The failure of Feminism?

[Nibblenic]

The point I want to start with in this thread is do you consider yourself a feminist. If you were all sitting with stangers in a pub say and some one asked would you say.... YES I am a feminist?

Or do you think all feminists are women in flat shoes with sort hair and possibly thier bra on fire.

I would like to think that every woman in the UK are equal to men but maybe when you scratch even a little below the surface you see that isnt the case for everyone everywhere.

I have to say there have been many advances since feminism first began just over 150 years ago and has takeled some huge issues in it various waves however...

My question is do you think the female population especially the under 30's consider themselves feminists and if they dont can anymore advancements in equality for all women be made if there is no longer a feminist movement?

 

[Lightworker]

I tend to shy away from the term "feminism" lean more towards gender equality. Looking at it from a global perspective I think women are their own worst enemies. In African and Asian cultures, women today still take pride in submitting to their husbands. They take pride in bearing children and keeping house (not that its a bad thing,we all have our purposes to fulfill) but a significant percentage still have that mentality of subservience. In the UK and West generally, maybe not so much.

 

[marley2580]

Yes I am a feminist and proud to be one. But when I say that to people they give me a very funny look. Most women would deny they were a feminist as it seems to have become synonymous with man-hating lesbians. I think that feminism did a lot for women but where it went wrong was in assuming that what women want is to 'have it all' - babies and work. If you were a woman that wanted to be a houswife or a SAHM then you were brainwashed and needed to be 'freed'. As a result women have stopped being slaves within the home only to become slaves in the workplace. What feminism should have focussed on (IMO) was about women's choices - if a woman wants to become a high flying executive she should be supported and encouraged, equally if a woman wants to be a SAHM then she should also be supported and encouraged.

 

[Lightworker]

Yep agree totally

 

[Nibblenic]

I have to say I also get funny looks when I say I am a femminist.
Mostly likely doesnt help that I have short borwn undyed hair normally wear flat shoes little to no make-up
Oh yeah have to carry around a fire extingisher to put out my bra constantly catching fire!

Thats the thing, if you ask a women if they think they should have rights to equal pay, to vote, to pensions, and promotion they will say yes. If you ask if they have the right to choose when they have children, when and who they marry, where they go and what they choose to do they will scream YES!

For some reason I think the message has been lost somewhere. It doesnt seem cool or even normal to call yourself a femminist but most women believe in the ideals that the movement held but dont want to associate themselves with the term femminist

 

[Lightworker]

You know the age group you identified are largely women who are in the process of finding husbands etc and like you say, I think women are aware that men are wary of feminists (based on some distorted understanding of the feminist movement) and so will always try to disassociate themselves from it. Mens natural instinct is to be the protector and they thus prefer a more vulnerbale type woman IYKWIM? So many women will try to play that part. I wonder if this post makes any sense lol

 

[Lightworker]

Personally, if I was trying to promote feminism, I would have an array of well-rounded women to front the campaign eg have lawyers, engineers, SAHMs, nurses, clergy etc and more than that, highlight their succesful relationships with the men in their life to show that feminism is about equality and that its not all about women living solitary, career-driven lives.

 

[bubbles]

I wouldn't say I'm a feminist at all, probably far from it. I think it's great what the feminist movement has done in the way of allowing us to vote etc but sexism still exists and they way I see it going now I think it could easily flip round to women being in the male role where we discriminate because of their gender.

did any of that make sense? it's late

 

[storm4mozza]

i personally think its each to their own, if a woman is happy being an independant woman then good on her, on the other hand if a woman prefers to be a housewife, cooking, cleaning and looking after the kids to please her husband thats her choice and each should be respected.

i class myself as an independant woman but i still like some of the traditional things like taking the mans name in marriage and hopefully being a stay at home mother

 

[bky]

I had an English teacher who had a sign that said Feminism is the radical notion that women are people. I agree with that slant on feminism, but hesitate to call myself a feminist because I've just met so many of the anti-men variety.
I used to joke I was a better feminist than self proclaimed feminists because I didn't see anything wrong with me going to work while my husband didn't, when the so-called feminist people I knew went on and on about how he was using me, being lazy etc. Talk about double standards!

Once a movement has overcome major barriers it's hard for those that it currently benefits to see things that still might need doing outside of the extreme slant, if that makes any sense. I mean, I think there are still things that need feminist activist attention (outside of piecemeal and isolated cases of injustice), but they aren't obviously outrageous, so don't get the necessary attention/public outrage, or are swept into the 'radical' pile IYKWIM...

There are so many movements where a vocal minority gives the whole movement a bad name that makes people actually doing good works in the movement's name want to distance themselves from the name...Not just feminism, but lactivism, political and religious groups etc...

 

[caz81]

I dont think im one at all, I believe my job is to look after my husband, children & house and my husbands job is to go out and earn the money for the family. I hate the fact that a lot of people look down on women who want to be housewives. I respect that other women might not agree with me and I think its nice there is meant to be a choice now. In reality I think women are just expected to do it all now and looked down on whatever choices they make.

