Sleep Sense Support Group!

[jacs]

Don't panic HG!
It's her way of telling you you're not doing it the way you usually do, and will subside when she gets used to the same routine being done over and over again.
Have you tried the 3-6 months method, where you don't pick them up? Evan hates PU/PD - it just wound him up too!
It is really hard to listen to, but you're there the whole time, so don't think you are abandoning her or anything - this is nothing like CC/CIO.

 

[history_girls]

Thanks x

I think pick up put down winds her up too much but nothing would calm her. How long is acceptable to leave them screaming? I think she would have gone over an hour.

When she wakes again I;ll try again and not give in. She knows what I am doing and she is cross. Must get through it though!

Thanks Jacs - needed those

 

[jacs]

How long is acceptable to leave them screaming? I think she would have gone over an hour.

On our first night we had half an hour of real crying. I was right next to him the whole time - stroking his head and shushing (I found that getting down to his level was less stimulating than leaning over him). I just told myself that he would HAVE to stop eventually, and that it was my job to help him learn to sleep. Anyway, I was still surprised when he did stop!

That is the only time he's fought sleep that much, sometimes he cries a bit (but nothing heavy), and that's it. It may take a little while, but once she gets how it works, in her own way she'll be so pleased to be able to just go to sleep when she needs to (and so will you!).

I have to add that I have been getting ALOT of help on here!!

 

[lyre]

Hi Elski, you are very welcome to join us - we are getting a nice little group going here now!

I have been SO stressed out this evening, I don't even really know why. I find it SO stressful trying to leave him when he wakes up early from a nap - today OH made me leave him for 20 minutes and he still didn't go back to sleep. He was still totally tired and grizzly when I got him up and then I started to get worried that I had traumatized him by not responding to him and that was why he wasn't in good form, then I started worrying about going back to work (totally unrelated but adding to my stress), then I think Thomas was picking up on me being stressed and wasn't in great form, then he seemed to be starving at his bedtime feed and looking for more after he'd drained both boobs, then he wouldn't burp for what seemed like AGES, then the dinner was overdone because it took me 20 minutes longer than expected to get him to bed. However he settled down to bed perfectly as usual, he is so great at bedtime now, there is never any complaining and he goes to sleep so quickly now.

Anyway that is my little rant over with, just needed to get all that off my chest. I think the main thing is that I worry about whether I'm doing the right thing for naps, I know I'm not really taking a consistent approach with them. Foogirl - thanks for the reassurance that things will improve with naps - I really just find myself doubting what I'm doing a lot with regards to the naps.

i've decided not to leave him for the 25mins when he wakes from the nap, going to leave him 10 mins then get him up...its too stressful for both of us and its not helping him as he wont go back to sleep after it..............also he has a long nap in the afternoons, so i think maybe its just natural for him to have 2 or 3, 30 minute naps and then a longer one of 90 mins in the afternoon.

 

[bloodbinds]

I'm joining you all!!

After a couple of weeks of thinking 'she'll grow out of it' i've decided to take an active step towards sleeping through the night! Have gone on the website and been e-mailing Dana - though her answers have been short and sweet, at least they are answers! Lol.

Bella naps wonderfully! It's the only time she does sleep well. Usually for about an hour sometimes more (rarely less)

But on the night she's been waking every 2 hours and have been feeding her back to sleep. After taking to Polaris and research, emails etc have decided to try the suggestion of putting Bella down to sleep while she is completely awake.

She has always self settled (or so i thought!) but turns out i've been putting her in really sleepy mode so she settles easily at night, and so every times she wakes, she depends on me to get her back into that sleepy mode. As Polaris put it, i'm putting her 80% into sleepyland and she can do the 20% on her own.
But she needs to do it 100% on her own so she will settle when she wakes on her own!

So tonight have put her down completely awake, she cried for about 5 minutes and then lay awake staring at her blanket for about 15 minutes, then drifted off to sleep (yay)
I'm going to watch Skins then go to sleep, and will let you know how it goes!

 

[TennisGal]

Hi Bloodbinds! Welcome - how was your night?

Morning all - how did everyone go last night? We had a very good night, her 'night feed' was at 5:45, and she went straight back to sleep for another hour and a half! (think she was tired post visitors)

History_Girls - I'd echo exactly what Jacs said, it is SO hard, but what helped DH and I was that we realised DD was upset because she couldn't work out how to get herself to sleep (without lying on one of us) and that she'd be so much happier once she had learned how to do so. She really is much happier! After a couple of nights, it gets so much better. it's so hard - I'm awful during naps, and just can't hear the crying.

