Too much folic acid?

[AndiAmsterdam]

Hi all - happy friday!!

Right after I found out I was pregnant, my husband and I scheduled an appointment with our 'huisarts' (Dutch term for GP) to find out about next steps, midwife recommendations/referrals, etc. The appointment wasn't entirely helpful, but at the end he did prescribe me 5mg folic acid tablets, as he had looked at my prenatal and said that 4mcg isn't enough folic acid.

I have been taking the prescription folic acid daily, along with my prenatal, but it has just occurred to me that perhaps this is a bad idea! Is there such a thing as too much folic acid, or will my body excrete the excess? I am hesitant to stop taking either one, especially as I am sure it would be difficult to find a prenatal without folic acid.

Any thoughts?

 

[Khatif]

As far as I know you cannot take too much of it and if you are pregnant 600-700 mg is the minimum intake you need.

My huisarts only recommended me to take double amount of the parental vitamins (Gravitamon) and make an appointment with the midwife (verloskundige)

 

[dan-o]

I've been prescribed 5mg to help lower my chance of miscarrige x

 

[tubs]

I've been prescribed 5mg to help lower my chance of miscarrige x

Me too.

 

[too_scared]

I didn't know 5mg lowers the risk of mc. I've always taken that much because of my age.

 

[Jenny Bean]

A walk in clinic recommended I take 5 mcg due to my age.

But after reading some articles I decided to stick with the prenatal amount for now.

Reading this I hope I haven't made the wrong decision.

The clinic knew nothing about my history and was just recommending this amount because of my age....uggg, now I am afraid I should have been taking more

 

[hollyw79]

your body eliminates any excess. I wouldn't take less if your doctor prescribed it!

I myself actually take an extra supplement on top of the prenatal.. folic acid is SO important!

 

[skyesmom]

actually there can be something as too much folic acid. the capacity of the body to use and excrete it depends in which form it is, folic acid or FOLATE which is NOT the same. folate is the direct usable form our bodies can use directly.

Folic acid needs to be converted and activated by an enzyme in our liver and excess intake can cause too much unconverted folic acid in blood, which is unused and can have side effects. Ie. it can mask a B12 deficiency during pregnancy.
in long term, several studies have shown that an excessive blood level of folic acid (NOT folate) leads to increased rate of colon, intestinal and prostate cancer in the general population (it is been introduced in many foods as a mandatory supplement in USA and Canada in 1998, especially milk and diary, so virtually all milk you buy there is already fortified with the folic acid form).

moreover, some studies indicate that it can also "mask" a miscarriage, meaning prolong a non viable pregnancy to several weeks longer.

the best would be to find supplements that have folate in, rather than folic acid, and introduce a lot of it with food. Seeds, lentils, spinach, broccoli are all abundant with it, i think lentils are the richest actually. Eating folate rich foods TOGETHER with folate containing supplements is the best way to facilitate the absorption of the folate by the intestine. This is because our organisms have evolved in a way to absorb complexes of molecules rather than single isolated compounds through our intestines, as this is what we get from food - a mixture of many complex things, rather than a large large dose of one pure compound only.

folates do help in pregnancy as they're used in the nucleotide synthesis pathway and they're required when the DNA is replicated at a high rate - meaning when there are lots of cells dividing and growing at a high rate. the problem is that folates help ALL sorts of cells to grow - not only babies - and cancers and tumors are nothing else but our normal cells that got out of control in terms of growth, by manipulating the growth control pathways.

unfortunately, one can't decide to which cells the supplies will go to, when taken orally. therefore it is important to check those supplements and see which form is present in there: folate or folic acid, and integrate it with diet as it will help the body to absorb it, process it, use it and eliminate it.

 

[dan-o]

Skyesmom, but in the case of having the mthfr gene mutation, what then? Is it possible to eat 5mg of folate rather than take the pills?

I've been prescribed 5mg by my consultant on a prophylactic basis due to recurrent pregnany loss, genetic defects and a history of preeclampsia (all signs of mthfr)

 

[Leilani]

Skyesmom, but in the case of having the mthfr gene mutation, what then? Is it possible to eat 5mg of folate rather than take the pills?

I've been prescribed 5mg by my consultant on a prophylactic basis due to recurrent pregnany loss, genetic defects and a history of preeclampsia (all signs of mthfr)

That is why a prescribed accurately measured dose is necessary! Sure trying to get it all the natural way is preferable, it is not always practical or measurable, especially when you need more than the standard dose.

Skyesmom, can we get a link to any of those studies about prolonging a non-viable pregnancy for several weeks?

 

[skyesmom]

Skyesmom, but in the case of having the mthfr gene mutation, what then? Is it possible to eat 5mg of folate rather than take the pills?

I've been prescribed 5mg by my consultant on a prophylactic basis due to recurrent pregnany loss, genetic defects and a history of preeclampsia (all signs of mthfr)

in this case, you need a proper dose prescribed, depending on what residual activity of the MTHFR enzyme you have left, this depends on which mutation you have, something doctors can establish and adjust the dosing. it is not a case of a normal standard pregnancy of course and needs special attention as your whole nucleotide metabolism is affected by the reduced activity of the MTHFR enzyme (by the way, i find this the funniest gene acronym ever).

for the studies regarding prolonging of non viable pregnancies, i'll look up and post, my ob/gyn mentioned it when i miscarried for the second time two years ago.

