Make Bradford British.... Ch4 1st March 9pm

[tina3747]

I agree with Nic.
I know people who really are not racisit, but they always refer to the corner shop as the P Shop. Which is highly ironic as it's run by an Indian couple!! I've heard people use the P word to describe anyone Asian, I hate it and I tend to say something if it's someone I know well enough but I dont always think it's used to be derogatory.
Same as round here calling people of mixed race "half-caste" It happens purley out of ill education rather than tying to be racist. That particular term makes me cringe, I hate it x

What you said!!!

The shops where I grew up, we all called them p shops... I suppose it was that era when anything was acceptable. My mum still calls it the p shop, try telling my mum it's no longer acceptable when 'P*ki John' , the owner of the shop calls himself a p*ki!!! She says he likes it....!

Also my white friend with a mixed race son calls him half caste, he calls himself half caste..... It's hard saying to someone in that situation it's not acceptable to use those terms anymore! Criiiiiinge!

 

[Nibblenic]

I think something was said last night by the older white woman, "you can just wander up to a Muslim as ask what their religion is about" I think thats true, that all the political correctness has stunted our conversations as we are too afraid to offend that we dont even ask.

Ill be the first to tell you know know next to nothing about any religion that isnt Christianity, I dont know their celebrations or the meaning behind them. Anything from Jewish, to Muslim to sheik. I am vaugley aware of some celebrations but could easy mix them up with a different religion.
I am not proud of this ignorance, at all. I always have a hunger for more knowledge but living where I do, where the non-white community is less than 1% of the population, even when I do learn things, I forget because it doesnt apply to my life or my surroundings. But when it does, I dont know if education would create understanding?

 

[FlowerFairy]

I liked her "dickhead " comment. But why is she on this programme?? Ilkley has never been part of Bradford it has a Leeds postcode.
There are rich affluent areas under the BD postcode like Skipton where I am originally from so why pick a women from leeds?

We have friends in who live nr skipton, Thornton in craven to be precise... Love it there! It's like living in the heart beat set!!!

Posh up in Thornton in Craven it is lovely up there! x

 

[tina3747]

I liked her "dickhead " comment. But why is she on this programme?? Ilkley has never been part of Bradford it has a Leeds postcode.
There are rich affluent areas under the BD postcode like Skipton where I am originally from so why pick a women from leeds?

We have friends in who live nr skipton, Thornton in craven to be precise... Love it there! It's like living in the heart beat set!!!

Posh up in Thornton in Craven it is lovely up there! x

They're loaded... Not posh

 

[smelly07]

I really enjoyed watching that and i think they are all a great bunch of people in that house LOL........ it made me wonder how different my life would have been if i had been born there, being mixed race (half-caste.....i still refer to myself that way...why is it bad?) i wonder how i would have fit in, in bradford.
i think how i was treated would be based on the colour of my skin?.....although i really dont feel asian at all and even have.... 'i am brown moments'....LOL......(as in thats how people see me... not that its wrong but they see my colour and judge me on that and i dont get excepted as half the race i am which is white if that makes sense)
anyone seen 'see no evil, hear no evil' the part where the blind black guy gets told he is black......and he didnt know he was black......... i mean you only know because we see it right but you dont feel your colour......does that makes sense.....(.sorry been a very long bad day today!!!!.....).

ANYWAY

i cant believe how different it is literally about a 2 hour drive away from where i live, i cant wait until the next episode!! x

oh and my MIL uses 'paki' when she talks about anyone with brown skin (even me) she doesnt understand why its wrong ....in her eyes why should a paki be ashamed of being called a paki.....thats what they are, she doesnt quite understand that not all brown people come from pakistan.
and Where i live if you called a 'paki' a 'paki' they wouldnt be offended they have a 'and what?' attitude, call an indian a paki you have a fight on your hand! x

 

[FlowerFairy]

I believe Half Caste is referring to the Indian Caste system of certain families being a higher Caste to another and that mixing 2 different caste's is not a good thing. Therefor if someone was of Mixxed Caste, they'd be half Caste and shunned. x
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caste

EDIT - Not just an Indian system x

 

[Nibblenic]

On again tonight at 9pm ladies x

 

[tummymummy]

11/24 46% ive been rejected xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

[FlowerFairy]

Never got to watch as OH was watching Footie, but It's skyplussed for today or tonight

 

[Bec C]

I watvhed last weeks but missed this week, cant stand that copper. i like the muslim man but dont like the muslim woman i like the posh lady.

