Think twice about having flu (or any other) vaccines for you and/or your baby

[britishsaffy]

All this uneducated fear mongering just makes me cringe. I'll definitely be getting the thimersol free shot. I'd rather NOT risk getting the flu this season and potentially dying or harming my baby. It is a FACT that pregnant women (along with children) are more susceptible to significant health risks than other groups once they have contracted the flu. The Flu itself can cause brain damage in your unborn baby. Why risk that?

I must admit that these type of posts do make me quite anxious. Even though I have done all the research, discussed it with my doctor and my husband before making what I feel to be an informed decision, these scare tactics make me worry.
That being said, I feel getting the shots is the right choice. My work provides the shots and i'll be having it. I had pneumonia last year which started as flu. I do not want that ever again!

 

[Mummyemmy09]

In my opinion vaccinations are used to prevent and wipe out fatal diseases, they would not be used otherwise! I have and will continue to vaccinate my children against these deadly viruses. I had all my vaccines when I was younger and I am fine, my sisters are fine, my cousins are all fine. I don't know anyone who has had adverse reactions to vaccines and who knows vaccines may have just saved my life.

Each to their own but I will not be risking my children's lives for the sake of a vaccine.

Emma x

 

[catcatcat]

Being pregnant you are more likely to die from the flu than have any ill effects from a flu jab. They may not be 100% effective but if there is any chance that it'll prevent flu (and more importantly swine flu) then it's worth doing.

If heard of too many cases of a pregnant woman or her baby dying as a result of swine flu to risk not taking it.

I miscarried last yr shortly after having flu. Flu wrecks you, it is not compatible with pregnancy. I think all these 'articles' are actually scaremongers or opinion not backed up with hard facts.

My kids were ill with swine flu last xmas they wernt too bad but it was rife in newcastle. Prior to this i was against vacines - not now. Im going straight in for one. X

 

[ggbaby2]

Outbreaks like these can blame anti-vaxers, as you call them, but the underlying problem can be laying in the opposite direction. Nobody will actually know why it's happening, these outbursts of illnesses. Have you read anything about pharmaceutical companies and how they're milking the nations and societies around the world? I'm studying social sciences and i did a bit of research regarding this. It's more beneficial to the world wide tycoon companies than to us, those who died from small pox years ago and now we can cure it:} I'm not saying that medicine can't help, but hey, vaccines can be avoided and cure for illnesses can still be found. Why there isn't a vaccine against cancer yet then? Wondering!

This post really does display your lack of understanding about the science behind the viruses that cause disease. I have a master's degree in Biology, and while I am not trying to be rude, I do feel like I need to address some of these issues:

1. There is no 'cure' for small pox. The REASON that Small Pox is not around at the moment, is because of the world-wide vaccination effort, done by the WHO. Once you get it, like most viral diseases, there is not much that can be done, other than treat symptoms to make you feel better. We can prevent the virus from being as active in your body as it otherwise would have BEFORE you get the virus - by giving your immune system the tools to learn how to deal with the virus before hand - through a vaccination.

In 1967, TWO MILLION people died of small pox - and since the 70's, that number has dropped substantially, until it has been effectively eradicated. We do know why this virus went away - because it wasn't able to be spread from person to person, causing a pandemic. Small pox has been around since 10,000 BC, so we do know the only thing that changed in the last 40 years was the vaccination. This is a pretty strong and conclusive cause/effect relationship.


Your arguement about there not being a 'vaccination' for cancer is completely counter-intuitive to your statement that pharmaceutical companies are just after money. All of the various types of cancer kills millions of people every year - so if they COULD come up with 'cure' for cancer, then don't you think the pharmaceutical companies would be all over it?? It would SURELY rake in the $$ for them.

But, more importantly, your statement again reflects your lack of understanding about cancer. There are hundreds of different forms of cancer, and each effect the body in a different way, and while a virus CAN cause cancer, it isn't usually a primary cause in some of the more common types of cancer - like breast cancer, lukemia, prostate cancer..etc. Those are caused by genetic triggers that have somehow been turned 'on'. SOME types of cancer have been more researched than others, and because of that, we have been able to make leaps and bounds in our treatment. Other types of cancer research isn't well funded (there are only so many researchers and so much $$$) so the progress is much slower. Below are just a few examples of recent advancements in cancer treatment:

~ Childhood Lukemia now has a tremendously high success rate
~ New and improved treatments for Breast Cancer has meant that many women, who would have been destined to die are now in remission.
~ Early screenings for prostate cancer have allowed men to have their prostate remove before the cancer metastisizes throughout the body, and has saved the life of thousands of men each year (my FIL included).

