Using Facebook to complain about companies

[Foogirl]

Looking IS an action though.

And yes looking can be discriminatory. I have seen people look at my baby in a discriminatory manner. And no im not one to assume its discrimination every time someone notices my child is different, there are subtle difference between curiosity and judgey discrimination. Looking then usually follows into another action but yes when people look at my child in one spot then continue looking as I move away including shifting their seated position to continue looking that becomes discriminatory as they are causing me to feel like I am in a hostile environment due to my childs disability. Making my child feel different due to her appearance etc is harmful to her not in a physical way maybe but is damaging to her self confidence etc this IS discrimination.


Oxford definition of discrimination
noun
[mass noun]
1the unjust or prejudicial treatment of different categories of people, especially on the grounds of race, age, or sex:


Just as an aside, the whole post is about not bad mouthing the restaurant or any business on the internet. But have you not just done the same thing by calling this girl idiotic, judging her mental health and saying she needs the world to revolve around her? Assuming you don't know this girl personally you cant possibly know this from one thing she posted on the internet.

I get those looks too. I prefer to see it as people simply reacting to something they see which is different from what they are used to seeing. I've never seen it as hostile, although children gawping at close range does make Abby uncomfortable but you can't really hold them responsible for this. I also see people looking fondly at her and she certainly can engage a crowd. I guess I just see it as human nature.

As for the woman, I'm not judging her mental health, I have no idea if she had mental health issues at all. I also haven't formed an opinion based on one post, but by a series of posts and events where she made her feelings perfectly clear. Her actions were idiotic in my opinion.

 

[kit10grl]

Looking IS an action though.

And yes looking can be discriminatory. I have seen people look at my baby in a discriminatory manner. And no im not one to assume its discrimination every time someone notices my child is different, there are subtle difference between curiosity and judgey discrimination. Looking then usually follows into another action but yes when people look at my child in one spot then continue looking as I move away including shifting their seated position to continue looking that becomes discriminatory as they are causing me to feel like I am in a hostile environment due to my childs disability. Making my child feel different due to her appearance etc is harmful to her not in a physical way maybe but is damaging to her self confidence etc this IS discrimination.


Oxford definition of discrimination
noun
[mass noun]
1the unjust or prejudicial treatment of different categories of people, especially on the grounds of race, age, or sex:


Just as an aside, the whole post is about not bad mouthing the restaurant or any business on the internet. But have you not just done the same thing by calling this girl idiotic, judging her mental health and saying she needs the world to revolve around her? Assuming you don't know this girl personally you cant possibly know this from one thing she posted on the internet.

I get those looks too. I prefer to see it as people simply reacting to something they see which is different from what they are used to seeing. I've never seen it as hostile, although children gawping at close range does make Abby uncomfortable but you can't really hold them responsible for this. I also see people looking fondly at her and she certainly can engage a crowd. I guess I just see it as human nature.

As for the woman, I'm not judging her mental health, I have no idea if she had mental health issues at all. I also haven't formed an opinion based on one post, but by a series of posts and events where she made her feelings perfectly clear. Her actions were idiotic in my opinion.

You said she had anger issues, this would be part of a mental health problem.

And I don't hold kids looking as an issue as I have said there is a difference between curiousity and rudeness. And its hostile when they make it quite clear they don't want their perfect baby near your child. curiousity is human nature actively making a child feel left out or unwanted is discrimination.

 

[Foogirl]

You said she had anger issues, this would be part of a mental health problem.

And I don't hold kids looking as an issue as I have said there is a difference between curiousity and rudeness. And its hostile when they make it quite clear they don't want their perfect baby near your child. curiousity is human nature actively making a child feel left out or unwanted is discrimination.

I guess I just choose not to see the world as a hostile place, choose to see the good in most people and choose not to slap a label on everything.

 

[kit10grl]

You said she had anger issues, this would be part of a mental health problem.

And I don't hold kids looking as an issue as I have said there is a difference between curiousity and rudeness. And its hostile when they make it quite clear they don't want their perfect baby near your child. curiousity is human nature actively making a child feel left out or unwanted is discrimination.

I guess I just choose not to see the world as a hostile place, choose to see the good in most people and choose not to slap a label on everything.

