Would you trust the h1n1 shot after this...

[goddess25]

We always have to keep ourselves informed and take responsibility for our own health. I am a RN and have seen some pretty nasty things happen over the years... I have seen many children die because they chose not to vaccinate there kids its heartbreaking... and while I agree that vaccination should happen in terms of MMR etc I find it difficult when it comes to new vaccinations like H1N1. I chose to vaccinate myself and my child last year and it was a difficult choice but yes i did it as I was scared.

I have seen people misdiagnosed really through medical negligence and unfortunately the medical profession get away with it all the time... a good example is my grandma who is 92 had a heart attack due to angina they eventually put in a stent and sent her home. They put her on a GTN patch which she puts on in the morning and takes of at night... about 2 years later (yes 2 years later) she starts having dizzy spells and faints alot the doctor puts it down to old age and does nothing. My mum calls me from Scotland and I live in Canada concerned so I ask did they take her blood pressure as the GTN patch can cause lowered blood pressure... she said no so i instruct my mum to take my gran to the doctor and make them do the blood pressure. Unfortunately before this my gran has a dizzy turn, falls on the stairs and hits her head... she has to go to the hospital and get some stitches but basically she is fine. The hospital tell her she has postural hypotension and really bad so basically when she is standing her BP is dropping so low she faints. Since I mentioned it my mum tells the ER doc about the GTN patch and it turns out no one even knew she was on it... her GP thought it ended 18 months before as it was supposed to they have just been giving her repeat prescriptions and that was it done. No discipline, nothing... abysmal care and since it was an old lady no one cares. I tried to get my mum and gran to put in an official complaint but of course they never wanted to cause any trouble and she even kept the same GP. It makes me furious.

Anyway I am ranting but basically we need to be fully aware of both sides, weigh up the pros and cons of everything we do medically and make an informed choice.

 

[KandyKinz]

I did laugh though as DH married me without ever knowing me with a period (I had Mirena) or knowing me off antidepressants. I did get a lot bitchier off the antidepressants and started nagging him about stuff.

I was fine on the Effexor but am glad I was able to quit it like that... must be horrible to be hooked on it, not able to stop.

LOL I'm just surprised my DH married me knowing what I was like pre-menstrual! It takes a brave brave man to do that sorta thing!

 

[lisaf]

Thats horrible, but I understand your point of view about it.
My brother has Fahrs' Syndrome.. got it in his 30s which is very young for it to show up. Its supposed to be genetic but there is no history of it in our families. There is a chance I will get it, but there is nothing they can do until I have symptoms and then they just treat them as they show up. Similar prognosis as Parkinsons. He's been stable for a couple years but he could get worse and die in 6 months or live another 30 years.. they just don't know. But he's basically brain damaged now and has facial twitches and 'pill rolling'. So sad for my parents.
If I have a CAT scan and its clear, it doesn't mean I'll be fine, I can still get it later. If I show signs now, there is nothing they can do until I have symptoms.

No genetic test for it either. So I'm just assuming I'll be fine and waiting and seeing.
MS is pretty awful and its tough to know what the right choices are.

 

[blutea]

We always have to keep ourselves informed and take responsibility for our own health. I am a RN and have seen some pretty nasty things happen over the years... I have seen many children die because they chose not to vaccinate there kids its heartbreaking... and while I agree that vaccination should happen in terms of MMR etc I find it difficult when it comes to new vaccinations like H1N1. I chose to vaccinate myself and my child last year and it was a difficult choice but yes i did it as I was scared.

I understand your fear but it really concerns me to hear that people assume a vaccine saved a life. There is no proof that vaccines save lives...it's theory. Vaccines are a great theory but they have never been proven to be safe or effective. As we are now discovering an individual can still contract an illness even after they have been vaccinated. It is very tragic when a child dies from an illness and it is equally devistating when a child dies as a result of a vaccine. I do agree that it is so important that we take charge of our health care. Modern medicine can be very helpful but it can also be very harmful.

