to circumcise or not?

[we can't wait]

Honestly, Palestrina, your comment struck me as incredibley rude. I didn't come on here to argue, just to share a perspective of someone doing it for reasons other than what some deem 'cosmetic.' Obviously, you didn't bother to actually read the wording of my comment. It was in no way inappropriate for me to mention God because my exact statement was "For people who do it for cultural reasons, circumcision is performed simply because God has commanded it and because it is tradition." My culture, Judaism, performs it for that reason. That is a fact. It's not a snide post at others that "God wants you to do it." I think you are the only one who took that offensively. It is clearly not even meant as a religious statement--- That was to explain the cultural view on it, since you are sharing the 'medical' view on it. Blutea even said she didn't fully understand the choice. I am just explaining why MY culture practices this. So please, don't immediately come in here trying to pick on my religion. Thanks.

In regards to the above videos, I understand that you are horrified, but you can find a video for just about anything on the internet. I could find one of a horrible experience, and one of a procedure that went well. The same could be done for anything-- going to the dentist, the gynocologist... there are all types of conflicting things on the web.

It is really rude for you to make a comment about the procedure-- saying that you are 'horrified,' and I'm 'altering his sex life.' Honestly, my DF is circ'ed-- and his sex life is just fine. It is a personal decision. Nothing that you post is going to change our religion, so you don't have to be so rude & make personal attacks. This friendly conversation, not an arguement about what you deem barbaric.

About your comment "I think that for 40some pages of this thread everyone has been very mature without having someone comment on our maturity level."
Oh my goodness! Quit being so witchy. Your comments are the EXACT immature comments I was referring to. I was simply saying that while I've been on BnB I have seen MANY threads about something so controversial. I've seen almost ALL of them turn nasty really fast. It was a compliment to the ladies of this forum. You are the only one who decided to, again, attack something I was saying nicely and make it sound mean. At the end I even said "That's great ladies " Obviously, I wasn't attacking anyone's maturity. I was complimenting all the lovely ladies who read the thread, commented, and respected everyone else.

Please, if you comment again, show a little more respect for my views. I feel like I was more than accepting of Bluetea's posts. There is no reason for you to act that way.

 

[Aidan's Mummy]

I did not have Aidan circumsised and I will not have any future son's done either. In my opinion it is a unessicary procedure that causes pain,disconfort and the risk of infection. All the claimed 'health benefits' can simply be overcome by non surgicial actions

Babies when they are young have very immature immune systems, that are already fighting to deal with a new world and all the germs it consists off. All circumscion is doing is putting unessicary strain on a primative immune system.

Having seen my nephew go through the recovery process after circumscion I am honeslty say I know it hurts. He was in a lot of pain and sobbed for days when he walked etc. So if it hurt an older child is will defianlty hurt a younger child. Some babies may not cry as they do sometimes go into themselves when in pain or their crying may be confused with hunger etc

As for relgious purposes that it isn't my place to comment on others faiths and beleifs. But I am say for ME if 'god' asked me to do something to Aidan that I knew would cause him pain, then he would no longer be worthy of my worship
x

 

[we can't wait]

This is completely off topic-- but the pictures in your siggy are absolutely adorable You have a precious little guy

Thank you for sharing you opinion, by the way.

 

[Aidan's Mummy]

Thank you. He is beautiful but I am biased: ) xx

 

[MrsPOP]

Ive actually circumcised men (during my first year after I graduated) and the pain they have afterwards is awful! However, I dont think that should be used as an argument to circ as a baby. Most men get circ'd when they are older due to developing BXO (Balantitis Xerotica Obliterans) or the like...medical reasons. How are we to know our children are going to develop these conditions in the future?

My best friend is in a relationship with a cut guy and they are having terrible trouble with their sex life due to his hypersensitivity on his glans.

Im from the UK anyway so its rare to get cut over here. I dont get the idea that uncut ones are supposedly more 'gross' than cut ones....all penises look odd!!!!

 

[we can't wait]

I dont get the idea that uncut ones are supposedly more 'gross' than cut ones....all penises look odd!!!!

 

[midori1999]

As this website shows, some of the Jewish community are standing up for what they believe is right and not circumcising their sons:

https://www.jewsagainstcircumcision.org/

This is from the above website:

"Growing up, we heard the same myths that all of you have heard - it’s just a snip, it doesn’t hurt. Lies! They have attached EKGs and EEGs to babies during circumcision. Their blood pressure rises, their brain waves go off the chart, they writhe in pain, and they go into shock. It hurts, trust me."



I know a few Jewish women who think circumcision is 'barbaric' (their words) and also feel their sons were in a lot of pain after they were circumcised. However, they live in such a patriachal society that they are so afraid to speak up and be shunned from their community they just allowed the procedure to go ahead. I find that very sad, but at least they acknowledge the realities of the procedure.

