Rant - Feeling so hopeless about sleep!

[cmarie33]

OH! And Charlotte's daycare buddy's mom, who I have become friends with, was complaining about how tired she was because she had to get up last night and pump. Her daughter STTN without a peep for months. I wanted to smack her, although I like her very much and would never do that Some people don't know how good they've got it. Cue world's smallest violen.

I have a friend who's lo has sttn since she was 6 weeks old. We're talking 6pm-9am! I have never been so jealous! I regularly say to lo 'Chloe has been asleep for X hours now!' I'm sure she grins when I say it!

 

[polaris]

It really is all relative with sleep isn't it? I remember when Thomas was waking at 5.30 without fail and the very odd morning that he would sleep until 6 a.m. it would feel like a lie-in! I mean, seriously, who ever knew that 6 a.m. could ever feel like a lie-in??

Sorry that Charlotte had a disturbed night too, I do know that feeling of just having had enough of trying unsuccessfully to soothe them when nothing seems to help at all. It's always such a relief when they do finally go to sleep in those situations!!

Clara is still asleep (2.10 p.m.) so I am going to follow Noelle's advice and go for a very early bedtime. Fingers crossed!

Does anyone on this thread have older kids? Reading another thread in baby club about routines got me thinking - I really wanted to be "go with the flow" with Clara because I had to stick to such a strict routine with Thomas, I really had no choice because he would just go into melt-down. And even though having a routine really worked for him, I really hoped that I could be more flexible with number two. With Clara, she doesn't get cranky when she's tired/over-tired, she's still her usual happy cheerful smily self, and it makes it so much easier to keep her up just a little bit too long or to feel like she's OK just having 20 minute naps here and there, so at first I thought that the more flexible approach was working. But now I feel like trying to be flexible and not have a strict routine ended up totally backfiring for Clara and her overall sleep really suffered as a result. I guess it doesn't help that even as a newborn she would never sleep for long in the pram or car-seat. So now I am back to being rigid about protecting her sleep and this takes precedence at the moment over getting out and about with my toddler. Don't get me wrong, he still gets out, but it's more limited because we work around Clara's naps for the moment. This stage won't last forever. Am I being a control freak? I just feel that her need for good quality sleep has to take priority right now.

 

[Boo44]

Sorry to hear of some unsettled nights! We'd had a run of later morning recently, even some 7am's which is just amazing! I think he's getting ill now though He woke us up coughing inbetween 4-5am last night. Poor thing wasn't awake but his coughing kept us up! He's coughed on-and-off today and I've put him to bed and he's fallen straight to sleep but I can already hear coughing through the monitor! So am preparing myself for a disturbed night again... Poor thing really suffers when he gets a cough as he always ends up wheezy too!

 

[Noelle610]

Poor Jack

 

[seaweed eater]

I've had facebook friends complain about having to get up to pump, too! ARGH!! Do you know how excited I am when I have to pump at night? That means LO is sleeping well, I woke up on my own instead of being woken (always more refreshing), AND I'm ahead on pumping for the day.

Boo, I hope Jack feels better soon! Mine has had a bit of a sore throat and started sniffling this morning so I'm afraid we're heading into another cold too...bracing myself!

Polaris, it doesn't sound to me like you're being a control freak at all. Keeping Clara on track with sleep is definitely important.

We had a really good night in the crib!!! Good by any standards. And no 45-minute waking in the evening, either. I was the nap master yesterday (2 normal length naps and 3 short ones: two in the car and one wake-to-sleep fail) so I think that really helped. Not holding my breath for it to happen again, especially with the possible cold, but it's very reassuring to know that we still have a good "normal" to go back to.

 

[Smile181c]

can i join pretty please? i'm so tired...

 

[Noelle610]

can i join pretty please? i'm so tired...

Of course! Come on in :wave:

Oh, and sorry you are here.

 

[VikkiD]

Daniel didnt sleep very well last night he started getting restless at 10:45 an wouldn't settle till I fed him at 12:40 up again moaning at 4:40 moaning on an off till 6 I think I might need to try a little earlier bedtime

 

[cmarie33]

We had a better night last night M went to be at 8, woke at 11 so I fed her then didn't hear a peep til 6.30! Big improvement on the 4-5 wakings!

 

[NotNic]

Well I think having a weekend off from having me hover over him may have made some small changes. The last three mornings have been later wake ups - after 6.30am and we can leave him to play until closer to 7am. He is attempting two naps. And we have had two STTNs. It has been a good few weeks since we had one of those.

