topping up

[Carolyn]

abigail's been breastfed for ten weeks, if i was to top her up with formula which formula shall i buy?

 

[LaDY]

Hi hun...to be honest i think that is a personal prefrence. I remember when i had my bubs and at night the midwives would give me formula milk for the night top up as he was always hungry...to be honest i was clueless...i didnt even look into formula as i was so keen to breastfeed, when they used to ask which milk i wasnted to give him i asked them what they think is best and they would just shrug their shoulders and say it is my choice. The only one i had ever heard of was cow and gate so i just went with that...my LO is now on Hipp organic formula as he has bad reflux...he was originally on cow and gate...iv heard aptimal is the closest to breast milk...go with what you feel is right hunny...Goodluck xxx

 

[1st_baby]

You can get nestle good start as its easy on tummy or in your area i think theres one called aptamil for gentel tummies

 

[Serene123]

Aptamil x

 

[doumauk]

Ive got aptamil. No one I knew had ever used it before but I chose the one closest to breastmilk. Id also heard a few stories about cow and gate and sma giving babies poorly tummies so I was put off chosing those brands. I breastfeed but have some cartons and a carton of the powder as well just incase I ever need it. It is a bit more expensive than other brands though. The cheapest Ive found is £7.91 at morrisons and most expensive place was co-op £8.49!!!! How they get away with charging that much more for the same thing amazes me.

 

[Carolyn]

unfortunately at the co op they had a poor choice...only aptimel follow on milk. so i got sma gold. she gagged, it was like it was poison! is this a normal response? do i try this again or buy MORE? (it's expensive isn't it?)

 

[Christine33]

hi hun
i fed ali with SMA gold until the past week as he always seemed to have green poo and really bad wind/colic. i had heard really good things about Aptamil and decided to give it a whirl (after speaking to HV). i have gradually introduced it to him this week and he has been a lot better and is far easier to burp and his colic has greatly improved. i would defo say it is better than SMA gold but every baby is different.

good luck and yes, they are expensive!

Christine
X

 

[jenstar]

Carolyn is it her first bottle? It might be the bottle/ plastic teat in her mouth she doesn't like. When I was starting top-ups my wee Mark wasn't too keen on the actual bottle going in his mouth until he realised what was in it! His first taste of Aptamil was off a spoon, you can use a sterilised syringe too. Then if she still doesn't like it move on and try another formula.

 

[Carolyn]

Carolyn is it her first bottle? It might be the bottle/ plastic teat in her mouth she doesn't like. When I was starting top-ups my wee Mark wasn't too keen on the actual bottle going in his mouth until he realised what was in it! His first taste of Aptamil was off a spoon, you can use a sterilised syringe too. Then if she still doesn't like it move on and try another formula.

she's taken bottles of expresed milk before...i think i'l get the other variety

 

[isil]

it's totally preference as you've found! Alasdair wouldn't take Aptamil but is very good on sma gold.

 

[creamcakes]

Carolyn,

Do you mind me being nosey and asking why you're considering going down the top-up route? Maybe you just fancy it??!

I got bad advice about the 'necessity' of giving top-ups in the very early days and honestly, it nearly put paid to BF for me and my DD. So I am a bit paranoid about this issue. Tell me to butt out if I am going off-message... I just don't want anyone else have to go through all the trouble of preparing bottles, risking compromising your breastmilk supply, etc etc etc if it's not necessary or not really what you want.


Lucy

 

[Carolyn]

Carolyn,

Do you mind me being nosey and asking why you're considering going down the top-up route? Maybe you just fancy it??!

I got bad advice about the 'necessity' of giving top-ups in the very early days and honestly, it nearly put paid to BF for me and my DD. So I am a bit paranoid about this issue. Tell me to butt out if I am going off-message... I just don't want anyone else have to go through all the trouble of preparing bottles, risking compromising your breastmilk supply, etc etc etc if it's not necessary or not really what you want.


