Leaving your baby!!! (kind of a rant)

[MommyJogger]

Very true which does link us in nicely to most people first thoughts that it's not very nice to be so judgmental and angry about is as OP seems.

Meh. I've gotten in the habit of treating others' emotions like I treat my toddler's. It's okay to feel certain ways about things. People have the human right to feel what they feel. It's about what you do with the emotions. I think a semi-anonymous internet rant looking for like minds is about right for the situation. It's not like she's been on the phone with CPS or insulting them to mutual acquaintances. I don't see anything wrong with being judgmental. We all judge and are judged.

ETA: catty-- I dunno, I still just don't get that vibe. I've been angry on behalf of others I view as helpless to their situation (the baby in this scenario) without it being a reflection of personal negative feelings I was working through, so maybe I'm the one projecting onto OP here?

 

[sue_88]

I do agree we can feel that way, sure, but a judgemental internet rant stating 'I wouldn't do this, the baby isn't even hard' and unfriend, as opposed to a friendly face at their door is what I oppose to.

 

[Kate&Lucas]

But what can't they both be feeling it's too much?

What if they both are absolutely shit scared of bring alone with a newborn and therefore they both go out together and leave the baby with friends?

What if they think that it's so hard they're not sure what they've got themselves into?

There's too many questions to point blank say that the baby is spending too much time away from their parents, and if they're both struggling then it's fantastic they've got the support and honestly they've got a long time to form a loving bond with their parents....for now it could all be about survival.

They can both be feeling it, but that's why I say it's different than if they were going out separately.
If they're having so much anxiety about being alone with the newborn, there's no reason they can't invite family over while one or the other goes out to help build that confidence. Beyond that, if they're having so much anxiety about caring for their own child that they'd rather leave the child with friends, that's something that they need to seek help for. This is also where "helpers" caring for the parents so the parents can learn to care for a newborn comes into play. There's simply no logical reason for the "help" to consistently be taking the child rather than taking on other household responsibilities when both parents seem to be available for involvement (rather than the father being back to work long hours or deployed, for example).
Even if they're struggling, this is quite simply a poor way to cope. I'm not saying they're bad parents if they can't figure out a better way to cope. She asked if we thought it was wrong. You can do things "wrong" and still love your child. But, yes, I think what they're doing, even if it's a coping mechanism, is objectionable in light of the fact that they seem to each be available to share the load and instead choose to "unload", as it were, on others instead of taking the time (when it sounds like they may each be on parental leave) to learn how to cope more sustainably and be there more for their newborn.

Perhaps they don't know how/where to seek help? Perhaps they're too scared to? If they DO have anxiety, as an example, it's something that is very difficult to seek help for on a personal level.
Or.. perhaps they're happy with their arrangement. It could be that for them (as it was for me), spending time apart from their child is helping them so far. Why change it if it's working? It doesn't mean that they'll still be taking so much time out in months/years to come, they might just need this time to ease themselves back into it.

 

[Larkspur]

I don't even think it's about whether it's "nice" for the OP to feel angry and judgmental, it's about whether it's useful to anyone, including the OP.

By her own words she's very worked up that her friends seem to be maintaining quite a lot of the freedom of their pre-baby life after having a baby, for whatever reason.

Unless the baby is being genuinely neglected ie palmed off on strangers or left at home by itself or the people doing the babysitting are resentful about doing it, it seems like a totally pointless thing to get "very very angry" over.

 

[MommyJogger]

Perhaps they don't know how/where to seek help? Perhaps they're too scared to? If they DO have anxiety, as an example, it's something that is very difficult to seek help for on a personal level.
Or.. perhaps they're happy with their arrangement. It could be that for them (as it was for me), spending time apart from their child is helping them so far. Why change it if it's working? It doesn't mean that they'll still be taking so much time out in months/years to come, they might just need this time to ease themselves back into it.

