I'm seriously close to giving up!!! (Long). *Update Pg 2

[Eliza_V]

I'm sorry, this is long, and slightly rant-esque..

As you've seen before, I've been struggling to get the OK for a homebirth.

I saw the midwife a couple of weeks ago (26th May), and things got a little heated.. I'd been to the cardiologist that morning who, once again, had said that nothing has changed and that yes I have a resting tachycardia but it hasn't got any worse, and shouldn't pose a problem in reagrds to having a natural (or even a home) birth. My BP was fine, and HR was approx 126bpm.


I went to the midwife that afternoon, and was trying to talk to her about the homebirth yet again (as I've got to pay for the pool soon but STILL haven't been given an answer) because I was upset that I had been dragged in to see a consultant a couple of weeks before that to basically be ambushed and told that I shouldn't be able to have a homebirth DESPITE all of the tests they made me having coming back FINE (see a previoius thread of mine) and she started siding with the consultant initially (saying "Don't you want the best for your baby? We're trying to keep you safe" etc.. To which I had to reiterate that if anything had come up - for me or baby - that posed a risk I wouldn't even consider a homebirth, but they were all FINE) but then realised that I was upset that no-one was listening to me and that I wasn't budging. I reiterated that the left hand isn't talking to the right hand (I had to present letters to prove when I had been discharged from the high-risk clinic for example, as letters conveniently aren't turning up) and that no-one seems to realise that this is my choice and people are deciding for me without even having a good reason to do so; I've jumped through all the hoops and they still are saying no! So she said to go to the next appointment (Friday 10th June) and she'd book an appointment for the following Monday (today) to discuss what was said, and she said if I'm not happy with their decision then to tell her Monday and she'd make arrangements for herself and a lady called Gail (delivery suite co-ordinator I believe) to come and see me and we;d come up with an alternative plan of care (for example, when to transfer to hospital, as people are too lazy to read my notes and take one look at my HR and start panicking.. So I'd get sent to the hospital unnecessarily despite the fact it's always like that).

Sooo, Friday. The consultant I was meant to be seeing "wasn't available", and a registrar came in. Normally this would annoy me but he happened to be someone I'd worked with in a different hospital who is very friendly and understanding, and thus understands my wishes for the birth. Firstly he tried to see if I could be sent up to delivery suite to see the consultant inbetween her seeing people up there, but after about na hour of waiting he realised it wasn't possible so he took the appointment instead.. He reiterated that I do not fit the criteria for a waterbirth in the hospital due to the tachycardia, but he knows how keen I am to have one (for pain relief purposes) hence why I was going for one at home, so he put forward the compromise of:

- Ignoring the guidelines as it were; and asking if I'd consder a waterbirth at the hospital if they could provide that for me. This way I could still have a waterbirth and minimal intervention, but have the back-up there should something unexpected happen and that way the "hospital are in their comfort zone". I said maybe, BUT there's still the issue/anxiety I have of being alone without my husband on the first night (espeically if I give birth in the middle of the night and get turfed to postnatal and he gets sent home) so he suggested

- Either sorting a side-room postnatally where my husband could stay overnight with me, or the potential of a "6-hour discharge" where I wouldn't even leave delivery suite after the birth, so my husband wouldn't have to go either.

I said that IF the above could be adhered to, along with having notes VERY CLEARLY written re: my tachycardia and the need NOT to intervene and take the waterbirth privledge away and putting me on constant monitoring for it, then it's something I'd consider. He said to talk to my midwife on Monday, and then she'd talk to Gail, who would then speak to be further about the likelihood of the above happening etc (as he couldn't say things for certain) and then a decision coulkd be reached before I'm 36 weeks (a week on Friday!) when I have to pay for the pool.

So, today is the day. Went to see the midwife, and it's a different one.. Who informed me that my midwife is ON HOLIDAY. Depsite the fact she booked today's appointment to make sure everything would be sorted before I'm 36 weeks!! What was the point in booking it when she KNEW she was away? The lady I had today, while nice enough, was a bit dippy and said "Oh that seems like something you need to see Julie for.." when she asked me to explain the "general gist of the situation" to her because there was "a lot to read" in my notes. When I explained my worries about "medical professionals" taking one look at my HR in hospital WITHOUT looking at my notes and assuming something is wrong - hence going for the homebirth - she said "oh I understand" and "I agree blah balh" etc etc.. Then proceeded to take my BP and HR (117bpm) and got all "Ok I'm going to have to take it manually because your HR shouldn't be that high unless something's wrong.." to which I said "SEE! That's normal for me!" I was really upset as this appointment seemed pointless, considering it was booked to make sure things were done quickly, but she then said she's in a team meeting with my midwife tomorrow despite the fact she's supposed to be on holiday and would mention the appointment to her and ask her to call Gail to organise a time to see me, then call me tomorrow afternoon. Well, this was after she said "Do you want to be in the meeting where you birth plan is decided?" Considering I'd just been ranting about how no-one listens to me regarding my birth plan, I was not best pleased by this question..

