I have to...

[iceylou]

I think you will find most people have come back to the thread because they cannot believe some of the things you have said.

It's funny - I am from Ireland where a lot of people are still religious and I often laugh with my friends that some of the older people that go to mass everyday (not everyone) are some of the most gossipy and spiteful people. Just because you believe in God doesn't make you automatically a nice person.

As others have said, you are judgemental, and that is not a very nice trait in a person.

so true and my aunt was one of them, she was a nun for about 50 yrs and was the most spiteful person i ever knew. she used everyone in the family, nobody would talk to her. she was also very abusive verbally and very racist to anyone from other countries considering she spent time in africa on missions!! that i could never understand.

 

[fluffpuffin]

I think you will find most people have come back to the thread because they cannot believe some of the things you have said.

It's funny - I am from Ireland where a lot of people are still religious and I often laugh with my friends that some of the older people that go to mass everyday (not everyone) are some of the most gossipy and spiteful people. Just because you believe in God doesn't make you automatically a nice person.

As others have said, you are judgemental, and that is not a very nice trait in a person.

so true and my aunt was one of them, she was a nun for about 50 yrs and was the most spiteful person i ever knew. she used everyone in the family, nobody would talk to her. she was also very abusive verbally and very racist to anyone from other countries!!

why do believer's personalities get judged but not non-believer's??? I would never ream saying - 'for an atheist that person is nice / horrible' - again, judgemental, or not??

 

[leelee]

I think you will find most people have come back to the thread because they cannot believe some of the things you have said.

It's funny - I am from Ireland where a lot of people are still religious and I often laugh with my friends that some of the older people that go to mass everyday (not everyone) are some of the most gossipy and spiteful people. Just because you believe in God doesn't make you automatically a nice person.

As others have said, you are judgemental, and that is not a very nice trait in a person.

so true and my aunt was one of them, she was a nun for about 50 yrs and was the most spiteful person i ever knew. she used everyone in the family, nobody would talk to her. she was also very abusive verbally and very racist to anyone from other countries considering she spent time in africa on missions!! that i could never understand.

I can well believe it. My Granny and her friend are the type of people I am talking about. They gossip and tut about everyone - looking down their nose at all sorts of things, but yet they are not very nice people themselves.

 

[indy and lara]

If the statement 'How can you not believe in God when you look into your child's eyes' is judgemental, then people on the non-believeing side have been judgemental too in that case, saying 'How can you believe when bad things happen??' - that's just the other side of the coin.

I often get the impression it's ok for non-believers to judge believers (for various reasons), but believers aren't allowed to speak about what they believe or they are called offensive. it seems strange that if one even suggests that it seems illogical in the face of some of the wonders of nature not to believe in God one gets attacked - and I think that's all the OP did.

The OP built on her original statement by adding that those who have something go wrong are weak souls where the devil has been able to have some influence and to go on to say that she pities people who don't believe in God . THOSE are the comments I have issue with. I don't give 2 hoots whether someone believes in God or not- your life, your choice. But I don't believe and I don't intend to sit here and listen to someone tell me that my son died because of some personality defect I have. That is judgemental and highly offensive and frankly I do not think it is okay for someone to say that.

 

[redpoppy]

I think you will find most people have come back to the thread because they cannot believe some of the things you have said.

It's funny - I am from Ireland where a lot of people are still religious and I often laugh with my friends that some of the older people that go to mass everyday (not everyone) are some of the most gossipy and spiteful people. Just because you believe in God doesn't make you automatically a nice person.

As others have said, you are judgemental, and that is not a very nice trait in a person.

so true and my aunt was one of them, she was a nun for about 50 yrs and was the most spiteful person i ever knew. she used everyone in the family, nobody would talk to her. she was also very abusive verbally and very racist to anyone from other countries considering she spent time in africa on missions!! that i could never understand.

I think I'd be like that if I never got laid.

 

[leelee]

I think you will find most people have come back to the thread because they cannot believe some of the things you have said.

It's funny - I am from Ireland where a lot of people are still religious and I often laugh with my friends that some of the older people that go to mass everyday (not everyone) are some of the most gossipy and spiteful people. Just because you believe in God doesn't make you automatically a nice person.

As others have said, you are judgemental, and that is not a very nice trait in a person.

so true and my aunt was one of them, she was a nun for about 50 yrs and was the most spiteful person i ever knew. she used everyone in the family, nobody would talk to her. she was also very abusive verbally and very racist to anyone from other countries considering she spent time in africa on missions!! that i could never understand.

I think I'd be like that if I never got laid.

