Support-Failed IVF can't do another??

[Jazavac]

On another note I see your FP ticker. Maybe we can focus on getting healthy together as one of our distractions. I put on 30 pounds through treatments since my wedding and stopped working out a lot b/c I never wanted to mess anything up in the 2ww, felt crappy during af week, and then always said "why bother" in the rest of my follicular phase. I've been trying really hard to at least watch what I eat and get back to exercising but although I've lost a few pounds haven't been able to get myself back to the gym yet-mostly b/c all my workout clothes don't fit!

That's what I've been doing, to pass the time and focus on good things - back to weightloss. I've been losing weight steadily since the beginning of 2007 and this ticker now is the final push. I've lost countless pounds, about 45 centimeters around my waist and now I have some more to go before I can call it done forever. I've not gained any back since, but I sat at the same number of kilos for over a year. No exercise = no weightloss for me. So now I exercise, as there was not much room for improvement in the food department - we already eat only healthy foods and have been for years now.

Meanwhile, while trying to figure out what we want done in the future and while waiting to meet with the RE again, I suppose we can work on regular TTC. BD and all that jazz.

 

[Jazavac]

Nayla, I'm seding some big your way.

 

[Titi]

On another note I see your FP ticker. Maybe we can focus on getting healthy together as one of our distractions. I put on 30 pounds through treatments since my wedding and stopped working out a lot b/c I never wanted to mess anything up in the 2ww, felt crappy during af week, and then always said "why bother" in the rest of my follicular phase. I've been trying really hard to at least watch what I eat and get back to exercising but although I've lost a few pounds haven't been able to get myself back to the gym yet-mostly b/c all my workout clothes don't fit!

That's what I've been doing, to pass the time and focus on good things - back to weightloss. I've been losing weight steadily since the beginning of 2007 and this ticker now is the final push. I've lost countless pounds, about 45 centimeters around my waist and now I have some more to go before I can call it done forever. I've not gained any back since, but I sat at the same number of kilos for over a year. No exercise = no weightloss for me. So now I exercise, as there was not much room for improvement in the food department - we already eat only healthy foods and have been for years now.

Meanwhile, while trying to figure out what we want done in the future and while waiting to meet with the RE again, I suppose we can work on regular TTC. BD and all that jazz.

Congratulations! That is a lot of weight. I know the exercise is sooo important-not just for being slimmer but I'm going to need to be in better shape if I end up being a parent in my fourties and fifties
it's just so hard for me to get started.

Regular ttc is nice too. We are kind of NTNP at the moment-I really don't need to temp or opk or anything I ov like clockwork and timed intercourse never got us a bfp ever-but I do like to sneak in a bd when I'm fertile. Once a TTCer, I think always a ttcer in some aspect-like, even when I want to totally NTNP and not pay any attn. to my body I know it too well know and can tell the exact minute I'm fertile!! And then I always want to sneak in some sexy time, just in case

 

[Jazavac]

We're still kind of trying hard this month, whatever that means. I suppose we could try having sex every other day, just to be able to say we've tried, but then again, with jobs, school and whatnot, there's just no way. Like - no way!

Our appointment with the RE is on the day my next period should show up. Uh huh.

 

[Titi]

We're still kind of trying hard this month, whatever that means. I suppose we could try having sex every other day, just to be able to say we've tried, but then again, with jobs, school and whatnot, there's just no way. Like - no way!

Our appointment with the RE is on the day my next period should show up. Uh huh.

That makes a lot of sense-because you've been trying about six months right? I was able to hard core ttc a long time-and six months is still within a really reasonable time to still get a natural bfp. This morning one of the girls I know that was just giving up hope after six months got a bfp on cycle 7. Will hope for a miracle for you!!!!!

 

[Jazavac]

I'm on my 7th cycle right now and I have no hope. I mean, normally, I would, since it's okay to be trying for even a year under 35. But we found out what our possible problems were while I was still on birth control and therefore were given only 6 months grace period. We've used it up and I've not even gotten a chemical pregnancy, let alone anything else. So, yeah, I don't really think this will happen for us. Maybe sometime down the line, if we pay insane amounts of money. But that's a maybe, too.