So is half cast wrong to say then? We all say that here

 

[smelly07]

i watched it last night!!!

I thought rashid and damon were great, i think the outcome on that situation was fantastic.

Audrey was racist and i am glad she started questioning herself and realising that.
sabbiya was great, i was shocked by the comments from the people in the pub. crazy.

mohammed was a prick his way of life reminds me very much of the experience i have with the asian culture, the females are seen as the lower sex and do all the cooking cleaning and come when called etc, he wasnt even willing to listen or learn. i think maura was great.

Desmond was fantastic, when he cried when he was telling jens of the racist attack... it tugged on my heartstrings, the effect desmonds expereinces have had on him are plain to see, i wonder how different his life may have been if he had grown up somewhere else in the UK and his daughter when she told us about the rascist comment she had from a child in her school, it just makes your blood boil!!!!...... Jens was an idiot but i dont think he was racists just naive.

where i live this isnt even a problem, yes there is ignorance but all in all we intergrate well, there will always be rascism, and lack of willing to understand and respect others religions on all sides of the coin where ever you live but i am shocked about how life is in bradford, it honestly amazes me!!!

hopefully especially people in and around bradford will have watched that and hopefully it has made them think and maybe even change how they treat others and stop the use of racist language.

if it makes one person think differently then it was a documentary worth doing!!! x

 

[mum22ttc#3]

I agree with all of your post Smelly apart from some reason I didn't really go on Sabbiya, I don't know why I just wasn't keen on her.

Damon and Rashid were Brilliant, definitely my favourite pair by far.

Jens, yep I think he said some stupid things but I don't think he was outright racist, just like you say naive. He really didn't see the problem with anything he was saying and I think he honestly thought it was acceptable. It seemed like it did register a little though when Desmonds daughter was telling him what gets said to her at school.

Mohamed I really didn't like, it seemed it was fine to show his way of life to others yet he wasn't even willing to try and live with Maura for even 2 days. I think he was the most unaccepting of other peoples cultures and other peoples ways out of them all. He actually pissed me off.

 

[summer rain]

I didn't like the presumption that integrating=pulling pints in a pub, there are many many religious (and secular) people who do not drink alcohol and who wouldn't hang around in or work in a pub but when it comes to Muslims it is seen as the ultimate sticking point regarding integration. Muslims are not allowed to be hypocrites and so like with many other issues; if they are not allowed to do something themselves they are not allowed to encourage others to do it, so in terms of alcohol that means no serving of alcohol or selling it and this is something universally agreed upon by all mainstream sunni and shia Muslim scholars, male and female. I know you get the odd dodgy Muslim in name only selling booze or serving it in restaurants but that doesn't mean its ok. I know in the end she only agreed to serve soft drinks but its still a bit iffy xx

 

[smelly07]

I think the only reason she was in that pub was because its where her partner worked.......... it was a.... this is my world come and experience it scenario.
Pubs are a big social point in this culture, even our most popular soaps sociate around a pub................coronation street, emmerdale and eastenders.
i dont see it as being hypocritical, she isnt encouraging people to drink alcohol by going to a pub and drinking a soft drink or even working in a pub and selling alcohol. people go into a pub and ask for an alcoholic drink of there own free will.

I think it is part of intergrating, a place i worked a few years back, our assistant manager was muslim and she wasnt allowed anywhere that sold alcohol, or seen as a pub/resturant. she couldnt come out of staff nights out or work do's because everywhere sells alcohol, it stopped her being able to fully socialise with us outside of work. Even our bowling alley has a pub/bar section in it so she couldnt come there, we also had swimming days with the babies/kids (it was a nursery) part of her job she wasnt allowed to go in the swimming pool etc

Also i worked with a jehovas whitness who arent allowed to socialise with non jehovas whitness out of work, working within the child sector she refused to celebrate all other cultures/birthdays etc whereas we have to make sure we celebrate all other cultures as part of the curriculum and appreiciate all the childrens religions and im not religious at all.