So anyway, she said she'll get her to ring me. And if she doesn't ring me I'm supposed to ring Gail, but how do I know that a) She'll know about me or b) I won't piss people off to the point where they wont want to help me anymore?? If they can adhere to the above suggestions that THEY have made as a compromise, then I will happily consider them providing it's all written CLEARLY in my notes and they are adhered to other than in the case of an emergency. But if the left hand isn't talking to the right hand now, how do I know they will when the time comes? I have to pay for this pool next week, what if I don't have an answer by then because they keep putting things off? If I still went ahead with a homebirth, they may still transfer me to hospital in a panic and I would definitley be monitored constantly in hospital then and wouldn't get any of my previous wishes, but if I go ahead with their compromise at least I know that they should be giving me a waterbirth and not monitoring me, and letting my husband stay with me (rather than the unknown of what will happen if i get transferred from home, which seems like something taht's likely to happen since people DON'T READ MY NOTES).

I feel so lost and let down, not to mention scared and unprepared for the impending birth in what could be any time in the next 3-8 weeks...

 

[chuck]

ARGH I'm mad on your behalf hun.

I'd write a simple letter to the head of midwifery for your area stating that you will be homebirthing and expect to be attended in labour. Don't go into details but say you have sought guidance and you are are of the risks of homebirth as well as the benefits and you are taking the relevant precautions regarding monitoring underlying health issues and are making a fully informed decision to homebirth.

I would throw in that you are very disappointed in the lack of support, understanding and information you have been able to get from your antenatal team and how it reflects badly on the trust.

Try not to worry, it is very rare you have to fight to the extreme of taking it further than that - although you will need to stand firm.

I know its all too easy to give in a take what seems llike the easier path trust me I know but I hate myself for havng done so with things like BF'ing.

This is your birth and you deserve to be able to do it your way.

Just rememebr to remain calm and you dont have to explain yourself or defend yourself you have the RIGHT to birth where ever you choose how ever you choose.

we're here to help you every step of the way.

 

[birdiex]

That's terrible

You're right to keep the letters, and I agree with Chuck, write to your head of midwifery. If you can, take it to her personally so that you KNOW she has recieved it, since the letters already have a habit of not turning up x

 

[Bournefree]

In your situiation and at this point in your pregnancy, I would be inclided to call the head of Midwifery and get an appointment - this needs sorting now! You can't have this feeling of all up in the air, and noone listening to you. Though I love to write a letter.. you need direct action.

Find out when the team meeting is to discuss your case. The MWs should be doing everything to enable your HB - yes it might not be simple or straight forward - but how you are currently being "treated" (if you can call it that?!?) is PREPOSTEROUS!

I also don't see why you can't be in the pool??! That doesn't seem to make physological or practical sense to me?! Considering the benefits of water and how it can relax you.
If they want your HR constantly monitored, it can be done from your clavial points to get a good ECG... and shouldn't unless you want fully submerge cause any probs with the water.. that's if you want to be monitored (I could certainly see you not wanting to to have your HR constantly monitored, I could see them getting twitchy!)

Get a meeting with the Head of Midwifery double quick.
Call the maternity Dept now, fine out when she is next in - she might even be working at the moment (midwifery is not a 9-5 job)

Please let us know how you get on with making an appointment.

You need to have you care discussed with skilled MWs who should make themselves available for you. Find out if your Head of Midwifery is also supervisor of MWs (Supervisors all report to the LSA and to the Nursing and Midwifey council.. so if you don't feel as though you are getting anywhere with her, you can go further)

Have you seen this? It the NMC guidelines on supporting women in their choice for home birth.
https://www.nmc-uk.org/Documents/Co...e2SupportingWomenInTheirChoiceOfHomeBirth.pdf
XxxX

 

[Mervs Mum]

I'm angry for you too

The only other thing I'm going to add is that you could look at an independent MW. I know it shouldn't be that way and I would still follow it up but if there's any way you could afford it it might be worth looking at. Up here they take payment spread over long periods too. I'm just thinking of a plan B which could take the stress straight out of things. x

 

[kcj2008]

Awwww hun I am angry for you too. I have had 3 children and am pregnant with my 4th. My 1st 2 were both hospital births which had so much intervention from the midwives I am now petrified to go anywhere near a hospital.