Because you have to ask *who* it's working for and what "working" means. Just because it satisfies a parent's need for immediate gratification doesn't mean that it's what's best for the baby or the family unit. Sometimes it is, certainly, but it would be a very odd case for it to actually be necessary for both of them to so frequently need it at the same time.

 

[MommyJogger]

I don't even think it's about whether it's "nice" for the OP to feel angry and judgmental, it's about whether it's useful to anyone, including the OP.

By her own words she's very worked up that her friends seem to be maintaining quite a lot of the freedom of their pre-baby life after having a baby, for whatever reason.

Unless the baby is being genuinely neglected ie palmed off on strangers or left at home by itself or the people doing the babysitting are resentful about doing it, it seems like a totally pointless thing to get "very very angry" over.

I don't really get your idea that she's worked up about the freedom. It really sounds to me more like she's worked up about their lack of taking responsibility for the care of their child, which to me is two different things because I doubt she'd be making the same rant if they were still going pre-baby things with the child strapped to them or taking turns with each other going out and doing pre-baby things. And there's not much she can do about it but feel angry and rant because it's not illegal.
I can't help but feel angry and want to rant about sleep trainers. There's not much else I can do, because it's not illegal to sleep train. Just because the anger isn't useful doesn't mean someone can just stop feeling it.

 

[wtbmummy]

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I have found some people do exaggerate though. A girl I went to school with leaves her child very often but really it's maybe only once a week but it *looks* on Facebook that she is always out having fun, having drinks in the day etc. But actually it is maybe one or twice a fortnight which for me is alot but she had her child young and maybe struggles more. How do you actually know how often someone is out unless they tell you every single time?

I think on internet forums, you kinda just have to go with the information the OP presents. Besides people posting every meal they eat and every bowel movement they make on facebook, depending on the size of the town, it's hard to miss seeing some people every day sometimes. Not to mention, if the people the couple are leaving the child with are having some of the same feelings as the OP, it might be a point of discussion among the social circle. I know when the couple I mentioned were leaving their child a lot, we had discussions with each other just because we were trying to figure out exactly how much childcare as a group we were providing because for a while, each of us thought we were the only ones and didn't realize we were part of a network of people they were cycling their LOs through.

But we DO know everytime they leave their baby. As I said my husband is his work partner. They work closly together 60+ hours a week so my husband gets told of every trip to the shop, every meal, cinema. My husband has even said to him "you only get to see her two days a week, how can you leave her overnight" To which he replied "well its good for her to see other faces" (working 60+hours they dont get to see the babies during the week)
My husband and I have been talking about it and we have realized it will be best to distsnce ourselves as we personally dont like there lifestyle choices (not just about the baby)


I also want to point out I never stopped talking to her but when we fell pregnant she stopped speaking to us as she didnt like that we were pregnant and she was not. Despite me trying numerous times to see her. I know of everything due to our husbands being together daily and it has been very hard for my husband since she stopped talking to me having to try and keep the peace at work as such.

Thank you for all your replies but I think I have read enough now. Clearly my husband and I are the ones in the wrong and it's ok to leave your baby and have others raise your child (we know this will continue as have known them many years)

Please can this thread now be closed as it is no longer helpful.

 

[Kate&Lucas]

Perhaps they don't know how/where to seek help? Perhaps they're too scared to? If they DO have anxiety, as an example, it's something that is very difficult to seek help for on a personal level.
Or.. perhaps they're happy with their arrangement. It could be that for them (as it was for me), spending time apart from their child is helping them so far. Why change it if it's working? It doesn't mean that they'll still be taking so much time out in months/years to come, they might just need this time to ease themselves back into it.

Because you have to ask *who* it's working for and what "working" means. Just because it satisfies a parent's need for immediate gratification doesn't mean that it's what's best for the baby or the family unit. Sometimes it is, certainly, but it would be a very odd case for it to actually be necessary for both of them to so frequently need it at the same time.