And then, if the baby is even born, it'll likely end up with a disease that will kill it, anyway. I mean, avoiding that kind of thing was the main reason we even waited this long. The only reason we started trying almost out of nowhere was the fact I had no eggs to rely on some years down the road, when we'd possibly have more genetic information available.

We're such a hopeless couple, yay.

 

[chocolatecat]

I'm probably not the best person to post on here, as things so far (fingers crossed) are starting to work out for me. But I do really feel for you.
Being unexplained is difficult, it can give you false hope, but also there maybe something that's not being fixed that can be. Our dr suggested on of the causes might be the tubes not working properly, they might not be blocked, but they're covered in finger like cells that guide the egg along at the right pace to get it to the uterus in time, if these aren't working, you're not going to get pg. Though we have no idea if that's the case for us, having a rational explanation for just one reason has been helpful. It was also why we were told not to do IUI, even though the NHS would have paid, it could have easily been a waste of time and energy.

So we did IVF (after 6 months of clomid, even though I was ovulating fine). It went well in that we got fertilised eggs, and frosties. But it failed. As did the next to FETs. So that's 3 failed embryo transfers. I know that's not quite the same as 3 failed IVFs, but emotionally it was close.
Our last IVF we choose to do egg sharing to reduce the costs, so that the majority of the pressure was emotional rather than financial. If it had failed we were already talking about stopping, as adding financial worries to the mix would have been very very difficult.

We got lucky, really lucky, as we didn't have enough eggs to share, we still got the reduced costs, got some frosties and a BFP.
I know I hated the "oh my friend got her BFP after 5IVFs, just keep going stories" during my time TTC. But I do think unexplained is different. trying to keep going when you're not sure what your fighting is tough.

All i can do is offer hugs and suggest you look into egg or sperm sharing to reduce costs.
good luck!

 

[Jazavac]

Thanks for sharing your experience chocolatecat, and congrats on your pregnancy!

I know nothing is black or white when it comes to infertility, it's more like countless shades of gray. It's just really hard to be patient, and even hard to make decisions that at least seem to be the right ones.

There's a link to my journal in my signature, where I'm kind of trying to explain what all is bugging me these days. There are just so many decisions to make and we sort of have no clue which direction to go.

 

[Titi]

I'm on my 7th cycle right now and I have no hope. I mean, normally, I would, since it's okay to be trying for even a year under 35. But we found out what our possible problems were while I was still on birth control and therefore were given only 6 months grace period. We've used it up and I've not even gotten a chemical pregnancy, let alone anything else. So, yeah, I don't really think this will happen for us. Maybe sometime down the line, if we pay insane amounts of money. But that's a maybe, too.

And then, if the baby is even born, it'll likely end up with a disease that will kill it, anyway. I mean, avoiding that kind of thing was the main reason we even waited this long. The only reason we started trying almost out of nowhere was the fact I had no eggs to rely on some years down the road, when we'd possibly have more genetic information available.

We're such a hopeless couple, yay.

oh hun.......I SO hope you are wrong and get a surprise. I know it's annoying when people that don't fully comprehend your situation tell you that "it'll happen" or whatever so I won't go there-I just truly wish for you that something changes that.

 

[Titi]

chocolatecat, thank you for sharing. That you took the time to read our posts and offer us hope and your story was very thoughtful. Congrats on your bfp!!!

I'm sure at some point we may be able to try something else-just not anytime soon.

 

[Jazavac]

It'd really be great for all of us to just wake up some day and see the surprise!

 

[chocolatecat]

I'm glad you didn't mind me posting. There's a fine line between wanting to hear about success and not wanting anyone else to have what you want (we're all allowed to be bitter!)
But I do really know how it feels to have had failures whilst everyone else around you is normal. Even those who succeed on their first IVF feel like the enemy at times.
I'm over the moon to finally be PG. I know 3.5 years isn't as long as some people, but we all know even 6 months seems like too long. I'm terrified, of course, but optimistic that we can get this far.

One other thing that really helped us both get through this was throwing ourselves into life, we traveled as much as we could afford, partied hard (Vegas baby) and I joined a roller derby team. Not sure if you know anything about derby, but it's pretty much the perfect sport for the infertile! A contact sport on skates is not something you can do when PG! And nearly everyone falls in love with it! The team of girls is massively supportive, and in 2 years of skating with over 50 girls none of them have got PG, where as about 10 out of the 30 women at work have! It's great to be in an enviroment where babies are ok, but frankly will get in the way of skating! I miss skating heaps, but it was always good when things when wrong to know that I had something to go back to and immerse myself in...
It's not for everyone, but it helped me a lot!

