Would you trust the h1n1 shot after this...

[Perdita]

So out of curiosity... if you were bitten by a wild animal and couldn't verify that it didn't have rabies.... would you go through the rabies vaccines?

No, I would not get the vaccine because of my history of vaccine injury and severe adverse reaction. I would go to the hospital and get treatment. One of the most effective methods to decrease the chances for infection involves thorough washing of the wound with soap and water.

I haven't had time to check on any responses to this but feel should point out that there is no treatment for rabies and it is 100% fatal. It is incredibly rare in Britain but in other countrie it's endemic and the risks are much greater. Not criticising your choice however would you make the same choice if it was your child and not you that was bitten??

There is treatment for rabies. If someone is bitten by an animal suspected of having rabies and go to the doctor before symptoms develop, they get a dose of Human Rabies Immune Globin (HRIG) with five subsequent doses of vaccine over a period of 28 days. The prognosis is usually very good as long as the individual gets treatment before symptoms develop. If they wait until after symptoms develop to get help, the prognosis is much poorer.

So it's my understanding that the treatment is a vaccination which is what would be refused????? The only way it will work is if given before the infection is established which is why has to be given as quickly as possible??
Maybe it's baby brain setting in!

 

[aragornlover8]

So it's my understanding that the treatment is a vaccination which is what would be refused????? The only way it will work is if given before the infection is established which is why has to be given as quickly as possible??
Maybe it's baby brain setting in!

Oh, I was merely stating that treatment *does* exist. I'm not sure if the other poster was stating that they would refuse the vaccine if treatment was necessary. I think they're saying they refuse it as a preventative measure. I can't speak for someone else though. I just didn't want anyone to think that there was no recourse for someone exposed to the virus.

I've got some serious baby brain too. Sorry if I didn't make sense.

 

[blutea]

Why would you go to the hospital for soap and water? Sorry, that just sounds like something you'd do at home. Sorry for my ignorance on that.. I just always felt stupid when I went to the ER for an injury and they used Neosporin and a bandaid, lol.

Washing the wound with soap and water is home care. Then, if necessary a person could go to the ER for rabies immune globulin (this is different than the vaccine). It's my understanding that the rabies immune globulin is sufficent and the vaccine truly is not necessary for post care.

So it's my understanding that the treatment is a vaccination which is what would be refused????? The only way it will work is if given before the infection is established which is why has to be given as quickly as possible??
Maybe it's baby brain setting in!

Unless you work as a vet or dog groomer or in a similar industery infection with rabies is very uncommon. The vaccine is not recommended routinely as preventative care for the general population, only for high risk individuals. The rabies vaccine has about a 75% adverse reaction rate.

"Human rabies is very rare. If bitten by an animal, rabies is still very rare. If bitten by a rabid animal, rabies transmission to a human is still very rare. So being bitten by a rabid animal is not a death sentence by any means."
This link will tell you more about rabies and treatment- https://www.vaclib.org/intro/rabies.htm

 

[bubble123]

I am so glad that the people that don't vaccinate are in the minority. SO glad.

I find your remarks to be insenstive and unproductive to this discussion.

 

[bubble123]

I haven't had time to check on any responses to this but feel should point out that there is no treatment for rabies and it is 100% fatal. It is incredibly rare in Britain but in other countrie it's endemic and the risks are much greater. Not criticising your choice however would you make the same choice if it was your child and not you that was bitten??

Your rabies fatality guess is incorrect. Check out the link blutea provided. It will educated you about rabies.

 

[bubble123]

I cannot see anywhere that says soap and water is adequate protection against rabies. 50,000 people die each year from rabies bites (mostly in developing countries where they don't vaccinate their dogs).

Its a personal choice, I just see the risk of dying from rabies as much higher than the risks from that vaccine... and its one instance where you know you are at high risk, and you know the fatality rate. I don't understand your choice, but its yours to make.

The link blutea provided with give you more information about rabies and treatment.

