Thoughts on this....??

[patch2006uk]

Normal BFing behaviour is often conceived as low supply. The problem is lack of education. It's normal for a newbon to not be satisfied after a length of time at the breast. Are newborns ever satisfied?

And I do understand where hot tea is coming from-there are milk banks if you really don't want your LO to have formula, and it is technically preferable for a baby to be given expressed milk from another woman than formula (I think by the WHO?), even though that's not always practical.

Lisaf makes a point I really agree with. A BFing toddler that tries to get at anyone's chest isn't being taught 'normal' (for our society) interpersonal contact with appropriate boundaries. My nephew when he was about 3 tried to claw into my top. I found it quite awkward having to tell him no-no other toddler has ever done that to me, so why should he just because he BFed for longer? Although, I will concede that it's a relatively easy fix, explaining to them why they can't, alot of ladies do seem to allow a clawing toddler get away with it

If this is incoherent, it's because it's 3.55am!!

 

[lovealittle1]

Patch you are right about the WHO.This is the order as suggested by WHO best is obviously breastmilk, 2nd best is your own expressed breastmilk, 3rd is donor milk and 4th is formula.

 

[Blah11]

See, I could never express whatsoever.

I just meant in the first six weeks the thing that is going to really establish your supply will be your baby on the boob, not a machine. I am sure there are some lucky mamas out there who can pump out no matter what though!

From what I know that if struggling with your supply, stick the babe right on there and don't take them off, lol

I think the pump thing to build up supply and get milk to 'come in' quicker is def more a us and maybe Canada thing. It doesn't really happen at all here.

 

[Blah11]

I guess I don't see self-weaning as inherently natural... mammals in the wild often stop nursing their babies before the babies choose to.. quite often actually.

I think another reason why I would stop before the age of 4 is that I would want to teach my child about personal space and respecting others.. cuddles are one thing, but the demands of a nursing toddler (lifting shirt up in public etc) can be teaching something I wouldn't want them to.

Again.. not criticising, here, just discussing the parenting philosophy behind not waiting for a child to self-wean.

Have you ever nursed a toddler? Mine has never lifted my top in public (cept to see my bump!). Most toddlers only bf a few times a day at home.

 

[hot tea]

By the age of two my son would nurse only in the morning and in the evening. By three only in the evening. He would never touch my breasts or ask for milk at any time out in public. Our bonding time was well established.

 

[tina3747]

Question for all the extendeds (not before 2?)
At what age would you say no and stop it?! If you had a 10yr old and still wanted to nurse, would you still find that acceptable if they didn't want to self wean? A 12 yr old boy? The girl I think was 10 on the programme I saw. Would you bf that age in public?

Just curious??

I just think if you had such positive views on the subject and your 100% confident to carry on as long why would you let any comment bother you especially from strangers?! Tell them to piss off!?

 

[Blah11]

Question for all the extendeds (not before 2?)
At what age would you say no and stop it?! If you had a 10yr old and still wanted to nurse, would you still find that acceptable if they didn't want to self wean? A 12 yr old boy? The girl I think was 10 on the programme I saw. Would you bf that age in public?

Just curious??

I just think if you had such positive views on the subject and your 100% confident to carry on as long why would you let any comment bother you especially from strangers?! Tell them to piss off!?

Before she went to school probably but I can't say for sure I wouldn't feed a 10 year old and def not in public because thats approaching preteen and at that age theyre ready to get boobies of their own and at that age IMO they need to start becoming adolescents and not children.
Besides I cant even work out the logistics of feeding someone that big? Sounds uncomfortable.

 

[tina3747]

Question for all the extendeds (not before 2?)
At what age would you say no and stop it?! If you had a 10yr old and still wanted to nurse, would you still find that acceptable if they didn't want to self wean? A 12 yr old boy? The girl I think was 10 on the programme I saw. Would you bf that age in public?

Just curious??

I just think if you had such positive views on the subject and your 100% confident to carry on as long why would you let any comment bother you especially from strangers?! Tell them to piss off!?

Before she went to school probably but I can't say for sure I wouldn't feed a 10 year old and def not in public because thats approaching preteen and at that age theyre ready to get boobies of their own and at that age IMO they need to start becoming adolescents and not children.

Would that be for her or you?

I'm not causing arguement I generally am interested!
I've never got alot of the natural parenting thing, suppose it's alien to me after having my first son 12 yrs ago. I choose not to take in alot on here as it becomes to intense but I read a natural p' magazine whilst standing in a queue the other day and it has made me look at other aspects of what I do in parenting.

