I don't agree with this ....

[aliss]

Nestle Scandal 1974

Nestle Boycott 1980

Google those if you don't know why advertising laws exist.

 

[special_kala]

Thank you Aliss.

 

[ticking.clock]

I don't care about advertising, I'm talking about support from MW/HV

As far as advertising goes, the same can be said about vaccines, they are not the best thing to give your child but people do, what I'm saying is that support should be there for both
Just like I think more should be said about the benefits of using cloth nappies and not reusables, but even my midwife said to me "ooooh you're brave" when I said I was using cloth!!!

 

[aliss]

You aren't the only person here ticking.clock, there are a lot of girls here "on the fence" who still believe that formula is equal in terms of ingredients or who believe Aptamil is the "closest to break milk" because of advertising.

 

[special_kala]

You do get support after your baby is born.

Hv will happily talk to you about bottle feeding issues but what support do you need during pregnancy if you have decided to bottle feed? It's not difficult

 

[ticking.clock]

You aren't the only person here ticking.clock, there are a lot of girls here "on the fence" who still believe that formula is equal in terms of ingredients or who believe Aptamil is the "closest to break milk" because of advertising.

Aptamil is EXACTLY the same as cow and gate (I think it is) as its all made by the same company
Yes...... BREAST IS BEST but advice and support should be available to ALL mums on all aspects of feeding/nursing/care

 

[aliss]

Maybe it is of value for girls in the UK for demand (in writing, for example, to the government) about having more information/support being provided.

I don't know, it just seems so strange to me because where I come from, there is no "bullying" or "pressure" to formula feed because it is a generally accepted thought that if you feed the baby the normal way, and if you have a medical reason to do otherwise, then that is just it, a medical reason.

Sometimes "bullying" and "pressure" comes from creating such an environment of "feeding choice" in the first place.

 

[xLaura]

You aren't the only person here ticking.clock, there are a lot of girls here "on the fence" who still believe that formula is equal in terms of ingredients or who believe Aptamil is the "closest to break milk" because of advertising.

Surely aptamil or any other formula is 'closet to breast milk' because its either BF or FF therefore FF is the only other thing to breast milk. Therefore I do agree with that statement. It wouldn't be allowed otherwise. Weather you agree or not it's the only alternative to breast milk therefore it's got to the closet available. It never mentions being the same.

 

[special_kala]

You aren't the only person here ticking.clock, there are a lot of girls here "on the fence" who still believe that formula is equal in terms of ingredients or who believe Aptamil is the "closest to break milk" because of advertising.

Surely aptamil or any other formula is 'closet to breast milk' because its either BF or FF therefore FF is the only other thing to breast milk. Therefore I do agree with that statement. It wouldn't be allowed otherwise. Weather you agree or not it's the only alternative to breast milk therefore it's got to the closet available. It never mentions being the same.

It isn't allowed. It was banned and they got in trouble.

Formula is nothing like breast milk and no brand is closer then any other.

 

[Bean66]

I did a BF session as part of our NCT and she basically said all formula was the same so brand didn't matter.

With regard to advertising, it's changed due to advertising standard law that nothing can be said that's not proven. That goes for everything. There is not one study which shows that FF is better so they simply can't say it is anymore. There are thousands of studies showing the benefits of BF and how BF saves the NHS money so why shouldn't the government/NHS 'advertise' this fact.

 

[special_kala]

Genuine question - what support do people who are going to formula feed want?

 

[xLaura]

You aren't the only person here ticking.clock, there are a lot of girls here "on the fence" who still believe that formula is equal in terms of ingredients or who believe Aptamil is the "closest to break milk" because of advertising.

Surely aptamil or any other formula is 'closet to breast milk' because its either BF or FF therefore FF is the only other thing to breast milk. Therefore I do agree with that statement. It wouldn't be allowed otherwise. Weather you agree or not it's the only alternative to breast milk therefore it's got to the closet available. It never mentions being the same.

It isn't allowed. It was banned and they got in trouble.

Formula is nothing like breast milk and no brand is closer then any other.