Solely based on the theory that they could be suffering from an anxiety/PND, taking time out could be helping in the short term to deal with those issues. That they're together doesn't strike me as a bad thing, I think too many new parents spend so much time apart, which can cause problems on it's own.

Obviously it's just one idea of what might be going on. But considering my own experience I couldn't bring myself to think badly about these parents given the info. So much goes on in others' lives which doesn't get talked about, it's easy to sit outside and say what they should be doing.

 

[MommyJogger]

I do agree we can feel that way, sure, but a judgemental internet rant stating 'I wouldn't do this, the baby isn't even hard' and unfriend, as opposed to a friendly face at their door is what I oppose to.

I dunno, I hate to feel like I'm defending OP to the death here, but I feel like we've all been in a situation where we've drifted apart from friends who ended up parenting very differently, especially when we find their methods emotionally taxing.
A friendly face at the door would be ideal in most situations and is something I think we all should strive to do more of, but it's hard to do when it looks like the people you'd be trying to help are perfectly happy with the way they do things.
I've definitely made a fool out of myself irl with a couple people I've too-pushily offered to help maintain breastfeeding when they said it was something they really, really wanted to do and it ended up they were actually very ready to switch to formula and just didn't want to air that fact. It's super awkward.

 

[MommyJogger]

Solely based on the theory that they could be suffering from an anxiety/PND, taking time out could be helping in the short term to deal with those issues. That they're together doesn't strike me as a bad thing, I think too many new parents spend so much time apart, which can cause problems on it's own.

Obviously it's just one idea of what might be going on. But considering my own experience I couldn't bring myself to think badly about these parents given the info. So much goes on in others' lives which doesn't get talked about, it's easy to sit outside and say what they should be doing.

I see what you're saying. Thank you for sharing your insight, PND is definitely foreign territory to me and I struggle to put myself in those shoes to see that POV.

 

[Blue_bumpkin]

The OP is entitled to her opinion. I think some previous replies were a little bit harsh for my liking, all the op done was ask everyone else's opinion on it and instead seems to be being judged for judging someone else (from what I can see). It's a little bit pot calling the kettle.

Anyway in my opinion it does seem a little excessive but I was at the opposite end of the scale with mine and could not be away due to anxiety issues which likewise is not healthy. I think most people just have to find a balance that suits them and this will not be the same for everyone and will take a little time to strike right. Can be hard to find your feet with a newborn. I remember thinking on my first shopping trip with Adam 'OMG HOW DO I CARRY A BABY AND MY SHOPPING?' And I near had a meltdown when he first cried in asda lol they may not plan on regularly being away from lo this much long term xx

 

[Pearls18]

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I have found some people do exaggerate though. A girl I went to school with leaves her child very often but really it's maybe only once a week but it *looks* on Facebook that she is always out having fun, having drinks in the day etc. But actually it is maybe one or twice a fortnight which for me is alot but she had her child young and maybe struggles more. How do you actually know how often someone is out unless they tell you every single time?

I think on internet forums, you kinda just have to go with the information the OP presents. Besides people posting every meal they eat and every bowel movement they make on facebook, depending on the size of the town, it's hard to miss seeing some people every day sometimes. Not to mention, if the people the couple are leaving the child with are having some of the same feelings as the OP, it might be a point of discussion among the social circle. I know when the couple I mentioned were leaving their child a lot, we had discussions with each other just because we were trying to figure out exactly how much childcare as a group we were providing because for a while, each of us thought we were the only ones and didn't realize we were part of a network of people they were cycling their LOs through.

But we DO know everytime they leave their baby. As I said my husband is his work partner. They work closly together 60+ hours a week so my husband gets told of every trip to the shop, every meal, cinema. My husband has even said to him "you only get to see her two days a week, how can you leave her overnight" To which he replied "well its good for her to see other faces" (working 60+hours they dont get to see the babies during the week)
My husband and I have been talking about it and we have realized it will be best to distsnce ourselves as we personally dont like there lifestyle choices (not just about the baby)


I also want to point out I never stopped talking to her but when we fell pregnant she stopped speaking to us as she didnt like that we were pregnant and she was not. Despite me trying numerous times to see her. I know of everything due to our husbands being together daily and it has been very hard for my husband since she stopped talking to me having to try and keep the peace at work as such.