 

[fluffpuffin]

If the statement 'How can you not believe in God when you look into your child's eyes' is judgemental, then people on the non-believeing side have been judgemental too in that case, saying 'How can you believe when bad things happen??' - that's just the other side of the coin.

I often get the impression it's ok for non-believers to judge believers (for various reasons), but believers aren't allowed to speak about what they believe or they are called offensive. it seems strange that if one even suggests that it seems illogical in the face of some of the wonders of nature not to believe in God one gets attacked - and I think that's all the OP did.

The OP built on her original statement by adding that those who have something go wrong are weak souls where the devil has been able to have some influence and to go on to say that she pities people who don't believe in God . THOSE are the comments I have issue with. I don't give 2 hoots whether someone believes in God or not- your life, your choice. But I don't believe and I don't intend to sit here and listen to someone tell me that my son died because of some personality defect I have. That is judgemental and highly offensive and frankly I do not think it is okay for someone to say that.

I agree non-believers shouldn't be pitied, but then a lot of people say to believers, they think we're silly for believing. I've had people give me looks of pity when they heard I was religious,because they thought I'm stupid for believing

But I think some of the OP's comments have been misinterpreted. She's being attacked from all sides and ever word she says is being looked at through a microscope, rather than looking at the context.

And there have been people calling her judgemental just based on her original post, which is just ridiculous, as it's just her statement and her opinion.

again I will say: why can people question why some believe in God but those with a faith cannot question why others don't believe??? discrimination??

 

[indy and lara]

If the statement 'How can you not believe in God when you look into your child's eyes' is judgemental, then people on the non-believeing side have been judgemental too in that case, saying 'How can you believe when bad things happen??' - that's just the other side of the coin.

I often get the impression it's ok for non-believers to judge believers (for various reasons), but believers aren't allowed to speak about what they believe or they are called offensive. it seems strange that if one even suggests that it seems illogical in the face of some of the wonders of nature not to believe in God one gets attacked - and I think that's all the OP did.

The OP built on her original statement by adding that those who have something go wrong are weak souls where the devil has been able to have some influence and to go on to say that she pities people who don't believe in God . THOSE are the comments I have issue with. I don't give 2 hoots whether someone believes in God or not- your life, your choice. But I don't believe and I don't intend to sit here and listen to someone tell me that my son died because of some personality defect I have. That is judgemental and highly offensive and frankly I do not think it is okay for someone to say that.

I agree non-believers shouldn't be pitied, but then a lot of people say to believers, they think we're silly for believing. I've had people give me looks of pity when they heard I was religious,because they thought I'm stupid for believing

But I think some of the OP's comments have been misinterpreted. She's being attacked from all sides and ever word she says is being looked at through a microscope, rather than looking at the context.

And there have been people calling her judgemental just based on her original post, which is just ridiculous, as it's just her statement and her opinion.

again I will say: why can people question why some believe in God but those with a faith cannot question why others don't believe??? discrimination??

If she had left it at her first comment then this thread would more have likely have died out. But she didn't, she kept digging and adding more and more to what she had said.

Discrimination my elbow. Asking why someone doesn't believe is one thing, telling them that their character is flawed is a totally different thing. I find her opinion regarding my stance pretty offensive. I am not a lesser person because I don't believe in her God and this is why I have responded to her post.

 

[iceylou]

I think you will find most people have come back to the thread because they cannot believe some of the things you have said.

It's funny - I am from Ireland where a lot of people are still religious and I often laugh with my friends that some of the older people that go to mass everyday (not everyone) are some of the most gossipy and spiteful people. Just because you believe in God doesn't make you automatically a nice person.

As others have said, you are judgemental, and that is not a very nice trait in a person.

so true and my aunt was one of them, she was a nun for about 50 yrs and was the most spiteful person i ever knew. she used everyone in the family, nobody would talk to her. she was also very abusive verbally and very racist to anyone from other countries considering she spent time in africa on missions!! that i could never understand.

I think I'd be like that if I never got laid.

i nearly choked lol.

 

[Natasha2605]

If the statement 'How can you not believe in God when you look into your child's eyes' is judgemental, then people on the non-believeing side have been judgemental too in that case, saying 'How can you believe when bad things happen??' - that's just the other side of the coin.

I often get the impression it's ok for non-believers to judge believers (for various reasons), but believers aren't allowed to speak about what they believe or they are called offensive. it seems strange that if one even suggests that it seems illogical in the face of some of the wonders of nature not to believe in God one gets attacked - and I think that's all the OP did.