 

[lisaf]

I just checked out that link. It is NOT a medical site, one of the statements it made was "Health is the outcome of a lifestyle which results in cell structure which is well nourished and toxin free. " which I'm sure is pretty insulting to those who have health issues depsite living as healthy as they can.

It says that 1-3 people in the US die of rabies each year. It does NOT state that those 3 people were vaccinated or not, or if those who were bitten but did not die were vaccinated.

The site gives no medical background for anything and just claims that fear of rabies is what causes it. That is completely unfounded and totally untrue.. .nobody will die just from the fear of it, and people who DO die from it, especially in other countries may not even know what rabies is.

That site is an interesting THEORY but is by no means something that should be taken as fact. If you want to gamble your health based on the beliefs on there, that is your choice, but that site is not proof of anything other than a set of beliefs.
They label their site Vaccine Liberation... their information will be biased in one direction only.

If vaccines don't work, then why are there only 3 rabies deaths per year in the US where we mostly vaccinate our dogs, and 50,000 worldwide in countries where dogs are not vaccinated. Surely its not that those 50,000 people did not have access to soap and water?

 

[My_First]

I haven't had time to check on any responses to this but feel should point out that there is no treatment for rabies and it is 100% fatal. It is incredibly rare in Britain but in other countrie it's endemic and the risks are much greater. Not criticising your choice however would you make the same choice if it was your child and not you that was bitten??

Your rabies fatality guess is incorrect. Check out the link blutea provided. It will educated you about rabies.

Actually its not, 80% mortality rate IF you get the actual disease. Most are prevented by rabies vaccination (afterwards).

https://www.wrongdiagnosis.com/r/rabies/deaths.htm

And whilst there has only been one in the US, it much higher in Africa, Asia etc..

And all sources are cited.

 

[lisaf]

Oh... and I love how that site claims vaccines have a placebo effect, but don't acknowledge that many people imagine reactions to vaccines....

I think the issue here is that we are all disagreeing because it has crossed over from a medical decision, to a set of beliefs.
I believe in science and though I do examine and research vaccines before taking them, I trust the data provided to me.

Those who have been injured by vaccines believe (and rightly-so) that the risks of vaccines do not outweigh the benefits for them.

And then there are those who claim there is 0 benefit at all to vaccines and that nobody should get them.... that is a set of beliefs too.

We all disagree on what the facts are and are not going to convince each other.

 

[Aidan's Mummy]

If parents continue to refuse vacinnations we could have a serious outbreak on our hands. I have looked at vaccinations in depth and in my opinon the positives far out weight the risks. Some of the diseases aidan has had has caused side effects such as a high temp. But that is Nothing compared to the side effects of the actual disease. Like loss of limbs,blindness, brain damage and even death. Things that I refuse to risk my child suffering when it can be prevented.
X

 

[blutea]

I just checked out that link. It is NOT a medical site, one of the statements it made was "Health is the outcome of a lifestyle which results in cell structure which is well nourished and toxin free. " which I'm sure is pretty insulting to those who have health issues depsite living as healthy as they can.

It says that 1-3 people in the US die of rabies each year. It does NOT state that those 3 people were vaccinated or not, or if those who were bitten but did not die were vaccinated.

The site gives no medical background for anything and just claims that fear of rabies is what causes it. That is completely unfounded and totally untrue.. .nobody will die just from the fear of it, and people who DO die from it, especially in other countries may not even know what rabies is.

That site is an interesting THEORY but is by no means something that should be taken as fact. If you want to gamble your health based on the beliefs on there, that is your choice, but that site is not proof of anything other than a set of beliefs.
They label their site Vaccine Liberation... their information will be biased in one direction only.

If vaccines don't work, then why are there only 3 rabies deaths per year in the US where we mostly vaccinate our dogs, and 50,000 worldwide in countries where dogs are not vaccinated. Surely its not that those 50,000 people did not have access to soap and water?

