breast is no longer best...new research

[milkmachine]

i didnt appreciate being sworn at. or accused of saying that ff were anything under bfeeder because thats not what i said and i wouldnt want anyone just dipping into the thread to think that of me.

 

[Blah11]

Lets just pretend 'that' post didn't happen!

 

[Wobbles]

Im still half asleep too - not good

 

[Wobbles]

i didnt appreciate being sworn at. or accused of saying that ff were anything under bfeeder because thats not what i said and i wouldnt want anyone just dipping into the thread to think that of me.

Im sure you don't so try to respond to that without swearing yourself or using offending comments OR if you think you have been misunderstood in your meaning and feel you have been talk ed to wrongly then again why not come about it yourself and exaplain without lowering your own personal tone keeping yourself sane at the same time.

^ Something for everyone to consider? haha You never know whist you think you have been misunderstood maybe you have misunderstood a reply so TALK to each other.

 

[Jo]

i didnt appreciate being sworn at. or accused of saying that ff were anything under bfeeder because thats not what i said and i wouldnt want anyone just dipping into the thread to think that of me.

But you didn't report it, we can't watch every thread every second, maybe if it had been reported, it could have been dealt with sooner

 

[milkmachine]

lol i only quoted what was said to me! and defended myself after some really aggressive posts. but yeah im wrong.

 

[Jo]

lol i only quoted what was said to me! and defended myself after some really aggressive posts. but yeah im wrong.

Milkmachine you are misunderstanding me.
I never said you were wrong at all, I'd be seriously annoyed if I was sworn at.
I meant if the original post (swearing) had been reported, maybe it could have been dealt with and moved on from.

 

[caz81]

i have just read this whole thread took a while and pages kept getting added as i was reading lol!!

i get really annoyed at this constant pressure to breast feed and little acceptance of the fact that it does not work for some people. I had an emergency c-section after a horrible labour, the hospital then wisked off my baby without asking me and bottle fed her, she was bottle fed a few times and then refused to latch on, i then got sh*t from the drs at the hospital for not breast feeding when they were the ones that made it so difficult (i cant wait to be back in england!) So yes i agree that breast feeding is probably better but i am fed up with being made to feel guilty because i could not do it. This was posted in ff section so i dont think it was necessary for loads of people to come in here and make people who ff feel guilty-im not saying it was the intention but it certainly was the result....

i also think that the benefits of breast feeding can at times be misunderstood - for example here the women are told if they breastfeed they will not 100% get pregnant - we know that not to be true so could other benefits be exaggerated? i dont know, im not a scientist and im guessing the rest of us arnt either.

Please respect the forum this is in (ff) and realise there are people here who are already really upset they can not breast feed - i feel so guilty and think i have not given my daughter the best start - i dont need people to add to that guilt

 

[PeanutBean]

I'm still ploughing through this thread but in the mean time here is some info for you all.

I have just read the published scientific paper that this story came from. I cannot quite believe how completely misreported it has been. The paper looks at a causal relationship between mothers breastfeeding and the level of androgens during their pregnancy (which is itself relates to a number of conditions including PCOS). The conclusion is that mothers breastfeed less when they have had high levels of andgrogens during pregnancy. An exact copy of text from the discussion is below for those who wish to read the science. There is nothing that says anything about whether or not breastmilk is good or bad.

In accordance with our overall hypothesis, we found that breastfeeding among women in both our study groups was negatively associated with maternal androgen levels in the second trimester of pregnancy. In both groups of women, the effect was essentially unaffected by adjustment for factors known to influence breastfeeding such as maternal age, education, and smoking (8).
Theoretically, if there is a causal relation, at least three mechanisms may explain the observed association between maternal gestational androgen levels and ensuing breastfeeding. High androgen levels during pregnancy may inhibit transformation of the breast in to the lactating state. Postpartum androgen levels, which may associate with gestational levels, may
inhibit lactation. Third, it is also possible that androgens have psychological effects making women less dedicated to breastfeeding. A combination of these mechanisms is a fourth possibility.

 

[helen1234]

i still stand bt what i say, you stand my boy next to any breast fed baby

 

[helen1234]

I still stand by standing my child next to bf baby and you spot the differance.

i'm not saying either is better, i will try bf'ing my next baby purely for convieneance.

thing is it gets people who ff backs up because even though you dont think your doing it your subconciously making ff mothers feel like they arent feeding their baby properly. and its a touchy thing if your feeling gulity about it.

it doesnt make you supermum cos you bf, it doesnt make ff 2nd best either.

unfortunatly what is natural for one mum isnt for another no matter how they try.

 

[OmarsMum]

I had a traumatic CS after 20 hrs of inducing. MW tried to force me to BF, my LO couldnt latch on. They left him to starve for 18 hrs! they sent me a BF consultant & kept trying with him for 2 hrs, but he just refused! His jaundice increased to 14.8. Whever I asked for milk they looked at me as if I'm asking for poison! I had to leave the hospital 1 day earlier because of all the stress.

I couldnt handle all the stress of BFing, so, I went for FF. I'm happy & my LO is happy with it..

Until now, when I take my LO for his routine checkups, they give me a disaproving look for FF..

