaching out to social work if the school are unable to help. Social work aren't just there to remove children from homes as many people may think, they may provide her with some effective strategies to control his behaviour and also support her son with alternative ways to behave.

Give her a hug next time you see her

 

[OnErth&InHvn]

Theres nothing YOU can do since they arent your kids. SHE has to make some action to change it.

 

[pregatlast]

I actually text her this morning saying that I hoped she didn't think I was out of line saying it but I was quite shocked by his behaviour. She said she was glad that I noticed it as she struggles to explain to other people how bad it is. I think I'm going to say to her that if it was her husband talking to her like that then it would be classed as verbal abuse and see how she reacts. She has asked her doctor for help before and they have just offered to refer him to a specialist to see if he has any medical/special needs - but she doesn't think that's the problem and I don't either. Her husband has said before that he doesn't want her to probe it too much with 'professionals' as he doesn't want social services involved, but she can't live like that. I've told her it isn't good for her and it isn't good for the younger kids to think that a) that behaviour is acceptable for them to copy or b) that it is acceptable for someone to treat them in that way, either now or later in life.

Thanks for the advice.

 

[pregatlast]

PS - my friend tends to smack her kids when they misbehave - not what I would do, but not my kids. She told me about a year ago now that it didn't work anymore with the eldest as he just hits back!!!!! I need to ask her if that still happens.

 

[OnErth&InHvn]

I actually text her this morning saying that I hoped she didn't think I was out of line saying it but I was quite shocked by his behaviour. She said she was glad that I noticed it as she struggles to explain to other people how bad it is. I think I'm going to say to her that if it was her husband talking to her like that then it would be classed as verbal abuse and see how she reacts. She has asked her doctor for help before and they have just offered to refer him to a specialist to see if he has any medical/special needs - but she doesn't think that's the problem and I don't either. Her husband has said before that he doesn't want her to probe it too much with 'professionals' as he doesn't want social services involved, but she can't live like that. I've told her it isn't good for her and it isn't good for the younger kids to think that a) that behaviour is acceptable for them to copy or b) that it is acceptable for someone to treat them in that way, either now or later in life.

Thanks for the advice.

You can get care and NOT involve social services. Our 9yr old has special needs and they automatically send in a social worker to the room and I said NO, she was not welcome. They made a note in our chart. Her special needs are a sensitive subject and i dont need to be judged or rehash the past through a social workers eyes.

MOST of the time they are there to help you get resources- in our case get pediasure, etc.

I know you want the best for your friend but you need to know boundaries too. SHE has to want this and not feel pressured to.

And for the love of pete- leave her marriage alone too! My husband looked at porn and had a sex addiction- people outside could have 110% said his behavior looked like abuse and they would have been WRONG. Imagine if they had pursued it?! (Hes well into recovery and much better)

 

[WackyMumof2]

Some children a quick spank works, others it won't. My 9 year old when he has a tantrum then the only way we have found to stop it in the butt is with a quick smack - and nothing to hurt him but enough to stop him in his tracks to think about his behaviour as well as to calm him down. For our 9 year old, those events are very few and far between and have become less and less as he's gotten older. I can't think of an occasion in the last 16 months where he's had one to be honest. If we didn't, he would go for hours! His Grandmother is the main issues in that because he wants, she gives with no regard to me but all that is changing. She doesn't have a choice especially with his lactose intolerance playing up which is a blessing in some strange sense. DS2 on the other hand, it only feeds the behaviours we don't like. But regardless of age or behaviour, they do get a warning spank (again, nothing to hurt) when they are being excessively rude and asking them hasn't helped.

That said, an 11 year is too old to be spanked and it's NOT going to stop the behaviour but I think, from what I have read, feed it. Your friend really does need her husband on board in a way that works for both parents. Old school or not, he's older and it's not working anymore. But some serious therapy to help identify what is causing him to lash out etc could benefit him. Could also be an underlying and diagnosed medical condition? By all means, I am NOT making excuses but it could be worth question anyway. He's going to get stronger and do more harm to the little ones as he gets older. Your friend also needs to get some professional help in as well. Best of luck to her and her family.

