Weapons. Yes or No? Why?

[xemmax]

Really interesting SerenityNow.

Also just to illustrate the point further about the cultural divide - police officers in the UK (excluding Northern Island) don't even routinely carry firearms (only certain branches do). Guns just aren't in the public eye over here like they are in the US - not even the police carry them for protection, so ordinary people don't think of them in that sense either.

 

[Pearls18]

There was a study done by the Journal of Trauma Medicine that looked at every single firearm related death in 3 different metropolitan areas in the US. It found that if you have a gun in your home it is 22 times more likely to kill someone living in that home than it is to be used in self defense. That includes accidental shootings, domestic violence, homicides and suicides.

I would not keep a gun in my home while the kids are still living here. The evidence simply does not support it making my family safer.

Similar is said of weapons if you carry them on you, there is more chance of it being turned on yourself (I'm talking knives, can't remember the exact stat)

 

[Noelle610]

There was a study done by the Journal of Trauma Medicine that looked at every single firearm related death in 3 different metropolitan areas in the US. It found that if you have a gun in your home it is 22 times more likely to kill someone living in that home than it is to be used in self defense. That includes accidental shootings, domestic violence, homicides and suicides.

I would not keep a gun in my home while the kids are still living here. The evidence simply does not support it making my family safer.

Similar is said of weapons if you carry them on you, there is more chance of it being turned on yourself (I'm talking knives, can't remember the exact stat)

I've read similar studies.

I agree with the PP who suggested having an alarm system - we live in the city and that's what we have. Once it is triggered, the police are immediately summoned. I know pro-gun folks would claim that an intruder may try to use violence before the police arrive, but the sound of that alarm scares away almost any criminal.

 

[marley2580]

The only thing I keep by my bed for protection is my mobile phone. If someone breaks in while I'm there, I plan on using it without mercy lol

 

[alaskagrown]

We have a gun in our house (who doesn't in Alaska?!).

And my crazy psycho ex boyfriend once broke into my house while shit-faced drunk looking for me. Fortunately he was so incoherent he could barely walk. Now he's currently in jail for raping a minor...all happened while he was drunk.

 

[pinklightbulb]

Baseball bats, knives, OK. You need some form of self-defense.

Guns, never.

 

[Lina]

I associate the ownership of a gun with living in an unstable place/country. I cannot grasp why a civilized, relatively safe society like the US would need armed citizens for this reason. It's just bizarre to me. I also don't keep anything in the house for self defense, as I don't fear imminent attack.

 

[Elephant5740]

I associate the ownership of a gun with living in an unstable place/country. I cannot grasp why a civilized, relatively safe society like the US would need armed citizens for this reason. It's just bizarre to me. I also don't keep anything in the house for self defense, as I don't fear imminent attack.

We need to be armed because criminals are going to carry no matter what. Law abiding citizens should be able to protect themselves with a gun without being looked at as uncivilized. I choose to own a firearm, I went through all the protocols to obtain a legal permint, i was tought how to shot and store it responsibly. I will keep going to ongoing classes. Those that don't want to use them, see them, touch them - that's fine with me. Don't buy one. But how can you not understand a person who wants to protect themselves and their family? It's find that you don't want a gun, but please don't look at those of us that own a gun as bizzare. It's a personal preference if you want to own a gun or not. I would never say you are bizzare for not wanting one or anyone else on here that doesn't want to own a gun. I would never tell you that you are wrong. It's a personal decision that i think should be respected on both sides. No one is wrong or right.

 

[Noelle610]

I associate the ownership of a gun with living in an unstable place/country. I cannot grasp why a civilized, relatively safe society like the US would need armed citizens for this reason. It's just bizarre to me. I also don't keep anything in the house for self defense, as I don't fear imminent attack.

I think you give the US too much credit

 

[staralfur]

You can say "I need to own a gun because a criminal could own a gun and it's the only way to protect myself adequately"...but I think it kind of goes around in circles.

