Any Aussie ladies starting IVF?

[eveclo]

Thank you K, my husband and I have kind of learnt to just expect bad news, so good news is always a very pleasant surprise! Just waiting for a little bit of it

and yay! all of that information seems to point that the HCG can help. I have read that some women do have HCG injections as well to aid implantation, i believe it was one of the ladies on this forum actually? I may be wrong.

Sparkle time is coming next cycle, I have a very strong feeling. [/QUOTE]

Eve, I've also been reading along cheering for you all to get a BFP! I understand how hard it is to go through cycle after cycle..... Keep strong by not testing. The cycle I got pregnant I went for my blood test and they took so damn long with my results I was just about to do the pee test!!! I did it anyway after the call just so I could see the two lines

Sparkle, it's always good to have a break in between cycles. It does take a toll on your body. The other thing I had done was a endometrial biopsy which tests your natural killer cells (which is basically your little lady bits kicking the crap out of anything that comes near it). Mine were slightly elevated so my OB put me on antibiotics and I was on steroids until I was almost 13 weeks.... I can't say what did the trick... My husband still thinks it was our frozen popsicle (we had one fresh and one frozen put back in) but whatever it was, I'm eternally grateful.

I wish you all the best of luck and hope you all get positive news very soon! [/QUOTE]

I want to get my NKC tested too if this cycle fails! I just cannot fathom why it isn't working, since our 'infertility' is meant to be male factor. There has to be something sneaky going on in there. After our first ivf cycle, I came out with a rash over christmas (during the 2ww) that just smashed my body. I had it for about 2 weeks and ended up in hospital. They thought I may have had lupus or something but my tests all came back clear. It was an immune thing, almost like my body going completely crazy after having the EPU & ET. So I'm just not sure whether that may have had something to do with it & my body is just rejecting everything after my immune system had to kick in. I had chronic urticaria... Which is an autoimmune issue. Ahh, too much to think about!


Congratulations on your pregnancy, I hope everything is going smoothly

 

[babypizazz]

Thanks Eve! Getting bigger every day.... And he is kicking up a storm...

I would definitely suggest getting the NK test done. An Endo biopsy also increases your chances of pregnancy for the next 3 months... They scratch up your lining which apparently helps implantation. Good luck!

 

[Sparkle_13]

Thanks so much everyone for all your kind words and support I'm feeling better tonight, a bit more positive, I seem to have a bit of a downward spiral though after every blood test so we'll see how I'm feeling tomorrow

Kris_t thank you so much for reminding me of that! I have definitely heard that before but I guess my mind has been going so crazy that I forgot, I'm now thinking maybe we should try again as soon as we can... Lucky I didn't mention anything to DH I'm sure I will feel ready to go again when the time comes and I'm probably not in the best frame of mind to be making decisions that I don't need to make just yet. Your success definitely gives me hope.

Thanks babypizazz! 1 of my GFs had the NKC test done as she's had 2 miscarriages, I don't think my clinic does them but I could definitely get it done somewhere else. Do you mind me asking if you had it done because of previous losses or was it another reason? Also I've heard about it as both a blood test and a biopsy, does anyone know what the difference is? Congrats on your growing little bean, when is your due date, mustn't be long now?

Eve, you're right the nurse was really nice to me today, maybe she's not so bad after all (same nurse who told me bluntly to talk to a counsellor if I was having trouble sleeping as I was anxious about morning injections...). I'm so impressed by how strong you are, I've always been a bit of an emotional and anxious person so it's been hard but I think I'm doing ok (most of the time haha). Had a nice dinner with hubby tonight and then some gelato so I'm taking your advice about spoiling myself already

I know exactly what you mean about protecting yourself and I completely understand, also I don't think there is anything wrong with being prepared and emailing the new clinic, it makes us feel better to have backups and contingency plans. Personally i don't believe that having positive or negative thoughts will influence the outcome, all it means is that you will have an amazing surprise when you test!

It definitely sounds like immune testing could be a good avenue especially if you've had autoimmune issues in the past, and the endo scratch is also something that I've heard of having good results. My dr did one when I had my hysteroscopy done in December, it didn't make a difference at the time but I think that's cos we need ivf with our morphology issues.