In no way, am I, by any stretch of the imagination a perfect parent and I too have struggled with my children's behaviours - and I still do. A lot of that was my upbringing (I wan't raised in an abusive home but we were raised with firm discipline) and that's contributed to how I parent. It has taken me YEARS to be able to actually have the strength to put myself into a program to understand not only my children, but how to parent better. We all make mistakes, it's part of being a parent. But maybe a Parenting program with a high success rate could benefit her and her eldest as well.

 

[Strassette]

Wow, that is a hard situation for your friend. What has she tried in term of discipline? I know everyone has their own values when it comes to disciplining, but I know that something like grounding has been a common one in the past. As my mother always said 'your friends will come and go but your sister will always be there with you'. I remember being grounded from friends if my sister and I weren't getting along so we could focus on our relationship with each other. If it has gotten too out of control though, where it is teetering on dangerous, I would recommend counseling - individual for the 11 yr old (with mom present for some sessions?) and then maybe family counseling ?
I would definitely encourage your friend, though! Make sure she knows she isn't alone. This is a tough situation and she may feel helpless and powerless in term of what she can do.
Good luck!

 

[daneuse27]

I'm glad that she is finding some support in you reaching out.

He may not have medical needs, but I think he does need therapy to determine why he lashes out and treats his mother like this. I wonder why the husband sounds so worried about getting "professionals" involved. It may be an intimidating thing to go through as a family, but would he rather his wife continue to be treated this way by their son? Would he rather his son grow up to treat other women this way?

I don't agree with advice telling you to back out as its not your family or kids. I think your friend needs support. Listen to what she has to say, and give her your honest opinion if she asks for advice. I hope that her and her family get the help they need.

 

[OnErth&InHvn]

I'm glad that she is finding some support in you reaching out.

He may not have medical needs, but I think he does need therapy to determine why he lashes out and treats his mother like this. I wonder why the husband sounds so worried about getting "professionals" involved. It may be an intimidating thing to go through as a family, but would he rather his wife continue to be treated this way by their son? Would he rather his son grow up to treat other women this way?

I don't agree with advice telling you to back out as its not your family or kids. I think your friend needs support. Listen to what she has to say, and give her your honest opinion if she asks for advice. I hope that her and her family get the help they need.

Im not saying not to listen or offer a hug... or even turn the other cheek. Im saying OP doesnt need to act as if shes the mom. Know boundaries that she can still help.

 

[pregatlast]

I'm not really sure how I am giving the impression that I'm the mum, or that I feel I need to take action, or that I'm saying anything about my friends marriage?! I am simply asking for advice on how to support my friend and for any advice I might be able to pass on to her to help her out - none of us are perfect, we all need help from each other.

Thanks for all the positive comments. My friend was at the doctor herself yesterday as she has just told me she is on anti depressants and is really struggling and not enjoying life as a mum just now. She said the doctor was really helpful about her situation with her eldest and has asked her to keep a diary to help try to identify the triggers for his outbursts and reactions and so on.

In terms of what discipline she has tried, obviously I don't know it all, but things she has told me/I have seen include shouting, sending him to his room, not allowing him to go to his clubs, removing his phone/games console, having reward charts to encourage positive behaviours etc. He seems to have quite a chip on his shoulder about being so much older than his brother and sister and feels everything that is done is done for them and not for him, hence the reason I have suggested to her before that she tries love bombing, or asking for his help with the younger kids, giving him a bit of responsibility etc but as I've said, she doesn't have much support from her husband and he is out of the house from 7am to 8pm mon to fri, so she really is quite abandoned. I mentioned that he is old school - it sounds like he doesn't get very involved with the kids, it is her department. He earns the money and she shouldn't ask about it and she deals with the kids and house and he shouldn't have to help.

I'll pass on the advice of counselling/therapy and see what she says.

Thanks again