Chinese Accupuncture

yeah I did i wanted her to be able to interpret the messages right I told her i had twins conceived from IUI. So i don't know if i should have given so much info. My twins will be six in at the end of February so that I guess anytime from june on if she is right. I have read a lot about wrong readings though so even though i do believe it's just hard to get email readings prob. I am around o time and have not done anything to track it. Bd sunday night but didn't lay still or anything to keep stuff in so prob should at least try tonight if i want to be in the game at all this month. It is cd 14. I have been too busy looking for floaters in my pee instead of testing for surges and temping.

Shiseru I like femara much better than clomid it has less side effects than clomid won't thin your lining as much.

Hi Briss !

Psychic123 is gail. Mesina's was not that expensive for all that she wrote to me. She did hit the nail on the head with my sadness/heaviness over my body just not working the way it is supposed to. This year both my SIL got knocked up in one month so i guess comparing myself to them made me even more sad if you know what i mean because a lot of women's bodies work right. Also because I had primary and secondary infertility I really appreciate the blessing of ever getting pregnant at all unlike aforementioned sister in law's who get pregnant and lock themselves in the bathroom to cry about it for two hours. We should all be so lucky you know?
 
Alison, sorry about UTI, I got it after lap, quite dreadful but easily treatable with antibiotics (there is a kind that you can take while TTC)

Ladies. very interesting about these predictions. I am so intrigued

I'm getting fatter and fatter, no trousers fit me anymore :( but I have no motivation to exercise or diet, am so tired from working non-stop
 
Alison, wow that prediction is really detailed. Interesting! I had this Fengshui master that came to me every year, said I have 3 children, 2 girls and 1 boy. I lost 1 baby girl and one at 8 weeks, this little one is my 3rd, so there, 3! I wonder is that it? :(

Sorry about your UTI I hope it clears up soon take some cranberries it's good for preventing UTI.

Indeed I don't have any side effects from Femara, so far so good tonight is my last pill and I will go in for a scan tomorrow.

Blythe, I took clomid but no IUI, just TI. I heard of soy isoflavines but didn't try. Not sure how it works, is it the same as Clomid and Femara?

Briss, work stress can definately cause weight gain! Well you don't have to diet or exercise a lot. I remembered I had glucose resistance when I was pregnant so i had to control my sugar level, I went on low GI diet, cut down carbo but lots of protein and fiber. I lost all baby weight in 2 weeks after giving birth and shed another 35 pounds after that!
 
Briss it does get old having to diet and excercise all the time I am sitting here not wanting to walk during my lunch hour and craving chocolate..I sure hope that guy was wrong shiseru. Well most of them are wrong I hate to say it so why not him too.
 
Thank you ladies, do not know what to do with myself just finished off a couple of chocolate eclairs... so much for losing weight

finally my temp's decided to move up, on 4-5 DPO. Was told today that will have to go on yet another business trip next week, basically will be flying all over europe most of next week, not great for the second part of TWW :( and also because of that will have to spend yet another weekend at the office

Blythe, how are you? just saw your chart, I am so sorry about AF...it's all so hard
 
just got a nasty wake up call, hubby's bought this machine that can measure your everything and my body fat is apparently 31%, I googled it and:

Essential Body Fat: 10%-13%
Athletes/Body Builders: 14%-18%
Average Healthy Female: 19%-27%
Borderline: 28%-31%
Overfat: 32%
Obese: 38%

I was skinny most of my life, how did I manage to turn into borderline fat category after 3 years of TTC... truly depressing, most people are concerned with baby fat, I still have no baby, just fat :(

That machine also said I do not have enough water, my biological age is 33 and I should not eat more than 1200 calories a day

Blythe, what do you think about going back to juicing? it's supposed to be much warmer by the end of the week
 
Wow Briss why did you DH buy a machine that measure fats? Did he need it himself or.. is he encourage you to lose weight? Drink lots of water to keep yourself hydrated, juice is great too! I put on a little weight after 3 rounds of clomid!