I'll let you know how I go tomorrow xxx

 

[eveclo]

Thanks so much everyone for all your kind words and support I'm feeling better tonight, a bit more positive, I seem to have a bit of a downward spiral though after every blood test so we'll see how I'm feeling tomorrow

Kris_t thank you so much for reminding me of that! I have definitely heard that before but I guess my mind has been going so crazy that I forgot, I'm now thinking maybe we should try again as soon as we can... Lucky I didn't mention anything to DH I'm sure I will feel ready to go again when the time comes and I'm probably not in the best frame of mind to be making decisions that I don't need to make just yet. Your success definitely gives me hope.

Thanks babypizazz! 1 of my GFs had the NKC test done as she's had 2 miscarriages, I don't think my clinic does them but I could definitely get it done somewhere else. Do you mind me asking if you had it done because of previous losses or was it another reason? Also I've heard about it as both a blood test and a biopsy, does anyone know what the difference is? Congrats on your growing little bean, when is your due date, mustn't be long now?

Eve, you're right the nurse was really nice to me today, maybe she's not so bad after all (same nurse who told me bluntly to talk to a counsellor if I was having trouble sleeping as I was anxious about morning injections...). I'm so impressed by how strong you are, I've always been a bit of an emotional and anxious person so it's been hard but I think I'm doing ok (most of the time haha). Had a nice dinner with hubby tonight and then some gelato so I'm taking your advice about spoiling myself already

I know exactly what you mean about protecting yourself and I completely understand, also I don't think there is anything wrong with being prepared and emailing the new clinic, it makes us feel better to have backups and contingency plans. Personally i don't believe that having positive or negative thoughts will influence the outcome, all it means is that you will have an amazing surprise when you test!

It definitely sounds like immune testing could be a good avenue especially if you've had autoimmune issues in the past, and the endo scratch is also something that I've heard of having good results. My dr did one when I had my hysteroscopy done in December, it didn't make a difference at the time but I think that's cos we need ivf with our morphology issues.

I'll let you know how I go tomorrow xxx

Good on you! Sounds like its a well deserved treat. And thankyou! We'll see how everything turns up. I feel like a lightbulb went off in my head last night in regards to that rash. Now to find a doctor that can help me. Joy!

Good luck! Ill be thinking of you

 

[babypizazz]

Hey Sparkle, I had it done because we had "unexplained" infertility, no losses to speak of.... Although my OB liked to point out that my eggs were probably bad quality because of my age (I'm 39) and my husband had less than impressive sperm results.... I did have very short cycles so doing IVF was great for my progesterone. My progesterone when I fell preggo was crazy high but I was also doing the pregnyl shots rather than crinone.. They did the biopsy on me which is also the endo scratch. I hadn't heard of a blood test for it and probably a good thing 'cause I would have opted for that....

I hit 28 weeks on Friday so not too long to go now....

 

[eveclo]

Anxiously awaiting to hear how your results went sparkle! I hope things are going down !

 

[Sparkle_13]

Hcg has gone up to 194... wtf is going on

They've told me to go get an ultrasound tomorrow at the early pregnancy assessment unit at the RPA, they said there is a very good chance they won't be able to see anything as it's so early, so I'm not sure if they're just sending me to help ease my mind or what... Hmmm this is really frustrating!

Thanks for checking in on me Eve

 

[eveclo]

Hcg has gone up to 194... wtf is going on

They've told me to go get an ultrasound tomorrow at the early pregnancy assessment unit at the RPA, they said there is a very good chance they won't be able to see anything as it's so early, so I'm not sure if they're just sending me to help ease my mind or what... Hmmm this is really frustrating!

Thanks for checking in on me Eve

what on earth is going on? I hope you are OK!!! This is just getting ridiculous.. I hope the ultrasound can help them work out how to help you...

Let me know how you go tomorrow, i'll be sending positive vibes from Brissy Do they still think it could be ectopic? Are you having any pain?

I'll be 7dp5dt tomorrow, and I know that if i did a test it would probably be accurate. I really just want to wait until our blood test on Monday, but then i remembered i would be at work, so i don't know how well i would do..considering i work in an office of about 8 of us, and we are all so close! I might call in sick just to have the whole day to be a sad sack haha. PLUS- my husband goes away on Monday until Friday for work. So i have the WHOLE week to be an absolute wreck by myself. Just such bad timing. Or, I could test on Sunday and just get it over and done with. By then I would be 11dp5dt which is definitely far enough to get a real result. If it's negative theres basically no chance it will be positive. Too many decisions to make, not enough time in my days to make them

I have been going absolutely crazy looking at immune issues on the internet and i am becoming so certain that this is a problem for us. I am going to be super persistent and take control when we end up doing our next cycle, but we have just spent too much already on IVF for me to feel comfortable doing it again straight away.