Gun violence where I am, outside of gang-related incidents, is pretty uncommon. I don't feel the need to own a gun because I don't think my chances of being assaulted with one are very high. But say people do start equipping themselves with guns just to be safe, all of a sudden more and more people own guns and you start thinking "hmm, all of these other people own guns and that increases my chances of being assaulted with one so maybe I should have one". All of a sudden it becomes normal and the chances of any gun-related incidents will go up.

I don't know if I'm making any sense, but I think it sort of perpetuates itself.

I don't think that Canada or the UK are just home to nicer criminals and that's why we don't see as much gun violence. Obviously it's got something to do with the gun culture in America.

 

[Sarahkka]

The statistics are pretty damning for the rate of gun ownership in the US and the shocking number of gun-related deaths.
It is not bizarre that anyone wants to own a gun - if you are into marksmanship, hunting, etc. But to think that the "properly stored" weapon (which in Canada means that your hunting rifle is in a locked cabinet away from ammunition) is going to be handy when this home intrusion happens and so provide adequate self-defense? I agree with the quoted study. I think you are more likely to over-react or behave with overself-confidence in such a scenario (in the unlikely event that it ever occurs), so I think the chances of injury or fatality are significantly higher with a gun in the house.
I think what the poster was saying is that it IS bizarre to most cultures outside of the US that the high rates of gun ownership and gun violence aren't recognized and addressed as a serious problem. The arguments for being armed to the teeth in your home seem pretty paranoid. Most of the rest of the developed world does not live like that and has trouble understanding why anyone would want to. You can get offended if you like. I think there are a multitude of wonderful things about the USA. I admire and respect a lot about that country. The stance on gun control, however, absolutely baffles me and it is not something I support or respect.

 

[Noelle610]

A lot of American gun culture is just that - cultural. Since we were colonized in our history and fought for independence, there's an underlying fear in many citizens that the government will "turn on them" and they need to be armed to protect their freedom.

The right to bear arms is protected in our constitution. There is a huge portion of our population that believes the constitution shouldn't be altered or ammended (although of course it has been) even though it was written in the 1700s. That's a different argument all together, but it's a touchy subjet here.

I do think these viewpoints are slightly paranoid and likely outdated, but they run very, very deep in our country. I think it's difficult to understand if you have grown up in a culture that simply doesn't do guns.

 

[Pearls18]

A lot of American gun culture is just that - cultural. Since we were colonized in our history and fought for independence, there's an underlying fear in many citizens that the government will "turn on them" and they need to be armed to protect their freedom.

The right to bear arms is protected in our constitution. There is a huge portion of our population that believes the constitution shouldn't be altered or ammended (although of course it has been) even though it was written in the 1700s. That's a different argument all together, but it's a touchy subjet here.

I do think these viewpoints are slightly paranoid and likely outdated, but they run very, very deep in our country. I think it's difficult to understand if you have grown up in a culture that simply doesn't do guns.

I completely understand what you’re saying, I totally get that is what a lot of Americans believe, but the country tends to be so self-obsessed and insular, like it is the only country to have a violent past? Ok so the US had to knock down a corrupt government...but so did France....and Germany (they had to deal with genocide for Christ’s sake!)...look at the World Wars that were predominantly fought in our back gardens only 70 years ago, but you don’t see us being riddled in gun crime and using that as an excuse for our behaviour, not that I am saying you are at all PP because I know you are only eloquently explaining this particular aspect of the argument not stating whether you agree with it or not, but for me it is the weakest argument and yet many Americans think it’s their strongest, and I blame them for not looking beyond the length of their own nose. (I don’t mean to be all like raaa America, I love the US, I’ve lived their briefly, I’m not intending to generalise as I know not everyone thinks the same, I’m talking about one group).

