is/was your LO a really bad sleeper? support and advise thread!

[aliss]

I'm not in your club anymore (1-2x a night at 18 months and sttn at 23 months) but I was in your club for 18 months!

I think *acceptance* was the only way to really deal with it. CC/CIO was not for me either. We made a morning 'routine' as a family to look forward too and made sure that OH + I had a little "us" time, even if only 10 minutes, per day when he finally started napping in the day at 4 months.

I'm guessing 6-20x a night for my LO in the first 6 months and a good 3-10x a night from then until 12 months.

If it happens again with #2 I will do the same thing, just SURVIVE, make a morning routine (ours was coffee + a cartoon, decaf for me regular for OH), and pray for the best. Nothing I tried ever worked anyways, and that end of the tunnel did eventually come.

I knew you'd reply!
but i was hoping you'd give us some tips. oh well.
yes, acceptance is my way of dealing with it atm, but don't know how I'll cope when I go back to work. really worried

TBH I found work (10 weeks) not so bad. It gave me a bit of a "me" break, despite the sleep deprivation.

Sorry, no cure or tips aside from "wait it out". Sucks, sorry

 

[Ramie]

Lauren's had 3 nights in her life she's slept longer than a 2.5 hour stretch.

On a normal night, I'll feed her to sleep around 7pm, resettle her with boob a handful of times before I give up & go to bed & then she'll sleep 2 hours or so for a feed & spend the rest of the night waking generally every half hour, often with a 2-3 hour awake period in there, just to make it even better!

I dream of a 4 hour stretch of sleep.

xx

Oh my, this sounds exactly like my evening/night. LO starts off in the cot where I resettle at 20/30/40 ish minutes and when I've had enough of doing this or when LO starts to get upset he comes into bed with me. A 3 hour stretch would be heaven. He feeds and comfort sucks throughout the night. xx

 

[chocolala]

chocolala!

I'm one with a terrible sleeper!

She's 10 1/2 months now. Always been a bugger getting her to sleep, she's always fought it really hard. When she realises she's going to sleep, she'll start kicking and crying or rubbing her eyes when she feels them closing, she'll do what she can to stay awake.

At about 2 months she slept through, but she had a sleep regression at 3 and 4 months. At 6 months, after having learnt to settle herself to sleep, she gave that up after doing it 4 times and started waking 6 + times a night. Until that point we'd been part time co-sleepers, from then on it was full time, otherwise I'd get barely any sleep. Sometimes in the early hours she'll wake every 30 mins or so.

At the moment I have no life other than getting lily to sleep - which can take hours - or being with her while she sleeps, as I can't leave her or she'll wake up. All that makes it very difficult to get things done, even the basics like washing up and dinner.

The last few days her sleep patterns have changed, she's gone longer, I've had one 4 hour stretch and a 5 hour stretch, but she's been fighting sleep harder than usual, took me 3 hours to get to sleep one day last week. I have no idea if this is going to last or not, we'll see.

I'm currently in the process of trying to fInd a cause for her sleep resistance, I figure there must be a reason as babies aren't supposed to fight sleep so hard. Our first point of call is seeing if she has tongue tie, which could be the cause of her fussiness.

Anyone here read the analytical armadillo blog on Duracell bunny babies? Very interesting read.

I am too trying to understand what's going on. Mine is not too bad to go to sleep (although it can take up to 1hr if I time it wrongly) for him the problem is to stay asleep.
I actually had a couple of questions I wanted to ask members of the club but totally forgot to post them in my original post

would you mind sharing with me:

1) did you have any stress/complications during your pregnancy/birth? (I remember flippity, you were induced a day before me!)
2) are you FF or BF? I have the impression this problem is more common in BF babies
3) tiredness aside - do you feel overwhelmed, worried, anxious, etc? do you feel you have enough support or you're doing most of the looking after LO on your own?

thanks!


Interesting what you say about tongue tie - my LO was TT and had it snipped at 4 weeks. he also has high

1) did you have any stress/complications during your pregnancy/birth? (I remember flippity, you were induced a day before me!)
With Lily her labour was very long, 4 days with 3 hours pushing. When she finally arrived her cord snapped as she was handed to me, this cause me to retain the placenta. I had to have that removed, so didn't see. Lily again for several hours. She was also back to back for most of my labour, she turned towards the end.

