CBFM Buddy

[smythdm]

Daisy - definitely think you need to get the "Dr." title in there - you have way way more answers than my doctor does (or that he gives me anyway).

 

[jchic]

Daisy is a doctor. She literally is my personal obyn, re and gp. I AM however, willing to share her with you ladies!

How is everyone? AFM, had mindnumbing cramps yesterday and now they are gone, woop! Waiting on AF now, should be here by Monday, then onto IUI with injectables!

 

[DaisyQ]

Daisy - definitely think you need to get the "Dr." title in there - you have way way more answers than my doctor does (or that he gives me anyway).

That's sad actually! I wish our doctors were more informative. I think they assume that because they are DOCTORS in their magical white coats, that we little people can't understand what's going on with our bodies, so they don't even attempt to try to explain. At least I feel that's the case with my doctor - he gives me the least amount of information possible, which is so frustrating.

Also doctors might know a lot in their specific field, but they don't know everything about everything, although they like to think they do. I'm a nutritionist in a hospital, and it's shocking how little doctors know about nutrition. But most of them THINK they know. It's unbelievable really. In two weeks, I've come across two mistakes by doctors that are related to nutrition, and it's obvious the mistakes were made because they really do not have an in depth understanding. Anyway, rant over.

So - it's official.

Devastated. Spent the morning crying and decided (at husband's urging) to take the day off to recover emotionally and just take it easy. Mental health day I guess. As much as I thought I was prepared for the BFN, having gotten one two days ago, I guess it's still a hard pill to swallow. It's much harder now, with IUI etc., because your hopes are higher. You feel like it really should work - with TWO eggs and 137 million sperm put RIGHT there - how could it not? But I guess it doesn't always work like that. It just makes me feel hopeless about it ever working. I'm just anxious to get through the next few cycles and move onto IVF. Now if that doesn't work, I will be utterly beside myself.

 

[Dawnlouise30]

Daisy

Daisy - definitely think you need to get the "Dr." title in there - you have way way more answers than my doctor does (or that he gives me anyway).

That's sad actually! I wish our doctors were more informative. I think they assume that because they are DOCTORS in their magical white coats, that we little people can't understand what's going on with our bodies, so they don't even attempt to try to explain. At least I feel that's the case with my doctor - he gives me the least amount of information possible, which is so frustrating.

Also doctors might know a lot in their specific field, but they don't know everything about everything, although they like to think they do. I'm a nutritionist in a hospital, and it's shocking how little doctors know about nutrition. But most of them THINK they know. It's unbelievable really. In two weeks, I've come across two mistakes by doctors that are related to nutrition, and it's obvious the mistakes were made because they really do not have an in depth understanding. Anyway, rant over.

So - it's official.

Devastated. Spent the morning crying and decided (at husband's urging) to take the day off to recover emotionally and just take it easy. Mental health day I guess. As much as I thought I was prepared for the BFN, having gotten one two days ago, I guess it's still a hard pill to swallow. It's much harder now, with IUI etc., because your hopes are higher. You feel like it really should work - with TWO eggs and 137 million sperm put RIGHT there - how could it not? But I guess it doesn't always work like that. It just makes me feel hopeless about it ever working. I'm just anxious to get through the next few cycles and move onto IVF. Now if that doesn't work, I will be utterly beside myself.

 

[Anxiously]

Sorry about the BFN Daisy I know that not seeing a line when it's time is a hard truth to bear. I'm contemplating not using a hpt until I'm into my 2nd trimester if it really happens

I must have cut a pathetic figure in the shower the night of AF's arrival - all alone (hubby's overseas), crying my heart out, thinking that my body's useless and asking the big WHY.

But after I calmed down, I told myself that I must go on as usual, and maintain my health and stress level for that one chance that I will have, someday, a child of my own. I'll gladly go through hundreds of IUIs and IVFs or whatever new technology there is to get there. And we're not alone in this, having been here exchanging heartbreaking stories, anxiety, happiness with all the other lovely ladies from all around the world.

 

[tinkerbellsie]

Aww Daisy I'm so sorry. maybe it is because the timings were off? Hope they get it tight for you this month. Xxx

 

[Mrs.B.]

daisy xx

 

[ttc_lolly]

Daisy huge massive to you x

 

[smythdm]

Daisy - I'm so so sorry. I know that some months are worse than others, and it sounds like this one was a doozy for you. It sucks. Give yourself enough time to be upset and mourn this cycle. Its funny how things work, in that your body gives you the time to do that during AF, and so far, for me anyway, by the time its O time, I've got renewed hope.

How many IUI cycles are you going to do before moving on to IVF. Recently talked to a co-worker and she said her only regret through the entire process was doing too many IUIs before moving on to IVF (which worked for her). Its so hard to determine your whole plan - how long, how many cycles, what to do, when, if you want to do ANYTHING.