I do think the rules and regualtions of some religions really do not help when intergrating amongst other races/relgions.

 

[Lightworker]

^ YES! Sometimes race and religion are their own worst enemies..someone said that you can trace the roots of some of the world's worst atrocities to religion.

Incidentally, yesterday I was randomly asked by this black lady "which church do you go to"..I told her I go to the Church of England - and then she said "oh you go to the "white people's church"..and I was like "eh?"

I know some people will keep to their own race/religion and any dealings with other race/religion will be purely superficial.

 

[Yammas]

I thought that Rashid and Damon were the best pair too the fact that they were able to find common ground despite being from different cultures was lovely.

The police officer was naiive not racist and tbh honest if he made that comment to me I dont think I would have handled it as well as Desmond did. I loved how his sister or was it his aunt was so straight forward in calling him out when he said something wrong she made me laugh.

I felt bad for shabbiya in the pub although I didint really like her idk why and aubrey I think she made a good point that even black people can be racist.

I thought Maura was nice but Mohammed would have got a slap if he knocked on the table at me!!! the way he stormed off at being asked how hed feel if his daughter went out with someone of a different race was unecessary I've asked and been asked that question many a time and never had such a negative reaction.

The saying 'whoever you hate will end up in your family' springs to mind so the question may come very true in years to come.

@Smelly can I ask why your co worker wasnt allowed in the seimming pool???

 

[smelly07]

yammas: because even when wearing a tshirt and leggings in the pool, which they do allow you to wear, it still shows off your figure and because males work there or are also in the pool she wasnt allowed to do it.

 

[summer rain]

I think the only reason she was in that pub was because its where her partner worked.......... it was a.... this is my world come and experience it scenario.
Pubs are a big social point in this culture, even our most popular soaps sociate around a pub................coronation street, emmerdale and eastenders.
i dont see it as being hypocritical, she isnt encouraging people to drink alcohol by going to a pub and drinking a soft drink or even working in a pub and selling alcohol. people go into a pub and ask for an alcoholic drink of there own free will.

I think it is part of intergrating, a place i worked a few years back, our assistant manager was muslim and she wasnt allowed anywhere that sold alcohol, or seen as a pub/resturant. she couldnt come out of staff nights out or work do's because everywhere sells alcohol, it stopped her being able to fully socialise with us outside of work. Even our bowling alley has a pub/bar section in it so she couldnt come there, we also had swimming days with the babies/kids (it was a nursery) part of her job she wasnt allowed to go in the swimming pool etc

Also i worked with a jehovas whitness who arent allowed to socialise with non jehovas whitness out of work, working within the child sector she refused to celebrate all other cultures/birthdays etc whereas we have to make sure we celebrate all other cultures as part of the curriculum and appreiciate all the childrens religions and im not religious at all.

I do think the rules and regualtions of some religions really do not help when intergrating amongst other races/relgions.

When I was growing up my family rarely, if ever went to pubs or alcohol serving restaurants and they are not Muslim. Many of my parent's friends when I was growing up were methodists and quakers and most of them don't drink either so a alcohol-heavy social culture is very odd to me and even if I wasn't Muslim I'd probably feel very uncomfortable around it. Although non-Muslim two of my sisters drink very very rarely and avoid the whole pub culture too. There are plenty of places that don't sell alcohol at least here in London, and I think that it works both ways and colleagues should maybe look into places that are more suitable for everyone to attend. Alcohol doesn't have to be part of every social occasion, people are teetotal or don't like being around alcohol for all kinds of reasons-nothing to do with race or religion. A recovering alcoholic may not be religious at all but they know they cannot go anywhere near where alcohol is being served. People would bend over backwards to accomodate for those reasons but when it comes to Muslims they are seen as being difficult or not integrating. Again with regard to the swimming; there are ladies only swimming sessions in most places and these are usually fine for Muslim women to attend but even if not-swimming is such a small part of people's lives (unless they are part of team GB) that I don't see why it is such a big issue? And yes serving alcohol or being in a pub isn't allowed for Muslims and it is seen by the religion as encouraging others to drink and I personally agree.