It should be left for nature, & not for debating & argueing. I dont really knw which is better, my mom & all my family BF, and they think I'm odd for FFing.

I dont try to explain myself or find excuses, I just smile as I knw I did what's best for my LO

 

[milkmachine]

you have to do whats right for you at the time

 

[Hevz]

Helen you've shattered my illusions now....gonna put my Supermum outfit away now

 

[Blah11]

Think people are forgetting that stats are based on averages so yes, a BF baby could be far more sickly than a FF baby but on average BF babies have less ear infections etc etc It doesn't mean that your FF baby is going to get increased ear infections just that if you BF your baby the chances of them getting one decreases. Hope that makes sense

 

[Serene123]

It is a shame this thread got angry.

I agree with Helen that if you sit them next to eachother or compare them you can't really tell the difference. Breast fed babies are meant to be more fussy at night but one of my friends (MissJacey) little boy was fussy during the night for longer than Caitlyn. It's just one of those things though, statistically BF babies wake up more in the night for a longer period of their life, and statistically they don't get as poorly. EVERY child is an individual though and none of the statistics can make you decide 100% whether a baby has been FF or BF. You can't look at a baby being a little bit sick and say "THAT BABY IS FF" because Caitlyn was sick after FF and BF.

I honestly don't think this debate is ever going to end anytime soon


Edit: I just read Blah's reply and realise that I've almost said the same thing she did

 

[Kayleigh09]

I had a traumatic CS after 20 hrs of inducing. MW tried to force me to BF, my LO couldnt latch on. They left him to starve for 18 hrs! they sent me a BF consultant & kept trying with him for 2 hrs, but he just refused! His jaundice increased to 14.8. Whever I asked for milk they looked at me as if I'm asking for poison! I had to leave the hospital 1 day earlier because of all the stress.

I couldnt handle all the stress of BFing, so, I went for FF. I'm happy & my LO is happy with it..

Until now, when I take my LO for his routine checkups, they give me a disaproving look for FF..

It should be left for nature, & not for debating & argueing. I dont really knw which is better, my mom & all my family BF, and they think I'm odd for FFing.

I dont try to explain myself or find excuses, I just smile as I knw I did what's best for my LO

I couldnt handle the stress of it either, i hated it when the midwives came in and said ''time to try again''. it made me feel like a cow!!! They'd come in, grab Summer, tell me i was holding her in the wrong position then ram her head onto my nipple, was hardly nice and certainly didnt feel natural to me!! I hated the way they did that and Summer used to get so upset and i did aswell. She was only 5lb when she was born so i felt like she could break at any minute and there was the midwife ramming her head onto my boob!! Definitely not attempting it next time!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Lucy_lu_84]

Also I don't think BF Mums are trying to make FF mums feel guilty...

At the same time i sometmes feels like FF Mums would rather BF mum's never gave their opinions on BF at all.

When i changed from BF to FF I spoke to a mixture of people and I have to say from the people I spoke to I felt a lot more pressure from the FF Mums to change over to bottles than I did from BF mums to try and carry on BF. I always wondered why this was! In fact I had little or no pressure to carry on BF... all the BF Mums seems to understand and just offered my support on what ever option I chose.
No idea why this is... but I know alot of people thinkg BF want everyone to bf, and put pressure and make them feel guilty I never found this at all. But then that might just tbe the people I spoke to

 

[passengerrach]

is it just me or is this thread just people repeating them selves over and over again i feel like this thread could maybe be narrowed down to like 5 posts that are different lol. why dont we just give it a rest hey girls i dont think anyone is saying anything weve all not heard before x chill out theres a lot more important things in the world than bf or ff

 

[Blah11]

I had a traumatic CS after 20 hrs of inducing. MW tried to force me to BF, my LO couldnt latch on. They left him to starve for 18 hrs! they sent me a BF consultant & kept trying with him for 2 hrs, but he just refused! His jaundice increased to 14.8. Whever I asked for milk they looked at me as if I'm asking for poison! I had to leave the hospital 1 day earlier because of all the stress.

I couldnt handle all the stress of BFing, so, I went for FF. I'm happy & my LO is happy with it..

Until now, when I take my LO for his routine checkups, they give me a disaproving look for FF..

It should be left for nature, & not for debating & argueing. I dont really knw which is better, my mom & all my family BF, and they think I'm odd for FFing.

I dont try to explain myself or find excuses, I just smile as I knw I did what's best for my LO

I couldnt handle the stress of it either, i hated it when the midwives came in and said ''time to try again''. it made me feel like a cow!!! They'd come in, grab Summer, tell me i was holding her in the wrong position then ram her head onto my nipple, was hardly nice and certainly didnt feel natural to me!! I hated the way they did that and Summer used to get so upset and i did aswell. She was only 5lb when she was born so i felt like she could break at any minute and there was the midwife ramming her head onto my boob!! Definitely not attempting it next time!!!!!!!!!!

In defense of the midwifes, it looks like they can't win People moan about them not helping them BF and giving them a bottle at the first oppurtunity and not giving any support and then you get people in your situation saying it's horrible that they were trying with you They're damned if they do, and damned if they don't.