Jehovah's Witnesses

[ShanandBoc]

Does make a pleasant change!! I like people who can put their beliefs across without being nasty/personal - we don't have to all have the same ideas or beliefs. What a boring world it would be if we all agreed.

ShanandBoc, you are now on my list of dream dinner party guests - I could argue with you for hours (in a nice way!).

haha Now if i wasnt on the other side of the earth from you, i may take u up on that offer!! x

 

[Midnight_Fairy]

Yes that is true. I would actually love to believe in god and heaven but I cant understand it all because of the science in my mind.

I also agree with pagan worship and astronomy and I wouldn't be able to give that up.

 

[madasa]

I wish I believed in something too. I really want to believe in God. My dad and his family are all devoted Catholics. I think I believe there is something. Or rather, I want to believe there is something. My life would be much more peaceful if I believed we were going to a better place, and that we were all being watched over. There are times in my life when I have prayed - but really only in times of dispair - maybe that makes me a hypocrite, I dont know. But I too have felt a very calming affect by talking to Him.

I can honestly say, this thread has shined a whole new light on the matter for me, and I will give it much thought in the future.

I've also prayed on times of despair, maybe it does make me a hypocrite!! Otoh, can you imagine being gid and having EVERYONE pray to you EVERY day? Far easier to answer prayers if those people only pray when they reLly need you???

 

[Aidan's Mummy]

I wish I believed in something too. I really want to believe in God. My dad and his family are all devoted Catholics. I think I believe there is something. Or rather, I want to believe there is something. My life would be much more peaceful if I believed we were going to a better place, and that we were all being watched over. There are times in my life when I have prayed - but really only in times of dispair - maybe that makes me a hypocrite, I dont know. But I too have felt a very calming affect by talking to Him.

I can honestly say, this thread has shined a whole new light on the matter for me, and I will give it much thought in the future.

I've also prayed on times of despair, maybe it does make me a hypocrite!! Otoh, can you imagine being gid and having EVERYONE pray to you EVERY day? Far easier to answer prayers if those people only pray when they reLly need you???

I've only began praying again since I have had some bible stuides

I pray for some ladies on here when their babies are at risk
I prayed a lot in the last few days

I pray when I need him. I also pray when I am scared. Like I the reall acount of the exorcist and how they were saying it actually happened. I couldn't seelp prayed and I felt a huge reilef wash over me and I slept
xx

 

[Eabha'sMum]

God is an invisible spirit being and lives obviously in heaven

In regards to how the population continued....

Gen. 5:3, 4: “Adam lived on for a hundred and thirty years. Then he became father to a son in his likeness, in his image, and called his name Seth. And the days of Adam after his fathering Seth came to be eight hundred years. Meanwhile he became father to sons and daughters.” (One of Adam’s sons was Cain, and one of Adam’s daughters must have become Cain’s wife. At that time in human history when humans still had outstanding physical health and vitality, as indicated by the length of their lives, the likelihood of passing on defects as a result of marrying a close relative was not great. After some 2,500 years of human history, however, when mankind’s physical condition had greatly deteriorated, Jehovah gave to Israel laws forbidding incest.)

so there has been a some sort of evolution, or really de-evolution of the human nature? a progression... easily equated to actual evolution?

Its not really a progreession, as we have come further and further away from perfection, Even with science and medical advances, there are more diseases etc and we still only live to around 90 if we are lucky.

Further from perfection... or just more adaptable to our enviroment?
Because this earth wouldn't be sustainable if people where living 7,000 odd years? It can bearly cope as is... and farther from perfection? The average age has decreased... from average 34 years in dark ages?

 

[Eternal]

Phew just read the entire thing! lol! Ended up being a bit if a ask a JW thing lol.

Back to the OP: Yes it can be annoying when people knock my door, but thats includes anyone from JW's, sale people and IN LAWS (the worse in my opioion lol). However, it only really annoys me if they keep pushing themselves on me, most JW's we have had round have been lovely and friendly.

My question: Do any of you beleive in anything before this life? or were we just created once we were born type of thing?

I have my own ideas on it, I am religious, a Christian, but wondered if anyone beleived in a before life? a pre-existance?

 

[aob1013]

I believe there was nothing before, and there will be nothing after.

