Polygamy/Polyandry

[summer rain]

I know quite a few Muslim ladies who have been left very lonely and friendless because their husband has another wife-which is sad. I know some Muslim women who want to be in a polygamous marriage but their family says no and they end up never getting married to anyone.

I don't actually think polyandry is natural for humans, I don't think most women are naturally that way inclined and when it comes to having children there are issues of paternity etc that would cause problems.

That's really interesting ... my understanding of Polygamy and Islam was that a man should only take another wife (or multiple other wives) if he could commit to treating them equally in all aspects (financial/time/emotionally etc).

I don't have strong opinions about Polygamy to be honest - part of me quite likes the idea of having 'Sister Wives' to share out all those irritating male traits

Polyandry? ... Why?, Why on earth would you want to have more than one overgrown child to pander to? Dear God! One is more than enough surely

Yes this is correct, but unfortunately some Muslim women are very anti-polygamy and say that it is virtually 'haram' (i.e. forbidden) because no man can treat all his wives equally and consequently Muslim women who are married in a polygamous marriage get treated very badly by people they thought to be their friends. xx

 

[NicoleLJ]

Being an ex-mormon for me it has to do with it being the full choice of all involved and all are of age to understand. In the mormon culture it was brought in because Smith was a pedifile and also could not be faithful. He had many wives, some even under 15yrs of age. He coerced most into it by promising them that they were garenteed to get to the top degree of glory and all their family would in exchange they had to marry him and give him sexual favours. It was and is sick. Most people in the religion are taught that Joshep only had one wife and to do research to find out otherwise is giving in to the devil. There are legal records showing proof of all the marriages and the ages of the girls along with the fact that many were still married to other men that were alive. The cover up the church did to hide this sick fact is amazing. To me it is an abuse of power. Then they changed the facts to try and make polygamy ok. Lieing and saying so many men died to cross the plains that men married multiple wives so someone could take care of those left behind. Records show that the divide in the sexs was not that upset with the crossing. That many women left without husbands never did get married agian and so on. In the mormon church it was brought about because of one sick sick man who used it to control and manipulate.

In that capacity I am totally agianst it. If it is 3 consenting adults, who are not being coerced and know what they are getting into then all power to them. It is their choice. But if a person is underage, someone using religion to coerce them into it or so on then it is WRONG in every sense of the word. That is my two cents.

 

[summer rain]

Being an ex-mormon for me it has to do with it being the full choice of all involved and all are of age to understand. In the mormon culture it was brought in because Smith was a pedifile and also could not be faithful. He had many wives, some even under 15yrs of age. He coerced most into it by promising them that they were garenteed to get to the top degree of glory and all their family would in exchange they had to marry him and give him sexual favours. It was and is sick. Most people in the religion are taught that Joshep only had one wife and to do research to find out otherwise is giving in to the devil. There are legal records showing proof of all the marriages and the ages of the girls along with the fact that many were still married to other men that were alive. The cover up the church did to hide this sick fact is amazing. To me it is an abuse of power. Then they changed the facts to try and make polygamy ok. Lieing and saying so many men died to cross the plains that men married multiple wives so someone could take care of those left behind. Records show that the divide in the sexs was not that upset with the crossing. That many women left without husbands never did get married agian and so on. In the mormon church it was brought about because of one sick sick man who used it to control and manipulate.

In that capacity I am totally agianst it. If it is 3 consenting adults, who are not being coerced and know what they are getting into then all power to them. It is their choice. But if a person is underage, someone using religion to coerce them into it or so on then it is WRONG in every sense of the word. That is my two cents.

I think anyone would agree with this. About mormon and mormon-offshoot polygamy historically I read a really fascinating book I got from Amazon about this; its a little out of date as it was written in the late 80s or early 90s so doesn't have about the recent issues with FLDS etc but the info about the early mormon churches practice of polygamy is absolutely gripping reading.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mormon-Pol...4796/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1331842799&sr=8-1

When I bought it a glitch on amazon made it £1 so it was a cheap fascinating read too xx

 

[tina3747]

I know quite a few Muslim ladies who have been left very lonely and friendless because their husband has another wife-which is sad. I know some Muslim women who want to be in a polygamous marriage but their family says no and they end up never getting married to anyone.

I don't actually think polyandry is natural for humans, I don't think most women are naturally that way inclined and when it comes to having children there are issues of paternity etc that would cause problems.

That's really interesting ... my understanding of Polygamy and Islam was that a man should only take another wife (or multiple other wives) if he could commit to treating them equally in all aspects (financial/time/emotionally etc).