 

[skyesmom]

here's the cancer incidence study in norway article:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19920236

Studies on B12 deficiency linked to miscarriage:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18636794

B12 deficiency and pregnancy in people with MTHFR 677 C/T mutation (one study also claims that no difference was found in folate levels between miscarrying and healthy group):
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23612630
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18636794

Mixed effect of genetic mutations, folate and B12 deficiencies and recurrent pregnancy loss:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11216876

a site on B12 deficiency info
https://b12deficiency.info/

An article on low folic acid levels not making any difference when it comes to miscarriages:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8267814


most of these are hard to read especially when it comes to paying close attention to statistics and controls used in the experiments but what comes through (and what my ob/gyn mentioned as well) is that B12 deficiency is correlated to recurrent miscarriage and miscarriage in general, while folic acid levels are not (my ob specifically mentioned miscarriage not the neural tube defects and malformations).
the main problem with the excess folic acid supplementation is that it can mask a B12 deficiency and this if undiagnosed and untreated can lead to miscarriage (and in this sense, prolong a non viable pregnancy as B12 is essential; some studies suggest that the increased chance of miscarriage with B12 deficiency is linked to homocysteine levels).

hope it is clearer now!

 

[dan-o]

Wow a it seems like a lot of people got cancer.

I'm only supposed to take it for 12 weeks, but obviously that's for each pregnancy, of which I'm on number 5 in the space of a year. I've probably taken the 5mg dose for 8 or 9 months out of 12.

I also took folinic acid 15mg I think, as part of my chemo, after I developed gestational trophoblastic disease, following a partial molar pregnancy.

So I basically have a slightly higher chance of cancer now. (10% instead of 8.4%)
Great. Lol.

 

[minties]

Skyesmom, but in the case of having the mthfr gene mutation, what then? Is it possible to eat 5mg of folate rather than take the pills?

I've been prescribed 5mg by my consultant on a prophylactic basis due to recurrent pregnany loss, genetic defects and a history of preeclampsia (all signs of mthfr)

in this case, you need a proper dose prescribed, depending on what residual activity of the MTHFR enzyme you have left, this depends on which mutation you have, something doctors can establish and adjust the dosing. it is not a case of a normal standard pregnancy of course and needs special attention as your whole nucleotide metabolism is affected by the reduced activity of the MTHFR enzyme (by the way, i find this the funniest gene acronym ever).

for the studies regarding prolonging of non viable pregnancies, i'll look up and post, my ob/gyn mentioned it when i miscarried for the second time two years ago.

I have never looked up what MTHFR stands for, but I bet I'm not the only person who's brain reads it as mother f*cker...

This is very interesting to me as I take folic acid to prevent mouth ulcers.

 

[SleepyBaby]

minties, u just won the internet hahahahahah

I have never looked up what MTHFR stands for, but I bet I'm not the only person who's brain reads it as mother f*cker...

^^ this made LOL so hard hahahahahah

 

[skyesmom]

i always read it as motherf***er as well, that's what i meant when i said it has the funniest name! ))))) it stands for methyltetrahydrofolate reductase, it's an enzyme.

dan-o, regarding increased cancer and such, i think one should take all these statistics with care. you got an enzyme deficiency so i think you don't run the same risk as your body has a lack of available folate due to the genetic condition you have.
also, taking it while pregnant or to treat a condition is different from taking it outside of pregnancy as there's an increased need of it there anyway.

i think people who need to pay attention to which kind of folate supplement they are using are the people with infertility issues who are taking it for years while ttc, at very high dosage. cancer isn't something that develops overnight and it takes a while to get there.

...and as well people with special diets that can potentially lack B12, ie. poorly fed vegans or those allergic to dairy (as way too many vegan people live off carbs mainly and forget to eat all those veggies they are actually allowed to consume).

same goes for people with bad dietary habits, and unfortunately there are way too many of those. you know, tons of over-reused frying oil at mc donalds won't do your intestines a favor in terms of long-term health either, the cancer stats increase for several reasons but i think it is the combination of many factors that can lead up to there.

so keeping an extra eye on the labels on foods and supplements won't harm you, but one should do that with a bit of reason and pondering without recurring to any sorts of extremism and ocding over every single item in the shopping cart.

i think op did well to ask herself if a double dose of folate is maybe too much, as it seemed like her doctor didn't take into account the prenatals she was already taking when prescribing her a supplement.

 

[Feb4th2011]

https://chriskresser.com/folate-vs-folic-acid
This is one article I read about it as well!

 

[babytots]

I always assumed your body would get rid of any excess folic acid. I take it due to my history of recurrent miscarriage and also take a pre-natal supplement as my morning sickness limits me to what I can eat at the moment

I have a history of low b12 though my doctor refused to diagnosis or treat me. I also suffer low iron levels and low folic acid levels.

I know low b12 can cause miscarriage especially if it's pernicious anemia but as my doctor won't diagnose anything related to my b12 there's not a great lot I can do

Will take a proper read of those links later x