Clomid Buddies (moved from TTC board)

[rickyandlucy]

Ask, I am so sorry. You do sound like you are handling it all really well, but I am sure it is so hard.

Belle, I think that's a good plan to wait and see how you feel. And if you don't feel up for it that is ok. I don't think you even need to tell them why; they may not understand. I skipped a first birthday party myself this year for the same reason. But it's weird, I was a mess at my sis in law's bridal shower (it happened to be the day after AF arrived), but I was fine at my husband's friend's baby shower.

So last Friday before AF made her appearance, DH and I went out to dinner. It's our usual place, and they know us there. Everybody seems to want us to have babies (don't think they realize that we want them too, lol), and we even got a long talk from the owner about how our furbaby doesn't replace a regular baby (DUH!). It's always just the two of us, but when we walk in they still always ask, "Just two?". This time DH tried to crack a joke about how hungry he was and said that we were "eating for three". The waitress started getting all excited and I had to explain that it wasn't true. Of course I was still hoping it was true, and was even planning to test the next morning, but then AF arrived right before bed. At least she saved me from wasting a digital.

I finally made an appt with the RE yesterday. They can't get us in until August 2. But we are going for a SA next Friday. Now that is going to be interesting. Any fellow Catholics here?

 

[rickyandlucy]

Nore, I feel your pain. In our case we don't know yet if the problem is him or me (or both), but DH absolutely HATES his vitamins. He is always "forgetting" them. He says they taste really bad. Trying to get him to use up this batch before moving on to another brand. I am sorry you are feeling so down about the move. How long have you been there now? Hang in there girl. You have friends here!

 

[Ask4joy]

Lights - I've thought of it...DH mentioned it. But I don't want to thin my lining... I was only monitored on the 50mg and my lining was always good. I tend to have heavier periods so I don't think that's an issue...

Steph - I think I'm going to start telling people who make comments like that, "we are in the middle of fertility treatments...thanks for your interest!" That will shut them up. People just don't know better...

Nore - it doesn't have to be 15% to do IVF but if it's lower they often recommend ICSI where they select a sperm and fertilize the egg with it rather than letting it happen on it's own in the Petri dish.

 

[BelleNuit]

I read a study that under 14% morphology using the strict criteria is considered subfertile for natural TTC but that as long as above 5% normal forms are seen regular IVF works just as well as ICSI. If less than 5% normal forms then ICSI may be helpful. Also once fertilization is achieved regardless of the morphology embryo development progresses fairly normally. So this indicates that morphology might impair fertilization rates (particularly in the case of IUI where malformed tails can affect how the sperm move, which would not impact IVF), but poor morphology doesn't necessarily indicate a high degree of dna damage which would result in CPs and poor quality embryos.

 

[Norelisa]

Nore, I feel your pain. In our case we don't know yet if the problem is him or me (or both), but DH absolutely HATES his vitamins. He is always "forgetting" them. He says they taste really bad. Trying to get him to use up this batch before moving on to another brand. I am sorry you are feeling so down about the move. How long have you been there now? Hang in there girl. You have friends here!

Nearly 2 weeks.. But staying with family and miss my "old"freedom.. And not too thrilled with some of the in laws (especially mother and brother in law).. They are very old fashioned and just annoying people..

Lights - I've thought of it...DH mentioned it. But I don't want to thin my lining... I was only monitored on the 50mg and my lining was always good. I tend to have heavier periods so I don't think that's an issue...

Steph - I think I'm going to start telling people who make comments like that, "we are in the middle of fertility treatments...thanks for your interest!" That will shut them up. People just don't know better...

Nore - it doesn't have to be 15% to do IVF but if it's lower they often recommend ICSI where they select a sperm and fertilize the egg with it rather than letting it happen on it's own in the Petri dish.