And it must be nice to have that option. Unfortunately the last year of my life has opened my eyes to a lot. When people cant even say congratulations because there is something wrong with your baby it becomes harder to see the good in them. Its not always as easy as choosing to see the good. Sometimes there is no good.

You also choose not to answer parts of my posts when it suits you too. You only seem to want to hear things that agree with your viewpoint. Again the world I live in I have to deal with everything not just the bits I want too.

 

[Foogirl]

I make that choice. I've experienced all these things. A premmie who might not survive, people who don't know how to react, saying and doing the most inappropriate things. People pulling their child away from mine, watching her not being able to participate in life like everyone else. The difference appears to be that I assume when parents pull their "perfect little darlings" away from Abby it is because they are worried their own kids will do or say something really offensive. And they themselves don't know what to say as the standard conversation about kids isn't there. I never assume it is prejudicial or discriminatory. And if it is, well it's their tough luck they are missing out on getting to know Abby.

My eyes have been opened in the 4 years I've experienced all of this, but I don't want to be bitter and twisted about it. I would suggest you don't start assuming things about me and my life and making out I don't know what the world is like. Neither preemie birth or raising a child with a disability is a game of top trumps. My life is no easier nor harder because there is someone better or worse off than me. But I can let the bitterness pull me under and blame the rest of the rest of the world for how much harder my life is, or I can see that most people mean well and act out of fear or confusions. Again, I CHOOSE the latter.

If I've missed responding to any of the vitally important parts of your posts it's because I am on my phone and can't always re-read every word. But it is very telling that you choose to interpret that as some kind of deliberate act, and of me keeping my head in the sand. This I what I mean by seeing problems that aren't really there.

 

[kit10grl]

The problems are there in the fact that you told I didn't know what discrimination was, there was a whole post about it in fact and then when I pointed out the simple fact that looks can be discriminatory (and we have been talking about it for several posts now) you said point blank looks cant be discriminiatory cos its not an action. When I contradicted this you just ignored that I answered and moved on to a new topic.

I don't like the implication in your post that I must be bitter and twisted because I am not willing to let some mothers be outright bitches to my child and then say oh well they mean well i'm sure. I'm talking about mothers with two month old babies so no they weren't worried their child might say or do anything. They were just being mean. This same group had a guest photographer visit one day, she took pics throughout the class. The only mother who didn't get copies of the pics was me. My child had a feeding tube in that day. But I'm sure its just coincidence that the different looking baby was the only one whose pictures the photographer didn't feel she needed to print.

Even now my own family wont hold my baby. Why should they get the benefit of the doubt. You say I shouldn't assume things about you but you are making plenty of assumptions about me. I must be giving in to the bitterness because I dare to stand up and protect my child from people treating her differently.

And as you said you are now 4 years into your journey. We are still in year 1. But I'm sure you coped perfectly from day 1. You never struggled with a single day of your daughters life. And if that's true great for you. But as the mother of a child with special needs surely you should have a better understanding of the fact that the first year is a very hard adjustment for most people. Most other parents in this situation I know are supportive and not sitting telling me I must be bitter and twisted because I haven't gotten over how hard my DAUGHTERS life is. Because again at no point am I sat worrying about myself, I cope fine she on the other hand might not and shouldn't have too. And I will fight against anyone who tries to say she should just accept being treated differently.

 

[deafgal]

I guess this is a good time to post this: https://sindeloke.wordpress.com/2010/01/13/37/

 

[deafgal]

Looking IS an action though.

And yes looking can be discriminatory. I have seen people look at my baby in a discriminatory manner. And no im not one to assume its discrimination every time someone notices my child is different, there are subtle difference between curiosity and judgey discrimination. Looking then usually follows into another action but yes when people look at my child in one spot then continue looking as I move away including shifting their seated position to continue looking that becomes discriminatory as they are causing me to feel like I am in a hostile environment due to my childs disability. Making my child feel different due to her appearance etc is harmful to her not in a physical way maybe but is damaging to her self confidence etc this IS discrimination.


Oxford definition of discrimination
noun
[mass noun]
1the unjust or prejudicial treatment of different categories of people, especially on the grounds of race, age, or sex:


Just as an aside, the whole post is about not bad mouthing the restaurant or any business on the internet. But have you not just done the same thing by calling this girl idiotic, judging her mental health and saying she needs the world to revolve around her? Assuming you don't know this girl personally you cant possibly know this from one thing she posted on the internet.