I went in for a scan this morning CD7, my lining is 6.5mm. follicle size is 12.5mm, 5mm (LO) and 6mm, 7mm (RO)

Looks like there will only be one dominant...
 
just had my app with Dr Z, will post a more detailed report later when I have more time but in short I did not feel it was worth 250 pounds, I would need to pay much more to start the actual treatment. She said a lot of general stuff that we know anyway about lifestyle etc. I managed by some miracle to persuade my hubby to come with me (had to promise that I will pay) and he just got a confirmation that it's all just a lot of nonsense. In the same way as my FS she did not pay much attention to my DH's low sperm count and just said that if my body is well I can get pregnant with any kind of sperm count. I really want to believe this but I do not think it's true. One of the scariest things she said after looking at my list of herbs (from my previous doc) is that I should stop them immediately because they are causing my cycle to get shorter which she thinks is a problem. So basically I paid for 4 months acu and herbs just to screw my health even worse? She said that every doc has a different style but that's not the combination of herbs she would prescribe ever to smb with my deficiencies. I am seriously upset
 
Oh briss I am upset to read this :( what a huge dissappointment and I totally understand your anger and upset over the herbs comment. I'm feeling very cynical about it all right now although have ordered some herbal pills from eBay.... Which I will take pre ovulation.

Will you proceed with a treatment programme with her? It all seems such a gamble but I suppose I hold onto those wonderful stories of women who have those acu/herbs successes.

I will look forward to reading more about it later :hugs:
 
just had my app with Dr Z, will post a more detailed report later when I have more time but in short I did not feel it was worth 250 pounds, I would need to pay much more to start the actual treatment. She said a lot of general stuff that we know anyway about lifestyle etc. I managed by some miracle to persuade my hubby to come with me (had to promise that I will pay) and he just got a confirmation that it's all just a lot of nonsense. In the same way as my FS she did not pay much attention to my DH's low sperm count and just said that if my body is well I can get pregnant with any kind of sperm count. I really want to believe this but I do not think it's true. One of the scariest things she said after looking at my list of herbs (from my previous doc) is that I should stop them immediately because they are causing my cycle to get shorter which she thinks is a problem. So basically I paid for 4 months acu and herbs just to screw my health even worse? She said that every doc has a different style but that's not the combination of herbs she would prescribe ever to smb with my deficiencies. I am seriously upset

Hi Bris,

Mel here...the girl that her hubby has a pathetic 2.5 million count, too. I'm call BS on the quote from your FS that said, "If you're body is healthy, doesnt' matter what the sperm count is". That's simply not true at all. First off, I'm extremely healthy and lean, running marathons for the past 7 years. My body fat is about 19%. The one "off" thing with me is I have long cycles due to my exercise, however, they are very healthy cycles when they come around. I feel like my body is very healthy and ideal to facilitate a pregnancy; however, it's all my hubby's fault. :nope:

To see the impact of sperm count read this article: https://health.nytimes.com/health/guides/disease/infertility-in-men/print.html
Basically, as my husband said, he's not even at the starting gates, according to this article, especially read the paragraph about the "The Path to the Egg". Kinda sobering. After reading this, my husband and I are convinced that it is all him now...and according to our FS and his urologist, it is.

Sure, losing weight will help and can't hurt, but I think your fertility issues are more likely due to the man, in this case.
 
she also said it's OK for him to drink alcohol!!! I thought I was going to explode, it was such a difficult thing to get him to quit beer and obviously now all my arguments and months of persuasion are out of the window. the main reason I went to her is because she talks a lot in her book about how easy it is to treat men and I was hoping she can prescribe him a herbal formula or smth, no such luck.

My DH actually was annoyed cos he is convinces that Dr Z was coping my other doc's herbal formula (after she explained how bad it was)

At the moment I am just really confused
 
That sucks bad briss, I am glad you are with someone whom you trust more now. For now I am just sticking with Pregnitude and fish oil and giving hubby alive whole nutriets liquid everyother day or so , fish oil and 1000 mg vit c. I think i was pounding us with too much before and it caused us to go iron deficienct (too much mg maybe?). Trying to get us to drink more water as both reproductive systems are fluid and he has weird joint paint which we think is dehydration.

