Anyone following the Facebook page justice for lucie?

I am in the USA so I don't understand about the receptionists and choosing who gets an appointment. When I call my pediatrician it says in the opening message to call 911 if you feel any life threatening danger for your child. Even if you call the advice nurse it says call 911 for an emergency, not to wait for a callback. If I was sitting in the doctor's office and my LO became that ill so quickly I would rush her to the hospital which thankfully is next door to the dr's office.

that being said i would not say the mother is "at fault" but she should have not just waited. any person with no medical knowledge should still know that blue lips is bad
 
I trained as a nurse, so Have more than advantage level of medical knowledge, but unless you are one of those parents who is backs and forth a and e every time the child is sick you have to make a judgement call.

They clearly didn't think that their child was that ill, I mean its quite insulting that people say, we'll if my child was that sick I would have called an ambulance, I am sure if they felt their child was going to die in the GPs they would have called. The gp after all has far more medal experience than the few weeks many paramedics have.

It's quite clear to me that although they knew the child was ill, they didn't think its was life threatening, and why should they? You are all jumping to defence of the receptionist with no medial training but neither did the parents, the receptionist on the other hand did have a duty of care and took it upon herself to make the child wait, she should have consulted someone of she was unsure or just let her in. Why make a sick child of any state wait, I mean think about it... You child is ill, nothing life threatening but concerned enough to see the GP, and left to wait that long, all you want to do is keep them warm at home.

Yes with hindsight an ambulance was the right action, and perhaps it makes all of us who now know this case to do the same, I know I would now be more likely to call an ambulance because how quickly children do go down hill.

The parents were the child's advocate, they took her to seek medical advice, when sitting there the child got worse, and he continued to seek advice from the receptionist who continued to ignore them, them the child lost colour and quickly stopped breathing at which point father raised the alarm and all hell broke lose.

The receptionist should have let them in when they got there and if she really felt it wasn't urgent she should have sought advice.

The problem is primary care is often difficult to access or get sense from, my son had pyloric stenosis, I was told its reflux and I was an over anxious first time mum, now, I was a nurse, but what do I know about babies, I had to trust, and keep trusting until own holiday we sought a gp as he was worse and they sent him in. We were lucky he had surgery as was fine, what could I have done, I sought other opinions but all backed up the hv, you can't take a baby to a and e for bring back milk, so I was stuck.

How many times has a receptionist make its difficult for you to get an appt? Unless you are very forceful then you are bind to have experienced it.

Yes the parents should have taken their child to a and e, but you can only go by what you know, they clearly didn't think it was that serious, and at some point when they felt it was, they were already there, expecting to be seen. Why on earth did that receptionist stop them?
 
I trained as a nurse, so Have more than advantage level of medical knowledge, but unless you are one of those parents who is backs and forth a and e every time the child is sick you have to make a judgement call.

They clearly didn't think that their child was that ill, I mean its quite insulting that people say, we'll if my child was that sick I would have called an ambulance, I am sure if they felt their child was going to die in the GPs they would have called. The gp after all has far more medal experience than the few weeks many paramedics have.

It's quite clear to me that although they knew the child was ill, they didn't think its was life threatening, and why should they? You are all jumping to defence of the receptionist with no medial training but neither did the parents, the receptionist on the other hand did have a duty of care and took it upon herself to make the child wait, she should have consulted someone of she was unsure or just let her in. Why make a sick child of any state wait, I mean think about it... You child is ill, nothing life threatening but concerned enough to see the GP, and left to wait that long, all you want to do is keep them warm at home.

Yes with hindsight an ambulance was the right action, and perhaps it makes all of us who now know this case to do the same, I know I would now be more likely to call an ambulance because how quickly children do go down hill.

The parents were the child's advocate, they took her to seek medical advice, when sitting there the child got worse, and he continued to seek advice from the receptionist who continued to ignore them, them the child lost colour and quickly stopped breathing at which point father raised the alarm and all hell broke lose.

The receptionist should have let them in when they got there and if she really felt it wasn't urgent she should have sought advice.

The problem is primary care is often difficult to access or get sense from, my son had pyloric stenosis, I was told its reflux and I was an over anxious first time mum, now, I was a nurse, but what do I know about babies, I had to trust, and keep trusting until own holiday we sought a gp as he was worse and they sent him in. We were lucky he had surgery as was fine, what could I have done, I sought other opinions but all backed up the hv, you can't take a baby to a and e for bring back milk, so I was stuck.

How many times has a receptionist make its difficult for you to get an appt? Unless you are very forceful then you are bind to have experienced it.