 

[madasa]

I have no problem with them - our neighbours are JW and they are the loveliest people. They do not preach at us at all; I'm not sure but I think they have some unwritten code that they don't go to their neighbours. We do get JW come round sometimes but if I see it's them then I don't answer the door; if I answer without realising then I am polite but tell them I respect their beliefs but have my own which I am very devoted to. They don't make any big deal and they go on their way.

Everyone is entitled to their beliefs and while I think it's a bit OTT to take the word to people's doors, they are just doing what they are meant to do which is to actively spread the word. I prefer a JW to a flippin double glazing salesman! One time one tried to sell me a conservatory; I told him I have one and he still said he wanted to see if we would like a new, updated one!!! At least when you tell JWs you are not interested, they go.

BTW I am very science minded, but I am also a Christian (and I believe). I am one who sees no reason why both cannot exist in tandem. If you can say where the beginning of the beginning of the beginning of the beginning came from, you can tell me there is no force other than science. That's just my belief though.

I prefer jws to those charity people who want yr bank details :-/. We get those all the time and some are very pushy and I feel stingy and mean saying no... Last time it I cut him short and asked bluntly was he asking for money and if so how much and how often.
Him: "oh no we're not really asking for money!..."
Me: "you've got FUNDRAISER" written on your tshirt."
He laughed sheepishly and went away

Sorry. Back to topic!

 

[Midnight_Fairy]

Phew just read the entire thing! lol! Ended up being a bit if a ask a JW thing lol.

Back to the OP: Yes it can be annoying when people knock my door, but thats includes anyone from JW's, sale people and IN LAWS (the worse in my opioion lol). However, it only really annoys me if they keep pushing themselves on me, most JW's we have had round have been lovely and friendly.

My question: Do any of you beleive in anything before this life? or were we just created once we were born type of thing?

I have my own ideas on it, I am religious, a Christian, but wondered if anyone beleived in a before life? a pre-existance?

I believe in re-incarnation x

 

[Gonnabeamomma]

I believe in nothing before or after... maybe a resurrection as was mentioned before on here but I wouldn't want to live in heaven... I practically have a panic attack moving across the city much less leaving the planet! LOL!

 

[andbabymakes3]

Contrary to what I have been arguing, I do believe there is 'something' out there. Whether that is mother nature, God, or some other greater force, I do believe somthing/someone is there. Just can't reconcile it with any organised religion. IF there is a God, why do people die young? No amount of passages in the bible will make me think that is ok. IF there is a God, I don't believe for a second that he/she/it would be vengeful, nor inflict pain and suffering on innocents.

 

[Blue_bumpkin]

Some people seem to be giving ShanandBoc a bit of a hard time; She has been asked dozens of questions, all of which she has answered fully, and politely. I for one am finding it very interesting, despite not being religious.

Can I ask, regarding Adam and Eve; does their existance mean that JW's dont believe we evolved from ape's, but only Adam and Eve? And if so, was there a world before humans were around? Dinosoars etc? Why was there such a long time before humans were on the planet?

Sorry if Im being stupid

Since Christian and JW's believe the same about creation I believe I can answer is, but I apologize if it's not right with JW's teachings. Man was created in God's image, we were never Apes and JW's do not believe in the theory of evolution, in fact by the end of Darwin's life he renounced the theory as well
Genesis 1:27 "So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created him."
There was a world before humans were created:
Genesis 1:1 "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Now the earth was formless and empty..."
Humans were created on the last day so there was a 7 day gap between the creation of the earth and all of it's entirety and when humans were created.

Thanks for that. So what about dinosoars/cavemen, things like that. Is it believed that they existed? I have a feeling I am being stupid lol

Oh you are not being stupid at all!!! I'm very inquisitive so I'm always wanting to know the why's and how's of everything

There is scientific proof that dinosaurs existed and I don't know any Christian who would dispute the fact that they were once here, but as with many animals they feel extinct at some point in time for an unknown reason.
For the cavemen, man started somewhere. When God created man they were at a primal state. As to them being as they pictured in movies, books etc. as long haired, un shaven men running around in animal skins beating their chests and banging on rocks etc. I'm not so sure lol

Thankyou Its all very confusing. I wonder if the "first" humans (cavemen) believed in any God. I know it would not have been to the depths that people believe now, but I would guess that they worshipped something.

I was always taught that the story of Adam and Eve was a parable and not meant to be taken literally?

