When is controlled crying acceptable?!

[Wobbles]

I dunno if I want to watch the video (although unsure of what it is) - I hate having things or feeling like things are being rammed my throat at a fast speed leaving me questioning my ability as a Mum & looking after my baby which includes loving her more than I could ever love anyone else.

Nobody mentioned age of - I certainly never all I outlined was she was not old enough yet and there is a degree of child getting own way nobody will change my mind on that because someone wrote a book or a paragraph contradicting someone elses book or paragraph. I was left to my own devices (as in given what I wanted) as a youngster given into and so on always wanted attention and I threw uncontrolable fits of tantrum & was very naught at sleep time.

Babies/children also fight sleep (not talking about newborns here) the fight is often whinging not crying. Being in the same room letting child know you are there without lifting baby out is a form of a controlled situation certainly not cruel or damaging to baby.

A mother starts picking up on childs different cries, that to me is some form of bond between child & parent therefore Mum who knows baby is in distress will see to the child with no doubt - making sure baby is fed, clean, comfortable in position, temp, acting accordingly if full of wind, poss constipated, and so on and so on.

I don't see anyone saying they would just put the baby down regardless just to get them to sleep - kinda sounds like people are saying they just want baby out of road and to shut up.

I think your opinions are quite strong but I think potentially could make some Mummies doubt themselves if I'm honest. No offence.

 

[fiona-thom]

I am never here to make Mothers doubt themselves as a parent - I just show factual evidence. Just as all pediatricians and GPs will say and most know, breastmilk is much better than formula. As is controlled crying is not the ideal for babies, again backed up by many people - 'experts'.

At the end of the day it is a Mothers choice, based on factual evidence.

 

[Wobbles]

But theres 'experts' who say controlled crying to a certain level is perfectly fine for baby (like my HV) whist 'experts' have printed leaflets giving them to parents that 'routine' is pretty much a must (like my local doctors).

Theres always two sides to most things one will say its no good the other will say its a positive way forward & you'll find information on both. Not soley on this discussion but almost everything in this day!

Whist theres controlled crying better worded as a controlled situation I believe theres a controlled limit too for the adult/parent. Like not being stupidly cruel by saying sod it let baby cry until they can't be assed no more or they have no energy to because they have gasped that much in a state.

Its definately parents instinct - of any that love there children will never leave child in any shape or form of stress. I jump and get edgy at any sign of nosie from Caitlin I'm always worrying whats up with her if anything.

 

[ColtonsMom]

Babies/children also fight sleep (not talking about newborns here) the fight is often whinging not crying. Being in the same room letting child know you are there without lifting baby out is a form of a controlled situation certainly not cruel or damaging to baby.

I agree with you. I feel my LO is far too young to be left crying. I get to him right after he starts crying. But, if I know it's not time to feed or he hasn't wet his diaper than I just talk to him. He is often comforted by me just rubbing his hand/arm/leg and talking to him in a soft voice instead of picking him up.

I also think controlled crying is good for a child. It will teach them to comfort themselves. I am definitally going to use controlled crying. Just not at this age, and not for awhile.

 

[Helen]

But the phrases 'routine' and 'controlled crying from day one' make me shudder in fear.

How dare you! I'm mortified at the suggestion that you think I would do anything to hurt my precious children!

 

[beanie]

I'm not entering the discussion about controlled crying but I do want to just say that it does annoy me when people say picking up your baby all the time makes for a clingy child. Personally I think this is more to do with the childs personality then anyhting else. I have always picked up Seren assoon as she started crying from day one and anyone who has met Seren would never describe her as clingy. She is happy to meet other people, never has been clingy.She comforts herself,is a great sleeper and will play happily by herself. I will use the same approach with Cally, maybe she might be clingy (though why this is a bad thing I never know as before we know it they are all grown up and we are complaining they are too independant) but that will be hr nature just as her sister isindependant. I carry Cally around in a sling and constantly get told she will get too used to being carried (love that)

 

[coccyx]

You can find statistics to support most points of view. Some people think co sleeping is a dangerous thing to do! Is the video from the tv programme about looking after baby from 3 different points of view. If it is ,the part when the newborn is left to cry for ages made me cry! The new mum downstairs was so upset. The maternity 'nurse' told them not to let the baby win! That to me was cruel.:

 

[mickey]

Quote:
But the phrases 'routine' and 'controlled crying from day one' make me shudder in fear.