The fact is, it does hurt some babies and no-one will know how their baby is going to react until it happens.

 

[Palestrina]

To you I may sound like somebody rude who is speaking out against your religion. I don't have anything against anyone's religion, it is not in my nature to be prejudiced against a religion. When I first posted on this thread my opinion was neutral in the sense that I believed that "circumcision is a personal choice and my choice is not to do it." If you asked me a couple of days ago what I think of religious circumcision I would have said "to each his own" and not thought any more about it. However in doing some research for both medical and religious reasons I have learned a lot of things I wish I did not know.

People do lots of crazy things to their children in the name of their religion. Some religions think it's not ok to medically intervene during illness and don't believe in doctors. Some religions think that babies are reincarnations of extra-terrestrial beings. And some parents believe that their child is subject to their physical and emotional abuse just because it is "theirs." I'm a teacher and it is in my character to look out for the best intention of children. If I see a child is neglected at home or is physically or mentally abused I do not hesitate to report it.

Sorry if that seems rude to you but religious reasons or not, I believe that genital mutilation is a horrific thing to do to a child, especially when that child has no one to advocate on his behalf.

 

[blutea]

Honestly, Palestrina, your comment struck me as incredibley rude. I didn't come on here to argue, just to share a perspective of someone doing it for reasons other than what some deem 'cosmetic.' Obviously, you didn't bother to actually read the wording of my comment. It was in no way inappropriate for me to mention God because my exact statement was "For people who do it for cultural reasons, circumcision is performed simply because God has commanded it and because it is tradition." My culture, Judaism, performs it for that reason. That is a fact. It's not a snide post at others that "God wants you to do it." I think you are the only one who took that offensively. It is clearly not even meant as a religious statement--- That was to explain the cultural view on it, since you are sharing the 'medical' view on it. Blutea even said she didn't fully understand the choice. I am just explaining why MY culture practices this. So please, don't immediately come in here trying to pick on my religion. Thanks.

In regards to the above videos, I understand that you are horrified, but you can find a video for just about anything on the internet. I could find one of a horrible experience, and one of a procedure that went well. The same could be done for anything-- going to the dentist, the gynocologist... there are all types of conflicting things on the web.

It is really rude for you to make a comment about the procedure-- saying that you are 'horrified,' and I'm 'altering his sex life.' Honestly, my DF is circ'ed-- and his sex life is just fine. It is a personal decision. Nothing that you post is going to change our religion, so you don't have to be so rude & make personal attacks. This friendly conversation, not an arguement about what you deem barbaric.

About your comment "I think that for 40some pages of this thread everyone has been very mature without having someone comment on our maturity level."
Oh my goodness! Quit being so witchy. Your comments are the EXACT immature comments I was referring to. I was simply saying that while I've been on BnB I have seen MANY threads about something so controversial. I've seen almost ALL of them turn nasty really fast. It was a compliment to the ladies of this forum. You are the only one who decided to, again, attack something I was saying nicely and make it sound mean. At the end I even said "That's great ladies " Obviously, I wasn't attacking anyone's maturity. I was complimenting all the lovely ladies who read the thread, commented, and respected everyone else.

Please, if you comment again, show a little more respect for my views. I feel like I was more than accepting of Bluetea's posts. There is no reason for you to act that way.

When I said I didn't understand, I was actually referring to why you felt you needed to circ, even as a Jewish person. I do have a good grasp of the Jewish faith because I am Christian and I am familiar with the Old Testament. My midwife is Jewish and she did not have her son circ'd. I do respect your choice but I am also aware that there are alternatives and many Jewish individuals are no longer circumcising.

 

[mommyof3co]

I haven't commented on this thread yet and seeing it's so long I really haven't read it but just wanted to give my opinion

We have 3 little boys, all of which are circumcised. With my first I was 16, I live in the US, it was 2003 so the rates of circ were still VERY high in my state. It was all I knew, never even thought about it while pregnant, it was just something that was done. So when they asked I of course said yes, my DH stayed with him, he was numbed completely and was actually fine throughout, he got upset when they undressed him but my DH calmed him then they did the procedure and he didn't get upset at all because he was fully numb. So my 2nd came along we did the same thing. With my 3rd though I was online more and seeing that not everyone was choosing to, I looked into a bit but then decided since we had with my other 2 and it was still very common where I was that we would circ him too.