So much so I paid £3000.00 for a independant midwife with my 3rd - no not rich - just had to work my backside off but she was worth triple her fee. This time I am having to save once again as I just cannot put my trust within the NHS system. I really feel you should complain, ultimately this is your decision and they have to by law attend your birth whether they are happy about it or not!!!

I actually had tachycardia with my first drove me mad but my doctor didn't really bat an eyelid and my resting pulse was I believe around the 123 mark. This is the last thing you need not having support from your midwives but stand your ground hunny I know it is very hard as at time they make you feel that you are risking yours or the babies lives but alot of the time they do like things to work there way and are very institutionalised thinking as I call inside the box and not to prepared to think outside of the box.

If you continue to get problems perhaps phone an indepedant midwife and ask there advice,they don't charge and would probably more than willing to provide some advice as they believe as women we can generally labour alone with little intervention and infact this has been proven safer.

Sorry for the long post and I so hope you get the birth you want and deserve!!! xx

 

[Eliza_V]

Thanks guys. The silly thing is that, IF they can adhere to fudging these guidelines and doing these things to allow a hospital waterbirth with husband being able to stay afterwards, then I'd be more willing to accept it which benefits THEM as they're the ones who are worried! Plus it means the uncertainty of whether I'll be transferred isn't there, and I know that I can spend my first night with my husband even if I am in the hospital (I wont get this if I am transferred). It just seems safer in the "at least I KNOW what will happen" sense. And hey, no mess to clean up But if they can't guarantee a waterbirth or that my husband can stay with me, then I will go back to the original plan of staying home and tell them yet again that I know my rights I just need to know before 36 weeks!

Unfortunately, an independent MW isn't really an option due to financial constraints

I will wait until tomorrow afternoon to see if my MW calls me back after the meeting like she's supposed to, to organise this meeting with the SoM/co-ordinator or whatever she is. If she doesn't, I'll bypass the midwife and call delivery suite myself as she should be there. DH is fuming for me too and wanted me to call today, but I don't think much would've been done since my MW is "On holiday" other than this meeting, so we'll see what happens..

*sigh*

 

[Bournefree]

It is your choice sweetie...
As long as you are sure of your choice, and are not feeling that you are being coxed into hospital by these concessions, if it isn't something that you were planning to do.
How they are going to be able to guarantee these concessions.. would be a mystery to me, with the unpredictable nature of spontaneous labour - as you certainly don't want to be induced, so 'they' can plan your birth.
I still feel that you would be more accommodated at home. As the transfer presents the same spontaneous problems as spontaneous onset of birth.
Sorry, not here to confuse you - just want you to be certain... as this isn't what you started wanting.

Are you sure your MW hasn't just taken 1 days leave and they are calling it "holiday" hence why she is back tomorrow>?

Fingers crossed for tomorrow.
XXx

 

[Eliza_V]

She's off all week apparently, but is still coming in for this "team meeting".

It's always been in the back of my mind whether a hospital would be "safer" as it was my first birth, but I didn't want to go ahead with it given my anxieties about being seperated from my husband, unnecessary intervention, and wishes for a waterbirth. I am struggling to see how they'd guarantee it all as well, which was why I was supposed to be meeting with Gail to discuss the likelihood of this happening (securing the pool if I ring when I'm in early labour for example, and the possibility of paying for a side-room if i do have to stay so it doesn't conveniently get given to someone else etc) so we can make a final decision as to whether I'd be going into the hospital or having a homebirth against advice (with the uncertainties of a transfer still hovering over my head!)

xx

 

[Mervs Mum]

You don't have to say obviously but I've just seen you're in Leeds so I'm guessing this is LGI. if so they have a shocking record of letting even low risk women in that one pool so if the pool is important then home is your best chance.

I strongly suggest you go to the next Leeds home birth group. There are independent mws there and they promise to attend women from the group at home if local hospitals refuse on the night they are available. It's a shame you can't consider an IM we have some of the best in the UK here and they will do everything to accommodate women.

