Illegal drugs - worse than legal ones?

[PeanutBean]

The problem with Nutt was that he compromised his position on the panel in the way he spoke out. I imagine he will have been employed on simlar terms to civil servants, who even in initial job applications have to sign away their political opinions. Just one if those things. It wasn't considered that he was being impartial on policy. Advisors are there to advise, rightly or wrongly politicians can choose how they wish to act on that advice. I'd like to see the government crack down on overfishing at the expense of those fishing communities as the science demands however they don't and won't because of short term economics and historical community basis. I'm also not sure it's fair to say that politicians make a decision because of popularity. As our representatives their duty is to put policy in place that reflects the majority. If that is technically incorrect then the task is to educate the populus so they can consider their standpoint then ask again.

 

[Dopeyjopey]

The problem with Nutt was that he compromised his position on the panel in the way he spoke out. I imagine he will have been employed on simlar terms to civil servants, who even in initial job applications have to sign away their political opinions. Just one if those things. It wasn't considered that he was being impartial on policy. Advisors are there to advise, rightly or wrongly politicians can choose how they wish to act on that advice. I'd like to see the government crack down on overfishing at the expense of those fishing communities as the science demands however they don't and won't because of short term economics and historical community basis. I'm also not sure it's fair to say that politicians make a decision because of popularity. As our representatives their duty is to put policy in place that reflects the majority. If that is technically incorrect then the task is to educate the populus so they can consider their standpoint then ask again.

Do you think it's coincidence that after David Nutt effectively made people think twice about the dangers, the media started demonising 'legal highs' by giving incorrect information? To me (my view is quite extreme because of my political views) it seems that is an easier way to get people back 'on side' than reassessing laws because people start to question them. My ex was heavily researching cathinones (sp) at the time of the mephedrone hype and he was getting completely different results to what the newspapers were saying - i can't help but think it was to make people forget about david nutt's opinions!

 

[blahblahblah]

I agree that some legal drugs are more harmful than some illegal ones. I would be happier making more illegal than the other way around though.

The problem with the comparisons between the legal and illegal items is how widely they are used and people often combining things - e.g. alcohol and cocaine is a common combo (I'm told!) - how do you know what caused the problem?

The law is something that isn't perfect, so I see no problem with questioning it. However, the whole point of having it is to make our society better, and I can see no justification for knowingly breaking it, even if you feel it is wrong. It may go against the grain of this debate, and maybe it is old-fashioned, but knowing that someone takes drugs does make me think worse of them.

Nowadays it seems socially acceptable to freely admit to using/abusing both legal and illegal drugs. IMHO losing social expectations like these is one of the biggest factors in our society being in the state that it is currently in.

 

[PeanutBean]

Dopey there was a pretty long time gap between the two news events so I don't think the reporting of one was particularly consequential of the other. The fact is that the media needs a kick up the backside for the inaccuracies and scaremongering in their reporting. Under the labour government almost all press went against them so I certainly would not consider much press manipulation by them if that's what you mean. It's much more likely that the conservative press was just doing it's usual conservative thing.

 

[Dopeyjopey]

I agree that some legal drugs are more harmful than some illegal ones. I would be happier making more illegal than the other way around though.

The problem with the comparisons between the legal and illegal items is how widely they are used and people often combining things - e.g. alcohol and cocaine is a common combo (I'm told!) - how do you know what caused the problem?

The law is something that isn't perfect, so I see no problem with questioning it. However, the whole point of having it is to make our society better, and I can see no justification for knowingly breaking it, even if you feel it is wrong. It may go against the grain of this debate, and maybe it is old-fashioned, but knowing that someone takes drugs does make me think worse of them.

Nowadays it seems socially acceptable to freely admit to using/abusing both legal and illegal drugs. IMHO losing social expectations like these is one of the biggest factors in our society being in the state that it is currently in.

The reason i am open about it is because i believe if people are going to take drugs they will regardless of legality. I don't agree it should be taboo because uninformed people can make silly choices, whereas if people have the facts they can make a safer choice.

Unfortunately drilling it in to your kids to 'just say no' doesn't work - i am evidence of that! I am hoping being open with my son will mean if he chooses to take drugs I can advise him on the safer option. Of course i'd prefer if he doesn't touch them, but if he does, i would feel better him taking MDMA than cocaine.

 

[Dopeyjopey]

Dopey there was a pretty long time gap between the two news events so I don't think the reporting of one was particularly consequential of the other. The fact is that the media needs a kick up the backside for the inaccuracies and scaremongering in their reporting. Under the labour government almost all press went against them so I certainly would not consider much press manipulation by them if that's what you mean. It's much more likely that the conservative press was just doing it's usual conservative thing.