Do something nice for yourself today and take it easy on yourself this weekend!

 

[chicky160]

Oh daisy xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

[DaisyQ]

Thank you to ALL of you ladies for your sweet words and support - the warmth and caring is palpable all the way over here in my corner of New Jersey!

The original treatment plan was to do 2 IUI cycles with clomid and one with injectables. We did not discuss IVF specifically or what the timeline for that would be. I think my Doc didn't want us to get ahead of ourselves, and of course we are all hoping IUI will be enough. My assumption is that after 3 failed IUIs, IVF would then be on the table.

I'm a big planner, and so I've looked ahead to see how this is all going to play out in terms of dates. As it turns out we are traveling during some critical times of my cycle, which throws some kinks into the original treatment plan. Specifically, travelling will mess up our third IUI cycle, which is supposed to be the one using injectable meds. That cycle, I will be out of town from CD 2-9. Thus I won't be able to do CD 3 blood work or go in for monitoring every other day, that injectable meds requires. I discussed this with the nurse and she said I could do another Clomid cycle. Not too jazzed about that suggestion. I don't love the side effects with Clomid, and it thins the lining etc. And injectable meds have better results. So the idea of doing a third IUI on Clomid and doing a FOURTH IUI on injectables in late May is not so appealing. This brings me to the second "kink" in the treatment plan. We are traveling in late June/early July as well! If all FOUR IUIs have failed, and IVF is now on the table, we would want to get that started in June. I'm not sure I will be able to do it in June because of that trip!! Which might mean a fifth IUI, and IVF in July/August. UGH.

To make matters more complicated (are you all still with me??), I have a 10K total, lifetime fertility benefit which includes IUI and IVF. So.... I'm not sure how much of this benefit we'll have left after 3, or 4, or 5 IUIs to cover the IVF. We are also financially tight at the moment - my husband lost his job 2 days after we got married, and although he got another job right away working for a completing firm, it pays less (for right now - it's sort of a start up). He also got sued by his former employer for violating his non-compete agreement (long but very interesting story - it's like a corporate warfare movie over here) so we lost money there as well. On top of that - there's an ex-wife who gets a very generous alimony/child support package (FOR THE NEXT 10 YEARS, don't get me started!). UGH!. So bottom line is that we don't have a ton of cash to put toward fertility treatments, so we have to use this 10K wisely.

So all of that said (sorry for going on and on and on) - I'm going to see the doctor on April 10th to discuss a revised treatment plan that will be the most cost (and time) effective. I'm going to see about doing IVF in APRIL - (!!!) or at the latest, in June.

My anxiety, like you said Smyth, is that we are going to waste valuable time, EMOTION, and financial resources on the IUIs, which aren't that effective, when we could be doing IVF, which is more effective.

So, we'll see...

My friend who went through this for FOUR long years, also recommends not waiting long before going to IVF, especially considering my age. She did IUI after IUI, and all the meds, and nothing worked. Then she did one round of IVF and poof - she is due any day.

Her opinion (not a doctor - but you know, a "daisy" type of doctor!), is that for women who do not ovulate on their own, IUI with ovulation induction can be very effective. But for women who already ovulate on their own, her impression is that IUI doesn't work - because the problem isn't with ovulation - it's either with sperm and egg actually meeting, or sperm penetrating egg. etc. And IVF fixes all that. So.

Yeah. OK I'm done. Going to do clomid and IUI this cycle (back to back - I'm calling the doc next week about it) and see how soon we can move to IVF.

 

[smythdm]

Hey guys -

Just had a really frustrating call with my OB. We spent 2 min on the phone, which was apparantly 2 min longer than he wanted. My husbands sperm count is low. He wouldn't give me numbers or tell me how low, or anything about the motility and morphology.

I also asked why my Day 3 and 21 tests weren't done with him; why he was turfing me over to a RE, and he just said b/c i can't do anything if the results aren't what we want them to be.

So long story short. I'm finding a new OB/GYN. I don't feel valued and this is a consumer business, so I'm taking my business elsewhere. Maybe I'll go back to him when I'm pregnant b/c I hear awesome stories about how he is with delivery and the other docs in his practice, but for now, my needs are not being met.

Question for you ladies - specifically what tests (other than HSG and SA) did you have done at your OB before going to an RE?

 

[DaisyQ]

Smyth, I'm sorry you had a frustrating call.

But listen. This is actually a positive thing. I think what your doctor is trying to say if you read between the lines, is that he is not qualified to deal with these fertility issues. He probably didn't tell you what all the SA numbers were, because this is not his area. He may not know how to interpret the numbers, and if you were to ask him what they mean, he might be stumped and either in a position to say he doesn't know (and what MAN ever admits they don't know!), or he would take a guess, which is not serving your best interests.

