To drink or not to drink?

[ShanandBoc]

You have no control tho over your baby ending up with downs syndrome? x

Sorry I don't know if you meant that as a question or not but..No I do not think you can control rather your baby has downs or not. We found out at my 18 weeks scan that my now 14 month old had a 2 vessel cord (3 is normal) and babies with 2 vessel colds can be born with downs, spina bifida, heart problem, under weight or all the above. I never smoked or drank or eat bad things. There was no way I had done anything that would have caused the 2 vessel cord..and that alone could have caused downs. Thankfully my little man was 100% at birth and still is. Anyway all I'm saying is no I don't think you can control rather your baby has downs or not.

It was in response to the previous post hun, i was stating that you dont have any control over DS but you do with FES AND FAS as DS was used as a comparison xo

Lol does that make sense??

It was my badly explained example that caused confusion...

Its ok, im not very good at explaining myself either as you can see above

 

[polo_princess]

You can give a child alcohol in the UK? Wow.

Alcohol is a DRUG. Feeding your unborn a drug is ridiculous just because YOU want a drink. This argument is going no where and should be closed PERIOD. Not because I'm sayin certain mothers are selfish, which are.

See now this is why threads like this go downhill as some people view threads like this as an arguement and not a civilised discussion between adults

It doesnt need closing if people can discuss the topic politley without being rude to one another, a differening opinion doesnt always have to equate to an arguement.

 

[My_First]

I won't call you selfish, but I will agree the decision to drink during pregnancy and risk disabilities that are completely preventable IS selfish. You say you enjoy alcohol, well, if you can't abstain for the health and safety of your baby, then perhaps those who choose to drink during pregnancy need some intervention.

You want some literature from the UK?

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/13332.php

May I ask what kind of financial supports the UK offers kids with disabilities? If it's none, thn perhaps that's why the government hasn't yet recommended no alcohol, because they don't have to pay for the choices of parents inflicted upon their children.

Regardless of what your UK literature says compared to my Canadian/US literature and recommendations, ALL literature agrees that THERE IS NO KNOWN SAFE AMOUNT OF ALCOHOL IN PREGNANCY!! That does not translate to, "Okay, I guess I can drink some because they don't know the dangerous amount" it translates to "You know, it's common sense, I need to abstain from alcohol because my absorption rate is probably different from another's woman's, so even one drink could affect my child".

My god, it's friggin common sense, and if your doctor and midwife told you it's okay to drink, then they ought to lose their licenses. They're not the ones having to raise these poor innocent children. I hope if your child is born with FAS, you can live with you decision.

Yes the Government here supports children with disabilities. As I said before. I dont think anyone is going to come to an agreement either way, but please do not call people selfish who are making their own choices.

Drs and Midwives are quite well qualified, thank you.

 

[elephant29]

Exactly my point....it isnt conclusive either way so therefore someone has the right to chose what to make of that information surely?

I, of course, love my LO as we all do and want to do what is best for her from the moment I found out I was expecting. That however doesnt mean I dont have a personal choice in what I chose to do during pregnancy.

I understand completely the point people are making when they say 'but why risk it'. It's the same with lot's of things during pregnancy, evidence wont always say yes or no in a black or white way so it is therefore down to the individual to chose how they go about using the information provided and not for someone else to tell them it is wrong or bad without conclusive evidence.

I do agree however that different parts of the world differ with their opinions on this.

 

[trumpetbum]

Not a popular opinion but I'm happy to have the occasional glass of wine and feel the risk is negligible. I wouldn't drink other than a glass of wine as this is the only drink I drink in small quantities for pleasure except beer or cider which has acceptable non alcoholic substitutes. I'm happy based on the evidence available that there is no link shown in evidence old or new between small, occasional alcohol intake and negative impact on a foetus. The NICE guidelines for health professionals advising expectant mothers concurs with this.
It is true that eliminating alcohol completely for the entirety of the pregnancy eliminates all risk altogether, as does eliminating all caffeine, artificial sweeteners, eggs, driving and anything else that might be of equal risk to the unborn child. Some will eliminate all these things jic, most will find a happy medium depending on their individual assessment of the risk they pose.
People just need to decide for themselves based on the evidence available. What others think of that decision should make no difference if you are confident in the validity of your decision.