Thank you for all your replies but I think I have read enough now. Clearly my husband and I are the ones in the wrong and it's ok to leave your baby and have others raise your child (we know this will continue as have known them many years)

Please can this thread now be closed as it is no longer helpful.

Was it ever?!

 

[nic18]

I leave my son once a week with my mum, so me & OH can actually have one night to ourselves and actually feel like a couple I'm also worried I kept him with us all the time the one time we actually needed him to be looked after he wouldn't want to go.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion & their own ways of bringing their child up

 

[Larkspur]

I don't even think it's about whether it's "nice" for the OP to feel angry and judgmental, it's about whether it's useful to anyone, including the OP.

By her own words she's very worked up that her friends seem to be maintaining quite a lot of the freedom of their pre-baby life after having a baby, for whatever reason.

Unless the baby is being genuinely neglected ie palmed off on strangers or left at home by itself or the people doing the babysitting are resentful about doing it, it seems like a totally pointless thing to get "very very angry" over.

I don't really get your idea that she's worked up about the freedom. It really sounds to me more like she's worked up about their lack of taking responsibility for the care of their child, which to me is two different things because I doubt she'd be making the same rant if they were still going pre-baby things with the child strapped to them or taking turns with each other going out and doing pre-baby things. And there's not much she can do about it but feel angry and rant because it's not illegal.
I can't help but feel angry and want to rant about sleep trainers. There's not much else I can do, because it's not illegal to sleep train. Just because the anger isn't useful doesn't mean someone can just stop feeling it.

But they are taking responsibility for the care of the child. If they're not doing it themselves, they're leaving her with a willing helper, presumably grandparents. It's not neglectful or cruel, it's a bit unusual, yes, but it's hardly irresponsible.

And I disagree about whether you can stop yourself getting angry. If you take the mindset that people who sleep train are deliberately being ignorant or cruel, yes, I can see how you might feel angry. If you try to understand it from the perspective that they're trying to genuinely do their best for their family, then you can feel concerned, and keen to give them tools to help if they want it, which has the added benefit of potentially being useful. I'm not sure I have seen anything much that was useful being offered in a conversation driven by anger.

 

[Andypanda6570]

\

I have found some people do exaggerate though. A girl I went to school with leaves her child very often but really it's maybe only once a week but it *looks* on Facebook that she is always out having fun, having drinks in the day etc. But actually it is maybe one or twice a fortnight which for me is alot but she had her child young and maybe struggles more. How do you actually know how often someone is out unless they tell you every single time?

I think on internet forums, you kinda just have to go with the information the OP presents. Besides people posting every meal they eat and every bowel movement they make on facebook, depending on the size of the town, it's hard to miss seeing some people every day sometimes. Not to mention, if the people the couple are leaving the child with are having some of the same feelings as the OP, it might be a point of discussion among the social circle. I know when the couple I mentioned were leaving their child a lot, we had discussions with each other just because we were trying to figure out exactly how much childcare as a group we were providing because for a while, each of us thought we were the only ones and didn't realize we were part of a network of people they were cycling their LOs through.

But we DO know everytime they leave their baby. As I said my husband is his work partner. They work closly together 60+ hours a week so my husband gets told of every trip to the shop, every meal, cinema. My husband has even said to him "you only get to see her two days a week, how can you leave her overnight" To which he replied "well its good for her to see other faces" (working 60+hours they dont get to see the babies during the week)
My husband and I have been talking about it and we have realized it will be best to distsnce ourselves as we personally dont like there lifestyle choices (not just about the baby)


I also want to point out I never stopped talking to her but when we fell pregnant she stopped speaking to us as she didnt like that we were pregnant and she was not. Despite me trying numerous times to see her. I know of everything due to our husbands being together daily and it has been very hard for my husband since she stopped talking to me having to try and keep the peace at work as such.