The thing to keep in mind is that just because you are bitten does not mean you will die from rabies. That's all I wanted you to take away from the link. However, there is no denying that our mind is a powerful thing and fear can cause problems.

 

[My_First]

I just checked out that link. It is NOT a medical site, one of the statements it made was "Health is the outcome of a lifestyle which results in cell structure which is well nourished and toxin free. " which I'm sure is pretty insulting to those who have health issues depsite living as healthy as they can.

It says that 1-3 people in the US die of rabies each year. It does NOT state that those 3 people were vaccinated or not, or if those who were bitten but did not die were vaccinated.

The site gives no medical background for anything and just claims that fear of rabies is what causes it. That is completely unfounded and totally untrue.. .nobody will die just from the fear of it, and people who DO die from it, especially in other countries may not even know what rabies is.

That site is an interesting THEORY but is by no means something that should be taken as fact. If you want to gamble your health based on the beliefs on there, that is your choice, but that site is not proof of anything other than a set of beliefs.
They label their site Vaccine Liberation... their information will be biased in one direction only.

If vaccines don't work, then why are there only 3 rabies deaths per year in the US where we mostly vaccinate our dogs, and 50,000 worldwide in countries where dogs are not vaccinated. Surely its not that those 50,000 people did not have access to soap and water?

The thing to keep in mind is that just because you are bitten does not mean you will die from rabies.

With an 80% fatality rate...thats pretty high odds I wouldn't want come across.

 

[blutea]

I haven't had time to check on any responses to this but feel should point out that there is no treatment for rabies and it is 100% fatal. It is incredibly rare in Britain but in other countrie it's endemic and the risks are much greater. Not criticising your choice however would you make the same choice if it was your child and not you that was bitten??

Your rabies fatality guess is incorrect. Check out the link blutea provided. It will educated you about rabies.

Actually its not, 80% mortality rate IF you get the actual disease. Most are prevented by rabies vaccination (afterwards).

https://www.wrongdiagnosis.com/r/rabies/deaths.htm

And whilst there has only been one in the US, it much higher in Africa, Asia etc..

And all sources are cited.

Notice how the link you provided is only able to offer estimates.

 

[lisaf]

The thing to keep in mind is that just because you are bitten does not mean you will die from rabies. That's all I wanted you to take away from the link. However, there is no denying that our mind is a powerful thing and fear can cause problems.

I appreciate that. And yes, I thought the death rate was 100% but I knew that was probably just a media perception.. 80% sounds more likely.

And yes, a bite does not mean you will die, but if 80 out of 100 people who get rabies die... and if even 25% of 1,000 people bitten by a rabid animal will get rabies... then that is a REAL risk in my opinion. And a huge risk for death.
Nobody says the rabies vaccine is easy or fun and it has many more side effects than other vaccines (one reason why we don't give it to someone unless we know they have been exposed). But even the 5% death rate quoted on your site is a lot lower than 80%.

Just my opinion. I am a very healthy person, but I don't trust my body to overcome THOSE kinds of odds, lol!

 

[lisaf]

Notice how the link you provided is only able to offer estimates.

Estimates are better than offering 'facts' that cannot be verified. It is more honest at least to say they are estimates.

If a kid in the country is bit by a rabid animal and doesn't tell anyone, and doesn't get sick or die, they can't possibly know that. And if that kid does die, but they don't do an autopsy or run tests to see what is wrong with him, they can't possibly know that either.

 

[BrandiCanucks]

I am so glad that the people that don't vaccinate are in the minority. SO glad.

I find your remarks to be insenstive and unproductive to this discussion.

Thank you for mentioning this. I found it to be this way, but did not feel like having this turn into the alcohol in pregnancy debate. I have very valid reasons for not vaccinating, so whether I am in the minority or not should not matter. My daughter was very possibly vaccine injured. I feel the risks of further injury with her and with my son far outweigh the benefits of the vaccine. Should we discover that her genetic condition was activated by a vaccine, and that our son carries it as well, I will be satisfied, pleased, and happy with my decision not to vaccinate, because I know that I am not only saving myself from raising not just one, but two children with disabilities, but I will also be saving my children from regressing and declining and facing daily struggles with musltiple aspects of their development.