 

[DazedConfused]

Children aged 10 and 12 can't BF as they loose the ability to suck properly. Humans tend to loose BF ability when they loose all their milk teeth.

 

[tina3747]

Children aged 10 and 12 can't BF as they loose the ability to suck properly. Humans tend to loose BF ability when they loose all their milk teeth.

Did you see the programme I mentioned?!? There was quite clearly a 10 (maybe 9?) yr old breast feeding!! Who also said she was never going to give up as she loves it so much!!As well as a woman bf a 5 yr old and twins!!

 

[xemmax]

I guess I don't see self-weaning as inherently natural... mammals in the wild often stop nursing their babies before the babies choose to.. quite often actually.

I think another reason why I would stop before the age of 4 is that I would want to teach my child about personal space and respecting others.. cuddles are one thing, but the demands of a nursing toddler (lifting shirt up in public etc) can be teaching something I wouldn't want them to.

Again.. not criticising, here, just discussing the parenting philosophy behind not waiting for a child to self-wean.

Out of curiosity, when would you stop? And when do you expect this to happen?

My son began to do this at 10 months - so obviously still reliant on milk as his main source of nutrition at that point. I think it's a young toddler thing to do, by 2/3/4 I would expect him to have grown out of it.

Also what are you referencing when you speak about mammals in the wild? I'd love to see as I am genuinely intrigued.. I have wondered this myself.

 

[Blah11]

Question for all the extendeds (not before 2?)
At what age would you say no and stop it?! If you had a 10yr old and still wanted to nurse, would you still find that acceptable if they didn't want to self wean? A 12 yr old boy? The girl I think was 10 on the programme I saw. Would you bf that age in public?

Just curious??

I just think if you had such positive views on the subject and your 100% confident to carry on as long why would you let any comment bother you especially from strangers?! Tell them to piss off!?

Before she went to school probably but I can't say for sure I wouldn't feed a 10 year old and def not in public because thats approaching preteen and at that age theyre ready to get boobies of their own and at that age IMO they need to start becoming adolescents and not children.

Would that be for her or you?

I'm not causing arguement I generally am interested!
I've never got alot of the natural parenting thing, suppose it's alien to me after having my first son 12 yrs ago. I choose not to take in alot on here as it becomes to intense but I read a natural p' magazine whilst standing in a queue the other day and it has made me look at other aspects of what I do in parenting.

both

 

[Blah11]

i watched that program and the little girl was 8. The twin toddler one was heartbreaking and exactly why I refused to make a toddler wean.

 

[Eve]

Children aged 10 and 12 can't BF as they loose the ability to suck properly. Humans tend to loose BF ability when they loose all their milk teeth.

Did you see the programme I mentioned?!? There was quite clearly a 10 (maybe 9?) yr old breast feeding!! Who also said she was never going to give up as she loves it so much!!As well as a woman bf a 5 yr old and twins!!

If you watched the whole thing and listened to the whole thing, the child was loosing her ability to suck properly and it was upsetting her, and it was soon time for her to wean etc... You are talking about the one with two daughters aren't you? Her oldest weaned first, and the younger daughter carried on, nursing and said it was better than mango even (thought that was cute!)

 

[Eve]

^^ I'm thinking it's a different program LOL

 

[Babushka99]

I saw the toddler one aww and when they realized they couldn't have anymore mummy milk one of them said "daddy milk" instead it was soooo cute.

 

[lisaf]

I guess I don't see self-weaning as inherently natural... mammals in the wild often stop nursing their babies before the babies choose to.. quite often actually.

I think another reason why I would stop before the age of 4 is that I would want to teach my child about personal space and respecting others.. cuddles are one thing, but the demands of a nursing toddler (lifting shirt up in public etc) can be teaching something I wouldn't want them to.

Again.. not criticising, here, just discussing the parenting philosophy behind not waiting for a child to self-wean.

Out of curiosity, when would you stop? And when do you expect this to happen?

My son began to do this at 10 months - so obviously still reliant on milk as his main source of nutrition at that point. I think it's a young toddler thing to do, by 2/3/4 I would expect him to have grown out of it.

Also what are you referencing when you speak about mammals in the wild? I'd love to see as I am genuinely intrigued.. I have wondered this myself.

