5 year old shoots dead 2 year old sister...

[juicyfruity]

this upsets me so much. that poor little boy is going to live with that guilt for the rest of his life. it will haunt him. it makes me so angry how careless people can be. i just dont understand the american gun mentality

 

[DragonflyWing]

Wow. I actually own several guns and even think it's fine to teach kids about guns, but I would never let a 5 year old handle a gun, and I would NEVER EVER EVER leave a gun "in the corner" for my kids to play with. That is absolutely ridiculous and I think these parents need to be arrested for reckless endangerment and perhaps even involuntary manslaughter.

That poor little boy, his whole life is going to be ruined now. Not to mention his poor little sister. So sad.

 

[lhancock90]

Annnnnnd its happened again.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...-shot-chest-brother-13-played-home-alone.html

Shes in critical condition, but seriously how many times will this happen!?

 

[sue_88]

Disgusting. These poor kids.

When will American's learn.

 

[kerrie24]

The parents should be ashamed of themselves.

 

[steph.]

Wow. I actually own several guns and even think it's fine to teach kids about guns, but I would never let a 5 year old handle a gun, and I would NEVER EVER EVER leave a gun "in the corner" for my kids to play with. That is absolutely ridiculous and I think these parents need to be arrested for reckless endangerment and perhaps even involuntary manslaughter.

That poor little boy, his whole life is going to be ruined now. Not to mention his poor little sister. So sad.

I dont think they should be charged, it wont achieve anything. They already have their own life sentence- losing their beautiful daughter and knowing they were responsible for it.

 

[DragonflyWing]

While I agree that no punishment would be worse than their own guilt, I do think there should be legal repercussions.

 

[babyjan]

Annnnnnd its happened again.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...-shot-chest-brother-13-played-home-alone.html

Shes in critical condition, but seriously how many times will this happen!?

I can't believe it's happened again!!

Poor girl, I hope she makes it through

 

[SaraEmily]

I've grown up around guns my whole life. They were locked in a safe, unloaded, unless we were out hunting. I started going hunting with my dad when I was 5 and he took safety VERY seriously.

I don't really see this is as a gun problem. It's a neglectful parent problem. And if you have a gun in the house, you need to be that much more careful. But it's not as if it's impossible to safely keep a gun in the house. You can outlaw guns, but you can't control neglectful parents.

Parents like that are the type who might leave a toddler alone to play in a medicine cabinet, or near a pool unsupervised, etc. I really don't think you can blame the gun. If this had been an accidental stabbing because the kids were playing with knives unsupervised, banning knives wouldn't even be part of the discussion. It would be about the parents not watching their kids.

 

[steph.]

While I agree that no punishment would be worse than their own guilt, I do think there should be legal repercussions.

But why? To punish them? I think they've had the ultimate punishment. To keep them from 're-offending'? I'm inclined to think they will be a lot more careful from now on. To serve as an example so other parents dont let their kids play with a loaded gun? Most wouldnt because their children would die not because they would go to jail.

I think this family is suffering enough and should be left alone to grieve and to do the best they can for their son.

 

[DragonflyWing]

While I agree that no punishment would be worse than their own guilt, I do think there should be legal repercussions.

But why? To punish them? I think they've had the ultimate punishment. To keep them from 're-offending'? I'm inclined to think they will be a lot more careful from now on. To serve as an example so other parents dont let their kids play with a loaded gun? Most wouldnt because their children would die not because they would go to jail.

I think this family is suffering enough and should be left alone to grieve and to do the best they can for their son.

Partly because while you or I would be guilt-ridden if this happened to us, we can't assume that of everyone. Just going on what was in the article, at least some of the family believes that it was God's will, that it was "her time to go." They may not be taking responsibility for their child's death at all. There are good reasons why breaking the law comes with legal consequences. Not to get too esoteric, but the family isn't the only one who lost this child...the whole world lost this child and everything she would have accomplished in her life. I feel terrible for the parents because as a parent myself, I'm not sure I could live with myself if I caused the death of my child. However, I don't think this absolves them of legal responsibility.

 

[Piper84]

Wow. I actually own several guns and even think it's fine to teach kids about guns, but I would never let a 5 year old handle a gun, and I would NEVER EVER EVER leave a gun "in the corner" for my kids to play with. That is absolutely ridiculous and I think these parents need to be arrested for reckless endangerment and perhaps even involuntary manslaughter.

That poor little boy, his whole life is going to be ruined now. Not to mention his poor little sister. So sad.

I dont think they should be charged, it wont achieve anything. They already have their own life sentence- losing their beautiful daughter and knowing they were responsible for it.

I don't agree that they necessarily know it's their fault. I presume there are laws which state you have to keep loaded weapons kept locked away when not in use. This wasn't the case here and the parents' negligence caused loss of life.

The father of a youth near here who left his guns unlocked was sentenced to a year (on probation) for reckless manslaughter and reckless bodily harm after his son dead shot 15 of his fellow students, and himself. I think it's the right way to go as it also serves as a warning to others being negligent with their weapons and an example has to be made, regardless of their personal loss.

 

[overcomer79]

I don't think all americans should be grouped together as irresponsible parents as some seem to think we are

 

[Piper84]

I don't think all americans should be grouped together as irresponsible parents as some seem to think we are

This isn't a thread about you or anyone else who doesn't keep loaded weapons within reach of their children.

