Education Maintenance Allowance - Good or Bad?

[cherryglitter]

What are your thoughts?

Whilst I think it's a good idea I don't think it's very fair.
I wasn't entitled to it whilst I was at sixth form, yet I had to buy a £45 a month bus pass whilst my friends had £30 a week to go out and get drunk with.

Not really fair in my opinion. I also had to work part-time after school and on the weekends to make up some money. Do they just assume that if your parents earn then they are going to give you money too?

My Dad and his partner never did.

 

[freckleonear]

Personally I think that rather than EMA being a means-tested allowance, colleges should be able to allocate it like a bursary to students who really do need it for their education. At the moment, many of the students who are eligible for it are wasting it on partying, while some students who really struggle with college costs are not eligible for it.

Also, the lecturers at our local college said that the standard of education at the college went down dramatically when EMA was introduced. Prior to that, students were there because they actually wanted to learn. Once EMA was introduced, they got a lot of students who didn't really want to learn but were just attending to get their money, who caused a lot of disruption. Making it a bursary would improve the situation.

I never got EMA, as while I was doing my A levels I was too young for it and by the time I was old enough I was doing my degree.

 

[Midnight_Fairy]

waste of money lol I never had it and we coped x

 

[PeanutBean]

I don't know much about it but my mum who was a teacher is very sorry to see it scrapped.

 

[Neferet]

When I was in sixth form I was entitled to it. I don't think it's fair to the people who have richer parents though. Just because parents have money, it doesn't mean they're going to give their kids money! Even though I got EMA and I liked it, I think everyone in college/sixth form should be entitled to the same amount.

 

[Blue_bumpkin]

When I was in sixth form I was entitled to it. I don't think it's fair to the people who have richer parents though. Just because parents have money, it doesn't mean they're going to give their kids money! Even though I got EMA and I liked it, I think everyone in college/sixth form should be entitled to the same amount.

But its not the 'childs' money iykwim - its to be used for anything needed be it travel, books, equipment etc. I thought EMA was a great idea. Although granted there are some who would have misused it.

Why wouldnt a parent pay for their childs travel/books etc.. if they had the money and their child didn't? How did they expect you to get what ou needed? Thats a genuine question btw. I received the EMA and it meant whereas my parents couldnt afford certain things for me I could get them myself rather than going without.

Eg. I needed a very expensive calculator for maths in my final year that cost around £60 (second hand) that the school did not provide, understandably so. My EMA paid for this and my travel, lunch etc...

 

[PeanutBean]

Blue I went out with a guy in uni whose parents were pretty loaded and always spending thousands of pounds on snakes! He was the same year as me, the last to get grants, and means testing meant he didn't get any but his parents gave him nothing. Be lived on tins of beans and in the end had to get what was basically a full time job in order to be able to afford to live. Some parents are just like that.

 

[cherryglitter]

I had to buy my own bus passes and some of my school uniform when I was in sixth form. I didn't get EMA. My Dad and his now ex-wife never paid for either.

 

[PeanutBean]

Thought you might be interested in this:
https://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/oct/23/education-maintenance-allowance

Here's an excerpt:

EMAs were basically a means-tested allowance of between £10 and £30, paid to 16- to 19-year-olds who stay on in education and whose household income had to be less than £30,810 per year. Those receiving the maximum £30 payment make up 80% of all recipients and their household income is below £20,817 per year. This sum may seem insignificant – but as a survey carried out by the NUS in 2008 found, 65% of participants on the £30 rate stated that they could not continue to study without EMA.

 

[blahblahblah]

IMO paying teenagers to go to school is just wrong. It should be set up some other way - maybe by just providing the equipment for qualifying (or perhaps even all) students rather than cash. Perhaps they could limit it to encourage people into the subjects that potentially benefit the country in the long run - science, engineering and the like.

I've known a number of students on EMA, and every single one used it as their socialising fund.

 

[rubixcyoob.]

The whole system needs a sorting out imo.
I go to uni and I get eff all. Nothing. No benefits to help. No EMA. Why? All because I can take out a student loan and get into debt.
Should I drop out uni and go to college or do nothing however, I'll get all the money they can thrown at me.

Totally discriminatory in the education system - you get help, up until a certain point. Either everyone gets it, means tested, throughout ALL levels of education - or no one.

I mean, if I went to college I would get EMA to help, yet I am still as equally poor going to uni just now and don't. Where is the logic in that?

 

[PeanutBean]

I'm not sure I wholly agree. There is, on average, a considerably better salary to be had through a degree than through college. I know this isn't so for everyone as I am one of the low earners that are highly educated, but this is nonetheless the principle that the loan system is based on. Whilst I would love to see free education at all levels the reality is that there isn't enough money to do that. I believe that where resources are limited the state funds should be invested in state education, so that's to 18 years old. Primary is extremely underfunded and yet this is our educational grounding.

I think any scheme that can support those who struggle to be able to stay in state education is a good thing. I also think there should be better provision for adult learners doing a levels or NVQs etc who dropped out at an early age. Also there should be better support to enable older people, with families, to be able to pursue higher education albeit on a loan of graduate tax basis. And I'd like to see better measures to improve accessibility of HE to those from less advantaged backgrounds. I am disgusted at the proposals put forward by Browne for unlimited HE fees; I'm more supportive of a graduate tax but need more details to be sure.

When it comes down to it though state funding should be there to support the masses in basic education first.