 

[NicoleB]

You have no control tho over your baby ending up with downs syndrome? x

Sorry I don't know if you meant that as a question or not but..No I do not think you can control rather your baby has downs or not. We found out at my 18 weeks scan that my now 14 month old had a 2 vessel cord (3 is normal) and babies with 2 vessel colds can be born with downs, spina bifida, heart problem, under weight or all the above. I never smoked or drank or eat bad things. There was no way I had done anything that would have caused the 2 vessel cord..and that alone could have caused downs. Thankfully my little man was 100% at birth and still is. Anyway all I'm saying is no I don't think you can control rather your baby has downs or not.

It was in response to the previous post hun, i was stating that you dont have any control over DS but you do with FES AND FAS as DS was used as a comparison xo

Lol does that make sense??

It was my badly explained example that caused confusion...

Its ok, im not very good at explaining myself either as you can see above

sorry..
I have the same problem I can never explain things the way I'm thinking them.

 

[ShanandBoc]

thats ok hun, i can see why you would have thought that

Sorry to hear about your bubs x

 

[Jess&Jay]

You can give a child alcohol in the UK? Wow.

Alcohol is a DRUG. Feeding your unborn a drug is ridiculous just because YOU want a drink. This argument is going no where and should be closed PERIOD. Not because I'm sayin certain mothers are selfish, which are.

See now this is why threads like this go downhill as some people view threads like this as an arguement and not a civilised discussion between adults

It doesnt need closing if people can discuss the topic politley without being rude to one another, a differening opinion doesnt always have to equate to an arguement.

And what you're saying here isnt offensive???
I AM an adult! Just because I am defending all unborn children and I feel strongly about this topic does not mean I am not an adult. I stated my opinion. I did not call ANY ONE out saying ok YOU, YOU'RE A BAD MOTHER. I said in general so whom ever feels it is to them, oh well. Blame that on yourself. So I'll say it in a way you can understand. This discussion is going no where. And should be closed PERIOD.

 

[BrandiCanucks]

I won't call you selfish, but I will agree the decision to drink during pregnancy and risk disabilities that are completely preventable IS selfish. You say you enjoy alcohol, well, if you can't abstain for the health and safety of your baby, then perhaps those who choose to drink during pregnancy need some intervention.

You want some literature from the UK?

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/13332.php

May I ask what kind of financial supports the UK offers kids with disabilities? If it's none, thn perhaps that's why the government hasn't yet recommended no alcohol, because they don't have to pay for the choices of parents inflicted upon their children.

Regardless of what your UK literature says compared to my Canadian/US literature and recommendations, ALL literature agrees that THERE IS NO KNOWN SAFE AMOUNT OF ALCOHOL IN PREGNANCY!! That does not translate to, "Okay, I guess I can drink some because they don't know the dangerous amount" it translates to "You know, it's common sense, I need to abstain from alcohol because my absorption rate is probably different from another's woman's, so even one drink could affect my child".

My god, it's friggin common sense, and if your doctor and midwife told you it's okay to drink, then they ought to lose their licenses. They're not the ones having to raise these poor innocent children. I hope if your child is born with FAS, you can live with you decision.

Yes the Government here supports children with disabilities. As I said before. I dont think anyone is going to come to an agreement either way, but please do not call people selfish who are making their own choices.

Drs and Midwives are quite well qualified, thank you.

I didn't call you selfish, I said your decision was selfish. There's a difference. Now, if I may be so bold as to ask, and please answer, because I am intrigued. This is something I can take to class on Tuesday

Are you aware there is a risk of FAS/FAE with even just one drink of alcohol?

Are you aware that this risk is because of a woman's differing tolerance levels and absorption rates? A woman who drinks one alcohol drink at a time may have a slower absorption rate than a woman who drinks frequently throughout her pregnancy, thus the woman who only has one drink may have a child affected more than the other woman's child.