 

[Gonnabeamomma]

My understanding is that all of the Bible was written so that no matter where we are or at what time frame we are in our lives, it guides us and gives us practical solutions to anything that affects us. All of the people and events mentioned literally happened or are a prophecy yet to happen. A study of the event and reading all details regarding it reveals whether it happened or is a prophecy that will happen.
The rest of my comments come from sincerely wanting to know what you think:
I have a question regarding the evolution thread from earlier... in the creation theory a rainbow is a reminder of God's promise to never allow a global flood to cover the earth again. How does evolution explain the rainbow... what use has science found for rainbows other than how they occur?
Something else I wondered regarding evolution and agnostics... the earth, according to the creation account, was to be filled with humans through procreation... if you don't believe in creation, why procreate? And is it possible that babies that are born deformed aren't deformed at all... they are in between evolutionary stages? Finally, marriage was created by God... if you don't believe in God or creation and you're an agnostic... why get married?
I am so very intrigued about all the things I've read in this thread and honestly... it has only created more questions. I am so curious about how your belief system shapes the way you think and believe... this is the most interesting discussion I've encountered in a long time!

 

[Midnight_Fairy]

Contrary to what I have been arguing, I do believe there is 'something' out there. Whether that is mother nature, God, or some other greater force, I do believe somthing/someone is there. Just can't reconcile it with any organised religion. IF there is a God, why do people die young? No amount of passages in the bible will make me think that is ok. IF there is a God, I don't believe for a second that he/she/it would be vengeful, nor inflict pain and suffering on innocents.

Yeah I agree. x

 

[flubdub]

My understanding is that all of the Bible was written so that no matter where we are or at what time frame we are in our lives, it guides us and gives us practical solutions to anything that affects us. All of the people and events mentioned literally happened or are a prophecy yet to happen. A study of the event and reading all details regarding it reveals whether it happened or is a prophecy that will happen.
The rest of my comments come from sincerely wanting to know what you think:
I have a question regarding the evolution thread from earlier... in the creation theory a rainbow is a reminder of God's promise to never allow a global flood to cover the earth again. How does evolution explain the rainbow... what use has science found for rainbows other than how they occur?
Something else I wondered regarding evolution and agnostics... the earth, according to the creation account, was to be filled with humans through procreation... if you don't believe in creation, why procreate? And is it possible that babies that are born deformed aren't deformed at all... they are in between evolutionary stages? Finally, marriage was created by God... if you don't believe in God or creation and you're an agnostic... why get married?
I am so very intrigued about all the things I've read in this thread and honestly... it has only created more questions. I am so curious about how your belief system shapes the way you think and believe... this is the most interesting discussion I've encountered in a long time!

Interesting idea x

 

[Lara310809]

^ Interesting seeing as witnesses dont believe in hell fire or that the majority of people go to heaven, it earth that was designed for humans to live on forever, the original purpose back in the garden of Eden.

From what u said it may not have been a JW who spoke to your mum

Besides divorce is acceptable according to the bible if adultery is involved.

We cannot say who will be saved or who will not, thats up to God to judge, but those who havent come to an accurate knowledge, either living or dead will be given the chance to do so, before they are judged.

perhaps it wasn't a JW after all, but that's what I remember from my mum telling me about it. Or perhaps she was a JW that had weird ideas about things, I'm not sure. I wasn't trying to have a go, since it was only that one woman that said those things; haven't had any problems with any other JWs

 

[madasa]

Love the rainbow thing, really got me thinking! But it's just an effect: if you do thus and this you get this. Mo different really to: if you add this chemical to this one it goes bang and you get a shower of pretty coloured sparks... Lots of things are aesthetically pleasing or colourful without there being evolutionary benefit. Sunsets for example.

 

[Lara310809]

I think jesus and Santa are as fictional as each other. But live and let live I say. My SIL is a JW and so are my nephews and nieces, love them lots and we get on so well considering our different views on religion. We in fact agree on lots of 'ethical' issues and values

I think that religion is fantastic for those that follow it, and apply it to their lives. My parents were raised Catholic and Church of England, but neither believed, so I was raised with knowledge of religion, and told that whatever I chose for my life was fine by them.