The OP built on her original statement by adding that those who have something go wrong are weak souls where the devil has been able to have some influence and to go on to say that she pities people who don't believe in God . THOSE are the comments I have issue with. I don't give 2 hoots whether someone believes in God or not- your life, your choice. But I don't believe and I don't intend to sit here and listen to someone tell me that my son died because of some personality defect I have. That is judgemental and highly offensive and frankly I do not think it is okay for someone to say that.

I agree non-believers shouldn't be pitied, but then a lot of people say to believers, they think we're silly for believing. I've had people give me looks of pity when they heard I was religious,because they thought I'm stupid for believing

But I think some of the OP's comments have been misinterpreted. She's being attacked from all sides and ever word she says is being looked at through a microscope, rather than looking at the context.

And there have been people calling her judgemental just based on her original post, which is just ridiculous, as it's just her statement and her opinion.

again I will say: why can people question why some believe in God but those with a faith cannot question why others don't believe??? discrimination??

I don't believe anyone with a faith is stupid. I just think religion causes a lot of problems, but then again what's life without problems. The only time I'll ever question religion is when it comes to ''cults'' and stuff like that. I don't think OP's original comments were misinterpreted, she said she could ''guarentee'' that when people are faced with losing a loved one they will be praying to god. I sure as hell won't be, wouldn't that make me a hypocrite? How can that be misinterpreted?

At the end of the day the way I form my beliefs is that religion has no proof, science does. Religion requires you to place your faith and trust in a power that can never be guarenteed and I, for one, am not prepared to do that.

 

[aob1013]

Just updated myself on this thread. OP, you are full of shit and highly offensive.

 

[Dopeyjopey]

I'm on my phone so apologies if this comes out muddled.

Firstly, I feel the need to say I class myself as spiritually agnostic. I don't believe in anything without proof but I can understand others have faith and am openminded about parts of various religions that seem feasible to me.

Secondly, if someone is questioning how people don't believe in God it is only fair that people can ask why someone does.

Now, disclaimers done, onto my point

Throughout history there have been many species that died out as the Earth's atmosphere changed and was no longer a good place for them to be. As humans, we have been lucky that all the changes have been ok for us and we've been able to adapt. IMO that is down to the random, not a creator.

In the Old Testament God seemed rather merciless to me and was something to be feared - if things weren't going his way he would wipe out the population and start afresh. Of course, that is just my interpretation of the Bible. I find it hard to swallow that when a bad thing happens to a good person it's 'taking one for the team' to make up for the bad things others do I can't bring myself to follow that way of thinking which seems to born of organised religion.

When I look into my son's eyes I am amazed at how nature works and that two microscopic elements have turned into a person who has his own personality. I created that, I nurture it and make it grow. Not God.

There may once have been a higher power of some form (whether that is God, Gods, Mother Nature, aliens etc) but I don't believe they are here anymore. There are just some things that no loving 'God' would let happen to their creations.

Having said that, I understand how faith can bring peace to people and if it works for you that's great. I don't think those beliefs should be pushed onto others and I certainly don't want anyone pitying me for believing that my body has more to do with creating a child than any God

 

[mrsthomas623]

Tbh I don't know why the OP posted this thread if they know it will cause debate and alot of upset, as I know if I lost a baby I couldn't believe in god and this thread would upset me, sorry if anyone disagrees x

I agree...this could cause alot of upset x

Just so everyone knows, I have lost a baby and I do not believe that it was God's fault. I'm a believer in God's will shall be done and when bad things happen I know that it's either one of two things, either thats how its supposed to happen in the grand scheme of things, or its the devil actions being manifested by a weak soul. Again....my opinion. I have had way too many good things happen in my life to NOT believe that there is a God out there and that he is the reason that I have the good things in my life that I have. I am a blessed woman, wife, and mom and I thank him everyday for it.

what the hell is this supposed to mean?!?

Oh goodness, Im gonna get ripped to shreds over this, but you asked and this is what i think that means:

it means that your faith is weak. thats why the devil is able to manipulate so easily because you don't have a strong foundation of faith to hold on to.

I think you are completely absurd and insulting.

 

[Tasha]

I have not read this all yet (will do it a moment), so sorry if I am repeating what any one has said.

I do not believe in a god, how can I when I carried my beautiful baby girl for 36 weeks and 6 days for her to be born sleeping? What can be the reason for that, or my seven miscarriages? It doesn't make me stronger, or a better person, it causes me pain every single day and bitterness, it makes life much harder than it should be and more difficult to continue with.

I simply can not understand how it is god that creates the good stuff (healthy baby's etc) and we are to be thankful for that, yet the negative stuff (baby's and children's death and so on) he plays no part in and we are not suppose to be angry at him. To me it is either or. If I accept there is a god and he brings beautiful healthy baby's then he also brings the misery of loss. If he doesnt bring the loss and sad things, then he doesnt bring the good.