What kind of financial supports does the UK offer children with disabilities?

Did you ask your doctor if it was okay to drink or did he say "You;re pregnant, don't worry, it's still okay to drink alcohol"?

 

[ShanandBoc]

It shouldnt need to be closed *sigh*

 

[elephant29]

BrandiCanuks.... I havent mentioned that I have a degree in social services (which included learning about different aspcts of social deprivation and how alcohol, drugs etc can effect children) and have worked with people who have learning difficulties and have seen the effects of FAS etc because I was merely pointing out about the personal choice aspect of the entire debate here. I don't think my professional opinion comes into the matter to much as this wasnt my argument but I dont need to go and read up on this subject because I have an adequate knowledge of it already.

You obviously have a great deal of knowledge on these specific subjects and I appreciate your point of view but it will not change mine and I still believe a women has the choice to chose how she interprets the information provided on light drinking during pregnancy.

 

[BrandiCanucks]

Alright, I'm saying this and this only..I need to get out of this thread because as someone who is a special needs parent and someone who works with children who are victims of preventable disabilities, this thread is just pissing me off. I am appalled at the selfishness displayed in this thread. It is disgusting that regardless of what a doctor or midwife has said, that even fully knowing there are risks of FAS/FAE, mothers are still choosing to risk preventable disabilities on their child. It is absolutely disgusting.

I will say only this: If you choose to risk these disabilities on your children and your children are born with this condition, YOU HAVE ONLY YOURSELF TO BLAME. Do not turn around and blame it on your doctor because he said it was okay. YOU MADE THE DECISION and it is sad and disgusting that your child has to suffer the consequences. THAT is selfish.

I hope to God that none of your children are born with FAS/FAE because it kills me to see the struggles of these children every day, but if they are you better work your ass off to support your child through all their struggles and disabilities. It is not an easy job and as harsh as this may sound, I hope you do feel guilt and regret, and that you learn from your selfish decision.

 

[NicoleB]

thats ok hun, i can see why you would have thought that

Sorry to hear about your bubs x

Thank you!! he is 100% healthy nothing more then a cold his whole life
it was a scary thing tho until we got our 3d scan at 20 weeks and everything looked 100% good.

 

[My_First]

I won't call you selfish, but I will agree the decision to drink during pregnancy and risk disabilities that are completely preventable IS selfish. You say you enjoy alcohol, well, if you can't abstain for the health and safety of your baby, then perhaps those who choose to drink during pregnancy need some intervention.

You want some literature from the UK?

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/13332.php

May I ask what kind of financial supports the UK offers kids with disabilities? If it's none, thn perhaps that's why the government hasn't yet recommended no alcohol, because they don't have to pay for the choices of parents inflicted upon their children.

Regardless of what your UK literature says compared to my Canadian/US literature and recommendations, ALL literature agrees that THERE IS NO KNOWN SAFE AMOUNT OF ALCOHOL IN PREGNANCY!! That does not translate to, "Okay, I guess I can drink some because they don't know the dangerous amount" it translates to "You know, it's common sense, I need to abstain from alcohol because my absorption rate is probably different from another's woman's, so even one drink could affect my child".

My god, it's friggin common sense, and if your doctor and midwife told you it's okay to drink, then they ought to lose their licenses. They're not the ones having to raise these poor innocent children. I hope if your child is born with FAS, you can live with you decision.

Yes the Government here supports children with disabilities. As I said before. I dont think anyone is going to come to an agreement either way, but please do not call people selfish who are making their own choices.

Drs and Midwives are quite well qualified, thank you.

I didn't call you selfish, I said your decision was selfish. There's a difference. Now, if I may be so bold as to ask, and please answer, because I am intrigued. This is something I can take to class on Tuesday

Are you aware there is a risk of FAS/FAE with even just one drink of alcohol?