Wishing you all the luck in the world.

 

[Jazavac]

I don't mind hearing about success stories, at all. And the feeling is, kind of, two-sided. I can be truly and honestly happy about someone else's pregnancy, but I can't say it helps me in any way. I mean, some women will say something along the lines of - yes, awesome your pregnancy gives me hope, yadda yadda yadda. In all honesty - nobody's pregnancy gives me hope. I'm not them. My only hope is, well, the fact that my organs are functioning and that the doctors might come up with a good percentage or chance of some sort. And that my body will pull through and actually accomplish something.

So, for the most part, hearing about someone else's success pisses me off. Again, I like to hear about it as I am fully capable of being happy for other people at the same time and like and appreciate shared stories.

 

[_Nell]

In all honesty - nobody's pregnancy gives me hope. I'm not them

That sums up perfectly how I feel. Like you i really don't mind reading success stories though.

I have low amh too Jazavac, but not as low as yours - did you have an antral follicle count? Mine doesn't correlate to my amh at all tbh. We decided we 'had to be in it to win it' and so went for our first IVF anyway, as it turns out egg number wasn't our problem (yet, my amh says it could be suddenly soon).
But I can relate to how you feel as i have an unresponsive lining. Stats says pregnancies don't occurr in IVF at all with less than 7mm, mine is 5mm, i have managed 7mm just on a previous cycle but even then pg rates are reduced against a healthy 8-14mm lining and well it didn't work for me, thrice and now a fourth time.
An unresponsive lining is like a brick wall, I get lots of people saying 'oh this happened to me one cycle, up your estrogen ' but mine has happened every cycle and doesn't respond to estrogen, literally it just doesn't thicken and yet it all loks ok on the inside, no scarring, no ashermans. Originally we though i had premature ovarian failure and wouldn't carry my own biological child....now it seems i have eggs but nowhere to grow them. Damned frustrating tbh.

Sorry to jump in again on this thread with 'my story' I could just really relate to how you feel and i've not read someone sum it up so perfectly. Until i hear from someone in the UK (because frankly the US seem to be better at trying to deal with lining problem patients) who's had repeat fails with thin lining and overcome it I can't feel hope from shared stories really.....even then the logic in my says one specific success isn't enough.

I wish us all our ticket out of limbo-land, I hope we all become those magical rare unexpected BFP's......the ones you find when you google your problem, read a thread, see the sigggy underneath and think, wow they did it!

 

[KittyCat82]

I agree how incredibly frustrating and upsetting I can be when you can't wirk with a specific problem. We are slightly different as we don't know what the problem is other than slightly low amh for my age (17 on uk scale). I've even been pregnant before (different partner) but can't seem to get pregnant with hubby despite the FS calling him 'superman' because of his sperm count etc. my friend had ivf at same place as we are in nov and is pregnant despite having PCOS and really bad problems with sperm and she keeps saying if it worked for her, it will work for us?? I think she wonders why I have been so down and why I don't just get on with the next round!! x

 

[Jazavac]

I have low amh too Jazavac, but not as low as yours - did you have an antral follicle count?

They counted my antral follicles early in the cycle, pre-ovulation of course, but not on day 2 or 3, as it wasn't part of a procedure or anything. So in a natural cycle, absolutely unmedicated, he counted 12 and then said - whatever, I'm done hurting you with the ultrasound, you have more than enough. One ovary showed clear and visible 8 ones, the other at least 4, but he said that that's perfectly normal, let alone for someone with nonexistent AMH. My FSH was 9.2, too, within normal limits, so nothing corresponds directly to my ovarian reserves. We've done the test (AMH bloodwork) twice so far, just to make sure they weren't mixing it up or reading it wrong or overall doing insane stuff. Nope. It was mine, somehow.

My lining is fine, size of the uterus as well, so are the ovaries. Shape, size, volume, all good.

12 million sperm is not something awesome, but doable, he said.

So we're mostly unexplained.

So now I'm (im)patient, just sitting around and waiting for February 9th, when I'll hopefully learn something new and possibly make a good decision.

