4th loss in a row - now what?

[OmarsMum]

I'm not sure how aspirin can cause a mc, but in my case, it seems that it starts bleeding, I also found the article

https://www.theguardian.com/science/2003/aug/19/healthsection.medicineandhealth

It says "Aspirin could block some powerful developmental pathways," he says. "This is a particularly critical time. It could interfere with the growth of blood vessels in the baby"

I'm staying away from it as I don't need it for clotting.

 

[LacePrincess]

Yeah I'm going to stop the aspirin but I'm slowing weaning off to be on the safe side. So hard to know what to believe and it's discouraging that it really seems like all dr's ever do is guess, then they turn around and go oops actually that stuff doesn't help it might hurt! Gee thanks!

 

[ReadynWaiting]

I agree! A lot of their knowledge is also opinion based which makes it difficult. I think just staying well informed keeps me a head of the Drs or at least able to question some of their advice.
I was thinking of taking aspirin but now it doesn't sound good. I still have to be tested for clotting issues but I really don't think that is my problem.

 

[Sweetkat]

Have found out today (10&4) that I am in the middle of my third MMC. Baby stopped growing at 10 weeks. I was almost expecting it as we have had 2 losses in a row and as OH has poor morphology (6%) and is on methotrexate for a medical condition, on which you aren't supposed to get pregnant (although his consultant swore blind it's safe).

Strange thing is, when he was off the medication, my DD was born fine. Now that he is on the medication, this keeps happening. I am not even upset, well I was crying earlier, more angry and pissed off.

Blame OH too because he didn't take the medication for 4 years when aw first met and didn't want kids. Then started taking it, then stopped taking it, now taking it and I have 3 MMCs in a row. Poor morphology think is caused by this.

Of course there could be an issue with me, will have the baby tested after the D&C and will have standard tests for blood clotting etc. Maybe they will find a reason.

Two of the losses were late on - 8&3 and now ten weeks (by measurements).

Sigh

 

[ReadynWaiting]

So sorry to hear this Sweetkat!

 

[Sweetkat]

So sorry to hear this Sweetkat!

Thanks. I can't believe that this far along and for the third time

 

[LacePrincess]

I agree! A lot of their knowledge is also opinion based which makes it difficult. I think just staying well informed keeps me a head of the Drs or at least able to question some of their advice.
I was thinking of taking aspirin but now it doesn't sound good. I still have to be tested for clotting issues but I really don't think that is my problem.

Well it's good to still get tested. Even though it is disappointing when everything is normal (how odd that is to say!) at least it rules out something.


Sweetkat - omg, I'm so sorry. So many hugs to you. It really is so infuriating! I really think this morphology thing is very likely to be a culprit. But it's so frustrating when there's nothing they can do short of IVF/ICSI that can help!!

 

[Sweetkat]

I agree! A lot of their knowledge is also opinion based which makes it difficult. I think just staying well informed keeps me a head of the Drs or at least able to question some of their advice.
I was thinking of taking aspirin but now it doesn't sound good. I still have to be tested for clotting issues but I really don't think that is my problem.

Well it's good to still get tested. Even though it is disappointing when everything is normal (how odd that is to say!) at least it rules out something.


Sweetkat - omg, I'm so sorry. So many hugs to you. It really is so infuriating! I really think this morphology thing is very likely to be a culprit. But it's so frustrating when there's nothing they can do short of IVF/ICSI that can help!!

I have been googling non stop re low morphology, and here is just one example


https://ivf.ca/forums/topic/28624-abnormal-morphology/

There is a lady there with 7 pregnancies all ending the same way. Can't be a coincidence, surely? Personally, I would rather know that there is no chance of a successful outcome naturally and try ICSI than be literally butchered every time after getting pregnant naturally.

And when I Google andrologists in London even Harley street all I get is people specialising in erectile dysfunction surgery. Thanks but no thanks

 

[Sweetkat]

Here is another one about male factors, and bad morphology linked to DNA splitting is listed as a factor

https://www.preventmiscarriage.com/Non-Immune-Causes/Male-Factors.aspx

Of course nobody will ever know whether this is THE reason for them, but some of us here seem to be affected by the same thing.

Not feeling too good today. Surgery tomorrow . I have never had any surgery in my life and now this, under General anaesthetic as well . For my sins obviously.

 

[LacePrincess]

Thanks for the links, SweetKat. I hope your procedure goes well. I'm so sorry you feel so badly, I know how it is, after my mmc during Christmas I was endlessly crying and saying over and over again, why me? What did I do to deserve this? Am I too greedy for wanting another baby? Who did I hurt in a past life to get such shitty karma now?

But it's none of our faults, at all. Nature's just a cruel bitch sometimes. The fear of it is now I feel like nothing will ever go right.....even if we get pregnant with a sticky bean I feel like I'm doomed to have everything go wrong anyways, one way or another. I mean I've beat the odds of more than 3 miscarriages in a row, why wouldn't the long odd bad things keep happening, right?

I do think this morphology thing just HAS to be a culprit. At least my RE agrees with me on that. Unfortunately it's just not very fixable. We're thinking donor sperm but I'm a little skeeved out at the thought for now.......We have one more IVF/ICSI round we're doing and then we just can't afford IVF anymore. I can clearly get a bfp on Femara, but not keep them.....and if our culprit is the morph it seems like donor sperm is the way to go.

 

[Sweetkat]

Thanks for the links, SweetKat. I hope your procedure goes well. I'm so sorry you feel so badly, I know how it is, after my mmc during Christmas I was endlessly crying and saying over and over again, why me? What did I do to deserve this? Am I too greedy for wanting another baby? Who did I hurt in a past life to get such shitty karma now?

