Nationalized health insurance

[mkm1083]

So it looks like "Obamacare" is probably going to be sticking around. Not sure I'm a fan of this.

Do those of you who have national health insurance like it or would you prefer something more like we currently have in the US? Why?

 

[discoclare]

Well I work for the UK NHS so I am a bit biased!

But I do think the NHS is great in the main. I have had private healthcare as well for quite a bit of my life (through my father's employer as a child and through my OH's previous employer) but I have never used it. I only have only ever used NHS care personally.

What aren't you in favour of? I have asked this question of so many americans (including some of my own family in debt-ridden California) and nobody ever seems to give me an answer! Just that they are happy with the way things are (even though insurance costs seem to be spiralling out of control). I think you don't get value for money at all with the way things are. For example, I work in infectious diseases and I know that a lot of our US colleagues have to pay more for the exact same drugs as we are using in our healthcare service (other countries such as France, Spain etc also get them cheaper than the US). This is because with the NHS we are a large organisation which has better bargaining power to reduce the cost of drugs to the service. With such a disjointed insurance type service no single organisation in the states bargains with the big drug companies, they just pass on the costs directly in the form of higher premiums. Really it should be the other way round, with a larger population the US should be able to knock the drug companies down more and get better deals.

 

[mkm1083]

There are two reasons I don't like it:
1. The government mandate. You must have health insurance or you will face a fine.
2. The government can't really do anything else right so I'm pretty sure they will find a way to royally screw this up too.

However, for me to provide health insurance for myself and two kids I'm looking at roughly $600 per month in premiums plus the co-pays and deductibles. I can't afford that. Not even close. And the cost has gone up since Obamacare passed.

I like what you're saying about the NHS being able to control costs. I wish I had confidence out gov't would be able to do the same.

 

[DukesAngel]

There are two reasons I don't like it:
1. The government mandate. You must have health insurance or you will face a fine.
2. The government can't really do anything else right so I'm pretty sure they will find a way to royally screw this up too.

However, for me to provide health insurance for myself and two kids I'm looking at roughly $600 per month in premiums plus the co-pays and deductibles. I can't afford that. Not even close. And the cost has gone up since Obamacare passed.

I like what you're saying about the NHS being able to control costs. I wish I had confidence out gov't would be able to do the same.

The cost has gone WAY up since Obamacare decided to come into play. I'm sickened by the thought of what I'm going to pay when LO comes along.

 

[mkm1083]

There are two reasons I don't like it:
1. The government mandate. You must have health insurance or you will face a fine.
2. The government can't really do anything else right so I'm pretty sure they will find a way to royally screw this up too.

However, for me to provide health insurance for myself and two kids I'm looking at roughly $600 per month in premiums plus the co-pays and deductibles. I can't afford that. Not even close. And the cost has gone up since Obamacare passed.

I like what you're saying about the NHS being able to control costs. I wish I had confidence out gov't would be able to do the same.

The cost has gone WAY up since Obamacare decided to come into play. I'm sickened by the thought of what I'm going to pay when LO comes along.

Also, from what I can tell - Obamacare doesn't actually provide government health insurance to everybody. We still have to pay for private insurance. Which the cost has gone up on. And if we can't afford to pay the premiums we get fined. Do I have this right?

Why couldn't they have done something like the UK did??? From the posts I see on here it seems like it works at least reasonably well.

 

[deafgal]

yes, because if people don't take care of their health, They will end up on SSI/disability/medicare/medicaid anyway at the expense of tax payers. My mom had breast cancer and she had medicaid/ My dad is in the army and he have tricare. I prefer preventive care.

There are some people who have cochlear implants and they do not qualify for disability or anything. (these people are usually late deafened who used to be hearing so they do well with cochlear implant - Rush Limbaugh is one of those people , but there are some prelingually deaf who do well with cochlear implant too.) but here is a problem, if their speech processor (the external hardware with microphone) broke and they are out of warranty, they may not be able to afford a new one as some of them can cost up to $7,000 each. And some insurance will only pay 60% of it but they still can't afford it without putting it on credit card and they NEED it right away or they will lose their job. They probably can not afford to pay off credit cards on top of batteries and other deaf related supplies (expensive! We use text messaging, internet [I do NOT use a phone at all, I do use a TTY but using a text messaging is better than a phoneline with TTY as I can reach out my family more without a third party], vibrating/strobe alarms, etc) and if they have children with health problems like I do, it gets really bad. I had to put my son's needs (life and death -asthma plus other things) over my needs to get a hearing aid/processor. It's very tempting to apply for SSDI and medicare so I can take care both of our needs.

so yes, I support it. But I do think people who have been warned by their doctors to quit their habits or it could harm their health should take small extra insurance (since they may need more healthcare than the national healthcare will allow) Or people who want a little extra like a premium to their healthcare. Kinda like car insurance do to high risk drivers who still have their license or those who want extra premium to their car insurance.

