Please read if you HAVEN’T had the flu shot already!

[3buutifulgirl]

I'm not sure why a second flu vaccine thread was started...

Regarding the classification of the flu vaccines, most pregnant woman are given the vaccines that are classified as category B pregnancy drugs. Other drugs in this category include tylenol, ibuprofin and insulin.

The information you present is very interesting and from valid sources. I personally disagree with some of your interpretations. For example, the articles by Moro suggest to me that there is no cause for concern. It is true that adverse pregnancy outcomes are reported after vaccination. The real question is whether there are more adverse effects reported after vaccination than occur in unvaccinated populations. These articles conclude that the rates in both groups are similar so there is no evidence of the vaccines causing harm. The full text of the first article can be read here. You will see that in this full article, not only does the author suggest that his research does not show any evidence of harmful effects, he also cites many other studies that reach the same conclusion. In particular, a study that followed mothers and babies for 7 years following prenatal vaccine and found no evidence of any adverse effects.

I had posted this in the other thread but I think it is relevant here too. This is from the cdc website. The term TIV refers to Trivalent inactivated influenza virus vaccine (ie the vaccine).

Pregnant Women and NeonatesFDA has classified FluLaval, Fluarix (GlaxoSmithKline Biologicals) and Agriflu (Novartis Vaccines and Diagnostics Limited) influenza vaccines as “Pregnancy Category B” medications, indicating that animal reproduction studies have not demonstrated a fetal risk, but there are no controlled studies in pregnant women; all other influenza vaccines are classified as “Pregnancy Category C” medications, indicating that adequate animal reproduction studies have not been conducted. Available data do not indicate that any influenza vaccine causes fetal harm when administered to a pregnant woman, and any of the approved TIV formulations may be used for vaccinating pregnant women. One study of approximately 2,000 pregnant women who received TIV during pregnancy demonstrated no adverse fetal effects and no adverse effects during infancy or early childhood. A matched case-control study of 252 pregnant women who received TIV within the 6 months before delivery determined no adverse events after vaccination among pregnant women and no difference in pregnancy outcomes compared with 826 pregnant women who were not vaccinated. During 2000–2003, an estimated 2 million pregnant women were vaccinated, and only 20 adverse events among women who received TIV were reported to VAERS during this time, including nine injection-site reactions and eight systemic reactions (e.g., fever, headache, and myalgias). In addition, three miscarriages were reported, but these were not known to be related causally to vaccination. Similar results have been reported in certain smaller studies, and a recent international review of data on the safety of TIV concluded that no evidence exists to suggest harm to the fetus. The rate of adverse events associated with TIV was similar to the rate of adverse events among pregnant women who received pneumococcal polysaccharide vaccine in one small randomized controlled trial in Bangladesh, and no severe adverse events were reported in any study group.

I think it's great that people are doing their own research, for what I've stated is a PERSONAL decision.
Loverguts and 3buutifulgirl, it is completely uncalled for to try to attack someone who is sharing their OPINION.
I have found all of the info shared here helpful, as I try to make my own decision about the vaccine.

I never attacked anyone by what I have said I to said that everyone makes their own decisions and has their own opinions...It is uncalled for you to call certain people out for their own opinions...I for one could care less what any one person thinks about the flu shot or me on this thread...I am an honest person with honest opinions just as you are I never mention anything about any person by calling them out on here and I dont appreciate being attacked by someone who knows nothing about me so please don't bother mentioning me in a thread unless you know me personally or it is something nice...like my parents always taught me. If you don't have anything nice to say about someone don't say anything at all!!!

 

[Blizzard]

I dislike my doctors 'pushing' drugs on me so much I've not even told them I'm pregnant - the less time they know, the less time they can try to fill me with drugs

I'm so sorry you feel this way . I have three friends who are doctors and they really do care and want what's best for their patients. If you've had a bad experience then I am sorry.

 

[Emzywemzy]

Interesting, but personally I'll be going to my doctor for health advice. That is what they are qualified to do after all. Thanks for posting though.

 

[JennyJelly]

My doctor is fine for most things and I actually quite like her, I just don't trust GP's - they love money too much! I just can't stand the way they try to force flu jabs on you - it's so unnecessary, i'm healthy, young and fit so what's the big idea?! Neolithic man didn't run to the doctor looking for a flu jab incase he got a sniffle!

Each to there own though - I think doctors should let people make their own informed choice.

 

[JennyJelly]

Interesting, but personally I'll be going to my doctor for health advice. That is what they are qualified to do after all. Thanks for posting though.

I would certainly listen to their advice on most things and we all need them at one time or another, the flu jab is the one thing I don't agree with though but that's because i've studied it a lot at uni.