 

[lisaf]

We always have to keep ourselves informed and take responsibility for our own health. I am a RN and have seen some pretty nasty things happen over the years... I have seen many children die because they chose not to vaccinate there kids its heartbreaking... and while I agree that vaccination should happen in terms of MMR etc I find it difficult when it comes to new vaccinations like H1N1. I chose to vaccinate myself and my child last year and it was a difficult choice but yes i did it as I was scared.

I understand your fear but it really concerns me to hear that people assume a vaccine saved a life. There is no proof that vaccines save lives...it's theory. Vaccines are a great theory but they have never been proven to be safe or effective. As we are now discovering an individual can still contract an illness even after they have been vaccinated. It is very tragic when a child dies from an illness and it is equally devistating when a child dies as a result of a vaccine. I do agree that it is so important that we take charge of our health care. Modern medicine can be very helpful but it can also be very harmful.

What about the polio vaccine? What about smallpox vaccines? Is there evidence that those diseases would have disappeared or gone down as much as they have without the vaccines?

 

[blutea]

We always have to keep ourselves informed and take responsibility for our own health. I am a RN and have seen some pretty nasty things happen over the years... I have seen many children die because they chose not to vaccinate there kids its heartbreaking... and while I agree that vaccination should happen in terms of MMR etc I find it difficult when it comes to new vaccinations like H1N1. I chose to vaccinate myself and my child last year and it was a difficult choice but yes i did it as I was scared.

I understand your fear but it really concerns me to hear that people assume a vaccine saved a life. There is no proof that vaccines save lives...it's theory. Vaccines are a great theory but they have never been proven to be safe or effective. As we are now discovering an individual can still contract an illness even after they have been vaccinated. It is very tragic when a child dies from an illness and it is equally devistating when a child dies as a result of a vaccine. I do agree that it is so important that we take charge of our health care. Modern medicine can be very helpful but it can also be very harmful.

What about the polio vaccine? What about smallpox vaccines? Is there evidence that those diseases would have disappeared or gone down as much as they have without the vaccines?

These diseases were in decline before the vaccines were introduced. They would have continued to naturally decline without the vaccines. Better living conditions, food sources, and sanitation helped greatly to eliminate these diseases. The effect of vaccines was actually mininal.
Take a look at these graphs for more examples about disease decline before vaccines-https://www.whale.to/vaccines/decline1.html

 

[lisaf]

Yes, this comes from the CDC so of course its going to be pro-vaccine... but I found the Measles chart to be particularly informative. Its proof that vaccines had a direct and dramatic impact on the occurance of measles.
https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vac-gen/6mishome.htm

 

[Ajisai]

Just because it is on the internet doesn't mean it is correct.

 

[lisaf]

Just because it is on the internet doesn't mean it is correct.

Well I can't post a book on here Only have links to the internet... I think the CDC is a pretty reputable source for information?

 

[JaniceT]

No Govt. Agency or Big Pharmaceutical company has or will fund a long-term study of the affects of vaccination on people. Why try to even risk having a study that could potentially put them in great liability if it prooves that there's great risk? It is direly needed and a few weeks ago, a group of independent people are trying to raise funding for an unbiased study of this sort. I'll look for the the link and if do find it, will post it here. I do support that more studies of long-term effects be carried out to inform the public so that people can make the educated choice themselves.

 

[lisaf]

I wasn't offering the CDC site a proof that vaccines are safe.
I was putting it up to link to some evidence that vaccines have worked. (not saying all vaccines work as well as they say, but there are some vaccines that have had such a dramatic effect on occurances of disease that you can't say vaccines have never been proven to work).

 

[JaniceT]

BTW I have two friends who are doing really well in the pharmaceutical company. Also, relatives who are doctors. The pharmaceutical companies will entice the docs to sell their brand of medicines/vaccines... in return, they get free 5-star meals, overseas holidays, all types of goodies. It's happening world wide. Very rich industry.

 

[Ajisai]

Just because it is on the internet doesn't mean it is correct.

Well I can't post a book on here Only have links to the internet... I think the CDC is a pretty reputable source for information?

