Children starting school without being potty trained

[indy and lara]

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[Yammas]

I think this is another exaggeration of the dialy fail tbh i work in early years and they start toilet training in toddlers and dont move up to preschool until they are toilet trained although children who are at home will be different.

I dont see why they wouldnt toilet train them though it makes life easier for both parties as the parents no longer have to change nappies and the child gets independance, by that age it shouldnt take long either as they should have the language and muscle skills neccessary to toilet train.

 

[Blah11]

I think the parents need support and encouraged to train when they're at nursery to get them trained before they start school. they're there for less time and at home more and idk, it just seems way more convienent.
How does it actually work? Does the teacher need to go and change their nappy or does the child do it themself? It can't be very dignified for the child either

I find it ridiculous that primary 1s cant use cutlery or put a coat on My 3 year old can fully dress herself now and even do her buckles up on her shoes and has been using a spoon/fork/knife for months and months.

 

[JASMAK]

My daughter has special needs and was trained at 4 years (I know you said you weren't referring to those with extra needs) but I was shocked at how many 5 year olds in kindergarten still had daytime accidents. Not sure how I feel about it...I was just surprised. As far as daycare, tehy take children not potty trained here, but only in underwear, in other words..they train them. There is no diapers or pull-ups..there fore the age is 2.5 to start, unless it is a baby nursery.

 

[Nibblenic]

I honestly didnt think schools would take children in nappies/pullups? I was aware that they would take them into nursery not dry, but I still dont think thats right, how can the other children be supervised properly if they are having to provide one2one care like that

 

[indy and lara]

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[indy and lara]

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[Natasha2605]

I just find it really sad that children are going into education (and even preschool) without having the basic life attributes ( for lack of better word ) that they need. Even if just to make life easier. Saying that though, my cousin's little boy is four (five in November) and he's not fully potty trained yet. Hell he's still on toddler milk. All because she prefers an easy life, but of course she blames him and says she has tried. Ridiculous. I hope she gets a grip on it by the time he starts school in August because it'd be humiliating for him.

I guess some parents just aren't teaching their children the basics that they need

 

[kerrie24]

I think it is lazy on the parents part,unless the child has some problem which makes it more difficult to potty train.
In my daughters class (5 and 6 yr olds) there are still children who cant do anything for themselves and even get carried from the car into the classroom!

 

[smelly07]

I work in a pre-school and we always encourage the parents to start toilet training before their child starts school, tbh the majority are out of nappies before they start preschool but we do have more and more children starting pre-school who are not toilet trained, since the rule change... i do think some parents are getting lazy... Its easier for us to handle these situations and to expect it in a pre-school but as for teachers in schools, IMO no its not your job youre there to teach. if it disrupts the class, etc etc then it is wrong. As a parent of a child in school i do not agree that children should be excepted if still in nappies.
At my daughters school and all schools in my town even if a child has an accident in school the parents are called in to change their child so i guess the same goes for children still in nappies.
This is enough incentive to encourage parents to help their child in the toilet training process.

As for coats and zips and shoes etc that is another thing we encourage ALOT in pre-school, in fairness zips are a bit tricky i bought my daughter a coat with buttons for her first year in school, so if she struggled with the zip she could always do her buttons up. x

 

[Rhi_Rhi1]

Luke cant do his zip, i actually feel bad now lol :/ he is potty trained tho,(as you would expect) this isn't that surprising to me tbh.. i just find it reflective of the state of how thing are lately

 

[Dragonfly]

here its a rule the pre school William is going to you are not allowed to be in nappies so I have to get him out of them by sep and he is really strong willed and wont use a potty for me now. So we gently helping him along. I think they should be done before school but the coats and zips isnt really that fair, I couldnt do my own shoe laces till i was about 10 and I was always embarrassed of it I just couldnt get it in to my head I wasnt a practical kid at all. I think william could do it though the coat but not sure on zips.

 

[kerrie24]

Luke cant do his zip, i actually feel bad now lol :/ he is potty trained tho,(as you would expect) this isn't that surprising to me tbh.. i just find it reflective of the state of how thing are lately

Aimee turned 6 yesterday and has only done her zip a few times,its too fiddly for her,not that we havent tried to teach her.Getting a coat which has buttons,press studs or velcro as well as zip means they can still close it somehow,but I think the teachers expect to be giving them a bit of help when they are this young.

 

[Lightworker]

I haven't read the article but coming at it from an Attachment Parent..it seems unfair to require children to learn something before they are ready. I know from a teacher's perspective (and even a parent of a child in class) its not a good use of resources to have staff to stop and change nappies etc, and its not convenient and so many other issued, more so now with lower budgets for schools etc.

I don't know its hard, but I feel sad for children made to to learn something before they are ready. x

 

[Nibblenic]

I haven't read the article but coming at it from an Attachment Parent..it seems unfair to require children to learn something before they are ready. I know from a teacher's perspective (and even a parent of a child in class) its not a good use of resources to have staff to stop and change nappies etc, and its not convenient and so many other issued, more so now with lower budgets for schools etc.