Quote:
How dare you! I'm mortified at the suggestion that you think I would do anything to hurt my precious children!


here, I want to add again, that I heard, twins, triplets and so on are able to soothe each other as they are used being together, due to the fact they were together in the womb!
makes absolutely sense to me, as well nature must have put sth in place to make a mother help to cope with multiplets.

ps: my OH is a non-identical twin

 

[Wobbles]

I'm not entering the discussion about controlled crying but I do want to just say that it does annoy me when people say picking up your baby all the time makes for a clingy child. Personally I think this is more to do with the childs personality then anyhting else. I have always picked up Seren assoon as she started crying from day one and anyone who has met Seren would never describe her as clingy. She is happy to meet other people, never has been clingy.She comforts herself,is a great sleeper and will play happily by herself. I will use the same approach with Cally, maybe she might be clingy (though why this is a bad thing I never know as before we know it they are all grown up and we are complaining they are too independant) but that will be hr nature just as her sister isindependant. I carry Cally around in a sling and constantly get told she will get too used to being carried (love that)

Lots of Mums have said the opposite though 'I gave into my child all the time now shes difficult & I can't leave her' type thing ...family (mine) included. So I could never take back what I've said and think it does have a little to do with. Even the woman in the GPs surgery was telling me the difference between her two was quite boring but hey ho

BUT there is a difference imo between picking up child to give them own way & picking up to comfort etc so maybe that is why Beanie? On the 'own way' I am talking about when baby is older walking etc

I think your right though their personallity does have alot to do with & if my daughter has my personality I'm in for a rough ride

Half asleep atm though ha!

 

[Wobbles]

You can find statistics to support most points of view. Some people think co sleeping is a dangerous thing to do! Is the video from the tv programme about looking after baby from 3 different points of view. If it is ,the part when the newborn is left to cry for ages made me cry! The new mum downstairs was so upset. The maternity 'nurse' told them not to let the baby win! That to me was cruel.:

Oh yes that was outragous! THAT is not what my thinking of this means btw!! That was a stressed baby needing Mummy now that was BAD!

Assuming it is what I think your mean theres a few discussions on the forum somewhere.

 

[coccyx]

No I never thought you did mean this! The newborn was stressed and so was the new mum. I could have slapped the maternity nurse! I do think as they get older they do for want of a better term 'try it on' sometimes. I have never rocked my children to sleep, my 20 month old has bath ,bottle , book, cuddle and then I say 'time for sleepy bobs". She is then put into her cot to sleep. She only cries when my hubby is back at the weekend and does not follow the routine!!!!!! Preapres to be slammed down for using the word ROUTINE

 

[Wobbles]

Haha Daddys home time to play huh Bless

(& haha )

Honestly I was a GET MY OWN WAY child from spitting orange at people in C&A cafe, biting peoples legs at bus stops, throwing myself on the floor in the newsagents, hiding under my duvet and not sleeping sneaking out of bed to the games cupboard, hiding to watch prisoner block H when my sister went to bed, pretending I was asleep when my foster parents went out and as I knew where my sisters matches were lighting playing cards flicking em across the room until she'd let me go down stairs with her or I'd tell Mum about her matches I was SO naughty!

 

[fiona-thom]

You can find statistics to support most points of view. Some people think co sleeping is a dangerous thing to do! Is the video from the tv programme about looking after baby from 3 different points of view. If it is ,the part when the newborn is left to cry for ages made me cry! The new mum downstairs was so upset. The maternity 'nurse' told them not to let the baby win! That to me was cruel.:

Yes, but non to support controlled crying -- unless some can find them for me. Apart from the fact -- that it works. But of course it does, I'd be completely knackered after all that crying, and in the end I'd just 'give up'... What's the point and I have to conserve my energy?

There is so much physical evidence backing that controlled crying wrong, and nothing to back up that it's right. An infants body temperature rises and their heartbeats increase to an abnormal rate during all that crying. Plus I've also pinpointed other physical effects in my previous post that could potentially bring harm...

I co-sleep, and alot of people disagree with it. As the same with BLW, and people happily voice their opinions at me, and it doesn't dent my Mother skills because everything I do is evidence based. I don't believe everything I do is right for every single person, and co-sleeping is one of them. Like-for-like going on statistics co-sleeping has had less infant deaths per annum compared to the cot. And of these deaths it is normally because a Mother wasn't following proper and sound safety precautions. Overheating is a major cause, due to newborns sleeping under a duvet.

And I don't mean to bring offense to people, but it's hard not to, I just want people to have the right information. So that they can make up their own minds from that....

There is only ONE situation where I believe controlled crying is right. When the Mother is suffering badly and completely at the end of her tether, then for the risk of the health of both Mother and baby, putting down a baby and letting it cry itself to sleep in my eyes deemed acceptable. Because a Mother who is strung out is shown to be more likely to harm/abuse her baby.