 

[Natasha2605]

I recieved it because of my parent's income but I used it for trips to the cinema etc. I don't think you should get paid to go to school. Most of the people who I knew had it admitted they were only there for the money. xx

 

[lesleyann]

without ema i couldnt not go to college, i would be down on household money to pay for busfair to try and better myself but however would at the same time be putting my family in a worse place by havign less money.. Im doing my health and social care course to get onto midwifery/childrens nursing but if ema stops i wont be able to do it..

Is ema being stopped then?

 

[PeanutBean]

Lesleyann the new government has announced plans to stop it. They've made some wishy washy statements about doing something else but as with all their 'policies' it's hot air at the moment.

 

[lesleyann]

ahh ok then hopfully alg will stay since im able to get that soon

 

[TattiesMum]

The whole system needs a sorting out imo.
I go to uni and I get eff all. Nothing. No benefits to help. No EMA. Why? All because I can take out a student loan and get into debt.
Should I drop out uni and go to college or do nothing however, I'll get all the money they can thrown at me.

Totally discriminatory in the education system - you get help, up until a certain point. Either everyone gets it, means tested, throughout ALL levels of education - or no one.

I mean, if I went to college I would get EMA to help, yet I am still as equally poor going to uni just now and don't. Where is the logic in that?

I know it seems loopy, but there IS a reason for it ....

Back in my day (yeah sorry ... the old crone is off again ) no-one got money for Further Education (ie 6th form/6th form college - the 16 to 18 age bracket) ...... BUT anyone of between 16 and 18 who wasn't in full time education or full time employment got The Dole (no such thing as Jobseekers Allowance back in the stone ages ) - that wasn't actually that many people though because apprenticeships were widely available

At the same time Uni students got their tuition fees paid in full AND a Grant for their living costs AND Housing Benefit towards their rent .... BUT only the top 10% of all students went on to Uni so it was sustainable

Then came the last Tory Gov't ....

Unemployment went through the roof ..... apprenticeships vanished .... loads of 16-18 year olds suddenly swelled the unemployment figures even more ...

Solution? Stop the dole for 16 - 18 year olds, thus removing them in one fell swoop from the unemployment figures.

That worked to tweak the figures, but it created a whole problem with huge quantitiies of young people with no further education, no apprenticeships, no jobs and no future The Tories fannied about a bit with Gov't backed trainee schemes over a number of years but they were just a joke ......and then Labour took over ...

Their solution was to encourage as many of the disenfranchised 16-18 year olds into education, and to keep them there for as long as possible so that they were both occupied and not re-included in unemployment figures (which would have caused a huge jump and looked bad - even though these people were technically unemployed anyway iyswim)

I won't even get started on why encouraging an entire nation into cerebral education rather than encouraging manual/blue collar skills is a bad idea in general ... but in terms of finances this policy meant that SO many people were going to university that to provide them all with a full grant was just impossible - so Student Loans were brought in (and later - in England - no free Tuition Fees as well) and grants were phased out .... the savings were then used to 'bribe' school leavers (16 to 18 is the most vulnerable point for leaving education in search of a bit of money and independance) into staying in further education - hence EMA.

You're right - the whole system is screwed up .... but it's the result of over 20 years of change, some of which - like apprenticeships and old ways of starting work alongside your Dad/Mum at 16 - have gone forever

 

[PeanutBean]

But EMA surely was also available for people doing NVQs as well as A-levels? I agree with keeping people in education to 18 (broadly and not for the purposes of massaging unemployment figures!) but there has to be diversity at that level, both academic and vocational qualifications and training. Labour did bring apprenticeships back. Gosh, I wish I could remember the name of the scheme...I'm sure the Tories are ditching it, or messing with it... Need my Mum here, she knows all the education related schemes...

 

[TattiesMum]

But EMA surely was also available for people doing NVQs as well as A-levels? I agree with keeping people in education to 18 (broadly and not for the purposes of massaging unemployment figures!) but there has to be diversity at that level, both academic and vocational qualifications and training. Labour did bring apprenticeships back. Gosh, I wish I could remember the name of the scheme...I'm sure the Tories are ditching it, or messing with it... Need my Mum here, she knows all the education related schemes...

Yes PB - EMA is available to NVQ students as well as A Level Students and was put in place for those, more vocational, courses in an attempt to redress the damage done by the disappearance of apprentices. The problem is, of course, that while vocational courses are useful - they really don't prepare someone for the realities of working life in the same way as a mixture of 'on the job training' and day release used to

Labour's apprenticeship scheme was called Modern Day Apprenticeships - but it never really took off to be honest It ended up just being another YTS type thing

Back in the Mid to late 80's I was working in Higher Education and saw at first hand the damage that the Tories did to the system with the '89 Education White Paper .... the whole thing has been a complete mess ever since ..... God I feel old today!!

 

[PeanutBean]

Yes that's the one! I suppose it's generally difficult to undo the great mess that previous governments leave behind. Doesn't fill me with confidence for life after this government! but with luck they're ridiculous 'policies' are so half baked they will mostly not come to fruition!

My mum is in her 60s and was training to be a teacher in the 80s. She started work when I was 8 so that'll be....1988 I think. I've grown up hearing about and living with how bad the Tories were. It seems amazing how few people seem to grasp the damage that was done then and the effects that we still feel today not just in education but across the state board. But then even my husband who's only 3 years younger than me seems to have grown up in a different era, even though his mum was a single mum in a council house who worked and studied her way up in the world. So how can we expect 20 year olds to have a clue about what a Tory government means?