I have dreams a lot of gett BFPs (really dark lines) and feeling a litle tiny baby in them too vivid. Last night all my friends were also pg too and I was telling one of them ,"but you don't understand what a big deal this is for me it is something i have wanted for 4 yrs". UGH then the alarm beeps this morning, pathetic.

BRiss would you guys think of doing IUI?
 
she also said it's OK for him to drink alcohol!!! I thought I was going to explode, it was such a difficult thing to get him to quit beer and obviously now all my arguments and months of persuasion are out of the window. the main reason I went to her is because she talks a lot in her book about how easy it is to treat men and I was hoping she can prescribe him a herbal formula or smth, no such luck.

My DH actually was annoyed cos he is convinces that Dr Z was coping my other doc's herbal formula (after she explained how bad it was)

At the moment I am just really confused

Ugh! Sorry to hear that. My doctor, and husband's doctor has said that with his sperm counts, it's almost impossible to get pregnant unless we get his counts up! So...I have him on a restricted diet, weekly acupunture, supplements, herbs, and he is taking Clomid, which his doctor prescribed. We're not sure if we can get his counts up due to his testicular cancer, but we're trying. He is due for another test this week. Also, I told him to drink a lot more water throughout the day, as he tends to run really dry and his volume is very low. We're trying this naturally for the next 5-6 months, and if not, then we'll have to explore other options. Good luck!!
 
Briss, there is definitely impact in TTC if the sperm is not strong.. but TCM does help! The TCM that I am with, there are 2 couples' DH with very low sperm count, low motility managed to conceive with the help of TCM. Me - after 2 tragic losses started TCM and found my cycles and health improved and carried a baby to term. My DH can only perform once or most 2x before the TCM but is now able to BD more during the fertile period. However, it needs both hands to clap in order to suceed that means both parties must maintain healthy throughout the TTC journey. Well did you notice any difference after you and your DH started the herbs?

I think you should just take her comments with a pinch of salt. And seriously... cut down alcohol.

Alison, before I knew i was pregnant, i have dreams about BFP too.. and it came true after a few months! So that's pretty positive!

I am going in for another scan tomorrow CD9, they said if the size is mature we can have the trigger and IUI at the same time. I am not comfortable doing that. I know washed sperm can survive 48 hours, but they lose the potency after 6 hours so it's best to have the IUI near to ovulation, that would mean at least 24 hours after the HCG trigger. I'll just have to decide tomorrow what to do.
 
The appointment was 20 min late which was rather annoying because my DH and I were taking time off work and also it was really hard to get my DH to go there in the first place so he was trying to use every excuse to leave. After we were finally showed in, we spent some time going through her form and answering outstanding questions (the usual TCM questions (but limited in number compared to Lewis' list) and medical history questions). She started with getting my age wrong, she thought I was 45! (thank you very much, do I REALLY look like 45?) then she gave us a speech about women between 35-45 being pre-menopausal and having difficulties conceiving. She also talked about lifestyle changes for quite a bit but I just remember holding my pen waiting until she says something important to take a note of and did not write anything in the end because everything she said was quite basis stuff and we all know that (eat well, fruit and veg, exercise, relax etc). But she did mention actually a few things that we should avoid which includes chili/curry, cold drinks and sugar is also in "avoid" category (I really need to take this seriously and start a war on chocolate) she also explained what TCM is and how acu and herbs are used (I did not need to pay 250 pounds to hear that) So I do not really have that much to say about this part. In the end she gave us a list of lifestyle recommendations where she ticked what applies to my DH and I which is helpful.

Then she checked my pulse and tongue and her assistant and she immediately said "red"! like it means something. I asked what it meant and she said she will explain but she never properly did actually. but when she was examining my tongue she looked at her assistant and said "worry". Later she also said it means I have excessive heat. They also examined my DH, you should see her face when she saw his tongue! Apparently it was "yellow" and dry and it also means excessive heat (I was actually suspecting it because my DH drinks so much water and he is often red). I asked why I have excessive heat while I am always cold? she tried explanting it, something to do with different organs or channels but I am still not quite getting it. She also said I have lever stagnation (something I suspected all along based on Lewis' list) which is causing excess heat and she said they need to clear all these accesses before true picture of my state appears.