What is the difference between the US and countries like France and Germany for example, is it their violent histories? No it is not, both have fought many wars, have had civils wars, had to protect themselves on home turf, corrupt governments, the difference I believe as to why America has such a massive amount of gun crime compared to the rest of the Western world is their gun legislation- or lack of. It’s as simple as that for me, however, with the amount of guns in circulation now it is too late I feel for America to ever get in line with the rest of us, but too many don’t even seem to want to anyway. And yes, I find that bizarre, I want my child to grow up in country where the flipping teacher isn’t carrying a gun and no I don’t understand why others don’t.

I think too many people in America like to say “you don’t know what it is like here, it’s in our culture etc” but I don’t think they give others enough credit, speaking for myself and a lot of people I know on here and in RL we’re a lot more observant and interested in other people’s cultures, I might not relate but I have a good understanding of other European countries, the States etc, I’m not saying I am an expert but I think people in the US perhaps don’t give other counties enough credit for our empathies just because as a whole their country is a lot more insular. For example someone once asked why British people cared so much about Obama (in an inflammatory way like it wasn’t our business) and that kind of summed it up for me really.

 

[Elephant5740]

Not true that more guns = more violence. Chicago has the strickest gun control laws in our country yet it has the highest gun related violence. What if a criminal knew you had a gun in your home and knew your neighbor did not? Which home do you think he would invade? What about a school that has a sign that says "no fire weapons allowed" vs. a school across the street with a sign that says "staff armed and trained"? Which school do you think a criminal would go into with a gun? If in your country you do not have criminals that use guns, that is great! But in the USA that is simply not the case. The chance a criminal has gun is pretty high and i don't want to take my chances with a bat or knife. If you live in the USA i recommend taking the proper steps to owning a gun - it's your constitutional right. I love the USA and that fact we have this right and hope it is never taken away. Criminals do not follow the laws, their guns are unregistered and if we need to do something at all about gun violence it's to punish those with illegal and stolen guns, not punish those that want to protect themselves. If you live in the USA, and are thinking about owning a gun, i would recommend it. If you live in the USA and do not want a gun, that is your choice and i respect that - I would hope you would do the same for us gun owners.

 

[Elephant5740]

Not true that more guns = more violence. Chicago has the strickest gun control laws in our country yet it has the highest gun related violence. What if a criminal knew you had a gun in your home and knew your neighbor did not? Which home do you think he would invade? What about a school that has a sign that says "no fire weapons allowed" vs. a school across the street with a sign that says "staff armed and trained"? Which school do you think a criminal would go into with a gun? If in your country you do not have criminals that use guns, that is great! But in the USA that is simply not the case. The chance a criminal has gun is pretty high and i don't want to take my chances with a bat or knife. If you live in the USA i recommend taking the proper steps to owning a gun - it's your constitutional right. I love the USA and that fact we have this right and hope it is never taken away. Criminals do not follow the laws, their guns are unregistered and if we need to do something at all about gun violence it's to punish those with illegal and stolen guns, not punish those that want to protect themselves. If you live in the USA, and are thinking about owning a gun, i would recommend it. If you live in the USA and do not want a gun, that is your choice and i respect that - I would hope you would do the same for us gun owners

 

[Noelle610]

A lot of American gun culture is just that - cultural. Since we were colonized in our history and fought for independence, there's an underlying fear in many citizens that the government will "turn on them" and they need to be armed to protect their freedom.

The right to bear arms is protected in our constitution. There is a huge portion of our population that believes the constitution shouldn't be altered or ammended (although of course it has been) even though it was written in the 1700s. That's a different argument all together, but it's a touchy subjet here.

I do think these viewpoints are slightly paranoid and likely outdated, but they run very, very deep in our country. I think it's difficult to understand if you have grown up in a culture that simply doesn't do guns.

I completely understand what you’re saying, I totally get that is what a lot of Americans believe, but the country tends to be so self-obsessed and insular, like it is the only country to have a violent past? Ok so the US had to knock down a corrupt government...but so did France....and Germany (they had to deal with genocide for Christ’s sake!)...look at the World Wars that were predominantly fought in our back gardens only 70 years ago, but you don’t see us being riddled in gun crime and using that as an excuse for our behaviour, not that I am saying you are at all PP because I know you are only eloquently explaining this particular aspect of the argument not stating whether you agree with it or not, but for me it is the weakest argument and yet many Americans think it’s their strongest, and I blame them for not looking beyond the length of their own nose. (I don’t mean to be all like raaa America, I love the US, I’ve lived their briefly, I’m not intending to generalise as I know not everyone thinks the same, I’m talking about one group).