 

[deafgal]

There are two reasons I don't like it:
1. The government mandate. You must have health insurance or you will face a fine.
2. The government can't really do anything else right so I'm pretty sure they will find a way to royally screw this up too.

However, for me to provide health insurance for myself and two kids I'm looking at roughly $600 per month in premiums plus the co-pays and deductibles. I can't afford that. Not even close. And the cost has gone up since Obamacare passed.

I like what you're saying about the NHS being able to control costs. I wish I had confidence out gov't would be able to do the same.

The cost has gone WAY up since Obamacare decided to come into play. I'm sickened by the thought of what I'm going to pay when LO comes along.

Also, from what I can tell - Obamacare doesn't actually provide government health insurance to everybody. We still have to pay for private insurance. Which the cost has gone up on. And if we can't afford to pay the premiums we get fined. Do I have this right?

Why couldn't they have done something like the UK did??? From the posts I see on here it seems like it works at least reasonably well.

That's how it works, yes, everyone have to have health insurance or they will get fined. But insurances are horrible as they will not cover everything and still take your money.

 

[mkm1083]

@deafgal - So how exactly does Obamacare help someone who is in the situation you describe? I really don't understand since Obamacare isn't actually providing the insurance you still will have the massive out-of-pocket expense.

Sorry, I'm just trying to get a handle on this and how it's going to impact me. I haven't paid much attention to it until now. Originally I thought it had been modeled after national health care in other countries. Obviously, I was wrong.

 

[deafgal]

I was supporting national healthcare.

When I was on medicaid, or my mom, etc. Most of the things were covered. Even my processor would be 100% covered (at least every 5 years, and they cover repairs too, when my insurance does NOT) Obamacare suppose to have a gov't assisted healthcare for those who can't afford insurance, from what I understand. and I think they are more likely be the lucky ones whose heathcare will be covered mostly while workplaces expect you to pay out of your paycheck for some crappy insurance cover about 30%-60% - like my cochlear implant processor which I tried to get them to cover.


people have sued insurance to cover everything. And they already have. Parents of deaf children have been suing them to force them to cover cochlear implants and won. It is a pain to deal with insurances to get them to cover a simple need. So we keep making laws. Like how they passed women healthcare should be cover 100% https://www.hhs.gov/news/press/2011pres/08/20110801b.html

 

[Wildfire81]

There are two reasons I don't like it:
1. The government mandate. You must have health insurance or you will face a fine.
2. The government can't really do anything else right so I'm pretty sure they will find a way to royally screw this up too.

However, for me to provide health insurance for myself and two kids I'm looking at roughly $600 per month in premiums plus the co-pays and deductibles. I can't afford that. Not even close. And the cost has gone up since Obamacare passed.

I like what you're saying about the NHS being able to control costs. I wish I had confidence out gov't would be able to do the same.

The cost has gone WAY up since Obamacare decided to come into play. I'm sickened by the thought of what I'm going to pay when LO comes along.

I agree. I am completely against Obamacare. Don't even get me started on my opinion of everything happening these days! Sure, I want cheaper healthcare, but I also want the freedom to make my own choice and not have it crammed down my throat!

 

[mkm1083]

I was supporting national healthcare.

When I was on medicaid, or my mom, etc. Most of the things were covered. Even my processor would be 100% covered (at least every 5 years, and they cover repairs too, when my insurance does NOT) Obamacare suppose to have a gov't assisted healthcare for those who can't afford insurance, from what I understand. and I think they are more likely be the lucky ones whose heathcare will be covered mostly while workplaces expect you to pay out of your paycheck for some crappy insurance cover about 30%-60% - like my cochlear implant processor which I tried to get them to cover.


people have sued insurance to cover everything. And they already have. Parents of deaf children have been suing them to force them to cover cochlear implants and won. It is a pain to deal with insurances to get them to cover a simple need. So we keep making laws. Like how they passed women healthcare should be cover 100% https://www.hhs.gov/news/press/2011pres/08/20110801b.html

Ahhhh got it now. Thanks. I must say that the medicaid that I and the boys were on for a little while was by far the best coverage I have ever received. I did have to pay out-of-pocket for it some because of my income level but nowhere near private insurance. Now I have a monthly premium $72 for a $10,000 deductible policy. This is just for me not the kids. I can't afford anything better.

 

[Pandora11]

Forgive me if i'm wrong, but it it not a good thing? It's so depressing seeing films like John Q etc and knowing in the US people go without medical care and feel damn lucky our country is not like that.

What exactly are the terms, does everyone get it?

Here we have the NHS but people with plenty of more also have the option to have private care etc.