 

[Blizzard]

A sniffle and the flu aren't the same thing . The flu is horrible, I've had it once and I hope I never experience it again, everything hurts, literally .

Anyway, I hope everyone is doing well, and h&h 9 months to you all. xxx

 

[Utahgirl]

I believe you're not being considerate, 3Buutifulgirl, which is why I called you out. I considered your response emotional and snarky, towards someone who had tried to be helpful and informative. Others on this thread have also been helpful and informative. Telling someone they'll be sick in the hospital for months is called fear-mongering. Providing someone with research they've done is informative. I like information, not emotions or fear, when making a medical decision. It's my right to say I don't like emotional fear-mongering, and your right to say you don't like my rational approach. We can agree to disagree.

 

[3buutifulgirl]

I believe you're not being considerate, 3Buutifulgirl, which is why I called you out. I considered your response emotional and snarky, towards someone who had tried to be helpful and informative. Others on this thread have also been helpful and informative. Telling someone they'll be sick in the hospital for months is called fear-mongering. Providing someone with research they've done is informative. I like information, not emotions or fear, when making a medical decision. It's my right to say I don't like emotional fear-mongering, and your right to say you don't like my rational approach. We can agree to disagree.

I was just stating that when someone is laid up in the hospital with flu induced pneumonia (it can and has happened) research all you want to...then they would be thinking they should have got the flu shot...in my opinion that is not fear mongering...BUT hey a lot of pregnant women are scared of a lot of things and maybe to them it could be...but her "research" is also fear mongering, but did I call her out on that no I didn't Why? because that is her opinion...What ever you women decide Good Luck!!! I say ask a doctor who KNOWS because they went to school for that reason and we didn't!!!

 

[Emzywemzy]

Interesting, but personally I'll be going to my doctor for health advice. That is what they are qualified to do after all. Thanks for posting though.

I would certainly listen to their advice on most things and we all need them at one time or another, the flu jab is the one thing I don't agree with though but that's because i've studied it a lot at uni.

Im sorry your docs are pushy. Mine actually aren't, they offer it and if you say no then they don't push the issue. I'd like to think the reasons they are so keen for people to have it extend beyond money though. They push it so hard to stop an outbreak, to stop so many people visiting them with the flu and ultimately stop people from getting seriously ill. That's their job, to protect public health. It's each to their own whether or not they get the jab and I like to read research, etc on the subject, but ultimately I'll be listening to my doctor for health advice x

 

[PegLeg2na]

Right, the things you are taking from the data are your own inferences and not what's actually there. If you can't find corresponding data for the number of spontaneous abortions that take place per million women without the flu jab being administered then this data has no relevence.

"My own inferences and not what's actually there?" I quoted directly from those articles, so yes it was actually there. If you can find information about spontaneous abortions for non-vaccinated women, I'd appreciate it. I was under the impression that during the 1st trimester the risk is 1:5, but I'm not sure about the risks during 2nd and 3rd trimesters.

I spend all day looking at scientific reports just like this at the moment.

I guess that makes us both "experts"? I do to, and have for years. Are you trying to discredit my research or just my methods of sharing it?

I think you're right hun and people should listen to their own concerns and discuss it with their Doctor if worried, but it's not fair to list your own comments with the data, you are not providing an unbiased view and it's unfair.

That's why I listed every "comment "as a "personal note" so that my thoughts were clearly separate from the material I posted. My comments are completely distinguishable from the data and I think it's okay to post my opinion so long as everyone knows it's my opinion. In some cases I was just rewording something to make it less confusing.

I agree that people need to know the risks I really do, but from both sides.

Id' really appreciate it if you could post information about the flu. The vaccine was my focus here but I agree, people should know the 'other side of the story', too. My goal here was just to help people stop and think before getting the shot.

 

[Blizzard]

Lets not have an argument here ladies. We're all passionate about this because we want what's best for our children. Everyone will make their own decision, and there is good information from both sides here now so perhaps it's best to let it go rather than turning it into a battle? Also, yes everyone's an expert. Peg I'm not arguing hun, it's a waste of both our time. People should talk to their doctors rather than making a decision based on what's here and I'm sure they will.

Just a thought and I hope I haven't caused offense.

 

[pinklightbulb]

I do not believe personally in getting vaccinated while pregnant, I prefer to let my immune system do its job. That is strictly JMO though and I am the one taking whatever risks others may think I am taking.

 

[sjwebb]

Everyone realizes what can happen if you get the flu while pregnant. You can still get the flu even when vaccinated. This will be a never ending controversy. To each their own.