I don't have strong opinions about Polygamy to be honest - part of me quite likes the idea of having 'Sister Wives' to share out all those irritating male traits

Polyandry? ... Why?, Why on earth would you want to have more than one overgrown child to pander to? Dear God! One is more than enough surely

Yes this is correct, but unfortunately some Muslim women are very anti-polygamy and say that it is virtually 'haram' (i.e. forbidden) because no man can treat all his wives equally and consequently Muslim women who are married in a polygamous marriage get treated very badly by people they thought to be their friends. xx

I'm sure I read or saw a tv programme somewhere about polygamy in Islam was bought in to stop prostitution and adultery, basically they're 'allowed to have sex with more than one person because they are married? Is that true? Can't remember where I heard or saw it?

 

[NicoleLJ]

I think anyone would agree with this. About mormon and mormon-offshoot polygamy historically I read a really fascinating book I got from Amazon about this; its a little out of date as it was written in the late 80s or early 90s so doesn't have about the recent issues with FLDS etc but the info about the early mormon churches practice of polygamy is absolutely gripping reading.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mormon-Pol...4796/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1331842799&sr=8-1

When I bought it a glitch on amazon made it £1 so it was a cheap fascinating read too xx

At first looking at the link I thought it was going to be another book that put Smith on a pedastal and not reporting the truth about his wives. Then when I read the comments I see that it is mentioned. So now I am intregied. Defiantely will look into it. I walked from the Mormon faith when I became uncomfortable with their treatment and hatred towards gays. Then I learned about Smiths true history and realized that the church was built by a liar. And if he was dishonest in such HUGE issues and got so many to cover up for him and abused his power then there was no way this religion was true in any sense of the word. The more I learned about him the more sickened I am. And the church still works to cover it all up to the point that the majority of it;s own members do not know. Thanks for pointing the book out to me.

 

[summer rain]

Hi hun, no it definitely isn't a book biased towards the mormon church; its an academic book so quite a heavy read at times and with a dry writing style, but very intriguing and references everything that it says xx

 

[summer rain]

I know quite a few Muslim ladies who have been left very lonely and friendless because their husband has another wife-which is sad. I know some Muslim women who want to be in a polygamous marriage but their family says no and they end up never getting married to anyone.

I don't actually think polyandry is natural for humans, I don't think most women are naturally that way inclined and when it comes to having children there are issues of paternity etc that would cause problems.

That's really interesting ... my understanding of Polygamy and Islam was that a man should only take another wife (or multiple other wives) if he could commit to treating them equally in all aspects (financial/time/emotionally etc).

I don't have strong opinions about Polygamy to be honest - part of me quite likes the idea of having 'Sister Wives' to share out all those irritating male traits

Polyandry? ... Why?, Why on earth would you want to have more than one overgrown child to pander to? Dear God! One is more than enough surely

Yes this is correct, but unfortunately some Muslim women are very anti-polygamy and say that it is virtually 'haram' (i.e. forbidden) because no man can treat all his wives equally and consequently Muslim women who are married in a polygamous marriage get treated very badly by people they thought to be their friends. xx

I'm sure I read or saw a tv programme somewhere about polygamy in Islam was bought in to stop prostitution and adultery, basically they're 'allowed to have sex with more than one person because they are married? Is that true? Can't remember where I heard or saw it?

I don't know, but that definitely isn't true. Polygamy is allowed in all monotheistic religions and in some other religions also, some Christians try to claim that it isn't allowed in Christianity as the new testament, particularly the epistles, talk in a grammatical sense of one man and one woman becoming 'one flesh' but there is nothing specific to say that it is no longer allowed for Christians. There are some small, non-Mormon churches in the US and some other countries that are polygamous and in countries where polygamy is common you do find a lot of Christians who practice it as well. Martin Luther, the famous protestant reformer said there was nothing in Christianity against marrying more than one wife and predicted his future followers to be polygamous. Since Islam is merely a continuation of the Judeo-Christian message, then polygamy is permitted in Islam provided certain conditions are met, and that is all there is to it. Islam didn't invent anything new with polygamy because both in the religions of those living in Arabia at the time and the culture that existed in that society, polygamy was already the norm but it was rampant uncontrolled polygamy where some men had hundreds of wives and a man could kidnap a lady and say she was his wife, or she could just start living with him and so on and so forth. Islam restricted the maximum number of wives to 4 and set strict conditions on the woman having to give her active consent, the husband having to provide for her, etc etc.

The programme you saw or article you read may have been talking about mut'a which is a shia practice of temporary marriage, which can be polygamous and the usual limits on the number of wives do not apply, also the marriage can last for as little as 6 hours according to some shia scholars and this is the legal position in Iran-other shia scholars say it has to be for a minimum of 3 months. In some countries, such as Iran it is used by prostitutes to legitimise their trade. This type of marriage existed before Islam and in the early days of Islam when more pressing matters of teaching monotheism and the core beliefs of Islam were paramount, it was allowed to continue, similar to drinking alcohol, but then was outlawed by The Prophet Muhammed Salalaahu Alaihi Was Sallam forever. Shias do not accept that it was outlawed as they don't believe the narration in which it was outlawed was valid, and believe a later Islamic leader outlawed it. Shias are the minority group in Islam. xx

 

[tina3747]

I know quite a few Muslim ladies who have been left very lonely and friendless because their husband has another wife-which is sad. I know some Muslim women who want to be in a polygamous marriage but their family says no and they end up never getting married to anyone.

