Protecting Our Children - BBC2 - 9pm - 30th Jan

[feeble]

Even the uneducated and lower classes can get 'a' job though, or do some volunteer work or put a bit into society... I don't think its necessarily to do with education, I think it's to do with a lack of a wish to positively contribute in any way.

There are lots of ways to contribute Without them being on vast sums of money, tax credits top up earnings so even a few hours a week in a cleaning job would remove that 100% on benefits factor...

 

[Natasha2605]

I watched this for the first time last night, how absolutely heartbreaking. I really thought she would do it, I thought that when she chose to leave him she'd finally be able to live the life that both her and her child deserved. She just couldn't in the end. Part of me did want her to be given another chance and part of me did think it was harsh she lost her little boy after one blip but then I realised that they just could take allow the possibility of it happening again. Marva was that controlled by Shaun that if he had suggested them moving away into tents wherever again, I bet she'd jump like a rabbit and that child would potentially be 'lost' so to speak from the system until they were tracked or returned.

Such a shame, and I don't believe he was ready to change. I think he was so obsessed with his own self pity and attitude of doing nothing wrong that he believed he was invincible. Not once did he show he was capable of ''rational'' or logical thinking and that was no good for any of them. God his attitude towards his 'good puppy' alone showed his views of reality were different from others.

With regards to sterilisation etc, yes the thought did cross my mind as the program finished. They are still generally young (23 and 29?) and it scares me to think how many more children they could conceive before their biological clocks begin to tick. And I do think they will continue to have children, because when they are in the drunken, jaked out states that's probably when they think they are most capable . I definitely think long term contraception should have been offered to them and I would like to see them get the help they so desperately need. But they can't do it together, the program showed that.

Also, I did think though, that even when Marva was clean and off alcohol there was still something about her that was 'off'' but I couldn't put my finger on what? She just seemed very glacant, uncommunicative and not passionate enough about her son or the situation she found herself in. Very strange.

 

[DanielleM]

Wow this thread went a bit off topic!! In regards to Marva and her baby, I find it really hard to relate to, the fact that my life revolves around my children, they are the most important things in my life. I just can't comprehend somebody that would put drink/drugs/men before your own child actually baffles me. I think that the support that they put into place for Marva was actually adequette placing her and her baby with a foster carer (I actually didn't know they could do this). At least they could have 'eyes' on the situation at all times.

I thought that she might of turned her life around and when they said she had broken the agreement, my first thought was 'oh no' and felt quite sorry for her, but then when the SW called her down out of her hungover bed state she showed not one ounce of remorse or any kind of emotion to the fact that she was having her FOURTH child removed from her care.

 

[smelly07]

With the benefits issue i just think more needs to be done to stop abuse of the system and to ensure money is spent on what it should be.

back to topic:
plenty of men and women are sterilized because they do not want any more children, i am no way against either if thats what someone wants to do BUT there is still nothing wrong in giving people all their options. I think Marva should have been giving all her options.

I read a book by a social worker and stories about the cases he worked on........ there was one young lady who had a drink/drug addiction and was a prostitute, she would fall pregnant continued with her addiction and prostitution whilst pregnant, once she gave birth she would refuse to let go of the baby ....she would be so devastated handing the baby over to SS..... he said it was heart breaking but she continued to fall pregnant and had 8 babies all born addicts and had health problems varying from mild to severe. sadly babies who were born addicts or with health problems were unlikely to find parents who would want to adopt them.
They advised her to look in to ALL methods of contraception but she didnt. should she of choosen to be sterilized .?... i think YES.
she died of an overdose not sure whether it was accidental or not. He said it was such a sad case but all he could think was the selfishness for not thinking about these little lives she continued to bring into the world.

 

[smelly07]

lightworker.......great thread btw really enjoying it x

 

[Rhi_Rhi1]

I noticed some people talking about foster care and the time scale it takes to apply, its worth asking your local council or local private agencies, what there time scale is, as ours can be as little as 6 months! due to low applicants... we are waiting to start the process atm, but our house needs work to be up to scratch,(they didn't tell us that its just obvious lol) our porch started falling off ! and our bathroom is leaking into our kitchen lol

but yeah its deffo worth inquiring x

 

[feeble]

We are really hoping at some point in the future we will have the space to foster...

 

[smelly07]

Feeble: do you think we could foster and be social workers...??? would we have time to both to the best of our ability????

we will look into fostering as soon as we get a bigger property as you need a spare bedroom, which at present is our only downfall.

 

[Lightworker]

Ladies thanks for the contributions. I like that we the thread is going this well, and we are able to talk about various aspects whilst still relating them to the show..so yay!

Re the sterilization, I also believe in redemption (for lack of a better word), and yeah, maybe long-term contraception is a better choice..but sometimes do you feel that realistically (or perhaps pessimistically) sterilization should still be raised?

Yeah, a lot needs to be done re uneducated people. I don't think education is always the route to success, but I was at a meeting recently and they were talking of creating a "work club" getting people back to work, and I said its all very well saying we want to get people back to work, but with the work ethic being very low in some areas..other things need to be factored in like ensuring that people aren't just "working" per se, but trying to achieve their individual dreams..thats more of an incentive I think.

Also..next week's episode will be sure to spark some debate as it involves sexual abuse. I read a synopsis and part of the evidence was that the child hated having their nappy changed ..now my LO HATES having her nappy changed, I have to physically pin her down lol..so it will be interesting to see how much weight that carries in drawing a conclusion of sexual abuse. x

 

[smelly07]

something Feeble said got me thinking..............should parents on benefits be made to do a certain amount of voluntary work each week............? especially when there are two parents at home not working or when their children are at school???? i think this is a good idea??? is it not???

lightworker: oooooooooo next weeks episodes going to be a tough one to watch!