A 'vaccination' against cancer would only work IF the cancer-causing agent was viral in nature - and most aren't. It turns out that we DO have a vaccination for at least one of the viruses that does cause cancer, HPV virus.

Making a 'vaccination' isn't feasable for every virus either. Some mutate MUCH too quickly for a vaccination to be effective (like HIV). The flu vaccination also mutates quickly, and it is challenging for scientists to be able to keep up with it. They have to predict from year to year how the virus will change - some years they get it right, sometimes it is less effective. There is a lot about science that we are still learning, and our understanding changes from year to year. And, for sure, in 100 years, we will look back and wonder what the heck we were thinking about SOME of it - but it isn't because there is a vast conspiracy, but because we just will know more. I agree that the pharmaceutical companies are for-profit companies, who want to maximize their profits. I also agree that there are a lot of medications that aren't well studied before they go to market, and we then learn that they can be dangerous - so people do need to be educated so that they can make their own decisions. However, they need to be *truly* educated, and not just read some propaganda pieces that have a lack of actual scientific evidence to back it up.

Thank you! I'm glad somebody here pointed that out. I heard a few years back about a 3 month old baby that died because his older sibling went to school with a kid who was not immunized and had the measles. Now the older sibling had been immunized so didn't catch it but brought it home to his baby brother who was still to young to be immunized and the baby died. Tragic story!

 

[silverrein]

Yeah, I just had the flu shot done earlier this week and read things regarding the flu shot that scared me half to death when I came home. So this is just making me rethink my decision to get the flu vaccine all over again

 

[AllieCat]

i aske dmy dr the twenty questions when she seguested a flu vaccine. Seemed she's used to hearing patients go "well ok then" and assuming it's fine because shes the dr. But like you i'm not the biggest fan of conventional medicine. I think dr's lie and they do it because they get paid by the medicine companies. She told me there where absolutley no risk or side effects (what a load of crap!!) I honestly dont think dr's should have any affiliation with medicine companies because then they are just sales people for the drugs. I'm not convinced a flu vaccine is something i need. i have never gotten one before and my dr even told me that "if it gets really bad they will hospitalize me and it MAY effect my baby" May is not good enough for me.. to me may means more than likely not but i have to say that because the drug companies help me earn a paycheck.. YUCK i hate conventional medicine.

 

[AveryATL]

They're not all a load of rubbish, you know. Science can PROVE most of the things that people say are dangerous about vaccines. Just as science proves your theory that they're safe, science proves our theory that they're not.

Money speaks louder than science, always remember that.

Science doesn't PROVE anything.That isn't how it works. Scientific experiments, done in a controlled manner (or at least as controlled as possible), simply provides evidence, and allows people to make conclusions based on the results of such experiments. If you have links, in peer-reviewed scientific journals that provides significant evidence that vaccinations are not safe, please share. You don't have a theory, and those who support vaccinations do not have a theory. The ONLY 'Theory' that involves vaccinations would be the 'Germ Theory' which suggests that microscopic organisms can cause diseases, and does not involve how those germs are best treated. A theory is a well studied, well established broadly-based explanation for observed phenomenon.

Websites that list 'facts', but can not actually back up the facts with actual controlled research are not scientific.

Sorry, I disagree that money speaks louder than science. There are hundreds of independent researchers at universities all over the world that are doing research for the love of science and the goal of progress. They do get grant funding, often from the government - NOT drug companies. I have done such research, and worked with highly esteemed universities who are doing research for the sake of science, to gain a better understanding about the world around us or to improve humanity. I find it sad that people have such a jaded view of why graduate students, professors and researches conduct their work.

You are right - there are lots of cases where research has become compromised by those that fund it. That is why it is important to look at who is providing the funding for research before you take for gospel the results. Obviously, drug studies conducted by a drug company are not unbiased. However, the majority of research is not tainted by the funding organization. This is one of the https://www.babyandbump.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=12989332main reasons why those peer-reviewed journals are important. To get work included in those journals, they have to pass throw a review board whose job is to best maintain and protect scientific integrity.