But it's none of our faults, at all. Nature's just a cruel bitch sometimes. The fear of it is now I feel like nothing will ever go right.....even if we get pregnant with a sticky bean I feel like I'm doomed to have everything go wrong anyways, one way or another. I mean I've beat the odds of more than 3 miscarriages in a row, why wouldn't the long odd bad things keep happening, right?

I do think this morphology thing just HAS to be a culprit. At least my RE agrees with me on that. Unfortunately it's just not very fixable. We're thinking donor sperm but I'm a little skeeved out at the thought for now.......We have one more IVF/ICSI round we're doing and then we just can't afford IVF anymore. I can clearly get a bfp on Femara, but not keep them.....and if our culprit is the morph it seems like donor sperm is the way to go.

I am actually waiting at the hospital to give blood so can have surgery tomorrow. I don't understand why things have to go wrong 3 times in a row for me. 1% of women have recurrent losses and somehow I end up in that 1%?! Like why?

Ok I am 35, that's not good. But plenty of people I know had baby after baby in their late 30s. So surely my age alone can't be to blame.

I am seriously considering leaving OH over this. Ok so maybe logically it's not his fault, but before he started methotrexate he didn't want children with me (he had 2 from a previous relationship). So he basically didn't care that I was worried that on the medication things would never work. He did give it up before DD was born, but he can't anymore.

So I am stuck in this shitty worst nightmare situation for which there is no resolution . I don't even have an RE - nobody seems to know anything about male factors in miscarriages and all just fob me off

Going to have testing done to see if anything is wrong with me, but I just don't think so...

Really hope we both work it out and get our babies. Well I am totally baby obsessed and with each loss becoming more so

 

[LacePrincess]

SweetKat, I'm very similar to you, I know how you feel. I'll be 37 in a few months (and where the heck did this decade go?!?) and part of that 1% of 1% club too. Totally sucks.

Have you talked to your DH about your feelings? Maybe it's time to see a counselor together?

I hope you can get in to see an RE, but honestly I'm not sure it'll help. They seem to know so little about recurrent losses, and morphology issues and how to fix them. Though it really would be worth it to test for everything they can test for. All our testing came out normal, which is frustrating in its own way since we still haven't figured out what we can fix, but it was worth doing.

 

[Sweetkat]

SweetKat, I'm very similar to you, I know how you feel. I'll be 37 in a few months (and where the heck did this decade go?!?) and part of that 1% of 1% club too. Totally sucks.

Have you talked to your DH about your feelings? Maybe it's time to see a counselor together?

I hope you can get in to see an RE, but honestly I'm not sure it'll help. They seem to know so little about recurrent losses, and morphology issues and how to fix them. Though it really would be worth it to test for everything they can test for. All our testing came out normal, which is frustrating in its own way since we still haven't figured out what we can fix, but it was worth doing.

I am 36 very soon . Thing is, if everything tested normal it has to be the sperm. I am obviously yet to test.


Right now I hate OH for wasting so much time in my late 20s and when I was desperate for children, because he already had his. Ok so even if there is some issue with me, prior to 30 there was more time to solve it.

Has your DH had tests for DNA fragmentation? Apparently even normal sperm can have that and anything above 30% makes carrying to term nearly impossible because the embryos are bad. Well at least if we get that, there is no way I am risking another pregnancy with OH.

Here is to hoping that we both get healthy babies.

I also found this


https://www.tdlpathology.com/services-divisions/tdl-andrology/sperm-dna-fragmentation


Hugs xxx

 

[Sweetkat]

This link is from Lister hospital - they have a well known miscarriage clinic


https://www.spermcomet.com/couples/miscarriage/

It says their research shows that 90% of unexplained losses have to do with sperm quality.

 

[LacePrincess]

Yeah that totally doesn't surprise me Sweetkat. What I don't get is why me and DH managed to make 3 perfectly healthy babies together, and now we can't. It's bizarre, sure we're a bit older but we're not OLD, and I thought guys only suffered from decreasing sperm quality due to age after like age 50+.

Nothing makes sense.

No we didn't have a fragmentation test done, I'm not sure my clinic does it but I will need to ask next time I see my RE.

 

[Sweetkat]

Yeah that totally doesn't surprise me Sweetkat. What I don't get is why me and DH managed to make 3 perfectly healthy babies together, and now we can't. It's bizarre, sure we're a bit older but we're not OLD, and I thought guys only suffered from decreasing sperm quality due to age after like age 50+.

Nothing makes sense.

No we didn't have a fragmentation test done, I'm not sure my clinic does it but I will need to ask next time I see my RE.

I don't understand anything at all. OH is 50+ but he was nearly 50 when DD was born. Could things have gone so much downhill cos of medication? I don't know. Maybe it's actually an issue with me. But DD was born fine, no issues....

Going to send OH off for tests and myself too.

Miserable place to be. Only way is up

 

[LacePrincess]

Well not much to do but try again....and again....and again. It is miserable.

 

[Sweetkat]

I sort of try saying to myself that I haven't lost babies, but haven't managed to make one cos sth went wrong . So it was almost a baby, so very close, but not enough

If you think too much about it you can actually end up losing the plot

 

[Sweetkat]

Mind you, I have lost the plot already. I think of almost nothing else and haven't done for the last year

 

[Sweetkat]

OH is going for his DNA fragmentation test today, although won't have any results for 2-3 weeks. If that comes back as fragmented, then even if there is sth wrong with me, fragmentation can't be fixed and OH can't give up his medicine which I think is causing the fragmentation (read some research papers online on this).... And even IVF chances are reduced with fragmentation. So I think OH and I will split over this.

He had the option of having children with me before he started the medication and didn't want children then. And now it may be impossible . Wish we could get the results today.