I don't actually think polyandry is natural for humans, I don't think most women are naturally that way inclined and when it comes to having children there are issues of paternity etc that would cause problems.

That's really interesting ... my understanding of Polygamy and Islam was that a man should only take another wife (or multiple other wives) if he could commit to treating them equally in all aspects (financial/time/emotionally etc).

I don't have strong opinions about Polygamy to be honest - part of me quite likes the idea of having 'Sister Wives' to share out all those irritating male traits

Polyandry? ... Why?, Why on earth would you want to have more than one overgrown child to pander to? Dear God! One is more than enough surely

Yes this is correct, but unfortunately some Muslim women are very anti-polygamy and say that it is virtually 'haram' (i.e. forbidden) because no man can treat all his wives equally and consequently Muslim women who are married in a polygamous marriage get treated very badly by people they thought to be their friends. xx

I'm sure I read or saw a tv programme somewhere about polygamy in Islam was bought in to stop prostitution and adultery, basically they're 'allowed to have sex with more than one person because they are married? Is that true? Can't remember where I heard or saw it?

I don't know, but that definitely isn't true. Polygamy is allowed in all monotheistic religions and in some other religions also, some Christians try to claim that it isn't allowed in Christianity as the new testament, particularly the epistles, talk in a grammatical sense of one man and one woman becoming 'one flesh' but there is nothing specific to say that it is no longer allowed for Christians. There are some small, non-Mormon churches in the US and some other countries that are polygamous and in countries where polygamy is common you do find a lot of Christians who practice it as well. Martin Luther, the famous protestant reformer said there was nothing in Christianity against marrying more than one wife and predicted his future followers to be polygamous. Since Islam is merely a continuation of the Judeo-Christian message, then polygamy is permitted in Islam provided certain conditions are met, and that is all there is to it. Islam didn't invent anything new with polygamy because both in the religions of those living in Arabia at the time and the culture that existed in that society, polygamy was already the norm but it was rampant uncontrolled polygamy where some men had hundreds of wives and a man could kidnap a lady and say she was his wife, or she could just start living with him and so on and so forth. Islam restricted the maximum number of wives to 4 and set strict conditions on the woman having to give her active consent, the husband having to provide for her, etc etc.

The programme you saw or article you read may have been talking about mut'a which is a shia practice of temporary marriage, which can be polygamous and the usual limits on the number of wives do not apply, also the marriage can last for as little as 6 hours according to some shia scholars and this is the legal position in Iran-other shia scholars say it has to be for a minimum of 3 months. In some countries, such as Iran it is used by prostitutes to legitimise their trade. This type of marriage existed before Islam and in the early days of Islam when more pressing matters of teaching monotheism and the core beliefs of Islam were paramount, it was allowed to continue, similar to drinking alcohol, but then was outlawed by The Prophet Muhammed Salalaahu Alaihi Was Sallam forever. Shias do not accept that it was outlawed as they don't believe the narration in which it was outlawed was valid, and believe a later Islamic leader outlawed it. Shias are the minority group in Islam. xx

All mandates of the religion of Islam are from God, the Wise, and thus one deduces that all things which are permitted are due to the fact that their benefit to the self and society outweighs their harms. *When one analyzes the reasons and results of the allowance of polygamy, it will be found that indeed the rulings of the religion of Islam are truly those which suits all times and places, as their source is God Almighty, the Wise and the Knowledgeable.

As the Quran indicates (4:3), the issue of polygamy in Islam is understood in the light of community obligations towards orphans and widows.* Islam, as a universal religion that is suitable for all times and places, can not ignore these compelling obligations.

Islamic polygamy addresses the social problems of prostitution and extramarital affairs common in the West.* Instead of cheating - infidelity is one of the top reasons for divorce in the West - Islam allows a man to marry more than one wife, with full recognition of the rights of both of them.* The basic principle in Islam is that men are held responsible for their behavior towards women just as women are responsible for their behavior towards men.



I searched good old goggle and found this!!
I'm sure it was a tv programme I saw it, sucker for the religious programmes as you know ! But was kind of along the lines of what I was saying, maybe slightly different!

