What If There Was No Formula?

I have always said I would love to see more breastfeeding support.

In one state, women are running a campaign to Ban the Bag (formula company samples, bottles, etc) in order to help women breastfeed without having the temptation of turning to formula when times are tough (clusterfeeding, sore nipples, etc).

I would like to see education on the topic of breastfeeding included in high school sex education.
 
I would like to see education on the topic of breastfeeding included in high school sex education.

It's shocking to me that there isn't anything about it! That's one of the ways breastfeeding will be so normalised! It actually makes me angry that a bottle is a picture that comes up often in relation to babies. Like my baby book has them in the borders and stuff. I know they aren't going to plaster the edges with boobs and even there might be breastmilk in the bottle but it's just sad to me that if you ask people to think of an item that relates to babies a high percentage of people will think "bottles".
 
They taught us about breastfeeding in my health class starting in 7th grade. I remember very vividly as our teacher brought in some breast milk and she sampled it in front of us!!
 
My cousin did a report in childcare (shes 15) on breastfeeding VS bottle. After my extensive chat with her she ended up saying breastfeeding because its free :haha:
 
I did Child Studies as a B course in high school and BF wasn't covered at all, except to say it was an "option" but there was a whole section on FF. This was 11 years ago.
 
Embarrassed to say when I was pregnant I only found out what breastfeeding was when I came here. I never seen it before, babies where fed off bottles and had no education on human body at all. You think I was living in a cave but everyone around me was like that. I am also glad I cant see my old posts as I know one I was shocked at someone asking who was breastfeeding their baby and saying how I certainly would not. I must have looked so ignorant and was to. And over my journey I have come to find myself rather alone in my parenting (except partner) because of my change in heart at sight of my son.
 
I asked for a lactation consultant or peer supporter in my hospital, I was asked by several peope what they where and informed they didn't have them sort of things. The amount of "what? say that again? " I was passed around to . Shocking. I ended up calling a breastfeeding helpline instead. Medical profession I asked where as useless as tits on a bull.
 
The MWs at my hospital were as useless as an ashtray on a motorbike, lol. No lactation consultant at all both times, and only one qualified one even around at all in a 2.5 hour radius around my city.
 
I didnt even know boobs COULD breastfeed until I was an adult.
 
I don't remember learning about breastfeeding in sex ed either but I always knew about breastfeeding even though all the babies I ever saw were fed with bottles, probably my mum told me although I don't remember.
 
I'm in Ontario Canada and I see boobs all over. We even learned about it in grade school and then high school. My OB's nurse asked me 500 times if I went to the pre-natal breastfeeding classes, when I was in the hospital (only 48 hours) I got two classes and they kept making me more and more lactation consultant appointments after I went home. Even all the moms in my baby groups breastfeed (I'm the only one who combi feeds).
I always grew up thinking that everyone breastfed which is why it was so shocking to me when I couldn't.
 
We weren't taught about BF in Sex Ed (although we got very minimal Sex Ed anyway, Catholic school :haha:), but I did learn about it in Home Economics where we looked at various reasons as to why a woman would make her choice.
Having read over the whole thread, I do think more should be done to normalise and support BF - although this I say ready to duck for cover, as some of you may know that I've not had my own baby yet and therefore have no personal experience to draw upon. At the same time no woman should be made to feel bad for how they choose to feed their baby, but I suppose it'll depend on where you stay as to which woman will get picked on - where I stay, it's the breastfeeding lady who gets looked at like she's nuts.
NHS Fife have plastered their Antenatal clinics, GP waiting rooms and the Maternity unit at the main hospital with posters advocating breastfeeding, yet I don't know a single person who has successfully breastfed their baby here for longer than a couple of days. I am determined to breastfeed my boy baby when he arrives, however I am already nervous about how other people will take it - will my friends and family think I'm trying to 'hog the baby'? It's kind of expected around here that if you're visiting someone with a newborn and they need a feed that you'll get to do it (something that's always annoyed me anyway, it's not your baby dammit! But that's an aside lol). Will I be supported properly if things get difficult? My OH laughed when I said that I plan to nurse our son until he's at least 6m, because he genuinely didn't know that that's the recommendation.

I have 2 particular cases that have caused me particular worry with feeding my son both as a newborn and beyond, because I know the women/babies involved. My ex's sister tried to breastfeed her first, and pumped colustrum for the first couple of days, but after her mum told her - quoted word for word because I was there when this was said, "oh you must just have no milk, give her a bottle" (2 days after birth), she made the switch to formula, and then had to use various versions of hungry baby and comfort formula to figure out what worked best. While I don't know exactly what issues she had with BF, if she'd been more supported would she have had more luck and been happier with her choice? She wasn't happy at all when she first had to give a bottle of formula.