Turning to my DH, apart from heat she mentioned nothing else really so I am still at a loss as to what his problem is. According to her our failure to conceive is all my fault and his miserable 2.8 million sperm count have nothing to do with it. I doubt it based on the huge numbers of women struggling to conceive with DHs low sperm counts. "you only need one" principal does not really work because for this one to get through you need ideally hundred millions to increase the odds. She said she can only treat him after I have been dealt with because my body is the key. Before she can prescribe what herbs I need to be taking I am supposed to do the blood test on CD1-3 but when I was told that it's going to be around 700 pounds (together with sperm test) I changed my mind. I am thinking I will try to get some of these tests for free from my FS (I am seeing her in May).

About herbs, she gave me a list of herbs and ticked 8 of them - I assume the ones I will be taking and said I would need to start with raw herbs (not powders) and she gave me instructions on how to boil them (takes over an hour!) twice a day. The cost is 10 pounds a day. One important thing she mentioned about herbs is that they should not be taken when ill particularly if it's cold (presumably because they clear heat). For acu, it would be enough if I came once a fortnight and every visit is 130 pounds.

re charts, I sent her all my 18 charts hoping she would study them to prepare for the appointment because there is a wealths of information there, I record all my symptoms on a daily basis but she did not. she started showing me how to chart my temps... I showed her my chars I do not think she particularly wanted to review them but she did and found that my first follicular phase is problematic, temps go too high and it's on a short side, not great. i need to concentrate on improving it. no idea how

vitamins, again I sent her a list of my DH and my vitamins which is really big and was hoping she can say whether we are on the right track but instead she was just trying to make us buy hers. I previously looked at hers and i do not think they have anything I am not currently taking

My DH's conclusion was that this is a lot of non-sense as he thought and it's for people who have plenty of spare cash to waste. I came out feeling very confused. Obviously upset because she criticised my other doc's herbal formula - this just makes me distrust TCM practitioners generally including Dr Z and I understand why my DH's chinese friends do not go to chinese docs in London - they cant tell who is good. My gut feeling is that she was right about my doc because since I started going to her my acne got out of control - sign of heat, isn't it? as soon as I stopped taking her herbs and returned back to my old doc's herbs I do not have any new spots coming out and I ovulated later (still probably due to stress more than anything) so I am thinking that might be that very first doc I went to a year ago was not that bad after all, I know I came out all bruised and feeling horrible but my acne got better and she did this painful procedure to clear heat - which is basically my issue. maybe I should go back to her? another option is to try to get these blood tests done (obviously without paying a small fortune) and then go to Dr Z
 
shiseru, that's the thing after 4 months of acu my cycle did not improve and my acne was getting out of control. I was hoping that acu and herbs were improving my egg quality (something you cant really see) but now I am not so sure. I wish I could get my DH to do acu and herbs but he is so against it. I manage to give him some chinese pills that are supposed to improve his sperm. My DH agreed to stop beer completely for 3 months which is expiring on 20 May he is now threatening that he is going to start binge drinking, he is clearly not enjoying the experience. Good luck with the trigger, I agree that ideally you want it as close as possible to O but it's so difficult to time it perfectly so it might be safer to get the sperm there early rather than risking getting them there too late

Melly, thanks for the link that's very interesting. have you had a repeat SA to check if the vitamins acu etc had any effect on your DH's sperm count? My DH has similar sperm count it would be so interesting to see whether it's all working

Alison, I have these dreams too and I feel so happy until I wake that is, I find that things come to you when you do not think about them. I do not think it's possible for TTC, I cant think of anything else.

Blythe, how are you doing?