Ok so I don't regret what I did, I did what I knew at the time. I do think had I known more beforehand I would never have done it. But I do know my kids weren't in pain during the procedure and healed up very well. I know there are some drs that don't use anesthetic and don't agree with that at all. I know a lot more about it now and we have made the decision that if this baby is a boy we will not have him circ'd but not because we think we did something wrong with our other boys but because we now see there is no great reason to and the rates in the US have dropped tremendously. Some areas are down to 30% being circ'd so by the time this baby would be sexually active or anything like that he'd be part of the norm. We haven't made our decision based on everyone else though, we have just decided now that knowing what we do we feel this is best. Everyone seems to think that just because we've changed our mind we must regret what we did before or think we did something wrong, but it's not like that at all.

 

[xolily]

if we're having a boy he will be being circumcised - OH is muslim.

 

[blutea]

if we're having a boy he will be being circumcised - OH is muslim.

But are you muslim? I'm not trying to disresepct your OH's religion but I also had our first son circ'd because it was what daddy wanted. Now, I realize it should not have been his choice because it is not his penis. IMHO, the person who owns the penis should be allowed to make that decision.

 

[MizzDeeDee]

IMO, this should be a decision that no parent should have to defend themselves against. If the parent wants to do it then they should. If the parent doesn't then they shouldn't.

People don't have to understand another person's decision, they just simply have to deal with it. It's not their child and they really don't have the right to tell them or not tell them to do it.

This is just like the breastfeeding versus formula debate. Everyone isn't going to agree, and I don't think that makes any one side more valid or correct then the other.

Just my opinion.

 

[blutea]

Circumcision is purely for cosmetic purposes, in most cases. How is it fair for a parent to choose to alter a person's penis and that person has to live with that alteration for the rest of his life? We did have our first son circumcised and I now feel we were wrong because it is his body and it should be his choice. With that said, parents who do circumcise are not monsters...I am not a monster...we all love our children. But, I do believe circumcision should be a decision for the person who owns the penis, he should have the right to choose what to do with his own body when he is old enough for informed consent and truly understand the consequences of his decision.

I do agree that not everyone will agree.

 

[MizzDeeDee]

Circumcision is purely for cosmetic purposes, in most cases. How is it fair for a parent to choose to alter a person's penis and that person has to live with that alteration for the rest of his life? We did have our first son circumcised and I now feel we were wrong because it is his body and it should be his choice. With that said, parents who do circumcise are not monsters...I am not a monster...we all love our children. But, I do believe circumcision should be a decision for the person who owns the penis, he should have the right to choose what to do with his own body when he is old enough for informed consent and truly understand the consequences of his decision.

I do agree that not everyone will agree.

Well, that's all your opinion.. isn't it? You believe it should be a decision for a person who owns the penis, but that just means that's your opinion.. right?

As for it being cosmetic- again your personal opinion. Some do it for cultural reasons, others for religious, and others for medical reasons that states that though it isn't a medical necessity, that it does have some medical benefits.

My point is that it's your opinion. Period. If the lady above wants to have her child's penis cut because of religion than who is anyone to tell them how wrong they are?

This is a debate I've never understood.

 

[lisaf]

I think as parents we make many choices that will alter our children's lives. We do the best we can, what we think is best, but that doesn't mean the choice was wrong.

 

[MizzDeeDee]

I think as parents we make many choices that will alter our children's lives. We do the best we can, what we think is best, but that doesn't mean the choice was wrong.

I agree 100%.

 

[KandyKinz]

As for it being cosmetic- again your personal opinion. Some do it for cultural reasons, others for religious, and others for medical reasons that states that though it isn't a medical necessity, that it does have some medical benefits.

I just wanted to state that medically speaking newborn circumcision is classified as a cosmetic procedure..........

 

[lisaf]

My friend's daughter was born with a growth on her nose (over one of the nostrils). There was nothing harmful about it but she did have it corrected as soon as possible.

I am not trying to compare the nature of the procedure, or the normality of foreskin etc...
I'm just saying that as parents we make choices about our kid's health and appearance and lives all the time without their input.

sorry, just wanted to add that story as an example of what I meant about us making choices all the time for our kids.

 

[MizzDeeDee]

As for it being cosmetic- again your personal opinion. Some do it for cultural reasons, others for religious, and others for medical reasons that states that though it isn't a medical necessity, that it does have some medical benefits.

I just wanted to state that medically speaking newborn circumcision is classified as a cosmetic procedure..........

Agreed, but i just wanted to state that penis cancer is almost exclusively in uncut males. Also, it's been proven that there is some correlation between uncut males being more susceptible to STDs.

Btw, I bet that some Jewish woman getting their child cut wouldn't appreciate you telling them that their ritual is "cosmetic".

Cosmetic is for looks. I guess some women might do it for that reason, but I don't many that have. Again, it's cultural, religious, and for some medical benefit.

And by the way, I don't care if you circ or not, I've been watching this thread for quite awhile and I don't get how a women who is deciding to do this is being made to feel guilty for it. It's her choice.