Sorry for having a massive rant! Sometimes I just feel like you / you ladies are the only ones that really understand! xx and SPARKLE, good luck again.

 

[Sparkle_13]

I know it's ridiculous huh! Excuse my French buts it's a total mind f**k! I think they think an ectopic is a possibility but not necessarily likely. I just find it so confusing cos they keep saying any day now I'll start bleeding and "we should start to see your hcg go down at your next test" but it just doesn't happen... It's not like I'm deluding myself that it could be viable it's just that I thought when it was over it would be over and as usual they only give me info as things come up so I never feel like I've prepared myself.

I've been having quite a bit of cramping and have felt like AF is on her way since Sunday but it just doesn't happen...

Oh that sucks hun that your hubby will be away all week, although I think it sucks cos you won't get to celebrate with him I know that you didn't want to test early but if I was you I would test on Sunday morning that way you and hubby will get the result together. If you wait till Monday though then I think taking the day off is a great idea, treat yourself to something nice On the off chance that you don't get good news maybe you could let someone else close to you know just so you can have some support while DH is away?

I didn't think you were ranting but either way no need to apologise, I do the same thing and you're right that's what we're here for

Thanks for the positive vibes, I'm sending sticky ones right back at ya xxx

 

[eveclo]

I know it's ridiculous huh! Excuse my French buts it's a total mind f**k! I think they think an ectopic is a possibility but not necessarily likely. I just find it so confusing cos they keep saying any day now I'll start bleeding and "we should start to see your hcg go down at your next test" but it just doesn't happen... It's not like I'm deluding myself that it could be viable it's just that I thought when it was over it would be over and as usual they only give me info as things come up so I never feel like I've prepared myself.

I've been having quite a bit of cramping and have felt like AF is on her way since Sunday but it just doesn't happen...

Oh that sucks hun that your hubby will be away all week, although I think it sucks cos you won't get to celebrate with him I know that you didn't want to test early but if I was you I would test on Sunday morning that way you and hubby will get the result together. If you wait till Monday though then I think taking the day off is a great idea, treat yourself to something nice On the off chance that you don't get good news maybe you could let someone else close to you know just so you can have some support while DH is away?

I didn't think you were ranting but either way no need to apologise, I do the same thing and you're right that's what we're here for

Thanks for the positive vibes, I'm sending sticky ones right back at ya xxx

Yep, you're right. It's like they are acting like they know how it all works and put false hope into you and then when things don't go as planned they cover their bums by saying next time! I just can't understand why it would be going up? So you're not having any spotting at all? I'm guessing the pregnancy tests would all still be a positive... Geez this is just ridiculous I actually can't even fathom it in my brain?

You're right, I think I'll just go and buy a FRER on Sunday and do the test and just have the day to be a sook, and then by Monday ill be fine. IF I need to sook I literally feel not one symptom my boobs have even stopped hurting, haha To be completely honest I am really happy that I will be looking into a new doctor and everything, so that is giving me a little more hope, although I did read an article saying that after 5 ivfs your chances go down heaps, and this was our '4th' transfer. So we'll see.

Thank you for the sticky vibes! I definitely need Em' xxx

 

[Sparkle_13]

I know that's the most frustrating thing that I keep expecting it to be over soon and then when it's not they say ok but it'll be soon. Just in the hospital waiting room now. I have been having a little spotting since Sunday that comes and goes, but that's it.

I don't think it means anything that you haven't had any symptoms, I think that's pretty normal and you shouldn't take it as a bad sign.

If it doesn't work out though I agree with you that it's great you're seeing another dr, I think a 2nd opinion is definitely in order, a fresh set of eyes may be just what you need. And I wouldn't worry to much about those statistics your still quite young, also I think the fact that you've done 4 transfers but that the dr didn't do anything different needs to be taken into account. Also I wonder if with your first transfers as they weren't 5 day if that has made a difference. Sorry if none of that made sense I'm on my phone. I'll update you later although unfortunately I'm very much expecting that they won't be able to tell me much...