It was within 3 months I think, although that is just from memory. Maybe it was to try and discredit labour's policies further then. I still think they may have been connected.

The media does need a kick up the arse - when the 4MMC stories hit, the sellers doubled their number of customers. It's stupid!

 

[PeanutBean]

Three months is a long time in media terms! I think more likely a dig at Labour - why are you protecting our fragile vulnerable children from these evil fatal chemicals?

 

[Dopeyjopey]

And all the while kids were reading thinking 'woah... this stuff sounds good and i can get it for 10 quid on the internet. I'm off to google plant food!'

 

[xbabybumpx]

I agree that some legal drugs are more harmful than some illegal ones. I would be happier making more illegal than the other way around though.

The problem with the comparisons between the legal and illegal items is how widely they are used and people often combining things - e.g. alcohol and cocaine is a common combo (I'm told!) - how do you know what caused the problem?

The law is something that isn't perfect, so I see no problem with questioning it. However, the whole point of having it is to make our society better, and I can see no justification for knowingly breaking it, even if you feel it is wrong. It may go against the grain of this debate, and maybe it is old-fashioned, but knowing that someone takes drugs does make me think worse of them.

Nowadays it seems socially acceptable to freely admit to using/abusing both legal and illegal drugs. IMHO losing social expectations like these is one of the biggest factors in our society being in the state that it is currently in.

The reason i am open about it is because i believe if people are going to take drugs they will regardless of legality. I don't agree it should be taboo because uninformed people can make silly choices, whereas if people have the facts they can make a safer choice.

Unfortunately drilling it in to your kids to 'just say no' doesn't work - i am evidence of that! I am hoping being open with my son will mean if he chooses to take drugs I can advise him on the safer option. Of course i'd prefer if he doesn't touch them, but if he does, i would feel better him taking MDMA than cocaine.

whats mdma? x

 

[Eve]

Esctasy or however you spell it, lol... which is one I don't like... It can be very dangerous!

 

[Eve]

I have never done it, only thing I did do while younger was pot... everything else scared the daylights out of me, even as a stupid, know it all teen lol. People do not know what they are taking in pill form, and you can overdose/dehydrate etc.. very easily I guess. I don't have much knowledge on it, that is pretty much all I know. It scares me...

 

[Dopeyjopey]

Esctasy or however you spell it, lol... which is one I don't like... It can be very dangerous!

Pure MDMA is not as dangerous as you would think. Far less dangerous than alcohol, tobacco, cocaine, ketamine etc. It's when it is in pill form and mixed with other things it becomes dangerous, or when you use it irresponsibly through lack of understanding. Poor Leah Betts proved that

 

[Dopeyjopey]

I have never done it, only thing I did do while younger was pot... everything else scared the daylights out of me, even as a stupid, know it all teen lol. People do not know what they are taking in pill form, and you can overdose/dehydrate etc.. very easily I guess. I don't have much knowledge on it, that is pretty much all I know. It scares me...

I'm not picking your post apart here but i think it is important to explain the following:

MDMA can affect your body being able to regulate temperature. For this reason if you are in a nightclub it is important to keep hydrated. However, like in the case of Leah Betts, if you drink too much water it can kill you.

 

[xbabybumpx]

just an intruiging question....where do you/have bought these drugs from? drug dealers?

 

[Dopeyjopey]

I've never bought them!

 

[xbabybumpx]

you said you used to smoke pot so you must of got it from somewhere lol

 

[Dopeyjopey]

Doesn't mean *I* paid for it a lot of my friends in the past did however, and if they offered, i was not the kind of person to say no! Then i had partners that smoked.

 

[xbabybumpx]

all im trying to get at is. if you buy drugs off a drug dealer,you cant be 100% whats in it. its the same with snidey cigs,they put all sorts of crap in there but they are still 'cigarettes' dykwim?

 

[Dopeyjopey]

all im trying to get at is. if you buy drugs off a drug dealer,you cant be 100% whats in it. its the same with snidey cigs,they put all sorts of crap in there but they are still 'cigarettes' dykwim?

I get you. I know a fair bit about drugs due to my ex's job. I know the different shaped crystals in powders, i know when weed has been dipped or sprayed and he could test pills. It was my introduction to chemistry and was very interesting. And although i don't need the knowledge for myself, if someone asked me to check the quality of their coke i could give them a good idea of how many different substances were in it!

I'll also add that it isn't just restricted chemicals i learnt about!

 

[BlackBerry25]

I think most people I know buy from someone they know or grow their own little plant. Usually cut our own, etc, so we can tell if something is in it.

I think if a good chunk of the population want it legal, it should be. We are working, tax paying citizens like anyone else.