That is not to say I dont want to believe, because I do, I think on days where that pain overwhelms me that some faith would perhaps help me to overcome it.

 

[Tasha]

Tbh I don't know why the OP posted this thread if they know it will cause debate and alot of upset, as I know if I lost a baby I couldn't believe in god and this thread would upset me, sorry if anyone disagrees x

I agree...this could cause alot of upset x

Just so everyone knows, I have lost a baby and I do not believe that it was God's fault. I'm a believer in God's will shall be done and when bad things happen I know that it's either one of two things, either thats how its supposed to happen in the grand scheme of things, or its the devil actions being manifested by a weak soul. Again....my opinion. I have had way too many good things happen in my life to NOT believe that there is a God out there and that he is the reason that I have the good things in my life that I have. I am a blessed woman, wife, and mom and I thank him everyday for it.

what the hell is this supposed to mean?!?

Oh goodness, Im gonna get ripped to shreds over this, but you asked and this is what i think that means:

it means that your faith is weak. thats why the devil is able to manipulate so easily because you don't have a strong foundation of faith to hold on to.

I think you are completely absurd and insulting.

I completely agree. I cant even find the post she done so am quoting everyone, but that is disgusting!!! So my baby is dead because I dont believe? Well that is a sick and fucked up line of thought. She is actually dead because of medical negligence, the science that created her, let her down.

Do you realise how damn offensive that is? I am actually in tears here, how dare someone blame bereaved parents for there loss? Sick!!!!

 

[leelee]

Tbh I don't know why the OP posted this thread if they know it will cause debate and alot of upset, as I know if I lost a baby I couldn't believe in god and this thread would upset me, sorry if anyone disagrees x

I agree...this could cause alot of upset x

Just so everyone knows, I have lost a baby and I do not believe that it was God's fault. I'm a believer in God's will shall be done and when bad things happen I know that it's either one of two things, either thats how its supposed to happen in the grand scheme of things, or its the devil actions being manifested by a weak soul. Again....my opinion. I have had way too many good things happen in my life to NOT believe that there is a God out there and that he is the reason that I have the good things in my life that I have. I am a blessed woman, wife, and mom and I thank him everyday for it.

what the hell is this supposed to mean?!?

Oh goodness, Im gonna get ripped to shreds over this, but you asked and this is what i think that means:

it means that your faith is weak. thats why the devil is able to manipulate so easily because you don't have a strong foundation of faith to hold on to.

I think you are completely absurd and insulting.

I completely agree. I cant even find the post she done so am quoting everyone, but that is disgusting!!! So my baby is dead because I dont believe? Well that is a sick and fucked up line of thought. She is actually dead because of medical negligence, the science that created her, let her down.

Do you realise how damn offensive that is? I am actually in tears here, how dare someone blame bereaved parents for there loss? Sick!!!!

Hope you are okay
xxx

 

[coccyx]

if being abusive and unkind to others is part of your 'faith' then you can stick.
i get along fine without believing in such nonsense. me and OH made our children. I had several miscarriages , not because i am an awful person but because of genetic problem, all expained by FACT and SCIENCE.

 

[Dopeyjopey]

tasha.

There are people that think that, but thankfully they are few (that i have come across anyway).

 

[Tasha]

I'm sorry but (possible offensive line coming up but cant think of a better way to word it after no sleep and 1 hour to induction) are you stupid?

How can you say you are not judging those that dont believe when your opening line is in big bold letters stating you cant believe how we cant believe and say you feel sorry for those that dont have faith?!

I truely dont have a problem with your faith or beliefs but I would NEVER judge you (which you HAVE done, intentionally or not) for them!!

I feel sorry for the people who don't see the same sentiment when they look at their children, that they dont see true miracles right in front of their faces. Not because people dont think the way I do. And I will say it again, I FEEL SORRY FOR ANYONE WHO DOESN'T THINK THAT THEIR CHILD IS AN ABSOLUTE MIRACLE! and yet I get called the rude one? And I never said anyone was stupid either...that is rude.

I think everyone here sees that miracle, every baby is a miracle but for different people that miracle comes from different places, for some nature, some god, some science, some from within us. As long as each of us love our baby's and realise just how lucky we are to have that baby, then surely it doesnt matter where or how people believe that little miracle was created?

 

[indy and lara]

Tasha, sending you hugs. These comments have upset me today and I know that they will have had the same impact on others in the same situation. We lost our children because of biology. It is hard enough to accept and live with without someone suggesting that somehow you have brought it upon yourself. Hope the rest of today is gentler Tasha.