But doing it so you can just have them tucked up in bed a ie 7pm so you can go downstairs and have a glass of wine, seems like you're putting your needs first. Especially considering babies don't have the right body-clock to begin with, it takes time to adjust and slowly guide them into.

My fear is we are moving into times when Mothers want to carry on as normal after a child has come into their lives, and make things as easy as possible at the risk of their babies health.....And it just really makes me desperately sad.

 

[Wobbles]

See I'm finding your posts very difficult because NOBODY has stated what words you are putting into our mouths.

Yes, but non to support controlled crying -- unless some can find them for me. Apart from the fact -- that it works. But of course it does, I'b be completely knackered after all that crying, and in the end I'd just 'give up'... What's the point and I have to conserve my energy?

NOBODY said they would leave their child in an uncontrolled crying 'state' NOBODY ... most people would know the limits as the parent for there individual child. Again I believe theres a difference in whinging (like a tired whinge/bored whinge) & crying in need of whatever it may be.

But doing it so you can just have them tucked up in bed a ie 7pm so you can go downstairs and have a glass of wine, seems like you're putting your needs first. Especially considering babies don't have the right body-clock to begin with, it takes time to adjust and slowly guide them into.

How dare you! Actually quite pissed off at this comment - nobody said this I flaming well didn't & I don't see anyone else suggesting your outragous comment either.

And I don't mean to bring offense to people, but it's hard not to

I see its just in your nature to do so!

As for one of your comments GIVING PEOPLE THE FACTS its just your way of things so everyone else should follow? If only everybody did everything by the book like co-sleeping.

Really annoyed now (not offended) so I will leave it there!

 

[elles28]

Thanks Wobbles you have put exactly what I was thinking into words xx

 

[fiona-thom]

I don't have a problem with cots, I believe what works for everybody is different. And some people find having a LO in their bed uncomfortable, and some have sleeping problems and so can't do so. I don't find it the ideal co-sleeping, it just works best for my baby.... btw.

I think I go on the more of the lines of 'Bringing up Baby' when I said that comment I must admit, and that is the extreme end of the scale as we all know. But I think if you do it from day one, then you're more likely to follow that example.... Because you obviously haven't tried anything else first. But anyway....

I shall also end this discussion here, as I have said the points that are relevant, and fighting it anymore is unneccesary.

 

[Wobbles]

Because you obviously haven't tried anything else first. But anyway....

Your suggesting I leave my child to cry now? That I am using any shape or form of cruel controlled crying? ... I certainly do not use controlled crying with my nearly 4 month old in fact have stated a possible future thing I have however put the baby down to take '5'. My opinion and the way I think or think I might do things may change in the future - who knows.

But please don't stick words in anyones mouths thats just nasty tbh & please don't suggest 'I don't know any other way' as if I am acting on a form of cruelty to my baby now. I haven't tried anything yet!

 

[fiona-thom]

the 'you' was meant as a hypothetical person in my sentance. Directed at the hypothetical person who would start controlled crying from day one.

I really didn't want to post back in here, but I don't see where I've turned around and said you are performing cruelty/child abuse on your child for doing it and you must not love them. Because that is not what I am saying....

I think people just don't have information to hand that could be crucial to their decision. And I have given that. If any of you would like to put some evidence down to why controlled crying is good for children then so be it. This is called 'debate'.

I am not here to put words into peoples mouths or force them to make one decision or the other, but to put down why I wouldn't use controlled crying, instead of just saying 'I don't do it', I always like to have a reason behind anything I do. And at the end of the day, it is a parents call, and if they're happy in the knowledge that they love their child and believe that it is the best thing for them, then it is up to them.

Right I'm most certainly banning myself from replying to this topic again.... I just don't want to be seen as some sort of demon.

 

[StirCrazy]

wow, it's amazing what an expert 8 months, 1 week and 5 days can make a person! It's very easy to go around quoting lines out of books as 'fact'... but to be honest I find it very offensive that you pretend to be some kind of authority on infant care when you are just learning to be a parent like the rest of us.

 

[beanie]

at risk of being shouted at I don;t think she has put herself as some kind of expert, just put forward some information for others. I have had a habit of using quotes from websites, so people can read it themselves not me saying I am an expert on these matters. this is one of those discussions that there can be strong differing view points (hence why I have been reading only and not joined in about CC.

As mothers all we can do is read round on all the differing points of view and make up our own minds about what is right. I have read some interesting points from both sides.