Delayed vaccination-Update-New doctor sounds promising

[Vrinda]

As I wrote earlier about

Hygiene-social and preventive dept want to make note of not vaccinated groups and I felt so bothered by it.

Update-They just asked about our vaccine decision and made us do some paper work related to it and then informed us our LO maybe not be admitted to some Kindergarten schools because of this.
I spoke with some other moms who are not vaccinating-It happened to them too.

Looks like they keep record of everything like this. ( even though we are delaying vaccination and opting out some, our doctor put us in same group as no vaccinating group)



I said I do not trust my doctor because of giving our information to 3rd party regarding vaccine decision.

We have decided to delay vaccination at least and we discussed this with our doctor ( have vaccinated some and choosing not to vaccinate some , delaying etc)

But she bullied us from the beginning- If you do not vaccinate then we will do this that etc...
Vaccination is a duty-mandatory one- even though the law clearly states otherwise.


Local law states the vaccination is not compulsory and parents have a choice.

Did anyone have any similar experience?

I am worried

EDIT- My OH has family history of allergies and such auto immune diseases, one of the reasons why we delay
The doctor is in touch with social and preventive department as well.

ONE MORE EDIT :

See they are trying to make laws strict here ( I spoke with a lawyer) and almost mandatory
so the fear and threats to parents leave NO CHOICE almost for all. But those who research knows that law states its not mandatory. Doctors themselves are under pressure from other authorities.

I am now not really very angry on our doctor, I see its not really her fault. But I am still upset.
She could have chose not to make it difficult for us to decide.

DOCTOR CHANGE :last month she-that doctor- wanted me to start weaning-inspite of LO doing well for her age etc...I want to breastfeed as long as possible, I do not want to hurry with solids-I explained to her and what she said?
She said, I should start solids because that will provide antigens ! ?
And that I should give also rice mix everyday after asking me if my LO is sleeping well in night I said yes, only 1-2 times wakes up then she said about rice, I think she was just trying to sell that nestle leaflet gave me to lure me into it?! ( Rice for what? milk got more nutritional value)
Come one, my LO was only 4 months when she said this- I know some mothers BF exclusively for atleast 6 months etc... My goal is even more a if all goes well...I can introduce solids slowly when my baby can sit ...
All this reasons I wanted to change my doctor



NEW DOCTOR: who is recommended by our previous doctor, is one of the best here for consulting regarding alternative schedule, so we have hope now some well guided information regarding vaccine decision. We are now talking about alternatives - opting some out etc with her



I will keep updating.

 

[Eve]

We are delaying and selective vaxing and believe me, I get the speech all the time!

 

[Vrinda]

Eve, but did they report you to socials(edit- hygiene social and preventive department not the social services as someone misinterpets) office because of this?
Our doctor sent our information to hygiene social and preventive department
She also lied to us, saying that vaccination is compulsary which I checked it is not,
then she said okay, its not compulsary but its a duty blah blah blah

We did tons of research and have decided to delay vaccination.
And they are giving us hard time.

I do not speak local language

 

[Eve]

No they didn't. I am not even sure what the Socials Office is...?

 

[Vrinda]

Well its a local hygiene office - preventive and social department office - where they keep record if something like this but I think its outrageous to do and we feel that doctor broke our trust.

I think some countries are very open about vaccine decision.This one certainly is not. Even though the laws are pretty flexible to choose if you want to vaccinate or not.

I am so angry at them for making it difficult for us. It seems that she is pushing us for vaccinating, even though we clearly stated we want to delay. I know some moms who never vaccinated ( we vaccined one) and they never got recorded by socials.So why us??
I am angry angry angry

 

[Eve]

I don't think it should be anyones business if you decide to delay or not vaccinate at all... I would be upset too...

 

[Vrinda]

Exactly, it shouldnt be anyone's business. I see you are from Canada. I think laws are pretty flex for vaccination there as well.

Should I speak with a lawyer? I am not sure what to do. Because law clearly states that its NOT MANDATORY to VACCINATE.

Why are they poking their nose?