I meant for the other link. Your post went up before I submitted. I meant to say that I never heard of whale.to as a reputable research publication. If it is found in pub med, "Nature," and government sites, I'm more likely to believe the credential. I looked at the whaler.to link but it does not give statistic significance value, or p-value.

There are crazy doctors out there just publish their theories on net which are not studied by reputable and credential researcher to be accounted for.

 

[JaniceT]

I wasn't offering the CDC site a proof that vaccines are safe.
I was putting it up to link to some evidence that vaccines have worked. (not saying all vaccines work as well as they say, but there are some vaccines that have had such a dramatic effect on occurances of disease that you can't say vaccines have never been proven to work).

I think you should in fact post more of sites like this. Parents and parents to be need to be more informed on both sides of the spectrum, and also in between so that people can have a better pictures.

 

[lisaf]

BTW I have two friends who are doing really well in the pharmaceutical company. Also, relatives who are doctors. The pharmaceutical companies will entice the docs to sell their brand of medicines/vaccines... in return, they get free 5-star meals, overseas holidays, all types of goodies. It's happening world wide. Very rich industry.

Yes, this is common practice for sure. How many pens do you see at doctors offices with drug names on them. Its not even a real obvious lure, but by putting their name in front of the doctors all the time, they hope it will make the doctors remember their medication when they have a patient with heartburn etc...
Not all doctors allow themselves to be persuaded by this, but there are still other subtle effects to the way the drug industry markets themselves.

Even providing samples means a doctor is more likely to just hand you some pills than send you to the pharmacy for an alternative drug.

 

[JaniceT]

LOL I should have studied to become a doctor. Free holidays every year. (just kidding)

 

[lisaf]

I wasn't offering the CDC site a proof that vaccines are safe.
I was putting it up to link to some evidence that vaccines have worked. (not saying all vaccines work as well as they say, but there are some vaccines that have had such a dramatic effect on occurances of disease that you can't say vaccines have never been proven to work).

I think you should in fact post more of sites like this. Parents and parents to be need to be more informed on both sides of the spectrum, and also in between so that people can have a better pictures.

Thanks, I just didn't want it dismissed because its on the 'internet' or because it comes from the pro-vaccine side of things. I felt the information was pretty good at the site.. especially explaining the statistics that are often misrepresented by the anti-vaccine movement (I'm talking about the claim that more kids who have been vaccinated get the illness than those who don't).

The site did say "Even one serious adverse event in a million doses of vaccine cannot be justified if there is no benefit from the vaccination." Its just trying to contradict the claims that vaccines don't do anything.. and discussing the known risks etc.

I know that people feel their reactions are not taken seriously by the vaccine industry... but let me tell you, some people will blame ANYTHING on vaccines or Mirena or whatever... there was a woman who blamed Mirena for ending her marriage! The anti-Mirena group made it hard for me to find any information about what I was dealing with after mine was removed. I'm not saying there weren't more side effects than the companys will admit, but the issue seemed to be that most women weren't given the package insert or properly informed of the possible side effects. Some things are a coincidence and unrelated to a vaccine or a medical device etc. Yet people out there believe it all is incontrovertible 'proof' of something.

 

[lisaf]

LOL I should have studied to become a doctor. Free holidays every year. (just kidding)

LOL... not sure it makes up for the cost of malpractice insurance!

 

[lisaf]

well its been fun ladies, I need to get some sleep! Catch up with you tomorrow!

 

[JaniceT]

Oh a friend just informed me that there's a new MMR vaccine out, manufactured by Japan. Much safer, less side effects compared to existing MMRs. However, advised to only administer when a child reaches 3 years old. Will ask her for more info.

Even with existing MMR vaccines, if I ever had to give my child that, I would wait until he/she is old enough to handle it.

LISAF, that's harsh, why weren't patients duly informed by Doc's on the side effects, etc? It's terrible! I think Docs and Pharmacists have a very serious duty to inform their patients instead of just dispensing and prescribing drugs.