I chose to be an atheist, but at the same time I celebrate Christmas (by spending time with family and givign gifts), Easter (by eating a chocolate egg), because that's what I have been brought up to do. If you think about it, it's very "have your cake and eat it too", and I'm the first to admit that. I don't want to offend anyone here - I'm not the type of person that wants to be able to believe; I'm very happy not believing in anything. I'm very scientific, and unless it's there in front of me, it doesn't exist. I'm not content in moulding my entire life around something that might exist. If I've been a good person, then that's good enough for me. I don't want to feel that my life is immoral and I should change things to be a better person, because I'm already a good person, and I believe in having total freedom and doing what you want to do. With basic things like sex before marriage; I honestly don't see a problem, because animals don't get married and they mate; would they be frowned upon? Esentially we are all animals Just my take on it

TBH so many laws follow the general idea of the 10 commandments anyway, and the Bible teaches us the "good" way to live, so I think it shapes people to be considerate, respectful and kind, so in that respect it's good.

I just don't like it when people take their religion and twist it to be hateful, believing that they are being "just", e.g. Al Quaida. That is the only time I can't stomach religion, but that is a tiny percentage of all religious people.

Oh and thanks to Shanandboc for all the responses you've given in this thread. I don't know much about JWs (or any religion TBH) so it's nice to understand a little more

 

[ShanandBoc]

God is an invisible spirit being and lives obviously in heaven

In regards to how the population continued....

Gen. 5:3, 4: “Adam lived on for a hundred and thirty years. Then he became father to a son in his likeness, in his image, and called his name Seth. And the days of Adam after his fathering Seth came to be eight hundred years. Meanwhile he became father to sons and daughters.” (One of Adam’s sons was Cain, and one of Adam’s daughters must have become Cain’s wife. At that time in human history when humans still had outstanding physical health and vitality, as indicated by the length of their lives, the likelihood of passing on defects as a result of marrying a close relative was not great. After some 2,500 years of human history, however, when mankind’s physical condition had greatly deteriorated, Jehovah gave to Israel laws forbidding incest.)

so there has been a some sort of evolution, or really de-evolution of the human nature? a progression... easily equated to actual evolution?

Its not really a progreession, as we have come further and further away from perfection, Even with science and medical advances, there are more diseases etc and we still only live to around 90 if we are lucky.

Further from perfection... or just more adaptable to our enviroment?
Because this earth wouldn't be sustainable if people where living 7,000 odd years? It can bearly cope as is... and farther from perfection? The average age has decreased... from average 34 years in dark ages?

Hi, i see what you are saying but consider this, the only reason we live until 80 or 90 now if we are lucky are due to medical advances, and there still are alot of people dying in their prime, esp with diseases such as cancer etc. New diseases have cropped up , alot of which are from our mis management of the earth (pollution etc) and chemicals in foods, drugs alcohol, and some medical treatmenst themselves cause other side effects and problems.

The only reason the earth isnt sustainable now, is because

a) Its further away from its perfect, natural state

b) We as humans dont manage the resources correctly and live in harmony with nature, With the creators guidance, the earth would be sustainable forever. Its just that we dont know what we are really doing, we can see these effects on the planet eveywhere, we have also messed up its natural cycles of seasons etc.. And our modern lifestyles puts alot of strain on these resources too

 

[ShanandBoc]

Contrary to what I have been arguing, I do believe there is 'something' out there. Whether that is mother nature, God, or some other greater force, I do believe somthing/someone is there. Just can't reconcile it with any organised religion. IF there is a God, why do people die young? No amount of passages in the bible will make me think that is ok. IF there is a God, I don't believe for a second that he/she/it would be vengeful, nor inflict pain and suffering on innocents.

Your questions are fair enough, but you have to look at the big picture of the bible. We are only looking at the here and now, but if these people that die young, are to ressurected when God steps in and takes control of the mess of a world we are in today, they will have the prospect of living forever, which more than makes up for any suffering experienced in this current system. Remember the bible tells us that this was his original purpose for humans. Why do you think none of us want to die? Why we find death so hard to understand and cope with? Its the opposite of everything that seems natural to us, i mean could you think of anything worse than loosing a loved one in death. We were never meant to die.

Funnily enough scientists cannot explain why we grow old and die, up to a certain point our cells keep renewing themselves, and scientists agree that they cant understand why our cells dont keep on doing this forever? As it seems this is what they should be doing.

The main message of the bible is Gods coming kingdom, him once and for all fulfillin his original purpose for humans and our amazing planet. It has been created for us to enjoy to the full, but how many of us actually really get to do this. How many of us get to travel the world, explore lands, natural wonders, see and touch all the animals, spend quality time with our loved ones?

This is why the bible refers to whats coming as 'the real life'. It what we all want as humans and more. And it also says that its the only hope for mankind