Or maybe a bean will mysteriously hatch this cycle, too. at that one, though, as I don't particularly believe in fairy tales.

 

[_Nell]

Jazavac, that's not disimilar to me, if you choose to go for IVF I think with an antral follicle count of around 12 you'd have enough eggs to play with' as they say (a count can be done at any point in the cycle so yours would be accurate).
I had my amh done 3 times, all low (around 1 on the US scale) yet i'm polycystic and have over 24 follicles on a scan. One Dr says he thinks because i'm polycystic i've used my egg suplly up fast by spitting out 20 or 30 each cycle. Another Dr thinks my amh predicts my egg supply is going to fall suddenly soon and then my antral follicle count will be just 2 or 3.
Me, i'm starting to think this amh malarky is not so great a test after all, every test has a sensitivty and specificity and i guess this isn't 100%.

My only issue at the outset pre IVF was my low amh, yet IVF has revealed a whole heap more so maybe amh is reflective of general fertility more than egg reserve.

Kitty - That must be very hard to have a friend who was successful when you weren't. I read on here someones reply to a query of what ivf was like once... 'if it works it's the best thing since sliced bread, if it doesn't it and everything to do with it just sucks', I think if it works first time it's hard for people to relate to how a 'fail' feels.

 

[Jazavac]

Yeah, I am below 1 on the US scale with my AMH. Bad, bad, bad, but just like you said yourself - nobody knows, right now, what exactly it doesmean, since my other results don't show anything really alarming. The way our RE put it was that I should be cautious because my AMH, as well as my FSH at 9.2 might be showing that my fertility is slowly declining, but that the actual phrase could mean anything, everything and not much at the same time. And it all makes sense at.. well, not making sense.

Last time we talked, he was more than confident that I would be IVF material, which sounded a lot better than the first prognosis, when all we knew was that horrible AMH. With my antral follicles, regular ovulation and, per his words, textbook-worthy cycles, I'd likely respond to stimulation and produce some eggs. How many, of course, he couldn't and can't predict. He can't tell even with perfectly 'healthy' women.

But, of course, we'll see where all this stuff takes us.

I am somewhat surprised that your AMH is low, while you're dealing with cysts, as well. After all, all of the available AMH info comes with disclaimers that PCOS usually brings AMH to high levels, if not extremely high.

 

[Titi]

Kitty - That must be very hard to have a friend who was successful when you weren't. I read on here someones reply to a query of what ivf was like once... 'if it works it's the best thing since sliced bread, if it doesn't it and everything to do with it just sucks', I think if it works first time it's hard for people to relate to how a 'fail' feels.

I had my ET 5 days after my good friend did her first. I had 3 transferred and she had 2 and she's 7 +6 with twins right now. It's really hard. I'm super happy for her but thought we'd get to do this together..and DH and I wanted twins sooooooooo bad.

 

[Leji]

Hi All. I'm new to this board in particular but I just wanted to offer a suggestion and some hope.

We tried to conceive for 3 1/2 years before we got pregnant and I am currently 15 1/2 weeks pregnant from a natural cycle frozen embryo transfer. I still pray every day that this pregnancy will go smoothly.

Prior to this pregnancy, we had 3 IUI's, 3 IVF's, and 1 FET. Our diagnosis was MFIF/unexplained as DH's morphology occasionally varied depending on acupuncture, diet, and supplements. After an ectopic pregnancy and subsequent salpingectomy from my 3rd IVF, I was fairly convinced that my endometrium was incapable of growing a baby. We were devastated.

A family member suggested I look into the "Fertile Heart" practice. It honestly changed our perspective on the way we viewed our trials in trying to get pregnant. Julia, the founder, is an absolutely amazing and inspiring woman who holds workshops and support circles to help women who are struggling to try and conceive. She offers tools such as imagery and body truth as well as diet advice. Her heart is big and she truly cares about delving into the issues that may be preventing women from achieving pregnancy.

I believe that without her help I wouldn't have gotten this far. I don't think I would have even had the courage to try again. Never did I think that I would be typing this message as a pregnant member.

So if anyone is interested at all, please check out the fertile heart website (I can't post the website since I haven't had 10 or more posts but you can google fertile heart). There is a wealth of information on the website alone. Of course, I highly recommend the workshop if you can make it and her books, Inconceivable and the Fertile Female.