I don't know its hard, but I feel sad for children made to to learn something before they are ready. x

But youve said yourself you believe In education LW. Surely in main stream school children are being taught things before they are ready. Where do you draw the line? They cant be potty if they arent ready, what if they arent ready to learn the alphabet? They have a set opportunity to learn things, then the class is moved on a time scale that is suitable for the average. So surely then you have to help your child and encourage them to keep up with the pace or their peers.
Or do you only see them as not be able to learn things physically and not mentally?
Obviously im not talking about any children with additional needs

 

[Pearls18]

I can't really comment only having a 16 month old, but surely it is lazy parenting sending your child to school in nappies unless they have some kind of developmental problems? My best friend is a TA in a primary school and the only children (she has said there's been a couple, but that it isn't common) who have come in with nappies are noticeably from poorer backgrounds, which must be so difficult for all involved, I know it puts the school in a difficult position due to what they can and can't do in terms of cleaning a child up these days.

It is slightly different in Wales as children can go to school one year earlier, but I wouldn't dream of sending Elliot in with nappies, I am hoping to have him trained before we have the next baby...famous last words?!

 

[Eternal]

eck Im terrfied now, my son is 26 months and not yet toilet trained at all, i havent even tried as he shows no interest in it and all the advice i was given was to leave it until the summer. He tries but there is no chance he can put his shoes on or do up a zip. Obviously he will have to be toilet trained by Jan when he starts school, but its upsetting thinking I will be classed as a lazy parent if he cant get his shoes on or do a zip by Jan. All his developmental minestrones he is scoring about 3 years, so I didn't realise he was so behind as far as getting him self dressed or toilet training. i thought most children needed help getting dressed until they were 4 or 5!

 

[smelly07]

Eternal: my youngest daughter is nearly 26 months old and i havent even considered toilet training yet....... my eldest daughter was 28 months old when i toilet trained her and it took 2 days. I think most children are toilet trained by 3 it doesnt take long when they are ready and the majority of parents whos child is still in nappies when they are at pre-school openly admit its partially due to lazyness.

In regards to coats, shoes, zips........ my youngest is able to put shoes on (not always on the right foot) and some clothing and take her coat and shoes off......i have not encouraged this, she wants to do it.....but at pre-school age we do start to encourage children to put coats on and do up zips/buttons and put shoes on and get clothes on and off themselves to become more independent and ready for school... Our ratio is 1:8.............at school there is 1 teacher and a 1 TA in a class of 30 (?)...........if the teacher/TA had to help every child with everything they would spend most the day, putting on shoes/coats, getting them dressed for P.E and then helping them back into their school clothes after, changing them if wet/soiled etc i would imagine it would take up a lot of precious school time.

My daughter could get herself dressed at school age (not perfect) and put shoes on (velcro i wouldnt buy shoes with laces) could put her coat on but couldnt do her zip.....i was aware of this so made sure she had a coat that had buttons as well as a zip.
If you are encouraging thats all you can do they wont do it if they simply cant do it but will get there...........some parents choose to just do everything for them because its easier and faster xxxx

 

[alaskagrown]

The way I see it, if your child is still wearing diapers/nappies by the time he or she is 4 or 5 years old (the age kids go into Kindergarten), you aren't really doing your end of being a parent by teaching them basic, fundamental LIFE SKILLS. (If they have special needs, provide them some leeway.)

Tying shoes and zipping coats...well, I think most kids know how to do this stuff either before they enter school or during their first year. I remember in Kindergarten having to help the teacher zip up other kids' coats and tying their shoes because about 1/2 did not know how to do it. It didn't seem much of an issue, they seemed to all learn how to do it by the end of the year.

 

[Lightworker]

I haven't read the article but coming at it from an Attachment Parent..it seems unfair to require children to learn something before they are ready. I know from a teacher's perspective (and even a parent of a child in class) its not a good use of resources to have staff to stop and change nappies etc, and its not convenient and so many other issued, more so now with lower budgets for schools etc.

I don't know its hard, but I feel sad for children made to to learn something before they are ready. x

But youve said yourself you believe In education LW. Surely in main stream school children are being taught things before they are ready. Where do you draw the line? They cant be potty if they arent ready, what if they arent ready to learn the alphabet? They have a set opportunity to learn things, then the class is moved on a time scale that is suitable for the average. So surely then you have to help your child and encourage them to keep up with the pace or their peers.
Or do you only see them as not be able to learn things physically and not mentally?
Obviously im not talking about any children with additional needs

lol you made me pause for thought. I do believe in education, but I believe in a system that focuses on, and progresses in line with the child's capabilities. I know this does not occur in mainstream school as such and I now feel hypocritical because I sent my DD1 to mainstream schooling not knowing how she would achieve....hmmm i need to think more about it.....