 

[summer rain]

^ YES! Sometimes race and religion are their own worst enemies..someone said that you can trace the roots of some of the world's worst atrocities to religion.

Incidentally, yesterday I was randomly asked by this black lady "which church do you go to"..I told her I go to the Church of England - and then she said "oh you go to the "white people's church"..and I was like "eh?"

I know some people will keep to their own race/religion and any dealings with other race/religion will be purely superficial.

As Mehdi Hassan rightfully pointed out on LBC last week the biggest mass killings of the 20th century were actually carried out by those following non-religious political ideology such as Hitler, Pol Pot and Stalin.

 

[smelly07]

I think the only reason she was in that pub was because its where her partner worked.......... it was a.... this is my world come and experience it scenario.
Pubs are a big social point in this culture, even our most popular soaps sociate around a pub................coronation street, emmerdale and eastenders.
i dont see it as being hypocritical, she isnt encouraging people to drink alcohol by going to a pub and drinking a soft drink or even working in a pub and selling alcohol. people go into a pub and ask for an alcoholic drink of there own free will.

I think it is part of intergrating, a place i worked a few years back, our assistant manager was muslim and she wasnt allowed anywhere that sold alcohol, or seen as a pub/resturant. she couldnt come out of staff nights out or work do's because everywhere sells alcohol, it stopped her being able to fully socialise with us outside of work. Even our bowling alley has a pub/bar section in it so she couldnt come there, we also had swimming days with the babies/kids (it was a nursery) part of her job she wasnt allowed to go in the swimming pool etc

Also i worked with a jehovas whitness who arent allowed to socialise with non jehovas whitness out of work, working within the child sector she refused to celebrate all other cultures/birthdays etc whereas we have to make sure we celebrate all other cultures as part of the curriculum and appreiciate all the childrens religions and im not religious at all.

I do think the rules and regualtions of some religions really do not help when intergrating amongst other races/relgions.

When I was growing up my family rarely, if ever went to pubs or alcohol serving restaurants and they are not Muslim. Many of my parent's friends when I was growing up were methodists and quakers and most of them don't drink either so a alcohol-heavy social culture is very odd to me and even if I wasn't Muslim I'd probably feel very uncomfortable around it. Although non-Muslim two of my sisters drink very very rarely and avoid the whole pub culture too. There are plenty of places that don't sell alcohol at least here in London, and I think that it works both ways and colleagues should maybe look into places that are more suitable for everyone to attend. Alcohol doesn't have to be part of every social occasion, people are teetotal or don't like being around alcohol for all kinds of reasons-nothing to do with race or religion. A recovering alcoholic may not be religious at all but they know they cannot go anywhere near where alcohol is being served. People would bend over backwards to accomodate for those reasons but when it comes to Muslims they are seen as being difficult or not integrating. Again with regard to the swimming; there are ladies only swimming sessions in most places and these are usually fine for Muslim women to attend but even if not-swimming is such a small part of people's lives (unless they are part of team GB) that I don't see why it is such a big issue? And yes serving alcohol or being in a pub isn't allowed for Muslims and it is seen by the religion as encouraging others to drink and I personally agree.

i dont and thats my opinion,.


what would you suggest to do for an evenings work nights out just out of interest? it isnt even the fact about not drinking alcohol in all honesty, some other collegues were not drinkers but were still able to go to places that sold alcohol. apart from fast food chains what resturants dont sell alcohol? We asked her to suggest some places but she said there wasnt anywhere really she could go and that her husband would approve off.

As for the swimming as part of our nursery work, swimming was an activity we did regularly with the kids, we couldnt arrange this activity at our local swimming pool when the ladies only swimming was on.... is once a week in an evening.
It wasnt a problem she just couldnt attend but she missed out.

i ALSO dont just pinpoint the muslim relgion, there are other religions that dont intergrate with other races/religions to.

At the end of the day we (as in non religious and various others) do accomadate other peoples religion but sometimes it is more cutural rather that religious imo... it needs to be a two way street or how will it ever work. ?