 

[amore]

I completely agree that everyone should be free to make a choice about the flu vaccine and for that reason I am going to offer my opinion of why I am pro vaccine. Please feel free to ignore my comment as I am not trying to cause a situation of moral panic or offend anyone who has a different perspective.

What 3buutifulgirl states is not scaremongering but a reality that needs to be stated along side any other research to give a balanced argument. I have had seasonal flu twice. I have a perfect bmi, am extremely healthy and a fitness fanatic but the first time I caught it I was ill for 5 weeks, lost a vast amount of weight and had the doctor at my house daily as I had developed bronchitus and was starting to develop pneumonia - being healthy is no guarantee. I am not trying to scare anyone, I am just giving a realistic experience of flu as it is certainly not a 'sniffle' in most cases. If you want to see the possible effect of flu in pregnancy then I am sure there was a women on baby hospital who had caught it and you can watch her experience x

 

[wavescrash]

I got the flu shot during all of my pregnancies and plan on getting it with this one to...if my doctors thought it wasn't safe they wouldn't RECOMMEND it...There are way more dangerous things during pregnancies than the flu shot...Research all you want to and it will not help you make the decision, When you are laid up in a hospital at 5 or 6 months pregnant with flu induced pneumonia then you will be saying God why didn't I just get the shot...Everyone is different and has there own opinions and everything is not for everyone, but as long as my doctor recommends something I say hey go ahead why not...doctors know way more than we do hence why they go to school for so long.....GOOD LUCK in your decision

Just so you know, getting the vaccine is is not a guarantee that you won't get the flu. You can still get it. It does reduce the risk, though, as does hand washing, eating healthy, staying away from sick people, getting plenty of rest, and recognizing early on when you are sick helps prevent it from getting out of hand.

And your doctor should be providing you the information I posted above, so long as you request it. You have a right to know what the manufacturer says about the vaccine you get.

I agree with the poster you quoted here... no, it doesn't guarantee you won't get it but it's definitely a step in prevention that I'm willing to take.

Everyone says it hasn't been proven 100% safe in pregnant women and there's no way to know what the long-term effects are. There's no way to know the other side of the argument either. It hasn't been proven UNsafe either.

Just like with breastfeeding, co-sleeping, baby wearing, etc... it's all personal preference. It shouldn't be turned into a huge debate or argument amongst insanely hormonal pregnant women.

I know this post wasn't intended to do that, just to inform, but I saw the argument start on the other flu vax thread and it really irked me.

 

[Wildfire81]

I love the bickering this causes. I'll NOT be getting the flu jab, it's bad for you. None of our doctors care about us really - they may say they do but they only care about all the money THEY make by pumping us with injections following a media led scaremongering campaign.

I get my flu shot from work for FREE, and my doctor still recommends it, what is their motivation in that case??

 

[PegLeg2na]

I love the bickering this causes. I'll NOT be getting the flu jab, it's bad for you. None of our doctors care about us really - they may say they do but they only care about all the money THEY make by pumping us with injections following a media led scaremongering campaign.

I get my flu shot from work for FREE, and my doctor still recommends it, what is their motivation in that case??

Well, in this case they got the money from your employer. Your employer paid whoever gave it to you.

 

[luckybreak]

I got the flu shot and got very sick ended up at the ER...so I refuse to take it again.

 

[artiste]

I skimmed this and I don't see how it's scary. Most of the research seems to say that there's no data on whether it's ok in pregnancy and that if there are tests on animals that there's no evidence of problems. I don't plan to get the regular flu shot, but I never do. I'm not big on putting stuff in my body that I don't need, especially during pregnancy.

That being said, I know personally someone who works with pregnant women and also the nurse at my ob/gyn clinic and both of them said that they saw a lot of women lose their babies when they caught h1n1. My problem with the research in this post on the h1n1 vaccine is that it says how many women had adverse outcomes after having the vaccine, but there is no context. what percentage of the total pregnant women vaccinated actually had a bad outcome and were the miscarriages etc actually caused by the vaccine or just coincidental? I got the h1n1 vaccine myself and had no problem in my last pregnancy. Just wanted to give my opinion on this.

 

[wavescrash]

I got the flu shot and got very sick ended up at the ER...so I refuse to take it again.

When I got the flu shot a few years back, I wound up getting sick afterward as well. When debating whether or not to get the shot this year, I raised that with my pharmacist (someone I trust very well) and she told me that it was unlikely the vaccination caused my illness. For starters, it takes 2 weeks until you're protected against the flu after getting the shot so if you fall ill in that time frame, you were likely infected before you got the vax and it just took some time to affect you. Either that or it was something unrelated with similar symptoms.

I'm not saying that's always going to be the case but in your situation, did they say the vax was responsible for you falling ill? It could have been coincidence.