I am pleased to see FF moved my O to CD13 - result! My deal did not go through, gutted after all the hours I've put in but slightly relieved there is less to do next week. Am working again tomorrow! when will I get my weekends back
 
The appointment was 20 min late which was rather annoying because my DH and I were taking time off work and also it was really hard to get my DH to go there in the first place so he was trying to use every excuse to leave. After we were finally showed in, we spent some time going through her form and answering outstanding questions (the usual TCM questions (but limited in number compared to Lewis' list) and medical history questions). She started with getting my age wrong, she thought I was 45! (thank you very much, do I REALLY look like 45?) then she gave us a speech about women between 35-45 being pre-menopausal and having difficulties conceiving. She also talked about lifestyle changes for quite a bit but I just remember holding my pen waiting until she says something important to take a note of and did not write anything in the end because everything she said was quite basis stuff and we all know that (eat well, fruit and veg, exercise, relax etc). But she did mention actually a few things that we should avoid which includes chili/curry, cold drinks and sugar is also in "avoid" category (I really need to take this seriously and start a war on chocolate) she also explained what TCM is and how acu and herbs are used (I did not need to pay 250 pounds to hear that) So I do not really have that much to say about this part. In the end she gave us a list of lifestyle recommendations where she ticked what applies to my DH and I which is helpful.

Then she checked my pulse and tongue and her assistant and she immediately said "red"! like it means something. I asked what it meant and she said she will explain but she never properly did actually. but when she was examining my tongue she looked at her assistant and said "worry". Later she also said it means I have excessive heat. They also examined my DH, you should see her face when she saw his tongue! Apparently it was "yellow" and dry and it also means excessive heat (I was actually suspecting it because my DH drinks so much water and he is often red). I asked why I have excessive heat while I am always cold? she tried explanting it, something to do with different organs or channels but I am still not quite getting it. She also said I have lever stagnation (something I suspected all along based on Lewis' list) which is causing excess heat and she said they need to clear all these accesses before true picture of my state appears.

Turning to my DH, apart from heat she mentioned nothing else really so I am still at a loss as to what his problem is. According to her our failure to conceive is all my fault and his miserable 2.8 million sperm count have nothing to do with it. I doubt it based on the huge numbers of women struggling to conceive with DHs low sperm counts. "you only need one" principal does not really work because for this one to get through you need ideally hundred millions to increase the odds. She said she can only treat him after I have been dealt with because my body is the key. Before she can prescribe what herbs I need to be taking I am supposed to do the blood test on CD1-3 but when I was told that it's going to be around 700 pounds (together with sperm test) I changed my mind. I am thinking I will try to get some of these tests for free from my FS (I am seeing her in May).

About herbs, she gave me a list of herbs and ticked 8 of them - I assume the ones I will be taking and said I would need to start with raw herbs (not powders) and she gave me instructions on how to boil them (takes over an hour!) twice a day. The cost is 10 pounds a day. One important thing she mentioned about herbs is that they should not be taken when ill particularly if it's cold (presumably because they clear heat). For acu, it would be enough if I came once a fortnight and every visit is 130 pounds.

re charts, I sent her all my 18 charts hoping she would study them to prepare for the appointment because there is a wealths of information there, I record all my symptoms on a daily basis but she did not. she started showing me how to chart my temps... I showed her my chars I do not think she particularly wanted to review them but she did and found that my first follicular phase is problematic, temps go too high and it's on a short side, not great. i need to concentrate on improving it. no idea how

vitamins, again I sent her a list of my DH and my vitamins which is really big and was hoping she can say whether we are on the right track but instead she was just trying to make us buy hers. I previously looked at hers and i do not think they have anything I am not currently taking

My DH's conclusion was that this is a lot of non-sense as he thought and it's for people who have plenty of spare cash to waste. I came out feeling very confused. Obviously upset because she criticised my other doc's herbal formula - this just makes me distrust TCM practitioners generally including Dr Z and I understand why my DH's chinese friends do not go to chinese docs in London - they cant tell who is good. My gut feeling is that she was right about my doc because since I started going to her my acne got out of control - sign of heat, isn't it? as soon as I stopped taking her herbs and returned back to my old doc's herbs I do not have any new spots coming out and I ovulated later (still probably due to stress more than anything) so I am thinking that might be that very first doc I went to a year ago was not that bad after all, I know I came out all bruised and feeling horrible but my acne got better and she did this painful procedure to clear heat - which is basically my issue. maybe I should go back to her? another option is to try to get these blood tests done (obviously without paying a small fortune) and then go to Dr Z


Thank you briss for noting this all down.....im very interested to read of your experience. I think im miffed most about the fact that she charges so much yet it lacks the personal touch. I would have expected her to have done her homework on you and have looked at your charts. I think she would have been better off asking what your experince of ttc and tcm was at the beginning before spending all that time talking to you about obvious stuff you already know.....obviously if you are new to this that info is crucial but i cannot imagine many of her clients are new to ttc......fruit and veg, relax..yes, yes, yes.....yawn.....although chilli avoidance recommendation for you is good as you are clearly already hot! Not so me....so heat creating foods are something i should go for. It would have been good to get a clearer explanation as to why you have that excess heat but still feel the cold.

