An independent Scotland?

[lindseymw]

With regards to the oil split, it will depend entirely how it will be split as to who gets what, which has not been decided yet.

As far as I am aware around 90% of the oil fields lie in Scottish Waters. But this may not be the way of how it is split.

If you go by population, it would split the other way i.e 10% to Scotland 90% to UK, excluding other Countries interests.

Obviously for Scotland, it's in their best interest to get as much of the share as possible as it accounts for a big chunk of their income (around 10-20%) as oppose to around 1% for the rest of the UK.

Has there been any discussion as to how Salmond will fund Scotland once the oil reserves run out? Estimated at around 15-40 billion barrels of oil which could last 10years, 15 years etc. What happens after that when Scotland lose potentially 1/5th of their income?

When the argument comes up about how much is spent per head vs how much income in Scotland, like the oil split it depends on how you work it out. I' guessing Salmond & co have used the one that makes it look good?

 

[Midnight_Fairy]

I am not Scottish and I think if they went independent it would be a juve mistake.

 

[lhancock90]

I'm Scottish and I will be voting no.

My family are HUGE SNP campaigners so I know an awful lot about it. However I feel like they're all living in cuckoo cuckoo land.

I can only give you info based on my family as it's what I've done the most research into.

Salmond says we 'could be like Ireland', and independent state that had a thriving economy - for the whole of 5 minutes. And now that country is down the shitter.

We will end up paying (as said in Salmond's twat book) 15% more tax MINIMUM. However he can't let you know exactly how much, as most of his answers are.

We will struggle to keep any sort of NHS (which is a UK organisation, if we leave the UK we will have a lot of starting over with it)

We will have to make up a lot of short falls with how much money we will lose from the UK government each year. Our oil and Whisky (2 main industries) will only cover half of what they give us each year.

Not to mention if we use population as a guide for debt inheritance we will inherit 92billion in debt. Which we deserve, Westminster didn't create the whole debt themselves. We gave them a helping hand.

Then we have the currency debate. Salmond's twat book says us keeping the pound is "vital". If we don't have it many companies will pull out of Scotland. It won't be economically viable for them to stay. However, it won't be in the UK's best interest for us to have a currency union. The Euro has shown how hard they are to sustain and regulate. Not to mention, if we kept the pound, all things money (interest rate etc) will still be controlled by the bank of England. I thought Salmond wanted independence? Obviously there is nothing the UK government can do to stop Scotland using the pound. They can however make our lives very difficult.

To me, he's like a 5 year old child wanting to run away from home. He wants to be a big boy but he still needs to hold mummy's hand to cross the road.

He has no answers for anything. Today on the currency debate Sturgeon had no answers, whatsoever, for what we will do if we actually go independent. The whole White paper is written on 'ifs and buts'.


I do think we'll go independent though. All they need to do it put 'Braveheart' on STV the night before and even I will be running to the polling station screaming 'FREEEEDOM'.

I'm English and i agree with all of the above.

 

[Mooshoo]

I find this a interesting thread. I am scottish but no amount of research is making my decision any easier all information is so conflicting

I think I am swayed more to yes but I have switched back and forth so probably will still be no closer by the time the vote come round.

What I do think though is seeing as we have a different set of laws and education system anyway we are partially there but like I said I am no closing in finding out any information

If people have links to good opinion sites I would love to read

 

[sparkle_1979]

I'm half Scottish, I've just moved to England after spending ten years there and was worried about Scotland getting the yes vote. I think it would be a huge mistake for Scotland and I hope it doesn't happen. I'm less concerned though now I live in England.. I know a lot of Scottish people who don't think it will happen mind you. My husband still works offshore bad he said the head of bp said it would be a mistake

 

[Abigailly]

With regards to the oil split, it will depend entirely how it will be split as to who gets what, which has not been decided yet.

As far as I am aware around 90% of the oil fields lie in Scottish Waters. But this may not be the way of how it is split.

If you go by population, it would split the other way i.e 10% to Scotland 90% to UK, excluding other Countries interests.

Obviously for Scotland, it's in their best interest to get as much of the share as possible as it accounts for a big chunk of their income (around 10-20%) as oppose to around 1% for the rest of the UK.

Has there been any discussion as to how Salmond will fund Scotland once the oil reserves run out? Estimated at around 15-40 billion barrels of oil which could last 10years, 15 years etc. What happens after that when Scotland lose potentially 1/5th of their income?

When the argument comes up about h much is spent per head vs how much income in Scotland, like the oil split it depends on how you work it out. I' guessing Salmond & co have used the one that makes it look good?

