Male Factor Roll Call

[Gracy 004]

suzie7, just wondering if you know what your partners count etc was? I find the clomid thing interesting, but i think we got told no chance except icsi for us because dh's was just so bad? How long has he been on the clomid?

 

[Gracy 004]

we had some good news today (not really related to fertility but i am taking everything i can get right now!). DH and i have booked in for our icsi in may without actually having a clue how we are going to pay for it, were prob going to get a big credit card,then today out of the blue we both got these really big pay cheques as we are both working in the same hospital and apparently we had both been paid at the wrong hourly rate since septmber or october last year and they paid us the money in a lump sum! unbelievable, it is 2/3 of the money we need! a very unexpected positive in what has otherwise been a terrible time, we are celebrating with a bottle of wine tonight

 

[MummyIwanabe]

Great news Gracy! it's like its a sign!!!! xx

 

[MummyIwanabe]

We were never advised DH should take clomid. That's interesting it was suggested to you as it wasn't to us!!

I was told IUI and IVF are not recommended for low morphology so we moved straight to ICSI. xxx

 

[ACLIO]

Clomid for men, I've never heard of that. Our FS told us ICSI was the only option there was no drugs etc that could be given to my DH

 

[scarlet angel]

Great news Gracy!! things happen for a reason

We also have the male factor, but the fertility clinic is leaving it as it is as lifestyle etc is fine.

 

[ACLIO]

I've just got DH Maca through the post I've read that women can take it too. We'll give anything a shot. I've also read some where about a vit that's supposed to help DH volume but can not remember what its called

 

[suzie7]

hmmm, this is all so interesting to me. I wonder why no one has been advised for DH to take clomid?

Our doctor says it is "not FDA approved but it's like candy for men. It won't do anything. The only reason it's not approved is because they don't have millions of dollars to approve it. It doesn't affect men like women" (which I hear it can make you go kind of quack!)

He says in 75% of men it increases their count by tricking their brain into thinking it's not producing enough testosterone. In 20% it does nothing and in 5% it actually may cause the count to drop. We are hopeful though. He will take it for 6 months and get re-evaluated at 3 months. If his count gets into the normal range, then I'll get on clomid to up our chances.

I get so confused on here if people are talking about their TOTAL count or their motile count PER ml. There is a big difference.

1st SA
Total Count 21 million
Total Motile Sperm 3.6 million with 17% motility

8 weeks later after LOTS of vitamins
2nd SA
Total Count 36 million
Total Motile Sperm 14 million with 37% motility

I wish I could just hear ONE story of someone getting pregnant naturally with low sperm count..... why are we all ICSI bound?

 

[Gracy 004]

Hey Suzie, your partners count seems pretty good from what I have read. I am hopeful for you, how great would it be to not have to go through all this icsi! Would you be willing to share your vitamin regime? The increase was quite significant.
Peartree, how you going mate? Hanging in there?

 

[ACLIO]

Hi Ladies,
I though I'd share what my DH is taking and if anyone go recommend anything else that would be great:
Wellman vits
Zinc
Maca 900mg tablets x6 a day

 

[MummyIwanabe]

I've been told eye-q by the clinic is good for omega 3 and omega 6 oils although its expensive it was recommended for sperm and also 2 brazil nuts a day. They can have chocolate on!

My friend asked today if we'd had tests done and if they were all ok. No one knows we're having treatment as my OH doesn't want them to but I was desperate to tell her but felt I couldn't as OH asked me not to.

Has anyone told their friends? My friend is due soon and other friends have just had baby so I don't think we'd gain much by telling them I just feel like I'd like to sometimes. Maybe its cos I'm not good at keeping secrets lol but they're like our family! xx

 

[ACLIO]

We've told our parents. We are seeing my DH best friend tomorrow night. They struggled for 3 years to get there BFP after 3 MC's. They did however get there BFP just before going for treatment. I think we might tell them so DH has someone to talk to and I get on really well with his wife. I know what you mean though cos its a tough one. In a way I don't want people knowing that we having to have help as I feel a failure and DH took it really bad when we found out aswel so I don't want it to effect his confidence. Deep down I don't think DH wants anyone knowing really

 

[MummyIwanabe]

None of our friends have had difficulty so I don't think they'd understand and although tempting I think DH is right and we should keep it to ourselves. i think he's also embarrassed so I think it's understandable and I can talk to my parents about it as they know so at least I have someone to talk too xxx

 

[ACLIO]

and you have us

 

[MummyIwanabe]

oh yes! And thank goodness for that! So glad I found this site!