45......how dare she!!!

Yes i think you have been treated for kidney yany deficiency in the past (the obvious go to diagnosis for girls ttc).....i think you have plenty of yang/heat already hence the increased acne with your last treatment plan. I would be very tempted to get her herbal prescription and do the herbs for a month or two....get a list of exactly what she has given you and buy them yourself from thereon......wont she do the herbs until you have sorted the Cd3 bloods?

I had my cd3 bloods done with my first FS appt in March......yes get them sorted in may....not long now.


Im ok.....im CD5 today and my period has been nice and steady and mostly red without clots....so quite a good one...not sure if it was post HSG effect or the black cohosh. I was intending to take BC CDs 1-10 but i wont pick the pills up until today so may leave it this cycle and try next....then i was thinking about doing soy isoflavines CD 5-9 but now probably wont....i did do them for a three month period last year with no joy but do recall having very strong ovulation pains each time......something for the back burner.

Upping my dose of dhea has certainly given me a natural lift in terms of energy and im staying up later with no ill effect the next day.....i feel positively younger. Skin is reacting but nothing to mortifying....yet!

I have some chinese herbal pills turning up today so will knock them back this week pre ovulation....will post link to them in a mo.....

i no longer have any tone in my body....i used to be fit and strong but now am lardy and lazy.....am going to do some smoothies working back up to juicing then possibly starting next cycle with another juice fast attempt....something else to focus on to take edge off the obvious :)
 
This is what i have coming.......

Nuan Gong Yun Zi Wan, is an all natural Chinese herbal supplement that is traditionally used for the treatment of female infertility. According to Traditional Chinese Medicine (TCM), it is best for cases due to cold in the uterus.

Although prescribed most commonly for infertility, Nuan Gong Yun Zi Pian can also be used to relieve other conditions such as dysmenorrhea (painful menstruation), delayed or irregular menstruation, deficiency type lower abdominal pain, soreness of the low back, threatened miscarriage and/or fatigue.

Western medicine acknowledges the importance of warmth in the reproductive cycle as well. For example, the hormone progesterone is known to have a thermogenic effect on the body and is responsible for preparing the endometrium for implantation of the egg after ovulation and fertilization. Lower levels of progesterone may result in a shortened luteal phase, also referred to as luteal phase defect and is typically considered an ovulatory disorder which can lead to infertility. The importance of harmonizing Yin and Yang in the treatment of infertility cannot be overstated.

Although uterine cold is of course closely linked to Yang deficiency, deficiencies of Kidney Qi, Spleen Qi, blood deficiency and blood stasis are also commonly present in cases of infertility where cold in the uterus is predominant. Nuan Gong Yun Zi Wan not only effectively warms the uterus but also tonifies blood without engendering stasis, boosts Kidney Qi, Yin and Yang while soothing the Liver and warming the meridians. This balanced approach makes Nuan Gong Yun Zi Wan an indispensible supplement in the TCM treatment of infertility.
 
Just failed to get size 12 jean on.....nowhere near getting zip done up. Starting juicing/smoothies today! Had jam on toast earlier and that will be last solid food for a week (yeah right!)
 
Oh Blythe, I was always size 6-8., now I would not even come close to size 12 trousers = scared they wont fit or I wont be able to breathe in them :( there is nothing wrong with being size 12 mind you, but it's just more than my norm probably because I am short I just look so big and so pregnant cos it's all around my tummy. I am so flabby and soft, disgusting! that's it, I am announcing a war on sugar :( (again) but I cant bring myself to exercise in TWW, am convinced this will affect implantation but determined to get off my sofa and just walk around London for a few hours every weekend
 

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