For that, I will be SO glad I am in the minority and did what was best for the health of my children, regardless of how other people, vaxxers and non-vaxxers alike, want to make me feel for my decision. I am a good mom and I do what is best for and by my children; no other person with an opinion is going to put me down for that.

 

[blutea]

With an 80% fatality rate...thats pretty high odds I wouldn't want come across.

The thing to keep in mind is that just because you are bitten does not mean you will die from rabies. That's all I wanted you to take away from the link. However, there is no denying that our mind is a powerful thing and fear can cause problems.

I appreciate that. And yes, I thought the death rate was 100% but I knew that was probably just a media perception.. 80% sounds more likely.

And yes, a bite does not mean you will die, but if 80 out of 100 people who get rabies die... and if even 25% of 1,000 people bitten by a rabid animal will get rabies... then that is a REAL risk in my opinion. And a huge risk for death.
Nobody says the rabies vaccine is easy or fun and it has many more side effects than other vaccines (one reason why we don't give it to someone unless we know they have been exposed). But even the 5% death rate quoted on your site is a lot lower than 80%.

Just my opinion. I am a very healthy person, but I don't trust my body to overcome THOSE kinds of odds, lol!

As I explained before, the rabies immune globulin is truly only necessary for post rabies care. This is different than a vaccine. The human rabies immune globulin (RIG) can prevent rabies because it provides immediate antibody protection against rabies infection even if the virus enters the body.

 

[Elhaym]

I just checked out that link. It is NOT a medical site, one of the statements it made was "Health is the outcome of a lifestyle which results in cell structure which is well nourished and toxin free. " which I'm sure is pretty insulting to those who have health issues depsite living as healthy as they can.

It says that 1-3 people in the US die of rabies each year. It does NOT state that those 3 people were vaccinated or not, or if those who were bitten but did not die were vaccinated.

The site gives no medical background for anything and just claims that fear of rabies is what causes it. That is completely unfounded and totally untrue.. .nobody will die just from the fear of it, and people who DO die from it, especially in other countries may not even know what rabies is.

That site is an interesting THEORY but is by no means something that should be taken as fact. If you want to gamble your health based on the beliefs on there, that is your choice, but that site is not proof of anything other than a set of beliefs.
They label their site Vaccine Liberation... their information will be biased in one direction only.

If vaccines don't work, then why are there only 3 rabies deaths per year in the US where we mostly vaccinate our dogs, and 50,000 worldwide in countries where dogs are not vaccinated. Surely its not that those 50,000 people did not have access to soap and water?

The thing to keep in mind is that just because you are bitten does not mean you will die from rabies. That's all I wanted you to take away from the link. However, there is no denying that our mind is a powerful thing and fear can cause problems.

I'm sorry, but that is categorically untrue. it is INCREDIBLY rare to survive a rabies infection. The first case ever known only occurred in 2004. Rabies is caused by a virus we can see and photograph. Fear doesn't cause rabies, rabies virions cause rabies.

It is extremely irresponsible to give such dangerous advice regarding a deadly illness. Vaccination is based on years of medical research and has saved countless lives, and to deny it is to deny reality.

 

[My_First]

Okay - This one here 'nerarly 100%'
https://www.netdoctor.co.uk/travel/diseases/rabies.htm

Is '100%' https://www.scidev.net/en/news/researchers-call-for-better-rabies-care-in-china.html

 

[blutea]

this old chestnut

Vaccinations are there for a reason.

Like I said, they do offer minimime benefit...and they are a huge money maker.

I don't really care if they are a money maker, they save lives.

Thankfully though, people that choose not to immunise are in the minority and i hope it stays that way.

Seriously, why do you even bother! You are not contributing to this discussion. It feels like you are just trying to provoke!