Lucy

no, don't mind chick!
been told she's 'not thriving' by sooooo many people, i've started to believe it i think. i know she's not a 'content' baby, she's high maintenance, she's taking alot of time etc. i knew this would be the case and was prepared for it. but i want her to thrive and they say she's not. pissed me off at first, but at the end of the day, they are the professionals and i'm an old first time mum. i welcome all advice and help. so if you have any, give away! bubs' weight is a concern for them, you may have read my numerous posts about this
thanks for your concern

 

[marley2580]

Is it just her weight they're worried about? They really should be looking at the health of the baby as a whole - weight gain, length, feeding habits, behaviour, etc.

 

[creamcakes]

i want her to thrive and they say she's not. pissed me off at first, but at the end of the day, they are the professionals and i'm an old first time mum.

Carolyn, I am so sorry you are getting a hard time from all quarters. Health Visitors and Midwives tend to know b***** all about breastfeeding and rarely have any constructive advice to offer. They are not very professional at all about BF in my experience. Doctors are often just as bad. Have they given you any constructive advice about how to remedy the situation if they feel that your baby needs more milk? Eg., how to increase your supply, or improve the latch, or do breast compressions so your baby gets the milk that is there effectively?? They should have tried everything before promoting formula top-ups but often it is easier to just press you to give formula so the charts look nice. How much weight is your daugher gaining? is she maintaining her centile? If not, how many centiles has she dropped?

I think the best advice I can offer you is to call a qualified lactation consultant and get them to come round to your house. They may charge around £40 but it will be money well spent if you can afford it. They will be able to give you sound advice about whether your DD is really not thriving (I bet the answer is no, no, no!) and what you can do about it if there really is concern.

Have a look at this page and if you scroll down there are a couple of lactation consultants in the Derbyshire area who do home visits or offer telephone support:

https://www.lcgb.org/locallc.htm

Other suggestions (not sure if you've tried them already, if so ignore): Domperidone on prescription from your GP, at least 4 tablets a day. They can prescribe it if they are so inclined - mine did.

Fenugreek capsules from Holland and Barrett - 3, 3 times a day. Makes you smell of curry, but seems to be an effective aid to increase supply.

Pumping with an electric hospital-grade pump after every feed, including during the night - it's a pain but very effective at increasing your supply; carry on for a bit after there is nothing more coming out. This will signal to your body to make more milk. Also, put your daughter on every time you see an opportunity for comfort sucking, eg, when she is feeling sleepy, stressed, cranky or overstimulated.

'Compress' your boob when your baby stops actively drinking at the breast. You do this by making a 'c' shape with thumb and index finger and putting this around your areola about an inch away (sorry quite hard to describe!), and then pressing quite hard against the chest wall. When she starts drinking again, release. Repeat again when she stops drinking. This kind of squeezes out some more milk for your bub.

Do some 'switch nursing' - this is where you put bub on one side for a short while, then the other side, then repeat as often as you can in one session. the baby gets more milk more quickly as they stimulate the breast more effectively while nurssing initially. More milk removed = more milk produced.

Some babies are just high-need, and it has nothing to do with feeding really - it could be colic, reflux, or just their temperament. My DD was incredibly high-need for the first three months. She was actually worse on formula. At 12 weeks, wham, she changed overnight. She is now so placid and a total joy. Just to let you know that there is hope on that score!

best of luck and ask away if any more questions.

PS, I just read some of the stuff your HV has been telling you in your other posts, especially about the 'need' to stop comfort sucking: what an absolute load of crap, this is exactly the wrong thing to tell you. Ignore her. She is obviously completely ignorant about BF. If your baby does become dependent on sucking for everything, you can wean her off later: it can be done relatively gently and your baby won't become 'clingy. What a load of rubbish. God, can you tell I am angry!

Lucy

 

[Carolyn]

i want her to thrive and they say she's not. pissed me off at first, but at the end of the day, they are the professionals and i'm an old first time mum.