Salmond hasn't said too much on how he reckons we'll fund ourselves after oil runs out. Oil is a declining resource, and it's top estimation reckons we have 40 years of oil left, although new fields are being discovered, possibly pushing it to 50. Salmond has said after that, because we will be a new country many more industries will be open to us?!

I think how they will do it is how the UK and Norway split it in the 60s. It was something like a 'median line'. And if that's the case then Scotland will get 90% of the oil (this is all according to the White Book, so who knows). But even so. We will still be relying on such an unstable resource for roughly 18% of our income.

He also talks about our Whisky industry. Which is barmy considering it has a decline of almost 20% over the last 10 years thanks to the introduction of the Chinese whiskys and less people drinking it due to the likes of blends.

So our 2 main industries are either in decline or subject to limitations. I love my country, but what else does it have going for it?

We have no big industries anymore.

I know he's talking about making the like of IR35 compulsory, and removing the likes of flat rate VAT. Yes, that will create more income. But all it means is a small company like I own will not be able to run in Scotland. We'll simply not be able to afford it. The reason we could afford to was because of these breaks given to us as a helping hand.

 

[Abigailly]

I find this a interesting thread. I am scottish but no amount of research is making my decision any easier all information is so conflicting

I think I am swayed more to yes but I have switched back and forth so probably will still be no closer by the time the vote come round.

What I do think though is seeing as we have a different set of laws and education system anyway we are partially there but like I said I am no closing in finding out any information

If people have links to good opinion sites I would love to read

If you 'like' the Better Together and Vote Yes Facebook pages there are always good debates going on on that. But with all the opinion pages, take it all with a pinch of salt and see what google has to say about their 'facts'.

There's not a single page I've found yet that makes it any easier for your average Joe to understand. I spend more time googling what words mean than reading the sites.

 

[Debi]

With regards to the oil split, it will depend entirely how it will be split as to who gets what, which has not been decided yet.

As far as I am aware around 90% of the oil fields lie in Scottish Waters. But this may not be the way of how it is split.

If you go by population, it would split the other way i.e 10% to Scotland 90% to UK, excluding other Countries interests.

Obviously for Scotland, it's in their best interest to get as much of the share as possible as it accounts for a big chunk of their income (around 10-20%) as oppose to around 1% for the rest of the UK.

Has there been any discussion as to how Salmond will fund Scotland once the oil reserves run out? Estimated at around 15-40 billion barrels of oil which could last 10years, 15 years etc. What happens after that when Scotland lose potentially 1/5th of their income?

When the argument comes up about how much is spent per head vs how much income in Scotland, like the oil split it depends on how you work it out. I' guessing Salmond & co have used the one that makes it look good?

I don't imagine it will go by population. The north sea oil is in scottish waters. If the oil is split that way then everything else will have to be. 10- 15 years is a very very conservative estimate! I doubt bp would be investing as much in NSO if they believed this. Also there is good evidence of huge oil fields beside the Orkney Isles and also on the West coast.
Scotland are now the world leaders in renewable energy so I would imagine we will be able to expand on that in the future for income.
Anyway we are more than capable of building industry in the years before the "oil runs out", especially with a government who only has scotland and scottish people's interests to account for. Our current goverment invests a huge amount of money in london to the detriment of every other city. Scotland used to have a lot of industry.

 

[Debi]

With regards to EU membership as well, Scotland will be in a completely unprecedented position, so no one can actually say what will happen. It's all speculation. There will be negotiations. Scotland (and the uk) have been members of the eu for 30+ years and already meet all the requirements. As it's an unprecedented situation, new laws can be made if agreeable to the members. Scotland will probably not have to go through the whole application process, it is completely unnecessary. If you want to get technical about it, the rest of the uk will also be a new nation (the united kingdom by definition won't actually exist anymore), so will the rUK have to apply again? - no because it would be a waste of time and resources.

 

[lindseymw]

Not all of the Oil is in Scottish Waters, hence there would need to be a split. As Abigailly has mentioned, there is likely to split using a Median Line as they have done in the past.

The 10-15 years is an estimate on the lower estimate for oil. There may be more, there may be not. I would at least expect a Government who wants to go independent to have a definate plan for future income and not base their plans on the what ifs and the maybes. But that's just my opinion anyway.

With regards to the EU, it has been stated that Scotland will have to apply like any other country wanting to join and I predict Spain will make this a bit difficult but who knows really at this stage. I can't say whether Scotland fit the criteria as I am not up on what the criteria is..something I will need to research.

For me, there is far too much grey areas, what ifs and maybes. There are no definate plans, no actual decisions have been made. It just seems to be based on hopes and pipedreams with no way to get there.

Just read this today, thought it was relevant to this thread:
https://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-26220638

Has Salmond got an actual plan if Scotland doesn't get a currency union? Or will he just throw his toys out of the pram?