Yes the parents should have taken their child to a and e, but you can only go by what you know, they clearly didn't think it was that serious, and at some point when they felt it was, they were already there, expecting to be seen. Why on earth did that receptionist stop them?

:thumbup:
 
Thanks, sorry it was long winded.

It's so easy to say what they should of done or what they would have done etc, I am sure everyone who has lost a child has gone over and over it. Flip I go over and over how I should have demanded anti biotics before I have birth so that one of mine didn't get strep b, they did but they were fine. But as parents we have to listen to medical advise and trust, at the end or the day they sought help and were let down, the receptionist took it upon herself to judge the situation rather than hand it over to someone who was able to deal with it. I don't think she should have all the blame, she didn't kill her, but she was negligent, she is as much to blame as a driver who kills someone or anything like that. It's not murder, but she has a significant amount of blame.

We need to be able to trust the health professionals who look after us and our children. Thing do need to change.

I don't always agree with the stuff that is said on that page, but it raises awareness and helps her deal, I mean how to you deal with a death of a child? I know you know, and I can't imagine how soul destroying and painful that is, we all deal differently and if it helps the i will support.
 
The problem is, aside from one doctor at our practice and Alex's cardiologist, I don't trust any other medical professional. I have to serve as his advocate because his condition is rare. So, I believe I can safely say if I were in the same position and Alex's lips were turning blue (a sign that his heart condition is worsening) I would call an ambulance.
 
The problem is, aside from one doctor at our practice and Alex's cardiologist, I don't trust any other medical professional. I have to serve as his advocate because his condition is rare. So, I believe I can safely say if I were in the same position and Alex's lips were turning blue (a sign that his heart condition is worsening) I would call an ambulance.

But you aware of his heart condition and any signs to look out for, so yes in your situation with Alex you would, but you weren't in the situation of these parents, or with their child, where they had a healthy child and probably thought she had nothing more than a virus which could be cleared by antibiotics. None of us can say what we would do unless we are in that given situation, we can all say what we THINK we would do, but none of us really know.
 
The problem is, aside from one doctor at our practice and Alex's cardiologist, I don't trust any other medical professional. I have to serve as his advocate because his condition is rare. So, I believe I can safely say if I were in the same position and Alex's lips were turning blue (a sign that his heart condition is worsening) I would call an ambulance.

But you aware of his heart condition and any signs to look out for, so yes in your situation with Alex you would, but you weren't in the situation of these parents, or with their child, where they had a healthy child and probably thought she had nothing more than a virus which could be cleared by antibiotics. None of us can say what we would do unless we are in that given situation, we can all say what we THINK we would do, but none of us really know.

That's what I put before though (I think it was this thread :haha:)

It's NATURAL for us to reflect on a situation and say what we would do differently. No one is blaming the parents (at least I'm not). I'm saying I would not let my child's lips turn blue and listen to a receptionist :flower:
 
The problem is, aside from one doctor at our practice and Alex's cardiologist, I don't trust any other medical professional. I have to serve as his advocate because his condition is rare. So, I believe I can safely say if I were in the same position and Alex's lips were turning blue (a sign that his heart condition is worsening) I would call an ambulance.

Yes but given that it means you are probably more aware of his condition than most professionals and more reactive and knowledgable about complications, whereas a mother of a child who has no issues at all, an illness it's just a illness not a sign that they are in respiratory distress, or cardiac in your case.

Her tips turned blue when she was at the surgery, it wast like they took her like that, she took a turn for the worse, which having a child with a serious pre condition I am sure you can understand.

Each parent have different skills and knowledge so we would all react differently, I am sure you would call an ambulance, and I am sure I would be able to recognise signs or respiratory distress and do the same, but not every parent has that knowledge. Plus we can't know the signs of everything, as a child with a condition such as your sons you will always be over cautious and rightly so, but the average parent won't be. That is what a doctors surgery is for.
 
That is true. The bigger issue I have is that a receptionist gave medical advice. People need to know that they are not trained to give medical advice.
 
The problem is, aside from one doctor at our practice and Alex's cardiologist, I don't trust any other medical professional. I have to serve as his advocate because his condition is rare. So, I believe I can safely say if I were in the same position and Alex's lips were turning blue (a sign that his heart condition is worsening) I would call an ambulance.

Yes but given that it means you are probably more aware of his condition than most professionals and more reactive and knowledgable about complications, whereas a mother of a child who has no issues at all, an illness it's just a illness not a sign that they are in respiratory distress, or cardiac in your case.