2) are you FF or BF? I have the impression this problem is more common in BF babies
I'm bf. I read recently in Kiss me - how to raise your children with love. By Carlos Gonzales. That it's perfectly normal for breast feed babies to get to a out 6 months old and then start waking very frequently. Don't know how true that actually is, though it reassured me somewhat.


3) tiredness aside - do you feel overwhelmed, worried, anxious, etc? do you feel you have enough support or you're doing most of the looking after LO on your own?
I have times when it really gets to me, I can't cope and it totally overwhelms me. I'll get very tearful, have a meltdown and then eventually get back to the point of acceptance. It's very hard though, I get no me time, no time with my husband and no one seems to realise, or they blame us because of how we're choosing to raise Lily, "rod for your own back" and all that crap. My husband does what he can to help, but he's busy studying with a deadline looming, so most of it is on me. We also have the added complication of caring for my mil, which can take a lot of my husbands time, the mil doesn't seem to get how much hard work lily is.

Interesting you asking these questions, I've just been asked them in the tongue tie form I've not long filled in. If Lily hasn't got tongue tie we're going to be looking to see if her birth could be the cause of her sleep fighting.

 

[kosh]

FF, it's funny you mention it as IRL lots of mums at the baby group have done it and they can't believe that I haven't. There doesn't seem to be quite as much controversy over it IRL as there is on here (as with many things!).

I'm persevering with my 'settle him in the cot at all costs even if it takes hours' routine at the moment as I'm still hopeful that the consistency will pay off in the end. It's really frustrating as he seems to be getting worse, but he's very bright and VERY stubborn (no idea where he got that from ) so I was expecting that it'd take a bit longer for him to 'comply'. I'm going to give it a couple of weeks and then reassess.

Sheesh! I never expected to STILL be moaning on about his sleep at this point. Who knew that i should have really treasured the nights of waking 3-hourly

Part of the reason I was scared was because LO is really stubborn and I thought it wouldn't work, but it turns out he is pretty clever and worked it out quickly.

Good luck with the settling him in his cot route, it involves much less wine than CC (which may not be a good thing!)

I do sometimes sigh at posts where LO's are waking every 3-4 hrs and think "if only!"

^^ this!

 

[MrsHedgehog]

1) did you have any stress/complications during your pregnancy/birth? (I remember flippity, you were induced a day before me!)
I had a complication free pregnancy. I had a natural labour which was quick and also complication free.
2) are you FF or BF? I have the impression this problem is more common in BF babies
I'm BF
3) tiredness aside - do you feel overwhelmed, worried, anxious, etc? do you feel you have enough support or you're doing most of the looking after LO on your own?
I have moments where it all gets to me and I worry that I've done everything wrong. However, the majority of the time I feel ok about it. LO is so easy apart from her sleeping that apart from being seriously sleep deprived I feel quite lucky. DH is good but isn't able to settle LO so most of it falls on me. I don't think anyone realises how hard it is or how sleep deprived I am as I'm pretty good at putting a brave face on and looking on the bright side.

 

[kosh]

Well you know I am in the same situation with my older twin Dominic though I am not sure if you meant me as one of the 4 mums. He sleeps at the most one stretch of 2 hours and then he is awake every hour/45 minutes and needs to have his dummy reinserted and be rocked back to sleep. And yet he is a cheerful lil thing during the day. My younger twin Sebastian is easy in every respect. I suspect since we never had to rock him to sleep, he knows how to drift off by himself. It's a vicious cycle. As for tips, I have none lol. Except that we are now often successful in fooling Dom by inserting the dummy, shoving a hand under his bottom and jiggling him where he lies. This works quite often but not always, depending on how awake he is.
I am too tired to rant tonight. Maybe tomorrow lol.

hi angel
you know i actually wrote the original post a while ago, before meeting you in the other thread -i should have corrected it and said 5 mums!
how was Dominic last night?
I was just thinking about you and those questions i asked.I guess you'd be the 'negative control' in the experiment, as I know you FF and also everything that happened to Dominic also happened to Sebastian, correct?

I think I may be one of the notorious 'no sleep' posters

of course you are!

He used to sleep for a solid block of 3-4 hours in the evening and wake regularly but feed quickly and back to sleep. Recently he's been stirring all evening and having some night wakings where NOTHING ges him back to sleep in less than 1.5 hours:shrug:.

have you read the '90min sleep program'? she explains this there. it seems that most babies have 90min alert periods (that's why most mums intuitevely put their LO to sleep 90min after they woke up) ,but in the night it also counts, so if your LO wakes up properly(i mean more than just to feed) he'll stay awake for ~90min (his alert cycle) until he can go back to sleep again.