We are taxed National insurance/tax on our wages(i dont know which part covers the national health) and it's such a small amount, and we've always had to pay it, it's unnoticable... unlike student loan etc. We pay for perscriptions which are fairly reasonably priced and dental work(unless on low income and have these paid for too) but don't pay to visit the Dr/hospital/have operations etc no matter what's wrong with us we get treated. I can't imagine having to worry about getting a job with insurance or having the exact insurance with the right cover, it seems so complicated.

The US seems unhappy with what Obama is trying to do but if it's resembles what we have, then i can't see problems with it.

 

[Pandora11]

Well I work for the UK NHS so I am a bit biased!

But I do think the NHS is great in the main. I have had private healthcare as well for quite a bit of my life (through my father's employer as a child and through my OH's previous employer) but I have never used it. I only have only ever used NHS care personally.

What aren't you in favour of? I have asked this question of so many americans (including some of my own family in debt-ridden California) and nobody ever seems to give me an answer! Just that they are happy with the way things are (even though insurance costs seem to be spiralling out of control). I think you don't get value for money at all with the way things are. For example, I work in infectious diseases and I know that a lot of our US colleagues have to pay more for the exact same drugs as we are using in our healthcare service (other countries such as France, Spain etc also get them cheaper than the US). This is because with the NHS we are a large organisation which has better bargaining power to reduce the cost of drugs to the service. With such a disjointed insurance type service no single organisation in the states bargains with the big drug companies, they just pass on the costs directly in the form of higher premiums. Really it should be the other way round, with a larger population the US should be able to knock the drug companies down more and get better deals.

How much do you American relatives pay for health insurance/medical care compared with our NI and Tax?

 

[Wildfire81]

For people who are low income, they get free healthcare in the form of medicaid. Unfortunately, their opinion of low income is not right. Depending on the person, we all pay different rates for insurance. My family pays about $300 a month.

 

[discoclare]

Well I work for the UK NHS so I am a bit biased!

But I do think the NHS is great in the main. I have had private healthcare as well for quite a bit of my life (through my father's employer as a child and through my OH's previous employer) but I have never used it. I only have only ever used NHS care personally.

What aren't you in favour of? I have asked this question of so many americans (including some of my own family in debt-ridden California) and nobody ever seems to give me an answer! Just that they are happy with the way things are (even though insurance costs seem to be spiralling out of control). I think you don't get value for money at all with the way things are. For example, I work in infectious diseases and I know that a lot of our US colleagues have to pay more for the exact same drugs as we are using in our healthcare service (other countries such as France, Spain etc also get them cheaper than the US). This is because with the NHS we are a large organisation which has better bargaining power to reduce the cost of drugs to the service. With such a disjointed insurance type service no single organisation in the states bargains with the big drug companies, they just pass on the costs directly in the form of higher premiums. Really it should be the other way round, with a larger population the US should be able to knock the drug companies down more and get better deals.

How much do you American relatives pay for health insurance/medical care compared with our NI and Tax?

Well that I'm not exactly sure of and don't feel that I can directly ask! My aunt and uncle, let's call them Aunty X and Uncle Y, have described what they pay as "a lot!" but my uncle worked for the military before he retired so probably had really good healthcare then and I think may still have some kind of coverage to do with that now (but not sure). They can afford to pay it, they put both of my cousins through private school and college and Uncle Y has a good pension while Aunty X is still working, so they aren't hard up. However, even with a really good insurance policy often not everything is covered. So for example, Uncle Y is in remission from a rare form of cancer and sees a specialist in San Francisco who is a national expert on that kind of cancer. He was prescribed retuxin (sp?) and his insurance (which he says is a good pretty comprehensive policy) doesn't cover it all so he has to pay a couple of hundred dollars per cycle!

Meanwhile Aunty Z has not long been laid off from a national chain of stores and lost her work insurance (she worked for them for 39 years!). She isn't yet old enough for the one you get when you are retired (?Blue Cross or medicaid or whatever) and she is trying to find another job, but at almost 60 I think it's unlikely anyone will want to take her on. She is uninsured currently (still Aunty X and Uncle Y are against nationalised healthcare despite being aware of Aunty Z's predictament). Aunty Z has really bad asthma which she has had since childhood. Her asthma meds cost about 300 dollars when I was there last (which I think was for a month's supply), and that was when she had insurance from her ex-employer (I think they continued to pay insurance for 6 months after they laid her off).

Cousin number 1 is in the police and I think has a good policy through his work. Cousin 2's husband is in the force too so ditto.

Reading some of these posts I can see why people have issues. My feeling is that the US needs to do something. I think it's hard to do things in the same way we do them in the UK (ie taking a percentage of your wage before paying it to you) because people would class that as "increasing taxes". And in the US usually if you increase taxes, the party in power and President become EXTREMELY unpopular and you lose at the next election (which may well happen to Obama anyway).

