Giving birth without assistance....

[sarah1980]

I saw a thread some time ago (pretty sure it was in this section) about a lady who was considering giving birth without the assistance of a midwife or similar. I cant find that thread anywhere now that I am looking for it! Anyway, I am wondeing what peoples opinions on this are? This is my first pregnancy so I do worry that sometimes I am a little naive but my ideal birth would be just me and my husband and no one else there but I worry this may be a little too risky. Also with regards to cord cutting and placenta delivery afterwards, how would this be dealt with? Opinions welcome!

Thanks,

Sarah.xxx

 

[oaklvr]

I don't think I would opt for it, being a first baby. It's hard to know what yourself or your partner will feel like in the middle of labor, and when you're delivering. I would have a midwife attend a homebirth. It sounds like a good compromise. If something did arise they'd have the knowledge to help you.

 

[lynnikins]

i would have the MW there they are trained to help and to spot the signs of anything not happening right that might need intervention, signs which you and your husband arent nessacarily aware and not trained to look for.

 

[NuKe]

i would have the MW there they are trained to help and to spot the signs of anything not happening right that might need intervention, signs which you and your husband arent nessacarily aware and not trained to look for.

I completely agree. I am planning a HB for #2, but I'd never consider even for a second, not having a professional there

 

[sleepinbeauty]

I once read a story about a midwife who just went to the house and stayed out of the way. All she asked was that she be allowed to check in on occasion. Would that be something for you?

 

[mummaofthree]

i had the midwife at my house... infact i had 4, but they just sat chatting amongst themselves (it wasnt a planned homebirth but i had prepared just incase)

as with my 2nd child i asked for the midwife not to touch me..... no pain relief and caught the bubba myself was amazing..... midwife was there ready to clamp the cord and help deliver the placenta

it was a very laid back... relaxed experience. x

 

[sarah1980]

I once read a story about a midwife who just went to the house and stayed out of the way. All she asked was that she be allowed to check in on occasion. Would that be something for you?

Yes, that definately sounds good. I have my midwife next week so I think I will discuss my options with her then. Thanks for your reply.

Sarah.xxx

 

[sarah1980]

i had the midwife at my house... infact i had 4, but they just sat chatting amongst themselves (it wasnt a planned homebirth but i had prepared just incase)

as with my 2nd child i asked for the midwife not to touch me..... no pain relief and caught the bubba myself was amazing..... midwife was there ready to clamp the cord and help deliver the placenta

it was a very laid back... relaxed experience. x

Now that sounds fab, I hope the midwives in my area would do that too.

Sarah.xxx

 

[sleepinbeauty]

I once read a story about a midwife who just went to the house and stayed out of the way. All she asked was that she be allowed to check in on occasion. Would that be something for you?

Yes, that definately sounds good. I have my midwife next week so I think I will discuss my options with her then. Thanks for your reply.

Sarah.xxx

Of course. I want the same thing someday. Check out the book that it was written in "Baby Catcher" by Peggy _____. Can't remember her last name off the top of my head. It's wonderful though.

 

[NuKe]

https://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Baby-Catcher...=Non_Fiction&hash=item19c55fcaf6#ht_773wt_932

 

[freckleonear]

silver_penny had an unassisted homebirth. Here's her birth story and here's the thread where she answered lots of questions about it.

It's something I would love to do but there's always a tiny niggling doubt at the back of my mind and I don't think I could actually do it. If I have more children then I will ask the midwives to sit in the corner and be completely hands off. I wouldn't do it for a first baby and I also think that you have to do an extreme amount of research into every possible scenario.

 

[madasa]

I would love to have an understanding midwife in the next room just checking in occasionally. What I'd like... REALLY like... is to go out in my garden and squat under a tree. (I think I am turning into a hippy while I am not looking. It's possible that I will be buying granola any day.) I don't think I would ever actually *do* that. But.... I think about it and want to get something as close to that as possible, *with* a care-giver present. Good luck!

 

[Eternal]

It makes me really scared to think anyone would want to. i understand the appeal, i was going to have a very natural delivery in a birth centre, water birth, no drugs etc etc.

I had complications that i wouldnt have known about, i ended up in hospital and my son was having decelerations, thankful he came out via emegency epistomy and i didnt have to have a section, but if i had stayed home my son would have died.

I understand the beauty of a natural unassisted birth, you can see videos on you tube, and i have seen ladies greieve over their birth experience as it wasnt what they wanted.

For me a beautiful birth is having a healthy baby (or two in my case) in your arms at the end of it, and i am greatful for anyone who can assist me in getting my babies here safely.