 

[summer rain]

Thats an opinion piece from an article that references the Qur'an in one place but it isn't from Islamic scripture-you get articles written by Christians and Jews that don't necessarily reflect the views of all Christians and Jews and the same goes for Muslims. It is unfortunately true that in divorces in the UK and US, adultery is one of the 'top' causes given on the divorce petition; but this is not why polygamy is permitted in Islam because this was not a concern 1400 years ago what was on divorce petitions etc in the west or anywhere else, and like I said polygamy wasn't anything new because it was widespread in all societies at that time. Islam just added very strict rules to its practice. If a man isn't able to provide for two (or more!) wives equally then he should not be marrying more than one.

 

[tina3747]

Imagine all the wives syncing PMT..... They probably don't think about that before marrying that many women!

 

[tina3747]

Thats an opinion piece from an article that references the Qur'an in one place but it isn't from Islamic scripture-you get articles written by Christians and Jews that don't necessarily reflect the views of all Christians and Jews and the same goes for Muslims. It is unfortunately true that in divorces in the UK and US, adultery is one of the 'top' causes given on the divorce petition; but this is not why polygamy is permitted in Islam because this was not a concern 1400 years ago what was on divorce petitions etc in the west or anywhere else, and like I said polygamy wasn't anything new because it was widespread in all societies at that time. Islam just added very strict rules to its practice. If a man isn't able to provide for two (or more!) wives equally then he should not be marrying more than one.

I do think it's an unnatural expectation to be with one person for the rest of your lives. Your lucky if you find that 'soulmate' and are completely happy in your marriage your whole lives but people change, not everyone stays the same forever, people want more out of there lives now so are less happy to stay in a marriage that doesn't suit. I can see where polygamy can fit for certain families, your sharing your life with more than one person so less chance of it going stale... Saying that I can also see the downsides, from the programmes I've watched the women seem very robotic in saying that they are happy but I've Los seen where they say jealousy is there and jealousy breeds in my opinion, it only ever gets worse. And I'm pretty sure every polygamous man will have his favourite, it's only natural!!

 

[summer rain]

Islam accepts that in his heart of hearts, a man may well have a favourite, but he has to make sure he doesn't treat his wives unfairly or let them see that he has a favourite from amongst them, if he shows favouritism or gives one of his wives more financially than another then on the day of judgement it is said in hadiths he will come with one side of his body dragging down onto the floor. I think different women have different levels of jealousy, if a woman knows herself to be a very jealous person then she should not consider entering into a polygamous marriage, it isn't an obligation to do so for any woman and unlike some other religions polygamy isn't a principle of the faith necessary for salvation. However some women dearly love their husband but are not jealous by nature xx

 

[Quackquack99]

Islam accepts that in his heart of hearts, a man may well have a favourite, but he has to make sure he doesn't treat his wives unfairly or let them see that he has a favourite from amongst them, if he shows favouritism or gives one of his wives more financially than another then on the day of judgement it is said in hadiths he will come with one side of his body dragging down onto the floor. I think different women have different levels of jealousy, if a woman knows herself to be a very jealous person then she should not consider entering into a polygamous marriage, it isn't an obligation to do so for any woman and unlike some other religions polygamy isn't a principle of the faith necessary for salvation. However some women dearly love their husband but are not jealous by nature xx

I've read that a man has to ask for permission to marry from his wife. Is there any truth to this x

 

[summer rain]

It depends; the majority of scholars say no he doesn't have to ask for permission from his first wife, but a minority say yes he does have to. Some scholars say that when marrying to begin with, the first wife can stipulate in her marriage contract that if he does marry another lady, then its an automatic divorce. Personally I chose not to do this because even if my husband married another lady; it would not bother me to the extent of throwing away our marriage of so many years. Even those scholars who say no he doesn't need the first wife's permission and that it isn't allowed to make this stipulation in the marriage contract, say that he should be honest with his first wife and tell her he has married someone else or that he is looking to marry someone else; because to not tell her would naturally involve lying at some point (where are you going honey? um to see my friend dave), which as well as creating serious trust issues that would understandably wreck a marriage, and of course it is completely forbidden in such circumstances to lie to your spouse. There are some women who say they'd rather their husband married in secret than married with their knowledge, particularly women from some Arab cultures. xx

 

[Midnight_Fairy]

In the book -"growing up Bin Laden" - Interesting read btw. He did ask his wife about marrying again.

Hope you dont mind me commenting as I know how he turnt out but about the religion side I did learn alot!

 

[Eve]

I think if they want to do it, go for it. If it isn't hurting anyone I don't care I love the show sister wives, but haven't watched in a while... maybe they aren't even on anymore for all I know lol...

 

[Midnight_Fairy]

I used to love Sister Wives but Robin wound me up!

 

[Eve]

Yeah, she wasn't my fav. I haven't watched in a while but I did love when she gave birth. So peaceful and the love in that family was so strong. It made me cry... lots!

 

[Midnight_Fairy]

I have not seen the last one

 

[Eve]

It was lovely.