 

[charlie15]

Can I just ask is there a limit that you give to your LO's nap length? The naps at home in Sophia's cot are going really well in the mornings, so thank you so much for the great advice to get going with that. She is now napping relatively easily for her morning nap 2 hours after waking. Yesterday at 1 and a half hours I went in and turned the white noise down and opened the black out blinds to encourage her to wake up. Is that about the right maximum time for a nap or longer? The naps during the rest of the day are still hit and miss still but I'm happy to focus on getting the morning nap a regular habit for the moment.

 

[Noelle610]

Charlotte slept great last night! Thought we were in for a terrible night. She had a hard time falling asleep... She "understands" now that if she throws her blakey and paci out of the crib and screams that mommy will come rescue her and she thinks it's hilarious. So we did that routine for 30 minutes. THEN she was up after just 30 minutes crying! I gave her her pacifier and she went straight back to sleep. And then proceeded to sleep the rest of the night until 6am.

Except my husband left for Vegas on business today and woke me at 4am, ugh!

 

[Smile181c]

max went down at 7, was awake by the time i got home from work at about 8 ish then didnt go back down til 9. woke up several times in the evening, then slept in our bed. woke at 1.30 for a feed and 5.45 then slept on my chest til 8.30ish "/

 

[bananaz]

Can I just ask is there a limit that you give to your LO's nap length? The naps at home in Sophia's cot are going really well in the mornings, so thank you so much for the great advice to get going with that. She is now napping relatively easily for her morning nap 2 hours after waking. Yesterday at 1 and a half hours I went in and turned the white noise down and opened the black out blinds to encourage her to wake up. Is that about the right maximum time for a nap or longer? The naps during the rest of the day are still hit and miss still but I'm happy to focus on getting the morning nap a regular habit for the moment.

Glad to hear things are improving! The morning nap does tend to stabilize first, or at least it did for my LO. About waking from naps, the guideline I've heard is to limit each nap to 2 hours and then aim for no more than 3.5-4 hours total sleep during the day at that age. Noelle might be able to give you more info, I've sadly never had the problem of a baby napping too long

 

[bananaz]

Noelle - Haha, well I'm sorry she gave you trouble at the beginning of the night but yay for sleeping through! Elsie also throws her stuff out of the crib but thankfully she does it when she gets up instead of at bedtime, that would drive me crazy.

Smile - That's really tough. How do you put him to sleep? And how do you respond when he wakes?


Things are pretty good here. She has been going down peacefully for her naps again now that I've started opening the blackout curtain a bit and rotating the stuffed animals she has in her crib. Can I just say how amazing it is to be able to set my baby down and walk away knowing that she's going to be asleep within 5-10 minutes?? It still feels like a miracle every time!

The past couple nights she's slept straight through from 7:30pm-5:15am (OMG awesome!), so now I'm keeping my fingers crossed that she'll start sleeping a little later because her normal wakeup time has been 6-6:30am and she needs the extra sleep. I know that even if I gave in and fed her at 5:15 she would still want to be up for the day so my only hope at this point is for her to stop waking at that time. I'm starting to actually feel rested now though. Hopefully it lasts!

 

[Noelle610]

Bananaz GREAT news!

 

[seaweed eater]

Bananaz, that is awesome!! So glad to hear it! Glad some other babies had good nights last night too. So did we!

I have a question though. What do you guys do when LO fights naps? Keep trying? for how long? -- or get them up? And then try again when they show sleepy cues or after, say, 15 minutes? Would you ever take LO in the car (if yours falls asleep there too) in this situation?

LO seems to really want longer wake times now but he can't consistently sleep longer than 30-35 minutes, even for his first nap, and the past week has taught me that he still really needs the extra rest...I could take him in the car, but I want him to nap in his crib in case he wants to sleep for longer. I'm never sure what to do about this.

Here's what I usually do: I try initially for about half an hour, then leave him in his crib for about 10 minutes if he's happy there. If he fusses, that means he's tired and I try nursing again, but if he's just kicking and babbling, then I take him out, play for 15-20 mins or until the first sleepy sign, then try again.

Does that seem reasonable? It doesn't always work well. This morning it took nearly 2 hours from the start of the routine until he was asleep. I started trying at 2.5 hr WT, about half an hour before he usually goes down. We have a routine, use white noise, room is dark, etc.