I know quite a few people and friends who lost babies during delivery, all in hospital and there was nothing that could be done, but i dont know if i could live with the guilt if i decided agaisnt having someone assit me and my baby died.

Just my opioion though x

 

[tristansmum]

i agree with the above. It sounds wonderful BUT if something went wrong could you forgive yourself? I know there is risk no matter where you give birth and some may agrue that home birth is less of a risk due to no "unnessesary" intervention (i personal don't agree but that is another issue). However, would you know if something was wrong/baby in distress/you bleeding ect???? Also i believe its illegal for anyone other than a health professional to deliver a baby (if its planned obviously not if you give birth in the car). Not sure if it is ever actually followed up but it would ruin a wonderful birth if your OH was being asked alsorts of questions about what happened....

I hope you can have a wonderful natural birth (i didn't get one unfortunately) but i would try to have an understanding MW there just in case. xxx

 

[silver_penny]

I saw a thread some time ago (pretty sure it was in this section) about a lady who was considering giving birth without the assistance of a midwife or similar. I cant find that thread anywhere now that I am looking for it! Anyway, I am wondeing what peoples opinions on this are? This is my first pregnancy so I do worry that sometimes I am a little naive but my ideal birth would be just me and my husband and no one else there but I worry this may be a little too risky. Also with regards to cord cutting and placenta delivery afterwards, how would this be dealt with? Opinions welcome!

Thanks,

Sarah.xxx

I had an unassisted bith and would do it again in a second. Yes, I know the risks, I know some people think I'm crazy/stupid/naive, but honestly I couldn't have asked for a better birthing experience. I did a toooonnnnn of research before I got pregnant with my second, and also did my own prenatal testing. My birth was, in a word, miraculous. I loved every minute of it. The intimacy and privacy was great. Don't get me wrong, I know its not for everyone, but if you and your SO are for it, then I would say consider it as a viable option. However, do plenty of research, don't go into it uninformed. Once I get the money, I hope to go to midwifery school, as would love to become a midwife (ironic, eh?) Beyond my love of learning, I would love to assist others in their journey to motherhood.

In regards to cord clamping and the placenta: We didn't cut the cord until the next day. We therefore did not need to clamp it. We froze the placenta with plans of planting it under a tree. Still haven't gotten the tree yet, so its in the freezer. Maybe a good first birthday present...

 

[sarah1980]

silver penny, it WAS your thread I was talking about and I have found it again so thank you so much. It is still something I am still looking into but DH is not convinced at all so it is looking like it may be the local midwife unit where I deliver but we shall see.

Thank you for sharing ypur amazing story!

Sarah.xxx

 

[sarah1980]

Also thanks to all who replied with their thoughts/opinions on the subject, much appreciated.

Sarah.xxx

 

[lozzy21]

Its not something i would ever do, a hands off birth would be perfect but not an unassisted. My daughter (and possably me) is another who would would have died with out a midwife being there.

Just to point out they are legal implcations in the uk for people who plan for an unassisted birth, not too sure what they are but i know they are some.

 

[Bournefree]

We discussed the legal implications in Sliver's orginal thread: Hope this helps
xxx

Congratulations on your safe arrival.

Unfortunately without trying to cause offence i do not understand why people would even consider unassited births. I understand that in the USA it is VERY medicalised and i can see the need for it, but here in the UK it is illegal to purposefully have a unassisted birth and also for a untrained person to act as a birth attendant.
As a trained professional i have seen many beautiful low risk births but also the other extreme where people are simply lucky to have the TRAINED professional there.
Yes there are many WHAT IF's and no it does not mean they will happen, but if they did i think it would be irresponsible to put yourself in a position to have to deal with them (or not) with what is basically no experience. Yes people who choose this option research these things and scenarios greatly, but if that were all were needed, ppl would not have to dedicated minimum 3yrs (hr in the UK) to have the privilege to assist women in their birth experience. I believe that no amount of research or "basic" medical training can prepare anyone for childbirth emergencies.

I know this sounds like a harsh post, (im sorry) i do respect womens rights and opinions and support women in these choices, but i would not be doing my job if women did not know EVERY possibility and risks involved. I do not believe that feeling a baby move tells you a baby is safe, - when babies are starved of oxygen it is not uncommon for them to have excessive movements as they fight for their life. This is why when we monitor fetal movement we look for changed and excessive as well as none or reduced.


ANyways, my rant over. Apologies if i have offended, it was not my intention but simply to express my opinion, and stress that free birthing is ILLEGAL in the UK. I would be very concerned for my ladies if i thought that a, they would intentionally go through with this, and b, they had that little trust in their midwives that they felt they could not let us support them in their birthing experience.