The second example is OH's son, who while I don't have first hand experience of what happened at the time (probably for obvious reasons lol), I do know what OH has told me about it and I know the effect that has been had on his son. His ex had to have an EMCS because of fetal destress (down to shoddy care at the mat unit), and as a result of this, she was totally spaced out after he was born, the midwife tried to syringe colostrum out of her (while, OH says, she was still out cold), and while she wanted to BF, she was so exhausted by the procedure initially that she couldn't really try like she wanted to and the midwives gave him a bottle, and from there he wouldn't take to the breast when she was more able to try to BF. FF itself has done him no harm at all, what has, however done him harm is that on advice from relatives, OH's ex decided to wean him onto solids at 4 months old, not in addition to the formula he was getting but rather to replace his lunch and tea time bottles. This has caused him to have problems with his digestive system to the point where his GP reckons he'll now have to regularly take Lactulose until he's at least 5 years old. In short - the midwives at the hospital (where I'll be giving birth myself in 4 months) are so hot and cold about breastfeeding and whether it should be pushed on a woman or not, there wasn't enough education about what comes next, and for first time mums that can be quite dangerous in itself. :wacko:

Feeding our LO's shouldn't be such a minefield!
 
I never had breastfeeding classes. The only baby I ever saw fed was my sisters and he was bottle fed due to a lactose intolerance. My mum breastfed us but it never came up in conversation.

And yet I knew there were two ways to feed babies. I do wonder how women get to the stage of becoming or nearly becoming mothers without realising their boobs are designed to feed them. I mean, what did you think they were for?:shrug:
 
if we didn't have formula I think there would be an increase in the amount of home made formulas and possibly a return to using things like evaporated milk which would be really bad. I think it might have it's good aspects though because it would make society take bf a lot more seriously, I had no idea what FF was until quite late on as it's just not something that was used or even sold in our village back home, my mum had poor supply and had two operations for mastitis before it dried up when I was around 2/3 months old, my aunt then moved in for a couple of months as a wet nurse and after that it was a case of other aunts aunts helping too.
 
In my case if there wasnt formula when I had my first baby at 17 I would have had more support and managed to continue bf, I combi fed as my bf at the time wanted to use the milk tokens we were entitled too and I was naive and young and did as he said! then my milk dried up so I went to ff.
with this LO not wanting the HUGE cost that formula is here for OH was a massive factor in me perservering with bf through loads of difficulties.

here the campesinas (peasant mountain women) cant afford formula and they all bf, im sure a very small percentage literally cant and I really dont know what they do.......but I was in a bus station the other day and an older lady had a baby who was crying and everyone was telling her "give the baby milk! dale teta! (give her boobie)" she said, I cant! its my grandaughter I dont have milk, so another lady said oh pass her over I do, and took the baby and breastfed her! so everyone mucks in here still I guess!
 
In my case if there wasnt formula when I had my first baby at 17 I would have had more support and managed to continue bf, I combi fed as my bf at the time wanted to use the milk tokens we were entitled too and I was naive and young and did as he said! then my milk dried up so I went to ff.
with this LO not wanting the HUGE cost that formula is here for OH was a massive factor in me perservering with bf through loads of difficulties.

here the campesinas (peasant mountain women) cant afford formula and they all bf, im sure a very small percentage literally cant and I really dont know what they do.......but I was in a bus station the other day and an older lady had a baby who was crying and everyone was telling her "give the baby milk! dale teta! (give her boobie)" she said, I cant! its my grandaughter I dont have milk, so another lady said oh pass her over I do, and took the baby and breastfed her! so everyone mucks in here still I guess!

I think that is awesome :)
 
I never had breastfeeding classes. The only baby I ever saw fed was my sisters and he was bottle fed due to a lactose intolerance. My mum breastfed us but it never came up in conversation.

And yet I knew there were two ways to feed babies. I do wonder how women get to the stage of becoming or nearly becoming mothers without realising their boobs are designed to feed them. I mean, what did you think they were for?:shrug:

Sexual objects. Yep thats it. I never seen breastfeeding, wasnt told about it anywhere, all formula fed kids in family. No one ever talked about breastfeeding it was always formula. I fed my sister formula when she was a baby to.No sex ed in school at all, no biology and sod all. May seem obvious to you when you say what did you think they where for but formula advertising was rather heavy in the past when I was growing up and even now it still is. You cant even get a breast pump or nipple shields in my town My other half praises breastfeeding and said it to his mates who where having another baby, they where horrified and said "we dont do that sort of thing to our children". Funny enough they dont speak to him any more. She was a smoker, liked a drink etc the norm for a parent around here.
 