 

[Nibblenic]

For those who look after thier home/family/man.
I take it as read almost, that is is YOUR choice to stay at homoe and be a homemaker. That is wasnt decided for you by your husband or by society? Sure that in itself is feminism at work? Also
Do you exersize or think you have a right to say vote and have a individual political stance seperate from your husband?
Do you consider yourself equal to your husband and worthy of the same respect or are you under him?
If you did decide to work in the future should you be paid less than a man doing the same job as you?
Do you believe your daughter have the same right to eductaion as your sons? DO you think that you have a say in what rights your children have?


I think all of the homemakers have said that they believe that women should have the right to work if they choose to. Surely that is also feminist view? That women should have rights and be able to choose how to exersize them?

 

[Lightworker]

That is why there is so much confusion. People automatically think being a feminist means being a high power career woman. I feel that title should be changed into something more comprehensive eg "gender-equalism" that reflects the true agenda of feminism. Otherwise there will always be mistakes and misunderstanding.

 

[Nibblenic]

I also think that the label or term feminism has become a negative word. Also something people want to dissasoicate thmeselves with. Even if they believe in the fundementals of the movement.

 

[OmarsMum]

For those who look after thier home/family/man.
I take it as read almost, that is is YOUR choice to stay at homoe and be a homemaker. That is wasnt decided for you by your husband or by society? Sure that in itself is feminism at work? Also
Do you exersize or think you have a right to say vote and have a individual political stance seperate from your husband?
Do you consider yourself equal to your husband and worthy of the same respect or are you under him?
If you did decide to work in the future should you be paid less than a man doing the same job as you?
Do you believe your daughter have the same right to eductaion as your sons? DO you think that you have a say in what rights your children have?


I think all of the homemakers have said that they believe that women should have the right to work if they choose to. Surely that is also feminist view? That women should have rights and be able to choose how to exersize them?

I dont like the term "feminism ", & I dont know why. For me men are men & women are women & they'r created in a different way. It's men's responsibility to provide a decent living for their families, & women have the choice to help.

If men & women where equal, we would have pregnant & BFing men, & lots of females workng as plumbers, garbage collectors & heavy machinery operators.


I have a post graduate degree & I was a facilities manager. I was treated equally to men at work. I had the same benefits & salary. I used to work at an engineering site in the middle of the desert full of male engineers & workers.

- Now, I'm a SAHM & I dont feel different.

- I vote & sometimes my political views are different than my DH's but we talk about it openly & he doesnt try to force his views on me

- DH never made me feel less than him, I have better education than him, I speak two languages fluently but he only speaks one & still struggles with the second. I'm better than him in managing finances, budgeting & organising payments. He's a successful business man & owns two businesses but he always seeks my help if he has problems at work or if he needs fresh ideas for his business. I have an open account & credit cards & DH gives me the money I want without questioning it. He never expected me to use my savings or own money for paying any expenses or buying my own stuff

- As for working in the future, we dont have decent part time jobs here, & as my family is my priority & I'm happy with helping my DH, I'm not planning to work again as an employee anytime soon. I might start my own business but it's still too early to think about it

- I had better education than my brothers as I wanted it & my dad supported me & offered to pay for it. But I refused as I was earning well & was able to pay for my MBA. It will be the same for my future daughters

- As for brining up my children, DH doesnt really interfer as he's a spoiler & he's very open to my ways or parenting & he respects my decisions.

I dont think I'm a feminist or equal to men, in fact women were created to tolerate more pain & stress than men. I dont even think it's fair for women to be equal to men. If we look at the big picture, they'r created to be better than men.

 

[Lightworker]

PP is a brilliant example of how feminism is misunderstood. I think people take their agenda too literally. Yep men and women are different eg if there's a burglar in the house, it is more likely that the man will investigate due to his strength etc however, feminism is more about creating an equally accessible platform for women eg women have the right to choose to be a SAHM or to go to work or to vote. Before feminism SAHMism was imposed on us, we were forced to be subservient,now we choose.

 

[Lightworker]

It's not about men and women having the same strengths and characteristics like the example of a man BFing, it is about equal OPPORTUNITIES. It is about giving a woman the right to choose in a world where women are treated as 2nd class citizens or even worse, as commodities.

 

[marley2580]

I dont think I'm a feminist or equal to men, in fact women were created to tolerate more pain & stress than men. I dont even think it's fair for women to be equal to men. If we look at the big picture, they'r created to be better than men.

Too true lol

 

[OmarsMum]

Here females have better jobs opportunities than men I had 5 offers at the same tins & I tripled my salary within 3 years after graduating. As we'r expats, females are cheaper to hire as most of the time they are sponsored by their husbands/ fathers. We even have better facilities in banks & gov offices. We don't wait in cues as females have priority to go 1st.

 

[Lightworker]

OT NMWB it seems Dubai has come along in leaps and bounds. I remember a decade ago my mom applied for a visa to go and shop in Dubai and it was turned down because she was a female travelling without a male relative.