I'm not saying its anything like breast milk but its the only other thing you can give your child than breast milk therefore it is the closest thing to breast milk because there's no alternative. Regardless of nutrients in both it is the closet thing for your baby to have.
But yeah I agree one brand shouldn't be allowed to say that over other brands all formula is the same (part from allergy ones obv)

 

[staybeautiful]

You aren't the only person here ticking.clock, there are a lot of girls here "on the fence" who still believe that formula is equal in terms of ingredients or who believe Aptamil is the "closest to break milk" because of advertising.

Surely aptamil or any other formula is 'closet to breast milk' because its either BF or FF therefore FF is the only other thing to breast milk. Therefore I do agree with that statement. It wouldn't be allowed otherwise. Weather you agree or not it's the only alternative to breast milk therefore it's got to the closet available. It never mentions being the same.

I think the point there was referencing claims that formula manufacturers used to put on packaging - Aptamil specifically put that they were 'closest to breast milk' on their packaging. Other companies put different things. The article below (Daily Mail, 2007, when companies were banned from putting nutritional claims on formula packaging) gives some examples of the things companies used to say to make consumers favour their product more than their competitors.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-441566/Baby-milk-firms-told-drop-nutrition-claims.html

In response to your second post personally, I'd say that formula is 'the best alternative' to breast milk rather than 'the closest thing to'.

 

[Saphira]

Your missing my point.......

I'm not against BF or FF, I have said that the BEST feeding method is one that makes mum and baby happy, but the info for BOTH should be given

Not missing the point, I don't think. Just don't agree. The BEST source of food and comfort and immune support for a baby is to be breast fed. This is true whether mom is happy with that or not. Some women aren't able or don't want to do that and that is their choice. An alternative exists that means these kids get nutrition that is not too bad and most get by just fine with it. There are health costs to babies and even some deaths (this has recently been quantified in a study) but for the vast majority it is fine.

I get what you are saying and understand you but honestly the increased pushing of breast feeding is, in many cases helpful.

Health care providers in baby friendly hospitals definitely help with ffing once bfing has been tried if it means baby is not thriving without supplementation. They just don't discuss it as an option before bfing has even been attempted (even just a day of bfing is beneficial)

We aren't surprised when docs etc don't provide you info on smoking or drinking as choice to deal with stress but they will help you quit. Choosing to smoke when stressed is a choice many people make And they feel it helps them but it doesn't mean we can or should promote cigs for relaxation or have docs suggest this and discuss this option to healthy non smokers. This may sound like a silly comparison but in my grand Mother's time her doc DID encourage her to smoke for her nerves. Times change as we get more info on risks and benefits.

I agree ticking.clock, there should be support for both BF and FF moms.

I bolded one part of your reply patooti, and I have to say it would be helpful IF more women were helped by MWs and nurses in the hospital once baby's arrived instead of ignored or rush-helped. It's in no way helpful to continue to push something and then not follow up when there are difficulties, and for many women BFing isn't nearly as easy as it would seem. That's where the support needs to lie, the after care.

Now, in the cases of moms who want to FF from birth or BFing isn't possible or working, I believe moms shouldn't feel silly for asking questions about FFing. I know I did in the hospital and the nicest nurse there was happy to answer my question. I simply asked which brand of formula she'd recommend and she told me her experiences with some causing more babies to be gassy so we stayed clear of those. Other than that, I don't recall having any questions. I certainly made up bottles the "wrong" way for a good month or two. Then again, what is the right way? Guess that varies depending on where you live. I simply follow the instructions on the box to a tee. The Cool Twister has made making bottles up fresh completely a breeze. I can now make up bottles with my eyes closed probably but I know the first weeks I had some questions here and there, sure!

And patooti, I really think it's a poor example to say doctors don't offer such advice to stressed individuals to smoke so why would they offer advice for FFing. I don't get this comparison at all to be honest. There's nothing wrong with FFing. I remember the first appointment with my daughter's pediatrician when she was around 3 weeks old. She asked how I'm feeding her - I replied very sadly, with formula. She sensed I wasn't feeling so amazing about having switched completely in the past days and told me, "Well hey, FF babies get on just fine too!" and moved on. I felt a ton better with such an attitude as opposed to getting a talking to. FF is not the end of the world. No one should be made to feel pressured or guilty. Both breastmilk and formula are perfectly suitable forms of nutrition for baby, period.