I read a study that under 14% morphology using the strict criteria is considered subfertile for natural TTC but that as long as above 5% normal forms are seen regular IVF works just as well as ICSI. If less than 5% normal forms then ICSI may be helpful. Also once fertilization is achieved regardless of the morphology embryo development progresses fairly normally. So this indicates that morphology might impair fertilization rates (particularly in the case of IUI where malformed tails can affect how the sperm move, which would not impact IVF), but poor morphology doesn't necessarily indicate a high degree of dna damage which would result in CPs and poor quality embryos.

Hopefully we can do ICSI here.. Sister in law, who is a nurse, told me that one has to see a shrink to do IVF here, will be interesting if it's the case, would be good for hubby to take a step back and understand his family flaws.. Sigh..

 

[Ask4joy]

That's good to know, Belle! The financial person from my clinic called me yesterday to go over costs and told me with PGS/PGD they usually do ICSI too...I will have to ask my doc about that as she didn't mention it. PGS is an additional $5000 (including freezing) and ICSI is another $1500...looks like our IVF bill is going to be closer to $18,000...yikes!!! We have saved for $10,000 so we are going to have to probably ask family for help. This better work!

No sign of AF yet and temps are still high ...stopped progesterone 2 days ago now. But maybe it will take longer after the cp...

 

[BelleNuit]

Wow it is so crazy expensive! We are also going to have to ask family to help if/when the time comes for IVF.

Nore I'm sorry the move has been so tough. I imagine there is a bit of culture shock too! That is interesting that you need to see a psychologist when you get IVF there. I think that is probably a good thing.

I had a tough time last night. I got a text from my mother saying my brother had some big news... 2 seconds later my brother called and I couldn't answer the phone because I was already sobbing. They're pregnant. After 1 month trying. I just cried and went to bed early. I'll have to call him back at some point today and let him share his big news.

 

[rickyandlucy]

Belle, I am so sorry. I can only imagine how that feels. I worry about the same thing happening with my brother and his wife...

 

[steph1607]

Oh Belle It feels like a kick in the stomach doesn't it. I'm so sorry that you have to keep feeling like this.

My goodness, I can't believe how expensive IVF is in the US/Canada. Here, you can get up to three rounds free on the NHS, BUT it depends on where abouts you live, and I think a lot of councils are changing their rules. Interestingly, my friend was telling me the other day about a friend of hers who is currently having IVF. The clinic where she is getting it offers an "egg share" option, so someone who for whatever reason can't have their own eggs pays for the donated eggs, and the person who donates then gets the IVF treatment free of charge. Of course you have to fulfill certain criteria before being able to donate in the first place, and like in France you also have to have counselling beforehand. Kind of nice to know that it could be an option one day.

 

[OnErth&InHvn]

Is it $18k for ONE round???

I say try 100mg again.

-----
CD10, WTO... which i BETTER do this cycle!

 

[Ask4joy]

Belle - I'm so sorry you are dealing with that. It seems the hardest when it is someone close to us.

Earth - yes, one freakin round! And if it doesn't work and we don't end up with extra embryos to freeze we are screwed. My only hope right now is that DH's new job will offer some coverage but it seems unlikely. He's going in for his 2nd interview today and meets with the HR person at the end so he might get some idea about benefits. The cost does make me want to keep trying a little longer...after 3 CPs I know I can get pregnant and from my research most people with multiple MCs do go on to have a successful pregnancy eventually! I'm increasing our coq10 ubiquinol
to 400mg/day (which costs about $70/month). We have only been taking 100mg/day the last 4 months. I do feel encouraged that I've conceived twice in the last 4 cycles...

 

[BelleNuit]

Thanks everyone. I've honestly just felt sick to my stomach all day and I think it's because I'm just so afraid it's never going to happen for us

 

[OnErth&InHvn]

Belle - I'm so sorry you are dealing with that. It seems the hardest when it is someone close to us.