What is the difference between the US and countries like France and Germany for example, is it their violent histories? No it is not, both have fought many wars, have had civils wars, had to protect themselves on home turf, corrupt governments, the difference I believe as to why America has such a massive amount of gun crime compared to the rest of the Western world is their gun legislation- or lack of. It’s as simple as that for me, however, with the amount of guns in circulation now it is too late I feel for America to ever get in line with the rest of us, but too many don’t even seem to want to anyway. And yes, I find that bizarre, I want my child to grow up in country where the flipping teacher isn’t carrying a gun and no I don’t understand why others don’t.

I think too many people in America like to say “you don’t know what it is like here, it’s in our culture etc” but I don’t think they give others enough credit, speaking for myself and a lot of people I know on here and in RL we’re a lot more observant and interested in other people’s cultures, I might not relate but I have a good understanding of other European countries, the States etc, I’m not saying I am an expert but I think people in the US perhaps don’t give other counties enough credit for our empathies just because as a whole their country is a lot more insular. For example someone once asked why British people cared so much about Obama (in an inflammatory way like it wasn’t our business) and that kind of summed it up for me really.

Hey, I totally agree with most of your argument. I was just trying to highlight the cultural landscape of the US for those that may not be familiar with it.

I do, however, think our cultural is a bit misunderstood by the rest of the world. Our country is just huge and has so many sub-cultures within it that it is unique in that way.

(I'm not saying that you don't understand and emphathize with our culture, but I just think it can be a hard one to wrap one's head around).

 

[Noelle610]

Not true that more guns = more violence. Chicago has the strickest gun control laws in our country yet it has the highest gun related violence. What if a criminal knew you had a gun in your home and knew your neighbor did not? Which home do you think he would invade? What about a school that has a sign that says "no fire weapons allowed" vs. a school across the street with a sign that says "staff armed and trained"? Which school do you think a criminal would go into with a gun? If in your country you do not have criminals that use guns, that is great! But in the USA that is simply not the case. The chance a criminal has gun is pretty high and i don't want to take my chances with a bat or knife. If you live in the USA i recommend taking the proper steps to owning a gun - it's your constitutional right. I love the USA and that fact we have this right and hope it is never taken away. Criminals do not follow the laws, their guns are unregistered and if we need to do something at all about gun violence it's to punish those with illegal and stolen guns, not punish those that want to protect themselves. If you live in the USA, and are thinking about owning a gun, i would recommend it. If you live in the USA and do not want a gun, that is your choice and i respect that - I would hope you would do the same for us gun owners

I think the difficult thing about the US is that criminals have guns. They just do. Even if we made our gun laws more restrictive or even banned firearms all together, they're out there and will be used. I'm not quite sure what the answer to this issue is, but it's something to consider.

 

[Pearls18]

I wasn't disagreeing with you Noelle just the aspect of the argument you brought up but not seeming to push yourself.

Elephant...Chicago is a populated city of course there will be more hun crime, also I bet it's gun laws are nothing like our own so not in fact our version of strict. Have you ever actually looked at global gun crime statistics?