I don't think Americans should be so defined by their nationality that they can't see beyond a perceived slight on their ability to parent safely and contribute to the debate.

 

[overcomer79]

well excuse me but phrases like "when will americans learn" or "americans love their guns more than their children" (the latter wasn't said on here but I saw t in one of the comments really irritates me because we are all being grouped together but gotcha...carry on.

whether you like it or not, we are all defined by nationality maybe not by the individual but certainly by others.

 

[Piper84]

That's true, but there are also other comments here that try and address the situation.

Of course people define us by our nationality, but also by sex, social class, hair colour, parenting, etc. It doesn't mean we have to define ourselves by our nationality when it comes to debating a contentious issue.

 

[steph.]

Wow. I actually own several guns and even think it's fine to teach kids about guns, but I would never let a 5 year old handle a gun, and I would NEVER EVER EVER leave a gun "in the corner" for my kids to play with. That is absolutely ridiculous and I think these parents need to be arrested for reckless endangerment and perhaps even involuntary manslaughter.

That poor little boy, his whole life is going to be ruined now. Not to mention his poor little sister. So sad.

I dont think they should be charged, it wont achieve anything. They already have their own life sentence- losing their beautiful daughter and knowing they were responsible for it.

I don't agree that they necessarily know it's their fault. I presume there are laws which state you have to keep loaded weapons kept locked away when not in use. This wasn't the case here and the parents' negligence caused loss of life.

The father of a youth near here who left his guns unlocked was sentenced to a year (on probation) for reckless manslaughter and reckless bodily harm after his son dead shot 15 of his fellow students, and himself. I think it's the right way to go as it also serves as a warning to others being negligent with their weapons and an example has to be made, regardless of their personal loss.

I'm pretty sure they do blame themselves. They are human. I think that when they say that maybe it was her time to go and the God wanted it this way it is their way of trying to come to terms as to why this happened, and this explanation provides comfort. It doesnt mean that they dont blame themselves.
I dont think it provides a warning to other parents if they get charged. Honestly can you imagine someone thinking "oh i was going to let my kid play with this loaded gun, but since it means i could go to jail then i wont". I think the warning to these other parents is that a child died.

Yes they were responsible for her death, the same way a parent is responsible when they leave the pool gate open and a toddler drowns, or a stair gate open and the child falls down the stairs, or they forget their baby in the car and the baby dies, or they reverse the car out of the garage and run over their toddler. I guess in all these situations you could say the parent was negligent, but it was an awful deadly mistake and as a result they have had to go through what i imagine would be the absolute worst thing to go through- losing your child. Giving them a criminal record wont help anyone, it will just make it harder for the family to carry on, find a job, look after the other kids.

 

[Piper84]

I'm pretty sure they do blame themselves. They are human. I think that when they say that maybe it was her time to go and the God wanted it this way it is their way of trying to come to terms as to why this happened, and this explanation provides comfort. It doesnt mean that they dont blame themselves.
I dont think it provides a warning to other parents if they get charged. Honestly can you imagine someone thinking "oh i was going to let my kid play with this loaded gun, but since it means i could go to jail then i wont". I think the warning to these other parents is that a child died.

Yes they were responsible for her death, the same way a parent is responsible when they leave the pool gate open and a toddler drowns, or a stair gate open and the child falls down the stairs, or they forget their baby in the car and the baby dies, or they reverse the car out of the garage and run over their toddler. I guess in all these situations you could say the parent was negligent, but it was an awful deadly mistake and as a result they have had to go through what i imagine would be the absolute worst thing to go through- losing your child. Giving them a criminal record wont help anyone, it will just make it harder for the family to carry on, find a job, look after the other kids.

I think the combo of loss of a child and criminal liability are more compelling than the loss of a child alone. I also think the law has to apply to everyone or it can be picked apart in each individual case, which is not the point of having legislation intended to protect people, especially when this kind of accident seems to happen so often.

I'm not sure where exactly these recent shootings have occurred, but here is a list of states in the US where you are obliged to keep your loaded weapons away from children: https://www.leg.wa.gov/Senate/Committees/LAW/Documents/SummaryOfStateChildAccessPreventionLaws.pdf

Legislation regarding leaving a pool gate or stair gate open or accidentally running over a child is not as clear cut. If the parents have broken the above laws, I don't think they should be allowed to get away with it just because the result of their stupidity resulted in the loss of a child. If anything, I think it makes it more justifiable to prosecute them.

 

[steph.]

I do get what you are saying, but what i meant was in cases where the parent's action which led to the death of their child was not done intentionally. So a parent accidently leaving the pool gate/stair gate open. Like in this case, they didnt intentionally let him play with a loaded gun as they thought it was unloaded, and if that had been the case nothing would have happened.

Btw i dont agree with guns, let alone kids having guns and think its completely crazy that a parent would buy their child a gun. But they were allowed to do it, and thats where the real problem is.

 

[Piper84]

On a personal level I also agree that losing a child is enough for any parent to deal with for a lifetime, but I was trying to view it from a legal perspective.

I really don't know the ins and outs of these recent cases as I find them too depressing to read, so I'm just going on the basis of parents who are recklessly leaving loaded guns around all the time.