 

[Clarabell543]

I can't believe that this has been going on for days! Surely we have enough stresses in everyday life without spending time debating on the net?!

 

[KeriEloise]

It terms of advertising, I think it is about eduction. People who were FF are more likely to FF and maybe never consider BF because FF is what they know. By putting Breast is best out there and getting MWs to talk about it, then it is helping to educate and break the cycle.

I maybe wrong but I think BF rates have increased a lot since the changes in advertising and education around BF.

sorry but my mum did not BF any of her 4 children because she didnt 'feel right' now each to their own feeling and never in my life would i judge her or belittle her (or anyone else for that matter) for not wanting to BF... Back then it was looked upon very differently... very sad but true~!
I WILL be BF my babies. and I think the fact my mum didnt has alot to do with that. I have 5 younger siblings (including half siblings) and only 1 of them was breastfed. I have spent my whole life making up FF bottles and helping my mum & stepmum with feeds.. im wanting to breastfeed because it is natural and the best thing (healthwise) for my baby. xx

Even a first time mum can work out how to FF- the MW wont point blank refuse to help but they dont need special training or anything. You just read the tin. I was nervous with my first but its fine once you have made a bottle etc its fine.

its not just making up a bottle that people want help and support with though! its the fact that they are new to a responsibility of feeding a baby whether it is FF or BF they may want some support and advice on how to do this. especially if they mentally are not coping with becoming a new mum very well in the early days and are feeling very low and not feeling a bond with their baby xx

 

[bubbles]

You aren't the only person here ticking.clock, there are a lot of girls here "on the fence" who still believe that formula is equal in terms of ingredients or who believe Aptamil is the "closest to break milk" because of advertising.

Surely aptamil or any other formula is 'closet to breast milk' because its either BF or FF therefore FF is the only other thing to breast milk. Therefore I do agree with that statement. It wouldn't be allowed otherwise. Weather you agree or not it's the only alternative to breast milk therefore it's got to the closet available. It never mentions being the same.

I think the point there was referencing claims that formula manufacturers used to put on packaging - Aptamil specifically put that they were 'closest to breast milk' on their packaging. Other companies put different things. The article below (Daily Mail, 2007, when companies were banned from putting nutritional claims on formula packaging) gives some examples of the things companies used to say to make consumers favour their product more than their competitors.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-441566/Baby-milk-firms-told-drop-nutrition-claims.html

In response to your second post personally, I'd say that formula is 'the best alternative' to breast milk rather than 'the closest thing to'.

I have to disagree, there are better alternatives than mass produced formula. Wet nursing or donor milk being the next best thing. In fact there is a list (I have a vague feeling it is WHO or UNICEF related) which shows formula is around the 4th alernative after donor milk and even homemade formula

 

[NaturalMomma]

Where I live everyone assumes you'll formula feed. In hospitals they even give out a "breastfeeding sample bag" which has nothing to do with breastfeeding. It has formula, bottles and formula coupons. Formula companies cannot advertise on TV in my state, so they advertise in parenting magazines and hospitals. Also formula companies have to have "breastmilk is best" on their cans, they don't put in on there because they believe in it.

 

[special_kala]

Where I live everyone assumes you'll formula feed. In hospitals they even give out a "breastfeeding sample bag" which has nothing to do with breastfeeding. It has formula, bottles and formula coupons. Formula companies cannot advertise on TV in my state, so they advertise in parenting magazines and hospitals. Also formula companies have to have "breastmilk is best" on their cans, they don't put in on there because they believe in it.

I am very glad mums in the UK are protected from this.

 

[patooti]

I can't believe that this has been going on for days! Surely we have enough stresses in everyday life without spending time debating on the net?!

Who said it was stressful? It's a conversation that has stayed really tame and constructive and people that are still interested in it are still participating. It's easy to skip over if it isn't your thing. It's not like we are debating so loud you can't hear the other posts about vaginal discharge and growth scans.