 

[Abigailly]

With regards to the oil split, it will depend entirely how it will be split as to who gets what, which has not been decided yet.

As far as I am aware around 90% of the oil fields lie in Scottish Waters. But this may not be the way of how it is split.

If you go by population, it would split the other way i.e 10% to Scotland 90% to UK, excluding other Countries interests.

Obviously for Scotland, it's in their best interest to get as much of the share as possible as it accounts for a big chunk of their income (around 10-20%) as oppose to around 1% for the rest of the UK.

Has there been any discussion as to how Salmond will fund Scotland once the oil reserves run out? Estimated at around 15-40 billion barrels of oil which could last 10years, 15 years etc. What happens after that when Scotland lose potentially 1/5th of their income?

When the argument comes up about how much is spent per head vs how much income in Scotland, like the oil split it depends on how you work it out. I' guessing Salmond & co have used the one that makes it look good?

I don't imagine it will go by population. The north sea oil is in scottish waters. If the oil is split that way then everything else will have to be. 10- 15 years is a very very conservative estimate! I doubt bp would be investing as much in NSO if they believed this. Also there is good evidence of huge oil fields beside the Orkney Isles and also on the West coast.
Scotland are now the world leaders in renewable energy so I would imagine we will be able to expand on that in the future for income.
Anyway we are more than capable of building industry in the years before the "oil runs out", especially with a government who only has scotland and scottish people's interests to account for. Our current goverment invests a huge amount of money in london to the detriment of every other city. Scotland used to have a lot of industrhy.

There is more oil off the Shetlands, there's no doubt about that. However we are yet to have invented the technology that is needed to extract it. As with the other oil fields, they can't even begin to estimate the size of the oil fields. It's not possible to do so, or to determine whether the oil is any good, until you have done some drilling. Which we haven't.

As for the EU, the president of the EC (so the man in charge of the organization that deals with all the legislation and decisions made for the EU) has said that this isn't an unprecedented case at all. Scotland will go in as a new country wanting to join the EU. As for the rUK, there position will stand as it is. They aren't a new state, they are a standing member which a member of their union has decided to leave. That's not their issue, therefore there stance within the EU will not be effected.

But as usual, Salmond has said that this isn't the case. He has written off a statement made by someone who has much more knowledge on the subject than him, no doubt called it 'preposterous' because it doesn't support his cause. He keeps doing it. Experts on a subject put forward their opinion, or the precedent andd if it doesn't support Salmond's big dreams he says they are wrong.

 

[Pearls18]

Why would Spain make it difficult for Scotland to join the EU?

 

[Tasha]

Why would Spain make it difficult for Scotland to join the EU?

Because they keep opposing countries joining x

 

[Abigailly]

Why would Spain make it difficult for Scotland to join the EU?

They keep opposing countries, particularly independent countries (Kosovo being an active example), as then it gives precedent and ideas to certain areas of Spain that have been wanting independence for years. I can't be sure but I think Catalonia may be one of their areas.

 

[Debi]

The Spanish foreign minister has actually stated that if the uk's constitutional order allows it then spain will have nothing to say about It (Scotland joining). They are aware that the cases of Catalonia and Scotland are different. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/feb/17/barroso-scotland-ludicrous-remarks
Other experts have said that it IS an unprecedented case, the bbc just haven't shown them.... I wonder why?!

 

[x Michelle x]

https://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news...e-allowed-to-use-british-oxygen-2014021283498

 

[lindseymw]

https://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news...e-allowed-to-use-british-oxygen-2014021283498

Wonder if Salmond will want a wall likened to the one of Game of Thrones? Actually, no one mention it as it will give him ideas.

 

[Fergie]

https://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news...e-allowed-to-use-british-oxygen-2014021283498

Wonder if Salmond will want a wall likened to the one of Game of Thrones? Actually, no one mention it as it will give him ideas.

I think Hadrian beat him to it

 

[Natsku]

Just a thought, what happens to the flag if Scotland does become independent? Will the Union Flag (Jack) have to be changed?

Edit: Because, well, I'd be opposed to Scotland becoming independent because well, I like the flag the way it is...

 

[Pearls18]

Just a thought, what happens to the flag if Scotland does become independent? Will the Union Flag (Jack) have to be changed?

Edit: Because, well, I'd be opposed to Scotland becoming independent because well, I like the flag the way it is...

Can you imagine how expensive it would be to change the Union Jack think of everything it is on, right now I'm thinking military uniforms, flag posts etc but it will be on SO much. I have to admit I would be very sad to see the Union Jack go, people in Wales have been moaning for a while about inclusion, has anyone ever tried to draw the welsh flag, nightmare!!