Xxx

 

[eveclo]

I know that's the most frustrating thing that I keep expecting it to be over soon and then when it's not they say ok but it'll be soon. Just in the hospital waiting room now. I have been having a little spotting since Sunday that comes and goes, but that's it.

I don't think it means anything that you haven't had any symptoms, I think that's pretty normal and you shouldn't take it as a bad sign.

If it doesn't work out though I agree with you that it's great you're seeing another dr, I think a 2nd opinion is definitely in order, a fresh set of eyes may be just what you need. And I wouldn't worry to much about those statistics your still quite young, also I think the fact that you've done 4 transfers but that the dr didn't do anything different needs to be taken into account. Also I wonder if with your first transfers as they weren't 5 day if that has made a difference. Sorry if none of that made sense I'm on my phone. I'll update you later although unfortunately I'm very much expecting that they won't be able to tell me much...

Xxx

I will make sure I keep you updated over this forum/I want to be kept updated with your journey

All of that definately makes sense. It's just a scary thought to think if I could have my own babies, or at least carry them.

I hope your ultrasound is going ok, I assume its this afternoon?? I think I'm getting a little bit of bleeding today, i realized I am 8dp5dt. So 13 dpo.. Sounds about right. We'll see what happens

 

[Sparkle_13]

Some spotting and bleeding at 13dpo could be implantation? You're on quite a high dose of progesterone right so surely it would be more likely that than breakthrough bleeding. My fingers and toes are crossed for you hun

So what a morning! I arrived at the hospital just before 8am, 1st I saw a midwife who said it's probably too early to see anything but sent me off for an ultrasound anyway, in the ultrasound the tech said they couldn't see anything in my uterus but this was not a surprise this early and especially with my low hcg level. They did find something though on my left side and it was really painful when she was poking around there, they're not sure what it is but the midwife then got the registrar who thought it might be an ectopic and was thinking we should do a laparoscopy! Scary! Luckily she then called in the gynaecologist who went through everything again and thought it could be a few things but she's leaning towards possibly some blood from my retrieval in the cavity around my ovary that has clumped together and formed a clot (this should hopefully go away on its own), another alternative is it could be an infection from my retrieval (so they gave me antibiotics just in case of this), or it could be a cyst, or it could be an ectopic. She wants me to wait a bit and go back in a week for another ultrasound or rush straight to emergency if my pain gets any worse or anything else changes. They were all really wonderful and caring and they put so much time into me (I was there for 4 hours!) but unfortunately they just can't tell me much and we just have to continue to wait and see

At least I'm feeling a bit better emotionally today, not sure why, I guess I'm just getting used to not really knowing what's going on haha

Sorry for the essay

 

[eveclo]

Some spotting and bleeding at 13dpo could be implantation? You're on quite a high dose of progesterone right so surely it would be more likely that than breakthrough bleeding. My fingers and toes are crossed for you hun

So what a morning! I arrived at the hospital just before 8am, 1st I saw a midwife who said it's probably too early to see anything but sent me off for an ultrasound anyway, in the ultrasound the tech said they couldn't see anything in my uterus but this was not a surprise this early and especially with my low hcg level. They did find something though on my left side and it was really painful when she was poking around there, they're not sure what it is but the midwife then got the registrar who thought it might be an ectopic and was thinking we should do a laparoscopy! Scary! Luckily she then called in the gynaecologist who went through everything again and thought it could be a few things but she's leaning towards possibly some blood from my retrieval in the cavity around my ovary that has clumped together and formed a clot (this should hopefully go away on its own), another alternative is it could be an infection from my retrieval (so they gave me antibiotics just in case of this), or it could be a cyst, or it could be an ectopic. She wants me to wait a bit and go back in a week for another ultrasound or rush straight to emergency if my pain gets any worse or anything else changes. They were all really wonderful and caring and they put so much time into me (I was there for 4 hours!) but unfortunately they just can't tell me much and we just have to continue to wait and see

At least I'm feeling a bit better emotionally today, not sure why, I guess I'm just getting used to not really knowing what's going on haha

Sorry for the essay

It's a bit late for implantation though I think... I will hold onto that wishful thought though for a while! Hehe.

That's great that all the nurses were so nice & caring. You've been through a lot the past few months!!! Well deserved.