Lyre, I think I'll do the same - max 10/15 mins. I do get her up, and then we play, but I can see she's tired...but if I put her in the cot again, she gets so upset!! One step at a time, I guess

I wonder sometimes if she can pick up on my vibes - because I kind of like her napping on me!! I think I need to be a bit more 'cot is GREAT' with my mentality for naps, as otherwise it's hard to get jobs done. It's just so lovely to have her napping on me!

So, everyone else?

Jacs - don't even get me started on the cats! One seems to think all DD's toys are for him!

 

[polaris]

Hi everyone
Feeling a lot better this morning, thanks for all the lovely messages.

Had a pretty good night with just one feed at 3, he did wake up briefly at midnight but put himself back to sleep within about two minutes of grumbling. And he's just gone down for his morning nap with pretty much no complaining, he cried for less than a minute and went to sleep. I might try 'wake to sleep' again to see if I can get him to take a longer nap, I just find that the day goes so much better when the first nap goes well as if that is a short nap it feels like the rest of the day goes a bit pear shaped too.

TennisGal - that was a great night last night - 5.45 is barely even a 'night' feed but great that she went back to sleep after it instead of thinking she was up for the day!

HistoryGirls - good advice from the others. I think the nice thing about this programme is that you can stay with them while they learn, so they don't feel like you have abandoned them - it is so so hard to listen to them crying as they try to figure out how to get themselves to sleep but they will work it out eventually. 45 minutes is a long time to listen to crying though hun, big hugs, that is not easy at all. It goes against every instinct not to just pick them up and try to make things better, sometimes I did need to pick Thomas up to calm him down but when he was really tired I also found that just made him worse. Somebody suggested using an ipod to kind of muffle the crying a little bit while you sit with them while they learn, I haven't tried this myself because we had already gone through that stage but it might be an idea. I think the other thing is that you have to feel really confident about what you are doing and why, because if you have any doubts then it is too hard to follow through with your plan. Your LO will be so much happier though once she figures it out.

Hi Bloodbinds - how did the rest of your night go?

Lyre - if Thomas seemed well-rested and happy after his 45 minute naps then I definitely wouldn't be trying to make him take a longer nap at all, I have read that some babies do well on short naps, that is just their natural pattern. But my experience is that he is cranky and clearly still tired unless he sleeps for longer. So we will try to keep at it.

 

[history_girls]

Thanks girls - rest of the night was ok - had two feeds as I think she is having a grow.

Has anyone not ditched the dummy doing this? If she could have her dummy it would be so much easier or does that ditch the whole idea?

 

[jacs]

TennisGal - that's fab! I would count that as sleeping through!!

Polaris - glad your night was better, are the feeds getting later now? We're now experiencing exactly what you mentioned the other day - Evan has gone from 4.30am to 12.30am for his feed! I couldn't believe it happened again last night!

History_Girls, flowers04, lyre - how did your nights go?

Welcome Bloodbinds!

Just put him down for his nap, he'd been up for 2hrs 20 and showed NO sleepy signs at all. He suddenly cried so I put him down (I was waiting for a sign!) and he fell asleep pretty much instantly - obviously tired! Please tell me he hasn't stopped the eye-rubbing?!

 

[jacs]

oops posted that before I saw your post HG!

So glad it got better for you.

You would need to ditch the dummy, unless she can control it herself. The blankie idea is recommended because they can snuggle/suck it without you being there, even though it is a prop. Has she got something to cuddle?

 

[history_girls]

Yeah she has a nunu which during the day she loves to sleep with on her face. At night she spends most of the time banging on her cot.

I knew dummy had to go - she did without after first big cry, so she can do it.

Ok I'm going to hide all the dummies from myself tonight well it is bin today, perhaps I shoudl run out and put them in the rubbish so not tempted!!!!!

 

[TennisGal]

Can imagine it's really hard - DD is a thumb sucker - it's her form of self-settling, I think the rage would be something to behold if she couldn't have her thumb!

Jacs - fingers crossed for the nap!

P - no grumbling for the nap, that's brilliant!!

 

[PieMistress]

Morning Everybody!

It's Friday, the in-laws are away and I have OH around all weekend

Well..... last night we gave Kyle his bedtime feed about 7.30pm and rather than put him down 80% sleepy we woke him up a bit more and put him in his crib. Needless to say he didn't like this BUT it only took OH doing PU/PD 3 times fo him to eventually find his thumb and hand (thank heavens for self-soothing now he's old enough) and fall asleep. He did grizzle a fair bit on and off but they were just sleep grizzles.

He then didn't wake up properly until 1am! A new personal best for our wee man He went back down after this feed awake again and didn't need to be PU/PD as he found his thumb which seems to work wonders (at the moment anyway!)