Lina meant that breastmilk has 3x as many unique ingredients as formula not that it has 3x as much of each ingredient. What she has said is true and has been proven by analysis of breastmilk. Some of the qualities of these ingredients hasn't yet been fully researched but who knows they could be highly beneficial? Until recently some of the indigestible sugars in breastmilk were thought to have no use but they were found via recent research to have prebiotic and immune qualities. If breastmilk was nutritionally nothing special then the formula companies wouldn't be clambering all over themselves trying to emulate ingredients and the fat blend in breastmilk as well as even claiming to have isolated a probiotic from breastmilk in the case of Hipp. That's not to say formula isn't nutritionally adequate because it is xx

My point being, when they discover BM *might* have something good in it, the formula companies "clamber over themselves" to include it. That's a good thing. But again, there's that word "proven" and in fact nothing it "proven" - at least not to a level I would consider it to be "fact" just a whole bunch of theories. And those "3X" things that are apparently so fantastic we have no idea what they are, might actually be worthless. Certainly, there aren't thousands and thousands of FF babies or children who are suffering because they aren't being given these magical, secret ingredients, so secret they have no discernible use.

My biggest problem with the stuff bandied about with BM is, on the one hand we are told it is all fantastic and contains this many bits and that many pieces so it must be fabulous, but on the other hand we are told it is totally unique and is perfectly tailored to your baby and not only that varies depending on the temperature, the time of day and even the exact age of a baby. So it is impossible to state that all breastmilk contains x number of nutrients. And even with it being so fantastically magical as it is, hospitals across the country are still insisting babies who are discharged from NNICU or SCBU with BFing mums are sent home with multivitamins and iron to give to their LOs - something not necessary with formula because these are already fortified. When I challenged this and was insistent I'd be eating a balanced diet so anything she needs she's get from me, I was told it wasn't enough and policy was policy. You'd have thought if BM was proven to be so fabulous always, then this policy would not be in place.:shrug:

Your last line is exactly where I was coming from though, formula is nutritionally adequate, and whatever else babies get from breastmilk is not something so important it cannot be excluded from a baby's diet. If it were, we'd find huge variants in the health and well being, both in the short and the long term of FF babies and that just isn't happening.

The situation with prem babies is different though and it depends how premature a baby is and their birthweight when it comes to whether they will be sent home with vitamins or not, I have had two boys who were full term discharged from SCBU and they were not given additional vitamins nor was I advised to give over the counter ones. Also just because something is a hospital policy doesn't make it gospel truth, some SCBUs have very old fashioned discharge policies that are not based on any recent research, my local hospital a baby has to be shown to be feeding formula well from a bottle in order to be discharged even a full term healthy birthweight baby who has had no issues gaining weight but is in there for a completely unrelated health problem. I spoke to some of the specialist doctors in the SCBU where my youngest was and they said they felt this was ridiculous and leading to babies being stopped from BF for no reason but they couldn't do anything about it. This particular SCBU's policy was also in direct contradiction to the overall policy of the NHS trust the PDF of which is online. I was reading a very extensive study recently about low birth weight and prem babies in India, some of whom were only given unfortified breastmilk, and others who were given formula or a mix of formula and breastmilk, obviously for the purposes of the study it was made sure the formula was being prepared correctly and not over diluted and so on. Surprisingly the babies fed only breastmilk may have taken some time to gain weight but in the longer term their weight gain was actually much better and after a few months they were a whole centile higher, on average, than the FF or combi fed babies. Definitely an area where more research is needed.

I personally do feel that breastmilk has nutritional and other advantages over formula milk otherwise I wouldn't breastfeed, something that in my area you have to fight tooth and nail to be 'allowed' to do. Bowel problems do run in my family and it is those that were formula fed in my family who have the worst issues, similarly with allergies, these run in both sides of the family but those BF for an extended period outgrow the allergies in toddlerhood whereas those who were FF continue to have allergies in the much longer term. My second youngest included, he was FF starting from 3.5 months old. My two sisters who were EFF from early on both suffered repeat ear infections as children and are now partially deaf. This is just in my family it may not be the same in other families. I have noticed that breastmilk whether put directly on a wound or ingested is a great healer, my youngest banged into the corner of a desk recently cutting his upper eyelid open and making a gash under his eye, :( and the GP said he'd develop quite a shiner that would take weeks to go fully back to normal, it is only 5 days later now and his eye is almost completely better with a faint yellowish bruise that is quickly fading. When the nurse saw him two days after he hurt his eye she was very surprised. My other boys when they got injured and were no longer breastfed their wounds wouldn't heal as quick. There are also protective qualities of breastfeeding for the mother that are often completely disregarded, no-one is saying BF is a magical panacea but if it reduces my risk of developing certain cancers then all the more reason for me to do it if possible.
 

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