Carolyn, I am so sorry you are getting a hard time from all quarters. Health Visitors and Midwives tend to know b***** all about breastfeeding and rarely have any constructive advice to offer. They are not very professional at all about BF in my experience. Doctors are often just as bad. Have they given you any constructive advice about how to remedy the situation if they feel that your baby needs more milk? Eg., how to increase your supply, or improve the latch, or do breast compressions so your baby gets the milk that is there effectively?? They should have tried everything before promoting formula top-ups but often it is easier to just press you to give formula so the charts look nice. How much weight is your daugher gaining? is she maintaining her centile? If not, how many centiles has she dropped?

I think the best advice I can offer you is to call a qualified lactation consultant and get them to come round to your house. They may charge around £40 but it will be money well spent if you can afford it. They will be able to give you sound advice about whether your DD is really not thriving (I bet the answer is no, no, no!) and what you can do about it if there really is concern.

Have a look at this page and if you scroll down there are a couple of lactation consultants in the Derbyshire area who do home visits or offer telephone support:

https://www.lcgb.org/locallc.htm

Other suggestions (not sure if you've tried them already, if so ignore): Domperidone on prescription from your GP, at least 4 tablets a day. They can prescribe it if they are so inclined - mine did.

Fenugreek capsules from Holland and Barrett - 3, 3 times a day. Makes you smell of curry, but seems to be an effective aid to increase supply.

Pumping with an electric hospital-grade pump after every feed, including during the night - it's a pain but very effective at increasing your supply; carry on for a bit after there is nothing more coming out. This will signal to your body to make more milk. Also, put your daughter on every time you see an opportunity for comfort sucking, eg, when she is feeling sleepy, stressed, cranky or overstimulated.

'Compress' your boob when your baby stops actively drinking at the breast. You do this by making a 'c' shape with thumb and index finger and putting this around your areola about an inch away (sorry quite hard to describe!), and then pressing quite hard against the chest wall. When she starts drinking again, release. Repeat again when she stops drinking. This kind of squeezes out some more milk for your bub.

Do some 'switch nursing' - this is where you put bub on one side for a short while, then the other side, then repeat as often as you can in one session. the baby gets more milk more quickly as they stimulate the breast more effectively while nurssing initially. More milk removed = more milk produced.

Some babies are just high-need, and it has nothing to do with feeding really - it could be colic, reflux, or just their temperament. My DD was incredibly high-need for the first three months. She was actually worse on formula. At 12 weeks, wham, she changed overnight. She is now so placid and a total joy. Just to let you know that there is hope on that score!

best of luck and ask away if any more questions.

PS, I just read some of the stuff your HV has been telling you in your other posts, especially about the 'need' to stop comfort sucking: what an absolute load of crap, this is exactly the wrong thing to tell you. Ignore her. She is obviously completely ignorant about BF. If your baby does become dependent on sucking for everything, you can wean her off later: it can be done relatively gently and your baby won't become 'clingy. What a load of rubbish. God, can you tell I am angry!

Lucy

hey lucy,
you sound like the type of person i need to be talking to!

in answer to your questions and a bit of background...

my midwife care was fantastic until the birth...midwife on holiday and then we moved to neighbouring county therefore receiving hv care and dr care from a new authority. i feel like i've slipped through the net.

i have spoken to another health visitor who is based near my school, she's willing to weigh and advise me in her weekly drop in. she;s phoned me twice in the week to see how i'm going!

i've also phoned a lactation consultant and she advised me over the phone about compressions etc. got dr to prescribe domperidone, got a pump from surestart...been advised by new hv that low iron CAN effect supply in sooooo many ways.

i know i have a baby who is not easy going to say the least..she is clingy but keeping her to the breast is not making this worse, it's fattening her up. she's 'thriving' more than she was!!

she's gained sooooo much in one week, her head and length have always been on the up. centiles - i'd have to look...


i feel like i've been given conflicting advice at a time where i was too vulnerable to filter it. now i'm doing what's best for abigail.

i don't feel like i've had 'help' from my nearest and dearest, they knew i wanted to breast feed but think that her clingynes, lack of weight, crying, etc is because i chose to breast feed her. I COULD QUITE EASILY SMACK THEM IN THE MOUTH, do they realise how insulting that is??everytime they say 'she needs a bottle'...god.


you know what lucy? the fact that this made you angry, makes me realise how 'apathetic' some professionals are..thanks for your concern and advice. i'm eagerly awaiting weigh in on tues, hopefully she's still gaining. if not the new hv says i should ask my dr to checks bub's urine, she coud have an infection that's gone unnoticed... anyhow,

carolyn

 

[creamcakes]

It sounds like you're doing fantastically well. I am so sorry you've had a lack of support. Me too, in the initial stages. The midwives were kind but ill-informed and all offered conflicting advice, like you experienced. It sounds like the new HV is a bit better, eh?