 

[Nibblenic]

something Feeble said got me thinking..............should parents on benefits be made to do a certain amount of voluntary work each week............? especially when there are two parents at home not working or when their children are at school???? i think this is a good idea??? is it not???

In a situation where both parents are not working, I definitely think at least one if not both needs to be doing part-time voluntary work. But even then, who is going to take them on? If they really arent work ready, anywhere with a customer facing environment wont take them, anywhere that requires official training wont take them.
It is a lot more complicated than that. Unfortuantly

 

[smelly07]

agreed that it is complicated and would be hard to achieve, but i think there are alot of places that would take on volunteers in more basic jobs, with the council, clearing paths, picking up rubbish doing all sorts of behind the scene jobs to help. The people who say they want to work but cant find a job....whats stopping them volunteering in something that interests them.........or maybe visiting the elderly and helping out in their houses/gardens with their shopping etc......... i think there are opportunities out there for people to give back to society if they really wanted to x

i work in a pre-school and we wouldnt knock back volunteers, i'm pretty sure alot of places wouldnt. x

or going back to college to study etc to give them better options x

 

[feeble]

I agree with volunteer work. Especially as we spend millions on street sweepers, envelop fillers etc etc on top of paying out loads in dole.

It should definitely be mandatory

 

[Natasha2605]

Smelly - you don't remember the name of the book about the social work cases by any chance do you?Sounds like something I'd 'enjoy' reading.

I definitely think that ANYONE on benefits that is physically capable of doing some form of voluntary work should be doing it. Hell even if it's sweeping streets, when it comes to interview time better to be able to say they've spent the last six months helping the council rather than having a completely blank space where it can be helped.

Tbh reading that next weeks one is about sexual abuse makes me feel apprehensive about viewing, possibly because I feel this show (rightly so) doesn't hold back on what it tells you. I'll need to record it and watch it during the day.

I take it there's not like a six month update on Marva's story floating about the internet? Just thinking that if her baby was born in April(?) I'd be intrigued to know her situation now.

 

[Hellylou]

Just found this thread - I've been dying to discuss what I've seen so far. I thought Marva's story was so very sad but the outcome was no surprise whatsoever. I thought they were incredibly optimistic thinking that just by being away from Shaun she had some kind of chance at parenting. She was quite clearly very very vulnerable herself - barely able to take care of herself in any way, let alone be responsible for a baby. She'd taken massive overdoses whilst pregnant, as well as the drinking, suffered from depression, and appeared to have some learning difficulties. Did they really think that by leaving Shaun 8 weeks before the due date she'd somehow be ok and ready to take on that kind of responsibility?

She had no chance. And the fact that after the baby was taken from her she didn't make any effort to attend the visits and even see him says everything. She was completely detached. It was clear during the meetings - she wasn't connecting with the real world, or anyone around her. She appeared drugged up, switched off, vacant. I was amazed they thought she had a chance. So sad.

 

[smelly07]

Natasha: i read so many books i honestly can not remember the name, if i do i will PM you x

i want to know how marva and shaun are as well...may google in a minute.

does anyone recognise them from something else........?? im so sure i had seen or read something about them when they lived in tents, i sort of had a deja vu moment when watching it x

 

[feeble]

Just went out for a walk in town and saw someone that I was pregnant with when I had Jasper. Basically it was this guy I knew from my hometown when he was younger, and this girl who just seemed absolutely out of her mind...

Anyway, I used to see them at my antenatal appointments in the waiting room because we had the same midwife and the day I went into labour, my midwife was in a meeting with social services about someone having their baby taken off them at birth...

I knew it was them straight away, just obvious you know.

I still see the guy around and he goes on about how great his life is and how much he loves cars, he told me the baby was getting adopted and it was like he was happy about it you know... Really weird

Anyway, the baby was in foster care for maybe 2 months? 4 months? Something like that and obviously now has been fostered. I saw the mum today so pissed she could barely walk coming out of poundland

I had jasper in a ringsling and I saw her look at him...

It was like there was this Flicker of understanding in her eyes, that this little boy was the same age as her little girl, wherever she was

She looked absolutely heartbroken . It really shook me up.

It's such a shame because although the best thing for the kid, when you take a mothers child away, no matter how crazy or pissed or whatever they are

You are basically signing their death sentence, it was like she had died inside

It's haunting me.

 

[Rhi_Rhi1]

Feeble: do you think we could foster and be social workers...??? would we have time to both to the best of our ability????

we will look into fostering as soon as we get a bigger property as you need a spare bedroom, which at present is our only downfall.

We were told one parent needs to be home full time, to foster care. x

Social work is the end game for me. I'm doing a Ba in History at the moment, and then a masters in social work a social work masters is two years tho! so its a long road yet :/

Sadly nothing that has happened on this show has shocked me so far. not that i am saying its okay, just that it was exactly what i was expecting from the show.

 

[feeble]

Mmm see that works well with home education, but would they allow you to foster and have your own kids out of school?

 

[smelly07]

Feeble: do you think we could foster and be social workers...??? would we have time to both to the best of our ability????

we will look into fostering as soon as we get a bigger property as you need a spare bedroom, which at present is our only downfall.

We were told one parent needs to be home full time, to foster care. x

Social work is the end game for me. I'm doing a Ba in History at the moment, and then a masters in social work a social work masters is two years tho! so its a long road yet :/

Sadly nothing that has happened on this show has shocked me so far. not that i am saying its okay, just that it was exactly what i was expecting from the show.

Yeah i thought so!!! its a 'job' as such....hmmmm so i could study to gain my social work degree whilst fostering but cant actively work if i am fostering???

to be honest if i fostered i would want to give it full attention anyway..... i just need to decide which one i want to do more....?!!?!!? tough one!