Ouch!! This all sounds painful. Will they do another ultrasound soon to check if there is any growth or anything in that area?

I'm so glad to hear you are feeling better emotionally. It's weird how this ivf business works... You kind of just learn to accept things and roll with the punches. It's what you have to do to keep sane. Or you run the risk of becoming completely loco! Hehe.

I am seriously hoping it is not ectopic. I just can't understand why your HCG goes up? So much confusion. I guess that's why I'm not a doctor!

Thanks for updating! It's funny I actually get quite nervous to read what you've written in case it's something really bad & ill feel horrible and want to help but I know I can't! This is why I can't even watch the Voice- I tear up when someone gets rejected or bad news haha! Constantly worrying for everyone. Eh, well at least you know someone on here is thinking of you haha

 

[Sparkle_13]

Ohhh you are way to cute! That's so sweet honey and I feel the same about you

Talking about getting teary during TV shows, you don't happen to watch Offspring do you? Omg talk about a tear jerker! I was actually physically sobbing during the final episode last season, and the cried pretty much the whole 1st episode of the new season, last night was the 2nd episode and I think I only got teary a couple of times haha! I'm such a baby, DH thinks it's pretty funny

They just said to come back next Thursday for another ultrasound, but if my pain gets any worse to go straight in. Exactly like you said though I'm trying to just relax and let it be so I don't go completely crazy there is nothing more I can do now other than be super vigilant

Nah I disagree I don't think it's too late for implantation, also they say IVFers often implant late

Xxx

 

[eveclo]

Ohhh you are way to cute! That's so sweet honey and I feel the same about you

Talking about getting teary during TV shows, you don't happen to watch Offspring do you? Omg talk about a tear jerker! I was actually physically sobbing during the final episode last season, and the cried pretty much the whole 1st episode of the new season, last night was the 2nd episode and I think I only got teary a couple of times haha! I'm such a baby, DH thinks it's pretty funny

They just said to come back next Thursday for another ultrasound, but if my pain gets any worse to go straight in. Exactly like you said though I'm trying to just relax and let it be so I don't go completely crazy there is nothing more I can do now other than be super vigilant

Nah I disagree I don't think it's too late for implantation, also they say IVFers often implant late

Xxx

I actually don't! Is it worth watching? The adverts look good but I haven't watched the previous series so I'm worried ill have no clue as to what is going on? I might track down the last series and start to watch it. I was really into that love child show when it was on & I loved puberty blues too, so I would love a show to get into! Plus, tears are just a bonus I think- hehe. My husband cracks up every time any of those shows are on, he always leans over to have a look at my eyes, it's hard because even when I'm not crying ill get accussed of it anyways haha

Just look after yourself, and make sure you get help if you do have more pain

Oh woohoo well in that case ill keep my confidence up a little. thanks sparkle xxxx

 

[Sparkle_13]

Yeah you definitely have to watch at least the last season, I think it would be hard to get into if you started from now. It's really good though, pretty kooky but good

That is so funny you sound exactly like DH and me, I cry during pretty much anything including in like suspense/action movies when I'm scared of what's going to happen , but especially anything sad and DH is always checking to see if I'm crying and asking "are you crying?" Even when I'm not too haha

Xxx

 

[Sparkle_13]

Have you decided if your going to test hun? Any fun plans for the wknd to keep you distracted?

I've had a bit of light to medium AF since yesterday so it might be over soon, it's such a strange feeling hoping that it ends soon because of course I know it would never be anything but at the same time it feels so weird to think that... That probably doesn't make any sense, I think I'm overtired. Bedtime me thinks

Let me know if any updates Eve and have a great wknd everyone xxx

 

[eveclo]

Have you decided if your going to test hun? Any fun plans for the wknd to keep you distracted?

I've had a bit of light to medium AF since yesterday so it might be over soon, it's such a strange feeling hoping that it ends soon because of course I know it would never be anything but at the same time it feels so weird to think that... That probably doesn't make any sense, I think I'm overtired. Bedtime me thinks

Let me know if any updates Eve and have a great wknd everyone xxx

I got my period today!! I am going to text my doctor tomorrow. But I just woke up this morning and the bleeding was a lot more (just the same as last cycles), and then tonight even more so. So we are out... Although we kind of both knew, we are still disappointed but you just can't do any more.