 

[LannieDuck]

Whilst I can't answer to the social office question (I'm in the UK, and I don't think social workers here have anything to do with vaccination), I feel I should point out that vaccination is one aspect of childcare that does impact other people. Some people can't vaccinate their children because of allergies/illnesses etc, and have to rely on herd immunity to provide protection from vaccine-preventable diseases.

As such, your choices do become other people's business.

 

[Ozzieshunni]

What country are you in? Certain countries have different obligations when it comes to medical standards.

We will be delaying the MMR until 15 months, but Alex has had all his other vaccines on time. I believe it is irresponsible not to vaccinate unless your child has a known medical condition or has had a previous reaction to a vaccine.

 

[Mooshie]

Whilst I can't answer to the social office question (I'm in the UK, and I don't think social workers here have anything to do with vaccination), I feel I should point out that vaccination is one aspect of childcare that does impact other people. Some people can't vaccinate their children because of allergies/illnesses etc, and have to rely on herd immunity to provide protection from vaccine-preventable diseases.

As such, your choices do become other people's business.

What country are you in? Certain countries have different obligations when it comes to medical standards.

We will be delaying the MMR until 15 months, but Alex has had all his other vaccines on time. I believe it is irresponsible not to vaccinate unless your child has a known medical condition or has had a previous reaction to a vaccine.

Completely agree with the above. It is most definately other people's business if you decide not to vaccinate.

 

[Vrinda]

Whilst I can't answer to the social office question (I'm in the UK, and I don't think social workers here have anything to do with vaccination), I feel I should point out that vaccination is one aspect of childcare that does impact other people. Some people can't vaccinate their children because of allergies/illnesses etc, and have to rely on herd immunity to provide protection from vaccine-preventable diseases.

As such, your choices do become other people's business.

I am listening to you, this is what pro vacciners would say all the time but it seems to me, there is one flaw in this argument. I've read vaccines itself are causing lots of problems with natural immunity ( I am not going into detail - there are plenty of books on the subject )
Bless all the babies born with allergies or illness ( fyi,I read also that vaccinated kids are more allergic etc than non vaccinated ones stats )So seriously, I am thinking, why to put a totally healthy baby's immunity at risk by vaccinating on this reason alone? I mean, in order to protect(which I read it doesnt actually) lets say 1 percent of herd, why risk the health of remaining 99 percent?

And please if you( or anyone reading this) have better knowledge on the subject, more than welcome to shed some here.
I am continiously researching on this matter.
Trust me, its a hardest decision I've ever made in my life.

Since we are delaying the vaccines at the moment and do not want to give some vaccines which we think are not necessary as per the area we live.

Peace
( I am not going to argue about my choice-we are not against vaccination, it should be a choice since it has its own pros and cons-known )
EDIT- My OH has family history of allergies and such autu immune diseases, one of the reasons why we delay

ON A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT NOTE
I hate all the second hand smoke that is making us sick all the time we are out.
Why is THIS not everyone's business and why is there no complete BAN on smoking or selling cigerretttes etc ?

 

[Eternal]

Personally I see a huge difference between delaying vaccs and not giving them. So if your delying I cant see how anyone else is involved (depending on how long), not giving does become a public issue, the more children who are not vaccinated the greater the occurance and DEATHS from preventable diseases. I think that information needs to be recorded by law, so that public health authorities have the info to determine things like outbreaks etc, I understand its your choice and yoru child but as a nurse and an mother I vaccinate. I have seen the deverstation, death and love term disability diseases like measles can cause. People say, oh its just measles, its a normal childhood disease, and it is, but it does kill.

Out of curiousity, do you all avoid menningitius vaccs as well?

(sorry if my spelling is wack, phone)

 

[Maman]

i was wondering what you are planning to delay?

even so social services have no right to be involved just over delay of vaccinations and they wouldnt hassle you JUST based on that, Theyre far too busy. Your doctor must have been concerned for another reason too.

 

[Leopard]

We are delaying/not vaccing as well and we are being borderline harassed by our health worker too.

 

[roomaloo]

Threaten them with legal action if they don't leave you alone if the law states it's not mandatory. They're trying to bully you into it, bet they have targets to hit like they do over here!