My husband has a PhD in biology. He and his colleagues are constantly complaining about how, for some reason, the public seems to see science as some kind of conspiracy funded by "the man." Science is the purest form of inquiry that seeks nothing but truth. To undermine scientists and claim they have ulterior motives is folly. Science has got us to where we are today but there are so many naysayers who would rather take the word of a celebrity or whack job with a computer when it comes to very important decisions. In cases like these, where doctors and scientists are told that they are wrong by the uneducated, it is a case of the blind leading the blind.

I wasn't undermining scientist, ffs I'm in school for physics! But I also know that what makes the drug companies money makes the government money, and the government funds a lot of these research programs. (not all, but a nice majority) The studies that have been done to prove they're safe have just as many counter studies proving they're not. You CAN sway statistics while still having it remain "scientifically correct."

When I said that we have different theories, I was using the other definition of the word, btw.

a particular conception or view of something to be done or of the method of doing it

If you are using the term science and the term theory in the same sentence, then you need to be careful about how you use that term, as it undermines your scientific credibility. Again, I would be really interested in reading any articles, published in peer reviewed journals, that suggest that vaccinations are not safe or are harmful. Government makes money from drug companies through taxes, sure. It makes a lot of money from other means as well. However, the PEOPLE who grant the government funding for research and then the people who actually DO the research are usually very, very removed from the people who are involved in the collection of money, so the conflict of interest is limited.

Have you had any experience with actual research in physics, or are you working on your Bachelor's degree? I didn't have a very clear understanding about how the research/grant process worked until I was involved in helping a research center procure a multi-million dollar grant from the National Science Foundation. It is incredibly hard to get a grant, and before grant funding is given, scientists have to do a tremendous amount of due diligence to show that their research is relevant, innovative and important.

 

[ashlee23]

omg cnt even bring myself to read the entire thread this has irritated me so much! to the poster who claimed "swine flu is a last year thing"... er u dont have a clue. we are preparing like crazy in hospitals for this years strain which has already begun to spread. there has been 24 cases in the hospital i work in within the last week!!! flu and swine flu poses a great risk to pregnant women and whilst the virus isn't thought to cross the placenta the effects of the flu on the mother can affect the baby. the fever related to influenza and H1N1 raises the mothers core temperature which can cause brain damage in the foetus. pregnant women are also far more likely to be admitted to hospital with heart and lung problems caused by influenza, which can in serious cases cause the death of the mother or the unborn child. they are also more at risk of picking up hospital aquired illnesses. H1N1 and influenza are also strongly linked to premature and low birth weight babies.
There is NO strong evidence the flu jab causes problems in an unborn child as the shot is an inactive vaccine and contains no live virus. like the virus itself this DOES NOT cross the placenta. xxx

 

[ashlee23]

i aske dmy dr the twenty questions when she seguested a flu vaccine. Seemed she's used to hearing patients go "well ok then" and assuming it's fine because shes the dr. But like you i'm not the biggest fan of conventional medicine. I think dr's lie and they do it because they get paid by the medicine companies. She told me there where absolutley no risk or side effects (what a load of crap!!) I honestly dont think dr's should have any affiliation with medicine companies because then they are just sales people for the drugs. I'm not convinced a flu vaccine is something i need. i have never gotten one before and my dr even told me that "if it gets really bad they will hospitalize me and it MAY effect my baby" May is not good enough for me.. to me may means more than likely not but i have to say that because the drug companies help me earn a paycheck.. YUCK i hate conventional medicine.

doctors in uk have NOTHING to do with drug companies and we still recommend it. and also so are u really saying that to be worth while u having the jab u need to be told it definately will harm ur baby?!?!? xx

 

[Skadi]

There is NO strong evidence the flu jab causes problems in an unborn child as the shot is an inactive vaccine and contains no live virus. like the virus itself this DOES NOT cross the placenta. xxx

Just to add to this... however the antibodies your body builds up DO cross the placenta which actually immunizes your baby as well for up to several months after birth!

 

[ashlee23]

There is NO strong evidence the flu jab causes problems in an unborn child as the shot is an inactive vaccine and contains no live virus. like the virus itself this DOES NOT cross the placenta. xxx

Just to add to this... however the antibodies your body builds up DO cross the placenta which actually immunizes your baby as well for up to several months after birth!

yep, so it's all benefit
think i may have come across slightly harsh in previous posts, really did not mean any1 any offense so sorry if I did, just think some ppl on here are confusing real H1N1 (swine flu) and influenza with what we'd all call man flu, ie a common cold and feeling ropey for a few days. when we are pregnant flu will not just make u feel ropey for a few days, i've seen so many healthy women come in to hospital in a dangerous condition due to the flu and for all the people thinking they have a good immune system and never get flu, our immune systems are so much lower when pregnant. please please please just get ur info from proper medical sources (not internet websites) and just think about it. xxx

 

[citymouse]

I've had the flu every couple of years recently and it is completely miserable, so I'm pretty sure I'll be getting the flu shot (for the first time ever).