I actually think his reason for referring you on to a RE is a good call. It's true - if your tests on CD 3 and 21 are abnormal, he can't do much about it really. This is not his area. Very few (if any) OBs are qualified to treat infertility. That's why there are REs, who are BOTH OBs and endocrinologists, specializing in the hormones at play in reproduction.

Seriously. This is a good thing. I hear you on maybe finding another OB - and it sounds like his phone manner leave something to be desired - but don't JUST get a new OB. Do go see a RE as well. If you want to get this process going, it's the first step.

I had NOTHING done through the OB. My OB said she wanted me to wait a year before doing any tests. She wouldn't even do a progesterone test. She is a new OB/GYN for me - but I also spoke to my old OB/GYN who I've known since I was 15 years old, and even she was like, calm down, don't stress, you don't need testing yet, blah blah.

So I took matters into my own hands and went to see the RE without a referral (I have a PPO so I don't need referrals anyway). I went to the doctor recommended by a friend.

It was the RE that ordered the SA, HSG, CD 3 bloods (prolactin, thyroid, estrogen, LH) and CD 1 bloods (progesterone). That was the extent of our testing.

 

[DaisyQ]

But you should ask for a copy of the SA results to be sent to you or maybe you can pick them up. You should have that info (as well as your HSG films and report) for when you go see the RE.

 

[tinkerbellsie]

Ah Daisy that is a lot of info! its ok though! I understand what you're saying re: not wanting to wait for ivf if most effective route. I am worried we will need to go down fertility treatment route what made you guys get intervention now if you don't mind me asking? We've been tryin since last august but they won't even do bloods until depo been out of system a year.. But I don't think my probs are cos of depo. I had lots of unexplained bleeding on different forms of contraception and went on the contraception to manage paun in first place- had cysts on scans but again they won't do further investigations x

 

[DaisyQ]

AND Smyth - while the low SA is a bummer - at least you might now know what the reason is. You can stop feeling broken. AND you can move on to effective treatment. IUI might be a good option if the SA isn't too terrible, and of course there's IVF.

Also, it's always a good idea to do more than one SA, if it's low.

My husbands was pretty good, but the morph was a little low (6%). His count for the SA was something like 80 million or so, maybe a little more, and the motility was good, 79% or something. I can't remember. But then for the IUI his count was 137 million. So there is definitely variability.

I've also read that the longer the "foreplay" and the better the ejaculation (the better it feels, the more excited the man is) the higher the sperm count. I told my husband this before he went to give his sample for the IUI and so he tried to make it good - and his sperm count was so much higher!! It's also possible your husband's might be lower because who really gets into jacking off into a cup at the doctor's office.

 

[DaisyQ]

Ah Daisy that is a lot of info! its ok though! I understand what you're saying re: not wanting to wait for ivf if most effective route. I am worried we will need to go down fertility treatment route what made you guys get intervention now if you don't mind me asking? We've been tryin since last august but they won't even do bloods until depo been out of system a year.. But I don't think my probs are cos of depo. I had lots of unexplained bleeding on different forms of contraception and went on the contraception to manage paun in first place- had cysts on scans but again they won't do further investigations x

Ugh, that's so frustrating. Is it possible to go to a different doctor and get a second opinion? I know the medical system is so different in the UK than it is here.

Here the "rule" is to seek treatment after one year of trying if you are under 35, or after 6 months if you are over 35. You can break the "rule" if there is another problem - like if you KNOW you have PCOS or endo, or a blocked tube - you can get treatment right away. The reason we did not wait a year, is because I felt like 34 is close enough to 35 - especially when you also consider my husband is older. So we waited 6 months, and then went in. We had testing done, and our first assisted cycle (clomid and IUI) was our 8th cycle overall.

I would think that with unexplained bleeding and cysts you could be seen earlier.

I also know that the depo shot can have long lasting effects, which really sucks.

 

[tinkerbellsie]

Thanks Daisy the problem I've got is I changed doctors and they don't have my medical history. I get so frustrated seen 3 doctors at the one surgery and they've all made me feel stupid and that they don't care its so stupid because it makes you consider doing things like take unprescribed tablets. I don't necessarily want help now- just tests to see if its all working. Its really getting me down. That's why I bought the cbfm to let me see if was oing as wasn't getting anywhere with opks "sigh"

 

[DaisyQ]

That sucks. And it sounds like you may not be getting anywhere with the CBFM either.

How long have you been off depo?

Is there any way to retrieve your past medical records? Can you call them up and have them sent to you?

 

[tinkerbellsie]

Yeah that's what I was worried about with the cbfm- is all highs better than all lows??? Lol. my last injection ran out at the end of August.

I could contact gp and ask them to forward records, but don't know if it would help. I wish my doc at my old surgery hadn't left, she wouldve helped. Not found a helpful doctor since. I had an af 18th dec (natural) and had an induced one (not prescribed using pill as advised that works for many women) on 2nd March. Just hoping not back to nothing again. I just feel like a failure.