If your daughter is fattening up, and is growing, then carry on doing what you're doing. You said she'd gained loads in a week - that's great. If she has gained weight well even just one week, this to me suggests that you absolutely don't have a problem with your supply.

It is a bit difficult when babies need to be on the breast so often - it can be a bit of a tie - but she will get so much more efficient at feeding in a few weeks. She will probably be all done in 15 minutes max and only need that about once every 3 hours! To those people who keep urging you to give her a bottle, I bet they wouldn't say that if they were the ones having to do the sterilising, making up bottles, heating them up, etc etc etc. Also, you could remind your nearest and dearest that bottle feeding woud mean they could do their fair share and give her half the night feeds. I bet that would make them more supportive of BF!!! I am only kidding about that last bit ... maybe.

You are doing so well: don't be put off by other people. You're doing the best thing for Abigail.

Oh, and the things those so called professionals said to you, my god, I really was totally appalled. I am really pleased that the lactation consultant called them up and gave them a b*********.

Let us know what happens at the weigh-in. PS sometimes my daughter has put on 13 oz a week, sometimes only 3.


Lucy.

 

[Carolyn]

It sounds like you're doing fantastically well. I am so sorry you've had a lack of support. Me too, in the initial stages. The midwives were kind but ill-informed and all offered conflicting advice, like you experienced. It sounds like the new HV is a bit better, eh?

If your daughter is fattening up, and is growing, then carry on doing what you're doing. You said she'd gained loads in a week - that's great. If she has gained weight well even just one week, this to me suggests that you absolutely don't have a problem with your supply.

It is a bit difficult when babies need to be on the breast so often - it can be a bit of a tie - but she will get so much more efficient at feeding in a few weeks. She will probably be all done in 15 minutes max and only need that about once every 3 hours! To those people who keep urging you to give her a bottle, I bet they wouldn't say that if they were the ones having to do the sterilising, making up bottles, heating them up, etc etc etc. Also, you could remind your nearest and dearest that bottle feeding woud mean they could do their fair share and give her half the night feeds. I bet that would make them more supportive of BF!!! I am only kidding about that last bit ... maybe.

You are doing so well: don't be put off by other people. You're doing the best thing for Abigail.

Oh, and the things those so called professionals said to you, my god, I really was totally appalled. I am really pleased that the lactation consultant called them up and gave them a b*********.

Let us know what happens at the weigh-in. PS sometimes my daughter has put on 13 oz a week, sometimes only 3.


Lucy.

thanks! about your last point, sometimes 13 ozs sometimes 3...are there contributing actors in each case? a growth spurt, she had a cold?

in the two weeks when her weight plateaued (sp?) she was feeding for 15 mins every two hours, she was having a break between her 6 week growth spurt and this one she's having now! during the growth spurt she 'grazes' the day away! i was told to feed her and put her down. so i did. then she hadn't put 'enough' on. 4 ozs in two weeks. her head had grown and length had continued. i'm listening to advice now, but not necessarily taking it.

fingers crossed for weigh in at 2.30pm tues!

cx

 

[jenstar]

Fingers crossed for Tuesday!

Also I don't envy you if you have to try and collect a urine sample from Abigail- such fun we had doing this with Mark!!!! You have to tape a wee bag on around their bits inside the nappy, then remove it and somehow decant into a sample bottle without spilling it all AND you can't get any poo in it! Not fun.

You still trying to top her up? Buy the cartons then if she doesn't like it (or need it) its only 57 p wasted not £8!