Her tips turned blue when she was at the surgery, it wast like they took her like that, she took a turn for the worse, which having a child with a serious pre condition I am sure you can understand.

Each parent have different skills and knowledge so we would all react differently, I am sure you would call an ambulance, and I am sure I would be able to recognise signs or respiratory distress and do the same, but not every parent has that knowledge. Plus we can't know the signs of everything, as a child with a condition such as your sons you will always be over cautious and rightly so, but the average parent won't be. That is what a doctors surgery is for.

I agree with this. Even medical professionals can get it wrong let alone 'just a parent'. When we lost Eve, my GP told me his Son had had the same strain of Meningococcal as Eve- both he and his wife are GP's and neither knew he was so poorly - i mean who hasnt had a child that has at some point been sickly and sleepy? You don't necessarily thing those are symptoms of a very serious illness and that your child is going to die. These parents probably thought exactly the same.

Not long back I was in our surgery, and my friend came in with her 8 week old. I'd seen my friend the day previous and the baby wasnt settling. The GP that day was running 1 hr 15 mins late. In surgery baby was screaming place down and had a temp, i told my friend to tell receptionist she felt baby needed seeing sooner and I even offered my slot, but receptionist wouldn't budge. When she finally got in to see the GP, he examined her and she had a pin prick rash consistent with Septicaemia, she was rushed to hospital. Turns out it wasn't- she was fine, but its besides the point, it could well have been and that 1 hr 15 minutes could have made all the difference. But can you imagine if every Mum phoned an ambulance because their baby crying and had a temp?
 
That is true. The bigger issue I have is that a receptionist gave medical advice. People need to know that they are not trained to give medical advice.

It's much easier and better to get receptionists to know their jobs than the general public to know what their job isn't. I generally don't think people think receptionists have medical knowledge, but all it needed was the receptionist to call the gp and say I have a worried parent here.
 
Out of curiosity what is your sons condition?
 
This story is so sad. People keep saying her lips were blue and she sat there for a further 1hr 10 minutes. The lips went blue whilst she was in the surgery not before hand.

It is very easy to say what you would or wouldnt do, but most people trust doctors and receptionist and death certainly would of crossed her mind.

I once took Morgan to the doctors as he was six weeks old and poorly, whilst we were there he went floppy, tbh it didnt cross my mind to go to a hospital in an ambulance when I was in a doctors surgery with people who are more trained than paramedics just behind the doors. :shrug: In the end he said lets wait to see if a rash appears :shock: and I did go to the hospital but on the say so of doctors at the hospital my Mum works out, other wise I would of trusted him. Morgan was diagnosed with mengitius.

I just think it is easy to say what you would and wouldnt do but you dont really know. I maybe should of fought harder, got a different opinion, screamed and shouted louder and louder til they listened and then my girls might be here. But I didnt and no going over it will change that. Its something I (and Lucie's mum) have to live with forever.
 
I had to become my son's advocate before he was even born. That, and my mom who is a nurse always told me I needed to advocate for myself always when it came for medical care.
 
I had to become my son's advocate before he was even born. That, and my mom who is a nurse always told me I needed to advocate for myself always when it came for medical care.

Thats easier for some people than others though.

I was one of my daughter advocate's, I did scream and shout for her, paid for extra scans, told them she would end up dead and I was right she did. Sometimes people dont listen. :shrug:
 
I had to become my son's advocate before he was even born. That, and my mom who is a nurse always told me I needed to advocate for myself always when it came for medical care.

Thats easier for some people than others though.

I was one of my daughter advocate's, I did scream and shout for her, paid for extra scans, told them she would end up dead and I was right she did. Sometimes people dont listen. :shrug:

:hugs: I know.
 
But we all advocate for our children, we all are trying to do our best with the knowledge we have, some of is are better at screaming than others, but we are all advocates for our children. The point is we shouldn't have to fight for their lives against this or any countries health care system.

The child in question was taken to an appropriate medical centre, the father in question didn't sit back and wait, he went back and forth, the sign that aggression will not be tolerated was pointed out to him but he continued to fight u tip it was too late, that child should not have bee left to die is arms while he was pleading to the mercy of an receptionist.

We all advocate for our children, we all fight to get the best, especially people like us who are well researched and knowledgable of these things, but still we are not doctors and doctors get it wrong too.

When I have felt something was wrong I have fought hard for it, no I have not started screaming at the top of my lungs demanding, I have gone about things differently, at times one tactic may have worked better than others and every situation will leave you with what ifs.
 

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