Again, Congratulations on your safe arrival. x

I have to correct the above.

As a lawyer I can tell you this is NOT true under the laws of England and Wales.

Firstly, you have ultimate freedom to birth in your own home or anywhere without any attendants - whether you do this intentionally or not. It would be a very strange state that would make a physiological function of the human race an illegal act. This right is also enshrined in Human rights law (it was also recently commented on and examined in the case of Ternovszky v Hungary 2010 "the right concerning the decision to become a parent includes the right of choosing the circumstances of becoming a parent. The court is satisfied that the circumstances of giving birth incontestably form part of one's private life")

Secondly, the only thing that is illegal is for a person to purport to act or intend to act as a midwife. This doesn't included OHs, doulas, your grandmother.. or even a kind bin man or anyone who is present at your birth.
It is an unfortunate common misconception (even among medical professionals)

Here is the Law:
Midwifery Order 2001, Paragraph 45
1) A person other than a registered midwife or a registered medical practitioner shall not attend a women in childbirth
2) Paragraph (1) does NOT apply -
a) where the attention is given in a case of sudden or urgent necessity; or
b) in the case of a person who, while undergoing training with a view to becoming a medical practitioner or to becoming a midwife, attends a women in childbirth as part of a course of practical instruction in midwifery recognised by the council or by the general medical council.


Had to clear that one up, as it could be very damaging to women's choices and freedoms

XXX

So are you saying that as long as your intend to become a midwife, professional etc that you are exempt from this law??

It is illegal for a not qualified person to purposefully act as a midwife etc. Even if it is OH/DOula etc. Obviously BBA's etc (born before arrivals) are very different cases but to act if i were "almost" qualified i would not have a leg to stand on as such if i were to act as that womens midwife and deliver her baby knowing that i have the "knowledge", just the same as i see "doctors" procedures all the time, i know the medical ins and outs, and could probably manage to deliver a baby etc, as such for a c-section but i would loose my job if i thought i could just perform this even in the case of a emergency.

I appreciate that this is not the same, but to say it is not illegal for a doula etc to act as the midwife , even if they intend to proceed to the career is wrong. (Apologies if i interpreted your comment wrongly)

As for no one knowing ALL the risks, i disagree that is why doctors trained for 7+yrs they are the experts and midwifes are the experts in "normal" childbirth.

Sorry, I think you have interpreted me wrong - Or I haven’t made it clear.
I'm not saying that any man and his dog whether they be a trainee MW or a doula are exempt and free from prosecution if they purposely intend to act as a midwife. It is illegal for anyone to do so. (I should have made that clearer when I mentioned the bin man etc)

This act was made to stop a lay-person from pretending to be a MW or a medical person with a women in childbirth. It is not to prosecute someone who is in the same room as a women in child birth offering support or encouragement and be in attendance i.e present, but they can not attend to the women. (there in lies the difference). So, if a person did something physical to the mother (attended her) or they were saying they intended to act or be a MW (which wasn't in an emergency) they would be liable to be prosecuted.
If it is an emergency, (imminent point of birth would count as an emergency) such as in paragraph 2.. paragraph 1 doesn't apply. Say there isn't a MW or medical professional available or even if there is a MW present an they need assistance with the mother, then ANY lay-person (the bin man, even a trainee MW OR trainee Doctor) could attend to the mother. (with her consent - if possible)
You wouldn't loose your job if you attended a women in an emergency (anyone can). However if you are a trainee MW you can’t touch a women (certainly not without consent anyway.. But neither can any registered MW) if it isn‘t an emergency unless it is part of your training and a registered MW is also in attendance.
However, if it was an emergency (no professionals available) and you were not with a women as part of your training, and you failed to act (unless asked not to by the women) you could certainly be sued, or worst case is, if the mother then died as a result of your negligence, you could be liable for murder by omission.

To summarise
- There is NO law against unassisted childbirth in England and Wales;
- Anyone can be present.. but they can't pretend to be a MW;
- Plus anyone can assist in an emergency and attend the mother.

It is very important everybody knows this; I would hate to think that any MW could be telling any pregnant women it is illegal to birth unassisted in the UK or to have there nearest, dearest or trusted with them, or for their nearest and dearest or bin man to help a women in child birth if needed.

I'll happily answer any questions, so it can be fully understood.
Xxx

 

[Mervs Mum]

Thanks for clarifying that point Bourne. The key issue is the 'acting as a MW'.

Lozzy I also think your own birth being quite traumatic is bound to influence how you feel about this x