 

[kosh]

I think I may be one of the 4?

you weren't but i read and replied to one of your posts yesterday (the one re supply) and thought you'd join

When LO was a newborn she slept beautifully with only 2 or 3 wakings. I though I was blessed with a 'good baby' We co-slept from birth as it just felt so natural and was much easier for BF during the night. At around 4 months the sleep regression hit and LO started waking up much more and it got gradually worse until at around 6months she was waking every 45mins. After a couple of months she got better again and started to go for a couple of hours and even have a few stretches of 5-6hours on the odd night. I thought we were at the end of the tunnel. Then it started to get really hot and she started to fight sleep until 1 or 2am. She was still sleeping in 2-3hour stretches but wouldn't go to bed before midnight and was sleeping until midday. We gradually managed to get her to bed earlier and earlier by waking her up earlier in the mornings and we had one or two nights where she slept relatively normally. I decided to start putting her in her cot for the first part of the night which didn't really work and now for the past couple of weeks she is back to waking every 45mins or less.

I just can't make any sense out of my LOs sleeping habits. Nothing I do seems to make any difference and I can't figure out why she is waking so much. She naps well during the day in her cot it's just the night time that is a problem. She goes to sleep fairly easily if I nurse her but won't sleep any other way.

I laugh when I see posts of people saying "help, my 8 week old is still waking 3 times a night" (no offence to these people as I understand any amount of sleep deprivation is difficult especially in the early days)

Maybe we'll together be able to come up with an answer to our sleep problems. I sure hope so!

me too

really hope we can help each other somehow.

I've just read your answers to those questions- mhm, your case obviously does not support my hypothesis

 

[lisa1980]

1) did you have any stress/complications during your pregnancy/birth?
Pregnancy was straightforward. I ended up with an emergency c-section due to LO's heartbeat dropping and then stopping but it wasn't too bad overall.

2) are you FF or BF? I have the impression this problem is more common in BF babies
I'm BF, although I have tried formula on occasion. I tried a bottle before bed but it made no difference whatsoever unfortunately. I agree that whenever I see a post about bad sleepers (after the 4-month mark let's say...before then they're expected to be bad IMO ) I usually predict that it's a BF baby and I'm usually right. I realise that's not exactly rock-solid evidence of anything but it's just something I've noticed too.

3) tiredness aside - do you feel overwhelmed, worried, anxious, etc? do you feel you have enough support or you're doing most of the looking after LO on your own?
It seems to go in cycles. Sometimes I feel ok about it and confident that he will sleep at some point. The co-sleeping has helped with this I think as i'm not quite as soul-crushingly tired as I was before, even though he wakes just as much. Other times (esp when I think about going back to work) I feel totally overwhelmed and depressed about it. I crashed my car not long ago and had a mini-meltdown so now my family and OH are being really supportive (don't think they realised how bad it was before), so I'm grateful for that, but I do the vast majority of his care alone as OH works A LOT of crazy hours and my family are a drive away. I usually feel better when I have some sort of 'plan' to try with LO. I realise that they often don't work and I will probably just have to wait it out, but that thought makes me feel so much worse so I keep trying. I also am so grateful that he's usually such a lovely baby who's a joy in every aspect other than sleep, so I try to keep that in mind when it gets bad.

How about you Kosh?

 

[nicb26]

I'm in the no sleep club too! And it's getting worse not better please keep the advice coming people! xx

 

[lisa1980]

He used to sleep for a solid block of 3-4 hours in the evening and wake regularly but feed quickly and back to sleep. Recently he's been stirring all evening and having some night wakings where NOTHING ges him back to sleep in less than 1.5 hours:shrug:.

have you read the '90min sleep program'? she explains this there. it seems that most babies have 90min alert periods (that's why most mums intuitevely put their LO to sleep 90min after they woke up) ,but in the night it also counts, so if your LO wakes up properly(i mean more than just to feed) he'll stay awake for ~90min (his alert cycle) until he can go back to sleep again.[/QUOTE]

I've heard of it but never read it. That would explain it then. I always try to get him back to sleep as soon as he wakes to avoid it, but lately my fail-safe method of sticking him on the boob is not working and he'll feed (usually a fairly slap-dash attempt as he's not really hungry) and then STILL stay awake

He'll then lay there kicking us and chattering away until he gets bored and cries because he's tired but WILL NOT go to sleep. Honestly, just when I thought the night-time couldn't get any more ridiculous. When he's a teenager I'm going to wake him hourly

I have a question for the sleep deprived club - were YOU (or your OH) a bad sleeper as a baby? And were you BF/FF?