Thank you for all your replies but I think I have read enough now. Clearly my husband and I are the ones in the wrong and it's ok to leave your baby and have others raise your child (we know this will continue as have known them many years)

Please can this thread now be closed as it is no longer helpful.

Was it ever?!

I'm sorry..I almost spit my coffee out...

 

[NoodleSnack]

I'd like to interject with the observation that everyone here seems to be focusing on the original post as though it's a criticism of the mother leaving her baby with people for periods of time, when that's not really what it's getting at (at least from my POV). It's about both parents, at the same time, deciding to go out and leave the baby with people for periods of time. Honestly, these two are distinct to me. If the mother needs to get out to feel human, she could always have left the baby with the father. If the father needs to get out to feel human, he could always have left the baby with the mother. If they need one night a week to heal a relationship that they feel is suffering from lack of attention, that's one thing. But really read what she wrote. Both parents, overnights each week, and then days out multiple other days of the week where they're both away from baby, and then weekends without the baby. That really does seem like it would be objectively excessive for BOTH parents to need to be away at the same time at such a young age.
It's not about whether the parents are there for the "good" and the "bad", it's about whether the baby has a parent there during the baby's "good" and "bad". You can't assign times for bonding. Bonding just happens when it happens, but you have to be there for it. I would never object to a baby being taken care of by another loving adult caregiver, but at such an early age (especially by any tribal community standards because that was brought up in a previous post), when the baby can see, what, a few inches from its nose, there's no reason the parents need to leave for hours at a time to achieve that and "the village" effect takes place at an older age than 24 hours, when the village would instead be focusing on taking care of the mother's needs so that she can competently and happily care for the baby.

1. She focused a lot on the mother and specifically said "sign up for as a mother."

2. For us, "the village" is there from day one. The whole family has a stake in the baby, they're not just there to "take care of the mother's needs". The baby is their family too, just as they are the baby's family with or without the parent/s.

 

[OnyxSnowfall]

Fact is : many people are not cut out to be parents.

Look at the state of the World and how well people have been raised (tho' many might argue that only so much was in their control in the first place hah).

OP's friend perhaps just isn't cut out for the baby stage --- maybe she'll be a better parent as her child ages. It is a blessing she has support though

 

[kerrie24]

I think that is excessive for such a young baby too and I dont care if thats judgemental.
If it was a topic like CIO,sitting baby in the front seat of a car,leaving them in the car while you buy petrol,having a cigarette while you push their pram etc etc then each of us would also have an opinion on that,doesn't mean nobody does it or should do it. If any person claims to never judge anyone (by appearance, dress sense,lifestyle choices,parenting skills,bad habits) then Im sorry but I simply can not believe them.
Give the Op a break!

 

[BabyMamma93]

alot of people here disagreeing with what your saying, but tbh... i agree!!
i always have this argument with my auntie..
My lb is almost 5 months old, and my mum is begging me to let him stay out, but i havent, and i wont. she keeps saying 'you must want a night off, to go out' well no actually i dont want a 'night off' i didnt have a baby so that i can have a 'night off' and palm him off to you, i had a baby as a choice.
i may also get alot of stick for this post but this is MY view and opinion i havent, and dont plan on going out any time soon, i plan on devoting all my time (apart from when im at work) on my family, not on drinking at weddings etc. and if people dont like that well then they can find another cute little baby to get broody over... he aint a puppy u can just maul while hes cute and cuddly..

so yes, i agree with you.. although i do think its a matter of opinions and im not getting at noone for your choices...

 

[Leesy]

I agree it's excessive. I wouldn't have had the energy to go out that much when my lo was just home from hospital anyway.