Are you aware that this risk is because of a woman's differing tolerance levels and absorption rates? A woman who drinks one alcohol drink at a time may have a slower absorption rate than a woman who drinks frequently throughout her pregnancy, thus the woman who only has one drink may have a child affected more than the other woman's child.

What kind of financial supports does the UK offer children with disabilities?

Did you ask your doctor if it was okay to drink or did he say "You;re pregnant, don't worry, it's still okay to drink alcohol"?

Yes I am aware of FAS. No there is no definative proof or study that shows how one glass of wine can affect the unborm child.

Yes, I realise that different people have different ways of reacting/absorbing alcohol.

The Government offers disabiliy benefits to both the mother and the child.

The Doctor asked, 'Do you drink', I said yes I do, but have cut down considerably since finding out I am pregnant. He said, okay as long as its not anymore that 2-3 units.

 

[Jess&Jay]

It shouldnt need to be closed *sigh*

This is a horrible topic. The woman who created it does not even post in here anymore, she got her answer. She is making her own decisions which is fine.

What I don't like is the constant going back and forth on who is right. Debating which country you are in because it makes it okay. No on will come to an agreement, the facts of alcohol during pregnancy are endless. Some people have common sense and other just don't care. In my opinion, those are selfish decisions. And I do feel strongly about this. I'm sorry to whom I've offended, I just don't like this

 

[ShanandBoc]

thats what debates are about tho, back and forth difference of opinions.

I think its good to discuss these kinds of topics.......and share info and experiences that may help someone. But as passionate as u may be you do have to keep your cool and respect others ( which i do find it hard to do at times) but theses kinds of threads have helped me to learn how to do just that! x

 

[My_First]

thats what debates are about tho, back and forth difference of opinions.

I think its good to discuss these kinds of topics.......and share info and experiences that may help someone.

And I agree. As adults we should be able to debate, and also accept that someone else will have a different opinion than yours. It doesnt make it right, and it doesnt make it wrong. Also what a boring old world we would live in, if we all agreed...

 

[elephant29]

ShanandBoc I agree completely. We are merely debating, albeit an emotive topic. It means going back and forth with opinions. Unfortunately it always ends up that people dont like certain things being said.

 

[Jess&Jay]

thats what debates are about tho, back and forth difference of opinions.

I think its good to discuss these kinds of topics.......and share info and experiences that may help someone. But as passionate as u may be you do have to keep your cool and respect others ( which i do find it hard to do at times) but theses kinds of threads have helped me to learn how to do just that! x

No one is being help, although I wish someone would take what we say into thought and understand our view and live it. but I highly doubt it will happen. I'm leaving this thread, I need a shot of orange juice after this drinking topic. Goodluck to the ladies that continue drinking. I pray and hope your child will continue to grow healthy and be born healthy.

 

[polo_princess]

You can give a child alcohol in the UK? Wow.

Alcohol is a DRUG. Feeding your unborn a drug is ridiculous just because YOU want a drink. This argument is going no where and should be closed PERIOD. Not because I'm sayin certain mothers are selfish, which are.

See now this is why threads like this go downhill as some people view threads like this as an arguement and not a civilised discussion between adults

It doesnt need closing if people can discuss the topic politley without being rude to one another, a differening opinion doesnt always have to equate to an arguement.

And what you're saying here isnt offensive???
I AM an adult! Just because I am defending all unborn children and I feel strongly about this topic does not mean I am not an adult. I stated my opinion. I did not call ANY ONE out saying ok YOU, YOU'RE A BAD MOTHER. I said in general so whom ever feels it is to them, oh well. Blame that on yourself. So I'll say it in a way you can understand. This discussion is going no where. And should be closed PERIOD.

Did at any point i specifically refer to you as being a child? I was referring to everybody in this discussion as being an adult. Please highlight what i said that was offensive

I'll thank you for not speaking to me with an attitude like that again, there is no need to be rude

Seriously ladies, can you not discuss this topic without being so personal and rude? I understand its an emotive subject and people feel very passionatley but its not a totally alien concept to have a bit of respect and politeness when entering an open discussion with others.