 

[Noelle610]

Can I just ask is there a limit that you give to your LO's nap length? The naps at home in Sophia's cot are going really well in the mornings, so thank you so much for the great advice to get going with that. She is now napping relatively easily for her morning nap 2 hours after waking. Yesterday at 1 and a half hours I went in and turned the white noise down and opened the black out blinds to encourage her to wake up. Is that about the right maximum time for a nap or longer? The naps during the rest of the day are still hit and miss still but I'm happy to focus on getting the morning nap a regular habit for the moment.

Glad to hear things are improving! The morning nap does tend to stabilize first, or at least it did for my LO. About waking from naps, the guideline I've heard is to limit each nap to 2 hours and then aim for no more than 3.5-4 hours total sleep during the day at that age. Noelle might be able to give you more info, I've sadly never had the problem of a baby napping too long

Yes, morning nap does stabilize first for most babies I think 4 hours is a good cap at that age. Anything more and you're cutting into night sleep and risking possible day/night confusion.

 

[Noelle610]

Bananaz, that is awesome!! So glad to hear it! Glad some other babies had good nights last night too. So did we!

I have a question though. What do you guys do when LO fights naps? Keep trying? for how long? -- or get them up? And then try again when they show sleepy cues or after, say, 15 minutes? Would you ever take LO in the car (if yours falls asleep there too) in this situation?

LO seems to really want longer wake times now but he can't consistently sleep longer than 30-35 minutes, even for his first nap, and the past week has taught me that he still really needs the extra rest...I could take him in the car, but I want him to nap in his crib in case he wants to sleep for longer. I'm never sure what to do about this.

Here's what I usually do: I try initially for about half an hour, then leave him in his crib for about 10 minutes if he's happy there. If he fusses, that means he's tired and I try nursing again, but if he's just kicking and babbling, then I take him out, play for 15-20 mins or until the first sleepy sign, then try again.

Does that seem reasonable? It doesn't always work well. This morning it took nearly 2 hours from the start of the routine until he was asleep. I started trying at 2.5 hr WT, about half an hour before he usually goes down. We have a routine, use white noise, room is dark, etc.

I usually try for about 30 minutes. If the nap isn't happening, I get her up and try again either when she seems tired or in 30 minutes (whichever comes first). I used to put her in the swing if nothing else was working, but now that she's older that doesn't work.

If he seems to want longer wake times, I'd go ahead and lengthen them - that should actually help his naps get longer. It may take a week before it's effective. If you're having a lot of nap refusals, you likely have to adjust your wake times somewhat.

 

[polaris]

Hi everyone.
Glad to hear of some good nights!

Noelle, that game of throwing stuff out of the cot gets old really quickly doesn't it? I do remember going through that with Thomas but I can't really remember how long it lasted, I think he did just get bored of it eventually. Yay for a good night afterwards though, despite the amount of teeth she's getting at the moment.

Bananaz - yay for sleeping through! Fingers crossed she will start sleeping a bit longer as she gets used to it. I really think there's such a huge psychological difference when the time starts with a 6 compared to when it starts with a 5! I can handle 6 a.m. but anything before that just feels too early.

Charlie - I limit Clara's naps to two hours each at the moment. This is something that changes with time though - with DS I had to progressively limit his morning nap to enable him to take a proper afternoon nap.

Seaweed - believe it or not Clara hasn't actually refused a nap since I got her onto a proper napping schedule (except when I tried to get her to take a third catnap). But sometimes it does take a while, usually if my timing is a bit off - I would probably keep trying for about half an hour or thereabouts. The main problem that I have had with Clara is not being able to tell whether she is under-tired or over-tired. I thought for ages that she was under-tired and that was why I kept getting short naps and difficulty falling asleep but actually she was over-tired and shortening her wake times worked for us. The wake times that I am currently trying are 2 hours before first nap, 2.5 hours before second nap, and 2.75-3 hours before bedtime. I am bringing her up about ten minutes before that for a quick feed and to settle her. It worked really well today - but tomorrow will probably be a disaster LOL, it's all still a work in progress!

Clara had two naps of two hours today and it was the first time she didn't seem a little overtired going to bed, she had a slightly later bedtime of 6.45 p.m. as well, whereas she has been going to bed at 6 recently. So I am hoping that she is beginning to catch up on her sleep debt and is less chronically over-tired - we will see how tonight goes!