Well, I'm glad that you're getting a little more something... Maybe this time we will be in sync with cycles... Hehe.

Sorry I haven't updated sooner, had a crazy day at work & then I came home and ate pizza. Well deserved I think.

Next steps for us, I'll hopefully talk to our current doctor about getting a possible test done on my NK cells, although she has never brought this up so I'm nervous for her reaction, as I've heard some people say a lot of doctors aren't a fan or believe in immune issues. It's all about waiting now, especially since we are going down to one wage for a while, I don't think it's a good time to be dipping into even more of our savings. Plus we bought a car probably should pay that off first now.

Ahh, it's so amazing to think if i were to tell myself back in September when our ivf journey began that we would still be here and have had 4 embryo transfers and not one had stuck of even semi stuck, I would never have believed it! Hopefully our luck changes, we aren't bad people and good things happen to good people eventually, just got to keep our heads up.

Have a good weekend Sparkle, I hope AF treats you kindly. We are going to spend some time with friends and family. My good friend has asked me to look after her 15 month old on Sunday (as I often do when she needs someone), and when she asked today I did feel like my heart sunk a little, just because it kind of hurts me and my husband when we spend time with him and realize we may never 'have' this. But I realized my life can't just stop for this anymore. My life is wonderful. Although some days I don't feel this way, I have to remember that this is not everything, just a small part: it's not over until its over. Thanks for listening to me. Or reading me... Haha xxx

 

[MiracleAngel]

Have you decided if your going to test hun? Any fun plans for the wknd to keep you distracted?

I've had a bit of light to medium AF since yesterday so it might be over soon, it's such a strange feeling hoping that it ends soon because of course I know it would never be anything but at the same time it feels so weird to think that... That probably doesn't make any sense, I think I'm overtired. Bedtime me thinks

Let me know if any updates Eve and have a great wknd everyone xxx

I got my period today!! I am going to text my doctor tomorrow. But I just woke up this morning and the bleeding was a lot more (just the same as last cycles), and then tonight even more so. So we are out... Although we kind of both knew, we are still disappointed but you just can't do any more.

Well, I'm glad that you're getting a little more something... Maybe this time we will be in sync with cycles... Hehe.

Sorry I haven't updated sooner, had a crazy day at work & then I came home and ate pizza. Well deserved I think.

Next steps for us, I'll hopefully talk to our current doctor about getting a possible test done on my NK cells, although she has never brought this up so I'm nervous for her reaction, as I've heard some people say a lot of doctors aren't a fan or believe in immune issues. It's all about waiting now, especially since we are going down to one wage for a while, I don't think it's a good time to be dipping into even more of our savings. Plus we bought a car probably should pay that off first now.

Ahh, it's so amazing to think if i were to tell myself back in September when our ivf journey began that we would still be here and have had 4 embryo transfers and not one had stuck of even semi stuck, I would never have believed it! Hopefully our luck changes, we aren't bad people and good things happen to good people eventually, just got to keep our heads up.

Have a good weekend Sparkle, I hope AF treats you kindly. We are going to spend some time with friends and family. My good friend has asked me to look after her 15 month old on Sunday (as I often do when she needs someone), and when she asked today I did feel like my heart sunk a little, just because it kind of hurts me and my husband when we spend time with him and realize we may never 'have' this. But I realized my life can't just stop for this anymore. My life is wonderful. Although some days I don't feel this way, I have to remember that this is not everything, just a small part: it's not over until its over. Thanks for listening to me. Or reading me... Haha xxx

Ohhh Eveclo... you made me cry now... I wish I was so positive as you are!!!! You really must have a very good soul! Enjoy your marriage and your friends and when you have the financial resources to try again... Just do it!!!
I understand your feelings and could never imagine it would be so difficult to have a baby... Here I am, after a tube removed, 2 failed IUIs, I failed IVF and current on the last day of my 2nd IVF cycle... I just came back from my blood test... Results this afternoon.
This morning when I woke up, I tested again and the HPT showed a lighter second line... for me, that was a sign of a chemical pregnancy... It was a message saying: You got close to have your baby, but still not this time.
Talked to my husband and this is our last shot. If it doesn't work, we don't have the financial resources to do it again... Deep inside, I think this is over, but I will update the status of my Beta this afternoon.