 

[susan_1981]

Oh god this thread does not fill me with hope! My baby is only almost 3.5 weeks old and not a great sleeper, although he has had 4 nights where he's been brilliant - until he wakes up that first time, then wakes every hour screaming!

I put my baby down and he feeds every 3 hours. I can't say he wakes up every 3 hours though because he has his bottle which takes about half an hour, then will stay wake for about 60-90 minutes, falls back to sleep after about an hour and then will wake up again about an hour later. He's quite a noisy baby so alot of it is him just cooing and oohing and ahhing in his moses basket so I try to zone out to get back to sleep. I considered this to be quite bad but from some of you girls, I think maybe I should be grateful! And of course he is only 3.5 weeks old so there's plenty of time. I just hope he doesn't regress! x

 

[kosh]

Oh god this thread does not fill me with hope! My baby is only almost 3.5 weeks old and not a great sleeper, although he has had 4 nights where he's been brilliant - until he wakes up that first time, then wakes every hour screaming!

I put my baby down and he feeds every 3 hours. I can't say he wakes up every 3 hours though because he has his bottle which takes about half an hour, then will stay wake for about 60-90 minutes, falls back to sleep after about an hour and then will wake up again about an hour later. He's quite a noisy baby so alot of it is him just cooing and oohing and ahhing in his moses basket so I try to zone out to get back to sleep. I considered this to be quite bad but from some of you girls, I think maybe I should be grateful! And of course he is only 3.5 weeks old so there's plenty of time. I just hope he doesn't regress! x

oh, don't worry, you don't belong here girl!
3.5 weeks is tiny, lots of things can happen, but hopefully you'll never join us!
I think I'll edit the original post and add: 'no newborns please'



lisa - i read your questions, will reply later. time to pu LO to sleep. poor thing he's really poorly with a bad cough, had no sleep whatsoever today (2x 20min) but still laughs

 

[aliss]

I (and my sister) were every 1-2 hour wakers for the first year (and 2 years for my sister), we were both BF. I'm sort of blessed in that I can complain to my mom about it and she totally understands with a hug rather than offer advice. She doesn't know any different either.

My LO, not sure if I mentioned it, was bottle-fed from the start! Breast at first, then combo, then formula. Formula actually made it much worse as it caused severe tummy pains (he had a milk allergy).

 

[Little_bump]

yay! people like me! all i see on facebook is these babies sleeping from 7-8 in the morning :O

LO wakes every hour from 9pm onwards until he wakes at half 6, he used to wake at 12, 3 then half 6 which i was happy with but now its getting worse

 

[Sherileigh]

My LO is 8.5 months old and is a boobaholic! He can't fall asleep without the boob. So I get him to sleep get out of the room and he cries because he woke up and needs me to get back to sleep. Sigh. This usually happens about 6-7 times before I join him in bed. I think we get a few hours then and early morning is just constant wake search for boob, suck twice and back to sleep. I try cc but end up giving in because I'm a suck. I am just tired of this.

 

[flippityflop]

would you mind sharing with me:

1) did you have any stress/complications during your pregnancy/birth? (I remember flippity, you were induced a day before me!)

Induced at 42 weeks. Nothing happened really, only got to 3cm after 9hrs of oxytocin and ended in an EMCS as LO'S heart rate drop. Had raised BP at times throughout the pregnancy.
2) are you FF or BF? I have the impression this problem is more common in BF babies
I BF up until about 5.5 months and started introducing a bottle of formula at night to help him sleep longer - didn't work!
3) tiredness aside - do you feel overwhelmed, worried, anxious, etc? do you feel you have enough support or you're doing most of the looking after LO on your own?
His sleeplessness made me incredibly stressed I barely ate and lost lots of weight. It made me sick all the time I was so worried about LO and how I could help him. I had great support from the HV team but they really couldn't help. They called a lot to check on me and I found out today they were coming out to do a PND assessment on me. My OH was supportive but there really wasn't anything he could do. LO just never settled for him. My MIL was round twice a week and she spent time with him while I got stuff done. My mum was there to lend an ear as were some other mums I see regularly. I feel I had lots of support but at the end of the day noone could help him or me actually solve the problem
The doctor actually referred us to a pediatrician although I think that's to do with his reflux and not his sleep. His reflux is fine really but she could see how desperate I was. The appt isn't until October anyway!