 

[Eliza_V]

Mervs Mum, it is LGI as a matter of fact.. I'm hoping that as a former colleague of mine is there that I can get him to stick up for me if they're being arseholes about letting me use the pool (after all, he was the one who suggested ignoring the guidelines for me in the first place). I thought they had two pools there? I know they had to close down the old pools as they weren't suitable for use but they opened two more?

This may be a silly suggestion.. But do you reckon I could pay for the pool at home even if I agree to go to hospital, and if they start putting up the barriers and refuse to budge can I discharge myself and go home and demand they send someone to me there as they didn't stick to their promises? I know it's potentially money down the drain if I get to use the hospital pool, and it's potentially more stress on the day.. But it just crossed my mind.. x

 

[Bournefree]

^^^^^ Now THAT is a great advice from MM and a brilliant idea about going to the home birth meeting!!!
Also good idea about the birth pool. You can decide what you would like to do on the day anyway! - Just because they have made all these consessions and you might have agreed to them, you might find on the day, you just don't want to BE moved in labour. If you get the pool second hand from e-bay or something, you won't loose money by buying it either Also, even if you do go in - or you could always take it with you?
XxX

 

[Mervs Mum]

Absolutely you can. You could ring up on the day and say youre not coming in until its confirmed thar you'll be whisked straight through to the pool!

The Leeds home birth group might have a loan pool you could borrow.

 

[Eliza_V]

I have been looking at second-hand pools on ebay but didn't want the kerfufflle of having to sell it on again afterwards, and there wasnt much difference in price between hiring and selling. Will have to look into this Leeds Homebirth Group.. How/where/when MM? x

I will have to make it clear to them that I'm not coming in unless there's a pool available, then! I'm not sure if I can bring my own one in tbh, I heard that some hospitals can even get funny about pludding your phone chargers in (as they aren't PAT tested) so bringing in a whole birthing pool?? Lol xx

xx

 

[Mervs Mum]

I know my local hospital are happy for you to bring your own as long as you take care of everything ie pumping filling draining etc. so it's well worth asking x

https://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=485151625493

 

[Eliza_V]

Really?? Well I'll definitely ask if that's an option then xx

 

[Mervs Mum]

It's a very pro normal birth hospital with a birth centre and LGI are probably the other end of the scale so don't hold your breath but you've nothing to lose!

 

[Eliza_V]

Update:

Midwife never called me back after the team meeting (surprise, surprise...) And when I called her today the phone was off with a message stating that she was on annual leave 'til the 20th and not to leave any messages.

I rang delivery suite and got through to Gail (eventually!) who was very helpful and said she'd been informed about me, and that they'd be sure to sort something out (in her words "Don't come in all defensive, I'm very flexible and I'm sure we can come to some sort of compromise" - in a friendly tone and not nasty btw lol) and she was keen to get this sorted quickly. So me and DH are meeting with her on Friday evening at 7pm, and my annoying MW doesn't have to be there

Also, I contacted the hire company for the birth pool and they said that if a decision still hasn't been reached by 36 weeks (payment date) then just to let them know and they wont ask for any money but still hold the booking open for me, and if I don't need it in the end then I won't be charged

Will keep you wonderful ladies updated! xx

 

[smoozey]

I would worry about agreeing to the concessions that the registrar suggested, the fact is that they are trying to make decisions without you already, once you are in the hospital it will be far more difficult to assert yourself, and very little you can do if they decide they 'can't' do what they promised they would. My sister had a terrible experience in hospital, she was supposed to be in the birthing unit, they told her she was going up to the labour ward for a 'review' then they wouldn't let her leave (she later found out that they had lied and were closing the unit) then she was treated to a series of patronising obs and midwives (one of whom actually tried to physically hold her down on the bed) the whole experience made her feel like she was putting her baby at risk everytime she disagreed with them. If it weren't for her strong will and her partners support she would have had an epidural, induction and assisted birth. All they wanted was for her to do what was easiest for them because they were understaffed. As a result, for a couple of weeks after she couldn't even talk about it without crying. It has made me even more determined to go for the home birth I want.

 

[Eliza_V]

Smoozey - What an awful experience I'm making it clear that if they don't adhere to my wishes (unless in the case of medical need, which they would have to *prove*) then I will be tunring around and going home! Tbh I am likely to have the birthing pool delivered to home as a back-up anyway.. Plus I'm hoping that, given a former colleague is a doctor there and wants me to contact him when I'm in labour, he will stick up for me (he is the one already pulling strings to get things changed). xx