And his next wake up after this was 5.40am (!!) But, two steps forward, one step back as he has only slept for 30 mins since then (he also had lots of big naps yesterday as we were out in the car all day).

Is anybody else using the PU/PD technique?

Problem is i'm now dreading daytime naps (but always have done!) because he really doesn't like being put down for sleep awake and ends up winding himself up so much that sleep just won't come. His crib is also still in our room, i'm not sure whether or not to put him in his own room yet as he is only 11 weeks old?

OH has been a brilliant help though and has done the PU/PD the past 2 nights

Okay, 2 yawns in and just put him down for a nap, did PU/PD about 5 times but unfortunately the last time I picked him up he stopped crying instantly and fell asleep so I put him down asleep - arghghgh! I can only do this with baby steps (had to have an ear plug in too!!)

to all the new peeps!

I have also read in the BW that it takes 3 days to start to re-establish habits but can take up to 7/14 days for things to actually change? I've got 'Baby Whisperer Solves Your Problems' and it's really good, it goes into PU/PD in more detail than the Sleep Sense which is helping me!

Have you guys been emailing Dana too and getting answers?

It's so nice not to feel alone with this and sharing this group really helps me know there are others going through it too (I know almost every mum is but talking does help!!)

Is everybody putting their LO in their cot for naps? I am out and about so much during the day it's not possible except for his short one in the morning after his first feed and the cat nap before his bath.

Is anybody else also following the Baby Whisperer EASY routine?

MWAHHHH he's just started crying - been asleep 6 minutes!!!

 

[PieMistress]

I have failed!! He was asleep for 6 mins then woke up howling - just tried PU/PD a handful of times but his crying was just escalating and he was getting in such a state so I ended up putting him in his rocker where he just fell fast asleep in the lounge with TV on. I'm a bad mummy

 

[lyre]

PM, we kind of do the EASY routine, seems to work well for us.

Last night was good 7 till 7 with one feed at 2.30.

Polaris, today max was up at 7 and so i decided not to put him down to nap until 9.30 to see if it would increase the length.............he's still asleep nearly an hour on........so with max may be he wasnt tired enough in the morning after having such a good nights sleep. then having a short nap, like you said, kind of messes the rest of the day. think its probably trial and error to figure out their natural rhythm.

welcome bloodbinds!

tennisgirl, sounds like you've had a massive improvement since you started, are you finding you feel better on more sleep? i feel like my brains are slowing coming back to me! lol

Jacs, hope the nap went well, i've found max can stay awake longer than 2 hours in the morning until is ready for a nap too.

historygirls, you sound like me when i used to be a smoker and wanted to quit! lol

 

[lyre]

I have failed!! He was asleep for 6 mins then woke up howling - just tried PU/PD a handful of times but his crying was just escalating and he was getting in such a state so I ended up putting him in his rocker where he just fell fast asleep in the lounge with TV on. I'm a bad mummy

Don't worry, it is hard at first. you have to stick with what feels right for you both and still try to be as consistent as possible........................its really hard. it will happen in time, cos youre making an effort x

dont suppose you have any idea what woke him? not startle reflex or anything? i find when max wakes early after being asleep, he is usually livid because he didnt want to wake.

 

[PieMistress]

He was upstairs and I was down in the lounge with the monitor - all nice and quiet then huge howls! And the rocker, well he has only slept for 20 mins and is now awake but yawning again ... ho hum!

 

[history_girls]

PieMistress - just like me last night! We are not ready to tackle day time naps yet - need to get nighttime sleeps sorted first.

I have resisted the urge to chuck the dummies in the rubbish and the dog going mad at the window tells me the bin men are here.

OH is on board for tonight and I'm not going to pick her up as i think it made her worse.

We do EASY to a certain extent - works better in the morning and arvo not the middle of the day - prob because naps are not long enough!

 

[jacs]

I did EASY when Evan was 3 months. I ended up getting us both in a right state, trying to stick to the routine, and abandoned it after 2 weeks!
Do you watch the BW programmes? Love that, watched one this morning!

Never mind about the nap PM, your night sounds great though!! And I bet you make progress with OH around as well.

 

[flowers04]

hey everyone

hope everyone is well

and Welcome to all the new members - we're growing yeahh

me and lo are bunged up with the cold so i've not really had a chance to catch up on everyones posts - hope you all had good nights - will try to catch up reading later

didn't have a great night - lo wasn't a happy bunny - poor thing

put her down for a nap and have tried wake to sleep Polaris - fingers crossed she'll sleep for longer

happy napping all