I felt completely helpless at times. There were times I hated being a mum
There were times when I resented LO and regretted having him Everyone says it'll get better but when you are stuck in sleep deprivation hell that didn't help. I just felt desperate all the time.

 

[lisa1980]

I (and my sister) were every 1-2 hour wakers for the first year (and 2 years for my sister), we were both BF. I'm sort of blessed in that I can complain to my mom about it and she totally understands with a hug rather than offer advice. She doesn't know any different either.

My LO, not sure if I mentioned it, was bottle-fed from the start! Breast at first, then combo, then formula. Formula actually made it much worse as it caused severe tummy pains (he had a milk allergy).

See I was an AWFUL sleeper until i was 2yrs old. I would scream all night (had colic and probably reflux my mum now thinks) and slept in my parents bed until I was 2.5yrs old. I was BF until 18months. I also feel lucky in a way as my parents totally understand my current situation, and in may ways it was probably worse for them as I was such a miserable baby whereas my LO is usually very cheerful.

My sister, however, was an excellent sleeper from early on. She would be sleeping in her cot in the nursery whilst I was still waking all night in my parents bed even though I'm 2 yrs older She was also BF until 1yr.

I feel like my 'sleep genes' were shoddy to start with and poor LO has inherited them It's probably complete coincidence but i always enjoy a theory

 

[Odd Socks]

Lauren's had 3 nights in her life she's slept longer than a 2.5 hour stretch.

On a normal night, I'll feed her to sleep around 7pm, resettle her with boob a handful of times before I give up & go to bed & then she'll sleep 2 hours or so for a feed & spend the rest of the night waking generally every half hour, often with a 2-3 hour awake period in there, just to make it even better!

I dream of a 4 hour stretch of sleep.

xx

omg odd socks
how do you cope?!

I think it's like Aliss said, you accept that's the way your baby is. I co-sleep with Lauren or I wouldn't be able to do it. She feeds back to sleep & I doze off. Sometimes, when she's having her marathon middle-of-the-night wakes, I am in tears & beg her to just go to sleep, but it doesn't help either of us. For whatever reason, she's waking & she needs me, so I go with it. I know it won't be forever & I figure at almost 8 months, we must me most of the way there! I didn't manage to breastfeed Bella & I always said I would take anything to be able to breastfeed Lauren!

would you mind sharing with me:

1) did you have any stress/complications during your pregnancy/birth? Aside from 9 months of morning sickness & low blood pressure, I had no problems with pregnancy & a very easy labour & birth with Lauren.

2) are you FF or BF? Breastfeeding.

3) tiredness aside - do you feel overwhelmed, worried, anxious, etc? do you feel you have enough support or you're doing most of the looking after LO on your own? I do feel overwhelmed sometimes (I suppose that comes with the territory!), but not really worried or anxious. OH helps out a lot with Bella, but Lauren only settles with me, so I do most of the things with her by myself.

 

[Dragonfly]

William was a bad sleeper, I didnt sleep train him. We co slept, fed him on demand and it passed. He sleeps well now. Alex was a good sleeper still is. I did nothing but let them gain independent sleep on their own. This to shall pass and I am glad the OP wont do cio or cc.

 

[MrsHedgehog]

We had a good night!

We went out for dinner to a friends and took LO with us. We got home around midnight. LO went straight off to sleep and woke only 3 maybe 4 times before waking for the day at 10am. It seems like a late bed time may be the key for us. Everyone says that an earlier bedtime makes babies sleep better but it has never worked for my LO. It's really hot here at the moment so we're stuck inside most of the day and the only time we can get out is in the evenings when it is cooler. Yesterday was a great day. LO woke at 10am after a bad nights sleep. She had a long nap from 12.30 until 3pm then another nap from 6 until 7pm. We went out to my friends, had dinner outside and spent all evening outside playing when it was nice and cool. Got home at midnight and LO went straight to sleep and slept so well. She woke at 10am this morning and is really well rested. I think we'll stick with this for a few days and see if it continues to work or if it was just a fluke.