 

[suzie7]

I broke down and told a close friend the other weekend. I try to put on a happy face for DH's sake- he hates to see me upset but it's hard. As close as my friend and I are I still felt like "one of those unfortunate couples." I hate that. I wish someone would get a BFP naturally so we could be hopeful!!!!
I despise the thought of ICSI- expenses, all the appointments, etc.

 

[Love0411]

We told our parents and our closest friends....2 of whom actually offered to donate their sperm to us. We haven't gone that route yet, but are still hopeful we can have one on our own. We will see. Good luck ladies!

 

[FBbaby]

Okay, WHO recommends that the minimum level of what is 'normal', ie, allow a pregnancy assuming the woman is okay within 12 months (or something like that I assume) is a count of 20 mil, motility of 50% and morphology of 15% normal. So the way I look at this is that you need 10 mil of agile sperm of which 15% has to look normal, ie. a total of 1.5 mil good sperms surrounding the egg. How you get to this number doesn't matter (ie. high count, good morphology but low motility, or lowish count, but okay morphology and good motility). I have absolutely no idea whether there is any scientific standing to what I'm writing, but I guess it makes sense to me And then of course, there is the debate around the morphology percentage, thanks peartree for the link.

If that the case Suzie, it is the motile count that matters with a minimum of 10 mil (assuming morphology is good) and your second SA is above the minimum 'normal results' Assuming there are no fertility problems with you, you should be able to get pregnant naturally, even if it takes a bit longer.

I think the decision of whether to go for ICSI depends on how 'bad' the SA is, but also on the woman. In my case, taking into account my assumption and the 15% morphology, OH has about 1/3 of what is the minimum good sperm getting to the egg. Not great, but still possible. Unfortunately, my age means that the quality of my eggs is going down. Still, there would probably be a chance of getting pg if I stayed as I am and continued to ttc, but I won't, my eggs will get worse quickly, so ICSI is the best for our situation.

There is indeed a big difference between your two results. It might be due to the vitamins and change of lifestyle, or it might be that your OH wasn't well for whichever reason when the sperm that was tested was created (ie, 6-8 weeks before the test). In your case, I would test again, ask for morphology results, but if the numbers come back as they are with morphology ok, I would wait to do icsi, assuming you are under 35ish as the odds are on your side that you will get your bfp with patience and perseverance

Gracy, that's brilliant news, i bet it felt like a big weight of your shoulders.

 

[suzie7]

Thanks for the encouragement. We don't know our morphology as they said our "count was not high enough to perform a morphology test." weird! anyway, doctor says we probably have a 10-15% chance of getting preggo (nothing wrong with me that they can find).
geez louise though, it seems impossible. I wonder if I'll ever see that BFP. I'm going to try shooting egg whites up my ya-ya lady garden this month to see if that works (according to another BnB with low count, this worked for her). ohhhh the things we'll try for a BFP....
My Dh is on a multi, vit c, vit e, 1250 mg maca, horny goat weed, arginine, carnitine, taurine, ginseng, coq10

I take loads of EPO and Vit B6 (suppose to help create more EWM), and prenatal.
A full 3 months since our vitamin regiment will be May 1, my 30th birthday!

 

[Gracy 004]

Thanks suzie, i sort of asked dh about taking some vitamins and stuff but hes a bit against it, just wants to go for the icsi - he is so certain it will work i dont think failure has crossed his mind. I know what you mean about people thinking about you being a poor unfortunate couple. I have told a few people at work (mainly cos i have to keep pulling sickies), but not too many of them have kids so they dont give me that 'poor you' look. I havent told anyone why we need the icsi, i have said it is because of me with endometriosis because understandably dh doesnt want the whole world knowing. I will also shoot the next person who says to me 'why dont you adopt?' arggghhhhh! like its that bloody simple! just drop a quick phone call to some poor third world country and they will send us over a lovely bouncing baby.seriously people have NFI about how insensitive that is! Unless you are some sort of mega angelina jolie type star, it involves more money than i will ever have, years and years of red tape and heartache ! Not sure what it is like from the other side of the world, but the australian goverment makes sure it is next to impossible.