 

[discoclare]

Forgive me if i'm wrong, but it it not a good thing? It's so depressing seeing films like John Q etc and knowing in the US people go without medical care and feel damn lucky our country is not like that.

What exactly are the terms, does everyone get it?

Here we have the NHS but people with plenty of more also have the option to have private care etc.

We are taxed National insurance/tax on our wages(i dont know which part covers the national health) and it's such a small amount, and we've always had to pay it, it's unnoticable... unlike student loan etc. We pay for perscriptions which are fairly reasonably priced and dental work(unless on low income and have these paid for too) but don't pay to visit the Dr/hospital/have operations etc no matter what's wrong with us we get treated. I can't imagine having to worry about getting a job with insurance or having the exact insurance with the right cover, it seems so complicated.

The US seems unhappy with what Obama is trying to do but if it's resembles what we have, then i can't see problems with it.

I think that's the problem, it doesn't resemble what we have. Obama wanted a system which "wasn't British and wasn't Canadian, but was our own system". That's where he's gone wrong. Just copy us or Canada! Canada's right next door, you can just look over their shoulder and copy!

 

[Pandora11]

I heard that other people added things on to the idea that Obama had in order for it to be passed. It seems so hard to make changes in the States, it's 2011, there must be a better way of doing these things. They're supposed to improve lives but it all seems to cause far more problems and ideas/proposals end up discarded and not followed through and no one is better off but had a rough ride in the process of all that faffing.

 

[mkm1083]

Well I work for the UK NHS so I am a bit biased!

But I do think the NHS is great in the main. I have had private healthcare as well for quite a bit of my life (through my father's employer as a child and through my OH's previous employer) but I have never used it. I only have only ever used NHS care personally.

What aren't you in favour of? I have asked this question of so many americans (including some of my own family in debt-ridden California) and nobody ever seems to give me an answer! Just that they are happy with the way things are (even though insurance costs seem to be spiralling out of control). I think you don't get value for money at all with the way things are. For example, I work in infectious diseases and I know that a lot of our US colleagues have to pay more for the exact same drugs as we are using in our healthcare service (other countries such as France, Spain etc also get them cheaper than the US). This is because with the NHS we are a large organisation which has better bargaining power to reduce the cost of drugs to the service. With such a disjointed insurance type service no single organisation in the states bargains with the big drug companies, they just pass on the costs directly in the form of higher premiums. Really it should be the other way round, with a larger population the US should be able to knock the drug companies down more and get better deals.

How much do you American relatives pay for health insurance/medical care compared with our NI and Tax?

Because of my children's ages and where we live (highest malpractice payouts in the country) we would have to pay roughly $600 a month for decent health insurance. I think that would be a $1,500 deductible. Not sure if that's the single or the family though. So if it's single then it would be $3,000 family deductible. I think it was an 80/20 copay. The way it works here is that you pay the monthly premium then you have to pay the amount of the deductible before the insurance covers anything. Then 20% of the bill (copay). Depending on the insurance it may also cover, for example, one annual office exam for a $35 copay.

With my current insurance if I were to get seriously sick and need to go the emergency room tonight and get admited to the hospital I would have to pay $500 to the emergency room. Then I have to cover a $10,000 deductible before insurance starts paying. After that I have the 20% copay. After I get to $12,500 out of pocket the insurance will cover everything.

 

[mkm1083]

Forgive me if i'm wrong, but it it not a good thing? It's so depressing seeing films like John Q etc and knowing in the US people go without medical care and feel damn lucky our country is not like that.

What exactly are the terms, does everyone get it?

Here we have the NHS but people with plenty of more also have the option to have private care etc.

We are taxed National insurance/tax on our wages(i dont know which part covers the national health) and it's such a small amount, and we've always had to pay it, it's unnoticable... unlike student loan etc. We pay for perscriptions which are fairly reasonably priced and dental work(unless on low income and have these paid for too) but don't pay to visit the Dr/hospital/have operations etc no matter what's wrong with us we get treated. I can't imagine having to worry about getting a job with insurance or having the exact insurance with the right cover, it seems so complicated.

The US seems unhappy with what Obama is trying to do but if it's resembles what we have, then i can't see problems with it.

I think that's the problem, it doesn't resemble what we have. Obama wanted a system which "wasn't British and wasn't Canadian, but was our own system". That's where he's gone wrong. Just copy us or Canada! Canada's right next door, you can just look over their shoulder and copy!

This country will never go for what Canada has. We hear too many horror stories about waiting lists that are years and years long and people dying before they get their treatment.

I must say I've started wondering how much better quality of life I would have if I were to re-locate to the other side of the Detroit River - into Windsor.

 

[mkm1083]

Thanks for all the responses. Really appreciate the feedback.