Earth - yes, one freakin round! And if it doesn't work and we don't end up with extra embryos to freeze we are screwed. My only hope right now is that DH's new job will offer some coverage but it seems unlikely. He's going in for his 2nd interview today and meets with the HR person at the end so he might get some idea about benefits. The cost does make me want to keep trying a little longer...after 3 CPs I know I can get pregnant and from my research most people with multiple MCs do go on to have a successful pregnancy eventually! I'm increasing our coq10 ubiquinol
to 400mg/day (which costs about $70/month). We have only been taking 100mg/day the last 4 months. I do feel encouraged that I've conceived twice in the last 4 cycles...

wow. I know the chances are better but still not 100%. 18K per round and you have no idea how many it may take or what they may add/change about the process along the way.

 

[BelleNuit]

It's an ugly bill to pay, but sometimes there is no other way.

 

[Ask4joy]

Exactly...and I'm not getting younger! If we have the money we will do it and if it doesn't work I guess we will keep trying naturally until we have more. When you think of how much we pay for our education, homes, cars, it seems like a small price to pay to start a family.

I'm sorry you are feeling so discouraged, Belle. I do believe your time will come and I hope it's soon! I have a friend who tried for 2 years, was diagnosed with unexplained, did 3 rounds of clomid, still wasn't pregnant and finally got pregnant on her 3rd round of femera + IUI. I hope IUI works for you too!

 

[BelleNuit]

I've been thinking that same thing Ask. I thought nothing of pulling out an $11 000 car loan, or accumulating close to $50 000 in student loans. It just seems like a tough pill to swallow because IVF isn't something that the average person has to pay for.

I hope you are right Ask. I know there is still a chance for this cycle, but I'm just not feeling it. I'm looking into options for naturopathy. I have $500 in benefits I can spend on a naturopath, can't hurt to get some diet and lifestyle recommendations.

 

[Ask4joy]

The fact that it usually has to be paid upfront as a lump sum makes it hard but I know there are programs that do fertility related loans...there are also grants you can apply for and programs that may pay for your 2nd IVF if you paid for 1 and it didn't work. There are options...but it is so unfair. Everyone else gets to make babies for free!

Naturopath sounds like a great idea. I've been thinking of doing acupuncture. My IVF clinic actually recommends it to help with stress. I've been reading more about stress and how it effects circulation and can decrease blood flow to the ovaries and uterus causing damage to the follicles, reducing egg quality and impairing implantation. Not sure if that's my issue but I know I struggle with stress and have been on and off anti-depressants and mood stabilizers since I was 18. I'm currently off everything and feeling pretty good now that school is out but I do have a quick trigger response to stress!

 

[BelleNuit]

I really do recommend acupuncture. My lining was much thicker and I had more follicles develop on my monitored cycle with acupuncture. It also is a huge stress relief for me

 

[rickyandlucy]

Belle, I know how you feel. It is completely normal. But you don't have to give up on your dream. You still have options. You can still do a couple more rounds of IUI. If that doesn't work, IVF. And I know I am the type of person that likes to always have a plan b and c; have you considered adoption?

I desperately want at least one, preferably two, biological children. But I am *trying* (not always successfully, lol) not to let TTC destroy me, because I know one way or another, I will be a mother. I know quite a few people who turned to adoption when they couldn't conceive, and quite a few of them still ended up having a child of their own along the way, despite the odds. I would imagine the odds of that happening would be even higher for those of us with unexplained infertility. So I know that even if we do end up turning to adoption, it doesn't mean we are giving up.

You are a long way from all that yet though. Just keep doing what you're doing, and keep your chin up. You will get there!

 

[BelleNuit]

Thanks Lucy. Adoption isn't the right option for us for many reasons. I know I would be okay with living a child free life if it came to it .

I'm just frustrated and feeling impatient. Because we are unexplained and young we pretty much have to take a more conservative approach, which basically just means we'll be waiting longer. Seems unfair when some people don't have to wait at all.