I get those looks too. I prefer to see it as people simply reacting to something they see which is different from what they are used to seeing. I've never seen it as hostile, although children gawping at close range does make Abby uncomfortable but you can't really hold them responsible for this. I also see people looking fondly at her and she certainly can engage a crowd. I guess I just see it as human nature.

As for the woman, I'm not judging her mental health, I have no idea if she had mental health issues at all. I also haven't formed an opinion based on one post, but by a series of posts and events where she made her feelings perfectly clear. Her actions were idiotic in my opinion.

You said she had anger issues, this would be part of a mental health problem.

And I don't hold kids looking as an issue as I have said there is a difference between curiousity and rudeness. And its hostile when they make it quite clear they don't want their perfect baby near your child. curiousity is human nature actively making a child feel left out or unwanted is discrimination.

I have to agree with her. You may be experience this as a mother, but the child's experience from her view will be a lot hurtful. In fact, I think those type actions is hurtful in the long term. They are not teaching their kids how to make friends who are different.

 

[Foogirl]

I know the experience for her will be more hurtful and of course I feel it. But the reality is, I can't stop it, I can't shield her from it, all I can do is teach her how to deal with it. I try to teach her to see the good in the world. but to fight the bad where she can. There will always be the starters. I tell her boys and girls stare at the moment because they want a cool snazzy frame like she has. This gives her an air of confidence. But it is really important that she learns that even when people say or do hurtful, they don't always mean to do them. For many people it is just an ignorance (not in a bad way) ofmthe situation and a loss as to know what to do, especially as there are different types of people with disabilities and they all react to things in a different way, just as we all do. There is no right way to deal with people and sometimes people get it wrong.

And no, of course I don't always see the world as a happy place and of course I have challenges, and did so especially in the begginning. but I have coped with it all by being how I always am, seeing the good in people and the good in situations and appreciating that most folk are just trying their best. I'm not suggesting anyone is bitter and twisted, just that if I had chosen to look for the bad reason that everyone does stuff. I would have become bitter and twisted myself. To me, accusing everyone of being discriminatory and thinking the worst, would make ME that sort of person and just as bad as those who do discriminate. The dark side is too easy to slip in to and I won't allow myself to go there.

And I still don't agree that a look can be discriminatory. I chose not to labour the point because you clearly do so there is no point continuing to flog the issue.

 

[Tasha]

I have to say I agree with Foo about a look. My sister gives evil looks all the time, I am forever telling her off for it but she doesn't even realise she is doing it My point is she does it to everyone but if it happens to be someone with a disability then it is not because of the disability but mostly cos she is rude to everyone (kidding of course). How could you possibly know the intentions/reasoning behind the look she has given?

 

[kit10grl]

I did say earlier that yes it is very hard to know the motives behind an action. So yes in a lot of circstances it would be hard to say a look was or wasn't discriminatory. The situations I particularly am thinking about included looks coupled with whispering and then moving babies away from my daughter. Or the looks coming from mothers who are perfectly nice to my lo until they ask how old she is and then become aware she is different.

I am also teaching both my children how to respond to the mean siruations. I am also going to teach her she doesn't need to be stand for being treated differently by a business due to her disabilities. Person to person is a different thing as u can't change someone else's behaviour but you can expect to be treated fairly by a business which is what the OP was about. I don't feel challenging things when being treated unfairly is a bad thing. It means I believe in equality not that I am a negative person. I would do the same for someone else's child to.

We clearly see things differently. That doesn't mean either of us is wrong.

 

[Foogirl]

I have to say I agree with Foo about a look. My sister gives evil looks all the time, I am forever telling her off for it but she doesn't even realise she is doing it My point is she does it to everyone but if it happens to be someone with a disability then it is not because of the disability but mostly cos she is rude to everyone (kidding of course). How could you possibly know the intentions/reasoning behind the look she has given?

As my husband says, "it's just my face"

 

[Foogirl]

And the main point I was making about the woman at the restaurant was that she was treated exactly like everyone else, albeit the restaurant clearly isn't that good at service. She wanted to be treated differently and that was where she got it wrong.

 

[Tasha]

she has actually said that to me on various occasions.

Kit I would say that was less the look and more the other actions.