As for childhood vaxes, I will do my research and get them in the most prudent manner possible.

The problem with large groups of people deciding not to vax their children is that, when you forego vaccinations, you are relying on the "herd"--basically most other parents--to have vaccinated their children in order that your child is not brought into contact with the illness. Once you break down the herd with multiple unvaccinated children, your child's risk of infection multiplies--especially if any of those children has siblings in other age groups mingling with other unvaxed kids. You're creating a network of children who are in danger of infection.

No doubt "big pharma" is making a lot of money off of us, and some of it in less-than-ideal ways--but many of their treatments are saving lives and/or making people healthier and more comfortable than otherwise possible.

My dad is into alternative medicine and is constantly emailing me these fear-mongering articles from organizations who use only other, similar organizations as their "proof." It gets tiring--and the funniest thing to me is that my dad doesn't live a healthy lifestyle. He eats poorly, drinks a lot, skips the cardio, and then relies on vitamins and supplements to keep him "healthy."

There are two--or three, or four--sides to every issue. You can bash the credibility of government-funded research, but who is doing the other research? And who is vetting it? And who is examining and critiquing their methodology?

 

[Jaylynne]

I have been a very healthy adult. I worked out 5x a week and ate healthy foods. Normally the only thing I get sick with is a cold about once a year. Two years ago I got the flu. It was the worst thing I've ever had in my life. I was confined to bed, would practically pass out trying to get up too fast for the bathroom, ran a high fever - over 104 degrees for days. I had to take cold baths just to cool down. Could only drink sips of water and maybe a cracker. I would shake since I felt freezing and got the sweats. I was in and out of sleeping all day and night I was so tired and aching. Almost was hospitalized but I began to recover. Lol I was glad because I didn't want to go to the hospital since I knew they'd do an IV and I hate needles...

If that can happen to a normally healthy adult, what do you think can happen to a pregnant woman and her baby when her immune system is already lowered??? I have no doubts that had I been pregnant in that situation my baby would be brain damaged or dead just from the high fever. I would have gone to the hospital if pregnant but I couldn't imagine a worse flu for me.

That year was the only year I didn't get my flu shot. I WILL be getting the pregnancy flu shot this year for the sake of my baby and myself. I would never forgive myself if I allowed irrational fear to harm my child.

 

[clio]

The problem with large groups of people deciding not to vax their children is that, when you forego vaccinations, you are relying on the "herd"--basically most other parents--to have vaccinated their children in order that your child is not brought into contact with the illness. Once you break down the herd with multiple unvaccinated children, your child's risk of infection multiplies--especially if any of those children has siblings in other age groups mingling with other unvaxed kids. You're creating a network of children who are in danger of infection.

This. The anti-vaccination movement simply makes the need to vaccinate my child even greater.

 

[VintageEnvy]

Ok the propaganda surrounding vaccinations being bad is becoming dangerously ridiculous. The misinformation out there is startling but also at the same time it shows how good we've had it thanks to vaccines. We no longer fear the almost eradicated polio instead we fear the thing that helped save us from it.

If we had to actually deal with these diseases in our everyday life we'd be clamoring for vaccines.

I will vaccinate my child not only to protect them, but also to protect yours whom you've chosen to not vaccinate. Have you ever heard of 'Herd Immunity'? If a certain percentage of the population is immunized then it protects the ones who aren't due to medical issues or personal beliefs. Your welcome.

 

[britishsaffy]

Ok the propaganda surrounding vaccinations being bad is becoming dangerously ridiculous. The misinformation out there is startling but also at the same time it shows how good we've had it thanks to vaccines. We no longer fear the almost eradicated polio instead we fear the thing that helped save us from it.

If we had to actually deal with these diseases in our everyday life we'd be clamoring for vaccines.

I will vaccinate my child not only to protect them, but also to protect yours whom you've chosen to not vaccinate. Have you ever heard of 'Herd Immunity'? If a certain percentage of the population is immunized then it protects the ones who aren't due to medical issues or personal beliefs. Your welcome.

Well said!