I haven't decided when I will stop yet, I think I would want to start weaning him if hasn't self-weaned around age 2 (not that the day he turns 2 we would stop, just that I would gradually reduce the availability of my breasts to him and eventually tell him 'no' and offer cuddles instead - do the same thing you do for all 'baby' habits, talk about being a big boy now, make it exciting). I'd be fine stopping close to 1 year if he self-weaned. Of course my guy doesn't have teeth yet, lol.. if he gets violent on my breasts that may urge me to stop sooner (he's rough enough on me without teeth! ) - I would try to work through the teeth issue if it came up just for the record, but I don't think I would have as much patience with the process if it hurt even more than it does now or did at first.

The mammals in the wild thing was mostly from what I know from my friend who breeds dogs.... the dog will just stop letting the puppies nurse. Also from what you see on Discovery Channel shows when they discuss the eating/mating/weaning habits of the animals. From googling just now, I'm reading that Chimps tend to nurse to 2 years so the length of time varies a lot. But most animals seem to have the mother initiate weaning and start rejecting the child. Often thats done to prepare for another pregnancy (not everyone can get pregnant while nursing) so there is a biological urge to stop nursing in order to maximize your genetic contribution to the species. But there is also an instinct to make sure your first child will be well-fed and survive so you don't lose out on all the energy/resources you devoted to raising that child.

https://www-personal.umich.edu/~phyl/anthro/conflict.html (anthropology article depicting the parent making choices to stop certain practices despite the child still wanting to do it including weaning)

 

[Blah11]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dh-HYZZTdAQ&feature=related

skip to 5mins that looks totally horrendous to me. Its so much kinder on both parties to just let them self wean. Chances are if she left her babies a bit longer (under a year) then they'd have weaned themselves and they wouldnt have had screaming, crying from both mum and toddlers and being awake all night

 

[MizzDeeDee]

I guess I don't see self-weaning as inherently natural... mammals in the wild often stop nursing their babies before the babies choose to.. quite often actually.

I think another reason why I would stop before the age of 4 is that I would want to teach my child about personal space and respecting others.. cuddles are one thing, but the demands of a nursing toddler (lifting shirt up in public etc) can be teaching something I wouldn't want them to.

Again.. not criticising, here, just discussing the parenting philosophy behind not waiting for a child to self-wean.

Out of curiosity, when would you stop? And when do you expect this to happen?

My son began to do this at 10 months - so obviously still reliant on milk as his main source of nutrition at that point. I think it's a young toddler thing to do, by 2/3/4 I would expect him to have grown out of it.

Also what are you referencing when you speak about mammals in the wild? I'd love to see as I am genuinely intrigued.. I have wondered this myself.

I haven't decided when I will stop yet, I think I would want to start weaning him if hasn't self-weaned around age 2 (not that the day he turns 2 we would stop, just that I would gradually reduce the availability of my breasts to him and eventually tell him 'no' and offer cuddles instead - do the same thing you do for all 'baby' habits, talk about being a big boy now, make it exciting). I'd be fine stopping close to 1 year if he self-weaned. Of course my guy doesn't have teeth yet, lol.. if he gets violent on my breasts that may urge me to stop sooner (he's rough enough on me without teeth! ) - I would try to work through the teeth issue if it came up just for the record, but I don't think I would have as much patience with the process if it hurt even more than it does now or did at first.

The mammals in the wild thing was mostly from what I know from my friend who breeds dogs.... the dog will just stop letting the puppies nurse. Also from what you see on Discovery Channel shows when they discuss the eating/mating/weaning habits of the animals. From googling just now, I'm reading that Chimps tend to nurse to 2 years so the length of time varies a lot. But most animals seem to have the mother initiate weaning and start rejecting the child. Often thats done to prepare for another pregnancy (not everyone can get pregnant while nursing) so there is a biological urge to stop nursing in order to maximize your genetic contribution to the species. But there is also an instinct to make sure your first child will be well-fed and survive so you don't lose out on all the energy/resources you devoted to raising that child.

https://www-personal.umich.edu/~phyl/anthro/conflict.html (anthropology article depicting the parent making choices to stop certain practices despite the child still wanting to do it including weaning)

I get what you're saying. Most mammal parents have to eventually discourage their offspring from continuing to nurse. I just don't know what age that would be appropriate to wean in humans because you will literally get several different answers depending upon who you speak to. At this point in society it's more about the mother and what she deems appropriate I guess.

 

[lisaf]

I get what you're saying. Most mammal parents have to eventually discourage their offspring from continuing to nurse. I just don't know what age that would be appropriate to wean in humans because you will literally get several different answers depending upon who you speak to. At this point in society it's more about the mother and what she deems appropriate I guess.

Whew! Glad you understood! lol!