 

[Pearls18]

Not true that more guns = more violence. Chicago has the strickest gun control laws in our country yet it has the highest gun related violence. What if a criminal knew you had a gun in your home and knew your neighbor did not? Which home do you think he would invade? What about a school that has a sign that says "no fire weapons allowed" vs. a school across the street with a sign that says "staff armed and trained"? Which school do you think a criminal would go into with a gun? If in your country you do not have criminals that use guns, that is great! But in the USA that is simply not the case. The chance a criminal has gun is pretty high and i don't want to take my chances with a bat or knife. If you live in the USA i recommend taking the proper steps to owning a gun - it's your constitutional right. I love the USA and that fact we have this right and hope it is never taken away. Criminals do not follow the laws, their guns are unregistered and if we need to do something at all about gun violence it's to punish those with illegal and stolen guns, not punish those that want to protect themselves. If you live in the USA, and are thinking about owning a gun, i would recommend it. If you live in the USA and do not want a gun, that is your choice and i respect that - I would hope you would do the same for us gun owners

I think the difficult thing about the US is that criminals have guns. They just do. Even if we made our gun laws more restrictive or even banned firearms all together, they're out there and will be used. I'm not quite sure what the answer to this issue is, but it's something to consider.

I know I agree, this is the problem I think it is too late for the US to ever be as safe as us with gun crime because there are too many guns out there, they've left it too late and too many people will die as a result.

 

[Pearls18]

A lot of American gun culture is just that - cultural. Since we were colonized in our history and fought for independence, there's an underlying fear in many citizens that the government will "turn on them" and they need to be armed to protect their freedom.

The right to bear arms is protected in our constitution. There is a huge portion of our population that believes the constitution shouldn't be altered or ammended (although of course it has been) even though it was written in the 1700s. That's a different argument all together, but it's a touchy subjet here.

I do think these viewpoints are slightly paranoid and likely outdated, but they run very, very deep in our country. I think it's difficult to understand if you have grown up in a culture that simply doesn't do guns.

I completely understand what you’re saying, I totally get that is what a lot of Americans believe, but the country tends to be so self-obsessed and insular, like it is the only country to have a violent past? Ok so the US had to knock down a corrupt government...but so did France....and Germany (they had to deal with genocide for Christ’s sake!)...look at the World Wars that were predominantly fought in our back gardens only 70 years ago, but you don’t see us being riddled in gun crime and using that as an excuse for our behaviour, not that I am saying you are at all PP because I know you are only eloquently explaining this particular aspect of the argument not stating whether you agree with it or not, but for me it is the weakest argument and yet many Americans think it’s their strongest, and I blame them for not looking beyond the length of their own nose. (I don’t mean to be all like raaa America, I love the US, I’ve lived their briefly, I’m not intending to generalise as I know not everyone thinks the same, I’m talking about one group).

What is the difference between the US and countries like France and Germany for example, is it their violent histories? No it is not, both have fought many wars, have had civils wars, had to protect themselves on home turf, corrupt governments, the difference I believe as to why America has such a massive amount of gun crime compared to the rest of the Western world is their gun legislation- or lack of. It’s as simple as that for me, however, with the amount of guns in circulation now it is too late I feel for America to ever get in line with the rest of us, but too many don’t even seem to want to anyway. And yes, I find that bizarre, I want my child to grow up in country where the flipping teacher isn’t carrying a gun and no I don’t understand why others don’t.

I think too many people in America like to say “you don’t know what it is like here, it’s in our culture etc” but I don’t think they give others enough credit, speaking for myself and a lot of people I know on here and in RL we’re a lot more observant and interested in other people’s cultures, I might not relate but I have a good understanding of other European countries, the States etc, I’m not saying I am an expert but I think people in the US perhaps don’t give other counties enough credit for our empathies just because as a whole their country is a lot more insular. For example someone once asked why British people cared so much about Obama (in an inflammatory way like it wasn’t our business) and that kind of summed it up for me really.

Hey, I totally agree with most of your argument. I was just trying to highlight the cultural landscape of the US for those that may not be familiar with it.

I do, however, think our cultural is a bit misunderstood by the rest of the world. Our country is just huge and has so many sub-cultures within it that it is unique in that way.

(I'm not saying that you don't understand and emphathize with our culture, but I just think it can be a hard one to wrap one's head around).

I've lived in Mississippi, I have Mississippisn friends, I do get the culture, I don't relate to it but I know where it has done from, just because it is all they've known doesn't make it right. It wasn't that long ago we were saying racial segregation was 'cultural'.