 

[Eve]

We decided to get the one for menengitis, as I know of a few children who have died because of it... chicken pox however? No... no need for it in my opinion and by injecting our children with all of these chemicals, I do wonder what we are really doing to their body and immune systems.

 

[Ozzieshunni]

I know that I'm doing it because some of these illnesses could negatively impact Alex's heart. I have to make a choice as to what's more important and I'll take that risk to see my son healthy and happy (which he thankfully is).

If a child that is un vaccinated comes in contact with my son and he or she is carrying an illness that he hasn't been vaccinated for, who is negatively affected?

 

[LannieDuck]

Whilst I can't answer to the social office question (I'm in the UK, and I don't think social workers here have anything to do with vaccination), I feel I should point out that vaccination is one aspect of childcare that does impact other people. Some people can't vaccinate their children because of allergies/illnesses etc, and have to rely on herd immunity to provide protection from vaccine-preventable diseases.

As such, your choices do become other people's business.

I am listening to you, this is what pro vacciners would say all the time but it seems to me, there is one flaw in this argument. I've read vaccines itself are causing lots of problems with natural immunity ( I am not going into detail - there are plenty of books on the subject )
Bless all the babies born with allergies or illness ( fyi,I read also that vaccinated kids are more allergic etc than non vaccinated ones stats )So seriously, I am thinking, why to put a totally healthy baby's immunity at risk by vaccinating on this reason alone? I mean, in order to protect(which I read it doesnt actually) lets say 1 percent of herd, why risk the health of remaining 99 percent?

And please if you( or anyone reading this) have better knowledge on the subject, more than welcome to shed some here.
I am continiously researching on this matter.
Trust me, its a hardest decision I've ever made in my life.

Since we are delaying the vaccines at the moment and do not want to give some vaccines which we think are not necessary as per the area we live.

Peace
( I am not going to argue about my choice-we are not against vaccination, it should be a choice since it has its own pros and cons-known )

ON A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT NOTE
I hate all the second hand smoke that is making us sick all the time we are out.
Why is THIS not everyone's business and why is there no complete BAN on smoking or selling cigerretttes etc ?

I'm an epidemiologist. I work with data on infectious diseases. At a population level, it's all about risk: the risk that someone will die/suffer serious illness as a result of the disease vs the risk that someone will die/suffer serious illness as a result of the vaccine. The risks of the vaccine are far smaller. Ben Goldacre has written some very good explanations of this in his book 'Bad Science'.

I'm not sure what you mean about the problems with natural immunity. Most vaccines work by triggering the body's own normal immunity processes - many use killed or attenuated (weakened) viruses to do this. They have the same antigens on their surface as live viruses, but don't attack the body (or attack in a weakened form). So the body can learn how to defend itself without actually being in danger.

Wrt the stats on allergies in vaccinated vs non-vaccinated children - do you know where they came from? I'd be interested in taking a look. I don't know of any association between allergies and vaccines. There has been an increase in allergies, and also an increase in rates of vaccination... but that doesn't mean that one has caused the other.

PS I agree about secondhand smoke

 

[Ozzieshunni]

Well said, Lannie

 

[Leopard]

I know that I'm doing it because some of these illnesses could negatively impact Alex's heart. I have to make a choice as to what's more important and I'll take that risk to see my son healthy and happy (which he thankfully is).

If a child that is un vaccinated comes in contact with my son and he or she is carrying an illness that he hasn't been vaccinated for, who is negatively affected?

Both of you are at risk, even when he is vaccinated. Vaccinated babies (ones vaccinated with the live vaccines) can actually pass that disease onto the unvaccinated, whereas an unvacc'd child can pass a different strain of disease onto him.

The way you have to look at it, is every time you vaccinate, you are creating an artificial immune system and destroying their natural immune system. Every time someone is vaccinated there is a very high possibility that they virus or disease they were vaccinated against will mutate into something more dangerous.
Take the H1N1 (I think) virus, or the swine flu as it was better known. Several of my friends had the vaccine against it; and got a really bad strain of the virus, and ended up in hospital, because it was a mutated strain. I got the swine flu myself, but it was pretty subdued and now my body is better equipped to fight off all the strains, not just the artificially prevented one.